Any comments and feedback on this new development called Iridium located at 11 Lincoln Road? Is it a good buy?

not too sure about it myself. I think jchua76 or RafflesCity may know.

It is located opposite Lincoln Modern.

I think the showroom is ready.

http://tinypic.com/9gklzb.jpg

:eek2:

Another super thin?

I think so...the size of the site is very small...lets see how slim this is going to be...it looks a little like Newton Gems.

who's the developer?

Viewed the showflat a couple of weekends ago. Located directly across The Lincoln Modern on Lincoln Road, next to Keppel's The Linc, diagonally opposite Keppel's Park Infinia, in an area that appears to be a (soon-to-be) concrete jungle of designer buildings.

It is developed by the Novelty Group and uses much of the same designer kitchen (De Dietrich) and bathroom (Duravit, Gessi) fittings as their other developments, the Vanadium and the Platinum Edge, except that this time their wardrobes are by Tecmo and kitchen cabinets by Dada.

What is amazing about all the Novelty Group's developments is that they manage to squeeze a 3 bedroom apartment into an area of around 1,000 sf, and yet managing for it to look spacious. The Iridium is even more amazing - they managed to squeeze a private lift lobby into every unit.

Iridium: Unique, short 17-storey small (and according to property agent, VERY exclusive) development, 45 units, all with private lift lobby. Small footprint, so swimming pool is located WITHIN the buiilding on the 9th floor spanning lengthwise the entire central portion of building and two floors worth of height, thus sacrificing maybe 4 or 6 units worth of saleable space.

There is a gym but no tennis courts. Penthouses come with sundeck and private pool.

The sales brochure is a big folder with a woman's photo on the cover, with cardboard pages inside the folder. The entire package looks pretty dumb but I can see what they're trying to market. Dumb but not as dumb as the DLV brochure, which resembles an art or graphic design student's portfolio folder.

I have a friend who summed it up best: If he was going to spend $1.xx million on a new condo around the Lincoln road area, he'd rather spend it on the biggest development in the area (Park Infinia) for the facilities, resale potential, and price-leader quality characteristic of a big condo, as the immediate area is so built-up that it doesn't really matter if you were living in a small "exclusive" development or a big one.

Have you ever had a property agent try his "small exclusive development" sales talk on you? On the "Exclusivity" of a small development:

In the Lincoln Road area (Iridium, The Lincoln Modern, The Linc, etc) and certain other small unit size, small developments (like the Duet, Balmoral Heights, Holland Mews, Residences at 338A, 2RVG, just to name a few), "exclusivity" of a small development is total BS - small is simply small. This "exclusivity" means nothing when there are much bigger developments surrounding and towering over you. If anything, when you buy a small unit size, small development, you can almost be sure that your property prices on the secondary market will head south soon after purchase. Check out the falling prices and lack of demand for the aforementioned developments.

What is truly exclusive are the luxury-end ones like The Ladyhill, St Martin's Residences, Tanglin Residences, DLV, The Botanic on Lloyd, etc. These are developments with a high-entry barrier on price, who hold their secondary-market prices well, and where big unit sizes and "small number of units" actually mean something; most importantly there are no 200-unit behemoths next to them.

So contrary to deceptive sales-talk, not all small developments are exclusive and the sooner people realize that, the better.

In answer to your question OP, I think Iridium is a good buy if prices were lower. At an average of $850 - 1,000 psf it is way overpriced for all its fundamental faults (tight location, low height, lack of facilities, neighboring condos, etc). At that price ($950psf) you can get something at The Lincoln Modern which are all loft apartments and the prices have descended from the original $1,200psf.

The Lincoln Modern = a money loser if you'd bought it 4 years ago; a good buy now. And yes brand new units at The Lincoln Modern are still available even after all this time.

A couple of Newton Suites 3 bedroom are still available for around $950 to $1,100 psf. Better hurry before they're all gone. Around 10 Newton Suites 2 bedroom are still available at above $1,000 psf.

Or perhaps you could consider Park Infinia? On Wednesday night a choice unit at Park Infinia on the 19th floor was available for around $880 psf. My friend snapped it up immediately. All units from 15th floor to 30th floor on the 01 stack of Block 2 are sold out, and other stacks are selling out fast. Buyers included Indonesian investors, local yuppies, and expats. On Thursday morning Keppel land increased all selling prices for Park Infinia.

In conclusion I think Iridium is not a good buy if you were thinking investment-wise, for reasons that I have already highlighted in an above post, and will stick to a bigger development like Park Infinia, or Infinium (not launched yet but most probably will in September at an estimated $950 - $1,200 psf).

It is located opposite Lincoln Modern.

I think the showroom is ready.

http://tinypic.com/9gklzb.jpg


so thin ! wonder if this can survive strong wind !! ^^^ :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

http://img12.imageshack.us/img12/1248/ir10un.jpg
^This building would be demolished

http://img12.imageshack.us/img12/7028/ir25cd.jpg
^Info panel

??? I thought Iridium will be built on the showroom/parking lot site? The agent told me that the old condo pictured above doesn't belong to the Iridium site.

Oh?

There's a super narrow strip of land between this old condo and the road.

Don't tell me... :runaway:
It's so thin?! :eek:

The plot is so small....

I think redstone was mistaken.

anyway this seems like an architecturally fascinating project. I'm not sure if other condos have their pools midway up the building.

But The Sentinel is even more extreme in having an even smaller plot!

Hi jchua76,

Thanks for your informative reply. I am actually torn between Park Infinia and Iridium. I agree with you that for the same $875psf for both developments, Park Infinia seems to be a better buy due to Park Infinia's enormous site area (234000 sqft), full condo facilities, towering landmarks and more reputable developers. But I think Park Infinia also has it's cons too. Firstly, it has lots of units... 486 in total. But it is the actual site location that is holding me back. Yes. The official address is at Lincoln Road, and the developer is marketing it as a Newton project, and therefore asking for Newton prices. However, if you look carefully, the site actually extends all the way to Keng Lee Road and Thomson Road! In fact the tennis courts are situated next to the 'Ten @ Suffolk' development, off Thomson Road, and there is even another entrance to Park Infinia from Suffolk Walk, also off Thomson Road. Most of the site area is in fact closer to Thomson Road than Newton Road. I can actually see the site very clearly when driving along Thomson Road. So do you actually consider Park Infinia Newton or Thomson?

Iridium pros are the private lifts, the 5-star hotel-like mid-air indoor pool, jacuzzi & gym, the exclusivity of only 45 units (subjective), the stylish & modern facade, the high quality & branded interior finishing and of course it's location, which is TRUELY off Newton Road. It's cons are obviously the very small site (15,000 sqft), the lack of facilities and the relatively unknown developer, which consists of only 2 Indian brothers. I learnt that the developer themselves are their own main contractor for the project, ie they do not employ any 3rd party contractor to do the construction. They are doing everything themselves! I mean, can we trust 2 Indian brothers to fulfill their promise and deliver the goods?

So that's why I still can't decide which project to go for. Anyone with any comments appreciated.

Iridium does indeed look super fragile.....

I learnt that the developer themselves are their own main contractor for the project, ie they do not employ any 3rd party contractor to do the construction. They are doing everything themselves! I mean, can we trust 2 Indian brothers to fulfill their promise and deliver the goods?


In any case, the use of sub contractors is inevitable because of the diversity of trades that goes on the construction. The main contractor cannot be expected to know every single trade. If they did in fact made that statement, I'm highly suspicious. If not, it would be interesting to see them pulling this off w/o sub contractors.

Dear TKW,

Had been to the Iridium showflat and it is indeed a wonderful project to be completed i muz say. It is developed by the Novelty Group and to a certain extent i agree to what JChua76 had mentioned above that it is amazing how the Iridium given the small sqfeet is able to squeeze a private lift lobby into every unit.

Iridium - Unique, 17-storey slim building, a small but very exclusive development, 45 units all with private lift lobby. Indoor swimming pool/Jacuzzi is located within the building which is pretty cool for a condo. Well, i mean u seldom see condos with such a feature don't u? In additon to that, if u or ur family is afraid of the sun..then this swimming pool/Jacuzzi is excellent for ur usage. U can swim or enjoy the jacuzzi in the day as long as u want without worrying that u will get sunstroke. On top of that, have u guys out there seen the design of the taps in the showflat? Is simply outstanding compared to the rest of the condos i had viewed not forgetting to mention on the overall uniqueness and classy touch of the whole place.

With the above mentioned, if u r one who emphasizes on location then i guess Iridium is the one for u as it is located on the heart of the Newton area where a prominent trademark building, Lincoln Modern is located. Iridium is located directly across the Lincoln Modern on Lincoln Road. So what r u waiting for if this is the exact location that u want.

If all of the above mentioned is what u want in a condo then i don't tink it matters that much on whether the developer themselves are their own main contractor for the project or not? Agree? :)

@tkw

perhaps, you should look at your needs, wants and constraints first :)

Lucky TKW so spoilt for choices in such an exclusive area.

Will u be dwarfed by the neighbours? Will your maintenace fees be exhorbitant?

Private lift lobby? What a waste of space. Youre paying for this space and its becos the condo building is so tiny that they've pushed it into your floor area. Swimming indoors? In singapore?

How often will u use the pool?

Designer stuff? Gimme a5% discount!

Thats my cents worth

But I think Park Infinia also has it's cons too. Firstly, it has lots of units... 486 in total. But it is the actual site location that is holding me back. Yes. The official address is at Lincoln Road, and the developer is marketing it as a Newton project, and therefore asking for Newton prices. However, if you look carefully, the site actually extends all the way to Keng Lee Road and Thomson Road! In fact the tennis courts are situated besides the 10 @ Suffolk development, off Thomson Road, and there is even another entrance to Park Infinia from Suffolk Walk, also off Thomson Road. Most of the site area is in fact closer to Thomson Road than Newton Road. I can actually see the site very clearly when driving along Thomson Road. So do you actually consider Park Infinia Newton or Thomson?

This lower part of Thomson Road isn't actually Thomson proper - the actual Thomson area you're talking about would be higher up Thomson Road, stretching from the MacRitchie Reservoir area all the way up to Sembawang Hills estate, and from the SICC Lornie Road entrance to Marymount/Bishan area.

I guess it is just unfortunate that Thomson Road is a very long road stretching from Upper Thomson (District 19/20) right down into District 8 (which is right next to the less pricey part of District 9). The Thomson/Suffolk Road area is actually, techically speaking, "lower" Thomson Rd, very near Kampong Java, the Istana and the CBD.

Because of the weird district zoning in the area, The Suffolk area is at the south-eastern tip of District 11, sandwiched between prestigious District 09 and the lower-end Districts 08 and 12, making it MUCH MUCH closer to the CBD than the Bukit Timah, Holland and Mt Sinai areas of District 10 and the Swiss Club, Watten and Dunearn areas of District 11.

In my opinion, it is perfectly alright to be situated next to this lower part of Thomson Rd, plus your official address is Lincoln Road. The Strata is also here on Thomson Road, on the other side of the road, and it is selling for the same price PSF as the Lincoln Road properties.

The following map will give you a rough idea of property district zones in Singapore: http://www.singaporeexpats.com/singapore-property-pictures/singapore-property-pictures.htm

You can see that the Newton/Novena/Suffolk areas are located at the south-eastern tip of District 11.

Iridium pros are the private lifts, the 5-star hotel-like mid-air indoor pool, jacuzzi & gym, the exclusivity of only 45 units (subjective), the stylish & modern facade, the high quality & branded interior finishing and of course it's location, which is nearer to Newton than Thomson. It's cons are obviously the very small site (15,000 sqft), the lack of facilities and the relatively unknown developer, which consists of only 2 Indian brothers. I learnt that the developer themselves are their own main contractor for the project, ie they do not employ any 3rd party contractor to do the construction. They are doing everything themselves! I mean, can we trust 2 Indian brothers to fulfill their promise and deliver the goods?

So that's why I still can't decide which project to go for. Anyone with any comments appreciated.

The Novelty Group are not big, but they are pretty daring. They are main contractors who are now concentrating on property development, including the building and construction of their own projects. They have so far launched 3 other projects in non-prime locations so far this year, Bluwaters (Pasir Ris), Platinum Edge (Potong Pasir), and Vanadium (Oxford Road, near Suffolk Rd) all of which sold well at prices above the average of their respective districts.

The Gessi bathroom taps you see in Iridium were also used in the Platinum Edge and Vanadium, as were most other finishings. In this aspect, I think that the Novelty Group will not save costs on shoddy construction and finishings, although it is true that these costs translate into the premium you pay. Being their own contractors, it isn't in their interest to screw themselves and their property for short-term profit. Furthermore they are currently trying to build a reputation as property developers and they wouldn't want to sully their name. I have asked around in the construction industry and have not heard anything bad or unreliable about the Novelty Group.

I believe these 2 Indian brothers are quite savvy businessmen, and they have apparently made a huge success of their family construction business handed down by the older generation. Cars they currently drive include Ferrari and Lamborghini.

Iridium - Unique, 17-storey slim building, a small but very exclusive development, 45 units all with private lift lobby

Small, yes. Exclusive, no.

Exclusivity in this area is BS. This area is neither pricey nor secluded enough. How exclusive are you when you have Park Infina next door? When you have bigger condos surrounding you on all 4 sides? When, because of its small plot, the neighboring condos are just a few meters away? When you have to draw your curtains to keep people from looking into your unit? Read my views a few posts above.


Small and exclusive developments (big unit size, small number of units) = The Ladyhill, The Tomlinson, The BLVD Residences, St Martin Residence.

Good price retention, high rental yield. High demand low supply, just like good-class bungalow land. May sell for profit.


Small and wannabe-exclusive developments (small unit size, small number of units) = Iridium, Duet, Holland Mews.

Lousy resale, low yield, no facilities. You will have a lot of trouble selling it later.

Small and exclusive developments (big unit size, small number of units) = The Ladyhill, The Tomlinson, The BLVD Residences, St Martin Residence.

Good price retention, high rental yield. High demand low supply, just like good-class bungalow land. May sell for profit.


Small and wannabe-exclusive developments (small unit size, small number of units) = Iridium, Duet, Holland Mews.

Lousy resale, low yield, no facilities. You will have a lot of trouble selling it later.

jchua, I indeed appreciate your thoughtful insights on this topic and I must say you are knowledgeable in the property scene. I can't help but think that you are in the property business. Anyway, back to the topic. I have to disagree with your above quotes though. You mentioned that the above projects, including The Lincoln Modern, The Linc, Residence at 338 & 2RVG etc are wannabe exclusive developments and their prices will head south after purchase. In your earlier post, you also use The Lincoln Modern as an example of bad resale (from 1000+psf to 900psf) due to its BS exclusive status. I think that the bad resale of properties currently do not just affect these small development projects, but also big projects. It is the current market forces and have nothing to do with the projects being small or big. Living in a small or big development is a matter of personal preference. In fact, most of the small developments under your besiege are in the prime districts 9,10 & 11. (Most developments in these prime districts are small developments anyway). If these properties have lousy resale and low rental yield, like you mention, then what of those in the non-prime areas? The Lincoln Road / Newton area is at the heart of prime district 11 and properties there, big or small, I believe, has about the same high rental yield and high resale potential.

I think that the bad resale of properties currently do not just affect these small development projects, but also big projects. It is the current market forces and have nothing to do with the projects being small or big. Living in a small or big development is a matter of personal preference. In fact, most of the small developments under your besiege are in the prime districts 9,10 & 11.

I have never said that ALL small developments are crap. It is just those with small unit sizes, ie: 1,200+ sf for 3 bedrooms. These small unit size, small developments usually have few facilities, tiny rooms, low bathroom-to-bedroom ratio, tiny bathrooms, far from MRT, high payments into sinking fund, and have absolutely nothing going for them in the rental and resale market. Expats want big apartments with balconies plus comprehensive condo facilities, and investors in the secondary market would not want to pay big money to buy these small unit size small developments from you. If you analyzed the historical price data for these properties you can see the downward trend of transacted prices from developers' selling prices to resale prices. I use the following website as it gives me historical prices further back in time than the URA one. http://www.condo.com.sg/

Put simply, if you had a small unit in a small development, that's 2 strikes against you when you do eventually put your property up for sale.

Most small developments that AREN'T crap in the prime districts of 9, 10, 11 have units of larger sizes, ie: 3 bedders of more than 2,000 sf, small number of units that really mean exclusivity (below 50 units), a rental income of more than $8,000 a month, and resale prices that typically hold, if not appreciate, really well. Yes, even in the current market with the current market forces. These will be the apartments in the "luxury" segment of the market like The Ladyhill, The Tomlinson, 7 Draycott Drive, Anderson Green, Habitat I & II, Juniper at Ardmore, Skyline Angullia, St Martin Residence and The Edge on Cairnhill. There is a shortage of these big unit, small development apartments in the prime districts and whenever there is one available, it is sure to generate much interest on the market.

The answer to your question is in your budget. No offense, but if a 1,200 sf apartment is all you can afford at 9, 10, 11 prices then my suggestion will be to invest in a small unit, in a development with more than 100 units. That is the safest option from an investor's POV. It makes little investment sense by insisting on exclusivity with your relatively low budget, especially in these districts.

(Most developments in these prime districts are small developments anyway).

I beg to differ. Most developments in 9, 10, 11 are big developments of over 100 units. Ardmore Park, Cuscaden Residences, Four Seasons Park, Grange Residences, The Claymore, The Light, Aspen Heights, Regency Park, Valley Park, Amaryllis Ville, Millpoint, The Colonnade, Scotts 28, The Levelz, UE Square, Belmond Green, Richmond Park just to name a prominent few. These condos are where the resale action is, in addition to the rental demand.

If these properties have lousy resale and low rental yield, like you mention, than what of those in the non-prime areas? The Lincoln Road / Newton area is at the heart of prime district 11 and properties there, big or small, I believe, has about the same high rental yield and high resale potential.

Condos in the non-prime areas have traditionally underperformed the property market index, based on what I have observed. These are usually 99-year leasehold, upgrader developments. There are currently more than 10,000 (or is it closer to 15,000?) brand-new unsold condo units in the HDB heartlands/non-prime-areas vying for the attentions of low-to-mid-end condo buyers. It is near impossible to resell a 2nd-hand non-prime-area condo without a discount of more than 25% to the original price that it was bought at! It is all supply and demand.

I can't help but think that you are in the property business.

Nope I'm not in any way connected with the property business. My mum used to invest in property (she still does) so I guess I picked it up from her. Also it isn't until the girlfriend and I started shopping for our own place that I really bothered to look in-depth into property, mainly because I'm a stingy f***er and didn't want to buy a lemon which I'll lose money on. (Doesn't everybody?) Anyway please take my comments positively - I'm only stating what _I_ would and wouldn't do or buy and the reasons behind. Final choice is yours dude. If you have a good feeling about the place and your brain doesn't tell you otherwise, then DO IT, plonk your $$ down! That's what I did - and haven't regretted it since. :)

Anybody else up at this hour watching the Milan-Chelsea exhibition match?

The Lincoln Road / Newton area is at the heart of prime district 11 and properties there, big or small, I believe, has about the same high rental yield and high resale potential.

I have this theory called the "King of the area" theory. The "King" here is the biggest development in the area, which is made up of the "King" and several surrounding smaller developments of varying sizes.

The "King" will have full condo facilities, big footprint, and often more than 150 units. The smaller developments have limited facilities, some without tennis courts, smaller (small-ish) footprints and fewer units than the "King".

We compare 2 freehold units of similar age (+/- 3 years), the similar size, similar price when bought from developer, similar layout, one in the "King" and one in a small development around the "King".

When both of these units come up for sale in the secondary market, the unit in the small development will always command a lower resale price than the unit in the "King".

Why?

- The "King" has full condo facilities; the small development does not.

- The owner of the unit in the "King" contributes less to the development's sinking fund (more units in condo); the owner of the unit in the small development pays more (fewer units in condo). The buyer buying your resale unit will definitely consider this;

- An expat looking to lease an apartment in the area wants the most condo facilities for his monthly rent; he may not be prepared to pay as much to lease the unit in the small development with limited facilities, as he would for the unit in the "King";

- More often than not, the "King" was developed by a big, rich, reputable and experienced developer listed on the SGX. The small development was likely to have been developed by a small developer (that most probably made their money from the construction business and then decided to go into property development);

- Because it is a big development by a big developer, the "King" will enjoy a far more prominent public exposure during the marketing for its launch, and a more prominent physical presence and visibility after TOP (because it is big-sized), even years down the road. These things do tend to stick in people's minds. Most buyers in the secondary market may not even have heard of the small development (yes, it is THAT exclusive! ;) ).

In a nutshell, in the secondary market the "King" will always be the price-leader, price-setter, and the demand-creator in the area. The small development will always have to settle for second-best prices and demand in the secondary market. This applies to any area in 9, 10, 11. Do some research and find out for yourself if this is indeed true; I have.

Examples of "Kings" abound:

Belmond Green (Balmoral Rd)
The Shelford (Shelford Rd)
The Tessarina (Bukit Timah Rd)
The Levelz (Farrer Rd)
Aspen Heights (River Valley Rd)
Scotts 28 (Scotts Rd)
Tiara (Kim Seng Rd)
Grange Residences (Grange Rd)
Ardmore Park (Ardmore Park)
Four Seasons Park (Cuscaden Walk)
The Claymore (Claymore Rd)

Future "Kings":

The Cosmopolitan
The Metz
RiverGate
Urbana
Parc Emily
Infinium
Park Infinia

We compare 2 freehold units of similar age (+/- 3 years), the similar size, similar price when bought from developer, similar layout, one in the "King" and one in a small development around the "King".

When both of these units come up for sale in the secondary market, the unit in the small development will always command a lower resale price than the unit in the "King".


So does that mean for people like me, who prefer lesser units in a more peaceful & tranquil environment will eventually lose out in the resale market? Does that mean to have good resale, I must go for the 'King of the area'? I am not someone who likes super huge development with rowdy environment, and every weekend have to vie with 400 to 500 families for the pools and other facilities. If every unit brings their relatives along, can you imagine that kind of crowd we'll have. The pool will be like a public pool! That is what is currently happening in those super huge projects in the suburban areas.

In a nutshell, in the secondary market the "King" will always be the price-leader, price-setter, and the demand-creator in the area. The small development will always have to settle for second-best prices and demand in the secondary market. This applies to any area in 9, 10, 11. Do some research and find out for yourself if this is indeed true; I have.


I have gone to the website www.condo.com.sg and found that the current biggest project in the Newton area , Amaryllis Ville is commanding about $850 psf. The smaller projects like Newton 18 and Lincoln Modern are commanding about $950 psf.

I have gone to the website www.condo.com.sg and found that the current biggest project in the Newton area , Amaryllis Ville is commanding about $850 psf. The smaller projects like Newton 18 and Lincoln Modern are commanding about $950 psf.

You have to go to the transactions page. It gives you historical prices that go all the way back.

Amaryllis Ville is 99-year leasehold and has held its prices consistently since its launch, which was around $800-$950psf in 2004. Today it is transacting for $850 to $1,000 psf!

Freehold, Newton 18's prices have dropped from a high of $1,200 psf in 2002/2003. Now it is $950psf even when the property market is picking up. Bear in mind that 2002/2003 was during the property slump. In just 2 short years, they have lost $200-$300 psf!

Freehold, The Lincoln Modern's prices have dropped drastically from a high of $1,100psf from 2000 to 2003 to $800+ psf now. In 3 years. That is absolutely PATHETIC.

Doesn't this absolutely prove my "King" theory? Even a 99-year leasehold property, which is the "king" of the area, holds its price better than freehold rivals in the same area! Now, imagine if Amaryllis Ville was freehold!

We need more property people here!!! :D

So does that mean for people like me, who prefer lesser units in a more peaceful & tranquil environment will eventually lose out in the resale market?

Like I said, lesser units in a more peaceful and tranquil environment + good resale is possible, at a price. These will typically be the bigger unit size (above 2,500sf for 3 bedroom), small (below 60 units) luxury developments like DLV, The Ladyhill, etc. with full facilities.

Does that mean to have good resale, I must go for the 'King of the area'?

If your budget only allows for a 1,200+sf 3 bedroom apartment at 9,10, 11 prices and cannot afford anything more.


I am not someone who likes super huge development with rowdy environment, and every weekend have to vie with 400 to 500 families for the pools and other facilities. If every unit brings their relatives along, can you imagine that kind of crowd we'll have. The pool will be like a public pool! That is what is currently happening in those super huge projects in the suburban areas.

Your question, as I remember correctly, was to choose between Iridium and Park Infinia. Park Infinia, with its 486 units to me will be the lesser of two evils. I'm not saying that it is ideal, but it is certainly the better choice if you were treating your condo as an investment.

Let's make sure we're on the same wavelength. To me anything above 100 units is a big condo. Anything below 50 is small, and anything in between is medium-sized. Bear in mind that in my posts above I wasn't even thinking of anything above 500 units. So when I was talking about "King of the area", I was referring to those 150 or 250 unit behemoths. In 9, 10, 11 this is considered big.

I understand your worries about overcrowding of facilities in the super-huge (above 300units) condo developments in the HDB heartlands. I have been to some of these condos and I understand what you're worried about - screaming kids, grandmothers and housewives talking loudly etc, but District 11 isn't exactly the heartland and you can be assured that certain unsavory types will not be living here.

You have to understand the dynamic behind condo buyers and districts 9, 10, 11 in Singapore - only certain people can bear to spend $800+ to $1,000+ psf in 9, 10, 11 to live in what is essentially the same type of building with the same type of facilities that can be gotten at $300-$500 psf in another district.

There are very few big developments with above 250 units in Districts 9, 10, 11, and Park Infinia will be by far the largest in District 11. Also, many 3 bedroom units will be rented out to single child or childless expat couples, judging by the number of foreign investors who bought Park Infinia in bulk.

For the local owner-occupiers living here, according to the Singaporean condo buyer demographic you can be sure that they are more likely to be the younger, highly-educated, gracious type and are likely to have their own country or town clubs to visit and swim at - the district 9, 10, 11 condo type whose parents also live in landed property in the same districts.

I'm sorry if the above sounds politically-incorrect but that seems to be the way it is and any 9, 10, 11 condo developer and marketing agent will know that.

If I were you, I would bide my time and wait for something else in another area of size around 100-200 units, if I cannot afford the exclusive luxury ones. For example, Leonie Hill Residences is a good choice and it wouldn't break the bank would it?

Bottom line is: if you can't afford true exclusivity in a small luxury development, then you shouldn't even consider buying a cheaper small development just for the sake of it being small. God knows it certainly isn't exclusive if the entry barrier is so low that many people can afford it (and worse, if it is Iridium that's being overshadowed by bigger taller neighbors just a few meters away). It isn't a replacement for the real thing and it isn't a good investment.

Wow. There are indeed lots of things to consider in buying a property. Actually, I am presently living in the Mandalay / Novena area and I thought of upgrading to a property in Newton for my personal stay because I really love the area, especially the Lincoln road area. Why? It's off the main Newton Road, therefore quieter. It's surrounded with several designer apartments. It's walking distance to 2 shopping malls, United Sq & Novena Sq, walking distance to 2 MRT stations, Newton & Novena, walking distance to great eateries around Newton & Novena, less than 5 mins drive to Orchard Road, and finally Lincoln Road sounds cool for an address. Investment potential did not cross my mind because I thought that at the present $850+ psf, it should be a good buy. But schua's thorough analysis has made me think again. To sum up his analysis, from the investment point of view, Park Infinia is a better buy than Iridium, because it is going to be the future 'King of the area'. However I am buying for my personal stay and personally I prefer the Iridium, due to the reasons I mentioned in my earlier post. So I have to sit back and think deep again... should I go for personal preference (Iridium), or should I go for future investment potential (Park Infinia). Will make my decision very soon. Thanks a lot for all your contributions. :)

I wonder if you have ever considered The Linc?

Keppel Land's The Linc, next door to Iridium, has 51 units all with private lifts. Good-looking and modern, KeppelLand-quality finishing and building reliability.

It shares the same fundamental location faults as Iridium - small, surrounded by other condos in a high-density area, with the (yet-to-be-launched) Miro and Iridium flanking it on both sides and Park Infinia looming just in front. Conventional ground floor swimming pool, which leads me to think that maybe The Linc's footprint is bigger than Iridium's.

Now check out the prices below:

http://www.condo.com.sg/mycondo/urasales.cfm?condoid=2237

Units have been transacted at prices more than $50 psf cheaper than Iridium, albeit at 2004 prices and it is only half-sold, with the last transaction in Oct 2004.

Keppel Land launched Park Infinia at slightly higher prices than The Linc, without even waiting to sell out The Linc, effectively killing any more sales The Linc might have had. I have a feeling that Keppel might lower prices to maybe around $750 psf for The Linc in an attempt to sell it out, which isn't entirely a far-fetched scenario.

If they do, then The Linc will be looking like a hot bargain especially next to Iridium's $850 psf. Imagine, practically the same spot on Lincoln road, with a $100 psf difference in price! But then again maybe some people might prefer Iridium's architecture.

Now consider the above scenario. If KeppelLand do indeed lower prices for The Linc, is there any reason why Novelty won't lower their prices for Iridium in an attempt to remain competitive?

There are 30 unsold units in The Linc. If a fire-sale occurs at The Linc and these 30 units are snapped up, that is 30 potential sales that Iridium would have lost if Novelty do not lower their prices. 30 units out of 45 units at the Iridium is 66% of the entire development! In short, it is highly possible that Keppel Land will manipulate prices at The Linc, maybe even going as far as dumping it on the market, and Novelty will then have to decide what to do with Iridium's pricing.

$850 psf for Iridium may sound really good at the moment, but after considering the above possibilities I really feel that $850 psf is overpriced.

Called Kep Land and was told that they are not selling the Linc at this moment. Hmm... very wierd... turning down a potential buyer. Btw, there are no private lifts in this development.

It says here?

http://www.thelinc.com.sg/Floorplans.asp

Don't understand why they call it private when it serves 2 units per floor.

Anyway, my property analyst friend says that it is unlikely that Keppel will lower prices for The Linc. They have stopped sales of The Linc most probably to re-launch at a higher price. I dunno man, will they do that? Will it sell well at a higher price?

Nope I'm not in any way connected with the property business. My mum used to invest in property (she still does) so I guess I picked it up from her. Also it isn't until the girlfriend and I started shopping for our own place that I really bothered to look in-depth into property, mainly because I'm a stingy f***er and didn't want to buy a lemon which I'll lose money on. (Doesn't everybody?) Anyway please take my comments positively - I'm only stating what _I_ would and wouldn't do or buy and the reasons behind. Final choice is yours dude. If you have a good feeling about the place and your brain doesn't tell you otherwise, then DO IT, plonk your $$ down! That's what I did - and haven't regretted it since. :)



So which development did you plonk your $$$ down? Since you are very analytical, you must have bought a really good property. So like to share with us which development did you buy? :)

haha..it is in the Newton area and it is something that the people on this site have gushed over.

haha..it is in the Newton area and it is something that the people on this site have gushed over.

So... another Newton fan here. Seems to have lots of Newton / Novena fans in this forum.

Newton Suites?? Can't be, coz u'll be contradicting yourself. I mean, Newton Suites isn't exactly 'King of the area' and it's a bit like Newton 18 type, ie single block in a small plot. Don't tell me it's Park Infinia or Amaryllis Ville??

Newton Suites is the biggest FREEHOLD development on Newton Rd. It is big (118 units), big enough footprint (single block + podium block). And it has a big-enough pool on the 5th floor of podium block, public sky gardens on every 5th floor, great botanical landscaping by Cicada, and it is designed by WOHA Architects.

The other freehold modern developments on Newton Rd, Newton 18 (81 units) by Wing Tai, and Newton Euro-Asia (69 units), are no competition.

Amaryllis Ville is different class: 99-year, also too big for my tastes, but it has very high rental yield. Maybe that's why prices have gone up for Amaryllis Ville. But because it is leasehold, I do not consider that in the same class as Newton Suites.

A development next to Newton Suites, Newton GEMS, boasts revolutionary architecture and it is currently only available for lease and not for sale. Even if Great Eastern decides to put it on the market for sale, I'm not worried as it is also 99-year leasehold.

In addition to being the biggest freehold development on Newton Rd, Newton Suites is also developed by United Overseas Land, who have vested interests in the area with Novena Square and United Square under their management. They also developed Novena Suites, another modern condo next to Novena MRT. The entire junction/MRT area is practically controlled by UOL and it is unlikely they will screw up the area. Newton Suites will be their flagship residential development in prime-district Singapore and I'm certain they will not screw it up.

In relation to the entire Newton/Novena/Lincoln area, Newton Suites is freehold King on Newton Rd, Park Infinia is the freehold King of Lincoln Rd, very near each other but totally different micro-location with different location characteristics and fundamentals.

Newton Suites 3 bedroom unit view is totally unblocked by anything and will remain so for the next 100 years or at least until they decide to re-zone the landed property on the opposite side of road.

There is a reason why all the 3 bedroom units at Newton Suites are sold out except for one on the lowest floor.

Yup, mine's a 3 bedroom unit halfway up the building. Bukit Timah view. It's the best I could find for my budget, and it was a bargain considering what people are now paying for Park Infinia and Iridium.

Reasonably good units at Park Infinia and Iridium are actually around $880psf - $900psf or more, and not the $850psf you mentioned.

Good choice man. I was looking at Newton Suites too initially. It is a rather funny thing that tilt me towards Iridium or Park Infinia. You may find it funny but it's actually the road name. I just find Lincoln Road very cool & 'stylo' for an address. Wierd huh? But I guess that's why sometimes people buy things based on emotions.

Anyway... back to Newton Suites... if I am not wrong, most of the units' views are blocked by Newton Gems, right? If yours is unblocked, that means you have really got yourself a great unit. Btw what is the psf you paid and what is your sq area? Do you know what is the plot size?

Haha... :)

Oh, btw how many units has Iridium got?
Any penthouses?

Good choice man. I was looking at Newton Suites too initially. It is a rather funny thing that tilt me towards Iridium or Park Infinia. You may find it funny but it's actually the road name. I just find Lincoln Road very cool & 'stylo' for an address. Wierd huh? But I guess that's why sometimes people buy things based on emotions.

Anyway... back to Newton Suites... if I am not wrong, most of the units' views are blocked by Newton Gems, right? If yours is unblocked, that means you have really got yourself a great unit. Btw what is the psf you paid and what is your sq area? Do you know what is the plot size of Newton Gems?

Nope none of views from the units' on my stack are blocked by Newton GEMS. This is because the site of Newton Suites is tilted clockwise towards the right (north). Don't know plot size of GEMS and frankly I do not care cos that plot is leasehold. The rental is high though! And it is fully-occupied.

Paid $848psf for 1,238 sf and very happy with that because below my budget. I was also looking in other areas (shortlisted ones were: Parc Emily, Holland Mews, The Levelz, Steven's Loft, One Oxley Rise, Urbana, The Imperial and The Pier) but decided that because of fundamental issues like resale potential, appreciation potential, macro/micro-environment, MRT, rental yield, etc, Newton Suites made the most sense in the end. We spent 6 months of viewings and intensive research to choose the one with best value. Actually if the property feels right, the head and heart are in total agreement, you've done your sums properly, then go for it man.

Haha... :)

Oh, btw how many units has Iridium got?
Any penthouses?

45 units total. 2 Penthouses available with private pool and private roof terrace. The top view of Iridium is fantastic coz instead of the usual concrete roof top, you'll see 2 lap pools.

Don't know plot size of GEMS and frankly I do not care cos that plot is leasehold. .

Oops sorry. I mean the plot size of your Newton Suites. Typing mistake.

I wonder if there are any other more active local property forum in the website. I remembered when I bought my 1st property years ago, there was a very informative local property forum which I often went to.. It's something like sg.pp.com. But unfortunately for some reason it just disappeared. Is there any more such forum around now besides skyscrapercity forum??

Just to side track a bit... jchua76... u mentioned that the king of the area will hold their price well, rite? I am currently living in The Ansley at Mandalay Road. It is without a doubt the king of the Mandalay vicinity. It simply dwarfs the neighbouring apartments, including Mandale Heights, Di Paradiso and even the future Pinnacle 16. Although only 100 units , it is the biggest site there with FULL condo facilities. It is the ONLY residential building there with condo status. The rest are all apartment status. So does that mean 2-3 years down the road when I move to Lincoln Road, I will be able to command at least the same price which I bought? King of the area theory, u know? Hehe.

Newton Suites plot: 3561.900 sq metre [m2] equivalent to: 38340.29160 sq foot [ft2].

Paid $848psf for 1,238 sf and very happy with that because below my budget. .

Congrats! Got yourself a good deal. I mean I saw that the average transaction was high $8**psf to $900+psf.

Just to side track a bit... schua76... u mentioned that the king of the area will hold their price well, rite? I am currently living in The Ansley at Mandalay Road. It is without a doubt the king of the Mandalay vicinity. It simply dwarfs the neighbouring apartments, including Mandale Heights, Di Paradiso and even the future Pinnacle 16. Although only 100 units , it is the biggest site there with FULL condo facilities. It is the ONLY residential building there with condo status. The rest are all apertment status. So does that mean 2-3 years down the road when I move to Lincoln Road, I will be able to command at least the same price which I bought? King of the area theory, u know? Hehe.

The King of the area theory should not be taken as an absolute rule of thumb, but rather as an indication of a property's secondary market value and performance in the secondary market.

The King of the area will hold its price well in relation to smaller developments in the same vicinity. If the price of the whole area drops, then the King will drop less than the other developments. Vice versa if market price of area rises. In other words, the King outperforms the vicinity's market average.

Of course these vicinity-specific movements in price are also affected by external factors such as Singapore's general property market index, natural disasters in the area (flood), and man-made factors in the area (like roadworks, public works, etc), or government re-zoning in the area (such as suddenly the landed property across the road is slated for 30-storey condo construction, or the large tract of land 2 blocks away has been sold and developers have plans to develop posh condo at your condo's price, providing stiff competition). Of course, the ultimate factor in deciding your eventual profit/loss is whether your condo was overpriced/underpriced when you first bought it.

The Ansley is a good development, but I see that prices have fallen. $755 psf in 2000 for the Communicable Disease Centre / National Skin Centre area was quite high, you know. That's Duchess Rd and Shelford Rd prices, areas which are much more pleasant. Furthermore, that price was before the existence of Novena Square and the current Renaissance of the Novena area, so it was probably artificially-inflated when they launched it due to optimism about the Novena Square offices and shopping mall. Turned out that other people were building choicier properties down Moulmein and Newton Road! So that would kind of draw demand away from Mandalay area. Add to that the external factors of a plunging general market (which never quite recovered) after September 11, SARS patients at TTSH, and there you go.

While being the King isn't a foolproof guard against recession or natural disaster, it will always survive trauma better than the rest.

If the market continues moving in the right direction, I daresay in 2 years' time you might have a pretty good chance of selling it at the price which you bought at. Mandale Heights provides very stiff competition as it is almost as large as yours, with 96 units. As I have stated in an above post, one criteria for being the "King of the area" is prominence and visibility. You must remember that The Ansley isn't very prominent. In fact the most prominent in the area would be One Moulmein Rise, although small (50 units), it is on the road and visible very far away, is iconic in the area, boasts fantastic architecture, and as a result will sort of overshadow every single condo in the Mandalay and Sinaran areas.

Tough competition.

Congrats! Got yourself a good deal. I mean I saw that the average transaction was high $8**psf to $900+psf.


Thanks man. Hope you do too.

They calculated the average based on both 2 and 3 bedders added together. In fact the 2 bedders went for low $9xx psf to over $1,000 psf. 3 bedders average was slightly lower, in the mid-high $8xx psf.

So does that mean 2-3 years down the road when I move to Lincoln Road, I will be able to command at least the same price which I bought?

I am not sure, but I have a feeling that property market in Singapore will go down in about 1 year's time.

No time to type it all out now but it is a combination of: high interest rate in China>after revaluation, a weaker RMB against USD as a result>bigger trade imbalance between China and US>higher unemployment in US>US economic downturn>US property prices head south>Singapore property prices follow suit as our property market closely follows the US'. All this against the backdrop of crude oil prices shooting past US$80/barrel, affecting shipping, raw materials, and electronics industries and indirectly the property industry.

In our own economy, we still have an oversupply of brand-new unsold condos in Singapore(think it was 19,000 units total unsold), add to that: new launches by Keppel (Park Infinia), CDL (The Sail 2), Far East (Orchard Scotts), etc because they want to catch the upswing in mood (new CPF laws). I wonder how accurately have they gauged the demand? Is our property market due to collapse again?

My god, I dunno if the government has accurately weighed all these before making such rulings.

Only my own assessment of things to come. Any economists out there feel free to correct me. I hope I'm wrong also.

Anyone has any idea when are the 2 Indian brothers starting construction on the Iridium? Ever since the launch 3 months ago, it's still an empty site with no construction vehicles in sight... Sigh...

What Indian brothers? :?

well it cant be me..thats for sure...im to lazy;) :D :)

@redstone
iridium is a novelty land, and novelty land was started by two indian brothers :)

Anyone has any idea when are the 2 Indian brothers starting construction on the Iridium? Ever since the launch 3 months ago, it's still an empty site with no construction vehicles in sight... Sigh...

some developers start construction before any launch while some take a longer time...maybe construction will start once they clear the showroom from the site..i dunno but the space there is really tight!

It looks great, the first time I saw the pic in the papers I thought it was some Dubai property launching in S'pore.

45 units, 2 penthouses with individual pools.
There are many awkward angles and corners and the private lift lobby is a waste of space.
The balcony is huge.
the 3 and 4 rooms will have front and rear view, the 2 bedded only faces the Linclon Modern and its neighbour

Lincoln Road may not have sunlight soon!

Surely a freaky cool thin one! :cool:

A new project call the Iridium is coming out...
suppose to be in dec 2009
any info on tat ?

A new project call the Iridium is coming out...
suppose to be in dec 2009
any info on tat ?
are you talking about the project at next to The Linc? Left 16 units only.... contact me at 98531740 if you want to see the show suite :)

Iridium is not a new project. :)

A new project call the Iridium is coming out...
suppose to be in dec 2009
any info on tat ?

I've heard of it, is it that curved thing at novena?

Since we are on wots new or not, anyone has anything on the Miro also nearby ?

Any new updates?

A very interesting project by relatively unknown firm. :cool:

wow its ultra thin...cool

construction does not seem to have started

Since we are on wots new or not, anyone has anything on the Miro also nearby ?

The site is still fenced up like it was 2 years ago. The rendering panel has been removed though.

Construction has begun....
Prices for that are have moved quite abit.
Im keenly awaiting for the area to be up, i believe it will look pretty. Esp, with 200 newton out there!

Just *begun*? But they sold out in 2005! Why the delay?

Its only a single block... im sure they will meet delivery TOP 2008

BUt the units are too small to be called "units". Not good!

Any floorplans?

"but units are small, etc. NOT GOOD!"

Believe it or not, some people *like* small units! :-)

It's actually an interesting development; I was tempted until Parc Infinia came along and screwed up the whole neighbourhood...

Are you sure! Given a choice, I am sure people would choose a 2000 sqft apartment to a puny 700sqft one. Period.

are you sure! given a choice, i'm sure people would choose a 2000 sqft apartmant to a puny 700sqft one. period. :carrot::banana:

Im sure it has all to do with $$$.
Iridium sells for alot smaller quantum than a bigger unit in a nice district.

"but units are small, etc. NOT GOOD!"

Believe it or not, some people *like* small units! :-)

It's actually an interesting development; I was tempted until Parc Infinia came along and screwed up the whole neighbourhood...

care to elaborate why park infinia screws up the neighborhood? i was there during their soft launch and was pretty impressed by it. Didnt commit to it tho due to the "relatively" high price then...
still remember the 4 bedrooms really WoW'ed us with the private lift lobby and layout.. think it was asking 2 million then..

@stingraytan
Nope, you are wrong. The largest 4-bedder is 2002 sqft, which at the time I went to see, it was only S$1.7 million. You probably went at a later time.
:rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::

cheers

excelsvr

Hi,

I understand that the Iridium TOP is supposed to be at Dec 2008. Now is already 3rd quarter July 2008, but they have not even build the 1st storey. They are left with 5 months to complete the building. I think it is impossible to build a 17th storey condo in 5 months time. Anybody knows what happen? Is the Novelty Group running into some problems? What is the penalty if they did not complete the TOP by Dec 2008?

http://www.ura.gov.sg/legal/PartC/HOUSING_DEVELOPERS_RULES.htm#916126497-000142

Under Sales and Purchase Agreement Section..

Para 13.5.

Liquidate Damages = 10% per annum of installments made to date.

I believe the TOP date is end Oct 08. Was peeking at the site few days ago.. formwork for level 1 floorslab and beam is done, yet to cast.

How's construction?

Hi,

I understand that the Iridium TOP is supposed to be at Dec 2008. Now is already 3rd quarter July 2008, but they have not even build the 1st storey. They are left with 5 months to complete the building. I think it is impossible to build a 17th storey condo in 5 months time. Anybody knows what happen? Is the Novelty Group running into some problems? What is the penalty if they did not complete the TOP by Dec 2008?
from the brochure that i have, the date is expected TOP dec 2008.

Yes.. my mistake.. Date of Delivery of Vacant Possession is 31 Dec 08.

^^ this is interesting.

So it is construction crunch or credit crunch???

this project is now completed. pretty nice lighting at night. pity about the size of the plot though.

this project is now completed. pretty nice lighting at night. pity about the size of the plot though.

Wonder when is the TOP?Hope to be this week according to the on-site contractor.

Anyone has any pics? Do post here and share. TQ

...........