Tagalog Literary Works and Linguistics Thread

[Askal82]

^^ Himigang Kati?

I thinks that's where Makati comes from. Maybe the beach front used to extend to that area before.

[bitoy]

It's a lyric in a song. :D

I see...parang "rhythmic tide".

I thinks that's where Makati comes from. Maybe the beach front used to extend to that area before.

It was more of the Pasig river tide, when the natives answered when asked, what's going on with that river? "Makati na ang ilog".

Unless Miguel López de Legazpi was asking them why are they scratching their crotches. :lol:

[Askal82]

A relic from Laguna Copperplate inscription (circa 1900) (Old Tagalog)

Swasti. Shaka warṣatita 822 Waisaka masa di(ng) Jyotiṣa. Caturthi Kriṣnapaksa somawara sana tatkala Dayang Angkatan lawan dengan nya sanak barngaran si Bukah anak da dang Hwan Namwaran dibari waradana wi shuddhapattra ulih sang pamegat senapati di Tundun barja(di) dang Hwan Nayaka tuhan Pailah Jayadewa. Di krama dang Hwan Namwaran dengan dang kayastha shuddha nu diparlappas hutang da walenda Kati 1 Suwarna 8 dihadapan dang Huwan Nayaka tuhan Puliran Kasumuran. dang Hwan Nayaka tuhan Pailah barjadi ganashakti. Dang Hwan Nayaka tuhan Binwangan barjadi bishruta tathapi sadana sanak kapawaris ulih sang pamegat dewata [ba]rjadi sang pamegat Medang dari bhaktinda diparhulun sang pamegat. Ya makanya sadanya anak cucu dang Hwan Namwaran shuddha ya kapawaris dihutang da dang Hwan Namwaran di sang pamegat Dewata. Ini gerang syat syapanta ha pashkat ding ari kamudyan ada gerang urang barujara welung lappas hutang da dang hwa.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laguna_Copperplate_Inscription

Modern Translation of LCI (Standard Tagalog):

Mabuhay! Taóng Siyaka 822, buwán ng Waisaka, ayon sa aghámtalà. Ang ikaapat na araw ng pagliít ng buwán, Lunes. Sa pagkakátaóng itó, si Dayang Angkatán sampû ng kaniyáng kapatíd na nagngangalang Buka, na mga anák ng Kagalang-galang na si Namwarán, ay ginawaran ng isáng kasulatan ng lubós na kapatawarán mulâ sa Punong Pangkalahatan sa Tundún sa pagkatawán ng Punong Kagawad ng Pailáh na si Jayadewa.

Sa atas na itó, sa pamamagitan ng Tagasulat, ang Kagalang-galang na si Namwarán ay pinatawad na sa lahát at inalpasán sa kaniyáng utang at kaniyáng mga náhulíng kabayarán na 1 katî at 8 suwarna sa harapán ng Kagalang-galang na Punong Kagawad ng Puliran na si Ka Sumurán, sa kapangyarihan ng Kagalang-galang na Punong Kagawad ng Pailáh.

Dahil sa matapát na paglilingkód ni Namwarán bilang isáng sakop ng Punò, kinilala ng Kagalang-galang at batikáng Punong Kagawad ng Binwangan ang lahát ng nabubuhay pang kamag-anak ni Namwarán na inangkín ng Punò ng Dewatà, na kinatawán ng Punò ng Medáng.

Samakatwíd, ang mga nabubuhay na inapó ng Kagalang-galang na si Namwarán ay pinatawad sa anumán at lahát ng utang ng Kagalang-galang na si Namwarán sa Punò ng Dewatà. Itó, kung sakalì, ay magpapahayag kaninumán na mulâ ngayón kung may taong magsasabing hindî pa alpás sa utang ang Kagalang-galang...

http://www.mts.net/~pmorrow/lci.htm

Could someone provide me the swardspeaks version for Modern version? :lol:

[habagatcentral1]

@Aska & Bitoy, it is probably the rootword for the Tagalog translation for "tide" because the modern Filipino would always refer to the sea tides as "antas o lebel ng taas ng dagat."

Mandaluyong was also given its etymology also from the word that refers to waves.. Is "daluyong" the old Tagalog of "wave" in which "alon or ola" (which is believed to be of Spanish origin) is now frequently used by contemporary speakers?

[Askal82]

I see...parang "rhythmic tide".



It was more of the Pasig river tide, when the natives answered when asked, what's going on with that river? "Makati na ang ilog".

Unless Miguel López de Legazpi was asking them why are they scratching their crotches. :lol:

Another meaning of Kati is Army diba? Hukbong Katihan ng Pilipinas

or Itchy Forces of the Philippines? :lol:

[habagatcentral1]

A relic from Laguna Copperplate inscription (circa 1900) (Old Tagalog)

Swasti. Shaka warṣatita 822 Waisaka masa di(ng) Jyotiṣa. Caturthi Kriṣnapaksa somawara sana tatkala Dayang Angkatan lawan dengan nya sanak barngaran si Bukah anak da dang Hwan Namwaran dibari waradana wi shuddhapattra ulih sang pamegat senapati di Tundun barja(di) dang Hwan Nayaka tuhan Pailah Jayadewa. Di krama dang Hwan Namwaran dengan dang kayastha shuddha nu diparlappas hutang da walenda Kati 1 Suwarna 8 dihadapan dang Huwan Nayaka tuhan Puliran Kasumuran. dang Hwan Nayaka tuhan Pailah barjadi ganashakti. Dang Hwan Nayaka tuhan Binwangan barjadi bishruta tathapi sadana sanak kapawaris ulih sang pamegat dewata [ba]rjadi sang pamegat Medang dari bhaktinda diparhulun sang pamegat. Ya makanya sadanya anak cucu dang Hwan Namwaran shuddha ya kapawaris dihutang da dang Hwan Namwaran di sang pamegat Dewata. Ini gerang syat syapanta ha pashkat ding ari kamudyan ada gerang urang barujara welung lappas hutang da dang hwa.


Sounds like Bahasa...:D

And according to my friend, it looks somewhat Sanskritish-Javanese....Maaari kayang sakup tayo dati ng Madjapahit Empire na nagmumula sa Java/Sumatera?

[Maxxclip]

Another meaning of Kati is Army diba? Hukbong Katihan ng Pilipinas

or Itchy Forces of the Philippines? :lol:


No. Katihan dahil sa kati o lupang katihan sila nagtatanggol

Ang Katihan sa Hukbong Katihan ay tumutukoy sa Lupa

[Maxxclip]

@Aska & Bitoy, it is probably the rootword for the Tagalog translation for "tide" because the modern Filipino would always refer to the sea tides as "antas o lebel ng taas ng dagat."

Mandaluyong was also given its etymology also from the word that refers to waves.. Is "daluyong" the old Tagalog of "wave" in which "alon or ola" (which is believed to be of Spanish origin) is now frequently used by contemporary speakers?

Tama ka:okay: Mandaluyong ay hango sa salitang "Daluyong" o alon ng dagat o uri ng katubigan

[bitoy]

@Aska & Bitoy, it is probably the rootword for the Tagalog translation for "tide" because the modern Filipino would always refer to the sea tides as "antas o lebel ng taas ng dagat."

Mandaluyong was also given its etymology also from the word that refers to waves.. Is "daluyong" the old Tagalog of "wave" in which "alon or ola" (which is believed to be of Spanish origin) is now frequently used by contemporary speakers?

Yeah, Mandaluyong came from "Daluyong" or Tidal wave,, but now Mandaluyong has been a pet name because of their famous Psychopathic hospital. Both Makati and Mandaluyong was a swamp area before the Spaniards came and even parts of Manila where its name came from.

Another meaning of Kati is Army diba? Hukbong Katihan ng Pilipinas

or Itchy Forces of the Philippines? :lol:

Philippine Marines ata yun... :lol:

[Askal82]

^^ :lol:

Hukbong Sandatahan pala ang army. :lol:

[higen]

A relic from Laguna Copperplate inscription (circa 1900) (Old Tagalog)

Swasti. Shaka warṣatita 822 Waisaka masa di(ng) Jyotiṣa. Caturthi Kriṣnapaksa somawara sana tatkala Dayang Angkatan lawan dengan nya sanak barngaran si Bukah anak da dang Hwan Namwaran dibari waradana wi shuddhapattra ulih sang pamegat senapati di Tundun barja(di) dang Hwan Nayaka tuhan Pailah Jayadewa. Di krama dang Hwan Namwaran dengan dang kayastha shuddha nu diparlappas hutang da walenda Kati 1 Suwarna 8 dihadapan dang Huwan Nayaka tuhan Puliran Kasumuran. dang Hwan Nayaka tuhan Pailah barjadi ganashakti. Dang Hwan Nayaka tuhan Binwangan barjadi bishruta tathapi sadana sanak kapawaris ulih sang pamegat dewata [ba]rjadi sang pamegat Medang dari bhaktinda diparhulun sang pamegat. Ya makanya sadanya anak cucu dang Hwan Namwaran shuddha ya kapawaris dihutang da dang Hwan Namwaran di sang pamegat Dewata. Ini gerang syat syapanta ha pashkat ding ari kamudyan ada gerang urang barujara welung lappas hutang da dang hwa.



I'ver read about this...This is old Tagalog and it does sound like Malayu...In fact it is believed that the lengua franca of SEA before the Spanish and the Portugese started colonizing was Malay. Which is excatly why Bahasa Indonesia and Bahasa Malaysia is almost the same.

Notice also the Hindu/Indian influence. The dates are paterned after the ancient Indian caledar, if Im not mistakened.

[Askal82]

Sounds like Bahasa...:D

And according to my friend, it looks somewhat Sanskritish-Javanese....Maaari kayang sakup tayo dati ng Madjapahit Empire na nagmumula sa Java/Sumatera?

It's a popular theory right now since the discovery of LCI. Yeah Old Tagalog resembles more Malay than the language we know as we speak of. I think the Hispanic influence on language over 300 years made a significant contribution not only to the vocabulary but the language structure itself as well in the same token as Old English changed to Modern English due to Norman invasion. If 1066 did not happen, English would sound more like German. If Spain didn't conquer the Philippine islands, our languages with Indonesia and Malaysia might be mutually intelligible.

[higen]

^^ :lol:

Hukbong Sandatahan pala ang army. :lol:

Hukbong Sandatahan is "Armed Forces" ata mate ;) ...Ung army kasi ang tawag eh "Hukbong Katihan"..."Katihan" is old Tagalog for "Field" same as "Larangan" Kung di ako nagkakamali. Ok rin kung tinawag nilang Hukbong Larangan, pero mas astig ara sakin ung Katihan...:lol:. Sa makatuiwd, Hukbong Katihan = Field Force.

Airforce = Hukbong Hangin :lol: j/k...Hukbong Panghimpapawid or Himpapawid.
Navy = Hukbong Dagat

[Askal82]

^^ Itchy forces nga. :lol:

[higen]

Sounds like Bahasa...:D

And according to my friend, it looks somewhat Sanskritish-Javanese....Maaari kayang sakup tayo dati ng Madjapahit Empire na nagmumula sa Java/Sumatera?

It's a possibilty...ala nga lang hard evidence yet, since the Spanish erased most of our writen pre-Hispanic history. The Script that was cited is pre Islamic Philippines. Our ancestors could have been Hindus. In Bali Indonesia, a lot of locals still practice they're version of Hinduism, while the rest of Indonesia are Muslims. We could have been practicing the same religion before Islam and Christianity. But of course that's just my speculation....no fact to support it yet.:)

Some tagalog words are derived from sanskrit...like the word "Alak", which means wine was derived from the sanskrit word "Arak" which means the same...

[habagatcentral1]

^^ Kung tutuusin, di rin ito malayo sa mga teorya na inilabas ng mga nakaraang mga siyentipiko ukol sa ating kultura at ang impluwensya ng mga dayuhan sa ating pananalita, kultura at iba pa.

Di rin malayo ang posibilidad na may kontak na tayo sa mga taga-Majapahit o Sri Vijaya dahil napakalapit nito sa ating kapuluan. Maaring ito'y nagsusuwestyon na marahil naging sakup o nagbabayad ng tributo ang isang bayan sa Laguna o sa Katagalugan sa mga imperyong ito.

Pero isa pa rin itong teyorya...Mahirap talagang pag-aralan ang buhay ng ating mga ninuno bago dumating ang mga dayuhang Kastila.

[mwg12a]

it's not Nganong ngalan mo?, it's Unsay ngalan mo?

ngano = why. as in Ngano bigaon man ka kuya? :D

and unsa = what

huwag na kayong magtaka kung bakit ang mga tagalog at bisaya ay hindi magkakaintindihan.

Napagod ka?

Si kuya LMAO nalibang sa isla.

Palit ka candy?

Kadjot lang, Nalibog ko.


Kuya? wala naman na kuya o ate sa bisaya a? LOL

[habagatcentral1]

Kuya? wala naman na kuya o ate sa bisaya a? LOL
I think the Cebuano counterparts are using that now frequently...remember that language is dynamic and may change from time to time.

[Sleepwalker]

I think the Cebuano counterparts are using that now frequently...remember that language is dynamic and may change from time to time.

Since language is dynamic, i am afraid that our language will be replaced by RB-influenced lingo.

[mAiNsTrEaMhunter]

Kuya? wala naman na kuya o ate sa bisaya a? LOL

I think the Cebuano counterparts are using that now frequently...remember that language is dynamic and may change from time to time.

i guess they are not cebuanos but migrants from other islands... i am a cebuano and we rather call manoy and manang as kuya and ate respectively...:)

[icarusrising]

It's a lyric in a song. :D

Lyrics would be "ang titik ng awit/musika".

[mwg12a]

^^
yeah because here in cebu, most of our boarders here who speaks tagalog are ilonggos/hiligaynons... i have friends and boarders who are warays but then they don't speak to us in tagalog... they speak to us in cebuano combined with waray... that's why we feel offended because ilonggos are visayans and its as if they are tagalogs when speaking to a cebuano. i asked them why they like to speak tagalog and not ilonggo when i guess all cebuanos can understand ilonggo very well... there is no need to speak tagalog in the visayas because even though we might have some slight differences from the way we speak, we can comprehend very well. now i have a ilonggo friend and im comfortable with her now because she speaks to me ilonggo and cebuano.... and its very cute....:)

I guess that's one way of the illonggos to communicate to cebuanos, because they knew that you guys get tagalog TV programs in your areas, so they know you would understand them one way or another. Maybe the cebuanos can understand most illonggo's language but illonggos can't share the same opinon that they understand cebuano bisaya because of the difference in some meanings of words, manner of expressing oneself and the difference in pronounciation of certain words.

Illonggos might be in the Visayas region but then they are still illonggos and not really a bisaya. It's like the bicolanos , kapangpangan and ilocano, they are all in the same region and island which is Luzon but they are not tagalog.


Just like what Habaggat had mentioned, I don't understand the need to feel offended if an Illonggo speaks to you in tagalog especially if they are just trying to express themselves the way they think they can express what they wanted to say. I'm sure it's hard for them to speak tagalog as well. I don't think by trying to communicate with you doesn't mean, they are trying to diserespect you and trying to impose on you. I mean, I don't think you or them would commit a moral or mortal sin if you had to speak tagalog, otherwise if that's the case, speaking to you in english would be considered morally wrong because it's not the language primarily spoken by the majority in Cebu.

[mAiNsTrEaMhunter]

^^
thanks bai pero kahibaw nako sa tanan.... thanks for the added insights.:)

[mwg12a]

i have a different approach, i encourage people to speak with each other in their languages even if i am with them. but i told them that i will just ask them for translation if i can't understand, most often translations are given to me in severals ways. usually a mixture of sign language, english and tagalog. but often i'm lucky enough to understand most of it. and i told them to speak to me in their language too. but i respond to them in english/taglish.

There you go, tagalog in Manila is changing anyway, that is it more of taglish now than just tagalog itself so you would really fit right in with them. I do the same with my inlaws, I mean, not my immediate inlaw but my inlaws spouses and family. They don't seems to very comfortable in tagalog so I told them speak to me the way they speak to a fellow cebuano/a because I know somehow I would understand it. It works that way. Infact, my brother inlaw's wife asked me if I can understand her because she said she is really having hard time speaking in tagalog, so i told her, I can understand them very well contrary to their belief that I have totally no clue on whatever they were talking about. I know what they were talking about. I know at first since i was just getting to know them, when I was in Cebu, i would not react if they mentioned something that refers to me so this time, I made sure that it is perfectly alright if they want to speak to me in cebuano bisaya, i didnt really find it hard to understand it, for one thing, cebuanos mix it with english and some words are similar to tagalog so, you would pretty much get what they are trying to say. We still share the same laughter.

[mwg12a]

Since language is dynamic, i am afraid that our language will be replaced by RB-influenced lingo.

LMAOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO:lol:

Namiss ko talaga sa mga pinoy, sa gitna ng siryoso na usapan biglang may "icebreaker " magpapatawa...LOL

[kiretoce]

Since language is dynamic, i am afraid that our language will be replaced by RB-influenced lingo.

Every SSCer should be very proud if they (the powers that be) changed our national language from Filipino [Tagalog] to RB-ish....but that sounds awfully close to "rubbish." :lol:

[demented_pigeon]

^^ aba kahit sa south ng manila (Alabang) may sarili nang wika ang mga tao dun like:

"Chong, pwede pa-bum ng cig?" na ibig sabihin ay "Pare, pahingi naman ng sigarilyo."

[icarusrising]

LMAOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO:lol:

Namiss ko talaga sa mga pinoy, sa gitna ng siryoso na usapan biglang may "icebreaker " magpapatawa...LOL

Eh bakit mga Pinoy lang? Eh mga Pinay? :sly: :lol:

[Sleepwalker]

I hope, the RB community don't misunderstand my comment as bashing/discrimination...Hehehehehe

If RB lingo will be pushed through, expect that this language will be bashed by the tomboys...Hmmm, at least it's no longer regionalism thing...It's another headache for the future SSCers..:nuts:

[kyle@1008]

^^ wala namang tomoy na lingo....meron ba? may close friend ako na tomboy she talks normally

[Sleepwalker]

^^ wala namang tomoy na lingo....meron ba? may close friend ako na tomboy she talks normally

Just kidding @kyle... :)

It seems three threads are simultaneously flooded with discussions about Tagalog/Cebuano thing... :)

[mwg12a]

Eh bakit mga Pinoy lang? Eh mga Pinay? :sly: :lol:

Wow, naisan ako nitong isang ito, may katwiran din. Pero hindi ko masabing namiss ko ang mga pinay, kasama kong matulog sa kama pinay na cebuana pa na kasing puti ng labanos. Kaya nga natutonan ko ito "Bahala saging basta loving" meron ka ba niyan araw araw??LMAO

[Askal82]

Ang dagsin o grabedad (Ingles: gravity, scientific gravity[1]) ay isang likas na kababalaghang na nagiging sanhi ng pagkakabighani o paghila ng mga bagay sa bawat isa.[2]. Sa pang-araw-araw na buhay, pinakakaraniwang iniisip ang grabedad o grabitasyon bilang isang sangkap na nagbibigay ng bigat o timbang sa anumang bagay. Dahil sa grabedad, napipilitan ang mga nakakalat na mga bagay para magdikit-dikit at magsamasama, dahil gayon ito ang nagiging pinakadahilan ng pagkakaroon at pagkakabuo ng mundo, ng araw, at lahat ng mga makroskopiko o mga malalaking bagay na nakikita sa uniberso o kalahatan ng daigdig. Tinatawag ding kalubhaan, kagrabihan, o grabiti ang grabedad o grabitasyon.[1]

Nilalarawan ito ng makabagong pisika sa pamamagitan ng heneral na teoriya ng relatibidad o pangkalahatang panukala ng pagkakaugnayan. Inilalahad ng batas ng kalubhaan ng uniberso ni Newton ang isang magaling na pagtaya o aproksimasyon sa halos lahat ng pagsusuma o kalkulasyon.

Halos mapagpapalitan ang mga salitang grabedad at grabitasyon (mula sa Ingles na gravity at gravitation) sa pang-araw-araw na paggamit, subalit sa makaagham na gamit may magagawang pagkakaiba sa dalawang ito. Isang pangkalahatang katawagan ang "grabitasyon" na naglalarawan sa mga pangunahing lakas (mga pangunahing puwersa, o mga puwersang pundamental) sa larangan ng pisika na sanhi ng pagkakapanatili ng mundo at ng ibang mga planeta sa kani-kanilang mga orbit (daang paikutan) sa paligid ng araw; at sa pananatili ng buwan sa kaniyang ikutan sa paligid ng mundo, para sa pagkakaroon ng mga agos at pagtaas at pagbaba ng antas ng tubig (pagkati at paglaki ng tubig); para rin sa kumbeksyon (convection; kung saan umaangat ang mga maiinit na pluwido sa pamamagitan nito); para sa pagpapa-init ng mga panloob ng mga nabubuong mga bituin at mga planeta magpahanggang sa mga labis na pinakamataas na mga antas ng temperatura; at sa iba pang mga magkakaibang mga penomenong mapagmamasdan natin. Bilang pagsalungat, sa pangkalahatang pagkakaugnay (heneral na relatibidad) nagkakaroon ng grabitasyon dahil sa mga kurbada o pagbaluktot ng espasyo at panahon (o oras) na nagiging sanhi sa mga nasa katayuang inersya o nakatigil ngunit gumagalaw o umaandar na mga bagay para bumilis (magkaroon ng akselerasyon) patungo sa isa't isa.

Isa lamang ang dagsin sa apat na pangunahing lakas ng kalikasan (ang dalawa pang iba ay ang elektromagnetiko at ang malakas at mahinang lakas nukleyar. Ang lakas ng kadagsinan o lakas kadagsinain ay ang mismong paghihila ng dalawang bagay sa isa't isa. Mas mahina ito kung ihahambing sa tatlo pang pangunahing lakas, datapwa't mas malayo ang nasasakop nito.

Ain't this cool?

:banana::banana:

http://tl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dagsin

Tagalog can be as scientific as any other languages. For some reason, I find it more fun to reading scientific articles in Tagalog than English.

[habagatcentral1]

^^ :lol: :lol:
Naalala ko tuloy ang UPCAT ko several years ago :D

Ang matematika at agham ay nasa salitang Tagalog. Medyo di rin ako nasanay na makita ang siyentipiko o matematikal na konsepto o konteksto sa wikang ito dahil kadalasan ay napag-aralan natin at gumagamit tayo nito sa elemetarya at sekondaryang lebel ng paaralan ay wikang Ingles.

[Dante Ferry]

Isa akong taal na Tagalog na ipinanganak sa Maynila. Kung ibig ninyong matuto ng tunay at tumpak na pananalita sa wikang Tagalog (hindi Filipino/Pilipino, ha), maaari ko kayong tulungan. Pwede din naman sa Pilipino, na sa ganang-akin ay isa nang lenggwaheng chop suy (na nilahukan ng halo-halo).

[Askal82]

Re: Agham sa Tagalog

Mas marami pa siguro ang magkaroon ng panibagong interes sa agham at teknolohiya kung ang karunungang tulad nito ay isinalin sa wikang kanilang kinalakihan (hindi lang Tagalog). May appeal kasi eh, lalo na sa mga hindi talaga bihasa sa Ingles.

Nakakatuwa lang basahin :lol:

[kiretoce]

Ang dagsin o grabedad (Ingles: gravity, scientific gravity[1]) ay isang likas na kababalaghang na nagiging sanhi ng pagkakabighani o paghila ng mga bagay sa bawat isa.[2]. Sa pang-araw-araw na buhay, pinakakaraniwang iniisip ang grabedad o grabitasyon bilang isang sangkap na nagbibigay ng bigat o timbang sa anumang bagay. Dahil sa grabedad, napipilitan ang mga nakakalat na mga bagay para magdikit-dikit at magsamasama, dahil gayon ito ang nagiging pinakadahilan ng pagkakaroon at pagkakabuo ng mundo, ng araw, at lahat ng mga makroskopiko o mga malalaking bagay na nakikita sa uniberso o kalahatan ng daigdig. Tinatawag ding kalubhaan, kagrabihan, o grabiti ang grabedad o grabitasyon.[1]

Nilalarawan ito ng makabagong pisika sa pamamagitan ng heneral na teoriya ng relatibidad o pangkalahatang panukala ng pagkakaugnayan. Inilalahad ng batas ng kalubhaan ng uniberso ni Newton ang isang magaling na pagtaya o aproksimasyon sa halos lahat ng pagsusuma o kalkulasyon.

Halos mapagpapalitan ang mga salitang grabedad at grabitasyon (mula sa Ingles na gravity at gravitation) sa pang-araw-araw na paggamit, subalit sa makaagham na gamit may magagawang pagkakaiba sa dalawang ito. Isang pangkalahatang katawagan ang "grabitasyon" na naglalarawan sa mga pangunahing lakas (mga pangunahing puwersa, o mga puwersang pundamental) sa larangan ng pisika na sanhi ng pagkakapanatili ng mundo at ng ibang mga planeta sa kani-kanilang mga orbit (daang paikutan) sa paligid ng araw; at sa pananatili ng buwan sa kaniyang ikutan sa paligid ng mundo, para sa pagkakaroon ng mga agos at pagtaas at pagbaba ng antas ng tubig (pagkati at paglaki ng tubig); para rin sa kumbeksyon (convection; kung saan umaangat ang mga maiinit na pluwido sa pamamagitan nito); para sa pagpapa-init ng mga panloob ng mga nabubuong mga bituin at mga planeta magpahanggang sa mga labis na pinakamataas na mga antas ng temperatura; at sa iba pang mga magkakaibang mga penomenong mapagmamasdan natin. Bilang pagsalungat, sa pangkalahatang pagkakaugnay (heneral na relatibidad) nagkakaroon ng grabitasyon dahil sa mga kurbada o pagbaluktot ng espasyo at panahon (o oras) na nagiging sanhi sa mga nasa katayuang inersya o nakatigil ngunit gumagalaw o umaandar na mga bagay para bumilis (magkaroon ng akselerasyon) patungo sa isa't isa.

Isa lamang ang dagsin sa apat na pangunahing lakas ng kalikasan (ang dalawa pang iba ay ang elektromagnetiko at ang malakas at mahinang lakas nukleyar. Ang lakas ng kadagsinan o lakas kadagsinain ay ang mismong paghihila ng dalawang bagay sa isa't isa. Mas mahina ito kung ihahambing sa tatlo pang pangunahing lakas, datapwa't mas malayo ang nasasakop nito.


Just looking at that (not reading it) hurts my eyes! :dizzy: I guess since words in Tagalog are drawn out with numerous syllables. :nuts:

[Waldenstrom]

^^ aba kahit sa south ng manila (Alabang) may sarili nang wika ang mga tao dun like:

"Chong, pwede pa-bum ng cig?" na ibig sabihin ay "Pare, pahingi naman ng sigarilyo."
isn't this Coño? :D

[Askal82]

Just looking at that (not reading it) hurts my eyes! :dizzy: I guess since words in Tagalog are drawn out with numerous syllables. :nuts:

Yeah, I think its just the matter of getting used to reading it. Tagalog or Filipino languages for that matter have more faithful sound representation compared to English or French so you have to break up the words according to syllables. On top of that, you have to determine how it is pronounced and in some texts, they use accent marks (i.e. ', ^ and `) but basically you can pick up the words you are reading based on context.

[Animo]

Ang mga salitang syensya at teknolohiya na ginagamit sa Filipinas ay galing sa salitang español o tinatawag na hispanismo kahit na ang pinagmulan nito ay sa salitang inglés.

Pagpasok ng anglicismo sa pamamagitan ng hispanismo

Anglicismo ang tawag sa mga salitang inglés na pumapasok sa ibang wika. Dahil sa pamamayani ng wika ni Tiyo Samuel sa Filipinas mula noon hanggang sa ngayon, walang patumangga ang pagpasok ng mga anglicismo sa atin. Sa kabilang dako, minalas ang inglés dahil sadyang walang wala itong anumang pagkakatulad sa ating wika kayat hirap itong umangkop sa Filipino.

Dahil dito, ginamit nito bilang “tulay” ang mga hispanismo. Ang proseso, mula sa inglès dumaraan muna sa español at tapos ay saka nagiging Filipino.

Halimbawa:

Inglés > Español > Filipino

tank > tanque > tangkè

traffic > tràfico > trapiko

gravity > gravedad > grabedad

gravitation > gravetación > grabitasyon

physics > física > pisika

convection > convección > kumbeksyon

acceleration > aceleración > akselerasyon

Pagbuo ng mga bagong salita

Isa pang paraan ng pagpasok na ginawa ng mga anglicismo ay ang paggamit ng mga morpemang español para makabuo ng bagong salita.

Halimbawa:

basketball > basketbol = basketbol + ista > basketbolista

boxing > boksing = boksing + ero > boksingero

Iyan ang mga prosesong linggwistiko na pinagdaan ng mga hispanismo para makapasok sa ating wika. Ito rin ang aking napapansin na ang mga salitang dayuhan sa Filipinas ay halo o galing sa wikang español kaysa sa wikang inglés. Ito ata ang proseso sa wikang Filipino.

[habagatcentral1]

^^ Bigla ko tuloy naalala si Padre Jose Arcilla SJ iyong mga pagsasalaysay ukol sa pagpasok ng aspeto ng wikang Kastila sa Tagalog. :D

[diz]

Lyrics would be "ang titik ng awit/musika".

thanks!

[icarusrising]

^^ Walang anuman.

Ang mga salitang syensya at teknolohiya na ginagamit sa Filipinas ay galing sa salitang español o tinatawag na hispanismo kahit na ang pinagmulan nito ay sa salitang inglés.

Pagpasok ng anglicismo sa pamamagitan ng hispanismo

Anglicismo ang tawag sa mga salitang inglés na pumapasok sa ibang wika. Dahil sa pamamayani ng wika ni Tiyo Samuel sa Filipinas mula noon hanggang sa ngayon, walang patumangga ang pagpasok ng mga anglicismo sa atin. Sa kabilang dako, minalas ang inglés dahil sadyang walang wala itong anumang pagkakatulad sa ating wika kayat hirap itong umangkop sa Filipino.

Dahil dito, ginamit nito bilang “tulay” ang mga hispanismo. Ang proseso, mula sa inglès dumaraan muna sa español at tapos ay saka nagiging Filipino.

Halimbawa:

Inglés > Español > Filipino

tank > tanque > tangkè

traffic > tràfico > trapiko

gravity > gravedad > grabedad

gravitation > gravetación > grabitasyon

physics > física > pisika

convection > convección > kumbeksyon

acceleration > aceleración > akselerasyon

Pagbuo ng mga bagong salita

Isa pang paraan ng pagpasok na ginawa ng mga anglicismo ay ang paggamit ng mga morpemang español para makabuo ng bagong salita.

Halimbawa:

basketball > basketbol = basketbol + ista > basketbolista

boxing > boksing = boksing + ero > boksingero

Iyan ang mga prosesong linggwistiko na pinagdaan ng mga hispanismo para makapasok sa ating wika. Ito rin ang aking napapansin na ang mga salitang dayuhan sa Filipinas ay halo o galing sa wikang español kaysa sa wikang inglés. Ito ata ang proseso sa wikang Filipino.

Nabanggit ng propesor ko noon sa Filipino na karaniwang sa wikang Kastila nanghihiram kapag walang salitang katumbas sa Tagalog. Makikita ito sa mga naunang pagsasalin ng Bibliya .

Namumutiktik mga salitang Kastila sa Filipino at marami sa mga ito'y may kinalaman sa mga bagay o gawaing panrelihiyon yamang isa ito sa mga pangunahing layon ng pananakop ng mga Kastila. Ang mga naunang napalimbag na mga aklat o manuskrito at ang pagtuturo sa simbahan ay nauukol sa pagpapalaganap ng aral at pagpapatibay o pagpapanatili ng pananampalataya ng mga napangaralang katutubo.

Ilan sa mga salitang ito ay:

English - Spanish - Filipino

angel - anghel - anghel

archangel- arcanghel - arkanghel

apostle- apostol - apostol

virgin- virgen - birhen

baptism- bautismo - bawtismo

benediction/blessing - bendicion - bendisyon/basbas

Christ- Cristo - Kristo

cedar- cedro - sedro

God- Dios - Diyos

church- iglesia - iglesya/simbahan

incense- incienso - insenso

hell/inferno- infierno - impiyerno

chapel- capilla - kapilya

lamb- cordero - kordero / batang tupa

spirit- espiritu - espiritu

sermon - sermon - sermon / pangangaral / pahayag

glory- gloria - glorya / kaluwalhatian

garden- jardin - hardin / halamanan

lion - leon - leyon

saint/ holy- santo - santo / banal

scepter - cetro - setro

paradise- paraiso - paraiso

miraculous- milagroso - milagroso / mapaghimala

prayer- oracion - orasyon/panalangin

rosary- rosario - rosaryo

throne- trono - trono/ luklukan

tower- torre - tore

[Mercato]

Cebuano ako pero matatas akong mag-tagalog. Weird. Pati mga batayang panuto ng wikang Filipino (sa kalakhan at di limitado sa tagalog) ay alam ko ng kaunti. weird. That's fine to hear.... :| hmmm, but the bigger question is - so are you also equally well versed or even better with your native tongue?

[demented_pigeon]

That's fine to hear.... :| hmmm, but the bigger question is - so are you also equally well versed or even better with your native tongue?

Well my mother tongue is really tagalog since My family speaks tagalog because my father is Bikolano and my mother is from Masbate and I was born in Marikina but raised in Cebu. I can speak Cebuano like any city dweller from Cebu City can. But I have a hard time conversing in older Cebuano because I don't have relatives or friends who come from rural Cebuano-speaking areas. So to answer you question finally, yes I am well versed in my native tongue which is Filipino but I am not that good in old-tagalog or old-cebuano.

[Mercato]

^^^^ Vamos a ver, I thought you were one of the cebuanos. Ok, that's fine... We are what we choose to be... a decade ago, I also said I was Batanguenyo when I prowled around those parts & imbibed their spirit... :lol:
I agree. I'm a Cebuano but I'm comfortable with speaking tagalog. It doesn't make me less of a Cebuano. Instead, it enhances my self-perception of what it is to be Filipino by transcending regional barriers. Many poets and writers in Cebuano coincidentally are also well versed in Tagalog. Socialism is a good cause. But first things first, its Filipino proponents has got to learn & reach out to the masses in their own tongues... ;);)

[demented_pigeon]

^^^^ Vamos a ver, I thought you were one of the cebuanos. Ok, that's fine... We are what we choose to be... a decade ago, I also said I was Batanguenyo when I prowled around those parts & imbibed their spirit... :lol:
Socialism is a good cause. But first things first, its Filipino proponents has got to learn & reach out to the masses in their own tongues... ;);)

I am a Cebuano. I speak Cebuano, the Cebuano spoken in Metro Cebu. But I am Filipino.

Well Socialism has reached out to the masses using other tongues. I guess I have to clarify to you that language has never been a barrier for the progressive movement. In fact, most of the leaders in the movement are multilingual and are well versed in other Filipino languages. Based on my readings, I have come across various papers and leaflets by leftists and socialists written in Cebuano, Ilokano, Bikolano, Waray, etc. I honestly don't know how you thought that there is a problem in bridging the language barrier. there was never such a problem in fact the movement was the first to adopt a Filipino language to encompass all known Filipino languages in 1960s even before we had that principle enshrined in the 1987 constitution.

[habagatcentral1]

Question:

Why does the Christian Visayan migrants in Cotabato are ok with using Tagalog as lingua franca in business, education and transaction in Cotabato City?

[demented_pigeon]

Question:

Why does the Christian Visayan migrants in Cotabato are ok with using Tagalog as lingua franca in business, education and transaction in Cotabato City?

this is my hinala, cotabato has a large tagalog population due to the military presence and most of these people are from lower classes, they don't have the "cebuano only mentality" of the upper classes. this kind of mentality is also present among the upperclass tagalogs. which is why i believe its more of a class rather than an ethnolinguistic rivalry. labanan lang ng mga mayayaman yan pero yung mga pobreng tagalog at cebuano madali namang natututo kapag kinakailangan nilang matuto.

[habagatcentral1]

^^ Actually the ethnicity in Cotabato is so mixed...Luzon and Visayas. Plus add to the fact that not only Maguindanaoans go here since this is the economic hub of Central Mindanao but other Moro groups and also Lumad groups, plus the military presence too.

Most of them are of lower class and hasn't learned English during 1950s influx.

[demented_pigeon]

^^ Actually the ethnicity in Cotabato is so mixed...Luzon and Visayas. Plus add to the fact that not only Maguindanaoans go here since this is the economic hub of Central Mindanao but other Moro groups and also Lumad groups, plus the military presence too.

Most of them are of lower class and hasn't learned English during 1950s influx.

kaya nga mas mahirap ang usapin ng wikang Filipino among educatd english speaking elites rather than with lowerclass Filipinos. kung gusto natin ng wikang filipino, tumingala lang tayo sa mga lower classes.

It still holds true that the language should come from below the same way i believe that history should come from below.

[Mercato]

I am a Cebuano. I speak Cebuano, the Cebuano spoken in Metro Cebu. But I am Filipino.

Well Socialism has reached out to the masses using other tongues. I guess I have to clarify to you that language has never been a barrier for the progressive movement. In fact, most of the leaders in the movement are multilingual and are well versed in other Filipino languages. Based on my readings, I have come across various papers and leaflets by leftists and socialists written in Cebuano, Ilokano, Bikolano, Waray, etc. I honestly don't know how you thought that there is a problem in bridging the language barrier. there was never such a problem in fact the movement was the first to adopt a Filipino language to encompass all known Filipino languages in 1960s even before we had that principle enshrined in the 1987 constitution. That is good to note.

[Igsuonnimo]

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3143/2994028690_0cb10295f9.jpg

[Juan Pilgrim]

Filipino author wins Asian book prize
Agence France-Presse
First Posted 11:32:00 11/14/2008


HONG KONG -- A novel by Filipino author Miguel Syjuco, which touches on 150 years of often turbulent Philippines history, has won a major Asian literary prize, organizers said.

Syjuco's "Ilustrado" was awarded the second annual Man Asian Literary Prize, which is open to novels from the region not yet published in English.

"Ilustrado seems to us to possess formal ambition, linguistic inventiveness and socio-political insight in the most satisfying measure," the panel of three judges said in a statement, after awarding the $10,000 prize Thursday.

"Brilliantly conceived, and stylishly executed, it covers a large and tumultuous historical period with seemingly effortless skill. It is also ceaselessly entertaining, frequently raunchy, and effervescent with humor."

The story is a fictional account of a young Filipino investigating the life of his mentor Crispin Salvador, a real-life writer and thinker, after the man's death.

It examines the disappearance of Salvador's manuscript about the corruption behind rich Filipino families.

Syjuco beat off competition from fellow Filipino Alfred A. Yuson for "The Music Child," Indian writers Kavery Nambisan for "The Story that Must Not be Told" and Siddharth Dhanvant Shanghvi for "The Lost Flamingoes of Bombay."

Chinese writer Yu Hua was also shortlisted for "Brothers."

The panel said the shortlist of five novels had shown the "great vitality" of the novel in a region "undergoing hectic and unexpected transformations."

Last year's inaugural prize was won by Chinese author Jiang Rong for his novel "Wolf Totem," which has since been published by Penguin.

The prize is backed by the company that sponsors the prestigious Booker prize, based in Britain.

http://newsinfo.inquirer.net/topstories/topstories/view/20081114-172206/Filipino-author-wins-Asian-book-prize

[Juan Pilgrim]

http://www.manasianliteraryprize.org/2008/images/miguelsyjuco.jpghttp://www.manasianliteraryprize.org/2008/images/miguelsyjuco2.jpgMiguel Syjuco was born in Manila, Philippines in 1976. His fiction and poetry have appeared in national publications and anthologies. He co-founded and edited an online publication, Localvibe.com. He has written poetry, fiction and journalism for national and international publications. The manuscript of his debut novel, Ilustrado, has just been awarded the Grand Prize at the Palanca Awards.

Ilustrado begins with Crispin Salvador, lion of Philippine letters, dead in the Hudson River. His acolyte Miguel investigates the author's demise and the disappearance of a manuscript about the corruption behind rich Filipino families. To understand the death, Miguel scours the life, charting Salvador's trajectory via his poetry, stories, interviews, novels, polemics and memoirs. The literary fragments become patterns become stories become epic: a family saga of four generations tracing 150 years of Philippine history forged under the Spanish, Americans and Filipinos themselves. Finally, the story twists, belonging to young Miguel as much as his lost mentor.
http://www.manasianliteraryprize.org/2008/MiguelSyjuco.html
Read excerpt of Ilustrado


Contact author at:
miguel.syjuco@gmail.com

[Animo]

By Ricardo Ma. Duran Nolasco (http://opinion.inquirer.net/inquireropinion/columns/view/20081114-172308/Filipino-Pilipino-and-Tagalog)
Philippine Daily Inquirer
First Posted 22:46:00 11/14/2008

TAGALOG, PILIPINO AND FILIPINO ARE LABELS by which the national language has come to be known at different periods of our history. In the early 1900s, people of different ethnic origins were communicating with each other with an evolving Manila-based lingua franca. Commerce and trade motivated the need for this common language. The elite spoke Spanish or English.

In the 1930s the Quezon government chose Tagalog as the basis for our national language, making it in effect the national language. It was to be the symbol of our nationhood, much like the flag and the anthem. It was to be "enriched primarily through the Philippine tongues" although the law also provided for its purification. It was also to be taught in school as a subject.

In 1959, a memorandum from the Department of Education changed the name of the language (and the subject) to "Pilipino" to remove the regional bias that the term "Tagalog" evoked. This didn't work. Instead, two strains of the national language developed. The first was the school variety, which abhorred "loans" from other languages and was difficult to learn even for native Tagalogs because of the way it was taught.

The other was a liberal and vibrant lingua franca. It was predominantly oral with a Tagalog core, used by the masses and propagated by the mass media with all the local contributions, accents, and borrowings from English and Spanish. In 1987, the makers of the new constitution finally gave recognition to this idiom. They renamed it "Filipino" to signal its non-exclusivist and multilingual character. It accepted contributions from all Philippine and foreign languages and it was used as the official language and medium of instruction, together with English.

Are "Tagalog," "Pilipino" and "Filipino" different languages? No. Someone speaking in Tagalog or Pilipino can be understood by anyone claiming to speak in Filipino, and vice versa.

Some teachers equate Tagalog with "purist" usage, and Filipino with "non-purist" or liberal usage. To them pulong and guro are Tagalog words, while miting and titser are Filipino words. "Word borrowing," however, is not a reliable basis for differentiating languages. Zamboangueño (Chavacano) borrowed heavily from Spanish but evolved a completely different grammar unintelligible to Spanish speakers.

I do not agree with the "purism" of the salumpuwit and salipawpaw type. Salumpuwit is short for pangsalo ng puwit ("ass catcher") and salipawpaw came from sasakyang lumilipad sa himpapawid ("a vehicle that flies"). What I subscribe to is the use of indigenous terms like "gasang" (Cebuano for coral) and "payew" (Ifugao for rice terraces) to enrich the national language.

Many people, especially parents, complain about the "deep" Tagalog (malalim) encountered in school. But the same is also true with English, where you have a conversational variety distinct from the academic one used in literature and in science. To be successful in school, you have to learn the intellectualized language, whether it is in English, Cebuano, Ilocano or Filipino. However, when the intellectualized language diverges from the everyday language as to render it incomprehensible even to its speakers and users, the parents may have a valid point.

Why then did we change the name of our national language from Tagalog to Pilipino, then to Filipino?

From being a language confined to native Tagalogs and their provinces, Tagalog has grown into being the common language of an entire people nationwide. Based on the 2000 census, three out of 10 Filipinos are native Tagalog speakers. But nine out of 10 Filipinos now speak and understand it thanks to TV, radio, movies, comics, out-migration and the educational system.

However, most of our people speak Tagalog or Filipino as a second language. English is also a second language that most people consider more prestigious than Filipino. According to the 2008 Social Weather Stations survey, three out of four Filipinos understand and read English, three out of five said that they could write in English and close to half replied that they could speak in English.

This explains our use of "Taglish." That's when you begin a sentence in either English or Tagalog, tapos nag-switch ka sa kabilang wika in the same sentence, or when you use Tagalog grammar but English vocabulary. (I-check mo nga ang figures na ito kung nagba-balance.)

So what do we call our language, our nationality and our country? It depends on the language you're using. The official English term for our language and our nationality is "Filipino"; for our country, it is the "Philippines." In Filipino, our language is "Filipino"; our nationality, "Pilipino," and our country, "Pilipinas." Proposing the term "Filipinas" for our country and "Filipino" for our nationality—in both languages—is really not advisable because they are contrary to official and public usage.

Twenty years after the national language was renamed Filipino, people still refer to it as Tagalog, except in school where it is called Filipino. The best thing that ever happened to the national language is that our people not just talk about it. They use it.

Dr. Nolasco (rnolasco_upmin@yahoo.com) is a board member of the Linguistic Society of the Philippines, a faculty member of the UP Department of Linguistics and the Foundation for Worldwide People Power’s adviser on Mother Language Education Initiatives.

[icarusrising]

-dp-

[icarusrising]

"Tagalog is the language of the non-privileged of the majority at least in Metro Manila. Tagalog is in itself a complex site where the people's struggle for recognition within the colonized society has been inscribed, from the first decades of American rule up to the middle of the twentieth century. It has always been the "other" of English in the language of power, and influence. English is the language of government, the laws and of other institutions while Tagalog remained the language of the home and the marketplace. Tagalog has often been identified with the less powerful sectors of society who read the weekly magazines in the antebellum period, and with the komiks after WWII.

A medium that traces its roots to the American colonial period, radio made its presence felt in the cultural life of the people in English the first decades of its development from the 1929s until the beginning of the Pacific War. Its programs featured American hosts, American popular songs played the original or sung by Filipino talents, and advertised products by American firms. The news programs were in English delivered by both American and Filipino talents who spoke with the proverbial American accent.

Tagalog effectively thrust itself forward when the first local soap operas were aired in the 1950s. Although a popular form lapped up by millions of Americans as early as the 1920s, this type of program captured the imagination of millions through the works of Lina Flor, Liwayway Arceo, Genoveva Edroza Matute, Loida Virina, to name a few, and thus effectively challenged the English programs, mostly musical jamborees and news programs.

In retrospect, the renewed interest in Tagalog during the postwar years destroyed the hegemony of the popular forms in English. More magazines in Tagalog came out, Tagalog movies continued to attract legions of fans. The komiks magazines met with instant success. Television stations came out with local programs. Various radio serials (Kapitan Kidlat, Gabi ng Lagim, Mga Kuwento ni Lola Basyang, Edong Map[angarap, Ate Barbara, Prinsipe Amante) mesmerized huge audiences."

-Taken from "AM Band of Brothers"
by Soledad S. Reyes
in Plaridel: A journal of Communication, Media and Society
August 2005, Vol. 2 No. 2

[manileño]

Question:

Why does the Christian Visayan migrants in Cotabato are ok with using Tagalog as lingua franca in business, education and transaction in Cotabato City?

this is straight out of the Cotabato City government website:

History:

Ethnic position in Cotabato has always fascinated observers. Ethnologically, the Chinese predated the Spaniards in coming to this place and remained constituting a commercial middle class. There are still descendants of Arab, American and Indian immigrants who will constitute a very small sector, the biggest ethnic group is still the indigenous Iranon Muslims, reflecting 36% of the population; next in rank is the immigrant Cebuano, comprising 26%; some 15% tagalog, 11% hiligaynons; ilocanos, maranaos, and chabacanos (origin from Zamboanga) compose the remaining 12%. In terms of economic roles, the Luzon migrants, excepting the boholanos vendors, are in barbershops, cottage industry, agriculture and domestic concerns. Maguindanao Muslims form a large percentage of the fishermen, stevedores, goldsmiths and some farmers. The more economically stable have antique shops, restaurants and lodging houses; others handle makeshift stalls; quite a few own and operate inter-island vessels and small rice mills. The Chinese also monopolizes commercial establishments, although some Christian natives have entered the grocery business.

so demented is right, tagalog migrants form part of the lower class in Cotabato City. And if i may add, Cotabato has the largest concentration of Tagalog migrants in Mindanao.

[Animo]

Lyrics would be "ang titik ng awit/musika".

Icarus ngayon ko lang napansin na medyo hindi ata ito pamilyar. Ang mas ginagamit ata ay "letra sa musika o "lirico ng kanta". Para sa akin, pag-ginagamit ko ang salitang "titik" and lumalabas sa isip ko ay ang alpabetong Filipino (hal. A, B, C, Ñ, NG, atbp.) :D

[icarusrising]

Icarus ngayon ko lang napansin na medyo hindi ata ito pamilyar. Ang mas ginagamit ata ay "letra sa musika o "lirico ng kanta". Para sa akin, pag-ginagamit ko ang salitang "titik" and lumalabas sa isip ko ay ang alpabetong Filipino (hal. A, B, C, Ñ, NG, atbp.) :D

I didn't use a dictionary to translate that. I used to be a member of the choir in my childhood in Manila. I would often hear the choir leader's admonition, "Bulaybulayin ninyo ang mga titik ng bawat awit." Meditating on the letters of the hymns would not make sense. I understood she was referring to the words or lyrics. I believe the term is still in use in the choir.

An online site "titikpilipino.com" that translates lyrics seems to agree with this.

Also a blog has this information regarding the song "Naku... Kenkoy!":

"Naku... Kenkoy!
Titik: Romualdo Ramos
Musika: Nicanor Abelardo
Koro: Mary the Queen Children's Choir
Pianista: Raul Navarro"

:cheers:

[Louman]

How do you say numbers with a decimal on it like 240.24 and 2409.23?

[Igsuonnimo]

240.24 - dos syentos quarenta at beinte quatro. (q = k)
dalawang daan at apatnapu punto dalawampu't apat.


2409.23 - dos mil kwatro syientos nueve at beinte tres
dalawang libo apat na raan at siyam punto dalawampu't tatlo.

[Louman]

^^ thanks. I'm going to assume the Spanish version is said more than the native one. I'm going to try saying the native version since I'm more fluent in Tagalog numbers than Spanish ones. It should be a mouthful. heheh.

[icarusrising]

^^ Mawtpul nga. :D

Easier if the numbers were read in the Filipinized way...

"." could be "poynt". Why not? Unibersidad ng Pilipinas Diliman already has a "tsekpoynt".

24.5 would then be twentipor poynt payb. :)

[Askal82]

Or if following the native way it could be:

240.24 would be Dal'wang daang apatnapu at dalawampu't apat na bahagdan.

in english would be Two Hundred Forty and Twenty four hundreths.

Why not use ika- like 'th

tenth, hundredths, thousandths

Ika-sampu, bahagdan (like percentage), ika-sanlibo in the same way we we're taught with mathematical notation.

[Juan Pilgrim]

"False Friends"
Gemma Cruz Araneta

An article on Spanish words that have different meanings in the Philippines:

“Cubetas— 50% de descuento”— I saw that enormous sign the first time I went to Gigante, a supermarket chain with several branches in Mexico city. How unusual , I thought, for a supermarket to sell sanitary installations and at half the price. Little did I imagine that the word cubeta is a “false friend”. In Filipino it refers to a toilet but in Spanish-speaking Mexico, cubeta has an entirely different meaning. The items on sail were pails, both plastic and metal, in rainbow colors and of various sizes and prices. Over there, cubeta had retained its original meaning which to us is, timba or balde. Now, why and how did we start calling a toilet or rest room cubeta, especially in non-urban areas ? I suppose that during Spanish colonial times, many houses did not have plumbing so in each room there was a pail to collect the night soil. The Spanish colonizers must have referred to the night pail as la cubeta as a kind of euphemism, to disguise its real use. The word casillas, which also means toilet or bathroom in many Philippine provinces, must have had a similar origin. The “out house,” a small structure detached from the main residence was where one went to answer the “call of nature.” In fact, casilla is a diminutive form of casa. Happily, we now use CR which has become so generic it can mean water closet, toilet and bathroom.

Last week, I stumbled upon a former co-worker at the DOT who was pleased to report that he was about to leave for Madrid. He very graciously offered to send messages to my relatives there but since I have none, I said I would instead do him a favor and warn him about “false friends.” Aside from cubeta and casillas, I felt I had to explain to him the most vulgar of them all-- lamierda. I told him to bite his tongue whenever he would be tempted to say it for under no circumstances should he pronounce the word. In Spanish, it has absolutely nothing to do with “painting the town red” or “going along for a lark” or having good wholesome fun with friends. ****** means fecal matter, never to be uttered in polite society.

How that crude and tasteless expression got into our contemporary vocabulary, I have yet to find out. I first heard that unfortunate phrase in the 80’s while vacationing in Manila. I had never encountered it in the genteel 60s nor during the turbulent 70s, before leaving for Mexico. When I first heard lamierda in its Tagalog usage, I was too flabbergasted to correct the person who had so casually said it. I heard it again from a Leftist friend who had returned from Managua. She wondered why the Nicaraguans were so appalled when she said she “wanted to go lamierda”, in broken Spanish. Needless to say, that friend was both horrified and embarrassed when I explained why that must have been so inexplicably offensive to Spanish-speaking people. According to some showbiz friends, lamierda is gayspeak but no one could tell me exactly how it came about. Fortunately, it is being replaced by the less vulgar “ gimmick”, or “gumimik”.

By far the most persistent and durable is the hideously unrefined and indecent kesihoda, also gayspeak, with its variants, quesijoda or quesihoda. In the vernacular its intensity seems to vary from “ the hell with them !“ (or you) to “ damn you ! ”. The original, expletive is ugly “!Que se joda!” ; to f—k is the English equivalent of the Spanish verb joder.

There are other “false friends” that we should learn-- puto sigue, siempre, seguro, “cebo de macho” and mamon, to name a few — so we can use them with care and in the proper context. Native Spanish-speakers should also be told that Filipinos can get very touchy when referred to as muchachos and muchachas, even if these are harmless words. The Instituto Cervantes will publish a list of misunderstood terms and phrases, most appropriately, on Phil-Hispanic Friendship Day or Dia de la Amistad Filhispana.

[Louman]

I never heard of bahagdan before. That's what happens when your Filipino education ends at grade 2. heheh.. Here's something I found on a book called Basic Tagalog for Foreigners and Non-Tagalogs.

Fractions

One part of a whole is expressed by adding the prefix ka- (shortened form of ika-) to the denomination (the lower number in the fraction). The word bahagi (meaning part) is often added also for clarity. The term kalahati, however is a set name for one half.

kalahati (or kalahating bahagi) for 1/2
katlo (or ikatlong bahagi) for 1/3
kapat (or ikapat na bahagi) 1/4
kalima (or ikalimang bahagi) 1/5
kanim (or ika-anim na bahagi) 1/6
kapito (or ikapitong bahagi) 1/7
kawalo (or ikawalong bahagi) 1/8
kasiyam (or ikasiyam na bahagi) 1/9
kapulo (or ikasampung bahagi or ikapu) 1/10

Bigger fractions are formed by adding a multiple in front:

dalawang-katlo for 2/3
tatlong-kapat for 3/4
apat na kawalo for 4/8 (usually simplified to.. oh let's say 1/2)

---------
So, are these rules still taught? I noticed that the word for 1/10 is kapulo which sounds like an old Tagalog word for ten.

[Louman]

Say, how long is the entire story of Biag ni Lam-ang? Is it something I can read in a couple of hours? An entire weekend? Or is it much longer than I think it is?

[manileño]

24.5 would then be twentipor poynt payb. :)

:lol: dal'wampu't apat tuldok lima is how i would say it.. or better yet veinticuatro punto cinco.. :)
bahagdan i thought is only used for percentages.

anyway, i hope the Komisyon ng Wikang Filipino would reconsider the words they infuse in the Filipino language. i mean twentipor poynt payb and tsekpoynt? don't we deserve a better language than this? its horrifying to see our language get closer and closer to Papuan and Jamaican. Pidgin!

btw, is Filipino language covered by this thread? i think this "national language in the making" deserves a separate thread..

[Askal82]

I never heard of bahagdan before. That's what happens when your Filipino education ends at grade 2. heheh.. Here's something I found on a book called Basic Tagalog for Foreigners and Non-Tagalogs.

Fractions

One part of a whole is expressed by adding the prefix ka- (shortened form of ika-) to the denomination (the lower number in the fraction). The word bahagi (meaning part) is often added also for clarity. The term kalahati, however is a set name for one half.

kalahati (or kalahating bahagi) for 1/2
katlo (or ikatlong bahagi) for 1/3
kapat (or ikapat na bahagi) 1/4
kalima (or ikalimang bahagi) 1/5
kanim (or ika-anim na bahagi) 1/6
kapito (or ikapitong bahagi) 1/7
kawalo (or ikawalong bahagi) 1/8
kasiyam (or ikasiyam na bahagi) 1/9
kapulo (or ikasampung bahagi or ikapu) 1/10

Bigger fractions are formed by adding a multiple in front:

dalawang-katlo for 2/3
tatlong-kapat for 3/4
apat na kawalo for 4/8 (usually simplified to.. oh let's say 1/2)

---------
So, are these rules still taught? I noticed that the word for 1/10 is kapulo which sounds like an old Tagalog word for ten.

Bahagdan is a portmanteau for Bahagi (part) and -daan (like isang daan)

Check this out: Mathematical numbers with Tagalog equivalents:

Matemateka o Sipnayan - Mathematics

Lakas ng Sampu-an - Powers of ten

Buumbilang - integers

Bilang na Lantay - Prime numbers

Bilang na ganap - Perfect number

Butal na bilang - irrational number

Matuwirang bilang - rational number

Bilang na tukol - even number

Pabubungkagin - factorization

tambilang - digit

bilang paulat - cardinal number.

source: http://tl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talaan_ng_mga_bilang

[crappypants]

bakit walang f , c at z sa alphabet natin. pero meron namang ng

[le Reine]

^^meron. sa bagong alpabetong Filipino. 28 lahat lahat

[kiretoce]

I like the "old school" 20-letter Filipino alphabet better.

[crappypants]

^^meron. sa bagong alpabetong Filipino. 28 lahat lahat

yeah , meron pero hindi naman sila nagagamet sa mga tagalog words? meron ba na tagalog word na me f, z, x or c? ano ba tagalog ng words, salita.

[le Reine]

yeah , meron pero hindi naman sila nagagamet sa mga tagalog words? meron ba na tagalog word na me f, z, x or c? ano ba tagalog ng words, salita.hindi sila nagagamit sa old tagalog words. ginagamit lang sila para sa mga hiniram na salita. kasi may rule na rin ata ngayon sa Filipino na i-retain ang spelling ng foreign proper nouns like Xerox, Casa Filipino, etc...

[crappypants]

I see^^ kase ang bahasa meron namang silang mga letters na j , c at Spanish den.

[kiretoce]

meron ba na tagalog word na me f, z, x or c? ano ba tagalog ng words, salita.

Famayfay and Falaka
Zantol and Zentavo

:rofl:

Corny pills! :bash:

[crappypants]

Famayfay and Falaka
Zantol and Zentavo

:rofl:

Corny pills! :bash:

Vading , Badaf. :lol:

[le Reine]

^^:lol: actually parang may discussion ata lately na may mga words sa gay lingo na isasama sa Filipino language. (pasensya na at laging Taglish ang gamit ko. Ang hirap ng purong Filipino eh)

[crappypants]

^^tagalog magiging RBonics he he. :lol:

[icarusrising]

yeah , meron pero hindi naman sila nagagamet sa mga tagalog words? meron ba na tagalog word na me f, z, x or c? ano ba tagalog ng words, salita.

May mga pangngalang pantangi na ginagamit ang mga iyon...

Alejandro, Roxas, San Fernando, Concepcion, Zabarte, Punta Fuego at... Xerex. :lol:

[kiretoce]

tagalog magiging RBonics he he. :lol:

RBonics!? :hilarious That's a good one! :rofl:

So, that means that it'll be a mish-mash of English, Tagalog, Inner-city Urban Slang, and Gay Speak. :lol:

[crappypants]

Yeah ^^ or tagaylog. :lol:lenguahe ng mga me itlog. :lol:

[le Reine]

I've noticed that the articles we were required to read in college in our Pop Culture and Art Studies classes already use those. I just felt weird because the language sounds so gibberish already.

And last night, I was walking with my cousins in Biñan. We met this group of RBs in the street and they were talking in Filipino combined with a lot of gay lingo words in it. I didn't understand anything at all. :lol:

@crappy: :rofl::lol:

[kiretoce]

@Marites: :rofl: You're on a roll! I just snorted from laughing so hard! :lol:

[icarusrising]

:lol: dal'wampu't apat tuldok lima is how i would say it.. or better yet veinticuatro punto cinco.. :)
bahagdan i thought is only used for percentages.

anyway, i hope the Komisyon ng Wikang Filipino would reconsider the words they infuse in the Filipino language. i mean twentipor poynt payb and tsekpoynt? don't we deserve a better language than this? its horrifying to see our language get closer and closer to Papuan and Jamaican. Pidgin!

btw, is Filipino language covered by this thread? i think this "national language in the making" deserves a separate thread..

Yung "tsekpoynt" ay mahigit na ata dalawang dekadang eksistido sa Unibersidad. Dati ring "Pamantasan ng Pilipinas" ang karaniwang ginagamit. Marahil ay mga kalagitnaan na ng dekada 80 ng gamitin ang unibersidad. Pero masagwa para sa akin ang "unibersite". :lol:

Ginagamit na rin ang salitang "tsek" sa mga panuto sa pagsusulit- "Lagyan ng tsek ang mga kahon kung ang pangungusap ay nasa karaniwang ayos. Lagyan ng ekis kung ito ay nasa di-karaniwang ayos."

Sa Kom I ko lang nga din natutuhan ang tinatawag na "istandard na Filipino"-
kompyuter, bolpen, nowtbuk, titser, klaskard...

[kiretoce]

On offense, but Filipinizing foreign words, especially English ones, are just awkward to look at when reading them. ;)

[icarusrising]

On offense, but Filipinizing foreign words, especially English ones, are just awkward to look at when reading them. ;)

But IMO, more effective when it comes to retention and assimilation. I prefer nowtbuk over kwaderno and bolpen to pluma. I think "repleksyon sa pangangailangan ng masa" is more empathic than "salamin sa pangangailangan ng maralita". Both are acceptable and the writer or speaker can juggle depending perhaps on the tone, desired effect or audience.

[Louman]

On offense, but Filipinizing foreign words, especially English ones, are just awkward to look at when reading them. ;)

That's what's done in other languages actually. For example, if you learn how to read Japanese katakana, you'll realize how many words of English origin is written with Japanese orthography. In fact, having a knowledge of Japanese katakana will make any Japanese game easy since all of the text, while it's in Japanese, is just English words with Japanese spelling. Another example, the Malaysian word for "general" and "empire" are actually "jeneral" and "empayar" and they don't seem to have a problem with that.

So I think we should have no problem or not laugh about it if we see words like traysikel or wansapanataym. It should be part of our culture to be able to spell it that way. We should not be ashamed of it just like the Japanese and the Malaysians aren't ashamed of changing the spelling of English words to fit their pronunciation rules.

[icarusrising]

English words like- mulct (from the Spanish "multa"), fructify, gnaw (from German "gnagan"), flatulent (from Latin "flatus"), gangrene (from Latin "gangraena" and Greek "gangraina"), asinine (from Latin "asininus"), decapitate (from Latin "capita"), and aasvogel (a direct loanword from archaic Afrikaans) make me cringe too not only because of the associated meanings and sounds but because of the visuals. And yes, many are also borrowed or evolved words.

[Lurker99]

That's what's done in other languages actually. For example, if you learn how to read Japanese katakana, you'll realize how many words of English origin is written with Japanese orthography. In fact, having a knowledge of Japanese katakana will make any Japanese game easy since all of the text, while it's in Japanese, is just English words with Japanese spelling. Another example, the Malaysian word for "general" and "empire" are actually "jeneral" and "empayar" and they don't seem to have a problem with that.

So I think we should have no problem or not laugh about it if we see words like traysikel or wansapanataym. It should be part of our culture to be able to spell it that way. We should not be ashamed of it just like the Japanese and the Malaysians aren't ashamed of changing the spelling of English words to fit their pronunciation rules.

^^ i agree. language evolution is inevitable in all languages in the world. like in filipino (i'd rather not use the term tagalog to be more general), the word "kumusta" which is already accepted as "kamusta" and the phonetic rule in tagalog which requires the inclusion of a consonant and a vowel per syllable which is already fading due to loaned words such as "p[u]wede" and "organisas[i]yon"

[mwg12a]

^^^ I was wondering about that. Why do we have to say or write "Kumusta" instead of Kamusta especially when writing a letter???

[crappypants]

Bahagdan is a portmanteau for Bahagi (part) and -daan (like isang daan)

Check this out: Mathematical numbers with Tagalog equivalents:

Matemateka o Sipnayan - Mathematics

Lakas ng Sampu-an - Powers of ten

Buumbilang - integers

Bilang na Lantay - Prime numbers

Bilang na ganap - Perfect number

Butal na bilang - irrational number

Matuwirang bilang - rational number

Bilang na tukol - even number

Pabubungkagin - factorization

tambilang - digit

bilang paulat - cardinal number.

source: http://tl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talaan_ng_mga_bilang

now i know why it's easier to learn the English terms. :lol:

[kiretoce]

That's what's done in other languages actually. For example, if you learn how to read Japanese katakana, you'll realize how many words of English origin is written with Japanese orthography. In fact, having a knowledge of Japanese katakana will make any Japanese game easy since all of the text, while it's in Japanese, is just English words with Japanese spelling. Another example, the Malaysian word for "general" and "empire" are actually "jeneral" and "empayar" and they don't seem to have a problem with that.

So I think we should have no problem or not laugh about it if we see words like traysikel or wansapanataym. It should be part of our culture to be able to spell it that way. We should not be ashamed of it just like the Japanese and the Malaysians aren't ashamed of changing the spelling of English words to fit their pronunciation rules.

But lest you forget that the Philippines is also an English comprehensive nation, so Filipinizing English words are kinda redundant.

[Askal82]

now i know why it's easier to learn the English terms. :lol:

Yeah, mahaba din kung babasahin o sasabihin yung mga words na yan. Nakakapagod kasi nageexercise ka rin. Nakababawas din ng taba ang pagbasa ng purong Tagalog. :lol:

[kiretoce]

^^ That's not pure. ;) You used the word "yeah" and the taglish word "nag-e-exercise." :colgate:

[icarusrising]

Ang mga Patalinghagang Pagpapahayag o Tayutay

1. pagtutulad (simile)

hal. Ang buhay ay isang gulong.

2. pagwawangis (metaphor)

hal. Ang karunungan ay hagdan patungo sa tagumpay.

3. pagbibigay-katauhan (personification)

hal. Nakiisa ang panahon sa pakikidalamhati ng mga mamamayan.

4. Pagmamalabis (hyperbole)

hal. Natagpuan ang biktimang lumulutang sa sariling dugo.

5. pagpaplit-saklaw (synechdoche)

hal. Maglalakad tayo ngayun. Wala akong gulong na dala.

6. pagtanggi (litotes)

hal. Hindi bato ang puso niya.

7. pagpapalit-tawag (metonymy)

hal. Sa kabila ng ulap ay may liwanag.

8. paglilipat-wika (transferred epithets)

hal. Nanghihingi ng kapalit ang kawawang sapatos.

9. pagtatambis (anthesis)

hal. Sa hirap at ginhawa, lagi tayong magkasama.

10. pag-uyam (irony or sarcasm)

hal. Kahangahangang ang mga kababayan nating matapos tumira nang iilang taon sa ibang bayan ay nakalimutan na ang sariling wika.

11. pagsalungat (epigram)

hal. Itinutulak ng iyong bibig, kinakabig naman ng iyong dibdib.

12. pagtatanong (rhetorical question)

hal. Maari bang tiisin ng magulang ang kanyang anak?

13. pagbibigay-aral (pabula, parabula at alegorya)

Halimbawa ng parabula ang "Bulagsak na Anak" mula sa Mga Banal na Kasulatan.

Halimbawa ng pabula ang "Ang Unggoy at ang Pagong".

14. paglulumanay (euphemism)

hal. Isang taon matapos bawian ng buhay ang kanyang asawa, sumunod na rin si Luis sa kabilang buhay.

15. pag-uulit (alliteration)

hal. Kung ikaw'y panulat,
Panulat ng paham;
Naghasik ng buti;
Nagtaas ng dangal.

[Maxxclip]

^^naalala ko tuloy ang guro ko sa Filipino, Kultura, At Kasaysayan:D

[Askal82]

^^ That's not pure. ;) You used the word "yeah" and the taglish word "nag-e-exercise." :colgate:


Well, isn't Taglish a dialect of Tagalog? :lol:

[manileño]

bakit walang f , c at z sa alphabet natin. pero meron namang ng


yep, we do have those in our present 28-letter alphabet.. if we go back in time to the 1800s and the Tagalog alphabet used by Francisco Balagtas and other writers, we had 32. The 20-letter alphabet started by Lope K. Santos was a mockery of the great literature and civilization we had, with the blatant aim of subordinating and intimidating our language to accomodate a higher and more advanced English language with a 26 letter alphabet (thats 6 letters more superior!).. why all of the sudden Filipinos are "F impaired" after having created works like "Florante (at Laura)", El Filibusterismo and even their identity as Filipinos, and the country Filipinas that gained independence in 1898 they couldn't anymore recognize and pronounce. It's clear the Americans were trying to erase a nation and civilization that existed before they came, otherwise their aim of "educating, civilizing and christianizing these indians" in the name of colonization would have been invalid.. its funny now when you look back to the ABAKADA and see how it evolved into the 28-letters we now have, we actually have the Americans and English to thank for the letters C, F, J, Q, V, X, and Z! :D that was 3 centuries of civilization taken from us.. and now Malaysians and Indonesians pronounce our country with an F and we dont... :D

anyway, thats just me being different. hehe! :lol: as far as the language evolution being inevitable, there should be at least some guidelines in place to prevent it from becoming any more mongrelized until it disappears and transforms to Inglish Langguej layk in Papuwa Nugini. :D


Balagtas Tagalog had these c, f, and z words.:

calle, calzada, carruaje, carinderia, cine, cinturon, cementerio, cedula, cenaculo, congreso, corte suprema, compañia, carrera, caballo, cuaresma, capiz, cuarto, cuello, corbata, capitan, consejal, cabecera, culto, carcel, celda, cueva, conejo, castañas, casillas, cubeta, campana, colchon, cubrecama, cortina, caratula, and my favourite filipino word with letter c: panCit

ferrocaril, fabrica, falda, florera, fiesta, feria, flan (leche), fuente, funeraria,

zarzuela, zaguan, tapiz, terraza, pozo negro, zapateria.

[Louman]

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v198/louman84/nakupo.png

"Naku po!" kasi wala nang mga internets.

I wonder who did this translation. heheeh.

[Louman]

But lest you forget that the Philippines is also an English comprehensive nation, so Filipinizing English words are kinda redundant.

I don't think we should Filipinize every word we can get our hands on but it would be nice to see some consistency with the spelling of words. It would make reading and pronunciation easier instead of having a nation with a problem of dyslexia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dyslexia).

[kiretoce]

^^ For simplicity sake then, just leave untranslatable English words in English and not Filipinize them. :okay:

That may lead to a Taglish society, but hey, we all agree that languages evolves anyway, right? ;)

[manileño]

^ that's a good standard. it's better to retain the spelling of english loan words in Tagalog than try to twist them to make them appear indigenous, cos in the end we lose both the quality and consistency of Tagalog and our knowledge of the correct spelling in English. however this should only apply to loan words, meaning English words that have no direct translation in Tagalog, which i believe is not a lot and would mostly be techie words and other modern terms. Nag-e-exercise is not one of them, in tagalog that would be nageehersisyo :D Let's bear in mind that Tagalog and Taglish are 2 separate languages/dialects. And while nag-e-exercise or nag-gogrocery are common usage in Manila and in expatriate communities abroad, in the provinces where the real Tagalog is spoken and understood (and which should be the focus of this thread) they use nageehersisyo and namamalangengke. their use of english is very minimal and usually as a last resort. Tagalog Language belongs to them... :)

[crappypants]

wala bang ;tagalog ang server? web page? :lol: waiter, bahay ng gagambang pagina. :lol:

[Animo]

wala bang ;tagalog ang server? web page? :lol: waiter, bahay ng gagambang pagina. :lol:

Server = serbidor
Web page = pahina sa internet

Hindi naman dapat "purista" ang ating mga salitang ginagamit. Lalo na iyong mga salitang pang teknolohiya. :) Nakakaaliw ang ibang mga Filipino, dahil ang mga komun na ginagamit ng mga tao o masa ay hindi sapat para sa kanila dahil katugma ito sa wikang español. :nuts:

[Animo]

This reminded me of a post by Mr. Rivera. I agree with both of you on both accounts. :cheers:

---

FALSE TAGALOG VS. TRUE TAGALOG:

We must distinguish two kinds of Tagalog.

(1) The true Tagalog which alphabet has 32 letters read and syllabicated like in Spanish, which is the Francisco Balagtás Tagalog, true basis of the Filipino native national language which official name is "Filipino", and (2) the false Tagalog which is the colonial Worcester-Lope K. Santos-so-called Purista-Abakada-Balarila Tagalog which official name is "Pilipino".

True Tagalog, (FILIPINO) by its 32 letter Alphabet is linked with all the other native languages as well as Spanish, and through Spanish, with English and all the other major European languages.

False Tagalog (PILIPINO) BY ITS 20 letter pre-Hispanic ABAKADA (now literally discarded) and its Balarila with its coined semantics and words which even the Tagalogs themselves do not know.

Let us first find out which Tagalog this WIKA is espousing. The undersigned will go to the Kumisyon sa Filipino and interview Dr. Aldave-Yap about this matter.

If the 32 letter Alphabet is restored, all our native languages will survive with Tagalog, the true one. It is the False Tagalog, called "Pilipino" that is inimical with all the other native languages including English and Spanish. But "Pilipino" has served its unintended purpose which is the decline of the colonial-imposed English language. But then "Pilipino" is the brainchild of American colonialism in this country.

Lines have to be really drawn.

Ang buwist sa ating wika ay ang kolonyalismo ng mga Kanong WASP hanggang ñgayon.

Guillermo Gómez Rivera


yep, we do have those in our present 28-letter alphabet.. if we go back in time to the 1800s and the Tagalog alphabet used by Francisco Balagtas and other writers, we had 32. The 20-letter alphabet started by Lope K. Santos was a mockery of the great literature and civilization we had, with the blatant aim of subordinating and intimidating our language to accomodate a higher and more advanced English language with a 26 letter alphabet (thats 6 letters more superior!).. why all of the sudden Filipinos are "F impaired" after having created works like "Florante (at Laura)", El Filibusterismo and even their identity as Filipinos, and the country Filipinas that gained independence in 1898 they couldn't anymore recognize and pronounce. It's clear the Americans were trying to erase a nation and civilization that existed before they came, otherwise their aim of "educating, civilizing and christianizing these indians" in the name of colonization would have been invalid.. its funny now when you look back to the ABAKADA and see how it evolved into the 28-letters we now have, we actually have the Americans and English to thank for the letters C, F, J, Q, V, X, and Z! :D that was 3 centuries of civilization taken from us.. and now Malaysians and Indonesians pronounce our country with an F and we dont... :D

anyway, thats just me being different. hehe! :lol: as far as the language evolution being inevitable, there should be at least some guidelines in place to prevent it from becoming any more mongrelized until it disappears and transforms to Inglish Langguej layk in Papuwa Nugini. :D


Balagtas Tagalog had these c, f, and z words.:

calle, calzada, carruaje, carinderia, cine, cinturon, cementerio, cedula, cenaculo, congreso, corte suprema, compañia, carrera, caballo, cuaresma, capiz, cuarto, cuello, corbata, capitan, consejal, cabecera, culto, carcel, celda, cueva, conejo, castañas, casillas, cubeta, campana, colchon, cubrecama, cortina, caratula, and my favourite filipino word with letter c: panCit

ferrocaril, fabrica, falda, florera, fiesta, feria, flan (leche), fuente, funeraria,

zarzuela, zaguan, tapiz, terraza, pozo negro, zapateria.

[habagatcentral1]

wala bang ;tagalog ang server? web page? :lol: waiter, bahay ng gagambang pagina. :lol:

Teka...if i-purist form kaya natin to? Transliterate it?

Server = Taga-lingkod
Web Page = Sapot Pahina
World Wide Web = Pandaigdigang Sapot
Website = Lugar ng sapot
Carbon = uling

:D

This is however a purist transliteration, and not "translation."

[kyle@1008]

^^
internet- magkahalong lambat
www. -wawawatuldok
server-saguiguilid
website- saputan
youtube- ikawtubo

[habagatcentral1]

^^ :rofl:

[Askal82]

wawawatuldokikawtubotuldokcom

www.youtube.com

:lol:

[Animo]

Tagalog was used in this Juanes song. I think their were only 7 languages used. It's almost in the end of the song.

Juanes rocks! :righton:

nx0KPyUEov4

Ito ang panahon para baguhin - It's time to change

[manileño]

This reminded me of a post by Mr. Rivera. I agree with both of you on both accounts. :cheers:

---

Ang buwist sa ating wika ay ang kolonyalismo ng mga Kanong WASP hanggang ñgayon.

Guillermo Gómez Rivera[/I]


haha, ive heard about this man rivera.. the Premio Zobel winner and spanish writer. is he a forumer too?
i subscribe to his arguments on Filipino language and history, they make a whole lot of sense and are founded on well-proven facts. I don't know about these Puristas, their movement and objective is a denial of the evolution and progress the Tagalog language has undergone in the past 4 centuries. It is somewhat like denying the transfusion of French into English language under 3 centuries of Norman rule, hehe what beauté! :D


Kayá dapat manatili ang mañga salitâng nabuô sa kaníkanilang panahón, kagaya nang serbidor at internet. Ang serbidor imbés na "server" sapagka't itó'y isang concepto na nagmulá sa panahóng castila. Ang internet namán ay napakilala mulá sa ingles. Walang patutuñguhan ang wika kapag artificial ang pagsalin at hindi pag-gamit nang luma at kinaugalíang vocabulario.

Balagtas Tagalog:

Cayá dapat manatili ang mañga salitâng nabuô sa canícanilang panajón, cagaya nang servidor at internet. Ang servidor en vez na "server" sapagca't itó'y isang concepto na nagmulá sa panajóng castilla. Ang internet namán ay napaquilala mulá sa ingles. Ualang patutuñgujan ang uíca capag artificial ang pagsalin at jindi pag-gamit nang luma at quinaugaliang vocabulario.

[habagatcentral1]

Ano nga pala ang purist Tagalog term sa: "Skyscrapercity"?

[kyle@1008]

^^ lungsodnakumakalmotsalangit

[Waldenstrom]

^^ For simplicity sake then, just leave untranslatable English words in English and not Filipinize them. :okay:

That may lead to a Taglish society, but hey, we all agree that languages evolves anyway, right? ;)
i agree! and i think it's already accepted nowadays. :)

[icarusrising]

Ano nga pala ang purist Tagalog term sa: "Skyscrapercity"?

Nagtatayugang mga gusali? :dunno:

[Askal82]

My attempt to Tagalized computer terms:

Screen = tabing (from pinilakang tabing) :lol:

flatscreen = patag na tabing :lol:

Keyboards/kepads = teklado

mouse = daga

printer = palimbagan

computer = tagatuos/ordenador

operating system = sistemang pamamalakad

run a program = patakbuhin ang programa

RAM = Pansamantalang imbakan ng datos (Random Access Memory)

Read & write speed = bilis ng pagbasa at pagsulat

Hard drive = Permanenteng imbakan

Optical discs = Midyang optikal

data = datos

wireless = walang kawid

network = Lupong kabit (group of connections) :lol:

Internet = Libutang lupong kabit (lupon is another tagalog word for group)

Local area network = lupong kabit na lokal

wireless network = lupong kabit na walang kawad

e-mail = dagliham (like dagitab) :lol:

upload = ipadala

download = kuhanin

save = ipunin/ipa-tanda

file = talaksan

[Animo]

Hindi sya myembro sa foro na ito. :D Galing iyan sa ibang diskusyon. :yes:

Saludo ako sa iyong pag-gamit ng mga tilde! :banana: Paano mo nakuha ang ^ sa letrang O? Ang pwede lang sa aking ordenador ay iyong mga tecladong pang espanyol. :lol:

haha, ive heard about this man rivera.. the Premio Zobel winner and spanish writer. is he a forumer too?

i subscribe to his arguments on Filipino language and history, they make a whole lot of sense and are founded on well-proven facts. I don't know about these Puristas, their movement and objective is a denial of the evolution and progress the Tagalog language has undergone in the past 4 centuries. It is somewhat like denying the transfusion of French into English language under 3 centuries of Norman rule, hehe what beauté! :D


Kayá dapat manatili ang mañga salitâng nabuô sa kaníkanilang panahón, kagaya nang serbidor at internet. Ang serbidor imbés na "server" sapagka't itó'y isang concepto na nagmulá sa panahóng castila. Ang internet namán ay napakilala mulá sa ingles. Walang patutuñguhan ang wika kapag artificial ang pagsalin at hindi pag-gamit nang luma at kinaugalíang vocabulario.

Balagtas Tagalog:

Cayá dapat manatili ang mañga salitâng nabuô sa canícanilang panajón, cagaya nang servidor at internet. Ang servidor en vez na "server" sapagca't itó'y isang concepto na nagmulá sa panajóng castilla. Ang internet namán ay napaquilala mulá sa ingles. Ualang patutuñgujan ang uíca capag artificial ang pagsalin at jindi pag-gamit nang luma at quinaugaliang vocabulario.

[manileño]

oh you mean the pakupyâ? :lol: subukan mo ang ALT+131. :D

@Askal. mahusay ang pagsalin sa Tagalog! gawang tama! (well done!) hehe.
kaya lang, medyo mahaba yata yung iba.. mahirap imemorya hehe!

eto for me, some minor adjustments:

flatscreen = tabingpatag or tabing patag (try to avoid using "na" as much as possible)
printer = tagalimbag, limbagero or impresora? (palimbagan sounds like printing store)
computer = ordenador (tagatuos sounds like anime hehe)
operating system - sistemang operatibo (pamamalakad is mahirap to memorize hehe)
upload = ikarga (ipadala is to send)
download = idiskarga (kuhanin is to get)
save = iimbak (ipunin is to collect)
file = salansan according tagalog dictionary. pero mahirap memorize hehe

[Animo]

^^ Salamat Juan. :)

Halimbawa:

Add Printer = Magdagdag ng Impresora
Configure Server = Isaayos ang Serbidor
Print File = Imprentahin ang Salansan

Basahin ninyo itong sitiong ito: https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu/edgy/+source/kdebase/+pots/libkickermenu-kdeprint/tl

^^ Mga salitang moderno sa inglés na ginawang Tagalog. Pili-in ninyo ang mga pangalan nila at maraming mga translations.

[FlashCollider]

[QUOTE=kyle@1008;28484746]^^ lungsodnakumakalmotsalangit[/QUOTE

natawa ako ditong mabuti... KUMAKALMOT sa LANGIT

[bukid]

^^ Salamat Juan. :)

Halimbawa:

Add Printer = Magdagdag ng Impresora
Configure Server = Isaayos ang Serbidor
Print File = Imprentahin ang Salansan

Basahin ninyo itong sitiong ito: https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu/edgy/+source/kdebase/+pots/libkickermenu-kdeprint/tl

^^ Mga salitang moderno sa inglés na ginawang Tagalog. Pili-in ninyo ang mga pangalan nila at maraming mga translations.

hindi ba dapat ganito upang maging mas tagalog yan:

Add Printer = Magdagdag ng Tagalimbag
Configure Server = Isaayos ang Tagapagsilbi
Print File = Itatak ang Salansan

[Maxxclip]

Ano nga pala ang purist Tagalog term sa: "Skyscrapercity"?

^^ lungsodnakumakalmotsalangit

Nagtatayugang mga gusali? :dunno:

skyscraper (noun) - a modern building, especially a block of city offices or apartments, that is extremely tall

+

city


=

"Lungsod Ng Mga Nagtatayugang Gusali";)

[Waldenstrom]

^^ I have the same thought with Maxxclip.

it's like this: prostitute="kalapating mababa ang lipad" - it is accepted. we don't need to put the words all together.

[habagatcentral1]

What about scientific and Western versions? I know for certain that there have been attempts to make a "pure Tagalog translation" of some Western thoughts and concepts into its native version.

So, what is the transliteration of the following:
Communism, Capitalism, Mercantilism, Masochism, Sadism, etc.

[Askal82]

^^ I think its much better to stick to their Latin/Hellenic forms rather than translating them to 'pure' Tagalog.

I think many scientific terms are more translatable to 'pure' than western thoughts and concepts.

[manileño]

^ i agree. and like all other western concepts that have been adopted in the local language, we use the standard hispanic form or by adding the suffix "O" (Komunismo, Kapitalismo, Merkantilismo, etc).. i prefer having this practical translation and keeping the foreignness of the word than totally coining a new word that is often times more bizarre for anyone to use and it takes away its original and cultural connotations.. let western concepts be western concepts and western technologies be western technologies.. (for example, eroplano. airplane... but salipawpaw?!!? :lol: )

[Maxxclip]

^^Magandang araw po sa inyong lahat. Ito po ang inyong lingkod panghimpapawid na nag-aanyaya na kung maaari po sana ay ikabit at isuot na natin ang sintrong pang-upuan upang ligtas po tayo habang pababa ang ating lulang salipawpaw.

Muli, maraming salamat at nawa’y sundin po natin ang mga alituntunin habang tayo’y nasa loob ng salipawpaw. :lol:

[manileño]

^ :lol: see what i mean? what's more foreign sounding now, the eroplano or salipawpaw? i was in a Cebu Pacific flight once and i remember the piloto saying eroplano and not salipawpaw.. if he used salipawpaw people would have laughed.. or panicked hehe! who even uses this word?

anyway, so thats the downside of being purista.. with their desire to indigenize words, they end up becoming more foreign to the native speakers themselves.

[kyle@1008]

^^ the proper word for plane I think is sasakyang panghimpapawid, the length of that word alone is a good enough reason to use plane, quite a mouthfull

[bukid]

salipawpaw is for helicopter. that's what i heard.

[Lurker99]

Well, isn't Taglish a dialect of Tagalog? :lol:

^^ Taglish or Englog has never been a dialect and will never be considered one because it's actually a code-switching phenomenon whereas Tagalog/Filipino and English words are both being incorporated in one sentence or discourse.

Ex: I think, kailangan na natin tapusin 'yan.

Dialect is the variation of diction, accent, and pronunciation in a certain and only ONE language.

^^ the proper word for plane I think is sasakyang panghimpapawid, the length of that word alone is a good enough reason to use plane, quite a mouthfull

^^ i think eroplano would give justice :lol:

again guys, loaning words from english, greek, latin, and spanish terms is never a crime towards any of the filipino languages. it's but something that we should appreciate and try to utilize in a fruitful way. once again, language change is inevitable and it would always depend on a cultural and national context in order to supplicate a specific speech community's (e.g. the Tagalogs, Cebuanos) terminological needs without the growing anomality or vagueness towards a set of terms.

bahasa melayu and bahasa indonesia also have a lot of localized words such as:
cable - kabel
action - aksi
confrontation - konfrontasi
science - sains
university - universiti [b. melayu]; universitas [b. indonesia]

[Louman]

Somebody help fix this kid's grammar and translation (provided you also have a knowledge of Japanese as well.) Warning: laughably bad Tagalog ahead!

qAf5RcaToJ0

"Ito was (http://boldt.us/humor/ROFL_MAO.html) 1918 kailan ang lalong nakararami at ang makipag-away tapon"

[Askal82]

salipawpaw is for helicopter. that's what i heard.

Hmmm, parang okay rin naman gamitin. Sanayan lang yan.

Oh!! tatlong salipawpaw na ang dumaan! :lol:

Bokabularyo:

Ang kahulugang pang-agham (scientific definition) ng salitang 'bagyo' ayon sa PAGASA:

-isang sistema ng klima na may nakabukas na sirkulasyon sa paligid ng isang sentro ng mababang lugar , tumatakbo sa pamamagitan ng init na inilabas kapag umaakyat at lumalapot ang basang hangin. Natutukoy sila sa mga ibang unos, katulad ng mga mababang presyon sa polar, sa pamamagitan ng mekanismo na nagpapatakbo sa kanila, na ginagawa silang "mainit na gitna" na sistema ng klima. Tinatawag din itong unos at sigwa.[1]

[Sleepwalker]

Why there is such a word "hubo't hubad"? Is there a difference between "hubo" and "hubad"?

Salamat po.

[kiretoce]

^^ From: www.tagalog-dictionary.com (http://www.tagalog-dictionary.com/).

hubo
hub´o' adj. nude, undressed from the waist down.

hubad
hub´ad adj. naked, undressed from the waist up.

Therefore, "hubo't hubad" literally means nekkid! :lol:

[Sleepwalker]

Hahahahaha...I like that definition...Thanks

[kiretoce]

^^ No prob! You're welcome! :okay:

[bukid]

^^ From: www.tagalog-dictionary.com (http://www.tagalog-dictionary.com/).

hubo
hub´o' adj. nude, undressed from the waist down.

hubad
hub´ad adj. naked, undressed from the waist up.

Therefore, "hubo't hubad" literally means nekkid! :lol:

ah, ito pala ang tamang pangungusap:

huboin ang iyong panty at hubarin mo ang iyong damit. :D

[filcan]

oy naging rated R na tayo :lol:

[Maxxclip]

ah, ito pala ang tamang pangungusap:

huboin ang iyong panty at hubarin mo ang iyong damit. :D

Tama:okay:

Isa pang halimbawa nito ay ang "I-sulat" at "I-guhit"

I-sulat: ginagamit kung letra o mga salita
Hal. Isulat mo ang iyong pangalan sa kuaderno/ kwaderno.

I-guhit: ginagamit kung mga simbolo o larawan
Hal. Iguhit mo sa papel ang direksyon/ mapa na aking patutunguhan.

[kiretoce]

Wala lang....

Parang gusto ko magsalita ng Tagalog ngayon. :colgate:

[Maxxclip]

:D

tongue twister

Pinutakti ng mga saksi ang kriminal na umako sa pagpalo sa lalaking nagtitinda ng sako.

Nalugso ang palaso sa pagkakatusok sa tuktok ng puno sa bundok.

[kiretoce]

^^ Hey now! That's not fair, is there something less advanced than that? :lol:




Oops! Dapat pala nagtatagalog ako dito. :colgate:

[Maxxclip]

^^if i know...yakang-yaka mo yan:D

[kiretoce]

^^ :lol: Kaya kong basahin, pero nakakatawang sabihin. :colgate:

[Maxxclip]

at bakit naman nakakatawang sabihin/banggitin/baybayin:D?

[kiretoce]

^^ Dahil may "accent" ako. :lol:

[Maxxclip]

^^:hilarious :lol: :rofl:

wahahaha...nai-imagine ko na:lol:

[Maxxclip]

sounds like:D...

Peyknowtaktey neng menga seksi eng kriminohl ne yumakoh se pegpelow sa leleking negthithindah neng secko.

[kiretoce]

Prizewinning writer keen to cause a stir (http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,25197,24907584-5001986,00.html)

Miguel Syjuco, the scion of a wealthy Philippines political dynasty, calls himself a class traitor.

He says he hopes his debut novel, Ilustrado -- which late last year won the second Man Asian literary prize, awarded for an unpublished novel written in English by an Asian writer -- will help sweep away the privileged life that is his birthright.

"I am not saying we should kill all the rich people in The Philippines," he says. "But we need to kill their way of life. Enough is enough with the corruption and bribes."

Much of the book is set in the exclusive gated community of Forbes Park in Manila where Syjuco, the son of a cabinet minister and acongresswoman, grew up surrounded by maids, drivers, armed guards and drug-addled richkids.

"I couldn't wait to get out of there," he says. "I was in my early 20s when I left. There was something about that way of life that I didn't like. They talk about noblesse oblige. Well, nobility should oblige. But they pay lip service with their charity.

"Look at the way they treat their domestic help; it would help if they paid them more or gave them two days off instead of one."

His manuscript is a rare expose of a world of false piety, machismo and materialism. It surveys Spanish colonial and then US rule, the Japanese occupation, and the kleptocracies of Ferdinand Marcos and his successors. The narrative jumps from New York City, where Syjuco spent four years as a graduate student and freelance writer, to Manila, San Francisco and the far-flung haciendas of the provincial Philippines, with fleeting moments in Paris andBarcelona.

The ilustrados of the title were part of the small, emerging wealthy class of Filipinos who had been educated in Spanish and had travelled abroad, mainly to Europe. Exposed to liberal ideas there, they returned to foment uprisings against the Spanish colonisers. Most notable among this illustrious generation was the novelist Jose Rizal, the martyred hero of The Philippines revolution who used literature to inspire a movement.

At the opening of Syjuco's novel, Crispin Salvador, an expatriate legend of Philippines literature, is found dead in New York's Hudson River. His admirer and student, a budding author also named Miguel, learns of a missing manuscript exposing the corruption of elite Philippines families, which Salvador had been working on.

Investigating the mysterious circumstances surrounding Salvador's death, Miguel returns to The Philippines, where he takes a wild ride through his nation's political, social and literary past and present. He is forced to confront his upbringing, his preconceptions about writing and literary greatness in The Philippines, the Filipino diaspora and social change.

"Poor little rich boy," reads one fragment addressed to the narrator. "You must choose sides. If you choose your own, you choose oppression, fratricide, indifference; you will never be content amongst your own.

"If you side with the others, you choose treason, patricide, betrayal; you will never be accepted amongst those unlike you."

The novel's great achievement is the meticulous creation of Salvador's character, through interviews and extracts from his voluminous writings. There are footnotes and invented excerpts of criticisms from The Paris Review, Le Monde and other local and international publications. The ploy is so believable, Syjuco has received puzzled questions from literary agents and publishers.

He further tested the credulousness of his readers by creating a fictional Wikipedia entry for Salvador. "They were a little bit upset at having been fooled," he admits.

Syjuco beat two Indian novelists, another Filipino and a Chinese contender to take home the $US10,000 Man prize. Ilustrado was chosen, the jury said, because it possessed "formal ambition, linguistic inventiveness andsociopolitical insight in the most satisfyingmeasure ... It is also ceaselessly entertaining,frequently raunchy, and effervescent withhumour."

There has been some criticism. Richard Lea, writing in The Guardian, expressed reservations about a prize for an "exciting new Asian writer" being awarded to "an English-speaking graduate of creative writing programs at both Columbia and Adelaide University".

"I write against Southeast Asian exoticism and books that italicise Tagalog words or place names," Syjuco says in response.

"The Filipino or Asian experience is global. To say that a novel has to be set in Asia to be Asian is completely wrong."

As for writing in English, he points out that itis the common language, the language ofeducation and government, in The Philippines amid the 50-odd dialects spoken across thearchipelago.

Australia does not feature in the narrative but the 80,000-word novel is the fruit of Syjuco's PhD in creative writing at the University of Adelaide. He says he owes a debt to the university because it offered him a scholarship that allowed him to devote himself full time to writing and gave him the "chance to fail". After a heated auction, he has signed a two-book deal with the Hamish Hamilton imprint ofPenguin in Canada, his base. Random Househas picked up Ilustrado for publication inAustralia.

Syjuco has Chinese Filipino matinee-idol looks, which wouldn't be out of place on a Manila freeway billboard. He has an easy laugh and ready, polished answers during our free-wheeling interview, conducted by telephone from his Montreal base: his upbringing and a career in newspapers and magazines clearly have prepared him well for the press attention the Man Asian award triggered.

Syjuco cites Jorge Luis Borges, Roberto Bolano, Saul Bellow and John Updike, along with Filipino writers Jessica Hagedorn, Carlos Bulosan and Bienvenido Santos, as his literary influences, but says it is time young Filipino writers looked beyond the magical realism of Latin America and of India, with its cliched sari-sagas. "It's outdated. We need to go beyond that to write about The Philippines frankly, not as people who are trying to idealise and pander to the West," he says.

Instead, according to Syjuco, Asian writers in general have a duty to expose the "cancers of their society" perhaps to an even greater extent than Western writers.

At Columbia University, Syjuco noticed many Western creative writing students focusing on "small stuff, the minutiae of the breakdown of relationships". "I was trying to do the exact opposite," he says. "My writing was extremely polemical and political."

He says that everyone in the Filipino diaspora is following in the footsteps of the ilustrado. "You could be a domestic helper or a fiction writer or a lawyer or a nurse.

"Hopefully we will all return to start another revolution, a social revolution."

[kiretoce]

^^ Man, that sounds so RB-ish. :rofl:

[Maxxclip]

^^:lol: so you're not that extreme

[kiretoce]

^^ Yeah, I can say my short and long vowels just fine. ;) I guess when I say it, it comes out monotone. No rhythm or flow, and I rush through it.

[Christendom]

pls help,,,where can i find the script english version of Florante at Laura?parang wala sa search engines...need it till tomorrow afternoon...thanks in advance

[Animo]

pls help,,,where can i find the script english version of Florante at Laura?parang wala sa search engines...need it till tomorrow afternoon...thanks in advance

Only in Spanish (http://www.gutenberg.org/etext/15531) and Tagalog (http://www.gutenberg.org/etext/15531). Sorry!

[Christendom]

Only in Spanish (http://www.gutenberg.org/etext/15531) and Tagalog (http://www.gutenberg.org/etext/15531). Sorry!

thanks for asap response...no worry!

[kiretoce]

Tao po! Max! Nasaan ka na? :colgate:

[Maxxclip]

yes, Your Highness?:D what can i do for you?

[kiretoce]

^^ Baliktad! Ikaw naman ang nag-i-Inggles ngayon. :lol:

[Maxxclip]

^^:D sige, hayaan mo'ng ulitin ko ang aking paunang pananalita;)

Opo, Mahal na kamahalan, ano po ang maipaglilingkod ko sa inyo?

[kiretoce]

^^ Hindi ako hari, si Bernie iyon. :lol: Wala lang....gusto ko magatagalog uli (or, should I use "ulit?"). :colgate:

[Maxxclip]

:D ganun ba, ikaw ba'y nagbabalak nang umuwi sa Pilipinas kaya gustong-gusto mong mag-Tagalog?

[kiretoce]

^^ :lol: Malay mo, magkita na lang tayo bigla sa isang kalsada diyan sa Maynila. :colgate:

[Maxxclip]

sige, magkita na alng tayo:)

[Maxxclip]

sa pagkahulog ng mga bansa sa suliraning pang-ekonomiya, lahat ay nag-aabang/ naghihintay sa unang hakbang ng tinaguriang pinakamakapangyarihang pinuno sa buong mundo.

ang kanyang katahimikan ay tulad ng isang pelikula na lalong pinananabikan at lalong kaabang-abang sa mga medya at masugid na taga-subaybay sa problemang kinakaharap ng mga bansang patuloy na dumaranas ng kaguluhan.

[kiretoce]

Okay, I'm gonna attempt to translate these (with a few add-ons or creative licensing on my part for it to make sense in English).... :colgate:

sa pagkahulog ng mga bansa sa suliraning pang-ekonomiya, lahat ay nag-aabang/ naghihintay sa unang hakbang ng tinaguriang pinakamakapangyarihang pinuno sa buong mundo.

Because of the economic downturn, all the countries on the globe are watching/waiting for the leader of the free world to make make/take his first step.

ang kanyang katahimikan ay tulad ng isang pelikula na lalong pinananabikan at lalong kaabang-abang sa mga medya at masugid na taga-subaybay sa problemang kinakaharap ng mga bansang patuloy na dumaranas ng kaguluhan.

His silence is making the media wait with much anticipation as to how he'll help solve the problems of these affected countries.

[Maxxclip]

^^:omg::ancient::bow::bow::bow:

nice try:okay:

you're getting better and better and better...

[Maxxclip]

sa kasalukuyan, si Ginoong Barack Obama - kauna-unahang itim na nahalal sa pagka-pangulo ay magsisimulang manumpa sa katirikan ng araw sa harap ng milyun-milyong mga kababayan upang ipahayag ang katapatan sa bansang Estados Unidos at upang tuparin ang mga pangako na kanyang binitawan.

ang kanyang pamunuan/liderato ay inaasahang magbibigay katuparan sa mga pangarap at inaasam na pagbabago ng karamihan. sa kanyang panunungkulan, susuungin niya ang mga samu't-saring suliranin nang pandaigdig.

[icarusrising]

Ibabahagi ko lang...

sapat-sapat, salasalabat.. sasala-sala sa lahat!

sa kaunting kibo,

may nababato.

kapag kibo ng kibo,

may naninibugho.



sa kaunting alis,

may namimiss.

kapag alis ng alis,

may naiinis.



sa kaunting datal,

may nangangatal.

kapag datal ng datal,

may nabubuwal.



sa kaunting tipon,

may nagugumon.

kapag tipon ng tipon,

may nilalamon.



sa kaunting bihis,

may nililitis.

kapag bihis ng bihis,

may natitsismis.



sa kaunting biro,

may namamalo.

kapag biro ng biro,

may nabubuo.



sa kaunting daing,

may naduduling.

kapag daing ng daing,

may napupuwing.



sa kaunting sagot,

may nangungurot.

kapag sagot ng sagot,

may kumikirot.



sa kaunting banat,

may kumakagat.

kapag banat ng banat,

may nangangagat.



sa kaunting kain,

may titsinelasin.

kapag kain ng kain,

may titsinelasin pa rin.


Tula ni Francis

[dvbaicrviser]

Nakabasa ako dati ng liham na sinulat noong 1940. Iba talaga ang pananagalog ng mga taga-Maynila noon sa panahon ngayon. Mas may saysay ang mga pinagsasasabi at hindi pinaghahalo ang Tagalog at Ingles.

[Igsuonnimo]

Ano ba ang pananagalog ng Manilans at Manileño?

Parang ito ba yung power/kapangyarihan ng Romans of the Rome?

[icarusrising]

O, ilaw, sa gabing malamig
Wangis mo'y bituin sa langit.
O, tanglaw, sa gabing tahimik
Larawan mo, Neneng, nagbigay pasakit. Ay!

Gising at magbangon sa pagkagupiling
Sa pagkakatulog na lubhang mahimbing.
Buksan ang bintana at ako'y dungawin
Nang mapagtanto mo ang tunay kong pagdaing.

http://tagaloglang.com/Tagalog_Folk_Song/Aking_Bituin.htm

[icarusrising]

Kataka-takang mahibang ang katulad ko sa iyo
Biru-biro ang simula ang wakas pala ay ano?
Aayaw-ayaw pa ako, ngunit ’yan ay ’di totoo
Dahil sa iyo puso kong ito’y binihag mo.

Ala-ala ka maging gabi’t araw
Alipinin mo’y walang kailangan
Marinig ko lang sa labi mo hirang
Na ako’y iibigin lagi habang buhay.

http://tagaloglang.com/Tagalog_Folk_Song/Katakataka.php

[icarusrising]

O, ilaw
Sa gabing madilim
Wangis mo’y bituin sa langit

O, tanglaw
Sa gabing tahimik

Larawan mo, Neneng
Nagbigay pasakit

Tindig at magbangon
sa pagkagupiling
Sa pagkakatulog
na lubhang mahimbing

Buksan ang bintana
at ako’y dungawin
Nang mapagtanto mo
ang tunay kong pagdaing

http://tagaloglang.com/Tagalog_Folk_Song/o_ilaw.php

[icarusrising]

Magtanim ay di biro
Maghapong nakayuko
Di naman makatayo
Di naman makaupo
(Di man lang makatayo
Di man lang makaupo)

Bisig ko'y namamanhid
Baywang ko'y nangangawit.
Binti ko'y namimintig
Sa pagkababad sa tubig.

Kay-pagkasawing-palad
Ng inianak sa hirap,
Ang bisig kung di iunat,
Di kumita ng pilak.

Sa umagang pagkagising
Lahat ay iisipin
Kung saan may patanim
May masarap ang pagkain.

Halina, halina, mga kaliyag,
Tayo'y magsipag-unat-unat.
Magpanibago tayo ng lakas
Para sa araw ng bukas.

http://tagaloglang.com/Tagalog_Folk_Song/Magtanim_Ay_Di_Biro.htm

[icarusrising]

Anong laking hirap kung pagka-iisipin
Ang gawang umibig sa babaeng mahinhin
Lumuluhod ka na'y di ka pa mandin pansin
Sa hirap ika'y kanyang susubikin.

Ligaya ng buhay babaeng sakdal inam
Ang halaga niya'y di matutumbasan
Kahinhinan niya'y tanging kayamanan.

http://tagaloglang.com/Tagalog_Folk_Song/Lulay.php

[icarusrising]

Leron, Leron, sinta,
Buko ng papaya,
Dala dala'y buslo
Sisidlan ng sinta;
Pagdating sa dulo'y
Nabali ang sanga,
Kapos kapalaran
Humanap ng iba.

Halika na Neneng, tayo'y manampalok
Dalhin mo ang buslo, sisidlan ng hinog
Pagdating sa dulo'y uunda-undayog
Kumapit ka Neneng, baka ka mahulog.

Halika na Neneng at tayo'y magsimba
At iyong isuot ang baro mo't saya
Ang baro mo't sayang pagkaganda-ganda
Kay ganda ng kulay -- berde, puti, pula.

Ako'y ibigin mo, lalaking matapang
Ang baril ko'y pito, ang sundang ko'y siyam
Ang lalakarin ko'y parte ng dinulang
Isang pinggang pansit ang aking kalaban.

http://tagaloglang.com/Tagalog_Folk_Song/Leron_Leron_Sinta.htm

[icarusrising]

Alagaan mo ang manok,
Bibigyan ka ng itlog.

Ang gatas at ang itlog
Ay pagkaing pampalusog.
Ang saging at papaya
Ay pagkaing pampaganda.

Ikaw'y uminom ng gatas
At kumain ka ng itlog.
Hindi magtatagal
At ikaw'y bibilog.

http://tagaloglang.com/Tagalog_Folk_Song/Filipino_Children_Song_Milk_and_Eggs.htm

[kiretoce]

^^ I'd be nice of you had vidclips of some of those songs as well, Isagani.

[dvbaicrviser]

Ano ba ang pananagalog ng Manilans at Manileño?

Parang ito ba yung power/kapangyarihan ng Romans of the Rome?

Subukan mo panoorin yung mga lumang pelikula ng LVN nung pre-war at nung 50's, ganon ang dating. :)

Pati pagsasalita ng ingles ng mga pinoy ng mga panahon noon, ang sarap din basahin at pakinggan. May bonus pa, medyo nararamdaman pa ang spanish nung mga panahon na yon.

[icarusrising]

^^ I'd be nice of you had vidclips of some of those songs as well, Isagani.

Here's Paruparong Bukid sang by Nora Aunor... :)

bVBl-XeM1yw

[icarusrising]

Katakataka by the Mabuhay Singers...

aa8cNQwonh4

[icarusrising]

bis5AWNcCOM

Sinisinta Kita


Kung ang sinta'y ulilahin
Sino pa kaya'ng tatawagin
Kung hindi si Nene kong giliw
Naku kay layo sa piling.

Malayo man, malapit din
Pilit ko ring mararating
Wag lamang masabi mong
Di kita ginigiliw.

Ginigiliw kitang tunay
Panaginip gabi't araw
Kung di ka natatanaw
Lagi nang nalulumbay

Sinisinta kita, di ka kumikibo
Akala mo yata ako'y nagbibiro
Saksi ko ang langit, sampu ng kanduro
Kundi kita mahal, puputok ang puso.

[icarusrising]

rc95NWtkK0w

Intro: Cm-Gm-D7-Gm-break

I
D7
Kung ganda ang pag-uusapan
Gm
Ay higit na ang Pilipina
D7
Sa lungkot man o sa ligaya
Gm break
Karinyosa rin at masaya
D7
Sa gitna man ng kahirapan
Gm
May sigla pa rin kung kumilos
D7 Gm--break
Pilipina ay karinyosa sa pag-irog

Chorus
D7 Gm
Ay hirang, sinta kitang tunay
D7
Puso mo ay ginto
Gm break
Pangarap ng bawat nagmamahal
D7 Gm
Ay mutya, yaman ka sa buhay
D7
Binata ay dukha
Gm--break
Pag di ka nakamtan

(Repeat I)

Adlib: Cm-Gm-D7-Gm-break

(Repeat Chorus)

(Repeat I)

(Repeat Chorus except last word)

Gm-Cm-Gm-break
... nakamtan

[icarusrising]

UO0yLdgEYtg

AY AY PAG-IBIG

Buhat ng kita’y makita
Nadama ang pagsinta
Ng puso kong nagdurusa,
Giliw ko maawa ka

Huwag mo sanang pahirapan
Puso kong nagdaramdam
Pagkat magpakailanman,
Ikaw ang tunay kong mahal

Ay, Ay, Ay, Ay, Ay O pag-ibig,
Pag pumasok sa puso ay maligalig
Ay, Ay, Ay, Ay, Ay, Ay hanggang langit,
Ang pangako ng pusong umiibig

Buhat ng kita’y makita,
Nadama ang pagsinta
Ng puso kong nagdurusa,
Giliw ko maawa ka

Ay, Ay, Ay, Ay, Ay O pag-ibig,
Pag pumasok sa puso ay maligalig
Ay, Ay, Ay, Ay, Ay, Ay hanggang langit,
Ang pangako ng pusong umiibig

[bakasaurus]

For the original creator of this thread..

@dancethingy

What are your purposes for reading Philippine literature? For pleasure or for academic pursuits?

I could suggest one collection of short stories sampled from different periods since we started writing in English. There are some short stories that I would like to see in the collection but the list itself is already a good anthology.
I think this is already a more than adequate appetizer for anyone interested in Philippine lit written in English.

The Best Philippine Short Stories of the 20th Century
Isagani Cruz (editor)
Tahanan Books. 2000.

Go grab a copy! (Hehe, I'm advertising though I won't get any cut from its sales)

[Animo]

By Benjamin G. Defensor (http://www.manilatimes.net/national/2009/jan/18/yehey/opinion/20090118opi5.html)

JOSE Rizal as a writer and novelist has been overshadowed by his fame as our National Hero. National Artist Virgilio Almario has found it necessary that we need to read Rizal again in Si Rizal: Nobelista. In this latest reassessment of Rizal as a writer, Almario quotes Petronilo Bn. Daroy in “Politics as Literature” as saying that “Rizal is a victim of the patriotism of our scholarship.”

Over the last three weeks we dealt with his question in citing criticism in defense of Rizal’s view of Filipino womanhood particularly in the creation of his character, Maria Clara. The late National Artist Nick Joaquin saw this almost 60 years ago and railed against it in his appreciation of Rizal’s novels—the Noli Me Tangere and El Filibusterismo.

Joaquin wrote primarily to defend Rizal as a novelist, comparing him to the great writers of the world in his time. In so doing, Joaquin also went to the defense of Maria Clara. The attack against Maria Clara could also be a gauge of how the intellectuals at the time when Filipino writers were beginning to make their mark in world literature—English in language, American in flavor?

It is possible that not very many of contemporary readers—then and now—may have appreciated his defense because he used the original Spanish of Rizal in his (presentation). We will use instead the English translation of Mrs. Ma. Soledad Lacson-Locsin. What he says is vintage Joaquin:

“Over the figure of Maria Clara—whom, after Doña Victorina, I consider Rizal’s most successful creation—there has been a worse misunderstanding, a double one. The 1920s turned her into a sentimental stock-figure; in reaction, some critics of the succeeding generation have knocked her down from her pedestal, branding her a caricature, not a paragon, and an obsolete ideal. They allege that not being a ‘pure-blood’ Filipina, she should not be urged as a model for Filipino women—a line of reasoning that automatically excludes from our emulation not only Rizal’s fictitious heroine, but Rizal himself as well as Burgos, Quezon, Arellano, and a host of our other national heroes. They are dismayed that Rizal should have made a mestiza, his heroine; but seem quite undisturbed that his hero should also be a mestizo. They assert that, being a friar’s love child, Maria Clara is, far from being an ideal, merely an object of disgust and that Rizal (apparently without the slightest sense of chivalry or mere justice, since he is willing to visit the sins of the father upon the innocent girl) was really holding her up to our scorn, not our sympathy—an assertion that makes me wonder if these critics have ever read the book. For anybody who reads the book cannot but feel that the author seems to have fallen in love with his heroine. The pen that’s usually so sharp and acidc suddenly turns tender and mellifluous whenever it deals with Maria Clara. Whenever Maria Clara appears on the scene, the prose, so hard and controlled elsewhere, trembles into poetry. How is her presence first felt in the book? Listen:

He would have admired one of those fantastic visions, one of those magical apparitions which at times are seen in the great theaters of Europe, in which to the muted sounds of an orchestra, in a shower of light and a cascade of diamonds and gold, in an oriental setting, and enveloped in transparent gauze, can be seen to appear a deity, a sylph advancing without touching the floor, circled and surrounded by a luminous halo. At her presence the flowers bloom, the dance frolics, melodies awaken and a choir of devils, nymphs, satyrs, genii, maidens, angels and shepherds, dance shaking tambourines, gyrate and at the feet of the goddess, deposit, each one, a tribute.

“And yet Maria Clara hasn’t actually appeared on the scene yet; this isn’t Ibarra beholding his beloved; its purely and entirely the author, bidding forth his heroine. And after the bitter mocking brilliance of the opening chapters, what a difference! Music and a shower of light! Diamonds and gold! And a goddess at whose present flowers sprang! And how does he describe her?

. . . her eyes, which were almost always downcast, revealed a pure soul when she raised them; and when she smiled and showed her small white teeth one could almost say that the rose is simply a plant, and ivory the tusk of an elephant.

“Here’s the author again spying on the first meeting of the lovers on the azotea:

. . . What were they recounting in gentle murmurs that make you tremble, little red flowers of cabello-de-angel? Tell us, you who exude fragrance from your breath and hues on your lips! You, fresh breeze, who learned rare harmonies from the secrecy of the dark night and from the mystery of our virgin forest! Tell us you sunlight-brilliant reflection of the eternal on earth. The only immaterial element in a world of matter’ tell us, for I only know how to recount prosaic madness!

“It’s always thus when he writes about his heroine. All through the sad and shameful things that happened to [Maria Clara] he keeps her surrounded by light, flowers, music and mystery—until she disappears intgo the nunnery, And when in . . .[the Fili] she dies at last, he bursts intro a delirious prose-poem.” (Continued next Sunday)

opinion@manilatimes.net

[Animo]

By Benjamin G. Defensor (http://www.manilatimes.net/national/2009/jan/25/yehey/opinion/20090125opi6.html)

(Second of two parts)

ALMOST 60 years ago, in January 1951, the late National Artist Nick Joaquin wrote a spirited defense of Maria Clara against the “Victorian” critics of the early 20th century. This was contained in critical analysis of Rizal’s two novels—Noli Me Tangere and El Filibusterismo. “The Novels of Rizal: An Appreciation” may well have been written in reply to an essay, “Maria Clara, Caricature or Paragon” by Salvador P. Lopez in the 1930s.

“Sleep in peace, unhappy child of my unfortunate motherland! . . . Go, we will remember you! . . .We will see you eternally as we have dreamed about you: lovely, beautiful, smiling like hope, pure like the light and nevertheless, sad and melancholy contemplating our miseries.”

Let Joaquin himself conclude his defense:

“And Where, I ask you, is the ‘half-breed’ the ‘caricature’ the ‘obsolete ideal’ in these lines? This is Rizal speaking straight to the reader—and how does he address his heroine? Daughter of my country! He is not bothered by the ‘impurity’ of her blood as some of our modern critics are. In this, the nationalism of Rizal’s age is considerable larger than ours.

“And yet, these critics are not really attacking Maria Clara, not the Maria Clara of Rizal anyway. Rizal nowhere announced that he was going to depict an ‘ideal woman’ or an ‘ideal Filipino woman’—whatever that may be. Being a true novelist, he set out to create just one particular person, a single definite individual—and he succeeded so well that his heroine has become a folk-figure, the only one of all his characters who has attained this highest form of literary immortality . . . The folk took over and recreated Maria Clara; unfortunately, there had been in the meantime, a sudden shifting of culture: Maria Clara was recreated as a Victorian—which she never was, nor any of her contemporaries for that matter.

“The Philippines never actually experienced the Victorian Age. When Rizal said that the Philippines of his era was a hundred years behind in time, he was absolutely right. For Rizal, that was cause for lamentation; for us, from our happier vantage-point in time, it may be cause for relief—for the Philippines by being ‘backward’ escaped some of the horrors of Victorianism. We may be said to have leapt straight from the 18th to the 20th century, from the age of romanticism and revolution to the age of politics and anxiety. However, we did not—and it would have been impossible to—completely escape Victorianism. Some time between the last of 1900s and the first of the 1920s a generation . . . suddenly developed Victorian tastes and attitudes. The señoritos became genteel indeed and the señoritas became addicted to blushing and fainting at the least provocation. The era of America’s ‘Manifest Destiny’ in the Philippines was a sort of Victorian twilight as the age of Spanish colonization was the last faint twilight of the Middle Ages . . .

“The Maria Clara of Rizal, a mere girl, is subjected to the most awful and brutal and staggering revelations imaginable—a revelation that could crush even a mature man. She straggers, but she isn’t crushed; she stands up under the blow. Is that the ‘spineless’ woman she is now declared to be? Imagine her Victorian counterparts having to undergo such an ordeal! To save her lover, and to save her mother’s name, she agrees to marry, in cold blood, a man she does not love, even at the risk of inviting the contempt of the lover she’s trying to save. This, remember, is the decision of a mere chit of a girl. Is that an example of the vacuity and immaturity of the women of those days? When she learns that her lover is dead, she defies even her real father: she will marry no man, she will enter a nunnery. You may question her decision, but you cannot question that she has a mind of her own and she seems capable of being the will of others to her own. Where, then, is the slave and chattel of men in this proud, passionate girl?

“There is, in fact, nothing at all of the Maria-Claraish in Maria Clara—no, nor any of the other women in Rizal… But we have lumped all the women of that time—who must surely have been as various and complex as the women of any other time—into our saccharine idealization of Maria Clara, which is a sentimentalizing vulgarization of the Rizal heroine; and it is this stock-figure that the critics have been attacking with such relish. Rizal saw a woman who was firm, clean, honest, graceful, devout, dignified, modest, tender and true; and if some say our generation must now consider such a woman ‘obsolete,’ then God help our generation!”

Joaquin was talking to a mid-20th century generation. But his view of womanhood is equally valid today, in the early 21st5 century.

opinion@manilatimes.net

[bakasaurus]

^^
Enlightening article!:cheers:

[eonynx]

Prizewinning writer keen to cause a stir (http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,25197,24907584-5001986,00.html)

Miguel Syjuco, the scion of a wealthy Philippines political dynasty, calls himself a class traitor.

He says he hopes his debut novel, Ilustrado -- which late last year won the second Man Asian literary prize, awarded for an unpublished novel written in English by an Asian writer -- will help sweep away the privileged life that is his birthright.

"I am not saying we should kill all the rich people in The Philippines," he says. "But we need to kill their way of life. Enough is enough with the corruption and bribes."

Much of the book is set in the exclusive gated community of Forbes Park in Manila where Syjuco, the son of a cabinet minister and acongresswoman, grew up surrounded by maids, drivers, armed guards and drug-addled richkids.

"I couldn't wait to get out of there," he says. "I was in my early 20s when I left. There was something about that way of life that I didn't like. They talk about noblesse oblige. Well, nobility should oblige. But they pay lip service with their charity.

"Look at the way they treat their domestic help; it would help if they paid them more or gave them two days off instead of one."

His manuscript is a rare expose of a world of false piety, machismo and materialism. It surveys Spanish colonial and then US rule, the Japanese occupation, and the kleptocracies of Ferdinand Marcos and his successors. The narrative jumps from New York City, where Syjuco spent four years as a graduate student and freelance writer, to Manila, San Francisco and the far-flung haciendas of the provincial Philippines, with fleeting moments in Paris andBarcelona.

The ilustrados of the title were part of the small, emerging wealthy class of Filipinos who had been educated in Spanish and had travelled abroad, mainly to Europe. Exposed to liberal ideas there, they returned to foment uprisings against the Spanish colonisers. Most notable among this illustrious generation was the novelist Jose Rizal, the martyred hero of The Philippines revolution who used literature to inspire a movement.

At the opening of Syjuco's novel, Crispin Salvador, an expatriate legend of Philippines literature, is found dead in New York's Hudson River. His admirer and student, a budding author also named Miguel, learns of a missing manuscript exposing the corruption of elite Philippines families, which Salvador had been working on.

Investigating the mysterious circumstances surrounding Salvador's death, Miguel returns to The Philippines, where he takes a wild ride through his nation's political, social and literary past and present. He is forced to confront his upbringing, his preconceptions about writing and literary greatness in The Philippines, the Filipino diaspora and social change.

"Poor little rich boy," reads one fragment addressed to the narrator. "You must choose sides. If you choose your own, you choose oppression, fratricide, indifference; you will never be content amongst your own.

"If you side with the others, you choose treason, patricide, betrayal; you will never be accepted amongst those unlike you."

The novel's great achievement is the meticulous creation of Salvador's character, through interviews and extracts from his voluminous writings. There are footnotes and invented excerpts of criticisms from The Paris Review, Le Monde and other local and international publications. The ploy is so believable, Syjuco has received puzzled questions from literary agents and publishers.

He further tested the credulousness of his readers by creating a fictional Wikipedia entry for Salvador. "They were a little bit upset at having been fooled," he admits.

Syjuco beat two Indian novelists, another Filipino and a Chinese contender to take home the $US10,000 Man prize. Ilustrado was chosen, the jury said, because it possessed "formal ambition, linguistic inventiveness andsociopolitical insight in the most satisfyingmeasure ... It is also ceaselessly entertaining,frequently raunchy, and effervescent withhumour."

There has been some criticism. Richard Lea, writing in The Guardian, expressed reservations about a prize for an "exciting new Asian writer" being awarded to "an English-speaking graduate of creative writing programs at both Columbia and Adelaide University".

"I write against Southeast Asian exoticism and books that italicise Tagalog words or place names," Syjuco says in response.

"The Filipino or Asian experience is global. To say that a novel has to be set in Asia to be Asian is completely wrong."

As for writing in English, he points out that itis the common language, the language ofeducation and government, in The Philippines amid the 50-odd dialects spoken across thearchipelago.

Australia does not feature in the narrative but the 80,000-word novel is the fruit of Syjuco's PhD in creative writing at the University of Adelaide. He says he owes a debt to the university because it offered him a scholarship that allowed him to devote himself full time to writing and gave him the "chance to fail". After a heated auction, he has signed a two-book deal with the Hamish Hamilton imprint ofPenguin in Canada, his base. Random Househas picked up Ilustrado for publication inAustralia.

Syjuco has Chinese Filipino matinee-idol looks, which wouldn't be out of place on a Manila freeway billboard. He has an easy laugh and ready, polished answers during our free-wheeling interview, conducted by telephone from his Montreal base: his upbringing and a career in newspapers and magazines clearly have prepared him well for the press attention the Man Asian award triggered.

Syjuco cites Jorge Luis Borges, Roberto Bolano, Saul Bellow and John Updike, along with Filipino writers Jessica Hagedorn, Carlos Bulosan and Bienvenido Santos, as his literary influences, but says it is time young Filipino writers looked beyond the magical realism of Latin America and of India, with its cliched sari-sagas. "It's outdated. We need to go beyond that to write about The Philippines frankly, not as people who are trying to idealise and pander to the West," he says.

Instead, according to Syjuco, Asian writers in general have a duty to expose the "cancers of their society" perhaps to an even greater extent than Western writers.

At Columbia University, Syjuco noticed many Western creative writing students focusing on "small stuff, the minutiae of the breakdown of relationships". "I was trying to do the exact opposite," he says. "My writing was extremely polemical and political."

He says that everyone in the Filipino diaspora is following in the footsteps of the ilustrado. "You could be a domestic helper or a fiction writer or a lawyer or a nurse.

"Hopefully we will all return to start another revolution, a social revolution."


this is the book i want to buy. i've read excerpts of it and i like it! one of the strongest themes is the seeming endless search for the filipino soul. that soul that is manifested in a myriad of positive and negative things but whose meaning appears to be elusive, even for the enlightened (illustrado).

a sweeping cinematographic but fictionalized take on both the distant and recent philippine history and their influences on contemporary philippines is both engagingly serious and infectiously funny at the same time. i hope to be able to buy this book in the month of february. congratulations to mr. syjuco for winning the very prestigious man asia awards for literature.

his illustrado is a remarkable work! another proud moment for philippine literature!

[bakasaurus]

this is the book i want to buy. i've read excerpts of it and i like it! one of the strongest themes is the seeming endless search for the filipino soul. that soul that is manifested in a myriad of positive and negative things but whose meaning appears to be elusive, even for the enlightened (illustrado).

a sweeping cinematographic but fictionalized take on both the distant and recent philippine history and their influences on contemporary philippines is both engagingly serious and infectiously funny at the same time. i hope to be able to buy this book in the month of february. congratulations to mr. syjuco for winning the very prestigious man asia awards for literature.

his illustrado is a remarkable work! another proud moment for philippine literature!

This comment is seconded! I am also really excited to read this book and will get a copy as soon as I come home.

[eonynx]

By Benjamin G. Defensor (http://www.manilatimes.net/national/2009/jan/25/yehey/opinion/20090125opi6.html)

(Second of two parts)

ALMOST 60 years ago, in January 1951, the late National Artist Nick Joaquin wrote a spirited defense of Maria Clara against the “Victorian” critics of the early 20th century. This was contained in critical analysis of Rizal’s two novels—Noli Me Tangere and El Filibusterismo. “The Novels of Rizal: An Appreciation” may well have been written in reply to an essay, “Maria Clara, Caricature or Paragon” by Salvador P. Lopez in the 1930s.

“Sleep in peace, unhappy child of my unfortunate motherland! . . . Go, we will remember you! . . .We will see you eternally as we have dreamed about you: lovely, beautiful, smiling like hope, pure like the light and nevertheless, sad and melancholy contemplating our miseries.”

Let Joaquin himself conclude his defense:

“And Where, I ask you, is the ‘half-breed’ the ‘caricature’ the ‘obsolete ideal’ in these lines? This is Rizal speaking straight to the reader—and how does he address his heroine? Daughter of my country! He is not bothered by the ‘impurity’ of her blood as some of our modern critics are. In this, the nationalism of Rizal’s age is considerable larger than ours.

“And yet, these critics are not really attacking Maria Clara, not the Maria Clara of Rizal anyway. Rizal nowhere announced that he was going to depict an ‘ideal woman’ or an ‘ideal Filipino woman’—whatever that may be. Being a true novelist, he set out to create just one particular person, a single definite individual—and he succeeded so well that his heroine has become a folk-figure, the only one of all his characters who has attained this highest form of literary immortality . . . The folk took over and recreated Maria Clara; unfortunately, there had been in the meantime, a sudden shifting of culture: Maria Clara was recreated as a Victorian—which she never was, nor any of her contemporaries for that matter.

“The Philippines never actually experienced the Victorian Age. When Rizal said that the Philippines of his era was a hundred years behind in time, he was absolutely right. For Rizal, that was cause for lamentation; for us, from our happier vantage-point in time, it may be cause for relief—for the Philippines by being ‘backward’ escaped some of the horrors of Victorianism. We may be said to have leapt straight from the 18th to the 20th century, from the age of romanticism and revolution to the age of politics and anxiety. However, we did not—and it would have been impossible to—completely escape Victorianism. Some time between the last of 1900s and the first of the 1920s a generation . . . suddenly developed Victorian tastes and attitudes. The señoritos became genteel indeed and the señoritas became addicted to blushing and fainting at the least provocation. The era of America’s ‘Manifest Destiny’ in the Philippines was a sort of Victorian twilight as the age of Spanish colonization was the last faint twilight of the Middle Ages . . .

“The Maria Clara of Rizal, a mere girl, is subjected to the most awful and brutal and staggering revelations imaginable—a revelation that could crush even a mature man. She straggers, but she isn’t crushed; she stands up under the blow. Is that the ‘spineless’ woman she is now declared to be? Imagine her Victorian counterparts having to undergo such an ordeal! To save her lover, and to save her mother’s name, she agrees to marry, in cold blood, a man she does not love, even at the risk of inviting the contempt of the lover she’s trying to save. This, remember, is the decision of a mere chit of a girl. Is that an example of the vacuity and immaturity of the women of those days? When she learns that her lover is dead, she defies even her real father: she will marry no man, she will enter a nunnery. You may question her decision, but you cannot question that she has a mind of her own and she seems capable of being the will of others to her own. Where, then, is the slave and chattel of men in this proud, passionate girl?

“There is, in fact, nothing at all of the Maria-Claraish in Maria Clara—no, nor any of the other women in Rizal… But we have lumped all the women of that time—who must surely have been as various and complex as the women of any other time—into our saccharine idealization of Maria Clara, which is a sentimentalizing vulgarization of the Rizal heroine; and it is this stock-figure that the critics have been attacking with such relish. Rizal saw a woman who was firm, clean, honest, graceful, devout, dignified, modest, tender and true; and if some say our generation must now consider such a woman ‘obsolete,’ then God help our generation!”

Joaquin was talking to a mid-20th century generation. But his view of womanhood is equally valid today, in the early 21st5 century.

opinion@manilatimes.net

in a way, rizal's maria clara is the symbol for the philippines. therein lies the genius of rizal! to capture the character of a country in one of his novel's characters!

[METROPOLITAN_ILOILO]

Get ready for Philippine Int’l Arts Fest

By Dexter R. Matilla
Philippine Daily Inquirer
First Posted 01:22:00 01/26/2009

Filed Under: Arts (general), Culture (general), Government

THE National Arts Month (NAM), renamed the Philippine International Arts Festival, opens with a bang Feb. 1 in three sites.

According to Shirley Halili Cruz, head of the National Committee on Dance of the National Commission for Culture and the Arts, the festival will be launched in colorful activities on “Sining Gising,” NCCA’s TV show on NBN 4; in a noontime variety show on another TV network; and at Concert at the Park.

But the festival has really been going on since Jan. 13. That day, the festival began its celebration at the Clamshell Tent 2 in Intramuros Manila as part of the 18-day countdown to the National Arts Month 2009.

NAM began 18 years ago when then President Corazon Aquino signed Presidential Proclamation No. 683, designating February each year as NAM.

During the start of the countdown, artists sang, danced, played musical instruments, read poetry and painted on the spot.

Performers included Chin Chin Gutierrez, Joey Ayala, Bayang Barrios, Catherin Loria, Cercado Sisters, Quezon City Ballet, Halili Cruz Dance Company, Ramon Magsaysay High School Chorale, Karangahan Philippine Dance Company, Teatro Marikeno, Pamanadanse, and Zimon’s Percussions.

The official jingle for the festival, composed by Joey Ayala, was also played.

Present during the event were NCCA chair and Education Undersecretary Vilma Labrador; NCCA executive director Cecile Guidote-Alvarez; and NCCA commissioner Ricardo de Ungria, chair of the NCCA Subcommission on the Arts and overall chair of the 2009 NAM.

Also present were Halili Cruz; Egai Talusan Fernandez, head of the NCCA Committee on Visual Arts; Gerard Lico, vice head of the Committee on Architecture and Allied Arts; Teddy Co, vice head of the Committee on Cinema; and Eduardo Perez Jr., vice head of the Committee on Dramatic Arts.

With the annual theme “Ani ng Sining” (Harvest of the Arts), the PIAF will be a countrywide celebration with key events involving hundreds of artists from different disciplines, reaching people from all walks of life.

Multidisciplinary event


The activities include “PA(ng)LABAS,” a multidisciplinary show that combines a traveling exhibition, lecture forum and film showing. It will examine both film and architecture, the title referring to both the concepts of projected moving image (palabas) and the exteriority of architecture (panglabas).

It will take place on Feb. 10, 4 p.m., with a symposium at Forefront Gallery and Aldaba Hall University Theater of University of the Philippines-Diliman; and Feb. 17-21 at the Cultural Center of the Philippines.

Vernacular architecture

The “Walai-Vernacular Architecture of Mindanao” is an architectural drawing and photography exhibit of the vernacular houses of Mindanao culled from the Walai Pangampong project. It is complemented with a lecture series, ritual dances and craft works associated with house building and construction, and a model replica of indigenous structure.

It is slated Feb. 6-13 in General Santos City and Feb. 20-28 at University of San Agustin, Iloilo City.

Sinerehiyon

Meanwhile, Sinerehiyon will showcase emerging cinema from the different regions in the Philippines—from the hinterlands in and around Baguio to Naga City in Bicol; Cebu, Bacolod and Iloilo in the Visayas; and Cagayan de Oro and Davao City in Mindanao.

The festival, a showcase of a new generation of artists telling stories of their own cultures and people in cinematic form, will run Feb. 18-22 at the CCP.

Sayaw Pinoy

Sayaw Pinoy will be a touring dance concert that brings together different dance forms. It features dance troupes of the host cities and municipalities performing back to back with professional dance companies.

It will run Feb. 6-9 in the Visayas and NCR; Feb. 13-16 in Mindanao; Feb. 20-23 in Luzon.

Dramafest at Letran-Calamba

Tanghal! The 3rd National University Theater Festival will be hosted by Colegio de San Juan de Letran-Calamba and will feature university-based theater groups from Luzon, Visayas, Mindanao and NCR in cooperation with Lusong Luzon Arts and Culture Network.

It will take place Feb. 10-14 on Letran’s spacious pastoral campus in Calamba, Laguna.

Writers’ fest

Taboan: Philippine Writers Festival will be a celebration of the word—written, painted, sung or performed—and will assemble writers from all regions and across generations. They will interact with one another and with their audience, tackling issues pertaining to their craft or the situation of writing in the country, and reading their new works.

This will be on Feb. 11-13 at UP Diliman, Ateneo de Manila University and Cubao Expo.

Music fest

Organik Muzik is a series of four concerts showing the metamorphosis of elements of Philippine music from village roots to urban variations, from Cordillera traditions to Kadangyan’s world music, from Leyteño siday to Junior Kilat’s reggae Binisaya, from the virtuoso kutyapi-playing of Gamaba (folk arts) awardee Samaon Sulaiman to the hard-driving neo-ethnic rock of Popong Landero, from the traditional Balagtasan to the acid-jazz rants of Lourd de Veyra and the Radioactive Sago Project.

Joey Ayala weaves the various musical traditions and idioms in a coherent whole during the concerts on Feb. 7 at SM Baguio; Feb. 15 at SM Cebu; Feb. 22 at SM Davao; and Feb. 28 at SM North Edsa, Quezon City.

Visual arts fest

Philippine Visual Arts Fest ’09 will gather Filipino and foreign artists in interactive art sessions and performance art. It will be held at Robinson’s Place in Ermita, Manila, and on Pioneer Street, Mandaluyong, Feb. 18-22.

The 17 regional schools for the arts of the Department of Education will gather for the 2nd Sining Pambansa in Baguio City for a conference. Keynote speaker is Malou Jacob, secretary-general of the International Theater Institute.

Under the Cultural Caregiving Program of the NCCA and the poverty-alleviation program of President Macapagal-Arroyo, the NCCA will sign a memorandum of agreement with the provincial government of Rizal, headed by Gov. Jun Ynares, for the establishment of the Artists’ Housing Village in Angono.

Also to be launched is the restoration of the Metropolitan Theater. Moreover, Urdaneta Park in Urdaneta City, Pangasinan, will be unveiled in commemoration of Fray Andres de Urdaneta’s 500th birth anniversary.

For more details, contact Rene Napeñas, head of the NCCA Public Affairs and Information Office at 0928-5081057; or Vanessa Marquez, NAM deputy festival manager, at 0918-6380412. You may also call (02) 5275529, 5272192 loc. 508, 612-615. E-mail ncca.paio@gmail.com or public_
affairs@ncca.gov.ph. Visit www.philippineartsfest.com or www.ncca.gov.ph.

LINK (http://showbizandstyle.inquirer.net/lifestyle/lifestyle/view/20090126-185514/Get-ready-for-Philippine-Intl-Arts-Fest)

[Animo]

Ma. Glaiza Lee (http://www.mb.com.ph/YTCP20090207147484.html)

Yes young people, we do have a genteel past

National Artist for Literature Nick Joaquin is recognized as the most distinguished Filipino author who wrote about diverse aspects of the Filipino heritage – so distinctly that critics invented the term "Joaquinesque" to describe the Baroque English with a Spanish trace that he used to write his monumental works.

The country’s best postwar author, Joaquin wrote mostly about Filipino subsistence during Spanish colonial period, often dealing with the coexistence of primeval and refined facets contained by the human psyche. He looked at the multiple cultural components that make up Philippine society as he presented in "A Portrait of An Artist as Filipino," which is now currently being staged by Repertory Philippines at Onstage, Greenbelt 1, Ayala Center, Makati.

Considered as the most important Filipino play written in English, "A Portrait" focuses on family conflict where old cultural standards clash with modern values and how they can co-exist and reconcile with each other.

"’A Portrait’ is a dramatic portrayal of a family’s conflicts (where) old cultural values are pitted against the realities of a country soon to be engulfed by (the) World War. Joaquin crafted the tale so that the audience gets so caught up in the lives of two unmarried women, Candida and Paula, and their father, Don Lorenzo Marasigan, that it becomes a compelling story to follow," explains director Jose Mari Avellana.

The narrative is simple enough. After a bitter confrontation with his two daughters, Don Lorenzo paints his final masterpiece, entitled "A Portrait of An Artist as Filipino." He then gives the painting to his daughters, Candida and Paula, as a parting gift.

Candida (played alternately by Ana Abad Santos and Irma Adlawan-Marasigan) and Paula (portrayed by Liesl Batucan) are barely able to maintain their sprawling ancestral house. They survive through the contributions from their successful siblings, resisting the temptation to sell their father’s self-portrait which is worth quite a fortune, and even ignoring their siblings’ intimidation to sell the family house.

Instead, they take in a male boarder, Tony Javier (Randy Villarama), to survive in the face of their father’s artistic drought. As the story unfolds, the daughters find personal liberation: Paula elopes with Tony, the painting was destroyed, and the two daughters apologize to their father for their ill treatment.

"When my mother, Daisy Avellana, came across (the) play in the early 1950, she immediately fell in love with the dramatic content of the piece. She asked Nick for permission to edit it down and stage it as the Barangay Theatre Guild version," shares Avellana.

The said theater guild staged the play in 1955, at the Aurora Gardens in Intramuros. A few years later, several versions were staged, including a film version which was produced and directed by Lamberto V. Avellana.

PRESENTING TRADITIONAL VALUES TO THE YOUTH

This year, Repertory Philippines is staging the Barangay Theatre Guild version, with no attempt to depart from Daisy Avellana’s script written true to Joaquin’s treatment of the plot. Director Jose Mari Avellana aims to bring as much realism to the masterpiece in terms of portrayal of Filipino manners and traditions and depiction of the characters.

"Did we not have a noble and genteel past? And are these cultured, well-mannered customs not dying? By attempting to show snatches of the idealism and sense of filial bonds of that glorious generation, we hope to awaken in our audience a sense of loss for these old values, with the prayer that the youth today take notice and seek out our roots and find our true identity," said Avellana who describes Joaquin’s masterpiece as "beyond reproach."

He continues: "Nick Joaquin chose to deal with a problem most common to all generations: facing the difficulties of maintaining a decent manner of living. It is simple and easy to follow, written in language that is so real. One will have no difficulty in relating to the plot. As we worked on the play, we were surprised to find that not much has changed… other than the exchange rate of the dollar."

"A Portrait of the Artist as Filipino" is onstage until Feb. 8, at 8 p.m. on Friday and Saturday, with matinee performances at 3 p.m. on Saturday and Sunday, at OnStage, Greenbelt 1, Makati City.

[neyoneyo80]

The Dilemma of Accounting in Filipino

ACCOUNTANTS (Pagtutuos), TAKE NOTE!!!

A bill filed by Sen. Lito Lapid asks that Proposed laws should be written in Filipino (Pilipino). Likewise, the official spoken language In the senate should be Filipino.

But I doubt this bill will see the light of day.

Read on to know why.

Ang Paggamit ng Wikang Pilipino

A young, good-looking representative from Laguna sponsored a bill Recommending the Filipino language be used in all Levels of accounting firms and Banking institutions. The solon claimed it will Provide a better understanding of the business transactions for Those who are inexperienced And non-English speaking citizens.

The bill received unanimous approval from the Hou se and was presented to the President for signature To become the law of the land. But in Spite of the overwhelming pressure from the members of The Congress, the President vetoed the bill.

Why?

She explained that when the English "business" words are translated in Tagalog, They sound very malicious malaswa) And are "nakaka-hiya at Nakaka-kilabot! "

Very Manila High ang dating, I should say.

Here are a few sample words - English to Filipino

Asset - Ari
Fixed asset - Nakatirik na ari
Liquid asset - Basang ari
Solid asset - Matigas na ari
Owned asset - Sariling pag-aari
Other asset - Ari ng iba
Miscellaneous asset - Iba't-ibang klaseng ari
Asset write-off - Pinutol na pag-aari
Depreciation of asset - Laspag na pag-aari
Fully depreciated asset - Laspag na laspag na Pag-aari
Earning asset - Tumutubong pag-aari
Working asset - Ganado pa ang ari
Non-earning asset - Baldado na ang ari
Erroneous entry - Mali ang pagka-pasok
Double entry - Dalawang beses ipinasok
Multiple entry - Labas pasok nang labas pasok
Correcting entry - Itinama ang pagpasok
Reversing entry - Baligtad ang pagkakapasok
Dead asset - Patay na ang ARI

[habagatcentral1]

^^ :hilarious:lol:

[flymordecai]

Haha nice.

If I had my way and I was the President of the Philippines, I would abolish the use of Taglish(especially in the media, which helps spread it) and progress the national language of Filipino by adding new words non-existent in Tagalog from other regional dialects of the archipelago. I would increase powers of the Filipino Language Commission, hiring linguists of all the regional dialects to come together and develop new words for more technical things, and publish it in books annually that will be sent to schools all over the nation.

[mwg12a]

It's hard to abolish that since it's never in the law. I guess the media can encourage taglish or even mixing any filipino sentences with the english words. I think this is part of the reason that the english in the Philippines is declining, and that the tagalog or any languages in the Philippines are also declining.

I once talked to a filipino professional basketball players visiting the US and happened to choose springfield as one of their iterinaries. JoJo Lastimosa back then asked me and a few other if it's tough to raise kids in the US. This is the way he stated it " Mahirap bang magraise ng babies at home dito sa America kahit makaka-afford kang mag hire ng yaya" to me it sounded odd and different as much as hearing someone speak in a very deep tagalog language.

[Louman]

Haha nice.

If I had my way and I was the President of the Philippines, I would abolish the use of Taglish(especially in the media, which helps spread it) and progress the national language of Filipino by adding new words non-existent in Tagalog from other regional dialects of the archipelago. I would increase powers of the Filipino Language Commission, hiring linguists of all the regional dialects to come together and develop new words for more technical things, and publish it in books annually that will be sent to schools all over the nation.

Getting rid of Taglish isn't going to be done with just laws. I think it would be better if shows that require a script or teleprompter get good writers.... or give the writers that they have now a Tagalog-English dictionary. haha.

[kyle@1008]

you won't be able to abolish tag-lish as long as Kris Aquino is alive.....

[Louman]

..must... resist.... getting.... sn...i..p..e..r...ri...fl..e........... LOL

[Igsuonnimo]

you won't be able to abolish tag-lish as long as Kris Aquino is alive.....

Ang elitismo ang isa sa nabigyan ng kahulugan dalawang dekada matapos ang EDSA 1986.

Maski noong panahon ng Kastila, hindi mapapansin o matatanggap sa alta-sosyedad kung balibaliko ang pangangastila.

Nagsasabi lang ng totoo.

[manila_eye]

magandang wika ang talagalog subalit maraming kulang at ang ibang salitang inggles ay hindi maaring isalin sa wikang ito.

plus the fact that tagalog is a huge factor why filipinos can easily adapt english and even other languages. imagine if cebuano is the national language paano na ang english natin? kadiri ang mga pronunciations natin!

[WawaY[625]]

magandang wika ang talagalog subalit maraming kulang at ang ibang salitang inggles ay hindi maaring isalin sa wikang ito.

plus the fact that tagalog is a huge factor why filipinos can easily adapt english and even other languages. imagine we cebuano is the national language paano na ang english natin? kadiri ang mga pronunciations natin!

pero at least di mapag babaligtad ang "p" at "f" :lol:

"ip a ficture faints a thousand words...." :lol: ispup lang pre :jk:

[Sinjin P.]

magandang wika ang talagalog subalit maraming kulang at ang ibang salitang inggles ay hindi maaring isalin sa wikang ito.

plus the fact that tagalog is a huge factor why filipinos can easily adapt english and even other languages. imagine we cebuano is the national language paano na ang english natin? kadiri ang mga pronunciations natin!

1. True, maganda ang Tagalog. I was so hooked to my El Filibusterismo and Noli Me Tangere books back then in high school.

2. Please do not generalize na lahat ng mga Bisaya ay matitigas ang dila. Hindi matigas ang dila ko ano. :lol: Kung nasa Manila ako, hindi ako napagkakamalang Bisaya. :yes: Pero, 'yung yaya namin, 'pag nagsalita na 'd'yan, tinatanong agad: "Day, bisaya ka?" :laugh:

3. I disagree sa kadiri ang mga pronunciations. Based nga sa mga naririnig ko from foreigners and 'yung mga nasa BPO industry, the Bisaya people speak English better than the Tagalogs. Not to incite any CvC ha, pero I guess totoo naman 'yun. 'Pag tumatawag nga ako sa Globe customer hotline, I can easily recognize kung Tagalog 'yung CSR: "Hellow, tenk yu por coling Globelines, dis is ___ po, haw mey I help yu?

------
For fun:
ENGLISH - TAGALOG - BISAYA (na matigas ang dila)

tricycle - traysikel - traysikol
bicycle - baysikel - baysikol
one-fourth - wamport - one-fort
one-half - wamhap - one-haf
one-whole - wamhul - wanhul

:rofl:

[hiiamdib]

You guys should not forget that pronunciations can be corrected with education. It is something that is not predisposed whether a person speaks tagalog or bisaya.

Anyway, would it be feasible to bring back baybayin as the writing system. And also, sana sa schools natin ay tinuturo ang filipino dialects and not just filipino. It's a good idea right? Prinupose nung filipino teacher ko nung ako ay nasa Highschool.

[radical_zeitgeist]

magandang wika ang talagalog subalit maraming kulang at ang ibang salitang inggles ay hindi maaring isalin sa wikang ito.

plus the fact that tagalog is a huge factor why filipinos can easily adapt english and even other languages. imagine we cebuano is the national language paano na ang english natin? kadiri ang mga pronunciations natin!

ethnocentrism shouldn't be tolerated in the forums. i could be a 1st speaker of some obscure language of the amazon jungles and still learn perfect english if given the opportunity (in education). i can probably pass your glorification of the tagalog language as the better language in learning english, but dont let your narrowness and backwardness demean someone elses language and culture. relearn history watson. tsk tsk tsk tsk.

ang walay pakisusi walay katungod nga mosulti. shodi abas yotch.

[Ang_Bantayanon]

magandang wika ang talagalog subalit maraming kulang at ang ibang salitang inggles ay hindi maaring isalin sa wikang ito.

plus the fact that tagalog is a huge factor why filipinos can easily adapt english and even other languages. imagine we cebuano is the national language paano na ang english natin? kadiri ang mga pronunciations natin!

Mawalang galang po.

Are you truly Cebuano because you don't sound like one? As far as I know, Cebuano speakers here in SSC write better English. What do you mean "imagine we cebuano is the national language"? Are you referring to the people or the language?

Kadiri naman po ang pagkagawa ng pangungusap nyo.. (j/k!) :lol:

[flesh_is_weak]

^^sang-ayon ako...

* * *

btw, what's wrong with having an accent?

for me, my bisaya accent gives english/tagalog a unique flavor that native speakers can only try but never recreate...

[manila_eye]

^^ ayan binago ko na from "we" to "if":bash:

relax, i was just flame baiting. :lol:

[Louman]

^^sang-ayon ako...

* * *

btw, what's wrong with having an accent?

for me, my bisaya accent gives english/tagalog a unique flavor that native speakers can only try but never recreate...

I dunno what the big deal is or what is funny with speaking Tagalog with a Bisayan accent. I've seen people make fun of it but I've found it nothing to laugh about. Every language has its variants in pronunciation so I don't see why there should be one single correct way to pronounce Tagalog as long as you can understand it..... and that the accent originates in the Philippines. Don't give me any of that bastardized Tagalog with a thick American accent. :lol::lol::lol::lol::lol: jk

[flesh_is_weak]

^^uy wag ka namang maging harsh sa kanila (those who speak with an american accent)

some of them do try really hard to speak the language...and despite the fact that they're ethnically filipino, they did not grow up in a filipino atmosphere, so expect them to have the accent...

[Louman]

^^ I must admit, when I had an Asian American studies class, there was a reading that involved some texts in Tagalog and I didn't participate to see how the Fil-Am kids would pronounce Tagalog words. I think I remember giggling in the inside when I heard nobyo pronounced as nobayo and the NG sound pronounced as NGG (like tungo pronounced as tunggo.) I'm evil, aren't I? :lol:

[Ang_Bantayanon]

^^ ayan binago ko na from "we" to "if":bash:

relax, i was just flame baiting. :lol:


Salamat! But as far as we are concerned you can have your tongue as national language, as long as it isn't rammed in our throats. :banana:

[mAiNsTrEaMhunter]

You guys should not forget that pronunciations can be corrected with education. It is something that is not predisposed whether a person speaks tagalog or bisaya.

Anyway, would it be feasible to bring back baybayin as the writing system. And also, sana sa schools natin ay tinuturo ang filipino dialects and not just filipino. It's a good idea right? Prinupose nung filipino teacher ko nung ako ay nasa Highschool.

sana wala nalang talagang ginawang filipino subject kasi yung filipino, tagalog naman yan. kahit anong paliwanag mo, tagalog pa rin yan kung tutuusin so dapat wala na yan! tagalog should be purposely be thought to people who are tagalog and not to a cebuano, waray, ilocano, bicolano, chavacano, etc.

magandang wika ang talagalog subalit maraming kulang at ang ibang salitang inggles ay hindi maaring isalin sa wikang ito.

plus the fact that tagalog is a huge factor why filipinos can easily adapt english and even other languages. imagine if cebuano is the national language paano na ang english natin? kadiri ang mga pronunciations natin!

well that's your opinion, but basically your all laughable! :ohno:

[WawaY[625]]

^^ i think for every bisaya/cebuano na matigas ang dila, may tagalog na mali mali ang pag gamit ng "f" at "p" at sobrang laaaaaaaamboooot naaaaang diiiiiiiilaaaaaaa...

so sa mga nangmamata ng bisaya dahil sa accent nito tandaan nyo na may mga tagalog speakers din na katawa-tawa ang english..and at least maraming bisayang nakakaintindi at marunong magtagalog, eh ang mga tagalog speakers na nakakaintindi at nakakapagsalita ng bisaya?

[Sinjin P.]

You guys should not forget that pronunciations can be corrected with education. It is something that is not predisposed whether a person speaks tagalog or bisaya.


True, but I purposely did not include that in my previous post because it can be looked at to as discrimination to the poor who can't afford to be educated. :)

[mAiNsTrEaMhunter]

;32748684']^^ i think for every bisaya/cebuano na matigas ang dila, may tagalog na mali mali ang pag gamit ng "f" at "p" at sobrang laaaaaaaamboooot naaaaang diiiiiiiilaaaaaaa...

so sa mga nangmamata ng bisaya dahil sa accent nito tandaan nyo na may mga tagalog speakers din na katawa-tawa ang english..and at least maraming bisayang nakakaintindi at marunong magtagalog, eh ang mga tagalog speakers na nakakaintindi at nakakapagsalita ng bisaya?

right! sa mga nananadyang pagtawanan ang tagalog accent ng bisaya, para sa mga bisaya bahala na kayo kasi pag kami rin ang nakikinig sa mga tagalog, parang mga binabae. yung pinagmamalaki ng mga tagalog ang accent nila eh para sa amin, para namang bading ang tono! :lol::lol::D

[icarusrising]

Educational attainment has little to do with pronunciation unless perhaps the course's objective is for the acquisition of a particular accent. I can cite several examples of highly educated Pinoys with their mother tongue accents becoming part and parcel of their English. The change is more on vocabulary and over-all fluency.

[Askal82]

One example is Mirriam Santiago. She can give you nosebleed speaking English but still retain that Illonggo accent of hers. :lol:

[bitoy]

One example is Mirriam Santiago. She can give you nosebleed speaking English but still retain that Illonggo accent of hers. :lol:

I met her.. I'll take a fifth on that. My ex-gf is from Iloilo, galit na pala sa akin at gusto na akong ipapatay ang akala ko pa naglalambing sa akin. :D

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~


yung pinagmamalaki ng mga tagalog ang accent nila eh para sa amin, para namang bading ang tono!

I now wonder how can a Tagalista brag about his accent?



Wow! -- lots of side-jabs in here.. :lol:





True, but I purposely did not include that in my previous post because it can be looked at to as discrimination to the poor who can't afford to be educated.


@sinjin, Btw, education starts at home, dun nagsisimula ang pananalita ng isang tao and one doesn't have to be rich to be educated.



Kung may tonong chinese ang Tagalog ko, dahil barkada ko karamihan Chinese, pero sa bahay namin, wala akong accent mag..............




....


...





Taglish. :D

[Sleepwalker]

On "if" and "pi":

"Oh I'm so sorry. Umm, my pamily..."
"I did not expect that I came from-- I came from one of the tough 10..."

Education does not guarantee fluency. I think, it's more on fractice. The more you fractice, the more you become pluent... :)

[icarusrising]

^^ Maybe not for conversational/everyday English but for usage of English in specialized spheres like medicine, law, business, etc. education provides one with the material for spontaneity and comprehension.

[WawaY[625]]

Education does not guarantee fluency. I think, it's more on fractice. The more you fractice, the more you become pluent... :)

:lol::lol::lol::lol:
dapat

"Educaaaaytion das not guaranteeee pluency" preng :lol:

oi, im not posting to bash the tagalogs ha, im just pointing out na as much as may kapintasan ang cebuano dialect (esp sa accent), same thing goes to the tagalog language so no language/dialect can really claim to be superior over the other ;)

kakaasar kasi minsan lalo na pag naas manila ako, when i speak tagalog i can talk like a regular tagalog and those who dont know me assume na di ako bisaya, and sometimes i'd hear mga kantyaw na kesyo nga matigas daw dila ng bisaya..tapos pag nalaman nila na bisaya ako they'd be surprised and ask me bat di daw matigas dila ko :bash:

[mAiNsTrEaMhunter]

I now wonder how can a Tagalista brag about his accent?



Wow! -- lots of side-jabs in here.. :lol:


what's a tagalista? I was only referring to tagalogs making fun of bisayan's tagalog accent.

[kiretoce]

Tagalista, a person that list things. :lol:




:nuts: Corny pills! :bash:

[mAiNsTrEaMhunter]

^^
:lol::lol::laugh::rofl:

[manileño]

;32756376']:lol::lol::lol::lol:
dapat

"Educaaaaytion das not guaranteeee pluency" preng :lol:

oi, im not posting to bash the tagalogs ha, im just pointing out na as much as may kapintasan ang cebuano dialect (esp sa accent), same thing goes to the tagalog language so no language/dialect can really claim to be superior over the other ;)

kakaasar kasi minsan lalo na pag naas manila ako, when i speak tagalog i can talk like a regular tagalog and those who dont know me assume na di ako bisaya, and sometimes i'd hear mga kantyaw na kesyo nga matigas daw dila ng bisaya..tapos pag nalaman nila na bisaya ako they'd be surprised and ask me bat di daw matigas dila ko :bash:

while no philippine language can claim superiority over the rest, tagalog language is, was and will always be the standard official and preferred language. so get over your jealousies and hatred. the tagalog dialect chosen was that of manila which has transformed over time to reflect regional influences on grammar, accent, etc in order to become a real national language. thats why if you compare it to batangueno, bulaqueno, caviteno, and other older tagalog dialects, so much of it has changed--its become softer and more cosmopolitan/refined (malambot) thanks to the visayan second language users most importantly who have influenced it like the other regions.

you guys havent heard of Ala eh accent from the origins of Tagalog in Taal, Batangas? you should be glad the national language didnt end up sounding like it or you'd have an even tougher time adjusting. :D

[WawaY[625]]

while no philippine language can claim superiority over the rest, tagalog language is, was and will always be the standard official and preferred language. so get over your jealousies and hatred.

dont get me wrong, im not against tagalog being the "official" language, i was just merely pointing out as to how the tagalog language can have flaws (ie pronounciation) just like the cebuano dialect (ie matigas na dila)

coming from a tag-bis (tagalog na bisaya) speaking city, ive no preference kung ano man ang lenguaheng gamitin natin at kinikilalang official language :okay:

[mAiNsTrEaMhunter]

while no philippine language can claim superiority over the rest, tagalog language is, was and will always be the standard official and preferred language. so get over your jealousies and hatred. the tagalog dialect chosen was that of manila which has transformed over time to reflect regional influences on grammar, accent, etc in order to become a real national language. thats why if you compare it to batangueno, bulaqueno, caviteno, and other older tagalog dialects, so much of it has changed--its become softer and more cosmopolitan/refined (malambot) thanks to the visayan second language users most importantly who have influenced it like the other regions.

you guys havent heard of Ala eh accent from the origins of Tagalog in Taal, Batangas? you should be glad the national language didnt end up sounding like it or you'd have an even tougher time adjusting. :D

^^ I still go for official languages rather than a national language! No Filipino subject in non-tagalog schools because it is still tagalog. Unless each region teaches its own language in its schools, then that's the time there can only be a Filipino subject!

[manileño]

;32758300']dont get me wrong, im not against tagalog being the "official" language, i was just merely pointing out as to how the tagalog language can have flaws (ie pronounciation) just like the cebuano dialect (ie matigas na dila)

coming from a tag-bis (tagalog na bisaya) speaking city, ive no preference kung ano man ang lenguaheng gamitin natin at kinikilalang official language :okay:

i see. i just hope we don't generalize people and languages cos the tagalog language you pointed out as being malambot is just manila. like i said, Batangueno is just as matigas as the balisong kaya if manila tagalog happened to be refined, its because its users have come to influence it, especially the ilonggo and other visayan peoples, expatriates and anglophones.. the Tagalog we're hearing now in manila and the media is the result of the national language policy and inmigration. :)

[WawaY[625]]

So is Davao tagalog considered a variant of the tagalog language?

sometimes I find myself in a silly situation wherein im with someone from Luzon, then may kausap din akong taga davao...just like sa bahay..pag gf kusap ko Id talk to her in tagalog-Davao then pag kausap ko ang housemates namin biglang magshishift ang accent ko to tagalog-Luzon :lol:

[kiretoce]

My take on the matter is that accents have no bearing on fluency and usage. Just like English; I speak English with a so-called American accent, but that's only obvious if I were in the UK or Australia; because to them, their way of speaking English is the normal and correct way. And the same is true if it were the other way around and an Australian or a British person comes over to the US and we say that they talk with an accent, although we all are talking the same language.

Tagalog is Tagalog, it's grammatical nuances and syntax remains the same. Best of all, it can be spoken in any accent, whether it be a Visayan-accent, an Ilocano-accent, a Waray-accent, and even the dreaded Conyo-accent. :lol:

[Louman]

i see. i just hope we don't generalize people and languages cos the tagalog language you pointed out as being malambot is just manila. like i said, Batangueno is just as matigas as the balisong kaya if manila tagalog happened to be refined, its because its users have come to influence it, especially the ilonggo and other visayan peoples, expatriates and anglophones.. the Tagalog we're hearing now in manila and the media is the result of the national language policy and inmigration. :)

sounds more like

"...the Tagalog we're hearing now in Manila and the media is the result of the national language policy, immigration, and Kris Aquino."

[WawaY[625]]

i see. i just hope we don't generalize people and languages cos the tagalog language you pointed out as being malambot is just manila. like i said, Batangueno is just as matigas as the balisong kaya if manila tagalog happened to be refined, its because its users have come to influence it, especially the ilonggo and other visayan peoples, expatriates and anglophones.. the Tagalog we're hearing now in manila and the media is the result of the national language policy and inmigration. :)

I guess yung tinutukoy ko eh "tagalog kalye"..the people who would pronounce "girlfriend" as "gelpren" or "floor" as "plor" :lol: same sa mga Bisaya na ang pagbigkas ng "ateneo" ay "atinyo" or "oil" as "owel"

[manileño]

@Waway i dont know about Davaoeno.. could be a pidgin of Tagalog and Visayan so it doesnt fall on any of the two. :)

^^ I still go for official languages rather than a national language! No Filipino subject in non-tagalog schools because it is still tagalog. Unless each region teaches its own language in its schools, then that's the time there can only be a Filipino subject!

you sound just like a latino from a reconquista movement in the US asking for equal language rights for spanish and english in the federal level.. sorry, you're already given filipino(tagalog), in the US you'll be forced to learn only one, english and not your spanish. :D

[Sleepwalker]

;32758300']dont get me wrong, im not against tagalog being the "official" language, i was just merely pointing out as to how the tagalog language can have flaws (ie pronounciation) just like the cebuano dialect (ie matigas na dila)

coming from a tag-bis (tagalog na bisaya) speaking city, ive no preference kung ano man ang lenguaheng gamitin natin at kinikilalang official language :okay:

Gusto mo matuto paano patigasin ang dila, Way? .... :lol::lol::lol:

Guys, believe me, having a stiff tongue is more on an advantage rather than something to make fun of...:naughty::naughty::naughty:

[manileño]

sounds more like

"...the Tagalog we're hearing now in Manila and the media is the result of the national language policy, immigration, and Kris Aquino."

Kris Aquino represents the repatriates and to some extent our own anglophone communities.. :D Manila Tagalog is the national language for all these reasons..

;32758652']I guess yung tinutukoy ko eh "tagalog kalye"..the people who would pronounce "girlfriend" as "gelpren" or "floor" as "plor" :lol: same sa mga Bisaya na ang pagbigkas ng "ateneo" ay "atinyo" or "oil" as "owel"

oh, ganyan talaga since english is not a mother language of any single philippine region. its part of assimilation i guess, it would prolly take another 200 years before we get to have a standard pronunciation of english loan words. just like spanish which took 300 years of practice resulting in a uniform pronunciation of the loan words we enjoy at present.

[Louman]

Here is what Tagalog is suppose to sound like before it goes through the Kris Aquino Taglish filter used on TV (warning, after watching you may be converted to a member of Iglesia ni Cristo!)

YQH-N5bGQD0

[WawaY[625]]

Gusto mo matuto paano patigasin ang dila, Way? .... :lol::lol::lol:


oh i do know how :lol:

pero kidding aside, siguro talent ko lang yun..i can talk cebuano like the cebuanos do as I can talk tagalog as the manilenyos do..i can talk tag-bis din hehe ewan nakukuha ko lang agad ang dalawang accent na yan pag kausap ko eh purong tagalog or purong cebuano (more or less)

[mAiNsTrEaMhunter]

@Waway i dont know about Davaoeno.. could be a pidgin of Tagalog and Visayan so it doesnt fall on any of the two. :)



you sound just like a latino from a reconquista movement in the US asking for equal language rights for spanish and english in the federal level.. sorry, you're already given filipino(tagalog), in the US you'll be forced to learn only one, english and not your spanish. :D

im not even spanish my friend and I'd love to improve my english more than trying hard to improve my filipino(tagalog). :D

[manileño]

im not even spanish my friend and I'd love to improve my english more than trying hard to improve my filipino(tagalog). :D

there are plenty of venues for that, in manila for example you just have to choose who you hang out with.. im sure in cebu you have cosmopolitan communities as well.. i mean its present in schools, businesses, governments, when you turn on your tv and pc, what more improvements do you need?

tagalog is only there to remind us that we are a country capable of having a common culture that stands even without foreign cultural import.

[bitoy]

;32756376']:lol::lol::lol::lol:
dapat

"Educaaaaytion das not guaranteeee pluency" preng :lol:

oi, im not posting to bash the tagalogs ha, im just pointing out na as much as may kapintasan ang cebuano dialect (esp sa accent), same thing goes to the tagalog language so no language/dialect can really claim to be superior over the other ;)

kakaasar kasi minsan lalo na pag naas manila ako, when i speak tagalog i can talk like a regular tagalog and those who dont know me assume na di ako bisaya, and sometimes i'd hear mga kantyaw na kesyo nga matigas daw dila ng bisaya..tapos pag nalaman nila na bisaya ako they'd be surprised and ask me bat di daw matigas dila ko :bash:

No one should consider that Tagalog is a superior language than others, it's just that Filipino is based on Tagalog and still in the constitution as the official language of the nation.

You must be hanging around with the wrong people, just ignore anyone bashing someone's identity.

what's a tagalista? I was only referring to tagalogs making fun of bisayan's tagalog accent.


Weren't you making fun of the Tagalogs on your earlier post also? Malumanay na kung malumanay ang mga Tagalog na taga Maynila, dahil hindi matigas kaya parang bading magsalita, ganoon ba yun? :lol:

Nice analogy there... :D

Tagalista, a person that list things. :lol:


:nuts: Corny pills! :bash:

Yes, that too... :lol:

A Tagalista is a person proficient in the Tagalog language or a proponent of using Tagalog also.

[WawaY[625]]

You must be hanging around with the wrong people, just ignore anyone bashing someone's identity.


uhmmm but such "pangangantyaw" is pretty common sa Metro Manila..mapa sa kalye man or sa TV..dont tell me di mo pa na encounter yan ;)

[icarusrising]

Tagalista, a person that list things. :lol:




:nuts: Corny pills! :bash:

Uy natawa ako dun! Naalala ko yung sergeant-at-arms namin. Siya yung tagalist ng noisy fufils. :lol:

[kiretoce]

^^ Woohoo! I've actually cracked a Tagalog joke that made someone laugh! :righton:


And a very corny one at that! :lol:

[mAiNsTrEaMhunter]

there are plenty of venues for that, in manila for example you just have to choose who you hang out with.. im sure in cebu you have cosmopolitan communities as well.. i mean its present in schools, businesses, governments, when you turn on your tv and pc, what more improvements do you need?

tagalog is only there to remind us that we are a country capable of having a common culture that stands even without foreign cultural import.

my house! :D

Weren't you making fun of the Tagalogs on your earlier post also? Malumanay na kung malumanay ang mga Tagalog na taga Maynila, dahil hindi matigas kaya parang bading magsalita, ganoon ba yun? :lol:

Nice analogy there... :D


i guess i was only making a comment of it in response to manila_eye's comments. I never started it.