Sheffield vs. Nottingham

[S.Yorks Capital]

It seems there is a growing rivarly on this forum between these two cities so what do people from outside of these cities think is the better one in terms of nightlife, importance, devolpment etc.

[kebabmonster]

Sheffield.

Though Nottingham is nicer in my humble.

[Leeds No.1]

Sheffield has alot more going for it on all those scenes even though both cities have a long way to go. Nottingham is a weird city; its placed in the middle of nowhere yet its a sizeable city but with no real importance (that I can think of, for example Sheffield was originally steel and mining). I know Sheffield better than Nottingham though, but Sheffield is quite nice even though it could do with livening up.

[Accura4Matalan]

Sheffield by quite some way IMO.

[Jack-O-Bean]

God you people must be common

[kebabmonster]

Don't know the ins and outs of how each city performs in the industrial/retail/transport sectors, but as an average joe walking about the places, I feel Sheffield has more of a big city vibe than Nottingham.

I would imagine Nottingham being more of a sellable brand though. Modern, compact city with a bigger airport, castle and the Robin Hood shite for the Grokels, as opposed to a big, ex industrial Northern behemoth (though Manchester has managed to completly reinvent itself in the past 15years, perhaps Sheffield's bite of the cherry is due?)/

[Leeds No.1]

Sheffield seems to be a bit of a Manchester than hasn't sparked yet. If you think about it, what is has isn't much different to what Manchester had to kick it off- MEN/Hallam Arena, Metrolink/Supertram, Trafford/Meadowhall and motorway connections. Also the ski slopes... I suppose the same could be said about Nottingham but it doesnt have the size or importance of Sheffield and the big city feel and look.

[kebabmonster]

I'd agree, Leeds No. 1. Whereas Manchester, Leeds, and to a certain extent, Liverpool, seem to be regenerating, Sheffield seems to be lagging. The Winter Gardens and getting rid of the egg box is a start, but come on Sheff, get your finger out.

It is a sort of Manchester waiting to happen-big population, loads of redevelopment oportunities, but doesn't seem fashionable in a way that Manchester, Leeds or Liverpool are. Of the Big Four, Sheffield, despite it's size, doesn't have the oomph factor.

Perhaps the mooted Commonwealth Games could kick start the place off. Or the Eagles winning the Grand Final in 5 years.

[Pobbie]

The thing is, I like Sheffield the way it is. Just because it's not deemed "cool" or whatever doesn't make it crap. It has a big village feel which I've yet to experience in any other city.

[kebabmonster]

You've got it bang on there. "Big Village" (which I don't think is meant in a derrogatory way) is what Sheffield seems to be. A city, give or take, the same size as Manc., Leeds and Liverpool. It could do better, not just for skyscrapers, but for improving its profile nationally, let alone trying to achieve international status.

[Leeds No.1]

I don't think Meadowhall does it much good. Its good and useful but it no doubt takes potential oppurtunity from the city centre. A major city centre flagship scheme is needed to get it going. Harvey Nichols, Peter Jones? In the same way since Harvey Nichols in Leeds, the city has got going.

[caw123]

Nottingham for me, a more interesting city centre IMO.

[Skid]

I know this is supposed to be for none Nottm/Sheff members, but why is Sheffield much bigger and more important than Nottingham?

Official Government defined Urban Area populations

Nottingham 666,358
Sheffield 640,720

Nottingham has -

A bigger Airport
Is in the top five shopping league table (Meadowhall is no.20 Sheff City Centre??)
Is the regional capital of the East Midlands (pop 4.2m) - regional media, development agency etc.
Is a bigger financial centre
has one of Europes largest teaching hospitals
has a Hard-Rock cafe
Test cricket ground
Olympic standard watersports centre
Racecourse
+ both cities have 2 similar size Universities, Trams + an Arena.

OK Sheffield has beaten Nottingham to get a 30+ storey building, but the council has just released a document identifying 4 sites set to have high-rises built over the next few years.

[S.Yorks Capital]

Sheffield is more important as it has a large metro area, bigger tram network, bigger arena, fastest growing airport, many olympic sized sports facilities and lots of devolpment under way as well as a larger student popualtion. As for the buisness side it is the fastest growing city outside London.

[Leeds No.1]

Bearing in mind that fastest growing can still mean that it's a long way from the biggest competitors. Sheffields city centre isn't that good but it has the Devonshire Qtr suppose, and the city centre is due for a large investment to regenerate it. The shops at Meadowhall are good city centre shops, but probably what pushes it down are things like the lack of big named department stores (HN, Selfridges, John Lewis etc) and the environment of the centre, and facilities.

Nottingham itself is clearly smaller than Sheffield, Sheffield is quite a sprawly city IMO. The points about:
Teaching Hospital
Hard-Rock Café
Test Cricket Ground
Olympic Standard Watersports Centre and the Racecourse I wouldn't really say make much difference, because most other cities have them or an equivalent.

After that though, Sheffield still has an industrial factory sort of feel to it IMO, and the city centre feels quite town like... Liverpool, Manchester and Leeds all have very strong rich city centres, but not Sheffield and I dont know why- there doesnt seem to be the same attraction to Sheffield as there is to other cities. Nottingham's is quite rich but quite small. Sheffield still feels quite industrial but much of it is modern warehouse manufacturing sort of industry, unlike in Bradford where its all old mills and everything with huge potential. So if Sheffield does want to really be recognised as superior to Nottingham and confirm it, it needs to really regenerate and build proper buildings on all these sites with warehouses and small buildings. Nottingham on the other hand in general can just build from where it is. It seriously needs to sort out the quality of life on offer in the city though- its quite well known for gun crime, something Im sure puts off businesses and potential residents.

[Karate_Kev]

ask anyone in the world outside britain, which city is more important. they will ALL say nottingham, every last one of them. unless they saw full monty of course

[Leeds No.1]

The international view of Britian is totally messed up... What people know is all based on history and things- Robin Hood connotated with Nottingham, Man U with Manchester...etc People probably wouldn't know 1/2 as much if it werent for those. Everyone always seems to think that we all live in/near London and London is the only main city.

[S.Yorks Capital]

I'm sorry but I don't agree with some of your comments Leeds No .1. and Karate Kev. Sheffield is much more famous around the world than Nottingham and as for the big city feel in parts Sheffield does seem quiet but in others its is very busy and bustling. Sheffield has got a John Lewis in the city centre and in the New Retail Quarter to be built the new John Leqis will be twice as big as the current one. Of course Sheffield has it's grimy industrial quarters but so does every city and most of Sheffield's have either been devolped or are going to be re-devolped. Only on Friday plans were unveilved for a £150 million re-generation plan for a former industrial area. In five years time Sheffield will be one of the big 6. Nottingham won't.

Here a links to prove why:

http://www.sheffield1.com

http://www.map21ltd.com/COSTC11/Sheffield/sh-backgrnd.htm

http://www.sheffieldnrq.co.uk

[Karate_Kev]

Sheffield is much more famous around the world than Nottingham

have you ever left sheffield? i think not if thats what you think, sheffield is about as famous as leicester on the world stage i.e. non existent. Even Derby is more famous than sheffield, if only for the name Derby

Nottingham is world famous for Robin Hood, and famous for its football team, champions of europe 2 times.

whats sheffield famous for? like i said, they have the full monty. Thats it. and nobody remembers the city the film was made in anyway. People in our nearest country, France have never heard of sheffield. It has no fame whatsoever for anything, sorry

[AndrewC]

It seems there is a growing rivarly on this forum between these two cities

..so lets stoke the fire by giving idiots a place to city bash and generally argue over whose penis is less tiny than whose. I see no chance of a reasoned debate coming from this 'battle'.

[S.Yorks Capital]

I think you will find Sheffield is much more famous than Nottingham and even Robin Hood is claimed by Sheffield now and as for your football teams they are champions of nothing now a bit like their home city.

[Karate_Kev]

you've got no argument have you

[bobthebuilder]

i think nottingham city center is vastly better than sheffields

i think sheffield people would admit that as meadow hall did alot of damage

but in 5/10 years time sheffield(i hate to say this) will be better,as the city counsel seem more organised and dont let any old shite go up

[Leeds No.1]

Yeh Sheffield has John Lewis on George Street. Thats about it. Currently, both cities have good and bad points, but Sheffield looks like it will have a more prosperous future (it seems).

[caw123]

I think you will find Sheffield is much more famous than Nottingham

It really isn't.

[Accura4Matalan]

Which city has the current fastest growth? I would imagine Sheffield, seems to have more developments and just opened a new airport.

[Jack-O-Bean]

Which city has the current fastest growth? I would imagine Sheffield, seems to have more developments and just opened a new airport.

The Airport is plain shite though, it's the size of my house and the only places you can go are crapy holiday destinations.

And what about the name? Robin Hood is and always will be Nottinghamshires legend.

Is that how desperate Sheffield are, they have to steal other cities fame?

[Accura4Matalan]

Well he was born in Sheffield... so I've heard.

[Fitzroy]

Notingham city centre apppears to have a better variety of shops than Sheffield, walking down the Moor in Sheffield is a full on sixties nightmare. Likewise Broadgate in Nottingham. I prefer Sheffield's tram system. Robin Hood airport is closer to Doncaster than Sheffield and Nottingham EMA is miles away from the city centre. Nottingham uni has a better academic reputation. Sheffield is by far the bigger city. Neither has a great skyline. The countryside around Sheffield is excellent. Nottingham has more gun crime ... can't decide!

[Pobbie]

The Moor a full-on Sixties nightmare? What makes you think that?

[Pobbie]

God you people must be common
What sort of snobbish remark is that?

I'm a student in Sheffield who loves the city: I've never been to Nottingham, so I can't really compare the two. However, I want to know why having a "big village" feel and lacking a Harvey Nichols are bad things for Sheffield. I believe the city is all the better for not being trendy. It's hills and proximity to the Peak District also make it rather unique as far as our cities are concerned.

[liveforever]

Think you'll find Robin Hood, a.k.a. Robin of Loxley, was born in a place called Loxley (funnily enough), a couple of miles north west of Sheffield. Who cares anyway, it's only the name of the airport. But if anyones stealing, it sure ain't Sheffield.

Sheffield is about 3 times bigger than Nottingham. Just to clear that up.

http://www.skyscrapernews.com/cities.php

I've got friends at University in Nottingham and they frequently come to Sheffield for nights out etc because they prefer it as a city and there is far more to do. They are all big lads but they admit that they never feel safe in Nottingham, one was even mugged on his own doorstep. They say Sheffield is such a nicer, safer place in comparison.

On the global stage Sheffield is so much more famous than Nottingham purely because of Sheffield steel and cutlery. Other than having a slightly better University and a football team living on past glories, Nottingham doesn't have much in comparison. Even Sheffield United are putting Sheffield on the map, and thats saying something!

Although Sheffield has a lot of work to do to catch up with the 'big boys', Nottingham has all that to do and more merely to catch up with Sheffield.

[Leeds No.1]

About the Peak District being close to Sheffield- the same applies to Leeds and the Dales (and to an extent Peaks and Moors spose) and Glasgow borders Loch Lomond so its not all so unique. I don't see how not being trendy makes it a better place though... Trendy shops/bars=more visitors, more excitement, more attention=more business=stronger city.

[Pobbie]

I don't mean close as in "not that far", I mean right on your doorstep: much of the Sheffield City is part of the Peak District National Park, and you're there as soon as you leave the western suburbs. Many parts of western Sheffield have fantastic views.

[Pobbie]

Leeds No. 1, places don't have to be trendy to attract business: if not being trendy helps a non-chav image, I consider it a bargain. I find it depressing that cities have to be "cool" or "in with it" to be deemed successful.

[jazz-sheff]

this debate is bollocks. How would people seriously know which city is better when all they do is spend most of their time posting on internet forums?

As for a few things that need to be cleared up:

nottingham- nice city, well done lads, good luck in the future
sheffield- already has john lewis and was famous for somethings called steel and cutlery a long time ago.

lets just leave it at that and get back on our own threads

p.s. people cite bob the builder as the instigator but in my eyes that guy is a fuckin comedy genius!

[Republica]

I looked around both Sheffield and Nottingham before coming to uni. I chose Nottingham because it it much more modern in terms of uni facilities and the city centre is much better. Plus it has an amazing nightlife.

I've only been out in sheffield at night once, was a great night. I have visited it dozens of times and all i could think was... Dee dar.

[Pobbie]

this debate is bollocks. How would people seriously know which city is better when all they do is spend most of their time posting on internet forums?
:applause:

Exactly mate. I'm not trying to say Sheffield is better than Leeds or Nottingham, I just believe Sheffield doesn't get a fair hearing: there is more to liking a city than skyscrapers and trendy clothes outlets.

[jazz-sheff]

:applause:

Exactly mate. I'm not trying to say Sheffield is better than Leeds or Nottingham, I just believe Sheffield doesn't get a fair hearing: there is more to liking a city than skyscrapers and trendy clothes outlets.

thats exactly how i feel- sheffield is getting judged on what it seems is the current crteria- trendiness and skyscraper proposals.

i hold nothing against nottingham as im sure its a fine city but people need to give sheff a fair chance before they start spouting shit about a place they've only read about on websites like this or visited for a couple of days. Just for the record i've lived in newcastle for the past three years and i fuckin love it so my view of the world does not end on the boundaries of sheffield

[Gareth]

p.s. people cite bob the builder as the instigator but in my eyes that guy is a fuckin comedy genius!

Indeed. Like Earlybird but more subtle. :)

[daveylad2]

..

[AndrewC]

p.s. people cite bob the builder as the instigator but in my eyes that guy is a fuckin comedy genius!

Bob has made most of the intelligent comments on this thread, nice one bob.

[Pobbie]

davey, why did you edit? That was a good post.

[daveylad2]

davey, why did you edit? That was a good post.


Sorry about that. I messed up trying to edit the post and managed to delete what I had put in the first place. It was late and I couldn't be bothered writing it out again. I said that Sheffield and Nottingham both had allot going for them, they both have tram systems we would give our right arms for here in Leeds. Sheffield has miles better sports facilities than Leeds and most other Cities in the UK. I can't remember what else I put. I think I said that Leeds no.1 should stop throwing his weight around and criticising other Cities.

[ranny fash]

they are pretty equal arent they. just to clear this up, there is almost no common rivalry between these 2 cities. the miners business was 20 years ago, and we hate derby.

[ranny fash]

^although there isnt actually anything wrong with derby

[rottersclub]

The thing is, I like Sheffield the way it is. Just because it's not deemed "cool" or whatever doesn't make it crap. It has a big village feel which I've yet to experience in any other city.

Yes, I agree. I lived in Sheffield for 3 years and had a great time - it didn't seem much like a city due to the large amount of countryside within the city's boundaries (I was 1/2 mile from the centre and could WALK into the peak district!) and the small streets of old cottages around the city centre.

However, economically, it seemed to be very poorly performing - especially compared with Nottingham and Leeds, which both seem to have attracted financial sector industies (Nottingham with Experian & Capital One.)

Having said that, I work with people who commute from Nottingham to Coventry to work. And when I finished at Sheffield Uni, there were no jobs at all in Sheffield. So I had to mvoe south.

[Insignia]

Nottingham > Sheffield.

[Pobbie]

After reading the other thread, I'm not at all surprised you've gone out of your way to dig this up. Are you bobthebuilder by any chance?

[adsheff]

So, some reasons why Sheffield is amazing:

• 4th largest city in England by population (more people than Manchester)
• Greenest city in UK, more trees per person than any other, recently won Entente Floral
• Safest city in England (governement crime statistics)
• Only city in the country to have a National Park within its boundary, also making it the highest city in the country.
• Super sexy supertrams - most powerful trams in Europe (to cope with all the hills)
• WORLD RENOWNED. Any high-class foreigner worth his salt would see 'Sheffield' stamped into his cutlery.
• Stainless Steel invented here.
• Something like 70% of the worlds precision medical equipment is made there because no where else can do it as well.
• PARK HILL: The largest listed building in the UK as well as the largest concrete structure. The soon to be uber-cool flats are pretty amazing most will agree.
• Arts Tower is the tallest academic building in UK.
• Wealthiest area outside London - Sheffield Hallam.
• The largest bomb ever to have been made, the Grand Slam, was made there in WW2
• Wicker arches were the longest viaduct in the world when built.
• Note to Nottingham residents - Robin Hood was from Sheffield.

On a less factual note, the hills in Sheffield really make it a unique place. I mean, Manchester for example is a great place, but its so flat you get a sense there's no spirit to the place. Sheffield has a real sense of identity and history and a friendliness that makes it quite special. IMO. And everyone here loves it! Oh, and you don't get shot at quite so much as in Nottingham...

[Northbeach]

Why has Manchester been drafted into this scrap?
Choc's away.

[kids]

ah - ha

[Insignia]

Sheffield is a good Town.. and Its got Trams :). However Sheffield is lacking a Big Shopping Centre. Nottingham has atleast 2 Major Shopping Centres.

[Leeds No.1]

What happened to Meadowhall?

[Insignia]

^ ah, right.

Broadmarsh;

-Home to the Largest TKmaxx
-2nd largest Boots Store in the UK. (Largest is in Victoria Centre... Nottingham)
-Nottingham Bus Station Interchange
-Direct Route to the City Centre from Train Station and Bus Station areas.

Very important. Aint it? not to mention that there is a 400 Million pound expansion of Broad marsh.

Also there is...

Victoria Centre;

-Largest Boots store in the UK
-Over 170 Stores. (Game, Gadgetshop, Tesco Metro, Boots, Next, House of Fraser and John Lewis.)

Meadowhall is a beautiful shopping centre but It is badly placed! in a bad Location!

[Accura4Matalan]

TK Maxx is crap.

[Insignia]

One of their Largest store is in the New Trinity Square Development.

http://www.trinity-sq.com/_downloads/view3.jpg

http://www.trinity-sq.com/_downloads/view2.jpg

http://www.trinity-sq.com/_downloads/view1.jpg

^^ Nice Isnt it? Sony Centre right next to Dixons. :D

http://www.trinity-sq.com/_downloads/view5.jpg

[adsheff]

Why has Manchester been drafted into this scrap?
Choc's away.
I did say "for example" so that's why. I was there once thinking how difficult it was to navigate around the place due to a lack of any decent hills or inclines.

[Leeds No.1]

Takky Maxx is terrible. But if you can be bothered to look you can find some bargains from time to time. Next Clearance is worse.

[Insignia]

...

[Insignia]

http://img151.imageshack.us/img151/4472/trinitysqlocation0fa.gif

[Gareth]

What happened to Meadowhall?

Meadowhall should be demolished and it's shops put in central Sheffield. It fucks Sheffield over big time, in my opinion.

[Chogmook]

It's strange that, somehow they can't manage to co-exist, however in Manchester, the City Centre (w/arndale of course) and the Trafford Centre seem to co-exist in harmony! Maybe Sheffield's City Centre needs to brand itself as an 'alternative' to Meadowhall properly.....get a selfridges & harvey nicks in the city centre!

[Accura4Matalan]

I'd hardly describe the relationship between the Trafford Centre and Manchester city centre as being harmonic. The impact may not be as bad as Sheffield, but there is an impact. Its the same with Liverpool and Cheshire Oaks, Bolton and Middlebrook.

[Gareth]

I'd hardly describe the relationship between the Trafford Centre and Manchester city centre as being harmonic. The impact may not be as bad as Sheffield, but there is an impact. Its the same with Liverpool and Cheshire Oaks, Bolton and Middlebrook.

Correct. Manchester is currently economically stronger than Sheffield and has been for years. So it copes better. The likes of Altrincham struggle with it though, and many downtown Manchester stores do see the Trafford centre as a drain on potential customers. I'm not sure but from memory, Meadowhall seemed to be closer to Sheffield than the Trafford Centre is to central Manchester. That's also a factor.

[Mr.Zen]

From the pictures Trinity Square looks really tiny. It is almost 2/3 in size to Victoria Centre.

That other Trinity Square Building with the Borders Shop is the same size as the Corner House and in the same Location.


Map of the Development:

http://img151.imageshack.us/img151/4472/trinitysqlocation0fa.gif

Trinity Square is the area highlighted in Green. :)

That comment is nice, sweet...well i see that your from Nottingham...So am i, i think that Sheffield has many awesome facilities and activities but, i think that Nottingham (In my opinion) has even better.

I'm new to this forum but, i think that this is an awesome community.

-Bump.

[Insignia]

Nottingham will get a Nike Store in Broadmarsh..


http://www.nottinghamcity.gov.uk/nottingham_-_city_of_the_future.pdf

..read Page 4: for Broadmarsh...

[Leeds No.1]

There is a John Lewis in Sheffield. Barkers Pool. If you didn't notice Takky Maxx is in most towns and cities and Burger King? Since when do people visit cities just to go a burger king. They'd have to be really fat retards to do that.

[Vertighost]

The John Lewis to be opened in 2010 (not 2011) will actually be one of the largest in the country. The current one is being demolished along with some surrounding buildings to make way for the £500m New Retail Quarter.

[Insignia]

... yes duh!

[Leeds No.1]

Look who that's coming from.
At least George is somewhat organized. Since when has Burger King represnted retail demand. Leeds is quite clearly one of the main retail centres in the country but has one small burger king in the to-be-demolished Trinity Qtr. And on the station.

Why would Nottingham have anymore retail demand than Sheffield- and btw, Sheffield's John Lewis is bigger than Nottingham's.

[Insignia]

Does this really matter?

[Gareth]

Fucking hell. Nottingham's biggest Boots is larger than Sheffield's biggest Boots.

Fucking wow! The things you learn on this forum.

[ranny fash]

^lol

[Vertighost]

Both city centres lack marque stores such as Havey Nicks or Selfridges. Nottingham is better designed although the NRQ will improve Sheffield immensely. It's pointless comparing store sizes (you may as well wave your dick about while your at it). Sheffield is currently undergoing huge redevelopment at the moment including a raft of new store. Hopefully, we'll get a few decent stores but I doubt it will settle this argument.

However, Nottingham will never be taken seriously while you continue to make a hero out of a thief from Sheffield.

[bobthebuilder]

Speaking of TkMaxx.. One of their Largest store is in the New Trinity Square Development... when finished.






http://www.trinity-sq.com/_downloads/view3.jpg

http://www.trinity-sq.com/_downloads/view2.jpg

http://www.trinity-sq.com/_downloads/view1.jpg

^^ Nice Isnt it? Sony Centre right next to Dixons. :D

http://www.trinity-sq.com/_downloads/view5.jpg




Trinity Square... when Finished should be Nottingham's 4th Biggest Shopping Centre. :)

you talk crap

1) tk max nottinghams already got one yet we get another crappy tk max???wtf. dixsons is shite, yet we get another one???? the design of the building looks bland, and dull

sorry mate it wont be done in 2007 with the speed the builders are going at

[Insignia]

you talk crap
dixsons is shite

The Irony of this post..

[Furrydice]

Both city centres lack marque stores such as Havey Nicks or Selfridges. Nottingham is better designed although the NRQ will improve Sheffield immensely. It's pointless comparing store sizes (you may as well wave your dick about while your at it).

Well said. It really is stupid to be arguing over who has the biggest John Lewis or TK Maxx (why boast about that when Nottingham has much better things going for it???)

The stuff about Meadowhall being a major drain on Sheffield is probably very true. Perhaps also the proximity of Leeds disadvantages Sheffield? - much in the same way as Nottingham attracts people from Derby and Leicester. Regardless of which city we think is bigger or more important, Meadowhall is a handicap for Sheffield and i dont think it will be able to compete with Nottingham as a retail or leisure destination for some time. Nottingham is 4th in the Experian town centres index - i dont think Sheffield city centre is even in the top 20. According to Experian Nottingham (4th) is on a par with Manchester City Centre (5th) and Leeds City Centre (6th).

[Insignia]

I’ve edited all the nonsense I posted.

Now please continue this truly interesting Sheffield vs Nottingham debate. :)

[Vertighost]

The broadmarsh development is nothing special. Both Sheffield and Leeds have similar large scale retail projects on the way. Did you see the business survey by the way. Nottingham was even beaten by its not so poor relation Derby. :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:

[Insignia]

The extension of Broadmarsh will give an extra 110'000 sq-m of Shopping floorspace. Which has already attracted Ralph Lauren, Calvin Klein, Nike and the ministry of sound.

The new Broadmarsh will have a new stylish Bus Station which differs from its predecessor and a Tram/Bus/Shopping Centre interchange... aswelll as a New Square which will have a dramatic view to Nottingham Castle.

It will play a vital role in the extension of the City Centre to the south, which is River Trent, The Meadows, and further down... Westbridgford.

[Leeds No.1]

Yeah but Leeds will have over 1m sq. ft added and I'm not sure about Sheffield but I know it's big. So Nottingham is getting this but so is Sheffield and Birmingham just had the Bullring...

[Insignia]

No.1 - Bullring is the biggest shopping centre in Europe? The extension of Broadmarsh will be the same size!

OK Sheffield has beaten Nottingham to get a 30+ storey building, but the council has just released a document identifying 4 sites set to have high-rises built over the next few years.

Skid - make it 5 for 1 Brook Street.

[Leeds No.1]

Yeah I think the point is is that while Nottingham is expanded shopping facilites, so have all the other cities therefore it doesn't make any difference really.

[Furrydice]

2005 Experian....

4th Nottingham (2,703,900 sq ft)
5th Manchester (3,059,000 sq ft)
6th Leeds (2,206,000 sq ft)

http://www.nottinghamcity.gov.uk/performance_report_retail_appendix_2005.pdf

Nottingham ranks higher than Manchester in the overall index because it has 555 comparison stores compared to Manchester's 479 i.e. less floor area but more choice.

Broadmarsh (approved) and Trinity Square (under construction) will add 700000 sq ft. I dont know whats going on retail wise in Manchester and Leeds but even if Leeds does have 1 million sq ft approved/under construction then it would still be 200,000 sq ft behind Nottingham. :runaway:

[Insignia]

...

[S.Yorks Capital]

Course it is.

[Leeds No.1]

2005 Experian....

4th Nottingham (2,703,900 sq ft)
5th Manchester (3,059,000 sq ft)
6th Leeds (2,206,000 sq ft)

http://www.nottinghamcity.gov.uk/performance_report_retail_appendix_2005.pdf

Nottingham ranks higher than Manchester in the overall index because it has 555 comparison stores compared to Manchester's 479 i.e. less floor area but more choice.

Broadmarsh (approved) and Trinity Square (under construction) will add 700000 sq ft. I dont know whats going on retail wise in Manchester and Leeds but even if Leeds does have 1 million sq ft approved/under construction then it would still be 200,000 sq ft behind Nottingham. :runaway:

No; the 1m sq. ft is for one development. Theres an extra 500,000sq. ft at Clarence Dock and 260,000sq. ft in the Trinity Quarter along with some other minor developments. So in total 1,760,000sq ft. in total of retail will be added. In other words Leeds will have 560,000 sq ft. more than Nottingham. And Manchester area is improving retail too. It doesn't matter anyway; the catchments for these cities are far larger than Nottingham.

In terms of this topic its important to know Sheffield's retail space which is?

[Insignia]

Little to none. :laugh:

[Furrydice]

In terms of this topic its important to know Sheffield's retail space which is?

No idea its not in the Experian Top 20. We'll just have to see what the rankings are in a few years time i guess. Im not trying to drag Leeds or Manchester into this discussion but a lot of people who've probably never been to Nottingham seem happy to completely underestimate the place. Its great if Leeds has 1.7 million sq feet of new retail space planned, thats like 2 Bullrings!! Itll certainly overtake Birmingham and Glasgow in the Town Futures Index.

[Leeds No.1]

I think it's not in that league because of the qualtiy of the shops not floorspace though...

[Vertighost]

God knows. Sheffield has always had an awful city centre. It is spread out over a huge area and the majority of it is effectively running along one street (The Moor, Pinstone Street, Fargate, High Street). With areas such as West Street/Division Street and Castle markets annexed from the main areas. This makes the city centre feel alot smaller because people tend to stick to the central area. The NRQ will finally create a core of shops along side pinstone street creating about 1 mil sq feet of floorspace. Which will also make the West St/Division St shopping area more accessable.

This is alongside the redevelopment of Carmel House, The Moor and the moving of the markets to a more central location at Moor Foot.

[Insignia]

In other words Leeds will have 560,000 sq ft. more than Nottingham.
What's the biggest office and commercial development in Leeds?

Nottingham's biggest office and commercial development scheme is the East Side (huge area of unused Land). The Eastside consists of 56 ha (140 acres) of land alongside Nottingham's vibrant Lace Market and retail core, from the Victoria Shopping Centre in the north to the railway line in the south.

In total, over 37 ha (91 acres) of mixed-use development is to be delivered in the coming years. Major redevelopment opportunities focuses around the bus depot and a new canal basin to the south of an extended Island Business Quarter - Nottingham's biggest office development. The £900 million Island Scheme will create new state of the art business quarter with 12 ha (30 acres) of office space.

The masterplan http://www.geocities.com/wwegrounds/eastsidecs.JPG

[Insignia]

so If Leeds has a bigger commercial development than Nottingham east, I will owe some apology for 'underrating it'. ...and that's "IF" ;)

[Leeds No.1]

What's the biggest office and commercial development in Leeds?

Nottingham's biggest office and commercial development scheme is the East Side (huge area of unused Land). The Eastside consists of 56 ha (140 acres) of land alongside Nottingham's vibrant Lace Market and retail core, from the Victoria Shopping Centre in the north to the railway line in the south.

In total, over 37 ha (91 acres) of mixed-use development is to be delivered in the coming years. Major redevelopment opportunities focuses around the bus depot and a new canal basin to the south of an extended Island Business Quarter - Nottingham's biggest office development. The £900 million Island Scheme will create new state of the art business quarter with 12 ha (30 acres) of office space.

The masterplan http://www.geocities.com/wwegrounds/eastsidecs.JPG

I'm not sure... but it doesn't matter about one development its cumimlatevley what matters. The biggest one's are probably Wellington Place, Clarence Dock, Quarry Hill, Harewood/Eastgate then all the skyscrapers.
Wellington Place=1.14m sq. ft
BWP=234,000sq. ft
Clarence Dock= 100,000sq. ft
Harewood/Eastgate= 100,000 sq. ft.
With all the skyscrapers and towers though it'll probably be around 2-3m sq. ft. I think before you go too far into this its important to consider that Leeds is one of Britain's biggest business cities with an internet sector quoted as larger than London's. Whether thats true or not is irrelevant- the point is, is that Leeds (and Manchester, Birmingham, Glasgow) are leading financial and business centres that regardless of office space or not somewhere like Nottingham or Sheffield has a long way to go to catch up. It's all very well building these offices- but how many will be empty?

[Vertighost]

Sheffield has the highest demand for office space in the country. The area around the airport is also going to become the largest busness park in the country.

[Boards]

No idea its not in the Experian Top 20. We'll just have to see what the rankings are in a few years time i guess. Im not trying to drag Leeds or Manchester into this discussion but a lot of people who've probably never been to Nottingham seem happy to completely underestimate the place. Its great if Leeds has 1.7 million sq feet of new retail space planned, thats like 2 Bullrings!! Itll certainly overtake Birmingham and Glasgow in the Town Futures Index.

I dont know the situation in Birmingham but in the last year the 500'000 sq ft Glasgow Fort has opened, Glasgow Harbour with 500'000 sq ft is under construction and Silverburn at 950'000 sq ft is under construction - so thats just under 2'000'000 sq ft extra for Glasgow just from the three main developments - so Leeds overtaking Glasgow - er no.

[Furrydice]

Its great if Leeds has 1.7 million sq feet of new retail space planned, thats like 2 Bullrings!! Itll certainly overtake Birmingham and Glasgow in the Town Futures Index.

mmm that comment was intended to be a little tongue-in-cheek.

The Experian data is widely used but it is essentially only a measure of the size and vitality of retail/leisure activity in a particular centre (though we can of course make assumptions about the economic strength of places on this basis). It doesnt include office or residential floor space. It also doesnt include out-of-town locations like Glasgow Fort or Silverburn. Unfortunatley for places like Sheffield with Meadowhall, these are treated as seperate centres in competition with proper city centres. Personally, I would be pretty horrified if there were proposals for massive new out of town shopping floorspace in Nottingham....

[Insignia]

I'm not sure... but it doesn't matter about one development its cumimlatevley what matters. The biggest one's are probably Wellington Place, Clarence Dock, Quarry Hill, Harewood/Eastgate then all the skyscrapers.
Wellington Place=1.14m sq. ft
BWP=234,000sq. ft
Clarence Dock= 100,000sq. ft
Harewood/Eastgate= 100,000 sq. ft.
With all the skyscrapers and towers though it'll probably be around 2-3m sq. ft. I think before you go too far into this its important to consider that Leeds is one of Britain's biggest business cities with an internet sector quoted as larger than London's. Whether thats true or not is irrelevant- the point is, is that Leeds (and Manchester, Birmingham, Glasgow) are leading financial and business centres that regardless of office space or not somewhere like Nottingham or Sheffield has a long way to go to catch up. It's all very well building these offices- but how many will be empty?

Let me rephrase this to you.

Is there a business development currently happening in Leeds which is equivalent to Nottingham East's £900m? (the Island development in Nottingham is £900m… which doesn’t include upper eastside.)

Yay or Nay!

[Leeds No.1]

Runs well into the billions.
http://www.leeds.gov.uk/files/2005/week30/inter__57D2D01DD38142A580256E00004160E8_520770b0-f0d2-47de-9a60-2c95f644c4ff.pdf

[Insignia]

Same, Nottingham would run into the Billions if I counted the price for just about every development in the City Centre.

… but I asked for a 'Single Development' which is as expensive as £900 million, or if Leeds has anything more expensive than £900 million (which is Notts most expensive development) going up.

please list.

[Leeds No.1]

Well how am I meant to know that. The cost is totally irrelevant- all the cost means is just how much money is being spent. The floorspace is more important, and one development? well who cares? Nottingham might have one development but every other city has more than one so it's only fair to give a totalled cost.

[Insignia]

Ok.. how about?


http://img368.imageshack.us/img368/530/s14jg.jpg

VS

http://www.lightrailnow.org/images/not-lrt-str-2003_irj.jpg

[S.Yorks Capital]

For a start Sheffield's trams are all being re-furbished to look like the one below and secondly Sheffield's tram system is way better than Nottingham's in many different ways.

http://www.stagecoachsupertram.com/uploads/TramatStop.jpg

[Insignia]

so far only 1 out of all the Trams have this new livery.. and although its an enhancement, I don’t think it looks better than NET.

[S.Yorks Capital]

All the trams are getting this livery over the next couple of months and I prefer Sheffield's trams. All though NET looks slick and modern the Sheffield trams look powerful and have a bit of character.

[Accura4Matalan]

so far only 1 out of all the Trams have this new livery.. and although its an enhancement, I don’t think it looks better than NET.
The Sheffield network is much more extensive.

[Leeds No.1]

Sheffield's trams are much more powerful aren't they? In order to get up some of the steep hills around Sheffield compared to the generally flat terrain of Nottingham.

[Insignia]

The Sheffield network is much more extensive.

Accura, if Preston had the NET, it would have been The Only thing worth talking about in your City.

NET runs from the Centre of the City to the North. There might be extensions from the Centre to the South and West. Though it's unfair to compare route length at this stage. NET is new, only 2 years old. The extensions will make NET more extensive than Sheffield's.

[Leeds No.1]

Thats a terrible come back; that's basically saying Nottingham has the NET and is the only thing worth talking about. Which might be true but yeah.

[S.Yorks Capital]

Sheffield's tram network has had no extensions since it was completed 12 years ago although the proposed new extensions would make it even bigger.

[Insignia]

Thats a terrible come back;

I'm not shielding Nottingham. I'm only stating the evident.

that's basically saying Nottingham has the NET and is the only thing worth talking about. Which might be true but yeah.

There is much more to talk about than just trams.


Nottingham has -

A bigger Airport
Is in the top five shopping league table (Meadowhall is no.20 Sheff City Centre??)
Is the regional capital of the East Midlands (pop 4.2m) - regional media, development agency etc.
Is a bigger financial centre
has one of Europes largest teaching hospitals
has a Hard-Rock cafe
Test cricket ground
Olympic standard watersports centre
Racecourse
+ both cities have 2 similar size Universities, Trams + an Arena.

(ripped from skid)

[Leeds No.1]

Yeah I didnt ask for all that stuff; if you havent ntoiced most cities have all those things too.

[S.Yorks Capital]

Sheffield has nearly all these things and some of them and most of them than Nottinghams. Sheffield is more well known around UK, Europe and the world and has lots more going for it in terms of devolpment. When it comes to the UK's top cities Sheffield is always placed ahead of Nottingham in practicaly every sense. You are just trying to run down Sheffield as you think it is an easy target and it is your nearest rival.

[Leeds No.1]

Coz it has nowhere to rival :) Leeds has Manchester, Manchester has Liverpool Leeds and Birmingham (oh dear lol), Birmingham has Manchester, Liverpool has Manchester, Glasgow has Edinburgh- need somewhere to pick on!

[S.Yorks Capital]

lol. who in your opion does Sheffield have to rival aside from Nottingham?

[Leeds No.1]

Leeds... although tbh I don't really see them much as rival cities. They seem to skip happily along among green pastures. In theory Leeds could also rival Bradford but it doesn't. Sheffield could rival Manchester as well- any major cities nearby really. Sheffield always seems to get on quietly by itself though heh

[S.Yorks Capital]

If u don't mind me asking what are your trueful opions on Sheffield. I am always interested what people from West Yorkshire think?

[Leeds No.1]

Im in Harrogate (aka North Yorkshire but has more to do with West Yorkshire than North heh) but actually lived in the south before here. But anyway I quite like Sheffield; nice place although sometimes it feels a bit like a ghost town. It could do with some regeneration and a bit of life which it is getting; its a good place. I don't really see it as a rival to Leeds because I think it's fair to say in terms of importance, not size, its not as important (yet). I must say it feels a bit industrial like stereotypical yorkshire but I have nothing against the place. I like Meadowhall although I know loadsa people don't! And I'm aware it takes trade from the centre.

[S.Yorks Capital]

Fair and true comments. Have jsut come across a website about a Sheffield devolpment which has a great video at Velocity-office space.co.uk. Check it out. It is good and gaves a feel of Sheffield.

[Insignia]

Leeds has Manchester,

In theory the same Nottingham - Sheffield comparison works for Leeds - Manchester.


Manchester has -

A bigger Airport!
Is much more famous & recognised World Wide.
Is in the top five shopping league table
Is the bigger financial centre

Tram transport, which Leeds doesn't have.

Bigger arena + stadiums
Better football reputation

furthermore Manchester - Bigger city population, Bigger metro and Bigger Urban area population.

not much of a rivalry there. :lol: Manchester is clearly superior to Leeds.

[S.Yorks Capital]

Insignia you always seem to change the subject when you lose or are losing an argument. Why can't you jsut face it that Nottingham is not one of the big league citys.

[S.Yorks Capital]

btw that good website about Sheffield and one its devolpments is www.velocity-space.com

[Insignia]

use stats to prove Sheffield is ahead of Nottingham. Im tired of hearing the same thing over again.

[Leeds No.1]

Manchester and Leeds are pretty much equal that was established ages ago; if they weren't there wouldn't have been so many polls about them. Nottingham never was and never will be one of the major league cities; it might regenerate into a nice place but it comes nowhere near the importance of Birmingham, Leeds or Manchester and Sheffield has the potential to become a major financial centre with the infrastructure it has. Sheffield has grown and declined like most major cities; Nottingham hasnt, it needs to grow to a major city before it can get major importance. It has nowhere near the population of Sheffield whether its city or metro anyway. about 2-2.5m around Birmingham, Manchester, Leeds, 1.5-2m aroudn Sheffield and Liverpool? Around Nottingham? Not 1m which is self explanitory.

[Leeds No.1]

Yeah. You're problem is is that all the statistics go towards Sheffield. And if Leeds is brought into it Nottingham has no chance.

[Insignia]

Insignia you always seem to change the subject when you lose or are losing an argument. Why can't you jsut face it that Nottingham is not one of the big league citys.

All I know is that Zurich, my home City shits on all 3 of these Cities, Notts, Leeds and Sheffield FACT!. But since I lived in the UK for 14 years, (10 in Nottingham, 4 In London) I think Nottingham is better than Sheffield, OPINION!

But the only way to determine the superior City is by using Hard Facts and real statistics, government statistics, reliable information! ect.

[S.Yorks Capital]

As for Zurich it may be an important city but I have heard many times that it is as boring as fuck and if it is so great why don't you live there anymore?

[Insignia]

As for Zurich it may be an important city but I have heard many times that it is as boring as fuck and if it is so great why don't you live there anymore?

Watch the bad attitude 'boring as fuck' because the only thing boring as fuck is the wasteland you live in called Sheffield.

I don't live in Zurich because of many reasons. My family, I'm 3-quarter's English, business, lifestyle, ect. An immature boy like you surely doesn’t know anything, if you haven’t noticed Zurich is a World City, which Sheffield, or Leeds, and alas Nottingham will never be.

[S.Yorks Capital]

It is not a world class city as London or New York is. It is more on the scale of Prague, Osaka, Nairobi is and you need to watch your attitude. As for the wasteland bit Nottingham is the crappiest one of them all you should know that cos u live there and I wonder why?

[Leeds No.1]

Zurich isn't a world city... where do you get that idea from? It's not much different to Leeds in terms of its league.

[S.Yorks Capital]

look i have to go now for the night but if you want to continue this debate tomorrow then Im up for it.

[Insignia]

It is not a world class city as London or New York is.

No other City other than Chicago, Frankfurt, Hong Kong, Los Angeles, Milan, Singapore come anywhere close to Alpha World Cities.


It is more on the scale of Prague, Osaka, Nairobi

Sheffield is below them all though.

and you need to watch your attitude.

Not immature like you.

You came with Zurich being 'boring as fuck'. If you posted this in the world forums, you would clearly be laughed at for you sheer stupidity.


As for the wasteland bit Nottingham is the crappiest one of them all you should know that cos u live there and I wonder why?

Sheffield is before anything. It is the most hideous city with a population over 200k in the UK.


look i have to go now for the night but if you want to continue this debate tomorrow then Im up for it.

come back again, when you wash your cheeky mouth.

[Insignia]

Zurich isn't a world city... where do you get that idea from? It's not much different to Leeds in terms of its league.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_city

Zurich is in the Beta world cities group (9 Points), with San Francisco, Sydney and Toronto.

It is much ahead of Leeds, much more important in almost every thing you could imagine!

Leeds (1 Points!) with Minimal evidence as World City, I'm surprised it made it to the lists... but this just shows how far behind it is to Zurich and this also shows how stupid of you for claiming Zurich is in same association as Leeds.

[Leeds No.1]

Zurich is just another European city like Leeds is. And Sheffield has 500,000 people not 200,000.

[Karate_Kev]

Sheffield is more well known around UK, Europe and the world

that is utter bullshit.

Nottingham is probably the most famous british city behind london, manchester and liverpool, maybe edinburgh

Nottingham has legend Robin Hood. sheffield has? er... nothing

Nottingham Forest have two european cups, making it world famous. Sheffield has.... fuck all

practically every person you talk to outside britain has heard of nottingham. Nobody has heard of sheffield. Nobody.

its a shame, because i quite like sheffield, its people are nicer than nottingham, but more famous? come on, thats simply not true

the two cities are similar, but in terms of fame, sheffield outside of britain is on a par with leicester. its a big place with nothing interesting about it.

[Leeds No.1]

Sheffield is quite a famous city... for steel (obviously) and Nottingham is only famous for Robin Hood. And I'm pretty sure York, Blackpool, all the major cities, Dover come into the most famous places.

[Karate_Kev]

York and Dover maybe, but blackpool has no fame outside of britain whatsoever. To be honest, neither do leeds or birmingham. I know this having lived in spain for along time. Sheffield is famous for steel INSIDE britain. Have you heard of Albacete? no? well, in spain its famous for steel knives. It has no impact outside of the nation.

Nottingham forest have won the european cup twice. Alot of people know nottingham because of the football team.

[Leeds No.1]

Err actually I have heard of Albacete; but its steel isnt as famous as Sheffield which was the world's biggest steel producer.

[Karate_Kev]

nottinghams one of a strange group of cities that punch way way above their weight,

for example you could compare it with other very famous, but smallish cities like
Florence, Salzburg, Dresden, Krakow, Geneva, Nice

sheffield is not a city that punches above its weight and is in a group of fairly large no-name cities like

Valladolid, Angouleme, Kalaningrad, Plovdiv, Colombus, Dax, Trieste etc

[RSWB]

Well, I used to live in Bangkok and the people there usually have only heard of London, Edinburgh and maybe Liverpool and Manchester (because of the football teams)

[Insignia]

Sheffield is quite a famous city... for steel

Yeah Only in Sheffield but not Global famous. Idiot.

[gothicform]

gotta agree with kev about nottingham being a smalish city that people know - mostly because of robin hood. oxford is another smallish famous one. nottingham is much more famous than sheffield. thats about theonly thing it really beats sheffield with though, whatever else you compare the two with sheffield comes out on top because its bigger no matter how you draw the boundaries.

[Bachy Soletanche]

Does that mean Stratford (upon avon, not the other one) is better known than Manchester/Birmingham/Bristol?

[BeestonLad]

What exactly is Sheffield 'world renowned' for? steel? I doubt it, it might be famous in this country for it but hardly world famous

[S.Yorks Capital]

Nottingham always bangs on about being famous for Robin Hood's home city yet even that is debatable. Some experts say that he hailed from Loxley in Sheffield.

[BeestonLad]

If he even existed!

[gothicform]

doesnt matter though. people THINK he's from nottingham. they might know him as robin of loxley, but thats besides the point. it doesnt pop up much in the myths anymore than doncaster or newark.

[Vertighost]

Have a look at a history book about Sheffield. The majority of major innovations in the steel industry were made by Sheffielders. The Sheffield 'brand name' is so valued that by law any company name that features it can be blocked by the Cutlers Company of Hallamshire. In the Turin Olympics, 85% of the skaters were wearing blades made in Sheffield. 50% of the world's surgical blades are made in Sheffield.

[Furrydice]

Nottingham never was and never will be one of the major league cities;

Shit someone should have told the Government:

English Core Cities = Birmingham, Bristol, Leeds, Liverpool, Manchester, Newcastle, Nottingham, Sheffield

it might regenerate into a nice place but it comes nowhere near the importance of Birmingham, Leeds or Manchester

Correct Nottingham doesnt have the critical mass of those cities, its more on a par with Newcastle, Bristol and Sheffield

and Sheffield has the potential to become a major financial centre with the infrastructure it has.

Really? Leeds better watch out then. Nottingham already is a much bigger financial centre than Sheffield. It has the HQ of the Inland Revenue, the European HQ of Capital One Bank and the HQ of Experian, the credit referencing company that is one of the fastest growing businesses in the UK (value £6-10bn). Plus Nottingham is the regional capital of a much wealthier region than Yorkshire, in which Sheffield is only the second city.

Sheffield has grown and declined like most major cities; Nottingham hasnt, it needs to grow to a major city before it can get major importance.

Id rather live in a city that was growing and growing than one that had grown and declined. Important point though, Nottingham isnt the same type of old industrial city as Sheffield or Liverpool. Its circumstances are much more similar to somewhere like Bristol. IMO though its better to live in a city whose economy is based on finance, healthcare, bio-technology and leisure/tourism than.....errr steel.

It has nowhere near the population of Sheffield whether its city or metro anyway. about 2-2.5m around Birmingham, Manchester, Leeds, 1.5-2m aroudn Sheffield and Liverpool? Around Nottingham? Not 1m which is self explanitory.

Please no not this again. Leeds is bigger than Nottingham yes, but its also bigger than Sheffield. Nottingham and Sheffield are similar sized cities. Seriously have you ever been to Nottingham No. 1?

[Leeds No.1]

Bristol, Nottingham and Newcastle are hardly major cities even if they are core cities.

[Metrolink]

No1 - seriously, have you been to Nottingham?

It has similar (but less pronounced) council boundaries to Manchester.

From memory, the ONS figures from Nottingham's urban area are actually very close to those for Leeds' urban area believe it or not, and certainly much higher than Sheffield.

[Metrolink]

Compare Nottingham

http://neighbourhood.statistics.gov.uk/dissemination/NeighbourhoodProfileSearch.do?areaId=276829

with Sheffield

http://neighbourhood.statistics.gov.uk/dissemination/NeighbourhoodProfileSearch.do?areaId=276794

'Nottingham' loses lots of it's population due to how the political boundaries are drawn, however, Sheffield gains lots of population due to how it's boundaries are drawn.

[Furrydice]

Bristol, Nottingham and Newcastle are hardly major cities even if they are core cities.

So where are you placing Sheffield....with Bristol, Newcastle and Nottingham or with Birmingham, Manchester and Leeds?

For a direct comparison of Nottingham and Leeds see http://www.nottinghamcity.gov.uk/misrep.pdf

[Metrolink]

excellent article furry - as I said, the size of 'real' Nottingham is very similar to that of Leeds - both around 700k people.

[AndrewC]

Oh god, now its a threeway battle between Leeds, Sheffield And Nottingham? Right, if any of you put as much effort into promoting your cities and the northern regions in general as you did bickering like children perhaps we'd all be better off.

This argument was interesting once, now it is very boring - please stop, you're probably scaring other posters away :no:

[Vertighost]

I can't believe i'm sticking up for Leeds here but its urban area is over a million (although it includes Bradford and Wakefield). Sheffield boundry probably loses more than it gains in urban population. The huge rural area to the west has only 20 thou in it while the boundry with Derbyshire is packed with 'villages' just the other side of the boundry.

Nottingham is only part of the core city group because the council kicked up a fuss when the weren't included and it is not even equivalent to Bristol which is a historic city that was once the second largest in the country (before the industrial revolution).

[gothicform]

Sheffield boundry probably loses more than it gains in urban population. The huge rural area to the west has only 20 thou in it while the boundry with Derbyshire is packed with 'villages' just the other side of the boundry.
not only that but also it has rotherham six miles from the city centre! rotherham is about the same size as the city of nottingham.

[Insignia]

Nottingham is only part of the core city group because the council kicked up a fuss when the weren't included and it is not even equivalent to Bristol which is a historic city that was once the second largest in the country (before the industrial revolution).

Your post doesn't elaborate anything though. They had a fuss because they weren't included, well duh?

[Vertighost]

Your post doesn't elaborate anything though. They had a fuss because they weren't included, well duh?

My point was that Nottingham wasn't considered a core city by the government as claimed. It just forced it's way in.

[Insignia]

Compare Nottingham

http://neighbourhood.statistics.gov.uk/dissemination/NeighbourhoodProfileSearch.do?areaId=276829

with Sheffield

http://neighbourhood.statistics.gov.uk/dissemination/NeighbourhoodProfileSearch.do?areaId=276794

'Nottingham' loses lots of it's population due to how the political boundaries are drawn, however, Sheffield gains lots of population due to how it's boundaries are drawn.


Precisely. Nottingham is much more densely populated than Sheffield aswell.

Nottingham 3,687 people/km²

Sheffield 142 people/ sq. mi

The Sheffield boundary even includes a National Park. This doesn't give it a thoroughly complex Network for Transport. Nottingham is more compact than Sheffield, and though the political boundaries mess up it's physical population it is much better linked to its Suburban areas than Sheffield ever was. Sheffield is an example of a city with horrifying commuter links even within its own boundaries!

[Vertighost]

Sheffield has 1,402 people/sq. km. As i've explained the rural areas that make up 2 thirds of the city only have 20 thou in them. If Sheffield was a unitary authority like Nottingham it would have around 4,000 people/sq km.

What the hell do you mean that Sheffield doesn't have a complex transport network. As well as the road system which is of a similar standard to Nottingham (although inadequate for the job in a lot of places) and both urban Heavy and Light Rail Networks. Although it doesn't have any urban motorways (they were planned but the transport authority was too obsessed with bus subsidies) the M1 is heavily used by locals.

[Insignia]

show me Sheffield Transport Network system.

[Vertighost]

What?

[Insignia]

Sigh! a map of your towns Transport Network.

[Insignia]

Nottingham City Transport

http://www.nottinghamcity.gov.uk/www/maps/g_lib/All%20Operator.pdf

which has commuter links to Derby (Trent Barton, Red Arrow) City (Go2), Greater Nottingham (Rainbow), City (NET), and City Link (Link Network)

[Vertighost]

Can't help you there. Are you suggesting it doesn't exist unless there is a map of it. I take it you have one of Nottingham.

[Vertighost]

Fasinating but thats South Nottinghamshire not Nottingham. What exactly are you trying to prove here?

[Vertighost]

The buses: http://www.firstgroup.com/ukbus/yorkhumber/southyorkshire/map/overgroundshef.php

The Supertram: http://www.supertram.com/uploads/RouteMap.pdf

Haven't got a rail map but can tell you that it is made up of the central station and 5 suburban stations.

There is also a cable car system to be built connecting Shiregreen with the city centre.

[Insignia]

Fasinating but thats South Nottinghamshire not Nottingham. What exactly are you trying to prove here?

well, yeah Nottingham is in South Nottinghamshire if you look at the geographical location of Nottingham in Nottinghamshire.

and this Transport Network is administrated by local transport authority of Nottingham and an independent group called City of Nottingham Transport, and a merger of a Derby - Nottingham link which is called Trent Barton.

[Insignia]

Does this Bus network only cover 1/3rd of Sheffield? It appears not so complex if it were to serve all of Sheffield.

[Vertighost]

well, yeah Nottingham is in South Nottinghamshire if you look at the geographical location of Nottingham in Nottinghamshire.

and this Transport Network is administrated by local transport authority of Nottingham and an independent group called City of Nottingham Transport, and a merger of a Derby - Nottingham link which is called Trent Barton.

Yes but it covers far more than the city of Nottingham. Shall I get a map of South Yorkshire and call it Sheffield.

The Sheffield map does just cover the 1/3 urban area. Like I keep on telling you there's sod all except a load of Sheep outside of it. The map doesn't include any services to Stocksbridge (the only urban area other than Sheffield and probably the only other part served by buses) so it is definately urban area only.

The Nottingham network system is the one that doesn't seem that complex. Some of those routes are going out to Mansfield, Derby and Loughborough as well as the rest of South Nottinghamshire and some to Derbyshire. The number within Nottingham itself looks quite small. If the Sheffield map included routes to the surrounding area it would be far more complicated.

[Insignia]

Yes but it covers far more than the city of Nottingham.

http://www.nottinghamcity.gov.uk/misrep.pdf


Shall I get a map of South Yorkshire and call it Sheffield.

Bad way to illustrate. NCT only serves the Nottingham Urban Area and predominantly areas within the City boundaries.

Some of those routes are going out to Mansfield, Derby and Loughborough

They are called Link routes.

as well as the rest of South Nottinghamshire and some to Derbyshire.

....and this would be Greater Nottingham.

The Sheffield map does just cover the 1/3 urban area. Like I keep on telling you there's sod all except a load of Sheep outside of it.

AHA!

so if sheffield doesn't have a network extensive enough for its boundaries, you might aswell forget about counting Metro areas.

If the Sheffield map included routes to the surrounding area it would be far more complicated.

BUT WHY INCLUDE? If Sheffield doesn’t even have an extended Transport Network within its own Boundaries?

[Insignia]

2/3rds of what you see on the map is quite clearly Nottingham and a 3rd would be the urban area. There are no metro links except the links going to the Airport and Loughborough. Rainbow 3 should be Higher up with the Robin Hood Line Stop at Mansfield.

[jazz-sheff]

staistics don't make a city what it is, and mentioning 'government statistics' and 'reliable information' in the same sentence as you did earlier insignia only goes to show your naivety. Also the only thing this thread demonstrates effectively is what a complete utter cunt you are. Godbless x

[Vertighost]

BUT WHY INCLUDE? If Sheffield doesn’t even have an extended Transport Network within its own Boundaries?
BECAUSE THERE'S NOTHING BT A LOAD OF SHEEP OUT THERE. How many times do I have to repeat that. Theres no point in sending buses to areas which contain one man and his dog. The Sheffield urban area extends to the south and east but like Nottingham most of it is outside the boundry of the council. Don't bother using the government statisics either as they are clearly bollocks. Donny is usually considered part of the same urban area but isn't included by the gov.

Bad way to illustrate. NCT only serves the Nottingham Urban Area and predominantly areas within the City boundaries.
And a map of South Yorkshire would more accurately cover Sheffield and its urban area (still missing North Derbyshire villages though).

[Insignia]

^ ok mate. I'm now backing out of this Transport discussion.

I'm going to end this by admitting that I like Sheffields Tram System moreover the Routes. It is more extensive than NET and the routes Interchange very well.

[ranny fash]

rotherham is about the same size as the city of nottingham.

:rofl:

mate, how on earth have you become a moderator when you are capable of posting something like that?!?!

:dunno:

nottingham has a bigger dick than sheffield, apparently.

[Insignia]

Hehe. Very funny ^

good night! its bloody 1 am+

[Gareth]

Here's one for you all.

Is Leeds & Sheffield > Nottingham & Leicester & Derby?

;)

[Insignia]

Here's one for you all.

Is Leeds & Sheffield > Nottingham & Leicester & Derby?

;)

'>' could be used for anything. ;)

what I was thinking Sheffield & Leeds > Leicester, Derby & Nottingham for having a smaller Dick. :lol:

[Leeds No.1]

Maybe its time for Wakefield to come into the equation!

Second tier win for Wakey
WAKEFIELD has been named as Britain's best "second-tier" city for business in 2006 according to the Britain's Best Cities Survey.
Britain's Best Cities – formerly known as Best Locations for Business – is a biennial survey of chief executive and senior management of major companies located in the 28 biggest cities across the country.
The latest survey of over 5,000 business leaders was carried out between August and November 2005 and showed Wakefield leads Britain's "second-tier" cities by virtue of its strong workforce and business environment advantages.
It has beaten rivals including Bradford, Nottingham, Southampton and Aberdeen.
Mohan de Silva, chief executive of Wakefield District Development Agency, first, said: "This is a terrific result for Wakefield and really demonstrates the progress the city and the wider district is making.
Proof
"Our workforce and business environment have rightly been recognised for their high quality, and employers and investors of the calibre of Nationwide, Warburtons, Pioneer and The Highways Agency are proof of this."
He added: "This accolade demonstrates the impact that First has made in its marketing and promotion of the Wakefield District.
"Perceptions of the city and district are changing regionally and nationally, and this is a ringing endorsement for Wakefield that can help first's and its partners ongoing drive to attract further investment to the district."
The survey counts first tier cities as national and regional "capitals" such as Leeds, Newcastle, Glasgow, Cardiff and Belfast.
In Wakefield, 66 per cent of local respondents were either satisfied or very satisfied with their existing business locations, higher than local rivals Leeds and Bradford as well as larger rivals Birmingham, Bristol, Newcastle and Liverpool.
11 April 2006

[gothicform]

because the population of the metropolitan borough of rotherham according to the govt is 252,000, nottingham is 275,000. doncaster at 286,000 is bigger. lol. if you want to count greater metropolitan areas then nottingham goes up two thirds of a million but then doncaster and rotherham go up absorbing each other and sheffield. no matter how you count populations im afraid nottingham is smaller than sheffield whether its by conurbation, city boundaries or anything :) sheffield is a better comparison with the likes of tyneside (newcastle, sunderland and gateshead), both being multiple places all close enough to each other to be counted as one. sunderland is 282,000, newcastle is 269,000 and gateshead is 191,000.

[Insignia]

because the population of the metropolitan borough of rotherham according to the govt is 252,000, nottingham is 275,000. doncaster at 286,000 is bigger. lol. if you want to count greater metropolitan areas then nottingham goes up two thirds of a million but then doncaster and rotherham go up absorbing each other and sheffield. no matter how you count populations im afraid nottingham is smaller than sheffield whether its by conurbation, city boundaries or anything :) sheffield is a better comparison with the likes of tyneside (newcastle, sunderland and gateshead), both being multiple places all close enough to each other to be counted as one. sunderland is 282,000, newcastle is 269,000 and gateshead is 191,000.


BUT only 40% of the people in the urban area live in the City! The City has tightly drawn Boundaries!

You don’t see sheep, or farms or anything separating the urban area and the City!

Nottingham’s real population is 700K.

[Born in the North]

Maybe its time for Wakefield to come into the equation!

Second tier win for Wakey
WAKEFIELD has been named as Britain's best "second-tier" city for business in 2006 according to the Britain's Best Cities Survey.
Britain's Best Cities – formerly known as Best Locations for Business – is a biennial survey of chief executive and senior management of major companies located in the 28 biggest cities across the country.
The latest survey of over 5,000 business leaders was carried out between August and November 2005 and showed Wakefield leads Britain's "second-tier" cities by virtue of its strong workforce and business environment advantages.
It has beaten rivals including Bradford, Nottingham, Southampton and Aberdeen.
Mohan de Silva, chief executive of Wakefield District Development Agency, first, said: "This is a terrific result for Wakefield and really demonstrates the progress the city and the wider district is making.
Proof
"Our workforce and business environment have rightly been recognised for their high quality, and employers and investors of the calibre of Nationwide, Warburtons, Pioneer and The Highways Agency are proof of this."
He added: "This accolade demonstrates the impact that First has made in its marketing and promotion of the Wakefield District.
"Perceptions of the city and district are changing regionally and nationally, and this is a ringing endorsement for Wakefield that can help first's and its partners ongoing drive to attract further investment to the district."
The survey counts first tier cities as national and regional "capitals" such as Leeds, Newcastle, Glasgow, Cardiff and Belfast.
In Wakefield, 66 per cent of local respondents were either satisfied or very satisfied with their existing business locations, higher than local rivals Leeds and Bradford as well as larger rivals Birmingham, Bristol, Newcastle and Liverpool.

11 April 2006

Leeds No1, do we know which city ranked 1st in the UK ?

[Insignia]

Ah forget this stupid debate. I'm done running around in circles!

[gothicform]

and even if nottinghams population is 700,000 thats smaller than sheffield and rotherham alone. ive said before and ill say again, sheffields boundaries like manchesters slice the actual urban area into stupid portions meaning rotherham's centre is 6 miles from that of sheffield city centre. they are totally physically connected and counted as different entities. no matter how you count the population of sheffield and nottingham sheffield comes out ahead. sheffields boundaries have a large chunk of countryside to the west and then stop at the east when the conurbation stretches another good 15 miles past it. ive never seen anyone except on these boards claim nottingham is bigger than sheffield because it isnt no matter how, depending on how you count it it can actually be the fifth largest in the country rivalling glasgow for size.
i would say after london, manchester, birmingham, leeds, liverpool, sheffield...

[Insignia]

well actually Sheffield's population is 3rd Largest authority in the country but that’s beside the point. I'm not going to bother my time to debate Centre population, urban population and how far they stretch.

Nottingham is more densely populated than Sheffield, and that’s obvious because Sheffield is 4x the size and only 1/2x City population. Nottingham is smaller and it’s crowded within its tightly drawn boundaries and no matter what you say, Nottingham has excellent transportation systems within its boundaries and urban areas.

It's up to someone else to debate your post.

[gothicform]

i agree with everything you say! nottingham is ahead of sheffield in many things, but its not bigger.

[Leeds No.1]

Leeds No1, do we know which city ranked 1st in the UK ?
dunno. If I could be bothered, I would find out, but I can't. at the moment. I would guess first league it would be Leeds or Manchester... But I have no idea. I didn't even know there was a re-ranking until I came across this article.

[Born in the North]

dunno. If I could be bothered, I would find out, but I can't. at the moment. I would guess first league it would be Leeds or Manchester... But I have no idea. I didn't even know there was a re-ranking until I came across this article.

Hi ,yes your right , I got hold of a copy of the article in the Estates Gazette, it's in their.

1st- Manchester, 2nd - Glasgow & 3rd - Leeds.

Cheers!

[Metrolink]

No1 - thought this was of major importance to you.

Didn't you're signature have Leeds - UK Favorite city for ages?

Would have thought you'd be interested in making sure your facts are upt o date.

[Vertighost]

Nottingham is more densely populated than Sheffield, and that’s obvious because Sheffield is 4x the size and only 1/2x City population. Nottingham is smaller and it’s crowded within its tightly drawn boundaries and no matter what you say, Nottingham has excellent transportation systems within its boundaries and urban areas.

The reason the debate goes round in circles is because you ignore whats being said. I've already already explained to you that Sheffield is compacted into one third of the actual area making it more dense than Nottingham (and almost as dense as your being).

[Insignia]

The reason the debate goes round in circles is because you ignore whats being said. I've already already explained to you that Sheffield is compacted into one third of the actual area making it more dense than Nottingham (and almost as dense as your being).

SIGH! Your point taken. Sheffield is very Big! even Liverpool is 4x smaller than Sheffield, as are Manchester, Bristol and Newcastle.

[Leeds No.1]

UK's favourite city is different to Best City for Business, both of which were true in 2004 and part of 2005. It was 2nd favourite city for most of 2005 after London.

[Insignia]

:sly:

[Vertighost]

SIGH! Your point taken. Sheffield is very Big! even Liverpool is 4x smaller than Sheffield, as are Manchester, Bristol and Newcastle.

If you say so. Personally I wouldn't go that far.

[ranny fash]

^look. it's over. we've all agreed. shef, notts = similar size, shef is a bit bigger. (*cough*doncaster is not part of sheffield*cough*). end of.

[Furrydice]

Exactly i second that. The fact that this debate has gone on and on (and on and on and on) clearly shows both sides have strong arguments, so its obvious theres not much to choose between the two. Please lets stop now.

[The Oil]

No1 - thought this was of major importance to you.

Didn't you're signature have Leeds - UK Favorite city for ages?

Would have thought you'd be interested in making sure your facts are upt o date.

Not as important as it was to you. You're the one whose initial reaction to the news was to get on the Leeds forum and gloat!?!?

[Insignia]

Exactly i second that. The fact that this debate has gone on and on (and on and on and on) clearly shows both sides have strong arguments, so its obvious theres not much to choose between the two. Please lets stop now.

with some colossal developments due for 2011 Nottingham will be on a revolution IMO!

[Accura4Matalan]

Wasnt the big planned tower cancelled?

[Vertighost]

All cities have 'something big planned' in 20xx. The key is if it happens and if it's any good.

[Insignia]

the big planned tower wouldn’t be a huge improvement and I’m not 100% certain if it was cancelled, Accura. The lace market properties still have the development on their website.

Vertighost... good for Sheffield if its getting 100m+ Towers http://www.weforums.com/forums/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif, good for Sheffield if its getting whatever http://www.weforums.com/forums/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif

[Insignia]

I should add...

Good for Nottingham if its getting Tram network expanded, good for Nottingham if its getting a 25acre shopping centre in the City Centre, good for Nottingham if its getting expanded Highways, A453, RingRoad, M1. http://www.weforums.com/forums/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif

[Vertighost]

If your only concerned about Nottingham then why the fuck are you posting to Sheffield V Nottingham thread. Piss off back to your own threads and rave on about the 2011 developments there. Come back when Nottingham is in the same league as Sheffield.

[Leeds No.1]

If you havent noticed city centre shopping centres are bad not good. Aka a new shopping centre isn't something to boast about unless its something really good like The Light, Manchester Trinagle or The Bullring. Average shopping centres turn their backs on surroundings and are usually empty after a few years.

[Insignia]

because this is a Fucking! Nottingham thread, Idiot.

[Leeds No.1]

I never realised Sheffield was a suburb of Nottingham.. learn something new every day.

[Vertighost]

I never realised Sheffield was a suburb of Nottingham.. learn something new every day.

I think in the head of insignia it is. If only the damn government weren't casting such tight boundries. We would obviously all realise that this was true and bathe in the magnificance of the Nottingham super city. :rock:

[Insignia]

I never realised Sheffield was a suburb of Nottingham.. learn something new every day.
you should learn one thing! what an utter cunt you are.

[S.Yorks Capital]

Insignia, you need to watch your attitude using bad language like that. It is very immature as I remember you saying to me last week.

[Insignia]

But look at who started it.

[Accura4Matalan]

I should add...

Good for Nottingham if its getting Tram network expanded, good for Nottingham if its getting a 25acre shopping centre in the City Centre, good for Nottingham if its getting expanded Highways, A453, RingRoad, M1. http://www.weforums.com/forums/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif
For such a large city, Nottingham has really poor access to the motorway network.

[Insignia]

Don't lie man. The A52 in Nottingham is almost Motorway Capacity. It is really easy to access Nottingham from M1-25 and Derby. There's also the Ring Road Highway which links all major Highways A52, A610 (M1-26), A606, and A60 which all are about Motorway level.

The link to Nottingham from M1-24 is really bad because the A453 isn’t wide enough but as I said there are plans to duplicate the traffic lanes.

[Insignia]

Accura, you got a car right?

why don’t you make the drive to Nottingham. Ride on the A52 from M1-25 to Clifton where I live... I will serve you with Tee... and we have a nice discussion then.

[Accura4Matalan]

No thanks...

[Vertighost]

The A52 is nothing like motorway standard. It completely lacks motorway style graded junctions. I hated using it because people were constantly using the outside lane because they have a right hand exit at the next junction. It never goes any faster than the inside lane. It's an average urban dual carriageway.

[Insignia]

No thanks...

oh, Ok.

[AndrewC]

For such a large city, Nottingham has really poor access to the motorway network.


The M1 is practically embedded into Nottingham like a spoon in a poor childs forehead.

[ranny fash]

For such a large city, Nottingham has really poor access to the motorway network.

hmmmmmmm......if "poor" means "quite good"

[Accura4Matalan]

hmmmmmmm......if "poor" means "quite good"
You have one motorway...

[jafa]

hey y'all
i reckon nottingham has a good world image
-i roughly know where it is on the map
-its the home of robin hood lol
-ive heard the university is real good
-so many famous cricket games i remember played there

i have heard of sheffield but don't know anything about it

[Furrydice]

You have one motorway...

Ive heard you say this before Accura to suggest Nottingham is some remote, middle of nowhere place. At the end of the day it doesnt matter that it only has access to the M1. UPS and DHL both have their UK bases at Nottingham East Midlands Airport - proof if any were needed that the city has excellent national road links.

[Accura4Matalan]

Ive heard you say this before Accura to suggest Nottingham is some remote, middle of nowhere place. At the end of the day it doesnt matter that it only has access to the M1. UPS and DHL both have their UK bases at Nottingham East Midlands Airport - proof if any were needed that the city has excellent national road links.
The comment I made and was challenged was:
'Nottingham has poor access to the motorway network'
Not the entire road network and mumbo jumbo... and certainly not the skies :P
I was just pointing out that a city of Nottingham's size in the UK should have at least 3.

[ranny fash]

there's the a50 west to the M6. er, all other major motorways and cities are generally easily accessible from notts via the M1.

so whats the point in building more?

[Pobbie]

Yeah, unless you want to motorise the A52 east towards Skegness. :D

Nottingham is privileged enough to have the M1 (Sheffield too). The M18 can't be more than half an hour north either (I'd say the M69/M6 is even quicker to the south).

[Vertighost]

there's the a50 west to the M6. er, all other major motorways and cities are generally easily accessible from notts via the M1.

so whats the point in building more?

Not entirely true. Getting to Liverpool/Manchester means crossing the black hole of transport that is the Peak District. You have to use the A6 with it 40 mph speed limits which is a real pain in the arse. Sheffield connections aren't much better but there is talk of extending the M67 and making parts of the A628 dual carriageway.

[majormystery]

Not entirely true. Getting to Liverpool/Manchester means crossing the black hole of transport that is the Peak District. You have to use the A6 with it 40 mph speed limits which is a real pain in the arse. Sheffield connections aren't much better but there is talk of extending the M67 and making parts of the A628 dual carriageway.

M1 to M62 to M60 and there is Manchester.
Back onto M62 and there is Liverpool.

Snake pass/Woodhead has better views though.

[wwwsam]

access to sheffield is really awful from manchester, oldham and the north west. The M1 is the only motorway into sheffield and the A61 is the only dual carriageway.

[Vertighost]

access to sheffield is really awful from manchester, oldham and the north west. The M1 is the only motorway into sheffield and the A61 is the only dual carriageway.

What about the M18, A630, A57. The government truly cocked up links between Sheffield and Manchester though. They scraped the best railway in the country to make way for a motorway. Then worked out that they couldn't afford the Motorway. See:

http://www.pathetic.org.uk/motorways/m67-2.shtml

The only remnents are the patheticly short M67 and the bizare A616. Not even a dual carriageway but still has grade-seperated junctions are a clue as to its origional purpose.

[ranny fash]

Not entirely true. Getting to Liverpool/Manchester means crossing the black hole of transport that is the Peak District. You have to use the A6 with it 40 mph speed limits which is a real pain in the arse. Sheffield connections aren't much better but there is talk of extending the M67 and making parts of the A628 dual carriageway.


but we dont want to start plonking motorways all over the peak district do we? instead of using the A6, why not just cane it up the A50 and M6? pretty direct to either manc or liverpool. that way you avoid the hideous scenery offered by the peak district

[Pobbie]

Not entirely true. Getting to Liverpool/Manchester means crossing the black hole of transport that is the Peak District. You have to use the A6 with it 40 mph speed limits which is a real pain in the arse. Sheffield connections aren't much better but there is talk of extending the M67 and making parts of the A628 dual carriageway.
I've used the A50 through Staffordshire once before and I found it to be a most satisfactory route.

[Insignia]

What about the M18,

saying the M18 is part of Sheffield is like saying the M69 is part of Nottingham. The M69 joins the M1 and then stretches on to Nottingham. This is the same with the M18. Sheffield has Poor to Satisfactory road/motorway networks.

[Vertighost]

saying the M18 is part of Sheffield is like saying the M69 is part of Nottingham. The M69 joins the M1 and then stretches on to Nottingham. This is the same with the M18. Sheffield has Poor to Satisfactory road/motorway networks.

What the hell are you on about. The M69 connects with Leicester. The M18 starts on the Sheffield boundry. There is no comparison. If I were to cast my net that wide I would include the A1(M) and the M62 (along with the M180 and M181) while I was at it.

[Insignia]

what the hell are you bullshitting about? the M62 or the A1 stop nowhere near Sheffield. Asshole.

[Vertighost]

Are you on drugs? I only claim that the M1 and M18 connect with Sheffield but both the M62 and the A1(M) are a lot closer than the M69 is to Nottingham. Go sober up.

[RSWB]

Blimey this is a strange argument to say the least, are we going to be comparing the number of bus routes in each city or something next? :tongue2:

[ranny fash]

I've used the A50 through Staffordshire once before and I found it to be a most satisfactory route.

it is indeed a most satisfactory route

[Leeds No.1]

No motorways go into Nottingham or Sheffield. The M1 marks the eastern boundary of the city but doesn't actually go into the city and the M18 just touches Sheffield. Nottingham has no motorways except the M1 which doesnt go into Nottingham but just passes nearby.

[Pobbie]

Don't forget that the A1 isn't too far from Nottingham either.

At the end of the day, at least both Sheffield and Nottingham have better access to the motorway network than Mallaig.

[rusheyboy]

Just to correct a point made much earlier, "Nottingham" East Midlands Airport is in LEICESTERSHIRE. The powers that be decided to attach the name of a city to the airport to apparently boost its profile. There is no evidence that adding Nottingham to the name has made it any more popular. The airport does not belong to Nottingham and for Notts people to suddenly try and claim it as theirs is....weird. Also there is a sign in the airport itself that says welcome to Leicestershire. It will confuse those who have little idea about the local geography but shouldn't confuse the people in and around the east midlands.

[ROYAL BLUE]

It is closer to Nottingham then Leicester.

Also Birmingham international is in solihull, which is a town in its own right.

[houston_texan]

u people should come and visit TEXAS.......wild wild west yeeeeeeeeeeeeeeaaaaa

[S.Yorks Capital]

and you should come and visit Yorkshire- the UK's Texas.

[wwwsam]

I have been to Nottingham and Sheffield today where I think Nottingham was a tad more full of life and appealing.

[moseeds]

saying the M18 is part of Sheffield is like saying the M69 is part of Nottingham. The M69 joins the M1 and then stretches on to Nottingham. This is the same with the M18. Sheffield has Poor to Satisfactory road/motorway networks.

Oiiiiii!! You nicked our airport, don't be trying to thief our lovely stretch of racetrack as well...!! :P

[Insignia]

Just to correct a point made before…

OK Sheffield has beaten Nottingham to get a 30+ storey building, but the council has just released a document identifying 4 sites set to have high-rises built over the next few years.

I’m not denying that there are more Highrise Proposals in Sheffield but there are 4 sites set to have high-rises built over the next few years (according to the council docs)

for the record there are more Under Construction storeys in Nottingham.

Nottingham East Side - 18
Waterfront Plaza - 14
Litmus - 14
Marco Island - 14
Jurys Inn Hotel - 13
The Exchange - 11
Trinity Square - 11
Ice House - 10
St. Caths - 9, 7, 5


Sheffield has only..

V1 Velocity Living - 14
Metier Apartments - 14
St Pauls Place Block 1 – 7

[Vertighost]

When did construction on East Side start?

[Insignia]

...