i was in malaysia last summer. i love the places and the people, but why is KL so dirty? i see people toss their waste so nonchalantly and the poor streetcleaners has to clean up after them. the rivers in the middle of KL were brown in colour, and full of rubbish. despite the massive development, malaysians seem to have little regard for the environment and cleanliness. i never saw anyone recycled anything either. i was saddened by this. the country is lovely, but the people could not care less to keep it clean.

Well I didn't do it

Confession...I used to when i was a little child..disposing rubbish into mangrove areas beside my house, thats because the rubbish trucks did not do their job well because they only came rarely in a month :sleepy: but not anymore and i realise that action could harm the environment...being influenced by nature books, pics of nature, geography subject, lessons from other countries, and Karam Singh Walia...

Sad. :(

first of all, i apologize for your dissatisfaction on what we had done to our city.but, we are really working on it. actually as a fact, if we are talking about cleanliness KL is still much better that european city,Dublin for example because i've been there.

hmmmm...i always get the thinking that KL is very, very clean.

Kl is not super perfect and spotless but gotta say much better than American cities!!!

Kl is not super perfect and spotless but gotta say much better than American cities!!!
well actually with the exception of Chicago...downtown area is super clean but can't say the same for the burbs..

here we have first world structure and facility, but sad we have alot thrid world mentality. Welcome to Malaysia...

Third-world mentality, yeah that is precisely what we have in Malaysia. I've seen people throw fruit peels, plastic bags and other garbage out of their cars on Malaysian highways as if the whole countryside is just one big garbage dump. Excessive black smokes and dirty buses are abound in many Malaysian towns and cities. Take a look at storm drains and there are often garbage and construction materials inside. Bad hygiene, poor maintenance, dirty habits, almost zero recycling; yeah that's what we Malaysians are and I think the time for change is overdue.

Also, stop comparing Malaysia to European or American cities. These cities don't really have city workers cleaning the streets all the time as labour costs are steep there. In Malaysia, seeing a lowly-paid sweeper on streets is a norm but yet we still build such filth. We already have a shining example down south, Singapore, to live our standards to, and comparing ourselves to other dirty cities is simply lowering our standards. You want MALAYSIA BOLEH? Start with loving our country first.

And it doesn't help that it's really hard in some places to find a proper rubbish bin. And when you do find one, its filled to the brim.

uh-huh....well wat else is new? I'm bored silly with this already

Thanks for pointing that out Dodi :okay:

I hope that the level of cleanliness here doesn't spoil your holiday. :(


Anyway there is this one thing I would like to clarify - brown rivers. The brown colour of the river is the natural colour of the river. Think Amazon and the Yangtze. It is the same situation. However about the rubbish in the river....well....that is the doing of KLites unfortunately :(

GreyX > Yea......it is not entirely spotless but no doubt KL is cleaner than many cities around the world ;)

but we all know KL is definately improving. I do think, KL is cleaner than some US cities like Oakland, CA or maybe even some parts of New York!

Kl is not super perfect and spotless but gotta say much better than American cities!!!

Yes! they just like to maintain cleaness in other place except downtown :bash:

Depends on the area though and also perceptions. I'm sure we heard of conflicting accounts from different friends who visited other cities. Like some friends said London and Shanghai are dirty while others said they are clean. A Taiwanese friend said KL is clean.
To me KL streets are pretty fine, well in many areas I would say thanks to the cleaners while streets like Jalan Sultan Ismail, Jalan PRamlee and KLCC..people generally who walk around those areas are more civic minded I guess?

^^ agree with all of u, and dodi, this is not something new. the govt. spent millions upon millions to uplift the cleanliness of our cities, but it's still ineffective. why ? because of our cavemen like mentality, like what vince's pointed out. unless ppl here can get rid of this mentality, and start appreciating / maintaining the infrastructures were have, we won't be seeing much improvements.

maybe we should adopt the system practiced in S'pore and HK by summoning compulsive offenders to a certain hours of public service ie. cleaning up the mess they left behind - so let these ppl get a taste of what it feels like to be a road sweeper !!

^^ Agree. I am all for the punishment to fit the bill. Get these idiots :bash: to do a certain period of public service as punishment.

there are other Malaysian cities which i thought clean like Kuching...maybe cleaner than KL right?

but anyhow...the enforcement alone i think is not the right way to achieve long term cleanliness habit among the people...this understanding should comes from their heart...that's why cleanliness should be inculcated from young age..

like a malay proverb 'melentur buluh biarlah dari rebungnya' - To bend a bamboo, start when it's still a shoot

Will fining (charging) and school community service work? :)

the dirtyness aside, the rivers were cemented to look like massive drains. who here the brains behind this? and i notice malaysians tend to prefer arab-esque architecture in their newer buildings especially in putrajaya. i didnt get a malaysian-feel while i was there. i wouldve like to see more malaysia and not cheap arab imitations. otherwise, even if you guys do not wish to go traditional, how about something more cleaner, crisper and more modern? the architect of KLIA captured it perfectly but i didnt see it anywhere else in the country. im not talking about the sultan abdul samad building or its contemporaries, which i think are stunning. i did have a great time in malaysia, but i thought i'd toss my 2 pence in.

^^ yes !!! kudos to dodi ... KLIA is very representative of Malaysia..and where's better to have such masterpiece than the main gateway to this country. putrajaya is a big waste of taxpayers' money !!! not just that...the maintenance is crap !! the last time i was there. the train terminal was very hagard looking and messy. Vandalised bus stops, public phones .... was a common sight.

putrajaya is a big waste of taxpayers' money !!!

I wonder if any Americans living in the 19th century would complain their government of building White House and Capital Hill...but Americans dont get angry i just want to say my opinion... :sleepy: :sleepy:

the dirtyness aside, the rivers were cemented to look like massive drains. who here the brains behind this? and i notice malaysians tend to prefer arab-esque architecture in their newer buildings especially in putrajaya. i didnt get a malaysian-feel while i was there. i wouldve like to see more malaysia and not cheap arab imitations. otherwise, even if you guys do not wish to go traditional, how about something more cleaner, crisper and more modern? the architect of KLIA captured it perfectly but i didnt see it anywhere else in the country. im not talking about the sultan abdul samad building or its contemporaries, which i think are stunning. i did have a great time in malaysia, but i thought i'd toss my 2 pence in.

About the rivers, looking like big drains. I think the intention of that was to control flooding. Well, I am not so sure, anybody knows why Malaysians cemented the rivers?

Depends on the area though and also perceptions. I'm sure we heard of conflicting accounts from different friends who visited other cities. Like some friends said London and Shanghai are dirty while others said they are clean. A Taiwanese friend said KL is clean.
To me KL streets are pretty fine, well in many areas I would say thanks to the cleaners while streets like Jalan Sultan Ismail, Jalan PRamlee and KLCC..people generally who walk around those areas are more civic minded I guess?

Yea, i think it depends which area of KL you're in.

The whole of KL is generally clean with the exception of places like Pudu and Masjid Jamek area! I hate those areas. It's an eyesore!

^^ yes !!! kudos to dodi ... KLIA is very representative of Malaysia..and where's better to have such masterpiece than the main gateway to this country. putrajaya is a big waste of taxpayers' money !!! not just that...the maintenance is crap !! the last time i was there. the train terminal was very hagard looking and messy. Vandalised bus stops, public phones .... was a common sight.

I wouldn't say it's a waste of tax payers money. It's a national pride and give it some time for it to be fully utilised. The vandalism and maintenance again come back to the Malaysian mentality. Sigh.

Well, what do u expect .. Malaysia still a third world country ... so Malaysia is not perfect ... some new part of KL is quite clean such as the KLCC and Bukit Bintang area but some older part of KL is dirty and chaotic.

Well, what do u expect .. Malaysia still a third world country ... so Malaysia is not perfect ... some new part of KL is quite clean such as the KLCC and Bukit Bintang area but some older part of KL is dirty and chaotic.
dude, malaysia is a developing nation not 3rd world...even '1st' world or developed nations have doirty areas...c'mmon let's be more realistic. I could speak for Miami...affluent neighbourhoods are spotless but the burbs are quite dirty!

^^ yes !!! kudos to dodi ... KLIA is very representative of Malaysia..and where's better to have such masterpiece than the main gateway to this country. putrajaya is a big waste of taxpayers' money !!! not just that...the maintenance is crap !! the last time i was there. the train terminal was very hagard looking and messy. Vandalised bus stops, public phones .... was a common sight.
Putrajaya is not a waste...as a matter of fact I think it is is brialliant..the lavish spending however is somethin to gasp about, nevertheless...I's say kudos! but gotta agree with you with some Malaysians who lack civic conscious and appreciation to beauty and cleanliness...sad... :bash: stringest laws need to be imposed on dem slackers! :rant:

I do agree with leeigh though.nowdays if we not think 5 steps ahead,we'll never progress.I think that Putrajaya is a good investment as it already draws attention,not only in tourism sector but also boast our economy.Plus,show appreciation to the nature.

Well, what do u expect .. Malaysia still a third world country ... so Malaysia is not perfect ... some new part of KL is quite clean such as the KLCC and Bukit Bintang area but some older part of KL is dirty and chaotic.

true. even developed countries have 'dirty' cities. :)

:yes:..except JApan

Malaysia 3rd world country?Mcm menghina or insult

sorry la, guys..didn't mean to be brunt. when i said putrajaya a waste of nation's coffers - it's meant to aim the maintainence culture of ppl in the country's high office. yes la..the whole concept of putrajaya is very impressive. at a macro scale, looks nice and sparkling - just like a newly polished car...but when u go upclose, u can see that the whole place is starting to rot and fester !! ppl are treating the place like there's no law - yellowlane parking is rampant - sic, even the gomen 's doing it..and they're talking abt leadership by example - blind leading the blinds ler :P public phones and bus stops are vandalised - so far, that place is made up mostly of civil servants and their families mar...so if these ppl in the gomen behave like cavemen, then they should not point their fingers at the public for not upkeeping public infrastructures properly. so with all these 'hidden' cost chipped in ... u tell me la...is it not a waste of taxpayers' money leh??? just my 2 cents worth ;)

ooo......I can't believe all ths thing already happen there bcoz the last time i been there ,it was extremely beautiful. i thinks when it come to this matter,we should blame to our ppl lah.Here in japan,their civic minded/concious are really high.they really love thier country and always keep everything clean.In this case,you guys think malaysian really love malaysia....:)

the dirtyness aside, the rivers were cemented to look like massive drains. who here the brains behind this?

The reason behind this hideous idea is flood control. The original embankments always silt and collaps into the river. And it is not wide enough. Furthermore the river is deepened.

When there is no rain, the river looks like a huge drain. But you should see it when it rains (even when just a little). I bet you won't believe the change. Sometimes the water even overflowed. That is why our cityhall placed flood warning detectors along that stretch of the rivers.




and i notice malaysians tend to prefer arab-esque architecture in their newer buildings especially in putrajaya. i didnt get a malaysian-feel while i was there. i wouldve like to see more malaysia and not cheap arab imitations. otherwise, even if you guys do not wish to go traditional, how about something more cleaner, crisper and more modern? the architect of KLIA captured it perfectly but i didnt see it anywhere else in the country. im not talking about the sultan abdul samad building or its contemporaries, which i think are stunning. i did have a great time in malaysia, but i thought i'd toss my 2 pence in.


Yes......many buildings nowdays are getting more and more of Arab treatment but most of them only on mosques. :yes:

Many buildings in Putrajaya (prominent ones like the Palace of Justice and the PM's office - Putra Perdana) are actually more of Sultan Abdul Samad bldg's kind of immitation rather than Arab. Those are actually ecclectic styling which fusions between the west, middle east and the east. And if you study Malaysian architecture history, eccletism plays a major role ;)

In contrary to popular beliefs, onion domes and its pinnacles are actually Mohgul of India and not the Arabs. The symmetry of the buildings in Putrajaya are mainly European renaissance classical. And of course the floral patterns are of SEA origin ;)

putrajaya is a big waste of taxpayers' money !!! not just that...the maintenance is crap !! the last time i was there. the train terminal was very hagard looking and messy. Vandalised bus stops, public phones .... was a common sight.


Are you really sure about this? I go to Putrajaya at least a few dozen times every year and I do not see such things. Perhaps you have to elaborate. :)

The issue of vandalism and crime in Putrajaya did land on media reports...stolen metal barriers on highways, vandalised cars just close to CCTV in a parking area are all been reported before...

I wonder if any Americans living in the 19th century would complain their government of building White House and Capital Hill...but Americans dont get angry i just want to say my opinion... :sleepy: :sleepy:
can you be more specific? :weird:

The issue of vandalism and crime in Putrajaya did land on media reports...stolen metal barriers on highways, vandalised cars just close to CCTV in a parking area are all been reported before...
o c'mon, please don't tell me you don't see this in NYC? does it make NYC any smaller? :)

Are you really sure about this? I go to Putrajaya at least a few dozen times every year and I do not see such things. Perhaps you have to elaborate. :)

seeing is believing sze, i've seen these happening with my very own eyes. kindda dissapointing that these things happen in an area housing a majority of civil servants. i've seen ppl throwing rubbish off a public bus in putrajaya, i've seen gomen officers driving like lunatics at the heart of the nation's admin centre. I've seen ppl breaking every single traffic rules there. There was once I drove down to 7-11 nearby the main wet market in Putrajaya - there i saw a small band of self proclaimed motor gang or putrajaya squating on the pavement off the shoplots - yapping away while smoking and litterring the surrounding areas with cigarette buds, soft drink's cans, snack's wrappers... god!! I should've brought along my camera !! :bash:

seeing is believing sze, i've seen these happening with my very own eyes. kindda dissapointing that these things happen in an area housing a majority of civil servants. i've seen ppl throwing rubbish off a public bus in putrajaya, i've seen gomen officers driving like lunatics at the heart of the nation's admin centre. I've seen ppl breaking every single traffic rules there. There was once I drove down to 7-11 nearby the main wet market in Putrajaya - there i saw a small band of self proclaimed motor gang or putrajaya squating on the pavement off the shoplots - yapping away while smoking and litterring the surrounding areas with cigarette buds, soft drink's cans, snack's wrappers... god!! I should've brought along my camera !! :bash:
we all know better than that, aen... what's the point of hidding that to our concious?? :evil: :)

i've seen ppl throwing rubbish off a public bus in putrajaya


Not to question your honesty but somehow I remember that all the buses in Putrajaya are those IVECO and Isuzu ones that windows are fixed close. So I dun think anyone could throw rubbish out of the windows as they couldn't be opened. :yes:

I could be wrong if there are other types of buses but thru my observation, there aren't any of such buses ;)

I personally have seen rubbish being thrown on the floor by people there but such things do happened everywhere. Not that Putrajaya doesn't have such problem but your eyewitness accounts make the city seems like a cowboy town. However I do think that most Malaysians lacked civic-mindedness and that is very bad :(

It is indeed a sad fact that littering is still prevalent in the city but there are a lot of foreigners in the city mind you whom are also litter bugs!!

It is even more sad to see parents littering or children doing that without being taught otherwise by their parents there and then ..... children are conditioned to think it is ok to litter so..... towards vision 2020, should not be just in terms of economy, technology and achievement in sports / science but civic mindedness should also be addressed. You hear the courtesy drive on light and easy radio? or what about the smile campaign ... service with a smile..... how do they know / gauge how effective their effort has been?

can you be more specific? :weird:

OK, i am just saying that we should not complain Putrajaya is a waste of taxpayers' money...think big...tourism will get a boost

Washington is one of the famous cities in the world and Malasian government do want to see Putrajaya in the same league as Washington, Canberra, Brasilia and etc....bla,bla,bla

o c'mon, please don't tell me you don't see this in NYC? does it make NYC any smaller? :)

Just like what our current PM said about Malaysian mentality...'First class facilities, Third world mentality'

OK, i am just saying that we should not complain Putrajaya is a waste of taxpayers' money...think big...tourism will get a boost

Washington is one of the famous cities in the world and Malasian government do want to see Putrajaya in the same league as Washington, Canberra, Brasilia and etc....bla,bla,bla


Not just the tourism dollar that it would bring. Also that it lessen the congestion of KL. Remember the days when traffic jam usually starts at 4pm?

I'd rather go to Putrajaya to do immigration stuffs than Pusat Bandar Damansara as there are less congestion there and more parking. Furthermore the buildings there are much nicer and are people-friendlier. ;)

I think Putrajaya is a very promising development -- and ambitious, I should say. I personally think it's not a waste. I love the place. Though it may seem empty and/or slightly deserted sometimes, I like the way they put up the city. It's very well-planned and everything's manicured to the farthest extent.

Not to question your honesty but somehow I remember that all the buses in Putrajaya are those IVECO and Isuzu ones that windows are fixed close. So I dun think anyone could throw rubbish out of the windows as they couldn't be opened. :yes:

I could be wrong if there are other types of buses but thru my observation, there aren't any of such buses ;)

I personally have seen rubbish being thrown on the floor by people there but such things do happened everywhere. Not that Putrajaya doesn't have such problem but your eyewitness accounts make the city seems like a cowboy town. However I do think that most Malaysians lacked civic-mindedness and that is very bad :(


it's not a question of having fixed windows on these buses - and i did not mention abt windows when i ranted ;) plus the window is not the only place where rubbish can be thrown out right ? ;) though i salute your attentiveness ... i'm positive and i believe on what i saw. i have nothing against putrajaya mar....why would i want to fry something out as bad press. it's just a pity sight that i can't help voicing out for the love of my country. :)

It was the mentality that needs to be changed. I once witnessed some passengers in an outstation car throwing out tissue papers on the fast lane on Federal Highway in KL. I was right behind it so I flashed the lights and gave the car infront a honk. They looked back at me and they threw out more tissue papers. I was like... "what the..." So I gave them a really long honk.

I'm not saying that ppl from outstation have that mentality but then again, many ppl have this thoughts in their minds - This is not my place, so I'll throw whatever rubbish I want, I can park my car illegally 'coz the city hall cant find me. I'm sure some KLites do the same in other places, for example, they dont mind parking their vehicles illegally in PJ or Subang becoz they know MPPJ & MPSJ wont be able to track them down :ohno:

Because mentality is hard to change, we need law and order to force them to change, which at present is inadequate and unreliable authority.

it's not a question of having fixed windows on these buses - and i did not mention abt windows when i ranted ;) plus the window is not the only place where rubbish can be thrown out right ? ;) though i salute your attentiveness ... i'm positive and i believe on what i saw. i have nothing against putrajaya mar....why would i want to fry something out as bad press. it's just a pity sight that i can't help voicing out for the love of my country. :)


Okies cool! :okay: No worries......yea I am not accusing anyone of bad-mouthing Putrajay or what but seriously.....during my numerous visits there I've yet encountered such litterbugs. However I have once saw the Putrajaya police petrol smoking (with one hand out of the vehicle dangling a ciggratte) while on thier rounds.

Not that I am against anyone smoking or whatsoever but being a civil servant, at least do not do it in broad daylight. BTW I have a picture of that :ohno:

Every city has their clean and dirty areas but I think Kuala Lumpur is the 2nd cleanest major city in South East Asia next to Singapore.

Every city has their clean and dirty areas but I think Kuala Lumpur is the 2nd cleanest major city in South East Asia next to Singapore.

I hope what were you saying is true...but i think still the gap is huge right?

Dodi this is what we call `tidak apa` attitude ! :eek2:

Read history then you`ll find that Japan was also dirty and the air was terribly polluted when it was modernising into an industrial nation.

Malaysia is now at the transition . I`ve seen a lot of improvement in terms of cleanliness over the past few years and KL now is much cleaner than many Western cities ( even cleaner than Geneva in Switzerland ) .

O yes...attitude transition...

Dodi this is what we call `tidak apa` attitude ! :eek2:

Read history then you`ll find that Japan was also dirty and the air was terribly polluted when it was modernising into an industrial nation.

Malaysia is now at the transition . I`ve seen a lot of improvement in terms of cleanliness over the past few years and KL now is much cleaner than many Western cities ( even cleaner than Geneva in Switzerland ) .

The air is getting dirtier though. KL used to have many many clear days, but that is not true anymore. More Protons on the road anyone?

I hope what were you saying is true...but i think still the gap is huge right?

Well compare it with other ASEAN cities like Bangkok, Manila or Jakarta. There's a big difference

Are you really sure about this? I go to Putrajaya at least a few dozen times every year and I do not see such things. Perhaps you have to elaborate. :)

I did the Discover Putrajaya tour last week, RM25 from KL Sentral, I didn't see any vandalism, just a few work in progress buildings. I was very impressed, got about 2 hours of video.

BTW did you know that there is a monorail running under the bridge, the one near the mosque, not operational yet.

KL is getting cleaner believe me.

Thrash Sucks.

Some people also litter because they think it makes them look cool.
I do not know if any of you guys have met people like that.