according to Furbe, the Whitecaps really want this new stadium and they are really pushing ahead for a new stadium in Downtown Vancouver. he also said that the Whitecaps wanted to build a waterfront stadium east of Canada Place but the city turned it down because they want to keep that land available for port expansion. the plan is for the stadium to be home to the Whitecaps and Lions, with eventual plans of landing an MLS franchise (basically the whitecaps getting promoted to MLS).



Vancouver Sun, Page F01, 22-Mar-2005

Pitching for FIFA bid

By Dan Stinson

The Vancouver Whitecaps' plans for a new downtown Vancouver outdoor stadium with a minimum seating capacity of 10,000 are progressing slowly but surely.

But construction of the stadium is not a prerequisite to the city's bid as one of six locations for the 2007 FIFA World Youth men's soccer tournament, Whitecaps FC director of operations Bob Lenarduzzi said Monday.

FIFA, soccer's world governing body, awarded Canada the 2007 World Youth (men's under-20) soccer tournament last August.

The National Organizing Committee has since selected Edmonton's Commonwealth Stadium and Toronto's York University as venues for the 24-nation, 52-game tournament, leaving nine cities to bid for the remaining four locations.

Vancouver's bid was officially launched at a news conference Monday.

It was also announced that Victoria, Calgary, Winnipeg, Hamilton, Ottawa, Montreal, Quebec City and Sherbrooke have entered the bidding process as venues for the July 1-22, 2007, tournament.

The final four locations will be awarded by the NOC on May 4.

Lenarduzzi, who serves as a vice-chairman on Vancouver's 2007 FIFA World Youth Championship Bid Committee, said Burnaby's Swangard Stadium would not be ruled out as a facility in Vancouver's bid, but added: "The bid would certainly be enhanced by the construction of a new stadium in the downtown [Vancouver] area."

Swangard Stadium's seating capacity is 5,722 and can be expanded to about 6,800 with the addition of end-zone bleacher seats.

But FIFA does not require minimum seating capacity for the tournament's group games and quarter-final matches, which Vancouver and the other eight bid cities would stage.

Commonwealth Stadium has been selected as the site of the tournament's championship game.

"We [the Whitecaps] are on record as wanting to build a new permanent stadium," Lenarduzzi said. "The problem we're going to have is the relatively short time frame for a 2007 event. If we find that we can't build a permanent facility in that period of time, we're prepared to look at a temporary facility. We've had discussions regarding that taking place."

Lenarduzzi said the temporary facility would accommodate between 10,000 and 15,000 spectators "and we would want to have the ability to expand it to 25,000 to 30,000 as a permanent facility."

Lenarduzzi said Whitecaps' owner Greg Kerfoot is prepared to fund construction of a proposed stadium, but added he could not disclose the location or the cost of the facility.

"If there's funding available, be it either through federal or provincial [governments], that's something we will try to access," Lenarduzzi said.

"But at this stage, Greg has made the commitment to move forward. The stadium will be in downtown Vancouver, but I can't say exactly where at this time. There are a lot of discussions and red tape to go through. I don't want to comment on the process because discussions are continuing."

Kerfoot is chairman of the Vancouver Bid Committee. Other committee members include vice-chairman John Rocha, who was recently hired as Whitecaps FC president, and B.C. Soccer Association president Victor Montagliani.

A 12-person committee advisory board includes Dave Cobb, senior vice-president, revenue, marketing and communications of Vancouver's 2010 Olympic Committee, and former Vancouver Canucks owner Arthur Griffiths.

----------------------------------------------------

one thing i would like to add is that the Lions would only move to this stadium if it's expandable to 50,000 (CFL minimum) for Grey Cup Games. i think the stadium should definetely have much more spectator capacity as suppose to only being expandable to 25,000-30,000. Vancouver needs a much more bigger stadium than that as the government wants to demolish BC Place after 2010.

anybody got any suggestions on downtown locations?

I love the idea of a new stadium. But I am not sure about where it should go. Downtown somewere would be great as it adds to the "skyline". But land is running out and I don't want it to take away from highrise areas and the new uni-health campus area.

As for BC Place - it is already and icon of van and would hate to see it go - however and huge reno is in order to modernize its look.

^ awhile ago, there was an article in the Sun that said the government is considering to implode BC Place to make way for condos after the Olympics.

Would there be room near Science World area? I suppose it depends on how big it will be. As for BC Place its a shame Vancouver could never make a go of it or find other uses considering its size and importance. Be a waste to implode it considering the potential. Watch it get tore down and something outdoor like Edmonton's big football statium go up in Surrey. Big covered stadiums in this country have the kiss of death. We'd rather be outside and cold. lol

"the waterfront east of Canada Place at Coal Harbour" <<< Coal Harbour is actually west of Canada Place near Stanley Park. That would be tragic. :)

Anyway, I chose the flats. Good access to skytrain. Seems they'd have to wait awhile for BC Place to get torn down. Anywhere they can get approval would be fine for me though.

There has been this new stadium talk for years, but I'm actually starting to believe something will happen this time. :righton: But of course nothing will, and we'll end up waiting another 10 years. :hahaha:

BC Place getting torn down would be a waist, but as long as it doesn't come out of my pockets... and it looks like an upside down toilet bowl.

I voted False Creek Flats but I think it should go up town near commercial.

I voted False Creek Flats but I think it should go up town near commercial.
Well if you're heading out there, how about where the old Empire site was? :) Nothing really there except a big parking lot and a couple playing fields.

Well if you're heading out there, how about where the old Empire site was? :) Nothing really there except a big parking lot and a couple playing fields.

horrible location being in the middle of nowhere and right beside a highway plus no rapid transit. besides, the city already has spent millions on the former Empire Stadium site creating a park. locals wouldn't like it. so many businesses would benefit from a new stadium in downtown.

horrible location being in the middle of nowhere and right beside a highway plus no rapid transit. besides, the city already has spent millions on the former Empire Stadium site creating a park. locals wouldn't like it. so many businesses would benefit from a new stadium in downtown.
Yea, I know. Sorry, I was sort of half joking. I totally prefer a place around downtown. I'm curious about that park btw. I've never seen what they've done with the areas that are complete.

Yea, I know. Sorry, I was sort of half joking. I totally prefer a place around downtown. I'm curious about that park btw. I've never seen what they've done with the areas that are complete.

well, i believe the budget for Hastings Park for phase I is $80 million (total budget $156 million) and the original plan was to move Burns Bog once the fair's lease expired a few years ago meaning the city could do whatever it wants with Hastings Park. of course, plans changed and the fair will stay in the park but changes could be made to the fair size.
http://www.city.vancouver.bc.ca/parks/parks/hastings/images/hastmap1-sm.jpg




Final plans for Empire Bowl:
http://www.city.vancouver.bc.ca/parks/parks/hastings/images/hpEmpireFieldsSketch.jpg
Empire Bowl, a $2.9 million development is "Phase 3B" in the greening of the park. The redevelopment of the 5.5 hectare site, provides additional sports facilities for the community, including two sand based, irrigated, turf soccer fields; two softball diamonds, an oval running track and a perimeter granular pathway. Landscaping includes perimeter trees and grassed banks. The 157 sq. m. field house contains change rooms, washrooms and related service spaces.



1995
http://www.city.vancouver.bc.ca/parks/parks/hastings/images/hastmap3-1-sm.jpg



2002
http://www.city.vancouver.bc.ca/parks/parks/hastings/images/airphoto2002.jpg

a downtown stadium would have to be really nice. how about these concepts:

http://www.worldstadiums.com/stadium_menu/past_future/pictures/future_stadiums/salvador_arena.jpg



OR


but smaller
http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/art/sports/seahawks/stadium/cover04.jpg
http://i.cnn.net/si/images/football/nfl/stadiums/seahawks.jpg

Get ride of that "Mushroom Bowl" or whatever the hell they call it. Horrible looking thing. Ya, nice when it rains but horrible when the sun is shining, its a nice day and you're stuck in a tent. There really is something Canadian watching the CFL in the cold. I find BC Place very clostraphobic and grey..........both in and out. I think it is , be far, Canada's worst stadium. It doesn't feel like a stadium but rather a hockey arena.
They could get one with a retractable roof re;SkyDome.
They are expensive but also the stadium could be built and the retractable roof later as in Montreal" big O.

All I know is build it near downtown. Don't be making the same mistake Winnipeg is making right now in building a stadium and waterpark at the edge of the city.

If football and soccer are moving out to this new stadium, how about retrofitting BC Place into a stadium that is suited for baseball? Now good luck in finding a tenant, MLB or AAA.

They should allow the public up onto the "roof" of BC place. I've seen maintenance workers goofing off and bouncing up and down on it. It looks like so much fun! :D

They could get one with a retractable roof re;SkyDome.
They are expensive but also the stadium could be built and the retractable roof later as in Montreal" big O.

about three years ago, there was a article in the Sun about the government asking a British company called BMP about its stadium SkyLid retractable roof technology.

BMP's Skylid:
- massive reductions (up to 80%) in overall weight for roofing structure and machinery
significantly lower construction costs
- lower impact on stadium design compared to conventional retractable roofing
- adaptable for all stadium-based sporting events
- opens and closes in only 10 minutes
- cost effective opportunities for wider roof span
- greater flexibility for stadium usage (concerts, exhibitions, etc.)
- can economically be added to existing stadia

BMP's study showed that it would cost between $20-30 million to install a Skylid for BC Place.

http://www.bdp.co.uk/graphics/skylid/skylid_centrebar_thin.jpg
http://www.bdp.co.uk/graphics/skylid/skylid_interior2.jpg

though imo, this costs cheap but also looks cheap. that's why i prefer Wimbledon's new retractable roof technology:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/media/images/39708000/gif/_39708177_interi_1.gif
http://news.bbc.co.uk/media/images/39708000/gif/_39708181_sequence1.gif
http://news.bbc.co.uk/media/images/39708000/gif/_39708183_sequence2.gif
http://news.bbc.co.uk/media/images/39708000/gif/_39708187_sequence4.gif


i say screw a new stadium, lets just redo BC Place and give it a retractable roof.

It's time to start looking towards the future. Downtown is running out of room. Where does downtown expand to?

There are several options - North-East - through gastown, and east vancouver. But you still need to leave room for the port expansion, and you'd have to clean up the neighborhood.

The other option is South-East, where BC place is, around false creek connecting to the high rises at Science world, and then to the other side of false creek, eventually connecting to the broadway corridor which should have a skytrain line as well (millenium expansion)


With all this being said I don't really think that a stadium at the BC place location is the best place. Though I WOULD just prefer it if they replaced it with a retractable roof, seems like this is not happening. Instead, we need a stadium right where they're saying - on the burrard inlet.

The only problem is that I say if you're gonna do it - do it right. None of this 20-25 thousand crap. Make it able to handle 50-60 thousand.

Would there be room near Science World area? I suppose it depends on how big it will be. As for BC Place its a shame Vancouver could never make a go of it or find other uses considering its size and importance.
Remember the days when every big concert act played large stadiums, like BC Place? Now even the biggest of them all, such as U2, prefer to play smaller arenas like GM Place. What happened? Did they just recently come to the realization that large stadiums are crap when it comes to acoustics and sightlines?

So I guess unless you can fill it with sporting events, there's not much use for large stadiums anymore.

If football and soccer are moving out to this new stadium, how about retrofitting BC Place into a stadium that is suited for baseball? Now good luck in finding a tenant, MLB or AAA.
As an addendum to this, both the Northwest region, and Canada as a whole, with the Expos departing, could use a team in the NL, wouldn't you say? What are the chances?

It's time to start looking towards the future. Downtown is running out of room. Where does downtown expand to?

There are several options - North-East - through gastown, and east vancouver. But you still need to leave room for the port expansion, and you'd have to clean up the neighborhood.

The other option is South-East, where BC place is, around false creek connecting to the high rises at Science world, and then to the other side of false creek, eventually connecting to the broadway corridor which should have a skytrain line as well (millenium expansion)


With all this being said I don't really think that a stadium at the BC place location is the best place. Though I WOULD just prefer it if they replaced it with a retractable roof, seems like this is not happening. Instead, we need a stadium right where they're saying - on the burrard inlet.

The only problem is that I say if you're gonna do it - do it right. None of this 20-25 thousand crap. Make it able to handle 50-60 thousand.


the city actually said Central Broadway and the Downtown Eastside would be in the future part of Vancouver's downtown.

i agree, 50,000-60,000 in the future is the way to go or we either re-do BC Place and give it a new roof. lets do it right! :cheers:

As an addendum to this, both the Northwest region, and Canada as a whole, with the Expos departing, could use a team in the NL, wouldn't you say? What are the chances?

the problem is - and i could be way off about this - nobody gives a crap about baseball in Vancouver.

The canadiens have/had their small fanbase, but beyond that? Could we sustain a major league team? I say no.

We are much more likely to support an NFL franchise - people do like football here. However, every city in north america would like an NFL franchise. And with teh money they make, and the revenue sharing policy they have, the owners aren't going to approve any expansion any time soon. And even IF they do allow a team in canada, it's going to Toronto first, Montreal second, Vancouver third. And there's many american cities in line to get cities ahead of any canadian city.

I think our only hope would be another NBA franchise but there the problem is similar to baseball. We USED to love basketball (i personally still do) but so many people got jaded after the grizzlies fiasco, i don't think anybody wants an nba franchise here anymore.


The point is Vancouver is going to be a one-team town for a very long time. (i'm not counting the CFL, and i do allow for the possibility of MLS but not counting that either)

no to the NFL coming to Canada or it would be the start of the end of our beloved and much more historic CFL.

The Grizz did good in Vancouver till they started sucking beyond a tolerable level if they did reasonably good then they would still be here and they would have a good fan base. I think the NBA should try here again in 15-20 years.

The Grizz did good in Vancouver till they started sucking beyond a tolerable level if they did reasonably good then they would still be here and they would have a good fan base. I think the NBA should try here again in 15-20 years.

not only that the team performance was a reason for their demise but how the franchise was operated. Griffths also sold it to an American who sweared he wouldn't move the team.

As for BC Place its a shame Vancouver could never make a go of it or find other uses considering its size and importance. Be a waste to implode it considering the potential. Watch it get tore down and something outdoor like Edmonton's big football statium go up in Surrey. Big covered stadiums in this country have the kiss of death. We'd rather be outside and cold. lol

Actually... BC Place is very much used. It is booked solid almost year round (playdome, car show, boat show, outdoor show, monster truck etc..). What is the point of an outdoor stadium? Consider how much it rains here! Football has only 10 games a year in BC Place and almost nobody goes to soccer games. We don't need an outdoor stadium! A retractable roof would be ideal but that is really expensive. I say renovate BC Place instead of demolishing it.

Edit: My last two sentences didn't make much sense.

Actually... BC Place is very much used. It is booked solid almost year round (playdome, car show, boat show, outdoor show, monster truck etc..). What is the point of an outdoor stadium? Consider how much it rains here! Football has only 10 games a year in BC Place and almost nobody goes to soccer games. We don't need an outdoor stadium! A retractable roof would be ideal but that is really expensive. I say beef up BC Place instead!

BC Place makes up for the lack of convention space in Vancouver. the stadium has about 250,000 sq. feet of convention/exhibition space. you have probably heard that the year before SARS, VCEC had to turn away more than 40 conventions because of lack of space. when Centennial Pavillon, the new convention centre, is finished it will take the job of BC Place in hosting conventions and exhibitions. i'm not sure where things like the monster truck rally and Playdome would go but the boat show and things like that would move to VCEC. some convention and show contracts at BC Place also expire in 2007.

also, when was the last time BC Place was filled at capacity? when were all 60,000 seats filled? November 28, 1999 when our city hosted the Grey Cup. the last time the capacity was even at the 50,000s was last year for the CFL Western Final.

but i still agree with you, BC Place is used for 4/5ths of the year; one of the most used stadiums in Canada. we should do a huge re-do and give it a retractable roof but as i said before, the cheapest of retractable roofs will come to at least $25 million.



interesting note btw, our old demolished Empire Stadium had 32,000 seats.

the problem is - and i could be way off about this - nobody gives a crap about baseball in Vancouver.

The canadiens have/had their small fanbase, but beyond that? Could we sustain a major league team? I say no.

We are much more likely to support an NFL franchise - people do like football here. However, every city in north america would like an NFL franchise. And with teh money they make, and the revenue sharing policy they have, the owners aren't going to approve any expansion any time soon. And even IF they do allow a team in canada, it's going to Toronto first, Montreal second, Vancouver third. And there's many american cities in line to get cities ahead of any canadian city.

I think our only hope would be another NBA franchise but there the problem is similar to baseball. We USED to love basketball (i personally still do) but so many people got jaded after the grizzlies fiasco, i don't think anybody wants an nba franchise here anymore.


The point is Vancouver is going to be a one-team town for a very long time. (i'm not counting the CFL, and i do allow for the possibility of MLS but not counting that either)

meh, Vancouver would probably be ahead of Montreal. MLB could work, if the team doesnt suck for too long. I think its just a matter of people supporting it, everything else is here. Population, money etc.

meh, Vancouver would probably be ahead of Montreal. MLB could work, if the team doesnt suck for too long. I think its just a matter of people supporting it, everything else is here. Population, money etc.

you left out one thing. we need a new stadium or a refurbished BC Place.

the problem is - and i could be way off about this - nobody gives a crap about baseball in Vancouver.

The canadiens have/had their small fanbase, but beyond that? Could we sustain a major league team? I say no.

We are much more likely to support an NFL franchise - people do like football here. However, every city in north america would like an NFL franchise. And with teh money they make, and the revenue sharing policy they have, the owners aren't going to approve any expansion any time soon. And even IF they do allow a team in canada, it's going to Toronto first, Montreal second, Vancouver third. And there's many american cities in line to get cities ahead of any canadian city.

I think our only hope would be another NBA franchise but there the problem is similar to baseball. We USED to love basketball (i personally still do) but so many people got jaded after the grizzlies fiasco, i don't think anybody wants an nba franchise here anymore.


The point is Vancouver is going to be a one-team town for a very long time. (i'm not counting the CFL, and i do allow for the possibility of MLS but not counting that either)
I thought the one thing baseball might have going for it is that out of the major league sports, it is the one whose season overlaps the least with hockey, whereas basketball's coincides with it almost entirely.

Of course, there's also much more hype and hoopla to a major league team, which is also bound to attract more fans than minor league.

but i still agree with you, BC Place is used for 4/5ths of the year; one of the most used stadiums in Canada. we should do a huge re-do and give it a retractable roof but as i said before, the cheapest of retractable roofs will come to at least $25 million.
It will still be cheaper than building a whole new stadium, will it not?

It will still be cheaper than building a whole new stadium, will it not?

the new Winnipeg Stadium with 40,000 seats is going to cost $160 million. the new stadium in TO is going to cost $75 million with 25,000 seats.

i would think it would be cheaper as our 10,000 to 15,000 seat expandable to 25,000-30,000 would cost at least $50 million. but then, you have to add in other renovations that should take place at the stadium when a new roof is installed such as new lighting, new acoustics, new video screens, new media technology, better accessibility, new seats, better stadium floor, better changerooms, etc. and a more modern look. that would cost at least another $25 million.

25 or 50 mill is still a hell of a lot cheaper than a new stadium. Th land alone would cost that much.
Put a retractable roof on the Mushroom so it is a real stadium not a tent. Ya, keeps out the rain but seriously it only rains a lot fron Oct to March, the summers are beautiful and dry as a bone.
Watching the CFL in Vancouver is a depressing experience. The seasons that we play the CFL in Vancouver are ussually quite dry.
Vancouver needs to think outside the box........er, should I say tent.

This is the sort of thing I'd like to see. :runaway:
http://img129.exs.cx/img129/218/theden15xm.jpg (http://www.imageshack.us)

Anyone recognize it? Not many here would. It's the old Den where Millwall used to play. Really interesting reading about its history...

Seriously, the Lions would do fine to stay where they are. Cut the roof off with scissors or something though. Btw - They are adding field turf, much better than astro turf, this year. It doesn't sound like the Caps are really interested in anything beyond 20 thousand at this stage. So, the two organizations would be hard pressed to find a compromise if they were to share the same facility.

Another thing I'd like to add, soccer should be played on real grass :soapbox:!!!

I was just thinking of the noise that could be generated by a stadium without a roof on at that location. I'm no acoustics expert, but I'd bet the sound would carry through much of downtown and across False Creek. People would complain, as they did during Indy. Probably not as bad as indy cars, but still noticeable I'm sure. Just something to think about.

:dance2:

our new stadium is likely to be something simple like this:

http://www.worldstadiums.com/stadium_menu/past_future/pictures/future_stadiums/dallas_burn.jpg
http://www.worldstadiums.com/stadium_menu/past_future/pictures/future_stadiums/chicago_bridgeview.jpg
http://www.worldstadiums.com/stadium_menu/past_future/pictures/future_stadiums/toronto_york.jpg
http://www.canadasoccer.com/images/stadium/stadium_sky.jpg
http://www.canadasoccer.com/images/stadium/stadium_inside.jpg

I think thats fine, a big simple stadium.

this is a really good article that somebody posted at SSP so i thought i might as well post it here as well.

Time for a New Vancouver Ballpark?
Pop the bubble? BC Place and Nat Bailey are aging, the Whitecaps are surging. In short, a stadium full of opportunities.

By Brian Schecter
Published: April 13, 2005


Is it time to pop the bubble?


What happens to Vancouver’s gigantic downtown mushroom after the Olympics? The fate of BC Place Stadium is still anyone’s guess. The one with the final say, the provincial government, has gone into hibernation on the issue pending this spring’s election.

But the region’s population growth, pricey land values and the coming Olympics are sharpening the imaginations of politicians and planners. They’re not only asking what to do with the Dome. Some would like to see a major stadium built in the Lower Mainland, a classy new home for professional soccer and maybe other teams.

But with that vision come new questions. If you build a stadium, will they come? And who will pay for it? Around town a lot of discussions, so far private and out of sight, centre on those questions.

Beating the drum loudly, however, is NPA Park Board Commissioner Suzanne Anton, elected to the Vancouver Park Board two and a half years ago. Anton’s preliminary investigations included looking at the edges of the Downtown East Side, most specifically on land located on the fringes of Chinatown, adjacent to the old CN Train Station.

The area is ripe for development and would fit into the city’s long-term master plan to revitalize the downtown core. Building a new stadium there, however, appears far down the list of civic priorities. A factor is that Anton lacks political juice in her new role on the Park Board, which prefers to focus on developing green spaces and community-based facilities.

What about Nat Bailey?

One big facility commanding the Park Board attention is the curling venue for the 2010 Games. It’s slated to be located at Vancouver’s Riley and Hillcrest Parks, next to Nat Bailey Stadium, home of the Northwest League Vancouver Canadians.

As part of the legacy program associated with Vancouver 2010, the Park Board will inherit the new $28 million curling facility along with a new community centre, library, swimming pool and skating rink, plus assorted other local area park improvements and amenities.

Will any of that glitter rub off on old Nat? Not much, it seems. The Park Board is landlord to the old ball park, built in the early 50’s within the boundaries of Queen Elizabeth Park. Today, the team that plays there, the single-A level Vancouver Canadians, occupies a low rung in minor league baseball. Vancouver used to have a triple-A team, but they outgrew Nat Bailey and departed for Sacramento in 1999.

The current thinking by the Park Board centers on keeping the baseball facility as is and upgrading the infrastructure of the 55 year old stadium as funds and time allow. That’s fine with owners of the Canadians. As the territorial rights holder to minor league baseball, and assuming the C’s are content to remain a part of the single-A short season Northwest League, Nat Bailey is more than adequate.

Rising Whitecaps

Across town, the A-League Vancouver Whitecaps are making waves about building a new, downtown, soccer-centric facility.

While ‘Caps owner Greg Kerfoot’s plans to build a privately financed new stadium to house both the men’s and women’s pro teams have been percolating for over a year now, Vancouver’s bid to grab a piece of the 2007 World Under 20 FIFA Championships has given those rumours some sense of urgency.

The Whitecaps have identified a number of potential sites, including a chunk of waterfront land. City planners are said to be open to the concept, but their interest is dependent upon approval from the land’s owners, Port Vancouver, who want to reserve the land for future expanded port-related business.

The Whitecaps alternate plans could include reviving Park Board Commissioner Anton’s ideas for an outdoor stadium somewhere in the False Creek flats area.

The Whitecaps currently play at Burnaby’s Swangard Stadium (capacity 5,722). While temporary seating could add another 1,100 seats, those numbers are about half of what the team envisions for a new stadium home.

Even then, at 15,000 seats, the numbers do not work for Vancouver’s CFL Lions, who would need a minimum 35,000 seat stadium and the ability to expand to over 50,000 for Grey Cup host city needs.

Lions waiting to huddle

Which brings us back to BC Place Stadium. While the Lions are content to extend their current lease through 2010, they are no doubt looking forward to huddling after the election with the provincial government over the question of their long term lodging.

Opened with fanfare worthy of a royal tour, Vancouver’s BC Place Stadium aged quicker than the Queen herself. Hailed as state of the art in 1983, the big dome was supposed to help put Vancouver on the big league map. In fact, built for an affordable $126 million, the stadium quickly attracted a wide array of sports, entertainment and trade show events.

The CFL’s Lions were quick off the mark – routinely packing their new football home, regularly drawing near standing-room-only crowds. BC Place would go on to host concerts, Papal tours, Expo 86, trade shows and sporting events.

Things, however, have changed. Operating in the black until the late 90s, the stadium has run deficits of around $2 million a year for the last eight years.

When the Liberals took over in Victoria in 2001, BC Place Stadium and its parent corporation BC Pavilion Corp. (PAVCO) came under the critical eye of the new provincial government. The Liberals pared back PAVCO operations and the future of BC Place Stadium was put on hold, pending the outcome of Vancouver’s bid to host the 2010 Winter Games.

Which is why few were cheering louder for Vancouver to win Olympic hosting honours than Stadium general manager Howard Crosley. His venue will host the opening and closing ceremonies.

Given that minimum five-year stay of execution, BC Place officials recently met with Vancouver planners as part of the city’s North East False Creek Official Development Plan. One idea discussed centered around building a mixed conference center, office and retail facility on the Smythe and Pacific corner.

Fresh turf

The biggest concern right now is what to do with the stadium in the short term.

Options will increase when Crosley replaces the Stadium’s worn out Astroturf carpet with FieldTurf he secured from Montreal’s Olympic Stadium – an affordable $1.5 million option that fell into his lap when the Expos left Montreal for Washington D.C.

In addition to saving about $750,000, buying the used FieldTurf surface potentially opens up new sports event opportunities for the stadium. According to Crosley, even adding four new major sports events per year would allow the Stadium to wipe out annual deficits.

For example, FIFA, the world governing body of soccer, has recently given its blessing to the synthetic surface, paving the way for FieldTurf venues to host major international matches and tournaments. With Canada already selected as the host country for the 2007 Youth (Boys U-20) Championships, BC Place Stadium officials would love nothing better than to showcase their new carpet at that time.

Similarly, the International Rugby Board’s ruling has okayed FieldTurf as a legitimate playing surface.

Although many at BC Place would dearly love to revive the annual pre-season baseball games, scheduling conflicts with existing trade and consumer shows make that unlikely.

Adding sports-related dates to the BC Place Stadium calendar opens up the potential to grow other venue-based revenue streams.

Increased events would translate into more exposure and in turn would be an enticement to lure new sponsors to the table. Dome officials are currently exploring building naming rights options – a title sponsorship opportunity that could bring in up to $750,000 a year in new revenues.

It’s all in play

So where will denizens of the Lower Mainland find themselves munching popcorn, drinking beer, and cheering themselves hoarse a decade down the road, if not sooner?

To date, the various stakeholders have not forged any real common bond, opting instead to act independently from one another, to further their own respective self-interests.

The Park Board is focused on post Olympic 2010 world and dealing with the legacies from the Games.

The Friends of Nat Bailey Stadium lobby group, is expending its energies ensuring the survival of pro baseball in Vancouver.

The Whitecaps are trying to move forward with their stadium plans – hoping other interested parties like the Lions, will join their cause - sooner rather than later.

As for Anton, she is ramping up for a run at City Council this fall, with an eye towards raising the profile of the stadium debate onto the civic stage. Whether that campaign is enough to jump-start the issue, remains to be seen.


BC Place by the Numbers

Construction Cost: $126 mil.

Official Opening: June 19, 1983.

Materials: five million kilos of reinforce steel, 60,000 cubic metres of concrete – length of a sidewalk from Vancouver to Seattle.

Size: Spans 10 acres of downtown land, capacity up to 60,000, including 8 hospitality rooms and 35 Pacific Rim Suites.

Number of User Days: 200 per year

Hosted Events: Tours, Conferences, Concerts, Expo 86, Six Grey Cups, trade & consumer shows and community events.

Net Economic Benefits: estimated $31 million in fiscal 2004, $3.5 million tax to Province Treasury

Total Attendance: 20.6 million. (March 2004)



TheTyee.ca (http://www.thetyee.ca/News/2005/04/13/NewVancouverBallpark/)



instead, imo, we should spend a hundred million or more to renovate BC Place and give it a new landmark sleek retractable roof. if the BC Liberals proposed this, I think it would really help them win the upcoming election in a month.

So far, the BC Liberals in the past few weeks have handed out $50 million to fund the construction of sport and recreational facilities across the province.

it would be a dream to have this done by 2010.

but unfortunately, i have just learned that today is the last day the Liberals can legally announce new spending before the election.

I think if they buid a new one it has to be downtown. Why not "lake Pender" as they call the area that looks like a lake behing the "Internation" Village. That thing has been a totally catastrophy from day one. Only 32% of thge area retail is rented and that is declining. It was ill thought out. Its right beside GMPlace and SkyTrain and would give Pender a desperate breath of fresh air and would connect Chinatown with Downtown.
Either that or expand and put a new roof on the Mushroom.

The artificial hole which became a giant lake caused by rain next to GM Place is a construction zone. they drained it out months ago to make way for condos and the new underground Costco.

Expanding BC Place and putting on a new roof is much more realistic. i don't see how they could put in more seats into that place though. if there were new improvements, i hope they could renovate the stadium floor so it could also accommodate a internatoinal sized running track when you remove seats.

honestly this is a no-win situation.


building a new stadium near the old train yards would be almost perfect, but if you're gonna do it you have to do it right - for the whitecaps AND the BC lions. But then you need capacity of at least 40,000 and Greg Kerfoot isn't going to foot the bill for that. For him 15 thousand is perfectly fine and acceptable.

BC place's main problem isn't just it's roof. Yes, realistically speaking, perhaps putting in much better turf and remodeling it to give it a retractable roof would be the perfect solution.

The problem still remains is it's location. What's wrong with it? It's much better suited for something else. It is PRIME downtown land that really should be used for skyscrapers not a stadium. Where it is right now it's wasting valuable space in downtown. The stadium should be more towards east end - near the train yards where the land is not as valuable.




But we can all dream of what would be BEST. My dream is that BC place is demolished and a new state of the art stadium is constructed in that train yard location that has a retractable roof, and can seat 50 thousand.


REALISTICALLY? what's going to happen is BC place WILL get a new pitch, and a new stadium WILL Be built somewhere but it'll be only 10-15 thousand strong and NOT in a prime downtown location

you'd demolish a stadium for condos? are you mad?

you'd demolish a stadium for condos? are you mad?
i think he is saying this assuming that the new stadium will be built to acomadate the Whitecaps and the Lions, so it would probally have aproximalty the same seating capacity of BC Place

Hey everyone! New here but I've enjoyed reading this forum for many months. I love the fact that this city is once again discussing stadia and what we're going to do about it.

I like any option that will be offered. I'm all for popping that dome and put in some sort of retractable roof similar to what has been mentioned before by mr x. The technology is there to do it as we've seen with Wimbledon's refurb. Or perhaps a partial sliding roof that only covers the stands similar to new Wembley. Or just a stationary roof that covers stands like Olympic Stadium Berlin. And remember that stadium has been around since 1936 and they just finished putting roof on it for the first time. These are all possibilities. I'll be pessimistic and say obviously that nothing will be done in time for the Olympics and perhaps not after. I think most people in are agreement that something needs to be done about it eventually.

I would also love a new stadium for football/cfl football/rugby etc. But it would definitely have to be something that has close to 40-50k seats or there is no point. And where to put it? The Flats is the obvious choice and to put it anywhere else is questionable. I like the idea of a waterfront/port area stadium if they could do it. It would be a great setting similar to San Fran's ballpark.

you'd demolish a stadium for condos? are you mad?

first it would be with the assumption that a new whitecaps/lions stadium is being built as well.


and no not for condos - for highrises. Commercial Office AND residential.

here was Bing Thom's proposal of a 845,000 joint convention centre facility under, at, and around BC Place Stadium in the early 90s.

http://img87.echo.cx/img87/4774/126aq.jpg


DOWNTOWN CONVENTION CENTRE AT BC PLACE STADIUM

Convention centres tend to be large internally oriented boxes that are detrimental to the urban fabric as they encourage very little street life. The proposal for the Downtown Place Convention Centre takes a different approach: to realize Vancouver's dream of Georgia Street as a grand boulevard.

From the Skytrain station, wide tree-lined walkways and a series of terraced gardens descending to the waterfront revitalize an important yet underused site. Our proposed solution to the traditional problem of a convention center is to bury the box on the cliff edge of a peninsula. The roof of this "buried box" would then be transformed into a vibrant open space, a "Tivoli Gardens", both day and night, that hosts a multitude of events and exhibits and surrounded by pavilions of shops and cafes. A magnificent "glass lantern" marks the entry at street level to the 845,000 sq. ft. convention center, which acts as a fulcrum to join otherwise adjacent and disparate facilities, such as the 2500-seat Queen Elizabeth Theatre, a 60,000-seat domed stadium and a 21,000 capacity hockey arena. These all in turn act as expansion spaces for the new centre.

The site's north end is to have 646,000 sq. ft. of commercial and residential development, and will offer places of quiet retreat for residents, workers and visitors in a classical urban park setting. The heritage Beatty Street Drill Hall in the middle of the site is to be restored to its original brick clad state, while the south end of the site will be framed by a 1250-room hotel and 345,000 sq. ft. of commercial and residential development. The Downtown Place Convention Centre proposal hence redevelops and expands the excitement of Vancouver's downtown.


personally, i much rather prefer the BC Place proposal. It was a big mistake of the government and the city imo.

Interesting points to note that BC Place would have been fully renovated and they were planning to dig up the stadium floor to put in convention halls and then cover it up.

This plan would have provided 845,000 sq. feet of convention space and the development size of the project would be 2.75 million sq. feet costing $600 million. As suppose to the waterfront plan that would cost $565 million providing 550,000 sq. feet of space and a development size of 1.4 million sq. feet.

honestly this is a no-win situation.


building a new stadium near the old train yards would be almost perfect, but if you're gonna do it you have to do it right - for the whitecaps AND the BC lions. But then you need capacity of at least 40,000 and Greg Kerfoot isn't going to foot the bill for that. For him 15 thousand is perfectly fine and acceptable.

BC place's main problem isn't just it's roof. Yes, realistically speaking, perhaps putting in much better turf and remodeling it to give it a retractable roof would be the perfect solution.

The problem still remains is it's location. What's wrong with it? It's much better suited for something else. It is PRIME downtown land that really should be used for skyscrapers not a stadium. Where it is right now it's wasting valuable space in downtown. The stadium should be more towards east end - near the train yards where the land is not as valuable.




But we can all dream of what would be BEST. My dream is that BC place is demolished and a new state of the art stadium is constructed in that train yard location that has a retractable roof, and can seat 50 thousand.
Which train yard are you talking about here? The one next to Pacific Central Station? That's too far away. I think the whole idea is to put it someplace that's within walking distance to the downtown core, and BC Place is filling that role quite well.

Would we just want to put yet more highrises where BC Place stands now? Wouldn't a stadium or any other structure that stands out from its surroundings give the area a little more variety and look better scenically than just a concrete jungle of endless highrises?

i personally really like where bc place is. it may look out-dated but i really do like it..

BC Place is a landmark building an shouldnt be torn down. Its hosted the opening of expo and will host the opening of the 2010 Olympic Games its a very important part of BC's history. I think it could do with a large scale renovation.

i too really like the location and the stadium. its not often these days that you see a downtown stadium which is something quite special and is a good thing. lets not push it out of downtown like how everyone else is doing it because their downtown is already developed and has no space for a stadium. other cities want to build their stadiums in downtown.

alright i guess i can see the alternative point...


fine ;)


in that case just upgrade the roof :D