Here's a post I'm already regretting making, a ridiculous can of worms that is probably going to go places I don't want to see it go, but what the hell...

First, a little conceit. As a life-long Chicagoan and someone who has always had great interest in my city, I have to say that (first) I have no doubt about Chicago's greatness and global status and (second) through work I have done in Chicago's tourism industry, I have no doubt that others from across the US and around the world agree with me. It's almost: NO CONTEST. Nothing is fact, but here's about as close as you can get: Chicago does city, does urban, in a totally remarkable, mind boggling way. I've said it before and I'll say it again: in my eyes (for right or for wrong), I see NYC and Chgo as peer cities; I have never, ever traveled to NY and came home to a place which I consider to be the "Second City"; I'd be willing to say that the vast majority of Chicagoans see things that way and would be unshaken or unconsidered if others outside our area differed. It's more imporant to us how we see ourselves than how others see us.

So, this board has me confused. What accounts for the large degree of Chicago trollers, the Chicago critics, even the Chicago haters? Is it, as I suspect, what others and what I post throughout this forum about our city that gets the juices flowing (especially the LA juices) in others? We all (me included) will get into discussions of other cities and throw in Chicago into the discussion; and sometimes that toss is gratuitous and disrespectful to the other city.

My sixth sense about the LA situation is that it was the back-and-forth that has gone on here that has caused their dismissal of Chicago in that NY/LA coastal axis. And I don't think the guys posting it even believe it; I think they're trying to score points in light of how they feel Chicagoans here (including me) beat up on LA.

Chicago has always been about bragging, about being bigger than big, about truly being that Windy City that promotes itself like no other. How much of that bravado is responsible for the digs and insults that Chicago gets here. Is it negativity to Chicago or is it negativity to what you and I post here that is responsible for the angst? DO CHICAGOANS BEHAVE WORSE (OR WORST) THAN FOLKS FROM OTHER CITIES ON THIS FORUM?

I'm asking this as a serious question, in hopes of getting a serious answer.

We are only at our worst (sometimes) when people put down our city. aAdmit it, we are a very proud bunch. I think the people of Chicago know more about their city and are more inclined to show it off than people of other cities, and frankly, Chicagoans have good reasons for it.

Like Kapoor said, Chicago is unique for an American city, there is immense civic pride found nowhere else.

I agree with Dancethingy. However, I think Chicagoans are worst not only when people put down their city, but even when people don't consider it as great as they do. Many Chicagoans can't understand how people don't see the beauty and greatness of their city as well as they do. I consider myself somewhat of an adopted Chicagoan, but I live o n the East Coast.

When I meet east coasters who don't know much about Chicago and stereotype it as "the midwestern town" "so freezing cold", etc but never consider the fact that Boston is just about as snowy and cold as it gets, it bugs me. They have no idea just how grand, beautiful, powerful, and energetic this metropolis really is (I confess that I know plenty of East Coasters who absolutely LOVE Chicago. Californians? They're weird, they only like California). That's when the bragging comes out.

The ultimate problem is the media. Most filming is in NYC or LA, so people only see those 2 cities. NYC deserves it, whereas LA just looks like another SunBelt City. If Chicago could do something to increase its media coverage, outsiders would be "wowed" more and less likely to stereotype the city

The points that both of you brought up are almost ironic...and correct. It's amazing. Chicago is physically issolated from the east and west coast which has over the years been responsible for erroneous viewpoints of our city. Urban Politician is right on in explaining the "unknown" quality that Chicago has, or more appropriately, had.

That, of course, has radically changed. Think about. That hospitality industry was once totally geared to conventions. I don't believe I have to tell you how much that has changed. Tourism has increased enormously. Chicago's profile is not only well known by Americans, but increasingly from people around the world.

And yet that very issolation has created a situation that dancethingy so well described. No major city can compare with Chicago in the way that it has created its own island, apart from other areas; in essence creating its own world.

Look at the northeast. NYC's position in the nation and the world is beyond question. In its own region though, NY is highly tied in with other northeast corridor cities. DC, a powerhouse of its own, is not all that far from New York. Manhattan, for all its island attributes, is more tied in to a region thaat heavily influences it than Chicago does.

Some thing, to a degree, on the West Coast. Penninsular SF needed bridges to connect it to Marin and East Bay and developed in splendid issolation. But it is still influenced by a city in the southern part of its own state with considerable population and power, albeit with a lot of smog thrown in.

Chicago meanwhile dominates the midcontinent in a way that no US city...NYC, LA, SF, DC.....can emulate. And within that region, Chicago has forged an incredible identity among Chicagoans who are intimately aware of its history, its architecture, its attractions, its business community, its real estate development, and a helluva lot more.

The ultimate problem is the media.

Enough said. You snatched the words right out of my mouth. That is how a lot of cities get their stereotypes.

edsg25 hit the proverbial nail on the head. They weren't kidding when they said Chicago was destined to dominate the continent. And outside of the Northeast and California... it practically does.

Good point, dancethingy, on the civic pride. Chicago has this element that cannot be duplicated to the same degree or quality elsewher, not even New York. The fact that Chicagoans love their city so much has tremendous tangible and intangible effects on the health of the city as a whole.

Does anyone else see the irony in the fact that it is the very same condition that, both, made this place what it is and simultaneously, made it so easy for people to ignore? Chicago's mid-continent location is undeniably what sparked its birth; as the eastern terminus of the western railroads, and the western terminus of the eastern railroads- goods and people had to be offloaded here during any trip across the country. It was this very location that allowed us to be the mediator of the Nation's coastal giants, until, eventually, we eclipsed all but one of them.

At the same time, Chicago's location in "the middle of nowhere" has always been its biggest hinderance. We all know what the stereotypical picture of the Midwest looks like to most people.

So, do we curse our condition? Or do we praise it for making that very cursing possible.

Live and let live. :sleepy:

At the same time, Chicago's location in "the middle of nowhere" has always been its biggest hinderance. We all know what the stereotypical picture of the Midwest looks like to most people.


There is no middle of nowhere. Well, at least not one that is geographically induced.

The biggest connection our coasts have with other nations that the interior does not have is the container port facilities that take in bulk trade coming from Europe and, far more, from Asia. Apart from that, Chicago is as coastal as NY, Boston, LA, SF.

And more so than Charleston or Savannah or Portland, ME. I have no doubt that I could get from Chicago to London or Tokyo a lot faster and with a lot better service options than people in those 3 Atlantic cities.

In an age of air traffic, the coast just doesn't have sway anymore.

And if America truly wants to continue to be a major, the major, player on the world stage, it better junk that absurd concept of "fly over country". If the greatest nation on the face of the earth is really a coastal strip along the n.e. Atlantic coast and California on the west, held together by a mass of meaningless and worthless lands, our country is in deep, deep trouble.

Chicago is only perceived as being in the middle of nowhere because it is in an area of the country that recieves little media attention nationally or internationally. That perception is purely relative because though the midwest doesn't get much media attention it contains vital agricultural and manufacturing markets that the coasts would die without. I see Chicago as a very important city but in a more subtle way than NY or LA. Chicago is a major "behind the scenes" economic player driving the unglamorous but vital industries.

Chicago is also seen as being in the middle of nowhere because no other city between the coasts can compete with Chicago's art, theater, and musical communites and is the undisputed leader in the midwest cultural arena. That is not to say that the cultural scene is not significant in other midwest cities but few other cities recieve national attention for this and are therefore "invisible".

What this all comes down to is how the media brands Chicago will become its national image, reality aside.

Don't worry Chicago your not that far from Toronto and we love you.

The media sucks. They are fickle, biased, inaccurate, and try to sway people's viewpoints into what they believe. They always appeal to the lowest common denominator. And as long and NYC and LA--with their largely ignorant population of people who know VERY little about Chicago--dominate the media, there is little hope of Chicago's current rennaisance getting much attention. It's sad, but it's not Chicago's fault--it's the close-minded media.

Luckily, Trump Tower got a lot of attention for the city due to "The Apprentice". I think Tribune Co. with its numerous TV and Movie studios, newspapers, etc. should do more to educate the world about Chicago. Otherwise, people will never know a whole lot until they come here. Interestingly, most people are "wowed" when they come here because they rarely expect the scale and energy of a true big city until they actually set foot here. America has very few urban places like Chicago, and I believe 80% of Americans have lacked any real experience with genuine urbanism

Don't worry Chicago your not that far from Toronto and we love you.

And we certainly love Toronto. I know I do! :)

Off topic: But I can feel the love tonight. :drunk:

Off topic: But I can feel the love tonight. :drunk:

Sometime tonight, I see Chicago and LA joining hand and singing "kumbiya"

Luckily, Trump Tower got a lot of attention for the city due to "The Apprentice". I think Tribune Co. with its numerous TV and Movie studios, newspapers, etc. should do more to educate the world about Chicago. Otherwise, people will never know a whole lot until they come here. Interestingly, most people are "wowed" when they come here because they rarely expect the scale and energy of a true big city until they actually set foot here. America has very few urban places like Chicago, and I believe 80% of Americans have lacked any real experience with genuine urbanism

It would make a big difference to the perception of Chicago's importance if a network were based here. Chicago has more national TV based here than any city other than the big 3 of NYC, LA and DC, plus Atlanta, but it's all in the form of individual programs, like the various talk shows and Ebert & Roper. Sure, there's WGN, but they don't show any original programs other than their news and the Cubs. If they started producing other programs locally, for national broadcast, it would make a big difference. In addition, I've always wondered why there aren't other cable channels based here. Nothing celebrity-centered could be based here (too far from the celebs on the coasts) but you'd think at least one channel along the lines of BET or a home/garden channel, or something like A&E would be based here.