I wizz thru Hornsby everyday by train and its booming!! highrise everywhere!
nice innovative designs.
i must jump out and collect data on the 20 or so skyscrapers.

bit of skyline
http://www.realestate.com.au/objects/props/4928/101834928ml1094004620.jpg

http://www.realestate.com.au/objects/props/8528/101648528cl1087502841.jpg

heres a new one by our favourites MERITON

thanks to FINN for this find-
http://www.meriton.com.au/avanti/bigavanti.jpg

Avanti: Cnr George & Burdett Street Hornsby

Avanti is Meriton’s progressive new development at Hornsby. Designed by Meriton’s inhouse team of architects, Avanti offers two stunning buildings of 13 storeys set in beautifully landscaped grounds.
Situated in the heart of Hornsby, Avanti is only a short walk from Hornsby Train Station and Westfield. You are also only minutes from numerous schools, parks and recreational facilities.

Resort-style facilities will include an indoor heated pool, sauna, spa, gymnasium, barbeque area and an on-site Caretaker/Manager to oversee the maintenance of the development.

Avanti will also encompass a number of retail shops and a childcare centre for 50 children.

Choose from a selection of 1, 1 + study, 2 and 3 bedroom apartments which all offer the finest in finishes and fittings such as floor-to-ceiling glass, gourmet kitchens with stainless steel European appliances and granite or stone benches, wiring for Pay TV and high speed internet connections, glass balustrades and large balconies.

Register your interest now: contact Jim Keats on 9287 2565

---------------------------------

Hornsby has a magnitude of towers from 6-12storeys
heres some-


MADISON
7STOREYS
http://www.realestate.com.au/objects/props/4152/101864152mm1095052923.jpg

7storeys
http://www.realestate.com.au/objects/props/8763/101798763mm1092671777.jpg

8storeys
25 Hunter st
http://www.realestate.com.au/objects/props/3255/101873255mm1090219824.jpg

8 storeys
College Towers

http://www.realestate.com.au/objects/props/2480/101852480mm1094618914.jpg

10 storeys
208 pac hwy
http://www.realestate.com.au/objects/props/3860/101813860mm1093239747.jpg

7 storeys UC

http://www.realestate.com.au/objects/props/9950/101789950mm1092288824.jpg

9storeys
ICON
http://www.realestate.com.au/objects/props/1189/101691189mm1089074810.jpg

7 STOREYS
http://www.realestate.com.au/objects/props/8528/101648528mm1087502841.jpg

8 storeys
PARKVIEW
http://www.realestate.com.au/objects/props/3237/101523237mm1083885356.jpg

10storeys
121 pac hwy
http://www.realestate.com.au/objects/props/5419/101445419mm1080424396.jpg

many also in neibouring Waitara,. same postcode-2077

9 storeys, Waitara
http://www.realestate.com.au/objects/props/1440/101071440mm1065017969.jpg

9 storeys -193 leonard Street, Waitara
http://www.realestate.com.au/objects/props/4431/101884431mm1095748213.jpg

9 storeys-205 City View Road, Pennant Hills

http://www.realestate.com.au/objects/props/6084/101836084mm1094024324.jpg

9 storeys-Orara, 39-47 Orara st,Waitara
http://www.realestate.com.au/objects/props/7002/101807002mm1092899403.jpg

7storeys-47 Waitara Ave Waitara
http://www.realestate.com.au/objects/props/2084/101742084mm1090823535.jpg

10storeys
Waitara Gardens, 501 Waitara Ave ,Waitara

http://www.realestate.com.au/objects/props/4851/101674851mm1088495401.jpg

7storeys-18 Romsey Street, Waitara
http://www.realestate.com.au/objects/props/1764/101481764mm1083040464.jpg
\
9 storeys
509 Waitara Ave, Waitara

http://www.realestate.com.au/objects/props/0068/101290068mm1074645138.jpg

new tower-9storeys

12 Romsey Street, Waitara
http://www.realestate.com.au/objects/props/4866/101064866mm1064815991.jpg

the end!

Ugh! Is it just me, or does anyone else out there think that most of those Hornesby develpments are really naff looking? Rather like taking the sensibility of a cheap project house and upscaling it to an apartment building...

they have definalty improved over past 5 years though.

They are all very nasty looking and very boring with very little architectural quality about them. I remember seeing them so aften on my way to Barker College that I just wanted to toss a bucket of paint on them and jazzz them up a bit. Boring brick for the boring suburbs.

quite boring indeed, best ones are at wolli creek, chatswood and sydney cbd.

Eden (Meriton) isnt too bad.
http://www.meriton.com.au/eden/eden_main_l.jpg

C'mon, you guys are too picky.
We need more of these midrise apartments to densify the suburb.
It's a start.

I don't mind the low rise or mid rise towers, I just want some more quality and creative designs. The last pic posted by Mr C shows the better ones built in recent years.

I think they are significantly better designs than the 3-storey walk-up red, blonde and brown brick unit buildings that surround 75% of train stations on the City Rail network!

Not that there's anything wrong with a well-built walk-up as an investment or as a place to live for that matter, be it dated or new, but they were the equivalent of today's new project home suburbs for lack of design originality and bland homogenity.

Hello? What do ya expect...skyscrapers with glass cladding in semi-regional area?

That place looks like a modern farm district or regional cities.

BTW: The Maximum storeys Hornsby can go up to is 14. Under NSW gov't definition, anything with multi-families living 14 storeys and under are called medium density.

got plans from Meriton yesterday for Avanti.
the twin towers will be tallest in Hornsby. the 13storey towers rise to 40m to roof and 47m to LMR. There heights (LMR) above sea level are- 223m!!

http://www.meriton.com.au/avanti/bigavanti.jpg

Does anybody know about this project in Waitara?

http://img.domain.com.au/img/5290/2004255041_1_FS.JPG?mod=050220-161005

It looks to be 14-levels and is advertised as being 105-units and only 1 minute walk from Waitara train station, but can't find anymore details. Also, Cul, where abouts on SS.com are the Hornsby and Waitara towers listed? :?

Hornsby is listed in Sydney's metro section. Waitara is part of Hornsby.

http://www.emporis.com/en/wm/ci/?id=106525
the list of 9 skyscrapers>

http://www.emporis.com/en/wm/ci/bu/sk/li/?id=106525&bt=2&ht=2&sro=1

the big one above is known as 3-11 Orara Street.>
http://www.emporis.com/en/wm/bu/?id=205783

Hornsby is listed in Sydney's metro section. Waitara is part of Hornsby.

http://www.emporis.com/en/wm/ci/?id=106525
the list of 9 skyscrapers>

http://www.emporis.com/en/wm/ci/bu/sk/li/?id=106525&bt=2&ht=2&sro=1

the big one above is known as 3-11 Orara Street.>
http://www.emporis.com/en/wm/bu/?id=205783

For some reason Hornsby isn't listed in the Sydney metro cities pull down list?? There's Bankstown, Bondi Junction, Chatswood, East Sydney, Homebush Bay, Hurstville, Manly, Marrickville, North Sydney, Parramatta, Redfern, Rockdale, St Leonards, Strathfield, Sutherland Shire...but no Hornsby. The only way to get to the Hornsby page is by searching for "Hornsby" in the search box - so you can't get to it through the Sydney page.

^ really? damn. ill have to tell chief ed about it.
thanks for lettin me know.

http://img.domain.com.au/img/5290/2004255041_1_FS.JPG?mod=050220-161005

Wow, an apartment building with a smaller apartment building on the roof -- ingenious! Are those giant redwoods behind it?

LOL :D

giant SEQUOIA??

http://www.cs.ucr.edu/~ywang/Sequoia%20NP.jpg

I went for a drive through Hornsby and the area on Thursday. Took some pics in Epping

http://img98.imageshack.us/img98/6178/epping0032ot.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

http://img98.imageshack.us/img98/6255/epping0017ab.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

http://img98.imageshack.us/img98/5165/epping0042xp.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

http://img252.imageshack.us/img252/2752/epping0066dj.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

http://img252.imageshack.us/img252/4838/epping0116xq.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

At Hornsby I got on the roof and took pics in most directions. I was very surprised by how developed the place is now, I use to go to the cinema and shopping centre around ten years ago. Must be some great views from these apartments. I wonder if there'll be some office high rise in the near future.

I started looking south west and worked my way round to south east.

http://img230.imageshack.us/img230/672/hornsby0001pr.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

http://img230.imageshack.us/img230/2758/hornsby0019wu.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

http://img230.imageshack.us/img230/1060/hornsby0024nb.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

http://img230.imageshack.us/img230/8717/hornsby0031dd.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

http://img230.imageshack.us/img230/326/hornsby0048ux.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

http://img230.imageshack.us/img230/5562/hornsby0073av.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

http://img230.imageshack.us/img230/7683/hornsby0229on.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

http://img230.imageshack.us/img230/2172/hornsby0233pe.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

http://img230.imageshack.us/img230/6402/hornsby0269dw.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

http://img230.imageshack.us/img230/1928/hornsby0284yx.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

http://img230.imageshack.us/img230/8501/hornsby0293hg.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

http://img230.imageshack.us/img230/8092/hornsby0306hh.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

http://img230.imageshack.us/img230/1225/hornsby0338va.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

http://img230.imageshack.us/img230/7903/hornsby0348ra.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

http://img230.imageshack.us/img230/8777/hornsby0378ux.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

http://img230.imageshack.us/img230/4240/hornsby0389uh.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

http://img230.imageshack.us/img230/720/hornsby0408qv.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

bump

I took some quite appaling photos last week in Hornsby, most with sun glare, through car windows and at weird angles. I wasn't going to post them for those reasons and the fact that I don't know what they're of but, enjoy: ;)

http://img363.imageshack.us/img363/3633/hornsby12009052tq.jpg
http://img363.imageshack.us/img363/3641/hornsby22009058fq.jpg
http://img363.imageshack.us/img363/8945/hornsby32009059qp.jpg
http://img363.imageshack.us/img363/8490/hornsby42009050dc.jpg
http://img363.imageshack.us/img363/7303/hornsby62009058xl.jpg
http://img363.imageshack.us/img363/6408/hornsby72009059ma.jpg
http://img363.imageshack.us/img363/9287/hornsby82009053yw.jpg
http://img363.imageshack.us/img363/9526/hornsby92009053rc.jpg

thanks for pix. i go through hornsby everyday. i wish 14storey height limit was lifted. really deserves a higher limit.

There is a hell of a lot of new stuff going up, most of which looks good. Mr C, I think the height limit is ok.

noticed ths morning with my sleepy eyes the enormous cores of Meritons 14st twin tower project AVANTI. maybe 6-7 storeys now

While this thread is bumped up to the top, I may as well post this photo I took a few days ago of part of the characterless part of these suburbs.
http://img212.imageshack.us/img212/2571/hornsby1612055mn.jpg

I read in newspaper that Hornsby is facing trouble by not meeting the required number of units under the guidline set by NSW government. They'll be reviewing new locations to build apartments.

I read in newspaper that Hornsby is facing trouble by not meeting the required number of units under the guidline set by NSW government. They'll be reviewing new locations to build apartments.

Ha! They have no choice but to increase the hight limit then.

ive always said 14storys is a silly height limit. 20storeys would be suffice

Meriton Avanti today:
http://img153.imageshack.us/img153/7012/avantihornsby22702065mu.jpg

The 2nd tower is hidden behind the brick building to the right. Its core is at about 3 levels above ground.

yes, i go past his project every bloody day but im always in a comotose state. its such a big development right near station and shops. looks good thus far.
its about 12 floors with 2 to go.
c heers

^^If you have a look in the Meriton sales office at the base of Meriton Tower construction site on Geroge St there's a model of this development, as well as the twin tower that will also be built behind the service station seen in the picture. I counted the floors on the model and I think the two towers are about 13/14 storeys.

saw avanti today. the north tower has topped out and south tower is 5 levels high/

I'll try to grab a photo in the next week or so, hopefully.

great. they look very imposing. nice looking. hornsby is looking denser.

Ugh! Is it just me, or does anyone else out there think that most of those Hornesby develpments are really naff looking?

Nope, they're shit alright.

there are alot of new developments that have good designs and materials.

The good thing about most of the designs from Hornsby/Waitara apartments are that the sliding doors and windows are big and tall, instead of small like commie blocks.

theres only so much you can do with small unit blocks.
heres a brand new one. nice brick infill concrete render.
CHARTER TOWERS
http://www.realestate.com.au/objects/props/5755/103095755ml1143683685.jpg


Meritons AVANTI- TOWER 1
http://www.realestate.com.au/objects/props/5287/102585287ml1123151614.jpg

new AURIGA
http://www.realestate.com.au/objects/props/8659/102418659bl1121695822.jpg

new block in Waitara
nice splash of colour to otherwise boring brick flats

http://www.realestate.com.au/objects/props/9637/102519637ml1145603701.jpg

ive always said 14storys is a silly height limit. 20storeys would be suffice

Hmm, by the look of the pic in sirhc8's post, I'd say they need a few more storeys than that...

I just wish they'd up the height limit over in Miranda. It's really getting quite built up in the core area now.

I like the look of Auriga...

^ yes its a shame they have put an 8storey hieght limit for the shire.definatley should be atleast 15. i was there last week. why have they stopped on the 8storey project next to kiora mall (opposite cath school) at only 4 storeys? the rio is still sticking up above roof. have they run out of money or markets that bad, they will add the other 4 floor s at a later date?

Sorry again about the quality. It's hard to take decent photos while you're driving.


http://img264.imageshack.us/img264/9380/p10103628fv.jpg

http://img140.imageshack.us/img140/7697/p10103645pm.jpg

http://img140.imageshack.us/img140/7713/p10103657km.jpg

http://img261.imageshack.us/img261/2483/p10103667vr.jpg

That Meriton near the train station looks huge, at least compared to the ones that have been sprouting in Waitara. I don't take much notice of them when I go to Hornsby, none of them are really that tall, I'm hoping for one biggie though in the future. And it'll probably spread down to the rest of Waitara

thanks sirhc
look impressive

From Hornsby Station today:
http://img400.imageshack.us/img400/5923/avantihornsby12605064ex.jpg

http://img99.imageshack.us/img99/6517/avantihornsby22605066dx.jpg

http://img99.imageshack.us/img99/8977/avantihornsby32605067az.jpg

thanks. yes they have been rising fast. fairly good quality structures.
the top of the tallest bldg is 242mRL which is as high as Sydney's tallest buildings.

noticed the 2nd tower is now full height with floors about 3 more to go. both look good "for meriton".

So Meriton's "Avanti - Tower 1" is being built on the old Hornsby Shire Council works depot site? Just asking because I once worked there. BTW, where is the council's depot now, if anyone knows?

Hornsby and Waitara sure have changed since I lived in nearby Wahroonga (1988-1992).

both Advanti towers are basically complete.look ok.

water clock
http://farm1.static.flickr.com/168/406672783_6537b13c44_b.jpg

I love that WTF water clock. I remember the general confusion when it was built.

Hornsbys historic Signal Box on rollers- sept11
http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1274/1356780487_b0641862b7_b.jpg

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1103/1356786517_59de0a840b_b.jpg

Where is/was it going Mr C?

The signal box was built in 1928 and was one of the largest most complex of its time. But Hornsby station has grown and it was time to relocate it. It weighed 320 tonnes and was going to be demolished but a great sydney firm-mommoth movers said they will lift it and move it. since platform 5 was extending, it had to be rolled 150m north.

http://www.railtravel.com.au/hornsbysignalbox/images/DSC_06852007-09-11_jpg.jpg

^ yes its a shame they have put an 8storey hieght limit for the shire.definatley should be atleast 15. i was there last week. why have they stopped on the 8storey project next to kiora mall (opposite cath school) at only 4 storeys? the rio is still sticking up above roof. have they run out of money or markets that bad, they will add the other 4 floor s at a later date?

It's been complete (at four storeys) for more than a year and it wont be going any higher by the looks of it.

I'd like to comment further on the Shire and it's NIMBYness but it belongs in another thread.

deleted

because im normally chasing zzzzz when i go thru hornsby of a day, i couldnt believe my eyes today when low and behold a new skyscraper uc! Its massive. looks like it could be another meriton. next to the other 2 x 14storeys near station on george st.
must find out more.
heres an old pic of Avante (may06)
, the new tower is left of the twin towers
http://img99.imageshack.us/img99/8977/avantihornsby32605067az.jpg

anyone interested. i found out what new development will be. checked out council website.
its a $5.8mil office project consisting of 6,800sqm of office space.
The building @ 110 george st will have 4 basements (68 cars),grd lev retail and 3 floors of office.
fab website>
http://www.110georgestreet.com
its great how a large office bldg is being built in far north suburb of hornsby.
render>
http://www.realestate.com.au/objects/props/4218/5294218ml1170887520.jpg

http://www.realcommercial.com.au/cgi-bin/rsearch?a=o&id=5294218&f=0&p=10&t=com&ty=&fmt=&header=&cc=&c=57166313&s=nsw&tm=1202303426
plans
checkout grd floor is @ RL176m! roof= RL193m (gable-RL196m) - rear height-RL171m=25m above grd.
http://www.110georgestreet.com/013Section1.pdf

^^From that rendering it looks like the development is being driven by Officeworks, with the developer adding in a few office floors to boost feasibility.

yeah could be right. ill try to get a passing pic to show how big it is. impressive for hornsby
cheers

on friday
not a good pic but shows you where it is.just north of meritons
its full height now
http://img259.imageshack.us/img259/9016/0002509avw5.jpg

^^From that rendering it looks like the development is being driven by Officeworks, with the developer adding in a few office floors to boost feasibility.


I agree its branding is complete Officeworks in appearance. i'd be very surprised if they were not involved.

not exactly hornsby but closeby-Warrawee
passing today saw 3 huge cranes
http://www.amberleigh.com.au/
nice highrise in green suburb
http://www.amberleigh.com.au/images/external.jpg

Is there really any employment up that way minus Westfield?

The suburbs around Hornsby surprise me by the low density feeling that they have. For example, here is Mount Colah - photo by me.
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/6/6c/Mtcolah.jpg/820px-Mtcolah.jpg

no not really. hornsby is a residential suburb. but as i posted before a new office tower is being built to provide 7000sqm of office space. thats a start

Office Works is progressing well.
website>
http://www.npoint.com.au/OfficeworksHornsby.asp
http://www.npoint.com.au/_data/docs/gallery/hornsby_2792_lgegallery.jpg

http://www.npoint.com.au/_data/docs/gallery/227_2750%20large%20gallery%20pic.jpg

the office works building is now complete. looks good

Is there really any employment up that way minus Westfield?

The suburbs around Hornsby surprise me by the low density feeling that they have. For example, here is Mount Colah - photo by me.
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/6/6c/Mtcolah.jpg/820px-Mtcolah.jpg

Hornsy has a reasonable industrial estate next to the F3, companies like wrigleys were/are based there. There are employment opportunities i guess.Hornsy also has a reasonable civic precinct with a large TAFE college, police and fairly big council. Hospital a bit further up as well. There are loads of car yards along the pacific Highway back towards thompsons corner with light industrial behind it.

I don't think hornsby feels low denisty on the westfield side. Look at neighbouring waitara ... it's a 10 story abominiation of concrete.

managed a passing shot yesterday of new office works office block. looks really good.
you cant see bottom 2 floors and damn train catenarys in way. but gives idea

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3278/3003919582_6b141515ab_b.jpg

I was reading in the papers over the weekend that Rees wants to see more development in Hornsby and other regional centres within Sydney to encourage more people to work near their homes.

from this aerial you can really see the commercial zones and resi areas
westfield centre with train station adjacent
train route heading north at bottom right of pic

large
http://www.flickr.com/photos/ninoxowl/3178584572/sizes/o/in/set-72157611586176781/

dec08
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3094/3178584572_c450ab9f20_b.jpg

That aerial gives us a good insight into the amount of highrises that have been built in recent years. More than I thought to be honest.

Big bump!

Hornsby Shire Council is currently getting community comments over 20 storey built form.

http://www.hornsby.nsw.gov.au/uploads/documents/draft_20_storey_built_form_concepts-March10.pdf

I'm guessing Hornsby Shire will go out in a loose to build 20 storey apartments to meet NSW government development guideline.

Please comment here in nimby discussion board about it!

http://bangthetable.com/topic/draft-20-storey-built-form-concepts

Any units built in Hornsby will no doubt be cheap and nasty. The precedent's already been set by Meriton.

GOOD iudea. bout time. 14st is too ;low

Any units built in Hornsby will no doubt be cheap and nasty. The precedent's already been set by Meriton.

My friend lives in one of the apartment complex in Waitara. I don't think the quality is cheap and nasty at all. Well built inside and has good landscape and facilities.

Wow, I've always thought of Hornsby as an ideal place and setting for high rises but I never thought that they'll actually build them there. We finally seem to be getting high rises in the suburban centres. I can't wait to see Sydney 10 years later - quieter suburbs with houses and 3-4 storey apartments surrounded by many major centres and pockets of high rises everywhere. A balanced mix between lower and higher densities - my ideal city :)

But the nimbys are causing me quite a bit of concern. Screw the nimbys :lol:

Wow, I've always thought of Hornsby as an ideal place and setting for high rises but I never thought that they'll actually build them there. We finally seem to be getting high rises in the suburban centres. I can't wait to see Sydney 10 years later - quieter suburbs with houses and 3-4 storey apartments surrounded by many major centres and pockets of high rises everywhere. A balanced mix between lower and higher densities - my ideal city :)

Agree - this is probably the ideal urban form.

My friend lives in one of the apartment complex in Waitara. I don't think the quality is cheap and nasty at all. Well built inside and has good landscape and facilities.

Certainly not what I've heard. And there're seriously not pretty from the outside.


http://img212.imageshack.us/img212/2571/hornsby1612055mn.jpg

I'm all for highrises in activity centres. I'm just not expecting great things.

I have my flame suit on as I must be the only one who doesnt get it, why would you want to live in a 20 storey apartment block in HORNSBY!?

Or any of that high density stuff around there. Hornsby/ Waitara is already a bit of a ghetto so I dont see the point. Its not that far from the edge of Sydney? I think an hour on the train from the City? There is not really good express services to the CBD either? I guess you could make it to Chatswood in what 40 minutes? So that is something.

Is the excitement because people just like higher density properties being built? Or people just like the idea of what is being built?

If this was in the inner areas or even just into the middle ring I reckon it would be awesome! However general residential development outside of Hornsby, Ku-Ring-Gai and Ryde seems to be slow in comparison which is a shame.

Hornsby is a major regional centre just like Liverpool or Penrith. You don't need to go to CBD or Chatswood, the area offers everything you need. It is a mini city itself. People live there for the convenience and also close proximity to the national parks. The view from the 20th floor must be fabulous but still affordable unlike inner city apartments.

There's no real employment in the Hornsby area, just some retail. Most travel to Macquarie Park, Chatswood or the CBD I asume. I would never live in an apartment 20kms from the city. I know one man who 'lives' in the blue mountains but has cheap apartment in Waitara to stay in during his working week. Otherwise I think there're full of immigrants.

And unsuccessful people...

^ Other people obviously have different living preferences to you. If I worked in Hornsby (or nearby) or had my social circle/family in Hornsby I would live there and I would prefer an apartment. It is convenient to the F3 so people can get out of Sydney quickly on a weekend or whenever. For others, the choice of apartment is cost-based as well.

Further, centres like Hornsby need the critical mass of residents in order to increase the amenity of the area and provide an economic base for higher quality and additional facilities and services, e.g. transport, shopping, cafes, employment, recreation and so on.

There's no real employment in the Hornsby area, just some retail.

There's a decent amount of employment at the Asquith industrial estate.

Commercial areas at Macquarie Park, Gordon and Chatswood are short train trips away.

It only takes 20 min to Macquarie Park, 23 min to North Ryde (Nothern Line), and 24 min to Chatswood (North Shore Line).

I work in North Ryde and many of my collegues live in Hornsby, and they are loving the convenience. Sydney isn't just about CBD anymore. It has to offer high density residential for the reginal centres/employment hubs as well.

Is the excitement because people just like higher density properties being built? Or people just like the idea of what is being built?


I'm excited by the idea of Transit Oriented Development - of not forcing people to spend $5000 per year or more on a car they don't need, let alone 2,3 or 4 cars per household.

I love economic efficiency and don't see anything efficient about a household of 4 people spending $20000 on transport because the government won't address the market failure in the transport market.

I've lived in China where you can get the bus round, and stayed in Manila where people can't move because there is little systemic public transport and the entire middle class want to drive everywhere.

There is nothing 'efficient' about private road transport.

Hence marrying urban form to transport networks is crucial.

And despite the whinging in the papers - the rail network is not carrying even the fraction of what it could be carrying if properly run. But a story for another day.

I shouldn't have made the comment about unsucessful people. Different stokes and all.

But Hornsby is an ugly, boring place. It mostly car dealerships along the Pacific Highway, Meriton or three-storey red brick apartment in the residential streets and a huge shopping centre which engulfs half the town. The quality of units in Ku-ring-gai has been higher (but no doubt more expensive).

There's some nice, leafy (low-density!) suburbs nearby, though.

No matter how much high density they put in most of the shire will always be low density - down some of those valleys for example.

Guess what folks, when Sydney has the population of HK and the area of HK, there won't be many prizes for what city it's going to ressemble!

I'm excited by the idea of Transit Oriented Development - of not forcing people to spend $5000 per year or more on a car they don't need, let alone 2,3 or 4 cars per household.

I love economic efficiency and don't see anything efficient about a household of 4 people spending $20000 on transport because the government won't address the market failure in the transport market.

I've lived in China where you can get the bus round, and stayed in Manila where people can't move because there is little systemic public transport and the entire middle class want to drive everywhere.

There is nothing 'efficient' about private road transport.

Hence marrying urban form to transport networks is crucial.

And despite the whinging in the papers - the rail network is not carrying even the fraction of what it could be carrying if properly run. But a story for another day.

I shouldn't but I am going to bite. While I share your desire for transit enabled development does that mean that what we are doing now is right? To me the Government is just evading the "grey" haze of NIMBYs that have taken over the inner ring and their own incompetence at Infrastructure development and are talking the easy way out, densifying out in the burbs in areas that have no risk of costing them politically. Not where the development should be happening at this point in the game. There is such a lack of development in Sydney as a whole that people will buy anything.

When someone finally gets around to doing the job right watch what happens to concrete jungles in the middle of no where like Hornsby. There has not been any extra major Infrastructure or transport investment in areas like Hornsby, Ku-Ring-gai or Ryde yet that is used as justification for the expansion. As I said, there has been the opposite for Ku-Ring-Gai. They will fill it until its ruined because for Labor there is no consequence. Not because its good planning for Sydney, or because its what people want. They will do it because its easy.

As for Cityrail I see many claiming that the issue is that its not run right. There are problems there but is that all there is to it? Are you saying they could run more then 20 DD TPH on the North Shore line? Are you saying that the Single North Shore line from Milsons Point to Hornsby now with these branches:

- Macqarie Park
- Upper Northern line
- Berowra
- Central Coast Peak services
- New North West line

NOt to mention the employment centres that these lines cover and the amount of passengers that travel from all over Sydney using these services.

You are saying the current North Shore line is good enough to support all this if Cityrail was run better? Or are you referring to the removal of DD trains as most do?

It only takes 20 min to Macquarie Park, 23 min to North Ryde (Nothern Line), and 24 min to Chatswood (North Shore Line).

I work in North Ryde and many of my collegues live in Hornsby, and they are loving the convenience. Sydney isn't just about CBD anymore. It has to offer high density residential for the reginal centres/employment hubs as well.

Less time then I thought. Although these people are not going to be happy when the NWRL comes on line ;)

Less time then I thought. Although these people are not going to be happy when the NWRL comes on line ;)

No problem. They will rent out their units in Hornsby and buy a McMansion in Rouse Hill. About time they need a big house with kids. It's all planned out nicely. ;)

Less time then I thought. Although these people are not going to be happy when the NWRL comes on line ;)

travel times will not change significantly with NWRL

travel times will not change significantly with NWRL

They will if you are going to Macquarie Park via the upper Northern line!

They will if you are going to Macquarie Park via the upper Northern line!

A few minutes to change at Epping is not 'significantly'.

A few minutes to change at Epping is not 'significantly'.

Ignore, I forgot there will be 8TPH on the Northern line post NWRL (Labor version anyway), still not quite as nice a service as it is now.

http://bangthetable.com/topic/draft-20-storey-built-form-concepts

Not enough pro-development people here, I need a little help!

ps. please don't offend the nimbys and call them something like "selfish". Perhaps we should use a nicer tone and start using words such as "we" or "our". If we're lucky enough, we just might be able to convert some weak-minded ones like that. :lol::lol::lol:

Trying to talk logic on a place like bang the table is a waste of time. it is basically set up to give NIMBYs a voice

Then lets add all our voices in and be louder than them.

http://bangthetable.com/topic/draft-20-storey-built-form-concepts

Not enough pro-development people here, I need a little help!

ps. please don't offend the nimbys and call them something like "selfish". Perhaps we should use a nicer tone and start using words such as "we" or "our". If we're lucky enough, we just might be able to convert some weak-minded ones like that. :lol::lol::lol:

Are you Aussie17? You sound very patient. :lol:

You can't talk logic with NIMBYs though. They don't care about the future of Sydney, what they care is just the view from their home.

Are you Aussie17? You sound very patient. :lol:

You can't talk logic with NIMBYs though. They don't care about the future of Sydney, what they care is just the view from their home.

Yeah, I know you can't smarten up the nimbys, but since Hornsby Council submitted the draft to the site themselves, if we all have a say on this, perhaps it'll send quite a strong message to them. It'll prove to them not everyone's a self-centred nimby.

And yeah, I'm Aussie17, I feel like i just dominated them.:lol:

Yeah, I know you can't smarten up the nimbys, but since Hornsby Council submitted the draft to the site themselves, if we all have a say on this, perhaps it'll send quite a strong message to them. It'll prove to them not everyone's a self-centred nimby.

And yeah, I'm Aussie17, I feel like i just dominated them.:lol:

LOL! The irony? If ever I saw an underdeveloped area compared to the amount of Infrastructure it has and is getting its Epping. There I could see 20 storey towers. Yet look at what is being proposed for that area...

Epping needs something done to the eastern end of Carlingford Road and the Epping Rd/Blaxland Rd junction to support any more development. I can't possibly see anything succeeding here without an additional rail crossing.

Epping needs something done to the eastern end of Carlingford Road and the Epping Rd/Blaxland Rd junction to support any more development. I can't possibly see anything succeeding here without an additional rail crossing.

Hornsby and the Pacific Highway is no better.

Epping development is tiny compared to the rail infrsustrucutre it boasts (and will be getting) and also has the M2 on its doorstep.

Hornsby and the Pacific Highway is no better.

I disagree - you have the two Pacific Hwy routes east and west of the rail line plus the Sherbrook Road rat-run to the east. Not to mention the freeway bypass!

Epping has the two signalised intersections at the end of Carlingford Road through which all town centre traffic must pass, the short distance between the two severely limits the storage capacity and makes co-ordination of the signals very difficult. While there's definitely an element of toll-avoidance, there's also plenty of north-south traffic proceeding from Beecroft Road to Blaxland Road and vice versa to which the M2 is no use.

RTA's proposal for a bus-only lane on Bridge St to allow buses to enter the rail overpass without having to go along Carlingford Road is a good start. I wonder if it is possible to widen the bridge to add an eastbound bus lane leading into Langston Place. Langston Place also needs a southbound bus-only lane.

I disagree - you have the two Pacific Hwy routes east and west of the rail line plus the Sherbrook Road rat-run to the east. Not to mention the freeway bypass!

Epping has the two signalised intersections at the end of Carlingford Road through which all town centre traffic must pass, the short distance between the two severely limits the storage capacity and makes co-ordination of the signals very difficult. While there's definitely an element of toll-avoidance, there's also plenty of north-south traffic proceeding from Beecroft Road to Blaxland Road and vice versa to which the M2 is no use.

The Eastern bound route into Wahroonga? You are kidding right? Single lane, slow rd with lots of traffic and poorly timed lights. Its a backstreet. Yet often quicker then the car park called the pacific hwy which is sad. The path through the back of St Ives is usualy a bit better. F3 Freeway is only good if you are heading out of Sydney or skipping to Berowra. Where as the M2/ LCT is a direct link to the CBD and other then traffic a bloody fast one too. Straight through the centre of Epping. Fantastic OP. Will be much better with the NWRL built too. Then you have Carlingford rd which scoots along too. All straighter and higher speed limits then any of the roads around Hornsby. All 50 or 60 other than the freeway.

I dont live in either area but when travelling through there I usually avoid the M2 toll going through the centre of Epping via either Epping rd or Blaxland rd and have always found so much less traffic then just general driving in Hornsby. That area is very crowded. I have rarely had an issue with traffic in Epping, ever! Well other then on a wet Friday night after a few accidents... Its low density stuff. Hornsby, well in fact from Pymble up is a pain nearly all the time. Traffic is REALLY bad here since they have developed the area. I have seen long lines of cars trying to get into the back route on the Eastern side of the rail line every time i have been there.

Alright. So now we have a debate going on there, and here.

Just when I thought this was a reliable, pro-development site :lol:

^ The straightness of Carlingford Rd and all the other approaches to Epping is irrelevant when it all comes down to the operation of three intersections. I drive through Epping all the time so am quite familiar with traffic patterns and know when to avoid it.

When driving through Hornsby I either use the F3 (if headed to Mt Colah or further north) or Pacific Hwy and rarely get problems. Pacific Hwy through Gordon/Pymble/Turramurra/Wahroonga is bad in peak but what else do you expect from a major radial route? You can rat run if you know your way and getting onto Sherbrooke Rd is not as bad as you think.

If you want to try Epping's traffic, approach it via Epping Rd in the PM or Carlingford Rd in either peak or even during lunch time.

Alright. So now we have a debate going on there, and here.

Just when I thought this was a reliable pro-development site :lol:

I'm not finished with the nimbys yet. I will attend council meetings to show approval of the development. I'm so sick of nimbys thinking that they have the mandate of the whole community and have general community's interest at heart.

^ The straightness of Carlingford Rd and all the other approaches to Epping is irrelevant when it all comes down to the operation of three intersections. I drive through Epping all the time so am quite familiar with traffic patterns and know when to avoid it.

When driving through Hornsby I either use the F3 (if headed to Mt Colah or further north) or Pacific Hwy and rarely get problems. Pacific Hwy through Gordon/Pymble/Turramurra/Wahroonga is bad in peak but what else do you expect from a major radial route? You can rat run if you know your way and getting onto Sherbrooke Rd is not as bad as you think.

If you want to try Epping's traffic, approach it via Epping Rd in the PM or Carlingford Rd in either peak or even during lunch time.


I get the feeling you live close to here CKF?

3 intersections? Yawn. How many intersections are on the Pac hwy! The speed and type of roads has a huge affect, how can you state otherwise? Not to mention the number of traffic lights and side streets on the Pac Hwy. Its just by design, most of the roads around the NW are superior to the Pac hwy due to its age. Its an old area aswell that has had liitle in the way of upgrades. They have done well with the traffic light synchronisation in Peak on the Pac Hwy (if you are on a through run!) but OP is ordinary. If you dont speed you hit every set of lights.

Pacific Hwy Pymble to Hornsby is bad peak, but its just as bad on the weekend. Really bad! Epping is not, it flows nicely. You will slow down through the Intersection and rail bridge at the main part of Epping but compared to the trip as a whole its nothing. You can also use the M2 to go around the centre if you need to. Its not the same for Hornsby.

Mind you the fix for Epping is alot easier then trying to fix the Pac hwy! That is why they need the F3 to M2 link to bypass the Pac Hwy, you will never get it any better then it is. NW was built with roads in mind`:)

Alright. So now we have a debate going on there, and here.

Just when I thought this was a reliable, pro-development site :lol:

Isnt a forum about debates? Mind you I know that CKF knows his stuff so you have to be on your game to run with him! :lol:

I am for development, esp development of Epping...

Currently there are too many trolleys dumped by nearby residents shopping at Westfield. Imagine what will happen after the 20 storey towers are built, it will be thousand times worse endangering the lives of pedestrians and vehicles not to mention an eyesore.

/facepalm.

3 intersections? Yawn. How many intersections are on the Pac hwy! The speed and type of roads has a huge affect, how can you state otherwise? Not to mention the number of traffic lights and side streets on the Pac Hwy. Its just by design, most of the roads around the NW are superior to the Pac hwy due to its age. Its an old area aswell that has had liitle in the way of upgrades. They have done well with the traffic light synchronisation in Peak on the Pac Hwy (if you are on a through run!) but OP is ordinary. If you dont speed you hit every set of lights.

Pacific Hwy Pymble to Hornsby is bad peak, but its just as bad on the weekend. Really bad! Epping is not, it flows nicely. You will slow down through the Intersection and rail bridge at the main part of Epping but compared to the trip as a whole its nothing. You can also use the M2 to go around the centre if you need to. Its not the same for Hornsby.


There is a tunnel underneath the rail-line just North of Epping station. I wonder why they reserved it only for bus lanes.

I got a feeling that there is a proposal to fix the clog issue on the bridge over railline.

Speaking of Epping... NSW seizing power from 3 Councils (Parramatta, Hornsby and Ryde) to develop around Epping station. Common sense has prevailed. The whole block from Genesis apartment to Bridge street (excluding Epping Hotel) needs demolishing.

Hornsby Housing Strategy excludes Epping

EPPING was not included in Hornsby Shire Council’s current housing strategy proposal.

However, the Department of Planning is about to appoint consultants to develop a plan for future re-development of the Epping CBD. These consultants will also develop a housing strategy for all those lands within reasonable walking distance of the station.

This will mean high-rise developments grading down to townhouses.
I, like many, don’t like high-rise developments, but if they must exist, railway stations are the obvious location.

I also believe that residential rezonings should be shared by all communities that meet the criteria.

On the above outline I think Epping residents should be asking the Hornsby Shire Council why Pennant Hills, Beecroft and Cheltenham have no rezoning proposals under the housing strategy mow on display for comment.
Brian Berry Epping

Editor’s Note: Epping Civic Trust is holding a public meeting on the housing strategy at the Epping Church of Christ Hall, 31 Bridge St. Epping at 7.30pm on Tuesday, April 21.

http://northern-district-times.whereilive.com.au/your-news/story/hornsby-housing-strategy-excludes-epping/

There is a tunnel underneath the rail-line just North of Epping station. I wonder why they reserved it only for bus lanes.

I got a feeling that there is a proposal to fix the clog issue on the bridge over railline.

Speaking of Epping... NSW seizing power from 3 Councils (Parramatta, Hornsby and Ryde) to develop around Epping station. Common sense has prevailed.

Hornsby Housing Strategy excludes Epping

EPPING was not included in Hornsby Shire Council’s current housing strategy proposal.

However, the Department of Planning is about to appoint consultants to develop a plan for future re-development of the Epping CBD. These consultants will also develop a housing strategy for all those lands within reasonable walking distance of the station.

This will mean high-rise developments grading down to townhouses.
I, like many, don’t like high-rise developments, but if they must exist, railway stations are the obvious location.

I also believe that residential rezonings should be shared by all communities that meet the criteria.

On the above outline I think Epping residents should be asking the Hornsby Shire Council why Pennant Hills, Beecroft and Cheltenham have no rezoning proposals under the housing strategy mow on display for comment.
Brian Berry Epping

Editor’s Note: Epping Civic Trust is holding a public meeting on the housing strategy at the Epping Church of Christ Hall, 31 Bridge St. Epping at 7.30pm on Tuesday, April 21.

http://northern-district-times.whereilive.com.au/your-news/story/hornsby-housing-strategy-excludes-epping/

Great news! They need to do something here. Bet you it wont involve any infrastrucure upgrades though... although I guess you could read that as a positive sign for the NWRL.

Pennant Hills is up in the air because of the NSFL upgrade I think. Its time will come. Cheltnham and Beecroft is NIMBY central. They know they will get a fight there...

Great news! They need to do something here. Bet you it wont involve any infrastrucure upgrades though... although I guess you could read that as a positive sign for the NWRL.

Pennant Hills is up in the air because of the NSFL upgrade I think. Its time will come. Cheltnham and Beecroft is NIMBY central. They know they will get a fight there...

If you consider a small bus lane in Bridge St. as 'infrastructure upgrade'.

http://www.rta.nsw.gov.au/constructionmaintenance/downloads/buspriorityprogram/bridgestreet_buspriority_plan.pdf

Bridge St upgrade has been talked for yonks...

Gridlock driving commuters around the bend

EPPING’S appalling traffic gridlock has been slammed as the worst in NSW by Epping State Liberal MP Greg Smith.

Mr Smith said Epping had one of the worst traffic bottlenecks he had seen.

Mr Smith blamed the traffic on changes to Epping Rd in March 2008, which cut the number of lanes in both directions to funnel more cars through the Lane Cove Tunnel.

“Changes to Epping Rd made all the difference and made travelling on it so much slower,” Mr Smith said. “A lot of the problems with Epping Rd are caused by the M2 being too expensive.

“Another problem is that a lot of people drive here, from the Hills, North Rocks, Parramatta, to come to Epping to catch the Epping to Chatswood Rail Link.

“But where are they going to park?

“The streets are already clogged with cars and it’s getting worse.”

Mr Smith said the intersection between Rawson St, Carlingford Rd and Ray Rd was particularly bad in the morning peak and had a knock-on effect that rippled through the entire northwest.

“I live in Rosen St, Epping, and people park there and then go to work,” he said.

“And more people are using Ray Rd so that often the queue stretches to Fernhill St and moves slowly.

“Rawson St is one of the worst traffic snarls around.

“There is no right-hand turn signal from Rawson St to Carlingford Rd so that traffic can sometimes go as far back as Bridge St.

“But the RTA say they won’t have a bar of a right-hand turn because it would slow down traffic.”

To ease the traffic, Mr Smith recommended widening Epping Bridge as one solution.

“We need an expert inquiry into this,” Mr Smith said. “Something drastic has to happen.”

Mr Smith was asked what he would do to fix the problem if the Coalition wrested power from Labor at the next State Election, on March 26, 2011.

“I will do my best and I’ll make a lot of noise, but I don’t know where the money’s coming from, that’s the problem,” he said.

An RTA spokesman said: “The RTA is carrying out significant projects around the Epping area that are already showing improvements to the network.

“On the M2-Epping Rd-Gore Hill corridor in the morning peak, there has been an improvement in travel speeds from 31 to 36km/h.

“In the afternoon peak, the M2 corridor continued to improve further, with travel speeds increasing from 61 to 66km/h.”

The RTA would carry out further work in the area, including an upgrade to the M2 motorway, the spokesman said.

http://northern-district-times.whereilive.com.au/news/story/gridlock-driving-commuters-around-the-bend/

If you consider a small bus lane in Bridge St. as 'infrastructure upgrade'.

http://www.rta.nsw.gov.au/constructionmaintenance/downloads/buspriorityprogram/bridgestreet_buspriority_plan.pdf

Bridge St upgrade has been talked for yonks...

Gridlock driving commuters around the bend

snip


The RTA would carry out further work in the area, including an upgrade to the M2 motorway, the spokesman said.

http://northern-district-times.whereilive.com.au/news/story/gridlock-driving-commuters-around-the-bend/


I thought the problem was that "certain" residents of Epping were fighting against this expansion?

Seriously I dont have problems driving through Epping outside peak. I find it great compared to other areas. Epping road is fast until you hit Epping rail bridge/ intersection but I normaly get through on the first light. Maybe I am not driving there enough. As I said Peak sucks but there is no real rail option for the hills so they clog up the roads. The upgrade should do the trick for buses.

I live in Carlo so i either cycle to Epping station or catch bus there. I know what it's like along Carlingford road in peak hour but it's not that bad on off-peak.

http://bangthetable.com/topic/draft-20-storey-built-form-concepts

So what are we waiting for? Can't we just all join, get the numbers even on both sides and start spamming them like we did to "no lewisham towers"? What's the difference between "no lewisha....." whatever and this? If anything, this proposal is even better! Hornsby council submitted the draft to that site themself, so they'll be taking notice of what happens there with no doubt. Honestly, I don't give a sh*t about the self centred, selfish nimbys, but it's about time we show the council that there's some "yimbys" (:lol:) out there as well. Theyr'e also telling other innocent people to do things like "protest!" or "don't give up! Send your feedback to the council!" and making new nimbys. We should have more pro-development people there educating those who aren't nimbys yet about why developments like these are needed and what they actually can bring.

I've already started :)

LOL! The irony? If ever I saw an underdeveloped area compared to the amount of Infrastructure it has and is getting its Epping. There I could see 20 storey towers. Yet look at what is being proposed for that area...

+1. Just want to see some change for once. I'd like to see some one or two at Carlingford or perhaps Eastwood too. Perfect setting for such high rises, but I know carlingford doesn't have the appropriate infrastructure yet.

The Hills Shire is actually moving towards higher density because they have finally figured that low density destroys quality of life especially mobility and dependence on private vehicles.

I'm getting so tired of grey haired brigade taunting about the "Bushland Shire" and how it is all concrete. Well i'm sorry but your existance in the "Bushland Shire" means that it isn't a "bushland" anymore!

Once upon a time there was a farm. Developers destroyed it; houses got built; you lived there and farms are now gone. The end. Moral of the story? Don't fucking be a hypocrite because you perpetuated change the day you bought a home! Unless you're a freaking bushman then don't bother complaining!

The Hills Shire is actually moving towards higher density because they have finally figured that low density destroys quality of life especially mobility and dependence on private vehicles.

I'm getting so tired of grey haired brigade taunting about the "Bushland Shire" and how it is all concrete. Well i'm sorry but your existance in the "Bushland Shire" means that it isn't a "bushland" anymore!

Once upon a time there was a farm. Developers destroyed it; houses got built; you lived there and farms are now gone. The end.

+1, perhaps they should move further upwards to where all the real bush is. They want bushland? They have bushland :lol:

+1, perhaps they should move further upwards to where all the real bush is. They want bushland? They have bushland :lol:

Exactly. They should build a tree house or move around hunting for possums.

Heh, I have to laugh at the venom you guys have for Hornsby/ Waitara NIMBYs, the place is not exactly low density now. How about we have a few more words for the whole "grey" ring about 5 to 10 km around the CBD. That could use some 20 Storey towers! I have alot less concern if a place out in the "bush" like Hornsby gets towers versus places that really should have them close to the CBD and Harbour. Where were you guys when Mosman Council for example puts forward a 40 Year plan of 700 dwellings max for their area...

:banana:

But there is no rail in Mosman and the traffic there is fierce all day long.

Heh, I have to laugh at the venom you guys have for Hornsby/ Waitara NIMBYs, the place is not exactly low density now. How about we have a few more words for the whole "grey" ring about 5 to 10 km around the CBD. That could use some 20 Storey towers! I have alot less concern if a place out in the "bush" like Hornsby gets towers versus places that really should have them close to the CBD and Harbour. Where were you guys when Mosman Council for example puts forward a 40 Year plan of 700 dwellings max for their area...

:banana:

Epping/Hornsby is my region! I can't go to every council meetings throughout this continent! Be pro-active and go to council meetings to voice some sense into this issue.

I am so sick and tired of selfish militant nimbys who think their voice is god's will! Avatar is the SSC's spokesperson at Mosman and i expect him to campaign hard.

Villagers do not belong in Sydney which is trying to embrace 21st century!

See that is the problem, they are not looking to build Hornsby like this because it is good planning, because there is a particular desire for people to live there or it has any outstanding attributes. Its because it has a rail line. That is what planning in Sydney is now. Leeching off 100 year old infrastructure because our state Government has been too incompetent to build any over the last 15 years when its clear where we are heading and when there are plenty of existing plans.

Using the Mosman area (Lower North Shore) as the example surely the wise move knowing that its actually walkable i.e. VERY close to the CBD and North Sydney and people actually want to live there would be to build a rail line. However we know that the NIMBY locals dont want that so we stick the density out on the fringes. Ridiculous.

I also think that its a case of many Sydney siders just saying they know we need density but stick it out there so its Not In My Backyard.

Look at the pictures in this thread, Hornsby as a village disappeared long ago!

Man, I am becoming a whinger! :bash: :lol:

I do find what the current Government are doing very frustrating though. Not to mention the growing NIMBY contingent. It doesnt have to be this way. Oh well.

:cheers:

Think I gave those NIMBYs a good and hard beating over there :lol: Well worth the patience, especially when it's being noticed by the council. If there's anyone who hasn't joined yet, why not join up and have your say? Even the numbers on both sides and let the council know.

http://bangthetable.com/topic/draft-20-storey-built-form-concepts

There are lots of good points made for the development, whilst the posts against it seem to be weak using the typical nimby arguments.

+1 for res12, Aussie17 and bellinid

-1 for radas and xfactor (typical nimby as you can see)

Who might you be?

Isn't res12 a nimby? He/she's stating typical nimby excuses too (and also apparently claims to "understand" that Sydney needs to go higher density), but at least he/she tries to make sense though, not like a typcal "mindless" nimby. Res12 took me the most time and patience to reply.

My identity was revealed here a page back i think :)

A post by "clem" over at Bang The Table:

"The only way to stop high rise development or in fact over development of any type is to stop immigration. The Government is allowing 300,000 migrants to enter Australia every year. Once here, they have to live somewhere, and the vast majority of them choose to live in capital cities close to transport. There is nor more space left. The only way is up. The only possible way to stop this is to stop immigration. This is not racist. It is fact.

:lol:

If "clem" isn't from here, then clearly, we're starting to make the nimbys realise the need. He/She's now trying to take the blame somewhere else, so perhaps it shows that he/she's starting to understand. :cheers:

I'm very pleased on the Hornsby bang the table threads - they are playing off NIMBYists against each other. Build it in Hornsby! No, build it in Waitara! No build it in Normanhurst!

HA HA HA HA HA!!!!!!!!! Just the way it should be!

Have your say and support the 20 storey development!

http://www.hornsby.nsw.gov.au/planningdevelopment/index.cfm?NavigationID=2403

housing@hornsby.nsw.gov.au

Isn't res12 a nimby? He/she's stating typical nimby excuses too (and also apparently claims to "understand" that Sydney needs to go higher density), but at least he/she tries to make sense though, not like a typcal "mindless" nimby. Res12 took me the most time and patience to reply.
True, but the part about them "understanding" what has to happen is what made me give them a +1. Although after reading some more of their posts I'm starting to lean more towards them being just a nimby.

My identity was revealed here a page back i think :)
Couldn't find it from my 15 second look.

I think I might go and join in the discussions there as well... :nuts:

lawl:
I don't know much about Barangaroo except that it seems incredibly dumb to build lots of office buildings near the waterline if there is supposedly going to be sea level rise in the future (even if it is a long way off).

Have your say and support the 20 storey development!

http://www.hornsby.nsw.gov.au/planningdevelopment/index.cfm?NavigationID=2403

housing@hornsby.nsw.gov.au

You have to remember that rezoning would allow for buildings up to 20 storeys. Some developers may not want to go all the way.

I do feel that Hornsby is going on the right track with highrise zoning - Wall to wall towers with little gaps can be claustrophobic. You also cannot admire the buildings as well from the street.

It's also good that they are promoting community spaces as well for residents and visitors to stimulate neighbourhood activity. I just hope it becomes a reality.

I don't have a problem with the Hornsby proposal. 20 levels is baby stuff by HK standards, and the buildings are within station ped-sheds as it should be.

The locals are whinging about the rail system being overloaded. Fact is, it is far from it. Some trains are overloaded but this is because of poor management - the very same management the NSW people voted in only 2 years ago and seem inclined to vote in again. Maybe Gladys has different ideas I doubt Fatty does.

And why is Waitara constantly degraded as a 'slum?' - sure, it isn't Killara, but it ain't Mt Druitt/MacFields either.

I am a regular user of the North Shore line and I am surprised at the increase in patronage on this line in the last year or so. I initially thought all the extras for the North Shore line was because of reduction in trains with the upper Northern line running via the ECRL but there is more to it then that I think. I have noticed this line can have plenty of passengers waiting whether it be at 2:30 pm or 7:30 pm. Its interesting, outside of the core peak time (especially at Wynyard) all the other platforms seem very sparse compared to the North Shore line. It didnt used to be like that.

My guess is the increase in units along the upper North Shore train line have done their job with people using the service to get to the CBD/ North Sydney and generally getting around instead of only using their cars. In the middle of the day and on the weekend though its a bit different and the North Shore line seems to only attract teenagers and the odd old person but I guess 4TPH OP doesnt help.


Oh and do you have to ask why Waitara is considered a slum by most? The majority of Aussies dont like density, especially in the suburbs. If your an hour out of Sydney most expect/ want houses still. Waitara is pretty dense by Sydney suburban standards. People have started to say the same about Killara!

Oh and do you have to ask why Waitara is considered a slum by most? The majority of Aussies dont like density, especially in the suburbs. If your an hour out of Sydney most expect/ want houses still. Waitara is pretty dense by Sydney suburban standards. People have started to say the same about Killara!

It's a passing fad. At the end of the day, Sydney is growing and will have more people. My grandmother grew up in a rarified Bexley with orchards and stuff. My grandfather refused a block of land his mother offered him as a gift in Dumbleton (now called Beverley Hills) because "who would want to live out there?" And they both turned down a offer to buy a house in Narrabeen - impossibly remote.

Waitara is just North Shore snobbery at its best. Snobbery is the best known export of the North Shore. I should know, my first years of life were in Lindfield and the area from Chatswood to Lindfield runs deep in my family.

We've gone over at length how they can get more trains on the line, and more people on the trains - but there is no political will to do anything any more so not sure it even matters.

Fatty O'Barrell keeps saying he supports the NIMBY/Banana POV but blind Freddy can see the developers will pour money into his coffers as much as they have the ALP if it keeps the wheels turning. And he has no magic answer to the population growth.

I look forward to Waitara becoming just another place with tallish buildings and accommodation people can vaguely afford in a basin filled with millions more people.

People have started to say the same about Killara!

I'd describe Killara as a slum too - there's nothing there!

Also the Greengate's food is shit.

How can it be a slum if there is nothing there?? Doesn't make sense.

^ No shops, no cafes, no facilities, only one shit pub.

My comment was very much tongue-in-cheek ;) Except for the comment about the food being shit at the Greengate. It is. Pymble Hotel is just as bad. It's almost worth driving to The Ranch at North Ryde for a pub feed. WTF is with there being so few pubs on the north shore? Victoria Rd ftw (3-4 in rozelle, 1 in Drummoyne, 2 in Gladesville, 1 in Ryde, 1 in West Ryde, 1 in ermo, 1 in rydalmere and a couple in parra)

It's a passing fad. At the end of the day, Sydney is growing and will have more people. My grandmother grew up in a rarified Bexley with orchards and stuff. My grandfather refused a block of land his mother offered him as a gift in Dumbleton (now called Beverley Hills) because "who would want to live out there?" And they both turned down a offer to buy a house in Narrabeen - impossibly remote.

Waitara is just North Shore snobbery at its best. Snobbery is the best known export of the North Shore. I should know, my first years of life were in Lindfield and the area from Chatswood to Lindfield runs deep in my family.

We've gone over at length how they can get more trains on the line, and more people on the trains - but there is no political will to do anything any more so not sure it even matters.

Fatty O'Barrell keeps saying he supports the NIMBY/Banana POV but blind Freddy can see the developers will pour money into his coffers as much as they have the ALP if it keeps the wheels turning. And he has no magic answer to the population growth.

I look forward to Waitara becoming just another place with tallish buildings and accommodation people can vaguely afford in a basin filled with millions more people.

I do agree with you to an extent, I think its generational too. However people dont like the fact that further in you have a lot of low density and then you get out to suburbs on the edge of Sydney and you have high density stuff. For a city built around the Harbour that is odd. Many people associate apartment blocks standing on their own amongst low density suburban houses with housing commission. Thus slums. It will most likely change in time.

Waitara sticks out to people on the North Shore as its has streets of large buildings close together with no trees which is a shock for a region built on the idea of large blocks of low density housing with lots of trees and nice Gardens. To the residents that is what Ku-Ring-Gai and Hornsby is about. It has no harbour or beaches. My old boss had a large stately home in Pymble and the second they started building units on the Pac Highway he sold up. He said he didnt pay lots of money to live out in an area like that to suddenly be surrounded by tall units. He said he expected that in places like the lower North Shore or Northern/ Eastern Beaches but not out where he lived.

The solution to the North Shore rail is more trains, not going to happen though. You just cant run so many suburban services off the one line from Chatswood to the CBD. Especially with the clientele you are trying to attract from the North Shore and North West. Most of these people would rather sit in their comfy car for hours then stand from Hornsby or Castle Hill all the way to the city. It doesnt help that petrol is so cheap and you can actually drive to city quicker then the train takes on the North Shore line. I know you dont agree but the North Region does need another line across the Harbour to the CBD. The adding of more housing and another line to the NW is only making it worse.

I look at the planning we have got at the moment and they are only looking to fill out certain areas, most of Sydney is still very much low density. The North Shore as discussed in this thread for example is a test run. See what works and what doesnt in our fair city. There is no risk to Labor as its the most blue ribbon Liberal area in OZ. Its got a "major centre" every few suburbs now. This isnt the case for a lot of Sydney. The current plans dont show this changing in the next 20 years.

My old boss had a large stately home in Pymble and the second they started building units on the Pac Highway he sold up. He said he didnt pay lots of money to live out in an area like that to suddenly be surrounded by tall units. He said he expected that in places like the lower North Shore or Northern/ Eastern Beaches but not out where he lived.

He expected to live in a city and not be surrounded by people? :nuts:

^ No shops, no cafes, no facilities, only one shit pub.

My comment was very much tongue-in-cheek ;) Except for the comment about the food being shit at the Greengate. It is. Pymble Hotel is just as bad. It's almost worth driving to The Ranch at North Ryde for a pub feed. WTF is with there being so few pubs on the north shore? Victoria Rd ftw (3-4 in rozelle, 1 in Drummoyne, 2 in Gladesville, 1 in Ryde, 1 in West Ryde, 1 in ermo, 1 in rydalmere and a couple in parra)

It comes down to how the areas where formed. The Upper North Shore came from Farming and large estates for the very wealthy. There were some smaller houses built close to the stations for the workers but not a lot. No case for lots of pubs.

The inner areas and along the Harbour were where the working class lived in the more high density type villages. Thus lots of business for pubs.

I guess all this densification along the North Shore line might change this but I have noticed very little difference although in the case of Killara it is between Gordon and Lindfield and has a pub so I cant see it changing. I have been to the Greengate and it seemed like a nice pub to me but I didnt eat there.

He expected to live in a city and not be surrounded by people? :nuts:

I keep telling you, the upper North Shore is (or was) considered the country to most people. The lower North Shore was the city. You work in the CBD/ LNS and live in the area when you are at uni or a young up and coming and then move to a large house on a big block on the upper North Shore when you are more established and having a family. Then back to a unit/ Town House on the LNS when you are finished raising kids. That is how it works :)

My old boss had a large stately home in Pymble and the second they started building units on the Pac Highway he sold up. He said he didnt pay lots of money to live out in an area like that to suddenly be surrounded by tall units.

It's good that he decided to move somewhere else. If you want to live close to the transport node, expect high density units. If you don't like tall units, stay away from the transport nodes. It's very simple.

It's good that he decided to move somewhere else. If you want to live close to the transport node, expect high density units. If you don't like tall units, stay away from the transport nodes. It's very simple.

Well in fairness he was probably 15 minutes walk from the station, between Pymble and Turramurra. His old house is still the same to my knowledge but may have some shadowing. Remember they are building large units up and down the Pacific Highway, not just around the station. In fact they havent really done huge development directly surrounding the stations on the upper North Shore line. That part still looks the same. They really do need to rebuild some of the old shops in places like Lindfield, Turramurra and Pymble. Turramurra is awful!

Well in fairness he was probably 15 minutes walk from the station, between Pymble and Turramurra. His old house is still the same to my knowledge but may have some shadowing. Remember they are building large units up and down the Pacific Highway, not just around the station. In fact they havent really done huge development directly surrounding the stations on the upper North Shore line. That part still looks the same. They really do need to rebuild some of the old shops in places like Lindfield, Turramurra and Pymble. Turramurra is awful!

kmc has some information of town centre renewals; as for transport nodes and density, is St Ives a transport node?

kmc has some information of town centre renewals; as for transport nodes and density, is St Ives a transport node?

Will check it out, thanks.

I think they justify St Ives by bus services into Gordon station and to Macquarie Park. However its really supported by all the parking at Gordon ;)

St Ives did always strike me as odd place for so much development but I have friends who live in an aprtment there and they like it. They dont ever rely on the buses though. They drive everywhere inluding to work in North Sydney and Chatswood.

Perhaps it's a good idea to rename this thread to "Upper Northern Sydney"

^ There's a Ku-ring-gai thread already...

St Ives did always strike me as odd place for so much development but I have friends who live in an aprtment there and they like it. They dont ever rely on the buses though. They drive everywhere inluding to work in North Sydney and Chatswood.

Snives needs a critical mass of population otherwise it will not grow and/or die - that's the rationale.

Ku-ring-gai is the original NIMBY council - read up on their history if you want the details but it does explain why it has turned out the way it has. The more things change, the more they stay the same.

Snives needs a critical mass of population otherwise it will not grow and/or die - that's the rationale.

Ku-ring-gai is the original NIMBY council - read up on their history if you want the details but it does explain why it has turned out the way it has. The more things change, the more they stay the same.

and Hornsby is empirical proof that there's no life after death.

Turn it back into bush and consolidate back into Killara :lol:

Snives needs a critical mass of population otherwise it will not grow and/or die - that's the rationale.

Ku-ring-gai is the original NIMBY council - read up on their history if you want the details but it does explain why it has turned out the way it has. The more things change, the more they stay the same.

I dont follow that at all, why would St Ives die versus say 80% of the rest of Sydney that is just as dense or less? There are less dense areas with much better transport.

I dont follow that at all, why would St Ives die versus say 80% of the rest of Sydney that is just as dense or less? There are less dense areas with much better transport.

I'm talking about the town centre.

I'm talking about the town centre.

Sorry, I follow you.

He expected to live in a city and not be surrounded by people? :nuts:

And he probably made a lot of money in the sale - as Henry George or David Ricardo would have predicted - capitalising unearned wealth from others.

And he was able to move to a similar house that doesn't have the problem he complains of - while keeping his profit. Not a bad little earner!

He is definitely the one about whom I said recently on Transport Textbook - The middle class pleading for welfare and the false victim.

On boy. OK then, go back to the many more times 4-6 blocks then! Idyots!!

Hornsby raises stakes in north shore apartment battle
MATTHEW MOORE URBAN AFFAIRS EDITOR
June 19, 2010
http://smh.domain.com.au/real-estate-news/hornsby-raises-stakes-in-north-shore-apartment-battle-20100618-ymuy.html

KU-RING-GAI residents are fuming over plans for hundreds of apartments in six-storey blocks but further north in Hornsby the council is considering towers three times the size.

Thirty kilometres from the CBD and on the edge of the Berowra bushland, Hornsby is classified as an outer-ring suburb, but Sydney's population growth has convinced the council it has little option but to contemplate developments with densities still rare in most inner-ring suburbs.

It has included in its draft housing strategy a proposal for 20-storey towers on five blocks close to the Westfield shopping centre, and within weeks will decide whether to make that draft policy permanent.

Many residents are furious and have formed the Stop 20 Group which will hold a public meeting today to protest at a policy they believe would see construction of 20 separate 20-storey buildings dramatically alter the character of the suburb.

The mayor, Nick Berman, said he understood the opposition but the council needed a policy on where to put the 10,000 new dwellings it has to take under the government's policy to deal with population growth.

The council had considered adopting a policy like that imposed by the state government on Ku-ring-gai, with four- and six-storey apartment blocks in and around train stations, but there had been heavy resistance from residents who feared apartments in quiet suburban streets. "The first draft had five-storey units in Asquith, Berowra, and Normanhurst and the clear message council received was residents wanted to see unit developments in the existing town centres, but not in low-density areas," Cr Berman said.

While 20-storey towers had angered some locals, most had agreed that if the extra homes had to be built, the best way to do it was to build a smaller number of higher-density buildings, he said.

He dismissed as a "gross exaggeration" plans for 20 towers and it was "more like six buildings" containing 599 units, housing 1200 to 1500 people.

But a spokesman for the Stop 20 Group, Kim Mullins, said her group "had information" that 20 towers would be allowed if the draft policy was adopted.

"We find 20 storeys tremendously disproportionate with even the projected needs and the resulting congestion will have huge impact on the town centre . . . with risks of escalating crime as there's so little for teenagers to do,' she said.

Cr Berman said one reason for allowing developers to build so high was because it increased the value of the project and gave them a better chance to buy out existing property owners to ensure projects went ahead.

Humph!!!

My head feels like exploding everytime how these NIMBY vandals cause widespread destruction on city planning and our quality of lives as a whole!!! I feel like getting a bulldozer and demolishing every houses NIMBY live in to erect 20 storey + apartments!!

Just imagine Kuring gai as a new Hong Kong after multiple demolition works. Build a train line and it's complete.

the nimby problem's just getting worse and worse. Won't take long until ours will be just like the ones in Europe. And with such a government...

Sydney's just a nimby-controlled political disaster.

Revealing to see the illustration put forward by the nimbys and that presented by the council/ government. Revealing of the low tactics the nimbys employ to stir up fear and loathing in the suburbs.
Taking their cue from fear-ridden hysterics of BAG, they've wildly exaggerated the situation with a solid wall of the same tower repeated & overlapping 6 times and looming threateningly over the railway station.
Not honest, folks.

These apartments won't have many teenagers living in them so it's not a valid argument. Hornsby Council have a good argument for building the towers, plus there are close to Westfield. It's not like they will appear in a quiet residential street in Berowra.

I am curious to see how these apartments sell. I am not sure this will be sucessful in Hornsby but time will tell.

they would sell. hornsby is a great area.lots of dinks live there.i train through it everyday.really good central area in the north.

^^Yeah why would they not sell? Near a freeway to Newcastle, choice of 2 rail routes, hospital with leaky roof, big shops, bush everywhere, what's not to like?

well yeah? near a freeway to newcastle or choice of sydney.
2 rail lines. how good is that!
hospital,s schools, big westfields, lots of open bush fresh air, waterways ect.
lovely place to grow up!
or invest in? hint hint

It has 1 railway line really, both the North Shore and upper Northern lines join at Chatswood unless you squeeze onto an interurban to get off at Central.

I just cant see your typical buyer of these types of apartments wanting to live in Hornsby, might end up like the upper end of Ku-Ring-Gai, many units sill not sold years after being built.

Many of these things you guys have listed as positives for Hornsy are hardly what your typical high rise buyer would look for and your typical Hornsby buyer doesnt tend to look for high rise. Just the way I see it. As I said, time will tell.

blinkers much

blinkers much


:lol: Familiar with irony?

C'mon, OZ R, there's no irony, wry wit, satire or even snide sarcasm in your post. In your latest I do see rationalisation in hindsight. If it's your opinion that the towers aren't such a good idea, stick to it unless someone comes up with a convincing counter argument/evidence for you.

C'mon, OZ R, there's no irony, wry wit, satire or even snide sarcasm in your post. In your latest I do see rationalisation in hindsight. If it's your opinion that the towers aren't such a good idea, stick to it unless someone comes up with a convincing counter argument/evidence for you.

Read into it what you want but thats not what I meant. Its merely my opinion that this type of development may not be a raging hot success in an outer area like Hornsby. Didnt say it shouldnt be built, that is for the developers to decide. Some of it will come down to sale price and strata costs but you do have to consider your market. It may well be very successful but when I look at the basics I do wonder. Still youre not likely to see many 20 Storey towers built in other Sydney suburbs so it might be quite the novelty :lol:

That's fine, that's your opinion, but it is NOT ironic. It was the claim of irony that I took you to task on, not your opinion. To claim irony is to backtrack on your argument.

That's fine, that's your opinion, but it is NOT ironic. It was the claim of irony that I took you to task on, not your opinion. To claim irony is to backtrack on your argument.

Take me to task? Who are you again? Dont try and be clever, youre not. The Irony claim was to the blinkers comment. Lets see if you can work out why. Drop kick.

You handle even the mildest hint of criticism with admirable maturity.

You handle even the mildest hint of criticism with admirable maturity.

Thanks. While I am sure LanceDriver appreciates your protection and the forum is impressed by your ability to keep up posting standards with your worthwhile "criticism" :| I dont think you even understood the comment you were "criticising". What a waste of bandwidth :ohno:

wat

lulz.

2 rail lines. how good is that!

Actually it has three railway lines: North Shore, Northern and Central Coast.

Those apartments will certainly sell. Plenty of shops including a large shopping center; a large railway station with direct services to the City, Gosford, Newcastle, Epping, Strathfield, Chatswood, North Sydney, Burwood and Parramatta. Only a short drive to say Galston to get away from the city and a few minutes drive to primary and secondary schools - what's not to like?

It's also convenient for people working in a major employment hub: Macquarie Park/North Ryde area.

Hornsby is about the same distance from Central as Parramatta so it really is sitting in a desirable location for a massive increase in density, and it will no doubt be very popular too. It's the city's northern gateway with good connections North, South to Epping (and onto NRyde etc), Rhodes, Strathfield (and Parramatta), and South East to Chatswood, NS and the CBD. Good luck to anyone trying to pull reasons out their arse why this isn't so...

Actually it has three railway lines: North Shore, Northern and Central Coast.

Those apartments will certainly sell. Plenty of shops including a large shopping center; a large railway station with direct services to the City, Gosford, Newcastle, Epping, Strathfield, Chatswood, North Sydney, Burwood and Parramatta. Only a short drive to say Galston to get away from the city and a few minutes drive to primary and secondary schools - what's not to like?

Again I dont why people see the Northern line as a separate after the integration of the ECRL. The trains just meet at Chatswood and take the same pair of tracks to the CBD. Why would someone from Hornsby who is not going to get off at Epping or Macquarie Park catch one of these 4 trains per hour? Its a much slower journey to Chatswood North Sydney and the CBD the the North Shore line that start at the same location. I am also not sure of the relevance of the Central Coast line for the average punter but yep it runs through Hornsby. You could squeeze on one of the interubans from the Coast to get off at Central but that is not exactly common or convenient.

Hornsby is about the same distance from Central as Parramatta so it really is sitting in a desirable location for a massive increase in density, and it will no doubt be very popular too. It's the city's northern gateway with good connections North, South to Epping (and onto NRyde etc), Rhodes, Strathfield (and Parramatta), and South East to Chatswood, NS and the CBD. Good luck to anyone trying to pull reasons out their arse why this isn't so...

Hmmm I wonder who that is directed at :lol: Ah forums, an off the cuff comment can sprout all sorts of responses :) Here is the basis for my comments.

Hornsby is the Cities Northern gateway, i.e. the edge of Northern Sydney. It is not close to the CBD which does have an effect for some. Yes its pretty much the same distance as Parramatta and that is considered outer west and not what I would call desirable but at least its meant to be Sydney's second CBD. Do you think Hornsby will get the infrastructure and investment Parramatta does? You have to keep this in mind when mentioning the benefits of Hornsby because to some people it makes a huge difference to the type of housing they want to purchase in an area and for what price.

By train from Hornsby the CBD is like 50 minutes, Burwood/ Strathfield would have to be over an hour and a quarter and Parramatta nudging an hour and a half. All on packed trains via the CBD. Driving is often much worse than this during peak. I dont find that nice and convenient as mentioned here.

Chatswood/ Epping/ Macquarie Park is obviously better in well under 40 minutes on the train although can be bad to drive it too despite being relatively close. However for your average Hornsby punter I reckon those centres are more important than for your average Ku-Ring-Gai unit buyer who normally wants North Sydney and the CBD.

This is partly why I think Hornsby units thrive, the demographics match up, especially for renters. Now if you have expensive units in 20 storey towers with high strata and high rents I am not sure it will be as successful. It is also worth considering that the upper Northern line will no longer go directly to Macquarie Park when the NWRL is built so it wont be as attractive as it is now unless you are in Epping.

As for primary and high schools being important for buyers of these types of developments? I would be surprised if a young family would be the typical buyer. I am also not sure what relevance the Central Coast has for 20 storey development potential buyers but maybe it might be good for some but I cant see it. How relevant is a Westfield's to a typical buyer of these developments? They normally want nice up market stores and a cafe lifestyle not a suburban mall complete with Kmart and MacDonald's!

These are all things that families look for when buying a suburban free standing home not what your normal office professional type buyer of theis style of high rise developments want. You have to keep this in mind. As I said though I am sure the developers will weigh this up when they put forward their proposals and they may price accordingly. What's more likely to make these developments successful is not what they offer but the fact that the shortage of these (or any) type of developments in the rest of the Sydney suburbs means that there is not really a lot of choice!

Now it may seem I am trying to put these developments down but I am not against them as I said. I am just trying to look at it as a potential buyer, be it to live in an apartment or to buy for investment. In the end though the most important point I think, will be how much these places cost to buy and maintain. If priced well many of these things can be forgiven because I cant see well off people wanting to buy them. You dont want to be paying the same price for one of these apartments as you will for a house. That doesn't happen on the lower or upper North Shore but can easily be done in Hornsby and its surrounding areas.

Thats the basis of my comment but as I said, wait and see. No one really knows until the developments are built and sold.

You are assuming that these will be expensive executive style apartments (with a brief caveat). Surely they won't be as expensive as their equivalent closer to the Sydney CBD and may even be cheaper than those stubbies in Kuringgai

You are assuming that these will be expensive executive style apartments. Surely they won't be as expensive as their equivalent closer to the Sydney CBD and may even be cheaper than those stubbies in Kuringgai

That is kind of my point, it will depend on what the developers do but you also have to compare them to what is on sale now. Hornsby is not that "cheap" now compared to a lot of other areas so you have to take an educated guess where they will price these units. That was why I first mentioned the possibility of the units remaining unsold like happens in Ku-Ring-Gai. Too expensive or not enticing people due to certain factors. That was my point, nothing against the developments themselves or saying this is what will 100% happen. However the suggestion from some is that part of the push in the North is to make the area more affordable anyway.

http://hornsby-advocate.whereilive.com.au/news/story/hornsby-council-scraps-plans-for-20-storey-buildings-in-cbd/

well that sucks
people living in highrise against more highrise???
http://images.whereilive.com.au/images/uploads/2010/06/30/be44bf864dc5f7c6e37d2e570d3a3de7_resized.jpg
hypocrytes^^^

Suck shit when they end up with many more times 6-10 storey rubbish spread out all over their area.

You could squeeze on one of the interubans from the Coast to get off at Central but that is not exactly common or convenient.

What do you mean, it happens all the time, many punters actively try to get the Vsets into the city. I have seen it time and time again at hornsby and a good number catch the interurbans from central home in the evenings, they also catch the north shore line central coast trains.

Suck shit when they end up with many more times 6-10 storey rubbish spread out all over their area.

bling bling

What do you mean, it happens all the time, many punters actively try to get the Vsets into the city. I have seen it time and time again at hornsby and a good number catch the interurbans from central home in the evenings, they also catch the north shore line central coast trains.

The percentage of Hornsby passengers doing this is not huge, you get more Hornsby people on the Coast via Shore trains. The V sets are pretty full before they get to Hornsby and if you are not going to Central you have to change to another crowded city bound train at the other end anyway. Its not worthy of being classified as another train line in my book. Others may disagree.

I actually think this decision in Hornsby may have more to do with the developers than local opposition...

I actually think this decision in Hornsby may have more to do with the developers than local opposition...

que?

The councils argument of higher density development in the Hornsby CBD was to reduce the need to build higher densities in other parts of the shire and reduce the pressure being placed by the NIMBY's, which is wise enough.

not hornsby but close
new additions to seventh day adventist hospital
these bldgs reach just over 200m above sea level

http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4090/4994563205_6aa54e672b_o.jpg

http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4131/4994562473_344901bd9c_o.jpg

The San has some great views of the city thanks to its height.

Looks good, I havent visited that Hospital in many years. Is the San in Thornleigh (Hornsby) or Wahroonga (Ku-Ring-Gai)?

Its in NIMBY heaven

Its in NIMBY heaven

Its in Beecroft?

:lol: Nah, it's in Wahroonga.

Nah, it's in Wahroonga.

:lol: Cheers.

I went there to visit someone there six years ago. Virtually clear and uniterupted views down into Sydney's CBD and beyond. :)

One of the buildings capitalises on the views.

new multi storey units nearing compeltion in College Crescent street.
jan22
http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5059/5501051125_2265fcd175_b.jpg

incredible density
may16
http://img155.imageshack.us/img155/308/hornsby.jpg

It is alot like Hurstville, where it backs onto the Railway line along with the other cluster around Waitara station.

Residential/Commercial development in Hornsby:

http://www.harviegroup.ca.com.au/photos/zip.24105-TheWalk_photomontage.jpg

http://www.the-walk.com.au/images/about_450.jpg

http://www.the-walk.com.au/

thanks looks great

Design is heavy-handed & ordinary.

but great ;)

The architecture is pretty average, but I like the idea of private rooftop terraces, direct access from your apartment.

http://www.the-walk.com.au/images/rooftop.jpg

Romantic idea, & I'd love one myself given my nasty habit of collecting & propogating plants, but will it get past council? Bit too radical? I'd still prefer a design with 'a lighter touch'.

Hornsby Shire crams in another 2700 homes
Council

13 Sep 11 @ 03:20pm by ROBBIE PATTERSON


ANOTHER 2700 new dwellings have been made possible in the Hornsby Shire after changes to were approved for the Hornsby local environment plan.

Planning and Infrastructure Minister Brad Hazzard gazetted the amendments to the plan on September 2.

The final gazetted housing strategy includes precincts to include a mix of townhouse, five-storey and eight to 10-storey residential and mixed-use developments.

The local environment plan changes take in parts of Carlingford, Pennant Hills and West Pennant Hills.

All submissions were forwarded to Mr Hazzard said Hornsby Mayor Nick Berman. And last month, the Mayor, Deputy Mayor and council staff also met Mr Hazzard to express residents’ concerns about the housing strategy.

Cr Berman said the government now needs to “come good” on promises to improve infrastructure services including roads, public transport, schools and hospitals for the imminent increase.

Inquiries: visit www.hornsby.nsw.gov.au/housing or call 9847 6760.

new 10storey uc
93-103pacwhy

http://i1.au.reastatic.net/800x600/1716931e345607a7cdf6201833677b368bdb12c0ac31718cfa3960b5bfb2f167/main.jpg