Hanoi: four ODA-funded projects to be implemented for 2005-2007

...
A four-year project on the construction of Nhat Tan bridge at a total investment of US$337.6 million (with US$246.2 million coming from Japan's ODA) will start in 2006 to facilitate transport and socio-economic development in the capital.

A project to build an urban railway system linking the Hanoi railway station and Noi Bai airport will be built at a cost of US$660 million (with US$577 million coming from ODA). The project will be implemented from 2006-2015 to help develop urban-industrial centres west of Hanoi and north of the Red River.

source: vov.org.vn

summary:

Main Road
Width of the road ranging between 37 m (121 feet) and 42 m (138 feet).
Asphalt pavement road with 6 traffic lanes for 2 sides.
Street light poles are aligning in parallel with 40 m (131 feet) interval at both sides of road.
3 m - wide (10 feet) median and sidewalk at both sides.
This Main Road, which is as high as the Hanoi – Noi Bai Highway, meets Level C in Japanese Traffic Classification.

http://www.thanglong-ip.com/images/main.jpg

Secondary Road
Width of the road ranging between 26 m (85 feet) and 27 m (89 feet).
Asphalt pavement road with 2 traffic lanes for 2 sides.
Street light poles are aligning in zigzag with 45 m (148 feet) interval at both sides of road.
Sidewalk at both sides.
http://www.thanglong-ip.com/images/sub.jpg

by thanglong-jp.com

projects untill 2010:
1. Tunnel under the Red River with estimated investment of US$300 million
2. Urban subway with estimated investment of US$1 billion.
...
4. Trams with estimated investment of US$100 million.
5. Highway ring road with estimated investment of US$100 million.
6. Bridges across the Red River with estimated investment of US$250 million.
7. Inner-city elevated train (Giap Bat-Gia Lam route) with estimated investment of US$90 million
...
by VN-Style

Hanoi: traffic junction breaks ground

Construction work began April 30 on the Nga Tu So road junction project in Hanoi.

The Nga Tu So junction, part of a project to develop urban traffic routes in Hanoi, will be built at a total investment of nearly VND1,140bil from the Japanese Government's official Development Assistance and Respondent Capital of Vietnam.

The project involves the Japanese Bridge and Structure Institute (JBSI), Loios Nerger of the US, BRITEC, Sumitomo-Mitsui (Japan) and the Vietnam Construction Import Export Corporation, Vinaconex. It will be built in 16 months, intended to ease congestion in Hanoi's southwest area.

Speaking at the groundbreaking, Deputy Prime Minister Pham Gia Khiem thanked the Japanese Government for its assistance and expressed his hope that the two countries would further promote cooperation

source: vnn.vn

Location : Hanoi - Ha Tay
Schedule : 2003-2005
Capacity: 30km
Total investment capital: 240,850,000 USD
Investor: VINACONEX

http://www.vinaconex.com.vn/Images/lvkd/pHOICANHCHUAN.jpg

Đường Láng - Hoà Lạc được mở rộng gấp 10 lần hiện nay
http://vnexpress.net/Vietnam/Xa-hoi/2004/05/3B9D25B3/LOAN3.jpg
source: vnexpress.net

Vietnam - Feasibility study of a tramline in Hanoi

On April 2, 2004, the People’s Committee of the City of Hanoi (Vietnam) officially chose SYSTRA as engineering company for a feasibility study of a pilot tramline in response to a call for tenders.

The initial conclusions of the study will be made available at the end of August 2004, and the study completed for President Chirac’s visit to Vietnam in early October.

SYSTRA has already established an assignment on the spot and will be mobilizing twenty-two experts on the project.

The intended tramline project could be installed on one of the main pilot bus routes, route 32. The principle is a 14-km long experimental line connecting the city center to the new districts west of the city, with the capability of carrying up to 100,000 passengers a day.

There are several possible alternatives in the city center, towards the Opera or the railway station.

source: systra.com

Đường Láng - Hoà Lạc được mở rộng gấp 10 lần hiện nay

Đường xá ngoài Bắc bao giờ cũng tốt hơn trong Nam 10 lần. :sleepy: :)

chính phủ luôn luôn chú trọng đầu tư cơ sở hạ tầng ở miền bắc ,đặc biệt là đưởng cao tốc

@saigon_monsooner and KhanhNhat: I don´t understand what you are written in vietnamese.........:colgate:

I added the vietnamese sentence here from the website but really didn´t know what it means....:colgate: thought it were be an impotant point.

tq:i suprised you dont know vnese?hehe.my means:the goverment always care invest infrastructure in north ,espencially highway.
and saigon_moonsooner means:the north street always better than south street 10 times.
advise you:learn vnese more....

I can´t reading and writing vietnamese perfectly but speaking fluently :) .

@KhanhNhat: every year I have to learn vietnamese in Hanoi but damn thats a shi*...I don´t want to waste my time...I´m more interest in "di choi"....:colgate:

By the way it´s normal when overseas vn youth either can´t vietnamese or not perfectly...;-)

By the way it´s normal when overseas vn youth either can´t vietnamese or not perfectly...;-)
Yeah true...many of my friends cant read Vietnamese at all.


KhanhNhat :chính phủ luôn luôn chú trọng đầu tư cơ sở hạ tầng ở miền bắc ,đặc biệt là đưởng cao tốc

I think one of the reasons is because unfortunately the war had sereverly damaged the northern infrastructure. So now the North need these infrasture so they can compete better with the economic power of the South.

Toi ngi Bien Bac chu tron dau tu co so ha tang hon tai vi khong may Cuoc Chien Trang xua da huy hoai nang ne he thong co so ha tang. Nay thi chinh phu chu trong hon de Bien Bac co mot he thong tot hon va de canh tranh voi mot nen kinh te manh hon cua Mien Nam. Thiet ra toi ngi hien nay mien Nam can nhung thiet ke ha tang nay hon mien Bac de phat trien toi da tiem nang kinh te. Nhung that ra..nhung chu trong nay cung tot Cho Mien Bac...vi da den duc cung phat trien toan tiem nang cua mien Bac.

Toi khong dong y. Mien Nam can co so ha tang gap rut hon la mien bac vi ly do kinh te va xa hoi. Saigon la thanh pho lon gap 2 Hanoi va co nen kinh te manh hon Hanoi rat nhieu. Vi la trung tam san xuat va xuat nhap khau cua ca nuoc nen chung ta can dau tu vao co so ha tang cho mien nam nhieu hon.

I think infrastructure investments in the south, particularly Saigon and the adjacent industrial zones and newly developed commercial centers are more urgent than in Hanoi as they are the main economic and export/import drivers of the whole country. Saigon is more than twice the population and economy of Hanoi yet only gets a fraction of the infrastructure investments. I think it's just a case of biasness.

Look at Hanoi, there's a brand spanking new airport and they're building another one, along with various bridges, highways and roads as well as public buildings. All for what when they don't need those excess capacity? Also, it doesn't make economic sense as they won't contribute to the economy.

Building those infrastructures in the South on the other hand will facilitate trade, investments and hence the prosperity of the whole country.

The government is trying to choke the South and squeeze it dry economically whilst trying to improve the economic fortune of the North.

To Lac Long Quan: Why do you think Saigon received less investment than Hanoi ? Take the Thu Thiem Tunnel for example , it alone cost more than 800$millions , equal to all the bridges and highway which are going to build in Hanoi . The Tan Son Nhat new airport was underconstruction right now why Hanoi's still on the paper. And the Long Thanh project,8$ billions? If you want to prove that the Communist goverment want to dry South's economy ,show me some stastic or don't post that topic there.

Dude, Saigon contributes over 40% of the national budget yet only get a fraction of it back as infrastructure investments. Most of the infrastructure projects are funded mostly or entirely by ODA, FDI or IMF/ADB/WB loans.

Everybody knows that Hanoi on the other hand receives much of the national budget allocation.This year's 4 of the 5 biggest government projects are in Hanoi and the northern provinces.

What's the better proof than the fact that the government actively discourage investors from investing in the south and actively encouraging them (even persuading/coercing) to invest in the North.

To Lac Long Quan: Why do you think Saigon received less investment than Hanoi ? Take the Thu Thiem Tunnel for example , it alone cost more than 800$millions , equal to all the bridges and highway which are going to build in Hanoi . The Tan Son Nhat new airport was underconstruction right now why Hanoi's still on the paper. And the Long Thanh project,8$ billions? If you want to prove that the Communist goverment want to dry South's economy ,show me some stastic or don't post that topic there.

Long Thanh will be built in 2010. They said that. But who sure it will be start in 2010.

And the Thu Thiem tunnel, 800$mil? Who says? Just 100$ mil and had been planned in more than 10 years, while Saigon really need it. It is also true with Thu Thiem bridge, just 80$ mil, and 10 years.

While in Hanoi and the northern provinces, they had started many projects with costs more than 300, 400$ mil. Nhat Tan 400$ mil, Vinh Tuy 300$ mil, Ha Tay highway 300$ mil, Quang Ninh bridge (I dont remember the names) 400$ mil, and so on... The Nga Tu So Crossroad cost 100$ mil, just for a crossroad. And they had planned all of these projects just in 1, 2 years. Do you believe it?
While in Saigon, almost the street are narrow now. The Saigon River need more bridge crossing but....
Live in Vietnam, and you will see.

I have been to Saigon and see the city's urgent need for more infrastructure projects.

Everytime I read news about a new project I instantly thought hey this is gonna be in Hanoi or the north.. and most of the time it's true.

Most of the northern projects doesn't make economic sense whereas a similar project built in the south would generate massive returns in trade, foreign investments and exports. It just doesn't make sense.

Man,just look at these infrastructures out there.Is there any true motorway ever be built in 'Mien Nam',except Saigon's peripheries? In the North,now it has expanded to more than 500km.I know that geographic conditions play some important role but a more equal investment from the government is something everybody are talking about in those parliamentary sessions.Think about the damned Dung Quat project,not enough to give a lesson?

Thu Thiem tunnel/bridge should have been there 10 years ago,and still nothing yet by now.

Man...I´m sad and tired to always hearing HCMC were more neglect than Hanoi...schould we divide the country again?...just to make HCMC 1000times better than Hanoi?...make this you feel better?...the government to their job not bad at all...you act like that the whole economy comes from HCMC...and that isn´t true!!!

Do you think Hanoi needn´t all those infrastructure projects, too?
Hey don´t forget...Hanoi is still the country´s capital!!!
I think we should build everthing in the South just to make you guys more happy, because suppossed the whole economy comes from the South...

You act like that the South is paying everthing for the whole country...did you know that many vn companies from the North invests into the South, too?

Ban rat buon khi nao nghe la TPHCM luc nao cung khong bang Hanoi...co khi phai lam VN thanh hai de cac ban vui long hon, dung khong?...TPHCMC co phai la moi cai Tanh Pho duy nhat o Vietnam de cai gi cung duoc dau.

Hanoi cung can nhung du an do. The de Thu do cua chung minh nho cai nha que thi hai lam, ha?

Sorry for my bad vietnamese.... :D

:)

1/Why Hanoi has so much money to build all these bridges and highway? The answer is that it came from land and ODA and tax,like Lang-Hoa Lac,it was built by Vinaconex<this company also invested hundred of millions in the south too> in exchange Vinaconex has the right to use all the land along Lang-Hoa Lac. It was basicaly how most of the projects in hanoi funded.

2/According to this source :http://www.atimes.com/atimes/Southeast_Asia/GE13Ae04.html
, Saigon spend 2,6$billions a year in infrastructure , if that is true then i can assure that in one year it spend more money than the whole Northern region including Hanoi.

Do you think Hanoi needn´t all those infrastructure projects, too?
Hey don´t forget...Hanoi is still the country´s capital!!!
I think we should build everthing in the South just to make you guys more happy, because suppossed the whole economy comes from the South...

You act like that the South is paying everthing for the whole country...did you know that many vn companies from the North invests into the South, too?
Ban rat buon khi nao nghe la TPHCM luc nao cung khong bang Hanoi...co khi phai lam VN thanh hai de cac ban vui long hon, dung khong?...TPHCMC co phai la moi cai Tanh Pho duy nhat o Vietnam de cai gi cung duoc dau.

Hanoi cung can nhung du an do. The de Thu do cua chung minh nho cai nha que thi hai lam, ha?

Sorry for my bad vietnamese.... :D :)



Nah i dont think we meant that we should neglect the North and concentrate all the energy on teh South..Hanoi is capital and u know what..i think it should be a political center and let Saigon be the economic center. I personally not being condescending toward the north when i feel as others too that the South need more infrastructure supports. Its base primary on economic reasons that i think the South should have a little more supports than it has currently. With this the South can collectively drags the entire nation toward a more faster economic success. Respectfully i dont think the North can do the same YET.


Theo loi noi cua ban thi chac ban cung la nguoi Mien Bac. Toi nghi nhung loi ung ho cho cac du an co so ha tang o Mien Nam khong co nghia la chung ta khinh bi Mien Bac..khong co the lam duoc nhu Mien Nam. Duc nuoc minh dau co lon bao nhieu ma bay gio con y niem chia doi Nam Bac nua. Ha Noi la thu do thi toi nghi hay de Ha Noi la trung tam chinh tri cua Vietnam va de Sai Gon la trung tam kinh te cua ca nuoc. Nhung loi ung ho nay toi nghia chi dua vao yeu to duy nhat: Kinh Te. Neu chung ta muon duc nuoc phat trien ve mat kinh te that nhanh va voi nen kinh te hien tai....thi chi co Mien Nam co du suc de manh de thu hut dau tu va phat trien nhanh le. Neu chung ta phat trien toi da tiem nang cua Mien Nam...thi toi nghi se de dang hon de keo ca nuoc len con duong giau co nhanh hon. Don nhien khong nen xay het tat ca o Mien Nam nhung hay cho Mien Nam nhung gi no can thiet nhat thoi.

Dung noi toi sai chu neu so ve mat lich su va van hoa thi don nhien khong co gi choi cai la Ha Noi hon Sai Gon nhieu.

Good speech,versalvin!

Uh you know this it what i mean,everybody.

Let Hanoi be like Berlin and HCMC like Munchen or Ruhr :D

Việc Thủ tướng Chính phủ ký QĐ số 323/QĐ - TTg ngày 20/4/2005 về việc đầu tư Dự án xây dựng đường cao tốc Cầu Giẽ - Ninh Bình (giai đoạn I) bằng phương thức phát hành Trái phiếu công trình do Chính phủ bảo lãnh không chỉ tháo gỡ những khó khăn để đẩy nhanh tiến độ chuẩn bị, triển khai đoạn đường cao tốc thứ ba trên tuyến đường bộ xuyên Việt mà còn góp phần mở ra một hướng đi mới thu hút các nguồn lực để hoàn thiện mạng đường cao tốc trong tương lai với tổng chiều dài lên tới 3.000 km.

Khác với hai dự án xây dựng đường cao tốc đã triển khai ở Việt Nam là đoạn Pháp Vân - Cầu Giẽ và Hà Nội - Bắc Ninh (đều nằm trên trục xuyên Việt) được đầu tư bằng nguồn vốn ODA, dự án xây dựng 56 km đường cao tốc Cầu Giẽ - Ninh Bình do Công ty Đầu tư phát triển đường cao tốc Việt Nam (VEC) làm chủ đầu tư được thực hiện bằng một phương thức hoàn toàn mới: do một doanh nghiệp nhà nước đứng ra bỏ vốn đầu tư bằng nguồn vốn điều lệ và phát hành trái phiếu công trình có bảo lãnh của Chính phủ.

Đường cao tốc Pháp Vân - Cầu Giẽ. Ảnh: Viết Huy

Sau một thời gian thu phí hoàn vốn, số tiền gốc cộng với lợi nhuận từ việc kinh doanh các dịch vụ "ăn theo" tuyến đường như: cho thuê biển quảng cáo; trạm dừng xe, trạm xăng, nhà hàng... sẽ lại được đem đầu tư xây dựng một tuyến cao tốc mới. Nói một cách ngắn gọn thì lần đầu tiên ở Việt Nam xuất hiện một ngành nghề mới: Kinh doanh đường cao tốc - lấy lợi nhuận của đường cao tốc để phát triển mạng đường tốc.

Theo ông Trần Xuân Sanh, TGĐ VEC, đây được coi là một giải pháp hữu hiệu để huy động nguồn vốn nhàn rỗi trong dân và của các nhà đầu tư trong và ngoài nước thông qua phát hành Trái phiếu công trình dưới sự bảo lãnh của Chính phủ. Hình thức huy động vốn này được đánh giá là khá an toàn cho các nhà đầu tư.

Được biết, để xây dựng khoảng 3.000 km đường cao tốc từ nay đến năm 2010, cả nước cần khoảng 110.400 tỷ đồng . Trong bối cảnh triển vọng vay vốn nước ngoài để đầu tư vào kết cấu hạ tầng hiện đại này gần như bằng 0 và việc một loạt các dự án BOT đường cao tốc khác đang gặp rất nhiều khó khăn thì đây là lời giải khả thi nhất.

Khai thông nút rối "vốn từ đâu"?

Theo phê duyệt của Thủ tướng Chính phủ, tuyến đường cao tốc Cầu Giẽ - Ninh Bình dài 56 km đi qua địa phận các tỉnh Hà Tây, Hà Nam, Nam Định và Ninh Bình sẽ có mặt cắt ngang được quy hoạch hoàn chỉnh cho 6 làn xe ô tô cao tốc (nền đường 35,5 m; mặt đường rộng 32,5 m).

Giai đoạn I xây dựng 4 làn xe từ Km 210 QL1A đến Km 260+30 QL10 dài 50 km có mặt đường rộng 25 m gồm chiều rộng mặt đường cơ giới là 18 m, dải đỗ xe khẩn cấp 6 m, chiều rộng lề 1 m, dải phân cách rộng 3 mét, dải đất dự trữ mở rộng lên 6 làn xe rộng 7,5m.

Trong giai đoạn I sẽ xây dựng 11 cầu lớn với tổng chiều dài khoảng 3.000 m; 3 cầu trung; 18 cầu nhỏ; 228 cống các loại; 3 nút giao liên thông; 5 nút giao trực thông; 95 cầu dân sinh và một số đường gom. Tổng kinh phí thực hiện giai đoạn 1 là 3.734 tỷ đồng; giai đoạn 2 là 1.688 tỷ đồng.

Như vậy, hướng tuyến của đoạn cao tốc Cầu Giẽ - Ninh Bình có một số điểm khác so với báo cáo khả thi ban đầu trên quan điểm hạn chế tối đa việc đi qua các khu đông dân cư để giảm kinh phí GPMB. Dự án sẽ được khởi công từ quý III năm 2005 và dự kiến đưa tuyến đường vào sử dụng vào cuối năm 2008.

Theo ông Sanh, sở dĩ tuyến cao tốc huyết mạch này chậm được triển khai là do giải quyết được nguồn vốn cho dự án. Tuy nhiên với những tháo gỡ của Thủ tướng Chính phủ được thể hiện trong QĐ 323, nút rối "vốn từ đâu" đã được khai thông.

Được biết, trong thời gian tới, Bộ Tài chính sẽ tạm ứng 1.000 tỷ đồng vốn điều lệ cho VEC theo tiến độ dự án sau khi dự án được phê duyệt thay vì phải đợi bán được quyền thu phí hai trạm Cầu Giẽ và Phù Đổng. Phần kinh phí còn lại trị giá 2.734 tỷ đồng sẽ được huy động từ việc phát hành trái phiếu công trình dưới sự bảo lãnh của Bộ Tài chính.

Hiện nay, phương án phát hành Trái phiếu công trình đang được các bên khẩn trương xây dựng tuy nhiên theo tiết lộ của chủ đầu tư, lãi suất của loại trái phiếu có kỳ hạn 15 năm nay sẽ vào khoảng trên 10%/năm - mức lãi suất được đánh giá là rất hấp dẫn.

Để tăng khả năng sinh lời từ việc kinh doanh tuyến đường, bên cạnh việc tổ chức thu phí có hiệu quả và kinh doanh các dịch vụ đi kèm - dự kiến kéo dài 14 năm, ngay từ lúc này VEC đang cố gắng xây dựng tuyến đường cao tốc dài nhất từ trước đến nay theo hướng tiết kiệm, chất lượng cao nhất làm tiền đề cho việc khởi động xây dựng mạng đường tiên tiến này theo một phương thức đầu tư được đánh giá là có nhiều ưu việt.

* Chiều 28.5, Tổng giám đốc Cty Đầu tư phát triển đường cao tốc VN Trần Xuân Sanh cho biết: Dự án xây dựng đường cao tốc Cầu Giẽ - Ninh Bình dài 56km, bắt đầu của dự án từ Km210 của QL1A (Hà Tây), kết thúc tại Km265+600 (QL10). Thủ tướng Chính phủ đã đồng ý tạm ứng 1.000 tỉ đồng vốn điều lệ cho Cty để thực hiện dự án được phê duyệt và giao Bộ Tài chính bảo lãnh cho Cty phát hành 2.734 tỉ đồng trái phiếu công trình để triển khai giai đoạn 1 dự án.

Đường cao tốc TPHCM-Long Thành-Dầu Giây: Nhà đầu tư mới dừng ở mức... tìm hiểu!

Bộ Giao thông vận tải vừa nhận được báo cáo của Ban quản lý dự án Mỹ Thuận cho biết đã có một số đối tác trong và ngoài nước tiếp xúc với ban quản lý để tìm hiểu và xin tham gia đầu tư dự án đường cao tốc TPHCM-Long Thành-Dầu Giây (tổng mức đầu tư khoảng 6.000 tỉ đồng) theo hình thức BOT.

Tuy nhiên, các nhà đầu tư mới chỉ đứng lại ở mức độ tìm hiểu thông tin về qui mô dự án hoặc đề nghị ký "biên bản nghi nhớ" giữa hai bên.

so after those 2 posts, what do you say?
Saigon had to do its projects on its own, while ... Hanoi is invested by ODA, goverment funds, etc...

the ideas that versalvin said are the same as mine. :(

^ it's like the older child has to scrap a living using his own ability while the younger child getting all fat from the parents' feeding.

It's so sad that after 30 years of liberation Southern Vietnamese are still treated as second class.

yeah i don't understand the meaning of those post by lovesaigon.

Khởi công xây dựng đường cao tốc đầu tiên tại Việt Nam.Đường ôtô cao tốc TP.HCM-Trung Lương, tuyến cao tốc đầu tiên của mạng đường cao tốc Việt Nam đã được Thủ tướng Phan Văn Khải phát lệnh khởi công xây dựng sáng 16/12, tại khu vực Bến Lức, tỉnh Long An.


Tuyến đường TP.HCM đi Long An hiện nay.
Đường ôtô cao tốc TP.HCM-Trung Lương là một bộ phận của tuyến cao tốc TP.HCM-Cần Thơ nối liền trung tâm kinh tế lớn nhất nước là TP.HCM với vùng trọng điểm nông nghiệp và thủy sản Đồng bằng sông Cửu Long.

Tuyến cao tốc dài 61,9km bao gồm 39,8km đường cao tốc và 22,1km đường nối, đi qua TP.HCM, Long An và Tiền Giang. Ngoài ra, trên tuyến còn có các cầu vượt sông, cầu cạn, cầu vượt đường ngang, hệ thống cống và các công trình phụ trợ.

Tuyến có 8 làn xe (mỗi làn rộng 3,75m) và 2 làn đường cho dừng xe khẩn cấp (mỗi làn rộng 3m).Trước mắt, giai đoạn 1 đường cao tốc sẽ có 4 làn xe và 2 làn dừng xe khẩn cấp. Tổng kinh phí đầu tư cho dự án là 6.555 tỷ đồng, dự kiến hoàn thành sau 36 tháng thi công.

Tổng Công ty Xây dựng giao thông 4 là đơn vị thi công dự án dưới sự tư vấn và giám sát của Công ty Quality Courier International (Cuba).

Phát biểu tại lễ khởi công, Thủ tướng Phan Văn Khải nêu rõ: Đường cao tốc TP.HCM đi Trung Lương là tuyến đường quan trọng, có lưu lượng xe qua lại lớn nhất cả nước. Việc xây dựng đoạn đường cao tốc này nhằm giải quyết tình trạng quá tải trên tuyến quốc lộ 1A hiện nay, đồng thời góp phần khơi dậy và phát huy những lợi thế của các vùng kinh tế trọng điểm TP.HCM và Đồng bằng sông Cửu Long.

Cùng với tuyến đường bộ, Thủ tướng đề nghị Bộ Giao thông Vận tải nghiên cứu khả năng xây dựng thêm tuyến đường sắt từ TP.HCM đi Đồng bằng sông Cửu Long.

Thủ tướng cho biết năm 2005, Chính phủ sẽ tiếp tục bố trí vốn để nâng cấp và mở rộng tuyến đường quốc lộ 1A từ Thành phố Cần Thơ đến Bạc Liêu

well I'm from saigon and just happy that the country is prosper north or south
but maybe we forget about the central part, they got flood and draught every year.....when there's draught cattles, buffalos plants all died.......and when the monsoon comes cattles, buffalos, plants all died.
Wrote email to God and complaint, but he didn't reply......could someone tell him to check heaven's email geez

Good speech,versalvin!

Uh you know this it what i mean,everybody.

Let Hanoi be like Berlin and HCMC like Munchen or Ruhr :D


Hehe. München/Munich is too green and hasn´t really much skyscrapers. Frankfurt am Main looks more economic strong and Berlin has more big city like which match to HCMC more. So I prefere more Düsseldorf or München and Berlin downtown as Hanoi....:colgate:
But really hope they will not be like those german cities. Vietnam has a more charming and lovely flair.

I LOVE VIETNAM!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

:)

well I'm from saigon and just happy that the country is prosper north or south
but maybe we forget about the central part, they got flood and draught every year.....when there's draught cattles, buffalos plants all died.......and when the monsoon comes cattles, buffalos, plants all died.
Wrote email to God and complaint, but he didn't reply......could someone tell him to check heaven's email geez


True we kind of neglect the Central Part too...well i did :bash: ...But speaking of Mien Trung, what do u think is her potential in term of economic power... i think it is tourism.

Well I'm banking on Da Nang to become the economic driver of the Central and hopefully the 3rd force in the Vietnamese economy. Centralers are so poor and economically/geographically/resourcefully disadvantaged.

^ it's like the older child has to scrap a living using his own ability while the younger child getting all fat from the parents' feeding.

It's so sad that after 30 years of liberation Southern Vietnamese are still treated as second class.
Don't be so mean like that. Obviously, the North is the poorer part of the country, so it needs investment to develope the economy. The South have a lot of advantages over the North, e.g most of money come from "Viet Kieu" go to the south. I belive that as the economy of the north grow, the south would also benefit from it.

JAPAN TO PROVIDE US$744.2 MLN PREFERENTIAL LOAN FOR VIETNAM

HANOI - The Japanese Government will provide a 80 billion yen (US$744.2 million) preferential loan for Vietnam, designed to help the country develop its infrastructure and environmental protection. The loan will be allocated to projects including the construction of the East-West Boulevard in Ho Chi Minh City, the building of the Cai Met-Thi Vai international port and the construction of a section of road from Hanoi to Thai Nguyen province. Other projects include the expansion of a thermo-electric power plant in Ninh Binh province, and the treatment of sewage and garbage in Hai Phong.

by shibuimarkets.com

This is what I don't understand. If Saigon is being neglected as some of you are of the opinion, how is it possible for it to be the most prosperous region in the country? Already Saigon has a per capita income 4 or 5 times higher than many parts of the country. Another factor is the high FDI inflow, I believe it has the highest in the country. This must mean that Saigon has the best infrastructure in the country, otherwise it wouldn’t attract that much investments, as infrastructure plays an important role in attracting FDI; and other kind of investments.

In order to have a sustainable economic environment, a country needs to have a more equal distribution of income. Therefore, the government is doing the right thing by attempting to attract investments to other parts of the country. In this case, by building more infrastructures in the North, again better infrastructure means more investments, thereby improving the living standard of people in the region.

Most of the northern projects doesn't make economic sense whereas a similar project built in the south would generate massive returns in trade, foreign investments and exports. It just doesn't make sense.

Can you give us some facts on your statement?

I have here a report from the World Bank assessing the impact of large scale infrastructure projects in Northern Vietnam. Although its main emphasis is on Highway 5, nevertheless, we can infer from it why other projects ca just be as economically effective.

http://www.worldbank.org/wbi/reducingpoverty/docs/newpdfs/case-Vietnam-ImpactofTransportInfrastructure.pdf


^ it's like the older child has to scrap a living using his own ability while the younger child getting all fat from the parents' feeding.

It's so sad that after 30 years of liberation Southern Vietnamese are still treated as second class.

Why don’t you look at this way, Saigon is now economically the mature child, strong enough to need fewer supports from the parents. Whereas, the North and the Central are the little children in need of more support to grow stronger?

This is what I don't understand. If Saigon is being neglected as some of you are of the opinion, how is it possible for it to be the most prosperous region in the country? Already Saigon has a per capita income 4 or 5 times higher than many parts of the country. Another factor is the high FDI inflow, I believe it has the highest in the country. This must mean that Saigon has the best infrastructure in the country, otherwise it wouldn’t attract that much investments, as infrastructure plays an important role in attracting FDI; and other kind of investments.

In order to have a sustainable economic environment, a country needs to have a more equal distribution of income. Therefore, the government is doing the right thing by attempting to attract investments to other parts of the country. In this case, by building more infrastructures in the North, again better infrastructure means more investments, thereby improving the living standard of people in the region.



Can you give us some facts on your statement?

I have here a report from the World Bank assessing the impact of large scale infrastructure projects in Northern Vietnam. Although its main emphasis is on Highway 5, nevertheless, we can infer from it why other projects ca just be as economically effective.

http://www.worldbank.org/wbi/reducingpoverty/docs/newpdfs/case-Vietnam-ImpactofTransportInfrastructure.pdf




Why don’t you look at this way, Saigon is now economically the mature child, strong enough to need fewer supports from the parents. Whereas, the North and the Central are the little children in need of more support to grow stronger?
I don't need to pull out figures. The fact that building those infrastructures in Saigon will increase investments, facilitate trade, export and output is the main reason why it's more beneficial to built it in the South. On a per unit increase in output basis Saigon surely surpasses Hanoi.


For those who argues that Saigon receives most of the remittance from overseas Vietnamese, may I say that it has got nothing to do with building basic infrastructure. Those money goes to consumer spending and entreprenerial business. Those money won't improve Saigon's bridges, roads, public buildings/parks etc because the revenue goes straight to the governmetn and recycled in Hanoi, Haiphong and various other Northern cities and localitites.

What is the estimate amount of money send back to Vietnam by Việt Kiều this year?

Somewhere in the vicinity of $3.8-4.2 billion dollars, of which Saigon will receive approx. $2.5 billion and the South in total $3.5 billion

The building of a 130km-long railway linking Hanoi's outer Gia Lam District with Cai Lan Harbour in the northern coastal province of Quang Ninh is underway.
http://english.vietnamnet.vn/dataimages/original/images623101_RailHNportNorthern.jpg
The work is being done by domestic companies, as was the design.

The new line is expected to meet goods and passenger demand in northern Vietnam's key economic triangle, Hanoi - Hai Phong — Quang Ninh.

It will also become part of the East - West Corridor - a cooperative programme between the countries of Southeast Asia.

The track from Yen Vien, outside Hanoi, will run through 15 stations in Hanoi, Bac Ninh, Hai Duong and Ha Long City.

A 5km-long spur line from Ha Long City to Cai Lan Harbour will be newly built as will 35km of line from Lim in Bac Ninh Province to Pha Lai town in Hai Duong Province's Chi Linh District.

The remaining railway system, 90km, from Kep Station in Bac Giang Province to Ha Long City will be upgraded.

The work also includes a bridge in Uong Bi and two pedestrian overpasses in Ha Long City.

Passenger trains oh the new system will travel at up to 120kmph; goods trains will travel at up to 80kmph.

Vietnam Railways has responsibility for the project and the estimated VND4tril (US$253.2mil) for the work will come from the sale of Government bonds.

The new railway is scheduled to open by 2010.

(Source: Viet Nam News)

by vnn.vn

@laclongquan: your statements should always be accompanied by some kind of proof,otherwise they are not convincing at all

@laclongquan: your statements should always be accompanied by some kind of proof,otherwise they are not convincing at all
How can you put a definite monetary value on such thing? And what do you mean it's not convincing? If you think from a logical point of view than surely you'll understand my reason better. I've stated it above and I don't see any need to regurgitate the same set of facts.

And for your information I'm a final year student studying economics/finance.

Cheers

Thank you for replying
from my point of view, all that the gov have done were in a effort to keep the gap between the 2 parts of the country not getting bigger. Imagine, in 10 years time, without alot of investment from national budget and advantages which southern provinces have, the north will soon have to completely live on the south.
btw, your nick looks familiar, are you in nhom7x? if its true, I can see the logic behind your posts

Well..Congrats..LacLongQuan..your last year heh
getting your bachelor? are you going for the master too?
What school are you going though?

Really,i will study business/finance too and maybe banking more lately....will leave for England this year's fall.....don't know what will happen to this freshman :)

Going to England heh? Wow...that's a big adventure there...nice :)
Well that's an excellent place then to study business/finance/bankings
what schơol are you heading to?

I'll take a foundation course for the first year in London,then apply to an university....hope it will be LSE :)
Yes it's quite a thrill travelling and study there...but perfect place to study i think..well there's no many things to do hahah...Do you think the US/Canada sound more interesthing for Viet students....but i and my family have chosen,and the scholarship...na...

Hah well in term of fun things to do then i think US is better...beside there are much a lot more Vietnamese people here to hangout...but heh you go to schơol to study not hangout...so i think it is a gơod choice...

what is LSE?

LSE -> London School of Economics.
I am in England now, welcum Saigon Monsooner but I'm doing IT not eco. Actually, I find my place (Birmingham) a little bit boring but it's a differentt story in London, quite a few Vietnamese there. From my own experience going to UK is not thrilling at all, it's peaceful and quiet.
I heard that many Vietnamese students got full scholarship at LSE(£ 14000), wish you will.

Well..Congrats..LacLongQuan..your last year heh
getting your bachelor? are you going for the master too?
What school are you going though?
Yup it's my bachelor. I'm still deciding whether to do an extra year of Honours or maybe just go and get a job to support my family. It's not the norm in Australia to go straight to master though, employers here are more concerned with experience than how far in tertiary education you've achieved.

I'm studying at the University of Technology, Sydney majorings in Banking and Finance and submajor in Business Law. Pretty interested in Economics though but it's not that popular at UTS.

Cheers

To LacLongQuang

Although you cannot provide any supports for your facts. I will give you the benefit of the doubt and agree that big infrastructure projects in Saigon will give a higher rate of return on investment per capita basis. So let’s say that the government allocates more resources to Saigon for big projects to fulfill its economic potential as you would want to.
Then Vietnam’s GDP growth rate will be higher. However, only Saigon and the surrounding Southern provinces benefit from this economic growth. This of course means a widening gap of income between the South and other parts of the country.

Now, here are the reasons why a widening gap of income which translates to inequality will be bad for Vietnam in the long-term.

#1 – The majority of the low income individuals will have more difficulty in qualifying for loans or access to other types of credits. If the poor cannot get access to capital they will less likely be able to educate their children, or have money to start their own businesses. Moreover, inequality is bad for the domestic industries, since a strong middle class usually spend more money on domestic goods and services. The rich however, typically spend their money on imported goods, travel abroad, send their kids overseas for education. One can say there’ll be capital flights out of Vietnam.

#2 – There will be inefficiency in asset allocation, the rich will have more political bargaining power and more influence on investments gathering to their needs. This comes with an expense to the poor folks and deepens their misery.

#3 – It’s just unfair.

All the above eventually will undermine social stability and solidarity between the North, Central and the South. I don’t know about you, but for me social stability plays a very important role in long-term sustainable economic growth.

Those are just my thoughts, please let me know what you think. I’d really like to see the point of views from a student of economic on this matter.

Latez

London, that's a good choice.
I went there for my Christmas holiday. I love the place particularly the old buildings, you don't get to see those in Toronto. The winter climate is so much better than Canada. I was surprised to see some sort of palm trees in Regent Park.

I am looking forward to go back there again this Christmas. Who knows I might even just relocate their eventually hehe....

Gơod points Mạnh Tiến...i'll think about that

(@tq: since you created this thread i think you should come back to original post and RENAME this tread to something something about the economic differentces betwêen North Central and South....not being sarcastic but since this is an interesting topic and beside the discussion kinda drifted away form the original topic a long long time ago....)

To LacLongQuang

Although you cannot provide any supports for your facts. I will give you the benefit of the doubt and agree that big infrastructure projects in Saigon will give a higher rate of return on investment per capita basis. So let’s say that the government allocates more resources to Saigon for big projects to fulfill its economic potential as you would want to.
Then Vietnam’s GDP growth rate will be higher. However, only Saigon and the surrounding Southern provinces benefit from this economic growth. This of course means a widening gap of income between the South and other parts of the country.

Now, here are the reasons why a widening gap of income which translates to inequality will be bad for Vietnam in the long-term.

#1 – The majority of the low income individuals will have more difficulty in qualifying for loans or access to other types of credits. If the poor cannot get access to capital they will less likely be able to educate their children, or have money to start their own businesses. Moreover, inequality is bad for the domestic industries, since a strong middle class usually spend more money on domestic goods and services. The rich however, typically spend their money on imported goods, travel abroad, send their kids overseas for education. One can say there’ll be capital flights out of Vietnam.

#2 – There will be inefficiency in asset allocation, the rich will have more political bargaining power and more influence on investments gathering to their needs. This comes with an expense to the poor folks and deepens their misery.

#3 – It’s just unfair.

All the above eventually will undermine social stability and solidarity between the North, Central and the South. I don’t know about you, but for me social stability plays a very important role in long-term sustainable economic growth.

Those are just my thoughts, please let me know what you think. I’d really like to see the point of views from a student of economic on this matter.

Latez

I'm not proposing that all the projects should be built in the South. All I'm asking is for a more equal distribution/allocation according to needs. What I'm seeing from the government is basically neglecting the south while bolstering the north, and all this is against the nation's best economic interests.

It's not in the interest of Vietnam to hold the south back and trying to prop up the north even though international investors are not that interested in the north.

And building those infrastructures/public facilities enhance Vietnam's competitiveness, production output and economic growth. It has got nothing to do with making the rich richer and the poor poorer. Building roads, bridges and various other public projects will create jobs for the poor and the unemployed through foreign investments and domestic investments.

I think you don't understand the implication and the importance of public spending on "Co so ha tang" very much.

I'm a capitalist by nature and I think money should be spent wisely where it is most beneficial for the purpose of utility maximisation (as economists would put it). I don't mind the north building those projects but I hope they are for good economic purposes and won't become white elephants later.

Gơod points Mạnh Tiến...i'll think about that

(@tq: since you created this thread i think you should come back to original post and RENAME this tread to something something about the economic differentces betwêen North Central and South....not being sarcastic but since this is an interesting topic and beside the discussion kinda drifted away form the original topic a long long time ago....)

But that isn´t possible to rename the topic!?

----------------
Public transit gets smart with card
For ease of management, busses in Hanoi will start using smart-cards by next month, said Tran Hung Tuan, Director of the Urban Traffic Management Board in Hanoi.
The city’s two most crowded, lengthy routes, No 32 (Giap Bat – Nhon) and No 34 (My Dinh – Gia Lam), have been operating under a pilot project to test the cards. Both routes currently have 50 buses in operation.

The EUR100,000 smart-card pilot is an important part of the ASIA TRANS project financed by the European Union. Card price for riders is expected to be from VND40,000 to 50,000.

However, the Vietnamese transit system is negotiating to produce a lower-cost version locally. On the pilot routes, buses will be installed with card-reader devices and connected with the Central Urban Traffic Management Board.

Statistics from the Hanoi Department for Transport and Urban Public Works show that in 2000 there were 10mil riders on the transit system. This figure jumped to 285mil in 2004.

The Government currently subsidises about VND10bil per year for city busses.

by vnn.vn

I'll take a foundation course for the first year in London,then apply to an university....hope it will be LSE :)
Yes it's quite a thrill travelling and study there...but perfect place to study i think..well there's no many things to do hahah...Do you think the US/Canada sound more interesthing for Viet students....but i and my family have chosen,and the scholarship...na...

congratulation!

but before ya think everything will be paradise like most vietnamese when they hear about oversea countries.
I just wanted to bring you back to reality and prepare the days ahead.
I'm did counseling for foreign students from oversea.....and monsoon I have to break it to you ........the number of foreign students that first entered the programs only 1/3 or 1/4 of them will likely to survive through the entire schooling.
lots of them CHinese, Korean, Japanese, (thank God no Vietnamese) came to me, some of them broke down, because they couldn't keep up with the livestyle, the school works, missing home. But mainly English, somehow I'm very surprised that many Vietnamese students had the same struggles, yet they pulled through, with all the essays, written and oral exams. I hope you do well too.......be prepared don't think life will be good and rosey like many students

Thank you,bang for sharing these experiences!I know the first year will be tough...i'm not ready for all the challenges and obstacles,really but i'm aware of them.Personally,i never think that living abroad would be heavenly,even when i think i can get on well with lifestyle....the paradise is always here,under this roof with my parents :D just hope i can get over the school works,u know,i'm lazy and forgetful by nature.... :ohno:

But that isn´t possible to rename the topic!?



nah just my opinion...but i though it can be renamed, since you are the starter of this tread you can go back and EDIT..then change the name under the title?...i though this is possible?


but then never mind..i noted LacLongQuan already opened a thread for Vietnam's infrastructure...

I'm somewhat considered native to Australia and I've had the experience of working with overseas students over the years doing assignments as part of my uni years and I must say that it's a very big mistake in the first place for them to travel to a foreign country without even knowing the basic skill, the language of that country. I saw many foreign students struggled and alot of them failed because of inadequate English skill, which is the main reason why many didn't manage to pass their exams. Also, the way of life over here is vastly different and many would feel lonely and isolated.

At times I was very frustrated having to work with overseas students on major projects (which I stopped working with them after the first year) because they tend to free ride and expect you to do everything for them. I know there's the language barrier but it just won't be tolerated.

So before going overseas to study, make sure you're adequately equipped for your new life and don't just come over to pay hefty fees and then fail.

I'm not proposing that all the projects should be built in the South. All I'm asking is for a more equal distribution/allocation according to needs.

I have pointed out on my first post that the South is the most developed region in Vietnam now. Actually, I think we all can agree on that it has always been the case, and will continue to be so for the future. If the situation is vice versa; that is, the North is more developed, and the government continues to allocate more resources to the North. I would be against that policy.

What I'm seeing from the government is basically neglecting the south while bolstering the north, and all this is against the nation's best economic interests.

Explain how it’s being neglected when it’s doing so well?

It's not in the interest of Vietnam to hold the south back and trying to prop up the north even though international investors are not that interested in the north.

Saigon has been given more autonomy than any other cities in Vietnam in approving big investment projects, up to $40 million I think. I think it has also been given more autonomy in raising capitals for public projects through bond offerings etc…(anyone correct me on this if I am wrong). Of course, this also means that it has to go on its own to raise capitals for some projects. However, I would say this is something very good for Saigon; it will be less constrained by the bureaucracy of the Central Government in taking charge of its economic needs. In fact, I’d like to see the Central Government giving more autonomy to other cities/provinces as well.

Tell me why investors should not be interested in the North? I would really like to see a few examples in which the government discourages companies to invest in Saigon/the South.

Here’s a hypothetical scenario. An investor let’s say Canon wants to build a $50 million plant in Saigon. But the government wants it to be built in the Northern province Bac Ninh, where the income level is of course lower than Saigon. There are likely two outcomes:

One, Canon doesn’t like the idea because it doesn’t meet their objectives. Do you think they would listen to the Government? (I think you can agree with me that it’s unwise to invest in something that doesn’t meet your objectives.) Of course Canon doesn’t want to, and threatens to pull out. Do you think the Viet Government would still insist Canon to build the plant in Bac Ninh?

Two, Canon goes with the idea to build in Bac Ninh. Although less preferable than Saigon for whatever reasons, but they wouldn’t do so if it doesn’t meet their objectives. Talking about utility maximization, since Bac Ninh is less developed than Saigon; then doesn’t it mean Canon’s investment in that province would yield a higher utility than in Saigon. Isn’t this better for Vietnam as a whole?

And building those infrastructures/public facilities enhance Vietnam's competitiveness, production output and economic growth. It has got nothing to do with making the rich richer and the poor poorer. Building roads, bridges and various other public projects will create jobs for the poor and the unemployed through foreign investments and domestic investments.

Again, if one region is more developed, has a higher income than the others, and the government continues to bolster that developed region with infrastructures projects. Investments will be pouring into the more developed region instead of the less developed ones. I don’t think I need to say again what will happen to the less developed regions, while the more developed one is zooming ahead with prosperity. It’s against a nation’s interest to reach a level where 20% of the population earn more than 80% of the population.

I think you don't understand the implication and the importance of public spending on "Co so ha tang" very much.

That’s a very fine example on criticising the person instead of the argument. Anyway, I don’t want to go further into this. I’d rather see more convincing arguments on your part why Saigon is being neglected with good examples to support it.


I'm a capitalist by nature and I think money should be spent wisely where it is most beneficial for the purpose of utility maximisation (as economists would put it). I don't mind the north building those projects but I hope they are for good economic purposes and won't become white elephants later.

I read in the news that this year’s ODA for Vietnam is at a record high, $3.4 billion. This for me is a sign of confidence by the donors that Vietnam has made good used of ODAs for projects in the past. Don’t you think that they are in a better position than we in determining whether the government invest in good projects or not?

-----
A final thought, as repetitious it sound on my part. Again, I don’t think that Saigon is being neglected; quite the contrary it has been given more autonomy to maximize its strength. It’s in the nation’s interest to have all regions to be equally developed whenever possible. This can be done by spreading out investments of infrastructure projects to the less developed regions. If you look at the developed countries, there are much less inequality than in developing countries. You wouldn’t want to see Vietnam taking the direction of South America, where all the wealth are concentrated in one or two big cities in a country, while all the others suffer. Insofar there’s no evidence that projects in the North turned out to be white elephants, quite the contrary they contributed to Vietnam’s economic development by reducing poverty, providing more employments, and investments (World Bank report on my first post). This is also being supported through the ODA donors’ confidence by increasing their aid to a record high of $3.4 billion.

I think I have said too much. This is my last post on this topic.

Latez, Everyone.

By the way, HCMC has more foreign investemts but Hanoi´s total foreign inv was much higher in 2004.

current situtation:
..."Localities, Hanoi takes the lead in terms of FDI attraction (62.9 per cent of new FDI), followed by Dong Nai and Ho Chi Minh City."...
http://vibforum.vcci.com.vn/the_news.asp?idnews=1565

..."Hanoi took the lead with more than US$824 million."...
http://www.bvom.com/news/english/news/index.asp?.sequence=30816&.this=55

http://www.hapi.gov.vn/portals/default.aspx?portalid=5&tabid=71&newsid=870
http://www.saigontimesweekly.saigonnet.vn/issue21/vietnam_this_week.htm
http://www.vov.org.vn/2005_05_18/english/kinhte1.htm

I have pointed out on my first post that the South is the most developed region in Vietnam now. Actually, I think we all can agree on that it has always been the case, and will continue to be so for the future. If the situation is vice versa; that is, the North is more developed, and the government continues to allocate more resources to the North. I would be against that policy.

Explain how it’s being neglected when it’s doing so well?

The South is the most developed is not by pure luck, it's through the hardworking of the Saigonese and through the support of overseas Vietnamese who fled this repressive regime. Although Saigon is more developed now, it won't be so for long because most of the infrastructure projects are going to Hanoi. A bridge to cross Thu Thiem, although vital as it is, took more than 10 years for it to be realised and another few more years to be built. That's the snail pace development that you see in Saigon. Hanoi on the other hand is having all her projects fast tracked and all comes with hefty price tags.

That really explains why the south is being neglected.

Saigon has been given more autonomy than any other cities in Vietnam in approving big investment projects, up to $40 million I think. I think it has also been given more autonomy in raising capitals for public projects through bond offerings etc…(anyone correct me on this if I am wrong). Of course, this also means that it has to go on its own to raise capitals for some projects. However, I would say this is something very good for Saigon; it will be less constrained by the bureaucracy of the Central Government in taking charge of its economic needs. In fact, I’d like to see the Central Government giving more autonomy to other cities/provinces as well.

Tell me why investors should not be interested in the North? I would really like to see a few examples in which the government discourages companies to invest in Saigon/the South.

LOL $40 million? You think? The last time I heard it's only $10 million. Give me a break, Saigon is more bureaucratically constrained than Hanoi. Hanoi even have the state's tactic support and the government actively encourages foreign investors to abandon Saigon for Hanoi. Here is an example:

"Executives at Nike said the Vietnamese government regularly encourages the company to shift manufacturing to the north. Among other things, such a move would stem the tide of migration to Ho Chi Minh City, which has become dangerously overcrowded in recent years. But Chris Helzer, Nike's director of government affairs in Vietnam, said, "To build a factory up north would present problems that would be difficult to overcome." Vietnamese officials are well aware of the north's poor reputation among foreign investors. They explain it as a vestige of Vietnam's history, in which the south was exposed to the capitalism of the United States while the north languished in the orbit of the Soviet Union. Over time, they insist, northern officials will shed old habits. "
taken from http://home.att.net/~r.hodgeman/vietnam2.html

Here’s a hypothetical scenario. An investor let’s say Canon wants to build a $50 million plant in Saigon. But the government wants it to be built in the Northern province Bac Ninh, where the income level is of course lower than Saigon. There are likely two outcomes:

One, Canon doesn’t like the idea because it doesn’t meet their objectives. Do you think they would listen to the Government? (I think you can agree with me that it’s unwise to invest in something that doesn’t meet your objectives.) Of course Canon doesn’t want to, and threatens to pull out. Do you think the Viet Government would still insist Canon to build the plant in Bac Ninh?

Two, Canon goes with the idea to build in Bac Ninh. Although less preferable than Saigon for whatever reasons, but they wouldn’t do so if it doesn’t meet their objectives. Talking about utility maximization, since Bac Ninh is less developed than Saigon; then doesn’t it mean Canon’s investment in that province would yield a higher utility than in Saigon. Isn’t this better for Vietnam as a whole?


Funny that you fail to account for the fact that the government will give preferential tax and land concessions to lure those investments away at the south's expense. Why do you think Hanoi attracted so much investment this year? Because Hanoi is more competitive than Saigon and possess a bigger consumer base? Or is it at the heart of the international transport route?

Utility maximisation depends on a number of factors, such as whether the area is closer to the consumer base, the ease of transportation and the productivity of the workers among other things.

Again, if one region is more developed, has a higher income than the others, and the government continues to bolster that developed region with infrastructures projects. Investments will be pouring into the more developed region instead of the less developed ones. I don’t think I need to say again what will happen to the less developed regions, while the more developed one is zooming ahead with prosperity. It’s against a nation’s interest to reach a level where 20% of the population earn more than 80% of the population.

If one region is more developed than another, SO LET IT BE. Why do you think Congo, with cheaper labour and set up costs doesn't attract as much investment as, say, China for example?

Then why is it that the government neglect Saigon's infrastructure needs and bolster Hanoi's infrastructure even though it is of less urgency and of lesser economic benefit?

The strong survives and the weak perish, that is how capitalism work. There is no point propping up Hanoi at the expense of Saigon and in the end the whole country will suffer. A developed and economically strong Saigon will result in it's wealth trickling down to nearby provinces and the whole country.

I read in the news that this year’s ODA for Vietnam is at a record high, $3.4 billion. This for me is a sign of confidence by the donors that Vietnam has made good used of ODAs for projects in the past. Don’t you think that they are in a better position than we in determining whether the government invest in good projects or not?

Yeah and instead of it being spent wisely and fairly, most of the ODA instead goes to developing the north and beautify Hanoi at the expense of the central, Saigon and the Mekong delta. Yes those donors are so wise that they give money to Cambodia only to be pocketed by Hun Sen and his cronies, or various other African nations only to be siphoned off by the dictators. Same situation with Vietnam, the money, instead of being distributed according to need, is siphoned off by the north to beautify the capital city and into the pockets of the corrupted communist son of b!tches.


PEACE

hehehe manhtien and laclongquan
I miss this kind of debate in highschool

but here's from my point of view:
I used to think exactly like laclongquan.....100% similar
and I disgusted at the way the north trying to be best and take away all the glories........but now I see something else.

I don't agree with everything they do....... but I think it's good that they balancing out the economy in the country.
Comes to think of it, it's a good thing that they do. Because I don't want Saigon to be the Meca of economic concentration and attracts millions of poor people from all over the country comming to this city. If you visit saigon now you'll see north, south, central dialects are being spoken...(things weren't like that when I'm a 6-7-8 yr old kid living there) .I say it's nice, but I don't want to arrive to the airport, a hotel or a shopping mall in Saigon and greeted by a person with a northern or a central accent........likewise I don't want to come to Hue or Hanoi and first greeted by someone with a southern accent.
If everything good and powerful is concentrated in Saigon, believe me...... crimes rate, the poors, the homeless and begars are all over the city.
take Soeul Korea for example every damn thing is focused and concentrated in Soeul, I don't have the exact percentage, but about 60-80% of the economy of south korea is generated in Soeul. This left many regions stayed underdeveloped and poor......and currently Soeul has gotten so big and difficult for the adminstrative bureaucrats to handle that they had to propose a plan to move the capital to another city.
So I'm very happy to see small cities are growing in Vietnam not just saigon or Hanoi, now Da Nang, Vung Tau, Haiphong, Ha Long, Can Tho, Nam DInh, Hai DUong, Lao Cai, all got 20 storeys buildings underconstruction and plans
Let Hanoi be strong and powerful and take some of the poor farmers comming to the city seeking for jobs from the North.
Let Da Nang , Nha Trang be strong and powerful and take some of the poor people from the central.
so these poor people won't have to travel wide and far and flooded Saigon.
Let Saigon deal with the poor people in the southern regions, the mekong delta.

I say Thai land is doing a good job at this, instead of open the past SEA Games in Bangkok where all the infrastructures are ready and availble, they however openedthe Sea Games in Chiang Mai and started building there and bring tourism and investment to Chiang Mai and turned that place from a poor town to the Chiang Mai ya see today.

Hey look at another perspective, if another hiroshima bomb or terrorists from the middle east come and destroy Saigon, we still got Hanoi, and Da Nang and Can Tho, and many many more places

You're missing the point. I'm not advocating for the Saigon to be the primate city of Vietnam. All I'm simply wishing for is that the government would distribute the funds for development equally and on a basis of need, not beautifying Hanoi just for the sake of it being the capital while many of Saigon's roads, bridges and canals are in a discrepit state. You look at Hanoi, they're building infrastructures spanning out further than Hanoi metropolitan itself and links it with other localities far away. But look at Saigon, as soon as you're out of the main districts and the city looks like a dump. Even the city itself is lacking many vital infrastructures that would otherwise improve the quality of life of the Saigonese.

overview of the most important infrastructure-projects in Hanoi:
http://www.hapi.gov.vn/portals/default.aspx?portalid=5&tabid=82&ctl=list&data=field&fieldid=5

Vietnam’s capital Hanoi has spent tens of millions of dollars to restructure its traffic network to improve road safety, but the project has proved a complete failure.
The city pumped in US$24 million, received from the World Bank, to restructure traffic conditions in many roads in the downtown area, install stoplights, and purchase equipment for traffic police.

However, according to observers, the project was possibly the most wasteful in the capital’s traffic-related efforts as it has not only failed to improve things but actually worsened traffic conditions.

Even before the project started, the local traffic police department had warned the Hanoi Department of Communication and Public Works (DCOW), the project initiator, that traffic conditions were still okay, and there was no need for restructuring. But the DCOW ignored the advice.

The DCOW’s approach to restructuring traffic involved building concrete medians down the center of many downtown roads, putting up traffic circles, and earmarking separate lanes for two-wheelers and motor vehicles.

But the median strips and traffic circles only served to narrow the roads, leading to more traffic jams and accidents, the observers said.

The separate lanes have not worked well either since bicycles and motor vehicles still encroach on each other’s lanes.

Earlier, the Ministry of Transportation too had warned the DCOW against making the changes, saying the structure of inner city roads must be uniform.

Waste

The DCOW purchased 20 250cc Honda-Rebel motorbikes at a cost of $125,800 for traffic police patrols.

But policemen have refused to use the bikes as they do not suit the requirements and are too short.

“The bikes should be used for traveling for pleasure instead of patrol work,” they said. Thus, the $125,800-worth vehicles have remained unused so far.

The DCOW also spent $2.5 million to replace traffic lights. Dozens of lights that had been working perfectly well were pulled out and replaced with new ones.

But, ironically, while other provinces in the country are switching to modern traffic lights with digital numbers, the DCOW spent the money to put up old-style ones.


by thanhniennews.com

...

Construction work began April 30 on the Nga Tu So road junction project in Hanoi.

The Nga Tu So junction, part of a project to develop urban traffic routes in Hanoi, will be built at a total investment of nearly VND1,140bil from the Japanese Government's official Development Assistance and Respondent Capital of Vietnam.

The project involves the Japanese Bridge and Structure Institute (JBSI), Loios Nerger of the US, BRITEC, Sumitomo-Mitsui (Japan) and the Vietnam Construction Import Export Corporation, Vinaconex. It will be built in 16 months, intended to ease congestion in Hanoi's southwest area.

Speaking at the groundbreaking, Deputy Prime Minister Pham Gia Khiem thanked the Japanese Government for its assistance and expressed his hope that the two countries would further promote cooperation

source: vnn.vn

Nga Tu So

http://img281.imageshack.us/img281/2281/25805289ny.jpg
http://img281.imageshack.us/img281/6329/25805113oj.jpg
http://img281.imageshack.us/img281/8995/25805123xj.jpg
http://img281.imageshack.us/img281/9489/25805140fe.jpg
http://img281.imageshack.us/img281/2963/25805156vo.jpg

(taken on august 05)

(c) TQ Tuan

im some of the pictures it seemed they are rebuilding the entire housing sections...if this is the case then why dont they just redesign the whole area..with better layout, scale....cause it seems many houses still have weird areas, shapes

versasin I thought the same too, but all those houses will make sense when you'rr in Vn and standing on the streets of saigon and hanoi. they look bad on pictures I know....but they look attractive when you're actually in the city.

hey I just noticed laclongquan is banned why is that? no wonder I didn't see him in a long time

oh him..didnt he was acused of being the same one as saigonese?

http://www.hanoimoi.com.vn/images/original/2005/12/200512261500592_Ngatuso.jpg
Mô hình cầu vượt trong dự án cải tạo Ngã Tư Sở của Hà Nội

http://www.hanoimoi.com.vn/vn/14/70550/

Hanoi has floated four broad solutions to the city's traffic problems in the hopes of easing the burdens on the city's transportation infrastructure and regaining some semblance of traffic order.

The plan comes at a time when Hanoi's traffic problems have reached an alarming level. Traffic jams have become commonplace in many major intersections, and the city is hampered with a system of outdated and narrow streets at a time when the number of vehicles in circulation keeps rising.

By November last year, about 162,850 cars, 1.5 million motorbikes and 1 million bicycles were running on Hanoi streets. The number of cars and motorbikes has been increasing by 12-15 percent a year. Over 60 percent of Hanoi residents use motorbikes as their main means of transport, and 5.8 percent go by car, while only 19.6 percent opt for the bus.

Hanoi's plan for the development of transport through 2020, an approval that lays a foundation for allocating funds to road construction, has been approved.

Under the plan, the city would be able to build a better network of roads that separates traffic flow and reduces the number of congested intersections.

In the short term, Hanoi would also concentrate on building a number of peripheral roads to route traffic around the city, for example, the section between Chui bridge and Duong bridge, Road 32, the section between O Dong Mac and Nguyen Khoai dyke and the Trung Tu-O Cho Dua-Giang Vo-Cau Giay section.

The city would also speed up the building of overpasses in such locations as Nga Tu So, Kim Lien, Nhat Tan bridge, Thanh Tri and an expanded leg of Highway 5.

Mass transit systems such as additional bus service, a subway and an elevated train would also be developed.

The city would also experiment with ways to reduce the number of vehicles in circulation at peak hours. Some one-way routes would be used for different means of transport, segregating cars and motorbikes, and, for the first time, separate routes for buses would be tried on a pilot basis.

The city would install more traffic lights in order to regulate traffic and minimise accidents. This year alone, in the time leading up to the Tet (Lunar New Year) festival, 10 more traffic signals would be installed across the city.

The city's second solution focused on administrative penalties for traffic violations. The city would increase fines for violations, issue incentives for use of buses, discourage the use of personal means of transport, and encourage local authorities to bear more responsibility for traffic situations in their areas.

Third, the city should revise vehicle ownership regulations, taxing the use of private means of transport. Road tolls could be applied in areas subject to traffic jams.

Finally, the city would increase public awareness and education about traffic rules and road safety, especially among students. Young people should be actively discouraged from driving motorbikes until they have reached the age to acquire a drivers' licence.

Tran Danh Loi, Deputy Director of the Department of Transport and Public Works, said the city would also put forward other solutions regarding staggering the work hours of offices and schools in the city, relocating bus stops and stations, and banning outdated vehicles.



(Source: VNA)

source: Đình Thắng (Tiền Phong)

Bộ trưởng Bộ GTVT- Đào Đình Bình đã đồng ý phương án xây dựng tuyến đường sắt (1 trong 8 tuyến đường nội thị đã được TP. Hà Nội quy hoạch) chuyên chở hành khách đi đường hàng không, theo tư vấn của Bộ Kinh tế - Thương mại và Công nghiệp Nhật Bản (METI).

Theo đó, METI sẽ phói hợp với Cục Đường sắt VN, Cục Hàng không VN và Tổng công ty Đường sắt VN để thống nhất các vấn đề có liên quan như tiêu chuẩn kỹ thuật của đường đô thị về kết cấu hạ tầng, đầu máy, toa xe và khoảng cách giữa các ga; mức tổng đầu tư của dự án.

Dự kiến, tuyến đường sắt này sẽ tạo điều kiện thuận lợi nhất trong phục vụ hành khách đi máy bay di chuyển từ trung tâm Hà Nội ra sân bay Nội Bài và ngược lại.

http://ashui.com/chitiet.php?k=1&d=20060227170924
This is a good news.. :)