After years of false starts and dashed hopes, it looks as if the crumbling but iconic Lister Block is finally going to be reborn.

Joe Mancinelli, vice-president of Labourers International Union of North America (LIUNA), which owns the decaying heritage building in the downtown core, says he's on the verge of unveiling a major redevelopment project.

"We're just kind of dotting the i's and crossing the t's and, hopefully, within the next month we will be ready for a more formal announcement."

Mancinelli declines to go into details but he credits Mayor Larry Di Ianni with being a driving force and offers tantalizing hints of more "juicy stuff" coming.

Mario Joannette, the mayor's executive assistant, confirms Di Ianni has been huddling with LIUNA and other players to find a solution, but he's tight-lipped about what's in the works. "We're anticipating an announcement but Joe Mancinelli will have to be the one who makes that."

Mancinelli says there are two phases to the project.

"Phase 1, we're almost there. That's why I'm talking about being weeks away from an announcement.

"But Phase 2 will take this from a great project into a spectacular project, and that has components that are quite frankly not complete yet and require other levels of government to participate. That's something the mayor has been working on relentlessly."

Mancinelli says if Di Ianni lands the big fish, it will be a much bigger story than redoing the Lister.

"We're talking economic development, we're talking new jobs, we're talking all the real juicy stuff."

Nonetheless, Mancinelli is acutely aware the rotting, six-storey landmark at James North and King William has become the poster child for what's wrong with the downtown.

"It's become a psychological symbol of downtown decay and once the announcement's made, within a 24-hour period, it will turn into a psychological symbol of renewal."

Councillor Bill Kelly, former chair of the city's economic development committee, suggests the breakthrough has been signing major tenants, the absence of which has been a stumbling block in getting a project going to save whatever architectural features are still salvageable after years of neglect.

"Obviously it's going to be an office complex or condos, one or the other," said Kelly.

In any case, Kelly hopes the long-awaited revitalization of the eyesore, which has been vacant for about 10 years, will be the catalyst for other developments in the core.

But he also notes that previous false starts have left many skeptical about the Lister, which went up in 1924 after a fire gutted the original 1886 building. Certainly there have been more than a few disappointments since LIUNA bought it in 1999.

The first blow fell in late 2000 when Ottawa chose to build the new federal building on a parking lot across from Copps Coliseum instead of at the Lister, a failure some attributed to then Heritage Minister Sheila Copps not paying close enough attention to the selection process.

That was followed a year later by the so-called Kittling Ridge proposal for a $78-million hotel-condo-office tower complex, which included the controversial idea of moving the farmers' market and Canadian Football Hall of Fame to the site.

For a variety of reasons, not the least of which was financing troubles and legal action by the owners of Jackson Square, that also went off the rails -- despite last-ditch attempts in 2002 by Copps to snag some federal tenants, including the National Archives and a call centre.

Things have been pretty quiet at the derelict building since then, other than for a small fire last year and the bitterly ironic news its boarded-up facade is a popular moviemaking location.

But we shouldn't forget that LIUNA is the outfit that saved the city's old CN station by converting it into a stylish banquet centre.

They're part of the consortium that is redeveloping the landmark downtown Royal Connaught Hotel. And they're still working on a multimillion dollar proposal for a European-style residential and commercial project on Pier 8 in Hamilton's west harbour.

Clearly nobody should underestimate their ability to get things done in this town.

:banana::banana::banana:

So happy to hear about this. Once Lister Block gets redeveloped it will be a symbol of renewal.

Pics????

Lister Block

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v162/tshaw/Lister-KingWilliam.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v384/Aallen396/lister1.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v384/Aallen396/lister2.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v384/Aallen396/listerblock.jpg

this is really good news Steeltown.

Whatever happened with the Music Hall of Fame? Wasn't that to be announced in January??

CARAS said they would announce the winner of the Canadian Music Hall of Fame bid in February but then they delayed the announcement until Spring.

I have a feeling CARAS will announce the winner of the bid during the Juno Awards on April 3rd.

CARAS said they would announce the winner of the Canadian Music Hall of Fame bid in February but then they delayed the announcement until Spring.

I have a feeling CARAS will announce the winner of the bid during the Juno Awards on April 3rd.

envelope please.

and the Canadian Music Hall of Fame goes to.... Hamilton! Yay!

envelope please.

and the Canadian Music Hall of Fame goes to.... Hamilton! Yay!

Hell ya

:pepper: :cucumber: :banana: :rock:

I hope we finally see some action here, i love that building!

That is awesome news for the Lister block. Think about this, not only will be that be good, but for the entire block of that place, that will create a spinoff of good things for that section of downtown, you think? If it is restored, it will look beautiful on those tree-lined streets.

Is Hamilton really getting the Canadian Music Hall of Fame? If it is I officially call Hamilton, "Canada's Cleveland, Ohio".

From the sound of this article, which came from the Hamilton Spectator, I think Lister Block will be both a mixture of condo and office space. LIUNA credited Mayor Di Ianni in helping Lister Block redevelopment so that’s a signal to me that Larry Di Ianni is going to give LIUNA some money from the residential loan program. The residential loan program is a program where the city gives incentives to developers to build or convert a building into a residential building in downtown Hamilton. Which is a successful program, examples are, the Annex, Cityview Terrace, Chateau Royale, Century Theatre, Core Lofts and Trinity Landing.

Then when you read on it says that the Lister Block redevelopment will create new jobs so I’m taking that as a hint of office space in Lister Block.

Is Hamilton really getting the Canadian Music Hall of Fame? If it is I officially call Hamilton, "Canada's Cleveland, Ohio".

Yes it's down to Hamilton and Toronto for the Canadian Music Hall of Fame bid. Toronto won this bid a few years ago but never built the Hall of Fame so CARAS started another bidding war. Last time Hamilton was in 2nd place.

Check out http://www.hamiltonmusicbid.ca/ to learn about Hamilton's bid.

It's pretty much identical to Cleveland's Rock and Roll Hall of Fame where Hamilton's proposal will be located next to the waterfront on Pier 8.

Yes it's down to Hamilton and Toronto for the Canadian Music Hall of Fame bid. Toronto won this bid a few years ago but never built the Hall of Fame so CARAS started another bidding war. Last time Hamilton was in 2nd place.


what happened to Wienerpeg?

Winnipeg missed a submission deadline and has been dropped from a short list to house the centre.

Let's hope that they will find ways to restore it, it's just a shame to leave such a beautiful building in downtown abandoned like this.

BTW, I heard from my friend in Hamilton that the Royal Connaught in downtown had folded? Can anyone confirm that? I would be sorry to see it go. It has a nice building and lobby for a budget hotel (the interior was terrible though).

The previous owner of the Royal Connaught went bankrupt. But then I think 4 or 5 months later a bunch of local developers purchased the hotel. The groups are called the Royal Connaught Development Group.

Members of the Royal Connaught Development Group:

Tony Battaglia - President of Tradeport and in charge of the development group
Joe Mancinelli - boss of LIUNA, will help give advise in restoring the Royal Connaught
Oscar Kichi - owner of Ramada Plaza Hotel, experience in running a hotel
Ted Valeri - T. Valeri Construction Ltd., will be in charge of the construction
Mario Frankovich - President of Burgeonvest Securities Ltd., will be in charge of financing

The Royal Connaught development group plans a massive 10-million dollar redevelopment of the landmark including a new first-class hotel, condominiums and office space.

Spokesman Tony Battaglia hopes for a re-opening date of June 5th of 2006 which will be Royal Connaught 90th anniversary.

Thanks for answering, Steeltown, I'm glad to hear that. ;)

Lister update

It's rumored that the Lister announcement might have something to do with the City Hall renovations. What does that mean? something about displaced workers, a revitalized Lister Block, City Hall gets fixed, workers move back in, and the Lister gets taken over by City Hall.

Good work Hamilton!
I'm no fan of Hamilton but being such an older city it does have a lot of good older archetecture. I hope more of this takes place. There are too many gems in Steeltown, I would hate to see them come down for a glass box.

Lister a Go… If City Signs On
Council to vote on tenancy that would cement revival of downtown landmark

The long-awaited redevelopment of the Lister Block hinges on the city becoming a tenant in the downtown landmark.

A rental proposal from the Labourers International Union is being considered by city hall and will dictate if the project goes ahead, said LIUNA vice-president Joe Mancinelli.

“If we can negotiate something with the city, the project is a go immediately,” he said.

Mayor Larry Di Ianni said late last night he doesn’t want to discuss details, because of ongoing negotiations. The decision rests with city council, he said. Council is expected to vote on the proposal May 9.

Mancinelli said the redevelopment would be mainly commercial. He called the city an “important tenant” that would convince already interested businesses to sign on.

“When you have the city as a tenant, they all come to the table,” he said. “They’re ready to go. That’s how close we are.”

“I think it’s going to be a win-win.” Said a hopeful Mancinelli, adding councillors will look like “heroes” if they help restore the decaying 1923 building.

The Lister Block proposal is just one positive sign for downtown. A striking purple façade on a new upscale restaurant and a soon-to-be removed For Sale sign on two landmarks are also raising hopes for the core.

Room 41 has opened its door in the former location of La Costa on King William and there is news that the long-abandoned Victoria Hall and MacKay buildings – collectively known as Foster building – have been sold.

In addition, the ongoing restoration of the landmark Royal Connaught, the upcoming opening of the new Art Gallery of Hamilton, the conversion of the Bank of Montreal building on James Street into a law office and a host of new condo projects – the Core Lofts, Chateau Royale, the former federal building at Caroline and Main and the old Spectator building on King William – are all boosting morale of those who care for the downtown.

Councillor Dave Mitchell said yesterday he understood the prime tenants in a redeveloped Lister Block would be large private companies and that the city is being asked to rent “a certain amount of space just to show good faith.”

Mitchell said the city would not be a key player and the project does not depend on the city’s involvement.

Di Ianni said he couldn’t reveal much because negotiations are at a delicate stage.

“All I can say is council has expressed unanimous interest in seeing the Lister Block redeveloped and there are negotiations to see whether there would be a city role and what if would be.”

LIUNA, which turned the former CN station on James Street North into the Liuna Station banquet centre, is also part of the group that recently bought the bankrupt Royal Connaught Hotel with plants to renovate and reopen it.

John Dolbec, chief executive officer of the Hamilton Chamber of Commerce, said he has heard lots of rumours about the development.

“To have some thing happen to the Lister Block is absolutely critical to the city.

“If you are in love with the architecture or not, and many people are, to have a big building at a major intersection derelict and abandoned is a billboard for downtown decay.

“It would be a tremendous shot in the arm for this community, a signal we have finally turned the corner on downtown renewal.”

Dolbec said the wave of condominium development downtown is “overshadowed be that monolithic, derelict building boarded up.”

Project manager of the Foster Building, James Tran, confirmed his Toronto clients have purchased the building and intend to convert the 118-years-old Victoria Hall into a professional office for lawyers or doctors. The MacKay building will become work-live lofts, said Tran.

The pair of buildings face Gore Park on the south side of King Street East just west of John Street.

Previous buyers also had big plans for restaurants, offices and condos there but Tran says his clients – whom he declined to name – are pushing forward with cleanup.

The buildings have been vacant for more than two decades. That means there is a lot of mess inside, he said.

“They are eager to get this going. It’s looking really positive.”

Showpiece buildings like the historically designated Victoria Hall and the MacKay building will be key to brining the Gore Park area back to life, said Councillor Bob Brantina, who represents the area.

Barry Michael, co-owner of Room 41, is a downtown cheerleader. Born in Hamilton and raised in Burlington, he says he sets out to land the location as soon as he heard La Costa was heading out last July.

He and business partner Brad Lomanto injected a lot of chase and a bold splash of colour into the historic building with the round façade.

“It’s such a beautiful old building. I knew I could do something spectacular with it.

“I believe in Hamilton. It’s got its problem but it’s a big city. There is a wall of graffiti or a homeless guy on the streets in Toronto and no one thinks anything of it. Here, it’s a big deal.”

Sak Jar, who opened neighbouring Thai Tamarind in the basement where The Rude Native used to be, is also high on his new home. He could have opened a restaurant anywhere but he chose Hamilton, he says.

“If we help each other, Hamilton will be booming again.”

But there are problems. He doesn’t think the city should allow prime downtown property to be swallowed up by a bingo hall and he’s angry about vandalism in the area.

The commercial vacancy rate in the core sits at about 29 per cent, amounting to 789,000 square feet, says realtor Dave Blanchard.

The big hits came from operations moving out of the Standard Life Building and the Stelco Tower last year, says Blanchard, president of a yearly vacancy report.

But things are looking up, he says.

this is great!

Union trying to pressure city: councillor

Councillor Dave Mitchell says the union that owns the Lister Block is trying to strong-arm the city into becoming a tenant of the long vacant downtown eyesore.

Late last week, Joe Mancinelli, vice president of Laborers International Union of North America (LIUNA), told The Spectator the long awaited redevelopment of the Lister Block hinged on the city agreeing to move in some of its staff. Mancinelli said publicly that a least deal with the city will dictate whether the project goes ahead.

But Mancinelli, who sits on the accommodations committee, said that was news to him.

“I was not led to believe that (the deal) was contingent on us being in there,” the Ward 11 councillor said yesterday.

Mancinelli's comments sound like the union is trying to twist the city’s arm, “and that doesn’t cut it.” Mancinelli said. “Before the city buys in, I think we should look at who all the other (prospective) tenants are and how secure everything is.”

The problem, said Ward 2 Councillor Bob Bratina, is that LIUNA wants the city to sign 20-years lease, while the city is ready to agree to only 15 years.

Council, which meets May 9, “will have to decide if we’re being held hostage on the situation or whether there is goodwill on both sides,” Brantina said.

The union has a track record of saving significant historic properties in Hamilton, including turning the former CN station on James Street North into a sumptuous banquet centre. It recently bought the bankrupt Royal Connaught and plans to refurnish the landmark downtown hotel.

LIUNA purchased the empty and crumbling 81-year-old, six storey building at James Street North and King William in 1999 and has made several abortive attempts to resurrect it.

The first disappointment came in 2000 when Ottawa chose to construct a new federal building opposite Copps Coliseum instead of in the Lister.

Next came a proposal to turn the Lister, with its famous terracotta façade, into a multimillion-dollar hotel, condo and office building.

That deal included the controversial idea of relocating the Canadian Football Hall of Fame and the Farmers’ Market.

City politicians want to see the building restored to its former glory without drawing on the public purse. To them, any recent downtown revitalization momentum is slowed by the mammoth building rotting in the core.

“I’m certainly not averse to a lease arrangement for one or two of our departments,” said Ward 7 Councillor Bill Kelly.

City Hall is bursting at the seams, both from age and occupants, but building a new home for municipal government simply isn’t going to happen, he said.

Since the city already installed some city workers in the former Eaton’s Centre, it makes “philosophical sense” to locate more right across the street.

Kelly said the city economic development department is a logical choice to relocate.

The city recently signed a two-year lease at One James Street, which would be up around the time a reborn Lister would be ready for occupancy.

“We’ve had proposal like this before, in which people say, “If you become prime candidate and if you pay prime rents, we can make this work,’” said Flamborough Councillor Dave Braden.

Braden wants Lister back on its feet, but “it’s too much money in too small an area.”

The problems in the core are so big “that one big bang is not going to do it,” he said.

But Councillor Maria Pearson and Murray Ferguson say fixing the Lister is a city priority.

“If we can get the Lister off the radar screen and upgraded, it will be a huge coup for the downtown,” Ferguson said.

Lister Block redevelopment talks heating up

HAMILTON - According to the union leader behind the redevelopment of the Lister Block, the city must agree to be a tenant in the building if they're going to get the necessary financing.

The vice president of LIUNA, Joe Mancinelli, says financial institutions don't see Hamilton as viable and without a solid tenant already in place they're not interested in a 40-million dollar investment in the downtown.

The union and the city have been negotiating a deal that would see the city rent space in the refurbished Lister building.

But Mancinelli says the banks want more than just details about the negotiations, they want the tenant secured.

No city tenant, no Lister rescue

The man behind the $40 million redevelopment of the Lister Block says that major Canadian financial institutions will not lend any money for it unless the City of Hamilton agrees to become a tenant.

“Financial institutions do not see Hamilton as viable,” said Joe Mancinelli, vice-president of the Laborers’ International Union of North America (LIUNA), said yesterday.

“They frown on investing in Hamilton and they are very difficult...Their level of confidence in Hamilton is very, very low.”

The union and the city have been negotiating a deal that would see the city rent space in a refurbished Lister building.

Mancinelli said at least two major institutions he approached for the $40 million won’t have anything to do with the project unless the city guarantees to move in.

“The financial institutions are telling us this: Without a triple-A lease in the building, they are not interested,” he said.

Mancinelli said he showed the banks details of negotiations with the city, but they said that wasn’t good enough.

Now Mancinelli has come back to the city and asked for new concessions, but “staff at the city have some problems with certain parts of the lease.”

He would not discuss the deal’s details, but stressed it would not cost taxpayers anything beyond what the city would have to rent space elsewhere.

“It’s not that we’re posturing here in order to get the city to buy in here,” he said.

Mancinelli said it was Mayor Larry Ianni who approached LIUNA to ask how to get the project off the ground.

Di Ianni says his role has been to bring the two sides together. But he said he has not been involved in specific negotiations.

“I have yet to see specifics on what is being proposed,” the mayor said.

Mario Joanette is the mayor’s executive assistant and part of the city’s negotiating team. He wouldn’t comment on Mancinelli’s claim that lenders aren’t interested in downtown.

“We’re trying to negotiate a deal with Joe in the city’s best interest,” Joanette said. “I’m not interested at all in getting into negotiations through the paper.”

John Dolbec, chief executive office of Hamilton’s chamber of commerce, said Mancinelli’s comments were “an extreme statement.”

The former banker said it was common for lenders to withhold funds for a commercial developer unless it has a triple-A tenant lined up.

“That’s standard commercial real estate lending,” Dolbec said. “I understand what he’s saying, but it’s not unique to Hamilton.

“I think the city’s involvement in this project would be win-win, but it has to make sense to the taxpayers.”

Mancinelli blasted Glanbrook Councillor Dave Mitchell for suggesting the union might be pressuring city hall.

“One councillor’s opinion, quite frankly, is not going to dictate downtown renewal.”

For the past several days, Mitchell and other councillors have asked for details of negotiations between the union and the city to dispel rumours running through City Hall.

After requests from Dave Braden and Terry Whitehead in a committee meeting, staff agreed to give council a closed-door update today.

……………………

Economic development Neil Everson said the Lister will become an essential downtown renewal anchor.

“To drive in York Boulevard and not see that boarded up building – yeah, it’s going to make a big difference,” Everson said.

Lister Block: three times a charm?

Is it true? Could it be possible? Really? What ...the Lister block is to be refurbished again? Oh wait, you say this is the third proposal in five years?

I can just imagine the emotional roller coaster people are feeling with the latest news out of City Hall that the Lister Block redevelopment is back on the radar screens of our local city council.

There have been stories about whether banks will finance the redevelopment without the city's participation and support. Denials from the banks are coming fast and furious about what they will and will not finance. There have been stories about politicians being bullied into a decision that might cost the taxpayer a lot of money down the road.

First off, I would like to point out that Joe Mancinelli, who is Vice President of the Labours International Union of all of Canada, is a man who has the best interests of the union he represents and interests of the city at heart. He has been involved in the revival of John C. Munro International Airport's revival. It was LIUNA who helped revitalize the old CN Station landmark and turned it into an elegant dining and reception hall. It was also LIUNA who turned a decrepit brownfield site on Queen St North into a beautiful old-age primary care facility. Recently, Joe Mancinelli and LIUNA were part of a consortium to purchase the old Royal Connaught Hotel. The track record of this individual and the organization he represents is impeccable.

Every major city in North America with any history has these types of historic buildings that will someday blossom into rebirth. In Chicago, an old abandoned high rise on Michigan Avenue was recently turned into a hotel by the owners of Hard Rock CafÈ. In Providence, RI, a high rise building that was abandoned for more than 50 years was redeveloped into a office and condominium tower. In these two cases both the city and their respective state governments gave incentives to the local developer to give these symbols of hope a chance to blossom.

Hamilton is not unique. Nor will it be the last city or government to help with these types of thorny cases that cause frustration. These are special circumstances where help is needed to get a project over the top. In this case, the City of Hamilton is looking for office space in the downtown. The needs of local government are more pressing than the 180,000 square feet that is found at city hall presently. In fact the total needed space is somewhere in the vicinity of about 540,000 sq. ft. If the city can fit a need to accommodate some space (that it will lease out anyway) at the Lister block while helping with the rejuvenation of this landmark and possibly spur more investment in downtown.

The claim that bankers won't fund these types of redevelopments is not true. Each case is individualized.

I do not believe the government should be the answer for all our problems. However, if a fair market, equitable and mutually agreeable contract can be signed for office space between the City and LIUNA, the symbol for downtown renewal in this special circumstance will be well on its way. The devil will be in the details. Let us hope that a third time is a charm.

Frank D'Amico is a long-time resident of the Hamilton Mountain and former city councillor. He can be reached at damico@mountaincable.net

Save the Lister Block before our eyes glaze over

I both winced and laughed the other day when the subject of the Lister Block came up in separate conversations.

I winched after being told about a faithful Spectator reader who’s had it up to here with the bazillion stories about saving the Lister and now routinely skips them.

And I laughed when someone else described Lister Block as the Rid Hill Creek Expressway of the downtown.

Both reactions sound like cries from hurtin’ hearts.

You can almost hear the mental anguish: Get this thing over with before I go cross-eyed or crazy reading about an issue that, like a psychic vampire slowly sucking the will and energy from a helpless victim, will neither die nor go away.

Like Red Hill, restoring the derelict Lister has taken on a spectral for-a-coon’s-age life of its own. We’ve heard it before, we’ve seen it before, and in return and re-echoes, it’s become two tons of tedious weight on the city’s back.

It’s no longer just about a heritage redevelopment project, it’s about turning a corner and laying to rest a symbol of the downtown core’s long meltdown and replacing it with a shiny monument to its slow-motion bounce back.

And, like it or not, that’s the context in which city council is going to have to examine the deal being put together by city staff and the building’s owner, LIUNA.

Unless you’re also swooning from Lister fatigue, you should know the bare bones of that proposal by now.

LIUNA has lined up some tenants of its own to occupy space in the Lister Block, but it needs the city to sign on as a long-term anchoring lease-holder before going ahead with the redevelopment of the historical landmark at James North and King William.

This isn’t the first time LIUNA, which acquired the vacant and rotting six-storey building in 1999, over $1.6 million, has presented city council with a break-or-break proposition for restoring the Lister.

In 2001, LIUNA made it clear a proposed $78 million hotel-condo-office project needed major help from the city to go forward, including a 30 year leasing commitment, $7 million in advance rent, and greasing the wheels for the farmers’ market and Canadian Football Hall of Fame to move over.

For financial and other reasons, that proposal never achieved litoff, despite last ditch attempts to corral some federal tenants.

Although everyone is pretty closed-mouthed about the details of the new proposal, which will be presented to council May 9, it’s doubtful it’s anywhere near as grandiose as the last one. And, more significantly, the proposal isn’t coming out of the left field. The negotiations are actually being driven by Mayor Larry Di Ianni, who identified restoring the Lister as a priority last summer.

In other words, Di Ianni approached LIUNA vice-president Joe Mancinelli about finding a solution, not the other way around.

The reality is both sides are trying to find mutually beneficial way of scouring the core of an eyesore.

LIUNA has a rotting investment on its hand; the city, which has made downtown redevelopment a priority, will need to rent office space in lieu of building a new City Hall.

With the help of city staff, they’re putting together a deal that presumably will preserve and restore the architectural heritage of the 81-year-old Lister.

Obviously, the business core has to make sense for city council to buy in. Hopefully staff’s participation will ensure the city’s interests are being looked after from a tenant’s point of view.

But council can’t forget there’s more at stake than just a price of rent.

The redevelopment of Lister is expected to be a catalyst to get other projects moving downtown. The trick may be trying to weigh a lot of high hopes and had-it-up-to-her hearts in dollar figures.

Found a great picture of Lister Block....I like this photo because you can really see the detail work on this building.

http://photos5.flickr.com/9422311_1bfb3e8470_o.jpg

14 days until Lister Block proposal is presented!

thanks for the updates Steeltown.

I think this proposal makes a bit more sense than the one in 2001. That building is suited best as basic rentable space, not for a farmers market and Football Hall of Fame. That would have been strange.

A restored Lister Block would cement that stretch of King William Street as a downtown destination... I'm surprised it does so well as it is.

A restored Lister Block would cement that stretch of King William Street as a downtown destination... I'm surprised it does so well as it is.

You know that there are some councillors who want King William Street to be cars free? Apparently there thinking of having a pilot project on King William Street to have car free days. If that's successful then King William Street will be cars free all year long.

You know that there are some councillors who want King William Street to be cars free? Apparently there thinking of having a pilot project on King William Street to have car free days. If that's successful then King William Street will be cars free all year long.

hmmm... ped-only streets can be a mixed blessing. Perhaps a Hess Village treatment would be better.

But no, I didn't know that. Thanks!

Lister Block Decision Expected Monday

HAMILTON - A major decision is facing Hamilton City Council.

It will meet on Monday to discuss whether the city will be part of the proposed re-development of the Lister Block.

Previous comments from the Vice-President of LIUNA, have suggested that the city's participation as a tenant is critical to the $40-million dollar investment taking place.

Mayor Larry Di Ianni has admitted that fixing up the Lister Block is necessary, for any downtown revitalization strategy to be seen as a success.

The city and the union have been trying to hammer out a lease agreement for several weeks.

4 days until Lister Block proposal is presented!

City would pay $18m in Lister deal

Councillors vote this morning on a deal that would let the city move into a refurbished Lister Block for 15 years.

City hall and LIUNA have negotiated a tentative $1.2 million a year deal in which the city leases 50,000 square feet of prime office space at about $24 per square foot.

That comes to $18 million over the course of the lease.

City staff would take over close to half the Lister Block's first phase of development in LIUNA's $40 million project.

When done, the Lister will have about 400,000 square feet of office and commercial space.

Councillors will debate the deal behind closed doors this morning.

Confident LIUNA officials have called a news conference for 1pm today "to discuss plans for the development of the Lister Block" pending the outcome of councillors' vote.

The union has argued it needs the city as an anchor tenant to secure both redevelopment investment and other tenants.

Councillors will decide how the cost of the lease stacks up against other available office space in Hamilton, such as the Standard Life building and the former Eatons Centre now known as City Centre.

I'll be listening to LIUNA's news conference today for 1pm. So in a couple of minutes I'll know if council voted for Lister Block redevelopment.

Hopefully tomorrow I'll get hold of Lister Block proposal well hopefully approved proposal.

I'll be listening to LIUNA's news conference today for 1pm. So in a couple of minutes I'll know if council voted for Lister Block redevelopment.

Hopefully tomorrow I'll get hold of Lister Block proposal well hopefully approved proposal.

good work Steeltown.

Do you get paid to be a journalist? ;)

APPROVED!!!!!

:D

lets hear the details, man!

Okay, I saw the rendering of Lister Block, lots of new glass. I think I also saw a new parking garage across Lister Block.

I'll try my best to get the rendering of Lister Block. If I have to I'll bug the living crap out of my ward councillor.

Lister Deal Approved
May, 09 2005 - 6:00 PM

HAMILTON - Hamilton Mayor Larry Di Ianni calls it a decision that will provide a legacy for this City Council and this community.

City politicians have voted 13-to-3 to enter into a 15-year lease with LIUNA, to house employees within three floors of a redeveloped Lister Block.

It's an agreement that will cost the city about 2-million dollars a year or 30-million over the life of the lease, with rent, operating expenses and other costs factored in.

Ward 1 Councillor Brian McHattie, one of the supporters, calls it an investment in the future of downtown.

Flamborough's Margaret McCarthy an opponent, compares it to playing Santa Claus to a developer.

LIUNA's Joe Mancinelli, who is pumping 40-million dollars into the derelict landmark, hopes to celebrate the re-opening of the Lister Block within two years.

Construction starts right away perhaps this summer or early fall.

Got the rendering! I'll scan it and post it here in a bit.

Details of Lister Block redevelopment:

* City to have a 15 year tenant lease
* Will demolish and rebuild (builders will try to save some features, incorporate in the new Lister Block)
* Lister Block redevelopment has 2 phases
* Phase 1 Lister to be razed, historic facade catalogued and reintegrated into a modern structure.
* Over two years, LIUNA and developer Hi-Rise Group will build a rectangular building at least 6 storeys high with 120,000 square feet (currently Lister Block is 50,000 square feet L shape)
* The ground level will be rented out to retail businesses, the upper floors leased as prime office space
* Developers have not finalized the building's design
* May build a 7 storey, adding another 20,000 square feet in office space
* New structure will include neighbouring James Street North properties, surrounded by glass curtain, surface parking as far back as Hughson Street, as well as some underground parking
* Phase 1 should be completed by September 2007
* Phase 2, build a second city hall tower starting in 2018. Up to 10 storeys and 200,000 square feet behind Lister to house a government tenant and large commercial business with which LIUNA is negotiating,

Here's the rendering

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v174/Appster/lister1.jpg

Lots of glass

so, essentially, they're tearing it down. They can't possibly support it's massive facade during demolition/construction, so they're 'cataloging' and 'reintegrating' it into the new structure.

facadism.... gives me mixed feelings.

It's a shame that they couldn't simply restore the building as is. I wonder if it's a wood-beam structure? A shame, really. But any new is good news when you're desperate.

"Flamborough's Margaret McCarthy an opponent, compares it to playing Santa Claus to a developer"

what is she referring to?

I was a little bit disappointed when I heard LIUNA and Hi-Rise will demolish Lister Block and rebuild. But it's hard to redevelop a building that's been vacant and rotting for the last 15 years.

I'm kinda worried about Hi-Rise being involved. Hi-Rise is known to make boxy buildings, look at the new federal building next to Copps.

Funny all the councillors who voted against this redevelopment was suburb councillors. Margaret McCarthy of Flamborough, Dave Braden of Flamborough, and David Mitchell of Glanbrook.

On a new page so people are probably missing the rendering

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v174/Appster/lister1.jpg

well, regardless, this is certainly good news indeed!

will they bother with retail at grade? Who is the architect?

did you see the price the city is paying for this? I can't remember excat figures but it going to cost the city $33/foot to rent space in the lister and only $12/foot on a refurbished building on main street. Im all for action downtown but the city is paying through the ass for this one.

Starting in 2007 Lister Block will have an initial rate of $36.50 gross per square foot. That amount would drop to $31.50 if the city exempts its space from property tax payments.

Leasing at 250 Main Street East the gross starting price is $18.75 a square foot.

But the difference from Lister Block and 250 Main Street is that Lister Block will be a Class A office space. The only new Class A office space in downtown is the new federal building where cost is estimated at $48 square foot gross.

APPROVED!? That's awesome, this will really help downtown Hamilton and bring more people to live in the inner city. Although more residential projects near, in, or around downtown Hamilton would do WONDERS!

Here's a much clearer rendering of Lister Block

http://skyscraperpage.com/gallery/data/549/5507listerblock.jpg

We'd save Lister says competitor

Offer too late, says mayor
By Eric McGuinness
The Hamilton Spectator

Jackson Square owner Yale Properties says it is willing to buy and restore the landmark Lister Block rather than tear it down and rebuild, as the Laborers' International Union of North America (LIUNA) proposes to do.

Yale says it can save the Lister without public money and can offer the city space in Jackson Square for much less than in a rebuilt Lister.

A lawyer representing the Montreal-based company made both those statements in a letter councillors had before they voted Tuesday to spend more than $30 million over 15 years for space in a building LIUNA plans to erect on the Lister site across James Street North from Jackson Square at King William Street.

But Mayor Larry Di Ianni says Yale doesn't own the Lister and didn't try to buy it from LIUNA before the union made its pitch.

"The approach on that should not be made to us, and not after the fact. It might have been helpful to make it to the owner before the plans were made."

In the letter hand-delivered last Monday, Oakville lawyer Rodger Campbell complained it appeared the city had chosen to deal with LIUNA without considering other options or allowing others to make proposals.

Campbell said, "I believe my client would have had an interest in restoring rather than razing" the Lister Block. He said Stelco's departure has left a lot of space empty in Stelco Tower, which rises above the Jackson Square mall.

Councillors had the letter when they went behind closed doors to hear staff propose the city pay a partnership of LIUNA and Hi-Rise Group higher-than-market rent for 60,000 square feet in a new building designed to resemble the Lister Block, which has sat empty and decaying for a decade.

Mayor Larry Di Ianni and other supporters of the deal said it was worth a premium price to rid downtown of an eyesore that hinders other development.

It's the second time in four years Yale has tried to block the city from participating in a LIUNA-backed redevelopment of the Lister property.

A 2001 proposal for an office-commercial-hotel complex, which hinged on moving the Hamilton Farmers' Market from Jackson Square, collapsed after Yale and market stallholders protested.

Yale asked Ontario's Divisional Court to declare that deal illegal and sued for $260 million in damages, arguing the agreement under which Jackson Square was built on city land in 1970 obliged the city to keep the market there and help make the development a success.

The two legal actions have been merged and are still before the courts. Both are based on claims that remain to be proven.

In defence, the city denies offering illegal financial incentives to LIUNA, denies any bad faith on its part and maintains it is free to move the market. It blames Yale's litigation for "thwarting negotiations" with LIUNA, Kittling Ridge Winery and another partner in the 2001 proposal.

Mayor Larry Di Ianni defended the new Lister deal as key to revitalization of downtown, while insisting he wants friendly relations with Montreal-based Yale and its president, Emile Mashaal. He said he'd met Mashaal in an effort to settle the lawsuit "which doesn't do either of us any good."

Campbell says the city has not assured Yale the market will stay, but Di Ianni said "I've made this very, very clear. The move of the farmers' market was contingent on the first Lister deal which went nowhere. It was tied to something that no longer exists."

The mayor noted that the budget this year includes money for significant upgrades to the market in which he would like Yale to participate.

Councillor Murray Ferguson, who calls the Yale letter nothing but "sabre-rattling," tried to introduce a motion to stop the city from doing business with any company that sues it.

He said later, "I don't understand how you can sue an organization and do business with them at the same time."

The mayor headed off Ferguson's action and said he wants a staff report on the implications before he will entertain it.

Lister will be 'enhanced': Mancinelli

By Eric McGuinness
The Hamilton Spectator

When the Lister Block is rebuilt in 2007, "it will look like the Lister looked in 1924," when the decaying downtown landmark was new.

That's what Joe Mancinelli, vice-president of the Labourers' Union of North America (LIUNA), told The Hamilton Spectator editorial board at an hour-long session yesterday.

With him were Warren Green, president of Hi-Rise Group, LIUNA's partner in the project, and Mayor Larry Di Ianni, there to defend city council's decision to rent half the new building for 15 years.

The city deal stipulates that "the landlord will use its best efforts to maintain the architectural detail of the existing building." But there has been uncertainty over how closely the replacement exterior would resemble what now stands at James and King William streets.

Mancinelli insisted yesterday, "The Lister Block will be restored. If there are pieces that cannot be restored, they will be replicated. What you're going to see is the Lister Block restored, with the exception of several buildings adjacent to it.

It would be impossible to incorporate them.

"In their place, we will build a modern structure that will enhance and beautify the streetscape and enhance architecture of the Lister Block as well. You will see a brand-new building with the Lister Block incorporated in it."

As examples of what can be done, the union leader displayed photos of heritage buildings dismantled and rebuilt in other cities.

He said some ceilings in the concrete-framed Lister Block are only 2.4 metres high, too low to install new electrical conduit and ducts for heating and air conditioning. He also said the L-shaped structure would be expanded to form a rectangle with more than twice the total floor area of the present building.

Di Ianni argued that the proposed net rent (without heat, light, taxes or other operating costs) starting at $22.50 per square foot -- is within the current market range for Class A office space and does not represent an illegal bonus to the Lister partners.

While the city doesn't pay that much for space it now rents downtown, the mayor said, "If you want to go after the cheapest space, Lister is not what you want." He said the agreed-to rent is "well within market values and competitively so."

The price taxpayers will foot is about $36 a square foot -- a price that includes rent and operating costs like heat and hydro.

Green said, "The only market for high-level, A buildings is the federal building. Everything else (in downtown Hamilton) is substandard. There are a lot of C buildings, but the only A is the federal building. This will be built to the same standards, but at a lower rent."

He and Mancinelli said space in Burlington, Mississauga and Toronto costs more than will the Lister space.

Royal LePage Commercial Inc.'s market report on office leasing for the first three months of this year put the average asking price for Class A space in Toronto's financial core at $25.28 net, close to Pearson Airport at $14.21 and in Burlington at $13.53. The overall Greater Toronto Area average was $17.50. A company researcher noted actual rents are often lower.

Here's the original Lister Block building (built 1886).

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v174/Appster/listerblock.jpg

The original got caught on fire
http://www.hpl.hamilton.on.ca/Collections/downtown/images/fire.jpg

I bought a book that has over 300 pictures of Hamilton way back in history this weekend.

which book did you buy? My Nana has about a half dozen different Hamilton history books all of them are good.

I bought "Hamilton: Panorama of Our Past" for $40. I got well at the Battlefield. There's a group called Head-of-the-Lake Historical Society which collects tons of historical stuff about Hamilton, there the people who gave us the original Gore Park fountain and the Clock Tower at the old Eatons Centre, now City Centre.

LIUNA moves to save another downtown gem

The 1923 Lister isn’t the only historic building LIUNA plans to restore in the heart of downtown Hamilton.

Union boss Joe Mancinelli says the redevelopment project will also include the preservation and restoration of the even older Thomas building, the adjacent 1854 office and storehouse that’s immediately north of the Lister.

That’s the narrow building which in the original artist’s rendering of the Lister project was covered by a soaring street-to-sky wall of glass. You can erase that unfortunate image from your memory.

The glass wall is toast.

Mancinelli says Laborers’ International Union of North America and its partners, Hi-Rise Group, intend to give the Thomas building the same treatment as the Lister.

They’ll preserve what can be preserved, reproduce what can’t be saved, and retain the same integrity and spirit of the original design, inside and out.

Mancinelli says the developers were never committed to the glass wall.

But last month, when they released their plans to rehabilitate the dilapidated Lister on James North into a structure fit for state-of-the-art modern offices, they didn’t appreciate the historical significance of the Thomas building.

Now that architects have brought them up to speed, they’ll incorporate the Thomas into the flow and design of the Lister Block.

“It’s not going to be displaced by a modern structure or conflicting architectural designs.

We’re going to maintain the integrity of what was there,” said Mancinelli.

The building was designed by William Thomas, a 19th-century English architect probably best known in Hamilton for St. Paul’s Presbyterian Church on James South and Christ’s Church on James North. He also designed the Niagara-on the-Lake courthouse and St. Lawrence Hall in Toronto.

Mancinelli points out the limestone building is actually much bigger than most people realize. What appears to be a separate building immediately next to it is actually a continuation of the same building that has been covered by metal cladding.

Unfortunately, he expects the stone window pediments that distinguish the Thomas were obliterated in order to make the cladding flush with the rest of the building.

But they can be reproduced from the surviving pediments.

The real issue will be the flow of floor space from the four storey Thomas to the six storey Lister.

They’re different buildings built in different eras. But the developers don’t want to maintain a stand-alone building.

They want to blend the two interiors so they’ll have one building that happens to have different distinguishing facades.

“The problem is more one of engineering to ensure that we can align the floors,” says Mancinelli. “Once we’re done with that, I think the rest is going to be fairly simple.”

Because the Thomas is shorter than the Lister, Mancinelli says they may have to bridge the height difference with some glass. But he can’t say for sure.

The architects, including Hamilton’s John Mokrycke, who worked with LIUNA on the restoration of the CN station, will be in charge of the historical part of the project, including how to aesthetically tie the buildings together.

Diane Dent, chair of the city’s Municipal Heritage Committee, formerly LACAC, is pleased LIUNA intends to protect the Thomas building. And she trusts Mancinelli when he says the intent is to preserve as much of both buildings as possible.

“But that doesn’t mean we aren’t nervous.”

Mancinelli estimates the Lister project will cost about $28 million. He says façade restoration for both Lister and Thomas will add about $3 million to that figure. Work is expected to begin in October.

Meanwhile, look for the next project graphic to look like the real thing.

“Instead of it being conceptual, I think the next artist drawing will actually be a rendering of what’s going to go up,” says Mancinelli.

Finally after 2 years of much discussion we can start to see the Lister Block redeveloped!

Premier offers $7 million for Lister Block redevelopment
June 22, 2007

Premier Dalton McGuinty has announced the province will give Hamilton $7 million for the redevelopment of the downtown Lister Block.

Premier Dalton McGuinty was in Hamilton this morning to make the announcement.The city will relocate its Public Health Department to the heritage building as an anchor tenant.

That move would reduce the overall cost to the local taxpayer of restoring the building and give the building an anchor tenant.

Building A Stronger Hamilton For Future Generations
Supporting Lister Block Restoration Project Means Good, High-Paying Jobs, Better Quality Of Life For Families

HAMILTON, ON, June 22 /CNW/ - Ontario Premier Dalton McGuinty announced today that the government is building a high quality of life for people in Hamilton by helping to revitalize its downtown core.

"Maintaining Ontario's heritage and preserving our history is part of building a stronger, more vibrant province for all of us," said Premier McGuinty. "The Lister Block restoration will not only revitalize downtown Hamilton, it will create new high-value jobs and strengthen the city for future generations."

Premier McGuinty made his remarks at the Lister Block site, where he joined Hamilton Mayor Fred Eisenberger, other local officials and community
members.

The McGuinty government is investing $7 million to redevelop the Lister Block, a six-storey vacant building that was constructed in the 1920s and has distinct architectural features. The project will help Hamilton realize its vision as a modern urban centre. It will also help attract new visitors and investment to the city.

Once the project is complete, the remodelled building will accommodate
Hamilton's public health department.

"The renewal of the Lister Block is a significant step toward the successful revitalization of Hamilton's downtown core," said Mayor Eisenberger. "Investment in Hamilton's future is essential, and Premier McGuinty's continued commitment to healthcare, transit, and now this latest investment in the Lister Block is an encouraging step in moving forward. I welcome the Province's continued partnership with the City of Hamilton over the long-term."

"The Lister Block is a provincially significant landmark and historical site," said Hamilton West MPP Judy Marsales. "By preserving its magnificent history and architectural beauty, our government is helping to make Hamilton a great place to live, work and play for families."

"I am so pleased that the Lister Block will be taken off of the 'critical' list," said Dr. Marie Bountrogianni, MPP for Hamilton Mountain.

"The rehabilitation and renovation of this historic site will be a turning point in revitalizing Hamilton's downtown core, and will provide more opportunities to showcase Hamilton's unique atmosphere and vitality."

Revitalizing downtown Hamilton is the latest way the McGuinty government is getting results for communities. Other measures include:

- Creating a multi-year, $17.5-billion rapid transit action plan for the Greater Toronto Area and Hamilton that will deliver jobs and investment by reducing congestion

- Launching ReNew Ontario, a five-year, $30-billion infrastructure investment plan to repair, revitalize and expand public infrastructure

- Releasing a landmark Places to Grow plan to create complete communities, with a better mix of businesses, services, housing and parks that will make them more livable.

"A stronger Hamilton, means a stronger Ontario," said Premier McGuinty. "Working, building and dreaming together, we can make Ontario the place to be for our children, and our children's children."

http://www.raisethehammer.org/images/new_lister_block_rendering.jpg

McHattie vindicated with province's $7m
By Nicole Macintyre
The Hamilton Spectator
(Jun 23, 2007)

The province is committing $7 million to help redevelop Hamilton's most notorious eyesore.

Construction on the Lister Block will start as soon as council inks a long-term lease to become the anchor tenant at the heritage building at the corner of James and King William streets.

"This is a done deal," Mayor Fred Eisenberger said yesterday after the announcement by Premier Dalton McGuinty.

The funding, despite its convenient timing, isn't dependent on the Liberals being re-elected in October.

"We want to help you strengthen this community," said McGuinty. "We want a stronger Hamilton for a stronger Ontario."

The funding will be used to lower the city's leasing costs of about $40 million over 20 years.

Tim McCabe, the city's head of economic development and planning, said he expects the lease will be formalized by the fall.

The province intervened in the Lister Block a year ago at the request of Councillor Brian McHattie, who objected to the original plan to tear down the heritage building.

Yesterday's funding announcement was vindication for McHattie, who was widely criticized for his call for help. Without his intervention, the city wouldn't have the province's help now, noted McCabe.

"We came through smiling on this."

The developers, Hi-Rise Group and Labourers' International Union of North America, expect construction will take up to 16 months.

The city's public health department, which is partly funded by the province, is expected to move into the Lister.

Nice to see the redevelopment of Lister Block finally take place. It was sad to see it unused for so long. I think Hamilton is finally starting to rise again and its great to see. Hopefully some new talls come soon!