Do you consider people like this New Yorkers? Why or Why not.

:)

No, they're Canadian

I used to live in Buffalo and was never called nor have I ever heard anyone called otherwise. I guess there's that "Upstater" vs "Downstater" thing, but I've always associated that with politics.

of course, yes...

yes. people from upstate or long island just have to specify that they're not from NYC because most associate the term with the city rather than the state.

Silly question

New York stops at Yonkers. everything south is in a parallel universe, and obeys its own laws of physics... and economics.

(a brooklyn resident for the past 10 years)

Because people from the State of Maine are considered Mainers...
Funny, I always called them Mainiacs. :)

People in all parts of the state contribute to the tax base that supports NYC, as well as Buffalo, Rochester, Syracuse, Utica, Albany, and all the other municipalities in the state. And all of New York State's citizens are subject to the state's laws and dysfunction.
Technically speaking, the tax structure supports Upstate more than the other way around. But therein lies the catch. The tax structure is so high so as to support a statewide social and political policy geared towards a dense city. Add to that a fiscal policy that makes sense nowhere. Upstate does not, and never would, have the base for which to sustain such a program (nor would 99% of the rest of the world). That's how Upstate pays, and it's gotten to the point recently where even Long Island is getting screwed by the system. Needless to say it'll only get worse as NYC continues to bleed jobs and corporate HQs to elsewhere within the metro (i.e. neighboring states). Look at the population growth rates - in gross they still blow the rest of the US out of the water, but in percentage terms they're pathetic. Not what you'd expect from a world-class alpha city.

In essence, the current system doesn't support one portion over the other, but rather drags both down. Typical Upstate voters are then too afraid to risk what they do have for change, and NYC is either too big and self-absorbed with its own issues to see the greater state's issues, or are just too oblivious to realize how much better off they could be. Add to that they're all just as partisan as anyone - and therefore gerrymandering works like a charm.

Of course. Why wouldn't they be? We are New Yorkers from Montauk to the City and the city up the Hudson River Valley, from the Adirondocks to the Catskills to the finger lakes to Lake Erie and Lake Ontario.

New York stops at Yonkers. everything south is in a parallel universe, and obeys its own laws of physics... and economics.

(a brooklyn resident for the past 10 years)

Are you the one that voted "No"?

Are you the one that voted "No"?

haha :) no.
if i could, i'd vote the other way around. NYC is like its own planet- and sometimes its population is unaware that there is a world beyond its borders. i have met NUMEROUS people here who were born and raised in Manhattan (in affluent families) who have never been to Brooklyn or any other borough, other than for the airports (and they didn't know those were not in Manhattan). really amazing.

Look at the population growth rates - in gross they still blow the rest of the US out of the water, but in percentage terms they're pathetic. Not what you'd expect from a world-class alpha city.

actually, most other alpha cities are pretty stable with moderate population gains. other cities NY's size that are exploding in population tend to be in 3rd world countries where the rural population is moving into the cities; shanghai and mumbai for example but i doubt you'll find paris or tokyo growing too much bigger than they already are.

Of course people from New York, whether inside or outside of NYC's borders, are considered New Yorkers. Why? Because people from the State of Maine are considered Mainers; those from Vermont are Vermonters, and those from Maryland are Marylanders. People in all parts of the state contribute to the tax base that supports NYC, as well as Buffalo, Rochester, Syracuse, Utica, Albany, and all the other municipalities in the state. And all of New York State's citizens are subject to the state's laws and dysfunction.

I don't blame you for asking the question though. There are so many parts of NYC, like Astoria Queens, where nobody is actually from New York. I have wondered in the past whether people from Queens should be considered New Yorkers. They are technically New Yorkers, but a good many of them are really Midwesterners playing the role of "New Yorker" for a while. People who live in Staten Island may as well be from New Jersey, in terms of culture and mentality. And I have always laughed about the people I have met at UB who were from Long Island and passed themselves off as being from "the city" because they think it's a cooler image. And, well, it is a cooler image. But that's all it is, an image, hype.

Yeah, the reason I asked this question was because a few months ago I was on a NYC Subway train and there was a sign that said; "there are 8,xxx,xxx New Yorkers" and I was like wtf, they are only including the people in NYC!!! What about the ppl that don't live in the city?!?!

I was about to organize a Subway boycott for those signs to be removed!!!:mad2:

Funny, I always called them Mainiacs. :)


Technically speaking, the tax structure supports Upstate more than the other way around. But therein lies the catch. The tax structure is so high so as to support a statewide social and political policy geared towards a dense city. Add to that a fiscal policy that makes sense nowhere. Upstate does not, and never would, have the base for which to sustain such a program (nor would 99% of the rest of the world). That's how Upstate pays, and it's gotten to the point recently where even Long Island is getting screwed by the system. Needless to say it'll only get worse as NYC continues to bleed jobs and corporate HQs to elsewhere within the metro (i.e. neighboring states). Look at the population growth rates - in gross they still blow the rest of the US out of the water, but in percentage terms they're pathetic. Not what you'd expect from a world-class alpha city.

In essence, the current system doesn't support one portion over the other, but rather drags both down. Typical Upstate voters are then too afraid to risk what they do have for change, and NYC is either too big and self-absorbed with its own issues to see the greater state's issues, or are just too oblivious to realize how much better off they could be. Add to that they're all just as partisan as anyone - and therefore gerrymandering works like a charm.

Upstate's tax base could be twice as large as it currently is if it were not so constrained by the politics of NYC and the state policy designed specifically for NYC

Yeah, the reason I asked this question was because a few months ago I was on a NYC Subway train and there was a sign that said; "there are 8,xxx,xxx New Yorkers" and I was like wtf, they are only including the people in NYC!!! What about the ppl that don't live in the city?!?!

I was about to organize a Subway boycott for those signs to be removed!!!:mad2:

new yorker is used to describe people from both NYC and NYS and it being in a subway train, it is obvious they are referring to just the city. the population outside the city limits is irrelevant to the NYCTA

new yorker is used to describe people from both NYC and NYS and it being in a subway train, it is obvious they are referring to just the city. the population outside the city limits is irrelevant to the NYCTA

Are you kidding?

Do you know how many people commute into the city from Long Island and Upstate (the immediate upstate counties) every day. Probably like 50% of the Professional population! They commute to the big terminals (Penn Station and Grand Central Terminal and then switch to Subway Trains to get wherever they need to be on Manhattan. The NYCTA would go broke if there was no ridership form outside the city!

How it works: I'm a Long Islander in the metro...but a New Yorker anywhere else in the world. And 'New Yorker' as in city, not state.

Are you kidding?

Do you know how many people commute into the city from Long Island and Upstate (the immediate upstate counties) every day. Probably like 50% of the Professional population! They commute to the big terminals (Penn Station and Grand Central Terminal and then switch to Subway Trains to get wherever they need to be on Manhattan. The NYCTA would go broke if there was no ridership form outside the city!

don't forget Connecticut and New Jersey (essentially parts of which are just NYC suburbs). you can also see helicopters landing on top of skyscrapers in the morning (heli-commuters?) if you have a good view of the city, not to mention people who will fly here for one day of business.

the population of NYC that is usually quoted is always around 8.5 million, but i would love to see some estimates of how the population swells and shrinks over the course of a day.

haha :) no.
if i could, i'd vote the other way around. NYC is like its own planet- and sometimes its population is unaware that there is a world beyond its borders. i have met NUMEROUS people here who were born and raised in Manhattan (in affluent families) who have never been to Brooklyn or any other borough, other than for the airports (and they didn't know those were not in Manhattan). really amazing.

I see what you mean now.

Those Manhattanites (is that the correct term?) must not like baseball or football that much, to never leave the island.

Are you kidding?

Do you know how many people commute into the city from Long Island and Upstate (the immediate upstate counties) every day. Probably like 50% of the Professional population! They commute to the big terminals (Penn Station and Grand Central Terminal and then switch to Subway Trains to get wherever they need to be on Manhattan. The NYCTA would go broke if there was no ridership form outside the city!

i know all that but it is a city agency touting about the city population.

How it works: I'm a Long Islander in the metro...but a New Yorker anywhere else in the world. And 'New Yorker' as in city, not state.

really? i never lumped long islanders in with the city.

I just meant that if I call myself a "New Yorker" anywhere else in the nation/world, I assume people would probably associate me with the city first, rather than the state. Long Island definitely has its own identity, but as Nygirl mentioned, the island loses its vibe the farther east you go out in suburbia--and that vibe definitely is influenced by NY city.

Do you consider people like this New Yorkers? Why or Why not.


Aside from "Texans" & to some degree "Californians", most people rarely strongly identify with their state.

How many "Illinoisians" do we run into?

Mostly "New Yorkers" means from the Big Apple or the broader downstate area.

^ nah, i know plenty of people from NYS that refer to themselves as new yorkers. i am from utica originally and i refer to myself as a new yorker.

if anything, chicagoans see themselves as chicagoans before they do illinois.

i am from utica originally and i refer to myself as a new yorker.


Yeah, but that's probably because not many folks outside of NY State know where Utica is, let alone much about it.

Its just a lot easier to just say your a NYer!

Yes, but when people refer to "New Yorkers" around here from I've seen, they refer to the city residents usually.

Aside from "Texans" & to some degree "Californians", most people rarely strongly identify with their state.

How many "Illinoisians" do we run into?

Mostly "New Yorkers" means from the Big Apple or the broader downstate area.

Only in the sense that New York City and the region have the most people. You don't meet many "Illinoisians" because there aren't many people in Illinois outside of Chicago. Texas and California are different because the population is more de-centralized. Both cities have two major population areas (Dallas and Houston, Los Angeles and San Francisco) and more huge population areas (San Antonio, and San Diego; El Paso, and Fresno; Austin, and Sacramento; etc).

That doesn't take from the fact that people from Syracuse or Utica or the Adirondacks are less of New Yorkers than people from Long Island or the Hudson Valley.

Only in the sense that New York City and the region have the most people. You don't meet many "Illinoisians" because there aren't many people in Illinois outside of Chicago. Texas and California are different because the population is more de-centralized. Both cities have two major population areas (Dallas and Houston, Los Angeles and San Francisco) and more huge population areas (San Antonio, and San Diego; El Paso, and Fresno; Austin, and Sacramento; etc).

That doesn't take from the fact that people from Syracuse or Utica or the Adirondacks are less of New Yorkers than people from Long Island or the Hudson Valley.


I hear what your saying, & NY State is for sure one of the greatest states!

Its just most people from say Buffalo are more likely to call themselves Buffalonians rather than New Yorkers.

Buffalo is better known nationally than say a smaller place like Utica by virtue of the Bills, Sabres, ChickenWings, etc.

Its just most people from say Buffalo are more likely to call themselves Buffalonians rather than New Yorkers.


Than it's really just an added benefit that New York City has the same name as the state, and so the audience can decide if they are referring to the city or the state. When someone says that they are from Cincinnati or from Texas or from Las Vegas, that person is refering to either a city or state. If someone says that they are from New York, they can mean that they are from the city and/or state, whereas someone from Buffalo is obviously from the city, and therefore you also know the state.

^You're right. If the state had a different name than New York, the city of New York wouldn't eclipse the state identity as much than it deserves in its own right. Believe me, as a Long Islander we're overshadowed by NYC enough. Again, as a population of 3 million we're almost lost amongst metro New York, while that's bigger than many states.

^ dont know about the rest of the country but LI is clearly seen as it's own thing despite the closeness to NYC. it's got its own culture, accent and everything.

Yes, but when people refer to "New Yorkers" around here from I've seen, they refer to the city residents usually.

in NY state, that makes sense; people tend to identify with their region or city. when i am in NYC, i tell people i am from utica or central NY, not a NY'er. here in texas, i am a "NY'er" and when people assume i'm from the city, i clarify by saying upstate.

"New Yorkers" tend to divide themselves up more within their own state than many others it seems. You have WNYers, CNYers, people from "downstate", "LI", "the North Country", etc. The only other examples I can immediately think of elsewhere might be "SoCal", "Youpers", and the Florida panhandle.

I live in New Jersey, 15 mins from Manhattan. I compete to New York City everyday for work. I consider myself a New Yorker.

in NY state, that makes sense; people tend to identify with their region or city. when i am in NYC, i tell people i am from utica or central NY, not a NY'er. here in texas, i am a "NY'er" and when people assume i'm from the city, i clarify by saying upstate.

Now one time when many residents across NY State DO tend to ID themselves as "New Yorkers" is during political campaigns, for Governor, Senaters, etc.

How it works: I'm a Long Islander in the metro...but a New Yorker anywhere else in the world. And 'New Yorker' as in city, not state.

Some other places try that and you get called out as "trying too hard". I don't get it. People in the Boston, Chicago, NYC, LA areas can rep their city, but here in the DC area, transplants from the midwest get pissed off if a native of the region from 10 miles outside the city center identifies themselves as being from Washington or DC.

As for the question, of course. I agree that there's the downstate vs. upstate rift, but I'd love to hear a person's reasoning as to why a person from Albany or something isn't a NYer.

"New Yorkers" tend to divide themselves up more within their own state than many others it seems. You have WNYers, CNYers, people from "downstate", "LI", "the North Country", etc. The only other examples I can immediately think of elsewhere might be "SoCal", "Youpers", and the Florida panhandle.

There are many more examples of this. Some people in New Jersey identify w/ an end of the state, Texas is a big state like NY that isn't homogeneous. Northern Virginia is politically, economically and culturally different from most of the state so there's an identity there as well.

As for the question, of course. I agree that there's the downstate vs. upstate rift, but I'd love to hear a person's reasoning as to why a person from Albany or something isn't a NYer.

I don't refer to myself as a NYer primarily for the reason that I don't want to associate myself which such an abomination of a state, a state that quite visibly has a disdain for its residents. NYers as it refers to the city have it easy in that regard.

of course no matter where we live in this state, were all proud new yorkers :-)

If you move down south, or to Texas, it doesn't matter if you're from Buffalo or Manhattan; you're still a "damn New Yorker" in the eyes of the natives.

of course no matter where we live in this state, were all proud new yorkers :-)

:nuts: Joke right?

Im a buffalonian more then im a new yorker. Buffalo and NYC are on opposite sides of the state and might as well be different countries.

Buffalo is a drinking town with a football problem.
NYC is a business city without a football team. (shh, just point to them on a map before you flame me...)

When i was in wyoming for school (WTI) I typicaly took over the school tours when they came through, and people constantly asked where i was from. One of the FIRST people to ever ask me that viomently denied the possibility that i was from New York.

"your accent sounds like you lived there for like a week"

You guessed it, he was from NYC, and i had to explain to him where exactly buffalo was in teh state.

His response was classic too. "you think im stupid now dont you ?"

Do you consider people like this New Yorkers? Why or Why not.

No, because a "New Yorker" refers to the residents of one of the city boroughs. I don't consider Long Islanders or anyone from Yonkers and up to be New Yorkers. Technically, of course, they are, if you use the term in reference to the state, but that's not how it's widely used.

If you move down south, or to Texas, it doesn't matter if you're from Buffalo or Manhattan; you're still a "damn New Yorker" in the eyes of the natives.

exactly.

I've lived in both upstate and downstate New York. :cheers:

If you're asked "Where are you from?" within New York state, IMO, you should never say "I'm from New York" unless you're actually from Manhattan proper. You shouldn't even say that if you live in one of New York's other 4 boroughs, though it is OK to say "I'm from New York City". If you're from some cowtown upstate you definitely shouldn't go around telling people at Cornell University, for example, that "I'm from New York". :no:

If you're being asked this question elsewhere in America, it's OK to say "I'm from New York" if you're from either New York City or one of the nearby suburbs. Though Long Islanders will never use the phrase, "I'm from New York". If you're from upstate, people will think you're a complete dipshit if you go around saying "I'm from New York" (instead of, "I'm from New York State") if they later find out you're from Syracuse.

lol, when I told someone in Albany that I came from New York, there was an awkward pause as if they couldn't understand what I meant.

People from the state of New York are New Yorkers and it's fine for them to refer to themselves as such. However, if someone in the U.S asks where they're from instead of just saying "New York" they should say "Upsate NY", "Western NY" or "Long Island" so people know they aren't from NYC.

I've lived in both upstate and downstate New York. :cheers:

If you're asked "Where are you from?" within New York state, IMO, you should never say "I'm from New York" unless you're actually from Manhattan proper. You shouldn't even say that if you live in one of New York's other 4 boroughs, though it is OK to say "I'm from New York City". If you're from some cowtown upstate you definitely shouldn't go around telling people at Cornell University, for example, that "I'm from New York". :no:

If you're being asked this question elsewhere in America, it's OK to say "I'm from New York" if you're from either New York City or one of the nearby suburbs. Though Long Islanders will never use the phrase, "I'm from New York". If you're from upstate, people will think you're a complete dipshit if you go around saying "I'm from New York" (instead of, "I'm from New York State") if they later find out you're from Syracuse.

i think people forget that there is also a state in addition to the city. it is them who are the dipshits for failing to make that distinction.

i think people forget that there is also a state in addition to the city. it is them who are the dipshits for failing to make that distinction.

actually, i kinda think people think that NYC covers most of NYS. Ive used the phrase "Western NY" in conversatons w/ people while out of state, and ive sometimes received the response "oh so your by NYC !!!"

-no, thats south eastern ny

"well then how far are you from new york?"

-like 7 hours

"oh wow, ny is that big?

-frack ...

(yep, used both meanings of "new york" in that .... someones brain is about to explode im sure ...)

yeah, buffalo is just outside of yonkers and westchester county.

i think people forget that there is also a state in addition to the city. it is them who are the dipshits for failing to make that distinction.

You have to realize though that the association of "New York" with Manhattan, tall buildings, subways, yellow taxis, etc. is very strong. So if you move down to Texas and you say, "I'm from New York", why wouldn't people think you come from Manhattan? It's unreasonable to expect that people will equate "New York" with dairy farmers from Wyoming county. That's why you should clarify with "New York State" or "upstate New York", rather than just "New York".

These are also the same, to borrow the term, dipshits who can't differentiate between Texas and New Jersey on a map, and think Alaska is an island about the size of Colorado (or they would, if they could find CO on a map) off the Pacific coast of Mexico.

Some other places try that and you get called out as "trying too hard". I don't get it. People in the Boston, Chicago, NYC, LA areas can rep their city, but here in the DC area, transplants from the midwest get pissed off if a native of the region from 10 miles outside the city center identifies themselves as being from Washington or DC.

I've given my location as Long Island, NY USA since I've been on this board. I don't say I'm from "near NYC".

As for the question, of course. I agree that there's the downstate vs. upstate rift, but I'd love to hear a person's reasoning as to why a person from Albany or something isn't a NYer.

Certainly I never implied people from Albany, Rochester, Syracuse don't have a *NY state* identity because NYC somehow should supercede in that. I never tried to define the upstater's identity, just my own. In the metro, I'm a Long Islander. But going anywhere else in the country, when I say I'm a New Yorker, people will undoubtedly confuse it with NYC. In other words, it's hard to have a state identity down here close to a city with the same name. It wasn't intended as a slight on upstaters. Paddington actually explained it better than I did....And I will identify myself as "Long Islander", especially if I'm in Florida, LA, or any other place that would tend to be more aware of my locale.

@mancuso

on the accent, culture of LI

People don't normally pronounce it: "LawnGUYLand". Sort of originates from people doing impersonations of LI Jews here, and that seems to have evolved into a perception of a LI accent. It's more a caracature, and even inside joke, that's been taken literally over time. Most working class areas of LI speak the same as Queens/Bronx/Staten Island/Jersey--practically interchangeable. Although, people along the north shore tend to stress their R (standard American). That coming from a better education, and being upper middle class in general. Although there's even a tendency towards that fake British accent Madonna uses, or on occasion the Westchester/Connecticut "Larchmont lockjaw"....as I do fuund all that rothrr amusing.

I do have a friend that uses a hard 'G' when saying "do you want to hanG out"....but he's from Brooklyn, and it sounds completely weird. I have a definite NY accent, but some guys from Brooklyn are so gutteral it's almost unintelligible.

As to culture, I'm not aware of any other contribution than that infamous Long Island Iced Tea. lol

on the accent, culture of LI

People don't normally pronounce it: "LawnGUYLand". Sort of originates from people doing impersonations of LI Jews here, and that seems to have evolved into a perception of a LI accent. It's more a caracature that's been taken literally over time. Most working class areas of LI speak the same as Queens/Bronx/Staten Island/Jersey--practically interchangeable. Although, people along the north shore tend to stress their R (standard American). That coming from a better education, and being upper middle class in general. Although there's even a tendency towards that fake British accent Madonna uses, or on occasion the Westchester/Connecticut "Larchmont lockjaw"....as I do fuund all that rothrr amusing.

I do have a friend that uses a hard G when saying "do you want to hanG out"....but he's from Brooklyn, and it sounds completely weird. I have a definite NY accent, but some guys from Brooklyn are so gutteral it's almost unintelligible.

As for culture, I'm not aware of any other contribution than infamous Long Island Iced Tea. lol


The North Jersey accent, Long Island accent, Brooklyn accent, Bronx Accent, Staten Island accent are not the same at all....even in "working class areas"

Definitely Brooklyn. Maybe the Bronx and Staten Island accents are a little thicker than LI. Other than that, come on, it isn't *that* noticeably different throughout the metro.

Definitely Brooklyn. Maybe the Bronx and Staten Island accents are a little thicker than LI. Other than that, come on, it isn't *that* noticeably different throughout the metro.

I respectfully disagree.

I've heard some weird accents in New Jersey. Staten Island and New Jersey accents are similar to me. An old-school Bronx accent does sound different to me than a Brooklyn accent. Queens is interesting, it seems like it depends on where you are in the borough. Traditionally, different ethnic groups have had different accents, I think it's still the case, but less so.

I have old family in Queens that says refers to Manhattan interchangeably w/ New York.

I understand how inside the state and even tri-state/northeast area to refer more specifically to your town, but outside of that area, people from Albany, Syracuse, and Buffalo are still considered New Yorkers. If you act like you're from the "The City" and you're from Rockland County, you do look a bit foolish though too.

I do have a friend that uses a hard 'G' when saying "do you want to hanG out"....but he's from Brooklyn, and it sounds completely weird. I have a definite NY accent, but some guys from Brooklyn are so gutteral it's almost unintelligible.

As to culture, I'm not aware of any other contribution than that infamous Long Island Iced Tea. lol

The hard 'G' is weird, "I'm a right/left winG-er". Other pronunciations that are distinctive "cAHMfert", "berCerk" and "mahnacky"(monarchy).

I've heard some weird accents in New Jersey. Staten Island and New Jersey accents are similar to me. An old-school Bronx accent does sound different to me than a Brooklyn accent. Queens is interesting, it seems like it depends on where you are in the borough. Traditionally, different ethnic groups have had different accents, I think it's still the case, but less so.

I have old family in Queens that says refers to Manhattan interchangeably w/ New York.

I understand how inside the state and even tri-state/northeast area to refer more specifically to your town, but outside of that area, people from Albany, Syracuse, and Buffalo are still considered New Yorkers. If you act like you're from the "The City" and you're from Rockland County, you do look a bit foolish though too.

The NJ accent and Staten Island are not alike and I really wouldn't call the NJ accent "weird".

oQJv04Y1rhc

I know some Staten Islanders who don't have thick as hell accents and they sound almost identical to family I have in Bergen County. It sounds like a generic, less caricatured, NYC area accent not closely derived from any particular ethnic group. And different from the Bronx, Brooklyn, and Queens accents which I agree with you on. I grew up in Queens and didn't spend a ton of time with working class Staten Island people, though.

The weirdest Jersey accents I've heard are by people who I think could be faking their accents after they moved to NYC after college. I lived in Murray Hill and lived near a lot of these types. You're right that the NJ accent isn't weird as a whole, though.

I know some Staten Islanders who don't have thick as hell accents and they sound almost identical to family I have in Bergen County. It sounds like a generic, less caricatured, NYC area accent not closely derived from any particular ethnic group. And different from the Bronx, Brooklyn, and Queens accents which I agree with you on. I grew up in Queens and didn't spend a ton of time with working class Staten Island people, though.

The weirdest Jersey accents I've heard are by people who I think could be faking their accents after they moved to NYC after college. I lived in Murray Hill and lived near a lot of these types. You're right that the NJ accent isn't weird as a whole, though.

Oh I thought you were saying the typical (strong) Staten Island accent was similar to the regular New Jersey accent. In that case I agree that people with more subtle accents from the two places could sound similar, sorry!

What did the people sound like? Just wondering because you can kinda tell when people are trying to imitate an accent. For example, no one actually from New Jersey would ever say "Joisey" in a serious manner.

haha When i was little, i used to think that NY was only New York City and Westchester County, the rest was Canada to me!!