Lansdowne Road is being redoveloped next year so the GAA have allowed Croke Park to be used for the Irish soccer and rugby team. The first match will be against France in rugby in February next year. It has a capacity of 82,000 but 12,000 of it is terraces so it will only be 70,000 for football. Anyway, here it is:

http://content.answers.com/main/content/wp/en/thumb/3/3a/500px-From_the_hill.jpg
http://www.stadionwelt.de/stadionwelt_stadien/templates/stadionlisten/irland/croke_park/100.jpg
http://www.carolinelittle.com/images/dublin_032.JPG
http://p.vtourist.com/1657477-Travel_Picture-Croke_Park_Dublin_August_th.jpg
http://kilkenny.gaa.ie/all8.jpg
http://www.stadionwelt.de/stadionwelt_stadien/templates/stadionlisten/irland/croke_park/160.jpg
http://www.irish-architecture.com/buildings_ireland/dublin/drumcondra/jones_road/croke_park/cusack_section_lge.html
http://www.irish-architecture.com/buildings_ireland/dublin/drumcondra/jones_road/croke_park/images/interior_lge.jpg

I like Croke Park. Any word on whether the open end is to be enclosed?

its not a soccer stadium so it does not have to comply with all seater regulations. the open end [hill 16] is famous throughout ireland so it is unlikely it will ever be enclosed like the other 3 ends ie the cusack stand , the hogan stand and the canal end. its a bit of a shame but its still a great stadium and because of the hill alot of sunshine can enter the stadium freely without casting huge shadows over the pitch as seen in fully enclosed stadia.

I like Croke Park. Any word on whether the open end is to be enclosed?
The terraces on Hill 16 will always be there. :)

It has been confirmed that Croke Park - the third biggest stadium in Europe with a capacity of 82,500 - will host football matches for the first time. Republic of Ireland's first game at Croke Park will be against Wales on March 24th 2007. The Czech Republic and Germany will follow in Autumn 2007.

This is significant as the Gaelic Athletic Association have traditionally banned "soccer" matches from being played there as it is the home of Ireland's Gaelic Football.

Rugby matches will also occur there in 2007, with Ireland's home Six Nations matches being played there.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/0/09/Croke_park.jpg/800px-Croke_park.jpg

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/8/81/From_the_hill.jpg

Rather than redevelop Lansdown Rd. Why don't they simply spend the money on making Croke Park fully enclosed, and the new National Stadium?

I know there are probably many different issues which would need addressing, but look at the propects here. A multi purpose Stadium of probably close to 100,000 spectators, suitable for Gaelic Football, Rugby and Association Football. The Irish FA could then stage European Cup Finals (an Irish first), plus various 'spin offs' like music concerts etc.

The costs of the development would surely be much cheaper then a 'new' Lansdown Rd. and the revenue generated from the different codes would be significant.

Croke Park already looks a magnificent venue. With the additional work done, one the World would look at with envy IMO.

Rather than redevelop Lansdown Rd. Why don't they simply spend the money on making Croke Park fully enclosed, and the new National Stadium?

I know there are probably many different issues which would need addressing, but look at the propects here. A multi purpose Stadium of probably close to 100,000 spectators, suitable for Gaelic Football, Rugby and Association Football. The Irish FA could then stage European Cup Finals (an Irish first), plus various 'spin offs' like music concerts etc.

The costs of the development would surely be much cheaper then a 'new' Lansdown Rd. and the revenue generated from the different codes would be significant.

Croke Park already looks a magnificent venue. With the additional work done, one the World would look at with envy IMO.

Because the GAA own Croke Park and only want it to be used for Irish sports. They are charging the Irish FA a fortune to use it for these international matches.

Expansion is also restricted by the fact that there is a railway line right next to the Hill end, and GAA don't own that land anyway.

Croke Park already hosts large concerts so that wouldn't be anything new.

Because the GAA own Croke Park and only want it to be used for Irish sports. They are charging the Irish FA a fortune to use it for these international matches.

I think just by the fact they are allowing the Irish FA to use the ground is a positive step.

What is the purpose in a city the size of Dublin needing two top quality stadiums anyway?

It has been confirmed that Croke Park - the third biggest stadium in Europe with a capacity of 82,500

Croke Park is a great stadium but I don't think it is Europe's third biggest stadium.

I can think of four stadiums that have capacities of over 83,000:

Nou Camp
San Siro
Olympic stadium, Kiev
Lushniki stadium, Moscow

In addition, the Olympic stadium, Rome is also 82,500.

Of course, Wembley will also surpass Croke Park when (should that be if?!) finally completed.

Nevertheless, Croke Park is a very impressive stadium. Can you tell me:

1. How on earth did the GAA afford to build it? Where did they get their money from?

2. How often is it used for sporting events and how often for concerts etc?

What exactly is "Gaelic football"?

From Wikipedia
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gaelic_football

At first glance Gaelic Football resembles a combination of soccer and rugby and/or Australian rules football. Players advance the ball up the field with a combination of carrying, kicking, and hand-passing to their team-mates. Some plays include a ducking and weaving movement where the player in possession will run toward an opponent and, at the last minute, change direction after wrong-footing the defender. Passing takes place to players on the run, so rather than passing directly to a team-mate, players will pass the ball into mid-air just ahead of the receiving player so that he can run into it. The scoring system adds another dimension to the game. If a team has a two-point deficit in the dying minutes of a match, they will start to try to get in closer to the goal and create a goal-scoring opportunity. Fans enjoy the high speed and frequent scoring, the many different ways to deliver the ball, and the unpredictable nature of the game.

Every year Australia and Ireland play a hybrid game of Australian Rules and Gaelic Football called International Rules Football.

does this place already hold 82 500? or are they going to expand it to hold 82,500? Im lazy to read :D

It already holds 82500.

farrk that huge then!

Croke Park is a great stadium but I don't think it is Europe's third biggest stadium.

I can think of four stadiums that have capacities of over 83,000:

Nou Camp
San Siro
Olympic stadium, Kiev
Lushniki stadium, Moscow

In addition, the Olympic stadium, Rome is also 82,500.
Apart from the Nou Camp, all of these stadiums are similar in capacity to Croke Park, and much less modern.

Of course, Wembley will also surpass Croke Park when (should that be if?!) finally completed.

Nevertheless, Croke Park is a very impressive stadium. Can you tell me:

1. How on earth did the GAA afford to build it? Where did they get their money from?
Loans obviously, secured on the selling tickets for the very popular GAA sports (particularly executive suites, long-term tickets etc.). It was also partly funded through governments grants.

2. How often is it used for sporting events and how often for concerts etc?
Fairly regularly for sporting events as it is the home of all of GAA's Irish sports. Some also feel it is used too much for concerts (U2 in concert below).

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/6/6b/U2-Croke_Park.jpg

Sports seating plan:

http://crokestadium.sitesuite.ws/images/croke_park_match.gif

Concert seating plan:

http://www.crokepark.ie/images/croke_park_map_concert.jpg

http://www.castlecaulfield.net/apb/DSCF0137.JPG

http://www.groganengineering.ie/images/croke10.jpg

This place "could" be the highest capacity stadium in the world, if they complete the bowls

Loans obviously, secured on the selling tickets for the very popular GAA sports (particularly executive suites, long-term tickets etc.). It was also partly funded through governments grants.

That's not what I heard - I read that the GAA was so flush that it was able to pay for all the redevelopment with cash, and didn't need any loans or government assistance.

Remember that all the GAA's sports are amateur, so it has plenty of money from ticket sales and TV rights to spend on development.

I think just by the fact they are allowing the Irish FA to use the ground is a positive step.

What is the purpose in a city the size of Dublin needing two top quality stadiums anyway?

You're looking at things backwards - Dublin will have two top quality stadia by circumstance not by design. As asdfg has alluded to, Croke Park is owned by the GAA and Lansdowne Road is (was?) owned by the IRFU. For years the GAA had a rule in its constitution banning the playing of "garrison" (i.e. British) sports on its grounds, though the IRFU were a bit more open-hearted, and let the FAI stage internationals at Lansdowne Road as the popularity of the national soccer team grew from the 1990s. However, while Croke Park was extended and improved over the years, Lansdowne Road remained pretty ramshackle, and isn't a very appropriate venue for international rugby and soccer. Some people have asked the straightforward question - "why can't they just play rugby and soccer at Croker?" - but you have to bear in mind that Croke Park is the property of the GAA and is theirs to do with with as they please, and if they don't want to share with two other sporting associations they don't have to (and I doubt the IRFU would want to give up having their own venue either).

You might as well ask the same question about London - squillions is being spent on Wembley while the RFU have thrown quite a few quid into redeveloping Twickenham. In some people's eyes it might be preferable to just have one national stadium for both rugby and soccer, but owning their own ground gives the RFU the ability to stage the matches it wants whenever it wants to - at the end of the season there are a number of big events (e.g. Premiership Final, London Sevens, England v Barbarians, Army v Navy) that usually clash with the Football League playoffs...

does anybody know the pitch dimensions at Croke Park,as the playing area looks huge.

lets not forget Twickenham will also surpass croke park

Nobody's mentioned that Ireland will be playing England in the Six Nations on 24 February - hearing "God Save The Queen" at one of the bastions of Irish nationalism will be a bit "weird" to say the least...

btw does the 82,500 capacity include the standing areas

dimensions 144.5 m x 88 m

dimensions 144.5 m x 88 m

blimey,thats big.a football pitch would be swallowed up by that.Quite a distance between pitch and stands.This might be another reason why football and rugby isn't pleyed here

does anybody know the pitch dimensions at Croke Park,as the playing area looks huge.

It is a huge pitch, because Gaelic Football pitches are generally huge to begin with. It is, apparently, one of the reasons why the IRFU and FAI wanted to redevelop Landsdowne Road back in the day. As far as I am aware, although don't quote me on this, there were three general proposals - (1) Redevelop Lansdowne, (2) Build an entirely new stadium somewhere out in the old Dublin docks and (3) For the government to purchase Croker, complete the stadium and modernise it (floodlights, etc.). The latter proved unpopular because of many, many things, one of which is the pitch size and, incidently, is one of the main sticking points of the proposed Maze Stadium in Northern Ireland as well.

The pitch at Croker is 144.5 m x 88m.

Also, what people don't seem to realise is that the terrace at the Hill End of Croke Park holds 13,500 and the seating itself only 69,000. Assuming that all three sides are exactly the same length, completing the bowl would only take the capacity up to about 93,000, because of the size of the terrace. It's a huge undertaking - purchasing land, building over a railway line etc. etc. to add what is a comparatively small number of seats, especially since demand may be uncertain.

In terms of money, it must be said that most people here, firstly, don't seem to know just how popular GAA sports are all throughout Ireland (in Northern Ireland, the main GAA stadium (Casement Park) holds 36,000 people. In Monaghan, Clones (St. Tiernach's Park) holds 36,000 people. Croke Park used to hold nearly 100,000. Given the population of Ireland, that's a huge level of popularity for the sport. While there were loans based on 10 year premium seating plans and some government support in the redevelopment, given GAA popularity, it wasn't that difficult to fund the whole thing.

It's a nice stadium and, in some ways, I hope that when it's full for the Ireland rugby internationals, the IRFU, FAI and the Irish Government will realise what a giant waste of time spending 300+ million Euro on a 55,000 capacity Lansdowne Road is. Any new stadium for rugby in Ireland should be looking to hold at least 65,000. Minimum.

lets not forget Twickenham will also surpass croke park

No, it won't.

Twickenham will have a capacity of 82,000 when completed - about the same as Croke Park, or very slightly less.

No, it won't.

Twickenham will have a capacity of 82,000 when completed - about the same as Croke Park, or very slightly less.

yeah but its all to be clear to me now, the seating stands at Croke park only hold 69,000. the figure of 82,500 has been very misleading, i just knew those stands couldnt fit that many.

yeah but its all to be clear to me now, the seating stands at Croke park only hold 69,000. the figure of 82,500 has been very misleading, i just knew those stands couldnt fit that many.


if the stands were to be continued all the way around,i'd guess the final capacity would be nearer 90k
.

yeah but its all to be clear to me now, the seating stands at Croke park only hold 69,000. the figure of 82,500 has been very misleading, i just knew those stands couldnt fit that many.

The discussion was about the overall capacity of Croke Park, not the seated capacity.

if the stands were to be continued all the way around,i'd guess the final capacity would be nearer 90k
.

Roughly 93,000. There isn't really any significant difference between the sides and goal line sides of Croker and it's gonna get the two new corners as well, should the seating be taken all the way around, easily making up for the loss in length vs. width.

From Wikipedia
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gaelic_football

At first glance Gaelic Football resembles a combination of soccer and rugby and/or Australian rules football. Players advance the ball up the field with a combination of carrying, kicking, and hand-passing to their team-mates. Some plays include a ducking and weaving movement where the player in possession will run toward an opponent and, at the last minute, change direction after wrong-footing the defender. Passing takes place to players on the run, so rather than passing directly to a team-mate, players will pass the ball into mid-air just ahead of the receiving player so that he can run into it. The scoring system adds another dimension to the game. If a team has a two-point deficit in the dying minutes of a match, they will start to try to get in closer to the goal and create a goal-scoring opportunity. Fans enjoy the high speed and frequent scoring, the many different ways to deliver the ball, and the unpredictable nature of the game.

Every year Australia and Ireland play a hybrid game of Australian Rules and Gaelic Football called International Rules Football.
Thank you :)

Sounds like a fun sport.

Thank you :)

Sounds like a fun sport.

As an Irishman, I can, sadly, tell you that the sport is hideously boring. Kinda like American sports really.

As an Irishman, I can, sadly, tell you that the sport is hideously boring. Kinda like American sports really.
Well, the article made it seem exciting and fast paced. I suppose its a matter of opinion really.

I haven't ever seen the sport played, so I don't have a real opinion on it yet. :)

Well, the article made it seem exciting and fast paced. I suppose its a matter of opinion really.

I haven't ever seen the sport played, so I don't have a real opinion on it yet. :)

I suppose that it's entertaining in the way that basketball is a more exciting version of netball, ice hockey a more exciting version of hockey and so on... Just that I much prefer rugby and football to GAA, so it doesn't excite me a lot. As far as I'm concerned, Gaelic football mixes the bad parts of rugby being a very structured game with football lacking structure at all.

Hurling on the otherhand is fantastic. It's like they've taken golf and turned it into a contact sport.

Now, back to topic!

That's not what I heard - I read that the GAA was so flush that it was able to pay for all the redevelopment with cash, and didn't need any loans or government assistance.

Remember that all the GAA's sports are amateur, so it has plenty of money from ticket sales and TV rights to spend on development.

At risk of sounding like a conspiracy theorist, I heard that Croke Park was heavily funded by the Catholic church in Ireland as a means of protecting and maintaining the Gaelic culture in the face of non-Irish sports encroaching into Ireland. This not only explains why the GAA have always been so staunch in their resolve to repel football and rugby, but it also follows that only a huge amount of money from the other direction would change their stance, which seems to be exactly what has happened. Did you know the ground is named after Archbishop Croke? I can only presume he was not C of E....

It's a good point that Gaelic football (and let's not forget hurling - a kind of hockey for psychopaths) are (supposedly) amateur sports and therefore handsomely fund the governing bodies, but I'm not sure there is that much money washing through the GAA to fund something like Croke Park. Also, it's not just big but also rather extravagantly appointed. It won't have come cheap.

The story could be nothing more that a good yarn but I happen to think there's quite a good chance that there's something in it.

In every way, it seems that Lansdowne and Croke are opposites. Lansdowne is old, in decline yet situated in the leafy southern suburbs of Dublin, surrounded by a neighbourhood of foreign embassies. Croke is in a pretty tough northern district of Dublin, crammed in between rows of housing with hardly any parking amenity or redeeming features that planners here would insist on. I'm sure it's quite a historc site but I can't help wondering if such a magnificent development in such a challenging location was 'helped along' in any way by powerful friends...?

Your views are the ones that anyone that has never been to Dublin would spout. I challenge you to find a decent parking space near Lansdowne Road on a match day. You won't, because unless you know someone near there, there's no fucking chance. The only redeeming feature of the current Lansdowne Road is that the DART runs under the old main stand. There are even fewer redeeming features of the new one. None of which include any of your conspiracy theories.

I'd also suggest that you look at the surrounding geography of Croker and Lansdowne before you make any more sweeping judgements. I guarentee you that there is more space around Croker than Lansdowne. Ger information from something that isn't the IFA message board.

I really like the design. It allows for large charity concerts and the like. Although, acoustics are pretty crap in stadiums for concerts. Still I like it.

It's a real shame about the terraced end. Now that Ireland is so rich the government could stump up the cash to put the railway in a tunnel.

It's a real shame about the terraced end. Now that Ireland is so rich the government could stump up the cash to put the railway in a tunnel.

It's unlikely that the government would do that for a stadium that it has been made clear, more than once, will not be used as a national stadium more more than a few years. More importantly, it's not even likely, given all the history surrounding the Hill 16 end that the GAA and many of its supporters would want that. It's also not just the railway line, it's the surrounding ground, the changes in access and so forth. It'd be a huge undertaking to add about 10,000 seats, given uncertain demand.

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3004/2355901788_6032b0c8f0_b.jpg
bigger one
http://www.flickr.com/photos/9480715@N06/2355901788/sizes/o/

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3026/2324007892_60ca75e9c9_b.jpg

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3060/2324000830_7a6ce41395_b.jpg

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2379/2244605392_fd4b842298_b.jpg

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1158/1325075794_74bd9f5a48_o.jpg

The GAA have recently given permission for Croke Park to be used for a Heineken Cup semi-final if Munster beat Ospreys in the quarter-final. If Leinster also beat Harlequins, it'll be an all-Irish semi-final and a guaranteed sell-out. What an atmosphere that would be...

^^
although i agree and i probably speak for everyone when i say we all dreamed about this one day, i think munster are looking to play in the gaelic grounds..minutes from thomond park whic in my openion would be class!

http://www.archiseek.com/content/attachment.php?attachmentid=7605&stc=1&d=1213650729


and as far as croke park is concerned, they put seats into the hill so seated capacity is around 76 or 77,000

^^
although i agree and i probably speak for everyone when i say we all dreamed about this one day, i think munster are looking to play in the gaelic grounds..minutes from thomond park whic in my openion would be class!

I thought that wasn't an option:

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/sport/2009/0129/1232923372253.html

"There is no possibility of any other GAA ground being used for the match. The 50,000 capacity Gaelic Grounds in Limerick was mooted as a possible alternative venue but the motion passed in 2005 at GAA’s annual Congress, which allowed soccer and rugby into Croke Park, specifically stated that GAA headquarters was the only ground to which the motion applied."

^^

dont quote me on this now but i read a few weeks ago in a limerick newspaper that the gaa or whoever owned the gaelic grounds are in serious talks with someone over the match as they now see it as a very wise boost to the economy in the region should it be played there..not sure on the details tho

Well, it's confirmed now - Munster v Leinster at Croker, 2 May at 17:30. Should be absolutely epic.

^^

cant wait for it..if only it was played at night, you couldn't get any better!

Found this pre-redevelopment picture this afternoon:

http://gallery.retrogaa.com/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=151&g2_serialNumber=2

Hell of a change, really. I also found this one; note that the Hill 16 End has been changed since then.

http://www.irishconcrete.ie/uploadedImages/Photo_Library/Precast_Concrete/croke%20park.JPG

Now:

http://3547.voxcdn.com/photos/5/95/151647_l.jpg

If Croke Park were able to be fully developed all the way around, how would it compare to a typical NFL stadium ??

If Croke Park were able to be fully developed all the way around, how would it compare to a typical NFL stadium ??

Not good i dont think. It would certainly be able to host it, but it doesnt seem to have enough suites and the design would be a little mid 90's. The upper deck seems a bit square, I dont think its rounded off enough. Its too wide I think and the sideline seats arent raised enough off the ground. As it is, this place looks like an unfinished Edward Jones Dome without the dome and without the scoreboard in the middle of the second deck.
http://football.ballparks.com/NFL/St.LouisRams/interior.jpg

Could it host the NFL? Of course. But it wouldnt be my first choice

For what it serves, this stadium is great, one of my favorites.

Its too wide I think

You can say that again. Two full-sized NFL pitches would fit on the surface at Croke Park.

In every way, it seems that Lansdowne and Croke are opposites. Lansdowne is old, in decline yet situated in the leafy southern suburbs of Dublin, surrounded by a neighbourhood of foreign embassies. Croke is in a pretty tough northern district of Dublin, crammed in between rows of housing with hardly any parking amenity or redeeming features that planners here would insist on. I'm sure it's quite a historc site but I can't help wondering if such a magnificent development in such a challenging location was 'helped along' in any way by powerful friends...?

What nonsense people sometimes post on forums!
Croke Pk and Lansdowne Road are actually quite similar in many ways. Both have been there for 100 years or more and are on restricted sites about the same distance from the City Centre. OK one is in a the posher end of town and one in the less prosperous side, but that reflects the support base for the sports played in each. Both are the HQ of associations that have largely used them for representative teams with infrequent fixtures, as distinct from the weekly soccer games found in many large European stadia. Both were sustained with these fixtures as the games were amateur. Both have been rebuilt in a way that squeezes them on their historic sites and neither have giant car parks or every will have. Croke Pk was redeveloped when money was relatively plentiful in Ireland, Lansdowne Road was lucky to get its work underway before the current recession.

Nice stadium!

see the stadium being used for the purpose for which it was designed
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gxmFaThMj8g

then one hour later
http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/images/2009/0714/1224250639550_1.jpg

this is to get ready for a U2 concert next weekend, with a 11 storey, 550 tonne stage that will take up 40 per cent of the pitch surface. There will then be 3 days to lay a new pitch before the next game.

The cost of this process is €1.2 million with U2 contributing approximately 40 percent of this.
The motivation to achieve such an “enormous” task comes from the €2.75 million profit Croke Park will earn from the three gigs.

The stadium then looked like this
http://www.ireland.com/media/images/gallery/2009-07/520x390/970397ed-d6c3-4f04-a5e0-f6020981bafa.jpg

http://www.ireland.com/goingout/artstheatre/stylegalleries/gallery/u2-lift-off-in-dublin/

If Croke Park Stadium had a buildout its capacity would be in the 90,000s range. But any buildout is unlikely seeing that if the Hill 16 end were expanded, Croke Park would be the only stadium in the world to have a railway run directly through it and the GAA would have to buy a street of houses to expand that end. Also we would have to realign that railway somehow (and tear down some houses in the process) to make room for the new stand). Why couldn't Dublin have built a new stadium with the same capacity as Croke Park instead of doing major expansion of a really small ground which sits in the middle of a residential neighbourhood?

I believe that if they wanted to close in that last end it would look completely different form the rest of that stadium and would be a cantilevering piece of work master piece.

Why couldn't Dublin have built a new stadium with the same capacity as Croke Park instead of doing major expansion of a really small ground which sits in the middle of a residential neighbourhood?


Croke Park had crowds of 80,000 over the years, so was never a "really small ground". The redevelopment provided a higher standard of accommodation. A new stadium in some remote location would be completely lacking in atmosphere.

Is the reeal reason why the end terrace at croke park remaining undeveloped due to the massacre which happened when British troops fired upon the spectators in the early part of last century?

Is the reeal reason why the end terrace at croke park remaining undeveloped due to the massacre which happened when British troops fired upon the spectators in the early part of last century?

The terrace was redeveloped in 2003, as a better terrace. The reason why it remained a terrace has partly to do with the demand for cheaper tickets, mostly to do with the engineering difficulties of extending the seating configuration because of the railway behind. It has nothing to do with who those murdered in the stadium by the British in 1920.

nice re-development, how much money did they spend?

nice re-development, how much money did they spend?

about 250 million, not bad for the size of the place and location.
its said to be one of the largest buildings in ireland, its 180 metres long and the same height as a 13 story tower.

as stated above its not an increase in capacity only a meere upgrade in comfort. back through the 50s up to the 80s it had attendances in the mid 80,000s highest attendance being 90,556 people

its all ireland hurling final today, so i thought id post you pics of some previous finals, renouned for its colour!

http://bp2.blogger.com/_glOI4zgolD0/RvEmz1K8dMI/AAAAAAAAAEk/T6Yjk-YL0D4/s320/hill+16+flags+&+flare.jpg
http://farm1.static.flickr.com/147/381926797_f516b19ab5.jpg
http://farm1.static.flickr.com/96/234303210_2197a504ab_m.jpg
http://farm1.static.flickr.com/24/47081222_7f6c576d21_m.jpg
http://farm1.static.flickr.com/96/235943904_e95470abaf_m.jpg
http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1082/1310800001_fadc9cb9b3_m.jpg
http://dynimg.rte.ie/000104a315e.jpg
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2602/3884759310_56c04bb328.jpg
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2524/3883521097_79fa0ac00a.jpg
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3087/2820427991_2ff818c5be_m.jpg
http://dynimg.rte.ie/0001049f15e.jpg
http://dynimg.rte.ie/0001049915e.jpg
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http://dynimg.rte.ie/0001beb415e.jpg
http://dynimg.rte.ie/0001be3a15e.jpg
http://dynimg.rte.ie/0001beb615e.jpg
http://dynimg.rte.ie/0001be3215e.jpg

all ireland final colours!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M_1MOTT6nYU&NR=1

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2geZO0EZns8

^^ Gaelic games look like a lot of fun!

Video of pitch reconstruction after U2 concert.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=enJ33yfZ8ew

Are there any plans about building the north stand to close the stadium?

They can't do it.

Are there any plans about building the north stand to close the stadium?

It's pretty big as it is tbh!

I know,but it would be excellent if it was symetrical to south stand.
Anyway,great stadium. :okay:

holds 94,000 in concert using the pitch, this is the famous 'croke park roar'
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YyALfQxlaWM


this is when ireland come out on pitch, the ireland chant is unreal, this is from bbc footage,i cant help getting goosebumps to this!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2dHSNueuYN4


exact same time except from a fans point of view
from 22 secs onwards
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0DzJXBE1Aow

This is a brilliant video:

CQ6-bYixpYE

This is a brilliant video:

CQ6-bYixpYE

^^
goosebumps goosebumps goosebumps!

this has to be up there with one of the greatest responses to a national anthem!

you can even hear the anticipation in the crowd as they scream before the first irish anthem..brilliant!

The thing that makes it so great is that the few thousand England fans that travelled could still be heard so they must have been blasting it out, then Ireland's response was special alright!

the same height as a 13 story tower
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3004/2355901788_6032b0c8f0.jpg

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2215/1606061128_e50de4d8e0.jpg

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2248/1606082420_f8cf2bf5a6.jpg

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3418/3392601386_60bb5a4bba.jpg

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3192/3668605965_7e190ee3aa.jpg
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_CIecIPRS6jc/Ro1blT9gP2I/AAAAAAAAAF0/iTeaRL01rdw/s400/croke+park.jpg


concerts can hold up to 94,000

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3136/2550154326_6b72782ac5.jpg
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2643/3778970354_e802571fbc.jpg

pictures from the all ireland football final last sunday, attendance was 82,286
kerry played cork and won, scoreline was kerry 0-16 to cork 1-09
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2428/3941659747_1e47802a7c.jpg
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2661/3950527137_f4a9cd4fc1.jpg
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2574/3947286063_75a43c97d2.jpg
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3590/3942440478_c3be0b41dc.jpg
http://dynimg.rte.ie/00029bce-674.jpg
http://dynimg.rte.ie/00029bd0-674.jpg
http://dynimg.rte.ie/00029bd4-674.jpg
http://dynimg.rte.ie/00029be8-674.jpg

The thing I like about Gaelic is that the players are all amateurs...they're all playing for the love of the game.

The thing I like about Gaelic is that the players are all amateurs...they're all playing for the love of the game.

and the love of their county

The thing I like about Gaelic is that the players are all amateurs...they're all playing for the love of the game.

Didn't know that. That's indeed pretty cool, playing in front of 80'000 people as an amateur.

Didn't know that. That's indeed pretty cool, playing in front of 80'000 people as an amateur.
:yes:

just like college football here in the states

What a match yesterday in Croke Park
R. of Ireland 2 x 2 Italy!

world record as the highest club rugby attendance ever at 82,209

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3644/3502583894_b6b6997de7.jpg


http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3569/3496305471_42a1de8df5.jpg

the crowd pouring out!
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3653/3497433632_8cdf28dea4.jpg


seating plan
http://www.crokepark.ie/images/crokepark_match_art_low_res.jpg

http://www.panoramio.com/photos/original/3410762.jpg

the two side stands (cusack and hogan stands) holds 25,000 each, the stand behind the goal (canal end) holds 20,000 and hill 16 holds between 12,500-14,000

hill 16

http://www.freewebs.com/tims92/Croke%20Park/Croke%20Park%207.JPG

http://www.freewebs.com/tims92/Croke%20Park/Croke%20Park%208.JPG

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3339/3222701149_b19e97c596.jpg

see Croke Park almost 50 years ago, All Ireland final 1960 (not 1961)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZHPviQiwhY0

If Croke Park Stadium had a buildout its capacity would be in the 90,000s range. But any buildout is unlikely seeing that if the Hill 16 end were expanded, Croke Park would be the only stadium in the world to have a railway run directly through it and the GAA would have to buy a street of houses to expand that end. Also we would have to realign that railway somehow (and tear down some houses in the process) to make room for the new stand). Why couldn't Dublin have built a new stadium with the same capacity as Croke Park instead of doing major expansion of a really small ground which sits in the middle of a residential neighbourhood?

Newlands in Cape Town sorta has a similar situation with a train running through the railway stand at the back..

Also imo I like that it doesnt have a completed buildout it adds character to the ground and conects the redeveloped ground with the old ground.

Newlands in Cape Town sorta has a similar situation with a train running through the railway stand at the back..

Also imo I like that it doesnt have a completed buildout it adds character to the ground and conects the redeveloped ground with the old ground.

personally i wouldnt think a train track would hinder the development, look at the new Lansdowne (aviva) stadium, the west stand had a busy railway line under it but didnt stop the rebuild.

to the comment above this, it was actually the 1960 final you have there with Down v Kerry
attendance that day was 87,768

personally i wouldnt think a train track would hinder the development, look at the new Lansdowne (aviva) stadium, the west stand had a busy railway line under it but didnt stop the rebuild.


Yeah I was more pointing out that there are other stadiums that have trains running through them

Sorry guys. Forgor to poast this. (Saw it 5 years ago)

Plan / vision to expand to 97,284
New 3rd tier (145°)!!!!!!!!!!! :D
http://www.ieindia.org/publish/ar/1003/oct03ar4.pdf

woah, thats crazy, but it would be awesome to see.

I wonder if hurling is kinde of sport which gave a background for american lacrosse? You know like rugby and amF or cricket and baseball.:)

I wonder if hurling is kinde of sport which gave a background for american lacrosse? You know like rugby and amF or cricket and baseball.:)
It's actually Native American in origin.

Hurling is allegedly the origin of shinty in Scotland, though.

Hurling is allegedly the origin of shinty in Scotland, though.

Nothing alleged about it, modern hurling and Shinty are simply different codifications of the same historic game, just as Scottish Gaelic and Irish Gaelic are the same language that broke into two dialects.

This is the annual international Ireland -Scotland compromise game
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NXduCD2y3JY

Westlife are to play a gig in Croke Park next June

the upper tiers are supposed to be one of the steepest..in Europe anyway

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3345/3607670839_1f265430d1.jpg

its been announced that croke park will soon be out dated and a new masterplan will be planned, it was in the papers and they had a documentary on it not so long ago, so in a few years time it could potentially the biggest stadium in europe!

ill try to find links etc

Ireland's biggest stadium and home of the Gaelic Athletic Association(GAA), Ireland's most poplular sports.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/eoghanmcn/47081222/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/munster-express/2845598724/

I´ve got a feeling I am missing something here.

a few pictures would help launch this thread methinks

http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=373431

Ireland's biggest stadium and home of the Gaelic Athletic Association(GAA), Ireland's most poplular sports.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/eoghanmcn/47081222/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/munster-express/2845598724/

FAIL!!!!

Time for a bit of an update!

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/147/381926797_f516b19ab5_z.jpg

http://lh4.ggpht.com/_5V7vNjVKdVI/TFFKo0yTLFI/AAAAAAACTcM/qtic3cWPpqA/s800/Croke%20Park.jpg

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1133/1287035541_d12a67b766_z.jpg

[img]http://farm1.static.flickr.com/244/3264203842_76e16863d6_z.jpg

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2643/3778970354_e802571fbc_z.jpg

view from top
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3192/3668605965_7e190ee3aa.jpg

top tier looks very steep!
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3322/3669408634_def6b41a1e_z.jpg

Forgot to update this a few weeks back - the GAA have re-introduced fencing now in front of the Hill 16 stand. The measure was done primarily to stop instances of pitch invasions after big matches in the hurling and football

Photo's from www.sportsfile.com

http://dynimg.rte.ie/0003a4a7-390.jpg

http://www.sportsfile.com/winshare/watermarked-b/Library/SF628/455539.jpg

http://www.sportsfile.com/winshare/watermarked-b/Library/SF628/455541.jpg

http://www.sportsfile.com/winshare/watermarked-b/Library/SF628/455538.jpg

http://www.sportsfile.com/winshare/watermarked-b/Library/SF629/456056.jpg

So there is still a terrace on which spectators stand? Can these be converted to seats easily? And what is the capacity with seats only? I know, a lot of questions but hopefully somebody can answer them.

Edit: I read in the opning post 70.000 seats and 12.000 on terraces. I would guess it would have 76.000 seats if these terraces were converted into seats, but it would be nice to have some confirmation on this. :)

Croke Park looks like Twickenham before they developed the hotel end.

So there is still a terrace on which spectators stand? Can these be converted to seats easily? And what is the capacity with seats only? I know, a lot of questions but hopefully somebody can answer them.

Edit: I read in the opning post 70.000 seats and 12.000 on terraces. I would guess it would have 76.000 seats if these terraces were converted into seats, but it would be nice to have some confirmation on this. :)

Yes the Hill is still a terrace for all GAA games. The terrace can be converted to all seater as it was for the international football games where FIFA & UEFA rules state the grounds must be all seater. With the opening of the new Lansdowne, its unlikely you'll see anymore international games in the stadium in the near future so it's unlikely you'll see full seating on the Hill.

I know the Hill holds around 13,000 in its terraced configuration but i've no idea what the seated capacity is/was

So there is still a terrace on which spectators stand? Can these be converted to seats easily? And what is the capacity with seats only? I know, a lot of questions but hopefully somebody can answer them.

Edit: I read in the opning post 70.000 seats and 12.000 on terraces. I would guess it would have 76.000 seats if these terraces were converted into seats, but it would be nice to have some confirmation on this. :)

Ya, the terrace is converted or that is was converted when football was played here, its not going to be used anymore tho with the aviva stadium just built.

and here are some pics of the hill with seats (capacity was between 75 and 76,000 with all the seats, so the capacity was reduced by about 7,500 during this time as full capacity is 82,500.

http://www.iol.ie/~johnwallace/images/img_0491.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b58/footloose_/P1-1.jpg

http://www.sportsfile.com/winshare/watermarked-b/Library/SF310/239066.jpg

http://www.sportsfile.com/winshare/watermarked-b/Library/SF310/239067.jpg

The reason for the lack of expansion of the Hill 16, is that an expansion will "steal" the sunlight from the houses behind the stadion (and some historic reasons eg. the rubbles of 1916 etc.)

One of the other stands have a railway under it, and Gaa rent the "air" from the railroad company.

The reason for the lack of expansion of the Hill 16, is that an expansion will "steal" the sunlight from the houses behind the stadion (and some historic reasons eg. the rubbles of 1916 etc.)

One of the other stands have a railway under it, and Gaa rent the "air" from the railroad company.

Think that might be the old Lansdowne you are thinking of?

The railway runs behind hill 16, and is another reason it would be hard to expand at that end.

The Hill end has been rebuilt since this photo, but you can see the railway line running behind it (I think it still occupies pretty much the same footprint). There is a Canal running under the Davin (?) Stand at the other end, though.
http://www.paschaldonohoe.ie/wp-content/uploads/2009/11/croke-park.jpg

I think what he means is that there is a railway running under the Canal end too, the stadium is sandwiched by them. You can just about see the tracks in the top of the picture there. (One line goes to Drumcondra station, the other to the Docklands station.)

The reason it won't be expanded in my opinion is because it's not really worth the slight capacity increase (~10,000 suggested) for the cost. It would be difficult but not impossible to construct around the railway (plus they'd need to do a deal with Irish Rail since it's their land). Nothing to do with the rubble from 1916 I wouldn't think - the original Hill 16 was redeveloped recently to be steeper and bigger so probably has none of it left.

Anyway it's good to have an area in the stadium for cheaper tickets. It might look a bit unfinished but it does its job well. As it is the 82,300 capacity is only reached a few times a year anyway, for example the football semi-final between Kildare and Down only had 60-something thousand at it. Well maybe in the long-term it'd be something to think about but it's fine for now.

the railway company have air rights deals with both Croke Park and the Aviva Stadium as both stadiums have railways running under them. In the case of Croke Park the Canal (Davin) Stand has a railway under it and a canal. The railway company have a corporate box and lease it back to Croke Park.

Expansion has been mentioned alot on this site and although unlikely (mainly due to costs) I still think hill 16 could have been finished better with the end being on a level as oppossed to the lopsided look (maybe a continuation of the lower tier the whole way round the stadium) - it would have meant part of the stand would be above the railway just like the old lansdowne. Failing that why have they placed the press box and a big TV in the bottom left corner of the stand. Is this not a complete waste of capacity (2000 terrace, 1000 seats?)

Expansion has been mentioned alot on this site and although unlikely (mainly due to costs) I still think hill 16 could have been finished better with the end being on a level as oppossed to the lopsided look (maybe a continuation of the lower tier the whole way round the stadium) - it would have meant part of the stand would be above the railway just like the old lansdowne. Failing that why have they placed the press box and a big TV in the bottom left corner of the stand. Is this not a complete waste of capacity (2000 terrace, 1000 seats?)

The continuation of the lower bowl around the Hill isn't possible because the rake of the tier would be intersected by the railway line at the rear. To give you an idea, the railway line is raised a lot higher than at the rear of Lansdowne road so a perfect bowl around this end is not possible without moving the entire railway line further back (the cost of this would be astronomical). The original plans when they were first released in the nineties were for an open seated terrace with no press boxes (see below) but again this would've been intersected by the railway at the rear

http://www.timspencerandco.net/cms/site/images/croker%20photo%20main_1.jpg

Couldn't the press box have been built so that it was overhanging the terrace like Porto's dragao stadium.They also should've located the press box directly behind the goal or failing that closer to the cusack stand side.

i never unserstand why so many stadiums are built near railways :ohno:

It's a waste of space! It dooms all expansion projects or influence the architect in thei calculations :mad:

The continuation of the lower bowl around the Hill isn't possible because the rake of the tier would be intersected by the railway line at the rear. To give you an idea, the railway line is raised a lot higher than at the rear of Lansdowne road so a perfect bowl around this end is not possible without moving the entire railway line further back (the cost of this would be astronomical). The original plans when they were first released in the nineties were for an open seated terrace with no press boxes (see below) but again this would've been intersected by the railway at the rear

http://www.timspencerandco.net/cms/site/images/croker%20photo%20main_1.jpg

I have to admit that even this looks better (seating or terrace) than the finished article. The thin terraced stand to the left of the press box in the picture below quite frankly looks ridiculous. Im generally not having a go as I think the stadium is amazing I just think it can be improved on.


http://t3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSKOpzprAa_8W3R_jjvjnFYAakYz2ccBlJClqak9L_6fLdQ1af9bw

Is it conceivable to have the rail line start to go underground after St. George's Avenue to reemerge just before Ballybough road?
Works and the closure of the line will of course need to happen to allow this.

Or is there simply not enough room to do a smooth descent and ascent?

Then you can reconstruct Hill 16 to a 10,000 seater stand, with a possible row of press boxes, and a large LED screen (that could be set up so that it's "blocking" out any form of light towards housing during event days) in the middle.

i never unserstand why so many stadiums are built near railways :ohno:

It's a waste of space! It dooms all expansion projects or influence the architect in thei calculations :mad:

Would you like to go from railwaystation to stadium about 30 minuts:p I don't think so.

Besides, it seems to me that most of the objects created on the old, where they were located near the center. Then the process of urban development was not as fast as it is now.

i never unserstand why so many stadiums are built near railways :ohno:

It's a waste of space! It dooms all expansion projects or influence the architect in thei calculations :mad:

Axel, i'll bite my tongue here and simply point out that when the GAA took over the plot of land that the stadium now resides it was 1885, I'd highly doubt that the founders of the GAA had the foresight to predict a four tier super stadium with executive suites and premium levels would appear on the site over one hundred years later.

At the time the plot of land was ideal for the associations needs and part of the charm of Croker is that, 126 years later, they still occupy the spiritual home of the game (even though they only came to own it outright in 1913) which means a lot to fans all around the country. The stadium itself is still relatively central to the city itself also and for the area it occupies, they've done a good job of securing such a large capacity giving the constraints of the site.


Is it conceivable to have the rail line start to go underground after St. George's Avenue to reemerge just before Ballybough road?
Works and the closure of the line will of course need to happen to allow this.

Or is there simply not enough room to do a smooth descent and ascent?

Then you can reconstruct Hill 16 to a 10,000 seater stand, with a possible row of press boxes, and a large LED screen (that could be set up so that it's "blocking" out any form of light towards housing during event days) in the middle.

The main issue with doing anything with the railway is the height at which it currently occupies between the streets you've mentioned. Regardless of if they could get the money together, which I would imagine would be seriously expensive, the biggest issue in that case would be how to keep the line open during the works. As it's the main Dublin to Sligo line, I can't see how they'd do so without having to purchase the houses running alongside the rail line (itself hemmed in by houses in much the same way the Hill is boxed in by the railway line). If you could purchase the houses then the issue with the railway being lowered becomes secondary because, in theory, you'd have space to move it further back, thus extending the Hill also.

The two biggest problems for any extension of the Hill are:
1) The compulsory purchase of the housing to the rear of the Hill/Railway line on Clonliffe Road. Any tweaks to the railway itself would probably necessitate further purchases of housing the length of Clonliffe Road to allow the line to remain open. The sheer cost of this alone would be too high for any gains the GAA may get

2) Planning permission for any extension would have to come up against local residents, Dublin City Council and the Gardai given the potential increase in crowds attending games. You could argue the stadium regularly hit attendences of 85-90,000 back in the day when the majority of the old stadium was terracing but in today's, safety conscious environment, I'm not sure it would fly given access to the ground isn't the best as it is.

For the record, I'm completely in agreement with those who say the Studio Boxes, LED screen and sliver of terrace next to the Hogan Stand look awful, it's attrocious looking, it's like someone making a model from Lego ran out of peices and is lumping in leftovers to fill the space. The original plan for the open terrace running right the way along that end of the ground for me is the best solution, and probably the most realistic.

First picture here is of Dublin fans in Croke Park who you can imagine could fill the place many times over if the capacity existed! Absolutely love these pictures, place is such a beast!

http://farm1.staticflickr.com/69/191835910_9944e4081f_b.jpg

http://farm1.staticflickr.com/24/47081222_7f6c576d21_z.jpg?zz=1

http://farm5.staticflickr.com/4143/4922229402_b4b86b2a86_b.jpg

http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3417/3607670737_d6cfd9eb3b_b.jpg

And of corse, the famous vertigo view!
http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3345/3607670839_1f265430d1_b.jpg

I want to post this for the sheer brilliance of these two videos, Ireland v England, entrance and the anthems, best responce to a national anthem by Ireland, probably posted before but i dont care!

2dHSNueuYN4

Even the English Commentators had lumps in their throats after that!
CQ6-bYixpYE

Apparently there's talk that Croke Park could host an NFL game with the steelers being lined up to play. As the Navy v Notre Dame game has already been penned in for the Aviva across town next year there could be alot of american footie on show in Dublin in 2012.


http://img.rasset.ie/00027cfa189r.jpg


Croke Park is linked to hosting NFL

Thursday, 27 January 2011

A spokeswoman for Ireland's Minister for Tourism, Culture and Sport has Mary Hanafin has confirmed discussions have taken place to host a NFL game in Croke Park in the Autumn.

The spokeswoman told the Irish Echo: 'Minister Mary Hanafin would very much welcome such a move to hold a future NFL game in Ireland, which has such a proud sporting tradition.

'There would be a great welcome for visiting fans traveling with the teams to Ireland as well as huge interest locally, and a knock on boost for Ireland from a tourism perspective.'

The NFL has moved one regular league game to Wembley Stadium in London for the last four years, leaving precedent for a clash in Croker.

Dan Rooney, whose family own the franchise the Pittsburgh Steelers, is the current US Ambassador in Dublin and could bring his Super Bowl finalists to Ireland.

Just noticed that that article is a tad dated. :tongue2:

The possibility of an NFL game is still valid though.

I'm concerned about sightlines

Gaelic pitches are HUGE compared to American gridirons

I'm concerned about sightlines

Gaelic pitches are HUGE compared to American gridirons

Same size has soccor stadiums tho

Same size has soccor stadiums tho

yeah but even soccer fields are wider than gridiron fields! either way this would be great. im a massive gridiron fan and would love to see a game played in dublin!:banana:

Hitmanhart here is a more up to date article. The GAA are defo trying to get an NFL game! If it becomes an annual match like Wembley then it could be a nice little earner for the GAA. Will it be all-seater or would they keep the terrace? Will they fill Croke Park for an NFL game in this financial climate? I would guess yes because for a one-off or once a year game people from all over the country and further a field would make the effort. Fingers crossed they get it as the article mentions Edinburgh Frankfurt and Munich are also interested

http://www.independent.ie/sport/gaelic-football/gaa-close-in-on-gridiron-match-as-nfl-officials-visit-croke-park-2952357.html

Great stadium but I prefer Aviva to this

Another article on the possible NFL game

http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/sport/gaa/croke-park-in-frame-for-nfl-bonanza-16087852.html

Another article on the possible NFL game

http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/sport/gaa/croke-park-in-frame-for-nfl-bonanza-16087852.html

While reading that article I did kind of think how seriously I should take it after reading this part:

Wembley stadium in London has hosted NFL matches recently but with the Olympics coming to the English captial next Summer, it's suitability remains in question.

What does the guy mean by that? :dunno:

The London NFL matches have been going from strength to strength every year.

^^^ The Last Wembley Game never sold out it was 10,000 fans less than before

Thats because tickets only went on sale a couple of months before the game because of the strike by the players. Normally there is a time frame of 9months or so.

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/ireland/2012/0206/1224311332228.html

Plan for major Croke Park entrance would see 1960s flats demolished

A MAJOR new phase of development for Dublin’s Croke Park involving a new “processional entrance” to the stadium, offices, restaurants, shops and handball facilities is planned by the GAA.

The development, which would include the regeneration of the 1960s flat complex Croke Villas, will depend on the GAA reaching agreement on the purchase of land from Dublin City Council.

The council had planned to redevelop Croke Villas, an estate of 79 flats on Sackville Avenue near the stadium, under a public-private partnership agreement with Bennett Developments, but the plans collapsed in December 2008.

In late 2010, the council determined it was “extremely unlikely that Croke Villas will be redeveloped in the foreseeable future”. The flats were in a state of decay and it was determined they should be vacated. Fewer than 20 of them are now occupied.

Plans put forward by the GAA have given new hope for Croke Villas. The return for the GAA would be the acquisition of council land to allow it to develop a new grand entrance to the stadium and office facilities – and crucially a new handball centre.

“Croke Villas was, is and continues to remain in an appalling condition, so we decided to see could we conceivably do something to help to change that,” Croke Park stadium director Peter McKenna said.

The plans would involve the demolition of the flats and the widening of Sackville Avenue to provide a boulevard or processional entrance to the stadium. This would become the only match-day entrance and would take crowds out of surrounding streets.

The residential element would be relocated away from the road and a new “urban village” would be created which could be used to encourage local enterprise with elements such as a dance studio or artisan bakery. The development would allow for the expansion of Croke Park’s office facilities and a handball centre.

After a lengthy planning process, the GAA last August secured permission from An Bord Pleanála to demolish the 1970s handball facility and community centre and build a new expanded centre, with 500sq m of office space in addition to sports, recreation and community facilities.

The plans were opposed by several groups including the occupants of the existing community facilities, represented by the Croke Park Streets Committees, principally on the grounds that bar facilities in the handball centre would not be replaced in the new centre.

Their concerns had been acknowledged by An Bord Pleanála inspector Mary Crowley, who recommended refusal of permission, stating the facilities available to the community would be “significantly compromised or lost”.

The dispute between the committees and the GAA has become entrenched, with legal proceedings recently issued by the GAA against members of the committees over their refusal to vacate the bar building. The committees’ chairman, Eamon O’Brien, said the dispute could be resolved if the GAA would agree to the replacement of the bar, popular with older community members.

“We were totally supportive of the redevelopment of Croke Villas and were fully prepared to move because Mr McKenna guaranteed full replacement facilities in the new development – but he has since gone back on that.”

Mr McKenna said it was the GAA’s belief the facilities included in any new development should be chosen by the community as a whole, not any one group.

“A lot of local people would be appalled at the idea of having a bar as part of the new community facilities, but it will be for the community to decide. Really it’s an unnecessary distraction. This is an opportunity to make a phenomenal transformation in people’s lives – and to try to relate it to this issue is grossly unfair to the people living in Croke Villas.”

The GAA requires the support of city councillors for the Croke Villas project to go ahead.