continued from old thread.

First reply!!! :banana:

First reply!!! :banana:

And how truly insightful it was... :jk:

Regardless. I ordered the free DVD being offered on the University Club Tower website and it arrived tonight. Don't they screen who they send these things out to??? Watching it made me sad I was not rich.

But they actually show some quick shots of how it will look with Kilbourn Tower in the background. It really does look kind of neat looking at those two buildings next to each other with Regency Condos in the background. A new experience driving in front of those monsters for sure... Of course reality vs. picture - it remains to be seen.

I highly recommend you order it, it is free and they send you a reservation contract. More than I make in two years just for the down payment... :eek2:

Wow, I don't look on the forum for a couple days and waves of development news are posted. Awesome. Thanks for the contributions everyone.

ill start the first wave in this new thread *a few weeks ago in mke*
the wave after this almost took me out... :eek2:
http://img225.imageshack.us/img225/7247/mke23tk.jpg

That's awesome Jay! Here's a picture of a wave that crashed up against the breaker when I was out there about a month ago. I was out about a hundred feet or so and actually snapped the photo as the wave hit ... so it's tilted cause I was pulling it down to shelter my camera from the water. I got drenched!

http://img413.imageshack.us/img413/5853/wave4iy.jpg

anyone suprised how lit up Milwaukee seems to be now--aside from the Christmas decorations?

On me and BrewCrews latest jaunt (well, not latest--that one yesterday involved dead bodies, Milwaukee County Parks, and the Sheriffs) I noticed a bunch of new shit lit up.

1)Wisconsin Tower antenna changes color (Anyone know if this will stay?)
2)Northwestern Mutual Place Tower has its borders lit up with blue neon lights (dont appear to be Christmas ones)--ala that one in Dallas with the Green lights.
3)That bridgetower on McKinley by the Schlitz. It looks very cool at night.

Someone should get a couple of good shots of Milwaukee lit up at night with these kinds of things.

Did "Markitect" or "Avissers" write Whitneys article today on Park Lafayette?

I'm sure this has been brought up and I just forgot about it but browsing emporis I cam across Broadway-Wisconsin Tower..

is this still under development or is it dead? anyone know?

Did "Markitect" or "Avissers" write Whitneys article today on Park Lafayette?

I cannot take credit for that. So no. I believe, doesn't Whiteny write her own material??? I agree with everything she says though...

I'm sure this has been brought up and I just forgot about it but browsing emporis I cam across Broadway-Wisconsin Tower..

is this still under development or is it dead? anyone know?

Dead. For a long time now. There had since been another proposal in the Buisness Journal a while back, but nothing since then.

Did "Markitect" or "Avissers" write Whitneys article today on Park Lafayette?

good article.. i think i agree almost 100% with her on this one

[QUOTE=avissers]I cannot take credit for that. So no. I believe, doesn't Whiteny write her own material??? I agree with everything she says though...

I was obviously kidding. It just sounded as she took your points one by one.

Someone should get a couple of good shots of Milwaukee lit up at night with these kinds of things.

I took some pictures of the Milwaukee Historical Center at night last Friday. I also took some cool night shots from the riverwalk. I'll post them on here when I get some more time.

Before
http://graphics.jsonline.com/graphics/news/img/may05/tcurrent502.jpg
After
http://graphics.jsonline.com/graphics/news/img/may05/trender502.jpg
Look at the new green spaces, definitely open to development!
Nice space opened in that ugly loop on the upper right hand side







100 things to do near Milwaukee
By OMC Staff Writers
As much as you love Milwaukee, let's face it, sometimes you just gotta get away for a day or a weekend. You can't spend every waking moment shopping the Third Ward, bar hopping on Water Street or whiling away your day in a warm cafe.

Here are some ideas for enjoying Wisconsin (and some neighboring states) throughout the year. The only rule was that the journey has to be beyond a half hour, and within three hours from Milwaukee. Add your favorites using the talkback feature below.


Take the ferry (SS Badger or Lake Express) to Michigan
Visit House on the Rock
Check out the Baraboo Circus Museum
Tour Taliesin
Hike the Kettle Moraine
Descend into the Cave of the Mounds
Go back in time at Old World Wisconsin
Visit poet Lorine Niedecker's house in Fort Atkinson
Go to the bathroom at Kolher Art Museum in Sheboygan
Watch birds at the Bong Rec. Area
See the greats at Packers Hall of Fame
Camp at Peninsula State Park
Visit Rock Island
Eat fondue in New Glarus
Canoe the Wisconsin Dells
Raft on the Wolf River
Go outlet shopping in Johnson Creek, Racine
Take a road trip to Ikea in Schaumburg, Ill.
See a movie at the drive-in in Jefferson
Slather it on at the Mustard Museum in Mount Horeb
Shop Chicago's Miracle Mile
Cruise Lake Geneva
Get your kicks at The Shoe Box in Black Earth
Take the Leinie's Tour in Chippewa Falls
Check out the waterfalls in Marinette County
Climb Rib Mountain in Wausau
Ski Little Swiss
Tour Wollersheim Winery in Prairie du Sac
Get your beer on at Oktoberfest in La Crosse
Attend Cranberry Festival in Tomah
Scream at Great America
See great art at the Art Institute in Chicago
Visit the Museum of Contemporary Art in Chicago, too (it's free on Tuesdays)
Shop on State Street in Madison
Slurp ice cream on the Terrace on UW-Madison Union
Chat with the farmers at the Madison Farmer's Market
Munch on buttery ears at Sweet Corn Festival in Sun Prairie
Rev it up at the Iola Car Show!
Go to a concert at Alpine Valley
Get your sea legs at the Maritime Museum in Manitowoc
Marvel at the weird planes at the EAA Fly-in
Hike around the reservoir in Herrington Stare Park
Climb the bluffs at Devil's Lake
Eat apple pie in a bag at the Elegant Farmer
See a show at the Fireside Lounge
Go cherry picking in Door County
Go to Fuzzy Thurston's bar in Green Bay
See the goats on the roof at Al Johnson's in Door County
Climb Holy Hill
Relax in Sister Bay
Eat dinner at Don Q Inn -- in an old airplane -- in Dodgeville
Learn about cows and milk at Hoard Dairy Museum in Fort Atkinson
Imagine what things used to look like at Aztalan in Fort Atkinson
Buy a Garden Star lawn ornament in Kenosha
Check the time at the world's largest grandfather clock in Kewanee
Check out Tommy Bartlett's Robot World in Wisconsin Dells
Visit Frank Lloyd Wright's great SC Johnson building in Racine
Disappear into the Houdini Historical Center in Appleton
See a play under the stars at the American Players Theater in Spring Green
Tap into the world's largest six-pack in La Crosse
Have lunch at the Thorpedo in Thorpe
Stay at Monches Millhouse B&B in Monches
Shop for pottery in Cambridge
Go Amish in Amherst
Giggle and get shushed at the "silent" Clark's Place in Steven's Point
Drink at the Bayside Tavern in Fish Creek
Pile one on at the hamburger Hall of Fame in Seymour
Tip back a drink in the cocktail lounge at Mars Cheese Castle
Enroll for classes at University of Lawsonomy
Get all medieval at the Bristol Renaissance Faire
Find great bargains at Seven-Mile Fair!
Treat yourself to the spa at the Kohler Waters Spa
Go antiquing in Galena, Ill.
Meet the elves at Santa's Village in Dundee, Ill.
Do the Frank Lloyd Wright tour in Oak Park, Ill.
Ride the rides at Bay Beach Amusement Park in Green Bay
Do Halloween on State Street in Madison
Skateboard at the outdoor skate parks in Green Bay
Eat a sundae in Two Rivers, the birthplace of the sundae
Zoom into Slinger speedway
See the Temple Lipizzaner horses in Wadsworth, Ill.
Commune with nature at Nicolet National Forest
Tour the State Capitol Building in Madison
Check out the Road Kill Museum in Madison
Charter a fishing boat on Lake Michigan
Hear a concert under the stars at Ravinia
Pet the donkey at the Apple Holler in Sturtevant
Unearth some old treasures at Cedarburg's Maxwell Street Days
Golf at Blackwolf Run in Kohler
Tour the Cornish miners' cottages and shop for art in Mineral Point
See if anyone in Brooklyn, Wis. knows Spike Lee personally
Stargaze at Yerkes Observatory in Williams Bay
Ride Kenosha's downtown streetcar
Eat gelato on Main Street in Waukesha
See Chiwaukee Prairie, the most intact coastal wetland in southeastern Wisconsin, in Kenosha County
Check out how cheese is made at Cedar Grove cheese factory in Plain (north of Spring Green)
Visit Belleville -- UFO capital of the world -- for UFO Days each October
Ride the historic train at East Troy Electric Railroad Museum
See the acclaimed collection of decorative arts at Racine Art Museum
Cheer or jeer the birthplace of the Republican Party in Ripon

From Business Journal--lots of stuff

Info on Lake Point Tower!-Story (http://milwaukee.bizjournals.com/milwaukee/stories/2005/12/05/story3.html)

Milwaukee Mile major hotel/retail/resturant project-Story (http://milwaukee.bizjournals.com/milwaukee/stories/2005/12/05/story1.html)

3 million dollar makeover for Federal Building Lobby-Story (http://milwaukee.bizjournals.com/milwaukee/stories/2005/12/05/story5.html)

It's good to hear that there are things going on behind the scenes on Lake Point Tower. Let's keep our fingers crossed.

I know it was a Calatrava rip off...but what do you guys think of this rendering of the other Pier Wisconsin design? I think it looked really cool, very Star Wars/Final Fantasy 8 like.

http://img209.imageshack.us/img209/2376/pierbig06249dv.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

Yeah, that does look very Final Fantasy 8 like. Like Balamb Garden is it?

Yeah, that does look very Final Fantasy 8 like. Like Balamb Garden is it?

lol yeah exactly! Floating on the water and everything. :)

I don't know about that list of 100 things. No Appleton Performing Arts Center? No Fox River Mall? (The largest tourist attraction in the Fox Cities, as well as the second largest mall in WI). No College avenue night life in DT Appleton? The only thing I saw on that list from the Fox Cities was the Houdini Museum. Granted, it's no cosmopolitan, but Wisonsin's 3rd largest urban area deserves some mention IMHO. :runaway:

No College avenue night life in DT Appleton?

I've been there aaannnd...


... yeah


:runaway:

good news about lake point tower

You could replace it with a parking lot and a Port-A-Potty and get the same amount of use that it is getting now," the source

haha so very true.


...yeah your right appleton area was stripped really bad

Is anybody wondering why or is really annoyed that the US Bank Corporation is settling on only a 42 story Lake Point Tower? Which we all know is the number of floors in the US Bank Center. Good grief, why not 46, or 48, or even 52 stories tall, and 650 or 700 feet tall.

This LPT is suppose to consist of a 300 room (I'm guessing here) hotel, the top 20 floors of condos, over 250,000 square feet of office space, and probably underground parking. So that leaves 21 floors divided between the hotel and the commercial office space, with the first floor reserved for retail.

I would think that the architects, designers, and developers of the LPT would like it to be the new signature skyscraper in downtown Milwaukee for the early 21st Century. Why would they be satisfied with "copying" a 35 year old building (By the time the LPT was completed) that was somebody else's idea? I don't understand the conservatism of height in the initial proposal.

If I were the developer of the LPT, I would look to Minneapolis and Chicago for some serious inspirational ideas as far as building height. Maybe 60 stories is too much to ask for in this project. But why not 48 to 50 stories tall??? Anybody else kind of feel as I do?

^^definitely... they should push the envelope atleast a LITTLE

Is anybody wondering why or is really annoyed that the US Bank Corporation is settling on only a 42 story Lake Point Tower? Which we all know is the number of floors in the US Bank Center. Good grief, why not 46, or 48, or even 52 stories tall, and 650 or 700 feet tall.

This LPT is suppose to consist of a 300 room (I'm guessing here) hotel, the top 20 floors of condos, over 250,000 square feet of office space, and probably underground parking. So that leaves 21 floors divided between the hotel and the commercial office space, with the first floor reserved for retail.

I would think that the architects, designers, and developers of the LPT would like it to be the new signature skyscraper in downtown Milwaukee for the early 21st Century. Why would they be satisfied with "copying" a 35 year old building (By the time the LPT was completed) that was somebody else's idea? I don't understand the conservatism of height in the initial proposal.

If I were the developer of the LPT, I would look to Minneapolis and Chicago for some serious inspirational ideas as far as building height. Maybe 60 stories is too much to ask for in this project. But why not 48 to 50 stories tall??? Anybody else kind of feel as I do?

I couldn't agree with you more.

I'm very curious to see what Boris Gokhman pulls out of his hat for his condo project at the corner of N. Water St. and E. Brady St. He is definately against a rezoning proposal to limit buildings to 85 feet. So I suspect his condo project would be at least 10 stories tall.

I want a taller building in Milwaukee. I'd really like to see them give Wisconsin a new tallest, at least. I would like to see it go over 700, but that's not gonna happen...

Yeah for now, ill take the 42 story, but i agree, it would be nice to see us go higher.

Is anybody wondering why or is really annoyed that the US Bank Corporation is settling on only a 42 story Lake Point Tower? Which we all know is the number of floors in the US Bank Center. Good grief, why not 46, or 48, or even 52 stories tall, and 650 or 700 feet tall.

This LPT is suppose to consist of a 300 room (I'm guessing here) hotel, the top 20 floors of condos, over 250,000 square feet of office space, and probably underground parking. So that leaves 21 floors divided between the hotel and the commercial office space, with the first floor reserved for retail.

I would think that the architects, designers, and developers of the LPT would like it to be the new signature skyscraper in downtown Milwaukee for the early 21st Century. Why would they be satisfied with "copying" a 35 year old building (By the time the LPT was completed) that was somebody else's idea? I don't understand the conservatism of height in the initial proposal.

If I were the developer of the LPT, I would look to Minneapolis and Chicago for some serious inspirational ideas as far as building height. Maybe 60 stories is too much to ask for in this project. But why not 48 to 50 stories tall??? Anybody else kind of feel as I do?
I pretty much agree with everything you wrote except that when it comes to Minneapolis. May I remind you that the 3 tallest buildings in Minneapolis are all within a matter of 1 to 3 ft of each other. Basically, they did the exact thing you wish doesn't happen in Milwaukee.

US Bank Place....776ft
IDS Center........775ft
Wells fargo........774ft

Secondly, shortly after the first news reports of LPT came out, I forget who it was, but a fellow forumer here talked to one of the lead persons at US Bank and he told us that the most realistic plans for the new building wouldn't be in the height range of the present US Bank but shorter.

I might be more disappointed in the lack of height if the tower was going to be north of USBank, but if its to the south, i think a similar height would be fine. Besides, i don't think anyone should be disappointed about a possible 42 story tower on the lake.

Imagine how different the skyline will look from the lakefront if its built compared to 2 years ago. It would be the difference between night and day with LPT, UC, and KT.

Also, why haven't they released a rendering yet? Wouldn't that maybe spur some excitement and help land a tenant? It seems like of weird to hide it.

Lets just hope they secure a tenant and the design is good.

I pretty much agree with everything you wrote except that when it comes to Minneapolis. May I remind you that the 3 tallest buildings in Minneapolis are all within a matter of 1 to 3 ft of each other. Basically, they did the exact thing you wish doesn't happen in Milwaukee.

US Bank Place....776ft
IDS Center........775ft
Wells fargo........774ft

Paule, your point is well taken. However, according to the Emporis Website, the three tallest in Minneapolis are:

IDS Center............................................792ft.
225 South Sixth (formerly US Bancorp).......776ft.
Wells Fargo Center.................................774ft.

I know, I'm splitting hairs here, sorry. I guess I was looking to Minneapolis and Chicago for some examples, inspiration, and motivation in regards to height, and that the LPT shouldn't be "limited" to just 42 stories and 600 feet. Minneapolis has a damn impressive skyline for a city of 374,000 people, and I'm envious in a neighborly sort of way.

Secondly, shortly after the first news reports of LPT came out, I forget who it was, but a fellow forumer here talked to one of the lead persons at US Bank and he told us that the most realistic plans for the new building wouldn't be in the height range of the present US Bank but shorter.
There's that Milwaukee/Wisconsin conservative disposition rearing its ugly head again. Shorter!!! With 20 floors of condos, and over 250,000 square feet of commercial office space, and 1st floor retail. I guess that leaves a hotel with a limited room count. Shit! Why the hell even bother if you can't create a really fantastic project.

yea i think limiting the LPT to 42 is taking away from the effect it could have on the skyline and the city. I hope the project goes through and surprises us all by being taller in the end.

I would hope this project would be at least over 40 stories and become the tallest in Milwaukee. Its an easily attainable stat to be the tallest in Milwaukee, unlike places like Chicago, Seattle, Minneapolis, NYC, etc. I guess if I am a developer, I would be like, "Why the hell not, lets go for it?"

However, there may not be a demand to warrant such a tall structure. Hopefully the people not buying into KT will look to this project instead. Something will be built there. Its a great location thats currently filled with an underused building. Whether it be 50, 40, 30 stories...it has to be something architecturally beautiful in my opinion. Its in the best location--it overlooks Lake Michigan, the Art Museum, Summerfest, Hoan Bridge, and the Milwaukee skyline. It would be some cool shit if Calatrava designs its.

First tenant for River Renissance----

from Journal Sentinel...
----An upscale restaurant and tavern chain with 14 locations throughout the eastern United States is entering Milwaukee with plans to open at a new condominium development in the Historic Third Ward.

Red Star Tavern is scheduled to open in River Renaissance, which is under construction at the southeast corner of N. Water and E. Erie streets. Red Star will be the development's main retail tenant, occupying 7,000 square feet on the first floor, along with an outdoor patio and bar overlooking the Milwaukee River, Steve Stewart, a River Renaissance partner and president of Investors Equity LLC, said today.

This will be the first Wisconsin location for Red Star, which is operated by Restaurants-America Inc. in Illinois, Ohio, Virginia, Alabama, Indiana, Kentucky and Pennsylvania. It is scheduled to open in March, when condos within the eight-story, 80-unit River Renaissance will be ready for occupancy.

The Milwaukee location will have indoor seating capacity for 300, with seating for another 100 people on the patio. The menu will include steaks, seafood and signature martinis. Restaurants-America, based in Glenview, Ill., also operates the Bar Louie chain and other restaurants and taverns.

Paule, your point is well taken. However, according to the Emporis Website, the three tallest in Minneapolis are:

IDS Center............................................792ft.
225 South Sixth (formerly US Bancorp).......776ft.
Wells Fargo Center.................................774ft.

I know, I'm splitting hairs here, sorry. I guess I was looking to Minneapolis and Chicago for some examples, inspiration, and motivation in regards to height, and that the LPT shouldn't be "limited" to just 42 stories and 600 feet. Minneapolis has a damn impressive skyline for a city of 374,000 people, and I'm envious in a neighborly sort of way.
Don't get me wrong, I think the developer in Milwaukee would do very well by looking to Minneapolis for possible inspiration...I was just showing how ironic it was that you chose Minneapolis after giving your opinion on same height buildings.

It's possible that the extra height on the IDS that Emporis came up with included the two towers on top of the building. I'm not sure what the purpose of the towers are but they look like radio towers. My source's include: The World Almanac and Book of Facts (2002), skyscrapers.com, and worldtallest.com


There's that Milwaukee/Wisconsin conservative disposition rearing its ugly head again. Shorter!!! With 20 floors of condos, and over 250,000 square feet of commercial office space, and 1st floor retail. I guess that leaves a hotel with a limited room count. Shit! Why the hell even bother if you can't create a really fantastic project.
Tell me about it! I couldn't agree more. The 42 floor sister tower concept is just that, a concept, not a real proposal. It may be that someone at US bank will go ahead with that concept yet in the future but again, according the the fella that informed us about the lunch he had with the big guy, the sister tower concept is not likely to happen. All we can do is keep our fingers crossed and for them to pull their head out their ass, opps sorry! out of the sand. :)

I would hope this project would be at least over 40 stories and become the tallest in Milwaukee. Its an easily attainable stat to be the tallest in Milwaukee, unlike places like Chicago, Seattle, Minneapolis, NYC, etc. I guess if I am a developer, I would be like, "Why the hell not, lets go for it?"
Yeah, just like this Mr. Dudley dude here in Wausau! In fact those are the exact words he said he used, LOL!

Hell, if Wausau can do it Milwaukee surely can...?

http://www.boomspeed.com/paule17/Dudley_Building-1.jpg
The guy is so gungho that he wants this building put up and finished in 11 months so that they can get started on it's own sister tower right to the north.

I know it was a Calatrava rip off...but what do you guys think of this rendering of the other Pier Wisconsin design? I think it looked really cool, very Star Wars/Final Fantasy 8 like.

http://img209.imageshack.us/img209/2376/pierbig06249dv.jpg (http://imageshack.us)


Wow. I've never seen that thing. That looks great. What was that supposed to be for... is it where that aquarium is being built now where the summerfest grounds is? I would love to see something like that at the lakefront.

Wow. I've never seen that thing. That looks great. What was that supposed to be for... is it where that aquarium is being built now where the summerfest grounds is? I would love to see something like that at the lakefront.

this was the previous plan for the aquarium, thankfully it was shot down, because its quite gaudy and crappy, and is too similar in design to Milwaukee art museum extention,

its quite ugly,

With the Red Star Tavern moving into River Renaissance, the Third Ward section of the River Walk is well on its way to eclisping the Downtown section. You've already got Milwaukee Ale House, a few smaller restaurant patios, beautiful condos, and a really cool secion of RiverWalk in front of MIAD.

I'm looking forward to the day when you can walk from MAM south along the Lake, through Lakefront State Park, then along the Third Ward Riverwalk, then all the way up to Commerce Street.

Yeah, just like this Mr. Dudley dude here in Wausau! In fact those are the exact words he said he used, LOL!

Hell, if Wausau can do it Milwaukee surely can...?

http://www.boomspeed.com/paule17/Dudley_Building-1.jpg
The guy is so gungho that he wants this building put up and finished in 11 months so that they can get started on it's own sister tower right to the north.

I still dig that building! Its like 100 E Wisconsins little brother. A sister tower eh? About the same height?

this was the previous plan for the aquarium, thankfully it was shot down, because its quite gaudy and crappy, and is too similar in design to Milwaukee art museum extention,

its quite ugly,


Yea, but I like the rendering. Whether it translates into a good idea in real life is another issue.

With the Red Star Tavern moving into River Renaissance, the Third Ward section of the River Walk is well on its way to eclisping the Downtown section. You've already got Milwaukee Ale House, a few smaller restaurant patios, beautiful condos, and a really cool secion of RiverWalk in front of MIAD.

I'm looking forward to the day when you can walk from MAM south along the Lake, through Lakefront State Park, then along the Third Ward Riverwalk, then all the way up to Commerce Street.

Dont forget about that seafood place in the Harborfront Condos, as well as some more stuff there, at Marine Terminal Lofts, and perhaps this "Hansens Landing" I have been hearing about. Can anyone tell me what building this is?

When this all gets finished, our riverfront will be quite amazing...with the Riverwalk leading all the way to the Lakeshore St. Park, with a bridge to the Pier Wisconsin/Milwaukee Art Museum. I expect some of the little factories and warehouses around these parts to get redeveloped also. Hopefully more cool stuff like we have seen is on the horizon.

Yeah, just like this Mr. Dudley dude here in Wausau! In fact those are the exact words he said he used, LOL!

Hell, if Wausau can do it Milwaukee surely can...?

http://www.boomspeed.com/paule17/Dudley_Building-1.jpg
The guy is so gungho that he wants this building put up and finished in 11 months so that they can get started on it's own sister tower right to the north.

Not to mention Green Bay's new tallest with their Astor place
http://arashakbar.com/images/scrap/Astor_Place.jpg

and Oshkosh with their Five Rivers Resort.
http://www.fiveriversresort.com/images/elevation2.jpg

Yea, but I like the rendering. Whether it translates into a good idea in real life is another issue.

that rendering looked cool, however the Pier was not going to float in the Lake as the rendering seemed to show. It was going to be connected to land and not look as big or impressive as this.

Here is the one under construction...
http://img50.imageshack.us/img50/2961/view20from20dock8ye.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

Yeah, just like this Mr. Dudley dude here in Wausau! In fact those are the exact words he said he used, LOL!

Hell, if Wausau can do it Milwaukee surely can...?

http://www.boomspeed.com/paule17/Dudley_Building-1.jpg
The guy is so gungho that he wants this building put up and finished in 11 months so that they can get started on it's own sister tower right to the north.
Hey! Let us get Mr. Dudley Do-it-right in charge of the LPT project. I'd bet if he was in charge, it would be at least 50 stories tall.

Is anybody (Markitech, Avissers, ReddAlert, etc.) aware if developers and designers sneak a peek at this forum from time to time to see what the enthusiasts like ourselves have to say about potential and proposed projects? Would they even care or bother to make note of our opinions and thoughts? Does the Milwaukee Development Thread and others even have a tiny inkling of possible influence on their project thought process? Or does it just boil down to whether it is financially feasible. (Of course it's all about the greenback, duh!)

I guess I'm asking if this forum has any persuasive clout whatsoever. It would be nice to know that they check this Website out periodically. But maybe hell hasn't frozen over yet!

I'm looking forward to the day when you can walk from MAM south along the Lake, through Lakefront State Park, then along the Third Ward Riverwalk, then all the way up to Commerce Street.

That day isn't too far off... and what a good day it will be. :)

.

Is anybody (Markitech, Avissers, ReddAlert, etc.) aware if developers and designers sneak a peek at this forum from time to time to see what the enthusiasts like ourselves have to say about potential and proposed projects? Would they even care or bother to make note of our opinions and thoughts? Does the Milwaukee Development Thread and others even have a tiny inkling of possible influence on their project thought process? Or does it just boil down to whether it is financially feasible. (Of course it's all about the greenback, duh!)

I guess I'm asking if this forum has any persuasive clout whatsoever. It would be nice to know that they check this Website out periodically. But maybe hell hasn't frozen over yet!

no clue to be quite honest lol. We have some architects, city planners, and real estate people on the boards--but I am not aware of any major developers checking in. I told Whitney Gould that she should check out the site in an online chat not too long ago.

They would be wise to check this stuff out because we are taking an intrest in what they are doing. We may not be buying their condos, but we have some decent discussions on them. Its a major site, so I am sure that somebody has checked it once.

BTW--they also say Brad Pitt may be on here. He is a lover of architecture and cities like us. Maybe, he is checking up on here, listening to us.

I guess I'm asking if this forum has any persuasive clout whatsoever. It would be nice to know that they check this Website out periodically. But maybe hell hasn't frozen over yet!

Who's to say that someone here isn't exactly who they seem to be? Hmm.....

Hey! Let us get Mr. Dudley Do-it-right in charge of the LPT project. I'd bet if he was in charge, it would be at least 50 stories tall.

Is anybody (Markitech, Avissers, ReddAlert, etc.) aware if developers and designers sneak a peek at this forum from time to time to see what the enthusiasts like ourselves have to say about potential and proposed projects? Would they even care or bother to make note of our opinions and thoughts? Does the Milwaukee Development Thread and others even have a tiny inkling of possible influence on their project thought process? Or does it just boil down to whether it is financially feasible. (Of course it's all about the greenback, duh!)

I guess I'm asking if this forum has any persuasive clout whatsoever. It would be nice to know that they check this Website out periodically. But maybe hell hasn't frozen over yet!

Not sure. I would assume that developers may have an interest and may actually view this, but they wouldn't build a building that isn't profitable or add additional stories because a handful of forumers said so. I'm sure they are more interested in what the banks have to say as well as potential tenants. Sad, I know... But true.

Actually, a couple of the Green Bay alderman read through the Green Bay Development News Thread and were blown away by the interest out there before a large vote on the boardwalk up there. Who knows, that may help in a small way to influence some of their decisions???

Who's to say that someone here isn't exactly who they seem to be? Hmm.....
Okay MilwaukeeMark, time to fess-up, who are you, really, hmmm???

Dont forget about that seafood place in the Harborfront Condos, as well as some more stuff there, at Marine Terminal Lofts, and perhaps this "Hansens Landing" I have been hearing about. Can anyone tell me what building this is?


Hansen's Landing is the second phase of the Harborfront Condominiums--those new buildings on E. Erie Street down by the Marcus Amphitheater.

Okay MilwaukeeMark, time to fess-up, who are you, really, hmmm???

Haha, I was just jokin around. :) I'm just a student at UWM with a love for Milwaukee and architecture/urban planning.

Hansen's Landing is the second phase of the Harborfront Condominiums--those new buildings on E. Erie Street down by the Marcus Amphitheater.

ahhhh, thanks Markitect.

Haha, I was just jokin around. :) I'm just a student at UWM with a love for Milwaukee and architecture/urban planning.
Well since you were so honest, you're free to leave!!!

And I'm just a middle-aged semi-college educated working stiff, who's had a major enthusiasm for big skyscrapers, big freeways, big airports, big military stuff, big earth movers, etc. since I was a little kid. If it's a Miller Park, a Sears Tower, a Boeing 747, a USS Ronald Reagan, a M1-A2 Main Battle Tank, a huge LeTourneau dump truck, or a Chicago O'Hara, well then, I'm impressed all to hell. I love watching shows like Mega-Machines and Extreme Engineering on cable TV.

So when the World Trade Center was viciously destroyed on 9/11, not only was I terribly angry and sad at the senseless loss of innocent lives, I was terribly angry at the loss of the magnificent Twin Towers in Lower Manhatten. The void it left in Lower Manhatten is stunningly stark. And every time I see a current view of Lower Manhatten, it just makes me so pissed off.

And I don't care what anybody says, I believe the Sears Tower is taller than the Petronas Towers. Those goofy Petronas Towers somehow are considered taller because of their totally useless decorative spires on top. The top useable floor of the Sears Tower is way taller than the top useable floors of the Petronas Towers.

I'm not exactly sure what the international rules and standards are, but if it states that the spires count as legitimate useable portion of the structure, then there needs to be some serious revision of the criteria. IMHO!

So when the World Trade Center was viciously destroyed on 9/11, not only was I terribly angry and sad at the senseless loss of innocent lives, I was terribly angry at the loss of the magnificent Twin Towers in Lower Manhatten. The void it left in Lower Manhatten is stunningly stark. And every time I see a current view of Lower Manhatten, it just makes me so pissed off.

I've seen Ground Zero twice since September 11. When you gaze into a gigantic 16 acre hole, and see the tremendous damage to neighboring buildings, it really drives home what happened there on that day.

I'm an urban planner and I work in community development in Milwaukee, but I'm not involved in any of the developments we talk about here. I have friends that are though.

And I don't care what anybody says, I believe the Sears Tower is taller than the Petronas Towers. Those goofy Petronas Towers somehow are considered taller because of their totally useless decorative spires on top. The top useable floor of the Sears Tower is way taller than the top useable floors of the Petronas Towers.

I'm not exactly sure what the international rules and standards are, but if it states that the spires count as legitimate useable portion of the structure, then there needs to be some serious revision of the criteria. IMHO!

Amen! Sears tower is still #1 in my book too.

I've seen Ground Zero twice since September 11. When you gaze into a gigantic 16 acre hole, and see the tremendous damage to neighboring buildings, it really drives home what happened there on that day.

i couldn't have said it better myself... i was last there in august and there are several neighboring buildings that are still heavily damaged 4 years after the fact... there's one in particular, i believe it's the deutsche bank building, that is completely covered in tarps on 3 sides from top to bottom and still looks in pretty bad shape...

Here's a rendering of the aquaria in Pier Wisconsin:

http://www.pierwisconsin.org/exhibits/pics/aquariumlabels.jpg

I'm an urban planner and I work in community development in Milwaukee, but I'm not involved in any of the developments we talk about here. I have friends that are though.

Ahhh!, so you do have inside knowlege and perhaps, even influence of the second hand nature. That is if your friends ask you for your opinion on specific projects. That's really cool.

Here's a rendering of the aquaria in Pier Wisconsin...

That looks fantastic! Where did you find that rendering? Did they post it on pierwisconsin.org? I'm so excited about this project... I was just looking at the construction cam today!

Ahhh!, so you do have inside knowlege and perhaps, even influence of the second hand nature. That is if your friends ask you for your opinion on specific projects. That's really cool.

Trust me, I have very, very little influence. And I'm never privy to anything confidential. But I pick up tidbits about "what's going on."

you guys want a great story about the Pier Wisconsin, check out this link from the Shepard Express.

EDIT--it talks about all the exhibits in the latter part of the article.

Pier Wisconsin (http://www.shepherd-express.com/10_20_05/cover.htm)

I still dig that building! Its like 100 E Wisconsins little brother. A sister tower eh? About the same height?
That's funny, when I posted that pic yesterday I thought the same thing. I've seen several renderings of the building in the newspaper and all of them were slightly different then the next. That pic did make me think of the 100 East though.

As for a sister tower, Mr Dudley Do right says he wants to first see how successful the building is before he makes any definate plans but if the building is a success he will go through with building a sister tower. And just like there is a question as to what a sister tower to the US Bank building will look like so too do I have a question as to what Mr Dudley means by "sister tower".

Hey! Let us get Mr. Dudley Do-it-right in charge of the LPT project. I'd bet if he was in charge, it would be at least 50 stories tall.
The way this guy talks and does the walk I don't think that would be a bad idea!


Is anybody (Markitech, Avissers, ReddAlert, etc.) aware if developers and designers sneak a peek at this forum from time to time to see what the enthusiasts like ourselves have to say about potential and proposed projects?
Not that I know of in these Milwaukee threads but several months ago there was a developer in the Madison thread talking about his project.


Would they even care or bother to make note of our opinions and thoughts? Does the Milwaukee Development Thread and others even have a tiny inkling of possible influence on their project thought process? Or does it just boil down to whether it is financially feasible. (Of course it's all about the greenback, duh!)
I think that if they did visit these forums we'd find that they share many of our thoughts and opinions, with of course a little more know how and experience.

I think financial feasibility is the number one answer here. Take Mr Dudley again, he's an 81 year old self made multi millionair who has nothing better to do with his money and just happens to love his hometown of Wausau. If we up here in Wausau waited around for a company to bring forward plans of a building of this magnitude or for the city to get involved this Dudley Building simply wouldn't be happening. Why? because of money and who's going to pay.

Now if Green Bay had a Mr. Dudley that Astor Place would've been built years ago and if Milwaukee had a Mr. Dudley and or several of them this US Bank sister tower concept wouldn't be a concept but would be already standing.


I guess I'm asking if this forum has any persuasive clout whatsoever. It would be nice to know that they check this Website out periodically. But maybe hell hasn't frozen over yet!
I don't think "clout" is the right word to use but I think we would be able to provide them with a bit of inspiration, which leads us back to your very first thought on this....They wouldn't need to go to Minneapolis or Chicago for inspiration, they could just meet us here! :)

The Wall Street Journal ran a complimentary piece on Milwaukee in today's (Dec. 7) issue. The story, "A Midwestern City Makes a Comeback," can be found on page B6. A photo of the MAM's Quadracci Pavilion is accompanied by a caption proclaiming that "changes in Milwaukee have intrigued investors ...." The local VP of a large PA-based real estate firm is quoted as saying that Milwaukee's economy will generate "a demand for newer, modern and more-efficient buildings."

This kind of buzz in a national/international news outlet is just the thing that movers and shakers behind Ovation Plaza and other proposed developments are waiting for. How many condo sales do you think an article like this will help to close?

Many have asked if we could influence developers decisions - well here's a chance...

New Web site solicits ideas for Pabst project

A Web site that seeks suggestions to redevelop the former Pabst brewery complex has been created, a Milwaukee real estate investment and development firm said today.

The site, www.pabstproject.com, was created by Zilber Ltd., which announced in November that it has signed a four-month purchase option for the Pabst site. Zilber Ltd. will use that time to assemble financing for the project, and created a detailed plan for new housing, offices and shops at the 21-acre property in downtown’s northwest corner.

A previous plan for the site, an entertainment, retail, office and housing complex known as PabstCity, was dropped by development firm Wispark LLC after the Common Council in July defeated a proposal to provide $41 million in city financing for that $317 million project.

Website (http://www.pabstproject.com/)

Hey Paule, maybe u can run the idea past Mr. Dudley about doing some Milwaukee projects, and see what he says. Hehe.

The Wall Street Journal ran a complimentary piece on Milwaukee in today's (Dec. 7) issue. The story, "A Midwestern City Makes a Comeback," can be found on page B6. A photo of the MAM's Quadracci Pavilion is accompanied by a caption proclaiming that "changes in Milwaukee have intrigued investors ...." The local VP of a large PA-based real estate firm is quoted as saying that Milwaukee's economy will generate "a demand for newer, modern and more-efficient buildings."

This kind of buzz in a national/international news outlet is just the thing that movers and shakers behind Ovation Plaza and other proposed developments are waiting for. How many condo sales do you think an article like this will help to close?

Sideliner, is it possible for you to post the WSJ article here for us to read. I know the WSJ Website is limited to subscribers only, so if you can't, I totally understand.

Sideliner, is it possible for you to post the WSJ article here for us to read. I know the WSJ Website is limited to subscribers only, so if you can't, I totally understand.

Sorry, that was my original intention, but I couldn't get in without registering. Here is what the Small Business Times on-line report had to say about it:

_______________________________

Milwaukee's 'comeback' featured in Wall Street Journal
Originally published 2005-12-07 00:00:00
The economic rebirth of Milwaukee is featured in The Wall Street Journal today. In a report headlined, "A Midwestern City Makes a Comeback," the publication states, "Milwaukee, an industrial city known for making gritty icons such as Harley-Davidson motorcycles and Miller beer, as well as small engines and mining equipment, is working on a classic American comeback after a decades-long shakeout of its manufacturing sector." The report quotes John DiVall, vice president of the Milwaukee office of Malvern, Pa.-based Liberty Property Trust, as saying, "It's not just a rust-belt town anymore. The companies that are still around are pretty strong and there will be a demand for newer, modern and more efficient buildings." Liberty Property Trust, a real estate investment trust (REIT) owns about 1.9 million square feet of office, warehouse and flex space in the Milwaukee market. The Wall Street Journal report features a photograph of the Calatrava Addition to the Milwaukee Art Museum. The report notes that the Milwaukee market's office and warehouse vacancy rates have declined, while the median price of its homes increased to $219,700 in the third quarter of 2005 from $205,100 a year earlier. The Milwaukee Press Club will celebrate the 160th birthday of the city on Wednesday, Jan. 25, at 5:30 p.m., in the Hilton Milwaukee Center. The public is invited to attend the City Birthday Party, and individual and corporate sponsorships are still needed. For $60, individuals can sponsor the party. The sponsors' names will be on the party's official invitation and program. For additional information about the party, visit www.milwaukeepressclub.org. The party will feature the "Gems of Milwaukee." The public is invited to vote on the special things that make Milwaukee a great place to live, work and play at www.gemsofmilwaukee.com. The top 10 "Gems" will be announced at the City Birthday Party.

The Small Business Times article about the WSJ article makes it seem like the WSJ puts Milwauke in a very positive light. A new awareness of the coastal and national, and international media about Milwaukee is developing. With all of the positive articles written by reporters and columnists from newspapers and magazines from around the country and the world in the last few years, maybe Milwaukee will become a hot destination instead of "fly-over territory". Thank you Sideliner :)

I picked up today's copy of the Wall Street Journal, and the article isn't exactly glowing, but it is positive. It's written for investors, in investorese, and the gist of it basically is that Milwaukee is staging a turnaround, but there are still major challenges ahead. For instance, one cavaet the newspaper cited was Milwaukee's weak office market. Apparantly we're behind every other major city except Oklahoma City in terms of strength of office market. But we've added thousands of new residential units, and office vacancies have gone down in the last few years.

Those just glancing through the WSJ would read the headline "A Midwestern City Makes a Comeback," see the photo of MAM and read "Milwaukee" in the first sentence and think "cool." So that's a good thing.

Milwaukee
A Midwestern City
Makes a Comeback
December 7, 2005; Page B6

Milwaukee, an industrial city known for making gritty icons such as Harley-Davidson motorcycles and Miller beer, as well as small engines and mining equipment, is working on a classic American comeback after a decades-long shakeout of its manufacturing sector.

The region's real-estate market still lags behind much of the rest of the country, though Milwaukee's economy began to turn around last year. But some investors are encouraged by changes in what has been dubbed "the world's toolbox." Milwaukee, which grabbed headlines with Spanish architect Santiago Calatrava's winged pavilion at the Milwaukee Art Museum in 2001, has added thousands of new downtown condominiums since 2000.


Changes in Milwaukee have intrigued investors, where the Milwaukee Art Museum's Quadracci Pavilion, designed by Santiago Calatrava, has grabbed attention.


"It's not a rust-belt town anymore," said John DiVall, vice president in the Milwaukee office of Liberty Property Trust, which is based in Malvern, Pa., and owns about 1.9 million square feet of office, warehouse and flex space in the Milwaukee area. "The companies that are still around are pretty strong and there will be a demand for newer, modern and more-efficient buildings."

Milwaukee office properties have been selling at prices near the middle of the pack in the Midwest, where values are lower than much of the rest of the U.S., while the city's industrial sector has fared slightly better. Milwaukee offices sold for an average of $109 a square foot for the 12 months ended in September, above the $75 fetched in Cincinnati, but below Chicago's average of $162, according to Real Capital Analytics of New York.

While the warehouse market is strong, the office market is among the country's weakest, according to Property & Portfolio Research Inc., a real-estate research firm based in Boston. Even as Milwaukee's economy began to improve last year, the region's third-quarter office rental rates of $13.66 a square foot were the second-lowest of any major metro area in the country, after Oklahoma City, according to PPR.


Milwaukee's manufacturing base is home to many smaller companies that make a wide array of goods, which helped buffer the region from industry downturns, said Stephen Malpezzi, chairman of the real-estate department at the University of Wisconsin-Madison's School of Business. The region also has employers with heft. It is home to eight Fortune 500 company headquarters, more per capita than New York or Washington, including Northwestern Mutual Life Insurance Co., which employs about 4,600 people in the region, and Harley-Davidson Inc., with about 4,200 workers in the area.

Recent demographic and economic trends have been hard on the region. The Milwaukee area, located along Lake Michigan about 90 miles north of Chicago, saw its population rise just 0.3% to 1.5 million people for the 12 months ended in September, below the nation's 0.9% growth rate, according to Economy.com. Milwaukee's job growth of 0.6% for the 12 months ended in October also lagged behind the national rate of 1.4%, according to the Bureau of Labor Statistics.

With about 107.8 million square feet of inventory space, Milwaukee's warehouse sector is the 15th-largest of the U.S. markets tracked by PPR. The warehouse sector's vacancy rate of 6.7% is nearly three percentage points below the national average, and rents are on the rise, PPR said.



WSJ's Ken Brown looks at the real-estate market in Milwaukee.Many Milwaukee manufacturers still make and store products in smaller-scale facilities, unlike some areas of the country where new million-square-plus-foot distribution facilities are becoming the norm as the need to meet the growing volumes of imported goods grows.

Local demand comes from companies like Brady Corp., which manufactured labels that could withstand extreme temperatures in World War I aircraft and now makes high-tech parts for products such as cellphones. Brady is adding a 60,000-square-foot warehouse distribution facility to the back of its Milwaukee headquarters where it will store inventory, much of it made in the U.S., said Carole Herbstreit, a company spokeswoman.

Secondly, shortly after the first news reports of LPT came out, I forget who it was, but a fellow forumer here talked to one of the lead persons at US Bank and he told us that the most realistic plans for the new building wouldn't be in the height range of the present US Bank but shorter.

Yeah, that was at a lunch we had right after they went public with the tower plans. At that time anyway they were really just looking at a shorter building. Seems like that might have changed since then? I'm not usually a skeptic but just because I heard it from the horses mouth I am a bit doubtful yet. Here's to hoping though!

usbmfa beat me to the punch with regard to posting that article but I thought I'd go ahead and post the picture/graphic that accompanied the words.

http://img233.imageshack.us/img233/3520/mam6sz.jpg http://img233.imageshack.us/img233/6139/bythenumbers7cx.gif

I can't for the life of me think of all 8 fortune 500 companies. Would anyone care to help me on this so I may remain lazy and not utilize google? :)

Yeah, that was at a lunch we had right after they went public with the tower plans. At that time anyway they were really just looking at a shorter building. Seems like that might have changed since then? I'm not usually a skeptic but just because I heard it from the horses mouth I am a bit doubtful yet. Here's to hoping though!
Thanks Coldwake and I will raise a glass to hoping!

You need to do that lunch thing again with that guy and tell him that there's at least a half dozen guys here at SSC who want to have a word with him. We will inspire!

Fortune 500 Milwaukee Companies:
(dollar amounts are in billions of dollars)

79. Johnson Controls Inc., Milwaukee, 86, $22.646
115. Northwestern Mutual Life Insurance Co., Milwaukee, 113, $17.060
160. Manpower Inc., Milwaukee, 176, $12.185
355. Harley-Davidson Inc., Milwaukee, 392, $4.904
398. Roundy's, Milwaukee, 436, $4.383
421. Rockwell Automation Inc., Milwaukee, 409, $4.104
427. Wisconsin Energy Corp., Milwaukee, 426, $4.054

I can't for the life of me think of all 8 fortune 500 companies. Would anyone care to help me on this so I may remain lazy and not utilize google? :)
I don't know for sure either but I would think that Rockwell Int. would have to be one along with possibly Manpower. Would it be right to assume that the top 8 nongovernment employers in the area be the list we're looking for?

Fortune 500 Milwaukee Companies:
(dollar amounts are in billions of dollars)

79. Johnson Controls Inc., Milwaukee, 86, $22.646
115. Northwestern Mutual Life Insurance Co., Milwaukee, 113, $17.060
160. Manpower Inc., Milwaukee, 176, $12.185
355. Harley-Davidson Inc., Milwaukee, 392, $4.904
398. Roundy's, Milwaukee, 436, $4.383
421. Rockwell Automation Inc., Milwaukee, 409, $4.104
427. Wisconsin Energy Corp., Milwaukee, 426, $4.054
Ok, there we go but what about the 8th one? The WSJ stated 8 fortune 500 companies in the area.

The Godfrey & Kahn law firm recently decided to renew its lease at the Marshall & Ilsley Corp. headquarters, after giving strong consideration to relocating. That move would have created an anchor tenant for a new, multi-tenant downtown office tower. Meanwhile, Manpower Inc. is planning a move from Glendale to downtown, but that would be in a building developed just for Manpower

That is from an article at http://www.jsonline.com/bym/news/dec05/376134.asp

The last line is interesting.. did I miss Manpower's announcement of their final decision?

Ok, there we go but what about the 8th one? The WSJ stated 8 fortune 500 companies in the area.

Are they talking just Milwaukee or the region? It might include SC Johnson in Racine. I am not even sure if it is a Fortune 500 company.. but thats one possibility.

Mabey the 8th one could be Kohl's?

Mabey the 8th one could be Kohl's?
LOL, it looks like we all want to be lazy tonight. Yes Kohl's is possible and I was also thinking of that Medical supplies company that moved out to the Wauwautosa business park a few years ago. I just can't think of the name...I need to go to bed!

exit 320 they did mention region so it also could very well be SC Johnson.

^^ Oak creek is definately within the region, so it could be it. You're also right about that -- no better time to be lazy than 3 in the morning. :sleepy:

EDIT - I just looked on the list and Kohl's is at 189. I did not find SC Johnson in the fortune 500 list.

Kohl's Corp., Menomonee Falls, Wis., 204, $10.282

I pass by the Kohl's Corporate Headquarters on Silver Spring everyday on my way to work!(U.S. Cellular - a subsidiary of #480 TDS, Inc.:))

I did not find SC Johnson in the fortune 500 list.

SC Johnson wouldn't be on the list because they're a privately held company, if I'm not mistaken. I think the Fortune 500 consists of only publicly held corporations.

Are they talking just Milwaukee or the region? It might include SC Johnson in Racine. I am not even sure if it is a Fortune 500 company.. but thats one possibility.


SC Johnson not only is a fortune 500 company, but it is one of the largest fortune 500 companies in the country. I recall it being somewhere close to 14, but the exact number escapes me now.

SC Johnson wouldn't be on the list because they're a privately held company, if I'm not mistaken. I think the Fortune 500 consists of only publicly held corporations.


Maybe the list I saw just listed the largest companies, and not publically held ones.

SC Johnson not only is a fortune 500 company, but it is one of the largest fortune 500 companies in the country. I recall it being somewhere close to 14, but the exact number escapes me now.

I'm sorry, but the Fortune 500 is ranked by revenues earned during a year's time. And since SC Johnson is a private company and isn't required by SEC regulations to reveal financial data because it doesn't have publicly traded stock. Therefore, Fortune Magazine wouldn't have access to revenue figures in order to rank them.

"Bottom line", SC Johnson isn't on the Fortune 500 list. Are they a huge company, sure. But we really don't know how big, do we.

I was also thinking of that Medical supplies company that moved out to the Wauwautosa business park a few years ago. I just can't think of the name...I need to go to bed!

I believe you're thinking of GE Medical Systems. Which is a division of the General Electric Company. And they are headquartered in Fairfield, Conn. So they wouldn't be on the Wisconsin list of Fortune 500 companies.

Maybe Bucyrus or Joy Global, both large public companies with HQ in Milwaukee.

Second thought probably JOYG, 4.40Billion, HQ in 100 E Wisconsin

http://finance.yahoo.com/q/pr?s=JOYG

this isnt madison but 313. American Family Ins. Group, Madison, Wis., 323,
$5.895

and this isnt a gb but 395. WPS Resources Corp., Green Bay, Wis., 539, $4.403

Milwaukee ranks in top Fortune 1000, 500 companies
By OMC Staff Writers
The latest issue of Fortune magazine says Wisconsin has an impressive 25 "Fortune 1000" companies, only 36 less than Illinois' 61 and more than Iowa, Indiana, Arizona and several other states.

Johnson Controls, Manpower, Kohl's, Northwestern Mutual Life and American Family Insurance Group are among the companies on the Fortune 1000 list. For Milwaukee companies, Johnson Controls ranked first in the state and 71 over all.

Switching to the "Fortune 500," Fortune magazine ranked Milwaukee as America's number nine city when measuring the number of Fortune 500 headquarters inside its city limits - ahead of cities that will probably surprise you - like San Francisco and Seattle.

The Milwaukee- West Allis-Waukesha area ranked number five in the nation when measuring the number of Fortune 500 companies as a share of the population - just behind the number four Minneapolis-St. Paul region in Minnesota. (Number one is the Silicon Valley, no surprise, made up of San Jose-Sunnyvale-Santa Clara, CA) Milwaukee, with Northwestern Mutual, Johnson Controls, Manpower, Kohl's, Harley-Davison, Rockwell, Wisconsin Energy Corp., outranked its peer cities such as Cincinnati, Detroit, Cleveland and even Chicago.

The Fortune 500 is a ranking of the nation's largest companies compiled by Fortune magazine on the basis of 2003 revenue. Wal-Mart was number one on the Fortune 500 for the fourth straight year, with 2004 sales of more than $288 billion, up about 11 percent from 2003.

Private Companies in Wisconsin

Here are the Wisconsin companies on the list:

FORBES.COM <~~source

Company Name(business) Rank Revenues ($mil)
Menard (home improvement stores) 23 6,508
SC Johnson (home cleaning, storage supplies) 24 6,500
Roundy's (grocery stores, food wholesaler) 40 4,777
Kohler (plumbing fixtures, generators) 53 3,600
Schneider International (trucking, third-party logistics) 70 3,198
JohnsonDiversey (cleaning, sanitation supplies) 71 3,169
Schreiber Foods (packaged cheeses, frozen entrees) 91 2,700
Ashley Furniture Industries (furniture) 148 2,000
Quad Graphics (catalog, magazine printer) 170 1,807
F Dohmen (drug distributor, benefits management services) 178 1,734
US Oil (oil, auto parts distributor, convenience stores) 311 1,047

The Godfrey & Kahn law firm recently decided to renew its lease at the Marshall & Ilsley Corp. headquarters, after giving strong consideration to relocating. That move would have created an anchor tenant for a new, multi-tenant downtown office tower. Meanwhile, Manpower Inc. is planning a move from Glendale to downtown, but that would be in a building developed just for Manpower

That is from an article at http://www.jsonline.com/bym/news/dec05/376134.asp

The last line is interesting.. did I miss Manpower's announcement of their final decision?

A final decision has not been announced yet, but industry insiders say Manpower is leaning toward Downtown.

Private Companies in Wisconsin

Here are the Wisconsin companies on the list:

Company Name(business) Rank Revenues ($mil)
Menard (home improvement stores) 23 6,508
SC Johnson (home cleaning, storage supplies) 24 6,500
Roundy's (grocery stores, food wholesaler) 40 4,777
Kohler (plumbing fixtures, generators) 53 3,600
Schneider International (trucking, third-party logistics) 70 3,198
JohnsonDiversey (cleaning, sanitation supplies) 71 3,169
Schreiber Foods (packaged cheeses, frozen entrees) 91 2,700
Ashley Furniture Industries (furniture) 148 2,000
Quad Graphics (catalog, magazine printer) 170 1,807
F Dohmen (drug distributor, benefits management services) 178 1,734
US Oil (oil, auto parts distributor, convenience stores) 311 1,047

What list are these companies derived from UWMilwaukeeJay? Not the Fortune 500 or the Fortune 1000 is it? Apparently a list of privately held companies, but what is the source?

lol woops i meant to put forbes, it has nothing to do with forture 500, its the private companies

"Although these other skyscrapers were created with higher occupied floors, they are not considered as tall under the arcane rules used for rating the world's tallest, according to which architectural spires count towards building height, but antennas atop a building do not." I know, I don't know why in hell they can count the spire, but not an antenna. It should be the ceiling height of the highest usable floor or something like that. Who decides as to what is official rules. Anyways here is a pic of the Burj Dubai, soon to be world's tallest building in a few years. This picture was taken this month. It will be at least 50% taller then the Sear's Tower.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/5/5c/I3uj5s.jpg/448px-I3uj5s.jpg

Titletown, I do believe that the Taipei 101 building in Taipei, Taiwan is now the tallest building in the world. I was just saying that the Sears Tower sure as hell looks taller to me than the Petronas Towers in Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia.

Your point about the "arcane" rules regarding the total allowable measurement of a building's height is where the debate lies. Apparently, the rules are as such that if spires were originally designed as part of the overall structure of the building, then they count as part of the height of the building.

On the other hand, antennas which weren't/aren't part of the building's structure, but added later to the top of a building cannot be counted as part of the building's height. That is my best uneducated guess on what the rules are saying.

I just think that spires are a "cheap" way to gain height for heiight's sake.

...Milwaukee, with Northwestern Mutual, Johnson Controls, Manpower, Kohl's, Harley-Davison, Rockwell, Wisconsin Energy Corp., outranked its peer cities such as Cincinnati, Detroit, Cleveland and even Chicago.


:eek2: :shocked: :shocked: :omg:

A final decision has not been announced yet, but industry insiders say Manpower is leaning toward Downtown.

I know it is pretty much assumed they will move downtown.. its just the wording the writer uses makes it seem like its a definite.

Another high rise condo for east side on Propect Ave. This doesn't sound like a real proposal but in the concept stage yet.
http://www.jsonline.com/bym/news/dec05/376403.asp

holy shit, this tower is a cool one!!!!! I love it. Check out the link, go through the menu, then check out the Lake Bluff project.

Annex (http://www.annex5.net/#)

holy shit, this tower is a cool one!!!!! I love it. Check out the link, go through the menu, then check out the Lake Bluff project.

Annex (http://www.annex5.net/#)
It's certainly different, it's ok.

It's certainly different, it's ok.

oh you found it now? Its different, but awesome. I love it and this must be built. I dont want to see this be substituted for some conservative crap.

oh you found it now? Its different, but awesome. I love it and this must be built. I dont want to see this be substituted for some conservative crap.
LOL, yeah I found it.

Um, I take it you like it? JK, I like it too. it certainly is innovative for milwaukee.

if this gets the green light--the Milwaukee skyline will look fantastic from the Lakefront. A possible Lake Point Tower all the way down to 2 20 story Park Lafayette Towers will look pretty badass. Dont forget about that one tower proposed for that mansion property.

LOL, yeah I found it.

Um, I take it you like it? JK, I like it too. it certainly is innovative for milwaukee.

yeah, very. Looks like something from Europe. Buildings like these tend to not get built here.

if this gets the green light--the Milwaukee skyline will look fantastic from the Lakefront. A possible Lake Point Tower all the way down to 2 20 story Park Lafayette Towers will look pretty badass. Dont forget about that one tower proposed for that mansion property.
Where exactly on Prospect is this?

Where exactly on Prospect is this?

Well, its by Lake Bluff...so, right around here, in the middle of the gap in the skyline in this photo.

http://img222.imageshack.us/img222/8443/1111485zm.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

Certainly is different. I would be interested to see a more detailed rendering. But didn't the article say that mandel has not chosen an architecture firm for the "possible" project as of yet???

Where exactly on Prospect is this?

I believe it may be where Ogden dead-ends into Prospect on that open lot next to the path down to the trails. The design is definatly pushing the envelope for Milwaukee, it would be a nice thing to see added to our skyline.

if this gets the green light--the Milwaukee skyline will look fantastic from the Lakefront. A possible Lake Point Tower all the way down to 2 20 story Park Lafayette Towers will look pretty badass. Dont forget about that one tower proposed for that mansion property.

Are the two 20-story P. Lafayette Towers those super heavily opposed (because they're hideous) triangular buildings? Would those even be in the skyline?

I'd love to see the Milwaukee Skyline come together in that gap. The thing with the Milwaukee Skyline is it looks awful from certain angles and pretty good from others- like the one you posted. Kind of like Boston in the way it's skyline can look so awful from certain angles.

Anyway, my dreams would come true if we got the Lake Point Tower, the 2 20-story buildings, the new US Bank Building (hopefully at least a LITTLE bit taller), and this new weird project. Maybe it could help Milwaukee out of being next-to-last in office whatever...

[QUOTE=Badgers77]Are the two 20-story P. Lafayette Towers those super heavily opposed (because they're hideous) triangular buildings? Would those even be in the skyline?

of course. They wouldnt be in downtown Milwaukee, but apart of the entire skyline viewed from most of the lakefront. P.Lafayette arent hideous at all. They are just underwealming, unlike this rendering.

I'd love to see the Milwaukee Skyline come together in that gap. The thing with the Milwaukee Skyline is it looks awful from certain angles and pretty good from others- like the one you posted. Kind of like Boston in the way it's skyline can look so awful from certain angles.

really, the worst view of the Milwaukee skyline is from the expressway...you cant see half the buildings. Almost all the rest of the views are decent IMO.

if this gets the green light--the Milwaukee skyline will look fantastic from the Lakefront. A possible Lake Point Tower all the way down to 2 20 story Park Lafayette Towers will look pretty badass. Dont forget about that one tower proposed for that mansion property.

The Lake Point Tower = 42 stories (hopefully taller)
The University Club Tower = 36 stories
The Lake Bluff Tower = 30+ stories
The Park Lafayette Towers = Two 20 story buildings
New ManPower Headquarters = ??? stories

Not bad, not bad at all.
That Lake Bluff Tower rendering as it is now is pretty radical for Milwaukee.
And the mansion property tower? What was the concept for this location? I don't remember the details.

I'm sorry to ask this; sometimes posts get past me on this thread, but is there a rendering of Lake point tower?

The Lake Point Tower = 42 stories (hopefully taller)
The University Club Tower = 36 stories
The Lake Bluff Tower = 30+ stories
The Park Lafayette Towers = Two 20 story buildings
New ManPower Headquarters = ??? stories

Not bad, not bad at all.
That Lake Bluff Tower rendering as it is now is pretty radical for Milwaukee.
And the mansion property tower? What was the concept for this location? I don't remember the details.

some tower built behind this mansion on Prospect...dont know anymore than that.

The Manpower Headquarters hopefully will be a tower. There will also be that one Axle shop tower announced a few weeks ago. I sure hope one of these current projects is done by that MVRDV (some mixure of letters) that won the Marcus Prize.

I'm sorry to ask this; sometimes posts get past me on this thread, but is there a rendering of Lake point tower?

its on the link entitled Annex, I posted some responses back. Its on the website. You'll find it.

its on the link entitled Annex, I posted some responses back. Its on the website. You'll find it.


Is that not Lake Bluff Tower, as opposed to Lake Point Lower? I thought they are different projects.

Anyway, I also love Lake Bluff Tower. I think something so architectural daring like that would really have a major positive impact.

ReddAlert, the "annex" link was for the Lake Bluff Tower. I think rgolch was asking if there's a rendering for the Lake Point Tower (US Bank sister tower). if I'm not mistaken. And I myself have never seen any renderings or plans for the Lake Point Tower as of yet.

Sorry, rgolch. I didn't mean to intrude.

confusing eh? Lake Point, Lake Bluff Tower, Lake Bluff....almost as bad as the Riverbridge, RiverCrest, Riverthat, or Brewers Bluff, Brewers Hill, Brewers Point.....

Oh Lord, you got that right. What was the axle place thing again? If you don't mind me asking. The cool thing is that since we seem to get confused and lose tract of this and that proves that milwaukee is a "happpening" place. Don't you think?

Oh Lord, you got that right. What was the axle place thing again? If you don't mind me asking. The cool thing is that since we seem to get confused and lose tract of this and that proves that milwaukee is a "happpening" place. Don't you think?

lol yeah, I dont remember half the stuff going on here....which is a good thing! The best things happening now are when the Park East is developed and the Menonmonee Valley is redeveloped for more jobs.

Menonomee Valley, Park East, Third Ward, Walker's Point, Prospect Avenue/lake front area, Brewers Hill area, Pabst Brewery area, etc. Jeepers!!! It's kind of hard for me to get my head around all this stuff. I'm just a big fan of Milwaukee and Wisconsin, and I love this stuff. Am I bias, hell yeah!

I also think it will be really interesting to see what happens in Madison over the next 10 years if that stem cell research repository starts up.

And Green Bay, with that city's downtown finally rising from it's long slumber.

Now we just need for downtown Appleton to get off the stick.

1. No renderings have been released to the public for Lake Point Tower (US Bank twin/sister tower).

2. The Downtown Manpower building (if that option is chosen) probably won't be a tower because it would be a single-tenant building and the site is relatively large (7 acres south of Schlitz Park).

3. There isn't really any proposal at all yet for the Goll Mansion site on Prospect Avenue (developer hasn't figured out what, if anything, he's going to do there yet).

The Manpower building (if they chose Downtown--site just south of Schlitz Park), probably won't be a tower, but more of a low/mid-rise since they have a relatively large parcel to work with and it is a single-tenant building.

That's terrible news. If there was ever a great potential tenant for Milwaukee's next tower, Manpower was it.

Lake Bluff Tower? I must have been asleep when this was discussed. Can anyone tell me the scoop on this? THANKS!

Lake Bluff Tower? I must have been asleep when this was discussed. Can anyone tell me the scoop on this? THANKS!

Scroll back a few posts and actually READ the messages. THANKS!

That's terrible news. If there was ever a great potential tenant for Milwaukee's next tower, Manpower was it.

I'm not too upset. The way the site faces the River and sits just north of Downtown, if Manpower wanted to make a statement and have a very well designed signature building, the results could be suh-weeeeeeeeeeeet. Even if it's short.

Menonomee Valley, Park East, Third Ward, Walker's Point, Prospect Avenue/lake front area, Brewers Hill area, Pabst Brewery area, etc. Jeepers!!! It's kind of hard for me to get my head around all this stuff. I'm just a big fan of Milwaukee and Wisconsin, and I love this stuff. Am I bias, hell yeah!

I also think it will be really interesting to see what happens in Madison over the next 10 years if that stem cell research repository starts up.

And Green Bay, with that city's downtown finally rising from it's long slumber.

Now we just need for downtown Appleton to get off the stick.

That's what I'm saying! Why will I be moving to the one city in Wisconsin that is not seeing any new downtown action?!? I wish I could live in Green Bay and commute to Appleton, but that would be a bit of a stretch.

Certainly is different. I would be interested to see a more detailed rendering.

I don't know if anyone realized this but when you bring up the Lake Bluff Tower page, there is a small triangle in the lower left that lets you scroll over and see more renderings of the project. So there are 6 renderings in all, and the last two might give a better perspective of where the building is located on Prospect.

I don't know if anyone realized this but when you bring up the Lake Bluff Tower page, there is a small triangle in the lower left that lets you scroll over and see more renderings of the project. So there are 6 renderings in all, and the last two might give a better perspective of where the building is located on Prospect.

Thanks, now I can see just how awesome this thing would be. This design is so different from anything seen in Milwaukee thus far ... the design alone would generate enough buzz to move a good number of units. On the off chance someone from Mandel is reading this -- go forward with this project! The design is so great it could be a real jewel in Mandel's crown, and real achievement for the city as a whole.

Everybody seems to reference to the Lake Bluff Tower and how nice it looks. Where is the rendering? Can someone post or point to where I can see it please.

Click here, then look under "Projects" for Lake Bluff Tower (http://www.annex5.net) (it's on a Flash slideshow thingine, so can't post the model shots/renderings)

Keep in mind this is only one design proposal--there were other [unmentoned] architecture firms that were asked to provide possible [unreleased] designs as well. Mandel has not yet selected a design to go with, nor has he decided whether to even build anything at all yet.

Click here, then look under "Projects" for Lake Bluff Tower (http://www.annex5.net) (it's on a Flash slideshow thingine, so can't post the model shots/renderings)

Keep in mind this is only one design proposal--there were other [unmentoned] architecture firms that were asked to provide possible [unreleased] designs as well. Mandel has not yet selected a design to go with, nor has he decided whether to even build anything at all yet.

yeah, I just hope he doesnt decide to save a couple bucks by bringing out some more conservative shit. Then again, the new lakefront buildings havent disapointed me...I hardly think this will be a bomb. Mandel is pretty cool with nice designs.


Going on what unseen was saying about Manpower. I also think this could be a cool building, given its location--whether a tower or a low/mid rise. I just hope with the available space that they dont opt for some suburban office building look. However, whats more important--lots of jobs downtown or a less stellar building? I choose the first, but why cant we have both?

Ok. This is a rumor. But the reason there may not be a rendering, and the reason that the building to the south is apartments that was put up just a short time ago and built, lets say, fast... was that this could be a bigger project.

Again, just a rumor. I don't want the apartment dwellers in the building to the south start freaking out on a rumor, but.....

Lets see what happens!

Ok. This is a rumor. But the reason there may not be a rendering, and the reason that the building to the south is apartments that was put up just a short time ago and built, lets say, fast... was that this could be a bigger project.

Again, just a rumor. I don't want the apartment dwellers in the building to the south start freaking out on a rumor, but.....

Lets see what happens!

I could dig it! How do you feel about this particular proposal on Prospect? I hope you dont oppose such a cool building. :)

Also, I would take that design of LBT any day over the 313 unit office park called Park Lafayette. I have to stare at it.

Also, I would take that design of LBT any day over the 313 unit office park called Park Lafayette. I have to stare at it.

well, in that Gould article, it did mention that Greenstreet and the city would work with the developers and architect over the design still. Who knows if this will be a current design? To be quite honest, I think the worst part of PL would be looking at it from the front all day...2 massive glass triangles. The back side towards Prospect is pretty cool looking IMO.

Thats my view from the front. And as I wrote Whitney, when did ANY building improve. As an example, small but important, look at the windows proposed on the Kenilworth building (facing prospect) renderings compared to what they are actually doing.

When you start to build you start to cut corners. I went thru this even with MAM

Going on what unseen was saying about Manpower. I also think this could be a cool building, given its location--whether a tower or a low/mid rise. I just hope with the available space that they dont opt for some suburban office building look. However, whats more important--lots of jobs downtown or a less stellar building? I choose the first, but why cant we have both?

The Milwaukee Journal Sentinel article from back in October states that Manpower should be finalizing and annoucing their decision in December.

http://www.jsonline.com/bym/news/oct05/364105.asp

A few points of the article:
Likely to choose the area just south of Schlitz Park.
Will bring 850 jobs downtown.
They need 260,000 square feet of space.

I'm guessing here, but with a need for at least 260,000 sq. ft., you think their new headquarters would be of the mid-rise size.

The Milwaukee Journal Sentinel article from back in October states that Manpower should be finalizing and annoucing their decision in December.

http://www.jsonline.com/bym/news/oct05/364105.asp

A few points of the article:
Likely to choose the area just south of Schlitz Park.
Will bring 850 jobs downtown.
They need 260,000 square feet of space.

I'm guessing here, but with a need for at least 260,000 sq. ft., you think their new headquarters would be of the mid-rise size.

Well...the Downtown site is 7 acres to work with.

1 acre = 43,560 sqft

43,560 * 7 = 304,920 sqft

In theory, they could build a single-story building and still have space left over.

Of course, that's not really a design option, since they also require parking, which wouldn't fit in the remaining space. Manpower definitely has to have a multi-level parking garage (the construction of which would rely on a tax increment financing package from the City) on the site to accommodate its employees.

So how tall the Manpower building would be depends on how the parking and any other possible open spaces are incorporated into the overall design. An office building on top of a multi-level parking garage would probably result in a shorter design, because the office and parking can be spread out over a greater portion of the site. From a construction standpoint, this would also be the least expensive to build. An office building and parking garage in a side-by-side arrangement would probably result in the tallest configuration because the office and parking would be spread out over smaller portions of the site. From a construction standpoint, this would be the most expensive to build.

Whatever the case, 7 acres is a lot of room to work with in a Downtown area (consider that the rectangular blocks in the Park East corridor are each about 2 to 2.5 acres in area).

^I am not too keen on that area...but will Manpower be directly on the river?

^I am not too keen on that area...but will Manpower be directly on the river?

The development team for Manpower's Downtown proposal is being led by Gary Grunau. According to media reports, the site is at the southeast corner of MLK Drive and Cherry Street. Grunau owns the site, which is currently a surface parking lot and an empty gravel lot along the river. He also owns the Schlitz Park development just up the street, which includes a large surface parking lot at the northeast corner of MLK Drive and Cherry Street. Not to mention, he also owns the Time Warner building (old power plant renovated into office space a few years ago) immediately south of the Manpower site.

After having done some quick calculating, I suspect the 7 acres for the Manpower project might actually include those lots on the Schlitz property as well, since they're owned by Grunau anyway, though it hasn't been mentioned in any articles so far (because without those lots, there's less than 7 acres).

Will they build directly on the river? That depends on how the building(s) are situated upon the site. No matter how the site is developed, a RiverWalk segment is mandatory. With the RiverWalk, it's also possible a larger open space park/plaza area couple be part of the design, with the building set back away from the river a bit. As for what will face the river--an office building, a parking garage, a little of both...we won't know until we find out, there are all kinds of possibilities, so we'll just have to wait and see.

The rebirth of Avenues West, a neighborhood on the Near West Side, continues to make great strides. The once fashionable neighborhood fell on hard times in recent decades, as bustling business districts eroded, historic mansions were subdivided into apartments, Victorian-era houses fell into disrepair, and crimes of the worst kind infiltrated the streets. In recent years, however, the neighborhood has been in the process of a major turn-around thanks to area institutions like Marquette University, the Department of City Development, and an army of developers and residents for a variety of different projects, large and small.

The latest new proposal is from Weas Development, which plans to build seven rowhouse-condos in the heart of the Avenues West neighborhood, at W. Wells and N. 22nd Streets. Each of the rowhouses, measuring 1,365 squate feet, will feature rooftop decks and attached garages--with a preliminary asking price of $250,000. The project was designed by Nagel-Tobiczyk Architects, a small local firm.

http://www.nltk-architects.com/Images/22ndstreet.jpg
^ The proposed rowhouses are styled with a nice, clean, modern look.

http://www.nltk-architects.com/Images/22ndstreetpersp.jpg
^ A view from the street.

Here are just some of the other projects around Avenues West , in various stages of completion (by no means an all-inclusive list, there are many others):

- Historic Lofts on Kilbourn - a former hospital converted into 99 apartments

- Marquette University - renovated campus buildings, new campus buildings (School of Dentistry, Raynor Library, and Al McGuire Center), streetscaping, various nearby aparmtent/retail developments

- 2040 Lofts - a former office building converted into 132 apartments for off-campus student housing

- WestPointe Condominiums - a former apartment building converted into 14 condos plus street-level retail space

- Milwaukee Center for Independence - new headquarters for non-profit group that helps people with disabilities

- Amabassador Hotel - renovation of flophouse into a luxury hotel (see previous from a couple weeks ago about this project)

- Mixed-use proposal for Wisconsin Avenue and 27th Street - new construction featuring 70 apartments, 30 condos, and up to 15,000 sqft of retail space

More details in this article from the Journal Sentinel: Avenues West opening up - Row-house condos make latest project (http://www.jsonline.com/bym/news/dec05/376724.asp)

ooooh those are nice. If those fill in quick, they should build some more rows in the area.

I am liking what I am seeing in this area. I am excited to see what this 27th st. development will be like. Wisconsin Ave. is probally one of the most interesting streets in the city, unfortunaly it has a bad rap. Downtown area will be pretty cool once this area takes off and Brewers Hill/North Ave/Bronzeville, MLK Drive start to improve even more.

Here's an article i found today

The high-rise guy
Developer sets his sights on the east side
By TOM DAYKIN
tdaykin@journalsentinel.com
Posted: Dec. 11, 2005

Warren Barr had worked for one of Chicago's largest development firms for 15 years before deciding to launch his own company in 1998.

Warren Barr


Photo/Michael Sears

Warren Barr, who has developed condos in Chicago, now has turned his sights to Milwaukee. Barr, shown at the Plaza East Office Center overlooking downtown, is the man behind the proposed Park Lafayette project. The Common Council takes up the issue Tuesday.

Quotable
My intent is to have a significant presence.

- Warren Barr,
developer seeking to enter the Milwaukee high-rise market

Recent Coverage
12/4/05: Gould: Park Lafayette condos show only the potential to be engaging
11/28/05: City planners approve east side condo project
10/5/05: East side condos would cater to untapped market

Advertisement

Within five years, Barr and his partner had created six housing developments, most of them in Chicago's South Loop area, totaling more than 900 condominiums and townhomes.

Barr has since formed another company that continues to develop condo high-rises in downtown Chicago. But he's also focusing on Milwaukee, where his proposed high-rise with more than 300 units is likely to win Common Council approval Tuesday. That $105 million project, known as Park Lafayette, calls for two 20-story towers east of N. Prospect Ave. and north of E. Lafayette Place. Park Lafayette has received unanimous approvals from the Plan Commission and the council's Zoning, Neighborhoods and Development Committee. It will be the first of what Barr says are major projects that his firm, Renaissant Development Group LLC, is planning for Milwaukee.

Renaissant has more than $100 million in financial backing, says Barr, whose previous venture, Legacy Development Group, was once among the largest home builders in Chicago. In Milwaukee, Renaissant joins a small group of players that are building high-rises.

"My intent is to have a significant presence," Barr said.

That news might rankle some east side residents who are unhappy about Renaissant's plans for Park Lafayette. Some nearby residents say the project would be too tall for the site, which is surrounded mainly by low-rise and mid-rise homes, apartment buildings and condo buildings. Opponents also say Park Lafayette would bring too many people to the densely populated area.

Supporters say the project will generate badly need property tax revenue for Milwaukee and bring new customers to neighborhood shops and restaurants.

Barr said his ideas for additional Milwaukee developments include projects to convert obsolete buildings to new uses.

"I'm not a person who can just build a tract project," Barr said.

That, he says, is what drove him to begin building condos in Chicago after leaving The James Cos., where he was chief financial officer. Barr, 53, had advanced as far as he could in the family-owned firm and wanted to do his own ventures. So he teamed up with Chicago architect William Warman to form Legacy Development.

Legacy focused on the South Loop, an emerging neighborhood bordering the downtown's southern edge. Legacy's first project, a 14-story building with 104 condos, opened in 1999.

That building, named 1 E. 14th Place, was followed by other developments in the South Loop, which was becoming one of Chicago's hottest neighborhoods. Legacy's developments also included a project in the Chicago suburb of Evanston.

Problems surfaced
But Barr and Warman had a falling out and ended their partnership in 2002. Barr declined to elaborate on the reasons, other than saying they had differences over the future direction of Legacy. Warman, who now operates Warman Development, didn't respond to requests for comment.

Also, problems surfaced with some of their projects. Condo owners at 1 E. 15th Place, a Legacy development, sued the firm and its partners over defects found in that building's balconies.

Barr said the balconies did have problems, which he said was the fault of the company hired to install them.

A search of the Internet database of the Cook County clerk of the Circuit Court turned up four other pending lawsuits involving Barr and Warman - not an unusual amount of litigation for a major developer. The plaintiffs include a Chicago-area roofing company saying it is owed just more than $225,000 for work performed for Legacy; some Legacy investors contending they've been improperly denied returns on their equity investments; and an affiliate of California investment firm Hearthstone Inc. seeking $4 million in damages because a group owned by Barr and Warman allegedly failed to properly develop a residential subdivision in Matteson, Ill.

Barr declined to respond in detail to those suits because they are pending. He and Warman are disputing those claims.

Renaissant, based in the suburb of Oak Brook, is pursuing high-rise condo projects in the South Loop, including Vision on State, a 20-story development with 253 units that's under construction.

Barr also began looking over a year ago at development sites in Milwaukee and its surrounding communities. In October 2004, Renaissant proposed a mixed-use development, including 170 condos, an 80-room hotel and retail space, in downtown West Bend.

That project, however, made little progress, said John Capelle, West Bend's community development director. In September, Capelle said, city officials began looking for other firms to develop the 8-acre site, which is owned by the city.

Barr said the West Bend project fell through in part because Renaissant couldn't land an anchor tenant for the retail space.

He thinks Park Lafayette will be successful. The development would create 313 condos with prices ranging from $165,000 to $500,000, with about 60% of the project's units slated to have one bedroom. Those would be smaller, and less pricey, than condos offered in downtown high-rises such as Kilbourn Tower and University Club Tower.

Listening to neighbors
The Park Lafayette plan, however, has drawn concerns from Water Tower Landmark Trust, a neighborhood group.

Members of the trust, which has not taken a formal stand on the project, have asked Renaissant to consider increasing the size of the units, said Randy Bryant, the group's spokesman. That would reduce the number of condos proposed for the site and increase their sale prices, said Bryant.

"They're really undervaluing this site," Bryant said about Renaissant's plan to have a large number of one-bedroom units.

Bryant said he's continuing to talk with Barr about those concerns. He said Barr has responded to neighbors by making other changes, including adding more parking spaces.

"I gave him credit for listening," Bryant said.

Barr said he's willing to listen, and sometimes make changes, to his projects. But he also said he cannot please everybody.

"If you're going to do a significant project in a neighborhood, some are going to like it," Barr said. "And some aren't."

some more good news for Old World Third St, along with the German brewpub joint.

MONDAY, Dec. 12, 2005, 3:14 p.m.
Old World Third St. project planned

A local restaurant and tavern operator said today he plans to develop apartments and a possible restaurant in a five-story vacant building in downtown Milwaukee.

Salvatore Safina plans to build six apartments on the three upper floors of a 17,500-square-foot building at 1033 N. Old World Third St. He said lower two floors would probably house a restaurant, but said those plans are not yet final. The building previously housed the Outlet furniture store, which closed two years ago.

Safina and his family also operate Giovanni’s restaurant, 1683 N. Van Buren St.; Centanni piano bar, 219 N. Water St., and Texture night club, 606 S. 5th St.


Wireless Milwaukee....

Aldermen briefed on Wi-Fi negotiations

A Milwaukee Common Council committee met in closed session today to discuss strategy for the ongoing talks with the local firm that wants to build a wireless computer network in the city.

City officials hope to meet with Milwaukee-based Midwest Fiber Networks Tuesday to review their business plan, and possibly do more negotiating as early as Wednesday, said Randy Gschwind, the city’s chief information officer.

He was among those who briefed the council’s Public Works Committee today.

The company wants to lease space in city-owned underground conduits and place antennas on light posts or other city structures. The two sides, which met formally for the first time Friday, are in talks to determine how much the city should be compensated, and in what form the compensation should come.

The company plans to spend about $20 million to build the system, which could make Milwaukee the first large city in the nation to go wireless.

“Our offer was clearly high, theirs was clearly low,” said Gschwind.

The city’s initial proposal was valued at about $500,000 a year and included payment into a fund for helping low-income people get computers, as well as 50-free sites for anyone tapping into the system and other considerations. Gschwind said discussions now may shift to tying compensation to a scale, so that it would rise as the network is up and the company is able to generate profits.

I didn't see a news article posted about this yet but this is from the common council minutes regarding Park Lafayette.

Substitute ordinance relating to the change in zoning from Multi-Family Residential (RM7) to a Detailed Planned Development (DPD) known as Renaissant’s Park Lafayette, on land located on the Northeast Corner of North Prospect Avenue and East Lafayette Place, in the 3rd Aldermanic District.

Sponsors: THE CHAIR

A motion was made by ALD. D'AMATO that this Ordinance be PASSED This
motion PREVAILED by the following vote:

Aye: Hamilton, Davis, D'Amato, Bauman, Bohl, McGee Jr., Wade, Donovan, Puente, Murphy, Dudzik, Witkowiak, Witkowski, Zielinski Hines Jr. 15
No: 0

well played PL

Ok, this is kind of terrifying. Why is the Brady St. neighborhood so high in pollution (38 times the average level)? And hell, I live on Warren Ave a couple of blocks south of Brady St, and I'm at 59 times the average level! I hope this is some kind of error!

http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/external/onlinenews.ap.org/pollution/test_searchy.html?SITE=AP&SECTION=HOME

hah hah suckers, the Northwest side is only 7 times the national level.

My neighborhood is only 13 times the national level. I'm going to step outside an take a deep, cleansing breath.

21.5 here :(

my house back in BD is 1.1.

Ok, this is kind of terrifying. Why is the Brady St. neighborhood so high in pollution (38 times the average level)? And hell, I live on Warren Ave a couple of blocks south of Brady St, and I'm at 59 times the average level! I hope this is some kind of error!

http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/external/onlinenews.ap.org/pollution/test_searchy.html?SITE=AP&SECTION=HOME
Welcome to Urban Density. I checked where I grew up in the burbs on the lake and its a 10.

Great link.

Welcome to Urban Density. I checked where I grew up in the burbs on the lake and its a 10.

Great link.

I still fail to see how my street lined by tons of houses and apartments and very little street traffic (Warren Ave) is 59x the average air pollution. Whereas my friend in Chicago near Logan Square (much more dense and traffic oriented) is at a 15. Does the geography have something to do with it? Warren Ave sits at the bottom of a hill, and is kind of blocked from wind from the east. Maybe its the gas station?

I really don't mind all that much, but it was kind of alarming :D.

Ok, this is kind of terrifying. Why is the Brady St. neighborhood so high in pollution (38 times the average level)? And hell, I live on Warren Ave a couple of blocks south of Brady St, and I'm at 59 times the average level! I hope this is some kind of error!

http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/external/onlinenews.ap.org/pollution/test_searchy.html?SITE=AP&SECTION=HOME

How is it that I live in Menomonee Falls and my house is 6.1 times the nat'l avg?...But my moms house in Sacramento, CA is .7 times the nat'l avg and the court she lives on is separated from Hwy 50(one of the busiest in the Sac Metro area) by a sound wall? Her house is 50 yards from the freeway and MY house is the more polluted one? OH, and did I mention Sacramento is in a valley so the bad air from Sac Metro along with the North part of the San Francisco Bay area just sits there?

How is it that I live in Menomonee Falls and my house is 6.1 times the nat'l avg?...But my moms house in Sacramento, CA is .7 times the nat'l avg and the court she lives on is separated from Hwy 50(one of the busiest in the Sac Metro area) by a sound wall? Her house is 50 yards from the freeway and MY house is the more polluted one? OH, and did I mention Sacramento is in a valley so the bad air from Sac Metro along with the North part of the San Francisco Bay area just sits there?
This site really doesn't make sense. I had a freind do a search where he lived in midtown Seattle and it was .6. There is obviously something wrong with these numbers. If it were correct it would be a great service.

I'd not be so quick to disregard the data. Obviuosly, they didn't send someone to directly measure every street in America, but the midwest doesn't have the cleanest air in the world. My street up here in Green Bay was a 46.5 (although I'm moving 30 min. south to Wrightstown where it's a 5.2...yippee!!!). Seattle for instance, it the winds are coming off the ocean is constantly being cleasned by clean air off the ocean, where as southeastern wisconsin is getting a lot of air from the Chicago area, and up here in GB we're getting it from Chicago, Milwaukee, the Fox Cities, and ourselves.

Developer plans apartments for central city
Milwaukee journal sentinel

A $4.7 million development that would create 24 apartments in Milwaukee’s central city will be reviewed at today’s city Redevelopment Authority meeting.

Fond du Lac-based Commonwealth Development Corp. has proposed the three-story building, which would include 2,500 square feet of street-level retail space, for the north side of W. Fond du Lac Ave and W. Center St., between N. 27th and N. 28th streets, according to a Department of City Development report.

The development would be partially financed through federal tax credits provided to developers of affordable housing. In return for receiving the credits, developers agree to rent some of their apartments to people earning no more than 60% of the county median income, or $28,200 in Milwaukee County (that income limit rises to $32,280 for a two-person household, and increases with additional people).

Commonwealth’s projects include New Village Townhouses, which is developing 16 new rental homes and the renovation of eight existing homes on scattered sites in the vicinity of W. Center and N. 17th streets.




Payne calls for new basketball arena to keep Bucks
Rich Rovito Milwaukee Business Jounal

The Milwaukee Bucks are close to signing a new long-term lease at the Bradley Center, but a new arena is needed if the team is to remain in the city beyond the terms of the agreement, according to Ulice Payne, chairman of the Bradley Center board.

The Bucks are expected to sign a long-term lease within a "matter of days," Payne said Wednesday during the Milwaukee Press Club's monthly Newsmaker Press Conference at the Newsroom Pub in downtown Milwaukee.

"It may be the last long-term lease we sign with an NBA team," Payne said.

The Bradley Center, which opened in 1989, is one of the oldest arenas used by an NBA team, and will have "run its course in being a home for an NBA team," within the next five to seven years, Payne said.

The community needs to begin discussing the issue of a new arena, Payne said.

He insisted that the Bradley Center board wouldn't seek public financing for a new arena because of the unwillingness of Milwaukee-area residents to support such a move.

"We need to step up and look for private sector solutions," he said. "We need to start talking."

The need to address the future of the Bucks franchise, as well as the need to have a new arena in order to attract top-notch concerts and other sporting and entertainment events, has put on hold discussions of merger between the Bradley Center and the Wisconsin Center District, Payne said.

"The merger discussions aren't dead, they just aren't a priority at this time," he said.

The Wisconsin Center District operates the Milwaukee Theatre, U.S. Cellular Arena and the Midwest Airlines Center.

"We have ongoing obligations to tenants and concert promoters," Payne said. "If it appears your future is uncertain, it's hard to attract events."

Franklyn Gimbel, chairman of the board of the Wisconsin Center District, agreed that public funding isn't a likely means of financing a new arena without political support.

"There are no politicians that willing to front run for an entertainment and sports venue," he said.

The need for a new arena goes beyond securing the future of the Bucks, who play 41 regular season games at the facility, Payne said. The Bradley Center also is home to the Marquette University men's basketball team and the Milwaukee Admirals professional hockey team.

In addition, the Bradley Center has featured 17 concerts this year, which is a record.

The Bradley Center had top-line revenue of about $23 million in 2004, a figure that will decrease in 2005 because the facility has outsourced its concession and merchandising operations.

"The top-line revenue will shrink, but the yield will probably be better," Payne said.

About $6 million in renovations are underway at the Bradley Center, but a plan laid out a few years ago for a $75 million overhaul was scrapped because of funding issues and debate over whether it made sense to pour money into an outdated facility by today's NBA standards, Payne said.

"We are limiting what we are putting into the building," Payne said. "There's not much more juice left in the orange."

The Bradley Center has been well maintained and isn't showing its age, Payne said. Nonetheless, it lacks the amenities of many of the new arenas, as well as adjacent development.

"You go to your house every day, and it's great," Payne said. "Then you go to someone else's house and you say, man, my closets are small. You look around the league and you see what you're missing."

Although Payne insists the Bradley Center wouldn't seek public funding for a new arena, he said the board may seek public infrastucture improvements to help spur private sector development.

Payne insists there isn't a turf war between the Bradley Center and the Wisconsin Center District. The entities have different business plans and aren't competing for the same business, he said.

The Milwaukee Center District is in "very good" shape and will have $1.3 million in cash leftover at year end after paying for debt service and operating expenses, Gimbel said.


any thoughts on the bradley center or a new downtown arena?

i think a new arena would be cool assuming they could ever find the room for one let alone the funding. Admittingly i've only been to the bradley center a few times so i dont desinctly remember anything incredibly positive nor negative about it but when i go there in march maybe i'll see where they're coming from.

about the air quality,
i have read that because of the lake, pollution from chicago and milwaukee hugs the shore and travels north. Which explains why Green Bay and milwaukee would have such bad air compared to the size of their metros.

Unless they tear down the bradley and replace it with something new

From the online version of the MBJ

The Milwaukee Department of City Development on Thursday reissued a request for proposals for a prominent site on West Wisconsin Avenue in downtown Milwaukee that has been considered for a new hotel.

DCD issued the request for proposals for a 2-acre city-owned parking lot at West Wisconsin Avenue between North Fourth and North Fifth streets, south of the Midwest Airlines Center and east of the Hilton Milwaukee Center. The site is divided into two parcels, a 32,400-square-foot site bounded on the west by North Fifth Street and a 54,000-square-foot site bounded on the east by North Fourth Street.

The city expects the site to be developed into a mixed-use building with a hotel, restaurant, retail stores and possibly residential and office uses.
Read the Entire Article (http://milwaukee.bizjournals.com/milwaukee/stories/2005/12/12/daily36.html?jst=b_ln_hl)

(MBJ)
another health center for the metro area
Wheaton plans $80M outpatient health center in Franklin
Rosland Briggs Gammon
Wheaton Franciscan Services Inc., the parent of Covenant Healthcare in Glendale and All Saints Healthcare in Racine, plans to open an $80 million, 275,000-square-foot outpatient facility in Franklin.
....
The project still has to secure approvals from the Franklin Plan Commission and Common Council.

Another health center for milwaukee area, the sprawl southward continues!

DCD seeks proposals for Wisconsin Avenue hotel site

I wish weston hotels could invest in that lol...

This pic shows that the Milwaukee skyline aint that bad, you just have to get it all in a shot:

http://image30.webshots.com/31/4/99/67/269249967TEkSNf_ph.jpg

I just caught myself up on some of these projects. There's so much going on it's becoming difficult to keep track of (definitely not the worst problem to have). The Lake Bluff project is fascinating. The design borders on quixotic. I love it and hope it gets built.

(MBJ)


Another health center for milwaukee area, the sprawl southward continues!


This would be a fitting time for the Imperial March from Star wars :fiddle: the march of sprawl continues south :( I just pray for the day when urban projects outnumber these disgusting sprawl projects, whether this day shall actually come I do not know =(

TMJ4 had a story talking about the vote to build a new 7 million-dollar (I believe) parking ramp, after demolotion of the current courthouse structure. It's expected to be vetoed though.

Why the veto?

TMJ4 had a story talking about the vote to build a new 7 million-dollar (I believe) parking ramp, after demolotion of the current courthouse structure. It's expected to be vetoed though.

Why the veto?

Most likely because a surface parking lot (one that would be surrounded by some kind of wall or fence, with controlled access into and out of the lot and Courthouse for the protection of judges and other officials) is much cheaper to build.

TMJ4 had a story talking about the vote to build a new 7 million-dollar (I believe) parking ramp, after demolotion of the current courthouse structure. It's expected to be vetoed though.

Why the veto?

i just heard the same on channel 6 and i did a little searching on it but i couldn't find a whole lot besides this from fox6's website..


Walker To Veto Parking Structure
(Milwaukee) Milwaukee County Executive Scott Walker says he will veto an amendment passed by the county board Thursday. It calls for an 8.7 million dollar, two-story parking structure to be built on the site of the courthouse annex-- which will soon be demolished. The board will make a decision on Walker's veto by next week.


i'm guessing the reason he vetoed it is because the county is still pissed about the state tearing it down... the state is using their money to tear it down as part of the marquette project, but they won't put up any money to replace it, so the county has to do it...

from what i heard, the original plan was to not replace the annex at all but to use surface lots or build a new parking structure in between the courthouse and the pabst development that could be used by both... but obviously they must have decided against that and proposed this new parking structure instead... this is the first thing i've even heard about it...

i'm guessing if the board already approved it, they're going to approve it again, right? they definately need to do something to provide parking for the courthouse employees and i personally think this would be the best use of space...

i'm guessing the reason he vetoed it is because the county is still pissed about the state tearing it down...

The whole tear-down-the-Annex thing was Scott Walker's idea to begin with. And the County Board a few weeks back finally agreed to have the Annex demolished as part of the Marquette Interchange project...since that section of freeway is shut down now anyway. So the County isn't pissed about the State tearing it down.

the state is using their money to tear it down as part of the marquette project, but they won't put up any money to replace it, so the county has to do it...


There was an agreement between the County and State on how to pay for the demolition of the Annex. The County would use procedes from selling off land in the Park East corridor to pay for knocking down the Annex.

But the County was pissed at the State because the State wasn't going to kick in anything to the County so those parking spaces can be replaced. The State held strong on that position, and the County had to suck it up.


So then the County had to decide how to replace the lost parking. Two basic ideas emerged. One was to build a new parking structure on the site of the Annex (but not built out over the freeway), that could be used by all kinds of County employees. The other idea was to build a walled in secure surface parking lot on the site of the Annex to be used mainly by judges and political figures, with other County empoyees having to find parking spaces somewhere else.

The County Board endorsed the parking sturcture option. County Exec Walker is supporting the surface lot option because it is much less expensive. Hence the veto.

from what i heard, the original plan was to not replace the annex at all but to use surface lots or build a new parking structure in between the courthouse and the pabst development that could be used by both...but obviously they must have decided against that and proposed this new parking structure instead... this is the first thing i've even heard about it...

There may have been some ideas about using a parking structure in conjunction with PabstCity early on, because there were three large structures proposed for that project...but that possibility obviously would have gone out the window almost 6 months ago.

The County-State Annex demolition agreement was only struck a few weeks ago, and the debate over new structure on Annex site vs. surface lot on Annex site has been going on since well before then.

i'm guessing if the board already approved it, they're going to approve it again, right? they definately need to do something to provide parking for the courthouse employees and i personally think this would be the best use of space...

Yes, a parking sturcture would make better use of land than a surface lot, that's for sure.

here is a longer article on the North side apartment developement mentioned earlier...

City grants preliminary OK to north side development
$4.7 million project includes 24 apartments, street-level retail space
By TOM DAYKIN
tdaykin@journalsentinel.com
Posted: Dec. 15, 2005
A $4.7 million development that would create 24 apartments within a poor but reviving neighborhood on Milwaukee's north side received preliminary city approval Thursday.

Fond du Lac-based Commonwealth Development Corp. proposed the three-story building, which would include 2,500 square feet of street-level retail space, for the north side of W. Fond du Lac Ave. and W. Center St., between N. 27th and N. 28th streets. The Redevelopment Authority granted an option to an investors group, led by Commonwealth, to purchase the city-owned vacant lot for $40,000.

Commonwealth plans to build two-bedroom apartments, with average monthly rents of $575.

The development would be partially financed through federal tax credits provided to developers of affordable housing. In return for receiving the credits, developers agree to rent some of their apartments to people earning no more than 60% of the county median income, or $28,200 in Milwaukee County (that income limit rises to $32,280 for a two-person household and increases with additional people).

Developers annually apply for portions of Wisconsin's share of the tax credits, which are allocated by the Wisconsin Housing and Economic Development Authority in a competitive process. Commonwealth will learn by April whether it will receive credits for the project, said Louie Lange, Commonwealth president.

Commonwealth's projects include New Village Townhouses, a development of 16 new rental homes and eight renovated homes on scattered sites in the vicinity of W. Center and N. 17th streets. The New Village development received tax credits.

The authority also reviewed plans by three Milwaukee-area firms - Legacy Redevelopment Corp., Williams Development Corp. and Irgens Development Partners LLC - to build up to 75 homes on the north side.

Legacy and its partners would build the homes on vacant parcels in an area roughly bordered by N. 20th St., N. 24th St., W. North Ave. and W. Brown St. The homes, with three to four bedrooms, would carry sale prices ranging from $149,900 to $225,900.

Because of a procedural delay, the authority did not vote on a proposed $2.95 million city grant to help finance the $16.5 million project, which would include improvements to nearby Johnson Park.

The city grant, which would be repaid by the homes' property taxes, is scheduled for a vote at the authority's Jan. 19 meeting. It is supported by both Mayor Tom Barrett and Common Council President Willie Hines, whose district includes the development area.

The Commonwealth and Legacy projects are among several residential developments on the north side. The CityHomes and Lindsay Heights developments together have added some 200 new homes to the area bordered by N. 12th, N. 23rd, W. Locust and W. Walnut streets. Madison-based Gorman & Co. recently finished a $6 million remodeling of the 115-unit Lindsay Commons apartments, 2111 W. Galena St., and North Avenue Community Development Corp. is remodeling a former St. Vincent de Paul resale shop, 1862 W. Fond du Lac Ave., into the 24-unit Johnson Park Lofts, an apartment building.

Finally, the authority granted an option to Minneapolis-based Sherman Associates Inc. to buy vacant lots south of W. Wisconsin Ave. between N. 25th and N. 27th streets for $473,634. Sherman plans to build a mixed-use project with 70 apartments, 20 to 24 condominiums and 17,000 square feet of retail space, anchored by a U.S. Bank branch.

The $17.5 million development is seeking affordable housing tax credits to finance a portion of its development. The condos, however, would sell at market rates, probably at around $200,000 each, said Loren Brueggemann, Sherman's vice president of development.

That project, which would be Sherman's first Wisconsin development, would be the latest among a series of major developments in the neighborhood west of Marquette University. Other recent projects include the $25 million redevelopment of an office building at 2040 W. Wisconsin Ave. into 132 student apartments; the $12 million restoration of the eight-story Ambassador Hotel, 2308 W. Wisconsin Ave., and the $15 million conversion of a former hospital building into the Historic Lofts on Kilbourn, a 99-unit apartment building, 2200 W. Kilbourn Ave.


I am quite suprised about this. The area is still quite ghetto, but if a developer going to spend 4.7 million for 24 apartments--it has to be vastly improving. The area is pretty cool in my opinion, I very much dig the neighborhoods.

To see the amont of recent news of development in rougher areas is very positive. While these are only apartments, they can have a pretty decent impact on the neighborhood--by attracting some working/middle class tenants who will actually care what happens in their area. They have the financial means to rent in a safer place in Milwaukee or the suburbs, yet choose to live here. They can be a positive example to others in the area.

here is a longer article on the North side apartment developement mentioned earlier...




I am quite suprised about this. The area is still quite ghetto, but if a developer going to spend 4.7 million for 24 apartments--it has to be vastly improving. The area is pretty cool in my opinion, I very much dig the neighborhoods.

To see the amont of recent news of development in rougher areas is very positive. While these are only apartments, they can have a pretty decent impact on the neighborhood--by attracting some working/middle class tenants who will actually care what happens in their area. They have the financial means to rent in a safer place in Milwaukee or the suburbs, yet choose to live here. They can be a positive example to others in the area.


that comes out to 195k per apartment, that seems a bit high, but im sure the developer is getting a nice profit from this, but its a bit crazy for low income housing to cost this much to build IMHO,
for 195k you could buy a nice house, instead of building low income housing, seems that this apartment building should cost half of this, but i guess the poor developer has to make payments on his yacht and sports car ;)

They are units built with low income housing tax credits, but that doesn't mean they have to be poorly built units. The whole point of the tax credit program is to allow developers to build high quality units and lease them at below market rents so they can still make the project cash flow. Most of the time the developer sells the tax credits to something like a bank and then uses the proceeds of the sale for equity on the project. This allows the developer to charge less on rent because they need less money to make the project recoup their original out of pocket investment.

I'm not surprised at all by Legacy's project nor by the proposal for FDL & Center. That corner has been ripe for something meaningful for years and this is just the project that has been a long time coming for that whole intersection. With the renovation of the Kilbourn State Bank across the street this intersection could spring to life and become a real lynchpin for revitalization of that whole neighborhood. The area still has a long way to go, though.

The Bradley Center.....

I think its ridicolous that we have to build a new arena already. Its like getting rid of a car after 50-60,000 miles. What more can they do to make the arena experience better? Sound, video, and seating can all be redone. Those retail and resturants they are talking about can easily be build around the BC. Sure, the outside isnt all that flashy...but I hardly think thats a reason to build a whole new arena. I would like to see one, but judging from the Miller Park fiasco....this city will shit its pants if they decide to raise taxes a penny for a new arena.

Where would we even build the new arena? Its nicely in place with a good number of bars and resturants around it...I dont see being put in a better spot. I dont like the idea of using Park East space for it.

I don't know much about sports economics, but multiple revenue streams (sit-down restaurants, independent entertainment facilities not tied to arena events, shops, etc.) seems to be what drives many of these facilities. In that regard, despite its relative youth and good condition, the Bradley Center has its limits. Its current single-use function keeps it from generating traffic on a day-in-day-out basis. That, coupled with Milwaukee's small market size, is what makes Ulice Payne nervous about the future of pro basketball here.

Will it take deep private-sector pockets to provide a new and/or improved venue for the Bucks? The cash-rich Potowattomi Casino folks come to mind. It's an influential group with a particular stake in being a good neighbor. I'm not necessarily advocating a wholesale relocation of the casino to 4th and State, but gambling and sports are both entertainment businesses with similar business models. The topic of moving the casino has been bandied about, and may become a front-burner issue once more. What we need most here is some creative leadership.

I don't know much about sports economics, but multiple revenue streams (sit-down restaurants, independent entertainment facilities not tied to arena events, shops, etc.) seems to be what drives many of these facilities. In that regard, despite its relative youth and good condition, the Bradley Center has its limits. Its current single-use function keeps it from generating traffic on a day-in-day-out basis. That, coupled with Milwaukee's small market size, is what makes Ulice Payne nervous about the future of pro basketball here.

Will it take deep private-sector pockets to provide a new and/or improved venue for the Bucks? The cash-rich Potowattomi Casino folks come to mind. It's an influential group with a particular stake in being a good neighbor. I'm not necessarily advocating a wholesale relocation of the casino to 4th and State, but gambling and sports are both entertainment businesses with similar business models. The topic of moving the casino has been bandied about, and may become a front-burner issue once more. What we need most here is some creative leadership.
From what I read Ulice is saying leave the Bradley Center there for the Admrials, Marquette, concerts, etc. and build yet another. Which would most likely be in Park East. So that would make 3 arenas in a very small area. Stingl in the Journal wrote a very funny article on the life span of an "athletic venue"...actually not so funny when you think about it.

I don't know much about sports economics, but multiple revenue streams (sit-down restaurants, independent entertainment facilities not tied to arena events, shops, etc.) seems to be what drives many of these facilities. In that regard, despite its relative youth and good condition, the Bradley Center has its limits. Its current single-use function keeps it from generating traffic on a day-in-day-out basis. That, coupled with Milwaukee's small market size, is what makes Ulice Payne nervous about the future of pro basketball here.

Will it take deep private-sector pockets to provide a new and/or improved venue for the Bucks? The cash-rich Potowattomi Casino folks come to mind. It's an influential group with a particular stake in being a good neighbor. I'm not necessarily advocating a wholesale relocation of the casino to 4th and State, but gambling and sports are both entertainment businesses with similar business models. The topic of moving the casino has been bandied about, and may become a front-burner issue once more. What we need most here is some creative leadership.


Moving the casino downtown is out of the question in my books. I'm so against it in fact, that I would consider leaving this city if it were to happen.

From what I read Ulice is saying leave the Bradley Center there for the Admrials, Marquette, concerts, etc. and build yet another. Which would most likely be in Park East. So that would make 3 arenas in a very small area.

No, that is not the case at all. This whole "replace the Bradley Center" is all about building a new multi-use facility; it is not about building a new basketball-only facility and keeping the BC for other stuff.

The media is playing up the NBA/Bucks/basketball angle simply because the Bucks are the BC's primary tenant and they happen to be in the process of negotiating a new lease (one that is reportedly "the last long term lease" they will sign to play at the BC). Any discussions about a new facility will incorporate the other teams and concert opportunities, so everyone gets a new home. Ulice Payne says so himself:

The need to address the future of the Bucks franchise, as well as the need to have a new arena in order to attract top-notch concerts and other sporting and entertainment events, has put on hold discussions of merger between the Bradley Center and the Wisconsin Center District, Payne said.

"The merger discussions aren't dead, they just aren't a priority at this time," he said.

...

The need for a new arena goes beyond securing the future of the Bucks, who play 41 regular season games at the facility, Payne said. The Bradley Center also is home to the Marquette University men's basketball team and the Milwaukee Admirals professional hockey team.

Payne calls for new basketball arena to keep Bucks (http://www.bizjournals.com/milwaukee/stories/2005/12/12/daily25.html?page=1)

Though the statements in that Business Journal article seem to contradict statements made in this same-day article from the Journal Sentinel:

In Payne's view, the Bradley Center cannot generate the amount of revenue National Basketball Association teams need to stay competitive. A new arena near the Bradley Center can do that, Payne said, and allow the Bradley Center to operate as a major concert and show venue as part of a larger sports and entertainment zone.

Clock ticking on Bradley Center, Bucks, Payne says (http://www.jsonline.com/news/metro/dec05/377738.asp)


The BJ artcile implies replacing the BC with a new multi-use facility, while the JS artcile implies keeping the BC for concerts/shows and building a new sports-only arena close by.

Weird.

Istead of building a new Bradley center why not remodel it? If I am not mistaken the Key Arena in Seattle was remodeled to meet the current standard NBA teams supposedly require. But to tell the truth what really needs to happen is to have the clowns who head the Bradley center and convention bureau work together as one unified whole and stop continuing the fued both sides have for each other.

Though the statements in that Business Journal article seem to contradict statements made in this same-day article from the Journal Sentinel:



Clock ticking on Bradley Center, Bucks, Payne says (http://www.jsonline.com/news/metro/dec05/377738.asp)


The BJ artcile implies replacing the BC with a new multi-use facility, while the JS artcile implies keeping the BC for concerts/shows and building a new sports-only arena close by.

Weird.
This version is what I was referring to. I don't think it was from either of the papers but a TV interview Ulice was quoted, where he talked about building a whole new facility. This would make sense given that Lloyd Pettit built the BC to get a NHL team. Maybe the whole thing is up to the Bradley Foundation and what they wish.

the bc cant be renovated to become a true nba facility it was clearly designed for hockey. if you've sat behind the backboards on the top level towards the top of the bc you were probably mad at the seats like i was

from Business Journal
Hiawatha service sets ridership record
More than a half million passengers have traveled between Milwaukee and Chicago aboard Amtrak's Hiawatha service trains -- an all-time high for the calendar year, the Wisconsin Department of Transportation said Friday.


State officials, which began monitoring Amtrak ridership in 1989, attributed the record ridership to increased marketing, rising gas prices and the new Milwaukee Airport Rail Station. Officials also cited Hiawatha's top on-time performance as a factor.

In November, Hiawatha service trains carried 48,369 people -- the 12th consecutive monthly ridership record -- for a total of Hiawatha ridership of 494,327 through November. The figure is up 16 percent over the comparable period last year.

State officials estimated that the 500,000th Hiawatha passenger boarded the train on Dec. 4 and predicted that total ridership for the year will top 530,000.

In 2004, Hiawatha trains carried 470,186 passengers. That also was a record.

"The ever-growing success of the Hiawatha Service provides a foundation for expanding passenger rail opportunities in Wisconsin and throughout the Midwest," WisDOT secretary Frank Busalacchi said.

Fantastic Redd!

i just thought this was interesting...on jsonline.
article: http://www.jsonline.com/bym/news/dec05/378562.asp
http://graphics.jsonline.com/graphics/news/img/dec05/mitchell_121905_big.gif
you will all like this one? or will you
The increased development along I-94 in Kenosha, Racine and southern Milwaukee counties suggests an eventual merging of the Chicago and Milwaukee regions, or what developers call standard metropolitan statistical areas (SMSAs).

http://www.universityclubtower.com/pics/sales/sales_summary110105.jpg

I've got a question, Markitect you probably have this one. I've been following the Erie Street Plaza Design Competition on the DCD website, but haven't heard a lot about it on this thread or in the news. Is this something the city is aggressively pursuing? Milwaukee DCD website (http://www.mkedcd.org/planning/EriePlaza/index.html)

Also has anyone seen the new plaza under the new Holton pedestrian bridge on Beerline B (on the Water St. side)? I checked it out the other night, it's really impressive. I'm going to try to get down there to take some pictures after finals are done.

I've got a question, Markitect you probably have this one. I've been following the Erie Street Plaza Design Competition on the DCD website, but haven't heard a lot about it on this thread or in the news. Is this something the city is aggressively pursuing? Milwaukee DCD website (http://www.mkedcd.org/planning/EriePlaza/index.html)


Well, it's not January 2006 yet...

I've got a question, Markitect you probably have this one. I've been following the Erie Street Plaza Design Competition on the DCD website, but haven't heard a lot about it on this thread or in the news. Is this something the city is aggressively pursuing? Milwaukee DCD website (http://www.mkedcd.org/planning/EriePlaza/index.html)

Also has anyone seen the new plaza under the new Holton pedestrian bridge on Beerline B (on the Water St. side)? I checked it out the other night, it's really impressive. I'm going to try to get down there to take some pictures after finals are done.

Yeah, like Markitect said, they are choosing a design in January. Hopefully we see some renderings--I am as excitied as you are. Its a really key location. I also checked out the Holton Marsupial Bridge plaza..its really cool. Right next to that Trocadero, an equally cool looking place. I have to say, the Marsupial Bridge is really something nice. The wood on there is really quality feeling.

Markitect--any word on the MacArthur Square and Cathedral Square redesign competitions?

I have no words on the MacArthur Square and Cathedral Square redesign competitions.

Milwaukee 50's style diner in Milan? :)


Italian diner salutes '50s Milwaukee
By Bobby Tanzilo
Maybe Milwaukee can't hold on to a retro downtown diner like Ed Debevic's but Brew City itself is fodder for a diner and musical venue that recalls a lost age in American culture. Milwaukee 50's Diner is located in the town of Varedo, in the province of Milan, in northern Italy.

The diner is something of a hotspot out in provincial Milan, hosting gigs of all stripes, car shows, rockabilly nights and more. On Wednesday night, there's even line dancing!

In its seven-year existence, the diner -- which is dominated by a 36-foot-long counter -- has hosted the likes of Bill Haley's Comets, Rocky Burnette, Robert Gordon, Rosie Flores and other American retro rock and roll and country performers.

Milwaukee 50s Diner opened on Oct. 1, 1998 according to one of the owners, Matteo Grandi, and the theme derives from a love for 1950s music, cars, film and culture. Many of the period furnishings came directly from the U.S.

"The name was chosen at the time for a number of reasons," says Grandi, who opened the diner with Romina Rustioni. "Because I love Harleys –- I’ve had one since 1989 -– because Milwaukee is the city where ‘Happy Days’ was set, because it is an Indian word, because of Miller High Life and because basically, I like Milwaukee even if I had never visited. I did visit Milwaukee and Wisconsin in 2003 for the mega rock and roll (rockabilly) event at Green Bay and I liked it a lot."

Lovers of American cuisine might rue what others consider the great food available in Italy. But they'll find a slice of heaven in Varedo, thanks to the diner, which proudly serves up baked potatoes, chicken wings, brownies and milk shakes, according to its Web site.

Given the fact that everyone in Italy associates Milwaukee with "Happy Days" (in the U.K. it's "Laverne & Shirley"), it's no surprise to see Milwaukee represented in this way. But, Milwaukee was just part of the inspiration for the diner, says Grandi.

“The idea really got legs in 1996-’97 after some vacations in Florida –- more precisely Fort Lauderdale -– where I rented a car and we drove around in search of American foods, design books and recipes, and eating lunch and dinner in the most inspirational places.

“After returning I worked hard to find the right location and a good interior designer. … We found a reconstruction of a ‘50s-style counter in a place in the Province of Novara. … Finally, the location arrived, too, in an old commercial building along the freeway connecting Milan and Como. (It was) empty for years and was perfect for a diner, seeing as how it was built in the ‘60s and had octagonal windows and pink walls outside.”

You can visit the Milwaukee 50's Diner by either flying to Milan and heading north on the SS35 or simply by visiting the diner's Web site milwaukeediner.it.

Someday, we'll tell you all about the Harley Café, offering some of the best espresso near the station in tiny Castell'Alfero, just north of Asti. Germans may love David Hasselhoff, but Italian adore Harleys.

Well, it's not January 2006 yet...

I'm aware. It is 2 weeks away though.

Some interesting points made in the design criteria expected for the RFP on the West Wisconsin Ave hotel site that was recently announced.

Remember there are two parcels, they can be bought seperately or combined.

• Parcels 1 and 2 Combined: 86,400 SF, 320’ of frontage on Wisconsin Avenue, and 270’ of frontage on 4th Street and 5th Streets
• Parcel #1 alone: 32,400 SF, 120’ of frontage on Wisconsin Avenue and 270’ of frontage on 4th Street
• Parcel #2 alone: 54,000 SF, 200’ of frontage on Wisconsin Avenue and 270’ of frontage on 5th Street

Building Placement:

Parcel #1

• Should occupy 100% of Wisconsin Avenue façade and first 200’ south of Wisconsin Avenue on 4th Street façade
• Setback should be between 0-8’ from property line

Parcel #2

• Should occupy 100% of Wisconsin Avenue façade and first 200’ south of Wisconsin Avenue on 4th Street façade
• Setback should be between 0-8’ from property line
• An appropriately scaled plaza could be placed at the corner of 5th and Wisconsin.

Building Height (if Parcels Developed Separately)

Parcel #1

• Minimum height of 12 stories along Wisconsin Avenue and minimum height of 5 stories along 4th Street
• Minimum ground floor height of 14’

Parcel #2

• Minimum height of 8 stories along Wisconsin Avenue and minimum height of 5 stories along 5th Street
• Minimum ground floor height of 14’

Building Height (if Parcels Combined)

• Minimum height of 8 stories along Wisconsin Avenue, with a taller element at the corner of 4th Street and Wisconsin Avenue
• Minimum height of 5 stories along 4th and 5th Streets
• Minimum ground floor height of 14’

Hopefully this will help aid in getting a better design than the Sheraton that was proposed before and then fell through. That design looked like an afterthought...

Proposals are due on February 24, 2006 and once approvals and financing are secured, 24 months until reality.

intresting^, at least they will make it fit in with the rest of downtown. I am looking forward to this alot. With this developed, downtown Wisconsin Ave. will be pretty much one continuous wall of buildings. BTW--there is a Starbucks being put into the Hilton on Wisconsin Ave.

For those of you interested in the potentially major mixed used stadium development of a soccer franchise....here are some updates:

Specifically, Milwaukee Professional Soccer has made progress with a major real estate developer, the City of Milwaukee, MLS, the soccer community, land owners and investors.

REAL ESTATE DEVELOPER: Milwaukee Professional Soccer has begun working with Washington, D.C. based real estate developer Global Equity Partners, LLC. Global is an international developer with unique experience in stadium-anchored mixed-use developments. Among other projects, Global is developing a new home for MLS’s DC United along the Anacostia River in Washington, D.C. Cities have welcomed Global’s progressive approach, which involves private backing of TIF bond issuance and ensures that the City will not be put at risk financially.

CITY OF MILWAUKEE: Milwaukee Professional Soccer and its development partner, Global Equity Partners, have issued a formal letter of interest to Milwaukee Mayor Tom Barrett and the President of the Common Council, Alderman Willie Hines, Jr. Milwaukee Professional Soccer has also met several times with City of Milwaukee officials to begin structuring a privately backed financing mechanism for the project. Alderman Hines and Alderman Michael D’Amato, along with City Comptroller Wally Morics, representatives of the Mayor’s office and the Department of City Development and Tim Sheehy from the Milwaukee Metropolitan Chamber of Commerce, have all provided positive input into the structure of the project.

MAJOR LEAGUE SOCCER: Milwaukee Professional Soccer met last month with the League’s leadership at the MLS Board of Governors meeting in Frisco, Texas in conjunction with its delegation’s visit to FC Dallas’ new soccer stadium, Pizza Hut Park, and MLS Cup. The League and Milwaukee Professional Soccer discussed terms for securing an option for an expansion team for MLS’s 2008 season. Milwaukee Professional Soccer is looking to acquire that option in the first quarter of 2006.

SOCCER COMMUNITY: Milwaukee Professional Soccer Chief Executive Officer Peter Wilt has met with many youth and amateur soccer groups over the last several months. Wilt has addressed youth soccer districts throughout the state including the Metro Milwaukee, Waukesha County, Madison and East Central Districts. Wilt has also attended important soccer events for the Milwaukee Wave, Milwaukee Kickers, Wisconsin Soccer Association and Interclubes. Milwaukee Professional Soccer is also working with the Wisconsin Youth Soccer Association leadership to develop a landmark partnership, which will enrich opportunities for the statewide youth soccer community. Milwaukee Professional Soccer has also organized viewing parties for the World Cup Draw and NCAA College Cup at Milwaukee’s premier soccer viewing venue, The Highbury Pub.

LAND OWNERS: In the last several months, Milwaukee Professional Soccer has worked with the City of Milwaukee, Milwaukee County and several private real estate companies to identify potential sites for the stadium and mixed use development. Milwaukee Professional Soccer and Global Equity Partners are in active discussions with land owners in order to secure development rights for the project.

INVESTORS: Milwaukee Professional Soccer has assembled a detailed private offering memorandum, which includes a stadium and team operations pro forma. The offering was recently made available to pre-qualified candidates who are interested in joining the current investor group. Milwaukee Professional Soccer is in discussions with more than two dozen potential investors locally, nationally and internationally.

“While we still have several hurdles to climb, we have made significant progress in key areas of this process,” Milwaukee Professional Soccer Chief Executive Officer Peter Wilt said. “I am encouraged with the progress we’ve made to date. The inclusion of Global Equity and the engagement in the process by the City of Milwaukee have provided a great boost to our efforts,” Wilt said.

more good news about soccer i see! I know that its going to be tough to convince people that this is a great idea considering even chicago cant fill a stadium but if this goes through, I know i'll more than likely become a regular attendant as well as really start to follow MLS. I grew up playing soccer and its definitely among my favorite sports. Sounds like things are going good thus far

wow^ I thought the soccer stadium was deader than a Tampa Bay Devil Rays game. I was initally for it, then was against it...now am on the fence. If they are going to put up their own money for it, god bless their efforts. Will Major League Soccer flourish? Who knows. It hasnt in many other cities and have this feeling it may not in Milwaukee. However, like we have discussed before--it can have some other uses--such as a football/soccer/any other field sport stadium for both UWM, Marquette, MSOE, MATC...whoever. I think it would be cool if they added a track and field aspect to it so that Milwaukee could host WIAA Track and Field and soccer events in downtown Milwaukee, as well as some national events (national soccer matches, Olympic trials, World Cup related matches, etc.)

I guess the main thing is having it in use alot. I wouldn't like seeing a huge stadium in the Park East just sitting there most of the time. They said its going to be a mixed use development...which is great. I dont like the idea of this killing the Wave and Wave United. The Wave are the New York Yankees of Proffesional indoor soccer. While I havent ever been to a game, I dont like the idea of losing them to this. They play at two different times, so I dont think it should be a problem.

Thanks for the update. I will be watching closely to see if they get the franchise option from MLS. This could potentially be great for the city.

how bout a new NBA stadium there ????????

Will Major League Soccer flourish? Who knows. It hasnt in many other cities and have this feeling it may not in Milwaukee.

Hasn't flourished, huh?

It's flourished enough, especially with all of the recent and planned stadium activity. Here's the rundown for the entire league:

Teams with recently-built stadiums:
- Columbus Crew (built 1999)
- Club Deportivo Chivas USA / Los Angeles Galaxy (built 2003; both teams share same stadium)
- FC Dallas (built 2005)

Teams with new stadiums under construction:
- Chicago Fire (completion in 2006; shared Soldier Field with NFL Bears)
- Colorado Rapids (completion in 2007; currently share INVESCO Field with NFL Broncos)
- MetroStars (completion in 2007; currently share Giants Stadium with NFL Giants and Jets)

Teams planning new stadiums:
- DC United (planned for sometime in the future; currently share RFK Stadium with MLB Nationals)
- Real Salt Lake (planned for 2008; currently share Rice-Eccles Stadium with Univ. of Utah)
- Toronto (planned for 2007; new expansion team)
- Houston (relocated from San Jose in Decemebr 2005; will share Robertson Stadium with Univ. of Houston until new stadium plans are finalized)

Teams sharing stadiums with other sports:
- Kansas City Wizards (currently share Arrowhead Stadium with NFL Chiefs)
- New England Revolution (currently share Gillette Stadium with NFL Patriots)

^Yeah, I guess...however, Milwaukee doesnt get huge crowds at Wave games, Brewer games, or Bucks games. I always hear about how badly the MLS is doing in most cities.

I find it hard to believe we can get 15,000 people regularly to show up to soccer when nobody wants to see an emerging power in both professional basketball and baseball. Then again, its his money so if he wants to build this stadium and bring a team here--all power to him. Milwaukee is a small market with high saturation of sports--professional, college, and amateur...so gaining these amount of people a game will be tough.

Tickets are cheap for these MLS games--so maybe that will be the kicker for families who would rather pay to see this than spend 100 dollars on tickets alone, with nosebleed seats at the Bradley Center.

I personally think the stadium would be better suited somewhere near the Hispanic population, not the black one. A neighborhood stadium in a mainly Hispanic hood' with some talented, recognizeable Hispanic players could be pretty good idea in these areas. With ticket prices that cheap, I think they could get alot of people--many who could just walk to the stadium--ala Wrigley Field. However, then you have the problems with whites and safety issues. Whatever, who knows....just my two cents on the issue.

I'm not a fan of an MLS stadium located in the Park East. My feeling is there are much more valuable uses for this space. Personally, I think the best spot for a soccer stadium would be the warehouse areas of the 3rd or 5th ward. Or just south in Walker's Point. A mixed use development and increased foot traffic in these areas could be extremely valuable.

From a purely game-experience standpoint, I think being down near the lake with the crowd noise echoing off the Hoan Bridge would be a cool experience. Think Marcus, but sports.

Also, like Redd said, I think you need to find a demographic for foot traffic and utilize that. Oh yeah.... and then trade for Freddie Adu!

MATC dorms downtown? What do yall think about it?

Downtown dorms?
Survey shows students interested in housing near MATC
By TOM HELD
theld@journalsentinel.com
Posted: Dec. 20, 2005
Student housing to serve Milwaukee Area Technical College would draw more than 800 student tenants, according to a consultant's projection presented Tuesday night.

Advertisement

While the college itself remains far from breaking ground on a residence hall, the survey findings - presented to the MATC Board of Directors - will add to the discussion of ideas for development of the former Pabst brewery site and other properties near the campus on W. State St.

"We would love to see them put in some student housing," said Michael Sargent, MATC vice president for finance.

College officials have been exploring offering student housing and hired a Maryland-based consultant to gauge the potential demand among MATC students.

Through a survey of 2,360 students, real estate consultant Anderson Strickler projected the demand for college housing at 836 full-time students. Adding part-time students to the analysis increased the demand by another 2,042 students, the report says.

MATC serves roughly 30,000 students at its downtown campus, 700 W. State St., and roughly 58,000 in total at four locations. The report was based on a figure of 5,436 full-time students.

The survey found that 75% of full-time students think it is "very important" or "somewhat important" for MATC to provide student housing. Among full-time students, 14% responded they "definitely" would have lived in campus housing had it been offered in the fall 2005 semester.

Only two of 16 schools in the Wisconsin Technical College System offer student housing: Western Wisconsin Technical College in La Crosse and Southwest Wisconsin Technical College in Fennimore. Neither school owns the housing.

MATC officials are not looking to become landlords, primarily because the school lacks investment capital that a student residence requires.

"We're still looking for someone to build it for us," Sargent said.

College officials have had some discussions with representatives from the development company that holds an option to the former Pabst brewery immediately north and west of the MATC campus.

Milwaukee Ald. Robert Bauman said he supports the idea of building student housing near the MATC campus with the caveat that it remain privately owned and on the tax rolls.

Thats my view from the front. And as I wrote Whitney, when did ANY building improve. As an example, small but important, look at the windows proposed on the Kenilworth building (facing prospect) renderings compared to what they are actually doing.

When you start to build you start to cut corners. I went thru this even with MAM
I jumped the gun on the Keliworth windows. They are now starting to install the mullions on the already installed windows and they look great!

But I still think my basic point has been demonstrated many times with other buildings such as the change of the western facade of UTCs neighbor. (Can't keep track of all the acronyms) that Whitney wrote about a few months ago.

I jumped the gun on the Keliworth windows. They are now starting to install the mullions on the already installed windows and they look great!

But I still think my basic point has been demonstrated many times with other buildings such as the change of the western facade of UTCs neighbor. (Can't keep track of all the acronyms) that Whitney wrote about a few months ago.

Ill have to check that out. The windows on Kilborn Tower are cool, the recently added ones on UCT are also very cool looking.

http://graphics.jsonline.com/graphics/news/img/dec05/crime21g.gif

For the first three months of the year, serious crime dropped by 15.9% compared with the same time last year, police reported in October. For the first half of the year, serious crime dropped by 9.4% compared with the same time in 2004.

Full Story Here: JS Online.com (http://www.jsonline.com/news/metro/dec05/379352.asp)

Brewing condos at the Blatz
A Milwaukee development company has purchased the Blatz Apartments for $21.5 million and plans to convert the 169-unit downtown building to condominiums.

The conversion of the prominent apartment building will be the latest in a string of conversions of large apartment buildings in downtown Milwaukee to condominiums. Since 2002, developers have planned or built 2,352 condos valued at $739.4 million in four downtown-area aldermanic districts, many that are selling for more than $500,000.
Biz Journal Article (http://milwaukee.bizjournals.com/milwaukee/stories/2005/12/19/story1.html)

Investor's Northridge plan has promise
Hopes for its revival have been raised again, due to the recent purchase of 46 acres of the shopping center, including the 500,000-square-foot main mall building, by Michael Mirharooni, a Beverly Hills, Calif., real estate investor. Mirharooni wisely wants to expand possible uses for the mall beyond retail to include office, medical, education, entertainment and restaurants.

While Northridge's continuing vacancy was caused, in part, by a negative image among real estate brokers and retailers, there is a positive development on that front. City officials said crime has actually declined more than 22 percent in the area over the past 18 months.
Biz Journal Article (http://milwaukee.bizjournals.com/milwaukee/stories/2005/12/19/editorial1.html)

Manpower plans downtown move
New building will house headquarters
By TOM DAYKIN
tdaykin@journalsentinel.com
Posted: Dec. 21, 2005

Manpower Inc. (stock: MAN) will move its corporate headquarters from Glendale to a new building that will be built in downtown Milwaukee, the company is expected to announce today, according to sources who have been briefed about the decision.


The Manpower offices will be developed on a site east of N. Martin Luther King Drive and south of W. Cherry St., adjacent to Time Warner Cable's regional headquarters.

The site is just south of the Schlitz Park office park. It was identified in October as the leading candidate to land the $50 million development.

The new headquarters will be about 230,000 to 260,000 square feet and will house 850 employees for the global staffing company.

Sources who spoke Wednesday about the project asked not to be identified because they didn't want to be seen as pre-empting Manpower's announcement.

Manpower spokeswoman Margaret Gerstenkorn declined to comment.

The Manpower building will be the largest downtown office complex developed since the 227,000-square-foot 875 East building, at 875 E. Wisconsin Ave., was completed two years ago.

The Manpower project also is a rare example of a large suburban office user relocating to downtown.

Downtown lost market share to suburban office parks during the past 20 years. But the growth in downtown housing and night life has made the area more attractive to young professionals. Those things helped entice Roundy's Supermarkets Inc., which operates Pick 'n Save stores, to move its headquarters from the city of Pewaukee to the eight-story 875 East in 2003.

Today's Manpower announcement likely will include details on proposed city financial assistance for the project.

Mayor Tom Barrett is expected to propose a tax incremental financing district, in which the city borrows money to help finance development. That money is then repaid through the development's property taxes, usually over several years. Once the debt is repaid, the property taxes flow to the city, school district and other local governments.

Such districts require Common Council approval.

Sources said city officials were considering around $20 million in subsidies, with the bulk of that helping to finance a parking structure for Manpower employees.

Manpower's offices are now split between two Glendale locations. Manpower owns two adjacent buildings west of I-43 and south of W. Lexington Blvd. at 5301 N. Ironwood Road and 5235 N. Ironwood Road, totaling 112,000 square feet. The company also leases 125,000 square feet at 5055 N. Lydell Ave., about one-half mile east of the Ironwood Road buildings.

Manpower has been based in Glendale for more than 30 years. Before then, the company's offices were located downtown. The company expects to operate more efficiently by consolidating its offices at one location.

Milwaukee's willingness to help finance a parking structure to bring Manpower downtown comes after the city failed to land GE Healthcare's $89 million division offices in 2004.

GE Healthcare executives chose the Milwaukee County Research Park in Wauwatosa for its offices. Downtown fell out of the running in part because then-Mayor John O. Norquist did not want the city to subsidize a $43 million parking structure.

Great news!!

^Yeah, that is really great news.

I have only been to Milwaukee once but I totally love its downtown.

We have the Amtrak Hiawatha service and, in a few years, Metra service in Milwaukee too. These are exciting times--the whole Chicago-Milwaukee thing is really synergizing nicely

^Yeah, that is really great news.

I have only been to Milwaukee once but I totally love its downtown.

We have the Amtrak Hiawatha service and, in a few years, Metra service in Milwaukee too. These are exciting times--the whole Chicago-Milwaukee thing is really synergizing nicely


Did the METRA thing already get approved?!?!? If it did, then :dance2:

Manpower plans downtown move
New building will house headquarters
By TOM DAYKIN
tdaykin@journalsentinel.com
Posted: Dec. 21, 2005




The new headquarters will be about 230,000 to 260,000 square feet and will house 850 employees for the global staffing company.


Today's Manpower announcement likely will include details on proposed city financial assistance for the project.

Mayor Tom Barrett is expected to propose a tax incremental financing district, in which the city borrows money to help finance development. That money is then repaid through the development's property taxes, usually over several years. Once the debt is repaid, the property taxes flow to the city, school district and other local governments.

Sources said city officials were considering around $20 million in subsidies, with the bulk of that helping to finance a parking structure for Manpower employees.



Am I the only one who thinks its nuts that we are competing with our own suburbs for business? We're throwing money at a company already based here. This isn't bringing any new jobs to anyone, except the construction companies. If we're going to spend money on attracting businesses, at least lure some business from elsewhere, so we'll get an actual net gain in jobs.

Am I the only one who thinks its nuts that we are competing with our own suburbs for business? We're throwing money at a company already based here. This isn't bringing any new jobs to anyone, except the construction companies. If we're going to spend money on attracting businesses, at least lure some business from elsewhere, so we'll get an actual net gain in jobs.

I disagree. While Manpower was pretty close to downtown as it was--its not downtown. We are focusing on creating a diverse, active, and prosperous downtown, not better upper middle class inner circle suburbs. Adding jobs to a downtown area, one that especially has a lackluster office rating, is always a good thing. Manpower is a huge company with alot of employees--800 of them in downtown Milwaukee is huge for the city. The benefit of having these people commuting, working, eating lunch, whatever in downtown everyday far outweighs the job loss to Glendale. Glendale wont become like Flint because of this....people will just have to commute 5 minutes longer to work everyday. It actually will probally be better in its new location--being a short walk or a bus ride from people who desperately need jobs offered through Manpower or at Manpower itself. This just adds further fuel to the fire (a good fire that is) to this area--one that is booming, yet is adjacent to the ghetto.

I think it is ridiculous that cities have to throw money at companies to get them to locate within their borders. It's ridiculous when Beloit throws money at a company to locate from South Beloit, Illinois, and it's even more ridiculous when Wauwatosa throws money at a company to get them to move from West Allis.

It's ridiculous, but it's a system that we have to deal with. Ultimately it's driven by politics. Next election year Barrett will be able to say "I added 800 jobs to Downtown Milwaukee." That's a much more effective campaign slogan than: "we need to work together as a region, because Glendale's success is Milwaukee's success, is Wauwatosa's success, and so on."

I disagree. While Manpower was pretty close to downtown as it was--its not downtown. We are focusing on creating a diverse, active, and prosperous downtown, not better upper middle class inner circle suburbs. Adding jobs to a downtown area, one that especially has a lackluster office rating, is always a good thing. Manpower is a huge company with alot of employees--800 of them in downtown Milwaukee is huge for the city. The benefit of having these people commuting, working, eating lunch, whatever in downtown everyday far outweighs the job loss to Glendale. Glendale wont become like Flint because of this....people will just have to commute 5 minutes longer to work everyday. It actually will probally be better in its new location--being a short walk or a bus ride from people who desperately need jobs offered through Manpower or at Manpower itself. This just adds further fuel to the fire (a good fire that is) to this area--one that is booming, yet is adjacent to the ghetto.

Sorry, I normally agree with your posts, but I don't agree with you here. All this does is offset my company's (Blue Cross Blue Shield) move to West Allis. Theres 800 of us moving in May 2006.

Like I said, Manpower is already in the area. There will be NO additional job growth because of this. The same people who work in Glendale will now be downtown. Big deal. Just like big deal we're moving to West Allis.

If my tax money is going to be used for corporate welfare, at least let it be to lure a company here, where there will actually be some jobs to be had!! Why waste our money to help them build a new building? Where was Tom Barrett when we were looking for money for a new building? The Blue Cross management forwarded to all of us the reply letter we got back from Mr. Barrett, basically saying "you're on your own."

The only reason Barrett is so on-board with Manpower coming downtown is that Grunau is going to be the developer.....and Barrett is so far in his pocket it's shameful.

The only reason Barrett is so on-board with Manpower coming downtown is that Grunau is going to be the developer.....and Barrett is so far in his pocket it's shameful.

Lol, yes, we all have heard about that ol' chestnut before. :)

This is still good for downtown. So we threw a couple million towards it. I can live with it. A job agency within walking distance of an area that needs supporting jobs...it all works itself out.

Lol, yes, we all have heard about that ol' chestnut before. :)

This is still good for downtown. So we threw a couple million towards it. I can live with it. A job agency within walking distance of an area that needs supporting jobs...it all works itself out.


I'm not saying that the outcome won't be good. Of course it's good to have more business and more people. But why the pick-and-choose method that Barrett is famous for? All I'm saying is that there is a company, Blue Cross Blue Shield, ALREADY DOWNTOWN, that needs a new building and parking structure, and he says no, we won't give you any subsidies or tax breaks, no TIF, just go ahead and move out of the city. And then a company with an equal amount of employees wants to move downtown, and he's opening up the checkbook like never before. Maybe we should have gotten Grunau to do our project and we could have stayed downtown.

I'm not saying that the outcome won't be good. Of course it's good to have more business and more people. But why the pick-and-choose method that Barrett is famous for? All I'm saying is that there is a company, Blue Cross Blue Shield, ALREADY DOWNTOWN, that needs a new building and parking structure, and he says no, we won't give you any subsidies or tax breaks, no TIF, just go ahead and move out of the city. And then a company with an equal amount of employees wants to move downtown, and he's opening up the checkbook like never before. Maybe we should have gotten Grunau to do our project and we could have stayed downtown.

That is a great point. Never really thought about Blue Cross in regard to Manpower moving downtown. We should have thrown some change at you as well. Probally GE Healthcare too. Oh well, whats done is done.

Manpower Inc. confirmed today it will move its corporate headquarters from Glendale to new offices that will be built just south of the Schlitz Park office park, overlooking the Milwaukee River in downtown Milwaukee.

The four-story, 280,000-square-foot Manpower headquarters will be developed on a site east of N. Martin Luther King Drive and south of W. Cherry St., adjacent to Time Warner Cable’s regional headquarters. It will house 900 employees for the global staffing company, with 800 employees coming from Glendale and another 100 employees from Manpower’s Jefferson Wells subsidiary in Brookfield.

The growing global staffing company also could add another 300 employees to the new headquarters over the next five years, according to a company statement. Manpower hopes to be in the building by July 2007, said company spokeswoman Margaret Gerstenkorn.

The offices will be built by Schlitz Park developers Gary Grunau and Scott Sampson, and leased to Manpower. The $87 million project, known as RiverBend Place, will include a riverwalk and additional office space created within a former power plant building just north of the Time Warner Cable offices, Grunau said.

Mayor Tom Barrett is proposing that the city provide a $25.3 million grant for the project, which will be paid back over an estimated 18 to 20 years through RiverBend Place’s property taxes. That grant, which will mainly be used to help finance RiverBend Place’s parking structure, will require Common Council approval.

RiverBend Place will be the largest downtown office complex developed since the 283,450-square-foot 1000 North Water building, 1000 N. Water St., opened in 1992.


I think the questioning of why our city is throwing money at an existing company which has already established itself is very valid. It seems very hypocritical in this new age of regionalism. However, as an urbanist who cares much more about creating a lively and livable downtown, I see this as great news! The potential of adding 1,200 people downtown will boost the attractiveness of the whole Park East area. Many of these people may want to be closer to work, which leads to a further demand for housing, which will help bring more projects to the area. With this being said, I am a little concerned as to just how urban this complex will be. At only 4 stories, it seems as though we are going to have a giant suburban office complex on a prime riverfront parcel. Hopefully with all the money we are throwing at them, we will have a quality urban design.

I have never thought that a parking structure is a good use for TIF money. Nevertheless, I am happy about this development, for not only will it develop a long underused big parcel, it will surely spark redevelopment of the old warehouses on MLK Drive just north of McKinley, and it will bring thousands of new jobs and a source of employment for low skill, low education workers, right in the heart of the City. This is great on many levels.

I'm not concerned about the height, I think it will fit just fine within its context.

Also, I see this as one big "told you so" for those naysayers who argued that tearing down the Park East was a boondoggle. I don't think there's any doubt that this building would be going up the the Park East were still standing.

The offices will be built by Schlitz Park developers Gary Grunau and Scott Sampson, and leased to Manpower. The $87 million project, known as RiverBend Place, will include a riverwalk and additional office space created within a former power plant building just north of the Time Warner Cable offices, Grunau said.

Mayor Tom Barrett is proposing that the city provide a $25.3 million grant for the project, which will be paid back over an estimated 18 to 20 years through RiverBend Place’s property taxes.

What ever happened to the days when politicians weren't governed by the folks who pay for their campaign re-elections??

Also, an interesting note, our Mayor is proposing that $25 million of the total $87 million be city $$ (29% of the whole project)......but the Common Council wouldn't approve $41 million for the $317 million Pabst City project (13% of the total project). Why would our lame-brained Mayor think that this would pass, when an even greater percentage of the total project would be picked up by taxpayers?? Oh yeah, Grunau's involved, I forgot....

I think the big difference between Pabst and RiverBend is that Pabst was being developed by an out of towner and RiverBend is being developed by a local. This still is a very provincial city in many ways.

The Milwaukee County Board today approved a scaled-down replacement parking plan on the site of the courthouse annex, which is slated for demolition in conjunction with the Marquette Interchange project.

Supervisors voted 12-5 for a $1.75 million surface lot with a 10-foot-high ornamental security fence and tunnel access to the courthouse. A security guard booth is included in the plan.

Supervisors scrapped an earlier plan to construct a $6.8 million, two-story structure. The new parking is needed for county employees, as well as for state judges who work at the courthouse. Elected county officials currently park in the annex as well.


Full Story Here (http://www.jsonline.com/news/daywatch.asp)

As the details of the project begin to filter in, it appears that this is going to be much bigger than just Manpower. Overall I think this is going to attract several more jobs to the area. Here is some additional information that has been given to the Milwaukee Journal Sentinal...

Also, a planned $10 million remodeling of a former power plant south of the future Manpower headquarters will create 60,000 square feet for 240 employees from other businesses, RiverBend Place developer Gary Grunau said.

The result will be two new office buildings, with more than 1,400 employees, in RiverBend Place’s first phase, to be completed by July 2007. Grunau and his partners have a 17-year lease with Manpower and are seeking tenants for the power plant building. Construction on both buildings is scheduled to begin by March.

Additional development phases could occur at RiverBend Place if demand for office space remains strong, Grunau said.

"It’s a lot bigger than just Manpower," Grunau said.

RiverBend Place will include a 1,200-stall parking ramp for Manpower, built north of W. Cherry St. and connected to Manpower’s headquarters by a skywalk.

Manpower also could help attract other companies that want to build their offices on nearby parcels left vacant by the former Park East Freeway demolition, Barrett said.

I don't know if the number of 240 additional employees that was thrown out there is already in the works or not. However, I do like the fact that they are renovating the former power plant as part of the development.

What ever happened to the days when politicians weren't governed by the folks who pay for their campaign re-elections??

Also, an interesting note, our Mayor is proposing that $25 million of the total $87 million be city $$ (29% of the whole project)......but the Common Council wouldn't approve $41 million for the $317 million Pabst City project (13% of the total project). Why would our lame-brained Mayor think that this would pass, when an even greater percentage of the total project would be picked up by taxpayers?? Oh yeah, Grunau's involved, I forgot....

when were those days?
probably never happened,

A new $94 million office complex Downtown with 1,400 jobs....

today's a good day for the city of Milwaukee.

A new $94 million office complex Downtown with 1,400 jobs....

today's a good day for the city of Milwaukee.

yeah, I agree. However, I am listening to Behling right now and he (like you would expect) is making good arguments against it. 25 million for a 6 mile move does seem kind of steep...however the benefits for downtown Milwaukee are very promising.

Did the METRA thing already get approved?!?!?

No.

The Metra extension has been "approved" in the sense that the decision-makers have agreed to continue studying, in more detail now, how it could be built, how it could be run, and how it could be paid for.

It is not a "for sure" thingl yet, and in theory, could be derailed if those questions cannot be favorably answered.

What ever happened to the days when politicians weren't governed by the folks who pay for their campaign re-elections??

Also, an interesting note, our Mayor is proposing that $25 million of the total $87 million be city $$ (29% of the whole project)......but the Common Council wouldn't approve $41 million for the $317 million Pabst City project (13% of the total project). Why would our lame-brained Mayor think that this would pass, when an even greater percentage of the total project would be picked up by taxpayers?? Oh yeah, Grunau's involved, I forgot....


What's with the conspiracy theories? Your companys move was based on the fact that the new building would have lower rent.

I think the big difference between Pabst and RiverBend is that Pabst was being developed by an out of towner and RiverBend is being developed by a local. This still is a very provincial city in many ways.

Not so sure that's the case, as PabstCity was being developed by a partnership of big-name local (Wispark), small-name local (James Haertel's group), and big-name out-of-towner (Ferchill Group) developers. For whatever reason, perhaps provinciality (?) the local media rarely ever mentioned anybody else but Wispark whenever PabstCity was brought up in the news.

One of the big hang-ups for PabstCity seemed to be the lease issue, which as I recall, was mostly short-term stuff to begin with, and then included something like a 5-year "out clause" that really worried the Common Council.
But for the RiverBend project, Manpower has agreed to something with a bit more permanance with the 17-year lease. The fact that they'll bring corporate office type jobs, as opposed to retail/service jobs might also play a role.

Also, an interesting note, our Mayor is proposing that $25 million of the total $87 million be city $$ (29% of the whole project)......but the Common Council wouldn't approve $41 million for the $317 million Pabst City project (13% of the total project). Why would our lame-brained Mayor think that this would pass, when an even greater percentage of the total project would be picked up by taxpayers?? Oh yeah, Grunau's involved, I forgot....

There is less risk involved with Manpower than there was with PabstCity. For Mapower, they're building a new headquarters...coroporate stuff, and it's pretty much a permanent thing unless for some reason the compnay goes under. For PabstCity, it was anchored by a large enterainment/retail district, which really would really depend on if people would actually shop/eat/play there, and this was precisely what the short-term leases and out-clauses were all about (i.e. "If we're not satisfied with the amount of business were doing at PabstCity after five years, we want to be able to shut down and pull out" kind of agreements).

I have never thought that a parking structure is a good use for TIF money.

Yeah, kind of lame unfortunately, but also kind of a necessary evil. It might be slightly less disappointing if a shared parking arrangement could be worked out, where the public would be able to use the parking structure after business hours and on weekends...but since the structure will have a skywalk connecting to the new office building across the street (very disappoitning!), that's probably out of the question. Here's hoping someone down at DCD can nix that.

Nevertheless, I am happy about this development, for not only will it develop a long underused big parcel, it will surely spark redevelopment of the old warehouses on MLK Drive just north of McKinley, and it will bring thousands of new jobs and a source of employment for low skill, low education workers, right in the heart of the City. This is great on many levels.

Yeah, this should give thar area around MLK Drive a good shot in the arm. Some smaller new buildings and warehouse conversions are already going on, but the Manpower move will give that area even more momentum.

By the way, this is the general area where the Harley-Davidson museum was originally planned. The museum itself would have gone in some of the old Schlitz buildings a bit north of Cherry Street; the smaller powerhouse a bit south of Cherry Street was going to be renovated into a restaurant and hotel; and the parking lots in between that are there now would have ramined parking lots. So it appears Harlkey's inability to devlop its museum there (too expensive to convert the old buildings) turned out to be a good thing after all. Not only will the RiverBend project develop those surface parking lots with a parking structure and office, but the small powerhouse will be rehabbed as well. Which ties into this...

I am a little concerned as to just how urban this complex will be. At only 4 stories, it seems as though we are going to have a giant suburban office complex on a prime riverfront parcel. Hopefully with all the money we are throwing at them, we will have a quality urban design.

Height is not really what makes a place urban, so you shouldn't really mistake something low-rise as being un-urban. There are design guildelines and regulations in place for this parcel to prevent anything built there from being too suburban in nature. At the very least, hold off until the design is revealed, then we'll know whether it'll have the qualities of a suburban office complex or an urban office complex.

Not so sure that's the case, as PabstCity was being developed by a partnership of big-name local (Wispark), small-name local (James Haertel's group), and big-name out-of-towner (Ferchill Group) developers. For whatever reason, perhaps provinciality (?) the local media rarely ever mentioned anybody else but Wispark whenever PabstCity was brought up in the news.

Fair enough. I have been to enough public meetings though, to know that a development faces more of an uphill climb if the developer is from out of town, and especially *Chicago*. I don't think the Council thinks this way, but enough people in the community do to influence their thinking at least a little bit.

My problems with the Pabst proposal were many, but one thing that stood out was when I learned that HOB is a perennial money loser and is not exactly in the midst of a building boom right now. Far from it. Seemed like a shaky foundation for such a major project.

So it was a parking structure that got Manpower downtown. No big surprise. But it makes me wonder what might have been had Norquist been willing to fund GE Healthcare's parking structure at Ovation Plaza. I guess we'll never find out.

As for the skywalk, hopefully the City will have enough leverage to take it out. Then while they're at it if they could convince the owners of 100 East Wisconsin or the building across Water Street to eliminate the skywalk over Water Street that blocks the view of City Hall.... what a great day for Downtown if they ever succeed in getting that piece of crap removed.

Overall I'm very happy about the Manpower development, mainly because it has the potential to bring a bunch of jobs adjacent to neighborhoods where jobs are needed the most. For me, that is the most important thing.

Here's an extensive article about Manpower/RiverBend Place from the Small Business Times: Manpower's move will bring 900 jobs to downtown Milwaukee (http://biztimes.datajoe.com/app/ecom/pub_article_details.php?id=77806)

Here's an extensive article about Manpower/RiverBend Place from the Small Business Times: Manpower's move will bring 900 jobs to downtown Milwaukee (http://biztimes.datajoe.com/app/ecom/pub_article_details.php?id=77806)

I winced when I read the line about how the "brick building" will "fit in with the surrounding buildings" including Schlitz and the Time Warner building.

It doesn't guarantee it will be crap, but now we can't expect anything terribly avant guard either.

Let's hope Greenstreet et al can prevent another Midwest Center or, worse, 1000 N Water.

My problems with the Pabst proposal were many, but one thing that stood out was when I learned that HOB is a perennial money loser and is not exactly in the midst of a building boom right now. Far from it. Seemed like a shaky foundation for such a major project.

Precisley. Now add on top of that the glut of live performance venues in Milwaukee, the poor performance of the newly remodeled Milwaukee Theatre, Gameworks, which is in, or just recently came out of bankruptcy, a movie theatre that was downsized and changed owner/operators and the mention of 5 year out clauses. Sure doesn't sound like a slam dunk to me. Of course when a city gets obsessed with a project because everywhere you look some metro area cbd is getting a massive entertainment complex developed by Cordish and we got to have one too, people tend not to take the time to think.

The Manpower HQ in downtown is a fantastic turn of events. It keeps the housing/condo boom rolling, (wanna bet Mandel breaks ground pretty damn quick on his Tannery project across the river?!), provides 900 more customers for downtown businesses, fills hotel rooms (yeah!) with business travelers and anchors a developing area immediately north of downtown. Not to mention the added benefit of having the whole of the previous benefits being greater than their individual sum due to them taking place in a dense urban setting. Call it synergy, call it a multiplier effect, call it whatever you want. Manpower downtown is far better for Milwaukee and thereby the metro area as whole than Manpower in Glendale.

Would it be great if it were a company from outside of the metro area. Yes. Would it be great if we didn't have to subsidize a parking deck. Yes. Unfortunately that is not how the world works when it comes to getting office tenants downtown. Pretty much any major downtown office building outside of NYC and Chicago gets subsidized in some way shape or form. Just ask Minneapolis and the $50.0 mil they threw at Target to keep and expand their headquarters downtown. We are not yet remotely close to a period in time where employers demand to be downtown because that is where all their workers want to live. We have over a 1/2 century to overcome.

What's with the conspiracy theories? Your companys move was based on the fact that the new building would have lower rent.

You are correct, but it wasn't that simple. The building we are in is nearly 30 years old, and needs major upgrades. The owner was willing to make the upgrades, but then charge even higher rent, but we still wouldn't have attached parking. The main players involved in making the decision wanted to remain downtown, either with City help at the current Michigan St location, or with City help at another location downtown (with parking). There were no downtown locations big enough to handle us that were cheap. But in the end, the amount the City would help still didn't balance out the $3-per-square-foot less rent in West Allis.

The City is willing to throw millions and millions for a company already based in the area, but not willing to extend the same help to a company already here. It's not a "conspiracy theory," it's a fact. One of the proposals for remodeling our current building was to attach a parking structure to the west side of the building, to 5th street. No City willingness to help there. I just don't see what's different about Manpower than Blue Cross.

I just don't see what's different about Manpower than Blue Cross.

Manpower sounds manly and powerful....and gay in some regards. Thats all I can come up with. Perhaps it will draw many gays to the city. Its like girlpower, but for homosexual men.

http://img467.imageshack.us/img467/439/ddddd3hs.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

Manpower sounds manly and powerful....and gay in some regards. Thats all I can come up with. Perhaps it will draw many gays to the city. Its like girlpower, but for homosexual men.

So, the corner of King and Cherry will become the heart of the city's gay scene? Awesome.

So, the corner of King and Cherry will become the heart of the city's gay scene? Awesome.

King and Cherry........:lol: Just sounds like the area of a booming gay district. You have to leave the Martin Luther part out though.

King and Cherry........:lol: Just sounds like the area of a booming gay district. You have to leave the Martin Luther part out though.

This forum is getting a tad off track.. :)

This forum is getting a tad off track.. :)

A tad??? :runaway:

King and Cherry........:lol: Just sounds like the area of a booming gay district. You have to leave the Martin Luther part out though.

shouldn't it be queen and cherry? wow.. that's really gay