Sept. 23 (Bloomberg) -- Turkish television star Kivanc Tatlitug made his debut on Israeli screens last month in a sign that commercial ties are surviving the political rift between the two countries.

As Tatlitug’s soap opera, “Menekse and Halil,” airs in Israel, business between the two countries is booming. Trade has risen 30 percent since January and sales of Turkish-made cars such as Ford Motor Co.’s Connect vans and Renault SA’s Clio doubled in Israel last year. Flowing in the opposite direction, refined fuels and industrial machinery powered a 40 percent jump in Israel exports to Turkey last year.

Trade is rising even after a diplomatic furor sparked by the killing of Turkish activists by Israeli commandoes during a May 2010 raid on an aid ship bound for the Gaza Strip. While Turkish Prime Minister Recep Tayyip Erdogan downgraded relations this month after Israel refused to apologize for the incident, ministers and business leaders in both nations lined up to argue that trade ties should be shielded from the fallout.

“Both countries need each other,” said Menashe Carmon, president of the Israel-Turkey Business Council. Business ties “are long-term and in private sector hands. Those are continuing without any change,” said Carmon, who’s a director of Turkey’s Bank Pozitif Kredi & Kalkinma Bankasi AS, which is owned by Bank Hapoalim Ltd., Israel’s second-biggest bank by assets.

Losing Turkey

Israel and Turkey forged close relations over four decades as key U.S. allies in the Middle East. While that military alliance has ruptured, executives need to keep trade flowing as the threat of a U.S. recession and the euro region’s worsening debt crisis dim their growth prospects.

Turkey’s central bank cut interest rates to a record low of 5.75 percent on Aug. 4 citing the risk of recession in the European Union, the destination of half of Turkey’s exports. In Israel, sales to the U.S., which buys about one-third of its exports, dropped an annual 29 percent in the three months through August.

Losing Turkey as a trade partner would hurt, Stanley Fischer, governor of the Bank of Israel, said Sept. 6.

“In terms of the sophisticated economies in the region, which is where we export most successfully, it is the most important,” he said.

‘More Careful’

For now, trade across the Mediterranean between the two countries may help soften the blow from a global slowdown. Turkey bought 3 percent of all Israel’s exports in the year to August, making the market worth $1.3 billion. That’s 40 percent higher than a year earlier. Refined petroleum products from companies such as Haifa-based Oil Refineries Ltd., the country’s largest refiner, made up almost a quarter of Israeli sales in Turkey last year, according to the Turkish Economy Ministry.

Turkey relied on Israel for 1.8 percent of its total exports in the first seven months of the year, led by autos, metals and machinery, according to Turkey’s statistics agency. At $1.4 billion, the total was 20 percent higher than a year ago.

‘At this stage, we shouldn’t expect anything to change in the private sector,” said Nilufer Sezgin, chief economist at Ekspres Invest, an Istanbul-based brokerage owned by Belgian bank Dexia SA. “The important thing is whether this situation will last or not. If the political tension with Israel is here to stay, then, naturally, the private sector will be more careful about deepening economic relations, though that is not the same thing as severing existing ties.”

‘Separate Issue’

About 10 percent of Israeli car imports in the eight months through August were made in Turkey, with models by Hyundai Motor Co. and Renault the top sellers, according to the Israeli Vehicle Importers Association. Israel’s $330 million car market was Turkey’s biggest outside Europe, according to Turkey’s auto industry association.

Billionaire Ahmet Nazif Zorlu may be the Turk with the most at stake in Israel, and he says politics and business shouldn’t mix. Zorlu, whose Vestel Elektronik Sanayi & Ticaret AS can make 15 million television sets a year, said he doesn’t intend to abandon the $1.3 billion his companies have invested in power generation in Israel.

“The Turkish government has its justified reasons but that’s a separate issue and doesn’t bind investors,” he told Dunya newspaper on Sept. 7. “We don’t have the luxury to just pack up and leave.”

The diplomatic breakdown is nevertheless rattling some investors. Oil Refineries shares have fallen 13 percent since Erdogan announced the break in relations on Sept. 2, while Bank Hapoalim, Israel’s second-biggest bank by assets, dropped 11 percent. The benchmark TA-25 index fell 8.2 percent.

Gaza Blockade

Erdogan suspended military ties with Israel and downgraded diplomatic relations, saying there will be no rapprochement until Israel apologizes for last year’s killings, pays compensation and lifts the embargo on Gaza. A United Nations report into the events said Israel’s naval blockade is legal and the country is entitled to enforce it, though its effort to stop the aid flotilla was “excessive and unreasonable.”

As political relations deteriorate both countries have the cushion of growth rates surpassing those of their western trading partners. Turkish output is set to grow 6.6 percent this year and Israel’s by 4.8 percent, the International Monetary Fund forecast this week. That compares with the fund’s prediction of 1.6 percent overall growth in developed economies.

‘Spoiled Child’

While Erdogan was calling Israel a “spoiled child,” Zafer Caglayan, his minister responsible for trade, said Israel is a good commercial partner and Turkey isn’t considering trade sanctions. Both have said Turkey’s quarrel is with the Israeli government, not individuals or businesses.

“We have to make a serious attempt to improve the relationship with Turkey,” Israeli Finance Minister Yuval Steinitz said in a Sept. 20 interview. It’s “very important for us, for the Turks, and actually for the entire region.”

Ozlem Ozsumbul, foreign and domestic sales manager at Dogan Yayin’s Kanal D, which is the broadcaster of “Menekse and Halil,” says its story of lovers separated by borders resonates with audiences across the Middle East.

“There are a lot of commonalities with Israel, Turkey isn’t in a different place,” she said in a telephone interview from Istanbul. “In the end, we too fall in love, get sad, cry and die like everyone else.”

--With assistance from Lara Setrakian in Dubai and Gwen Ackerman and Alisa Odenheimer in Jerusalem. Editors: Ben Holland, John Fraher, Andrew J. Barden

http://www.businessweek.com/news/2011-09-22/turkey-israel-booming-trade-obscured-in-erdogan-political-rants.html

Thanks for the good news. :) We could all use that....

countries that have strong trade ties via the private sector don't go to war against each other. It is a political risk no government can take in any market economy where the strongest lobby groups are the private sector.

:)

is Menaske and Halil that show about a Greek girl and a Turkish guy hitting it off? :?

is Menaske and Halil that show about a Greek girl and a Turkish guy hitting it off? :?

nope,

but there was a series a couple of years ago called yabancı damat (I think it was translated as love without borders) which was about a Turkish girl and Greek dude hitting it off.

nope,

but there was a series a couple of years ago called yabancı damat (I think it was translated as love without borders) which was about a Turkish girl and Greek dude hitting it off.

How bout you make an Israeli guy and a Turkish girl hitting it off? :) I can be that guy...and we can dress you up as a girl and make you play the female character ;)

How bout you make an Israeli guy and a Turkish girl hitting it off? :) I can be that guy...and we can dress you up as a girl and make you play the female character ;)

:madwife:

your a true sport...

http://www.justblowme.com/images/smilies/bondage.gif

Btw - EFES was/is big in Israel. The Pilsner!

http://images.sodahead.com/polls/000891235/funny_pictures_hot_or_not_cat_xlarge.jpeg

Trade volume is around 3 billion dollars.

Erdogan: UN sanctions on Israel could aid Mideast peace processIn interview with TIME, Turkish Prime Minister says sanctions are promoted when dealing with Iran and Sudan, but taboo with regards to Israel.
By Haaretz
Tags: Israel Turkey Iran UN Recep Tayyip Erdogan



Sanctions imposed by the United Nations on Israel would have resolved the issue of Mideast peace long ago, Turkish Prime Minister Recep Tayyip Erdogan said in an interview on Monday, adding that he felt the Quartet on the Middle East was not genuinely seeking to resolve the conflict between Israel and the Palestinians.

Asked on the steps that could have been taken by the international community to further peace negotiations between Israel and the Palestinians, Erdogan reiterated claims made during a recent speech to the United Nations General Assembly, according to which the UN was not acting on anti-Israel resolutions.


"Until today, the UN Security Council has issued more than 89 resolutions on prospective sanctions related to Israel, but they've never been executed," Erdogan said, asking: "One might wonder why no sanctions have been imposed on Israel."

"When it's Iran in question, you impose sanctions. Similarly with Sudan. What happens with Israel then?" Erdogan said, adding that had "these sanctions been imposed in this day and age, the Palestine-Israel conflict would have been resolved a long time ago."

The Turkish PM indicated in the Time interview that the reason the international community had stood by without sanctioning Israel was that the Quartet – which includes Russia, the United States, the European Union, and the UN – was not genuinely interested in resolving the Mideast conflict.

Speaking of what he considered to be the Quartet's lack of sincerity in addressing Mideast peace, Erdogan said: "you need to take a sincerity test before you even think of accomplishing this: [Ask yourselves the question], do we really want to resolve this issue or not?"

"Unfortunately, I do not even see the traces this within the Quartet. Because if the Quartet was so willing to resolve this issue, they would have imposed certain issues on Israel today," the Turkish PM said.

"That's why I'd like all the parties involved to be sincere and stand behind those resolutions," Erdogan said.

Erdogan's comments to TIME came amid a continued deterioration of Israel-Turkey ties, over Israel's refusal to apologize for its 2010 raid of a Gaza-bound aid flotilla.

^^ The sick man from Turkey strikes again!

He should wonder why he's country doesnt get sanctions for the same actions that Israel does. He made friends into enemies in days! Now he lost favour in Syria and Israe...makes uneasy relations with Cyprus followed by Greece and still wonders how he can be the next upcoming sufi'st ottoman empire?

shame!!!

^^

Whenever Erdogan opens his mouth it makes me go facepalm.

Anyways, I don't get why Israelis are getting so riled up over what he has to say, it's hardly as if his wanting sanctions would lead to Israel facing international sanctions.

Why doesn't Israel just ignore him or just treat him as a madman like they do with Ahmedinajad. I don't think even Ahmedinajad is getting so much attention from the Israeli press and public.

Our opposition usually tends to make fun of him at every opportunity instead of taking him seriously, which really pisses him off.

^^ The sick man from Turkey strikes again!

He should wonder why he's country doesnt get sanctions for the same actions that Israel does. He made friends into enemies in days! Now he lost favour in Syria and Israe...makes uneasy relations with Cyprus followed by Greece and still wonders how he can be the next upcoming sufi'st ottoman empire?

shame!!!

A smart comment from Kappa!:nuts:

^^

Whenever Erdogan opens his mouth it makes me go facepalm.

Anyways, I don't get why Israelis are getting so riled up over what he has to say, it's hardly as if his wanting sanctions would lead to Israel facing international sanctions.

Why doesn't Israel just ignore him or just treat him as a madman like they do with Ahmedinajad. I don't think even Ahmedinajad is getting so much attention from the Israeli press and public.

Our opposition usually tends to make fun of him at every opportunity instead of taking him seriously, which really pisses him off.

He has an embassy in Israel and his people (media, public, etc..) reflect his views....

I just would like to see Turkey become part of the middle east...but its clearly taking sides. Doesnt Turkey have people have lost loved ones in Terror attacks and are maimed in living in wheel chair for the rest of their lives? The same with Israel...yet.... if Israel fights terorrism, we get sanctioned? Why dont you sanction both groups instead of giving one the fruits of freedom and respect, mainly because of the same political aspiration and religion.

I just dont get Turkey sometimes under Erodogan.
On one end, they say that US/Europe failed them ...so they align themselves in the middle east...

In the middle east, its a turmoil where governments some friendly/some not who are being turned left and right..... Assad and Erodogan were friends and now enemies.....
Yet, Erodogan wants to maintain some allies, so he doesnt say a word about Iran or Sudan....just to stay in the fit....

:? What happened to Anti-turkism in that area?

A smart comment from Kappa!:nuts:

I wish that after your 270+ comments on here, you would have came up with something unique rather than trolling and asking random questions about the air, the sun and the croatian dialect in warfare....

I wish that after your 270+ comments on here, you would have came up with something unique rather than trolling and asking random questions about the air, the sun and the croatian dialect in warfare....

Here you go:

"Kappa21 has now been successfully added to your ignore list".

:)

I just dont get Turkey sometimes under Erodogan.
On one end, they say that US/Europe failed them ...so they align themselves in the middle east...


Turkey has been taken for granted for far too long, Erdogan is just playing on this, many people in Turkey would prefer an isolationist policy, he is aware of this and is saying, we don't need to go that way we can be a leading power if we win over the Arab/Muslim world.

Erdogan won in Egypt,Libya and Tunis.

Over 200 businessmen made over 2400 contracts there.Also no-visum between Turkey & Egypt will start soon.

^^

I still wish that we were a country like Switzerland, no political alignment with anybody, just a place that only trades but doesn't get involved.

^^

I still wish that we were a country like Switzerland, no political alignment with anybody, just a place that only trades but doesn't get involved.


Sounds good but a country with 600 year old imperial past cannot be like Switzerland even it wants to...

Sounds good but a country with 600 year old imperial past cannot be like Switzerland even it wants to...

we don't have to carry the bad karma of an imperial past forever

Sounds good but a country with 600 year old imperial past cannot be like Switzerland even it wants to...


^^
Turks always be imperial.From the chinese wall till the gates of vienna.

Can someone explain to me why are Turks so nationalistic?

Can someone explain to me why are Turks so nationalistic?

your's is not the only country on the planet surrounded by people wishing it to be wiped off the face of the world ;)

^^
Turks always be imperial.From the chinese wall till the gates of vienna.

States founded by Turks before Ottoman Empire are not directly related to Republic of Turkey... Turkish Republic is the heir of Ottoman Empire... History of Turkey as a state started in 1299...

PS: All of the states founded by Turks before Seljuks were nothing but tribal confederacies... Even Seljuk state was not necessarily an empire...
The word empire is used so loosely today... There are only a few empires in history and OE is one of them...

your's is not the only country on the planet surrounded by people wishing it to be wiped off the face of the world ;)

Who wants to wipe Turkey off the face of the world? Moreover, who could actually do it? ;)

Who wants to wipe Turkey off the face of the world? Moreover, who could actually do it? ;)

Kurds, Armenians, Greeks, various Slavic nations, etc., the list is very long.:)

Can someone explain to me why are Turks so nationalistic?

I would, but I would get banned for "racism"...

your's is not the only country on the planet surrounded by people wishing it to be wiped off the face of the world ;)

With one difference.We never got beaten or conquered in our whole history ;)

I would, but I would get banned for "racism"...

Please do... I'm curious...

Kurds, Armenians, Greeks, various Slavic nations, etc., the list is very long.:)

But none of them could or would do anything to Turkey. Pretty harmless. Except those Kurds.

With one difference.We never got beaten or conquered in our whole history ;)

My point exactly.

Kurds, Armenians, Greeks, various Slavic nations, etc., the list is very long.:)


It is the Ottomania drama :pet:

Who wants to wipe Turkey off the face of the world? Moreover, who could actually do it? ;)

Kurds, Armenians, Greeks, various Slavic nations, etc., the list is very long.:)

^^ what he said

And you have nukes,we don't ;)

But none of them could or would do anything to Turkey. Pretty harmless. Except those Kurds.

Currently no (because of idiotic leadership), but hopefully Erdogan will lead the Turkish nation to national suicide, and if in the following few decades NATO collapses and Turkey's neighbors get their acts together, it will be gang bang time.:banana:

^^ what he said

And you have nukes,we don't ;)

I am sure you must be losing sleep in Ankara because of the possibility of an Armenian or Greek invasion. :lol:

Currently no (because of idiotic leadership), but hopefully Erdogan will lead the Turkish nation to national suicide, and if in the following few decades NATO collapses and Turkey's neighbors get their acts together, it will be gang bang time.:banana:

:lol:

I think Greece is knock-out for the next 50 years because of the financial crisis and depts there.They even cant fill their tanks with gasoline and must save their outputs.And Armenia is too poor and small.Over 3 million armenians working now in Turkey.

Currently no (because of idiotic leadership), but hopefully Erdogan will lead the Turkish nation to national suicide, and if in the following few decades NATO collapses and Turkey's neighbors get their acts together, it will be gang bang time.:banana:

from the Balkan pov, the last time you tried that you ended up fighting each other instead :D

I am sure you must be losing sleep in Ankara because of the possibility of an Armenian or Greek invasion. :lol:

no, but it does get annoying continuously being told to go back to mongolia

My point exactly.

The Turks were beaten plenty of times, but it is true that since the Ottoman Empire was founded, that nobody has completely conquered or annexed Turkey.

Currently no (because of idiotic leadership), but hopefully Erdogan will lead the Turkish nation to national suicide, and if in the following few decades NATO collapses and Turkey's neighbors get their acts together, it will be gang bang time.:banana:

To which of the nations you mentioned above do you belong to? Or let me rephrase the question. Under what conditions does someone need to suffer to have such dreams?

Can someone explain to me why are Turks so nationalistic?


This is why;)

Currently no (because of idiotic leadership), but hopefully Erdogan will lead the Turkish nation to national suicide, and if in the following few decades NATO collapses and Turkey's neighbors get their acts together, it will be gang bang time.:banana:

This is why;)

that and the treaty of Sévres which was a Euro-American wet dream gone wrong (for them)

Corrected...
the following few decades NATO collapses and Turkey's neighbors get their acts together, Turkey the daddy will have a foursome with his favorite bitches Greece, Armenia and Serbia:banana:

that and the treaty of Sévres which was a Euro-American wet dream gone wrong (for them)


The Australians&New Zealand celebrating their defeat on ANZAC Day :)

The whole Commonwealth (UK,Australia,New Zealand) was beaten very hard. And Winston Churchill had to pass away after the Gallipoli Disaster.

http://www.smh.com.au/ffximage/2007/04/25/anzac_wideweb__470x334,0.jpg

And we only lost our arab territories because of the German Empire.

German Empire&Ottoman Empire against British Empire/France and the rest of the world (WW1)


The germans capitulated totally and the Ottomans were forced to sign a contract or the World versus Ottoman Empire had to deal on.

Germans had to sign the Treaty of Versailles (totally capitulation) and Turks the Treaty of Sevres.But we didnt accept that treaty and the empire striked back.The germans had to deal with this treaty till Hitler said : Fak you all !!!

So the treaty of Versailles was the beginning of WW2 (once my german history teacher told me :) )

But Turkey was neutral in WW2

Hitler conquered whole continental Europe except of Suisse (the bank of the German Nazi Reich) and Italy (with his partner Mussolini)

Once a german general adviced Hitler to get over Turkey to Caucasus then Hitler said :" If we enter with 2000 tanks into Turkey only 2 will come out" and he decided the route over Ukraine.

Turkey has been taken for granted for far too long, Erdogan is just playing on this, many people in Turkey would prefer an isolationist policy, he is aware of this and is saying, we don't need to go that way we can be a leading power if we win over the Arab/Muslim world.

Turkey cant risk to be an isolationist.....
They have too much stake in other countries and cant possibly walk alone.......they'll fail!

But Turkey was neutral in WW2

Hitler conquered whole Europe except of Suisse (the bank of the German Nazi Reich) and Italy (with his partner Mussolini)

Once a german general adviced Hitler to get over Turkey to Caucaus he said :" If we enter with 2000 tanks into Turkey only 2 will come out" and he decided the route over Ukraine.

There are several reasons for this.
1.Germany had limited resources they simply didn't have the manpower to invade everywhere they fancied.
2.Turkey was a former ally which Germany hoped to get to enter the war on its side. It would have been better to recieve added manpower for the axis rather than use extra manpower to subdue a country which was basically friendly towards the axis.
3.Since Turkey was not hostile towards the axis it acted as a neutral buffer zone for the southeastern flank of fortress europe. The allies would basically have to declare war on neutral Turkey to attack fortress europe from the southeast which would bring Turkey into the war on the axis side.

Hitler self was a soldier in WW1 and he knew about the german-turkish alliance on that time.He adviced Turkey for food supply for the german soldiers (Wehrmacht) in the cold russian/slavic regions.

Turkey needed to stay neutral because a World War 1 was enough and it needed a revitalization time.

Also Hitler was a huge fan of Atatürk because of his blonde hairs and blue eyes.He fit into his racial advanced theories of the Aryans :lol:.He had some weird theories about the ÜBERMENSCH (the ultra advanced human, the over human)

Btw.

many european jews fled to Turkey during Nazi occupation of Europe.

The Turkish Passport (based on a true story)

RSJcOzio8hQ

Btw.

many european jews fled to Turkey during Nazi occupation of Europe.

The Turkish Passport (based on a true story)




Sure, never forget Turkey's benevolence ...


"Turkey ... a model of modernity and moderation for other Muslims to follow"
http://www.danielpipes.org/comments/189182


"Gazi Mustafa Kemal's (Ataturk) declaration dated February 2nd 1923 was proclaimed in Izmir: 'Our country has some elements who gave the proof of their fidelity to the motherland. Among them I have to quote the Jewish element; up to now the Jews have lived in happiness and from now they will rejoice and will be happy.' "
http://ankara.mfa.gov.il/mfm/web/main/document.asp?SubjectID=18367&MissionID=65&LanguageID=0&StatusID=0&DocumentID=-1

"The quote above decorates the website of no lesser institution than Israel's embassy in Ankara."


"(...) True, in the 30-ies Jewish refugees from Germany arrived at Turkey. But the Turks accepted only those with money to pay for 'bakshishlar' (bribes) and the "Struma" incident demonstrates very clearly what motivated the Turks while accepting one kind of refugees and sending back others to certain death.

As the war approached and Turkey's relation with Nazi Germany improved the Turks increased pressure on their Jews. On November, 11th, 1942 the notorious "Varlık Vergisi" or 'property tax' law was passed. Land, buildings, businesses, industrial enterprises and almost everybody belonging to minority including a cab driver or a hat maker, were to pay a property tax which was calculated by special administrative commissions on a case-by-case, mostly quite arbitrary, basis. Even though due to profitable trade with Nazi Germany Turkey's gold reserves increased five times during the war, the official reason for the tax was that the State Treasury was "empty". In reality the idea was to ruin the minorities and Turkify the economy. Accordingly, the law discriminated the citizens making minorities pay much higher taxes than Moslems.The tax was set at such arbitrary rates - Greek Orthodox at 156% of annual income, Jewish at 179 % , and Armenian at 232 %-compared to the 4.96 percent annual income tax paid by Moslem Turks. The decision made by commission was not revocable and 30 days were given to pay the enormous tax which in many cases exceeded the value of the property. It was rightly named a new jizya. The varlik vergesi effectively stripped the Jewish community of much its wealth. Thousands of Jewish businesses were ruined, their property –including furniture and other equipment -was confiscated and sold for almost nothing at auctions. Almost overnight a huge amount of Jewish property and businesses went into Muslim hands and was thus "Turkified". (...)"

you know who Daniel Pipes is ? an american jew :lol:

I´ve read many anti-turkish comments about him.

Btw.

many european jews fled to Turkey during Nazi occupation of Europe.

The Turkish Passport (based on a true story)

RSJcOzio8hQ

What about the Jews that were harmed in the 1950s riots which targeted Kurds, Greeks, Armenians and went on to attack the Jews
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/7/74/Istanbul_Pogrom_1955.jpg
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/9/9b/Istanbul_Pogrom_fft5_mf39796.jpg
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/6/6f/Athenagoras.jpg

the numerous pogorms that occured against jews in the ottoman empire from Israel to Syria, Rhodes, Thrace and beyond......

The fact that a best seller in the Turkish Books happens to be Mein Kempf...

Anything more to be proud of ?

I knew Tekken wouldn't be able to resist this thread.

What about the Jews that were harmed in the 1950s riots which targeted Kurds, Greeks, Armenians and went on to attack the Jews

Anything more to be proud of ?

You should be grateful when Spain was kicking all the jews and only the Ottoman Empire accepted them in Europe.No single county in Europe accepted the jew and still does not accept them (see France)

No nation in history helped Jews more than Turks....

No nation in history helped Jews more than Turks....Depends which way you look at it. All countries have been good and bad for Jews in various ways. Unfortunately Jews (like the Kurds, Gypsies, Armenians, Druze) are a dispersed minority and dispersed minorities have never had it good.

America being created arguably helped Jews the most because the mass immigration of the late 19th and early 20th centuries allowed millions of Central and Eastern European Jews to move to the country where many have flourished since. Had Hitler rose to power 100 years earlier, there would be far fewer Jews alive today since most were in Europe at the time.

Russia (despite being a very anti-semetic country) helped the Jews too because they were the ones who sent weapons to Israel in 1948 which helped the Israeli's win the war of independence. Russians defeated the Nazis's at Stalingrad which ultimately saved the bulk of Russia's Jewish population. Then in the years following the collapse of the Soviet Union the underground Jewish oligarchs suddenly became very rich. :lol:

France helped weaponise Israel in the 50's and 60's which allowed the Israeli's to win a few wars. Algerian Jews fled to France along with the Pied-Noir in 1962.

Denmark resistence secured the safety of thousands of Jews in WW2 by moving them to Sweden. Swedish diplomat Raoul Wallenberg then saved thousands of Hungarian Jews by sheltering them in buildings designated as Swedish territory.

Thousands of Jews fled Europe and went to safety in Shanghai, China.

Engalnd were responsible for the Balfour declaration which lead to the creation of Israel, they fought the Nazis, they also took in plenty of Jewish immigrants in the 19th and 20th century.

Australia allowed 5000 German-Jewish refugees to move to the country in 1938 when other countries where closing their borders. More Holocaust survivors live in Australia than an other country in the world apart from Israel.

Morocco told Vichy France to get stuffed when they wanted to implement anti-semitic decrees in the country. Moroccan Jews then moved to Israel and vastly improved the attractiveness of the population. :lol:

I should also mention South Africa where 10's of thousands of Lithuanian Jews moved to in the 19th and 20th centuries and Jews have done very well in that country.

Turkey cant risk to be an isolationist.....
They have too much stake in other countries and cant possibly walk alone.......they'll fail!

We managed to get through WW2 following a neutral, isolationist policy. Trade with the highest bidder and don't ask questions, that's the sort of policy I would like to see, it won't make you a superpower or anything but it will keep you away from headaches.

You should be grateful when Spain was kicking all the jews and only the Ottoman Empire accepted them in Europe.No single county in Europe accepted the jew and still does not accept them (see France)

No nation in history helped Jews more than Turks....

Again.....Muslims saying how good life was for Jews under Islamic rule was...

There is a couple of things to understand here:

1) Dhimmi - which was still in effect in the ottoman empire
2) Attacks against Jews - which the Ottoman authority didnt do much to help or protect jews
3) Modern Turkey - not recognizing Israel in the UN when it was proposed.

and so on and so on and so on

We are not your father.

Europa has cared very well :lol:

Big Daddy is beating.

Just out of interest, are there any successful Jewish Turks? I mean Jews who became successful in Turkey, not those who moved to Israel or America and then became successful.

Just out of interest, are there any successful Jewish Turks? I mean Jews who became successful in Turkey, not those who moved to Israel or America and then became successful.

The founder of Mango (Isak Andic) is a Turkish Jew. Granted, he moved to Spain.

Just out of interest, are there any successful Jewish Turks? I mean Jews who became successful in Turkey, not those who moved to Israel or America and then became successful.

There was one billionaire who got murdered by some unknown people in 2002.... anyone remember his name?

There was one billionaire who got murdered by some unknown people in 2002.... anyone remember his name?

Uzeyir Garih?

http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=798712

3) Modern Turkey - not recognizing Israel in the UN when it was proposed.


Yet modern day Turkey has de facto and de jure recognised Israel before many other countries.

Plus, I don't think that there is a single Turkic language speaking country that doesn't recognise Israel despite all of them being majority Muslim countries and despite the majority of muslim countries not recognsing Israel.

Also the Ottomans many times outlawed blood libels by Christians in the Arab lands against Jews. Turks never had any blood libels against Jews. Turks, historically have never been anti-semitic, the anti semitism of the modern era that can be seen rising from time to time has always been of foreign influence but has never been inherent and long lasting.

Did you guys know we fought together against the Anglo-Saxon terrorists at the battle of Gallipoli in 1915-1916? True story.

^^

Austro-Hungarian?

:D

^^

Austro-Hungarian?

:D

Yes, we Croatians were a part of the Austro-Hungarian army which fought alongside the Turks against the Anglo-Saxon terrorists at the battle of Gallipoli.:D

^^

Bulgarians were our allies too, ah the good old days :D

^^

Bulgarians were our allies too, ah the good old days :D

Funnily enough, on paper we are all allies even today, since Croatia, Bulgaria, Greece, Turkey, Germany, Hungary, etc. are all members of NATO.:D

Yes, we Croatians were a part of the Austro-Hungarian army which fought alongside the Turks against the Anglo-Saxon terrorists at the battle of Gallipoli.:D

Crooks!

^^

Bulgarians were our allies too, ah the good old days :D

Even bigger Crooks!!!

Erdogan extends special Rosh Hashanah greeting to Jews

Turkish PM wishes a happy new year to Jewish Turks, says the holidays and feasts of different faiths and cultures add color to Turkish society.
By Haaretz
Tags: Turkey Recep Tayyip Erdogan Jewish World



Turkish Prime Minister Recep Tayyip Erdogan extended a special greeting to the Jewish citizens of Turkey on Thursday, congratulating them on the holiday of Rosh Hashanah.

In his greeting, Erdogan said that Turkey is a place where different faiths and cultures live together and stressed that the various cultural feasts add color to Turkish society.

"Rosh Hashanah is the Jewish New Year and I wish our Jewish citizens a healthy and fruitful new year," he said.

Turkish-Israeli tensions have deepened recently due to events surrounding an Israeli raid on a 2010 Gaza-bound ship, which killed nine Turkish citizens. Israel has refused to heed Turkish demands that it apologize for the incident.

from the Balkan pov, the last time you tried that you ended up fighting each other instead :D

Are you talking about the Greeks? Yeah, that rift among the monarchists and those who supported Venizelos cost the Greeks getting back their territories.

Just to clarify, I do not support the complete destruction of Turkey, just you guys giving Constantinople (and the rest of Eastern Thrace) and Northern Cyprus back to the Greeks, the Kurds their independence and the Armenians their territories.

Funnily enough, on paper we are all allies even today, since Croatia, Bulgaria, Greece, Turkey, Germany, Hungary, etc. are all members of NATO.:D

:yes:

:D

Erdogan extends special Rosh Hashanah greeting to Jews

Turkish PM wishes a happy new year to Jewish Turks, says the holidays and feasts of different faiths and cultures add color to Turkish society.
By Haaretz
Tags: Turkey Recep Tayyip Erdogan Jewish World



Turkish Prime Minister Recep Tayyip Erdogan extended a special greeting to the Jewish citizens of Turkey on Thursday, congratulating them on the holiday of Rosh Hashanah.

In his greeting, Erdogan said that Turkey is a place where different faiths and cultures live together and stressed that the various cultural feasts add color to Turkish society.

"Rosh Hashanah is the Jewish New Year and I wish our Jewish citizens a healthy and fruitful new year," he said.

Turkish-Israeli tensions have deepened recently due to events surrounding an Israeli raid on a 2010 Gaza-bound ship, which killed nine Turkish citizens. Israel has refused to heed Turkish demands that it apologize for the incident.

He should have said to all Jews of the world, except Lieberman :tongue2:

Are you talking about the Greeks? Yeah, that rift among the monarchists and those who supported Venizelos cost the Greeks getting back their territories.

Just to clarify, I do not support the complete destruction of Turkey, just you guys giving Constantinople (and the rest of Eastern Thrace) and Northern Cyprus back to the Greeks, the Kurds their independence and the Armenians their territories.

nope, I was thinking about how they all turned on the Bulgarians.


I'm in a happy mood so I won't reply the rest of the post :angel:

nope, I was thinking about how they all turned on the Bulgarians.


I'm in a happy mood so I won't reply the rest of the post :D

Yes, hopefully we will have smarter leaders in the future. Even though I think that if anybody will liberate Constantinople, it will be Russia and not the Balkan nations (even though they would almost for sure aid the Russians), but such a war is very far away.

What? You don't think I was generous enough?:D OK then, you can get the whole of Cyprus in exchange for Eastern Thrace, give just that area where Ararat is to Armenia, give the Kurdish majority areas independence, and you can even keep that city which you stole from Syria. Do you like this offer/deal better?:D

^^

the chicks in Istanbul and the west in general are usually quite hot and I won't tolerate any greek dude banging them. the ones in the east and south east are generally fugly so the kurds and armenians can do whatever they like with them.

^^

the chicks in Istanbul and the west in general are usually quite hot and I won't tolerate any greek dude banging them. the ones in the east and south east are generally fugly so the kurds and armenians can do whatever they like with them.

Screw the Greeks then! Give Eastern Thrace to Bulgaria or Russia then, they would take better care of it anyway. Then we can have everlasting peace.:)

Btw, do you know what the TFR is for ethnic Turks and ethnic Kurds in Turkey respectively?

Screw the Greeks then! Give Eastern Thrace to Bulgaria or Russia then, they would take better care of it anyway. Then we can have everlasting peace.:)

Btw, do you know what the TFR is for ethnic Turks and ethnic Kurds in Turkey respectively?

if you are gonna send russian girls, you can have ankara as well

tfr:

I used to have a map but can't find it now, it's about 3 or 4 times higher for the kurds than it is for the rest of the country.

if you are gonna send russian girls, you can have ankara as well

tfr:

I used to have a map but can't find it now, it's about 3 or 4 times higher for the kurds than it is for the rest of the country.

Nope, you can get Bosniak and Albanian girls if you want, but Russian ones are out of the question. And we don't want Ankara either.

Really?!? Then you Turks are screwed without anyone attacking you from the outside. If they make up 20% of the population now, with such birth rates they will become the majority in Turkey by the end of the century. Oh well, Turkey will become Iranian again then.:banana:

Turkish (west) girls easy?!?!??!

Are the russian jew girls in Israel easy to get.I mean the ones who coming from slavic countries :)

Turkish (west) girls easy?!?!??!

Not for israelis honestly no one likes Israel anymore in Turkey. Left or right thinking people everyone lost the sympathy for israel...I lost my sympathy too.

Are the russian jew girls in Israel easy to get.I mean the ones who coming from slavic countries :)

No they are tough.........they have military experience so they'll snap your neck before you can snap your pants

Not for israelis honestly no one likes Israel anymore in Turkey. Left or right thinking people everyone lost the sympathy for israel...I lost my sympathy too.

Too much anti-israelism....

I'd still do it if its easy.......... :) my dick is an international body of mystery

Report: Israel scrambles IAF warplanes toward Turkish shipTurkish media reports claim Israeli F-15s approached Turkish research vessel near contested Cyprus drilling area.
By Haaretz
Tags: Israel Turkey



Israel Defense Forces jet fighters were scrambled toward a Turkish seismic research ship in the Eastern Mediterranean, Turkish media reported on Friday, in what seemed to be a further escalation in the already fraying ties between the once longtime allies.

According to the report, cited by the Turkish daily Today's Zaman and based on a report by the Turkish Vatan daily, two Israel Air Force F-15s took off to face the Turkish vessel on Thursday night, flying through the airspace of both Cyprus and Turkish Cyprus.

Israeli Air Force F-15 fighter jets during a ceremony for newly graduated pilots at the Hatzerim Air Base, June 28, 2010.

Photo by: Reuters
The report added that the warplanes approached the Turkish ship despite incessant warnings by forces in Turkish Cyprus, according to which the planes had breached the territory's airspace.

Ultimately, the report indicated, Turkey launched two F-16 fighters to track the Israeli planes, at which point the IAF fighter jets returned to Israeli airspace.

In addition, the report claimed that an IAF helicopter hovered over the ship, Piri Reis, while the ship was in the Aphrodite gas field off Cyprus' southern coast and near to the larger Leviathan natural gas field.

The reported incident took place as Israel-Turkey ties continued to deteriorate over Israel's refusal to apologize for its 2010 raid of a Gaza-bound aid flotilla which resulted in the deaths of nine Turkish nationals.

A recent inflammation in tensions came amid controversy over drilling rights in what could be natural gas-rich areas in the Eastern Mediterranean.

On Tuesday, Turkey said it was exploring for gas in an offshore zone where Cyprus started drilling last week, a provocative step in a dispute over Mediterranean resources.

Last week, Turkey and Turkish Cyprus signed a pact outlining maritime boundaries in the eastern Mediterranean, paving the way for gas exploration. Turkey said it would protect any research vessel with warships, raising the prospect of an armed stand-off.

On September 23, Turkey dispatched its only research vessel, the Piri Reis, to the eastern Mediterranean.

"Piri Reis, escorted by warships, has started research in the same area where Greek Cypriots are exploring," Omer Celik, Vice Chairman of the ruling AK Party who oversees foreign affairs, said on Twitter.

"We have shown clearly to everyone that we will not allow the eastern Mediterranean to become a Greek Cyprus-Israel goal," he said in another message.

Nope, you can get Bosniak and Albanian girls if you want, but Russian ones are out of the question. And we don't want Ankara either.

Really?!? Then you Turks are screwed without anyone attacking you from the outside. If they make up 20% of the population now, with such birth rates they will become the majority in Turkey by the end of the century. Oh well, Turkey will become Iranian again then.:banana:

sorry, no Russian girls, no deal :colbert:

Turkish (west) girls easy?!?!??!

no, they're frustrating.

no, they're frustrating.

Not for Chuck Norris.:nuts: :lol:

sorry, no Russian girls, no deal :colbert:

Oh well, we will just have to wait for the Kurds to take Turkey over demographically then.:)

^^

ermm, how does that benefit you?

The Islamic Republic of Kurdistan is hardly gonna hand over Islambol to the Russians ;)

^^

ermm, how does that benefit you?

The Islamic Republic of Kurdistan is hardly gonna hand over Islambol to the Russians ;)

We will ask for Eastern Thrace in exchange for gang-banging the Turkish minority from the West.:banana:

Or alternatively, since the Kurds are an Aryan people, we will bring them back to their Zoroastrian roots, and Constantinople will become an clean, Aryan, Zoroastrian city:), so it won't matter anymore that it isn't in European Orthodox Christian hands.:)

We will ask for Eastern Thrace in exchange for gang-banging the Turkish minority from the West.:banana:

Or alternatively, since the Kurds are an Aryan people, we will bring them back to their Zoroastrian roots, and Constantinople will become an clean, Aryan, Zoroastrian city:), so it won't matter anymore that it isn't in European Orthodox Christian hands.:)

you have no idea :D

you have no idea :D

About what? That the Kurds will be an bigger headache for us Europeans than you Turks are?:D

If so, then the plan is the following: We give Eastern Thrace to Bulgaria (or to Russia), Western Anatolia to the Greeks, Eastern Anatolia to the Armenians, while you Turks and Kurds get deported to your respective ancestral homelands, Iran (the Kurds) and Mongolia (the Turks), everybody is happy and everyone wins.:)

Or we just give the whole of Turkey to Russia, while sending all of you Turks and Kurds to Germany and Austria as Gastarbeiters.:nuts::lol:

About what? That the Kurds will be an bigger headache for us Europeans than you Turks are?:D

If so, then the plan is the following: We give Eastern Thrace to Bulgaria (or to Russia), Western Anatolia to the Greeks, Eastern Anatolia to the Armenians, while you Turks and Kurds get deported to your respective ancestral homelands, Iran (the Kurds) and Mongolia (the Turks), everybody is happy and everyone wins.:)

Or we just give the whole of Turkey to Russia, while sending all of you Turks and Kurds to Germany and Austria as Gastarbeiters.:nuts::lol:

sorry, no Turk alive here from mongolia ;)

sorry, no Turk alive here from mongolia ;)

You sure?;)

Then how about this, you all convert to Orthodox Christianity, change the name of the country to lets say Troy and change your language from Turkish to some European one?:nuts:

Christianity is a wrong religion and Europe is falling down from the wrong belief ;)

Either Jesus is not God,nor God son. God cant die and God never let a prophet die brutally with pain.

And the belief that Jesus take the sins of all humans is wrong.Then the test on world would make no sense.

And in islamic belief the man who was murdered brutally on the cross was not Jesus but a roman soldier.

The true story is this :

The roman soldiers wanted to kill the true Jesus and hunted him into a cave.
A single roman soldier went into the cave to kill Jesus.Now God transformed the face of the roman soldier into the face of Jesus.

So everyone believed that he is Jesus.The true Jesus got back into the sky and will come back during the time of MAHDI to brake the cross and kill the pig.

After Jesus the christians changed the religion into wrong directions.There are over 1000 bible version.This religion is changed totally.This is why God decided to sent the last religion and the last prophet of the whole universe till end of the world.

And the jewish religion was also changed into wrong directions.Then Jesus came.This religion also went into fail.

In islamic belief all prophets are our prophets : Adam,Noah,Moses,Jesus,Muhammed.They all were prophets to send the right message to the humans.But the humans changed every message of the prophets and the books.So another religion came and another prophet.

But God is saying that Muhammed is the LAST ONE and ADAM the first.

And in islamic belief GOD damned all jews for their arrogance against him.This is why God spread them all over the world as punishment.The jew were hunted in every part of the world.

The jews never trust God.After Moses went to the top of the mountain for the 10 rules the jews back gonna wild and they made a bull of gold to believe on it.

So the christians and jews will go into : "CEHENNEM" !!! and atheists :)

So the christians and jews will go into : "CEHENNEM" !!! and atheists :)
I think in Arabic it sounds something like "jahannam".
Anyway, the Jews are already there. :)

Valley of Hinom:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/1/1a/Valley_of_Hinom_PA180090.JPG/800px-Valley_of_Hinom_PA180090.JPG

You should be grateful when Spain was kicking all the jews and only the Ottoman Empire accepted them in Europe.No single county in Europe accepted the jew and still does not accept them (see France)

And in islamic belief the man who was murdered brutally on the cross was not Jesus but a roman soldier.

The true story is this :

The roman soldiers wanted to kill the true Jesus and hunted him into a cave.
A single roman soldier went into the cave to kill Jesus.Now God transformed the face of the roman soldier into the face of Jesus.

So everyone believed that he is Jesus.The true Jesus got back into the sky and will come back during the time of MAHDI to brake the cross and kill the pig.

After Jesus the christians changed the religion into wrong directions.There are over 1000 bible version.This religion is changed totally.This is why God decided to sent the last religion and the last prophet of the whole universe till end of the world.

And the jewish religion was also changed into wrong directions.Then Jesus came.This religion also went into fail.

In islamic belief all prophets are our prophets : Adam,Noah,Moses,Jesus,Muhammed.They all were prophets to send the right message to the humans.But the humans changed every message of the prophets and the books.So another religion came and another prophet.

But God is saying that Muhammed is the LAST ONE and ADAM the first.

So what you saying?
It seems the Islam is in the wrong direction with its people and its interactions with other cultures/religions........

Islam is never on wrong direction but the people are.This is the difference between Islamic Golden Age and the Age of Despots/Monarchs.But after the Arab Spring the islamic world and ummah will be on better ways.

The Quran of today is the same like the Quran of 1400 years ago.Every word,phrase and even point is the same.There arent 1000 versions of the Quran.

Interchange of cultures.The rise of Europe began with the contact of the advanced islamic civilization (Crusades in Jerusalem and Moorish people in Spain).

And Islam is in favor of interchanges with other cultures to make Dawah

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dawah

In Islamic theology, the purpose of Da‘wah is to invite people, both Muslims and non-Muslims, to understand the worship of Allah as expressed in the Qur'ān and the sunnah of the prophet, as well as to inform them about Muhammed.

And the biggest Dawah maker in Germany is a german :lol:

Pierre Vogel alias Abu Hamza


http://www.google.de/url?source=imgres&ct=img&q=http://www.fr-online.de/image/view/2011/3/18/8356308,5310356,highRes,maxh,480,maxw,480,_Mon%2BApr%2B18%2B19%25253A25%25253A26%2BCEST%2B2011.jpg&sa=X&ei=9d2ITtqDFZOP4gSp-6ixDw&ved=0CAQQ8wc&usg=AFQjCNEKWFkY0_iXzyHqLBNKMAKFeJLlYA

http://www.google.de/url?source=imgres&ct=img&q=http://ansarulhaqq.files.wordpress.com/2010/12/2501361.jpg&sa=X&ei=mN6ITvflLYXO4QSV-7TMDw&ved=0CAQQ8wc&usg=AFQjCNHYoQOxDnFhjy7k2gRDhUSXa-3cxA

well this thread just went down the drain...

Islam is never on wrong direction but the people are.This is the difference between Islamic Golden Age and the Age of Despots/Monarchs.But after the Arab Spring the islamic world and ummah will be on better ways.

Islam seems to contradict itself...it says peace, wants war. It talks about glory, yet turns into poverty....it says loyalty and then gives submission...

Arab spring or not there is 2 problems with the muslim world and that is the problem they have within themselves and also with others. Jews-Christians-Buddhist-Hindus etc....
You dont see Jews and Hindus duking it out nor Buddhist and Christians.....

The Quran of today is the same like the Quran of 1400 years ago.Every word,phrase and even point is the same.There arent 1000 versions of the Quran.

Interchange of cultures.The rise of Europe began with the contact of the advanced islamic civilization (Crusades in Jerusalem and Moorish people in Spain).[/qupte]

The Quran never changed as the torah and the bible.......but people always made their own assumption and phrases and misinterpereted the holy books to thinking this is the right way to live because its the ultra way...

[quote]And Islam is in favor of interchanges with other cultures to make Dawah

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dawah

In Islamic theology, the purpose of Da‘wah is to invite people, both Muslims and non-Muslims, to understand the worship of Allah as expressed in the Qur'ān and the sunnah of the prophet, as well as to inform them about Muhammed.


Sounds more like making non-muslims become muslims......
If that happens in the Muslim world (muslim becomes christian) he will be stoned to death.

And how comes this is coming from a Turk....
The Turk and Islam is like 2 positive magnets..... so far apart....drinking and conquering others, genocide, occupation and right wing/atheist nationalism....

If you muslims wanted to be true, you wouldnt create borders and divisions between yourselves.... sunny/shia, countries, wealthy and heirchies....
Look how people in the gulf treat muslims who come from Pakistan....as nothing but servants.....

well this thread just went down the drain...

Yeah, and we were so close to brokering an permanent peace treaty between our peoples:(...

Yeah, and we were so close to brokering an permanent peace treaty between our peoples:(...

you seem like another Leora #2 for the forum and an agent for closing down threads...including your own...

you seem like another Leora #2 for the forum and an agent for closing down threads...including your own...

If I wanted this thread to be closed, I would post something like this:

http://zionstrumpet.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/02/2-16-11-kick-the-muslims-out-europa.jpg

Ups...

^^ Are you sure about that? I'd think you'd get an opposite reaction.

I think you just want to close your career in this forum for good......

Say Hello To My Little Friend

:lock: