Well that is a nice development for all of the heightists. Myself included. A supertall in Miami would be so incredible. Even if JUST ONE. Like the Empire State building was in NY for decades.

I wish Tibor would take his money from Villa Magna, and dump it into this project, then make a nice Bayfront Park at the Villa Magna site...I know, As if?

It's probably asking too much, but does anyone have access to the data that would show what these FAA height restrictions really are throughout downtown?

We know this site, for instance, is 949' and that other spots are apparently considerably less but I can't recall seeing anything that definitively showed exactly what the restrictions are in the entire area. Something like that would probably answer many questions here.

With the FAA and the airport authorities, the city has never seemed eager to challenge their restrictions in the past. Is there even a single example of them doing so by ordinance? Hopefully that won't always be the case since there doesn't appear to be any other way to break the supertall barrier.

Either way, hope this project makes the leap from paper to reality eventually. Office towers GOOD...:cheers:

Rx -

I thought you had reported that the county had reached an agreement with the aviation authority to allow buildings to 1,000' in the core ?

yes and now the county has to legalize it by passing an ordinance to state the limits and in what area but they where trying to implement it at the same time with miami21...

they will have to sit down now label the streets(plots of land) that 1000ft are allowable and pass the ordinance... then the building goes to faa for approval in which the county ordinance states that its ok to build it at that hieght and faa stamps that the building is over by 100 ft but its approved aslong as the top is lit at all times and then they just record it into there little file so that planes wont fly anywhere near that height in that area as to avoid a collision with the tower and done...

so now its really up to the county to finalize things. *basically the talks have happened now they just need to put it on paper*

Is One Bayfront Plaza still a realistic possibility?

So this is basically an ordinance from the county, meaning the city wouldn't have to implement it? Although at the moment the city has never really had an issue with tall buildings.

And what are the feelings from miami dade aviation, they seem to be against any project which is in a pathway of a plane, I think this issue will come down to whose willing to lobby more, the developers or the airlines, seeing as miami politics are corupt, airlines will win.

So this is basically an ordinance from the county, meaning the city wouldn't have to implement it? Although at the moment the city has never really had an issue with tall buildings.

And what are the feelings from miami dade aviation, they seem to be against any project which is in a pathway of a plane, I think this issue will come down to whose willing to lobby more, the developers or the airlines, seeing as miami politics are corupt, airlines will win.

Seeing as how the airport is the single biggest economic entity in Dade, it's not too surprising that they pretty much call the shots on these matters...or at least have in the past.

Because of the proximity to downtown, it's to be expected that some height restrictions will always be a fact of life. The question seems to be if there's really room for compromise here or whether the FAA and the airport will ultimately win any "showdown" over height.

Wish we had access to some sort of FAA map that would show what restrictions exist in the entire downtown area. Maybe that would give us all some idea of what is or isn't possible.

(and thanks for the update, Rx)

here you go spell
http://www.miami-airport.com/pdfdoc/MIA-AHZAMz_11X17-MIA_HEIGHT_RESTRICTION_MAP_11x17.pdf

Really interesting in my opinion first time i've seen the complete map.

HERE IS A SECTION OF IT

http://img185.imageshack.us/img185/27/23442152mp7.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

here you go spell
http://www.miami-airport.com/pdfdoc/MIA-AHZAMz_11X17-MIA_HEIGHT_RESTRICTION_MAP_11x17.pdf

Really interesting in my opinion first time i've seen the complete map.

Architec, thanks VERY much for that! Been waiting a long time to see such a comprehensive map and "voila"...guess all I had to do was ask. And thanks Rx for that detail of the most important section.

Great work! :cheers:

I dunno. That is a lot of hotel rooms and office space. Mabye they are going for too much and should scale back to make this happen. They must need to ahve all that room to make the project work but I would think makeing the building more slender and having less square footage would probably be more realisitic.

I would like to say for those who don't already know, there are cranes on the Met 2 site now. I was by there today and there is a lot more action than last time I was there (3 weeks ago) and soon I expect some major things to get started with Met 2.

Really !? what type of cranes ? real ones? or the portable kind?

In full view of Biscayne Bay, less than 200 miles from the heart of Havana itself and towering high above the city, Miami's leaders come together in one of the most recognized spaces in town - the top floor of the 55-story Wachovia Financial Center.

The Havana Club at the Miami City Club is more than a social club; it is an intimate meeting ground for corporate and community leaders and a place where business is conducted in style


http://www.thehavanaclubofmiami.com/about_the_havana_club.html

These photos were taken on May 13, 2007.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/b/b5/Met21.jpg

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/d/d5/Met22.jpg

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/f/f3/Met23.jpg

Pile Driving...You won't see any construction cranes until the foundation piles are driven...in about 5 or 6 months...

One Bayfront Plaza is going to go before the Planning Board on May 16th. Here are the stats:

70-stories, 1049 feet tall, 850 hotel rooms, a whopping 2,124,000 sqft of office space, 120,000 sqft of "exibition/banquet" area, 112,000 sqft of retail space and 2560 parking spaces. It is expected to cost Tibor Hollo $1.3 Billion to build it.

On the FAA issue the City states that the building does not comply with the MD Aviation Dept height ordinance. It states the current height allowed by the MDAD is only 949 feet at that location, and that the County would need to pass an ordinance to allow taller buildings. Here is the quote (from page 32 of the doc below):


http://egov.ci.miami.fl.us/Legistarweb/Attachments/34611.pdf


Does anyone know the outcome from the meeting on May 16th???

When Does Logic break ground?

Does anyone know the outcome from the meeting on May 16th???

OBP passed "with conditions". I'm guessing the conditions are that the height issue gets worked out with the MD Aviation people.

When Does Logic break ground?

I thought I heard in late March that Logik had broken ground. I can't confirm if that is true and I haven't seen the site lately, so I don't know the progress.

http://www.wired.com/wired/archive/14.12/images/ST_45_skyscrapers1_f.jpg

Architek, where did you locate this pic/rendering of future Miami buildings? It's stunning!

Architek, where did you locate this pic/rendering of future Miami buildings? It's stunning!

The Picture is from Wired Magazine. I did not however find the link to the article.

http://www.wired.com

I remember seeing it some time ago but can't remember exactly when. It must have been awhile, though, as it apparently shows things like "Lynx" and EWT.

What is the tall building between Four Seasons and Wachovia supposed to be? I'm drawing a blank on that one.

^^1101 Brickell

I POSTED THE CORRECTED IMAGE ON PAGE 32 OF THIS FORUM BACK IN APRIL 2ND








APRIL FOOLS JOKE?

http://img47.imageshack.us/img47/2706/556zr7.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

The world's cities are getting taller – and fast. Between 2001 and 2012, almost as many skyscrapers will be constructed as were built in the entire 20th century. While vertical metropolises like Hong Kong and New York continue to mint monoliths, the most dramatic changes are happening in lower-profile places. Thanks to globalization and the steady migration of people to urban cores, cities that once had only a few high-rises are morphing into mini-Manhattans. Miami, for example, had only five skyscrapers (buildings more than 150 meters, or 492 feet, tall) in 1999 but will have 71 by 2012. Dubai, in the United Arab Emirates, will soar from two in 1999 to 90 by 2012. Here's a snapshot of the world's fastest-changing skylines.

– Patrick Di Justo


http://www.wired.com/wired/archive/14.12/start.html?pg=6

So what is the smaller building in front of EWT?

rebuilt holiday inn hotel although im not sure if they will keep the brand name

One Bayfront Plaza is going to go before the Planning Board on May 16th. Here are the stats:

70-stories, 1049 feet tall, 850 hotel rooms, a whopping 2,124,000 sqft of office space, 120,000 sqft of "exibition/banquet" area, 112,000 sqft of retail space and 2560 parking spaces. It is expected to cost Tibor Hollo $1.3 Billion to build it.

On the FAA issue the City states that the building does not comply with the MD Aviation Dept height ordinance. It states the current height allowed by the MDAD is only 949 feet at that location, and that the County would need to pass an ordinance to allow taller buildings. Here is the quote (from page 32 of the doc below):



http://egov.ci.miami.fl.us/Legistarweb/Attachments/34611.pdf

By the way, I don't know if anyone else cares but the architecture firm behind the project is these guys:
http://www.terra-archinternational.com/

I'm suprised such a large project didnt go to one of the bigger firms like Arquitectonica, or even Kobi Karp or Revuelta or Seiger Suarez or Fullerton-Diaz. I do like their "current work" on their website though.

OF COURSE WE CARE DAVE! Thanks for bringing the info.. I think that fact that it is not one of the big boys, is why it looks different.

For better or worse. I am happy that the local boys are thriving, and at the same time it's great to get some fresh perspective.

Can anyone photoshop the location for 1 Bayfront Plaza...if not, can you at least tell me what buildings this is close to??? I have no idea as to its' location. Thanks!

Can anyone photoshop the location for 1 Bayfront Plaza...if not, can you at least tell me what buildings this is close to??? I have no idea as to its' location. Thanks!

Its to be built on the site of the current ~15 story brownish "Vitas" building next door to the north of Wachovia at 100 South Biscayne Blvd.

Where the smaller orangish-brown building to the bottom right of Wachovia now stands in this pic:
http://z.about.com/d/miami/1/7/s/2/Downtown_Marina-4675.jpg

http://img112.imageshack.us/img112/6942/556zr7xc1.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

Amazingly fresh.

WOW!!! I am crossing my fingers for that one!!

Is it not true that no building over 300 feet has actually started construction (not site work or clearing) in Miami since the beginning of the year? This is odd considering the number of proposals. This is the list kept by formers at skyscraperpage:


http://img329.imageshack.us/img329/9514/paramountbeachao4.gif
http://img107.imageshack.us/img107/5140/spirenk7.gif
credit: kazpmk

What does this mean for Miami? Are all those beautiful building on hold?

its always hard to tell exactly when a building is really "under construction". For example Capital at Brickell started digging a big hole in the ground late last year but does that mean that they started construction last year? They are just really getting started now. I'm pretty sure Paramount Bay started this year. They were digging in the dirt before this year but real construction didnt start until this year. Ditto with Met2.

real construction commenced in 2007:
Met 2 (617 feet)
1450 Brickell (527 feet)
Paramount Bay (real name is paramount at edgewater square) (496 feet)

600 Brickell has broken ground but I wouldn't really call it "under construction" yet.

I'd also say that the 2nd and 3rd ICON Brickell towers didn't really get started until 2007.

1450 Brickell and Brickell Financial Center have started this year. I forget when exactly Met 2 started, but it has been sometime recently.

Here is the list from 2006. there are 11 construction starts in Miami from that year over 295 feet. That still seems low somehow. The recent list may be a month or so dated.
http://img242.imageshack.us/img242/1871/final2006listnk2.gif

The Met 2 complex currently has two towers under construction. Suffolk construction broke ground last month (April) on the 42 story JW Marriott hotel, after completing pilings on the 47 story office tower. The towers will be connected by a 14 story podium containing retail, restaurant and parking space. In addition, Sunny Isles Beach (~five miles from Miami) has had a few groundbreakings this year that are not shown on that list.

I ALLREADY WENT OVER THAT QUESTION BEFORE "SOMEONE NEEDS TO JUST SCROLL BACK AND READ"




LOFT 3


http://img443.imageshack.us/img443/1355/loft302yp1.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

http://img443.imageshack.us/img443/4899/loft301mf4.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

I ALLREADY WENT OVER THAT QUESTION BEFORE "SOMEONE NEEDS TO JUST SCROLL BACK AND READ"

Um, I was interested in a broad opinion and perhaps a discussion, not particularly your opinion on the issue.

I really live the Loft buildings. They're more affordable, they're more lowkey, and they raise the density in the area while giving the area a more urban, residential feel. I find them to be of the more important projects under construction, even though they aren't necessarily the tallest towers.

I POSTED A FACT NOT AN OPINION "GO BACK AND READ"

YOU STATED NO PROJECTS HAVE STARTED THIS YEAR

I ALLREADY RESPONDED AND NOW OTHERS HAVE ALSO... SO DROP THE QUESTION...

IF YOUR LOOKING FOR A DISCUSSION TRY POSTING A BETTER QUESTION.
IF YOUR LOOKING FOR OPINIONS LET ME JUST STATE WE PREFER FACTS.

:banana: I'm just happy to see 3Midtown on that list...even if it is just a pipedream...:lol:

I POSTED A FACT NOT AN OPINION "GO BACK AND READ"

YOU STATED NO PROJECTS HAVE STARTED THIS YEAR

I ALLREADY RESPONDED AND NOW OTHERS HAVE ALSO... SO DROP THE QUESTION...

IF YOUR LOOKING FOR A DISCUSSION TRY POSTING A BETTER QUESTION.
IF YOUR LOOKING FOR OPINIONS LET ME JUST STATE WE PREFER FACTS.

I don't really need to respond to this do I? It was more than a little rude and unnecessary as well as arrogant. Please let us not have a further exchange. The validity of my question is not at all changed by your all-caps responses. I was reasonable and on topic to ask the question such as I did and most other responses were conversational and polite.

dude don't listen to RX, HE HAS ISSUES and no your comment was a good one.

By the way RX, STOP MAKING EVERY ISSUE ON HERE A COMMENT ABOUT YOURSELF, EVERY RESPONSE OF YOURS STARTS OFF WITH ,i.

DUDE

CHILL OUT

HE WANTS TO SAY I POSTED AN OPINION WELL TRUTH BE TOLD I POSTED A "FACT"

BELOW HIS QUESTION POSTED ON MAY 19TH AND THE SAME QUESTION POSTED AGAIN...

I just realized while pouring over a few websites that Miami hasn't actually started construction of any high-rises in 2007 thus far. There is a lot of site work going on and a lot of construction as well as proposals, but it seems nothing has actually started the construction process in the least 5 months. Is this true? What is causing this?

Is it not true that no building over 300 feet has actually started construction (not site work or clearing) in Miami since the beginning of the year?

HE GOT HIS ANSWER HE NEEDS TO LEAVE THE QUESTION ALONE AND GO BACK TO THE ATLANTA FORUM AND POST HIS CITY VS CITY THREADS

BY THE WAY "I" WOULD NOT POINT FINGERS, CROSS REFERENCE YOUR STATEMENT AND SEE THAT EVERYONE USES "I" AND ITS NOT ALL ABOUT THEM... I COULD SPEAK OF MYSELF IN THE THIRD PERSON BUT THAT WOULD SURE ENOUGH MAKE ME CRAZY...


OK SO FOR ARCHITEKS PEACE OF MIND FROM NOW ON "I" WILL POST ALL MY COMMENTS IN THE THIRD PERSON.

"RX727SFL2002 DOES NOT HAVE TO TOLERATE THIS." HOW F#@KING ARROGANT DOES THAT SOUND...

ALL "I" HAVE TO SAY IS YOUR BRILLIANT, THANKS FOR THE PEDESTAL...

I was hoping Loft 3 would be the tallest. It looks like it is just under Loft 2 height. At least it adds some density to that area. Imagine the ride on Metromover through that canyon of condos.

The Loft development is one of the most important ones going up right now. Even though they aren't that tall, they are creating much needed density in the northern downtown area west of Biscayne Boulevard. I hope more projects like this start happening west of Miami Avenue in the northern part of downtown.

BTW...I was on metromover today in that area and it's already a very interesting setup with a station right in the middle of Loft 2, and a ride very close to the sides of Loft 1 and Loft 2...Loft 3 will only add to the already great density in that area.

When is Loft 3 expected to be complete?

BELOW HIS QUESTION POSTED ON MAY 19TH AND THE SAME QUESTION POSTED AGAIN...

That thread was summarily closed a day after my posting so I brought it up again because I never actually got an answer (no the closing had naught to do with me). I thought I may restart that conversation somewhere else with a chart to go along and spur more discussion. I believe that is reasonable. Unfortunately, it seems you simply searched my name and found the forums I have yet posted in, then presumed to judge me.

HE GOT HIS ANSWER HE NEEDS TO LEAVE THE QUESTION ALONE AND GO BACK TO THE ATLANTA FORUM AND POST HIS CITY VS CITY THREADS

I have barely used skscrapercity and I started even posting in the Atlanta section because I felt strongly about the inaccurate perception that the city of Atlanta's population growth was linear. I have no particular alliance to Atlanta and I have lived in the Miami area since before I even hit puberty. I regret that you believe I have to introduce myself and defend my posts in order to bring up a topic of conversation. I disagree. No matter what you say I will continue to do as I see fit as I would expect of any self-respecting person especially on an as informal a setting as the internet. I ask that everyone please ignore this person's hate tainted rantings when he refers to me.

To speak directly to you, Rx727sfl2002, let us not speak again. Ignore my posts as I will of yours and do not quote or talk about me. It will be as if I didn't exist to you and I think you will find a little less stress in your day. This of course doesn't mean that you may say what you please without response or consequence. I believe that we don't have to have unpleasant exchanges even if we disagree about every point.

To stay on the topic, I think the gray area between construction and site work has made this list skew perhaps a little towards 2006. Are there actually items missing on those lists was my question or is this pretty much what the situation is? That list was for structures above 295 feet to reiterate.

LOFT 3


http://img443.imageshack.us/img443/1355/loft302yp1.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

http://img443.imageshack.us/img443/4899/loft301mf4.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

Niice... It's going to be a cool metrorail ride there...

So whats the deal with Loft 3, same parking situation? temporary space for x number or years i heard about before with the previous loft?

So whats the deal with Loft 3, same parking situation? temporary space for x number or years i heard about before with the previous loft?

I purchased in Loft2 and that is the only drawback. My DH is not too happy about the parking situation, but the parking is leased for many, many years. I am sure they are not building parking spaces on any of the lofts buildings and we will probably share the space on the City of Miami lot. Does anyone know how much the city charges for an extra space? I am going to call them & find out & I will post the reply.

Sorry, I posted twice!

I purchased in Loft2 and that is the only drawback. My DH is not too happy about the parking situation, but the parking is leased for many, many years. I am sure they are not building parking spaces on any of the lofts buildings and we will probably share the space on the City of Miami lot. Does anyone know how much the city charges for an extra space? I am going to call them & find out & I will post the reply.

How does the parking work? Will the individual associations be leasing from the city? Is there an umbrella association where all 3 buildings lease the spaces as one entity? Will the 3 buildings share amenities or not? Will they be connected in anyway? How long is many years? 5, 7, 10, 25? What does DH stand for? Any chance the 3 bldgs can eventually purchase the spaces from the city? any talk of doing a skywalk connector or some kind of covered crossing for rainy days? Anyone who has purchased or has insider info as to the parking issue including will memebers have their reserved spot or first come first served please enlighten me/us

The lease for the parking garage for Lofts 1 and 2 are for 50 yrs. Not sure about Lofts 3. No sky bridges as of now.

thanks miami nole any more answers to my many other questions? what entity does the leasing? is the parking paid for by the developer or are monthly fees build into the condo fees? how much? in other words DETAILS PLEASE

I go to MDC and I have never seen any activity at all in that lot. None whats so ever.

I go to MDC and I have never seen any activity at all in that lot. None whats so ever.

What lot are you talking about?

the site of loft 3. there hasn't been a stitch of aCTIVITY. MAybe they are going to start when Loft 2 is done.

I have noticed a few businesses have left the little strip mall so I'm guessing leases are running out, the building is sort of being moth balled, dying a slow death.. the wrecking ball can't be too far away

In that little strip mall looks like new businesses and a new little market just opened up. Were are they going to go? I'm pretty sure that there are some new businesses in that place. And if loft do own that lot I guess they will get rid of the people and businesses and tare it down. It is a pretty grungy looking building. And with the exception of that one market.. that green hole is always shut down.

Businesses have been getting out of there for quite a bit of time now. The chicken place on the corner is gone. So is a market that was there. No new businesses in there. It will be demolished within a few months according to the loft office (which is in the shopping center also).

Hi :)
I bought at loft 3 and they told they will start const. mid this year...to be finished in 09..

Can anyone take any pics???

Have a great day:banana:

I love teh way CBD is looking now!!!! I went to MDC and back then it looke dpretty bad but now is looking GREAT!!!!!!!!
:wave:

Hi :)
I bought at loft 3 and they told they will start const. mid this year...to be finished in 09..

Can anyone take any pics???

Have a great day:banana:

I love teh way CBD is looking now!!!! I went to MDC and back then it looke dpretty bad but now is looking GREAT!!!!!!!!
:wave:

Telma:) ,
my friend,
Welcome to the Friendly Family Forum of MIAMI:banana: ,

Loft 3 , hasn't cleared the site of the old buildings there as of yet.
Loft 3 will not even start until Loft 2 is ready for the Sales center of Loft 3 moves out of its own site accross the street.
As soon as Loft 2 is ready, The Loft 3 sales center will occupy the ground floor of Loft 2, and start tearing down the old buildings accross the street to begin Loft 3.
Can I shorten that statment, LOL.:lol:

I THINK IT WILL START CONSTRUCTION IN AUGUST-SEPTEMBER

It's very exciting to have an actual buyer in the new miami urban core so let me add my voice to Chuck's and extend a very warm WELCOME.

:banana2: :banana2: :banana2: :tyty: :wave: :wave: :wave: :wave:

ok now please read my posts higher up on this page titled "details please" and "more details" and give us the inside scoop on the parking everything you know.

Also I for one would also love to know, how far you work, will you be mostly walking? will you have a car? do you plan to live there or did you buy as an investment?

It's very exciting to have an actual buyer in the new miami urban core so let me add my voice to Chuck's and extend a very warm WELCOME.

:banana2: :banana2: :banana2: :tyty: :wave: :wave: :wave: :wave:

ok now please read my posts higher up on this page titled "details please" and "more details" and give us the inside scoop on the parking everything you know.

Also I for one would also love to know, how far you work, will you be mostly walking? will you have a car? do you plan to live there or did you buy as an investment?
^^ ^^ ^^ Easy my friend:ohno: ,
The Taller the Better:) ,
Don't let Toucano or Jason see this Post,
If I were you, re-eidted it NOW, take off that selling information and do it in the Private Messages at the top right corner,
remember no selling at any forums,
Read the rules please, I'll also re-edited and delete this Info,
Welcome again !!!:cheers:

what am I selling? there's no selling there my friend, I'm conducting a very unscientific survey to see if as I suspect most loft buyers are end users but I don't see where I'm selling anything, maybe you should re-read my post more carefully my friend.

In my business I don't have to sell anything and usually let people come to me, they do because they always benefit a lot more than I do.

I just re-read my post and maybe you think I'm trying to sell her a car! I'm a realtor I dont sell cars but that is just hilarious.

what am I selling? there's no selling there my friend, I'm conducting a very unscientific survey to see if as I suspect most loft buyers are end users but I don't see where I'm selling anything, maybe you should re-read my post more carefully my friend.

In my business I don't have to sell anything and usually let people come to me, they do because they always benefit a lot more than I do.

I just re-read my post and maybe you think I'm trying to sell her a car! I'm a realtor I dont sell cars but that is just hilarious.

The Taller the Better:) ,
my friend, No problem,
I'll just mind my own business:lol: ,
It's not my job to tell my friends the rules anyway:ohno: ,
Have a beautiful day:banana: ,
its lovely out there in Miami, today, sunshine Rocks:cheers:

actually I would love a little explanation. Did you think I was trying to sell her a car? Can you be more specific and tell me where you think I broke the rules? I'm not being argumentative I'm genuinely curious because other than you misunderstanding about the car thing I just dont see it.

SOMEONE HAD MENTIONED HOW L.A. COURTHOUSE IS VERY SIMILIAR TO MIAMI... HERE IS THE PICTURE OF THE L.A. COURTHOUSE FOR ALL OF YOU TO VIEW...

http://img254.imageshack.us/img254/9937/losangelescityhall28collx4.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

actually I would love a little explanation. Did you think I was trying to sell her a car? Can you be more specific and tell me where you think I broke the rules? I'm not being argumentative I'm genuinely curious because other than you misunderstanding about the car thing I just dont see it.

The Taller the Better:) ,
there's no problem here:ohno: ,
I was just letting you know Toucano and Jasonhouse has warned others here:ohno: , of No selling or advertising of Houses or Condos or anything:ohno: ,
Just being " a little " friendly:banana: in letting you know,
lets get back to some fun:lol: ,

And RX:) , my friend, Great picture !!!:cheers:

Well I appreciate your intentions but I think the mods will agree I wasn't trying to sell her anything specially since she was already sold (she purchased the unit already)

No hard feelings of course as you are the grandfather of the forum. I don't know your actual age but your almost 2500 posts makes us think of you as the wise old man of the forum. I mean this in a very respectful way, I hope that's how it comes across.

Well I appreciate your intentions but I think the mods will agree I wasn't trying to sell her anything specially since she was already sold (she purchased the unit already)

No hard feelings of course as you are the grandfather of the forum. I don't know your actual age but your almost 2500 posts makes us think of you as the wise old man of the forum. I mean this in a very respectful way, I hope that's how it comes across.

THANKS^^ ^^ , The Taller the Better:) ,
My friend, I do really do understand ya,
and how did you know I was a " grandfather:ohno: " well just one grandchild so far:banana: , lol
but , anyway, thanks for the name " Grandfather " lol, I am getting old:lol: and the respect,
p.s. by the way, okay, I'm 52 now, but don't tell anyone, LOL:nuts: :nuts:

RX i believe thats the LA City Hall.

oops

That is the Los Angeles City Hall.

RX i believe thats the LA City Hall.

That is what RX put on the top of the picture "LA City Hall"

They are very similar. They were probably done by the same architect, around the same time with the same architectural styles, with the same federal dollars.

That is what RX put on the top of the picture "LA City Hall"

lol RX put LA courthouse not city hall :ohno:

RX i believe thats the LA City Hall.

yea thats LA city hall

http://www.miamitodaynews.com/news/070607/story1.shtml

Downtown Hyatt set for renovation

By Risa Polansky
Downtown Miami's Hyatt Regency is to be renovated, and possibly expanded, now that city officials have settled on preliminary plans for the future of the 5.7-acre James L. Knight Center complex.
Based on consultant Staubach Co. Northeast's recommendation, the city plans to sell its Knight Center property north of the I-95 ramp and to explore a revamp of the Hyatt facilities.
Miami subsidizes the Knight Center about $1.9 million a year, said Lori Billberry, director of public facilities.
City and Hyatt officials are to meet this month to discuss plans, she said.
At a commission meeting last month, attorney Joel Maxwell of Akerman Senterfitt, who represents the Hyatt, said possibilities include "doubling the number of hotel rooms, and maybe construction of a first-rate conference center."
Hyatt Equities representatives could not be reached.
Hotel officials "want to make it a better property, make it a centerpiece for attracting meetings and conferences to downtown Miami," said attorney Neisen Kasdin, a Hyatt co-counsel.
An invitation to bid on the 1.3 acres of north-end land is expected soon. A garage and the colorful landmark Bank of America Tower with ground-floor retail would be included under transfer of a lease arrangement.
The administration has yet to settle on an asking price for the land. "We're going to set a minimum," Ms. Billberry said.
The 4,646-seat Knight Center; 28,000-square-foot Miami Convention Center; 23,000 square feet of University of Miami conference space, auditoriums and meeting rooms; and 612-bed Hyatt Regency with 23,000 square feet of meeting area make up the rest of the complex.
The city has yet to schedule a meeting with the university, which declined to comment, to discuss plans for its part of the complex, Ms. Billberry said.

That's good news.....hopefully the Hyatt can become one of the nicer options for hotels in downtown after the renovation. There will really be some good new hotel options in that area after the Met 2 Marriott is completed and the Hyatt is renovated.

When I went through the Hyatt complex to get to the knight center metromover station you could really see how the complex is connected to the BOA tower. That will be an important part of making it great after the renovation (keeping it connected with the tower).

it will be demolished and a taller 650+ feet tower will go in its place
it will be mixed use condo-timeshare-hotel with office space.... that is hte only way to maximize the land and the city will no longer have the center in its tax roll as an expense but instead the owners will be paying the city taxes for the convention center there...

Rx, are you saying that the Hyatt will be demolished or the Bank of America Tower?

If it's the Hyatt (of course it is, anyone with sense wouldn't knock down the BOA) then that's good to hear, just another skyscraper added to downtown!

the hyatt would be demolished

i think that bidding will begin at around 35 million for the whole site which is a developers dream come true... related will probably bid for the site...

Well they are right across in One miami...

That Hyatt thing is pretty ugly so I say bring it. Hope they do something nice and shiny haha.

lemme know what date the implosion is...

I've stayed at this hotel before. What an amazing location! And if I remember correctly, it was BUSY! That thing needs to double the number of rooms there. They demolished the Sheraton across the street from it to build ICON: Brickell. A nice 70+ storey hotel would be perfect here. Hyatt's done tall hotels before-- they're the occupant for the Jin Mao Tower in Shanghai, an 80-story, 1000-foot-high building.

now that i remember, the hyatt in Atlanta (which was pretty freakin sweet...) was decently tall, and it had a rotating restaurant at the top, Polaris. it was awesome.

so... to the future developers... hint-ati-hint-hint-hint

this is just kind of random but it is it is a warning to downtown miami drivers. I got a ticket the other day making a left onto the cross street through macy's that leads to the miami avenue bridge. it says no turns, and most people ignore it because there really isn't a good sign for a left turn to be illegal at this intersection but a cop was waiting on the corner once you pass macy's and I, as well as 5 other drivers got pulled over. it was my first ticket ever which stunk. just warning everyone

just warning everyone

:lol: I think the fact that it says "no turns" should be enough of a warning. :nuts:

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y61/Sotomon3/skylineMIA.jpg
latest on Wikipedia.com 6/10/07

^^ who took that? Nice picture!

Looks who's back...

http://www.miamigov.com/planning/pages/Boards/UDRB062007.pdf

Appearing before the UDRB on Jun 20th, 2007
Item #5 -Empire World Towers 330 Biscayne Blvd
review of an application for a Major Use Special Permit for New Construction.

nice...

Hopefully, they're being submitted with a bit more daring architecture.

Told ya so...

My source told me they had been working on it with the city for the past months...

Hopefully, they're being submitted with a bit more daring architecture.

I thought the design was gorgeous, they only think missing was a public plaza where the old ugly hotel is between them.

Can someone repost the old beautiful renderings of the EWT twin oval towers from high above the omni area. I think there were two awesome renderings and now I can't seem to find them around here anymore.

Is this it?
http://www.miamirealestatetrends.com/Images/StarterImages/Images2/Empire-World-Towers.jpg


Just wondering, is the EWT site considered Park West?

Or these renderings:
http://www.kobikarp.com/images/empirenewer002.jpg

http://www.kobikarp.com/images/empirenewer001.jpg

Thanks Dave for the great renderings!!

I would like to see OVERTOWN cleaned up and developed properly,before anything else is erected in the central business district.

The northern CBD (Park West) needs help too. I'd rather see that area east of 95 and south of 395 fixed up before Overtown, which is more disconnected from downtown because it's north of 395.

parc lofts is occupied and filling station is on the 3rd floor but is this really considered overtown? thoughts?

I thought Overtown was more to the west than to the north of downtown?

It's both. Overtown is the area west of I-95 and north of the Miami River, as well as the area north of I-395, west of Miami Avenue, and east of NW 12th Avenue.

parc lofts is occupied and filling station is on the 3rd floor but is this really considered overtown? thoughts?

Those two projects are in the extreme northeast corner of Overtown, but probably are more western Midtown. Logik is in SE Overtown and New Arena Square is as well. Much of overtown is west of I-95 though and hasn't really seen much talk of development.

Those two projects are in the extreme northeast corner of Overtown, but probably are more western Midtown. Logik is in SE Overtown and New Arena Square is as well. Much of overtown is west of I-95 though and hasn't really seen much talk of development.

The areas north of 395 to 20 st are now being called the performing arts district, north of 20 st is wynwood, and a signficant piece of that area west of 95 (everything west of 7 ave to the river and south of 836 is divided between 2 separate areas not considered part of overtown, Spring Garden along the river and Highland Park to the northeast of it.

so overtown is north of 5 st, east of nw 7 ave, west of nw 1st ave and south of 20th St... this is my rough understanding of it not undisputed fact

Since Crosswinds project is a dead issue,the city needs to tear down the remaining cinder block housing and build decent looking governmental looking housing to avoid gentrification for the existing and future tenants.Any thoughts on this?

With the Everglades on the Bay project "Top Out" just months away, Gryphon Shell is shifting its gears to another level and preparing for the upcoming challenges ahead. We are reaching the 46th level slab on the South Tower and the 42nd level slab on the North. Once the 49th levels of the slabs are poured in the respective towers, the real fun begins; the team will begin to encounter something new, the tedious and adventurous task of dismantling the Owner’s Cantilever jump form system 500 feet above the ground. This work will involve special preparation and coordination between the Gryphon team and our subcontractors. Completion of this job requires the team to dismantle tons upon tons of "I" beams, "C" channels and sheet metal fifty stories in the air. Once the system is taken apart piece by piece we will lower the steel, clean the steel of soil and grease and package the system to ship it back to Australia. We anticipate this activity to last about 2 weeks per tower. After this task is completed we will then continue to work on the remaining two slabs and the roof, forming them up conventionally. Our current target completion date for both of the towers is the beginning of August.

Gryphon Shell has maintained its rigorous 6 day pour schedule placing approximately 1500 yards of concrete a week but in the coming weeks our production pace will slow down. We have begun work on the recreational deck on the West Podium, where we have been faced with pool design problems and numerous design changes that made it almost impossible to schedule our work. This along with the never ending problems we encounter playing the role of a subcontractor were we are expecting and assuming (ASS wrong) that someone else had coordinated and scheduled the follow on trades. Our biggest obstacle ahead is the construction of a 28" concrete slab that will be the foundation for the Health Spa that stands above the Amenities deck. This slab will require around 2000 yards of concrete and will be re-shored 8 Levels below.

On the East Podium we are bringing up the last two slab sections to the Amenities level. We are currently on the 6th Level for Area 5 and the 3rd Level for area 6B. We have begun construction on the lap pool in the East Podium and will continue to work on the other pools and the bar as soon as areas 5 and 6B reach the Amenities height. The Podium decks are scheduled to top off in late June.

Gryphon will continue its efforts to confront and conquer all challenges that the role of a subcontractor has brought upon.

- Josh Harder, Assistant Project Manager


http://img239.imageshack.us/img239/4627/everbay2k7051tb4.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

http://img524.imageshack.us/img524/7962/everbay2k7052bi8.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

http://img239.imageshack.us/img239/3997/everbay2k7053rl7.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

RX:) , my friend,
Thanks for that great update:banana: ,
It's amazing how many of us members were there to see the Old Everglades Hotel come down in just 8 seconds, LOL.:cheers:

Go Cranes !!!:banana: :) :banana:

RX:) , my friend,
Thanks for that great update:banana: ,
It's amazing how many of us members were there to see the Old Everglades Hotel come down in just 8 seconds, LOL.:cheers:

Go Cranes !!!:banana: :) :banana:



HAHA

Everglades looks amazing. I really can't wait till Loft2 is done and when they begin on Loft3. That whole area is getting better everyday, it's awesome.

Loft 3 and then Loft 4 yes!!!

RX, that was a very detailed construction update for the Everglades project (thanks). Do you know what happened there with Gryphon to cause them to say that they are playing the role of subcontractor?

I work in construction, and I'm just curious, since I thought Gryphon was the GC for the project.

So, by my count, 17 towers are u/c or recently completed in the CBD north of the river and south of the expressway.

And presumably there are a few more to come, such as Loft 4 and, hopefully, Met 3.

Ive always liked the Everglades project, nice looking towers

did you count one miami? do you count everglades and one as two towers?

The USS Gridley joins America's naval fleet and makes history by becoming the first Navy warship ever to be commissioned in Miami.


WATCH THE VIDEO
http://www.miamidade.gov/ondemand/Feature_Gridley.asp

did you count one miami? do you count everglades and one as two towers?It doesn't seem to me that there are many tall skyscrapers in the center of the CBD.It seems they are mostly skewed toward Biscayne Boulevard and the Miami river.Why is this?

did you count one miami? do you count everglades and one as two towers?

Yes, I counted One Miami, and Everglades as two. I could be off by one or two.

It doesn't seem to me that there are many tall skyscrapers in the center of the CBD.It seems they are mostly skewed toward Biscayne Boulevard and the Miami river.Why is this?

Because those areas are more desirable. The areas near Biscayne Boulevard (east of NE/SE 2nd Ave) and the Miami River (south of SE/SW 1st Street) are the most desirbale and nicest in the CBD. The interior still has some "grit and grime" and there aren't as many new projects, and the ones that do exist there aren't as tall as the ones on the edges of the CBD. Brickell doesn't have this problem as much but with the CBD it's very evident.....mainly because of some of the older buildilngs that they would never knock down in the interior like the 19-story Alfred I. duPont buildling, which has historical significance but is not that tall. There are some taller ones though like the Stephen P. Clark center, Museum Tower, Bank of America tower, etc. so you're not 100% correct.

It is getting there.

It doesn't seem to me that there are many tall skyscrapers in the center of the CBD.It seems they are mostly skewed toward Biscayne Boulevard and the Miami river.Why is this?

The answer is so big you can go swimming in it.

Why do the bayfront and the river have in common? ... people like to look at water! And developers know they can charge a premium for it so there you have it.

question is the building in the left the IVY project?
http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g268/khst_2006/1182412988641193.jpg

question is the building in the left the IVY project?
http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g268/khst_2006/1182412988641193.jpg

I believe that's Wind.

DESIGN ISSUES WITH THE POOL DECK HAVE EATEN INTO THERE DEADLINE THIS IS WHY THEY MENTION THE FOLLOWING


we have been faced with pool design problems and numerous design changes that made it almost impossible to schedule our work. This along with the never ending problems we encounter playing the role of a subcontractor were we are expecting and assuming (ASS wrong) that someone else had coordinated and scheduled the follow on trades.

no Dale he was right Ivy is on the left and wind is on the right, looks like the pedestal for Mint is uc too (front of Ivy)

Cima will follow suit soon on the right

Somebody should put up a building just called "Bob."

(although I might just order a "Mint Ivy Wind" at a cocktail lounge) :cheers:

Damn I didn't know there were going to be 4 buildings in that little area. Shit. I just though 3. wow

Damn I didn't know there were going to be 4 buildings in that little area. Shit. I just though 3. wow

Actually 6 are planned with a 7th on a small out-parcel. The other buildings may be many years away though.

Somebody should put up a building just called "Bob."

(although I might just order a "Mint Ivy Wind" at a cocktail lounge) :cheers:
lmao@Bob

how 'bout we name one for Chuck.

Actually 6 are planned with a 7th on a small out-parcel. The other buildings may be many years away though.

Do you have any website reference to this so I can check it out?

Do you have any website reference to this so I can check it out?

The plans for the buildings they submitted to the city:

Riverfront East (Wind, Cima..etc) -page 8 shows the 3 buildings on the east side
http://egov.ci.miami.fl.us/Legistarweb/Attachments/11541.pdf

Riverfront West (Ivy, Mint..etc)
http://egov.ci.miami.fl.us/Legistarweb/Attachments/11484.pdf

lmao@Bob

how 'bout we name one for Chuck.

Thanks " Born in the Grove :) ",
my friend,

can we call tower # 5 " Chuckster ", lol.:cheers:

Very true , there are 6 really planned condos in the same area,
# 1 , Wind , true on the right,
# 2, IVY, true on the left,
# 3, Mint, in front along river on the Left,
and # 4, Cima, approved and ready to break ground soon, on the river on the right,
# 5, Chuckster, in the back right,
and # 6 , Dave's Loft, in the back , on the left.

The plans for the buildings they submitted to the city:

Riverfront East (Wind, Cima..etc) -page 8 shows the 3 buildings on the east side
http://egov.ci.miami.fl.us/Legistarweb/Attachments/11541.pdf

Riverfront West (Ivy, Mint..etc)
http://egov.ci.miami.fl.us/Legistarweb/Attachments/11484.pdf

NICE. Thanks. Can't wait. That'll look great.

Thanks " Born in the Grove :) ",
my friend,

can we call tower # 5 " Chuckster ", lol.:cheers:




What about ChuckScraper??? Lol.

What about ChuckScraper??? Lol.

NOW THAT'S a name for a tower. :) :)

ooo ooo i got one.


The Chuckropolis!

The last crane at Loft 2 came down yesterday. They have already planted some palm trees on the 35th floor pool deck.

The last crane at Loft 2 came down yesterday. They have already planted some palm trees on the 35th floor pool deck.

Great news that Loft 2 is nearing completion. Any idea when it will open to residents? That is a cool building with the metromover station inside that "hole"....it's also a decent size even though it's not very tall and adds much needed density to the area.

Can't wait until they start LOFT 3 and 4.:banana:

It doesn't seem to me that there are many tall skyscrapers in the center of the CBD.It seems they are mostly skewed toward Biscayne Boulevard and the Miami river.Why is this?
Views. Buidings built on the water have better views from their apartments/offices.

Damn I didn't know there were going to be 4 buildings in that little area. Shit. I just though 3. wow 13.5 Acres isn't a little area.
As far as buildings per acre, The Riverfront project is by far less dense than Brickell Key.
There are also long term plans to add two more towers across the steet from from Riverfont.

13.5 Acres isn't a little area.
As far as buildings per acre, The Riverfront project is by far less dense than Brickell Key.
There are also long term plans to add two more towers across the steet from from Riverfont.

Well EXCUSE me. :nuts:

Well EXCUSE me.:)

Drove by downtown, saw epic is now building the tower.

I think it was very polite of Epic to glass in the liner units immediately, so we didn't have to stare into a garage looking pedestal for the next two years.

Do you think they are going to build both of the towers for epic?

Not now...maybe someday. They will be very happy to get one finished and sold. I think Epic came into the game 2 years or more later than most...later than Met3... and who's winning the race? There were several surprises to me about late starters like Icon Brickell, boom there it is # TOWERS! much later, many years after, say Ice. Everyone loves Brickell I guess. It's a little to corporate for me. I know...no commute is good.

Not now...maybe someday. They will be very happy to get one finished and sold. I think Epic came into the game 2 years or more later than most...later than Met3... and who's winning the race? There were several surprises to me about late starters like Icon Brickell, boom there it is # TOWERS! much later, many years after, say Ice. Everyone loves Brickell I guess. It's a little to corporate for me. I know...no commute is good.

The difference is in the developer.

Ugo Columbo is probably the highest quality developer we have (Skyline, Santa Maria, Bristol, Grovenor House and Epic)

And of course Icon Brickell is Jorge Perez and if he says I'm gonna put a tower here you can bet your sweet bippy you will see that f**ker rising soon there after.

The Met people and the Midtown people on the other hand seem to have their heads up their arses.

yes, but to be fair, the met people are slightly ahead of the midtown people; they have shaq! ooooooooooooooooo

The difference is in the developer.. Exactly! Savvy investors will buy Ugo Columbo, Jorge Perez, and Edgardo Defortuna in any market.
PS. Ugo didn't do Skyline.

Well I wish one of these SUPERDEVELOPERS would go and take a chance in Edgewater. Is Edgewater waterfront so undesirable? Overpriced? Jorge has gone to 79th and Grove Bay.

This is very very interesting

Pedestrian-friendly Biscayne Boulevard in works
BY MICHAEL VASQUEZ
mrvasquez@MiamiHerald.com

Biscayne Boulevard in downtown Miami often serves as the city's front porch, welcoming visitors to Bayside Marketplace, the American Airlines Arena and other venues.

But with eight lanes of traffic, the wide boulevard can be imposing -- or even downright intimidating for anyone not in a car. ''Like a highway,'' says downtown business owner Jose Goyanes. Enter Miami's Downtown Development Authority. As part of a 118-page downtown master plan that is still in the draft stages, the panel is considering a proposal to give the boulevard a more inviting, pedestrian-friendly feel.

What would that mean? Trees. Lots of them. The concept is to replace five acres of traffic lanes and parking lots with a public park, stretching from Northeast Fifth Street to Southeast Second Street.

Another element of the proposal: Narrow the boulevard to make it easier for pedestrians to cross the street.

The public will get its first glimpse of the still-unfinished master plan today at 5:30 p.m. at a Downtown Development Authority board meeting. The vision of a new Biscayne Boulevard is sure to be part of the discussion.

''That is our window on the world,'' Executive Director Dana Nottingham said of Biscayne Boulevard. ``It's where the visitors, residents, business workers -- everyone -- comes together.''

And making it a lot greener and walkable, it turns out, wouldn't cost much. Miami City Commissioner Marc Sarnoff, whose district includes much of downtown, said he's been told by city staff and state transportation officials that the cost to city taxpayers would be ''minimal to none.'' City staffers have not yet assembled any formal assessment of the proposal.

The Florida Department of Transportation would have to contribute some funds to redoing the street, but not a staggering amount -- about $1 million or less, Sarnoff said.

''This is as close to a no-brainer as you'll ever find,'' he said. ``It's just wise and prudent for us to pursue this as quickly as possible.''

Under one proposed scenario, underground parking lots would be built beneath the proposed public park.

European companies would be willing to fund it in exchange for reaping the long-term revenues from parking fees, Sarnoff said.

Some ideas put forth by the authority to spruce up downtown Miami are simple. They include installing better street lights and creating uniform guidelines for storefront facades, signage and awnings.

Other suggestions are complex and would require the cooperation of various stakeholders. One such proposal calls for reconfiguring and redeveloping the site of the downtown Hyatt Hotel and the James L. Knight Conference Center, located on Southeast Second Avenue and fronting the Miami River.

The city of Miami owns the Knight Center as well as the Hyatt land, which is leased by the hotel chain. If both sides agree on the new layout, the DOT, too, would have to get involved because the plan calls for lowering the adjacent I-95 ramps that are both a physical and visual barrier.

But the results could be jaw-dropping: a new riverside park with an expansive view of the Miami River.

Bernard Zyscovich, the architect who helped write the authority's master plan, says a less-intimidating, more pedestrian-friendly downtown would make the area more lively for Miamians to meet and interact -- hopefully even after dark -- and draw more tourists.

Zyscovich calls it ``urban tourism.''

''Now, people go to cities because they have an interest in seeing what the life of the city is like,'' he said. The problem with downtown today, he said, is it's ``not the kind of place you'd ever want to come back to, by and large.''

The authority's master plan has been in the works for a while, but the plan's arrival on the public stage couldn't be more timely.

In recent weeks, the downtown area has been the unofficial whipping boy for Miami's business community.

It started with Macy's Florida Chairman Julie Greiner, who last month ripped the state of downtown in a speech to the Greater Miami Chamber of Commerce. She complained of ``broken curbs, collapsed sidewalks and garbage-strewn empty lots.''

The city, fearing the loss of one of downtown's most important tenants, has been trying to make nice with Macy's. Miami Mayor Manny Diaz, while disputing Macy's assessment of downtown, acknowledges it is a neighborhood in transition. But the mayor says it's on the way up.

When asked last week what downtown needs, Diaz responded: ``Time.''

The residential towers now rising downtown are key, the mayor added. More people living in downtown will lure better restaurants and more retailers.

Downtown sure need time but it also needs representatives that go forward with their plans..so many ideas so few steps towards them..they need to stop talking and start their plans ..miami 21 ...transports...street car...metrorail....parks...museum.....beautification of downtown, cleaning streets and finding homes to homeless...increase in police ...THEY NEED TO GO FORWARD...NOW!!!!

Thank you borninthegrove. Im really dying to hear more about this park!!!


"5 acres of traffic lanes and parking lots" can anyone give a more detailed explanation of what parcels this covers???

I'm guessing they're talking about the parking lot between the northbound and southbound lanes of Biscayne Blvd, in front of Bayfront Park.

From the article I got the impression it would be on the land where the Knight Center and the Hyatt are on the river.

Im just confused because it says "5 acres of traffic lanes and parking lots"

Looks like the plan is to move both directions of traffic to where the Southbound lanes currently are and expand the park farther west, covering the area where the northbound lanes and the parking lot is:

Herald images
before:
http://media.miamiherald.com/smedia/2007/07/16/09/140-071607now.embedded.prod_affiliate.56.jpg

after:
http://media.miamiherald.com/smedia/2007/07/16/09/583-071607new.embedded.prod_affiliate.56.jpg

Wow thanks Dave8721. You are always providing us with awesome information!!!

Wow, that looks amazing, amazing, AMAZING! If that were to get done, that would be so good. I really like that they're proponents of more green space and pedestrian-friendly areas. Very happy to hear this, now let's DO IT!!

that rendering is kind of confusing, the metromover portion that goes over the biscayne median is nowhere to be found, it isn't very clear, but hopefully it'll work. we need green parks with shade. however, do you guys think reducing the biscayne lanes will alleviate traffic?

that rendering is kind of confusing, the metromover portion that goes over the biscayne median is nowhere to be found, it isn't very clear, but hopefully it'll work. we need green parks with shade. however, do you guys think reducing the biscayne lanes will alleviate traffic?

It'll certainly congest Biscayne Blvd but I'd prefer that than to have the huge ass avenue we have now. Plus, it would promote the use of mass transit in the area, considering the metromover has stations around all downtown for free, you can't ask for more. All you'd have to do is park in other parts of downtown and take the metromover, or simply walk, if you need to get to the areas on Biscayne Blvd. The parking lots under the metromover in the medians are annoying, and dirty-looking; if they were made into green spaces, the avenue would be beautified and look much cleaner, as well as give much shade. The metromover would be under the current parking lots and the park would shift west. In the rendering it doesn't show the metromover, because the metromover turns west right at 50 Biscayne. I think it's a really great idea. :)

It is like you are the frog in FROGGER trying to get across that damn street now. I love the rendering and design however, the traffic will be increased greatly. But you can't have your cake and eat it to. I prefer the new design.

yes, but to be fair, the met people are slightly ahead of the midtown people; they have shaq! ooooooooooooooooo

LOL...I really like Shaq but it was hard not to laugh when people thought using his picture in an ad would spur sales at Met3. I mean, what kind of person would make a financial decision involving hundreds of thousands of dollars because a basketball player who won't even live there says they should buy?? :nuts:

(here's to a Met3 groundbreaking before Christmas......of 2020.) :cheers:

It is like you are the frog in FROGGER trying to get across that damn street now. I love the rendering and design however, the traffic will be increased greatly. But you can't have your cake and eat it to. I prefer the new design.

Agreed. If things wind up looking like that rendering, then I think it's a pretty dramatic improvement of the streetscape. Sure, the traffic may increase but it may also cause some people to find alternate routes and I think anything that creates less of a "wall" between Bayfront Park (and its extensions) and the rest of the city---as the Boulevard has often been---has to be viewed as a plus.

And thanks for the rendering, Dave!

you know, i always envisioned the parking lots in the middle of biscayne blvd being converted into the lanes for the miami streetcar. its the way san francisco has it.... not that we should copy them, but they do have the right idea.

Did anyone else catch the bit about a new riverside park where the Hyatt and James L. Knight Conference Center are located? There was another announcement about this development a while ago and I feel like it involved connecting the Knight Center to the BOA Tower somehow. Anyone remember what I'm talking about?

EDIT: Found it, although there was no mention of any parks in the article (Miami Today, June 7th, 2007 (http://miamitodaynews.com/news/070607/story1.shtml)).
Downtown Hyatt set for renovation
By Risa Polansky
Downtown Miami's Hyatt Regency is to be renovated, and possibly expanded, now that city officials have settled on preliminary plans for the future of the 5.7-acre James L. Knight Center complex.
Based on consultant Staubach Co. Northeast's recommendation, the city plans to sell its Knight Center property north of the I-95 ramp and to explore a revamp of the Hyatt facilities.
Miami subsidizes the Knight Center about $1.9 million a year, said Lori Billberry, director of public facilities.
City and Hyatt officials are to meet this month to discuss plans, she said.
At a commission meeting last month, attorney Joel Maxwell of Akerman Senterfitt, who represents the Hyatt, said possibilities include "doubling the number of hotel rooms, and maybe construction of a first-rate conference center."
Hyatt Equities representatives could not be reached.
Hotel officials "want to make it a better property, make it a centerpiece for attracting meetings and conferences to downtown Miami," said attorney Neisen Kasdin, a Hyatt co-counsel.
An invitation to bid on the 1.3 acres of north-end land is expected soon. A garage and the colorful landmark Bank of America Tower with ground-floor retail would be included under transfer of a lease arrangement.
The administration has yet to settle on an asking price for the land. "We're going to set a minimum," Ms. Billberry said.
The 4,646-seat Knight Center; 28,000-square-foot Miami Convention Center; 23,000 square feet of University of Miami conference space, auditoriums and meeting rooms; and 612-bed Hyatt Regency with 23,000 square feet of meeting area make up the rest of the complex.
The city has yet to schedule a meeting with the university, which declined to comment, to discuss plans for its part of the complex, Ms. Billberry said.

Scroll down for the quote:
This is very very interesting
Pedestrian-friendly Biscayne Boulevard in works
BY MICHAEL VASQUEZ
mrvasquez@MiamiHerald.com

Biscayne Boulevard in downtown Miami often serves as the city's front porch, welcoming visitors to Bayside Marketplace, the American Airlines Arena and other venues.

But with eight lanes of traffic, the wide boulevard can be imposing -- or even downright intimidating for anyone not in a car. ''Like a highway,'' says downtown business owner Jose Goyanes. Enter Miami's Downtown Development Authority. As part of a 118-page downtown master plan that is still in the draft stages, the panel is considering a proposal to give the boulevard a more inviting, pedestrian-friendly feel.

What would that mean? Trees. Lots of them. The concept is to replace five acres of traffic lanes and parking lots with a public park, stretching from Northeast Fifth Street to Southeast Second Street.

Another element of the proposal: Narrow the boulevard to make it easier for pedestrians to cross the street.

The public will get its first glimpse of the still-unfinished master plan today at 5:30 p.m. at a Downtown Development Authority board meeting. The vision of a new Biscayne Boulevard is sure to be part of the discussion.

''That is our window on the world,'' Executive Director Dana Nottingham said of Biscayne Boulevard. ``It's where the visitors, residents, business workers -- everyone -- comes together.''

And making it a lot greener and walkable, it turns out, wouldn't cost much. Miami City Commissioner Marc Sarnoff, whose district includes much of downtown, said he's been told by city staff and state transportation officials that the cost to city taxpayers would be ''minimal to none.'' City staffers have not yet assembled any formal assessment of the proposal.

The Florida Department of Transportation would have to contribute some funds to redoing the street, but not a staggering amount -- about $1 million or less, Sarnoff said.

''This is as close to a no-brainer as you'll ever find,'' he said. ``It's just wise and prudent for us to pursue this as quickly as possible.''

Under one proposed scenario, underground parking lots would be built beneath the proposed public park.

European companies would be willing to fund it in exchange for reaping the long-term revenues from parking fees, Sarnoff said.

Some ideas put forth by the authority to spruce up downtown Miami are simple. They include installing better street lights and creating uniform guidelines for storefront facades, signage and awnings.

Other suggestions are complex and would require the cooperation of various stakeholders. One such proposal calls for reconfiguring and redeveloping the site of the downtown Hyatt Hotel and the James L. Knight Conference Center, located on Southeast Second Avenue and fronting the Miami River.

The city of Miami owns the Knight Center as well as the Hyatt land, which is leased by the hotel chain. If both sides agree on the new layout, the DOT, too, would have to get involved because the plan calls for lowering the adjacent I-95 ramps that are both a physical and visual barrier.

But the results could be jaw-dropping: a new riverside park with an expansive view of the Miami River.

Bernard Zyscovich, the architect who helped write the authority's master plan, says a less-intimidating, more pedestrian-friendly downtown would make the area more lively for Miamians to meet and interact -- hopefully even after dark -- and draw more tourists.

Zyscovich calls it ``urban tourism.''

''Now, people go to cities because they have an interest in seeing what the life of the city is like,'' he said. The problem with downtown today, he said, is it's ``not the kind of place you'd ever want to come back to, by and large.''

The authority's master plan has been in the works for a while, but the plan's arrival on the public stage couldn't be more timely.

In recent weeks, the downtown area has been the unofficial whipping boy for Miami's business community.

It started with Macy's Florida Chairman Julie Greiner, who last month ripped the state of downtown in a speech to the Greater Miami Chamber of Commerce. She complained of ``broken curbs, collapsed sidewalks and garbage-strewn empty lots.''

The city, fearing the loss of one of downtown's most important tenants, has been trying to make nice with Macy's. Miami Mayor Manny Diaz, while disputing Macy's assessment of downtown, acknowledges it is a neighborhood in transition. But the mayor says it's on the way up.

When asked last week what downtown needs, Diaz responded: ``Time.''

The residential towers now rising downtown are key, the mayor added. More people living in downtown will lure better restaurants and more retailers.

Thanks Paul, this is what I thought I read in the 2nd article you posted. Frankly, I'd be more excited about a riverfront park at the Knight Center location than what theyre proposing on Biscayne.

They need to start now! ..they need to stop talking and take actions...Tose projects take time they need to be proactive and start it up giving full authority to people who know the city well like Zyscovich who can put together a team of representative from downtown and take decision quickly.

^^ ^^ YES!!! Let's get it going!

However, there goes all the time money and work that went into the boulevard. haha. The city really needs to plan better instead of just spending.

indeed put people in charge that know their stuff..no politicians

Just do it!

On a random note, is it just me or are some of the avatars on here not showing up anymore?

^^ ^^ YES!!! Let's get it going!

However, there goes all the time money and work that went into the boulevard. haha. The city really needs to plan better instead of just spending.

THey are actually speaking of the area from NE 2 to NE 5 (right before AAA). The area that is currently being renovated is from 5th to the PAC.

Just do it!

On a random note, is it just me or are some of the avatars on here not showing up anymore?

I've noticed the same, kevin...mine also disappeared. The avatar goblin strikes again, I guess.:lol:

LOL...I really like Shaq but it was hard not to laugh when people thought using his picture in an ad would spur sales at Met3. I mean, what kind of person would make a financial decision involving hundreds of thousands of dollars because a basketball player who won't even live there says they should buy?? :nuts:

(here's to a Met3 groundbreaking before Christmas......of 2020.) :cheers:

LOL SpellBound:) , my friend,
that's funny:lol: ,
but:ohno: ,
it will be way before then:nuts: ,
okay, let's say by Christmas, 2012, ???:ohno: lol
don't worry , be happy:banana: ,
as soon as the Met 3 sales trailer is removed from the Met Square property and moved into the Lobby of MET 1, Met 3 will resume the already groundbreaking and continue with it's foundation which has a few pounded in rebar colums in the northwest corner of the MET 3 site, which anyone can see these colums on the Metro Mover cars going over the site with the parked construction workers cars on the property of MET 3 and these were pounded in by a huge red crane already put in over a year ago.
everything should be planned for a late January, 2008 continued foundation work on MET 3 !!!:cheers:

^^ ^^ Chuck funny thing you mentioned the foundation at the MET 3 site. I've noticed all along that there are already rebars and cement pylons sticking out of the ground. So have they started the foundation long ago and when they move the trailer and everything into MET 1 they will start from there? So technically they have broke ground on MET 3. I can't wait until it's done. The site will be great. I know they will finish the MET project. :banana:

They 'broke ground' on Met3 like 3 years ago but they ran into all sorts of trouble with Indian remains on the site which caused the year and a half long archealogical dig to take place.

They 'broke ground' on Met3 like 3 years ago but they ran into all sorts of trouble with Indian remains on the site which caused the year and a half long archealogical dig to take place.

Then, they broke ground again, about a year ago, according to one respected forumer.

Just busting on you, man. :lol:

They need to start now! ..they need to stop talking and take actions...Tose projects take time they need to be proactive and start it up giving full authority to people who know the city well like Zyscovich who can put together a team of representative from downtown and take decision quickly.
Actions are being taken. About 2 months ago, I saw the renderings for the Hyatt/"riverfront" park and asked Zyscovich for jpg to post here on SSC. He definitely didn't want them circulated yet.
There is no way in hell that Zyscovich can do this by himself, and there probably isn't any one person to make a project of this magnatude happen by themselves. The team is in place, and like all major capital improvement projects they take time...lot's of time.

So Roark, there is a proposed Hyatt/Knight center park??? Can you tell us what you saw please? Im very curious about this.

So Roark, there is a proposed Hyatt/Knight center park??? Can you tell us what you saw please? Im very curious about this.

I'm assuming this is the same riverfront park that was mentioned yesterday in the Miami Herald, right?

What's the status on Loft 3 and Loft 4? When is construction expected to begin on those two?

What's the status on Loft 3 and Loft 4? When is construction expected to begin on those two?

Kevin Kagy:) , my friend,
Good question, could be awhile, and might again be on hold.
But,
Jorge Perez:banana: and the Related Group are getting Oasis 1 started first.
It's sold out, and breaking next month, and sales have already started selling good on Oasis 2.:cheers:

Why would loft 3 be on hold? Sales were very brisk and the building in the parcel is pretty much empty now and we knpow related can handle building multiple projects simultaneously. Loft 4 is still in the planning process and it will still be a while for that one.

Why would loft 3 be on hold? Sales were very brisk and the building in the parcel is pretty much empty now and we knpow related can handle building multiple projects simultaneously. Loft 4 is still in the planning process and it will still be a while for that one.

My Guess is to allow construction costs to fall a bit further...

^^...and hurricane season to end.

Why would loft 3 be on hold? Sales were very brisk and the building in the parcel is pretty much empty now and we knpow related can handle building multiple projects simultaneously. Loft 4 is still in the planning process and it will still be a while for that one.

All the shops in those buildings have been closed and is ready for demolition, so it should be soon. Maybe by Christmas, Loft 3 will begin its foundation.

All the shops in those buildings have been closed and is ready for demolition, so it should be soon. Maybe by Christmas, Loft 3 will begin its foundation.

TRUE Kevin Kagy:) , my friend,
so true,
It's be awhile until groundbreaking is to begin on Loft 3, hopefully May of 2008:cheers:
, But the old Buildings would have to be vacant , and still Not vacant as of last week, I drove down N.E. 2nd ave, and still people are in these old buildings on the LOFT 3 , site and many not moving out soon,
as it looks, ,.nothing is being done to this site as of yet !!!:ohno:

Top of 50 Biscayne illuminated:

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1236/936041766_346a0b3ff2_o.jpg

Top of 50 Biscayne illuminated:

Ok, 50 Biscayne just redeemed itself. :lol:

50 is looking better. Looks like they are working on the building at night. When are they going to start closings?

In this tightening market it was very wise for 50B to get there visual calling card finished and lit up. It changes the entire exprience of the building and the possibility of living there.

I think others should do the same. Has Ten Museum Park ever had a lit crown?? Does anybody know if it will.

Has anybody notcied if Opera Tower Crown is lit.

I saw it lit once and that ws it.

WOW! What a gorgeous downtown we have. 50 B really looks good. congrates to them.

Looks amazing, really great. I also enjoy seeing some condos lit up at One Miami, it shows people really DO live here lol!

I already got notice of loft2 closing Sept/October. Are all these units closing at purchase price? Since there is so much going on, I wanted to know if units are being appraised at purchase price.

Thanks.

Of course they're closing at purchase price, there's a signed contract, the developer cannot arbitrarily demand more money from you any more than a buyer can demand a discount!

Only exception is if you resold your unit then the closing will be at the resale price. Plus developer fees/closing costs of course

Of course they're closing at purchase price, there's a signed contract, the developer cannot arbitrarily demand more money from you any more than a buyer can demand a discount!

Only exception is if you resold your unit then the closing will be at the resale price. Plus developer fees/closing costs of course

Well, this happened to someone I know. She purchased her unit for $365k & before closing the appraisal came in at $325k and they had to give her that price. This is why I am asking, also a lot of developers are offering incentives just to get everyone to close and not back out. I know Loft2 is not offering anything so I was just curious due to what I have heard.

news to me.

^^ Beautiful shot of Miami at night... I really like how 50 Biscayne turned out too :)

Well, this happened to someone I know. She purchased her unit for $365k & before closing the appraisal came in at $325k and they had to give her that price. This is why I am asking, also a lot of developers are offering incentives just to get everyone to close and not back out. I know Loft2 is not offering anything so I was just curious due to what I have heard.
Could this have been a foreclosed property that she was buying? I know that banks will frequently lower the price for a property if an appraisal comes in below the original price.

^^ Beautiful shot of Miami at night... I really like how 50 Biscayne turned out too :)

Wow that's a GREAT PIC! They already sent me a closing notification for 50 Biscayne. Supposedly it's going to start happening end of aug/early sept, but it may take longer for some of the higher floors.

It's really taking shape... I can't wait to live there! :)

I HOPE IT IS YOUR TOTAL DREAM HOUSE!!!:banana:

Are you facing the bay or the city? What floor?

Congratulations. I love hearing about people who are moving on up to the new Miami buildings!!:)

I HOPE IT IS YOUR TOTAL DREAM HOUSE!!!:banana:

Are you facing the bay or the city? What floor?

Congratulations. I love hearing about people who are moving on up to the new Maimi buildings!!:)

Thank you! 50th Floor, East View! :cheers:

WOW!

Let me know if you want it photographed!:)

Party at Mimo's!!!

Wow that's a GREAT PIC! They already sent me a closing notification for 50 Biscayne. Supposedly it's going to start happening end of aug/early sept, but it may take longer for some of the higher floors. It's really taking shape... I can't wait to live there! :) Excellent choice Mimo!!! For the record! I was the one that always loved 50 Biscayne in this forum and took a lot of heat for it (along with all the we hate Revuelta daggers!)

Not sure if I posted this or not, but 50 Biscayne looks just like the Enright Building that was in the movie version of The Fountainhead. This movie is MUST own for any architecture fan...the book is better, but if you don't have that many hours, check out the movie and hit pause on the Enright rendering!

I think it's safe to say that the people who told us to be patient with 50 Biscayne have been vindicated.

I think it's safe to say that the people who told us to be patient with 50 Biscayne have been vindicated. Oops...sorry Dale... you were on board the 50 Biscayne Bandwagon of two.

Here is a nighttime webcam closeup of the 50 biscayne top:

http://img110.imageshack.us/img110/3012/1185890641925496pq8.jpg

Here is a nighttime webcam closeup of the 50 biscayne top:

http://i182.photobucket.com/albums/x59/bobmiami/50Biscayne072607021.jpg

Those lights really make 50 Biscayne stand out on the skyline.

I also noticed they added lights on the east part of the pool deck overlooking the bay. (I will post updated pics soon.) It lights up the whole mid section of the building and columns. I'm hoping they do the same for the front of the lobby.

Don't forget Blue, had the whole back of the building lit up, but later shut it off, I assume the residents could not sleep and complained.

Mimo, you have a great view but need a new camera.

Yeah, sorry... my camera sucks! Looks so much better in person. :)

Could this have been a foreclosed property that she was buying? I know that banks will frequently lower the price for a property if an appraisal comes in below the original price.

No it was not a foreclosure, it was new construction.

540 foot Everglades on the Bay has a tree on top of the building this weekend and a large American flag hanging from the crane to celebrate the topping off of the first tower. The second tower appears to be only a few weeks behind...

http://img115.imageshack.us/img115/142/1186300902987763kw8.jpg
http://img111.imageshack.us/img111/3271/1186300902987910kh4.jpg
http://img184.imageshack.us/img184/8769/1186300902987978mv4.jpg

Loft4 from today's Home Guide in the Herald:
http://img.travidia.com/ss-zoom/1892872

article on the building:
http://specialsections.miami.com/SS/Page.aspx?sstarg=&facing=false&secid=31908&pagenum=3

From Miami Sun Post:

Stay Downtown

There’s nothing static about downtown Miami (forgetting the bad and ugly, which always gets more publicity than the good!). The central area is living up to its metropolis status while becoming an even better destination for visitors.

Latest news: Luxury high-rise waterfront development Epic Residences & Hotel at 300 Biscayne Boulevard Way has teamed with San Francisco-based Kimpton Hotels & Restaurants to manage its hotel component. For the cognoscenti, Kimpton is known for its “cool” factor, individuality and commitment to ecological practices in the 40 luxury boutique hotels it runs in 17 locations around the United States. Epic Hotel will occupy 15 of the 54 stories in the tower and feature a combination of approximately 400 standard rooms and one- and two-bedroom suites, each with a private balcony. Amenities and Kimpton’s signature services will be available for both Epic residents and hotel guests. These include private boat docking, a world-class spa, a high-tech business center and poolside services. Also in the works: chef-driven, destination restaurants and high-profile lounges to bring distinctive nightlife to the property.

Those who want to enjoy the hotel amenities but live in their own home can buy a unit in Epic Residences starting in the $500,000s. There are also separate one- and two-bedroom waterfront townhomes. EPIC is being developed by Ugo Colombo’s CMC Group, Alfredo and Diego Lowenstein’s Lionstone Development, and Amancio Ortega’s Ponte Gadea Group. Construction for the tower has begun. Completion is scheduled for winter 2008 and an additional condominium tower is planned.

Loft4 from today's Home Guide in the Herald:
http://img.travidia.com/ss-zoom/1892872

article on the building:
http://specialsections.miami.com/SS/Page.aspx?sstarg=&facing=false&secid=31908&pagenum=3

Hmm...Didn't see a design like this coming...

It's very unfortunate. I think 2 and 3 are the best of the series. I just thank god that they are not fronting Biscayne Blvd., but instead just contribute to density. Design excellence doesn't mean loss of profit Mr. Developer!

call me wierd but a little paint could go a lo0ng way, just look at the mural on 50 biscayne....or paint it black make it different, loft 4 looks like a cheaper loft2 w/o the whole.

You're absolutely right Architek I actually liked 2 better when it had red in several spots on the building...not just in the tunnel. And I don't even like red.

Even the crown elements on 2 are much more pleasingly related to the building than 4. The scale of the crown seems wrong on 4. I wish they would push that gesture in a little bit of a different direction with a greater cantilever or something????

http://img236.imageshack.us/img236/7733/chicagohk9.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
Shot at 2007-08-10

What do people think about an actual RED building for Miami??

You can't really expect much when the prices start at $139K and from what I remember most of the units are priced below $250k. That being said, paint doesn't cost that much so they at least could have tried to do something creative with the paint job.

Though no, I wouldn't want it to be red like that Chicago one.

Also, I wonder if the building has an "L" shape to it? The parcel its on has a peice that exents a little bit in the northern direction (you can't see it from this angle).

Considering Loft4 is not due until 2011, I am sure it is going to look a little different that this early rendering.

Hey Miami, first post, but long time reader. Learned a lot from this website!! Whenever I talk to someone about downtown, they are shocked to see that I know so much. I love going through the expressway and telling everyone what each building is called. LOL. OK, quick question, when does construction start for Loft 3?

You can't really expect much when the prices start at $139K and from what I remember most of the units are priced below $250k. That being said, paint doesn't cost that much so they at least could have tried to do something creative with the paint job.

Though no, I wouldn't want it to be red like that Chicago one.

Also, I wonder if the building has an "L" shape to it? The parcel its on has a peice that exents a little bit in the northern direction (you can't see it from this angle).

Dave, I don't mean any disrespect, but 'can't really expect much', is a recipe for crap. These are all low income housing solutions that reject that notion. They don't require more money, just a little more thought and care and talent. The Lofts aren't even low income buildings they are workforce housing. If the developer could take just a little less profit (they make plenty of profit on workforce housing though not as much as luxury. Didn't Related PROFIT over $3 billion?) or just take a little time to select an architect who is passionate about design excellence regardless of the budget, there are many who specialize in solutions for low income housing. I think the citizens and commissioners of Miami CAN and should expect a lot more, as they are trying to re-create their downtown. Reasonable prices is not an excuse for mediocre design...or worse.


http://img456.imageshack.us/img456/7067/low3rl7.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
Shot at 2007-08-11

http://img247.imageshack.us/img247/6858/lowrm8.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
Shot at 2007-08-10


http://img481.imageshack.us/img481/3290/low2ya1.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
Shot with NIKON D2X (http://profile.imageshack.us/camerabuy.php?model=NIKON+D2X&make=NIKON+CORPORATION) at 2007-08-11

http://img481.imageshack.us/img481/2949/lojx5.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
Shot at 2007-08-11

^^In Miami, if you make workforce housing look decent, then investors will just buy all of the units and sell them back for a profit. I believe this was the case with Loft 3, which sold out in 3 or 4 days (no idea of when construction starts though). In Overtown, they can't even get a development off the ground without local politicians crying about neighborhood housing prices rising.

http://img236.imageshack.us/img236/7733/chicagohk9.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
Shot at 2007-08-10

What do people think about an actual RED building for Miami??

Good question Arch. I've always thought that building was an eyesore in a beautiful skyline.

I've always loved Chicago and I'd like to start taking 1 weekend trip a year every year!

I think red is cool. It adds diversity to the skyline. I think one of the reasons Shanghai's skyline around Jin Mao and Pearl TV towers is so jaw-dropping and fascinating is because of the multiple colors used there. Purples, reds, greens--not traditional colors from skyscrapers. And it's probably a plus that they have 30-story tall plasma TV ads on them too.

http://img217.imageshack.us/img217/1451/peraltowersw3.jpg

http://img211.imageshack.us/img211/1316/shanghaiorientalpearltvht5.jpg

On Loft 4 parking situation and Related possible putting a bid in to buy the BOA tower garage:

http://www.miamitodaynews.com/news/070816/story7.shtml

Realty firms set to clash over Bank of America tower garage

By Risa Polansky
Developer Related Group is to sign a license agreement with the Miami Parking Authority for 410 parking spaces in the city-owned convention center parking garage downtown now predominately utilized by Bank of America tower occupants.
The deal has created tension between the development powerhouse and Blue Capital, which owns the tower and provides 615 spots to its tenants.
And when the city puts out to bid the garage and the land it and the office tower sit on, the companies could be vying for more than parking spaces — both may make offers on the property, representatives say.
Attorney Al Dotson, on behalf of Blue Capital, told parking authority board members at a meeting last week that allowing Related to use the garage as off-site parking for its proposed Loft 4 residential tower would be "extremely problematic for the existing users of the garage."
In an e-mail, he added that Blue Capital's office and retail tenants use not only the allotted 615 parking spaces butÝ"further, tenants of the office tower have purchased additional monthly parking rights to accommodate their employees, adding to the current parking usage."Ý
The garage has 1,352 spots, with 1,149 cars currently issued permits to park there, according to authority officials.
The agreement granting Loft 4 tenants access to 410 spaces at market rate once the project is completed — set for 2010 — is to be signed within the week, Related, parking authority and city officials say.
"We oversell all of our garages," said Arthur Noriega, authority executive director. Related's request is a "perfect shared use for a garage. That garage is way underutilized at night and on the weekends."
While the city owns the garage, the authority may allot spots without city approval so long as a potential tenant isn't requesting anything outside the parking authority's rights as manager, such as a lease extending beyond 2012, when the authority's management agreement is up, said Lori Billberry, Miami's director of public facilities.
In that case, the contract would require city commission approval.
After reviewing the proposed agreement between Related and the parking authority, she said city involvement is unlikely, barring last-minute contract changes by Related. Authority officials said the same.
The reason behind overselling the garage is that Loft 4 residents would use their cars during the day, leaving plenty of spaces for office tenants to park in during business hours, Mr. Noriega said.
"It never reaches peak," he said of the garage. "It's absolutely a good use for the space."
But parking authority board member Stephen Nostrand questioned why the authority would assume drivers would drive to work when the idea of urbanizing through projects such as Loft 4 suggests tenants would use public transportation or walk, leaving their cars in the garage.
The city allows a developer in the central business district to accommodate parking off-site if a project is within 600 feet of a rapid transit station.
Lofts 4 is planned for 151 SE First St., near First Street Station.
But Miami doesn't offer enough public transportation to negate the need to drive, Mr. Noriega said.
Also, said Oscar Rodriguez, Related's senior vice president of development, a project like Loft 4 — comprised of workforce housing units starting at $139,000 — is designed to draw people downtown, meaning tenants may still have jobs elsewhere and need to drive during the day, leaving the garage free for business-hours tenants.
Loft 4 residents would begin occupying the spots in fall 2010, when the project is to be completed, he said.
The project is to go before the city commission for approval before year's end and break ground within a year, Mr. Rodriguez said.
As part of its plan to sell the garage and the 1.43 acres it and the office tower sit on, the city plans to offer Blue Capital the first shot before bidding, Ms. Billberry said.
However, once the public bidding process begins, Mr. Rodriguez said, "Related could be a potential buyer of this garage as well."

We have so much parking available in Downtown, it's disgusting. I think they can manage!

Speaking of downtown parking:

http://www.miamitodaynews.com/news/070816/fyi.shtml

COMING ALONG: Plans for a new courthouse center garage are to go before Miami's Planning Advisory Board in September, with demolition of the existing garage, 40 NW 3rd St. downtown, scheduled Nov. 1, officials said at a Miami Parking Authority board meeting last week. The new facility would have 852 spaces, 4,043 square feet of retail and 40,878 square feet of office space, according to City of Miami records.

After seeing Maki's pics in the other thread and seeing Epic, whats going to happen to the second tower. Is it still a go, or is that dead too?

It's encouraging seeing Miami making progress on the parking issue. I beleive that part of making a great city is making it based around pedestrians and transit as much as possible in urban areas. Miami Downtown and beaches has the capability to be one of these areas, and it's great that some of the newer buildings will lack parking. It will help to make your city more environmentally friendly and have a better urban environment as well.

It's encouraging seeing Miami making progress on the parking issue. I beleive that part of making a great city is making it based around pedestrians and transit as much as possible in urban areas. Miami Downtown and beaches has the capability to be one of these areas, and it's great that some of the newer buildings will lack parking. It will help to make your city more environmentally friendly and have a better urban environment as well.

I love that idea also, but I don't know if Miami is ready for that. I often use the city transit & the first thing I hear is negative feedback from friends & co-workers. I find that people hop in their cars to even go a few blocks down the road. Hopefully downtowners will get into the mood of living in the city, walk & use the metro...

I'm sorry, but the four "Loft" towers are NOT going to age well. Especially when the surrounding area densifies, and even the upper-floor units become dark dungeons with a view of nothing besides someone's living room 40 feet away. The balconies are so shallow, they're worthless for anything besides smoking on.

If the buildings' units' owners are lucky, it'll morph into a condo for middle-class recent college grads who'll get a job downtown, rent from someone and live there for a few years, then move on. Their condo associations are going to have to be absolutely neurotic about enforcing occupancy limits (like "number of bathrooms x 2 = total allowable living occupants of any age or species"), because they could easily turn into tenements if the owners aren't careful. And god forbid, if it's legal, the condo association needs to categorically prohibit anything vaguely resembling a section 8 rental...

Could it get that bad Canes???

I'd like to visualize recent college grads and young professionals there. I also see it being the affordable option. But section 8??? Section 8 in Loft 2??? That would be a travesty.

If Section 8 housing could afford $550 a month association fees.... I just got the numbers for association fees this week. I totally disagree with that comment. I actually know around 8 people moving into the building (all professionals between 28 and 40 yrs. old). Looking forward to it.

I'm not saying it would happen tomorrow... I'm saying it'll happen if the association decides to allow more than 2 or 3 carbon-based lifeforms per unit to live there. As long as they're prepared to tell a 30 year old woman with a 1/1 unit, "You can have a child, a pet, OR a husband/live-in-boyfriend/lesbian-lover... pick ONE"(*), aggressively forces married couples with 1/1 units to move within 6 months of having a baby, and (most importantly) takes the hard line and says, "no" when a married couple with 2 kids in a 2/2 unit either have child #3 or an elderly parent wants to move in (and backs it up with immediate legal action by the association's attorneys), everything will probably be ok.

In other words, the condo association needs to do its best to make them as UNattractive for families as possible, because the only families for which tiny units with no parking are going to be attractive are POOR families who'll drag the place down. The best way would be to radically raise the fees another $250-400/month to pay the salary of one or two live-in activity directors whose job is to organize fun daily activities and outings likely to entertain single twenty/thirtysomethings. The desired demographic will love it, because the building will have the same vibe the dorms had back on campus, and it'll give them an excuse to be social... while the UNdesired demographic (people with kids, and married couples in danger of having one) will think it's a waste of money and be massively turned off by it.

----

(*) The rationale for expressing maximum occupancy in terms of living carbon units is because anything that restricts occupancy by relationship or age is likely to be challenged successfully in court. If you say a unit can have two living inhabitants per bathroom (one per half) and leave it at that, you're on legally safe ground regardless of motivation. The hardest part is making people who moved in realize that it's time to move on and make room for the next delighted resident(s), rather than staying and eventually ruining the happy vibe for everyone.

I'm sorry, but the four "Loft" towers are NOT going to age well. Especially when the surrounding area densifies, and even the upper-floor units become dark dungeons with a view of nothing besides someone's living room 40 feet away. The balconies are so shallow, they're worthless for anything besides smoking on.

If the buildings' units' owners are lucky, it'll morph into a condo for middle-class recent college grads who'll get a job downtown, rent from someone and live there for a few years, then move on. Their condo associations are going to have to be absolutely neurotic about enforcing occupancy limits (like "number of bathrooms x 2 = total allowable living occupants of any age or species"), because they could easily turn into tenements if the owners aren't careful. And god forbid, if it's legal, the condo association needs to categorically prohibit anything vaguely resembling a section 8 rental...
You've gone off the deep end.
The Loft projects are within 4-6 pedestrian blocks of the City, County, and Federal Courthouses. They are also in close proximity to the Metromover which gives great access to the Brickell Financial District.
Residents can walk to Macy's, Marshall's, Ross, Starbucks, Hooter's, Gap, Bannana Republic, The FREAKIN BISCAYNE BAY, and every major bank, and law firm. WALKING distance. Oh yeah...and the Miami Dade College.

FLASHBACK: 1900. Canes predicts that Manhattan will not "age well"
upper-floor units become dark dungeons with a view of nothing besides someone's living room 40 feet away. The balconies are so shallow, they're worthless for anything besides smoking on.
Please...do you think all the Lawyers and bankers are going to continue living in Kendall and Aventura once there are options closer to their offices?

Sadly Miami has more suburban offices than many other large cities (I can't find the statistic, but I swear I remember someone backing up this claim on this forum). It seems the low vacancy rate for offices in Miami just results in ugly two story office buildings springing up in West Kendall. I figured Miami would gain at least one iconic office tower from this boom because of the low office vacancy rates. Maybe we'll see One Biscayne rising soon...

http://listings.miamiloftsandcondos.com/2-midtown-miami-condo.html

check this out lots of pictures in the individual listings..pls post

Sadly Miami has more suburban offices than many other large cities (I can't find the statistic, but I swear I remember someone backing up this claim on this forum). It seems the low vacancy rate for offices in Miami just results in ugly two story office buildings springing up in West Kendall. I figured Miami would gain at least one iconic office tower from this boom because of the low office vacancy rates. Maybe we'll see One Biscayne rising soon...

www.brookings.edu/es/urban/officesprawl/lang.pdf
% of office space in Primary Downtown (1999)
New York: 56.7
Chicago: 53.9
Boston: 37.4
Philadelphia: 34.2
San Francisco: 33.9
Denver: 30.4
Los Angeles: 29.8
Washington: 28.6
Atlanta: 23.6
Houston: 23.0
Detroit: 21.3
Miami: 13.1

It appears that they include Midtown & Downtown Manhattan as one primary downtown while not counting Brickell and the CBD as one downtown and that they must not be including the San Jose or Silicon Valley area in SF's metro. Another caveat is that no "major" city makes up less of its metro than Miami does (~400,000 people (in just 36 sqmiles) in a metro of 5.5 million).

The document below lists 2007 numbers with 11.7 million square feet in downtown and 45.6 million square feet overall or 25.9% of the office space (14.3% in the "CBD"). Of course thats just Miami-Dade. It would be a much lower % for the entire metro.
www.grubb-ellis.com/PDF/metro_off_mkttrnd/Miami.pdf

Please...do you think all the Lawyers and bankers are going to continue living in Kendall and Aventura once there are options closer to their offices?
One word answer? Yes. At least, once kids enter into the equation. Because that's exactly how it is in every other city in America, including New York. The 'Loft' towers are competing with 20,000 other condo units that DO have abundant parking, larger units, and won't be in permanent twilight once adjacent buildings are built. Right now, they're shiny and new. We'll see who's right 25 years from now when that's no longer the case.

In the long run, just about ANY condo not inhabited by incredibly wealthy residents inevitably goes in one direction: downhill. Why? As the building ages and looks dated, its value goes down relative to newer buildings. A few residents will press for renovations, get frustrated, and move -- to be replaced by new, poorer residents who are happy with the building exactly as it is (or couldn't afford higher fees because they're stretched to the breaking point to afford it now). A few more residents get frustrated about resistance to remodeling, and sell... to be replaced by more poorer residents. And the vicious cycle continues, until the majority of former residents who wanted to remodel the building and could afford it has left. It's also one of the major advantages of co-ops over condos as one's primary residence... co-ops are shitty non-liquid investments, so people tend to stay instead of sell... which increases pressure to improve the building. And a co-op can borrow money in its own name, so when the building's underlying mortgage gets paid off sometime between year 25 and 40, its directors can borrow another huge chunk of money to massively renovate it, and just keep the monthly fees what they've always been.

I have friends in Doral who've witnessed this already beginning to happen. They own a huge unit in Doral Isles that was built about 10 years ago. After Wilma, they and about a dozen others wanted to use it as an opportunity to do some improvements to the building's aesthetics. They were totally shot down by the other 85% of the residents, many of whom bought units there during the recent boom and, as they discovered, were financially stretched to the breaking point just to afford their unit there in the first place. Those same friends are now seriously thinking about selling and buying a house in Coral Gables, because they can see the long-term writing on the wall & they aren't happy about it.

Please...do you think all the Lawyers and bankers are going to continue living in Kendall and Aventura once there are options closer to their offices?

Do realize that not everyone wants to raise a family in downtown. This isn't Manhattan. Downtown is for that young, single, professional that has enough money to buy a condo.

Sadly Miami has more suburban offices than many other large cities (I can't find the statistic, but I swear I remember someone backing up this claim on this forum). It seems the low vacancy rate for offices in Miami just results in ugly two story office buildings springing up in West Kendall. I figured Miami would gain at least one iconic office tower from this boom because of the low office vacancy rates. Maybe we'll see One Biscayne rising soon...

We have 1450 Brickell, Met 2 and the Brickell Financial Centre.