:)

I would prefer it to be organized by let's say South Africa for a change...

CAPE TOWN 2020, TORONTO/BUENOS AIRES 2016

World's Best Cities Ranked by Travellers, 2003 (1)
City/Country Score (2)
Sydney, Australia 87.3
San Francisco, United States 85.6
Florence, Italy 84.6
Rome, Italy 83.8
New York City, United States 82.7
Bangkok, Thailand 82.7
Charleston, United States 82.3
Chicago, United States 81.0
Venice, Italy 80.9
Victoria, Canada 80.7
Santa Fe, United States 80.0
Cape Town, South Africa 79.9
Vancouver, Canada 79.6
Singapore 78.9
Paris, France 78.6


CAPE TOWN HAS THE GOODS TO MATCH ITS BEAUTY

by Michael Farr, Cape Times 13 February 2002

Perceptions of the central city of Cape Town, the Mother City's flagship, have changed radically, both nationally and internationally, especially over the last few years.

Fuelled by increased security and cleansing services, combined with a good value proposition, the city is attracting growing numbers of tourists and new business, most notably in the film, leisure, finance and IT industries.

Since the Cape Town Partnership was formed in mid-1999 to kickstart the rejuvenation of the CBD, it has focused primarily on working closely with local government in getting basics right and building a platform from which Cape Town can market itself as a competitive global destination for new investment.

It follows that if you cannot deliver a safe, clean and well-administered city centre, you clearly are not in a position to deliver the investment environment that is required to boost the economy of the city, the wider metropole and the province.

Getting the basics right, which through the Central City Improvement District has been delivered by ratepayers and local government, was the all-important first step to the taking of the product to market.

At the same time, international trends had to be borne in mind. One such trend has been that of disaggregation — or a major multinational deciding that certain administration, couia 1e corniucteci in cities other than that in which the company is headquartered.

The evolution of information technology has made this possible, and many international companies, looking towards the bottom line in a weakening global economy, would conclude that if certain functions could be conducted in another international city as effectively but at half the price, this option should seriously be considered.

At the same time, major multinationals have tended to start looking at cities, rather than countries, when making investment decisions. While where the city is located is important from a macro point of view, each city’s environment, assets and attitude are bping much more closely scrutinised. This has meant that, for example, a major international call centre company would look to Cape Town, Dublin, Delhi and Manila as possible locations for their business. Investment brand assets are based on variables which prove the investment case, and include issues such as the business environment, quality of life and the availability and price of skilled labour.

In early 2001, the partnership teamed up with the major investment, commerce and tourism bodies to conduct an international study on those things that make us competitive globally. Fortune and Arthur Andersen in New York conduct an annual study on what makes cities throughout the world competitive as business locations, but unfortunately do not include Africa in their study.

The basis for their judging of over 150 cities in the world is across four categories: workforce, business environment, quality of life for attracting talent, and cost of doing business. The also interview executives in 160 cities across the globe.

The partnership approached the Unilever Institute for Strategic Marketing at UCT to conduct the South African leg of the study, and with the co-operation of Arthur Andersen, applied the same formula to South African cities to see just where Cape Town stacked up domestically and completed. While the statistics are for the year 2000, and therefore before the Argentinian economic crash, for example, they remain valid for 2001/2.

The basis for winning status is the score achieved for skilled workforces, stable governance and good quality of life. So, what did the research tell us and how exactly do we measure on some key criteria?

* Workforce: Cape Town’s work-force, at a little over 1.3 million, is comparable to Seattle, Washington or Baltimore, Maryland, and a full third higher than Vancouver, Canada. Its unemployment rate is the lowest of the three major cities in South Africa.
* Skills: Cape Town's proportion of degreed people exceeds any other city in South Africa by a fair margin. It is estimated that Cape Town has more computers per 1 000 people than any city in South Africa, and exceeds Bangkok, Buenos Aires, Rio de Janeiro, Santiago, St Petersburg or Warsaw. Further estimates indicate that it has more internet connections per 1 000 people than any city in South Africa, and exceeds Bangkok, Buenos Aires, Kuala Lumpur, Moscow, Rio de Janeiro or Santiago.
* Professionalism: Cape Town’s professional or managerial employment as a percentage of the worklorce is higher than Miami, New York, San Diego or Richmond, and is marginally under the US average of 25.2%.
* Education: Cape Town spends more on education as a percentage of GNP than Athens, HongKong, Melbourne, Manila, Singapore or Seoul.
* Government employment: Cape Town’s proportion of the workforce employed by government is beneath the US average of 15.7%, despite the fact that parliament is based in Cape Town. It also exceeds Boston, Seaffle, New York, Charlotte, North Carolina and Cleveland, Ohio.
* Safety: Cape Town’s crime rate in the wider metropole is comparable to New York or Los Angeles. At city centre level, a joint, zero-tolerance effort by the private sector and city council has now brought the central city more into line with international norms.
* Pollution: Cape Town is a relatively clean air city and has fewer bad air days than Atlanta, Baltimore, Charlotte, Los Angeles, Dallas, New Orleans or Sacramento, amongst many others, especially Houston.
* Price of property: despite its superior quality of life, Cape Town is amongst the cheapest cities anywhere in the world to buy or rent property in dollar terms (and at the time the study was conducted, the rand was still 8:1). Average A-grade rentals in Cape Town’s central city— and for that matter most of the busi*ness districts in South Africa are considerably less costly than any North American, Latin American or European city, and are competitively below most emerging economy cities. The World Competitiveness Yearbook in fact rated us first of the 47 countries it investigated.
* Growth and prospects: Cape Town’s real GDP growth in 1999 was comparable to the city average for New Zealand,Hong Kong and the Philippines. Its forecast growth rate for 2002 is 3.5-4%
* Global business environment: using the Arthur Andersen/Fortune measure, Cape Town’s Business Environment Score is higher than Buenos Aires, Rio de Janeiro, Kuala Lumpur, Manila or Prague, and is comparable to Lisbon, Rome or Tokyo.
* Cost of living index: Cape Town comparable to Kuala Lumpur and Madrid. It is easily more competitive than most major cities in the world, but particularly more so than Buenos Aires, Jakarta, Istanbul, Moscow, Warsaw, Singapore or Taipei.
* Entrepreneurial: Cape Town creates proportionally more new firms than most major cities. In terms of its propensity to create new companies, it typically exceeds Amsterdam, Bangkok, Barcelona, Brussels, Buenos Aires, Manila, Moscow, Paris, Singapore, Vienna or Zurich.
* Risk: Cape Town’s composite economic, political and financial risk rating is better than any other city in South Africa, and is comparable to Manila, and better than Brasilia, Jakarta, Moscow or Rio de Janeiro.
* Economic freedom: Cape Town is on a par with Kuala Lumpur, Warsaw or Santo Domingo and is better than Moscow, Manila, Delhi or São Paulo.
* Inflation: Cape Town’s inflation rate remains low and in 1999 was below Budapest, Delhi, Istanbul, Jakarta, Manila, Moscow, Rio de Janeiro or Warsaw, amongst many others.

Proving the investment case is one thing, but using the information to attract investment is really what it’s all about. The facts from the research enable us to conclude that at a global level, the strengths we particularly have are:

* Access to and price of skills
* Education standards and levels
* Price of property (to rent or buy)
* Telecoms infrastructure
* Language
* Private/public services
* Value for money
* Quality products
* Niche industries
* Commuting time
* Aesthetics
* Climate
* Time zone
* Heritage/culture/history

For reasons that would be self-evident, we cannot reasonably aspire to compete with New York, London or other first-tier international cities.

But we can, and should, compare ourselves favourably to some of the best second-tier cities in the world, including Taipei, Bangkok, Manila, Buenos Aires, Kuala Lumpur and others.

Cape Town is no longer at the beginning of the investment trend. She has the product, the environment, the determination and all the potential she needs to attract the kind of domestic and international investment necessary for Cape Town's growth.

Perhaps we're all needing now is a slight attitude adjustment to believe in ourselves and what we have to offer the world.

I dont doubt lisbon or europes abillities to host a games, its not that, i just want the games to truly become a global event not a euro-american event, yes it tough to host the games but at the end of the day you it will be africa's turn and CAPE TOWN will step forward and grab the opportunity...all i ask is that if europe wins 2012 that the world gets behind a cape town 2020 bid because we will try our best to make the games the best we can

Mo Rush, I lived in S. Sfrica during 17 years and REALLY hope Cape Town gets it in 2020. In fact I have no doubts. However. in 2016 it might be Lisbon's chance of holding them.

I vote for Paris...The worst choice for me is London.

Lisbon.

Go Lisbon

Paris !

LDN all the way!

paris in 2012 and lisbon in 2016!!

Paris has already been host of a summer olympic games.
London and Madrid are my choice.

Paris has already been host of a summer olympic games.
London and Madrid are my choice.


well well well...how can people be so ignorant !!! :bash: :bash:

london has organised the GAMES as many times as paris !!

paris in 2012 and lisbon in 2016!!

That's impossible. You (we) need NY to win if u want Lisbon to have any chance.

That's impossible. You (we) need NY to win if u want Lisbon to have any chance.

yes you`ve got the point!! asia (china), america (NY) and then europe with lisbon!!:)

I think London should win this. They have the most ambitious plan, the funding is all in place, we've proved we can host major international events (Manchester Commonwealth Games in 2002) and London's past Olympics were to bail out other countries who couldn't afford it!

paris for sure

I hope it will be in Europe again in 2012 :
1 - Paris
2 - London
3 - Madrid
4 - NY

The closeness of voting on this forum indicates how tight the race for 2012 wil actualy be perhaps with madrid in a less trong position but i think we can all agree that Moscow will not last past the first round. Then its between madrid and new york and madrid could possibly lose out due to barcelona 1992 but madrid could also go on and new york could lose out, leaving three european cities and no chance of lisbon 2016, so if madrid goes up against paris, paris will win and the race will be tighter if madrid goes up against paris but in all likelihood london will face off with paris in the final round.

BUT... what i hope for is a total shock or suprise
Moscow leaves in the first round
followed by madrid in yound 2
then london drops out in round 3
paris loses out to new york by 5 votes and new york wins
lol

go cape town 2020!! great city for a great people!! 2016 could be in lisbon, portuguese proved they can do it very well (euro2004 organized by the portuguese was considered the best euro football tournement ever!)!

Can Lisbon finance the games on their own? (Without E.U money)

No I wouldnt vote Lisbon.

Lisbon VS Paris

i would vote lisbon anyday over paris

Can Lisbon finance the games on their own? (Without E.U money)

They would have to (did the greeks get any EU financing)!! And BTW Accura you might wanna give reasons for that.

Spain dosent deserve it again. I love spain they had EXELLENT olympics BUT we should let someone else get them. I would like Newyork But the USA has had it alot aswell so London is My Vote

wow giorigios we agree that london should host the games never thought it was possible for us to agree on something

ciao

London should definitely get the Olympics. All the other countries bidding have held the Olympics or World Championships recently. I think it's about time a major sporting event came to Britain again. It would certainly be very unfair if Madrid got the games considering they were held in Barcelona in 1992. That would mean Spain had the olympics twice in 20 years, and I certainly don't think they are deserving of that considering the terrible racist abuse England's black football players received in the friendly in Madrid. The UK hasn't had the olympics since 1948 and London is certainly a world class city which deserves the Olympics more than any other city.

2M12, Madrid forever!!!

Madrid all the way!!
-It's the only big European capital which hasn't organised the Olympic Games yet!
-It has the second best puntuation! ( 8.3, just shortly before Paris => 8.5)
- One of the best tranportation systems in the world, gorgeus infraestructures.........

Paris and London have hosted them twice!! Madrid none! Yes, Barcelona hosted them in 1992 but with that rule New York should have no chance (Atlanta 1996), and it's still a serious candidate to win.!

GO 2M12!!

Yeah!!!! MADRID 4ever and ever!!!!!

I want Madrid is time for it paris and london had done it 3 times ... let other cities organize the games

Can Lisbon finance the games on their own? (Without E.U money)

Why the question? Is Portugal a country only dependent on E.U. finance?! Sure the money is important, but the country doesn't rely on this source to hold any type of world event. In fact, I think, these huge projects are a blessing for this nation.

If an European city gets the games in 2012, nope, I won't vote for Lisbon.

Why the question? Is Portugal a country only dependent on E.U. finance?! Sure the money is important, but the country doesn't rely on this source to hold any type of world event. In fact, I think, these huge projects are a blessing for this nation.

So your answer is that no E.U money is necessary to hold the games in Lisbon?

So your answer is that no E.U money is necessary to hold the games in Lisbon?
Mate, u don't get a penny from the EU for that kind of thing!! Remember the Athens Olympics and Portugal Euro2004?? I hav to tell u that so much doubt is starting to become a little offensive!!

To my Portugese friends...I would definitely want the Olympics in Lisbon for 2016. I wasn't able to come to portugal for the EURO so this would be an excellent opportunity to visit your beautiful country.

Go Lisbon!!!


p.s. to all those doubters...Greece did not get a penny from the EU for the Olympics just as Portugal did not get a penny for the EURO from the EU. these stereotypes have to stop because they are getting offensive, and quite frankly, pathetic.

In 2012, Madrid will definetely not get them!
yes!!!!!! MADRID is going to get the Olympics in 2012!!!!!!!!

spoke to someone from portugal today lisbon cant host olympics sorry not big enough is just one reason

What's not big enough Lisbon? How about Cape Town, Mo Rush?? Huge metropolis isn't it!? U know ur comments are starting to get a little annoying!!

Lisbon haves all the capacity to make it. Go Lisbon 2016!

well im just going on what somebody quite intelligent who is from portugal said its not my opinion would still perfer lisbon to pais though

well im just going on what somebody quite intelligent who is from portugal said its not my opinion would still perfer lisbon to pais though

What on earth is pais? Where is that character from?

pais = paris oops its shorthand hehe paris is being renamed to pais

Lisbon has all the capacities to host an Olimpics just look at athens.. we have probably the same size, population etc.. i dont think if the O.G are the best thing for Portugal right now.. i think we could invest that money on other things but thats my opinion! anyway i dont why u guys are worring about the O.G in 2o12 wiil go to Madrid or Paris or London so Lisbon won´t stand a chance in 2016..

After seeing how thegames have transformed cities like Barcelona and Athens into beutiful modern cities I doubt Lison which is already so great will have any problem doing it.
Athens proved to the world that small countries can host amazing Olympics, an "unforgettable dream games" to be exact. Contrary to some peoples beliefs Athens is more beutiful today than ever before and now is modern and one of the cleaner cities in Europe with all kinds of state of the art public transportation. I am not saying this to brag about Athens but to show the great effects an Olympic ames can leave on a city and country.

I hope in 2016 Portugal will have it's chance to shine. :cheers1:

spoke to someone from portugal today lisbon cant host olympics sorry not big enough is just one reason

4 monts before the 2004 games people said Athens could not host it and look what happened:
http://www.athens2004.com/Images/Legacy/calatrava/closing_ceremony1_29-09.jpg

Proved all the nay sayers wrong and hosted a great Olympics. I am fully confident Lisbon can as well.

Lisbon can definately host the games....


But if a European country wins 2012 (Paris, London, Madrid) then no chance for another European country in 2016.

Excelent picture!

So your answer is that no E.U money is necessary to hold the games in Lisbon?

Yes.
Obviously I'm not refering to the new airport and to some new freeways(Lisbon has almost all needed) that will have to be built and some or other minor infra-structure that does not imply sports.

spoke to someone from portugal today lisbon cant host olympics sorry not big enough is just one reason

Not big enough??!! Explain.

:drunk: After seeing how thegames have transformed cities like Barcelona and Athens into beutiful modern cities I doubt Lison which is already so great will have any problem doing it.
Athens proved to the world that small countries can host amazing Olympics, an "unforgettable dream games" to be exact. Contrary to some peoples beliefs Athens is more beutiful today than ever before and now is modern and one of the cleaner cities in Europe with all kinds of state of the art public transportation. I am not saying this to brag about Athens but to show the great effects an Olympic ames can leave on a city and country.

I hope in 2016 Portugal will have it's chance to shine. :cheers1:
:drunk:

I will support Lisbon 2016

Hey guys, it was just a question without any implications at all from my side.

I don't know at all if Euro 2004 or Athens 2004 got any E.U money, that's why you ask people, right?

Whether it is offensive to ask a straight question, I don't know.

Hey guys, it was just a question without any implications at all from my side.

I don't know at all if Euro 2004 or Athens 2004 got any E.U money, that's why you ask people, right?

Whether it is offensive to ask a straight question, I don't know.

No, not at all. Feel free to ask.

No! Paris Madrid London Moscow too many candidates for Europe for 2012. I seriously doubt New York gets it, and if that happens (90% it won't) that's the only chance Lisbon will have to host 2016.

Buenos Aires 2016!

there is nothing wrong with lisbon nobody doubts lisbons abilities to host the games its just that perhaps taking the games to new frontiers will be good for the future of the olympic games....
BA 2016
Cape Town 2020
Asian city 2024
but when lisbon bids it will have tough opposition as london new york etc might bid again

also IOC might favour those who lost out in 2012 bid so new york could give BA a run for its money eventhough i think its greedy for north america not to give south america a chance

Special request by Mo Rush:

This is the Jamor Sports Complex:
http://www.cm-oeiras.pt/Images/Fototeca/Geral/af030.jpg
http://www.cm-oeiras.pt/Images/Fototeca/Geral/af188.jpg
http://www.cm-oeiras.pt/Images/Fototeca/Geral/sac116.jpg

Olympic Swimming Pool- the pics taken by me aren't great but they were all I had time for and u get the idea!!
http://uk.msnusers.com/bb6mj9egeb5a4i32vdqlunsei0/Documents/Pictures%2FCIMG0417.JPG
http://uk.msnusers.com/bb6mj9egeb5a4i32vdqlunsei0/Documents/Pictures%2FCIMG0418.JPG
http://www.fpnatacao.pt/ficheiros/campeonatos/piscina.jpg
http://www.fpnatacao.pt/ficheiros/foto_mes/6.jpg
http://www.fpnatacao.pt/ficheiros/foto_mes/5.jpg
http://www.cm-oeiras.pt/agenda/18/imagens/p14_a.gif

The national stadium which i think wouldn't just be refurbished but demolished and replaced by a new olympic stadium.
http://www.stadionwelt.de/Stadionwelt-Stadien-Arenen/Stadionlisten/Portugal/Jamor/nacional_03.jpg
http://www.stadionwelt.de/Stadionwelt-Stadien-Arenen/Stadionlisten/Portugal/Jamor/nacional_02.jpg
http://www.stadionwelt.de/Stadionwelt-Stadien-Arenen/Stadionlisten/Portugal/Jamor/nacional_17.jpg
http://phalanx-ut.com/sup3r/cpg/albums/userpics/10001/normal_DSC00718.JPG
http://phalanx-ut.com/sup3r/cpg/albums/userpics/merda_taca_x_FCP/normal_Img_3213.jpg

You can see that if Lisbon is to host the olympics a load of work will have to be done but at least the basis is there.

Thanks a lot i really appreciate it, those images are great and i particularly like the aquatic centre and the tennis centre as cape town has neither although it can create an indoor centre for swimming just some cape town existing venues:

BELHAR SPORTS CENTRE BADMINTON: (8,000)

http://goweb.co.za/nrc/imagesnr/Belhar01.jpg

AQUATIC TRAINING VENUE

http://galleries.news24.com/SA/CT/Peninsula/images/06.jpg

CASTLE OF GOOD HOPE (5,000) AND GOODHOPE CENTRE (6,000)
(top of image) FENCING AND TABLE TENNIS

http://img83.exs.cx/img83/373/goodhopebridge4xq.jpg

http://www.museums.org.za/iziko/images/hire/castle05.jpg

VELODROME : CYCLING (6,000)

http://www.brownbuilt.co.za/applications/images/siterolling01.jpg

http://www.viewbyview.com/assets/images/CT.1.300.jpg

http://www.viewbyview.com/assets/images/CT.2.1.jpg

HOCKEY CENTRE HARTLEYVALE

http://www.nuhc.co.uk/NUHC_Annual_Easter_Tour_files/hart5.jpg

http://www.nuhc.co.uk/NUHC_Annual_Easter_Tour_files/BM7.JPG

http://www.aerialeye.co.za/hast03.jpg

NEWLANDS RUGBY STADIUM - SOCCER 50,000



http://www.gilesridley.com/rugbypics/wpr02.jpg

http://www.aerialphoto.co.za/images/Newlands%20Cricket%20Rugby%20&%20SAB.jpg

http://www.newlandstours.co.za/images/rugby-statium.jpg

NEWLANDS CRICKET STADIUM - BASEBALL 25,000 and NEWLANDS SWIMMING CENTREswimming centre to the right and north of the cricket field

http://img142.exs.cx/img142/4333/newlandsaerial3ki.png

http://img142.exs.cx/img142/6272/newlandsaerial28mv.png

http://www.aerialphoto.co.za/images/cricketstadium.jpg

GREENPOINT STADIUM SOCCER 20,000

http://www.photonetwork.co.za/photographers/KobusSmit/KOSM0249.jpg

CAPE TOWN INTERNATIONAL CONVENTION CENTRE - WRESTLING AND WEIGHLIFTING

http://www.cticc.co.za//userimages/CTICCVIEWT_middle.jpg

http://www.cticc.co.za//userimages/CTICC_EX_middle.jpg

http://www.cticc.co.za//userimages/Arrival-Kudu_middle.jpg

ATHLONE STADIUM - 25,000

http://www.worldstadiums.com/stadium_pictures/africa/south_africa/western_cape/cape_town_athlone.jpg

http://archive.touchlinephoto.com/touchline/image-bin/2004/06/30/102406-smitcarriestorchstadium.lrw.jpg

TURFHALL SOFTBALL STADIUM

http://www.softball.co.za/thallatnight.jpg

BEACH VOLLEYBALL CAMPS BAY BEACH

http://www.fivb.org/vis_web/beach/2004/Photos/MCAP2004/Screen/mcap2004.129.jpg
image taken 2004 FIVB WORLD CUP

http://www.fivb.org/vis_web/beach/2004/Photos/MCAP2004/Screen/mcap2004.109.jpg

POSSIBLE EQUESTRIAN CENTRE

http://www.aro.co.za/IMAGES/COURSES/KENIL1.gif

CYCLING ROAD RACE

http://goinside.com/98/4/argus4.jpg

http://www.golden-bike.ch/01_album/Arg59.jpg

MARATHON


http://www.colibri.se/skukuza/bilder/sydafrika-Rob-6-384x256.jpg

http://www.sportotto.de/two_oceans/head_logo.jpg

Well those are some of cape towns venues its not much but we are proud of what we do have
http://cache.gettyimages.com/comp/50953457.jpg?x=x&dasite=MS_GINS&ef=2&ev=1&dareq=E2399169AC85D6DE270A5654A50D61F01AF62BFC5449CC06

http://archive.touchlinephoto.com/touchline/image-bin/2004/06/12/101458-radebekissestorchlooks.lrw.jpg

Moscow Moscow Moscow Moscow????????

Moscow Moscow Moscow Moscow????????

Drunk Drunk Drunk Drunk????????

1. Madrid
2. New York
3. London
4. Paris
5. Moscow

why bother , the Queen on england herself believe in Paris2012 !

Thursday, January 13, 2005
London 2012 Officials Deny Queen’s Remarks About London’s Chances
Posted 1:03 pm ET (GamesBids.com)

London 2012 bid officials Thursday called it “nonsense” that the Queen reportedly has said Paris will win the bid for the 2012 Summer Olympic Games.

In a private conversation during a reception for Britons who have made outstanding contributions to the country held at Buckingham Palace, the Queen is reportedly to have told a community worker she thought Paris would win because London’s bid lacked public support.

Amran Hussain, 19, who works with the deaf, was quoted in the Daily Mail as saying “I told her I was from Newham, a London borough which is backing the bid for 2012. I thought she would be really enthusiastic and go into the subject of the economic benefits, but she straight away said she thought that Paris would win. I was quite shocked because she’d previously been backing the London bid”.

According to Hussain the Queen said Paris has the best chance of winning. She said that Paris had a lot of backing from the public and “we don’t have that, unfortunately”.

Buckingham Palace refused Thursday to deny or confirm the content of the conversation. A spokesman said, “the Queen has thousands of conversations with people every year and we never confirm or deny any of them. The Queen has shown her support for the London 2012 team by hosting a reception in June last year”.

London 2012 spokesman Mike Lee said, “we believe this is a bit of nonsense that is not going to have an impact on the bid. It is not damaging. It is not verifiable that she said that.

“Those comments don’t fit with our experience of the Royal Family. They have been positive and the Queen herself has been very supportive”.

He added, “the campaign for the bid is in great shape, support is growing and recent polls say that it is between 70-75 per cent”.

Meanwhile the Telegraph reports that London 2012 is preparing for the International Olympic Committee’s (IOC) evaluation commission visit February 16-19 by staging a mock visit a few days before the real event.

London 2012 has gathered together a dozen or so people who have been on previous evaluation commission visits who will be given a tour of the proposed sites and sit through 17 presentations designed to convey how London would stage the Games.

Also, Richard Sambrook, head of BBC World, has written a letter to IOC President Jacques Rogge asking him to reconsider the IOC’s decision to cancel the 2012 bid cities television debate.

The reality is that paris seems to be losing global support and fast, this will open the door for london, but madrid support is also somewhat strong but not strong enough to convince 50+ IOC members that the games should go back to spain, perhaps im wrong in saying paris is losing support but perhaps IMO they are assuming that they will win and this could be to their advantage i must say that i wll be glad and not schocked if london wins... the person who discovered and exposed the ioc members for corruption could have made sure that they either vote for london or he will expose them????

but the race for 2012 is closer than we think if any of us think we have any clue about how close or how unclose the voting will be im sure we certainly will be wrong
for come july in singapore the IOC might shock the world by revealing new yorks name but i always go with the betting people as they have been right many times and they say london so as long as the hype around the london bid continues and ioc memebers are convinced that london is the best bid then london shall win

HOWEVER we all know the losers win second time round
1.athens won second time round after losing out to atlanta
2. beijing won second time round as they were pipped at the post by sydney
3. perhaps paris will win the second time round as well, i think what we need to realise that europe does have the most voters in the ioc and that the way the votes are split wil be critical however paris should not count on europe voting for them alone, london can expect huge support from north america as soon as new york gets booted out of the voting process madrid will fall soon after new york leaving london and paris

Paris will receive prob most of the european vote unless london works extra hard...
i have no doubt that perhaps the close UK US ties will ensure london of the majority of north americas vote BUT the canadians who are french at heart might swing towards paris, leaving south america who if convinced enough could send their votes to london or paris if perhaps they can assure BA or Rio of their support for 2016

that leaves Asia who IMO might be tempted to vote for london but then paris also offers a strong technical bid and the asians might have to stike a deal .....

oceania i think honestly will go for london not that they have many votes

which LEAVES africa who think in particularly SA that london should support cape towns future olympic bid...north africa could go to paris as france were supporters of the moroccan bid but certain votes towards central and southern africa could see london in with a big chance....

BUT at the end of the day it could come done to who has the best relationship with the russians? who will they vote for once moscow is booted out although moscow IMO would not get more than 20 votes these could be the ones that decide the fate of the paris or london bid and tony blair better improve his relations with vladimir putin so that london does not go home crying!!!
this is just my opinion

I conducted a very simple poll in south africa amongst friends who despite being aware that barcelona hosted the games in 1992 thought that madrid would be good hosts
SO madrid won
followed by london which confuses the issue further south africans should support london who suported SA2010 but its only one vote and im sure sam ramsamy(nocasa president) might go for london

to think that NYC has not hosted the games yet.. its unfathomable..
NYC

sydney shud do it agen !

The Queen is alleged there is no proof she said this only the word of someone who waited a few months to 'sell' the story to the newspapers. She said that because of better public support in Paris, that Paris could win. So isn't saying Paris is better, or that she doesn't like London's bid, but that Londoners need to support the bid more.

What's not big enough Lisbon? How about Cape Town, Mo Rush?? Huge metropolis isn't it!? U know ur comments are starting to get a little annoying!!

I couldnt agree more. U must learn that cape town will probarbly not get the games so please stop posting crap about what may happen. Not being mean or anything but u think that cape town is better than anyother city. IMO I would love to see many european countrys hosting the games. That way they have more meaning. There closer to there origin. also are those pics stadiums that will be used? It looks like a Flshback to sydney were architecture didnt exist. this is why i love europe hosting games. They actually put in effort to make things Spectacular, No Cheap Generic stadiums. I really hope for SA sake that if you do somehow manage to get it you will Not use the majority of these stadiums. For example the velodrome is WAY below the bar set by the Athens one.

Madrid!!!!! I hope!


Hahaha, If I was a comittee member , I surely will not vote for Madrid.
I think those guys , there are racists.

If not to mention what happened to coloured players of the national English soccer team.

And I think Spain is also country who is not very fond with Arabist people.

When you think about the match-up, I think Paris , London, New York and Moscow are to impressive. Madrid could do things better by saving the finance -promotion and invest it into other things.

Because they don't have a ghost of a chance.

Madrid :nono: :nono: :nono:

Hahaha, If I was a comittee member , I surely will not vote for Madrid.
I think those guys , there are racists.

If not to mention what happened to coloured players of the national English soccer team.

And I think Spain is also country who is not very fond with Arabist people.

When you think about the match-up, I think Paris , London, New York and Moscow are to impressive. Madrid could do things better by saving the finance -promotion and invest it into other things.

Because they don't have a ghost of a chance.

Madrid :nono: :nono: :nono:
And how about your prince ? He dresses up like a nazi.

And how about your prince ? He dresses up like a nazi.


Hahaha, like I'm from England.
I'm no Englishman, rufi.


I think a city like Barcelona is far more liberal than Madrid.

Portugal -Lisboa, A Very Big NONO

:nono: :nono: :nono: :nono: :nono: :nono: :nono: :nono:

Why????

After the European Championship of 2004, we saw people and the community suffering from not getting the proper attention.

All the money went to the new stadiums and the security.

Portugal is one of the most poorers country within the Europena Commonwealth. I think in Portugal they shuld focus on bringing more prosperity to there own people.



Regards Soundwave

Of course ! our neighbours are great organizing things

That is utter rubbish!!! I don't know whether that comment is the product of the prejudices and preconceptions you've been exposed to and fed or you heard it somewhere, sowndwave, but if at any time people suffered from lack of attention it wasn't certainly a consequence from organising the Euro. Please do refrain from posting such fallacious arguments if you know nothing about what you are talking about!!
Many thanks Fern

if you think so the you have stated you are a dumbass that is talking about something you don't know

spaniards are not racist.there are racist groups, yes.but not more than in other countries.so shut up your mouth

well, if moroccan people have a bad reputation in spain is not because they are moroccan, is because the most of them are dealing with drugs or stealing people with knifes.if they worked as all the people they would be accepted just like the other inmigrants

if you think so the you have stated you are a dumbass that is talking about something you don't know

spaniards are not racist.there are racist groups, yes.but not more than in other countries.so shut up your mouth

well, if moroccan people have a bad reputation in spain is not because they are moroccan, is because the most of them are dealing with drugs or stealing people with knifes

The irony of this statement is just too much for me to bear. Someone else please take this one......

this is very good news !!

Saturday, January 15, 2005
French Professional Football League Endorses Paris 2012
Posted 3:18 pm ET (GamesBids.com)

The French Professional Football League (LFP) announced it is endorsing Paris’ bid for the 2012 Summer Olympic and Paralympic Games by holding its matches under the colour of Paris 2012 this weekend and next weekend.

Across France the matches are taking place January 15, 16, 22 and 23 and the 22 players entering the field will wear Paris 2012 T-shirts and children, wearing the same T-shirts, will accompany them. Former Olympic champions and medallists will kick-off the Games.

Spectators in the stands will be provided with pennants featuring the colours of the French bid.

Philippe Baudillon, CEO of Paris 2012 said, “this show of support by the National Football League demonstrates a new momentum in the mobilization of the sporting world and the people of France behind the bid. For Paris 2012 this is another opportunity to demonstrate L’Amour des Jeux of the whole country and our nation’s dedication to the quest of becoming the host city of the 2012 Olympics.

Thierry Rey, promoter of the Paris 2012 bid, said he was looking forward to getting French players from the FA Premier League to stand in Trafalgar Square while wearing “Support Paris 2012” T-shirts. He said “that would show that although they are very involved in English football, there is a little part of them that shows that their country is important to them”.

Meanwhile, the French newspaper Le Parisien commented on the alleged remarks the Queen made that Paris would probably win the bid for the 2012 Summer Games. The newspaper wrote, “the Queen votes for Paris”, adding that the French capital “could not have dreamt of a better advertisement. The Queen has dented English hopes even more”.

A leading regional newspaper, L’Est Republicain commented, “The Queen has caused a scandal. At the headquarters of the Paris 2012 bid the organizers are loving it. The good news is piling up and Paris’ superb project is taking form day after day”.

http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/nol/shared/img/nav/v3_banners/v3_uk_fp_banner_ani_rb.gif

Premiership to promote London bid

London will advertise its 2012 Olympic bid at every Premier League football game for the rest of the season.

A link-up with the Premier League will see the bid promoted on advertising boards and in match programmes.

"Hosting the Olympics would be a tremendous event for the whole country, not just London," said England and Spurs defender Ledley King.

"I remember Euro '96 and what an impact that had. Imagine what it would be like and how the public would react."

Tottenham captain King and Premier League chief executive Richard Scudamore helped London bid leader Lord Sebastian Coe launch the campaign at White Hart Lane.

"Our games are now screened in 195 countries with a global home reach of over 600 million," said Scudamore.

"People all over the world will realise the significance of us backing London 2012."

And, in a similar move, the French Football League will support the Paris bid for the 2012 Games.

Over the next two weekends, all 22 players will wear Paris 2012 t-shirts and be accompanied by children wearing similar t-shirts while former Olympic champions and medalists will 'kick-off' the games.

London's bid team will take the football competition around the United Kingdom if the city wins hosting rights for 2012 when the International Olympic Committee votes on 6 July.

"We plan to share the Olympic experience by holding the competition at venues such as Villa Park, Old Trafford, St James' Park, the Millennium Stadium and Hampden Park," said Lord Coe.

The England team have already backed London's bid, with captain David Beckham appearing in a special promotional film.

So sorry Kony, Beat you to it, a couple of days ago.

Not so great now is it, when we beat you to it.

ok

nothing really great about it though

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/other_sports/olympics_2012/4174985.stm

Where is Paris's video? Everyone else has loads of them Paris none

cape town wont get the games?????? have u been reading the newspaper???? jacques rogge mentioned this week he wants the games in africa and wants south africa to concentrate on SA 2010 soccer world cup then bid for the olympics???
games will come to africa and most likely to cape town so what the hell are u talking about?
the only reason i said lisbon was too small is because i asked someone who lives there about euro and whether lsibon could host the games not to atack lisbon..why is everyone attacking cape towns venues of course they will all need upgrade and you cant compare us to athens at all i never suggested we had all our olympic venues completed far from that actually i just posted the little we have that could be used !!!!! why all the hostility? europe can host games after cape town!!!! wait a little bit, u compared some venues as if they were olympic venues gosh at least our velodrome has a roof athens velodrome did not have one before they plonked that white oval to make it look modern, its still open on the sides this venue like sydney is at least closed, i heard they use curtains when it rains to keep the rain out of the velodrome WOW what technology!!!
cape town is not better than eurpean cities altogether but its africas best chance to host the games thats all im saying

You should do the same: focus on the WC2010 and then in the O.G.2020 (10 yars of deifrence!)
Anyway,I think cape town has all the chances to win the host of the O.G.2020!And I suport it!
Lisbon, and Portugal, can be the best option for 2016. Excelent weather, excelent people that knows better then anyone to recieve, outstanding organizing capacities (proved in the euro2004),beautifull spots,awesome food, geographic conditions for various competitions...etc etc etc! Go Lisbon 2016!

where are paris 2012 videos??????? and new york/??????

Paris has given up of the euro 2012 bid to reunite all strikes to fight for the 2012OG bid!

London or New York.

I vote for Spain...

US---> hosting too many Olympics already
France---> same with you
Moscow---> Politically corrapted... if they have a lexury of building a sport arena.. please consider support your economy and spend more money on environmental problems. Very idiotic to host Olymic. They wanted to hosted for political reason and nothing else.
London---> no space???

I hope...Madrid!!!

Any city really, But Not New York- that is the worlds worst city for the Olympics. Its too squahsed up and ugly conretized- they could've at least chosen a city needing re-generation because its a lie to say everywhere in America is up to amazing high standards.
New York would be the worst olympics ever.

Madrid!!!!!!

I ve voted for Madrid, but I m afraid that Paris will win.

NY, London and Paris don´t need OG to keep on beeing world major cities..

The cities that don´t have that status need to improve constantly. That s why I think in Europe it must be cities like Budapest, Istanbul, Warsaw, Lisbon, or Madrid.

Portugal -Lisboa, A Very Big NONO

:nono: :nono: :nono: :nono: :nono: :nono: :nono: :nono:

Why????

After the European Championship of 2004, we saw people and the community suffering from not getting the proper attention.

All the money went to the new stadiums and the security.

Portugal is one of the most poorers country within the Europena Commonwealth. I think in Portugal they shuld focus on bringing more prosperity to there own people.

Regards Soundwave

Poor? look up the word in a dictionary please. If you mean Portugal does not have a national income as high as some other european nations, then yes that is obviously true. To say that the stadiums' costs influenced the portuguese negatively is total nonsence!!! The Euro2004 was a national project that embrased 90% of the population, that brought in tourism revenue and capital gains that highly exceeded the construction costs involved. Some other road/highway projects were speeded up mainly because the soccer tournament caused some thirst for new development and modernization.
Exs. At this moment there are 4 cities that have begun or will begin building there light city subways (Coimbra, Porto, Almada, Oeiras), one thousand km of highways are being built, new International Airports in Lisbon, Beja and Porto, new high speed (Bullet Trains/TGV) lines and obviously many new 4/5 star hotels.........and obviously we are getting ready to bid for the 2016 games ....our work has already begun!

Yes - this is what I'd call a poor country!

Portugal -Lisboa, A Very Big NONO

:nono: :nono: :nono: :nono: :nono: :nono: :nono: :nono:

Why????

After the European Championship of 2004, we saw people and the community suffering from not getting the proper attention.

All the money went to the new stadiums and the security.

Portugal is one of the most poorers country within the Europena Commonwealth. I think in Portugal they shuld focus on bringing more prosperity to there own people.



Regards Soundwave

What an f..ing idiot?! I won't even bother with such comments.

Anyway, I hope NYC gets 2012 so that Lisbon could aim for 2016, but I think a more realistic bid could be made for 2020.

but I think a more realistic bid could be made for 2020.
You shouldn't have said that mate!! Now we'll have to listen to Mo Rush blagging on about Cape Town's better venues and all that rubbish!!! ;)

i never said cape town has better venues we have very litle but i believe in our potential as africas bes city to host a wonderful games not meaning that portugal wont host an amazing games...

i still laugh at how people think the athens velodrome which was an open air one and taht got a new roof plonked on it is better than a fully indoor velodrome.....

cape towns velodrome might not be better than athens but we dont need curtains to keep the wind and rain out our venue is indoors i mean athens coukd have at least ensure that the roof fitted onto the venue...without spaces around the velodrome

It was in jest mate!!! Don't take it so seriously! I do admire your optimism and persistence in trying to sell the Cape Town games. You're doing a great job for them. And I mean this!!

http://briefcase.pathfinder.gr/download/losada_77/25627/304012/0/DSC02055.JPG

and what if it rains, do the poor cyclists get drowned in water
just a joke people have a sense of humour

Mo Rush please come to Athens and see why the f*cking velodrome is not only beautifull but also 1000% functional and see how these f*cking curtains works.Do you think that it is accidental that it belongs in top3 velodromes of the world?

why not

Mo Rush please come to Athens and see why the f*cking velodrome is not only beautifull but also 1000% functional and see how these f*cking curtains works.Do you think that it is accidental that it belongs in top3 velodromes of the world?

DAniel calm down i said it was a joke why does everyone get so angry i know its amazing velodrome and i dont doubt that i know how the system works why does everyone get soooo insecure and start using foul language certainly does not impress me ... daniel it seems you have other issues so sort them out and then come back to the forums with some sense of humour please

I hate people that complain about the best ever facilitys in an Olympic Games. :(

Mo Rush, I hate to break it out to you, but I think Cape Town's bid will rival with Lisbon's in 2020. The main candidate to Portuguese prime minister in Portugal's elections in February, has cast his doubts wether Lisbon should hold them in 2016. To him 2020 is a more probable date. Yet, he will be in favour of preliminary testing and research to be able to find out which year will be the better one for bidding.

yeah i dont mind as long as cape town does its best so that the games can come to africa it will be good competition, good luck to lisboa...

Probably Lisbon will bid for 2020...let`s see!

I ve voted for Madrid, but I m afraid that Paris will win.


Don't be afraid mon ami. Be happy au contraire. The Olympic Games in Paris will be truly great and fun for all.

All for the glory of the French republic, rather than for the glory of the Olympics. It would be yet another Grand Project to make the French feel good and important about themselves.

Voted for London not because of political reasons but for its ingenious stadium design.

1.London
2.Paris
3.Madrid
4.Moscow
5.New York

1.London
2.Paris
3.Madrid
4.Moscow
5.New York

What about La Habanna?

What about La Habanna?
What? Are they in the final 5?

The odds from Willhill:

Paris 1.33
London 4.00
New York 13.00
Madrid 13.00
Moscow 34.00

Actually I'd like Madrid to host the OG more than London because of the bad press for Athens 04 from many british papers and also because it will be more fun, the weather will be better etc but I don't know how serious threat could ETA pose..

I think you're all voting for NYC, MAD, MOSX and LON because it's quite obvious that Paris has got this one hands down.........

I think you're all voting for NYC, MAD, MOSX and LON because it's quite obvious that Paris has got this one hands down.........


Ooooooh yeah.It's just so obvious.You'd have to be blind not to see it.l.o.l.
Anyway i think Madrid will win.

1. New York
2. Madrid
3. London/Paris
4. Moscow

Any city really, But Not New York- that is the worlds worst city for the Olympics. Its too squahsed up and ugly conretized- they could've at least chosen a city needing re-generation because its a lie to say everywhere in America is up to amazing high standards.
New York would be the worst olympics ever.

Laughable. First of all, the area where the proposed Olympic venues and housing is in desperate need of a rejuvination and second, you are rediculously stupid and arrogant.

Well, i still think it is between London and Paris with the possibility of New York pipping them to the post.

^^^ Very gay imo .. it looks as if he is about to swing over and sit on that giant vibrator *jokes* a lovely poster and may the best city win ;)

Moscow - Iwould like to see the Olympics over there, would be very interesting. Furthermore, to get out of USA and Europe for a change.

Moscow had them in 1980

ITS GONNA BE LONDON 2012! BACK THE BID! :D

How do you delete accident posts!!!

Its been said, though, that if thge voting got strategic then New York would win.

Its so close that a big European City may go out first (only New York is not European). If New York does not go out first (this poll says moscow would be first, but it is not authoritative) then it is likely whichever european cities goes will transfer their votes (per se) to New York, since if it goes to America then Europe may be able to bid again.

So it is possible, in order to bid another day, that the first Euro city to be dropped will support New York, and therefore New York will stay above last place all the way and then win.

The alternative is if the Euro countries switch their votes to Europ cities, but that is of less strategic interest.

I hope London wins, it would be unfortunate if New York won because it was 'not-European.' Obviously if New York does win, there is no reason it didn't do so based on its own merits, i just think voting strategy should be considered.

Well, I certainly hope London does not get it. It just does not have the transport infrastructure and no scenery worth seeing that people have not seen before. There is no natural beauty and the weather is crap. Unpleasant and overcrowded already. A nightmare to work in... The Olympics and the associated construction would just disrupt the city more.

Well, I certainly hope London does not get it. It just does not have the transport infrastructure and no scenery worth seeing that people have not seen before. There is no natural beauty and the weather is crap. Unpleasant and overcrowded already. A nightmare to work in... The Olympics and the associated construction would just disrupt the city more.

Yet another pig ignorant comment from an obviously totally pig ignorant individual. Im sick to death of idiot comments like this, especially aimed at the UK or London....

I´ve voted for Madrid, because I think that Madrid is the best prepared for this event.

(sorry, but my english is very bad) :)

I'd like to see NYC get it. Opportune time for the world's greatest city to shine. If not, then Paris hopefully.

Yet another pig ignorant comment from an obviously totally pig ignorant individual. Im sick to death of idiot comments like this, especially aimed at the UK or London....

I know Zenith, Im sick of it too. People rarely know what they are talking about and base their views on old 1950's films and tired old stereotypes.

It never occurs to people that the Olympics in London would be a great opportunity to put right some of things they complain about. Like improvements in transport.

I am currently having an argument with stupid aussies who think somehow that Australia will overtake the UK in population and that the UK is full of racists who don't let in foreigners, whereas Australia is far more multi-cultural than London.

It gets on my tits something chronic.

There is no natural beauty and the weather is crap. Unpleasant and overcrowded already. A nightmare to work in... The Olympics and the associated construction would just disrupt the city more.

You could just as well be talking about NY or Moscow with those statements. Even more so in the case of NY.

If you south africans hate London so much why the hell do you all migrate over here. Piss off home if you don't like it

I am currently having an argument with stupid aussies who think somehow that Australia will overtake the UK in population and that the UK is full of racists who don't let in foreigners, whereas Australia is far more multi-cultural than London.
.

interesting...

I vote for Madrid.

A FEW CONTROVERSIAL STATEMENTS SOME OF WHICH COULD BE TRUE WHICH DO YOU BELIEVE IN:? simply theories and statements ive heard CHOOSE WHICH ARE TRUE BY SIMPLY choosing the number

1. There are four european cities bidding, it is highly unlikely that the games will go to new york
2. Not safe enough in New York and Moscow for obvious reasons 9/11 etc and we could not predict or assure anyone of no large scale attacks
3. Paris will win...as those who miss out like athens for 1996 and beijing for 2000 always go on to win...
4. Madrid will definitely not win as barcelona hosted 1992,a solid bid but not enough to convince over 50 IOC members tha the games should go back to spain...
5. Moscow will be kicked out in the first round with very few votes
6. It is clear that the australians support London and if New York does not make the final two then majority of the north american votes will go to London due to the BLair and Bush having a good relationship
7. It comes down to politics and the actual bid counts very little
8. Who will europe support when it comes down to london and paris?????
9. The winner could be decided by the african vote and the few who voted for moscow in round one...
10. Paris will win in round two/three with majority vote
11. London could pull in many votes in the last few weeks before the final vote
12. IOC members have already decided who they will vote for..
13. Even in summer London is too cold and the games will be more like a winter games, making condition miserable
14. Madrid has the best technical bid
15. In future bidding should be stopped and cities such as Cape Town, Buenos Aires and Rio could be asked to host the games by the IOC if they meet the requirements.
16. London will not bid if they lose outon 2012
17. Paris are becoming too complacent with their bid
18. London could win if they threaten to expose all IOC members involved with bribery
19. Jacques Rogge wants the games in Paris
20. Some intelligent sources or experts already know who will win the 2012 bid....
21. The winner in this race will go on to stage a less advanced games than beijing e.g. the stade de france is not exactly a futuristic 2012 stadium

FACTS : a poll taken in cape town using university showed that people favoured MADRID (to my suprise as the host) stating that London was simply to full and polluted, New York not safe enough as well as having congestion problems, Paris would host a boring games and are simply too arrogant, and Moscow after the recent events as well as the circumstances of the 1980 games do not stand a chance..

obviously Paris if the only city able to host the games

1. Paris
2. London (brits are willing to corrupt voters)

the others cities can't win.
NY after Atlanta 96 : it would be a shame (fed up with america)
Madrid after Barcelona 92 : impossible (too expensive for such a poor country)
Moscow : an other undevelopped country to host the games after Beijing, it's a joke !

Don't be stupid.... Paris capital of the world forever
French people always telling stupid things!!
Listen guy, Paris & London have two Olimpic Games each one, and Madrid it's the only one biggest cities in Europe that doesn't have! And in your videos, you think (both cities) that you are the best cities in the world!! Nothing more far from the reality!!!!
I like very much london, but I think it will not win. And you, you have posibilities, I know, but Madrid also has it.
And you should know one thing. Spain has increased his economy much more than France, which is going down too fast. In a few years, first city in Europe, London, and second, Madrid, of course. Paris is finished!!

^ St. Petersburg are much bigger then Madrid, but never had olympics too...

and i suggest you to rephrase your first sentence...

French people always say stupid things? That's the stupidest thing I seen on this forum.

BTW Legolas, Toulouse is growing faster than Madrid.......

I don't know Exarchus, you say some stupid things (jk). All the stuff you write in French seems stupid to me because its not in English, I mean, how dumb is that, speaking another language, when English is great.

Of course just so I don't get in trouble, i was entirely joking.

I don't know Exarchus, you say some stupid things (jk). All the stuff you write in French seems stupid to me because its not in English, I mean, how dumb is that, speaking another language, when English is great.

Of course just so I don't get in trouble, i was entirely joking.


lol.

French language rocks!!!!!

French people always say stupid things? That's the stupidest thing I seen on this forum.

BTW Legolas, Toulouse is growing faster than Madrid.......
Juajua. Dream guy!!! There are more cities in Spain 100 times bigger and more important than Toulouse!!
Madrid is bigger than St. Pt. in Metropolitan Area. The same than Paris, that has 2 mill. people only in the city, but 9 in the MA. Madrid has 6 mill in MA. But before I mean the "west" of europe. Sorry. I think you should have more marketing to be known in the rest of Europe.
And, exarchus, I know that French people thinks you are the best, but you must learn better other languages as english one!!! Mine it's not very good but we don't think our language it's the best, being the second more spoken in the world, & we try to learn anymore as english one!!

The metroarea of Paris is more than 9milions.
2 milions is the inner city only.

Toulouse population grow is 1,5% a year minimum (up to 3,5% a year). The metroarea is 1milion now. Population grow will stay stable for a couple of decades.


About languages, well I speak French and English correctly.
I can read Spanish, Italian and a bit of latin, having studied them. I can also read old Frankish because I speak French and read latin even though I never learned it. Any comments? You can try in Spanish, there are many chances I understand it, though I'll answer you in French then.

EDIT: I forgot Occitan and Catalan, I can read some of those too.

I though the most spoken in the world was Chinese Mandarin followed by Arabic.......

I voted for Madrid, but that's only because I wanna see the Olympics in Boston in 2016

boston??yeah keep dreaming

Toulousse wont ever be at madrid`s level! Impossible! I hope New York wins the competition so lisbon could host the OG2016! Anyway Lisbon 2020 is okay as well! Maybe it would be even better...

Noir, the thing is the Olympics have become too huge for their own good. How many 'small' countries can host them? Are they to become a play thing for the U.S and other large countries?

I vote Paris 2012. After the barking America did over security at Athens 2004, what are they thinking trying to bring them to ground zero?

Oh, and the 2016 or 2020 games will be in Toronto. Mark my words.

I'm not saying Toulouse will be bigger than Madrid, I'm saying it's growing faster. To answer those who say Madrid grow faster than Paris (and Madrid will certainly not be at Paris level either).

Not to hijjack the thread but here are some point so you guys are aware of what going on here.

Though, about history or forecast we never know, Toulouse have a strong population and economic grow, the fastest of europe for a city of its size in fact (about 1milion). It's close of Montpellier, wich as the 2nd strongest grow of Europe after Toulouse, giving the area a strong potential.
The economy is based of aerospace (EADS, Airbus, CNES, SNECMA) high technology (Motorola Europe, Alcatel, Matra) and biological technologies.

French people always say stupid things? That's the stupidest thing I seen on this forum.

BTW Legolas, Toulouse is growing faster than Madrid.......


Please, take also into account the racist and offensive comments made by an ignorant like gun57 who obviously never went to Spain.

By the way, Spanish is always ranking in the top 4 most spoken languages in the world but definitely more spoken than Arabic of course but behind Mandarin as you have pointed out. I suggest you to type “most spoken languages” on Google, there are a bunch of interesting articles about that…

It looks to me that you are very much focused on what’s happening only in France and wish to know what makes you say that Toulouse a city with an estimated population of 427’000 inhabitants and now ranking in third position in France (a country that only has 2 cities above 500’000 people) has the highest growth in Europe and Montpellier the second… Are you talking about an economical point of view or the population? Madrid does not have the pretension to be the number one in Europe but it definitely has a tremendous growth in all point of views and the city has grown faster than Paris in the last decade at least in terms of population as the city will soon reach the 6 millions inhabitants including its satellites cities that had a growth in percentage much higher than Toulouse which by the way it’s a city a like very much but that cannot be compared with Madrid of course.

A+ :)

I've discussed with a Spanish moderator. We know Gun57, don't worry about this.

But if you feel someone is trolling, the answer isn't to go in the same kind of statements.

For Toulouse, 400.000 is the inner city, 1 milion is the metroarea.

Since 6 milions for Madrid is the metroarea, it's fair to talk about the metroarea of the French cities too. And I'm saying Toulouse is growing faster, wich you agree with obviously Toulouse population grow is between 1,5% and 3,5% a year unless you can fight bigger ratio (for the same size, tiny villages who double their population easily don't count). Since Legolas say Madrid is growing faster than Paris while it won't get the same position than Paris (especially considering Spain isn't as centralised than France).


Toulouse population grow last years (1st in urban area, 2nd is metroarea):

1968 439,764 474,000
1975 509,939 585,000
1982 541,271 645,000
1990 650,336 797,373
1999 761,090 964,797

Last census was 99, metroarea reach the milion in 2002. The source is the INSEE. National agency for census.

According to wikipedia.

Madrid inner city is: 3 milions, urban area is 5 milions, metroarea 6 milions.

Paris inner city is 2 milions, metroarea is 11 milions.


About Toulouse and Montpellier grow, here is the best article in English I could find (I didn't write it).
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Languedoc

Growth is particularly strong in the metropolitan areas of Toulouse and Montpellier, which are the two fastest growing metropolitan areas in Europe at the moment.

I've discussed with a Spanish moderator. We know Gun57, don't worry about this.

But if you feel someone is trolling, the answer isn't to go in the same kind of statements.

For Toulouse, 400.000 is the inner city, 1 milion is the metroarea.

Since 6 milions for Madrid is the metroarea, it's fair to talk about the metroarea of the French cities too. And I'm saying Toulouse is growing faster, wich you agree with obviously Toulouse population grow is between 1,5% and 3,5% a year unless you can fight bigger ratio (for the same size, tiny villages who double their population easily don't count). Since Legolas say Madrid is growing faster than Paris while it won't get the same position than Paris (especially considering Spain isn't as centralised than France).


Toulouse population grow last years (1st in urban area, 2nd is metroarea):

1968 439,764 474,000
1975 509,939 585,000
1982 541,271 645,000
1990 650,336 797,373
1999 761,090 964,797

Last census was 99, metroarea reach the milion in 2002. The source is the INSEE. National agency for census.

According to wikipedia.

Madrid inner city is: 3 milions, urban area is 5 milions, metroarea 6 milions.

Paris inner city is 2 milions, metroarea is 11 milions.


About Toulouse and Montpellier grow, here is the best article in English I could find (I didn't write it).
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Languedoc


Thank you for the data! It is amazing how Toulouse is growing! Your city will soon surpass Lyon and rank in the second place in France.
A comparable city in Spain is Murcia (seventh biggest city in Spain) that experienced a growth of 6.8% (over 25’000 inhabitants in one single year!) in its population due to a sustained and massive immigration from Colombia and Ecuador mainly. The city reached 399’000 inhabitants in the official census of January first 2004. Thus and although no one is saying that Murcia had the highest growth in terms of population of Europe we can admit that its growth was definitely superior to the figures you have posted for Toulouse.

For the Olympics, I think it would be quite fair for Paris to have them if it is not Madrid. Both cities are the best prepared to host them!

PS: I am sorry but I don’t get what your wrote about legolas in your last post.

moscow! for winter, but never the summer olympics! its summers are too cold for most.

Here is what Legolas said

And you should know one thing. Spain has increased his economy much more than France, which is going down too fast. In a few years, first city in Europe, London, and second, Madrid, of course. Paris is finished!!

This statement is wrong. + Toulouse grows faster than Madrid (I checked Madrid stats).

For Murcia, is it a regular grow for 50 years or just one booming year? Toulouse is a regular grow that's lasting for 50 years and will last for at least 20 more (maybe more).

I don't think Toulouse will catch Lyon soon.

Here is what Legolas said



This statement is wrong. + Toulouse grows faster than Madrid (I checked Madrid stats).

For Murcia, is it a regular grow for 50 years or just one booming year? Toulouse is a regular grow that's lasting for 50 years and will last for at least 20 more (maybe more).


I agree with you, what legolas wrote is completely wrong but he probably wrote this after reading gun57 :D

Of course Toulouse’s growth was bigger in percentage but the “urban” Madrid is growing by approximately 90’000 people every year. As an example of its growth, I think (I ma almost sure) that the subway network it's now even bigger than the one of Paris!

Murcia has been growing for about ten years now but its growth is particularly high since the last five years I would say and no one can really tell when this will stop. Personally, I don’t think it will continue to grow like this for another ten years but who knows?
A strange fact is that France besides Paris does have any other big city as only one surpasses half a million inhabitants (Marseille) whereas in Spain there is more cities over 100’000 and 500’000 inhabitants although the country only has 43 millions inhabitants compared to the 60 millions from France but of course this is not the topic of this thread, sorry about that!

Et vive le Pays Cathare!

A+

I agree with you, what legolas wrote is completely wrong but he probably wrote this after reading gun57 :D

Of course Toulouse’s growth was bigger in percentage but the “urban” Madrid is growing by approximately 90’000 people every year. As an example of its growth, I think (I ma almost sure) that the subway network it's now even bigger than the one of Paris!

Murcia has been growing for about ten years now but its growth is particularly high since the last five years I would say and no one can really tell when this will stop. Personally, I don’t think it will continue to grow like this for another ten years but who knows?
A strange fact is that France besides Paris does have any other big city as only one surpasses half a million inhabitants (Marseille) whereas in Spain there is more cities over 100’000 and 500’000 inhabitants although the country only has 43 millions inhabitants compared to the 60 millions from France but of course this is not the topic of this thread, sorry about that!

Et vive le Pays Cathare!

A+


If you count the metroarea, Marseille and Lyon are both above 1,5 milion (1,6 milion for Lyon).

Yes, France as a lot of cities but small ones. This is what happened when you're controlling a large area.

Though, you got to understand France lost a lot of people in its history. Before the 100 years' war it was about 20 to 25 milions (approximation) and fell down to 10 milions after it (that's with the plague, the famine and of course the war itself). There are been other mass death since of course.

Take it easy exarchus!!!
First. Look at your english:"stupidest thing I seen ". I don't know how is for you a correctly sponken english...
Second. Inhabitants in Toulouse: http://www.mairie-toulouse.fr/VivreAToulouse/EnChiffres.htm 398.000 inhab. in '99. In the other page you said, speaks about the pirynees.
http://www.invest-in-midipyrenees.com/page249.htm
I have seen Toulouse pop. in other pages (emporys for example) and says the same.
Really I don't know which one is correct (I'm not living there) but...
Third. I saw in a web page that the Comunity of Madrid had the best growing of the Comunities (metroareas more or less) of europe. I don't know really if it's true.
Madrid hasn't 5 mill. in urban area. It only has 3 mill (3.100.000 aprox).
Well, this is another thread from we can learn a lot from ourselves.
Right know, I think Paris has a lot of posibilities of win. London is growing also in its posibilities.
But, and sorry, I think Madrid will surprise all of us and it'll win.

Take it easy exarchus!!!
First. Look at your english:"stupidest thing I seen ". I don't know how is for you a correctly sponken english...
Second. Inhabitants in Toulouse: http://www.mairie-toulouse.fr/VivreAToulouse/EnChiffres.htm 398.000 inhab. in '99. In the other page you said, speaks about the pirynees.
http://www.invest-in-midipyrenees.com/page249.htm
I have seen Toulouse pop. in other pages (emporys for example) and says the same.
Really I don't know which one is correct (I'm not living there) but...
Third. I saw in a web page that the Comunity of Madrid had the best growing of the Comunities (metroareas more or less) of europe. I don't know really if it's true.
Madrid hasn't 5 mill. in urban area. It only has 3 mill (3.100.000 aprox).
Well, this is another thread from we can learn a lot from ourselves.
Right know, I think Paris has a lot of posibilities of win. London is growing also in its posibilities.
But, and sorry, I think Madrid will surprise all of us and it'll win.

My stats are given by the INSEE, the organisation that makes the stats. Hardly attackable then. Trust mine then.


Ok, if you dislike stupidest, lest use most stupid rather......

Though, in English we say pyrenees.

I've check the grow of Madrid, before my post don't worry. According to www.madrid.org it was 4,6 milions in 1981 it's 5,4 milion in 2001, for 6 milions I rounded it up with the stats of 2004 (about 5,6 milions I figure).
Toulouse in 1982 was 640.000, now it's over 1 milion.

It's obvious the grow in Toulouse is % bigger.

i loved so much World Cup in Paris so i will vote for France. do your best if u win ;)

This poll is surprising, since Pairs has the least votes but it will probly win.

This poll is surprising, since Pairs has the least votes but it will probly win.


Moscow does, and I doubt it'll win.

For me, New York. New York will win for a new beginning...

madrid¡¡¡¡

città bella¡¡¡¡

No, I said that for "I seen" but, don't worry.
My english, as before I said is not very good, but pyrinees is first time I say the word.
And right now I understand you. You mean the comunity of Madrid. Ok, it's not the same than the urban grow and not the same than the metroarea one.
Well, I hope Madrid will win but it's very dificult that we'll host the summer games.

I'm biased of course. Paris. Period. ;)

M O S C O W

London... hopefully. Otherwise Paris.

Madrid!!

[QUOTE=Mo Rush]A FEW CONTROVERSIAL STATEMENTS SOME OF WHICH COULD BE TRUE WHICH DO YOU BELIEVE IN:? simply theories and statements ive heard CHOOSE WHICH ARE TRUE BY SIMPLY choosing the number

4. Madrid will definitely not win as barcelona hosted 1992,a solid bid but not enough to convince over 50 IOC members tha the games should go back to spain...

14. Madrid has the best technical bid

FACTS : a poll taken in cape town using university showed that people favoured MADRID (to my suprise as the host) QUOTE]

I don´t understant your arguments :down:

I vote for Paris!

Ooooooh yeah.It's just so obvious.You'd have to be blind not to see it.l.o.l.
Anyway i think Madrid will win.

Why is this funny? Everyone knows that the winner is most likely going to be Paris. Most official opinion polls show this - except the ones which state 'who do you want to win?'...

Well your telling us that Paris has this won hands down.Ofcourse i'm going to laugh.What's the point of the other cities preparing for their bids?
Look.I do agree that Paris is the favourite.But to simply imply that it is in the bag is nonsense.Besides i do think that a couple of other cities are making very good bids and giving Paris lots of competition.
Just bear in mind that the favourite doesn't always win.
But if you want to be arrogant and think it's already won.Then go ahead as this can only benefit the other candidates.

moscow! for winter, but never the summer olympics! its summers are too cold for most.
35C is cold for you?

Well your telling us that Paris has this won hands down.Ofcourse i'm going to laugh.What's the point of the other cities preparing for their bids?
Look.I do agree that Paris is the favourite.But to simply imply that it is in the bag is nonsense.Besides i do think that a couple of other cities are making very good bids and giving Paris lots of competition.
Just bear in mind that the favourite doesn't always win.
But if you want to be arrogant and think it's already won.Then go ahead as this can only benefit the other candidates.

Not necessarily Peshu - there are reports that London has practically given up in response to overwhelming support for Paris... Heres an article. (Don't shoot the messenger).

"Headlines in the Sunday Observer screamed “London’s Torch Goes Out” and “London’s Olympic Dream In Tatters”. The Observer reported that key members of the bidding team have told the newspaper, “London has in effect abandoned hope of winning the 2012 Olympic Games, because it is so far behind Paris”.

One unnamed board member is quoted as saying Paris had taken an unassailable lead in the bidding process while a second stated that morale among the top brass had plummeted.

Mike Lee, London 2012’s director of communications, described the pessimism from within the bid as “a nonsense”. He said the mood is upbeat and confident. “We have received extremely positive feedback on our proposals, and on the details of our candidate file which we submitted in November”.

Culture secretary Tessa Jowell dismissed the story and declared those involved in the London campaign believe the race for the 2012 Games is still wide open. She said “the newspaper report claims key figures in government have given up hope of winning. I’ve never met these people, nor spoken to them”.

Bid chairman Sebastian Coe said he was astonished by the report. He said that recent discussions with all 22 of the bid’s board members had failed to uncover any disenchantment.

He told BBC Radio Five, “the only reaction this story has brought from the whole of the senior team this morning, and I’ve spoken to many of them, is incredulity. It quotes an unnamed board member. There are 22 of these and I met them all two weeks ago. Unanimously they endorsed the strategy and thinking behind the bid”.

Coe said, “the only issue raised by IOC members is that they feel this is one of the toughest competitions they’ve been in. They think we’re doing rather well”.

A London 2012 spokesman told GamesBids.com that they believe the story was designed to be as sensational as possible but is so poorly researched and reported that it lacks any substance or credibility. He said there were no sources named and every source is anonymous.

The spokesman told GamesBids that “a senior London sports editor has already expressed his doubts publicly about the story, telling BBC Radio Five Live this morning that ‘I don’t think the story is right’”.

He added, the story also demonstrates a clear lack of knowledge or understanding of the Olympic Games itself, citing an example that at one point the report talks about 16 Olympic sports when there are actually 28 sports."

MADRID :)

LONDON should win bring back some excitement to the games

London should get it because I live there :p

I'm joking before everyone starts getting a tantrum.

London should get it but i'll post why tomarrow.

After the racist incidents in Spain where a multitude of Spaniard had called blacks monkeys, Madrid is DISCARDED!



Madrid is banished of world-wide esport calendar! :banned:

k so moscow stand no chance and madrid does not either who knows why new york even try?

I LOVE NYC!!! And they are building a new $1.5 billion stadium on the West Side of Manhattan. That's why, not to mention the symbolic post-9/11 rebound.

Not necessarily Peshu - there are reports that London has practically given up in response to overwhelming support for Paris... Heres an article. (Don't shoot the messenger).

"Headlines in the Sunday Observer screamed “London’s Torch Goes Out” and “London’s Olympic Dream In Tatters”. The Observer reported that key members of the bidding team have told the newspaper, “London has in effect abandoned hope of winning the 2012 Olympic Games, because it is so far behind Paris”.

One unnamed board member is quoted as saying Paris had taken an unassailable lead in the bidding process while a second stated that morale among the top brass had plummeted.

Mike Lee, London 2012’s director of communications, described the pessimism from within the bid as “a nonsense”. He said the mood is upbeat and confident. “We have received extremely positive feedback on our proposals, and on the details of our candidate file which we submitted in November”.

Culture secretary Tessa Jowell dismissed the story and declared those involved in the London campaign believe the race for the 2012 Games is still wide open. She said “the newspaper report claims key figures in government have given up hope of winning. I’ve never met these people, nor spoken to them”.

Bid chairman Sebastian Coe said he was astonished by the report. He said that recent discussions with all 22 of the bid’s board members had failed to uncover any disenchantment.

He told BBC Radio Five, “the only reaction this story has brought from the whole of the senior team this morning, and I’ve spoken to many of them, is incredulity. It quotes an unnamed board member. There are 22 of these and I met them all two weeks ago. Unanimously they endorsed the strategy and thinking behind the bid”.

Coe said, “the only issue raised by IOC members is that they feel this is one of the toughest competitions they’ve been in. They think we’re doing rather well”.

A London 2012 spokesman told GamesBids.com that they believe the story was designed to be as sensational as possible but is so poorly researched and reported that it lacks any substance or credibility. He said there were no sources named and every source is anonymous.

The spokesman told GamesBids that “a senior London sports editor has already expressed his doubts publicly about the story, telling BBC Radio Five Live this morning that ‘I don’t think the story is right’”.

He added, the story also demonstrates a clear lack of knowledge or understanding of the Olympic Games itself, citing an example that at one point the report talks about 16 Olympic sports when there are actually 28 sports."


Well i still think that both Madrid and New York will be serious contenders.Although being realistic.I think that Paris will indeed win.But you never know.

where is athens? :D :jk: dont shoot!

I LOVE NYC!!! And they are building a new $1.5 billion stadium on the West Side of Manhattan. That's why, not to mention the symbolic post-9/11 rebound.

No offence, but I think the violins for 9/11 stopped playing a long time ago... especially since Afghanistan and Iraq...

They are here.... :uh: I can feel them....

http://archrecord.construction.com/news/olympics2012/images/moscow-1.jpg
http://archrecord.construction.com/news/olympics2012/images/moscow-2.jpg
http://archrecord.construction.com/news/olympics2012/images/moscow-3.jpg
http://archrecord.construction.com/news/olympics2012/images/moscow-4.jpg
http://archrecord.construction.com/news/olympics2012/images/moscow-5.jpg


Moscow
Moscow touts its river, new facilities, and the city’s Olympic track record

Among the remaining contenders for the 2012 Olympics, Moscow was the most recent host to the games. Political tensions overshadowed the 1980 Olympics, as most Western nations boycotted them. The desire to hold a full-fledged Olympics has been cited by Russian officials as a major stimulus to the current bid. The sporting events of 1980 also left a wide-ranging infrastructure in place that will contribute the essential components in 2012.


The futuristic $500 million Olympic Village, media hub, and press center would be the games’ most ambitious project. The Luzhniki Olympic Complex, built for the 1980 games, will receive major additions. A new fanlike stadium, for soccer, will also rise in the Otradnoe suburb of Moscow.

www.m2012.ru/en/ | Photography courtesy Moscow 2012 Bid Committee

During the formal bid presentation in November, the plan outlined a vision of a compact Olympic quarter, located entirely within the city limits. Most venues are spread out in five complexes within the radius of about 6 miles along the sinuous Moskva (Moscow) River. A group of planners and architects from Studio #2 of Mosproekt-4 Institute is responsible for the concept. The river contributes not only the spatial axis to the scheme, but also serves as the main transportation artery, where spectators can be ferried to sites from 70 passenger piers. The so-called “Olympic River Concept” is also an effort to showcase the city. The Moskva meanders for about 45 miles from the northwest to the southeast of the city, unfolding along the historic center around the Kremlin to the edifices of the Soviet period.

Another selling point of Moscow’s bid is the readiness of more than two thirds of the necessary infrastructure. As in the 1980 Olympics, the Luzhniki Olympic Complex and its Olympic Park will be at the core of the games, hosting opening and closing ceremonies and many sporting events. The structure of the Luzhniki Stadium was built in 1957 and renovated in 1979 and 2000. Major additions are planned from 2009 to 2011. A number of complexes built for the 1980 games will be refurbished, including the Krylatskoe
racetrack and the CSKA soccer/track-and-field stadium.

While new venues will go up in the Tushino area of Moscow, the single most ambitious new project includes a planned set of buildings for the Olympic Village, media hub, and press center. This gleaming complex, each building with a terracelike descent toward the river, will rise in the northwest of Moscow at a cost of more than $500 million.

The financial estimate for the games is a modest $2.5 billion. Planners tout Moscow’s experience with major sporting events and the value of holding the games in the “New Russia.” 2012 will also mark the hundredth anniversary of Russia’s participation in the Olympics. It is only ironic that IOC inspectors are unlikely to experience the vital “Olympic River Concept” during their planned February visit. The waterways are likely to be barely navigable, covered in snow and ice.

:hm:Moscow

^

\/

london

Spain already had it in 92 forget them, New York or London deserve it most. Defaintely be important to NY as they will be continuing to "re-build" after 9/11. An event like 9/11 stays with a city for a long long time not something u can just brush off after 11 years....

Who cares if a city/country has hosted it before? There's no rule against it and its not as if its going to ruin the games. It might be unfair, but that's life...

London should definately be hosting in 2012. The London stadium is out of this world, amazing. If that doesn't get built, i'll be very dissapointed. Moscow doesn't look too bad either. If London doesn't get it, then I hope it goes to Moscow. I suspect, however that Paris is gooing to be hosting the games in 2012.

1 - London
2 - Moscow
3 - Paris
4 - Madrid
5 - New York

just be serious:

-Unfortunately NYC is out because this controversial west city stadium has been too much talked about...it raised too many issues so in the meantime none of the other aspects of the bid are discussed...

-moscow :themselves they know they won't have it

so it's a 3-horse-race really.

and if Madrid gets stronger (IOC members apparently were so impressed by the madrid infrastructures that they applauded several times during their visit) this will damage London'position at number 2 more than Paris number 1 spot...


I really think it's will be between Paris and London/Madrid. I doubt the final round will oppose London and Madrid.

There are high possibilities madrid comes back at the number 2 spot (even number 1 before Paris) come june (final IOC report).

If so, London:bye bye

Then if it's a Madrid/Paris fight: i predict (and hope) Paris will win with 55 % votes. But i could be wrong ;)

9/11 HAPPENED many days in iraq its does not make new york deserve the olympics remember the usa is not the most popular place amongst the global audience,

And Neither is Cape Town.......its his opinion dont alter it also please speak english in this forum...."9/11 HAPPENED Many days in Iraq..."?? what r u talking about?

Spain already had it in 92 forget them, New York or London deserve it most. Defaintely be important to NY as they will be continuing to "re-build" after 9/11. An event like 9/11 stays with a city for a long long time not something u can just brush off after 11 years....

The USA had them in 96 so what kind of comments are these? The olimpics are attirbuted to a city not to a nation... London and Paris had them twice and Madrid, well never!

I have voted for Madrid, but my reason is.. the Games did a lot for the development of Barcelona, Atlanta or Athens. So, now is our chance to have a make up in our city (that is developing itself without having games!)..

By the visit of the IOC last weekend and their valorations, i think the battle will be Paris/Madrid. But i think every world city must have hosted a Games at least once, so it should be our time (yes, i know last time for Paris was 1926.. dont repeat it again)..

it seems indeed Madrid did a very good job in impressing the IOC...a paris Vs madrid is very likely to happen...and Madrid still can win...

It's going to be between Madrid and Paris.

And Neither is Cape Town.......its his opinion dont alter it also please speak english in this forum...."9/11 HAPPENED Many days in Iraq..."?? what r u talking about?

meaning many lives were lost on many days in iraq just as they were lost in the 9/11 attacks, human life is important not who was killed/attacked lets feel sympathy for iraq and give them the games too, new york has an excellent bid i hope they do well as they have strong support from top athletes nadia comaneci and pele are just two athletes featured in the new york bid book.Does anyone think paris will not win??? although it would seem more interesting if the bid race was competitive, are we fooling ourselves or not? i really hope the race is not one way..

PARIS, Feb. 7 (Xinhuanet) -- With the high-profile bid race for hosting the 2012 Olympic Games now in the key evaluation phase five months before the vote, Paris officials are wary of being portrayed as untouchable front-runners.

"This is something I've been hearing for a long time," said Philippe Baudillon, chief of the city's Olympic bid campaign. "I don't believe in favorites. It's really a competition. We have to work very hard to get the games."

Paris is competing against London, New York, Moscow and Madrid in the race. The International Olympic Committee (IOC) will select the winner on July 6 in Singapore.

Ever since the five finalists were picked last spring, Paris has been considered the city to beat.

Paris has paid its dues after losing bids for the 1992 and 2008 games; France successfully hosted the 1998 World Cup; Paris staged the 2003 track and field world championships; the City of Light offers all the attractions of one of the world's favorite tourist destinations.

But Paris is reluctant to shoulder the No. 1 contender tag, mindful that previous favorites have lost. Rome was beaten by Athens in the vote for the 2004 games.

"I don't believe in a lot of these things," Baudillon told the Associated Press in a telephone interview. "We have five major cities. If all the five cities are here, they are not here for nothing. They are here to be the best."

Speculation about the race has escalated since the IOC evaluation commission began its month-long inspection tour of the five bid cities.

Madrid was the first stop last week. The panel will next visitLondon from February 16-19, followed by New York (February 21-24), Paris (March 9-12) and Moscow (March 14-17).

Baudillon, a hurdler in his youth, says he doesn't pay attention to what his competitors are doing.

"When you try to check what happens around you, you can't be the best," he said. "It's the IOC to choose and not anybody else.The IOC will decide on the best technical bid. We want to be the best technical bid," the French was quoted by the news agency as saying. Enditem

BOLSCHOI Magnificent pics......very...dare i say it..Athenian. I wouldnt mind seeing Moscow get the OG's. Funny how all citys but NY are European :D

Paris had the games in 3 times , and London too.
But Madrid never celebrated any games.

I'm agree with kony. Madrid Vs Paris. Madrid has the best technical bid and Paris had TWICE the games Vs Madrid none, but Paris tried it three times and Barna was in '92.
We'll see...

Madrid....

I honestly believe that Madrid deserves it.It's about time that this gre8 city gets the recognition it deserves.Besides one of my best friends was born in Madrid.

A big NO to New York and London as long as their leaders keep violating any form of international law.

Paris/Moscow/Madrid is fine to me.

double post

Are you stupid, France and Spain violated international law by having troops in Kosovo. The Kosovo operations were not sanctioned by the UN, it was illegal in international law. Russia doesn't exactly have a great record treating the Chechens, or recently by interfering in another soveriegn states elections.

Use you head before you write things down.

And anyway isn't the Olympics meant to be about sport. Thats why there will be in China (gross human rights abuses) have been in Moscow while it was fighting a war in Afghanistan.

MADRID CAR BOMB AT ITS CONVENTION CENTRE, some racist chants and now a car bomb injuring 39 outside a proposed olympic venue, all madrid needs now is some bribery rumours!!

Are you stupid, France and Spain violated international law by having troops in Kosovo.


funny prizemazda...when in another thread i called you "stupid" you were all shocked and you said i was being rude because of that...now it's you who accuse others of being stupid...

so i guess the best thing to do then is to post here the answer you made to me after i said you were stupid :


Kony I don't start posts calling people stupid, thats you. You wanted proof of you being rude, well its there for all to see

Kony, you are so rude, do you talk to your mother with that mouth.

and below is a comment adressed to me by another angry forumer in the same thread...i though it should help you in your therapy :

Calling people stupid, is not the way to convince people you are right, could I suggest a politer approach might get you further.

By the way, London is seen by many around the world as a unique mix of history, peoples and cultures.

it's all here (http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=177367)

it all shows how shallow and hypocritical you are...

Anyone else bored with morons spouting cack about this!

Its between Paris & London. Bookies never get it wrong. There favouring Paris at the moment and im Agreeing with them. They dont deserve it, but thats the way it go's.

For once however, I would just like to see the British support rewarded now and then. Its a shame but at least its close enough for a couple of hundred thousand to make the trip!

P.S Kony, knowone likes you ... you are the most biased forumer on this boards, let alone the most aggrivating. so ssshhhhh, you're petty remarks arent needed in this thread :)

P.S Kony, knowone likes you ...

actually i was just refreshing Prizemazda's memory...but as u mention it i don't need to come in an internet forum to be "liked" and to have friends...i don't know who you are but if it's your case, i am so sorry for you...

actually i was just refreshing Prizemazda's memory...but as u mention it i don't need to come in an internet forum to be "liked" and to have friends...i don't know who you are but if it's your case, i am so sorry for you...

If you dont come on these threads to be liked, then the least you could do is not come on these threads and become a di*k.

Are you stupid, France and Spain violated international law by having troops in Kosovo. The Kosovo operations were not sanctioned by the UN, it was illegal in international law. Russia doesn't exactly have a great record treating the Chechens, or recently by interfering in another soveriegn states elections.

Use you head before you write things down.

And anyway isn't the Olympics meant to be about sport. Thats why there will be in China (gross human rights abuses) have been in Moscow while it was fighting a war in Afghanistan.


I can tell you one thing that is certain.The olympics is most certainly about making money.Alot of it.Especially with those fat corrupt members of the olympic commitee.Sport takes second place by miles.

MADRID CAR BOMB AT ITS CONVENTION CENTRE, some racist chants and now a car bomb injuring 39 outside a proposed olympic venue, all madrid needs now is some bribery rumours!!


As if the other cities don't bribe.Wake up.
It's just so sad to have this stereotype about certain countries.Too many films i think.There is corruption in every country.It's just that a Mexican might fall into corruption more quickly then an American because he is generally so much more desperate financially.

MADRID CAR BOMB AT ITS CONVENTION CENTRE, some racist chants and now a car bomb injuring 39 outside a proposed olympic venue, all madrid needs now is some bribery rumours!!

:ohno:
Look who is talking about racism! If you are from South Africa and are concerned about this sad phenomenon, I think you shouldn’t be wasting your valuable time on this forum because there is probably much more to do in that respect in your country like stopping whites from “feeding” lions with locals…
I don’t think that a country like Spain that is currently legalizing nearly 800’000 illegal foreigners can be treated as a racist country just because of several monkeys (fans) were giving a very pathetic image in a football stadium. Either you are as narrow minded as these idiots and this would explain why you make these silly comments or either you think twice before posting.
The ETA terrorism is almost dead compared to early years like 1992 when Barcelona hosted the OG. Unfortunately, this is not specific to Spain but to all countries sadly.
Your bribing comments or rumours you want to spread again shows how narrow minded you must be…

Mo Rush, what are u talking about??

We have had terrorism since a lot of time, and the IOC and everybody knows it. But London, NYC, Paris, and Moscow; all this cities had terrorism (and some still do). Racism? C´mon, thats the typical "The Sun" and "The Mirror" stupid stories for creating controversy and sell more newspapers.

Think before posting, please.

Obviously people from cape town have little respect and are extremely dumb and bias. Since i Hail From Hellas, the land that founded these games dedicated to our Gods and one in particular, Zeus, i Ask him to Curse your city of never ever hosting a game in his honour or on Olympian Game at all. VIVA HELLAS, VIVA EUROPE!!!! VIVA MADRID VIVA PARIS VIVA LONDON!!!!!

[QUOTE=pricemazda]Are you stupid, France and Spain violated international law by having troops in Kosovo. The Kosovo operations were not sanctioned by the UN, it was illegal in international law.


What are you talking about! How many civilians the Spanish and French troops killed in Kosovo and how many yours killed in Irak and on other countries? Common just be serious for a while, the UK will ALLWAYS lose in this silly and pathetic comparison. Spanish troops were sent in the Balkans to protect civilians in the best way they possibly could. As far as I know Spain has absolutely no interest in going there…

Kika, u forgot to say Spain, France and other countries went to Kosovo under UN flag.

They didn't go into Kosovo with the UN, Russia vetoed any UN resolution. So NATO, did it anyway.

Saddam Hussein killed over 300'000 of his own people, should we have allowed it continue. I was against the war, for the reasons we were told, if they had said lets get rid of a nasty dictator, I would have supported it. But I am not going to argue that after the event, it would be better if saddam was still in power. You say that to the people who voted in their first election.

That made it illegal in international law. So either you oppose US&UK in Iraq because it was illegal and action in Kosovo, or you don't

Do you honestly think British troops in Iraq were sent there to kill civilians. You need to look at the differences in British run Basra and American run Baghdad.

there was a car bomb in madrid and there was racist chants these are facts!! not my opinions no further comment to giorgios talking to greek gods i think that an issue he needs to sort out himself!!

Thats exactly y CT dont deserve the OG's. Thats what there really about i bet you South Africans dont know a thing about the Routes of the games. If you have been to greece you would know how powerful the country is and thats why many people believe that the gods do create energy

there was a car bomb in madrid and there was racist chants these are facts!! not my opinions no further comment to giorgios talking to greek gods i think that an issue he needs to sort out himself!!

What? Is that it? You just sound like a parrot repeating over and over the same stuff. Honestly I was expecting another reaction from you particularly after what I have said. That just confirms how narrow minded you must probably be.
I don’t think that someone coming from a country like yours has something to teach us in Europe. By the way, I suspect you to have something against Spaniards that I would call racism, don’t you?

They didn't go into Kosovo with the UN, Russia vetoed any UN resolution. So NATO, did it anyway.

Saddam Hussein killed over 300'000 of his own people, should we have allowed it continue. I was against the war, for the reasons we were told, if they had said lets get rid of a nasty dictator, I would have supported it. But I am not going to argue that after the event, it would be better if saddam was still in power. You say that to the people who voted in their first election.

That made it illegal in international law. So either you oppose US&UK in Iraq because it was illegal and action in Kosovo, or you don't

Do you honestly think British troops in Iraq were sent there to kill civilians. You need to look at the differences in British run Basra and American run Baghdad.




My question wasn’t how many this AH of Saddam killed (figures that by the way can be trusted as much as the ones concerning the mass destruction weapons as they come from the same lying sources i.e. the USA and the UK). My question was how many, your troops killed and how many the Spanish troops killed in the Balkans? Before posting what you have just said about the Spanish troops, you should first check what they have done in Kosovo and in the rest of the Balkans (hospitals, schools etc.) and then check what the British troops did since they have started bombing Irak in 1991… I don’t think you will stand the comparison… When will your government follow what the British people really want instead of following like a little dog what your big brother (USA) wants? Are you in Europe or are you the 51st state of the USA?

He has something against all europeans? Are you jealous were too good for you?

yes cause ure only worth a parrot response what are you talking about teaching europeans ??? you are seriously taking this tooo seriously

yes cause ure only worth a parrot response what are you talking about teaching europeans ??? you are seriously taking this tooo seriously



:fiddle:

you all say that other forumers are hating whole nations and calling them racist.

well quite frankly you are not giving the best image of your home nations across to others with the petty arguing about something that the majority of forumers dont want to read about in this forum.

get over yourselves and get a life....god if everyone in your countries had an attitude like yours no wonder people hate you

xx

If you dont wanna read about it fine get out,,,, simple live wif it

you all say that other forumers are hating whole nations and calling them racist.

well quite frankly you are not giving the best image of your home nations across to others with the petty arguing about something that the majority of forumers dont want to read about in this forum.

get over yourselves and get a life....god if everyone in your countries had an attitude like yours no wonder people hate you

xx



To whom is this post addressed if I may ask? Please, read ALL the posts before replying!

;)

By Gordon Farquhar
BBC Five Live sports news correspondent in Madrid

The International Olympic Committee's inspectors certainly take their responsibilities seriously.

Every session of their visit to Madrid over-ran as they asked a barrage of questions about the finer details of the city's plans for the 2012 Olympics.

Having seen the majority of the venues at first hand now, Madrid appears to have most of the answers.

There is plenty of available land, all of it in the hands of the city authorities.

Major works have already begun at what will be the main stadium site, where an aquatic centre is under construction, along with a new metro station which is designed to handle large crowds.

The idea of having an athletes' village so close to the main Olympic ring is clearly one of the main selling points.

Competitors will be able to walk to the main stadium, pool and gymnastics hall, although persuading them to give up the comforts of an air-conditioned bus might be tricky.

The two other clusters of venues make a lot of sense, and it all adds up to a compact, neat, and credible bid. But is that enough?

Some 80% of the venues are going to be built whether the Games come to Madrid or not, so the physical legacy of the Olympics will not be huge.

Especially when you compare, say, with London's ambitious plans for an enormous Olympic park in a run-down area of the East End, and the legacy is greater in New York too.

There may be substantial support for the bid here, but what evidence of genuine enthusiasm?

Yes, of course, from the city authorities, but I did not get the feeling that one way or the other most people were unduly concerned.

If the bid has opponents, only a handful, bearing banners describing themselves as "victims of tourism", could be bothered to stand up and demonstrate their views when the IOC's representatives were in town.


The IOC inspectors will need some stamina to survive the next few weeks
So do the Madrilenos really care?

The bid team unveiled their banner in front of 60,000 football supporters at the Bernabeu stadium, to polite applause.

Hey ho, such things are difficult to judge. It is possible, however, to reasonably question whether Madrid has got the 'wow' factor.

Increasingly, IOC members seem to be favouring bids with added value, something a little extra.

I think the Madrid bid is a bit short of big ideas, on the lines of staging the beach volleyball beneath the Eiffel Tower, or along Horseguards Parade.

Some might dismiss that as a gimmick, but it does not do to be too stylish, cool or European about these things.

Madrid's many fine buildings and historical streets will serve largely as a backdrop, not a prop in the grand production as conceived by their rivals.


Feature: What is the evaluation commission looking for?
The commissioners worked hard. They asked for extra details, and sought additional briefings on areas where they need more information.

They posed for the odd photograph, even took penalties for the benefit of the cameras in the Bernabeu.

But they stuck to their task, and spoke to no-one from the media apart from at the final press conference, where Madrid's bid was given careful, considered praise without prejudice to the other four candidates.

They will need some stamina to survive the next few weeks, and doubtless will work long hours to draw up their report for members on the relative merits of the five great cities they will inspect.

They may even place Madrid at the top of the pile for its technical merits.

There is to be no official ranking, although it does not take a genius to work out which way they're thinking.

But I'm not sure that's going to be enough for the members whose votes are the only measure that really counts.

Mo Rush....please be a more normal person and Stop posting big slabs of writing u found on google....its annoying just link the url and give ur opinion included in the post

Paris has just built a temporary olympic "signal" on the locus of the future Olympic Village. That'll be a nice welcome sign for the IOC team.http://www.froggydelight.com/images/janvier2005/reperegonfleblanc.jpg

it looks shit

Mo Rush....please be a more normal person and Stop posting big slabs of writing u found on google....its annoying just link the url and give ur opinion included in the post

its called a forum, i can say what i like

Poll is still going on!!

Ok Mo Rush, but all you're telling it's false. Madrid has a very good technical bid (perhaps the best). no one (even british newspapers) can't say another think about it.
From now, I'll ignore all your post, because are all fanatic comments

Madrid has a very good technical bid (perhaps the best). no one (even british newspapers) can't say another think about it.

That's what MoRush's post said or did you not bother to read it and just post your flaming comments anyway. Twat!

It was a positive post legolas, and a positive article from the British press, and i do like it when the articles are posted in the thread like mo rush did, i hate bouncing around through windows.

Thanks mo rush.

It was a positive post legolas, and a positive article from the British press, and i do like it when the articles are posted in the thread like mo rush did, i hate bouncing around through windows.

Thanks mo rush.
Legolas i could laugh and say "in your face" but i will not i will see it as an honest mistake on your behalf and continue happy foruming just next time read the article im not out to damage madrids image, i will post all new articles related to the bid if memebers want me to

Good news - Olympic chiefs visit London. Bad news - they'll be travelling by Tube
It's crunch week for London's bid to host the 2012 Games. Jonathan Thompson and Andrew Johnson report

13 February 2005

Senior government ministers and British sporting heroes will be on hand to extol the capital's virtues when the 12-member International Olympic Committee (IOC) team visits this week to assess the London 2012 bid.

Although much of their four-day visit is expected to be spent in the exclusive Four Seasons Hotel in Canary Wharf grilling bid organisers in question and answer sessions, the evaluation commission will spend one day visiting London's proposed venues - and will take a trip on the Tube. It could prove a costly journey.

London 2012 organisers, who have spent up to £20m on the project, have pencilled in trips to the proposed sites, including the planned stadium at Stratford, the Millennium Dome at Greenwich and the ExCel centre in Docklands.

However, the commission can insist on being taken anywhere, including the new Wembley stadium, which will host the football, or to the archery venue at Lord's, or even to Wimbledon or Hackney.

Earlier this month, the Madrid bid suffered a setback over lack of accommodation, which was criticised by IOC members. Will transport prove London's Achilles heel? On Friday The Independent on Sunday sent four reporters on various journeys across London to put the transport infrastructure to the test.

Journey 1: Canary Wharf to Wembley

A simple trip that became an odyssey

A metallic voice on the Canary Wharf station intercom informed a packed Tube that the Jubilee line was down. A simple direct trip, 18 stops on the same train, was about to turn into a two-and-a-half-hour odyssey. Seeking "alternative routes", the crowd moved towards the nearby Docklands Light Railway, where the first four trains were too full for any more passengers. Squeezing on to the fifth was an angry, undignified scramble.

Next was the Central line, then a switch to the Metropolitan, and finally a wet Wembley. Something of an own goal.

Journey time: Two-and-a-half hours, one way.

Journey 2: Canary Wharf to Lord's

'A magical mystery tour of London lines'

This trip seemed a simple one. Hop on the Jubilee line at Canary Wharf and hop off 10 stops down the line at St John's Wood. Simple, if it were not for the chaotic transport infrastructure. Severe problems on the Jubilee line meant we had to take the Docklands Light Railway instead. Forced to use a combination of the Jubilee, Metropolitan and Hammersmith and City lines, the journey to the cricket ground at Lord's took the best part of two hours. Four trains were missed due to crowding and the journey turned into a magical mystery tour of London stations and lines.

Journey time: One hour 55 minutes, one way.

Journey 3: Canary Wharf to Wimbledon

How 12 miles turned into an 80-minute epic

It's 12 miles from the Four Seasons Hotel in Canary Wharf to the All England Tennis Club in Wimbledon, but on London's rickety District line, it's an uncomfortable 80-minute mission. First you take the Docklands Light Railway, then the District line from Bank/Monument. There are 20 stops, and passengers may have to change at Earl's Court as there are various branches on the line. There were no seats and should the IOC team go to see the tennis facilities by Tube next week, they could find their noses squashed against the glass, and perhaps expect a few bruised ribs.

Journey time: One hour 20 minutes, one way.

Journey 4: Canary Wharf to Hackney Wick

Driver of a late train stopped for a chat

To travel from Canary Wharf to the new international station at St Pancras is an easy trip via the DLR and Northern line. But the money has yet to be released to complete the station from where Olympic visitors will be able to catch the express service to the Olympic village at Stratford. And to get to Hackney Wick, the site of the proposed basketball arena, they would have to take the Tube to Highbury & Islington and then take a Silverlink train. On the way back they might find theirtrain, already delayed by 15 minutes, stopping between stations while the driver chats to the driver of a train going in the opposite direction.

Journey time: Two hours, round trip.

i don't understand all these great big disasters, i use the tube all the time, and not once have i suffered a major setback. Maybe i am just lucky.

What do you expect? Usual British reporting casting anything negative.

To go from Canary Wharf to Wimbledon get off at Waterloo and get the mainline.

The journeys the IOC do will be during the day, not during rush hour. So I really doubt trains will be 'full'.

Why are the British so harsh on themselves? They've got fantastic economic performance, low unemployment, and other very positive indicators that are in the envy of not only the other EU nations, but the world in general. All I hear is about how the public transport sucks and no one can buy a home. These are problems that are not unique to the UK! Sure, you can talk about these problems, but all I read is constant bitching about the relatively minor problems facing the country. Chin up mates!

Why are the British so harsh on themselves? They've got fantastic economic performance, low unemployment, and other very positive indicators that are in the envy of not only the other EU nations, but the world in general. All I hear is about how the public transport sucks and no one can buy a home. These are problems that are not unique to the UK! Sure, you can talk about these problems, but all I read is constant bitching about the relatively minor problems facing the country. Chin up mates!

Its a national disease, aussies call us whinging poms. We are on the whole very hard to please. But also our media tends to always look for the negative, and say even the BBC when presenting a story they do a plus and a minus angle to everything.

Its a national disease, aussies call us whinging poms. We are on the whole very hard to please. But also our media tends to always look for the negative, and say even the BBC when presenting a story they do a plus and a minus angle to everything.

What does "whinging poms" translate to in the English spoken across the pond?

delete

whinging= whinging
poms = brits (or whatever you call us over there)

It is a very British thing, it serves a general purpose, but teh media push it to the pessimistic extreme. They make it seem painfully poor relative to the rest of the world, although they dont always say that, that is the impression they give off. It so much better elsewhere................

However, if we were not so critical and hard to please there is a possibility that standards in some areas would be lower and we would be generally worse off. Alternatively, it could inspire great pessimism to the point where it's considered pointless, if you know what i mean!

Warsaw! hahaah jk

London
Paris
Madrid
NY
Moscow

http://cache.gettyimages.com/comp/52213780.jpg?x=x&dasite=MS_GINS&ef=2&ev=1&dareq=1562F455D739C8E68E7DD28C9C4239A4A9C30E9B9B114CE8

http://cache.gettyimages.com/comp/52213768.jpg?x=x&dasite=MS_GINS&ef=2&ev=1&dareq=1562F455D739C8E67D26EB667AF3FDFFA9C30E9B9B114CE8

http://cache.gettyimages.com/comp/52213754.jpg?x=x&dasite=MS_GINS&ef=2&ev=1&dareq=1562F455D739C8E6311CE57DF55E3728A9C30E9B9B114CE8

http://cache.gettyimages.com/comp/52209879.jpg?x=x&dasite=MS_GINS&ef=2&ev=1&dareq=C31CA8177AA01A470BF6F0F66AF74C54A9C30E9B9B114CE8

http://cache.gettyimages.com/comp/52209836.jpg?x=x&dasite=MS_GINS&ef=2&ev=1&dareq=C31CA8177AA01A47BDF119C9A3DB701BA9C30E9B9B114CE8

http://cache.gettyimages.com/comp/52205574.jpg?x=x&dasite=MS_GINS&ef=2&ev=1&dareq=1562F455D739C8E6AF1D6DCC2BEAEF1FA9C30E9B9B114CE8

http://cache.gettyimages.com/comp/52209824.jpg?x=x&dasite=MS_GINS&ef=2&ev=1&dareq=C31CA8177AA01A4799928962F9395DDFA9C30E9B9B114CE8

http://cache.gettyimages.com/comp/52209828.jpg?x=x&dasite=MS_GINS&ef=2&ev=1&dareq=C31CA8177AA01A47D970F71075ECDFAFA9C30E9B9B114CE8

BRING THE GAMES TO LONDON,
LONDON 2012 - SPORT AT HEART

How was the visit?? Here, in Spain some news say people in GB dislike London bid and IOC people aren't so happy as in Madrid was. Here, people say the fight is between Paris and Madrid. (I hope. Less competitors)

How was the visit?? Here, in Spain some news say people in GB dislike London bid and IOC people aren't so happy as in Madrid was. Here, people say the fight is between Paris and Madrid. (I hope. Less competitors)

london 2012 cause i got that feeling things havent even started to get heated yet