I can't find a llink but there was something in the LA business monthly about a plan to build another layer on the 10 freeway for cars, and a monorail and pedentrain and bike way on the top level.

I totally agree the 10 needs to be a double decker. That would relieve the traffic on the 10, thank God. I don't like the idea of having a Monorail on the 10 especially if it's going to travel from Santa Monica and Downtown. Like they really need another train???????

I don't see the need for a monorail if the expo is parralel and so close.

^ And the Purple Line down Wilshile......

The purple line down wilshire? That's my hypothetical line fron union station, up sunset through hollywood, Weho, and terminating at the Beverly Centre.

i love the idea, but the monorail is a bad move. they should do some light rail to connect to the rest of the city rather then fliping technologies right in the middle of the buildup

How about the monorail going from dt LA to IE. Although it would probably take for ever.

[QUOTE=FROM LOS ANGELES]How about the monorail going from dt LA to IE.


^ Never going to happen!!!!

What do you think the Metrolink is for. Besides remember those "People" choose to live out there and work in the city. Let them deal with the heavy traffic on a daily basis......hahahahah!

Yeah i had a bad feeling about that question, as if i already knew the answer.

Yeah i had a bad feeling about that question, as if i already knew the answer.


^ Were you wondering since your from the Pico Riviera area and it's kinda out there as well????

Uh? Nope. Pico Rivera is like 10-15 mins from Downtown Los Angeles. (right?)

"Besides remember those 'People' choose to live out there and work in the city. Let them deal with the heavy traffic on a daily basis."

Had those 'People' decided not to live in IE, houses in LA would be in the millions of dollars by now. This would further aggravate the housing situation in LA. Rents and mortgages would be exorbitantly out of reach of the majority of the people. It is a quid pro quo.

"Besides remember those 'People' choose to live out there and work in the city. Let them deal with the heavy traffic on a daily basis."

Had those 'People' decided not to live in IE, houses in LA would be in the millions of dollars by now. This would further aggravate the housing situation in LA. Rents and mortgages would be exorbitantly out of reach of the majority of the people. It is a quid pro quo.


+1, if those people could affort to buy a house and to live in LA, they would !!

I don't see the need for a monorail if the expo is parralel and so close.
Stop thinking like a tard! We need lines overlapping one another, intersecting and bi-secting. Take a look at this! And don't give me this is not New York crap!
http://de.geocities.com/nyc_rail/nyc-map.htm

+1, if those people could affort to buy a house and to live in LA, they would !!


^ Stop making it like the poor left only. Some middle/upper class residents also got up and left, so I know more than 50% can afford to live in Los Angeles. So like I said let them deal with the traffic on a daily basis........ If only they will quit their jobs in our city so our residents who choose to stay can get those jobs! Life would be soooooo great.

Could some of the submerged freeways like the 101 between DTW and Hollywood, and parts of the 10 be covered by parks like they did in Boston?

hope theyll have killer ventilation in there

Could some of the submerged freeways like the 101 between DTW and Hollywood, and parts of the 10 be covered by parks like they did in Boston?


^ OK, now your just asking for too much. Let's take one step at a time!

Isn't interesting that the Red Line to SM will cost an estimated $5billion and serve so many, reduce gridlock and will inevitably result in increased density and many new projects along its path. It will also tie the city together more cohesively. Yet, the 710 tunnel underneath S. Pas will cost over $7billion and will end up inevitably in more gridlock. Think what could be done with $12 billion dollars all directed toward only subway building.
http://www.mta.net/board/Items/2006/05_May/20060503RBMItem45handout.pdf

Isn't interesting that the Red Line to SM will cost an estimated $5billion and serve so many, reduce gridlock and will inevitably result in increased density and many new projects along its path. It will also tie the city together more cohesively. Yet, the 710 tunnel underneath S. Pas will cost over $7billion and will end up inevitably in more gridlock. Think what could be done with $12 billion dollars all directed toward only subway building.
http://www.mta.net/board/Items/2006/05_May/20060503RBMItem45handout.pdf

yes but for right now. the 71o tunnel would alleviate much of the traffic on the i-5. and everyone can get to the freeway. not everyone everywere uses the wilshire subway.

Isn't interesting that the Red Line to SM will cost an estimated $5billion and serve so many, reduce gridlock and will inevitably result in increased density and many new projects along its path. It will also tie the city together more cohesively. Yet, the 710 tunnel underneath S. Pas will cost over $7billion and will end up inevitably in more gridlock. Think what could be done with $12 billion dollars all directed toward only subway building.
http://www.mta.net/board/Items/2006/05_May/20060503RBMItem45handout.pdf


exactly what i was thinking. no sweat to spend billions on a tunnel for cars, but for Public transport that will change the way the city is and alter traffic in almost every street in central LA, naw.

yes but for right now. the 71o tunnel would alleviate much of the traffic on the i-5. and everyone can get to the freeway. not everyone everywere uses the wilshire subway.

You'd get MUCH MUCH more than just a Red Line down Wilshire. You'd be well on the road to London/NYC/Paris/Tokyo type system. But NO!! Spend $7billion dollars building a multibillion dollar tunnel that is only 6 miles long because the county punked out and did not declare eminant domain and force the SoPas folks to fucking move........Funny, they've done that to sooooo many other folks in less affluent areas. Now where is the fucking BRU!!!

Red Line twice the mileage almost half the cost.

Where is the Daily News now!?!?!? Fuckheads!!

not everyone everywere uses the wilshire subway.

Yeah and I don't use the friggin' 710!!! In fact, none of my friends around where I live use the fucking 710!! But I bet the people who do use the 710 one day could use the Red Line to the beach to avoid traffic.......If I don't drive how can I use the 710?? But even if you do drive you can still use my Red Line and probably will!!! This isn't fair!!!

You'd get MUCH MUCH more than just a Red Line down Wilshire. You'd be well on the road to London/NYC/Paris/Tokyo type system. But NO!! Spend $7billion dollars building a multibillion dollar tunnel that is only 6 miles long because the county punked out and did not declare eminant domain and force the SoPas folks to fucking move........Funny, they've done that to sooooo many other folks in less affluent areas. Now where is the fucking BRU!!!

Red Line twice the mileage almost half the cost.

Where is the Daily News now!?!?!? Fuckheads!!

not everyone everywere uses the wilshire subway.

Yeah and I don't use the friggin' 710!!! In fact, none of my friends around where I live use the fucking 710!! But I bet the people who do use the 710 one day could use the Red Line to the beach to avoid traffic.......If I don't drive how can I use the 710?? But even if you do drive you can still use my Red Line and probably will!!! This isn't fair!!!

calm down...

freeways are like rivers... plug one spot and the hole system changes, on the other end, make a new connection and it changes again. im glad to see there building many many miles of trains and what not but they cant just stop building freeways. need not repeate history again by looking only at one system for the saving grace of the city

Relax, I didn't know Virgin Mary is capable of trash talking.

Relax, I didn't know Virgin Mary is capable of trash talking.:laugh:

need not repeate history again by looking only at one system for the saving grace of the city
True.

Ok, I'm back on track.......So why is it that we as taxpayers are going to pay twice as much as it would cost to just bulldoze the neighborhood when other hoods have been bulldozed in the past? Why are we accomodating these people? The very fact that we have many LRT lines instead of HRT lines that are grade seperate is because of cost, right? Subways are more expensive to build than light rail trains, right? Hasn't that been the argument since day one?? "It's just too expensive to build". This is a waste of my money and I'm opposed to it. And I'm not asking for the county to rip up freeways to only build subways(everyone knows what happened in the past), I'm asking for a moratorium on freeway building(not repair) as is clearly what this is, building an extension of a freeway. I might even be prone to agree with the project if it were a surface road, but a multi billion dollar high tech underground tunnel because the residents have been kicking up dust for decades? Fuck 'em den! Let them choke on their car exhaust and traffic!

true, having a tunnel would not be my first choice. but this is pasadena we are talking about, not compton. wo cares if they want to build a freeway there. people with the money are the only ones we need to listen to....

some times i wish there were more disasters in this city to free up some land that the city can quickly use to make life better for us all seeing how nothing will get done as long as someone wants to be re-elected

At the rate the South Pasadena people yell and scream, it would probably be cheaper to spend $7 billion on a tunnel than to pay all the legal fees from lawsuits that would result from a surface freeway. :bash:

I'm definitely up for putting this money toward the subway, but I don't think it's that simple. What I mean is, that the money for highways doesn't come from the same place the money for the subways comes from. And this is a highway, even if it is underground.

And supposedly, this is the last link in the L.A. freeway system that wasn't built. (There were a ton of other freeways propsed like the Beverly Hills Freeway, the Reseda Freeway, but those were all cancelled.)

Plus, I think the 710 tunnel could be a little shorter than six miles. You could probably cut off a mile or so on both ends. :wave:

Bottom line, if it was a choice between building this 710 tunnel and building the "Subway to the Sea", the subway is a much better bargain. I would recommend it. But I don't think the money can be moved around like that.

If you don't believe me about the Reseda Freeway, here's a map from way back in the day. Even back before I was born.

http://www.cahighways.org/maps/iop-masterplan.jpg

:)

Gotta say that this is one thing that LA did get right, to not complete that enormous freeway system. Let's hear it for the NIMBY's on this one! The good thing about all of this is that mass transit WILL eventually happen, what with an 18% gain from just last year. So, the rail system will only complement the freeway system thus giving LA one of the best transport systems in the world.

even as someone who loves the freeways in the greater los angeles area, im actually happy this plan never happened. at least with the system we have now, once you get a mile away from an interchange traffic usually moves at a good rate. imagine if this was the case:
http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a22/godblessbotox/1956-la-mteb3.jpg


another good map, pdf format
http://www.cahighways.org/maps/2003scstatus.pdf

Taken from the LA Times commentary section. Couldn't have said it better myself.

We all agree that a very expensive tunnel in South Pasadena needs to be built to accommodate one community that has abused the legal system to subvert the greater transportation needs of California.

Yet those advocating for another expensive tunnel, the Wilshire Boulevard subway, have to beg and claw its way into existence even though it would serve as many if not more commuters than the South Pasadena tunnel.

Like it or not, the cheaper option for the extension of the 710 has always been on the surface (like every other freeway), and those living in South Pasadena have imposed a double standard that we now have to pay for.

Perhaps one innovative funding mechanism would be to install toll booths at every road used by South Pasadenans to access our freeway system … say, $10 a pop until we get those extra billions?

Meanwhile, I hope our Wilshire Boulevard and downtown connector subways (which have no viable surface alternative) are prioritized before this boondoggle; those are long-overdue tunnels that really would benefit the entire region.

KENNETH S. ALPERN

interesting stuff...
http://www.outtacontext.com/iop/photos.html

not sure what to think of this guy... also k i think this guy is your nemisis
http://republican.sen.ca.gov/web/mcclintock/article_print.asp?PID=211

Thank God the MTA had an 18% increase on bus and rail since this time last year. That is super duper significant. If car sales were up 18% I might be behind building more freeways(maybe not). But McClintock brings up some decent points. Freeways should be maintained just not anymore built.

So when do we start digging the tunnel...... Hooray 4 da 710!!!!!!

Probably'll never happen really.

Build it. Toll it. And use the soil to cover up and reconnect several of the communities wrecked by the freeway expansion of the 50s, beginning with South LA and East LA.

oh yah look at all the delapidated communites that have fallen to horrible conditions because a freeway was built in there local...

I've been thinking and I'm against this tunnel thing more and more. They simply cannot have a tunnel while everyone else gets relocation papers. This cannot happen!

agreed

how do past errors justify making the same mistake again?

^ My thoughts exactly.

Let this be a model for all freeway expansion opponents that will hopefully put an end to freeway extensions in Los Angeles as we know it: put it underground or don't build it at all.

I'm not mad at South Pasadena and Norwalk for fighting to preserve their communities. I'm mad at the bastards at CalTrans and our politicians for wrecking countless communities and failing to propose adequate solutions to our traffic nightmare. Grade-seperated light and heavy rail are the only way - the only possible way we can move all of LA. Adding a couple of freeway lanes MIGHT offer temporary relief. But a 6-car subway/elevated trains coming every 2-3 minutes can move 100K+ people an hour!

but until the entire city is covered with light rail and subway people will still use the highway, thus we cannot abandon it and say oh dont build it at all...

there is a reason that eminent domain is out there, it is for the benefit of everyone whom lives in the city. not the wants and wishes of one community. if they only think of them selves the should move out to butt-fuck lancaster and setup shop there. cities are a collection of people coming together to better each other lives and working of of each other strong points.

...or just using the other guy to benifit yourself