The Feds recent proposal to inc. immigration by 40% is a good policy or bad one

Good idea, as long as it's skilled laborers. This country's certainly not getting bigger by natural growth, that's for sure.

Good Idea: Having breakfast served to you in bed.
Bad Idea: Having tennis balls served to you in bed.

Sorry, the poll reminded me of those 'Good Idea/Bad Idea' sketches they did on Animaniacs. :)

It would be a terrible idea if most of those immigrants flooded into a few small areas of the country without federal funding to help the jurisdictions out. Toronto and Vancouver could find themselves swamped with new immigrants who will have special needs.

Depends really...if it were mostly skilled young workers and university students who will stay here after they graduate, then it could be good. If it were mostly older, unskilled workers that will feed off of our system, then it would be bad. But almost every immigrant would want to settle in the urban centres, primarily TO, Van, Mon.

I'm all for it as long as the screening process is efficient.

I agree with all of the above opinions.

Alberta neeeeeeeeds skilled labour! So many shortages... send your immigrants our way! :shocked:

Winnipeg needs skilled labour, too: so much construction happening here (which we have not seen for 20 years).

I am all for opening them there floodgates!

Good Idea: Having breakfast served to you in bed.
Bad Idea: Having tennis balls served to you in bed.

Sorry, the poll reminded me of those 'Good Idea/Bad Idea' sketches they did on Animaniacs. :)

LOL!

Good idea: Stopping to smell the roses.
Bad idea: Stopping to pick the roses.


This immigration thing is probably a good thing, but I put a 'not sure' reply.

Depends. Canada (especially the GTA) is lacking skilled labour (ie. plumbers, electricans, construction workers), and the number of Canadian born residents going into it is so small that a number of construction workers are brought in from the US on work permits. Really it's not anything new, while they were building the CN Tower, 90ish% of all iron workers in Ontario were working on it full time.

I think we should cut back on some the professionals we permit in. I think we already have enough lawyers as it is...but we can always use more teachers, as well as young newly-wed couples, they never can keep their pants on and that can only benefit the lacking population.

Immigration in Canada HAS to be increased or the country is doomed. The combination of low birth rates and the looming baby boomer mass retirement (I believe it will really pick up 2015 onward, and peak 2030?) makes it vital. We are to expect shortages in just about every profession. Skilled labour, doctors, engineers and financial services are already starting to see the strain of lack of professionals.
So we will need to increase immigration specifically to fill in those rolls. This will mean being more competitive especially since China/India--are traditional immigration countries--are more competitive in keeping there people from emmigrating.

As much as I love our immigration, we need to make sure that it is not abused.

The provinces should be allowed to determine their own skilled labour quotas and screen the applicants themselves. The feds' bureaucracy is too slow to meet the demands of the market.

BAD IDEA!!!!! for fucks sake!

charity begins at home, lets take care of those in the country before we allow others to come in.

There are some ups and downs, imo they should be spread out across the country, including some to Manitoba, Saskatchewan, and the maritimes. The screening process needs to be tightened though, as we live in dangerous times.

BAD IDEA!!!!! for fucks sake!

charity begins at home, lets take care of those in the country before we allow others to come in.


I think that's the whole point of immigration, to take care of those already in Canada. I do want a doctor to be available to see my when I'm old and frail. Not enough Cdn doctors are even enrolling in medical school to meet today's shortage never mind what it going to be like in 20+ years.

BAD IDEA!!!!! for fucks sake!

charity begins at home, lets take care of those in the country before we allow others to come in.

Here is an idea, why don't you come over to my house and personnally expel me.

It is not like most of the immigrants that come here work hard anyways.

the point is that foreign doctor after coming here is not going to help u as he wont get the license.Canada is doing a terrible job in integrating foreign trained professionals in workforce.so wats use in increasing whole underlass of skilled profs already struggling to survive even further without addressing the Real issues at home!

I think that's the whole point of immigration, to take care of those already in Canada. I do want a doctor to be available to see my when I'm old and frail. Not enough Cdn doctors are even enrolling in medical school to meet today's shortage never mind what it going to be like in 20+ years.


I see your point and its a good one indeed, but the fact of the matter is just that, highly trained individuals are coming into Canada and failing to find work....working in fields far removed from what they are trained in.

Don't get me wrong, its not that i'm against the idea of immigration....hec, my parents were immigrants in the 70's, but the entire process of immigration is grossly mismanaged in Canada and there is far too much preferential treatment in the screening process. Priorities have to be straigthened.

I'm not a Reformist, I know i come off as harsh, but I strongly disagree with increasing immigration, its just absurd to me

BAD IDEA!!!!! for fucks sake!

charity begins at home, lets take care of those in the country before we allow others to come in.

So where did your ancesters immigrate from? Would you have wanted them to have some asshole tell you you're not wanted... Because that's what you attitude implies.

In my mind this is certainly positive. With the populations ageing as well as the need for workers. In a large country with a small population. I am certainly a optimist. The positives must certainly outwieght the negatives!

So where did your ancesters immigrate from? Would you have wanted them to have some asshole tell you you're not wanted... Because that's what you attitude implies.

Portugal...........and you're not getting my point. I'm for immigration if its done properly, but I don't feel this is the case in Canada at the moment. I'm really disappointed that I can't express my opinion without being attacked. So what if i don't agree with the majority in this thread, is that such a problem....would this thread have even been worthwhile if everyone just agreed with the proposal?....isn't good to examine both sides of the coin?

geez, i'm not trying to be an ass here, but if you didn't want my opinion you should have never asked in the first place.

I love it; I knew if I waited all the ill-conceived notions we know and love would be presented. There are many other countries with far more acute population troubles: Japan is full of old people, as is Italy; the birth rate in scandinavia is far lower than canada –– indeed, the more educated and better off a country is, the lower the birth rate. This first reason for more immigration is almost the anti-malthus argument; More people for more's sake is a bad idea. Nobody immigrates to canada to work on a farm or in a small town; virtually all immigrants are headed for the three biggest cities. canada is a rich country, but we can't help everyone. Many of you seem to think canada is turning away doctors and nurses by the thousands because of our immigration policies. Idealism I love, but most immigrants aren't university graduate professionals. Everyone's heard the horror stories about foreign doctors driving cabs, etc. I would rather have 100 good doctors driving cabs than one bad doctor practising.


BAD IDEA!!!!! for fucks sake!

charity begins at home, lets take care of those in the country before we allow others to come in. So where did your ancesters immigrate from? Would you have wanted them to have some asshole tell you you're not wanted... Because that's what you attitude implies.Some Garrett Hardin (http://www.garretthardinsociety.org/articles/art_living_on_a_lifeboat.html) for you.
Hardin identifies this in the article you won't read. No surprise, this argument leads to infinite regress, ie. all white people should get out of N.A., etc. We have every right to keep new immigrants out. It's like something John Cage once said, which has become a major theme of Massive Change –– "Begin Anywhere"


I loved this one:
The screening process needs to be tightened though, as we live in dangerous times. Did you even think as you were writing that tripe? How could you possibly believe that?

great idea, look at USA, US was built by immigrants, Canada is massive country it can absorb large immigrant population, as long there is job creation to cope with immigration rates, also priorities should be given to skilled labour, ppl who arrive should be given as assistance to cope with language and social integration...

Canada is great country, by allowing more immigration it can only be better and more diverse...
Just look at Vancouver a shining example of diverse yet integrated city with great ppl and diversities...

Many of you seem to think canada is turning away doctors and nurses by the thousands because of our immigration policies. Idealism I love, but most immigrants aren't university graduate professionals. Everyone's heard the horror stories about foreign doctors driving cabs, etc. I would rather have 100 good doctors driving cabs than one bad doctor practising.


From what I've heard, the federal government's been accused of favouring post-secondary grads, and are not letting in the kind of skilled labour that's needed by the provinces (e.g. construction workers, carpenters). Also, there's been too much family immigration lately, and that undermines the goals for allowing immigration in the first place. Usually these individuals are dependent on their sponsors and lack any skill or knowledge to adopt into mainstream Canadian society. They often end up choosing to stay within their ethnic community, and become excluded from the rest of society. The fact that they don't restrict family immigration to immediate family members is quite puzzling.

Immigrants game for a new experience
Canada-Soviet series was the draw for one man; another loves hockey's speed

Jonathan Fowlie
Vancouver Sun

September 26, 2005

VANCOUVER - When Christopher Law moved from Hong Kong to elementary school in Richmond, he was surrounded by hockey.

At his new school, gym classes consisted of ball hockey games. In the hallways, his schoolmates all wore jackets from their local minor hockey teams. And when school was over, his friends always wanted to play street hockey until it was too dark to see.

Now 22, Law says he still can't get enough of the game, and loves playing in a men's league in Richmond and watching it on television with friends.

"I honestly can't put a finger on what I love about hockey but, if anything, it is the speed and skill of the game that makes it so fun to play and watch," he said in an e-mail recently. "I'm very much obsessed," he added.

Law is not alone among immigrants in his obsession with watching Canada's national sport.

In a 2003 poll by Jack Jedwab, the executive-director of the Association for Canadian Studies, 27 per cent of non-European immigrants said they liked to follow or watch professional hockey. The only other sport that came close was soccer, which 24 per cent of those immigrants watched or followed.

"I [find hockey] very exciting," said David Lo, 59, who moved to Canada from Hong Kong in the early 1970s, and who said he has noticed immigrants getting increasingly more interested in hockey.

"I used to watch soccer," he said in an interview recently, "but after hockey I think soccer is too slow a game."

Lo said he discovered hockey during the 1972 Canada-Soviet hockey series, and has been interested in the game ever since.

"We were watching it and I found it was quite interesting and exciting," he said. "I think at that time everyone was watching hockey instead of going to work," he added, explaining he was drawn to the Soviet series because of how excited people were getting at the time.

Lo, who does accounting work and is a part owner of the Empire Supermarket in Richmond, said he was drawn to the Vancouver Canucks after the Soviet series, and that he likes the games so much he's had season tickets on and off for about 25 years.

"When you go to the game you really feel it [the excitement]," he said. "You see people on the streets when we win the game."

Lo said the game has caught on so much with Canadian immigrants that some of the people who have returned to Hong Kong from Canada have purchased satellites, and get up at odd hours of the morning, just to follow their favourite NHL team.

"It's changing in Hong Kong -- a lot of people are watching hockey right now," he said. "They watch the Canadian hockey," he added.

While Lo said he loves watching the game, he said he has never played it, something that seems common among others who have come to Canada and discovered the sport.

In a question asked in a similar 2003 poll to the viewership question, Jedwab found that only one per cent of non-European immigrants play hockey.

That compares with 15 per cent who said they play soccer, and six per cent who play tennis.

Kamaljit Mann, 27, who moved to Canada from India about five-and-a-half years ago is one of those people, and says he wants to play, but has never learned.

"I never skated in India. I could have started playing here, but I never skated," he said.

Mann said he was drawn to watching hockey because his family and friends all loved the game, and because it is such a big phenomenon throughout the country.

"Hockey is a game of Canadians," he said proudly. "It's great for the country."

He added he could have taught himself to skate after arriving here, but didn't because he didn't have anyone to do it with.

"No one I know plays hockey. Most of the people I know just watch it, they don't play," he said, adding, however, that many younger kids in his community are starting to play the game.

In places such as Richmond, several younger immigrants like Law appear to have taken to the sport.

In Law's case, he said, his love for the game came from spending much of his youth in Canada, and with friends who spoke about almost nothing other than hockey.

"You grow up as a kid and your dad doesn't give you a football to play with, he gives you a hockey stick," he said.

"Canadian kids want to grow up to be Sidney Crosby, Wayne Gretzky or Mario Lemieux," he added. "For us it's in our culture, it can't be helped."

jfowlie@png.canwest.com

COMING UP

TUESDAY: Exploring the world of National Hockey League commercials.

WEDNESDAY: While putting muscle on the ice, the Canucks are also a force behind several charities.

THURSDAY: A look at local bars where hockey fans can watch their favourite sport.
© The Vancouver Sun 2005

I see your point and its a good one indeed, but the fact of the matter is just that, highly trained individuals are coming into Canada and failing to find work....working in fields far removed from what they are trained in.

Don't get me wrong, its not that i'm against the idea of immigration....hec, my parents were immigrants in the 70's, but the entire process of immigration is grossly mismanaged in Canada and there is far too much preferential treatment in the screening process. Priorities have to be straigthened.

I'm not a Reformist, I know i come off as harsh, but I strongly disagree with increasing immigration, its just absurd to me

So then the answer may lie in both our opinions. Increase immigration steadily while doing a complete overhall of the immigration system to attract the right immigrants and making sure their education/credentials are recognized when they come to Canada.

Some ideas would be to set agreements with certain countries to allow credential rules to be loosened with less upgrades than currently. Examples include Western Europe, USA, China and India. Imagine a system that would filter our the best and brightest from abroad, allow for short term free/subsidized housing, cover their education costs and English if needed. Once they have got their educational upgrades necessary for their career. They are placed in a co-op like position in their career in which the government will give subsidies to the companies that will hire them.
After an initial 1-3yr period in Canada, the immigrant is then taken off the system hopefully ready for a full career.
It may be costly to run, but the payoff will be huge. I'm pretty sure a doctor pays more in taxes than a taxi driver.

The more the merrier!

… Imagine a system that would filter [out] the best and brightest from abroad, allow for short term free/subsidized housing, cover their education costs and English if needed. Once they have got their educational upgrades necessary for their career. They are placed in a co-op like position in their career in which the government will give subsidies to the companies that will hire them.
After an initial 1-3yr period in Canada, the immigrant is then taken off the system hopefully ready for a full career.
It may be costly to run, but the payoff will be huge. I'm pretty sure a doctor pays more in taxes than a taxi driver.
It's like magic!

Doctor: serves one
take 1 part immigrant.
add english.
add education, stirring occasionally.
let sit 1-3 years.
serve cold.

The same recipe written another way:

take 1 part fresh immigrant
add money
add money
add money

There are throngs of people in canada who want to get into medical school in canada; the UBC school, to which uvic and unbc are vassals, has enough spots for less than 1/6 of the people who apply.

Another major problem with immigration in canada is our so-called "cultural mosaic" –– appropriate to reference a blanket when talking about our cultural policies.(1 (http://www.thefurtrapper.com/indian_smallpox.htm)) Even the future Governor General has derided canada's ghetto creation policies. Take Vancouver for example; an oreo of a city

Well both your concept and mine are possibilities and it depends on the immigrant being selected. That is why I mentioned filtering our (should say filter in) the best and brightest from abroad. In other words this would'nt be for every immigrant who passes into Canada but the ones who have the most and highest potential to earn a fulfilling career in Canada.