Brickell's Villa Magna gets name change, more focus on commercial

By Eric Kalis
The focus of the bayfront Villa Magna project has shifted yet again, this time from residential and hotel components to a major mixed-use development that uses restaurants and retail to draw interest in other project elements.
The architect for a group of Spanish investors who partnered with developer Tibor Hollo to plan the luxury residential and hotel project Villa Magna unveiled modified plans to a City of Miami board last week — without Mr. Hollo — for the Brickell Bay Drive site and a neighboring property.
Whether Mr. Hollo is still involved in the project, which is no longer called Villa Magna, or the owner of the property is unclear. Phone calls to Mr. Hollo were not returned by press time.
The 1201 Brickell Bay Drive property would still have 326 luxury condominiums, said Suria Yaffar, principal at architectural firm Zyscovich, which is the local architect for both the former Villa Magna site and nearby 1390 Brickell Bay Drive. Spanish architect Segui and Partners is the lead architect for both projects.
Revised plans for 1201 Brickell Bay Drive call for an increase of hotel suites from 198 to 216, Ms. Yaffar said, and adding 93,000 square feet of commercial space and 18,000 of bayfront restaurant space. The 1390 Brickell Bay Drive project is to include 88 condos, 135,000 square feet of office space and 37,000 square feet of ground-floor retail, she said.
Spanish majority investors Grupo Pedro Iglesias, which bought the 1390 Brickell Bay Drive property for $35 million in January, is behind the shift. The change in strategy appealed to the city's Urban Development Review Board, Ms. Yaffar said, which voted 4-0 in favor of amending the major use special permits for both properties. The city's zoning and planning advisory board will eventually make recommendations to city commissioners, who will vote on the amendments.
"The board was pleased to see that we increased the retail space and added an office component," she said.
Attempts failed to contact principals from Grupo Pedro Iglesias.

Now it can be said

VILLA MAGNA IS DEAD

fairweatherfriend YOU WERE RIGHT

RX was wrong too bad he's not around to buy you that beer

Dont worry chuck will buy it for you, he always insisted it was clearly visible in his so called 2012 dreams

I guess since it is being renamed and completely transfigured, it really is dead as in "Death and Transfiguration" by Richard Strauss. But I am very happy with these two separate projects being taller than original specifications, both being over 500 feet with 1201 Brickell Bay possibly over 700 feet tall. This warrants the dancing banana, which means I have to be feeling good to use this thing. :banana:

Better idea: let taller and fairweather go out and enjoy a bitter beer together. They deserve one another.

Better idea: let taller and fairweather go out and enjoy a bitter beer together. They deserve one another.

Either way, here's to a better looking skyline overall! :cheers1: :banana:

Better idea: let taller and fairweather go out and enjoy a bitter beer together. They deserve one another.

why the hostility Dale I'm just giving credit to the guy who called it a year early and was castigated by everyone for saying so. At the time I had no idea who was right but regardless, I'm not your enemy man. :cheers:

Psh, nvm.

I have no doubt though that Tibor could have pulled off Villa Magna had he really wanted to. I have a feeling he did something to help ensure the future of One Bayfront Plaza. I think someone making him an offer he couldn't refuse is exactly what happened, and I think these two separate buildings (both taller than original specifications) that we could be getting from these Spanish developers are a huge improvement esthetically with where they will be placed in the skyline. :) :cheers:

why the hostility Dale I'm just giving credit to the guy who called it a year early and was castigated by everyone for saying so. At the time I had no idea who was right but regardless, I'm not your enemy man. :cheers:

Well, sounds like the best of both worlds. Sounds as if the new ownership means the crazy Russians are gone (that was fairweather's issue), and also that we get an even bigger and better project. :cheers:

Would love to see a rendering when one is available!!!

Well, sounds like the best of both worlds. Sounds as if the new ownership means the crazy Russians are gone (that was fairweather's issue), and also that we get an even bigger and better project. :cheers:

I think we all came out winners with this move! It is a very exciting development! Here's to the new Miami that's coming. :cheers: Again, more evidence of powerful developers with a broader vision moving forward in spite of what the market is doing RIGHT NOW! A toast to the future gentlemen! :cheers:

Some seriously bad sports out there! Hey, whatever did become of RX? Does anyone know at this point whether Tibor still has a piece of this and whether he will remain involved as this thing moves forward? I really wish someone out there could tell me if, and if so, how badly Tibor's former partners were burned on this.

Anyway, now I can root for all of you and the success of the project. Does it have a name at this point?

Some seriously bad sports out there! Hey, whatever did become of RX? Does anyone know at this point whether Tibor still has a piece of this and whether he will remain involved as this thing moves forward? I really wish someone out there could tell me if, and if so, how badly Tibor's former partners were burned on this.

Anyway, now I can root for all of you and the success of the project. Does it have a name at this point?

What are you babbling about ? From all indications it's getting built and is going to be bigger than the original.

What are you babbling about ? From all indications it's getting built and is going to be bigger than the original.

My, aren't we a bit snappy! And no, "it" is not going to be built. "It," or "Villa Magna," crapped out and is being replaced by another, totally different project......

That's more or less what I'm babbling about.

My, aren't we a bit snappy! And no, "it" is not going to be built. "It," or "Villa Magna," crapped out and is being replaced by another, totally different project......

That's more or less what I'm babbling about.

That's just spin from a guy who can't afford to pay for his own beer.

Guys, I think you need to scroll up and pay attention to some of my postings for a change. I'll buy you all beers because now we all have reason to celebrate, but Fairweatherfriend, I don't think Villa Magna "crapped out!" I think a much sweeter deal presented itself!

I think those of you who said Villa Magna would not be built over a year ago were saying it based on the fact that the real estate market bubble had burst, while those like Chuck and myself being among the more senior members of the forum were saying it would be built based on our years of living in South Florida (23 for me) and knowing what Tibor Hollo is capable of.

I think the man pulled a rabbit out of a hat. Rather than 2 residential towers at 574 feet tall, we are now likely to see a mixed-used (residential, retail, office) tower, more appropriate I think for the Brickell area, directly on the waterfront around 700 feet tall and another dead project that was originally specified at 478 feet tall that will now be over 500 feet tall. Whether this one larger tower gets a new name or not, I think Villa Magna is an almost perfect name for a large mixed-used project, a city within a city. If the new owners chose to still call it Villa Magna, then it didn't really die. It just got a makeover.

Now Tibor can focus virtually all of his attention on One Bayfront Plaza and possibly see its completion before he dies even though he turned 80 this year!

I don't think anything will be on that site in less than 6 years. This new project has to start selling all over again. In 18 months the market in this area is going to be significantly worse and I don't see anyone building such towers any time in the near future regardless of the mixed use status. There are a lot of other office, hotels and retail locations recently completed or still under construction.

I think Capital (which i hope does go up) will be the last major start in a long time... maybe a project like Lofts 3 which holds a very different niche.

Eventually something will get built in that spot... just not anytime soon.

I don't think anything will be on that site in less than 6 years. This new project has to start selling all over again. In 18 months the market in this area is going to be significantly worse and I don't see anyone building such towers any time in the near future regardless of the mixed use status. There are a lot of other office, hotels and retail locations recently completed or still under construction.

I think Capital (which i hope does go up) will be the last major start in a long time... maybe a project like Lofts 3 which holds a very different niche.

Eventually something will get built in that spot... just not anytime soon.

You could be right, Dach. But you never know who might get behind any given project on any given day. As I said on a previous posting, these Spanish developers could even have a block of potential buyers they canvassed back in Spain before they made the decision to buy Villa Magna. :cheers:

I so enjoyed visiting this blog and checking up on the progress of the project and alienating those in in tuned to the specifics of the project. My guess is that there will be nothing to post within the next six months if we are lucky.

...

Is fairweatherfriend a nimby then ?

^^Do you and your neighbors intend to fight the new building now that it is going through approval process now (as I assume you did with the original Villa Magna), or do you like this one better?

Mileage Man:), our friend,
You just gave us a clue about our " Fairweather " Friend:lol: .
He really is a resident of the Jade condo tower attending the City of Miami public meetings protesting against the taller and more bulkier Villa magna Towers, and I'm getting this feeling he'll be there fighting the newest proposal for a one higher tower instead of two,
which I am now convinced Tibor Hollo is getting to his last leg of develping towers and turning it all over to his sons in the future. I still wish he started the original plans alot sooner, But lets hope he gets approved and builds this tower soon before it's too late.:cheers:

p.s. DALE:), our Orlando friend and friend of Miami, too.
Happy 3,500th Post:cheers::banana:^^^^^^ ,
I see I'm just a little late to let you know:),
But Congrats anyway, Onward to Orlando getting it's own forum soon:cheers: !!!

Guys, I think you need to scroll up and pay attention to some of my postings for a change. I'll buy you all beers because now we all have reason to celebrate, but Fairweatherfriend, I don't think Villa Magna "crapped out!" I think a much sweeter deal presented itself!

I think those of you who said Villa Magna would not be built over a year ago were saying it based on the fact that the real estate market bubble had burst, while those like Chuck and myself being among the more senior members of the forum were saying it would be built based on our years of living in South Florida (23 for me) and knowing what Tibor Hollo is capable of.

I think the man pulled a rabbit out of a hat. Rather than 2 residential towers at 574 feet tall, we are now likely to see a mixed-used (residential, retail, office) tower, more appropriate I think for the Brickell area, directly on the waterfront around 700 feet tall and another dead project that was originally specified at 478 feet tall that will now be over 500 feet tall. Whether this one larger tower gets a new name or not, I think Villa Magna is an almost perfect name for a large mixed-used project, a city within a city. If the new owners chose to still call it Villa Magna, then it didn't really die. It just got a makeover.

Now Tibor can focus virtually all of his attention on One Bayfront Plaza and possibly see its completion before he dies even though he turned 80 this year!


When is the cheerleading from Chuck, RX, and others like you going to start for this new project? I'm trying to remember how many times we heard that groundbreaking would be starting in 3 months or after Thanksgiving or "any time now". This is not meant as a personal attack because I don't know him from Adam, but I don't know how someone like Chuck can be taken seriously. At best, his unwavering optimism in the face of everything that was going on with the market makes him look foolish in my opinion. Oh, and your "it didn't really die, it just got a makeover" comment made me laugh out loud, thanks for that. Do you work for Tibor?

Cheerleading seems to anger you for some reason.

Thanks DALE:), my Orlando friend,
I needed to see your comment,
you made my day !!!:cheers:

Damn...what are we supposed to chat about now? And I am far from a nimby.

Damn...what are we supposed to chat about now? And I am far from a nimby.

I suppose we could talk about the coming bigger and better Villa Magna. Personally, I hope it blocks out the Sun.

I suppose we could talk about the coming bigger and better Villa Magna. Personally, I hope it blocks out the Sun.
^^^^^^
LOL DALE:), my Orlando friend,
you just made my day again:banana:,
Our " Fairweather:) " friend will never give up,
But, just think of it this way, He's kept this Villa Magna Thread alive for almost 2 years now, And without his " Nimby " views, it would be boring and gone , lol.:ohno::cheers:

NEWS FLASH
Heard a rumor that the sale to the Spanish folks is not a done deal......:banana:

Whatever happens to this site...........whether its 2010 or 2015............I hope its something truly signature that looks very impressive with its frontage on the Brickell skyline!

NEWS FLASH
Heard a rumor that the sale to the Spanish folks is not a done deal......:banana:

crotchety old nimby

When is the cheerleading from Chuck, RX, and others like you going to start for this new project? I'm trying to remember how many times we heard that groundbreaking would be starting in 3 months or after Thanksgiving or "any time now". This is not meant as a personal attack because I don't know him from Adam, but I don't know how someone like Chuck can be taken seriously. At best, his unwavering optimism in the face of everything that was going on with the market makes him look foolish in my opinion. Oh, and your "it didn't really die, it just got a makeover" comment made me laugh out loud, thanks for that. Do you work for Tibor?

I haven't been back to this thread in a while obviously. I thought it was dead.

No, I don't work for Tibor, and I'm glad you thought my comment was so funny. It's all in good fun, but I would like a better idea of what this project is going to be before I start cheerleading for it (at least specifications in height and stories).

Chuck and I are the same age. We are only 10 months apart, and we've been around the block a few times. We have a little better understanding of long-term investment and what people with money and power can do beyond some of the younger members of the forum.

As I've said before on other threads, what we've seen make it to construction thus far has been the result of developers exploiting the incredible market demand that was there in the beginning. Beginning of boom: Smaller developers/short-term investment/immediate return. What the market is doing right now does not mean something will not be built. As I've said before, it simply will not be built by these smaller developers who were looking to capitalize on the tremendous market demand that brought about the "condo boom."

Now, the boom was such that it has attracted the attention of more powerful developers. Second phase of boom: Bigger developers/long-term investment/future return. We are just now entering the second phase of the boom with many projects being taken over by more powerful developers, with a broader vision, who have the long-term investment in mind and who are investing in the future of Miami. Because of what the market is doing right now though is why many projects still moving forward are simply converting to mixed-used because that is what will make money the fastest in this market, and some of these developers have such money and power behind them that they don't have to be bothered with this preconstruction sale business that so many of you have come to think is so important. And who you think they are is only who they are on the surface. We have no way of knowing what billionaire might actually have hired them to do the job because he wants his place in this historic building boom that gave Miami the third biggest skyline in the U.S. in just a few short years. This is why I say we could still see almost anything at this point. I think at this point, it really has more to do with who wants to see it go up rather than what the market is doing RIGHT NOW.

They are not so much concerned with what the market is doing RIGHT NOW as they are with what the market will do in the future and what they envision Miami will become, but the younger guys don't seem to understand that. They have no concept.

Chuck is by no means as foolish as he may appear to you. We just happen to see things with a broader vision than someone apparently younger than we are. So on the contrary, somebody like you could seem pretty foolish to us, but I choose not to look at it that way, and I'm sure Chuck doesn't see it that way either since he is a father with grown children. :cheers:

I haven't been back to this thread in a while obviously. I thought it was dead.

No, I don't work for Tibor, and I'm glad you thought my comment was so funny. It's all in good fun, but I would like a better idea of what this project is going to be before I start cheerleading for it (at least specifications in height and stories).

Chuck and I are the same age. We are only 10 months apart, and we've been around the block a few times. We have a little better understanding of long-term investment and what people with money and power can do beyond some of the younger members of the forum.


Chuck is by no means as foolish as he may appear to you. We just happen to see things with a broader vision than someone apparently younger than we are. So on the contrary, somebody like you could seem pretty foolish to us, but I choose not to look at it that way, and I'm sure Chuck doesn't see it that way either since he is a father with grown children. :cheers:

Wow Quantum:),
my update 2008 World Almanac Book brother and friend,

what great words of wisdom:banana:,
thank you very much, and Yes , my birthday is coming up on Dec.10th:lol:,
Like you said in your most recent post here,
We are in the " Second Phase " of Our Greatest BOOM in Miami's 111th Anniversary !!!:cheers:
There will be more activity in Office Towers in the next 5 years as the Prime Rate will drop more early next year for more Office Developers to break ground on more taller tower projects top reach the 1,010 Foot Tower Height FAA:bash: approved areas !!!:)

p.s. as for Villa Magna,
okay maybe a little more od a delay,
But I still see a Tower rising here at Tibor Hollo's site , By him and taller in my Dreams of 2012 !!!

I'm going to be a " Prime Number " coming up on my birthday,
Can anyone guess what " Prime Number it is, ????. LOL.

Not for anything, but given an unlimited time horizon, an idiot could make the call that someday something big will be developed on the site. What and when will be a function of the market. Big developer, little developer....give me a break. It's about the math. Given the cost basis of the land, construction costs and market prices...doesn't add up. The project is not feasible.

i could give a crap how long either of you have been around the block. An old idiot is certainly no smarter than a youthful intellect.

Is it 53 Chuckster???

I hope you have a great birthday!

Big developer, little developer....give me a break. It's about the math. Given the cost basis of the land, construction costs and market prices...doesn't add up. The project is not feasible.

Well, maybe that's why we're going to get one BIG Villa Magna rather than two smaller ones. LOL!!! And there seems to be evidence all around of "big developers" moving forward in this market. Dave8721 is always posting stuff about them. What actually gets built remains to be seen, but they are there and they are in motion behind the scenes. I admire your youthful intellect, but apparently there are those who know things that you don't who are moving forward in this market. And I might be an old idiot, but at least I made it this far. There are those who thought I'd never make it past 40. :cheers:

at least I made it this far. There are those who thought I'd never make it past 40. :cheers:

Were you a wild one Quantum? :cheers:

Were you a wild one Quantum? :cheers:

No, I was a sheltered child and a late bloomer! I'm still reliving my repressed adolescence!:)

Actually, I have a medical condition that might have done me in years ago, but being the fighter and survivor that I am, it didn't! After staring down death, people like dude2006 and fairweatherfriend are major non-entities to me.

Does anyone know whether the project was ever sold to the Spaniards as rumored earlier in this thread?

they havent made there deposit and filed and extension...

So is Villa Magna dead..after all those adds in Both Sun-Sentinal & Miami Hearld???

Wow - if they haven't bought the thing yet, chances are, they never will. Unless of course, at some incredibly steep discount.

Zzzzzzzz....
C'mon, what's up out there? Seriously, is there any word or any rumor as to what's going on or is this dead in the water?

Where are all my old friends?

as dead as fried chicken

:badnews::goodnight::angel1:

Can't wait for all the apologies coming my way.....Seriously though, did the Spaniards ever close on the purchase of the parcel?

Can't wait for all the apologies coming my way.....Seriously though, did the Spaniards ever close on the purchase of the parcel?

Last I heard of Villa Magna was the Spaniards had purchased it and we're going to redesign the project into a mixed-use mostly office tower, but from what I know they haven't released any renderings on the project.

What's to happen to the other empty lot almost across the street from Villa Magna, is there anything proposed for that, or will it just be an empty lot forever?

edit

Ive asked that before...and I was told that that property cannot have anything built on it... I dont remember why.

I know there was definitely a condo tower proposed for that property a couple months ago, and I don't understand why something couldn't go there.

I have confirmed the Spaniards never closed on the transaction. I seriously hope this poses no problems for Tibor....

I have confirmed the Spaniards never closed on the transaction. I seriously hope this poses no problems for Tibor....

My Sources tell me otherwise

So....what now??????????

Careful what you say fairweatherfriend, Tibor Hollo might sue you.

Driving by the empty lot with the sign removed from the billboard, I had a vision. In my dreams of 2012...the lot will remain empty, or at least not with Villa Magna on it.

Alot of people out there owe me kudos for calling this from the start! Nailed this sucker on the head. Heard the land actually went back to the bank....may or may not be true.

Tibor lost the land too? Yikes. I'm surprised they needed a bank to buy the land.

Hellooooooooooooooooooooooooooo

You can almost hear an echo!

As a crafty Jewish fellow I know says.............."this thing is as dead as my Nana"

And to think I was anticipating a week of apologies, if not many beers!

We could be 24 hours away from being annihilated by a killer asteroid, and fairweatherfriend would be down on Brickell, praying for a direct hit on the Villa Magna site.

Yes...you would be correct. Anyone have any new info on the site? Is Tibor still involved?

Villa Who??? Lol just kidding.

Still waiting for those beers I'm owed...

Still waiting for those beers I'm owed...

Well, where do you want to meet to do this? And name your brand! :):cheers:

http://www.miamitodaynews.com/news/080626/story1.shtml

Plans for Villa Magna luxury condominiums revived

By Yudislaidy Fernandez
Development of Brickell's last prime bayfront parcel is on hold after developers scrapped a planned luxury hotel and reverted to high-end condos once the market improves.
Jerome Hollo, vice president of Florida East Coast Realty, said plans now are to revive the luxury condominium concept for Villa Magna on the 2.5-acres at 1201 Brickell Bay Drive. The design is for two 60-story towers totaling 787 units, along with restaurants and retail on ground levels, he said.
The departure of Spanish investors Grupo Pedro Iglesias from the project led to killing the hotel plans and reviving the condo component, Mr. Hollo said. The investors liked the hotel concept, he said, but couldn't secure the capital to participate. "They just weren't in a position to execute this type of project."
Grupo Pedro Iglesias hasn't entirely given up on helping to develop Villa Magna as a hotel, said Juan Bartolomé SeguÌ, group stakeholder and project architect. His group has $161 million in capital but needs about 50% more financing to solidify its offer, he said in a phone interview from Palma de Mallorca, Spain.
"It's our star project and we want to continue with it."
Bruno Opt, chief operating officer for the group, said the extra financing is key. "It's a tough time at the moment," he said from Spain.
Miami developer Tibor Hollo originally planned Villa Magna as high-end residential. In September, plans shifted again when he sought city approval for a mixed-use component to feature the hotel, restaurants and retail.
The Hollos said timing of the project will hinge on when the market rebounds.
"It's certainly the best piece of land; any project will do wonderful," Jerome Hollo said. "But it's got to be the right time."

thats awesome and great news!!!

Villa Magna has a lame design. :(

yeah but could shape up the skyline

And its a lot better than an empty lot...

And its a lot better than an empty lot...

Disagree. I'm not saying it's a bad design (or a good one for that matter) but I don't think ANY development just for development's sake is necessarily a good thing. Miami should be well beyond that stage by now and must demand architectural excellence. The city is in too beautiful a setting to settle for anything less.

To put it another way, I'd rather have one Ten Museum than ten One Miami's, y'know? The alternative is to wind up with a city that looks like Sao Paulo and (no offense to Brazilians) but that ain't exactly Sydney or Chicago when it comes to memorable skylines.

Anyway, none of this even means Villa Magna is actually going to be built. It's just keeping the proposal alive from a development/sales standpoint. Hopefully it DOES rise with a gorgeous design...otherwise I'll opt for the empty lot until something better comes along.:cheers:

xxx

I don't have a problem with the design of the building. Judging from the buildings that surround it: The Club, The Mark, Emerald, and that ugly little yellow one adjacent to Emerald, it is good enough for the area. The "new design" that came out a while ago with the one tower was, in my opinion, too dull and was too similar to Met 3. Villa Magna was a nice tower, not a wow tower, but not something to be ashamed of. But not to be too pesimistic, I do hope something nicer than the two tower and one tower design would come out :).

and what if a uglier design appears in villa magna's site

It's so generic... Nothing about it stands out. It's the same white walls and blue balconies. The only good thing about it is its location and height. If it was more a la Marquis, then that'd be awesome. But another white/blue condo building? Blech!

Just to refresh everyone's minds:

http://www.bryansereny.com/articleimages/villa_magna_brickell_condo.jpg
http://www.bryansereny.com/articleimages/villa_magna_brickell_condos.jpg
http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n12/MiamiCondoInvestments/VillaMagna.jpg
http://miamirealestatetrends.com/images/StarterImages/Images2/VillaMagnaMainPic.jpg

but there's nothing such as glassy condos every condo has white concrete so is the only choice.

but there's nothing such as glassy condos every condo has white concrete so is the only choice.

They don't all have to have white concrete. That's where architecture and design come in.

what do you mean

Look at Infiniti, the concrete is a dark blue.

but is the same i was talking about all glass like espiritu santo plaza and met 2 and park place.

Look at 2Midtown. A beautiful Taupe...and a nice relief from white. Concrete is not white. It's just paint. It can be any color. I would like to see a black building. And a red building. Although I like white best.

I think black would create more heat being that were in Miami. White is very clean and modern. I don't care what anybody says (since everyone around the country criticizes our "empty white condo buildings").

http://img66.imageshack.us/img66/9149/15986480kl9.th.jpg (http://img66.imageshack.us/my.php?image=15986480kl9.jpg)

[img=http://img66.imageshack.us/img66/9149/15986480kl9.th.jpg] (http://img66.imageshack.us/my.php?image=15986480kl9.jpg)

Disagree. I'm not saying it's a bad design (or a good one for that matter) but I don't think ANY development just for development's sake is necessarily a good thing. Miami should be well beyond that stage by now and must demand architectural excellence. The city is in too beautiful a setting to settle for anything less.

To put it another way, I'd rather have one Ten Museum than ten One Miami's, y'know? The alternative is to wind up with a city that looks like Sao Paulo and (no offense to Brazilians) but that ain't exactly Sydney or Chicago when it comes to memorable skylines.

I've been in Sao Paulo for almost two months now. Most of the buildings are 20 story concrete buildings painted in some random bright shade. The streets are very walkable in some places (Avenida Paulista) and impossible to walk through in others. We in Miami need to keep fighting for high quality street level interaction in our buildings, because that is the thing the main thing that I dislike about some of these buildings in Sao Paulo. Many of the buildings have no store fronts on the bottom floor, in fact the bases of the buildings are often surrounded with gated yards leaving very little room for pedestrians to walk.

I've been in Sao Paulo for almost two months now. Most of the buildings are 20 story concrete buildings painted in some random bright shade. The streets are very walkable in some places (Avenida Paulista) and impossible to walk through in others. We in Miami need to keep fighting for high quality street level interaction in our buildings, because that is the thing the main thing that I dislike about some of these buildings in Sao Paulo. Many of the buildings have no store fronts on the bottom floor, in fact the bases of the buildings are often surrounded with gated yards leaving very little room for pedestrians to walk.

Very well said and your description is EXACTLY what Miami must not become, imo. It's ugly when all is said and done and Miami can do better than condo forest.

What are you doing in Sao Paulo, dgm?

I am a research intern here. It is just for the summer. Maybe if I get a chance I can take some pictures of things that I find similar to Miami. I personally think that Avenida Paulista is an analogue of Brickell (and really what Brickell should stride to be). Of course Avenida Paulista is more dense, has a subway line, and maybe 100 times more people on it. Here is an idea from Brasil that might be of use to Miamians: every person in Sao Paulo has a day of the week where they are not allowed to drive during rush hours (based on the final number of their license plate). Even with that rule the traffic is god-awful here. Imagine 15 million Miami drivers, throw in curvier roads and 5 million motorcyclists with no regards for traffic law, and you have Sao Paulo during rush hour.

Edit. Double Post.

Imagine 15 million Miami drivers, throw in curvier roads and 5 million motorcyclists with no regards for traffic law, and you have Sao Paulo during rush hour.

Yikes! No thanks!

Anyway, that's really cool that you're doing your internship there for the summer---or should I say "winter" since that's what it is there. I imagine the weather would be pleasant there now. I've only been to Argentina in South America (first place I saw snow, actually) but would love to explore Brazil sometime.

Best of luck in your work and watch out for those crazy drivers. :cheers:

mexico city has a wierd climate the temperature is 65 F degrees!!!!!!!!!!!!!!cold at night about 50 F degrees.

mexico city has a wierd climate the temperature is 65 F degrees!!!!!!!!!!!!!!cold at night about 50 F degrees.

Sounds great to me! I absolutely hate hot weather.

well thats the bright side i got tired of the heat of miami.

Sounds great to me! I absolutely hate hot weather.
It's probably a great weekend in Philly....is it going to be hot? and are the best fireworks at the Art Museum? THanks! and my apologies for going off the topic of the thread.

It's probably a great weekend in Philly....is it going to be hot? and are the best fireworks at the Art Museum? THanks! and my apologies for going off the topic of the thread.

It's pretty hot and humid here but at least at night it's pretty comfortable. Already looking forward to the Fall, though. I am definitely NOT a hot weather person. :lol:

Yeah, the fireworks at the museum are spectacular. I went two years ago when Elton John was the headliner...not sure who it is this time but I have to be at work that night anyway (dammit). There's also a big display along the Delaware riverfront a day later that's within walking distance of my house so at least I'll catch that one.

Pretty cool to be here for the 4th. Sometimes I catch myself taking all the history here for granted after living in Philly for five years but it's pretty amazing.

Yeah, the fireworks at the museum are spectacular. I went two years ago when Elton John was the headliner...not sure who it is this time but I have to be at work that night anyway (dammit). There's also a big display along the Delaware riverfront a day later that's within walking distance of my house so at least I'll catch that one.
Pretty cool to be here for the 4th. Sometimes I catch myself taking all the history here for granted after living in Philly for five years but it's pretty amazing. Cool...my girlfriend wasn't born in the US and A, so this will be her first REAL American Independence Day...Philly has to be the best city to experience it all.
John Legend is playing the concert at the Art Museum this year.
We are staying in the CBD so it's going to be great to walk around and take in the sites.
Can't wait to see your city Spell!!

That's great, Roark! I didn't realize from the previous post you were actually headed this way. Hope you enjoy the sites...if you get the chance check out Reading Terminal Market, lot's of fun.

And a Happy 4th to EVERYONE here from where it all began...:cheers:

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/21/26602218_72f7f4431b.jpg?v=0

That's great, Roark! I didn't realize from the previous post you were actually headed this way. Hope you enjoy the sites...if you get the chance check out Reading Terminal Market, lot's of fun.

And a Happy 4th to EVERYONE here from where it all began...:cheers:

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/21/26602218_72f7f4431b.jpg?v=0Happy 4th 0f July to you Spellbound and to others on the forum,what city is on your banner today Spellbound? It shows the New York City skyline 4th of July celebration on mine.

while im in mexico city my mother is taking pictures of the fireworks tonight in her brickell condo. man i wish i was there. no fireworks in mexico.

Happy 4th 0f July to you Spellbound and to others on the forum,what city is on your banner today Spellbound? It shows the New York City skyline 4th of July celebration on mine.

LOL...Madrid. I still haven't changed the date feature so I should be getting the 4th of July stuff sometime next week. :lol:

Gotta be at work tonight but I hope the rain holds off so Roark and a half-million of his closest friends can enjoy the show here in Philly this evening.

So what's the latest news on this project?

Still waiting for those beers I'm owed...

At this point, I'm not sure if you're still owed beers, but I'll take a couple Dos Equis with a steak burrito at Rosa Mexicano.

That's great, Roark! I didn't realize from the previous post you were actually headed this way. Hope you enjoy the sites...if you get the chance check out Reading Terminal Market, lot's of fun.
And a Happy 4th to EVERYONE here from where it all began...:cheers:
Wow...what a GREAT city! I didn't get your tip till after we returned, but we made it there anyway. Excellent! We stayed right accross from the City Hall and walked just about everywhere (except for a cab ride to Pat's), it is an exceptional city and it is great that Miami will be including some of the great elements from a 300 year old city.
Loved the Comcast building and the myriad of classic deco skyscrapers. Can't wait to go back!

So glad you enjoyed your trip here, Roark! Philly is indeed pretty special and it's a neat time to be here with so much renewal happening---hopefully it will stay the cheap alternative to NYC, though!

Miami, of course, will always be home for me but I've never regretted moving here for a moment. I owe you a beer (or three) next time! :cheers:

So what's new out there? Does anyone even know who owns the site at this point in time?

So what's new out there? Does anyone even know who owns the site at this point in time?

See Dave8721's post #565 on page 29.

Are the Russians still in the picture?

Are the Russians still in the picture?

I'm not sure, but if you ever want to visit another thread, check out my QuantumPx thread where I put all the photos I've been taking since the beginning of the summer.

Villa Magna to become Hollo Park

http://www.miamitodaynews.com/news/081211/story1.shtml

Developer Hollo leases bayfront land to Miami for $1 a year until markets rebound, park planned


By Yudislaidy Fernandez

Amidst a steep downturn for builders, one upside is that a Miami developer is willing to lend Brickell's last prime bayfront parcel to the City of Miami for a park.
Tibor Hollo, chairman and president of Florida East Coast Realty, agreed to City Commissioner Marc Sarnoff's request to contribute the 2-acre site to the city's vacant land project, a program Mr. Sarnoff has spearheaded to create park-like spots in empty lots through voluntary agreements with property owners.
He plans to discuss Hollo Park, the project's official name, at today's (12/11) commission meeting and is drafting an ordinance to build the temporary park at 1201 Brickell Bay Drive under a three-year lease.
Mr. Hollo said he likes the park concept and has no intent to develop the luxury hotel and condo planned at the site for some years. While he waits for real estate and credit markets to improve, he's willing to lease the land to the city for a $1 a year.
Mr. Hollo said he prefers that Miamians benefit from the green space, which the Brickell area desperately needs as more residents move in.
The city would build a passive park with a dog park and a children's play area. Mr. Hollo would build pathways and install park benches, and the city would pay for landscaping and fencing, Mr. Sarnoff said.
Mr. Hollo would pay all ad valorem property taxes on the site during the lease, but the city would pay for liability insurance and incur the costs of any park-related lawsuits.
Mr. Sarnoff said City Manager Pete Hernandez is committed to expediting the bayfront park to maximize the time Brickellites get to enjoy it.
"The community that has suffered from the highest impact of building is getting a break with green open space."

Villa Magna to become Hollo Park

http://www.miamitodaynews.com/news/081211/story1.shtml

DAVE:)., My Best Update Friend ,
I come in here today for a longtime miss for my Birthday TODAY:cheers: and to see this ,.
Its so sad:ohno:,.
This was one of my Best projects to see go up and Now It's going to be a Park,.
Gosh , I should of stayed in the grave !!!:ohno::nuts:

DAVE:)., My Best Update Friend ,
I come in here today for a longtime miss for my Birthday TODAY:cheers: and to see this ,.
Its so sad:ohno:,.
This was one of my Best projects to see go up and Now It's going to be a Park,.
Gosh , I should of stayed in the grave !!!:ohno::nuts:

"Mr. Hollo said he likes the park concept and has no intent to develop the luxury hotel and condo planned at the site for some years. While he waits for real estate and credit markets to improve, he's willing to lease the land to the city for a $1 a year."

Chuck, I don't interpret this as meaning the project is dead, but just going into hibernation for a while. I don't see it being a permanent park and we might yet live to see Villa Magna. I just don't think Tibor Hollo will at this point to be perfectly honest with you.

To add to that Q, I don't think Hollo is going to waste his $20 million purchase on a park!!

As much as a skyscraper would be really cool for the Villa Magna site, Brickell desperately needs park space, so this a great initiative.

The lot West of Villa Magna (I think there was a tower proposed for it) would be great for a park. Unfortunately, it does face the parking garage. But the Villa Magna lot is too precious for park space.

The lot West of Villa Magna (I think there was a tower proposed for it) would be great for a park. Unfortunately, it does face the parking garage. But the Villa Magna lot is too precious for park space.Nope...the lot west of VM already has a Club at Brickelll Bay on it.

It is great that Tibor Hollo is doing this, but mark my words...once the creatures of habit get used to using this park and the Hollo boys are ready and able to develop this space, the headline won't be "The Hollo Family sure was cool for giving us a free park for 10 years, let's give them an award".
The headline will be, "Brickell doesn't need another luxury highrise for the rich people, we need park space, those bastards!!!"
Predictible....

Nope...the lot west of VM already has a Club at Brickelll Bay on it.

It is great that Tibor Hollo is doing this, but mark my words...once the creatures of habit get used to using this park and the Hollo boys are ready and able to develop this space, the headline won't be "The Hollo Family sure was cool for giving us a free park for 10 years, let's give them an award".
The headline will be, "Brickell doesn't need another luxury highrise for the rich people, we need park space, those bastards!!!"
Predictible....

ROARK:), my old Everglades Hotel Friend,
I believe the West Lot is the really SouthWest Lot of the Villa Magna SITE , West of THE JADE condo tower.
I believe it was 1350 BRICKELL BAY TOWER :nuts:???:bash: Never Built !!!,.,. too bad , such a loss there , too.

To add to that Q, I don't think Hollo is going to waste his $20 million purchase on a park!!

It's too much prime real estate to remain a park, but I would rather see a mixed-use supertall go on that site. I think it is the most appropriate place in Miami to put one. I think a 1,010 feet tall tower would be perfect there. Imagine that there on that site along with One Bayfront Plaza where it will be. :):cheers:

Sorry, the lot West of Jade... Thank You Chuck!!

Nope...the lot west of VM already has a Club at Brickelll Bay on it.

It is great that Tibor Hollo is doing this, but mark my words...once the creatures of habit get used to using this park and the Hollo boys are ready and able to develop this space, the headline won't be "The Hollo Family sure was cool for giving us a free park for 10 years, let's give them an award".
The headline will be, "Brickell doesn't need another luxury highrise for the rich people, we need park space, those bastards!!!"
Predictible....

I was thinking the same thing. Its going to be a public relations nightmare when they try to reclaim the building site after its been a park for years.

Sorry, the lot West of Jade... Thank You Chuck!!

I don't think I ever uploaded this first photo here because I couldn't find it anywhere except on my computer.

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3198/3100965490_b61bfc03ec_b.jpg
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3198/3100965490_b61bfc03ec_b.jpg

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3251/2953566290_5f12f36859_b.jpg
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3251/2953566290_5f12f36859_b.jpg

I can wait till a developer buys out the people in those four towers in front of four seasons...those are some eyesores.

Sorry, the lot West of Jade... Thank You Chuck!!

This is another pic I never uploaded because of the blur, but here it serves a purpose. The blur is not as bad here as it is on my flat screen large-sized. :) :cheers:

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3437/3274181174_d434e9d50d_b.jpg
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3437/3274181174_d434e9d50d_b.jpg

The Villa Magna should be developed into a huge mixed-use complex similar to Icon Brickell and the empty lot just east of Espiritu Santo should be made into a green park.

^^I agree with you Kevin. My thing is, I hope, if something does ever go there, that the Villa Magna site would have something of similar height to Jade. I think it would look tacky if 1000 footer sprung up there. Maybe somewhere South of Four Seasons, but not V.M.

^^I agree with you Kevin. My thing is, I hope, if something does ever go there, that the Villa Magna site would have something of similar height to Jade. I think it would look tacky if 1000 footer sprung up there. Maybe somewhere South of Four Seasons, but not V.M.

According to the FAA, a supertall could not be built south of the Four Seasons. I think that would look even more tacky and out of place, and I don't think a project with the breadth of Icon Brickell would fit on the Villa Magna site.

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3141/2661057455_409599c5e2_o.jpg
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3141/2661057455_409599c5e2_o.jpg

I can wait till a developer buys out the people in those four towers in front of four seasons...those are some eyesores.

Four Ambassadors?

In all honestly after being inside the one of the four it wasn't shabby on the inside.

Four Ambassadors?

I think Architek is referring to thses jobs just to the left of Jade on Brickell Bay. This is another pic I never posted before because I liked the other one better.

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3207/3102396848_dbdf741c32_b.jpg
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3207/3102396848_dbdf741c32_b.jpg
^^

Oh yeah, good call - now I see what four building he is referring to....

The Four Ambassadors were were finished in 1968,I remember seeing the construction of those 4 structures in the movie "Tony Rome" where Boxer Rocky Graziano is standing in the foreground.

I remember being in Miami 1976 and early 1980's and the Four Ambassadors stood more prominent back then, as today they are hidden or considered an eyesore and I have even heard them being called the "Four Embarassments",but hey they would look great in Overtown.

The Four Ambassadors were were finished in 1968,I remember seeing the construction of those 4 structures in the movie "Tony Rome" where Boxer Rocky Graziano is standing in the foreground.

I remember being in Miami 1976 and early 1980's and the Four Ambassadors stood more prominent back then, as today they are hidden or considered an eyesore and I have even heard them being called the "Four Embarassments",but hey they would look great in Overtown.

If I may go off topic a bit again, here I don't think they look so bad and blend well with the architecture of 801 Brickell and 901 Brickell.

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3188/3006543883_7b6b51aa49_b.jpg
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3188/3006543883_7b6b51aa49_b.jpg

I can wait till a developer buys out the people in those four towers in front of four seasons...those are some eyesores. Don't hold your breath...those are condo buildings and it would be very difficult to control all the units and make that buy. Probably not in the next 50 years.

If I may go off topic a bit again, here I don't think they look so bad and blend well with the architecture of 801 Brickell and 901 Brickell.

I have never had a problem with The Four Ambassadors. I actually like them!! Many people say that they are old and no other city has anything like it. On CSI: Miami they do shots of them all the time, and I like them more and more each time.

The buildings are fine, there engagement of the street is another thing altogether.

The buildings are fine, there engagement of the street is another thing altogether.

That's my biggest complaint, is that they offer absolutely nothing to the pedestrian. If they could incorporate a set of shops along Brickell Bay Drive, that'd be awesome, but the way they stand now they offer nothing to the area.

That's my biggest complaint, is that they offer absolutely nothing to the pedestrian. If they could incorporate a set of shops along Brickell Bay Drive, that'd be awesome, but the way they stand now they offer nothing to the area.Nothing is pretty harsh, it requires the pedestrian to know his surroundings a little bit, but I'll let you in on the secret if you don't know it yet! There is an excellent little Tiki Bar, open to the public, it offers the people in the area great Eastern views of the marina, Brickell Key, and you are almost sure to see Manatees, Rays, and some dolphins.
Now that Renzi won't likely be developing the tower at 4Amb., maybe they can connect the bay walk. Icon Brickell has a great one that would connect from the Miami Circle through the park to the two bank builidngs over the Brickell Key Bridge through 4Amb and connect to the baywalk that passes behind AON through The Mark to the new Hollo Park, and along the Baywalk of Jade and around back to Brickell Avenue at 15th Road.

Villa Magna will now be a park, at least for the foreseeable future.

I remember when the Four Ambassadors used to dominate the Brickell skyline.

I remember when the Four Ambassadors used to dominate the Brickell skyline.

You must have been a toddler at the time. :)

http://www.miamitodaynews.com/news/090219/story5.shtml

Hopes for Hollo Park on Brickell's bayfront are out with the tide


By Yudislaidy Fernandez

Plans to build a temporary park on Brickell's last prime bayfront parcel are all but dead.
The license agreement for the project was withdrawn during last week's Miami commission meeting, marking a major setback in the quest for parks in the Brickell corridor.
Developer Tibor Hollo, chairman and president of Florida East Coast Realty, and Commissioner Marc Sarnoff announced in December the two had reached a deal for the developer to lease the 2 acres at 1201 Brickell Bay Drive to the city for three years for $1 a year. Mr. Hollo planned a luxury hotel and condo development there but wanted to wait for a market rebound.
Mr. Sarnoff said the developer caused plans to fall apart by bringing in an element that wasn't part of original discussions.
"They wanted to have substantial change made to the MUSP (major use special permit)," he said, adding he didn't know what the exact change was.
Miami requires major use special permits for large-scale developments. The city was to grant Mr. Hollo an extension to his permit in exchange for use of the land.
Mr. Hollo denied the park project was halted because he requested a permit change. He added he still plans to develop a luxury hotel and condos there.
He said the delays were caused by "the city's legal department" and that his intentions were to ensure the license agreement's language guarantees that the land returns to his ownership.
"We want to make sure that the parcel cannot be taken from us because we've given it to the city for nothing," he said.
City Attorney Julie Bru said some issues surfaced that weren't part of the original agreement between the parties but said she couldn't give further details.
The initial agreement for Villa Magna Park called for the city to build a passive park with a dog park and a children's play area.
Mr. Hollo would build pathways and install benches and the city would pay for landscaping and fencing.
The developer would pay all ad valorem property taxes on the site during the lease, but the city would cover liability insurance and incur costs of any park-related lawsuits.
Ms. Bru insisted her department wasn't responsible for delay.
"I do not believe there is anything my department is waiting on for further action on my behalf."
She said Mr. Hollo's legal team is still reviewing lease documents and could propose further action.
Mr. Hollo said he's not calling off plans for the park, adding he just wants to protect his property.
"We are willing to do this as long as the (city's) legal department is willing to protect us," he said.
But Mr. Sarnoff said negotiations are over.
He was excited about the prospect of giving Brickell a bayfront park, he said, but under the current situation it's better to part ways with the developer.
Villa Magna Park was to be the first park built under Mr. Sarnoff's green spaces program, an effort to turn empty lots into parks through voluntary agreements with property owners.
But he said he's talking with other developers.
Mr. Sarnoff said he planned to meet with his staff Tuesday afternoon to define a "more definite program" to "avoid setbacks" such as this.

That's a shame. Brickell really needs more parks.

That's a shame. Brickell really needs more parks.

How do you figure? You have a park in Brickell Key, Miami Circle, Brickell Park, Simpson Park, Brickell Plaza Mini Park, and Southside Park. I think thats more than enough, especially in the fact that we would not want to waste such prime real estate. A temp park would be better than the dirty lot there is now, but I wouldn't say Brickell is in need of more parks.

Agreed, Brickell has some parks. Still, that area of Brickell doesnt have any public parks... All those parks are a few blocks away. With the amount of bldgs and development in the area, a nice park would be great. Its one of the densest areas of brickell.


Brickell Mini Park is well, mini.... Simpson Park is more of a preserve (not an active park) which currently is not very accessible (I think), and Southside Park is west of the MetroRail. The green space on brickell Key is owned by the hotel and Brickell Park and the Circle are on the very north-east corner of Brickell, not in a central location for "Brickellites". (hehehe)

I'm not saying that those are not good parks, just that another park in such a central location wouldnt hurt. Furthermore, I don't think putting a park on the waterfront is "wasting prime real estate".

Whether they did this or not, it wasnt going to be permanent, and seems like its not going to happen anyways now, so I guess its a mute subject.

Agreed, the area is very urban, if a park was to go any where, it sould be the lot across the street from Jade... I forgot what was the supposed to go there that never happened, but not the Villa Magna site!!

Agreed, the area is very urban, if a park was to go any where, it sould be the lot across the street from Jade... I forgot what was the supposed to go there that never happened, but not the Villa Magna site!!You must be thinking of the 1390 Brickell Building.
Here is a rendering from one of their parties.
http://i113.photobucket.com/albums/n215/restainer/1390.jpg

Yea... thats the one.

Anymore renderings? Hahahahaha

You must be thinking of the 1390 Brickell Building.
Here is a rendering from one of their parties.
http://i113.photobucket.com/albums/n215/restainer/1390.jpg

Anymore renderings? Hahahahaha

http://www.infomiamirealestate.com/preconstruction/er/1390-Brickell-Bay1.jpg

Wow, that sure beats Brickell House!

It's funny how Brickell House just had it's own little pre construction party yesterday. The lot is still open to peruse. They just flatened it.

Speaking of Villa Magna, recently it has been used to park ground lifts, today it had event trucks on it probably for this President's Day weekend. Villa Magna has also been mentioned in recent articles on Brickell House, as it is nearby but has the advantage of being bayfront.

Additionally, a condo tower called Villa Magna is approved to open on a nearby plot with more direct water views than the land-locked Brickell House site, potentially providing stiff competition.

Read more here: http://www.miamiherald.com/2011/10/17/2459039/new-condos-slated-for-brickell.html#storylink=cpy

http://www.miamiherald.com/2011/10/17/2459039/new-condos-slated-for-brickell.html

http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7058/6894346765_bc9db62ac4_b.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/rcadimensia/6894346765/)
0217121745a (http://www.flickr.com/photos/rcadimensia/6894346765/) by rcadimenisa (http://www.flickr.com/people/rcadimensia/), on Flickr

http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7049/6894346771_c8bbd486c3_b.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/rcadimensia/6894346771/)
0217121746 (http://www.flickr.com/photos/rcadimensia/6894346771/) by rcadimenisa (http://www.flickr.com/people/rcadimensia/), on Flickr

Any idea on the height or layout of the tower?