EDIT: I should be more specific that this is about the BC politics.

Here is my last attempt to sway those crazy NDP supporters ;). Feel free to respond. I hope most facts are right, they are from the Liberal website, the news, and a 1990s BC politics book (Barbarians in the Garden City, it is a good read).

I got on a rant, it is late, I am tired, but I am done. The grammer and order are probably wierd and there aren't many colourful adjectives but oh well.


I find the NDP’s campaign disgusting. The NDP pray on the good nature of people in there ads and claims by exploiting stories of rare, unfortunate circumstances. The BC Liberals do what is best for everyone. The NDP claim the BC Liberals are a one-sided government. It is true that the Liberals support business, but that is good for everyone. Businesses allow people to work and feed their families. Something the NDP successfully campaigned against in the 1990s. The NDP are obviously the more one-sided government. Carole James received more than half of her leadership campaign money from unions. About one third of the NDP candidates are union leaders or activists. Over 105 unions have registered as third-party advertisers – all of them running aggressive political attack campaigns on behalf of the NDP. In contrast, only 7 business associations signed up. The BCGEU handpicked Carole James to be the NDP leader in 2003.

The current NDP president is a BCGEU organizer. The BCTF, the BCGEU, the BC Federation of Labour, and the HEU are running multi-million dollar campaigns to get the NDP back in power. The BCTF is spending $5 million on this election campaign – 25 per cent more than a political party is allowed to spend. An NDP MLA has recently been caught advertising in the schoolyard: she said she will continue to campaign at elementary schools regardless of what parents think. Carole James has admitted on CFAX Radio that she endorses using public school resources for partisan political fundraising. The advertising in schools and the extra spending by unions are illegal according to Election BC.

Here is a quote from when the NDP were passing a bill for their union friends: “It's a bill that's needed by the unions. I'm happy to be part of the government that is bringing in this bill.” It is extremely obvious that the NDP will be one-sided when they decide where your tax dollars go. In fact, current NDP member Harry Lali explained it quite well when he said, “We know what side we're on…Yes, we're on the side of organized labour.” All the pro-union action taken actually caused a drop in output per person, A.K.A. productivity.

The BC Federation of Labour, CUPE, HEU, and the CAW all have a privileged “affiliate” status with the NDP; even though Carole James promised that the NDP would separate its ties with organized labour. And Carol James is claiming Gordon Campbell isn’t keeping promises? The Liberals have kept more than 90% of their promises, a record far better than the NDP’s.

What has to be understood is that the NDP lied for ten years about how much damage they had done to BC’s finances and that the Liberals were making their promises based on the NDP false information. When the Liberals got into power, they had to make tough decisions to balance out the books such as leasing BC Rail.

The NDP are actually against balancing the budget every year. Here is a quote from a former NDP member: “Putting forward balanced-budget legislation suggestions is not only shameful, it is disgraceful.” He was referring to the Liberals legislation that budgets have to be balanced from now on so no party would ever double the debt like the NDP did in the 1990s.

Leasing the operation of BC Rail for 60 years was a promise that was broken for the good of the province. The previous set up wasn’t working and the lease means that there will be lower rates, a billion dollars of investment to the benefit of the taxpayers, faster shipping, 700 new railcars, the BC Rail debt of $500 millions was paid off saving $30 million per year in interest, $200 million dollars went to other transportation investment, and $135 million went towards developing the north. The NDP would have missed out on this key investment. A current NDP MLA is quoted saying “I don’t care whether it’s an American company that is going to buy a third of BC Hydro or if a Chinese corporation wanted to buy the land in Northern BC, what’s BC should stay BC.” It is obvious that the NDP don’t understand how many billions of dollars foreign investment has brought into the province. Another smart move made by the Liberals is the privatization of the cleaning of hospitals. It is cheaper, quicker, and won’t go over budget. The cleanliness of the hospitals has actually gone up in the Fraser Health Authority ratings. A fact that the NDP continue to ignore.

The NDP claim that Gordon Campbell isn’t listening. He made a citizen’s assembly to create a new voting system and is letting the public vote on it. He set up a government website called “Waste Buster” where anyone can report ways that the government is wasting money. He is also making a congress so teachers can report directly to the premier. This is further proof that Gordon Campbell is the best person to lead the province.

The NDP made countless mistakes when they were in power. Putting unions ahead of patients and students caused more than 4 million workdays to be lost to strikes. The Liberals support essential service protection for patients and students. The NDP rather use students as political bargaining chips.

The NDP 1991 platform claimed “We will not spend more than British Columbians can afford.” Yet they made 8 straight deficit budgets. More NDP lies. On two occasions, the NDP told the public that they had balanced the budget – the main responsibility of government. On both of these occasions they lied. These are known as the infamous “fudge-it budget” scandals. NDP Premier Glen Clark used his authority to trade a casino licence to his neighbour for a porch on his house in the infamous Casinogate scandal. Current NDP MLA said “I have no concern that the Premier has broken the law.” The NDP stole about $2 million from charities in Nanaimo. They promised to pay it all back. They only paid back $140,000 but Carole James claims otherwise. Another NDP broken promise. Current NDP member Corky Evans summarized the dwindling days of the NDP quite well in this quote: “In our hysteria to deal with the recession we tried to bribe capital into saving us – but it didn’t work. It didn’t work with aluminium smelters. It didn’t work with the jobs and timber accord. It didn’t work with the fast ferries that we thought we could sell to the world. It didn’t work with the amusement park on Burns Bog. It didn’t work with the trade and convention centre in Vancouver. It hasn’t turned a single wheel yet.”

The NDP claim that the Liberals doubled gambling. When the NDP were in power, they tried forcing casinos into the cities of Surrey and Vancouver for the NDP’s personal gain.

From 1995-2001, under the NDP, there were 4 premier changes and 109 cabinet changes. The NDP were – and are – an unreliable government. They haven’t learned their lesson from the Fast Ferry Fiasco. They want to try building ferries in BC again, ignoring the free-market process - even after they went $463 million over budget last time. This half billion dollar venture isn’t outlined in their platform. How will it be paid for considering they also say they won’t raise taxes? If the NDP are elected we will be looking at another Fudge-it Budget fiasco.

The fact that the NDP claim they won’t raise taxes is laughable. They made the exact same claim in the 1990s – just before they raised taxes by $2 billion. They also say that they will improve healthcare and education. But how? If they aren’t going to raise taxes, where will the money be cut from? By “improving healthcare” will they be moving money from services into unions. No doubt. The NDP platform also says nothing about opening new hospitals.

All the NDP do is attack. Here are recent comments by NDP members, mostly from the past few weeks: The Liberals are "Parasites who must hate their grandchildren”, "Home-wreckers", and "I doubt Christ would be a Republican or Liberal.” An NDP MLA claimed Liberal Sindi Hawkins was playing the sympathy card, just because she has been successfully battling leukemia for the past year. Current NDP MLA, Harry Lali, even made this atrocious remark: “Being an Indo-Canadian, Patty Sahota has completely abrogated her responsibility to her race.”

The NDP also have absolutely no plan for the future. The word Campbell appears 154 times in their platform but the year 2006 appears only once. 2007 appears once also. And the year 2008 doesn’t appear at all in their 64 page platform. Most of the plan only talks about the first 9 months to a year. There is also not plan for: combating crime, the softwood lumber dispute, nurse training, doctor training, school safety, healthy schools, the pine beetle infestation, and Pharmacare. There is also no plan for economic growth or job creation, mining, oil, gas, forest revitalization, technology, transportation projects, and regional infrastructure.

Even a local (by local, GVRD) NDP MLA, Karen Rockwell, doesn’t support Carole James as her leader, how can you?

With everything doing so well, it seems almost sadistic that someone would want to change governments right now. Especially to the NDP. But then again, the NDP are against positive change such as the Olympics, paying off debt, the RAV line, tax relief, and the law that restored workers’ democratic right to a secret ballot so they weren’t bullied into unions.

It is still the same old NDP. The party currently consists of 19 Union Representatives, 17 Failed Provincial Candidates, 10 Former NDP MLAs, 8 Failed Federal NDP Candidates, 8 BCTF NDP Candidates, 6 Union Activists, 6 Former NDP Cabinet Ministers, 6 Former NDP political staffers, 3 opposed to Balanced Budget Legislation, 3 Casinogate Characters, 2 Former NDP Ministers of Health, 2 Former NDP Chiefs of Staff, 2 NDP Provincial Congress Members, 2 NDP Candidates forced off the slate by Scandal, 1 former President of the NDP, 1 Former NDP Minister responsible for Gaming, and 1 guy who wrote the fake “memo to file” in Casinogate Scandal. While talking about the previous NDP government, Carole James said “I look forward to those days again.”

But do you?




I didn't cover everything but I droned on long enough. I also have a defence of the minimum wage.

As someone who truly abhors everything the quazi-communist NDP stands for, I'd rather people voted for them than the current Liberals.

But as for the NDP being 'fair' .... there's a joke. Here's something to think about if you really think the NDP doesn't play the back scratching game:
In 1997 Southern Manitoba was severely flooded. Since then we have been waiting for work to begin on expanded flood control measures. In particular the Red River Floodway is to be expanded. The floodway is basically a giant ditch going around Winnipeg on the East. A man-made river essentially meant to divert springtime flood waters and save the city from damage.

Anyway, the NDP got it into it's head that any company that wanted to do the work would have to be a unionized one. So what they said was that , if you aren't unionized, hey no problem, we'll just get a union to cover you. Okay, for starters that doesn't really make much sense since it guarantees higher costs but that wasn't the best part. The NDP claims that the reason they are doing this is so that there will be no work stopages during construction. Well, anybody who knows anything knows that you don't get work stopages when no unions are involved. Non-unionized people don't strike and it's that simple. But never mind that. When the companies that wanted to bid on this massive project said this to the government, the NDP's response was "well, tell you what....how about this: We'll get a union in there to negotiate a deal. All your workers will pay union dues but won't actually be a part of the union."
What ?

That's right : The NDP is forcing workers to pay union dues to unions the workers aren't in. And these unions obviously aren't going to represent any of the workers because, well afterall, they aren't part of the union .

So the end result is that workers will pay union dues to unions that won't represent them so that the unions can negotiate a deal to keep workers from going on strike. However, there would be no strikes if there was no union involved.

Now, first person to figure out who donates the most to the NDP party coffers gets a cookie.

^Unions!


The craziness. I was in Winnipeg during that flood.


If I was being forced into paying union dues, I would take them to court. Although it would cost me more, it is the principle that matters.

So why would you "rather people voted for them than the current Liberals." ?

As someone who truly abhors everything the quazi-communist NDP stands for, I'd rather people voted for them than the current Liberals.

Do you mean the federal liberal party? The BC Liberal party is not even affilated with them, lol.

@ touraccuracy, :applause: *take a bow* May BC finally enter its Golden Decade! :banana:

Do you mean the federal liberal party? The BC Liberal party is even affilated with them, lol.

@ touraccuracy, :applause: *take a bow* May BC finally enter its Golden Decade! :banana:
Federally yes. Provincially it would prove to be the ruin of BC (again) to vote for the NDP. Manitoba was finally digging itself out from the pit the NDP dug for us in the eighties under the Conservatives in the nineties. However, too many people were wooed by the promise of "a chicken in every garage and a car in every pot" because they blamed the Conservative government for all the cost cutting of the nineties. On closer examination though it looks like this:
-Whatever cuts were made to the provincial budget were made to get this province out of the red the NDP put us in
-All the headway the former Conservative government had made is now pretty much being undone by the NDP again. In other words, in ten years I expect to see us right back to where we started assuming we boot these goose-stepping anti-capitalists out of the legislature.

I give the current incarnation of the NDP some credit this time for not TOTALLY spending us into oblivion. I might even be induced to believe that they have mended their tax and spend ways enough to make them appear moderate. But they still have the same old anti-business approach they've always had and are so lodged in bed with the unions that I expect a provincial contest will soon be launched to determine the names of the children of this unholy union. Either way, I foresee in the next few years a major drop in investment in this province thanks to the NDP and then the fun begins anew.

DON'T FOLLOW OUR LEAD B.C. !

^Unions!


The craziness. I was in Winnipeg during that flood.


If I was being forced into paying union dues, I would take them to court. Although it would cost me more, it is the principle that matters.

So why would you "rather people voted for them than the current Liberals." ?
Speaking federally of course (not provincially for BC) it's a matter of choosing idiots over thieves. If there were no Conservatives I'd vote for the NDP long before I'd vote for this gang of ne'er do wells we currently have occupying the big seat in Ottawa.

An idiot might shortchange you but a thief will do it again if you let him.

The Lierals (I forgot the b, but let's just leave it as is :)) have caused enough problems.

Ontario's been through an NDP government too. It isn't very fun. But I'm thinking it would probably be better than what we have now.

THis country needs new political parties... well, they'd still have the same corrup politicians... This country needs new politicians. Ones that aren't corrupt...

My hopes are too high...

Well why dont we start our own political party. Hell we can toss in money for fun and suince we are a political party the government mustt fund us based on our votes.

Well why dont we start our own political party. Hell we can toss in money for fun and suince we are a political party the government mustt fund us based on our votes.

Well, we need people in 72 ridings. (I think it's 72.. Or was it 54?) to get official federal status. And we need to figure out a policy. Who will be our leader?

Too bad Stronach and MacKay won't be having kids now :P they'd be perfect! WEll, we'd have to seperate it from the parants, so as not to contaminate it with stupidity, but it would have been perfect!

I'm no big fan of the NDP and I voted Green BUT Campbell is an arrogant pig. The Liberals did turn around the economy and got rid of much of the absurd NDP redtape but they also greatly benefitted from circumstance ie high commodity prices.
BC is still a recourse economy and high commodity prices means tons of cash for the treasury.
The famous tax cuts??..it depended on what side of the income bracket you are on.
My mom and dad are retired with a decent pensions but after the tax cuts they are WORSE off by $400/year because the Liberals increase in healthcare premiums and drug costs. They are flat rated and therefore a very regressive tax.

@Vid: ambisextruous ? lol ...cute !
@ssiguy : Forgive my ignorance on the matter but I take it that the Liberals are in power in BC. That being the case, I also recall that BC had crashed under the NDP. Now, personally, in your shoes I'd probably be a little weary concerning the Liberals and I think you make some pretty good points about the BC economy being resource based. Nevertheless, BC is the kind of province that really should never be a have-not....ever. You guys have absolutely everything going for you out there except for Alberta's oil.....and I envy you guys for it. At the same time though, I was amazed that BC was run into the ground by the NDP while the ROC was booming after the last recession. I don't know if you consider them (the NDP)a viable option or not but in case you are, just take a look at what they did to your wonderful province last time they had power. The Greens are still off the radar over here so you'll have to educate me on them....they sort of sound like the NDP's vegetarian cousin to me so I don't know if they're really a better idea. However, feel free to educate me on them as I have to admit I haven't really heard anything bad about them yet.

Don't get me wrong, ther NDP was a disaster from start to finish. It was, however, also the product of circumstance. They were in power when China and India were not the engines they are today. Japan was in deep recession in the 90's and you had the monetary collapse of SouthEast Asia in 1998. That backed up with low commodity prices they didn't have much of a chance.
The media was against them. There was that famous scene of them raiding Clarke's house and were pulvirized by the Van Sun/Prov and Victoria T/C...........all ownerd by CanWestGlobal.
Of course when Campbell came home from Hawaii pickled they offered nothing but support.
The Greens are a real alternative and the NDP HATE them because they say they split the vote. They are quite different in their views on transit, preventative healthcare, sustainable economy and proportional representation which the NDP does NOT want.
When you get 10% of the vote they are not just tree huggers but represent a truly wide variance of the public.

Well if we can get the forumers here and in SSP, then I am sure we can come close. Our platform will be strictly city based. Hell even if we don't win anything (we won't) we will get money and use that to push our city agendas. Well it may work.

Funny thing with BC politics. Has anyone noticed that the BC Liberals are now more Conservative than the Alberta COnservatives.

Funny thing with BC politics. Has anyone noticed that the BC Liberals are now more Conservative than the Alberta COnservatives.

Fiscally yes. Socially, not yet. :) BC is still the most socially progessive province in the West (probably 2nd to Quebec in the country).

Whatever with the NDP. At the end of the day they are still powerless regardless of the 33 seats they won in the election, and they have to understand that, they were partying like they won yesterday. The green part is just a joke plain and simple. The next election will most likely be between these two parties again, i dont see the green party electing a member to the legislature anytime in the near future.

B.C. Liberals are conservative? That's because B.C. Liberal is actually spelled, SOCIAL CREDIT. Regardless of who you voted for, it is important to get your facts from sources other than the "B.C. Liberal" website. Teachers have not gone on strike for 12 years - since collective bargaining was introduced by Harcourt. B.C. Economic growth is nothing surpassing mediocre. I used the liberal website for this one: "B.C.'s economy outpaced the national average for the first time in seven years in 2003. B.C.'s economic growth of 2.5% in 2003 was ahead of the national average of 2.0% growth over the same period. (B.C. Stats, Nov. 12, 2004)" Hey, but let's count back 7 years from 2003 with me. 2002, 2001,...It equals 1996. In the midst of the "Anti-business quagmire" that was NDP reign. Last year, NDP Saskatchewan had 3.5% growth. In addition to this, BC's debt grew substantially (almost 5 billion) and they have admitted they will spend more to build more highways and bridges (to name after former Socred premiers). Given a choice between "tax and spend" and "just spend", I would be inclined to think of the future - to think of 2006.

B.C. Liberals are conservative? That's because B.C. Liberal is actually spelled, SOCIAL CREDIT. Regardless of who you voted for, it is important to get your facts from sources other than the "B.C. Liberal" website. Teachers have not gone on strike for 12 years - since collective bargaining was introduced by Harcourt. B.C. Economic growth is nothing surpassing mediocre. I used the liberal website for this one: "B.C.'s economy outpaced the national average for the first time in seven years in 2003. B.C.'s economic growth of 2.5% in 2003 was ahead of the national average of 2.0% growth over the same period. (B.C. Stats, Nov. 12, 2004)" Hey, but let's count back 7 years from 2003 with me. 2002, 2001,...It equals 1996. In the midst of the "Anti-business quagmire" that was NDP reign. Last year, NDP Saskatchewan had 3.5% growth. In addition to this, BC's debt grew substantially (almost 5 billion) and they have admitted they will spend more to build more highways and bridges (to name after former Socred premiers). Given a choice between "tax and spend" and "just spend", I would be inclined to think of the future - to think of 2006.

I’m not going to respond to all of this right now, but here you go:

Teachers have been on strike in the past 12 years. It happened a few times while I was a student.

The NDP were anti-business and admitted it.

Talking about substantial debt growth, how about 200% in the 1990s? $1.7 billion in one year under the Liberals was the largest down payment on the debt ever.

Let's not even talk about debt.. debt reduction was and will never be a platform of the NDP. The NDP is always shortsighted when it comes to fiscal responsibility.

Teachers have not been on strike in 12 years. When another union goes on strike, Teachers, as any union, respect and will not cross picket lines. CUPE was on strike, not teachers.

No B.C. Government has ever exited power with a provincial debt lower than when they were voted into power. To claim that any B.C. govt is any more responsible than any other is ludicrous. In fact, The 2003-04 public accounts show that in 2001, taxpayer-supported debt was 19 per cent of B.C.'s gross domestic product; at March 31 of this year, it had climbed to 20.8 per cent. The Socreds (B.C. Liberals) have put us further into debt even with their ideologically-driven government cutting.

Seriously anyone supporting the NDP makes me want to vomit, they are a disgrace to this province, and really i think alot of people just never saw the benefits from the government policies yet, it needs more time, and come next election im optomistic the liberals will get a stronger majority, because people will start to feel the positives... it takes time.

"Seriously anyone supporting the NDP makes me want to vomit, they are a disgrace to this province,..."[sic]
More so than the provincial party investigated for fraud? The first political party in B.C. to nominate a convict?

"...and really i think alot of people just never saw the benefits from the government policies yet, it needs more time,..."[sic]
The one benefit a new government brings is distance from the previous one, in this instance, the removal of a huge volume of regulation; a decidedly positive thing. A tax cut does not take time to take effect; it appeals directly and immediately. Service cuts are phased in as budgets come to a close. If anything, the further we grow from the NDP, the more government contracts will end, and not be renewed.

"...and come next election im optomistic the liberals will get a stronger majority, because people will start to feel the positives... it takes time."[sic]
Yes, all the positives, like declining real wages. (-1.6% in 2004 vs Can avg +0.7%)
If they do win another election, it will be in no small part thanks to Asper and his assorted brands of news.
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/ArticleNews/TPStory/LAC/20050518/BCPANEL18/TPNational/Canada

Asper ? Which Asper are you referring to BTW ? Izzy Asper ?

It's lenny now. Izzy died in 2003. In fact, he's probably responsible for most of the opinions in this thread, since almost everything we read or hear is owned by Canwest.
http://www.yourmedia.ca/modules/canwest/040922_chouaib_cwg_muslims.html
http://ottawa.cbc.ca/regional/servlet/View?filename=ot_reuters20040917

Teachers have not been on strike in 12 years. When another union goes on strike, Teachers, as any union, respect and will not cross picket lines. CUPE was on strike, not teachers.

No B.C. Government has ever exited power with a provincial debt lower than when they were voted into power. To claim that any B.C. govt is any more responsible than any other is ludicrous. In fact, The 2003-04 public accounts show that in 2001, taxpayer-supported debt was 19 per cent of B.C.'s gross domestic product; at March 31 of this year, it had climbed to 20.8 per cent. The Socreds (B.C. Liberals) have put us further into debt even with their ideologically-driven government cutting.

Not crossing the picket lines is just as bad. 4 million work days were lost to strikes in the 1990s!!!!!!! I have no respect for unions. They once had a place but now all they do is drive up the prices for the consumer or the government. They don't reward hard work and they don't punish low quality work. It is hilarious that the NDP claim hospitals are dirty just because the cleaning is contracted out. Like a union could do any better. With unions, everyone makes more money, but they pay that increase back through union dues, then the employer can't afford to pay all the employees more so he closes down, and then everyone loses their job.

There actually is a responsible party. The BC Liberals made legislation to keep the budget balanced (the NDP were against this), the BC Liberals are looking into better voting systems, and the BC Liberals are making many other smart decisions especially effecting economy.

Debt

NDP:
Doubled taxpayer supported debt in less than a decade.
Increasing debt resulted in $2.6 billion a year being spent on interest costs.
Debt-GDP ratio increased dramatically - by 20% in less than a decade.

Liberals:
A record $1.7 billion pay-down of debt.
Debt-to-GDP ratio has decreased by over 10% and will continue to go down over the next three years.


Government cutting driving us further into debt eh? Feel free to explain that. The NDP are the ones who make the radical, idealogical decisions... no question about it.

^ Second that. Unions are a waste of resources, destroys competitiveness, and ends up being a leach on the average joe's paycheck. They're useless and scandalous (e.g. Canada Post's <worked there for one summer> union HQs are currently having an internal battle because the Ontario division pocketed millions for themselves)

No B.C. Government has ever exited power with a provincial debt lower than when they were voted into power. To claim that any B.C. govt is any more responsible than any other is ludicrous. In fact, The 2003-04 public accounts show that in 2001, taxpayer-supported debt was 19 per cent of B.C.'s gross domestic product; at March 31 of this year, it had climbed to 20.8 per cent. The Socreds (B.C. Liberals) have put us further into debt even with their ideologically-driven government cutting.

:eek2: Comparing by nominal value makes no sense. The only way to gauge the actual weight of debt is by comparing the Debt-to-GDP ratio. If this ratio is falling drastically, then that indicates positive debt management. Even the federal government uses the Debt-to-GDP ratio to determine their debt reduction targets, not nominal values.

Debt:
Debt-to-GDP ratio has decreased by over 10% and will continue to go down over the next three years.

&


http://www.bcliberals.com/media/Doubled-debt.jpg



More so than the provincial party investigated for fraud? The first political party in B.C. to nominate a convict?
Oh man, don't talk about scandals if you are supporting the NDP:
Former NDP Finance Minister: Bargained 64 counts, pleaded guilty to fraud, pleaded guilty to running an illegal lottery.
The publications arm of the NDP: pleaded guilty to 2 counts of operating an illegal lottery, pleaded guilty to fraud.
Glen Clark: charged with 2 criminal counts including defrauding the government and breach of trust.
The NDP: lost a $150 million lawsuit.
$1.9 million were stolen from charities by the NDP.
NDP gag laws were found unconstitutional.
...and so, so many more.
The legal costs of all these court cases were paid for directly from taxpayers!


The one benefit a new government brings is distance from the previous one, in this instance, the removal of a huge volume of regulation; a decidedly positive thing. A tax cut does not take time to take effect; it appeals directly and immediately. Service cuts are phased in as budgets come to a close. If anything, the further we grow from the NDP, the more government contracts will end, and not be renewed.
All good stuff :okay:


Yes, all the positives, like declining real wages. (-1.6% in 2004 vs. Can avg +0.7%)
You really shouldn't bring up certain things if you support the NDP:

Under the NDP median family income FELL by 2.2% in British Columbia (1990 – 2000) while it INCREASED 0.8% for Canada as a whole. Take-home pay dropped by $1,738 under the NDP between 1990 and 1999 – a drop of nearly 9%.

In BC, the percentage of people earning over $16/hour is higher than anywhere else in the country.

Average after-tax income INCREASED by 11 per cent between 2000 and 2003.

Average income in BC in 1992, $500 above the national average.
Average income in BC in 1999, $700 BELOW the national average and $2400 below Alberta.

British Columbia’s families have more money in their pockets under the BC Liberals than they ever did under the NDP.

Under the BC Liberals’ term, on average, British Columbians’ after-tax family incomes (in real 2003 dollars) are the highest they have been since 1980.
Since 2000, British Columbia families saw the one of the largest increases in after-tax family incomes in Canada at 6.2 per cent, more than double the Canadian average of 3.1 percent and second only to Saskatchewan.
From 2000 to 2003, after-tax family incomes in British Columbia increased by $3,400 to $58,200, an increase of 6.2 per cent. The average increase for Canadian families was $1,800, an increase of 3.1 percent.
To compare, from 1992 to 2000 under the NDP, British Columbia was the only province in Canada to see their after-tax incomes drop. Under the NDP after-tax incomes FELL by $500 or 1 per cent, while Canada as a whole saw a GAIN of $6,100 or 11.7 per cent.
Under the NDP (1992 to 2000), annual after tax incomes averaged $54,278. Since the BC Liberals came to office, after tax incomes have averaged $58,667 (2001 to 2003), an increase of $4,389 or 8.1 per cent – an income level not seen since 1980.

The median incomes for the province as a whole, they are actually UP by 1.8%, from $22,300 in 2002 to $22,700 in 2003. Overall, median incomes for the province have increased 6.6% since 2000 – from $21,300 to $22,700 in 2003.

Under the NDP, 1/10 British Columbians were on welfare.

Annual average take-home pay was lowered by $1738 between 1990 and 1999. I should have gone up because of inflation.

And since taxes have a major role in this:

Average provincial income tax payable declined by 25 per cent.

Under the NDP:
BC had the highest personal income tax rates in Canada.
Imposed $2 billion worth of new taxes on everything from personal to corporate income.
Fees, royalties and taxes had increased roughly 1.5 times faster than British Columbians’ pre-tax incomes.

Under the Liberals:
Introduced significant tax relief - for net relief of over $1.5 billion.
Significantly improved the competitiveness of BC industries, leading to economic renewal and best job creation record in Canada.
730,000 low income British Columbians will pay lower taxes - including 330,000 who will now pay no tax.

EVERYONE is paying less in taxes (MSP + income + property + sales) than they would have under the NDP 2001 platform.

http://www.bcliberals.com/media/takehome.jpg


If they do win another election, it will be in no small part thanks to Asper and his assorted brands of news.

THE GAG LAWS under the NDP!
Quick summary: The NDP made "gag laws" that meant third parties could only spend $5,000 (a one time, quarter page ad in the Vancouver Sun). The NDP on the other hand, were allowed to spend $6.6 million plus tax payer supported ads. The NDP also wanted to ban opinion polls in the media but instead they made tough regulations that, if not followed, could lead to criminal prosecution. The gag laws replaced the Elections Act but included nothing about limiting organized labour help. The laws banned ads that promoted or opposed a position that might be associated with a particular party; this meant a party could show an ad that said they would balance the budget. The gag laws were eventually found unconstitutional!

I also explained in my original post that the current NDP were illegally breaking the new Election Act's regulations.

And you are claiming unfair media coverage?

My god, I love it. 1/10 of British Columbians on welfare? Reducing that number is far from a science; make the conditions more difficult. In November 2003 the Vancouver Coastal Health Authority set up a 3 week audit because of the low quality of the cleaning work done by Sodexho, the multinational at the center of the hospital cleaning scandal in Scotland. The CEO of the Fraser Valley Health Authority, Bob Smith, was fired after numerous cases of infection (caused by a lack of cleanliness) and one death (due to chronic overcrowding).
Do we know what a median is? It's something they cite when the average doesn't fly their way. It means two billionaires moved out of the province.
The "B.C Liberals" entered government with a 1.67 billion surplus.
Even the most glowing forecast of gdp growth is not as high as the 4.6 it was in 2000. BC's per per capita GDP growth was 0.9% through most of the 90's due to a huge influx of people; population growth was 21% between 1991 and 2001. Real GDP growth through this period was an average of 2.8%
Unions drive prices up, certainly. But so do environmental regulations, bylaws, anti-child labour laws; abolition of slavery drove costs up too.
We could continue trotting out our own facts into an infinite future, but a reprieve - I am not an NDP supporter. My opposition is only to the childish anti-union, anti-taxes grade 5 conservatism that seems to swell with this kind of populist shift to less government. There is a critical mass of social programs that will raise the quality of life of all people in B.C., and finding it is a political dialogue. If political parties make you want to vomit, maybe you should move to Cuba, where the water does that.

I despise unions. Having said that we really couldn't do away with them and shouldn't really want to. Everything everybody has said about them from their cost to their lack of promoting efficiency and quality is absolutely true. Nevertheless, the unfortunate truth is that if they were abolished tomorrow it wouldn't take long before the greediest among us were taking advantage of the situation. The problem we have is when unions find their way into bed with governments (a la NDP)

If there is a solution it requires the governments to impose restrictions on unions. Or maybe a better way to put it would be to say that , through legislation, a union should not be allowed to demand more than a company can afford. Unions don't care when the company hits hard times and as such continue to demand more even when the increased burden of supporting the employees becomes untenable for a company. Many times unions have made demands for higher wages when a company needed to actually roll wages back. And those companies shut down or closed the local operation.
Because of the NDP's longstanding and intimate association with unions I could never support the NDP. They simply aren't thinking about the big picture or actually considering the needs of the employees. They are concerned with the support unions provide the party with.

This is one of the big reasons the NDP are absolute poison to businesses and can never attract support on a federal level that will take them close to the big seat. I say good for BC for not falling for their crap this time round. Enjoy your coming prosperity !