A lot of crap is being written against the Athens 2004 Games and they are unsubstantiated, so this is what I responded with:

To all the doubters and Athens 2004-haters, once again facts will prevail and images will speak. Listed below are most of the venues used at Athens 2004. An image or two is posted for each venue and it is stated whether or not the venue was new or renovated. When I see these I see spectacular, innovative, and imaginative architecture. Clearly, as others have stated, the architecture of the facilities in Athens was much more inspired than the dull and "safe" architecture of Sydney's facilities:

Ano Liossia Hall - Judo and Wrestling (Brand New):

http://www.athens2004.com/Images/Multimedia/images/ano_liossia_16-06.jpg

http://www.athens2004.com/Images/Multimedia/images/liossia_13-08_p.jpg


Olympic Beach Volleyball Stadium (Brand New):

http://www.athens2004.com/Images/Multimedia/images/beach_volley_09-07.jpg

http://www.athens2004.com/Images/Multimedia/images/BeaVol14-08_p.jpg


Faliro Sports Pavilion - Taekwando and Handball (Brand New):

http://www.athens2004.com/Images/Multimedia/images/falirosportspavillion2_16-06.jpg

http://www.athens2004.com/Images/Multimedia/images/Faliro_14-08_p.jpg


http://www.athens2004.com/Images/Multimedia/images/falirosportspavillion1_16-06.jpg


Galatsi Olympic Hall - Ping Pong and Rhythmic Gymnsatics (Brand New):

http://www.athens2004.com/Images/Multimedia/images/Galatsi_14-08_p.jpg

http://www.athens2004.com/Images/Multimedia/images/galatsi1_16-06.jpg


Kaftanzoglio Soccer Stadium (Renovated):

http://www.athens2004.com/Images/Multimedia/images/look_08b.jpg

http://www.stadia.gr/kaftanzoglio/kaftantzoglioworks5.jpg


Markopoulo Olympic Equestrian Center (Brand New):

http://www.athens2004.com/Images/Multimedia/images/equestrian_16-06.jpg


Nikaia Olympic Weightlifting Hall (Brand New):

http://www.athens2004.com/Images/Multimedia/images/Nikaia14_08_p.jpg

http://www.athens2004.com/Images/Multimedia/images/nikaia_09-07.jpg

http://www.stadia.gr/nikaia/nikaianow8.jpg

http://www.stadia.gr/nikaia/nikaianow10.jpg

http://www.stadia.gr/nikaia/nikaianow7.jpg


Peace and Friendship Stadium - Volleyball (Renovated):

http://www.athens2004.com/Images/Multimedia/images/11Aug2004Sef1_p.jpg

http://www.athens2004.com/Images/Multimedia/images/11Aug2004Sef3_p.jpg


Pan-Cretan Soccer Stadium (Brand New):

http://www.athens2004.com/Images/Multimedia/images/pankritio_09-07.jpg

http://www.stadia.gr/pankritio/pankritio30.jpg

http://www.stadia.gr/pankritio/pankritio29.jpg


Persiteri Olympic Boxing Hall (Brand New):

http://www.athens2004.com/Images/Multimedia/images/boxing1_09-07.jpg


Hellinikon Olympic Commplex - Includes Basketball Stadium, Baseball Stadium(s), Softball Stadium(s), Field Hockey Stadium, and the Canoe/Kayak Slalom course/seating area (Brand New):

http://www.stadia.gr/hellinikon/hellinikon6.jpg

http://www.stadia.gr/hellinikon/hellinikon7.jpg

http://www.stadia.gr/hellinikon/hellinikon8.jpg

http://www.stadia.gr/hellinikon/hellinikon9.jpg

http://www.athens2004.com/Images/Venue%20Maps/fencing_07-04.jpg

http://www.athens2004.com/Images/Multimedia/images/baseball1_16-06.jpg

http://www.athens2004.com/Images/Multimedia/images/canoe_kayak_0908.jpg

http://www.athens2004.com/Images/Multimedia/images/canoe-kayak_slalom2_16-06.jpg

http://www.athens2004.com/Images/Multimedia/images/hockey2_16-06.jpg

http://www.athens2004.com/Images/Multimedia/images/hockey14-08_p.jpg

http://www.athens2004.com/Images/Multimedia/images/softball116-06.jpg


Karaiskaki Soccer Stadium (Brand New):

http://www.stadia.gr/karaiskaki/karaiskaki1.jpg

http://www.stadia.gr/karaiskaki/karaiskaki6.jpg


Panpeloponisian Soccer Stadium (Brand New):

http://www.stadia.gr/patras/patrasnew6.jpg


http://www.stadia.gr/patras/patrasnew8.jpg


Panthessaliniko Soccer Stadium (Brand New):

http://www.stadia.gr/panthessaliko/panthessaliko18.jpg

http://www.stadia.gr/panthessaliko/panthessaliko19.jpg

http://www.stadia.gr/panthessaliko/panthessaliko20.jpg


OAKA Oympic Complex - Includes Velodrome, Basketball and Gymnastics Indoor Halls, Tennis Complex, and Indoor and Outdoor Swimming Centres(Renovated):

http://www.stadia.gr/oaka/oakaworks34.jpg

http://www.stadia.gr/oaka/oakaworks33.jpg

http://www.stadia.gr/oaka/oakaworks31.jpg

http://www.stadia.gr/oaka/oakaolympics1.jpg

http://www.stadia.gr/oaka/oakaworks32.jpg

http://www.stadia.gr/oaka/oakaolympics2.jpg

Velodrome:

http://www.stadia.gr/oaka/podilatodromiofinal.jpg

http://www.athens2004.com/Images/Multimedia/images/11Aug2004Velod1_p.jpg

Baskettball and Gymnastics:

http://www.stadia.gr/oaka-b/kleisto_oaka5.jpg

http://www.stadia.gr/oaka-b/kleisto_oaka3.jpg

Main Tennis Court:

http://www.athens2004.com/Images/Multimedia/images/11Aug2004Tennis1_p.jpg

http://www.athens2004.com/Images/Multimedia/images/11Aug2004Tennis2_p.jpg

Aquatic Center:

http://www.athens2004.com/Images/Multimedia/images/10Aug2004OakaAqu1_p.jpg


City-Cycling Course:

http://www.athens2004.com/Images/Multimedia/images/podilasia_dromoy.jpg

Panathinaiko Stadium (Home of 1896 Olympics):

http://www.athens2004.com/Images/Multimedia/images/panathinaiko_11-08.jpg


Non-Competition Venues:

http://www.athens2004.com/Images/Venue%20Maps/Images/28apr04ibcP.jpg

http://www.athens2004.com/Images/Venue%20Maps/Images/28apr04mpcP.jpg


There is so much more, such as the new airport, countless highways, tram line, subways, the countless clean beaches right in Athens, etc....but these have been posted before.

Add in the world-reknown Acropolis and Ancient Olympia, and it is clear to see why Sydney could not have beaten Athens. So they partied drunk in the streets in Sydney. I was in Athens for the Olympics and there was partying too. However, there was more than that. There was spirit, history, civility, and pride that, unless you were there, you will never understand the feeling.

Wpaia ta eipes Leafs Fan. Na sou po kai egw thn ali8eia, egw zw sthn Australia kai ama sou elega merikes apo ths malakies pou eixan pi oi kolo Australoi prin kai meta tous agwnes 8a eixate pathi thn plaka sas. Einai telios amorfoti anthropi kai megaliteri apateones den nomizo iparxoun. Kseris poses fores emeis oi Ellines grafame grammata ktl sths efimerides sthn Australia gia ths malakies pou grafane. Kai otan teliosane oi Agwnes, pou htan oi kaliteri agwnes olon ton epochon, akoma grafane kai legane ths aidies tous. Sthn Australia exoune kati pou to lene "Tall Poppy Syndrome", auto einai, otan kapios pai kala, h pefti stou kosmou ta lefta ktl prospathane na tous teliosoune, kai auto egine me thn A8hna 2004.

Wpaia ta eipes Leafs Fan. Na sou po kai egw thn ali8eia, egw zw sthn Australia kai ama sou elega merikes apo ths malakies pou eixan pi oi kolo Australoi prin kai meta tous agwnes 8a eixate pathi thn plaka sas. Einai telios amorfoti anthropi kai megaliteri apateones den nomizo iparxoun. Kseris poses fores emeis oi Ellines grafame grammata ktl sths efimerides sthn Australia gia ths malakies pou grafane. Kai otan teliosane oi Agwnes, pou htan oi kaliteri agwnes olon ton epochon, akoma grafane kai legane ths aidies tous. Sthn Australia exoune kati pou to lene "Tall Poppy Syndrome", auto einai, otan kapios pai kala, h pefti stou kosmou ta lefta ktl prospathane na tous teliosoune, kai auto egine me thn A8hna 2004.


Simfono apolitos mazi sou Alexander. Emis i ellines den eipame pote asxima pragmata gia tin Australia. Na poume tin alithia, i Australia einai omorfi xora kai i agones tous eitan poil kali. Alla afou i malakes lene tosa asxima pragmata gia tin Athina 2004, e tote, ti tha kanoume emeis? Ama then legane tis malakies tous i Australezoi emeis i ellines then tha legame POTE oti ta dika mas Games eitan kalitera apo tis Australias giati san laos exoume sevasmo kai filotimo.

Afto pou exoun i Australezoi einai "Inferiority Complex"

Geia!

Organosan kalous agwnes alla itane gia ton ipno.. the "Boring Games"...

Gia komplex, poli dikaio exeis, oi anthropoi einia toso fanatismenoi me thn idea oti olos o kosmos prepi na tous theli kai na tous sevete oti einai gia ta klamata.

Me tous akoute tous anomalous afstralous. Kai sto telos ths imeras oi Agwnes einai dikoi mas, ellinikes kai as ti lene oloi oi varvaroi.

Athens 2004 was much more colourful than Sydney and a lot more modern

The openning ceremony of Sydeny was better,the closing ceremony of Athens was better (Athens opnnening ceremony started better but lasted too short according to me).

In the sportive way, sydeny games were better (this is not fault of Athens, but fault of athletes of all countries)...

In organization, Athens was better. Also it was a meaningful organization.

Sydney's opening ceremony was a disgrace... sorry, thats the only way of putting it. It showed the lack of culture that Australia has (Or does not have). Giant thongs, transvestites, clothes drying lines, lawn mowers and people dancing on steel does not make a good opening ceremony.

Athens on the other hand was full of class, culture, history and poise. Something Sydney easily lacked. Sydney had a great games, but its opening ceremony was nothing short of cringe worthy.

Objectively speaking, Sydney is visually one of the best modern cities on the planet with an alleged quality of life that even surpasses the one of Canadian cities like Toronto or Vancouver (or Seattle in the US) which are considered tops according to many world surveys.

All that is good and I am happy that the Aussies have taken so much care of their habitats, building, and outdoor environment.

However, this does not give them the right (even if many of their venomous comments relevant to the pre-1995 Athens have a truth in them) to attack a small country, especially when the image of Athens during the games was (and still is) the one of a very decent Mediterranean metropolis with a very beautiful downtown and ultra-modern (albeit lowrise) suburban business districts like Maroussi which is rapidly developing into a very significant Business hub.

I am very sceptical because even if the skyline of Sydney (resembling to Toronto BTW) is a dream skyline for me, I still do not understand this syndrome which -some times covertly, some times openly- all the ex commonwealth and English-speaking countries express lately (with the exception of Canada to the best of my knowledge) about cultural, political, social and military suppremacy by the WASPs (or Anglo-Saxons) in general? Tell me a reason why Athens was not a kick-ass destination during the summer of 2004. No traffic jams, excellent venues, excellent transportation system, hospitable people, etc, proximity to sea and mountains.

Was it because we didn't have a "skyline"? Was it because the city was not a highrise downtown with a two-storey sprawl filled with condos, shopping "malls" with 5,000 parking spaces each with Mc Donalds, Wendy's and the other icons of the by-products of the so-called "globalisation" which slowly but surely they try to shove down our throats in order for us to become TV vegetables and wait for the next blockbuster which we will be watching while eating plastic in a multiplex (BTW, Athens has 60,000 sq metres shopping centres and 20-theatre cineplexes)? I mean that's all about it?

I don't know, some of the Aussies (certainly not the ones I have known in the past) that belong to the press and media need to visit their shrink's couch more often. At least in Greece we still have the luxury to have friends and get psychoanalysed and let out our feelings for no charge, without guttering them out to the eyes of the world public.

Pity...

Well said Gregory.

As a Greek, if Beijing hosts amazing games I will be the first to be happy for them and admit that they were better (if they are better than Athens) and I will hold no hostility towards them for that (as long as the Games are not successful due to human rights violations by the government and the poor are not treated as animals). Personally, I will remember Athens 2004 as the most magical time of my life (well, a close second to the EURO 2004 when Greece won - that was crazy! Hellas OLE OLE! Den stamato na tragoudo pote!). Although I will remember the Athens Games as the best ever (for many reasons), I will have no problem admitting if a future Games is even better. For God's sake, 2008 is another 3 years from now and technology, arechitecture, and organizational strategies improve with time! It is inevitable that each Games will be better than the next (with exception to Atlanta - that was a disgrace! I think that Athens in 1996 could have probably done a better job than Atlanta even though, realistically, Athens was not ready at the time).

This is what I dont understand about the Australians. There is nothing wrong in admitting that theAthens Olympics were great. They are very defensive....but as Gregory says, I think they have fallen prey to the media's bias and to the idea that if it ain't Americanized or "globalized" it ain't worth shit......what a pity....

hhehehe that thread that i started is really bringing out the anti greekness in everyone!

Guys, with regards to the Beijing games, we have to admit that the Chinese will do anything in their (mighty, let's admit this) power to deliver the best, surely the most grandiose games ever and thank God, their tradition is old and rich enough to offer unbelievable spectacles in the context of the Olympics. I mean, I wait and see, and surely, I don't underestimate this race of 1.5 billion people who work like crazy, like their country to the point of nationalism, yet they don't consume themselves with exchanges of pityful comments about other countries.

I always believed that it's works that are remembered, not stupid comments. Of course the Athens installations are to be surpassed. What will be remembered though is that at that particular moment, during the summer of 2004, Athens was the place to be. period.

As a Greek, if Beijing hosts amazing games I will be the first to be happy for them and admit that they were better (if they are better than Athens) and I will hold no hostility towards them for that (as long as the Games are not successful due to human rights violations by the government and the poor are not treated as animals).

Poli sosta file, alla min ksexnas, oti eisai Ellinas kai oxi Australos kai den prepi na kaneis ton eauto sou na estanese kaliteros apo ton allon me ton tropo pou to kanoun oi (kolo)Australoi....

Everything about Sydney was better than Athens,well maybe only story about that cheater Greek Athlete couple was kicks azz of Australians news.That's the only thing Australians couldn't come close...

yeah, because the historic link to the games, Sydney beats Athens.


Historical events taking place in Olympia, 1986 Olympic Stadium etc Sydney wins to, with all of their revival of historic sporting venues.


Sydney Architectually beat Athens also, with their stunning designs.....


Their temporary venues and "convention halls" supassed brand new venues built with latest technologies....


riiiiiiight

Everything about Sydney was better than Athens,well maybe only story about that cheater Greek Athlete couple was kicks azz of Australians news.That's the only thing Australians couldn't come close...

I liked Athens Olympics more than Turkeys Olympics.......................oh wait they never had one. :weirdo:

what an idiot he is just a 12 year old kid that knows nothing about architecture and Olympics.

That and since he is so much more "mature" instead of intelligent debate he chooses to troll Greek topics now, and say nonsense.


True friends. :)

A quick opinion:

Better Opening Ceremony: Athens (by far)

Better Facilities: Athens (no comparison here)

Better Olympic Spirit: Athens (period)

Better Organization: Athens (the Athens2004 OG is now a case study for the rest)

Better Security: Athens (not even a nail got broken in Athens)

Better performance from the athletes: Sydney

Overall: Athens (Best Ever Olympic Games)

I liked Athens Olympics more than Turkeys Olympics.......................oh wait they never had one. :weirdo:


No gocaps, Turkey actually has a good shot at the Olympics.... I mean Asia has hosted in a while. :)


Right lambark.

Everything about Sydney was better than Athens,well maybe only story about that cheater Greek Athlete couple was kicks azz of Australians news.That's the only thing Australians couldn't come close...

Κοιτάξε πως θα βγάλει πρώτα η γκόμενά σου τη μαντήλα κακομοίρη και μετά μίλα. :sleepy:

Aston to kakomiri ton Tourko. Einai yia klamata i hora tous. Kai kati fatses pou ehoune i agrianthropi. Sto diaoulo na pane oli tous.....

A quick opinion:

Better Opening Ceremony: Athens (by far)

Better Facilities: Athens (no comparison here)

Better Olympic Spirit: Athens (period)

Better Organization: Athens (the Athens2004 OG is now a case study for the rest)

Better Security: Athens (not even a nail got broken in Athens)

Better performance from the athletes: Sydney

Overall: Athens (Best Ever Olympic Games)

Better Opening Ceremony: Athens

Better Facilities: Sydney

Better Olympic Spirit: Sydney

Better Organization: Athens

Better Security: Athens

Better performance from the athletes: Sydney

Overall: Well it's very hard to pick but I'll say Athens - for being our neighbours... :)

Gia to sigekrimeno 8ema, min tous donete 8aros sto allo thread. Ean kapios ehei kolisei, pioi eimaste emeis na tous kanoume ekpaideusei. Megalosa stin Australia kai tous xero kala. Astous na lene. Allo, den nomizo einai 8ema Anit-Ellinismo para Pro Australezismo - kai tous ehei 8olosei tin skepsei.

Istanbullu I may be biased here but it's a shame to even compare the crappy stadiums of Sydney with the state-of-the-art Athenian facilities (Athens is the only city that built the most brand new stadiums and that every sport had it's own venue, not like the comedy in Sydney where you had 8 sports packed in an ugly concrete box ;) )
As for the Olympic spirit, you had to be in Athens this summer to understand
more than 80,000 volunteers, endless parties, numerous events in a living city that never sleeps, olympic games returned home. You can't find anything more

Thank you Athens! :bow:

There were many drug test issues at Athens, I also think fans booing other nations athletes didn't help for the olympic spirit. Also Sydney games had a bigger attandence.

Just comparing...

They didn't boo other athletes..... they booed the Kenteris situation, it was not directed to the other athletes. And it was a section of die hard Kenteris supporters (who still support him) the whole stadium was not booing. There were even small fights between people telling them to stop booing, it was insane.


I think the drug tests and the stand the Olympic Comitees took lowered the level of performance for atheltes. This is something that will taint sports forever to come. Every Olympics as long as they enforce the rules will have these incidents, unless the athletes stop. (fat chance) It was much stricter than Sydney, MUCH. Plus that drug that was hidden for so long they could find now, so all the ones who excelled in Sydney were now in trouble or scared. It can be viewed good (that they are being caught/stopped) or bad that it ruins the games.

Sydney had alot more attendence though, thats for sure.

There were many drug test issues at Athens, I also think fans booing other nations athletes didn't help for the olympic spirit. Also Sydney games had a bigger attandence.

Just comparing...


The booing only occurred during the men's 200m finals because the Greek fans were upset at Kenteris' situation and his banishment from the event. I do not condone the booing, but I am sure you will agree that we are emotional people and sometimes are emotions get the best of us.

With respect to the attendance, I was reading an article a few days ago that stated that Sydney's main Olympic Stadium had an attendance capability of 110,000 spectators for track and field. Athens' OAKA had 70,000. That is 50,000 more seats available. If you multiply that difference by 12 days of track and field games (plus opening and closing ceremonies) that is 600,000 more tickets used in Sydney's favour. Plus, it is well known that tens of thousands of tickets were given away for free in Sydney. The Athens organizers did not do this in order to be fair to those that had pre-bought tickets (like me!).

You cant simply look at total tickets used or sold because the venues for both cities have different capacities. All I know is that, in the end, Athens sold 94% of all their tickets. That is an incredible figure if you consider the fear of people to visit Athens because of the fearmongering western media, post 9/11 security fears, the expensive EURO (I mean the Australian dollar is worthless and it is very cheap to American tourists, Canadians, Brits, and all other Euro people). During the Athens Games (and still today) the Euro is worth more than the US$ dollar and that kept/keeps Americans away 9hence increased tourism to the beautiful towns and cities of Croatia and Turkey). Americans like going places were their dollar is strong. All these issues are easily and conveniently forgotten by the Aussies but are very important to remember if we are going to be fair in this debate.

94%?

Are you sure about that number leafs?

We sold over 3.5 million I believe almost 3.6 (if I remember correctly) and the total number of tickets available were 5 million I think.