View Full Version : Farewell, Condo Cashouts


brickell
February 17th, 2006, 10:23 PM
http://www.nytimes.com/2006/02/17/business/17investors.html?_r=1&8hpib=&oref=slogin&pagewanted=all

Farewell, Condo Cash-Outs


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By MOTOKO RICH
Published: February 17, 2006

When developers in Arlington, Va., threw a party 18 months ago to showcase plans for Clarendon 1021, a condominium development that had not yet been built, 3,600 prospective buyers stood in line just for the chance to book reservations to bid on the apartments.

Now, less than a year after the building opened, speculators in this and other buildings are putting dozens of units on the market at the same time, causing asking prices and profits to slip.

Of 23 investors who sold since Clarendon 1021 opened last summer, the three most recent sellers actually lost money, after paying all fees, and average profits in the building have declined since August, said Frank Borges LLosa, owner of FranklyRealty.com.

The Great Condo Gold Rush is fading from memory and the Great Sell-Off has begun. "Money Down! Motivated Seller, Want More? Just Ask!" screamed an investor's online advertisement last week for a one-bedroom apartment in Clarendon 1021 that had never been lived in.

"I hate it when people say prices can never go down," said Mr. LLosa, a resident of the building. "The speculators make the profits more volatile."

Over the last few years, real estate speculators looking to make a quick gain also snapped up preconstruction condos in Chicago, Miami and San Diego. With prices rising by more than 20 percent a year, short-term buyers figured that by the time the condos were ready to occupy, they could sell them without ever moving in, clearing thousands of dollars in profits.

But as more speculators look to cash out in recently hot condo markets around the country, some economists say they could put even more downward pressure on prices in those buildings where for-sale listings are swelling. In Miami, at the Jade Residences at Brickell Bay, more than 20 percent of the building's 352 units are on the market. In San Diego, about a third of the 96 units in the Alicante, a condominium that opened last fall, are listed for sale and sellers are already starting to cut asking prices.

In Donald Trump's luxury condos at 120 Riverside Boulevard in Manhattan, owners of more than one-fifth of the building's 250 units are currently marketing their apartments. With so much inventory, said Ilan Bracha, a broker with Prudential Douglas Elliman in New York, "the buyers are coming in, checking the best views and then they negotiate. This is the reality."

While investors made up only 9.5 percent of residential mortgages nationally in the 10 months through October, according to First American Corporation's LoanPerformance, a San Francisco mortgage data firm, the numbers are much higher in places like San Diego, where investors represented 13.5 percent of residential mortgages, and Miami, where they were 16 percent.

Hans Nordby, research strategist at Property and Portfolio Research in Boston, said those numbers underreport the real level of speculation in those markets because many buyers disguise their intentions when they get their mortgages. As those speculators flood the market, he said, they will put pressure on other sellers to cut prices, too. "A rising or sinking tide affects all boats," Mr. Nordby said.

Still, a sell-off in speculative condos is unlikely to start a widespread housing crash, because condos were more overbuilt than single-family homes during the recent boom, said Joseph Gyourko, professor of real estate and finance at the Wharton School of the University of Pennsylvania. But weakness in the condo market, he said, "is a consistent indicator that the great boom has really ended."

For those buyers who had dreamed of quick riches, the change in the market has come as a sobering lesson. A little over a year ago, Shabana Qureshi, a 26-year-old engineer, put deposits down on two condos in Arlington. "My friends were making hundreds of thousands of dollars off of properties," Ms. Qureshi said. "I just thought I'll take this risk now and not think about it too much, and once the time comes I can either sell it or use it depending on my needs."

She moved into a one-bedroom condo at Clarendon 1021 with hardwood floors, granite kitchen countertops and a heated pool on the roof. But having taken a pay cut with a new job, she can no longer afford the mortgage and maintenance fees, which are almost $3,000 a month.

Last week, she put the condo, for which she paid $438,000, on the market for $470,000 and plans to move into the other condo she bought in Arlington. She is selling the Clarendon condo herself to save on the real estate commission. But even if she gets her asking price, she figures she will break even after closing costs.

Having scrimped to buy at what she said she believed was the peak of the market, Ms. Qureshi said she regretted her investments. If she had to do it all over again, she said she would have spent more money on travel and a new car. "I would have been more carefree and invested once I had a family," she said.

In the last few years, speculators were drawn to real estate because of double-digit appreciation. Nationally, median condo prices increased by nearly 13 percent, to $218,200, in 2005, according to the National Association of Realtors. But earlier this month, the group, which is based in Washington, forecast a slowdown in the rate of appreciation, saying that median home prices for all housing types — single family, townhouses, condominiums and co-ops — would rise by only 5 percent this year.

Already, the rate of appreciation in some of the hottest markets for speculators has slowed. In San Diego, the median home price (the exact middle of all prices) rose at an annual rate of just 2.5 percent in January, compared with 20 percent a year earlier, according to DataQuick Information Systems, a research firm.

Last week, in a sign of a broader slowdown in the housing market, Toll Brothers, the luxury home builder, said orders for new homes fell by nearly 30 percent in the three months ended Jan. 31. On Monday, KB Homes also said that orders were down significantly and that more buyers were canceling contracts.

At the same time, developers are still building condos in Miami, New York and Chicago, so speculators trying to sell will also have to compete with new units coming on the market.

The slowdown will affect all sellers, of course, but speculators may be more acutely affected if they were expecting speedy profits or are paying mortgage and maintenance costs on empty apartments. In some cases, even if they rent them out, the rents will not cover their costs.

This is not the first time that condo markets have been influenced by investors. In the late 1980's, developers converted thousands of condo units in the Northeast and many of them were bought by speculators, said Karl E. Case, an economist at Wellesley College. Many of those investors, he said, ended up losing money when they sold in the early 1990's. "It was ugly," he said.

More experienced investors take a philosophical view of what they see as inevitable setbacks. R. Dawn Stahl, a lawyer in San Diego who bought two apartments in the Alicante, is now trying to sell both of them.

But in a city where there are about 6,200 condos for sale, up from about 3,100 this time last year, according to the San Diego Association of Realtors, it has been difficult to lure buyers. Ms. Stahl has yet to receive any offers, so she has already lowered her asking price on one of the listings from $650,000 to $599,000.

She paid $499,000 for that two-bedroom apartment and said she believed she would make a small profit after paying commissions and capital gains taxes. But if she cannot sell within a few months, she will rent the apartments out instead.

"I knew that was a risk that I took," Ms. Stahl said.

But a reason that a speculative sell-off is not likely to lead to a bursting bubble is that unlike stocks, where investors can panic and sell large volumes in a matter of hours, owners of real estate will only slash prices so far. "People resist and don't sell," said Mr. Case. "It tends to stabilize prices."

A year and a half ago, Erez Abkzer, who owns a window treatment business in New York, signed a contract for a one-bedroom condo facing the river in 120 Riverside for $850,000. "The market was booming and I decided to jump on that wagon," he said.

He closed on the apartment last month and immediately listed it for $1.1 million. He said he would rent the apartment rather than lower his price. "Otherwise it would all be in vain," Mr. Abkzer said. "I won't make money on it."

Some brokers say that speculators have unrealistic profit expectations. "I think a lot of sellers are saying I should make X percent," said Eve Thompson, an agent with Long & Foster in Fairfax, Va. "But your chances of being able to do that are as good as going to Oracle and telling them you want more for your stock."

In Miami, where there appears to be a large overhang of investor properties, sellers are still making profits, said Ron Shuffield, president of Esslinger-Wooten-Maxwell Realtors. But with the inventory of available condos having jumped from about 5,400 listings at the end of December 2004 to about 12,750 now, he said, asking prices have come down in the last three or four months. Mr. Shuffield said he was confident that there would eventually be takers for most of those condos because of the influx of buyers from Latin America and Europe as well as baby boomers from the Northeast.

But some real estate watchers say there is evidence that demand is starting to slacken in Miami. According to Michael Y. Cannon, managing director of Integra Realty Resources-South Florida, a market analyst, the volume of sales of existing condos declined by 9.6 percent in South Florida between 2004 and 2005.

For now, the bumper crop of properties is a boon to buyers. In San Diego, Tom Hinks, a 21-year-old who is looking to buy a condo downtown, has realized he can take his time.

His approach might scare some sellers. Since Mr. Hinks started looking four months ago, he has viewed 30 condos. "I've actually liked quite a few of them," he said. "But every day it seems like the prices are starting to trim down so I don't want to pay too much."

Roark
February 18th, 2006, 03:45 AM
Yeah, read this today.
This really drives me crazy! The NYT leads people to belive that the Arlington market is the same as the Miami market is the same as the Manhattan market.
Thank goodness the faithful SSC forumers are 100 times smarter than that!! We know that real estate is local. We also know that when some journalists have preconceived notion about what they want the reader to believe, they will hand a pick a quote to support the presumption. How about this gem...But some real estate watchers say there is evidence that demand is starting to slacken in Miami. According to Michael Y. Cannon, managing director of Integra Realty Resources-South Florida, a market analyst, the volume of sales of existing condos declined by 9.6 percent in South Florida between 2004 and 2005.
As smart SSC forumers, lets analyze that one. real estate watchers say there is evidence that demand is starting to slacken in Miami Hmmmm....EXISTING condos. Existing down 9.6 percent. Geez, what about the NEW condos whose sales have increased in triples digits?!?!?
Isn't that "evidence" that demand has not slakened???
Oh, those newspaper guys...in totallity, there are way more condos demanded in our Miami market than last year, or the year before, or the year before....etc.

Here is my favorite genius New York Times Real estate article. The headline is laughable because the median price of a Miami Beach condo was up 19% that year. "Chill Out" puh-leeeeeese.
____________________________________________
November 8, 2001, Thursday

HOUSE & HOME/STYLE DESK
TURF; Miami Beach Buyers Chill Out
By TRACIE ROZHON
MIAMI BEACH -- AT the north end of Ocean Drive, the Art Deco axis of South Florida's night life, the Breez restaurant sits empty. It's a bar without drinkers, a restaurant without diners. It laid off its star chef five weeks ago. ''We do a lot of cleaning,'' said Gabriel Fernandez, the 25-year-old bartender, wiping the sinuous aluminum bar.
A nearby parking lot contains just two cars. One has a ''For Sale'' sign on the windshield. The other belongs to the attendant.
Farther down the beachfront strip, sidewalk hawkers offer two-for-one piña coladas and rum punches, thrusting menus into the hands of passers-by. At the Delano, Ian Schrager's oceanfront hotel, the icy chic of the corridors is undisturbed by human visitation: the long white marble sushi bar is empty. The Zen-like dining room has only a few patrons.
For the last decade, Miami Beach has welcomed fashion photographers, interior designers and a fabulous fraternity of club hoppers -- all of whom coexisted with an older population in Bermuda shorts and knee-high black socks. As a photograph, and as a happening, it worked. But this fall the scene has evaporated. The jets are half empty, and many of the hotels are struggling to stay alive.
After seven years of ever-ascending prices, Miami Beach's overheated real estate market is finally cooling down. ''Everybody -- buyers and renters -- is cautious right now,'' Zaino Mizani, a real estate agent with Majestic Properties, a company that both sells and develops condominiums, said Tuesday. ''It's hard to convince people to buy. If they have to come here because of job relocation, they'd rather rent and hold on to the cash and see what happens.''
Some developers are making deals, not only for condos but for rentals. This week at the Waverly, a new rental project that is only 60 percent full, the landlords are offering between one and two months' free rent; two-bedrooms go for $2,235.
The city's market is starting to bloat with listings of high-priced houses and half-built condominium developments, according to figures gathered by the local real estate agents association.
Before Sept. 11, there were 540 condominium apartments on the market. This week, there were 1,497 -- almost triple the number. Before the attacks in New York, there were 73 houses in Miami Beach on the market. Now, there are 260.
Bruce Singer, the president of the Miami Beach Chamber of Commerce, said he worries about a glut of new condominiums in tall towers that are still on the drawing boards, or just starting to rise. ''It's not an opportune time,'' he said.
Mayor Neisen O. Kasdin is uneasy, too. ''New hotel development, office construction and retail were already slowing,'' he said. Until Sept. 11, residential real estate was ''continuing very strong.'' Now, he is awaiting the sales figures. ''There is a good deal of concern,'' he said. ''There's no candy-coating it; tourism has been hit bad after 9/ 11.'' Last weekend's cancellation of the Art Basel Miami Beach show, a result of fears of terrorism and anthrax, left Miamians reeling, the mayor said.
In an oceanfront area of mid-1990's condominium towers, the first of what was to have been twin projects has been built. ''We've heard the second has been delayed,'' Mr. Mizani said. He gestured to a sign there proclaiming the Continuum development: ''Never Before, Never Again.'' ''That may be true,'' he said, with a wry smile. (The developer said there was no date set for groundbreaking on the second tower.)
At the Green Diamond tower on Collins Avenue, near the famous Fontainebleau Hotel, condominiums are selling for $350,000 to $800,000, around 20 percent to 30 percent less than similar ones at its twin next door, the Blue Diamond, which opened for business first. At the Yacht Club at Portofino, a 38-story, 220-unit condominium, there are 63 apartments for sale; 20 came on the market after Sept. 11. At the corner of Second Street and Collins Avenue is Ocean Place, a much smaller development. It is almost finished, but it appears that workers have walked off the job, leaving unfinished plasterwork and lighting fixtures hanging from their cords.
Of the 17 properties shown on a recent tour of houses for sale, 10 had come on the market after Sept. 11.
Five of the rest had been reduced significantly. The price of one town house condominium had been reduced three times: from $425,000 to $380,000 to $365,000 to $349,000. A 1924 villa on Hibiscus Island had already been reduced from $3.5 million to $3.29 million on Oct. 4. The next day, it was reduced again, to $2.95 million. The stucco had been troweled -- and retroweled -- on a classic Mediterranean-style movie star mansion that desperately needed renovation, but the bones were there: a double-height living room with a stone fireplace, overlooking a swimming pool and an 80-foot waterfront. A white yacht was moored out front -- blocking most of the view.
At another open house, for Villa Palma, a $3.4-million house with a marble fountain and a tennis court, the broker handed out fliers. ''Owner very motivated and has reduced price yet again,'' they said.
Samuel Spencer Blum, a real estate lawyer here, said he has seen ''a definite decrease'' in new contracts. Mr. Blum blamed the lull on the national economy and on the terrorist attacks in New York. (Almost unmentioned here are the anthrax attacks in Boca Raton.) ''If they're afraid to buy a toaster,'' Mr. Blum said, ''they're going to be afraid to buy a second home.''
In the Coral Gables section of Miami, he said, ''three contracts have fallen through in the last week; nothing's wrong with the house -- people kept getting cold feet.''
Nevertheless, some brokers are far from pessimistic. Jerry Grabill, chairman of the Realtor Association of Greater Miami and the Beaches, said the market ''hasn't changed very much: I expected it to go down the tubes, but it seems to be stable.''
Alan Jacobson, president of Wimbish-Riteway Realtors, who deals in the most expensive properties in Miami Beach, said business is fine. ''We have 13 signed contracts over $1 million since Sept. 11,'' he said. ''That's below our average, but it's not a reflection of a down market.''
In general, Mr. Jacobson said, ''what has happened is, the supply of properties starts to exceed demand, and the prices come down. Those people who were waiting to put their house on the market are no longer waiting.'' He predicted that ''real estate will remain stable in South Florida as it always has been.''
''Buyers who believe they can get a steal in this market are wrong,'' he said.
Mr. Jacobson is right about customers not getting a steal. In fact, Michael Y. Cannon, a real estate appraiser, said prices do not appear to be affected. ''But the jury is still out,'' he conceded. He said data on the real estate market would not be fully digested until December. One sign of a softening, Mr. Cannon said, was the increasing number of classified advertisements in local newspapers placed by owners of unfinished condominiums trying to unload their investments. But overall, he said he disagreed with ''the pundits'' who predict sharp price declines.
Even if there are no steals, most buyers here expect a reduction, or at least more bargaining room, said Mr. Mizani of Majestic Properties.
Jason Bryan, manager of Johnny Rockets restaurant in the Coconut Grove section of Miami, was out looking for a two-bedroom bargain rental two weeks ago. ''There's lots of selection, and a lot more room to negotiate a price,'' he said. ''We see a lot that have been reduced.'' (Miami's Multiple Listing Service shows 1,069 rentals available in Miami Beach; of those, 469 came on since Sept. 11.)
Mr. Bryan passed the Johnny Rockets on Ocean Drive. There were two people sitting at tables on the sidewalk. Inside, there was no one. ''Last year, it would have been packed,'' he said. At the cafe at Gloria Estefan's Cardozo Hotel, there were 13 people sitting along the wraparound porch.
Again, no one was inside.
But the people here say they hope that when the weather up North turns cold, the tourists will remember Miami Beach.
''Oh, honey, of course Sept. 11 affects our economy,'' said Mitchell Wolfson Jr., the founder of the Wolfsonian Museum. ''But Miami Beach has the capacity to reinvent itself,'' Mr. Wolfson concluded. ''The city has done it before.''

nimbyhater
February 19th, 2006, 02:28 AM
fukin liberal media... i wonder what rush has to say on the real estate subject...

logybogy
February 19th, 2006, 09:21 AM
Lenders are starting to leave the area...I think we are going to see a lot of the projects go bye-bye with inexperienced developers.

Financing to build condos withers
By Pat Beall

Palm Beach Post Staff Writer

Sunday, February 19, 2006

There goes the fast money.

Major commercial lenders are withdrawing from financing South Florida condo construction and conversion deals, another sign the overheated market may be too hot to handle.

UBS AG is out of the Miami market, confirmed spokesman Peter Casey. So is GE Commercial Finance. Philadelphia-based private real estate investment firm AMC Delancey is still interested in Florida. Just not, for the time being, South Florida.

"We are seeing lenders overall pulling the plug," said Dan Kodsi, president of Royal Palm Communities, a developer in Boca Raton.

It's not only lenders on the construction end who are newly nervous about risk. The federal government hopes to damp the sale of exotic home mortgages which enable even credit-poor prospective homeowners to buy. So, even if condo developers get financing, condo buyers may not.

The likely upshot: "There are many thousands of condo units announced as future projects or in the planning stages that will never get going," predicts Bradley Hunter, director of Metrostudy's South Florida Division in West Palm Beach. "They won't even get to the starting line."

That's downright starry-eyed compared to the dark prediction served up by Fitch Ratings Service, the New York credit ratings company. Fitch projects that one out of every 10 condo conversion deals nationally inked last year will fall flat.

Jack McCabe hasn't stuck a figure on it, but the Deerfield Beach-based real estate prognosticator and president of McCabe Research and Consulting is talking of creating a vulture fund poised to swoop in on distressed properties and pick them up for a song.

AMC Delancey CEO Kenneth Balin said of the tightened lending, "It doesn't mean the fundamentals aren't strong."

"It means people are playing a game of musical chairs and when the music stops, someone is not going to have a chair."

You don't have to be a real estate whiz to spot the early warning signs that condo financing is being hamstrung by everything from the high price of construction to skittishness over rising interest rates.

"See how many are dark at night," said McCabe of condos newly on the market. "There might be one light on for every 20 units. People are not living there. It is the height of the season, but they are sitting dark."

Rebel Cook, a local broker, said, "People call me every day asking me to sell their properties."

Real estate agent Darlene Delano said when she recently took a client to view a North Flagler condo, it was empty.

"This is a four-story building and we did not see one person while we were parking, or on any floor," Delano said. "In fact, we didn't see anyone from the time we walked in, to the time we left."

Even "pre-sold" buildings are struggling. That's because would-be owners who put down deposits thinking they would secure a 2.5 percent interest rate mortgage are now facing rates of 5.5 percent and higher — just as the condo is ready for occupancy, and they have to sign mortgage papers.

"Within the last three weeks, I have seen several reservation holders who walked away from earnest money deposits," McCabe said. "There was a fellow who had put over $100,000 down who walked away."

Builders blindsided by rising materials costs can lose a lot more than that.

"There are some horror stories where developers opened their presales department and signed contracts and then went to build only to find out (construction) prices have gone up — and now they find out they have sold everything too cheap," Balin said. "They priced it wrong."

That appeared to be the case at Promenade Condominiums in Boynton Beach, where reservation money was returned to buyers last month after the developer cited "meteoric rises in construction costs." One of those buyers has since sued, in part because the condos were put back on the market for sale — in his case, for an extra $70,000.

At Opera Place, BAP of Miami's high-profile high-rise in downtown West Palm Beach, the rising cost of materials prices forced the developer to assess a "construction surcharge" to those converting reservations to contracts. Miami developer BBB Group didn't even get that far. Citing a lack of financing — and construction costs that made generous financing necessary — BBB called it quits last week, walking away from its planned 49-story, 364-unit Brickell Bay condo.

To be sure, most major finance firms and banks can withstand taking a hit if sales at their projects slump. Speculative investors hoping to make a quick buck reselling are another story. The going figure is that half of all South Florida condo purchases within the past one to two years have been made by investors. McCabe is among those who thinks the number of such investors is closer to 70 percent.

What no one disputes is that many of those investors are real estate novices.

"The taxi driver, the shoeshine guy are taking on a whole different level of risk," said Balin. "Might as well go to the Seminole casino."

Down cycles inevitable

The more optimistic believe that empty condos will ease the shortage of affordable apartments, as investors who can't sell opt for leasing their empty units. Delano said she represents several people "who have bought units and now are unable to sell them, so they are contemplating renting."

But, she said, most condo deeds restrict rentals.

Further, "People are not going to be able to rent these out at anywhere near the amount needed to cover" their costs, McCabe said. That's because many of the new units were designed to appeal to the luxury market, and a lease big enough to cover seven-figure mortgages is out of reach for many renters.

Balin agreed. "The numbers don't work as a rental," he said.

As a result, speculators who can't quickly resell are likely to wind up renting their units at a loss.

Down market cycles are nothing new to South Florida, of course.

"I would counsel people not to think that the sky is falling," said Metrostudy's Hunter.

Some will even benefit. Kodsi, for one, said developers are now approaching him to partner on already announced deals, using his established company's 30-year track record to nail down financing. Shakeouts, he added, "are good for the industry."

And, of course, building has not ground to a complete halt. About 600 showed up at The Related Group of Florida's recent party to unveil its tony ICON Palm Beach, a 21-story residential tower on Flagler Drive. According to a spokeswoman, two people signed contracts on the spot.

dach2k5
February 20th, 2006, 05:01 PM
The number of condos actually completed during this boom is still relatively small. I don't think it's clear what will happen when thousands of units start to come onto the market every year for the next 5 years. At some point, people need to actually live in a significant chunk of these units. How many of these investors can actually afford to close and carry their unit for a significant amount of time should the market turn a bit?

One thing that I can say for certain is that when you are in the middle of a boom it is very easy to forget times when you weren't in that boom. This happens to a lot of investors in stocks, bonds, etc.

Roark
February 20th, 2006, 05:32 PM
:) I'd bet Rush doesn't talk much about real estate, he's got plenty of other topics to be running with these days!
A couple of comments, mostly about that Palm Beach Post Article.
1. Bankers have been pulling out tightening lending parameters for over a year now. We have known this.
2. Fitch predicts 1 out of 10 would tank this year. Not bad! About 1 in 10 didn't get built while we were in a boom cycle!
3. Jack McCabe leads a "vulture fund" (the author didn't mention that, or didn't know that). The vulture fund raises money to buy distressed condos if buyers don't close or need to get out. McCabe has been predicted the bust correctly zero times out of the last 3 years!!! He probably prays that someone will finally listen to him and cancel their contract!
4. Supply and Demand: As the 1390's and the ____________(insert the next one) return deposits, the sun is still shining on Miami with 80 degree temperatures on Feburary 20th. 1390 tanks=less supply. Have we seen anything to suggest that demand is slowing. No. Especially if you were on Miami Beach or Coconut Grove this weekend!!

Roark
February 20th, 2006, 06:02 PM
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

dach2k5
February 20th, 2006, 09:25 PM
1. Why do you think this is? I've talked w/ many of the major condo lenders and they are quite concerned with the market right now. They want larger percentages in presales to close their loans and that means a longer lag between revenue and costs. This longer lag = greater risk.

4. The problem is that construction has a very long lead time between when demand is seen and when supply can be delivered. This long lead time (ie, zoning, approvals, permitting, and construction) means that there is often overbuilding when a boom nears it's end. This could easily lead to a dip in the market and decrease your liquidity significantly. People forget that real estate is not a liquid asset.


1. Bankers have been pulling out tightening lending parameters for over a year now. We have known this.
4. Supply and Demand: As the 1390's and the ____________(insert the next one) return deposits, the sun is still shining on Miami with 80 degree temperatures on Feburary 20th. 1390 tanks=less supply. Have we seen anything to suggest that demand is slowing. No. Especially if you were on Miami Beach or Coconut Grove this weekend!!

rider_of_rohan
February 20th, 2006, 09:44 PM
fukin liberal media... i wonder what rush has to say on the real estate subject...

rush will get back to you just as soon as he is done buying his illegal drugs and getting divorced again.
Now if you would like to back up your stupid statement with some proof there is a liberal media, and if there is that this article has anything to do with it we would love to hear it.

Dale
February 20th, 2006, 10:43 PM
1 out of 10 won't get built ?

THE SKY IS FALLING !!!

Toucano
February 21st, 2006, 12:21 AM
rush will get back to you just as soon as he is done buying his illegal drugs and getting divorced again.
Now if you would like to back up your stupid statement with some proof there is a liberal media, and if there is that this article has anything to do with it we would love to hear it.


Ha ha ha... Very well said...

Roark
February 21st, 2006, 07:15 AM
1. Why do you think this is? I've talked w/ many of the major condo lenders and they are quite concerned with the market right now. They want larger percentages in presales to close their loans and that means a longer lag between revenue and costs. This longer lag = greater risk.The reason is pretty simple. Banks want to make a return with the least amount of risk. If you talked to lenders today and they were concerned, you should have asked them a year ago. They were concerned then too. It just turns out that the news is hitting the wire now. Good projects are still getting financed. Bad projects aren't.
Many developers (the one I work for especially) will oversell a building before we approach a bank. "Hello Mr. Banker, I have 625 reservation checks ($25,000) for our 400 unit building, what kind of rate/terms can you give me"?

You are on the right track...banks want to see pre-sales, smart developers sell 150% of a building with reservations and then approach the bank. The reservation to purchase agreement ratio is very high...90% of the building's contracts go hard and the builiding gets built.

4. The problem is that construction has a very long lead time between when demand is seen and when supply can be delivered.Not exactly true. Ivy at Riverfront had so much demand that the developer could dictate the money terms. (buyer's market for money). Demand (hard contracts) were realized before one shovel hit the ground. This long lead time (ie, zoning, approvals, permitting, and construction) means that there is often overbuilding when a boom nears it's end.Unless, of course, and in reality, banks tighten up lending standards at the end of the boom cycle. In reality, that is what is happening...banks are tightening up lending which will minimize/prevent overbuilding. [/quote]
This could easily lead to a dip in the market and decrease your liquidity significantly. People forget that real estate is not a liquid asset.Faithful followers of the SSC forum have seen the real estate cycle .jpg a hundred times and DO NOT forget that real estate is illiquid. My take is that the Real estate cycle will have less peaks and troughs than in the past because of the way that people share information.
Old timers like to point out the Miami Real estate bust of the 1980's. There was no Skyscraprer Forum then! (Seriously). People could not/did not share information so freely back then. Banks know when too much is too much.
I think we are seeing a natural and healthy evolution of a Real Estate boom cycle. Banks tighten up lending...developers stop pumping supply into the system...buyers may or may not ease demand.
I've seen ZERO evidence that buyers are easing demand. I've seen lots of evidence of easing supply.
The sky isn't falling. We will be alright.

nimbyhater
February 22nd, 2006, 03:03 AM
rush will get back to you just as soon as he is done buying his illegal drugs and getting divorced again.
Now if you would like to back up your stupid statement with some proof there is a liberal media, and if there is that this article has anything to do with it we would love to hear it.


i apologize for your not sensing my sarcastic tone...