I am super confused about the McChesney development at The Point. :lol:

I'm hungry. :eat: :D

Are you ready? http://greenville.brightforums.com/ :dj: :llama:

Magnolia Park Town Center's website is down. Are you ready for the new Magnolia Park? ;)

Are you ready? http://greenville.brightforums.com/ :dj: :llama:

Cool site! I just joined. :)

:llama: Urbanplanet+SSC= http://greenville.brightforums.com/ :llama: Revolution like Ron Paul says. :D

YES. :banana2: :lol: I found the Peacock's twin: http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=572689

Bids are to be completed tomorrow for the construction of a six-story 77,989 square foot Hilton Garden Inn at the Point. Expect construction to commence soon. :yes:

^Is that going to be besdie the Dury Inn also? Or is it next to the other hotel next to old frontage road?

^^Next to Homewood Suites on the Carolina First side.

It looks like Volkswagen will probably be going to Rocky Mount, NC according to Automotive News. :( We lost Rolls Royce and now VW. When will this state ever step up to the plate?

[QUOTE=g-man430;17918998]It looks like Volkswagen will probably be going to Rocky Mount, NC according to Automotive News. :( We lost Rolls Royce and now VW. When will this state ever step up to the plate?[/QUOTE

Have you noticed that Ameri-Suites at Pelham and Haywood has been remodeled and is now Hyatt Place?

^^Yes, but VW isn't coming here. :(

Well this really sucks. I wonder what happened?

Before we blame our state for being unprogressive, let's wait and see why VW chose that site. Our state could've offered a great incentives plan, only to have VW choose the Rocky Mount, NC site for other reasons beyond our control.

^^VW hasn't confirmed the site yet and will not for at least 6 months, so there is still hope.

According to yesterday's Automotive News, VW has not made a decision on location. Read Stefan Jacoby's (VW CEO) comments about the Rocky Mount rumor. No one knows where the plant will end up.

The other thing I find interesting, in this article it states that VW will be building an engine and transmission plant in addition to vehicle assembly plant. Two plants in two different locations.

Don't write off South Carolina yet guys.

http://www.autonews.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080123/ANA02/94808948/1202

^^Ok, so maybe VW is coming to Anderson. Look at what state is crossed out: http://www.autoblog.com/2008/01/24/vw-also-planning-engine-transmission-plant-in-the-u-s/ :bow:

^^Ok, so maybe VW is coming to Anderson. Look at what state is crossed out: http://www.autoblog.com/2008/01/24/vw-also-planning-engine-transmission-plant-in-the-u-s/ :bow:

You're fast at jumping to conclusions, my friend. It's not coming :ohno:, it IS coming :cheers:, it's not :bash:, it IS! :nuts:

^^I confused you. Yay. :hug:

As always, g-man doesn't really know anything other than what he reads or hears from others. Everyone can speculate, but to say something is or isn't going to happen based on the latest information is just plain stupid, as everyone should have learned by now.:weird:

^^Correct, just like how I knew the exact week an article would come out regarding the Gateway site or how I also knew the groundbreaking date for the Peacock. ;) Volkswagen is going to happen. No wait it isn't. It's going to be Hyundai. :D Maybe Raleigh-NC's new penguin factory.

^^Correct, just like how I knew the exact week an article would come out regarding the Gateway site or how I also knew the groundbreaking date for the Peacock. ;) Volkswagen is going to happen. No wait it isn't. It's going to be Hyundai. :D Maybe Raleigh-NC's new penguin factory.


You did know the groundbreaking date for the Peacock, but you didn't know the shutdown construction date, LOL.:lol::ohno: BTW is the POM starting next week?

^^I wish it would start next week. You know the way that goes though. :nuts:

As always, g-man doesn't really know anything other than what he reads or hears from others. Everyone can speculate, but to say something is or isn't going to happen based on the latest information is just plain stupid, as everyone should have learned by now.:weird:

I-N-D-E-P-E-N-D-E-N-T. Do you know what that mean man? http://youtube.com/watch?v=gT1XrPmJ0XQ :scouserd:

I dont think the POM will get built....im not joking either.

^^Unfortunately, I have to agree with you. :(

Skyliner is right. I have been acting like a jerk and an idiot lately. Time to change hopefully. :yes: :) The reason I have been acting like that is because there is nothing happening right now. Nobody will post or go take update pics anymore. Everything seems to be on hold and we never hear anything about projects anymore unless it's downtown. :( Sorry guys.

Why are you guys being so pessimistic regarding the Pinnacle on Main all of a sudden? Since we have all had plenty of opportunities to give up on this project, why now? We've had more encouraging news in the past month than we've had in two years! While nothing is certain until construction begins, I feel like the project has some renewed momentum and will start soon. Who's with me? :)

^^Good point. I guess it's just because we really thought it would start last month and it didn't. We haven't heard anything about it in a long time and the website hasn't been updated in over a year. I know the Greenville News is doing a story on it that will be good news, but until that comes out I can't help but feel down about this project.

I sent Bob Ellis an email apologizing for being a jerk to him and making fun of his project. I suggest anybody else who has made fun of him or his project do the same. :yes:

" g-man Rocks! " http://www.mysmilie.de/smilies/musik/img/025.gif

^^Thanks man. :okay: Several planned developments including a new one for Simpsonville and Lake Conestee nature center are on the county's planning commission agenda for next month: http://greenvilleplanning.com/land_Development/current_rezoning_cases/infromation.html Looks like action is starting to pick up again. :)

I sent Bob Ellis an email apologizing for being a jerk to him and making fun of his project. I suggest anybody else who has made fun of him or his project do the same. :yes:

I will do that when he sends an email to everyone he's misled and lied to over the past two years regarding a start date for the project. Given the number of people he has lied to, multiplied by the times he has done so, means that I don't need to be in a hurry to locate his email address.

I for one have never made fun of his project. I think it's a great project that will extend Main Street northward. But when it comes to him calling wolf and then not delivering, I am not going to apologize for calling a spade a spade. That's his problem to address, not everyone else's. Just build the freaking thing already, or shut up about it until you have a definite start date.

Next.

^^Weren't you the one who also said that we shouldn't say it's dead and quit being so pessimistic about it? ;) It's not his fault that the project keeps getting delayed. I wish people would quit thinking that. It's the investors fault and nobody elses. I wish he would quit giving these start dates too. :nuts:

^^Weren't you the one who also said that we shouldn't say it's dead and quit being so pessimistic about it? ;) It's not his fault that the project keeps getting delayed. I wish people would quit thinking that. It's the investors fault and nobody elses. I wish he would quit giving these start dates too. :nuts:

I'm not being pessimistic. I think it will happen soon (or at least hope it does), and feel that the more recent news seems encouraging. But that does not excuse all the false alarms over the past few years. I realize that it isn't directly his fault that the project keeps being delayed (at least we assume it isn't), but he is still the one who keeps providing the start date of "in a few weeks" or "next month" when asked. If he truly has no clue, then I would prefer that he say so.

I'm pulling for the guy, I really am. By all accounts he seems like a nice guy and I am sure he is working hard to make the project happen. But because we care so much, it makes all the ups and downs very hard to take! :)

^^What recent news? :dunno: I haven't seen any news in over a year regarding this project. Always trust a man in a bowtie. ;) I can relate this project to a roller coaster in many ways. :nuts: I'm sure it will get built. It's more a question of when not if. I'm guessing it will start next month.

TBA's from the newest issue of the Greenville Journal:

With the former Greenville Memorial Auditorium site sold, the city will begin working on a development agrrement to add more streetscaping to the area. One possibility is a covered walkway spanning the sunken road next to the site. Developers have plans for a hotel, a restaurtant, a parking garage and condos. Expect to see more details in 30 days.

The city will spend $135,000 on improvements along East North Street as part of the development of the Palmetto Band headquarters. The city will do things such as plant trees and add benches to make the street more inviting to walkers. Making the downtown's side streets more pedestrian-friendly has been a major goal the past few years.

Expect to see demolition of the bridge over Bergamo Plaza sometime in the first few months of 2008.

The BassMaster Classic will get $20,000 from the city's contingency fund. Organizers are in a mad rush to get the fishing tournament to decide whether to come back in 2009. Some of the world's top anglers will come to the Upstate next month for the event that has been dubbed the World Series of bass fishing.

Land underneath the Church Street bridge has been rezoned for a commercial building. Expec to see plans for a new multistory building on the site soon.

Demolition has started on the former City Hall plaza at the corner of Broad and Main streets. The work should take several months.

Work is moving fast on the Hamptons, a former church-turned-condo project near downtown.

Told you it wasn't his fault. The feds just lowered interest rates. Expect many projects to get going here very soon that have been delayed:

Thank you.
It has been a very difficult process and continues to be with the current capital funding markets and economic climate. However, we are still moving forward and really want to start this month. As I have said before, the contracts are signed and everyone is poised to go. The delay is with the equity investor group which has had non-related issues on other projects in other cities which hampered their funding structure. They are still in the deal and we believe the papers will process by Monday. We have too much money, time, energy invested and too many interested parties involved and believers in this project to not proceed.

Bob Ellis
The Ellis Group P.A. Architecture
220 North Main Street, Suite 325
Greenville, SC 29601
[p] 864.235.7464
[f] 864.235.7561
www.ellisgrouparchitecture.com

:okay: Told you developments are starting to coming back. 45.33 acres rezoning request to planned development at The Point: http://councilagendas.greatergreenville.com/minutes/2008/January/Formal/1-28-2008/Item14b.pdf

More money for GTA? Yes please:
http://councilagendas.greatergreenville.com/minutes/2008/January/Formal/1-28-2008/Item14f.pdf

More good things coming for GTA it seems:
http://councilagendas.greatergreenville.com/minutes/2008/January/Formal/1-28-2008/Item15a.pdf

Master plan regarding over 120 miles of bike/walking paths to be adopted by city council:
http://councilagendas.greatergreenville.com/minutes/2008/January/Formal/1-28-2008/Item15b.pdf

Cascades at Verdae pics taken 1/15/08: http://www.triangleconstruction.com/pages/cascades.html

Hasta la vista baby. Credit to erm1981:
http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f361/erm1981/0125081631a.jpg

My heart skipped when I turned up broad street.....I didnt expect them to have torn that much down, I think this one will go up much better than the other two buildings downtown.

This is only a rumor, so don't get real excited but i'm hearing Dave and Buster's is looking at putting a location at the Highway 14/I-85 development that will include Bass Pro Shops. This location would make sense seeing how it's directly located between Greenville & Spartanburg. There's one in Omaha, so I don't see why one couldn't come here. :)

My heart skipped when I turned up broad street.....I didnt expect them to have torn that much down, I think this one will go up much better than the other two buildings downtown.I too am anxious to see this one completed - especially considering that is the most prime corner in downtown during the annual USA Cycling Pro Championships Road Race. Too bad the construction start was delayed.

^^Good point man about the cycling championship along with the many other events that run through that corridor. We should see actual construction of the building begin by summer. :)

I can't quite figure out where that property is around the Point... I wonder what they're looking to develop with the new 'Planned Development' designation. Have we heard of this before?

^^Yes: http://www.greenvillenews.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20071024/BUSINESS/710240368/1003/BUSINESS

:banana:
http://img89.imageshack.us/img89/3972/002ax0.jpg

http://img89.imageshack.us/img89/7565/001uo3.jpg

http://img89.imageshack.us/img89/8893/003or3.jpg

http://img89.imageshack.us/img89/3976/004ir9.jpg

Does anyone have a clue about the proposed building on the vacant lot under the Church St bridge? It just says multi-story/ This would be a great spot for a highrise. :banana::banana:

^^Mixed-use office is all I know. I doubt it will be more than 6 stories just by the sound and location of it.

Does anyone have a clue about the proposed building on the vacant lot under the Church St bridge? It just says multi-story/ This would be a great spot for a highrise. :banana::banana:Don't expect much height there. Perhaps a couple to a few stories at most. I heard about this one quite awhile back. It will definitely be a nice addition to a vacant lot though.:)

^^Yes: http://www.greenvillenews.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20071024/BUSINESS/710240368/1003/BUSINESS

I think we heard about this one a few months back, all the details sound very familiar. This must just be the next step

Don't expect much height there. Perhaps a couple to a few stories at most. I heard about this one quite awhile back. It will definitely be a nice addition to a vacant lot though.:)

I would agree. This whole general area is low-rise with a lot of surface parking :nuts: I would expect this to be no different. Will be great to have additional development in this area, but would be surprised with anything more than 3-4.

^^Even if it were a highrise, it wouldn't have much impact on the skyline if at all due to how low of an elevation grade there is on that site and around it. :yes:

And no, that is not me on Urbanplanet. :ohno: I'm not that stupid. If I were to come back, it would be under a different username.

This is only a rumor, so don't get real excited but i'm hearing Dave and Buster's is looking at putting a location at the Highway 14/I-85 development that will include Bass Pro Shops. This location would make sense seeing how it's directly located between Greenville & Spartanburg. There's one in Omaha, so I don't see why one couldn't come here. :)

I would love to have a Dave & Buster's in Greenville, and acknowledge that it would probably do well at that location...but I would LOVE for the city to do their best to get them to locate downtown. I think it would go a long way toward giving people additional entertainment options downtown. Their options are endless:

-Part of the Woolworth's development at Main and Washington
-Part of Riverplace phase II
-On a vacant site in the West End
-As a key anchor in a yet-to-be-determined entertainment district in the CBD.

Thoughts?

^^I went to the one in Omaha over Christmas and i'm still trying to figure out how they are any different than Frankie's Fun Park. Looked the same to me. :dunno: I don't see one locating downtown unless it's on the county square site. I could see one going to the Point also if that were to get built. The reason I don't see one going downtown is because they tend to locate in the burbs and they need a lot of space that a lot of these downtown projects don't have unfortunately.

:okay: Check this out guys: http://www.weather.com/multimedia/videoplayer.html?from=email&bcpid=823425597&bclid=877032950&bctid=1379238758

South Carolina is the only state to sign an economic relationship deal with China and it's starting to pay off:

Chinese company brings 120 new jobs to Spartanburg

By Heidi Cenac-Anderson Independent Mail

Friday, January 25, 2008

SPARTANBURG — The South Carolina Department of Commerce on Friday announced that American Yuncheng Plate Making Inc. will locate a manufacturing facility in Spartanburg. The company is expected to invest $10 million and bring 120 new jobs to Spartanburg within the first five years.

The 30,000-square-foot facility will manufacture engraved printed cylinders used for packaging, decoration and textile transfers. The company is slated to begin construction in the beginning of 2008.

American Yuncheng Plate Making was founded in 1982 in Shanxi province, China. The company has expanded its business to other Chinese districts and started international development in 1999. The company’s Spartanburg facility will be its first North American facility.

:nuts: I have never heard Charleston, SC listed as a finalist for the VW plant. Something tells me somebody doesn't have all of their facts straight: http://www.ajc.com/metro/content/business/stories/2008/01/25/volkswagen_0126.html

hum what if that were true?

^^What if it's not? Autoblog is saying South Carolina. Autonews is saying North Carolina. AJC is saying Savannah or Charleston. Reuters & Forbes are saying Anderson or Rocky Mount, NC. :nuts: It will probably end up going to Florida. :lol:

Im not going to worry about it. If we get it, we get it.

^^What about the Pinnacle on Main? Are you going to worry about that? No need too. You will see why next week most likely. ;)

Im so worried about it I need my nerve pills....help!!!

Im so worried about it I need my nerve pills....help!!!

ME TOO! I haven't been able to sleep in... 2-3 years now! I've lost track of the time...:wallbash:

^^I never sleep. Just ask Raleigh-NC. I take pics during the day and post them in the middle of the night. :lol:

^^What about the Pinnacle on Main? Are you going to worry about that? No need too. You will see why next week most likely. ;)

I'm definitely worried about POM and the Peacock. Tight money was the reason given for stopping construction on the Peacock. The Feds lowered the interest rates more than have in the last 20+ years the other day. Let's get some opinions:
The Peacock will resume construction:
1. Any day now.
2. Within 2 moinths
3. 3-6 months
4. 9-12 months
5. 1-2 years
6. Never

I'm going with #4 right now as I am an optimist.:lol:

^^#2 just by the sound of things and the feds lowering interest rates. Maybe even sooner. :yes:

That is NOT me on urbanplanet. I swear. I'm not that stupid. I wish people would quit thinking that. I don't know who that g-man is, but it's not me. :ohno: :bash:

I'm definitely worried about POM and the Peacock. Tight money was the reason given for stopping construction on the Peacock. The Feds lowered the interest rates more than have in the last 20+ years the other day. Let's get some opinions:
The Peacock will resume construction:
1. Any day now.
2. Within 2 moinths
3. 3-6 months
4. 9-12 months
5. 1-2 years
6. Never

I'm going with #4 right now as I am an optimist.:lol:

I would say #3 but will hope for #2 :)

I would say #3 but will hope for #2 :)

Me too. Hoping for #2.

#1 seems most logical. We've been hearing that for over a year anyway on other projects, so why not just continue to rely on that information.

^^For all we know, construction could restart on the Peacock and start on the Pinnacle next week. :yes:

:nuts: I have never heard Charleston, SC listed as a finalist for the VW plant. Something tells me somebody doesn't have all of their facts straight: http://www.ajc.com/metro/content/business/stories/2008/01/25/volkswagen_0126.html

Upstate property among potential VW sites (http://http://www.charleston.net/news/2008/jan/21/upstate_property_among_potential_vw_site28130/)

Monday, January 21, 2008

South Carolina may be in the hunt for a Volkswagen AG manufacturing plant, but reports that the Charleston region is in the running appear to be off track.

The Upstate, already home to BMW — well, that's another matter.

VW is scouting sites of at least 1,000 acres, and the Carolinas and Georgia are leading the race, according to trade journal Automotive News, which broke the story last week. The Wolfsburg, Germany-based automaker hopes to find a suitable property soon in order to start production by 2011.

VW has confirmed that is it looking at opening a second North American plant — the other is in Mexico — while stressing that it has not picked a site. A decision is expected soon, a senior company official said last week at the North American International Auto Show in Detroit. BusinessWeek reported that the plant would crank out 200,000 vehicles annually and require as many as 2,500 workers on its payroll.

Automotive News said VW is kicking the tires at two North Carolina sites as well as property in South Carolina near Anderson, which is within an hour of the BMW plant in Greer. It's also near a built-in galaxy of suppliers, not to mention Clemson University's automotive research center.

Charleston's name has cropped up in a report or two about the VW plant search, but only because it would offer the company relatively easy access to a deepwater port from the Upstate.

I think the upstate has the best chance of coming out on top for VW.

^The only thing that has me worried is the purchase of the large tract of land by a group of German investors in the Rocky Mount area. To me, that doesn't bode too well for us. But I'm still holding out hope.

^^Yeah, same here. The good news is that they are looking at more than one site to put several different plants, so there is a shot Rocky Mount and Anderson could both get plants. Which type of plant both places get remains to be seen though. :yes:

^The only thing that has me worried is the purchase of the large tract of land by a group of German investors in the Rocky Mount area. To me, that doesn't bode too well for us. But I'm still holding out hope.Do you believe the company would display such blatantly poor character though? I mean, to have your spokesperson say that the company is still looking, "while stressing that it has not picked a site." It seems to me that if they have indeed already purchased the property, it would be unnecessary to lie about that to the public. They could simply deny to answer any questions regarding the chosen property until the press release instead of saying one thing and actually doing another so carelessly. Am I thinking rationally here??? :confused:

^^Maybe seeing how Stephen Jacoby said they were all silly rumors. :) Just because some farmer said a bunch of Germans were buying his property several months ago does not mean they are today nor does it mean he was telling the truth. Heck, it could be a bunch of Germans but not VW. It could also be the opposite of that though too. Maybe it is VW. Who knows. I guess we'll find out for real on January 28th because that's when that property is scheduled to close.

Skyliner, I would hope not. However, there have been cases where pending developments have leaked a bit. I guess we'll just have to see how this one plays out.

Cascades at Verdae:
http://img84.imageshack.us/img84/7769/010sb0.jpg

http://img84.imageshack.us/img84/5516/009ig6.jpg

http://img84.imageshack.us/img84/7029/011vw4.jpg

http://img84.imageshack.us/img84/9731/012ny7.jpg

http://img84.imageshack.us/img84/1028/008la3.jpg

Carolina First corporate headquarters:
http://img84.imageshack.us/img84/6565/006wp4.jpg

http://img84.imageshack.us/img84/1084/007re6.jpg

http://img84.imageshack.us/img84/6029/005ji2.jpg

http://img84.imageshack.us/img84/3770/004vg1.jpg

Acadia:
http://img84.imageshack.us/img84/9603/036sg9.jpg

The Paddlehouse & the Riverhouse-
http://img84.imageshack.us/img84/5992/014dx9.jpg

http://img84.imageshack.us/img84/140/015sl0.jpg

http://img84.imageshack.us/img84/8813/016hv2.jpg

http://img84.imageshack.us/img84/8482/021zr6.jpg

http://img84.imageshack.us/img84/5452/017lh4.jpg

http://img84.imageshack.us/img84/6399/018ho6.jpg

Walking/bike path-
http://img84.imageshack.us/img84/3281/022ka1.jpg

http://img84.imageshack.us/img84/9176/023pc2.jpg

The Pavilion-
http://img84.imageshack.us/img84/7880/025vv5.jpg

Southern Connector toll road/booth from the Pavilion-
http://img84.imageshack.us/img84/9016/026nr4.jpg

Homes-
http://img84.imageshack.us/img84/9523/024iz3.jpg

http://img84.imageshack.us/img84/4065/028ly5.jpg

http://img84.imageshack.us/img84/2263/029pj3.jpg

http://img84.imageshack.us/img84/1875/030xv1.jpg

http://img84.imageshack.us/img84/7805/031bi1.jpg

http://img84.imageshack.us/img84/5724/027qr5.jpg

http://img84.imageshack.us/img84/6460/035cb5.jpg

http://img84.imageshack.us/img84/6793/032xe1.jpg

g-man, thanks for the continuous photo updates :okay:

^^For all we know, construction could restart on the Peacock and start on the Pinnacle next week. :yes:

Catfish could have kittens too! LOL!:lol: But I would be happy if it were true.:banana:

^^Let's just say this project has a greater chance of starting within the next week or two than it's had within the past year or two. And you're welcome Raleigh-NC. :okay:

Hey, Gman- Thanks. In the first post of pictures, that entire first portion is the Cascades? I had no idea they were that far along with that portion of the development. I guess I've based my understanding of the progress of Verdae on the Hollingsworth Park portion, which is taking forever it seems, though it's understandable that things must be done... yea yea... But what they have done getting the utilities and whatnot in there looks good. I'm just ready to see some homes going up!:banana:

^^Yes. The Cascades is moving along a lot faster than Hollingsworth Park. :yes: Not sure why it's taking them so long to start building the homes. :dunno:

^^Let's just say this project has a greater chance of starting within the next week or two than it's had within the past year or two. And you're welcome Raleigh-NC. :okay:

If it does start, let's hope it is a steel structure, not a concrete pillar one. A steel structure goes up so much quicker. Maybe the height will dictate steel.

^^The Pinnacle on Main will be built out of concrete. A steel skeleton would go up much faster, but Bob Ellis wants this to be LEED certified gold and a steel structure over a concrete one would not make this building gold certified. :yes: I asked him about that several months ago. Also, most highrises are built out of concrete not steel. Just look at the Peacock for example.

i heard rumors that the piedmont iga is becoming a piggly wiggly?
could someone please confirm...:gossip:

^^The who? :dunno: What's iga? Sorry, I have been to Piedmont this many times in my life: zero. Maybe I need to take a ride through there sometime. :lol: The sad part is that it's less than 10 minutes from where I live. :nuts:

It was a piggly wiggly before it was an IGA.

^^I still don't know what IGA is, but i'm guessing it's a grocery store. Never heard of them before. Is there only like one in existence? :dunno:

IGA (http://www.iga.com/) is a fairly "large" name among local grocery stores. I visited the one in Piedmont a couple times and it was nice. They had an Anderson Meat Market there as well.

I have never heard of IGA either.

they must be downsizing because i know of several IGA closures in both WI and MI. but piggly wiggly is expaning in WI-idk, my source may be pulling my leg. i'll try to get more info.

IGA stands for Independent Grocers Alliance. You can read more about it here http://www.iga.com/aboutIGA/history.asp

No, that is not me on urbanplanet, but I do have time for you guys. I would honestly love to come back. I even sent metro'm an apology email last week, but he never got back to me. Figures. If they did let me back on there, then I would be back in a heartbeat and the Greenville section wouldn't be dead anymore. :yes:

-I noticed something recently that was very disturbing to me. Somebody posted in the Woolworth redevelopment thread on urbanplanet not too long ago wondering what is going on with that project and nobody answered that person's question. I thought that was pretty low especially seeing how there was a GSA Business article on the development just a week earlier. I would of stepped up to the plate and answered that person's question. I suggest somebody who is a forum member currently on there do the same. :)

Let's see how long it takes somebody to post this article on Urbanplanet. Where's the whistling emotion? ;) I personally wouldn't mind seeing the Go Center go where that ugly parking lot is currently at the intersection of Main and Broad Streets. :yes:

Blue Wall tourist center would use old Camp Spearhead

Published: Sunday, January 27, 2008 - 7:38 am

By Nan Lundeen-The Greenville News

To showcase the Upstate's mountain scenery, they figure what better jumping off point for a tourist information center than the old Camp Spearhead off State 11 at the edge of the Blue Ridge Mountains and state parks such as Caesars Head.

Potentially named the Blue Wall Center after a Cherokee name for the mountains, it would serve with its proposed companion center, the Go! Experience in downtown Greenville, to draw tourists.

"This fits really well with the strategy that we have about positioning Greenville as a weekend getaway destination," said Chris Stone, president of the Greenville Convention & Visitors Bureau, lead agency for the projects.

Greenville County's hospitality tax would provide $5 million toward each center, which are estimated to cost $10 million each and to be built by 2010, Stone said. The bureau is hunting a site for the 20,000-square-foot downtown facility and expects to draw up specifics for each project in the next six months.

Of the Blue Wall, Dr. Bill Ranson, who chairs the Department of Earth and Environmental Sciences at Furman University, said, "Being at the foot of the Blue Ridge escarpment there are lots of waterfalls and beautifully clean water falling off the mountains down onto the Piedmont."

Ranson, who served on a charette that created concepts for the two centers, said the Blue Wall area is "important for the biodiversity of the plant life and wildlife," and the slopes would be sensitive to human activity.

"I think it's probably a good location because it's an established site," he said. "They wouldn't have to disturb another place."

Proposed plans include an aviary, an observatory, an encounter center, a café and inns.

The bureau, which is working with the Greenville County Recreation District and other agencies, is talking with Naturaland Trust, owner of the 170 acres where the center could locate.

Camp Spearhead, which serves children with special needs, hasn't given Naturaland a firm date when it would move to its new location at Pleasant Ridge County Park, said George Schackel, Naturaland projects director.

A booklet produced from the charette suggests 'green' or environmentally sensitive buildings and "sustainable means of group transport."

Ranson said while tourism is good economically, he's concerned about impact, such as cars "spewing out carbon dioxide."

"The Smokies is a perfect example of a national park we've almost loved to death," he said. "I wouldn't want to see that happen to Highway 11. We can do it better."

-I noticed something recently that was very disturbing to me. Somebody posted in the Woolworth redevelopment thread on urbanplanet not too long ago wondering what is going on with that project and nobody answered that person's question. I thought that was pretty low especially seeing how there was a GSA Business article on the development just a week earlier. I would of stepped up to the plate and answered that person's question. I suggest somebody who is a forum member currently on there do the same. :)


A lot of questions go without answers on UP now. Many of us are busy or have "moved on".

^^Wrong time to get busy and move on wouldn't you say? ;) How come you guys weren't busy two years ago? You were working then and you're working now. What's the difference? Right?

Greenville May Take Over Bus System
GTA Vote Tonight

Monday, Jan 28, 2008 - 12:49 PM

By Kristen Nastasia-WSPA

The Greenville Transit Authority's Board of Directors approved a move that would have the system entering into an agreement with the City of Greenville.

Under the new system, to save money, City of Greenville workers and GTA would merge eliminating double costs. GTA's board would remain, receiving state and federal grant money.

According to Matt Carter, Chairman of the GTA Board, "the agreement will help stabilize transit operations, providing a firm foundation for future transit improvements."

The Greenville City Coucil will vote tonight on the measure.




Lockheed to extend lease at Donaldson
The agreement secures about 1,000 jobs at the industrial park

Published: Monday, January 28, 2008 - 11:51 am

By Rudolph Bell-The Greenville News

Lockheed Martin Corp. has agreed to a five-year extension of its master lease at the Donaldson Center airfield, a company spokeswoman said Monday.

By signing the extension, Lockheed indicated its intention to keep about 1,000 jobs at the industrial park in southern Greenville County at least through the summer of 2012, when the extension expires. Lockheed, a major defense contractor, refurbishes and upgrades military planes at Donaldson Center.

"We’re very pleased that we were able to partner with Donaldson Center and negotiate a mutually beneficial lease agreement," said Lockheed spokeswoman Candy Eslinger.

The Maryland-based company had insisted on airfield improvements during lease negotiations, and Donaldson Center officials struggled for more than a year to find the money.

It finally came through in September, when the state Budget and Control Board voted to provide nearly $2 million from the state Energy Office. Another $1 million was secured through the Appalachian Regional Commission.

Where is everyone? Has the POM started yet? :banana:

Where is everyone? Has the POM started yet? :banana:

The Pinnacle on Main hasn't started yet obviously and this is where everybody is at: http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=513289&page=57

From the McGarey Group:

Magnolia Park
Everything Possible, Everything Here

Located in the center of Greenville’s most popular shopping district, Magnolia Park is a 65-acre redevelopment strategically located at the merge of I-85, I-385, and Woodruff Road in Greenville, South Carolina. Nestled within the city’s fastest growing residential, retail, and office corridors, Magnolia Park will become one of the largest retail centers in Upstate South Carolina and will be a landmark destination of better living and shopping for the entire region.

Opening in Fall of 2009, Magnolia Park will capitalize on its exceptional visibility and access featuring a powerful combination of retail, restaurants, 20-screen Regal Cinema, hotel, and office uses. Upon completion, this mixed-use Town Center will be over 1,000,000 square feet to include:

410,000 SF Specialty and Anchor Retail


75,000 SF Restaurants


80,000 SF, 20 Screen, 3,680 Seat Regal Cinema


100,000 SF Office


70,000 SF boutique scale hotel with 135 keys (I thought it was supposed to be 375 rooms. :dunno:)


150,000 SF Costco


Supporting 190,000 SF community center including Old Navy, Bed Bath & Beyond, Shoe Carnival, Party City, Rooms to Go, Comp USA, and Atlanta Bread Company.
Magnolia Park is surrounded by 70 Corporate Headquarters with more than 75 Fortune 500 companies including BMW, Michelin, Hubbel, Microsoft, and IBM. The average annual household income is $72,500 and rising, and Greenville retail sales continue to boom with a 39% growth rate over the past six years alone.

Magnolia Park was designed by the world-class architectural firm of Development Design Group (www.ddg-usa.com) and is being developed by Menin Development Companies (www.menindevelopment.com)

Join the Development that is going to change the critical point of commerce for Greenville and its surrounding communities.

This quote really says a lot about our metro:

"Magnolia Park is surrounded by 70 Corporate Headquarters with more than 75 Fortune 500 companies including BMW, Michelin, Hubbel, Microsoft, and IBM. The average annual household income is $72,500 and rising, and Greenville retail sales continue to boom with a 39% growth rate over the past six years alone."

That really puts the business and corporate aspect of our area into perspective. Very impressive!

That is a very encouraging statement :banana:.


Man they better get cranking if they plan to open by fall 2009! :uh:

^^That's almost two years away. Plenty of time to start construction, which by the way will happen in the Spring. Gsupstate and his Menin cowards won't admit though. Kind of glad the Point might not happen now. Could help downtown instead of hurt it.

It says over 1MM SF to include...

It lists the already there theater and costco, and the supporting 190sf shopping center. This means that over 400ksf is already present. Doesn't sound like they will really be adding as much as they make it sound?

^^It will start construction this Spring. Gsupstate and his Menin cowards won't admit though which is illegal by the way under the freedom of information act.

Along with everything else in Gville :lol::bash:


Ever seen "The Money Pit?" When asked when the house would be finished the answer was always, "oh, about two weeks." :lol:

^^I edited my post man. :lol:

It says over 1MM SF to include...

It lists the already there theater and costco, and the supporting 190sf shopping center. This means that over 400ksf is already present. Doesn't sound like they will really be adding as much as they make it sound?

I'm confused. :nuts: The Greenville News article says this:
Menin Development plans nearly 616,000 square feet of shopping, 375,000 square feet of office space, 180,000 square feet of housing and a 375-room hotel at the development. That is totally different than what it says on the McGarey Group's website. Who's right? :dunno:

^^Ah. Sneaky. :lol: Just responding to the first sentence.

I'm hoping the Greenville News is the right one. :yes:

^^^^I would have to go witht the official website. The Gville news isn't always totally accurate. :nuts: Maybe they scaled back? :dunno:

^^^^I would have to go witht the official website. The Gville news isn't always totally accurate. :nuts: Maybe they scaled back? :dunno:

But the Greenville News got their information from the documents available at City Hall. They couldn't of scaled it back that much that fast. Maybe McGarey didn't list everything that would be included on their website. :dunno:

Coincidence? It's German and involves Audi/Volkswagen:

German glass firm to open plant in S.C.

Richard Fritz Inc. of Germany will open a $6 million, 63-employee automotive glass factory in Duncan in Spartanburg County, the state Department of Commerce announced Thursday.

Richard Fritz is a supplier to Land Rover, Porsche, GM, Audi, Lamborghini, Saab, Ford, Mercedes and Volkswagen.

Richard Fritz, Inc. Announces New Facility in Duncan, S.C.
Investment to bring 63 New Jobs to Spartanburg County

News release-South Carolina Department of Commerce

COLUMBIA, S.C. - The South Carolina Department of Commerce today announced that Richard Fritz, Inc. will locate a new facility in Spartanburg County. The $6 million investment will initially create 63 new jobs at the Duncan facility.

The Richard Fritz Group produces glass encapsulation, rubber and plastic moldings and components, and modular systems for the automotive industry. Richard Fritz, Inc. will produce encapsulated automotive glass at its Duncan facility. Worldwide, the company is a supplier to Land Rover, Porsche, GM, Audi, Lamborghini, Saab, Ford, Mercedes, Daimler, Volkswagen, Audi, and more.

“Today’s announcement is another sign that our efforts to better the economic soil conditions for business are working to attract new investment. As well, this news signals that South Carolina’s automotive industry continues to grow and create job opportunities. We remain committed to continuing our efforts to strengthen the state’s business climate and promote economic growth throughout the state,” said Gov. Mark Sanford.

“Spartanburg County enthusiastically welcomes the addition of Richard Fritz, Inc. to the existing international automotive cluster that has been established in our community. Their decision to locate here in Spartanburg County demonstrates our community’s ability to attract quality companies providing new job opportunities for the citizens of Spartanburg. We welcome them to our area and look forward to seeing them grow here,” said Carter Smith, Executive Vice President, Economic Futures Group, Spartanburg Area Chamber of Commerce.

“Richard Fritz is a long-time automotive supplier with a strong European presence. The company’s decision to locate in South Carolina is speaks to the strength of our state’s automotive sector, business climate, and workforce. Richard Fritz is a welcomed addition to Spartanburg County and the state’s business community,” said Joe Taylor, Secretary of Commerce.

Richard Fritz, Inc. was established in 1946 in Stuttgart, Germany as a wholesaler for rubber and plastic moldings and is a leader in glass encapsulation. In addition to the company’s facility in South Carolina, Richard Fritz, Inc. has two facilities in Germany and additional operations in Slovakia, Hungary, Spain, and France.

Pretty soon they're going to have to add more gates to the A terminal. Only gate B4 is used for Northwest and with direct flights to three different cities by mid-2008, I wouldn't think there would be enough room around that gate to hold more than 2 planes:


Minneapolis/St. Paul-Greenville/Spartanburg

Northwest will start daily nonstop service between its Minneapolis/St. Paul hub and Greenville/Spartanburg, S.C. on May 2, 2008. Operated by Pinnacle Airlines using 50-seat CRJ 200 aircraft, flight 5640 will depart Minneapolis/St. Paul at 1:10 p.m. and arrive in Greenville/Spartanburg at 4:47 p.m. Flight 5641 will depart Greenville/Spartanburg at 5:35 p.m. and arrive at Minneapolis/St. Paul at 7:31 p.m. Northwest currently serves Greenville/Spartanburg from its Detroit and Memphis hubs.

Northwest is offering 1,000 WorldPerks Bonus Miles for roundtrip travel between Minneapolis/St. Paul and Greenville/Spartanburg from May 2 through June 30, 2008. Instant online enrollment is available at www.nwa.com. Registration is required prior to travel. Additional terms and conditions apply. For complete details visit www.nwa.com/offers/mspgsp08.

Only three more weeks until...

http://i259.photobucket.com/albums/hh303/g-man435/2008_Classic_800x600_2.jpg

^^^^I would have to go witht the official website. The Gville news isn't always totally accurate. :nuts: Maybe they scaled back? :dunno:


I'll help clarify. First, nothing has been scaled back.
There is currently only about 225,000 sq ft. present in what will be the "Town Center".....Costco and the theaters.

The 190,000 currently where Old Navy, Party City, etc are located is not considered part of the "Town Center", this is why the wording list this section as "supporting community center".

Also, please keep in mind, the square footage numbers are not total building square footage....the parking decks (which will be sizable) are not included in this square footage.

Pretty soon they're going to have to add more gates to the A terminal. Only gate B4 is used for Northwest and with direct flights to three different cities by mid-2008, I wouldn't think there would be enough room around that gate to hold more than 2 planes:

Minneapolis/St. Paul-Greenville/Spartanburg

Northwest will start daily nonstop service between its Minneapolis/St. Paul hub and Greenville/Spartanburg, S.C. on May 2, 2008. Operated by Pinnacle Airlines using 50-seat CRJ 200 aircraft, flight 5640 will depart Minneapolis/St. Paul at 1:10 p.m. and arrive in Greenville/Spartanburg at 4:47 p.m. Flight 5641 will depart Greenville/Spartanburg at 5:35 p.m. and arrive at Minneapolis/St. Paul at 7:31 p.m. Northwest currently serves Greenville/Spartanburg from its Detroit and Memphis hubs.

That is great to hear, but I am confused because I thought we already had one flight each day from GSP to Minneapolis-St. Paul. Perhaps they cancelled it and are now adding it back, but I am fairly certain I have seen that flight on the flight board at GSP in the past. Can anyone else confirm whether I am right or just crazy? :nuts:

That is great to hear, but I am confused because I thought we already had one flight each day from GSP to Minneapolis-St. Paul. Perhaps they cancelled it and are now adding it back, but I am fairly certain I have seen that flight on the flight board at GSP in the past. Can anyone else confirm whether I am right or just crazy? :nuts:

I'm not entirely sure about the past, but I know my parents went out there last year and had to be routed through Chicago... so perhaps they stopped it for a little while?

GSP has never had a direct route to Minneapolis with Northwest to my knowledge. Me and my family only fly Northwest due to the Worldperks membership we have with them. :yes:

I'll help clarify. First, nothing has been scaled back.
There is currently only about 225,000 sq ft. present in what will be the "Town Center".....Costco and the theaters.

The 190,000 currently where Old Navy, Party City, etc are located is not considered part of the "Town Center", this is why the wording list this section as "supporting community center".

Also, please keep in mind, the square footage numbers are not total building square footage....the parking decks (which will be sizable) are not included in this square footage.

Oh, so we have to subtract 225,000 square feet of it that's already there? Man that sucks. :rant: Also, what about the 375 room hotel that was supposed to be part of this development? I don't see it listed. Somebody's lying. :fiddle:

Oh, so we have to subtract 225,000 square feet of it that's already there? Man that sucks. :rant: Also, what about the 375 room hotel that was supposed to be part of this development? I don't see it listed. Somebody's lying. :fiddle:
You think it sucks?? :bash: G-man....get a clue.

This is a large development, but the key focus of this development is "quality" over "quantity".
If you want a couple million square feet, go have some developer throw up 10 or 12 Wal-Mart stores for you. :lol:

The hotel is listed...."boutique hotel". I'm not involved in the discussions on the hotel portion.

^^It's going to be another Peacock. :cry: Another hotel project reduced in size. :nuts:

This is a large development, but the key focus of this development is "quality" over "quantity".
If you want a couple million square feet, go have some developer throw up 10 or 12 Wal-Mart stores for you. :lol:


:lol:

I can see it now: A developer buys a huge 500-acre parcel of land in Cowpens, SC anchored by a Wal-Mart Supercenter on each end. The "town center" portion will be the parcels in-between and will consist of the following:

-Sally Beauty Supply
-Dollar Tree
-Great Clips
-Ultra Tan
-Super Nails
-Mail Boxes Etc.
-Tractor Supply
-Feed & Seed

Those are just some of the special attractions to this wonderful development. Since it will be one of the largest retail developments anywhere, it will obviously have some themed features including:

-NASCAR store
-Museum dedicated to the history of Wal-Mart (many of the holdings will come from Bentonville, AR where it all started)
-Bass Pro Shops

There will also be an "ethnic" wing of the town center with a Chinese restaurant, pizza place, and french fry stand. The "promenade" connecting the town center's main thoroughfare will consist of art and relics from cultured cities like Paris, KY, Florence, SC, Rome, GA, and a very special surprise from Venice, CA.

Country music will be piped in at all times, of course. Saturday mornings and afternoons will feature folk and bluegrass music as well. There will also be a huge microbrewery with some of the finest beers brewed on-site, including Busch Light, Pabst Blue Ribbon, and Natural Light. No bottles will be available - just cans.

There will also be an RV lot and campground. They will leave an undeveloped portion that could potentially go "upscale" in the form of a Motel 6.

The policy for the entire experience is "No Shirt? No shoes? No problem!"

Okay g-man, clean off your keyboard. And stop worrying about Magnolia Park. It's going to be great!

[lQUOTE=Greenville;18126087]:lol:

I can see it now: A developer buys a huge 500-acre parcel of land in Cowpens, SC anchored by a Wal-Mart Supercenter on each end. The "town center" portion will be the parcels in-between and will consist of the following:

-Sally Beauty Supply
-Dollar Tree
-Great Clips
-Ultra Tan
-Super Nails
-Mail Boxes Etc.
-Tractor Supply
-Feed & Seed

Those are just some of the special attractions to this wonderful development. Since it will be one of the largest retail developments anywhere, it will obviously have some themed features including:

-NASCAR store
-Museum dedicated to the history of Wal-Mart (many of the holdings will come from Bentonville, AR where it all started)
-Bass Pro Shops

There will also be an "ethnic" wing of the town center with a Chinese restaurant, pizza place, and french fry stand. The "promenade" connecting the town center's main thoroughfare will consist of art and relics from cultured cities like Paris, KY, Florence, SC, Rome, GA, and a very special surprise from Venice, CA.

Country music will be piped in at all times, of course. Saturday mornings and afternoons will feature folk and bluegrass music as well. There will also be a huge microbrewery with some of the finest beers brewed on-site, including Busch Light, Pabst Blue Ribbon, and Natural Light. No bottles will be available - just cans.

There will also be an RV lot and campground. They will leave an undeveloped portion that could potentially go "upscale" in the form of a Motel 6.

The policy for the entire experience is "No Shirt? No shoes? No problem!"

Okay g-man, clean off your keyboard. And stop worrying about Magnolia Park. It's going to be great![/QUOTE]



:rofl::rofl::rofl:

LMAO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
And this sentence: "No bottles will be available - just cans"............firmly burns the mental image!!!!

^^It's going to be horrible. I can see it now. :cry: It's going to stall and everything else. Heck, it hasn't even started construction yet. Don't be hatin on Bass Pro Shops. That is actually a very nice store. :D

^^It's going to be horrible. I can see it now. :cry: It's going to stall and everything else. Heck, it hasn't even started construction yet. Don't be hatin on Bass Pro Shops. That is actually a very nice store. :D

You know I had to throw in Bass Pro Shops, just for you. I hope we end up getting one, because it is a cool store and will draw a lot of people to Greenville.

TBA's from this week's Greenville Journal:

-Target is once again said to be looking to build a new store in Greenville. Plans for a SuperTarget on Pelham Road met with fierce resistance from neighbors last year...

-The city plans to make some annexations along Woodruff Road near Sulphur Springs Road...

-The slow revitalization of Poinsett Highway continues. Bruce Plaza has become the latest shopping center to get a facelift. Several more buildings along the corridor leading to downtown will also get new looks in the next few months...

-The former city collision building on the edge of downtown is undergoing a voluntary environmental cleanup. This could be the first step in long-expected improvements to the area near Hollis Highway...

-Look for an update soon on the county's 10-year comprehensive plan. Mellone Long, the county's recently appointed planning director, will talk to Chamber of Commerce members on Feb. 7...

-The Eastside Area Council will host a discussion on Feb. 14 about future developments along Woodruff Road...

-Expect to see some changes coming to the downtown Greenville Transit Authority's transfer station. Business and community leaders want to see the terminal look more inviting and not so dark...

-Nominations are being accepted for the Silver Crescent Awards, which are given to companies excelling in manufacturing. There are more than 5,000 manufacturers in South Carolina. The Silver Crescent Foundation will announce the winners in May...

-The city is working on its federal budget wish list. High on the list is money for teh Meadowbrook/Cleveland Park West Park project as well as putting more curves in the Reedy River downtown. City officials also want money for the proposed rapid transit that would connect downtown to the Clemson automotive research park...

CU-ICAR announces partnership with INTEC

CLEMSON — The Clemson University International Center for Automotive Research (CU-ICAR) Friday announced INTEC U.S. Inc., a German software company headquartered in Munich (INTEC GmbH), has selected the CU-ICAR campus as headquarters for its first U.S. presence. A technology leader in software for the automotive industry, INTEC will provide multi-body and real-time simulation software to CU-ICAR graduate students and professors.

“The new environment we see being created here at CU-ICAR, the academic research coupled with industrial partnership, creates tremendous collaboration potential. It is the environment we want to be in to introduce our products and services to the automotive sector and other industries in the United States,” said INTEC founder and President Alex Eichberger.

INTEC’s SIMPACK software will support the development of mechanical or mechatronic devices. It can be used for such simple mechanisms as door latches or complex full-vehicle models that include cars, airplanes, wind turbines, trains and engines. It is currently being used by such companies as BMW, Daimler, Bombardier and Bosch.

“This is cutting-edge technology in automotive and aerospace design,” said mechanical engineering chairman and professor Imtiaz Haque. “We will be able to do virtual prototyping and testing research that will support the auto industry in developing processes that get vehicles to market more efficiently with greater cost-savings.”

“SIMPACK will aid in the advancement of the emerging area known as mechatronics,” said John Ziegert, the Timken Chair in Automotive Design and Development and professor of mechanical engineering. “It’s the combination of mechanics, electronics, control engineering and computing that makes it possible to attain simpler, more economical, reliable and versatile systems.”

INTEC hopes to spawn 15 software technology jobs at its CU-ICAR campus location in the next five years.

The South Carolina Department of Commerce and the state of South Carolina have partnered with Clemson to recruit investment and build CU-ICAR to be an economic development agent utilizing Clemson’s strengths in automotive engineering to grow the state’s automotive industry and related fields

“INTEC’s advanced-technology application spans both basic and complex mechanisms and is being used by automotive leaders throughout the world,” said South Carolina Department of Commerce Secretary Joe Taylor. “The company’s decision to locate in South Carolina further demonstrates the strengths of our state’s economy and the potential towards growing South Carolina’s knowledge-based economy with high-tech and high-paying jobs.”

CU-ICAR is a new model for economic development in South Carolina, matching Clemson’s strengths in automotive engineering with the state’s strong automotive economic cluster. Located in the heart of the Interstate 85 corridor, midway between Charlotte, N.C., and Atlanta, Ga., CU-ICAR is ideally situated in the Southeastern automotive and motorsports economy.

CU-ICAR is a 250-acre “technopolis” where BMW, Michelin, Timken, Sun Microsystems and other corporate partners are joining with Clemson to focus on automotive research and other transportation and advanced-manufacturing issues.

The state of South Carolina also is a key partner, having created legislation to support economic development and innovation. For example, the Research Centers of Economic Excellence Endowed Chairs Program matches private funding to recruit top faculty. CU-ICAR has four endowed chairs created through the program. Three of these chairs, along with five junior faculty positions, have been filled. These faculty members, along with other faculty from the main campus, form the academic team for one of the nation’s most exceptional master’s and doctoral degree programs in automotive engineering. The doctoral program is one of the first in the country.

Coincidence I went out today and took pics of the campus:
http://i259.photobucket.com/albums/hh303/g-man435/016.jpg

Future site of Collaboration 1 buildings:
http://i259.photobucket.com/albums/hh303/g-man435/015.jpg

Garden area on top floor of parking garage:
http://i259.photobucket.com/albums/hh303/g-man435/017.jpg

http://i259.photobucket.com/albums/hh303/g-man435/019.jpg

http://i259.photobucket.com/albums/hh303/g-man435/018.jpg

Campbell Graduate Center-
http://i259.photobucket.com/albums/hh303/g-man435/012.jpg

http://i259.photobucket.com/albums/hh303/g-man435/013.jpg

http://i259.photobucket.com/albums/hh303/g-man435/024.jpg

http://i259.photobucket.com/albums/hh303/g-man435/025.jpg

http://i259.photobucket.com/albums/hh303/g-man435/027.jpg

Ponds with creek in between-
http://i259.photobucket.com/albums/hh303/g-man435/021.jpg

http://i259.photobucket.com/albums/hh303/g-man435/020.jpg

Plaza-
http://i259.photobucket.com/albums/hh303/g-man435/014.jpg

http://i259.photobucket.com/albums/hh303/g-man435/023.jpg

http://i259.photobucket.com/albums/hh303/g-man435/026.jpg

http://i259.photobucket.com/albums/hh303/g-man435/022.jpg




Fresh Market shopping center complex:
http://i259.photobucket.com/albums/hh303/g-man435/003.jpg

http://i259.photobucket.com/albums/hh303/g-man435/006.jpg

http://i259.photobucket.com/albums/hh303/g-man435/005.jpg

Those photos of ICAR are nice, but nothing like seeing it from I-85. It is totally stunning, sleek, and futuristic. :)

Thanks for the update pics and Journal TBA's.

I particularly like the CU-ICAR pictures! I love the graduate school. It's so fascinating.:cheers:

All this is well and good, but what about the POM????????????????????????:banana:

^^Go here man: http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=513289&page=57 How many times do I have to tell you? :lol:

:okay: You guys should enjoy this presentation of CU-ICAR: http://www.tennvalleycorridor.org/library/REV%20Geolas%20Nov%2019_1196797804.ppt There was a really good story in a recent issue of the Greenville Journal on CU-ICAR and how students are now attending the Graduate Center there. I wish I would of saved it and typed it up, so everybody could read it. It also said construction on the Collaboration 1 buildings could start towards the end of this year.


http://i259.photobucket.com/albums/hh303/g-man435/Picture1.jpg

Aerials:
http://i259.photobucket.com/albums/hh303/g-man435/cu-icar_tn1_aerial1.jpg

http://i259.photobucket.com/albums/hh303/g-man435/cu-icar_aerial2.jpg

A look inside the Graduate Center under construction:
http://i259.photobucket.com/albums/hh303/g-man435/CGEC002.jpg

http://i259.photobucket.com/albums/hh303/g-man435/CGEC001.jpg

Who was it again that is going to build multiple highrises on the gateway site in downtown Greenville: http://www.independentmail.com/news/2008/feb/01/lake-keowee-development-now-has-ten-buildings/

Happy Groundhog Day everybody. :D :lol: I wonder if Phil will see his shadow.

Phil saw his shadow, so get ready for global freezing :lol: Thanks for the rendering and update photos!!!

52 stupid NIMBY'S oppose this: http://www.greenvillecounty.org/County_Council/_Agenda/PSPD/CZ-2007-65.pdf Glad to see the Planning Commission recommends approval of it.

I am opposed to the rezoning of that property as well. How can eliminating all multifamily housing be considered wise for the future sustainability of that area? The County has long-range plans for a reason. Allowing strip malls to go up at a whim just doesn't show clear resolve to successfully accomplish our vision.

^^It's a mixed-use development Skyliner. Wake up man. :weird: That's why the planning commission recommends approval of it. Just houses there wouldn't make it mixed-use.

:lol: I hope Magnolia Park has a Cluckin' Bell. Doesn't get more high-end than that: http://www.cluckinbellhappychicken.com/ (Be sure to turn on your computer speakers ;))

Dale and Thomas Popcorn is currently in negotiations to put a store at Magnolia Park Town Center. They have a location currently at Menin's other high-end development Downtown at the Gardens in Palm Beach, FL. Gsupstate, you give away these things too easily. :lol: Thanks man. ;)

O-CHA Tea Bar (http://www.myspace.com/ochateabar) is re-opening tomorrow at 300 RiverPlace, Suite 122, next to Art Crossing. :)

^^Thanks man. My mom wants to go buy tea there and was wondering when it was going to re-open. :okay:

Be sure to check this out. Goes to County Council tomorrow: http://www.greenvillecounty.org/County_Council/_Agenda/Council/Triparty%20Resolution%20GTA%20208%20(1).pdf and http://www.greenvillecounty.org/County_Council/_Agenda/Council/Transit%20Triparty%20Agreement%20108.pdf

Council gives final nod to city-operated bus system
Change will have zero effect of budget, city manager says

Published: Monday, February 4, 2008 - 7:37 pm

By Ben Szobody-The Greenville News

Greenville City Council remained divided but gave final approval today to a $677,000 budget amendment to fund what will be a city-operated bus system come April.

City manager Jim Bourey told council he had "very thoroughly" reviewed 22 objections to the city's takeover plan from local consultant Bob Lloyd and remained convinced the city's operations agreement with the Greenville Transit Authority is on "very solid ground."

Mayor Knox White called the 4-3 roll call the "defining vote" for the future of local transit, which has been weighed down by inadequate funding, route cuts and more than a year of political debate.

Today's budget amendment creates a new city fund to pay for the bus system's operation, including a $292,157 appropriation for fleet maintenance. Bourey said the new costs will be covered by payments from GTA, making the net effect on the city budget zero.
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Councilwoman Lillian Brock Flemming renewed previous objections that the city's operations plan contains too much speculation, leaves crucial transit problems unanswered and hasn't allowed enough public input.

Councilwoman Chandra Dillard asked Bourey for the federal government's definition of an "intergovernmental agreement" -- a standard Lloyd has said the city-GTA deal doesn't meet, which he said throws into doubt other aspects of the deal. Bourey said he'd send it to her later.

Flemming, Dillard and Diane Smock have opposed the city plan, saying it is a major taxpayer risk staked on inadequate due diligence.

In the short term, city officials say they want to put GTA on a solid footing that could include more frequent routes and may attract investment from stakeholders like Greenville Technical College.

Long term, the city-run system will look to leverage 80 percent federal matching funds to potentially add bus shelters and a rapid bus line from downtown to the developing automotive research park.

So the City is definitely running GTA (based on tonight's City Council vote), but tomorrow night's County Council meeting is to determine whether the County still wants to be involved with public transit in Greenville - correct?

^^Correct. :)

You might be adding Livnsidout to the list of stalled projects. It appears the owner doesnt have the funds to keep paying for too much longer.....ill keep you updated.

Anyone ever heard of Southern Tide Polos (http://www.southerntide.net/)? It meant nothing to me until I read this article (http://www.tmcnet.com/usubmit/2007/11/26/3120580.htm). Pretty nice to have in town, along with other local apparel businesses like OOBE (http://oobe.com/). :)

Wow, that's great! Does anyone know of additional store that you can find their shirts? I'd love to check them out and possibly do my part to help them grow through purchasing.

Maybe some day soon they'll be able to open a Southern Tide store on Main Street. :)

Anyone ever heard of Southern Tide Polos (http://www.southerntide.net/)? It meant nothing to me until I read this article (http://www.tmcnet.com/usubmit/2007/11/26/3120580.htm). Pretty nice to have in town, along with other local apparel businesses like OOBE (http://oobe.com/). :)

You still haven't told me why you're against that mixed-use development on Fork Shoals Road. :nuts:

Wow, that's great! Does anyone know of additional store that you can find their shirts? I'd love to check them out and possibly do my part to help them grow through purchasing.

Maybe some day soon they'll be able to open a Southern Tide store on Main Street. :)

There was a story on Southern Tide in GSA Business several months ago I believe.

You still haven't told me why you're against that mixed-use development on Fork Shoals Road. :nuts:At this point, it goes against the long range plans for that area.:)

BTW, Clemson's recruiting class (http://clemsontigers.cstv.com/sports/m-footbl/spec-rel/020508aaa.html) has reached top 10 status with the addition of Allen, McClain and Harper. :banana:

^^Just saw the news on ESPN's website. :banana: :dj: #4 recruiting class in the nation baby.

At this point, it goes against the long range plans for that area.:)


But it's mixed use. Who cares if it goes with the long range plans or not. There's a reason the Planning Commission recommends approval of it. It's sort of like Griffin Park or Acadia just smaller. :)

Rosewood Mall, which was to be built at Clemson Blvd./I-85 in Anderson County is officially dead according to the Anderson Journal. The developer didn't seem like he knew what he was doing in the first place.

:banana: #2 in the nation: http://sports.espn.go.com/ncaa/recruiting/football/news/story?id=3233800

:banana: #2 in the nation: http://sports.espn.go.com/ncaa/recruiting/football/news/story?id=3233800

Don't get too excited, G-Man, high recruiting classes doesn't necessarily equal wins, especially as long as TB is coach, just ask ND.

Tommy is a great coach for Clemson. Each season there is notable improvement/ greater depth at most positions. :)

:D New site plan: http://www.menindevelopment.com/magnolia2.html Looks nice. Gourmet grocery that is 15,000 square feet. ;) Sounds like Trader Joes. I don't like how there is still a parking lot where there was before in front of Hollywood 20. :( I do like how it's more compact though. :) Reminds me a lot of Village-Pointe in Omaha. Hoping it will be more like Birkdale Village though. Apple is obviously the retailer listed as "electronics" just south of Sports Authority on the same side. Cheesecake Factory is "Restaurant A" located next to the spa.

I love that evening shot of Greenville's skyline that appears in the "Description" section :okay: The site plan looks nice, too. Hopefully, they will redevelop the rest in a similar fashion, some time in the future.

^^That's what i'm hoping they'll do too after the economy recovers. :)

Let me look into my crystal ball. What do I see? The Point Development to be. It's large and in charge. It puts MPTC to shame but Menin's got nobody to blame. Do you want it? Do you need it? Let me hear it. Ladies and gentlemen. :dj: :banana:

I have just received word that Regal is the reason they took out the hotel and shops/restaurants in front of Hollywood 20. They were worried it would affect their business too much. Trader Joe's is indeed the gourmet grocery according to source involved with project. :)

Joe isn't a trader. :D

http://i146.photobucket.com/albums/r263/peacockdude/Picture256-1.jpg

http://i146.photobucket.com/albums/r263/peacockdude/Picture257-1.jpg

Where is everybody? :gaah: :cry: Don't you just love it when I go off-topic? :D That was just for you Skyliner. :hug:

Let me look into my crystal ball. What do I see? The Point Development to be. It's large and in charge. It puts MPTC to shame but Menin's got nobody to blame. Do you want it? Do you need it? Let me hear it. Ladies and gentlemen. :dj: :banana:

Ok, this is me biting. Have some info?

^^It's getting there. Slowly but surely.

The large hotel for MPTC has been cancelled and is going to be replaced by a boutique hotel instead. Sounds like another Peacock brewing. :lol: The reason for this is due to the economy, not enough room to put a hotel on the site thanks to Regal being a bunch of cry babies, and the amount of new hotels being built in the area.

Funny how everybody says they're busy with school and work when they had school and work two years ago. We're they not busy then? :dunno:

Sorry, Gman. I heard there was a posting limit and so I wanted to save up my posts for a really big announcement. :lol:

NAh, but there's not too much going on right now, or it seems.

Now, if the Point project gets back on track, then let me know...

^^Big announcement? Not with the economy the way it is right now. Things will pick up in the Spring when several new shopping centers start construction. Raleigh-NC loves those things, don't you? :lol:

Yeah, right... I love the shopping centers, particularly those that dedicate 90% of the land to surface parking :lol:

^^Yay. You came back. I thought you died. :hug: Just don't eat my fish. :D

You bet your ass I am back :lol: In fact, I never left. I always read these threads, but can't always respond. I caught a little break last night because the baby penguin went to sleep and I had the opportunity to post :)

:rofl: See Skyliner. I can't be mature. This is why: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1mmNe7m5-IM&eurl=http://www.gtaforums.com/index.php?showtopic=310952&st=0

You immature forumer!!! Here is some Greenville related stuff:

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QrgUPCXZEiA

TL1vtSTtlPs

rDVMkQIVVww

This guy is good!!! Check out the segment between 2:28-2:29 for the best part of the video, though. God, I LOVE Greenville for that!!!

C5gH_Nczh6Q

One more reason I know I will like Greenville:

9l6vDdhr6gw

^^OMG alert. Where's the faint emotion? :eek: :lol: Lofts/condos will be built above retail and office space at MPTC according to gsupstate. I expect this to be no short of a Birkdale Village type development. 3-4 stories tall. Kind of like this when complete: http://www.birkdalevillage.net/concept.htm (bottom right picture)

:D Take the love-meet personality quiz today: http://www.rockstargames.com/IV/#?page=loveMeet&content=interactive0 Are you a boring loser? Perhaps a douchebag? Maybe a pervert? :rofl:

Don't need any quizzes to tell me what I am... I know I am a pervert :lol:

^^:rofl:

Several tenant contracts have been signed for MPTC according to the Greenville Journal, so I guess that means we should expect a list of retailers/restaurants that will locate here soon.

Does anybody know what this is or where it will be located? Site work and new construction of a mixed-use development in Greenville. Design plans call for the construction of 211,000 square feet of retail space, 18,000 square feet of restaurant space, 26,000 square feet of office space, 242,000 square feet of residential units and a 66,000-square-foot, 110-room hotel. Construction to begin third quarter 2008: http://www.bidclerk.com/project.662728.html

The map has a peg over Big-O Dodge on Laurens Road. That is next to the Verdae development. Wonder if it is part of that or a spin-off?

^^^The problem is that Bidclerk is never right when it comes to putting the location of these developments on their maps. :nuts:

:D Walmart on Pelham Road:
http://i259.photobucket.com/albums/hh303/g-man435/16444_sized.jpg

COUNTDOWN: 13 DAYS!!!! :dj: :dance: :banana: :carrot: :cucumber: :pepper:

http://sports.espn.go.com/outdoors/bassmaster/classic/index
http://www.wyff4.com/news/15260441/detail.html
http://www.independentmail.com/news/2008/feb/07/upstate-gears-bassmasters-tournament/
http://www.timesdaily.com/article/20080209/NEWS/802090332/-1/COMMUNITIES04
http://www.bassresource.com/bass_fishing_123/bass-classic-events-08.html
http://www.charleston.net/news/2008/feb/03/classic_anglers_head_hartwell29412/

Plenty of Entertainment on Tap for Fishing Fans at 2008 Bassmaster Classic Outdoors Expo

While the 2008 Bassmaster Classic contenders are on Lake Hartwell, thousands of fishing fans are expected at the Carolina First Center in Greenville, S.C., for the three-day Bassmaster Classic Outdoors Expo (show hours are listed below).

The expo is considered one of the top consumer shows of the year, partly because of the spillover of the intense Classic energy, partly because exhibitors are known to debut their newest products but mostly because it's always fun.

New boats, thousands of fishing products and great deals on outdoor gear aren't the only attractions of the show. Exhibitors offer contests, interactive displays, appearances by top bass pros and many other one-of-a-kind events.

Classic sponsors lead the way in that department. Toyota will present its Toyota Outdoor Tour, which includes a Casting Challenge, the Tundra simulator and opportunities for fans to have their photos taken with the Bassmaster Classic trophy. Toyota will also run its popular Toyota Prove-It, adjacent to the Carolina First Center, where fans can drive Tundras or Sequoias. Additionally, fans who donate one can of food at the Toyota exposition space will be entered to win a chance to fish with a Toyota Tundra sponsored Bassmaster Elite Series pro following an Elite event.

At the Advance Auto Parts booth, fans can play a Nintendo Wii fishing game or inspect the company's popular tricked-out truck. Lowrance, Mercury, Skeeter and Yamaha will demonstrate their cutting-edge models. Skeeter also will give fans the chance to register to win a jersey autographed by a pro, while Yamaha will conduct seminars. At the Purolator booth, the Big Bass Fan $5,000 contest will offer fans a chance to be "paired" with the 25 final-day contenders. A $5,000 prize will be awarded to the fan paired with the Classic contender who weighs in the biggest fish Feb. 24.

At the Berkley booth, fans can put their names in the hat for a chance to be selected as the Berkley Cast for Cash contestant. If successful, the caster, who must be present at the Feb. 23 weigh-in at the Bi-Lo Center when his or her name is drawn, will win $50,000 for landing a practice plug inside a 12-inch-diameter target.

Show visitors can learn how to get the best action from Berkley baits by watching lures get put through their paces in the Berkley Tank, and witness Master Youth Anglers receiving their awards of Berkley rods.

The Expo also will be the venue for the preliminary national finals of the Bassmaster CastingKids competition at 11 a.m. ET Feb. 23. Later that day, at 2:15 p.m., the kids will move to the Bi-Lo Center, where the finalists in two age groups will flip, pitch and cast to targets to win scholarship money. Additionally, at the Expo's Kid's Zone, children will find plenty of entertaining activity.

Expo activities also will celebrate BASS' 40th anniversary, and BASS members will receive special treatment at the show. The first 100 members to arrive at the Expo will receive a gift, and all members are eligible for a 5 percent discount on merchandise. Members of the BASS Federation Nation and Life Members are eligible for more benefits, including use of a lounge at the Carolina First Center.

The first 50 kids to the expo each day will receive a free gift, courtesy of Skeeter and Yamaha, and the first 100 adults will receive a free gift, courtesy of BASS. Other giveaways include a Walt Disney World vacation package, complete with a fishing trip with Bassmaster Elite Series pro Preston Clark.

No one attending the show will have to wonder what's happening on Lake Hartwell. The Webcast show Hooked Up will provide hourly updates with leaderboards through live feeds into the BASS booth at the Expo.

The 2008 Bassmaster Classic will be hosted by the Greenville Convention & Visitors Bureau. The tournament will receive 13 hours of television coverage on ESPN2.

2008 Bassmaster Classic Outdoors Expo
Carolina First Center
1 Exposition Ave.
Greenville, S.C.

Noon-9 p.m., Feb. 22
10 a.m.-6 p.m., Feb. 23
10 a.m.-4 p.m., Feb. 24

http://i259.photobucket.com/albums/hh303/g-man435/2008_Classic_800x600_2-1.jpg

:drool: I think I just drooled all over myself: http://greenvilleonline.com/apps/pbcs.dll/section?Category=YOURUPSTATE0301&community=&photocat=&userID=&photoSetID=&start=8&photoID=16435&status=&pagebegin=0

WOW another walmart.

^^:hug: http://www.usatoday.com/money/industries/food/2008-02-10-trader-joes-china_N.htm#uslPageReturn

FREE PANCAKES: http://www.ihoppancakeday.com/ :drool: :eat: :banana: :dj: :pepper: :carrot: :cucumber:

You will get fat with all those pancakes you eat :ohno:

^^Where did everybody go? Did they die? :dunno: Must be hiding after that Clemson loss. ;)

I don't know why you guys are so scared. Hey, you're white. Smile. :) You can come out of your holes now and post. It's ok. Nobody's going to hurt you. :lol: You can even contact a developer by email or go out and take update pics for once in your life.

I noticed you guys are talking about GSP on urbanplanet. Very slim chance we'll get a low-cost carrier anytime within the next 5 years. The officials here don't know what they're doing and never will.

More destruction for the mountains. I think i'm going to be sick. Look at what company is listed at the bottom of this form. B&C anyone: http://greenvilleplanning.com/land_development/prelim_subs/Tall%20Pines%20Variance%20Letter.pdf

http://greenvilleplanning.com/land_development/prelim_subs/08-113-Master%20Plan%20and%20Plat.pdf

So much for the housing crisis. This is just phase I too: http://greenvilleplanning.com/land_development/prelim_subs/08-110-Master%20Plan%20with%20Plats%201A%20and%201B.pdf

I noticed you guys are talking about GSP on urbanplanet. Very slim chance we'll get a low-cost carrier anytime within the next 5 years. The officials here don't know what they're doing and never will.

You can't say that. What, pray tell, should the officials be doing that they aren't?

^^Whatever Charleston is doing. They got AirTran and we didn't. Greensboro got Skybus and we didn't. Burlington, VT got JetBlue and we didn't. Basically they need to offer them tax incentives. Of course they're too stupid to know that though.

The Journal said the City of Greenville has jumped on board with their federal lobbyists to get money to help GSP land a carrier. I think they're trying.

^^Yeah, and we're getting highrises built. I wasn't born yesterday. If they were trying, we would of gotten FedEx and Skybus like Greensboro did. Am I right?

I want back on urbanplanet. That's all I have to say.

I want back on urbanplanet. That's all I have to say.

They still won't let you post there, despite your nice email to one of the moderators a few weeks ago?

^^Correct. :( The shoe store that will be located at the southeast corner of Sports Authority at MPTC will most likely be DSW. :)

^^Correct. :( The shoe store that will be located at the southeast corner of Sports Authority at MPTC will most likely be DSW. :)

I like DSW. Another great addition to MPTC. :)

^^I like mass transit, highrises, low cost carriers, sidewalks, roads that don't have potholes, etc. Where in Greenville? :( Charlotte is progressive. I'm not sure what this place is.

Did you forget to take your meds?

^^I like mass transit, highrises, low cost carriers, sidewalks, roads that don't have potholes, etc. Where in Greenville? :( Charlotte is progressive. I'm not sure what this place is.

Charlotte has also had somewhat of a head start, so that is not a fair comparison. If you compare Greenville to Charlotte when they were at our stage (size, etc.), I think we are more progressive than they were. For a city and metro our size, Greenville is quite forward-thinking. A lot of great things are happening!

All of those things you mentioned are either in the works or have already occurred. I know you are in one of your occasional "Greenville sucks" moods, but I'll play along anyway:

Mass transit - look into any of the master plans for the city (Sasaki, Vision 2025, etc.) and mass transit is included. The city never misses a chance to talk about rapid transit between ICAR/Verdae and downtown. The rail line has already been purchased. This is very much in the works.

Highrises - also on the way. Gateway will happen. Pinnacle on Main will probably happen soon (despite our jokes). Federal courthouse will provide some height in a few years. Peacock will too. There are plenty of other chances to have highrises in developments coming online soon (Woolworth's redevelopment, Riverplace, etc.).

Low cost carrier - the airport has been trying their best to lure a low-cost carrier, and now the city is on board to help. We'll get our budget carrier in time, although none of us know when.

Sidewalks - I think Greenville is a fairly walkable city. Downtown is as pedestrian-friendly as an urban center gets. The city's system of trails and greenways is quite impressive, and the master plan includes improvements and additions galore. Many new residential communities include sidewalks. What is your complaint here?

Potholes - I have never noticed our roads being bad. Charleston's roads are much worse than Greenville's. Columbia's are bad in places too. Our roads aren't perfect, but I have seen far worse (even in North Carolina).

Greenville is on top of things more than you seem to realize, g-man. Look around a little and appreciate all the great things that are happening!

Did you forget to take your meds?

:lol:

Wait until g-man and Bob Ellis move to Charlotte... Half the city will be miserable and pretty much every high-rise proposal there will stall... indefinitely :rofl:

Skyliner, what are you talking about? I sent you a PM. Maybe you should check it. Greenville doesn't have a mass transit system. Prove me and these other forum members otherwise. Highrises. How many have been proposed and how many of those have been built? It's less than one. Low cost carriers. Zero of those unless you count Allegiant which only goes to Florida as one. Don't forget about zero West Coast destinations too. Even Greensboro has that. Sidewalks. Most of the roads around here don't have them. I'll go out and take pics if you want proof of that. Roads that have potholes. Those are everywhere. I can walk up the street and find that.

Oh yeah, and we can't forget about rails-trails. Most cities (Madison, Omaha, etc.) Greenville's size have had these in place for at least a decade. Greenville is just now getting one. Why did it take them so long? Underground powerlines too. Omaha has all of theirs buried. Can't find a single one buried here. Their lightpoles are all on masts. Ours are on wires. Not even Verdae Blvd. has sidewalks. :nuts:

^^I like mass transit, highrises, low cost carriers, sidewalks, roads that don't have potholes, etc. Where in Greenville? :( Charlotte is progressive. I'm not sure what this place is.

If that's all that matters to you, then dude - you live in the wrong city...seriously.

Oh yeah, and we can't forget about rails-trails. Most cities (Madison, Omaha, etc.) Greenville's size have had these in place for at least a decade. Greenville is just now getting one. Why did it take them so long? Underground powerlines too. Omaha has all of theirs buried. Can't find a single one buried here. Their lightpoles are all on masts. Ours are on wires. Not even Verdae Blvd. has sidewalks. :nuts:

We can play the comparison game all day. Rather than looking at what Greenville doesn't have, why not realize the things Greenville does have? We have things that plenty of other cities would kill for. I will give you a few examples off the top of my head, and you can take it from there:

-an amazing downtown waterfall
-one of the most pedestrian-friendly downtowns anywhere
-tons of international corporate investment
-the future of automotive research (at least in the United States, if not the world)
-a mayor and city council with big goals - and an excellent track record to back it up
-a metro that is growing at a healthy rate
-mountains less than 30 minutes away
-a metro with the state's best public (Clemson) and private (Furman) institution
-a city that has come a long way, and has its best days ahead of it (a true embodiment of the "New South!")

Now you can keep it going...

G-man, what I find most frustrating about your attitude at times is that you cycle through the same complaints every week or two, but then you suddenly switch your mindset and start kicking others around for being negative about development in the city. It really gets old man. Most of us aren't trying to compare today's Greenville with today's Charlotte, because it is not even a close comparison in most categories, starting with population. RT's advise is very good. If you care deeply enough about big city elements Greenville has not been able to acquire yet, you ought to seriously make an effort to relocate. Otherwise, please understand that patience is our best tool as we navigate through rough water in the signature highrise department. :)

We can play the comparison game all day. Rather than looking at what Greenville doesn't have, why not realize the things Greenville does have? We have things that plenty of other cities would kill for. I will give you a few examples off the top of my head, and you can take it from there:

-an amazing downtown waterfall
-one of the most pedestrian-friendly downtowns anywhere
-tons of international corporate investment
-the future of automotive research (at least in the United States, if not the world)
-a mayor and city council with big goals - and an excellent track record to back it up
-a metro that is growing at a healthy rate
-mountains less than 30 minutes away
-a metro with the state's best public (Clemson) and private (Furman) institution
-a city that has come a long way, and has its best days ahead of it (a true embodiment of the "New South!")

Now you can keep it going...-the USA Cycling Professional Championships
-the BMW Charity Pro-Am
-the 2008 Bassmaster Tournament
-the 2008 Wing Ding
-the many other fantastic annual festivals lots of cities envy us for
-a visibly growing innovation cluster along I-85 that has already begun to attract global companies who have decided to locate here instead of much larger places like Detroit.
-a perfect place to enjoy minor league baseball in the summer, and a top-notch front office who care about the community.
-theatres, galleries, and more providing constant cultural enrichment.

Anyone care to continue...

^^
I think he may be bi-polar or at the very least Manic Depressant. :ohno:

Geesh. I would love to have remained in Greenville, but unfortunately, my wife didn't want to remain, so I was pretty much forced to go. The challenge for me was to find a larger city (for me) with more options (for her) with a similar or better quality of life to offer (for my entire family). It wasn't easy, I assure you.

Be thankful that you have what you have and be a positive part of its growth. :bash:

^^How come when they widened Woodruff Road and built that new road where Rocky Slope Road used to be in Verdae in the city limits, they didn't bury the powerlines? I thought that's what the city wanted to do. Guess not.


:puke: Get ready for more traffic.

City OKs The Point apartments
Business owner says decision only makes traffic issues worse

Published: Tuesday, February 12, 2008 - 2:00 am

By Rudolph Bell
BUSINESS WRITER
dmbell@greenvillenews.com

Greenville City Council on Monday approved a developer's plans for nearly 700 apartments at The Point in a move that one property owner said was sure to exacerbate traffic congestion near the intersection of Woodruff Road and Interstate 85.

"All we're doing is just adding fuel to the fire," said Jerry Fender, managing member of The Office Center, an office building at The Point.

City Council voted unanimously to annex and rezone 41 acres at The Point, paving the way for Flournoy Development Co. of Columbus, Ga., to build the apartments in two phases. The developer plans the apartments at the dead end of Market Point Drive, one of two roads used to access The Point property from Woodruff Road.

City planners initially recommended against the development, noting that it would block a long-planned but never-built extension of Market Point Drive to Carolina Point Parkway, the other road into The Point.

Blocking the planned road extension would "promote traffic conflicts and inhibit the use of Market Point Drive as another means of connectivity in this vital transportation corridor," planners said in their initial report on Flournoy's request for permission to build the apartments.

But after talking with the developer, planners changed their minds and signed off on the developer's idea to connect the two roads with an angular route that goes around the 41 acres instead of the more direct route through the property that was originally envisioned.

The developer has offered to donate half of the right of way for the angular route, but the city doesn't have any money for a new road.

Jean Pool, the city's planning and development manager, said her department reversed its original position on the apartments in part because the city wants to see housing at The Point. She said planners asked the developer to explore all options for connecting the two roads before deciding in favor of the apartments.

"We wanted to feel comfortable this is the best of several alternatives, and it is," Pool said.

Fender, whose office building is along Market Point Drive not far from where the apartments are planned, said he expects his business to suffer as a result of council's decision. Fender said he already encounters objections to Woodruff Road traffic when trying to lease space in the 24,000-square-foot building to small businesses.

"The situation's just going to be intolerable the way I see it," he said.

Fender's business is part of The Point Property Owners Association, which objected to the apartment development during a meeting of the city Planning Commission in November but wasn't represented at Monday night's City Council meeting.

Fender said his business and others at The Point were always led to believe that Market Point Drive and Carolina Point Parkway would be connected by a more-direct path and not by "left turns and right turns."

G-man, what I find most frustrating about your attitude at times is that you cycle through the same complaints every week or two, but then you suddenly switch your mindset and start kicking others around for being negative about development in the city. It really gets old man. Most of us aren't trying to compare today's Greenville with today's Charlotte, because it is not even a close comparison in most categories, starting with population. RT's advise is very good. If you care deeply enough about big city elements Greenville has not been able to acquire yet, you ought to seriously make an effort to relocate. Otherwise, please understand that patience is our best tool as we navigate through rough water in the signature highrise department. :)

Then let's compare it with Omaha then. They have a nice transit system with a signature highrise over 600 feet tall. ALL powerlines in the entire city are buried. ALL of their interstate lights work too unlike here. Nah, let's compare Madison instead. One of the most greenest cities in the country with one of the best bike paths in the country. They have buses left and right. I can't seem to find even a single GTA bus here when I look for one. Oh wait. Can't forget about Greensboro. They have a low-cost carrier now with a direct connection to LA.

g-man, you have some serious self-esteem issues and/or you may be two-faced, by nature :lol: If you can't see the great things your city has to offer, then you should find a cave and call it home... for the rest of your life. Neither Charlotte, nor most other fast growing cities are the paradise you make them look. These places have been dealing with growth issues that sometimes are painful and their efforts don't always bear the fruits that you may think. Charlotte is no more walkable than most other cities in our region. They have simply realized that and been working on changing things around. Given their size, it will take A LOT of effort to succeed, and that will be partial. Now, substitute the name "Charlotte" with the name of most sunbelt cities and you will get the picture. Don't judge only by looking into downtowns and some New Urbanist communities; if you do, you will realize that Greenville is not behind.

Public transportation systems are not easy to put in place, unless you get public funds, and I am talking about lots of money. Public transit is not a money maker, but rather a loss generating amenity. The bigger the city - assuming its economy is healthy - the easier it is to absorb the losses. If you want to be like Portland, OR, then you have to take a lot of things in consideration. Portland's real estate values have sky-rocketed (last time I checked) and from what I heard from people who are actually from Portland, the urbanity has come at a cost beyond what they were willing to pay.

Bottom line: Be happy with what Greenville offers. Other forumers have provided lists of things that Greenville can be proud to have. You may not impress Charlotte forumers in these forums, but rest assured you can be proud of Greenville, nevertheless... Except for having Bob Ellis, of course :lol:

^^Why would I be proud of a place that can't even bury the powerlines when they widen the road? The City of Greenville and Duke Energy have come to an agreement to bury powerlines. Why didn't they bury them when they widened Woodruff Road? :nuts: The other forumers seem to have found a cave to call home. They never post anymore. :lol:

You can get a Wi-Fi access in a cave these days :lol:

http://i259.photobucket.com/albums/hh303/g-man435/bilde.jpg

At present growth rate, the Upstate could look like Atlanta by 2030

Published: Tuesday, February 12, 2008 - 1:01 pm

By Ben Szobody
STAFF WRITER
bszobody@greenvillenews.com

A new Clemson University study projects an Upstate boom through 2030 with land development outpacing population growth by a ratio of 5 to 1 -- creating gridlock -- unless regional development policies change.

Urbanized areas would more than double from about 720,000 acres in 2005 to 1.5 million acres in 2030 and blanket about two-thirds of Greenville County from State 11 in the north to Fork Shoals in the south, said the report, a four-year project by Clemson's Strom Thurmond Institute with Upstate Forever and Saluda-Reedy Watershed consortium.

Brad Wyche, executive director of Upstate Forever, called it "one of the most important studies that has ever been done for our region," but said he doesn't advocate curbing population growth or cutting business development.

Instead, he said the same growth can consume fewer acres of land, in some cases through voluntary development incentives that draw projects into urban areas and away from sprawling rural districts without heavy-handed government regulation.

The report says the "pave-over" rate in the eight-county Upstate region defined by the Saluda and Reedy rivers is equivalent to roughly one Haywood Mall per day, or about 80 acres.

The pace of development between 1940 and 1990 was half the pace of population growth, according to an earlier Clemson study, but then spiked tenfold between 1990 and 2000, with the amount of developed land outstripping population growth 5 to 1, the new report said.

In actual numbers, population grew by 15 percent during the 1990s, while development acreage increased by 80 percent, the report said.

That 5-to-1 ratio is the basis for projections through 2030 and relies on census figures and satellite images of growth, said Wyche and Jeff Allen, director of Clemson's South Carolina Water Resources Center.

"Do we want to be the next Atlanta?" Wyche said. "That's where this study says we're heading."

Greenville, Spartanburg, Pickens, Anderson, Abbeville, Greenwood, Laurens and Newberry counties were included in the study.

The "toolbox" for growing smarter includes a return to "traditional neighborhood design" where instead of creating single spurs off major highways development includes a grid of more compact, walkable streets and a mixture of development types in one place. Filling in urban gaps, revitalizing older developments and establishing boundaries for how far crucial infrastructure like water and sewer service is extended are additional options.

The proposals come at a crucial time when Greenville County is updating its future land use plan. Clemson and Upstate Forever officials will present their report to county officials in the next few days.

Check back to GreenvilleOnline.com for more updates.

Then let's compare it with Omaha then. They have a nice transit system with a signature highrise over 600 feet tall. ALL powerlines in the entire city are buried. ALL of their interstate lights work too unlike here. Nah, let's compare Madison instead. One of the most greenest cities in the country with one of the best bike paths in the country. They have buses left and right. I can't seem to find even a single GTA bus here when I look for one. Oh wait. Can't forget about Greensboro. They have a low-cost carrier now with a direct connection to LA.

I think you do this to generate more forum activity here. I truly do. Congratulations, g-man. It worked.

Then let's compare it with Omaha then. They have a nice transit system with a signature highrise over 600 feet tall. ALL powerlines in the entire city are buried. ALL of their interstate lights work too unlike here. Nah, let's compare Madison instead. One of the most greenest cities in the country with one of the best bike paths in the country. They have buses left and right. I can't seem to find even a single GTA bus here when I look for one. Oh wait. Can't forget about Greensboro. They have a low-cost carrier now with a direct connection to LA.

You're comparing Greenville to Omaha, Madison, and Greensboro? Aside from Greensboro, I don't think it's a fair comparison.

Madison is one of the most amazingly progressive cities that I've ever visited...not to mention it's the CAPITAL of Wisconsin and home to a MAJOR (BIG 10) University. It really is a lovely city surrounded by water. The high-rise development there can't go higher than the dome of the capital building, though, so things are very dense. They do have an excellent transit system, but if you've ever been there, you'll instantly realize that they really need it. As for those bike paths, did you know that they become cross-country trails in the winter, too?

Omaha's soil is very loose, silty soil. It's not the hard compact red clay we have here. It probably cost them very little (in comparison) to bury utility lines there.

Greensboro having a low cost carrier still boggles my mind. Look how close Winston-Salem/Greensboro is to Charlotte and Raleigh-Durham both. It makes no sense to me, so somebody must have slept with someone somewhere in order for that to have happened.

...The other forumers seem to have found a cave to call home. They never post anymore. :lol:

Sorry, but I've been just more than a tad bit busy...and my cave doesn't have Wi-Fi.

If you compare Greenville to Charlotte when they were at our stage (size, etc.), I think we are more progressive than they were.

That's kind of hard to compare, especially since I don't think we were even around when Charlotte was Greenville's size. And of course, the economic conditions were pretty different back then as well. Charlotte was pretty progressive starting with the time it passed Charleston to be the largest city in the Carolinas (in the early 1900's) and it really hasn't looked back since.

But at the least, I'd definitely say that Greenville is as progressive as Charlotte was when it was Greenville's size. Greenville's momentum, which it has enjoyed for the past several years, cannot be denied.

You're comparing Greenville to Omaha, Madison, and Greensboro? Aside from Greensboro, I don't think it's a fair comparison.

Madison is one of the most amazingly progressive cities that I've ever visited...not to mention it's the CAPITAL of Wisconsin and home to a MAJOR (BIG 10) University. It really is a lovely city surrounded by water. The high-rise development there can't go higher than the dome of the capital building, though, so things are very dense. They do have an excellent transit system, but if you've ever been there, you'll instantly realize that they really need it. As for those bike paths, did you know that they become cross-country trails in the winter, too?

Omaha's soil is very loose, silty soil. It's not the hard compact red clay we have here. It probably cost them very little (in comparison) to bury utility lines there.

Greensboro having a low cost carrier still boggles my mind. Look how close Winston-Salem/Greensboro is to Charlotte and Raleigh-Durham both. It makes no sense to me, so somebody must have slept with someone somewhere in order for that to have happened.

My aunt lives in Madison. I visited it in August of 2007. My grandparents along with my other aunt live in Omaha. I visited it in December 2007. I go to Greensboro at least once every year to go to the large water park they have there. How is it not a fair comparison? All three I listed have around the same sized metro area as Greenville. Another thing I need to rant about. Where are the minor league sports teams at? All we have is baseball. What about hockey, basketball, and football? Also, Greensboro has a large waterpark. Why don't we?

My aunt lives in Madison. I visited it in August of 2007. My grandparents along with my other aunt live in Omaha. I visited it in December 2007. I go to Greensboro at least once every year to go to the large water park they have there. How is it not a fair comparison? All three I listed have around the same sized metro area as Greenville. Another thing I need to rant about. Where are the minor league sports teams at? All we have is baseball. What about hockey, basketball, and football? Also, Greensboro has a large waterpark. Why don't we?

Evidently, it's because we suck and don't even deserve to be a city. :lol:

I see Ben Nobody from the Greenville Snooze finally put a link up for that study regarding the upstate being the size of Atlanta by 2030: http://greenvilleonline.com/assets/pdf/BS99604212.PDF

Because we suck and don't even deserve to be a city. :lol:

Exactly. If I was a city council member or mayor, this place would be much better than it is. We would have a low cost carrier by now like JetBlue or Southwest with direct western destinations.

Exactly. If I was a city council member or mayor, this place would be much better than it is. We would have a low cost carrier by now like JetBlue or Southwest with direct western destinations.

Right, because all it takes is for somebody in city government to call or email one of the low-cost carriers to tell them about Greenville - and BAM! - there's your low-cost carrier at GSP International! IT IS SO EASY A CAVEMAN CAN DO IT! If only they knew how easy it was, we would all be flying to world-class destinations on a regular basis. Why can't they get a little motivation and get that accomplished? :ohno:

You really should run for a position in city government, g-man. Those clueless morons could certainly use your dose of common sense and astute business acumen to get us that low-cost carrier - not to mention tons of highrises, new sidewalks, buried power lines, more Fortune 500 corporate headquarters, mass transit, professional sports franchises, etc.

^^So easy Greensboro can do it. No reason Greenville can't.

Build, build, build. :nuts:

Greer city officials, business owners see benefits of unprecedented growth

By Christina Wilson-Spartanburg Herald Journal

Published: Tuesday, February 12, 2008 5:14pm

With much of the Village at Pelham already open, construction of its 140,000-square-foot, full-service hospital under way and new businesses steadily springing up along the Pelham Road and Highway 14 corridor, plus the completion of new police and municipal buildings downtown approaching, economic development leaders are trumpeting Greer's unprecedented growth.

"The potential now for what the Greer area will be is phenomenal," said Village at Pelham Administrator David Parks, recently named head of the Pelham Area Council of the Greater Greer Chamber of Commerce. The council is a new arm of the organization formed to recruit the growing number of businesses surrounding the hospital complex, about 15 minutes from the city's downtown.

Parks likened the population explosion of Greenville and Spartanburg Counties to that of Dallas and Fort Worth, Texas, in the 1950s. "The growth rate in Greer is even faster. These are not just projections. They're a reality."

Chamber Executive Director John Kimbrell said about 75 of its 560 corporate members already hail from "the other side of the interstate" but there are hundreds more potential members who could benefit from networking opportunities and services afforded to business owners.

"This initiative is building on what we already have done," Kimbrell said during the first meeting of the new council last Thursday. "There are a lot of businesses and a lot of needs. Members have called on us to be more engaging to this area to enhance the whole organization and bring more people to our area and downtown as well."

In addition to the 48-bed hospital under construction and services already offered at the adjoining medical complex - surgery, laboratory, physical therapy, physician's offices and after hour "minor care" are all are open -- Spartanburg Regional Health System last week announced plans to build a new cancer center at Village at Pelham.

Parks said the center, with opening targeted for early 2009, was planned based on an obvious need in the community. "We're putting the facility in the Greer area because the patients here need it."

Businesses hoping to cash in on more than 200 employees at the facility - owners of Coffee Station and Janet's Sweetery have said they expect to gain clientele from the concentrated workforce - have purposely located in the area. Among them is Brick House Coffee, located in the Capital Bank Building across the street from the Village.

"This location is doing slow," said Nick Knutson. He and his wife manage four Upstate locations of the specialty coffee house. "The development of the area hasn't quite caught up to us yet. But as the hospital opens and development continues, we expect it to happen."

Downtown growth

Not only is property being sought by potential business owners near the corridor, Parkway and Batesville Road areas of the community, but downtown as well, according to the executive director of the Greer Development Corporation.

"We have experienced a great deal of success downtown, not the least of which is the $21 million investment by the city in its police and municipal complexes and adjacent park area," Reno Deaton said. "It has increased the demand for downtown property."

The two-story Alta Cunningham building on the 100 block of Trade Street is on the market for $725,000. Next door is The Starlight Ballroom, which is undergoing exterior renovations.

Owner Diane Christofferson said the value of the Trade Street building in which she operates Great Bay Oyster House has doubled since she first opened, attributing the rising property worth in part to the police complex downtown.

Other downtown business owners have grumbled in past weeks regarding construction noise, traffic patterns and limited parking, but Christofferson said business owners actively courted the department to its new headquarters, expected to open in April. "We wanted that building here."

Debra Mojarro, co-owner of Bistro 107, said she plans to relocate her business outside the city due to concerns stemming from the construction and a related drop in receipts and foot traffic, but will not do so "anytime soon."

Other downtown business owners have lauded the city's growth, insisting parking or other traffic-related issues have not caused concerns that merit negative attention.

"Our business and several other businesses that are near us have done well because they are located downtown, and we feel it is the place to be," wrote Events at the Davenport co-owner Scott Stevens in response to implied criticism of the city's management of building projects.

"I do understand the growing pains during the current construction, but we feel that it will ultimately bring more life to the downtown. Also we have found that all the recent parking changes and signage have helped with that issue."

Candace Kavo of Justin's Steakhouse said the Greer restaurant - one of four Upstate locations she co-owns with her husband - has experienced a successful slight increase in business in the last year.

"We have not had a serious problem with parking and we have never really heard any of our customers complain about the parking situation or the present construction," she stated.

"I think we agree that it is a necessary part of growing and it happens in every city that is attempting to grow. We feel that once this project is complete we agree that it will only benefit the area. We are happy to be in Greer and we have no intentions of leaving or moving anywhere else anytime soon."

New commercial development director sought

Despite the recent community-wide surge in economic development, the city recently lost its commercial development director, Deaton said.

He refused to give a reason for the Jan. 3 departure of Melissa Thomas, saying only, "She's just no longer with us."

Responsibilities of the post include recruiting and retaining new commercial businesses and "continuing to move forward with goals and initiatives of the GDC." Advertisements have been posted and resumes will be accepted through the end of this month.

Deaton, who attended the newly formed Pelham Area Council's first meeting at Capital Bank on Highway 14, said completion of the hospital will further boost the continuing community-wide growth.

"The Village at Pelham is providing for us in Greer a number of opportunities," he said. "It's very effectively expanding Greer's blueprint. It's important we stay in touch with these businesses as they build into its fabric."







Clemson University study: Upstate could look like Atlanta in 2030

By Jason Spencer-Spartanburg Herald Journal

Published: Tuesday, February 12, 2008 6:30pm

Upstate counties will lose up to 1.5 million acres of land to development by 2030 unless new policies are put into place to manage growth, according to a Clemson University report released Tuesday by the nonprofit group Upstate Forever.

That group has a laundry list of such policies — including countywide zoning — that it will push on county administration and planning organizations from Spartanburg to Anderson to Newberry in the next few months.

They argue that population and residential and commercial growth will continue, but the amount of land that growth takes up could be virtually cut in half.

“Nobody’s looking at the big picture,” Upstate Forever Executive Director Brad Wyche said. “But if this study isn’t a wake-up call, I don’t know what is. And it’s on all the issues. Economic development. Roads. Water. Education. Everything.”

Projections are based on data collected between 1990 and 2000 in eight Upstate counties. The population grew by 15 percent, but the amount of land developed grew by 80 percent during that time. In academic terms, that’s a 5-to-1 growth ratio.

Continuing at that rate for the next two decades means about 86 acres of land will be developed every day. That’s slightly larger than the footprint of Haywood Mall in Greenville.

Cities and counties need to put more emphasis on redevelopment and revitalization projects (think Academy Sports going into the old west-side Lowe’s Home Improvement building), developing cleared land in already-urban areas (called “in-fill development”), countywide zoning, and allowing the transfer of “development rights” from rural areas to urban areas (where landowners can negotiate deals with developers to allow for denser development in and around cities), Wyche said.

Parts — if not all — of that is going to be a hard sell.

“Right now, everybody should be concerned about the lack of growth,” said Frank Nutt, a developer and former Spartanburg County councilman.

“You can’t force people to live where they don’t want to live. And you can’t force businesses to go where they don’t want to go. Our history is pretty good with that. I don’t think anything about that has been a drawback to us so far.”

But Wyche and his associates — they began a two-day tour of area newspapers and television stations Tuesday — insist that development will still come. Their point is that counties have bargaining power, that land-use policies won’t deter growth, that zoning won’t scare away the next BMW. Basically, they argue that growth is coming — it’s just a matter of how.

And, they’re fairly ambitious. Angela Viney, director of Upstate Forever’s Spartanburg office, believes that countywide zoning can happen here in a year.

Otherwise, this area will become just like Atlanta, riddled with sprawl and traffic congestion, they said.

“That’s just one of the whole battery of tools and strategies — zoning. There’s many different types of zoning, and many different concepts. So, it’s premature to even speculate about any of that,” Assistant County Administrator Chris Story said.

“It’s only one piece of the game plan. What do we do with our roads? What do we do with our schools? What do we do with our water lines and sewer lines? There’s a whole soup of stuff that affects how that map will look in 30 years. Regulations are a part of that … but there’s a whole set of factors.”

The county government has contracted with several firms to review its land-use policies. An initial assessment of those policies is expected within a few weeks, though any policy changes probably wouldn’t come up until the fall, Story said.

Until then, “The more information, the better,” he said.

I just dont see it happening here for a while. G-man....your wishing to hard. You got to have patience.

^^So easy Greensboro can do it. No reason Greenville can't.


FWIW, Greenvlle is on the Southwest Airlines radar. They have been here looking. Maybe before too much longer. BTW G-Man I used to live downtown and at least power lines are buried in the CBD. I remember the big ice storm a few years ago when everyone lost power, we never did. That was nice. Needless to say we had plenty of company.:)

^^I know Southwest along with other low-cost carriers have been looking here. They have been for sometime, but none of them will take the plunge and with the economy the way it is, I don't see it happening for a good while. My power was out for 5 days. NOT fun. :(

I see Ben Nobody from the Greenville Snooze finally put a link up for that study regarding the upstate being the size of Atlanta by 2030: http://greenvilleonline.com/assets/pdf/BS99604212.PDF

Very interesting graphics! Kinda scary too.

Gman I understand some of your frustration, especially with the construction delays, and some of the transportation and airport shortfalls. But understand that many of the "shortcomings" of the area are only seen as such because there is a demand for them. Our area is growing steadily, and offers a lot. This means people want to be here. With all the growth, our airport and mass transit have become inadequate. That is not a good thing, but it is representative of the fact that we are growing and have a lot to offer, which is a very good thing. There are some things I would like to change about Gville, and I have my opinions on what I would like to see take place. But, it is a pretty cool place already. I will point out that Falls Park is something that virtually no other city in the country has. I think FP is absolutely first class, and I will take it over a six-flags or an aquarium any day of the week! Ceaser's head is another "attraction" that is pretty unique to Gville. There are not too many mountains around, that close to a major metro area, that command such a sweeping view. I have taken people from California, Nevada, and Colorado up there, and they were very touched by what they saw. Cheer up gman, though there are a few frustrations, this is a great place to live. Enjoy.

^^Not working man. :( I don't like paying $500 to fly out of an airport. Put me on the airport commission to get these idiots to stop sitting on their hands all day and actually get something done.

I thought the housing market was in a slump or something. :weird: Build, build, build, build. :nuts:

Developer to seek final OK on 56-home community in Greer

Published: Tuesday, February 12, 2008 - 5:05 pm

By Lorando D. Lockhart-The Greenville News

Developer Frankie McCLeer has the go-ahead to begin construction on 56 houses on Westmoreland Drive from the Greer Planning Commission.

But he must now submit final drawings to City Council for its blessings before beginning work on the Village at Bent Creek subdivision.

McCleer received unanimous approval at the Jan. 22 Planning Commission meeting following questions from committee members and at least one resident.

He said the project has essentially been approved, but the council must give its final say before the approval is official.

"This is more like a formality," McCleer said. "Once it gets in the hands of the city tomorrow, it could take about four to six weeks before construction begins.

John Irons lives in a nearby subdivision and wanted to know if his and the new development would share amenities during the Jan. 22 meeting.

But McCleer said the two developments could have separate homeowner associations, which would mean separate amenities.

The plan calls for 56 homes ranging in price from $300,000 -$500,000.

The three to five bedroom homes would range in size from 2,300-4,000-square-feet.

Each house would be custom built but by different builder on 10,000 square foot lots.

The developer also said they would work to preserve wetlands and provide a detention pond on the property.

McCleer said his company would probably build the first five or six houses.

Construction could begin in four to six weeks, McCleer said, but that depends on how tomorrow's meeting goes, he said.





Another development may be on horizon for Simpsonville

Published: Monday, February 11, 2008 - 2:00 am

By Nathaniel Cary-The Greenville News

Simpsonville may get another large residential and retail development just north of Heritage Park, a month after the City Council approved a giant mixed-use development on the south border of the park.

The city Planning Commission has approved a development on 70 acres, part of which would tie into the existing Heritage Creek subdivision that is under construction.

Developers Tuley & Tuley Inc., who are developing the Heritage Creek subdivision, plan to build a mixture of retail space, apartments and houses on the acreage that lies between the Duke Energy building and Summit Place Living Center and opens up onto South East Main Street.

Tuley & Tuley requested annexation and rezoning to a planned development. The Planning Commission recommended approval by a 3-1 vote. Three members of the commission were absent.

"It's a great example of what the city did by building Heritage Park," said Mark Holmes, an attorney representing Tuley & Tuley. "It's a great draw, and people want to be close to it."

Initial site plans show a retail center with parking at the front of the property. Behind that, developers plan to build an apartment complex with up to 280 apartments. At the back of the property they plan to build 162 houses that would tie in to Heritage Creek with two access points.

In approximately 120,000 square feet of retail space the developers have left ideas open and proposed marketing it for a small grocery store and local retail as well as offices.

"We're not talking about a major retail center," Holmes said.

One commissioner worried about the amount of new growth Simpsonville has experienced and how this subdivision would draw enough buyers to fill it. Kirk Leitke voted against the request, citing the number of open lots that haven't sold in surrounding subdivisions.

Rick Tuley with Tuley & Tuley said that homes had sold briskly in Heritage Creek so far. In a year and a half, 120 lots had sold since the property had been marketed, he said, with houses ranging from $180,000-$340,000.

"The reason we're proposing this development is because there is indeed a strong market for this development," Tuley said. "This development won't come on line until after Heritage Creek is completed."

The City Council recently approved a rezoning request for Heritage Crest, a 162-acre mixed-use development south of the park that would include retail, offices, town homes and single-family houses.

Two subdivisions, Heritage Park and Heritage Creek, are under construction next to the park.

City Council is scheduled to take first reading on the annexation request at its Feb. 12 meeting.





M.S. Shore Co. plans to build shopping center on Rutherford Road

Published: Tuesday, February 12, 2008 - 2:00 am

By Angelia Davis-The Greenville News

A site northeast of the Greenville city limits is being groomed for new office, warehouse and commercial space.

The Park @ Rutherford will offer space for up to eight tenants on Rutherford Road, between Beverly and Piedmont Park roads.

Construction of the two buildings that will make up The Park @ Rutherford should be completed this summer, according to Mardy Shore, president of M.S. Shore Co. Inc.

M.S. Shore of Greenville is now leasing spaces in the center. The project is being developed by Hardstone Development LLC of Greenville.

M.S. Shore and Hardstone Development partnered to revive the former Auld Hardware building and Dixie Home Store, at the corner of Poinsett Highway and Rutherford Road.

That project at 110 Poinsett Highway received the Greater Greenville Association of Realtors' 2007 Commercial Revitalization Award.

Dollar General occupies the old Dixie Home Store, while Snap Shop Cafe & Art Bar and Crosby Stills photography occupy space in the former Auld store.

The Park @ Rutherford will have spaces ranging from 1,200 to 4,800 square feet.





Greenville County sets up new tax corporation
It would fund revitalization at parks and sports complexes

Published: Tuesday, February 12, 2008 - 11:16 am

By Ben Szobody-The Greenville News

Greenville County Council has formed its own nonprofit corporation that could soon go in debt by as much as $40 million for recreation improvements.

The arrangement is part of a sweeping plan to revitalize dilapidated parks, build sports complexes and create nature promenades in the county using a tax designed for tourist improvements that is partly shouldered by visitors.

The Greenville County Tourism Public Facilities Corp. opened with three well-known employees — council Chairman Butch Kirven, Vice Chairwoman Judy Gilstrap and County Administrator Joe Kernell — and will pay off its debt with the county’s new 2-cent restaurant tax.

County officials say that instead of issuing taxpayer-backed bonds that would have stretched the county’s allowable debt limit, the creation of the new corporation allows them to borrow the money without pledging property taxes.

Instead, the so-called "hospitality tax" from restaurants outside city limits covers the payments. In the event of a shortfall, the county isn’t liable and the "certificates of participation" would default, Gilstrap said.

Kernell said that would give investors control of the physical improvements to local parks and destinations through ground leases between the county, the corporation and the Greenville County Recreation District, which will own most of the park sites.

County documents set the annual rental rate at $1, and the leases are pledged as part of the security for investors.

So far, restaurant tax collections have fallen short of initial projections of $6.75 million a year, averaging instead between $515,000 and $520,000 a month, or $6.2 million a year, Kernell told council members.

Gilstrap said restaurant taxes may fluctuate, but "people are not going to suddenly stop eating at restaurants in unincorporated areas of Greenville County."

Kernell said the new corporation likely won’t use all $40 million of the debt it’s allowed under proposed county ordinances, and that a tax stream of roughly $2.5 million a year will be sufficient to keep up with payments.

Gilstrap said the three county officials serve as employees by virtue of their public office, and Kirven called it a "shell corporation" set up to meet legal requirements and protect taxpayers.

Both said they don’t believe the corporation fragments public accountability for how tax money is used because they’re powerless to make any changes in the 16 parks projects set for funding, including the Children’s Museum downtown and the MESA Soccer Complex on Anderson Ridge Road.

"All the accountability goes back to the County Council," Kirven said. "It just passes straight through this corporation."

Under state law, Gilstrap said the corporation will have an annual meeting and keep minutes. Kernell said they will be public.

Had the county issued regular "general obligation" bonds, Gilstrap said its AAA credit rating could have been jeopardized.

All six cities in the county charge hospitality taxes, and the county joined them a year ago as a way to improve a park system some council members said was 30 years out of date and to attract more visitors to the county for tournaments and leisure.

Projects already under way include the MESA soccer fields, baseball diamonds for Northwood Little League and a new Camp Spearhead for disabled residents.

Kernell told council members some of the anticipated projects could be paid for without issuing debt, and Gilstrap said the restaurant tax funding may free up revenue at the Recreation District to do still more improvements.

The new corporation has yet to sell the debt because one of the proposed park projects is moving from Pleasant Ridge in the northern part of the county to the old Camp Spearhead site, and Kirven said the county is waiting for accompanying legislation to catch up.

A final council vote is scheduled for Feb. 19.

^^Anyone have any guesses on what year Greer will surpass Greenville in population? :ohno::lol:

^^2009. :lol:

My aunt lives in Madison. I visited it in August of 2007. My grandparents along with my other aunt live in Omaha. I visited it in December 2007. I go to Greensboro at least once every year to go to the large water park they have there. How is it not a fair comparison? All three I listed have around the same sized metro area as Greenville. Another thing I need to rant about. Where are the minor league sports teams at? All we have is baseball. What about hockey, basketball, and football? Also, Greensboro has a large waterpark. Why don't we?

It's not a fair comparison at all. Since you've visited both Omaha and Madsion, then you should clearly realize this from first-hand experience. I mean, my God, it should smack you in the face as soon as you visit either of the other two cities that they are absolutely nothing like Greenville. Don't misunderstand me...Greenville is great in its own right, but it's nothing like either of these two cities. I'd buy the comparison with Greensboro or maybe even one with Augusta, Georgia before I'd accept a comparison of Greenville with Madison or Omaha.

^^Why wouldn't they be fair comparisons to Greenville if their metro areas are around the same size? Ok, We'll go with Greensboro then instead. They have a large waterpark. We don't. They have a low-cost carrier with a direct destination to LA. We don't. Their airport is expanding like mad. Ours is a sitting duck. Nah, let's go with Augusta. They have a major golf tournament that brings in tons and tons of people, money, publicity, etc. Greenville has ummm....uhhh...???

^^Why wouldn't they be fair comparisons to Greenville if their metro areas are around the same size? Ok, We'll go with Greensboro then instead. They have a large waterpark. We don't. They have a low-cost carrier with a direct destination to LA. We don't. Their airport is expanding like mad. Ours is a sitting duck. Nah, let's go with Augusta. They have a major golf tournament that brings in tons and tons of people, money, publicity, etc. Greenville has ummm....uhhh...???

I'll try to spell it out for you statistically since your first-hand experience with the three cities obviously doesn't leave an impression on you. The MSA for Greenville (around 1,000,000) is actually for pretty much all of the Upstate (Greenville-Spartanburg-Anderson). The MSA for Madison pretty much includes only Madison and the rest of Dane County (around 500,000). The MSA for Omaha is just the Omaha metro itself (around 800,000). There's a definitive population density difference. That's all I'm going to say on this subject.

Greensboro is a much better comparison, yes...and why their airport is expanding at a rate faster than that of ours I feel simply lies in its management. It boggles the mind considering it lies almost equidistant between CLT and RDU. I would have expected that it would lose a ton of passengers to these two larger airports that are within easy driving distance/time. Somebody in charge of Greensboro's airport is doing something right and the folks in charge of ours aren't.

Greenville had a water park until the city put up signs telling people to stay off of the rocks and to not slide down the falls. Seriously though...I don't know what to tell you about the water park, man. Go raise some capital and build one when you graduate from college. Greenville's ripe for a real honest-to-goodness water park. Just be sure to build it near I-85/I-385 so it will fit in with the rest of the skyline out there.

Greenville has the BMW Charity Pro-Am...granted, it's not the Masters. Greenville also has the US Pro Cycling Championship and the 2008 Bassmaster Classic. Those have to count for something...

^^Why wouldn't they be fair comparisons to Greenville if their metro areas are around the same size? Ok, We'll go with Greensboro then instead. They have a large waterpark. We don't. They have a low-cost carrier with a direct destination to LA. We don't. Their airport is expanding like mad. Ours is a sitting duck. Nah, let's go with Augusta. They have a major golf tournament that brings in tons and tons of people, money, publicity, etc. Greenville has ummm....uhhh...???

I have a suggestion for you. Move somewhere else, whether that is for college or for your first job. Get out of Greenville. Go wherever you like - Atlanta, Charlotte, Omaha, DC, LA. The world is your oyster. When you get there, study the city very carefully. Evaluate the people, the way of life, the developments, how far the city has come and where it is headed. This will be good for you to see firsthand what another place is like. Please be aware that your experience as a resident is MUCH different than it is as a visitor. Through this process, you'll learn a lot about the world, but you will learn even more about yourself.

After that, my prediction is that you will have a greater appreciation for Greenville. I say that with confidence, because many of us who love Greenville - and I mean love it - have lived other places. Those of us who have done so don't just like Greenville because we have to. Rather, it is based on very real evidence. We have seen the world, observed, taken inventory of what we want out of life, and concluded that Greenville is a very special place. There is just something about it. It's not perfect, just as nowhere is. But when it comes to quality of life, Greenville is hard to beat.

The highrises, national retailers, and mass transit are all in Greenville's future. Those things will come, and we will be a better metro for it. But as you know, quality of life isn't just about how pretty your skyline looks, whether you have all of the national retailers at your disposal, or how easily you can get around on public transit. It is also about things like affordable home prices, the friendliness of people you encounter, the cleanliness of your city, the taxes you pay, and the ease with which you can maneuver through traffic. If it weren't, you could move to New York City and never have a care in the world (hint: for 99% of the population, NYC does not provide a very high quality of life)

Just my two cents. Take it for what it's worth. :2cents:

^^I want to move to Charlotte. Just my two cents. They have a lot more going for it than Greenville ever could. Instead of having to waste my money on gas, I could hop on the LRT line and ride to my destinations.

^^I want to move to Charlotte. Just my two cents. They have a lot more going for it than Greenville ever could.

Go for it. You'd fit right in over there, I think. :wave: I'm with ya on the LRT/transit though. That was a major factor for me. I hope Charlotte can expand beyond just its initial Blue Line though - opposition has been pretty fierce.