So... are they? Does anyone have pics? What routes are they serving thusfar?

The whole fleet won't be rolling in city streets until early 2007. Delivery will start early next year. They'll serve all trolley bus routes.

http://img336.imageshack.us/img336/9030/trolley16lj.jpg
http://img336.imageshack.us/img336/2379/trolley25cp.jpg
http://img336.imageshack.us/img336/4179/trolley39ir.jpg
http://img336.imageshack.us/img336/9674/trolley47ji.jpg
http://img336.imageshack.us/img336/3315/trolley56gn.jpg
http://img336.imageshack.us/img336/7281/trolley68rx.jpg



View the full report on our trolley buses in PDF (the whole thing isn't German just to tell you so you're not turned off by it when you see German.......the left side is German, the right side is English):

http://62.153.170.122/files/dao_project_402_download__Vancouver_501.pdf









and from rt_0891, pictures of the trolleys:
The new Trolleys:

http://img339.imageshack.us/img339/9123/25402902d7f052eed4b9pe.jpg

http://img330.imageshack.us/img330/4030/25403050bf70f69518b2zf.jpg

http://img330.imageshack.us/img330/3724/25402948921f304c3bb6ab.jpg

http://img330.imageshack.us/img330/7725/25403008a206284cdab0ka.jpg

http://img330.imageshack.us/img330/7267/25403136f5ba6f39d2b1gg.jpg

http://img330.imageshack.us/img330/1236/25403098a1f495fe7bb7du.jpg

^^

Was that just a demo bus?

^ yes. a prototype.

Wow, ".affed" was banned? About time!

The new buses look pretty good. Is there any difference in the way they are connected to the wires? Because the old ones always disconnect from them. I saw two of them disconnect at the same intersection at almost the same time.

Looking very nice.

Wow, ".affed" was banned? About time!

YESS!!! Does any one know what in particluar he did that go him banned?

^It may have been what he said about everyone who lived in just outside of the City of Vancouver should be burned alive... but that was a while ago.

I suppose we should get back on topic, but Mr. X pretty much solved any questions that may arrise. The whole Western Provinces section seems a bit dead lately.

I'm glad Vancouver has renewed its trolley system. They are quieter, have better pickup and zero emissions unlike diesels.
Curious. It said Vancouver has the second largest trolley fleet in N.A., who is #1?

San Fransisco with 344 trolley buses - 60 articulated and 284 regular

Here's the Muni link and info:

http://www.sfmuni.com/cms/mms/aboutmun/trolley.htm

About Trolley Buses

Trolley buses (also known as "trolley coaches" or "trackless trolleys") are rubber-tired vehicles with motors powered by electricity from overhead wires. "Trolley" refers to the trolley poles on the roof of the bus that are used to transmit the electricity from the overhead wires. Thus, "Electric trolley bus" is a redundant term, but must be used occasionally to differentiate real trolley buses from the faux trolley cars and cable cars that are actually small buses.

The first trolley bus service in this country was in Hollywood's Laurel Canyon in 1910. Trolley buses began operating on Staten Island, New York, in October 1921, and in Philadelphia in October 1923. Philadelphia has had continuous trolley bus service since that time.

Although their operations are less flexible than that of motor buses, trolley buses are more energy efficient, much quieter, and much less polluting. Also, they operate better on hills, require less maintenance, and are longer lasting than motor buses. Modern trolley buses have an auxiliary power unit (APU), which allows the buses to travel off-wire for several blocks and avoid anything blocking their normal route, such as an excavation in the street or a street fair. The use of trolley buses is generally restricted to lines on which a high-enough frequency of service can justify the expense of the electric power system installation and vehicle costs.

San Francisco has the largest trolley-bus fleet of any transit agency in the U.S. and Canada. San Francisco's trolley buses (as well as its streetcars and the cable motors for the cable cars) are almost entirely pollution-free, since their electric power comes from the city's hydroelectric Hetch Hetchy Water & Power Project. For many people, trolley buses' quieter, cleaner service outweighs the unsightliness of the overhead wires necessary for their operation.

In addition to benefits cited in the above post,
this will be a draw to more tourists to Vancouver.

CMBC have hired recently few dozens elec technologists
to test and maintain the new trolleybusses.

I just love these sorts of things. I wish Halifax had some electric transit vehicles of its own. How much more do they (and their infrustructure) cost compared to normal buses?

The only drawback I can think of is that all the overhead wires can look a bit messy in the urban landscape. But that's just a minor quibble. :)

It's cool that this is the 2nd largest fleet in NA. Does anyone know how widespread they are throught the rest of NA and the world?

I saw one of these cruising along Broadway near Granville last week. Not sure if it was in service. Looks nice.

Yes, I believe I have seen some running.

sweet, they look nice. hopefully edmonton transit will buy some new trolley's s
sometime soon.

It used to run as 9 in the mornings around 8:05am westbount at cambie and broadway. Now it sometimes arrives at the intersection, but turns towards downtown as 17 I believe. Haven't seen it in a week though, so they may have put it on another route again.
Too bad Translink decides to ditch the oldest route in the system; 15 cambie will now be diesel even after the RAV line is built. Its a shame considering that it will cause more pollution...

Yeah, they look very nice...i saw one in Marpole-Granville last week.

Translink's order of forty 60-foot trolley buses, called the New Flyer E60LFR, will be arriving soon:
http://bbs.hangzhou.com.cn/attachment.php?aid=1611848&noupdate=yes
http://bbs.hangzhou.com.cn/attachment.php?aid=1611849&noupdate=yes
http://bbs.hangzhou.com.cn/attachment.php?aid=1611851&noupdate=yes
http://bbs.hangzhou.com.cn/attachment.php?aid=1611852&noupdate=yes
http://bbs.hangzhou.com.cn/attachment.php?aid=1611855&noupdate=yes
http://bbs.hangzhou.com.cn/attachment.php?aid=1611856&noupdate=yes
http://bbs.hangzhou.com.cn/attachment.php?aid=1611857&noupdate=yes
http://bbs.hangzhou.com.cn/attachment.php?aid=1611858&noupdate=yes
http://bbs.hangzhou.com.cn/attachment.php?aid=1611859&noupdate=yes


I'd imagine these buses would serve routes such as the Main Street route and the UBC 99 B-Line.

:redx:

haha

according to reports in all of todays papers and on the news the new busses - 39 of them - are not up and running due to power steering problems they have been pulled out of service

^^
Apparently this is software related and having to do with when the buses cross switches (and have to use battery power temporarily).
According to the Vancouver Transit group, the new E60LFR should be on the streets for testing (no passengers) in the next couple of days...number 2501

i saw one today that said not in service

it was going north on granville from i am guessing the new bus yard

it was one of the double ones - looked nice

These will probably not be used in downtown. One can only imagine this bus running as #5 Robson and turning from Granville to Robson, and Robson to Denman...

Posted by Zivan56

New pics in Vancouver of the E60LFR electric trolley. Translink ordered forty of these.

http://img217.imageshack.us/img217/9121/new2gm9.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
http://img212.imageshack.us/img212/5484/new4cw9.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
No more sitting in the middle?
http://img212.imageshack.us/img212/968/newgs0.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

http://www.imageupload.com/uploads/ddabb_6.jpg (http://www.imageupload.com)
http://img165.imageshack.us/img165/8718/new6mj9.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
http://img217.imageshack.us/img217/6756/new3zn5.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
http://img165.imageshack.us/img165/3659/new5yb0.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
http://img63.imageshack.us/img63/5176/new7xo5.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
http://img212.imageshack.us/img212/6162/new8xh6.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
http://img165.imageshack.us/img165/686/new9dx6.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
http://img165.imageshack.us/img165/4516/new10xg4.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

It'd be cool if Edmonton got those new trolleybuses to replace the older BBC ones currently in the fleet. I've ridden on one of the New Flyer trolley buses while in Vancouver over the xmas holidays, and it wasn't bad at all riding in one of those. The only issue I have is the capacity - these 40' trolleys seem not to have as many seats as those diesel-powered ones. Frankly, this is pretty strange.

Those are beautiful! The somewhat ackward proportions of the single bus melts away into a streamlined, powerful-looking bus. Wow. 40 is a good start but I'd like to see 400 of these in time. I'm truly floored at how good that looks in my eyes.

Those are beautiful! The somewhat ackward proportions of the single bus melts away into a streamlined, powerful-looking bus. Wow. 40 is a good start but I'd like to see 400 of these in time. I'm truly floored at how good that looks in my eyes.

Well, they are just like the previous generation LF diesel buses with a different face and electrified. Don't get me wrong, they look good but they didn't knock me off my feet. I would prefer more something like this:

http://www.protrolleybus.ch/zuerich/vbz/vbz,irisbus.jpg
http://web.ncf.ca/fe177/images/trolleybus.jpeg

Here is one with a colour destination sign!
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/6/60/Trolleybus_Cristalis_Limoges.JPG

http://www.vbz.ch/vbz_opencms/export/system/galleries/pics/medien/gt_inter_seite_gross.jpg

Here is a cool looking one except this trolley is an artist's impression. But 12 gas/electric hybrid versions of these do exist and are in active public use.
http://citytransport.info/NotMine/Phileasa.jpg
:)

^ those are beautiful, but are quite expensive....used mainly for rapid bus services.

IMO those are fugly, except the middle one. The rest are like buses dressed in tram drag and look too tacky.
On a side note, the source of the new trolleys power steering problems has been found. Apparantly, the power steering pump, made in Bulgaria BTW, is not pumping enough fluid to keep the power steering mechanism running when the bus is not powered (dead spots). They will install a higher capacity power steering pump to resolve the problem.

... like buses dressed in tram drag...

LOL, yes, I can see that.
The fit and finish is much better on these buses compared to ours though. Just compare the doors, theirs are flush and smooth and ours are a little recessed with exposed mechanisms. The rooftop equipment looks to be better integrated on theirs too. I know I'm splitting hairs here, but I couldn't help but notice. In the end I just want a bus to show up on time and be relatively clean inside.


On a side note, the source of the new trolleys power steering problems has been found. Apparantly, the power steering pump, made in Bulgaria BTW, is not pumping enough fluid to keep the power steering mechanism running when the bus is not powered (dead spots). They will install a higher capacity power steering pump to resolve the problem.

I hope these pumps are off the shelf. If they have to redesign them to make them higher capacity, then these buses will be off the road for a while.

LOL, yes, I can see that.
The fit and finish is much better on these buses compared to ours though. Just compare the doors, theirs are flush and smooth and ours are a little recessed with exposed mechanisms. The rooftop equipment looks to be better integrated on theirs too. I know I'm splitting hairs here, but I couldn't help but notice. In the end I just want a bus to show up on time and be relatively clean inside.

I agree about the fit and finish. New Flyer dumped the very first few trolleys with an incomplete re-design (you can tell by looking the front door, which is not the same on the first few trolleys compared to the newer deliveries of the trolley/diesel redesign). They basically used the new trolleys as a testbed for the new design for all the buses.
The rooftop stuff definitely looks like a 5 minute job, they should have found a way to contain it inside or make it less visible (they did it in the old 1980's E901 trolleys). My guess is since they haven't made trolleys for a while, and since Translink had a VERY vague contract for them to design a custom trolley, they can do whatever they want as long as the buses run.



I hope these pumps are off the shelf. If they have to redesign them to make them higher capacity, then these buses will be off the road for a while.

Unfortunately, it looks like they are not. A representative of the Bulgarian firm is coming to Vancouver to take a look at the problem. It sounds like they won't fix it for a while. Again, not New Flyers fault in terms of how long it takes, as the contract with them is very vague (and doesn't specify performance guarantees)

At least fixing the New Flyer problems won't be on Translink's dime.

I really don't like those examples of pseudo-trams, with the exception of the second-to-last one. Part of what I like about the new trolleys is that they are just normal buses but with electric motors. It reinforces that electric trolleys aren't a flashy novelty but rather a viable, legitimate transportation option. The trolleys dressed up as streetcars would be rediculed if they were rolled out in Vancouver.

I think the new buses we have look way better than those George Jetson/camper era buses above. What's the point in making a bus look like it's supposed to go fast when it isn't? Gee, all that extra effort to make it aero dynamic will really help at 40km/h. :nuts: I don't even like the light rail vehicles that look like that.

There is very much a difference in style between North American and European designs. I suppose we like what we are used to seeing. I'm originally from Germany, now living in Canada, so I like both, but I still favor the European designs. I'm surprised at the negative reaction to the first bus, I would be very proud to see those on Vancouver streets despite the "bus in tram drag" look. North American transit vehicles look and feel too utilitarian, almost reflecting the lower value we give to public transit. Taking public transit in North America is still mostly a poor man's mode of transpotation. I think sleeker, more comfortable, quieter and cleaner vehicles would attract a greater cross section of demographics.

^^ Considering Skoda's bid was way lower than New Flyers and they had been building trolleys forever, they still didn't get the contract. Had they gotten it, we would have gotten something like:
http://www.tbus.org.uk/trolleySkoda.jpg

The bidder chosen by the TransLink selection team, New Flyer Industries/Kiepe, will produce 17 fewer buses for $32 million more, and deliver them a year later than the date Neoplan/SKODA had offered.

and it would have been built in BC as well:
Stauder said early on in negotiations, the company was surprised when TransLink advised it to drop from its offer plans for an assembly plant in Vancouver.

"We know from experience that it's always good to have local content in a proposal. But they told us to take it out, they didn't tell us why and we did."
http://www.vancourier.com/issues03/111103/news/111103nn6.html

^ that looks so awesome~!

^^ Considering Skoda's bid was way lower than New Flyers and they had been building trolleys forever, they still didn't get the contract. Had they gotten it, we would have gotten something like:
http://www.tbus.org.uk/trolleySkoda.jpg



and it would have been built in BC as well:

http://www.vancourier.com/issues03/111103/news/111103nn6.html

Wow, reading that article from the courier makes me wonder what really went on behind closed doors. Looks like Translink had made up their minds before the bidding process even started. Someone must have lined somebody's pockets quite nicely!

wow........this is really retarded. The Skoda deal was so much better.


"We sent a letter saying we could lower the price even more and asking why they were negotiating with only one company, that's not good business practice. They said, 'Oh well, that's what we're doing,'" said Stauder, adding Czech Prime Minister Vladimir Spidla even sent a letter to Premier Gordon Campbell asking what happened.

What shocks me even more is that nobody even cared at the time. I remember it was on the news as a 10 second story and it quickly floated away. I like the Skoda design, as it would have been a perfect fit for Vancouver.

I'm not familiar with the deal but perhaps it was a maintenance issue? If our maintenance infrastructure was already geared towards the parts for one company, it wouldn't be cost effective to go out and buy new buses that need a different set of parts. Not only would it double the parts but it would double the knowledge needed by maintenance staff and operators.

Why does Translink use GM and other buses then? They just put in a huge order to NovaBus a couple months back, which uses completely different parts from the New Flyer buses.

Why does Translink use GM and other buses then? They just put in a huge order to NovaBus a couple months back, which uses completely different parts from the New Flyer buses.

For how many buses? Where will they operate?

http://www.protrolleybus.ch/zuerich/vbz/vbz,irisbus.jpg
)


what an ugly POS

For how many buses? Where will they operate?

126 of them. They will replace the older buses which are ending their service life (ie. ones going up Cambie, other high floor/non-accessible older buses in other places).

Why does Translink use GM and other buses then? They just put in a huge order to NovaBus a couple months back, which uses completely different parts from the New Flyer buses.

Well like I said, I'm not familiar with the whole process that has occured. I was just putting forward an idea. If what you say is true then I'm stumped.

The Skoda trolley bus bid fiasco boils my blood. More buses for less money and they would be assembled in Vancouver?? It is too bad Translink thinks buses only come from New Flyer...

The Skoda trolley bus bid fiasco boils my blood. More buses for less money and they would be assembled in Vancouver?? It is too bad Translink thinks buses only come from New Flyer...

AND the order would be here a year earlier PLUS none of this headlight nonsense.

The new trolleys are slowly being fixed. I see more and more on Broadway each day...

Video of the 60 foot trolley bus inside/outside:
M2TnJD3uLtQ
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M2TnJD3uLtQ&mode=related&search=

The Skoda trolley bus bid fiasco boils my blood. More buses for less money and they would be assembled in Vancouver?? It is too bad Translink thinks buses only come from New Flyer...
I'm not even sure if we'll get any bus by now if the bid goes to Neoplan/Skoda... Remember that Neoplan USA just went bankrupt last year?

I'm not even sure if we'll get any bus by now if the bid goes to Neoplan/Skoda... Remember that Neoplan just went bankrupt last year?

I thought we had a bid for the trolleys from Neoplan Germany, which is completely different to the bankrupt and now non-existing Neoplan USA....or was the bid from the USA firm?

I thought we had a bid for the trolleys from Neoplan Germany, which is completely different to the bankrupt and now non-existing Neoplan USA....or was the bid from the USA firm?

Quote from a 2004 news release (http://www.translink.bc.ca/About_TransLink/News_Releases/news01210401.asp):
The two consortia were New Flyer of Winnipeg with Kiepe Electrik of Germany, and Neoplan of Denver with Skoda Electric of the Czech Republic. Each presented an initial proposal and, after consultation with TransLink’s evaluation team, submitted a revised proposal in late July 2003. Both were informed that one would be chosen for contract negotiations based on their revised proposals. Here is a snapshot of the two revised proposals and how they were evaluated.

It mostly likely can't be the Germany one anyways... imagine how much it'll cost to ship the entire fleet of buses from Germany to Vancouver...

It mostly likely can't be the Germany one anyways... imagine how much it'll cost to ship the entire fleet buses from Germany to Vancouver...

The Neoplan/Skoda bid proposed to build an operating plant here in Vancouver so the buses could be built here. As well, Skoda wanted to reach into North American markets by making Vancouver their North American headquarters.

Looking at Translink's evaluation of the two bids, it does look like New Flyer was the best bid.