Can we have a politics thread? I'v seen several posts get ruined by this, and there are several issues I'd like to talk about, the reason Im asking is becuase I know this is a sensitive issue for us all, but there is no reason that we can't debate about this in a mature manner.

We have one of these in the Iranian forum, as well as a few other forums...

It's an attempt to contain all of the political debates in one place, so it's not a bad idea.

If anyone goes too far and I haven't already spotted it, PM me. :)

Well I like to avoid politics in our forum, but you guys are right, people will talk about politics no matter what ! so might as well contain the discussion here. Let's just keep this thread clean of personal and hateful attacks

I'm posting this w.r.t a question i was asked by MKTJ on my view of the solution to corruption in Iraq.

corruption can only be solved by having an anti-corruption police

giving good incentives for people to report corruption


extreme punishment to people who commit corruption including:

1- a hold on all their and their immediate relatives assets to pay off part of what they stole.

2- addition to long prison sentences with forced hard labour to pay off what they stole... the more they steal the longer the hard labour... e.g. they pay off $10 of what they steal for every day of hard labour).

3- The hard labour of the "corruption inmates" can be used for useful things like desert farming, building solar thermal power stations in the desert (basically the jobs to utilise the desert areas that ordinary people living in the urban/rural areas are unwilling to do.

4- Reduce the cost for security by embedding an electronic tag inside their bodies making them easily trackable.


make corruption as scary today as the word "saddam" was in the past.

^^ they already have an anti corruption agency.. what would you do when this agency is itself is corrupt? make another agency... then what? they all can watch each other all day.. while sneaking bread under the table !

the only way to combat corruption is by massive technology overhaul... everything should be computerized, reliance on cash should be greatly reduced, and the usage of traced transactions must be the norm.. accountability measures should always involve a "name and shame" approach.. proper e-government, e-commerce should be established, and finally.. Iraq needs to have a new CENSUS!!

I agree 100%.

in fact the creation of an "electronic ID" for every person based on their unique biometric information will alone reduce corruption by 80%

Of course none of the iraqi ministries want to go electronic. Because everything will become clear then... especially the tens of thousands of "ghost" employees (most of iraq's budget goes on salaries today, therefore thats where the biggest possibilities for corruption arise).

When you make all transactions with government electronic, and all large money transactions electronic you cut down massively on fraud.

By having imposed cash limits of 1M dinar for cash transactions and cash carried on the person, you also reduce corruption (anyone carrying more then 1M dinar in cash is arrested immediately... that should get the acceptance of electronic payments up, electronic payments should be possible using ordinary telephones, so, for example farmers or beduins can sell their produce without the need for cash).

All of this makes life for terrorists extremely difficult. Citizens have a limit of 1M dinar in cash to deposit in their account per month... there's no limit on transfer deposits, only on cash. This will weed out all the black market / illegal activities.

and finally.. such an electronic government and payment regime will make the issue of taxation, social security all that much easier... assessment of people's taxability and discovery of poor people who are eligible for state support.

^^ So do you think that we will have e-government anytime soon?

You said that the ministries don't want to go electronic, But can the parliament pass a law to force the government to do so (if they want of course)?!

I guess the members of parliament don't want that either, as many of them are already corrupt!

Now I wonder why Iraqi people elected them in the first place?! I guess people like to get bitten so they can learn the lesson!

So does this mean that we will have to wait for another election so that the people may elect some impartial persons?

Dear god it's like the vicious circle of corruption wont get solved soon.

MKTJ, I will explain.

The ministries don't want a true e-ID / E-government / e-payment system because it reduces their work, their "control" over people and also finds corruption.

The Members of Parliament and political parties are too thick to even know what such a scheme is in reality (they do "talk" about in generalities, but don't really understand it).

The PM office did in fact send out a contract for an "initial proof of concept" project last year (after many failed attempts since 2005).

BAGHDAD (AFP) -- Iraq signed a memorandum of understanding with French defence group ThalesThalesLoading... on Tuesday to establish a central database holding important information about the country's citizens, its government said.

The project is the first phase of plans for a massive national identity card scheme that aims to replace four different types of paper documents currently used by Iraq's 30 million citizens.

"The price of the project is 12.4 million dollars, to complete the first phase," the Iraqi interior ministry said in a statement.

Although the ministry said a contract had been agreed, a source close to the deal told AFP the two sides had only signed a memorandum of understanding.

It was not immediately clear when a contract might be signed, but the ministry statement said work on the project would begin next year and would last six months.

Iraq announced the identity card system in July, with the intention for the scheme, which is expected to cost 300 million dollars in total, to be operational in about two years.

The ministry did not clarify at the time of the announcement, however, if an individual's data would be electronically implanted on the new plastic card, as is the case in other countries.

The new system will be used by men, women and children nation-wide and the data written on the identity cards will be imprinted in both Arabic and Kurdish.



however all of these little schemes are missing the point about what's needed in Iraq. A complete overhaul of all ministries, banking and retail and making it all electronic. This is not particularly expensive (will certainly cost $3-$4Bn USD) and that cost will be recouped within a year at most both in terms of:
-increased tax collection
-reduced social security payments to "ghost" and undeserving recipients
-elimination of "ghost" employees from ministries
-reduction in small scale corruption by keeping an electronic paper trail of ALL transactions inside Iraq and all international transactions.

Of course Iraq's parliamentarians are not really hurt by these, because whatever corruption they are involved in, payments are made to their bank account in Beirut, Amman, Dubai, Istanbul... so such a system has no negative effect on them, only on the ministerial staff involved in the "inside" corruption.

Thence, I would have thought they SHOULD certainly support such a scheme as it won't hurt their pockets, whilst appearing "good" to the people and improving internal transparency in Iraq.

As for the next elections... which party, tell me MKTJ shall I vote for that has the above policy on their manifesto?

Allawi?
Maliki?
Jafari?
Abdul Mehdi?
Sadr?
Samara'ai?
Barzani?
Goran?

who? NONE.

The PM office did in fact send out a contract for an "initial proof of concept" project last year (after many failed attempts since 2005).

Are they working on it right now? or It's still just a memorandum of understanding?

Of course Iraq's parliamentarians are not really hurt by these, because whatever corruption they are involved in, payments are made to their bank account in Beirut, Amman, Dubai, Istanbul... so such a system has no negative effect on them, only on the ministerial staff involved in the "inside" corruption.

And they are just getting away with it!

Thence, I would have thought they SHOULD certainly support such a scheme as it won't hurt their pockets, whilst appearing "good" to the people and improving internal transparency in Iraq.

good point!

As for the next elections... which party, tell me MKTJ shall I vote for that has the above policy on their manifesto?

Allawi?
Maliki?
Jafari?
Abdul Mehdi?
Sadr?
Samara'ai?
Barzani?
Goran?

who? NONE.

As I said previously in the next election people may (looking to the previous elections I doubt they will) elect other members ''some new names'' not the people you named.

I wish everyone there will stop voting for specific party only because they simply belong to the same religious sect, But I guess people will keep doing that as sectarianism became rooted in the society. :ohno:

Are they working on it right now? or It's still just a

I wish everyone there will stop voting for specific party only because they simply belong to the same religious sect, But I guess people will keep doing that as sectarianism became rooted in the society. :ohno:

I agree, yes, the violence has greatly reduced, but people's mentality still somewhat sectarian. I believe neoptoisim and sectarianism is the root of the corruption problem in Iraq.

Yes, we can establish e-government/e-commerce to eliminate corruption. but people can still bribe, and help their relatives (or people from their party/sect) etc. The problem can be reduced by technology, but not solved. people must be educated better..

^^ very true, before new technology is introduced, the people have to be educated about its use and the consequences of its misuse.

The problem can be reduced by technology, but not solved. people must be educated better..

Very true. Now the question is how are people going to be educated for god's sake?!

There are almost no local independent media networks. (as every party have has a channel and newspaper!)
Most people don't have an access to the internet.
Outdated education system (thanks to our dedicated ministry of edu.)

I have previously talked of a "manifesto for a new Iraq"

here's the initial 24 points. I will add more points below (please feel free to dispute them and add your own!).

1- Government salaries are limited to 2x minimum wage (including MPs)
2- Government is funded by taxation from Corporate, income and import duties/taxes and not oil revenue
3- Oil money is put into a fund that invests in joint-stock companies and services in Iraq.
4- All ID cards replaced by one universal ID card with full biometric information.
5- No more subsidised electricity or ration programme
6- All government budgets have to be within the confines of what can be raised through taxation / levies, which are limited to 80% of "world average" to keep Iraq competitive.
7- Deficit is limited to a maximum of 5% for one year, reducing by 1% for each subsequent year.
8- Import duties levied on all produce that can be produced in Iraq, up to a maximum of 30% (in order to keep local manufacturers competitive).
9- Lawfare unit in the foreign ministry established to fight Iraq's cause against countries who are harming Iraq, both legally and using international PR.
10- Government employees are employees of the people, and online networks can be used by citizens to raise complaints and vote down / remove corrupt/incompetent/criminal state employees from minister down to street cleaner.
11- Local neighbourhoods are responsible for contracting refuse removal / street cleaning (either within their community, or using a contractor). Failure to comply can result in quarantine of that area from any public services until its cleaned up.
12- Punitive penalties for all anti-social behaviour including, littering, graffiti, dirty shops, illegal stalls, illegal parking, breaking public property, dirty cars / houses (external) etc... make the salaries of policemen tied to a monthly "catch" as well as higher bonus for reducing offence rates. Police pay from these penalties, at the same time citizens have the right to overturn and highlight police abuse using an electronic system with a local court for small claims (consistently bad policemen given extremely punitive jail terms to deter them from false claims) - police must provide video/photo evidence of offences.
13- Make democracy universal, with people's universal IDs they should be able to vote on services, policies, members of parliament, quality of services as well as create new topics with a threshold for raising it to parliament once enough votes are included.
14- Eliminate all "foreign studentships" and "bi3that" and bring all necessary expertise in country instead, to eliminate the many funding the lifestyle and personal aspiration of the few.
15- Guaranteed minimum wage job for every citizen who needs a job. (but no handouts). The "Oil fund" is used to create economically viable and sustainable jobs for all the unemployed with immediate effect as the handouts are taken away.
16- The government has to regulate all private and joint stock companies, in line with international and newly created national standards.
17- The "Oil fund" has to invest in medium to long term public-private initiatives where commercial or private funding is insufficient. The criteria is that the service provided has to be usefull for society and has a Return over the long term (20 years). Such projects include, desalination, solar electricity, mass housing projects, roads and urban railways, phosphates and cement, ports, etc...
18- Part of the oil fund (5%) is used to invest in Research & Development of technologies where Iraq has a potential edge (not reinventing the wheel). These include solar air conditioning, solar powered vehicles, desert farming, medical/pharmaceutical technologies, optics, etc... The research can use up to 20% foreign experts, but they must be based physically in Iraq.
19- Iraq should stop pegging the dinar to the USD and let it float freely. Also invest the USD reserves into local joint stock industries to eliminate imports where its economically viable (farming, power generation, light industries, cement, bricks, to begin with...).
20- Encourage and promote the technology leapfrogging of Iraq to surpass the world in a number of key pillars of technologies. including petrochemicals, solar power, desalination, desert farming and air conditioning, solar vehicles, and modern power storage / transmission techniques.
21- All ministries are dissolved and replaced with simple "regulatory authorities" that have to be funded within the limits of what can be raised from taxes. They are not allowed a single penny from oil revenues.
22- The only remaining "ministries" are defence (interior is merged with it), foreign ministry and Economic ministry (finance / oil ministry merged together). The Higher education and education ministries are dissolved and replaced by an "education standards regulator", ditto for electricity ministry etc...
23- Political freedom for all, and a general amnesty to pre and post 2003 exiles.
24- "Collective guilt" principle for murder and terrorism crimes (similar to old fashioned tribal laws) to eliminate terrorism by local actors and eliminate the aiding and abbeting for foreign terrorists coming into Iraq (by collective it means immediate family held liable for crimes, forcing them to report in terrorists before a crime is committed). - This is an "emergency law" that can be repealed by a simple majority after a period of 5 years in a public plebliscite and return Iraq to International norms in criminal laws.

25-Create a large free zone on the lake Razazza south west of Baghdad "Sin City Baghdad" http://wikimapia.org/#lat=32.8588252&lon=43.7063599&z=9&l=0&m=b which is a "completely free zone" where everything is legal except murder, theft, rape and anti social behaviour. Open this up for all foreigners to invest in giving them 99 year leases. All of the construction is funded by the investors, but they pay a 10% annual levy for having the free zone to the central government (which is used to fund the Iraqi ministries like defence). The activities can include (but not limited to):
liquor,
drugs (all types, hard and soft can be grown and consumed within the free zone)
Prostitution
Gambling
night clubs
Money Laundering (but not from inside Iraq, only sourced from outside Iraq).
Stem Cell Research
Commercial Organ donations and transplants
Uncensored website hosting
Uncensored media hosting and transmission
All religions allowed (including cults)
All political organisations allowed (including terrorist/nazi etc)
Homosexuality legalised
Gold and diamond trading and processing (no questions asked)
Ivory/furs etc... trading and processing legalised
All types of banking/investments/derivatives allowed.
Everyone, from any country is allowed to enter sincity baghdad without visa.
basically all activities that may be restricted in other countries are acceptable (with the exception of murder/rape/theft/loutishness).

The initial 24 points sound promising. However I would recommend some minor alterations.

1- Government salaries are limited to 2x minimum wage (including MPs)
I think 2 x minimum wage is too low. I think no more than 2x average wage is more realistic and fair if we have a government that functions as it should.

5- No more subsidised electricity or ration programme
The elderly and widows should be an exception to this rule in my opinion (although I'm sure some people will find a way of exploiting such a policy to get free electricity).


11- Local neighbourhoods are responsible for contracting refuse removal / street cleaning (either within their community, or using a contractor). Failure to comply can result in quarantine of that area from any public services until its cleaned up.
I would prefer a UK-like council tax system that is locally run for each neighbourhood. (with widows and the elderly exempt once again)

14- Eliminate all "foreign studentships" and "bi3that" and bring all necessary expertise in country instead, to eliminate the many funding the lifestyle and personal aspiration of the few.
I think bringing all necessary expertise to the country is important but I think scholarships also have their benefits, especially at these times when Iraq is 30 years behind the rest of the world in areas such as research and development.

24- "Collective guilt" principle for murder and terrorism crimes (similar to old fashioned tribal laws) to eliminate terrorism by local actors and eliminate the aiding and abbeting for foreign terrorists coming into Iraq (by collective it means immediate family held liable for crimes, forcing them to report in terrorists before a crime is committed). - This is an "emergency law" that can be repealed by a simple majority after a period of 5 years in a public plebliscite and return Iraq to International norms in criminal laws.
This sounds a little extreme as often the families are not at fault and infact are completely unaware of crimes commited by individuals within the family.

25- I'm not sure a free zone on the lake Razazza (next to Karbala one of the holiest sites in Iraq) is such a good idea. I was hoping a NEW Karbala city could be built there instead. A modern metropolis on the lake rather than having modern structures overshadowing the shrines in old karbala ruining the current atmosphere of the old city. Thats not to say that the old city should be neglected and abandoned, these areas need to be brought to the 21st century too, but in a culturally sensitive way.

26- An Iraqi national health service needs to be established that provides healthcare that is free at the point of use for all Iraqi citizens. (Free prescriptions for the elderly, widows and chronically ill)

The initial 24 points sound promising. However I would recommend some minor alterations.

1- Government salaries are limited to 2x minimum wage (including MPs)
I think 2 x minimum wage is too low. I think no more than 2x average wage is more realistic and fair if we have a government that functions as it should.

I think it gives the government a good incentive to raise minimum wages to a "living wage" (which also has the effect of justifying elimination of social security and subsidies)

5- No more subsidised electricity or ration programme
The elderly and widows should be an exception to this rule in my opinion (although I'm sure some people will find a way of exploiting such a policy to get free electricity).

Setup free care homes for elderly who can't afford to pay for food or electricity. This also creates employment opportunity for carers (mainly women).

11- Local neighbourhoods are responsible for contracting refuse removal / street cleaning (either within their community, or using a contractor). Failure to comply can result in quarantine of that area from any public services until its cleaned up.
I would prefer a UK-like council tax system that is locally run for each neighbourhood. (with widows and the elderly exempt once again)

Iraq is not britain, nothing works in Iraq without a stick, so a punishment "mechanism" has to be put in place to force neighbourhoods to comply, collection can be done by "councils" as you suggest, which is a good idea, but the key is the stick.

I don't see the special "widows and elderly" exemption once again. There should be social houses available for the very poor or elderly to go to. Widows (if they are of working age) should go out and work like everyone else (unless they have some relatives or their own private savings to live off). Once again. the insidious disease of social security and benefit entitlement rears its head. NOBODY should starve or sleep on the streets. But there should be no free money handed out to able bodied people AT ALL. Disabled and elderly, if they need help, can move to a care home where everything is paid for from national resources.

14- Eliminate all "foreign studentships" and "bi3that" and bring all necessary expertise in country instead, to eliminate the many funding the lifestyle and personal aspiration of the few.
I think bringing all necessary expertise to the country is important but I think scholarships also have their benefits, especially at these times when Iraq is 30 years behind the rest of the world in areas such as research and development.

They have benefits only for the people who take them. Most of them don't study seriously (having fun in europe/US) and others simply end up never returning to Iraq and Iraq loses all that money down the drain for the benefit of the few. Never allow those at public expense at all. for the price of one year's worth of "scholarships" I could setup a dozens of top quality research centres in Iraq, and hire specific foreigners to run research programs if need be inside Iraq.

24- "Collective guilt" principle for murder and terrorism crimes (similar to old fashioned tribal laws) to eliminate terrorism by local actors and eliminate the aiding and abbeting for foreign terrorists coming into Iraq (by collective it means immediate family held liable for crimes, forcing them to report in terrorists before a crime is committed). - This is an "emergency law" that can be repealed by a simple majority after a period of 5 years in a public plebliscite and return Iraq to International norms in criminal laws.
This sounds a little extreme as often the families are not at fault and infact are completely unaware of crimes commited by individuals within the family.

That is true. But this law would certainly make sure that people start to question their sons movements a bit more zealously. And its nothing strange for Iraq. they are used to "tribal law" which is essentially similar.

25- I'm not sure a free zone on the lake Razazza (next to Karbala one of the holiest sites in Iraq) is such a good idea. I was hoping a NEW Karbala city could be built there instead. A modern metropolis on the lake rather than having modern structures overshadowing the shrines in old karbala ruining the current atmosphere of the old city. Thats not to say that the old city should be neglected and abandoned, these areas need to be brought to the 21st century too, but in a culturally sensitive way.

I didn't intend this zone to be near karbala at all. There's a good 30-40km between the "sin city baghdad" and Karbala.

27 - Eradicate illiteracy. Every Iraqi must be able to pass a basic test (with the essential education required to function in a modern society (read, write, basic maths)). If they are unable to pass the test they will be provided with free compulsary education (unless they are 60+) in order to acquire an ID card. This will put an end to men obstructing their wives/daughters/sisters from being educated.

Widows with young children will have difficulty working. I agree, if their social circumstances permit they should be strongly encouraged to work. However, regardless of whether they work or not I think they should still be entitled to additional benefits.

28 - Anti-corruption initiative
Iraqi volunteers should exert their efforts into exposing corrupt individuals regardless of whether they work in the private or public sector.

For example, undercover volunteers should use tape recorders and other means at their disposal to catch all those who request or pay bribes etc.... If enough volunteers catch enough high profile people and this is well publicised, everyone will fear exposure and this could dramatically reduce the level of corruption in Iraq.

27 is very good.

28 can be added to 10 maybe?

also with regards to widows. Children should have the ability to go to good quality nurseries while their mothers work. This creates jobs for the mother (whichever sector it may be) as well as another job in the nurseries (where the children spend the day). This also ensures that children follow a good curiculum in education / food / hygene from a very young age as well as be able to read/write/sing/dance before they even start school. All this creates more JOB opportunities too.

27 is very good.

28 can be added to 10 maybe?

also with regards to widows. Children should have the ability to go to good quality nurseries while their mothers work. This creates jobs for the mother (whichever sector it may be) as well as another job in the nurseries (where the children spend the day). This also ensures that children follow a good curiculum in education / food / hygene from a very young age as well as be able to read/write/sing/dance before they even start school. All this creates more JOB opportunities too.

Agreed

a key question. Should healthcare and basic education be completely free? and if so, how should it be funded?

a key question. Should healthcare and basic education be completely free? and if so, how should it be funded?

Since when was it humane to put a price on one's health and right to education. Yes, of course it should be free, and it should be funded by the government, they have enough money in their pockets to look after every citizen in Iraq. Whether they choose to do so is a different matter.

Bearing in mind the majority of Iraqis are in desolate poverty, for example how are widowed mothers of children with illnesses requiring concrete medication expected to pay for such basic rights? If money is required of people in such situations, then Iraq will be a cycle of forever poverty with no hope of improvement.

Ok. So you made the case for healthcare and education to be free. How should it be funded?

The government as i already mentioned, i can't imagine anyone else preparing to fund this proposition. The rich of Iraq (excluding those reeping the benefits in office) have left there is nothing but the poor left.

higher education shouldn't be free.. but generous subsidies/ student loans should be provided IMHO

The government as i already mentioned, i can't imagine anyone else preparing to fund this proposition. The rich of Iraq (excluding those reeping the benefits in office) have left there is nothing but the poor left.

Have you read the first bits of the manifesto. The oil money doesn't go to the government anymore. So the government gets money from taxes, state industries, import duties and levies on the "Baghdad sin city". Would that be enough to pay for the army, judiciary/courts/prisons, as well as all the schools and hospitals (and their payroll)?

An idea is that the prison system should be self funding (from proceeds of the labour of prisoners), but the judiciary should not be (to avoid them throwing people in prison for financial benefit!). However would that free up enough money for healthcare and education?

Education: Primary and secondary school should be free, this is to ensure that everyone get's a basic education! basic education would be funded from a tax paid by the people, it's either extra taxes or oil money. Higher education should not be free, instead there should be tuition fees loan and maintenance loans to cover university costs, this must be provided by the government with no interest building on the loans, that way the government get's taxes from the university by paying the tuition fees for the students directly to the university, students will pay back the loans gradually after graduating and earning more than a certain amount of money. This way the government get's more money then they gave up and get's the countries youth educated. The amount of loans you receive for higher education depends on your families income, people from low income families will be entitled to the full amount where as people with high income will get less.

Health: This is a tough one, maybe have a scale? people with a low income get free health care, middle-class people get some help and the rich people don't get any help?

Have you read the first bits of the manifesto. The oil money doesn't go to the government anymore. So the government gets money from taxes, state industries, import duties and levies on the "Baghdad sin city". Would that be enough to pay for the army, judiciary/courts/prisons, as well as all the schools and hospitals (and their payroll)?

An idea is that the prison system should be self funding (from proceeds of the labour of prisoners), but the judiciary should not be (to avoid them throwing people in prison for financial benefit!). However would that free up enough money for healthcare and education?

No i have not. Why should the army, judiciary, prisons come before schools and hospitals, citizen health should come first above all else, always. Im not suggesting to abandon all other sectors but prioritise the important one's first.

Education: Primary and secondary school should be free, this is to ensure that everyone get's a basic education! basic education would be funded from a tax paid by the people, it's either extra taxes or oil money. Higher education should not be free, instead there should be tuition fees loan and maintenance loans to cover university costs, this must be provided by the government with no interest building on the loans, that way the government get's taxes from the university by paying the tuition fees for the students directly to the university, students will pay back the loans gradually after graduating and earning more than a certain amount of money. This way the government get's more money then they gave up and get's the countries youth educated. The amount of loans you receive for higher education depends on your families income, people from low income families will be entitled to the full amount where as people with high income will get less.

Health: This is a tough one, maybe have a scale? people with a low income get free health care, middle-class people get some help and the rich people don't get any help?

I agree, this is similar to the policy practised in the UK.

I agree, this is similar to the policy practised in the UK.

Non of that will ever happen unless there is a properly functioning department for work and pensining, where you can just send your own special code (similar to the NI number in the UK) this code could be used by various departments (can be by banks, employees, universities etc) and they will know all the information required by typing the code into the system. There needs to be a proper computerized system, that way there will be less corruption as it'll be easier to keep track on.

Non of that will ever happen unless there is a properly functioning department for work and pensining, where you can just send your own special code (similar to the NI number in the UK) this code could be used by various departments (can be by banks, employees, universities etc) and they will know all the information required by typing the code into the system. There needs to be a proper computerized system, that way there will be less corruption as it'll be easier to keep track on.

Of course, but again this will all come at a cost but it will be worth it in the long run, better system = better living, i guess we can add it to the list of the many to-do-things.

Of course, but again this will all come at a cost but it will be worth it in the long run, better system = better living, i guess we can add it to the list of the many to-do-things.

Well it's an investment, investing in the future, people back home live for today and don't care about tomorrow, what surprises me the most is that most of the politicians in Iraq hold European degrees for example bahram salih got his doctorate in the U.K why are they not using the U.K model is beyond me.

Well it's an investment, investing in the future, people back home live for today and don't care about tomorrow, what surprises me the most is that most of the politicians in Iraq hold European degrees for example bahram salih got his doctorate in the U.K why are they not using the U.K model is beyond me.

Beats me :dunno: It's a real shame, they do have the expertise (those who have been in exile and like you said have studied in Europe) and have the means to change things around, so why not?? I think that it goes without saying that the " why fix something that isn't broken? mentality" is prevalent amongst 99% of Iraq's politicians.

Well since the entire discussion is about the manifesto. It would be prudent to read it first and make suggestions on it. One of the key points is a universal Id system as a Foundation stone for e governance and anti corruption measure (as well as tax and social security purpose).

Of course using the uk is an interesting example. The uk is bankrupt today isn't it? Due to the labour borrow and spend madness. Perhaps we should avoid that particular route for Iraq.

As for the exiles who were in uk, they were all LIVING on the social security rather than understanding how the funding for it came about... And they are certainly destroying iraqs economy by emulating the insane levels of social spending that the uk had (which they used to use and abuse, but never personally understood nor paid into).

As for the importance of army/police/judiciary, these are the foundations for a state upon which other services and industries are able to function peacefully. They ARE more important than universal healthcare from a governmental structure perspective. Without them you simply wouldnt be able to have any of the schools and hospitals you speak of,

Well since the entire discussion is about the manifesto. It would be prudent to read it first and make suggestions on it. One of the key points is a universal Id system as a Foundation stone for e governance and anti corruption measure (as well as tax and social security purpose).

Of course using the uk is an interesting example. The uk is bankrupt today isn't it? Due to the labour borrow and spend madness. Perhaps we should avoid that particular route for Iraq.

As for the exiles who were in uk, they were all LIVING on the social security rather than understanding how the funding for it came about... And they are certainly destroying iraqs economy by emulating the insane levels of social spending that the uk had (which they used to use and abuse, but never personally understood nor paid into).


Ok, so i have some reading to do before i contribute further to this topic.

In simple terms i answered your question without taking other matter's into account, my answer is based on what i believe is the better option to serve basic human rights, so the UK is not in the best state as of now but which country is in your opinion?

Although i do agree that the day the UK gets rid of social security benefits is the day it will get back on it's feet, for this is partial if not more reasoning as to why our economy is heading down south.

As for the importance of army/police/judiciary, these are the foundations for a state upon which other services and industries are able to function peacefully. They ARE more important than universal healthcare from a governmental structure perspective. Without them you simply wouldnt be able to have any of the schools and hospitals you speak of,

Of course i do not disregard their level of importance but i fail to recognise how Iraq can move forward with this kind of thinking, you cannot build an army/police or even a democratic judicial system with a dying retarded nation. The people are just as important as those "protecting" them. In my honest opinion i will always believe that education and health takes precedence above those mentioned earlier.

Anyhow what is your stance on all of this? lol

Well since the entire discussion is about the manifesto. It would be prudent to read it first and make suggestions on it. One of the key points is a universal Id system as a Foundation stone for e governance and anti corruption measure (as well as tax and social security purpose).

Of course using the uk is an interesting example. The uk is bankrupt today isn't it? Due to the labour borrow and spend madness. Perhaps we should avoid that particular route for Iraq.

As for the exiles who were in uk, they were all LIVING on the social security rather than understanding how the funding for it came about... And they are certainly destroying iraqs economy by emulating the insane levels of social spending that the uk had (which they used to use and abuse, but never personally understood nor paid into).

As for the importance of army/police/judiciary, these are the foundations for a state upon which other services and industries are able to function peacefully. They ARE more important than universal healthcare from a governmental structure perspective. Without them you simply wouldnt be able to have any of the schools and hospitals you speak of,

Sheytan the UK got in to this situation becuase the UK fighting two wars and not becuase their system is bad, on the contrary the UK system is a very good one. The government finances students and get's a return from it in terms of tax from the universities (more students = more tax) and then when ever the students earn more than 15k they start to gradually pay back, (more people with degrees = more high paid people = more tax) and so over all this investment on the governments side is a good one.

The UK benefits are not insane they are only insane if you can't speak English or have a genuine excuse to not work, you'll only get benefits if you are willing to work and willing to accept help from the job center to work, though one thing I hate about it is that full time students don't get help, I practically live on 30 pounds a week in London .

kurd123 I used to live in the UK so I know very well that its corrupted to the core, mismanagement, real-estate bubble that sapped the economy from productive industries, wealth transfer from the young to the old, that is the UK in a sentence, its a catastrophe! but the iraqi politicos don't realise it because it didn't seem that way to them in the DSS queue. :D (i'm in london right now actually LOL).

I will post an updated "manifesto" and also a 10 year "plan of action".

kurd123 I used to live in the UK so I know very well that its corrupted to the core, mismanagement, real-estate bubble that sapped the economy from productive industries, wealth transfer from the young to the old, that is the UK in a sentence, its a catastrophe! but the iraqi politicos don't realise it because it didn't seem that way to them in the DSS queue. :D (i'm in london right now actually LOL).

I will post an updated "manifesto" and also a 10 year "plan of action".

LOL well I guess I'm still young to experience the corrupted system in the UK :banana:

London is getting more and more expensive to live in, it costs me 12.40 every week to get the bus to college, and 5 pound a day to eat something so that I don't die lol... and all I get is 30 pound a week, can't get any job becuase for every interview I go to there are a bunch of graduates applying to, so yeah it sucks for students right now.

here's the updated text incorporating the new suggestions.

Manifesto for a new Iraq

1- Government salaries are limited to 2x minimum wage (including MPs)

2- Government is funded by taxation from Corporate, income and import duties/taxes, taxes from "baghdad sin city" and not oil revenue

3- Oil money is put into a fund that invests in state and joint-stock companies and services in Iraq.

4- All ID cards replaced by one universal ID card with full biometric information.

5- No more subsidised electricity or ration programme

6- All government budgets have to be within the confines of what can be raised through taxation / levies, which are limited to 80% of "world average" to keep Iraq competitive.

7- Deficit is limited to a maximum of 5% for one year, reducing by 1% for each subsequent year.

8- Import duties levied on all produce that can be produced in Iraq, up to a maximum of 100% (in order to keep local manufacturers competitive). Exemptions are only given to areas where Iraq cannot produce its own alternative at an economical price.

9- Lawfare unit in the foreign ministry established to fight Iraq's cause against countries who are harming Iraq, both legally and using international PR.

10- Government employees are employees of the people, and online networks can be used by citizens to raise complaints and vote down / remove corrupt/incompetent/criminal state employees from minister down to street cleaner.
Anti-corruption initiative
Iraqi volunteers should exert their efforts into exposing corrupt individuals regardless of whether they work in the private or public sector.
For example, undercover volunteers should use tape recorders and other means at their disposal to catch all those who request or pay bribes etc.... If enough volunteers catch enough high profile people and this is well publicised, everyone will fear exposure and this could dramatically reduce the level of corruption in Iraq.

11- Local neighbourhoods are responsible for contracting refuse removal / street cleaning (either within their community, or using a contractor). Failure to comply can result in quarantine of that area from any public services until its cleaned up.

12- Punitive penalties for all anti-social behaviour including, littering, graffiti, dirty shops, illegal stalls, illegal parking, breaking public property, dirty cars / houses (external) etc... make the salaries of policemen tied to a monthly "catch" as well as higher bonus for reducing offence rates. Police pay from these penalties, at the same time citizens have the right to overturn and highlight police abuse using an electronic system with a local court for small claims (consistently bad policemen given extremely punitive jail terms to deter them from false claims) - police must provide video/photo evidence of offences.

13- Make democracy universal, with people's universal IDs they should be able to vote on services, policies, members of parliament, quality of services as well as create new topics with a threshold for raising it to parliament once enough votes are included.

14- Education: Eliminate all "foreign studentships" and "bi3that" and bring all necessary expertise in country instead, to eliminate the many funding the lifestyle and personal aspiration of the few.
Eradicate illiteracy. Every Iraqi must be able to pass a basic test (with the essential education required to function in a modern society (read, write, basic maths)). If they are unable to pass the test they will be provided with free compulsory education (unless they are 60+) in order to acquire an ID card. This will put an end to men obstructing their wives/daughters/sisters from being educated.
Children should have the ability to go to good quality nurseries while their mothers work. This creates jobs for the mother (whichever sector it may be) as well as another job in the nurseries (where the children spend the day). This also ensures that children follow a good curiculum in education / food / hygene from a very young age as well as be able to read/write/sing/dance before they even start school. All this creates more JOB opportunities too.

15- Guaranteed minimum wage job for every citizen who needs a job. (but no handouts). The "Oil fund" is used to create economically viable and sustainable jobs for all the unemployed with immediate effect as the handouts are taken away.

16- The government has to regulate all private and joint stock companies, in line with international and newly created national standards.

17- The "Oil fund" has to invest in medium to long term public-private initiatives where commercial or private funding is insufficient. The criteria is that the service provided has to be usefull for society and has a Return over the long term (20 years). Such projects include, desalination, solar electricity, mass housing projects, roads and urban railways, phosphates and cement, ports, etc...

18- Part of the oil fund (5%) is used to invest in Research & Development of technologies where Iraq has a potential edge (not reinventing the wheel). Encourage and promote the technology leapfrogging of Iraq to surpass the world in a number of key pillars of technologies.
Solar power generation
solar air conditioning,
solar powered vehicles,
desert farming,
medical/pharmaceutical/biotech,
optics,
desalination
modern power storage / transmission techniques.
Chemical/petrochemical technologies utilising with Iraqi raw materials
etc... The research can use up to 20% foreign experts, but they must be based physically in Iraq.

19- Iraq should stop pegging the dinar to the USD and let it float freely. Also invest the USD reserves into local joint stock industries to eliminate imports where its economically viable (farming, power generation, light industries, cement, bricks, to begin with...).

20- Iraqi defence Ministry's budget limited to 3% of GDP. All defence ministry purchases from abroad (expensive weapons) must be accompanied by a 100% offset deal in a NON-PETROCHEMICAL industry, in order to offset the high cost of weapons.

21- All ministries are dissolved and replaced with simple "regulatory authorities" that have to be funded within the limits of what can be raised from taxes. They are not allowed a single penny from oil revenues.

22- The only remaining "ministries" are defence (interior is merged with it), foreign ministry and Economic ministry (finance / oil ministry merged together). The Higher education and education ministries are dissolved and replaced by an "education standards regulator", ditto for electricity, health etc...

23- Political freedom for all, and a general amnesty to pre and post 2003 exiles.

24- "Collective guilt" principle for murder and terrorism crimes (similar to old fashioned tribal laws) to eliminate terrorism by local actors and eliminate the aiding and abbeting for foreign terrorists coming into Iraq (by collective it means immediate family held liable for crimes, forcing them to report in terrorists before a crime is committed). - This is an "emergency law" that can be repealed by a simple majority after a period of 5 years in a public plebliscite and return Iraq to International norms in criminal laws.

25-Create a large free zone on the lake Razazza south west of Baghdad "Sin City Baghdad" http://wikimapia.org/#lat=32.8588252...99&z=9&l=0&m=b which is a "completely free zone" where everything is legal except murder, theft, rape and anti social behaviour. Open this up for all foreigners to invest in giving them 99 year leases. All of the construction is funded by the investors, but they pay a 10% annual levy for having the free zone to the central government (which is used to fund the Iraqi ministries like defence). The activities can include (but not limited to):
liquor,
drugs (all types, hard and soft can be grown and consumed within the free zone)
Prostitution
Gambling
night clubs
Money Laundering (but not from inside Iraq, only sourced from outside Iraq).
Stem Cell Research
Commercial Organ donations and transplants
Uncensored website hosting
Uncensored media hosting and transmission
All religions allowed (including cults)
All political organisations allowed (including terrorist/nazi etc)
Homosexuality legalised
Gold and diamond trading and processing (no questions asked)
Ivory/furs etc... trading and processing legalised
All types of banking/investments/derivatives allowed.
Everyone, from any country is allowed to enter sincity baghdad without visa.
basically all activities that may be restricted in other countries are acceptable (with the exception of murder/rape/theft/loutishness).

26- Healthcare: An Iraqi national health service needs to be established that provides healthcare that is free at the point of use for all Iraqi citizens. (Free prescriptions for the elderly, widows and chronically ill). This is paid from taxes and managed by a "national health company" funded from oil sales.

27 - Prison system self-funding through prisoner labour use. However any abuse against prisoners results in litigation against low and high end prison staff. All prisoners have access to the electronic system to complain and vote on issues like other citizens, they are also entitled to keep 40% of the minimum wage for the work they do, given to them on their release.

So are we going to present this manifesto to anyone ? LOL

Maybe we should start a SSC political party and run in the next elections !l

any additions and amendments?

even if it doesn't get through, point 25 would make an excellent movie, blockbuster material for sure.

Iraq diverts F-16 budget for food rations


BAGHDAD — Iraq has postponed the planned purchase of 18 F-16 fighter planes from the United States this year and diverted the funds to feeding the poor, an official said on Monday, amid growing protests that have been inspired by the uprisings in Egypt and Tunisia.

"The F-16 contract has been postponed this year and the money has been diverted toward improving food rations" for the poor, government spokesman Ali Dabbagh told AFP.

"Mo more fighter contract," he added.

"In the new draft budget for 2011 that was presented to us, $900 million was earmarked for the purchase of F-16s, which will be used to finance rations and social benefits," confirmed Mohammed Khalil, a Kurdish MP who is a member of parliament's finance committee.

"We had to make choices because of the budget deficit," he added.

This year's draft budget projects spending at $81.86 billion and revenues of $68.56 billion, leaving a $13.3 billion deficit.

In an interview with AFP this month Prime Minister Nuri al-Maliki said that six million Iraqis possessed food ration permits, entitling them to the full quota of subsidised essentials. He said his government would increase the total amount spent on food rations for the needy from $3 billion to $4 billion.

For more than a year, Iraq has been engaged in talks with the United States for F-16 fighters to protect its airspace after the planned departure of US forces at the end of this year which will leave Iraq without air cover.

Brigadier General Jeffrey Buchanan, the spokesman for US forces in Iraq, told AFP this month that the full package of the F-16 deal was worth $3 billion, and the version on offer was the Block 52 model.

"The long-term value of the offer for the 18 aircraft was $3 billion, including the aircraft, ammunition, spare parts, training and everything else, including avionics and electronics," Buchanan said.

Protests over irregular deliveries of rations and lack of basic services like electricity have sparked protests around Iraq that have multiplied since uprisings in Tunisia and Egypt toppled entrenched dictatorships in those countries.

I'm all for feeding the poor people, how about cutting MP salaries before compromising our air defense (which will be vacant once the USA is out)??

I'm all for feeding the poor people, how about cutting MP salaries before compromising our air defense (which will be vacant once the USA is out)??

ermm. MP salaries + Expenses = $75k per month (I am using the "highest" figure for the sake of argument). It would be about $300M per year.

We can easily cut this to $50M per year, freeing up $250M for the populace.

That would be about $1 per month per person. Enough for an extra kilo of rice or beans in the ration program. not much for you or me but something for the poor.


As for the F16s (and 18 mirage F1 MF2000s). Iraq would not have received those before 2013 anyway, and they would hardly have protected Iraq from any neighbours anyway.

Now maliki has the perfect opportunity to announce the retention of US forces in Iraq until 2020 - even the sadrists can't argue against it now :D

These fighters would have cost $900M for F16s and $500M for Mirages. That $1.4B could have funded quite a bit of reconstruction... but instead it will be, once again, spent on social security (spending money to keep the people idle and country in ruins!!! how INSANE).

ermm. MP salaries + Expenses = $75k per month (I am using the "highest" figure for the sake of argument). It would be about $300M per year.

We can easily cut this to $50M per year, freeing up $250M for the populace.

That would be about $1 per month per person. Enough for an extra kilo of rice or beans in the ration program. not much for you or me but something for the poor.


As for the F16s (and 18 mirage F1 MF2000s). Iraq would not have received those before 2013 anyway, and they would hardly have protected Iraq from any neighbours anyway.

Now maliki has the perfect opportunity to announce the retention of US forces in Iraq until 2020 - even the sadrists can't argue against it now :D

These fighters would have cost $900M for F16s and $500M for Mirages. That $1.4B could have funded quite a bit of reconstruction... but instead it will be, once again, spent on social security (spending money to keep the people idle and country in ruins!!! how INSANE).

Why not use that money to build some infrastructure that will bring in jobs....!

Why not use that money to build some infrastructure that will bring in jobs....!

common sense is not common (especially among Iraq's political elite!) not to mention the iraqi populace "votes for" social security over and above reconstruction / jobs. That is a FACT. Iraqis want to freeload.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20110220/wl_mideast_afp/iraqpoliticsparliament

Iraqi parliament stays classy.

First class a**holes

There is no excuse for getting such a high pay.. high pay is meant to reduce the temptation for reciving bribes.. which is ironic since we rank amongst the worst on the planet in this regard

UPDATED>



1-Oil Money
a, All oil Money put into a "Iraq Fund" which manages investments in Iraqi industries and services.
b, Investments must be in Iraqi owned industries.
c, Investment decisions must be for commercially viable industries and in line with Iraq's development plans.



2-Government Funding and spending
a, Government is funded by taxation on businesses and employees.
b, Government also receives funding from Levies on imports and levies from "Baghdad Sin City" and other free zones.
c, Most government ministerial jobs are reorganised and delegated to companies as opposed to industries with a new set of commercial standard employment contracts for employees.
d, Government employees are limited to a maximum of 2x minimum wage
e, expenses are limited to a maximum of 25% of salary.
f, Taxes (except import duties) are restricted to "world mean average" to keep government from overtaxing industries and re-creating a bloated government structure.
g, Government borrowing is limited to a maximum of 5% of government budget for the first year, declining by 1% for each subsequent year.
h, Import duties levied on all produce that can be produced in Iraq, up to a maximum of 100% (in order to keep local manufacturers competitive). Exemptions are only given to areas where Iraq cannot produce its own alternative at an economical price.
i, Most ministries are dissolved and replaced with simple "regulatory authorities" that have to be funded within the limits of what can be raised from taxes. They are not allowed a single penny from oil revenues.The only remaining "ministries" are defence (interior is merged with it), foreign ministry and Economic ministry (finance / oil ministry merged together). The Higher education and education ministries are dissolved and replaced by an "education standards regulator", ditto for electricity, health etc...



3-State and Joint Stock Enterprises
a,All current state enterprises rebuilt through fund and foreign expertise injection by the "Iraq Fund"
b,Additional enterprises setup for different services including:
-Renewable Energy for power generation
-Energy efficient water desalination
-Modern farming techniques and soil remediation
-Silicon, Optics and other industries where Iraq has potential advantages
-Rail and Light rail production and rollout throughout Iraq
-Low cost housing projects managed and leased to tenants.
c,The government has to regulate all private and joint stock companies, in line with international and newly created national standards.
d,The "Oil fund" has to invest in medium to long term public-private initiatives where commercial or private funding is insufficient. The criteria is that the service provided has to be usefull for society and has a Return over the long term (20 years).


4-Universal ID system
a,All ID cards replaced by one universal ID card with full biometric information.
b,Make democracy universal, with people's universal IDs they should be able to vote on services, policies, members of parliament, quality of services as well as create new topics with a threshold for raising it to parliament once enough votes are included.



5-Employment laws
a, Guaranteed minimum wage job for every citizen who needs a job. (but no handouts). The "Oil fund" is used to create economically viable and sustainable jobs for all the unemployed with immediate effect as the handouts are taken away.
b, Government employees are employees of the people, and online networks can be used by citizens to raise complaints and vote down / remove corrupt/incompetent/criminal state employees from minister down to street cleaner.



6-Subsidies
a, No more subsidised electricity or ration programme
b, Iraq should stop pegging the dinar to the USD and let it float freely. Also invest the USD reserves into local joint stock industries to eliminate imports where its economically viable (farming, power generation, light industries, cement, bricks, to begin with...).



7-Local Services
a, Local neighbourhoods are responsible for contracting refuse removal / street cleaning (either within their community, or using a contractor). Failure to comply can result in quarantine of that area from any public services until its cleaned up.
b, Electricity and water is supplied by the "electricity" and "water" companies at international prices and with guaranteed levels of supply and quality. Companies are liable to pay compensation for sub-standard services.
c, End users can also setup microgeneration plants and sell electricity into the national grid at an agreed commercial tariff rate.



8-Healthcare
a, An Iraqi national health service needs to be established that provides healthcare that is free at the point of use for all Iraqi citizens. (Free prescriptions for the elderly, widows and chronically ill).
b, This is paid from taxes and managed by a "national health company" funded from oil sales.



9-Education
a, Eliminate all "foreign studentships" and "bi3that" and bring all necessary expertise in country instead, to eliminate the many funding the lifestyle and personal aspiration of the few.
b, Eradicate illiteracy. Every Iraqi must be able to pass a basic test (with the essential education required to function in a modern society (read, write, basic maths)). If they are unable to pass the test they will be provided with free compulsory education (unless they are 60+) in order to acquire an ID card. This will put an end to men obstructing their wives/daughters/sisters from being educated.
c, Children should have the ability to go to good quality nurseries while their mothers work. This creates jobs for the mother (whichever sector it may be) as well as another job in the nurseries (where the children spend the day). This also ensures that children follow a good curiculum in education / food / hygene from a very young age as well as be able to read/write/sing/dance before they even start school. All this creates more JOB opportunities too.
d,Part of the oil fund (5%) is used to invest in Research & Development of technologies where Iraq has a potential edge (not reinventing the wheel). Encourage and promote the technology leapfrogging of Iraq to surpass the world in a number of key pillars of technologies.
Solar power generation / air conditioning / powered vehicles. desert farming, medical/pharmaceutical/biotech, optics, desalination, modern power storage / transmission techniques. Chemical/petrochemical technologies utilising with Iraqi raw materials etc... The research can use up to 20% foreign experts, but they must be based physically in Iraq.



10-Law and Order
a, Death penalty and repossession of all properties and wealth of extended family for corruption above $10k. Hard labour for corruption below $10k.
b, 10 day "amnesty" period for corrupt officials who return stolen cash during which all banking and travel in and out of the country is forbidden.
c, Punitive penalties for all anti-social behaviour including, littering, graffiti, dirty shops, illegal stalls, illegal parking, breaking public property, dirty cars / houses (external) etc... make the salaries of policemen tied to a monthly "catch" as well as higher bonus for reducing offence rates. Police pay from these penalties, at the same time citizens have the right to overturn and highlight police abuse using an electronic system with a local court for small claims (consistently bad policemen given extremely punitive jail terms to deter them from false claims) - police must provide video/photo evidence of offences.
d, Political freedom for all, and a general amnesty to pre and post 2003 exiles.
e, "Collective guilt" principle for murder and terrorism crimes (similar to old fashioned tribal laws) to eliminate terrorism by local actors and eliminate the aiding and abbeting for foreign terrorists coming into Iraq (by collective it means immediate family held liable for crimes, forcing them to report in terrorists before a crime is committed). - This is an "emergency law" that can be repealed by a simple majority after a period of 5 years in a public plebliscite and return Iraq to International norms in criminal laws.
f, Prison system self-funding through prisoner labour use. However any abuse against prisoners results in litigation against low and high end prison staff. All prisoners have access to the electronic system to complain and vote on issues like other citizens, they are also entitled to keep 40% of the minimum wage for the work they do, given to them on their release.




11-Military and foreign relations
a, Lawfare unit in the foreign ministry established to fight Iraq's cause against countries who are harming Iraq, both legally and using international PR.
b, Iraqi defence Ministry's budget limited to 3% of GDP.
c, All defence ministry purchases from abroad (expensive weapons) must be accompanied by a 100% offset deal in a NON-PETROCHEMICAL industry, in order to offset the high cost of weapons.



12-Create a large free zone on the lake Razazza south west of Baghdad "Sin City Baghdad"http://wikimapia.org/#lat=32.8588252...99&z=9&l=0&m=b which is a "completely free zone" where everything is legal except murder, theft, rape and anti social behaviour. Open this up for all foreigners to invest in giving them 99 year leases. All of the construction is funded by the investors, but they pay a 10% annual levy for having the free zone to the central government (which is used to fund the Iraqi ministries like defence). The activities can include (but not limited to):
liquor,
drugs (all types, hard and soft can be grown and consumed within the free zone)
Prostitution
Gambling
night clubs
Money Laundering (but not from inside Iraq, only sourced from outside Iraq).
Stem Cell Research
Commercial Organ donations and transplants
Uncensored website hosting
Uncensored media hosting and transmission
All religions allowed (including cults)
All political organisations allowed (including terrorist/nazi etc)
Homosexuality legalised
Gold and diamond trading and processing (no questions asked)
Ivory/furs etc... trading and processing legalised
All types of banking/investments/derivatives allowed.
Everyone, from any country is allowed to enter sincity baghdad without visa.
basically all activities that may be restricted in other countries are acceptable (with the exception of murder/rape/theft/loutishness).

the dinosaurs of iraqi politics are still having their "personal vendettas" played out as the "real crisis" whilst the country can go f*ck itself.
Ex-Iraq PM backs out of chairing key body
(AFP) – 4 hours ago
BAGHDAD — Iyad Allawi, leader of the bloc that won the most seats in Iraq's 2010 elections, said on Wednesday that he will not chair a supervisory body that he was to have headed as part of a power-sharing deal.
The National Council on Strategic Policies was to be created as a sop to Allawi when rival Nuri al-Maliki was nominated to a second term as prime minister in November, and was intended to constrain Maliki's powers by providing a body for other politicians to make decisions on major issues.
It has yet to be established, though, as a law required to bring it into existence has not been passed.
"I will not participate in the national council," the former premier said in an interview with the Al-Rasheed satellite television channel to be broadcast later on Wednesday. Key quotes were provided beforehand to AFP.
"This is a final decision, and Iraqiya can choose another person instead of me," he said, referring to his Iraqiya bloc which won 91 seats in the 325-member parliament, two more than Maliki's State of Law coalition.
Allawi attributed his decision to "the lack of implementation of the national partnership agreement."
The narrow margin after the March 2010 election led to months of political deadlock before a power-sharing agreement was finally agreed in November, with a government named the following month with Maliki at its head.

Politicians break away from Iraqia bloc in Iraq
English.news.cn 2011-03-07 20:46:52 FeedbackPrintRSS
BAGHDAD, March 7 (Xinhua) -- Eight politicians from the parliamentary political bloc of Iraqia have withdrew on Monday from the cross sectarian bloc, headed by former prime minister Ayad Allawi, due to political dispute.

"We have decided to withdraw from the Iraqia bloc which failed to follow its original plans that we agreed with its leaders from the beginning," Jamal al-Battikh, a leading figure in the Iraqia bloc told a news conference in Baghdad.

Battikh said that the he and seven politicians of the bloc have also decided to form a new parliamentary bloc proposed to be named "White bloc of Iraqia" which will be headed by Hassan al-Alawi, a Shiite secular politician.

For his part, al-Alawi said that his new bloc will pursue the original program of the Iraqia bloc which has been ignored by the leader of Iraqi bloc, Ayad Allawi.

"The forming of the White bloc of Iraqia is an uprising against the way of dealing with the political problems and the formation of the cabinet by the leaders of the Iraqia," al-Alawi said.

Al-Alawi ruled out that his new bloc is going into alliance with any other parliamentary blocs, attributing his stance to that his bloc is "liberal while the others are conservative blocs."

Al-Iraqia is an umbrella bloc of seven parties, including the leading National Accord Movement of Allawi himself.

The bloc gained narrow victory in March 7 elections last year, with 92 seats out of the country's 325 parliament seats. Only two seats ahead of Allawi's Shiite contender Prime Minister Nuri al- Maliki who nonetheless managed to keep his post for another four years.

On the radio they were debating whether they though the Iraqi government would ask for an extension on withdraw of US forces.

http://gulfanalysis.wordpress.com/2011/03/08/the-iraqi-parliament-declares-itself-above-the-constitution-and-its-own-laws/#comments

The Iraqi Parliament Declares Itself Above the Constitution and Its Own Laws

Posted by Reidar Visser on Tuesday, 8 March 2011 17:28

It is not a good omen: In the context of unprecedented political anger in the Iraqi streets, parliament today voted to ignore the country’s constitution and its own laws. In a ruling on the validity of deputy replacements that occurred subsequent to the formation of the Maliki government last December (i.e. deputies who joined the government and gave up their seats in parliament to be replaced by others), both constitutional and legal provisions were conveniently sidestepped.

Specifically, in today’s ruling, parliament validated the memberships in the assembly of six deputies against whom objections had been raised: Jawad al-Bulani, Faris al-Sinjari, Mina Salih Mahdi, Muhammad al-Hindawi, Abdallah Khalaf Muhammad and Jawad Ghanim al-Shuhayli. At least three of those cases (Bulani, Hindawi and Shuhayli) represent flagrant violations of the law on parliamentary replacement since the new deputies are from a different governorate than the original deputy. The constitutional provision for one deputy per 100,000 Iraqis – as reflected in the distribution key for deputies per governorates – is thereby also violated.

Additionally, there are replacement cases that should have been challenged, but haven’t. Most prominently, they include Salim al-Jibburi of Tawafuq; a Diyala candidate who replaced a Salahhadin candidate. It is also unclear what happened to Daghir al-Musawi, who was supposed to replace a National Alliance candidate of the “Hizbollah in Iraq” party, but whose name is not to be found in the latest list of parliament members. It is possible that the National Alliance changed its mind in this case; if he had been made a deputy it would have been another violation of the rules since Musawi was a candidate in Basra and not in Maysan.

What today’s vote shows is that once more the Iraqi political elite is unable to rise above camaraderie and cliquishness and make a principled stand on legal and constitutional issues. Until this tendency goes away, it seems unlikely that the assembly will be able to make the transition from serving its own interests to serving the people it is supposed to represent.

Garibo wanted to talk politics and sent me the following message.

funny how u copy pasted my statement and changing it to your beloved allawi aka the hitman u wanna talk politics im open to all doors, i admire your work in the forum for posting such amazing updates on iraqi projects but believe me its stops there.

you need to read more of my posts before sending me messages. Once again the point I was making flew by you, so I fear I must clarify the point I was conveying.

The point is that your statement is simply diabolical rhetoric of the same mud-slinging sort that you accuse others of. I edited your words to show you how you sound.

By the way, I think both allawi and maliki are illiterate, thieving donkeys (so sadly you were at least right on one aspect, that I hate maliki, but wrong, in thinking that I like allawi!). read my manifesto on SSC if you want to know what my political thoughts are.

But since you support abu sibah, I doubt if you can reason.

Gharibo,
last year, most of us had different views from Sheytan about Maliki, Government and all the politics in Iraq... but now its proved that he was right !
The thing is we all had hope in them, but they all seemed to be haramis ! and not give a crap about Iraq ..
now u will say u like baathis, well Sheytan is from Samawah, Brigdreamer didnt see his home cause of them , for me they killed my dad's uncles, and most members here dont like them .. again we dont have anything personal against baathis or anyone, we just judge based of their actions ! well atleast im talking about myself but im also kind of sure that most of the members here are like that !

Honestly I dont care who was the president ! I just want someone who WORKS ! NOT TALKS ! I would be happy if we have a speechless president/prime minister

Thanks yousifovic.

In fact I don't have such a big issue with thieves, as long as they are smart thieves. Unfortunately the political "class" in Iraq are simply mediocre, petty, squabbling, incompetent fools, who steal in a very crude and low-class fashion. That extends to all of the political class that have ruled Iraq (or been in opposition) since 1979.

I honestly think Iraq deserves better than the low class STUPID and COMPLETELY INCOMPETENT fools of baath, daawa, communist party, isci, allawi, sadr etc... etc...

finally, all these parties and their supporters care about is the fight between each other. None of them are focused on structuring and managing the country for the future. NONE.

Gharibo,
last year, most of us had different views from Sheytan about Maliki, Government and all the politics in Iraq... but now its proved that he was right !
The thing is we all had hope in them, but they all seemed to be haramis ! and not give a crap about Iraq ..
now u will say u like baathis, well Sheytan is from Samawah, Brigdreamer didnt see his home cause of them , for me they killed my dad's uncles, and most members here dont like them .. again we dont have anything personal against baathis or anyone, we just judge based of their actions ! well atleast im talking about myself but im also kind of sure that most of the members here are like that !

Honestly I dont care who was the president ! I just want someone who WORKS ! NOT TALKS ! I would be happy if we have a speechless president/prime minister


Please don't say "We", I dont share your "we"'s views.

And as far as my reading has gone in this forum (not too far), but I don't agree with him and he hasn't proven himself "right". He also can't speak with manners, as he clearly called me "disgusting"- judging without knowing.

Please don't say "We", I dont share your "we"'s views.

And as far as my reading has gone in this forum (not too far), but I don't agree with him and he hasn't proven himself "right". He also can't speak with manners, as he clearly called me "disgusting"- judging without knowing.

You are welcome to counter-argue your political points here. As for calling you "disgusting" ... here's the entire conversation and let others make their minds up on who "speaks with manners".
http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=1372643&page=5

You are welcome to counter-argue your political points here. As for calling you "disgusting" ... here's the entire conversation and let others make their minds up on who "speaks with manners".
http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=1372643&page=5

it's my opinion, i'm a girl, i dont get tattoes like that so, guys can look at my from top to bottom and check me out -.-

it's my opinion, i'm a girl, i dont get tattoes like that so, guys can look at my from top to bottom and check me out -.-

so who does not speak with manners?

its okay to joke around but in this iraqi forum i see theres alot of hate on him(maliki) nobody mentions allawi or barzani or talabani, as if he runs iraq like saddam did... alot of rumors shit talking on him saying hes iranian backed show me the proof annd what the hell was i writing made a mistake fuck al-hakim al maniuk i meant mohammed baqir al-sadr...

Ya habibi ya Garibo just for your information. See below :)

Hi not sure if this has been made but just thought it would be cool to have a thread that you can post videos/pictures that you found funny or entertaining here so we could all see it so hope this is fun and hope to see some funny stuff lets start...:)

Talibani tell jokes about himself on TV :lol:

DNJXzaXGwfo&feature

so who does not speak with manners?

surely thats a rhetorical question, the tv presenter or the people she aims to look at her?

i'll answer; the tv presenter, idc if others dont have enough gheera to admit it, but if their sisters wanted to get a tatoe like that, i doubt any will allow it. ( refering to the iraqis here)

it's my opinion, i'm a girl, i dont get tattoes like that so, guys can look at my from top to bottom and check me out -.-
i think people mostly reacted negatively to the fact that you wrote that youd "spit on her face", instead of just criticizing the tattoos. which is a little over the top when posting on a public forum, no matter if your a guy, girl, or alien. the fact that she is one of only a handful of people who represent iraq in a postive image on the international community should warrant at least a less negative comment, no matter if you agree with her body art or not.

Alyaa. WRONG ANSWER. You're the one who doesn't speak with manners. Since you called the person who's done no one any harm "disgusting" AND openly said you'd spit on her face because of the body art she chose for herself.

Yet at the same time, (trying to keep on topic for this thread LOL) You are probably a supporter of a political party which has among its leadership a cadre of:
-thieves
-murderers
-torturers
-Idiots with fake degrees in high places
etc...

whom you do not think are disgusting, and certainly do not want to spit in their faces if you met them.

Please reassess your moral compass.

we dont have anything personal against baathis

lol i gotta disagree I HATE baathis and I dislike anyone who supports them ... they have brought nothing but poverty , war and death to countries and helped noone but themselves. I wish every baathi supporter would stop being so ignorant and simply open their eyes to the fact that the baath party are scum

Everyone.

Can I please remind you of the forum rules, Sectarian and Religious debates are not allowed, and this is NOT the purpose of this forum. Although initially I didn't support having a politics thread (so such arguments don't flare up). I agreed to the idea as long as everyone treats one another with respect.

The idea of this thread as I see it is tackling political issues (such as legislation, policy and decision making), not attacking other people based on their political / religious beliefs.

if you disagree with something, please state so in a polite way, without insulting people. a simple " I disagree" will do .. no need to start trouble..

lol i gotta disagree I HATE baathis and I dislike anyone who supports them ... they have brought nothing but poverty , war and death to countries and helped noone but themselves. I wish every baathi supporter would stop being so ignorant and simply open their eyes to the fact that the baath party are scum

haha same but i meant if they were good no1 would hate them uknow..

haha same but i meant if they were good no1 would hate them uknow..

vohyat rabak i completely agree with you :)

lol i gotta disagree I HATE baathis and I dislike anyone who supports them ... they have brought nothing but poverty , war and death to countries and helped noone but themselves. I wish every baathi supporter would stop being so ignorant and simply open their eyes to the fact that the baath party are scum

+99999999999999999999999999999999999 infinite

and shaytan u dont even know what party i support, so wouldn't talk -.-

party of ali I presume :D

sheytan you're judging me you dont know me, i can reason since fyi im probably get the closest sources of parliament all the guys running the show i know them personally, maliki i met him in person in hajj. the point is, we can all argument and prove who's right or wrong. the truth is the baath will never ever see the day iraq will be in their hands again. its history thank goodness there is a GOD

met maliki in hajj back in '99

I know these people very well, been to their houses, ate dinners with them, been to the various green zone offices with them, etc... etc...

they are not fit to run a country. Since I know that absolutely none of them is qualified or experienced to do so.

whilst i know that abu israa is at least aware that he's incompetent, his army of advisors that run the show for him are no better, not at all. Most of them were selling vegetables or living on social security before being thrust in to run a country of 30M people and budget of $80Bn p/a. They are simply incompetents with fake degrees and zero real world experience for the most part! Oh, Allawi's lot aren't any better either :D Lets not even bring Hakim or Sadr's lot into the equation! 3arabanchia.


Honourable exceptions include Hussain Shahristani and Abdul Qader al Obaidi.

Others are mostly muppets.


oh and PS. there is no god. sorry to tell you Santa is not real kiddo. And I agree that the old baathis who destroyed Iraq are thankfully gone forever... shame that we need to put up with the resulting retardation that their rule caused, among which includes religious and extremist parties having the majority of power in Iraq :D

As for "judging people" look in the mirror first ;)

LAISH MA' TROUH TIG RASSEK ALA TOWFA ;) inta wain ayesh ya sheytan

Any comments, corrections, additions?



1-Oil Money
a, All oil Money put into a "Iraq Fund" which manages investments in Iraqi industries and services.
b, Investments must be in Iraqi owned industries.
c, Investment decisions must be for commercially viable industries and in line with Iraq's development plans.



2-Government Funding and spending
a, Government is funded by taxation on businesses and employees.
b, Government also receives funding from Levies on imports and levies from "Baghdad Sin City" and other free zones.
c, Most government ministerial jobs are reorganised and delegated to companies as opposed to industries with a new set of commercial standard employment contracts for employees.
d, Government employees are limited to a maximum of 2x minimum wage
e, expenses are limited to a maximum of 25% of salary.
f, Taxes (except import duties) are restricted to "world mean average" to keep government from overtaxing industries and re-creating a bloated government structure.
g, Government borrowing is limited to a maximum of 5% of government budget for the first year, declining by 1% for each subsequent year.
h, Import duties levied on all produce that can be produced in Iraq, up to a maximum of 100% (in order to keep local manufacturers competitive). Exemptions are only given to areas where Iraq cannot produce its own alternative at an economical price.
i, Most ministries are dissolved and replaced with simple "regulatory authorities" that have to be funded within the limits of what can be raised from taxes. They are not allowed a single penny from oil revenues.The only remaining "ministries" are defence (interior is merged with it), foreign ministry and Economic ministry (finance / oil ministry merged together). The Higher education and education ministries are dissolved and replaced by an "education standards regulator", ditto for electricity, health etc...



3-State and Joint Stock Enterprises
a,All current state enterprises rebuilt through fund and foreign expertise injection by the "Iraq Fund"
b,Additional enterprises setup for different services including:
-Renewable Energy for power generation
-Energy efficient water desalination
-Modern farming techniques and soil remediation
-Silicon, Optics and other industries where Iraq has potential advantages
-Rail and Light rail production and rollout throughout Iraq
-Low cost housing projects managed and leased to tenants.
c,The government has to regulate all private and joint stock companies, in line with international and newly created national standards.
d,The "Oil fund" has to invest in medium to long term public-private initiatives where commercial or private funding is insufficient. The criteria is that the service provided has to be usefull for society and has a Return over the long term (20 years).


4-Universal ID system
a,All ID cards replaced by one universal ID card with full biometric information.
b,Make democracy universal, with people's universal IDs they should be able to vote on services, policies, members of parliament, quality of services as well as create new topics with a threshold for raising it to parliament once enough votes are included.



5-Employment laws
a, Guaranteed minimum wage job for every citizen who needs a job. (but no handouts). The "Oil fund" is used to create economically viable and sustainable jobs for all the unemployed with immediate effect as the handouts are taken away.
b, Government employees are employees of the people, and online networks can be used by citizens to raise complaints and vote down / remove corrupt/incompetent/criminal state employees from minister down to street cleaner.



6-Subsidies
a, No more subsidised electricity or ration programme
b, Iraq should stop pegging the dinar to the USD and let it float freely. Also invest the USD reserves into local joint stock industries to eliminate imports where its economically viable (farming, power generation, light industries, cement, bricks, to begin with...).



7-Local Services
a, Local neighbourhoods are responsible for contracting refuse removal / street cleaning (either within their community, or using a contractor). Failure to comply can result in quarantine of that area from any public services until its cleaned up.
b, Electricity and water is supplied by the "electricity" and "water" companies at international prices and with guaranteed levels of supply and quality. Companies are liable to pay compensation for sub-standard services.
c, End users can also setup microgeneration plants and sell electricity into the national grid at an agreed commercial tariff rate.



8-Healthcare
a, An Iraqi national health service needs to be established that provides healthcare that is free at the point of use for all Iraqi citizens. (Free prescriptions for the elderly, widows and chronically ill).
b, This is paid from taxes and managed by a "national health company" funded from oil sales.



9-Education
a, Eliminate all "foreign studentships" and "bi3that" and bring all necessary expertise in country instead, to eliminate the many funding the lifestyle and personal aspiration of the few.
b, Eradicate illiteracy. Every Iraqi must be able to pass a basic test (with the essential education required to function in a modern society (read, write, basic maths)). If they are unable to pass the test they will be provided with free compulsory education (unless they are 60+) in order to acquire an ID card. This will put an end to men obstructing their wives/daughters/sisters from being educated.
c, Children should have the ability to go to good quality nurseries while their mothers work. This creates jobs for the mother (whichever sector it may be) as well as another job in the nurseries (where the children spend the day). This also ensures that children follow a good curiculum in education / food / hygene from a very young age as well as be able to read/write/sing/dance before they even start school. All this creates more JOB opportunities too.
d,Part of the oil fund (5%) is used to invest in Research & Development of technologies where Iraq has a potential edge (not reinventing the wheel). Encourage and promote the technology leapfrogging of Iraq to surpass the world in a number of key pillars of technologies.
Solar power generation / air conditioning / powered vehicles. desert farming, medical/pharmaceutical/biotech, optics, desalination, modern power storage / transmission techniques. Chemical/petrochemical technologies utilising with Iraqi raw materials etc... The research can use up to 20% foreign experts, but they must be based physically in Iraq.



10-Law and Order
a, Death penalty and repossession of all properties and wealth of extended family for corruption above $10k. Hard labour for corruption below $10k.
b, 10 day "amnesty" period for corrupt officials who return stolen cash during which all banking and travel in and out of the country is forbidden.
c, Punitive penalties for all anti-social behaviour including, littering, graffiti, dirty shops, illegal stalls, illegal parking, breaking public property, dirty cars / houses (external) etc... make the salaries of policemen tied to a monthly "catch" as well as higher bonus for reducing offence rates. Police pay from these penalties, at the same time citizens have the right to overturn and highlight police abuse using an electronic system with a local court for small claims (consistently bad policemen given extremely punitive jail terms to deter them from false claims) - police must provide video/photo evidence of offences.
d, Political freedom for all, and a general amnesty to pre and post 2003 exiles.
e, "Collective guilt" principle for murder and terrorism crimes (similar to old fashioned tribal laws) to eliminate terrorism by local actors and eliminate the aiding and abbeting for foreign terrorists coming into Iraq (by collective it means immediate family held liable for crimes, forcing them to report in terrorists before a crime is committed). - This is an "emergency law" that can be repealed by a simple majority after a period of 5 years in a public plebliscite and return Iraq to International norms in criminal laws.
f, Prison system self-funding through prisoner labour use. However any abuse against prisoners results in litigation against low and high end prison staff. All prisoners have access to the electronic system to complain and vote on issues like other citizens, they are also entitled to keep 40% of the minimum wage for the work they do, given to them on their release.




11-Military and foreign relations
a, Lawfare unit in the foreign ministry established to fight Iraq's cause against countries who are harming Iraq, both legally and using international PR.
b, Iraqi defence Ministry's budget limited to 3% of GDP.
c, All defence ministry purchases from abroad (expensive weapons) must be accompanied by a 100% offset deal in a NON-PETROCHEMICAL industry, in order to offset the high cost of weapons.



12-Create a large free zone on the lake Razazza south west of Baghdad "Sin City Baghdad"http://wikimapia.org/#lat=32.8588252...99&z=9&l=0&m=b which is a "completely free zone" where everything is legal except murder, theft, rape and anti social behaviour. Open this up for all foreigners to invest in giving them 99 year leases. All of the construction is funded by the investors, but they pay a 10% annual levy for having the free zone to the central government (which is used to fund the Iraqi ministries like defence). The activities can include (but not limited to):
liquor,
drugs (all types, hard and soft can be grown and consumed within the free zone)
Prostitution
Gambling
night clubs
Money Laundering (but not from inside Iraq, only sourced from outside Iraq).
Stem Cell Research
Commercial Organ donations and transplants
Uncensored website hosting
Uncensored media hosting and transmission
All religions allowed (including cults)
All political organisations allowed (including terrorist/nazi etc)
Homosexuality legalised
Gold and diamond trading and processing (no questions asked)
Ivory/furs etc... trading and processing legalised
All types of banking/investments/derivatives allowed.
Everyone, from any country is allowed to enter sincity baghdad without visa.
basically all activities that may be restricted in other countries are acceptable (with the exception of murder/rape/theft/loutishness).

Any comments, corrections, additions?



1-Oil Money
a, All oil Money put into a "Iraq Fund" which manages investments in Iraqi industries and services.
b, Investments must be in Iraqi owned industries.
c, Investment decisions must be for commercially viable industries and in line with Iraq's development plans.



2-Government Funding and spending
a, Government is funded by taxation on businesses and employees.
b, Government also receives funding from Levies on imports and levies from "Baghdad Sin City" and other free zones.
c, Most government ministerial jobs are reorganised and delegated to companies as opposed to industries with a new set of commercial standard employment contracts for employees.
d, Government employees are limited to a maximum of 2x minimum wage
e, expenses are limited to a maximum of 25% of salary.
f, Taxes (except import duties) are restricted to "world mean average" to keep government from overtaxing industries and re-creating a bloated government structure.
g, Government borrowing is limited to a maximum of 5% of government budget for the first year, declining by 1% for each subsequent year.
h, Import duties levied on all produce that can be produced in Iraq, up to a maximum of 100% (in order to keep local manufacturers competitive). Exemptions are only given to areas where Iraq cannot produce its own alternative at an economical price.
i, Most ministries are dissolved and replaced with simple "regulatory authorities" that have to be funded within the limits of what can be raised from taxes. They are not allowed a single penny from oil revenues.The only remaining "ministries" are defence (interior is merged with it), foreign ministry and Economic ministry (finance / oil ministry merged together). The Higher education and education ministries are dissolved and replaced by an "education standards regulator", ditto for electricity, health etc...



3-State and Joint Stock Enterprises
a,All current state enterprises rebuilt through fund and foreign expertise injection by the "Iraq Fund"
b,Additional enterprises setup for different services including:
-Renewable Energy for power generation
-Energy efficient water desalination
-Modern farming techniques and soil remediation
-Silicon, Optics and other industries where Iraq has potential advantages
-Rail and Light rail production and rollout throughout Iraq
-Low cost housing projects managed and leased to tenants.
c,The government has to regulate all private and joint stock companies, in line with international and newly created national standards.
d,The "Oil fund" has to invest in medium to long term public-private initiatives where commercial or private funding is insufficient. The criteria is that the service provided has to be usefull for society and has a Return over the long term (20 years).


4-Universal ID system
a,All ID cards replaced by one universal ID card with full biometric information.
b,Make democracy universal, with people's universal IDs they should be able to vote on services, policies, members of parliament, quality of services as well as create new topics with a threshold for raising it to parliament once enough votes are included.



5-Employment laws
a, Guaranteed minimum wage job for every citizen who needs a job. (but no handouts). The "Oil fund" is used to create economically viable and sustainable jobs for all the unemployed with immediate effect as the handouts are taken away.
b, Government employees are employees of the people, and online networks can be used by citizens to raise complaints and vote down / remove corrupt/incompetent/criminal state employees from minister down to street cleaner.



6-Subsidies
a, No more subsidised electricity or ration programme
b, Iraq should stop pegging the dinar to the USD and let it float freely. Also invest the USD reserves into local joint stock industries to eliminate imports where its economically viable (farming, power generation, light industries, cement, bricks, to begin with...).



7-Local Services
a, Local neighbourhoods are responsible for contracting refuse removal / street cleaning (either within their community, or using a contractor). Failure to comply can result in quarantine of that area from any public services until its cleaned up.
b, Electricity and water is supplied by the "electricity" and "water" companies at international prices and with guaranteed levels of supply and quality. Companies are liable to pay compensation for sub-standard services.
c, End users can also setup microgeneration plants and sell electricity into the national grid at an agreed commercial tariff rate.



8-Healthcare
a, An Iraqi national health service needs to be established that provides healthcare that is free at the point of use for all Iraqi citizens. (Free prescriptions for the elderly, widows and chronically ill).
b, This is paid from taxes and managed by a "national health company" funded from oil sales.



9-Education
a, Eliminate all "foreign studentships" and "bi3that" and bring all necessary expertise in country instead, to eliminate the many funding the lifestyle and personal aspiration of the few.
b, Eradicate illiteracy. Every Iraqi must be able to pass a basic test (with the essential education required to function in a modern society (read, write, basic maths)). If they are unable to pass the test they will be provided with free compulsory education (unless they are 60+) in order to acquire an ID card. This will put an end to men obstructing their wives/daughters/sisters from being educated.
c, Children should have the ability to go to good quality nurseries while their mothers work. This creates jobs for the mother (whichever sector it may be) as well as another job in the nurseries (where the children spend the day). This also ensures that children follow a good curiculum in education / food / hygene from a very young age as well as be able to read/write/sing/dance before they even start school. All this creates more JOB opportunities too.
d,Part of the oil fund (5%) is used to invest in Research & Development of technologies where Iraq has a potential edge (not reinventing the wheel). Encourage and promote the technology leapfrogging of Iraq to surpass the world in a number of key pillars of technologies.
Solar power generation / air conditioning / powered vehicles. desert farming, medical/pharmaceutical/biotech, optics, desalination, modern power storage / transmission techniques. Chemical/petrochemical technologies utilising with Iraqi raw materials etc... The research can use up to 20% foreign experts, but they must be based physically in Iraq.



10-Law and Order
a, Death penalty and repossession of all properties and wealth of extended family for corruption above $10k. Hard labour for corruption below $10k.
b, 10 day "amnesty" period for corrupt officials who return stolen cash during which all banking and travel in and out of the country is forbidden.
c, Punitive penalties for all anti-social behaviour including, littering, graffiti, dirty shops, illegal stalls, illegal parking, breaking public property, dirty cars / houses (external) etc... make the salaries of policemen tied to a monthly "catch" as well as higher bonus for reducing offence rates. Police pay from these penalties, at the same time citizens have the right to overturn and highlight police abuse using an electronic system with a local court for small claims (consistently bad policemen given extremely punitive jail terms to deter them from false claims) - police must provide video/photo evidence of offences.
d, Political freedom for all, and a general amnesty to pre and post 2003 exiles.
e, "Collective guilt" principle for murder and terrorism crimes (similar to old fashioned tribal laws) to eliminate terrorism by local actors and eliminate the aiding and abbeting for foreign terrorists coming into Iraq (by collective it means immediate family held liable for crimes, forcing them to report in terrorists before a crime is committed). - This is an "emergency law" that can be repealed by a simple majority after a period of 5 years in a public plebliscite and return Iraq to International norms in criminal laws.
f, Prison system self-funding through prisoner labour use. However any abuse against prisoners results in litigation against low and high end prison staff. All prisoners have access to the electronic system to complain and vote on issues like other citizens, they are also entitled to keep 40% of the minimum wage for the work they do, given to them on their release.




11-Military and foreign relations
a, Lawfare unit in the foreign ministry established to fight Iraq's cause against countries who are harming Iraq, both legally and using international PR.
b, Iraqi defence Ministry's budget limited to 3% of GDP.
c, All defence ministry purchases from abroad (expensive weapons) must be accompanied by a 100% offset deal in a NON-PETROCHEMICAL industry, in order to offset the high cost of weapons.



12-Create a large free zone on the lake Razazza south west of Baghdad "Sin City Baghdad"http://wikimapia.org/#lat=32.8588252...99&z=9&l=0&m=b which is a "completely free zone" where everything is legal except murder, theft, rape and anti social behaviour. Open this up for all foreigners to invest in giving them 99 year leases. All of the construction is funded by the investors, but they pay a 10% annual levy for having the free zone to the central government (which is used to fund the Iraqi ministries like defence). The activities can include (but not limited to):
liquor,
drugs (all types, hard and soft can be grown and consumed within the free zone)
Prostitution
Gambling
night clubs
Money Laundering (but not from inside Iraq, only sourced from outside Iraq).
Stem Cell Research
Commercial Organ donations and transplants
Uncensored website hosting
Uncensored media hosting and transmission
All religions allowed (including cults)
All political organisations allowed (including terrorist/nazi etc)
Homosexuality legalised
Gold and diamond trading and processing (no questions asked)
Ivory/furs etc... trading and processing legalised
All types of banking/investments/derivatives allowed.
Everyone, from any country is allowed to enter sincity baghdad without visa.
basically all activities that may be restricted in other countries are acceptable (with the exception of murder/rape/theft/loutishness).

lol shaytan did u write all of that, because walla u have heaps of spare time if u did lol.

and how is their "no god"... its funny because the shaytan said this lol, quiet clearly he lies.
"I know these people very well, been to their houses, ate dinners with them, been to the various green zone offices with them, etc... etc... " ...please tell me why i have trouble believing this too :O? ..

Do you have anything to contribute?

Was there a need to quote the entire script?

You can believe what you want to believe with regards to who I had the misfortune to meet with, work with and eat with, this is an anonymous forum so you can decide to believe or not believe anything you want, it really makes absolutely no difference to the argument regarding Iraq's political elite, you can simply peruse the projects on this forum, or go visit Iraq to see for yourself :D

I did in fact write the above, over a long period of time, with corrections and additional ideas from other people. Its an attempt to create a manifesto for a modern Iraq. You are more than welcome to amend and critique it.

Any comments, corrections, additions?
I agree with most but some of the things that I found disturbing lol :

b, Government also receives funding from Levies on imports and levies from "Baghdad Sin City" and other free zones.




10-Law and Order
a, Death penalty and repossession of all properties and wealth of extended family for corruption above $10k. Hard labour for corruption below $10k.
c, Punitive penalties for all anti-social behaviour including, littering, graffiti, dirty shops, illegal stalls, illegal parking, breaking public property, dirty cars / houses (external) etc...


12-Create a large free zone on the lake Razazza south west of Baghdad "Sin City Baghdad"http://wikimapia.org/#lat=32.8588252...99&z=9&l=0&m=b which is a "completely free zone" where everything is legal except murder, theft, rape and anti social behaviour. Open this up for all foreigners to invest in giving them 99 year leases. All of the construction is funded by the investors, but they pay a 10% annual levy for having the free zone to the central government (which is used to fund the Iraqi ministries like defence). The activities can include (but not limited to):
liquor,
drugs (all types, hard and soft can be grown and consumed within the free zone)
Prostitution
Gambling
night clubs
Money Laundering (but not from inside Iraq, only sourced from outside Iraq).
Stem Cell Research
Commercial Organ donations and transplants
Uncensored website hosting
Uncensored media hosting and transmission
All religions allowed (including cults)
All political organisations allowed (including terrorist/nazi etc)
Homosexuality legalised
Gold and diamond trading and processing (no questions asked)
Ivory/furs etc... trading and processing legalised
All types of banking/investments/derivatives allowed.
Everyone, from any country is allowed to enter sincity baghdad without visa.
basically all activities that may be restricted in other countries are acceptable (with the exception of murder/rape/theft/loutishness).

^^^^ WHAT ?! This "sincity" is just ...

[/B][/U]

^ lol^ didnt bother reading.. but i have to say shaytan has some bright ideas ...lol!!!!!!!!!!!!!

walla i think he is being sarcastic..

shaytan have you like got any feedback from government officials on that sin city idea i would genuinely like to hear what they think lol

Hi IraqiShi3i.

the first item is to completely eliminate corruption with an extremely onerous penalty (but giving the guilty an amnesty period to give themselves in and return the stolen money). There is no other way IMHO to eliminate completely corruption in the Iraqi government. Sadly the only thing understood in this regards in Iraq is DEATH of the thief and DESTITUTION of the thief's extended family.

The second point has several key points.
1- Sin city will give people in Iraq who want a very liberal lifestyle and society to live freely (it actually allows other regions of Iraq to become more conservative and, and for example ban alcohol - US style).
2- It means that people who don't want to see alcohol and nightclubs outside their doors, will not have to see them outside their doors... it will be moved to a separate area and closed off.
3- Sincity will be so attractive to international finance and other organisation of dubious sort, that it can spur massive development within Iraq, whilst at the same time being isolated from Iraq. It provides income for Iraq's government and work for Iraqi contractors - from other countries.
4- The "free for all" motto would create a "Super Macao" for Iraq, and spur innovation, development as well as clean up vice and make it more mainstream. It gives the people of the world a "vegas away from vegas".



PS. I have not asked any "government baboons" what they think. I am guessing their reaction would be along the line of "ASTAKHFURILLAH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!" <STROKE>.

Hi IraqiShi3i.

PS. I have not asked any "government baboons" what they think. I am guessing their reaction would be along the line of "ASTAKHFURILLAH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!" <STROKE>.

wil abbas, ra7 amoot min ith7ik!!!.. lol
sincity, iraq will have the most relijious cities like karbala and najaf and the opp! lol!

shaytan, i really hope ur making fun out of this and are sarcastic.. dont say this publicly, i swear i cant think of one decent person who won't laugh at u!!

The second point has several key points.
1- Sin city will give people in Iraq who want a very liberal lifestyle and society to live freely (it actually allows other regions of Iraq to become more conservative and, and for example ban alcohol - US style).
2- It means that people who don't want to see alcohol and nightclubs outside their doors, will not have to see them outside their doors... it will be moved to a separate area and closed off.
3- Sincity will be so attractive to international finance and other organisation of dubious sort, that it can spur massive development within Iraq, whilst at the same time being isolated from Iraq. It provides income for Iraq's government and work for Iraqi contractors - from other countries.
4- The "free for all" motto would create a "Super Macao" for Iraq, and spur innovation, development as well as clean up vice and make it more mainstream. It gives the people of the world a "vegas away from vegas".


I dont really like the term "sin city" despite your good intentions.. Baghadad is a city with profound history.. almost unparalleled in our region if not the globe.. why do we want it to be like las vagas ??

instead of trying to make it a world center for science, technology, and forward progressive thinking like what our forefathers did, you instead want it to turn into a "vagas away from vagas" .. why ?

I know you expressed dislike towards Baghdadis on many occasions in the past, but seriously Baghdad is my birthplace, and the birthplace of atleast 1 quarter of Iraqis.. no one wants their birthplace to be referred to as "sin city"..

well instead of a sin city dont you think like a tourist resort might be better ? yes allow alcohol there but not drugs (all types, hard and soft can be grown and consumed within the free zone) and Prostitution and even thought I agree with this All religions allowed (including cults) i dont agree with the brackets... and the name itself is displeasing especially for Iraqis to have this on Iraqi soil because yeah freedom is good but having a city designed for you to sin then we are getting bad deeds aswell because we are inviting them to do so and im not suprised they will say astakfurallah lol Allah wont be happy at all with the idea !

shaytan, are u aware of a game called grand theft auto? ...

wil abbas, ra7 amoot min ith7ik!!!.. lol
sincity, iraq will have the most relijious cities like karbala and najaf and the opp! lol!

shaytan, i really hope ur making fun out of this and are sarcastic.. dont say this publicly, i swear i cant think of one decent person who won't laugh at u!!

You probably don't know many decent persons then, or have a different interpretation of what "decency" is... i.e. if spitting at people who's tattoos you don't like is "decent", then yes I am sure "decent" people of that sort wouldn't like it :D

I dont really like the term "sin city" despite your good intentions.. Baghadad is a city with profound history.. almost unparalleled in our region if not the globe.. why do we want it to be like las vagas ??

instead of trying to make it a world center for science, technology, and forward progressive thinking like what our forefathers did, you instead want it to turn into a "vagas away from vagas" .. why ?

I know you expressed dislike towards Baghdadis on many occasions in the past, but seriously Baghdad is my birthplace, and the birthplace of atleast 1 quarter of Iraqis.. no one wants their birthplace to be referred to as "sin city"..

I was born in Baghdad too, and lived in Baghdad. The name can certainly be changed to something else, like Razz City? If you note, I want to make "sin city" also the centre for scientific work that is frowned upon in other countries including stem cell research, as well as a hub for internet activities that may be banned in other countries. Its also a free for all for other scientific activities where the lack of red tape and regulation as well as the free and fun lifestyle attracts people from around the world. Sin City is aimed primarily at NON Iraqis, not at Iraqis.

well instead of a sin city dont you think like a tourist resort might be better ? yes allow alcohol there but not drugs (all types, hard and soft can be grown and consumed within the free zone) and Prostitution and even thought I agree with this All religions allowed (including cults) i dont agree with the brackets... and the name itself is displeasing especially for Iraqis to have this on Iraqi soil because yeah freedom is good but having a city designed for you to sin then we are getting bad deeds aswell because we are inviting them to do so and im not suprised they will say astakfurallah lol Allah wont be happy at all with the idea !

Your suggestion is already available (and much more) in Baghdad today... so what exactly is the "unique selling point" of "Razz city"? Remember this is primarily to attract INTERNATIONAL people and capital, not Iraqi.

shaytan, are u aware of a game called grand theft auto? ...

are you MrIraq in drag?

what if sin city expands or people begin to make their neighbourhoods like sin city ? slowly the whole of Iraq might turn into sin country :S

what if sin city expands or people begin to make their neighbourhoods like sin city ? slowly the whole of Iraq might turn into sin country :S

not at all. anyone in Iraq can go and move to sincity if they want. If they want to beat themselves and eat qeema, you can do that, if they want to drink coffee and talk about the good old days under saddam before the dirty iranians took over, they can move to tikrit or Ramadi, if they want to live in Old Baghdad, they can do that... if they want to live or work in "sin city" they can do that too!



PS. You know the "manifesto" I wrote was rather long, Can you guys comment the other points? Your views are very important!

beat themselves and eat qeema

rather insultive to us shia lol :P and how big exactly do you want this city? like a whole other governate ??

rather insultive to us shia lol :P and how big exactly do you want this city? like a whole other governate ??

what u on about?? I'm a merza and half Kufi :D and spent last year's ashura in Mudhif il Abbas in Karbala!

The size of the "Raz city" could be about 50km x 50km or about 2500km2, which gives it enough room to grow?

what u on about?? I'm a merza and half Kufi :D and spent last year's ashura in Mudhif il Abbas in Karbala!

The size of the "Raz city" could be about 50km x 50km or about 2500km2, which gives it enough room to grow?

lool sorry I read somewhere something and thought you werent muslim aha never mind :P

lool sorry I read somewhere something and thought you werent muslim aha never mind :P

I'm not a Muslim! Doesn't stop me being a merza, or having some nice qeema in Karbala with my Shia buddies.

I'm not a Muslim! Doesn't stop me being a merza, or having some nice qeema in Karbala with my Shia buddies.

what about the occasional beating you talked about :P

Hi IraqiShi3i.

the first item is to completely eliminate corruption with an extremely onerous penalty (but giving the guilty an amnesty period to give themselves in and return the stolen money). There is no other way IMHO to eliminate completely corruption in the Iraqi government. Sadly the only thing understood in this regards in Iraq is DEATH of the thief and DESTITUTION of the thief's extended family.

The second point has several key points.
1- Sin city will give people in Iraq who want a very liberal lifestyle and society to live freely (it actually allows other regions of Iraq to become more conservative and, and for example ban alcohol - US style).
2- It means that people who don't want to see alcohol and nightclubs outside their doors, will not have to see them outside their doors... it will be moved to a separate area and closed off.
3- Sincity will be so attractive to international finance and other organisation of dubious sort, that it can spur massive development within Iraq, whilst at the same time being isolated from Iraq. It provides income for Iraq's government and work for Iraqi contractors - from other countries.
4- The "free for all" motto would create a "Super Macao" for Iraq, and spur innovation, development as well as clean up vice and make it more mainstream. It gives the people of the world a "vegas away from vegas".



PS. I have not asked any "government baboons" what they think. I am guessing their reaction would be along the line of "ASTAKHFURILLAH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!" <STROKE>.
:rofl:

I'm not a Muslim! Doesn't stop me being a merza, or having some nice qeema in Karbala with my Shia buddies.

:rofl:

Maliki alludes to majority rule

Baghdad, June 4 (AKnews) – The Iraqi Prime Minister Nouri al-Maliki said on Saturday that the concept of national partnership was a good one, but if it failed, the majority must take control.Maliki

Speaking at a memorial service for the Shia political leader, Muhammad Baqir al-Hakim, who was assassinated in 2003, Maliki said that all Iraqi blocs must assume their responsibilities.

“We are in a national partnership government,” he said, “It is unacceptable that there is partnership without responsibility.”

The Iraqi leaders have been locked in a fierce row for several months over key ministerial slots that have remained unfilled since the new cabinet headed by Nuri al-Maliki was sworn in on December 21.

The lack of political consensus over the allocation of the ministries of Defense, National Security and the Interior, has left Maliki assuming the interim role of heading them all.

“The concept of national partnership is good, but if it isn't achieved then the majority should take responsibility,” Maliki continued, “We cannot allow Iraq and its people's freedom to be subjected to (these) useless differences.”

Reported by Haider Ibrahim

Rn/Ka/AKnews

:lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol:

That is one big f@$k you to the non shia.

Lebanon will cooperate with Iraq in al-Azri case

By Malak Najem

Beirut - In the case of the defected Iraqi Commercial Bank director, Hussein al-Azri, Lebanon said it will fully cooperate with Iraq.

Azri was accused of corruption after the Integrity Commission and the monetary audit council revealed that Azri had granted loans without any guarantees, thus causing the lost of millions of U.S. dollars.

"There is friendship and cooperation between Iraq and Lebanon, and Lebanon is bound to treaties with Iraq in this issue", said Gharib al-Husseini, spokesman for the Lebanese Foreign Ministry.

"These treaties require Lebanon to decide about Iraq's request as soon as possible."

Iraq said yesterday that they want Lebanon to hand over Azri.

"There is now judicial, diplomatic and legal efforts done by the head of the government to return Azri, especially after we found out that he is in Beirut", a government spokesperson said.

The Ministry of Finance announced Sunday that Iraqi Prime Minister Nuri al-Maliki appointed Hamdiya al-Jaff as new director of the Commercial Bank.

http://www.zawya.com/story.cfm/sidZAWYA20110609063741/Lebanon_will_cooperate_with_Iraq_in_alAzri_case

MPs call on Talabani to sign pending death warrants
14:23
Baghdad, May 16 (AKnews) – A number of Iraqi parliamentarians called on President Jalal Talabani to sign a backlog of pending death warrants following reports that he had refused to ratify death sentences passed on 50 prisoners sentenced under anti-terror laws.

National Coalition (NC) MP, Judge Jaafar al-Moussawi, told AKnews that constitutional shortcomings oblige the President to sign death sentences without delays which could have a negative impact on internal security.

“The constitutional vacuums have hindered a lot of things,” he said, “…writing the Constitution hastily left a lot of gaps that need amending for the stability of all the institutions of the state.”

The Iraqi President has expressed his personal opposition to the death penalty on numerous occasions, and said that he will honor his signature on international treaties calling for the abolishment of capital punishment.

In November last year, Talabani controversially refused to sign an execution order for Tareq Aziz, the former deputy of dictator Saddam Hussein sentenced to death last month for crimes against humanity.

"No, I will not sign the execution order for Tareq Aziz, because I am a socialist," Talabani told French television France 24 in an interview at the time.

The Center Coalition’s Abdullah al-Jabbouri told AKnews that approval should be given to execute those sentenced to death, as failing to do so compromises the country’s security and may help to encourage the spread of crime.

"According to Iraqi law, the president must ratify the sentences,” he said, “…but if he has moral objections, he can authorize another person to ratify the death sentences”.
-----------------------------------

There's over 1200 terrorists and murderers waiting for execution but our president doesn't feel like giving his signature to kill those murderers, instead, he thinks its better to keep them in jail and spend money on them, he also refused to sign Saddams and tariq aziz's execution (saddams was passed by maliki, and no, im not advertising for Maliki but Im glad he was brave enough to sign the death sentences). what a shame, talibani either signs it or let someone else take his place.

How's his health? Not too great I hope.

A Second Chamber for the Iraqi Parliament?
21 September 2011


Over the past few days there have been persistent reports that some leading members of Iraqiyya who have lost faith in the national council for high policies are contemplating reviving the debate about a senate in the Iraqi parliament as a potential substitute.

To some extent, there are positive aspects to this suggestion. Firstly, unlike the strategic council, the senate is already in the Iraqi constitution, even though its composition and prerogatives are ill-defined (article 65, which apparently was added to the constitutional draft in 2005 as a last-minute measure). Iraq has had a bicameral parliamentary structure in the past as well: The senate during the days of the monarchy was an appointed upper chamber to the “elected” first chamber. Potentially, then, a senate could serve as a deliberative forum that could supplement the existing parliament, not least since the appointment formula sketched out in the constitution – two representatives per governorate and region – would produce a different political dynamic than that prevailing in the proportionally elected house of representatives. Indeed, when compared with the strategic policy council (which would largely comprise members of the existing government), the senate comes across as an institution that holds far greater promise for avoiding a mere duplication of the stalemates that currently dominate both the executive and the legislature in Iraq.

But there are also multiple problems connected with the senate. In the first place, the senate enjoys no specific prerogatives defined in the constitution. The explanation is probably very simple: The drafters of the constitution must have had a last-minute realisation that since they had rather unceremoniously transformed Iraq into a loose federation, they would need to add a second chamber since most good federations have one. An attempt to define the powers of the chamber was done during the unsuccessful attempt at revising the constitution in 2007–2009, but those powers indicated in the revision are not particularly strong and resemble that of many European second chambers, i.e. the senate has the power to delay but not to ultimately block the actions of the first chamber. This is very far from what some Iraqiyya members (such as Nabil Harbo) have in mind when they declare that the second chamber will potentially have greater powers than the strategic policy council.
Even more importantly, there are special legal requirements and thresholds pertaining to the law for creating the senate: A two-thirds absolute majority or 216 deputies in the current parliament. This means that unless the senate is created as part of the special constitutional revision under article 142 (which can be done with an absolute-majority vote followed by a popular referendum), the senate, just like the projected federal supreme court, belongs to the realm of legislation requiring special-majority votes that seem unlikely to see the light of day anytime soon.
The hard reality is that neither the senate nor the strategic policy council is likely to come into existence or give Iraqiyya what they are seeking. If they are objective, they would instead notice that Prime Minister Nuri al-Maliki currently has problems both with the Kurds and his fellow Shiite Islamists (including most recently Sabah al-Saadi, an independent, and Kazim al-Sayadi, a Sadrist). Negotiating with him directly seems to remain a far more realistic way of winning real power.

Norwegian Institute of International Affairs, Reidar Visser

Quartet talks due in Baghdad between Iraq, Iran, Saudi Arabia and Turkey
October 18 2011


Iraqi parliament announced on Monday that quartet talks will be taking place in Baghdad between Iran, Saudi Arabia and Turkey to discuss pending issues in the region upon the initiative of Iraqi Parliament Speaker.

“Iraqi parliament speaker Osama Al Nujaifi, who is attending the International parliamentary conference in Swiss capital Bern, met on Monday with Iranian speaker Ali Larijani,” spokesman of parliamentary foreign relations committee Abbas Al Amiri told Alsumarianews. “Both parties agreed upon holding quartet talks in Baghdad between Iraq, Iran, Saudi Arabia and Turkey,” he noted.

“The meeting was positive. Iranian Speaker showed positive interaction and did not oppose the initiative,” Al Amiri declared.

“The initiative was made by Al Nujaifi. As a first step, the Saudi Parliament and new Turkish Parliament Speaker will be contacted in this regard,” Al Amiri added expecting the meeting to “tackle regional issues and set forth a resolving strategy.”

“Iraqi speaker suggested that Iraq hosts the quartet talks and hold them on a regular basis in the three concerned countries in view of dealing with urgent issues”, Al Amiri proposed. “This initiative is a start of a union that gathers influential parties to discuss pending issues in the region in addition to security, economic and political cooperation among regional countries,” he added.

“Iraq is now aware that it has the ability to deal with intense crisis through dialogue and not through tensed escalation,” Al ‘Amiri quoted Iraqi parliament speaker as saying.

Hey guys. I have been wondering about why the people in southern Iraq isn't thinking about implementing federalism since the conflicts between sunni and shia is clear. Additionally if the southern ''states' will become federal it will result in alot of opportunites. They would be economically stronger than now ( because of the oil) and the conflicts will probably end?

Another question is:
The oil in Kurdistan isn't distributed to the whole country but only to the kurds. Then why the hell does the iraqi government give 17% of iraq's budget to the autonomous iraqi kurdistan? Are the politicians idiots? Because i can't see any strategic purpose for this -.-

Correction: 71% for the federal government. 12% for company and 17% for the KRG. But it's still a piss of for the kurds to get a larger share of their oil while the south have to distribute almost all of it with the rest if the provinces including the KRG

Correction: 71% for the federal government. 12% for company and 17% for the KRG. But it's still a piss of for the kurds to get a larger share of their oil while the south have to distribute almost all of it with the rest if the provinces including the KRG

yeah our president has to be kurd too, soo great to know.. and u should see how much million it costs the government for his trips to countries.. true fact.

yeah our president has to be kurd too, soo great to know.. and u should see how much million it costs the government for his trips to countries.. true fact.

:lol:

:lol:

No walla bro no jokes, his role is a stupid ceremonial role, and walla he sleeps at hotels which are like 20grand a night, and wil quran im not exaggurating, his last trip to walla i forgot the place (not too long ago), costed the gov like one and abit million, like seriously!@, what about all the aytaam!

the dumbass goes cracking jokes and getting payed ibrasna!

No walla bro no jokes, his role is a stupid ceremonial role, and walla he sleeps at hotels which are like 20grand a night, and wil quran im not exaggurating, his last trip to walla i forgot the place (not too long ago), costed the gov like one and abit million, like seriously!@, what about all the aytaam!

the dumbass goes cracking jokes and getting payed ibrasna!

Well we can't do anything than wait.. and hope for better politicians in Iraq..

A presidential system could be better than the current one.

To answer ALI's question. Ppl in southern Iraq are mis-guided sheep that do not know how to control or manage themselves without the aid of Baghdad. During the last 20 years of time, those supporting the central government type in Iraq had made sure that southern ppl get mis-educated about their potentials and capabilities.

Many think that things will get even worse if regions are formed in south Iraq. Let's take Basra as an example, many of the ppl living today in Basra (population is exceeding 4millions btw) come from origins that spread through four main other governorates that include mainly:

1- Maysan (Ppl of Hayaniyah in Basra and other places especially Medainah and Qurna)
2- Nasiryah (Mostly Zubair)
3- Samawa.
4- Kut.
5- Diwanya and others.

As you can see ppl in Basra are from diverse origins, the original inhibitors of Basra (Basrawiis) are actually less than those i mentioned earlier. Add to that that most of the educated ppl are afraid of the region project being hijacked by militias and corrupt parties so they rather not vote for it. While the other part of ppl are uneducated and not informed well about the benefits.

It is not as easy as u think to form a region in the south, it might be easier for the Kurds at the north because they are a different race and were very heavily hurt by the consequent Iraqi regimes, besides they have been independent sicne 1991.

Adding to that, there are few who think of the broader shia region with Najaf and Karbala and south Baghdad. It appears to surface everytime there is an explosion or sectarian violence against shia somewhere in Iraq then drops down slowly. Such a project is largely opposed for a single fact that don't want to replace a central government in Baghdad by another from Najaf. Then, comes the three governorates region of Basra, Amara and Nasiriyah which is highly apposed by those original inhibitors of Basra who are sick already of the ones coming from these governorates and living with them since the 60s and 70s.

I think when the Sunnis will form their own region that will make it easier for those who support the foundation of the shiite southern region of south Baghdad. It is the only motivation that will drive the ppl to vote for the creation of such a region. Individual state regions like the one Basra tried to create back in 2008 or 2009 will always be crashed by the central government. A good example is not funding the project like what Maliki is doing to Salahdin initiative, or playing with the votes and making the voting system as complicated as possible as done in Basra.

What I really think should happen to Iraq, is a federal system like the one in the United States, every state has its own government, senate and organization for investment and basic services, of course matters dealing with sovereignty like Oil and defense forces should always be handled by the central government. But basic services like Education, health, electricity, water and investment should be handled by the region.

To answer ALI's question. Ppl in southern Iraq are mis-guided sheep that do not know how to control or manage themselves without the aid of Baghdad. During the last 20 years of time, those supporting the central government type in Iraq had made sure that southern ppl get mis-educated about their potentials and capabilities.

Many think that things will get even worse if regions are formed in south Iraq. Let's take Basra as an example, many of the ppl living today in Basra (population is exceeding 4millions btw) come from origins that spread through four main other governorates that include mainly:

1- Maysan (Ppl of Hayaniyah in Basra and other places especially Medainah and Qurna)
2- Nasiryah (Mostly Zubair)
3- Samawa.
4- Kut.
5- Diwanya and others.

As you can see ppl in Basra are from diverse origins, the original inhibitors of Basra (Basrawiis) are actually less than those i mentioned earlier. Add to that that most of the educated ppl are afraid of the region project being hijacked by militias and corrupt parties so they rather not vote for it. While the other part of ppl are uneducated and not informed well about the benefits.

It is not as easy as u think to form a region in the south, it might be easier for the Kurds at the north because they are a different race and were very heavily hurt by the consequent Iraqi regimes, besides they have been independent sicne 1991.

Adding to that, there are few who think of the broader shia region with Najaf and Karbala and south Baghdad. It appears to surface everytime there is an explosion or sectarian violence against shia somewhere in Iraq then drops down slowly. Such a project is largely opposed for a single fact that don't want to replace a central government in Baghdad by another from Najaf. Then, comes the three governorates region of Basra, Amara and Nasiriyah which is highly apposed by those original inhibitors of Basra who are sick already of the ones coming from these governorates and living with them since the 60s and 70s.

I think when the Sunnis will form their own region that will make it easier for those who support the foundation of the shiite southern region of south Baghdad. It is the only motivation that will drive the ppl to vote for the creation of such a region. Individual state regions like the one Basra tried to create back in 2008 or 2009 will always be crashed by the central government. A good example is not funding the project like what Maliki is doing to Salahdin initiative, or playing with the votes and making the voting system as complicated as possible as done in Basra.

What I really think should happen to Iraq, is a federal system like the one in the United States, every state has its own government, senate and organization for investment and basic services, of course matters dealing with sovereignty like Oil and defense forces should always be handled by the central government. But basic services like Education, health, electricity, water and investment should be handled by the region.

:applause:

The more politicians there are (federalism), the more corruption of power. Even more so in the case of regional governments.

Perhaps the most decisive aspect of centrality is the opportunity for secularism to get established. The need and necessity of secularism would always be imminent with the heterogeneous set of Iraq, it would be the only solution. You can give chances of secularism a big fat good bye kiss if regional gevernments are to be established. The largely homogenic character of future regions would delude the regional leaders into thinking that ALL people are clones, programmed by the latest Theocracy Ultimate 3.0, and not view them as individuals, with different ambitions. The undeniably attributed shortcomings of a regional government is the lack of pragmatism, humility and sense of state unity, whereas a centralized government would be, by necessity and nature, attributed these traits, in a law abiding democratic process ofcourse.

It is a matter of perspective really. While some choose to view reg. governments as "closer" to the citizens, granting them greater freedoms and being more responsive to their needs and aspirations, I choose to see regional governments as great obstacles in formation of a future secular state, implementing religious indoctrination bargained with economical freedoms. They would become mini dictatorships within a state. Not to mention the inertia in all aspects of implementations by the central government, the immense cost of bureaucracy, the unhealthy competition between regions (highly evident by the relations of Baghdad-KRG), the double-edged sword of foreign policy, policies desirable to one region but environmentally detrimental to a nother etc etc.

Consequently, if you argue for regional governments in Iraq (I'm ofcourse excluding Kurdistan here, since I'm not delusional enough not to) then you argue for an Islamic state, doomed for decadence.

Remarks with Foreign Ministers Hillary Clinton and Hoshyar Zebari


http://video.state.gov/en/top-stories/video/1323843839001/remarks-with-with-iraqi-foreign-minister-hoshyar-zebari/s~creationDate/p~1/?p

Kurd123 you're 'Ideas' from Aliraqi yes?

Kurd123 you're 'Ideas' from Aliraqi yes?

yes

yes

I was reading over the Hashimi arrest warrant thread, unfortunately I couldn't comment because I got banned a while ago... but I agree with everything you and randomV were saying... you guys were on a roll. :D I can't believe they banned random though... those c*nts ban everyone who doesn't share their sectarian views.

those c*nts ban everyone who doesn't share their sectarian views.

are you refering to the aliraqi forum ? Even though I dont post much I still follow it regularly and they dont have sectarian views ... yes they may have different views but that doesnt make them sectarian just because someone may not like alhashimi

I was reading over the Hashimi arrest warrant thread, unfortunately I couldn't comment because I got banned a while ago... but I agree with everything you and randomV were saying... you guys were on a roll. :D I can't believe they banned random though... those c*nts ban everyone who doesn't share their sectarian views.

All I was trieng to tell them is that arresting Hashimi is not going to solve the terrorist problems in Iraq, and it's not my job to judge whether he is guilty or not, that will be done by a fair and just judge hopefully becuase if he is found to be guilty arresting him will not solve anything since there are 1000's of people ready to replace him, and infact if he is arrested it would only lead to more sectarian violence in Iraq as the Sunni will most likely want to retaliate or feel even more isolated and try to push for more Independence which may end up in a civil war, and the response I got from the Maliki worshipers is "you are sectarian" "you support terrorists" etc, and so my response was, fine if arrest maliki and butcher each other.

It is clear that Maliki wants to get rid of the competition and he will starts with the Sunnis and move onto the Kurds after, he is making a big mistake and the more he isolated all the other groups in Iraq the more they will turn against him. Kurds don't want to take sides becuase it doesn't benefit us and I hope maliki does not push us into the corner and force us to take sides.

Maliki is clearly looking for trouble as there are rumors circling the Kurdish news that he has invited the extremist mullah Kerkar to Iraq to work against Kurdistan, he is fighting fire with fire and he will be the reason for Iraqs break up and the unnecessary death of thousands of innocent Iraqis becuase at the end of the day, he and other leaders sit in their comfy expensive homes where as the Iraqi civilians are used at pawns in this political and sectarian game!

All I was trieng to tell them is that arresting Hashimi is not going to solve the terrorist problems in Iraq, and it's not my job to judge whether he is guilty or not, that will be done by a fair and just judge hopefully becuase if he is found to be guilty arresting him will not solve anything since there are 1000's of people ready to replace him, and infact if he is arrested it would only lead to more sectarian violence in Iraq as the Sunni will most likely want to retaliate or feel even more isolated and try to push for more Independence which may end up in a civil war, and the response I got from the Maliki worshipers is "you are sectarian" "you support terrorists" etc, and so my response was, fine if arrest maliki and butcher each other.

It is clear that Maliki wants to get rid of the competition and he will starts with the Sunnis and move onto the Kurds after, he is making a big mistake and the more he isolated all the other groups in Iraq the more they will turn against him. Kurds don't want to take sides becuase it doesn't benefit us and I hope maliki does not push us into the corner and force us to take sides.

Maliki is clearly looking for trouble as there are rumors circling the Kurdish news that he has invited the extremist mullah Kerkar to Iraq to work against Kurdistan, he is fighting fire with fire and he will be the reason for Iraqs break up and the unnecessary death of thousands of innocent Iraqis becuase at the end of the day, he and other leaders sit in their comfy expensive homes where as the Iraqi civilians are used at pawns in this political and sectarian game!

:applause::applause::applause::applause::applause::applause::applause::applause:

EXACTLY. Thank you..


It's very obvious that Maliki just wants to get rid of his political opponents, trying to get hold of as much power as he can. An arrest warrant for Hashimi and trying to kick out Saleh al Mutlaq.. he's going after the competition one by one. I don't understand why Maliki worshippers continue to defend him when it's clear he doesn't give a crap about Iraq or it's people. The withdrawal of the Americans and the months afterward was an EXTREMELY crucial and sensitive time which would determine the fate of the country completely, cards had to be played right and yet Maliki played the worst one. Instead of co-operating and working together to actually get the country on the right path we start playing this game which innocents Iraqis are dying because of and which will ultimately lead to the break up of the country! Great move by the PM, looks like civil war is what we wants. He is clearly becoming more and more authoritarian, something that even the US media is constantly reporting, some Iraqis choose to deny it though. Don't forget how he went and allied with that filthy dog Muqtada Al Sadr, the biggest terrorist in Iraqi history, just to get more support and to be able to hold on to his PM position.

If Hashimi is to be tried he must face trial in Arbil. Baghdad is corrupt and Maliki will ensure his execution whether he is in fact gulity or actually innocent. I applaud the kurds for keeping Hashimi, and hope they don't give in to the pressure.

:applause::applause::applause::applause::applause::applause::applause::applause:

EXACTLY. Thank you..


It's very obvious that Maliki just wants to get rid of his political opponents, trying to get hold of as much power as he can. An arrest warrant for Hashimi and trying to kick out Saleh al Mutlaq.. he's going after the competition one by one. I don't understand why Maliki worshippers continue to defend him when it's clear he doesn't give a crap about Iraq or it's people. The withdrawal of the Americans and the months afterward was an EXTREMELY crucial and sensitive time which would determine the fate of the country completely, cards had to be played right and yet Maliki played the worst one. Instead of co-operating and working together to actually get the country on the right path we start playing this game which innocents Iraqis are dying because of and which will ultimately lead to the break up of the country! Great move by the PM, looks like civil war is what we wants. He is clearly becoming more and more authoritarian, something that even the US media is constantly reporting, some Iraqis choose to deny it though. Don't forget how he went and allied with that filthy dog Muqtada Al Sadr, the biggest terrorist in Iraqi history, just to get more support and to be able to hold on to his PM position.

If Hashimi is to be tried he must face trial in Arbil. Baghdad is corrupt and Maliki will ensure his execution whether he is in fact gulity or actually innocent. I applaud the kurds for keeping Hashimi, and hope they don't give in to the pressure.

Once again Im going to ask you to please refrain from using such language it is very disrespectful ... if you dont like who he is then just say so and dont begin swearing I may not lke some of jaish almahdis ideas but they did put fear into alqaeda and that is good enough for me and oh and biggest terrorsit ? so what about alzarqawe or Abu Ayyub al-Masri or abu omar albaghdadi I dont see you calling these people terrorists ... hmmm I wonder why ... ?

Once again Im going to ask you to please refrain from using such language it is very disrespectful ...

And once again I'm going to laugh my ass off at you hahahahahaha :lol:

Just the fact that you're defending Jaish Al Mehdi and asking me to respect Muqtada Al Sadr says enough about you.

Not gonna bring this up again since there's no need to bring personal matters into it but that fucking asshole kalb ibin 16 kalb is responsible for the murder of my teenage cousin who I never had the pleasure of meeting and the kidnapping and torturing of my other teenage cousin. So I'm pretty sure I have a right to insult him. :D

if you dont like who he is then just say so and dont begin swearing I may not lke some of jaish almahdis ideas but they did put fear into alqaeda and that is good enough for me and oh and biggest terrorsit ? so what about alzarqawe or Abu Ayyub al-Masri or abu omar albaghdadi I dont see you calling these people terrorists ... hmmm I wonder why ... ?

You 'may not like' some of their ideas?! Hahahah.. oyyyyyy. Please enlighten me, which ideas DO you like? Sending death notes to people, the forcing families out of their homes, ethnically cleansing neighbourhoods.. beheading children.. harassing women? Which of these do you admire so much? I'm curious.

That's good enough for you?! WOW. So you're basically saying that you don't give it a shit that the guy has killed tens of thousands of innocent civilians. Hmmm right they were Sunni so why WOULD you care???

Of course Zarqawi is a terrorist. I'm glad that bastard is dead.. one of the biggest achievements for US forces was finishing him off. The whole world's a much better place without people like him. The guy's been dead for like 5 years now though so Im not sure why you're bringing him up??

Anyway I don't know why we're talking about Muqtada Al Qundara, I dont wanna derail this thread lets stick to the topic.. the guy doesn't deserve the attention.
It's just weird how you're always reading my posts and looking for anything I say about him and then quickly run to defend him. Seems like you're a fan or something.

The reason I personally like them is because of how they were able to help my family because a group of alqaeda had rented a house down my street and were using it as a base for operations and the Mahdi army in my area warned us about them and then brought the Iraqi army down to take care of them.

^^^

This argument isn't going to ever end. Both alqaeda and Mahdi army and are responsible for killing innocent people end of story, let's not try to defend any of them just because they are from the same sect we belong to or have done one positive point to polish their image .

As for jaish al mahdi, If we go back in the early stages in the creation of the Mahdi army, we'd realize the they had a considerably noble goal, and the is to fight the "invaders" although I totally disagree with them about armed jihad because it is totally unrealistic to defeat the US militarily. At that point they have had much support from sunni factions and from the Arab population in the middle east as well as Iran and Hezbollah. But the Mahdi army quickly turned into a Gang and hit squads. They were infiltrated by "capsalchia" the lowest of the lowest started to join the Mahdi army, they'd go kill alcohol sellers then share the alcohol amongst themselves (I heard that from a friend in Iraq). Most of them were looking for a Immunity of prosecution from killing, robbery and other criminal acts.

Nonetheless they didn't start killing the Sunnis. It was only after alqaeda started mass killing Shias in markets, mosques and public spaces that the Mahdi army started to retaliate. And their terror wasn't only against Sunnis but Shias as well. One incident that I heard from my cousin, they killed a person in Basra just because he failed to stop his bike at their "salat juma" place, it was later found out that the reason he couldn't stop is because the brakes on his bike didn't work.

not in defense for them, but I haven't heard of jaish al Mahdi beheading children Or stuffing humans with explosives or doing suicide bombing in markets, their way of killing was going to Sunnis areas and picking the most vulnerable people then torturing and killing them. but the Mahdi army has stopped since 2008 and since then 90% of the attacks are done by so called "Sunni" factions.

As for alqaeda, I don't think I need to give much details about them, they kill anyone who "may" oppose them whether Sunni Shia or whatever in the worst way possible, but it seems they have a special tast for Shia blood as we've been seeing for the past years.

The latest explosions that targeted Shia pilgrims was today. It is a piss off to see iraqis getting killed for no reason, and when a person in the government is convicted of terrorism ( I'm talking about alhashimi) everyone calls to ignore or forgive just because he is Sunni or Shia. And before blaming be of being a "Maliki worshipped" I hate al Maliki's directions but Hashimis case isn't about sunni Shia or maliki, it's about the blood of innocent people. Unfortunately hundreds of terrorists are still free because they belong to a specific party. In basrah there are hundreds of cases In which the courts cant go on with Because the victims are In a political party. But hopefully in the coming years and when (if) we get a stronger government all the cases will resume and justice will be achieved even against the highest officials.

no comment.

Fair enough AlShawi....

FromBaghdad thank you for not commenting. :D Saved us all a lot of trouble..


Anyway, let's bring the discussion to the present. Who here would support early elections?

Fair enough AlShawi....

FromBaghdad thank you for not commenting. :D Saved us all a lot of trouble..


Anyway, let's bring the discussion to the present. Who here would support early elections?

2014 is a long time away.

merry chirstmas

chounz and kurd123, Hashimi case is handled by the Iraqi supreme court, therefore Iraqi tribunal sent a masculine arrest against Hashimi.
so the case is judicial and not political and has nothing to do with the sunni and shia. Decisions shall be within iraqi jurisdiction, and the iraqi supreme court is the country's higest administrative court. and what the kurdish government is doing is just a courtesy to Hashimi, above the iraqi constitution, and iraqi constitution states that the court's decision must be introduced where the incident took place.

although al Maliki gave him several chances, but without advantage with this man and he wouldn't atone for his sins.

RXkM6DbWUWs

Btw, the case will be unresolved if he does not show up to the Iraqi court, and things may get worse for him.
as I said earlier that the religion is more important than persons!
i say here agian iraq and iraqi blood is more important than persons!

and another thing kurd123, I live in Norway so I know very well who mullah Krekar is and what it's between Krekar and Maliki is not true! I'm bombing sure!

otherwise here we go after evidence and not rumors!

if it's true where is ZAINAR mission?

you should see this first!

hQhKt5pyjJ0&feature=related]

then.
0QEsmXexDD4&feature=related

you should see this first!

0QEsmXexDD4&feature=related

That's very funny. However, this shouldn't be considered more than a bit of comedy, because its a few short clips out of an interview. I detest Allawi but we should be fair.

That's very funny. However, this shouldn't be considered more than a bit of comedy, because its a few short clips out of an interview. I detest Allawi but we should be fair.

His pocket is full, what does the Diktor care about anyway.

Hey guys i have been wondering about your opinions regarding the politcians in iraq as nationalists. Do we even have nationalists? if that is the case which(party) or ( who) do you consider as a nationalist and why ( not ) ?

Hey guys i have been wondering about your opinions regarding the politcians in iraq as nationalists. Do we even have nationalists? if that is the case which(party) or ( who) do you consider as a nationalist and why ( not ) ?

What we have is a lot of thieves and rapists raping the country.

It can't be possible, that we don't even have 1 :(

It can't be possible, that we don't even 1 :(

There are individuals, but not many, and their parties are not very respectable (no Iraqi party is, IMO).

I like this part of the interview of (سحور سياسي), particularly from 03:15

RGftNW-KMd8

Haha it's a very funny part at 4:00. He got a point about, that Iran's influence have caused, lack of foreign investment in Iraq since they want to benefit, by investing in Iraq, though i'm not sure. For instance i heard that the Jays al mahdi destroyed an electric building in Samawa but that was in 2006 or something like that. However he is pathetic somehow, i mean you don't go around and say '' these'' are with the Iranians and ''those'' are with the Americans -.-

Haha it's a very funny part at 4:00. He got a point about, that Iran's influence have caused, lack of foreign investment in Iraq since they want to benefit, by investing in Iraq, though i'm not sure. For instance i heard that the Jays al mahdi destroyed an electric building in Samawa but that was in 2006 or something like that. However he is pathetic somehow, i mean you don't go around and say '' these'' are with the Iranians and ''those'' are with the Americans -.-

you're unfortunately wrong, he's 100% right bro, he doesn't need to prove who are compradors for whom? but the purpose implies that those politicians haven't emphasized public objectives in the country. day by day every word he says is sadly marked in Iraq's history.

http://www.eurasiareview.com/21042012-iraqs-new-international-role-oped/

April 21, 2012


By Yusuf Fernandez

In March 2012, Iraq hosted an Arab League summit for the first time in two decades. On May 23, it will similarly host the nuclear negotiations between Iran and the P5+1 group. According to commentators, both events show Iraq’s bid to reemerge as a regional power now that Saddam Hussein has gone and the American occupation has ended.

Although Baghdad still maintains good relations with Washington, there is no doubt that Iraq is asserting its independence and US influence in Iraq is waning. The threat by the Bush administration to withdraw all economic and military support from Iraq, if the country did not accept the agreement on the status of US forces in the country, did not lead the Iraqi government -who opposed any form of legitimation of the US military presence and especially the recognition of a right to legal extraterritoriality for American troops in the country- to give in to this blackmail.

Now, with US troops gone, the Obama Administration has preferred not to explore the possibility of future security agreements with the Iraqi government, which would lead to the presence of US military trainers and advisers in the country. Kenneth M. Pollack, director of the Saban Center for Middle East Policy at the Brookings Institution, claimed in an article: “We have surrendered so much of our influence”.

At the same time, contrary to what some media had hypothesized, security in the country is clearly improving. Al-Qaeda and other extremist groups are still a threat and continue to carry out coordinated attacks killing dozens of people in the country. However, their actions are diminishing in frequency and intensity. The arrest of numerous terrorists in recent months and the lack of popular support for their cause have contributed to this result.

On the other hand, Iraq’s political system makes the country immune to the challenges of the Arab Spring. Although the Iraqi government is not popular among some groups of the population, no one doubts of its political legitimacy after gaining the confidence of the Parliament, which has been elected through fair and clean elections.

The improvement of security has been accompanied by a rapid economic development. Iraq’s gross domestic product is expected to grow by an average rate of at least 9.4% annually between 2012 and 2016 as the oil-producing country largely benefits from higher oil prices, a senior central bank official said in February. In 2011, the GDP grew around 5-6%.

“We expect Iraq’s GDP in 2015 to jump to 360 billion dollars from 170 billion currently,” deputy central bank governor Mudher Kasim told Reuters. “The reason (for the increase) will come from oil… If the oil sector is developed it will drive the country’s development engine.”

Camps in the South have been refurbished and oil is being exported at record levels. Iraq expects to be producing between 5 million and 6 million barrels a day of oil by 2015, around double its current level, said the country’s Deputy Prime Minister for Energy, Hussein al-Shahristani. On March 14, the Oil Ministry predicted that Iraq’s crude oil reserves, currently pegged at 143.1 billion barrels, will double in the next few years because of wider exploration and increased development by international companies operating Iraq´s major fields.

The planned oil production increase is a result of an effort to renovate many large but depleted oil fields that were starved of investment for more than two decades of sanctions and war. Major international oil companies are now taking part in these projects and this led to an increase in the oil production of around 500,000 barrels a day in 2011, Shahristani said.

Iraq’s religious influence over the region’s Shiite communities is also increasing. Many Shiites, including from the Persian Gulf countries, regularly visit the holy cities of Najaf and Kerbala in Ashura and the Arba in festivities and maintain strong links with the Iraqi religious establishment.

The Baghdad Summit
In March, dignitaries from 20 nations across the region poured into a Baghdad to discuss the many important issues confronting the Arab world, including the crisis in Syria, the political transitions in Egypt and Libya and the Israeli colonization in Palestine.

“Iraq today embraces its Arab brothers,” said Ali al-Musawi, a spokesman for Iraqi Prime Minister, Nouri al-Maliki. “We know very well that holding the summit in Baghdad will restore our economic and political significance as a major player and a pivotal state in the region.” He added that Iraq has already settled a 500 million dollars airline lawsuit with Kuwait, agreed to a prisoner exchange with Saudi Arabia, and restored full diplomatic relations with Libya.

The summit was considered a sign of Iraq’s reacceptance in the Arab world after more than two decades of isolation. Iraq spent more than 500 million dollars to clean up and renovate Baghdad and restore the Republican Palace, built by Saddam Hussein and then occupied by the US Embassy for several years, where the summit took place.

Among the leaders of the Persian Gulf Arab states only the Kuwaiti emir attended the summit. The Kuwaiti emir’s presence reflected the improvement of the long tense ties between both countries since Saddam Hussein’s 1990 invasion and seven-month occupation of Kuwait.

“It is no surprise that the [Persian] Gulf States did not want to give Iraq the prestige that they would by sending heads of state to the summit,” said Crispin B. Hawes, Middle East director of the Eurasia Group, a New York-based risk consultant agency, to Associated Press. “They want Iraq to continue to be a second-rate citizen in the region; they want to keep Iraq inside the box. They do not want it to be another major regional player.”

Some [Persian] Gulf Arab states and Iraq have publicly clashed because of Iraq’s support for the revolution of Bahrain and close relations with Iran. In particular, Saudi Arabia has not yet accepted the new realities in Iraq. During the Iraq-Iran war (1980-1988), Saudis supported Saddam Hussein against Shiite Iran although they changed their policy when Saddam’s army invaded Iraq in 1990. Saudi Arabia took part in the [Persian] Gulf War against Iraq and the relations between both countries were openly hostile until the last years of Saddam´s rule in which they started to improve.

Currently, Saudi rulers are wary of a democratic culture in Iraq and also laments the overarching reality of Shiite parties controlling a country as rich in resources as Iraq. They are also concerned that Iraq has the potential to overtake Saudi Arabia as the world’s top exporter of oil. In this way, according to some experts, Saudi Arabia will thus do what it can to ensure instability prevails in Iraq in order to prevent Shiite groups and parties from becoming stronger than they are already.

Saudi rulers have been funding the Iraqi opposition, the Iraqiyya coalition, led by former Baathist Iyad Allawi and have publicly received the Iraqi Vice President Hashemi, who is wanted by the Iraqi authorities under the charge of having links with terrorism. Recently, Saudi King Abdullah bin Abdel Aziz told US President Barack Obama that he did not trust Maliki at all because he was “an Iranian agent”.

For its part, Iraqi media has regularly accused some of the country’s neighbors, particularly Saudi Arabia, of supporting Al-Qaeda and other Sunni extremist groups operating in the country. Around 3,000 Saudis are currently in Iraqi prisons because of terrorism charges.

Iraq and other non- Persian Gulf Arab states such as Algeria, also oppose Qatar and Saudi Arabia’s bid to arm Syrian rebels fighting Damascus, claiming that toppling Assad “could spark sectarian violence”. Iraq has also rejected any form of interference in Syria or the adoption of sanctions against this country. “We cannot overthrow by force the government of Bashar al-Assad, and military aid brought by Saudi and Qatar is a flagrant interference in the internal affairs of Syria and all Arab countries”, Maliki said.

Observers in Baghdad claim that the fall of Bashar al Assad’s regime could prove to be disastrous for the Iraqi Shiite-led government, especially if it gives access to power to Sunni radical groups or the new Syrian government allies itself with Saudi Arabia or Persian Gulf countries because it could empower and radicalize rival Sunni parties in Iraq.

Iraq’s new role is not limited to the Arab world as it shows its hosting of the second round of talks between Iran and the P5+1 group over the Iranian nuclear program, which will take place on 27 May in Baghdad instead of Istanbul. Iraqi Foreign Minister Hoshiyar Zebari told Reuters the proposal for talks in Baghdad came from an Iranian delegation visiting Iraq recently and that the Iraqi government had supported the proposal. The United States and other Western governments also accepted it.

Therefore, Iraq’s new political independence and economic development, along with its close relationship with Iran and the Western countries and its reentry into the Arab world, will lead the country to play an increasingly important role in international and regional scenarios after decades of isolation and war.

---moved to a more appropriate thread.

Wait, shaytan are you a mode now or something?

No, I'm not. why do you ask?

Good article. But it seems to throw a lot of things out with no evidence.
Anyway.. Is iyad realy being funded by saudi? Wenal daleel?

well. I dont have any proof. I guess its purely circumstantial. Where's the proof that Iran funded Sadr? there's no check that we can see!

Exactly, I want to see bank statements or video footage lool. Hem hay yigdaroon yizawiruha :/

The head of the world's largest intergovernmental body after the UN, the 57-member Organization of Islamic Cooperation (OIC), has said it will weigh in on Iraq in order to diffuse the governance crisis there that has escalated along sectarian lines.
Ekmeleddin İhsanoğlu, the secretary-general of the OIC, told Today's Zaman in Libreville, the capital of Gabon, that the organization has been working on a comprehensive plan to reinvigorate the 2006 Mecca agreement in order to resolve the disputes in Iraq.

“At the Arab League summit in Baghdad, I had a long conversation with Iraqi Prime Minister Nouri al-Maliki. We are working to reinvigorate the Mecca agreement and take it to the next stage,” he said.

The Mecca agreement, signed in 2006 in Jeddah under the auspices of the OIC, is a 10-point compromise deal reached by major Iraqi factions in which Muslim Shiite and Sunni groups called for an end to bloodshed and sectarian violence. The document calls for the safeguarding of the two communities' holy places and the defense of the unity and territorial integrity of Iraq. The OIC reconciliation conference at which the Mecca agreement was signed had helped to stabilize Iraq.

Sectarian tensions flared in Iraq in December, when the Shiite-led government tried to remove Sunni Deputy Prime Minister Saleh al-Mutlaq and sought an arrest warrant for Sunni Vice President Tariq al-Hashemi on charges he had run death squads.

Turkish Prime Minister Recep Tayyip Erdoğan, who had supported the 2006 agreement, accused Maliki last week of fanning tensions between the country's Shiites, Sunnis and Kurds with his "self-centered" ways. Turkey is worried that the violence in Syria and growing tension in Iraq could lead to a wider conflict between Shiite and Sunni Muslims in the region.

İhsanoğlu, a Turkish diplomat who heads the OIC, said the request to renew the Mecca agreement actually came from Maliki himself. “Maliki values the Mecca agreement. We are prepared to renew this agreement. We'll be sending a team to Baghdad soon,” he explained. The OIC head dismissed claims that the original agreement died after fresh sectarian violence erupted in Iraq, saying that both the head of the Iraqi government and other stakeholders in the Middle East want to broaden the terms of the agreement.

The OIC leader met with Maliki on the sidelines of the Arab League summit held in March, which was marred by the sectarian dispute when fewer than half the leaders of the Arab world showed up in an apparent snub of Maliki's pro-Shiite, pro-Iranian policies.

TEHRAN — Iraqi Prime Minister Nuri al-Maliki arrived in Tehran on Sunday for two days of meetings with Iranian leaders and senior officials on various bilateral issues, Iran's IRNA state news agency reported.
The visit notably comes ahead of an important May 23 meeting to be hosted in Baghdad between Iran and the P5+1 group of world powers on Tehran's disputed nuclear programme.
Maliki's schedule of meetings including President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad underlined the current good relations between their Shiite-dominated administrations -- a far cry from the hostility and war that reigned between their countries in the 1980s when Baghdad was run by Saddam Hussein and his Sunni-led government.
Maliki, who was at the head of a delegation of ranking Iraqi political and economic officials, was also to see parliamentary speaker Ali Larijani and chief nuclear negotiator Saeed Jalili, and to attend a meeting of the Iran-Iraq joint economic commission.
The focus of talks was on bilateral, regional and international issues, and to "develop and strengthen bilateral ties," IRNA reported.
It was Maliki's first visit to Tehran since October 2010, when he was trying to secure regional backing for a second term as premier following inconclusive March parliamentary polls.
Iraq and Iran have similar positions on the crisis in Syria, where the regime of Iranian ally President Bashar al-Assad has been carrying out a bloody crackdown on an uprising against his rule, in which thousands have died.
But there are some contentious issues between the two countries, including the diversion by Iran of rivers that flow into Iraq, as well as borders and oil.

Lol who wrote this article? Never knew you could start a sentence with 'But'.

Its from AP. Yes you can begin a sentence with "but" AFAIK.

It's interesting how our neighbours are so keen to "diffuse sectarian tensions" in Iraq. Maybe they should diffuse the ethno-sectarian tensions in their own countries first. Especially Saudi Arabia and Bahrain, who are unapologetically anti-Shia.

Tehran: Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad on Sunday said that if Iran and Iraq stay “powerful and esteemed” there will be no place for enemies of the world’s nations, including the United States and the Zionist regime, media reported on Sunday.

In a meeting with Iraqi Prime Minister Nouri al-Maliki in Tehran, Ahmadinejad said that Tehran-Baghdad ties are exemplary.

“Tehran, Baghdad share ‘unbreakable’ relationship,” he said.

Iranian PM said that there is no obstacle in the path of consolidating relations between the two countries at regional and international levels.

During the meeting, Maliki called for the expansion of relations based on the principles of peace, stability, and common interests and said that Tehran-Baghdad political relationship is close but the two countries should make every effort to enhance ties in other spheres as well.

There is a need for a great stride in relations, he said, adding the two countries’ officials are determined to cement ties in all areas.

Maliki also met with Iranian Majlis Speaker Ali Larijani and held talks on various issues including the latest developments in the region and the world.


Nooooooooooooooooooooooo!! :lol: OH NO please god no! We're screwed for eternity!

Iran is like the girl in the relationship and iraq is like the guy. One part of him wants to commit and the other part doesn't, which is causing some internal struggle. The girl is so clingy and is nothing but trouble for the guy, and only wants to change him and make him become more like her. :D

Just off the top of my head..

Iran is desprate atm. This isnt good.

منصورة ايران

iran is sexy...

if we unite can we do like a special ministry for SEEGHA? we call it ...

Union's Minister for Seegha Affairs! FYI, Seegha is mut3a.

And I like how chounz puts it...

Iran knows how to play the game, but they don't understand that a strong relation with them will bring trouble to Iraq.
Let's keep a neutral relation with everyone especially the USA an turkey

Iranians detest Arabs. Every friendly gesture from them is deceit.

Never forget how much contempt they have for Iraqis.

Iran is like the girl in the relationship and iraq is like the guy. One part of him wants to commit and the other part doesn't, which is causing some internal struggle. The girl is so clingy and is nothing but trouble for the guy, and only wants to change him and make him become more like her. :D

Just off the top of my head..

It's not like that at all. It's more like they think we're stupid and can use us like they use Lebanese Shia to further their regime's goals.

Iranians detest Arabs. Every friendly gesture from them is deceit.

Never forget how much contempt they have for Iraqis.

QUOTED FOR TRUTH!

thanks for the article.

It's not like that at all. It's more like they think we're stupid and can use us like they use Lebanese Shia to further their regime's goals.

But we are stupid and they do use us. ?

But we are stupid and they do use us. ?

It's more that they use individuals and parties that benefit from their patronage.

No one's fooled.

It's a dilemma either we side with Iran or Saudi Arabia, and Iraqi politicians have decided to side with Iran for known reasons, but we could get over this dilemma if we unite and become the leading nation in the middle east,that way well become leaders and not followers

iran is sexy...

if we unite can we do like a special ministry for SEEGHA? we call it ...

Union's Minister for Seegha Affairs! FYI, Seegha is mut3a.

And I like how chounz puts it...
I nominate basrwii for minster of mut3a, fbwl can be his deputy.. both will have so much fun together.. they should start a reality show

It's more that they use individuals and parties that benefit from their patronage.

No one's fooled.

no one really buys any of this, its a marriage of convenience ..

but this can be good for iraq if we can push some issues like oil and borders given Iran's somewhat desperately looking for allies in the region

Iraq's Sadr in Kurdistan to mediate crisis

By Abdel Hamid Zebari (AFP) – 8 hours ago

ARBIL, Iraq — Powerful Iraqi Shiite cleric Moqtada al-Sadr arrived in Iraq's Kurdistan region on Thursday, presenting himself as a mediator in a crisis between Iraq's premier and the region's president.

Tensions are high between the autonomous region's president, Massud Barzani, and Prime Minister Nuri al-Maliki, whom Barzani has accused of moving toward dictatorship.

"I met Nuri al-Maliki in Tehran, and I came to listen to the opinion of the Kurdish leaders and their views," Sadr told a news conference at Arbil airport, after arriving on a private plane from Tehran.

"Everyone should look out for the public interest and the unity of the Iraqi people, and I hope that everyone will be responsible," he said.

Sadr then presented a list of 18 points that he wants to discuss with Kurdish leaders.

"Minorities are an important part of Iraq, and we have to bring them to participate in building Iraq, politically, economically and in security," Sadr said, also calling for "cancelling the policy of neglect and marginalisation."

Another point is that "we have to work to support the Iraqi government by bringing all the components of the Iraqi people inside it," he said.

And "we have to give priority to Iraqi interests over sectarian and ethnic and party interests."

Sadr also said "we have to end the issue of the security posts," meaning that permanent ministers of security and defence must be appointed.

And "we have to stand strongly against any internal or foreign threats against any component of the Iraqi people," he said.

Fuad Hussein, head of the office of the presidency in Kurdistan, said this was "a historic visit, and it will lead to the expansion and strengthening of the relationship between Kurdistan and all Iraq."

"It will also lead to more stability in the political situation in the country," he told journalists at the airport.

Sadr, who spends most of his time on religious studies in Iran, "will meet Barzani today, and there is a significant possibility that he will go to Najaf after finishing his meetings in Kurdistan," a Sadr source told AFP.

Najaf is the Shiite holy city where Sadr's main office is located, and where he spent much of his life.

Sadr spokesman Salah al-Obeidi earlier told a news conference in Baghdad that the cleric had accepted an invitation to visit Kurdistan, saying "the crisis needs such a move to resolve the situation."

He added that "the sayyid (Sadr) is trying to put Al-Ahrar (his parliamentary bloc) and himself personally in the middle."

"One of the goals of the visit is to solve the crisis," Obeidi said.

Barzani said on April 22 that he opposes the sale of F-16 warplanes to Iraq while Maliki is premier, as he fears they would be used against Kurdistan.

Barzani had previously accused Maliki of moving toward dictatorship, and said the premier aimed to "kill the democratic process" after the head of Iraq's electoral commission was arrested for alleged corruption.

Earlier this month, Kurdistan stopped oil exports over more than $1.5 billion (1.13 billion euros) it said is owed to foreign oil companies working in the region, that Baghdad has allegedly withheld.

The central government's top two oil officials responded by saying Arbil owed Baghdad more than $5 billion in promised exports, and was smuggling the oil it produced to Iran.

Sada8a il allah. :D Sar 'mediator'..

Sada8a il allah. :D Sar 'mediator'..

It's a circus.

It's a circus.

Indeed. I'm surprised Hashimi hasn't come back to solve the dispute between Maliki and Barzani himself. :D

:lol:

Damn right its a circus.

a circus of incompetent murderers and thieves with fanatical supporters in the millions :D

Lool, wow, the irony.

After a new play in the circus, the Shia party's have withdrew all support from the Kurds and Iraqia bloc for changing the government. The Turkish/Saudi/qatari/barzani plan isn't going to succeed.

I knew it, moqtada gave Iraqia and barzani some hope when he talked against Maliki, but he withdrew support After probably an under the table deal with Maliki.

I personally hate Malikis policy but I don't want him to fall right now. It's better to have change through elections. But he should certainly think about decreasing the restrictions on provincial councils and other government institutions.

a circus of incompetent murderers and thieves with fanatical supporters in the millions :D

I don't think it's the "supporters". the problem with Iraqi politics as I said before is they're all bad. But we have to choose the best of the worst. We the people have no other choice. The honorable people are usually targeted.
But at the end of the day we can't talk against them if we don't vote.

But again there are many blind followers. I won't lie I used to be one mysel, until I went to Iraq and figured they're all just corrupt mafias controlling the government institutions. I start to hate on every single one of them after a trip to the mina2.

who did you use to support?

I just feel so much disappointed guys that i have no hope of iraq getting out of this mess in near future
If the mentality of our people not going to change we not going anywhere
Most of the provincial council members are good for nothing some of them even scare of correcting abad planed project

All this provincial council election should stop and central goverment decide on projects til the mentality of people change so they will be able to choose the right people to the job

There is a meeting now between Allawi, Talabani, Barazani, Sadr and Nujaifi brothers in Erbil.

who did you use to support?

Il keep that disclosed don't want want any headache replies. Lol

I understand you. :)

Secular, non religious affiliated government all the way..... Religion is to valuble to be involved in such corruption.

I would like to see Iraq as secular also but it's highly unlikely at the moment..

Secular, non religious affiliated government all the way..... Religion is to valuble to be involved in such corruption.

+1

Secular, non religious affiliated government all the way......

Lets hope we get some secular, competent patriots so that we can vote out the current crop of losers and morons.

The announcement has increased tensions between Erbil an Baghdad. According to AFP, Massud Barzani, the president of Iraq’s autonomous Kurdistan, said he opposes the sale of F-16 warplanes to Iraq while Nuri al-Maliki is premier, as he fears they would be used against the region.


Ok, please someone tell me that this is a propaganda lie and berzani did not say this! Honestly, after everything that iraq has gone through this man thinks that the government is going to drop bombs in kurdistan?

This is offensive and beyond stupid for him to say such a statement.

barazan is playing with fire. he'll regret it.

Honestly, I'm shocked, cant believe he said such a thing. I thought he was smarter then that :/

The announcement has increased tensions between Erbil an Baghdad. According to AFP, Massud Barzani, the president of Iraq’s autonomous Kurdistan, said he opposes the sale of F-16 warplanes to Iraq while Nuri al-Maliki is premier, as he fears they would be used against the region.


Ok, please someone tell me that this is a propaganda lie and berzani did not say this! Honestly, after everything that iraq has gone through this man thinks that the government is going to drop bombs in kurdistan?

This is offensive and beyond stupid for him to say such a statement.

He doesn't mean that the Iraqi Government is going to commit another genocide on the Kurds once they recieve the F-16s, but I think he's just generally worried that the Iraqi Army will of course become stronger and Maliki might use the planes at some point to threaten Kurdistan. He's definitely being a bit paranoid but I don't blame him COMPLETELY for being concerned.

Personally, I really don't think that Maliki ordered the planes with the intent of using them against Kurdistan or anything like that, we need to build up our army and it's a good deal I guess, but I don't think Barzani's statement was really that 'offensive' or 'stupid'.

No chounz, it shows how far behind the relations are. Its utter bullshit.

^^ completely agree bruvs, internal squabbles among politicians happens in every nation in the world, but to undermine the central government like that, is complete and utter ignorance on barazani's behalf. Hes just taken things way outta proportion, i mean up until 2 months ago, everything seemed fine and dandy between KRG and baghdad, but now all of a sudden, you get him dropping these F bombs left right and centre. dictatorship this, F16 genocide this, i mean common, someone has to draw the line for this jackass. besides, these F16 are going to be the property of IRAQ, not maliki, theyll be used to protect ALL of iraq, including KRG, not malikis house. someone should just tell this bitch to calm the fuck down and stop making a scene :D

someone should just tell this bitch to calm the fuck down and stop making a scene :D

:lol: Why are you so excited.. :D

im not, its just getting ridiculously funny to even hear this guy speak every day about the same shit over and over again, makes all of look bad.

INTERPOL issues Red Notice for Iraq Vice-President

http://www.interpol.int/var/interpol/storage/images/internet/homepage/slider-homepage/interpol-issues-red-notice-for-iraq-vice-president/99226-1-eng-GB/INTERPOL-issues-Red-Notice-for-Iraq-Vice-President.jpg;pvec4463b9cc2d5251

LYON, France – At the request of Iraqi authorities, INTERPOL has published a Red Notice for Iraq’s Vice-President, Tariq Al-Hashemi, on suspicion of guiding and financing terrorist attacks in the country.
The Red Notice for Al-Hashemi represents a regional an international alert to all of INTERPOL’s 190 member countries to seek their help in locating and arresting him, following the issue of a national arrest warrant by Iraq’s Judicial Investigative Authority as part of an investigation in which security forces seized bombing materials and arrested individuals.
The publication of the INTERPOL Red Notice for Tariq Al-Hashemi will see INTERPOL's Fugitive Investigative Support unit and the Command and Coordination Centre at its General Secretariat headquarters closely liaise with its National Central Bureaus in the region and worldwide to pool and update all relevant intelligence.
“The INTERPOL Red Notice against Tariq Al-Hashemi will significantly restrict his ability to travel and cross international borders. It is a powerful tool that will help authorities around the world locate and arrest him,” said INTERPOL Secretary General Ronald K. Noble.
“This case also clearly demonstrates the commitment of Iraqi authorities to work with the world police community via INTERPOL to apprehend individuals facing serious charges,” added the Head of INTERPOL.
Containing identification details and judicial information about a wanted person, a Red Notice is circulated to police in all of INTERPOL’s member countries and seeks the apprehension of a wanted person with a view to their extradition.
A Red Notice is not an international arrest warrant. Many of INTERPOL’s member countries however, consider a Red Notice a valid request for provisional arrest, especially if they are linked to the requesting country via a bilateral extradition treaty. In cases where arrests are made based on a Red Notice, these are made by national police officials in INTERPOL member countries.
INTERPOL cannot demand that any member country arrest the subject of a Red Notice, and an individual wanted for arrest should be considered innocent until proven guilty.

http://www.interpol.int/News-and-media/News-media-releases/2012/PR039

THE RED NOTICE
http://www.interpol.int/Wanted-Persons/(wanted_id)/2012-297774

http://www.iraqup.com/up/20120509/OB08r-yUl0_700928977.jpg

scum!

7EEEEEIILLL!

Iraqi leaders threaten PM with vote of no confidence

Four of the most senior political leaders in Iraq’s fragile coalition have threatened to bring a vote of no confidence in the government unless “autocratic decision-making” stops, a letter published in a state newspaper on May 5 said.

The four senior lawmakers, Osama al-Nujaifi, Masoud Barzani, Ayad Allawi and Moqtada al-Sadr, sent the letter to Prime Minister Nouri al-Maliki’s bloc on May 3, political sources told Reuters.

Some of al-Maliki’s opponents, including Barzani and Sadr, have accused him of becoming a dictator and several of his critics say he deliberately sidelines Sunnis and Kurds. The letter outlines eight demands to be met by May 13 to ensure the four leaders’ support for al-Maliki’s administration. “In case of a refusal to comply with the principles and frameworks of this agreement, practical steps will be taken, within a period of time not exceeding 15 days, to act upon a vote of no confidence against the government,” the letter says. The letter is dated April 28, the last day of a three-day mini-summit held by the leaders during which they said they tried to find a solution to the political impasse. Maliki did not attend the meeting, which was held in the Kurdish capital Arbil.

The letter called on the government to stop interfering with the security forces and with the work of parliament and contained a paragraph criticizing autocratic decision-making. “Putting an end to any kind of one-man decision-making in the government pyramid and a tendency towards autocracy,” the sixth demand reads. The letter also demanded that a two-term limit for the post of prime minister be retroactively introduced. Al-Maliki is serving his second four-year term as prime minister.

“(This is necessary) in order to ensure a peaceful transfer of power and to establish the foundations and principles of democracy and in order not to allow a climate of dictatorship,” it said. Al-Maliki’s bloc met on April 3 and pledged to hold a meeting of all of the coalition’s political blocs within a week to hammer out a solution to the crisis, Ibrahim al-Jaafari, chairman of the coalition, said in a statement on his website.

lool i thought you hated moqtada ;) ^^ and woow its funny how low these people are going lol they are accusing almaliki of being a dictator by "targeting" the sunnis when in fact the only reason they are accusing him of this is because they want to be in his position instead of him because ive never heard of almaliki targeting sunnis and killing them so they try and portray him as some sectarian dictator lol ... pathetic

^^ i bet you all moqtada haters are giving him the thumbs up now
That really shows you how narrow minded some peope are!!!

And im not a big fan of almaliki but whoever going to replace him is gona do the same if not worse in getting his people and followers in to goverment positions

Muqtada is probably taking his orders from Tehran. Those guys are getting sick of Maliki, and would like to see Iraq fall into chaos again.

I await this vote of no confidence. They are, after all, entitled to exercise their democratic right.

Lets see how the Iraqis take to being ruled by the four mentioned.

lool i thought you hated moqtada ;) ^^ and woow its funny how low these people are going lol they are accusing almaliki of being a dictator by "targeting" the sunnis when in fact the only reason they are accusing him of this is because they want to be in his position instead of him because ive never heard of almaliki targeting sunnis and killing them so they try and portray him as some sectarian dictator lol ... pathetic

Yeh, it's a bit rich of Muqtada, of all people, to make claims about Maliki being sectarian.

Iranian tool.

The vote of no confidence isn't going to pass and the sadris will never practically ally with Iraqia and barzani against the national coalition. Moqtada is just trying to pressure Maliki on some issues. But just wait and see ,the barzani party and Iraqia block are going to have their jaws drawn down after the sadris vote against them. We all know what this is about especially after Qatar and Saudi Arabia got on the line. its another step to weaken the Shias.

But what pisses me off is moqtadas retarded political mentality. His blaming Maliki of being sectarian (REALLY??). I'm not saying Maliki is any better but moqtada should be the last to talk. Besides this kind of talk should be avoided since our Arab sisters just want something to use against Iraq.

The Interpol arrest warrant was a big "boori" that dropped on barzani's and erdogans head. Lol I can imagine how put down they feel especially barzani. They're going to their "lugi" state right now.

al iraqyia had an interview with al maliki yesterday, i couldn't find it on the web, but i recommend you to watch it. they'll probably rerun it tomorrow.

as for those who are hating on al maliki. mark my words, when we're gonna have a new government. ALL of you gonna wish he was still in power.

wallah he's ashraf wahid, and the only one fighting for a united iraq.

MUST WATCH

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fSddijvn0KE

smuggling the oil has reached to Afghanistan, hehe.

MUST WATCH

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fSddijvn0KE

كلامك صحيح يا حبيبي رشيد...بس لو يعوف المالكي و يجي غيرة اضن احسن,, لأن الكهرباء ماكو

كلامك صحيح يا حبيبي رشيد...بس لو يعوف المالكي و يجي غيرة اضن احسن,, لأن الكهرباء ماكو

حبيبي هو كلما يريد يسوي شي يطلعولة ميت الف سالفة

المالكي راد يبني بيوت للفقراء ماقبلوا عليه كالو لان هاي دعاية للمالكي

they don't want him to succeed or have good reputation.

alhajaj was a bad man, but he said something very true about iraqis:

يا أهل العراق يا اهل الشقاق والنفاق

حبيبي هو كلما يريد يسوي شي يطلعولة ميت الف سالفة

المالكي راد يبني بيوت للفقراء ماقبلوا عليه كالو لان هاي دعاية للمالكي

they don't want him to succeed or have good reputation.

alhajaj was a bad man, but he said something very true about iraqis:

يا أهل العراق يا اهل الشقاق والنفاق

Hajjaj may have been right in that regard, but remember this is something much bigger than Iraqis. The Sunnis and the Iranians have a common interest in Iraq failing.

Hajjaj may have been right in that regard, but remember this is something much bigger than Iraqis. The Sunnis and the Iranians have a common interest in Iraq failing.

yep , true .. and more countries are involved.

it's because they know if iraq becomes stable. we will be the richest country in the region, and the most powerful, and all decisions in the middle-east must be approved by us.

they don't want that to happen. they want us to stay weak, and keep us fighting each other.

yep , true .. and more countries are involved.

it's because they know if iraq becomes stable. we will be the richest country in the region, and the most powerful, and all decisions in the middle-east must be approved by us.

they don't want that to happen. they want us to stay weak, and keep us fighting each other.

A7sant akhoia.

yep , true .. and more countries are involved.

it's because they know if iraq becomes stable. we will be the richest country in the region, and the most powerful, and all decisions in the middle-east must be approved by us.

they don't want that to happen. they want us to stay weak, and keep us fighting each other.

if almaliki leaves, its better, maybe he is shareef but he surely cannot control the situation, hence he best resign. can't he see that the other parliamentarians don't want him.

if almaliki leaves, its better, maybe he is shareef but he surely cannot control the situation, hence he best resign. can't he see that the other parliamentarians don't want him.

they don't want him, because he's not allowing them to play with iraq as they please.

he's most likely not running for another term.

That's what he at least said let's see if he can keep that promise. :)

Look, Maliki doesn't sit there making decisions by himself. If Haider al Abadi or Hussein Shahristani replaces him, there's not going to be much difference in what you see from the Da'wa party.

Man this thread is a waste of time...

I just wondered why that Al Maliki has still not given the important military posts, like the defence minister, to one from his own party?

he did, but the other parties didn't accept the names he proposed.

am telling you, they're not letting the guy work.

BjMlUYbEQGs

cuDGTpaqZgc

3qCo4j1umqI

ههههههه

is he the same guy who went crazy when someone said something bad about saddam on tv ?

Yes, the same bastard.

is he the same guy who went crazy when someone said something bad about saddam on tv ?

Yes this is the ba3thi Mish3an Al Jubouri.... FBWL why did you leave out the most important part? :lol:

https://www.rasheed-b.com/2007/01/04/video-show-some-selfrespect-or-i-will-do-something-you-can-not-even-imagine/

mish3an is just a plain old nutter. he spent years calling maliki a safawi and vowing to behead him! now this :lol:

http://www.hrw.org/news/2012/05/15/iraq-mass-arrests-incommunicado-detentions

(Beirut) – Iraq’s government has been carrying out mass arrests and unlawfully detaining people in the notorious Camp Honor prison facility in Baghdad’s Green Zone, based on numerous interviews with victims, witnesses, family members, and government officials. The government had claimed a year ago that it had closed the prison, where Human Rights Watch had documented rampant torture.

Since October 2011 Iraqi authorities have conducted several waves of detentions, one of which arresting officers and officials termed “precautionary.” Numerous witnesses told Human Rights Watch that security forces have typically surrounded neighborhoods in Baghdad and other provinces and gone door-to-door with long lists of names of people they wanted to detain. The government has held hundreds of detainees for months, refusing to disclose the number of those detained, their identities, any charges against them, and where they are being held.

“Iraqi security forces are grabbing people outside of the law, without trial or known charges, and hiding them away in incommunicado sites,” said Joe Stork, deputy Middle East director at Human Rights Watch. “The Iraqi government should immediately reveal the names and locations of all detainees, promptly free those not charged with crimes, and bring those facing charges before an independent judicial authority.”

The government should appoint an independent judicial commission to investigate continuing allegations of torture and other ill-treatment, disappearances, and arbitrary detention in Camp Honor and elsewhere, Human Rights Watch said.

Multiple witnesses told Human Rights Watch that some detainees arrested since December 2011 have been held in the Camp Honor prison in Baghdad’s International Zone, known as the Green Zone. In March 2011 the government announced it had closed Camp Honor prison, after legislators visited the site in response to evidence Human Rights Watch provided of repeated torture at the facility.

The two most sweeping arrest dragnets occurred in October and November 2011, detaining people alleged to be Baath Party and Saddam Hussein loyalists, and in March 2012, ahead of the Arab summit in Baghdad at the end of that month.

In April two Justice Ministry officials separately told Human Rights Watch that since the roundups began in October, security forces often have not transferred prisoners into the full custody of the justice system, as required by Iraq law. Instead, the officials said, security forces have transported dozens of prisoners at a time in and out of various prison facilities, sometimes without adequate paperwork or explanation, under the authority of the military office of Prime Minister Nuri al-Maliki.

Fourteen lawyers, detainees, and government officials interviewed by Human Rights Watch said that recent detainees have been held at Camp Honor prison. Some of the officials said that detainees have also been held at two secret detention facilities, also inside Baghdad’s Green Zone. These allegations are consistent with concerns raised in a confidential letter from the International Committee of the Red Cross (ICRC) obtained by Human Rights Watch in July 2011 after the letter’s existence was made public by the Los Angeles Times.

Officials, lawyers, and former detainees also told Human Rights Watch that judicial investigators from the Supreme Judicial Council continue to conduct interrogations at the Camp Honor prison. Between December and May, Human Rights Watch interviewed over 35 former detainees, family members, lawyers, legislators, and Iraqi government and security officials from the Defense, Interior, and Justice Ministries. Without exception, they expressed great concern for their own safety and requested that Human Rights Watch withhold all names, dates, and places of interviews to protect their identities.

“It’s a matter of grave concern that Iraqis in so many walks of life, officials included, are afraid for their own well-being and fear great harm if they discuss allegations of serious human rights abuses,” Stork said.

“Precautionary” Detentions ahead of March 2012 Arab Summit

The most recent mass arrests occurred in March as the government dramatically tightened security throughout Baghdad in preparation for the Arab League summit there on March 29. Family members and witnesses told Human Rights Watch that arresting officers characterized the roundups as a “precautionary” measure to prevent terrorist attacks during the summit. Six detainees released in April told Human Rights Watch that while they were in detention, interrogators told them that they were being held to curb criminal activity during the summit and any “embarrassing” public protests.

Legislators from Prime Minister al-Maliki’s State of Law party have denied in the news media that any preemptive arrests took place, claiming that all arrests were of suspected criminals and in response to judicial warrants. All detainees and witnesses interviewed, over 20 in all, said they had not been shown arrest warrants.

In Baghdad neighborhoods where multiple arrests were made, including Adhamiya, Furat, Jihad, Abu Ghraib, and Rathwaniya, residents told Human Rights Watch it appeared that a large proportion of those detained had previously spent time in prisons run by the US military, including Abu Ghraib, Camp Bucca, and Camp Cropper. Some family members and legislators concluded that people were being arrested not because of suspected current criminal activity, but simply because they had been detained before.

In May an Interior Ministry official told Human Rights Watch that “security forces, in the interest of keeping security incidents to a minimum during the summit, while the world was watching, sometimes decided it was easier to just round up people who had been imprisoned years before, regardless of what crime they may have committed.” In April a Justice Ministry official told Human Rights Watch that of the hundreds arrested, “some have been released, about 100 will be officially charged within the justice system, and the rest are somewhere else. We do not know where.”

During an April 9 parliament session, Hassan al-Sinead, head of the parliament’s Security and Defense Committee and a member of Prime Minister al-Maliki’s State of Law Party, held up what he said were official security reports of Baghdad Operation Command and said, in response to allegations of pre-emptive arrests by other legislators, that there were only 532 arrests in all of Baghdad during the month of March, and that none were pre-emptive.

Two other members of the parliamentary committee subsequently told Human Rights Watch that this figure greatly underreported arrests that month. At the April 9 session an investigative committee was formed, made up of members of the Security and Defense and Human Rights committees. Members of the investigative committee told Human Rights Watch that plans to visit detainees never happened. To date, no investigation results have been released.

“Baathist” Arrests

In October and November 2011, security forces arrested hundreds of people in Baghdad and outlying provinces, almost all during nighttime raids on residential neighborhoods. State television reported that Prime Minister al-Maliki ordered these arrests. Government statements, including by the prime minister, claimed that those arrested were Saddam Hussein loyalists plotting against the government. Family members told Human Rights Watch that security forces came to their doors with lists and read off names. Some of those listed were former Baath party members and others were not, including people who had died years ago. Three officials separately told Human Rights Watch that the total number arrested in the campaign approached 1,500.

A man whose 57-year-old father was arrested along with 11 neighbors on October 30 told Human Rights Watch in December, “A week after my father was arrested, some of the same police officers who arrested him came back and found family members to give them belongings [of neighborhood men who had been arrested], like clothes or money or IDs, but they still said they had no information about where they were being held, or what they were being charged with.”

The man’s son showed Human Rights Watch a document the police had given to him that listed the date his father was arrested but left blank the space reserved for the name of the detention facility.

Upon learning that some prisoners were being held in Baghdad’s Rusafa prisons, run by the Justice Ministry, Human Rights Watch asked Justice Minister Hassan al-Shimmari on January 4 for access to the prisoners. The request was refused.

Though not all arrests have been on the same scale as those in October, November, and March, regular arrest campaigns have taken place, often in largely Sunni neighborhoods in Baghdad as well as in several outlying provinces, said witnesses, family members and media reports. Strict government secrecy regarding the number of arrests and exact charges makes it difficult to assess the scope.

While some prisoners were released within hours or days and say they were not mistreated, others told Human Rights Watch they were tortured, including with repeated electric shocks. Most said interrogators forced them to sign pledges not to criticize the government publicly or to sign confessions. They said interrogators threatened that unless they signed these documents they would suffer physical violence, female family members would be raped, or they would never be released. Some families told Human Rights Watch that they were told to pay thousands of dollars in bribes to secure their loved ones’ release. In two cases known to Human Rights Watch, detainees were released after the families made such payments.

Camp Honor Prison

Camp Honor is a military base of more than 15 buildings within Baghdad’s fortified International Zone, which Iraqis and others continue to refer to as the Green Zone. The Iraqi Army’s 56th Brigade, also known as the Baghdad Brigade, which falls under direct command of the Office of the Commander in Chief of the Armed Forces, controls the Camp Honor complex and is responsible for the security of the Green Zone.

On March 29, 2011, Justice Minister al-Shimmari told Human Rights Watch that the government had closed the camp’s main detention facility, Camp Honor prison (often simply referred to as “Camp Honor”). Al-Shimmari said that authorities had moved all its detainees, whom he alleged were terrorists and Islamist militants, to three other facilities under the control of his ministry.

Contrary to this assurance, Human Rights Watch has received information from government and security officials indicating that some detainees from the “Baathist” and “Summit” roundups were held in Camp Honor prison and that it is still being used at least as a temporary holding site, or as a place to extract confessions before moving detainees into the official correctional system. This use of military prisons outside the control of the Justice Ministry is consistent with known procedures at other publicly acknowledged facilities outside of the ministry’s control, such as Muthanna Airport Prison and a facility in western Baghdad run by the army’s Muthanna Brigade, both of which have also housed hundreds of detainees from the recent arrests, according to government officials and former detainees.

A security official from the Defense Ministry told Human Rights Watch in April that judicial investigators attached to the Supreme Judicial Council go to the Camp Honor prison on a regular basis, where they participate in investigations and interrogations, alongside military investigators from the 56th Brigade. A lawyer who works for the government but did not want his department identified corroborated this allegation in an April interview with Human Rights Watch.

Three former detainees who spoke with Human Rights Watch between December and April gave credible accounts of what they said were their interactions with judicial investigators in Camp Honor prison. These allegations are consistent with judicial procedures known to have taken place there in the past. One detainee told Human Rights Watch in April that he had been held for over a month in Camp Honor prison, from late October to early December.

In a March interview, another man told Human Rights Watch he had been detained in Baghdad in early November and taken to a prison inside the Green Zone, which guards and other detainees told him was Camp Honor prison. His description and a sketch he made of the layout of the cells and interrogation trailers were consistent with the known layout of the facility.

Another detainee said in early December that he could confirm that he was in Camp Honor prison in May 2011 by the proximity of clearly recognizable surrounding buildings. When he was taken from the main holding facility to adjacent trailers for violent interrogations on three separate occasions, he said, he was not blindfolded. “The Defense Ministry and the old Council of Ministers [Hall] are right there,” he said. “I’m a former military man, and I used to work very close to there, so I knew right where I was.”

In July Human Rights Watch obtained a copy of a May 22,2011 letter written by the International Committee of the Red Cross (ICRC), which said the ICRC had “collected reliable allegations” of two separate secret detention facilities attached to Camp Honor military base, plus another facility next to the headquarters of the Counter-Terrorism Service, also in the Green Zone, “that are used to this day to hold and conceal detainees when committees visit the primary prison.”

In the letter, the ICRC also documented the methods of torture used inside Camp Honor prison and affiliated facilities, consistent with torture methods Human Rights Watch had previously reported.The ICRC addressed the letter to Prime Minister al-Maliki and copied Farouq al-Araji, head of al-Maliki’s military office, General Mahmoud al-Khazraji, commander of the 56th Brigade, other defense officials, Justice Minister al-Shimmari, and Judge Midhat al-Mahmoud, head of the Supreme Judicial Council.

After the Los Angeles Times made public the letter’s existence on July 14, the ICRC released a statement declining to confirm or deny its authenticity, as per long-standing policy to confine its communications to officials of the government concerned. In July and August, two Iraqi government officials and one former official familiar with the letter assured Human Rights Watch of the letter’s legitimacy.

Two defense lawyers separately told Human Rights Watch in May 2012 that clients of theirs had been held in Camp Honor prison as recently as August 2011. Another lawyer told Human Rights Watch that while working at the Supreme Judicial Council over the past year he encountered frequent references in comments by judges and others, as well as in court paperwork, to prisoners being held in Camp Honor prison and in “two other prisons in the Green Zone also run by the 56th Brigade.” Four officials from the Defense and Justice ministries, plus two former officials, also told Human Rights Watch of the existence of these secret prisons, one also part of the Camp Honor complex, unofficially called “Five Stars,” and another outside the base, but still within the Green Zone.

Treatment of Detainees

Statements to Human Rights Watch by those captured in the roundups and detained in various prisons, including those run by the Justice Ministry, varied in describing the treatment they received. Some said they were not physically mistreated. Three people detained in the “Summit” dragnet told Human Rights Watch that security officers assured them that they just had to wait until the Arab Summit was over and they would be released – that holding them “was just a precautionary measure.” Others described multiple beatings and threats and some described abuse that amounts to torture.

In May, a 59-year-old man told Human Rights Watch that he was arrested in late October in a southern province of Iraq and transported with more than 60 other prisoners to a detention facility in Baghdad, which he identified but asked Human Rights Watch to keep confidential. “When I first arrived, I was blindfolded and had my hands tied behind my back, and I had to walk down a long line of men, each of whom punched me in the face and hit my head with wire cables as I passed them,” he said. “After that, I was in solitary confinement for some time, and then they brought me before the judicial investigators. I couldn’t believe that they beat so hard and gave me electric shocks for three continuous hours, without even asking me any questions.”

He also said that during other interrogations his captors stripped him naked, hit him with wire cables, boxed his ears, poured cold water over him, and shocked him with electrodes attached to his back.

He was released in March, five months later, after his family paid over US $10,000 in bribes and an influential politician intervened on his behalf. Before leaving custody, he was forced to sign what he said was a confession, though he is not sure of its contents, as well as a pledge to never speak “against the government” and never to talk to the media about his arrest. “They told me that if I break any of these rules, they will bring in my sons and destroy them, and rape my wife,” he said. “As I left, they told me, ‘We will arrest you again, and make sure you’re executed.’”

Family members of detainees who spoke with Human Rights Watch said they had no idea where their loved ones were being held, despite multiple inquiries to the Ministry of Human Rights and the headquarters of the security forces that arrested them. In cases in which the government disclosed where prisoners were being held, security forces hindered or completely blocked detainees’ access to legal and family visits.

“On paper, a defendant can be defended by a lawyer, but in real life, it is next to impossible,” said a defense lawyer who is attempting to represent two men arrested in the “Summit” sweep in March. He told Human Rights Watch that when he is actually informed of the location of a detainee and allowed in, he is kept waiting for hours, and then told to go home because it is the end of the day. “Any lawyer attempting to see his client will be subjected to threats by the security forces holding the detainees,” the lawyer told Human Rights Watch. “Several times in the past few months, they said, ‘So, you want to represent a Baathist and a terrorist? I wonder what is making you do this, why you are on his side.’ This is clearly an attempt to intimidate attorneys from standing up for their victims.”

Families who tried to hire lawyers to defend relatives arrested in the “Baathist” sweep gave strikingly similar accounts. In December, one man told Human Rights Watch that his family went to four separate criminal defense lawyers who were at first cooperative. But when they learned that his father was taken in the “Baathist” arrests, he said, “each immediately told us that they could not interfere in this case because the arrests were by order of the prime minister’s office.” He cited one lawyer as saying: “This case is already decided. It’s a lost case, and I can’t be part of it, because they were arrested by the order of the prime minister.’”

“It is amazing that all four had the same reaction and this made us lose hope,” the family member said. “We did not try to get another lawyer, and have no idea where my father is.”

^^ The above article is dedicated to the fools who actually believe that the new Iraq has 'freedom' and 'democracy'.

ALLAWI: Iraq’s slide toward renewed violence
Washington’s disengagement risks wasting years of sacrifice
By Ayad Allawi Monday, April 9, 2012

It has been nine years since U.S. forces removed a brutal tyrant in Iraq at a huge cost in lives and treasure, but already the country is slipping back into the clutches of a dangerous new one-man rule, which inevitably will lead to full dictatorship, and already it is dashing hopes for a prosperous, stable, federal and democratic Iraq. Exploiting the unconditional support of Tehran and the indifference of Washington, Prime Minister Nouri al-Maliki has violated the constitution to consolidate his own power by using security and military forces to intimidate and oppress political rivals and, indeed, the general population, as manifested in his suppression of peaceful demonstrations in Iraq.

Mr. al-Maliki presides over an increasingly Kafkaesque bureaucracy characterized by corruption and brutality, relying on the compromised judiciary as a weapon against political opponents while concealing the crimes of his cronies. The government falls short of providing basic services, including clean water, electricity and decent health care; the unemployment rate among our frustrated youth is above 30 percent, making them easy recruits for terrorists and prey for gangs; the security situation is deteriorating day by day in spite of an increase in special security forces. Unfortunately, some of these forces turn out to be part of the problem, operating torture chambers tied directly to the prime minister himself, as widely reported by international human rights organizations.

Of even greater concern is the increasing number of attempts to quash or take over institutions that are supposed to be independent, such as the elections, integrity and communication commissions and, most recently, the Central Bank. These, among other disturbing acts, are chilling reminders of the governance pattern established by dictatorship. More recently, Mr. al-Maliki stepped up his rhetoric against the government of the Kurdistan region. This was partly on the heels of Mr. al-Maliki’s unconstitutional moves to target Vice President Tariq al-Hashimi and Deputy Prime Minister Saleh al-Mutlaq immediately after he returned from a trip to the United States. This, in turn, brought Iraqis to make wrongful inferences about Washington’s role in this series of events, in contradiction to the original vision of the United States to build a democratic state in Iraq with civil liberties, national reconciliation, an independent and fair judiciary, and pluralistic political and media systems.

Washington’s evident disengagement gave Mr. al-Maliki the confidence to move even closer to his objective of achieving absolute power by blatantly avoiding the implementation of the power-sharing Erbil Agreement sponsored by Masoud Barzani and the White House. Eventually, the political momentum behind the agreement dissolved, allowing the country to drift back into sectarianism and autocratic rule instead of moving forward with reconciliation and reconstruction. The resulting disastrous state of affairs is fanning increasing disillusionment among Iraqis about the role of the United States and its efforts to create a stable democracy in Iraq.

With no obvious effort by Washington as the patron of the Erbil Agreement to break the current deadlock, Iraq surely will plunge into violence among Iraq’s sects, ethnic groups and even political parties. Meanwhile, letting the current unhealthy governance run amok will only exacerbate differences and encourage various other governing bodies to declare their own autonomous regions, as recently has been the case in Basra, Anbar, Salahuddin and Diala. This will result in multiple feuds between the central and regional governments on one hand, and among various religious sects and groups jockeying for power on the other hand, risking a repeat of the cycle of vengeful violence during the dark days of 2006-07. The fragmentation of Iraq and a return to sectarian violence will not just tear apart the fabric of Iraq, it will further destabilize an already restless region while undoubtedly inviting the unwanted intervention of neighboring countries, which already are competing for influence in Iraq.

Yet, it is possible to avoid this scenario. The United States must step up its efforts through the United Nations to put the political process back on track without delay by insisting on full implementation of the Erbil Agreement in order to establish transparency, the rule of law, national reconciliation, and respect for both the constitution and human rights. While it is up to the Iraqis to find a solution within the terms of our constitution, the United States has always been an important ally in Iraq’s democratic transformation, which is yet incomplete. Today more than ever, America’s support is an imperative if we want to avoid seeing Iraq fall back in the hands of one person and his party.

The White House still has considerable leverage on the al-Maliki government, and it should use such leverage to ensure that the huge sacrifices of the Iraqi and American peoples have not gone in vain. This is the only hope left for Iraq to escape what seems to be a sure march toward the fate of a failing state, which will be marred with wars, corruption and authoritarian rule, further fueling terrorism in an already unstable region. That would be an avoidable and tragic legacy to the U.S. role in the country, with disastrous consequences for the world.

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2012/apr/9/iraqs-slide-toward-renewed-violence/

chounz,

allawi would be even worse than this lot. his gang are not the solution.

chounz,

allawi would be even worse than this lot. his gang are not the solution.

I don't think they're the 'solution' either, but I definitely don't think they'd be worse. Who do you suggest then? I don't think there are any other replacements. I think they deserve a chance. Maliki has had two terms, very disappointing so far to say the least, they deserve a shot to prove that they can do better..

I also think a new government is needed. However it's wrong to say that Maliki didn't do anything. When Maliki came to power iraq was devastating characterized by sectarian violence and chaos caused by terrorist groups. What do you expect from the man on a situation like that?

no one in the current parliament is suitable to run a country sadly. and no one who is suitable is "electable" by Iraq's degenerate populace.

It's a little unfair to call them degenerate. Lots of things about Iraq are degenerate but what you have to consider is that people don't vote for who they think is the best person, they vote for who they expect to maximise some implicit utility function (which may be degenerate, or not). This means weighting ranks with chances of election.

Unfortunately, we find ourselves in a rather unpleasant Nash equilibrium, and personally speaking, I would vote for Maliki's list again given the outcome of the last election, even though he is far from what I would consider an ideal candidate.

^^ this is what i've been saying for so long, basically lesser of two evils. Dawlat il qanoon are in no way the best solution, and in a perfect world, im sure we wouldnt vote for em, but right now, in our current predicament, they're sure as hell better than the alternative. pricks who would sell their own mother for the chair with one list prostituting themselves to turkey/saudi arabia and the others to iran. however, one thing i wish with all i can is that in the next election, a somewhat 'moderate' list appears. maybe a youth, or expat, or something party. one that isnt aligned with any nation be it SA/Iran/USA or any other ones, even if they dont win, or even if they only get 1 seat in parliament, i just want them to be there, cause if it doesnt start now, we'll never have an alternative party to these pricks since our current ones have already started to grow roots.

^^ this is what i've been saying for so long, basically lesser of two evils. Dawlat il qanoon are in no way the best solution, and in a perfect world, im sure we wouldnt vote for em, but right now, in our current predicament, they're sure as hell better than the alternative. pricks who would sell their own mother for the chair with one list prostituting themselves to turkey/saudi arabia and the others to iran. however, one thing i wish with all i can is that in the next election, a somewhat 'moderate' list appears. maybe a youth, or expat, or something party. one that isnt aligned with any nation be it SA/Iran/USA or any other ones, even if they dont win, or even if they only get 1 seat in parliament, i just want them to be there, cause if it doesnt start now, we'll never have an alternative party to these pricks since our current ones have already started to grow roots.

We were too deflated in the last election. We let their sabotage get to us and we didn't vote in the numbers we should have. Now hopefully in the next round the Da'wa party will do much better, which will give them the leverage to deal with these prostitutes.

Muqtada, Hakeem, Barzani, Allawi, all of them can go to hell.
Then Maliki can as well, but that will depend on a the Iraqis themselves presenting alternatives. If they don't, it will be a very slow change.

It's a little unfair to call them degenerate. Lots of things about Iraq are degenerate but what you have to consider is that people don't vote for who they think is the best person, they vote for who they expect to maximise some implicit utility function (which may be degenerate, or not). This means weighting ranks with chances of election.

Unfortunately, we find ourselves in a rather unpleasant Nash equilibrium, and personally speaking, I would vote for Maliki's list again given the outcome of the last election, even though he is far from what I would consider an ideal candidate.

degenerate, i think describes our populace perfectly.

Adjective:
Having lost the physical, mental, or moral qualities considered normal and desirable; showing evidence of decline.
Noun:
An immoral or corrupt person.
Verb:
Decline or deteriorate physically, mentally, or morally.
Synonyms:
deteriorate

people don't vote for who they think is the best person, they vote for who they expect to maximise some implicit utility function (which may be degenerate, or not). This means weighting ranks with chances of election.

Unfortunately, we find ourselves in a rather unpleasant Nash equilibrium, and personally speaking, I would vote for Maliki's list again given the outcome of the last election, even though he is far from what I would consider an ideal candidate.

YES. This is exactly how I feel.

And I would vote for Allawi's list again given the outcome of the last election, even though he is far from what I would consider an ideal candidate.

We were too deflated in the last election. We let their sabotage get to us and we didn't vote in the numbers we should have. Now hopefully in the next round the Da'wa party will do much better, which will give them the leverage to deal with these prostitutes.

Muqtada, Hakeem, Barzani, Allawi, all of them can go to hell.
Then Maliki can as well, but that will depend on a the Iraqis themselves presenting alternatives. If they don't, it will be a very slow change.

Errrrrrrr.. highly unlikely mate. :D

actually chounz. you'd be surprised. maliki has massively INCREASED his popularity recently. he's also doing a proper saddam style system of patronage to keep people on side with incentives/jobs/perks for "his" lot.

YES. This is exactly how I feel.

And I would vote for Allawi's list again given the outcome of the last election, even though he is far from what I would consider an ideal candidate.

Indeed Chounzie, Nash equilibrium. It will take a lot to break us out of it.

actually chounz. you'd be surprised. maliki has massively INCREASED his popularity recently. he's also doing a proper saddam style system of patronage to keep people on side with incentives/jobs/perks for "his" lot.

Well, elections are what like a year and a half away?(Wow, thought it would come sooner :D) ...so we'll see what happens during that time frame.

Indeed Chounzie, Nash equilibrium. It will take a lot to break us out of it.

Well I agree so much with what Haider was saying, as long as a new list does emerge, that's a start I guess.

one thing i wish with all i can is that in the next election, a somewhat 'moderate' list appears. maybe a youth, or expat, or something party. one that isnt aligned with any nation be it SA/Iran/USA or any other ones, even if they dont win, or even if they only get 1 seat in parliament, i just want them to be there, cause if it doesnt start now, we'll never have an alternative party to these pricks since our current ones have already started to grow roots.

So true.

maybe we should setup a party :D

^^ this is what i've been saying for so long, basically lesser of two evils. Dawlat il qanoon are in no way the best solution, and in a perfect world, im sure we wouldnt vote for em, but right now, in our current predicament, they're sure as hell better than the alternative. pricks who would sell their own mother for the chair with one list prostituting themselves to turkey/saudi arabia and the others to iran. however, one thing i wish with all i can is that in the next election, a somewhat 'moderate' list appears. maybe a youth, or expat, or something party. one that isnt aligned with any nation be it SA/Iran/USA or any other ones, even if they dont win, or even if they only get 1 seat in parliament, i just want them to be there, cause if it doesnt start now, we'll never have an alternative party to these pricks since our current ones have already started to grow roots.

I don't see this happening soon. Maybe two or three rounds down the line, but there are barriers.

Somehow, we need to get a nationalist, secular party with no tradition of association with foreign governments gaining traction.

The other avenue for reform is weakening central government in favour of local government.

some general may fit the bill! LOL

I don't see this happening soon. Maybe two or three rounds down the line, but there are barriers.

Somehow, we need to get a nationalist, secular party with no tradition of association with foreign governments gaining traction.

The other avenue for reform is weakening central government in favour of local government.

That would be a dream come true.

lool wow! if allawi was in power all this time, we'll still be in a civil war, and the security situation wud be 100000 times worse than now! dude, most of that party are ba3this.

and you're not going to see secularism in iraq.

as for those so called human rights watch. i have 0 respect for those biased liars. look at the timing of this news. its wen we have a conflict with hashimi and the krg. someone is behind this.

i wish they wud report on human rights violation in israeli prisons or in the usa, and what happened during the occupy movement. they can take those articles and shove it up their ass.

lool wow! if allawi was in power all this time, we'll still be in a civil war, and the security situation wud be 100000 times worse than now! dude, most of that party are ba3this.

and you're not going to see secularism in iraq.

as for those so called human rights watch. i have 0 respect for those biased liars. look at the timing of this news. its wen we have a conflict with hashimi and the krg. someone is behind this.

i wish they wud report on human rights violation in israeli prisons or in the usa, and what happened during the occupy movement. they can take those articles and shove it up their ass.

Why not? Most people (including religious people) are already of the opinion that religion should not be involved in politics.

Why not? Most people (including religious people) are already of the opinion that religion should not be involved in politics.

its not gonna work. thats the truth, and the majority gonna be opposed to it.
some things are not made for us my friend. it will bring us more problems than good.

the problem in iraq is not the way it shud be ruled, or what type of system we should adopt. the problem is economy.

if the economy in iraq improves, everything in iraq will improve, politics will improve, our religious people will improve. basically every aspect of our life will improve. we should focus on our economy and find a way to fix it.

if the economy in iraq improves, everything in iraq will improve, politics will improve, our religious people will improve. basically every aspect of our life will improve. we should focus on our economy and find a way to fix it.

I actually believe in this so much. When the standard of living in Iraq increases, poor people become more educated and exposed to the outside world, their MENTALITIES change (hopefully) and become less religious-minded, secularism and freedom will it be a lot easier to evolve. While typing this I remembered a theory I studied in Economics during high school, which further helps this point:
I forgot the name of the theory but it's basically a 'pyramid' of needs, it says that when people in life meet one set of needs, they will move on to the next, and they won't long for one set if they haven't fulfilled the one prior to that.

I think it was:

1. Human needs (food, drink, sleep, shelter, 5th one?)
2. Safety/security
3. Social needs (friends, family, social life etc.)
4. Respect, confidence, recognition, etc.

And then one last set of need, sorry forgot what it was exactly but something basically along the lines of being a big part of society, more recognition/acceptance, promotion, entrepreneurship, etc. things like that.

Point is people right now in Iraq don't have electricity and don't have clean water... of course they won't be asking for more freedom.. they're barely surviving. There was a 'methel' in arabic/iraqi that my dad used when describing the situation in Iraq, something about feeding the dog or something :D .. it was basically talking about the leaders, it's saying how not giving the people what they want and demand.. keeps you in power and gives you more control over them.
When Iraqis start have a better quality of life, good jobs with good incomes, get air conditioning/electricity and water, have SAFETY and SECURITY, proper education and healthcare, new houses and new cars... they will long for needs such as freedom of speech, freedom of what to wear and how to look, they will start challenging social norms and customs and will try to change them, they'll say no when religious 'authorities' ban certain festivals with music and public dancing, they wont accept teenage boys getting killed for having different hairstyles and wearing skinny jeans.
HOPEFULLY, then, the people will be in charge and not the imams or seyyids or religious sheikhs or whatever. Not even the politicians. The people will decide what they want their country to be like.

I just looked it up and remembered, it's called Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs.

^^hm.. i would think people would need most of these things at the same time.. don't understand why there is a hierarchy..

eg, if you are hungry, looking for basic humanitarian needs, it doesn't imply you wouldn't care about social needs :dunno:.. in fact, it's probably as important as your basic needs since without social relations, it would be difficult to survive.

I actually believe in this so much. When the standard of living in Iraq increases, poor people become more educated and exposed to the outside world, their MENTALITIES change (hopefully) and become less religious-minded, secularism and freedom will it be a lot easier to evolve. While typing this I remembered a theory I studied in Economics during high school, which further helps this point:
I forgot the name of the theory but it's basically a 'pyramid' of needs, it says that when people in life meet one set of needs, they will move on to the next, and they won't long for one set if they haven't fulfilled the one prior to that.

I think it was:

1. Human needs (food, drink, sleep, shelter, 5th one?)
2. Safety/security
3. Social needs (friends, family, social life etc.)
4. Respect, confidence, recognition, etc.

And then one last set of need, sorry forgot what it was exactly but something basically along the lines of being a big part of society, more recognition/acceptance, promotion, entrepreneurship, etc. things like that.

Point is people right now in Iraq don't have electricity and don't have clean water... of course they won't be asking for more freedom.. they're barely surviving. There was a 'methel' in arabic/iraqi that my dad used when describing the situation in Iraq, something about feeding the dog or something :D .. it was basically talking about the leaders, it's saying how not giving the people what they want and demand.. keeps you in power and gives you more control over them.
When Iraqis start have a better quality of life, good jobs with good incomes, get air conditioning/electricity and water, have SAFETY and SECURITY, proper education and healthcare, new houses and new cars... they will long for needs such as freedom of speech, freedom of what to wear and how to look, they will start challenging social norms and customs and will try to change them, they'll say no when religious 'authorities' ban certain festivals with music and public dancing, they wont accept teenage boys getting killed for having different hairstyles and wearing skinny jeans.
HOPEFULLY, then, the people will be in charge and not the imams or seyyids or religious sheikhs or whatever. Not even the politicians. The people will decide what they want their country to be like.

idk what people on this forum have against religion!!! but it looks like most of you live outside of iraq, probably in europe, and it's where they brainwashed you at school into thinking that you're backward people, to a level where they made you ashamed of yourself and who you are, and you find yourself constantly trying to change your identity. they taught you to hate yourself.

it's something that been done some many times before in history, i.e. african americans. watch this short clip by malcolm x:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gRSgUTWffMQ
^^ same thing is being done to muslims today!

look your not going to succeed by eliminating religion from your region. our region (the middle east) is where all religions have started. it where every major historical figure was born. it's where most empire and dynasties where founded. you cannot erase all of that. it's IMPOSSIBLE. there is too much history, heritage, and culture to erase.

so it's wiser of you to find a way to work with religion then to just dismiss it completely.

you also proposed a dangerous idea of giving iraqis all kinds of freedoms. we're a type of people (iraqis) who take everything to the extreme. if you give iraqis all these freedoms, all you're going to see is sex, drugs, alcohol, and the spread of many diseases. WE DON'T KNOW BALANCE. believe me we'll be worse than africa, and at that moment you'll know what backward really means.

you cannot let people have a say in everything. you must have a leader. it will be a mess without one.

lastly, here is something that they didn't teach you in school. the secularism that you're crying for was founded by a muslim polymath named Ibn Rushd (Averroes). he's considered to be the founder and the father of secularism. and he's the one who actually brought secularism to europe.

be proud of who you are. hopefully when you get older your mind will mature, and you'll realize that it's not always about entertainment. have some values.

you also proposed a dangerous idea of giving iraqis all kinds of freedoms. we're a type of people (iraqis) who take everything to the extreme. if you give iraqis all these freedoms, all you're going to see is sex, drugs, alcohol, and the spread of many diseases. WE DON'T KNOW BALANCE. believe me we'll be worse than africa, and at that moment you'll know what backward really means.



doesn't that imply Iraqis will also take religion to the extreme :D

just following your logic btw ..

doesn't that imply Iraqis will also take religion to the extreme :D

just following your logic btw ..

yep you're right. that too!

example: tatbir