http://27.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lfsuapUgrj1qdcm6ho1_400.jpg

http://www.bmoviefilmvault.com/breviews/titles/beware_the_blob_title.jpg

Coming to your city soon.

That "urban blob" argument abstracts Liverpool's densely developed and well served urban core into the same thing as noddy little housing estates in West Yorkshire. It's a wholly 'on paper' argument. The old county boroughs of Liverpool, Birkenhead, Wallasey and Bootle are the core of a linear city along the Mersey


You need a bridge to make it mean something, otherwise its just too detached from urbanity.

You need a bridge to make it mean something, otherwise its just too detached from urbanity.Two road and one rail tunnel don't count?

Two road and one rail tunnel don't count?

Where is this road you speak of?!?!?

I know of one thats much further down close to Runcorn.

Where is this road you speak of?!?!?

I know of one thats much further down close to Runcorn.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Queensway_Tunnel

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kingsway_Tunnel

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mersey_Railway

You need a bridge to make it mean something, otherwise its just too detached from urbanity.

which side would you say was more detached from ubanity?


http://i182.photobucket.com/albums/x167/yoshef/aerial201.jpg

10123.

There's an underwater walkway as well.

which side would you say was more detached from ubanity?


http://i182.photobucket.com/albums/x167/yoshef/aerial201.jpg

The area closes to the camera...

Anyway enough with this bull! Leeds and Liverpool are roughly the same size lets leave it at that.

That pic is old as fuck. Theres no arena or anything.

The area closes to the camera...

Anyway enough with this bull! Leeds and Liverpool are roughly the same size lets leave it at that.

Agreed. Enough alread.
Bold- Really? :nuts:

10123.

There's an underwater walkway as well.

Not to mention the eponymous ferries across the Mersey.
I think there are plenty of cities with rivers as wide as that and to not include Birkenhead as part of Liverpool's urban area is disingenuous at the very least

^^Indeed, cities such as New York, Istanbul, Sydney, Auckland, Hong Kong all have waterways as large if not larger that run through them. Yet those areas which are physically detached from the rest of said conurbations are still considered, by and large, to be a integral parts of those cities.

Aww I was just about to take the mick because I said rivers and you mentioned Istanbul, Sydney and Auckland but you actually said waterways which is what I should have said in any case. What a shame :(

I love to disappoint!

You need a bridge to make it mean something, otherwise its just too detached from urbanity.

So that's that sorted then,it does mean something,three links you were unaware of and one that you are aware of which is soon to be joined by a second bridge.Oh and those ferries,it's so undetached I can get a bus,train,taxi,ferry or drive a car to the Wirral from the City Centre.

^^Indeed, cities such as New York...all have waterways as large if not larger that run through them. Yet those areas which are physically detached from the rest of said conurbations are still considered, by and large, to be a integral parts of those cities.

That's not always the case though as that area with a handful of skyscrapers just over the Hudson from downtown Manhattan and linked with a tunnel is Jersey City, which of course is not in New York at all but in New Jersey. It also feels a million miles away from Manhattan in just about every way.

The fact that it's in New Jersey and 'feels' different is irrelevant; The outer Boroughs within NYC have a largely different feel to Manhattan, even in areas within close proximity to the island, the East river isn't as large as the Hudson but it's hardly a babbling brook either (and Staten Island is even further from 'Downtown' than Hoboken, Jersey city or Bayonne are). Plus there's fact that New Jersey is a part of the New York (Tri-state) Metropolitan area.

The area closes to the camera...

Anyway enough with this bull! Leeds and Liverpool are roughly the same size lets leave it at that.

Lol ok. Believe what you want to believe :lol:

That's not always the case though as that area with a handful of skyscrapers just over the Hudson from downtown Manhattan and linked with a tunnel is Jersey City, which of course is not in New York at all but in New Jersey. It also feels a million miles away from Manhattan in just about every way.

But they're different states. The equivalent would be if the Wirral was in Wales.

Lol ok. Believe what you want to believe :lol:


Only the truth though and you know it.

Liverpool - 1.2 million people

Leeds - 700,000 people

I believe Pablo.

Only the truth though and you know it.

I seem to remember that you live in one of those places that are included in an overbounded Leeds and that is perhaps the reason why you're so adamant on this subject.

Liverpool is definitely bigger than Leeds. Or at least, it feels bigger.

Plus Wiggley's maps don't include Southport and the Wirral.

And don't say that people on the Wirral don't consider themselves from Liverpool.

Because I know a handful of people from Wirral who say they live in Liverpool.

I seem to remember that you live in one of those places that are included in an overbounded Leeds and that is perhaps the reason why you're so adamant on this subject.

I live in Meanwood part of the main urban blob. google it.

Liverpool is definitely bigger than Leeds. Or at least, it feels bigger.

Hmm, yeah, You would say that wouldn't you Mr little know nothing

I live in Meanwood part of the main urban blob. google it.

People in Birkenhead live a mile from the city centre connected by three tunnels,google it or better still,use your eyes.How many miles away are you? How can a city centre be at the edge of the city? Surely it's going to be fairly central.

People in Birkenhead live a mile from the city centre connected by three tunnels,google it or better still,use your eyes.How many miles away are you? How can a city centre be at the edge of the city? Surely it's going to be fairly central.

Why would it be central? Liverpool was built next to the mersey waterfront just like most other Waterfront towns and cities the centre of Liverpool was built next to the waterfront its then expanded out eastward.

Why would it be central? Liverpool was built next to the mersey waterfront just like most other Waterfront towns and cities the centre of Liverpool was built next to the waterfront its then expanded out eastward.

It expanded in both directions,scousers moved to both sides of the river,your not local so you don't know that.This is not some trivial point scoring SSC debate,it's simply a fact.Ask Yoshef about his family background.Anyway,almost time for work for me so I'm off.

Liverpool's a bigger city than Leeds though, very clearly. Nobody's argued about the economy.

Well that has answered the never ending question on the size of Leeds and Liverpool and clearly there is very little difference in their populations with Leeds officially the more populous of the two.

People in Birkenhead live a mile from the city centre connected by three tunnels,google it or better still,use your eyes.How many miles away are you? How can a city centre be at the edge of the city? Surely it's going to be fairly central.

except for the fact that birkenhead has its own town centre and CBD. That is then seperated by industrial, then sea. It's completely different from city centres that are split by a waterway, whereby half the city centre is on one side, and the other half on the otherside, like London. With liverpool, the entire centre is on one side. Birkenhead has an entirely seperate towncentre and cbd with its own retail.

Moreover, residents in birkenhead are significantly further away than a mile, house to liverpool. They have to pass birkenhead town centre for one lol.

birkenhead functions as a dormitary urban annexe to liverpool, in the very same way that wakefield does.

Anyway, birkenhead town centre and its residential areas are not liverpool, but to me theyre definitely part of the same Urban Area (even if the government doesnt think so), that combined urban area being 1.1 million people, which is still smaller than the government defined urban area that Leeds is a part of, the west yorkshire urban area of 1.6 million people.

Hmm, yeah, You would say that wouldn't you Mr little know nothing

Okay then, label with me with that title when I have evidence.

Not to mention the fact that Liverpool is blatantly larger than Leeds.

Christ, Leeds against the world this week.

except for the fact that birkenhead has its own town centre and CBD. That is then seperated by industrial, then sea. It's completely different from city centres that are split by a waterway, whereby half the city centre is on one side, and the other half on the otherside, like London and Manchester. With liverpool, the entire centre is on one side. Birkenhead has an entirely seperate towncentre and cbd with its own retail.

Moreover, residents in birkenhead are significantly further away than a mile, house to liverpool. They have to pass birkenhead town centre for one lol.

birkenhead functions as a dormitary urban annexe to liverpool, in the very same way that wakefield does.

Anyway, birkenhead town centre and its residential areas are not liverpool, but to me theyre definitely part of the same Urban Area (even if the government doesnt think so), that combined urban area being 1.1 million people, which is still smaller than the government defined urban area that Leeds is a part of, the west yorkshire urban area of 1.6 million people.

Whoops! :|

except for the fact that birkenhead has its own town centre and CBD. That is then seperated by industrial, then sea. It's completely different from city centres that are split by a waterway, whereby half the city centre is on one side, and the other half on the otherside, like London. With liverpool, the entire centre is on one side. Birkenhead has an entirely seperate towncentre and cbd with its own retail.

Moreover, residents in birkenhead are significantly further away than a mile, house to liverpool. They have to pass birkenhead town centre for one lol.

birkenhead functions as a dormitary urban annexe to liverpool, in the very same way that wakefield does.

Anyway, birkenhead town centre and its residential areas are not liverpool, but to me theyre definitely part of the same Urban Area (even if the government doesnt think so), that combined urban area being 1.1 million people, which is still smaller than the government defined urban area that Leeds is a part of, the west yorkshire urban area of 1.6 million people.




How long does it take to get from Wakefield to Leeds on the underground?

Birkenhead is closer to Liverpool city centre than the area I currently live in which is in South Liverpool (and yes within the city's local authority boundary).

Leeds against the world this week.

No, Lad 2011/10213 against the world. Thankfully they don't represent most people in Leeds.

moi ?!?!?

http://media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lybqwdf8311qiklw8.gif

Anyway thanks for clearing that up I guess Bikerland is part of Liverpool... or is Liverpool part of bikerland??......

http://media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m2a96cgGVb1qcoa6s.gif

except for the fact that birkenhead has its own town centre and CBD. That is then seperated by industrial, then sea. It's completely different from city centres that are split by a waterway, whereby half the city centre is on one side, and the other half on the otherside, like London. With liverpool, the entire centre is on one side. Birkenhead has an entirely seperate towncentre and cbd with its own retail.

Birkenhead has a town centre similar to what all the Merseyside towns have. The residents of Birkenhead and the eastern side of the Wirral as a whole come to Liverpool City Centre for most of their retail, leisure and for a large percentage of Wirralians, their employment (I have both family & friends who live on the east side of the Wirral, so I know this). Plus if Wirral Waters ever gets started, it will create a City Centre which spans the river.

Moreover, residents in birkenhead are significantly further away than a mile, house to liverpool. They have to pass birkenhead town centre for one lol.

Not if you use the Queensway Tunnel, that way you bypass Birkenhead Town Centre.

birkenhead functions as a dormitary urban annexe to liverpool, in the very same way that wakefield does.

Birkenhead originally was its own independent town, but with the growth of the Port of Liverpool & Cammell Lairds it has become another dormitary town/suburb for Liverpool; it just so happens that it's located on the opposite side of the Mersey. I don't know enough about Leeds/Wakefield to be able to make a similar judgement.

Birkenhead has a town centre similar to what all the Merseyside towns have. The residents of Birkenhead and the eastern side of the Wirral as a whole come to Liverpool City Centre for most of their retail, leisure and for a large percentage of Wirralians, their employment (I have both family & friends who live on the east side of the Wirral, so I know this). Plus if Wirral Waters ever gets started, it will create a City Centre which spans the river.
Yeah Birkenhead Town Centre is no different from Bootle Town Centre. They are to Central Liverpool what Salford CC and Stretford TC are to Central Manchester, or West Bridgford TC is to Nottingham (except WB is actually really nice... where as the other four are, well, not :lol:).


Birkenhead originally was its own independent town, but with the growth of the Port of Liverpool & Cammell Lairds it has become another dormitary town/suburb for Liverpool; it just so happens that it's located on the opposite side of the Mersey. I don't know enough about Leeds/Wakefield to be able to make a similar judgement.

Leeds and Wakefield are separate and independent cities.
Birkenhead is an inner-city/inner-suburban area of Liverpool. Like Stretford is in Manchester.

When you can get from a densely populated neighbourhood to a city centre in less than 5 mins on an underground train that comes every 3/4 mins, you live in that city.

No, Lad 2011/10213 against the world. Thankfully they don't represent most people in Leeds.

Oh fuck off, its fagal and Mr Know nothing AKA Vold who starts these silly debates.

Yeah Birkenhead Town Centre is no different from Bootle Town Centre. They are to Central Liverpool what Salford CC and Stretford TC are to Central Manchester, or West Bridgford TC is to Nottingham (except WB is actually really nice... where as the other four are, well, not :lol:).

Bootle was the place I was trying to compare it to. :yes:

When you can get from a densely populated neighbourhood to a city centre in less than 5 mins on an underground train that comes every 3/4 mins, you live in that city.

Birkenhead must have the best public transport in Merseyside. Including Bidston and Rock Ferry it has seven train stations! In my town we only have one, which is normally full because of the people from West Lancashire who come here to park due to the train fares being cheaper in Merseyside. :ohno:

Birkenhead must have the best public transport in Merseyside. Including Bidston and Rock Ferry it has seven train stations! In my town we only have one, which is normally full because of the people from West Lancashire who come here to park due to the train fares being cheaper in Merseyside. :ohno:

Try living in East Liverpool with no Merseyrail stations at all :ohno:

Try living in East Liverpool with no Merseyrail stations at all :ohno:

If only we had got Merseytram, it would've been so different in east Liverpool right now. :no:

But they're different states. The equivalent would be if the Wirral was in Wales.

Well, some people seem to think the villages of North Wales are basically a suburb of Liverpool. :poke:

Erm...

Labour peer Lord Adonis claims House of Lords should move to Salford Quays

Deborah Linton April 17, 2012

Labour peer Lord Andrew Adonis has claimed that the House of Lords should move north – to Salford Quays. The former government transport minister, says moving parliament's upper house would shift politics away from 'Planet London'.

Writing in this week's Spectator magazine, he says: “London is New York, Washington and LA rolled into one, which is unhealthy for our national politics. “So I have a serious suggestion. If the House of Lords is to be reformed in the next year, part of the reform should be to move it out to a city in the Midlands or the north, maybe next to the relocated BBC in MediaCity in Salford Quays. “Half of our national politicians would then assemble well away from ‘Planet London’. The public purse would make a net saving by selling the vast and expensive property portfolio the Lords has been acquiring to house its 850 members along Millbank and the surrounding streets. And yes, yours truly — a Londoner and proud of it — would be happy to lead the way.”



Read more at: http://menmedia.co.uk/manchestereveningnews/news/s/1491522_labour-peer-lord-adonis-claims-house-of-lords-should-move-to-salford-quays-

I'd support the House of Lords moving, but why to Salford Quays? The House of Lords is hardly media.

There's also no point in moving things out of London if they're just going to be centralised somewhere else. Let Salford have media, but why not put the House of Lords in Liverpool?

I'd support the House of Lords moving, but why to Salford Quays? The House of Lords is hardly media.

There's also no point in moving things out of London if they're just going to be centralised somewhere else. Let Salford have media, but why not put the House of Lords in Liverpool?
Realistically the best place for it would be Manchester or Birmingham due to transport links.

Leeds No.1 has a point though.











But so does Lord Adonis..

Yeah Salford doesn't really make any sense, perhaps he's linking it with the BBC. I think Liverpool, Manchester, Leeds and Birmingham could all potentially house it although arguably Birmingham as it'll have superior transport links once HS2 is completed.

Regardless though it'll never happen.

Regardless though it'll never happen.

Why wouldn't it?

I'll tell you why; you've been brainwashed with this London-centric society which says "nothing will ever happen outside of London". It's how politicians get away with not funding anything outside of the M25.

If only we had got Merseytram, it would've been so different in east Liverpool right now. :no:

Line 1 wouldn't have got anywhere near West Derby (which is where I grew up) and Line 2 would have only skirted the fringes around Alder Hey, so the tram wouldn't have benefit me at all.
Although, a diversionary spur from Line 1 down Muirhead Avenue and up through Croxteth (where it'd rejoin the 'main' line) and a spur from Line 2 up Princess Drive (and into Stockbridge Village) would have covered a nice chunk of West Derby (but not the village itself).

Well, some people seem to think the villages of North Wales are basically a suburb of Liverpool. :poke:
Surburbs, no. But North East Wales is in Liverpool's "sphere of influence". I know people from several NE Welsh towns and they use Liverpool as "the city"... they go there for shopping, entertainment etc. Plus, a lot of NE Welsh families have Liverpudlian relatives (and vice versa).

Realistically the best place for it would be Manchester or Birmingham due to transport links.

Which will always be the case if these two cities are constantly chosen for public projects.
The whole point of moving public sector/government out of London is to decentralise the country and break the London dominance of public and private investment. There's no point doing that if you end up creating mini-Londons in Manchester and Birmingham.

Why wouldn't it?

I'll tell you why; you've been brainwashed with this London-centric society which says "nothing will ever happen outside of London". It's how politicians get away with not funding anything outside of the M25.

Not really...

Some things should stay in London, this is one of them. While your at it you may as well move Buckingham Palace, and number 10.

There all interlinked and should all stay together.

Not really...

Some things should stay in London, this is one of them. While your at it you may as well move Buckingham Palace, and number 10.

There all interlinked and should all stay together.

But London doesn't need anything.

It can keep its parliament, but why, for instance, is the National Parks Foundation (or something?) based there? Why not make Manchester the media capital, Leeds the finance capital, Birmingham the law capital, etc?

Why don't we also move the better weather London gets to the north too? It's only fair. And while we're at it we might as well put some of the north's hills and dales in London - it's unfair they're all in the north.

Also, to all those Scousers who think that BBC North West Tonight is Manchester-centric, tune in tonight! All it's been is Liverpool, Liverpool, Liverpool! There's only been a runner from Manchester and a few other stories in Manchester. The rest has been devoted to Liverpool..

Why don't we also move the better weather London gets to the north too? It's only fair. And while we're at it we might as well put some of the north's hills and dales in London - it's unfair they're all in the north.

I sense you're taking the piss.

These institutes aren't clamped down to London you know, they can easily move away.

It'd be cheaper, too.

But London doesn't need anything.

It can keep its parliament, but why, for instance, is the National Parks Foundation (or something?) based there? Why not make Manchester the media capital, Leeds the finance capital, Birmingham the law capital, etc?

You've got what you need though.

Manchester has the BBC
Leeds has the NHS
Liverpool has ..... (?)

This creates the foundation for future growth. Leeds is regarded as one of Europe's Leaders in health-care, we have the largest teaching hospital in Europe and now private medical research companies are coming together to make Leeds a world leader in medical science. Manchester has the media companies, which will stimulate future growth in this field and make Manchester a leader in all sorts of creative industries.

It all boil down to funding for public projects rather than how many bodies we can attract.

I don't have an issue with it being in Salford, but I don't really understand why it has been mooted. If it was a media institution I could understand, but it's not.

Perhaps they should put it in Newcastle or Glasgow- might help justify HS2 future phases more!

Why don't we also move the better weather London gets to the north too?

Hah. Not really sure London gets particularly better weather than most of the country. Sometimes a few degrees warmer from the heat island, but it doesn't get noticeably less rain or more sun.

Also, to all those Scousers who think that BBC North West Tonight is Manchester-centric, tune in tonight! All it's been is Liverpool, Liverpool, Liverpool! There's only been a runner from Manchester and a few other stories in Manchester. The rest has been devoted to Liverpool..

The Little Girl Giant event is going to be massive,there's bound to be loads of coverage of that this week,so are the Titanic Commemorations,that's unavoidable,as is the Grand National and both teams appearing at Wembley.I never watched it so I don't know what was featured but it's been a really big week for Liverpool.BBC has always been a lot fairer than Granada,if big events are happening they should be given equal coverage,that's all we ask.

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The show will take place from April 20-22 and is one of the most complex events Liverpool City Council has ever staged, involving hundreds of people in its planning and execution.

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The House of Lords should abolished not moved.

I think all principle regional cities should have more government departments for sure...but dont see it happenig much unfortunatley...

The House of Lords should abolished not moved.

Here here.

Erm...



Read more at: http://menmedia.co.uk/manchestereveningnews/news/s/1491522_labour-peer-lord-adonis-claims-house-of-lords-should-move-to-salford-quays-

The Tories are having a spass attack as it is with the reform plans.

Can you imagine them agreeing to moving from the House of Lords anywhere up north as well.

Out of interest, wonder if it'll be renamed when (if) the Lords disappear.

The Tories are having a spass attack as it is with the reform plans.

Can you imagine them agreeing to moving from the House of Lords anywhere up north as well.

Out of interest, wonder if it'll be renamed when (if) the Lords disappear.


Will never happen simple -a move anywhere North of Watford that is....

Let Salford have media, but why not put the House of Lords in Liverpool?Nah, let Manchester have them, they are always claiming to be capital of the North West, the Lords might give that claim some traction. Anyway, I doubt very much that Scousers would appreciate having them (Lords) in their midst. :)

Nah, let Manchester have them, they are always claiming to be capital of the North West, the Lords might give that claim some traction. Anyway, I doubt very much that Scousers would appreciate having them (Lords) in their midst. :)

Thanks babe xoxo

Id rather have something worthwhile being moved to Liverpool.

850 'senators', along with their staff, lobby firms, media and all that would follow would be a huge boon for any local economy - much more so than BBC at MediaCity.

Alas, the Lib Dem reforms will not include such a revolutionary idea, even the more basic plans are struggling to get Tory support, but that is an entirely different discussion.

Id rather have something worthwhile being moved to Liverpool.

Indeed.


You could argue for branches of government being moved to Edinburgh, Belfast and Cardiff to equalise the union a little. Or turn Britain into a full on federation and create a new capital and move all federal government there (leaving London as the capital of England).

Why not both?

I bet we are talking 10k plus jobs would follow.

Given the 'excitment' about the possible positive effects of schemes like Liverpool Waters, this would have an immediate equal effect - no 40 years of dreaming.

P.S. Not saying it will happen, it won't.

But if it were to the effect on the local area would be absolutely massive.

Thanks babe xoxo



LOL

P.S. Not saying it will happen, it won't.

But if it were to the effect on the local area would be absolutely massive.

Agreed. While federalism is my ideal model for Britain, it won't happen for multiple reasons. Particularly the risk of a major change in the UK's constitution reopening political troubles in Northern Ireland.



If we were to designate a new federal capital, my preference would be for somewhere like Wrexham. Somewhere in England wouldn't calm fears about English dominance of the UK. Scotland would be a risk at least until the referendum. And NI would be problematic for obvious reasons.

Could equally argue that the NI, Scots and Welsh have more democracy than the northern parts of England right now, as such little point in increasing democratic levels in any part of the UK that already benefits from a devolved parliament and instead it should go to a part of the UK that is a long way from the UK government but does not have the added democracy that devolution brought about.

It's all a pointless discussion either way.

The Naval stuff in London should be consolidated into the Portsmouth sites, most of it is here anyway.

That "urban blob" argument abstracts Liverpool's densely developed and well served urban core into the same thing as noddy little housing estates in West Yorkshire. It's a wholly 'on paper' argument. The old county boroughs of Liverpool, Birkenhead, Wallasey and Bootle are the core of a linear city along the Mersey



I see where you're coming from, but does beign on the other side of quite a wide body of water automatically make something part of the same contiguous urban area? Thurrock/Tilbury/Grays and Dartford/Gravesend etc are opposite each other on a much narrower river crossing, yet are definitely not the same settlement.

http://cache2.asset-cache.net/xc/95570598.jpg?v=1&c=IWSAsset&k=2&d=6C4008C0FD9EB5A579F13C8EAC030A5948A84BD97A45FAEBD8EAC1A107A6CB71
http://i571.photobucket.com/albums/ss153/mikestanton/DSC_0639.jpg

Erm...

Read more at: http://menmedia.co.uk/manchestereveningnews/news/s/1491522_labour-peer-lord-adonis-claims-house-of-lords-should-move-to-salford-quays-

ermm;)...

Call to move House of Lords to Birmingham
By Neil ElkesApr 20 2012

The House of Lords should move from London to Birmingham, a former Government minister has claimed.


Ex-Labour transport secretary Lord Andrew Adonis said the move would bring the institution closer to the people.

He claimed that, with plans to reform the Lords with direct elections being considered, its location should also be examined as too much government power and wealth was centred in London.

The proposal was backed by Midlands politicians who said Birmingham would be ideal for the nation’s second chamber.

Former Wolverhampton Labour MP Lord Dennis Turner said the region should also bag other government departments.

“There is so much in London that it is in danger of tipping into the sea,” he said.

“There are plenty of sites and opportunities for development in the West Midlands and they would be made very welcome.

“But I fear we would have trouble convincing the powers-that-be that the world does not revolve around London.”

Birmingham City Council leader Coun Mike Whitby said: “I support the idea, and would be happy to speak to the government about the formidable offer Birmingham could make.”

He added that he backed proposals to relocate government departments four years ago and continued: “I believe it to be essential to support not only an equitable distribution of investment, but also of influence.”

Lord Adonis, writing in the Spectator magazine, said: “If the House of Lords is going to be reformed next year, part of the reform should be to move it out of London to a city in the Midlands or the north.

“Half of our national politicians would then assemble well away from ‘Planet London’.

“The public purse would make a saving by selling the vast property portfolio the Lords has. And yes, yours truly – a proud Londoner – would be happy to lead the way, if by then I am still a member.”


Read More http://www.birminghampost.net/news/politics-news/2012/04/20/bid-for-the-house-of-lords-to-move-to-birmingham-65233-30798208/#ixzz1sbUAFzv9

ermm;)...



Read More http://www.birminghampost.net/news/politics-news/2012/04/20/bid-for-the-house-of-lords-to-move-to-birmingham-65233-30798208/#ixzz1sbUAFzv9


Madness and will never happen...another non story in ther Post...:bash:

Adonis was on the local news, the night he gave the Salford Quays comments.

Was clear from his interview he had no where in particular in mind, just thought moving away from London would be a good idea. He mentioned loads of non London Towns and cities, including Brum, as possible locations.

Still, as they all said on the TV, never ever going to happen.

I see where you're coming from, but does beign on the other side of quite a wide body of water automatically make something part of the same contiguous urban area? Thurrock/Tilbury/Grays and Dartford/Gravesend etc are opposite each other on a much narrower river crossing, yet are definitely not the same settlement.

http://cache2.asset-cache.net/xc/95570598.jpg?v=1&c=IWSAsset&k=2&d=6C4008C0FD9EB5A579F13C8EAC030A5948A84BD97A45FAEBD8EAC1A107A6CB71
http://i571.photobucket.com/albums/ss153/mikestanton/DSC_0639.jpg

Arf.

Is that the only meaningful thing you can say when you disagree with something? 'Arf'? :eek:

It was a reflex to a ridiculous comparison.

It's typical of the arbitary nature of the willy waving.

In all seriousness modern urban Wirral was developed to accommodate Liverpool shipyards and surburban commutators. Technology made the expansion of the city possible, quite different from the typical English model of small towns growing and merging over the last 200 years or so.

Some of the comparisons on here are sub region to city. The West Yorkshire analogy to Merseyside or Greater Manchester is a classic example. The closer comparison would be between West Yorkshire and Liverpool/Manchester but even that doesn't work as the dynamic of the North West is quite different.

I see where you're coming from, but does beign on the other side of quite a wide body of water automatically make something part of the same contiguous urban area? Thurrock/Tilbury/Grays and Dartford/Gravesend etc are opposite each other on a much narrower river crossing, yet are definitely not the same settlement.

http://cache2.asset-cache.net/xc/95570598.jpg?v=1&c=IWSAsset&k=2&d=6C4008C0FD9EB5A579F13C8EAC030A5948A84BD97A45FAEBD8EAC1A107A6CB71
http://i571.photobucket.com/albums/ss153/mikestanton/DSC_0639.jpg

Hardly comparable. The picture below shows what is functionally one city. The central area is located on one side of the river at the narrowest point. All roads lead to Rome. The picture above looks more like the Runcorn gap.

http://farm5.staticflickr.com/4017/5147353375_fee31dc09a_b.jpg

You guys might be getting your D&Ds and such, but we're getting the world's largest TGI Fridays!! :banana:

So now we have an All Star Lanes which only appears in London.
And a Le Relais Entrecote which only appears in London, Paris, and New York

Beat THAT.

Beat THAT.

We have Central Perk from Friends. :dunno:

What do you mean you have Central Perk from Friends?

There is a cafe in Trafford Park called Central Perk.

Is it any different to that?

What do you mean you have Central Perk from Friends?

There is a cafe in Trafford Park called Central Perk.

Is it any different to that?

I don't know about the one in Trafford, but the one in Liverpool is a replica of the cafe in Friends. :)

It doesn't really show inside, but here's the website: http://www.central-perk.co.uk/

Suppose some like coffee shops.

Suppose some people liked Friends.

Not one for me though.

Don't we already have a Central Perk in Piccadilly area? I'm sure I met a friend in there once...

Don't we already have a Central Perk in Piccadilly area? I'm sure I met a friend in there once...

Maybe it's a common cafe name? :dunno:

Below is the interior in the Liverpool one.

http://www.sevenstreets.com/image-uploads/2012/03/central-perk.jpg

Looks fucking dreadful.

Commercialisation bullshit selling coffee at mental prices.

What is the state of the heads of people to want to pay overly inflated prices for shitty coffee just because the room is laid out like a dull comedy from a decade ago?

Well I think it's great.

Certainly better than the generic Costas and Starbucks.

It probably will cost quite a lot though

And expect a lot of people expecting to want to sit on the "friends table"

London has one.

I can just imagine the type of person who would go in them as well.

So now we have an All Star Lanes which only appears in London.
And a Le Relais Entrecote which only appears in London, Paris, and New York


Not much use to you then are they?

Not sure what that's supposed to mean.

Are there invisible ones somewhere around Manchester? :?

http://www.sevenstreets.com/image-uploads/2012/03/central-perk.jpg


pastiche

an incongruous combination of materials, forms, motifs, etc., taken from different sources; hodgepodge.

"That's £2.50 please."

"A Blueberry Muffin is £2.75."

You guys might be getting your D&Ds and such, but we're getting the world's largest TGI Fridays!! :banana:


Considering TGI Fridays is shite, it's nothing to be proud of really. Hooters have two restaurants in the UK. One in Nottingham and another in Cardiff. Not even London has one. Still doesn't make it good.

I quite like Friends. :shifty:

But luckily I have real cafes I can go to.

:lol: You're probably the last person on this forum I thought would have liked friends.

Considering TGI Fridays is shite, it's nothing to be proud of really. Hooters have two restaurants in the UK. One in Nottingham and another in Cardiff. Not even London has one. Still doesn't make it good.


I'm sure there is one in Bristol too

:lol: You're probably the last person on this forum I thought would have liked friends.

Sometimes I just can't be fucked being smart, or realistic, or interesting, or edgy, or anything else. Then the 3 years of conditioning through E4 repeats kicks in and I remember sometimes Chandler says funny things.

Considering TGI Fridays is shite, it's nothing to be proud of really. Hooters have two restaurants in the UK. One in Nottingham and another in Cardiff. Not even London has one. Still doesn't make it good.It's difficult to beat Hooters, for wings. 10 traditional with TMI sauce, a side of fries with cheese sauce and celery with blue cheese dip? Unbeatable. But that's here in the US.

PS: The Wing House and Tilted Kilt have passable wings too.

You guys might be getting your D&Ds and such, but we're getting the world's largest TGI Fridays!! :banana:

So now we have an All Star Lanes which only appears in London.
And a Le Relais Entrecote which only appears in London, Paris, and New York

Beat THAT.

When you get D&D and Everyman then we'll talk.

Until then...

http://28.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m2mw7fkVpT1ql5yr7o1_400.gif

When you get D&D and Everyman then we'll talk.

Until then...

http://28.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m2mw7fkVpT1ql5yr7o1_400.gif

I'm not exactly "into" fine dining but it seems pretty clear to me that Le Relais Entrecôte, at least, is a lot more exclusive than D&D who have 23 restaurants.

I wonder why places such as Hard Rock Cafe and TGI seemingly do so well in Manchester?

My guess is two fold.

1) the football crowds, we get a fair few overseas and long distance visitors to the city. HRC especially is something of a destination to go to when you are in town - hence popular with the out of town crowd.

2) We get a load of people in town from a fair old distance for the MEN, retail and general goings on in town. Again, as these people are coming from places like Stoke, Blackburn, Newcastle (loads of hen and stag dos in town recently from the North East), please that don't have HRC, but people that are willing to give TGI or HRC a go.


FWIW - at one point there was a HRC in London, Edinburgh, Manc, Brum, Nottingham, Cardiff, Leeds and Belfast.

Now just the London, Edinburgh and Manc ones survive.

There must be something going on to support this rare brand, something that is pulling in TGI I suspect.

I'm not exactly "into" fine dining but it seems pretty clear to me that Le Relais Entrecôte, at least, is a lot more exclusive than D&D who have 23 restaurants.

Theres no brand awareness for Le blenqeehbfjb.

So while I don't question it will be a fine edition to Manchester's dining scene it will need alot more to get people talking. While D&D is apparently a well known restaurant.

Chose the wrong time to google "Le Relais Entrecôte" on the 6th month anniversary of me becoming a vegetarian. Fuckkkkkkkk. Wish these cultured meat boffins would get a move on.

Theres no brand awareness for Le blenqeehbfjb.

So while I don't question it will be a fine edition to Manchester's dining scene it will need alot more to get people talking. While D&D is apparently a well known restaurant.

So we should come back when we get a new McDonalds, then will it happen?

10123 is never going to admit that we have some pretty good nosh opening in Manchester in the next few months.

Still, I don't mind. Let him keep preaching about D&D. We'll carry on enjoying our Le Relais Entrecote, which only appears in three other cities in the world, and our World's Largest TGI Fridays.

Seems pretty good to me.

I definitely won't be enjoying either of those places.

Preach it sister!

http://media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lwn32c6Rkf1qgpaiu.gif

The phrase 'world's largest TGI fridays' genuinely makes me feel nauseous.

The phrase 'world's largest TGI fridays' genuinely makes me feel nauseous.

It ain't intended for you. It is for the patents taking their kids to Manchester to do some Christmas shopping.

Have they got a Hairy Horse?

Well I'd never eat there obviously, simply the idea that Manchester will have the worlds largest TFI fridays makes me feel ill.

Well I'd never eat there obviously, simply the idea that Manchester will have the worlds largest TFI fridays makes me feel ill.

It will be popular and will create some (low paid) jobs which is positive.

Put it this way.

The Hard Rock has survived in Manchester. I stand corrected, but isn't there only one more surviving in England or the UK?

Business should pick up as well, what with the National Football Museum opening across the road and another CL with both Manchester clubs in it.

The UK's largest Hard Cock. http://www.hardrock.com/locations/cafes3/cafe.aspx?LocationID=55&MIBenumID=3

As above Manchester, London and Edinburgh survive.

Leeds, Brum, Nottingham, Belfast and Cardiff failed.

I've honestly never heard of the Hard Rock Cafe.

It must not have been popular.

I've honestly never heard of the Hard Rock Cafe.

It must not have been popular.

Clearly the one in Leeds was not popular it last about 2 years.

I've honestly never heard of the Hard Rock Cafe.

It must not have been popular.

Clearly, the one in Leeds was not popular it lasted about 5 years.

The UK's largest Hard Cock.

:naughty:

I've honestly never heard of the Hard Rock Cafe.

It must not have been popular.

No. Seriously?

Find a location. http://www.hardrock.com/

No. Seriously?

Find a location. http://www.hardrock.com/

All the globally important cities have one :lol:

I've honestly never heard of the Hard Rock Cafe.

It must not have been popular.I was in one when i was in florida. I liked it but wouldnt rave on about it. I liked the rainforest cafe better.

Hard Rock Cafe was always packed in Leeds. It didn't close because it was unpopular, it closed because the business was taken over in a deal that didn't include many of its cafes.

Hard Rock Cafe was always packed in Leeds. It didn't close because it was unpopular, it closed because the business was taken over in a deal that didn't include many of its cafes.

Odd that the Manchester one stayed open along with a hundred our so other ones :lol:

Frankie and Benny's with a few bits of shit memorabilia hanging on the walls, mostly non-local. Tacky clowntown shite.

They feel like Frankie and Benny's with a few bits of shit memorabilia hanging on the walls, mostly non-local. Tacky clowntown shite.And really overpriced here. but to be honest ive only been twice.

They feel like Frankie and Benny's with a few bits of shit memorabilia hanging on the walls, mostly non-local. Tacky clowntown shite.

Maybe, but all the global cities have one.

Name a single important global city where they don't have a presence.

They are clearly very popular with many people who visit they cities.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hard_Rock_Cafe

Look at all those cities that have one today in 2012.

Cities that for one reason or another seem to be attracting many people into the city for a short stay for some entertainment reason I would suggest.

Maybe, but all the global cities have one.

Name a single important global city where they don't have a presence.

They are clearly very popular with many people who visit they cities.



Shanghai

They feel like Frankie and Benny's with a few bits of shit memorabilia hanging on the walls, mostly non-local. Tacky clowntown shite.

No way Yosh!

It's like saying the Cavern is just a glorified coal bunker. :wink2:

Just look at thatmemorabilia .

It has an awe-inspiring collection of authentic music memorabilia, with priceless pieces from The Beatles, Pearl Jam and Jimi Hendrix plus Mancunian greats such as Simply Red, Oasis, The Smiths, Stone Roses, Happy Mondays and Herman's Hermits gracing the cafe walls, along with more recent additions including stage costumes worn by Madonna and Tina Turner.
And so to the menu…. Hard Rock Cafe believe in sticking to what they do best, the American classics with a few surprises thrown in for good measure. The most popular starters include tasty Santa Fe spring rolls, succulent hickory-smoked chicken wings, potato skins, Tupelo chicken, and of course the Jumbo Combo; all guaranteed to rock your senses.

http://blogdadois.files.wordpress.com/2011/07/5527_hard_rock_cafe_manchester.png

http://blogdadois.files.wordpress.com/2011/07/hard-rock-cafe.png

http://www.restaurantsofmanchester.com/american/hardrockcafe.htm

Let's see who bites first.

Clearly had a falling out with the Chinese, they all closed half a decade ago.

Still, certain types of cities get one (Shanghai had one), certain types of cities maintain one.

In the UK only Edinburgh, London and Manc meet those criteria.

Shanghai

Shangpool.

Clearly had a falling out with the Chinese, they all closed half a decade ago.

Still, certain types of cities get one (Shanghai had one), certain types of cities maintain one.

In the UK only Edinburgh, London and Manc meet those criteria.what is that criteria?

Clearly had a falling out with the Chinese, they all closed half a decade ago.

Still, certain types of cities get one (Shanghai had one), certain types of cities maintain one.

In the UK only Edinburgh, London and Manc meet those criteria.



Is Beijing not in China?

http://www.hardrock.com/locations/cafes3/cafe.aspx?LocationID=5&MIBEnumID=3

It is, doesn't change they seem to have closed a load of their places in China not so long ago.

Anyway, as I was saying, tends to be the big important global cities on there doesn't it?

Certainly something that goes in the positive column when considering how successful a city is at getting outsiders to spend their money in town, something I bet the local tourism boards in nearly all the UK cities would love to have to market themselves with.

Tell me yoshef - with the hoards of visitors in Liverpool, many visiting the Beatles, why has there never been a Hard Rock in Liverpool?

Manchester is more important than Shanghai, using Kurt's patented Hard Rock Cafe methodology.

Your logic doesn't follow.

I said globally important cities tend to have a Hard Rock Cafe.

Not, despite what you would want me to have said, that all cities with a HRC are globally important.

Nice try. :lol:

I said globally important cities tend to have a Hard Rock Cafe.



LOL!

Tell me yoshef - with the hoards of visitors in Liverpool, many visiting the Beatles, why has there never been a Hard Rock in Liverpool?


Well, whenever they were expanding in the UK, last decade or whenever, pre-2008, perhaps at that time Liverpool was way off the tourist/retail map.

Your logic doesn't follow.

I said globally important cities tend to have a Hard Rock Cafe.

Not, despite what you would want me to have said, that all cities with a HRC are globally important.

Nice try. :lol:


Shanghai doesn't have a Hard Rock Cafe, ergo it's probably not globally important.

Manchester has a Hard Rock Cafe, ergo it's probably globally important.

Which post did are you going from there?

Please feel free to quote me.

I posted globally important cities tend to have HRC - they do, that is indisputable.

I never ever said that having a HRC makes a city globally important.

Like usual you are trying to make out that I have said something I have not because you are trying to make a point that doesn't exist. :lol:

I will make it simple for you, the list below contains all the cities that you would consider to be of global importance.

However, not all cities on the list are globally important...

London
Toronto
Los Angeles
Tokyo*Roppongi
New York
San Francisco
Stockholm
Chicago
Houston
Dallas
Cancún
Honolulu
Reykjavík
New Orleans
La Jolla
Sydney
Toronto*SkyDome
Boston
Acapulco
Washington DC
Singapore
Orlando
Maui
Las Vegas*at*Hard Rock Hotel
Montreal
Puerto Vallarta
Aspen
Calgary
Bangkok
Kuala Lumpur
Paris
Osaka
Tijuana
Berlin
Jakarta
Atlanta
Newport Beach
St. Thomas
San Juan
Tel Aviv
Miami
Mexico City
Bali
Taipei
Beijing
Nashville
Edmonton
Cozumel
Hong Kong*Kowloon
Madrid
San Antonio
Kanata
Hong Kong*at Chater Road
Vancouver
Edmonton
Myrtle Beach
Copenhagen
Whistler
Buenos Aires
Melbourne
Phoenix
Banff
Taichung
Cabo San Lucas
Antwerp
Makati
Hollywood*at*Universal City Walk
Surfers Paradise
Ottawa
Niagara Falls USA
Shanghai
Guangzhou
Key West
Atlantic City
Cape Town
Seoul
Niagara Falls Canada
Beirut
Shenzhen
Nagoya
Baltimore
Yokohama
Sacramento
Amman
Bahrain
Barcelona
Memphis
Dubai
Philadelphia
Lima
Edinburgh
Guam
Ankara
Lake Tahoe
Cleveland
Salt Lake City
Kona
Sharm el-Sheikh
San Diego
Saipan
St Louis
Denver
Guadalajara
Rome
Orlando
Amsterdam
Indianapolis
Kobe
Ft. Lauderdale
Gatlinburg
Oasis
Fukuoka
Cayman Islands
Rio de Janeiro
Manchester
Malta
Osaka*Universal
Cairo
Belfast
Queenstown
Managua
Osaka
Bogotá
Pattaya
Birmingham
Phoenix
Austin
Munich
Tokyo*Uyeno-Eki
Nottingham
Pittsburgh
San Francisco
Minneapolis
Leeds
Cologne
Lisbon
Moscow
Cardiff
Nassau
Detroit
Catania
Hollywood FL
Louisville
Dublin
Destin
Foxwoods
Panama
Athens
Hurghada
Kuwait
Gothenburg
Caracas
New York
Gran Canaria
Oslo
Belo Horizonte
Santo Domingo
Mumbai
Narita
Ocho Rios
Margarita
Warsaw
Biloxi
Boston
Punta Cana
Fiji
Cartagena
Bengaluru
Singapore Changi Airport
Bucharest
Seoul
Mallorca
Aruba
Pune
Yankee Stadium
Prague
Venice
New Delhi
Dallas
Las Vegas
Penang
Hyderabad
Marbella
Phuket
Ho Chi Minh City
Seattle
Sentosa
Berlin
Kraków
Hollywood*on*Hollywood Blvd
Medellín
Honolulu
Glyfada
St Maarten
Tampa
Hong Kong*at*Lan Kwai Fong
Florence
Sydney
Costa Maya
Hamburg
Dubai
Budapest
Macau
Nicosia
Helsinki
Hanoi
Nabq
Limassol
Santiago
Melaka
Colombo
San José
Chennai
Brussels
New Buffalo, Michigan (Hard Rock Four Winds)

Which post did are you going from there?

Please feel free to quote me.

I posted globally important cities tend to have HRC - they do, that is indisputable.

I never ever said that having a HRC makes a city globally important.

Like usual you are trying to make out that I have said something I have not because you are trying to make a point that doesn't exist. :lol:




Shanghai, Rotterdam, Istanbul, St Petersburg

Aye, used to though didn't it.

No idea why that one closed but doesn't change the simple fact that globally important cities tend to have a HRC. They have all certainly had one at some point (I see Cairo's closed around the time of the revolution).

Sure, you have thought of one example that used to but closed, doesn't change the simple fact that almost all globally important cities are on that list.

P.S.

tend/tend/
Verb:
Regularly or frequently behave in a particular way or have a certain characteristic: "written language tends to be formal".

Guangzhou, Shenzhen, Shantou

I will make it simple for you, the list below contains all the cities that you would consider to be of global importance.But some are not even cities but suburbs of cities.

However, not all cities on the list are globally important...True; the likes of La Jolla is a suburb of San Diego as is, almost, Tijuana, Whistler is a ski resort outside of Vancouver, Sentosa is a small day-trip island off Singapore, Kanata is a suburb of Ottawa, Canada, Cabo san Lucas is a resort town at the bottom of Bahia California (Sea of Cortes,) St. Thomas is an Island in the USVI and the HRC is in the town of Charlotte Amalie, and on St. Maarten it is in Phillipsburg. It was originally in Marigot on the French side, St. Marten, Ocho Rios is a small resort town on Jamaica, etc. The Hard Rock Cafe is an overpriced hamburger joint.

I think I read somewhere that one of the owners is also an owner of the Everton soccer club.

Guangzhou, Shenzhen, Shantou

You are getting boring.

You are about the only person in the world that thinks that HRC do not tend to set up in almost all globally important cities.

tend/tend/
Verb:
Regularly or frequently behave in a particular way or have a certain characteristic: "written language tends to be formal".

As I said, clearly the format doesn't work as well in China, still, they have given it a go in the most important cities in China, only for it to seemingly fail.

Dhaka, Karachi

The Hard Rock Cafe is an overpriced hamburger joint.


Aye. A globally important version of McDonalds.

Dhaka, Karachi

I think you're alone now.

In fact, I lost the point you were failing to make a long time ago so will leave you once more to your delusions for another night.

delusions of hamburger related importance?

I think LNGCats is the world's most boring person

Not really.

Just pointing out that having a HRC cafe in town and being able to sustain one, in a northern UK city that is not exactly big on tourism is no bad thing.

It is a positive sign of being able to get people from outside the area to spend money in the place. Something that international companies recognise and are willing to invest in the city to do so.

As is usual, if there was one in Liverpool, Leeds, Brum or where ever, but not Manc, it would be mentioned all the time.

The only reason this got mentioned was off the back of the TGI news which is again, the same part of the market and another sign that a certain type of person is coming to spend their money in Manchester (probably due to football, MEN and shopping) and more so than to other parts of the UK on the whole.

It's one of those signs, a sign to go along with all the masses of statistical evidence that you ignore as it is always in some manner flawed.

Not really.

Just pointing out that having a HRC cafe in town and being able to sustain one, in a northern UK city that is not exactly big on tourism is no bad thing.

It is a positive sign of being able to get people from outside the area to spend money in the place. Something that international companies recognise and are willing to invest in the city to do so.

As is usual, if there was one in Liverpool, Leeds, Brum or where ever, but not Manc, it would be mentioned all the time.

The only reason this got mentioned was off the back of the TGI news which is again, the same part of the market and another sign that a certain type of person is coming to spend their money in Manchester (probably due to football, MEN and shopping) and more so than to other parts of the UK on the whole.

It's one of those signs, a sign to go along with all the masses of statistical evidence that you ignore as it is always in some manner flawed.

Are you for real?

As is usual, if there was one in Liverpool, Leeds, Brum or where ever, but not Manc, it would be mentioned all the time.


Don't think anyone gives a shit to be honest.

Hard Rock Cafes are rubbish (IMO)

Don't think anyone gives a shit to be honest.True; The one in Orlando is full of Brit vacationers taking pictures and saying "Eee bah gum, lukt'this are Meg" :lol:. Most Floridians in the area drive west on I-4, for about an hour, to the HRC Casino in Tampa.

Sorry cats but :lol:

Don't think anyone gives a shit to be honest.

Indeed, but for whatever reason many took offence to the fact that it exists and caused a right kafuffle (spelling).

My sole point is, along with the TFI news the HRC is a sign that Manc, more so than almost everywhere else outside of London, is capable of getting people into town from slightly further afield than you would consider locals.

They are signs of the people that come in for shopping, football concerts at the MEN or whatever, groups of people that stay over that are visiting Manc from further afield are almost certainly what these companies are making money from.

Add to this the things like the hotel stays, number of hotel rooms, hotel occupancy, hotel rates etc and the pattern is repeated.

Now, I am certainly not saying Manc is some sort of tourism hotbed, it most certainly is not.

However, quite significant numbers of people from around the UK do seem to be spending more and more night stays in the city -fuelling the success in the hotels, HRC and TGI. Nothing more, nothing less.

The last time I was in Bali I believe (if memory serves me right) the HRC was located in the tourist and beach area of Kuta and not in Denpesar. HRC catered mostly to Australian tourist. Hardly Balinese, those being of the Hindu faith and who revere cows, not eat them.:lol:

"Just looking in my store madam":)

LOL at LNG, hasn't the one in New York closed anyway. The argument is irrelevant.

Besides globally important cities have D&D restaurants. Anyone seen the list of cities that have one...

* London
* Copenhagen
* Pairs
* Tokyo
* New York
* Leeds

;)

Anyway, be it London (http://www.hardrock.com/locations/cafes3/cafe.aspx?LocationID=91&MIBEnumID=3), New York (http://www.hardrock.com/locations/cafes3/cafe.aspx?LocationID=99&MIBEnumID=3), Toronto (http://www.hardrock.com/locations/cafes3/cafe.aspx?LocationID=65&MIBEnumID=3) (including the Blue Jays one before it closed), Paris (http://www.hardrock.com/locations/cafes3/cafe.aspx?LocationID=92&MIBEnumID=3), Berlin (http://www.hardrock.com/locations/cafes3/cafe.aspx?LocationID=573&MIBEnumID=3)...

I've been to 50 odd HRC in about 20 odd countries with the Mrs as she loves the cocktails that they sell.

oh, and if we are looking for more up market restaurants, hows about the Manc based San Carlos (http://www.sancarlo.co.uk/) that is slowly expanding across the country.

It is the restaurant that City's management team take their latest victim that they are about to sign so you often see pap pictures of footballers coming out of there in the middle of the night when they are linked to City.

oh, and if we are looking for more up market restaurants, hows about the Manc based San Carlos (http://www.sancarlo.co.uk/) that is slowly expanding across the country.

It is the restaurant that City's management team take their latest victim that they are about to sign so you often see pap pictures of footballers coming out of there in the middle of the night when they are linked to City.

Funny, we have 2 San Carlos restaurants in Leeds, Manc has one lol!!

oh, and if we are looking for more up market restaurants, hows about the Manc based San Carlos (http://www.sancarlo.co.uk/) that is slowly expanding across the country.

It is the restaurant that City's management team take their latest victim that they are about to sign so you often see pap pictures of footballers coming out of there in the middle of the night when they are linked to City.



San Carlo fitsy opend in Birmingham so think it is more Birmingham based. LOL
About San Carlo
Located across six vibrant cities, San Carlo is a must for people who appreciate fine Italian food, good service, luxurious and comfortable surroundings and value for money.

HISTORY OF SAN CARLO
The San Carlo story first began in 1992 in Birmingham, when Carlo Distefano opened the first San Carlo restaurant. San Carlo quickly became a favourite with many of the city's residents due to its authentic Italian food, ambient atmosphere and high standards of service. San Carlo now operates throughout the country with leading restaurants in Bristol, Leicester, Manchester, Liverpool and Leeds.

FOOD
All San Carlo restaurants create food of the highest quality, but each restaurant displays its own unique style in food due to the individuality of our creative chefs and management. San Carlo are proud to be able to provide the true essence of authentic Italian food in contemporary surroundings.

Funny, we have 2 San Carlos restaurants in Leeds, Manc has one lol!!

Actually there are two, San Carlo's and San Carlo Cicchetti. Saw Harry Redknapp in it last year.

http://www.sancarlocicchetti.co.uk/

I've been to 50 odd HRC in about 20 odd countries with the Mrs as she loves the cocktails that they sell.Most people would, when visiting Singapore visit the "Long Bar" at Raffles for a "Sling" or Dos Hermanos in Havana for a "Daiquiri" or a "Tom Collins" or a "Manhattan", in New York or a "Julep" in Savannah, a "Fuzzy Navel" in Dublin, OH., etc. It is only a parochial Manc that would go to an overpriced Micky Dees, for anything.:hilarious

Actually there are two, San Carlo's and San Carlo Cicchetti. Saw Harry Redknapp in it last year.

http://www.sancarlocicchetti.co.uk/

Not showing on their website.

LOL at LNG, hasn't the one in New York closed anyway. The argument is irrelevant.

Besides globally important cities have D&D restaurants. Anyone seen the list of cities that have one...

* London
* Copenhagen
* Pairs
* Tokyo
* New York
* Leeds

;)

THIS

Yes it is, look again.

http://www.sancarlo.co.uk/

LOL at LNG, hasn't the one in New York closed anyway. The argument is irrelevant.

Besides globally important cities have D&D restaurants. Anyone seen the list of cities that have one...

* London
* Copenhagen
* Pairs
* Tokyo
* New York
* Leeds

;)

Wow, if D&D open in any other city within the UK in the next couple of years, its going to be a huge blow for Leeds.

Wow, if D&D open in any other city within the UK in the next couple of years, its going to be a huge blow for Leeds.



http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-cdZBrZPzgCc/Twbh-zPlgCI/AAAAAAAACTc/O_2qCl7hN5k/s1600/dungeon_master.jpg

^^ And that's meant to mean??

Lol. Dungeons and dragons. You know that isn't far off what I picture 1018229 to look like. Some sort of sprite.

Wow, if D&D open in any other city within the UK in the next couple of years, its going to be a huge blow for Leeds.

http://28.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m2mw7fkVpT1ql5yr7o1_400.gif

:)

Can't wait!

10123'll eat his words.

Can't wait!

10123'll eat his words.

Seriously, if you hear about one of these opening somewhere else in say, 18 months, and you immediately think 'hahahha some poster on a geeky website was wrong!' you are a tragic individual.

They will expand because CEO said it's 'an excellent venue for our first restaurant in the North of England'.

In other words, more are coming.

Right, so in fact all this gloating from 10123 about the first D&D outside New York and Paris etc is, uhm, invalid?

Not quite, it's true, but it's silly to keep bringing it up when it might not be true for that long necessarily. It's a shot in the foot waiting to happen.

Having said that, if it ends up the same as the HN effect, HN Leeds seems to get more attention than the other regional stores despite it not being the only one outside London for quite some time now.

As far as I'm concerned, none of this is all that important really. Cities are not really in competition with each other in the same way reports would make out. They're in competition with their regional centres. In most cases people only have one or two choices of where to go for a big shopping day out; it's not a choice of all the major UK cities. People in Bristol aren't bothered about what's happening in Manchester, and people in Glasgow have no stake in what's happening in Leeds.

Do people in this thread honestly think that because one city has two Mcdonalds that that makes it more important than another city? Some of the posters are extreemly childish and an embarrasment to their own city. I have lived in two of the UK great cities and although I like one better than the other it is not because one has a bigger Mcdonalds or more Burger Kings or Curry take a ways than the other. Most people on here are waving their own dicks because that is the only dick they know. To really experience a place you must live in it. A day trip just wont do it i'm afraid. I think most people on here haven't even visited any other city except to go to a match never mind lived there.

Hard Rock Cafe as a symbol of global importance? Maybe a symbol of money without any sophistication or taste. Going to a new city and shunning the interesting local cuisine/nightlife for a generic Hard Rock Cafe is probably worse than going to the Costa Del Sol for a full English (at least those cafes are independently-run).

The first Pizza Huts that opened in China were fully booked 2 weeks in advance - does that make Pizza Hut a sign of sophistication and importance?

Clearly the one in Leeds was not popular it last about 2 years.

It failed to compete with a high quality local offering in the City Centre :)

They should have opened it at the White Rose Centre or Birstall - it'd have thrived amongst the other bland chains.

Hard Rock Cafe as a symbol of global importance? Maybe a symbol of money without any sophistication or taste. Going to a new city and shunning the interesting local cuisine/nightlife for a generic Hard Rock Cafe is probably worse than going to the Costa Del Sol for a full English (at least those cafes are independently-run).

The first Pizza Huts that opened in China were fully booked 2 weeks in advance - does that make Pizza Hut a sign of sophistication and importance?I know and you're right. Thanks for posting it and this post in quotes below is the kind of shite i'm talking about. It makes some people laugh but makes me embarrassed and want to puke when I see shite like that.
Anyway, be it London (http://www.hardrock.com/locations/cafes3/cafe.aspx?LocationID=91&MIBEnumID=3), New York (http://www.hardrock.com/locations/cafes3/cafe.aspx?LocationID=99&MIBEnumID=3), Toronto (http://www.hardrock.com/locations/cafes3/cafe.aspx?LocationID=65&MIBEnumID=3) (including the Blue Jays one before it closed), Paris (http://www.hardrock.com/locations/cafes3/cafe.aspx?LocationID=92&MIBEnumID=3), Berlin (http://www.hardrock.com/locations/cafes3/cafe.aspx?LocationID=573&MIBEnumID=3)...

I've been to 50 odd HRC in about 20 odd countries with the Mrs as she loves the cocktails that they sell.

Hard Rock Cafe as a symbol of global importance?

Who said that?

Are you misquoting people :lol:

It failed to compete with a high quality local offering in the City Centre :)

They should have opened it at the White Rose Centre or Birstall - it'd have thrived amongst the other bland chains.

It failed because there are insufficient numbers of the types of people that visit HRC in Leeds.

The lack of a football team(s) that drags in thousands of overseas and far away people each week, the lack of a very popular arena next door, the lack of the retail offering mean that insufficient people, parents with teenage kids on the whole, visited Leeds to make it a going conern.

It's that simple.

To repeat what I said last night.

In itself it means very little.

However, add together with the stats you see on how many hotel rooms are in each city, how many of those rooms are used in each city and what people pay and you get a small piece of a very large jigsaw.

Fact is, more people, of the type you go to HRC, visit Manc that the other cities, hence the higher number of busy hotels, hence things like HRC can survive whereas they cannot elsewhere.

It failed because there are insufficient numbers of the types of people that visit HRC in Leeds.

The lack of a football team(s) that drags in thousands of overseas and far away people each week, the lack of a very popular arena next door, the lack of the retail offering mean that insufficient people, parents with teenage kids on the whole, visited Leeds to make it a going conern.

It's that simple.

What an absolute pea brain

It failed because there are insufficient numbers of the types of people that visit HRC in Leeds.

The lack of a football team(s) that drags in thousands of overseas and far away people each week, the lack of a very popular arena next door, the lack of the retail offering mean that insufficient people, parents with teenage kids on the whole, visited Leeds to make it a going conern.

It's that simple.

What a load of tosh!! How do you account for the closure of the Birmingham HRC then??

What a load of tosh!! How do you account for the closure of the Birmingham HRC then??



In the total wrong location at the Top of Broad Street ????

HRC in the Bullring opposite selfridges, its a no brainer but HRC havent even though of it, pity them.
But Birmingham doesnt miss this kind of establishmnet, we are too upmarket for Hard rock cafes, we aspire to "michelin" standards, LOL

In the total wrong location at the Top of Broad Street ????

HRC in the Bullring opposite selfridges, its a no brainer but HRC havent even though of it, pity them.
But Birmingham doesnt miss this kind of establishmnet, we are too upmarket for Hard rock cafes, we aspire to "michelin" standards, LOL


Oh dear I hate it when I have to get involved...but 3 Michelin stared restaurants are in Brum ( 4th one could be on the cards soon )...think thats not too bad for good old Brum huh ?...yes I know your all googling it now muttering ....'really ugly Birmingham 3 of them cuuuh ? '...but alas Industrial Brum with its Chineese Tat lol does indeed ........

In Brum we just don't shout about ourselves enough, were just nice down to earth people who really aren't that bothered...perhaps thats not a good thing ?...who knows !..Manc shout alot and it does them no harm to be fair... anyway back to topic....

I could dig out the article earlier this year from the biggest newspaper in the world ( New York Times ) placing Birmingham as the regional Culinary capital of the UK but whats the point we are not that bothered remember !...

...listen id love to have a 'HRC'...but seriously we wont cry over not having one lol !...

It failed because there are insufficient numbers of the types of people that visit HRC in Leeds.

The lack of a football team(s) that drags in thousands of overseas and far away people each week, the lack of a very popular arena next door, the lack of the retail offering mean that insufficient people, parents with teenage kids on the whole, visited Leeds to make it a going conern.

It's that simple.

The Leeds location might have worked if the Arena had been there, as Albion Street will be a key route up to the Arena when it opens next year.

As for 'types of people that visit HRC', such as your good self, they probably went to Tiger Tiger next door instead, as it offers better deals. Certainly a few more chain bars have opened along Albion Street/Woodhouse Lane since the closure of HRC, so presumably they just weren't geared up to be competitive when the economic downturn occurred.

Aye, as I said, there are insufficient of that type of person going to Leeds.

Guess what, there is a Tiger Tiger next door to HRC in Manc - both survive.

As I keep repeating, in itself it means nowt.

However, add it to the higher number of hotel room stays, it is simply a small part of showing that more people, of a certain type (family for shops, young people for concerts, overseas and long distance travellers for football) travel to Manc than to other non-London cities and stay over in England.

Close your eyes, pretend that Leeds and Brum have as many people staying in hotels each Friday and Saturday night visiting town for the local football/concert or whatever.

The reality is Leeds (in your case) doesn't have and never will have a football team(s) that drags in loads of people into the city hotels for the weekends.

It will never have an arena that is as successful at pulling in young people into the hotels, bars and restaurants as the MEN.

As I say, just a small piece of a jigsaw, but a jigsaw all the same.

The Manc HRC does not survive because of locals go there I bet. It will be these 'outsiders' heading to town that see it as a bit 'unique' something that they don't have at home. It is simply a sympton of having lots of outsiders in town each weekend.

As I keep repeating, in itself it means nowt.

However, add it to the higher number of hotel room stays, it is simply a small part of showing that more people, of a certain type (family for shops, young people for concerts, overseas and long distance travellers for football) travel to Manc than to other non-London cities and stay over in England.I wonder what makes us so popular with tourists? I mean we don't have anything better than brum, leeds or liverpool for tourists and compared to liverpool and glasgow we shouldnt realy be in the same league. Do you think it is just the football and arena that make us really popular with visitors?

I don't.

I think certain types of people go to football and concerts. The type of people who will frequent HRC and TGI.

The reason that more of this type of people visit Manchester from overseas or where ever is not because Manchester is better at anything, it is simply down to the fact that we have one (maybe two) very large football teams that people come from overseas and over land to watch. Those people are having a special event, something they don't do very often. They are the demographic of the people who go in the HRC and TGI.

Likewise the MEN arena, exactly the same applies.

I am not saying Manc is a better tourist destination - no matter how much you want me to say so, I am just giving you reasons why there are three times the hotel rooms in manc compared to Liverpool (4,200 compared to 1,400 according to the report jrb quoted recently) with higher occupancy and higher room rates.

Tell me, why do you think that to be the case if it is not people coming to the arena or footballing events?

Granted these figures are a year old, but things have not changed that much in 12months.

Those who disagree with me that there are more people coming to Manc for weekends, for football, for MEN for retail for whatever, please explain this report...

http://www.placenorthwest.co.uk/news/archive/9533-hotel-occupancy-rises-in-manchester-falls-in-liverpool.html

The table at the bottom of this article is much clearer if you click on the link.

Hotel occupancy rises in Manchester, falls in Liverpool
13 Jul 2011, 12:26
Hotels in cities across the North West experienced contrasting results in performance during May, according to new figures released by PKF Hotel Consultancy Services.
Research by PKF showed Manchester demonstrated a particularly strong performance, with rooms yield in the city rising by 7.0% from £57.05 in May 2010 to £61.05 this year.
PKF said this was driven primarily by a 4.6% increase in room rate to £76.99 alongside a 2.3% rise in occupancy to 79.3%.
The report said Chester hoteliers also had a good month in May, despite a 1.8% fall in occupancy to 70.5%. Figures showed room rate in Chester increased by 6.2% from £65.25 in 2010 to £69.29 in 2011. PKF said this resulted in a rooms yield of £48.85, a 4.6% improvement on the previous year's results.
Unlike Manchester and Chester, PKF said Liverpool and Blackpool struggled to match the previous year's results.
In the seaside town of Blackpool, room rate increased 0.9% in May 2011 to £61.23, while occupancy fell 3.5% from 67.5% to 65.1%, resulting in an overall rooms yield of £39.86, a drop of 2.6% when compared to the same time last year.
PKF said a similar picture was painted in Liverpool, with rooms yield in the city falling by 6.4% from £50.05 to £46.86, following a 0.9% decline in occupancy to 69.6% and a 5.5% drop in room rate to £67.33.
Days Inn Liverpool is one of the latest hotels to open in the city, located in former offices in James Street, which is operated by Sanguine Hospitality.
Paris D'Allessandro, general manager at Days Inn Liverpool, said: "The summer months are challenging times for hoteliers and dropping rates is one way to be more competitive.
"We are operating at a rate of more than 20% above forecast occupancy and we are very positive about the coming months. That said, there is no room for complacency and you must offer a quality product to be able to compete and attract guests, which is something we are benefitting from."
Jane Jackson, partner at PKF, added: "This is the most positive set of results so far this year for the region. That said it is evident that the market is still fragile and we are a long way off a full recovery. Significant challenges remain within the region's hotels, which are heavily reliant on the MICE (meetings, incentives, conferences and exhibitions) and corporate markets. Skilful revenue management will be required to further nurture the recovery of the local hotel market."
The following table shows final data from PKF Hotel Consultancy Services for May 2011:
Rooms department
2011
2010
% change
Manchester hotels
Average daily room rate per occupied room
£76.99
£73.63
4.6
Average daily room occupancy
79.3%
77.5%
2.3
Average daily rooms yield per available room
£61.05
£57.05
7.0
Approximate number of rooms per day
4,200
Liverpool hotels
Average daily room rate per occupied room
£67.33
£71.25
-5.5
Average daily room occupancy
69.6%
70.2%
-0.9
Average daily rooms yield per available room
£46.86
£50.05
-6.4
Approximate number of rooms per day
1,450
Chester hotels
Average daily room rate per occupied room
£69.29
£65.25
6.2
Average daily room occupancy
70.5%
71.8%
-1.8
Average daily rooms yield per available room
£48.85
£46.86
7.3
Approximate number of rooms per day
700
Blackpool hotels
Average daily room rate per occupied room
£61.23
£60.66
0.9
Average daily room occupancy
65.1%
67.5%
-3.5
Average daily rooms yield per available room
£39.86
£40.93
-2.6
Approximate number of rooms per day
650




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UPDATE: Adds comment from Days Inn Liverpool…
comment by Ed | 13/07/2011 16:44:34



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Who is staying at all those extra hotel rooms in Manc? What are they doing when here?

I don't.

I think certain types of people go to football and concerts. The type of people who will frequent HRC and TGI.

The reason that more of this type of people visit Manchester from overseas or where ever is not because Manchester is better at anything, it is simply down to the fact that we have one (maybe two) very large football teams that people come from overseas and over land to watch. Those people are having a special event, something they don't do very often. They are the demographic of the people who go in the HRC and TGI.

Likewise the MEN arena, exactly the same applies.

I am not saying Manc is a better tourist destination - no matter how much you want me to say so, I am just giving you reasons why there are three times the hotel rooms in manc compared to Liverpool (4,200 compared to 1,400 according to the report jrb quoted recently) with higher occupancy and higher room rates.

Tell me, why do you think that to be the case if it is not people coming to the arena or footballing events?


Dunno which report that is from, but IIRC from a report I saw there were over 4200 rooms, just in Liverpool City Centre, and over 8000 in the city.

From PKF Hotel Consultancy Services.

They stated that on average 4,200 rooms per night are in use in Manc each night, 1,450 in Liverpool, 700 in Chester and 650 in Blackpool.

So, the reality is Liverpool is by far and away closer to Chester and Blackpool than it is to Manchester.

See link in post above for details.

Btw - you are suggesting (8,000 rooms in Liverpool) that Liverpool has about 1/10 of the hotel rooms used in London each night (according to PKF Hotel Consultancy Services). I doubt that very much.

Oh, and this is exactly what I mean.

Don't trust the stats we get from independent places. Pretend they are not real.

Ignore the secondary symptoms - HRC being sustainable in Manc but not elsewhere.

Ignore the explanations for this higher hotel occupancy - football, MEN and larger business sector (for the week days).

In fact, just ignore everything that does not fit with your view point and get upset when someone on the media/government says something that reflects reality.

Dunno which report that is from, but IIRC from a report I saw there were over 4200 rooms, just in Liverpool City Centre, and over 8000 in the city.

These hotel reports just take snippets from each city. They don't compare total stock.

These hotel reports just take snippets from each city. They don't compare total stock.

Indeed, they are trying to give an approximate number of average stays in hotel rooms in the city over a year from what their web site says.

For example, they are saying that in London last August, during the riots month, the figures dropped to about 16k / night on average.

They are not biased in anyway, just an independent company reflecting what is going on.

Reflecting for whatever reason more people, many more people, are willing to pay much more to stay in a hotel each night than in other places.

I have attempted to give the reasons for this. Other have pretended that this is not real and simply, as usual, ignore the independent reports that they don't like.

Oh, and this is exactly what I mean.

Don't trust the stats we get from independent places. Pretend they are not real.

Ignore the secondary symptoms - HRC being sustainable in Manc but not elsewhere.

Ignore the explanations for this higher hotel occupancy - football, MEN and larger business sector (for the week days).

In fact, just ignore everything that does not fit with your view point and get upset when someone on the media/government says something that reflects reality.

Surely you could argue that Liverpool's football reputation is up there with Manchester's, particularly abroad?

I think the MEN probably has more of a factor in HRC's success, as well as the city centre being geographically a lot more spread out (meaning people pick and choose what areas they spend their night in, and the whole bar offering of the city doesn't service as competition as in other, more compact city centres).

I didn't talk about reputation.
I talked about how many people come to Manchester to the football.

OT holds 76k people, a large number of which come from far and wide - just look at the coaches each time there is a home game.

City's ground holds 46k and is starting to draw more people from further afield.

How many people, in comparison, visit Everton and Liverpool? Sure, famous clubs etc, but I'd suggest the small grounds makes the numbers coming from far afield much lower.

Agree about the location of the HRC -hence why I repeatedly use that as one of the reasons for the correct type of person visiting the city to use the place to make it viable.

The MEN attracts about 1.2m people per year, from memory that is about three times the next busiest none London arena in the country. That has an effect on the number of people coming into town and making use of TGI/HRC type things that they may well not find at home.

It also helps explain the busy hotels on the weekends.

They stated that on average 4,200 rooms per night are in use in Manc each night, 1,450 in Liverpool, 700 in Chester and 650 in Blackpool.




there are three times the hotel rooms in manc compared to Liverpool (4,200 compared to 1,400 according to the report jrb quoted recently)



Which one then?

In use, about 3 times on average are used in Manc compared to Liverpool according to the independent report.

Just like there is about 3 times as much grade A office space let each year, just like there is about 3 (nearly 4 actually) times as many serviced office rentals.

See the theme?

Probably not, didn't agree with your preconceptions.

Take a read of the report, it may give you an unblinkered view of the real world.

And the airport accounts for a lot of overnight stays. If you are coming from Carlyle for a early flight you will need to be here the night before. I dont know if this is also applies to liverpool airport. Coz I think liverpool is as well known as united around the world and I know people come from ireland and northern ireland to watch everton as well as liverpool just like united. Must be the airport factor for the boost in hotel room accupancy. Just my thoughts.

I agree it will, but it won't be enough to get close to making up the difference unless you are suggesting that more people stay at hotels at Manchester airport than in Liverpool in total.

Of course the airport, just like the MEN, retail and football teams, brings a lot of secondary jobs to the area.

Those people from Carlisle and their money is just as welcome as those going to the football.

Oh and again, I never said Liverpool was not as well known, I said the small stadium restricted the number of people visiting.

Oh and again, I never said Liverpool was not as well known, I said the small stadium restricted the number of people visiting.

The oddball city gets a lot of visitors, precisely for being different.

I agree it will, but it won't be enough to get close to making up the difference unless you are suggesting that more people stay at hotels at Manchester airport than in Liverpool in total.No I am not saying that I am thinking though that there are more hotels at manchester airport than at liverpool airport and as liverpool doesnt have as many passengers flying there. a one night stay at the airport is as good as a one night stay in town. also with liverpool now having the new shopping precinct liverpool 1 it is in my opinion a better shopping experience than the trafford center. And I think most people who come anywhere for shopping do it on a day trip. No I think the airport plays a massive role in our numbers.

No I am not saying that I am thinking though that there are more hotels at manchester airport than at liverpool airport and as liverpool doesnt have as many passengers flying there. a one night stay at the airport is as good as a one night stay in town. also with liverpool now having the new shopping precinct liverpool 1 it is in my opinion a better shopping experience than the trafford center. And I think most people who come anywhere for shopping do it on a day trip. No I think the airport plays a massive role in our numbers.

I was suggesting that Manchester airport has about 600 rooms in the three hotels, Bewleys, Hilton and Radisson. Given they will not be full each night they are not having as big effect as you suggest.

Either way, just like there is three times the office space there seems to be proportionally the same ratio of businessmen staying in the hotels during the week.

This 3:1 ratio crops up in a couple of stats like this.

Of you think the airport is massive, then is shows how small the Liverpool figures are.

Of the 4,200 in Manchester what proportion are staying at the airport do you reckon?

And in which hotels?

See the theme?


Yep. Tourists in Manchester stay in Grade A Office space too.

Yep. Tourists in Manchester stay in Grade A Office space too.

Who said they did?

Just thought it interesting that you see the same ratio.

If the same amount of businessmen stay in hotels (I've heard businessmen use hotels during the week) for each 1,000 sq ft off office space in each city you'd expect 3 times add many hotel stays in Manchester would you not?

I don't.

I think certain types of people go to football and concerts. The type of people who will frequent HRC and TGI.

The reason that more of this type of people visit Manchester from overseas or where ever is not because Manchester is better at anything, it is simply down to the fact that we have one (maybe two) very large football teams that people come from overseas and over land to watch. Those people are having a special event, something they don't do very often. They are the demographic of the people who go in the HRC and TGI.

Likewise the MEN arena, exactly the same applies.

I am not saying Manc is a better tourist destination - no matter how much you want me to say so, I am just giving you reasons why there are three times the hotel rooms in manc compared to Liverpool (4,200 compared to 1,400 according to the report jrb quoted recently) with higher occupancy and higher room rates.

Tell me, why do you think that to be the case if it is not people coming to the arena or footballing events?


Your Probably right, the same reason why Manchester can sustain HRC restaurants but cannot sustain a quality restaurant scene cause who wants to eat in a city centre full of football fans if you want a lovely meal, the same reason why Birmingham can sustain this kind of establishment becouse its city centre is not full of rowdy football fans.
Still feel Birmingham could sustain a big HRC though, defo in the Bullring area of the city, football fans or not.

Who said they did?

Just thought it interesting that you see the same ratio.

If the same amount of businessmen stay in hotels (I've heard businessmen use hotels during the week) for each 1,000 sq ft off office space in each city you'd expect 3 times add many hotel stays in Manchester would you not?


It's only interesting if you like a strawman.

there are three times the hotel rooms in manc compared to Liverpool (4,200 compared to 1,400 according to the report jrb quoted recently)

4652 actually, with 512 under construction, which will be double the figure we had 6 years ago.

Back on topic though, hotels are a red herring IMO. I bet the clientelle of the Hard Rock Cafe in Manchester is largely concert goers and footy fans, a large proportion of which will be regional, and a large proportion of them will have wool DNA.

Discussion has moved onto why three times as many hotel rooms are stayed in each night in Manchester.

Also, is the fact that there is a similar proportion of office space in the city relevant or a coincidence?

I strongly suspect it's linked.

Treble the office workers, I bet you treble the businessmen needing a hotel room.

I bet Brum, with a similar amount of office space has similar hotel room occupancy on average. About three times that in Liverpool.

I guess Hard Rock Cafe is full of businessmen then, it IS an indicator of a global city afterall.

I guess Hard Rock Cafe is full of businessmen then, it IS an indicator of a global city afterall.

Arf. Not able to face reality, rather pretend that reports are wrong, ignore what can be seen and make out that people have said something they haven't.

Still, continue getting upset when the media, the government or the public talk about the reality you close your eyes to :lol:

The reality being there are three times as many hotels occupied in Manchester on average each night and three times the offices to fill those hotel rooms.

Discussion has moved onto why three times as many hotel rooms are stayed in each night in Manchester.

Also, is the fact that there is a similar proportion of office space in the city relevant or a coincidence?

I strongly suspect it's linked.

Treble the office workers, I bet you treble the businessmen needing a hotel room.

I bet Brum, with a similar amount of office space has similar hotel room occupancy on average. About three times that in Liverpool.


Reference Brum I think your probably correct re offic space etc, we have a big conference and exhibition industry in Brum which helps too , and like Manc many venues with various sports events and music events etc....think there are about 30 new hotels being built or approved in Brum ( So Far ) but I could be wrong,

I guess Hard Rock Cafe is full of businessmen then, it IS an indicator of a global city afterall.

It isn't, but this is!

http://www.diserio.com/gawcworldcities2010.jpg

:troll:

You said Liverpool had 1,400 hotel rooms, based on that report.

You are clearly wrong, why not just admit it?

It isn't, but this is!

:troll:


That's a big pile of steaming burgers.

"Fukuoka", just under Leon. I wonder how you pronounce that ?

You said Liverpool had 1,400 hotel rooms, based on that report.

You are clearly wrong, why not just admit it?

No, I said it had 1,450 rooms occupied on average per night.

I even posted the article for you to read.

Still, instead of facing reality you'd rather pretend I was talking about something else and shift the discussion away from reality.

Probably best really, seeing reality will blow away almost all of your positions in these discussions out of the water.

Rather shift away from talking about why there see so few hotel rooms occupied in Liverpool, rather not talk about why there is so little office space used, when discussions move to things like HS2 you can pretend to think that there will be the same demand from Liverpool as Manc :lol:

Good work, close your eyes. Unfortunately for you the decision makers have their eyes wide open and will always make decisions that will grate with you.

That's a big pile of steaming burgers.

"Fukuoka", just under Leon. I wonder how you pronounce that ?

:pet: The original world city might be a world city again some day.

Is Seattle a world city really?

Only world city in England is London.

Just had another thought.

Passengers from Manc to London on the WCML are 2.6 times (nearly that 3 again) that from Liverpool to London.

Odd how there are so many comparisons that are about 3(ish):1 ratio between the places.

Odd how it's always ignored, especially in the favourite sport of always comparing Liverpool to Manc on the Liverpool forum is ongoing.

Watch those comparisons reappear come the autumn with the HS2 announcement when the usual crap about how the cities are the same will come out again, ignoring the reality that doesn't fit with their world view.

Someone has a bee in their bonnet

Nothing compared to the bees in bonnet by those who get agitated when reality touches on their blinkered world.

As I say, watch the Liverpool forum for bees in bonnet come the autumn with the HS2 announcement.

I have lived in both city's, born and raised in one and lived for a number of years in the other. I like both places because i'm comfortable in either. It wasnt always like that, stereotypes and all that but once you get past that and see for yourself you soon see that it is just people with an agenda trying to influence you one way or the other. mind you I still have my preferences but this time based on personal experience. as for figures.:nuts:

Don't disagree. What people like and dislike is entirely subjective.

I have never ever claimed anywhere, including Manchester, to be better or worse than anywhere else.

I simply point out that despite what many on here say, Manchester, Liverpool, Leeds, Newcastle, Preston, Sheffield, Nottingham etc are all very different places.

When people, as they do all the time on the Liverpool forum make out that Liverpool it's the same as Manchester with the same transport and infrastructure needs they do so by costing their eyes to reality.

I wouldn't take him too seriously, he's a supposedly married man who spends every waking minute on this website, instantly replying to anyone who says Manchester isn't the biggest, bestest thing ever. He also claims to have everyone on ignore despite the fact it's very easy to see who is ignoring you because the option to send a PM doesn't come up.

http://images.icnetwork.co.uk/upl/birmpost/apr2012/2/2/the-birmingham-referendum-for-an-elected-mayor-904785232.jpg

:pet: The original world city might be a world city again some day.


aye, then we too can enjoy a cardboard hamburger whilst gazing giddily at a framed pair of Peter Noone's underpants, safe in the knowledge that Kurt will no longer make cruel taunts over our lack of Grade A office space.

No, I said it had 1,450 rooms occupied on average per night.


Well, doesn't look like you said that, it looks as though you said this...

I am just giving you reasons why there are three times the hotel rooms in manc compared to Liverpool (4,200 compared to 1,400 according to the report jrb quoted recently) with higher occupancy and higher room rates.

Just come back from Leeds....gutted that there isn't a hardrock cafe.

Your Probably right, the same reason why Manchester can sustain HRC restaurants but cannot sustain a quality restaurant scene cause who wants to eat in a city centre full of football fans if you want a lovely meal, the same reason why Birmingham can sustain this kind of establishment becouse its city centre is not full of rowdy football fans.
Still feel Birmingham could sustain a big HRC though, defo in the Bullring area of the city, football fans or not.

exactly

Just come back from Leeds....gutted that there isn't a hardrock cafe.

That's because it's not a World Beefcake city, like New York, London, Manchester and Nabq.

When people, as they do all the time on the Liverpool forum make out that Liverpool it's the same as Manchester with the same transport and infrastructure needs they do so by costing their eyes to reality.



Grow up.

"he asked me a question, and he's from the liverpool forum, so he must be like other people who i argue with and have exactly the same opinion as those on threads I troll."

Well, doesn't look like you said that, it looks as though you said this...



Yes, and within 8 minutes posted the correct details, including a link and the full article.

Oddly I could not remember the precise details after over 1 year. But went out of my easy to post the exact article.

I clearly remembered it much better than you did :lol:

Only someone wanting to distract from the substance of the two posts would pretend that it was not me who made it very clear, off my own back exactly what I meant.

Still, keep your blinkers on. Pretend it was not me that have the figures and the report of my own back.

Ignore them as usual :lol:

Odd you change the subject, never acknowledge the simple facts, ask those rations of 3:1 that in your mine are all not true.

How very blinkered. :lol:

That's because it's not a World Beefcake city, like New York, London, Manchester and Nabq.

Only world class cities have D&D restaurants.

On the homepage....

Date: 27/4/12
D&D LONDON owns and operates over 30 of the most famous restaurants in London, Paris, New York, Copenhagen and Tokyo.

1 year later

Date: 27/4/13
D&D LONDON owns and operates over 30 of the most famous restaurants in London, Paris, New York, Leeds, Copenhagen and Tokyo.

Yes, and within 8 minutes posted the correct details, including a link and the full article.




I only asked about how many rooms Liverpool had, and no, you didn't retract the claim that you made.

Grow up.

"he asked me a question, and he's from the liverpool forum, so he must be like other people who i argue with and have exactly the same opinion as those on threads I troll."

When was the last time YOU acknowledged there was three times the number of hotel rooms occupied in Manchester each night?

Remind me the last time you acknowledged the same ratio of office demand and WCML usage amongst other things?

You don't, like the others you pretend these reports and facts provided from various independent groups are false, you are one of the petiole that regularly tries to pretend both cities are very similar.

They are not.

Yes, and within 8 minutes posted the correct details, including a link and the full article.

Oddly I could not remember the precise details after over 1 year. But went out of my easy to post the exact article.

I clearly remembered it much better than you did :lol:

Only someone wanting to distract from the substance of the two posts would pretend that it was not me who made it very clear, off my own back exactly what I meant.

Still, keep your blinkers on. Pretend it was not me that have the figures and the report of my own back.

Ignore them as usual :lol:

Odd you change the subject, never acknowledge the simple facts, ask those rations of 3:1 that in your mine are all not true.

How very blinkered. :lol:

http://media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lgf3e64Inb1qbh7dc.gif

I only asked about how many rooms Liverpool had, and no, you didn't retract the claim that you made.

I don't know how many rooms Liverpool has.
Never claimed to.

Not relevant.

You changing the subject again as you don't like the real world when it is highlighted to you.

I don't know how many rooms Liverpool has.



Well at least you finally found the cojones to admit it.

Now, my next question: how do you know that Manchester has 3 times as many rooms as Liverpool, if you don't know how many rooms Liverpool has?

Well at least you had the cajones to admit it.

Now, my next question: how do you know that Manchester has 3 times as many rooms as Liverpool, if you don't know how many rooms Liverpool has?

Arf.

Repeat after me.

Manchester has 3 times a many rooms occupied per night than Liverpool.

Means nothing to you obviously :lol: