MONTRÉAL | Public Transport [Archive]

hkskyline

September 11th, 2005, 02:52 AM

A system in need of major surgery: Our metro stations and trains urgently require an injection of $2.6 billion.
The green-line cars, in particular, are so old they need to be replaced before breakdowns and maintenance costs soar
10 September 2005
Montreal Gazette

When Montreal's rubber-tire metro made its debut in 1966, it was fast, quiet - and a sophisticated addition to a city on the cusp of staging the world's fair.

OK, so it was sweltering at first inside the cars and a few people fainted because of an ill-conceived ventilation system.

But it still won over many Montrealers like Robert Humphreys, whose first impression when he zipped along in the metro was: "Wow."

"We were all just enthralled with it at the time," said Humphreys, 64, now semi-retired. "So even if there were little mistakes, you never noticed them. You were more forgiving."

Next year, the metro turns 40. It won't be "the new 30." Signs of creeping age can be seen - and even felt, in the case of travelling on Line 1, the green line, when your body sometimes shakes uncontrollably as the train heads east from Lionel Groulx. (The vibrations are the result of tires wearing out and an old suspension on the green-line cars.)

Maintenance costs are rising and the entire metro fleet is old - the MR-63 cars on the green line are almost 40 years old.

In an industry where subway cars start being replaced after 30 years, the average age of the MTC's fleet is about 32 years - more than double that of the Toronto Transit Commission's fleet, with an average age of about 14.

Even if Quebec gives the go-ahead immediately to replace the MR-63s, with tenders and test runs, the last of them probably wouldn't be withdrawn from service until about 2013 - at the age of 47, said Carl Desrosiers, executive director of the MTC's metro network. And spare parts will be impossible to find by then, he said.

While safety won't be a problem because of the metro's fail-safe system, Desrosiers said the maintenance costs will explode and there is a risk the number of breakdowns will increase.

"What we say is if we move right away, there won't be a crisis," he said. "It will go well. But if we stretch it out, then we'll have a reliability problem."

Some key upgrades of the metro's aging infrastructure are already under way. In fact, the 66-kilometre network is undergoing the mother of all facelifts and some extensive surgery. A new control centre, 43 new escalators - more reliable ones, the MTC promises - and a new public-address system with clearer sound are part of the $311-million Phase 1 renovations, scheduled to end next year.

If the proposed second and third phases receive funding, the metro will get a new signalling system, countless kilometres of new fibre-optic cables and numerous other upgrades.

"I would say to you we're rebuilding (the metro)," said Desrosiers, who is scheduled to speak about transit technology at the MetroRail 2005 international transit conference in Miami, Dec. 5 to 7. "It's a bit like an old car where you start to change a part - you have to change almost all of them."

The hefty price tag for all the work under way and on the MTC's metro wish list is almost $2.6 billion over 10 years, including about $1.1 billion for 336 new metro cars.

The renovations are important, but the cars are vital, said Marvin Rotrand, vice-chairperson of the MTC's board of directors. "You can't have a wonderful system and non-functioning rolling stock."

For now, at least, the MTC wants to replace the oldest cars in its fleet, the 336 MR-63 cars, which operate on the green line and are the same age as the metro. The matter is being studied by the Quebec government.

"Without knowing anything about it, except for my general experience, they're pushing the envelope on age," said David Gunn, a well-known veteran of the transit industry who has run subway systems in New York, Toronto, Washington and Philadelphia.

Now president of Amtrak, Gunn said the 30-year life of subway cars can be extended through diligent maintenance and by heavily overhauling them at a key point. He noted, for instance, that London's Underground has cars that are over 50 years old on the Circle and District lines that work pretty well. Still, Gunn said, in a heavily travelled system like Montreal or Toronto, "by the time a car has reached 35, 40 years, they are getting very tired."

"There is a point that it becomes extremely expensive, and it's difficult to keep them operating."

Gunn suggests the MTC get an option to replace its MR-73 cars that run on the orange, blue and yellow lines. Built by Bombardier, the 423 MR-73 cars are 28 to 30 years old, making them slightly younger than the TTC's oldest subway cars.

Desrosiers said the MTC will certainly study the idea.

"It would make sense to say we'll raise an option within five years to have the same cars," he said, noting it costs about $50 million to start up a production.

So where will all the money come from?

Last year, the MTC and the Quebec Department of Transport undertook a joint study to see what would be the best way to finance the new cars, said Claude Dauphin, chairperson of the MTC's board. They looked at different options, including leasing cars, he said.

"They are aware of the urgency, and I'm convinced that they will go to the Treasury Board soon with that."

Under the recent federal-provincial gasoline tax revenue agreement, Montreal is slated to receive $657 million in infrastructure money, of which $367 million over five years would go to public transit.

"It won't solve everything, but at least it's amounts of money that we didn't have before," Dauphin said.

He suggests that more federal money, in addition to provincial funding, will be needed for Phase 2 and 3 of the metro renovation program, called Reno-Systemes. Ottawa invested in Montreal's metro for the first time during Phase 1, covering about 30 per cent of the costs, with Quebec picking up 45 per cent and the MTC and Metropolitan Transit Agency 12.5 per cent each.

For Phase 2, the MTC's Dauphin said he believes it is a matter of weeks or months before Quebec issues the final authorization.

Dauphin does not foresee commuters having to help offset the infrastructure investments through a fare hike.

"Users did their share in my opinion in the past four years," he said. "We had a lot of fare increases, but now they need a break."

Murtaza Haider, an assistant professor in McGill University's engineering faculty, questions why the provincial government decided to "throw away" $800 million on the metro extension to Laval, knowing the scale of investment that was needed to upgrade the existing system. "Why didn't they spend money on this rather than building an extension that almost no one on the island of Montreal will use?"

- - -

Last December, the metro system shut down temporarily when the internal telephone system, which is the same age as the metro, broke down for 80 minutes. Fortunately, they had spare parts from eastern Europe, said Desrosiers, because there aren't any such systems in North America anymore. (The telephone system is being replaced as part of the Phase 1 renovations.)

In June, a large section of the metro network was shut down for most of the workday after a cable under a platform caught fire at the Sherbrooke metro station and spread to other cables.

- - -

Robert Bergeron contends that 20 years ago metro riders never gave a thought to a system malfunction and were surprised when it happened. "Today, we expect a breakdown," said Bergeron, leader of the Projet Montreal municipal party. "See how it has changed in the minds of users?"

Desrosiers said the metro had an excellent year in 2004 when the number of rolling stock breakdowns dropped from 2003. However, so far this year, the rolling stock has broken down more than in 2004 for the corresponding period.

More malfunctions occur with the green-line cars. With their original motors from 1966, MR-63 cars travel about 170,000 kilometres between breakdowns, which Desrosiers said meets international standards. "We're still at that level, except that it's going down 10,000 kilometres a year."

By comparison, the younger MR-73 cars go more than double the distance of green-line cars - 350,000 kilometres - between breakdowns. The MTC's maintenance costs for rolling stock have risen from $28.6 million in 2000 to $35.3 million in 2004.

In Toronto, Rick Cornacchia, the deputy general manager, subway operations at the TTC, says their new subway cars are three times more reliable than their older cars. "That's the kind of benefit you really do get for the customers," he said.

Ridership on public transit in Montreal remains high. In fact, the public transit lobby group Canadian Urban Transit Association says it believes Montreal has the highest ridership per capita in North America. About 367,000 people here use the bus and metro system daily, according to a recent survey by the Metropolitan Transit Agency.

"It's still one of the world's good metro systems - reliable and safe," Dauphin insisted.

For coverage and service, Haider calls it one of the world's best systems. "It works very well. It's the envy of most North American operators, with the exception of Toronto, which is very exceptional," he said.

The Railway Technology Strategy Centre at Imperial College in London does benchmarking for 23 subway systems in the world, including the MTC and those in New York, London, Paris and Toronto.

The centre examines such elements as service, efficiency and covering costs, said Richard Anderson, the managing associate.

According to 2003 data, he said, the MTC metro cars, largely because they are well maintained, are among the most reliable of the systems the centre looks at in Europe and North America.

Desrosiers calls the MR-73 cars more reliable than most trains in North America and says they have kept the workhorse MR-63s in great shape through meticulous maintenance.

"Normally, a 39-year-old car is decrepit," he said.

Timeline: in 1966, Fanfare and a 20-Cent Ride

Oct. 14, 1966 : The Montreal metro is born. It consists of Line 1 - Atwater to Frontenac (the Beaudry and Frontenac stations opened two months later) - and Line 2, Henri Bourassa to Place d'Armes.

The fare is 20 cents.

February 1967: The Square Victoria and Bonaventure stations open.

Line 4 is launched from Berri de Montigny to Longueuil.

April 1967: The Ile Ste. Helene station opens in the nick of time on April 28 - the same day Expo '67 kicks off.

March 3, 1971: The metro runs all night for the first time during the so-called storm of the century.

(Seventeen people died in the blizzard.)

Dec. 9, 1971: Train driver dies when his train slams into a stationary one and catches fire at a switching area north of the Henri Bourassa station. The fire destroys 27 cars and a metro garage, causing $7 million in damage.

Jan. 23, 1974: About 1,200 metro riders escape a smoke-filled tunnel between the Laurier and Rosemont stations after a series of tire blowouts started a fire. The blaze destroys the nine-car train. No one is injured.

The metro subsequently underwent a series of safety improvements after an inquiry recommended nearly $70 million worth of changes. They included installing emergency power generators, additional fire extinguishers and improving communications.

Reflecting on those changes, former MUCTC board member Abe Limonchik told The Gazette in 1987: "It was a fortune, but the overhaul was done and Montreal now has one of the safest subways in the world."

1976: Line 1, the green line, is extended to Honore Beaugrand. An automatic train control system is launched on the line later that year. Among other things, the computerized system ensures adequate space between two trains on the network. The new fail-safe system was introduced mainly because of the 1971 accident. Carl Desrosiers, head of the MTC's metro network, said the system, which was avant-garde at the time, has proved to be extremely safe and reliable.

September 1978: The green line is extended to Angrignon.

April 1980: Line 2, the orange line, now extends to Place St. Henri.

September 1981: The orange line reaches the Snowdon station.

1982: The orange line is extended to Cote Ste. Catherine and then the Plamondon station.

January 1984 : The Du College station opens on the orange line.

1986: In June, Line 5, the blue line, is launched from De Castelneau to St. Michel. In October, the orange line is extended to one of its current endpoints - Cote Vertu station.

June 1987: The blue line extends to Parc.

January 1988: The blue line's Snowdon station opens.

June 2002: The Montreal Transit Corp. introduces three prototypes of reconfigured metro cars and seeks the public's feedback, as part of its bid to cope with increased ridership.

Dec. 2004: The internal telephone system, which is the same age as the metro, breaks down for 80 minutes, forcing the metro system to temporarily shut down.

June 20, 2005: Half the metro system is out of service for most of the workday when a cable under a platform catches fire at the Sherbrooke metro station and spreads to other cables.

July 2007: The three metro stations in Laval are expected to open.

hkskyline

September 13th, 2005, 05:43 AM

I've always thought the Metro was very well maintained. There wasn't rust on the ceilings; the stations are clean and spacious.

System 'among the worst' for aged
But improvements are coming for elderly and handicapped
BRENDA BRANSWELL
12 September 2005
Montreal Gazette

One thought haunts Grace Cawley every time she leaves her Longueuil home to travel to work on the metro.

"Is the escalator going to be working? - that's my fear," said Cawley, 64, who has a form of muscular dystrophy.

"And often it isn't."

For Cawley, negotiating a long flight of stairs - up or down - is an arduous process. Her bad knee hurts more going downstairs. Walking up them in the metro, which Cawley has also had to do, poses other problems. "The only thing I can do is rest my muscles for a bit and then go again - it's awful," said Cawley, an X-ray technician.

Cawley finds older people - and she doesn't consider herself one of them yet - are quite fearful about taking the metro. "I don't hear them talking about crime ... it's the physical set-up and the stairs and escalators that don't work."

With an aging population and the first of the baby boomers about to turn 60, concerns about the metro's accessibility are likely to face even more scrutiny in the coming years.

The physical layout also poses headaches for parents with strollers when escalators are out of service. For many disabled people, especially those confined to wheelchairs, the metro is still an impenetrable fortress. Unlike Toronto, where nearly one-third of the subway stations are wheelchair accessible, none of Montreal's 65 stations are so equipped.

Claude Dauphin, the chairperson of the Montreal Transit Corp.'s board, calls the city a pioneer with its wheelchair accessible buses.

When it comes to the metro, however, MTC officials readily acknowledge they lag behind. "We're among the worst," conceded Carl Desrosiers, executive director of the metro network at MTC.

Desrosiers noted that Montreal's youngest metro stations were conceived in the late 1970s and early '80s. At that time, society wasn't as concerned about the issue, he said.

Some improvements are on the horizon. The three new stations in Laval expected to open in July 2007 will be wheelchair accessible.

And Phase 2 of the MTC's $1.5-billion renovation program called Reno-Systemes proposes making six metro stations accessible. (Phase 1, which includes building a new control room, is underway. Phase 2 is waiting for the go-ahead from the Quebec government.)

A working committee that includes representatives for the disabled, the MTC and the Quebec Department of Transport suggested the stations, Dauphin said. They are: Henri Bourassa, Berri-UQAM, Bonaventure, Cote Vertu, Longueuil and Lionel Groulx.

With two superhospitals planned for Montreal, Dauphin suggested Vendome and Champs de Mars should be added to the list.

"It won't solve the problem ... it's the start," says Michael Magnaer, with the Office des personnes handicapes du Quebec. The government agency has been pushing for the metro to be accessible to the disabled for about 20 years now - and not just because it's an amazing transportation system, Magnaer said.

It's also to give them access to the underground city, he said. "From the point of view of a disabled person, it's an ideal place.

"There is no snow, it's easy to get around. ... There are lots of boutiques and stores and all."

It isn't simply a matter of installing elevators, Magnaer added. "It's the whole question of evacuation in the event of a fire, a terrorist attack - anything."

In 2007, Montreal is scheduled to host the 11th International Conference on Mobility and Transport for Elderly and Disabled Persons. Magnaer said he thinks having the event here might pressure the provincial government to act on the issue. Obviously, he said, a conference of that scope "won't hurt the cause."

- - -

Last year, Desrosiers wandered around the metro with his eyes blindfolded, clutching a cane. He did so at the invitation of the Regroupement des aveugles et amblyopes du Montreal metropolitain. The advocacy group has invited MTC officials into the metro to sensitize them to the difficulties faced by visually-impaired riders. Desrosiers experienced first-hand a trouble spot in the Berri-UQAM station caused by echoing sound where buskers played music.

"For a blind person, when there is an echo, they lose their sense of orientation," Desrosiers said. "I tried it and I walked into a wall." (They stopped musicians from playing there, he added.)

Last winter, the group submitted a report to the MTC that evaluated the metro's initial 26 stations. While it has not been made public, Yvon Provencher, a spokesperson for the group, said the major problems involve lighting, signage and inadequate visual markings on stairs and escalators to help orient the visually impaired.

"Henri Bourassa is a problem; it's too dark," Provencher said. Ditto for the Mont Royal station near the turnstiles.

He holds up the Sherbrooke station as a model for its lighting. "Everywhere in the station it's very, very well lit."

The group also wants reflective, textured yellow tiles placed near the edge of train platforms as a warning for visually impaired people.

The MTC, which has approached Quebec for financing, plans to install the tiles in stations as part of Phase 2 of its renovation program, Desrosiers said.

- - -

At the entrance to the McGill metro station, Gaelle Petit is the picture of efficiency. She quickly hoists a stroller over the turnstiles, then coaxes her 21/2-year-old daughter, Mia - resplendent in a purple poncho, jeans and a pink hair-band - into the station.

Mia can walk down the stairs now. But things haven't always been as easy. In the past when an escalator was out of service, Petit had to carry her in the stroller by positioning it on her hip as she walked down the stairs.

"It's quite heavy. It's especially not easy for the back," said Petit, 28.

- - -

At 85, Margaret Dugal still uses the metro every day and likes the system. Of late, when she goes to the Snowdon station, she has had to walk down more than 115 stairs because a new escalator is being installed.

"I don't enjoy it. Very often I have to wait and rest on each landing because I have a cane," said Dugal, who has had a hip and knee replacement.

"For us, it's a major preoccupation," Desrosiers said. "We're not very satisfied with our escalators now. We want them to be more reliable. That's why we're investing."

Phase 1 of the huge renovation program has included the installation of 43 new escalators. Desrosiers said they will be much more dependable than the ones they are replacing. "They are old escalators and we had a series that had a bad design, which were less reliable than the other ones."

He acknowledged they've run into problems with the brand-new escalators - among them the one at Guy-Concordia that Cawley noticed has already been out of service during her daily commute.

As with new trains, Desrosiers said, it's normal to have to iron out bugs with new escalators. "We had several problems. They are almost all solved now, and it will give us an escalator that is quite a bit more reliable."

In Boston, the Massachusetts Bay Transportation Authority has a telephone service that provides people who ride the T with updates on the status of elevators and escalators in subway stations.

With his heart problem, Moe Spanier would certainly like a heads-up about non-functioning escalators before he heads to a metro station.

Spanier, 73, had to walk up the stairs at the Cote Ste. Catherine station a few months ago and got to the top huffing and puffing.

"Why don't they put a sign on the bus telling you that the escalator going up is not working?" he asked.

For her part, Cawley plans to keep taking the metro as long as she can. The first time she called the MTC to complain about escalators not working, Cawley said, they apologized and were "very nice and gracious."

"They actually phoned me about once a year for the next three or four years to see if I thought things had improved much."

And have they?

"Not really," Cawley said with a laugh.

hkskyline

November 25th, 2005, 05:47 AM

Details of Montreal subway on computer of man questioned in Madrid bombings
23 November 2005
The Canadian Press

MADRID, Spain (AP) - Police found detailed data on Spanish trains, a map of the London Underground and information on Montreal's subway system on the personal computer of a Moroccan questioned in the Madrid terror bombings, a Spanish newspaper has reported.

Abdelhak Chergui, a 32-year-old Moroccan who studies telecommunications in Spain, was arrested in May along with his brother, Abdelkhalak

He was questioned by Judge Juan del Olmo, the magistrate leading the investigation of the March 11, 2004, bombings that killed 191 people and wounded more than 1,500 people.

At the time, police said the two were suspected of helping to finance the attacks and providing weapons to people accused of carrying them out.

However, Del Olmo released them for lack of evidence after ordering them to surrender their passports.

Police kept investigating Abdelhak Chergui, and in an examination of his personal computer found detailed information on the Madrid, London and Montreal systems, El Pais reported Monday. It quoted a police report submitted to the judge in September.

Police declined to comment on the newspaper report.

El Pais did not say if Spanish police suspected Chergui of any role in the deadly London terror attacks of July or if Spanish authorities planned to bring him in for more questioning.

The Madrid attacks were claimed by militants who said they acted on al-Qaida's behalf to avenge the presence of Spanish troops in Iraq under then-prime minister Jose Maria Aznar, a conservative.

Socialists led by Jose Luis Rodriguez Zapatero won a general election held three days after the bombings. Zapatero withdrew the troops shortly after taking power.

A total of 26 people are in jail in connection with the Madrid bombings, but around 80 more who were questioned and released are still considered suspects.

systematica

November 26th, 2005, 12:30 AM

Rubber tires require more maintenance than steel wheels, as they wear out faster.

Rubber tires eliminate the rumbling vibrations that shake adjacent buildings. In Toronto, you can hear the subway rumble more than a block away but in Montreal, you hardly feel it even if you are right on top of the line -- this is important in cities with lots of old stone buildings that were not built to withstand constant vibration. There is also less disturbance when the line runs through residential neighbourhoods.

Humberto123

November 26th, 2005, 02:49 AM

The Montreal Metro is dated and maintenance is lacking. Needs a facelift.

hkskyline

December 14th, 2005, 03:30 AM

MTC hikes cost of passes, turns to anti-fraud system
13 December 2005
Montreal Gazette

The Montreal Transit Corp. is raising transit fares in January - the ninth hike in as many years - and installing electronic fare boxes to catch riders who shortchange the system.

The adult monthly pass goes from $61 to $63; the reduced monthly pass will cost $33.75, up from $32.50.

Even with fare increases, Montreal's transit system is still a bargain, Marvin Rotrand, vice-chairperson of the public transit board, said yesterday.

"We're among the most affordable transit commissions in North America," he said yesterday at a news conference to unveil the agency's $864.4-million budget for 2006.

The budget includes $5.6 million for service upgrades, including 12,000 hours of additional bus services in Pointe aux Trembles and St. Laurent.

But transit officials also forecast a budget shortfall next year of $32 million. Board chairperson Claude Dauphin blamed it on rising energy costs, employee wage and benefit increases, and expanded services for adapted-transit users.

But a public transit advocate says the excuses are beginning to wear thin.

"We're very disappointed," said Normand Parisien of the Transport 2000 lobby group.

"With the federal government giving a share of gas taxes to cities for public transit, we were expecting a better deal for commuters."

The steady rise in fares - the cost of a monthly pass has jumped 40 per cent since 1997 - is tough on low-income families in Montreal, Parisien noted.

Hotel chambermaid Sara Berrios says it's hard enough to pay for a monthly pass without seeing the price go up every year.

"In itself, $2 isn't that much money," said Berrios, who commutes downtown every day from east-end St. Michel. "But when you raise the fare by $2 every year, it gets expensive.

"It's hard when everything, including groceries, keeps going up in price."

Transit authorities say their hands are tied: they depend on commuters for 45 per cent of their budget.

As it is, the fare hikes next year will offset $10.6 million in higher diesel and natural gas costs, but that still leaves the transit company $22 million short for 2006, Dauphin said.

The city of Montreal, despite its own budget problems, has promised to jack up its contribution by $10 million next year, for a total of $278 million.

But the provincial government has made no such promise.

"A couple of years ago, Quebec told us our fares were too low, and if we increased the fares they would help us," Dauphin noted. "We're still waiting for that new financial framework."

Dauphin said he hopes Quebec comes up with a bailout package and new funding sources in its budget in February 2006.

In the meanwhile, the transit agency is going after commuters who cheat the system by tossing insufficient change into fare boxes or using the wrong ticket.

The agency is to install new electronic fare boxes in all 1,600 buses by the end of 2006.

Automatic readers will be added to the boxes when a smart-card fare system is introduced, possibly by 2008.

The anti-fraud system will pay for itself within seven years, transit authorities say, and eventually bring in $20 million in additional annual revenue.

Inspectors will be hired to make spot checks - red lights and beeping sounds on the fare boxes signal insufficient payment - and hand out tickets for infractions.

But the system will rely as much on peer pressure as getting tough with scofflaws.

"If the red light goes on, all the other passengers see it," transit board member Dominic Perri said. "You might do it once or twice, but it would take a very special kind of person to cheat the system on a regular basis."

Monthly Pass Less Expensive Here

City One time (cash) Individual ticket Monthly pass

Toronto $2.50 $2.00 $98.75
Montreal $2.50 $1.92 $63.00
Ottawa $3.00 $1.90 $71.25
Vancouver $2.25 $1.80 $69.00
New York* $2.32 $1.86 $88.16

* U.S. prices converted to Canadian funds, $1 U.S. equals $1.16 Canadian, as of Dec. 8, 2005.

Source: Montreal Transit Corp., Toronto Transit Commission, OC Transpo, Vancouver Transit Authority, Metropolitan Transportation Authority, Massachusetts Bay Transportation Authority

New Transit Prices for 2006

Monthly Pass Regular fare: $63.00
Change from 2005: +$2.00

Reduced fare: $33.75
Change from 2005: +$1.25

Weekly pass Regular fare: $18.50
Change from 2005: +50 cents

Reduced fare: $9.75
Change from 2005: +50 cents

Tickets (6) Regular fare: $11.50
Change from 2005: +25 cents

Reduced fare: $6.00
Change from 2005: +25 cents

Single fare Regular fare: $2.50
Change from 2005: -

Reduced fare: $1.50
Change from 2005: +25 cents

Source: Montreal Transit Corp.

DonQui

December 14th, 2005, 06:44 AM

hkskyline, without you, this entire subsection of the forum would be dead.

Thanks!!!

:master:

samsonyuen

December 14th, 2005, 04:16 PM

The price of a monthly pass is a steal!

Taller, Better

December 14th, 2005, 04:44 PM

Here are some pics for people to get an additional idea of what the Metro system in Montreal looks like. Firstly, the trains are much smaller in width than the TTC, and the rubber tires do make a bumpy ride. I always carry a pocketbook with me to read on the subway, but in Montreal it is not possible to sit and read because of the bumpiness.
I like the outside look of the blue trains very much, though.
IMO the Metro stations are very dated looking... very "1967" in appearance. A great deal of brown/grey exposed concrete, and oranges/browns/reds. I am not sure how this
could be easily freshened up as it is such a cohesive late 60's look. I think it would
take a major overhaul.
I think if you asked the average Montrealer, they would still think of the Metro
look as very attractive and modern, so I doubt if there would be a political will to change it.
I have included a picture of that adorable exterior Metro entrance that was given to
the City of Montreal by the Metro in Paris. Part of it was actually original, and part of
it was reconstructed. Here goes( I took all these pictures this past Autumn):

http://img394.imageshack.us/img394/5962/oct2305montrealtrainatbeaudrym.jpg

http://img488.imageshack.us/img488/8121/oct2305montrealmetrostnsquarev.jpg

http://img488.imageshack.us/img488/7267/oct2305montrealmetrostnlionelg1.jpg

http://img488.imageshack.us/img488/8437/oct2305montrealmetrostnlionelg.jpg

http://img488.imageshack.us/img488/3598/oct2305montrealmetrostnentranc.jpg

http://img488.imageshack.us/img488/7089/oct2305montrealinsidemetrotrai.jpg

http://img488.imageshack.us/img488/2190/oct2305montrealbeaudrymetrostn.jpg

http://img488.imageshack.us/img488/1961/oct2305montrealatwatermetrostn.jpg

Taller, Better

December 14th, 2005, 04:49 PM

The price of a monthly pass is a steal!

The Montreal Metro system has been more subsidized by the senior
levels of government than the Subway system in Toronto. The
actual one ride ticket price is higher in Montreal than in Toronto, and
the monthly passes are cheaper.

Minato ku

December 14th, 2005, 09:36 PM

new trains of Montreal subway may be to look this

in Paris subway
http://hidehay-hp.hp.infoseek.co.jp/METRO/PIC/P2014.jpg

in santiago subway
http://www.railway-technology.com/projects/santiago/images/santiago1.jpg

Taller, Better

December 14th, 2005, 09:45 PM

I am happy the trains look the way they do now. I don't think they need to adopt
a generic contempory style unless they truly need new trains.
The ones you show are in my opinion no improvement.
To me it is the metro stations that are looking tired, not the trains.

Haber

December 15th, 2005, 12:19 AM

KCexile

December 15th, 2005, 01:47 AM

One of the biggest problems with rubber-tired systems is punctures. Particularly in Mexico City this is a problem because several lines run with headways of as little as 2 minutes. One train with a flat tire limping to the end of the line immediately causes severe backups and headaches. While strong cultural ties with the French is one reason why rubber tire technology was chosen for Mexico City, it is not the most compelling reason: The vast majority of Mexico City's Centro Historico was built on the dried lakebed of Lake Texcoco and subsidence in weak soils is a SERIOUS issue. The reduced vibrations of rubber tires was the overriding factor for choosing rubber tires in this city. However, the most recent lines built by the city have been steel-wheeled and this appears to be the trend for any new construction outside of sensitive areas.

Taller, Better

December 15th, 2005, 07:19 AM

The reason why it's bumby is because the suspension is really old on those vehicles, not because of rubber tires
Ahhhh... thanks for the explanation. In any case, it does not make for
a very smooth ride.
I assumed the rubber tires were solid, and am shocked to find they
are inflated!!!! Well, in Mexico, anyway. Is it the same in Montreal?
Is there any discussion in Montreal about sprucing up the dated stations?
I was very surprised to watch a new exterior for, I believe, Beaudry being
built a few years ago. To my shock when it was done, it was totally,
completely "1970" looking!! A complete timewarp, architecturally. I would
have thought they may have tried to make it look a bit more contemporary.

hkskyline

December 30th, 2005, 06:23 PM

Pettigrew mugged in Montreal subway
Last Updated Fri, 30 Dec 2005 05:55:21 EST
CBC News

Foreign Affairs Minister Pierre Pettigrew was attacked in a Montreal subway station Wednesday night as a man tried to steal his cellphone.

A 19-year-old bystander jumped in to help Pettigrew fend off his attacker.

Both Pettigrew and his Good Samaritan suffered minor injuries. Pettigrew's cellphone was returned to him after the incident.

A man has been charged with aggravated theft and has undergone a psychiatric evaluation.

Pettigrew's office told French-language media that it wasn't rare for the minister to take public transportation without bodyguards.

hkskyline

March 30th, 2006, 04:55 AM

Alstom willing to work on railcars with rival
Boss wants no war with Bombardier
29 March 2006
The Globe and Mail

MONTREAL -- The president of Alstom SA's transportation unit said yesterday he isn't interested in a lobbying war against Bombardier Inc. over a lucrative contract to build the Montreal subway's new generation of railcars and offered as one option a partnership with his rival.

Pointing out that France's Alstom and Montreal-based Bombardier often collaborate on train contracts around the world, Philippe Mellier said at a news conference: “I am perfectly prepared to work with Bombardier.

“We're not hegemonic. We're not arrogant.”

He added that Alstom would be willing to locate some of the work — such as final assembly — at Bombardier's plant in La Pocatière, about 135 kilometres east of Quebec City on the south shore of the St. Lawrence River.

The La Pocatière plant is the biggest industrial employer in the region. In 1974, it assembled the 423 additional Métro cars needed when the subway system was expanded in connection with the 1976 Olympic Games. The facility now employs about 800 people. At its peak, about 1,400 worked there.

Bombardier Transportation spokeswoman Hélène Gagnon said in an interview yesterday that André Navarri — president of the division — will respond to Mr. Mellier's comments today during Bombardier's presentation of its fourth-quarter and year-end financial results.

The issue of whether the Quebec government should bypass the public tendering process and negotiate directly with Bombardier for the $1.2-billion contract to replace the aging fleet of 336 Métro cars has been making headlines lately.

Proponents of direct negotiations argue that La Pocatière faces a significant work slowdown and the loss of hundreds of jobs within the next few years if no new contracts are won, and that a public tender process would take too long.

Alstom, which provided the initial design for the Métro's first fleet of rubber-wheeled cars in the 1960s, has been arguing that it would be unfair to end users and taxpayers to not call for public tenders and that avoiding competitive bidding would be highly unusual.

Quebec provides two-thirds of the financing for new rolling stock for the province's mass transit systems.

Mr. Mellier also said yesterday that Alstom is way ahead of Bombardier with its state-of-the-art line of subway cars, and that they could be up and running in Montreal by the end of 2009 or early 2010.

“It's stupid to think that if we go [to direct negotiations with Bombardier] it's going to be quicker,” Mr. Mellier said, pointing out that Bombardier must go through a lengthy process of designing the new car, building a prototype and working out the kinks, among other time-consuming steps.

He added that Alstom's technologically advanced subway cars will also yield hundreds of millions of dollars in maintenance savings over their 30- to 40-year lifespan.

Alstom plans to present a detailed proposal to Quebec's Economic Development Minister Raymond Bachand within the next few days, he said.

hkskyline

March 30th, 2006, 03:19 PM

Bombardier rejects Alstom bid for subway car joint venture
Bloomberg News
30 March 2006

Bombardier Inc. rejected an offer from French rival Alstom SA to join forces for a $1-billion order to build subway cars for Montreal's public transit authority. "To cooperate, there would have to be added value," Bombardier executive vice-president Andre Navarri said yesterday on a conference call with reporters. "We have the best technology. I don't think Alstom brings anything today here in Quebec." Philippe Mellier, president of Alstom's transport unit, told reporters in Montreal yesterday that the Paris-based company was "ready to cooperate" with Bombardier on the Montreal contract. Societe de Transport de Montreal, the agency that runs the city's public transport system, needs to replace more than 300 subway cars in the next few years. Bombardier chief executive Laurent Beaudoin last month urged the Quebec government to award the order to the Montreal-based company without tender to help preserve jobs in the province. Mr.

Navarri, a former Alstom executive who now runs Bombardier's train unit from Berlin, said Mr. Mellier's comments that the Canadian company would have to design brand-new cars for Montreal are "flagrant lies." Montreal's subway cars, like those of Paris and Mexico City, run on rubber tires. "We are No. 1 in tire-based technology, and as we speak, we are delivering subway cars to Mexico City," Mr. Navarri said. "This was an order that we won against Alstom in 2002."

micro

March 30th, 2006, 10:28 PM

Here are some pics for people to get an additional idea of what the Metro system in Montreal looks like.
I cannot see your pics, only one :cry:

elkram

April 2nd, 2006, 10:40 PM

I wish the city would snap out of it and inaugurate Line 3 by at least establishing metro service between Central and Edouard Montpetit stations. The tunnel through the mountain is a major piece of infrastructure, and it astonishes me that it's been underused for all of its 93 years. L'AMT told me something like that there are too many parties' zoning matters to be overcome for such a shuttle to be implemented when I contacted them to find out if they themselvers still had such a project in mind (like the edition of the map sometime in the 1980s projected).

Oh! and what was it with The Gazette, in its metro's-40th-anniversary series last year, posting all those west islanders' daft comments urging metro extensions to no nearer than Dorval? Are N Americans that under-informed?!? How come their comments weren't along the lines of establishing quarter-hourly commuter train service? North Americans' standards are so off-target. I told the L'AMT that it's in its best interest to revert to serving a western society by ridding the island of its 211 bus service wherein most of its passengers must remain standing as it zips along the busy expressway for at least 20 minutes at a time (anyone remember a couple of years ago when a 211 crashed the barrier to some elevated interchange section, and was perched/caught there with its front half dangling out ready to all fall down any second?).

Cheers,
Chris

VelesHomais

April 4th, 2006, 08:46 AM

Impressive system

hkskyline

January 25th, 2007, 12:30 PM

Alstom goes to court to derail Bombardier deal for Montreal subway cars
Wed Jan 24, 4:32 PM
By Ross Marowits

MONTREAL (CP) - French transportation company Alstom has gone to court yet again in an attempt to derail Bombardier Inc. from winning a $1.2-billion order for new subway cars for the City of Montreal.

The French multinational recently asked the Quebec Superior Court to issue a safeguard order, or injunction, to stop talks and preliminary work on the project between the Montreal-based transportation company and the city's transit authority.

"We've put in a request that would force the STM (Societe de transport de Montreal) to go back in the tender process like the law says," Alstom Canada president Pierre Gauthier told The Canadian Press.

"The law is quite clear. It says if there is any other railway equipment producer in Canada, then the STM must proceed by a bidding process."

Alstom decided to initiate the new legal procedure - which has been postponed until Feb. 12 - after learning that its request for a declaratory judgment filed last June won't be heard before next summer.

The company fears any preliminary work completed between the STM and Bombardier would establish specifications that would clearly favour the large Quebec transportation conglomerate.

Alstom CEO Patrick Kron was in Montreal on Wednesday to discuss the French giant's legal strategy with his Canadian subsidiary's executives.

He also met with customers in the energy sector such as Hydro-Quebec and later travelled to Calgary for talks with TransAlta, one of Canada's biggest power producers.

Alstom abandoned a legal challenge against Bombardier late last year after it received about one-third of the subcontracting work for Bombardier's US$3.5 billion contract with French National Railways to supply 372 trains.

Gauthier wouldn't say whether a similar deal would be acceptable in Montreal.

"Who knows what's going to happen in the future, but for the moment we believe that on that product, which is rubber tire subways, we are the number one in the world and we want to show it."

The Quebec government announced last May that Montreal's transit authority could begin negotiations with Bombardier to replace 336 subway cars between 2010 and 2012.

In September, Toronto city council approved a $710-million contract with Bombardier to build 234 subway cars for the Toronto Transit Commission.

These non-bid contracts are so lucrative, they allow Bombardier to undercut the competition in other projects around the world, Gauthier said.

"What we view is happening here in Canada gives our competitor an unfair advantage that they can then use to dump product and pricing in other areas where the markets are unprotected."

Bombardier spokeswoman Genevieve Dion said it's up to customers to decide the procurement process they want to follow.

"We haven't started working on the STM project yet and as there are legal procedures, we won't comment."

Montreal's transit authority has no plans to begin negotiations with Bombardier until next November, said spokeswoman Isabelle Tremblay.

Internal work is proceeding to develop the terms and conditions of an eventual order.

"Because (negotiations are) not scheduled before November, things are continuing normally," she said.

This type of lawsuit by Alstom is commonly pursued in the transportation industry, said a Toronto analyst.

"These things are just part of the background music in that industry," said Richard Stoneman of Dundee Securities.

"In most countries, there is a real insistence that companies that get infrastructure work of this type that's paid for by taxpayers has direct and ongoing benefits to local industry."

The French company employs 1,500 workers in Canada, including 700 in Quebec. A total of 250 of the Quebecers work in transportation, with the remaining focused on power generation.

A facility that employed nearly 2,000 to renovate old Montreal subway cars was closed a few years ago when there wasn't enough work to sustain such a large facility, Gauthier said.

elkram

April 2nd, 2007, 07:49 PM

It's been a year since I posted my expansion of Montreal's network. In response to recently reading Montreal's three-year business plan for public transport improvements:

Montreal`s PTI 2007-2008-2009 Programme Triennal d'Immobilisations
http://www.amt.qc.ca/corpo/documents/budget/budget2007/pdf/Budget_AMT_2007_PTI.pdf

I drummed up this drawing that's scanned poorly (my 'pooter's on the fritz):

http://www.geocities.com/trainrover/070330.jpg

PCC

April 19th, 2007, 06:04 AM

Hi!

I lived in Montréal for 10 years and I find the Métro verry noisy and it gives you a verry bumpy ride. In some cartypes there is no window in the end part of the cars, only some kind of iron bars, so all the noise from outside gets in the cars. The traction equipment makes quite allot of noise and also the tyres make noise, but ofcourse no squeeling in curves.

Suprizingly there is hardly any escalators and elevators in the system so it´s verry unfriendly for older people, handycaped people and people with babycarriges. I do find the Métro verry clean and if you like concrete structures / stations it sure is a nice place to take a subway ride!

Montréal does have a verry high class and modern rail transit line, and that is the interurban line from Gare Centrale to Deux-Montagnes. The cars are always clean and the ride is always exelent! The train is always in time, quiet ride, nice and cool -air conditioned summertime and fast ride.

Perhaps someone has some nice prictures of this superior rail transit system? Perhaps some pictures from the underground station Gare Centrale ant the carhouse at Deux-Montagnes?

If you are looking for an extremly quiet subwaycar I just have to recomend the Stockholm Transit C20 class cars! I have made many rides with rail transit in many cities in my life but, no subwaycar has been so extreemly quiet. It also gives a delightful smooth ride thanks to Bombardiers superior aircussioned boggies!

Regards / PCC

isaidso

April 28th, 2007, 02:26 PM

My favourite subway....cute subway cars, seriously massive monumental stations, great art, and cheap cheap cheap to ride on.

I just wish they ran more frequently. I suppose that will get better over time.

elkram

May 1st, 2007, 10:20 PM

The three-station Laval extension opened past Saturday. The topmost editorial in today's edition
of the city's English-language daily claims it unfair that Laval's now served by metro, mentioning that
the West Island oughtta be equipped with the same level of service. I say it's not worth boring the
metro out to West-island municipalities, when there exists a broad enough right of way overland
to accommodate electrification plus frequent service. West Islanders needn't an underground metro,
an overland one would be fine.

Double crossover switches have finally been introduced, but out of the hundreds of photos posted on
the AMT'S website, none of them shows either one of the new type of tracking found each end of
Montmorency terminus.

http://www.amt.qc.ca/grandsprojets/image/metrolaval/photos/283-montmorency.JPG

http://www.amt.qc.ca/grandsprojets/image/metrolaval/photos/196-concorde.JPG

http://www.amt.qc.ca/grandsprojets/image/metrolaval/photos/241-cartier.JPG

http://www.amt.qc.ca/grandsprojets/image/metrolaval/photos/09-henri-bourassa.JPG

hkskyline

May 18th, 2007, 08:30 PM

Montrealers warned to expect long transit strike
CBC
Fri May 18, 6:47 AM

Montrealer commuters are being warned to expect a long strike by maintenance workers at the Montreal Transit Corporation as they are scheduled to walk off the job on Tuesday.

Transit chair Claude Trudel said Friday the workers' demands are "unrealistic and unjustifiable."

The corporation won a major victory Thursday when the province's Essential Services Council ordered the workers to provide more services than they did during their last strike in November 2003.

During that strike, there was no weekend service on the metro. This time, the council has ordered full weekend service during peak hours.

About 2,200 transit maintenance employees have been working without a contract since January. They voted earlier this month to strike May 22 if a new deal isn't reached.

Wage increases and the corporation's pension plan are the main sticking points in negotiations. Workers are asking for a two per cent raise every year over the next three years.

The corporation is offering two per cent a year over a three-year period, but not starting until 2008.

Union spokesman Denis Bonneau said recently the maintenance workers want wage increases on a par with those won by workers in Laval and Longueuil in their most recent collective agreements.

"We're doing the same job. We want the same thing," Bonneau said.

The City of Montreal has told the transit corporation it can't afford raises this year because of an island-wide wage freeze in the last municipal budget designed to curb a growing deficit.

If the parties don't reach an agreement by Monday night, maintenance workers said they will walk off the job at 12:01 a.m. Tuesday.

elkram

June 19th, 2007, 10:21 PM

Local news reports today that 132 police officers are being assigned to complement the Metro's current 60 security patrollers. This is great news, I've been bugging the transit corporation to assign more security staff to the fully underground network.

It's hoped that the police presence underground will curb gang violence. (Five teenage youths alarmed all us passengers heading down into the Guy-Concordia station from Guy-street entrance one Sunday evening mid-April. They were knocking into us, stepping on our shoes, kicking escalator panels, jumping up to thump the overhead lighting, spitting, etc. Their angst immediately reminded me of those poor yobbos trolling the London tubes that I'd come across regularly enough back in the 70s and 80s.)

city_thing

June 20th, 2007, 02:42 AM

I remember seeing somewhere that there's a station in Montreal that has en enterance painted in gay pride colours -do any of you guys know it? I'm assuming it's in the rainbow colours as it's in a gay district?

elkram

June 20th, 2007, 07:03 PM

A picture of Beaudry Station in Le Village found on the following page of the STM's:

http://www.stm.info/English/metro/art/a-index.htm

micro

June 20th, 2007, 08:26 PM

It looks like thin plastic tubes fitted on poles. Or maybe painted aluminum.

Close-up:

http://img527.imageshack.us/img527/2940/beaudryil8.jpg

elkram

June 21st, 2007, 10:30 PM

Hmmm, the first day of la STM's security scheme, Monday, June 18th, has turned out to be a flop.

A pair of security patrollers -- as opposed to police officers -- were sought out by platform-bound passengers somewhere in the Berri-UQAM junction coz a man was beating up his female companion. The patrollers' response to them was that they cannot exercize any right to intervene due to the new scheme. The passengers unsuccessfully tried summoning one of the ticket collectors on the mezzanine above to dial 911. The collector's refusal was because she was too busy (to be calling and yapping with some intake staff). La STM held a news conference late yesterday afternoon about Monday's mishap, and said that both STM parties ought to have assisted -- gee, thanks.

Fabio

June 23rd, 2007, 04:07 PM

I really like Montreal metro system, even if some station need a quickly renovation.
One question, does anyone know of any expansion to be made on the next 5 years, something with chances to be made?
I mean like the expantion of the Blue Line to Anjou? Yellow line in Longueuil as well as the Bonsecours Station? are these or any other project likely to be done soon?

I know there area some tramways projects, but anyother thing on the Métro?

Thanks in advance.

elkram

June 25th, 2007, 10:57 PM

Both the City and transit-planning organization here wish to extend the Blue line by one stop toward the east, at Pie-IX Boulevard. The City, however, wishes to extend it a further four stops so that the terminus be at Galeries d'Anjou.

I gather the transit-planning organization -- l'Agence metropolitain de transport -- is pretty independent. For instance, greater-Montreal municipalities have a devil of a time dealing with it. So I don't know what to make of the metro being extened to Anjou.

An upcoming public-transit-friendly civic rep here would like to see the four stations beyond Pie-IX on the Blue line served by trams instead of metros.

isaidso

July 3rd, 2007, 11:01 AM

So what is the total length of the Montreal Metro with the 3 stations added in Laval. I would imagine that Montreal has surpassed Toronto in this regard since Toronto had only a few kilometres more subway than Montreal prior to this expansion. (68.3 km vs. 66.0 km) Does any one have the new figure?

Good going Montreal, and keep building it out. There is no reason the Metro couldn't be double it's current length.

Homer J. Simpson

July 3rd, 2007, 07:02 PM

^Toronto's system is 70.1 Km at last check. According to Urban Railnet, Montreal's system is 69.2 Km long.

elkram

July 4th, 2007, 01:19 AM

^^ The English daily here pegged its length at 68Km after the Laval extension came on stream -- mind you, there are chords, one of which is double-tracked and stretches at least 2Km, plus all the garages are underground -- the papers here've seemed to have forgotten that the western arm of the Orange Line (Line 2) is tunnelled for no less than 3Km all the way up to rue de Salaberry (Ouest?), putting it at an equivalent distance of one metro station, north (the other side) of the Bois-Franc commuter station, which both the city and regional transit planning authority wish to interchange with the metro.

Good going Montreal, and keep building it out. There is no reason the Metro couldn't be double it's current length.
I agree with your last sentence, hence I can't agree with your first one.

Umm, the English daily did a big extra on the tram and metro a few Saturdays ago. They focussed reporting on some "transit" planner's (not the civic rep I must've mentioned earlier here) scheme that would see what metro service we've scored ourselves the past 20 years on our Blue Line fully converted into a tramway.

How absurd.

There've also been newspaper articles whining on and on about the news' suspicion that rubber-tyred trains were a lousy choice of traction for metros here; they think these trains of ours should have been limited to steel wheels.

With all this chronic Expo-67 40th anniversary rubbish being 'experienced', you'd think they'd have remembered that the city's selection was more than careful, encompassing both practicalities and aesthetics.

Our squishy trains were the compromise between yankee-sized metro wagons and service yielded by trams; crucially-speaking, however, they failed to remember that the squishy size here was adopted so that doublings of the length of our network are to happen multiple times, not simply once only . . .

miamicanes

July 6th, 2007, 01:23 AM

Are the Montreal trains capable of running on their steel wheels as a primary operating mode along conventional track (with power rail in the right place, of course)? Or are the steel wheels literally just a fallback safety feature that were never meant to be used as a primary operating mode?

Relevant example: if a city (like, say, Miami) had a large, existing rail network designed for steel wheels wanted to add little automated spur lines that just ran back and forth all day like peoplemovers perpendicular to the normal stations using rubber-tired Montreal-type trains (because they're quieter), but wanted to be able to run the Montreal-type trains along the main Metrorail track to the maintenance facility along the steel tracks, perhaps by designing the spur so that at some point before the track merged into the mainline, the concrete pad driven on by the tires ramped downward to lower the train onto its steel wheels for continued running.

elkram

July 6th, 2007, 04:23 AM

^^ Their (inner) steel wheels are built primarily for emergency running. It's weird coz the younger fleet's not equipped with suspension and yield shoddy rides period (the older one still gives such a slick ride at the age of 41, these wagons still impress me, while those from the newer fleet mostly shake out one's fillings). Our metros aren't quieter, although their noisiness never becomes overbearing moments of piercing squeels or clangs.

I remember that dual-mode overhead and third-rail fleet out of Moorgate in London in the late 70s -- in the darkened tunnel, I felt like I was a passenger stepping into Space 1999, what a sensationless experience that was!! -- that fleet was the first to be manufactured with rubber balloon membranes as the suspension of the fleet, absorbing the bumps and wobbles into its condensed air masses. The only other advantage of rubber-tyred running is that vibrations don't degrade the concrete tunnel walls and floor. Sorry, Montreal limits its metro operations to fully autonomous lines (its {puny!} five commuter lines, however, do spur like you suggest). I'm sure there'd be nothing hard about manufacturing the dual-mode traction you suggest, although the tracking accommodating both types, mind you, might be a different matter, e.g., preventing hoardes of makes of freight cars coming in from all directions from wrecking some parallel component used by rubber-tyred traction any time of day; the metros here are pretty narrow and don't broaden beyond its lateral guiding electric rails.

isaidso

August 3rd, 2007, 07:12 PM

^^
I agree with your last sentence, hence I can't agree with your first one.

Good going because a city two-thirds the size of Toronto has built a subway system with 4 lines versus 3 for Toronto (of which 1 is a subway to nowhere).

Good going because a city two-thirds the size of Toronto has built a subway with as much track as Toronto.

That Montreal could still double its system shouldn't take away from what has been accomplished already. Not only is the Montreal Metro much better looking, and much cheaper to ride on, but Montreal continues to expand the Metro.

Toronto? Fast, efficient, but horrifically ugly and possibly shrinking if you can believe it. The Toronto Transit Commission has stated it's intent to shut down one of the lines due to budget constraints. Torontonians are so used to a such a small subway network that a good chunk of the population thinks another 2 east-west subway lines is over building. To give you an idea of how underbuilt the network is here, consider that the closest east-west line is about 4 km north of the waterfront at Bloor Street. Downtown Toronto exists south of Bloor, but there isn't an east-west subway line in the entire downtown, only along it's northern edge.

Appreciate what you have and keep up the steady pace of expansion and renewal.

elkram

August 5th, 2007, 01:54 AM

^^ You're right, overall Toronto's so plump with folks it deserves more rails than us. We downstream here are similarly as slow as Toronto at gelling transit when we compare ourselves to places beyond our coasts. The only aspect that's about to be upgraded is the Montreal region and its broad fringe all being linked into a new fare payment scheme involving silly non-touch electronic fare collectors zone through zone -- self-serving practice at its zenith, were you to ask me . . . to be so restricted as to improve upon the revenue scheme . . . sounds too private transit to me.

trainrover

September 10th, 2007, 07:04 PM

Whoa, did this fire take place in Montreal's brand new, secretly-located Centre de contrôle?!? Too much (I myself got to work on time today) . . .

Métro service resumes

Rene Bruemmer, The Gazette
Published: 2 hours ago

Thousands of commuters were stranded in Montreal's metro system for half an hour this morning after a minor fire at the control centre forced officials to shut down all four lines.

Workers performing regularly scheduled maintenance at the system's control centre, where approximately 20 Montreal Transit Corporation employees oversee the running of the system, accidentally cut through a high-voltage cable, causing sparks, smoke and the evacuation of the control centre, said MTC spokesperson Odile Paradis.

Firefighters were called in to quell the blaze, and the metro, which was shut at 9:38, was restarted half an hour later. Paradis said traffic was relatively light because the problem started after rush hour, but still affected "thousands."

For security reasons, the MTC does not divulge the control centre's location.

hkskyline

November 14th, 2007, 02:34 PM

Montreal's bus and subway drivers vote in support of strike mandate
13 November 2007
The Canadian Press

MONTREAL _ Montreal's bus and subway drivers have voted to give their union a strike mandate, raising the possibility of the city's second transit strike in less than a year.

Union members voted 97 per cent in favour of the strike mandate on Tuesday night.

The union says it hopes the mandate will be enough to breathe new life into stalled negotiations between the two sides.

The public transit operators have been without a contract since January and are fiercely opposed to a proposed wage freeze for 2007.

Around 2,200 public transit maintenance workers walked off the job last May, leaving Montreal with no bus or subway service for four days.

trainrover

December 20th, 2007, 09:51 PM

Service frequency's going to upped by about 1/4 come 7 January 2008. Some senior STM staffer told me that the increase shan't be achieved by increasing the speed limit from 72 to 80KPH (phew!).

Laval's mayor announced last week his wish that Laval's new extension be extended farther such that the Orange Line be routed back to Montreal via Cartierville and be effectively transformed into a circle line.

I reckon this circle-line thing ought to be additionally done such that the Blue morphs into becoming the Green Line.

Ashok

December 20th, 2007, 09:54 PM

I am not too sure about the circle. You might service more area if you make the whole line go into Laval instead of spending it on making a circle. Cote Vertu should come into Laval for sure.

trainrover

January 16th, 2008, 07:01 PM

Has anybody else noticed the mild increase in service frequency? I'm surprised at how perceptible the slight increase has consistently been by this second week into the increase now.

I am not too sure about the circle. You might service more area if you make the whole line go into Laval instead of spending it on making a circle. Cote Vertu should come into Laval for sure.
There`s really not much to go to in Laval, no?

I was suggesting turning the Blue Line into the Green Line, thereby proposing there be a second circle line here.

trainrover

February 5th, 2008, 06:59 PM

Habfanman

February 7th, 2008, 01:16 AM

This morning's news on the radio mentioned some wish/plan that ten stations be added in the northern and eastern districts of town here. I didn't hear what group/org is recommending these extensions.

Some nationwide advocate was reported in some local newspaper today, advising that 40.1 $billion must be invested into this country's public transport systems . . . ASAP.

I saw it on the news the other night but I was talking to my girlfriend on the phone at the time. I'm fairly sure it was the provincial government making the announcement. I can't find anything online!!

Habfanman

February 7th, 2008, 01:27 AM

Has anybody else noticed the mild increase in service frequency? I'm surprised at how perceptible the slight increase has consistently been by this second week into the increase now.

There`s really not much to go to in Laval, no?

I was suggesting turning the Blue Line into the Green Line, thereby proposing there be a second circle line here.

I have noticed the increase and I like it!

I would like to see Montmorency hook up with Côte-Vertu. They are planning to expand north anyhow so it wouldn't take much to eventually connect the two. This would take a lot of pressure off of the east side of the orange line.

I'd also like to see the blue line extended east (planned) and a good bus/light rail connection between the blue and green out there.

What about someday looping Snowdon to connect with a slightly extended Angrignon? (it's OK to dream isn't it?)

dwdwone

February 8th, 2008, 04:17 PM

Is there any news on light rail projects for Montreal?

My understanding is that because the metro runs on rubber tires, it has to be all underground to safeguard it from the freeing temperatures. Is there any truth to this? If so, tunneling being so much more expensive, it would make sense to expand the system using conventional heavy rail or light rail.

Electrify

February 8th, 2008, 09:37 PM

QQ: I know one of the constraints with Montreal's subway is rubber tires and it cannot run outside. But with winter tires, concrete heating, and salting equipment on the trains could they not build an above ground expansion? I mean, buses can run outside in winter with not too much trouble, and many systems don't have winter tires either.

trainrover

February 11th, 2008, 07:14 PM

What about someday looping Snowdon to connect with a slightly extended Angrignon? (it's OK to dream isn't it?)
It's needed -- either the Green or Blue Line should make it all the way into Lachine's east end.

Is there any news on light rail projects for Montreal?
L'Agence métropolitain de transport -- the authority that plans the Montreal regions public transport -- has now come up with a «tram-train» -- see Page 26 on their tri-annual report at the following hyperlink:
http://www.amt.qc.ca/corpo/documents/budget/budget2008/pdf/Budget_AMT_2008_PTI.pdf

I'd like to see where this novel idea of their goes; I mean, how do you make a tram freight-train-collission-proof cheaply, huh? (Cheesh!)

In the meantime, they plan on requipping Park Avenue with trams, which isn't turning out to be popular with Montrealers (myself included).

My understanding is that because the metro runs on rubber tires, it has to be all underground to safeguard it from the freeing temperatures. Is there any truth to this?
Yes, if the transit authority in question doesn`t want to bother itself with snow removal; no, otherwise.

QQ: I know one of the constraints with Montreal's subway is rubber tires and it cannot run outside. But with winter tires, concrete heating, and salting equipment on the trains could they not build an above ground expansion? I mean, buses can run outside in winter with not too much trouble, and many systems don't have winter tires either.
I don`t know. With Toronto`s winters far milder than Montreal`s, I remember being delayed often coming into work mornings because of ice freezing up outdoor points/switches on their steel-to-steel network there, such equipment being miles/stations away from where I boarded and alighted my morning train . . . weather's bad any way you slice it, right?

hkskyline

June 13th, 2008, 03:50 AM

Was it really worth it?
On the one-year anniversary of the inauguration of Laval's three new stations, questions remain about whether the $745-million investment is paying off
26 April 2008
Montreal Gazette

Riding the métro from Laval into Montreal during the morning rush hour, Louise Privée is pleased, even if having a seat is too much to hope for.

"I like it a lot," she said of the new Laval line. "There's never enough places to sit, but it's still more comfortable than the bus." One year after the three- station, 5.2-kilometre métro extension into Laval was officially inaugurated on April 26, Laval commuters and Montreal's métro authorities are understandably pleased, although legions of seatless riders and overflowing métro parking lots indicate the new line has quickly become a victim of its own success and questionable planning.

Daily ridership emanating from the three Laval stations has risen to 60,000 passengers per weekday (approximately 30,000 leaving in the morning and returning in the evening), 20 per cent higher than the 50,000 that were projected to be using it after one year.

But riders like Privée also resurrect the question of whether the $745-million investment was worth it in the first place.

Privée used to ride the bus from her home in the Vimont sector to the Henri Bourassa métro station in Ahuntsic, just across the water from Laval, then take the métro to her Old Montreal workplace, a commute of about an hour and five minutes.

Now she takes a half-hour bus ride to get to the Cartier station in Laval and rides for another half-hour to work - a savings of five minutes.

The MTC estimates that as few as 2,000 users of the Laval line might be new users. This means the vast majority were already using public transit, so only a relatively small number of cars have been taken off the roads thanks to the métro. (One wag wrote The Gazette to say that even if there were 3,000 new users, it still works out to $248,000 per person, so why not just buy them all condominiums in Montreal instead?) "If it's just bus rides that are being replaced, then it's a very expensive solution to a basic problem," said Murtaza Haider, a professor at McGill University and Ryerson University in Toronto specializing in public transportation and urban planning. A better and much less costly idea would have been to improve the bus system, he said.

Laval Mayor Gilles Vaillancourt begs to differ.

"Buses," he said, in the same tone one would use for the word cockroaches. "It's been 30 years that I've been hearing that and it doesn't impress me at all. You cannot convert new users to a bus system. You have to give them a real alternative, and that alternative we now know is the métro." Buses get stuck in traffic jams and snow storms, and are more costly to operate per user than subway trains, he said. Buses cost $4.75 per user per trip, as compared to under $3 for the métro system, he said.

Montrealers forced to wait as métro cars packed with Laval residents sailed by them inundated the MTC with complaints in the months following the line's opening. There were more than 400 complaints in nine months, compared with the 122 complaints registered the year before in the same period, Radio-Canada reported, citing documents obtained through the Access to Information Act.

"Of course, it is a success; we are very happy with the high numbers, but there are complaints and we're trying to reduce those to a minimum," said MTC spokesperson Marianne Rouette, adding that the number of complaints dropped 60 per cent in January and February from the initial levels.

To cope with demand, the MTC has increased frequency by 17 per cent since January, is modifying train cars to hold more passengers, and has upped the number of trains on the Orange Line from 29 to 33, running every 31/2 minutes at rush hour, Rouette said.

One out of every two southbound trains leaves directly from Henri Bourassa, ensuring Montrealers will have room, Rouette said.

"We can't get the complaints to zero; that would take a miracle," she said. "And the miracle is when the new trains come." New trains are expected by 2012 or 2013, she said.

The growing pains are a good thing, said Normand Parisien, executive director of the Quebec branch of advocacy group Transport 2000, because they will spur improvements to Montreal's aging fleet, much of it nearing 45 years old.

Fighting against métro systems is difficult because they're popular with the public, he said. It didn't help that the Parti Québécois government of Lucien Bouchard severely lowballed the construction estimate at $179 million when it promised the venture during pre-election season in 1998.

"We wish the best for the new system," Parisien said, even though the group has protested against it for 15 years as a costly investment for such a short distance.

"People are happy with the métro, but they have to realize it reduces the margin to manoeuvre for other projects." The métro construction soaked up $745 million in tax dollars that won't go to health care, pothole repairs or upgrades to Montreal's existing transit system, Haider said.

Both the MTC and the Metropolitan Transit Agency, the provincial body that oversees transit planning in the Montreal region, are quick to note the Laval line was a political decision.

"The government decided the métro should be extended to Laval, and we'll live with the decision," said Marvin Rotrand, vice-chairman of the MTC board and a Montreal city councillor, noting that the line appears to be a success.

"Clearly the city would have preferred an extension of the Blue Line east toward St. Léonard, Montreal North and Rivière des Prairies, where there is a very large population." The MTA is working on a study for an extension of the Blue Line to the east, as well as an extension of the Orange Line north for two stops beyond Côte Vertu into St. Laurent, the scene of heavy housing development in the last decade. Vaillancourt is pushing for a further 10-kilometre extension of the Laval line that would hook up with the other end of the Orange Line, completing the loop.

"The Laval line is proof that if you build it, they will come," said Joël Gauthier, president and CEO of the Metropolitan Transit Agency, adding that the ease of métro travel makes it a greater draw than the bus.

But the Blue Line running from Snowdon to St. Michel puts the lie to that theory, Haider said. Built 22 years ago, it is still underused, showing that only population density guarantees a proper return on métro investment. (An extension eastward would solve that problem, Gauthier said.) Similar complaints have been made about the line that extends to Longueuil.

To Haider, the Laval extension is a waste no matter how many riders use it.

"If I had $800 million, I would have invested in transit efficiency by reducing wait times for buses and replacing the aging fleet of métros," Haider said, noting that it's unfair that service for Montrealers has worsened as a result of the Laval métro line, considering they pay the bulk of the operating costs.

"Montreal is such a cold city. When you see people waiting outside in minus 30C, and they don't know if the bus will come in five minutes or 25 minutes, that rider will be lost as soon as they can afford a vehicle." A Léger Marketing survey conducted for Le Journal de Montréal and TVA and made public this week found that 60 per cent of all Quebecers use cars to get to work; but half said they might switch to public transit if service improved. Many respondents complained that public transit now takes too long, is too crowded or just doesn't exist in their neighbourhood.

Vaillancourt brushes off the anti-métro sentiment, saying it only exists in Montreal, which would rather take the view "that nobody exists except them." The fact the métro is overcrowded and métro station parking lots holding 2,000 cars are full is proof the system is a success, he said. He estimates the number of new users at 4,000 to 5,000. Transport Quebec does not have statistics yet on what effects, if any, the métro has had on traffic patterns.

"Who else has been able to divert 5,000 cars?" he asked. "Nobody but Laval." For passengers like Laval resident Marco Nocella, the line is the fulfillment of a 30-year-old political promise long overdue.

"Sooner or later it would have to be built," he said. "Might as well do it now. It was necessary."

iampuking

June 13th, 2008, 05:03 PM

It will be less crowded if they increased the frequency... A train every 3 1/2 minutes is rubbish.

trainrover

June 17th, 2008, 07:36 PM

^^ plus it really doesn't venture into many neighbourhoods -- I'd bet the frequency would be even worse if it went more places here.

DENTROBATE54

June 19th, 2008, 01:09 PM

Good going because a city two-thirds the size of Toronto has built a subway system with 4 lines versus 3 for Toronto (of which 1 is a subway to nowhere).

Good going because a city two-thirds the size of Toronto has built a subway with as much track as Toronto.

That Montreal could still double its system shouldn't take away from what has been accomplished already. Not only is the Montreal Metro much better looking, and much cheaper to ride on, but Montreal continues to expand the Metro.

Toronto? Fast, efficient, but horrifically ugly and possibly shrinking if you can believe it. The Toronto Transit Commission has stated it's intent to shut down one of the lines due to budget constraints. Torontonians are so used to a such a small subway network that a good chunk of the population thinks another 2 east-west subway lines is over building. To give you an idea of how underbuilt the network is here, consider that the closest east-west line is about 4 km north of the waterfront at Bloor Street. Downtown Toronto exists south of Bloor, but there isn't an east-west subway line in the entire downtown, only along it's northern edge.

Appreciate what you have and keep up the steady pace of expansion and renewal.

:cheer:! These are laregly the same issues I myself have with the TTC (or my personal nickname for them... the sTTingy C) and Toronto's subway network.

In the summer of of 2006, I happened to spend a whole week in Montreal (and Ottawa) on vacation. The person I went with insisted we rent a car. But after a day or two we came to realize the extensiveness of Montreal's metro was so convenient that we had no need for the rental car.

Our motel was on the outskirts of town near Laval but luckily it was only a minutes walk from Suave Station. In the downtown everywhere was walking distance from a Metro. It was so convenient and made me green with envy that their downtown was so well connected, while Toronto's was :puke:. I didn't even get to ride all the lines, but instead used the rental car only to later find out some of the places we went were nearby a Metro (Mont Royal, Cote Neiges, Namur, Pie Ix).

Contrasting Toronto and Montreal, Montreal's system is far superior since as you've pointed out urban Montreal is smaller in surface area than Toronto yet a subway line seems to extend throughout most of the inner city and even offers good service into the suburbs (La Salle, Ahuntsic, East Montreal, Longueuil.). If only Toronto could follow Montreal's example.

Why are new metro lines there being built for under $1 billion with the end-result of ultra-modern, spacious stations? The Sheppard Line, which runs in the suburbs north of the 401, cost nearly $3 billion to build and now sits virtually empty and underused through off-peak. Seeing that cost-recovery is non-existant, it's actually funds from other transit projects yhat's needed to keep the line operational.

trainrover

June 19th, 2008, 04:37 PM

....so convenient....so convenient....made me green with envy....so well connected....far superior....ultra-....
Their appearances and noisiness aside, me, I find the networks darn-right similar.

Du Métro d'aujourd'hui (http://www.journalmetro.com/linfo/article/71503) :

Plus de policiers... plus de crimes!
MARIE-EVE SHAFFER, MÉTRO
19 juin 2008 05:00

Depuis que les policiers ont commencé à patrouiller dans le métro il y a un an, le nombre de crimes qui y sont commis a augmenté.

Les délits et les infractions criminels ont ainsi fait un bond de 1,2 % depuis le mois de juin de l’an passé. Selon le Service de police de la Ville de Montréal, cette augmentation est due à la présence policière.

«Nos agents ont fait beaucoup plus d’arrestations d’individus recherchés pour bris de probation ou de condition», a indiqué hier le directeur adjoint du SPVM, Pierre-Paul Pichette.

Le nombre de voies de fait survenues dans le métro est passé de 225 en 2006-2007 à 238 en 2007-2008. C’est l’augmentation des actes de violence commis contre les policiers qui explique cette hausse, selon le SPVM.

«Il y a beaucoup plus d’interventions des policiers dans le réseau du métro, et [ils] travaillent avec des individus qui ont davantage besoin d’aide que d’être confrontés à un système de loi», a fait savoir M. Pichette.

En revanche, les vols qualifiés, les agressions armées et les crimes contre la propriété ont connu une baisse, respectivement de 18,4 %, de 30 % et de 14,6 %.

Environ 800 000 déplacements s’effectuent chaque jour dans le métro de Montréal. De ce fait, le responsable de la sécurité publique de la Ville de Montréal, Claude Dauphin, croit que le bilan de la première année de la présence policière dans le métro est somme toute positif.

Plus de pouvoirs

Depuis le 18 juin 2007, les agents de surveillance du métro ont été remplacés par des policiers. Ces derniers ont davantage de pouvoirs que leurs précédesseurs, ce qui leur permet de procéder à des arrestations. «Avant, nous ne pouvions pas en faire», a mentionné le directeur général – exploitation métro, Société de transport de Montréal (STM), Carl Desrosiers.

Pas moins de 46 anciens agents de surveillance de la STM ont réussi à faire la transition, en obtenant un diplôme de l’École nationale de police du Québec.

hkskyline

June 24th, 2008, 12:11 PM

More people riding bus and metro, Montreal transit authority says
Thu Jun 19, 6:19 PM

MONTREAL (CBC) - The Montreal Transit Corp. says its ridership has increased by nearly four per cent this year compared with last.

The MTC recorded 4.2 million more trips on buses and subways between January and April 2008, a four per cent increase compared with the same period in 2007.

Improvements to the frequency of transit service and a trio of new metro stations helped drive numbers up, the MTC said Thursday.

About 90 per cent of the reported increase came from metro ridership, which shot up after the MTC opened three new subway stations in Laval, north of Montreal, in May 2007.

The MTC is putting more buses on the road to handle increased passenger volume, said Marvin Rotrand, vice-president of the transit corporation.

"In some areas you'll see far more frequncy outside of rush hour, some of the metro buses will run longer hours, in some areas where there was only service during rush hour there will now be all day service," he said Thursday.

Service will be increased on 12 routes around the city, starting June 23, which will add up to an additional 40,000 hours of bus service every year, Rotrand said.

A new bus route will also be created in the Old Port.

isaidso

June 24th, 2008, 12:27 PM

:cheer:! These are laregly the same issues I myself have with the TTC (or my personal nickname for them... the sTTingy C) and Toronto's subway network.

In the summer of of 2006, I happened to spend a whole week in Montreal (and Ottawa) on vacation. The person I went with insisted we rent a car. But after a day or two we came to realize the extensiveness of Montreal's metro was so convenient that we had no need for the rental car.

Our motel was on the outskirts of town near Laval but luckily it was only a minutes walk from Suave Station. In the downtown everywhere was walking distance from a Metro. It was so convenient and made me green with envy that their downtown was so well connected, while Toronto's was :puke:. I didn't even get to ride all the lines, but instead used the rental car only to later find out some of the places we went were nearby a Metro (Mont Royal, Cote Neiges, Namur, Pie Ix).

Contrasting Toronto and Montreal, Montreal's system is far superior since as you've pointed out urban Montreal is smaller in surface area than Toronto yet a subway line seems to extend throughout most of the inner city and even offers good service into the suburbs (La Salle, Ahuntsic, East Montreal, Longueuil.). If only Toronto could follow Montreal's example.

Why are new metro lines there being built for under $1 billion with the end-result of ultra-modern, spacious stations? The Sheppard Line, which runs in the suburbs north of the 401, cost nearly $3 billion to build and now sits virtually empty and underused through off-peak. Seeing that cost-recovery is non-existant, it's actually funds from other transit projects yhat's needed to keep the line operational.

Yes, Toronto's subway 'system' is an embarrassment. I'd trade our subway in for Montreal's without a moments deliberation. I live in central Toronto and can't take a subway downtown. Somethings wrong when you can only leave downtown in one direction: north.

trainrover

June 25th, 2008, 09:43 PM

^^ Everything still runs downstream lake- or riverside, huh?

Many morning commuters can't board here either, I'm sure the Laval-extension article somebody pasted earlier on here mentions this.

Hey, I'd bet our stupidity here is supreme, in that we've got ourselves a century-old tunnel servicing barely-hourly electric trains that's just screeching its need for its own metros to intercourse with our crosstown Blue and Green Lines......plus, ever since its erection, the 20-year-old Montréal-Trust tower downtown's been harbouring some shell of half of a transfer station to the McGill station. There's no doubt inaugurating metro service between Bonaventure and Edouard-Montpetit stations would dish up much relief for many a metro commuter here.

trainrover

July 21st, 2008, 03:47 AM

A train every 3 1/2 minutes is rubbish.
The initial network used to yield their usual 3.0-minute frequency on all of its first three lines; 1.5-minute was the rush hour norm.

Then they computerized it, such that no train could leave its station if the platform at the next station was occupied by another train...increased frequencies became inevitable.

Then you got a crook of a suburban mayor fostering the longest on-island run between stations that's exceeded only by that inter-island run that undercuts halfway across a segment of the southern leg of the Saint-Lawrence River.

Hmmph.

iampuking

July 21st, 2008, 12:27 PM

The initial network used to yield their usual 3.0-minute frequency on all of its first three lines; 1.5-minute was the rush hour norm.

Then they computerized it, such that no train could leave its station if the platform at the next station was occupied by another train...increased frequencies became inevitable.

Then you got a crook of a suburban mayor fostering the longest on-island run between stations that's exceeded only by that inter-island run that undercuts halfway across a segment of the southern leg of the Saint-Lawrence River.

Hmmph.

So were headways every 3 minutes or every 90 seconds, it is not clear from your post.

And why would signalling system make it so that a train cannot leave a platform until the next platform along the line is unoccupied?

trainrover

August 6th, 2008, 07:22 PM

So were headways every 3 minutes or every 90 seconds, it is not clear from your post.
3 minutes outside rush hours -- 90 seconds during rush hours

And why would signalling system make it so that a train cannot leave a platform until the next platform along the line is unoccupied?
This is probably our legacy from pumping out the world's first fully automatic train, L'Express Expo/The Expo Express. The program counts how many revolutions the tyres make; wheel-turn counting and signalling have been strictly kept separate.

isaidso

August 7th, 2008, 06:50 AM

^^ Everything still runs downstream lake- or riverside, huh?

I'm still waiting for the 'Downtown Relief Line' to be built. It's in blue. I live just northwest of where that Exhibition subway station would be. Presently, I can't get downtown by subway. I can travel by bus north to Dufferin Station on the Bloor line. Then east by subway to Yonge, then change subway lines to go south to get to Union.

Then I have to hear about suburbanites scream bloody murder that we don't need a new subway line, we just need to build more freeways into the city. It's because of them that there isn't enough political will in Toronto to get this done. It's beyond selfish. People who actually make responsible decisions about where they live, people who actually LIVE in Toronto, are going without proper subway connections, because outsiders want Toronto covered in freeways so they can drive here quicker. It's not like they don't have roads to get here. They want BIG roads. We don't have any route in at all. :ohno:
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/f/ff/TtcV233.png

You guys in Montreal are very lucky. Montreal Metro rocks!

trainrover

August 7th, 2008, 05:58 PM

^^ Yay! somebody's committed the 'relief line' onto some map -- me, I'd have made its bottom segment run under E & W Queen :)

Ito hear about suburbanites scream bloody murder that we don't need a new subway line, we just need to build more freeways
Better refer to that lot as (quote) psychopaths.....less painful that way, no? :wallbash::rant:

hkskyline

August 31st, 2008, 06:18 AM

MTC might zap bug-ridden tickets
Multi-trip cards jam new equipment
'There are still too many problems. I don't want to hide that,' transit official admits
29 August 2008
Montreal Gazette

Persistent technical problems with a $169-million ticketing system could force the Montreal Transit Corp. to abandon its freshly launched six-ticket magnetic cards.

The cards, which were to replace paper tickets by the beginning of 2010, continue to periodically jam and occasionally immobilize the bus and subway ticket-taking equipment recently installed across the system, officials conceded yesterday.

The magnetic-strip cards were launched in both one-trip and six-trip formats late last April.

After glitches quickly arose, the six-trip cards were rapidly pulled from service by the MTC in late May.

Yesterday, officials blamed the bugs on humidity, bent cards and electrical groundings on some buses. The difficulties should not be considered unusual, they said, given that the project requires 9,000 pieces of new equipment to be put into service.

Commuters made about 8.5 million trips using the magnetic cards between April 28 and Aug. 24, and the cards jammed new ticket-taking gear 5,904 times, said Serge Piotte, the MTC's project manager for the new fare system.

"About three-quarters of the time" the problems were with the new electronic farebox on MTC buses, he said. Often the troubles were intermittent and thus difficult to pin down. "It's not one single problem. There are series of difficulties."

Backed into a corner, the transit authority is now "seriously thinking" of just dropping the six-trip card altogether, MTC chairperson Claude Trudel said.

Transit officials still hope not to be forced into taking that drastic step, both Piotte and MTC spokesperson Marianne Rouette insisted,

"The volume of transactions" using the magnetic-strip cards "has tripled during the past two months," Piotte said, "but the number of problems has doubled.

"So the proportion of problems is going down - but not as fast as it should.

"There are still too many problems. I don't want to hide that."

The MTC hopes to resume sales of the six-trip cards "in several weeks," Rouette said, after pinning down and fixing the buggy performance.

However, she added, she could not provide a new target date for any such resurrection.

In some cases, a user's magnetic multi-trip card has been swallowed by the new equipment and the passenger was forced to trek to one of five MTC service centres to collect a refund.

That happened to " fewer than 1,000" customers since spring, Piotte estimated

During the past few months, Rouette and other public-relations staff at the MTC had continually played down snags in the new system.

After the MTC stopped selling the six-trip card in May, it waited more than a month before it acknowledged the backtrack.

Rouette had insisted July 7 that "the only reason" six-trip cards had been dropped for the summer was a desire to ease congestion for specific events "such as the jazz festival and Just for Laughs." She said then that the MTC would reinstate sales of the six-trip card Sept. 2, - which falls on Tuesday next week.

trainrover

September 4th, 2008, 09:25 PM

Multi-trip cards jam new equipment
Funny, coz their queue-jamming's what'd been more apparent...

trainrover

September 15th, 2008, 09:12 PM

Heh heh...Montréal's fully indoor network is susceptible to the weather after all. The humidity from Ike's remnants caused equipment failure whereby sections of the Orange and Blue Lines failed this morning. These failures occurred after keeping the trains running all night in the hopes their motors would be dry enough, etc., instead of stabling them in the garages (underground depots).

trainrover

September 16th, 2008, 06:38 PM

Two articles this morning:

Métro's Orange Line faces more slowdowns
Montreal Gazette
Published: 4 hours ago (0809 Hours EDT)
MONTREAL - The Montreal Transit Commission Tuesday morning announced that service on the métro's Orange Line could be interrupted for brief periods of time throughout the day.

Service was interrupted for several minutes around 7:20 Tuesday morning between the Bonaventure and Beaubien stations.

On Tuesday morning, an MTC spokesperson said the delays are directly related to Monday's problems when excessive humidity caused circuit breakers to blow, cutting power to the Orange Line and halting service several times between 7 and 11 a.m.

========================================

Métro breakdowns blamed on humidityOrange line's circuit breakers trip. Condensation on electrical equipment results in delays affecting 25,000 users

JAMES MENNIE
The Gazette

Tuesday, September 16, 2008

If you fought your way through the remnants of Hurricane Ike yesterday morning to reach a métro station only to discover the subway wasn't running, the Montreal Transit Corp. has a message for you: It wasn't the hurricane, it was the humidity.

At least 25,000 commuters were delayed, stranded or packed into métro trains as a series of power failures interrupted subway service between 7 and 11 a.m.

The MTC says the outages were caused by the blanket of humid air that preceded Sunday night's high winds, ultimately prompting circuit breakers to cut power on the Orange Line.

"It was entirely due to the humidity," MTC spokesperson Marianne Rouette said of the power failures that halted service on the métro's busiest route.

"The first incident occurred at 7:05 a.m. between Snowdon and Bonaventure stations and lasted about 40 minutes," she said. "The second occurred at 8:14 a.m. between Villa Maria and Côte Vertu, and it was during that outage that service was lost along the length of the Orange Line."

Service was restored at 9:05 a.m. - only to be knocked out an hour later between Snowdon and Côte Vertu stations for 40 minutes, Rouette said.

Another disruption, between Bonaventure and Snowdon, occurred at 4:10 p.m. and lasted 18 minutes. At 6:53 p.m., power to the Orange Line between Lionel Groulx and Beaubien stations went out for 48 minutes.

Humidity was also blamed for the mechanical breakdown of two of the 10 métro trains serving the Blue Line, Rouette said.

Dominique Lemay, the MTC's director of operations, acknowledged that hot and humid weather doesn't usually lead to a breakdown of subway service.

"The métro runs during heat waves, but at that time the air in the tunnels is also hot," he said. "Since Sunday, we had unseasonably hot and humid weather that was preceded by cool temperature. The air in the métro tunnels being cool, when that humid air circulated, we began getting condensation on everything."

Moisture on wiring and the métro's electrified rails was detected by a system that controls current to the tracks, Lemay said. Circuit breakers automatically cut power as soon as a dangerous level of condensation is reached.

So why didn't breakdowns occur on other métro lines?

Lemay has a theory: Trains on the Orange Line date from the 1970s and run on a higher level of current than the older models operating on the Green Line. "That higher tension of current makes the breakers (on the Orange Line) even more sensitive."

Hydro-Québec was blaming the remnants of Hurricane Ike for blackouts that affected 18,000 customers on Montreal Island and 10,000 on the South Shore. The utility said power was to be restored by this morning.

jmennie@thegazette.canwest.com

trainrover

September 17th, 2008, 05:26 PM

(Again) two articles today.....in the first one, how come the short subway under the river didn't suffer this week around like it did in 2003 is being asked while, me, I reckon it'd be safe to say that fewer vents pierce the river subway while the other lines possess many accesses, which allowed for quicker cooling of their tunnelling and equipment before the onslaught of sub-tropically-toned moisture condensing such that it cloak everything.....Snowdon's junction corridors facilitating cross-platform transfers glistened SLIPPERY! Sunday (get a load of the tanked floors, eh?):

STM : Le problème sur le point d’être régléMARIE-EVE SHAFFER, MÉTRO
17 septembre 2008 05:00

Le service de métro sur la ligne orange serait en voie d’être complètement rétabli.

«On continue d’investiguer, a indiqué hier la porte-parole de la Société de transport de Montréal, Odile Paradis. Le tronçon où les problèmes se produisent comprend les stations entre Beaubien et Bonaventure.»

Depuis lundi, de fréquentes pertes d’alimen-tation ont provoqué de nombreux arrêts de service sur la ligne orange.

Le taux élevé d’humidité dans les tunnels serait en cause. Le Syndicat des employés techniciens de la STM a pour sa part évoqué l’usure des rails, mais selon Odile Paradis, il n’en est rien.

Des équipes d’entretien ont nettoyé la nuit passée les isolateurs, une des composantes techniques du métro. «On pense que l’opération de nettoyage pourrait vraiment aider à régler la situation», a fait savoir la porte-parole de la STM. La ventilation dans les tunnels a aussi été augmentée pour réduire les impacts de la condensation.

Des pannes de service similaires se sont produites en 2003 sur la ligne jaune après une longue canicule. La STM ignore pourquoi cette fois-ci la ligne orange a été touchée et non une autre.

Si de nouvelles pannes surviennent, des autobus seront disponibles pour faire la navette entre les stations de métro.

====================================

Problems persist in métro tunnelsThe Gazette
Published: 8 hours ago (circa 0400 Hours EDT)
Montreal Transit Corp. officials say they're hoping the subway will be sufficiently dried out this morning to run smoothly. But a transit spokesperson said yesterday that while the problem of high humidity in the métro's Orange Line tunnels seems to have been solved, MTC engineers may now have to deal with an equipment malfunction they suspect is a consequence of the damp air. There was a 19-minute interruption of service on the Orange Line at 7 a.m. yesterday, the MTC's Mariette Rouette said, and then engineers stopped service at 10:15 a.m.for 40 minutes to repair a circuit breaker that regulates the level of current to the track. The engineers suspect the source of the problem may be on a track between Berri-UQÀM and the Sherbrooke station.

trainrover

September 19th, 2008, 07:29 PM

I'd forgot to share this article:

Slick new métros come with $1.2B price tag
Reduced maintenance costs expected. Bombardier, Alstom bid for contract to replace circa-1960s subway trains

JAMES MENNIE
The Gazette

Friday, August 01, 2008

For $1.2 billion, you'll be able to walk from one end of your métro train to the other, have less of a chance the subway train's doors will close on you and maybe - just maybe - have an air-conditioned ride during the summer months.

The Montreal Transport Corp. is shopping around to buy 342 new métro cars to replace a fleet of subway trains that have been in service since the mid-1960s.

And MTC chairperson Claude Trudel told reporters yesterday that the transit authority has earmarked $1.2 billion for the purchase - $800 million for the cars, the rest for training, renovation of the existing métro system to accommodate the new cars, interest costs and inflation.

Three-quarters of the contract will be paid for by the provincial government, the remaining 25 per cent by the MTC.

The trains sought by the MTC will be single-bodied, allowing passengers access from one end of the vehicle to the other. Cameras will survey the interior of the cars, handicapped access will be improved and transit authority officials say they're contemplating equipping the trains - which will be deployed on the Orange Line between 2012 and 2014 - with air conditioning.

"Montrealers are going to be seeing the kind of métro train they've never seen before," said MTC director of operations Carl Desrosiers during a briefing session on the purchase held by the transit authority.

"There will be more space inside ... and this train will be less expensive to maintain."

Other differences Montrealers will notice on the trains include:

n Three doors per car, one fewer than on the models now in service but wider and installed on the outside of the train. This allows the subway car's walls to be thinner and its floorspace correspondingly larger, permitting more passengers to be accommodated per train.

Each door will be controlled independently by its own sensor system rather than a driver opening and closing all the train's doors at once, meaning reopening the door if someone gets stuck in it will less time consuming.

"Sometimes, in (a crowded station), it's very difficult for a driver to efficiently close (all) the doors, there's always somebody getting their briefcase stuck," Desrosiers said. "When the driver has to reopen and close the doors, there's a chance someone else gets stuck trying to get on - the train can be stuck for a minute or a minute and half.

"That can be a problem because there's a two-minute, 20-second interval between trains, and that delay can go all the way down the line. "

n Wheelchair access will be provided - two spaces at each end of the train, while chairs with flip-up seats will allow cyclists and commuters pushing strollers more room. While that access will be available by 2014, Trudel did acknowledge the MTC is still in the middle of a 20-year project to make all its stations accessible to wheelchairs.

n Surveillance cameras will be activated whenever an emergency brake is pulled, a door becomes stuck or someone picks up an intercom phone to speak to the driver.

n A signal will sound when the métro doors are about to close, and a light above the door will give the same message to commuters who are hard of hearing.

n The possibility the new trains will be air conditioned. Desrosiers was less than sanguine about the prospect, saying it would be expensive and air conditioned trains would end up blowing their heat exhaust into the stations they pulled in to.

Today's call for tenders by the transit authority ends a five-month detour on the MTC's road to replacing its aging fleet of MR-63 subway cars - the shaking, rattling, patched-up models commuters ride on the subway's Green Line - some of which have been in service since the subway opened in 1966.

Last February, the Quebec government decided not to appeal a Superior Court judgment that rules the contract to construct the subway cars, which was given to Bombardier Inc., had to be subject to a bidding process.

The court ruling, rendered a month earlier, was the result of a challenge of Quebec's decision by Alstom Canada Inc.

The MTC started a bidding process from scratch, an operation that included providing Alstom all information about the contract already provided to Bombardier.

Desrosiers said that even then, every foreign manufacturer that might have been interested in bidding on the contract also had to be brought up to speed.

"In the end, however," he said, "the only firms that were interested were Bombardier and Alstom."

jmennie@thegazette.canwest.com

trainrover

September 24th, 2008, 05:45 PM

:)
The metro operator improved the service frequency a second time this year at the beginning of this month. I don't know about the Yellow Line here, but I can say that the remaining three lines seem to have a headway of between five and six minutes, which is the first time since the dawn of the 1980s that the service has been this frequent. Lunchtimes seem to revert to rush hour service, being every two to four minutes; evenings, much like daytime service; around midnight, up to every eight minutes (better than every 12 minutes).

The extended peak periods took too long to bring about.

There's still a lot of standing passengers but at least we've more breathing room on our rides underground.
:)

dwdwone

September 24th, 2008, 06:38 PM

Does Montreal have any plans for installing light rail?

Homer J. Simpson

September 24th, 2008, 07:14 PM

^I have not heard anything about Montreal considering LRT. That does not mean it is not in the works as I'm not exactly an expert on Montreal's transit system.

Toronto on the other hand has a very ambitious LRT agenda.

officedweller

September 24th, 2008, 09:01 PM

I've heard of a couple of proposals - both on street LRT as well as an exclusive ROW line to the South Shore.

Apparently the South Shore LRT line is dead:

http://spacingmontreal.ca/2007/11/07/south-shore-politicians-want-their-light-rail/

trainrover

September 25th, 2008, 07:50 PM

Does Montreal have any plans for installing light rail?
Yes. From downtown to the harbour, alongside the western third of Old Montreal's riverfront southern boundary, and up Park Avenue a few kilometres -- they wanna route this line up the Côte-des-Neiges at some point, such that the tram line appear like yet another pair of buffalo horns on our rapid transit maps. Most of us dread the idea of its meddlesome installation, probably because we're fully aware of the metro being the superior form of getting somewhere in a hurry. Silliness! they wanna bury a roadway for several kilometres, without any train -- ain't that just the daftest?! But we're used to all this big-lippy talk, droning awn 'n awn (years on end...)

The regional Agence métropolitaine de transport (http://www.amt.qc.ca/) is studying the feasibility of Tram-train, where a hefty portion of network ROW would be split between industrial-spur and commuter-route running, while the rest --maybe? one-third-- would course suburban boulevard medians.

Their big ideas :ohno: (http://www.amt.qc.ca/corpo/documents/budget/budget2008/pdf/Budget_AMT_2008_PTI.pdf)

Apparently the South Shore LRT line is dead
It's better termed dormant, but you're right nonetheless -- as of "Early Monday", read that paragraph and the subsequent few, all starting about two-thirds down the following posting I lodged about Pont Champlain Bridge, to grasp how come (there: who can think of a better tactic at burying any idea of rapid transit to the South Shore?):

http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showpost.php?p=25440250&postcount=81

trainrover

September 30th, 2008, 06:51 PM

Service frequency's also been bumped up, after all, on the city's Yellow Line; mind you, the newer MR73 units have been swapped for shorter MR63 ones.

This has probably been mentioned here some time ago, that Laval's mayor during the days of planning the Laval metro extension clinched passengers' paying higher fares when boarding the trains there in his 'burb.

The following 24 heures article: (http://www.24hmontreal.canoe.ca/24hmontreal/actualites/archives/2008/09/20080929-222922.html)

Deux tarifications pour les usagers du transport en commun

Les Lavallois en ont assez de payer

Jean-Claude Grenier

29/09/2008 22h29 - Mise à jour 29/09/2008 22h32

Le prolongement de la ligne orange du métro vers Laval a été un succès. Toutefois, les usagers lavallois sont exaspérés de payer davantage que les Montréalais pour ce service.
24 heures Les trois nouvelles stations de métro en terre lavalloise ont créé un engouement inattendu de la part des autorités de transport. Des chiffres révèlent qu'avec l'ajout des stations Cartier, de la Concorde et Montmorency, ce sont 60 000 voyageurs supplémentaires par jour qui utilisent le métro.

Il n'y a pas l'ombre d'un doute. La prolongation de la ligne orange vers Laval est un retentissant succès. Si ces trois stations font le bonheur de plusieurs, elles continuent d'irriter des milliers d'usagers qui s'interrogent toujours sur cette double tarification imposée tandis que les usagers de la Rive-Sud n'ont pas à débourser un centime supplémentaire pour se rendre de Longueuil vers le centre-ville.

Incompréhension au niveau de la tarification

Les usagers rencontrés tout près du guichet de la station Montmorency se demandent pourquoi ils leur en coûte 16 50 $ pour l'achat de six billets alors que le prix est de 12 $ pour ces six titres de transport quand ils sont achetés sur le territoire montréalais et même au guichet de la station de métro de Longueuil. Les billets achetés sur l'île de Montréal ne fonctionnent pas dans les tourniquets de Laval.

«Ça fait plusieurs mois que je pose la question aux échangeurs et j'attends toujours une réponse. Pourquoi les usagers de Laval doivent-ils payer des frais supplémentaires», s'interroge Jasmin Roy.

Marie-Johanne Latour déplore également que les Lavallois aient à payer plus cher. «C'est vrai que le métro nous permet de traverser la rivière pour se rendre plus près de chez-nous, cependant les lacunes sont nombreuses. À quelques occasions, le service a été interrompu sur la ligne orange. On a dû quitter le métro à la station Henri-Bourassa et aucun système alternatif n'avait été mis sur pied pour nous permettre de se rendre vers Cartier, de la Concorde ou Montmorency. On a marché ou on a pris un taxi.»

«Quand je m'informe pour connaître la raison, on me répond avec un symbole de zone 3 qu'aucun usager ne comprend. La STM aurait aussi avantage à identifier d'une couleur différente les billets unitaires pour Laval et Montréal.» ajoute Louis P.Meilleur.

Mouvement

Aux trois stations lavalloises, des usagers du transport en commun ont entrepris la signature d'une pétition qui sera déposée en octobre ou novembre aux instances de la Société de transport de Montréal afin que les tarifs soient les mêmes à Laval qu'à Montréal concernant l'achat d'une lisière de six billets.

trainrover

October 29th, 2008, 05:59 PM

Google will help you navigate public transit

Montreal Gazette

Wednesday, October 29, 2008

MONTREAL - Want to know how to take public transit to get from Montreal to Blainville?

Now, you can get get detailed instructions to get around greater Montreal, estimated times of arrival and the cost of the fare, all on Google Maps.

The Montreal Transit Corp., the Metropolitan Transit Agency, the Réseau de Transport de Longueuil, and the Laval Transit Corp. have teamed up with 14 smaller public transit agencies around Montreal to offer the service.

The transit agencies will announce the new application at a press conference at Google's offices on McGill College Ave. Wednesday morning at 10. Montreal became the fourth Canadian city to offer the service, which is available in both official languages, and 10 other languages, including Arabic, Spanish and German.

"It's one of the more complicated public transit applications we have put together, because of the large number of agencies that had to work together," said Naomi Bilodeau, a spokesperson for Google, which will provide the service to the transit agencies free of charge.

Isabelle Tremblay, a spokesperson for the MTC, said she didn't know how many hours it took to put the application together, but Bilodeau said it took the transit agencies about a year to put all the information into the proper format so Google could read it and update it regularly.

It works the same way Google Maps's driving directions application works. You enter in your origin and destination, either by entering an address or postal code, or by clicking on a location on the map. You then click on the "get directions" button, and the "public transit" link. The program will show the user three alternate routes to take, and calculate the travel time. The user can also specify the time and day that he or she wants to leave the point of origin, or arrive at the destination.

"Google wants to see more people use the Internet," Bilodeau said. "We hope this will make it much more simple to take public transit and it will expose people to the options that they have available."

The program can be also accessed on Blackberrys and most cellular phones with Internet access, although for now, it will run slower on the iPhone, Bilodeau said. The service is also available in text-only format, for people who are visually impaired.

The program relies on the schedules set by the transit agencies months ahead of time, but it can also adapt to service disruptions and road closures if the information is updated routinely.

Bilodeau said it's not yet possible to link cities that also have the public transit option. Vancouver, Ottawa, and Fredericton are the other Canadian cities to offer the service, and Google Maps provides public transit information for 50 cities in the U.S., and several European cities.

On the web: maps.google.ca.

MetroWest

November 14th, 2008, 02:33 PM

I think the Montreal Metro is much better than most systems I have ridden on. I do think that the handicped acsesability needs to be improved, and the cars need to be improved (not the outside design, but the susspension) I also think there could be higher frequincies...

trainrover

November 14th, 2008, 07:34 PM

(not the outside design, but the susspension)
Montreal's predominant, --uhm-- newer fleet, the MR73, is not equipped with suspension. I believe the MR63, our 42-year-old fleet, had its suspension retrofitted in the early- to mid-1990s, although I might be wrong about this being a component of their retrofit.

isaidso

January 9th, 2010, 10:05 AM

Are there any new developments or line extensions under construction?

trainrover

January 14th, 2010, 12:42 AM

^^ hmmph, funny you should ask. I saw an Agence métropolitaine de transport advert in today's edition of the weekday freebie 24 heures, announcing their PTI 2010-2011-2012 (http://www.amt.qc.ca/salle_de_presse/publications/pti_10_11_12.pdf) report that summarises all their forthcoming studies and projects. The thing that hmmphs me is that their ad mentioned their extensions currently being studied amount to just a few stations' worth, yet some provincial minister here supposedly tasked the mayors of Montréal, Laval, and Longueuil to look into much lengthier extensions (more than one dozen's worth) than those being re-iterated by l'AMT...

Thus my answer must be, just who TF knows!

trainrover

January 27th, 2010, 09:34 PM

http://www.24hmontreal.canoe.ca/archives/24hmontreal/actualites/media/2008/12/20081210-145310-g.jpg hee hee http://www.24hmontreal.canoe.ca/archives/24hmontreal/actualites/media/2008/12/20081210-145310-g.jpg hee hee http://www.24hmontreal.canoe.ca/archives/24hmontreal/actualites/media/2008/12/20081210-145310-g.jpg
24 heures' 10-December-2008....errrr . . report (http://www.24hmontreal.canoe.ca/24hmontreal/actualites/archives/2008/12/20081210-145310.html)

whether above rendering a proposal or the adoption itself still not apparent...no mention of bringing back suspension either
...photo was republished Monday (25 Jan 2010) to which I can't locate 24 heures' article...

trainrover

February 25th, 2010, 08:55 PM

Metro open all night Saturday 27 February 2010, again (http://www.stm.info/English/info/comm-10/a-co100225.htm) -- my! were passengers ever so different 3:30AM, same event, last year, compared to the metro's regular hours of operation; quite the eye-opener, it was! :shocked: Platforms and trains were crowded/jam-packed.

trainrover

February 27th, 2010, 07:09 PM

New bid arises for métro cars (http://www.montrealgazette.com/arises+m%c3%a9tro+cars/2620166/story.html#ixzz0glN9sQsY)

Spain's CAF rides in: Muddies waters of STM's contentious contract

By François Shalom, The GazetteFebruary 27, 2010 10:26 AM

http://www.montrealgazette.com/arises+m%c3%a9tro+cars/2620166/2510196.bin
Société de transport de Montréal's original 336-car deal has grown to at least 765 cars at least and perhaps 1,053. Photograph by: Allen McInnis, Gazette file photo

MONTREAL – For a contract that started out as a no-bid handout to local train-maker Bombardier Inc., the field of bidders for the Montreal métro car replacement deal sure is getting crowded.

Spanish train manufacturer Construcciones y Auxiliar de Ferrocarriles SA (CAF) announced yesterday it will file a last-minute expression of interest for the contract that began in 2005 as a 336-car, $1.2-billion deal, but has multiplied in size either two-fold or three-fold since then.

That late entry roils the water even more for a contract that had a rocky start, but had settled down, until December at least, to the prosaic business of producing subway cars.

Jesus Esnaola, general manager of CAF's international division, told reporters that he and Julen Barrutia, area director of the international subsidiary, had a "very courteous" hour-long morning meeting with the Société de transport de Montréal after filing their thick, three-binder proposal to renew Montreal's métro cars ahead of Monday's deadline.

The issue has been controversial from its launch, when the STM announced Bombardier would be awarded the sole-source contract without going to tenders. That was overturned when Paris-based Alstom SA sued in Quebec Superior Court, and won its demand to be let in.

That seemed to be that for several years - until December, when Chinese firm C.S.R. Zhuzhou Electric Locomotive Co. demanded to be allowed to bid. It contended that the contract had never been open to international bids and that Alstom had simply latched on to the original closed bid. That forced a stunning reversal by the STM last month, when it halted the exclusive talks with the Bombardier/Alstom consortium and called for international tenders. It appeared all the more surprising since everyone involved had been saying for weeks that the results of the two-year-long negotiations - on price, the numbers of cars and many other details - had been finalized and would be announced within days.

Zhuzhou further muddied the waters by preparing a lawsuit to rescind the requirement in the STM's public request for proposals that the cars' wheels be made of rubber.

Glen Fisher, Zhuzhou's Canadian representative, claimed that pneumatics are increasingly antiquated technology and that the requirement is a transparent ploy to exclude Zhuzhou, which is proposing steel wheels.

STM spokesperson Odile Paradis would only say that "we did receive CAF's expression of interest and we're going to proceed with the analysis of the documents that they submitted to us under the public notice of intention, which ends on Monday at 3 p.m."

"We'll verify to see if they conform with our requirements. But we don't know, will there be others (interested by Monday)?"

Asked why CAF had waited until the last possible instant to make its interest known, Esnaola replied that it was because the contract had multiplied since its inception. The dollar amount of the contract has not been disclosed by the STM, but Paradis did confirm that it was now for 765 cars at least and perhaps 1,053, three times the original number.

"Actually," Barrutia said, "the STM published its (second) notice of intentions of interest only on Jan. 22."

Esnaola said that CAF did not bid on the original deal because "we had work on many other contracts before."

CAF has done rubber-wheel subway contracts in Santiago, Chile and in Mexico City, either as lead contractor or a partner. In Mexico, the lead builder was Bombardier, but CAF has not partnered with Bombardier on projects, unlike Alstom, Barrutia said.

Esnaola said that to respect the 60-per-cent Canadian-content threshold requirement, CAF would build a plant "somewhere in Quebec" and use many of the same local sub-contractors that do business with Bombardier and Alstom.

"We have done the same thing in Brazil, where we are working on the Sao Paulo métro," Esnaola said.

But Esnaola and Barrutia would not be drawn out on whether the Montreal métro could switch to steel wheels, as Zhuzhou is proposing to do.

CAF has a factory in New York and has worked on mass-transit systems in Houston, Pittsburgh and Washington, D.C.

The company does not make mass- transit engines and would have to outsource the powertrain component for the Montreal contract.

Esnaola said that despite being present in Asia, CAF has no interest in bidding on contracts in China, which is set to build more than 70,000 kilometres of train lines that will require thousands of trains during the next decade.

"We think Chinese companies will win those contracts," Esnaola said.

Read more: http://www.montrealgazette.com/arises+m%c3%a9tro+cars/2620166/story.html#ixzz0glN9sQsY

Unreal :ohno:

What garage would accommodate the extra few hundreds' worth of cars? :uh:
MONTRÉAL Métro (http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?p=52610923#post52610923)

iampuking

March 1st, 2010, 02:56 AM

So what, some guy is saying that they should replace hundreds of kms of track just to run steel-wheeled cars when the current technology is already perfectly adequate? Ridiculous.

manrush

March 1st, 2010, 05:11 AM

Brice

March 3rd, 2010, 08:20 AM

Pneumatics are not antiquated technology.

LMB

March 3rd, 2010, 09:01 PM

I thought that the Montreal Metro already had steel rails anyway.

It does, but they act as failsafe, should a tire go flat. So the state of the tracks is -- my guess -- unknown, so major works may be necessary.

Pneumatics are not antiquated technology.
Any new constructions in this technology, other than in Paris?

trainrover

March 11th, 2010, 07:28 PM

So what, some guy is saying that they should replace hundreds of kms of track just to run steel-wheeled cars when the current technology is already perfectly adequate? Ridiculous.
Errrr, we don't possess hundreds of kilometres of metro tracks here...approx 150's worth, that's all :cry: After listening to the Chinese manufacturer's (English-speaking) N.A. rep on regional radio yesterday morning, I'd say his firm's more an abomination after listening to his refutation of their disqualification by our transit authority...our cars are approaching 35 and 45 years of age respectively, and his firm's brattiness is currently proposing to contest their disqualification in some court of law, which really risks further dragging out this replacement of our pair of fleets. :mad:

I thought that the Montreal Metro already had steel rails anyway.
It does, in addition to the concrete ones and the lateral steel ones.

So the state of the tracks is -- my guess -- unknown, so major works may be necessary.
The tracks are fine...the only major work that'd be necessary would be to plop down a lot of ballast atop the concrete track flooring to muffle loudly clanging steel wheels...

Any new constructions in this technology, other than in Paris?
I read a short news report Summer 2009 that some urban community's adopted pneumatic-tyred rolling stock for its new metro system, but forget which one.

LMB

March 11th, 2010, 11:11 PM

which really risks further dragging out this replacement of our pair of fleets. :mad:

And how is that abnormal, I mean the protest? It happens every time, in every country.

I mean no offence, but is there anybody in Montreal who can do better than moving Mirabel to Dorval? Where are the voters, drunk resting at home? Why is this not a scandal?

Why do you people allow such things?

city_thing

March 12th, 2010, 11:02 AM

Why were Chinese rail manufacturers not allowed to compete for the contract?

Is it because of poor Chinese train standards, or because Canada wants Bombardier to win? :P

trainrover

March 26th, 2010, 12:30 AM

^^ It's nothing to do with that firm's hailing from the PRC -- -- for years now, ads on English-language TV have boasted how we federal constituents ought to be proud about some Cdn train manufacturer being some darling at pumpin' out snazzy trains, none of which's ever seen any service coast to coast to coast over here...

And how is that abnormal, I mean the protest? It happens every time, in every country.
I never wrote its being abnormal; besides, what're you claiming as happening everywhere?

I mean no offence, but is there anybody in Montreal who can do better than moving Mirabel to Dorval?
Yes, that'd be us, over here: We had moved half of Dorval out to Mirabel, where landing in the middle of the bush (i.e., wilderness) unnecessarily induced unsuspecting passengers reckon they'd been hijacked ("no sign of the city: where is it?!").

Where are the voters, drunk resting at home? Why is this not a scandal?

Why do you people allow such things?
I bet those people are yet still making their way home here from Mirabel...

Trisuno

March 26th, 2010, 06:02 PM

It does, but they act as failsafe, should a tire go flat. So the state of the tracks is -- my guess -- unknown, so major works may be necessary.

Any new constructions in this technology, other than in Paris?

Lyon, Torino, Rennes, Lausanne, Toulouse etc...

iampuking

March 27th, 2010, 05:25 AM

Why were Chinese rail manufacturers not allowed to compete for the contract?

The article quotes one Chinese company, not all of them. And the reason this said company is disqualified is because they do not meet the specifications of the Montreal Metro. It's like complaining that London Underground is excluding Chinese companies because they're disqualifying full sized metro trains from being manufactured for tube-sized Underground lines. :nuts: If they want a chance at constructing the next generation of Montreal Metro carriages then they should design ones with rubber tyres, they're in no position as the seller to judge what the buyer wants. It's preposterous!

city_thing

March 28th, 2010, 08:35 AM

^^ Well it's pretty arrogant and stupid of the Chinese company to complain about being disqualified from the tender then :lol:

batman08

March 28th, 2010, 06:34 PM

When will construction begin on new lines and stations?

trainrover

April 7th, 2010, 12:17 AM

^^ at this rate? your guess just might be better than any of ours over here ;)

trainrover

April 29th, 2010, 11:06 PM

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Nouvel appel d’offres pour les voitures de métro: Rien n’est encore joué (http://www.journalmetro.com/montreal/article/514298--nouvel-appel-d-offres-pour-les-voitures-de-metro-rien-n-est-encore-joue)

http://media.metronews.topscms.com/images/1c/00/b1d2be214a07994ee8f7118fee22.jpeg

La Société de transport de Montréal (STM) s’est montrée très prudente, mercredi, en commentant la possibilité de lancer un nouvel appel d’offres afin d’octroyer le contrat pour le renouvellement de 765 voitures du métro.

Contrairement à ce qui a été avancé par Le Devoir mercredi, la STM a indiqué ne pas avoir reçu le rapport final de la firme Hatch Mott MacDonald, qui est chargée d’étudier la proposition de l’espagnole CAF (Construcciones y Auxiliar de Ferrocarriles). La porte-parole de la STM, Odile Paradis, a indiqué que le rapport n’était attendu que dans quelques jours.

«[Mercredi], nous avons eu une rencontre en comité restreint avec les experts du groupe Hatch Mott MacDonald, a précisé Mme Paradis. Les gens ont échangé et ils ont peut-être demandé des ajouts d’information [à CAF]. Ce n’est qu’après cette rencontre que le groupe Hatch finalisera son rapport.»

En attendant, la STM refuse de confirmer ou d’infirmer qu’un nouvel appel d’offres sera lancé. Selon Le Devoir, pourtant, l’entreprise CAF répondrait à toutes les conditions imposées par la STM.

Délais supplémentaires
Advenant le lancement d’un nouvel appel d’offres, les usagers du métro devraient composer avec au moins une année de délais supplémentaire. Dans ce cas, les nouvelles voitures pourraient être livrées au cours de l’année 2014.

La Confédération des syndicats nationaux (CSN) s’est élevée contre ces nouveaux délais. Elle a exigé que le gouvernement assume ses responsabilités et octroie le contrat sans délai au consortium Alstom-Bombardier. «L’emploi, le service, l’environnement, l’âge de la flotte, tout milite pour commencer la construction des nouvelles voitures sans délai, a déclaré la présidente de la CSN, Claudette Carbonneau. La question n’est pas d’occulter un processus d’appel d’offres. Il y en a eu dans le passé et le contrat a bien été alloué.»

Le ministère des Trans*ports du Québec (MTQ) n’a pas répondu à cet appel, évitant de sombrer dans la spéculation. Le Parti québécois a pour sa part dénoncé la «comédie d’erreurs» dans laquelle le gouvernement Charest a plongé la STM depuis 2006, année au cours de laquelle il a accordé le contrat du renouvellement des voitures de métro à Bombardier sans appel d’offres. Au moment de mettre sous presse, Bombardier et Alstom n’avaient pas répondu aux appels de Métro.

trainrover

May 14th, 2010, 06:56 PM

Des parfums dangereux (http://www.journalmetro.com/linfo/article/525000--des-parfums-dangereux)

http://media.metronews.topscms.com/images/82/0d/25695e2848708666b9490335381a.jpeg

Métro
La couverture de l’étude Rien pour séduire : les risques associés aux substances secrètes contenues dans les parfums.
MATHIAS MARCHAL
MÉTRO
12 mai 2010 22:13

Britney Spears est-elle dangereuse pour la santé? C'est ce qu'on pourrait conclure à la lecture d'une étude publiée mercredi sur la dangerosité de certains composants chimiques contenus dans les parfums. Curious, celui de la célèbre chanteuse pop, fait partie des produits épinglés.

«Les substances chimiques qu'ils contiennent sont inhalées ou absorbées par la peau. Un grand nombre aboutissent dans l'organisme, dont celui des femmes enceintes et des nouveau-nés», prétend Jane Houlihan, VP de la recherche du Environmental Working Group, le laboratoire qui a testé 17 parfums achetés au Canada et aux États-Unis.

Chaque parfum contenait en moyenne 14 substances comme le phtalate de diéthyle et le musc de synthèse. À cause d'une faille légale, certaines substances échappent à la loi sur l'étiquetage, déplore la coalition à l'origine de l'étude.

Asthme et maux de tête, dérèglements hormonaux, allergies : la liste des effets supposés de ces substances est longue. En tout, 91 produits chimiques différents ont été repérés. Ce serait trois fois plus que le nombre de substances surveillées par les organismes de contrôle mis en place par l'industrie.

Santé Canada assure de son côté «surveiller le marché pour détecter tout effet indésirable signalé et prendre les mesures correctives qui s'imposent pour protéger la santé et la sécurité des Canadiens».

Des parfums épinglés
Voici quelques parfums montrés du doigt :

Seventy Seven : Plus grand nombre de substances chimiques
Aqua di Gio : Plus grand nombre de substances allergisantes
Ceux de Halle Berry et de Jennifer Lopez : Perturbateurs endocriniens
Lire le rapport (Anglais) doesn't work, dead link
..

dwdwone

May 14th, 2010, 08:58 PM

Has the light rail in Montreal begun construction?

trainrover

May 14th, 2010, 10:05 PM

^^ No -- first, the authorities/stakeholders around here have to blab & blab about this kind of idea for several decades before most of us locals ever get to see it, you know.

trainrover

May 22nd, 2010, 08:55 PM

Can anybody please explain how come Metro's online versions of their reports differ from their print copies? Thanking you in advance.

Métro : La STM conteste la requête d'Alstom-Bombardier (http://www.journalmetro.com/Linfo/article/530855--metro-la-stm-conteste-la-requete-d-alstom-bombardier)

La Société de transport de Montréal (STM) entend contester la requête du consortium Alstom-Bombardier qui vise à invalider l'avis public international lancé en janvier dernier pour le remplacement des voitures de métro.

«La STM est en total désaccord avec les prétentions que le consortium amène dans sa requête», a déclaré la porte-parole Odile Paradis. Cette dernière a indiqué que la STM a fait preuve de rigueur dans tout le processus et qu'elle a travaillé en concertation avec le gouvernement du Québec.

Le consortium remet en cause l'avis public devant la Cour supérieur du Québec, arguant que les conditions comprises dans l'avis public étaient moins exigeantes que celles de l'appel d'offres de 2008, ce qui contrevient à la lettre d'autorisation du ministère des Affaires municipales, des Régions et de l'Occupation de territoire censée encadrer le processus d'octroi du contrat. Les clauses concernant le contenu canadien et l'expertise du fournisseur étaient différentes, selon le consortium.

«Les avocats de la STM prendront tous les moyens nécessaires pour accélérer la procédure», a avisé Mme Paradis.

Le consortium Alstom-Bombardier a réussi à s'entendre en décembre avec le gouvernement du Québec et la STM pour le remplacement de 365 voitures de métro. Puisque le contrat stipule désormais que 765 voitures devront être construites, un avis public international a été publié. Deux entreprises y ont répondu : le chinois Zhuzhou Electric Locomotive et l'entreprise espagnole CAF. La proposition de celle-ci est toujours analysée par la firme Hatch Mott MacDonald, qui doit rendre incessamment son rapport final à la STM.
..

trainrover

October 2nd, 2010, 09:13 PM

Bidding process for metro cars halted (http://www.montrealgazette.com/news/Bidding+process+metro+cars+halted/3606268/story.html)

'Emergency need' cited. Special law to award contract would send negative protectionist message: CAF

By FRANCOIS SHALOM, The Gazette (http://www.montrealgazette.com/) October 1, 2010

Twelve hours before an international call for bids was to be issued yesterday, Quebec once more short-circuited the much-delayed bidding process to replace Montreal's metro cars for a week.

The sudden halt of the tortuous process -five years and counting -is ultimately meant to accelerate the "emergency need" to replace the aging subway fleet, a government spokesperson said.

And Quebec, La Presse said, will reportedly revert to its original position of 2005 by invoking a special law that would once again hand the rich deal to Bombardier Inc. on a no-bid basis, a stance that launched the Montreal metro contract saga spiralling into farce.

Asked why Quebec is adding a new chapter to the labyrinthine process of lawsuits, countersuits, grinding halts, restarts, contract changes and a host of other delays, all of which have cost millions of dollars, Alexandre Boucher, an aide to Transport Minister Sam Hamad, said that "it's because it is a priority for the minister."

"There is an emergency need to renew the (subway) fleet for the Montreal passengers and for the Quebec economy."

But he would not confirm information in La Presse that a Bombardier/Alstom consortium would get the nod.

Asked about the apparent contradiction of accelerating a process by stopping it, Boucher noted that "of the 52 months since this has been in the works (officially on Quebec's books), 36 were due to judicial pursuits (by a Chinese firm), 15 to the Societe de transport de Montreal's decisional process and one month to Quebec's decisional process."

The STM and Bombardier/ Alstom referred all questions

to the Quebec government.

Philippe Roy, a spokesperson for Construcciones y Auxiliar de Ferrocarriles, S.A. (CAF), the Spanish firm that forced the reopening of the process in a splashy January development, said it was "abnormal" and "quite stunning that the Quebec government, suddenly and in the middle of the night, is changing the rules of the game."

Jesus Esnaola, CAF's director of international affairs, called the special law "an apparently extremely negative protectionist message," adding that "the maintenance of jobs is an argument that cannot be validly invoked to push CAF away from the bidding process."

CAF has undertaken to create as many Quebec jobs and to deliver the cars on time. CAF asked Premier Jean Charest for an emergency meeting on the matter.

CAF reminded Charest in a statement that it "expressed its interest to participate in the international call for tenders after an invitation by the STM and the government of Quebec."

"CAF always believed in the good faith of the parties involved and in the integrity of the process."

The firm warned that invoking a special law will be completely contrary to agreements and practices that govern international commerce.

"This simply makes no sense," Roy said. "What kind of message is Quebec sending to foreign firms that want to invest here?"

He said it was premature to say if CAF will sue to stop any eventual no-bid award to the Bombardier consortium.

But he noted bluntly that Bombardier is the largest train supplier in Spain, suggesting that the company might be subject to retaliatory measures on contracts there.

The news report claims that Bombardier will receive an initial deal to supply 500 metro cars, half of the projected order.

Richard Bergeron, a member of Montreal's executive committee in charge of urban planning, said he was "extremely disappointed" by the halt.

Noting that there's a by-election after the recent death of Claude Bechard, Quebec's former transport minister in whose riding Bombardier's La Pocatiere plant will do work for the contract, Bergeron said "there's too much parochial provincial politics involved in this decision."

"Bombardier needs no leg-up, it's an emblem of Quebec business milieu, quite capable of winning on its own.

"The attempts to benefit Bombardier led us to this chaotic road to begin with.

"Everything indicates that (the $3.5 billion widely quoted for 1,053 cars) is too expensive, up to $1 billion too much."

The savings could pay for Montreal's tramway project, he added.

Unions and the Conseil du patronat expressed support for Quebec's decision.

Read more: http://www.montrealgazette.com/news/Bidding+process+metro+cars+halted/3606268/story.html#ixzz11EKuNakc

manrush

October 2nd, 2010, 10:35 PM

So basically, back to square one.

If I were Charest, I would invoke some imaginary emergency powers and award the contract to CAF immediately, just to spite Bombardier.

TheKorean

October 2nd, 2010, 11:18 PM

Why does Montreal Metro remind me so much of the Paris metro? From Rubber tires to the actual stations...

manrush

October 2nd, 2010, 11:56 PM

The MR-63 was loosely based off the MP-59.

And Montreal's stations are similar to the ones in Brussels and Santiago (perhaps Montreal's station design inspired both cities?)

hkskyline

October 4th, 2010, 10:46 AM

Why does Montreal Metro remind me so much of the Paris metro? From Rubber tires to the actual stations...

Well, I guess the French share technologies amongst its French-speaking counterparts. :)

trainrover

October 5th, 2010, 11:34 PM

So basically, back to square one.

If I were Charest, I would invoke some imaginary emergency powers and award the contract to CAF immediately, just to spite Bombardier.
^^Good hunch nonetheless

Quebec law to award métro car contract to Bombardier-Alstom (http://www.montrealgazette.com/news/Bombardier+m%C3%A9tro+deal/3625372/story.html)

By Kevin Dougherty and Andy Riga, Gazette Quebec

Bureau October 5, 2010 1:05 PM

http://www.montrealgazette.com/news/2344920.bin
Société de transport de Montréal is about to announce the final terms of the contract to replace its fleet of métro cars. The only two bidders on the contract, Bombardier Inc. and Alstom SA, have formed a consortium to build the large order, which could number up to 700 cars.

LA POCATIÈRE - The Quebec National Assembly will adopt a law to award the Bombardier-Alstom consortium a contract to build 500 métro cars for Montreal's subway.

The contract is worth about $1.3 billion, or $2.6 million for each of the 500 metro cars, Premier Jean Charest said.

Charest made the announcement Tuesday at Bombardier's factory here where subway and transit rail cars are assembled.

The decision means the contract won't be opened to other bidders. In a communique, the Quebec government said the Montreal metro contract is not subject to international trade rules, which call for a competitive bidding process, because the consortium is the unique supplier in Canada.

CAF, a Spanish company, and Chinese builders, had expressed interest in the contract and may launch legal challenges.

La Pocatière, 140 kilometres northeast of Quebec City, is in Kamouraska-Témiscouata riding, where Charest's Liberals hope to win a by-election.

The seat was held by Claude Béchard, a minister in the Charest cabinet, who died last month.

Montreal Mayor Gerald Tremblay has welcomed news that new metro cars appear to finally be on the way.

It's good news for Montreal, which "urgently" needs the new equipment to replace cars built in the mid-1960s, Tremblay told reporters Tuesday soon after Premier Jean Charest announced the deal.

Asked if he fears lawsuits from competing companies will cause further delays, Tremblay said, "I'm assuming that the Quebec government made due diligence on their decision."

More details to come.

http://www.montrealgazette.com/news/Bombardier+m%C3%A9tro+deal/3625372/story.html#ixzz11WR9OWOf

The MR-63 was loosely based
It's Bombardier's MR-73 that's the fleet that's becoming loose (Canadian Vickers' prior fleet's still solid).

Bah, I found it telling after listening to this news on the radio only to find myself several hours later riding one of the younger trains wherein my wagon felt and sounded like it was about to collapse, particularly on the bends. Plus the train was being driven manually and never neared maximum speed, which is unusual in manual mode coz drivers deftly try to outdo the maximum speed without (momentarily) inducing the automatic overspeed brakes.

deasine

October 6th, 2010, 05:11 AM

Montreal mentioned by Int'l Transport Consultant, Jarrett Walker:

montréal: more on the new frequent network
http://urbanist.typepad.com/.a/6a00d83454714d69e20133f4c5f840970b-320wi
Andy Riga of the Montreal Gazette did an interview of me (http://communities.canada.com/montrealgazette/blogs/metropolitannews/archive/2010/09/30/stm-10-minutes-max-bus-autobus-frequent-bus-network-jarrett-walker.aspx) on Frequent Network branding, in response to the rollout of such a brand by their local transit agency, the STM. The whole interview is here (http://communities.canada.com/montrealgazette/blogs/metropolitannews/archive/2010/09/30/stm-10-minutes-max-bus-autobus-frequent-bus-network-jarrett-walker.aspx). News stories based on it are here (http://www.montrealgazette.com/Minutes+just+flak/3607174/story.html)and here (http://www.montrealgazette.com/technology/will+offer+advantages+riders+system+managers/3606226/story.html).

The most useful big-picture idea, in restrospect, is probably this:

Many urban opinion leaders in North America have formed their idea of good transit from travelling in Europe, where many cities have rail networks that feel complete. In London, Paris, and Berlin, rail seems to be going everyone that most people, and certainly most tourists, want to go. So these opinion leaders come away with the view that building great transit is about expanding rail.
That attitude is colliding with the urgency of transit improvement in North America [and Australasia], where most cities have incomplete rail networks if they have them at all. Faced with the big sustainabiliy challenges that are coming on, these cities are discovering that they need quality transit sooner, and in more places, than they can possibly deliver with rail network expansions.
So it no longer makes sense to say that the "good" transit network is the rail network. We need brands and systems of communication that help people see where their good services are, regardless of whether they're rail or bus or ferry or gondola. And since we all hate waiting, frequency is the most important variable to market!

(Walker ("http://www.humantransit.org/2010/10/montr%C3%A9al-more-on-the-new-frequent-network.html), 2010)

IrishMan2010

October 6th, 2010, 08:46 PM

Nice system. Has character.

TheKorean

October 6th, 2010, 09:37 PM

Need to go from Central Station (taking Amtrak to Montreal) to Bell Centre to catch a Habs game? Can I take the subway?

Montrealer

October 6th, 2010, 09:49 PM

Need to go from Central Station (taking Amtrak to Montreal) to Bell Centre to catch a Habs game? Can I take the subway?

No need to take the métro, the Bell Centre is not even 2 blocks away from Central Station.

TheKorean

October 6th, 2010, 10:40 PM

Convenient. Guess a lot of Habs fans take the AMR trains.

I love the fact that the ZCentral Station has high platform, the only one in canada.

trainrover

October 9th, 2010, 04:18 PM

{QUOTE}rail seems to be going everyone that most people{/QUOTE}
Whether anglo/franco, ^^ no wonder the state of American rail's merely disfigured.....whose hope might one be tagging along with, ehh?

trainrover

November 6th, 2010, 04:05 PM

n2zDSdVy9hg..

+
STM wins American Public Transportation Association award as Outstanding Public Transportation System in North America (http://www.stm.info/english/info/comm-10/a-co101005b.htm)

La STM remporte le prix de la meilleure société de transport en Amérique du Nord décerné par l’American Public Transportation Association (http://www.stm.info/info/comm-10/co101005b.htm)

trainrover

November 9th, 2010, 11:32 PM

FpyhaDM3Z3E
I've a hunch that this video ain't the same one that the radio news kept harping about this morning, although the dang reporter kept saying things about the "emergency brake... ... ... ...the emergency brake" when such a brake's never been available to any metro passenger.....the red-enamelled handle's just an alarm, requesting the driver to halt at the next station whenever activated!! :ohno: Anyhow, I can't understand why the cell-phone videographer --as reported to have-- waited until Frontenac station before alerting STM staff all the way from Langelier station: might the prospect of 15 minutes' worth of fame explain why (although I still can't find the youtube-lodged video!)?
..

paulista1978

November 12th, 2010, 01:42 PM

Why does Montreal Metro remind me so much of the Paris metro? From Rubber tires to the actual stations...

I´ve been to both. Apart from rubber tires, it´s rather different. Paris stations are ugly, dirty and crowded, with access via stairs (except for line 14, which is driverless, etc). Montreal has clean stations with escalators. It´s more similar to Santiago, as someone said.

trainrover

November 14th, 2010, 07:23 PM

^^
I´ve been to both. Apart from rubber tires, it´s rather different. Paris stations are ugly, dirty and crowded, with access via stairs (except for line 14, which is driverless, etc). Montreal has clean stations with escalators. It´s more similar to Santiago, as someone said.
for Montreal's first year, the two systems were more alike, e.g., both systems had automatic platform entry gates ¬
http://www.stm.info/english/en-bref/images/a-jarry.gif (http://www.stm.info/english/en-bref/a-at-last.htm)
...en français (http://www.stm.info/en-bref/mepmet9.htm)

trainrover

March 12th, 2011, 08:26 PM

Montreal's metro runs overnight only one day each year: February's last Saturday night, La nuit blanche --another one of those Las-Vegas-II'y fests, you know :ohno:. Anyhow, the Blue Line overnight this year had headways of 10 minutes.

For a district-linking, crosstown metro line that nears no closer than approx. 2 miles to the edge of the (puny!) city centre, don't you find that 3AM-etc-headway too elevated for a place with relatively so few people?!?

manrush

March 12th, 2011, 09:22 PM

What's the status on the tramway in Montreal. Is it still under study?

TheKorean

March 12th, 2011, 11:52 PM

So whats the story on central Station being the only VIA station to have high platform and having electrified commuter rail?

hkskyline

March 14th, 2011, 04:17 AM

So whats the story on central Station being the only VIA station to have high platform and having electrified commuter rail?

VIA also shares its main station with commuter rail in Toronto though.

trainrover

March 27th, 2011, 10:03 PM

^^ as does Gare Centrale (the Deux-Montagnes and Mont-Saint-Hilaire lines, plus the forthcoming Train de l'est).

Never mind the national operator, it's still the country's lone station to be equipped with stepless platforms and electricity feed.....the fact the two coexist there's only coincidental...

Merely talking about the city's wished installations (trams and shtuff) is enough to assure itself its supposèd world-class status...

Anyhow, click here (http://www.stm.info/English/info/comm-11/a-co110218.htm) to see the livery that the operator's chosen for the new fleet:

milwaukee-københavn

March 27th, 2011, 10:56 PM

I read somewhere that STM is considering going over to electric trolleybuses on some routes. Anybody know anything about it?

More interested in actual news about the project than people's distain for buses..

trainrover

April 5th, 2011, 12:35 AM

^^ The MTC wishes to make all its traction electrically powered by Year 2025. The trolley busses you must've been getting wind of wouldn't be powered by overhead wires; no, they'd like their route termini to be equipped with battery charging stations that they figure would take at least 20 minutes to recharge the batteries of any bus, i.e., after each one-way trip it'd make :ohno: (Does anybody think the MTC can afford recruiting actual [real!!] engineers?!?!)

I disdain busses, by the way ;)

By the way, doesn't anybody else --namely another Montrealer/Montréalais-- find the MTC's promotion of the renderings of its wheel-less trains as queer as I do?!? You see, I can't think of any other metro around the world where clean, ever-so-tidy skirting of the undercarriages like either Montreal's MR63 or MR73 fleets does... I'd dislike seeing the loss of this Montreal characterstic from the city's future fleets...

trainrover

May 14th, 2011, 06:16 PM

(Montreal's) The STM invites transit users to voice their opinion about the seats for
the future métro cars

http://www.stm.info/English/info/comm-11/images/siege1.jpg

http://www.stm.info/English/info/comm-11/images/siege2.jpg

http://www.stm.info/English/info/comm-11/images/siege3.jpg (http://www.stm.info/English/info/comm-11/a-co110420.htm)

Their question's useless --for now-- because of elimination of advertisents from its own renderings...
..

Larmey

May 15th, 2011, 01:29 AM

The absolute mismatch in technology in Montreal for its needs shows you the stupidity of blind nationalistic politics.

The Parisian metro can be rubber-tired because Paris has a moderate climate with very infrequent snowfalls and lack of severe winter weather. Here rubber tires make sense.

In Montreal, rubber tires make absolutely no sense whatsoever, and hinder the further development of the metro. In most North American cities, in the outer areas of a metro network, lines are above ground to save costs. So, just to be like Paris (and hence be more "French") Montreal went with rubber tires.

This means that even if the metro is ever extended to an outer area, the tunnel must be built underground. Otherwise, the rubber tires won't work!

:nuts:

Nouvellecosse

May 15th, 2011, 10:12 AM

The STM could easily decide to make a surface or elevated section (if it had trains that were weather resistant) by simply heating the rails to keep snow and ice from accumulating on the tracks. There are thousands of road vehicles in Canada that have rubber tires, so obviously they can work in this climate as long as snow or ice doesn't build up (which is why we plow and salt the roads).

But the fact is, having a completely underground system hasn't really hindered the Metro's expansion. When you compare the subway network in Montreal to other cities in North America, the metro is just as extensive relative to the population.

Greater New York City has about 1km of metro for every 50,000 people (when you include NY Subway, PATH, and SIR). Greater Chicago has about 1km of metro for every 54,000 people, Greater Boston has about 1km of metro for every 74,000 people, and greater Toronto has about 1km of metro for every 81,000 people. Montreal by comparison has 1km of metro for every 53,000 people.

So Montreal has been able to afford a system large enough to serve the population very well without having significant surface extensions that are present in all the other systems mentioned. Also, surface subway actually has several disadvantages in a climate like Montreal's in that the weather takes a major toll on the system requiring more to be spent on maintenance, and it is less comfortable for customers since they are exposed to the cold.

Besides, the current Montreal metro could not be extended significantly even if it could go outside because the lines already have near the maximum number of stops. A line cannot have more than about 15 stops from the end to the most common destination (usually city centre) since it makes for a tedious journey. NY and London overcome this by having express service, but the Montreal Metro doesn't have the extra tracks that would allow trains to pass each other. Adding such a capability would be massively expensive. Therefore, as Montreal grows, the best option would be to eventually build an S-Bahn/RER/BART type suburban system that would serve outlying areas. But until the city is large enough to justify the expense, it can make do by upgrading and expanding commuter rail.

trainrover

May 21st, 2011, 06:58 PM

Larmey! I can't tell what you're really saying :nuts: (http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showpost.php?p=77788029&postcount=150).

The only possibly nationalistic ingredient inherent in Montreal's metro --from concept all the way through to inauguration-- might be (and that is "might be") the very tones themselves (of blue and white) to the metro livery here!

FYI, underground boulevard Pie-IX Line 7 was supposed to be steel traction, not rubber (this was ages ago, when numbering the lines superceded colouring'em).

The STM could easily decide to make a surface or elevated section
but, no: its board obstinately went on record last Autumn that they'd never sanction such rights of way :ohno: although they avow at cluttering the streetscape ('arterialscape') with trams; I mean, what transit operator wishes at becoming hell-bent at encumbering itself with pratts' traffic?!? Mine!

Je trouve le concepte derrière le peindre du croix sur la montagne problématique: toi?
http://www.mouvementcollectif.org/images/signatures/signature_6.jpg (http://www.mouvementcollectif.org/fr/outil-signature)

Il y a la compagne Chaque passager compte (http://www.mouvementcollectif.org/fr/les-dessous-de-la-campagne) auquel son (introuvable!) affiche montre une petit centre ville sous une montagne courronée par un croix dont l'ensemble montagneux me pertube.
;)

manrush

May 21st, 2011, 07:49 PM

Hopefully, they'll dedicate a right-of-way and a lane to trams, like in Paris or Lyon.

http://www.parisbypod.com/images/pod/A7-Tramway-Alesia.jpg
http://www.parisbypod.com/images/pod/A7-Tramway-Alesia.jpg

http://www.galvaunion.com/images/realisations/tramway/galvanisation-tramway-8.jpg
http://www.galvaunion.com/images/realisations/tramway/galvanisation-tramway-8.jpg

trainrover

May 21st, 2011, 08:13 PM

"Hopefully"? :lol: Relatively-speaking, we are --uhm-- crucifying the MTC and the MTA here :lol: Plus, that's why I tried invoking a term "'arterialscape'" earlier ;).

Larmey! there is a gallic thing sorta happening, being the Tram-train (http://www.amt.qc.ca/docs/expose/Nouveau_Tramway_en_France.pdf) concept (that I understand as to be hailing from the French Republic...even! the MTA themselves are hailing it as being "new" [«nouveau»]).

manrush

May 21st, 2011, 11:03 PM

sterlinglush

May 22nd, 2011, 05:48 AM

Besides, the current Montreal metro could not be extended significantly even if it could go outside because the lines already have near the maximum number of stops. A line cannot have more than about 15 stops from the end to the most common destination (usually city centre) since it makes for a tedious journey. NY and London overcome this by having express service, but the Montreal Metro doesn't have the extra tracks that would allow trains to pass each other. Adding such a capability would be massively expensive. Therefore, as Montreal grows, the best option would be to eventually build an S-Bahn/RER/BART type suburban system that would serve outlying areas. But until the city is large enough to justify the expense, it can make do by upgrading and expanding commuter rail.

Good points overall in this post, but I'd like to point out that the metros in Seoul, Beijing, Shanghai, and Tokyo don't follow this paradigm. (Line 1 in Seoul does have an express service, although it's infrequent enough that it doesn't necessarily save a lot of time.) If the lines are extended, people will ride them. It may be tedious, but if it's cheaper and less frustrating than commuting on a crowded freeway, it's a better option.

trainrover

May 27th, 2011, 06:51 PM

I thought the regulations in Quebec prohibited the running of urban rail vehicles on mailine tracks.
Not Quebec's regs (provinces up here aren't mandated enough for railway stuff): It's the enormous tagging onto the yanks' sets of regs by our own federal ones, I believe.

The cbc reported some months ago that our federal regs are to be overhauled: any chance of the same thing happening with the USA's sets (train operations, configurations even...)?

Kind of off-topic, but the CPR's being really obstinate at providing free, safe & secure access across its not-all-that-busy-docklands-serving-multi-tracked ROW through one of the densest 'hoods in the land here. The CPR is so almighty enough to be in the possession of The right to be fining (obligatorily-speaking-) trespassers, a creed of either a Mile-End or a Petite-Patrie local who follows any one of numerous holes in the trackside fences, 144$CDN. In 2011. What I ain't been hearing is how about revising The Railway Act of Canada (http://www.archive.org/details/cihm_25321) instead of wasting time at pining away on intra-Victorian ideals this far in the future :ohno: For instance, how many years has the footbridge linking Park X and Villeray been allowed to have been demolished due to 'pestersome' deterioration?

:toilet::soapbox::toilet:

Moreover, english cbc radio's local morning show about three months ago featured on the line all da way from Calgary a CPR spokesperson (executive staff) who was allowed to categorise, on our airwaves, that docklands-serving ROW as plied-by-commuters. This utterance of hers was not corrected, plus it's been so flippin' long that none of us could have any bloody idea which semi-century she must've yapped out loud :ohno:

:horse: :horse: :horse: :horse:

Regretably, substantial tunnel, surface or even elevated dedicated rail service is lightyears off this region's radar here.

IanCleverly

June 17th, 2011, 06:26 PM

AMT electro-diesel arrives in Montréal

Montréal commuter rail authority Agence Métropolitaine de Transport took delivery of its first Bombardier-built ALP-45 electro-diesel locomotives on June 9. The first of 20 locos was officially received by AMT President & CEO Joël Gauthier and the Vice-President of Business Development & Communications for Bombardier Transportation North America Ann MacDonald.

Built at Kassel in Germany, the locomotive was shipped from Hamburg to Newark, New Jersey, and moved to Montréal under its own power; it will be commissiond at AMT’s Saint-Eustache depot where the Deux-Montagnes commuter EMUs are maintained. The remaining locos are to be delivered at the rate of one a month, allowing AMT to expand services on its five existing lines and open the Train de l’Est route now under development.

Story continues here (http://www.railwaygazette.com/nc/news/single-view/view/amt-electro-diesel-arrives-in-montreal.html)

trainrover

June 17th, 2011, 07:36 PM

^^ Thank you for sharing that article because neither I nor The Montreal Gazette knew the proper term Electro-diesel locomotive (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electro-diesel_locomotive) :)

Plus another thank-you for inducing me to (quickly :shocked:) score the ALP-45DP (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ALP-45DP) model name :)

By the way, regional politicians --and rightly so-- are fussing with the authority/ies about danger behind locos passing under Mount Royal, to which the latest autoritative reply's been that hazards have been mitigated by multiple fuel compartments (eight's worth?) to our own ALP-45DP fuel tanks. Their reply makes me wonder what suffix'll be tacked onto the model name (I see that our tanks hold 200 more --uhm-- Bombardier US gallons than New Jersey's does). Plus, just what must've lead up to the purchase of 125MPH / 200KPH locos by our commuter operator, especially were its relatively-predominant restrictive 10MPH speed limits considered?
Ready for Montreal? New AMT locomotives to be tested in extreme temperatures

http://postmediamontreal.files.wordpress.com/2011/06/img00857-20110609-1351_opt.jpg?w=600

http://i939.photobucket.com/albums/ad236/trainrover/panto.jpg (http://blogs.montrealgazette.com/2011/06/09/ready-for-montreal-new-amt-locomotives-to-be-tested-in-extreme-temperatures/)

STM beefing up late-night bus service
(http://www.montrealgazette.com/news/montreal/beefing+late+night+service/4952384/story.html)
This last bit of good news makes me wonder how much closer the region might've become to all-night metro service. Anyhow, why doesn't the operator just run a couple of trains to call at every third station or thereabouts overnight?
http://i939.photobucket.com/albums/ad236/trainrover/nightbussesmap.jpg (http://www.stm.info/english/info/a-nuit.htm)

trainrover

July 9th, 2011, 09:33 PM

:mad2:
It would appear that Gare Lucien L'Allier is going to be retrofitted. I wonder if there be any plan to install track-end hydraulic buffers http://www.skyscrapercity.com/images/icons/icon6.gif

http://www.cyberpresse.ca/images/bizphotos/435x290/200911/11/123444-maquette-gare-lucien-lallier.jpg
^^ clickable, from novembre 2009 :ohno: (http://www.cyberpresse.ca/actualites/regional/montreal/200911/11/01-920509-gare-lucien-lallier-la-facture-passe-de-40-a-215-millions.php)

http://web.student.tuwien.ac.at/~e9526139/montreal_lucien-l-allier_x.jpg
...............surely this one must've been discarded by one of this year's visiting Jazz fest musicians ^^ :shocked:

http://i939.photobucket.com/albums/ad236/trainrover/buffer.jpg
^^ clickable (http://web.student.tuwien.ac.at/~e9526139/eisenbahn_2.htm)

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/35/71487864_383737b273.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/donnasmillie/71487864/)
^^ this one possibly pre-dates WWII (was trying to find an image of the ginormous ones equipping London's terminal Euston Station)!

http://t0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcT9_icpW_eLuV9vHX7na9VFOWagIH3RgFskYtursIoQapxPxsGs&t=1
^^ clickable (http://localadventures.blogspot.com/2011/05/tanjong-pagar-railway-station-tours.html)

batman08

July 9th, 2011, 10:56 PM

When is expected to begin construction of new sections of the subway?

trainrover

July 10th, 2011, 05:40 PM

It's not expected. There's talk-talk-talk (reports), however, the past several weeks proposing private investment to fund expansion of the network in time for the city's 375th anniversary (2017).

Apple1

July 10th, 2011, 08:57 PM

Hello,

Is there a thread on traffic issues in Montreal? It is such an incredible mess, and it affects tourism and even the value of houses on the island and even the economic activity of what was once called the "Metropolis of Canada".

The enormity of the problem is considerable. Two week-ends ago, I left lake Placid while a colleague was heading back to Manhattan. I live in St-Lambert, so usually, I do not have to go on the island. However that day, I had supper on Plateau Mont-Royal.

As incredible as it may seems, my colleague arrived in Manhattan before I arrived on the Plateau Mont-Royal. :ohno: I waited around two hours to cross Champlain bridge [truly]. Then I was blocked downtown. Many streets were closed. Two one-ways had changed direction, etc.

Of course, I was late for supper - my host were unhappy :bash: .... but they did believe me. Every one in the city has experienced the traffic problems.

*

Seriously, the economic impact of this major traffic problems seems considerable. At my work, an economist told us that the actual mess will necessarily negatively impact building projects on the island. And it would increase the... decreasing population trend on the island as well.

Local Montreal Gazette newspaper states that there is a real crisis going on.

"This is a full-blown crisis. It’s time everyone started to behave like they know this."

Read more: http://www.montrealgazette.com/Gazette+View+Memo+task+force+There+crisis+there/5075044/story.html#ixzz1RjIlJFNy

Is somebody aware of citizen's mobilization on the issue?

And if there is none, would it be worth starting a thread were issues could be explored and solutions and actions considered?

p.s.: Maybe I am on the wrong thread... If so, please tell me where to go!!!!

trainrover

July 11th, 2011, 10:42 PM

Yes, although you are on the wrong thread (I don't think any Montrealer's dared to create such a thread (http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=1418152&highlight=)).

Champlain Bridge has been assessed at risk of collapsing
One of the Mercier Bridge spans has been shut for three months' of emergency repairs
The Turcott interchange is also at risk, as are its (super!-) elevated approaches

When the Mercier span was shut some Monday morning mid-June, an afternoon traffic reporter kept announcing that afternoon that the Agence métropolitain de transport was putting on new "routes", "nine new lines", and other such gibberish when all the English-speaking fella meant to say was that extra Montréal-Candiac trains were being commissioned into service for the emergency repairs -- it astonishes me that locals don't understand what trains are :shocked:

In short, it's frightening :dunno:

trainrover

July 15th, 2011, 01:44 AM

nIP5-wKgcUM
^^ filmed from N America's possibly-oldest metro fleet

trainrover

July 15th, 2011, 01:47 AM

QRw5DbK2Riw
^^ the country's largest metro interchange now into the 3rd month of its 5-year-long renovation :ohno:
+ part of its renovation budget allocated for installation of temporary mock-ups (walls, columns, etc) :uh:

trainrover

July 15th, 2011, 01:56 AM

g3sKG1IC6hY
^^ (Empty) Blue-line train finishing its St-Michel-to-Snowdon run

trainrover

July 15th, 2011, 01:59 AM

4Ck7KFQMry4
^^ (Emtpy) Blue-line train preparing its Snowdon-to-St-Michel run

DanielFigFoz

July 15th, 2011, 01:59 AM

The tunnel goes quite far beyond the terminus!

trainrover

July 15th, 2011, 02:02 AM

bV3V3IIahXE
^^ I'd certainly have reported the faulty doors instead of filming it...

trainrover

July 15th, 2011, 02:16 AM

The tunnel goes quite far beyond the terminus!
Right. What you're looking at is what was being reported back in the mid-1980s as being a garage (depot/yard), but it's really just an arrière gare, a 'behind-the-station'. It's length stems from the chord linking the Blue & Orange Lines (Snowdon station's an interchange). Wealthy Hampsteaders either sued or threated to sue the construction authority/ies due to all the cracks their house foundations suffered, the ones on streets that intersected with Queen Mary Rd from all the rock blasting boring the tunnel under the Road. It's sort of funny that no such foundation-cracking has been reported by any residents of any other community/district.

Here's an example of a real garage:
oyeRXTQr_DY
^^ my first time viewing one :uh:
Oh! how typical of Montrealers at loving to make their tyres squeal http://www.skyscrapercity.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

trainrover

July 15th, 2011, 02:30 AM

And here's a regular arrière gare (terminal station Honoré-Beaugrand just cropped out of view):

ZaGSOQZ8z6k

trainrover

July 15th, 2011, 02:36 AM

^^ same origin (as above), but to the garage this time around:

WrsersHQGbM&NR
^^ my first time viewing :)

trainrover

July 15th, 2011, 07:29 PM

_XpI18arT2Q
Dubbed-over :uh: compilation comprising:

0'01" - Deux-Montagnes-bound EMU leaving Central Stn under the mountain, through Pierrefonds, and onto Bigras Island
2'22" - St-Jerôme-bound commuter from Montreal Island to Jesus Island (Montreal to Laval), and on the North Shore
4'38" - Candiac-bound commuter leaving Lasalle Station, crossing the St-Lawrence River and Seaway
7'30" - riverside segment unknown :dunno: possibly Lucien-L'Allier-Station-bound from Candiac through Kahnawake
8'30" - Central-Station-bound commuter from Mont-St-Hilaire
9'40" - moving Nightstar stock
10'20" - short metro ride on the Green Line (Line 1), whereabouts undetermined :dunno:

trainrover

July 19th, 2011, 10:30 PM

^^ same twin tunnel portals ▼▼
http://www.trainweb.org/oldtimetrains/photos/cnr_electric/Mount_Royal_Tunnel_1.jpg
^^ clickable (http://www.trainweb.org/oldtimetrains/photos/cnr_electric/MRT_gallery.htm)

Mount Royal Station became Central Station, which is said to have be the last major urban station opened on the continent (inaugurated during WWII).
http://www.trainweb.org/oldtimetrains/photos/cnr_electric/Mount_Royal_Station.jpg
^^ clickable (http://www.trainweb.org/oldtimetrains/photos/cnr_electric/MRT_gallery.htm)

http://www.virtualmuseum.ca/Exhibitions/Africanworkers/images/Photos/car2.jpg
^^ clickable (http://www.virtualmuseum.ca/Exhibitions/Africanworkers/English/HTML/car2.html)

http://www.cawcouncil4000.com/images/centralstation_1945.jpg
^^ clickable (http://www.cawcouncil4000.com/07jun12_centralstation_history.html)

http://www.imtl.org/image/big/CN_1942_centrale.jpg
^^ clickable (http://www.imtl.org/montreal/image.php?id=1108)

http://www.urbanphoto.net/blog/wp-content/uploads/2007/03/modern03.jpg
^^ clickable (http://www.urbanphoto.net/blog/2007/03/30/three-visions-of-montreal/)

trainrover

July 19th, 2011, 11:00 PM

4Ck7KFQMry4
^^ (Emtpy) Blue-line train preparing its Snowdon-to-St-Michel run
▼▼ Continues where ^^ left off. However, I'm puzzled that the motors can't be heard, leaving me to wonder if there be some new night/maintenance train that's been acquired :dunno:. With stops the journey takes 11 minutes.

gGvl_bBTOMA
If you look carefully after pausing the video at 3'11" (http://i939.photobucket.com/albums/ad236/trainrover/interchange.jpg), you can see where the Édouard-Montpetit station recessed ceiling and adjacent walls where the two pairs of illuminated are located. I'm convinced that this is where passageways will be bored to effect an interchange with the Mount Royal tunnel (two miles north of downtown -- the Deux-Montagnes plus the Blainville-St-Jerôme [to be re-routed] and the forthcoming Train de l'Est lines) will be effected, for it's quite easy to feel the commuter trains rumbling by as they pass underneath. No other station has such a recess. (The Parc-Snowdon portion of the Blue Line was opened 1988.)
http://www.trainweb.org/oldtimetrains/photos/cnr_interurban/Mount_Royal_Tunnel_1.jpg
^^ clickable (http://www.trainweb.org/oldtimetrains/photos/cnr_interurban/MRT_gallery.htm)

trainrover

July 20th, 2011, 01:39 AM

Changing tracks
rjGpJQ1xDL4

trainrover

July 20th, 2011, 01:44 AM

Maintenace depot
Ari8QnGtW7Q
^^ dubbed :uh:

trainrover

July 20th, 2011, 01:54 AM

From atelier Beaugrand to (adjacent) garage Beaugrand
BZimVePtBKo

trainrover

July 20th, 2011, 01:55 AM

cPjYsFBctE8
^^ first time seeing garage Angrignon from the inside ▼▼ (yellow depot)
http://i939.photobucket.com/albums/ad236/trainrover/garageAngrignon.jpg

trainrover

July 20th, 2011, 08:37 PM

http://www.skyscrapercity.com/images/icons/icon14.gif
6bcitUsO0lM

trainrover

July 20th, 2011, 08:38 PM

http://www.skyscrapercity.com/images/icons/icon14.gif
6sEyxJeu4jc

trainrover

July 22nd, 2011, 10:08 PM

:nuts:
DcC31r1BxBY
▲▲http://www.skyscrapercity.com/images/icons/icon10.gif▼▼
zsUrVQNB888
^^ Ils ont raison ;)

trainrover

July 22nd, 2011, 10:15 PM

Montreal métro stations become underground saunas

Temperatures in individual subway cars varied between 28.9C and 35.9C on all lines between noon and 6:30 p.m.

http://i939.photobucket.com/albums/ad236/trainrover/metrochaud.jpg
temperatures in Centrigrade (http://www.montrealgazette.com/health/M%C3%A9tro+becomes+underground+sauna/5141074/story.html)

Either August or September is worse than July...

---------------

Train d'entretien (toujours bruyant):

9MpXZSHi_Ig

hkskyline

August 17th, 2011, 06:46 PM

Report on viability of air conditioning on Montreal buses due at end of year
By James Mennie, The Gazette
August 9, 2011

MONTREAL - The humidex will be hovering around 30 this week and city buses will start to fill now that the construction holiday has ended.

But sweltering Montreal commuters will have to wait until the end of this year to know whether the Société de transport de Montréal (STM) will even think about giving the green light to air conditioning on its buses.

STM spokesperson Isabelle Tremblay said on Monday that an ongoing survey of passengers for their views on whether they’d welcome air conditioning on city buses would continue until next month and that transit authority workers – including maintenance personnel and drivers – would be polled for their opinions, as well.

“We won’t have a report (on the viability of air conditioning) until the end of this year.”

Tremblay’s comments come as the STM polls riders on bus routes 24 (Sherbrooke), 10 (De Lorimier), 103 (Monkland), 165 (Côte des Neiges), 173 (métro bus Victoria), 535 (Park Ave./Côte des Neiges reserved lane) and the 747 Express to Trudeau airport on whether they would welcome – and be willing to pay more in transit fares – for air conditioning on STM buses.

That survey last month prompted The Gazette to dispatch four reporters armed with identical digital thermometers to take temperature readings on the STM network during the hottest part of the day (noon to 3 p.m.) and again during the afternoon-rush hour.

The results showed that in many cases, the temperature (without the humidity factored in) exceeded the temperature outside — in one instance hitting 38C.

While The Gazette’s experiment simply confirmed what many regular commuters know, it also quantified just how steamy buses can become during a Montreal summer and explained in part the transit authority’s decision to launch the survey a year after dismissing air conditioning on buses as too expensive and environmentally unfriendly. The STM had argued that its studies showed it would cost about $20 million to equip its buses with air-conditioning units and an additional $5 million annually to maintain them. Fuel consumption would increase by about 25 per cent, the transit authority argued, while exhaust from the air-conditioning units and the buses themselves would create about 3,200 tonnes of greenhouse gases a year.

And a survey conducted earlier for the STM found that air conditioning was a priority of only 14 per cent of métro users. Among bus users, AC ranked 12th as a priority.

Air conditioning on the city’s métro system, which would cost an estimated $50 million to install and $2 million annually to maintain, is not being considered.

Tremblay acknowledged on Monday that no matter what the survey established when it comes to commuters and air conditioning, any decision on whether to equip buses to make them cooler in the summer will ultimately be determined by the STM’s finances.

Heat wave index: The Gazette measured the temperature across the city at noon and during the evening rush hour. We focused on metro cars and stations, which are not air-conditioned.

jmennie@montrealgazette.com

Read more: http://www.montrealgazette.com/technology/Report+viability+conditioning+Montreal+buses+year/5223974/story.html#ixzz1VJ0Lq1FN