No I just defended Liverpool since 10231 (I think) made false comments about the city being in decline. That is not true in terms of the economy and population. The government cuts may change this but I guess we will see. I never suggested Liverpool's economy was better than Leeds' and I even stated that Leeds was better economically. I never said anything negative about Leeds.

Google maps. What's with the venomous arsey shit speak? You seem to be filled with so much anger like someone has insulted your mother lol.

This is a city vs city forum that is supposed to be jovial, even if it does predominantly consist of the same handful of manchester, liverpool and brum forumers with deluded egos bigging up their city with endless pages and having a bizzare fascination with attacking leeds in the same breath then getting up in arms when a leeds forumer dares respond or refute said bullcrap and so then diverts said action by shockingly asserting that all leeds forumers do is big up their city (even tho anything said by leeds forumers on this entire thread is a response to a provocation or bullcrap about leeds. It is comical, so dont get angry - and be happy that this is the first time you have ever rebutted a leeds forumer's rebuttal, and actually been correct for once lol :)

You can take what I say any which way you want and if you choose to take it that I'm in any way angry or venomous towards your comments then fine, that's your take on it. I have no problem with your opinion on something or someone, so long as you don't confuse it with being factual.

Talking of 'firsts', this is the first time I've seen a real, heartfelt apology for being wrong from you Wiggley. :)

I live about 10 miles from the nearest countryside but it doesn't diminish the fact that Brum is a very green city. Looking out of my window I see endless sprawl yet thousands of trees and I know down there among all the suburbs there are the lungs of the city, the parks. Leeds forumers seem to think (or be confused by) that because a 2 minute drive past Elland Road gets you to the countryside somehow makes their city better? Major cities have miles of suburbs, thriving communities, lots of parks and their citizens have a different attitude to country folk. Major cities don't boast about the countryside being a 2 minute drive away - a half an hour drive maybe yeah!

Of course, MSP, living in Birmingham you can make full use of one of the largest urban parks in the world, completely within the boundary of the city, surrounded completely by urbanity.

Of course, MSP, living in Birmingham you can make full use of one of the largest urban parks in the world, completely within the boundary of the city, surrounded completely by urbanity.

Don't all cities have urban parks though??? You don't really have a point there.

Besides, Roundhay Park in Leeds is one of the largest urban parks in Europe, the 3rd largest in the UK (After London and Dublin) and larger than any urban park in Brum.

We have a Beach in the City Centre. We Win.

I agree with Morestories.

A major world city (or in fact any big city) defines itself for having sprawling (usually flat) suburbs, which stretch out for miles and miles out from the city centre.

Name me one major world city where you can find yourself in rolling hills within 5 minutes of leaving the city centre.

Basically, if you can achieve this, it's not because "your city is the best" or "it's great for our residents" or "it's great because the city is surrounded by beautiful countryside" it basically means that ... your city's small. It means the suburbs don't stretch that far. It means your city does not have dominance over its surroundings, and that it is, in fact, a small speck of brown on a massive plain of green.

I think we should all sleep with each others mums.

Of course as we are all perfectly well aware, if you head out of Leeds city centre in two particular directions towards the south west and south east you do encounter countryside fairly swiftly, but not in all directions. To be honest it's quite laughable to see the obsession some have with this and portraying Leeds as a 'small town' using hugely distorted facts, as if it somehow makes their own cities better and the population of Leeds 'country folk' with their different, perhaps inferior mindset. Especially when VoldemortBlack then starts talking about 'major world cities', as if anybody has claimed that Leeds, Birmingham or Manchester could be called one of those!

The idea that the more endless sprawl you have around your city, the better it is because it is somehow more important is a bit odd too.

If you think about what people are really arguing about here it's pathetic. As I've said, is Moscow three times as good as St Petersburg? Or whatever the size difference is.

I live about 10 miles from the nearest countryside but it doesn't diminish the fact that Brum is a very green city. Looking out of my window I see endless sprawl yet thousands of trees and I know down there among all the suburbs there are the lungs of the city, the parks. Leeds forumers seem to think (or be confused by) that because a 2 minute drive past Elland Road gets you to the countryside somehow makes their city better? Major cities have miles of suburbs, thriving communities, lots of parks and their citizens have a different attitude to country folk. Major cities don't boast about the countryside being a 2 minute drive away - a half an hour drive maybe yeah!

No, its the ususal obsessive group of forumers on here who seem to think (or be confused by) that because you have to drive through sprawls of horrificly deprived depressing inner city areas before you can get to anywhere bordering normality, that somehow it makes their city better and if anyone disagress then they must be "bigging up their city" - despite those who assert that more inner city grot and poorer access to idylic living is "better" are actually the ones trying to big up their city.

Being a few minutes from rolling hills in one direction, yet a few minutes in the other direction a city with massive employment oppurtuities that match the drab urban sprawl of birmingham is regarded as a huge advantage by most normal people.

One thing people who move from london to the regional cities aways mention is the fact they now dont have a 45 minute commute to work from their semi rural idylic commuter village. The fact that Leeds offers this more so than birmingham (despite offering the same scale of city employment oppurtunities) is a big plus, which also accounts for the higher quality of life indices and lower commute times.

commuter villages are just dislocated sprawl, there isn't that much difference in terms of harm done to the central and inner city areas of a city IMO.

Besides, Roundhay Park in Leeds is one of the largest urban parks in Europe, the 3rd largest in the UK (After London and Dublin) and larger than any urban park in Brum.

Another lie, I find it mildy amusing that you believe that. I suggest you Google 'Sutton Park', just to put you in the picture. :)

If you think about what people are really arguing about here it's pathetic. As I've said, is Moscow three times as good as St Petersburg? Or whatever the size difference is.

True, but then isn't this thread specifically for people to bitch about each other's cities? You know that you'll find this kind of crap on this thread so why moan about it?

Another lie, I find it mildy amusing that you believe that. I suggest you Google 'Sutton Park', just to put you in the picture. :)

Not really comparable parks, by the look of it. Roundhay is a rather more manicured one - along the lines of a country estate with ornamental gardens, artifdicial lakes, follies etc. Sutton Park looks to be a lot more 'wild' and left to its own devices.

Obviously there are places for both these types of park in any city and city region.

Not really comparable parks, by the look of it. Roundhay is a rather more manicured one - along the lines of a country estate with ornamental gardens, artifdicial lakes, follies etc. Sutton Park looks to be a lot more 'wild' and left to its own devices.

Obviously there are places for both these types of park in any city and city region.

Perhaps you need to write a special "Leeds definition" of:
- Parks
- Cities
- Urbanism
- Skylines
etc?? :dunno:
It seems you need to re-define such things in order to justify your wild claims in your own mind.

A park, surely, is "an area of land, usually in a largely natural state, for the enjoyment of the public, having facilities for rest and recreation".

Sutton Park is over three times the size of Roundhay Park, and contrary to claims that the one located in Leeds is the third largest park in the British Isles, the one in Birmingham is the largest urban park in Europe (according to some sources).

Nobody want to swap mums then?? :dunno:

Don't all cities have urban parks though??? You don't really have a point there.

Besides, Roundhay Park in Leeds is one of the largest urban parks in Europe, the 3rd largest in the UK (After London and Dublin) and larger than any urban park in Brum.

Dublin isn't in the UK.

Perhaps you need to write a special "Leeds definition" of:
- Parks
- Cities
- Urbanism
- Skylines
etc?? :dunno:
It seems you need to re-define such things in order to justify your wild claims in your own mind.

A park, surely, is "an area of land, usually in a largely natural state, for the enjoyment of the public, having facilities for rest and recreation".

Sutton Park is over three times the size of Roundhay Park, and contrary to claims that the one located in Leeds is the third largest park in the British Isles, the one in Birmingham is the largest urban park in Europe (according to some sources).


My, you're a very irate little man aren't you? It wasn't me making claims about park size, so please keep a lid on the random hissy fit.

A 'park' is a concept very much open to definition, as you've demonstrated quite aptly. It's very easy to draw a boundary around a collection of fields and wild meadows and call it a park - especially when it helps with willy waving about your city :)

A major world city (or in fact any big city) defines itself for having sprawling (usually flat) suburbs, which stretch out for miles and miles out from the city centre.

I try to stay away from this sub-forum, but WHAT!? ^^ I think most 'world cities' would try and reduce their urban sprawl - rather than boast it. I'm sorry Voldy but that doesn't make much sense.

Another lie, I find it mildy amusing that you believe that. I suggest you Google 'Sutton Park', just to put you in the picture. :)

I'm not lying :sly:

Blame wikipedia http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roundhay_Park#cite_note-Largest-0

My, you're a very irate little man aren't you? It wasn't me making claims about park size, so please keep a lid on the random hissy fit.

A 'park' is a concept very much open to definition, as you've demonstrated quite aptly. It's very easy to draw a boundary around a collection of fields and wild meadows and call it a park - especially when it helps with willy waving about your city :)

I really don't understand this "hissy fit" business :nuts:. Like I said to your close friend Wiggles, you can take what I say any which way you like and if you choose to jump on the Wiggley band wagon (like *some* other Leeds forumers who can't think for themselves) and take it that I'm an "angry little man" then fine. You're entitled to your opinion. If you knew me as a person then perhaps you'd change your mind :lol::lol::lol::lol::lol:

I'm merely pointing out a few facts that you seem to find so excruciatingly difficult to comprehend that you have to resort to trying to belittle me as a person instead. That is a tactic school kids use when they can't think of an intelligent way of dealing with a situation. Your personal attacks won't disguise real, hard facts though. :)

Oh, and there aren't any fields ("land used for agricultural purposes") or meadows (no grazing or hay cultivation going on) in Sutton Park, it is actually a 'Park' no matter which way you look at it.

I'm not lying :sly:

Blame wikipedia http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roundhay_Park#cite_note-Largest-0

Fair enough. It doesn't actually say its the third largest after Dublin and London though but I can see how it could have been mis-interpreted.

Perhaps you need to write a special "Leeds definition" of:
- Parks
- Cities
- Urbanism
- Skylines
etc?? :dunno:
It seems you need to re-define such things in order to justify your wild claims in your own mind.

A park, surely, is "an area of land, usually in a largely natural state, for the enjoyment of the public, having facilities for rest and recreation".

Sutton Park is over three times the size of Roundhay Park, and contrary to claims that the one located in Leeds is the third largest park in the British Isles, the one in Birmingham is the largest urban park in Europe (according to some sources).

Yes well wasteland these days would be classed as a park in Birmingham wouldn't it.

Sutton park is a pumped up field on steroids. Yes there are some nice parts but the size is seriously unjustified and for most part is no where near as pleasant as roundhay park.

Yes well wasteland these days would be classed as a park in Birmingham wouldn't it.

Sutton park is a pumped up field on steroids. Yes there are some nice parts but the size is seriously unjustified and for most part is no where near as pleasant as roundhay park.

What an irate little man you are with all that venomous arsey shit speak!

:)

I really don't understand this "hissy fit" business :nuts:.

its the angry snapish condescening tone you take, where a differing opinion seems to be taken very personally by you.

Like I said to your close friend Wiggles

^^ see, more snapish snide undertones jeesus lol

, you can take what I say any which way you like and if you choose to jump on the Wiggley band wagon (like *some* other Leeds forumers who can't think for themselves) and take it that I'm an "angry little man" then fine. You're entitled to your opinion. If you knew me as a person then perhaps you'd change your mind

sadly, you can only be judged here by your actions. It's your tone. Someone said roundhay park was one of the largest or whatever. You could have pointed out that birmingham lays some similar claims. Instead you chose to take it like some heinous crime ... "see look! MORE NASTY LIES FROM THOSE BASTARD LEEDS PEOPLE their continuous proaganda lie machine" It's a bit extreme :|

I'm merely pointing out a few facts that you seem to find so excruciatingly difficult to comprehend

where did anyone find anything excrtiatingly difficult to comprehend in this discussion?

]that you have to resort to trying to belittle me as a person instead. That is a tactic school kids use when they can't think of an intelligent way of dealing with a situation. Your personal attacks won't disguise real, hard facts though. :)

Saying you are coming across as angry and to chill out in the way you rebut things is hardly a personal attack. An intelligent way of dealing with a discussion is to discuss.. without being aggressive, rude or nasty as you have been.

Oh, and there aren't any fields ("land used for agricultural purposes") or meadows (no grazing or hay cultivation going on) in Sutton Park, it is actually a 'Park' no matter which way you look at it.

Parks are a pretty vague term and any council can designate plane open grassland, cordon it of, and call it a park. Yes, sutton park adjoins the urban area of the west midlands, in much the same way the dales and the moores adjoin other urban areas. It's somewhat differnt to inner city huge manicured gardens, even if both may be labbeled as a "park" by their respective councils That said, i respect that you have a differing opinion.. and as such I wont get angry, become condescending and snide, and label you a lie machine where I feel it is my duty to dispel your evil henious lies :nuts:

^^ Pot, kettle, black? :dunno:

You do amuse me Wiggs with your attempts at trying to belittle people. :lol::lol::lol:

Have you really yet to understand why you elicit some of the reactions you do? :nuts:

^^

as stated already..Saying you are coming across as angry and to chill out in the way you rebut things is hardly a personal attack where someone is trying to belittle you. If anything you belittle yourself :(

Having differing viewpoints and opinions is fun on here. But I will pipe up and point out some on here dont take kindly to your snide nasty tone especially when it's unwarranted. I appreciate you dont like that and as such have tried to turn it round, but hopefully you can move on now :)

^^ It seems you were easily offended by my tone, for which I appologise. I should have known better when discussing things with such a sissy. I will "fluff" it up next time so that you don't get easily offended, add a few 'pleases', 'thank yous' and 'sirs'. Would that help? :nuts:

I appologise.

Well done. Hopefully you can avoid being personal, snide, and angered in future when another trivial exchange of differing opinions on a topic occurs. :)

Well done. Hopefully you can avoid being personal, snide, and angered in future when another trivial exchange of differing opinions on a topic occurs. :)

I will delighted to change my tone when discussing things with you, my lord. I am honoured to be in your esteemed company. :)

ta. :)

glad youve seen sense

Did a quick comparison of cities and poor/wealthy areas.
Red is the poorest, blue is the richest.

http://img705.imageshack.us/img705/6606/manchesterl.png
http://img193.imageshack.us/img193/659/liverpoolh.png
http://img560.imageshack.us/img560/4043/bimingham.png
http://img220.imageshack.us/img220/7481/leedsc.png


Overall I would say its impossible for Liverpool, Manchester and Birmingham to improve its poor areas. The areas that are poor are too large (Especially Brum, I know that includes nearby towns but the amount of red is mind boggling), the only way I can see improvement is when the city center expands itself into the poorer areas.

Leeds does fairly well overall. A reason for this could be is that typically/historically the richer suburbs have always been in the north, hence the markings where the suburbs expanded along the A1. While the poorest areas are to the south. This has meant that areas in North Leeds that were poor only 20-30 years ago are now up-and coming areas due to them been surrounded by more well off areas. Unusually Leeds center isn't fully surrounded by red, with it branching of with lighter shades in the north, areas that not so long ago were poor.

It would be interesting to hear how the cities showed have faired...

Are those maps to the same scale? I doubt it.

If they are they make Leeds look like a tiny village. North West of the initial blue band is rural countryside and not a city, leaving just a tiny area on the screen, almost all red, that shows Leeds. The other maps appear to cover a much wider area, yet almost all the cities.

If they are not to the same scale it is impossible to create a valid opinion of how far the poverty spreads across the different areas isn't it as in one picture (Leeds) you have compressed the scale and in the others you have blown it up.

Either way, what are you trying to prove?

Many NGO provide details of the levels of poverty in Northern cities and compare them.

Try comparing Leeds to cities like Brighton and Bristol (cities much more similar in size to Leeds than Manchester, Liverpool and Birmingham). You will find that compared to other cities of similar size Leeds is actually not very wealthy whatsoever.

Someone trying to brag that Leeds is more wealthy that some other poverty stricken northern cities is a tad disappointing and gives the impression the poster is a bit of a sick individual that takes pleasure in others misfortune.

As I have said elsewhere, the urban areas in towns and cities north of Watford in England are without doubt a shame on our nation, very few people with wealth aspire to live in those urban areas, rather they flee to the south or rural parts of the north, to pretend otherwise is massdellusion on your behalf.

Great find 10123 very interesting. I live in south Leeds :ohno:

But on a dark blue patch :banana:

Those maps look a bit misleading, the blue areas to the north of Leeds look very rural, the blue areas in south Manchester such as Atlrincham , Cheadle etc are very urban.

Those maps look a bit misleading, the blue areas to the north of Leeds look very rural, the blue areas in south Manchester such as Atlrincham , Cheadle etc are very urban.

Indeed, given they show no context of where the urbanity starts and ends I am interested in how they are 'very interesting' other than showing on the whole urban areas in the north of England tend, to be very poverty stricken.

Zoom out a tiny bit and you would get the rural area just south of Manchester, Alderley Edge, Wilmslow, Poynton etc as continuous dark blue, just as you get lots of dark blue in the rural areas outside of the urban parts of Leeds.

Is this really news to the Leeds forumers? Or is this just a piss poor attempt to use the poverty of those in urban northern English cities, combined with the fact that Leeds has little urbanity compared to other northern English cities in an attempt to show Leeds has less poverty?

Yes, Leeds does almost certainly have fewer people in poverty, but likewise there will also be fewer rich people, fewer middle class people in the urban part because the urban part of Leeds, i.e. not the countryside where urban flight leads to, is so small in Leeds compared to the other northern English cities you are attempting to compare to.

10123 - show the same maps for Brighton and Bristol, be interesting to see where the smaller wards end (the higher density parts of the maps) and where the red turns blue. I bet the area of small area wards (the urban parts) will end at a similar place to those in the Leeds map, but on the whole they will be much bluer.

Here is the link to the map http://www.google.com/fusiontables/embedviz?viz=MAP&q=select+col0%2C+col1%2C+col2%2C+col3%2C+col4%2C+col5%2C+col6%2C+col7%2C+col8%2C+col9%2C+col10%2C+col11%2C+col12%2C+col13%2C+col14%2C+col15%2C+col16%2C+col17%2C+col18%2C+col19%2C+col20%2C+col21%2C+col22+from+628653+&h=false&lat=51.502758957640296&lng=-0.00823974609375&z=12&t=1&l=col0

Look how poor vast swathes of London are compared to the northern English cities?

Is 10123 trying to tell us that London is also much poorer than Leeds?

Or is the point that the larger the city, the more poverty you tend to see in England?

If the later, why is he surprised (and wiggleleeds) to see that Leeds has less red on the map than the larger cities of Liverpool, Manchester and Birmingham?

Indeed, given they show no context of where the urbanity starts and ends I am interested in how they are 'very interesting' other than showing on the whole urban areas in the north of England tend, to be very poverty stricken.

Zoom out a tiny bit and you would get the rural area just south of Manchester, Alderley Edge, Wilmslow, Poynton etc as continuous dark blue, just as you get lots of dark blue in the rural areas outside of the urban parts of Leeds.

Is this really news to the Leeds forumers? Or is this just a piss poor attempt to use the poverty of those in urban northern English cities, combined with the fact that Leeds has little urbanity compared to other northern English cities in an attempt to show Leeds has less poverty?

Yes, Leeds does almost certainly have fewer people in poverty, but likewise there will also be fewer rich people, fewer middle class people in the urban part because the urban part of Leeds, i.e. not the countryside where urban flight leads to, is so small in Leeds compared to the other northern English cities you are attempting to compare to.

10123 - show the same maps for Brighton and Bristol, be interesting to see where the smaller wards end (the higher density parts of the maps) and where the red turns blue. I bet the area of small area wards (the urban parts) will end at a similar place to those in the Leeds map, but on the whole they will be much bluer.

I'm wondering if you're going to reveal which regular forum member/troll you are under this 'new' profile :nuts:

anyway, back to your long commentary, it's somewhat disingenuous, given that even the urban parts of Leeds or the wider west yorkshire urban area are nowhere near as deprived as Liverpool, Manchester, Birmingham, or the wider urban areas.

Look how poor vast swathes of London are compared to the northern English cities?

Is 10123 trying to tell us that London is also much poorer than Leeds?

Or is the point that the larger the city, the more poverty you tend to see in England?

If the later, why is he surprised (and wiggleleeds) to see that Leeds has less red on the map than the larger cities of Liverpool, Manchester and Birmingham?

I'm not surprised. It's well known that Leeds is more affluent than those other cities, despite its work force being as large as Birmingham, and the wider urban area being anger the merseyside and denser than greater machester. Moreover, larger does not necessarily mean more greater deprivation, two thirds of englands poorest areas are in Liverpool and Manchester (not Birmingham or London)

Here you go, Leeds, Manchester, Liverpool, Birmingham, Bristol, London and Brighton all to the same scale in the same maps.

What I see if that the smaller the ward (more urban in all likelyhood) the more chance of that being red than blue in the northern cities and London.

There are of course many blue wards in these areas and again, the larger urban areas tend to have many more of the small blue areas than the smaller urban areas.

Just like you find some blue in Leeds, you find it around the southern cresent in Manchester (in larger numbers as the urban area is so much larger - but proportionally maybe less than compared to the whole of the city).

But anyway, we can all make our own minds up.

Birmingham

http://img51.imageshack.us/img51/5145/birminghamd.png

Brighton

http://img692.imageshack.us/img692/5161/brighton.png

Bristol

http://img833.imageshack.us/img833/2825/bristol.png

Leeds

http://img856.imageshack.us/img856/6452/leeds.png

Liverpool

http://img40.imageshack.us/img40/3207/liverpoolw.png

London

http://img594.imageshack.us/img594/3276/londonj.png

Manchester

http://img25.imageshack.us/img25/5503/manchesterw.png

So, judging by those Maps, Bristol is doing the best out of the Core Cities (though where is Sheffield, Newcastle and Nottingham?)

http://i53.************/28lq8uq.jpg
Oh, by the way - and please excuse my crude border - here is Portsmouth. Not doing so badly, and some blue in the inner city too! (Gunwharf Quays and Old Portsmouth on the harbourfront, and part of Southsea (which is full of massive houses).

I made no attempt to show all the core cities, rather in my opinion, the larger the urban area the more red the map appears.

Moving from Brighton through Bristol (which is much more blue than Leeds and about the same size) to Leeds then Liverpool, Manchester and Birmingham through to London, the propensity of red versus blue on the map increases.

Apparently this is a shock to some in the Leeds area.

really? The proportion of dark red (the most deprived) is highest in Liverpool, then Manchester, then Birmingham, Brighton, London Leeds, bristol.

And as already said, no Leeds forumers find the revelation that Leeds is affluent particularly "shocking" lol.

So which troll are you? Maybe one of the mods should do an ip check

Thing is walking around Leeds' city centre gives no sense that it's affluent, the city centre is ugly and dull. Bristol is one of the gems of Britain, gorgeous to walk around and some of the finest city architecture in Britain.

Liverpool, Manchester and even Brum are all way ahead of Leeds in terms of aesthetic eye pleasing too.

I don't dislike the city at all and think parts of it are very pleasant and interesting, but I just don't get the big deal about Bristol. I've been three or four times and enjoyed it, but I must have missed something. You're right though, it does feel fairly affluent in comparison to some other similar sized cities.

If we're talking about affluent areas, one only, doesn't one(it's Royal Wedding day), have to look at the Golden Trinagle, sat on the Border of South Manchester and Stockport. Which I'm led to believe is the most, or one of the most affuent areas outside of London and the South East.(I stand corrected)

And to those forum members who swear blind it isn't part of Manchester.(as we see it and know it) Come and see the daily commute from Wilmslow and the surrounding areas, via the Handforth Dean bypass and Kingsway into the city centre.

Golden Trinagle

You do realise that there are many golden triangles? Leeds has one, as do thousands of places all over the world, just like the term 'millionaires row'. It's not unique to Cheshire.

Money begets money, amenities and services spring up where people live who can pay for them. Commuter suburbs are detrimental to a city IMO, they drain money out of the city.

You do realise that there are many golden triangles? Leeds has one, as do thousands of places all over the world, just like the term 'millionaires row'. It's not unique to Cheshire.

Ah but. The term Golden Triangle is associated with Mancheshire.

An old article, but it it makes the point.

Northern exposure: The Cheshire set
Footballers, TV stars, the landed gentry - old and new money rubs along in the bars of Wilmslow. As a new drama celebrates the spending spree, Katy Guest explores the Surrey - or the Essex - of the North. Minus the white stilettos.(I added that bit)

"They're coming from as far as Leeds these days," they tut.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/this-britain/northern-exposure-the-cheshire-set-419112.html

^^ nowhere does the above article hint that the term "golden triangle" only refers to cheshire.

The term exists in numerous places, including Leeds

http://cdnedge.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/1803874.stm ......

With a bigger budget, you could pick up an "executive" home, in Leeds' "Golden Triangle". This exclusive commuter area is close to Harrogate, Leeds and only a quick canter to the Dales for weekends.

What's interesting about the Greater Manchester metropolitan area map is that it gives a fantastic insight into the real scope of the city, as you see the the inner city areas in red, then a strip of lighter colours around the m60 ring road where suburbia is. And then the colours get darker again as you reach the seperate mill towns such as oldham, rochdale, wigan etc.

If we're talking about affluent areas, one only, doesn't one(it's Royal Wedding day), have to look at the Golden Trinagle, sat on the Border of South Manchester and Stockport. Which I'm led to believe is the most, or one of the most affuent areas outside of London and the South East.(I stand corrected)

And to those forum members who swear blind it isn't part of Manchester.(as we see it and know it) Come and see the daily commute from Wilmslow and the surrounding areas, via the Handforth Dean bypass and Kingsway into the city centre.

There are Golden triangles everywhere, and I doubt the area you have listed is richer than the West/North Yorkshire one that encompasses North Leeds, Ilkley, Harrogate and parts of York.

Illkley is the richest place outside of the South.

23. ILKLEY, West Yorkshire

Average price: £399,244
Outperforms surrounding area by: 157%
Sales over £500,000: 25%
Five-year price increase: 74%

Named by the Halifax at the end of last year as the most expensive town outside southern England, Ilkley is an ideal Leeds commuter town and a prized beauty spot. Just above it looms the atmospheric moor of the song (On Ilkley Moor Baht' at, which is all about being out without a hat), while over the hill lies the full glory of the Yorkshire Dales. Once the Victorians discovered special water dribbling out of springs on the moor, they turned it into a smart spa town and the villas they built still attract wealth. One of these, Maple Grange, pictured, is for sale through Carter Jonas (01423 523423) at £2.5m. Resident literati indulge at the local theatre, The Playhouse, and throw an annual literary festival.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/property/3361027/Britains-richest-towns-30-21.html

Here you go, Leeds, Manchester, Liverpool, Birmingham, Bristol, London and Brighton all to the same scale in the same maps.

All the maps were to scale!!!! :bash:

Probably why I was surprised that Leeds looked so small in comparison.

A
Someone trying to brag that Leeds is more wealthy that some other poverty stricken northern cities is a tad disappointing and gives the impression the poster is a bit of a sick individual that takes pleasure in others misfortune.


Deluded and blind I see....

I haven't bragged about anything, the maps (all at the same scale) I commented on were facts. There are swathes of poor areas much larger in Brum/Manc/Liverpool compared to Leeds. I haven't hinted anywhere that I take pleasure is saying somewhere is poorer than the other.

If thats the case then please go complain to the Guardian about these maps..

^^ nowhere does the above article hint that the term "golden triangle" only refers to cheshire.

The term exists in numerous places, including Leeds

http://cdnedge.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/1803874.stm ......

With a bigger budget, you could pick up an "executive" home, in Leeds' "Golden Triangle". This exclusive commuter area is close to Harrogate, Leeds and only a quick canter to the Dales for weekends.

There are other Golden Triangles, but there's only one Golden Triangle.

It's like saying there's more than one Wiggley-Wiggley-Wiggley-Wiggs. But we know the true one.

Face facts lads. As anyone in the know will tell you, the Golden of Goldest Triangles is in Mancheshire.

"golden triangle"

The term exists in numerous places, including Leeds.You're correct, the term Golden Triangle is not unique to Cheshire or any other place in the UK. There are many places here in North America that have been dubbed with the title, some dating back to pioneer days. Some other names are; Golden Valley, Golden Horseshoe, Golden Acres (here in Texas), Golden Mile,etc.

There are Golden triangles everywhere, and I doubt the area you have listed is richer than the West/North Yorkshire one that encompasses North Leeds, Ilkley, Harrogate and parts of York.

Illkley is the richest place outside of the South.

23. ILKLEY, West Yorkshire

Average price: £399,244
Outperforms surrounding area by: 157%
Sales over £500,000: 25%
Five-year price increase: 74%

Named by the Halifax at the end of last year as the most expensive town outside southern England, Ilkley is an ideal Leeds commuter town and a prized beauty spot. Just above it looms the atmospheric moor of the song (On Ilkley Moor Baht' at, which is all about being out without a hat), while over the hill lies the full glory of the Yorkshire Dales. Once the Victorians discovered special water dribbling out of springs on the moor, they turned it into a smart spa town and the villas they built still attract wealth. One of these, Maple Grange, pictured, is for sale through Carter Jonas (01423 523423) at £2.5m. Resident literati indulge at the local theatre, The Playhouse, and throw an annual literary festival.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/property/3361027/Britains-richest-towns-30-21.html

10123, I'm sorry to disappoint you once again, but coming in at No 9 is.........

9. ALDERLEY EDGE, CheshireAverage price: £481,104
Outperforms surrounding area by: 207%
Sales over £500,000: 31%
Five-year price increase: 63%
Bang in the middle of the Cheshire golden triangle, this is by far the pushiest town in the country. It punches way above the weight of the area, with prices on average 207% higher, and locals drink more champagne than anywhere else in the UK. The Wilmslow Express recently reported that Whitebarn Road was the "swankiest" in the North West, and that two post codes contain almost a third of the properties in the top 100 most expensive streets in the region. You could bump into Manchester United's Gary Neville and Ryan Giggs, Coronation Street actors, or even Charlotte Church and Gavin Henson out househunting. A new 21st-century mansion with five bedrooms (two of them guest suites) and a leisure complex with a heated swimming pool, sauna, steam room, media room and plant room is for sale through Jackson-Stops & Staff (01625 540440) at £2.99m.

The said article which you originally posted dates back to April 2008. http://www.telegraph.co.uk/property/3361042/Britains-richest-towns-10-1.html (much has changed since then)

PS. Please do your homework first and correctly before posting it.

Did a quick comparison of cities and poor/wealthy areas.


Overall I would say its impossible for Liverpool, Manchester and Birmingham to improve its poor areas.

Leeds does fairly well overall.

This is the mental post that started all the discussion off.

Can I just remind you that Leeds looks MUCH more like Manchester than it does Leeds.

Also, if the poverty is much more wide spread in Manchester than Leeds then so must the wealthy people.

Otherwise how on earth do you explain the figures on the third tab of this workbook?

http://www.statistics.gov.uk/downloads/theme_economy/GVA_NUTS3.xls

Although it does not give figures for the urban area (it includes the wealthy rural parts of Leeds for example), the per head indicies for Greater Manchester South is 111.6 compared to 111.5 in Leeds.

Now Greater Manchester South has about twice the population of Leeds, so tell me Leeds forumers what does this mean?

Sure, there is much more poverty in the northern boroughs of Wigan, Bolton, Rochdale, Bury and Oldham. But are you lot not normally the same people who try to convience us that those boroughs are nothing to do with Manchester?

Fact is, Manchester and Leeds are very very similar economically and 10123's orginal post that it was impossible for Manchester (and Liverpool and Birmingham) to recover was clearly blinkered rubbish that we expect to hear from him. After all, the numbers of very poor people in London is many times more than that in Liverpool, Birmingham and Manchester combined yet you would not say the same there would you?

I don't dislike the city at all and think parts of it are very pleasant and interesting, but I just don't get the big deal about Bristol. I've been three or four times and enjoyed it, but I must have missed something. You're right though, it does feel fairly affluent in comparison to some other similar sized cities.

I ain't saying anywhere is better ort worse than anywhere else. Just pointing out that 10123 original post that Leeds was somehow unique as a northern English city and the others were destined to be in poverty for ever are clearly the words of someone with a whopping great chip on their shoulder.

Who gives a shit?

Precisely!

Who in their right mind wants a six lane motorway bisecting their city?

There are Golden triangles everywhere, and I doubt the area you have listed is richer than the West/North Yorkshire one that encompasses North Leeds, Ilkley, Harrogate and parts of York.

Illkley is the richest place outside of the South.

23. ILKLEY, West Yorkshire

Average price: £399,244
Outperforms surrounding area by: 157%
Sales over £500,000: 25%
Five-year price increase: 74%

Named by the Halifax at the end of last year as the most expensive town outside southern England, Ilkley is an ideal Leeds commuter town and a prized beauty spot. Just above it looms the atmospheric moor of the song (On Ilkley Moor Baht' at, which is all about being out without a hat), while over the hill lies the full glory of the Yorkshire Dales. Once the Victorians discovered special water dribbling out of springs on the moor, they turned it into a smart spa town and the villas they built still attract wealth. One of these, Maple Grange, pictured, is for sale through Carter Jonas (01423 523423) at £2.5m. Resident literati indulge at the local theatre, The Playhouse, and throw an annual literary festival.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/property/3361027/Britains-richest-towns-30-21.html



I really, really try not to get involved in this forum anymore, but that is embarrassing even by the standards here.

in the South Manchester 'Golden Tringle' area on your list there there is;

Alderly Edge 9th
Hale 12th
Wilmslow 26th
and Knutsford 36th

I've remarked on this before, most areas like other people have said have their golden triangles and millionaire's rows, but the one to the South of Manchester is the richest outside of London and the home counties, by some margin as well, not that it makes much difference, but that's the facts. A quick look at a site like rightmove.co.uk illustrates this as well.

I really, really try not to get involved in this forum anymore, but that is embarrassing even by the standards here.

in the South Manchester 'Golden Tringle' area on your list there there is;

Alderly Edge 9th
Hale 12th
Wilmslow 26th
and Knutsford 36th

I've remarked on this before, most areas like other people have said have their golden triangles and millionaire's rows, but the one to the South of Manchester is the richest outside of London and the home counties, by some margin as well, not that it makes much difference, but that's the facts. A quick look at a site like rightmove.co.uk illustrates this as well.

It's not the first time 10123 has dropped a........

http://fc03.deviantart.net/fs71/f/2010/271/a/7/atomic_flash_anim_gif_by_anonymiianonymous-d2zpeyw.gif

on the City talk threads.

It's not the first time 10123 has dropped a........

http://fc03.deviantart.net/fs71/f/2010/271/a/7/atomic_flash_anim_gif_by_anonymiianonymous-d2zpeyw.gif

on the City talk threads.

I won't drop another one till the center for cities report :)

I won't drop another one till the center for cities report :)

You forgot to mention the Corn Exchange. :hammer: As well as the 2010 UK (City) Regional PDF report. :colgate: Remember?

I don't dislike the city at all and think parts of it are very pleasant and interesting, but I just don't get the big deal about Bristol. I've been three or four times and enjoyed it, but I must have missed something. You're right though, it does feel fairly affluent in comparison to some other similar sized cities.

I after agree with you there, I didn't think much of the place when i went there last year, i actually found it quite boring infact. :nuts:

You forgot to mention the Corn Exchange. :hammer: As well as the 2010 UK (City) Regional PDF report. :colgate: Remember?

Oh and Victoria quarter...

Sorry... I have a habit on commenting on facts :)

Oh and Victoria quarter...

Sorry... I have a habit on commenting on facts :)

and figures.

At least you've stopped using Wikipedia.(Leeds City Region) :wink2:

Illkley is the richest place outside of the South.

23. ILKLEY, West Yorkshire

Average price: £399,244
Outperforms surrounding area by: 157%
Sales over £500,000: 25%
Five-year price increase: 74%

'A' for effort. :pet:

Ah but. The term Golden Triangle is associated with Mancheshire.The earliest reference to the term "Golden Triangle" I can find refrences the 18-19 century slave trade route from Liverpool to Goree to the West Indies and Americas then back to Liverpool. Ships would leave the Mersey with pots, pans, knives, ag-implements, trinkets etc., which would be traded for human beings which in turn would suffer the middle passage to be traded, on the western shores of the Atlantic and islands of the Caribbean, for sugar, spices, rum, tobacco, cotton etc., which would then be carried back to Liverpool and sold for profit. And a good profit it was, making the shipowners very wealthy indeed and the port and city of Liverpool into the "Second City of the Empire. The route was dubbed the 'Golden Triangle'. Trumps your Mancheshire by a few centuries and the fact it was the hated Liverpool that coined the phrase must be doubly galling to you.:lol:

The earliest reference to the term "Golden Triangle" I can find refrences the 18-19 century slave trade route from Liverpool to Goree to the West Indies and Americas the back to Liverpool. Ships would leave the Mersey with pots, pans, knives, ag-implements, trinkets etc., which would be traded for human beings which in turn would suffer the middle passage to be traded for sugar, spices, rum, cotton etc., which would then be carried back to Liverpool and sold for profit. And a good profit it was, making the shipowners very wealthy indeed and the port and city of Liverpool into the "Second City of the Empire. The route was dubbed the 'Golden Triangle'. Trumps your Mancheshire by a few centuries and the fact it was the hated Liverpool that coined the phrase must be doubly galling to you.:lol:

Gosh!

Now there's a claim to fame.

200 years on and he's still......(fill in as appropriate)

How's business ATM? Are you still redirecting air passengers. :goodbye:

Now there's a claim to fame.Another "claim to fame" is the word SKYSCRAPER which has Liverpool mercantile origins. The word refered to the top-most sail on a clipper rigged ship. When the ship was rolling in a heavy swell the sail would look as if it was "scraping" the sky. Hence the term SKYSCRAPER.

Don't you just hate that Liverpool.:rofl:

Is there anything from today, 29th April 2011, that you are proud of in Liverpool or does everything date back a couple of hundred years?

Is there anything from today, 29th April 2011, that you are proud of in Liverpool or does everything date back a couple of hundred years?Yes, there is: The 'Roy Castle Institute into Lung Cancer Research' the only institute in the world dedicated solely to the research and treatment of lung cancer, one of the three deadliest variations of the disease. The 'Liverpool University School of Tropical Medicine' the worlds leader into the research for a cure and eradication of the third worlds biggest killer, Malaria. Shall I go on?

If you so chose.

Just it normally seems that the proud boasts of many on here, especially those from Liverpool, relate to events that happened well before any of us were ever alive, or as your latest examples show, have practically zero impact on the average person who lives in Liverpool.

Still, different people are proud of different things. Live and let live and all that.

I'm especially proud of the Grand National,it's a National institution and goes out to over half a Billion audience annually,it's got a long history but it's as big as it ever was,I love it.:)

Can I just remind you that Leeds looks MUCH more like Manchester than it does Leeds.

:s

If you so chose.

Just it normally seems that the proud boasts of many on here, especially those from Liverpool, relate to events that happened well before any of us were ever alive, or as your latest examples show, have practically zero impact on the average person who lives in Liverpool.

Still, different people are proud of different things. Live and let live and all that.



No more baffling than working class football fans having pride in a bunch of low brow footballers indulging in a "build the most stupid looking house" competition away from the area that employs them.

Jesus. It's pride in one room pride in the next. At least in this thread I can pretty safely say - you're all idiots. x

Nothing wrong with a bit of civic pride, and stop calling me Jesus.

Maybe. It isn't as disturbing as an imaginary affinity with everyone you've never met in an entire country I suppose. But it's still stupid. Come on guys there are better things to be getting on with, ignore jesus.

Still, different people are proud of different things. Live and let live and all that.My post had nothing, whatsoever to do with "pride" it was to do with the outlandish, and false statements by another Manc. The statement, by JRB, that the term "Golden Triangle" was exclusively associated with "Mancheshire" was/is patently false. But Mancs, in every capacity, are prone to using dodgy data to inflate the place. Examples: Man United founded in 1878 when everyone knows that it was the Newton Heath club that holds that founding date. In fact it was not until 1902, when Newton Heath declared bancruptcy that some of the directors along with new investors formed into the club we now know as Manchester United. Also, the Halle bills it's self as the UK "oldest concert orchestra" when we know it was founded by Charles Fredrik Halle, a one time pianist employed, years before, by the Liverpool Philharmonic Society.

Not pride LNG, just honesty.

Those maps show perfectly well that Brum's got the most affluent suburb so close to its city centre out of all the core cities - that suburb is Edgbaston. It's the large blue area just SW of the centre.

My post had nothing, whatsoever to do with "pride" it was to do with the outlandish, and false statements by another Manc. The statement, by JRB, that the term "Golden Triangle" was exclusively associated with "Mancheshire" was/is patently false. But Mancs, in every capacity, are prone to using dodgy data to inflate the place. Examples: Man United founded in 1878 when everyone knows that it was the Newton Heath club that holds that founding date. In fact it was not until 1902, when Newton Heath declared bancruptcy that some of the directors along with new investors formed into the club we now know as Manchester United. Also, the Halle bills it's self as the UK "oldest concert orchestra" when we know it was founded by Charles Fredrik Halle, a one time pianist employed, years before, by the Liverpool Philharmonic Society.

Not pride LNG, just honesty.

I/it realy get's to you doen't it Sloyne. :lol:

This is what I wrote.

Ah but. The term Golden Triangle is associated with Mancheshire.

Not this.

Golden Triangle" was exclusively associated with "Mancheshire

Sloyne's play on words strikes once again.

I've lost count of the amount of times you've claimed Liverpool's exclusivity when it comes to history and it's achievements.(as long as it was 200 years ago) They just roll off your keyboard.

Fair play to you though Sloyne. When it comes to redirecting air passengers away from Manchester Airport, you're exclusively associated with that. :cheers:

And just to recap. The term Golden Trinagle may apply to other area's in the UK, but it's firmly assocaited with Mancheshire(that really has got to Sloyne), more than other any other area. So much so, that they even made a TV drama about it. (it was so good, it flopped instantly)

Taken from the Daily Fail, so it must be true. Arf!

WELCOME TO CHESHIRE WIVES More millionaires per square mile than anywhere in Britain. Champagne selling out at [pounds sterling]300 per bottle. Lamborghinis parked outside the pizza parlours. As Cheshire's Golden Triangle gets its own TV drama, the truth about the place that's more Dosh and Sex than Posh and Becks; cheshire;britain;finance;wealth;millionaires.

Just a final on Sloyne.

that the term "Golden Triangle" was exclusively associated with "Mancheshire" was/is patently false. But Mancs, in every capacity, are prone to using dodgy data to inflate the place

Work it out for yourselfs.

Very poor journalism. What's worse is some people actually believe it.

Very poor journalism. What's worse is some people actually believe it.

Luckily I don't believe a word of it Boards. Hence the term, the Daily Fail. Then again, some part of it may be true? I'm always open to every opinion. Even yours.

PS. It's not like you to pop up every now and again to fire a broadside.

:lol: Aye, what a bastard

It is absurd though they can actually print something like that.

Try comparing Leeds to cities like Brighton and Bristol (cities much more similar in size to Leeds than Manchester, Liverpool and Birmingham). You will find that compared to other cities of similar size Leeds is actually not very wealthy whatsoever.



Bristol, yes, but Brighton? You're off your rocker. Brighton itself has a population of about 155,000, whilst the city of Brighton & Hove unitary authority is about 256,000.

Lol it was just LNGcats (aka the banned Metrolink) trying to troll

Brighton is about a third the size of Leeds. I compare Brighton with Leeds.

Leeds is about a third the size of Manchester. 10123 compares Leeds with Manchester.

Yet you don't acuse 10123 of being a troll.

Odd.

Brighton is about a third the size of Leeds. I compare Brighton with Leeds.

Leeds is about a third the size of Manchester. 10123 compares Leeds with Manchester.

Yet you don't acuse 10123 of being a troll.

Odd.

It isn't just about size though, is it. Leeds and Manchester have similarities in terms of their functions, economies and urban patterns. They are also both Core Cities.

Brighton, on the other hand, is a very different urban pattern, and differs in that it is both a major coastal resort and commuter settlement of London, as opposed to a post-industrial city turned business hub.

If you want to compare Brighton with similar places, consider Weston Super Mare, Blackpool, Southend and Bournemouth, not Leeds.

Why is Metrolink constantly banned by the way? Whilst he is argumentative, picky and annoying, so are plenty of other forumers!

Brighton is about a third the size of Leeds. I compare Brighton with Leeds.

Leeds is about a third the size of Manchester. 10123 compares Leeds with Manchester.

Yet you don't acuse 10123 of being a troll.

Odd.

:rofl: do you really think Brighton is in the same league as Leeds?

Leeds is is just like every other core city in the UK, non of the core cities are ahead of each other in a big way, they all have their strengths and weaknesses, saying Leeds isn't up there with Manchester is rubbish in some ways its ahead of Manchester, and in others not so much, it works like that with all of them, it's only London which it doesn't you can't compare London with Manchester, liverpool, Leeds or Birmingham. Londons steps ahead of all the core cities, whereas the core cities are basically all on a more similar level so they can be more fairly compared, but just like everything in life theres always pros and cons, where one city does well another city does bad.

Brighton is about a third the size of Leeds. I compare Brighton with Leeds.

Leeds is about a third the size of Manchester. 10123 compares Leeds with Manchester.

Yet you don't acuse 10123 of being a troll.

Odd.

:hammer:


The size of the city is irrelevant.

Going by your ideology Leeds is doing extremely well considering it will be ahead of Manchester in retail, has more major law firms...........

:hammer:


The size of the city is irrelevant.

Going by your ideology Leeds is doing extremely well considering it will be ahead of Manchester in retail, has more major law firms...........

Funny that, I have a friend who's an accountant who said that a lot of the major law firms were moving out of Leeds now. I'll try and see where they got the stat from ...

:rofl: do you really think Brighton is in the same league as Leeds?


No.

Very similar relationship to that of Leeds and Manchester.

:hammer:


The size of the city is irrelevant.

Going by your ideology Leeds is doing extremely well considering it will be ahead of Manchester in retail, has more major law firms...........

Yes, Brighton has and more tourism jobs and such like.

Reading a similar sized city to Leeds with no doubt have many more well paid (not helpdesk) IT staff. So what?

Different city.

Brighton is to Leeds what Leeds is to Manchester. All different, none better than the other, just different no matter how much to try to pretend otherwise.

It isn't just about size though, is it. Leeds and Manchester have similarities in terms of their functions, economies and urban patterns. They are also both Core Cities.

Brighton, on the other hand, is a very different urban pattern, and differs in that it is both a major coastal resort and commuter settlement of London, as opposed to a post-industrial city turned business hub.

If you want to compare Brighton with similar places, consider Weston Super Mare, Blackpool, Southend and Bournemouth, not Leeds.

totally agree with that, in terms of functions, economies, and offering leeds and manchester are similar, and to an extent all of the core cities are. The history from industrial centres to post industrial decline, inner city rings of deprivation based on terrace houses were workers lived, through to re-emmergence as financial and service centre economies is startlingly similar too. folowed by the renaiisance of city living and city centre rejuvenation, to becoming the core for commerce, retail, leisure, nightlife and business services, and empoyment hub for the entire wider urban area, as indeed the wider metropolitan area, with both's economic reach and employment pool and offering being virtually the same.

however, that is neither here or there. In the context of what was being discussed about deprivation levels, metrolink's assertion was that larger urban areas will have a greater proportion of deprivation or a greater depth of deprivation. This assertion was shown to be false, as both liverpool and manchester's urban areas show this the most, not london, or birmingham.

and yet the figures for the GVA of Greater Manchester south (the urban part of Manchester) are higher than they are for the Leeds Local Authority - that includes the rich countryside area.

Agree there is plenty of poverty in Manchester, for some reason you seem to fail to accept that overall the wealth is pretty much the same, as such there must be equally as many rich people in Manchester relative to Leeds than there are poor to balance out the overall economy.

Anyway - why do you fixate on Manchester all the time?

Surely if you want to compare Leeds to a successful, similar sized city with a similar economy you would look to Bristol? A city with much higher wages, higher wealth and lower levels of deprevation than any northern city.


P.S. More people live in London, below the official government poverty level than live in the entireity of Greater Manchester. Not sure what that means or how it ties in with your ideas about poverty etc. Also, Birmingham has the highest levels of unemployment and welfare dependancy following the recession in some parts of the city. Not trying to use this to big up where I live as many on here as some seem to try to by using others peoples misfortune to big up their own locality, rather to point out that your simplistic view of the world is just that.

and yet the figures for the GVA of Greater Manchester south (the urban part of Manchester)

GMS is not the urban part of manchester. It's the richer half of greater manchester. What most would describe as 'manchester' would roughly equate to everything inside the m60. This would include significant chunks of the poorer Greater Manchester North NUTS3.

... are higher than they are for the Leeds Local Authority

yet GVA per head of the exclusively richer portion of manchester (GMS) is 22.9k per capita, the same as Leeds MD which includes an even mix of poor and affluent areas.

:hammer:


The size of the city is irrelevant.

Going by your ideology Leeds is doing extremely well considering it will be ahead of Manchester in retail, has more major law firms...........

10123 is off again on one of his delusional boasts.

Leeds is doing extremely well considering it will be ahead of Manchester in retail

As of 2010. http://www.caci.co.uk/492.aspx

Experian 2009 retail rankings.(can't find 2010) http://www.nottinghamcity.gov.uk/CHttpHandler.ashx?id=7599&p=0

It seems your splendid shopping arcades(yes I did write that) aren't helpinng Leeds up that table.

Omitted from those surveys is the Avenue in Spinningfields, which is currently filling up and having stores fitted out.

Oh I nearly forgot. John Lewis is looking for a site in the city centre. http://menmedia.co.uk/manchestereveningnews/news/s/1419098_john-lewis-searching-for-site-to-open-major-store-in-manchester

That would give us a flush. kendals(House of Fraser), Selfridges, Harvey Nics and John Lewis, all in the city centre and within walking distance of each other.

In a nut shell. When it comes to shopping, Manchester pisses all over Leeds, From the Avenue/Spinningfields, to Bridge Street, to King Street, to Deansgate, to St Annes Square, to Cathedral Street, to Exchange Square, to the revamped Arndale, to Market Street, to Afflecks Palace, to the NQ, and to the numerous department stores. Let's throw in the much loved Trafford Centre :nuts: as well for good measure.

You really are talking s*** once again 10123.

As for law firms. As I've stated on numerous occasions(hallo!), law firms in Leeds regardless of the amount, have no impact whatsoever on Manchester or on it's law firms. (how many times?)

Come back to us when Leeds has got one of these.

http://www.euroclad.com/media/2291/facades_mcjc.jpg

Also.

73.We detected a feeling in Leeds that the North East is in danger of losing out to Manchester and the North West. This is understandable, but not, we trust, justified

Appendix K. http://www.judiciary.gov.uk/publications-and-reports/reports/general/justice-outside-london/index/birmingham-manchester-leeds.htm

No doubt 10123 will now move onto banking and then crime once again. :blahblah:

10123 is off again on one of his delusional boasts.



Experian 2009 retail rankings.(can't find 2010) ....
In a nut shell. When it comes to shopping, Manchester pisses all over Leeds,
You really are talking s*** once again 10123.

As for law firms. As I've stated on numerous occasions(hallo!), law firms in Leeds regardless of the amount, have no impact whatsoever on Manchester or on it's law firms. (how many times?)

10123's assertion was correct though. Once trinity is complete (its currently under construction), it will push leeds back up to being ahead of manchester in the retail rankings as it was before. also Leeds still currently has the largest number of big law firms outside london (followed by birmingham), with the highest fee earnings outside london too (ie bigger corporate deals). Whether this changes in a few years who knows.

suggesting 10123 is delusional is of the mark, especially considering, that out of both two posts (yours and his), yours is vastly more delusional in each and every sentence.

That would give us a flush. kendals(House of Fraser), Selfridges, Harvey Nics and John Lewis, all in the city centre and within walking distance of each other.

except, 99% of all designer brands are found in both cities, whether it be in big boxy department stores, or beautifil ornate chic glazed victorian arcades crammed with designer bootiques. And when it comes to the bog standard shopping, give me pedestrianised victorian streets over an 80s mall any day.

Why is Metrolink constantly banned by the way? Whilst he is argumentative, picky and annoying, so are plenty of other forumers!

Partly because he creates multiple accounts. Obviously now he gets banned for this, but previously would have one account then disappear for a while and return under another alias despite the other account being open.

Dejav JRB ?!?!?

What I posted is true, when Trinity is complete Leeds will be ahead of Manchester in retail. By then the £650M Eastagate development will be under way which is another 1M Sq f.t to add to the list (Which also includes a John Lewis).

Yes Leeds is missing a Selfridges, personally I would like one in Leeds. Would I trade it for VQ? Certainly not. I'm sure you would trade all those 'flush' stores for a slice of VQ ;) which by the way has a number of European exclusives. Oh... and when Trinity is completed there will be a number of exclusives too, such as D&D restaurants, they operate the most famous restaurants exclusively in London, Tokyo, Paris, New York and now Leeds. We are been spoiled by two new D&D's designed by Conran and partners. Plus the new Everyman boutique cinema, the first outside of the South East.

And yes Leeds has bigger and better firms of solicitors than Manchester, granted the difference in the Legal side isn't too different between Manchester but we still have a higher number of world class law firms. And we why would they have some of The bank of England offices in Leeds, surely Manchester would be suitable? Naah

Yeah but will "Trinity" be upmarket, boutique-type stores like we're seeing a big boom of here in Manchester in the NQ and at Spinningfields or are they just going to be crap, shitty high street chains like Boots and Tesco? :ohno:

Boutique = unique and unique, if successful, is what brings in the tourists.

Nobody will come from far and wide to go to TK Maxx, no matter how many of them you cram into your city.

Yeah but will "Trinity" be upmarket, boutique-type stores like we're seeing a big boom of here in Manchester in the NQ and at Spinningfields or are they just going to be crap, shitty high street chains like Boots and Tesco? :ohno:

Boutique = unique and unique, if successful, is what brings in the tourists.

Nobody will come from far and wide to go to TK Maxx, no matter how many of them you cram into your city.

Its split into two sections, Trinity East and Trinity West. Both separate buildings, and both catering to different audiences.

So yeah East (I think) will cater to the more average stores, that you would expect in most shopping centres, so Primark/Boots/M&S.

While West includes the exclusives (D&D, Everyman, Apple store etc).

E'en so though, on a bright summer's day, how many people do you think will want to shop in a hot, stuffy, (grim, in the case of the Arndale), shopping mall while the sun shines outside, reflecting off all the beautiful victorian buildings?

I'd rather shop around in St Anne's Square, Spinningfields and the central area rather than in the Arndale, any day!

Also:

"when Trinity is complete Leeds will be ahead of Manchester in retail"

But are you doing a Leeds-forumer border-fetish special and just including Manchester borough or is this including the Lowry in Salford and the Trafford Centre in Trafford?

10123's assertion was correct though. Once trinity is complete (its currently under construction), it will push leeds back up to being ahead of manchester in the retail rankings as it was before. also Leeds still currently has the largest number of big law firms outside london (followed by birmingham), with the highest fee earnings outside london too (ie bigger corporate deals). Whether this changes in a few years who knows.

suggesting 10123 is delusional is of the mark, especially considering, that out of both two posts (yours and his), yours is vastly more delusional in each and every sentence.



except, 99% of all designer brands are found in both cities, whether it be in big boxy department stores, or beautifil ornate chic glazed victorian arcades crammed with designer bootiques. And when it comes to the bog standard shopping, give me pedestrianised victorian streets over an 80s mall any day.

it will push leeds back up to being ahead of manchester in the retail rankings as it was before

And how do you know that Wiggs? Do you write the reports? When that time comes, and when the reports state that, then I will believe it. I certainly won't be taking your word for it. Your track record speaks volumes. Remember?

10123, you, etc, keep on going on about law firms in Leeds. As has been stated on numerous occasions, that claim/boast has no impact on Manchester whatsoever. Why can't you get the simple fact into your heads?

Manchester does very, very, well when it comes to law. Apart from having numerous law firms, law schools(just like Leeds), it also has the Civil Justice Centre. Something Leeds can only dream of.

Opened on 24 October 2007, the Manchester Civil Justice Centre is the biggest court complex to be built in the UK since the Royal Courts of Justice in London 1868-82

The building provides accommodation of around 34,000m² on 15 levels. It houses 47 courtrooms, 75 consultation rooms, in addition to office and support space.

As for my post being delusional compared to 10123's. Please. It's obvious to anyone with half a brain(don't include yourself) that Manchester has a much better and diverse shopping experience. I know it, you know it, and so does he. It's just that neither of you can bring yourselfs to admit it.

PS. Glad to see your back on your charger Wiggs. :horse: We've missed your......(fill in as appropriate) input.

Level it Wiggs. It's going nowhere. PM your Leeds pet poddle 10123 and tell him to give the Manchester bashing a rest. The shit is sticking to his fur, and apart from the smell, he isn't looking good or coming across well.

Partly because he creates multiple accounts. Obviously now he gets banned for this, but previously would have one account then disappear for a while and return under another alias despite the other account being open.

Who has been banned?

Maybe you could tell me the account names so I can see who they are?

10123's assertion was correct though. Once trinity is complete (its currently under construction), it will push leeds back up to being ahead of manchester in the retail rankings as it was before..


Manchester or Manchester City Centre?

Are you really claiming that Leeds will ever have more retail spend that the whole of Manchester :lol:

Next thing you will be telling us that the Trafford Centre is not in Manchester:nuts:

^^

S'what I just said :)

^^

S'what I just said :)

Indeed. I am a slow reader :D

Think the Leeds contingent are just slow overall.

Oh and before you do start kicking up shit about your border fetishes and how Trafford & Salford are actually a million miles away from Manchester with vast swathes of countryside in between them, I'll just ask you to read out the name on the top of these Market Stalls which appeared in the Lowry Plaza at Salford Quays in, err, oh yeah, Salford.

http://i581.photobucket.com/albums/ss255/trakkie/P5020051.jpg

Funny that, I thought Salford was in a different dimension to Manchester?

Indeed. I am a slow reader :D

Think the Leeds contingent are just slow overall.


They're coming up with more shit-stirring facts to excel themselves up to something they're not (a city that compares with the likes of Manchester and Birmingham)

E'en so though, on a bright summer's day, how many people do you think will want to shop in a hot, stuffy, (grim, in the case of the Arndale), shopping mall while the sun shines outside, reflecting off all the beautiful victorian buildings?



thats why both trinity and eastgate both have central open glazed atriums and stick to the street grid plan

Dejav JRB ?!?!?

What I posted is true, when Trinity is complete Leeds will be ahead of Manchester in retail. By then the £650M Eastagate development will be under way which is another 1M Sq f.t to add to the list (Which also includes a John Lewis).

Yes Leeds is missing a Selfridges, personally I would like one in Leeds. Would I trade it for VQ? Certainly not. I'm sure you would trade all those 'flush' stores for a slice of VQ ;) which by the way has a number of European exclusives. Oh... and when Trinity is completed there will be a number of exclusives too, such as D&D restaurants, they operate the most famous restaurants exclusively in London, Tokyo, Paris, New York and now Leeds. We are been spoiled by two new D&D's designed by Conran and partners. Plus the new Everyman boutique cinema, the first outside of the South East.

And yes Leeds has bigger and better firms of solicitors than Manchester, granted the difference in the Legal side isn't too different between Manchester but we still have a higher number of world class law firms. And we why would they have some of The bank of England offices in Leeds, surely Manchester would be suitable? Naah

And how many years is that away 10123?

Do you honestly think Manchester's retail offering will stay stagnat until then? Not a chance.

A huge expansion is planned by the Trafford Centre’s new owners. Add a further 300,000 sq ft of retail space planned for the COOP's City centre Noma district, and Leeds might, just might, match Manchester with it's planned additional 1mill sq ft of retail space.

I won't hold my breath.

I'm interested in why they are so fixated in comparing EVERYTHING to Manchester.

I bet not one of them will ever even think in their heads about whether Bristol or Leeds has the largest media sector will they?

Why not?

Is it any more interesting that the 'fact' that they ALWAYS come out with that Leeds has more barristers than Manchester or Birmingham or Mexico City or whatever their nonesense irrelevant claim is today?

No, because they are fixated with a city that they see as something to aspire to. For whatever reason they feel threatened by what they consider Manchester to be and feel they need to knock it at all oppurtunity when the reality is what goes on in Manchester has practically zero affect on the lives of anyone in Leeds and should be a total side issue for them.

And how many years is that away 10123?

Do you honestly think Manchester's retail offering will stay stagnat until then?

10123 thinks that Leeds in 2025 will be better than Manchester in 2011 - god knows why, in fact, god knows why he cares so much as it clearly won't.

thats why both trinity and eastgate both have central open glazed atriums and stick to the street grid plan

Yet again though, purpose-built shopping centres such as the Rock in Bury, or streets lined with a mix of Victorian & Georgian buildings, set out in a parade-form with shops on either side of a bustling, pedestrianised street? Boutique shops. Maybe the odd Tesco Express or whatever, but primarily unique brands.

I know which one I would choose.

I. why don't they ever discuss current or future projects?

The wheels on the bus go round and round.

In no particualr order.

Crime.
Law.
Banking.

Or.

In no particular order.

Law.
Banking.
Crime.

Or.

In no particualr order.

Banking.
Crime.
Law.
Shopping arcades.(just for 10123)

:nuts:

E'en so though, on a bright summer's day, how many people do you think will want to shop in a hot, stuffy, (grim, in the case of the Arndale), shopping mall while the sun shines outside, reflecting off all the beautiful victorian buildings?

I'd rather shop around in St Anne's Square, Spinningfields and the central area rather than in the Arndale, any day!

Trinity isn't a proper shopping center, in a sense that it isn't enclosed, its open plan. Basically instead of having a large glass frontage to the entrance there isn't one. Its done out the same as an arcade and leads on several streets, which is why on a hot day trinity will be fine. As long as the endless glass roof doesn't act as a green house :nuts:

http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4129/5007861947_532cdab95f_b.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/guardianleeds/5007861947/) Leeds Trinity (http://www.flickr.com/photos/guardianleeds/5007861947/) by guardian.leeds (http://www.flickr.com/people/guardianleeds/), on Flickr

but never, in no particular order...

Media
Transport
Rate of office development

or


Transport
Media
Rate of office development

or

Rate of office development
Transport
Media

Trinity isn't a proper shopping center.

So are you including just Manchester city centre or all of Manchester in your retail comparison?

I am guessing most people in Manchester find that they have access to both the city centre Selfrdiges and the one in the Trafford Centre for what it is worth so I would be very surprised if you were to only count one.

Trinity isn't a proper shopping center, in a sense that it isn't enclosed, its open plan. Basically instead of having a large glass frontage to the entrance there isn't one. Its done out the same as an arcade and leads on several streets, which is why on a hot day trinity will be fine. As long as the endless glass roof doesn't act as a green house :nuts:




Looks similar to Bury Rock:

http://www.bdp.com/Global/Projects/The%20Rock,%20Bury/04_the-rock-bury_ext.jpg

There's a competitor for Leeds! Bury!

Actually no wait. Bury has better transport and is probably even better well known worldwide than Leeds :lol:

And how do you know that Wiggs? Do you write the reports? When that time comes, and when the reports state that, then I will believe it. I certainly won't be taking your word for it.

it is according to caci themselves, who have taken into account all new schemes coming for all cities. they themselves say when trinity is complete leeds will jump back to 4th place, behind london, glasgow and birmingham.

10123, you, etc, keep on going on about law firms in Leeds. As has been stated on numerous occasions, that claim/boast has no impact on Manchester whatsoever. Why can't you get the simple fact into your heads?

10123 mentioned law firms and retails due to hilarious comparison with brighton. In the sense that, Leeds having more larger law firms and a retail ranking that will return to being higher than that of leeds is not bad for a city that allegedly should be getting compared to brighton, not manchester. :nuts:

that leeds' legal clout may or may not have an impact on manchester (and vice versa) is neither here nor there. Altho it's clear it does. If Leeds wasnt getting the highest fee earners with the biggest corporate deals, and the most number of of big law firms, then its certain that manchester would have,

As for my post being delusional compared to 10123's. Please. It's obvious to anyone with half a brain(don't include yourself) that Manchester has a much better and diverse shopping experience. I know it, you know it, and so does he. It's just that neither of you can bring yourselfs to admit it.

even thought they both have 95% of the same designer clothes and brands. the only difference is that manchester has much more of that in dedicated boxed in department stores or malls, whilst leeds has them in chic designer boutiques along beaitiful glazed victorian arcades, along with a compact victorian pedestrianised heart. I find it funny that it is you who is asserting that the boxy malls manchester experience is vastly superior and that anyone who disagrees and says they are just different but the same is "delusional". look in the mirror and see what you are saying. Its almost like anyone who disagrees with your delusional inflated view based entirely on your own subjective viewpoint must be delusional. It dont make sense lol

Manchester or Manchester City Centre?

Are you really claiming that Leeds will ever have more retail spend that the whole of Manchester :lol:

Next thing you will be telling us that the Trafford Centre is not in Manchester:nuts:

No. All such retail ranking reports (of which leeds will be ahead of manchester like it was before) are based on city centre's. They have seperate reports for out of town shopping malls.

and yet miles more retail money is spent in Manchester than Leeds eh wiggles.

In fact, I bet Bristol is about the same as Leeds retail wise. I be Cabbots Circus probably takes the total Bristol spend right up to Leeds' total spend given the similar population and greater wealth in Bristol.

No. All such retail ranking reports (of which leeds will be ahead of manchester like it was before) are based on city centre's. They have seperate reports for out of town shopping malls.

So you are hoping that one day Leeds may overtake HALF of Manchester retail offering :lol:

Genius.

Such high hopes!!!

So are you including just Manchester city centre or all of Manchester in your retail comparison?

I am guessing most people in Manchester find that they have access to both the city centre Selfrdiges and the one in the Trafford Centre for what it is worth so I would be very surprised if you were to only count one.

Ask the developers they are the ones saying it

Trinity Leeds is expected to catapult Leeds from seventh to fourth place in the UK retail rankings surpassing Manchester when it opens in spring 2013.

even thought they both have 95% of the same designer clothes and brands. the only difference is that manchester has much more of that in dedicated boxed in department stores or malls, whilst leeds has them in chic designer boutiques along beaitiful glazed victorian arcades, along with a compact victorian pedestrianised heart. I find it funny that it is you who is asserting that the boxy malls manchester experience is vastly superior and that anyone who disagrees and says they are just different but the same is "delusional". look in the mirror and see what you are saying. Its almost like anyone who disagrees with your delusional inflated view based entirely on your own subjective viewpoint must be delusional. It dont make sense lol

Difference is though is that Manchester has a whole city centre district devoted to "chic, boutique shops". Baring in mind the Northern Quarter is probably about the size of Leeds' whole city centre, Manchester also has the crappy high street brands in the form of Market Street and the Arndale.

Don't think that Leeds is the only city with boutique shops when Manchester is overloaded with them.

Ask the developers they are the ones saying it

Trinity Leeds is expected to catapult Leeds from seventh to fourth place in the UK retail rankings surpassing Manchester when it opens in spring 2013.



Right, so the marketing bumpf from a company with a vested interest in selling shop space is the source for your information - excellent.

By the way - 7th today in 2011. About right I would have thought.

How about we wait until 2013 and see if Leeds has caught up with HALF of the Manchester retail offereing then eh?

No. All such retail ranking reports (of which leeds will be ahead of manchester like it was before) are based on city centre's. They have seperate reports for out of town shopping malls.

LMFAO!

This is a fucking joke, isn't it?

Seriously, please let it be a joke.

Greater Manchester, then, pisses all over Leeds and West Yorkshire. There's another win for Manchester over Leeds.

Next. What's it gonna be? Transport? Go on, have a crack at it.

They're coming up with more shit-stirring facts to excel themselves up to something they're not (a city that compares with the likes of Manchester and Birmingham)

have you missed the last 300 pages? it consists 75% of mostly JRB, and a small contigent of other manchester forumers just posting over inflated ego posts about manchester, then getting upset when other forumers point out the delusions or when other forumers rebut false assertions about leeds. JRB and said forumers then divert from said rubuttals by ironically asserting that by leeds forumers countering said bullcrap about manchester, that they must be trying to big up leeds and are just shit stirring. Its hilarious.

We're not getting upset because of our "over-ego", we're getting pissed off with Leeds trying to big itself up. Seriously, how would you feel if Bournemouth started saying it had better financial services and better retail than Leeds? That's how we feel at the moment.

Fucking yokels.

Just found this on the New York Times homepage:

http://travel.nytimes.com/2011/05/01/travel/01nextstop-manchester.html?pagewanted=1&hpw

When was Leeds last featured in the New York Times travel section? :nuts:

Who has bigged up Manchester tonight?

Maybe you could point me to the relevant post number?

All I can see if Leeds forumers determined to make EVERY single comparison with Manchester for some reason. Totally fixated on the place.

I'm interested in why they are so fixated in comparing EVERYTHING to Manchester.

I bet not one of them will ever even think in their heads about whether Bristol or Leeds has the largest media sector will they?

Why not?

Is it any more interesting that the 'fact' that they ALWAYS come out with that Leeds has more barristers than Manchester or Birmingham or Mexico City or whatever their nonesense irrelevant claim is today?

No, because they are fixated with a city that they see as something to aspire to. For whatever reason they feel threatened by what they consider Manchester to be and feel they need to knock it at all oppurtunity when the reality is what goes on in Manchester has practically zero affect on the lives of anyone in Leeds and should be a total side issue for them.

Or, just maybe, it could be that most of the over inflated bull crap on this thread is 95% of the time from manchester forumers, who whilst spouting said bullcrap make false assertions about other cities, then get upset when forumers from those other cities pop in occasionallly and counter those false assertions.

As an example... when JRB et al post one of their standard posts such as "manchester is miles ahead in every aspect from XYZ compared to the other cities", when someone from leeds points out that that is not entirely true and as an example leeds is ahead in .... ,those leeds forumers are not trying to assert leeds is top notch, they are merely disagreeing with the obsessive continuous delusional over inflated ego posts by the manchester lot. THIS is why most posts relate back to manchester.

Wiggles, show me which post someone from Manchester has done that tonight then?

Which post in particular are you talking about?

I could direct you to any one of 10123s who commits the exact crime you talk about yet you seem to ignore that - odd.

As I said before, how would you (Leeds forumers) feel if Bournemouth started claiming it was bigger than Leeds and had better financial services and retail than Leeds? That's how we (Manchester, Birmingham etc) feel about Leeds.

The real question here is.

Who are you?

Indeed.

Tonight alone 10123 has been posting very spurious claims about retail offerings and law firms.

When Manc's challenge them they are bigging up Manchester.

When Leeds forumers challenge claims by Manc forumers that is perfectly acceptable as Manc's are always over egging Manchester.

Is that how you see if wiggles?

Yet again though, purpose-built shopping centres such as the Rock in Bury, or streets lined with a mix of Victorian & Georgian buildings, set out in a parade-form with shops on either side of a bustling, pedestrianised street? Boutique shops. Maybe the odd Tesco Express or whatever, but primarily unique brands.

I know which one I would choose.

Yes, the one that leeds has, and manchester doesnt.

It's leeds whose retail experience is primarily the unique chic victorian arcades packed with boutique stores, and the pedestrianised victorian streets.

its machester whose primary retail experience is in an enclosed 80s mall, with designer gear in enclosed boxy department stores.

the only difference is that leeds will now have an added focus on a new mall aswell, ecept that mall wont be an 80s style arndale, it will be street grid glazed over atriums.

Is wiggles bigging up Leeds again :lol:

Surely breaking his own rules on how Manc's should behave on this forum?

Wiggles, which posts have Manc's been over egging Manchester tonight?

Yes, the one that leeds has, and manchester doesnt.

It's leeds whose retail experience is primarily the unique chic victorian arcades packed with boutique stores, and the pedestrianised victorian streets.

its machester whose primary retail experience is in an enclosed 80s mall, with designer gear in enclosed boxy department stores.

the only difference is that leeds will now have an added focus on a new mall aswell, ecept that mall wont be an 80s style arndale, it will be street grid glazed over atriums.

The Northern Quarter in itself if probably bigger than Leeds' city centre as a whole, so I think Manchester is the clear winner in boutique-style shops tar-va-much.

I hate the Arndale, so that's why I (and many others) avoid it at all costs.

Do you not think that this new "Trinity" or whatever it is is basically what many cities were building in the 80's? In-town shopping centres with "glazed over atriums"? Hmm.

if you say so. its why my other half (from manchester) prefers that we shop in leeds, simply because its much nicer, even if 98% of the brands available are the same

So more people prefer Leeds to Manchester and the retail spend in 2011 is much higher there then?

I love the great range of Chinese supermarkets you can find in Leeds.

Sorry, I meant Manchester.

Difference is though is that Manchester has a whole city centre district devoted to "chic, boutique shops". Baring in mind the Northern Quarter is probably about the size of Leeds' whole city centre, Manchester also has the crappy high street brands in the form of Market Street and the Arndale.

Don't think that Leeds is the only city with boutique shops when Manchester is overloaded with them.

if you say so. its why my other half (from manchester) prefers that we shop in leeds, simply because its much nicer, even if 98% of the brands available are the same

wiggles - your inability to back 13138 suggests you make it up as you go along.

Surely not.

if you say so. its why my other half (from manchester) prefers that we shop in leeds, simply because its much nicer, even if 98% of the brands available are the same

You have a girlfriend/boyfriend in Manchester? Bit long distance isn't it? (Not dissing and not meaning to get personal)

As LNG brought up, does Leeds have one of the largest china towns in Europe?

(two chinese restaurants in "Trinity" doesn't count)

LMFAO!

This is a fucking joke, isn't it?

Seriously, please let it be a joke.

Greater Manchester, then, pisses all over Leeds and West Yorkshire. There's another win for Manchester over Leeds.

Next. What's it gonna be? Transport? Go on, have a crack at it.

Its a "fucking" joke that all the retail ranking groups rank city centres? Seems the correct thing to do if comparing different city centres and their retail offering.

Of course, if, as it seems you are wanting to look at purey retail spend based on a constructed area, such as greater manchester, then naturally a larger metropolitan county should have a larger retail spend of individual retail centres combined then a smaller area such as west yorkshire. Not sure what you are trying to proove or what an addition of multiple centres actually shows. Altho ironically as absurd as such an aggregation that you insist on doing is, i would imagine retail spend of all combined retail centres within west yorks is higher than that or the same as greater manchester. Huddersfied, wakefield and bradford all have large retail centres bigger than bury or oldham, or wigan or other retail cores within GM. Halifax, castleford, and pontefract are also large.

We're not getting upset because of our "over-ego", we're getting pissed off with Leeds trying to big itself up. Seriously, how would you feel if Bournemouth started saying it had better financial services and better retail than Leeds? That's how we feel at the moment.

Fucking yokels.


But why are Leeds forumers even mentioning leeds financial clout? When directly countering over inflated ego comments by manchester forumers who are asserting that manchester beats everywhere else at everything (when it doesnt). By showing that it doesnt, not for one minute are leeds forumers trying to big leeds up (none really give a shit), what they do give a shit about is countering the continual obsessive 300 pages full of manchester forumers posting over inflated delusional posts about how manchester is better than anywhere else and that if anyone disagrees then they must be "bigging their city up". grow up, and really look at your posts.

Indeed.

Tonight alone 10123 has been posting very spurious claims about retail offerings and law firms.

When Manc's challenge them they are bigging up Manchester.

When Leeds forumers challenge claims by Manc forumers that is perfectly acceptable as Manc's are always over egging Manchester.

Is that how you see if wiggles?

hardly spurious, both factual statements. Stop ignoring the historical context. Why did 10123 even mention legal and retail clout of leeds. He was asserting that its pretty good going to have a city whose legal clout is larger than manchester, and whose retail ranking will overtake manchester, when that said city should be compared to brighton, not manchester. His post was aimed at pointing out how hilarious your over-inflated delusional comparison was.

Is wiggles bigging up Leeds again :lol:

Surely breaking his own rules on how Manc's should behave on this forum?

No not bigging up leeds, i wouldnt be so egotistical. My posts are to directly counter JRBs assertion that manchester is far superior for its retail and that to suggest otherwise is delusional. I wouldnt be on this if people like JRB didnt make up such utter deluded rubbish lol

You mean...

http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showpost.php?p=77123597&postcount=13094

Because it is.

You (and him) hate it when spurious claims are made by marketing Leeds (legal claim) and some retail developer (Trinty) are challenged.

Also, I point out over and over again you are fixated with Manchester.

Just because YOU consider Leeds to be challenging Manchester is retail (really!!!) and Law that someone Manchester and Leeds are comparable.

Yet the fact that Bristol more than competes with Leeds in the media sector and also competes quite well in the retail area somehow does not mean that Bristol is comparable with Leeds.

Please explain the difference.

it is according to caci themselves, who have taken into account all new schemes coming for all cities. they themselves say when trinity is complete leeds will jump back to 4th place, behind london, glasgow and birmingham.

It's not like you not to post a link. You don't know what's in the pipeline in Manchester. When the retail space is built and filled in Leeds, let's go back to the subject. Until then, Leeds in nowhere near Manchester when it comes to shopping and what's on offer.

10123 mentioned law firms and retails due to hilarious comparison with brighton. In the sense that, Leeds having more larger law firms and a retail ranking that will return to being higher than that of leeds is not bad for a city that allegedly should be getting compared to brighton, not manchester. :nuts:

That leeds' legal clout may or may not have an impact on manchester (and vice versa) is neither here nor there. Altho it's clear it does. If Leeds wasnt getting the highest fee earners with the biggest corporate deals, and the most number of of big law firms, then its certain that manchester would have

He along with you always mention law firms. And just like you two, I always mention the amount of law firms in Leeds doesn't impact on the law firms in Manchester, or on Manchester itself.

I'm sure the CJC with 47 new courts had a massive impact on Manchester though. More than any one law firm or fee earner has had in Leeds. Agreed? Leeds as well as Birmingham missed out due to the Government cutbacks.(same old story for Leeds)

There's more than enough work in Manchester. And know doubt it's paid just as well. I don't see an exodus to Leeds do you?

even thought they both have 95% of the same designer clothes and brands. the only difference is that manchester has much more of that in dedicated boxed in department stores or malls, whilst leeds has them in chic designer boutiques along beaitiful glazed victorian arcades, along with a compact victorian pedestrianised heart. I find it funny that it is you who is asserting that the boxy malls manchester experience is vastly superior and that anyone who disagrees and says they are just different but the same is "delusional". look in the mirror and see what you are saying. Its almost like anyone who disagrees with your delusional inflated view based entirely on your own subjective viewpoint must be delusional. It dont make sense lol

And how do you know it's 95% Wiggs? There you go again with your made up figures. Or are you now a retail expert? If anyones delusional it's you. Can we have some more made up figures please.

When it comes to more choice and more high end fashion Manchester beats Leeds hands down. Not only that, but I'm willing to bet the independent offering in Manchester is better as well. It's all guess work isn't it, but I'm '99.9%' sure of it. Damn! I've just done a Wiggs.

Wiggs.

Let's talk about this and the economic imapact this will have on (Gtr) Manchester. I don't see any banks in Leeds building a new HQ.

http://img718.imageshack.us/img718/8679/qpqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqq.jpg

Let's talk about this and the economic impact this will have on (Gtr) Manchester.

http://img560.imageshack.us/img560/9944/city1e.jpg

Let's talk about this and the economic impact it will have on (Gtr) Manchester.

http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a260/Geeves8612/P1000751.jpg

http://i167.photobucket.com/albums/u141/amazingtrade/P1050864.jpg

Let's talk about this and the economic impact it will have on (Gtr) Manchester. (hopefully the one in leeds will have a similar impact?)

http://img6.imageshack.us/img6/6480/screen20110401212350.jpg

Let's talk about this and the economic impact it will have on (Gtr) Manchester. Even we don't know what to expect yet. But at 200 acres in total, right on the edge of the city centre, it's going to be Massive. Excuse the City related pun.

http://img823.imageshack.us/img823/6118/93180375.jpg

Oh, I forgot to add the Northern Rail Hub, etc, etc.

So while Leeds put's all it's eggs in one shopping basket in the city centre, (Gtr) Manchester has 4 huge projects spread thoughout the city.

And there lies the difference, minus, law, banking and retail.

PS. Sorry for all the punctuation and spelling mistakes. Can't be arsed going over it all again. Time for a cup of tea and a biscuit.

No not bigging up leeds, i wouldnt be so egotistical. My posts are to directly counter JRBs assertion that manchester is far superior for its retail and that to suggest otherwise is delusional. I wouldnt be on this if people like JRB didnt make up such utter deluded rubbish lol

But even you say it is.

Even you say that the retail in the place known as Manchester is FAR bigger than that in Leeds.

Tell me. Why are you looking at comparing Leeds with Manchester all the time? Why was the original comparison not with Bristol for example?

oh yes, well reminded JRB.

10123 (and Wiggles) make their assumptions on Manchester's retail being static.

Now, given the vastly improving transport connections to the city centre from Chorlton, Didsbury, Sale Moor, Wythenshawe, Hollingwood, Oldham, Rochdale, Shaw, Ashton, Droylsden..... (the list reall does go on a lot more that that) with Metrolink expansion, only a Leeds forumer would not think that the retail offering in Manchester will increase as and when more and more peopleget more and more better access to the city centre.

oh yes, well reminded JRB.

10123 (and Wiggles) make their assumptions on Manchester's retail being static.

Now, given the vastly improving transport connections to the city centre from Chorlton, Didsbury, Sale Moor, Wythenshawe, Hollingwood, Oldham, Rochdale, Shaw, Ashton, Droylsden..... (the list reall does go on a lot more that that) with Metrolink expansion, only a Leeds forumer would not think that the retail offering in Manchester will increase as and when more and more peopleget more and more better access to the city centre.

And don't forget, with new owners of the Trafford Centre, there is fresh talk of the stalled Metrolink extension to and from the city centre.

So it should be possible to visit both shopping destinations from any part of the city by public transport eventually.

as someone who normally reads by the sidelines, from what ive read so far, its always the usual suspects who keep going back to the same point over and over again (wiggs, 10123) - as interesting as it is, cats does has a point, and everone has back up their sources..the exception seems to be the leeds forumers (wigs ans 10123) when making assumptions about the retail offering in leeds is going to be ranked higher than manchester - seems ludicous tbh

also, just to add my two pence - friends and relatives go to manchester because it has more to offer than leeds, even those who live in york as its just over an hour by train...

and while were on the subject of city bashing(this is the city bashing thread afterall) leeds has always disappointed me with a lack of any chinese supermarkets/china town...and thats speaking as someone who is chinese and has friends travelling to chinese supermarkets from as far as colne and chester!

anways, let the bashing commence (again)

LUKE: Look at him. He’s headed for that small moon.

HAN: I think I can get him before he gets there…he’s almost in range.

BEN: That’s no moon! It’s Greater Manchester

HAN: It’s too big to be Greater Manchester

LUKE: I have a very bad feeling about this.

LUKE: Look at him. He’s headed for that small moon.

HAN: I think I can get him before he gets there…he’s almost in range.

BEN: That’s no moon! It’s Greater Manchester

HAN: It’s too big to be Greater Manchester

LUKE: I have a very bad feeling about this.

L1.

Has put Liverpool on the map.

Bitch! :lol:

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_rOxJ-Rvzrmc/SsU3TIdhYgI/AAAAAAAAA2U/D4BJYuShYOw/s400/County+Arcade+Leeds+ceiling+sm.jpg

Leeds Lads
http://a7.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/226701_10150288972032942_500247941_9626141_1288107_n.jpg
so.many.cleavages

I was waiting for the ubiquitous photo of Leeds' arcades to show up!

It's a nice arcade.

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_rOxJ-Rvzrmc/TQlNU4e3nqI/AAAAAAAAB6I/R9pM1hn5d24/s1600/Corn%2BExchange%2BLeeds%2BInterior%2B2.jpg

Come on Wiggs and 10123, join in.



http://www.myemoticons.com/info/styles/adult/images/sheepshagger.gif

Everyday, we're al gonna say,
We love you Leeds! Leeds! Leeds!
Everywhere, we're gonna be there,
We, love you Leeds! Leeds! Leeds!

Marching On Together!
We're gonna see you win
na na na na na na
We are so proud,
We shout it out loud we love you Leeds! Leeds! Leeds!

We've been through it all together,

And we've had our ups and downs
We're gonna stay with you forever,
at least until the world stops going round

na na na

Everyday, we're all gonna say we love you Leeds!Leeds!Leeds!
Everywhere, we're gonna be there,
We, love you Leeds! Leeds! Leeds!

Marching On Together!
We're gonna see you win
na na na na na na
We are so proud,
We shout it out loud we love you Leeds! Leeds! Leeds!
We are so proud, we shout it out Loud we love you LEEDS! LEEDS! LEEDS!

http://i182.photobucket.com/albums/x167/yoshef/sheepshagger.jpg

Loving it!!!

These just about sum up Leeds as a shopping destination .....

http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4014/4641565784_90435787e3.jpg

http://i26.************/2hd0411.jpg

http://www.soultsretailview.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2011/01/merrion_centre_leeds_graham_soult.jpg

http://www.soultsretailview.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2011/01/leeds_shopping_plaza_graham_soult.jpg

.... eat your heart out Manchester!!!!!!

I Google'd "total retail spending uk cities" this morning.

The first response says it all...

http://www.retailresearch.org/worldshoppingcapitals.php

Wonder why Nottingham Uni chose to use Manc and not Leeds as their second UK city?

Still, even though they used GM instead of something more representative of Manc the figures (in table 2) are still pretty impressive.


EDIT - http://www.caci.co.uk/492.aspx and http://www.caci.co.uk/download.aspx?path=/libraries/document/833.pdf is the report I suspect that Trinty are claiming will change come 2013.

So, do the Leeds forumers REALLY think that the Leeds retail spend in the city centre will increase by over 50% due to Trinity and that in the mean time Manchester won't grow at all due to Co-Op, Spinningfields, better Metrolink access to the city centre? REALLY???

Even if you do, add on all the other retail offerings in Manchester and you will see that whichever way you look at it Leeds has a far smaller retail offering that Manchester seems to. Leeds being much closer in size to the Trafford Centre than it is to Manchester - but hey, lets not allow the reality to get in the way of some of the Leeds forumers postings.


No doubt wiggles and 10123 will see this as me bigging up Manchester (by posting facts with references) yet their ludicrous claims (with no backup evidence whatsoever) are somehow not over-egging Leeds. Funny how this forum works.

On most skyline photos of leeds, the top 7 tallest buildings on the skyline will be something like 110m, 106m, 103m

(from another thread) whats this third 103m skyscraper in Leeds. I though it has only two 100m+ towers, just curious, or is it just exaggeration again from Leeds

Leeds forumers over-egging their local city again but acusing others of doing so?

Quelle surprise.

Leeds Lads
http://a7.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/226701_10150288972032942_500247941_9626141_1288107_n.jpg
so.many.cleavages


At least they're not wearing sportswear.

and while were on the subject of city bashing(this is the city bashing thread afterall) leeds has always disappointed me with a lack of any chinese supermarkets/china town...and thats speaking as someone who is chinese and has friends travelling to chinese supermarkets from as far as colne and chester!



Leeds has got two Chinese supermarkets - Wing Lee Hong on Vicar Lane and Tai Lee Hong on Sheepscar Street. There's also a Chinese cash & carry. When did you visit - 1973 or something?!

There is a 'chinatown', in that there's a collection of buildings and backstreets around the Vicar Lane/Sheepscar area with some pretty good chinese restaurants (the sort actual Chinese visit), a Chinese cooking academy, hairdressers, a community centre etc, as well as a karaoke bar. Arguably not as good as Manchester or Liverpool's, mind. Our twin city of Hangzhou gave us a Chinatown gate to put up, and what has the council done with it over the last few years? Kept it in storage!

Unfortunately quite a lot of it will get knocked down if the Eastgate Quarters ever gets built, but there are plenty of other redundant office/industrial buildings in the streets around that would be easily converted - a real Chinatown is an organic thing that serves the needs of the city's chinese population, not a kitsch attempt at building up a tourist attraction, as you get in some places.

L1.

Has put Liverpool on the map.

Bitch! :lol:

:wink2:

a real Chinatown is an organic thing that serves the needs of the city's chinese population.

You mean like the Manc one?

Out of interest, are Wiggles and 10123 going to post whether or not they think Leeds retail spend in the city centre will be rising by over 50% when Trinity opens and that Manchester will remain static in the mean time?

Or were the over-egging it?

a real Chinatown is an organic thing that serves the needs of the city's chinese population.
You mean like the Manc one?:) :lol: :rofl:

So if China town does not serve the local Chinese population who is it serving?

Who is using the HSBC or Ladbrokes that has the signs in Manderin (spelling???)

You really cannot have someone saying something positive about Manchester can you? No matter how true it may be.

So if China town does not serve the local Chinese population who is it serving?

Who is using the HSBC or Ladbrokes that has the signs in Manderin (spelling???)

You really cannot have someone saying something positive about Manchester can you? No matter how true it may be.I was doing business in a very small town in MI. (pop 1600) and visited a store with a sign that contained a greeting in about 30 languages which, I was led to believe, included Mandarin, Cantonese, Japanese, Korean, Hindi, Urdu, Farsi, Arabic, Tagalog, Swahili, Hawaiian, Ojibwa and Inuit. I asked the store owner how many people in his community spoke those languages to which he replied; "Non I guess, it's just a sales gimmick."

By the way L, would that be methane that you are carrying? LNGC = Liquid Natural Gas Carrier.:)

You need to get yourself to China town in Manchester.

Seems that the orientals have bought into this sales gimic in a much bigger way that those non-orientals. Still, why let reality get in the way of your hatred for all things Manchester.

Some of those lads on that pic from Leeds are fit so I dont know why its been used. It is a decent pic. To be fair though it could be students from across the uk since its a tillate picture but still.

Still, why let reality get in the way of your hatred for all things Manchester.Indeed. So why?
You will find a "real" Chinatown in San Fran, LA, San Diego, Seattle, Houston, New York, Miami, Atlanta, Chicago, Phoenix, Boston, Vancouver, Calgary, Toronto (3), Montreal and I would even lay odds that San Antonio has a bigger Chinatown than Manchester's.

:lol: I'd like to see you go into Wong Wong's on Princess Street and say that it is just a gimmick.

For the record latest estimates are that there are around 1800 Chinese people living in Manchester city centre. Manchester is probably the most proportionally Chinese city in England.

http://www.manchester.gov.uk/downloads/download/4220/corporate_research_and_intelligence_population_publications

Sloyne.

I never said it was bigger than those you listed. Are you changing the discussion because you've made a fool of yourself again?

Still, at least you have given up on trying to pretend that China town is not primarily there for the purpose of our oriental cousins who have moved to the area and agreed my original point was indeed spot on. Thanks for agreeing.

Indeed. So why?
You will find a "real" Chinatown in San Fran, LA, San Diego, Seattle, Houston, New York, Miami, Atlanta, Chicago, Phoenix, Boston, Vancouver, Calgary, Toronto (3), Montreal and I would even lay odds that San Antonio has a bigger Chinatown than Manchester's.

You'll probably find this forum more to your taste:

http://www.skyscrapercity.com/forumdisplay.php?f=103

Now you no longer need to waste your bandwidth on piddling british cities

Bye-bye.

Indeed. So why?
You will find a "real" Chinatown in San Fran, LA, San Diego, Seattle, Houston, New York, Miami, Atlanta, Chicago, Phoenix, Boston, Vancouver, Calgary, Toronto (3), Montreal and I would even lay odds that San Antonio has a bigger Chinatown than Manchester's.

From experience I have not seen bigger Chinatowns in Montreal, Boston or Seattle.

It also has a longer Curry mile than all the above.

Chinatowns are boring anyhow, like "gay villages" they all look the same.

Portsmouth doesn't have one, which is odd. Our uni has the highest proportion of Chinese students in the UK. One of the guys I did my third year group project with was a Chinese student too, doing his MSc now up at Leeds Met.

They're not really studying to open restaurants or shops that sell plastic cats that wave.

No but there are still the shops to cater for them, they just are not clustered. Portsmouth tends to be mixed, there are a lot of Chinese shops/restaurants on Albert Road for example, however there are also about 65253752452 indian restaurants/takeaways too, as well as pubs, bars and other independant shops. We aren't big enough to divvy up areas so we mix instead.

Suburban Knight
a real Chinatown is an organic thing that serves the needs of the city's chinese population, not a kitsch attempt at building up a tourist attraction, as you get in some places.

so the china town in Manchester does not server the needs of the chinese residents who live here? i think youl find if you ask nay chinese perosn living here, including me that it does serve us very well as we keep up with all the latest news happening from the local areas that we originally come from, in my case, tai po in HK - my parents even tell me that the wing fat on ashton old road was only a small shop in china town as did the wing hing lung on upper brook street, theres also the massive wing yip in nearby ancoats...

and the last time i was in leeds was actually second week of april..i stayed for a week using leeds uni facilities - my friend having studied here for three years failed to show enthusiasm at the 'china town' in leeds...

so in answer to your question, the china town here does serve the chinese residents, the fact its kinda of a tourist area is just a bonus

No but there are still the shops to cater for them, they just are not clustered. Portsmouth tends to be mixed, there are a lot of Chinese shops/restaurants on Albert Road for example, however there are also about 65253752452 indian restaurants/takeaways too, as well as pubs, bars and other independant shops. We aren't big enough to divvy up areas so we mix instead.

im going to be in portsmouth in a few weeks (holiday with friends) where would you recommend btw seeing as ive never been there (supermarket or restaurant wise)?

so the china town in Manchester does not server the needs of the chinese residents who live here? i think youl find if you ask nay chinese perosn living here, including me that it does serve us very well as we keep up with all the latest news happening from the local areas that we originally come from, in my case, tai po in HK - my parents even tell me that the wing fat on ashton old road was only a small shop in china town as did the wing hing lung on upper brook street, theres also the massive wing yip in nearby ancoats...

and the last time i was in leeds was actually second week of april..i stayed for a week using leeds uni facilities - my friend having studied here for three years failed to show enthusiasm at the 'china town' in leeds...

so in answer to your question, the china town here does serve the chinese residents, the fact its kinda of a tourist area is just a bonus

At what point did I mention Manchester Chinatown? I didn't, so stop spoiling for a scrap - I was thinking more along the lines of artificial Chinatowns, such as the one they tried creating in Aberdeen, away from the part of the city centre where the chinese businesses had actually clustered.

All I sought do to was educate you on what Leeds does have, which is more than your shortsighted ramblings came across.

im going to be in portsmouth in a few weeks (holiday with friends) where would you recommend btw seeing as ive never been there (supermarket or restaurant wise)?

Anywhere on Albert Road. The All you can eat gaff in Gunwharf is pretty cool, but it doesn't feel genuine.

I've noticed a second concentration of Chinese businesses in Manchester appearing along Oldham Rd around the large Wing Yip.

I have to agree with Sloyne for once.

Manchester's China Town was only put there as a tourist gimmick.

The whole area is in fact created by a Holodeck, which is switched on every morning at 6am by Pat Karney. (Manchester City Council's city centre spokesperson)

The Chinese people are also fake. They are in fact Mancunian actors, made up and dressed to look like Chinese people.

For further information(Sloyne), please contact Pat Karney on 0161 234 5000.

Manchester China Town New Year Celebration, 2010.

Please bear in mind this is really the holodeck and these scenes didn't really exist.

hbXV5HKIVGY&feature=player_embedded#at=86

(they are in fact real, but don't tell Sloyne)

Manchester needs to build some decent modern buildings.

I think raising the educational and aspirational achievements of the slallies of Manc is much more important than any new shiny office block tbh.

Forget your Gerhkin and Shard, what Manc is REALLY missing is highly educated adulats and aspiration.

Forget your Gerhkin and Shard, what Manc is REALLY missing is highly educated adulats and aspiration.



I endorse this sentence

I think raising the educational and aspirational achievements of the slallies of Manc is much more important than any new shiny office block tbh.

Forget your Gerhkin and Shard, what Manc is REALLY missing is highly educated adulats and aspiration.

Amen brother.

The word ‘believe’ there in the original Hebrew is ‘AMAN’ from which we get the English word ‘AMEN’ which means ‘I believe that it will be so.

I think raising the educational and aspirational achievements of the slallies of Manc is much more important than any new shiny office block tbh.

Forget your Gerhkin and Shard, what Manc is REALLY missing is highly educated adulats and aspiration.

LIVERPOOL education chiefs were celebrating after confirmation that not a single city school was now classed as “failing”.

The confirmation from Ofsted that all the city’s schools are now satisfactory or above was hailed as a momentous day for Liverpool education.

The last three failing schools have recently had their failing tags ripped up, following Ofsted visits.

The clean bill of health means that, for the first time since the Ofsted inspection regime was introduced 20 years ago, Liverpool has none of its 167 schools classed as “inadequate” – a tag that can lead to closure unless significant improvements are made.

And, based on Ofsted data, it also means Liverpool is the only major core city to achieve this .

Coinciding with annual rises with GCSE results, which are now above the national average, Ofsted now class 77% of schools in the city as either “good” or “outstanding”. This compares to a decade ago when 25 schools were judged to be failing.



Read More http://www.liverpooldailypost.co.uk/...#ixzz1LKH7kF4n

Like this :) haha

I think raising the educational and aspirational achievements of the slallies of Manc is much more important than any new shiny office block tbh.

Forget your Gerhkin and Shard, what Manc is REALLY missing is highly educated adulats and aspiration.

Then come to Leeds my friend! The land of opportunity!

Some of those lads on that pic from Leeds are fit so I dont know why its been used. It is a decent pic. To be fair though it could be students from across the uk since its a tillate picture but still.

Its been used in jest, but mainly because they all look and dress like absolute c**ts.

Manchester chinatown
http://www.nytix.com/repository/hotels/chinatown.jpg

NY chinatown
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_OBZ90VoJqNc/RwooSh8nvzI/AAAAAAAABHM/aRhnKksUcKk/s320/Chinatown.JPG

Don't think that new york street looks anything like Faulkner street tbh. Probably in a good way too.

Manchester chinatown
http://www.nytix.com/repository/hotels/chinatown.jpg

NY chinatown
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_OBZ90VoJqNc/RwooSh8nvzI/AAAAAAAABHM/aRhnKksUcKk/s320/Chinatown.JPGYou have those pictures reversed and, methinks, deliberately. The give-away? Vehicle license tags and fire escapes on the buildings and the U-Haul van. But then what else is new? Just another Manc playing fast and loose with, this time, another city's pics.:lol:

You have those pictures reversed and, methinks, deliberately. The give-away? Vehicle license tags and fire escapes on the buildings and the U-Haul van.


wow not much gets past Miss Marple here ^^^^

No flies on Sloyne.

He wears diapers*.

*See what I did there?

The buildings in Manchester's Chinatown are brilliantly intact. There are none of the carbuncles you see in the nearby CBD. In addition none of the ground floors have been knocked through for glass frontages as you see in the rest of the city centre. No doubt the area would have been extensively 'developed' years ago if it wasn't for the Chinese setting up shop there :ohno:

One other thing; New York city's Chinatown is not just one street, it encompasses a number of streets on a couple of city blocks. The picture looks to be that of one of the side streets (Mott or Pell) that runs between the Bowery and Elizabeth Street.;)

He doesn't get it does he.

Let the one man show continue.

Roll up, roll up!

Introducing............

New York city's Chinatown is not just one street
Neither is Manchester's. That picture is of one street.

A brief overview for the nutter in the travel agents in San Antonio.(if he's really there?)

http://www.manchester2002-uk.com/maps/chinatown-map.jpg


Manchester's Chinatown is located in a square bounded by York Street, Portland Street, Oxford Street and Mosley Street. It not only contains many Chinese Restaurants, but Thai, Malaysian, Singaporean and other Pan-Asian restaurants, shops, bakeries and supermarkets, most of which have their main trading times on Sunday mornings.

No 69 on the menu. Two can chew.

China Town.

All of the buildings surrrounding the square/car park.(upper/middle right) And many of the buildings surrounding them.

http://www.webbaviation.co.uk/gallery/d/41496-1/eb15649.jpg

The Start of China Town.(Princess Street) The Yang Sing.

http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4117/4884389477_e4bb6950a2.jpg

You have those pictures reversed and, methinks, deliberately. The give-away? Vehicle license tags and fire escapes on the buildings and the U-Haul van. But then what else is new? Just another Manc playing fast and loose with, this time, another city's pics.:lol:

I know:lol:. It was the closest photo I could get to NY without the bloody gate. In all seriousness though, NY chinatown feels like a huge cross-section of Manhattan south of Soho, impressive in not only its size but range of restaurants, diversity of buildings and chinese/oriental population (plus its chinese McDonalds). It feels a bit dirty though. Saying that, walking through Chinatown in Manc on a warm weekend morning, you do get a similar sense - 90% of people around there are Chinese, and although not residing there, are busily getting on with their day and doing business as if it was home. Its much cleaner however. For a city of Manchester's size, you could say that its Chinatown is more or less a miniature of NY's, with some passing similarity to SF. It does well to have it.

I know:lol:. It was the closest photo I could get to NY without the bloody gate. In all seriousness though, NY chinatown feels like a huge cross-section of Manhattan south of Soho, impressive in not only its size but range of restaurants, diversity of buildings and chinese/oriental population (plus its chinese McDonalds). It feels a bit dirty though. Saying that, walking through Chinatown in Manc on a warm weekend morning, you do get a similar sense - 90% of people around there are Chinese, and although not residing there, are busily getting on with their day and doing business as if it was home. Its much cleaner however. For a city of Manchester's size, you could say that its Chinatown is more or less a miniature of NY's, with some passing similarity to SF. It does well to have it.

Yeah! And it ain't one f***ing Street either. :lol:

A brief overview for the nutter in the travel agents in San Antonio.(if he's really there?)



No 69 on the menu. Two can chew.

See, he won't answer now because he's realised he's lost yet another argument.

But he sure will pop up when we say anything America & Manchester, being the annoying little prick that he is.

Are wiggles or 10123 not going to even bother to make an effort in showing their retail claims the other day were no more than blatant over-egging of Leeds, exactly the same the wiggles was acusing others of doing?

See, he won't answer now because he's realised he's lost yet another argument.Can't answer at 30k feet in the air, only when I'm sitting in the departure lounge and bored and waiting to board.
For a city of Manchester's size, you could say that its Chinatown is more or less a miniature of NYs, with some passing similarity to SF.Dream on!:) And no, you couldn't. New York's Chinatown is a "neighborhood" with people not just working in the area but also living there. As for a "passing similarity to SF", that would be passing in an SST, right? Please be realistic, San Frans Chinatown is the biggest Oriental community (by population) outside of Asia. Also, New York's Chinatown population is made up of ethnic Chinese from a number of far eastern locations; mainly Taiwanese then Hong Kong, Vietnam and the PRC. Some Korean businesses have moved into the area taking advantage of the tourist footfall.

*though id add my tibit, being the resident chinese on here for manc that i know of*


though i agree that the manchester china town is no where near the size of the ones in the usa, what makes you think no one lives in china town in manchester? theres quite a few old peoples homes catered for chinese residents only, though the main ones are just outside of china town (my grand parents lived in the ones on canal street above the bars! they have the green window frames if you hapen to walk down that way), they do live there - lancaster house and the apartments around have lots of chinese people living there as well as students and other professionals

(and yes, canal street is an odd/bizzare place for old people, though my grand parents felt safer cos it was busy..)

Tex by name, Texan by nature

Can't answer at 30k feet in the air, only when I'm sitting in the departure lounge and bored and waiting to board.
Dream on!:) And no, you couldn't. New York's Chinatown is a "neighborhood" with people not just working in the area but also living there. As for a "passing similarity to SF", that would be passing in an SST, right? Please be realistic, San Frans Chinatown is the biggest Oriental community (by population) outside of Asia. Also, New York's Chinatown population is made up of ethnic Chinese from a number of far eastern locations; mainly Taiwanese then Hong Kong, Vietnam and the PRC. Some Korean businesses have moved into the area taking advantage of the tourist footfall.

Diverting yourself away from your ridiculously ignorant claims that Manchester China town was a gimmick.

Who's the gimmick for, btw?

i agree that the manchester china town is no where near the size of the ones in the usa.But almost nothing, I repeat, NOTHING in Manc compares with anything in the US but Mancs are constantly comparing themselves to US cities (mostly NYC.) Manc has a McDonalds, Starbucks, KFC so all of a sudden it is "like New York"? Mancs comparisons should be with Liverpool, Leeds, Newcastle, Sheffield and, at a push, Birmingham but even there Manc compares favourably with some, not so favourably with others. The airport is about the only thing I can think of that would set Manc above it's English rivals but, even there, most of it's passengers come from outside it's boundaries.

But almost nothing, I repeat, NOTHING in Manc compares with anything in the US but Mancs are constantly comparing themselves to US cities (mostly NYC.) Manc has a McDonalds, Starbucks, KFC so all of a sudden it is "like New York"? Mancs comparisons should be with Liverpool, Leeds, Newcastle, Sheffield and, at a push, Birmingham but even there Manc compares favourably with some, not so favourably with others. The airport is about the only thing I can think of that would set Manc above it's English rivals but, even there, most of it's passengers come from outside it's boundaries.

and where in my post do I compare that manchester is better or even compare manchester to anywhere in the usa? i think youd find i actually said the china town in manchester is no where near the ones in the usa..merely correcting you on your short sightedness that no chinese people live in china town...when they clearly do..

The USA is full of idiots and inbreds, so stop trying to make it sound like the powerhouse of the world.

One word; China.

and where in my post do I compare that manchester is better or even compare manchester to anywhere in the usa? i think youd find i actually said the china town in manchester is no where near the ones in the usa..merely correcting you on your short sightedness that no chinese people live in china town...when they clearly do..

Yeh exactly. Go on Sloyne, explain who manchester china town is a gimmick to?

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/10327685

Hmmm. Would I like to see sloyne go up to this lot and say that their existence in Manchester is a gimmick? :)

But almost nothing, I repeat, NOTHING in Manc compares with anything in the US but Mancs are constantly comparing themselves to US cities (mostly NYC.) Manc has a McDonalds, Starbucks, KFC so all of a sudden it is "like New York"? Mancs comparisons should be with Liverpool, Leeds, Newcastle, Sheffield and, at a push, Birmingham but even there Manc compares favourably with some, not so favourably with others. The airport is about the only thing I can think of that would set Manc above it's English rivals but, even there, most of it's passengers come from outside it's boundaries.

Look friend, this is a lighthearted place. I was joking with the photos. But you'll have to understand that the designs of warehouse building you see in Manchester - specifically around Canal Street, Chinatown, parts of the Piccadilly Basin, and of course various buildings around Liverpool and the docks etc - you know, the old major industrialised cities - were undoubtably copied stylistically in Brooklyn, Jersey City, Manhattan etc. It's indisputable. A reason why parts of Manchester are used as a cheaper filming alternative for Hollywood as a stand-in. Come to our Chinatown and experience it on trading day on Sunday morning.

Plus, as I've already said, Manchester does have similarities to Liverpool, and Glasgow, many in fact, and some with Leeds yes, but minimal with everywhere else.

Sloyne won't reply now because he's been contradicted yet again.

Someone say something about the USA and we can watch him pop back up again.

http://manchester.chineseconsulate.org/eng/visa/W020070313067742500287.jpg

Chinese embassy in Manchester, sloyne, heavily thumbed 20 year old copy of notes from a small in hand, buzzes in: "Shows over folks, you're not fooling anyone you know."

Tex/scouser by name, Canadian immigrant/scouser by nature
As in he just loves the sound of his boring old voice.:|

But almost nothing, I repeat, NOTHING in Manc compares with anything in the US but Mancs are constantly comparing themselves to US cities (mostly NYC.) Manc has a McDonalds, Starbucks, KFC so all of a sudden it is "like New York"? Mancs comparisons should be with Liverpool, Leeds, Newcastle, Sheffield and, at a push, Birmingham but even there Manc compares favourably with some, not so favourably with others. The airport is about the only thing I can think of that would set Manc above it's English rivals but, even there, most of it's passengers come from outside it's boundaries.

I would heavily bet you are not an American. You are one of them deranged scousers.

Folks, check back at post 13183. He's the one who started comparing Manchester to American cities, now he's claiming it was the mancs.

He claims manchester only compares with Birmingham "at a push" :lol:

But almost nothing, I repeat, NOTHING in Manc compares with anything in the US but Mancs are constantly comparing themselves to US cities (mostly NYC.) Manc has a McDonalds, Starbucks, KFC so all of a sudden it is "like New York"? Mancs comparisons should be with Liverpool, Leeds, Newcastle, Sheffield and, at a push, Birmingham but even there Manc compares favourably with some, not so favourably with others. The airport is about the only thing I can think of that would set Manc above it's English rivals but, even there, most of it's passengers come from outside it's boundaries.

You're a liar and a Walter Mitty Character Sloyne. Most Manc's don't and haven't compared Manchester to New York or to any other American city.

I've been posting on SSC for 8 years(f***ing hell, is it that long), and I've never compared Manchester to New York. Are you mad? You don't have to answer that.

The fact that parts of the NQ in Manchester city centre are often used as American city backdrops in films and programmes, probably explains another one of your now infamous gaffes,

Some great news for comic fans in Manchester came through this morning. Marvel productions has joined up with Manchester based company Vision+Media and found a few locations which fit well for 1940's New York.
It will be the first time filming of Captain America has moved out side of America but Manchester's Northern Quarter will be perfect for the movie.

Perhaps you're getting the two mixed up Captain San Antonio America?

Oh btw. I seem to recall you comparing Liverpool to a certain American city. Perhaps I'm a liar too?

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3136/2430965135_567176d755_b.jpg

Chinese community protest against the BBC in 2008 (http://www.guardian.co.uk/media/2008/apr/20/chinathemedia.bbc)

Sloyne:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1dOcZhcRNN4#t=5m02s

:lol:

On a serious note Sloyne.

Don't you feel embarrassed by your constant behaviour on this thread? (yes I know, it is the City Bashing thread)

Talk about a one man campaign.

I've got news for you Sloyne. We've all moved on, Mancs and Scousers alike. Apart from the odd bit of banter, there's a lovin going on across the forums, and those bad old days(which I admitedly took part in) are long gone.

As they say in America. Wake up and smell the coffee.

Yeh I thought this thread died - who brought it back to life?

Did we miss it really?

Do you really want to carry on Sloyne? (of course you don't)


2001 census. Let's see what 2011 brings.

The Chinese community of Manchester©

Sandy Lo

Being one of the important focal points for the Chinese in the North West, Manchester has the third biggest Chinese population after London and South East. According to the 2001 Census, of 247403 Chinese in Britain, 26887 were reported living in the North West (0.4% of the total population in the area). Unlike other ethnic minority communities, the Chinese immigrants are widely distributed around the city. The economic situation of the community can be characterized as having a high self-employment rate, with most of the people working in the catering industry, though the Chinese community in Manchester has the highest rate of employment in professional or managerial positions among other ethnic minority groups and there is a high proportion of semi-skilled manual workers. The community also has a high rate of people getting high level of qualifications.
The Chinese immigrant population can be divided into various groups speaking different Chinese dialects ('fang yan') with different countries of origin. There are five main groups:
1.Hong Kong Chinese,
2.PRC Chinese,
3.British-born Chinese,
4.Malaysia Chinese, and
5.Chinese from other countries
Each group's family income, education levels, age distributions and English proficiency are very different among themselves. Hong Kong is the main country of origin of most local Chinese, but China is where the recent immigrants come from. Therefore Cantonese is the dominant Chinese dialect within the community, as shown by some studies such as Lo (2001), a study of the language use patterns of Manchester Chinese, even though more and more Mandarin-speaking people from China have come to the UK for study or work in the recent decade. Among other Chinese dialects, Hakka and Mandarin are the first languages of some immigrants after Cantonese. The former is the first language of most elderly people. The Cantonese spoken by the Manchester Chinese community is a local variety, with variations mainly in lexicons from their counterparts in Hong Kong.
Except where translation and interpretation services are available, English, as the language of the host British community, is used in public domains like government and schools for communication with non-Chinese but it is more frequently used with other peers or siblings by some British-born Chinese.
Cantonese and English are the main combination for code-switching among young people, while the elderly seldom made use of any code-switching, though some of them know both Cantonese and Hakka. While code-switching is not often used at work in, at mainstream schools with teachers or in family unless among siblings, it is used much more frequently in situations like the conversations among friends, and at religious services, depending on the interlocutors.

It's only a gimmick though, right? :lol:

Have you guys considered just ignoring him rather than devoting page after page to him?

Are wiggles or 10123 not going to even bother to make an effort in showing their retail claims the other day were no more than blatant over-egging of Leeds, exactly the same the wiggles was acusing others of doing?

Answer this question: How much retail is there in Manchester centre in Meters square. And how much is there in the Greater Manchester area?

Answer this question: Who gives a shiney shit?

Having been to Toronto's Chinatown, I'd agree with sloyne that North American Chinatown's are more neighbourhoods rather than a few streets of shops, tourist attractions, and restaurants. However I wouldn't say this is a good thing. The Chinatown I saw was a product of segregation with a resulting deprivation. In Manchester, Chinese people live all over the city, with a small quarter of the city centre as a cultural expression. This doesn't make it any less real.

Answer this question: How much retail is there in Manchester centre in Meters square. And how much is there in the Greater Manchester area?

I'll just get my tape measure :|

Have you guys considered just ignoring him rather than devoting page after page to him?

He's not a lost cause yet.

There is still a flicker of light,and a window of opportunity. We can't give up until the light finally goes out and the last Beatle track fades form his memory.("Let it be, let it be, speaking words of wisdom, let it be")

Answer this question: How much retail is there in Manchester centre in Meters square. And how much is there in the Greater Manchester area?

He is the b****** child of Sloyne. The new anti-Christ.

I wouldn't hold your breath, mate :lol:

Answer this question: Who gives a shiney shit?


Most unsubmerged logs are shiny when fresh. They dull when they set, when the moisture evaporates.

Most unsubmerged logs are shiny when fresh. They dull when they set, when the moisture evaporates.
The amount of actual 'shineyness' depends on the colonic mucilage levels yoshef. :cool:

Please don't ask me how I know...;)