I hope you guys can help me. I'm a high school student in grade 11. Since the first grade I've wanted to become an architect. I gave up on that dream when I realized I don't have the required math skills.

I've been researching other careers but I know this is my passion. I heard some talk of "urban planning", and from what I understand there is little math involved.

It seems this would be the perfect career, but there's one thing I'm worried about. I've been diagnosed with social anxiety and I don't think I could handle a lot of public speaking. I'm okay in a small group of people, but to speak for an audience ... I'm not so sure.

Should I keep looking?

What area of urban planning? Staff position in a muicipal government? Private consulting firm? Urban planning is a large field. However, most jobs involve at least occasion public speaking. Usually not in front of a massive number of people, but maybe 50 or so. Executive presentation may involve 20 or more professionals or politicans. The bigger the town or city, the bigger the audience.

I would suggest enrolling in speaking classes in high school and collage. Any class that involves presentations. I've had my own public-speaking issue in the past, and these classes help made more comfortable. It's one of those things that you need experience in. It gradually become more natural as you find your style. (Like if you can't think or ad-lib when in front of people, write everything down you can think of. Whenever you're distracted, focus on the notes.) The classes help greatly with this.

So is this is your passion, if you really want to do this, don't let anything get in your way. Find the niche that you find the best, and go for it. Let nothing stand in your way.

Which area should I focus on to avoid public speaking?

Also, is there much drawing involved?

Which area should I focus on to avoid public speaking?
Most entry-level positions do not require public speaking, but ALL planning positions, regardless of career level, require interaction with the public on the individual basis. So, if you don't have people skills you will unlikely get hired, therefore, perhaps, you should avoid the planning field. OR, you can simply triumph over your insecurities, of public speaking, and, possibly, public interaction, like everyone else.

On the otherhand, GIS analysts, whom aren't planners per se, have minimal, if any, contact with the the public and rarely, if ever, are required to public speak.

Also, is there much drawing involved?
No, the work is 99% computerized.

I think its a little to early (high school) to come to a conclusion that you don't have what it takes to do something you like. Having good communication skills is quite essential for an architect or urban planner but that's not something you can't work on if you think that's what you are lacking. Throughout your course in the Uni, you'll go through countless presentations, its a way of life. You do get better as you go along with guidance from teaching staffs and peers.

If you are really into architecture or urban planning, why don't you try to overcome it instead of avoiding it altogether. Who knows?

are there good job prospects in this field?

Offtopic...

are there good job prospects in this field?

http://www.fsu.edu/~durp/images/leftmast.gif

Employment Resources for Students (http://www.fsu.edu/~durp/employment/index.html)

Click the above link. Scroll down to the "State/Regional Planning Employment Resources" and visit several links of the various state APA chapter sites. Each site has job announcements. Take a look at them and the job prospects for yourself. :)

thanks

Your first planning job will likely be in current planning, that is, development review and basic research. You'll look at some new development in the municipality where you work -- for instance, a new subdivision -- and write a "staff report" to determine your findings; approval, approval with conditions, denial, or table.

You will have to make a presentation of your findings -- and defend them -- at a meeting of the local planning commission, and perhaps a city council (at least in the US planning system). The complexity of these presentations ranges from offering an executive summary of your report to elaborate multimedia productions. Many of these public meetings are televised on local govenrment access stations on cable. Many attending these meetings will be very hostile towards planners, especially if you're in a rural area or a region with a strong local culture of "rugged individualism."

How to get over your social anxiety? I'm not a psychiatrist, but medication would certainly help. Many young planners attend Toastmasters meetings to improve their speaking skills, in a non-hostile environment.

On the other side of the coin, a lot of planners have ADD. It helps to see the "big picture", and look at a development proposal or the built environment in general from many different perspectives. However, at a public meeting, ADD planners tend to veer off on tangents to explain the "big picture," and end up speaking too much.

Lol, great post, Cyburbia. Hope you post more often.

I hope you guys can help me. I'm a high school student in grade 11. Since the first grade I've wanted to become an architect. I gave up on that dream when I realized I don't have the required math skills.

I've been researching other careers but I know this is my passion. I heard some talk of "urban planning", and from what I understand there is little math involved.

It seems this would be the perfect career, but there's one thing I'm worried about. I've been diagnosed with social anxiety and I don't think I could handle a lot of public speaking. I'm okay in a small group of people, but to speak for an audience ... I'm not so sure.

Should I keep looking?
:lol: Same here. I wanted to be an architect all my life, then I relized that I don't like math, algebra, etc. I could be great in math but I lost my interest on it, and didn't want to have a profession that involved math. I'm also in the 11th grade and I get really nervous when I talk infront of a crowd I don't know. I'm actually getting better at though, I starting to get the courage to actually talk infront of people, but I still get nervous. I was about to start a thread just like this, but you beat me to it.

I gave up on that dream when I realized I don't have the required math skills.

theres not much maths....

its just x - / + not very hard? and u do work on computors that have calculators.....

dont listen to what every one says...

Greetings all, I´m an Architectu with the specification on urban planning. I´ve read this thread and what I can say is that urban planning is a part of architecture, it´s all linked, in other words, urban planning deals with architecture in a larger scale and the politics concerning the cities and the territory (like STR said). We then have architecture that deals with the object (architecture, in it´s meaning of the word) and so on. As for the maths involved it´s pretty much like PLOTSTYLE afirmed. I think for those undecided minds it´s worth the shot, go for it!

theres not much maths....

its just x - / + not very hard? and u do work on computors that have calculators.....

dont listen to what every one says...
Are you sure about this? I also gave up on being an architect. I thought math has a major role in being an architect.

I was a Teaching Assistant in grad school (for planning) and I had many undergrad students ask me for advice about what classes they should take to prepare for planning school. I would always recommend a basic economics class and a business class... these were the classes that I wished I had taken. A thorough knowledge of economics and how the business world works is indispensible in planning, for knowing these fields helps you know what is indeed likely to happen to a City with a little planning and a little help.

Like the Sears Tower guy said, don't let anything stand in your way. In school prepare yourself to think creatively and analytically and develop the backbone to withstand criticism of your ideas. At the same time develop the empathy to see "both sides" of an issue so you can at least understand where the people who disagree with you are coming from.

Are you sure about this? I also gave up on being an architect. I thought math has a major role in being an architect.

email me at jmarden@toscanoarchitects..com hint hint...

EDIT: what on earth do your career advises tell u?

I would always recommend a basic economics class and a business class... these were the classes that I wished I had taken.

That's good advice. The MUP program at SUNY/University at Buffalo includes both macroeconomics, microeconomics and real estate classes. It's important to know the role (and limits) of urban planning in the broader context of a market economy.

I always told people that planning is a multidiciplinary field that encompasses architecture, geography, economics and sociology. The ratio of those disciplines in your studies depends on your desired specialty; urban design, comprehensive planning, current planning/zoning administration, transportaton planning, economic development, community development, and parks and open space planning.

That's good advice. The MUP program at SUNY/University at Buffalo includes both macroeconomics, microeconomics and real estate classes. It's important to know the role (and limits) of urban planning in the broader context of a market economy.
Very, very good advice. I majored in geography w/ a planning emphasis. I also minored in Bus. Admin, which was supposed to be a second major in finance but had to leave school for family reason. I really want to go back and get the second major, but in economics. I realized that I might not want to be a planner...I'd rather deal with law and public policy. I have plans for law school which will open a lot of doors for me in government. I want to do a lot...I want to plan, develop, litigate, formulate public policy. Regardless of whether I go into planning or public policy, or even business, knowledge of economics and law will go a long, long way for my career goals. I just want to say that it can't be stressed enough how important economics is...in general...to life.

I always told people that planning is a multidiciplinary field that encompasses architecture, geography, economics and sociology. The ratio of those disciplines in your studies depends on your desired specialty; urban design, comprehensive planning, current planning/zoning administration, transportaton planning, economic development, community development, and parks and open space planning.
I'd say it's much more broad than that. In my planning classes there were all kinds of majors: all social sciences (especially poli sci), geology, earth science, civil engineering, architecture and business.

Btw, don't forget environmental planning which is very related to geology, earth science, biology and ecology.

email me at jmarden@toscanoarchitects..com hint hint...

EDIT: what on earth do your career advises tell u?

What does that mean? *raises eyebrow*

Is there a lot of math involved in being an architect or not?

Also, thanks for your repsonses guys. It really helped.

email me at jmarden@toscanoarchitects..com hint hint...

EDIT: what on earth do your career advises tell u?
Do you mean my career adivsors? if that's the case, I haven't realy talk to one. I know i'm stupid for not doing that and I'll go talk to mine when I go back to school next week.

Edit: I just remembered that one of our guess speakers in my class from UC Berkeley/Cal was studying to be an urban planner. I told him that I also wanted to be an urban planner and he told me that I should call him so he can talk to me about urban planning.

I'd say it's much more broad than that. In my planning classes there were all kinds of majors: all social sciences (especially poli sci), geology, earth science, civil engineering, architecture and business.

I forgot law, which plays an important role in planning. It's not just property law, but also constitutional (at least in the US). It's the amendments that affect planners; mainly Article 1 (freedom of speech, freedom of religion/church-state separation) and Article 5 (seizure of property without just compensation). For instance, zoning isn't a taking under Article 5, nor is rezoning for a less intensive (and less profitable) land use. However, you can't change the zoning in a way that deprives a property owner of all economic benefit from their property, making it unbuildable.

Cyburbia, I think planners should beware of lawyers who are looking for an alternative career in land use and environmental planning. Their knowledge on the statutes are unchallenged by planners, naturally. Although, I think most planning departments would rather save the cash and hire a MURP.

Architects use Hardly any MATH!! I'm a sophmore in High School and i occationally work at a 20 person firm in chicago. I asked them all if math is important in Architecture and they all agreed that it wasn't at all! the only math involved is measuring, finding square footage/area, and other stuff. If you're more into the engineering aspect of architecture there's definetly more math involved, but you don't need to be an excellent engineerer to be an excellent architect

i dont see how math is so much involved with architecture, i think you just need to have passion, some good visionary image, and skills, maths is more like the playfield of an engineer. When it comes to 3d renders and detailplans (im 16) i can create a building if i have the specified gross floor area needs the size of the lot... plz, enlighten me here :)
edit: ah! I totally agree with the above poster!

That's good advice. The MUP program at SUNY/University at Buffalo includes both macroeconomics, microeconomics and real estate classes. It's important to know the role (and limits) of urban planning in the broader context of a market economy.

I always told people that planning is a multidiciplinary field that encompasses architecture, geography, economics and sociology. The ratio of those disciplines in your studies depends on your desired specialty; urban design, comprehensive planning, current planning/zoning administration, transportaton planning, economic development, community development, and parks and open space planning.

I agree... to add to your list of important skills to acquire as an effective urban planner would be statistics (understanding demographics, etc), project evaluation, cost benefit analysis, understanding real estate financing and the development process, as well as municipal bonding. In addition to economics and land use studies, these are some of the things studied here at Columbia in the graduate level planning program.

I agree... to add to your list of important skills to acquire as an effective urban planner would be statistics (understanding demographics, etc), project evaluation, cost benefit analysis, understanding real estate financing and the development process, as well as municipal bonding. In addition to economics and land use studies, these are some of the things studied here at Columbia in the graduate level planning program.

This is very true but it's a pity that there are so few public sector planners in practice today which actually posses this knowledge.

Don't get me wrong, I'm studying to become a planner. However when I worked with a developer last year, the city planners we had to deal with were reconmending things so out of whack that many times we just had to pack up and terminate the project. It's like they had no concept of Real Estate Finance. I laugh at them now since their communty has since gone to the shitter and their downtown is slowly becoming a ghosttown. On the other hand, communties which were flexible with our needs, ones in which we did build in, are continuing to thrive. Our developments in those select communties are so profitable they we were even looking at expending in a number of markets before I left.

I was under the impression that the math involved in Architecture is pretty basic, just basic arithmatic, some basic algebra, and maybe a little a bit of trig. Basically the Architect just comes up with some concepts and gets the engineer to run the numbers?

You don't have to be great at maths to be an architect necessarily but you need to be good enough to know when someone is taking you for a ride and such like. The idea that the architect just comes up with the concept and get's the engineer to run the numbers gives a pretty weak impression of how it should work in the best professional relationships.

I've done a little bit of masterplanning in my time and I have to say that if anything it is just as maths intensive as architecture, if not more so. I agree wholeheartedly with what previous posters have said about a grounding in economics being important for example. You can plan dream cities to your heart's content on Sim City but when it comes to someone having to pay for them to make them happen in real life you're going to need a pretty thorough understanding of the economic and political criteria involved.

I don't see the key skills of a sucessful urban planner as being that different to that of an architect to be honest. I see them more as different specialisations within one larger field - and they're both great fun so don't be put off.

This is very true but it's a pity that there are so few public sector planners in practice today which actually posses this knowledge.

Don't get me wrong, I'm studying to become a planner. However when I worked with a developer last year, the city planners we had to deal with were reconmending things so out of whack that many times we just had to pack up and terminate the project. It's like they had no concept of Real Estate Finance. I laugh at them now since their communty has since gone to the shitter and their downtown is slowly becoming a ghosttown. On the other hand, communties which were flexible with our needs, ones in which we did build in, are continuing to thrive. Our developments in those select communties are so profitable they we were even looking at expending in a number of markets before I left.

Yeah I definitely agree, especially having worked in some municipal planning departments. I really don't know what kind of planning backgrounds these people have, but it sure seems like there is a severe disconnect between the academic level of planning and the actual practice. Sadly, since is the case, I doubt I will work for the government as a planner. More likely a planning consulting firm or someday go into development.

I don't think that your lack of math skills should scare you away from architecture if that is your true passion. Granted, I am only in my freshmen year, but at least where I'm studying (Technical University at Delft, Netherlands) the emphasis lies heavily on the design part, and not so much on the technical part. This, I'm sure, varies per institution, but you may want to look into that before fully discarding that entire discipline if you want to do that rather than urban planning.