All I can say is -- Allah don't let this be a high-cycle hull. Or one with a tail strike. And who's taking care of the maintenance? Kabo Air? Hopefully not.

Their Wikipedia page says that they mostly do Hajj Charters and their financials are pretty shaky. I can't believe Biman couldn't find anyone else and had to go to Nigeria to lease a 747 :ohno:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kabo_Air

My question to Imran - in last reconstitution of Biman board there were two ex military official included. Do you think or know if they had any overwhelming role in getting 747 from kabo?

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2418/2323635394_b9641c38b9.jpg?v=0

Found it in the net....

what was the outcome of the board's meeting?

Just saw the news ticker at BDnews24

-Govt to buy 8 Boeing Aircrafts. From BDnews24 :banana:

Nice render shatilislam.

The latest FSX I presume?

Biman is making headlines in international press thanks to it's procurement decision.

From cnn:
http://money.cnn.com/news/newsfeeds/articles/newstex/AFX-0013-23647357.htm
Bangladesh's ailing national carrier Biman will buy eight new Boeing aircraft for 1.26 billion dollars as part of a fleet overhaul to help make the airline profitable, a minister said on Monday.

'We want to give a new face to Biman,' Civil Aviation Minister Mahbub Jamil told reporters.

US aircraft giant Boeing edged out European rival Airbus for the contract to supply the planes to state-owned Biman, which has been posting huge financial losses and is facing fierce competition from smaller, private rivals.

Airbus is a unit of European aerospace group EADS.

'Biman's board has decided to procure four Boeing 777-300ERs and four 787-8 aircraft as part of the fleet overhaul,' the minister said.

'Our aim is to make Biman profitable by the next financial year. Already we hope it will break even this year... as we've made it more efficient,' he said.

The eight aircraft will bring Biman Bangladesh Airline Ltd's fleet strength to 20.

Biman has already laid off 2,000 workers, plans to axe 2,000 more, and has suspended eight loss-making international flights and four domestic routes under its restructuring drive.

'The eight new aircraft will cost 1.26 billion dollars with each 777-300ER costing 182 million dollars and (each) 787-8 plane 133 million dollars. We'll sign a preliminary agreement by March 15. A final deal will be signed by April 15,' Jamil said.

Boeing will hand over the 463-seat 777-3003R between July and August 2013 and the 294-seat 787-8 between July-December 2017, Jamil said.

Biman posted a record loss of more than 120 million dollars for the financial year ending June 2006 and is expected to announce a 100 million dollar loss for the following financial year on soaring global fuel prices and higher-than-expected maintenance costs.

Cnn loves to poke Mr.A :)


Reuters:
http://www.reuters.com/article/businessNews/idUSDHA18438620080310

National carrier Biman Bangladesh Airlines said on Monday it agreed to buy eight Boeing aircraft worth nearly $1.3 billion as it looks to modernize its small fleet and fight off competition from local rivals.

Boeing had offered to supply the airline with four twin-aisle 777-300s by 2013 and four 787-8s Dreamliners by 2017, Biman Chairman Mahbub Jamil told a news conference.

"A deal will be signed with Boeing by March 15 as we need the aircraft to maintain our flight schedule," Jamil said without giving further details.

Biman was forced to halt its flights to New York, Paris, Tokyo, Frankfurt, Brussels, Yangon and Mumbai in 2006 due to a shortage of funds and aircraft.

Biman, which will fund the purchase through bank loans, plans to lease few aircraft to plug its scheduling gap before receiving the new planes from Boeing, Jamil said.

The loss-making airline is also reviewing a separate offer for planes from Europe's Airbus. "Airbus will make a presentation within the next 10 days," Jamil said.

Biman became a public limited company in July, still 100 percent state-owned, as part of a rescue plan by the country's army-backed interim government.

It flies 19 international routes with a fleet of 12 aircraft, but faces competition from four smaller, local private airlines, one of which has extended its operations to include regional routes connecting Bangladesh capital Dhaka to Kuala Lampur, Singapore, Delhi and Dubai.

Bangladesh and India have recently agreed to increase flight frequencies between the two countries.

Reuters(based in Uk) still hopeful that Biman will consider Airbus. Another presentation from Airbus within next 10 day? Guess it is for the A320.

From bdnews24.com

http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s195/tareq79/bb.jpg

The country's biggest airport Zia International Airport (ZIA) will wear a new look by the end of this year as the government pledges to end hassles for travellers, a special aide to the chief adviser said Sunday.
http://www.thefinancialexpress-bd.com/search_index.php?page=detail_news&news_id=27617

ZIA, as well as the airports in Chittagong and Sylhet will be under a whole new security policy by the end of 2008 as well. If everything goes as planned, the improvements will be remarkable...much like taking the score from 0 to say 90!

Biman leases Boeing-747 from Nigeria

"The 542-seater aircraft from Kabo Air Ltd will arrive at Zia International Airport by tomorrow or the day after tomorrow,"

http://www.thedailystar.net/story.php?nid=27013

542 seats on a B747-200???

Ah....I see...bet they'd be selling the lav seats as revenue seats as well...and Biman becomes the first airline in the world to do so...drumroll please!!! ;)

This Jumbo should wear a special title..."Cattle Express"!!!

ZIA, as well as the airports in Chittagong and Sylhet will be under a whole new security policy by the end of 2008 as well. If everything goes as planned, the improvements will be remarkable...much like taking the score from 0 to say 90!

Come on, Imran, give us the details. At least some of it? What kind of change/improvements?

My question to Imran - in last reconstitution of Biman board there were two ex military official included. Do you think or know if they had any overwhelming role in getting 747 from kabo?

I don't think so. It's the availability and cost isues that led to this choice. B747s from more 'reputable' lessors would probably cost more, if available. Air Atlanta Icelandic, for example, is out of 747s for quite some time to come.

542 seats on a B747-200???

Ah....I see...bet they'd be selling the lav seats as revenue seats as well...and Biman becomes the first airline in the world to do so...drumroll please!!! ;)

This Jumbo should wear a special title..."Cattle Express"!!!

People who fly this aircraft shall be expected to check their legs at the gate, for there won't be any leg room whatsoever! :lol:

My post on 8th February, 2008 (Post # 862) was:

Biman to go Boeing's way

Airbus made its proposal to Biman through the past couple of days, offering A320/321 and A330-200/-300 and from what I hear they were dismal.

Biman is leasing 2 747s pretty soon, and are shopping for 2-4 B777-200ERs to take on lease until the new B777s and B787s gets delivered by Boeing.

In case Biman fails to find the B777s on lease by themselves, they'll settle with taking the lease option from Boeing for 777s and 787s beginning from the end of 2009 and operate them until the new build 777s and 787s get delivered from 2013 through 2017.

Its a matter of time now (max. ~45 days) until the order with Boeing gets announced. The initial number of frames may be less than 8 (as originally planned) but will probably include options for BG to exercise later.


...and it took 31 days! Not bad, eh? ;)

The next thing should be Biman to firm up the order for the B737NG's instead of the Airbus A320. The figures are already in favour of the B737NG, and Biman should not let political issues overwhelm them to order the A320 when the majority of their future fleet will be Boeings.

Come on, Imran, give us the details. At least some of it? What kind of change/improvements?

Well, the security at BD airports is horrible by all practical assumptions and a new security policy framework is being drafted, accommodating a balance of technology and practical applicability in BD, to be implemented at all international airports of BD. The timeframe is tight, but if it gets implemented, it'd set an example at least in the context of the Indian Subcontinent. I'm keeping my fingers crossed!

People who fly this aircraft shall be expected to check their legs at the gate, for there won't be any leg room whatsoever! :lol:

Unless they put some seats on the cargo hold itself, and offer a 'super economy non-air-conditioned' service! 542 seats on the cargo deck+main deck+lav seats should provide more legroom than the J class products by the world's best airlines! ;)

PS: Man...some of us here have serious 'fetish' issues regarding Biman, don't we? :)

Has the Govt. got anything to say about this buying? I mean, is the final decision already made or will it wait for Govt's nod?

Has the Govt. got anything to say about this buying? I mean, is the final decision already made or will it wait for Govt's nod?

If the financing arrangement (85% from ExIm Bank of US and 15% from local banks) mentioned does not require any 'guarantee' by the government, then there's no nod to wait for. I don't know the details of how the financing will be arranged yet, but will soon find out and shall be able to tell you more about it. :)

While many on SSC poo poo the CTG, Biman owes its new lease on life to this interim regime. Allah only knows what would have happened if the decision was left up to an elected government. They'd probably be still hemming and hawing about it.

Allah only knows what would have happened if the decision was left up to an elected government. They'd probably be still hemming and hawing about it.

Probably? You're still not sure about that?? You don't really have to be modest here you know! :)

is it realy safe to do business wid this kabbo air?:ohno:

http://www.airliners.net/discussions/general_aviation/read.main/3880735/

somebody mentioned that all the asset of kabbo air was seized last week by a high court due to outstanding debts.

congratz biman to go boeing way. its a very good decission for long term.

is it realy safe to do business wid this kabbo air?:ohno:

http://www.airliners.net/discussions/general_aviation/read.main/3880735/

somebody mentioned that all the asset of kabbo air was seized last week by a high court due to outstanding debts.

True. Details here:
http://www.tribune.com.ng/07032008/news/news8.html

That's a total of 66.2 million Nigerian Nairas (if the plaintiff gets the damage charges too) that Kabo will have to pay, and it equals to approximately US$ 566,500. From what I can understand, Kabo Air has operational issues which has led to this situation and/or the legal system at Nigeria is in a pretty sorry state as far as Rules of Business is concerned. I'm afraid I'd be confirmed by people more knowledgeable that it is actually both these factors!

My post on 8th February, 2008 (Post # 862) was:

Biman to go Boeing's way

Airbus made its proposal to Biman through the past couple of days, offering A320/321 and A330-200/-300 and from what I hear they were dismal.

Biman is leasing 2 747s pretty soon, and are shopping for 2-4 B777-200ERs to take on lease until the new B777s and B787s gets delivered by Boeing.

In case Biman fails to find the B777s on lease by themselves, they'll settle with taking the lease option from Boeing for 777s and 787s beginning from the end of 2009 and operate them until the new build 777s and 787s get delivered from 2013 through 2017.

Its a matter of time now (max. ~45 days) until the order with Boeing gets announced. The initial number of frames may be less than 8 (as originally planned) but will probably include options for BG to exercise later.


...and it took 31 days! Not bad, eh? ;)

The next thing should be Biman to firm up the order for the B737NG's instead of the Airbus A320. The figures are already in favour of the B737NG, and Biman should not let political issues overwhelm them to order the A320 when the majority of their future fleet will be Boeings.

Yes and we appreciate your insightful posts here in SSC. :master:

Credit: Akbar A. Sattar
Hope you don't mind AkiZV6 (Akbar) had to post this pic :)

http://i269.photobucket.com/albums/jj50/amar11372/gmg.jpg

Yes and we appreciate your insightful posts here in SSC. :master:

Cut that crap. You bow down only to the Almighty.

*Sorry for being off-topic...let's get it back on! :)

Credit: Akbar A. Sattar
Hope you don't mind AkiZV6 (Akbar) had to post this pic :)


Finally a bright pic of the Z5 B747! I was getting depressed with the previous ones with the sunny side the other way!!

True. Details here:
http://www.tribune.com.ng/07032008/news/news8.html

That's a total of 66.2 million Nigerian Nairas (if the plaintiff gets the damage charges too) that Kabo will have to pay, and it equals to approximately US$ 566,500. From what I can understand, Kabo Air has operational issues which has led to this situation and/or the legal system at Nigeria is in a pretty sorry state as far as Rules of Business is concerned. I'm afraid I'd be confirmed by people more knowledgeable that it is actually both these factors!

Biman appears to have a knack for doing business with shady outfits. Didn't they find themselves in a pickle over purchasing/leasing a 707 way back when? The aircraft seemed to have many owners, something comparable to selling one piece of land many times over. Deja vu all over again?
:ohno:

Probably? You're still not sure about that?? You don't really have to be modest here you know! :)

No sense in stirring up the hornet's nest. I don't wish to provide any ammo to those folks (the CTG haters). :)

Govt to ratify int'l treaty to reduce borrowing costs of airlines
Star Business Report

The government will ratify an international treaty that will cut the cost of international borrowing for the country's airline industry, which is growing 8 percent a year.

“We are going to sign the Cape Town Convention soon. The signing of the convention will help local airlines purchase aircrafts at reduced costs,” Mahbub Jamil, special assistant to the Chief Adviser, said yesterday.

Jamil, also chairman of Biman Board of Directors, made the announcement at a press conference on national flag carrier's aircraft purchasing plan. The Biman will purchase eight Boeing aircraft at a cost of $ 1.265 billion to revive its ailing fleet of 11 aircraft.

The government move industry insiders believe will boost the country's aviation industry that saw three local and four foreign airlines enter the market last year.

The Cape Town Convention and Aircraft Protocol is an international rule that allows global lenders to take control of aircraft in case of default by the debtor from a country that has ratified it.

The added security means the lender is prepared to finance the aircraft purchase at a lower interest rate, meaning the buyer will pay less for the plane.

To ratify the convention, the government had earlier formed a committee with the representatives from Biman and private airlines. The committee is expected to submit its final proposal to the Ministry of Civil Aviation and Tourism this week, a member of the committee said.

“We are about to finish our task. We wish to submit the draft report within a couple of days,” said Fakhrul Islam, head of the committee.

Experts said unless a country ratifies the convention, international lenders generally impose high interest against the debtor due to the risk associated with lending.

The Cape Town Convention and Aircraft Protocol, which came into force in 2003, reduces the risk to such deals by establishing an international legal framework.

“We are happy that the government has taken the initiative. The ratification will encourage many aircraft leasing company to come to Bangladesh,” said Shahab Sattar, managing director of country's largest private carrier GMG Airlines, which is also considering a Boeing proposal to purchase six new aircraft.

The GMG chief, referring to the plan of purchasing aircraft, said it will be easier for the carrier to receive financing from global lenders such as US based EXIM Bank to purchase new aircraft following the ratification.

Imran Asif, an aviation industry consultant, said the ratification will help local airlines get aircraft at lower costs.

http://www.thedailystar.net/story.php?nid=27142

Ohh man, Imran you could make tons of money by forecasting the future. ;)

Imran, the cost of $1.265 billion for Biman to buy the 8 aircrafts that is going around in the press is just a arbitrary number right? or is Biman acutally going to pay that much? with a 25%-30% discount wouldn't it come down to about $900 million?


-Also attached to the deal with Boeing "Boeing will also provide advanced training and technical support to Biman pilots. It will assist Bangladesh upgrade the Zia International Airport (ZIA) so that wide-bodied Boeing 777-300 and Boeing 787-8 aircraft can land. It will also help Biman in its marketing."

http://www.ittefaq.com/content/2008/03/11/news0267.htm
at the very middle of this article,it sayz biman is buying the boeing777-300er staring price frm 187 millionz to less.

but in wiki,it sayz boeing777 startz from 187 m.
my qus how is biman be able to get 300er wid that money when the base model of 777,which is 200 or/200er starts from 187??

"The ratification will encourage many aircraft leasing company to come to Bangladesh,” said Shahab Sattar, managing director of country's largest private carrier GMG Airlines, which is also considering a Boeing proposal to purchase six new aircraft.

The GMG chief, referring to the plan of purchasing aircraft, said it will be easier for the carrier to receive financing from global lenders such as US based EXIM Bank to purchase new aircraft following the ratification." - TheDailyStar (http://www.thedailystar.net/story.php?nid=27142)


-Anyone know what the 6 models of aircraft are that Boeing offered to GMG?

-Also attached to the deal with Boeing "Boeing will also provide advanced training and technical support to Biman pilots. It will assist Bangladesh upgrade the Zia International Airport (ZIA) so that wide-bodied Boeing 777-300 and Boeing 787-8 aircraft can land. It will also help Biman in its marketing."

What are they really talking about? 777s land regularly at ZIA. BA, MH, SQ, (and probably others) all operate 777s. And I thought any airfield that handles 777 can also handle 787.

^^
I was also thinking the same...


-Also attached to the deal with Boeing "Boeing will also provide advanced training and technical support to Biman pilots. It will assist Bangladesh upgrade the Zia International Airport (ZIA) so that wide-bodied Boeing 777-300 and Boeing 787-8 aircraft can land. It will also help Biman in its marketing."

Wish Boeing could help Biman to be more professional. Who will do the maintenance of these new $200million frames? No offence but the latest technology Biman engineers have seen is in the 25yr old A310.

^^
I was also thinking the same...



Wish Boeing could help Biman to be more professional. Who will do the maintenance of these new $200million frames? No offence but the latest technology Biman engineers have seen is in the 25yr old A310.

Air India? Kidding aside, Boeing is, after all, going to put up a multi-million dollar maintenance facility in collaboration with the Indians, in Nagpur.

Now that airplane on the way lets think about airport for a sec. I had heard there was/is a plan to have a bigger airport somewhere in Mymensigh.

Asif do you have any info regarding that?

Govt to ratify int'l treaty to reduce borrowing costs of airlines
Star Business Report

http://www.thedailystar.net/story.php?nid=27142

Ohh man, Imran you could make tons of money by forecasting the future. ;)

You betcha! ;)

Imran, the cost of $1.265 billion for Biman to buy the 8 aircrafts that is going around in the press is just a arbitrary number right? or is Biman acutally going to pay that much? with a 25%-30% discount wouldn't it come down to about $900 million?

-Also attached to the deal with Boeing "Boeing will also provide advanced training and technical support to Biman pilots. It will assist Bangladesh upgrade the Zia International Airport (ZIA) so that wide-bodied Boeing 777-300 and Boeing 787-8 aircraft can land. It will also help Biman in its marketing."

I only hope these folks aren't disclosing the actual purchase amount of US$ 1.265b, if it is that. If you check Boeing's price list (http://www.boeing.com/commercial/prices/index.html) and pick the lower end of the price brackets for the 777-300ER and 787-8 and then multiply each by 4 and add up, it comes to about US$ 1.628b and then if you discount it by 25% it comes down to US$ 1.221b! The offer from Boeing to Biman strictly prohibits disclosure of actual purchase prices but I'm afraid that is just what is being done here!

And from the extra support Boeing has offered Biman, it seems like they're doing what they do for airline "start-ups"!
http://www.boeing.com/commercial/startup/index.html :)

Going slightly offtopic from the current discussion topic-

United's advertisement in newspaper today:

http://img389.imageshack.us/img389/3170/20080310114bsb1.jpg

Going slightly offtopic from the current discussion topic-

United's advertisement in newspaper today:



Good to see that the startups are trying to be innovative by offering non-traditional city pairs. I feel that they ought to offer routes that link Dhaka with northern part of the country, all the way up to Dinajpur. If they cannot fill the seats from one city, then, perhaps it should be something like, Dhaka-Rajshahi-Rangpur/Saidpur-Dinajpur-Dhaka.

[B]
-Anyone know what the 6 models of aircraft are that Boeing offered to GMG?

That's an easy guess: 777, 787, 737NG! ;)

What are they really talking about? 777s land regularly at ZIA. BA, MH, SQ, (and probably others) all operate 777s. And I thought any airfield that handles 777 can also handle 787.

Pavement strength. ZIA has a pathetically low PCN of 59, which would be improved to 84 or above. However, Boeing will not be a part of this...CAAB will me made to do it. EK already operates the 777-300ER to DAC, and SQ, BA uses the 777-200ERs. The 777-200LR/-300ER only has additional ground manoevereing instructions due to their raked wingtips extending the wingspan compared to the other 777 models.

Air India? Kidding aside, Boeing is, after all, going to put up a multi-million dollar maintenance facility in collaboration with the Indians, in Nagpur.

Air India doesn't have any direct participation at that Nagpur facility...it'll be Boeing's own and Biman would benefit from getting the heavy checks done there. With the extensive composite technology on the 787, it'd take a while for Biman to do much on that plane by themselves, but it should try hard to gather the expertise asap to do up to C checks on the 737NG and the 777s.

Now that airplane on the way lets think about airport for a sec. I had heard there was/is a plan to have a bigger airport somewhere in Mymensigh.

Asif do you have any info regarding that?

Nope. But ZIA is supposed to get a degree of significant extension.

Not sure if there's anything new here, but this was on BBC today:

Biman to buy eight new aircraft

Bangladesh's state-owned airline, Biman, has announced that it will buy eight new aircraft for $1.26bn as part of a fleet upgrade and overhaul.
Ministers say the move is aimed at making the airline profitable.

Correspondents say the long term aim may be the hard task of transforming the ailing airline into a profit-making venture before privatising it.

Biman presently has 11 long haul aircraft, but only about half of them operate on international routes.

'More efficient'

"We want to give a new face to Biman," Civil Aviation Minister Mahbub Jamil said.

Correspondents say that the US plane maker, Boeing, narrowly beat its European rival, Airbus, for the contract to supply the planes.

"Biman's board has decided to procure four Boeing 777-300ER and four 787-8 aircraft as part of the fleet overhaul," the minister said.

"Our aim is to make Biman profitable by the next financial year," Mr Jamil added.

"Already we hope it will break even this year... as we've made it more efficient," he said.

Boeing will hand over the 463-seat 777-300ERs between July and August 2013 and the 294-seat 787-8s between July-December 2017, Mr Jamil said.

He said the company was holding negotiations with Airbus next month for procuring short-haul aircraft.

Biman posted a record loss of more than $120m for the financial year ending June 2006 and is expected to announce a $100m loss for the following financial year - because of increasing global fuel prices and high maintenance costs.

Cash-strapped

"It's the first time in Biman's 35-year history that the national flag carrier is purchasing aircraft directly from the manufacturer and it's being done transparently," Mr Jamil said.

Last year Biman slashed its workforce as part of a privatisation initiative to cut losses.

The airline has been so cash-strapped it is struggled to pay salaries and maintain its elderly fleet of aircraft.

Correspondents say that Biman's erratic passenger schedule, the poor state of its elderly aircraft, its bloated staff numbers and its failure to pay fuel bills have all added to its woes.

In recent years the company has been beset by corruption allegations, especially over aircraft-leasing, with government-appointed middlemen usually named as the beneficiaries.

The airline's difficulties have been attributed by many observers to the reluctance of successive governments to relinquish control of Biman and allow it to stand on its own feet.

^^Good, now that Biman is in the process of taking off of the life support they should think about offering better service. There will be new planes, improved airports, but how about improved services? Haven't heard anything about that... Will they be able to get behind those eras where all seats were reported booked by the local Biman offices whereas half the plane was flying empty?

Looks like things are moving in the right direction after a very long time..I guess better late than never.

Wow.....Its about time.....

Is a second runway included in the extension plan?

Is a second runway included in the extension plan?

I don't want to elaborate on the reasons why, but its very unlikely. A second runway at ZIA will have to be built, if ever, by an elected government.

I don't want to elaborate on the reasons why, but its very unlikely. A second runway at ZIA will have to be built, if ever, by an elected government.

I didn't think ZIA is busy enough to warrant a second runway. Unless of course there are technical reasons for it.

^^Good, now that Biman is in the process of taking off of the life support they should think about offering better service. There will be new planes, improved airports, but how about improved services? Haven't heard anything about that... Will they be able to get behind those eras where all seats were reported booked by the local Biman offices whereas half the plane was flying empty?

Looks like things are moving in the right direction after a very long time..I guess better late than never.

That remains to be seen, isn't it? In fact, now that the "structural" reforms are underway, its quality of service shall make or break the airline, in my opinion. EK, MH, SQ, prove that an airline can be profitable even if it is government owned. All three of these airlines owe their success to their consistent high quality ratings. And quality of service begins from the booking experience and ends after baggage retrival at destination.

I have heard about bad behavior of FAs on EK flights, and the other day, finally read quite a bit about it on a forum. It appears that the FAs have a disdain for Bangladeshi passengers, particularly the labourer class. If that is indeed the case, then now is the time for Biman to cash in on quality by providing very good service and begin to chip away at EK's market share from the DAC-DXB sector.

^^I don’t think a second runway is feasible at this stage. It will cost a fortune. Plus, it might not be necessary with in a short period of time also; rather they need to upgrade their air traffic control systems and personnel on an emergency basis. The length of the current runway in ZIA is 10500 feet and there were talks about extending it to 12,000 feet, but that would require demolishing quite a few houses so the idea hadn’t flown very well among the general public. 4-5 years ago Rajuk gave notices to quite a few building owners in Uttara whose house was located in the flight path to demolish some of the top floors. Frankly nothing has happened in that regard thus far. Demolishing people’s house is not an easy thing in a densely populated poor country like Bangladesh. I am saying all these because from looking at the google map I don’t see freely available land where another 12000 feet runway can be built.

Biman is likely to procure two more aircraft for short-distance routes. Airbus is to deliver a presentation of their product to Biman soon, after which Biman would decide about the planes.

http://www.thedailystar.net/story.php?nid=27162

Why is Airbus not giving up? They already have thousands of orders which worth millions of dollars. Then why are they nagging to sell two medium aircrafts?

Why is Airbus not giving up? They already have thousands of orders which worth millions of dollars. Then why are they nagging to sell two medium aircrafts?

Because in business,every penny matters. Then you have the turf issue -- Boeing has been outselling Airbus, these days, so they have to try anything and everything to increase their marlket share.

In Biman's case however, it wouldn't make business sense to opt for a couple of Airbus while the bulk of their fleet shall be Boeing.

Biman Bangladesh Airlines Limited will not operate any domestic flight except on Sylhet and Chittagong routes as the national flag carrier is eyeing to establish itself as a world class airline, reports UNB.
The fleet committee in its proposal said that it would not be a wise decision for Biman to operate domestic flights except on Chittagong and Sylhet routes.
"We include Chittagong and Sylhet as there are huge number of expatriates from these two areas live in different countries around the world," Captain Shah Alam, a member of the fleet committee, told UNB Tuesday.
He said the fleet committee proposed to operate connecting services for Sylhet and Chittagong.
Replying to a question, Capt. Shah Alam said, there are four private airliners operating their domestic flights and the domestic market is already saturated.
"We don''t want to enter in that saturated and small market; we want to do our core business and that is operating international flights."
In the proposal, the fleet committee mentioned that there is no need to procure small aircraft in future to operate domestic flights. "Rather, we are looking to make a new impression in the international market," the fleet committee member said.
Chief Adviser''s Special Assistant Mahbub Jamil on Monday at a press conference also said that they are not interested in domestic market. "We will open the domestic sector to the private airliners," he had said.
Biman currently owns three types of aircraft -- four McDonnell Douglas DC10-30s, four Fokker F28s and three Airbus A310-300s. Out of a total of 11 planes of Biman fleet, only four or five are operating now while the rest are grounded.
Amid aircraft shortages, Biman cut seven international routes and was forced to reduce flight frequencies on five profitable international routes like Riyadh, Jeddah and Kuwait. Biman''s market share came down to almost half of what it had in 1991.
Capt. Shah Alam said the national flag carrier would try to restore its flights on the profitable international routes.
Biman Bangladesh Airlines on Sunday decided to purchase eight Boeing aircraft at a cost of US$ 1.265 billion to resuscitate the country''s lone public sector airlines.
Biman will sign a MoU with Boeing representatives here on March 15.
Of the eight Boeings, the first consignment of four aircraft will be arriving here in 2013 while the second consignment in 2017.
Currently, GMG Airlines, United Airways, Best Air and Royal Bengal are operating domestic flights along with Biman.
The new private airlines are now operating domestic flights on routes connecting Dhaka with Chittagong, Cox''s Bazar, Sylhet and Jessore.

http://www.newstoday-bd.com/frontpage.asp?newsdate=#11410

Is a second runway included in the extension plan?

Second runway for zia would be an utter waste of money. There are so many other things to do- extend the terminals, built more airbridges, get a better baggage handling system, ILS, and most importantly get a professional ATC and management team. Just look at LGW. With a single runway of 10,879ft(~400ft more than DAC) it handles 721 daily movements with a peak hour activity of 56 movements!

That remains to be seen, isn't it? In fact, now that the "structural" reforms are underway, its quality of service shall make or break the airline, in my opinion. EK, MH, SQ, prove that an airline can be profitable even if it is government owned. All three of these airlines owe their success to their consistent high quality ratings. And quality of service begins from the booking experience and ends after baggage retrival at destination.

I have heard about bad behavior of FAs on EK flights, and the other day, finally read quite a bit about it on a forum. It appears that the FAs have a disdain for Bangladeshi passengers, particularly the labourer class. If that is indeed the case, then now is the time for Biman to cash in on quality by providing very good service and begin to chip away at EK's market share from the DAC-DXB sector.

^^You meant 5 years from now.... One should not compare EK with BG, because they are not in the level playing field. One simple example: BG pays 40% tax on fuel, whereas EK gets subsidy on it(they deny it though)

5 years from now, EK would ferry 600 passengers on a single flight from zia with A380s. Considering the DAC-DXB sector's demand for the lowest price and reliable service, BG's 777 can't compete with A380's economies of scale.

Biman could only exploit the weak spot of Bengali people by encouraging them to use their country's carrier. They however lost that trust with decades of bad service.
9W could actually be a very good example for Biman to work on(Even though 9W targets upmarket customers and the purchasing power of Indians are higher than Bengalis)

Sweet...got a handful of posts to reply to! :)

1. ZIA doesn't need a second runway...no dispute about that at all! But if you ask me, I'd say it should have a whole new terminal and a whole new apron/ramp area to go with it. Why? Simply to cater to the flights to/from middle-east and the labour traffic thereof. The only way to build all that will have to be by acquiring the south-eastern part of Nikunja just after the end of runway 14 (clear off the runway heading). The cost of acquiring that area will be way lower than the cost of building a whole new airport somewhere else, to say nothing about the cost of time that will be wasted for doing so.

2. The narrowbody order from Biman is Airbus' to lose if the choice is made based on figures. From what I know, the purchase price offered by Boeing for the 737NG is lower than what Airbus has offered for the A320 already (and I'm not sure if they can get much lower than that). The direct operating costs of the 737NG and the A320 are very similar and in certain hypothetical operational scenario would be in favour of the 737NG. The major advantage of the 737NG is its commonality with the 777 and the 787. The Shortened Transition and Rating (STAR) for 737NG pilots to fly the 787 is just 11 days, for example. And then there's the yoke vs. sidestick issue. If Airbus could win the widebody order, they'd have had the same advantage for the A320.

3. BG's service quality should also improve as it goes through the revival process. The management just needs to get one simple message across to its employees - that they can lose their jobs if they don't perform up to the mark. Through the political regimes and while Biman was a state corporation, everyone took it for granted that no matter how disgustingly they performed, their job will never be gone...and that did it.

4. EK with their A380's to DAC? I wouldn't build a 2-storey aerobridge for them at ZIA and see how they try and stash in 650+ poeple on that whale! ;)

Sweet...got a handful of posts to reply to! :)

1. ZIA doesn't need a second runway...no dispute about that at all! But if you ask me, I'd say it should have a whole new terminal and a whole new apron/ramp area to go with it. Why? Simply to cater to the flights to/from middle-east and the labour traffic thereof. The only way to build all that will have to be by acquiring the south-eastern part of Nikunja just after the end of runway 14 (clear off the runway heading). The cost of acquiring that area will be way lower than the cost of building a whole new airport somewhere else, to say nothing about the cost of time that will be wasted for doing so.

2. The narrowbody order from Biman is Airbus' to lose if the choice is made based on figures. From what I know, the purchase price offered by Boeing for the 737NG is lower than what Airbus has offered for the A320 already (and I'm not sure if they can get much lower than that). The direct operating costs of the 737NG and the A320 are very similar and in certain hypothetical operational scenario would be in favour of the 737NG. The major advantage of the 737NG is its commonality with the 777 and the 787. The Shortened Transition and Rating (STAR) for 737NG pilots to fly the 787 is just 11 days, for example. And then there's the yoke vs. sidestick issue. If Airbus could win the widebody order, they'd have had the same advantage for the A320.

3. BG's service quality should also improve as it goes through the revival process. The management just needs to get one simple message across to its employees - that they can lose their jobs if they don't perform up to the mark. Through the political regimes and while Biman was a state corporation, everyone took it for granted that no matter how disgustingly they performed, their job will never be gone...and that did it.

4. EK with their A380's to DAC? I wouldn't build a 2-storey aerobridge for them at ZIA and see how they try and stash in 650+ poeple on that whale! ;)

I'm very much in agreement, Imran.


The corporate culture MUST change in Biman, with "customer service" becoming the watch word.

I also doubt whether a) ZIA shall make the necessary improvement to handle A380, and b) EK shall operate A380 on DXB-DAC sector.

As of now Airbus still holds the lead on number of planes delivered. Of coarse their position was shaken after the A380 delay. So, airbus wants to have their aircraft flying with every possible airlines because business wise no one can say with certainty that this order will be the final order ever for Biman. So, airbus may have better shots next time if they had few types flying with the airlines already.

There was no way airbus can compete with Boeing here because of the total volume ordered (intended). Business wise, it’s not a good idea to purchase aircraft from only one manufacturer. Such scenario will lead to loss of negotiation power. In the future Biman will not have any tool to leverage in the negotiation process. But Biman is such a small airlines that currently they don’t have much choice anyway.


Regarding EK flying in A380 with 650 pax to DAC, I have heard that this is what they planned when they ordered the large number of A380. By the way, they can use abridge as well as traditional stairs together without any problem. Currently at DXB they are using stairs frequently as EK’s dedicated terminal is not completed yet. So, they won’t have any problem boarding and deplaning 650 passengers from A380.

IMHO > The possibility of EK operating A380 on DXB-DAC sector is pretty high, because with 58 orders their main target market is Indian subcontinent. If they can fill two 777s now, with current growth in 5 years time, they expect(& should) fill up one A380. DAC demands more capacity than high frequency. They can also utilise one frame on two sectors (ie- DAC & DEL) eachday, so maximum utilisation can also be achieved. (SQ needs 2 A380's to operate on SIN-LHR-SIN as opposed to 1 on SIN-SYD-SIN- thereby losing premium operational time)

Even if DAC is not A380ready, they could use existing infrastructure to board passengers but it will be a long and slow process...

Good to see that the startups are trying to be innovative by offering non-traditional city pairs. I feel that they ought to offer routes that link Dhaka with northern part of the country, all the way up to Dinajpur. If they cannot fill the seats from one city, then, perhaps it should be something like, Dhaka-Rajshahi-Rangpur/Saidpur-Dinajpur-Dhaka.


Do they have airports in Rangpur, Saidpur and Dinajpur?

Do they have airports in Rangpur, Saidpur and Dinajpur?

There is one in Saidpur. There may be airfields in or around Rangpur/Dinajpur that are used by the military that could be opened up for civilian use, I am sure, if the airlines show interest and pay usage fees. I have seen in the Philippines, many operational airfields that have nothing but a runway and a shack but are used daily by many local airlines.

Well I agree with most of you that in business consideration, Biman should go for the 737NGs rather than the A320s, as rest of its fleet would be of boeing's (though i think they will continue with the A310s for few more years). But I humbly would like to add another perspective, and that is political. By denying Airbus totally, we risk of making the European Union unhappy. So from broader national interest perpective, I believe Biman has taken a wise decision to go for the short haul Airbuses. I know many of you may differ with me, and I understand the logics, as I myself subscribe to those. But due to my profession (a poor diplomat of a poor country), I know how much political pressure is there on the government from the European governments to take at least couple of Airbus planes. This is not a question of number of sales and profitability for airbus, but rather a question of building partnership, so that they can look forward in future to cultivate this tie. This is the new form of 21st century's corporate imperialism..........and it may not be that harmful for the receipients i guess....


Regarding Biman's decision of closing domestic operation except CGP and ZYL, i think it is a good decision. I also think they should stop flights to CGP and ZYL also and should utilize the private airlines as feeder airlines in these two routes. In this way they can permanently get rid of those F28s and concentrate on the international and regional fleet.

^^ I think it is a good balance buying the long range carriers from Boeing and short range from Airbus. As long as the total number of different types of aircraft is reasonably limited (how about two each for a total of four types? - just a suggestion) then it will be OK cost-wise. We do have to maintain good relations with EU because they are a big potential market for BD products.

Business wise, it’s not a good idea to purchase aircraft from only one manufacturer.

I beg to differ. Both cost and operational efficiency is achieved through fleet uniformity. Prime example is Southwest. All they have is 737. I'm sure there are airlines with all airbus fleet (can't think of one right now though).

Biman to close domestic flights except Ctg, Sylhet

Another great bleesing is disguise for the private airlines. I think by the time Biman's new fleet come into full operational, the private airlines would have already would have made an impression in the Bangladeshi avaition market. Namely, GMG and United. Does everyone agree?

This is not a question of number of sales and profitability for airbus, but rather a question of building partnership, so that they can look forward in future to cultivate this tie. This is the new form of 21st century's corporate imperialism..........and it may not be that harmful for the receipients i guess....


How would purchasing a couple of Airbus with precious foreign currency, help build a partnership? Why not build that partnership through purchasing some other type of goods that are preferable to be from EU (countries)? To me it sounds like appeasement -- so as not to bruise their collective egos.

^^ I think it is a good balance buying the long range carriers from Boeing and short range from Airbus. As long as the total number of different types of aircraft is reasonably limited (how about two each for a total of four types? - just a suggestion) then it will be OK cost-wise. We do have to maintain good relations with EU because they are a big potential market for BD products.

Now that I buy. If the ROI for a few million dollars worth of Airbus is many (times) more millions in sales of goods from Bangladesh to EU, that is well worth its while, even though it may not be beneficial to Biman. Question comes to mind though, wouldn't one call it "speed money"? But then we are used to that (tactic).

I think by the time Biman's new fleet come into full operational, the private airlines would have already would have made an impression in the Bangladeshi avaition market. Namely, GMG and United. Does everyone agree?

Does anyone have any pics of the 2nd United aircraft?

Heard United have applied for routes to the Middle-East and Europe (London) anyone have anything to add? I.e. how long it would take them to get it and how long it would take them to fly international operation wise (i.e. aircraft, crew, etc.)?

Anyone flown Best Air, United or Royal Bangal?... How was it?

I think Biman should follow Jet Airways (9W) of India.

Does anyone have any pics of the 2nd United aircraft?

Heard United have applied for routes to the Middle-East and Europe (London) anyone have anything to add? I.e. how long it would take them to get it and how long it would take them to fly international operation wise (i.e. aircraft, crew, etc.)?

Anyone flown Best Air, United or Royal Bangal?... How was it?

I think Biman should follow Jet Airways (9W) of India.

Yes, this is the second United Dash 8-100. It's a much newer aircraft than the first one. It has been purchased outright by United.http://i265.photobucket.com/albums/ii225/akbar1_photos/DHC-8-100-UnitedAirways-2.jpg

SHATILISLAM

1. The whole issue of making the EU unhappy by going entirely for Boeing is ridiculous. Air France became the launch customer for the 777-300ER...you think they cared for EU's 'happiness' about it? France is itself the major country behind Airbus and Air France had enough of the A340-300 to decide not to go for the -500/-600. Likewise, Northwest dumped the 777 for the A330...and you think US was unhappy about it? Its not about what anyone is happy with or not, its what fits the needs best...and for Biman, with the widebody fleet of Boeing the most logical narrowbody aircraft is none other but the 737NG. Yeah, if aviation in Bangladesh should get anything from Europe, it should be the ATC systems that they could take from Thales...and everyone's going to be happy! :)

2. I can't agree with the fact that Biman doing away with domestic flights excepting CGP and ZYL is a good idea. I think there's a nice little trick that Biman can play here and I shall be seeing the men there to give them the idea and see if they like it.

TANZIRIAN

3. If the order went to Airbus, it should've been A340-600, A330-300/A350XWB, and the A320. Now that it has gone largely to Boeing, the narrowbodies should be the 737NG only. A 4th type of aircraft is the kind they can use for the little tricky idea I mentioned above in 2 to keep operating on low-density domestic routes. Mixing up Boeing and Airbus for a total of just 8-12 aircraft doesn't make sense.

TISLAM

4. Easy buddy.....EasyJet is all Airbus...US Airways is mostly Airbus and probably some BAe props but no Boeings anymore! :)

Bhai Imran -- you forgot Jetblue's all Airbus narrowbody fleet :)

Of course they've recently bought some ERJ's so they don't qualify anymore.

OH MY GOD!!!! I HAVE THE SAME IMAGE FOR GMG AIRLINES!!!!!

http://i271.photobucket.com/albums/jj142/Akbar_026/GMG_7879_FlyR_0208.jpg

http://i271.photobucket.com/albums/jj142/Akbar_026/GMG_7773ER_FlyR_0208.jpg

http://i271.photobucket.com/albums/jj142/Akbar_026/GMG_7773-7879_FlyR_0208.jpg

This photo is an exclusive entry here and not to be found anywhere else on the Web at the moment...until the order gets announced officially by Biman and Boeing!

Enjoy! :)

http://i227.photobucket.com/albums/dd236/TheCoolOnes/Biman2.jpg[/QUOTE]

http://www.airliners.net/search/photo.search?regsearch=N810WP&distinct_entry=true

Is GMG going for 787-9 ??

Does anyone know why Ethiopian skipped 777 & ordered 787-8 & -9? What's their strategy? Will it be profitable for GMG to buy 787-8 & -9 rather than one version of 777 & one version of 787?

OH MY GOD!!!! I HAVE THE SAME IMAGE FOR GMG AIRLINES!!!!!

Cool...gimme a high five!

I guess we both know the source of the images...eh? ;)

Does anyone know why Ethiopian skipped 777 & ordered 787-8 & -9? What's their strategy? Will it be profitable for GMG to buy 787-8 & -9 rather than one version of 777 & one version of 787?

Well, the 787-8/-9 would do the job for Ethiopian...its just that the design freeze of the 787 wasn't done at the time when they chose the 777.

And, as importantly if not more, the 787 is quite a bit cheaper to buy than the 777s...thanks to the degree of outsourcing on the 787 project.

As for GMG, if they need the 777-300ER, there won't be any 787 to replace that in the foreseeable future. Even the proposed 787-10 won't match the performance specs of the 777-300ER. But the other 777 models will be well replaced by the 787-8/-9/-10.

just wondering why don't Biman consider Embraer E-Jets or Bombardier C Series instead of B737 or A320 for flights to regional and neighbourhood like flight to katmandu, Yangon, kolkata. the cost of this airline is much cheaper the boeing. Air Canada has some E-jets are pretty good i guess, it doesn't feel like i am in a small aircraft

Leased Boeing from Nigeria joins Biman

I think it's this one:

http://www.airliners.net/photo/Kabo-Air/Boeing-747-238B/0177980&photo_nr=29&prev_id=0178686&next_id=0177511

Nobody posted this news yet(published yesterday), so I am going for it.

http://img212.imageshack.us/img212/7029/iukj8lh1.jpg

In short:

-CX has started twice weekly freight service on HKG-SGN(vietnam)-DAC-HKG
-Operated with 747-200F
-Plans to double frequency in 3 months


Imran bhai, I'm waiting for your expert comment on my opinion on EK's possibility of operating A380 in DAC.. if you didn't notice it's here (http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showpost.php?p=18975364&postcount=1307)

Is GMG going for 787-9 ??

According to wikipedia "In addition to its current fleet comprising of Boeing 747s, Boeing 737-800, Boeing MD82s, and Dash 8s, GMG will be adding 2 Boeing 767-300ERs in June 2008 and 2 more Boeing MD-82s in April 2008. The airline has also announced it will soon be ordering Boeing 777s and Boeing 787 Dreamliners which are expected to be delivered by 2012." :cheers:

Imran bhai, I'm waiting for your expert comment on my opinion on EK's possibility of operating A380 in DAC.. if you didn't notice it's here (http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showpost.php?p=18975364&postcount=1307)

I thought ZIA's runway can't support A380 yet.

OH MY GOD!!!! I HAVE THE SAME IMAGE FOR GMG AIRLINES!!!!!

http://i271.photobucket.com/albums/jj142/Akbar_026/GMG_7879_FlyR_0208.jpg

http://i271.photobucket.com/albums/jj142/Akbar_026/GMG_7773ER_FlyR_0208.jpg

http://i271.photobucket.com/albums/jj142/Akbar_026/GMG_7773-7879_FlyR_0208.jpg
[/IMG][/QUOTE]


Looks great, gota learn to do these kinds of graphics someday.

just wondering why don't Biman consider Embraer E-Jets or Bombardier C Series instead of B737 or A320 for flights to regional and neighbourhood like flight to katmandu, Yangon, kolkata. the cost of this airline is much cheaper the boeing. Air Canada has some E-jets are pretty good i guess, it doesn't feel like i am in a small aircraft

I don't think it would make much sense to procure aircraft of that size/type just to ply on those routes. Biman would probably want aircrafts with longer range, passenger and cargo capacity, so that they can not only use the aircrafts for KTM, RGN, CCU, but DEL, BOM, KHI, CMB, BKK (and similar routes) as well.

Nobody posted this news yet(published yesterday), so I am going for it.

In short:

-CX has started twice weekly freight service on HKG-SGN(vietnam)-DAC-HKG
-Operated with 747-200F
-Plans to double frequency in 3 months


Imran bhai, I'm waiting for your expert comment on my opinion on EK's possibility of operating A380 in DAC.. if you didn't notice it's here (http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showpost.php?p=18975364&postcount=1307)

I didn't know there was that much freight traffic between DAC and SGN. Or is SGN an intermediate stop/hop for hauling cargo between DAC and HKG?

A Boeing 747-200 aircraft was added yesterday to the fleet of Biman Bangladesh Airlines Ltd.

Biman leased the aircraft from Kabo Air Ltd, a Nigeria-based airline, for six months to minimise disruption in flight schedules.

“The 542-seater aircraft will be in operation from March 17 after undergoing repair works. It will be used to operate flights in the Middle East region,” said a Biman official.

Biman has been facing problems in maintaining flight schedules due to an acute shortage of aircraft.

With inclusion of the new airbus, the number of Biman's aircraft now stands at 12. Biman is likely to add a similar aircraft to its fleet soon.

http://www.thedailystar.net/story.php?nid=27520

What's wrong with this picture? How come the aircraft just leased, has to be repaired? I thought standard lease agreement stipulate that no major repair/overhaul shall fall within the lease period.

A Boeing 747-200 aircraft was added yesterday to the fleet of Biman Bangladesh Airlines Ltd.

Biman leased the aircraft from Kabo Air Ltd, a Nigeria-based airline, for six months to minimise disruption in flight schedules.

“The 542-seater aircraft will be in operation from March 17 after undergoing repair works. It will be used to operate flights in the Middle East region,” said a Biman official.

Biman has been facing problems in maintaining flight schedules due to an acute shortage of aircraft.

With inclusion of the new airbus, the number of Biman's aircraft now stands at 12. Biman is likely to add a similar aircraft to its fleet s

http://www.thedailystar.net/story.php?nid=27520

What's wrong with this picture? How come the aircraft just leased, has to be repaired? I thought standard lease agreement stipulate that no major repair/overhaul shall fall within the lease period.

It might have broken down on way to Bangladesh!!!!:lol:

It might have broken down on way to Bangladesh!!!!:lol:

True when Biman employees touches an airplane, it suddenly becomes crap. :)

Another pic of the Kabo Air Boeing 747-200 leased by Biman.

http://www.airliners.net/photo/Kabo-Air/Boeing-747-238B/0175088

Another pic of the Kabo Air Boeing 747-200 leased by Biman.

http://www.airliners.net/photo/Kabo-Air/Boeing-747-238B/0175088

Another pic of the Kabo Air Boeing 747-200 leased by Biman.

http://www.airliners.net/photo/Kabo-Air/Boeing-747-238B/0175088/M/

Date: 12th March, 2008
Time: 4:30pm - 5:45pm

For those of you who gets high on pics taken at BD airports, I took a little walk yesterday at ZIA and caught up a few birds as I walked from the domestic ramp all the way to the export cargo area! Don't expect top-quality pics though as I took the shots on my mobile and the light of the day was fast fading away!

Enjoy...!

Pic#1: GMG's 'Mad Dog' (Reg: S2-ADM) resting under the setting sun.
http://i227.photobucket.com/albums/dd236/TheCoolOnes/Pic01.jpg

Pic # 2: This RAK B757 (Reg: A6-RKA) had just arrived from Al Ain.
http://i227.photobucket.com/albums/dd236/TheCoolOnes/Pic02.jpg

Pic # 3: An Angular look at the same MD-83 to get some light on her port side.
http://i227.photobucket.com/albums/dd236/TheCoolOnes/Pic03.jpg

Pic # 4: Northwest at DAC? Not quite! That's the B747-200 Biman leased from Kabo Air arriving on its delivery flight...an ex-Northwest classic she is (Reg: 5N-MAD; built in 1986)
http://i227.photobucket.com/albums/dd236/TheCoolOnes/Pic04.jpg

Pic # 5: Looking for her gate...
http://i227.photobucket.com/albums/dd236/TheCoolOnes/Pic05.jpg

Pic # 6: Still looking for her gate...
http://i227.photobucket.com/albums/dd236/TheCoolOnes/Pic06.jpg

Pic # 7: I love the 757's mean and menacing looks...
http://i227.photobucket.com/albums/dd236/TheCoolOnes/Pic07.jpg

Pic # 8: Finally she found her gate!
http://i227.photobucket.com/albums/dd236/TheCoolOnes/Pic08.jpg

Pic # 9: This old lady is getting a lot of attention from the men around her! ;)
http://i227.photobucket.com/albums/dd236/TheCoolOnes/Pic09.jpg

Pic # 10: And you can try counting the number of men around her if you wish!
http://i227.photobucket.com/albums/dd236/TheCoolOnes/Pic10.jpg

Pic # 11: And here's another old lady (Reg: S2-ACP) getting dressed up for the date later in the evening.
http://i227.photobucket.com/albums/dd236/TheCoolOnes/Pic11.jpg

Pic # 12: In my eyes, she looks a bit angry! Jealous...you think?
http://i227.photobucket.com/albums/dd236/TheCoolOnes/Pic12.jpg

Pic # 13: The last rays of light on her port-side.
http://i227.photobucket.com/albums/dd236/TheCoolOnes/Pic13.jpg

Pic # 14: This is the point where I began to realize it was a day for the 'classics'...Meridian's AN-26-100 at the import cargo ramp.
http://i227.photobucket.com/albums/dd236/TheCoolOnes/Pic14.jpg

Pic # 15: This Russian bird looks typical alright, but not ugly.
http://i227.photobucket.com/albums/dd236/TheCoolOnes/Pic15.jpg

Pic # 16: Now this is one old woman...and doesn't look too keen to take to the skies anymore!
http://i227.photobucket.com/albums/dd236/TheCoolOnes/Pic16.jpg

Pic # 17: Looks beaten...tired...and neglected!
http://i227.photobucket.com/albums/dd236/TheCoolOnes/Pic17.jpg


I am just about half the way over with the pics. Will post the rest later today which includes the Best Air 737, Biman's hangar, the F-28s, the A310, and an Orient Thai B747-300. Stay tuned! :)

In Dhaka, what is the most suitable public place for planespotting in ZIA?

Hei this is not the B747-200 we guessed as Biman's lease.....this plane in ZIA is 5N-MAD (ex-northwest), while the plane in London found in airliners.net is 5N-PPP (ex virgin atlantic).

Imran thanks for the series of pics.....

WAITING FOR THE REST....

IMRAN,

Bismillah Airlines Cargo plane......doesn't it fly anymore? is it an antonov?

Plane ta ke dekhe khub maya laglo :(

Thanks for the pics Bhai Imran.

@Shatil -- the Bismillah Airlines bird is an ancient Hawker Siddeley HS748. It should look neglected. AFAIK, the only things hitching a ride in it are mostly shrimp fry from Thailand to Cox's Bazaar.

The HS748's modernized, stretched, re-winged, re-engined version was known as the BAE ATP that Biman used to use. That too is now obsolete :)

thanks manbil777 for the info.....


In flight status website, they show that Bismillah airlines has daily flights to and from Bangkok and China.......r they running the antonovs on these routes?

My question more specifically, what is their fleet size? their website gives a ridiculous list of all sorts of aircrafts.....

Bismillah have a slew of old crates (the Antonovs can be bought cheap on the used market). I lost count and track a long time ago.

Whatever does not break down is good for the journey I guess :)

Does Orient Thai operate flights to Dhaka?

In Dhaka, what is the most suitable public place for planespotting in ZIA?

Currently it is the area called Dolipara/Baunia towards the threshold of Rwy14. You can watch planes landing into and taking off from Rwy14 but if you're photographying, you may be interrupted by the ever-so-idiotic Ansars patrolling the perimeter there. Also, following a report on Prothom Alo recently, CAAB has put fences around the entire ILS lighting length. Another spot, though a bit difficult to get to is the eastern part of Nikunja which is close to the airport boundary walls, from where you can see planes rolling on the runway for takeoff, or turning into the taxiway after landing on Rwy14. In rather rare circumstances, you'd probably see some landings on Rwy32.

Having said all this, let me give you the best news you can get: by the end of 2008, if the airport security plan goes smoothly, ZIA might have an OBSERVATION DECK itself, where access will be allowed to the public against an entrance fee of some sort! Now that'd be great, eh? :)


My question more specifically, what is their fleet size? their website gives a ridiculous list of all sorts of aircrafts.....

It is a ridiculous airline...what were you expecting? :)

Does Orient Thai operate flights to Dhaka?

Chartered flights only so far. Mostly for cargo and UN peacekeepers transports.

IMHO > The possibility of EK operating A380 on DXB-DAC sector is pretty high, because with 58 orders their main target market is Indian subcontinent. If they can fill two 777s now, with current growth in 5 years time, they expect(& should) fill up one A380. DAC demands more capacity than high frequency. They can also utilise one frame on two sectors (ie- DAC & DEL) eachday, so maximum utilisation can also be achieved. (SQ needs 2 A380's to operate on SIN-LHR-SIN as opposed to 1 on SIN-SYD-SIN- thereby losing premium operational time)

Even if DAC is not A380ready, they could use existing infrastructure to board passengers but it will be a long and slow process...

You are quite correct...except for the fact that EK won't probably use an A380 between DAC-DXB through another point. That's because if the infrastructure can take it, they'd be able to fill an A380 from DAC and DXB each way. The problem is, if ZIA doesn't get adequately equipped to load/unload the pax and their baggages as required by the A380, then the "long and slow" process will be a strong deterrent for EK to deploy the A380 on this route. Turnaround times are extremely important for airlines, and having to load the WhaleJet with 'traditional' infrastructure would mean loss of flying hours...if you lose 2 hours of flying everyday (due to slow turnarounds) through years, it'd run into millions of dollars in loss, and I'm not sure if an airline like EK would do that.

Besides, with Dubai growing as it is I don't think EK would have much of a problem in filling up the A380s on routes where they can operate easily.

Nice pics Imran bhai!

Is GMG going for 787-9 ??

Yes

Continued from Part 1 of 2 (Post # 1340)


Pic # 18: Best Air's "new" ;) 737!
http://i227.photobucket.com/albums/dd236/TheCoolOnes/Pic18.jpg

Pic # 19: The fiery orb is on its way out for the day...
http://i227.photobucket.com/albums/dd236/TheCoolOnes/Pic19.jpg

Pic # 20: The classic look!
http://i227.photobucket.com/albums/dd236/TheCoolOnes/Pic20.jpg

Pic # 21: This Diesel 10 (S2-ACS) hasn't taken to the skies in a very long time and her paint is smudging off.
http://i227.photobucket.com/albums/dd236/TheCoolOnes/Pic21.jpg

Pic # 22: Getting work done on her powerplants.
http://i227.photobucket.com/albums/dd236/TheCoolOnes/Pic22.jpg

Pic # 23: Not sure what's with covering up her nose like this!
http://i227.photobucket.com/albums/dd236/TheCoolOnes/Pic23.jpg

Pic # 24: Two DC-10s and two F-28s in there at the shop.
http://i227.photobucket.com/albums/dd236/TheCoolOnes/Pic24.jpg

Pic # 25: One of the three F-28s out of service, and this one (Reg: S2-ACV) sitting outside the hangar.
http://i227.photobucket.com/albums/dd236/TheCoolOnes/Pic25.jpg

Pic # 26: Once she gets the work done on her, she ought to take a bath!
http://i227.photobucket.com/albums/dd236/TheCoolOnes/Pic26.jpg

Pic # 27: Just got herself pushed out of the hangar.
http://i227.photobucket.com/albums/dd236/TheCoolOnes/Pic27.jpg

Pic # 28: Taxiing real fast out to Runway 14 for her trup back to Al Ain.
http://i227.photobucket.com/albums/dd236/TheCoolOnes/Pic28.jpg

Pic # 29: Can't wait to head out for the sun!
http://i227.photobucket.com/albums/dd236/TheCoolOnes/Pic29.jpg

Pic # 30: Long shot!
http://i227.photobucket.com/albums/dd236/TheCoolOnes/Pic30.jpg

Pic # 31: Showing signs of having been with Garuda once upon a time!
http://i227.photobucket.com/albums/dd236/TheCoolOnes/Pic31.jpg


That's all that I have for now...until next time! :)

Great photos, Imran!

Nice pics Imran bhai!

Great photos, Imran!

Thanks folks! Glad that you liked them! :)

Thanks for the great pic Imran Bhai.

do you have Any info about the B747 (pic 31) ??

Awesome pictures Imran, seems like you have unrestricted access in ZIA.

Private airliners to get govt help to boost their business

The government would help the private airliners boost their business in and outside the country so that they could effectively compete with foreign airliners, said Chief Adviser's Special Assistant Mahbub Jalmil Thursday, reports UNB.

'The government has taken initiatives to build a modern, service-oriented and profit-making airline system in the country to compete with other international airliners,' he said.

He was speaking at a meeting with high officials of private airliners at the Industries Ministry.

Mahbub Jalmil assured the executives of the private airlines that the government would help them like national flag carrier Biman Bangladesh Airlines Limited to increase their competitive edge.

The meeting elaborately discussed the existing problems being faced by the private airliners and the possible solution to the problems.

The representatives of the private airlines urged the CA's Special Assistant to take steps so that all concerned abide by government rules on operating flights on international routes, infrastructure development at airports, increase bonded warehouse facilities and the workforce of the Civil Aviation, reduce landing fees, navigation and space hiring charges and introduce an easier process in providing licence for pilots.

The meeting decided to form a subcommittee with representatives from the Civil Aviation and Tourism Ministry, Civil Aviation Authority and representatives from private airliners to find out a solution to the problem in providing licence for pilots.

http://www.thefinancialexpress-bd.com/search_index.php?page=detail_news&news_id=28036

Thanks for the great pic Imran Bhai.

do you have Any info about the B747 (pic 31) ??

Not sure what kind of info you're seeking, but maybe this can help:

Construction # 22489
Line # 611
Aircraft Type: Boeing 747-3B5
Engines: 4x PWJT9D-7R4G2
Test Registration: N6009F
Current Regustration: HS-UTL
Current Operator: Orient Thai Airlines
Date of First Flight: 30 Mar 1985
Date of Delivery: 15 Apr 1985
Originally Delivered To: Korean Airlines
Original Operator Registration: HL7469
Other Operators: Garuda Indonesia (leased from Orient Thai Airlines)

It was in DAC for transportation of UN Peacekeepers.


Awesome pictures Imran, seems like you have unrestricted access in ZIA.

Not quite unrestricted...they kept my lighter and the pack of cigarettes at the checkin gate! ;)

Private airliners to get govt help to boost their business

http://www.thefinancialexpress-bd.com/search_index.php?page=detail_news&news_id=28036

The biggest help by the GoB the airlines of Bangladesh will soon get are:
1. Ratification of the Cape Town Convention & Aircraft Protocol by GoB
2. Lifting of duties on jet-fuel (40%) completely
3. Lifting of duties on aircraft & spares import (10%) completely

Mark my words. :)

Date: 12th March, 2008
Time: 4:30pm - 5:45pm

For those of you who gets high on pics taken at BD airports, I took a little walk yesterday at ZIA and caught up a few birds as I walked from the domestic ramp all the way to the export cargo area! Don't expect top-quality pics though as I took the shots on my mobile and the light of the day was fast fading away!

Enjoy...!


lol

Thanks a lot for these fantastic pictures. You should take *little walks* at ZIA more often, and give us some treats.

Btw, why are they bothering to keep the DC10 (s2-acs) in the hanger. It's in shambles and better off in one of the round-abouts in Nikunja!

The biggest help by the GoB the airlines of Bangladesh will soon get are:
1. Ratification of the Cape Town Convention & Aircraft Protocol by GoB
2. Lifting of duties on jet-fuel (40%) completely
3. Lifting of duties on aircraft & spares import (10%) completely

Mark my words. :)

Now thats what I am talking about. I will be tracking your forecasts :) (but you have noting to be worry about since all of your predictions to date came true LOL)


-On the serious note, Whats the tax rate on the Airline operators? Do they pay the same corporate tax as others in BD?

Not quite unrestricted...they kept my lighter and the pack of cigarettes at the checkin gate! ;)

They are not good for you anyway!

Thanks for the pictures. I enjoyed them thoroughly.

[QUOTE=kodbel;19015918]lol

Thanks a lot for these fantastic pictures. You should take *little walks* at ZIA more often, and give us some treats.
QUOTE]

I whole heartedly second that! In fact, Imran should take his little walks for a seven day period (Mon-Sun), so that we can have our fill of all the touchdowns at ZIA. :)

http://img358.imageshack.us/img358/3411/pic30jy9.jpg


how many dc 10 does biman hv agn? i thout only three:ohno::ohno:

sorry for the poor marking:cheers:

and what is the point of buying fokkers when you are actualy gona feed them siting in the hanger?
i thought biman bought them recently frm indonesia
wt a waste of money, shoud v bought some dash-8

http://img358.imageshack.us/img358/3411/pic30jy9.jpg


how many dc 10 does biman hv agn? i thout only three:ohno::ohno:

sorry for the poor marking:cheers:

and what is the point of buying fokkers when you are actualy gona feed them siting in the hanger?
i thought biman bought them recently frm indonesia
wt a waste of money, shoud v bought some dash-8

Biman website has updated its fleet info recently.....

TYPE REGN. NO. CONFIGURATION DATE OF ACQUISITION
DC-10-30 S2-ACO 30 244 September 23, 1983
DC-10-30 S2-ACP 30 244 August 16, 1983
DC-10-30 S2-ACQ 30 244 December 31, 1983
DC-10-30 S2-ACR 30 244 January 06, 1989
A310-300 S2-ADF 25 196 August 19, 1996
A310-300 S2-ADH 18 200 December 13, 2000
A310-300 S2-ADK 25 198 October 22, 2003
F-28 S2-ACV -- 80 February 24, 1999
F-28 S2-ACW -- 80 April 12, 1999
F-28 S2-ADY -- 80 May 26, 2004

According to it, Biman has 4 DC-10-30 (leased 5th one is returned to Pegasus), 3 A310s and 3 F-28s (among which one is being used for ground training, one is in the hanger, one is flying......the 4th one which has already been written off is being canibalized for spare parts for others.....this is possibly the F-28 parked outside the hanger in Imran's pic). The newly arrived leased 747-200 is not in the list. So it stands that right now 2 dc-10s, 3 a310 and 1 F-28 is operating....it varies between 6 to 8 in any given time.....so the 747-200 would be a big relief....

Had Biman not brought and leased the A310s (4 were originally, one being destroyed in dubai), this airlines would have been closed long time ago.....

It was a surprise for me to learn that they are recruiting DC-10 flight engineers (while visiting their website). With less number of DC-10s in the fleet shouldn't they have more than enough number of FEs?

3 times weekly - doubling number of flights to Bangladesh (3 x to Dhaka already). Second foreign airline to serve both Dhaka and Chittagong (although IC did that a few years ago). Thai is the other one.

Interesting to note that RAK has 95% load factor to/from Dhaka.

Good for CGP - Thai, RAK, Oman, Air Arabia. Add GMG and Biman for international flights.

Zia also is scoring some notable additions - RAK, Bahrain Air (first LCC to DAC?)...and word has it that Air Arabia wants to start also. Will we see Jazeera and Sama fly to DAC soon?

Does anyone know when Kang Pacific starts Dhaka? They have now reduced their schedule to 2 weekly from 3 weekly - but who knows when they will start.

http://www.gulfnews.com/business/Aviation/10197349.html

Zia also is scoring some notable additions - RAK, Bahrain Air (first LCC to DAC?)...and word has it that Air Arabia wants to start also. Will we see Jazeera and Sama fly to DAC soon?

Does anyone know when Kang Pacific starts Dhaka? They have now reduced their schedule to 2 weekly from 3 weekly - but who knows when they will start.

http://www.gulfnews.com/business/Aviation/10197349.html

I know Air Arabia is sure to serve DAC soon, but I'm not informed about Jazeera/Sama.

Kang Pacific launches themselves in 30 days as per their website. Their website also states:
Detailed planning is underway for KPA to obtain an Air Operators Certificate (AOC) from the UAE by early 2008. In the meantime it will commence operations using wet-leased aircraft. Plans for aircraft acquisition are underway and the aircraft types under consideration include 250 to 300 seats widebodies such as the A300-600R and 767-300ER and 150-200 seat narrowbody types, including the A320 family and Boeing 737 Classic and NG aircraft. The widebodies will operate to Europe and Asia-Pacific and the narrowbodies within the Middle East and Indian sub-continent. A project office has been established at Fujairah and is being staffed with the key management team who will oversee the detailed planning and implementation of flight and ground operations.

So, did they receive the AOC yet? And I think they're also not quite 'on track' with a sensible fleet plan. A300s and Classic 737s? Not my cup of tea! ;)

"Officials said Boeing will not only deliver aircraft, but also provide technical and financial supports for staff training, route planning, upgradation of the airport, and preparation of a marketing strategy for the carrier.

Before the delivery of the passenger planes, Boeing will lease Biman four used 777-300ER in 2009 and 2010 and four used 787-8 in 2011-12 to help the national flag carrier cope with a surging passengers' growth.

Meanwhile, in an apparent attempt to pacify Airbus, Biman officials said the airlines will launch talks with the Airbus next month for procuring short-haul aircraft." -TheFinancialExpress



-There you go guys. Apparently Airbus is in a state of agitation since all the orders went to Boeing and so Biman, being the good guys ;) has to "pacify" Airbus. :lol:

Meanwhile, in an apparent attempt to pacify Airbus, Biman officials said the airlines will launch talks with the Airbus next month for procuring short-haul aircraft." -TheFinancialExpress

There you go guys. Apparently Airbus is in a state of agitation since all the orders went to Boeing and so Biman, being the good guys ;) has to "pacify" Airbus. :lol:

I don't think Biman will be allowed to to order the A320 for the sake of political pressure/pacification purposes. If Airbus is to get the A320 order, it should beat Boeing by purchase prices adequately enough to offset the benefits of the 737NG with a fleet of 787s, and 777s.

Apart from the inherent benefits of the 737NG with a fleet of 787/777 there are other direct comparison issues that either Biman will have to show the audacity to ignore OR Airbus will have to negate through extremely aggressive bundled package for the A320. Here goes a few:

B737-800 (with winglets): 162 pax; Range of 3,065 nmi (5,675 km)
A320 (with CFM engines): 150 pax; Range of 2,805 nmi (5,195 km)

B737-900ER (with winglets): 180 pax; Range of 2,795 nm (5,175 km)
A321 (with CFM engines): 183 pax; Range of 2,280 nm (4,225 km)

Operational Empty Weight Per Seat:
A320 with 150 pax is 9% higher than B737-800 with 162 pax
A321 with 183 pax is 8% higher than B737-900ER with 180 pax

Block Fuel Per Seat (500 nm trip/2-class seating/737NG with winglets):
A320 with 150 pax is 6% higher than B737-800 with 162 pax
A321 with 183 pax is 5% higher than B737-900ER with 180 pax

Total Maintenance Cost Per Seat (500 nm trip/2-class seating/737NG with winglets):
A320 with 150 pax is 25% higher than B737-800 with 162 pax
A321 with 183 pax is 26% higher than B737-900ER with 180 pax

Relative Cash Trip Cost (cash airplane operating costs/500 nm trip):
A320 with 150 pax same as 737-800 with 162 pax
A321 with 183 pax is 5% higher than the B737-900ER with 180 pax

Relative Cash Seat-Mile Cost (cash airplane operating costs/500 nm trip):
A320 with 150 pax is 8% higher than B737-800 with 162 pax
A321 with 183 pax is 5% higher than B737-900ER with 180 pax

Airbus should be asked to just offset the figures at their disadvantage with a nice little bundled package with a nicer price tag! ;)

*Anyone with any doubts whatsoever with the aforementioned figures should consult the detailed airplane characteristics documents for the concerned aircraft models made available by Boeing and Airbus for confirmation of the facts presented here.

Iasif do you have the updates on Air Asia X operation in Dhaka ? Is it still flying there ? And do you know when will they convert it into commercial service ?

Iasif do you have the updates on Air Asia X operation in Dhaka ? Is it still flying there ? And do you know when will they convert it into commercial service ?

Air Asia X hasn't begun serving Dhaka yet, and I'm not sure when they will but I'd guess it isn't too far away from coming into being! The one time I had met Mr. Fernandes, at a CAPA event in Mumbai last year, he told me they would've begun services to DAC already had they not got themselves 'unnecessarily involved' with Orion Group (Obaidul Kader et al) earlier. :)

Air Asia X hasn't begun serving Dhaka yet, and I'm not sure when they will but I'd guess it isn't too far away from coming into being! The one time I had met Mr. Fernandes, at a CAPA event in Mumbai last year, he told me they would've begun services to DAC already had they not got themselves 'unnecessarily involved' with Orion Group (Obaidul Kader et al) earlier. :)

Is this the group closely affiliated to former PM/Hawa Bhaban? So, does AirAsia now need to do some intense PR campaign to (CTG) to reverse themselves?

I don't think Biman will be allowed to to order the A320 for the sake of political pressure/pacification purposes. If Airbus is to get the A320 order, it should beat Boeing by purchase prices adequately enough to offset the benefits of the 737NG with a fleet of 787s, and 777s.

Apart from the inherent benefits of the 737NG with a fleet of 787/777 there are other direct comparison issues that either Biman will have to show the audacity to ignore OR Airbus will have to negate through extremely aggressive bundled package for the A320. Here goes a few:

B737-800 (with winglets): 162 pax; Range of 3,065 nmi (5,675 km)
A320 (with CFM engines): 150 pax; Range of 2,805 nmi (5,195 km)

B737-900ER (with winglets): 180 pax; Range of 2,795 nm (5,175 km)
A321 (with CFM engines): 183 pax; Range of 2,280 nm (4,225 km)

Operational Empty Weight Per Seat:
A320 with 150 pax is 9% higher than B737-800 with 162 pax
A321 with 183 pax is 8% higher than B737-900ER with 180 pax

Block Fuel Per Seat (500 nm trip/2-class seating/737NG with winglets):
A320 with 150 pax is 6% higher than B737-800 with 162 pax
A321 with 183 pax is 5% higher than B737-900ER with 180 pax

Total Maintenance Cost Per Seat (500 nm trip/2-class seating/737NG with winglets):
A320 with 150 pax is 25% higher than B737-800 with 162 pax
A321 with 183 pax is 26% higher than B737-900ER with 180 pax

Relative Cash Trip Cost (cash airplane operating costs/500 nm trip):
A320 with 150 pax same as 737-800 with 162 pax
A321 with 183 pax is 5% higher than the B737-900ER with 180 pax

Relative Cash Seat-Mile Cost (cash airplane operating costs/500 nm trip):
A320 with 150 pax is 8% higher than B737-800 with 162 pax
A321 with 183 pax is 5% higher than B737-900ER with 180 pax

Airbus should be asked to just offset the figures at their disadvantage with a nice little bundled package with a nicer price tag! ;)

*Anyone with any doubts whatsoever with the aforementioned figures should consult the detailed airplane characteristics documents for the concerned aircraft models made available by Boeing and Airbus for confirmation of the facts presented here.

Not that I'd like to dispute your data, why would one purchase a narrow body Airbus if a similar body type Boeing appears to be better in most aspects? Seems like a no brainer.

Is this the group closely affiliated to former PM/Hawa Bhaban? So, does AirAsia now need to do some intense PR campaign to (CTG) to reverse themselves?

Yeah...those were the guys. The man behind it has been absconding since 1/11 and is reportedly in Singapore.

Air Asia X should now be able to operate flights to/from CGP/DAC by their own efforts now...GoB is opening up its mind and getting into the mood of liberalization and I don't see why an airline like Air Asia should find it difficult to begin services...except for the fact that their capacity isn't growing as fast as they'd like to. AFAIK, they were in the process of choosing between the A350XWB and B787, and a decision was impending...not sure how far they're with that though!

Not that I'd like to dispute your data, why would one purchase a narrow body Airbus if a similar body type Boeing appears to be better in most aspects? Seems like a no brainer.

It is a no brainer! I just don't get the excuse of making Europe happy here. If Airbus wants to be pacified, just give them some damned pacifiers!

Certain people at Biman are of the idea that PIA got screwed in their European operations because of the fact that they became the launch customer for the 777-200LR (instead of the A340-500) which is pure bullshit. PIA's 747's were the only ones 'banned' and for good reasons too! EASA conducted random inspections on some PIA 747s, which is a rightful task at their disposal (as also is with the FAA) and found issues on the aircraft relating to non-adherence to mandatory AD/SB's for the aircraft. Consequently those aircraft were banned from flying into Europe.

If I can recall correctly, the ban was on four 747s and all these four are up for sale now!

Bangladesh Government is facing an unprecedented type of informal but stiff pressure not only in Dhaka but also in London, Paris, Berlin and New York to pacify "someone".

This is amazing how corporate business interest nowadays dictates foreign policies of nations.

It is a no brainer! I just don't get the excuse of making Europe happy here.

Me neither, but the point was made not to tick the Europeans off. I tend to agree as these lot tend to be more conniving, sensitive, sentimental, and not so up front. That's how they colonized the world, after all.

Anyway, I hope common sense shall prevail among the powers that be, in Biman, which favors Boeing.

:crazy: I have been reading this thread for weeks (to lazy to register haha).. You guys have some of the great comments of our national airline to improve their service....

so the debating about the boeing and airbus orders... i was thinking bit more differently. Since boeing got the orders of 777 and 787(8 in total), biman has to think about the future growth in air travel in bangladesh. I was personally thinking of adding 8 more planes, such as A330-300 which can replace present A310s to serve the Middle east/Asia-pacific/Australia region while the 777 and 787 can serve longer range destination.

Not sure whether this youtube video is a repost.....if not, aand if some of u haven't seen it, plz let me know your feedback...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qa3oQFyWFPw

Not sure whether this youtube video is a repost.....if not, aand if some of u haven't seen it, plz let me know your feedback...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qa3oQFyWFPw

Nice video shatilislam, Very picturesque, flying into the sunset.

:) awesome video...

Bangladesh Government is facing an unprecedented type of informal but stiff pressure not only in Dhaka but also in London, Paris, Berlin and New York to pacify "someone".

This is amazing how corporate business interest nowadays dictates foreign policies of nations.

Rx for pacification of Airbus, et al:

http://i227.photobucket.com/albums/dd236/TheCoolOnes/pacifier.jpg

so the debating about the boeing and airbus orders... i was thinking bit more differently. Since boeing got the orders of 777 and 787(8 in total), biman has to think about the future growth in air travel in bangladesh. I was personally thinking of adding 8 more planes, such as A330-300 which can replace present A310s to serve the Middle east/Asia-pacific/Australia region while the 777 and 787 can serve longer range destination.

The A330, in my opinion, is the best widebody Airbus has ever built. However, the 787 and Airbus' own A350XWB will replace the A330 thanks to the betterment of technologies. Biman, with a fleet of eight 787s and 777s will have a lot to prove and make feasible use of these airplanes. By the time they would be in a position to add capacity, the A330 will have been replaced almost entirely (for new orders I mean) by the 787 and the A350XWB. The simple reason why the A330 is selling so well now is because it is far superior than the 767, and the 787/A350XWB's EIS is a bit too late to address the worldwide capacity growth. The A330 production will be on for quite some time though, for the reason that USAF has picked the MRTT version of it but its sales for commercial airlines will be taken away by the 787 and the A350XWB.

Therefore, when Biman will be ready to add capacity on top of the eight 787/777s, it would probably do so with more 777s and 787s to retain commonality. The 787-10 which Boeing promises to launch in the future would be a very potential option as well.

:crazy: I have been reading this thread for weeks (to lazy to register haha).. You guys have some of the great comments of our national airline to improve their service....

so the debating about the boeing and airbus orders... i was thinking bit more differently. Since boeing got the orders of 777 and 787(8 in total), biman has to think about the future growth in air travel in bangladesh. I was personally thinking of adding 8 more planes, such as A330-300 which can replace present A310s to serve the Middle east/Asia-pacific/Australia region while the 777 and 787 can serve longer range destination.

Welcome to the forum Silv3r. Enjoy your stay.

Biman website has updated its fleet info recently.....

TYPE REGN. NO. CONFIGURATION DATE OF ACQUISITION
DC-10-30 S2-ACO 30 244 September 23, 1983
DC-10-30 S2-ACP 30 244 August 16, 1983
DC-10-30 S2-ACQ 30 244 December 31, 1983
DC-10-30 S2-ACR 30 244 January 06, 1989
A310-300 S2-ADF 25 196 August 19, 1996
A310-300 S2-ADH 18 200 December 13, 2000
A310-300 S2-ADK 25 198 October 22, 2003
F-28 S2-ACV -- 80 February 24, 1999
F-28 S2-ACW -- 80 April 12, 1999
F-28 S2-ADY -- 80 May 26, 2004

According to it, Biman has 4 DC-10-30 (leased 5th one is returned to Pegasus), 3 A310s and 3 F-28s (among which one is being used for ground training, one is in the hanger, one is flying......the 4th one which has already been written off is being canibalized for spare parts for others.....this is possibly the F-28 parked outside the hanger in Imran's pic). The newly arrived leased 747-200 is not in the list. So it stands that right now 2 dc-10s, 3 a310 and 1 F-28 is operating....it varies between 6 to 8 in any given time.....so the 747-200 would be a big relief....

Had Biman not brought and leased the A310s (4 were originally, one being destroyed in dubai), this airlines would have been closed long time ago.....

The updated fleet info in Biman website doesn't show the DC-10-30 (S2-ACS) in real bad shape in the hanger as shown in Imran's picture. Apart from it, Biman has 4 more DC-10s (S2-ACO/P/Q/R).....a good news indeed....

:) Thanks for the reply Imran Bhai and amar11372..

You made some great points on my post. I have flown on A330 from Emirates.. it was one of the smooth ride ever. This babe(A330) along with A320 are the best selling from Airbus. Anyways back to Biman... i will my my opinions into points. (I am sorry if they have been previously discussed)

1) Customer Service
:down: It is bad, well at least the one's i have bump into. Some of the Air Hostess needs some serious attitude/anger control. :ohno: well seriously i dont deserve this kind service if i am $paying$ for the flight.

2) Domestic Flights
So, biman finally canceling all domestic flight except Chittagong and Sylhet because of shortage of aircraft (poor fokkers are too tired to take off). How about starting a subsidiary airline, lets call it "Biman Express", totally separate unit operating independently just like other subsidiaries BFCC etc. They can serve domestic and regional destination by using smaller aircraft 50 to 100 seater aircrafts.

3) Cabin Atmosphere
Most of the airlines today has good legroom and inflight entertainment. Buying just new fancy expensive wont do the job, Biman needs good inflight entertainment and keep the legroom. (DC-10 has good legroom on both economy and first class)

lets hope for the best :banana:

Dhaka, March 15 (bdnews24.om) — Biman Bangladesh Airlines has signed a memorandum of understanding for the purchase of eight Boeing airliners.

The deal was signed at the Biman head office Saturday for eight Boeing planes to be purchased at a cost of $1.26 billion. Of the aircraft four are of the new Boeing-777-300 ER series and the other four Being-787-8 models.

Biman managing director MA Momen and director general (aircraft contracts) of the US Boeing Company Glen A Green signed the MOU Saturday.

The present deal marks the first time that Biman are buying aircraft directly from the manufacturing company.

The chief adviser's special assistant for civil aviation and tourism Mahbub Jamil and US charge d'Affaires Geeta Pasi were present at the signing.

Mahbub Jamil told reporters: "This is a revolutionary decision of the government. The signing of the MOU has paved the way for buying another four aircrafts in the future."

US charge d'Affaires Geeta Pasi also termed the signing the MOU as a memorable event, saying there was a demand for aviation services in Bangladesh.

Mahbub said, as per the MOU, four Boeing-777-300 ER airliners would be added to the Biman Bangladesh fleet in July, August, October and December of 2013.

The remaining four planes would be added in July, August, October and November of 2017, he said.

Mahbub told reporters that the government is considering some form of policy to ensure that no corruption takes places in procuring aircrafts in future.

The policy would make provisions to continue buying planes directly from the manufacturers.

Biman's fleet currently includes four DC-10s, three Airbuses and three F-28 aircrafts.

bdnews24.com/mhc/sm/eh/rah/1824hours

2) Domestic Flights
So, biman finally canceling all domestic flight except Chittagong and Sylhet because of shortage of aircraft (poor fokkers are too tired to take off). How about starting a subsidiary airline, lets call it "Biman Express", totally separate unit operating independently just like other subsidiaries BFCC etc. They can serve domestic and regional destination by using smaller aircraft 50 to 100 seater aircrafts.

I am in partial agreement with you on this. I also think there's a way for Biman to continue to operate on other domestic routes (apart from just CGP and ZYL) profitably. I, however, think the equipment should be much smaller than 50 pax and I do have an idea that might work for Biman in more than one way. Soon enough, I shall try and pitch that idea to Biman to see if they can give it a try! :)

:)
2) Domestic Flights
So, biman finally canceling all domestic flight except Chittagong and Sylhet because of shortage of aircraft (poor fokkers are too tired to take off). How about starting a subsidiary airline, lets call it "Biman Express", totally separate unit operating independently just like other subsidiaries BFCC etc. They can serve domestic and regional destination by using smaller aircraft 50 to 100 seater aircrafts. :banana:

I also agree with you. Let "Biman Express" be country's first LCC !!

The loss-making airline is also reviewing a separate offer for planes from Europe's Airbus . Airbus will make a presentation within the next few days, Jamil said.

http://www.reuters.com/article/rbssIndustryMaterialsUtilitiesNews/idUSDHA8195320080315

United Airways is in the middle of preparing their new look website. It looks good, lot more information than the current one. Alot better than Biman's or GMG's.

They are also planning to add 2x dash 8-300 and 6x wide bodied jet aircrafts.

http://www.uabdl.com/new_website/index.shtml

United Airways is in the middle of preparing their new look website. It looks good, lot more information than the current one. Alot better than Biman's or GMG's.

They are also planning to add 2x dash 8-300 and 6x wide bodied jet aircrafts.

http://www.uabdl.com/new_website/index.shtml

Speaking of which, it is high time, GMG give a badly needed facelift to its website. Better yet, a brand new one, in keeping with its shiny image.

The critiques just can't agree with Biman's latest decision.

Article published today in Dailystar:

http://thedailystar.net/story.php?nid=27871

"Boeing! Boeing!
M. Firoze

One of the cardinal principles of the business world and sound economic management is that success is rewarded and failure is penalised. In a successful business organisation the CEO and his team of managers are rewarded with pay raises and bonuses for turning out a profit for the company and its shareholders. If the company makes a loss or is found guilty of breaking the law the CEO and his team are unceremoniously booted out or sent to jail.

A perennially unprofitable company usually goes bankrupt; the assets are sold off to pay its creditors and employees and the investors count the losses.

This is a truism and the basis of wealth creation across the globe but not for the government of Bangladesh (GOB). Its recent decision to acquire a fleet Boeing jets for Bangladesh Biman is a brilliant example of how to reward failure, inefficiency, and corruption with taxpayer money. For a government which came to power with a pledge to uproot corruption and inefficiency this action is even more unpardonable.

If Biman was a successfully run and efficiently managed corporation it would have managed to raise the money from its retained earnings and creditors at home and abroad to buy a new fleet of aircraft. Nobody would have a quarrel on that issue.

Having a national flag carrier is not a strategic or a security issue; it is a simple case of national vanity. One of the best known and legendary airlines of yesteryears was PanAm. In fact PanAm was an American icon; it was a symbol of the good life, its smartly attired beautiful stewardesses were featured in a Hollywood movie which forms the title of this article.

PanAm and another American giant TWA both lived beyond its means and succumbed to the harsh realities of the market place. Uncle Sam did not step in with taxpayer money to save them.

Today, it is Sir Richard Branson's Virgin Atlantic, which is the most notable airline in major US international airports. If the lone superpower on this planet can live without a national flag carrier so can we! Biman has to fold its wings and its assets sold off, there are many entrepreneurs at home and abroad to step in to the country's aviation market. The GOB will be richer with licensing fees and tax income from the private airlines.

Spending 1.265 billion dollars of taxpayer money on eight luxury aircraft is a scandalous case of misplaced national priority. It is a sum larger then what was spent to build the Jamuna Bridge. Spending this sum on a national works program to build roads and cyclone shelters and seawalls against storm surges would have revived a moribund economy and created millions of new jobs.

Let us stop imagining being the oil sheikhdoms of the Middle East who have money to burn. The GOB has to learn a lesson what a toiling rickshaw puller and garments worker knows very well: There is no free lunch!"

^^I didn't know that Sir Richard Branson's Virgin Atlantic, is the most notable airline in major US international airports :nuts:

Another extract from Khurshid Alam Khan who is the President, Flight Engineers & Navigators Association ...

"Whenever Biman opted to buy - as it did at various stages of its history - brand-new aircraft, for example the DC10 in 1989, the ATPs in 1990, or the A310s in 1996, Biman invariably ran into financial difficulties primarily because of a highly adverse debt-equity ratio that once reached the staggering value of 83:17 bringing Biman precipitously close to bankruptcy. This time again, unless the Government provides enough financial support in terms of equity, the history will only repeat itself. The political Governments never lived up to their commitment to Biman in terms of providing equity injection resulting each time in disputes between Biman and the Government following the purchase of every new aircraft.

Biman really does not need to go through all the rigour of strait jacket exercises, for it really does not need to commit today to a colossal amount of expenses in its current financial condition. Rather, Biman would do well to cut its proverbial coat according to its cloth.

With the arrival of the Superjumbo Airbus A380, many airlines will face over-capacity which they will trim by selling off their other long haul aircraft. The Singapore Airlines is already flying its two Superjumbo Airbus A380s on SIN-SYD sector, the Emirates is scheduled to operate its new A380s non-stop from Dubai to New York on 1st October 2008, London Heathrow on 1st December 2008, and Sydney-Auckland on 1st February 2009. From the media reports we know Airbus expects to deliver 13 A380s in 2008 and 25 in 2009 and 44 per year from 2010 onward. One can reasonably expect, by 2013, when Boeing offers to deliver its first B777 to Biman, there will be a glut of aircraft of various types including B777s in the aviation world. Can Biman then not buy at a bargain price from the secondary market the B777s that it is desperate today to place orders for?

The Fleet Planning Committee of Biman never ceases to amaze the observers with its overtures. Already mired in a controversy as to its composition, the Fleet Planning Committee now fronts an erstwhile Biman Board member to make the presentation of its fleet planning before the current Biman Board. The capacity in which the erstwhile Board member has access to the Board meeting and the capacity in which he makes a presentation before the Board are not just academic questions, but also are vital legal ones that beg explanations from those who are at the helm of affairs of Biman.

If Biman would properly keep all its aircraft airworthy and flyable all the time, there would be no reason why it cannot maintain the flight frequency and schedule in its present route structure without any disruption. Irrespective of old or new, the three used DC10s that Biman bought in 1983-84 for a total of US$63m and the one brand-new DC10 that it bought in 1989 for US$69m - the workhorses of the national flag carrier - continue till today to render absolutely the same services. Pertinently, what matters is how you maintain your aircraft, not how new or how old your aircraft is.

We have never had any dearth of people looking after the interest of the Boeing or the Airbus or the international financial institutions. This time around we expect the new Board members of Biman Bangladesh Airlines Limited will be passionate about the very survival of Biman and not let themselves be guiled by the mirage of the rosy picture of Biman's future as depicted by the seller's feasibility study."

Full article published on the 9th http://nation.ittefaq.com/issues/2008/03/09/news0706.htm

Although some of their points are worthwhile, their opinions just don't add up :crazy2:

The critiques just can't agree with Biman's latest decision.

Although some of their points are worthwhile, their opinions just don't add up :crazy2:

While the flight engineer's opinions may be disregarded as being biased who has vested interest in keeping those old aircrafts flying, Mr. Firoze's comments ought not to be scattered to the wind.

It is indeed true that the 1.26 billion could be spent on many worthy national infrastructure or elsewhere. But to be fair to Biman, it should be given the opportunity to redeem itself and prove itself worthwhile for the sacrifice of that amount of foreign currency. This should be the last chance for Biman. If they continue business as usual, then surely it ought to be auctioned off, lock, stock, and barrel.

All the ninny-whining and sob-sister stories won't change anything...too late :)

And why are these people crying after the fact?? the decision's already made...

Boeing makes a better aircraft for_Biman's_needs. It's a fact. We need massive reliable aircraft for 'Labor_tanatani' (777's) to the Middle East and Malaysia. We need nimble 737's that can fly in and out of airports like KTM and PARO. We need reliability first and foremost. Biman needs Boeings to get out of the hole it is in.

Did you guys know 737's don't have main gear doors? At all? They decided to get rid of them. The wheels just expand at altitude and get locked in.

That's a workhorse of a machine. These are tough, tough, tough high-cycle birds that spend most of their times on the sky (not sitting on the ground) and keep making money for the airlines.

We need to get tough aircraft that can land with the nose gear folded in and not lose one life. Those are the qualities Boeing's aircraft have. The efficiency is just a bonus. Look at Best Air. It's flying a 25 year old Boeing and it's flying just fine.

I've spoken to more then a dozen pilots at Continental and FEDEX (who fly both Boeing and Airbus types and they're unanimous in their assessment that Airbus' reliability is a question mark. They say that there are no major faults but little things would break like fuses, bulbs, displays etc. I've flown in a Boeing 737-100 that Alaska Airlines is probably still flying (the first airplane they bought back in the 60's). That crate used up all 10,000 feet of the runway but it did get off the ground. Airbus couldn't sell planes and make money if not for European Govt. subsidies.

We neither have the time nor the experimentation margin needed to play around for Biman's requirements. You cannot plan a fleet wishing that surplus airplanes at discounted prices will someday become available because if they do -- then you can expand the fleet. But you cannot plan your fleet on that fact alone.

Obviously these people writing op-ed pieces have some kind of motivation because they can't put up any kind of strong argument based on facts.

All the ninny-whining and sob-sister stories won't change anything...too late :)

And why are these people crying after the fact?? the decision's already made...


Actually, the folks against the deal have been crying for quite a while but it is a cry in the wilderness ... nobody is listening.

The ninny-whining doesn't bother me. What I worry about is that all this may come to a naught when an elected government returns and, once again they find a golden goose in Biman. They will find a way to scrap the Boeing deal and go for leasing from the current market, since a shady deal can always be had from "fly by night" organizations.

Three flights a week commenced from March 15.

http://www.albawaba.com/en/countries/UAE/223706

Just went through United Airways' Prospectus

http://i269.photobucket.com/albums/jj50/amar11372/Air.jpg

-Does anyone know what the 6 big jets are?



http://i269.photobucket.com/albums/jj50/amar11372/route.jpg

-Also I believe this may have been discussed before but, United Airways states that they will fly Sylhet-Dhaka-London by this year. Assuming they do have the necessary infrastructure would BD govt allow them to fly this route? How about the UK govt?

The critiques just can't agree with Biman's latest decision.

Article published today in Dailystar:

http://thedailystar.net/story.php?nid=27871

Another extract from Khurshid Alam Khan who is the President, Flight Engineers & Navigators Association ...

Full article published on the 9th http://nation.ittefaq.com/issues/2008/03/09/news0706.htm

Although some of their points are worthwhile, their opinions just don't add up :crazy2:


(1) Mr. Feroze's point of argument is the opportunity cost of spending US$ 1.26 billion for Biman's fleet renewal. This argument is valid for just about every investment/expenditure GoB would make in any industry. If GoB hadn't committed this sum for Biman, but had indeed invested it on say 'steel manufacturing', (;)) wouldn't this same question have arisen as to how the money could be better spent?

The underlying fact is if Biman can survive and sustain profitably into the future, these questions wouldn't stand the test of time. If it doesn't, well, we all know what will be.

(2) Mr. Khurshid Alam Khan is on the verge of losing his job following the publication of his article on New Age. On 13th March, he had sent a fax message to Biman disowning the article. Rumour has it that it was some of his fellow mates who had written these articles and had them published by his name without an explicit consent. I don't know how its all going to go down but this 2nd article on Ittefaq is aggravating the troubles for him!

Just went through United Airways' Prospectus

http://i269.photobucket.com/albums/jj50/amar11372/Air.jpg

-Does anyone know what the 6 big jets are?



http://i269.photobucket.com/albums/jj50/amar11372/route.jpg

-Also I believe this may have been discussed before but, United Airways states that they will fly Sylhet-Dhaka-London by this year. Assuming they do have the necessary infrastructure would BD govt allow them to fly this route? How about the UK govt?

As far as I know, the ZYL-DAC-LGW has been proposed to the civil avation ministary, and they have already signed an MOU with a malaysian company to leave come purchase Airbus A310.

If the green signal is given by the civil avaiation in Bangladesh, then they can fly into London. Instead of using Heatrow airport, they want to use London Gatwick, which is the second bigest in the UK. This airport is very popular with the budget airlines of the UK.

Does anyone know any detail about Mahbub Jamil? Had he been considered as advisor when first group of advisors selected?

United Airways:
Sounds interesting about the United Airways... but one thing concerns me that is A310 doesnt have enough fuel capacity to operate between ZIA and LGW directly. Are they planning to add another destination between this flight?

Regarding website of United Airways. New site looks good but still needs lots of work. To be honest i prefer Biman website, its simply user friendly but only if they can update it on regular basis. GMG website is a joke, they should consider spending some good money for online booking.

Biman:
Oh yah one thing i forgot to mention about "Biman Express" was, they can offer one class service and let passenger pay for the inflight meals and drinks. The suitable aircraft i was thinking was about ATR-42 + cut few seats to make room for more cargo(atleast it can carry some freight).

(2) Mr. Khurshid Alam Khan is on the verge of losing his job following the publication of his article on New Age. On 13th March, he had sent a fax message to Biman disowning the article. Rumour has it that it was some of his fellow mates who had written these articles and had them published by his name without an explicit consent. I don't know how its all going to go down but this 2nd article on Ittefaq is aggravating the troubles for him!
^^
I dare not call them mates then!! Typical Bangladeshi mentality.


After United's price cut, now RoyalBengal has done the same. Including both adverts for easy comparison:

http://img389.imageshack.us/img389/3170/20080310114bsb1.jpg

http://img204.imageshack.us/img204/6457/20080316165bey9.jpg


With very high inflation in the economy airfare must be the only item in Bangladesh which is going down!!!

:nuts: well seems like 100 taka price difference and i am surprised to see all price from Royal Bengal has tax included.

The only scary part is that in few years time, these domestic services wont exist because of high competition and low profit margins, private airline will mostly focus on international which are profitable (middle east mostly).

After United's price cut, now RoyalBengal has done the same.

With very high inflation in the economy airfare must be the only item in Bangladesh which is going down!!!

Trust me on this one: this is an extremely unhealthy price war! They are living one-day-at-a-time which is the last thing to do in airline business. There's a very tight limit as to how hypothetically hopeful you can be for the future ahead, more so in Bangladesh, and I'm afraid that what is now looking to be a promising synergy in the BD airline industry might soon become a spoilsport.

Just try to find out the DOC and OOC of the Dash-8-100, in BD terms, and then try to match that with any bit of profitability to these fares...you'll see what I mean!!

ZIA International @ night

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v193/Bangladesh/bangladesh1/Bangladesh2/Bangladesh3/dhakaairport178.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v193/Bangladesh/bangladesh1/Bangladesh2/Bangladesh3/dhakaairport179.jpg

[QUOTE=Tmac;19067440]ZIA International @ night

Gotta beat you with some nightshots! :)

Are you/were you in Dhaka recently?

[QUOTE=Tmac;19067440]ZIA International @ night

Gotta beat you with some nightshots! :)

Are you/were you in Dhaka recently?

haha no man. I found these shots in the internet.

I really enjoyed your ZIA photos. How about some Shah Amanat and Osmani photos? We really appreciate the effort and time you put in explaining the current aviation scene in Bangladesh. You are an asset for us Bangladeshis. Keep up the great work Imran!

-Does anyone know what the 6 big jets are?

No not really. That is a very vague sentence! :nuts:

Regarding Biman's purchase, I do agree that the sum of the price is a little too high for BD. I think we can build the Padma bridge with that kind of money. On the other hand, something had to be done to get the airline out of life support.

I was thinking about letting the airlines die, mainly because I don't think govt. should bail airlines out by using public money. Biman should learn to stand on it's own foot; if it can't, then it should fall, as simple as that. Now, we all know that lack of modern aircrafts is not the only reason why Biman is in limbo today. So, they need to identify other causes and handle them properly. Otherwise buying new planes would be similar to buying new and modern equipments for a person who is on life support and probably has died! :cheers:

^^
I dare not call them mates then!! Typical Bangladeshi mentality.


After United's price cut, now RoyalBengal has done the same. Including both adverts for easy comparison:

http://img389.imageshack.us/img389/3170/20080310114bsb1.jpg

http://img204.imageshack.us/img204/6457/20080316165bey9.jpg


With very high inflation in the economy airfare must be the only item in Bangladesh which is going down!!!


Compition is good for the consumer but I don't like price war alone. The airlines need to compete in other fields such as, customer service, time keeping flight scheduel, customer loyelty ect..

This Royal Bengal airline has a copy cat tactic. Since day one, thay have been copying United. They get the same aircraft, same destinations, and now they try to cut the price by 100tk, stupid.

By the way, United will fly to Jessore, Barisal, Kalkata, Khatmandu, Delhi very soon. Na matter what RBA does, United will always be one step ahead of them.:lol:

GMG plans to buy 6 Boeings for $900m
Talks with IFC, Kuwaiti financier; MoU soon
Staff Correspondent

GMG Airlines in a landmark move yesterday unveiled its plan to buy six new generation aircraft from US plane maker Boeing at $900 million (Tk 6,200 crore) in a bid to expand routes and capture the growing marker share.

"We're going to buy six new planes -- three Boeing 777-300ER with 463 seats and the rest Boeing 787-9s," Shahab Sattar, managing director (MD) of GMG, the country's largest airlines, told The Daily Star last night.

"We have almost finalised the deal with Boeing and within next four to five weeks are going to sign a Memorandum of Understanding," he added while talking to Boeing officials at his office.

Sattar went on to say: "With the new aircraft we'll expand our international routes to Singapore, Hong Kong, Kuwait, Saudi Arabia, Mascot, Doha, Bahrain, Rome and London."

The country's first private carrier took this landmark decision after Biman Bangladesh Airlines Ltd on March 10 announced its plan to buy eight new-generation aircraft from Boeing at a cost of $1.265 billion (Tk 8,728 crore).

Aviation industry marks a boom with the launch of three private airlines in last eight months and another set to start commercial flights next month, thanks to a steadily growing demand for air transport.

The industry is growing by 7.5 to 8 percent every year, while the market size of passengers is worth around Tk 3,500 crore, private operators say.

Asked about financers for buying the aircraft, the GMG MD said: "Negotiations are on with a Kuwaiti financing company and International Finance Corporation, the World Bank's private sector arm."

"We are also holding talks with domestic banks for the financing."

GMG Airlines, now with a fleet of seven aircraft, operates flights to Kolkata, Delhi, Kathmandu, Bangkok, Kuala Lumpur and Dubai in addition to domestic routes.

The carrier eyes an ambitious turnover of around Tk 1,350 crore in 2008 as it is set to fly to four new Middle Eastern destinations.

"We expect to hit Tk 1,350 crore turnover as we're going to fly to Abu Dhabi, Muscat, Kuwait and Doha in addition to our existing international destinations," Sattar said earlier in an interview with The Daily Star.

The airlines made a Tk 280 crore turnover last year.

In 2007, GMG carried 3.72 lakh passengers on international routes, achieving a 72 percent growth from previous year's 2.16 lakh passengers.

http://thedailystar.net/story.php?nid=28090

GMG plans to buy 6 Boeings for $900m
Talks with IFC, Kuwaiti financier; MoU soon
Staff Correspondent

GMG Airlines in a landmark move yesterday unveiled its plan to buy six new generation aircraft from US plane maker Boeing at $900 million (Tk 6,200 crore) in a bid to expand routes and capture the growing marker share.


Seems like the speculation about GMG buying 6 next generation Aircrafts is indeed true. Come to think to it, it seems like all the speculations about BD aviation is coming true. ;) Imran, do you believe that now since GMG has gain considerable power with these purchases, the rest of the three smaller carrier will consolidate?

Zia Airport

Credit: mahemot

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3070/2335185237_90440b4b3d_o.jpg

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2367/2335185303_571f3cc513_o.jpg

[QUOTE=iasif;19067518]

haha no man. I found these shots in the internet.

I really enjoyed your ZIA photos. How about some Shah Amanat and Osmani photos? We really appreciate the effort and time you put in explaining the current aviation scene in Bangladesh. You are an asset for us Bangladeshis. Keep up the great work Imran!

Glad to be of any good! :)

No not really. That is a very vague sentence! :nuts:

Regarding Biman's purchase, I do agree that the sum of the price is a little too high for BD. I think we can build the Padma bridge with that kind of money. On the other hand, something had to be done to get the airline out of life support.

I was thinking about letting the airlines die, mainly because I don't think govt. should bail airlines out by using public money. Biman should learn to stand on it's own foot; if it can't, then it should fall, as simple as that. Now, we all know that lack of modern aircrafts is not the only reason why Biman is in limbo today. So, they need to identify other causes and handle them properly. Otherwise buying new planes would be similar to buying new and modern equipments for a person who is on life support and probably has died! :cheers:

Agreed. I had even written this very same thing - that flashy new airplanes alone will not get Biman to cloud # 9. It has a bunch of very serious issues to take care of in the areas of administration, management, marketing, and operations...without which the airline won't really see the light of the day!

As for the money part behind the planes, its quite a bit different than spending on bridges. Here, Biman will pay up this money over maybe a couple of decades, and hopefully from its own revenues. If it can't, the planes will be impounded/repossessed by the creditor. This factor is a security for the creditor, and a motivator for the airline. Now imagine if a dozen bridges were built for US$ 1.2b and then over half a decade the rivers ran dry! Would the creditor then be able to impound/repossess the bridge? :) Like I said earlier, the issue of 'opportunity cost' will be associated with any investment, anywhere in the world. But yet, choices will have to be made!

Compition is good for the consumer but I don't like price war alone. The airlines need to compete in other fields such as, customer service, time keeping flight scheduel, customer loyelty ect..

This Royal Bengal airline has a copy cat tactic. Since day one, thay have been copying United. They get the same aircraft, same destinations, and now they try to cut the price by 100tk, stupid.

By the way, United will fly to Jessore, Barisal, Kalkata, Khatmandu, Delhi very soon. Na matter what RBA does, United will always be one step ahead of them.:lol:

No one is innovating here mate! GMG could say the same about United copying their equipment choice, most of their domestic routes (duh...as if we have a handful of options!), and then undercutting their fares by a few hundred takas. If I can remember correctly, United's launch fare between DAC-CGP was about Tk.300 less than GMG's.

I'd like to see United 'untie' themselves from the convention, because that's where the magic is. :)

Seems like the speculation about GMG buying 6 next generation Aircrafts is indeed true. Come to think to it, it seems like all the speculations about BD aviation is coming true. ;) Imran, do you believe that now since GMG has gain considerable power with these purchases, the rest of the three smaller carrier will consolidate?

Consolidation requires a mature market. Ours is still a pretty fragile one if you ask me. I'm not ruling out the possibility, but its a long shot.

As for GMG gaining power with these new airplanes...well...with the Cape Town Convention and Aircraft Protocol coming into effect, private carriers will find it pretty easy to order for and get hold of new airplanes. The challenge is whether they'd be able to hold onto them for long. The government policies are weak, policymaking strengths weaker, and the legal system the weakest. It'd be a challenge for any private airline in Bangladesh to hedge themselves against these obstacles and operate feasibly. GMG has one asset that will be much, much more valuable to it than the new planes - experience. Its something others can't buy for money, and thats what GMG will have to make most use of to get where they want to be.

^^Thanks for your reply.

The highlight of the following article is this:

The GMG, now with a fleet of 7 aircraft, flies to Kolkata, Delhi, Kathmandu, Bangkok and Kuala Lumpur. It also operates on domestic routes.
The company will hire another 747-300 by April 15, two more MD-82s by May and another two 767-300s to operate long-haul flights.

http://www.newagebd.com/busi.html#2

In light of the anticipated growth, two questions come to mind,

1) Have they secured the rights to operate new routes, specially the ones mentioned in the report?

2) Do they have resources, both financially and manpower wise to continue and sustain projected growth? I mean, they cannot grow and maintain growth solely on foreign hires, as that would cost fortune and negative image as well.

Imran, as an expert in this area, I am hoping that you might be able to shed some lights on the above points.

^^Thanks for your reply.

The highlight of the following article is this:

The GMG, now with a fleet of 7 aircraft, flies to Kolkata, Delhi, Kathmandu, Bangkok and Kuala Lumpur. It also operates on domestic routes.
The company will hire another 747-300 by April 15, two more MD-82s by May and another two 767-300s to operate long-haul flights.

http://www.newagebd.com/busi.html#2

In light of the anticipated growth, two questions come to mind,

1) Have they secured the rights to operate new routes, specially the ones mentioned in the report?

2) Do they have resources, both financially and manpower wise to continue and sustain projected growth? I mean, they cannot grow and maintain growth solely on foreign hires, as that would cost fortune and negative image as well.

Imran, as an expert in this area, I am hoping that you might be able to shed some lights on the above points.

1. I think these (Saudi Arabia, Bahrain, Singapore, Hong Kong, London) are GMG's "planned" routes, because till date, BG is the only designated carrier from BD in the ASA's concerned. GMG will have to appeal to get designated and only after that they can use the frequencies subject to CAAB's approval.

2. Right now they are addressing the capacity issue with wet-leased airplanes giving it a 'tutti-fruity' look altogether, but with the announced order with Boeing and the delivery of the planes in time, the fleet will hopefully streamline. Their current international operations is bringing them invaluable experience, and is giving them the indicators for infrastructural strengthening. And like I said earlier, experience is their biggest asset and they ought to use it wisely! :)

Very impressive from GMG...they seem to be matching Biman's purchases. On a side note...does anyone know what the letters "GMG" stand for?

Biman to pay Tk 8.7 crore as duty on eight aircraft
Four aircraft to come in 2013
United News of Bangladesh . Dhaka

The Biman Bangladesh Airlines Limited is to pay 10 per cent duty on the import of eight aircraft from the US Boeing Company at a cost of $1.265 billion for which memorandum of understanding was signed on March 15.

The duty alone will come to about Tk 87 million. Biman director of finance Muhammad Tahir Hossain told the news agency that they are aware of the involvement of huge money for procurement of the aircraft, including duty. ‘But the payment of the aircraft is still far away as we have just signed the MoU, not the final deal.’

The first consignment of four aircraft will come in 2013 and another four in the second consignment in 2017. The payment will be made in instalments, he added.

Replying to a question, Tahir said Biman, like other companies, will comply with all rules and regulation of the government. ‘Obviously, we will pay duty to the government.’

Asked about any relaxation he said they would seek relaxation of duty before the aircraft are imported. Limping with few old aircraft and sustaining heavy loss Biman decided on March 9 to purchase eight Boeing aircraft to resuscitate the national flag carrier.

Of the first consignment, the first one Boeing 777-300ER aircraft will cost $182.17 million. Each of three others will cost $182.51 million, $183.20 million and $184.01 million. The initial selling price of this kind of aircraft is $272 million.

The first Boeing 787 aircraft of the second consignment will cost $132.83 million while each of three others will cost $133.08 million, $133.53 million and $133.81 million. The initial selling price of these planes is $167 million.

http://www.newagebd.com/busi.html

HAHA, I knew it that Biman officials couldn't keep their mouth shut about the actual/list price of the Aircrafts. :lol:

Biman to pay Tk 8.7 crore as duty on eight aircraft

http://www.newagebd.com/busi.html

HAHA, I knew it that Biman officials couldn't keep their mouth shut about the actual/list price of the Aircrafts. :lol:

Yet another explicit display of sheer unprofessionalism. Well before the DC-10s and F-28s, Biman should get rid of these elements.

As for the import duries, Biman will not have to pay this Tk.8.7 crore. Soon enough, the import duties on aircraft & spares would be gone completely...to the benefit of all airlines of Bangladesh. :)

Best Air in talks to buy six new planes
Sohel Parvez

Best Air has opened talks with aircraft makers to purchase six new planes in a multi- million-dollar deal as part of its plan to launch several international routes.

The move comes hot on the heels on the announcement by Biman and GMG Airlines that they are also making major aircraft acquisitions and is further evidence of the increasing competition in the nation's aviation industry.

“We have plans to expand our routes to the Middle East, Far East and Europe in the coming days. It's also a part of our efforts to offer premium services to our passengers,” M Haider Uzzaman, chairman of Best Aviation, said after a meeting with a visiting team of European plane maker Airbus in Dhaka yesterday.

On Sunday, GMG Airlines said it would buy six new generation aircraft from Boeing at $900 million (Tk 6,200 crore), while on Sunday Biman singed the $1.265 billion (equivalent to Tk 8,728 crore) deal with the same supplier to get eight new aircraft.

Haider however said it was not the aircraft purchasing competition rather a complementary step considering the current volume of passengers in Bangladesh's aviation market.

“It's quite a big market. We see about 2 lakh passengers on an average a month. If we all are better equipped, we, the local carriers, would be able to recover our market lost to foreign operators,” he said.

“We want to start our international flights to Bangkok in early April,” Haider said.

The Best Air chairman said the Airbus gave a presentation of its products. “They will make their financial offers to us for a fleet of four A-320 and two A-330 aircraft shortly,” he said.

“We have presented the salient features our products here. We are more than happy talking to Best Air,” said Paul Moultrie, area sales director of Airbus Middle East following the meeting with Best Air.

Haider however said Best Air also wants to sit with the Boeing before taking any final decision.

Majority controlled by Kuwait-based Aqeeq Aviation Holding, the Best Air started its operation on country's busiest Dhaka-Chittagong route on January 14 this year with a single Boeing 737-200.

The carrier launched operation at a time when Bangladesh aviation industry is growing at about 7.6 percent a year with foreign carriers control about 90 percent of the total volume of annual air traffic due mainly to weakness of Biman.

The Best Air according to its chairman has yet to reach a break-even point, although it recorded a load factor, or seat occupancy, of about 60 percent in February from about 34 percent in January.

“We hope to reach a break even point by April,” the Best Air chairman hoped.

--Dailystar (http://thedailystar.net/story.php?nid=28412)


When can we expect United & RBA's announcement for intent to purchase new frames? These newcomers are all in a frenzy!!:cheers:

60 percent load factor on 2X daily DAC-CTG..not bad..considering their capacity is also bigger than the rest.

When can we expect United & RBA's announcement for intent to purchase new frames? These newcomers are all in a frenzy!!:cheers:

60 percent load factor on 2X daily DAC-CTG..not bad..considering their capacity is also bigger than the rest.

Awesome news about Best Air. I guess they do have the money for it since they are backed by a Middle Eastern firm. On the side note they should go with Boeing since everyone else is going with Boeing, I am guessing more Boeing spare part will be available compared to Airbus'. :cheers:

Imran a few days ago to posted that ZIA will be renovated, along with equipments. Were you talking about this.....

September 2, 2007 Newage (http://www.newagebd.com/2007/sep/02/front.html#4)

Government plans $52 million ZIA modernisation project
Zahedul Islam

The government has planned to install a new radar system and other communication and navigational equipment at the Zia International Airport to ensure safe and secure operation of aircraft.

The government, under the $52 million ‘Upgrading of Zia International Airport’ project, has also planned to strengthen the taxiway of the country’s largest airport to accommodate the wide-bodied passenger planes which are heavier than other airliners.

‘We need to replace the radar urgently as the present one is obsolete in the modern air traffic control system,’ said an official of the Civil Aviation Authority of Bangladesh, the executing agency of the project.

The present radar at the Zia airport was installed in 1984 on a turnkey basis by a French company. The radar has undergone major repair two times in the past, and its present condition is not good because one part of the radar is fully out of order.

The government of Denmark will provide ‘mixed credit loan’ for implementation of the project which will help the CAAB to comply with the requirements of the International Civil Aviation Organisation, an agency of the United Nations, which codifies the principles and techniques of international air navigation.

Civil aviation ministry officials said the project proposal has been sent to the Economic Relations Division for completing the necessary formalities before signing an agreement with the Danish government in this regard.

In view of the importance of the project, civil aviation adviser MA Matin, in a recent letter to finance adviser Mirza Azizul Islam, requested him to take personal initiative for implementation of the project. In the letter, Matin said that ZIA would be radar-less if a new radar was not installed within a year to replace the obsolete one.

‘ZIA will run without radar unless a new one is installed by next year,’ said Matin in the letter, adding that it would also tarnish the image of the airport.

The existing taxiway of the airport, which was constructed in 1979, is hazardous for the operation of wide-bodied aircraft like DC-10 and B-747 as the Pavement Classification Number of the taxiway is only 40.

The PCN (a standard to indicate the strength of the taxiway) should be at least 70 for operation of wide-bodied aircraft. ‘It is crucial for the country that the airport is functioning well.

‘The deterioration of the taxiway and selected parts of the communication equipment is not an acceptable situation as per the ICAO,’ said a senior CAAB official.

Biman to add new aircraft on lease for Middle East
United News of Bangladesh

Biman Bangladesh Airlines Limited, now spreading wings in a turnaround, is likely to add another Boeing to its fleet in May to increase its flight operations to the Middle East.

The latest procurement is part of its ongoing renovation process to make the national flag carrier a world-class airliner. The next Boeing 747 will be incorporated under Aircraft, Crew, Maintenance and Insurance lease process for one year.

This latest aircraft will be used to operate flights to Gulf and Middle Eastern countries. ‘We are looking to refurnish and strengthen our activities in Gulf and Middle Eastern countries. The process of leasing the next Boeing 747 is a bid towards that destination,’ Biman managing director MA Momen said.

A tender was floated in this connection on March 10, where it was stated that the Boeing 747 has to be 200 or 300 or 400 series and the manufacturing year of the aircraft must not be earlier than 1980.

The tender mentioned that the lease would be applicable for a year commencing from May 2008 and it is extendable subject to mutual agreement. Biman wanted to have the guarantee that the leased aircraft has at least 3,000 block hours (every flying hour from take-off to landing) for the period of one year.

Aircraft manufacturers, airlines, owners, operators and leasing companies having aircraft of their own can participate in tender. Biman restricted any agent or broker from participating in the tender as it said that the organization would not deal with any agent or broker during the process of evaluation and finalization of contract.

The last date for submission of tender was fixed April 2. Recently, Biman has leased a 542-seat Boeing 747-200 from a Nigeria-based airline, Kabo Air, in a bid to minimize the disruptions in flight schedules.

The national flag carrier has been facing serious troubles in maintaining flight schedules due to acute shortage of aircraft for quite some time now. It was also taken under the ACMI lease process for six months. But its lease might be extended after that, following a negotiation between the two sides.

Under the lease conditions, Biman will have to pay $5,300 to Kabo Air Ltd for per block hour. Biman currently owns three types of aircraft — four DC10s-30s, four F28s, and three A310-300s.

Of those, only four or five can fly everyday, while the rest are grounded due to technical glitches. Biman is going to purchase eight Boeing aircraft at a cost of $ 1.265 billion and signed a MoU with Boeing representatives here on March 15.


Newage (http://www.newagebd.com/busi.html)

Guess everyones gonna shop this year!

http://amadershomoy.com/online/news.php?id=27020&sys=3

http://amadershomoy.com/online/news.php?id=27020&sys=3

Cart before the horse?

Imran a few days ago to posted that ZIA will be renovated, along with equipments. Were you talking about this.....

September 2, 2007 http://www.newagebd.com/2007/sep/02/front.html#4

This is old news and had gone nowhere. What I am talking about, however, includes ATC modernization, pavement & runway strengthening, extensive security upgrades, and significant improvement of overall service efficiency at the airport. I don't know how far they'll be able to go, but I trust the best possible efforts will be put in.

Cart before the horse?

Welllllllllll before the horse! ;)

Soon enough, the import duties on aircraft & spares would be gone completely...to the benefit of all airlines of Bangladesh. :)

Really, that would be great. We need to give our airlines breathing room to grow. Govt. can charge taxes when they are stable, just like the cell phone industry.

Anyway, how do you know this? From your inside sources?:nuts:

Very impressive from GMG...they seem to be matching Biman's purchases. On a side note...does anyone know what the letters "GMG" stand for?


GMG stands for the initials of the 3 people that founded GMG GROUP back way long time ago. Before GMG was an airline.

True. The first company was samah razor blade industry in Tejgaon I believe.

Anyway, how do you know this? From your inside sources?:nuts:

You know I have a pretty dependable crystal ball, dontcha? ;)

True. The first company was samah razor blade industry in Tejgaon I believe.

If I'm not mistaken, GMG's first establishment in Bangladesh was called GMG Industrial Corporation. Of course, prior to that they had establishments in Pakistan, before Late Mr. Aziz Sattar decided to move to Bangladesh. I don't think this 'Tejgaon' area even existed at that time and Samah was probably founded way later! I might be wrong here, and would gladly concede to any correction by Akbar Sattar! :)

iasif do u have the ears of Mahbub Jamil? If u do, tell him to fcuk Airbus when they try to sell A320 again.

With the Air Services Agreement between India and Bangladesh now allowing 61 flights from either side to any metro, Bangladesh-based private international carrier, GMG Airlines now plans to add new routes and increase frequency on the already existing routes in India.

Speaking to Express AviationWorld, Shahab Sattar, managing director, GMG Airlines said, "We would be connecting the cities of Mumbai and Chennai between mid and end-2008 and will also be increasing our frequencies to Kolkata and Delhi soon." Frequencies to Kolkata will increase from the current 18 flights to 21 flights a week and the Indian capital will receive a daily from the current three flights a week from April 2008.

Flights from Dhaka will connect Mumbai thrice and Chennai twice a week and the airline will seek to appoint a GSA in Delhi soon, revealed Sattar. India has been an important market for the airline, and its first international flight from Chittagong connected Kolkata in September 2004. It registers a load factor of 65-70 per cent in this market. "We have agreements with Indian Airlines, Air India, Jet Airways and Kingfisher Airlines in the country and feed traffic from Delhi and Kolkata to various domestic and international routes from India and a marginal rise in our fleet will be an opportunity for us," said Sattar. The airline currently operates MD80 aircraft in the Indian skies and is hoping to introduce B737 aircraft once inducted.

http://www.expresstravelworld.com/200803/aviationworld06.shtml

Published on 20 feb -- BERNAMA.


Best Air's right to fly to Kuala Lumpur will be a bilateral arrangement as, in return, Malaysia's long haul low cost carrier AirAsia X will fly to Dhaka soon.


http://www.bernama.com.my/bernama/v3/news_lite.php?id=314992

Shahab Sattar, managing director, GMG Airlines mentioned, "The domestic passenger traffic (in Bangladesh) is growing at 10-12 per cent, however slow deregulation is eroding the market share by allowing foreign airlines to fly more freely than private operators."


http://www.expresstravelworld.com/200803/aviationworld19.shtml

Shahab Sattar, managing director, GMG Airlines mentioned, "The domestic passenger traffic (in Bangladesh) is growing at 10-12 per cent, however slow deregulation is eroding the market share by allowing foreign airlines to fly more freely than private operators."


http://www.expresstravelworld.com/200803/aviationworld19.shtml

iasif do u have the ears of Mahbub Jamil? If u do, tell him to fcuk Airbus when they try to sell A320 again.

Man, why are you so harsh on Airbus? They make great planes also.....:cheers::cheers:

iasif do u have the ears of Mahbub Jamil? If u do, tell him to fcuk Airbus when they try to sell A320 again.

If the choice is made based on figures and practical advantages, and not for political pressures, the order is most likely to go to Boeing for the 737NG unless Airbus offers the A320s at throwaway prices (which I don't see them doing).

unless Airbus offers the A320s at throwaway prices

I believe they do have just a little cost advantage locally -- as A320's are now being assembled in China.

And don't forget the ARJ-21(Chinese homegrown MD-82) , change the windshield, give it a new wing/engines, et voila! new airlinerhttp://img166.imageshack.us/img166/6522/01arj21hj1.jpg

These days nobody is giving away new airplanes at a discount -- the obvious reason would be that air travel in Asia is expanding at a breakneck pace (led by China and India).

I believe they do have just a little cost advantage locally -- as A320's are now being assembled in China.

And don't forget the ARJ-21(Chinese homegrown MD-82) , change the windshield, give it a new wing/engines, et voila! new airliner

Chinese built A320/ARJ-21: Made by the Chinese, for the Chinese! :)

They had tried doing this earlier, to build MD-80s in China under license from McDonnell Douglas and had built some, all of which were for the Chinese carriers. The whole thing became a joke at one point and they soon gave it up!

Back to the topic, from what I know, in the last offer that Airbus had made to Biman, the price offered for the A320 was 'not good enough' compared to Boeing's for their 737NG. If Airbus in their new offer can beat Boeing's price significantly, they might stand a chance.

And like I said earlier, if making the EU happy is in agenda, it should be for the ATC infrastructure which can come from Thales...though Raytheon would give a tough competition on that end as well.

:nuts: i am lost... what does ordering a plane has to do with EU or American Government.

what does ordering a plane has to do with EU or American Government

Boeing = US Govt. pressure,
Airbus = EU pressure.

Imran Bhai -- I understand we have Thales ATC right now which isn't working.

In any case -- I lean toward Boeing. I've flown enough in both Airbus and Boeing (narrow and wide) and I like the boeing birds for how tough they are and the amount of abuse they endure in US and EU trunk-liner service daily. In one trip I changed planes from a 737-100 to a 737-800ng. The difference in quietness, rigidity, ride quality was like night and day (although the 800 was about twice as big) :)

:nuts: i am lost... what does ordering a plane has to do with EU or American Government.

In certain cases, everything! Ask El Al, Iraqi Airways...!

In case of Bangladesh, if it necessarily required to please Europe, Biman should've gone all-Airbus with their order and it would've made more sense than now non-sensically considering splitting the order between Boeing and Airbus.

Boeing = US Govt. pressure,
Airbus = EU pressure.

Imran Bhai -- I understand we have Thales ATC right now which isn't working.

In any case -- I lean toward Boeing. I've flown enough in both Airbus and Boeing (narrow and wide) -- and in one trip I changed planes from a 737-100 to a 737-800ng. The difference in quietness, rigidity, ride quality was like night and day :)

What ZIA has right now was from Thomson, which became Thales much later. The system was probably very modern at the time when it was installed over 2 decades back but by today's standards its a belonging to the museum. ATC at ZIA desperately needs a new PSR, an MSSR, and a whole new system console to evade the impending danger of serious incidents.

As for the 737-100 and the 737-800NG, firstly, consider yourself very lucky for having flown on a -100 737....very few of those were built before being replaced by the -200! As for the noise, the 737-100/-200 were Stage III compliant after having the hushkits installed, whereas the 737NG already complies to the proposed Stage IV. Ride quality mostly depend on wind and weather conditions. On a good day, you could have a perfectly smooth ride on a vintage 737-200...and on a not-so-good-day you could be sitting tight in a spanking-new 777-200LR with the feeling that the plane is about to get torn apart! That's the fun of flying if you ask me! :)

In certain cases, everything! Ask El Al, Iraqi Airways...!


So I guess its better not to have a National Flag carrier, then there is no pressure. :) Right?

So I guess its better not to have a National Flag carrier, then there is no pressure. :) Right?

Well, its not just about 'national flag carrier' but rather about the country and the airline in question. Singapore Airlines, for example, is a pride for all the Singaporeans and they literally toy around the manufacturers to get the best possible deal out of them...and they give a damn about keeping the manufacturers or their countries 'happy'! SQ took the A340-300 from Airbus, named them 'Celestar' and pumped in a huge campaign for them and then they traded them off with Boeing when they took in the 777s. That's what I mean by 'toying around'...brutal professionalism! :)

And then you have Thai International Airways who seems to have at least one of every type of aircraft there is...Emirates will seemingly buy every new widebody there will be...and I could go on! :)

Has AI resumed its service to DAC?

So is it being because Biman is a Flag carrier? or just political view on developing nations?


So with all the new aircrafts joining the private and national carrier and also new airlines serving ZIA......do you think there will be enough room to park them in ZIA? i mean say for example in peak hours (early morning)....

I believe they do have just a little cost advantage locally -- as A320's are now being assembled in China.

And don't forget the ARJ-21(Chinese homegrown MD-82) , change the windshield, give it a new wing/engines, et voila! new airlinerhttp://img166.imageshack.us/img166/6522/01arj21hj1.jpg

These days nobody is giving away new airplanes at a discount -- the obvious reason would be that air travel in Asia is expanding at a breakneck pace (led by China and India).

nice looking... they need to build something bigger than that.....

nice looking... they need to build something bigger than that.....

Actually it won't be any bigger. Supposed to be a regional jet.

nice looking... they need to build something bigger than that.....

They will. The regional airliner is needed in much bigger numbers initially (for domestic alone). These will do fine for domestic like Imran bhai says.

They've planned a 350 seat long-range airliner by 2020.:)

They will. The regional airliner is needed in much bigger numbers initially (for domestic alone). These will do fine for domestic like Imran bhai says.

They've planned a 350 seat long-range airliner by 2020.:)

They'll go the same direction the Russian civilian (commercial) aircraft industries went, just watch!

They'll go the same direction the Russian civilian (commercial) aircraft industries went, just watch!

I disagree with you on this issue. Assuming you meant "go the same direction the Russian civilian (commercial) aircraft industries went" as bad. The Russians did horrible because no one wanted to buy their plane due to various issues. On the other hand the Chinese has 1 Billion+ people, the Chinese State-Owned Aircraft manufacturers will always find a market for their planes (1 Billion @ home plus Billions in emerging countries). Also the Chinese govt is overflowing with cash, so capital is not even a issue to them.

I disagree with you on this issue. Assuming you meant "go the same direction the Russian civilian (commercial) aircraft industries went" as bad. The Russians did horrible because no one wanted to buy their plane due to various issues. On the other hand the Chinese has 1 Billion+ people, the Chinese State-Owned Aircraft manufacturers will always find a market for their planes (1 Billion @ home plus Billions in emerging countries). Also the Chinese govt is overflowing with cash, so capital is not even a issue to them.

Allow me to clarify what I meant. Of course with a population of over a billion, they'll be able to sell some planes but I do not see any foreign buyers.

Allow me to clarify what I meant. Of course with a population of over a billion, they'll be able to sell some planes but I do not see any foreign buyers.

I am sure Taiwan, Fellow communist countries of Vietnam, Cambodia, And Laos would. Not the mention all the friends China made in Africa, South America and the Middle East (Iran).

^^Durability and toughness wise no one can claim with scientific evidence that planes made by Boeing is better than those made by Airbus. Both the manufacturer makes superb planes and that's a good thing. When it comes down to choosing which planes to buy, it all depends on the customers specifications such as number of seats, fuel efficiency, cargo capacity etc. And the customer goes for the best offer. Of coarse there are other factors as well.

So, planes made by which company is better is irrelevant and quite frankly HIGHLY subjective. I personally flew most of the variant of planes made by these two manufacturer and cannot say one is better than the other.

They will. The regional airliner is needed in much bigger numbers initially (for domestic alone). These will do fine for domestic like Imran bhai says.

They've planned a 350 seat long-range airliner by 2020.:)

They are already very much building a 350-seat airliner, just not by their own name yet - the 787 Dreamliner! ;)

I remember back in 2005, Airbus' John Leahy (I personally think he's the biggest joke in the history of commercial aviation) commenting on the 787 as saying "a Chinese copy of the A330" which made the Chinese furious for having undermined Chinese quality...and I tell you these people have tremendous pride (for good reasons) on what they do, and they'll let no one make a passing comment like that and get away with it! :)

They'll go the same direction the Russian civilian (commercial) aircraft industries went, just watch!

Nah, dude...its very, very different in the case of China, and if you ask me, I think they'll become a very, very formidable force to threaten both Boeing and Airbus in about 20 years from now.

The Soviet Union actually had very good engineering know-how to build airplanes, but they ran dry on cash and then splitting of the USSR nailed the commercial aviation industry. Though, I think they (especially Tupolev, Sukhoi and Ilyushin) are doing well to recover recently.

But China is in a league of its own. They can manufacture at impeccable quality and at unmatched costs...and is the reason why both Boeing and Airbus will be building a lot of their planes in mainland China and surrounding areas knowing fully well that these people will soon end up copying their designs (Patents? What's that?? :)). The advantage to Boeing and Airbus is their R&D infrastructure using which they'll try to 'leapfrog' in technology to stay ahead of China when they start building at large scale, which won't stop the Chinese from buying Chinese, and would be a big chunk for Boeing and Airbus to lose! :)

I was lazying around in the afternoon and found some of the older pics I had taken at ZIA in 2005/2006...and thought would share some of the eye-candies with you folks!

Pic # 1: A couple of BAF's newer Chengdu F-7s belonging to the 'Thundercats' squadron, backtracking on the runway for a training sortie.
http://i227.photobucket.com/albums/dd236/TheCoolOnes/BAF-F7-01.jpg

Pic# 2: And here's a solo screamer turning onto Rwy14.
http://i227.photobucket.com/albums/dd236/TheCoolOnes/BAF-F7-02.jpg

Pic # 3: A couple of the older F-7s will now fire it up.
http://i227.photobucket.com/albums/dd236/TheCoolOnes/BAF-F7-03.jpg

Pic # 4: And here's a 2-seater trainer version of the F-7.
http://i227.photobucket.com/albums/dd236/TheCoolOnes/BAF-F7-04.jpg

Pic # 5: This is the Mil Mi-17 belonging to the BAF for exclusive use of the Prime Minister, seen on a test run here.
http://i227.photobucket.com/albums/dd236/TheCoolOnes/BAF-Mil17-01.jpg

Pic # 6: Another round of fly-past.
http://i227.photobucket.com/albums/dd236/TheCoolOnes/BAF-Mil17-02.jpg

Pic # 7: Biman's vintage workhorse, the F-28 (Reg # S2-ACV) turning onto Rwy14 for takeoff.
http://i227.photobucket.com/albums/dd236/TheCoolOnes/DSC01723.jpg

Pic # 8: China Eastern's B737-300 backtracking for departure.
http://i227.photobucket.com/albums/dd236/TheCoolOnes/pic01-1.jpg

Pic # 9: Final turn on Rwy14 for her flight to Beijing via Kunming,
http://i227.photobucket.com/albums/dd236/TheCoolOnes/pic02-1.jpg

Pic # 10: Another F-28 on finals to Rwy14.
http://i227.photobucket.com/albums/dd236/TheCoolOnes/pic03-1.jpg

Pic # 11: A true classic here...SV's B747-100 turning onto Rwy14 for her flight back to Jeddah.
http://i227.photobucket.com/albums/dd236/TheCoolOnes/pic04-1.jpg

Pic # 12: The turn is almost complete...in a few moments she was on a long takeoff roll.
http://i227.photobucket.com/albums/dd236/TheCoolOnes/pic05-1.jpg

I recall the Saudia planes used to be painted green...when did they switch to blue?

ya, untill they had a corporate makeover.

wtf is dis?:bash: photo taken at KUL. bangladesh airlines? is in it biman bangladesh?

http://cdn-www.airliners.net/photos/photos/6/3/2/1338236.jpg

wtf is dis?:bash: photo taken at KUL. bangladesh airlines? is in it biman bangladesh?

The f*** is the B747-200 which Biman leased from Kabo Air of Nigeria.

This is how she looked like when she was delivered on 12th March, 2008:
http://i227.photobucket.com/albums/dd236/TheCoolOnes/Pic05.jpg

She is an ex-Northwest bird, hence the colour on the fuselage. Kabo painted the tail blue and placed their logo (as seen on the pic above). Biman has simply super-imposed their logo on top of the Kabo logo, and some vinyl stickers for the titles and the flag....and there you have the ugly old lady! :)

Its a frightening/sickening sight alright for anyone with any aesthetic sense!

On another note, I'm surprised to see they're using it on the DAC-KUL route too...thought it'd stay busy doing its legs back ond forth between Bangladesh and the Middle-East!

wtf is dis?:bash: photo taken at KUL. bangladesh airlines? is in it biman bangladesh?


:eek2:
Bizarre! Takes cake for piant job on the cheap.

absoultly cheap shot frm biman

garbaze

Bizarre! Takes cake for piant job on the cheap.

What could've been as cheap, if not cheaper, and yet not so "cheap", is if they had the rickshaw painters do a special livery on this plane! :rofl:

A few days back, when we were talking about painting Biman's interiors like the local buses, someone at Biman was definitely listening to us...and probably told himself "heck, if we can't do it on the inside, we'll do it on the outside so the whole world can see it!"

And who was that friend of ours talking about a "creative arts" department at Biman??? ;)

What could've been as cheap, if not cheaper, and yet not so "cheap", is if they had the rickshaw painters do a special livery on this plane! :rofl:

A few days back, when we were talking about painting Biman's interiors like the local buses, someone at Biman was definitely listening to us...and probably told himself "heck, if we can't do it on the inside, we'll do it on the outside so the whole world can see it!"

And who was that friend of ours talking about a "creative arts" department at Biman??? ;)

But come to think of it, Imran. It is creative!

this is unacceptable, pathetic beyond words.

bimanz food looks quite yuumy

http://www.airlinemeals.net/images/meals/biman019.jpg

http://www.airlinemeals.net/images/meals/biman018.jpg

http://www.airlinemeals.net/images/meals/biman017.jpg

http://www.airlinemeals.net/images/meals/biman009.jpg

http://www.airlinemeals.net/images/meals/biman006.jpg

http://www.airlinemeals.net/images/meals/biman005.jpg

btw these are Maslin Executive Class meal. all they need is to replace those old fashoned melamayne plates with nice set of dinner set.:bash:

:puke: thats an ugly beast

A prime example of incompetence by Biman. Why spend money on a paintjob, when its only going to be on service for 6 months? It isn't also a decent model,ie 777, A346; that they can show off !


Looks like Biman loves to tweak liveries on wet-leased bodies.

Before:
http://img182.imageshack.us/img182/8994/0538150uu8.jpg


After:
http://img516.imageshack.us/img516/6862/0189806dl4.jpg

Source: airliners.net

This ugly beast looks more like a miletary aircraft

atleast the color combi of canadian airlines goes well wid it but wtf is dat grey-red-blue-green lukz like? shit

atleast the color combi of canadian airlines goes well wid it but wtf is dat grey-red-blue-green lukz like? shit

No overt profanity, please! :)

A prime example of incompetence by Biman. Why spend money on a paintjob, when its only going to be on service for 6 months? It isn't also a decent model,ie 777, A346; that they can show off !

Looks like Biman loves to tweak liveries on wet-leased bodies.

That Canadian-Pacific hybrid livery, in my opinion, was the best Biman ever had! Shame it wasn't an original!

I'm feeling like digging myself a grave...

The photo of the leased 747 made it to the top of the most viewed photos list at airliners.net....and a discussion thread is also racing up to the top...its the 2nd most discussed topic right now:
http://www.airliners.net/discussions/general_aviation/read.main/3898376/

What a shame!

I'm feeling like digging myself a grave...

The photo of the leased 747 made it to the top of the most viewed photos list at airliners.net....and a discussion thread is also racing up to the top...its the 2nd most discussed topic right now:
http://www.airliners.net/discussions/general_aviation/read.main/3898376/

What a shame!

I guess we all have to go over there and try to alleviate the situation. ;)

:nuts: i cant look.... so does anyone has picture of interior? by the way... at the end of the day, credit goes to the painter

Thanks for the pics iasif.Really great to see some shots of BAF planes.Hoping to see more such pics from you in the future.

But come to think of it, Imran. It is creative!

You guys might hate it,but I actually find it quite unique.:)

^^
So do I, it's quite unique.

You guys might hate it,but I actually find it quite unique.:)

Oh it's unique alright. Just tacky.

Oh it's unique alright. Just tacky.

I don't know about that TIslam, I mean, at least this has created some much needed interest for Biman. (sometime, bad publicity, can be good publicity):cheers:

Can anyone tell me whether it is possible to walk from the international terminal to the domestic terminal at ZIA?

Can anyone tell me whether it is possible to walk from the international terminal to the domestic terminal at ZIA?

Unless they have built some kind of connector (tunnel or bridge) recently, you cannot walk from/to the domestic to international terminals.

hi,

i've been reading the posts here for the last couple of months and it is fascinating to read the great posts.

i have one view about 'iasif' (imran asif). i believe that he is not predicting anything as he says, but he is rather writing the future! the kind of information he has and the level of access he has at the airports makes my belief even stronger.

however, my best regards to him for keeping everyone informed and enlightened!

however, my best regards to him for keeping everyone informed and enlightened!

I will 2nd that. :)

//

DHAKA: Bangladesh's privately-owned GMG Airlines expects to complete a deal with plane maker Boeing to buy six new aircraft worth more than $900 million in the next few months, GMG's chairman said on Monday.

Boeing had offered to supply three 777-300ER and three 787-9 Dreamliners to GMG, from 2012 to 2017. "We have decided to accept the offer and hope a final agreement will be signed by the end of June or early July," Abdus Sattar, chairman of GMG Airlines, told Reuters.

Boeing also recently won a $1.265 billion deal to supply eight aircraft to the national carrier Biman Bangladesh Airlines Ltd, GMG Airlines started its international operations in 2004 and currently flies from Dhaka to Kolkata, Delhi, Kathmandu, Bangkok, Kuala Lumpur and Dubai with a fleet of seven aircraft.

It started domestic operations in 1998 and is one of five Bangladeshi carriers competing for an increasing number of domestic and regional travellers. Bangladesh and India have recently agreed to increase flight frequencies between the two countries.

Unless they have built some kind of connector (tunnel or bridge) recently, you cannot walk from/to the domestic to international terminals.

so how does one go from the international arrivals to the domestic, for their connecting flight? without having to go outside of the airport?

hi,

i've been reading the posts here for the last couple of months and it is fascinating to read the great posts.

i have one view about 'iasif' (imran asif). i believe that he is not predicting anything as he says, but he is rather writing the future! the kind of information he has and the level of access he has at the airports makes my belief even stronger.

however, my best regards to him for keeping everyone informed and enlightened!

I might not live till sunrise tomorrow...who do you think is writing my future? ;)

Chill mate, I'm only writing the posts here...the future is only in His hands to write! :)

I will 2nd that. :)

My pleasure! :)

The government Monday allowed two more private airlines to fly to lucrative international routes in a major boost to the country's fledgling aviation industry, officials said.

Best and United airlines, two private carriers which started operation last year, have been allocated slots in the Gulf countries and on the regional routes, civil aviation chief Shakeb Iqbal Khan Majlish said.

"It's major decision. It will be a huge boost for the country's private airlines. We want them to compete with foreign airlines so that they can grab some of the market shares that national carrier Biman has lost," Majlish told the Financial Express.

The latest decision allows Best Aviation to operate seven weekly international flights on the most lucrative Dhaka-Dubai route, thrice a week on Chittagong-Bahrain and two flights on Chittagong-Kuwait.

The airlines, majority owned by Kuwait-based Aqiq Aviation, has also obtained permission to operate two regional routes: Kunming in South Chinese state of Yunnan and Kolkata.

The country's biggest private carrier GMG, which in February became the first private airlines to fly to Dubai, has got slots to operate three weekly flights on Dhaka-Doha.

Officials said United Airways, Bangladesh's third private airline, has also been allowed to operate on the Gulf aviation hub of Dubai seven flights a week.

The carrier, 95 per cent owned by expatriates Bangladeshis, has also got slots to fly to regional routes of Kuala Lumpur, Kolkata and Kathmandu.

Majlish said the allocations of more slots for the private airlines were due to a change in the government policy, as it seeks to inject competition in the aviation industry.

"The government is now very liberal. We're encouraging the private sector to have its share of the growing market. But they must be ready to face fierce competition and should improve service quality," he said.

Bangladesh's air traffic grew 7.3 per cent last year, making it one of the fastest-growing aviation markets in the region.

But decades of poor performance by state-owned carrier Biman has enabled foreign carriers to snatch some 83 per cent of the market worth about 1.5 billion dollars.

The civil aviation chief said Biman has already told the authorities that it is not going to increase its international flights, owing to shortage of long-haul and mid-haul aircraft.

Although Biman last week signed a deal to buy eight new Boeing planes at a cost of US$ 1.26 billion, it would not get the supply from the US aircraft manufacturer before 2012.

Best Aviation chief M Haideruzzaman hailed the government decision, saying it would help them grow fast.

"The government decision proves that it wants a level playing field in the aviation industry. We will soon procure long haul aircraft to fly to Dubai and other long haul and regional destinations," he said.

He said Gulf is the most important market for Bangladeshi airlines as one in two people who fly abroad goes to the six Gulf countries, which employ more than 70 per cent of the country's over five million migrant workers.

World's sixth largest airline Emirates at present carries the bulk of the traffic between Dhaka and Dubai, followed by ailing Bangladesh national carrier Biman.

Emirates operates 14 jumbo flights a week and will soon add two more. There are also several other top gulf carriers operating in the route.


http://www.thefinancialexpress-bd.com/search_index.php?page=detail_news&news_id=28911

The latest decision allows Best Aviation to operate seven weekly international flights on the most lucrative Dhaka-Dubai route, thrice a week on Chittagong-Bahrain and two flights on Chittagong-Kuwait.

http://www.thefinancialexpress-bd.com/search_index.php?page=detail_news&news_id=28911

What will happen now to Best Air which has been advertizing for Dhaka-Bangkok flight for last few months?

What will happen now to Best Air which has been advertizing for Dhaka-Bangkok flight for last few months?

Maybe they got a slot for Dhaka-Bangkok flight too in addition to those mentioned in the newspaper.

so how does one go from the international arrivals to the domestic, for their connecting flight? without having to go outside of the airport?

Time to ask our resident expert, Mr. Imran. :)

Maybe they got a slot for Dhaka-Bangkok flight too in addition to those mentioned in the newspaper.

I think your hunch is right.

Very good to see govt. helping the local airlines grow. But these airlines don't have the resources to fly these routes. I think it would have been better had the govt. required them to acquire necessary resources prior to giving the approval. Anyway, lets see if they can reap the benefits out of this opportunity!

Very good to see govt. helping the local airlines grow. But these airlines don't have the resources to fly these routes. I think it would have been better had the govt. required them to acquire necessary resources prior to giving the approval. Anyway, lets see if they can reap the benefits out of this opportunity!


I disagree, I think the airlines need to know where they stand with the CAAB first before they go all in with wide bodied aircrafts.

Now that these internation slots have been awarded to them, they can work towards a goal to acheiveing them, ofcourse, the quicker they can do it the better it will be for them financialy, I am sure their management teams are fully aware of this.

The news from the United tent is that, they have already started working on a new website, which will enable online booking ect.

They are in talks with a singapore company to lease to purchase an Airbus A320 for the Dubai route.:banana:

Time to ask our resident expert, Mr. Imran. :)

Well, there is a corridor which connects the two terminals but I'm not sure if they use that regularly. As for international pax connecting on to domestic flights, I've seen some being transported from the transit area at the international terminal to the domestic terminal using buses at the ramp. Again, I'm not sure if this is a regular practice!

I disagree, I think the airlines need to know where they stand with the CAAB first before they go all in with wide bodied aircrafts.

Now that these internation slots have been awarded to them, they can work towards a goal to acheiveing them, ofcourse, the quicker they can do it the better it will be for them financialy, I am sure their management teams are fully aware of this.

The news from the United tent is that, they have already started working on a new website, which will enable online booking ect.

They are in talks with a singapore company to lease to purchase an Airbus A320 for the Dubai route.:banana:

The problem with this approach is that they will use rent-a-plane, rent-a-cabin crew, rent-a-pilot, rent-a-ground crew etc, which will produce unreliable and low quality service, which will make the airlines short lived. There won't be much benefit for the country as well because they will spend bulk of their revenues on the rents.

There is a certain threshold for obtaining such license in India. As a result Kingfisher Air, despite having ordered the newest and latest aircrafts, still hasn't received the go-ahead to fly overseas (as far as I know). And I tend to like the rationale behind the Indian govt' policy.

The government Monday allowed two more private airlines to fly to lucrative international routes in a major boost to the country's fledgling aviation industry, officials said.

Best and United airlines, two private carriers which started operation last year, have been allocated slots in the Gulf countries and on the regional routes, civil aviation chief Shakeb Iqbal Khan Majlish said.

http://www.thefinancialexpress-bd.com/search_index.php?page=detail_news&news_id=28911

Not wanting to sound like a spoilsport, but to me it all sounds too ominous!

As I speak, a number of our local private airlines are being subjected to an operational audit by ICAO's COSCAP-SA, and I had been informed that the initial findings prior to the practical audits didn't look good, and that passengers' safety may quite extensively be at stake already.

By allowing these carriers to fly international without having demonstrated acceptable operational safety, CAAB is yet once again acting absolutely irresponsibly, attributed by its sheer incompetence as I had stated earlier.

In commercial aviation, passenger safety is of paramount importance and nothing should supercede it in priority. I hope CAAB, while allowing slots to these airlines to fly within and beyond the borders, would make it mandatory that they get cleared under the COSCAP-SA audit as far as operational safety is concerned before they can launch new services. The ones who will fail to live up to the required standards should be entirely grounded altogether by CAAB until such time they are capable of demonstrating better practices.

Make no mistake, I have nothing against the private airlines, and this issue of operational safety is also quite prevalent at Biman itself (especially their DC-10 CRM is at an alarming state right now). What I am insisting on is that no one should be allowed to fool around with passengers' lives, and its wiser to take logical preventive measures now than to bite your tongue and take corrective measures later...after very, very precious lives are lost.