Jays + Leafs = NFL in T.O.?
Lobbying no longer Godfrey-only affair


DAVE PERKINS Toronto Star

It will pain Paul Godfrey to miss the final game of the Blue Jays' season, this coming Sunday, but only gently. He has bigger things on his plate — like scouting for an NFL franchise. As usual.

Godfrey and his personal lawyer, Dale Lastman, will be in Mexico City, taking in the San Francisco-Arizona game, the first NFL regular-season match played outside the United States. They are flying there on the private jet of Larry Tanenbaum, the CEO of Maple Leaf Sports and Entertainment.

Flying home, a source said, they will add a passenger to the travelling party, namely Phil Lind, the No. 2 man at Rogers who also plans to be at the game.

On the surface, the group — but mainly Godfrey — wishes to assure a regular-season game in Toronto, which is pretty much a given for 2006 or 2007. Dates and details have yet to be ironed out, but expect they will be. NFL commissioner Paul Tagliabue indicated as much last February.

But the purpose of this trip certainly does not end there. The presence of Tanenbaum tells you that. Lind's, too. The fact they are flying in Tanenbaum's private jet is not a big deal. The swells go everywhere on private jets these days and these three are always close, anyway.

The real purpose of this journey by the three — the president of the Blue Jays, the CEO of Maple Leaf Sports and Entertainment and Lastman, a plugged-in board member at MLSE — is to quietly continue the longshot process of securing an NFL team for Toronto. They're not going down there for the refried beans.

Phone calls on the subject went unreturned, but it doesn't take much to figure out this play. An NFL team long has been a dream of Godfrey's. He's been at it for about a quarter-century and he's as adamant as ever. Ted Rogers, who is now beginning to turn the financial corner with the Blue Jays, since purchasing the team several years ago and the SkyDome less than one year ago, has shown no interest in laying out the several hundred millions required to purchase an NFL franchise. But he owns the building and might be interested in a position or a partnership.

Sources indicate Tanenbaum now is interested both in pursuing an NFL franchise and in joining economic forces with the Rogers/Blue Jays empire on such a purchase. While Tanenbaum doesn't have that kind of money, the Ontario Teachers Pension Plan certainly does and Tanenbaum seems to have the ear of the Teachers.

Would Teachers be interested in an NFL team? Why not?

Franchise prices in the NFL are high, but values never do anything except go up. Plus, NFL teams make scads of money. Teachers, sitting on assets of something like $55 billion, toys with relatively minor properties like the Leafs and Raptors as much for entertaiment value as for profit. Why wouldn't they go a size larger with the NFL?

The SkyDome is not technically large enough for the NFL. But Rogers' purchase of the joint did two things the NFL requires: It brought under control all luxury box revenues, which the NFL insists on. It also eliminated that shabby old AstroTurf field, the one that prevented even another NFL exhibition game from being played here.

A reasonable expansion could bring the stadium up to the 60,000-seat level the NFL requires and given the way Rogers has spent money fixing up the SkyDome so far, it might be within reach — until the cry is raised for a nice, new, publicly financed stadium.

A Canadian dollar rising against the U.S. greenback also paints a less grim picture for potential Canadian buyers of an NFL team.

With expansion franchises at $600 million, note the difference between a 60-cent Canadian dollar and today's 85-cent buck.

Do the math and somebody is forking out a couple of hundred million less.

There are NFL teams available, even without considering the New Orleans Saints' owner was looking to relocate before Hurricane Katrina ripped the city apart. Not to pick a victim's bones here, but in what promises to be a weak economic market for a long time, are the Saints worth more in New Orleans or elsewhere?

Obtaining a team is all in the future and the chances have never been great. The present is about three amigos flying off to Mexico to continue a process that continues by landing one game.

never
going
to
happen

Going to happen!
Cheapest pro sport out there. Tickets are the most expensive, x 8 home games and 2 exhibition games = by far and away cheapest season tickets. Skydome is built and paid for. It will not be so hard to add seats-- easy, in fact. Arrange the movable seats as follows: 1 bank of seats into football position, the other bank of seats in baseball position. Install "'temporary' seating" to get to 65,000.00 (may have to overlap some existing sets, but do need to fill in 'blank spots. Easy.)

Expand the NFL into Mexico and Toronto- an international expansion. Easy. PAves way for - with new planes coming on line - expansion of North American pro sports into Europe. (Baseball into Asia? Tokyo is 12 hours away from Toronto, 8 or so away from LA/ Vancouver)

It will happen. The corporate base is here. And the combined might of the Leafs, Rogers and the Ontario Teachers Pension Plan is nothing to sneeze at.

The bills are two hours away. If you really want to see a game, you know where to go.

We have the argos. Yeah, yeah, it's the CFL but I like it.

You can have both.

The CFL is small potatoes. Go NFL! Its a better sport anyway. 3 downs my ass.
I too believe this WILL happen...not for a long time tho.

Id love to see it happen, but if they renovate the skydome for it, make it a FOOTBALL STADIUM ONLY!

I hate multi sport stadiums like Oakland and Miami, they look ugly as hell.

Build a new baseball stadium with fewer seats, thatd be nice :)

Naw...the NFL would never let this happen with the Bills just 2 years away.

Toronto can handle a NFL team with our population and sports fans, but I think the attendence would depend on how well the team does, the Argos average about 20,000 a game/

^^ Toronto does have a passion for football, that passion seems to only be for NFL, University, and Highschool.

The mayor was asked about this on one occasion, he responded saying, "If they want to build us a stadium? sure, why not."

I also would question attendance - just based upon it not being hockey, based upon the Jays and the fairweather raptors fans.

But, even with say worst case senario of 35-40K attendance, the team will still make money (after the novalty wears off). I say: If someone wants to put down the $600MM to buy a franchise, go for it. If it takes 10 years to bring a team here, doug flutie will be at the ripe age of 52, and could be a backup/mentor to a young up and comer.

How about calling all of the condos from Cityplace that look over the feild of the Skydome private box seats? That would get the number of seats over 60,000.

If Toronto had 0 people coming out to an NFL game, the owners would still make money. If you don't understand why that is, you don't understand the NFL.

if you download an archive of Prime Time Sports today (09/29/2005) for the 5:30 segment, McCowen makes it very clear why it will never come here.

^^that might be an exxageration but he makes a point

^i was referring to lucky's comment.

McCowan always said it would cost too much.

I watched primetime sports today and they focussed quite a bit on the possibility. He definitely didn't rule it out, but he did raise the question about why the NFL would even consider coming here and what the complications with the national TV deal would bring. CBS, FOX and ESPN would not want to show games where one of the markets is not in the United States. The case they did make for Mexico City was that if they get a team, then the millions of Hispanics that live in the states would provide a huge boost to the NFL ratings because they will feel represented in the league.

The biggest advantage that Toronto has is that the NFL does want to go international, but it wants to first grow throughout North America before venturing overseas. Expanding overseas would mean you would have to bring in at least 4 teams for competitive balance due to the wear of travelling. I think Mexico City will be the first place to get an international team, but truely believe Toronto is next in line (or may get their team at the same time).

They could remodle the hotel rooms that look over the playing field at Skydome into corporate suites, or remove them all together and add more seating

Plus, re-arrange the current, movable seats (1 bank set in baseball position, other in football) and add temporary seating for NFL football. Easy.

It will happen. Why not a Mexico City and Toronto expansion? Two countries, one round of expansion. I think the NFL might leap at it.

I hope to see the NFL here in Toronto sooner than later...

having an NFL team in Toronto will not kill the Argos or the CFL.

It will more likely compliment all the football fans in the GTA who end up flocking to Buffalo, Detroit, Pittsburg, Philly.

Hardcore Football fans know that having a big name NFL franchise here will help grow the sport in Toronto.... more gambling!!!! LOL

If Toronto had 0 people coming out to an NFL game, the owners would still make money. If you don't understand why that is, you don't understand the NFL.

Which actually makes me laugh. Shared TV revenues allow teams to get this revenue source while blacking out games if attendance/ticket sales are low.

FOOTBALL
MLSE expresses interest in an NFL franchise
Board of directors throws its support behind fact-finding mission to Mexico

By MICHAEL GRANGE

Friday, September 30, 2005 Page S3

A National Football League fact-finding mission to Mexico this weekend by some of Toronto's most powerful sports executives, including Maple Leaf Sports and Entertainment chairman Larry Tanenbaum, has the support of the MLSE board of directors, company president Richard Peddie says.

The executives will attend Sunday's game between the Arizona Cardinals and San Francisco 49ers in Mexico City, the first regular-season NFL game to be played outside the United States.

Not only was the trip discussed by the board yesterday, Peddie said, but the possibility of an NFL team coming to Toronto has been talked about by the board regularly in recent years.

"Larry sure has made the board aware of the NFL opportunities, both hosting a game and the possibility of a franchise," Peddie said.

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"The board is interested in knowing more. It's a fact-gathering effort right now. We all know the NFL is an outstanding league, but we know the cost of entry is a steep one.

"Something like this fits in our core competency -- running teams and owning buildings is what we do -- but it's more than we've ever paid for anything."

When the Houston Texans joined the league in 1999, owner Bob McNair paid a $715-million (all figures U.S.) expansion fee and spent more than $300-million on a stadium.

A number of obstacles stand in the way of an NFL team coming to Toronto any time soon. But Peddie made it clear that MLSE is interested.

"It's the elephant in the room," Peddie said.

Tanenbaum will be joined aboard his private jet by Paul Godfrey, the president of the Toronto Blue Jays, and by Dale Lastman, an MLSE board member and co-chairman of Goodmans LLP, one of Toronto's leading law firms. Lastman is an expert in corporate mergers and acquisitions. Godfrey has long lobbied the NFL on Toronto's behalf.

Hitching a ride on the return flight will be Phil Lind, the vice-chairman of Rogers Communications, which owns the Blue Jays.

It remains to be seen what such a concentration of heavy hitters means for the short and long-term future of the Toronto sports marketplace.

However, given the financial commitment that an NFL team would require, pooling resources would be a necessity.

The possibility of a regular-season game coming to Toronto is out there, but could there be more?

"Well, my interest in an NFL team in Toronto is well known, I've never abandoned it," Godfrey said yesterday.

"But an NFL team coming because of this trip is a bit of a stretch. I've been invited, as have others, to see the first regular-season NFL game played outside the U.S.

"If there's an opportunity for a game to be played outside the U.S. in the future, I would make a bid on behalf of the Rogers Centre.

"Anything more than that would be speculating."

Still, nothing can happen in Toronto until the NFL has filled the largest gap on its roster -- a franchise in Los Angeles, the second largest media market in the United States but without an NFL team since 1995.

The good news for Toronto is that the league is getting close to solving its Los Angeles problem.

League owners are expected to meet in October to choose among three potential sites for a franchise in Los Angeles and the expectation is that football will be played there again by 2010 at the latest, according to NFL spokesman Brian McCarthy.

The question is whether the Los Angeles entry would happen through the relocation of an existing team or through expansion.

If the NFL goes the expansion route, bringing the total number of teams to 33, the hope would be that the league would expand again to bring the number of franchises to 34.

If the league relocates an existing team, the hope would be that the league would then expand twice -- once to backfill the market that lost a club and a second time to bring the total number of franchises to 34.

Whether the Rogers Centre would be appropriate as even an interim home might be a long shot. Even with a renovation, it would be a struggle to get more than 60,000 seats into the building, Godfrey has said, and that's well short of the NFL standard.

"The average attendance over the last couple of years has been 66,000 and the smallest stadium we have right now is Soldier Field [home of the Chicago Bears], which is 62,000, but the majority are in the 70,000 range," said McCarthy, who added that the league prefers single-use stadiums.

Another hurdle would be persuading the other NFL owners that a franchise in Toronto would add value. Because the NFL pools most of its revenue, it is much more discerning about whom it allows into its club. Simply being able to come up with a franchise fee and sell season tickets is not enough.

"The other NFL owners would want to know what kind of new dollars a new team would bring to the pot," said David Carter, a sports marketing expert who has consulted on bringing NFL team back to Los Angeles. "They aren't interested in simply shifting dollars around."
...

* © Copyright 2005 Bell Globemedia Publishing Inc. All Rights Reserved.

why don't they just merge the two leagues.....the NFL has a great revenue sharing policy in place so the owner of the CFL franchises will love to jump on that bandwagon....Traditionalists will hate me for saying this but i think this is a good idea....People don't want to see the Toronto argos vs the BC lions...PEOPLE want to see the ARGOs vs. (insert NFL team here). NFL is kinda of a bitch league...CFL is has ten more yards and one less down...

HEY that just gave me a good idea....cutting down the field 10 yards will leave room for a lot more seating space...ohho!!!

I say keep the canadian franchises but make it into ONE NFL.....or joint the two league into a new name NAFA...or NAFL

^^ Having said that....CFL is almost as old as the NFL...you just can't fuck with a league that old. WHich is why it never happened already

^^It's not that easy, first of all NFL attracts much bigger crowds than in Canadian cities and plus the NFL's players are a lot more skilled and talented which would cause over 90% of the CFL's current players to be jobless in order for the Canadian teams to be able to compete.

^^It's not that easy, first of all NFL attracts much bigger crowds than in Canadian cities and plus the NFL's players are a lot more skilled and talented which would cause over 90% of the CFL's current players to be jobless in order for the Canadian teams to be able to compete.

That is a total crock of bullshit

^^Dave Dickinson, one of the best QB's in the CFL didn't even make it as a backup in the NFL. Many CFL players have tried their luck in the NFL but came back because they were cut. Some notables that did make it were Doug Flutie and Jeff Garcia.

but those players are garbage

I can't see the NFL here for a long time...and like it that way.

^y?

Oct. 2, 2005. 09:02 AM
NFL's Mexican foray more peddling than expansion
Garth Woolsey says north or south of the border — don't hold your breath for team

GARTH WOOLSEY

So what does Mexico City have that Toronto does not?

Well, it has a population of 18.1 million, for one thing. At last count, it was home to 161 museums and 344 hospitals. There are World Cups and Olympics in its sporting resume.

Plus, tonight it has the first regular season NFL game played outside the United States. Eat your heart out T.O. (and, no we're not talking Terrell Owens here).

Paul Godfrey, the former Metro chairman and current president of the Blue Jays is heading up a "fact finding" delegation at tonight's game, expected to attract up to 100,000 spectators at Azteca Stadium. He, along with Larry Tanenbaum of Maple Leaf Sports and Entertainment, among others, are flying south this morning to fly the maple leaf in hopes we might some day play host to such a game. Maybe even land our own franchise.

NFL commissioner Paul Tagliabue last winter alluded to future foreign expansion when he said: "I think it could be very likely that the next franchises in the NFL beyond 32 are outside the United States." Mexico? Canada? Japan? London, England?

"I really hate to miss the final game of the (Jays) season," Godfrey said yesterday, "but going to the game in Mexico is a matter with some really important long-term implications."

You can't win, if you don't play, right? And, when it comes to promoting Toronto as an NFL city, Godfrey is a long-time player.

Azteca has been the site of NFL exhibition games in the past and boasts the largest-ever turnout for a game of gridiron — 112,376 in 1994 (but the grand old stadium notably has few luxury boxes of the sort the NFL covets). Torontonians have shelled out big-time for pre-season games, too, but the numbers have been restricted by the Rogers Centre's seating capacity, which would have to be jacked up if the NFL were even to consider housing a team there.

The NFL has said it estimates there are 20 million NFL fans in Mexico (roughly one in five citizens) and that 250,00 play football, but those numbers are more a reflection of the league's pervasiveness via television and merchandise sales than the roots of the sport in a soccer-first culture. Playing the game, or attending games, is prohibitively expensive in a nation where the minimum wage is $4 (U.S.) a day.

What the NFL is really up to with this game is an effort to market itself to the huge financially-empowered Hispanic population in the U.S. itself, including 25 million who have connections back to Mexico. The league bought 1 million newspaper inserts in Spanish-language U.S. newspapers, for example, and this weekend is running public service announcements with English subtitles, featuring tight end Tony Gonzalez of the Chiefs and hall of famer Anthony Munoz.

Certainly, Mexico is animated today. Niners safety Tony Parrish, who has helped promote the game, told reporters: "They don't just want a game. They want a team.''

Yet, Geraldine Gonzalez of the NFL's own Mexican office said that won't be happening any time soon.

"A franchise in Mexico, it's not a priority for the short or medium term," she told Associated Press. "It's not so viable."

What Toronto has that Mexico City does not is a football tradition, existing NHL, NBA and MLB franchises, an under-control, expandable stadium, a well-heeled population and the acquisitive interests of MLSE, Rogers Communications and the Ontario Teachers Pension Plan, which might be willing and able to pony up the required billion or so U.S. dollars.

All of which amounts to nothing without an NFL motivated to expand its elephant's footprint north of the border, rather than south, or across the Atlantic or Pacific.

Talk is cheap.

Tonight, Mexico has the bullfight. We've got the bull.

Additional articles by Garth Woolsey



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^y?

Not much of a football fan, but from a national perspective, I'd hate to see the Argos and CFL disappear.

Hey remember when Baltimore had a team in the CFL???....wasn't that the shyt?

A quick dose of reality those who believe that Toronto will get an NFL team anytime soon:

1. NFL rules ban corporate ownership. They only want individuals to own teams. They do allow for joint-ownership made up of a few people however 1 person must own at least 30% of the team. That means that OMERs/Rogers/MLSE cannot be part of any bid. Also, the NFL wants the owner who has the 30% share to have other equity equal to the total team’s value. Thus one person with roughly $600M US in personally accessible assets would have to front the purchase - names anyone??

2. The NFL bans cross-ownership of professional sports teams in the same geographic area/region. They will not allow someone who owns an NBA, NHL or Baseball team to also buy an NFL team. If someone wants a team they would have to divest themselves of all other sports ownerships.

3. The league shares most revenues – tv rights, merchandise, etc. So how would putting a team in Toronto increase how much Fox/ABC/CBS/NBC/etc would be willing to give the NFL, since none of those networks can sell ad time in Canada. Empirical numbers show that when a Canadian/American team match-up is broadcast in the US, the network gets lower ratings than all American team match-up.

4. And finally, the revenue that the team owners get to keep is based on corporate suites, club seats, stadiun parking and other stadium sources. As nice as the Skydome is (and can be) the fact remains that it pales in comparison to recently built stadiums. If a team owner can make more money in a recent/new stadium elsewhere (San Antonio for instance), that owner can out bid an owner from Toronto for a team since they will have a higher cash flow from the future team.

While I enjoy the NFL, I’m also a realist. Without major structural changes to the how the league is run (which ain’t gonna happen) the NFL is not coming North.