This is HUGE.
From today's Wall Street Journal:

July 13, 2005

PLOTS & PLOYS


Neighborhood Architect

By ALEX FRANGOS, RYAN CHITTUM and CHRISTINE HAUGHNEY
Staff Reporters of THE WALL STREET JOURNAL
July 13, 2005; Page B6

Frank O. Gehry doesn't have to worry about what gets built next to his landmark Walt Disney Concert Hall in Los Angeles.

Developer Related Cos. has asked Mr. Gehry to design the entire $1.8 billion Grand Avenue redevelopment, a massive cluster of hotels, apartments, restaurants and retail and entertainment enterprises adjacent to his swooping performance icon in Los Angeles. A spokesman for Gehry Partners confirmed the job.

Kenneth A. Himmel, an executive at Related, says Mr. Gehry will have a "pretty strong free hand" in the project, which is meant to breathe life into the desolate downtown L.A. strip. Plans include a 40- to 50-story tower across the street from the concert hall.

New York-based Related dabbled with a series of architects before putting Mr. Gehry in sole charge. Skidmore, Owings & Merrill, Thom Mayne's firm Morphosis, Elkus/Manfredi Architects, and Brenda Levin were all involved at some point. The two sides are expected to sign a contract in early August.

The commission gives Mr. Gehry, 76 years old, his second immense urban redevelopment project. He is also the only architect for Forest City Ratner's $3.5 billion arena, office and housing plan for Brooklyn's Atlantic Rail Yards.

Ugh! I hate Gehry. I've yet to see anything made by his hand that looks good. Hey Frank, try designing somthing that doesn't look half-melted!

I think it is an improvement over David Childs of SOM. Hopefully he will spread some of the work around with some of the other people originally mentioned eg: Zaha Hadid.

David Childs? Hmm, well Gehry isn't THAT bad. So perhaps this isn't a downturn in events.

Two thoughts--

I'm not aware of any Gehry high rise projects. Could be very interesting to see what he comes up with.

Morphosis would have been a excellent choice as well.

^^^

http://images.forbes.com/images/2001/07/05/feat_hotel_400_254.jpg

That's a fantastic choice. His Disney Hall is one of the great architectural masterpieces even outranking Bilbao in my opinion. Hopefully he doesn't mimic Disney Hall which can stand on its own. It would be great if he brings in a few other architects like Thom Mayne and Zaha Hadid, but we'll see. Also, it is going to be very interesting if Brad Pitt designs a building!

^From what I understand, Disney was designed before Bilbao...

I'm not aware of any Gehry high rise projects. Could be very interesting to see what he comes up with.


He designed a hotel for MT Manhattan, which I think later died... It SUCKED really, really bad IMO.

Between Childs and Gehry, I'm afraid I would have to go with Childs.

Disney Concert hall = crap IMO

Its not even inovative. Its just crunching up a piece of paper and using it to desgin a building

http://img334.imageshack.us/img334/3368/akai0059he.jpg

I'm an architect!

http://img337.imageshack.us/img337/9489/ar0wz.jpg

I'm an architect!

Heres my grand avenue

http://img315.imageshack.us/img315/3319/akai0069bg.jpg

Disney Concert hall = crap IMO

Its not even inovative. Its just crunching up a piece of paper and using it to desgin a building

http://img334.imageshack.us/img334/3368/akai0059he.jpg

I'm an architect!

WOW! I am impressed, where did you go to school to become a architecture?

obviously :)


actually I did take a class of architecture last year

This is what I did :D Casa de Aquamadoor

http://img336.imageshack.us/img336/5797/akai0075sp.jpg

http://img336.imageshack.us/img336/8374/akai0083hr.jpg

http://img336.imageshack.us/img336/4910/akai0097fc.jpg

http://img336.imageshack.us/img336/3867/akai0102jt.jpg

http://img336.imageshack.us/img336/7738/akai0113yu.jpg


Can't say its any better than Gehry's stuff :D

AMAZING!!!!!!!!!!!!! THE LA TIMES AND OTHERS ARE SAYING THIS WILL BE THE NATION'S MOST ANTICIPATED SKYSCRAPER AFTER FREEDOM TOWER. THOUGH PLACES LIKE MIAMI MAY PLAN TALLER ONES. THE FACT THAT THIS IS LA AND GEHRY MAKES ALL THE DIFFERENCE. THAT'S THE POWER OF LA.

If the design is similar to the piece of shit building posted at the top of this thread, I'll hate it.

He's not doing the residential buildings. He's doing the iconic tower, but he gets a say in who designs the residential buildings. I think Childs would have killed Grand Avenue like he killed that disaster called the Freedom Tower. With Gehry, he is hit and miss, but Disney hall was definitely a hit. I think his designs tend to be better when he visual exciting when he designs one thing rather than a whole project.

Originally Posted by savvysearch
He's not doing the residential buildings. He's doing the iconic tower, but he gets a say in who designs the residential buildings. I think Childs would have killed Grand Avenue like he killed that disaster called the Freedom Tower. With Gehry, he is hit and miss, but Disney hall was definitely a hit. I think his designs tend to be better when he visual exciting when he designs one thing rather than a whole project.
It's good he isn't doing the residential buildings. There aren't any buildings designed by him that I like, not even a little, I hate them.

Hopefully, people end up keeping his buildings out of New York City, and while they're at it, the United States.

With respect to high-rises, I think Gehry's hyper-flamboyant style better suits LA than cities like, say, New York.

I'm not a big fan of Gehry, he's currently designing a 1000+ footer in Lower Manhattan, so we're waiting to see what he comes up with there.

The only decent work I think he did was the design for the NY Times Tower he entered into the competition, but lost to Renzo Piano:

http://www.guggenheim.org/exhibitions/past_exhibitions/gehry/images/projects/projects_images/ny_times13_lg.jpg

http://www.skyscrapercity.com/photopost/data/500/2404nytimesgehryskyline.JPG

WOW.

I'm surprised that so many dislike the WDCH, it's the most amazing building [by far] for me in Los Angeles.

Absolutely modern and gorgeous!

Saying that, I really hope the rest of the Grand Ave. project doesn't mimic the WDCH, and I hope he doesn't use the concert hall as the "center piece" for the project.

Well that suck's,...!!!!!!! i'll give it to him for his Culteral, Retail, Concert Hall's, and anything lowrise he's done.


But I don't think he can, or ever will, be able to do skyscrapers...!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I think Gehry's designs are wonderful, but you'll only cheapen them by doing too many of them. The Grand Avenue project would benefit from a host of different architects doing cutting-edge designs. This is downtown LA's best opportunity to jump-start itself from a kind of sterile dead zone to a center of world-class architecture. Architecture can only go so far in redeeming a dysfunctional core, but if coupled with some good streetscaping, might go a long way to making downtown inviting and interesting.

Ugh! I hate Gehry. I've yet to see anything made by his hand that looks good. Hey Frank, try designing somthing that doesn't look half-melted!

I think he undertands glass forms very well. It's quite exciting, really.

Well, if this where my development project, I would choose three firm's to work on this one.

(1) SOM, San Francisco office. ( Craig Hartmann, principle.) with them in charge of exclusively; Landscaping, Traffic/pedestrian Infrastructure, of the entire project,(2) residental towers,with the largest retail component, and of course, have Craig do the office tower.

(2) Johnson, and Fain, Los Angeles. ( Scott Johnson, principle.) In charge of all other, Residental, and Retail, components. And perhaps another, smaller office tower.

(3) John Burgee, and assoc. New York City. (with Phillip Johnson, principle in spirit.) In charge of only one square block, containing the tallest building (res.) of the project, and a shorter twin (res.) tower.

I'll bet a team like this could come up with a spactacular plan.

Can't wait for a rendering, I would think anything glass would suit pretty well with California Plaza across the street. Lets pray he doesn't mess this up.

WOW.

I'm surprised that so many dislike the WDCH, it's the most amazing building [by far] for me in Los Angeles.

Absolutely modern and gorgeous!

Saying that, I really hope the rest of the Grand Ave. project doesn't mimic the WDCH, and I hope he doesn't use the concert hall as the "center piece" for the project.

Not me i quite like it.

WOW.

I'm surprised that so many dislike the WDCH, it's the most amazing building [by far] for me in Los Angeles.

Absolutely modern and gorgeous!

Saying that, I really hope the rest of the Grand Ave. project doesn't mimic the WDCH, and I hope he doesn't use the concert hall as the "center piece" for the project.


I agree. I think many people are very satisfied with that building. But I think there is such a thing as too much Frank Gehry. It would be great to have a number of architects involved in the project. Hopefully they get someone else to design the second tower. But I am happy that Gehry is on board as I think he will not try to upstage WDCH but complement it.

AMAZING!!!!!!!!!!!!! THE LA TIMES AND OTHERS ARE SAYING THIS WILL BE THE NATION'S MOST ANTICIPATED SKYSCRAPER AFTER FREEDOM TOWER. THOUGH PLACES LIKE MIAMI MAY PLAN TALLER ONES. THE FACT THAT THIS IS LA AND GEHRY MAKES ALL THE DIFFERENCE. THAT'S THE POWER OF LA.

I wonder if the Gehry Grand Ave skycraper will still be the 2nd most anticpiated skyscraper in the US with the new 2000 ft Chicago skyscraper. I think it still might be as FT in NY is the most important and the fact that it is Gehry in LA, but 2000 ft is tall.

Giving Grand Avenue a Sense of Place

Frank Gehry's Designs Offer Opportunities for a New Downtown Landmark

by Robert S. Harris

Sam Hall Kaplan often seems to get things right about urban design Downtown, but not in his latest diatribe about Frank Gehry and the Grand Avenue project ("Grand Concerns," August 1, 2005). Indeed, if all the reports are accurate, there is now the prospect of creating one of the most glorious public urban places in the United States.

To understand my enthusiasm, it is necessary not just to think about the "property" of the project, but especially about the larger place that is being created. This place will be formed on its west side by the Walt Disney Concert Hall, and on its east side partly by the signature tower for which Gehry is being commissioned.

But further, and significantly further, other buildings on the other side of Grand Avenue, across from Disney Hall, are now to be designed by architects sensitive to the qualities necessary to forming the new Grand Avenue place. Then, if my wishes were to come true, Gehry would be asked also to design a spectacular laser/digital clock tower at the corner of Grand and First streets. The "clock" would be useful to theater and concert goers, and its landmark character would mark the spot of Downtown's primary cultural center, with venues including the Music Center, Disney Hall, Colburn School and MOCA. At the base of this smaller landmark tower could be an information depot such as the "I" centers in cities across Europe. These are places where visitors can get information, buy postcards and memorabilia, and generally get their bearings.

So let us now imagine this new Plaza de Los Angeles framed by Disney Hall and the Gehry-designed project elements, with paving stretching seamlessly across Grand Avenue from façade to façade, the distinctions between vehicular and pedestrian areas marked by subtle paving changes and bollards whose lights at night would add liveliness. This plaza is then the place of first choice for special cultural events, and the place to stroll and to be seen. Add the transformation of Grand Avenue and First Street into a generous tree-lined promenade and we have a public center.

If imaginations will go this far with me, then perhaps next we can address the means for making a dramatic link north to a second, different but distinctive plaza connecting the Music Center and the transformed civic park.

In developer Related Cos.' $1.8 billion plan, Gehry's contributions are essential. The buildings on both sides of the Plaza de Los Angeles need to be worth seeing and worth visiting, and well enough related to each other in character to form a single, coherent place. The smaller "clock tower" is the local landmark seen easily from north and south along Grand Avenue, and from east and west along First Street. Meanwhile, the taller tower will be seen as a significant element of the Downtown Los Angeles skyline, viewed across the city as a landmark of the cultural center, just as City Hall is the landmark of the Civic Center.

Finally, but absolutely not least, if it is true that the distinguished landscape architect Laurie Olin has agreed to join the team, then the prospects for excellent open space design have been raised to a very high level. Mr. Olin's national and global practice includes Bryant Park in New York, Canada Square at the London Docklands, the Independence National Historic Park Master Plan, and the National Constitution Center and Liberty Bell Center in Philadelphia. LACMA and the Getty Center are among his projects in Los Angeles. The reclamation and redesign of Bryant Park adjacent to the New York Public Library transformed it into one of the most beautiful and vibrant urban parks anywhere.

Three cheers for everyone involved, and even more cheers for Los Angeles and Downtown.

Robert S. Harris, FAIA, lives Downtown, was the chair of the Downtown Strategic Plan Advisory Committee, and is professor emeritus in the USC School of Architecture.

page 5, 8/15/2005

i'm so pissed right now i ordered this damn book by frank gehry ,called gehry draws cost me 50 bucks i was expecting a good book explaining his designs especially since the book has 500 pages. so i get the book today i open it and its filled with little doodles and crappy as drawings that look like they were done by a five yera old,how is this guy an architect?


it was about 400 pages of ugly wierd drawings like this below\/
http://www.libreriauniversitaria.it/data/images/BUS/300/241/0262182416.jpg

He has lots and lots of other architects that figure out his designs.

As long as Ghery has nothing to do with anything higher than 200' in the project, he has my blessing.

WOW.

I'm surprised that so many dislike the WDCH, it's the most amazing building [by far] for me in Los Angeles.

Absolutely modern and gorgeous!

Saying that, I really hope the rest of the Grand Ave. project doesn't mimic the WDCH, and I hope he doesn't use the concert hall as the "center piece" for the project.


In an interview, Gehry said that grand ave towers will definitely not be WDCH part II. So I'm excited. WDCH is my favorite building in the USA. It is the one of the great American buildings so I'm glad he gets say in what goes around it.

I agree, the Disney concert hall is an outstanding building, and Gehry a great architect, his flamboyance is almost untouched. Maybe i'm just old school, and not much a fan of constructivist/ deconstructivist architecture.
His work, to me, just works better below the 200' mark

Will be the tower of the grand ave taller than the USBank tower???????? How many towers are going to build in the project?????? Please I would like to know it

its 5 towers, the iconic tower is about 50 stories tall, and the others are from 30 - 45 stories.

HAlf-melted. LOL.

I can't remember where, but i heard that same thing, somewhere in the 45 to 50 story area, but nowhere on any Grand ave. project info, did it say it would be the tallest.
But what makes a difference is if it's a residential or an office tower, becouse your standard, generic residential tower, at 50 floor's, is around 480' to 550', and an office tower at 50 floors, (except on very rare occasion's) is never less than 700'
Also remember that, some of the elevation's of the development site(s) are the highest, south of the I 110, US 101, interchange.
A gentle rise in elevation (going North) from SBC center, on average is about 260' to 290' then in you imagine a rough, diagonal line, centered at the intersection of 6th and Grand, it starts rising, so that by 4th and Grand, your elevation is 410'.
Most of the said development is above the 350' mark, so the "iconic" tower will be on the highest ground. Here's an approximate picture of prominent building elevations,(of course, from sea level)

AON tower, 265'
US Bank, 300'
Wells Fargo center, 415'
City Hall, 350'
Disney Concert hall, 430'
My house 23'

I can't wait until the design is released. Like the LA Times said: "this and WTC reconstruction will be the highest profile skyscraper projects in the US".

I can't wait until the design is released. Like the LA Times said: "this and WTC reconstruction will be the highest profile skyscraper projects in the US".

I am glad to see L.A. getting 5 more towers though the tallest, 50 stories isn't all that high (understandibly-earthquakes and shit). I have a condo in a 32 story building in the South Loop (I'm on the 22 floor). Never the less, they will be a great additions to the L.A. skyline. Things are starting to look up in downtown L.A.

I don't mean to hijack this thread but I must state that there are several "high profile" projects happening around the country that may parallel this, or even be more significant.


Silverlake, I guess the L.A Times forgot about Trump Chicago, which is currently the tallest bulding under construction in the country (1360 ft 92 stories) and the 3rd tallest under construction in the world. Maybe I should also mention that the Waterview (also be near 90 stories) 1000 ft will break ground in October.
What about the new Fordham Spire proposal by world renoun Spanish achitect Santiago Calatrava 2000ft! Rumor has it that there has been 800 offers already, and they haven't even opened their sales center yet! Of course there is another 90 story in the works- the Manderin Oriental, and several other 70+ stories, plus almost 2 dozen 50+ story buildings in the works. All in all, 150 highrises within the next 5 or 6 years. I would like to see the actual quote by the L.A. times reporter who made this statement. Are you sure he didn't say that this is the greatest construction project in L.A., or the West coast? I also want to reiterate that I am all for highrise living in evey city, still, absurd statements must be questioned.
Please do not take any offense to my post (especially L.ASportsfan, he seems pretty levelheaded.
Here are some high profile projects in Chicago.

Trump Chicago (1360 ft 92 stories)
http://img316.imageshack.us/img316/8690/trump12tx.jpg
http://images.snapfish.com/3449963923232%7Ffp54%3Dot%3E2344%3D%3A4%3B%3D6%3A8%3DXROQDF%3E2323%3A%3A8%3B%3B%3B369ot1lsi

Waterview (89-90 stories 1050 ft)
http://www.chicagoarchitecture.info/Images/TheLoop/WaterviewTower-001.jpg

One Museum Park (735ft 65 stories?)
http://img370.imageshack.us/img370/4526/grantparktowerrende1458301kd.jpg


The Legacy at Millenium part 71 stories (820ft)
http://www.thelegacyatmillenniumpark.com/images/pic_home_03b.jpg

Of course, the Fordham Spire (2000 ft)
http://img203.imageshack.us/img203/1046/fordhamspirereal4er.png
http://photos33.flickr.com/37766154_d5c77b7cc3.jpg?v=0

Elysian 60 stories
http://img192.echo.cx/img192/6616/elysianthe013lp.jpg
Site being cleared for the Elysian:http://images.snapfish.com/3447%3B49523232%7Ffp63%3Dot%3E2344%3D%3A4%3B%3D6%3A8%3DXROQDF%3E2323%3A59%3C3597%3Aot1lsi
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v514/krzycho/chicago6/PC280049.jpg

Claire At Watetower (53 stories 595ft)
http://www.perkinswill.com/images/projects/lg/lg-102a.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v514/krzycho/chicago6/PC280037.jpg
The Streeter (48 stories)
http://www.thestreeter.com/img/building.jpg
http://img368.imageshack.us/img368/4307/3218jn.jpg

and what about the miami projects............i don't really think that this project is in the top 5

Miami is on fire, even more so than NYC and Chi-Town, regardless of the height differences in the buildings being constructed. I would love to see L.A. also be up there. We can't let the Asian cities have all of the highrise records LoL!

and what about the miami projects............i don't really think that this project is in the top 5
C'mon now it's the fuckin LA TIMES. You expect them to say it's the 5th biggest project in the country?

Those are some great projects in chiown. If i remember correctly, the quote wasnt about the tower itself, rather the whole development might be one of the most important in the nation.

You have to understand (chicagogeorge and the mad hatter) that the last skyscraper built in DTLA was Cal Plaza 2..way back in 1992. 13 years is quite a long time for a city to go without any highrise devlopment on a large scale. With LA Live about to start construction (However the 55 story hotel/condo won't start construction until this time next year) and the pending approval of the massive Grand Ave project (complete with the Gehry Tower that'll totally redefine the skyline), you can see where us Angelino's are excited. A 55 story building might be nothing in NY or Chicago. But LA is going to have 2 by 2009 so yeah..

Also LA Live and Grand Ave are two totally different styles. LA Live is more entertainment, hip place. Whereas Grand Ave will be..well..grand. The designers say that it'll rival Paris' (Forgive my spelling) Champs de Elyssies.

I think I may have asked this but Im unsure. When will they release renderings, if they havent done so already? Also if things are a go, why such a delay in construction? (this time next year)

And I understand completely what youre saying Threehundred. No need to explain here.

And chicagogeorge, I swear Im going to beat the hell out of you with all of these freakin' pictures. Im workin with 56k, man! I dont have the patience. :)

You have to understand (chicagogeorge and the mad hatter) that the last skyscraper built in DTLA was Cal Plaza 2..way back in 1992. 13 years is quite a long time for a city to go without any highrise devlopment on a large scale. With LA Live about to start construction (However the 55 story hotel/condo won't start construction until this time next year) and the pending approval of the massive Grand Ave project (complete with the Gehry Tower that'll totally redefine the skyline), you can see where us Angelino's are excited. A 55 story building might be nothing in NY or Chicago. But LA is going to have 2 by 2009 so yeah..

Also LA Live and Grand Ave are two totally different styles. LA Live is more entertainment, hip place. Whereas Grand Ave will be..well..grand. The designers say that it'll rival Paris' (Forgive my spelling) Champs de Elyssies.

Thanks for putting it into perspective for me. I think DT L.A. will be very different in a few years. I'm really glad that the city is starting to look more and more vertical. L.A. is one exciting freaking city. Again props to L.A.


I would like to see any rendering of upcoming projecrs!

i was trying to picture what a tower by gehry would look like
75 story gehry designed tower in new york
http://www.skyscrapercity.com/photopost/data/500/2404beekman.JPG

new york times:proposal
http://www.thecityreview.com/gehgugt1.gif

I don't like Gehry. It's like he's struggling to be authentic or original. He's better suited for lowrise buildings that can pass for art (like the Pavillion in Millennium Park or the Disney Concert Hall), but for projects as large as the New York Times building damn, that would of just decimated the skyline.

Hopefully this time Gehry comes out with a hit.

Well, Gehry is apparently doing a more traditional design (or for him that means not insane)

when is it going to start the construction of the Grand Ave??????????????

^ 2006..more or less. We still don't know exactly what the buildings look like.

*FYI* Frank Gehry designed a highrise building in LA a long time ago. It was cancelled however. Lets see if I can find it...

Here it is..the Rapid Transit Center
http://skyscraperpage.com/gallery/data/577/28losangeles-rapidtransitcenter.jpg

holy shit thats ugly,it looks ok until you get to the third setback or the third small building,and then the way it ends looks nasty.but the top is ok.

My hope is that his towers are spectacularly bizzare. Maybe a tower version of his Toledo museum or weisman museum. It would definitely be an icon. Just hopefully none of the designs he did for NY.

http://www.joeyharrison.com/ftp.joeyharrison.com/Toledo_Museum_of_Art-Gehry_wing.JPG
http://www.wholeo.net/Trips/Travel/MN/3-19jun1Weisman.jpg

I do know this, this city has 11 buildings, above the 50 story mark, all except two above 700' (those other two, not far behind at 699') 18 buildings above 30 storys, and a veritable sea of 16 to 26 story buildings.

The view north from the Baldwin Hills, from the Marina Del Rey, down the entire Wilshire corridor, to Downtown, is pretty goddamed impressive, if this city's mass transit was not based on the Freeways, surely our density would be more centralized, given a few more years, when the three light rail lines now under construction come on line, and some more heavy rail appovals run through the city council, the fabric of development will see some drastic changes.......................give us some time.