I've just heard that Singapore airlines will be providing the longest non stop trip which will be from Singapore to Los Angeles. The trip should take eighteen hours and elimnates the stop over in Tokyo or Tiapei

What do you think?

fuck that would be as boring as hell....>(

Pilots undergo series of tests to ensure they stay alert during non-stop flights that may last as long as 18 hours

By Karamjit Kaur

SINGAPORE Airlines looks set to be the first to fly passengers non-stop from Singapore to the United States, when it starts using the new Airbus A340-500 early next year.

The move will mean SIA cuts about four hours off the current flight time to Los Angeles, arriving on the West Coast in about 16 hours.

As such a long-haul has never been attempted before, pilots will be put through a battery of onboard tests to see how alert they are.

The Singapore to Los Angeles flight is likely to be the first such long-haul route, and the pilots will be wired up to monitor their brain waves. They will also be given special watches to monitor their activity level.

Scientists from the European Committee for Aircrew Scheduling and Safety will study the data, which will also be used to verify an earlier study they did, commissioned by the Civil Aviation Authority of Singapore (CAAS).

An SIA spokesman said yesterday: 'The safety of our crew and passengers is a top priority for the airline and we will do everything that is required to ensure that this is always observed.'

In the first study last year, the team recommended four pilots be used on such flights, which can stretch up to 18 hours depending on, say, wind conditions.

SIA has ordered five A340-500s, with an option to buy five more.

Currently, Boeing planes are mainly used on the SIA flights to the US West Coast, which stop at either Hong Kong, Tokyo or Seoul.

Flight and cabin crew are changed during stopovers.

Current CAAS guidelines allow a pilot to be on duty for up to 18 hours, from reporting to work until signing off.

Pilots on the current US West Coast schedule are on duty, at most, 13 to 16 hours because of stopovers. The general rule is they are at the controls for only half that time.

The non-stop flight will require a new set of working conditions for the cockpit and cabin crew of SIA, which recently laid off 570 staff and announced its first net loss, of $312 million for the three months ended June 30.

CAAS has been discussing the matter with SIA and the pilots' association.

It has been talking separately with the Singapore Airlines Staff Union. Union president Eddie Chew, told The Straits Times various issues would be negotiated.

'This is a new service so we will be touching on topics like allowance, rest time and the number of crew on these super long-haul flights.'

Analyst Ian Thomas, a senior consultant at the Sydney-based Centre for Asia Pacific Aviation foresees SIA tapping the corporate market for this new service.

'The yield will be much higher,' he said, referring to earlier reports that SIA is likely to charge a premium.

Source
The Straits Times

Well thats amazing. LAX is now home to the longest flight route.
Fun in first, but boring as hell in coach.

I like Singapore.

Any flight time past 4 hours,is when jet lag begins to set intp the body clock.Even a 9 hour hop is wearisome and boring.It used to be great about 40 years back when jets just came in.One would have 4 hours say from SYD to NAN(Fiji)and then after an hour to stretch ones legs,it was 6 hours to HNL(Hawaii)and another stopover,then 5 hours to LAX.Now its one aircraft non stop,with 14 hours,which is TOO MUCH.:mad:

Originally posted by chrisaus

fuck that would be as boring as hell....>(

Not if you bring some stuff to read like a book, newspaper or some magazines or a pack of cards.

And Singapore Airlines have the inflight channels with films, news and entertainment even Nintendo.

I heard SIA was also considering direct flights EWR - SIN, skipping the stop in AMS. Any thruth to that?

Originally posted by Vertigo

I heard SIA was also considering direct flights EWR - SIN, skipping the stop in AMS. Any thruth to that?

What does EWR and AMS stand for?

Sorry. EWR = Newark (near New York). AMS = Schiphol (near Amsterdam).

Amsterdam and New York (one of the airports)

I never heard of this route..I dont think its possible to fly nonstop from Singapore to NY.

Some info from Airbus's website

August 10 2003
Singapore Airlines’ A340-500 takes shapes

The first A340-500 for Singapore Airlines is now taking shape in the Toulouse final assembly line. Singapore Airlines, which has ordered five very long range A340-500s, will use them to open up some of the world’s longest air-routes such as Singapore to Los Angeles, which to day can only be served with one-stop. Deliveries are scheduled for this winter.

http://www.airbus.com/MultimediaElements/2067.jpg

I think it takes 23hrs to fly from London Heathrow to Melbourne. So I guess that could be the same time for flying from Singapore to New York. These planes must be

You're right, I was mixing some things up. I was actually thinking about the non-stop flights from LAX.

BTW, according to a message in rec.travel.air, there won't be coach class on the direct LAX-SIN flights:


Starting early next year, Singapore Airlines' new Los Angeles, CA (LAX) to Singapore (SIN) flight will become the longest--one that requires around 18 hours to complete westbound and probably around 16 hours to complete eastbound. To stretch its range, the plane being used (Airbus A340-500) will only be fitted with premium seating--1/3 First Class and 2/3 Raffles (Business) Class with a seating capacity of around 175 passengers.


@kota16: jet lag actually doesn't have much to do with the length of the flight, but with the amount of time zones you cross. I can fly from the Netherlands to South-Africa without any jet lag problems.

18 hours....either you watch 9 movies one after the other, go for an extended nap, or hopefully its possible to surf on ssc up there! :D

The web would be available but a fee would be charged to access it.

Originally posted by huaiwei

18 hours....either you watch 9 movies one after the other, go for an extended nap, or hopefully its possible to surf on ssc up there! :D

You would have to be a millionaire to surf SSC on an airplane! :D

Originally posted by chrisaus

fuck that would be as boring as hell....>(

There is a personal entertainment unit for each seat aboard SIA planes.........so I don't think boredom is much of an issue.......I spent the exact amount of time crossing the pacific from Taipei to LAX too (I think the Airbus A340-500 are faster than a 747-400.....:?) on Eva Air ......no personal entertainment unit....only a small TV screen on the ceiling showing 'Bring It On' .....arrggghhhh!

Luckily I din sleep the entire night so I slept for 13 hours on the plane.....waking up for meals and a game of cards with my sis and dad......

I reckon that a non-stop flight is so much better than a 4-hours stopover (midnight) in Taipei....that's what we did! ........The terminal is boring as hell as all shops were closed!!! :rant:

Originally posted by Fabian

The web would be available but a fee would be charged to access it.

wikid you can still spam even when on holidays:D

If you had a laptop, a bunch of pc games and a stack of dvd's I think you could handle it. It's the leg room that fucks it for me.

i think it would be too long. stop over for a few hours should be better.

Shiza I didn't realise the new A340's will be able to fly *that* far.

LAX is already home to the current worlds longest nonstop flight.

That is LAX-Melbourne which is approx 14-15 hours and is now served by the current longest range aircraft: Boeing's 747-400ER, first ordered by Qantas with extra fuel tanks in the cargo hold to complete the journey without occasional stopovers for fuel that sometimes hindered the flight when served by previous 747-400's

21 Jan 2004

http://photo.starblvd.net/Raffles/1-1-2-1078631034?m=1&pg=0&ro=0&co=1&pw=*168D401AA405

http://photo.starblvd.net/Raffles/1-1-1-1078630971?m=1&pg=0&ro=0&co=0


Passengers of Singapore Airlines (SIA) can now feast their eyes on an exquisite painting titled “Perfection” which will adorn the elegant and spacious Raffles Class cabin on SIA’s ultra long-haul aircraft A345LeaderShip.

A soothing water-colour painting depicting the 18th green at the Tampines Course in Tanah Merah Country Club, “Perfection” is the first realistic painting of a golf scene to be featured in SIA’s aircraft. Specially commissioned by SIA for the Raffles Class cabin of the A345 aircraft, “Perfection” is the work of Mr. Chang Chin Fai, a Singaporean artist renowned for his paintings of familiar local scenes.

In an appreciation to Tanah Merah Country Club for allowing the artist to capture a scene of its golf course, SIA’s Senior Executive Vice President (Commercial), Mr. Michael Tan presented the painting to Mr. Sim Kee Boon, Chairman of Tanah Merah Country Club, in a simple ceremony on 16 January 2004. The copy of the painting will be showcased in the interiors of the A345LeaderShip cabin.

SIA ushered in 2004 with the arrival of its first ultra long-haul aircraft – the SIA A345LeaderShip. The A345LeaderShip will offer the longest non-stop commercial service in the world when it commences operations between Singapore and Los Angeles on 3 February 2004.

With the launch of the A345LeaderShip Singapore-Los Angeles service, SIA will operate a daily non-stop flight between Singapore and Los Angeles. Designed to keep globetrotters comfortable throughout the unprecedented 16 to 18 and a half-hour flight, SIA’s A345LeaderShip has a two-cabin interior with an enhanced Raffles (business) Class and a spacious Executive Economy Class that features the widest economy class seat in the industry at 20”.

http://www.singaporeair.com/images/TMCC_Painting.jpg

Raffles Class
http://photo.starblvd.net/Raffles/1-1-3-1078631092?m=1&pg=0&ro=0&co=2

Economy Class
http://photo.starblvd.net/Raffles/1-1-4-1077100600?m=1&pg=0&ro=0&co=3

http://photo.starblvd.net/Raffles/1-1-5-1078631129?m=1&pg=0&ro=0&co=4

My first sightings of these planes and the interiors! Thanks raffi! :colgate:

And erm...they really gonna use those snack bar corners?? ;)

yeah i guess.. the economy class has snacks at the bar but the business class doesnt right? weird.. hrmm i think 18 hour flights wouldn't be too bad for me so i can sleep without missing free movies. and uh if it hasn't been mentioned there will be ewr-sin flights after the middle of the year i think.. yes skipping amsterdam. the perfection art thingy looks cheesy :(

Well, the issue I am getting at was that I tot the US has implimented rules baring the congregation of passengers anywhere in the cabin?

oh. if the snacks are good, no rules can bar me.

3rd Feb 2004

SIA launches world's longest commercial flight

SINGAPORE Airlines on Tuesday launched the world's longest non-stop commercial flight when an Airbus A340-500 left for Los Angeles in an historic voyage. Flight SQ20, with 140 passengers aboard, will arrive in Los Angeles after 16 hours, with the return flight taking 18 1/2 hours. This saves up to two hours in flying time each way from the previous one-stop route.

SIA officials said they were satisfied with the 75 per cent take-up rate for the maiden voyage and announced the launch of a second non-stop service between Singapore and New York had been brought forward from August to June. 'Tentatively we're programming it (the first flight to New York) to be on the 28th of June. I think the launch of this non-stop flight to Los Angeles has created a lot of interest from the business community,' said SIA chief executive Chew Choon Seng.

The Singapore-New York route will take 18 hours in each direction and save six hours of travel time. Mr Chew said the carrier will consider expanding its fleet of five long-range Airbus planes if the two services are successful.

Transport Minister Yeo Cheow Tong and SIA chairman Koh Boon Hwee both described the Singapore-Los Angeles flight as the world's longest non-stop commercial flight. The long-range aircraft, christened A345 LeaderShip, has been modified to carry only 181 passengers to allow for more space and offers just two classes -- business and executive economy. Passengers will have to pay a 10 per cent premium on the ticket but officials and travellers said there was a market for the flights.

Travel consultant Kelly Daoud, 35, of Palm Springs, said he bought a ticket on the inaugural flight 'to be part of history' and had also booked a seat for the upcoming Singapore-New York service. 'Businessmen will like it,' he said, while waiting to board the gleaming white aircraft at Changi Airport.

Singaporean businessman Johnny Ang, 43, who was en route to his company's headquarters in Denver, usually took a flight via Vancouver in Canada. He said the direct flight would save him time and would be less tiring. Mr Yeo said direct flights to the United States should help deepen trade ties with Washington and encourage tourism.

Staff of the more than 1,300 US corporations operating from Singapore will connect more easily with their home bases, he said. With the direct flights, Singapore will also make full use of an open skies agreement it signed with the United States in 1997 that removed restrictions on the capacity and frequency of flights. Before that, Singapore had to negotiate with some countries for stop-over rights.

'Changi (Airport's) position as an aviation hub will also grow, now that it can offer direct connections from this region to nearly all parts of the world without need for an immediate stop,' Mr Yeo said. -- AFP

FEB 5, 2004
S'pore to LA - in 14 hours

Helped by tail winds, inaugural non-stop flight on SIA's new long-range aircraft slashes flight time by four hours

By Karamjit Kaur

LOS ANGELES - A single non-stop flight by Singapore Airlines across half the globe on Tuesday drove home how much this world has shrunk.

SQ20 left Changi Airport at 4pm on Tuesday and, helped by strong tail winds, landed 14,630km away in Los Angeles about 14 hours later, about two hours ahead of schedule. This is about the same amount of time it takes to fly in one of the carrier's regular planes from Singapore to major European cities like London, 10,880km away and Paris, 10,720km away. A trip to Japan and Korea would take half that time. The same journey in one of carrier's regular planes would have taken about 18 hours. It would have also meant a stop at Taipei or Tokyo.

About 140 passengers, including 15 journalists from Singapore and the region, made the historic trip to the American west coast in SIA's new long-range aircraft, the A345LeaderShip. It was the first such journey to test the limits of the new plane, which Emirates began flying at the end of last year from Dubai to Sydney, a distance of about 12,000km. When the aircraft landed, two fire engines sprayed water on it for good luck.

SIA also flies to San Francisco and New York, and has an arrangement with other airlines that allows its passengers to fly to a number of other American cities, from Seattle to Washington DC to Mexico City. It suspended its flights to Chicago and Las Vegas last year and has no plans to relaunch them.

Passengers on the inaugural flight were full of praise for the new service because of the time it saves them. Mr Ignatius J. Rasiah, 46, who flies to the United States four or five times a year on business, said that depending on his final destination, the journey can take more than 20 hours and include two transfers.

The chief technology officer of research and development (Asia) at PerkinElmer, a life sciences research company at Ayer Rajah Crescent, added: 'It can be very irritating when you have stopovers, because you have to lug your hand luggage in and out of the plane, join queues and go through security checks.' One of his company's vice-presidents, Mr John Tan, 40, who was on board too, said the non-stop flight allowed him to better divide his time working and sleeping.

Because there are 181 seats instead of the usual 300 plus, passengers had more leg room and found it easier to move around during the flight between the two meals served, and to get to the snack bars. There, they could pick up chocolate bars and chips in economy and hot snacks like omelettes and instant noodles in business class. Champagne was served throughout the flight.

Flight fares currently costs the same as on SIA's other planes - $1,800 for economy and $7,000 for business class. Despite their long hours of work, the cabin crew still looked fresh when they said their good-byes. The real challenge, however, is expected to be the flight back to Singapore which is expected to take almost 19 hours because the plane will be flying against the wind.

-- With additional information from Jane Ng and Goh Chin Lian

18-hour flight? So fast so good

Karamjit Kaur flew more than over 14,000km to LA and back on SIA's new long-range aircraft. Will such non-stop long-haul flights take off?

I WAS not looking forward to the flight home from Los Angeles.

Singapore Airlines (SIA) flight SQ19 was almost full and the prospect of being cooped up in a cattle-class economy seat for 18 1/2 hours without a break was pretty depressing.

The non-stop 14,700km flight was made possible because of the new, long-range Airbus aircraft we were flying in - the A340-500.

It is hard to overstate the impact that this new plane would have on air travel.

It can fly from Asia to the United States, without making stopovers along the way, saving travellers precious time.

I had travelled in business class on the inaugural flight from Singapore to Los Angeles on Feb 3, during which the seats recline to flat beds, and was resigned to a sleepless journey home in the economy class.

But one look at the plane interior and the gloom lifted.

Airbus had designed the aircraft for 313 passengers in a three-class configuration. But SIA decided to go with just 181 seats - 64 in business class and 117 executive economy.

The economy class seats are arranged in a 2-3-2 configuration instead of the usual eight seats in a row.

The result: the seats are 51cm wide, instead of 46cm, and the leg room is 94cm instead of 81cm - or 13cm more. I could also lean back 20cm, an extra 5cm.

The extra centimetres made a world of difference.

I could stretch my legs out fully, which meant less stress on the knees.

Each seat also comes with a foot rest which I didn't really fancy because when I reclined my seat, I ended up resting my calves on the foot rest, which made me very uncomfortable.

Another peeve: the arm rests in the executive economy class don't pull up, so I could not stretch out even though the next seat was unoccupied.

Popular spots on board were the passenger meeting areas - one at the front of the plane for business class travellers and another at the back, for economy class passengers.

Here, up to six passengers can gather around a bar-like counter and talk, an innovative design welcomed by travellers who cannot sleep or who want to stretch their legs.

I helped myself to the snacks available - muffins, fruits, chocolate bars, chips and instant noodles - and chatted with the passengers and the flight crew.

Mr Lee Devlin, 44, an engineer based in Colorado, could not get over the extra leg room in economy class.

He said: 'At first, I was a little worried that the 18-hour flight was going to be gruelling.

'But the seats are comfortable and the food is good.'

Mr Ignatius J. Rasiah, 46, who flies to the US four or five times a year on business, said this new non-stop flight would appeal to corporate travellers.

The chief technology officer of research and development (Asia) at PerkinElmer, a life sciences research company at Ayer Rajah Crescent, said: 'It allows you to plan your time better so you decide when to work, when to sleep and when to watch movies.

'A regular flight with a stop disrupts not just your work but also your thought process, which can be very frustrating.'

Just ask Mrs Preethi Amarasekera, 38, who flew from Washington to Los Angeles, got on the SQ flight, landed at Changi and took a connecting flight to Manila where she lives and works at the Asian Development Bank.

All this, with her one-year-old girl in tow.

She said: 'It's such a pain having to push the stroller in and out of planes.

'So if you ask me, the fewer the stops, the better.'

Although the airline encourages passengers to take regular walks in the cabin to prevent deep vein thrombosis, many chose to stay in their seats.

For those who did not want to sleep or read, there was plenty of entertainment.

Passengers in both classes could choose from 29 movies, 47 video games, 78 television shows and 102 compact discs.

Movies included those that had not yet been released in Singapore such as Out Of Time and Runaway Jury.

The individual screens are bigger than usual and I especially liked a new feature which let me pause, fast forward and rewind a movie or drama as I pleased.

But the control box, which is placed under every seat, proved irksome.

Indian businessman Ravindra Badkar, 70, who is based in Los Angeles, found it difficult to stretch out his legs 'because I kept hitting the metal box'.

Surprisingly, I got more sleep - five hours straight - flying economy on the way back.

The bottom line: If you're willing to fork out $7,000, go ahead and enjoy the flat beds, lobster meals and loo with a view in business class.

Me, I would rather pay $1,800 and fly executive economy.

You get the same good service, the same entertainment choices and the same silverware.

The food may be less fancy but I'm not too bothered about that.

Mr Peter Harbison, managing director of the Sydney-based Centre for Asia Pacific Aviation, was convinced that the long-haul service would appeal to corporate travellers.

'Even with fewer seats, I am sure SIA will make money from this service.'

I landed at Changi Airport at 5.45am on Feb 8, more than 17 hours after taking to the sky.

My husband, who was waiting for me at the airport, looked at me and said: 'No way you flew 18 hours.

'You don't look tired at all!'

Funny my wife flew to Djakarta with SQ two days ago and they used a A345 Leadership to do the job !

Anyway, she quite liked the seats and she said the plane is very quiet (4 engines rules) compared to a 777.

But it looks like there's not much space for the SQ staff iun between the aisles.

Regards,

Originally posted by Julien

Funny my wife flew to Djakarta with SQ two days ago and they used a A345 Leadership to do the job !

Anyway, she quite liked the seats and she said the plane is very quiet (4 engines rules) compared to a 777.

But it looks like there's not much space for the SQ staff iun between the aisles.

Regards, I was surprised, until I went to check it out and realised it is indeed being used on SQ154 and SQ161
between Singapore and Jakarta!! :eek:!

I dont think your wife paid a premium for the fight right? And did she have access to the snack bar?

i think the planes are being used for the special $200 flights to three destinations? jakarta.. bangkok and somewhere else i forgot...

Originally posted by heirloom

i think the planes are being used for the special $200 flights to three destinations? jakarta.. bangkok and somewhere else i forgot... Huh? They use seats with more space and sell the seats more cheaply?? What a good deal?! :D

yealor... should fly to perth....

Originally posted by huaiwei

I was surprised, until I went to check it out and realised it is indeed being used on SQ154 and SQ161
between Singapore and Jakarta!! :eek:!

I dont think your wife paid a premium for the fight right? And did she have access to the snack bar?

Not sure whether she paid a premium, it was a business trip paid by her company.

She did not go to the snack bar, but yeah she said it was available.

She liked the seats very much !

On a sidenote, I have to say I very much miss the SQ A343 for SNG-CDG trip. It was unbelievably quiet and the layout was as good as B747 or B777 in terms of passenger comfort. Now SQ uses the B777, a very fine aircraft but noisy compared to the A343.

Rgds,

She should have taken advantage of the snack bar...I am wondering whats on offer there! :D

As for the A343...it seems like all of them have been removed from the SIA fleet by now?

Posted: 04 May 2004 2118 hrs

Transponder hitch causes hijack alarm aboard SIA plane to US

By S Ramesh, Channel NewsAsia

SINGAPORE: A hijack scare on a SIA plane heading for Los Angeles on Tuesday turned out to be a false alarm.

Nevertheless, US authorities scrambled an F-16 to fly alongside the plane and armed police stormed the aircraft when it landed.

During the 16-hour non-stop flight, the brand new Airbus A345 jetliner began transmitting a hijack alert.

The alert was picked up by air traffic controllers and US authorities responded immediately.

An American F-16 fighter jet was scrambled to escort the ultra long-haul jet carrying 126 passengers and 14 crew.

The SIA flight was then ordered to land in a remote section of LA International Airport.

Reports from Los Angeles say that as soon as the SIA plane landed, armed police officers stormed the aircraft and hostage negotiation teams rushed to the scene.

But within minutes, it was confirmed that the emergency hijack signal was a false alarm.

The alarm code must be manually entered by the pilot.

A US Federal Aviation Administration spokesman said the pilot of Flight SQ20 assured US authorities that the transponder had malfunctioned.

Singapore Airlines says the incident is under investigation. - CNA

The plane was used by SQ for a trial flight to Jakarta, Bangkok and Bali in the January 2004, yet another A345 that just arrive 2 months ago was in trial flight for jakarta-Singapore.

cheers

The plane was used by SQ for a trial flight to Jakarta, Bangkok and Bali in the January 2004, yet another A345 that just arrive 2 months ago was in trial flight for jakarta-Singapore.

cheers
Trail flight? It was discussed earlier in this thread that the A345 seems to be used on the Sg-Jakarta sector, perhaps when it has landed in Singapore and it has enough idle time left to hope over to Jakarta and back! :D

LOL, it would be fun if they do that as i am krisflyer member :lol:

I had enough of 777s in Jkt-Sg routes....can you imagine, 9 times a day with 777, i want A345 back in Jakarta ! :drunk:


cheers

I heard SIA was also considering direct flights EWR - SIN, skipping the stop in AMS. Any thruth to that?
Turns out that what you heard was true indeed! :eek:

SIA to fly to NY in longest non-stop service

The Straits Times
MAY 3, 2004

SINGAPORE Airlines (SIA) begins a non-stop service to New York on June 28 that will take 18 hours in each direction - a new record for the world's longest non-stop flight. The daily service promises to cut travel time by up to four hours.

Fares have not been finalised, but passengers can expect to pay about S$2,000 for a round-trip economy-class ticket, the same price for a flight with a transit point.

With the new service, SIA will increase the frequency of its flights to New York from 11 times weekly to 14. Passengers can still fly to New York via Frankfurt but SIA will stop flying to the Big Apple via Amsterdam when the non-stop service starts.

The New York service beats the previous record for non-stop flights, held by another SIA service: The 16-hour one to Los Angeles which was launched in February.

http://img.singaporeair.com/saa/main/portlets/global/en_UK/images/t2_news_newsrel.jpg

Singapore Airlines To Fly Non-Stop To New York From 28 June 2004

3 May 2004

Singapore Airlines (SIA) will commence its non-stop service to New York from 28 June 2004.

The Singapore to New York flight will set a new record for the world’s longest non-stop commercial flight, beating the existing record set on 3 February this year with the launch of SIA non-stop services between Singapore and Los Angeles.

SIA’s record-breaking A340-500 aircraft, called the A345LeaderShip, will travel over 16,600 km (around 9,000 nautical miles) on the Singapore to New York route. The flight will take about 18 hours in each direction and save passengers up to four hours in travel time, as compared to the existing one-stop services.

The distance covered on SIA’s Singapore to Los Angeles service is 14,762 km or 7,971 nm.

Flight SQ22 will depart Singapore for New York (Newark airport) at 1205 hours and arrive in the Big Apple at 1830 hours the same day. The return service will depart from Newark at 2300 hours and touch down in Singapore at 0535 hours two days later.

“The schedule allows passengers to connect easily to onward points in the US and to other parts of Asia, depending on the direction of travel,” said Mr Huang Cheng Eng, SIA’s Executive Vice President, Marketing and the Regions. “Business travellers, in particular, will appreciate the convenience and time savings of non-stop travel, as well as the spaciousness and comfort of the A345LeaderShip.”

With this daily non-stop service, SIA will increase its frequency to New York from 11 to 14 times weekly. This includes the daily one-stop service SIA operates via Frankfurt to the city. The existing one-stop service via Amsterdam, which operates four times weekly, will be discontinued.

SIA A345LeaderShip

The non-stop service will be operated using SIA’s ultra-long-range A345Leadership, the world’s first all premium long-haul aircraft. Specially designed for the business traveller, it focuses on customer comfort and convenience and features just 181 seats in a spacious two-class configuration.

The new Executive Economy Class offers 117 seats in a 2-3-2 configuration, with a seat pitch of 37 inches and a seat-back recline of eight inches. The Executive Economy Class seat is also industry’s widest at 20 inches, and is complimented with a leather adjustable headrest, an innovative leg and foot rest, a nine inch personal video monitor, and AC power supply outlets for customers who wish to power up their laptops in-flight.

The Raffles (business) Class Cabin features 64 of the Airline’s renowned lie-flat SpaceBeds. Arranged in a 2-2-2 configuration, the seats have a wider seat pitch at 64 inches, a bed width of 26 inches, a bed length of 78 inches, adjustable headrest, leg rest and lumbar support, a 10.4 inch personal video monitor, AC power supply, and a DVD port.

All seats are equipped with SIA’s well-known in-flight entertainment system, KrisWorld, offering over 300 entertainment options, including 60 on-demand movies, over 75 TV programmes and a host of music, technology, travel and children’s programmes. The system also features over 100 music CD albums, and more than 30 Nintendo® games. With “on-demand” audio, TV, and movie channels, the passenger is able to pause, fast-forward or rewind a CD or movie anytime.

This premium aircraft is designed to allow passengers to move around and socialize if they wish to with passenger corners in both Raffles and Executive Economy Class cabins, where passengers can stretch out while helping themselves to an array of drinks and snacks.

LOL, it would be fun if they do that as i am krisflyer member :lol:

I had enough of 777s in Jkt-Sg routes....can you imagine, 9 times a day with 777, i want A345 back in Jakarta ! :drunk:


cheers
You must be truly priviledged to be a member...I cant afford it myself! :D

They do indeed use A345 on that sector. Check out SQ154 and SQ156 for instance! :eek: :D I actually wonder if they stock the snack bars!

you can actually be a member just by joining on singaporeair.com :P no flights needed haha... but word of advise - it'd be better to join UA's mileage programme - the points do not expire as long as you fly once every 36 months (on any star alliance airline), whereas your krisflyer miles expire and pouf you can't use them. so you can like fly on singaporeair and credit the miles to ua and use the ua miles to redeem sq flights :D excellent isnt it :D :D
:D
:D
i'm loony a little now because i have been writing an essay
for
hours
:D

I've just heard that Singapore airlines will be providing the longest non stop trip which will be from Singapore to Los Angeles. The trip should take eighteen hours and elimnates the stop over in Tokyo or Tiapei

What do you think?


Jeez....I believe I wouldn´t like the non-stop trip, I would probably miss standing up in Tokyo or Taipei´s airport

Yea heirloom is correct, you can joined krisflyer, just go to the website and sign up :)

cheers

Flyling 11 hours from Sao Paulo to Toronto wasn't so bad!

Actually it was quite fun, I spent the whole time talking to a girl in the plane heheh :D

Yea heirloom is correct, you can joined krisflyer, just go to the website and sign up :)

cheers
I am talking about having an account and REMAINING as a member with them of coz! :D

LOL, well cmon, of course you can afford to remain as a member ! :cheers:


cheers

LOL, well cmon, of course you can afford to remain as a member ! :cheers:


cheers
I wish I could! :D Even when I flew to Bangkok last year, I took Cathay instead...coz its amongst the cheapest while still giving me reasonable service! :D

Flyling 11 hours from Sao Paulo to Toronto wasn't so bad!

Actually it was quite fun, I spent the whole time talking to a girl in the plane heheh :D

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http://messenger.msn.es/Resource/emoticons/red_smile.gif
I suppose you find that a reasonable excuse to take a long haul flight? :D

Actually I don't know why Singapore Airline claimed that they have the longest nonstop service from Singapore to LAX in the first place. During the opening of Hong Kong international Airport a nonstop flight from NYC to HK by Cathay Pacific was the longest nonstop flight and the first ever airliner to fly over the polar regions.

Well, i can explain that, SIA is the 1st one who fly nonstop from sg to lax, no doubt about it, Cathay also the 1st one who fly from HK to NYC, yet...no doubt about it.

Now, check the flight routes on how SIA fly from SIN to NYC and compare that to Cathay on HKG to NYC, you wil get the figure afterwards :D


cheers

LOL, it would be fun if they do that as i am krisflyer member :lol:

I had enough of 777s in Jkt-Sg routes....can you imagine, 9 times a day with 777, i want A345 back in Jakarta ! :drunk:


cheers

Hey same here my wife used to get the 345 as well on her trips to Jakarta but now it's the triple 7 all the time.

Actually I don't know why Singapore Airline claimed that they have the longest nonstop service from Singapore to LAX in the first place. During the opening of Hong Kong international Airport a nonstop flight from NYC to HK by Cathay Pacific was the longest nonstop flight and the first ever airliner to fly over the polar regions.
Er...SIA is saying it is the longest non-stop REGULAR scheduled flight! :) Or does cathay fly that route regularly too? What airplane was used, btw?

I suppose you find that a reasonable excuse to take a long haul flight? :D

Absolutely hell yes.

BTW...found this listing from USA Today with a listing of the world's longest flights. I added the sg-NYC one for comparison's sake:

New York City/Newark to Singapore: 10315 miles (16600 km), 18 hours
Los Angeles to Singapore: 9173 miles (14762 km), 18 hours 40 minutes (16 hours back)
New York City/Newark to Hong Kong: 8044 miles (12946 km), 16 hours
Chicago to Hong Kong: 7768 miles (12501 km) 15 hours, 50 minutes
Los Angeles to Hong Kong: 7320 miles (11780 km) 15 hours, 45 minutes

Yeap, thats why i said route flights comparison is the best, basically SIA fly from sg to LA via hk then japan then alaska then LA :D


cheers

Obviously Singapore-Los ANgeles is a longer distance than HK-NY.

Why else would SIA acquire the ultra-long range A340-500 to handle this route for if it could use its existing fleet which are similar to Cathays....

Yeap, thats why i said route flights comparison is the best, basically SIA fly from sg to LA via hk then japan then alaska then LA :D


cheers
Huh? The distances I listed were for the non-stop flights! :D Anyway SIA's one-stop flights are either at Tokyo or Taipei. :)

Why don't they fly directly from, at least, Tokyo to Los Angeles without that weird stop in Alaska?

I mean, LA - Tokyo is kind of the same as Sao Paulo - Paris, however SP - Paris has no stops!

Why don't they fly directly from, at least, Tokyo to Los Angeles without that weird stop in Alaska?

I mean, LA - Tokyo is kind of the same as Sao Paulo - Paris, however SP - Paris has no stops!
Er....there is no stop in Alaska. :D

Its nonstop, so the plane fly through HK, japan, alaska then LA but not making any stop, just in airspace :D

cheers

Its nonstop, so the plane fly through HK, japan, alaska then LA but not making any stop, just in airspace :D

cheers
Oh..now I understand what you are saying! Sorry for the mistake! :)

What about the non-stop service service from LAX and SFO to SYD with Qantas and United? Aren't those longer????? :dizzy:

Handling of false hijack alert criticised

Airport police accused of overreacting; they blame poor communication

LOS ANGELES - The decision to allow a SWAT team to storm a Singapore Airlines jet on Monday after it had sent a computerised hijack alert has sparked a debate among law enforcement officials here on whether the action had violated protocol and jeopardised the safety of those on board.

The hijack alert turned out to be a false alarm, brought on by a malfunctioning transponder on SQ20.

Several law enforcement sources, including some from the Los Angeles Police Department (LAPD), complained that Los Angles International Airport police had overstepped their authority by sending SWAT officers onto the plane.

But airport officials said it was necessary to board the plane right away because they were not certain if a hijacking was under way.

The quarrel underscores the jurisdictional complexities that involve protecting the airport, aircraft and passengers.

At least six agencies are charged with security at the airport here, including the FBI, Transportation Security Administration, the LAPD and the independent airport Police Department.

'Every addition to the alphabet soup of agencies at the airport potentially adds to confusion in times of crisis,' Councilman Jack Weiss said.

Questions about the ground response followed disclosures that several federal agencies had known that the flight's transponder was malfunctioning for at least four hours, but had failed to notify airport officials and local law enforcement about the problem.

The communication breakdown left local law enforcement agencies scrambling to deal with the plane just minutes before it landed.

Aboard the plane were 126 passengers and 14 crew members on a Singapore-LA non-stop flight.

On Wednesday, Los Angeles Mayor James Hahn sent a letter to Transportation Secretary Norman Mineta, calling for a probe on why local officials had not been alerted about SQ20.

'Given the events of Sept 11, the close coordination between agencies and existence and use of a tight notification process is critical,' Mr Hahn wrote.

'Monday's events were a very poor example of that.'

Airport officials said the lack of information about the flight's status ultimately led an armed airport police SWAT team to board the jet.

LAPD and federal officials have criticised the decision as an overreaction, with one official trained in counter-terrorism describing it as 'a very dangerous move'. -- Los Angeles Times

Posted 2/4/2004 10:20 PM

Fliers on world's longest flight get room to move

By Chris Woodyard, USA TODAY

ABOARD SINGAPORE AIRLINES FLIGHT 19 — Twelve hours into the new longest scheduled flight in the world, a spirited political discussion has broken out around the stand-up lounge in the back of the plane.

Mo Rajan, an Alameda, Calif., consultant from Seat 16C, and Providence retiree Glenn Short, 62, who's assigned to Seat 39, are debating whether President Bush started out as an isolationist. While they disagree on politics, they agree the flight passes faster when they can get up, walk around and socialize. "It breaks up the flight for you," Short says. "It makes you much more comfortable."

The 18½-hour trip from Los Angeles to Singapore began Tuesday night and ended Wednesday afternoon Pacific Time, setting a new standard for airliner conviviality. But Singapore Airlines officials say they hope the features they've built into their Airbus A-340 will encourage more socializing on future flights, perhaps making being cooped up in a plane for the equivalent of two workdays more bearable. At least this non-stop flight saves passengers a two-hour stopover in Taipei or Tokyo.

The improvements are well-timed. L.A.-Singapore non-stops are only the start of a new run of ultralong airline flights. Singapore Airlines plans to start New York-to-Singapore non-stops in June. Though the route is longer in miles, favorable winds are expected to hold travel time to 18 hours flat, saving passengers six hours in travel time. Later this year, Emirates will launch 17-hour non-stops between San Francisco and Dubai.

Tonight, passengers are lucky. The new Airbus A-340, designed in a two-class arrangement to be more spacious, carries only 151 fliers among its 181 seats. The empty middle seats allow a weary flier to stretch out.

Most significantly, the layout encourages passengers to stand up and walk around. They can congregate in the stand-up lounge or go around the corner to grab a banana or bag of Cooler Ranch Doritos from a complimentary snack bar.

The stand-up bar and sandwich area in coach "take up valuable real estate on board, but we felt it was essential for the comfort of passengers to provide social space," says Teng Kwong Yeoh, Singapore Airlines' senior manager for product development.

The airline hopes touches like these, along with the time savings, will justify the higher fares it charges for this non-stop flight on the way to its Asian hub. There, Flight 19 connects to 56 destinations.

Bragging rights for the longest flight have leapfrogged since the dawn of the Jet Age. Until this week, the longest scheduled non-stop was Continental Airlines' flight from Newark to Hong Kong, which takes 16 hours.

Longer flights are a product of technological advances — planes built to stretch the limits of range. The Airbus A-340 model that Singapore and Emirates fly is designed to go farther than any other jet, a maximum 10,200 miles without refueling. A 301-seat Boeing 777 model set for delivery in 2006 will fly 10,700 miles. That new jet will be able to fly from New York to Sydney, a distance of 10,562 miles, although not with a full load of passengers.

The new planes solve some problems for airlines. By skipping refueling points, airlines don't have to worry about exceeding their allocation of scarce takeoff and landing rights at congested airports such as Tokyo.

They also give airlines a marketing edge. Quicker flights command higher fares. Business travelers often consider speed and convenience more important than price.

Singapore is charging an average of about 10% more for Flight 19 and its return, Flight 20, compared with the airline's fares for its one-stop flights, says airline spokesman James Boyd.

Money saved on fuel and landing fees is offset by the tradeoff in revenue because the Airbus jet has fewer seats than the airline's Boeing 747s used for other flights.

Instead of the usual three-class arrangement, Singapore's long-range Airbus has only business class and premium economy.

Wider seats

On the Web site, the introductory fare for premium coach on the non-stops was listed at $1,122 round trip last week, including taxes. The existing one-stop coach fares were priced last week from $609 to $926 round trip for the same travel dates.

To keep passengers happy for such an extended period, coach seats are 3 inches wider than the standard 17 inches on Singapore. The distance between seats is about 5 inches more than in regular coach. Seats recline 8 inches, 2 inches more than standard coach. They have head- and footrests and a power port.

Business-class seats become lie-flat beds.

Of course, being on a flight for so long lends itself to mingling. As passengers walked around to stretch, they met other passengers in the lounge. It's small. A sign on the wall says only six passengers should congregate at any time.

"When I read up on it, I wasn't sure. At first, I thought it was a 'bar-bar,' " where alcohol was served, says Suraphol Sresthaphunlard, who works in sales for an engineering firm in Houston.

He adds he was pleasantly surprised to find a stand-up area where passengers can sip soft drinks and mingle.

Other long-haul airlines contemplate similar moves that could bring passengers together. Virgin plans to introduce Internet-style chat rooms on planes starting later this year. Passengers will be able to type in a message on their in-flight entertainment system that all the passengers can read, then wait for replies. "We wanted to create these little communities," says spokeswoman Lysette Gauna.

Singapore rejected one Virgin touch that also brings passengers together. There are no masseuses on board. Yeoh says the airline did not think a massage chair would fit in.

There are air-to-ground telephones — one for every seat — but no onboard Internet yet. Boyd says high-speed e-mail and Internet could arrive as soon as this summer.

Until then, the airline continues to look to its traditional draws, such as food. In addition to serving three meals, Singapore's marathon flight also offers passengers choices of hot and cold snacks, such as pasta and sushi.

Although major U.S. airlines fly to Asia, none have embraced the kind of high-service concepts seen in coach on this flight. Spokesmen for United, American and Continental say they cling to efficient, basic service in coach but nothing fancy.

To handle the higher level of service, Singapore has 14 flight attendants, three fewer than would be on a 747 with double the passenger capacity. The plane carries extra crew because there's no refueling stop in which to bring aboard fresh staff. There's one flight attendant for every seven passengers in business class, compared with one for every 10 on the one-stop flights. In coach, the ratio is one for every 23 passengers compared with the usual one for every 32.

The plane has extra bunks for pilots and crew. The commander of the flight, Siew Loong Leong, says crew bunk areas are quieter and more spacious than on other jets. He and his co-pilot take turns resting about every three hours with longer breaks later in the flight as they alternate with another team of pilots.

Made for long flights

The service touches complement other features designed into a plane made for long flights. Cabin colors are muted. Lighting is soft. Designers consider the passenger experience a success if no one recalls much about the cabin.

"You remember the in-flight service, the crew, and you have no real recollection of what was around you," says Alan Pardoe, Airbus' product marketing director for the A-330 and A-340.

Splashy graphics are out: "If it's something like a big logo, you would probably want to tear it off the bulkhead after 18 hours."

That's important. Most passengers on this flight simply dozed most of the time.

Early in the flight, Ruben Toral, 66, a retired textile executive from Charlotte, proclaimed the extended length "scary" and wondered how he and wife, Elizabeth, 67, would hold up. More than halfway through, Toral says he's feeling "magnificent."

He pauses a second and adds, "Magnificently tired."

http://images.usatoday.com/money/_photos/2004/02/05/long-flight.jpg
Singapore Airlines' new SpaceBeds have a 64-inch seat pitch.
By Robert Hanashiro,USA TODAY

Posted 2/4/2004 10:35 PM

3 meals, 2 desserts and some gin and tonic

By Chris Woodyard, USA TODAY

ABOARD SINGAPORE AIRLINES FLIGHT 19 — Are we there yet? The juvenile refrain is beginning to be heard among the hushed voices of adults aboard the world's new longest scheduled flight. It's 15 hours into the first non-stop airline flight from Los Angeles to Singapore. Three hours are left.

The cabin is a reassuring mix of jet whoosh, snores, sniffles and the thump-thump of sock-covered feet sauntering in the aisles. The cabin lights are turned up for the first time in about eight hours, signaling a second round of hot towels. Passengers try in vain to wipe away their fatigue.

Although the coach seats have about 5 inches more legroom and a little more recline, sleeping is still a tossing-and-turning ordeal. I caught about five hours of shut-eye thanks to a gin and tonic and the donation of an Ambien sleeping tablet. The real action is in the back of the coach section.

A lively crowd, known worldwide as people with thick British accents, have gathered in the little lounge that is this Singapore Airlines jet's most unusual feature. They tell airline stories with animated gestures in the brightly lit area — really a beige-walled cubicle with a table built into the wall to lean on or place a drink. A curtain separates them from their slumbering fellow travelers.

Flight 19 is the ultimate red-eye. It's supposed to cater to business travelers who write off a sleepless night as the price of getting the deal done. But this particular flight attracted every kind of flier — executives, retirees, vacationers, aviation buffs and working reporters.

No matter the reason for their travels, passengers say they're willing to pay extra to avoid making a refueling stop. "I think it was a few hundred dollars (more), but it was worth it for the time," says Lily Daneshgar, 46, of Los Angeles.

If she's like most passengers, she also risks landing a little heavier. Over 181/2 hours, my food intake consisted of a sandwich at the gate (avoiding the cake), a dinner of fish with pesto and a scoop of Häagen-Dazs vanilla ice cream for dessert, a yogurt cup, another dinner of stuffed chicken and custard cake for dessert, all washed down by liquids of every variety. I arrived tired, but not hungry.

Wow ,SIA would have the world's longest and second longest non-stop flights soon!

A great success and pride for Singapore!:D

What about the non-stop service service from LAX and SFO to SYD with Qantas and United? Aren't those longer?????

I've been flying from LAX to Syd and its not longer compare to SIA SG-LAX/NYC, which have 18 hours block time, It was only 10 hours from LAX to SYD when i used Qantas.


cheers

I've been flying from LAX to Syd and its not longer compare to SIA SG-LAX/NYC, which have 18 hours block time, It was only 10 hours from LAX to SYD when i used Qantas.


cheers
Gee..you seem to fly ALOT all over the place! :D

Hey a question for you guys. When Planes fly from US to Asia lets say LAX to HKG, why do they fly all the way up to the bottom of Alaska pass down to Japan then to HKG, why not just go in a straight line to HKG instead of a curve? Is it because for safety reasons, so at any given time they are close to the coast? Or is it because its actually shorter on a globe while it looks longer on a flat map?

Hey a question for you guys. When Planes fly from US to Asia lets say LAX to HKG, why do they fly all the way up to the bottom of Alaska pass down to Japan then to HKG, why not just go in a straight line to HKG instead of a curve? Is it because for safety reasons, so at any given time they are close to the coast? Or is it because its actually shorter on a globe while it looks longer on a flat map?
Hmm....I think I read somewhere that they use the coastline for navigational purposes or something....but I will try to verify this later if I can. Anyway, good question! :)

Gee..you seem to fly ALOT all over the place!

Nah, its just happened like that because mom lives in states and i am staying in melbourne, but its like twice a year though, travel is very expensive nowadays. :D

Hey a question for you guys. When Planes fly from US to Asia lets say LAX to HKG, why do they fly all the way up to the bottom of Alaska pass down to Japan then to HKG, why not just go in a straight line to HKG instead of a curve? Is it because for safety reasons, so at any given time they are close to the coast? Or is it because its actually shorter on a globe while it looks longer on a flat map?

I assume maybe it shorter and safer, because if something happen they can communicate and if necessary landing on the airport they passed. Again, its just my assumption :D

cheers

Hey a question for you guys. When Planes fly from US to Asia lets say LAX to HKG, why do they fly all the way up to the bottom of Alaska pass down to Japan then to HKG, why not just go in a straight line to HKG instead of a curve? Is it because for safety reasons, so at any given time they are close to the coast? Or is it because its actually shorter on a globe while it looks longer on a flat map?

This is part of the Great Circle Route theory. Since the earth is spherical, when you cut a plane across the polar regions, the circumference of the cut is small compared to cutting a plane across the equator. The theory goes along the lines that because of the spherical property, the shortest distance between two cities would be a great circle and not a straight line projected on a 2-dimensional map. Hence the shortest route between North America and Asia is a route over the North Pole. Due to political concerns that was not possible until recently.

So airplanes fly routes that are near great circles, going up to Alaska and then coming back down across the US. Many flights from Europe to Asia follow the same logic. As long as they fly near the Arctic - the thinner circumference polar region - they save distance.

This is part of the Great Circle Route theory. Since the earth is spherical, when you cut a plane across the polar regions, the circumference of the cut is small compared to cutting a plane across the equator. The theory goes along the lines that because of the spherical property, the shortest distance between two cities would be a great circle and not a straight line projected on a 2-dimensional map. Hence the shortest route between North America and Asia is a route over the North Pole. Due to political concerns that was not possible until recently.

So airplanes fly routes that are near great circles, going up to Alaska and then coming back down across the US. Many flights from Europe to Asia follow the same logic. As long as they fly near the Arctic - the thinner circumference polar region - they save distance.
Just for illustration, what was once the longest scheduled aviation route, the one between NYC and HK via Continental Airlines, was via the north pole using a B777-200ER. When SIA flew to LA without using the polar region, it has to use a longer flight path, which the B777 do not have sufficient range for. The A345 provided the needed range, and helped it to be able to accomplish that. The sg-NYC one will be over the polar region, and takes almost the same time as the sg-LA one...18 hours! :)

The polar routes used to be impossible to fly because of problems on the Russian side. Since the first passenger flight from New York to Hong Kong by Cathay Pacific in 1998, the Russian side has gradually opened up and more airlines are taking advantage of the airspace for significant fuel and time savings.

In fact, Russia has a lot to gain, because they are a key stakeholder in the Europe-Asia and North America-Asia great circle routes.

The polar routes used to be impossible to fly because of problems on the Russian side. Since the first passenger flight from New York to Hong Kong by Cathay Pacific in 1998, the Russian side has gradually opened up and more airlines are taking advantage of the airspace for significant fuel and time savings.

In fact, Russia has a lot to gain, because they are a key stakeholder in the Europe-Asia and North America-Asia great circle routes.
Yeah...and interestingly, they didnt make it a regular flight until later this year.

Anyway....I dont know who was asking for information about the opening of the polar route (how come when ppl dont ask for info, it gets furnished, and when ppl ask for it, it dosent), but what is clear, is that SIA managed to fly the two longest passenger routes in the world. One via the polar route, and the other via the rim of the Pacific! :D

Actually, the opening of the polar routes actually helps airlines fly longer and faster. What used to require a technical stop now can be done nonstop. Of course it can only achieved by both improved aircraft design and route planning.

Although there are significant savings flying eastbound during the winter time because of the prevailing winds even for older Airbuses.

Actually, the opening of the polar routes actually helps airlines fly longer and faster. What used to require a technical stop now can be done nonstop. Of course it can only achieved by both improved aircraft design and route planning.

Although there are significant savings flying eastbound during the winter time because of the prevailing winds even for older Airbuses.
At the same time, thou, not all extremely long routes can use it. The sg-LA one is shorter by not using the polar route, for example, but the sg-NYC route has to go polar.

In practice, airlines fly the polar route from the North American East Coast to Asia because passing through the North Pole is actually feasible Thus airlines fly polar between New York and Hong Kong (Cathay Pacific, Continental, etc.) West Coast flights still fly around Alaska and down the other side of the Bering Strait through Japan because it is west of the North Pole. It wouldn't make geographical sense to fly east then west again. Nevertheless the Alaska routing still a big circle route albeit not polar.

In practice, airlines fly the polar route from the North American East Coast to Asia because passing through the North Pole is actually feasible Thus airlines fly polar between New York and Hong Kong (Cathay Pacific, Continental, etc.) West Coast flights still fly around Alaska and down the other side of the Bering Strait through Japan because it is west of the North Pole. It wouldn't make geographical sense to fly east then west again. Nevertheless the Alaska routing still a big circle route albeit not polar.
Yeah.....as is what SIA is obviously doing for both cases?

A lot of airlines are flying the Alaska route and / or the polar route, not just SIA. Carriers that have flown the polar route include Cathay Pacific and Continental, and a whole score of airlines cross the Bering Strait via the Alaska route - Cathay Pacific, Korean Air, etc.

A lot of airlines are flying the Alaska route and / or the polar route, not just SIA. Carriers that have flown the polar route include Cathay Pacific and Continental, and a whole score of airlines cross the Bering Strait via the Alaska route - Cathay Pacific, Korean Air, etc.

Not all routes can benefit from the polar routes. Agree with the great circle theory. The polor routes will only benefit those airports which are further north, away from the equator (opposite is true for the southern hemisphere). For example, to fly from Singapore (very near the equator) to another city near the equator (say, Kampal, Nairobi, Quito or Bogota), the great circle in this case will be the along the equator, and not through the poles.

Polar routes will benefit the US East Coast because of geographical location (fly north then west) while West Coast flights will still prefer the great circle route around Alaska since they'll need to fly east to cross the North Pole and then west down Asia.

Of course, geography is a major determinant of the routing. It'll be silly for airlines to fly from Sydney to Anchorage to Los Angeles.

Not all routes can benefit from the polar routes. Agree with the great circle theory. The polor routes will only benefit those airports which are further north, away from the equator (opposite is true for the southern hemisphere). For example, to fly from Singapore (very near the equator) to another city near the equator (say, Kampal, Nairobi, Quito or Bogota), the great circle in this case will be the along the equator, and not through the poles.
Actually it is not just a case of pure distance alone. Jet streams do play a part as well, and their effect can be reduced when a flight is taken over the poles. Sometimes it is more economical to fly a circumfrencial route westward if the distance invovled allows for both flights to take place.

Jet streams can shorten a long flight, but if it means travelling more distance to cancel the effects of a shorter route over the calmer polar regions, then is it worth it? For example, jet stream gains are evident in the eastbound Hong Kong - New York and Hong Kong - Toronto routes in the winter, but airlines are still willing to fly the polar route because there are more savings.

Hence route planners at airlines have to do a lot of work optimizing their route structures to save fuel and travelling time.

An 18 hour flight...wow that's very long.....but I will try it anyway....

Would you try it, forumers??

I'm glad you posted that question, Stan, because I feel strongly about it.

I doubt i'd be able to stand an 18 hour flight, though i'd be game for a try. Most likely, i'd spend half the time asleep, staring out the window, or chewing on some fruit snack. It'd be a bonus if it were an SIA flight, because then i'd check out KrisWorld. Still, 18 hours of watching blockbuster hits and playing nintendo games could potentially be pretty brain-numbing.

i would try! i want to try economy plus! *make country bumpkin face* besides, there's never enough time to both sleep and watch free movies

i would try! i want to try economy plus! *make country bumpkin face* besides, there's never enough time to both sleep and watch free movies

Ah! A movie junkie, i see! On my flight home from Fukuoka(it's only a 6hr flight), i watched both Johnny English and Thomas the Tank Engine, and i must say they were quite enjoyable, though i found the Tank Engine one a tad shallow(i wonder why). The delicious cookies served did a good job of distracting me from the boredom that started shortly after.

Actually I was wondering if I can really "tahan" (stand) being in an restricted area for 18 hours....I tend to freak out when being forced to sit still for too long (cant even last a 2 hour lecture for eg)! :D

So if you catch me on that flight, I would probably be found at the passenger lounge instead of in my seat most of the time. :)

I can hardly stand a 8 hour bus ride to Genting ,much less than a 18 hour journey.

But i guess if you're with friends or family it won't be all that bad..... besides, the odd air pocket or tropical hurricane is sure to inject some excitment into any flight, regardless of journey time....

i once slept through a 5 segment flight from florida to sg.. all the way.. did not eat for at least 24... maybe 30? (including waiting times at airport) hours... i think i'll be rather capable of sleeping through 18 hours too:)

I get the impression that you're both a movie junkie and a lazy pig. Care to validate that statement?

I find it terribly difficult to sleep on aeroplanes, but airports are another matter.

3 years ago, my family had to transfer flights at KIX from Singapore to Sapporo, but the flight was delayed due to blizzards up north. We waited nearly 24hrs before getting on the plane.... obviously, i slept alot during that time...

Wow...wonderful response.....:D

I would try it just to break my own record.....And bcos I think this is a significant flight in aviation history.....:D

Please share..... it's always a pleasure to hear from fellow forumers....

I can hardly stand a 8 hour bus ride to Genting ,much less than a 18 hour journey.
Well its not like I can stand even an hour's bus ride when I didnt sleep well the night before too anyway. :D Motion sickness seems to be quite selective I suppose, and I believe you have taken shorter flights before? Do you experience the same kind of discomfort?

http://abcnews.go.com/images/nav/abcnews_logo.gif

Long Haul
World’s Longest Flight Lasts 18½ Hours, and Soon Will Have Competition

By Bob Jamieson

http://a.abcnews.com/media/WNT/images/abc_wnt_singapore_040318_nh.jpg
Singapore Airlines flies the world's longest airplane flight — 18½ hours nonstop from Los Angeles to Singapore.
(ABCNEWS.com)

O V E R T H E P A C I F I C O C E A N, March 28 — What crosses the largest ocean, 10 time zones and more than 8,700 miles, and depending upon the direction can take two days on the calendar — or no calendar time at all?

It's the longest commercial flight on Earth — Singapore Airlines Flight 19 from Los Angeles, carrying four pilots, 151 passengers and 543 meals for the 18½-hour trip.

"I mean, that's a whole day, isn't it?" asked Janet Rienstra, a passenger embarking on a recent run. "I've never done it before, so we'll see," said another passenger, Denny Repko. "The last four hours might get to be a bit much."

With this route, Singapore Airlines is beginning the next trend in passenger travel — ultralong-range flights. In June, it begins flying from New York over the North Pole, more than 10,000 miles down to the equator, and then on to Singapore, saving six hours. In a similar vein, Dubai-based Emirates Airlines soon begins service to New York and San Francisco.

New Engines

Such long flights are "something that's never been done before," said John Leahy, senior vice president of marketing for Airbus, which builds the new plane both airlines are flying.

This new Airbus plane is made of lighter materials and has a new wing design. It has four new fuel-efficient Rolls Royce engines, lighter and more powerful than before. Rolls Royce says the key to the engine's efficiency is huge fans, made significantly lighter with new blades made of titanium and air.

Not to be outdone, Boeing is building a long-range version of its 777, capable of flying even farther. Soon, virtually any pair of cities in the world could be connected by a non-stop flight.

"Eventually we'll see … Sydney to New York and other places in the United States," said Randy Baseler, senior vice president of commercial planes for Boeing. "These will become very important, particularly for the business traveler who's trying to save time."

What to Do?

About six hours into Rienstra and Repko's recent flight Feb. 9, the plane was over the Pacific after about the length of time it takes to fly from coast to coast in the United States. And there was still another 12 hours to go. So what do the passengers do?

"Sleep, watch TV, read, play games … look out the window," said passenger Alexandra Vekich. "So far we figured out, my daughter and I, we could watch about 15 movies," said Kathy Vekich, Alexandra's mother. In fact, there are 50 movies on demand. And soon, there will be high-speed Internet access.

Most important, instead of the 300 seats the plane could have, it has only 181 seats, flat beds in business class and wider seats with more leg room in coach. There also are two standup buffets to encourage passengers to get up and move around, and there's upgraded food. Of course, the ticket costs 10 percent more than the fare for the direct flight, which must stop somewhere for refueling.

"I consider it a very valuable 18 hours, personally," said Francesca Hunter. "I love being able to be still, relaxed, have people waiting on me."

There might be new life to the old idea that getting there can be half the fun — but for Hunter and the other passengers there were still three hours to go.

What about Melbourne to Chicago? There is also talk of Perth to London when longer distant aircraft go into service.

What about Melbourne to Chicago? There is also talk of Perth to London when longer distant aircraft go into service.
Hmm....so long that the city pair is within 8,650 nm (16,000 km), it will be possible to fly that today? You have any idea what is the distance invovled?

Hmm....so long that the city pair is within 8,650 nm (16,000 km), it will be possible to fly that today? You have any idea what is the distance invovled?

Melbourne to Chicago is already active but I aint sure of the distance. I'll try and find out.

The run to NY and San Fran should be intresting from Dubai
Nice to know some more details about that !

And just on the surface of the topic that 12 hours is about as long as commerical passangers will take ! As i know i cant do much longer than that.
But still saves trasfers and such

are the ads for the nonstop service to New York out yet?

Yup! It's already in the Times magazine.

wow..could someone scan it in? maybe huaiwei?

or on my next flight I could take the mag if I spot it (I already scanned in the LA one:))

I dont buy Times thou. :D Anyway, I was told that FOR ONCE, the Singapore skyline appeared in NYC tv screens thanks to the ads for this flight!! :D

thats cool! good publicity for our tiny little island!;)

savethewtc told you issit?

thats cool! good publicity for our tiny little island!;)

savethewtc told you issit?
Yeap....he is the one who saw it. I told him to record it if he can...muahahah. :D

Well at least he could recognise our skyline! ;)

Melbourne to Chicago is already active but I aint sure of the distance. I'll try and find out.

Melbourne-Chicago was going to go into service from Qantas on their new 747-400ER's, but only as an extension of the Melbourne-LAX route (previous longest flight in world before the Sing-LAX flights.

It's currently on hold until the aviation market picks up again.

Melbourne-LAX is longer then NYC-HK? Seems like alot of conflicting info here?

Melbourne - Los Angeles : 12764 km
Hong Kong - New York : 12963 km

Source : Expedia

THE SIA ADVERT IS FREAKING COOL! Whenever I catch it on television it makes me feel so proud of our national carrier and our country! The narrator's voice is soothing, the graphics are stunning, the idea of an 18 hour flight is shocking and the entire advert is just so original, as original as the wonderful adverts for Emirates, unlike the adverts of some other airlines which not only make the entire advert look and sound like a pop music video but also gives you a feeling of ''hey, this advert looks and sounds so similar to another I have seen, hmmm...''.

Hi ignoramus! Welcome to SSC and feel free to check out the Singapore forum here

http://www.skyscrapercity.com/forumdisplay.php?s=&forumid=333

I only saw the advert on CNA and it was very graceful and inspiring :yes:

Heres the ad on the website

http://img.singaporeair.com/saa/main/images/topbar_sialogo.gif
http://img.singaporeair.com/images/global/GlobalHomePage/GlobalHomePage1/MainImage/grl_a340nyc.jpg

Oh I have been reading the threads of SSC for quite some time now. Until today I didn't really get down to signing up and posting anything here due to plain laziness. How do you post photos here by the way? Looks tedious to me. Being pure lazy, I avoid doing anything tedious. Hope it easy.

Here's the SIA ad at Changi Airport, hope you like it.

http://img73.photobucket.com/albums/v222/ylstan03/Airport/DSCN12633.jpg

How do you post photos here by the way? Looks tedious to me. Being pure lazy, I avoid doing anything tedious. Hope it easy.

http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=59844 :cheers:

Thanks RafflesCity for the link and babystan03 for the photo. Very very nice and helpful. Man I just love SIA adverts. Now THATS what I call branding. Gosh I am getting very addicted to this forum.

THE SIA ADVERT IS FREAKING COOL! Whenever I catch it on television it makes me feel so proud of our national carrier and our country! The narrator's voice is soothing, the graphics are stunning, the idea of an 18 hour flight is shocking and the entire advert is just so original, as original as the wonderful adverts for Emirates, unlike the adverts of some other airlines which not only make the entire advert look and sound like a pop music video but also gives you a feeling of ''hey, this advert looks and sounds so similar to another I have seen, hmmm...''.
Haha...I was wondering where you are from, and now I know. :)

Anyway, I actually prefered the advert for the Sg-LA route because the soundtrack is better? Have you seen it before?

Thanks RafflesCity for the link and babystan03 for the photo. Very very nice and helpful. Man I just love SIA adverts. Now THATS what I call branding. Gosh I am getting very addicted to this forum.

Haha....I'm glad you are(addicted i mean)........:D

I remember seeing it before but since that was like 4 or so months ago I can't really remember how it was like anymore. Still, it had to be as good or perhaps even better than the current one. Still I can't get over the advert. Really got a shock when it appeared on tv. Wonder how foreigners abroad watching this would also feel. Still remember the advert for Malaysia Airlines though. Its very funky. Makes me feel like dancing. haha. Singapore and Emirates Airlines adverts are usually very classy and astonishing.

Here's the SIA ad at Changi Airport, hope you like it.

http://img73.photobucket.com/albums/v222/ylstan03/Airport/DSCN1263.jpg
Sweet.....(I am referring to the Singapore Girl)!! :D

I posted this ad elsewhere but havent posted it here yet. Scanned from the inflight mag.

http://img43.photobucket.com/albums/v133/RafflesCity/siaadv.jpg

SIA ads are usually classy, and focus less on the hardware(plane) but on software(stewardesses). Their innaugural flight to NY in 1992 had an impressive ad I recall.

Thats a very good picture. Suddenly realized that UOB Plaza 1 looks almost identical to that building in Los Angeles (forgot the name though) but its that tallest one. That adds to the effect of the 2 skylines being very very similar. And yes huaiwei, that Singapore Girl is hot!

I remember seeing it before but since that was like 4 or so months ago I can't really remember how it was like anymore. Still, it had to be as good or perhaps even better than the current one. Still I can't get over the advert. Really got a shock when it appeared on tv. Wonder how foreigners abroad watching this would also feel. Still remember the advert for Malaysia Airlines though. Its very funky. Makes me feel like dancing. haha. Singapore and Emirates Airlines adverts are usually very classy and astonishing.
I saved a copy of the advert in my pc. If you want it, I can send it to you via IM! :D

But that advert didnt show Singapore, while this one does, so that is the only major difference I noticed. Well, as I said earlier, savethewtc saw it, and he immediatley told me how rare it was that the Singapore skyline ever appears on NYC television! :D

The Emirates one...is it that one with the old lady?

SIA ads are usually classy, and focus less on the hardware(plane) but on software(stewardesses). Their innaugural flight to NY in 1992 had an impressive ad I recall.
Yes, I still remember that ad very well too, including even the soundtrack and all, coz I was infatuated with aviation stuff since I was a kid?

Just picture this....a view that floats over the oceans....the camera flies past the statue of liberty, several more views floating over various skyscrapers of NYC, before the music builds up on a crescendo as the camera floats up Chrysler Building, and wooah! There you have it, a Singapore Girl stands perched on a balcony, with that paper umbrealla over her shoulder, smiling as radiantly as ever. The camera floats away from her and the Chrsyler slowly, the music goes down into smoothing mode again, the rest of the skyline slowly moves into view, as a narrator gently announces the new route in just a line or 2.

And there is always that SIA soundtrack, but for this ad, they gave it a jazzy sounding tone so typically New Yorkish, just as they localised the same tune for every other destination too.

Simply unforgetable, and so very SIA! ;)

You have a very remarkably clear memory. Such a detailed and vivid description. Wow. I cant remember anything beyond a few months. If only there was a picture of that advert on the web.

What old lady? Didn't see any. I was thinking of the one where that Emirates stewardess knows like so many languages and was so helpful in translating what this man had to say to the other man. That was the only part in the advert I remembered. But one thing is for sure, I remember that it was very classy, like there's this mood in the air.

Oh I liked that advert where that Singapore Girl climbed up some rocks wait I mean a mountain of sorts overlooking the surrounding landscape. Wanted to laugh when I saw it. Like how can a graceful girl like her wearing heels and a her tight fitting uniform climb up such steep slopes. Such a contrast. But more seriously, the soundtrack there was very nice too. Very majestic. I remember at the end the word were ''Singggggggggggggggapppppppore Girl'' in a whisperish kinda tone.

@huaiwei, WOW you described it very well! :okay: That was the one I remembered.

I just cant wait to see how they advertise the new A380..its kinda like in 1998 when they underwent that service revamp with the colourful megatop:)

Singapore Airlines has actually the Singapore to New York non stop service television commercial online. Click the link under highlight at http://www.singaporeair.com/saa/app/saa

Managed to catch the A340-500 landing........(picture taken on 16/6/04):D

http://img73.photobucket.com/albums/v222/ylstan03/Airport/DSCN12962.jpg

cool pic! I travelled on the Celestar A340 back in 1998. Looks almost the same as this. I think this has bigger engines? :cool:

cool pic! I travelled on the Celestar A340 back in 1998. Looks almost the same as this. I think this has bigger engines? :cool:
Not so sure about the engines, but you are definitely the few who manage to catch that flight on the A340s...SIA sold all of them almost as fast as they were bought!

yah I read. But then in 1998 there were many A340s if I recall. The flight I took was only from SIN-BKK though. SIA has a habit of using long haul planes for short haul flights. I remember they served Dom Perignon champagne in economy (that was when they launched the product revamp. I think they still do now, but you got to ask for it. Theyre smart)

yah I read. But then in 1998 there were many A340s if I recall. The flight I took was only from SIN-BKK though. SIA has a habit of using long haul planes for short haul flights.

Haha....not surprising....SIA use B777-200 for the 1 hour Singapore-KL flights.......:D

They dont have smaller planes now! :lol:

I remember Garuda complained when SIA used Megatop for SIN-Jakarta

They dont have smaller planes now! :lol:

I remember Garuda complained when SIA used Megatop for SIN-Jakarta

I can see why after I see this picture(no offence).........:D

http://img73.photobucket.com/albums/v222/ylstan03/Airport/DSCN12492.jpg

Sometimes they still use Megatop for CGK-SIN flights during holiday season :lol:

Garuda use 737s to get more passengers, because with 737 they can fly 8 times a day, therefore passengers can choose more suitable time depends on their needs but SIA is also responding with double their flights a day usually..:lol:

cheers

Sometimes they still use Megatop for CGK-SIN flights during holiday season :lol:

Garuda use 737s to get more passengers, because with 737 they can fly 8 times a day, therefore passengers can choose more suitable time depends on their needs but SIA is also responding with double their flights a day usually..:lol:

cheers

Haha....great....more flights between CGK-SIN........:D

The SIA Unifrom is Peranakan styled.Reflects the multi-cultural background and culture of Singapore.

They dont have smaller planes now! :lol:

I remember Garuda complained when SIA used Megatop for SIN-Jakarta
Hey...I remember more then 10 years ago, I flew on Garuda from Jakarta to Denpasar on a B747 too!

Can see the pretty gal clearly here....in the Changi site! :D

http://www.changi.airport.com.sg/media/Changi/images/titles/en/about_feature_site.gif

For the first time ever, fly non-stop
from Singapore to New York with Singapore Airlines

http://webadmin.caas.gov.sg/Changi/Features/FlyNonStop/FlyNonStop1.gif

From 28th June 2004, Singapore Airlines introduces daily non-stop flights between Singapore and New York (Newark) on the world's longest range airliner - the A340-500. Flying non-stop on Singapore Airlines' A340-500 allows travellers to enjoy considerable savings of up to 4 hours in travel time, and greater convenience with fewer stops in-between cities in Asia and the United States.

Designed with the executive traveller in mind, Singapore Airlines' new A340-500 offers an unprecedented level of comfort in two exclusive cabins - Raffles (Business) Class and the new Executive Economy Class.

http://webadmin.caas.gov.sg/Changi/Features/FlyNonStop/FlyNonStop2.gif

Raffles Class

http://webadmin.caas.gov.sg/Changi/Features/FlyNonStop/FlyNonStop3.gif

Executive Economy Class

For more information on Singapore Airlines' non-stop services between Singapore and New York, please visit www.nonstop2newyork.com (if you are from Asia) or www.nonstop2singapore.com (if you are from North America).

SIA ads are usually classy, and focus less on the hardware(plane) but on software (stewardesses). Their innaugural flight to NY in 1992 had an impressive ad I recall.Stewardesses are "software"? LOL!! :okay:

Anyway Singapore direct to Los Angeles and, even more amazingly, to New York is astonishing. Some figures:
http://www.wcrl.ars.usda.gov/cec/java/lat-long.htm

- 14,115km = Singapore to Los Angeles
- 15,324km = Singapore to New York

The New York route stretches capabilities to the limit. The A340-500 is the longest range airliner in the world and has a maximum range of 16,000km - so 15,324km is close to the limit. :)
http://www.airbus.com/product/a340_a500_introduction.asp

Stewardesses are "software"? LOL!! :okay:

Anyway Singapore direct to Los Angeles and, even more amazingly, to New York is astonishing. Some figures:
http://www.wcrl.ars.usda.gov/cec/java/lat-long.htm

- 14,115km = Singapore to Los Angeles
- 15,324km = Singapore to New York

The New York route stretches capabilities to the limit. The A340-500 is the longest range airliner in the world and has a maximum range of 16,000km - so 15,324km is close to the limit. :)
http://www.airbus.com/product/a340_a500_introduction.asp
Hmm...your post made me do a double check (coz I was quite sure the flight routes is longer then that), and I noticed something:

SIA Press Release (http://www.singaporeair.com/saa/app/saa?dynamic=PressReleases/NTE_2704.html)

The actual flight route being undertaken is over 16,600 km, which would have blasted that limit. The range limit shown in the Airbus site is actually on the assumption that the plane is filled up to maximum capacity (313 passengers for a 3-class seating, could be much more if there are 2 classes or just 1). SIA retrofitted the plane such that is sits only 181 in a 2-class configuration....so I suppose this is why it could go even further? ;)

/\ Well spotted!

@Monkey, all long haul nonstop flights always amaze me. Even Singapore to London is quite disorientating every time :)

@huaiwei, that girl looks like an older version of Fiona Xie:D

Back then, who would have dreamed of nonstop flights between the Big Apple
http://www.bc.edu/bc_org/avp/cas/fnart/fa267/20th/empire03.jpg
http://www.photolib.noaa.gov/coastline/images/line0987.jpg
http://www.photolib.noaa.gov/coastline/images/line0985.jpg
http://www.photolib.noaa.gov/coastline/images/line1684.jpg

and this little place?
http://picas.nhb.gov.sg/data/tn_pcd/19980005494-8073-3222-4699/img0021.jpg
http://picas.nhb.gov.sg/data/tn_pcd/19980005771-8106-3181-7858/img0053.jpg
http://picas.nhb.gov.sg/data/tn_pcd/19980005105-8073-3222-5039/img0009.jpg
http://picas.nhb.gov.sg/data/tn_pcd/19980007437-8263-3201-0166/img0082.jpg

Aviation is fascinating!
http://img51.photobucket.com/albums/v157/baqthier/sgswissnite2.jpg
http://skylinerotterdam.info/forum/album_pic.php?pic_id=1021

http://www.sky.s64.pl/home/W/Sing/sa05.jpg

@Monkey, all long haul nonstop flights always amaze me. Even Singapore to London is quite disorientating every time :)London to Singapore is the longest single flight I have ever flown. Here is a comparison of my longest flights:

10,849km - London to Singapore
09,625km - Hong Kong to London
09,599km - London to Tokyo
09,480km - London to Sao Paulo
09,199km - London to Shanghai
08,609km - London to San Francisco
08,146km - London to Seychelles
06,052km - Singapore to Melbourne
05,561km - London to New York
05,491km - Cairns to Hong Kong
04,206km - Paris to Dakar
03,513km - London to Tel Aviv

you been to Seychelles! :eek:

Singapore to London is also my longest - 13 hours usually

other long flights I done include Taipei-Anchorage and Vienna-Bangkok

SIN-Oz isnt considered long these days :P

The most important thing: bring a bottle of water on board and get an aisle seat, for multiple trips to the toilet :lol:

London to Singapore is the longest single flight I have ever flown. Here is a comparison of my longest flights:

10,849km - London to Singapore
09,625km - Hong Kong to London
09,599km - London to Tokyo
09,480km - London to Sao Paulo
09,199km - London to Shanghai
08,609km - London to San Francisco
08,146km - London to Seychelles
06,052km - Singapore to Melbourne
05,561km - London to New York
05,491km - Cairns to Hong Kong
04,206km - Paris to Dakar
03,513km - London to Tel Aviv
My God..you travel the world! :applause:

I forgot..that was an excellent site you showed us, btw. Now I can make estimations easily between any city pair! ;)

@Huaiwei
Yes I love that site. :)

@Raffles
I prefer window seats. I know they're not as comfortable and convenient but I have worked out a technique of jumping over people to get to the aisle without waking them up. Also the views are fabulous. I wouldn't enjoy flying if I couldn't see out of the window. From London to Singapore you fly over the Himalayas/Karakoram in Pakistan. This range includes K2 (the world's second highest mountain) and is incredibly spectacular. I love flying to Italy or the Riviera for the same reason - the Alps are stunning. Also cities look good. We circled Singapore for a while waiting for a landing slot and I had an excellent view - could see all the ships coming and going from the port and also the skyline. I have also had great views over London, Paris, Berlin, Hong Kong, Shanghai, Rio de Janeiro, San Francisco and Dakar. Sometimes the most interesting places are remote areas that you would never ordinarily get to see. I already mentioned the mountains but there are others too. En-route to Dakar you fly over the Sahara. It's completely empty down there. It makes you feel small seeing the vastness of it. Flying to Sao Paulo and Rio you cross the Amazon. I did this at night and you can make out these tiny settlements lit up in the middle of the vast blackness of the rainforest. It makes you wonder how these places are on the ground. God I love flying.... :yes:

^
Knowing you, I guess you'd leap over the armrests quite nimbly;)
Well I too also prefer window seats, but usually have to reserve those right at the back, where its just 2 seats by a window instead of 3 (also more room to dump your stuff). Flying over Iran & Afghanistan can be thrilling when you ponder whats below in the darkness, but the best is take off and landing. I always try my best to take pics :yes:

http://www.skyscrapercity.com/photopost/data/2/103lhr4-med.jpg
http://www.skyscrapercity.com/photopost/data/2/103lhr6-med.jpg
http://www.skyscrapercity.com/photopost/data/2/103sin2-med.jpg
http://www.skyscrapercity.com/photopost/data/2/103319c-med.jpg
http://www.skyscrapercity.com/photopost/data/2/103319g-med.jpg

^
Rare pictures..:eek:....it's so exciting seeing a familiar place from a different angle......:)

@babystan

I posted the Sg aerials before in the Sg forum. Have u seen them cos I have more..:cool:

@babystan

I posted the Sg aerials before in the Sg forum. Have u seen them cos I have more..:cool:

Haha...no wonder it look familiar.....:D You have more?? Wow thats great...:D

JUNE 23, 2004
SIA to start longest distance passenger flight

NEWARK (New Jersey) - A flight between Newark and Singapore being touted by the airline as the longest non-stop passenger flight by distance in aviation history is scheduled to take off on June 28.

The flight from Newark Liberty International Airport will touch down 16,664km and 18 hours 30 minutes later at Singapore Changi Airport.

A Singapore Airlines Airbus A340-500 aircraft will make the historic flight, which the International Air Transportation Association confirmed would be the longest, surpassing Qantas flights from Los Angeles to Australia.

The 11.35pm flight inaugurates daily non-stop service from Newark to Singapore.

SIA already makes the longest flight in terms of flying time, 18 hours and 45 minutes from Los Angeles to Singapore, said an airline spokesman, Ms Anna Stancioff. But that flight is a shorter distance, she said. The Newark-Singapore route, which flies over the North Pole, will arrive in slightly less time, she said.

The Monday night flight is fully booked, with 181 passengers, Ms Stancioff said. She said the flight's 60 movie options include the entire Lord of the Rings trilogy. -- AP

Copyright @ 2004 Singapore Press Holdings. All rights reserved.

16,664km!! That shall be the number to beat for anyone wishing to challenge that and grap the title of world's longest scheduled passenger flight in history! :)

Lol the whole Lord of the Ring trilogy is a very good choice for this flight. That would last probably almost half of the flight duration ! :D

what's the greatest distance between two major cities?

what's the greatest distance between two major cities?
Depends on how you define a "major" city right?? :?

um maybe any airport with 20mppa and above?

um maybe any airport with 20mppa and above?
Crazy nut...you able to provide me with a list of cities for comparison instead? :D

um no.. maybe the list of airports that are to have the facilities to accommodate the a380?

um no.. maybe the list of airports that are to have the facilities to accommodate the a380?
Haha...what does the A380 gotta do with this flight, which is using the A345? ;)

Maybe I will just take the listing from the ACI website, plus some more additions for notable cities.....hows that?

airports which would be readied to accommodate the a380 could be considered more or less significant airports...

Its going to take me a damn long time to find out if I were to do it manually, but anyway, you might be happy to know the longest distance between Singapore and some major cities around the world would be ranked as follows (I added more cities in the Central America thou...it was clearly the furthest distance from us! the two existing longest routes were highlighted in bold for comparison):
City Distance (Great Circle, km)
Quito 19712.39802
Bogota 19306.38615
Lima 18803.10039
Panama City 18801.41342
San Jose 18476.77392
Caracas 18339.8475
La Paz 18098.32958
Kingston 17855.86529
Georgetown 17811.90201
Havana 17204.94844
Miami 16962.89978
Mexico City 16599.41259
Santiago 16383.95441
Atlanta 16012.69135
Houston 15994.68667
Sao Paulo 15965.81359
Buenos Aires 15870.55458
Rio de Janeiro 15714.36825
Dallas 15639.39725
Boston 15123.45429
Washington D.C. 15543.05417
New York City 15323.64669
Detroit 15104.48866
Chicago 15067.2098
Montreal 14793.80808
Phoenix 14614.84633
Minneapolis 14588.85356
Denver 14580.88642
Las Vegas 14206.29531
Los Angeles 14114.65844
San Francisco 13576.67551
Vancouver 12816.66476
Madrid 11376.80938
Lagos 11135.94093
London 10848.84145
Honolulu 10807.21887
Anchorage 10731.41067
Paris 10728.34938
Brussels 10553.00103
Amsterdam 10490.66987
Frankfurt 10256.39471
Rome 10006.65543
Berlin 9914.308137
Athens 9047.069005
Johannesburg 8653.076122
Istanbul 8641.924421
Moscow 8415.648418
Auckland 8410.067841
Cairo 8257.669061
Jerusalem 7914.86476
Damascus 7852.192765
Mecca 7276.897917
Riyadh 6641.768422
Sydney 6296.084576
Doha 6197.332683
Brisbane 6145.850888
Melbourne 6052.068881
Tokyo 5317.582984
Osaka 4939.595119
Islamabad 4809.127523
Karachi 4735.191923
Seoul 4668.377566
Beijing 4476.126955
Delhi 4147.279723
Mumbai 3909.026613
Perth 3905.883725
Shanghai 3801.293914
Taipei 3253.933598
Kolkata 2891.753476
Guangzhou 2628.392265
Hong Kong 2582.023828
Manila 2392.416074
Hanoi 2201.978308
Bangkok 1429.365881
Jakarta 887.1126657
Kuala Lumpur 312.4235844

weren't there direct flights to chicago before? how come it wasn't touted at the world's longest flight? what planes were for the flight? or was there a stopover or somethign?

weren't there direct flights to chicago before? how come it wasn't touted at the world's longest flight? what planes were for the flight? or was there a stopover or somethign?
There were stopovers of coz, and if I am not wrong, the stopover was somewhere in Europe.....you refering to the SIA flight?

yep

yep
I just found the info for it...it used to be via Amsterdam:

http://www.ohare.com/images/doa/avi_news.gif

August 2, 2001

O'HARE INTERNATIONAL AIRPORT WELCOMES SINGAPORE AIRLINES' FIRST PASSENGER FLIGHT TO CHICAGO

http://www.ohare.com/images/doa/avi_news/sing1.jpg http://www.ohare.com/images/doa/avi_news/sing3.jpg

CHICAGO - August 2, 2001. O'Hare International Airport today welcomes the launch of Singapore Airlines' non-stop service to Amsterdam with continuing service to Singapore. The introduction of passenger flights by Singapore Airlines will be the carrier's first Midwest service and only same-plane service from Chicago to Singapore.

"We welcome Singapore Airlines passenger service to O'Hare" said Chicago Aviation Commissioner Thomas R. Walker. "It is only fitting that an airline that is widely considered to be the world's best should fly to the best airport in North America as voted for the third consecutive year by the readers of Business Traveler International," he said.

"This is a very important day in the history of our airline" said Colin Neubronner, Vice President, Midwest for Singapore Airlines. "Our same-plane service to Singapore provides the quickest connections between the Midwest and Southeast Asia. We are proud to call Chicago our new home."

The addition of the Singapore Airlines' Boeing 777 service to Amsterdam and Singapore represents continued growth in international service for O'Hare. A total of 53 scheduled and charter airlines offer non-stop and direct service to 212 destinations around the world.

O'Hare is pleased to welcome Singapore Airlines passenger service and looks forward to continued growth in the international sector. O'Hare offers more non-stop service than any other airport in the United States. With so many travel choices, O'Hare continues to offer more of what travelers want in quality air service.

Chicago continues to look for ways to improve its aviation system. Mayor Richard M. Daley's Proposal for the Future of O'Hare improves and modernizes O'Hare by adding one new runway and reconfiguring others. The Mayor's proposal, which is not funded by local or state tax dollars, will help O'Hare remain a leader in global aviation. To learn more about Mayor Daley's Proposal for the Future of O'Hare, visit www.chicagoairports.com.

^
Is this flight still in operation?? Or did they remove it since there will be direct flights from Singapore to New york??

^
Is this flight still in operation?? Or did they remove it since there will be direct flights from Singapore to New york??
It was stopped last year during the SARS crisis, and they have not restarted it yet, if they ever do?

i think they should fly to miami. or orlando just for universal studios and disneyland.

The SIN - ORD started before 9/11 and stopped after 9/11 then, it started again several months before SARS and stopped when SARS hit. Doesn't look like SQ want to resume the flight. It would be nice if they do....

SIA is now using A345 to Jakarta as well. I think it is the 154 (leaves SIN at 10 am) and 160 (leaves SIN at 1700). Megatop is also used for SIN - CGK on two days a week.

SIA is now using A345 to Jakarta as well. I think it is the 154 (leaves SIN at 10 am) and 160 (leaves SIN at 1700). Megatop is also used for SIN - CGK on two days a week.
Oh yeah...as David-80 mentioned many pages earlier...he was saying you could enjoy a better plane for a normal ticket price! :D

SIN-ORD has stop overs, right?

SIN-ORD has stop overs, right?
Yes....we just mentioned it was Amsterdam....

Opps...

Opps...
I am too used to your quirks by now! :D

Anyway, Chicago seems to be a jinx for SIA....if I remember, those two cancellations were not the only two. They used to fly to Chicago quite a few more years earlier isnt it?

Ooooh, the flight is taking off tomorrow!:D

JUNE 27, 2004
SIA executive economy class is tops
For a little more, passengers get extra space and better amenities

By Serene Luo

SPACIOUS seats, champagne and blockbuster movies - cattle class has never been this ritzy.

While other airlines, like EVA Air and British Airways, also offer premium economy seats, Singapore Airlines has pulled out all the stops to create the most luxurious ones so far.

It offers wider seats, more entertainment choices and a higher crew to passenger ratio.

http://straitstimes.asia1.com.sg/mnt/media/image/launched/2004-06-27/n6.jpg
Seven seats spanning each row instead of the usual 10, so passengers get more room.

These Executive Economy Class seats, already available in its non-stop long-haul flights to Los Angeles, will also be offered from tomorrow on its one-stop flights to New York on Airbus A340-500 planes.

Miss Teo Meng Joo, 19, a university student who flew the 18-hour non-stop SIA flight from Los Angeles to Singapore a month ago, said she stretched out on the spacious seats and managed to catnap.

Her verdict? 'The seats were big, the in-flight entertainment was great. If I had the money, I'd go on it again.'

One of the earliest to offer premium economy class seats was EVA Air. It introduced its Evergreen Deluxe seat in 1992 on Boeing B747-400 and McDonnell Douglas MD11 planes.

http://straitstimes.asia1.com.sg/mnt/media/image/launched/2004-06-27/n6a.jpg
Laptop charging points.

Scandinavian Airways System, Virgin Atlantic and British Airways soon followed suit.

Passengers pay more for premium economy seats, which bridge the gap between business and coach class, and get extra space and better amenities.

On SIA and British Airways flights, such seats have electrical points for powering up laptop computers. EVA Air serves premium economy meals on porcelain, not plastic.

SIA is the first airline to replace all economy seats on a plane with premium economy ones on the two non-stop flights to Los Angeles and New York. These flights also offer business class, but not first class.

Although these Airbus A340-500 planes can take more than 300 passengers, they have only 181 seats, to give passengers more room and greater comfort to work, sleep or move about, said an SIA spokesman.

http://straitstimes.asia1.com.sg/mnt/media/image/launched/2004-06-27/n6b.jpg
Personal 9-inch screens

She said: 'The Executive Economy Class product was developed because we believe there is a good market for the product on the Singapore-US route.'

Passenger loads on the LA flights have been encouraging, she said, and February to May numbers have been 'above average'.

British Airways said its World Traveller Plus programme in 2000 was 'extremely well-received'.

Its research shows that there is 'a niche for the value-conscious traveller who desires more space and privacy', said BA's spokesman.

Although many airlines think there may be a niche for these travellers who want the comfort of business but don't want to pay the price, Mr Anthony Concil, the corporate communications director of the International Air Transport Association, thinks premium economy is 'not a must-do product'.

He doesn't think it's an industry trend and said that not every airline finds premium economy a pragmatic and commercial choice.

http://straitstimes.asia1.com.sg/mnt/media/image/launched/2004-06-27/n6c.jpg
Space to lounge around.

But it definitely makes a difference to passengers like Mr Ray Bigger, who owns his own training company in Singapore, and travels on business to London and Sydney, and around the region several times a year.

He said: 'It's that extra 15cm to 20cm between my knees and the seat in front.

'Or the fact that I don't have to worry about getting stopped at the gates because my laptop and notes have exceeded the usual baggage allowance.

'It's economical and good value for money.'

Copyright @ 2004 Singapore Press Holdings. All rights reserved.

Ooooh, the flight is taking off tomorrow!:D
Yeap! The first flight will be taking off in a few hours, and I would be expecting the usual media blitz! :D

Yeap! The first flight will be taking off in a few hours, and I would be expecting the usual media blitz! :D

Oh what a coincidence, I'll be at the airport tomolo.....The first flight from Singapore taking off at 12.05pm right??....:D

Oh what a coincidence, I'll be at the airport tomolo.....The first flight from Singapore taking off at 12.05pm right??....:D
Haha..if you are really lucky, you might catch something interesting on film...as well as the very plane itself on the tarmac! :)

The world's longest flight has just commenced!

Scheduled Time: 12:05
Airline: http://webadmin.caas.gov.sg/FIS/images/airlines/SQ.gif
Flight: SQ22
To: Newark
Terminal: 2
Checkin Row: 05
Gate: F52
Status: Departed 12:24

Bon voyage! :cry: :wave:

(will add photos of the exact plane taking off if I can find them later!! :D)

Yes...the action has started......here's wat happen at the check in counter at changi airport at 11.05am(28/06/04)........:D

http://img73.photobucket.com/albums/v222/ylstan03/Airport/DSCN14432.jpg

Woo! Did you mangage to get any shots of the plane itself? I read from aviation forums that ppl in Newark are actually camping there to snap the plane when it lands!!! :eek:

^
Unfortunately no...... :bash: Wah they are camping to snap photos of the plane ah??? :eek: So "on"....I only went there about 10 plus....... :)

I dont noe about Changi, but Neward is definitely a camping spot now! :D

http://gc.kls2.com/cgi-bin/gcmap?PATH=SIN-EWR&PATH-UNITS=km&PATH-COLOR=red&MARKER=1

Enjoy!

They're flying over the Pole?

Time is GMT + 8 hours
Posted: 28 June 2004 1406 hrs

SIA to set new world record with direct flight to New York

SINGAPORE : The first Singapore Airlines direct flight to New York took off here on Monday for what was set to become the world's longest non-stop commercial flight, company officials said.

Flight SQ22 to Newark airport will take an Airbus A340-500 aircraft an average of 18 hours to cover, beating by two hours a record also set by SIA on its Singapore-Los Angeles direct service inaugurated in February.

The new direct flight will save customers up to four hours in travel time compared with SIA's one-stop services to New York, said Huang Cheng Eng, SIA's Executive Vice-President for marketing and the regions.

The Singapore-New York service and its return flight SQ 21 will cover a distance of close to 9,000 nautical miles (about 16,600 kilometres) over the North Pacific.

The ultra long-haul A340-500 used for the service has only 181 seats in a two-class configuration, with 64 seats in Raffles business class, all equipped with "space beds" in a "2-2-2" seat configuration.

The rest is devoted to Executive Economy Class, with 117 seats in a "2-3-2" configuration described as among the industry's widest at 20 inches (50.8 centimetres).

All seats are equipped with amenities such as laptop power supply outlets and an in-flight entertainment system offering over 400 entertainment options including 60 movie choices for the long journey.

The flights will also feature "passenger corners" in both Business and Executive Economy cabins offering passengers some space to stretch out or socialize while helping themselves to drinks and snacks.

SIA placed an order for 10 A340-500s in 1998 - five on firm order and five on option - worth US$2.2 billion, including spares and spare engines.

The aircraft is powered by four Rolls-Royce Trent 553 engines.

SIA is consistently voted one of the world's best airlines and has maintained a strong following despite its higher fares by banking on its reputation for efficient service and a modern fleet. - AFP

Copyright © 2004 Agence France Presse. All rights reserved.

Found someone's map for the exact to and from routes! :D

http://homepage.ntlworld.com/duc_huynh/SIA%20Pictures/A345%20Leadership/Brochure/2.jpg

OMG.....:eek2:...That is far!!!!!!!!!!! Excellent illustration of the distance.....:)

why different routes? why not just take shorter route for both?

Time is GMT + 8 hours
Posted: 28 June 2004 1709 hrs

Singaporean couple wins free trip to New York on first non-stop flight
By Yvonne Cheong, Channel NewsAsia

SINGAPORE : One couple - or rather one man held his breath and won a free trip for two on Singapore Airlines' first non-stop flight to New York.

He was shortlisted from 180 people over the weekend in a contest held by MediaCorp's Class 95.

An hour before the contest, it was jitters and high hopes for the finalists.

They had their luggages packed, leaves taken, and their partners waiting.

Leonard Lee, contestant, said: "Today I woke up and my voice wasn't too good and I see the other competitors they seem to be in high spirits, good voice. We'll see how it goes."

Adrian Rodriguez, contestant, said: "Don't let them know the secret, but I was like practising in the toilet...taking deep breaths, expanding this."

Wong Nan Soon, contestant, said: "I've got a very supportive mother-in-law who is waiting outside with my full 10-piece luggage set."

In the air conditioned cold of the Class 95 studio, with DJs and judges, it was clear from the start who the winner was.

Finally, Leonard Lee was declared the winner.

Leonard and his girlfriend Yvonne were whizzed off to Tangs for a $300 shopping trip to start off their first overseas holiday together.

And with the help of a personal shopper, it was shirt and tie for him and shoes for her.

Bernard Lim, Deputy General Manager of MediaCorp Radio, said: "In New York, they have this wonderful party that they have to go to - it's at the trump world tower which is a huge residential area, very very luxurious owned by Mr Donald Trump of course and this is going to be a very very luxurious party on the second night." - CNA

Copyright © 2004 MCN International Pte Ltd

JUNE 29, 2004
World's longest flight takes off from Changi
By Karamjit Kaur

MUCH has been made of the comfort of Singapore Airlines' passengers on non-stop flights to America, but just as important is the state of alertness of the pilots.

At the launch of the airline's non-stop service to New York - the world's longest commercial flight - yesterday, the Civil Aviation Authority of Singapore (Caas) told The Straits Times it is satisfied passengers are in safe hands.

http://straitstimes.asia1.com.sg/mnt/media/image/launched/2004-06-29/p4.jpg
A warm welcome on the maiden flight to New York from stewardesses Sharon Lim (left) and Petrina Bong. -- HOW HWEE YOUNG

A battery of onboard tests since a non-stop service to Los Angeles began in February confirms this, it said, adding that more than 200 pilot tests have been done so far.

The flight to New York on the same long-range Airbus 340-500 aircraft, covers 16,668km, about 2,000km more than to Los Angeles.

Pilots flying to the Big Apple will be similarly monitored, said a Caas spokesman.

A final report on the rules for such long flights should be ready by April, he added, and findings will be shared with other aviation authorities.

Since SIA is the first to offer such long-haul flights, its standard of pilot safety is also likely to be used as benchmark, observers say.

SIA pilots flying non-stop to the two cities are required to record when they do what, and have special watches to monitor their activity level.

During rest time, their brain waves are monitored to ascertain the quality of sleep.

SIA also has to ensure that each flight has four pilots, including two captains. Ordinarily, long-haul flights sometimes have four pilots, but only one needs to be a captain.

Passengers on Flight SQ22 interviewed at the airport yesterday were confident of Singapore's aviation safety standards and looking forward to the 18-hour journey, which will shave up to four hours off travel time on regular flights.

SIA's one-stop service through Amsterdam takes 22 hours, including transit time.

Business class traveller Carl M. Valenti, managing director (Asia Pacific) at Moneyline Telerate, a financial services provider, said: 'For me, the main attraction is the time saved. Four hours is quite significant.'

He was one of 181 passengers, including nine guests, on board the aircraft, which left Singapore just after noon.

The aircraft is designed for 313 passengers in a three-class configuration but SIA's plane has only 181 seats in two classes: 64 in business class and 117 in executive economy.

The executive economy class seats are arranged in a 2-3-2 configuration instead of the usual eight seats in a row, which means they are 51cm wide, instead of 46cm, and leg room is 94cm instead of 81cm.

All seats have an in-flight entertainment system with more than 400 options, including 60 movie choices.

At the launch, SIA executive vice-president for marketing Huang Cheng Eng said that apart from the benefits to passengers, flying non-stop also allows Singapore to make full use of the open skies agreement with America.

Otherwise Singapore has to negotiate landing rights with another country en route, every time SIA adds a new American flight.

PASSENGERS ARE IN SAFE HANDS: SIA says onboard tests on pilots on its other non-stop service - to LA - confirm no adverse effects on their alertness.

Copyright @ 2004 Singapore Press Holdings. All rights reserved.

does the open skies pact mean that sia can fly from point to point in usa?

I think so...

cool maps! over the north pole!

does the open skies pact mean that sia can fly from point to point in usa?
I am going to show here the FULL text from that agreement! :D

Air Transport Agreement Between
The United States of America and
The Government of the Republic of Singapore

The Government of the United States of America an the Government of the Republic of Singapore (hereinafter, "the Parties");

Desiring to promote an international aviation system based on competition among airlines in the marketplace with minimum government interference and regulation;

Desiring to facilitate the expansion of international air transport opportunities;

Desiring to make it possible for airlines to offer the traveling and shipping public a variety of service options at the lowest prices that are not discriminatory and do not represent abuse of a dominant position, and wishing to encourage individual airlines to develop and implement innovative and competitive prices;

Desiring to ensure the highest degree of safety and security in international air transport and reaffirming their grave concern about acts or threats against the security of aircraft, which jeopardize the safety of persons or property, adversely affect the operation of air transportation, and undermine public confidence in the safety of civil aviation; and

Being Parties to the Convention on International Civil Aviation, opened for signature at Chicago on December 7, 1944;

Have agreed as follows:

Article 1: Definitions

For the purposes of this Agreement, unless otherwise stated, the term:

(a) "Aeronautical authorities" means, in the case of the United States of America, the Department of Transportation, or its successor, and in the case of the Republic of Singapore, the Minister for Communications, and the Civil Aviation Authority of Singapore, the agency authorized to perform the functions exercised by the said minister;

(b) "Agreement" means this Agreement, its Annexes, and any amendments thereto;

(c) "Air transportation" means the public carriage by aircraft of passengers, baggage, cargo, and mail, separately or in combination, for remuneration or hire;

(d) "Convention" means the Convention on International Civil Aviation, opened for signature at Chicago on December 7, 1944, and includes:

(i) any amendment that has entered into force under Article 94(a) of the Convention and has been ratified by both Parties, and

(ii) any Annex or any amendment thereto adopted under Article 90 of the Convention, insofar as such Annex or amendment is at any given time effective for both Parties;

(e) "Designated airline" means an airline designated and authorized in accordance with Article 3 of this Agreement;

(f) "Full cost" means the cost of providing service plus a reasonable charge for administrative overhead;

(g) "International air transportation" means air transportation that passes through the airspace over the territory of more than one State;

(h) "Price" means any fare, rate or charge for the carriage of passengers (and their baggage) and/or cargo (excluding mail) in air transportation charged by airlines, including their agents, and the conditions governing the availability of such fare, rate or charge;

(i) "Stop for non-traffic purposes" means a landing for any purpose other than taking on or discharging passengers, baggage, cargo and/or mail in air transportation;

(j) "Territory" means the land areas under the sovereignty, jurisdiction, protection, or trusteeship of a Party, and the territorial waters adjacent thereto; and

(k) "User charge" means a charge imposed on airlines for the provision of airport, air navigation, or aviation security facilities or services including related services and facilities.

Article 2: Grant of Rights

(1) Each Party grants to the other Party the following rights for the conduct of international air transportation by the airlines of the other Party:

(a) the right to fly across its territory without landing;

(b) the right to make stops in its territory for non-traffic purposes; and


(c) the rights otherwise specified in this Agreement.

(2) Nothing in this Article shall be deemed to confer on the airline or airlines of one Party the rights to take on board, in the territory of the other Party, passengers, their baggage, cargo, or mail carried for compensation and destined for another point in the territory of that other Party.

Article 3: Designation and Authorization

1) Each Party shall have the right to designate as many airlines as it wishes to conduct international air transportation in accordance with this Agreement and to withdraw or alter such designations. Such designations shall be transmitted to the other Party in writing through diplomatic channels, and shall identify whether the airline is authorized to conduct the type of air transportation specified in Annex I or in Annex II or both.

(2) On receipt of such a designation, and of applications from the designated airline, in the form and manner prescribed for operating authorizations and technical permissions, the other Party shall grant appropriate authorizations and permissions with minimum procedural delay, provided:

(a) substantial ownership and effective control of that airline are vested in the Party designating the airline, nationals of that Party, or both;

(b) the designated airline is qualified to meet the conditions prescribed under the laws and regulations normally applied to the operation of international air transportation by the Party considering the application or applications; and

(c) the Party designating the airline is maintaining and administering the standards set forth in Article 6 (Safety) and Article 7 (Aviation Security).

Article 4: Revocation of Authorization

(1) Either Party may revoke, suspend or limit the operating authorizations or technical permissions of an airline designated by the other Party where:

(a) substantial ownership and effective control of that airline are not vested in the other Party, the Party's nationals, or both;

(b) that airline has failed to comply with the laws and regulations referred to in Article 5 (Application of Laws) of this Agreement; or

(c) the other Party is not maintaining and administering the standards as set forth in Article 6 (Safety).

(2) Unless immediate action is essential to prevent further noncompliance with subparagraphs 1(b) or l(c) of this Article, the rights established by this Article shall be exercised only after consultation with the other Party.

(3) This Article does not limit the rights of either Party to withhold, revoke, limit or impose conditions on the operating authorization or technical permission of an airline or airlines of the other Party in accordance with the provisions of Article 7 (Aviation Security).

Article 5: Application of Laws

(1) While entering, within, or leaving the territory of one Party, its laws and regulations relating to the operation and navigation of aircraft shall be complied with by the other Party's airlines.

(2) While entering, within, or leaving the territory of one Party, its laws and regulations relating to the admission to or departure from its territory of passengers, crew or cargo on aircraft (including regulations relating to entry, clearance, aviation security, immigration, passports, customs and quarantine or, in the case of mail, postal regulations) shall be complied with by, or on behalf of, such passengers, crew or cargo of the other Party's airlines.

Article 6: Safety

(1) Each Party shall recognize as valid, for the purpose of operating the air transportation provided for in this Agreement, certificates of airworthiness, certificates of competency, and licenses issued or validated by the other Party and still in force, provided that the requirements for such certificates or licenses at least equal the minimum standards that may be established pursuant to the Convention. Each Party may, however, refuse to recognize as valid for the purpose of flight above its own territory, certificates of competency and licenses granted to or validated for its own nationals by the other Party.

(2) Either Party may request consultations concerning the safety standards maintained by the other Party relating to aeronautical facilities, aircrews, aircraft, and operation of the designated airlines. If, following such consultations, one Party finds that the other Party does not effectively maintain and-administer safety standards and requirements in these areas that at least equal the minimum standards that may be established pursuant to the Convention, the other Party shall be notified of such findings and the steps considered necessary to conform with these minimum standards, and the other Party shall take appropriate corrective action. Each Party reserves the right to withhold, revoke, or limit the operating authorization or technical permission of an airline or airlines designated by the other Party in the event the other Party does not take such appropriate corrective action within a reasonable time.

Article 7: Aviation Security

(1) In accordance with their rights and obligations under international law, the Parties reaffirm that their obligation to each other to protect the security of civil aviation against acts of unlawful interference forms an integral part of this Agreement. Without limiting the generality of their rights and obligations under international law, the Parties shall in particular act in conformity with the provisions of the Convention on Offenses and Certain Other Acts Committed on Board Aircraft, signed at Tokyo on September 14, 1963, the Convention for the Suppression of Unlawful Seizure of Aircraft, signed at The Hague on December 16, 1970, the Convention for the Suppression of Unlawful Acts against the Safety of Civil Aviation, signed at Montreal on September 23, 1971, and the Protocol for the Suppression of Unlawful Acts of Violence at Airports Serving International Civil Aviation, Supplementary to the Convention of September 23, 1971, signed at Montreal on February 24, 1988.

(2) The Parties shall provide upon request all necessary assistance to each other to prevent acts of unlawful seizure of civil aircraft and other unlawful acts against the safety of such aircraft, of their passengers and crew, and of airports and air navigation facilities, and to address any other threat to the security of civil air navigation.

(3) The Parties shall, in their mutual relations, act in conformity with the aviation security provisions and appropriate recommended practices established by the International Civil Aviation Organization and designated as Annexes to the Convention; they shall require that operators of aircraft of their registry, operators of aircraft who have their principal place of business or permanent residence in their territory, and the operators of airports in their territory act in conformity with such aviation security provisions.

(4) Each Party agrees to observe the security provisions required by the other Party for entry into, for departure from, and while within the territory of that other Party and to take adequate measures to protect aircraft and to inspect passengers, crew, and their baggage and carry-on items, as well as cargo and aircraft stores, prior to and during boarding or loading. Each Party shall also give positive consideration to any request from the other Party for special security measures to meet a particular threat.

(5) When an incident or threat of an incident of unlawful seizure of aircraft or other unlawful acts against the safety of passengers, crew, aircraft, airports or air navigation facilities occurs, the Parties shall assist each other by facilitating communications and other appropriate measures intended to terminate rapidly and safely such incident or threat.

(6) When a Party has reasonable grounds to believe that the other Party has departed from the aviation security provisions of this Article, the aeronautical authorities of that Party may request immediate consultations with the aeronautical authorities of the other Party. Failure to reach a satisfactory agreement within 15 days from the date of such request shall constitute grounds to withhold, revoke, limit, or impose conditions on the operating authorization and technical permissions of an airline or airlines of that Party. When required by an emergency, a Party may take interim action prior to the expiry of 15 days.

Article 8: Commercial Opportunities

(1) The airlines of each Party shall have the right to establish offices in the territory of the other Party for the promotion and sale of air transportation.

(2) The designated airlines of each Party shall be entitled, in accordance with the laws and regulations of the other Party relating to entry, residence, and employment, to bring in and maintain in the territory of the other Party managerial, sales, technical, operational, and other specialist staff required for the provision of air transportation.

(3) Regarding ground handling:

(a) Each designated airline shall have the right to perform its own ground-handling in the territory, of the other Party ("self-handling") or, at its option, select among competing agents for such services in whole or in part. The rights shall be subject only to physical constraints resulting from considerations of airport safety. Where such considerations preclude self--handling, ground services shall be available on an equal basis to all airlines; charges shall be based on the costs of services provided; and such services shall be comparable to the kind and quality of services as if self--handling were possible.

(b) With respect to passenger check-in and maintenance (including engineering, cabin cleaning, services and repairs) airlines designated by the United States shall be permitted to offer these services to any airline.

(c) With respect to ramp (apron) service for cargo, U.S. airlines may lease equipment and operators thereof to or from other designated U.S. airlines or lease equipment to or from the authorized contractors. For the purposes of this Article, ramp (apron) services for cargo shall apply to all cargo carried on:

(i) All-cargo aircraft;

(ii) Combination aircraft for carriage of cargo in belly or upper deck or both.

(d) with respect to all-cargo operations, U.S. designated all-cargo carriers shall be permitted to perform ground handling services for any airline.

(4) Any airline of each Party may engage in the sale of air transportation in the territory of the other Party directly and, at the airline's discretion, through its agents, except as may be specifically provided by the charter regulations of the country in which the charter originates that relate to the protection of passenger funds, and passenger cancellation and refund rights. Each airline shall have the right to sell such transportation, and any person shall be free to purchase such transportation, in the currency of that territory or in freely convertible currencies.

(5) Each airline shall have the right to convert and remit to its country, on demand, local revenues in excess of sums locally disbursed. Conversion and remittance shall be permitted promptly without restrictions or taxation in respect thereof at the rate of exchange applicable to current transactions and remittance on the date the carrier makes the initial application for remittance.

(6) The airlines of each Party shall be permitted to pay for local expenses, including purchases of fuel, in the territory of the other Party in local currency. At their discretion, the airlines of each Party may pay for such expenses in the territory of the other Party in freely convertible currencies according to local currency regulation.

(7) In operating or holding out the authorized services on the agreed routes, any designated airline of one Party may enter into cooperative marketing arrangements such as blocked-space, code-sharing or leasing arrangements, with

(i) an airline or airlines of either Party; and

(ii) an airline or airlines of a third country, provided that such third country authorizes or allows comparable arrangements between the airlines of the other Party and other airlines on services to, from and via such third country; provided that all airlines in such arrangements (1) hold the appropriate authority and (2) meet the requirements normally applied to such arrangements.

Article 9: Customs Duties and Charges

(1) On arriving in the territory of one Party, aircraft operated in international air transportation by the designated airlines of the other Party, their regular equipment, ground equipment, fuel, lubricants, consumable technical supplies, spare parts (including engines), aircraft stores (including but not limited to such items of food, beverages and liquor, tobacco and other products destined for sale to or use by passengers in limited quantities during flight), and other items intended for or used solely in connection with the operation or servicing of aircraft engaged in international air transportation shall be exempt, on the basis of reciprocity, from all import restrictions, property taxes and capital levies, customs duties, excise taxes, and similar fees and charges that are (1) imposed by the national authorities, and (2) not based on the cost of services provided, provided that such equipment and supplies remain on board the aircraft.

(2) The following shall also be exempt, on the basis of reciprocity, from the taxes, levies, duties, fees and charges referred to in paragraph 1 of this Article, with the exception of charges based on the cost of the service provided:

(a) aircraft stores introduced into or supplied in the territory of a Party and taken on board, within reasonable limits, for use on outbound aircraft of an airline of the other Party engaged in international air transportation, even when these stores are to be used on a part of the journey performed over the territory of the Party in which they are taken on board;

(b) ground equipment and spare parts (including engines) introduced into the territory of a Party for the servicing, maintenance, or repair of aircraft of an airline of the other Party used in international air transportation;

(c) fuel, lubricants and consumable technical supplies introduced into or supplied in the territory of a Party for use in an aircraft of an airline of the other Party engaged in international air transportation, even when these supplies are to be used on a part of the journey performed over the territory of the Party in which they are taken on board; and

(d) promotional and advertising materials introduced into or supplied in the territory of one Party and taken on board, within reasonable limits, for use on outbound aircraft of an airline of the other Party engaged in international air transportation, even when these stores are to be used on a part of the journey performed over the territory of the Party in which they are taken on board.

(3) Equipment and supplies referred to in paragraphs 1 and 2 of this Article may be required to be kept under the supervision or control of the appropriate authorities.

(4) The exemptions provided by this Article shall also be available where the designated airlines of one Party have contracted with another airline, which similarly enjoys such exemptions from the other Party, for the loan or transfer in the territory of the other Party of the items specified in paragraphs 1 and 2 of this Article.

Article 10: User Charges

(1) User charges that may be imposed by the competent charging authorities or bodies of each Party on the airlines of the other Party shall be just, reasonable, not unjustly discriminatory, and equitably apportioned among categories of users. In any event, any such user charges shall be assessed on the airlines of the other Party on terms not less favorable than the most favorable terms available to any other airline at the time the charges are assessed.

(2) User charges imposed on the airlines of the other Party may reflect, but shall not exceed, the full cost to the competent charging authorities or bodies of providing the appropriate airport, airport environmental, air navigation, and aviation security facilities and services at the airport or within the airport system. Such full cost may include a reasonable return on assets, after depreciation. Facilities and services for which charges are made shall be provided on an efficient and economic basis.

(3) Each Party shall encourage consultations between the competent charging authorities or bodies in its territory and the airlines using the services and facilities, and shall encourage the competent charging authorities or bodies and the airlines to exchange such information as may be necessary to permit an accurate review of the reasonableness of the charges in accordance with the principles of paragraphs 1 and 2 of this Article. Each Party shall encourage the competent charging authorities to provide users with reasonable notice of any proposal for changes in user charges to enable users to express their views before changes are made.

(4) Neither Party shall be held, in dispute resolution procedures pursuant to Article 14, to be in breach of a provision of this Article, unless (i) it fails to undertake a review of the charge or practice that is the subject of complaint by the other Party within a reasonable amount of time; or (ii) following such a review it fails to take all steps within its power to remedy any charge of practice that is inconsistent with this Article.

Article 11: Fair Competition

(1) Each Party shall allow a fair and equal opportunity for the designated airlines of both Parties to compete in providing the international air transportation governed by this Agreement.

(2) Each Party shall allow each designated airline to determine the frequency and capacity of the international air transportation it offers based upon commercial considerations in the marketplace. Consistent with this right, neither Party shall unilaterally limit the volume of traffic, frequency or regularity of service, or the aircraft type or types operated by the designated airlines of the other Party, except as may be required for customs, technical, operational, or environmental reasons under uniform conditions consistent with Article 15 of the Convention.

(3) Neither Party shall impose on the other Party's designated airlines a first-refusal requirement, uplift ratio, no-objection fee, or any other requirement with respect to capacity, frequency or traffic that would be inconsistent with the purposes of this Agreement.

(4) Neither Party shall require the filing of schedules, programs for charter flights, or operational plans by airlines of the other Party for approval, except as may be required on a non-discriminatory basis to enforce the uniform conditions foreseen-by paragraph 2 of this Article or as may be specifically authorized in an Annex to this Agreement. If a Party requires filings for information purposes, it shall minimize the administrative burdens of filing requirements and procedures on air transportation intermediaries and on designated airlines of the other Party.

Article 12: Pricing

(1) Each Party shall allow prices for air transportation to be established by each designated airline based upon commercial considerations in the marketplace. Intervention by the Parties shall be limited to:

(a) prevention of unreasonably discriminatory prices or practices;

(b) protection of consumers from prices that are unreasonably high or restrictive due to the abuse of a dominant position; and

(c) protection of airlines from prices that are artificially low due to direct or indirect governmental subsidy or support.

(2) Each Party may require notification to or filing with its aeronautical authorities of prices to be charged to or from its territory by airlines of the other Party. Notification or filing by the airlines of both Parties may be required no more than 30 days before the proposed date of effectiveness. In individual cases, notification or filing may be permitted on shorter notice than normally required. Neither Party shall require the notification or filing by airlines of the other Party of prices charged by charterers to the public, except as may be required on a non-discriminatory basis for information purposes.

(3) Neither Party shall take unilateral action to prevent the inauguration or continuation of a price proposed to be charged or charged by (a) an airline of either Party for international air transportation between the territories of the Parties, or (b) an airline of one Party for international air transportation between the territory of the other Party and any other country, including in both cases transportation on an interline or intraline basis. If either Party believes that any such price is inconsistent with the considerations set forth in paragraph 1 of this Article, it shall request consultations and notify the other Party of the reasons for its dissatisfaction as soon as possible. These consultations shall be held not later than 30 days after receipt of the request, and the Parties shall cooperate in securing information necessary for reasoned resolution of the issue. If the Parties reach agreement with respect to a price for which a notice of dissatisfaction has been given, each Party shall use its best efforts to put that agreement into effect. Without such mutual agreement, the price shall go into effect or continue in effect.

Article 13: Consultations

Either Party may, at any time, request consultations relating to this Agreement. Such consultations shall begin at the earliest possible date, but not later than 60 days from the date the other Party receives the request unless otherwise agreed.

Article 14: Settlement of Disputes

(1) Any dispute arising under this Agreement, except those that may arise under paragraph 3 of Article 12 (Pricing), that is not resolved by a first round of formal consultations may be referred by agreement of the Parties for decision to some person or body. If the Parties do not so agree, the dispute shall, at the request of either Party; be submitted to arbitration in accordance with the procedures set forth below.

(2) Arbitration shall be by a tribunal of three arbitrators to be constituted as follows:

(a) Within 30 days after the receipt of a request for arbitration, each Party shall name one arbitrator. Within 60 days after these two arbitrators have been named, they shall by agreement appoint a third arbitrator, who shall act as President of the arbitral tribunal;

(b) If either Party fails to name an arbitrator, or if the third arbitrator is not appointed in accordance with subparagraph a of this paragraph, either Party may request the President of the Council of the International Civil Aviation Organization to appoint the necessary arbitrator or arbitrators within 30 days. If the President of the Council is of the same nationality as one of the Parties, the most senior Vice President who is not disqualified on that ground shall make the appointment.

(3) Except as otherwise agreed, the arbitral tribunal shall determine the limits of its jurisdiction in accordance with this Agreement and shall establish its own procedural rules. The tribunal, once formed, may recommend interim relief measures pending its final determination. At the direction of the tribunal or at the request of either of the Parties, a conference to determine the precise issues to be arbitrated and the specific procedures to be followed shall be held not later than 15 days after the tribunal is fully constituted.

(4) Except as otherwise agreed or as directed by the tribunal, each Party shall submit a memorandum within 45 days of the time the tribunal is fully constituted. Replies shall be due 60 days later. The tribunal shall hold a hearing at the request of either Party or on its own initiative within 15 days after replies are due.

(5) The tribunal shall attempt to render a written decision within 30 days after completion of the hearing or, if no hearing is held, after the date both replies are submitted. The decision of the majority of the tribunal shall prevail.

(6) The Parties may submit requests for clarification of the decision within 15 days after it is rendered and any clarification given shall be issued within 15 days of such request.

(7) Each Party shall, to the degree consistent with its national law, give full effect to any decision or award of the arbitral tribunal.

(8) The expenses of the arbitral tribunal, including the fees and expenses of the arbitrators, shall be shared equally by the Parties. Any expenses incurred by the President of the Council of the International Civil Aviation Organization in connection with the procedures of paragraph 2(b) of this Article shall be considered to be part of the expenses of the arbitral tribunal.

Article 15: Termination

Either Party may, at any time, give notice in writing to the other Party of its decision to terminate this Agreement. Such notice shall be sent simultaneously to the International Civil Aviation Organization. This Agreement shall terminate at midnight (at the place of receipt of the notice to the other Party) immediately before the first anniversary of the date of receipt of the notice by the other Party, unless the notice is withdrawn by agreement of the Parties before the end of this period.

Article 16: Registration with ICAO

This Agreement and all amendments thereto shall be registered with the International Civil Aviation organization.

Article 17: Entry into Force

This Agreement and its Annexes shall enter into force on the date of signature. Upon entry into force, this Agreement shall supersede the Air Transport Agreement between the United States and Singapore, with annexes and exchange of notes, signed at Singapore March 31, 1978, as amended.

IN WITNESS WHEREOF the undersigned, being duly authorized by their respective Governments, have signed this Agreement.

DONE at Singapore, this 8th day of April, 1997, in duplicate, in the English language.

TIMOTHY A. CHORBA, U.S.AMBASSADOR
GOVERNMENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA

For the Government of the Republic of Singapore:

MAH BOW TAN, MINISTER FOR COMMUNICATIONS
GOVERNMENT OF THE REPUBLIC OF SINGAPORE

ANNEX I: Scheduled Air Transportation

Section 1: Routes

Airlines of each Party designated under this Annex shall, in accordance with the terms of their designation, be entitled to perform scheduled international air transportation between points on the following routes:

A. Routes for the airline or airlines designated by the Government of the United States:

1. From points behind the United States via the United States and intermediate points to a point or points in Singapore and beyond.

2. For all-cargo service or services, between Singapore and any point or points.

B. Routes for the airline or airlines designated by the Republic of Singapore:

1. From points behind Singapore via Singapore and intermediate points to a point or points in the United States and beyond.

2. For all-cargo service or services, between the United States and any point or points.

Section 2: Operational Flexibility

Each designated airline may, on any or all flights and at its option:

1. Operate flights in either or both directions;

2. Combine different flight numbers within one aircraft operation;

3. Serve behind, intermediate, and beyond points and points in the territories of the Parties on the routes in any combination and in any order;

4. Omit stops at any point or points;

5. Transfer traffic from any of its aircraft to any of its other aircraft at any point on the routes; and

6. Serve points behind any point in its territory with or without change of aircraft or flight number and may hold out and advertise such services to the public as through services;

Without directional or geographic limitation and without loss of any right to carry traffic otherwise permissible under this Agreement; provided that, with the exception of all-cargo services, the service serves a point in the territory of the Party designating the airline.

Section 3: Change of Gauge

On any segment or segments of the routes above, any designated airline may perform international air transportation without any limitation as to change, at any point on the route, in type or number of aircraft operated; provided that, with the exception of all cargo -services, in the outbound direction, the transportation beyond such point is a continuation of the transportation from the territory of the Party that has designated the airline and, in the inbound direction, the transportation to the territory of the Party that has designated the airline is a continuation of the transportation from beyond such point.

Section 4: Intermodal Services

Notwithstanding any other provision of this Agreement, airlines and indirect providers of cargo transportation of both Parties shall be permitted, without restriction, to employ in connection with international air transportation any surface transportation for cargo to or from any points in the territories of the Parties or in third countries, including transport to and from all airports with customs facilities, and including, where applicable, the right to transport cargo in bond under applicable laws and regulations. Such cargo, whether moving by surface or by air, shall have access to airport customs processing and facilities. Airlines may elect to perform their own surface transportation or to provide it through arrangements with other surface carriers, including surface transportation operated by other airlines and indirect providers of cargo air transportation. Such intermodal cargo services may be offered at a single, through price for the air and surface transportation combined, provided that shippers are not misled as to the facts concerning such transportation.

ANNEX II: Charter Air Transportation

Section 1

Airlines of each Party designated under this Annex shall, in accordance with the terms of their designation, have the right to carry international charter traffic of passengers (and their accompanying baggage) and/or cargo (including, but not limited to, freight forwarder, split, and combination (passenger/cargo) charters):

Between any point or points in the territory of the Party that has designated the airline and any point or points in the territory of the other Party; and

Between any point or points in the territory of the other Party and any point or points in a third country or countries, provided that such service constitutes part of a continuous operation, with or without a change of aircraft, that includes service to the homeland for the purpose of carrying local traffic between the homeland and the territory of the other Party.

In the performance of services covered by this Annex, airlines of each Party designated under this Annex shall also have the right: (1) to make stopovers at any points whether within or outside of the territory of either Party; (2) to carry transit traffic through the other Party's territory; and (3) to combine on the same aircraft traffic originating in one Party's territory, originating in the other Party's territory, and traffic originating in third countries.

Each Party shall extend favorable consideration to applications by airlines of the other Party to carry traffic not covered by this Annex on the basis of comity and reciprocity.

Section 2

Any airline designated by either Party performing international charter air transportation originating in the territory of either Party, whether on a one-way or round-trip basis, shall have the option of complying with the charter laws, regulations, and rules either of its homeland or of the other Party. If a Party applies different rules, regulations, terms, conditions, or limitations to one or more of its airlines, or to airlines of different countries, each designated airline shall be subject to the least restrictive of such criteria.

However, nothing contained in the above paragraph shall limit the rights of either Party to require airlines designated under this Annex by either Party to adhere to requirements relating to the protection of passenger funds and passenger cancellation and refund rights.

Section 3

Except with respect to the consumer protection rules referred to in the preceding paragraph above, neither Party shall require an airline designated under this Annex by the other Party, in respect of the carriage of traffic from the territory of that other Party or of a third country on a one-way or round-trip basis, to submit more than a declaration of conformity with the applicable laws, regulations and rules referred to under section 2 of this Annex or of a waiver of these laws, regulations, or rules granted by the applicable aeronautical authorities.

ANNEX III: Principles of Non-Discrimination Within and Competition among Computer Reservations Systems

Recognizing that Article 11 (Fair Competition) of this Agreement guarantees the airlines of both Parties "a fair and equal opportunity to compete,"

Considering that one of the most important aspects of the ability of an airline to compete is its ability to inform the public of its services in a fair and impartial manner, and that, therefore, the quality of information about airline services available to travel agents who directly distribute such information to the traveling public and the ability of an airline to offer those agents competitive computer reservations systems (CRSs) represent the foundation for an airline's competitive opportunities, and

Considering that it is equally necessary to ensure that the interests of the consumers of air transport products are protected from any misuse of such information and its misleading presentation and that airlines and travel agents have access to effectively competitive computer reservations systems:

1. The Parties agree that CRSs will have integrated primary displays for which:

a. Information regarding international air services, including the construction of connections on those services, shall be edited and displayed based on non-discriminatory and objective criteria that are not influenced, directly or indirectly, by airline or market identity. Such criteria shall apply uniformly to all participating airlines.

b. CRS data bases shall be as comprehensive as possible.

c. CRS vendors shall not delete information submitted by participating airlines; such information shall be accurate and transparent; for example, code-shared and change-of-gauge flights and flights with stops should be clearly identified as having those characteristics.

d. All CRSs that are available to travel agents who directly distribute information about airline services to the traveling public in either Party's territory shall not only be obligated to, but shall also be entitled to, operate in conformance with the CRS rules that apply in the territory where the CRS is being operated.

e. Travel agents shall be allowed to use any of the secondary displays available through the CRS so long as the travel agent makes a specific request for that display.

2. A Party shall require that each CRS vendor operating in its territory allow all airlines willing to pay any applicable non-discriminatory fee to participate in its CRS. A Party shall require that all distribution facilities that a system vendor provides shall be offered on a non-discriminatory basis to participating airlines. A Party shall require that CRS vendors display, on a non-discriminatory, objective, carrier-neutral and market--neutral basis, the international air services of participating airlines in all markets in which they wish to sell those services. Upon request, a CRS vendor shall disclose details of its data base update and storage procedures, its criteria for editing and ranking information, the weight given to such criteria, and the criteria used for selection of connect points and inclusion of connecting flights.

3. CRS vendors operating in the territory of one Party shall be entitled to bring in, maintain, and make freely available their CRSs to travel agencies or travel companies whose principal business is the distribution of travel-related products in the territory of the other Party if the CRS complies with these principles.

4. Neither Party shall, in its territory, impose or permit to be imposed on the CRS vendors of the other Party more stringent requirements with respect to access to and use of communication facilities, selection and use of technical CRS hardware and software, and the technical installation of CRS hardware, than those imposed on its own CRS vendors.

5. Neither Party shall, in its territory, impose or permit to be imposed on the CRS vendors of the other Party more restrictive requirements with respect to CRS displays (including edit and display parameters), operation, or sale than those imposed on its own CRS vendors.

6. CRSs in use in the territory of one Party that comply with these principles and other relevant non--discriminatory regulatory, technical, and security standards shall be entitled to effective and unimpaired access in the territory of the other Party. One aspect of this is that a designated airline shall participate in such a system as fully in its homeland territory as it does in any system offered to travel agents in the territory of the other Party. Owners/operators of CRSs of one Party shall have the same opportunity to own/operate CRSs that conform to these principles within the territory of the other Party as do owners/operators of that Party. Each Party shall ensure that its airlines and its CRS vendors do not discriminate against travel agents in their homeland territory because of their use or possession of a CRS also operated in the territory of the other Party.

[end of document]

ummm that's no help... i can't read that!

i assume the answer is yes then. will singapore airlines fly point to point? perhaps with tiger airways?

B. Routes for the airline or airlines designated by the Republic of Singapore:

1. From points behind Singapore via Singapore and intermediate points to a point or points in the United States and beyond.

Each designated airline may, on any or all flights and at its option:

3. Serve behind, intermediate, and beyond points and points in the territories of the Parties on the routes in any combination and in any order[end of document]
Hahahaa....based on some of the text, such as these, it seems as thou they can. But from what I noe of US policies, they are VERY restrictive over any foreign airlines flying their domestic routes...

doesnt this override any US policy?

doesnt this override any US policy?
I am not so sure, but it seems like the only reason Singapore might gain domestic access is because we dont have a domestic market in the first place to oppose it! But the Americans will be pretty dumb to let us fly their domestic then. :D

all in the spirit of free trade :D

A few older articles about the long flights which are rather interesting:

World's longest flight to its most ambitious city

By PAUL MILLER

Published: March 5, 2004

SINGAPORE — A WIDE-BODY jet, its wings drooping with a heavy load of fuel, sets off every evening from Los Angeles International Airport for an astonishing 18-and-a-half-hour nonstop flight to this impressively modern city in Southeast Asia.

It is a flight that only became possible last month, with the introduction of the ultra-long-range Airbus 340-500, which allowed Singapore Airlines to claim the record for the longest non-stop flight — more than 9,000 miles — in commercial aviation history.

Thanks to a host of technological innovations and some much-appreciated personal touches by the airline’s famously personable cabin attendants, it’s also one of the most enjoyable flights — even in coach.

“We’ve tried to find the perfect balance between making the flight commercially viable and giving the passengers as much room as possible,” said James Boyd, spokesman for Singapore Airlines in Los Angeles. “The A340-500 can carry 313 passengers, but we’ve configured it for just 181.”

“There was a lot of concern when these flights were announced, because it’s not healthy to be stuck in a small space for 18 hours,” said Richard Maslem, deputy editor of Airliner World magazine, an industry bible. “So what Singapore Airlines has done, in effect, is eliminate the economy cabin by giving everyone a lot more room. Also, the in-flight video system is superb. The time actually goes by very quickly.”

There is no first class on the record-breaking LAX-Singapore run, a flight that spends more than 15 hours out of sight of land. Up front, 64 business-class passengers have ultra-luxurious seats that convert into fully flat “spacebeds.” A roundtrip in that cabin runs about $4,800.

But in a class Singapore Airlines calls “Executive Economy,” where the 18,000-mile round trip is priced at less than $1,200, passengers enjoy considerably more room than the usual economy class on international flights.

And passengers used to the cramped quarters on domestic coach flights will hardly recognize their surroundings.

“We’ve designed a completely new seat, which is three inches wider than the industry standard, and we’ve spaced the rows much farther apart,” Boyd said. “On the whole plane there are just 13 middle seats — the idea is to give passengers a focus on personal space.”

In Executive Economy, two-and-a-half hot meals are served, plus there are hot and cold snacks continuously available in the passenger lounge, where people can walk around, mingle and refresh themselves as the hours go by.

Midnight over the dateline

On a recent trip, at midnight over the international date line in the middle of the vast Pacific Ocean, the emphasis on passenger comfort was brought to life: A hungry traveller, surrounded by his sleeping compatriots — just 132 of them on this particular flight — made his way down a darkened aisle to the rear of the cruising aircraft. Parting a delicately pleated curtain the color of Häagen-Dazs vanilla ice cream (which was on his mind, since it had been served several hours earlier, at the end of dinner), he was greeted by a beautifully attired, perfectly coifed and expertly made-up flight attendant who rose from the seat where she waited, alone, ready to attend to the needs of her charges. She smiled broadly and, with an accent that spoke volumes about the diverse heritage of her homeland, said, “Sir, would you like a nectarine?”

The name tag pinned to her uniform read, “Ten Li Yee,” but she said her name was Wendy. The other name was her “dialect” name, she explained. This was her first run on the ultra-non-stop flight between California and Singapore.

“The passengers really seem to appreciate the extra room,” she said. Like her fellow attendants on this flight, her poise and intelligence qualified her for the prestigious assignment. Singapore is a highly competitive society, where a slight change in entrance requirements for college makes front page news in the Straits Times, and its renowned airline is one of its most enviable achievements. Last weekend, labor negotiations between management and the pilots — regarding how many business class seats should be set aside for their rest periods on long-haul flights and whether profits have recovered sufficiently after 9/11 and the SARS epidemic for flight crews to recoup some of their givebacks — were chronicled in great detail in the local newspaper and took up almost three full pages in the Sunday edition. The people who work for Singapore Airlines know how important they are.

“We have to be better than the other airlines flying across the Pacific,” said another youthful flight attendant named Grace. “Especially on an 18-hour flight.” Then she realized she was talking to a reporter and had second thoughts.

“Does my company know you’re writing a story?” she asked.

200 channels

Aboard Singapore flight 19, long-haul passengers can entertain themselves with 60 on-demand movies on personal 9-inch LCD screens. There are dozens of TV and music channels available, while the kids can stick to familiar territory with a wide selection of Nintendo and other video games. On their video screens, passengers can even compete with each other at computer chess or trivia. Another touch much appreciated by a traveling reporter: Even in coach, the seats come with laptop power ports.

Underlying all the comforts that make the passengers feel at home on a record-breaking journey across the Pacific are a host of technical achievements that keep airline travel moving forward, despite the fact that jetliner speeds are about the same today as they were when the 707 was introduced in 1959. With the Concorde retiring last year, airlines passengers are pretty much stuck at 550 mph, according to industry experts.

“But eliminating stops is a great time saver, especially on long trips,” said Maslem. The Los Angeles-Singapore flight saves several hours, because passengers on the route used to have to stop in Tokyo or Hong Kong. “An even bigger savings — at least five hours — will come when they introduce nonstop flights between Singapore and New York this summer,” Maslem added. That trip is possible now only by flying through London or Frankfurt.

The original 707 could fly a maximum of just 2,700 miles without landing — barely enough to get from Los Angeles to New York. The A340-500 can go almost four times as far. The Boeing 777-300ER, currently in flight trials, will have a similar range.

Over the poles?

Singapore Airlines’ New York-Singapore flight, set to begin in June, will travel directly over the North Pole. United Airlines is already flying 747s over the pole between New York and Hong Kong. In the airline industry, there is talk of the new generation of long-range airliners being used for Sydney-Rio de Janeiro service, which would take passengers near the South Pole, making polar circumnavigation possible for the first time in history in complete comfort.

“For a businessman like me, the time savings can be significant, and if you just love to fly, these new routes are simply thrilling,” said Philip Goren, a South African software engineer working for a German company in Singapore who said he travels between Singapore and the United States several times a year.

The A340-500 owes its development, in part, to a 1997 “open skies” treaty between Singapore and the United States which allowed unlimited direct air service between the two nations. But when the treaty was signed, no aircraft existed that could make the trip.

In 1999, Singapore Airlines ordered five of the new long-range jets offered by Airbus, with engines made by Rolls-Royce. The first was delivered last fall and entered service Feb. 3. Emirates Airlines also ordered the plane, which it is flying between Dubai and Australia.

“We’re studying the U.S. market to see what other cities might be viable for service to Singapore,” Boyd said. “We have lots of options.”

Reaching for the skies

The ambition of Singapore Airlines reflects the striving of its home city to be an economic engine for Asia, if not the whole world. Singapore was founded in 1819 by Stamford Raffles, a British agent for the East India Company, whose mission was to establish a British port to compete with highly profitable Dutch outposts on the route between India and China. First, Raffles had to conquer locals’ fears that their island’s dense jungles were home to demons and vampires. There were also real threats — tigers, pythons and wild boar. But Singapore’s success was almost immediate and has only increased since it achieved independence in 1965. According to a recent economic study by a Dutch university, Singaporean workers are almost 95 percent as productive as their American counterparts — a higher figure than any Asian nation, including Japan.

The SARS epidemic last year hit Singapore Airlines and its home nation hard. To help keep out communicable diseases, passengers arriving at Changi airport have their temperatures taken automatically by infrared sensors as they descend an escalator to the baggage claim area. Anyone with a high fever is taken aside for examination, immigration officials said.

But once inside the bustling city, which has more skyscrapers than San Francisco, visitors can sample exotic Asian cultures, along with some of the best hotels and restaurants in the world, especially the renowned Raffles Hotel, where movie stars, great authors and heads of state routinely stay. Plaques on the entrances to suites commemorate visits by Joseph Conrad, Somerset Maugham, James Michener and Charlie Chaplin, among others.

Thanks to prevailing winds from the west, the trip back home to the United States is shorter than the trip out — a mere 15 hours from Singapore to Los Angeles. And after hours and hours following the great circle route back to the United States, the flight makes landfall over the Monterey Peninsula. If only it would stop right there.

haha san francisco isn't exactly known for having loads of skyscrapers

July 2004

http://www.travelandleisure.com/includes/navbar/images/logo_tl.gif

Good-bye, Layovers

An oncoming wave of super-long direct flights promises to change the way we travel around the globe. Andrea Bennett reports on the future of flying

by Andrea Bennett

Since February, it has been possible to live your life in two hemispheres—or at least to feel as if you did. When you board Singapore Airlines Flight SQ20, you leave Changi Airport at 4 p.m., cross 10 time zones in 18 hours without stopping, and arrive in Los Angeles at 4 p.m. the same day. The flight can shave up to three hours off the carrier's normal route, and is made possible by the Airbus 340-500, which has the longest range of any commercial aircraft in operation today.

SQ20 isn't the only super-long-haul flight to debut in 2004. At press time, Singapore was also planning to begin nonstop New York-Singapore service this summer, and Emirates Airline expected to launch 13-hour direct flights from New York to Dubai. Also coming up: nonstop service from New York to Hong Kong on Cathay Pacific, and Toronto to Hong Kong on Air Canada.

Of course, such flights aren't entirely new—Continental Airlineshas intermittently offered direct service between New York and Hong Kong since 2001—but today they represent a growing trend. In just a few years, we may be not only flying farther without needing to stop in hubs but also enjoying unprecedented comforts in the air.

Whether longer-haul direct flights become the norm depends in part on which of the world's two largest aircraft manufacturers, Airbus and Boeing, wins more business from the airlines as international travel increases.

Airbus is betting that carriers will want to offer point-to-point service on certain routes while also continuing to stop in hubs on others. The company has already taken the lead in manufacturing planes that can fly farther; as of May, it had logged orders for 22 A340-500's (which can fly 8,650 nautical miles) and 84 A340-600's (7,500 nautical miles). At the same time, its major next-generation plane, scheduled to begin flying in 2006, is the A380, a monster double-decker that can carry up to 555 passengers. The idea behind it: transport more passengers to popular hubs on fewer flights, thus easing congestion. The A380 has proven equally attractive to carriers—Airbus currently has 129 on order. Emirates, for example, is using the A340-500 on its New York-Dubai route, and is also buying 45 A380's; Nigel Page, a senior vice president of commercial operations at the airline, expects that these planes will travel between Dubai and European hubs.

Boeing, for its part, sees direct flights as the way of the future. According to spokesman Tom Brabant, the company believes that travelers want to fly "where and when they want" and prefer more frequent nonstops between smaller, less busy terminals. To fill this perceived need, both of Boeing's next-generation planes are long-range: the 777-200LR, which will be able to fly nearly 10,000 nautical miles when it goes into service in 2006, and the 7E7, a smaller, lighter fuel-efficient plane that can fly up to 8,500 nautical miles. The company has identified 450 possible new city pairs that these planes might serve, such as Detroit-Beijing.

This approach is a gamble for Boeing, which has trailed Airbus in sales four of the past five years (Boeing delivered 281 commercial aircraft in 2003, Airbus 305). It's arguable that a more diversified product line will continue to give Airbus an edge, but either way, according to Virginia-based aviation analyst and historian George Hamlin, there should be a growing market for longer-range aircraft. If the major international airlines stick to operating shorter flights between a small number of heavily used hubs, Hamlin says, low-cost carriers could create new point-to-point routes and capture business, much as they've done within the United States and Europe. (Low-cost carriers now control about 14 percent of Europe's market and 22 percent of America's.)

For now, flying longer-haul international flights on some routes simply makes good business sense for many airlines. By capitalizing on greater fuel efficiency and eliminating multiple take-off, handling, and refueling charges, airlines can increase profits per flight. What's more, says Singapore Airlines spokesman James Boyd, these new flightsallow carriers to bypass restrictive government regulations. "Singapore and the United States have an open-skies agreement, and we can fly as much as the market will allow," he notes. "But that's not true of some intermediate destinations. It was a drag on growth."

These flights also give airlines an opportunity to win the business of the customer they most want: the international business traveler. Recent Business Travel Monitor data from American Express (the parent company of this magazine) shows that the typical domestic business-class fare from Newark to San Francisco plunged 78 percent between December 2002 and December 2003, mostly due to competition from low-fare carriers. Because business travelers are the passengers most likely to demand first- and business-class seats for longer flights, new super-long-haul flights offer the airlines a chance to recoup losses in the domestic market by selling a greater number of the higher-priced international tickets (see "High Flying," below).

The International Civil Aviation Organization projects that world passenger traffic will rise by 4.4 percent in 2004, taking the airline industry back into the black for the first time since September 11, 2001; in 2005, traffic is expected to increase by 6.3 percent. What a growing number of longer nonstop flights may signal more than anything else is renewed optimism about travel among those who are willing to pay a higher price in exchange for extra comfort and, even more important, extra time. As George Loewenstein, a professor of economics and psychology at Carnegie Mellon University, puts it, "Time has become the new scarce commodity."

New York-based writer Andrea Bennett reports on commercial aviation for Travel + Leisure.

High Flying: The Perks of Long-haul Flights

To better serve passengers paying a premium on new super-long flights, many carriers, including those listed below, have reinvented their services.

• Emirates Airline reduced the capacity of its A340-500's flying between New York and Dubai in order to devote more space to the front of the cabin. Its 12 fully enclosed first-class mini-suites (cost: about $7,000 round-trip) have electric sliding doors, seats that recline flat, telephones, in-flight e-mail service, 19-inch video screens on which you can choose from 50 TV channels and 100 movies, plus vanity tables, mini-bars, and room service. The 42 seats in business class—which recline to a nearly flat position and have built-in massagers—are all located next to a window or on the aisle.

• Cathay Pacific redesigned the cabins on its new long-haul planes so that eight first-class passengers can browse a private gallery of images from Hong Kong photographers while either helping themselves to food at a buffet table or ordering from a menu on demand. Seats have phone, fax, and e-mail service; they recline flat and have a pitch of 79 inches. The 21 business-class seats are wider (20 1/2 inches) and longer (75 inches) than those on normal routes and come with e-mail and telephone service.

• Singapore Airlines designed its Los Angeles-Singapore A340-500's to carry just 181 passengers in two classes. In Raffles Class (business), the 64 SpaceBeds recline flat and have a 64-inch seat pitch (six more inches than on the company's other planes). At 20 inches, Executive Economy seats are the widest of any economy-class seats in the air. Both cabins have self-serve bars and snack counters.

Less then 2 hours left for the inaugural flight SQ22! :)

Detailed Flight Information:
Singapore Flight 22 to Newark, NJ
(EWR-Newark International Airport)

Airline: Singapore
Flight Number: 22
Departure City (Airport): Singapore, Singapore (WSSS)
Departure Time: 06/28/2004 12:05 PM
Arrival City (Airport): Newark, NJ (EWR)
Arrival Time: 06/28/2004 06:24 PM
Remaining Flight Time: 01:55
Aircraft Type: A345
Current Altitude: 41,000 feet
Current Groundspeed: 580 mph
Flight Status: In Flight

Hmm...one source seems to say the plane has landed, while another hasent:

http://www.flytecomm.com/cgi-bin/trackflight

Detailed Flight Information:
Singapore Flight 22 to Newark, NJ
(EWR-Newark International Airport)

Airline: Singapore
Flight Number :22
Departure City (Airport): Singapore, Singapore (WSSS)
Departure Time: 06/28/2004 12:05 PM
Arrival City (Airport): Newark, NJ (EWR)
Arrival Time: 06/28/2004 05:35 PM
Remaining Flight Time: 00:00
Aircraft Type: A345
Current Altitude: 0 feet
Current Groundspeed: 0 mph
Flight Status: Landed

http://www.rlmsoftware.com/TravelTools/ProcessFTQuery.asp?qt=af

Singapore Airlines
Flight Number 22 (SQ22)

Departure
Airport: SIN
Scheduled Time: 12:05 PM, Jun 28
Actual Time: Not Available

Arrival
Airport: Newark, NJ
Scheduled Time: 6:30 PM, Jun 28
Actual Time: 6:29 PM, Jun 28 (Est)
Status: In air
Altitude: 41000 feet
Ground Speed: 512 KTS
Equipment: A345

http://www.rlmsoftware.com/fvRLMSW41/FlightViewCGI.exe?qtype=gif&acid=SQ22&depap=SIN

28/29 June 2004
17:55:37 hours Newark Time
05:55:37 hours Singapore Time

Singapore Airlines
Flight Number 22 (SQ22)

Departure
Airport: SIN
Scheduled Time: 12:05 PM, Jun 28
Actual Time: Not Available

Arrival
Airport: Newark, NJ
Scheduled Time: 6:30 PM, Jun 28
Actual Time: 6:28 PM, Jun 28 (Est)
Status: In air
Altitude: 37400 feet
Ground Speed: 530 KTS
Equipment: A345

About 20 mins left!! :D

SQ22 can be seen popping into this map at the top left! :eek:

http://img31.photobucket.com/albums/v94/huaiwei/SIA/5-55-37_PM.gif

28/29 June 2004
18:06:12 hours Newark Time
06:06:12 hours Singapore Time

Singapore Airlines
Flight Number 22 (SQ22)

Departure
Airport: SIN
Scheduled Time: 12:05 PM, Jun 28
Actual Time: Not Available

Arrival
Airport: Newark, NJ
Scheduled Time: 6:30 PM, Jun 28
Actual Time: 6:37 PM, Jun 28 (Est)
Status: In air
Altitude: 37000 feet
Ground Speed: 483 KTS
Equipment: A345

The plane is steadily descending, and slowing down...

http://img31.photobucket.com/albums/v94/huaiwei/SIA/6-06-12_PM.gif

28/29 June 2004
18:11:39 hours Newark Time
06:11:39 hours Singapore Time

Singapore Airlines
Flight Number 22 (SQ22)

Departure
Airport: SIN
Scheduled Time: 12:05 PM, Jun 28
Actual Time: Not Available

Arrival
Airport: Newark, NJ
Scheduled Time: 6:30 PM, Jun 28
Actual Time: 6:28 PM, Jun 28 (Est)
Status: In air
Altitude: 27900 feet
Ground Speed: 560 KTS
Equipment: A345

http://img31.photobucket.com/albums/v94/huaiwei/SIA/6-11-39_PM.gif

28/29 June 2004
18:19:07 hours Newark Time
06:19:07 hours Singapore Time

Singapore Airlines
Flight Number 22 (SQ22)

Departure
Airport: SIN
Scheduled Time: 12:05 PM, Jun 28
Actual Time: Not Available

Arrival
Airport: Newark, NJ
Scheduled Time: 6:30 PM, Jun 28
Actual Time: 6:31 PM, Jun 28 (Est)
Status: In air
Altitude: 19800 feet
Ground Speed: 490 KTS
Equipment: A345

http://img31.photobucket.com/albums/v94/huaiwei/SIA/6-19-07_PM.gif

28/29 June 2004
18:26:39 hours Newark Time
06:26:39 hours Singapore Time

Singapore Airlines
Flight Number 22 (SQ22)

Departure
Airport: SIN
Scheduled Time: 12:05 PM, Jun 28
Actual Time: Not Available

Arrival
Airport: Newark, NJ
Scheduled Time: 6:30 PM, Jun 28
Actual Time: 6:38 PM, Jun 28 (Est)
Status: In air
Altitude: 10200 feet
Ground Speed: 339 KTS
Equipment: A345

http://img31.photobucket.com/albums/v94/huaiwei/SIA/6-26-39_PM.gif

28/29 June 2004
18:32:22 hours Newark Time
06:32:22 hours Singapore Time

Singapore Airlines
Flight Number 22 (SQ22)

Departure
Airport: SIN
Scheduled Time: 12:05 PM, Jun 28
Actual Time: Not Available

Arrival
Airport: Newark, NJ
Scheduled Time: 6:30 PM, Jun 28
Actual Time: 6:38 PM, Jun 28 (Est)
Status: In air
Altitude: 7000 feet
Ground Speed: 205 KTS
Equipment: A345

http://img31.photobucket.com/albums/v94/huaiwei/SIA/6-32-22_PM.gif

28/29 June 2004
18:35:39 hours Newark Time
06:35:39 hours Singapore Time

Singapore Airlines
Flight Number 22 (SQ22)

Departure
Airport: SIN
Scheduled Time: 12:05 PM, Jun 28
Actual Time: Not Available

Arrival
Airport: Newark, NJ
Scheduled Time: 6:30 PM, Jun 28
Actual Time: 6:38 PM, Jun 28 (Est)
Status: In air
Altitude: 7000 feet
Ground Speed: 200 KTS
Equipment: A345

http://img31.photobucket.com/albums/v94/huaiwei/SIA/6-35-39_PM.gif

The world's longest flight has just been completed!!!

Singapore Airlines
Flight Number 22 (SQ22)

Departure
Airport: SIN
Scheduled Time: 12:05 PM, Jun 28
Actual Time: Not Available

Arrival
Airport: Newark, NJ
Scheduled Time: 6:30 PM, Jun 28
Actual Time: 6:40 PM, Jun 28
Status: Landed
Equipment: A345

Yoohoo!!! :banana: :carrot:

The return flight via SQ21 takes off in just over 4 hours later at 23:00 hours, Newark time, and will arrive at 05:35 hours, 30th June, Singapore Time. Seeya later! :D

The flight from Newark to Singapore has commenced!!!!!!!:D

http://www.panynj.gov/aviation/ewrframe.HTM

1145, 29 June(Singapore Time)
2345, 28 June (Newark Time)

Singapore Airlines flight number 21 (SQ21)

Departure (Newark time)
Airport: Newark, NJ
Scheduled Time: 2300, Jun 28 (Singapore time: 1100 , Jun 29)
Actual Time: 2330, Jun 28 (Singapore time: 1130, Jun 29)
Status:In air at an altitude of 3100 feet with a ground speed of 250KTS
Equipment: A345

Arrival (Singapore Time)
Airport:SIN
Scheduled Time:0535, Jun 30
Actual Time:0528, Jun 30 (Estimated)

A real time map
http://tracker.flightview.com/fvRLMSW41/FlightViewCGI.exe?qtype=gif&acid=SQ21&depap=EWR

Flight status at
1205, 29 June (singapore time)
0005, 29 June (Newark Time):
http://www.rlmsoftware.com/default.asp

Singapore Airlines
Flight Number 21 (SQ21)

Departure (Newark Time)
Airport: Newark, NJ
Scheduled Time: 2300, Jun 28
Actual Time: 2330, Jun 28

Arrival (Singapore Time)
Airport: SIN
Scheduled Time: 0535, Jun 30
Actual Time: 0451, Jun 30 (Est)

Status: In air
Altitude: 29000 feet
Ground Speed: 483 KTS
Equipment: A345

Business Times - 29 Jun 2004

Lunch in S'pore and dinner in New York, thanks to SIA
SIA, Emirates and Cathay now fly non-stop to NY

By GEORGE JOSEPH

(SINGAPORE) Asia's top three airlines have wasted no time in launching direct non-stop flights to a booming New York, rebounding after the nightmare of the 9/11 terrorist attacks and three years of recession.

As Wall Street rings up the corporate tills again, Singapore Airlines, Dubai's Emirates and Hong Kong's Cathay Pacific are taking advantage of the need for premium business and leisure travel into the Big Apple in the quickest way.

'New York City is the world's financial centre and premium business travellers don't want to waste any time stopping in between, if they can,' Emirates area manager in Singapore Stephen Chu said yesterday.

All three airlines are also eyeing the potential for premium US travellers to Asia's tourism markets, as well as the renewed interest in New York.

Singapore Airlines yesterday launched a non-stop service to Newark Airport in New Jersey, on the outskirts of New York, creating aviation history with the longest commercial flight.

The 18-hour flight on the 16,668 km route slashes about four hours from SIA's existing one-stop service and betters its own long-haul record in February - the first non-stop Singapore-Los Angeles flight which did the 14,700 km in 16 hours.

Emirates Air started a daily 14-hour non-stop service between Dubai and New York on June 1 and Hong Kong's Cathay Pacific will join the fray on Thursday when it launches a Hong Kong-New York non-stop service.

A New York city spokesman said the Big Apple is seeing record numbers of travellers this year and the next. 'We have retained market share and remained the number one destination in the US for overseas visitors,' said Rhianna Roddy, vice-president for global tourism at NYC & Company.

The city has also launched several projects to enhance visitor experience and is building more luxury hotels as well as 'affordable' ones. And the Statue of Liberty, closed as a security precaution after 9/11, is about to be reopened with a more streamlined system to reduce long waiting lines.

SIA, Emirates and Cathay Pacific have all forecast enough traffic on direct New York routes to make services daily, in addition to existing one-stop services.

The three carriers had non-stop services to New York in mind from the late 1990s, but the 9/11 terrorist atrocity and the economic recession that followed put paid to those hopes. Also, no aircraft at the time could do long-haul flights from Asia to the US West Coast.

European aircraft maker Airbus moved in to fill this gap for an ultra long-range aircraft, which has now made the non-stop flights possible.

Airbus started delivering two long-range models - the A340-600 (A346) and the A340-500 (A345) - last year.

In February, SIA became the first airline to operate the A345, the longest-range commercial aircraft currently in service. It now has five A345s for dedicated use on Los Angeles and New York flights.

'The A340-500 combines outstanding passenger appeal, low operating costs and complete operating flexibility for ultra long range flights,' said Airbus communications director for Asia, Anthony Philips.

'Airbus proposed the A340-500/600 in 1997 to match the demands of innovative airlines who could foresee increasing passenger demand for ultra long range non-stop services as a major travel trend.

'With deliveries of the first A340-500s beginning in late 2003, both Singapore Airlines and Emirates have moved quickly to inaugurate new ultra long-range non-stop flights from their hubs at Changi and Dubai,' Mr Philips said.

SIA's flights leave Singapore at 12.05pm daily and arrive at Newark at 6.30pm local time the same day. The return flight leaves at 11pm Newark time and arrives in Singapore two days later at 5.35am.

Yesterday, the Civil Aviation Authority of Singapore celebrated the SIA inaugural flight by giving out 20,000 apples to travellers at Changi Airport.

Copyright © 2004 Singapore Press Holdings Ltd. All rights reserved.

Real cool isnt it, Stan? We could go to this page anytime and see the location of the plane real time in the map above!! :D

^
Absolutely cool...... :cool:

It will be even cooler when it's around 0530(singapore time).........:D

The NY-SIN flight had commenced?

^
Look at thread #221. :)

The NY-SIN flight had commenced?
Yeap...this flight will be going over the north pole, compared to the Newark-bound flight which dosent. :)

Here's another long flight about to start on July 2nd:

The new connection to Christchurch (commencing July 2nd) will be an extension of the upcoming Dubai-Melbourne non-stop service, which Emirates will operate with the ultra long-haul A340-500 aircraft. Initially flying three times a week, the service will double to six times weekly on 1 August.

This means that Emirates will offer a total of 27 flights a week to New Zealand by August. The airline presently flies to Auckland daily via Sydney, daily via Singapore and Brisbane, and daily via Singapore and Melbourne.

Emirates will use Melbourne as a hub for christchurch and Melbourne, Sydney and Brisbane for the Auckland connection to Dubai and beyond.

Hmm....I will be wondering how all these flights compare in terms of actual route length, rather then the great circle one, but the later can be used as a very rough guage for now?

This listing is an attempt to rank all non-stop flights currently being operated by at least one airline in terms of great-circle distances, but it is not exhaustive in the sense that I have not finished doing all the research yet.Flights in bold are currently in service.

• Singapore-New York City: 9534 miles (15343 km) (8285 nautical miles) via Singapore Airlines
• London-Perth: 8998 miles (14481 km) (7819 nautical miles) via Qantas, speculated route
• Auckland-New York City: 8819 miles (14192 km) (7663 nautical miles) via Emirates by mid-2005
• Singapore-Los Angeles: 8774 miles (14121 km) (7625 nautical miles) via Singapore Airlines
• Johannesburg-Atlanta: 8421 miles (13552 km) (7318 nautical miles) via South African Airways
• Cape Town-Atlanta: 8121 miles (13070 km) (7057 nautical miles) via South African Airways
• Hong Kong-New York City: 8098 miles (13033 km) (7037 nautical miles) via Continental, Cathay Pacific from 1st July
• Johannesburg-New York City: 7960 miles (12810 km) (6917 nautical miles) via South African Airways
• Melbourne-Los Angeles: 7918 miles (12743 km) (6881 nautical miles) via Qantas
• Hong Kong-Toronto: 7838 miles (12614 km) (6811 nautical miles) via Air Canada from 1st August
• Hong Kong-Chicago: 7822 miles (12589 km) (6798 nautical miles) via United Airlines
• Sydney-Los Angeles: 7487 miles (12049 km) (6506 nautical miles) via Qantas, United Airlines, Air Canada
• Dubai-Sydney: 7484 miles (12044 km) (6503 nautical miles) via Emirates
• Doha-Melbourne: 7447 miles (11984 km) (6471 nautical miles) via Qatar Airways from late 2004
• Dubai-Melbourne: 7249 miles (11666 km) (6299 nautical miles) via Emirates from 2nd July
• Hong Kong-Los Angeles: 7233 miles (11640 km) (6285 nautical miles) via Cathay Pacific
• New Delhi-Toronto: 7222 miles (11623 km) (6276 nautical miles) via Air Canada

If anyone know of a city pair currently served by at least one airline, and is longer then any in the list above (above 7000 miles), please to post them here, along with the airline(s) operating the sector plus the distance from this site:

http://www.indo.com/distance/

Just outa question hwo farwould sydney - Newyork be or Mel

Just outa question hwo farwould sydney - Newyork be or Mel
Melbourne-New York City: 10355 miles (16664 km) (8998 nautical miles)
Sydney-New York City: 9935 miles (15989 km) (8633 nautical miles)

Both will be longer then the current flights, but no airliner will be able to fly just yet without a real danger of the plane falling out of the sky prematurely! :D

JUNE 29, 2004
SIA pilots on S'pore-New York flight monitored for alertness
By Sandra Davie

SINGAPORE - Pilots flying the new non-stop Singapore to New York route are being monitored electronically to gauge their alertness during the 18.5-hour journey, aviation officials said on Tuesday.

Singapore Airlines pilots are hooked up to a hand-held computer, and also wear a special watch that monitors alertness levels during the new 16,670km long-haul flight, which was launched on Monday.

The Civil Aviation Authority of Singapore (CAAS) said in a statement: 'These ultra, long range flights are the longest, non-stop commercial flights in history. New rules are needed ... since the pilot's duty period extends beyond 18 hours.'

Current aviation regulations on flight time limitations - in Singapore and in most other countries - allow a pilot to be on duty for up to 18 hours, it said.

After each Singapore to New York flight, the pilots are also hooked up to a brain wave-measuring device to monitor the 'quality and quantity of rest', CAAS said.

Singapore Airlines now has four pilots on each long-haul flight as part of the CAAS' provisional rules. Two of those must be captains, the authority said.

A report on the pilot study is expected next year. -- AP

Copyright @ 2004 Singapore Press Holdings. All rights reserved.

Time is GMT + 8 hours
Posted: 28 June 2004 2320 hrs

SIA sets new world record with direct flight to New York

NEW YORK - Singapore Airlines (SIA) claimed a small spot in aviation history on Monday, when the first direct flight from the city state to New York arrived here, inaugurating the world's longest non-stop commercial service.

Flight SQ22 touched down at Newark Airport at 6:41pm local time (2241 GMT) having taken a little more than 18 hours to cover the distance of nearly 9,000 nautical miles (about 16,600 kilometres) over the North Pacific.

The new direct flight using an ultra long-haul Airbus A340-500 will save customers up to four hours in travel time compared with SIA's existing one-stop services to New York.

"It's an important milestone, not just for Singapore Airlines, but aviation in general," said SIA spokesman James Boyd. "It marks the advent of a whole new generation of aircraft that can connect pretty much any two points on the globe with one tank of fuel."

The A340-500 used for the service has only 181 seats in a two-class configuration, with 64 seats in business class, all equipped with "space beds" in a "2-2-2" seat configuration.

The rest is devoted to Executive Economy Class, with 117 seats in a "2-3-2" configuration described as among the industry's widest at 20 inches (50.8 centimetres).

All seats are equipped with amenities such as laptop power supply outlets and an in-flight entertainment system offering over 400 entertainment options including 60 movie choices for the long journey.

The flights also feature "passenger corners" in both Business and Executive Economy cabins offering passengers some space to stretch out or socialize.

"I watched a lot of movies and ate a lot," said passenger Teo Lay Cheng, a frequent traveller on the Singapore-New York route. "It's still a long flight but the absence of a refuelling stopover is obviously a bonus."

The inaugural flight was full with a fair number of paying passengers joining the SIA executives and invited Asian journalists on board, at a cost of 9,160 Singapore dollars (5,388 US) for Raffles Class and 2,050 dollars for Executive Economy.

SIA placed an order for 10 A340-500s in 1998 - five on firm order and five on option - worth 2.2 billion US dollars, including spares and spare engines.

The Singapore carrier has also ordered 10 Airbus A380 "super jumbo" aircraft, which will be the world's biggest civilian airliner with a passenger capacity of 550, for its long-haul routes to the United States and Europe.

Last month, SIA reported a net profit of 849.3 million dollars for the year to March after a turbulent 12 months in which the Severe Acute Respiratory Syndrome (SARS) epidemic sharply undercut travel in the Asia-Pacific region. - AFP

Copyright © 2004 MCN International Pte Ltd

but there are two way around hte globe whats the diff for each ?

About 4 hours to go b4 SQ21 reach Singapore........:D

Singapore Airlines
Flight Number 21 (SQ21)

Departure
Airport: Newark, NJ
Scheduled Time: 11:00 PM, Jun 28
Actual Time: 11:30 PM, Jun 28

Arrival
Airport: SIN
Scheduled Time: 5:35 AM, Jun 30
Actual Time: 5:32 AM, Jun 30 (Est)
Status: In air
Altitude: 35000 feet
Ground Speed: 468 KTS
Equipment: A345

Scheduled Time: 05:35
Airline: http://webadmin.caas.gov.sg/FIS/images/airlines/SQ.gif
Flight: SQ21
From: Newark
Terminal: 2
Belt: 33
Status: Confirmed 05:16 http://webadmin.caas.gov.sg/FIS/images/flashFis.jpg

SQ21 from Newark has landed in Singapore!!!!!!! :banana: :banana: :D

Airline:http://webadmin.caas.gov.sg/FIS/images/airlines/SQ.gif

Flight:SQ21
From:Newark
Terminal: 2
Belt: 33
Scheduled Time:05:35
Status: Landed 05:20

:cheers: to the completion of the world's longest polar as well as non-polar flights!! :banana: :carrot:

:banana:

JUNE 30, 2004
SIA non-stop to NY - it didn't feel like 18hrs
New service a hit as it saves four hours flying time and provides luxury of space with only 64 seats in business class and 117 in executive economy. SANDRA DAVIE was on the first flight

INDONESIAN Slamet Rahardjo is an aviation buff, so he was on a Singapore Airlines flight on Monday to make history again.

Mr Slamet, who is in his 40s, was among 181 passengers who flew 18 hours non-stop on SQ22, from Singapore to New York on SIA's record-setting Airbus plane.

http://straitstimes.asia1.com.sg/mnt/media/image/launched/2004-06-30/h7a.jpg
Water cannons salute the arrival of SIA's inaugural non-stop flight to New York at Newark Liberty International Airport on Monday. -- AP

Just five months ago, on Feb 3, he was on another pioneer flight: SIA's 16-hour, non-stop flight from Singapore to Los Angeles.

In fact, he was so keen to be in all the SIA 'firsts' that when he arrived in New York at 6.40am on Monday, he turned and headed right back to Singapore the same day on SQ21.

'I don't want to miss out and want to be on the first flight out of New York as well,' said the chief financial officer of a media company.

The plane took off at 11pm, New York time, and flew over the North Pole to reach Singapore.

Mr Slamet paid $9,160 for the return business-class ticket. For now, SIA is charging the same fare as on its existing flight with a stopover in Europe but, eventually, passengers will pay 5 to 10 per cent more when flying on the new A340-500.

http://straitstimes.asia1.com.sg/mnt/media/image/launched/2004-06-30/h7b.jpg
Mr Slamet Rahardjo was among 181 passengers on the flight.

However, business travellers especially are happy to pay the premium, saying the four hours of flying they save are worth it.

Australian businessman Stephen Alfrich, 51, who was flying to a medical conference in Bermuda, via New York, said: 'Every hour saved is time for myself.

'In fact, because of this direct flight, I can take some time off in New York.'

The usual SIA flight to New York takes 22 hours.

Previously, there was one stopover in either Amsterdam or Frankfurt. With the new service, some flights will be non-stop, while some will still stop over in Frankfurt.

Also, SIA will fly 14 times a week to New York, up from 11.

Mr Alfrich was full of praise for the flight's plush SpaceBeds, business-class seats that become flat, 66cm-wide beds.

In the executive economy class, passengers were pleasantly surprised at how easy it was to 'bear' the long flight.

Madam Ingrid The, 50, a Singapore permanent resident en route to visit her sister in New York, found no need to use her special socks that help prevent deep vein thrombosis.

'I should have known, this is SIA - they do everything first-class, even in economy,' said the accountant with a smile.

She paid $2,050 for her executive economy seat.

Airbus had designed the plane for 313 passengers in a three-class configuration. However, SIA reduced it to only 181 seats - 64 business class and 117 executive economy.

With fewer seats, those in executive economy, seated seven abreast instead of the usual eight, have 12.5cm more leg room and can lean back an extra 5cm. This is a feature also found on the non-stop flight to Los Angeles.

Another extra that won praise is the 'gathering' space in the back of the plane along the windows.

A bar-like counter to hold drinks allows up to six passengers to stand and talk while snacking on fruit, chocolates and buns.

American businessman Mokhtar Noureddin, who flies regularly between New York and various cities in Asia, was there often to stretch his legs.

'I'm comfortable enough,' he said. 'Just a little bored because I don't like watching movies.'

However, the movies, including some current releases such as Hellboy and Taking Lives, and the fish in clam sauce dinner were enough to keep most passengers occupied.

Mr Leonard Lee, 27, who won a free trip for himself and his girlfriend, Miss Yvonne Lai, 27, for being able to say 'Singapore to New York non-stop' and drag out 'stop' for as long as possible, said he didn't even feel the 18 hours pass.

Said Mr Lee, who works in the IT industry: 'We watched the movies, ate good food, slept a little and before you know it, we were landing in the Big Apple.'

Copyright @ 2004 Singapore Press Holdings. All rights reserved.

Really thats not very many people at all to make it worth while

seems that most people on that flight are Indonesian :lol:

cheers

Really thats not very many people at all to make it worth while
You referring to? :?

seems that most people on that flight are Indonesian :lol:

cheers
Yeah...and they must be really loaded, eh? That Mr Slamet could splurge thousands just for this....a true blue hard core aviation fan indeed!! :applause:

As a matter of fact, there are many Indonesian that die-hard SIA fan :D

cheers

what a silly man... i would at least have gotten some krispy kremes...

Melbourne-New York City: 10355 miles (16664 km) (8998 nautical miles)
Sydney-New York City: 9935 miles (15989 km) (8633 nautical miles)

Both will be longer then the current flights, but no airliner will be able to fly just yet without a real danger of the plane falling out of the sky prematurely! :D

hehe

Really thats not very many people at all to make it worth while

they are charging higher premium fares i guess.

that guy who flew to NY and then boarded the next plane back - :dizzy:

must be the inflight entertainment

not sure I would be some one to do that jsut to be on the first flight
oh well