Edsg25 has often said that NYC is more preoccupied with its standing in the hierarchy of cities than anyplace else. He said that the "world's greatest city" title is a critical part of the NY's identity and without it, people may be less willing to put up with the stresses of living there.

I believe that Edsg's statements about NYC can be applied to the United States. We constantly hear in the media and in this culture about how the US is the "greatest country in the world". Many Americans think this way and automatically assume that the US is the best place in the world to live.

I just got back from Japan and I have been the Scandinavia. I believe that the crime, poverty, educational system, and uncleanliness throughout the US is an embarrasment. No other first world country scores so poorly in so many quality of life indicators.

I wish Americans would aknowledge that we are not the greatest in everything and that we have a lot to learn from the rest of the world. My visit to Japan was a real eye-opener.

^^ I've only been to Canada and yet I feel like I can agree with you. I also had a friend (coworker) from Ireland who was totally unimpressed and moved back after less than 2 years.

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A4, we end up placing threads that ask "Is the Midwest in Decline?", "IS Califonria turning into a disaster?", "Is the bloom off the Sun Belt?", "can the northeast come back?" and never stop to question if all the regions are suffering and maybe losing competitve edge, what does that say about does that say about the nation as a whole?

By the way this nation treats the environment, growing gaps between rich and poor, international wars that will bankrupt our children and spread hatred for the US, disregard for infrastructure, obscene use of energy and resources, an educational system with too many children left behind, and more, it is clear that we are relying on the divine intervention of God (who, we are reminded in evangelical America, actually is on our side) to keep us on top forever in a world strewn with Romes and British Empires.

This must be great theatre for China and India.

Great idea for a thread, A4. I think many of us know as a fact that America is far from being the paradise that a lot of regular coffee-sipping gas guzzling Americans do. But then, we are in a position of understanding the precarious position that the American economy teeter-totters on without the balance of good, stable communities. Our misfortune lies in the fact that very few people will ever have the awakening that we've had.

America's greatest weakness, and probably the source of all of the problems you've observed, A4, is that our country has thrown most of its communities away. It has thrown away communities and replaced them with super-giant Walmarts and Targets, thus turning us into prisoners in a huge corporate marketing game. Our inter-relationships with the people around us have dwindled so badly that it's as if every single American is out there competing with everybody else.

I hope to some day live in a community where there is still a strong local economy and interdependence between neighbors, and I have faith that America still has such communities. On a recent trip through the upper peninsula of Michigan, I saw evidence of that. It is becoming exceedingly rare, though

AMERIKA SUKZ!!!!!

I think many people can acknowledge this, there are plenty of intellectuals and people in the educational system who know about all of those pitfalls you mention. But we need some sort of vision to change this. I mean, if the answer is with taxes and government, it's not going to be very popular, if you're a libertarian, you say limit the gov't influence and let's try to do this without them. Even politicians when they're not wrapped up in partisanship can acknowledge that we have work to do. I think we just need to do it though, I hate all this talk about it. I don't see a mindset change happening anytime soon, and there are some who are fine with the current state of things because they have the resources and intelligence.

But I do agree with you urban, it's gonna be hard, but I think the sense of community would help for things like education and poverty.

The US poverty rate has apparently risen 17% in the last 5 years. Shame. I'd say energy costs are one major burden on the poor. Heating costs, gasoline, electricity... they're all going up in price, yet the minimum wage goes down and the education system is hanging in the balance.

I do not know what to think about this thread.

I agree with it and I also disagree with it.

The USA has its share of a large uninformed/misinformed citizenry. But I would also like to point out that this nation nurtures the greatest and most critical minds in the world.

A great nation is defined by the complexity of its problems and the struggle to evercome them. By the nature of this country's diverse demographics and by reason of its enormous military and political power, it is only expected that the problems encountered are more difficult and the mistakes made in the name of the American (USA) people more glaring to the world at large.

Who would have it otherwise? To expect any less would be absolutely naive.

Other countries such as Japan also face enormous difficulties, but even their intrinsic complexities pale with what this country has to deal with.

A country is defined by its struggles as much as its successes. Count yourself privileged to be part of these struggles.

Anyone who looks at statistics and travels to other countries is liable to see that the disparities between American life and that of other first world nations is not all that far off. The US is at the top of some quality of life indicators and not at the top of others. World Development Indicators rank Switzerland, Sweden, Australia, Canada, Denmark, Japan and others consitently above the US as having a better quality of life. But it's not so clean cut as many might make it out to be. It's not all ignorant, SUV-driving conservatives claiming the US is the best while in reality it's not. But I certainly agree with you that the "greatest country in the world" title has a lot to do with it.

Unlike Switzerland, Sweden, Canada, Japan, etc. the United States has, for better or worse, taken a proactive foreign policy. Some call the US the "police of the world", but whatever you want to call it, this factor alone separates the US from other nations with high quality of life indices. Directly, it stretches the US budget thin, spreading funds across a wide range of branches by which other nations are less burdened. The United States is the greatest supporter of unilateral and multilateral international relations. As a result there is less money to spend on social programs, and in turn they suffer - education, health care, etc.

But this title also indirectly affects the US is other ways. By having such an aggressive foreign policy, the United States is also subject to a higher rate of immigration than places like Japan or Switzerland. This also puts pressure on US social programs for obvious reasons.

The United States population is also in a much different realm than these other nations. It's far larger than even massive countries like Canada and Australia, and far more stable than a country like Japan. Keep a watchful eye on Japanese quality of life if they don't fix their population problem in the next forty years.

I would argue that many nations benefit from the same foreign policies that have held back the United States. Whether you agree with US foreign policy or not, I believe that some nation(s) needs to take a leading role in influencing international politics; and while Canada, Australia, Japan, etc. have shied away from this role in favor of turning inward, the US has adopted this role and has possibly suffered for it.

Now this is not to say that the US couldn't benefit from driving hybrid cars or from not getting into wars that it doesn't need to be in, but there are more levels to the issue than simply the US being not as developed, but believing they are. More at work here than ignorance.

Anyone who looks at statistics and travels to other countries is liable to see that the disparities between American life and that of other first world nations is not all that far off. The US is at the top of some quality of life indicators and not at the top of others. World Development Indicators rank Switzerland, Sweden, Australia, Canada, Denmark, Japan and others consitently above the US as having a better quality of life. But it's not so clean cut as many might make it out to be. It's not all ignorant, SUV-driving conservatives claiming the US is the best while in reality it's not. But I certainly agree with you that the "greatest country in the world" title has a lot to do with it.

Unlike Switzerland, Sweden, Canada, Japan, etc. the United States has, for better or worse, taken a proactive foreign policy. Some call the US the "police of the world", but whatever you want to call it, this factor alone separates the US from other nations with high quality of life indices. Directly, it stretches the US budget thin, spreading funds across a wide range of branches by which other nations are less burdened. The United States is the greatest supporter of unilateral and multilateral international relations. As a result there is less money to spend on social programs, and in turn they suffer - education, health care, etc.

But this title also indirectly affects the US is other ways. By having such an aggressive foreign policy, the United States is also subject to a higher rate of immigration than places like Japan or Switzerland. This also puts pressure on US social programs for obvious reasons.

The United States population is also in a much different realm than these other nations. It's far larger than even massive countries like Canada and Australia, and far more stable than a country like Japan. Keep a watchful eye on Japanese quality of life if they don't fix their population problem in the next forty years.

I would argue that many nations benefit from the same foreign policies that have held back the United States. Whether you agree with US foreign policy or not, I believe that some nation(s) needs to take a leading role in influencing international politics; and while Canada, Australia, Japan, etc. have shied away from this role in favor of turning inward, the US has adopted this role and has possibly suffered for it.

Now this is not to say that the US couldn't benefit from driving hybrid cars or from not getting into wars that it doesn't need to be in, but there are more levels to the issue than simply the US being not as developed, but believing they are. More at work here than ignorance.


Very well articulated. My previous post attempts to point out similar things. But you do it more concretely.

Its true that the U.S. sucks compared to other western nations. However, which other of these western nations has a population of 300,000?



China 1,300.1
India 1,086.6
United States 293.6
Indonesia 218.7
Brazil 179.1
Pakistan 159.2
Russia 144.1
Bangladesh 141.3
Nigeria 137.3
Japan 127.6
Mexico 106.2
Philippines 83.7
Germany 82.6
Viet Nam 81.5
Egypt 73.4
Ethiopia 72.4
Turkey 71.3
Iran 67.4
Thailand 63.8
France 60.0



A bigger population means bigger problems. We also have had a bit of a more turbulent history--especially when it comes to race. We are also a very young nation. Were England, France, Germany, Japan, or Scandinavia always prosperous and pleasant? No. Who is to say America will not be the same way, when China or India becomes the new power of the world?

Also, dont overrate these places too much. France has a very high unemployment rate, plus it also has some nasty ghettos and race problems--as seen with the rioting two weeks ago. In America you can get better healthcare, quicker healthcare, more efficent healthcare...you just have to pay for the insurance. Japan is nice, but the culture is too different for most of us to be comfortable. Could you honestly live in a tiny space in which you paid many times more than what you would for a bigger apartment overlooking some landmark in NYC or Chicago? What about living right on top of each other with virtually no privacy? Plus, Japan has some cultural apsects that would offensive to Western women.

In conclusion, there is no perfect nation. America has its problems, but so does everyone else. We are pretty damn good considering our population and size. Russia and China are also huge, with many very poor regions, yet the U.S. does not. Our poor look like Donald Trump to the poor of the world. I love the U.S. and think it has the most to offer. What other country has as many different and unique cities as the U.S. anyway?

Very well articulated. My previous post attempts to point out similar things. But you do it more concretely.

Thanks. I appreciate the compliment. One more thing that I wanted to stress is that I'm not saying that the US is in some way better because it is able to deal with a mulitude of problems while at the same time taking up some noble cause, but I think the role that the US is playing is an inevitable one. I think you can make a very strong case that in today's world there needs to be a hegemon. However, hegemony has historically worked in cycles, and hegemons collapse - for similar reasons which currently strain the United States. Nevertheless, I think it is a long way away before anyone challenges the US in this role, even though we can currently see the cornerstones being put into place by China and India.

One mistake which the current US Administration is making however is trying too hard to solidy its role as a world hegemon as something permanent. In doing so they have offended many allies and burned many bridges, and if they fail, as have all other civilizations before them, they risk a crash and burn collapse. Power will almost inevitably transfer sometime in the future. The best thing the United States can do is place itself in a position for a peaceful transition, such as when Britain passed the torth to the US following the Second World War and was able to remain a formidable power itself. But in order to do so, Americans need to realize exacltly what A42251 asked them to at the start of this thread - realize we are not all-powerful,nor do we have to be. Just look at how happy Canada and Australia are :)

The US poverty rate has apparently risen 17% in the last 5 years. Shame. I'd say energy costs are one major burden on the poor. Heating costs, gasoline, electricity... they're all going up in price, yet the minimum wage goes down and the education system is hanging in the balance.

Didn't the minimum wage go up?


AMERIKA SUKZ!!!!!
Is that necessary?

It may seem bad that, the US score low on the test, but good for a huge country like the US! Just like what ReddAlert had said.

Didn't the minimum wage go up?

It dropped over the past 40 years, which is what I'm referring to. At current, one would have to have two or three minimum wage jobs to get above the poverty line. This is also an issue state by state. For example, in Maryland, the minimum is something like $5.15 an hour (which is also the national average), but the state government rejected a proposal a few months back that would lift the minimum wage. The national minimum was bumped up some in the mid-90s, but trickled back down over the years. Congress raised the debate again a month ago, but it ran into controversy. I don't know if anything was made out of it since.

[QUOTE]I just got back from Japan and I have been the Scandinavia. I believe that the crime, poverty, educational system, and uncleanliness throughout the US is an embarrasment. No other first world country scores so poorly in so many quality of life indicators.
I think this statement is highly misguided. Neither Japan nor Scandinavia could fit in, nor walk in, the shoes that the US has to.

I wish Americans would aknowledge that we are not the greatest in everything and that we have a lot to learn from the rest of the world. My visit to Japan was a real eye-opener.
Yeah, I bet the racial and ethnic diversity of the place was really envious..*rolls eyes*

^ yeah. i noticed that japan was like 99.99% japanese when i was there and i would imagine scandinavia is almost as close of homogenous society where as the US is quite diverse

Its true that the U.S. sucks compared to other western nations. However, which other of these western nations has a population of 300,000,000?



China 1,300.1
India 1,086.6
United States 293.6
Indonesia 218.7
Brazil 179.1
Pakistan 159.2
Russia 144.1
Bangladesh 141.3
Nigeria 137.3
Japan 127.6
Mexico 106.2
Philippines 83.7
Germany 82.6
Viet Nam 81.5
Egypt 73.4
Ethiopia 72.4
Turkey 71.3
Iran 67.4
Thailand 63.8
France 60.0



A bigger population means bigger problems. We also have had a bit of a more turbulent history--especially when it comes to race. We are also a very young nation. Were England, France, Germany, Japan, or Scandinavia always prosperous and pleasant? No. Who is to say America will not be the same way, when China or India becomes the new power of the world?

Also, dont overrate these places too much. France has a very high unemployment rate, plus it also has some nasty ghettos and race problems--as seen with the rioting two weeks ago. In America you can get better healthcare, quicker healthcare, more efficent healthcare...you just have to pay for the insurance. Japan is nice, but the culture is too different for most of us to be comfortable. Could you honestly live in a tiny space in which you paid many times more than what you would for a bigger apartment overlooking some landmark in NYC or Chicago? What about living right on top of each other with virtually no privacy? Plus, Japan has some cultural apsects that would offensive to Western women.

In conclusion, there is no perfect nation. America has its problems, but so does everyone else. We are pretty damn good considering our population and size. Russia and China are also huge, with many very poor regions, yet the U.S. does not. Our poor look like Donald Trump to the poor of the world. I love the U.S. and think it has the most to offer. What other country has as many different and unique cities as the U.S. anyway?
Thank you... :)

I was going to post a similar one, but you stole my words ;)


Officially my favorite post ever.

And on a side note:

Every country has issues. Ours get blown out of proportion (media wise) simply because were the only remaining Super Power in the world. And as some one has mentioned above (almost like the "America's Burden"). What if we just stoped caring for the rest of the world as we do, pouring Trillions into the World's economy, and instead, putting it all in ourselves? Backlash would be the worst it would ever be. And we would probibly get attacked by not only the Terrorist, but probibly by another country. If we took all our money, and spend it on our country, I think we would probibly score highest in all the tests.

Another thing,
try combining Japan, Germany and France into one country and watch the fireworks. Theyd be at each others throats just like we are.

Thank you... :)

I was going to post a similar one, but you stole my words ;)


Officially my favorite post ever.

thank you! :cheers:

Just be glad we live in a capitalist country. The socialist countries are at the other end of the quality of life spectrum. Economic regulation is the culprit for the lowering quality of life.

Just be glad we live in a capitalist country. The socialist countries are at the other end of the quality of life spectrum. Economic regulation is the culprit for the lowering quality of life.

Last time I checked, Scandinavia continually beats us on the HDI and they have a lot more regulation than we do.

Capitalism has its benefits but those 35 hour workweeks and six week vacations sound pretty nice to me!

I think your work and pay go hand in hand. Capitalism is good because it encourages people to go out and work hard and work smart, and when alot of people do that, everybody prospers.