There has been some justifiable criticism on these threads of the number of times the phrase 'world class' is used to glamourise the most run of the mill developments.

So lets forget about the world class public toilets, litter bins and bus shelters and concentrate on what in this city and region is really 'world class'. By that I don't mean necessarily the best in the world but those things that bear comparison to the best that the world has to offer. It might be a modern building, a cultural event, something from the city's history etc. My own suggestions are as follows:

1) The Beatles

Liverpool's tourist industry may go on about the Fab Four ad nauseum but how many other figures from popular culture have had so much impact on the entire world?

2) Liverpool Anglican Cathedral

The largest Anglican Cathedral in the world and the seventh largest of any denomination.

3) The Queensway Tunnel

Longest road tunnel in the world when built, still the longest in Britain and one of the largest underwater tunnels in the world, conceived on a heroic scale with marvellous art deco architecture.

4) The Grand National

Most famous steeplechase in the world, watched every year by hundreds of millions.

5) The Mersey Docks

In their heyday, the nine miles of docks along the Liverpool waterfront were one of the greatest sights in world shipping.

6) The Liver Bird

Other cities have mythical beasts as symbols but the Liver Bird is unique to Liverpool and its perch 300' above the city must make it one of the most famous civic symbols anywhere.

7) The Liverpool and Manchester Railway

By no means the first ever railway but the L&MR marked the beginning of the modern passenger railway which was to conquer the world.

8) The Williamson Tunnels

Virtually forgotten for ages but now recognised as one of the most extensive and magnificent underground follies to be found anywhere. Maybe not as famous as the Paris catacombs but they are still finding more and more of them.

9) The Mersey Ferries

A Sunday Times poll a few years ago listed these as the seventh most famous ferries in the world. When you consider that the competition included New York's Staten Island Ferry, Hong Kong's Star Ferry and the Sydney Harbour Ferry you realise that they are a world class attraction.

10) The New Brighton Tower

Sadly no longer with us but this tower would have been second only to the Eiffel Tower in Paris in terms of height. New York had nothing to compare at the time.

11) The Northern Airport Terminal

Probably the greatest survival from the early days of aviation. This magnificent terminal built in the Art Deco style has no rival in Britain and only Berlin's Templehof matches if for size and spendour in Europe.

12) St Georges Hall

One of the finest public buildings in the world, a one hit wonder for Harvey Lonsdale Elmes its 24 year old architect.

13) Oriel Chambers

and

14) 16 Cook Street

These buildings by architect Peter Ellis were completely revolutionary when built and are suspected to have influenced the early Chicago skyscrapers.

That's all I can think of at the moment, any more suggestions or comments on my list?

Great thread and list Martin.
Let's get this thread up and running with a few pics and posts. I'm off to bed soon, but I'll dig out a few pics in the morning.
Here's one for tonight. - Ref 11)
http://www.**************************/archive/speke001.jpg

I would add to that excellent list the Albert Dock, opened in 1846

Cream - It defined a generation

13) Oriel Chambers and 14) 16 Cook Street
These buildings by architect Peter Ellis were completely revolutionary when built and are suspected to have influenced the early Chicago skyscrapers.

And the word "skyscraper" it's self comes from the sail above the tops'l found on Liverpool clipper ships namely the "skys'l". It was said that when the ship was rolling, "it was scraping the sky".

The Open 2006 at Royal Liverpool (Hoylake).

Magnificent dock system, let's hope they fill in no more.

How many cities have a waterfront promenade to stroll along? otterspool.

Neolithic relics at Calderstones park,

Not just the Royal, Waterfront, but golf in general.

Wasn't the Liver building the 1st skyscraper in Britain?

I've heard that the Queensway tunnel is the largest diameter underwater tunnel in the world.

scousers - the people of liverpool

The liver buildings - one of Britain’s first multi-storey reinforced concrete framed buildings.

more info here (http://scouseology.com/viewtopic.php?t=227)

Runcorn Bridge...

Thank you Martin, excellent thread. I have some additions and ammendments to your posting.

1) Liver building- tallest building in Europe when it was built- Europe's first skyscraper.

2) Anglican cathedral- biggest in Europe, 5th (not 7th) largest in the world.

3) One of the few cities in the world to have two significant cathedrals.

4) First electrified over-head railway in the world- and the 3rd over-head railway in the world after New York and Chicago.

5) Most (2500?) listed buildings outside of London.

Good shout on the Runcorn Bridge Accy, if we can count it as Liverpool.

Whilst Runcorn is offically Cheshire territory I grew up there and have a scouse accent. The reason being that most people there were either born in/from, or have parents from Liverpool. Sociologically speaking it should be a suburb of Liverpool- therefore the Runcorn bridge (or Mersey crossing) should be counted as Liverpool. Besides, it wouldn't have been built in the firsy place had it not been for the Mersey/Liverpool bay area.

So yeah, another thing that makes Liverpool world class. I don't know about now, but when the Runcorn bridge was built it was one of the longest single span bridges in the world and one of the longest arch-span bridges in the world. Not sure where it stands now. It's the same design but longer and bigger than the Tyne bridge (-the icon of Newcastle.)

Click here (http://www.scouseology.com/viewforum.php?f=22) - for a comprehensive archive of what makes Liverpool, its Buildings, Merseyside and Scousers World Famous. Includes Liverpool Firsts :)

2 Pages worth!

Add to that list, Liverpool Museum, or as is to be known now "Liverpool World Museum. It was reviewed on the arts section of Newsnight last night after a 30 million re-vamp and extension . The consensus was that Liverpool now has a world class museum. A great addition to the city's cultural attractions.

Thanks Kev. That Scouseology website is superb! I've made it one of my favourites :)

Add to that list, Liverpool Museum, or as is to be known now "Liverpool World Museum. It was reviewed on the arts section of Newsnight last night after a 30 million re-vamp and extension . The consensus was that Liverpool now has a world class museum. A great addition to the city's cultural attractions.Watched Newsnight Review also, and all the guests on the show, who all visited the Museum seemed impressed, and not a bad word spoken. :cheers:

They visited under the impression they were visiting Anfield and it's museum only, with the visit to the World Museum revealed to them. The word "World" isn't to imply best in the world or anything like that, it is to represent the collections from around the world, and they are only currently showing about 20% due to the vastness off the collection.

Good shout on the Runcorn Bridge Accy, if we can count it as Liverpool.
Anyone who thinks Runcorn isnt part of the Liverpool area needs their head fixing. Its more scouse than Southport or the Wirral.

Click here (http://www.scouseology.com/viewforum.php?f=22) - for a comprehensive archive of what makes Liverpool, its Buildings, Merseyside and Scousers World Famous. Includes Liverpool Firsts :)

2 Pages worth!

Cheers Kev. Some interesting stuff on there.

It's like a mini encyclopaedia.

Stanley Dock - The largest brick building in the world (and its fucking amazing)

I'm from Manchester (although now living in London) and I don't know Liverpool that well, but I do love the row of grand buildings from the Walker Gallery, the Museum down and round to the town hall (I think). From what I remember they're in a horrible location by several main roads, but they have a sense of monumental pride that's the equal of most of the grand buildings in London, yet have very few peers outside the capital.

I've never really seen the reason for the fuss around the pier head though. Several nice Edwardian office blocks in a luckily iconic location. The do say Liverpool to all who see them, but they're not world class in my opinion.

I'm from Manchester (although now living in London) and I don't know Liverpool that well, but I do love the row of grand buildings from the Walker Gallery, the Museum down and round to the town hall (I think). From what I remember they're in a horrible location by several main roads, but they have a sense of monumental pride that's the equal of most of the grand buildings in London, yet have very few peers outside the capital.

I've never really seen the reason for the fuss around the pier head though. Several nice Edwardian office blocks in a luckily iconic location. The do say Liverpool to all who see them, but they're not world class in my opinion.

If you want to know what all the fuss is about, and view the finest collection of photos of the downtown area go to www.************************** , and marvel at the handywork of Scouserdave. :)
Maybe then you will acknowledge that the waterfront 3G are worldclass( ugh-not that word again)

world class bus station :puke:

Did anyone see Newsnight Review on Friday? They had a discussion on the World Museum, Liverpool (formerly the Liverpool Museum), which is set to open to the public on April 29th. All three of the contributors were unanimous in their praise for the place and the discussion ended with them describing it as a 'world class' museum.

Some interesting suggestions above. I would stop short of calling the Walker Art Gallery a 'world class' gallery as it isn't in the same league as say the Louvre or the Hermitage in St Petersburg but it certainly is one of Britain's best.

The Liver Building is on a par with some of the early New York or Chicago skyscrapers and was, so I believe, the tallest office building in Europe for many years and it pioneered large scale reinforced concrete construction so I think it justifies the title 'world class'.

I'm not a great football fan but as Liverpool Football Club have been European Champions and have beaten most of Europe's major clubs at some time, they must rank as world class. So as not to offend Woody and the rest, I would also have to mention that Everton has achieved top flight football for over a hundred years - longer than any other team?

I wouldn't class the Runcorn Bridge as world class. It's a very attractive structure and is a purer form of the steel arch than the more famous Sydney Harbour Bridge (which has artificial abutments to make it look stronger) and is much greater span than the Tyne Bridge. However, the steel arch was on its way out as a structural form for major bridges when Runcorn was built and the bridge was therefore something of an anachronism (it was the last major structure to use riveted construction), if a very impressive one.

More modern bridges such as the Forth, Severn and Humber (which was the longest span bridge in the world when built) are more likely to deserve being called world class.

I think the warehouses do deserve a mention, especially Albert Dock (largest collection of Grade 1 listed buildings in Britain) and Stanley Dock (reputed to be the largest brick building in the world).

.

. So as not to offend Woody and the rest, I would also have to mention that Everton has achieved top flight football for over a hundred years - longer than any other team?).

Cheers Martin ,

I would stop short of calling the Walker Art Gallery a 'world class' gallery as it isn't in the same league as say the Louvre or the Hermitage in St Petersburg but it certainly is one of Britain's best.

But the Walker is on a par with the likes of Prague, Budapest, Amsterdam, Stokholm, Oslo, Lisbon and Vienna and superior to Helsinki, Copenhagen, Belgrade, Athens, Brussels, Kiev, Toronto, Montreal, Sydney, Auckland and most US, African, South American, Asian and Middle Eastern cities. After the Louvre, Prado etc., the Walker has one of the best pre Raphaelite collctions in Europe.

The Royal Liverpool Philharmonic Orchestra is so good that it competes with the likes of Moscow, Berlin, Milan, New York, etc., for it's musical directors. In the recent passed, Libor Pisek was courted by Philadelphia, Toronto, St. Petersburg and Rome but he chose to stay with the RLPO saying; "I am already the conductor of two of the worlds great orchestras [Prague & Liverpool] so what have I got to prove by moving?".

Liverpool, by anyones standards, has some world class components and is probably the most interesting city outside the capital. Well you only have to realize that, due to thier importance, Liverpool's museums and galleries are designated "National" a distinction that no other city, outside of the four UK capitals, can claim.

If you want to know what all the fuss is about, and view the finest collection of photos of the downtown area go to www.************************** , and marvel at the handywork of Scouserdave. :)
Maybe then you will acknowledge that the waterfront 3G are worldclass( ugh-not that word again)

I just don't think they're very interesting. I did look through the photos and while they're attractive enough for turn of the century office blocks I still think they're overhyped. I guess I find Liverpool's slave money architecture a lot more interesting than it's industrial port stuff. The city does have a lot to commend it and I do have a soft spot for it.

Liverpool: I do have a soft spot for it.

Like the business end of a dumdum bullet? :)

I guess I find Liverpool's slave money architecture a lot more interesting than it's industrial port stuff
Hi Che,
which "Liverpool's slave money architecture" are you referring to? I may have a few piccies.

Hi Che,
which "Liverpool's slave money architecture" are you referring to? I may have a few piccies.

I'm not quite sure really. I haven't been to Liverpool for a good few years. I just think that the Late Georgian and neo-classical architecture works better there than the Late Victorian/Edwardian, which seems to me to be unsuited to the scale Port cities need. Having said that I don't hate the Pier Head, I just think it's a bit unimpressive.

(I don't know why I always get termed Che, when quite clearly my username refers to everyone's favourite plasticised pop warbbler)

Did anyone see Newsnight Review on Friday? They had a discussion on the World Museum, Liverpool (formerly the Liverpool Museum), which is set to open to the public on April 29th. All three of the contributors were unanimous in their praise for the place and the discussion ended with them describing it as a 'world class' museum.

Just had a root around and you can actually see Newsnight Review on the web here:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/programmes/newsnight/review/default.stm

Just click the 'VIDEO' button in the top right of the page.

The Liverpool segment starts at about 7 minutes 40.

Got to say, I'm very excited about this museum reopening, and yes, all the Newsnight contributors clearly loved it.

I'm not quite sure really
Thought not :cheers:

Cher, at the time Liverpool wasn't just a port, it was one of the worlds major commercial cities with banking and insurance companies here with global reputations that threatened to rival London. They would've been unsuited to oversize milltowns and basic ports, yes, but Liverpool was neither.

I feel the need to clarify. I don't think the the pier head is too grand for Liverpool, rather not grand enough. I can see why people would become attached to it, but as architecture I just find it unispiring. It isn't a reflection on the city. The classical civic buildings and the Anglican Cathederal are world class*. I just wonder if your affection for the Liver et al leads to an obsession with the pier head (the need for an iconic fourth grace being a case in point), at the expense of better buildings which might present a better impression of the city. I don't doubt that the dock area has the potential to be a world class view/location, I just don't think it's got there yet.

*In my opinion based on my personal view that world class is that which is beautiful, unique, and imediately places you at a location.

I feel the need to clarify. I don't think the the pier head is too grand for Liverpool, rather not grand enough. I can see why people would become attached to it, but as architecture I just find it unispiring. It isn't a reflection on the city. The classical civic buildings and the Anglican Cathederal are world class*. I just wonder if your affection for the Liver et al leads to an obsession with the pier head (the need for an iconic fourth grace being a case in point), at the expense of better buildings which might present a better impression of the city. I don't doubt that the dock area has the potential to be a world class view/location, I just don't think it's got there yet.

*In my opinion based on my personal view that world class is that which is beautiful, unique, and imediately places you at a location.

Which "classical civic buildings" are you referring to? I may have a few piccies.

Which "classical civic buildings" are you referring to? I may have a few piccies.

Well unless I've completely imagined it there's a row of them with the Walker, the Museum and the library, that I remember as being very impressive.

Well unless I've completely imagined it there's a row of them with the Walker, the Museum and the library, that I remember as being very impressive.

No, you're not imagining it, the street is known as William Brown Street and it is surely one of the finest rises in Europe. As for your comment about Liverpool's Pier Head, the only way you could not know you were in Liverpool is if you were approaching Shanghai's Bund from the Po River and you had a skinful of Caine's bitter.

I guess I find Liverpool's slave money architecture a lot more interesting than it's industrial port stuff

Well unless I've completely imagined it there's a row of them with the Walker, the Museum and the library, that I remember as being very impressive.

Still can't recall any of "Liverpool's slave money architecture" eh Cherghttp://skyscrapercity.com/images/icons/icon5.gif

F**k me your up early dave u s**t the bed. :fart:

F**k me your up early dave u s**t the bed. :fart:
Don't be so crude Begsy lad. I soiled the bed.

:hahaha: Nothing like a bit of scouse wit after a shite day at work.

:hahano:

Hey Accura, I see you're having a teen-age strop day. What's the matter grease ball, did you have a hard day at school? :)

????

Teacher bummed him. He's in shock. Poor lad...

Just had a root around and you can actually see Newsnight Review on the web here:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/programmes/newsnight/review/default.stm

Just click the 'VIDEO' button in the top right of the page.

The Liverpool segment starts at about 7 minutes 40.

Got to say, I'm very excited about this museum reopening, and yes, all the Newsnight contributors clearly loved it.

Cheers Damon, it really gets the thumbs up doesn't it. :)

Still can't recall any of "Liverpool's slave money architecture" eh Cherghttp://skyscrapercity.com/images/icons/icon5.gif

Oh everthing in this country built before the previous century is result of exploiting someone's hard work. The whole of Lancashire's cotton import/export economy was built on slavery, in one way or another. Hence 'slave money'.

At least Liverpool is Bristol. They invented it.

Very little of Liverpool's central architecture dates from the the period when Liverpool earned money from the slave trade. It is a not-infrequently made mistake by ignorant outsiders that Liverpool's grand architectural heritage was paid for the slavery.

The slave trade was abolished in the British Empire in 1807. I can think of only one of Liverpool's main civic or commercial buildings (the Town Hall) that is old enough to have been built by then and only three significant buildings including that one in the whole City Centre that dates from the pre-abolition period.

St George's Hall, the commerical buildings of Castle, Dale and Tithebarn Street, the Pier Head buildings, the Albert Dock, the Anglican Cathedral - all are post abolition.

A few of the old warehouses, on the fringes of the city in the Ropewalks and Baltic Triangle might qualify and a fraction of the old Georgian residential stock perhaps, although most of this is c.1830 or later. Otherwise, there isn't much of slave trade era Liverpool in existence in the centre of town.

Liverpool's greatest period of growth and prosperity occurred in the century after the slave trade's abolition and the city's grandest architecture reflects this, later period.

9) The Mersey Ferries

A Sunday Times poll a few years ago listed these as the seventh most famous ferries in the world. When you consider that the competition included New York's Staten Island Ferry, Hong Kong's Star Ferry and the Sydney Harbour Ferry you realise that they are a world class attraction.

Is a ferry on the Mersey not the longest regular (continuous) ferry service in the world started approx 1150 ish?

Something else that most Scousers are unaware of is that the HSBC (Hong Kong & Shanghai Bank) got it's start in Liverpool. HSBC is part of the "Swire Group" along with Cathy Pacific Airlines, among others, and was founded in Liverpool in 1816 by John Swire, who was a sometime partner of Alfred and John Holt. Some of the companies founded in Liverpool read like a whose-who of the Fortune 500 companies.

Sloyne, that's a very interesting piece of info I'll have to find out a bit more on the Swire group, thanks.

Try looking at:
http://www.swire.com/
You will find that this is a very big multi-national conglomerate with tentacles in almost everything, including Coca~Cola.
I believe that some of the Swire family still reside in Liverpool. The Mosley Hill area, I think.

Very interesting history of the company, and good to see credit givent to the founder and Liverpool on the front of the main page. :)

Try looking at:
http://www.swire.com/
You will find that this is a very big multi-national conglomerate with tentacles in almost everything, including Coca~Cola.
I believe that some of the Swire family still reside in Liverpool. The Mosley Hill area, I think.

Fascinating site. :cheers:

Here's a site relevant to this thread,

It's all about the buildings in the World heritage site. Has a bit of info on each building, but would be a excellent site if it had accompanying pictures.

Click here (http://www.liverpoolworldheritage.com/index.asp)

Brilliant site, tells you all you want to know about many buildings.