City Square House

The building which stood on the site of City Square House has almost been totally demolished and will be replaced with the extremely modern white and glass office building that you see below.

Data

No. of floors - 10
Height -
Building type - Office
Year of construction - 2005
Architect - DLA Architecture
Location - Leeds city centre

http://www.leeds-cityscape.co.uk/render1.jpg

http://www.leeds-cityscape.co.uk/render3.jpg

City Square House

The building which stood on the site of City Square House has almost been totally demolished and will be replaced with the extremely modern white and glass office building that you see below.

Data

No. of floors - 10
Height -
Building type - Office
Year of construction - 2005
Architect - DLA Architecture
Location - Leeds city centre

http://www.leeds-cityscape.co.uk/render1.jpg

http://www.leeds-cityscape.co.uk/render3.jpg


Work has just started on construction, so we should see a couple of cranes on site before the end of the year

Work has just started on construction, so we should see a couple of cranes on site before the end of the year

Excellent news. This is an absolutely fantastic building IMO, and considerably better than either the old city sqaure house, or the original version for the replacement. It's been well over 3 years since it was approved, so it's long overdue though.

Excellent news. This is an absolutely fantastic building IMO, and considerably better than either the old city sqaure house, or the original version for the replacement. It's been well over 3 years since it was approved, so it's long overdue though.

quite so, the old red brick crap looked awful next to Princess Exchange. Its been literally a hole in the ground for two years and a bit of an eyesore for people coming out of the station. The new design is indeed very fetching, I like the sharp point the building comes to and what appears to be a greeny tinged glass finish. I'm home this weekend so shall get a shot or two and see what action has happened in the past couple of weeks.

Again, City Offices.net had this to say a couple of months back

AWG sells City Square House site.
AWG Developments has sold the site of its new 12,350 sq m net (132,935 sq ft) City Square House development in Leeds. McAleer and Rushe Group, the County Tyrone-based developers and contractors has paid £11 million for the cleared site which has planning permission for a 10-storey scheme on Wellington Street. It is understood that McAleer and Rushe intend to speculatively build the scheme following a full review of the design.

We've not seen any new planning permission for the site, therefore I think it would be a safe bet to say that the building going up will be that first proposed by AWG. More Irish investors coming into Leeds then, apparently Irish investors have jumped feet first into the residential property market, and now they seem to want a bit of the commercial property. Can't see how they'd fail with this one, great location, Grade A office space, fantastic landmark building. Whey hey!

You could say this is the last piece to city square, but I have noticed that as such a visible building, the building above the leeds shopping plaza facing city square- Albion Tower? well that thing next to city exchange, the ugly brown thing, needs a good reclad. It needs something that will back city square and hopefully get rid of this eyesore. Most of Leeds prominent ugly buildings have been recladded now, this is one that hasnt. Im glad City Square provides such a good first view of Leeds for some people coming out of the station, even though most people would only just touch the south east tip of the square- this could call for further money inkeeping with city square to put into the area around New Station Street and Boar Lane- it could fit in with a renovation of Albion Street...

Im glad City Square provides such a good first view of Leeds for some people coming out of the station, even though most people would only just touch the south east tip of the square- this could call for further money inkeeping with city square to put into the area around New Station Street and Boar Lane- it could fit in with a renovation of Albion Street...

It would give an even better impression, not only for visitors, but the good council tax payers of Leeds, if the fountains could be got to work properly ! :bash:

Again, City Offices.net had this to say a couple of months back

AWG sells City Square House site.
AWG Developments has sold the site of its new 12,350 sq m net (132,935 sq ft) City Square House development in Leeds. McAleer and Rushe Group, the County Tyrone-based developers and contractors has paid £11 million for the cleared site which has planning permission for a 10-storey scheme on Wellington Street. It is understood that McAleer and Rushe intend to speculatively build the scheme following a full review of the design.

We've not seen any new planning permission for the site, therefore I think it would be a safe bet to say that the building going up will be that first proposed by AWG. More Irish investors coming into Leeds then, apparently Irish investors have jumped feet first into the residential property market, and now they seem to want a bit of the commercial property. Can't see how they'd fail with this one, great location, Grade A office space, fantastic landmark building. Whey hey!

That's what I thought, although I'm sure the new board that has gone up on the hoardings states 15,000 sq m, I'll have to check tomorrow. (perhaps that's not net and includes lobbys etc).

http://www.citysquarehouse.co.uk/render4.html
http://www.citysquarehouse.co.uk/render5.html
http://www.citysquarehouse.co.uk/render2.html
http://www.citysquarehouse.co.uk/render3.html
I kinda guessed that wouldnt work from the .html bit. http://www.citysquarehouse.co.uk/render3.html just put that in the browser but change the '3' to 2,4 and 5.

just put that in the browser but change the '3' to 2,4 and 5.
There you go LN1

http://www.citysquarehouse.co.uk/include/image/render1.jpg

http://www.citysquarehouse.co.uk/include/image/render2.jpg

http://www.citysquarehouse.co.uk/include/image/render3.jpg

http://www.citysquarehouse.co.uk/include/image/render4.jpg

http://www.citysquarehouse.co.uk/include/image/render5.jpg

Just not sure. Whilst I quite like the sharp edge, the question remains is it good enough for this location?

Just not sure. Whilst I quite like the sharp edge, the question remains is it good enough for this location?
wotever the out come im sure it is gonna be no worse than the attmept at the park plaza hotel!!

how is progress going at this building? is there any cranes or ne thing above ground yet?

Nope. I've not seen any work going on above the blue hoardings, God knows what's happening behind though. Like I say though, no cranes or owt like that yet.

Park Plaza would be infintely better if it didn't have the "mania" restaurants in it, but stuck with high end quality like ChinoLatino instead - IMO

Park Plaza was the worst ever attempt at renovation, how dull it is, absolutely zero artistic merit, only marginally better than in its former life. City Square House looks like an attempt that we expect from a location like this, in the company of the architectural heavy weights like Princes Exchange and the Norwick Union Building (and, as i expect, the beauty of the old post office)! This one could be a bit better though.

It's not bad from this side, but the grey stripe is unforgivable.

http://www.leeds-cityscape.co.uk/photos/09-04-2005/Park%20Plaza%20Hotel%20Leeds.jpg

It's not bad from this side, but the grey stripe is unforgivable.

http://www.leeds-cityscape.co.uk/photos/09-04-2005/Park%20Plaza%20Hotel%20Leeds.jpg

When our skyscraper boom is fully fledged in, say, about 5 years time, this will become a great oportunity to knock this bloody thing down and have something iconic maybe!!??

:master: Please, please!!

Yes, it could hardly be called a masterpiece. Anyway, City Square house just seems a very unremarkable building. I'm afraid this building alongside the perpetually filthy Queens Hotel will ensure that City Square is still the place you dash through to get somewhere else.
If we truly are going through an urban "renaissance" (and I hesitate in using this government sponsored word) then surely we should be using designs that will stand the test of time and be admired in the future......or am I just bitching? :)

Yes, it could hardly be called a masterpiece. Anyway, City Square house just seems a very unremarkable building. I'm afraid this building alongside the perpetually filthy Queens Hotel will ensure that City Square is still the place you dash through to get somewhere else.
If we truly are going through an urban "renaissance" (and I hesitate in using this government sponsored word) then surely we should be using designs that will stand the test of time and be admired in the future......or am I just bitching? :)

No Liam, my sentiments too. I actually liked the original design better the the most up to date one. The council should have had a 'trash need not apply' rule for such sensitive and high profile area.

Yes, it could hardly be called a masterpiece. Anyway, City Square house just seems a very unremarkable building. I'm afraid this building alongside the perpetually filthy Queens Hotel will ensure that City Square is still the place you dash through to get somewhere else.
If we truly are going through an urban "renaissance" (and I hesitate in using this government sponsored word) then surely we should be using designs that will stand the test of time and be admired in the future......or am I just bitching? :)


I think the Queens is one of the finest buildings in Leeds. It has an almost Stalinesque/Russian splendour about it. It aint that filthy is it, well it wasn't 2 days ago when I last drove past it!

Liam, your spot on. for an area such as this the coucil should whip up architectural competitions to find the best in iconic and durable architectural design and building engineering. Places like this should be an art gallary of architecture, especially when it is the first impression of most people coming from the Train Station for the first time. Just as the Princes Exchange is when people come out the back way!!!

I'm afraid this building alongside the perpetually filthy Queens Hotel will ensure that City Square is still the place you dash through to get somewhere else.


The Queens has been cleaned recently, and now looks like a huge slab of wedding cake. CSHouse is pretty smart imo, echoing in modern terms, the adjacent rail offices.

slab of wedding cake... hahahaha, too true! does anyone know when the old post office building will be unveiled? i love that building

Early 2006 (all the advert says). It is called Residence6, 'Leeds' First and Only 6 Star Serviced Apartments' although I thought those ones in the VQ were to be 6 star serviced...

As for Park Plaza, I don't like the tower that much but I can think of lots of other buildings I would rather see something done to above that. The Podium is OK though. The Queens to me looks fine but it does look a bit dirty but really its OK, nice backing to the Square. I think it would be a good idea to build offices above Leeds Station, on the part above the Wellington Quarter, as its pretty low rise, prime location, would look good denser (providing it was a good design) and it would hide the less attractive rear of The Queens.

When our skyscraper boom is fully fledged in, say, about 5 years time, this will become a great oportunity to knock this bloody thing down and have something iconic maybe!!??

:master: Please, please!!

There really shouldn't be any need to knock it down, but the council should have stuck out for something much better, just think what they did with K2 from a similar starting point, and that has won awards, and everyone loves K2. Even Cavendish House is starting to look quite tasty (from the Headrow side).

Park Plaza really is a very plain re-clad, and could do with some spicing up. Large single letter signage at the top saying 'Park Plaza' or something that is lit up at night would really help, it's just missing any kind of focal point above the podium. And what is that weird railing thing around the top that was added ? I thought it was for some sort of lighting feature at first, but it seems to serve no purpose whatsoever.

They actually spent a lot of money on re-furbishing Park Plaza and it took over a year, it has just been totally let down by some totally boring old architect with no imagination.

City House's re-clad, although plain, works well and makes it look neat and crisp. Park Plaza just looks kind of messy.

Park Plaza already looks like it needs an overhaul, what a waste of a prime opportunity

There really shouldn't be any need to knock it down, but the council should have stuck out for something much better, just think what they did with K2 from a similar starting point, and that has won awards, and everyone loves K2. Even Cavendish House is starting to look quite tasty (from the Headrow side).

Park Plaza really is a very plain re-clad, and could do with some spicing up. Large single letter signage at the top saying 'Park Plaza' or something that is lit up at night would really help, it's just missing any kind of focal point above the podium. And what is that weird railing thing around the top that was added ? I thought it was for some sort of lighting feature at first, but it seems to serve no purpose whatsoever.

They actually spent a lot of money on re-furbishing Park Plaza and it took over a year, it has just been totally let down by some totally boring old architect with no imagination.

City House's re-clad, although plain, works well and makes it look neat and crisp. Park Plaza just looks kind of messy.


Couldn't agree with you more- dramatic lighting would help this unnatractive building to shine. I don't understand why the owners of Park Plaza have not done this?

They might do in the future. As I as saying in another thread, go take a look at the skyline from Potternewton Lane/Scott Hall Road at night, and many buildings are lit up, its quite impressive. K2 has a green uplighting at the top now...

Wasn't there a plan to tear City House down and start again?

Wasn't there a plan to tear City House down and start again?

I hope so. If you look at the site, it's crying out for an iconic structure. Give people an incredible final image of Leeds before they leave the city by train, not a confirmation of existing prejudices. (the site is also visible all the way down Park Row) A re-clad, which seems to be the 'maximising profits' option nowadays, would be a disaster for the city in this case.

I hope so. If you look at the site, it's crying out for an iconic structure. Give people an incredible final image of Leeds before they leave the city by train, not a confirmation of existing prejudices. (the site is also visible all the way down Park Row) A re-clad, which seems to be the 'maximising profits' option nowadays, would be a disaster for the city in this case.

I fully agree. This is a far from visually pleasing building, a re-clad would not suffice. Its prominent position radiates grimness to all that visit Leeds!

the podium is nice though

I hope so. If you look at the site, it's crying out for an iconic structure. Give people an incredible final image of Leeds before they leave the city by train, not a confirmation of existing prejudices. (the site is also visible all the way down Park Row) A re-clad, which seems to be the 'maximising profits' option nowadays, would be a disaster for the city in this case.


I agree with that a re-clad is not ideal but I often wonder what folk coming into the city on train make of the awful identikit apartment blocks springing up on Whitehall road. They are about as inspiring as Westlife!

To be totally honest, I doubt most people really take into account many of the buildings, unless they have something really unique. When Im in Leeds with friends they never look at the buildings, only whats in them (shops, restaurants), unless I point it out.

As for City Square House, I like the Podium. On the skyline, maybe BWP will take away the effect it has and therefore it will be less noticed... I dont exactly hate it, theres worse.

What do people make of the Royal & SunAlliance building?

http://creative.gettyimages.com/source/classes/FrameSet.aspx?s=ImageDetailSearchState%7C3%7C5%7C0%7C0%7C15%7C2%7C1%7C%7C0%7C0%7C0%7C1%7C14%7C60%7C2000.15c4.0050..000b.26a0.28c0..2003.0007%7C1%7C0%7C0%7C%22messy%22+and+%22paint%22%7C%7C1%7C0%7C0&pk=5

I agree with that a re-clad is not ideal but I often wonder what folk coming into the city on train make of the awful identikit apartment blocks springing up on Whitehall road. They are about as inspiring as Westlife!

Yes, i totally agree, and weren't some of us (me, mostly) going on about how the entrance to the city would be gobsmackingly fantastic by the end of the decade. After seeing the miserable, business park-esque Whitehall block going up, i feel my hopes for this area were misplaced. How could Carey Jones get Princes Exchange so right, and Whitehall so wrong? It isn;t as if the client demands a budget job.

In the words of Westlife - "Can't believe that I'm a fool again."

Hopefully the other buildings there will be inspiring and interesting...

I posted a few days ago about why City Square House has not yet started. Does anyone know when this scheme will be starting as it looks very unattractive having such a prominent position taken up by just mud and rubble.

On the subject of Criterion Place appearing to go nowhere why has the site of City Square House been dormant for the last two years and the previous Guardian Exchange building was standing empty for a few years before that! Surely such a prime site must have tenants and also it looks silly for such a prominent site to be only used for mud. Are the developers in financial trouble or doing a CentrePoint of deliberately keeping the site empty for some reason?! :mad:

Shame really as the renders look really good. :(

http://www.leeds-cityscape.co.uk/render1.jpg

http://www.leeds-cityscape.co.uk/render3.jpg

It was meant have started last year, the project must have fallen through, again (for a second time). Why can't they get proper developers on these prestigious jobs instead of the Mickey Mouse two bit cowboys we seem to often get !

This render looks a little like the base of BP. Can't decide if this would be a good place for a tower or not.

I guess the best solution would be a small park, to set off LL rising behind, but unlikely as Leeds is anti green space in the city centre. It would not need a very tall building at this location to hide La Lumiere from view as you leave the station.

Wasn't the scheme taken on by a different development company somewhere in Ireland who wanted to review the designs before proceeding?

I emailed AWG, who according to the website are the developers, and got this interesting but rather useless response:

"AWG sold this site some 12 months ago and is now longer responsible for said site. Unfortunately I do not have any contact details on who purchased and apologies but cannot help you any further."

anything thats tall in leeds in needed exept if its very very ugly i dont mind this building
its needed for the area.

I emailed AWG, who according to the website are the developers, and got this interesting but rather useless response:

"AWG sold this site some 12 months ago and is now longer responsible for said site. Unfortunately I do not have any contact details on who purchased and apologies but cannot help you any further."

Found this.
AWG Developments has sold the site of its new 12,350 sq m net (132,935 sq ft) City Square House development in Leeds. McAleer and Rushe Group, the County Tyrone-based developers and contractors has paid £11 million for the cleared site which has planning permission for a 10-storey scheme on Wellington Street. It is understood that McAleer and Rushe intend to speculatively build the scheme following a full review of the design. - (18-03-2005)

http://www.mcaleer-rushe.co.uk/commercial.htm
http://www.mcaleer-rushe.co.uk/contact.htm

This site annoys me probably the most out of any in Leeds. Really prime, we know it changed hands from AWG to Mcaleer Rushe, who we were told were assessing the scheme before building began. Here we are, and there is still absolutely nothing going on. Oh except, they've covered part of that horrible bare building wall with an advert, and then (shockingly) put up some fake brick cladding to cover the other bare patches, which doesnt even match the colour of the bricks around the perimeter :bash: It looks terrible.

This site http://www.colliers.com/Content/Repositories/Base/Markets/UnitedKingdom/English/Market_Report/PDFs/LeedsOfficesFINAL.pdf

suggest end 2007, but it doesnt seem to be up to date as it has BWP for Sept 06 completion.

I have a sneaking suspicion that the developers may be holding on and letting the value of the site increase, as it has to be one of the most desirable plots in the city......

Doubt they would get planning permission for anything that much taller than the existing plan?

This site annoys me probably the most out of any in Leeds. Really prime, we know it changed hands from AWG to Mcaleer Rushe, who we were told were assessing the scheme before building began. Here we are, and there is still absolutely nothing going on. Oh except, they've covered part of that horrible bare building wall with an advert, and then (shockingly) put up some fake brick cladding to cover the other bare patches, which doesnt even match the colour of the bricks around the perimeter :bash: It looks terrible.

This site http://www.colliers.com/Content/Repositories/Base/Markets/UnitedKingdom/English/Market_Report/PDFs/LeedsOfficesFINAL.pdf

suggest end 2007, but it doesnt seem to be up to date as it has BWP for Sept 06 completion.

I have a sneaking suspicion that the developers may be holding on and letting the value of the site increase, as it has to be one of the most desirable plots in the city......

I agree it really is annoying that this prime site is still undeveloped even though the old buildings on this site were demolished like a couple of years ago with the old Guardian Exchange building being empty at least two years before that. I just wish so much they start soon as surely with this site they would certainly attract tenants and it is of a very high design deserving of City Square. Certainly the thought of remaining delibarately derelict reminds me of the Centrepoint Tower in London which was notourious for being unused for many years (allegedly!). Why can't they build it for goodness sake! :bash:

So any news on this getting built any time soon.?

'leeds the best', if people have important news about a project - they'll tell us. There's really no need to keep asking such questions.

What the hell is going on with this development its been a while now.

What the hell is going on with this development its been a while now.

Unfortunately, absolutely nothing. The first thing to happen since the original building was demolished is the putting up of a large advert for Nokia that has gone up today.

It's a real shame as this is a prime site, situated so close to the station.

Unfortunately, absolutely nothing. The first thing to happen since the original building was demolished is the putting up of a large advert for Nokia that has gone up today.

It's a real shame as this is a prime site, situated so close to the station.

The real reason for the inaction is that the site has changed ownership.

Some progress here

From YP:

....This is the second major deal that McAleer & Rushe have completed in Leeds over the last 18 months.
The company recently paid AWG Developments £11m for City Square House on Wellington Street.
The speculative development of this prime office development should start later this year.

That sounds like good news.

If they've spent £11m on the land, they'll really want to be getting on with it.

Some progress here

From YP:

the trusty YEP again. If all they can say is that it should start later this year, I wouldn't hold out too many hopes to be fair.

its a nice scheme though, great design for the site and perfect little intrusion into City Square. the sharp glass nicely contrasts with the shite grey of Park Plaza and the grand frontage of the old Post Office.

It says the same thing on the developers website as well so it might actually this time happen.

This is moving forward.
Will be discussed at the forthcoming plans panel. :)

You mean http://www.leeds.gov.uk/moderngov/Published/C00000173/M00001089/AI00007149/citysquarehouse.pdf Thanks for the info!! :D:D

14 floors of offices, this could be huge - 60m or so.

Exciting front page story in tonights YEP:

Office tower block plans unveiled.

There's a fantastic render of the new plans for City Square House by Mc Aleer and Rushe. 14 stoerys of steel and glass which is a striking visual. Sorry, I can't scan the picture, but it is a vast improvement from the original designs.

The news report says:

City Square House is a proposed 170,000 sq ft 14 storey development. Planning permission is being sought from LCC after working closely with the council on bringing an iconic building to this important site in City Square.
This is the office development that the Leeds market has been waiting for offering quality office space in the city centre.

This building will compliment the other high rise buildings around City Square and will be a dramatic introduction to the journey down Wellington Street with Lumiere a few hundred yards further down the street

.

A good design I would say, building up to a tall point at the City Square corner. The presentation to the planning panel mentioned a design to match Lumiere down the road, with the image you can see that.

This scan isn't brilliant, but gives the idea.

http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid225/p33fcc6bd0d3e606d2a6c1e356dbbff93/e9bc224d.jpg

Courtesy of YEP.

Good front page story YEP (credit where credit's due).

http://img251.imageshack.us/img251/3596/scanhi5.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

Edit : Too slow!

Looks like an absolute stunner to me!! with this all but one corner of city square will be pleasing to the eye!!

Different colour shade on yours, which gives a better impression.

Looks good and it will surely add a lot of scale to this end of town although I would have prefered something of consistant height as opposed to the tower with adjoining low rise. Would this I guess be in the region of 50 metres in height? Also how long do we have to wait to get this thing past planning as it would certainly be a need to fill the empty void between Leeds City station and the former Majestyks nightclub sooner rather than later. Did the previous scheme for this site already have planning permission and does this redesign mean that new permission is now required?

Looks brilliant. Did you see any other renderings at the planning panel rob? It appears that one side has a completely different cladding design to the other

WOW looks awesome, so is this just proposed like the paper says or is it approved because the paper makes out its already gone to panel?

also, is that a spire i can make out on top or is it just part of that glass part?

A bold statement building. I love it.


http://www.leeds-cityscape.co.uk/2342.jpg


http://www.mcaleer-rushe.co.uk/popup/current4_large.jpg


http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid225/p33fcc6bd0d3e606d2a6c1e356dbbff93/e9bc224d.jpg

I like the building but I think it is inappropriate 'cos it might take the edge off how big lumiere looks. Something inkeeping with the current low rise level would make lumier look gigantic.

I would have said that buildings of this size around Lumiere will complement it, give more of a cluster feel to the area. its not too big that it will overshadow Lumiere but not too small that it will make the Lumiere pair stick out like a sore thumb all on their own

I personally prefer the first two designs shown above.

I would have said that buildings of this size around Lumiere will complement it, give more of a cluster feel to the area. its not too big that it will overshadow Lumiere but not too small that it will make the Lumiere pair stick out like a sore thumb all on their own

But because of perspective, it might impede this view

http://www.carrerapropertyconsultancy.com/images/lumiere/lumiere-apartments.gif

Which I think is quite an important view of lumier from Boar lane

I personally prefer the first two designs shown above.

It would certainly have blended in more with the adjacent Hotel and Railway offices.

http://www.leeds-cityscape.co.uk/render1.jpg


http://www.leeds-cityscape.co.uk/render3.jpg

It would certainly have blended in more with the adjacent Hotel and Railway offices.

http://www.leeds-cityscape.co.uk/render1.jpg


http://www.leeds-cityscape.co.uk/render3.jpg



Remember, if your a true skychaser, your always reaching for the sky....so its 14 storeys and a great iconic tower for me, not this midriser.

I like all designs, however the latest design does reflect the land value of this site, the state of leeds today (rather than 2 years ago), and the demand for prime office space.

I think it will have the opposite effect of taking pride from Lumiere. Instead it will compliment it by building up a modern density around it; think of The City where all buildings are 10 storeys+; it feels like a big city.

It's a shame we couldn't have had something similar to replace Royal Exchange House.

Which is Royal Exchange House?

the hotel in city square i think is royal exchange house

this development is heads and shoulders above the previous designs think of the sheer glazed frontage on wellington street it will look class IMO this is by far a better proposal for leeds and will give the city square a feel big city feel IMO...

You mean the Park Plaza, not The Queens!

yes park plaza not the queens dude!!

im slightly underwhelmed by this, but still think its a good design for an embarassingly empty central plot, tho i'd be happy with the above design too, just something half decent to complete the square!

I would have said that buildings of this size around Lumiere will complement it, give more of a cluster feel to the area. its not too big that it will overshadow Lumiere but not too small that it will make the Lumiere pair stick out like a sore thumb all on their own

I really like this redesign of City Square House.. nice clean tall and sharp design the somewhat vague looking spire ? will also look great if there is one " and if erected ;)" and as shown in the latest render. I agree with Leeds John having a building like this at the current hight will not impead on Lumiere, I'm sure it will enhance it, looking or standing nearby to City Square House will throw an even greater perspective on Lumiere making it apear even taller ! Wow what a sight, I cant wait :banana:

http://img251.imageshack.us/img251/3596/scanhi5.jpg

a few observations:

- the third iteration in the design stage, certainly looks the most impressive heightwise
- noticeable for the 'facade overrun', which seems to be prevalent in lots of London schemes (facade overruns the top of the building, hiding any nasty plant equipment loitering around)
- the developers recognise the value of the site, particularly its location literally next door to the station. they clearly want to maximise their investment with as big as building as possible on the site. I guess 14 storeys is a tall as they can get away with on this part of City Square
- basic shape looks like a nod towards Lumiere
- all in, probably prefered the design of the middle scheme, but have no objections, as long as the cladding is top notch, and we see a few more renders asap.

This area of leeds needs buildings of this height to give it that important major financial city feel it brags about, all round here it manages to do this and this latest render looks like something you would find in London. Although i liked the middle design, this latest one is by far of a higher class and will finish city square off and make it an unbelievable square.

Imagine the view from City Sq in a few years if this is completed - the majestic Queens and Old Post Office, the nice No.1 City Sq and this building, and then Criterion (we hope) and Lumiere just off the Square...

Remember, if your a true skychaser, your always reaching for the sky....so its 14 storeys and a great iconic tower for me, not this midriser.


Oh come on, this place might be called Skyscrapercity but it doesn't mean we all think bigger is better. Where it's appropriate, yes build tall, though I really feel City Square is not quite the right aesthetic for this sort of tower, and as previously said it would block some of the views of La Lumiere. I also find the new design a bit odd. One half is cladding with windows and the other is sheer glass. I must admit not something I've really seen before, but I just don't think it works, it makes it feel unintegrated.

Well, I have to say that I think this site is suited for a relitavely tall buildings. The buildings around City Square are quite tall really; the space allows it. I mean, Park Plaza is 20 storeys. This will only be 14, and will really set off the Wellington Street/Whitehall Road financial corridors. Princes Exchange is a similar height, and also visible from City Square.

I mean, Park Plaza is 20 storeys. This will only be 14, and will really set off the Wellington Street/Whitehall Road financial corridors. City Square.

but park plaza has a low rise base which this one (arguably) misses. I think there should be more thought of continuity with the immediate low rise buildings rather then just a 'low bit' then 'a high bit'. It could do with some descending slopes or curves maybe to flatter the lowe rises imediately next to it or a scale down to build the hight between majestics into the Queens.

I do actually like the building though. I think the use of windows on one side and glazing on t'other is a great idea. To me it is saying "this is whats to come" (regarding lumiere) but then keeps from copying it too much.

At least I would say that if I didnt know the real reason (from the planning app.): " It is proposed that the north facing elevation of the tower would be glazed (the side which would not suffer from solar gain due to it’s orientation) but that the elevation of the lower
building would introduce an increased level of masonry to reflect the more traditional use of materials on Wellington St. On the southern elevation, where solar gain would become an issue, the proposal is to use a more solid masonry treatment."

So a pretty pragmatoc step then.

I have liked all the designs so far. Lets just hope they can crack on with building this one so we don't have to wait for a fourth redesign. As for the height, I think 14 storeys is about right for the location. Situated in the South West end of City Square, if it were any taller it would start to block out the sun.

though I really feel City Square is not quite the right aesthetic for this sort of tower, and as previously said it would block some of the views of La Lumiere.

But it's not really a tower by any stretch of the imagination, the best you could call it is mid-rise, many would say it is low rise. It may block some views of Lumiere but will definately enhance others acting like a little brother to the 30 storey facade of Lumiere further down Wellington Street.

What this render doesn't show is that the building cuts back from the wide points you see here, to form a 'diamond' shape. So the fourteen story element doesn't continue flush with Wellington Street, it sort of disappears again to open up that vista. I don't think it'll block Lumiere. As for the contrasting materials - it's a clever idea, to try and bring together what is a mish-mash of styles around the square. By picking up two of the dominant styles - the white render of the Queens, and the glazing of Princes Exchange and Lumiere, it provides some unity without trying to be all things at once.

I think this is by far the best scheme proposed for this site. I think the renders flatter the earlier ones somewhat - they were proposed at the time and of and seem reminiscent of No 1 Whitehall, which represents an architecture that I think we've moved on from.

Talking about the Queens hotel, i think in order to make it look like a class hotel and get over it's old-fashioned' railway hotel they should put canopy's over the windows like they do on the Dorcester in London and that you find in countless hotels in europe, i just think it would benefit the hotel and the square its in as well.

As for the city square house, the current design finishes off the square and it would most definately only add to Lumiere not take anything away and what a gateway to Leeds this road will be in a few years with Wellington Place added to it as well.

I must admit i'm quite excited by the new (3rd) render. It has 'class' written all over it, and like previously mentioned, i too think it will enhance the City Square to no end.

As for the worry with regards to blocking a fine view of Lumiere - we can't protect the views from all angles forever. Leeds need to progress, and if that means taking away some of the 'wow factor' from another building then so be it.

I have to say that I agree with the overall sentiment of approval. The former designs did nothing for me, whereas I think this is a rather striking design. So this design gets my unqualified subjective approval!

I have to say that I agree with the overall sentiment of approval. The former designs did nothing for me, whereas I think this is a rather striking design. So this design gets my unqualified subjective approval!

From this angle, the previous design doesn't look so hot.

http://www.dla-architecture.co.uk/index_home.htm

We're going to see Lumiere from almost everywhere in Leeds, loosing a bit of a view from City Square shouldn't be too much of a concern.

The Civic Trust being positive about the new proposals in their latest newsletter:

The second development was the replacement for City Square House, the now demolished building between the Queen’s Hotel and the Majestyk Nightclub. This will be a prominent feature for those crossing City Square or walking down Wellington Street. There is already planning permission for a what is a rather boxy building on this site. New owners have come up with a scheme which, although slightly larger in floor area and height, has the potential to be a far more attractive building. An interesting feature of the presentation was that it showed the new building in context with other proposed developments, something too few architects show us. On this site, the relationship with Lumiere (the 54 floor building further down Wellington Street) is crucial and had evidently been thought about. While supporting the principles, a key issue for us was the impact on the small roundabout which is the ‘back entrance’ to the station – we felt more care should be taken with this side of the building.

wow i like this - it will provide a stepped lead up to lumiere, and its bright glassy look is much better than the terrecotta clad west point behind it.

I think buildings round this point need to be really good as they are prime sites, visible by tens of thousands a day.

wow i like this - it will provide a stepped lead up to lumiere, and its bright glassy look is much better than the terrecotta clad west point behind it.

I think buildings round this point need to be really good as they are prime sites, visible by tens of thousands a day.

Completely agree with you there. I think that the Square is a great example of architecture through the ages, and apart from the obvious exception, they're all of extremely high quality. They're a great entrance to the city for visitors coming in from the train station.

Subliving.

Good news, looks like a beauty and totally befitting of such a prime location!

Just need something to happen with the old Majestyks, anyone know the score there?

Completely agree with you there. I think that the Square is a great example of architecture through the ages, and apart from the obvious exception, they're all of extremely high quality. They're a great entrance to the city for visitors coming in from the train station.

Subliving.

I agree. However, I just went to sheffield for a day and the new entrane to the train station is amazing. Ignoring the architecture around it, I think it is far better a public space then Leeds has.

I agree. However, I just went to sheffield for a day and the new entrane to the train station is amazing. Ignoring the architecture around it, I think it is far better a public space then Leeds has.

It's quite isolated from the rest of the city centre though and requires a walk down a steep slope to get to it whereas City Square is often used by office workers on their lunch break. However, i agree, Sheffield's Station Square is a triumph and while it may not be surrounded by impressive high-rise, it has the potential for new buildings to accompany the Showroom cinema (the best in the UK imo) and the NCFPM, now the union of Sheffield Hallam uni. In fact, Sheffield has built some of the best public spaces in Yorkshire within the last five years.

Yeh, i will agree with that. The winter gardens is a bit of a triuph too. Why can't Leeds do that same I wonder. I will be interested if the lumiere winter garden becomes a true public space or just a garden for the super rich that own appartments in it.

Yeh, i will agree with that. The winter gardens is a bit of a triuph too. Why can't Leeds do that same I wonder. I will be interested if the lumiere winter garden becomes a true public space or just a garden for the super rich that own appartments in it.

Ironically, Leeds is a victim of its own success. Sheffield and the rest of South Yorkshire have benefitted from the massive Objective 1 European funding programme over the last seven years or so (around £700m) with corresponding amounts of other public sector funding to match it. Much of this has come from bodies like Yorkshire Forward and English Partnerships.

Leeds has not been eligible for this kind of funding, so most of the large scale projects have been private sector-led and most of the cultural stuff has been largely invisible, like the Grand Theatre refurb and the work taking place on the new museum.

Yep, its true. Leeds gets hardly any grants and that. But if you think Leeds gets a bad deal, Harrogate is even worse! No-one gives us grants because they think its a wealthy place! Yes it is. But the money is with the people, not with the organisations that would like it.

Found a better quality render:

http://www.propertyweek.com/Pictures/460xAny/k/i/x/17_p11_news_City_Sq_House.jpg

^^ fantastic - can't really say anything bad about this proposal, great height on a landmark plot. Good stuff.

question -
where will the shadow fall from this building?
i hope it will not fall on the palace or any of city square?

No shouldn't cast much shadow over City Square- think about where the sun is in relation to City Square House; the shadow will only be cast across the side of The Queens wouldnt it?

Anyone know when construction is likely to begin?

I like the size and shape of this building but would also like to know why it is clad differently on the two sides? I'm reserving judgement until we see more renders.

I like the size and shape of this building but would also like to know why it is clad differently on the two sides? I'm reserving judgement until we see more renders.

Yup, I'd prefer to see it glass clad on both sides, however I think I have a rational explanation. The side that is 'stone' clad is south-ish facing. Thus, if it was a huge glass facade it would heat up like the sahara desert in there.

Subliving.

OK, with the new high quality render, have to say that looks quite good, but is that gray paneling I see off to the right? On another note though, I wonder why the glass cladding on Lumiere itself couldn't match this quality? Instead, despite originally looking good, opting for some unnecessary colour coding, which just doesn't look right from some angles.

question -
where will the shadow fall from this building?
i hope it will not fall on the palace or any of city square?

What palace?

i think the old post office is called a palace though i cant recollect its name?
anybody help?
plus i think the shadow from this project will be cast down wellington street / up boar lane(think thats its name?) this shall be the same shadow direction as luminere

Yes, Boar Lane direction but don't think it'll be high enough to affect that- the site is just off City Square if you look; shadow will be cast on The Queens more.

http://img183.imageshack.us/img183/3598/citysqhouseqa0.jpg

07/04127/FU/C

McAleer and Rushe Group

Multi level office block up to 14 storeys with basement car parking

Grid Ref: 429758433394

City Square House
Wellington Street/Aire Street
Leeds
LS1 4DL

Knight Frank
9 Bond Court
Leeds
LS1 2JZ

City and Hunslet
26/06/07

Theres the planning app :)

Full or outline?

Subliving.

Full, under the new coding, FU = full.

I hope this gets moving soon, another ugly gap will be knocked on the head, and another smart office building added to the city centre.

Thank you! I don't understand the planning process too well...

Subliving.

I was at LBIA and picked up one of those Leeds buisness promotions magazines and it mentioned that this was due to start constuction late 2007. Fingers crossed because this building is a world class office development. There was some other project projection times as well that i'll mention later when i have time. :)

I was at LBIA and picked up one of those Leeds buisness promotions magazines and it mentioned that this was due to start constuction late 2007. Fingers crossed because this building is a world class office development. There was some other project projection times as well that i'll mention later when i have time. :)


Following on from that prediction, there's a piece in last Thursday's Yorkshire Post about the tightening supply in the Leeds office market. I'll post the full thing in the general thread but the following extract is interesting:


"The new schemes started or scheduled to start development in 2007 include 170,000 sq ft City Square House, Wellington Place (120,000 sq ft), Bridge House (around 150,000 sq ft) and Latitude Red (121,000 sq ft)."

Construction at Latitude is well under way and we know about the planned start at Wellington Street but I hadn't heard that plans were so well advanced for City Square House. Maybe, though, we should be wary of newspaper predictions.

Bridge House- is this Mayfair Bridge House? The plan that was "cancelled" (or so we think so)

A blank poster board has emerged above the hoarding on the corner of this plot, so things are obviously moving forward following a presumably successful planning application.

Good stuff is there any pictures of this poster board and what is on it (eg: area of development, completion date etc) as it would be so good to get this started asap especially as it is at such a prominent spot. Has there been any identified completion date for this development?

Bridge House- is this Mayfair Bridge House? The plan that was "cancelled" (or so we think so)

Yes, it's now owned by Kenmore, who are developing it as a primarily commercial based project, alongside a hotel. A planning app should be in any time now.

And just for Val Verde.....


http://img528.imageshack.us/img528/9569/1000843em1.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

Hopefully there's more to come :lol:

This will be on site properly in a few months from what I've heard.

That's the new redesign for the building... the core's finished now and they just havew to clad it in blue paint... :lol:

Subliving.

Just walked past the site and some high res photos are up...(much better than the carp ones at lumiere!)...the tower looks great and I love the glass. One thing that concerns me is where the new building joins 17 Wellington Street it looks like a 60's concrete block! Obviously a bit worrying for me as I live in 19 (which is also Grade II listed).

Does anyone know what material this will be?

Cheers, Rich.

I'd noticed that too, although I don't mind that style as long as it made of high quality materials

Had a look today for myself, and must say I wasn't too impressed. Apart from the fact it's tall, and clad with in vogue glass and portland stone, what exactly does this have going for it?! It looks a bit crude and oppresive at ground level, and the treatment of the rear seemed messy.

Full marks to them though for such convincing renders. I took a couple of pictures if anyone wants to see, as the website (www.citysquarehouseleeds.com) doesn't seem to be up at the moment.

Had a look today for myself, and must say I wasn't too impressed. Apart from the fact it's tall, and clad with in vogue glass and portland stone, what exactly does this have going for it?! It looks a bit crude and oppresive at ground level, and the treatment of the rear seemed messy.

Full marks to them though for such convincing renders. I took a couple of pictures if anyone wants to see, as the website (www.citysquarehouseleeds.com) doesn't seem to be up at the moment.

I'd love to see some images, put 'em up, personally i love to be oppressed by a building! :lol:

I drove past here quite quickly yesterday, but the render that is furthest away from city square on the hoardings shows a render i havn't seen before of the building looking down the street from lumiere. From the quick glance i got, it looked a lot different from that side.

At last, this is going before the planning panel next Thursday, with a strong recomendation for approval of what is described as a high quality scheme on a key central site.

There appears to be a target date of September, which the council have shamefully missed, I remember some stinging criticism from the developers of this project about how the council's planning team are holding back major projects in Leeds due to delays in the planning process. Anyway, this should be a formality, and I look forward to seeing this little sister to Lumiere starting in the new year. I notice they have to cough up over £1/4m for section 106 agreement goodies for METRO for the privelege of building it!

good old planners what a set of tools, the biggest waste of space in this country bar non

So does anybody know what happened to this in that thursday meeting then? I really wish it would get a move on, it will just complete city square so well. Plus it's a glass clad office block! Something of which is not in that much abundance in Leeds city centre!

Not heard anything yet, I can only assume all went well and was approved in principle.

The members report was very positive about the proposal and recommended approval. the conclusion to their report stated 'The proposal is considered to be a high quality office development which will rejuvenate and is appropriate for this site. As a result, Officers consider the scheme to be acceptable for the location, and Members are requested to note the above report and agree the officer recommendation.

I hope this is built, or at least something built here!!! I really like the current design, it would help to make city square look even better to visitors arriving by train!!! Its an important 'gateway' into the city, and needs to be impressive as such!!!

Confirmation is now published that City Square House was approved in principle by the planning board last month.

As the developers complained some time ago that the council planning department were holding them up, that should suggest that they will be wanting to get on with this as soon as things are ready to go. The reported supply shortage of grade 'A' space will certainly get them sharpening their pencils I should think.

Finally :) I expect this will start quite soon then, and be completed by the time Lumiere is up- what a good view that will be from City Square.

It will be a good view, that 14 storey flush glazed facade on Wellington Street will be like a mini Lumiere, with the real one just along the road, Wellington Street's going to look almost mini Manhatton-like.

Confirmation is now published that City Square House was approved in principle by the planning board last month.

As the developers complained some time ago that the council planning department were holding them up, that should suggest that they will be wanting to get on with this as soon as things are ready to go. The reported supply shortage of grade 'A' space will certainly get them sharpening their pencils I should think.

Great news, this is one of the projects i want to see go up the most, that hole at the moment is crying out to be filled in. Btw what does apporved in principle mean? Im hoping it means that they can go ahead and build it now?

I would take a guess it means that the scheme has the approval of the council, just not confirmed. I think it means that it needs official confirmation before construction can start, but they know they will get approval.

Let's remember this is 56m too- the 2nd tallest building in City Square.

How tall is the park plaza?

77m I believe (20 storeys).

For comparison, 1 City Square is 54m- so this is just 2m taller. How tall is The Queens, actually? Edit: 40m is The Queens (which seems the average height for this area).

Is the 56m to the roof or that little blade thing too?

great start to the New Years, lets hope this gets off the ground as its a rather embarrasing view seeing a derelict site immediately outside the Station/Queens. The new (3rd design), looks fine.

I would take a guess it means that the scheme has the approval of the council, just not confirmed. I think it means that it needs official confirmation before construction can start, but they know they will get approval.

Let's remember this is 56m too- the 2nd tallest building in City Square.

That's about it, the councillors on the planning board have approved it subject to the planning officers giving the final go ahead after setting the relevant conditions. It is approved, but not released as approved yet.

so when is this likely to be approved so construction can start.? are we talking another 6 months, or a year ?

Just a reminder of how stunning it is!

Found a better quality render:

http://www.propertyweek.com/Pictures/460xAny/k/i/x/17_p11_news_City_Sq_House.jpg

Does anyone know if 56m is inclusive of that spire?

Subliving.

I think its to the roof. Just a guess, in that the roof height seems to be a similar height to 1 City Square, 54m.

Just had a quick scan through last week's planning decisions. This scheme has now received full planning permission. :)

Fantastic. I have a feeling this one will be up quite quickly.

Subliving.

Just had a quick scan through last week's planning decisions. This scheme has now received full planning permission. :)

Cool. I think it's an excellent design, well worthy of its location.

it may not change the skyline, but looks fantastic!

Hmmm, so has no one (not Noone (http://www.encyclopediadramatica.com/Noone)) taken pictures of the new boardings that offer a render from another perspective on the building? I was walking around Leeds yesterday and saw these up, so was surprised not to catch an update on here. I suppose I could have done it myself, but I'm not one of you sad-o's who take photo's of promotional boards...

I'm not one of you sad-o's who take photo's of promotional boards...
Just one who comes on the internet to look at them? :cheers:

More to the point just when is City Square House going to finally start construction?

Just one who comes on the internet to look at them? :cheers:


Heheh, yes indeedy!

More to the point just when is City Square House going to finally start construction?

I feel your fustration on this, i want this project to go up more than most in Leeds, it's a stunning building in a wonderful location and most importantly its office space. I wish they would just hurry up with it!

More to the point just when is City Square House going to finally start construction?

It got full planning permission in the last month or so, according to the 'Bulletin

From skyscrapernews website:



Leeds Approve City Square House
Published on 01-04-2008 by Skyscrapernews.com


City Square House, a planned 14 storey office building has been approved for the centre of the Yorkshire city of Leeds.

The site is located adjacent to the Leeds railway station and occupies a landmark corner plot on Wellington Street. The site has already been cleared of the previous occupying six storey building enabling rapid construction of the scheme should it be prudent to build it.

Whilst awaiting development the scheme was sold on in 2005 from AWG Developments to the McAleer and Rushe Group for £11 million. The new developers are reported as intending to speculatively construct the 15,000 square metre scheme.

Since then the scheme's designers, DLA Architecture, have worked on the project gradually upping the scale of the building from 10 floors to the current 14 and worked on the shape of the building to help it resemble more closely the approved Lumiere skyscraper that will stand nearby.

The design features flushed glass facades, a curving corner profile, facade overruns and even an elegant spire giving City Square House a slick and ultra modern glass feel.

However, with a speculative start planned and no occupier signed up it may be some time before construction begins given the changing economic climate and indications of falling demand in the office markets.

I suspect that article was written from reports on here, doesn't Rob write for Leeds on skyscrapernews? The last few lines don't exactly instill me with confidence.

Yeah he does.

The last few lines are a bit misleading in one sense though. Although there is this problem at the moment, and things aren't going too well, office demand is still high in Leeds, and is expected to remain high until 2010 when it may start to fall, with the delivery of more office space.

If anyone's heading up New Station Street, could they check out the state of play here and see if there's anything going on at ground floor level? As I was coming into town today from the south, I noticed that a lot of City House's windows were open, mostly on the upper storeys. It made me wonder if the building was being gutted ahead of its refurb.

There is a sign saying "Danger Demolition" at the entrance to City House, the place is currently being internally stripped.

City House and city square house are different.

I'll start a new thread.

I'll start a new thread.

Don't Rob as I have already created a thread on the reclad of City House last month: http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=596781

Good news that work at least to strip out this building has commenced. Any pictures?

Sorry, so you have.
I was just looking for where we had discussed this all before .. that's where.

City House and city square house are different.


Apologies for causing the confusion :nuts:

I should know better, given that I worked in City House for three years.

http://img523.imageshack.us/img523/2742/image141za7.jpg

Picture taken today of the waste land which is meant to be the City Square House site. I take it there has still been no news on this long, long, long planned development and I guess it is another one which is dormant until the economy goes on the up again despite its primest location fronting onto City Square and it's office usage as opposed to residential? Shame really as it really is something needed to fill this empty gap in City Square.

^^ a grim site indeed - not sure what's best, the old building, or an overgrown pile of bricks. I really like the design for this, goes great with t'other glass pointy one across the road (Princess Exchange....!?!?)

Yeah Princes Exchange.

It could get built though as office news in Leeds remains positive.

Anyone heard anything more about this? We keep hearing about how Leeds needs more Grade A office space so it would be a shame if this was dropped!

This one is cropping up again with a new website and new images. It says 'starting onsite soon' which is a pretty bold claim to make at this time. I suspect 'soon' is used in quite a broad sense...
http://www.citysquarehouse.co.uk/

http://www.citysquarehouse.co.uk/images/cs4.jpghttp://www.citysquarehouse.co.uk/images/cs2.jpghttp://www.citysquarehouse.co.uk/images/cs3.jpg
http://www.citysquarehouse.co.uk/images/cs1.jpg

This one is cropping up again with a new website and new images. It says 'starting onsite soon' which is a pretty bold claim to make at this time. I suspect 'soon' is used in quite a broad sense...
http://www.citysquarehouse.co.uk/

http://www.citysquarehouse.co.uk/images/cs4.jpghttp://www.citysquarehouse.co.uk/images/cs2.jpghttp://www.citysquarehouse.co.uk/images/cs3.jpg
http://www.citysquarehouse.co.uk/images/cs1.jpg

Nice renders although I'm sure they will be just nice renders for rather a long time unfortunately especially as I'd imagine it would take a while for office demand to improve with the current recession (although this is a development which really should have been built during the last economic cycle considering the amount of time this has been development (10 years?).

Yeah it should have been built. However I'm still confident that it will get built eventually, even if it takes another 5 years. It couldn't be more of a prime site; it's the last remaining development site in the true financial heart of the city and right next to the station. The site will be gold at the next economic upturn if it hasn't already been developed.

Notice there has been a further design change since we last saw it, most notably to the south facade which has taken on a white Simpson look.

It feels like you're being teased when you get websites springing up showing stuff like this and the West Properties scheme, but your head's telling you they aren't going to happen any time soon.

It is a VERY prime site though, and one or two developments still going...

I was starting to think that this one had been swept under the carpet so it's nice to see that it's still being thought of! I love the renders of it so I really hope it gets built!

I don't think it is the sort of development that would be 'swept under the carpet'. We keep getting told that despite the economy, office demand remains high in Leeds and will continue to for quite a while, simply due to the lack of supply. If office space is what is needed/wanted, then there seems no better place to deliver it than on this site.

You're right, I just don't understand why this hasn't been built yet. I hate it how developers prevaricate around the privets...

http://www.citysquarehouse.co.uk/images/city-square3-large.jpg




http://www.citysquarehouse.co.uk/images/city-square4-large.jpg




http://www.citysquarehouse.co.uk/images/city-square1-large.jpg





http://www.citysquarehouse.co.uk/images/city-square2-large.jpg

What a great building! Can't wait (though could be long wait as people say).

http://www.citysquarehouse.co.uk/images/city-square1-large.jpg


Bit of a change from...

http://www.propertyweek.com/Pictures/460xAny/k/i/x/17_p11_news_City_Sq_House.jpg

It also appears to have lost a floor

I count the same number of floors. All thats changed is theyve removed the spike off the roof and they have taken the glazed curtain off one side to reveal the actual windows. I think it looks a lot better now, but hardly major alterations.

it looks identical to city house in one of the renders :dunno:

ok not identical but obviously quite similar.

I count the same number of floors too.

I meant it's lost a floor compared with the title of this thread, not the previous render, which in my opinion is much better looking than the new one

The glazed curtain looked classy and prestigious and the spike gave it a sense of pride and importance

The new version is alright, but nowt special imo

it looks identical to city house in one of the renders :dunno:

ok not identical but obviously quite similar.

Yup, it's a bit oo-er from Wellington Street. Looks like they went floor space crazy.

Yup, it's a bit oo-er from Wellington Street. Looks like they went floor space crazy.

Not following really; in what way?

apparantly the developers have gone bust i've heard of the grapevine

apparantly the developers have gone bust i've heard of the grapevine

By that do you mean the Northern Irish based McAller and Rushe (I guess they still own the City Square House site)? Do you have a source? Still it is unfortunately typicial of these current times.

Well it was certainly on an unbelievably long gestation period and it is a shame it wasn't actually developed when the economy was in better nick considering it is in such a high profile location as City Square.

Presumably their other sites including the Hindle Valves site opposite from Bridgewater Place and ASDA HQ which they bought for a long term development (which wouldn't be developed for a long time yet recession or no recession) and relatively recently announced development for a site in Bradford for a hotel and offices between the TJ Hughes department store and the former Odeon cinema (which would unneccesarily involve demolition of victorian buildings) would also be axed by going under?

By that do you mean the Northern Irish based McAller and Rushe (I guess they still own the City Square House site)? Do you have a source? Still it is unfortunately typicial of these current times.

Well it was certainly on an unbelievably long gestation period and it is a shame it wasn't actually developed when the economy was in better nick considering it is in such a high profile location as City Square.

Presumably their other sites including the Hindle Valves site opposite from Bridgewater Place and ASDA HQ which they bought for a long term development (which wouldn't be developed for a long time yet recession or no recession) and relatively recently announced development for a site in Bradford for a hotel and offices between the TJ Hughes department store and the former Odeon cinema (which would unneccesarily involve demolition of victorian buildings) would also be axed by going under?


Was just thinking that if it is indeed McAller and Rushe. Not sure whether to be that bothered given the scheme in Bradford and its repercussions. For Leeds though it's a shame as this looked nice, a really high quality design.

i have no source, i was chatting to a guy who works in princess exhchange, who seemed to know about lumiere and it being hold etc, and I said "at least city square house is getting built right next door to you". He said his understanding was the developers have gone bust and the developmet has been shelved.

McAleer & Rushe have not gone bust they ahve recently announced in the property press a partnership with Jurys Inns for 4 new UK hotels

http://www.propertyweek.com/story.asp?sectioncode=297&storycode=3131844

They are also on site with the new 5 star 'W' Hotel in Leicester square, London the progress of which is on the London board of this site.

I have a friend who is an agent in Leeds and she tells me that they are still actively marketing City Square House and will most likely bring construction forward once an occupier is found. Unfortunately the banks will not fund development at the moment without pre-lets for buildings.

Lets hope they find an occupier as this is a cool building for this central leeds site.

Thanks for the update ClaireyBear, this is such a good location and high quality scheme, hopefully it will be one of the first major office buildings to be let once the economy starts to move in the right direction.

Thanks for the update ClaireyBear, this is such a good location and high quality scheme, hopefully it will be one of the first major office buildings to be let once the economy starts to move in the right direction.

Well fingers crossed the already built/near completed offices will be let first! (Latitude, the Mint, Broadgate and Toronto Square)

I wish they'd press ahead with this, even in these times, such prime floorspace if priced right would be snapped up - there is still demand in Leeds. And it's so embarassing to have that weed-infested empty plot right there on city square...

how can we be complaining of not enough office space when there's a big office block just north of the railway line that's had 'to let' signs in since September?

Stil, good building. Just not tall enough.

There was a major lack of Grace A Office space until recently. Well, there still would be if the economy was on the up. The need hasn't been satisfied, it's just that companies aren't taking up more space at the moment. With that, and the fact that it is on the edge of town doesn't help Latitude. If City Square House was built now, I imagine it would be one of the first buildings to be taken up when the economy picks up again.

they should try and make this as tall as possible.. as big as the council will allow. would look cool to look up at while having a coffee in city square

It's already had a height increase. Lumiere will be the focal tall building in the area, not this.

Thats if Lumiere goes ahead. I agree this should be made as tall as possible.. it would create a brilliant 'corridor' if this is built taller and Lumiere further down, will provide an impressive first impression from the two bottom exits.. I think LCC are pro scrapers so would like to see it happen!

They are pro-skyscraper, but only if it fits in with the skyline plan. There are specific zones set out for skyscraper development. I'm not sure if the one that allows Lumiere extends to this site.

It won't go ahead in the current climate without a pre-let.

It won't go ahead in the current climate without a pre-let.

The current climate hopefully may not remain too bad for too much longer:


Positive signs in office market, surveys claim

OFFICE rental values in Leeds will "bottom out" in 2009 as the city positions itself for a return to growth, new research claims.

The ‘Office Trends – UK Key Cities’ report by property consultants Drivers Jonas claims that the lack of available grade A office space in Leeds city centre meant it was the only city to see rents increase last year in a survey that also covered London, Birmingham, Manchester, Edinburgh and Glasgow. Meanwhile, separate research by Sanderson Weatherall has revealed that 99,000 sq ft of office space was taken up in Leeds city centre during the first quarter of this year, a figure just below the 107,000 sq ft 2008 quarterly average.

Jonathon White, of Sanderson Weatherall's Leeds office agency department, said the take up figure was positive gievn the recession. Mr White said: “Given the general deterioration of the economy since this time last year, it is very encouraging to see take-up staying at roughly the same level.

“Unsurprisingly in the current economic climate many larger firms are putting expansion/re-location plans on hold. Those approaching lease expiry are looking to renew existing leases helping them to save money on dilapidations and moving costs, especially given the flexible approach currently being adopted by most landlords. This is backed up by the fact only one city centre transaction was over 20,000 sq ft while 14 of a total of 21 transactions involved premises of 5,000 sq ft or less. As such, demand appears robust.”

DJ's research highlighted Leeds City Council’s active requirement for 300,000 sq ft of space as a reason for optimism. Rental values are expected to fall across all six cities and with an additional 500,000 sq ft grade A space coming on stream this year Leeds could expect some short term oversupply, the group said. However, with no new starts expected on office developments in the city this year this additional capacity should be taken up relatively quickly once the market returns, according to the survey.

Despite rental growth in 2008, overall take up stood at approximately 400,000 sq ft - below the 10 year average of 550,000 sq ft - and investment transactions were 15% lower than 2007.

John Weir, partner at DJ Leeds, said: “Like everywhere else, Leeds is not immune to the current recession and demand will continue to slow this year. However, the city will not be faced with a massive oversupply which should help ensure a quicker return to values.

“Crucially, Leeds’ ascension over the past ten years has strengthened its offering to businesses which explains its popularity among existing occupiers.”

DJ's survey also said rents in Leeds are set to fall by a further 8%, while prime yields set to stabilise at 7.5%.

Sanderson Weatherall’s figures also cover out-of-town office take-up, with 104,000 sq ft over the first quarter being up on the 2008 quarterly average of 83,000 sq ft. However, this figure was bolstered by two sizeable deals of 45,000 and 15,000 sq ft respectively. Mr White said: “Whilst the overall take-up figure is quite encouraging, it must be noted that almost half of the take-up is attributable to one freehold sale.

“Further to this, the take up is still down on the long term average indicating out-of-town demand is somewhat fragile at present. There are a number of reasons why out-of-town take-up has fallen in recent years, many of which precede the current credit crunch. Business parks with poor transport infrastructure, local amenities and poor levels of on-site parking have suffered most. More recently, as some city centre landlords have lowered their quoting rents, there has also been a lowering of rental differentials between city centre and out-of-town space. As such, an increasing number of companies that would previously have looked at good quality but more economically viable out-of-town space will now consider city centre accommodation as well.”

www.thebusinessdesk.com, dated 9th April 2009

"Leeds City Council’s active requirement for 300,000 sq ft of space as a reason for optimism"

Anyone know what that's for? I thought they had a lot of existing space at the Merrion? Might be putting 2+2 and getting 5 but possible phase 2 of Merrion redevelopment = the tower block?

"Leeds City Council’s active requirement for 300,000 sq ft of space as a reason for optimism"

Anyone know what that's for? I thought they had a lot of existing space at the Merrion? Might be putting 2+2 and getting 5 but possible phase 2 of Merrion redevelopment = the tower block?

It's actually a requirement for around 100,000 sq ft. The Council is looking to relocate from up to fifteen City Centre buildings and consolidate in a new state of the art office block on the City centre rim.

Last I heard, they were looking to move to a site next to the new A63.

Refurbishment of Merrion House? You've got to be kidding. The place is beyond help!

Tenants sought for building of the future

Published Date: 07 May 2009

PROPERTY consultants are looking to kick-start construction at the largest planned speculative office building in Leeds by securing pre-let tenants. The 14-storey City Square House development is being masterminded by the Irish development company, McAleer and Rushe.

The firm bought the original City Square House from developers AWG for about £11m, in 2005. The former GRE building, which is next to Leeds railway station, was subsequently demolished and planning consent obtained for the new design.

Construction was scheduled to start in 2007 and complete in 2010 but along with many other schemes in the region, it was put on hold because of difficult market conditions.

But Knight Frank, which is letting the space, insists that the 174,000 sq ft building remains a "live project".

Guy Cooke, partner at property consultants Knight Frank in Leeds, said: "This is very much a live project, despite the property downturn. We are actively pursuing pre-let interest to kick-start the construction process and have been buoyed by reaction to date.

"This is the iconic office development that the Leeds market has been waiting for."

Stephen Surphlis, of McAleer and Rushe, added: "We are confident that the new City Square House will be a tremendous success story and become a flagship development for the city of Leeds.

"We are supremely confident of Leeds's future growth potential, not only within the region, but as a major European city."

Joint agents on the development are the Leeds office of Sanderson Weatherall. Yorkshire Post Business Section

Yorkshire Post Business Section

Well il only believe it whenever this scheme actually finally starts construction. Could Knight Frank be just hyping this development in the hope of lets perhaps and didn't claims that this development will start soon were made periodically over the past few years when it clearly didn't. :ohno: This certainly has to rank among the more frustratingly slow developing developments in the city centre.

Yes I agree, but at least they are trying to sort it out. It should be one of the most, if not the most, attractive site for anybody looking to locate in Central Leeds due to the amazing location as soon as they can afford to do so. I think that gives it quite a good chance of being taken up and developed- more so than any other proposed development in the city.

I would be surprised to see any action in the near future, but good that it is still on the marketing books.

Its chance of getting anywhere would be its prestigue design and scale, and being in probably the best location for any office development in Leeds. That may be enough to push it to the front of the prospective market's list of favourate potential office developments, but will that be enough in the current climate to see any action, we will have to wait and see.

I would be suprised if there was a more prestiguous location in the north, not just Leeds- where else can say it's on the City Loop, literally next to the city's main station AND the main square in the city?

I don't think it will get going now unless a tenant is secured, but I'm sure it will be one of the first sites to be developed when the economy improves.

In today's YEP:


Empty Leeds office space is still live

Published Date: 21 May 2009

By Debbie Leigh

The site of an office building at a major gateway to the city has lain empty for FIVE years – but its developers insist it remains a "live project." One of the city's biggest eyesores was wiped out when City Square House was demolished in 2004 but instead of being replaced by the planned £50m head office, an empty wasteland took its place.

Irish development company McAleer and Rushe bought the cleared site, on the corner of City Square and Wellington Street, from developers AWG in 2005, and construction was due to start on the new City Square House in 2007 and be completed in 2010.

But the firm spent several years redesigning the structure – the largest planned speculative office building in Leeds – and by the time it finalised its plans for the 14-storey, 175,000 sq ft block, the property market had begun its downward spiral and it was unable to get the funding to start work.

Now property consultants are looking to get the project off the ground by securing pre-let tenants. Guy Cooke, of Knight Frank in Leeds – joint agent on the scheme with Sanderson Weatherall – said: "This is very much a live project, despite the property downturn.

"We are actively pursuing pre-let interest to kick-start the construction process and have been buoyed by reaction to date.

"This is the iconic office development that the Leeds market has been waiting for.

"It is in a truly prime position, facing City Square, and will fulfil the pressing need for 'state of the art' Grade A office space in central Leeds."

Stephen Surphlis, of McAleer and Rushe, added: "We are confident that the new City Square House will be a tremendous success story and become a flagship development for the city of Leeds."

Leeds city centre has seen several developments mothballed, including the Lumiere skyscraper, also on Wellington Street.

Weren't new renders of this posted somewhere else recently or was that another project? It seemed to be in the same location judging by the render. I'm not certain, but I think it was posted by Di Livio, and no I'm not referring to those on the page before this.

what does "buoyed by the recation to date mean" - does that mean ovwerhelmed, or underwhelmed?

'buoyed' means 'lifted up' or 'floated'. In this case I suppose it means 'encouraged'.

Empty Leeds office space is still live

Published Date: 21 May 2009

By Debbie Leigh

The site of an office building at a major gateway to the city has lain empty for FIVE years – but its developers insist it remains a "live project." One of the city's biggest eyesores was wiped out when City Square House was demolished in 2004 but instead of being replaced by the planned £50m head office, an empty wasteland took its place.

How ridiculous, the old City Square House was hardly 'one of the cities biggest eyesores', it was a bland but inoffensive red brick office block the likes of which can be found in many other parts of the city centre. Welcome to Planet YEP! :ohno:

How ridiculous, the old City Square House was hardly 'one of the cities biggest eyesores', it was a bland but inoffensive red brick office block the likes of which can be found in many other parts of the city centre. Welcome to Planet YEP! :ohno:

Also being pedantic im sure that the old City Square House building was empty for several years prior to being demolished way back in 2004. Is it me or was the old City Square House very similar to the (also planned to be demolished and eventually redeveloped) NUM Building in Sheffield? Was it the same architect?

http://www.leodis.org/imagesLeodis/screen/66/2002228_20319766.jpg

http://www.google.co.uk/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&geocode=&q=NUM+Building+Sheffield&sll=53.380813,-1.47382&sspn=0,359.995193&ie=UTF8&ll=53.413625,-1.341705&spn=0,359.384766&t=h&z=11&layer=c&cbll=53.380296,-1.472454&panoid=fII848NZpgwZh9R3vJBRUQ&cbp=12,314.26,,1,-5

I would have preferred it too had not being demolished and remained in use as offices (surely there must have been some loss of income from the site not being used for anything over the intervening period although didn't City Square House have asbestos (although many other buildings do still have that and remain in use)? However could it have quite easily being another debacle similar to Bridge House at the corner of Wellington Street / Inner Ring Road of a former office becoming more and more decripit had it became disused (allthough leaving it as an empty plot is equally as much a debacle considering plans to redevelop this site have been on the drawing board for donkeys years)?

http://www.google.co.uk/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&geocode=&q=Leeds&sll=53.800651,-4.064941&sspn=13.26154,39.375&ie=UTF8&ll=53.797818,-1.559458&spn=0.001616,0.004807&t=h&z=18&layer=c&cbll=53.797487,-1.559501&panoid=bu7fzGBpmBwtK-haIfpX5A&cbp=12,86.15,,0,-4.05

That is so weird - I have no memory of that building...

Subliving.

Neither do I, the buiding doesn't look that old (mid 80s to early 90s), can't have been around long before it was demolished.

Well, I'll admit I also don't remember this building!

When was it demolished in 2004? That was when I first came to uni here, but like everyone else, no recollection of it!

Proof that this building did actually exist, aerial photo from 1999 (Windows Live Maps)

http://img268.imageshack.us/img268/5153/aerial.tif

I vaguely remember it, and it's demolition. I also remember my grandad used to express his disbelief at the demolition of such a 'new' building every time we saw it!

My first memory of it is when it was half ripped down- looking a bit like The Core did a few months ago.

I also have no memory of this building at all. I came to leeds in 1999.

It was very unobtrusive. You couldn't really notice it with all the tall buildings in city square. It wasn't an ugly building, just dated.

I have no recollection of it either but I didn't start coming into town on a regular basis until 2000 so that might account for it...

http://www.davidheyscollection.com/userimages/k-long-leeds-city-rebuild.jpg

Class B1 No 61090 on an engineers train at Leeds City on 28th July 1963 during rebuilding of the station; some of the iron station roof supports can be seen on the bogie bolster wagon. The new City House office block is under construction on the right and the old station roof is being dismantled on the left. The locomotive was built by the North British Locomotive Company in October 1946, withdrawn in September 1963 and scrapped at Darlington Works. Photo and text information by Keith Long.

Great photo, :okay: but wrong thread. It's of City House as opposed to City Square House.

D'oh

D'oh


Still a cracking pic and a great find.

I found it looking for pictures of the Marsh Lane station (I didn't find any). There's not many older construction photos knocking about. Didn't City House, WRH et al excite people when they were going up?

I'll whack it in the right thread next time it gets bumped. It'll only end up in the City Varieties thread or something if I try find it

There's not many older construction photos knocking about. Didn't City House, WRH et al excite people when they were going up?

There are a few on Leodis.


Dudley House (the original K2 building)

http://www.leodis.net/imagesLeodis/screen/45/2004426_29050845.jpg


West Riding House

http://www.leodis.net/imagesLeodis/screen/30/2004426_38183230.jpg


The old Ntawest building, city square

http://www.leodis.net/imagesLeodis/screen/64/2004426_22053164.jpg

Infrimary Street

http://www.leodis.net/imagesLeodis/screen/01/2009323_168701.jpg


Merrion House

http://www.leodis.net/imagesLeodis/screen/84/2004426_30768984.jpg


http://www.leodis.net/imagesLeodis/screen/00/2004426_69944400.jpg


Headrow Burton store

http://www.leodis.net/imagesLeodis/screen/93/200824_165993.jpg

http://http://www.image-upload.net/images/muckrguo98estw2wz426_thumb.jpg (http://www.image-upload.net/viewer.php?file=muckrguo98estw2wz426.jpg)

City Square House

I worked on this job for Costain, it was finished in 1983. I left the country in 1985 and have only recently returned (nothing to do with that job). I was supprised to hear of its demise, (it looks pretty shitty in VV's photo) as at the time it was considered a first class development and was one of the largest jobs outside of London. Does anyone know what the problems were?; I can see from the photo that the lead panels were staining the stonework, but there must have been serious problems if it was knocked.

However I'm not sure if my image has uploaded, if not prehaps someone could please tell me how to do it, thanks

http://i37.tinypic.com/vwwtbc.jpg

Your [img] tags were a bit mucked up and it wouldn't let me hotlink the picture when I tried so I saved it and uploaded it elsewhere. Nice pic

Thanks for them construction pics too, DL

Thanks Tony, the pic would have been taken 1981/82

http://http://www.image-upload.net/images/muckrguo98estw2wz426_thumb.jpg (http://www.image-upload.net/viewer.php?file=muckrguo98estw2wz426.jpg)

City Square House

I worked on this job for Costain, it was finished in 1983. I left the country in 1985 and have only recently returned (nothing to do with that job). I was supprised to hear of its demise, (it looks pretty shitty in VV's photo) as at the time it was considered a first class development and was one of the largest jobs outside of London. Does anyone know what the problems were?; I can see from the photo that the lead panels were staining the stonework, but there must have been serious problems if it was knocked.

However I'm not sure if my image has uploaded, if not prehaps someone could please tell me how to do it, thanks


Natwest were the last company to occupy it i think. Presumably it was something to do with not finding many companies willing to rent space there and there was the opportunity to knock it down and treble the floor space.

Thanks Tony, the pic would have been taken 1981/82

Good picture of the construction of City Square House Fourbytwo. Were you involved in any other Leeds developments?

Was the 1980s scheme designed to be any taller perhaps before being scaled down (say at the insistance of the council) and was there any protests against the loss of the previous buildings on that site (picture taken 25th May 1980) and it just shows the much shorter gestation from getting the new City Square House completed following the demolition of the previous buildings on that site.

http://www.leodis.org/imagesLeodis/screen/64/2008915_167264.jpg

Still I personally can't understand why the 1980s City Square House wasn't just retained imo as opposed to just being left as a big void in the ground for over 5 years and completely vacant a few years before that, considering it occupies such a prominent plot. Presumably it is a case of developers just waiting in the vain hope of the site gaining value over time as opposed to actually just developing the new City Square House. Was there any structural issues or asbestos in City Square House.

As for tenants wasn't it a mix of NatWest and AXA occupying that building as shown in my picture on the previous page from 1999?

This was the only job I worked on in Leeds, me and the project manager came up from the midlands office to do the job. The site had already been cleared when we started and I don't know if there were plans for a taller building, somehow I don't think so.

I wonder whether there were structural issues with the building. The piling was carried out by a Nominated Subcontractor; 600mm bored piles mostly friction bearing into mudstone. The design was for 66 no piles with pile caps, however when they started testing some of the piles they did not meet the test performance criteria. This caused major shit between Costain and GRE with the top bigwigs involved. The job was stopped for about 6 months. It was resoved by a redesign of the foundations putting in another 120 piles and basically turning the design into a mat foundation. They reckoned the original piles failed due to debris at the bottom of the pile, so the additional new piles had to be physically inspected by going down in a cage and signed off by everyone. Costain got paid for everything and came out of it quite well, however the piling contractor had to do the additional piles for nothing.

After that the job went smoothly. I'm not in contact with anyone to find out any more details or whether there were any lawsuits about it. If anyone has any contacts with Ove Arup they may be able to shed some light on matters.

On a sad note the project manager passed away last year, God rest him.

http://i37.tinypic.com/vwwtbc.jpg


Is that Sean Long at the top left? :nuts:

Bump.

http://www.toddarch.com/images/photos/commercial/citysquarehouse/main.jpg

The Queens looks dirty there...

The Queens hotel is a disgrace. Total dump on the outside. Never been in

It's all art deco inside- rather 1930s. Not my style but some people like it.