Height: 930 ft
Floor count: 75
Location: East Lake and North Stetson
Construction end: 2010
Architect: Solomon, Cordwell, Buenz and Associates
Developer: Mandarin Oriental Hotel Group Ltd. (MOHG)

Website (http://www.mandarinorientaltower.com/)

http://area.autodesk.com/themes/site_themes/area/profiles/neoscape/images/MandarinOrientalChicago.jpg

http://img135.imageshack.us/img135/5796/mandarin1mq.jpg
http://img516.imageshack.us/img516/6021/chicagotowersm9md.jpg

WE WERE SO WRONG ABOUT THIS BEING A PART OF WATERVIEW TOWER, BUT HAY, WHO SAID BEING WRONG WAS ALWAYS BAD!!!!!.....


Mandarin Oriental hotel will check in
Site near Millennium; Ritz-Carlton for sale

By Thomas A. Corfman
Tribune staff reporter
Published June 8, 2005

A venture that includes construction executive Gerard Kenny said Tuesday that it has a deal for a posh Mandarin Oriental hotel on a site near Millennium Park, part of a proposed 90-story tower that also will include luxury condominiums.

Meanwhile, the owner of the Ritz-Carlton at Water Tower Place said it would put up for sale the 435-room property, one of Chicago's best-known, high-end hotels.

The two deals reflect the renewed attention that investors are giving to a property sector that some experts say can offer higher returns than other real estate investments, such as office buildings or apartment complexes.

"Hotels are the place to be right now," said Arthur Buser, managing director of Jones Lang LaSalle Hotels, a unit of the Chicago-based real estate firm with the same name. "Your initial yield ends up to be double digits out of the box, and there is no other real estate you can do that with," he said.

The $550 million Mandarin Oriental project will be located at Lake and Stetson Streets, but it will have an address of 215 N. Michigan Ave. because the site is part of the Illinois Center office complex.

At 887 feet, the skyscraper is expected to be the city's seventh-tallest tower when it is completed in 2008.

Hong Kong-based Mandarin Oriental International Ltd. has been looking for a Chicago property for at least eight years.

The project gives Mandarin an opportunity to "further strengthen our brand," said Edouard Ettedgui, chief executive of Mandarin, which has 21 hotels worldwide--six of them in the U.S.--and plans to open a Boston property in 2007.

A partnership controlled by Kenny acquired the vacant site in 1998, paying what seems now like a bargain price of $4.4 million, according to property records.

But what looked at the time like a quick development deal dragged on, the result of several factors, including the downturn in hotel development after Sept. 11, 2001.

"The opening of Millennium Park made this thing go," said Kenny, a director with Kenny Construction Co., who spends most of his time on real estate development.

Generally low profile, Kenny was thrown into the spotlight in 1992, when his Wheeling-based firm managed the repair project for the Loop flood. His brother James, a former executive with the firm and a Republican fundraiser, was named ambassador to Ireland in 2003 by President Bush.

The partnership is contributing the 44,000-square-foot site to a joint venture that includes Frank Leo, an investor, developer and former New York printing company owner, said Kenny, whose firm will manage the construction.

The 1.2 million-square-foot project will include 300 condos and 250 hotel-condo units. An additional 50 condos, to be called Mandarin Oriental residences, will have the full benefit of the amenities of the hotel. The chain is known for its high level of service.

A marketing firm has not yet been named, and Kenny acknowledges that sales will be key to arranging financing.

"The Mandarin name brings such a special presence to Chicago," he said.

Under the hotel-condo concept, rooms are sold as condominiums to private buyers, who allow the hotel to rent them out when the owners are not using them.

Kenny may hope the Mandarin project fares better than another hotel deal his firm was involved in, the Renaissance Hotel near O'Hare International Airport.

The 362-room hotel was completed during the downturn in hotel business and was hurt by partnership disputes.

The property was sold last year at a substantial discount to its announced $57 million cost.

"There's no comparison whatsoever," Kenny said.

As one of the city's newest luxury hotels moves forward, one of its most prominent hotels is going on the market.

Eastdil Realty Co. has been hired to market the Ritz-Carlton, said Patrick Meara, a senior vice president with Chicago-based JMB Realty Corp., which co-owns the hotel with Toronto-based Four Seasons Hotels Inc.

----------

tcorfman@tribune.com

Aaarggh! You just beat me by a second! :) Finally, the eyesore will be filled by 90-story hotel/condo!!!!

This is a fantabulous new!
:dance:

Great news....... so many skyscrapers. Is chicago still the most booming city in America(at least in downtown or in skyscrapers)?

Wait... let me get this straight, is this the same as waterview or another sperate building, because the way Bvictor1 worded the words.

Also... is this going to be 7th place before or after the completion of the Trump and waterview?

Awesome news! :cheers:

This is great news for the Lakeshore East community. Millennium Park has really spurred some great residential development (Heritage, 340OTP). This project will only heighten the value and prestige of this area.

Azn_chi_boy - this is completely separate from Waterview. I think Waterview is going to have a difficult time getting started. From the time I began talking to them in November, the sales staff declared they were weeks away from signing a major hotel operator. That was months ago and they are still giving the same spiel.

This is a boost (although unneeded) to 340OTP and the Lakeshore East development.

Great news!

I nearly fainted when I read this story on the train this morning. Had anyone heard even a whisper about this project before this announcement?

It's a long way from announcement to construction, of course. And any hiccup in the market will scuttle this plan fast. But it's certainly another indicator of the ever more powerful Millennium Park Effect.

It's notable that the article didn't mention an architect or even a timetable for selecting/announcing an architect. It does discuss selection of a marketing firm, which is kind of putting the cart before the horse: how do you sell a building without a design? Maybe it was just a case of poor reporting in the article (what a shocker that would be!)

Kevin -- I think its the case of poor reporting. The article was centered around the fact that Mandarin Oriental was coming to Chicago, *not* that Chicago might gain a new 90-story building. What gives? Who cares about Mandarin Oriental except for real estate types? Who cares about another 90 story tower? A LOT of people.

I don't get Corfman. I thought it generally takes years of working at smaller-city papers to get the chance to vie for Tribune reporter opening. This sort of quality lapse at a major city daily is unacceptable.

As much as it pains me to say ChicagoLover, I think you've got it backwards. Unfortunately, most people in this city would much rather hear about the Mandarin (a name they know) than a 92-story tower. They probably couldn't tell you whether 900 North Michigan is 20 stories or 200 - but, they all know there's a market downstairs and a Tweeter on the 7th level. Nobody in cities gives a shit about architecture except the select few (I would estimate less than 1%).

Every single day, I meet someone in Chicago whose ignorance regarding is a testimonial to what I'm saying.

This development is great news.

But like all great news, I will celebrate with reserve. I want to see some caisson-drilling before I get too excited

Well, I must say, that when the snipped of information was posted yesterday in the Waterview Tower thread I got curious. So I decided to send an email to the U.S Offices of Mandarin Oriental Hotels. I must say, that if the service and response time to guests is as quick and efficient as to which they replied to my email, the hotel guests will be quite pleased...

Below if the coorispondents between my self and a representative of the hotel group...

THE EMAIL I SENT

To Ms. Lou Hammond, or to whom it may concern,

My name is Butler Adams, and I am an architecture student in Chicago. I
have been following a project in Chicago called Waterview Tower, which
is a 89-story building that will have a proposed condo/hotel on several
floors.

Earlier today I came across this small news clip:

Mandarin Oriental To Manage New Chicago Hotel, Residences
HONG KONG (Dow Jones)--Mandarin Oriental Hotel Group said Tuesday it will manage a new 250-room hotel and 50 residences in Chicago. Mandarin Oriental, 75%-owned by Singapore-listed Jardine Strategic Holdings Ltd. (J37.SG), said the hotel and residences are scheduled to open in early 2008. Mandarin Oriental, Chicago will occupy 15 floors of a new 90-storey tower. The Residences at Mandarin Oriental, Chicago, will be located above the hotel with units ranging from 1,000 to 3,000 square feet.

Mandarin Oriental operates 21 hotels worldwide.

Here is the link (http://sg.biz.yahoo.com/050607/15/3sv4n.html)


I was wondering if there is any way for you to confirm that Mandarin
Oriental will be coming to Chicago? I know that the Mandarin Oriental Hotel Group has been making an attempt to enter the Chicago market for almost a decade.

If it's true that Mandarin Oriental Hotels will be apart of Waterview
Tower in Chicago, can you tell me about the project (hotel operators
perspective), and what you expect to accomplish here in Chicago?

I do hope to hear back from someone on this matter.

Butler V. Adams
Architecture Student

THE RESPONSE

Information below:
MANDARIN ORIENTAL ANNOUNCES NEW LUXURY HOTEL
AND RESIDENCES IN CHICAGO


HONG KONG, June 7, 2005 - Mandarin Oriental Hotel Group has announced that it will manage a new 250-room luxury hotel and 50 branded residences which are planned to open in Chicago in early 2008. The project provides the Group with a unique opportunity to establish its luxury brand in another important American city.
Mandarin Oriental, Chicago will occupy 15 floors of a new 90-storey tower which will be an exclusive mixed-use development in Chicago's growing Millennium Park neighborhood. In addition to the hotel and its luxury residences, the new 1.2 million-square-foot development will feature a further 300 deluxe condominiums as well as upscale retail shops.
The project is ideally located for Chicago's world-class cultural attractions, shopping, dining and entertainment facilities. It is adjacent to Millennium Park, the city's renowned centre for art, music, architecture and landscape design, featuring the most sophisticated outdoor concert venue of its kind in the United States, designed by Frank Gehry. Located at 215 North Michigan Avenue, the hotel is also a short walk from the Magnificent Mile Shopping District and is exceptionally placed for easy access to McCormick Place, the largest convention facility in America. Chicago's vast Pedway system is accessible directly from the development, which allows convenient covered walkways to the city's financial district.
Mandarin Oriental, Chicago will be a showcase of innovative, contemporary design, combining a reflection of the Group's oriental heritage with a strong sense of place. The 200 oversized guestrooms and 50 suites will be among the most spacious accommodations in the city, with views of Lake Michigan to the north and east, Millennium Park to the south, and Chicago's celebrated cityscape to the west. The finest entertainment and technology systems will also be a prominent in-room feature.
An array of dining choices will be offered at the hotel's 80-seat signature restaurant, an all-day dining venue, spa café, stylish bar, lobby lounge and Cake Shop - Chicago's version of the legendary "Mandarin Cake Shop" at the flagship Mandarin Oriental in Hong Kong.
The Spa at Mandarin Oriental, Chicago will create an unprecedented relaxation experience within a vibrant urban setting. The 20,000-square-foot facility will feature 14 treatment rooms, with two VIP couples suites, state-of-the-art heat and water treatments, including a Hamam for men and Rasul for women, as well as a spa café offering tailor-made, healthy cuisine. A dedicated pilates and yoga studio will complement the fully-equipped fitness facility. Reflecting the Group's Asian spa expertise in design and service, this facility will offer among the most comprehensive range of wellness, beauty and massage treatments in the Chicago area, with holistic signature treatments created exclusively by Mandarin Oriental.
The hotel will also offer exceptional amenities to business travelers, including the latest in-room technology as well as a full-service business centre. Ample meeting and function space, with a 10,000-square-foot ballroom, and four additional private meeting rooms equipped with state-of-the-art technology will also be featured.
The Residences at Mandarin Oriental, Chicago will be located above the hotel with units ranging from 1,000 to 3,000 square-feet. As with all Residences at Mandarin Oriental, owners will be treated as permanent guests of the hotel and will enjoy exclusive access to the exceptional services and amenities provided on property.
"We are delighted to be opening a new hotel in the celebrated city of Chicago. This project represents a wonderful opportunity for Mandarin Oriental to further strengthen our brand in significant business and leisure destinations worldwide," said Edouard Ettedgui, Group Chief Executive of Mandarin Oriental. "We look forward to bringing Mandarin Oriental's renowned levels of hospitality to this vibrant new development and its remarkable location. We certainly support Mayor Daley's mission for the area's success."
"We are excited about the addition of Mandarin Oriental to the city of Chicago. The development only serves to further enhance the amenities and visitor attractions in and around Millennium Park," said Mayor Richard M. Daley.
The project is being developed by Illinois Center Development, LLC (ICDG), a private investment partnership formed by the development team of Frank Leo and Gerard Kenny of Chicago, Illinois. Mr. Kenny's firm, Kenny Construction Company, will be leading construction of the overall project. The award-winning firm of Solomon Cordwell Buenz (SCB) will be lead architect coordinating with Patrick Danan of ICDG.
"Our project will play an important role in the continuing renaissance of the area surrounding Millennium Park. The development promises to be a new city icon and we are very pleased to be working with Mandarin Oriental to create a unique luxury experience in Chicago," said Frank Leo, a principal of Illinois Center Development, LLC.
Chicago boasts many tourist attractions, including the finest shopping along Michigan Avenue, fine dining and myriad cultural venues, all within walking distance of the new project. Transportation to and from this important Midwestern U.S. city is among the most accessible in the world; Chicago's O'Hare Airport handles more than 55,000 domestic flights and 7,000 international flights a month - with more passengers than any other international airport.
Mandarin Oriental Hotel Group is the award-winning owner and operator of some of the world's most prestigious hotels and resorts, currently operating 21 luxury hotels with a further six under development in Hong Kong and Tokyo (opening 2005), Prague and Riviera Maya, Mexico (2006), Boston (2007) and Chicago (2008). In total, Mandarin Oriental now operates, or has under development, approximately 8,000 rooms in 14 countries with 12 hotels in Asia, ten in The Americas and five in Europe.
# # #

holy crap!! if this happens its friggin awsom . id love to see some renderings if there are any yet.

The award-winning firm of Solomon Cordwell Buenz (SCB) will be lead architect coordinating with Patrick Danan of ICDG.


SCB is a pretty good choice. We should be grateful that Mandarin did not select bland-itecht name Lowenberg for designing a new hotel tower as a new Chicago icon.

Great news. I just wish it wer at least 113 ft. taller.

Wow is this awesome. It seems like everytime I come on here there is news of a new tower going up. Were going to have a whole new skyline by the end up the decade if Chicago keeps building like they are now or are planning on building.

Who all these big projects really get built. I say make them all over 1,000 ft. Show the rest of the world were the home of the skyscraper really is.

"Meanwhile, the owner of the Ritz-Carlton at Water Tower Place said it would put up for sale the 435-room property, one of Chicago's best-known, high-end hotels."

What's the deal with this??? Does the Ritz plan on moving locations or are they out of the chicago market for good? Perhaps they're building a new tower of their own!!! or moving to Waterview. If it is leaving what does that say about Chicago when a city like Denver has Ritz and we don't. Anyways, I'm assuming the property will go condo.

Great news. I just wish it was at least 113 ft. taller.

You're not the only greedy one here. I'm hoping for just 10 more floors, which would not only give us that extra 113 feet but would give us another 100 story tower. :drools:

add a spire like the AT&T building, to make it over 1,000ft.

"Meanwhile, the owner of the Ritz-Carlton at Water Tower Place said it would put up for sale the 435-room property, one of Chicago's best-known, high-end hotels."

What's the deal with this??? Does the Ritz plan on moving locations or are they out of the chicago market for good? Perhaps they're building a new tower of their own!!! or moving to Waterview. If it is leaving what does that say about Chicago when a city like Denver has Ritz and we don't. Anyways, I'm assuming the property will go condo.

The owners of hotels are not always necessarily the operators of hotels. Sometimes hotel companies sell their properties and lease them back while remaining the operator of the site. They can then use the immediate proceeds from the sale to do things they need to do: renovate, buy back stock, whatever. Late last year, Hilton announced they were putting the Palmer House up for sale for this reason. One contingency in any sale would be that Hilton would retain rights to operate the hotel.

I don't think this is what's going on with the Ritz-Carlton. I think this property was already owned by someone other than the hotel and that investor/group is looking to sell to another investor/group. In either case, I don't believe there are any plans to shut down the hotel or move. It's just a matter of the real estate potentially changing hands.

Has anybody seen the rendering on SSP? Strangely, it kinda looks like the Heritage.

I think that's a rendering of an unbuilt project for the area.

Has anybody seen the rendering on SSP? Strangely, it kinda looks like the Heritage.

The picture was that of the Boulvards Project, which was dead about 1 year ago. Think it is just being used to help size up the possibilities.

Is it just me or does 887' seem a bit short for 90 stories?

It's very short.

So am I mistaken? Was Manderin originally planning to operate out of Waterview, but now they are constructing their own highrise hotel? Also, how much in jeopardy is Waterview now without a hotel occupant?

This is a rendering of the Park Boulevard Tower, and older proposal for the site.

http://skyscraperpage.com/gallery/data/554/6324boulevard_east_towers_1.jpg

http://skyscraperpage.com/gallery/data/554/6324boulevard_east_towers_2.jpg

http://skyscraperpage.com/gallery/data/554/6324boulevard_east_towers_3.jpg


So am I mistaken? Was Manderin originally planning to operate out of Waterview, but now they are constructing their own highrise hotel? Also, how much in jeopardy is Waterview now without a hotel occupant?

Well, nothing had ever been confirmed about the Mandarin Oriental being apart of Waterview Tower. It was all speculation.

Reminds me a bit of Trump Toronto.

hey, I found a summary of the article.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The Mandarin Oriental Hotel Group is to manage a new 250-room luxury hotel and 50 branded residences which are planned to open in Chicago in early 2008.

Mandarin Oriental, Chicago will occupy 15 floors of a new 90-storey tower which will be an exclusive mixed-use development in Chicago’s growing Millenium Park neighbourhood. In addition to the hotel and its luxury residences, the new 1.2 million square-foot development will feature a further 300 deluxe condominiums as well as upscale retail shops.

The project is ideally located for Chicago’s world-class cultural attractions, shopping, dining and entertainment facilities. It is adjacent to Millennium Park, the city’s renowned centre for art, music, architecture and landscape design, featuring the most sophisticated outdoor concert venue of its kind in the United States, designed by Frank Gehry. Located at 215 North Michigan Avenue, the hotel is also a short walk from the Magnificent Mile Shopping District and is ideally placed for easy access to McCormick Place, the largest convention facility in America. Chicago’s vast Pedway system is accessible directly from the development, which allows convenient covered walkways to the city’s financial district.

Mandarin Oriental, Chicago will offer 200 oversized guestrooms and 50 suites which will be among the most spacious accommodations in the city, with views of Lake Michigan to the north and east, Millennium Park to the south, and Chicago’s celebrated cityscape to the west.

An array of dining choices will be offered at the hotel’s 80-seat signature restaurant, an all-day dining venue, spa café, stylish bar, lobby lounge and Cake Shop – Chicago’s version of the legendary “Mandarin Cake Shop” at the flagship Mandarin Oriental in Hong Kong.

The 20,000 square-foot Spa at Mandarin Oriental, Chicago will feature 14 treatment rooms, with two VIP couples suites, state-of-the-art heat and water treatments, including a Hamam for men and Rasul for women, as well as a spa café offering tailor-made, healthy cuisine. A dedicated pilates and yoga studio will complement the fully-equipped fitness facility.

The hotel will also offer exceptional amenities to business travellers, including the latest technology in the guest rooms as well as a full-service business centre. Ample meeting and function space, with a 10,000 square-foot ballroom, and four additional private meeting rooms equipped with state-of-the-art technology are also featured.

The Residences at Mandarin Oriental, Chicago will be located above the hotel with units ranging from 1,000 to 3,000 square-feet. As with all Residences at Mandarin Oriental, owners will be treated as permanent guests of the hotel and will enjoy exclusive access to the services and amenities provided on property.

“We are delighted to be opening a new hotel in the celebrated city of Chicago. This project represents a wonderful opportunity for Mandarin Oriental to further strengthen our brand in significant business and leisure destinations worldwide,” said Edouard Ettedgui, Group Chief Executive of Mandarin Oriental. “We look forward to bringing Mandarin Oriental’s renowned levels of hospitality to this vibrant new development and its remarkable location. We certainly support Mayor Daley’s mission for the area’s success.”

“We are excited about the addition of Mandarin Oriental to the city of Chicago. The development only serves to further enhance the amenities and visitor attractions in and around Millennium Park,” said Mayor Richard M. Daley.

The project is being developed by Illinois Center Development, LLC (ICDG), a private investment partnership formed by the development team of Frank Leo and Gerard Kenny of Chicago, Illinois. Mr. Kenny’s firm Kenny Construction Company will be leading construction of the overall project. The award-winning firm of Solomon Cordwell Buenz (SCB) will be lead architect coordinating with Patrick Danan of ICDG.

“Our project will play an important role in the continuing renaissance of the area surrounding Millennium Park. The development promises to be a new city icon and we are very pleased to be working with Mandarin Oriental to create a unique luxury experience in Chicago,” said Frank Leo, a principal of Illinois Center Development, LLC.

Source: http://www.asiatraveltips.com/news05/76-Chicago.shtml

For a moment, I thought it will be a Chicago icon as Mandarin promised. Thankfully, it wasn't. *whew*

If you're referring to the pictures that bvic posted... those aren't the proposal for the Mandarin. That's an old proposal for the same site that never materialized.

I just spoke with John Lahey, who is Presigent of Solomon Cordwell Buenz. I was expecting to leave a voice mail, but hey, what can I say. At this time a rendering is not avaliable :( I was told that they are still in the early design phase, and it would be 1-2 months before something might be presentable.

He was unable to confirm if the height of the building was being measured from the bottom of the pit or from the upper levels of Lake and Stetson, which is where we want the measurements taken from.

He mentioned that the programming for the Mandarin Oriental was a bit different than what they expected, so some things are being worked on.

What I'll probably do is check back in with him at the end of August, and maybe something more will be available. Until then we need to be parient, (which I know is hard for some of you) and keep this thread active with questions and speculation.

What I'll probably do is check back in with him at the end of August, and maybe something more will be available. Until then we need to be parient, (which I know is hard for some of you) and keep this thread active with questions and speculation.

Don't worry, we can all be "parient". ;)

Good news on the height not being final. 887' seems really short for 90 stories, I'm looking for that to go up quite a bit. 900+

Thanks for keeping us informed, BVictor! I have a feeling that it may reach 900 ft or higher.

I think we all can be "parient" throughout summertime. :)

Good news on the height not being final. 887' seems really short for 90 stories, I'm looking for that to go up quite a bit. 900+
the floor count probably isn't solidified at this stage of the game either. maybe it ends up only being 80 floors/800 ft. or maybe it even gets a more severe height reduction.

my point: don't bank on or look for anything at this point in time, it's much too early in the process.

So now are ther still two 90 story towers in the works? Mandarin and Waterview?
How's progress coming along on the Waterview. Is ground breaking in the near future?

^ waterview tower is currently proposed to stand 89 floors. victor has said that constrution would start sometime this summer/fall, but we've still heard absolutely nothing on the hotel operation front, so i still hold some doubts.

He mentioned that the programming for the Mandarin Oriental was a bit different than what they expected, so some things are being worked on.


What does this statement mean? I dont understand.

uhhhhhhhhhh, it's a pretty straightforward statement dude. the programming for this job wasn't exactly what they were expecting so they're doing some more work on it. i don't mean to be a pretentious ass about it, but what don't you understand?

uhhhhhhhhhh, it's a pretty straightforward statement dude. the programming for this job wasn't exactly what they were expecting so they're doing some more work on it. i don't mean to be a pretentious ass about it, but what don't you understand?

Dont be an ass!! If I knew I wouldnt've asked the question. What programming are they talking about? Thats what confused me. Im not sure I know what this programming is? I may have just misunderstood something. Just because you know these things does not mean others will. If I dont know or understand something. I ASK!! Thats the only way you learn. And whats obvious to you may not be to all. If you had no real intention of answering, why post? Other than the fact you had the need to make me feel stupid!! Thanks.

the floor count probably isn't solidified at this stage of the game either. maybe it ends up only being 80 floors/800 ft. or maybe it even gets a more severe height reduction.

Dude, shut up! I don't even want to think about that.

I share the confusion, by programming do we mean the entire package? Number of rooms, floor count, square footage, other construction stuff? Or programming like, hotel operation stuff? Not the best word to use there..

^^ The program is a tool designers use to translate a client/developer's facility needs into a plan. A client will present the designer with a list of what they need. For example, so many square feet for this purpose, so many square feet for that purpose. It's then up to the designer to figure out the blocking and stacking so that the building meets their needs. The developer has a list of needs that they have identified and it is up to the designer to fit that into plans that work and make them both some money.

I share the confusion, by programming do we mean the entire package? Number of rooms, floor count, square footage, other construction stuff? Or programming like, hotel operation stuff? Not the best word to use there..

Thanks. What you have is exactly what I was getting at.

^^ The program is a tool designers use to translate a client/developer's facility needs into a plan. A client will present the designer with a list of what they need. For example, so many square feet for this purpose, so many square feet for that purpose. It's then up to the designer to figure out the blocking and stacking so that the building meets their needs. The developer has a list of needs that they have identified and it is up to the designer to fit that into plans that work and make them both some money.

Ah okay. Cool to know. I didnt know that...obviously. Thanks HowardL :)

Dont be an ass!! If I knew I wouldnt've asked the question. What programming are they talking about? Thats what confused me. Im not sure I know what this programming is? I may have just misunderstood something. Just because you know these things does not mean others will. If I dont know or understand something. I ASK!! Thats the only way you learn. And whats obvious to you may not be to all. If you had no real intention of answering, why post? Other than the fact you had the need to make me feel stupid!! Thanks.

dude, i apologize. i falsely assumed that everyone on this forum knows what a building program is. i didn't know that that was the part you didn't understand. i can't read minds. i wasn't trying to be an ass, i literally didn't know what part of that statement you didn't understand. if you had just asked "what does programming mean?" i would have been glad to answer your question, but because i sometimes forget that not everyone in this community is involved in the proffession, it was hard for me to understand what you didn't understand.

again, my apologies.

dude, i apologize. i falsely assumed that everyone on this forum knows what a building program is. i didn't know that that was the part you didn't understand. i can't read minds. i wasn't trying to be an ass, i literally didn't know what part of that statement you didn't understand. if you had just asked "what does programming mean?" i would have been glad to answer your question, but because i sometimes forget that not everyone in this community is involved in the proffession, it was hard for me to understand what you didn't understand.

again, my apologies.

Nah, dont worry about it. I guess I shouldve been more clear in my question. My apologies for that. I just couldnt figure out how I wanted to phrase it. BUT, now I know what it means and thats what matters.

I digress. :)

Great explanation Howard. I think programming can be simply thought of as a building's "uses." How are people going to interact with the architecture; what is the function of the space supposed to be?

^-- just an even simpler answer.

Mandarin Oriental, Chicago (Opening 2008)

Mandarin Oriental, Chicago will occupy 15 floors of a new 90-storey tower which will be an exclusive mixed-use development in Chicago’s growing Millennium Park neighbourhood, and is ideally located for Chicago’s world-class cultural attractions, shopping, dining and entertainment facilities.

The hotel will be a showcase of innovative, contemporary design, combining a reflection of the Group’s oriental heritage with a strong sense of place. The 20,000 square-foot Spa will create an unprecedented relaxation experience within a vibrant urban setting.

In addition to the 250 spacious guestrooms and suites, the property will also feature 50 luxurious branded residences and a further 300 deluxe condominiums, as well as upscale retail shops.


http://www.mandarinoriental.com/hotelsite/520/images/our_com_dev_chi.jpg

Mandarin Oriental, Chicago (Opening 2008)

Mandarin Oriental, Chicago will occupy 15 floors of a new 90-storey tower which will be an exclusive mixed-use development in Chicago’s growing Millennium Park neighbourhood, and is ideally located for Chicago’s world-class cultural attractions, shopping, dining and entertainment facilities.

The hotel will be a showcase of innovative, contemporary design, combining a reflection of the Group’s oriental heritage with a strong sense of place. The 20,000 square-foot Spa will create an unprecedented relaxation experience within a vibrant urban setting.

In addition to the 250 spacious guestrooms and suites, the property will also feature 50 luxurious branded residences and a further 300 deluxe condominiums, as well as upscale retail shops.


http://www.mandarinoriental.com/hotelsite/520/images/our_com_dev_chi.jpg

That looks like the rendering for the old Park Boulevard Tower project. Is that design "back on the books", so to speak? Or is this just a "filler" image until the offical plans are released?

That looks like the rendering for the old Park Boulevard Tower project. Is that design "back on the books", so to speak? Or is this just a "filler" image until the offical plans are released?


I don't really know. When I flip back and forth, between the 2, they seem to be one in the same, but it's the image that I got off of the Mandarin Oriental website.

Cool. Glad you guys heard about it then. Didn't see it on the first pg of discussions and didn't bother searching for it. I generally don't follow Chicago development as much as Miami & NYC, so wasn't really sure... I'm sure I'll be checking it out once it opens.

Man... I'm really pulling for this project. Nothing makes me happier than a supertall :)

Man... I'm really pulling for this project. Nothing makes me happier than a supertall :)
especially one that fills a yawning cavern of prime real estate.

Is it just me or does that look very similar to The Heritage at Millenium Park?

Is it just me or does that look very similar to The Heritage at Millenium Park?
^ i agree , its not the same but simular

How can you guys even begin to speculate what this thing looks like from an image that size? It's barely a smudge on my screen!

Well now it looks like there are two 90 story projects in the works for downtown, excluding the Trump which is already in construcion phase. Anyone want to lay some odds if either the Waterview or the Manderin project will actually be built? I'm optimistic of both projects.

^None of the two projects have my confidence yet, they've got a long way to go before I'll bet they even break ground. Waterview, from where it's at right now, may as well have been announced yesterday.

I've actually got more faith in the Mandarin project than I do in WT. Sorry Butler :)

Ya gotta have faith. It will be built. And the Cubs will beat the White Sox in the world series. You'll see. :)

Latoso, you make it oh so difficult not to comment on that. Gonna try to stay on subject...... :weirdo: J/K!!

anyways, I have faith that both will be built. WV seems to be too far along unlike say... 7SD, (to me thats a good enough sign) when they land a hotel tennant- its a done deal, (hopefully in the very near future) and the amount of money, or borrowing power behind MO seems so make it as likely as any tower proposed to be built.

I emailed The Mandarin Oriental about the rendition of this tower and they said...

Dear Chad,

Many thanks for your interest in Mandarin Oriental, Chicago. At this time a rendering of the project is not available.

Best,

Katie

Good effort, Chad.

I guess we have to sit tight and wait.

I emailed The Mandarin Oriental about the rendition of this tower and they said...

You sent an email to Katie McCall. That's the same lady who sent me the press release...

I even sent her renderings of the old Boulevard East Tower which appears to be the same rendering that's on the Mandarin site, she didn't respond to that email.

anything new with this proposed development ? its been a month since anyone has posted any updates on this puppy. id hate to see this one fall to pieces.(id hate to see any development fall to pieces for that matter)

I have generally considered this proposal dead upon delivery. There are too many projects ahead of this one with similar programs. How many condo hotels does Chicago demand?

But Mandarin will need a place to go no matter what. Either this, Block 37, *maybe* Waterview, or they could sign on to the Fordham Spire, although I'm not sure if they're the right hotel for such a building.

but...the mandarin hotel has not only secured an investment in this project but according to some records they accualy are the sole investores and developers of the building , which means that everything is set and ready for them to take it into the design stage. so if their the developers and they announced there comming then that means they prob. already secured funds for the project , so now architects are prob working on it as we speak and its just a matter of time before construction starts.

from this article we can determine that this project may not have fallen through the cracks yet! plus it seems like their is infact a private investment group interested in funding the project!
-----------------------------------------------

United States Developers Believe That ‘Super-Tall’ Buildings Make Sense
13 September 2005

The Council for Tall Buildings and Urban Habitat reports from New York that more skyscrapers are planned for the United States than ever, despite predictions to the contrary following the 9/11 terrorist attack four years ago. The technical, financial and political challenges builders face in taking them from the drawing boards to completion is the subject of the Council’s World Congress in New York City from October 16-19. An estimated 400 people from more than 30 nations are expected. Among 110 scheduled presentations will be one by Freedom Tower architect David Childs of SOM. Tishman Speyer’s Tom Farrell will report on restoring Rockefeller Plaza; and Skyscraper Safety Campaign founder Sally Regenhard will give her views on building safety and the attitudes of builders and developers.

“Super tall buildings make sense for an abundance of reasons, and Americans—both in the commercial and residential sectors—are showing new interest in working and living in them,” says Ron Klemencic, chairman of the Council’s executive committee. In general, the building industry defines a ‘super tall’ building as one that is more than 70 stories.

The nation’s tallest building is the 1,450-foot Sears Tower, but Chicago has plans to go taller. Architect Santiago Calatrava recently unveiled a proposal for a 2,000-foot tower that would be the nation’s tallest. When Chicago’s Trump Tower is completed (scheduled for 2007), it could reach 1,360 feet. Illinois Center Development, a private investment group, is planning a 90-story mixed use structure and the Mandarin Oriental Hotel Group has agreed to take 15 floors.
In New York City, the 1,776-foot Freedom Tower is on the boards. In Las Vegas, Ivana Trump announced she would develop an 80-story condo tower. Miami recently inaugurated the Four Seasons Hotel—at 794 feet, it’s the tallest building south of Atlanta.

Asia and the Middle East lead the skyscraper race. Taiwan, Malaysia and China have eight of the world’s ten tallest buildings, including Taipei 101, the record-holder, at 1,667 feet. Development teams from both Taipei 101 and the Burj Dubai, a structure underway in the United Arab Emirates, which when complete, could near a half-mile high, will talk about technological and engineering challenges in erecting their structures at the October Tall Building Congress.

Well I hope this scraper gets built. I would love to see renderings when they become available.

Well who's ready for some drama.....

I saw a front page headline in the Sunday Tribune at work, but didn't get a chance to read it, but it asked who is building the Mandarin Oriental, and apparently the people who are submitting this project to city hall have mob connections. The on-line version of the trib has not updated yet, so be on the look out for today's paper.

Hahahaha. That's nice. Wonder if that puts this one in the gutter.

Since I buy the Sunday Trib Saturday, I'll try and scan it.

Well who's ready for some drama.....

I saw a front page headline in the Sunday Tribune at work, but didn't get a chance to read it, but it asked who is building the Mandarin Oriental, and apparently the people who are submitting this project to city hall have mob connections.

There's a cement shoe joke in there, but I'm not quite sure how to phrase it.

Here it is, not the best scan ever, but before the website:

http://img361.imageshack.us/img361/8094/mandarin12bl.png
http://img361.imageshack.us/img361/456/mandarin29dv.png
http://img361.imageshack.us/img361/4861/mandarin33sf.png

Not the way I wanted to hear about it, but good to know it's still alive.

Since I buy the Sunday Trib Saturday, I'll try and scan it.


I never understood that one. Why do people buy tomorrows paper today? This ain't fuckin' "Early Edition (refering to the tv show). Seems like a waste not to get the most updated information as possible....

by the way it's ( it is ) buy not by or bi ....

if you are so inclineded?


relax by the way.....oh boy the mob.....rbrbrbrbbrbrbrbrbrbrbbrb.....i am shakin in my boots...

this is chicago you jag*ff* it woudln't be with out it


get of your high horse

A repost of the scanned article.

And I know it's buy, but it was also 4am when I wrote the reply. You knew what the hell I meant didn't you?


Just who is building Mandarin?
Filings on downtown high-rise reveal partners linked to alleged mob `front'

By Thomas A. Corfman
Tribune staff reporter
Published October 2, 2005

Gerard Kenny, the Chicago construction executive who is planning to build a 90-story hotel skyscraper adjacent to Millennium Park, has a registered business venture with a developer identified by authorities in Pennsylvania and New Jersey as a front man for organized crime figures.

Leonard J. Mercer Jr. was Kenny's original partner in the $550 million deal to build the Mandarin Oriental, envisioned as a glittering addition to Chicago's skyline. Kenny said Mercer later withdrew from the deal. He was replaced, however, by two associates who were denied licenses last year by New York racing authorities after published reports highlighted their business ties to Mercer.

Mercer is a convicted felon who was once described by the Pennsylvania Crime Commission as a "front man" and "land speculator for various organized crime figures."

Kenny and Mercer operate a company called Wheeling Partners of Illinois LLC, which filed documents with the state as recently as June and has not been dissolved. Kenny said Friday that the Wheeling firm, formed to build the Mandarin, is now inactive.

Instead, Kenny is building the skyscraper with Patrick Danan and Frank A. Leo, businessmen with close ties to Mercer. Danan and Leo tried to buy a New York racetrack last year with the financial backing of Mercer. They were denied racing licenses when they did not provide state-mandated financial disclosures.

The quiet connection between the massive Mandarin construction project and an alleged associate of the mob wasn't noticed by the city's Planning Department when aides attached Mayor Richard Daley's name to a press release hailing the Mandarin development.

"The project only serves to further enhance the amenities and visitor attractions in and around Millennium Park," Daley was quoted as saying on June 6.

Connie Buscemi, spokeswoman for the city Planning Department, defended the city, saying it could not have known of Mercer's ties to the project because a formal development plan had not yet been filed. Such a plan, she said, would have triggered closer scrutiny by city officials.

Nonetheless, the Planning Department does not routinely conduct extensive background checks on participants in private real estate deals the way state agencies might investigate participants in regulated industries such as gambling.

Even so, a simple Internet search would immediately illuminate the connections between Danan, Leo and Mercer through the New York racetrack deal.

Because of the lack of regulatory oversight, it is difficult to document how frequently investors who have been publicly linked to organized crime enter the Chicago real estate market.

"There are all kinds of ways that organized crime could have a piece of this," said Douglas Roller, a former head of the Chicago organized crime task force of the U.S. Justice Department.

"The biggest issue is: Where is the money coming from?" said Roller, now in private practice in St. Louis with the law firm Helfrey Simon & Jones.

The three participants in the Mandarin deal--Kenny, Danan and Leo--insist that the project is legitimately funded and free of involvement by organized crime.

But Alton Miller, Mayor Harold Washington's former press secretary, said the city and the mayor risked, at the least, an uncomfortable public-relations problem.

Miller said that Daley's endorsement of a project with any connection to Mercer or his associates represented "sloppy staff work," especially given that prosecutors are investigating allegations of City Hall corruption.

"At a moment in his career like the one we are in, you would think they'd be on red alert over there," he said.

Mercer, a Florida real estate developer, was identified in a 1995 New Jersey State Commission of Investigation report as an "associate" of Philadelphia's Scarfo crime family and a "front" in a real estate deal for a bookmaker linked to organized crime.

Mercer did not respond to requests for an interview. Danan and Leo declined to be interviewed, but responded in writing to some questions from the Tribune.

Kenny said that his company with Mercer for the Mandarin project had been dissolved, but he could not explain why Illinois state records showed it still existed, as of Friday.

At first, Kenny explained that he asked Mercer to withdraw because of the controversy over the New York racing deal. But in a subsequent interview, he claimed Mercer dropped out voluntarily.

"He stepped aside because of his reputation," Kenny said. "He told me, `You have a great deal here, and I don't want to interfere.'"

About Mercer, Kenny said, "I have nothing but good things to say about him." And Leo, a wealthy retired printer, "is a man of his word," Kenny added. "I checked him out."

Kenny, 56, has controlled the Mandarin site since 1998. He now spends most of his time on real estate deals, although he said he remains a director of Kenny Construction Co. The Wheeling-based firm has been involved in major Chicago public works projects, including the renovation of Soldier Field and the downtown repair project after the 1992 Loop flood.

Kenny's brother, James, a former company executive and a Republican fundraiser, was named U.S. ambassador to Ireland in 2003. The company and its executives have also given contributions to some Democrats, including Daley, who has received $8,000 from them since late 1999.

Kenny Construction would earn lucrative fees building the 1.2 million-square-foot Mandarin project, to be completed in 2008. Plans for the 215 N. Michigan Ave. development include 300 luxury condos and 250 hotel-condo units. An additional 50 condos, to be called Mandarin Oriental residences, would use the amenities of the hotel, including a spa. A New York-based spokeswoman for Mandarin did not return calls requesting comment.

Last year, Mercer, Leo and Danan formed a company for the Mandarin project without Kenny, but the firm was dissolved last month when it did not file an annual report.

Kenny announced the Mandarin deal on June 6, listing Leo and Danan in the press release as partners. Two days later, Mercer's name appeared on paperwork filed with the state by Kenny's Wheeling Partners.

Another company, named 215 Developer, was formed with Kenny in July, Danan and Leo said. This company acquired the Mandarin site for $27.2 million last month from a venture controlled by Kenny, who bought the parcel seven years ago for $4.4 million. Although Kenny has partly cashed in on his investment, he said he remains deeply involved in day-to-day operations of the hotel development, he said.

Mercer, 71, owns International Housing Development Group Corp., a Ft. Lauderdale company of which Danan, a 60-year-old architect, is president, according to corporate and court records. During most of the last five years, Mercer was listed as vice president, but removed himself as an officer this year.

In the early 1980s, Mercer was already an established Philadelphia real estate investor when he became part of a venture that developed the Ocean Club condominiums, a twin, 34-story tower complex on Atlantic City's Boardwalk, perhaps his first high-profile deal.

His business interests eventually expanded to Florida, where he owned a Ft. Lauderdale hotel and Ta-Boo, a well-known Palm Beach nightspot.

But Ta-Boo filed for bankruptcy in 1985, and Mercer later pleaded guilty to federal charges related to kickbacks for a loan for Ta-Boo from a New Jersey Teamster pension fund, according to newspaper accounts and a 1990 report by the Pennsylvania Crime Commission.

In 1995, Leo retired after selling off Colorforms, a direct mail printing firm he founded and co-owned in New York. It was sold to a company then called Wallace Computer Services, of west suburban Hillside, for $27 million in cash and stock, plus assumed debt.

Between 1996 and 1998, Leo was at various times chairman, acting chief executive and a director of a New Jersey racetrack company controlled by Robert Brennan, the flamboyant owner of First Jersey Securities Inc. Brennan was found guilty in 2001 of money laundering and bankruptcy fraud and sentenced to more than nine years in prison.

In a related civil case, the Securities and Exchange Commission alleged in 2000 that a company controlled by "close associates" of Brennan, including Leo, was a front for Brennan's purchase of a Ft. Lauderdale cruise ship at a time when Brennan was under a court order not to transfer assets, court documents show.

"He told me he was just helping a friend," Kenny said of Leo.

Based on the SEC's allegations, a federal judge barred a transfer of the ship and issued a criminal contempt citation against Brennan, who received an additional jail sentence. Leo was not charged with any wrongdoing in the case.

Last year, Leo and Danan were part of a venture that acquired a majority interest in Vernon Downs, a hotel and harness racing track near Syracuse, N.Y., also approved for 1,000 video lottery terminals for computerized gambling.

Although not a named buyer, Mercer helped finance the racetrack deal by guaranteeing a portion of the loan used to buy the stake, and his development company would have redeveloped the 600-acre property, according to documents related to the sale.

Amid newspaper reports of Mercer's role in the venture and Leo's ties to Brennan, Danan and Leo did not complete financial disclosures required by the New York State Racing and Wagering Board. A cash crisis then forced the racetrack's parent company to file for bankruptcy protection from creditors.

The racing board is still seeking to force the Mercer group to divest its stake in the racetrack, though Mercer and Danan deny having ownership, according to bankruptcy court documents.

In a written response to questions posed by the Tribune, Danan and Leo said they dropped the racetrack applications because they no longer need licenses. But in July, they teamed up with Mercer and the seller to propose a reorganization plan for the racetrack that ultimately proved unsuccessful, according to court documents.

Danan and Mercer are listed as managers of 19 active companies, five of which include Leo, according to Florida corporate records.

Chicago's Department of Planning said it was unaware of all this when it provided two quotations from Mayor Daley for the press announcement about the Mandarin development. Hong Kong-based Mandarin Oriental International Ltd., which is known for its high level of service, has agreed to manage the hotel but will not own it.

Buscemi explained the city's praise for the project, saying, "Whenever a business like Mandarin Oriental expresses interest in coming to Chicago, we are always pleased at hearing that."

But she said the project would face closer scrutiny after a formal development plan is filed.

"There is still a very public process that would involve the Plan Commission and possibly the City Council, depending on what is proposed," Buscemi said. "We will look at every aspect that we need to look at before a final decision is made."

Kenny remains optimistic about the deal.

"The mayor's very excited about the project," he said.

Oh, dear! Hope it will not be dealyed further longer.

Last week, Mandarin announced an additional market: Dallas. And it shows a rendering of 70 stories building.

We have yet seen the rendering of Chi-MO.

im loosing faith in this one . and im realy annoyed because if this wasnt uncovered then the manderine would have prob been built but now its down from 55% chance to 15% chance in my books. what a piss off!!!

Because I'm cool like that BVictor. :)

I enjoy getting the news in "advance" or they screw up my deliveries all the time or I enjoy buying two of them.

Because I'm cool like that BVictor. :)

I enjoy getting the news in "advance" or they screw up my deliveries all the time or I enjoy buying two of them.

whatever floast your boat, it's your $1.80

Someone made a big mistake (non-local goverment) and I think this is an attempt to smear and destroy the project before the lawsuit occurs. My lips are sealed...but it is the reason there has been a hold up. Keep your eyes open and don't let the politics blind you.

(Ask yourself...when in the hell did it matter if financing is coming from the mob?) Now it is a big deal?

ok was it our friend carley or trump ?? lol

ok was it our friend carley or trump ?? lol

non-local government

Just wanna know, so they will ue thi design finally??

http://www.mandarinoriental.com/hotelsite/520/images/our_com_dev_chi.jpg

http://www.mandarinoriental.com/hotel/520000016.asp#chi

Wow. Never noticed this:

"Water enthusiasts will find a world class site for scuba diving and snorkelling, with a natural barrier reef, shallow reefs and a famed coral wall on the resort’s doorstep."

Really now? Aren't they landlocked :hahaha:

Chad, that was the design for an older tower for around the same height that was proposed on the same site before Mandarin Oriental. Whether they use it or not we don't currently know (except that SCB is designing it).

http://img467.imageshack.us/img467/286/chicagotowersm8kr.jpg

I actually emailed them several weeks back, but no [automated] response even. They probably won't release any new info until they've resolved whatever problems they had (address/mob).

ah...so while they finallizing things up. They just showing this old version on their website instead?, thats cool, Thanks :okay:

I think so. I mean, they could still use that design, but we just don't know yet. Speaking of their website, I just checked it out again. Looks like they got my email - no more scuba diving in Lake Michigan :)

There was another piece on hotel/condo development in the business section. I wouldn't take this as the ultimate source, but they said 2009 occupancy for Mandarin. They also mentioned a Palladium Development, which I have never heard of, but found an UC website for.

Well I saw the drawings for this one today. All I can really say is that height wise its in the same league as waterview and trump if you know what I mean.

Well I saw the drawings for this one today. All I can really say is that height wise its in the same league as waterview and trump if you know what I mean.
holy crap! they raized the height!?!?!?! its a 1000+ footer!?!?!? fuck yeh!
i sure hope thats what your insinuation at least

Seriously, you're one of my favorite users :)

I'm a very happy man now, even if I have a pile of work left to do. Anything else you can tell us that won't get you in trouble? Any personal remarks like "it's really cool" or something?

I knew they would try and compete with the big boys...

Do you know when they'll release renderings?

Dang! I should've get you a spy camera so you can secretly photograph any rendering!

So if this new info is true, I think that old rendering is garbage (hopefully). I mean, it's not the worse building ever, but it's really tame and doesn't say anything about Mandarin Oriental, especially if they want to compete with the other big towers. Imagine four 1000-footers going up in a row almost. Only in Chicago. And maybe Dubai.

Edit: And I'm forgetting the other towers too. Start off on the tour seeing Fordham Spire, then make your way down the river and see all of Lakeshore East and the huge Studio Gang tower (plus the other large one across), then keep going and see Aon, 2Pru, and Mandarin. Then keep going and see the Intercontinental Hotel and then Trump. And wrap it up with Waterview and 300 North LaSalle.

I'll be a tourist in 2010 and take a boat ride again :hahaha:

The old rendering is garbage. And maybe I just haven't seen the actual address shown on this site before but it looks like 225 N Michigan.

Haven't we already been told that the old rendering is for an old project and was only shown as a place-holder and some sort of possible indication of scale?

The old rendering is garbage. And maybe I just haven't seen the actual address shown on this site before but it looks like 225 N Michigan.

Yeah that has been talked about on here before. They are using the Pedway to give it "a Michigan Avenue Entrance", pretty pathetic but whatever sells the units better, go for it. :)

Well I saw the drawings for this one today. All I can really say is that height wise its in the same league as waterview and trump if you know what I mean.

Sweet!

The old rendering is garbage. And maybe I just haven't seen the actual address shown on this site before but it looks like 225 N Michigan.

So is the new rendering in the same class as Trump and Waterview as well??

richardsonhomebuiyers is saying it's in the same league...so let's hope it's in the same class!!!!

The old rendering is garbage. And maybe I just haven't seen the actual address shown on this site before but it looks like 225 N Michigan.

This has been bugging me for a while now as to when they'll release new information. :)

Is SCB still designing this tower?

A simple Yes or No is acceptable, if possible. If you can say more if the answer is no, please do :)

Spyguy SCB is still he architect for this building. As far a s when they will release the renderings I have no idea. We just did some newer drawings for them the other day and now the height is showing as around 900 again.

I'm now confused to.

Well that's really weird (height). Thanks anyway.

900 ft ain't that bad. But SCB is still working on design. Who knows? They could change their mind by adding 100ft at the request of Samuel Assefa.

Two projects that I can't see making it past the drawing board Mandarin, and Fourth Presbyterian

Two projects that I can't see making it past the drawing board Mandarin, and Fourth Presbyterian


So if Mandarin doesn't build its own highrise, do you thing they will try to find another location in the city? My understanding is that they have been itching to get in for years. They may not raise the capital for their own highrise, but if not, I bet they'll still find a way into the city.

I think 4th Presbyterian is a goner. This one I still have hope for, however. The mob thing was a scare, but I don't think that's enough to bring about this project's end.

Mandarin Oriental wanted to enter this market for a long time, and they're going to get in one way or another. An amazing, eye-catching design, Mandarin Oriental's name (which I think is "worth" more than Shangri-la's name), and the fact that they can sell this as a Michigan Avenue tower will hopefully make this tower a reality.

This one has a better chance than the 4th Presbyterian. Still not going to be easy.

Any updates on this one that you can tell us about, richardson? :)

Yeah, I feel ya spyguy. I'm getting ancy on this one too. I am really anticipating the new rendering (and dying with anticipation with the studio gang tower).

It has been 8 months since the MO's announcement. 8 frakkin' months without a single rendering! 8 frakkin' months of waiting! 8 frakkin' months of nothing's going on except the mob tie! and 8 frakkin months of killing us without mercy! :gaah:

We might go ahead and accept the early verdict: death of MO-Chicago. :gaah:

This project is not dead. There was some printing just last week. Not for the building it self but for the sales center.

This project is not dead. There was some printing just last week. Not for the building it self but for the sales center.
Oh, thank you, richard! Thanks so much for letting us know. I feel better now. :rock:

One other thing; Did you sneak a peek at the print? If so, pleasse describe.

I did peek at the print. Actually I see just about everyone that comes through. 108 N State, Parkview, Elysian, OMP, ect... I just don't have the time to really look into to much detail of them and I can only say so much.

As far as the Mandarin sales center prints. I didn't see to much. I just remember seeing them come in for it and setting it up quick. There really wasn't much to see on them worth noting.

I will keep everyone up to date on this one as much as I can.

When did they announce a new rendering for this building? So it won't be the one that resembles 340 On The Park? I'm out of the loop on this one (excuse the pun.)

When did they announce a new rendering for this building? So it won't be the one that resembles 340 On The Park? I'm out of the loop on this one (excuse the pun.)

I don't think there was any official announcement. But
richardsonhomebuyers was kind enough to let us know that the previous rendering is not whats planned.

Well we just got some new drawings in for this one. Looks like it is 1,017' to the very top and 1,079 from the ccd. So far the building is not bad looking. I have yet to see a color rendering of it.

:runaway: :runaway: :runaway:

Did I ever tell you how awesome you are? :D

That's quite tall, and it's good that things are still going on. Is there any vague description you can give us, like BVictor's "thin is in" comment? :)

1,017? Wow, that makes it 130 feet taller than is depeicted below.

http://img523.imageshack.us/img523/3998/DPFS.gif

Yeah, that pic was intended to show how it might be better if MO wasn't built as it blocked several sightlines to FS, but since I only have a basic massing model (due to lack of renderings), I never made any othe shots centered on MO.

awesome awesome awesome...can't wait to see the renderings.

STR, your work is amazing!

Richardsonhomebuyers, thanks for updating us!

Great job!

I've just seen a rendering of it along with Aqua. The current rendering that we have for it, the former Park Boulevard or whatever is very outdated. Manderin is quite modern looking, but you can still tell that it was designed by SCB. From the documentation that I saw today, Mandarin will be 64 stories and 879' 6" as measured from Stetson.

What the hell. Now I'm a little mad/confused. Someone must be viewing outdated material because there is a huge difference between 1000 ft and 90 floors and 880 ft and only 64 floors.

im even more confused, kingofdurians was saying that the Manderin was going to be in the Aqua. so somthing screwy is goin on around here!

Victor how many drawings did you see? I noticed some the other day that say what you are saying. However in the same set of drawings they have the height that I posted a couple days ago.

The only way to know for sure would be to post the drawings ;)

The only way to know for sure would be to post the drawings ;)

Thats what Im saying. Let the public judge for ourselves. :)

im gonna cross my fingers on this one and hope this one will break 1000ft as we all hoped it might

richardsonhomebuyers, did you get my PM's?

Yeah Adam I got them. It is going to be next week at the earliest that I can get them.

Sounds good, thanks rich. I really hope this one gets built. With 2Pru, AON, Aqua, and Mandarin I think it will create a man made mountain right there. Screw urban cannons, Chicago has an urban mountain. :)

^^^^^there are plenty of urban cannons in Chi....just go to the west side :) :lol:

^Ya, I know Chicago has urban canyons too. I just thought that goes with out saying though. Sorry for the spelling mistake you smart ass. :laugh:

Crazy Ivan on SSP found this hidden in one of those company/investor PDFs that are typically boring to look through:

http://img130.imageshack.us/img130/15/1044336038f4dc9f32ao6ev.jpg

The design already seems really modern.

Hmm. I like!

So do I. I feel much more assured that this project is still alive and that its design will be very nice.

Fascinating.....

That rendering looks quite similar to the pics in post 115 or 117 of the 321 E. Ohio Development (http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=170247&page=6&pp=20). Thoughts?

Well both were done by SCB so that might explain some of the similarities, but they're still two separate projects.

Any confirmations on this one, richardson? Is it a plain (glassy) box all the way to the top, or are there some surprises still?

Has there been any more word on the apparent contradiction between richardonhomebuyers figure of 1017 and Bvics 800ft+ figure

Well both were done by SCB so that might explain some of the similarities, but they're still two separate projects.

Any confirmations on this one, richardson? Is it a plain (glassy) box all the way to the top, or are there some surprises still?

No, it's not a plain glassy box.

Thanks, and that's good too hear. Not that all new boxes are bad, but I would much rather prefer something a bit different.

Now let see who's the man...haha :D

http://img530.imageshack.us/img530/6954/mandarinchicago1ig.jpg

Interesting. Very interesting. What, when, where and how? I guess "what" doesnt apply.

^Chad! What's the source for this rendering? Is it really MO-Chicago?

^^ Quite positive it is.

http://img107.imageshack.us/img107/6853/mandarinchicago19zp.jpg

Hmmmm.....fascinating design.

The height, The height is it 800 whatever or 1017' come on I gotta know

From the look of the rendering relative to 2 Pru, this building must be around 1000-1200 feet.

That cat is out of the bag, sort out. I don't recall a spire however. Actually, much of the top looks different from that, but if that's what they're showcasing then maybe that is it.

this design is looking realy tall the way the depict it next to the 2 pru. building. i agree with hydogen , this looks to be in the 1100-1200 range! ..........uhhh ugh guhgg ..... .. hold on a sec , i gotta go clean up my pants.does any one here have a towel

STR get it rendered on your map!!!

If it's not accurate then there's no point in doing it. Unless I see otherwise, I think that this design shown is an earlier version.

^That and the rendering is so screwed up that there isn't much I can do with it. I could chamfer the western roofline, but that's about it without any other reference. I really need some concrete numbers. Right now, there's to much up in the air.

And post all requests in the main model thread. I don't have time to pour through every thread in the section looking for tips.

Thats not it. Sorry

So, we have to sit tight and wait for the public release of MO's rendering.

:gaah:

So here it is guys:


Mandarin Oriental Tower,Chicago.
65 floors
http://img502.imageshack.us/img502/669/mandarinchicago9pu.jpg

http://www.mandarinorientaltower.com/

http://img516.imageshack.us/img516/6021/chicagotowersm9md.jpg

Very nice looking. I like the suddel Mandrian fan ecthed into the glass. This is a nice modern bit of tallness that will be a welcome addition to the skyline.

So no slant on top a la Citibank... I still like it.

The tower is fine from the waistline up... doesn't really inspire me to say much. But that base? That's some sexy shit. I think this will be one of the great contemporary street-level experiences in Chicago to date.

I like the design. It's not spectacular, but it offers the skyline another dose of modern, glassy goodness. I agree with geoff_diamond: the base is gorgeous. It will interact beautifully with street-level. Transparent and energetic, it is a far cry from many of the introverted, windowless cube bases plaguing River North.

So this thing is 65 floors not 90? With this design i don't really mind though. Im thinkin 700-800 feet? Its a good quality building.

I like the design. It's not spectacular, but it offers the skyline another dose of modern, glassy goodness. I agree with geoff_diamond: the base is gorgeous. It will interact beautifully with street-level. Transparent and energetic, it is a far cry from many of the introverted, windowless cube bases plaguing River North.

Is there a thread on this building in the Highrise News and Developments section? It might be a good idea, now that we finally have a reliable rendering. Or, if there already is one, it should definitely be added.

There isn't. Only reason I'm hesitant to make one is because we don't know the final height or floor count (yes they say 65, but I doubt that includes the lantern at top).

So no slant on top a la Citibank... I still like it.
the slant from the previouse rendering was shown on the other side of the building , so it ay still be there.

65 floos? what happened ? they chikened out of pushing for the sky?

The curve doesn't exist. That was probably an old rendering just. But the balconies (I think) form another kind of curve on the sides. I also like that big glass box to the left that's above the base; good location for something like a restaurant.

Also, just by counting by hand I get something like 72 floors from base to top.

Nice design. I like it. Does anyone here think MO looks similar to proposed Inter-Continental in term of renderings? It is like they are cousins, lol.

Mandarin will be 64 stories and 879' 6" as measured from Stetson. Just in case, any forumer wants height info.

I just heard a blurp on Fox news Chicago about the Mandarin. They showed a model of the tower as well. I'm beginning to take this project more seriously.

This Mornings Chicago Tribune 3/21/06


Hotel, condos design shown
Questions remain on Mandarin/Oriental

By Thomas A. Corfman
Tribune staff reporter
Published March 21, 2006


The design for the controversial Mandarin Oriental condominium/hotel tower was unveiled Monday by principals in the massive project, despite unanswered questions about its backers.

The development was proposed in June by a venture that included Frank A. Leo, a former New York print company owner, and Florida architect/developer Patrick Danan.

In October the Chicago Tribune reported that Leo and Danan were denied licenses by New York racing authorities in 2004 after published reports of their business ties to Leonard J. Mercer Jr., who has been identified by authorities in Pennsylvania and New Jersey as a front man for organized crime figures.

The skyscraper is proposed for a site at Lake and Stetson Streets that was controlled by Gerard Kenny, a construction executive turned developer who retains an ownership stake in the project.

Mercer, a veteran Florida developer, was originally a partner in the Chicago Mandarin project, though Kenny has claimed he has withdrawn.

The chief executive of the Americas for the luxury Hong Kong hotel chain declined to comment Monday about Mercer or his ties to Danan and Leo.

"I don't really want to comment. . . . I don't know, and I don't want to comment on that," Wolfgang Hultner said during an interview after the press conference. Mandarin previously did not return requests for comment.

Kenny, formerly a top executive with Wheeling-based Kenny Construction Co., also declined to comment Monday. Leo and Danan have previously said they dropped the horseracing applications after a racetrack deal fell through.

During the press conference Leo, who has little real estate experience, downplayed the difficulty of his new profession.

"This developer stuff isn't exactly rocket science. . . . Brain surgery maybe, but not rocket science," he said. He declined to answer any questions.

The cost of the project has risen to $750 million, from an estimate of $550 million when it was announced in June. Yet the project has been scaled back to 65 stories, not including four floors for building equipment, from the 90 stories originally announced. Nonetheless, the total height of the building has increased to more than 930 feet from 887 feet.

Although the project still will include a 250-room hotel, to be managed by Mandarin, the number of condominiums has been cut to 150 from the 350 first proposed.

Larger Rendering

http://images.suntimes.com/popups/FTR/images/mandarin_032106_285.jpg

yeah, I'm definately digging on this one. Much better than the first rendering that was shown.

OMG...Looks GREATTTT!!! :eek:

I didn't see this article posted...

http://www.globest.com/news/499_499/chicago/144030-1.html

Palladium Floats 65-Story Hotel-Condo Project
By Mark Ruda
Last updated: March 21, 2006 08:53am

CHICAGO-Palladian Development is the latest to propose a Downtown hotel, teaming with Mandarin Oriental Hotel Group on a 500-unit, 65-story project overlooking Millennium Park. The 250 hotel rooms, being sold as condominiums, will take up the first 31 stories, with 250 condominiums on the upper floors of the $750-million building.


Despite an address of 215 N. Michigan Ave., Mandarin Oriental Tower is separate from the Illinois Center office complex, which includes Loeb Partners Realty’s 1.9-million-sf Michigan Plaza at 205 and 225 N. Michigan Ave. as well as Parkway Properties Inc.’s 1.1-million-sf 233 N. Michigan Ave. Instead, the hotel and condominium tower will be built on the west side of Stetson Avenue, one block east of Michigan Avenue. Solomon Cordwell Buenz is designing the steel and glass tower while Todd-Avery Lenahan leads the interior design team.


Prices of the condominiums are expected to range from $500,000 to more than $10 million. Mandarin Oriental Hotel Group will manage the hotel units. The project, expected to open in 2009, also includes a 40,000-sf health club.


Two hotels are within a block, including the 692-room Fairmont hotel at 200 N. Columbus Dr. Strategic Hotels & Resorts plans to test the hotel condominium market this year when it offers 156 rooms at its luxury property as condominium and fractional ownership units. The Hyatt Regency Chicago is at 151 E. Wacker Dr.


The one-acre Mandarin Oriental Tower was acquired in September for $27.2 million, according to property records, with a $25-million mortgage from SFT I, Inc.

Is anyone interested in perhaps changing the height and floors on the title of this thread?

Ha! A Michigan address with a Stetson location shouldn't confuse tourists at all!!! Good luck finding that tower folks!

Ha! A Michigan address with a Stetson location shouldn't confuse tourists at all!!! Good luck finding that tower folks!

Well, with it being 900'+ tall it shouldn't be all that hard to find!!! But then again...

That only works when you know what you're looking for. You think the average tourist could tell the Sears Tower from Tower Records?

That only works when you know what you're looking for. You think the average tourist could tell the Sears Tower from Tower Records?

No I don't. I deal with tourist with my work and they always get Sears and Hancock mixed up.

Vanity addresses can be dangerous. Wasn't there a case of a woman caught in a fire in a building with a Michigan address that was actually off Michigan, and firefighters had a hard time locating her due to the false vanity address?

Vanity addresses can be dangerous. Wasn't there a case of a woman caught in a fire in a building with a Michigan address that was actually off Michigan, and firefighters had a hard time locating her due to the false vanity address?

I believe she gave an Illinois Center address instead of the proper 233 Michigan Avenue...

Here are few shots of the site from my conference room window of 225 N Michigan of the Manderian Oriental site
http://images.snapfish.com/346673%3B33%7Ffp343%3Enu%3D3279%3E%3A85%3E266%3EWSNRCG%3D32335%3B87%3B353%3Anu0mrj
http://images.snapfish.com/346673%3B33%7Ffp343%3Enu%3D3279%3E%3A85%3E266%3EWSNRCG%3D32335%3B87%3B353%3Cnu0mrj

I always pass this empty site during my lunch break. Needless to say, I am overjoyed with the fact that missing piece will be filled.

I always pass this empty site during my lunch break. Needless to say, I am overjoyed with the fact that missing piece will be filled.

Ditto, I walk by it about three times a week, depending on which way I'm walking during lunch. I will be interesting if this and Aqua go up, working between them will be cool.

SSDD

Cool pics, THANKS!

So thats where its going I just couldn't picture it..and I ride the bus by everyday always amazed at what a bizzare looking hole it is.

a little birdy sent me a telegram yesterday...

East Elevation
https://extranet.emporis.com/files/transfer/6/2006/04/449004.jpg

North Elevation
https://extranet.emporis.com/files/transfer/6/2006/04/449005.jpg

South Elevation
https://extranet.emporis.com/files/transfer/6/2006/04/449006.jpg

West Elevation
https://extranet.emporis.com/files/transfer/6/2006/04/449007.jpg

Thanks, BVictor. I like the East Elevation. It looks cool.

i like the west elevation better

If only I could afford it too.

Well then, I like the NORTH elevation! ;)

I really hope this gets built along w/ Intercontintal,, and Aqua.....these together w/ the Calatrava will focus a lot of super tall and near super tall glory in a small area

I stopped by the sales center this afternoon, and I was told that they should begin to market this project to the public sometime this summer. I asked about current sales and things are going okay. I was told that about 15% of the hotel suites were already sold and somewhere between 15%-20% of the condominiums were sold. They been selling to preferred buyers and people close to the Mandarin and developement team.

I really hope this gets built along w/ Intercontintal,, and Aqua.....these together w/ the Calatrava will focus a lot of super tall and near super tall glory in a small area

Yeah, no kidding.

Not to be a neggo here, but the first domino fell when Deutsche killed the deal that would've financed the Fordham Spire.

Chicago must have the most prolific collection of unbuilt skyscrapers.

Just get the damn Spire built.

News is News


August 11
Mandarin Tower Pop-Up Immersion Theater Benefits CAF

Stop at the Prudential Building, 130 E Randolph between 11 and 2 on August 11 for a chance to experience the Mandarin Oriental Immersion Theater 4000 sq. ft. temporary pop-up venue. Get a taste of the luxury property before it is built AND provide needed funds for CAF. Highlights include a MOBar, cake shop, hand massages and gifts. $15 admission all goes to CAF.

74 floors? The confusion never ends.

http://img161.imageshack.us/img161/5637/mandarinouq4.jpg
http://img105.imageshack.us/img105/1364/mandawi5.jpg

Last I saw was like 899 now. But you know what who really knows. This thing has had some many different numbers attached to it.

http://www.suntimes.com/output/society/cst-ftr-society16.html

Mandarin Oriental uses luxe condos for three benefits
August 16, 2006
BY LISA LENOIR SUN-TIMES COLUMNIST

The million-dollar questions guests asked one another at the Mandarin Oriental Tower, Chicago's preview party was: "So what floor are you going to live on?" and "Where are you going to be in 2009?

In a 4,000-square-foot temporary space at 130 N. Randolph, real estate developer Gerard Kenny, president and chief operating officer of Palladian Development, employed "immersion marketing" last week to give more than 500 Chicagoans a lifestyle experience filled with select aesthetics and amenities of the world-class Mandarin Oriental's hotel condominiums.

Kenny, along with son Chris, rolled out the "What's your M.O?" concept at three separate charity parties for the Goodman Theatre, Lynn Sage Breast Cancer Research Foundation and the Mercy Home for Boys & Girls. (Kenny's company donated $5,000 to each charity.)

The Goodman Theatre launched this innovative affair Tuesday, with Board of Trustees Chair Les Coney and trustees Debbie Bricker, Shawn Donnelley and Neal Zucker hosting a chichi crowd in a calming space -- overflowing with streamlined Asian influences.

A building model, designed by architect Martin Wolf of Solomon Cordwell Buenz, wooed the curious to explore the sleek design, which provides inside/outside views that enable those walking by the building to experience the action inside and vice versa.

Three types of living options range from a mere $600,000 to $21 million. A place in the "Jewel Box" brought a sparkle to many eyes at the event. (The 6,000-square-foot residence will be on the 40th floor and will have floor-to-ceiling glass windows with ceiling heights of 22 feet.)

"The energy comes out of the building," said Wolf. "This area of urban Chicago [near Millennium Park] ... it's got a buzz you can pick up on."

Tom Kehoe of Kehoe Designs used architectural renderings to transform the raw venue into all things Mandarin, replete with a residence living room, a sky lobby, MOBar, the Spa and the Cake Shop. He did confess the hotel's execs gave him only "little snippets" of the interior details in an effort to keep it hush-hush until the 2009 opening.

But Kehoe was able to re-create the decadent spa area. Guests relaxed with soothing hand massages. In a separate lounge area -- with Oriental rugs, a chenille sofa, fluffy pillows and club chairs -- they socialized with friends. The affair was capped off with delicious bites from Jon Wool's Finesse Cuisine.

Guests taking in the Mandarin Oriental's lush brand of rest and relaxation were Margaret Garner and Denis John Healy.

PARTY FILE

Guests (all three events): More than 500.

Amount donated: $15,000.

Hotel stats: Located adjacent to Millennium Park, the hotel will have 74 floors with 250 hotel condos, 100 residences, 150 tower condos plus such amenities as a 24-hour concierge, room service, full-service spa, high-end shops, restaurants and business facilities.

Gift bag: Original poster of Cesar Russ' Millennium Park photographs and a $200 gift card to the spa.

So 74 floors any further word on final height, the rendering next to 2pru above looks a bit short to me?

just some light reading:

Mandarin Oriental Chicago to Open in 2009
Prices will range from $600,000 to $21 million.
by Meaghan O'Neill
Interior Design · September 8, 2006

Located at Stetson Avenue and Lake Street, just one block from Millennium Park, Mandarin Oriental Tower, Chicago could become one of the city’s most luxurious residential addresses, when completed in 2009. Designed by architect Martin Wolf of Solomon Cordwell Buenz, with interior design by Todd Avery Lenahan (best known for his work on Wynn Las Vegas) of Avery Brooks & Associates, the Tower will offer three ownership options: Condominiums, residence-apartments, and guest rooms. Ownership options are differentiated mainly by choice of furnishings and extent of hotel amenities. The latter will include an enormous spa, five-star dining, a bar-lounge, and the world-renowned Mandarin Oriental Cake Shop.

Lavish one- to four-bedroom condos, of which 150 are available, will offer spectacular views, a private lobby entrance, and the option to choose from several interior designers. The 770- to 13,000-square-foot spaces cost between $600,000 and $21 million. The 100 Residences at Mandarin Oriental, Chicago are situated in the middle of the tower and offer one- to three-bedroom spaces, from 844 to 6,200 square feet and are priced from $1.2 million and up. Also available for purchase are 250 Guest Rooms, which come fully furnished. With average room sizes of more than 750 square feet, these one- and two-bedroom guest suites will be among the city’s largest.

Chicago-based Palladian Development is developing the property and the Corcoran Sunshine Marketing Group is leading the marketing campaign.

http://interiordesign.net/articles/images/ID/20060907/Mandarin%20Oriental%20Tower%20Chicago.jpg

http://interiordesign.net/articles/images/ID/20060907/MOC%20Bedroom.jpg
http://www.interiordesign.net/id_newsarticle/CA6369639.html

^^^^Considering construction has not even really been conceived yet let alone started doesn't 2009 seem a little ambitious, afterall we are talking of a building that iapproaches 1000ft......this is no mean feat

As mentioned on SSP, the Mandarin Oriental website was updated with lots of new info and floorplans.

Another mention of 74 floors, as well as a phrase "live at 900 feet"

http://img518.imageshack.us/img518/275/hero01lm0.jpg

I was called by one of their sales reps (she asked me whether I had been to the Mandarin Hotel in AOL/Time Warner and I said, in a rather sophisticated voice, "yes of course") and she said sales already started 2 weeks ago. A one bedroom around 760 sq feet is about $560,000. So this is definitely on the higher end of the price scale.

I would have tried to squeeze out more info (height, percent sales, etc) but I didn't want to be rude to my wife, with whom I was eating lunch at a restaurant.

I'm glad they finally moved into the sales phase.

UPDATE Last updated: September 12, 2006 08:37am
Palladian Plans $500M Hotel/Residential Condo
By Marita Thomas

Mandarin Oriental TowerCHICAGO-Locally based Palladian Development has finalized plans for Mandarin Oriental Tower, Chicago, a 74-story building in the East Lakeshore neighborhood that will combine 250 condo hotel units with 250 residences. Hong Kong-based Mandarin Oriental Hotel Group will manage the property.
This follows plans for US Mandarin brand luxury hotels and residences scheduled to open in Boston, Las Vegas and Dallas between 2008 and 2009. Other under development include Mexico and Barcelona in 2007, Grand Cayman in 2008 and Macau in 2009.

The Chicago property will be located at an existing parking lot in the East Lakeshore neighborhood adjacent to Millennium Park. There will be separate entrances at 210 N. Stetson and 230 N. Stetson for the hotel and residential components, respectively. A Palladian spokeswoman tells GlobeSt.com the estimated development cost of the project ranges between $400 million and $500 million.


Unit pricing is equally stellar. The 150 Tower Condos, which occupy floors 55 through 74, range from one-bedroom units to four-bedroom layouts. Prices begin at $600,000 and reach to $21 million. Prices for the 100 other residential condo unit on floors 41 through 54 begin at $1.2 million.
The 250 hotel condo suites occupy floors 28 through 40 and range from about 572 sf to 793 sf. Prices for these begin in the $600,000s and reach to $7 million. Hotel unit buyers can enroll in Mandarin’s rental program, which provides management, maintenance and leasing of units when owners are away. Hotel and residential owners share all of the hotel’s amenities, and it is designed as a five-star property.

The lower floors, one through 28, will contain two restaurants, a spa, fitness center and additional service retail along with parking space. Martin Wolf of locally based Solomon Cordwell Buenz is the lead architect.

September 12, 2006

http://img221.imageshack.us/img221/1558/moly5.jpg

The sales center is now open and there's a model of the building inside.
http://img236.imageshack.us/img236/6629/p9190191xp0.jpg

Here's the new signage near the site:
http://img159.imageshack.us/img159/6829/p9190189kw3.jpg http://img170.imageshack.us/img170/1559/p9190188mp1.jpg http://img159.imageshack.us/img159/7596/p9190186mh5.jpg

$20 million for a pad??

date for construction start? this year?

There was some activity at the Mandarin Oriental site on 10/17. Kenny Construction had a pickup truck and a Caterpillar loader/backhoe on the lot. The equipment was moving sand around and leveling out the ground near the north entryway.

http://img457.imageshack.us/img457/3562/pa170084ui0.jpg http://img457.imageshack.us/img457/6036/pa170082ly2.jpg
http://img163.imageshack.us/img163/3139/pa170083cm3.jpg http://img163.imageshack.us/img163/8842/pa170080cl8.jpg

A truck from Hydro-Exc., Inc. was on site at noontime. Here's a description of what they do from their website:

Hydro-Exc., Inc. (http://hydroex.com/) is a construction service company that assists contractors in making their projects safer, more productive and profitable. Safety is our first priority. When contractors hire our services, we can safely excavate and expose underground utilities with our state of the art equipment. There is no fear of striking a utility, or bringing harm to employees or the environment they work in.

My god... I never thought this one would really happen!!!!

I love this tower!

So is Mandarin considered site prep, under construction, or what??

That tower is really awesome.

I emailed the sales center and got completely stonewalled. All I asked was for sales percentage sold and their projected groundbreaking date and I got a reply that said..

"Thank you Dan. We appreciate your interest and our current information is available to the public on our website"

huh?...I've never really been stonewalled like that before when contacting the sales centers, I'm now somewhat suspicious of their sales progress, anyways Im going to swing by the sales center this week and ask in person and I won't leave until they answer me, unless they call the CPD then I will leave, but not happily. :)

^ I love the persistence. To be honest, I can't imagine how a project like this isn't sailing though sales. It's a great project and the sales package that they send you is very nice

They've actually been pretty nice to me and quite helpful with requests for certain info (although I never asked for % sold).

Why do developers of buildings like this one, design it to be 930 ft. why not just add an extra 70 ft. and make it a 1,000'? I never understood why some fall just short, is it that only the enthusiast's care about the 1,000ft. plateau & certain developers could care less?

^But who said it was even 930 feet? It seems like this one will actually be under 900.

^But who said it was even 930 feet? It seems like this one will actually be under 900.

I was going off of the 930'/ 74 floors figure at the top.

Height figures on this building have varied all over the place. Even the models/drawings are not consistent.

Why do developers of buildings like this one, design it to be 930 ft. why not just add an extra 70 ft. and make it a 1,000'? I never understood why some fall just short, is it that only the enthusiast's care about the 1,000ft. plateau & certain developers could care less?
You answered your own question perfectly. The number 1000 is nothing more than a number to anyone but us. They will make the building as tall as it needs to be for them to meet their desired profit margins and contain the desired program - if that happens to be 400 feet then so be it, if it happens to be 1400 feet then that's fine too. Development is like everything else - all about the bottom line.

In the present market, I don't see how this one gets built. It seems to to have been introduced too late. No wonder they're not releasing sales figures.

^-- Agreed. I think they just missed the bubble.

there was no bubble geoff. It was a bull market for several years and it cooled off . a bubble is an over inflation which generaly ventualy bursts. this was not that. this was a strong market that cooled like it should

With all due respect, I'm well aware of the difference between bull and bubble markets. Typically, when a bull market cools, it results in slowing or even stagnating appreciation; whereas, when a bubble bursts, actual depreciation usually occurs. As someone who lost money selling a condo within the last year, I would have to say, from personal experience, that the housing explosion was more bubble than bull. And again, with all due respect for your opinion, I've heard it referred to as such (a "housing bubble") by hundreds of real-estate analysists over the past five years.

In the present market, I don't see how this one gets built. It seems to to have been introduced too late. No wonder they're not releasing sales figures.


^ Well, they sold 20-25% of the units in the few first weeks. Slow sales are something developers are aware they have to accept at this point. I can't imagine them pulling out after making it this far with this project.

With all due respect, I'm well aware of the difference between bull and bubble markets. Typically, when a bull market cools, it results in slowing or even stagnating appreciation; whereas, when a bubble bursts, actual depreciation usually occurs. As someone who lost money selling a condo within the last year, I would have to say, from personal experience, that the housing explosion was more bubble than bull. And again, with all due respect for you opinion, I've heard it referred to as such (a "housing bubble") by hundreds of real-estate analysists over the past five years.
the definition of a burst bubble is not when theres a slight depreciation in a lightly over inflated market. the term bubble being burst is used by extreem situations that causes full market crashes , huge job losses , many companies in that marker fold, and the overal us economy gets jaulted. this was harldy the case in our recent real estate market.

I don't think I said it had burst already. I certainly (and unfortunately) think it is in the process of doing so, however. All I said is that they missed the bubble (meaning the creation of it) - not that it's completely over yet (the destruction).

- edit

This sucks! Seems every tower that isn't in the ground yet isn't going to happen. If Mandarin can't get something like this done, you can forget about the Spire or Park Michigan. Somebody feel free to assure me that this is not the case...

The spire won't have a problem because of the location. The views are incredible plus every unit would be different because of the twist. the Mandarin is in the middle of all this other buildings that there is actually not to many good views. Also remember the spire is design by Calatrava.

...

This sucks! Seems every tower that isn't in the ground yet isn't going to happen. If Mandarin can't get something like this done, you can forget about the Spire or Park Michigan. Somebody feel free to assure me that this is not the case...

So what are you based on may I assure you?:lol:
They will be build and I can assure you that you are a sucker for the BS!:nuts:

The Mandarin Oriental is way too ambitious a proposal in this market. I would say the same for the Park Michigan. Adding to the softer housing market, I would think part of the problem is now the *perceptions* of a soft housing market. People who might otherwise be interested in signing a pre-construction contract and putting money down might be wary because of the market. Instead, a person planning on moving downtown in several years might go for something already under construction, or already built, rather than take a gamble that something like Mandarin Oriental will actually get built.

Its too bad with Mandarin Oriental, but as for Park Michigan, the design was boring. I don't care if Park Michigan never soars.

I consider us lucky to have seen the plan for Aqua survive, even as construction costs increased and the market softened.

The Mandarin Oriental is way too ambitious a proposal in this market. I would say the same for the Park Michigan.

^ Yeah, you've already said that.

How about adding something else to this discussion? Threads at SSP (ie Chicago Spire) get closed because people spend more time talking about why a project won't happen than about the project itself.

The Mandarin Oriental is way too ambitious a proposal in this market. I would say the same for the Park Michigan. Adding to the softer housing market, I would think part of the problem is now the *perceptions* of a soft housing market. People who might otherwise be interested in signing a pre-construction contract and putting money down might be wary because of the market. Instead, a person planning on moving downtown in several years might go for something already under construction, or already built, rather than take a gamble that something like Mandarin Oriental will actually get built.

Its too bad with Mandarin Oriental, but as for Park Michigan, the design was boring. I don't care if Park Michigan never soars.

I consider us lucky to have seen the plan for Aqua survive, even as construction costs increased and the market softened.

What are you talking about? Too ambitious?! The city is having some of the largest most ambitous projects sprouting up around us as we speak. As for the Park michigan, that building will not be as super luxurious as the mandarin i think it will start out with much stronger sales than the mandarin had.
P.S I dont consider it luck for the aqua building to have survived. Its has mostly apartments which are currently hot in this market. There was never any issues with aqua getting built.

TUP: Well I'm sorry for being repetitive. I see there is tolerance for repetitive optimism but little tolerance for repetitive pessimism.

Chicago23: Acknowledged, but still 263 condos to sell.

TUP: Well I'm sorry for being repetitive. I see there is tolerance for repetitive optimism but little tolerance for repetitive pessimism.

^ No, CL, but is this the skyscrapers-that-won't-happen-forum or is this skyscrapercity? The whole purpose of this forum is to discuss projects in a meaningful way--their design, layout, height, and yes their financing issues.

But if you've already made up your mind that a project is out the window, then what's the point of posting in that particular thread over and over again to restate that? I don't know about you, but it seems like good common sense to me

If you built it, they just may come. Not a guarantee, but if you build a great product people will want to buy it regardless.

^ No, CL, but is this the skyscrapers-that-won't-happen-forum or is this skyscrapercity? The whole purpose of this forum is to discuss projects in a meaningful way--their design, layout, height, and yes their financing issues.

But if you've already made up your mind that a project is out the window, then what's the point of posting in that particular thread over and over again to restate that? I don't know about you, but it seems like good common sense to me

Cut me some slack TUP. I count only one repeat on this thread. And while I'm a natural pessimist, you know from my posts I'm a huge Chicago booster.

In this week's Crain's "Letters to the Editor" there is an upbeat rejoinder from the developers of the Mandarin to Crain's earlier negative take. It's worth a gander.

Shawn and myself visited the sales center today, and we were able to collect accurate information on this building.


As of this moment the building is 75 stories tall and 857'-6 5/8"

So far they are about 25% sold, and they would like to break ground sometime towards the end of January whether they hit the 50% mark by then or not.

I have some photos of the model that I will post later.

As of this moment the building is 75 stories tall and 857'-6 5/8"
Thanks for the update, Bvic and Shawn. One question: does it begin at the upper street level or ground level?

It is 2' shorter than Water Tower Place. Given its proximity to Aon and 2Pru, this will be the nation's tallest filler building and I doubt it will be too noticeable on the skyline.

That's probably why they have the huge lantern with Mandarin's logo at the top.

Yeah I have to admit I am mightlil disappointed about the height....it really is going to be swallowed up next to essentially two 1000 fters (yeah I know 2pru ain't quite there...close enough for govt work).

I had the same feeling about aqua when it came in at 815......

...is was really hoping for the nations grestest concentration of supertall...or near supertall....bah

Yeah I have to admit I am mightlil disappointed about the height....it really is going to be swallowed up next to essentially two 1000 fters (yeah I know 2pru ain't quite there...close enough for govt work).

I had the same feeling about aqua when it came in at 815......

...is was really hoping for the nations grestest concentration of supertall...or near supertall....bah

I think when you consider the fact that if Chicago Spire also gets built that of the top 10 buildings in the US, 6 will be in Chicago (Chicago Spire, Trump International, Sears, Aon, Hancock, Waterview) as oppossed to 3 in NY (Freedom Tower, Empire State, Chrysler), I think you already have nation's greatest concentration of supertalls.

^^^^I agree, but i was just hoping for a nice cluster

Thanks for the update, Bvic and Shawn. One question: does it begin at the upper street level or ground level?

The height that I posted was from upper street level. Also forgot to mention that the building will be connected into the Pedway system. There will also be 2 resturantes in the building, both open to the public.

Here are some photos of the model that I took Thursday when I visited the sales center.

http://i97.photobucket.com/albums/l240/BVictor1/P1060013.jpg

http://i97.photobucket.com/albums/l240/BVictor1/P1060014.jpg

Detailing of the lower levels as seen on the east face
http://i97.photobucket.com/albums/l240/BVictor1/P1060015.jpg

View up the west face
http://i97.photobucket.com/albums/l240/BVictor1/P1060016.jpg

Ornimental crown as seen from the east
http://i97.photobucket.com/albums/l240/BVictor1/P1060017.jpg

Detailing of the lower levels as seen on the west face
http://i97.photobucket.com/albums/l240/BVictor1/P1060018.jpg

Landscaping around the residential entrance
http://i97.photobucket.com/albums/l240/BVictor1/P1060019.jpg

http://i97.photobucket.com/albums/l240/BVictor1/P1060020.jpg

Car turnaround on Stetson
http://i97.photobucket.com/albums/l240/BVictor1/P1060021.jpg