one of the greatest

but where is the tallest tower ?

will it appear soon ?

--Thanks Riyadhi for your reply, have you got any more pictures for the shammiya projects and any schedules?
-- also can anyone post a selection of the 4 main projects in makkah (listed) and any others planned in a different forum which will make it easier for people like me to understand what the plans are for the future of Makkah.

-- Jabal Omar project
-- Shammiya project
-- khandama project
-- Al beit Towers

20 October 2006

http://images5.pictiger.com/thumbs/59/fe27ce723efa1bce66fe2bfbb6d2de59.th.jpg (http://server5.pictiger.com/img/740513/picture-hosting/-users-zohir-desktop-dsc-07529.php) http://images5.pictiger.com/thumbs/f2/62a6b818fc0bc4298c8db185f2f5aff2.th.jpg (http://server5.pictiger.com/img/740514/picture-hosting/-users-zohir-desktop-dsc-07553.php)

when i was there in 28 ramdan i walk under abraj al bait it was too huge and the main tower in ~7 or 8 floor i cant see clearly becouse the light was high.

ohh i forgot to tel you the left tower already pepole live in.

^^ what is that building doing right infront of the AL Beit towers - is it a hotel? if so whats it called? and will it stay there?

that was a gift from King Fahad to bussnes man i cant remember his name but he's famous person.

Oh good. So now we know for sure that the main tower is coming up..

WOW MAJESTIC!!

That would of been awsome.
yeah it would :) , to bad:lol:

is there an appointment for ending ?

http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n118/Saudi-Guy/Abraj%20Al%20Bait/MARKED.jpg

i think this is better and more explained view

http://thespoke.net/photos/hashamhas/images/973624/original.aspx

Wow looking at the rendering, this enormous project is perfectly symmetrical!

Sorry for bringing this up, but, is there a specific reason as to why this project is being built so close to the Ka'aba?
I think it would've looked better if it was a little farther away (atleast a kilometre).

^ Yes, every pilgrim wants to live as close to the Holy Mosque as possible. I know, I've been there umpteen number of times and it is really difficult to walk say around a kilometer from the hotel to the mosque. What else could be better than to build tall hotels next to it?

wtf? where is photo of main tower uc?
all i see is podium with some cranes on top. we need a photo from rear where main tower is rising from.\
im not convinced the main tower is above podium yet.

^^ It seems to have materialised into thin air :O

... or it never existed... :S

Sorry for bringing this up, but, is there a specific reason as to why this project is being built so close to the Ka'aba?
I think it would've looked better if it was a little farther away (atleast a kilometre).

I agree.

Unfortunately, they are built over there because of commercial considerations. Units directly overlooking the haram command astronomical rates.

When will they begin building the middle part?

I agree.

Unfortunately, they are built over there because of commercial considerations. Units directly overlooking the haram command astronomical rates.

Actually i dont think its just that. If you have ever been to mecca you know how bad the traffic is, especially during hajj when literally everybody is trying to et to the grand mosque. Housing the pilgrims so close to the mosque instead of having to bus them in elieves some of those traffic woes.

Actually, it is the opposite. Pilgrims spend more time in Mina than in Mecca. By concentrating all the new pilgrim capacity in the centre of Mecca you're in fact overloading the transport links between central and eastern Mecca. The ideal places to put these developments would've been in the north-eastern and south-eastern districts of the city, like in Aziziah or Sharaye'. You can also have premium developments in the centre of the city, but you have to spread the load.

wtf? where is photo of main tower uc?
all i see is podium with some cranes on top. we need a photo from rear where main tower is rising from.\
im not convinced the main tower is above podium yet.

here it is
it is circled with green

http://thespoke.net/photos/hashamhas/images/973761/original.aspx

but why is 2 late in construction , that's what i do not know !
it seems there is no a plan 4 it

eng_kheffa you dont know that is the tower under construction. There is no evidence for it. We need a reliable source and pictures...

does anyone have any updates??

unfortunately updates are very rare for this project but keep checking back and im sure someone will post some :-)

any updates??

It has been about 8 weeks since the last update... I guess the Hajj has probably both held things up at the construction site and restricted many avenues of communication out of Mecca. I do hope someone returning from it can post some pics of the progress.

Photos from flickr:
13 Jan.
http://farm1.static.flickr.com/130/355429933_89091f6939.jpg?v=0

12 Jan.
http://farm1.static.flickr.com/151/355417325_c09b13d736.jpg?v=0
http://farm1.static.flickr.com/40/355415943_e61402b45c.jpg?v=0
http://farm1.static.flickr.com/124/355415701_aa8fff18da.jpg?v=0
http://farm1.static.flickr.com/163/355412892_f42c71fa3e.jpg?v=0
http://farm1.static.flickr.com/127/355412756_366a6f8ea3.jpg?v=0
http://farm1.static.flickr.com/149/355411460_d4984ff847.jpg?v=0

:O

Thank you so much for the pics Halawala!! And thank you to Flickr :P

They are getting really huge!

Great shots!
These towers look so much better in real life than in the renders.
Hope the big one doesn't look out of place as this is becoming a nice little block.

I like it!

great new pics

:eek: :runaway: This is extremely huge!

Jan 19 2007

http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n118/Saudi-Guy/Abraj%20Al%20Bait/Jan%2019%202006/1.jpg

http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n118/Saudi-Guy/Abraj%20Al%20Bait/Jan%2019%202006/P1020322.jpg

http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n118/Saudi-Guy/Abraj%20Al%20Bait/Jan%2019%202006/P1020324.jpg

http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n118/Saudi-Guy/Abraj%20Al%20Bait/Jan%2019%202006/P1020323.jpg

http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n118/Saudi-Guy/Abraj%20Al%20Bait/Jan%2019%202006/P1020326.jpg

-----------
not sure about these one!
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n118/Saudi-Guy/Abraj%20Al%20Bait/Jan%2019%202006/2.jpg

http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n118/Saudi-Guy/Abraj%20Al%20Bait/Jan%2019%202006/P1020327.jpg

-----------

http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n118/Saudi-Guy/Abraj%20Al%20Bait/Jan%2019%202006/3.jpg

http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n118/Saudi-Guy/Abraj%20Al%20Bait/Jan%2019%202006/P1020345.jpg

http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n118/Saudi-Guy/Abraj%20Al%20Bait/Jan%2019%202006/P1020344.jpg

-----------

http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n118/Saudi-Guy/Abraj%20Al%20Bait/Jan%2019%202006/4.jpg

http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n118/Saudi-Guy/Abraj%20Al%20Bait/Jan%2019%202006/P1020346.jpg

^^

Thanks Saudi_guy, it's turning out beautifully.

wow, now thats an update!!
so big one hasnt started yet?

^^in fact i can't go behind ,it's deeply back in Mountain!

WOW ALRIGHT!!! This is by far the best and really the first update about the Abraj Al-Bait we have had!!!

Your the man Saudi guy!!! Do you live in Mecca or just visiting?

:eek2::eek2: This is a huge project, when is supposed to be finish, because is a wonderful project. By the way nice updates, the pictures looks amazing, and the project have advanced a lot.

so if i was to add this worlds tall diagrams, should it be the 485m version in pic above? also what has been built of the 485m tower? podium? foundations?

WOW great progress! It is sad most of forumers including me will never see this beauty in real.

Domenico:i live in jeedah(50 km far from mecca) but most who live's in jeedah go to mecca once every day~week.

Escoto_Dubai2008: we should wait
1 tower completed
1 almost complet
1 i think 70%~80% finsh
so there steel 4 towers we can't seen it.

The facade look stunning and I especially love this spiral staircase:
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n118/Saudi-Guy/Abraj%20Al%20Bait/Jan%2019%202006/P1020344.jpg

ive added the mecca tower to my diagrams.
ive left off the 2 x240m winged towers that are only joined by bridges.
The diagram on skyscraperpage is too wide. from latest render the main tower is approx 82m wide not 100m as shown on ssp.ive worked out some heights- main tower is 330m high with main roof at 360m. base of spire diamond structure is approx 376m.what is that glass diamond straucture anyway? some sort of ob pod?

http://img249.imageshack.us/img249/6326/thebig7january2007hn0.jpg

Hey Culwulla, Is 'Russia Tower' confirmed o_O?

Where did you get info that it will still be built?

Great diagram!!!

Hey Culwulla, Is 'Russia Tower' confirmed o_O?

Where did you get info that it will still be built?

There is a thread about Russia Tower in the Construction Updates. Please read it, it explains everything.

WOW, great update, this builing is the underdog of the tall ones u/c but surely one of the most beutiful ever! When completition expected?

There is a thread about Russia Tower in the Construction Updates. Please read it, it explains everything.

Sarcasm? The thread hasnt been updated in nearly a year!! :P

Awesome project, I also like the crescent moon that will be on the top. :)

Sarcasm? The thread hasnt been updated in nearly a year!! :P
No, I am not being sarcastic. And what thread hasn't been updated in a year?

Wow!! Tall + massive. great updates Saudi Guy.
BTW: are these buildings part of a single structure at bottom or are they just independant buildings clustered together?

No, I am not being sarcastic. And what thread hasn't been updated in a year?
He meant the Russian Tower thread..right?

The Russia Tower thread was last updated on January 10th... so 9 days ago.

wow, massive update. that complex is so damned huge, can't believe

haven't seen this project for quite a while, My Gosh!!! its progress is so stunning.

in fact there will be more than 100 tower in these area in ~2015 like Jabal omar,al Shamyah,Jabal Khandma,and more........i just can't wait to see it.

how many supertalls?

hmm i dont know realy, some of it over rocks in the mountain with ~150m that may looks like more than 400m see that pics
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n118/Saudi-Guy/Jabal%20Khandama/b87b961d6ac07b3ee91c8a5a26608720.jpg

http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n118/Saudi-Guy/Jabal%20Khandama/41aa8742d3f61f3b9289b2485fd3f5da.jpg

one of that another project
http://aloula.flipdevnet.com/wp-content/files/Image/alshamia7.jpg

Such a massive project, what used to be on the site?

THis project is so dense, judging by the photos :O

Saudi Guy are all those projects under construction?

in fact yes if you were in there you can see easly all mountains are didging and many new tower under construction or old building dispear but idont know about shamyah project!

saudi guy, i was going to do a more detailed diagram of just the whole project.
in this diagram its missing the 240m towers on the flanks.
what status are they at?
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n118/Saudi-Guy/Abraj%20Al%20Bait/AAB.jpg

the left one at 3storeys? 20m?
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n118/Saudi-Guy/Abraj%20Al%20Bait/Jan%2019%202006/P1020327.jpg

right tower 5 storeys? 40m?
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n118/Saudi-Guy/Abraj%20Al%20Bait/Jan%2019%202006/P1020345.jpg

^^yah the left wing at 3f and the other at 5f ,i think it's stoped or slow ,they work now on hajer tower(right the left wing).

i like the design

ok, heres a diagram ive spent time on. is this getting there saudi guy?


http://img401.imageshack.us/img401/6822/abrajalbaitmecca2oh.jpg

^^ Oh, well done mate. Nice one :-)

Good job CULWULLA. The diagram is awesome :)

CUL Buddy your gifted with this stuff awsome AL-Bait diagrams.

I'm sure it will be great in person but it looks like a Casino.

^^ A casino? What are you silly?

Yeah, it looks like something you'd see in Vegas excpet it's the real thing.

that awsome,good work CULWULLA its look like you seen it in real:cheers:
I'm sure it will be great in person but it looks like a Casino.
other members say like that before!!!i seen that casino in pic it's not that much i think!

pics please

yes photos please???

is there any one???

the shear greatness of this project will dwarf anything a casino could offer but one thing both will have in common is enormous wealth.

No updates on this project in a while. Any news anybody?

sorry for bumping a thread without any new information.... but there has been a lot of posts in part 1 recently and i wanted to put this one ahead of it so people stop, seems most people here find it impossible to actually look for threads themselves.

Thanks nezzybaby for bumping the thread and don't worry about the information because I have some,



http://img520.imageshack.us/img520/7496/hotel2ph8.jpg
Now I believe that title of the post should be changed to 577M not 485M anymore or we can create new thread to be Abraj Al-Bait 577M (PART 2).

For members who like this project and its location, Congrats :banana:

For members who hate the project for its location and disagree with building any skyscraper infront of the holy mosque, You can hate it more now lol :lol:

Thanks to DreaM1981.

^^ that tower will have a clock like a church??

March 2007
http://www.travel4arab.com/photo/data/500/medium/Photo-0114_Small_.jpg

looking so slow work and not much progress !!!

i think it finishes at 2010

Absolutely beautiful. This tower is a great addition to Mecca.

Is the main tower rising?

Is the main tower rising?

Yes, they started building the main tower (above podium) 1 month ago.

Should not moderator change the thread name from "abraj al-bair (PART 2) 485M" to "577M" ?

Hi evryone,
ive been wanting to know about this project for the past year when i visited Mecca. i found this wonderful forum about 2 weeks back and seen how well the project has progressed. its GREAT!:)
just a few requests from u guys:
1. what is that building doing right infront of the AL Beit towers - is it a hotel? if so whats it called? and will it stay there?
2. has anyone got information of any projects on shammiya side - i remember seeing some pics about it but cant find them now.
thanks

1-Small hotel which will be demolished soon inshaallah.
2-Yes there is a project there but didn't start yet.

The change in the design was officially announced yesterday. The major change is adding a clock which will be the highest in the world. And as DreaM1981 said, the height of the hotel tower will be 577m.

http://www.okaz.com.sa/okaz/myfiles/2007/03/14/a10-big.jpg
looks like a giant big ben!

http://www.aawsat.com/2007/03/14/images/ksa-local.410449.jpg

http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2007/03/08/world/08mecca-650.jpg

Changes in the design,

http://i13.tinypic.com/433bgoo.jpg

^^ i like the 2005 design. whats the purpose of such a big sized clock placed in it. it is forcing the building to appear small than it actually is.

That clock is such a disgrace, why not an electronic clock instead?

The 2005 design is the best. This clock tower.... is um... no.

it looks a bit like a communist building now.

That clock is such a disgrace, why not an electronic clock instead?

you mean like the digital clock at Big Ben in the simpsons episode "lisas marriage"

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

The 2005 design is the best. This clock tower.... is um... no.

agree, 2005 design was better but the height of 577 is better :)

At least not 1 of the 2 million expected for the last days of Ramadam each year could ever have an excuse to be late.

A clock in such a symbolic tower? Terrible.

The change in the design was officially announced yesterday. The major change is adding a clock which will be the highest in the world. And as DreaM1981 said, the height of the hotel tower will be 577m.

http://www.okaz.com.sa/okaz/myfiles/2007/03/14/a10-big.jpg
looks like a giant big ben!

http://www.aawsat.com/2007/03/14/images/ksa-local.410449.jpg

That clock is the ugliest thing I've seen. It's supposed to be a skyscraper, not an oversized clock tower right?

That clock is the ugliest thing I've seen. It's supposed to be a skyscraper, not an oversized clock tower right?

I believe that the clock is not the ugliest thing but ugliest thing is "height of the Hotel tower (main tower) is almost double than other towers which look ugly".

If they increased the height of other towers, It would look ok. when you look at 2007 design, you feel that hotel tower (main tower) has no relation with other towers at all as if they are not one project.

Anyway, I would like to add very important note:

As far I have been informed, there are other new two towers will be built behind the two big towers beside the main tower and the height of these towers will be over than 300M so, the building is supposed to look ok after the official announcement of the new design 2009.

http://img185.imageshack.us/img185/5900/abrajnr1.jpg
Conclusion: Project might contain 9 towers not seven as it is now and the extra added towers will be higher than all of them except the main tower.

I have no proof yet but take it a word and wait for 2009 design to prove it :banana:

I think that the tower looks very nice.

so very ugly!

I think this is a very appropriate place for a big clock.

I think this is a very appropriate place for a big clock.

Agreed.

It is obvious to me the reason behind placing a clock on this tower is to assist the pilgrims and worshipers in their journey of prayer and enlightenment. I dont disagree with it and I dont think it looks terrible. It simply looks a little awkward, as if its not sure it wants to be there :)

Sometimes the most beneficial things are not the most ecstatically pleasing.

Agreed.

It is obvious to me the reason behind placing a clock on this tower is to assist the pilgrims and worshipers in their journey of prayer and enlightenment. I dont disagree with it and I dont think it looks terrible. It simply looks a little awkward, as if its not sure it wants to be there :)

Sometimes the most beneficial things are not the most ecstatically pleasing.

yeah i think we all understand the reason for the clock. but isn't there an extremely loud speaker blasting the call to prayer all throughout the day??? isn't that enough? it sure as hell was enough to wake me up every morning when i lived surrounded by mosques!

and the spire, although significant for religious reasons, is pretty silly looking. reminds me of a hood-ornament on a car.

...but isn't there an extremely loud speaker blasting the call to prayer all throughout the day??? isn't that enough?


Just spare a thought for the deaf :tongue3:

...and the spire, although significant for religious reasons, is pretty silly looking. reminds me of a hood-ornament on a car.

Sigh... to true...

Just spare a thought for the deaf :tongue3:

ahhhh, excellent point! that's very accommodating of them!

yeah i think we all understand the reason for the clock. but isn't there an extremely loud speaker blasting the call to prayer all throughout the day??? isn't that enough? it sure as hell was enough to wake me up every morning when i lived surrounded by mosques!



It's symbolic. Have you ever seen an Imam who didn't wear a wristwatch? Even if there are other ways to tell the time, the clock is there to be a reminder to remember prayer time. Anyway, whether or not it is ugly is a question of taste, but I don't think it makes any sense the people saying "it's scandalous to put a big clock on such a tower so near to the mosque."

agree, 2005 design was better but the height of 577 is better :)

Well if we can't have both, then I would rather take the shorter one.

Why the clock? Why? Oi. lol:ohno:

Personally I don't like the clock design. I'm sure it will be impressive if built, on account of size and height, but it does not look well integrated into the rest of the design. And I doubt that very many people would use it for time, but then again that's just my opinion.

http://aawsat.com/english/images/2007/03/14/O31708309.jpg

Yea! I like design in 2005.

worse design!! in 2007

http://aawsat.com/english/images/2007/03/14/O31708309.jpg

It's Big Ben in Mecca.

http://www.tutorialtomb.com/upload/pictures/Big Ben 2213.jpg

Is this design higher than the 2005's one?

yes

Hey, does anyone know where that elevation drawing came from showing the height? Also, does anyone have a press release to show when this latest design was announced? You can send me a message.

BTW, all the papers are saying the clock will sit at 380 meters above the ground, but if the tower is really 577 meters to its spire, that would make the area above the clock 197 meters, which doesn't seem likely from any of the renderings. Either the clock sits higher, or the tower is not 577 meters.

World's Tallest Clock Tower to be Built in Mecca

14/03/2007
By Nahid Andijani

Jeddah, Asharq Al-Awsat- The holy city of Mecca is soon to become home to the world’s tallest clock tower following the announcement of the decision made by the Custodian of the Two Holy Mosques, King Abdullah bin Abdulaziz, to construct the Mecca clock tower.

The governor of Mecca, Prince Abdul Majeed bin Abdulaziz, announced Tuesday that the clock would be placed on top of the fifth tower of the King Abdulaziz Endowment project opposite the Holy Mosque at 380 meters high, making it the world's highest clock. The four sides of the clock will be adorned by the name of God.

The project will use four clock faces for each side of the tower, including 2 main clocks that are 80 meters high and that will adorn the name of God, and that will be 65 meters wide with a 39-meter diameter. The other two clocks will be placed 65 meters high and will be approximately 34 meters wide with a 25-meter diameter.

http://aawsat.com/english/images/sfeature/clock.jpg

There will be an elevator to take visitors to the surrounding balcony below the four clocks.

Asharq Al Awsat learnt that the project is still tentative. The company that will build and install the clock and the cost of the project are yet to be determined. The source told Asharq Al Awsat Tuesday that one of the world's leading clock makers would be chosen to take on the project.

The Saudi Binladin Group is in charge of developing the King Abdulaziz Endowment project and may be assigned to oversee or coordinate the details of building the clock. The project is expected to take six months to complete.

The King Abdulaziz Endowment project, which overlooks the Holy Mosque and has been chosen as the site of the world's highest clock, is one of the world's largest construction projects. The project was rated the largest architectural building in view of the total area, which exceeds 1.4 million square meters. Designed using the Islamic architecture, it contains 7 adjacent towers, with 6,000 housing units, and has over SR6 billion (US$1.6 billions) in investments.

With the construction of the clock, Saudi Arabia, specifically the western region, will be the site of two world landmarks, including the Jeddah Fountain, which is 261 meters high and was built at the order of King Fahd bin Abdulaziz. The area of flowing water is 4,000 square meters. Three giant pumps are used to pump water at a speed of 320 kilometers per hour and are 261 meters in height.

www.aawsat.com

Lmichigan,

I did some measurements and I got almost the same height. I Used the 39m diameter that was mentioned in the above article as a scale on that drawing.

Ugly!

lol! agreed

Lmichigan,

I did some measurements and I got almost the same height. I Used the 39m diameter that was mentioned in the above article as a scale on that drawing.

You mean you got the same height as the elevation drawing showing the top to be 577 meters high?

The crescent moon does not look good on this style of building. Had they have built a building with traditional (i.e. Islamic) style of exterior, the crescent moon at the top may have looked better.

it looks a bit like a communist building now.

Haha

The 2005 design looks the best, adding the clock looks retarded

You mean you got the same height as the elevation drawing showing the top to be 577 meters high?

I got around 550 m.

Someone needs to email the architect, developer, and/or constructor to find the exact heights and figures. I'm sure they'll answer.

BTW, we see the top number in that scanned elevation drawing, but we can't see the base number. Often times, architects do not measure from 0 meters. We really don't know what the base number is.

i wonder why in such an important religious place such an over-dimensioned building can be constructed. It will dwarf all the minarets of the mosque, and not a mosque but THE mosque. It is something as putting the Venetian from Las Vegas next to St Peter in Rome. From now on the most important building in the city will seem to be the hotel, quite controversial, don't you think?

^^ No

i wonder why in such an important religious place such an over-dimensioned building can be constructed. It will dwarf all the minarets of the mosque, and not a mosque but THE mosque. It is something as putting the Venetian from Las Vegas next to St Peter in Rome. From now on the most important building in the city will seem to be the hotel, quite controversial, don't you think?

I used to think the same when I first heard of this project. However, the pros outweigh the cons. It is being built to accomodate the pilgrams, who number in the millions at one time.

http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2007/03/08/world/08mecca-650.jpg

Wow, that gives you a really good idea of the scale. Put the clock tower in the middle and it's going to be absolutely ginormous!

I used to think the same when I first heard of this project. However, the pros outweigh the cons. It is being built to accommodate the pilgrims, who number in the millions at one time.

I can imagine that accommodation is a major problem but this seems more about having rooms with a great view over the mosque, even if pilgrims loose the minaret skyline from the central patio. If you see a satellite view of Mecca (http://www.nationsonline.org/oneworld/map/google_map_Mecca.htm)
you can see that there is plenty of unbuilt land within hundreds of meters from there where a whole hotel district could be raised. I suppose that most of pilgrims can't afford to pay a room in this hotel. They will be placed in tents as it has been done. I would find a bit shocking to confirm such a drastic wealth inequality from the heart of a religious center. It is about how the city is conceived and there should be some construction rules that reflect this. In a financial center as Dubai, NY or HK, concurrence is the rule, in Paris, rationality and equality where behind the urban project. This a great opportunity to show what are the central values behind an Islamic conception of the city and it would be a shame if it is not seized.

Nothing wrong with the 2007 design, but I prefer the 2005 slightly. The 2 new 300m+ buildings may help the overall feel.

gee is every new bldg in the world going over half a km?? how awesome. so is 577ma significant number? 1892ft? what happened in 1892?
such a massive clock. anyone got the time? lol
http://www.gifs.net/Animation11/Everything_Else/Clocks/Clock_3.gif

Someone needs to email the architect, developer, and/or constructor to find the exact heights and figures. I'm sure they'll answer.

BTW, we see the top number in that scanned elevation drawing, but we can't see the base number. Often times, architects do not measure from 0 meters. We really don't know what the base number is.

I already did!! or how would I get such drawing with specified height and details of the clock before the official announcement of construction of such big clock?

Take my word as final word please:

Height of the small front towers = 225 M + 15 M (tent) = 240 M
Height of main tower = 577 M

any future discussion about height can be called "useless arguement" since I am sure 100% of what I am saying plus what do you want more than part of the approved design drawing that I posted? lol

I like the idea of the clock.

i hope thet high Increase to 1km:D it will be great if they add two towers behind that two wing towers and make it 440m it make that project more massive:banana:

^^ Isn't it massive enough already?

Man... this is really ugly. I always disliked this tower but this is horrible... :puke:

Why is it so important to have a record? They couldn't have the tallest building in the world so they went for the tallest clock tower... :bash:

gee is every new bldg in the world going over half a km?? how awesome. so is 577ma significant number? 1892ft? what happened in 1892?
such a massive clock. anyone got the time? lol
http://www.gifs.net/Animation11/Everything_Else/Clocks/Clock_3.gif


Only thing I can think of with regards to 577 is..

The 5 is for Five Pillars of Islam
7's are for 7 levels of Heaven?

haha K i suck in numerology but whatever.

^^ Isn't it massive enough already?

Man... this is really ugly. I always disliked this tower but this is horrible... :puke:

Why is it so important to have a record? They couldn't have the tallest building in the world so they went for the tallest clock tower... :bash:

Who said that they are looking for a record?

It is very simple... The project is "Development of King AbdulAziz Endowment" so, they want this project to be known well all over the world as a respect to their father king abdul Aziz.

Also, They need the capacity to be very high cause more capaciry means more income which all is for the holy mosque as endowment for king abdulAziz.

They are not like Dubai looking for records but they need the project to be massive enough, modern, high capacity and notable as respect for king abdul Aziz name.

after looking at the building projected pic I think it looks great becz it is massive and different than other buildins which are just one tall buidling. this one is like a gate and 3 tall structures.

how many floors will it have?

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/157/377405789_c7ae20db5e.jpg?v=0

guess where the worlds current largest clock is located?

MILWAUKEE, WISCONSIN

The Allen-Bradley Clock Tower is listed in the Guinness Book of World Records as the world’s largest four-faced clock. Because the octagonal faces are nearly twice the size of the clocks in London’s Big Ben, chimes were never added in order to allow Big Ben to remain the largest four-faced chiming clock in the world.
wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Allen-Bradley_Clock_Tower)

how many floors will it have?

the 485m version should have 76 but the new maybe 100 but i'm really not sure

how many floors will it have?

You can not count the floors easily or compare the number of floors in abraj al-bait to any another project at all.

Reason is: The height of floors are different... for example in shopping mall area, the height = 5.5 M for each floor.. in podium area, the height = 4.9 M for each floor... for tunnel the height of the floor = 15 M... in typical floors, height = 3.6 M and some are 4 M.

That is why I said "no need to count the floors and compare with other projects because this project is really special and totally different than other projects" since it has

Shopping Mall.
Two tunnels
Car parking
Museum
Resturants
Mosques
Small hospital
plus the hotel which has the clock and many other mixed stuff too.

thanks DreaM1981
but i do not want to compare it with other projects :D
i just wanted to know hao many floors it will have :D

i thought something about 100 floors

BTW
topic title should be changed
no mods here?
MECCA: Abraj Al-Bait (Part 2) - (577m)

I like...it looks like old russian style....

^^ o_O Huh!?

Wow, what happened to this one?

Haha. Mine is bigger ;).

Well, it's not the biggest clock. It's the biggest FOUR FACED clock.
The Colgate clock in hoboken is quite a contender with its 50+ feet height.

BTW, I have the biggest pencil with four dents in the back and burned on the front, lined with lateral teeth holes, in raw wood, round and sitting on the back of a 7 sheets stapled document printed on a laserjet with two squares and 5 lines drawn on the back, using my writing.

I should call Guiness. Well, wait, better, I hear the call of Guiness... Beer never waits !

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/157/377405789_c7ae20db5e.jpg?v=0

guess where the worlds current largest clock is located?

MILWAUKEE, WISCONSIN


wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Allen-Bradley_Clock_Tower)

the new design is quite tacky compared to the old one. nice clock though.

24/03/2007

http://img231.imageshack.us/img231/8937/ab1qb5.jpg

http://img63.imageshack.us/img63/5196/ab2xp6.jpg

Sorry for bad quality.

Very sureal... thx for the pics!

from flickr,
http://farm1.static.flickr.com/145/430413856_f3fa153fd5.jpg?v=0


http://farm1.static.flickr.com/133/317971592_b6d80e7b43_o.jpg

great pics it looks like the buldings are being built fast.I have one question not regarding AB-A on the last pic posted by Riyadhi is the ground made of marble

A clock in such a symbolic tower? Terrible.

Not really, there is a good need for clocks in Mecca - prayer times

Nice pictures. The tower looks awsome.

great pics it looks like the buldings are being built fast.I have one question not regarding AB-A on the last pic posted by Riyadhi is the ground made of marble


Manufactured marble & Porcelin (This is for shopping mall)
Granite (This is for main enterance)

You are welcome Domenico

Here are some other pictures... We can see the top of the podium (almost +100 m) and Hotel + Tower Hajer have been started to be built above the podium.

Also, we can see one of towers (Al-Marwa Tower) with all details and it is clear that roof is being built for tents.

24/03/2007

http://img53.imageshack.us/img53/1183/abhcjz4.jpg

http://img53.imageshack.us/img53/6804/abhc2ft4.jpg

http://img144.imageshack.us/img144/7924/abblo7.jpg

Very impressive project, shame I'll never be allowed to see it in person.

great pic's DreaM1981 that what we miss it:)

Thx again.

What do you mean by tents? Do you actually mean people can put up their own tents there? :P

In the picture below, we really get to see how beautiful the facade is. For those who thought it looked like Vegas, how wrong you were...

You are welcome Domenico
http://img144.imageshack.us/img144/7924/abblo7.jpg[/CENTER]

^^it's looks HUGE in that one.

Thx again.

What do you mean by tents? Do you actually mean people can put up their own tents there? :P

Yes for pilgrimes lol joking sure :lol:

Tents will be resturants. There are many on each tower and the centeral podium too.

The tents on centeral podium some will be mosque and other will be resturants inshallah as far I have been told.

http://img142.imageshack.us/img142/4856/modelnewgz2.jpg

Is Abraj Al-Bait going to be 458m or 577m high? There are some posts about new hight.

Is Abraj Al-Bait going to be 458m or 577m high? There are some posts about new hight.

577M, Click here (http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=334299&page=17) for more informations about the height.

Wow!
Someone should change the hight in the topic title.
With 577m is Abraj Al-Bait one of the highest U/C skyscrapers of the world, only the clock is IMO a little bit to big.

you have model of abraj al bait?

Thanks for responding to my question

Some pictures for the shopping mall of abraj al-bait...

24/03/2007

http://img240.imageshack.us/img240/4491/shm1zi5.jpg

http://img411.imageshack.us/img411/7631/shm2nw4.jpg

http://img518.imageshack.us/img518/9892/shm3fj0.jpg

http://img159.imageshack.us/img159/318/shm5or7.jpg

http://img70.imageshack.us/img70/3453/shm4sl5.jpg

Note: These pictures are real ones not renders.

awesome!!

Thanks for the updates

ive scaled this pic and calculated heights if its 577m
-height to main roof-390m
-height to centre clock-425m
-height to roof-440m
base of spire-500m
spire-577m
tower width-65m.

http://aawsat.com/english/images/2007/03/14/O31708309.jpg

dream1981, ive updated diagram. can you indicate status of other towers in diagram?naming them etc i get really confused.lol

http://img150.imageshack.us/img150/985/abrajalbaitmecca577mceruw7.jpg

That's an awesome diagram CULWULLA :applause:

dream1981, ive updated diagram. can you indicate status of other towers in diagram?naming them etc i get really confused.lol

http://img300.imageshack.us/img300/730/abbbsnv2.jpg


Hotel Tower 577 m (Called in construction Tower H)
Hajar 260 m (Called in construction Tower C) *
ZamZam 260 m (Called in Construction Tower D) *
Sarah 240 m (Called in construction Tower K)
Maqam 240 m (Called in construction Tower F)
Marwah 240 m (Called in construction Tower B) *
Safa 240 m (Called in construction Tower A) *


* Tents are included in the height.

EDIT: Thanks Brother Riyadhi for fixing :)

you are great CULWULLA i realy like your work:)

http://img300.imageshack.us/img300/730/abbbsnv2.jpg


Hotel Tower 577 m (Called in construction Tower H)
Hajar 260 m (Called in construction Tower C) *
ZamZam 260 m (Called in Construction Tower D) *
Sarah 240 m (Called in construction Tower K)
Maqam 240 m (Called in construction Tower F)
Marwah 240 m (Called in construction Tower B) *
Safa 240 m (Called in construction Tower A) *


* Tents are included in the height.

this is my lowly work :)


http://i56.photobucket.com/albums/g179/F9y/AbrajAl-bait-FaisalF9y.jpg

NEW UPDATE:
I have been told that car parking (L5, L6, L7 & L8) have been cancelled and the levels will be commercial area (shops) as part of the mall. This means Shopping mall of abraj al-bait will be 11 floors!!

11 Floors Shopping mall!! this is really big specially if the area of each floor is 15,000 m2 :lol:

^^ Such a move would make sense to me because the building will mostly cater to the pilgrims who are big consumers and don't have a car to park. :)

This has to be the ugliest crap I've ever seen !! :(

Something like the off spring of a fat Big Ben tower imitation in the middle of a communist building in order to set up a las vegas cheap Casino, YUCK !! :ohno:

[CENTER][IMG]http://img300


Hotel Tower 577 m (Called in construction Tower H)
Hajar 260 m (Called in construction Tower C) *
ZamZam 260 m (Called in Construction Tower D) *
Sarah 240 m (Called in construction Tower K)
Maqam 240 m (Called in construction Tower F)
Marwah 240 m (Called in construction Tower B) *
Safa 240 m (Called in construction Tower A) *


* Tents are included in the height.

EDIT: Thanks Brother Riyadhi for fixing :)

LOL, diagram after diagram after diagram :P

So, are you saying there are going to be tents installed on the roofs of the towers? :O

has any of these 200m+ tower already topped out?

I don't know what to think about this project. The clock looks weird, and the tower reminds me "the 7 sisters" in Moscow, but instead of having a communist red star on the top of the spire, it's got a crescent.
On the other hand this complex is quite impressive. I wouldn't call it a "classy" architecture, though. It's a bit Las Vegas style - mixture of other buildings pretending to be real.

So, are you saying there are going to be tents installed on the roofs of the towers? :O

yes but not all... Tents will be on the roofs of Tower Al-Safa (A), Al Marwa (B), Hajar (C) and Zamzam (D).

has any of these 200m+ tower already topped out?

Not yet but tent of Tower Al-Safa (A) is supposed to be installed end of this year inshallah.

yes but not all... Tents will be on the roofs of Tower Al-Safa (A), Al Marwa (B), Hajar (C) and Zamzam (D).

Oh yes of course!! I overlooked the fact the asterisks were only attached to these towers :D

thanks for clearing that up. ive adjusted diagram.

http://img219.imageshack.us/img219/3541/abrajalbaitmecca577mcervs1.jpg

NICE!

Good job :okay:

wow awesome... one of the best if not the best project i have ever seen in my life

577m or 485m?

577

577

Do you also know the floor count and development status?

i just cant believe the arabian government.

they destroy the little historical landmarks we have and make way to build this monstrocity.

good job culwulla!

577m? not 485m?

its ok, but will all the construction workers be muslims?

its ok, but will all the construction workers be muslims?

Sure. only muslims are allowed in Makkah and that is one of main reasons that Saudi Binladin Group is the main contractor of many huge projects there since it has the manpower, professional engineers and foremen to build such huge projects and even better than many european and asian contractors.

Sure. only muslims are allowed in Makkah and that is one of main reasons that Saudi Binladin Group is the main contractor of many huge projects there since it has the manpower, professional engineers and foremen to build such huge projects and even better than many european and asian contractors.

that cool! i knew only muslims were allowed in, but was just wondering. the saudi binladin group. any relation to osama bin ladin?

^^ As far I know, no relation since they disowned him long time ago.

From bbc:

Binladin name 'hijacked'

Binladin Group built the pyramid-shaped Faisaliah Center in Riyadh

Bin Laden - the name is reviled in much of the Western world, but shared by one of Saudi Arabia's largest business empires.
The respected name of the Binladin group - which uses the traditional English spelling of the family name - has been "hijacked", said the half-brother of Osama Bin Laden in the first interview by a family member since the attacks on the US.

In the early 1990s, the family repeatedly reached out and made attempts to plead with Osama to moderate his views ... after these attempts failed, there was a reluctant but unanimous consent that Osama should be disowned

Abdullah Mohammed Binladin
"Our name is being hijacked," Abdullah Mohammed Binladin told the Boston Sunday Globe.

Though there is no evidence of financial links between Osama Bin Laden and the $5bn-a-year Saudi Binladin Group, some business partners have quit joint ventures.

The family disowned Osama Bin Laden in 1994, and Mr Binladin said they have no connections with him.

"In the early 1990s, the family repeatedly reached out and made attempts to plead with Osama to moderate his views," Mr Binladin said.

"After these attempts failed, there was a reluctant but unanimous consent that Osama should be disowned."

Family business

The Saudi Binladin Group is operating with Royal privilege and associated with most of Saudi Arabia's prestigious construction projects.

Mohammed Bin-Awad Binladin built his business on links with King Faisal

Though it is trying to extend its business globally, the bulk of the Binladin Group's business remains in the kingdom.

Founder Mohammed Bin-Awad Binladin, originally from the Hadramaut region of Yemen, designed and built the al-Hada road in the 1950s, for Muslims to make the pilgrimage to Mecca in Saudi Arabia.

This gained him the trust of Saudi Arabia's King Faisal, who hired him to rebuild the mosques in Mecca and Medina, the holiest sites in Islam.

After Mohammed died in 1967, control of the family business passed first to his son Salem, and then to another son Bakr, after Salem's death in a plane crash in 1988.

The Binladin Group also built the pyramid-shaped Faisaliah Center ********** in Riyadh, which opened last year, and restored Al Aqsa mosque in Jerusalem, Islam's third holiest site.

Contracts to build military facilities for US forces in Saudi Arabia during the Gulf War are thought to have caused the split between the family and Osama.

Partners review

Despite the failure of some small business deals, most of the Binladin Group's international partners are standing by the company, though some are keeping the situation under review.

The Faisaliah Center: Lucrative construction contract

Dutch ABN Amro bank, which owns 40% of a Saudi bank that has dealt with the Binladin Group for seven decades, said it has no evidence of wrongdoing.

"If there is *** information regarding a client which would lead us to revaluate the relationship or review the relationship then we will not hesitate to do so," an ABN spokesman said.

Chas W Freeman Jr, a former US ambassador to Saudi Arabia and now chairman of Projects International, a Washington company that arranges global business deals, said he would continue discussing proposals with the Binladin Group.

But he added that some companies which have had "very long and profitable relationships" with the group were "now running for public relations cover".

He blamed ignorance, and said the Binladin name remained "very honoured" in the kingdom.

Damage limitation

But some businesses have not taken any chances that their images could be damaged.

"Given the events of the past two weeks, we will be monitoring the situation closely," said Citigroup, which provides banking services to the Binladin Group.

The UK soft drink and confectionery company, Cadbury Schweppes, has severed ties with a Saudi distributor owned by a Lebanese holding company in which the Binladins have a minority stake.

A Cadbury Schweppes spokeswoman said that the attacks on the US prompted it to speed up an earlier decision to cut ties because of slow sales.

"I think it is understandable," she said.

Multitone wireless networking of Britain suspended dealings with Baud Telecommunications, a Binladin Group subsidiary, after the terrorist attacks.

"At times like this, businesses such as ours... have a duty to act with total integrity," said Michael Walker, chief executive, but noted the company does "very little" business in Saudi Arabia.

Abdullah grounded

Meanwhile Abdullah, who at 35 is the youngest of the 54 children born to wives of the late Mohammed Bin-Awad Binladin, has remained in Boston Massachusetts while the rest of his US-based relatives have gone into hiding.

He told the Boston Sunday Globe that since 11 September he had stopped using credit cards and avoids using his name for fear of upsetting strangers.

Mr Binladin, who moved to the Boston area in the 1990s and earned a doctorate at the Harvard Law School, has also suspended his hobby of flying single-engine planes.

He last saw Osama at the funeral of their oldest brother, Salem, in 1988.

"He had been living most of the time in Afghanistan," Abdullah recalled.

"I personally did not know him very well."

Source (http://***s.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/1586052.stm)

I have been told that there are studies now to increase the height to 600M but still not officially. I am not sure that height will be increased 100% but I just wanted to share it with you all.

I hope to be official soon inshallah :banana:

lol, in the end that tower will override Burj Dubai ^^

^^ not that high :lol:

...inshallah :banana:

hu? o_O

^^ Hopfully or Gods willing

I have been told that there are studies now to increase the height to 600M but still not officially. I am not sure that height will be increased 100% but I just wanted to share it with you all.

I hope to be official soon inshallah :banana:


577m to 600m? that's not a huge improvement is it? how will the extra little height help? maybe they should make it taller...and get rid of that clock...it's pretty hidious...

I read an article about this towers today and and in article writen that these towers are hurting history.

I read an article about this towers today and and in article writen that these towers are hurting history.

Could you give the site where that stands on?

it's not a nice building...huge and nothing original, looks like Staline's buildings in Moscow...

577m to 600m? that's not a huge improvement is it? how will the extra little height help? maybe they should make it taller...and get rid of that clock...it's pretty hidious...

No i think the clock is quite important and should stay there. Remember, muslims pray five times a day at specific times. A clock like this i think will be very useful for its position.

They are demolished historical site just for this modern building.

They are demolished historical site just for this modern building.

Oh it's not the first time. The Saudi's are notorious for pissing on the history of other nations. They've demolished several historic Ottoman buildings (including the 220-year-old fortress of al-Ajyad) as well as houses, castles and cemeteries just for building new developments in Mecca and Medina.

Now this hideous monstrosity is being built. Yes, there might be demand for it, but guess what? Pilgrims have been going in and out of Mecca for centuries. The historic houses (now demolished) in the area surrounding Masjid al-Haram contained local communities which openly accepted pilgrims into their homes.

And a 5 star hotel? Don't they realise that not all pilgrims can afford this? Abraj Al-Bait, as large as it may look, will only house around 65 000 people at a time, and most of them will be permanent residents.

No i think the clock is quite important and should stay there. Remember, muslims pray five times a day at specific times. A clock like this i think will be very useful for its position.


Do you really think people in Makkah need a clock to look up prayer times? :lol:

Because of the way the valley is shaped, in most liklihood if you can see that clock, you'll hear the call to prayer from the Holy Mosque itself. And even if you don't, you'll hear it from some other mosque nearby. :)

soo.. any update?? :)

This building's just too close. That's the only problem that I have with it.

I can't see any point in denying luxury accomodation to Muslims that can afford it -that'd be like telling Donald Trump or Bill Gates to stay in a backpacker hostel. No one would ever say that, even if they are on a pilgrimage. Not one of us has the right to dictate such a thing to another person.

But this is such a holy site, and having this building right next to it detracts from that. The architecture is straight from some cheap Las Vegas theme hotel. It also creates a social structure whereby the richest Muslims get the best treatment -surely the Hajj is a time of ALL Muslims bowing together infront of God? This building even dwarfs the mosque.

I just think it should have been built a distance away from the main mosque. It's detracting from the whole reason as to why the pilgrims are there in the first place.

And on the subject of the House of Saud practising this architectual and historical genocide by demolishing places of cultural significance, I really, really don't agree with it. These sites are important to humanity and shouldn't be torn down just to put a few more dollars in the pockets of the Saudi royal family and Paris Hilton.

I'm sorry if this has offended anyone.

Don't be sorry: you're right. You're not even meant to tear down trees in Mecca let alone build anything taller than The Sacred Mosque!

Oh it's not the first time. The Saudi's are notorious for pissing on the history of other nations. They've demolished several historic Ottoman buildings (including the 220-year-old fortress of al-Ajyad) as well as houses, castles and cemeteries just for building new developments in Mecca and Medina.

Now this hideous monstrosity is being built. Yes, there might be demand for it, but guess what? Pilgrims have been going in and out of Mecca for centuries. The historic houses (now demolished) in the area surrounding Masjid al-Haram contained local communities which openly accepted pilgrims into their homes.

And a 5 star hotel? Don't they realise that not all pilgrims can afford this? Abraj Al-Bait, as large as it may look, will only house around 65 000 people at a time, and most of them will be permanent residents.

First of all, Abraj Al-bait is not only 5 star hotel, it consists of 4 star hotels and even royal hotels so all types and classes are available not as you said.

secondly, about uthman house and old houses, I believe if Saudi offered 10,000 visa only yearly not 3 million as it does now and the execuse was "makkah is full by historical houses so we can not make any extension", I believe that you and all muslims would attack saudi so much and would not like it at all.

Imagine!! muslims are 1.5 billion and only 10,000 maximum are allowed to perform hajj to dont destroy the old houses for extensions of haram and buildings around it to let pilgrimes sleep in air conditioned areas unless if you want to them to sleep on streets and stop cars, buses and all ways of translportations.

Let's be honest and logic please, I am not saying that saudi government did not make any mistakes... yes they did but they are learning too and improving the service yearly... many extensions for the haram but there were no new buildings so they detected that pilgrimes have no places to live in and they used to lie in streets.

Saudi government started building new towns and skyscrapers around the haram for pilgrimes but they detected that streets are not enough for pilgrimes.

The saudi government started now to build new modern railway to server pilgrimes.

You do not have to go to makkah and find it desert as it was unless if you accept few thousands to perform hajj only yearly which means 99% of muslims will die without performing hajj and the execuse would be "Sorry we can not destroy any historical house".

Other cultures can keep their hisotircal houses and protect cause it is totally different situation than Makkah.

for example in Egypt, they do not plan to wipe the graves around the pyramids. Why? because no millions go to perfom hajj there and only tourists go for a visit which is not essential.

In Makkah, almost 7 millions go AT SAME TIME and AT SAME PLACE... where can you find it? while makkah is surrounded by huge mountains!!

This government paid more than 200$ billions to improve Makkah and Madinah. at least all should appreciate it... I believe that any of your country would not pay half to improve or even to support improving of Makkah and Madinah... maybe even if they were in your countries, we would buy tickets to go into the haram not free as it is now. :)

Note: I am not saudi but I am logic.

This building's just too close. That's the only problem that I have with it.

I can't see any point in denying luxury accomodation to Muslims that can afford it -that'd be like telling Donald Trump or Bill Gates to stay in a backpacker hostel. No one would ever say that, even if they are on a pilgrimage. Not one of us has the right to dictate such a thing to another person.

But this is such a holy site, and having this building right next to it detracts from that. The architecture is straight from some cheap Las Vegas theme hotel. It also creates a social structure whereby the richest Muslims get the best treatment -surely the Hajj is a time of ALL Muslims bowing together infront of God? This building even dwarfs the mosque.

I just think it should have been built a distance away from the main mosque. It's detracting from the whole reason as to why the pilgrims are there in the first place.

And on the subject of the House of Saud practising this architectual and historical genocide by demolishing places of cultural significance, I really, really don't agree with it. These sites are important to humanity and shouldn't be torn down just to put a few more dollars in the pockets of the Saudi royal family and Paris Hilton.

I'm sorry if this has offended anyone.

Muslims dont go there to see the mosques "greatness". Altough it may be beautiful, its just an emotional argument that the mosque will no longer dominate the "skyline" when coming to Mekka. Mosques started as simple places to live, it started as a place where to offer people a home. I think that it is way more important to make the city more functional and safe for all the people going there for pilgrimage, than to preserve the view towards the mosque.
Though i disagree to build a fivestar hotel, but thats another issue.

Also it should be noted, that its custom in islam not to let old things hinder new improvements.

^^ I agree with you :okay: (except that I agree with building 3,4 & 5 stars hotels near the holy mosque to satisfy demands of many different standards of people).

its right next to the main mosque in mecca and they demolished a vast chunk of the ancient town to build it.

consider this too... people walk from all over the world to mecca on pilgrimage, these guys will walk over the sahara. you then have a bunch of rich guys who stay in a luxury hotel next to it... sort of defeats the purpose of the whole thing which is about sacrifice for god. the whole point of it is an expression of a devotion to god, attaing a higher social standing during it or through it is dishonourable according to islamic texts.

if anyone wants to read more on this development of mecca unesco has an excellent report. youll see that all the house of saud wants is to make money and destroy the religious shrines of anything they think is blasphemous including all the shia ones in the country. this involves demolishing many old houses, such as where this nephew or that wife of mohammed lived.

the building itself is a loathsome stalinist lump, which is quite appropiate when you consider there's only two countries in the world that have no parliament at all. saudi arabia, and burma. the architecture perfectly fits the mind boggingly corrupt house of saud.

Some people should know that Mecca is a holy place, not a historic site. People go there to pray, not for site seeing. If you want history, go to Egypt and you'll find 2200 years old pyrmids instead of crying over 220 years castle!

And for those who think that it is wrong to build anything taller than the holy mosque, please tell us where was that mentioned in the Quran. Also please provide an alternative solution to host the millions for pilgrims every year!
It is so easy to condemn, yet so hard to creat!

I truely believe that the same people who now bash the Saudi government for building those skyscrapers would have bashed the government if it had not built it!

Finally, this subject has been discussed enough already. And the skyscrapers are rising. So it's time to move on...

DreaM1981,

Where are you originally from? And can you confirm if the construction of the hotel tower started or not? the thread still says that the tower is 'proposed'.

have not you guys noticed something? thread has been changed to be "MECCA ABRAJ AL-BAIT 577M (PROPOSED).

lol@proposed... the project is almost finished :lol:

Name should be changed to be "Mecca: Abraj Al-Bait 577M (Part 2) U/C". :)

thats one of the ugliest scrapers of the last years... :ohno: and its a shame that they build it so close to the kaaba!

lol Riyadhi, I replied at same time when you was replying and that is why I didn't see your second reply.

Yes hotel construction started 2 months ago and there are many pictures I already posted 2 weeks ago.

http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=334299&page=21

mecca is a historic place BECAUSE its a holy site, its also a historical place because its old. here are some of the holy shrines that the saudi govt is demolishing right NOW

http://www.savethehijaz.org/

The Washington-based Gulf Institute estimates that 95 per cent of millennium-old buildings have been demolished in the past two decades.

http://www.savethehijaz.org/img/makkah-aerial.jpg

^^ I would like to say the following:

1- If you disagree with existance of King's palace in same location of Qubais Masjed, I can tell you that this palace will be demolished soon and transfered somewhere else.

2- If you disagree with existance of hilton makkah in same location of Abu bakr house (which am not sure of it), I can tell you that it will be wiped soon since it will be the main enterance of Jabal Umar to the haram.

3- If you disagree with existance of public toilets in same location of Sayeddah Khadijah house (which am not sure of it too), I can tell you that next plans after extension of haram (Al-Shamiyya side) the later extension will be in Ghazza side which include the public toilets.

4- If you disagree with existance of one of doors of haram in location of Dar al arqam school, I can tell you "do you disagree with demolishing any school to increase the area of haram and to be one of main gates? If yes then NO COMMENT"

Now I can say, not only the saudi government demolished all of these sites and if you want to make sure of it, please read the history before even Al-Saoud leads Saudi arabia... You will find that many many islamic religious leaders made such steps to extend the capacity of haram so whom are you blaming exactly?

No one anwered me and still you guys are argueing!! would anyone accept it if Saudi provides 10,000 Hajj visa only yearly?

Anyway, as Riyadhi said.... It is the time to move on and discuss the project not historical stuff.

the point is the kings palace was built on a historic site which is now demolished. that its moved elsewhere is now irrelevant. removing the hilton also does not restore the lost historic building that stood on this site. likewise, public toilets too saw something demolished. its not what stands there now, its what they have replaced thats the problem.
coming next, why the demolition of st augustines abbey by henry the 8th and turning it into a royal palace was ok because the royal palace was eventually pulled down.

http://www.savethehijaz.org/img/makkah-aerial.jpg


Wow I never knew it was so crowded in that area.

why is it now Proposed? i've thought it is already UC

gothicform:

If u never demolish/replace historic buildings you will eventually end up with no place for developement whatsoever.

In my opinion, a building is just a building no matter what building it is. I mean, they are just symbolic, its not the buildings that are important but in this case for example what has happened there, that can be preserved in other ways.

Of course it is good to preserve as much as possible, so that people can experience them, but maybe its not always possible. You have to have a balance. And sooner or later everything will get replaced/improved. All buildings are transient.

the point is the kings palace was built on a historic site which is now demolished. that its moved elsewhere is now irrelevant. removing the hilton also does not restore the lost historic building that stood on this site. likewise, public toilets too saw something demolished. its not what stands there now, its what they have replaced thats the problem.
coming next, why the demolition of st augustines abbey by henry the 8th and turning it into a royal palace was ok because the royal palace was eventually pulled down.

I will not repeat myself or go into useless arguement so just we better move on and keep our comments only about the project and progress :bash:

why is it now Proposed? i've thought it is already UC

I think the title needs to be changed.

Do you really think people in Makkah need a clock to look up prayer times? :lol:

Because of the way the valley is shaped, in most liklihood if you can see that clock, you'll hear the call to prayer from the Holy Mosque itself. And even if you don't, you'll hear it from some other mosque nearby. :)

Prayer calls don't really give you that much time to prepare, they usually come just a few minutes before the actual prayer starts. This is more helpful.

mecca is a historic place BECAUSE its a holy site, its also a historical place because its old. here are some of the holy shrines that the saudi govt is demolishing right NOW

http://www.savethehijaz.org/



http://www.savethehijaz.org/img/makkah-aerial.jpg

Whats your point, these are all regular people houses. Your not supposed to be worshipping anything but god in islam anyways, not even the prophet.

You guys complaining about stuff like a 220 year old castle being demolished. What gave the people 220 years ago anymore right to build at that site than people now. Things ere built back then, to meet the demands of that time, and things are built now for todays demand. Makkah has seen exponential growth in modern times regarding the number of pilgrims. What was perfectly fine to have even 50 years ago isn't feasable any longer. You wentforma situation where a couple of thousands pilgrims come ever year to several million and still increasing fast. Due to the advent of things such as planes, and due to the increase in the general worlds financial well being, more people than ever can attempt the pilgrimage. These are just modern world realities that you have to adapt to. Nobody crosses the sahara on foot anymore to go the hajj.

Whats your point, these are all regular people houses. Your not supposed to be worshipping anything but god in islam anyways, not even the prophet.

You guys complaining about stuff like a 220 year old castle being demolished. What gave the people 220 years ago anymore right to build at that site than people now. Things ere built back then, to meet the demands of that time, and things are built now for todays demand. Makkah has seen exponential growth in modern times regarding the number of pilgrims. What was perfectly fine to have even 50 years ago isn't feasable any longer. You wentforma situation where a couple of thousands pilgrims come ever year to several million and still increasing fast. Due to the advent of things such as planes, and due to the increase in the general worlds financial well being, more people than ever can attempt the pilgrimage. These are just modern world realities that you have to adapt to. Nobody crosses the sahara on foot anymore to go the hajj.

I second that, especially the first two sentences

Prayer calls don't really give you that much time to prepare, they usually come just a few minutes before the actual prayer starts. This is more helpful.

That's why there are two calls per prayer. :)

abu bakr was the first ruler after mohammed and the man responsible for preserving the quran in the precise written form it still continues in today. the house was 1400 years old when it was demolished. how is a hilton hotel there rather than any other site in the city good. how is the existence of the historic building NOT worshipping god?
sayidda khadija was one of the prophets daughters. her mother was the first person to convert to islam. out of everywhere you could build toilets you pick this 1400 year old building.

Your not supposed to be worshipping anything but god in islam anyways, not even the prophet.

thatll be news to the shia then who celebrate people and places too.

building tlal in a cramped city is important. no one is saying dont build tall, they are all saying "why demolish the historic core of the city to build a luxury hotel?" retain the historic core, build the new stuff a bit out from it, if youre worried about people getting from a-b then just build an underground metro system.

for what's it worth, i'm re-posting 2 of my posts from the Saudi forums for the same building(s).


....you have to understand the logistics of Makkah. If you have been there (and see the area and not just the mosque) you will realize that the holy mosque is surrounded by mountains. That's how it always was. Buildings, etc were built on the sides of the mountains and you should know that there are limitations to that. So, in recent years, some of the mountains have been flattened to make taller buildings. Still, that is a very difficult process. Think about it, that whole area is very dense so it's not easy to just blast away.

Therefore, the real estate prices are very high and the developers (any developer but just the government) have to build high to make up for the costs associated with acquiring land and construction. It might seem really simple but building near the haram is very costly...just think about the insurance/liability in case of accidents.

Most people are against limiting the number of pilgrims coming to Makkah. Do you think it's really possible to accomodate people without building high? Also, have you seen the deplorable conditions of most of the hotels around the Haram? They're in extremely bad shape. In some cases there's a single bathroom for an entire floor of people. Why would anyone want that to continue? I feel like, if there is more and more development...ultimately the competition will start to bring the prices down a bit (maybe not that much) more people will be able afford livable conditions when they visit the holy mosque. Maybe you're a young man....think about your parents...if you brought them to Makkah...would you want them to stay in one of those crumbling buildings? What about the older people who are really frail? What's so bad if they stay close to the Haram? Anyway, there are soo many arguments as to why this building isn't the evil everyone is making it out to be.

I'm getting tired of defending this....please go for yourself...see how things are there for yourselves..and decide if we need new projects and new developments there.

There is also a risk with keeping these structures around, which is why the government destroys/demolishes them. Just think about what you said. You felt like crying when you heard/saw that some of these structures are being destroyed. That's exactly the problem. People get too attached to these structures where mere humans lived. After a while people (or even now if they were allowed to) people would start glorifying these sites as something associated with God even though that is not the case.

For this very reason, Islam discourages idols and similar type of objects as this, in the past, has led to idol worship. Think about this: A man finds/makes a little statue. He's very excited and starts heading over to his friend's place to show him. On the way, some incident occurs but he survives. He starts thinking...oh wow..the idol is good luck..it protected me...and then he tells his kids...and once he passes away...his kids semi-worship it as something that saved his father..and..so on...that's how it starts..

If we leave these structures around (which I have nothing against personally..I'm just explaining why the government takes steps against them) we run the risk that people may get too attached to them (which you can see happen to yourself) and in a few generations people may start signifying those sites as holy and worship the remnants. This has happened over the centuries..and still does....especially in India/Pakistan/Bangladesh. Mere mortals are turned into God or God's special people and people sit around and worship them....ask them for favors, etc.

So in the end we have to decide...what's more important...to follow God's word and destroy what could potentially lead people to follow the wrong path and associate structures with God...or leave them for sentimental reasons..

After seeing the new rendering with the clock, I think the name of the building should be...........


BIG BIN.

This thread needs to return to its topic now please.

Yeah build a commercial center next to religious and cultural center of the muslim world FUCKING GENIOUS! NOT!

^^ then one of admin should change the title of the thread to add (PART 2) and (U/C) instead of proposed :lol:

Any photos of the old houses?

LOL

thats the funniest post ever, gothicforms the guy who does the banning on this forum, dont think hes gonna ban himself... you fool.

If he is one of people who ban here (moderator) and he argues that much about this project and repeating himself then bye bye skyscraperforum :lol:

^^ He is one of the Administrators

Rather ugly in my opinion. The original was better, but even then its a too big and bulky.

Any new updates??????

I got new information. Maybe some of you know it and others don't.

Did you guys know that there will be a railway station connected to this project?

Anyway It is a fact. Railway station will be connected to it inshallah (god willing) :)

^^ DreaM1981, what do you mean by railway station? Is this the railway connecting Makkah to the other cities or is this a local train station..like for a mass transit within the city? Will this station be underground?

as for me this mecca looks like a big railway station :D