Anyone seen this (from 'Building Design' last week)? Is this Ludgate Hill or Newhall Street?

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Birminghams rough diamond
03 June 2005


M3 Architects has revealed images of a dramatic new mixed-use scheme in Birmingham, dubbed a “rough diamond” in the city’s Jewellery Quarter.

The project, for an unnamed consortium which includes the site’s landowner, is at pre-planning stage but will be shown in the Royal Academy of Arts’ Summer Exhibition, which runs from June 7 to August 15.

The glazed development includes three 120m-high towers, 111,480sq m of office space, a 150-room hotel and residential accommodation.

M3 Architects partner Nadi Jahangiri said the practice had been appointed for the scheme through “word of mouth” after impressing with designs for a mews development in south London.

Referring to the Birmingham project, he added: “The idea behind the form of the scheme is that it is a rough jewel or rough diamond. It is on the site of an existing car park that will be relocated in phases during construction. We are talking to the planners at the moment and getting encouraging noises, and it should be in for planning by the end of the year. We are a practice of only six but we do a lot of speculative work and are very good with planners.”

The Royal Academy exhibition, now in its 237th year, is the world’s largest contemporary art exhibition, showing sculptures, prints and architectural models, most of which are for sale.

The architectural work includes Grimshaw’s Fulton Street train station in New York City, an office scheme in Leadenhall Street in London by Richard Rogers, a painting by Will Alsop and schemes by Michael Hopkins, Ian Richie, Eva Jiricna and Edward Cullinan.

http://tinypic.com/5v698j

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Call me daft, but I can only see two there, though....

That's quite a brave design, no doubt there will be coutless objections

Wow where did that come from looks amazing, quite a day for daring design in birmingham.

And i can only see two towers as well, someone has counted the BT tower as well!

Wow where did that come from, looks amazing, quite a day for daring design in Birmingham.

And i can only see two towers as well, maybe its hiding?!!

Hey I like it.. Its right by the BT tower.. So i think it isn't ludgate... There also pretty tall if BT is to scale!

Excellent, Go Brum Go!!!!!!!

If they do go ahead they'd look fantastic lit up next to the BT tower

Impressive. I like that tilted design. Gives it more presence. Fingers crossed for this one.

In glass there is potential!!!
120meters as well!
Needs time to grow on me, although i think the location is great.

OMGosh! That is an eyecatcher, this would be utterly incredible addition to skyline, speechless. :)

OMGosh! That is an eyecatcher, this would be utterly incredible addition to skyline, speechless. :)

When you've got time EK have a go at doing a few rendroids with it on the skyline....just to give us a taster

Wow, those could be world class, if they stick some nice cladding on em. Relatives of Criterion Place methinks.

Wow, Birmingham's had a great day.

These are amazing and the location is fantastic.

I can see architecture schools across the UK in coming years doing trip's to Birmingham to learn from the good rather then the bad.

Rough height estimates I would say is Tower 1 - 130m, Tower 2 - 120m and Tower 3 - 50m+

could be wrong but I think this is the site bordered by Lionel Street/Newhall Street and Great Charles Street Queensway. At the moment there's a car park and some derelict buildings along two sides. If it is there, I think it would look fantastic. :)

Just imagine how they'd look from this viewpoint

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v173/Robdann/Birmingham/BTTower.jpg

They are very nice towers, a wonderfully unique design. They should be a little bit further away from BT though. Its just a little too close.

Either way, great news for Brum :)

They are very nice towers, a wonderfully unique design. They should be a little bit further away from BT though. Its just a little too close.

Either way, great news for Brum :)

A nice little mini cluster though. Imagine them on this picture.

http://skyscraperpage.com/gallery/data/708/490skyline.jpg

They are very nice towers, a wonderfully unique design. They should be a little bit further away from BT though. Its just a little too close.

Either way, great news for Brum :)
If they're where I think they are, then there's a road running between the nearest tower and the BT tower.(Lionel Street) Imagine standing between the two on Lionel Street and looking up..fab.

Everyone dig out your old BT Tower pics, and let your imagination run wild :crazy2:

http://im1.shutterfly.com/procserv/47b3ce34b3127cce9bd42a96211800000016108AbtGrNu5ZNQ

What's happening with Brindley house, is it staying or going?

there is 3 buildings but there not all 120m as stated, not sure i like it myself but it might look better in a proper render? its a little too fat for me, but its another good high proposal for brum at least, cant the push it higher though considering its proximity to the bt tower?

To fat? Dont forget there nextdoor to the BT tower, which is the equivelent of a very tall twig Blueboy ;) :cheers:

yeah you ve got a point, just think that a taller tower would look better, obviously!

Obviously but, There being 3 of them make up for it immensly.

From what I can work out from the model it shows the derilict site facing Great Charles Street bounded by Ludgate Hill and Lionel Street. The BT tower and Brindley House are therefore oposite this iste on Lionel Street. The model shows the entrance to the Great Charles Street tunnel and the distinctive buildings on Newhall Street (all guess work though). In which case It definately does not follow the site brief which has buildings steping down the slope facing Great Charles Street and the derelict buidlings retained. I hope the planners are feeling brave because this looks fantastic

They are superb, I think its good having them right next to BT Tower actually, create a nice look.. They are chunky but I don't think it goes against them... Good luck Brum, I hope you get em U/C and sharpish ;)

amazing find..... 2005 is turning out to be an amzing year for birminghams higghrise potential. a truly amazing looking scheme which has my full support.

however, may i suggest some caution withthis one. a few points to be aware of;

* they are a small town planning firm of just 8 people, a very impressive feat to bring this one to reality...though it isnt unhread of
* this is the site of the proposed new coach station which we refused and dropped due to local protest. if they dont want a new coach station being built there, chnaces are they aint going to like these monsters (however, i think it was traffic that was more of an issue with the coach sta prop)
* This is right inbetween two of the cities major conservation areas.....colmore row and jewellry qtr.

i do like it and they are things going fo it. ive always thought this ocation was ripe for a towers or two and have designed many for this site..... lets just wait and see though!

amazing find..... 2005 is turning out to be an amzing year for birminghams higghrise potential. a truly amazing looking scheme which has my full support.

however, may i suggest some caution withthis one. a few points to be aware of;

* they are a small town planning firm of just 8 people, a very impressive feat to bring this one to reality...though it isnt unhread of
* this is the site of the proposed new coach station which we refused and dropped due to local protest. if they dont want a new coach station being built there, chnaces are they aint going to like these monsters (however, i think it was traffic that was more of an issue with the coach sta prop)
* This is right inbetween two of the cities major conservation areas.....colmore row and jewellry qtr.

i do like it and they are things going fo it. ive always thought this ocation was ripe for a towers or two and have designed many for this site..... lets just wait and see though!
This is not the site of the previously proposed coach station, its further up Great Charles Street Queensway. Its the site opposite that site. Like I said earlier there's a car park on part of the site and some disused buildings along another edge fronting Newhall Street. I've always wished they'd do something here...maybe now they will! :)

oh, ok then...well ill have to check where bouts then and see if it too is in a conservation zone.... however, its on the limestone ridge where the council want to focus highrise proposals and this would compliment paradise circus v well!

oh, ok then...well ill have to check where bouts then and see if it too is in a conservation zone.... however, its on the limestone ridge where the council want to focus highrise proposals and this would compliment paradise circus v well!
Agreed. I wouldn't call this the Jewellery Quarter though would you? Yes its on the edge of, but I think its clutching at them there straws to call this area the Jewellery Quarter. Maybe I'm just being pedantic.. :)

I wouldn't take this as anything more than an architectural model at this stage, and an unrefined one at that... certainly not a firm proposal. M3 architects have never really built anything of scale and are known for their fanciful and hollow schemes. Wait until something is actually proposed before getting too excited.

agreed...though still nice to see the interest is there! maybe make the site aware to other developers!

I wouldn't take this as anything more than an architectural model at this stage, and an unrefined one at that... certainly not a firm proposal. M3 architects have never really built anything of scale and are known for their fanciful and hollow schemes. Wait until something is actually proposed before getting too excited.
Rule Britannia...she's pissed on our parade...Proposals in Brum never never never will be made..! :)

i wouldn't want to be on the top floor next to those BT tower transmission dishes for too long....major radiation zapping!! :runaway:

There's a residential block very near at the moment, and more to come with the development of the tower next to the canal. I remember having a very pleasant evening in that block with a guy from Dallas a few years back but stop asking me about that coz it aint relevant!... :okay:

Everyone dig out your old BT Tower pics, and let your imagination run wild :crazy2:



good idea :D I will have a goo soon


btw FANTASTIC and very bold design ! I would love to see this getting built..


:cheers:

good idea :D I will have a goo soon

:cheers:

Sounds loike you've got a bit of a Black Country accent going on there Fusionist

gasp ooh these look fab. (sorry feeling very gay today...something to do with all my mates getting married and popping sprogs out, am needing to assert my gayist tendencies lol)

seriously, how fooking ace would it be to have these pointy buggers up next to bt tower. stunning design. hooray! (skips about room in highly camp fashion preparing himself for a stag nite tonight lol)

Sounds loike you've got a bit of a Black Country accent going on there Fusionist

you could be right. Sometimes, even I don't understand what I say !! ;)

Fascinating. As has been mentioned, there is something of criterion place in these chaps. It'll be interesting to see how this idea progresses. Only problem with this - they will detract from BT's glorious isolation. But I can hardly complain about that.

Looks very impressive although i wonder what Ian Simpson will say when he comes across this. The specs for the scheme seem really unrelistic though.

"111,480sq m of office space" That is some space to fill. Makes it the third largest office scheme behind Eastside and Paradise Circus. I'm no office take up expert but how can they propose that kind of space at a time when the big office schemes have finally started/starting (Masshouse and Post and Mail) with others starting in the next 18 months (City Park Gate, Martineu Galleries, Chamber of Commerce, Arena Central, Snow Hill, Peat House, Snow Hill plaza 2, Edgbaston Shopping Centre redevelopment plus a dozen other medium size office developments. After this the real big guns Paradise Circus and Eastside in the medium term.

Its great looking scheme but i have my doubts whether it will end up being this big.

p.s. after research, it is still slap bang in the jewellry qtr conservation area...however, with good design, its height shouldnt be too much of an issue with the existance of the BT tower!

very interesting, even if they dont get built, at least the landowners are now pushing forward with development of this site, its been derelict since i was a kid !!! but the towers do look cool

How the fuck can it be 'slap bang' in the middle of the Jewellery Quarter conservation area when it quite clearly isn't 'slap bang' in the middle of the Jewellery Quarter.??

I think this proposal is just what we need. I love pyramid shaped buildings. Somebody asked about Brindley House earlier - it's being reclad with the canal under getting spruced up, so this area's going to be class soon. This site is def on the Euro Carpark site with the derelict Victorian buildings on the perimeter. Ludgate will be next door to this. And this is not really in the Jewellery Q - more like Financial Q.

I wouldn't take this as anything more than an architectural model at this stage, and an unrefined one at that... certainly not a firm proposal. M3 architects have never really built anything of scale and are known for their fanciful and hollow schemes. Wait until something is actually proposed before getting too excited.
It's a bit closer to qualifying as a proposal than that Ecotower thing was, though - if the article is to be believed then they have at least been paid to produce the design by somebody who just conceivably might be in a position to build it. Agree it's not one to chalk up on the bedpost quite yet though.

It's also not particularly ground-breaking in either the good (innovative) or bad (controversial) sense, either - 'shards of glass' aren't exactly unheard of these days, cf LBT, WTC, criterion Place etc. The question must be "is it a good shard of glass?", and from that model you can't really tell.

The diagonal passageway is encouraging though - it would help people walking from St Paul's Sq into town to cross the ringroad at the relatively civilised Newhall St crossing rather than the stereotypical-Brummie-nightmare Church Street crossing. That seems to show a slightly deeper feel for the city and how works than you night expect from a small London practice swanning up the M1 on a self-publicity jaunt.

Historically this is the core of the Colmore Estate isn't it? It's only thought of as the JQ because the ring road sliced it in two and put a two-block seam of shitness though the middle of one Birmingham's most attractive areas, so that St Paul's suddenly had more links to Vyse St than it did to Church St.

Fucking Manzoni. :bash:

Looks promising :)

CAn't really be any objections to height from residents or the CAA being next to the BT Twoer. You'd hope so, anyway.

If this does turn out to be a solid proposal, I guess we'll see what this council's made of when this and the Cube go for PP. I can't say I'm optimistic about the Cube bearing in mind the tories' opinion of Selfridges. You'd think they'd learn from it, but you know what they're like.

It's a bit closer to qualifying as a proposal than that Ecotower thing was, though - if the article is to be believed then they have at least been paid to produce the design by somebody who just conceivably might be in a position to build it. Agree it's not one to chalk up on the bedpost quite yet though.

True, but most serious projects don't get shoved in to an exhibition before they've even been worked up... you have to ask why they've done it.

But that just makes it worse, lol :( I really really want you guys to get these towers.. They kick ass..

wel again, as i have already said, do not get too worked up and excitied over these towers. they are nice and show a number of encouraging things........ they show the owner is looking at eoither developing the site or atleast selling it on as a development location....but also the idea that towers may well work on the site!

I would hope the owner's been looking at this site for development, because I've been looking at a bloody eyesore of a bomb site for nigh on 30 frigging years! Why does it take so bloody long to plan and build on our huge plots of nothingness!

...prob because the owner is happy with the amount of money its bringing in as a car park and has now only just realised that cars are out, and inner city living is in!

Looks interesting and ohh.. office space !

These towers are going to stand out on the skyline, at 120m and that eccentric design!

wel again, as i have already said, do not get too worked up and excitied over these towers. they are nice and show a number of encouraging things........ they show the owner is looking at eoither developing the site or atleast selling it on as a development location....but also the idea that towers may well work on the site!


The idea behind the form of the scheme is that it is a rough jewel or rough diamond. It is on the site of an existing car park that will be relocated in phases during construction. We are talking to the planners at the moment and getting encouraging noises, and it should be in for planning by the end of the year

I don't know how much credance that paragraph has but it looks like they want to push ahead with this. The major concern i have is the size of the development, its too big.

Heres some good aerial pics of the site.

http://www.webbaviation.co.uk/birmingham/bmd24-bt-tower.htm

This is the car park at the moment - Bottom left

http://www.webbaviation.co.uk/birmingham/bm45.htm

Looking at that last aerial pic, it looks like this development would only coverless that half of the car park. Even if this was built, there would still be a large peice of land left empty.

well i believe the idea is that this site only covers the area upto the road and does not effect the car park planned for the new coach station as the owners of that site have plans of their own!

I thought the 'new' coach station was going to be the re-vamped one in Digbeth..

looks cool but seems the majority believe it will never happen, shame

I thought the 'new' coach station was going to be the re-vamped one in Digbeth..

It is.

What woodhousen meant was that the site was planned for the coach station, but that it isn't being built there anymore.

I think the Ludgate carpark has been sold on and will now be a mainly residential scheme but with new development next door it could change hands again and a new development brought through.

I'm about as confused as a pickled sprout :dunno:

Went past here today too. The site is vast and looks like it would involve the demotilion of the vacant victorian buildings and I can't see that happening in the jewellery quarter even if the scheme was of outstanding quailty.

http://tinypic.com/6f9xf9.jpg http://tinypic.com/6f9xci.jpg

http://tinypic.com/6f9xl0.jpg

I haven't seen that building in the second photo before.I wonder how long that has been vacant.

I haven't seen that building in the second photo before.I wonder how long that has been vacant.
oooh..at least 960 years. :)

Bump!!!

Anyone think, Birmingham is doing its skyline in stages? Were start over with buildings under 30m, then were go to buildings up to 80, then 100m, then 120m, then 120m+

Because when this go for planning later this year - Birmingham could have up to 1, 2,3,4,5,6,7,8 towers proposed or built over 120m. Quite a hefty amoutn really.

but is this project for real are we sure???????

but is this project for real are we sure???????

Read the first post - Its been designed for a local consurtium. Its in pre-planning at the moment and will be submitted later this year.

sorry just wanna make sure, hopefully this can get built will look really good, and hopefully thy will be quick about it

this will not happen........ the practice who have developed this contain only 3 people and they have NEVER built anything of this scale...infact anything over 3 floors lol.

however, as i have said earlier...... its good thast they have highlighted the prospect of highrise schemes on this site for other bigger developers!

so this is a load of bull,

not really....they may well have been asked to design such a thing by the property owners to get a sence of public opinion and then someone may take it further....they wouldnt lie about their intentions....but its one thing having intentions, its another thing actually getting round to doing it.....

i wish them luck, whos to say they cant do it????? but its gonna b alot of hard work and things may well change!

so this is a load of bull,



You mean "rings" more like.... (anyone see the clever dual-punning going on here?)

:D

.........

That article on the first page quote's the architects saying that they hope to have it in for planning by the end of the year, maybe its wishful thinking but as some other i have low expectations but the major reason is the size of the development for that location, its just too big in volume unless they are confident of pre-lets.

defo...but hey, i hope people and other developers are looking!!!!

http://tinypic.com/6f9xl0.jpg

Sorta off topic, but the BT Tower looks so shiny in this one!

It looks beautiful doesnt it :cheers1:

About all this rough diamond lark. I expect to see some sort of proposals submitted by the end of the year. Lets not forget, its not M3 Architects that are building the thing, they have just designed it. They will get developers etc on to the scheme if and when it happens.

I expect there to be at least 1 tower here anyway. just look at its location and its surroundings.

When will we hear more?

i wouldnt b suprised if we dont lol

...put them out of their misery on the other one as well Woody ;)

...put them out of their misery on the other one as well Woody ;)

Bio dont rile me ;)

Me? :angel:

what other one?

lolbio, im writing it up, donmt worry

?????????

lolbio, im writing it up, donmt worry

Woody are we talking about some news that shall be put up on skyscrapernews.com within the next few days?

It hasnt anything to do with AC has it?

why can he just tell us now???

because its a skyscrapernews special lol....do not worry, it wont be a suprise and has nothing to do with AC

Eh? What? I don't come on here for ages and now I'm going to be left in suspense....I'm gonna go and have a look at ssn now

no point, i aint finished yet lol

Yeah i noticed.....anyway I'll leave you to it but I'll be checking back all day :)

Woody you're a dissapointment ;) - nothing new so im only guessing its got something to do with, Martineau Galleries or City Park Gate or it could be a revisedplan for Park Central which sees it break the 100m barrier ...

Oh guess work I love it ...

Hurry up chief, im gonna be bored tonight ... all alone :cheers1:

That's one hell of a write up woody!!

That's one hell of a write up woody!!

Have I missed something :dunno:

Have I missed something :dunno:

No, just the fact that he's taking so long to realease any information

No, just the fact that he's taking so long to realease any information

His a bugger isnt he ;) well it better be good otherwise I have a funny feeling there be at least 2 of us who wont be very happy :hahaha:

make that three

make that four

Do dogs count, thier kinda aggitated I havent walked them for 3 days as I've been waiting here for Woody to make me happy ;)

That sounds rather rude

He's a teast isn't he?

The tension is unbearable, I hope it lasts forever...

why do u think its good news?

why do u think its good news?

You're right it could be awful news, but we would rather know and discuss then not and guess :)

If it is bad news, it hasnt got anything to do with BST and the CAA has it. that would be a bummer.

They're not bringing forward the demolition of Natwest Tower and Central Library to Jan 2006 are they?

Or maybe they're going to have a controled explosion that sends Natwest tower flying over the Council House, and landing on the Library?

Or HCT is being pulled down due to saftey reasons and is to be replaced with Birminghams brand new 1 storey richard rogers library which will be the biggest of its kind in Holloway Circus?

Woody you are the slowest writer known to man :hahaha:

yeah hurry up!!! i still think its to do with new street

Ill write what I have been told ... :(

* The news is bad
* Although not unexpected
* It has nothing to do directly with any of the main proposals currently in the city

Make what you want, but personally im not looking forward to it

so that means you definately havent heard that the masterplans for AC have been reduced to a wooden public toilet complex?

phew.

or does it?

is AC a 'main proposal currently in the city'?! i mean its not 'in the city' so to speak, its just a 'thing' at the back of mike whitby's tiny brain.

Keyboard tap sound. sound of man standing up. Then walking around, sitting down. Tap. Pause

Pause

tap.

Sound of man standing up, walking to kitchen sound of kettle being switched on. pause. Tea making noises. Tea slurping noises.

pause.

Washing up noises

pause

Walkign back to desk. pause

tap.

tap.

Pause.

tap.

click.

tappy-tap.

pause.

Sound of man standing up, going up stairs.

pause.

Toilet flushing

etc etc etc

Personally I think BST has been reduced in height - just my hunch ad I hope I'm wrong...

Thats a city center development.

Its probably something stupid, like the Tate Tower was for real, but its been scrapped due to funding or something ridiculous like that.

Either way, just take it as it comes, nothing we can do about it is it?

Either way, just take it as it comes, nothing we can do about it is it?

ha! not with that attitude!

Well we cant and I'm the most optimistic Brummie here apart from Usherling ;)

Well it's bad news - I suppose we'll all just have to take it on the chin... please don't let it be Tate Tower...

why do u think its bad news?

Woody is indicating it's not good news - all will be revealed soon enough I suppose...

Woody told me a tiny wee bit. Thats what I posted, I dont know anymore, we will have to wait until his finsihed his article and discuss it then :)

Ill write what I have been told ...

* The news is bad
* Although not unexpected
* It has nothing to do directly with any of the main proposals currently in the city

Make what you want, but personally im not looking forward to it

I think it could be a reduction in height of the BST tower, the tower exceeds CAA guidelines by around 30m so i can see this being the bad news as the developers and the CAA/Council come to a compromise.

If thats the case we ain't going to get very tall towers in the near future :bash:

Dee im sure it wont be that, as I would've thought that would classify as a main proposal within the city, plus that would be very unexpected, something Woody says it is not. :dunno:

However, Woodhousen ... may you tell us when we will be able to read the write-up? Might put a few minds to rest for a while :)

no...cuz this is so much fun!!!!!

no...cuz this is so much fun!!!!!

thats mean! anyone know where this guy lives so we can egg his house!

Feck that! you know how many degrees colder Newcastle is then Birmingham at this time of year? ;)

Honestly, Woody, please mate ... im going away for a week on Thursday :(

Well Well Well ... I never expected that. Its not that bad Woody

so what is it???????????/

well people, im off to...um...birmingham for 2 weeks and i dont think i have an internet connection where im going

however, you guys will either just have to ponder over it or try and get bio or the other unnamed forum member who knows to tell you the news.......

if i can get online i will but i cant pomise anything!

Well Well Well ... I never expected that. Its not that bad Woody

Any chance of spilling the marginally bad beans?

I would'nt know ... ask Woodhousen

Tease...

who knows?

It's just a load of cock, as I long suspected. Nothing ever changes in Birmingham. The backpedalling capital of Europe. Long may the city stagnate.

I agree.....if there's some news just let us know, this is dragging on like Arena Central the remake part 10

it can t be anything special otherwise we would have heard it by now

You'll find out sooner rather then later dont fret :cheers:

Martin G - you fake Brummie, stagnating? BOLLOX ...

You'll find out sooner rather then later dont fret :cheers:

Martin G - you fake Brummie, stagnating? BOLLOX ...

I have never seen so many cranes rearing their heads over the city skyline and everyday there seems to be another. Work is about to start on the demolition of the old TV studios paving the way for Arena Central to start, Digbeth is already seeing the fruits of regeneration with homes being released at Aisling Heights on Bradford St, with most of the other buildings down there earmarked for development now empty. On the other side of Deritend High St we already have The Custard House plus the Typhoo and Worcester Bar redevelopment schemes in the pipe line.

Crossing the city center there is still loads of work going on in the jewelery quarter, not only with talk of the three towers but residential schemes are been squeezed into every listed building that developers can get their hands on.

As for towers ... HCT and The Mailbox has lifted many a brummy's heart [as has the Bullring]. When i left the UK 14 Years ago we had Hyatt, ICC and the beginings of Brindley Place. Other than that i must admit Brum's outlook was grim. Now i see people who are proud of their city and are starting to look skywards. HCT is just about sold and opens shortly, Rotunda has hardly been started and has been fully sold already. There is no doubt that there is the money and the desire to want to live above the city and demand is high. There is also the evidence of the high demand for prime office space with the £ per square foot about to hit £30.

There was talk of a new Bullring 20 Years ago, but it needed a vision to get it. The Hyatt and ICC started the ball rolling, now we have Bullring, HCT, Broad St and Orion, NewSt WILL happen, it's got to ... like wise with Digbeth Coach Station, it may be a very heavy ball to push but it's going to be very difficult to stop. We will get our towers, it may take some time but i predict that the Birmingham Skyline will be transformed over the next ten years.

CH

^^ Hallelujah! :)

Have a good Christmas all - I shall reappear in a few days. Take care,

Bio :cheers:

You'll find out sooner rather then later dont fret :cheers:

Martin G - you fake Brummie, stagnating? BOLLOX ...


Correct - I'm not from Birmingham - I'm from the Wirral! :D

Was in Brum last weekend for the Villa match, first trip down there for ages - maybe I was expecting more, but to say there are loads of cranes / development going on in Brum at the moment is stretching it a bit, apart from the now finished HCT, at first glance there appeared to be virtually bugger all on the Brum horizon happening.

Was in Brum last weekend for the Villa match, first trip down there for ages - maybe I was expecting more, but to say there are loads of cranes / development going on in Brum at the moment is stretching it a bit, apart from the now finished HCT, at first glance there appeared to be virtually bugger all on the Brum horizon happening.

I'm sorry that you got that impression MetroLink, but for some reason you missed so much.

just one shot i grabbed heading out of Deritend recently:

CH

http://i29.photobucket.com/albums/c258/cargohold/cranes.jpg

Can you see those cranes from the train entering or leaving New Street?

I enetered and left NS from both sides, and in comparison to entering and leaving Manchester - as I do virtually every day on the Alty line tram, there is absolutley no comparison (this is quite inadvertantly going to start an argument so this will be my last post), Brum has the one new building, and some white mid rise thing under developement near one of the entrances to NS - as you head towards GMEX on the tram, you can see several high rises and multiple mid rises all underconstruction, all from the same vantage point.

Maybe it is down to the view you get as you approach Brum by train and Manchester by tram from the south, but at present, their is absolutely no comparison in what is going on with those cities.

Thats funny, I think you should check out the Brum development summary - Orion, HCT, Rotunda, Holiday Wharf, Southside, Baskerville House, Masshouse, Opal Court etc ...

You will also notice when arriving on the train to new street, that Birmingham actually has a better skyline then Manchester (but I suppose you didnt feel the urge to mention that)

Now bog off

Didn't have access to the internet on the train, so quite tricky to check out the Brum development thread on the way into NS.

Anyway, as I said, it's probably more due to the vantage point from which you arrive in the city at - GMEX station being raised up and the approaching track curves you around to see a good view of the south / west of the city centre - Brum you go downwards and can hardly see anything but the next building in front of you.

Brumculture - have you been on the Alty line of the Metrolink towards Manchester recently? If not, I guess you won't be able to comment on the view you get as you approach GMEX, and compare it to the view as you approach NS will you.

Anyway, pub calling, have a good xmas all.

P.S. I didn't mention overall skyline, I mentioned activity on the skyline - very different thing - me thinks you're getting defensive for some reason and trying to change the subject to one you feel you have more confidence with.

Really going now.

Actually Metrolink I was 8 storeys up in Manchester about 2 weeks ago and had great views of the city. The skyline is getting better, but its a long way of matching Birmingham although Beetham has given it that extra wow factor.

The development in Birmingham is there, you just need to walk around the city to see it.

Something maybe you could do on your next trip :) im sure one of us will meet some of you if you wish to do a tour

Merry Christmas

well people, im off to...um...birmingham for 2 weeks and i dont think i have an internet connection where im going

however, you guys will either just have to ponder over it or try and get bio or the other unnamed forum member who knows to tell you the news.......

if i can get online i will but i cant pomise anything!

Why bother to tease people, if you were not going to say anything til after the new year !!!!

its a load of bollocks thats why

Can you see those cranes from the train entering or leaving New Street?

I enetered and left NS from both sides, and in comparison to entering and leaving Manchester - as I do virtually every day on the Alty line tram, there is absolutley no comparison (this is quite inadvertantly going to start an argument so this will be my last post), Brum has the one new building, and some white mid rise thing under developement near one of the entrances to NS - as you head towards GMEX on the tram, you can see several high rises and multiple mid rises all underconstruction, all from the same vantage point.

Maybe it is down to the view you get as you approach Brum by train and Manchester by tram from the south, but at present, their is absolutely no comparison in what is going on with those cities.

:blahblah: :blahblah: :blahblah: :blahblah: :blahblah:

i went to brum the other weekend and i did nt see any thing as i had my eyes closed the whole time, then i went to wigan and saw a man building an extension on his house, in terms of developement there is no comparison between these, blah blah blah , metrolink and all the other mancs who spout shit on our threads, got tell it to some one who gives a fuck! and leave us to worry about how many cranes we have in peace, thank you , merry christmas

^^^ thank you

here here

This thread may as well be the Bham spam thread....if there's something to tell us fucking tell us!!! Don't you think we've suffered enough with AC. No wonder Manchester is now the 2nd city....and yes wake up it is. The forum members on here are as bad as the shite council when it comes to putting us in the picture......

......I've gave up on Bham, it's shit and backward and always will be thank fuck I'm moving to Sale in the new year.....I look forward to positive forumer input and a progressive city to photograph

......

Looks as if im gonna have to take over you as Brum's main photographer then with me new digital camara ;)

Merry Christmas everyone ... in Britains second city :cheers1:

Smiley - where in Sale are you moving to?

I live near Dane Road in Sale, right by the Bridge pub.

Sale is a great place to live, very close to the city centre, and with quite a lot of local things to do - i.e. decent pubs and restaurants.

Obviously the trams are a great bonus.

Metro talk about this privately or in a different thread not here

This would be a fantastic project in a great location. It really does set off the BT tower and kind of makes that structure much more of a centrepeice.

Unfortunately, it doesn't seem to have much momentum behind it so far.

Lets try to keep the baiting to a minimum eh Metrolink;)

No wonder Manchester is now the 2nd city....and yes wake up it is.


erm, actually it still is n't , despite birmingham being shit and backward as you say?! your even beliving the manc bullshit hype your self, thats the problem with people in this city, your so used to the put downs based on old fashioned and often un true stereo types, that you belive em your self, you dont shout about whats good.
just look at the attitude of some of the mancs on our threads, there full of 'emselves, full of shit mainly but they belive it, and it winds you up, why?
so what if manc has more high rise proposals, 5 or 6 years ago we had plenty they had none, do you really think that the avarage jo in the street gives a fuck?! no .

there full of 'emselves, full of shit mainly but they belive it, and it winds you up, why?

???

how the fuck are we full of overselves???

full of shit???

what do you think we talk about?

I think he was just trying to liven this place up a bit :cheers1:

The thing is though, You lot are all saying (quite rightly) to fuck mancester issues off out of the brum threads, and then when nothing more is said, blueboy posts that to start something off. Remember, smileface was the one who said the bad things about Brum (even though Metrolink said something irrelevant and and slightly gloating) so there is no need to say that mancs are full of shit.

Merry Christmas everybody :)

There really isn't much news re skyscrapers in Brum at the moment, not the end of the world though really is it! I don't think that Tate tower is going ahead now but that's no surprise, Mancunians welcome here and Smileyface who now appears to have jumped our sinking ship ;) I have my inflatable hula hoop ready for evacuation and plan to set up my own New Birmingham in errr... the Shetland Islands.

The thing is though, You lot are all saying (quite rightly) to fuck mancester issues off out of the brum threads, and then when nothing more is said, blueboy posts that to start something off. Remember, smileface was the one who said the bad things about Brum (even though Metrolink said something irrelevant and and slightly gloating) so there is no need to say that mancs are full of shit.

the full of shit remark was aimed at those mancs that continualy spoil our threads by goading us with often infactual statistics about how great there city is compared to brum, people like metrolink and early bird as example, i understand there are many mancs out there that are a little more intelligent than that, but what i dont get is why people like smiley get so down about things ecause someone throws a list of mancs proposals in their face? why do you care? all im interested in is what is going here so why do i have to continually search through all this dribble to fine some facts??
so please people end it here.......cause if you want to play name calling the my dads in the army and he ll come and kick your ass!! :rant: :laugh: :blahblah: :goodnight :goodnight :goodnight

^nothing compared to my army in red and black ;)

Or my Gold & Black army ;)

This thread's about as informative as a Central Trains winter timetable. Let's also get one thing straight here - Blueboy and BrumCulture are spot on. I,too have had enough of gloating out-of-towners doing us down. i'm not surprised you can't see anything from Villa Park in terms of cranes - the place is in a dip and a wonderful Jacobean Hall is in the way. If you want to see a great skyline and cranes galore, go up to St Andrews and enjoy the vista from there. There you go - fuck the Northern cities and their claims and let us get on with enjoying 2006 being a great year for Brum. We've still got a brilliantly dramatic and dense-looking city centre and it's only getting better.

Exactly, we might not have any as tall as HCT under construction in 2006, but weve got 5 times as many towers ready to start. Something within its own right is exciting enough.

The Cube is gonna be a very special building to watch grow. I personally cant wait for this one.

right, just because were not building as tall as manc at the moment does nt make us a backward city, although we seem to have to deal with a lot of shit that manc, london etc dont, like the caa.
in terms of scrapers brum is still way ahead of manc... at the moment,some thing you all semm to have forgoten, and while it appears mancs boom is about to happen, brum is still building the base for its by attracting investment and development in the center. 10 or 15 years ago no one wanted to develope in the center, it was a grave yard, weve had to do a lot more regeneration than manc in the last cople of years in terms of building infrastructure to attract investment and we still have much to do before we can worry about scrapers and the caa! (new street station anyone?)
but despite this we still had brums tallest just finished (not including bt !!) and the likes of bst and ac (?) to look forward to amongst many other possible developments such as the ......2, maybe 3, towers in the Jewellery Quarter? ...backward we are not! (except for that awful etap hotel on bristol street!!)

^^^well said Blueboy - your talking sense

its easy to get frustrated and start saying all sorts of rash comments

people need to keep things in perspective

news about arena central is nearly here so lets just wait and see

10 or 15 years ago no one wanted to develope in the center, it was a grave yard,

NIA, ICC, Symphony hall, Hyatt hotel, Colmore Gate, brindley place, various hard landscaping projects etc..

So I would say that there was at least as much investment in the city centre then as there is now.

If you think about it, we haven't really stopped developing since the 50s. The late fifties saw the masterplans for the inner ring road and the buildings that ran along it, which was probably the biggest masterplan of all. The 60s saw the Bull Ring which was the largest American-type mall in Europe, and Rotunda and 150m high BT Tower. The 70's saw the NEC and Arena, the Sentinels, Alpha plus numerous high-risers. Also, the masterplan for the canals and redeveloping Bingley Hall (ICC). The 80's saw the masterplan for the new Bullring and the ICC, plus the Pavilions and the Arcadian come to fruition. The 90's saw the completed ICC, Hyatt, Brindley Place, NIA, NEC expansion.
What other city outside London has even come close to doing all this? No wonder Brum feels like it's taking a breather.

If you think about it, we haven't really stopped developing since the 50s. is that the 18 or 19 hundreds? :)

Happy new year for tomorrow everyone and I wonder what 2006 will bring?

In the development desert of December 2005 it's warming to hear Digbeth coach station may actually happen. I don’t want to get too excited but i'm going to drink another mulled wine, scoff another mince pie and let off a £1 firework in a quiet suburb in celebration.

oh happy day

NIA, ICC, Symphony hall, Hyatt hotel, Colmore Gate, brindley place, various hard landscaping projects etc..

So I would say that there was at least as much investment in the city centre then as there is now.

yes i agree, but that was the start of it, and that attracted people and further investment into the city centre which will in turn lead to bigger and hopfully higher things

If you're at the top of the provincial tree - as it were - you're there to be shot down. It's a well known fact that all of Brum's rivals have looked at what we've achieved in the last 25 years and have taken up the mantle bigtime. Now we must push on with quick but well-thought out decision making.

If you're at the top of the provincial tree - as it were - you're there to be shot down. It's a well known fact that all of Brum's rivals have looked at what we've achieved in the last 25 years and have taken up the mantle bigtime. Now we must push on with quick but well-thought out decision making.


Very interesting way of putting it there matey,10 years ago i would have put Birmingham as way ahead in the cities outside London, so over the last 10 years its amazing at how much other cities have caught up with you, esp Manc , thats why our younger forumers get overexicited about all the developments in recent years.
Who would have predicted back then ,there would be debate's about the meaningless title of 2nd city on forums like this.
Thing's have changed now , big companies are now not just opting for London, all the regional cities are scrapping for this business ,which in hand means new developments. :)
I think this as all the hallmarks for a healthier British economy, Bof NY emplying over 1,000 in Manchester,would you have said that even 5 years ago? thing's like that have even got the London luvvies sitting up and taking notice.
And long may it continue.:)

So like you said matey if your at the top of the tree, you should expect to be shot at. :)

Its like footbal really, Utd have always been the one to been shot down from all corner's,, and Chelsea will find out this in the future :)

Enough of my end of year rambling's ,, All the best Birmingham x

This thread may as well be the Bham spam thread....if there's something to tell us fucking tell us!!! Don't you think we've suffered enough with AC. No wonder Manchester is now the 2nd city....and yes wake up it is. The forum members on here are as bad as the shite council when it comes to putting us in the picture......

......I've gave up on Bham, it's shit and backward and always will be thank fuck I'm moving to Sale in the new year.....I look forward to positive forumer input and a progressive city to photograph

......

I don't think you meant this Smiley :(

And as for the news, I have to be careful what I say and when I say it otherwise I get dropped in it and that means no more news from me.

The news that everyone was getting wound up about (if it already ahsn't been mentioned) is that Tate Tower is not going ahead.