old thread>
http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=188273&page=21

Walked past the Datokta building today, they have started to errect some hordings at street level, so I would imagine something is about to happen.

^just checked out our internal DA register. An application was put in last week for demolition of existing 8storey Phllip court bldg which will take 10 weeks. yes looks like this one is a go-er. another "boutique" style unit block.
good stuff

Cul? Would they be just demolishing the old building and leaving the hole?, or are they definetly building something and is it Datokta that they are building?

Council policy now insists that you cannot demolish an exisiting premises unless you are certain of instant redvelopment. this was brought on by sartor years ago beacuse of the unsightly holes (20) around the CBD. which are not only ugly but dangerous.

^just checked out our internal DA register. An application was put in last week for demolition of existing 8storey Phllip court bldg which will take 10 weeks. yes looks like this one is a go-er. another "boutique" style unit block.
good stuff

yeah but euro tower was marketed as a boutique style unit block
and look what we got

i dont think we will see another Euro tower. Dakota will be an upmarket unit tower. can only imagine prices$$

I think they are selling it 2.5 million dollar and upwards. I have seen the video footage with conceiage at lobby. One unit per floor. No balcony except penthouse.

and at lounge are these drop down plasma screens from ceiling and everything is crestron electronic touchscreen automated. You get out of lift and you see your kitchen and lounge. No unit door. The only door is the lift door.

The parking is fancy too. You go drive to the parking entrance and park your car in a cage. Then this cage swivels around and is packaged like a fork lift placing goods on a giant steel shelf at a warehouse.

^^ Kinda like the VW factories in Dresden and other places in Germany.

http://pwp.netcabo.pt/ssmnp/vw_autostadt_silo_400.jpg

http://pwp.netcabo.pt/ssmnp/autostadt.jpg

Imagine if they build those type of parking in city! Skyscraper that is actually a parking lot.

Finance
Empty feeling for Sydney CBD office market
Paddy Manning, Office
MATP
1029 words
3 August 2006
The Australian
1 - All-round Country
25
English
Copyright 2006 News Ltd. All Rights Reserved

AS the NSW economy drifts, Sydney remains Australia's worst-performing CBD office market, with vacancy rates stuck at a stubbornly high level despite strong demand elsewhere in the country.

Australia's overall CBD office vacancy rate fell by 0.6 per cent to 6.9 per cent in the six months to July, led by markets such as Brisbane which has recorded its lowest-ever vacancy rate of just 2.3 per cent.

Sydney had the largest CBD office market in the country, with 4.8 million square metres, but the vacancy rate was the highest of any CBD at 9.4 per cent -- just 0.3 per cent lower than it was in January.

An expected mini-boom in Sydney's office market has failed to materialise, as tenants are increasingly opting for non-core CBD or suburban locations.

Andrew Balzanelli, regional director Sydney leasing for Jones Lang LaSalle, said the city's vacant offices were spread throughout the market.

He said that while there had been some headline-grabbing deals for big licks of space in the past six months -- including Suncorp at 259 George Street, Babcock & Brown at Chifley Tower and Deacons at Grosvenor Place -- there was still plenty of space about.

"A medium-sized tenancy from 800-2000sqm has enormous choice within the city," Mr Balzanelli said.

He said Sydney office tenants remained upbeat.

"People are still looking at top-line revenue growth instead of cost-cutting," he said.

Mr Balzanelli said that although developers were dusting off plans for new Sydney office towers, there would be no boom.

"Will we see a supply boom? No, I think people are too savvy."

Including the new Walsh Bay precinct in the city's western corridor, a total of 112,170sqm of new office space was brought into the market in the first half of 2006.

Only 77,530sqm of that space was taken up by tenants but another 37,523sqm of older space was withdrawn from the market for refurbishment or change of use, creating the slight drop in vacancy.

Another 24,960sqm of office supply was expected in the Sydney CBD by the end of this year, principally comprising the Village Cinema site and refurbishments at Grosvenor Place and 50 Bridge Street.

"While this space does not have tenants pre-committed, business tenants should easily absorb this space," said the Property Council's NSW president Mark Gray. Mr Gray is NSW chief of developer Leighton Properties, which has yet to secure tenants for its $150 million, 20,500sqm office development at 100 Pacific Highway, North Sydney, which is almost complete.

In 2007, another 120,233sqm come on line -- almost half of which is pre-committed. Key projects include Multiplex's King Street Wharf and World Square sites, and the refurbishment of 259 George Street.

There are another 394,222 sqm of uncommitted or planned projects slated for completion in 2008 and beyond, including the 73,350sqm office component of Westfield's massive Pitt Street Mall redevelopment.

One industry source said future supply to the Sydney market was "nowhere near the level that's been delivered in the last 4-5 years. Assuming the rate of net absorption can remain at current levels, you imagine Sydney is poised to deliver good growth."

In the tight 1.7 million sq m Brisbane market, the Property Council's Queensland executive director Robert Walker said record-low vacancy rates would be mitigated by projects already under way -- including ABN Amro's Brisbane Square and Citimark's 179 North Quay.

A wave of speculative development is tipped for the Brisbane market, led by Austcorp's 80-storey Vision Tower in Mary Street, which has an uncommitted 27,000sqm office component.

"What we won't see is a big jump in vacancy rates, meaning the market may well be just about to burst," Mr Walker said.

"Growth in white-collar employment will ensure the commercial market remains tight."

The lowest office vacancy was in Canberra, at just 2.1 per cent -- the same as six months ago -- but the city faces a mountain of supply with a total of 215,000 sqm to be added to the 1.6 million sqm market next year.

Overall, Australian CBD and non-CBD office markets broke the 20 million sq m barrier for the first time.

Melbourne defies dire vacancy fears

CBDs

MELBOURNE'S office market has defied earlier dire predictions to become the stand-out success of the year with a massive 173,530sqm of office space taken up.

The city's CBD vacancy rate dropped 0.8 per cent to 7.5 per cent in the six months to July.

Investa Property Group executive Michael Cook said the 3.6 million sqm Melbourne market, which used to be called a "basket case" amid predictions that office vacancy would reach 14 per cent, was one of the most resilient in the world. "You knock Melbourne down, it comes back up again."

Mr Cook said Melbourne had become the superannuation and funds management heart of Australia and Investa had benefited from being "overweight" in the city.

Tenants such as Citibank and BlueScope Steel had grown their occupancies by 40 per cent, he said.

"Sydney's the market that's got the hiccup at the moment," Mr Cook said.

Doug Cleine, director office leasing for Colliers International in Melbourne, said the Property Council figures were slightly distorted by "big, lumpy take-ups" because the leasing of office space in a new development was not recorded until a project was finished, even though the leasing deals had been done prior to and during construction.

Buildings finished in the first half of the year included Australian Super Developments's 8 Exhibition Street, Multiplex's Southern Cross tower and ISPT's Urban Workshop.

But Mr Cleine said backfill space vacated by UBS and Ernst & Young, who moved into 8 Exhibition Street, had already been leased, indicating real demand for offices.

"There is finally real growth in the office worker population," Mr Cleine said.

Sydney's CBD office market is just so big, 1.2m sqm bigger than Melb....Surely this is just a correction from the 1990s....

That is not surprising. The vacancy rate has traditionally been just under the 10% mark for years.

CULWULLA has said many times and other articles hint of any new major office constructions not beginning until 2007 in Sydney's CBD. Meanwhile only scoobies are happening around town, surely with the largest being ATO @ World Square and theskyvue @ the old Nock & Kirby's site on George St, coming onto the market in 2008.

Well heres a rundown of large office buildings completed in sydney per decade since the 80s, quickly took it down going by the timeline diagram on skyscraperpage.com

I'm not too sure if adding such smaller projects as the ATO @ WS, various offices near King St Wharf such as AMEX, and various offices throughout the cbd, would in combination consitute 1 or 2 large office buildings.

Going by these trends, it would not be entirely unreasonable to see some of the new projects start and be complete before the end of the decade. On the other hand, all of them going ahead would mean a high concentration of developments in a mere 3-4 years, which would be unreasonable going by trends.

I just feel as though the world has changed since the 90's and that going by past trends may no longer be too reliable

Just some info for us to think about...

2000-2009 (7 or 14*)
*John Boyd Tower
*33 Bligh St
*Mid City Centre
*Westfields redevelopment
*1-9 Bligh St
*Goodsell Tower redevelopment
*EDH towers
Deutsche Bank Place
Civic Tower
Ernst & Young Centre
Aurora Place
Westpac Place
Citigroup Centre
Angel Place

1990-1999 (15)
Macquarie Bank @ Martin Place
Spherion Tower
KPMG Centre
BT Tower
Defence Plaza
Bank of America
Chifley Tower
1 O'Connell Place
Darling Park 1
Darling Park 2
363 George St
400 George St
Governor Macquarie Tower
Governor Phillip Tower
Sydney Central

1980-1989 (11)
Capita Centre
Gateway Plaza
National Australia Bank
Grosvenor Place
Telstra Plaza
AON Tower
HSBC Centre
State Bank Centre
AAPT Centre
AMEX Building
Met Centre

Please correct me if im wrong cul

looks good garg.
just on new office towers. definates for 2007 start are Westfield tower and 1-9 bligh st.Mirvac are keen for Goodsell redvelopment but atm have this heritage issue hanging around. once thats sorted they want to commence 2007/8.
Commonwealth bank are after 65,000sqm in CBD and may go after approved JB tower.
ANZ are after 25,000sqm which is what 33 Bligh is.
Mid city is after a tennant.
And as for EDH, well starts 2007 and being state gov, the DA's will come in quick and fast and start up pretty much staright away.
plus theres others we dont know about yet. Sydney's next cycle will definately start 2007 with many coming on line in 2010.

Excellent list gargarensis, It shows what a great time the 90s were for office tower development in Sydney. However that kind of grow could never be sustainable decade on decade forever. There just aren't enough space to keep building towers, all more likely there just aren't enough sites without height restrictions, not without combining smaller buildings into big plots begin enough for towers. This can be tricky to do or not cost efficient.

Also as you say there have been a lot of smaller office developments which have created extra capacity in the market.

As Cul says when EDH comes online there will be a few more towers to take into account, although I personally don't know if they'll be completed by the end of the decade.

Also did the 80s and 90s see the same numbers of Residential towers in the city. If these are added to the number of Office Towers I'm sure the 00's haven't been too bad.

well its all too obvious that up until recently we've experienced a boom in residential development, and while it may not have a direct impact on demand/supply of office property, it does impact on the availability of possible development sites, just as lord bertrum commented

ultimately the development of 'satellite cities', which we have already begun to witness, may spell the downfall of large-scale development in the cbd. Sydney, particularly considering the haphazard state of its transport system and the sprawling distribution of the workforce, may not be able to support a larger centralized cbd - hence, the viability of satellite cities.

when sartor brought in his "living city" concept in 1994 in welcomed highrise resi to the CBD. the population of actual residents of CBd went from 2000 to 35,000 as of last year!!
yes some of the satellite cities will grow but i dont think they will take the big companys away from CBD. Ive talked to planners and they said nothing beats the CBD. this is why Green sq is taking its time to start. no one wants to build there office out there! they dont want a 20storey height limit. they want to build there 50storey in CBD.
Unfortunately from now on, any new tower for Sydney means demolition of 2 or 3 or even more skyscrapers. aka -1-9 bligh st project of Goodsell site.
theres only 1 site left in sydney with nothing on it and thats the bus depot across from belmore park. Its awaiting start for a 15storey resi bldg.
i just think you shouldnt lose hope in sydney;s future.

my personal preference for the future of the sydney cbd has me sitting on your side of the fence, cul

the cbd has come along well in the past 20 years, and im sure that in the next 20 ill still be around to see something the likes of gpt, chifley, aurora, or db, coming along again

Also to note that Norwest doesnt appear to be going as well as they hoped. Woolworths in particular are losing more staff than anticipated, Woolies projection of staff loss was about 5%, however HR insiders have told me that it is approaching 25-30% turnover purely due to lack of transport and facilities. Most of these people were working in the CBD, to only be moved way way out west where there are no trains and the bus service terrible given Woolies pay for the private busses but they operate at inconvenient times. Their staff do no want to drive to work given the price of petrol, time spent in their cars, traffic jams and impact on lifestyles. Even those who live in the area say it is harder to get to unless you drive.

This just proves why the CBD will remain king. Personally I would need to be paid at $10,000 a year extra to do the same job and work out of the CBD than work in the CBD. Thats a monetry value to how much I feel that would impact my standard of living. There's an awful lot of people who feel the same way.

I wouldn't be surprised if at a later point Woolies just create their own shuttle service from Norwest to the nearest Train station. It happens with alot of firms based on the periphery of London.

This just proves why the CBD will remain king. Personally I would need to be paid at $10,000 a year extra to do the same job and work out of the CBD than work in the CBD. Thats a monetry value to how much I feel that would impact my standard of living. There's an awful lot of people who feel the same way.

I wouldn't be surprised if at a later point Woolies just create their own shuttle service from Norwest to the nearest Train station. It happens with alot of firms based on the periphery of London.

Well the person who works there at the moment, who is now leaving, calculated what it costs her, admitedly she is coming from Bondi Junction, but with her hourly rate, plus petrol, car maintainence etc, is costing her $32,000 per annum, just in travel!!!

Woolies already have their own shuttle service from Parramatta, Seven Hills and one other station I forget, but their times are from 5.30am to 8.15am, so if you start work later or get caught up on a train and come in late due to personal reasons you would have to drive in, and then coming home the first shuttle bus starts at 5.30pm, what if you need to leave earlier than that? What if you get sick? You're stuck there unless you get a lift or a taxi.
Needless to say staff are not happy.
And how rude is this they have a Woolworths supermarket there which is more expensive that other stores, even with the miserbale 5% staff discount it is more expensive. Plus they do not supply any cups, glasses, cutlery, crockery etc so you have to use the cafes and restaurants there, unless of course you bring all this from home, which now many do.

Well the person who works there at the moment, who is now leaving, calculated what it costs her, admitedly she is coming from Bondi Junction, but with her hourly rate, plus petrol, car maintainence etc, is costing her $32,000 per annum, just in travel!!!

did she work at Town Hall or at Yennora (or Parramatta) before the move to Norwest? I suppose the location there would be difficult for ancillary staff, whereas the majority of the salaried employees have company cars and so their loss is only non-economic (time, quality of life etc)

Also to note that Norwest doesnt appear to be going as well as they hoped. Woolworths in particular are losing more staff than anticipated, Woolies projection of staff loss was about 5%, however HR insiders have told me that it is approaching 25-30% turnover purely due to lack of transport and facilities. Most of these people were working in the CBD, to only be moved way way out west where there are no trains and the bus service terrible given Woolies pay for the private busses but they operate at inconvenient times. Their staff do no want to drive to work given the price of petrol, time spent in their cars, traffic jams and impact on lifestyles. Even those who live in the area say it is harder to get to unless you drive.

Need to remember that 95% of Woolies HO staff ALREADY worked "out west" before moving to Norwest.
The Strathfield office had about 100 people, Homebush had about 100 people, Yennora had about 800 people ( no rail and crap bus service ), Baulkham Hills ( BIG W) had about 100 people and Parra had about 50 people.
The George St office was just for Roger Corbett, the legal department and a few others- no more than 50 people there. They've all moved west now.
Can completely understand why traffic in the Norwest area would be pissing staff off though !
Woolies staff knew about the move to Norwest 7 or 8 years ago so fortunately much of the sorrounding area is already VERY well populated by Woolies people.
The new CEO Mike Luscombe is a Narabeen boy so he has a fair commute !!

The George St office was just for Roger Corbett, the legal department and a few others- no more than 50 people there.

That's patently untrue. Not only was Corporate HQ at Town Hall but so was most of Corporate/Supermarket Finance. Most of the space they occupied prior to moving to Yennora was reoccupied by the time of Norwest

Woolies staff knew about the move to Norwest 7 or 8 years ago so fortunately much of the sorrounding area is already VERY well populated by Woolies people.

I don't think that's true either. There was certainly talk about it - before the M2 was open in fact - but nothing was really confirmed until the deal was done. Homebush was seriously considered as an alternative, for example.

I worked at both Town Hall and Strathfield offices and both were against the move. Even though a number of staff lived in western sydney, to get to the city or strathfield was easy on the trains, and now they have no choice but to drive or bus, and taking the bus is time consuming and harder given you usually have to change buses.
This new HQ has been around since the early 90's I hear, however it took ages for it to come to reality so many staff thought it a pipe dream, however when it was officially announced it really went up fast and staff were literally swept off their feet. I think it took about 2 years all in all, but staff were still thinking it would not happen, and it took little over a year to build, sooner because Strathfield and town hall leases were up (so I hear).
Staff never had an input into Norwest which I think led to a lot of resentment and hatred towards Roger Corbett who was all about profit and not staff, and I have to say he was an old fashioned idiot. Woolies were seen as a good employer many moons ago, and sadly I think that has been lost :o(
Needless to say I left the month before the move to Norwest, no way in hell I was doing that travelling!

anyone been to sydneys minus 5 bar yet?
be nice on hot day
from flickr
http://static.flickr.com/103/284898172_a603b72e1d.jpg?v=0

http://static.flickr.com/106/284898287_67f3a71610.jpg?v=0

http://static.flickr.com/104/284898396_cd17bcd8bb.jpg?v=0

^^ No. I wanted to go last time i was up, but ran out of time. One just opened in Melbourne. They're an interesting concept.

you wouldnt really need one for melb? lol
hey what about my idea. Dubai+ 55 bar. Have it like a sauna and you sit there sweating it out ? with bikini clad chicks walking around with cold beers?
:cheers: :banana:

^^ Melbourne's cold...how original. What about a nudist bar? That would really be interesting.

This might be old news to some, but it was new to me... St Vincent's Hospital have applied to have the Caritas site in Darlinghurst (bounded by Bourke, Burton and Forbes Streets) considered a site of state significance; they want to build up to 131 residential units in buildings of 4, 7 and 11 storeys. It's right at the top of the hill, so should get pretty good views. The proposal also includes rebuilding one of the hospital buildings, but it will be the same height as the existing building (28m), so not much interest there.

See http://exwwwsvh.stvincents.com.au/RedevelopmentProjects/StateSignificance/ and http://www.planning.nsw.gov.au/asp/major_projects.asp.

The FBI has set up an office in Australia.
It opened yesterday in MLC centre ,sydney.
Special agent Thomas Fuentes, whi will run the office managers 75 FBI offices worldwide.

The long reach of American Law.

How bizarre. Oh well more office space taken up which is always good :o)

Now MLC is more of a target. I wonder if this adversely affects rentals? anyone know? With the American Consulate and now the FBI offices located in this tower does it affect any rentals around the floors they are located or indeed the entire office block? I know some people from NSW State and Regional Development that were concerned about moving from Grosvenor Tower to MLC but it was less to do with proximity to the USA consulate and more about harbour views.

cul

you have mentioned before that the council is looking at changing the FSRs in the CBD. This will no doubt dramatically affect the style and bulk of designs of the very few spaces left in the city.

If it passes, it will be a huge change for the city. Would this rule out any change of the Height Limit or any other 'positive' changes for another decade or so?

^im not sure. the Property Council are the ones to put this forward to council. It should give a taller bldg for a site which would normally wouldnt be as tall. I dont think it would effect 235m height controls.

Cul, have you heard anything about a new office block development on Mount Street, North Sydney? ten storeys I think.

is Sydney the most visited city in Australasia?

http://skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=412027

Cul, what is that acrylic cityone-like model next to Deutsch Bank Tower? I saw it in the model room this afternoon.

I assume the clear acrylic section related to some envelope.

I haven't seen it, but my guess would be the Goodsell Tower proposal.

that will teach you av for not paying attention in class.
yes its the goodsell site envelope
see here>
http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?p=10215766#post10215766

I recently read that the toilets at the Chifley Tower's level 41 restaurant have views over the harbour just like the Softiel toilets in Melbourne. The Views are spectular. You can take a leak and admire the harbour at the same time. How good is that!!!!!

Also there is talk of a bistro opening up on the same level as well to provide more affordable dining options.

They do .. and the male toilets wash basins have a quarter junction view. So you not only get a view south through all the towers, but you get a view out east and out to the ocean :P IMHO better views then Softiel

While damn expensive, the 7 course meals are excellent. Worth a try at least once in your life, for the food and the views for a special occasion.

yes lev41 restaurant is awesome. toilet view south>
lev41 is approx 185m (RL210m) , sofitel =135m.
http://static.flickr.com/43/124591651_8a4b7c0bb4_o.jpg

view east
http://static.flickr.com/44/124593279_ace7938d09_b.jpg

the Heads
http://static.flickr.com/52/124593278_4cda59ed42_o.jpg

view north
soh
http://static.flickr.com/48/124593277_9e677b26b2_o.jpg

Hobbyco have opened another store at the Rhodes Shopping Centre for hobby enthuaists.

Also Dymocks in the City have the book "Sydney's Century" by Peter Spearitt which descibes the urban development of the city in the 20th century. He also discusses highrise development as well.

Not sure where to post this - so please move to the appropriate thread.

The construction of the new power substation across the road from Amex and KENS is now entering it's next phase - as today I saw the crane being assembled onto it's tower.

It's in the projects under 10 levels thread.

*headmaster voice* Young gazmo! You just have to visit the site more often and pay attention in class. Take this note home for your parents to sign.

Consider myself sufficiently reprimanded.

I confess I don't post as often as I once did, and now only read the "big" project threads now. Under 10 stories I ignore *blush*

Apple store for Sydney ....

http://www.smh.com.au/news/biztech/the-winner-is-sydney/2007/02/07/1170524145606.html

im pretty sure the Apple store in sydney is going on bottom floor of 77 King st which is currently being refurbed

Pretty much what the article has said. I was hoping we would get something iconic like the NYC store, but I don't so, but still it would look really kewl to see the refurbished building with a massive apple on the front :o)

It'll be all high-tech and gee-golly-gosh, but I doubt we'll be seeing 10m glass cubes nor tube-like elevators. If they stick it in 77 King's refurb, they won't have the height to play around with as it's ceilings are relatively low, although the ground floor is reasonable. Having said, we may be pleasantly surprised with the fit-out.

As I'm too lazy to go trolling back through the long ago posts, I'll post this here:
City Quarter at Camperdown: 2-50 Pyrmont Bridge Road (cnr Booth Street) has apparently been approved. Designed by Fender Katsalidis, it will consist of 3 connected buildings stepping down the Booth Street hill, 16, 12 & 12 storeys (RLs 69.8, 58.8 & 51.5 respectively), containing 421 1 & 2 bedroom apartments. This project has been on the cards for years but seems finally, to have gained the OK.
Cul: you might move this to its own thread if you think it worth it. Thanks.

we had a city quarter thread. must of dropped off last page.

we had a city quarter thread. must of dropped off last page.No, here it is:

UC: City Quarter residential complex (Camperdown) (http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=359790&highlight=Sterling)

yes lev41 restaurant is awesome. toilet view south>
lev41 is approx 185m (RL210m) , sofitel =135m.
http://static.flickr.com/43/124591651_8a4b7c0bb4_o.jpg

view east
http://static.flickr.com/44/124593279_ace7938d09_b.jpg

the Heads
http://static.flickr.com/52/124593278_4cda59ed42_o.jpg

view north
soh
http://static.flickr.com/48/124593277_9e677b26b2_o.jpg


I've pissed in those dunnies stacks of times! LOL

Nice shots cull.

js

a little goss... shhhhh
you didnt hear it from me.
plans are underway to build a "large landmark" office tower opposite Town Hall on block with Energy Australia and Rialto-the only bldgs that will be staying.
not sure about when woolies and those small pubs will go to turn into the new city square. but its gonna look awesome.
ill post more when i get more info.

Good to hear Culwulla. Let's hope it is really glassy and has curves. :P

Eh? There are plans to build a large office tower on the site of the future city square? Will they build it on wheels so it can be moved when the council decides they need the square? Rialto and Energy Australia sites both have 235m height limits, but, as you say, they're not going anywhere.

Read it again: the central part of the block between Rialto/SCC and the planned city square.
Hypothetically, how tall/big could such a building be given the site area and the height limit on that area? Just to tantalize us.

^maybe 200m? it will have to be set back from George st more so then Pitt st and also address the future city square to its north.Its south face will have to look at Rialtos balconies. just thinking out loud with a design from my head, i think a tower with a rectangular floor plate and stepped roof would suit the site.
aka-Rockefeller centre or Index-Dubai.big plaza area at street level. will be such a sought after address. maybe numero uno?
1. direct link to Town hall station.
2. george street adress
3. across from town hall precinct
4. adjacent to new city square.
5. 235m height limit zone?

in this pic you can see the site.
the bldgs that require removal are the 2x15storey bldgs on pitts st and 10storey next to Rialto.Also katies and 5storey on gerge st next to Energy oz podium.

http://static.flickr.com/118/316148664_0d31eaf3b7_b.jpg

Oooh something over 180m should fill the gap directly next to Citigroup nicely.

Also, is this roughly where the planned underground station (Park St) for the new RCRL is due to go in? Maybe they could kill two birds with one stone...

Oooh something over 180m should fill the gap directly next to Citigroup nicely.

Also, is this roughly where the planned underground station (Park St) for the new RCRL is due to go in? Maybe they could kill two birds with one stone...Also near the approved 188m 163 Castlereagh Street (http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=382255)

From The Sydney Yawning Herald, 9/06/2005 - If or when it goes ahead, it won't be operational until somewhere between 2017-2020:

http://www.skyscrapercity.com/photopost/data/509/379sydneycbdrailplan2.JPG

Eh? There are plans to build a large office tower on the site of the future city square? Will they build it on wheels so it can be moved when the council decides they need the square? Rialto and Energy Australia sites both have 235m height limits, but, as you say, they're not going anywhere.

I like the Energy Australia building, I don't want to see if go anywhere. I don't really think a square in this area is required, A large building with elevated podium could achieve a public area thats pergectly acceptable. I think a city square here could end up looking really tragic, it;s very dependent on the landscaping and the rendering I have seen for the square looked crappola, with gums and some stupid bushes. Id rather see lavish public art and something truely extreme and eye-catching.

I like the Energy Australia building, I don't want to see if go anywhere. I don't really think a square in this area is required, A large building with elevated podium could achieve a public area thats pergectly acceptable. I think a city square here could end up looking really tragic, it;s very dependent on the landscaping and the rendering I have seen for the square looked crappola, with gums and some stupid bushes. Id rather see lavish public art and something truely extreme and eye-catching.

the En Au building isn't my cup of tea, but it'd look good with a refurb. The podium's not too bad, though.

There are, however, worse buildings.. *cough*Telstra Exchange*cough*

Myer Burwood will be closing on March 23 and I got a letter mentioning of a history making sale when it closes.

Better get that wallet out and get ready to shop!!!!!:D

Mmmm they have Nautica there, the burwood lads wont be happy. I might have to put in an appearance see what's on the cheap. BTW what is replacing Myer, that's the only large shop that Mall has?????????????????????

Are they getting DJs instead?

did you guys read my posts? the Rialto and Energy aus blg stay put.
cammo- energy aus has had a refurb!! it was completely reclad back a few years back.
I think its a great spot for a tower with no podium and just ground level plaza facing the new city sq.

original scc bldg
http://image.sl.nsw.gov.au/gpo4/52/d4_52905.jpg

Yeah i did read your post i knew it stayed put, just reiterating that I liked it and wanted it to stay.

The council shouldn't have accepted the Rialto. It's much better to convert the whole block into a square than a half job.

I agree, imagine how much the price of an apartment in Rialto will increase by when the square is finally realised.

Mmmm they have Nautica there, the burwood lads wont be happy. I might have to put in an appearance see what's on the cheap. BTW what is replacing Myer, that's the only large shop that Mall has?????????????????????

Are they getting DJs instead?

Thats the bet!!!! DJ's are interested in leasing the space.

Also near the approved 188m 163 Castlereagh Street (http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=382255)

From The Sydney Yawning Herald, 9/06/2005 - If or when it goes ahead, it won't be operational until somewhere between 2017-2020:

http://www.skyscrapercity.com/photopost/data/509/379sydneycbdrailplan2.JPG

It might be a good idea to wait to do the square until the line is under construction (if indeed it does go ahead.

IMHO the square isn't needed. I think a significant setback would probably be enough. Even leaving what's there would work. The Woolies building just 'fits' there.

Hmm, I actually like how the tower looked before the refurb, though that look and the current podium would be a good match. It has about the right amount of height for the area. Or it may just be the camera angle playing tricks on me. Again, though, there are definitely worse buildings around. It's not an eyesore by any definition.

As for a square, it would need to be either over the top public art or a monument. Nothing else would fit.

...And that's why Meriton developed there...

I agree, imagine how much the price of an apartment in Rialto will increase by when the square is finally realised.

remember railto is serviced apartments. so price wont change much. but they wont get any views north any way due to the planned tower between rialto and new city sq. actually have lots of shadow and limited views.

the tragic row of bldgs along pitt st side
http://farm1.static.flickr.com/157/394845257_de8878fabe_b.jpg

the tragic row of bldgs along pitt st side


Hmm, I've seen worse. Could use some height, though, and I imagine that's what you were getting at.

i just mean the bldgs wont be missed. nothing outstanding at all.

what are the height limit for those?

Certainly the Fletchers fotographics store won't be missed.

http://i87.photobucket.com/albums/k160/papervagina/gbpp.gif

Here's the relevant section of the height limit map. Light blue is 55m, darker blue is 235m and the yellow is sun access plane to Hyde Park.

There won't be much room for a square if anything is built north of SCC/Energy Australia. How far south is the square actually supposed to go?

the square takes up woolies and the 4 properties east. the site for the tower is 70m wide to pitt st and depth of 78m to george st.

Hi,

I have a client at 12 Mount Street, and was surprised to see fresh North Sydney Council DA Notice signs for 16 Mount Street when I walked past there today.

The diagram of the building looks great - very unique triangular tower shape - like a <| on a podium...

There's got to be more information on this DA somewhere, but don't know where to look.

^^ Yeah, that has got to be resubmitted with perhaps slight design changes.

^^^ It was - 11 January 2007.... This DA is current!

16 Mount Street, North Sydney - Expiry Date 29/01/07
Demolish existing buildings and construct multi-level commercial building with basement parking, Urbis JHD Pty Ltd, DA 660/06

(from North Sydney Council website)

I have tracked down the DA documentation from the council's MasterView system - check this out!

http://masterview.northsydney.nsw.gov.au/Cache/0032D490.001.pdf

Apparently North Sydney council thinks it's too "rad' and the architects are thinking of resubmitting. It's likely the the protruding angle will become more subdued if North Sydney Council gives the word. If rebsumitted, it will hopefully be available in about 6 weeks time.

Thanks for finding the current gaz. I liked what I saw on the wall (& in the pdf) too.

Cooee: http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=74318

...

I like the design of this building, I hope that the architects don't change the design too much. It's a real shame things like this get knocked back.

Too "Rad" - what a shame! It's a great design, something that I'm certain our Melbourne peers would have accepted with open arms and yet it is frowned upon here.

I know it may cost a few bucks but could they make extended tube sections. Jack up the top of Sydney tower and then insert the new sections. attach new cables and then say its 450m tall. You would be able to see Circular Quay better and the present height limit could be increased for new city buildings.....and Sydney Tower would still be the tallest landmark.

Too "Rad" - what a shame! It's a great design, something that I'm certain our Melbourne peers would have accepted with open arms and yet it is frowned upon here.Too "Rad" is just my term for what North Sydney Concil basically said to the developers, and that they would like it to conform more to the boxiness of North Sydney in general - amazing but true.

Gee, what happened to The Mayor Department's idea of jazzing up North Sydney and making it competitive in the entertainment and retail areas? Having some differing styles of architecture about would certainly start to give the place some added atmosphere & make it visually more interesting and modern, even to those not into architecture as such.

Don't tell us that BeauMonde is the most daring we'll ever see!?

Funnily enough I agree with North sydney Council on this one, I think I'd rather it 'conform' too. I think there is room for something exciting but I dont think this is the site or the design. The tower could have gone a bit higher though.

I find the design of the tower quite conservative anyway. Give it a bend here or there, and it's ask is to tone it down?! lol Everything apart from the angles is just "modern standard office". At least the angles give it a definate silhouette. Give it subdued angles, it more than likely just becomes another part of Legoland. 100 Pacific Hwy has proved to steer in this ever-so-slightly divergence, & Innovation Place seems to be heading in a path of interest, albeit for slightly different reasons.

As far as the height, as long as it's a high quality piece, I never mind how tall or short it is.

....

I walked past the seven news centre yesterday, and I noticed what appeared to be the set of today tonight right next to the news desk. I'm pretty sure Today Tonight is now produced from Sydney :)

I had also noticed that while watching the show in recent weeks, that the set was slightly different to the Melbourne set and I was hearing background noise ie Ambulances that would not be picked up if produced from Melbourne.

The "made in Melbourne" tag can now be removed from its promos down south:D:D:D

^ Are you sure? Because when I worked on Macquarie street once in a while they would film Today Tonight with that other annoying bitch in Sydney.
Maybe it is permanent.

^^ Its permanent, now that Naomi has left. The picture and audio quality is noticably worse now too, I think this is due to the less than state-of-the-art studios 7 has in Sydney atm. (despite what they say about Martin Place, having seen the quality of programs from both the Docklands and Martin Place, the Docklands wins hands down. Much less ambient picture and sound noise and far far fewer techinical stuff ups and synch problems)

Channel 7 has been busily consolidating all its news and current affairs into Sydney.... The last nationally broadcast news bulletin in Australia not to be broadcast from Sydney was the 4.30pm 7 news. It moved to Sydney after Mike Amor decided he wanted to move back to Australia and needed a job.

For whats its worth the ratings suffered badly afterwards (Rebecca Maddern was a far more professional and polished anchor and the Melbourne newsroom presented more international, less myopic news segments than Sydney's) and is now helmed by Samantha Armitage.

Wowsim, have they removed the "Made in Melbourne" tag from their promos?

^ Are you sure? Because when I worked on Macquarie street once in a while they would film Today Tonight with that other annoying bitch in Sydney.
Maybe it is permanent.

It was just being produced in summer, when Naomi was away and Anna was filing in, but with Anna staying, why not keep her here.

^^ Yep... They also used to refer to it as "Melbourne's Today Tonight" in the voice overs. Now they say "Seven's Today Tonight".... oh dear =)

TV promos have also refered to TT as "Sydney's Today Tonight" as well to make the viewer think it's still local. I remember for much of 2005-06 we had Naomi with the Melbourne skyline, and late last year, we finally got the harbour bridge.

In Brisbane, I remember seeing previews during seven news and Naomi would go "After the news with Rod and Kay (In reference to presenters Rod Young and Kay McGrath)...." I never heard Naomi go "After the news with Ian..."

For those interested in Business Park developments, The Weekend Sydney Morning Herald is going to have a special feature on them, published for Saturday 24th March '07.

heres a scoop. we all know com bank are relocating 70,000sqm out to Homebush into a couple of lowrise bldgs but they always said they want a smaller HQ to remain sydney. well looks like they are going to build an office bldg on site of Sega world. approx 30,000sqm or size of mac bank at kings st wharf.

Well they should double it, keep all the staff there and we can get a new tower.

Last time we talked about Sega World & its demise on here, the thought was to have apartment buildings on the site. Now it is going to be a 30,000 sq m office groundie??

The good side: The traditional CBD expands in real terms a little further to the west yet again, like when Darling Park Tower 3 aka Rabobank was built & how Barangaroo Bay will do it on a much larger scale as well.

The bad side: We were hoping "Which Bank?" was going to take up space in the CBD in one of the newly planned towers, like John Boyd (which needs a sizeable pre-commitment).

BTW CULWULLA. What was the source of info?

i think com bank have chosen a perfect site for there city HQ. i think the bottom floor will be retail etc with multi levels above with offices. it will really put some life into that part of d harbour. not sure whne DA will be in but sometime this year.

OK, obviously it wasn't in the press then. Just you heard at work :okay:

...

Please don't let Comm Bank build a craptacular building like Westpac Place.

Will it be called Commie Place?

OK, obviously it wan't in the press then. Just you heard at work :okay:
yes muse.keeping ears close to railway tracks.amazing what you can hear.lol

the blue thing at darling harbor (sega world?) is the peak of the areas trash. if anything should be heritage listed its that. 100 years in the future they can look back and think.. what where they smoking.

http://www.cityofsydney.nsw.gov.au/Development/documents/LocalActionPlans/LocalActionbooklet.pdf

maybe of some interest to people.

I like the trash of the cone.

looks interesting, we'll see.

Easter Show starts next Thursday at Homebush - www.eastershow.com.au

Frank Sartor has been reappointed as planning minister. Should be good ***s for most of us. the big buildings should continue to flow with him at the helm and for CUB and Barangaroo, it should progress well.

I wish Frank Sator has the nerve to build super skyscrapers and override local council planning restrictions. Give the CASA the finger and crack the ground the next day.

I wish Frank Sator has the nerve to build super skyscrapers and override local council planning restrictions. Give the CASA the finger and crack the ground the next day.

Hahahahaha.... agree man! Seriously, we live in Sydney, you would think it would be like Dubai of the south - but evidently not! I wonder whats to behold in Bang-a-kangaroooooooooo (got that from a previous post, i like it)

What i'd rather see in Gina the mayor of North Sydney wack up some super monstrocity like the Burj Dubai and see how Sydney City Council feels. Either that or Whilloughy go hardcore in Chatswood .. giving the SCC the finger and the whole fist ... this would be so amusing. It's hard to say what would appear in postcards however.

Sometimes I would just like to knock up some mega hardcore 800m structure, and do lines of coke from the roof, toss cig butts on nimbys and stick it to Sydney City Council by dropping waterbombs printed with clover's face over on the edge.

'Here, have your city of town bikes and villages you mole. I will have my city in a building, see what this does to your hieght restrictions, sun-access plans and reflectivity codes!'

^^ just be careful your lines don't blow away up there in that ever constant wind! what a waste that would be.

What i'd rather see in Gina the mayor of North Sydney wack up some super monstrocity like the Burj Dubai and see how Sydney City Council feels. Either that or Whilloughy go hardcore in Chatswood .. giving the SCC the finger and the whole fist ... this would be so amusing. It's hard to say what would appear in postcards however.

Gina is a nimby :bash:

^^ I know, she is a gronky cow too, i want her out. All the lower north shore mayors suck crap. The mosman mole is a joy to behold too.

And add Willogouby Council to the list as well. They hate Chatswood having more skyscrapers :bash:

heres a scoop. we all know com bank are relocating 70,000sqm out to Homebush into a couple of lowrise bldgs but they always said they want a smaller HQ to remain sydney. well looks like they are going to build an office bldg on site of Sega world. approx 30,000sqm or size of mac bank at kings st wharf.The Commonwealth Bank is now looking for an extra 60,000 sq m in the Sydney CBD. It has now short-listed 3 buildings; Darling Park Tower 1 (IBM), the Westfield Tower and The Mid-City Centre Tower. For that amount of space, only the Darling Park Tower comes close to 60,000 sq m but there are certain issues with the building's current tenants.

Anyway, full report on this from the Fin Rev @ post #274 HERE (http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=150272&page=14)

Hey wheres my post!!!?


Anyway: So much for "no demand" so "no tallies"

As I said before - no space, no highrise living - no demand.

Just like no spaceship which takes ppl to space - there will be no demand for it.

But if they get erected different story - DEMAND

For that amount of space, only the Darling Park Tower comes close to 60,000 sq m but there are certain issues with the building's current tenants.

Why won't someone tell them about John Boyd, damnit?! They must think there's something wrong with being south of Market Street.

Just heard on 2UE that the Sydney Town Hall will receive a $60 million upgrade which would take a year to complete. It will secure the future of the building.

They also said that the sandstone is also crumbling contributing to the detoriation of the building.

And an article from The Sydney Morning Herald (smh.com.au)

Rock of ages runs low for $60m renovation
Sunanda Creagh Urban Affairs Reporter
April 25, 2007

Other related coverage
Town hall $60m facelift
Advertisement
AdvertisementTHE City of Sydney will spend more than $30 million just on sandstone in its ambitious plan to renovate Sydney Town Hall.

It had better get in quickly, though: rare yellowblock sandstone, of which there are only 10,000 tonnes left, is expected to run out within eight years.

The Lord Mayor, Clover Moore, yesterday announced the details of the $60 million Town Hall "rescue package", more than half of which will be spent on restoring the chipped sandstone facade. Many cracked tiles in floor mosaics will be replaced.

"We believe we have a duty of care to undertake these works and guarantee Town Hall for future generations," Cr Moore said of the 118-year-old building yesterday. "It's the sort of work I think the administration has put off."

Howard Tanner, a heritage architect, has been hired to oversee the project. A basement room, Peace Hall, will be turned into a function room where the Town Hall collection of historical artefacts will be displayed. Indoor services such as airconditioning, power and sprinkler systems will be upgraded and the outside of the building cleaned.

The council will move to an as yet undisclosed location during the year-long renovations, which are mooted to begin next year.

Ron Powell, manager of the NSW Centenary Stonework Program, said the council would need permission from the Minister for Commerce, Eric Roozendaal, to dip into the state's limited supply of yellowblock sandstone.

"We have 10,000 tonnes of it left. That's all there is," Mr Powell said. "It's predominantly for state-owned buildings but also occasionally for buildings of … heritage and civic significance, like Town Hall, the Great Synagogue, Sydney University."

The council may consider using lower quality sandstone from Gosford, and treating it so it looks like yellowblock - a practice considered controversial in conservation circles, he said.

The council's official historian, Dr Shirley Fitzgerald, said tunnelling under the building to create plant rooms might uncover archaeological finds. "Almost certainly we'll find some more bodies," she said. Town Hall was built on Sydney's first graveyard.

The National Trust's director of conservation, Jacqui Goddard, said the council should focus more on regular maintenance than on one-off rescue plans

i basically live in the old yellowblock quarry in pyrmont where the stone for these buildings came from. i believe some more was kept when jacksons landing was dug out but that's it. it's all almost built on now but there is so much of it left under the new developments and cliff faces around pyrmont point. you just can't get to it anymore, plus a lot of these "fake" cliff faces are now heritage listed.

the funny thing is that the quarries in pyrmont closed a long time ago because there was no demand, but now it would be worth a fortune if you had sat on it for a while rather than selling for development, or at least dug a lot of it up and stored it somewhere before redeveloping.

the only other area where this stuff came from was millers point. they'd have to dig up observatory hill to get anymore from there.

early days guys, but a tower is being planned for top of Commonwealth bank (money box) on cnr Martin pl/pitt st. not sure of height but atleast 120m. design comp set for august.

^^ Are you serious…. that would totally destroy the look of the beautiful old bank. I agree some older structures work great with the mix of architectural styles such as the GPO and customs house, but the money box,(I Feel) only works standing alone.... it would totally lose its power and individuality with a tower above it. the structure itself suits a stumpy and flat form as it is now. When are they ganna learn that there is so much other shit out there they can knock down and redevelope... leave our classics the way they are, they dont need botox.

^ a 200m tower was APPROVED back in 1988. But these days with historic precinct and shadows its limited the site. The money box bldg consists of 3 stages. the first was built in 1911-16 which is rectangular facing martin place and cnr pitt st. then in 1933 a large section was added to give it he square look. then in 1968 a eastern section was added along with some facing rowe st. THIS is the section where tower will rise from. It basically rises up near MLC tower. so it wont interfer with existing 12storey com bank.

^ a 200m tower was APPROVED back in 1988.Here's a render of the 1988 Commonwealth Bank proposal, looking down Martin Place.
Apologies for the poor quality, but the SMH doesn't age that well, and it's better than nothing. :)

http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c317/WKirkwood/Skyscrapers/CommBank.jpg

All these large building proposed and approved in the 1980's and hardly any tallies built. Hmmph.

^thats because of the Wall st crash of 1990.

I forgot about that.

Hopefully restrictions will be raised so that large buildings can be built and then lots of tall and a little fatter buildings will be built without the market crashing. Wouldn't that be lovely.

I like that SMH 1988 proposal. I seem to like all the late 80s designs ... I hope we get something equivalent or better.

^nah. not gonna happen after 1994 LEP. theres a thread on this project.
the new envelope is setback more and only 120m high.like GPO development.

i wish.... i think it make more since to me since i live in sydney rather then another city. could look amazing with the right building on garden island.

-----
http://www.smh.com.au/news/national/keatings-unlikely-house-call/2007/05/23/1179601494647.html

Keating's unlikely House call

Catharine Munro
May 24, 2007
Other related coverage

* I'd abolish states: PM

AdvertisementAdvertisement

THE former prime minister Paul Keating believes Australia should abandon Canberra as the capital and move Parliament to Garden Island in Sydney.

Outlining his vision for Sydney Harbour last night, Mr Keating said he agreed with the 19th century architect Francis Greenway that a landmark building should fit on the headland where the navy is presently located.

"John Howard has moved the Government to Sydney. Cabinet meets in Phillip Street and the Government only returns to Canberra when Parliament sits," Mr Keating told a packed lecture room at the Powerhouse Museum.

Mr Keating, a Sydney resident, said he wouldn't care if the capital was in Melbourne, "but if you want to impress the visitors, of course, you come to Sydney".

He took a swipe at what he referred to as "the heritage industry" for not giving up old buildings in the pursuit of major overhauls of the city.

"A giant naval crane that the National Trust wants preserved on Garden Island should not stay," he said.

Mr Keating, one of the judges for the design competition for East Darling Harbour's redevelopment, said he was confident the State Government would ensure that public space remained on the 22-hectare site.

"I think the big fight to have is locking up these places [like East Darling Harbour, Ballast Point and Goat Island] so that the nazis can't get their hands on them, and by nazis I mean the developers," he said.

is it just me or did keating sound a bit bi-polar in that article. he goes on about "bad" people stopping development then he says people need to fight developers. i must have read it wrong, many times.

^^ He's definitely unstable...

classic line>
"Mr Keating, a Sydney resident, said he wouldn't care if the capital was in Melbourne, "but if you want to impress the visitors, of course, you come to Sydney".
lol

Ironic, because this was in the Australian today quoting a London retail expert. Hopefully the Melbourne fan boys don't see this otherwise you wont be able to shut them up for a week :) Harsh words in the opening two sentences, but some would agree.

There's more to Melbourne, say retail pros
* Stephen Lunn
* May 26, 2007

IF a city were a woman, Sydney would be a blonde and Melbourne a brunette.

London-based international retail expert Martin Raymond believes there is little in Sydney to keep a visitor interested, while Melbourne's layers make it a richer tourist destination.

"I say Sydney is a blonde city, while Melbourne is more of a brunette," Mr Raymond said.

"Sydney is optimistic, quite surface, quite open, but when I look at it closely there is nothing much that really makes me want to stay for too long as a tourist. But in Melbourne there is depth, complexity, there is richer colour, and there are hidden gems, much like Paris."

Of course, the retailista is being careful not to bite the hand that feeds, or at least fed, him. He and business partner Christopher Sanderson helped Melbourne develop its current retail strategy three years ago, drawing on their work in Paris, London, Barcelona and New York.

"A visitor can't help but feel Melbourne has retained a real European, bohemian feel that other Australian cities like Sydney and Brisbane haven't," Mr Sanderson said.

Asked what gave Melbourne a competitive advantage over its Australian rivals, Mr Raymond said the deft use of laneways and "above-awning" retail areas made it unique, not just here but internationally.

"You just don't get the laneways anywhere in the world like you do in Melbourne," Mr Raymond said. "In other cities you go out of your way to avoid them; here you go out of your way to explore them.

"And there is so much already being done above street level in terms of retail and restaurant/bar in Melbourne, spaces that other cities don't really consider. They should keep pursuing that as a point of difference."

Mr Raymond said much of Australia's creative talent was based in Melbourne, and servicing them in the CBD made for a vibrant atmosphere.

"Fifteen per cent of the people working in Melbourne's central area have a creative job, compared to the national average of five per cent," he said.

The Bracks Government and the City of Melbourne coughed up $200,000 three years ago to retain the pair to help develop the Melbourne Retail Strategy 2006-12, aiming to position the city as a leading retail destination. "People don't come to a city for the footy grounds and the sports facilities," Mr Raymond said. "If you mention Melbourne overseas the thing they immediately think of, like Paris, is the cafes."

On Thursday, Melbourne Lord Mayor John So delivered a favourable one-year report card: more money spent ($1.8 billion more than last year), an 8 per cent increase in CBD pedestrian traffic, and more kerbside cafes.

But surely there must be something wrong with Melbourne?

"Well, pedestrians should be put on par with cars in much of the CBD," Mr Raymond said.

"And Melbourne must avoid the trap of accepting the mediocre and continue to invest in outstanding architecture, like it did with the Federation Square project."

http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,20867,21795828-5006784,00.html

blonde chicks are hotter though...

I hope Barangaroo ends up looking like downtown NY - that will really put sydney up there. Coz then we will have a downtown, midtown (wynyard), and uptown (chinatown, WT) district.

I cant wait to see GLOBE ST! Finally a WALL ST of OZ. I think Martin Place might still be our Wall st though... its just too big and high profile to be preceded.

^ It should ideally go the other way around. Uptown would imply the northern most district, with downtown being the southern most district. Midtown would predictably fall somewhere in between.

...it's just too big and high profile to be SUPERceded.
Preceded: comes before.
Superceded: replaced in priority.

^ It should ideally go the other way around. Uptown would imply the northern most district, with downtown being the southern most district. Midtown would predictably fall somewhere in between.

"Downtown" usually refers to the financial centre of a city (I think:) ) and "uptown" is usually used to refer to a kind of high density residential, office and entertainment district of a city centre (I think:) ).

^ I think that might be partly right. I know in the US 'downtown' gets used fairly often to describe the CBD or city centre. However I'm not sure 'uptown' gets used much at all outside of New York and I would not know of any cities besides New York that use the term 'mid town'. Generally a city can only have one 'downtown', but it could have many dense residential areas and it wouldn't sound right to call them all 'uptowns'.

Regardless I think in most cities were the terms are applied 'up' or 'upper' refers to northern areas while 'down' or 'lower' refers to southern districts. In New York therefore, 'midtown' is the area in between the two :)

Downtown in NY is 'down' because it's down river (Hudson). Not necessarily because that way is south.

"Downtown" usually refers to the financial centre of a city (I think:) ) and "uptown" is usually used to refer to a kind of high density residential, office and entertainment district of a city centre (I think:) ).

Agree - as per post.

I guess OZ is still kind of english - we all still say "city" which is actually very english. In middle east people say "downtown" and is asia also - more american. But I have heard heaps of sydneysiders say midtown - but hardly ever downtown. I hear up town too - but they normally say it in two words, like UP TOWN.

^^

I've noticed that older people tend to call it town. Like, "I'm going to go into town."

i use both town and city for the same thing, ie, "i'm going for a wander into town" or "i'm going for a wander into the city".

I think the terms are very inter-changable.

Same here. Interchange "town" and "city" quite often as LanceDriver said.

Agree - old ppl always say "town" hahaha i just noticed that!!!

i ALWAYS say city... never change.

Agree - old ppl always say "town" hahaha i just noticed that!!!

i ALWAYS say city... never change.

you deserve an award ... how about the SSC Poptart Award?

Martin Raymond has no idea what he is thinking. I know of people (including Victorians) who visit Sydney regularly and never get bored of the city's sights.

There's plenty more to see in Sydney than what some believe. If I had a friends or family visiting Sydney, I would have endless activities and sights for them to experience.

I'm with Fabian on this one: and I've done it any number of times with family from the Bush, from Melbers and Canberra and from overseas, several times. Once you throw in trips to the mountains, Southern Highlands, Central Coast and South Coast, and even the Hunter, on top of the restaurants, theatres, museums and sights including beaches, it gets to be a matter of how can I fit it all in and who's going to call "Uncle" first, me or the visitors?

^ agreed. i've got quite a few visitors coming over for about 3 weeks in October and have run out of days to fit in all the things we want to do. There's things like ferry trips over to Watsons Bay pub for the arvo, also over to Manly, the zoo and countless wanders around the city aswell as unlimited driving trips to do.

^^ He's just trying to drum up business for himself...

The problem is as always that people don't see what is under their noses. As already pointed out there are many many things that can be done within the greater Sydney area, and that is before specifically going out to do activities for example whit water at Penrith, Kayaking in the middle harbour etc.

My uni campus (Strathfield) is hosting ACU Alive in September and we will host students from Canberra, Brisbane, Melbourne and Ballarat, and one of the days will be allocated for sightseeing. For some of them, it will be their first trip to the city, and I will probably have to guide them around if I am selected. It's going to be hard choosing what to do with them.

8/6/07 - I was selected :)

Culwulla,

TonyP, Avatar and i went to an exhibition of high rise living in Sydney. There was this proposal on the Rocks of an apartment which curves North-South. It is behind the MCA. Probably back in the 70s-80s? It was made up of a few curvy buildings and all are around 60m high.

Do you have the actual rendering of it?

There were also three tall octagonal buildings replacing the current Westfield building at Victoria Rd, Kings Cross.

I may be wrong, but...
The buildings at the Rocks sound like Harry Seidler's entry in the Rocks redevelopment competition - early 1960s? - all of which came to nought.
The 3 towers development at the top of William Street was also 1960s, maybe, and was a project called "The Palisades" by architect Ken Woolley of Ancher, Mortlock, Murray & Woolley. Woolley was one of Sydney's most innovative architects during the '60s and '70s: did some early work with NSW Government Architect and in partnership with Philip Cox (Cox Richardson now).

Culwulla,

TonyP, Avatar and i went to an exhibition of high rise living in Sydney. There was this proposal on the Rocks of an apartment which curves North-South. It is behind the MCA. Probably back in the 70s-80s? It was made up of a few curvy buildings and all are around 60m high.

Do you have the actual rendering of it?

There were also three tall octagonal buildings replacing the current Westfield building at Victoria Rd, Kings Cross.

These two designs were rather exciting and looked great, love to see more info and some additional renderings of them.

you heard it here first.
Goldfields House is set to become the no1 residential adress in sydney or even Aus? You can only imagine how much units will go for with the magnificent views. Also its location.
its going to be compeltely reconstructed /new glass facade ect.
ill let you know more when i can.

http://image.sl.nsw.gov.au/apa/24/d7_24408.jpg

http://smh.com.au/ffximage/2006/06/30/office18.jpg

Fantastic! It couldn't happen to a more worthy building - it's always been butt ugly and a blight on the Quay, and especially as it occupies such a prominent position. My prayers to the Great Whatever may yet be answered.

The mind boggles at what these apartments will cost.

you heard it here first.
Goldfields House is set to become the no1 residential adress in sydney or even Aus? You can only imagine how much units will go for with the magnificent views. Also its location.
its going to be compeltely reconstructed /new glass facade ect.
ill let you know more when i can.

From what I read in the SMH a few months ago, there were plans to convert into a mixed use tower with office, hotel and a penthouse apartment.

Was hoping they'd demolish it and build something in its place with a more interesting shape. Oh well, I hope they can make it look nice.

I was only talking about this the other day ... this will hopefully rid us of the ugly brown box. New smooth glass will be welcome.

What's the height limit on Goldfields site? Could they add any floors?

^^ 3 metres.

The height limit there is 110m and the height of Goldfields House is... 110m! It's got good proportions for apartments - nice and thin.

I was only talking about this the other day ...

I know... with me!

This is fantastic news - even if the height stays the same, the view from Circular Quay is slowly getting 'glassier', with this conversion and the Bligh street tower up the road.

think frank gehry.

Govt urged to stop exodus from western Sydney
Wednesday, 13 June 2007. 10:49 (AEST)Wednesday, 13 June 2007. 10:49 (ACST)Wednesday, 13 June 2007. 07:49 (AWST)
A western Sydney council is calling on the New South Wales Government to help reverse what it describes as an exodus of young people from the area.

The Mayor of Parramatta, David Borger, has told a function in Sydney, that outdated perceptions of the area as a cultural desert, need to be addressed in order to stop young people moving away from the western suburbs.

Mr Borger says after Sydney and Melbourne, western Sydney has the third largest economy in Australia.

He says while the Government is planning for infrastructure in the west, there is not enough planning for the arts.

think frank gehry.

Great barrier reef! Do you mean along those lines, or he's being approached?!!?

He's trying to get a development done in my old home town of Brighton...
http://www.gavpolitics.co.uk/www3/images/KingAlfred.png

^^ we can honestly hope so. If it is even remotely like that (and if it's Frank Gehry then it should be; he is obsessed with that design for the past 10 years), i'll be over the moon. ANYTHING is better than what is there at the moment.

but its only going to be a refurb yeah?

^its shell will be saved but thats about it. nice new cladding and floor plan.
more goss>
checkout 33 bligh thread!! its back now over 200m!!!!!

Great barrier reef! Do you mean along those lines, or he's being approached?!!?

He's trying to get a development done in my old home town of Brighton...
http://www.gavpolitics.co.uk/www3/images/KingAlfred.png


What a vomit, keep him away from sydney thanks.

Mo(o)re on the Town Hall upgrade. From The Sydney Morning Herald (http://www.smh.com.au/news/national/town-hall-upgrade-criticised/2007/06/22/1182019377404.html)

Town Hall upgrade criticised

Sunanda Creagh Urban Affairs Reporter
June 23, 2007

THE Lord Mayor of Sydney, Clover Moore, and her fellow councillors will have their offices upgraded as part of a $34 million makeover of the Town Hall's interior, but Cr Moore is adamant the patch-ups are essential safety repairs.

However, one councillor says he has been told the upgrades include new carpet, a paint job and lighting - and accused Cr Moore of hypocrisy on the issue of spending on Town Hall maintenance.

Cr Shayne Mallard pointed to a 1990 interview with Cr Moore in which she said unnecessary restoration of Town Hall should be skipped. "As homelessness and poverty is increasing, only the bare minimum of building maintenance needs to be done," she said at the time.

He said the works now being considered by the council were unnecessary. "It's a whole upgrade of the material element of the council's offices; it's not just safety and wiring," he said yesterday.

"I'd estimate there's close to $10 million in non-essential spending on the upgrade," he said, $7 million of which is being spent on refurbishing a basement area called Peace Hall.

"I treasure my office, it's lovely as it is, and the Lord Mayor's room seems pretty plush to me - although I have only been invited in there about three times," the Liberal councillor said. "This council is giddy with money."

A spokesman for Cr Moore said Cr Mallard was wrong.

"The stuff that's happening in the Lord Mayor's office is repairing the wiring so it doesn't spark and cause a fire," he said, adding that other essential upgrades included installation of sprinkler systems, and improvement of the air-conditioning, plant room, ventilation and fire equipment.

The $7 million Peace Hall upgrade would allow the council to earn more money from hiring it out, he said.

the guy is quoting something from 17 years ago!

They all whinge & whine about inappropriate use of ratepayer dollars but would gladly do the same thing once in office. The fact buildings need maintenance. You cant just let town hall go to seed. Its not a good advert for the city.

Sydney Town Hall is one of the city's most important buildings and given its status and age, you cannot skimp on costs of maintaining and preserving the building.

And it's better to do it now while its cheap to do so :)

What a vomit, keep him away from sydney thanks.

That could turn out good. If the facade was nice and blue like that of Gateway Plaza's then the light reflecting off that would look fantastic.

http://www.smh.com.au/news/arts-reviews/max-dupain--modernist/2007/06/26/1182623886752.html

Max Dupain - Modernist Exhibition

NSW State Library

Flesh and stone were the two great influences on Max Dupain's vision. From his earliest photographs he strove to transform the naked human body into something resembling the marble forms of antiquity. Women, especially, were often rendered as triumphantly sensual yet naturalistic, as if the sculptor Bernini had suddenly picked up a camera.

As the pre-eminent photographer of Australian architecture for more than half a century, Dupain found sensual shapes hidden within the geometry of concrete, steel and glass.

"I stress … simplicity and directness [and] reduction of the subject to … symbolic terms … I want to extract every ounce … from any exciting form. I want to give life to the inanimate," he wrote in 1976.

Max Dupain Modernist concentrates more on Dupain's astonishing diligence as an architectural photographer than his more personal work. For several decades it seemed no architect in Australia was content unless Dupain's rigorous eye recorded his creation.

Dupain also formed enduring friendships with some of Australia's great postwar architects. He once told me that during a 1979 visit to his terminally ill friend Syd Ancher, whom he had described as "the archpriest of domestic architecture", Ancher surprised him by confessing he felt "the public had no love for concrete".

Dupain's soaring cathedral-like observation of Ancher, Mortlock and Woolley's Town Hall House, made three years earlier, suggests the photographer never shared his great friend's pessimism.

The show also features the late Harry Seidler prominently with Dupain's adventurous (for the time) pictures of Australia Square and the Rose Seidler House presented in large, finely made digital prints. His potent 1978 observation of Seidler's Australian embassy in Paris is something different, however, reducing a complex concrete curve to origami-shaped abstraction.

I never thought I would see a Max Dupain photograph that wasn't made traditionally, but these immaculate digital prints (scanned directly from original negatives) reflect Dupain's vision in an essentially faithful manner.

Curator Avryl Whitnall's selection allows visitors ample space to reflect on Dupain's documentation of Sydney's emerging modernist architecture. Ultimately, however, Dupain's reputation as an artist rests among the few personal images present at the library. Torso in Sunlight 1941, Jean with Wire Mesh, 1938, Meat Queue, 1946 and 1938's wry Waiting for the Main Event all reveal the restrained humanity and invention that nourished his durable vision.

SYDNEY OPERA HOUSE is now on the UNESCO World Heritage List.
And not before time! Congratulations Jørn Utzon, only the 2nd living architect to have a building listed.

I know there is a thread somewhere but I'm in a bit of a rush...

the model of goldfields house refurb is coming in soon.

Will Goldfields have to go to a design comp? Or will the fact that it's a refurb mean that one won't be required?

Should Goldfields refurb gets its own thread? Who is the architect of the refurb? ...please?

Goldfields desperately needs something done to it and any change will have a massive impact on the view of northern skyline. I hope it's a top quality exterior job to match the interiors.

which one is the goldfields building can sum1 post a pic of it plz!

It's the boring, 2 tone brown 26 storey 'tower' at the western end of the Quay, cnr George and Alfred & Pitt sts; it's the same size as the AMP Building. It has the swamp critters fountains and pools in front of it. It is entirely without character and has epitomised bland error from the moment it was built and if ever a Sydney building needed an emergency make-over, this is the one.

...and here it is on Emporis:

Goldfields House (http://www.emporis.com/en/wm/bu/?id=goldfieldshouse-sydney-australia)

So r they knocking it down??????? The starbucks building

fixing it up mate, not taking it down.

heh, i guess you could call it the starbucks building

How are they going to fix it? Its just a box building??? Hmmm maybe cover it with a giant screen which says "Gday. Welcome to Australia"

They will strip the curtain wall façade and replace it with whatever, I truly hope, imaginative new curtain wall the most creative (yes, please!) architect can design. No problem.

truly hope, imaginative new curtain wall the most creative (yes, please!) architect can design. No problem.

How about a curtain wall made of actual giant curtains? Not only would it look different, but it would solve the problem buildings like World Tower have with lots of curtains in different states of openness making the windows look ugly.

They should knock it down completely and build Gateway Plaza 2.

:drool:

Curtain wall construction is, in effect, a giant glass/aluminium/steel curtain, that hangs from the skeleton frame of the building thus the name, except it is attached to the frame, possibly to stop it from flapping about in a stiff breeze or prevent some fool from tying it in a knot to keep it 'out of the way'.

They should knock it down completely and build Gateway Plaza 2.

:drool:

I cannot see why they cannot go any higher.

The idea was that Goldfields House should match the AMP Building on the eastern end of the Quay when viewed from the harbour.

Gateway Plaza @ 164m was a NSW Labor initiative, not a Sydney City Council one. I doubt very much we will see anything that tall near The Quay ever again.

On the 110m Goldfields House makeover, partial quote from CULWULLA, 2 pages ago post #165:

It's going to be completely reconstructed/new glass facade etc.^^ So glass it will be! Hopefully lots of it.

I cannot see why they cannot go any higher.

You're right. They should build a twin.

http://img207.imageshack.us/img207/9917/twogatewayvd7.png

CQ is the PERFECT setting for Australias tallest. Why no tallies there - its the best location for a tallie!!!!!!!!! Imagine how much money you would make from a residential apartment 90 storey tower or hotel right where that building is? And how beautiful it will look in that location and the best views. A tallie and money could not ask for a better location. Hmmm perfect for a TRUMP TOWER

CBD-1 (http://www.emporis.com/en/wm/bu/?id=cbd1-sydney-australia) was planned for where Cove now stands. It was knocked back due to the fact that it would apparently somehow interfere (or rather detract) with the view of The Bridge. Besides, these days The Quay would be expected to be as open and get as much sunlight as possible. Too many people would protest at the idea of a supertall proposed for the area. Reality check.

I doubt strongly we will see any errr "tallies" right on The Quay.

...

^^ Thats just WAY too bad for Sydney. Geez ppl are so stupid - whats a supertall going to do besides provide more money, more jobs, a better view, more shops/cafes, etc... Take away 3 metres more access to sun ?!!!- well here is an idea - the sun is the worst thing for you!!!! And besides its a city and there are still heaps of other spots in the quay to provide sun. Too much submission to NIMBYs is not good - you practically give them the power. Not good enough seriously. And it isnt even about a tallie anymore.

Anyway thanks for the info - always though that the Quay was pretty much the greatest tallie spot. I wish i owned a 90-storey hotel on the quay!! or office tower!

cbd-1 was a loss to sydney, although i can agree it would have unbalanced sydney for years.
Its building would have prevented other high rises going up as it would have picked up a lot of office space.

shit happens ;p

Yeah you wouldn't want a situation which Perth had after Central Park and QV1 were built.

How much space was supposed to be in CBD-1?

How much space was supposed to be in CBD-1?

6,000 sqm of open space for office, church and a hotel

cbd-1 was a loss to sydney, although i can agree it would have unbalanced sydney for years.
Its building would have prevented other high rises going up as it would have picked up a lot of office space.

shit happens ;p

Probably not given the shortage of sites for development, and it had been mooted as a mixed used tower with apartments as well.

A true vertical community in the centre of the financial district.

maybe, but if you look at the track record of buildings going up in the 80's.
chances are we would have just ended up with another hole somewhere. if not here at cbd-1 then at chifley, governor phillip, etc.
don't think demand was ever as strong as the supply rush.

could be wrong though! have not even looked into vacancy ates of the 80's heh.

CBD-1 (http://www.emporis.com/en/wm/bu/?id=cbd1-sydney-australia) was planned for where Cove now stands. It was knocked back due to the fact that it would apparently somehow interfere (or rather detract) with the view of The Bridge. Besides, these days The Quay would be expected to be as open and get as much sunlight as possible. Too many people would protest at the idea of a supertall proposed for the area. Reality check.

I doubt strongly we will see any errr "tallies" right on The Quay.

...

Cheers Muse, I hadn't seen a picture of this before. Reminds me of (i think) the Bank of China building in HK. It would have been rather unbalanced, especially looming over the low-rise Rocks area, but can you imagine the views!!!!!

I reckon CBD 1 would have aged terribly and in hindsight i agree with the planners. A tallie would be nice, but not at the spot. EDH would be fab, but for me i really don't see the need for a supertall in Sydney, unless it takes Centrepoints spot.

All buildings show their age and are 'of their age'. Quality of design, as defined by its age/style, is the key characteristic we should aim for so that even though a building is clearly of a particular period, it is admirable for its integrity of design, &/or because it is so idiosyncratic and interesting historically.

At 445m, that render on Emporis is either very understated, or it had a mahoosive spire on top. The surrounding buildings are over half the size of the CBD1, and they sure as hell aren't all 200+m. I think they made the right choice not to approve it though...

The one that we should have is Skytower. Which was to be built near town hall, Skytower was just so incredibly tall and hot.

ive seen the new glass canopy for world square. its goning up to council tonight. Its bascially a bubble /triangular shaped space frame covering the central square area with side sections also. looks ok.

^ do you think there will be any problem with it getting approved? it's freezing in there at the moment.

i think it will get approval.should only take a couple of months to erect.

Hey.....wouldn't this be a perfect tower for the Wynyard site. Roughly 235m to top of cage = bang on the Sydney height limit. :)
http://i9.tinypic.com/537vw5d.jpg

stop teasing; lol

For anyone interested. They are looking at completing the war memorial at Hyde Park with the final water feature.

http://www.sydneymedia.com.au/html/3327-national-salute-needed-for-aussie-diggers.asp?orig=Home

should look good. nov9 finish date? they better hurry up.

http://www.sydneymedia.com.au/asset/2/images/original_Hyde_Park_plan1929_-_Dellit.jpg

I assume you refer to the cascading water steps as opposed to what looks like light blue paint split on the picture immediately below the monument?

i think that supposed to be the shadow from the memorial?

It must be indicated shadow - look at the shape of it. Odd choice of colour though.
I think this is a great idea.

Looks great. On a side note, It's going to be wierd when hyde park will look like that render. Once all the trees are cut down and re-planted.

yeah, makes the park look larger when the trees are small. atm it looks small because of the massive wide/tall trees.

It's such a shame that those trees need to be cut down, it's so beautiful in there at the moment.

I've always thought they should also make a nice old fashioned arched pedestrian bridge over Park St so you don't need to cross at those lights.

theres been plenty of proposals over the years for bridges over william st. nothing ever eventuated. shame.

There was also the plan to close Park St through Hyde Park connecting the park together as part of the Cross City Tunnel. Disappointing. :(

I think it's one of those places though where a bridge is the best option. Unlikely to happen though, and even if it did, it'd likely be some awful modern thing which would not suit the park at all.

a DA will be lodged soon for a 20storey block of units cnr Goulburn and Riley st,Surry Hills. nothing major, but its good to see units making a comeback.

^ good, i think they need to push that corner of surry hills upwards coz it's on the cbds edge and near oxford st. the nimbys will show themselves on this one though.

Coolio. 20-levels for that area is bit more than most.

Nice to hear - I walk past every day and wonder how long it will be before th ugly office building is replaced. There shouldn't be too many problems with Nimbys, Lance - it has buildings of about 50m high on three sides and the police station on the other. My maps says that the height limit for the site is 45m, so maybe the council will be the problem...

http://www.emporis.com/en/wm/bu/?id=190goulburnstreet-sydney-australia
http://www.emporis.com/en/wm/bu/?id=darlingtonhouse-sydney-australia
http://www.emporis.com/en/wm/bu/?id=190rileystreet-sydney-australia
http://www.emporis.com/en/wm/bu/?id=cambridgeinn-sydney-australia
http://www.emporis.com/en/wm/bu/?id=streetmarbury-sydney-australia
http://www.emporis.com/en/wm/bu/?id=monumentapartments-sydney-australia

A DA was submitted a couple of years ago which is still in our model i think.it
was 15 levels.
http://www.emporis.com/en/wm/bu/?id=200goulburnstreet-sydney-australia

maybe new DA is 20 levels include basements?
It replaces Dainford House known as 200 -218 Goulburn st.

Have you got any photos of that corner of the model, Cul? About the only one in the CBD model thread (http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=253098) in which is is visible is the one below, but it's a bit hard to see...

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1438/644784649_30692f62e8_b.jpg

http://www.smh.com.au/news/national/city-braces-for-pain-before-gain/2007/08/03/1185648145709.html

can that smh newspaper segment start the whole "i don't like grass in a city square" debate again? heh.

ill try to get a pic tommorro papervag

Never mind, Cul. I went and had a look today at lunchtime. The approved building looks pretty boring - I hope the new one is a bit more interesting.

More homes a squeeze
Source: Southern Courier
Author: Laury Desmond

http://www.villagevoice.com.au/article/20070724/NWS10/707240354/Hoenig++more+homes+a+squeeze

The State Government's Draft East Subregional Strategy, released last week, aims to "improve housing choices" in Botany Bay and Randwick by 2031.

In the strategy, Botany Bay has been earmarked to produce 6500 more homes, but the Mayor, Ron Hoenig, said the council faced a trade-off between the need for new homes and the need for jobs.

"In the last decade Botany has recycled industrial areas around Botany and Mascot station," Cr Hoenig said. "This has created about 1500 residential units, but the problem is finding the land.

"The Department of Planning has reduced its support for the rezoning of industrial land for residential use because of the need for jobs."

Cr Hoenig said some areas could not be used because of restrictions placed on the council by the department.

"Mascot station is a possible area but is constricted by aircraft noise. The land around the British and American Tobacco site at Eastgardens is another but the department have said they want this to remain industrial for job creation," Cr Hoenig said.

"We can't use land near the Orica site because of groundwater pollution. The department is asking Botany to contribute to a third of the housing in the Eastern Suburbs, but they don't want high rises, which are alien to the area.

"The [Draft East Subregional Strategy] is going to be a challenge and is not made easy by the department's policies - which are a constraint to achieving their aim."

Randwick City Council has been earmarked to create 8400 new homes and Randwick Mayor Paul Tracey said the strategy had been developed with the full co-operation of the council.

"Some of the new dwellings will be part of the revitalisation of our town centres and existing transport routes such as Maroubra Junction, Kensington and Kingsford. The focus here will be to encourage greater use of the public transport system, which we feel is very important," he said.

"We have to accept the challenge that Sydney is growing."

Never mind, Cul. I went and had a look today at lunchtime. The approved building looks pretty boring - I hope the new one is a bit more interesting.

say new render today. alot better. lots of silver and glass.still 14storeys/50m.
wth 5 undergrd.
architect Tony Owen
http://www.tonyowen.com.au/

there lodging DA next week.

The new crop of office towers due in the next few years may not be super tall but they are really gonna chock up this view of the CBD !!!Anyone wanna photoshop them in ????
http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1127/864817696_40f6bcf1a9_b.jpg

say new render today. alot better. lots of silver and glass.still 14storeys/50m.
wth 5 undergrd.
architect Tony Owen

Thanks, Cul. He's done some nice stuff, so I'm looking forward to seeing this one.