if they have too wait for extra permits for the foundation i hope they start sealing and water proofing the entire plot

Still no reply to some of the more important issues like what is the latest on linking construction to payments. Why do builders need our cash now so urgently if our escrow accounts have been managed correctly and there is very little physical progess against expected costs (and no one has highlighted that initial payments were not made into escrow account).

So lets stick to simple yes or no questions:

1> Has anyone got a copy of their escrow account and are we legally entitled to this as SP have told me I am not entitled to this information
2> Has anyone received a copy of their initial registration from the land registration (I assume very few of us have got married or moved house as per SP's latest update)?

PS Thanks to all who take pictures and contribute in a constructive manner (if you pardon the pun).

Still no reply to some of the more important issues like what is the latest on linking construction to payments. Why do builders need our cash now so urgently if our escrow accounts have been managed correctly and there is very little physical progess against expected costs (and no one has highlighted that initial payments were not made into escrow account).

So lets stick to simple yes or no questions:

1> Has anyone got a copy of their escrow account and are we legally entitled to this as SP have told me I am not entitled to this information
2> Has anyone received a copy of their initial registration from the land registration (I assume very few of us have got married or moved house as per SP's latest update)?

PS Thanks to all who take pictures and contribute in a constructive manner (if you pardon the pun).

1> No - SP claim that I am only entitled to see what I have paid. SP claim that only RERA have the authority to see overall ESCROW account position.

2> No - After chasing for a month or two I finaly got a receipt from SP. They basically now ignore my weekly emails asking about this or fob me off by saying that they are registering The Point first and then Bay Central in the order that payments were made.

Basically, we all need to email ceo@rera.gov.ae to at least alert them to the issues.

True Blue's track record shows that has been right pretty much on everything he posted about SG/SP, while the record of his distractors has been way wrong. i find his comments very useful and realistic, and should be repeated daily imo just to remind people who get optimistic for nothing when the facts on the ground are still proving him right!

his construction knowledge is unmatched on this forum, and there is no wishful thinking in his opinions. so please True Blue keep it up!

you and TBTB (True BlueThe Bore) are missing the point. It is self evident that we are being led a merry dance. They have done the same thing with the Point and TT also for the business reasons previously explained. What is the point in keep going over the same issues? There is nothing you can do about it except now that RERA are coming more to the fore complain to them.

Did I say SP made that statement about the raft inspection? Oh Boy!!

Always the same when people don't like getting bad news, shoot the messenger.

Let me repeat myself, how can I give you a plan and timetable if the start date in unknown? Give me a break!

Well assume a start date of 1st March for the residential towers and if this changes we'll flex your plan accordingly. Then assume a finish date of, say, June 2012 for handover or whatever you think is more likely taking into account their performance on the Point and TT. We'll then have a more realistic yardstick to judge them by.

I have asked SP to ask SG for their version of a timetable. This they have done and SP hope to publish it in a week or so. I am not expecting a convincing effort because SG are unresponsive that is why it will be useful to have our own.

Isn't this the key purpose of the forum? The banter is fine but only after the main business has been dealt with.

19/February/2009

Bay Central and Al Fattan Office Tower

http://img3.imageshack.us/img3/558/imresolt67sj1.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

http://img510.imageshack.us/img510/6945/imresolt71ut3.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

i thought you said, or someone else, that there is a change in the construction progress in BC, and thus implying that Select is improving. what TB said, and i totally agree with him here, is that the construction progress sucks as it did last year, and by no means should be considered as an improvement. and that's the point, Select has not changed a bit in the construction progress compared to last year, contrary to what you were implying in your post.

if you haven't implied any of that, then why object when TB only responded to someone who was suggesting that!

you and TBTB (True BlueThe Bore) are missing the point. It is self evident that we are being led a merry dance. They have done the same thing with the Point and TT also for the business reasons previously explained. What is the point in keep going over the same issues? There is nothing you can do about it except now that RERA are coming more to the fore complain to them.

i thought you said, or someone else, that there is a change in the construction progress in BC, and thus implying that Select is improving. what TB said, and i totally agree with him here, is that the construction progress sucks as it did last year, and by no means should be considered as an improvement. and that's the point, Select has not changed a bit in the construction progress compared to last year, contrary to what you were implying in your post.

if you haven't implied any of that, then why object when TB only responded to someone who was suggesting that!

BCD keep making progress. Last 2/3 months seems quicker than before but whether is it quicker than last year I don't know. BCD are proceeding at their pace which is slower than investors want. This is what happened with the Point and TT. Leopards don't change their spots. So if we start with the premise hand over will be June 2012 which seems some sort of consensus between us how are we doing against this now and what stages do we need to get to in 3, 6, 9 etc months. We can then see if we are ahead or behind this schedule as months go by. Now wouldn't that be helpful?

There is absolutely no point in saying progress is slow or slow against Dec 2010 handover because this is stating the obvious especially when it is said time and time and time again. It is not that TB or anyone else is wrong in saying this but they are using the wrong yardstick. That is my point. We need a more realistic yardstick otherwise you and many others just winge all the time which is pretty pointless and frankly the posts are not worth reading. Apologies in advance if I appear rude. I'll think I'll join Morris for a drink. :nuts:

^^^ then simply don't read them and don't tell anyone to stop expressing their opinions, especially if they have been right all along and you have been wrong!!!

and please don't tell me again that i should accept a delay of 3 years as normal and be positive about the developer. and don't try to steer this thread to your liking by asking forumers to stop posting opinions you disagree with.

As per Land department if you have paid 30% you dont have to pay any more till the construction is 30% complete (who determines this 30% is a question) and after that all payments will go as per construction. Many of the investors are forming groups of their investments and making representations to the developers/rera etc. Why cant all the bc investors get together and ask all their questions (we all know the questions) as a group. May be we can get them to acknowledge that this project is not going to complete by 2010 and why should we all not get a payment holiday till the construction reaches atleast 30% as most of us have paid more than this..................

^^^ then simply don't read them and don't tell anyone to stop expressing their opinions, especially if they have been right all along and you have been wrong!!!

and please don't tell me again that i should accept a delay of 3 years as normal and be positive about the developer. and don't try to steer this thread to your liking by asking forumers to stop posting opinions you disagree with.

Think we all agree we are disappointed with the developer. I have never said the developer is great. But I have counteracted the doom and gloom merchants and said BC will be built albeit late and in my opinion Dubai is still a good place to stay invested. That's it. That's my line. What I would now like to know is when is it likely to be built.

So you are angry with the developer, so is every BC investor including me. What are you going to that will make a difference? Do you seriously think the developer is interested in our views? If you read the threads on the Point and TT the posts cover all the same issues and many people have tried before you to make a difference but to no avail. There has been more than one attempt with BC to do something as a Group including me. Nothing has been done in practice because it is too difficult. The only effective course of action is to complain to RERA. I have done this, have you?

In the meantime I'll spend my energy on trying to predict when BC will actually be built. You can carry on huffing and puffing if it makes you feel better but it is miserable reading.

OK - Let's try something constructive...

Q. As an investor in BC, have you registered your concerns with RERA using the online form that is here: http://rpdubai.ae/rpdubai/ComplaintAction.do?method=checkProfile

I have done this.

Slowhand has done this. I am pretty sure Glover has done this.

So scores on the doors:
3

Let's see if we can get this into double figures!

no one is huffing and puffing here, we are only bringing you back to reality when you post statements of progress being better and improvements being made. so don't try to shut anyone out because you find it unpleasant to read.

i am also tired of many opinions i read on this forum and all the wishful thinking of changes to come, but i don't tell you or anyone else not to say whatever you want.

let me ask you this, did you make any promises to Select when you met them that you will try to tone down the criticism on this thread!

You can carry on huffing and puffing if it makes you feel better but it is miserable reading.

^^
but what did you list as your complaint catagory?

just choose any nearest catagory.. ive also filed a complaint so that makes 4

I've just filled in a complaint so heading for double figures.

I selected the first option as this might be taken more seriously and was most applicable to me. The interface isnt the best. Have to press return after entering details in some of the fields. I searched for Bay Central Developments in RERA list of developers and used those details. Following was my complaint:

When I purchased the property the developer (Select Property acting on behalf of Select Group) requested payment into their account: Bay Central Developments Phase 1 Limited, Barclays Bank, BARCAEAD, Account 359726. After the first 2 stage payments they sent a letter requesting payment into an escrow account. I have repeatedly requested proof that ALL payments made were transferred into the escrow account by requesting an Escrow Statement of Account (for my specific payments). They have refused to provide this and say they do not have to provide this to me. They have also failed to send my initial registration into RERA despite having all my details and payment since October 2008.

PS Following is supplied developers email address. I assume this is a typo(missing an s). noor.khan@elect-group.ae

Hi bcietmp

1> NO
2> NO
3> NO
4> NO
5> NO
.......
.......
999> NO

I have answered all the possible questions that you could ask about BC on that forum in the future. Apologize for being sarcastic but all odds are against our interests.





Still no reply to some of the more important issues like what is the latest on linking construction to payments. Why do builders need our cash now so urgently if our escrow accounts have been managed correctly and there is very little physical progess against expected costs (and no one has highlighted that initial payments were not made into escrow account).

So lets stick to simple yes or no questions:

1> Has anyone got a copy of their escrow account and are we legally entitled to this as SP have told me I am not entitled to this information
2> Has anyone received a copy of their initial registration from the land registration (I assume very few of us have got married or moved house as per SP's latest update)?

PS Thanks to all who take pictures and contribute in a constructive manner (if you pardon the pun).

5 investors so far...

This may help some people who are struggling with details.

http://i40.tinypic.com/5u2qew.jpg

Also, there is a freeform notes section where you can complain to your hearts content. I certainly found it theraputic! However, you could write this up using word/notepad/etc and then paste it in. Also that way you can keep the doc for ref in case the website goes down.

If we do get to double figures, then we should create a group email to ceo of rera containing all the RERA ref numbers.

OK - Let's try something constructive...

Q. As an investor in BC, have you registered your concerns with RERA using the online form that is here: http://rpdubai.ae/rpdubai/ComplaintAction.do?method=checkProfile

I have done this.

Slowhand has done this. I am pretty sure Glover has done this.

So scores on the doors:
3

Let's see if we can get this into double figures!

I've done it.

I've done it...albeit several weeks ago.

Regarding all the different points of view about who is right and who is wrong. Who cares? We all accept that there is a substantial delay and we should be focusing on moving forward. Glover you are correct everyone IS allowed an opinion unfortunarley some people's opinions are put across in a bad way. Your best mate has an aweful manner and clearly has a thing against SP/SG. This comes across on all the SP threads and this is the reason he gets on most people's nerves. I think anyone contributing to these threads in a constructive manner is welcome...and by constructive i don't mean SP lovers...i just mean keep it real without all the drama. I will ask you as no one else can answer this - why is he an expert and why are his opinions valued. I have read the full Dorra forum and he was wrong about many things and refuses to critisise Cayan. Now surely that shows some kind of bias given that they were late by over a year and then demanded the final payment before allowing people to snag. There lies the problem...his points of view, while technically they may be correct, are always littered with immature biased opinions on the developer and he often tries to manipulate facts. You accused Slowhand of being an SP mole...i think your best mate is wosre than that...he staes his opinions as fact as if he is in the know when they are ONLY his opinion...thats the point. The people on this forum causing the biggest noise are in two categories. Amature investors that are panicking and need anything to grasp at to allow them to get out. They bought 4 or 5 units on lpp and overstretched and now there arse is collapsing. And non investors who like to cause bother because they can!
Anyway - i expect the usual rhetoric in reply but still look forward to meeting all my fellow investors in the bar of the BC Rennaisance. Now who will bite first??!

We currenlty have an private email group which includes 8 BC investors, if any others want too join please PM me..

BC investors only and who want too take some kind of action only..

Thanks

We currenlty have an private email group which includes 8 BC investors, if any others want too join please PM me..

BC investors only and who want too take some kind of action only..

Thanks

I would suggest that this private email group will only be open to people that provide us with a valid RERA reference complaint number.

As this is an open forum we need to keep the integrity of our list. I'll hope everyone will understand.

i would love to Join this group...and will provide reference no....

Charlie the Big Potatoes --- Please post Bay Central Photos

i would love to Join this group...and will provide reference no....

Charlie the Big Potatoes --- Please post Bay Central Photos

Room serviced / cleaner :lol: gone for a break.

BCD keep making progress. Last 2/3 months seems quicker than before but whether is it quicker than last year I don't know. BCD are proceeding at their pace which is slower than investors want. This is what happened with the Point and TT. Leopards don't change their spots. So if we start with the premise hand over will be June 2012 which seems some sort of consensus between us how are we doing against this now and what stages do we need to get to in 3, 6, 9 etc months. We can then see if we are ahead or behind this schedule as months go by. Now wouldn't that be helpful?

There is absolutely no point in saying progress is slow or slow against Dec 2010 handover because this is stating the obvious especially when it is said time and time and time again. It is not that TB or anyone else is wrong in saying this but they are using the wrong yardstick. That is my point. We need a more realistic yardstick otherwise you and many others just winge all the time which is pretty pointless and frankly the posts are not worth reading. Apologies in advance if I appear rude. I'll think I'll join Morris for a drink. :nuts:


I would like to congratulate Morris on the great job he has done on you. Only one or two meetings with him and I can hardly tell the difference :lol::lol::banana:

Many Congarats Morris :cheers:

Yes and I can't wait to meet you soon as well Mackie. :banana:

http://i41.tinypic.com/2ducjkz.jpg

All taken thursday 19th

http://i43.tinypic.com/inzaz4.jpg

http://i42.tinypic.com/2ywgtpf.jpg

http://i42.tinypic.com/mhf5v5.jpg

http://i39.tinypic.com/154im2e.jpg

http://i43.tinypic.com/11w6kpv.jpg

http://i43.tinypic.com/2zekmbo.jpg

http://i39.tinypic.com/2nvavkk.jpg

http://i43.tinypic.com/29fqrkx.jpg

http://i43.tinypic.com/9b95xv.jpg

http://i42.tinypic.com/ir2czn.jpg

http://i44.tinypic.com/aouo79.jpg

http://i42.tinypic.com/xq9ras.jpg

http://i39.tinypic.com/8xubo8.jpg

http://i43.tinypic.com/2cs8dph.jpg

http://i40.tinypic.com/1676w07.jpg

http://i42.tinypic.com/9tg9yg.jpg

http://i39.tinypic.com/35kj490.jpg

Charlie;

You have excelled yourself young man :applause::applause:

http://i44.tinypic.com/esvs5d.jpg

Thats all guys.

Great Photos ---thanks Charlie ---

Now i would ask our forums best experts to make comments about the progress....(please dont forget to mention your qualification)....

i can see they have build solid platform in front of west tower....i have seen at silverlane picture that they have covered whore area....how things will move from here..:ohno: ..need simple explaination please..

they have covered whore area.

Yes i would also like to learn more about this too. Excellent that it will be covered so as not to burn ones arse in the mid day sun.

They think of everything in Dubai dont they.

Yes i would also like to learn more about this too. Excellent that it will be covered so as not to burn ones arse in the mid day sun.

They think of everything in Dubai dont they.

Those Eastern Europeans burn too easily!
:lol:

CBP - Thanks man.

See Select Property, Now THAT is an update. Not that s**t you put in a pdf....:ohno:

CBP - Best update ever - How did you get up in quays tower to take pics ?

Here's a panorama from CBP's pics!

http://i39.tinypic.com/awxged.jpg

hi guys thinking of selling up looking for about 1500/ft.... sniffing around a steal at Hemingway Ave, Haines City. could be a good retirement home too...what do you guys think...

I dont think 1500 psf is a realistic price at the moment for any development in the marina 3 years away from handover.

Good luck.

http://i42.tinypic.com/xq9ras.jpg

^^

I am no expert but should all the metal bars to sticking out around the edges of the development, like they are waiting to be trimmed to size? Something defintely doesnt look right in pix :?

^^ Even if piling isn't completed around there, they can still do it with no major problems. However I believe the piles are there most likely, just waiting to be dug out to expose their caps.

^^

I am no expert but should all the metal bars to sticking out around the edges of the development, like they are waiting to be trimmed to size? Something defintely doesnt look right in pix :?

This is normal, these are starter bars which will lap with the reinforcement of the surrounding basement slab which will be poured EVENTUALLY.

CBP - Best update ever - How did you get up in quays tower to take pics ?

Just realised from FWIW panorama your pics are from Al Fttan - thanks

BTW SP dd tell me that te podium would be out of the ground by the end of the year (mind you that was in Sept 08 -LOL - I have to laugh or i'd cry !

BTW SP dd tell me that te podium would be out of the ground by the end of the year (mind you that was in Sept 08 -LOL - I have to laugh or i'd cry !

Don't feel bad about it, they posted on Botanica thread that they are still on track with original completion date. Lying comes natural to them and even more so now that they have taken on a group of staff from Emaar, another highly regarded bunch of liars.

^^^^ add to that their letter to homeowners in the Point that their apartments will be handed over in May. new staff or old, it doesn't make any difference. SP's corporate culture is all coming from the top, shaped by many years of selling used cars!!

how long do you recokon its gonna take untill the podium is done?

At least a year b4 this is above the hoarding, will post pics of here and TT later.

Don't feel bad about it, they posted on Botanica thread that they are still on track with original completion date. Lying comes natural to them and even more so now that they have taken on a group of staff from Emaar, another highly regarded bunch of liars.
I fear that lying is endemic in Dubai unfortunately
We as investors rarely find out until it's too late

At least a year b4 this is above the hoarding, will post pics of here and TT later.

Hope the Atlantis doesn't sting you for the wireless !!!
Will be sad to see you leave there mate

Standard payment plan people :

Contract payment due june 09

Changed to Sept 09 will have paid 87% of total Price

even sept 09 they i dont think it will start to rise

need a longer payment hoilday or RERA too pull there finger out and sort something quick

Standard payment plan people :

Contract payment due june 09

Changed to Sept 09 will have paid 87% of total Price

even sept 09 they i dont think it will start to rise

need a longer payment hoilday or RERA too pull there finger out and sort something quick

Beppe, are you saying SP have added another 3 months payment holiday??

Beppe, are you saying SP have added another 3 months payment holiday??

beppe is correct this is for people on spp. payment was due 1st june when sp gave a 3 month holiday which brings it to sept.no further payment holiday has been added by SP:ohno:

the pound wont recover anytime this year hopefully next year slowly maybe.. so next payment will be a killer costing an extra 9k.. SP should have given SPP people longer payment hoilday 9-12 months..

any one at SP listening??

beppe is correct this is for people on spp. payment was due 1st june when sp gave a 3 month holiday which brings it to sept.no further payment holiday has been added by SP:ohno:

Thanks, I am on the spp and my original payment due date was March 1st so with the exstension it will be June 1st....guess I have different payment dates....

^^ you should have got a letter from SP about the payment hoilday..

Thanks, I am on the spp and my original payment due date was March 1st so with the exstension it will be June 1st....guess I have different payment dates....

yes unless SP have a change of heart and extend payment holiday.Or Rera may need to step in to link construction to payments. As you know what most investors think of SP it is unlikely that you will get a another payment holiday. we will see if RERA will step in:ohno:

yes unless SP have a change of heart and extend payment holiday.Or Rera may need to step in to link construction to payments. As you know what most investors think of SP it is unlikely that you will get a another payment holiday. we will see if RERA will step in:ohno:
RERA - WILL step in this summer as things could get worse

RERA - WILL step in this summer as things could get worse

i certainly hope so. what i gather at present RERA have only listened to developers side which offcourse is biased. I gather from dubai investors group rera have started to listen to investors and end users. Hope fully RERA will act in investors favour and perhaps get rid of all cowboy developers in dubai.:bash:

we need more complaints too RERA... who havent then doo it now

Latest pictures please...i am heavily rely on pictures posted on this forum.......

also i m on LPP and my next payment is supposed to due in March09 but because of payment holiday it will be now in June09...so only 3 months holiday..not 6 or 9 months...

we need more complaints too RERA... who havent then doo it now

Latest pictures please...i am heavily rely on pictures posted on this forum.......

also i m on LPP and my next payment is supposed to due in March09 but because of payment holiday it will be now in June09...so only 3 months holiday..not 6 or 9 months...

Beppe - Yes, we need more genuine investors to join our group! We're all in this together!

Hey UK_to_Dubai!

I sent you a Private Message to join our group, but have not had a reply from you?

You still interested?

FWIW- Beppe --

sorry i didnt know about ur messages as i never used it before...i will reply u soon...

thanks

http://i43.tinypic.com/260rk8w.jpg

i think RERA is starting to get it. no more lies about completion dates from Select or any other developer.

-------------------------------------------

Property buyers will discover whether the construction of their homes has been cancelled, delayed or is on schedule in one of several initiatives designed to protect investors concerned about the housing market downturn.

The Independent Progress Monitoring Report, an online scheme announced yesterday by the Real Estate Regulatory Agency (Rera), will see government engineers touring Dubai’s housing construction sites to check that progress is being made and assess the stage that work has reached.

http://thenational.ae/article/20090225/NATIONAL/708648301/1133

http://i43.tinypic.com/6j3air.jpg


http://i44.tinypic.com/xm7fqx.jpg

I believe there is a push to get the two residential towers to road level ASAP. Preparations are being made to start piling shortly on hotel.

A more detailed milestone plan should be published shortly.

IMRE should be able to take his great photos in perhaps a month when the towers are a bit taller?

At some point the status on SSC needs to change to UNDER C from GROUNDWORK.

slowhand

^^^^ a "push"!! are you becoming a mouth piece for SP! there are hardly any workers in those pictures. let me see, about 20. i think you should rephrase to a "drag"!!

we have lift-off..

I believe there is a push to get the two residential towers to road level ASAP. Preparations are being made to start piling shortly on hotel.

A more detailed milestone plan should be published shortly.

IMRE should be able to take his great photos in perhaps a month when the towers are a bit taller?

At some point the status on SSC needs to change to UNDER C from GROUNDWORK.

slowhand

Good photos and good update. Keep it coming despite all the negatitvity. Most of the comments on this site come from over stretched investors [amateur speculators] that bought 3 or 4 on lpp and as recently as 5 months ago were telling us all how we were silly to not have bought as many as them and are now panicking or people looking to knock a great developement. I can only guess slowhand that you are in it for the long haul and have planned your finances accordingly as you are always upbeat.

^^^^ a "push"!! are you becoming a mouth piece for SP! there are hardly any workers in those pictures. let me see, about 20. i think you should rephrase to a "drag"!!

Have you ever posted anything that is constructive or helpful to anyone? if so please say which post.

Have you ever posted anything that is constructive or helpful to anyone? if so please say which post.

Glover is one of the ones that only a few short months ago was boasting about how he had 4 units on LPP and WE were all silly not to do the same as him as he would make fortunes from his investment. What happened to that guy with the positive attitude?

Good photos and good update. Keep it coming despite all the negatitvity. Most of the comments on this site come from over stretched investors [amateur speculators] that bought 3 or 4 on lpp and as recently as 5 months ago were telling us all how we were silly to not have bought as many as them and are now panicking or people looking to knock a great developement. I can only guess slowhand that you are in it for the long haul and have planned your finances accordingly as you are always upbeat.

your last point is correct. I am a realist hence my view point. The negative ones are short of money or grumpy old men (see BBC program) but without the humour or disappointed because they were turned down for a job and you can see why now or trying, unsuccessfully, to be interesting because they have difficulty getting their regular acquaintances to listen anymore because they are boring. Move on, get a life.

this is coming from two guys who said we should accept 2012 as a realistic handover date, that's about 3 years late in completion, yet at the same time posting every other day how great the construction progress is!!

slowhand, you have to come clean and tell us why SP is treating you different than other investors. did you tell them that you are part of a group of investors and are acting as a representative of the group somehow!!!

aren't you the one who called me stupid few months ago and said Select is right and everything is fine with the company, only to file a complaint against them with RERA recently!!! now who is the moron here!!

you guys must be blind or something, you post pictures that there is a "push" in the construction when there are only about 20 workers onsite! you can't be that much in denial!

AGAIN, PICTURES SPEAK LOUDER THAN WORDS!

Glover is one of the ones that only a few short months ago was boasting about how he had 4 units on LPP and WE were all silly not to do the same as him as he would make fortunes from his investment. What happened to that guy with the positive attitude?

*popcorn*

I for one am just happy that there has been visible progress since the last pics were posted, with all the doom and gloom on this forum I as an investor am happy this project is still moving forward even though very slowly, its still moving and not on hold. One concern is (and maybe I can get some help from one of the construction guru´s on this forum) how far can the 2 residential towers proceed before they have to pause and wait for the hotel tower to play catch up? Or perhaps they dont need to wait....any comments would be appreciated.

^^ agree... another concern is it the hotel is very late will they give us separate handover

I for one am just happy that there has been visible progress since the last pics were posted, with all the doom and gloom on this forum I as an investor am happy this project is still moving forward even though very slowly, its still moving and not on hold. One concern is (and maybe I can get some help from one of the construction guru´s on this forum) how far can the 2 residential towers proceed before they have to pause and wait for the hotel tower to play catch up? Or perhaps they dont need to wait....any comments would be appreciated.

Handover can only start once all 3 towers are fully constructed and it is deemed 'safe' to do so by the legal authorities. Therefore, if the 2 residential towers and shared podium go up asap, we would still need to wait for hotel to finish construction. We do not need to wait for Hotel to officially open though...just removal of heavy plant equipment, cranes, people, etc.

I am sure SP/SG would like you to carry on believing that seperate handover is possible, but it is not. I can give you examples from Marina Quays or JBR as evidence to back up my statements.

Grubman - have you complained to RERA? Do you want to join our merry gang?

Handover can only start once all 3 towers are fully constructed and it is deemed 'safe' to do so by the legal authorities. Therefore, if the 2 residential towers and shared podium go up asap, we would still need to wait for hotel to finish construction. We do not need to wait for Hotel to officially open though...just removal of heavy plant equipment, cranes, people, etc.

I am sure SP/SG would like you to carry on believing that seperate handover is possible, but it is not. I can give you examples from Marina Quays or JBR as evidence to back up my statements.


Hello all, new poster here (although have looked on with interest for a few years). Not personally invested into this project although I do have a bit of property here and there.

So you know Im not going to be a regular poster here however happy to help with the construction knowledge that I do have when Im online

Bay Central was originally 3 plots 8V (West),8X (Central) and 8W (Hotel Tower). Now in one respect Select have been VERY clever as it means that actually they can in fact hand over the Central and West Tower before the East Tower is complete. In principal it is like saying Al Marsa could not hand over because Princess tower is not complete which obviously is not the case.

This although it has its advantages naturally has its drawbacks as ALL permits will have to be submitted separately an will be approved separately, thus slowing down construction speed, this would be my feeling as to why the hotel tower has not started. DM, Civil Defence and Emaar will make Select have to comply with far more regulations than they would for a normal residential tower. Hence the speed at which Silverine will have progressed.

My honest opinion to Everyone on this forum is forget completion dates (I know its hard thing to accept) just so long as your property is being built try and stay positive, the government are currently doing everything in their power to slow progress on projects from behind the scenes to limit supply. They continually change regulation at the drop of a hat and developers have to comply.

As I said good luck, lets see what the next few years bring.

Agree, plenty more to worry about than handovers that are years off. Welcome to the forum and good luck Sunday, we will be there.........:banana:

you say you know about construction!! very doubtful.

these "were" three separate plots. once merged, they are one and treated as one by the authorities. in fact, if they were separate, Select would not be able to build BC as is today (each tower would have to be separate with its own compound wall, podium, basement parking, etc.)

handover cannot be separate because the hotel and towers are one project with shared podium, basement parking, etc.

FWIW is right, no handover until the authorities deem all three towers safe and ready for occupation.

amazing how investors expectations got so low today that a completion will be enough, even if after 4-5 years from the original completion date, which is highly likely with BC.

attitudes like this will lead to developers screwing investors and getting away with it as long as they, some day or another, will finish the project!



Bay Central was originally 3 plots 8V (West),8X (Central) and 8W (Hotel Tower). Now in one respect Select have been VERY clever as it means that actually they can in fact hand over the Central and West Tower before the East Tower is complete.

aren't you the one who called me stupid few months ago and said Select is right and everything is fine with the company, only to file a complaint against them with RERA recently!!! now who is the moron here!!! Thanks for that. Your eloquent way is a pleasure and very mature. I look forward to our days sitting at BC as best mates and neighbours!!!

you guys must be blind or something, you post pictures that there is a "push" in the construction when there are only about 20 workers onsite! you can't be that much in denial!

AGAIN, PICTURES SPEAK LOUDER THAN WORDS!

Glover - Two differencies between you and me.
I DO NOT think everything is a conspiracy and accept the reasons for delays coupled with company learning as they go. SP are NOT the first company to incurr lengthy delays - palm Jumeirah for example - I knew this before i bought and accept things will be late. I have two units, as you know, one to stay in and one to rent out or sell...depends on market at the time. I have my finances in place to pay for my two bed on SPP and also have four years payments [in dirhams] for my one bed on LPP.
That said i don't just accept things and get on with life. My one and only concern and reason for my RERA complaint is simple. I think SG should have offered a longer payment holiday as i would rather get the interest. I am still very passionate about this issue and have regular contact with SP on same. Like slowhand i believe that open communications with SP are better than childish ranting and raving. Unfortunately people like slowhand and me just deal with situations differently from you and co. Thats not to say either is right...just different. However anytime we try and post something you accuse us of being involved in THE consiracy...childish. You have to understand we are all different. I hope you are able to hold out and things work out for you...
In the meantime i would like to say i think there is progress on site and with the world and Dubai as it is at present this is good enough for me. I think if they continue at this pace we are on target for Dec 2011.

^^^^ see that's your problem, you don't see how manipulative, deceptive, and misleading this developer is! there is a pattern in all their developments, and only the blind would not recognize it. you are definitely in that category.

and with your attitude and others accepting delays with no substantial payment freezes to correspond with construction progress, Select will just continue this deception.

the project will finish someday, that i believe. and it will be a great development whence its done. meanwhile, i will never accept long delays without a corresponding freeze in payments. be sure of one thing, i will fight for it as long as i hold my apartments.

one more thing, don't expect from me and others not to respond to any bullshit about progress being better. the West tower has been on hold for the last two months, the hotel piling is not even on, and yet you and others stand by and cheer Select on few promises from them.

right now as things stand, completion in 2012 is on the optimistic side. expect longer delays imo.

2012! 6 Years in the making. Long long time to have a big bundle tied up for especially on spp. I think you have every right to kick up for holidays, 3 months is a joke.

Has anybody on here got their Land Department registration documents? You know the one's we paid 1% of the purchase price for?

I emailed RERA and they told me to email Dubai Land Department: info@dubailand.gov.ae

I urge everyone to do the same.

^^^^ see that's your problem, you don't see how manipulative, deceptive, and misleading this developer is! there is a pattern in all their developments, and only the blind would not recognize it. you are definitely in that category.

and with your attitude and others accepting delays with no substantial payment freezes to correspond with construction progress, Select will just continue this deception.

the project will finish someday, that i believe. and it will be a great development whence its done. meanwhile, i will never accept long delays without a corresponding freeze in payments. be sure of one thing, i will fight for it as long as i hold my apartments.

one more thing, don't expect from me and others not to respond to any bullshit about progress being better. the West tower has been on hold for the last two months, the hotel piling is not even on, and yet you and others stand by and cheer Select on few promises from them.

right now as things stand, completion in 2012 is on the optimistic side. expect longer delays imo.

Research and due diligence form an important part of any potential investment. I believe most people that have invested with SP simply overlooked this simple rule and fell for the non-status payment plans. SP are certainly the most manipulative, deceptive, and misleading bunch I have ever come across - Morrisman being the Chief of staff on this forum.

Whether or not this development is built is one issue. The quality of the final product is what I cant wait to see. I envisage it to be so basic judging by how money hungry the developer is - It certainly would be fitted with the cheapest of products out there.

Hello all, new poster here (although have looked on with interest for a few years). Not personally invested into this project although I do have a bit of property here and there.

So you know Im not going to be a regular poster here however happy to help with the construction knowledge that I do have when Im online

Bay Central was originally 3 plots 8V (West),8X (Central) and 8W (Hotel Tower). Now in one respect Select have been VERY clever as it means that actually they can in fact hand over the Central and West Tower before the East Tower is complete. In principal it is like saying Al Marsa could not hand over because Princess tower is not complete which obviously is not the case.

This although it has its advantages naturally has its drawbacks as ALL permits will have to be submitted separately an will be approved separately, thus slowing down construction speed, this would be my feeling as to why the hotel tower has not started. DM, Civil Defence and Emaar will make Select have to comply with far more regulations than they would for a normal residential tower. Hence the speed at which Silverine will have progressed.

My honest opinion to Everyone on this forum is forget completion dates (I know its hard thing to accept) just so long as your property is being built try and stay positive, the government are currently doing everything in their power to slow progress on projects from behind the scenes to limit supply. They continually change regulation at the drop of a hat and developers have to comply.

As I said good luck, lets see what the next few years bring.

Thanks for your help with the expanation of the permit process. I must confess to slightly dissagreeing with your assessment of the rate of progress at BC versus the rate of progress at Silverene. Rather than speculate as to the difficulties imposed on Select by the authorities, I still rely on my "opinion" that the difference lies in the amount of construction resources allocated to the 2 developments.

I strongly suggest you observe the 2 sites more closely and re examine your thoughts as to whether permit delay is the real reason for the lack of performance at BC, or is it the workforce, plant and equipment, site wellfare and general work ethic all being at about 20% of the level of that evident at Silverene.

I can empathise with your sentiments that investors should forget completion dates so long as there is progress of sorts but this is an impossible expectation of anyone unless the financial demands of the developer are relaxed inline with their pace of construction progress. Herein lies the main probelm with this particular developer. A contract is between 2 parties and should offer protection and comfort to either party.

Has anybody on here got their Land Department registration documents? You know the one's we paid 1% of the purchase price for?

I emailed RERA and they told me to email Dubai Land Department: info@dubailand.gov.ae

I urge everyone to do the same.


thanks for the info... i emailed them.. but the email bounced back.. maybe the email address is wrong?

^^^^ see that's your problem, you don't see how manipulative, deceptive, and misleading this developer is! there is a pattern in all their developments, and only the blind would not recognize it. you are definitely in that category.

and with your attitude and others accepting delays with no substantial payment freezes to correspond with construction progress, Select will just continue this deception.

the project will finish someday, that i believe. and it will be a great development whence its done. meanwhile, i will never accept long delays without a corresponding freeze in payments. be sure of one thing, i will fight for it as long as i hold my apartments.

one more thing, don't expect from me and others not to respond to any bullshit about progress being better. the West tower has been on hold for the last two months, the hotel piling is not even on, and yet you and others stand by and cheer Select on few promises from them.

right now as things stand, completion in 2012 is on the optimistic side. expect longer delays imo.

OK...

I can empathise with your sentiments that investors should forget completion dates so long as there is progress of sorts but this is an impossible expectation of anyone unless the financial demands of the developer are relaxed inline with their pace of construction progress. Herein lies the main probelm with this particular developer. A contract is between 2 parties and should offer protection and comfort to either party.

At last...i can 100% agree with this well stated point of view. I knew we would get there one day!

thanks for the info... i emailed them.. but the email bounced back.. maybe the email address is wrong?

Strange that it did not work. I got the address from here:

http://www.dubailand.gov.ae/ld_website/english/Misc/Contact_US_English.aspx

Email:info@dubailand.gov.ae

your last point is correct. I am a realist hence my view point. The negative ones are short of money or grumpy old men (see BBC program) but without the humour or disappointed because they were turned down for a job and you can see why now or trying, unsuccessfully, to be interesting because they have difficulty getting their regular acquaintances to listen anymore because they are boring. Move on, get a life.

Glover is one of the ones that only a few short months ago was boasting about how he had 4 units on LPP and WE were all silly not to do the same as him as he would make fortunes from his investment. What happened to that guy with the positive attitude?

You 2 are either plants or plonkers. So fess up which is it?

One would think if the project is officially delayed by 1 year ( we all know it will be longer) by SP should not the payment schedule also be defered by one year? It would certainly calm a lot of investors down and I am not quite sure why they do not do this.....

Strange that it did not work. I got the address from here:

http://www.dubailand.gov.ae/ld_website/english/Misc/Contact_US_English.aspx

Email:info@dubailand.gov.ae

just sent another email i think its gone.. lets see what they have too say..

Anybody any further news on payment holidays?

Also...Got this photo which shows new entrance to BC which i have been told was part of the reason for the delay...Re-design of full site to accomodate hotel in east tower. Was initially central. Got it from SG in Dubai. Anybody seen it before?

http://i41.tinypic.com/3484w3r.jpg

What floor number do the apartments start in towers? Is it floor 1 on top of podium or floor 3 [for example] Trying to work out if apartment on floor 30 for example is 30 + podium[3? or 5?] or 30.

One would think if the project is officially delayed by 1 year ( we all know it will be longer) by SP should not the payment schedule also be defered by one year? It would certainly calm a lot of investors down and I am not quite sure why they do not do this.....


As an answer to your reasonable question about the payment schedule, I quote below the post of an investor:

On Feb 25, 12:58
Today I had a call from SELECT GROUPS marketing arm, based in the UK.
Essentially they have said that unless I make a payment by April 1st 2009,
they will terminate my contract and I loose the 16% deposit (£93,000)…..

Sorry I forgot to tell you that they’re talking about Aquitania !! which is about to be completed in the next …… century.

^^^^ they cannot terminate the contract without going through a process and by law, it will be RERA who would eventually decide if they can terminate the contract or not, irrespective of the contract he signed!! the law passed last year supersedes the contract, and the head of RERA has repeatedly said that no contract will be canceled without going through RERA first.

Anybody any further news on payment holidays?

Also...Got this photo which shows new entrance to BC which i have been told was part of the reason for the delay...Re-design of full site to accomodate hotel in east tower. Was initially central. Got it from SG in Dubai. Anybody seen it before?

http://i41.tinypic.com/3484w3r.jpg

What floor number do the apartments start in towers? Is it floor 1 on top of podium or floor 3 [for example] Trying to work out if apartment on floor 30 for example is 30 + podium[3? or 5?] or 30.
I have not seen this photo before - do you have anymore especially of the interior of the building. Thks

Anybody any further news on payment holidays?

Also...Got this photo which shows new entrance to BC which i have been told was part of the reason for the delay...Re-design of full site to accomodate hotel in east tower. Was initially central. Got it from SG in Dubai. Anybody seen it before?

http://i41.tinypic.com/3484w3r.jpg

What floor number do the apartments start in towers? Is it floor 1 on top of podium or floor 3 [for example] Trying to work out if apartment on floor 30 for example is 30 + podium[3? or 5?] or 30.
I have not seen this photo before - do you have anymore especially of the interior of the building. Thks

^^ ive seen that picture and i posted it on here few months ago..

[QUOTE=glover;32872244]you say you know about construction!! very doubtful.QUOTE]

Actually I said I know a BIT about construction! My my what a great way to make friends and influence people.

Im 90% sure that the Central and West Towers WERE Merged however not the hotel tower. You would have to contact the developer or Emaar for further clarification.

I can feel myself being sucked in already and I promised myself that would not happen! Ah well

Talk it all with a pinch of salt.

[QUOTE=glover;32872244]
I can feel myself being sucked in already and I promised myself that would not happen! Ah well

:lol:

Welcome onboard THFC, please keep posting as your construction knowledge is really useful. We need as much info as posssible about this development. :)

i guess you didn't read my post. by municipality regulations, two separate plots cannot have shared podium etc. so by the sheer fact of the hotel being part of the residential podium, this should tell you that all three plots have been merged. otherwise, each plot would have to have its own podium, compound wall etc. [QUOTE=glover;32872244]you say you know about construction!! very doubtful.QUOTE]

Im 90% sure that the Central and West Towers WERE Merged however not the hotel tower. You would have to contact the developer or Emaar for further clarification.

Good News...

Marriott International has announced aggressive global expansion plans over the next five years, including 30 new hotels in the Gulf region.

The growth plans by 2014 include 17 new properties in the UAE, nine in Saudi Arabia, three in Qatar and one in Bahrain.

The hotel giant also plans one hotel in Egypt, one in Algeria as well as 19 new hotels in China, 23 in India, eight in Thailand, five in the Caribbean and Latin America, five in France, six in the UK and six in Mexico.

The announcement comes as the global economic slowdown hits the region's hotel trade, in particular, in the UAE where hotels have slashed room rates in a bid to stimulate business.

The Marriott International's pipeline of hotels under construction, awaiting conversion or approved for development currently totals about 130,000 rooms worldwide.

The company expects its worldwide system to encompass nearly 600,000 rooms by year-end 2009.

Marriott Executive Apartments, the upscale serviced apartment brand of Marriott International, is expected to nearly double in size in the next 36 months, the company added

Hi guys..

does anyone have sold their apartment as i am looking to sale mine and wanted to know what price i shall put on the market...

i know its not right place to market my apartment but just wanted an honest opinion..

i have spoken to SP and they said you can sell it through other agents as i dont need to tie up with them for 3 months anymore...

i have 1 bed type C -696 sq ft apartment on 29 th floor...central tower...expecting near to what i have paid for...i am on Long term Payment Plan...

please pm me

also i dont have bank account in UAE as i am living in UK...is it better to open an account in UAE?? so when you sell your apartment its easy to transfer the money...need advice please....

i know its great development and when it complete it will be great place to live but can not afford anymore ..i can hang on for other 1 year but lets see what kind of offer i am gettig....

any progress pictures which can encourage me to hang on with...

Dubai authorities introduce new investor protection rules

Friday, 27 February 2009 14:21 Mark Dubai - Dubai Property News

Investors gain more protection in Dubai
As criticism of the Dubai authorities continues to grow they have today announced a major change in the way in which property developments and property developers will be monitored and financed in the future. The Real Estate and Regulatory Agency (RERA) seems to be taking a much firmer hold of the property development sector and property developers in particular. They have introduced a number of potentially significant changes which should improve the climate for property investors in the region.

The Dubai property market
In line with worldwide property markets there has been a significant decline in the Dubai property market although this difficult period appears to have revealed a number of significant regulatory weaknesses in the region. Authorities such as the RERA have come in for significant criticism with many people concerned about the lack of protection for investors and laws and regulations which appeared to side with property developers.

While the decline in the general property market in the region is bad enough the significant increase in suspicion and concern about the way the Dubai property market operates has caused further problems. However, the RERA has today announced significant changes which should offer a greater degree of protection for investors in the region.

Changes by the RERA
There have been some significant changes which include: -

Financing the land for off-plan developments
Historically a number of property developers have been in the habit of selling off-plan developments when in many cases they may not even own the land outright at the time of promoting the development. In many ways this allowed property developers to use property investors as "cash cows" to fund their future costs while letting property investors take on a greater degree of risk.

Today's announcement from the RERA confirms that new property developers in Dubai will have to acquire any land outright before selling and promoting an off-plan development. Whether this will impact on the cost of plots in any new off-plan development remains to be seen but it will give new investors confidence that there is actually a backbone to the development, i.e. the land. This will also force property developers to use their own funding prior to promoting a property, increasing the likelihood that developments will be finished on time and increasing the chances of a development being successful.

Financing the construction phase of an off-plan development
As we mentioned above, historically many property developers have been promoting off-plan developments prior to the construction phase which effectively allowed them to use investor’s deposits to finance the initial construction phase which very much simplified their financial liabilities and again transferred the bulk of the risk to investors.

The RERA has again stepped in to tighten up this process with investor protection very much in mind. Future off-plan projects will need to inject a minimum of 20% of the perceived project value before the construction phase can begin. Slowly but surely the introduction of these two financial requirements ensures that there is more backbone to planned developments and the degree of risk to investors is reduced although not outright.

Future property payments
As with the above change to regulations, which will be implemented in March 2009, the RERA has also moved to ensure that future investor payments will need to be linked in some way to the construction phase. This will ensure that property developers who may be financially weakened are not able to obtain access to investor funding without ensuring it would be used in the appropriate manner, i.e. the construction phase. Slowly but surely investors should feel a little more secure that property developers are being forced to take on more of a risk than they have in the past.

Cooling off period
The RERA has postponed the introduction of official new sales agreements in the short term but has stepped in to implement a 15 day cooling off period as seen in many other investment markets. This 15 day cooling off period will allow investors the opportunity to reconsider their positions and their decision to invest with the option to cancel their agreement outright within the first 15 days. This should cut out the number of investors who have historically agreed to participate in new projects in the "heat of the moment". It should also reduce the effects of so-called "hard selling".

Monitoring of property developers
As from next week all RERA approved projects will be monitored on an ongoing basis with details and information made available on the agency's website. This will ensure a greater degree of transparency than many markets around the world and hopefully encourage further property investment as and when markets recover. It will also eliminate the impact of rumours and scaremongering which have become commonplace in some areas of the Internet during the ongoing economic downturn.

It was also interesting to see that when the RERA was initially created there were 870 developers in the Dubai region although this has now been reduced to 427 developers through mergers, takeovers, extinct companies and those who have moved out of the property development industry.

Not all risks have been removed from the Dubai property market!
While the above changes in the regulatory framework and financing of future off-plan developments has been welcomed across the board it is also worth highlighting the fact that the RERA does not believe that all projects officially listed and sanctioned by the agency will be completed on time. At this moment in time the RERA expects 25% of projects to be cancelled, 25% to be consolidated, 25% to be rescheduled and a further 25% to be completed on time.

Conclusion
Slowly but surely we have seen significant changes in the Dubai property market with regards to the regulation of property developers and property investors. It is worth noting that the changes are very much on the side of property investors although the expectations of the RERA with regards to officially sanctioned projects offer a touch of reality, i.e. they will not all be completed.

Property investors will feel the major benefit of the above changes as and when the property market starts to recover although it is encouraging to see that the Dubai authorities are finally waking up to the potential loss of international investors unless their interests are taken seriously.

direct link

http://www.propertycommunity.com/property-in-dubai/202-dubai-authorities-introduce-new-investor-protection-rules.html

West Tower

http://i42.tinypic.com/scxe1x.jpg

Central Tower

http://i44.tinypic.com/w0l0k7.jpg

The positive investors will be pleased with further progress. The negative investors/whingers/snipers will be pleased they have something more to moan about. We all win! :)

^^ thanks for the pictures.. im happy with the progress.. ( these few weeks )

^^ thanks for the pictures.. im happy with the progress.. ( these few weeks )

Me too! Thanks for the pictures Slowhand! :applause:

True Blue - looks like SP/SG/DCE have finally pulled their fingers out...now all we need is some progress on the hotel plot to make me happier...:lol: ohh and if I could get my hands on my land department docs that would be good too.

Giles - you listening?

You 2 are either plants or plonkers. So fess up which is it?

who are you? what do you know about anything? You obviously haven't been reading all the BC posts so either your illiterate or lazy or both. I'll put you in the numpties category. :)

For the record
- the BC developer is amongst the slowest. This is not necessarily because they are incompetent but more likely because they are using investors’ money to fund the whole build and none of theirs
- BC is making continual progress albeit too slow for investors’ liking and will get built
- handover is likely to be 2012 maybe 2011. TBTB can't be bothered enlightening us with his wisdom with a plan so we can better judge when handover will be
- the developer is not really interested in investors. They are proceeding at their pace not ours
- there is nothing in practice we can do about this. There have been several initiatives by people on this thread but none has come to much
- in practice only RERA can pressure the developer
- the marina is looking better and better each day and will get better still (look at some of the recent photos on other threads). It will turn out to be a good if not great investment in the medium term.

The wise ones realised all this sometime ago and have chilled out. As did some Torch and the Point investors who went through this experience earlier than with BC. The penny hasn't dropped with newcomers, dullards and numpties as yet.

Whingers, snipers, trouble causers, people who overextended themselves can't stop themselves whinging because they have nothing better to do or they have got themselves in financial difficulties. That’s it really. :)

West Tower

The positive investors will be pleased with further progress. The negative investors/whingers/snipers will be pleased they have something more to moan about. We all win! :)

Excellent photos and i am happy to see further progress.

who are you? what do you know about anything? You obviously haven't been reading all the BC posts so either your illiterate or lazy or both. I'll put you in the numpties category. :)


And also good summary for foxy. Thought i would comment as i was the other "plant or plonker!

the pictures have given me a little hope to hang around with my apartment for a while...:dizzy:

the site look tidy and will may see some progress on hotel tower....

its investors like us, the realistic ones who face facts and confront them and push for change that make any developer take notice, not investors like you who burry their heads in the sand and, to comfort themselves, cheerlead them on any appearance of progress.

handover is 2012 minimum. imagine when this project will be completed if all investors where like you, "positive" investors living in lalaland!

do yourself a favor, STOP attacking other people and focus on helping out on how to get this project completed ASAP and push for a payment freeze to correspond with delays. only then you will earn the name a "positive" investor. as it stands now, you are only a mouthpiece for Select.

just go check the threads of all their other developments and you will see how big of a screw up this developer is! but hey, lalaland feels better!


The positive investors will be pleased with further progress. The negative investors/whingers/snipers will be pleased they have something more to moan about. We all win! :)

^^
you have to understand glover for some people this is the biggest, most exciting investment they have done. From a month ago when people believed it would not be built to it actually rising is a hude relief to people, including myself. I will take 2012 instead of nothing......

its investors like us, the realistic ones who face facts and confront them and push for change that make any developer take notice, not investors like you who burry their heads in the sand and, to comfort themselves, cheerlead them on any appearance of progress.

do yourself a favor, STOP attacking other people and focus on helping out on how to get this project completed ASAP and push for a payment freeze to correspond with delays. only then you will earn the name a "positive" investor. as it stands now, you are only a mouthpiece for Select.

How arrogant are you?
To summarize your point...
Don't have an opinion that differs from Glover and co. or i will lambast you.
Keep it real. People are more relieved than anything else. And there has been a big improvement in the last few months.

What do YOU suggest we do to "confront them and push for change that make any developer take notice"? And how do you know we are not...because we don't make announcements on here!

Question for Glover and co. - When a country attacks another! When a terrorist strikes! When a mugger gets their victim! Do they announce it on a lonely hearts forum or do they deny while all the time planning it?
Maybe thats why you are in such a mess Glover...a complete lack of stratedgy and understanding.

Finally...for now anyway...i bought into this developement 18 months ago - later than most probably. At the time i was told that there was a complete redesign of the site as the hotel tower was being moved from central to east. I was also told to ignore the renders of the entrance as that was completely changed too. I was informed by Mathew of SG in Dubai that the likely hood was of an 18 month to two year delay in handover. This might go along way to expain why i, and some others have a different outlook from the original investors. Just a thought.

^^
you have to understand glover for some people this is the biggest, most exciting investment they have done. From a month ago when people believed it would not be built to it actually rising is a hude relief to people, including myself. I will take 2012 instead of nothing......

Good point. But watch out for the snipers. You are not allowed to be upbeat.

^^
Hope u guys have your daily dose of Weetabix. Another 4+ years to go.
I expected the 3 towers to share a common podium but the current construction work suggests that each tower stands as a separate entity. Is this right?

^^
I expected the 3 towers to share a common podium but the current construction work suggests that each tower stands as a separate entity. Is this right?

C'mon...you must be at it!!!

http://i41.tinypic.com/3484w3r.jpg

^^
Exactly ... A common podium linking all towers if I am interpreting the pix correctly. Progress so far suggests two separate standalone towers.

Doesn't look like a common podium to me. The towers seem to be coming out of the ground on their own foundations with a common interconnected lobby/entrance. Nevertheless a separate handover will be out of the question IMO.

How arrogant are you?
To summarize your point...
Don't have an opinion that differs from Glover and co. or i will lambast you.
Keep it real. People are more relieved than anything else. And there has been a big improvement in the last few months.

What do YOU suggest we do to "confront them and push for change that make any developer take notice"? And how do you know we are not...because we don't make announcements on here!

Question for Glover and co. - When a country attacks another! When a terrorist strikes! When a mugger gets their victim! Do they announce it on a lonely hearts forum or do they deny while all the time planning it?
Maybe thats why you are in such a mess Glover...a complete lack of stratedgy and understanding.

Finally...for now anyway...i bought into this developement 18 months ago - later than most probably. At the time i was told that there was a complete redesign of the site as the hotel tower was being moved from central to east. I was also told to ignore the renders of the entrance as that was completely changed too. I was informed by Mathew of SG in Dubai that the likely hood was of an 18 month to two year delay in handover. This might go along way to expain why i, and some others have a different outlook from the original investors. Just a thought.


Good point. But watch out for the snipers. You are not allowed to be upbeat.

And previously;

My language too...We should ban all the scaremongers from this site. At worst i suspect 6 months late.

There is no consistency in your statements, if you don't already work for DS maybe you should apply:)

true blue.. how doo you think the site build going.. any comments from your contruction knowledge.. thanks

For a site this size the construction is under resourced and appears to be operating on daylight hours only. As a result the progress is slow.

I have just read on the torch thread, that at least 50 people on the LPP will be handing their apartments back to Select Property Group.

This does not inspire me with confidence, and I am far from being 'chilled out'...

Can we have your take on the situ slowhand?

Today Friday:
http://img214.imageshack.us/img214/3773/cimg2961.jpg (http://img214.imageshack.us/my.php?image=cimg2961.jpg)

^^ thanks for the picture... west tower has risen even more just above ground level

For a site this size the construction is under resourced and appears to be operating on daylight hours only. As a result the progress is slow.

I agree with this but at least progress is being made.

I have just read on the torch thread, that at least 50 people on the LPP will be handing their apartments back to Select Property Group.

This does not inspire me with confidence, and I am far from being 'chilled out'...

Now looks like the contract is being changed....

Well I certainly hope that all of you who are trying to bring the ship down with you fail, as some investors are now on the final straight, 1 more year:cheers:

The issue with 02 unit size hasn't cleared up, SP don't understand why 12 sqm is missing from size & will contact TS for clarification.

& yes anjam I've heard of the 15.3 amendment:banana:, Great if its agreed as it would stop me going to a solicitor

^^
What amendment are they making to 15.3?

Anjam or Shaffar.

Please can you share details of this ammendment as I have not heard (although been out of the loop for a few weeks) thanks.

Anyone know what the changes are?

I have just read on the torch thread, that at least 50 people on the LPP will be handing their apartments back to Select Property Group.

This does not inspire me with confidence, and I am far from being 'chilled out'...

The number 50 is really a guess by someone. No one knows what the figure will be. I doubt that SG would allow SP to release such sensitive info.

How many apartments are there in the Torch? I am guessing at 700 (is it 70 residential floors at 10 per floor?) so 50 is not a large % of the total even if the 50 is true. I would think many LPP investors thought at the outset that they were almost guaranteed to make a great return in Dubai and they could sell out or flip anytime even before handover. Consequently many would have stretched themselves financially to invest. They probably didn't buy forward. Many now will be hurting because of the higher risks they took. Some will play online poker and lose at that as well (95% of players do!). On the other hand I would imagine there will be investors, especially those whose currency is tied to the US$, would be interested in buying at original cost in the Torch given handover is perhaps only 12 to 15 months away. If I could buy at 7.2 AED to the £ which is rate when I bought into BC I would be interested in buying into the Torch.

Almost of the Torch buyers are Brits and the exchange rate change makes it more interesting to handover now. Only 50% of BC buyers are Brits and less so in later developments.

I think the risk of the Torch not completing is close to zero. Neither SG or RERA would want this under any circumstances. Extra short term finance to cover the remaining building costs not covered by Escrow account balances, if it is needed, would be found. As a last resort, if necessary, my guess would be SG would be slow to pay out (with RERA’s blessing) just to get the project finished as this is relatively close. This would be on the grounds they had to sell the apartments before they could make a refund as they had insufficient funds to do otherwise. Bear in mind that each development is likely to be carried out through a separate company set up for this sole purpose. There will not be one pot of funds in which all investors’ funds for all SG's projects is put. Each development will have a separate pot. So I reckon those who hand back apartments will only get a refund if there are sufficient funds in the pot to make the refund AND fund completion or, if there isn’t, as and when the apartment is resold. In other words, no real consequences to investors who don’t want to hand back.

I firmly believe that the marina is and will be a stunning place to live and property prices were cheap when we bought. I don’t know what prices where like in the Torch but £130,000 for a 1 bed apartment in BC with a full marina view in an up and coming up place like Dubai is cheap. A similar apartment in Melbourne for example would be £200,000+ without the fabulous marina surroundings. Melbourne is a great place and my favourite but there are visa restrictions, property buying restrictions, it is not a tax free environment etc unlike Dubai. There is plenty of demand in the rental market especially for the Marina and I think that Torch and BC investors will get a 8 to 10%+ return in year one. Sounds like a good investment to me. :)

i share your concern FWIW. i think with Torch apartments being returned, investors holding payments in the yet unbuilt Botanica, West Avenue, the World developments, and Pacifica, Select will be cash strapped, which could threaten even projects under construction.

Select is really acting real stupid here and against their own interest. they should revise their payment policy and be a lot more flexible about payments. otherwise, investors would simply not pay, and RERA will stand with these investors in the end because the developer is way way behind schedule in all their developments.

I'll say it S-L-O-W-L-Y for you...

It's 50 PEOPLE, not 50 apartments - MisterMark is handing back 3 units! So I am not really concerned at what percentage of the building this is.

I think MisterMark also believes the Marina is a great place to live/invest. That's why he is handing back 3 torch units to SP, so that he can buy something that is already built and can be leased out asap...

And in these economic times, I can't blame him.

Could you really argue against him handing back his units and then buying in say JBR and earning income for 2 years or so before someone get's their torch keys?


The number 50 is really a guess by someone. No one knows what the figure will be. I doubt that SG would allow SP to release such sensitive info.

How many apartments are there in the Torch? I am guessing at 700 (is it 70 residential floors at 10 per floor?) so 50 is not a large % of the total even if the 50 is true. I would think many LPP investors thought at the outset that they were almost guaranteed to make a great return in Dubai and they could sell out or flip anytime even before handover. Consequently many would have stretched themselves financially to invest. They probably didn't buy forward. Many now will be hurting because of the higher risks they took. Some will play online poker and lose at that as well (95% of players do!). On the other hand I would imagine there will be investors, especially those whose currency is tied to the US$, would be interested in buying at original cost in the Torch given handover is perhaps only 12 to 15 months away. If I could buy at 7.2 AED to the £ which is rate when I bought into BC I would be interested in buying into the Torch.

Almost of the Torch buyers are Brits and the exchange rate change makes it more interesting to handover now. Only 50% of BC buyers are Brits and less so in later developments.

I think the risk of the Torch not completing is close to zero. Neither SG or RERA would want this under any circumstances. Extra short term finance to cover the remaining building costs not covered by Escrow account balances, if it is needed, would be found. As a last resort, if necessary, my guess would be SG would be slow to pay out (with RERA’s blessing) just to get the project finished as this is relatively close. This would be on the grounds they had to sell the apartments before they could make a refund as they had insufficient funds to do otherwise. Bear in mind that each development is likely to be carried out through a separate company set up for this sole purpose. There will not be one pot of funds in which all investors’ funds for all SG's projects is put. Each development will have a separate pot. So I reckon those who hand back apartments will only get a refund if there are sufficient funds in the pot to make the refund AND fund completion or, if there isn’t, as and when the apartment is resold. In other words, no real consequences to investors who don’t want to hand back.

I firmly believe that the marina is and will be a stunning place to live and property prices were cheap when we bought. I don’t know what prices where like in the Torch but £130,000 for a 1 bed apartment in BC with a full marina view in an up and coming up place like Dubai is cheap. A similar apartment in Melbourne for example would be £200,000+ without the fabulous marina surroundings. Melbourne is a great place and my favourite but there are visa restrictions, property buying restrictions, it is not a tax free environment etc unlike Dubai. There is plenty of demand in the rental market especially for the Marina and I think that Torch and BC investors will get a 8 to 10%+ return in year one. Sounds like a good investment to me. :)

I'll say it S-L-O-W-L-Y for you...

It's 50 PEOPLE, not 50 apartments - MisterMark is handing back 3 units! So I am not really concerned at what percentage of the building this is.

I think MisterMark also believes the Marina is a great place to live/invest. That's why he is handing back 3 torch units to SP, so that he can buy something that is already built and can be leased out asap...

And in these economic times, I can't blame him.

Could you really argue against him handing back his units and then buying in say JBR and earning income for 2 years or so before someone get's their torch keys?

^^
Makes sense .. with 1BR apts in Marina Promenade, Park Island and even on the Palm Jumeriah available on the market for 1.1M, I think he could buy in any of these completed developments and be left with some spare change.

Every one for himself. SP have being very good at this i.e looking out for their own pockets, so if investors bounce from the projects ...Tough luck

You can see a little bit of Bay Central in this pic of our now on-hold neighbour Pier 8: :runaway:

top section covered by plastic, ON HOLD ...

07/March/2009

http://i42.tinypic.com/nzoyol.jpg

You can see a little bit of Bay Central in this pic of our now on-hold neighbour Pier 8: :runaway:

Not the only Marina tower to be put ON HOLD lately. http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showpost.php?p=33260172&postcount=1705

Shhhhhhhhh Dont tell True Blue.

All looking quiet solid for The Point then! Anyone fancy a deal PM me.

^^
Makes sense .. with 1BR apts in Marina Promenade, Park Island and even on the Palm Jumeriah available on the market for 1.1M, I think he could buy in any of these completed developments and be left with some spare change.

Every one for himself. SP have being very good at this i.e looking out for their own pockets, so if investors bounce from the projects ...Tough luck

that is if SP/SG return the monry. they can drag it on to their liking:ohno:

Not the only Marina tower to be put ON HOLD lately. http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showpost.php?p=33260172&postcount=1705

Shhhhhhhhh Dont tell True Blue.

It is interesting that when a project slows to the speed of BC that it is immediately put on hold.

I remember proving this project was effectively on hold and no moderator batted an eyelid.

What ever happened to the hotel piling that was starting soon?:dunno:

Today Friday:
http://img214.imageshack.us/img214/3773/cimg2961.jpg (http://img214.imageshack.us/my.php?image=cimg2961.jpg)

Pleth thanks for the picture. More progress each new day. Should be up to road level by end of March.

The doom sayers won't see anything positive in this. Must be miserable being miserable all the time.

Looks like Dumb and Dumber have taken over this thread so I will not bother:bash:

^^
Makes sense .. with 1BR apts in Marina Promenade, Park Island and even on the Palm Jumeriah available on the market for 1.1M, I think he could buy in any of these completed developments and be left with some spare change.

Every one for himself. SP have being very good at this i.e looking out for their own pockets, so if investors bounce from the projects ...Tough luck

As I said if there is insufficient money in the Torch's pot to finish the Torch after paying out the handbacks then the handbacks won't be paid out until the apartments are resold. FWIW, it doesn't matter how many or few investors want to do this ie 50 people or 50 apartments it doesn't matter. Why? The Torch developer is a standalone limited company ie not a person or a group and will be under no obligation to put more money in. Unless they choose to put more money in, the developer are likely to have to say that they have insufficient funds to pay out handbacks and complete. ALL the Torch investors will then have a claim for breach of contract and ALL the Torch investors will want to handback so they are on equal footing. In these circumstances the developer ie the standalone company will be insolvent and how much do you think the investors will then get back? Not very much if anything. Select Group might want this standalone company to be insolvent because they would then form a newco and buy back the incomplete building for not very much from the liquidator and make even more money when they complete. RERA wouldn't want this. Company bosses are letting their companies go bust everyday in the UK now and leaving banks, outside investors, trade creditors and HMRC out of pocket before buying the business back and carrying on without all that debt owing. Unfair it might be but legal nevertheless.

As long as the development is complete RERA will be happy and, only because of the economic circumstances, will not support investors who want to pull out even if the contract allows it. RERA will do nothing that will harm the prospects for completion. That is all RERA is interested at present making sure all started projects are completed and investors don't get ripped off. They want to protect and builds Dubai's reputation as a safe place to invest. This is of paramount importance to them. Be grateful for RERA.

Please realise as has been said many times before on SSC by several contributors your contract is with the developer not SP. SP is a standalone UK company with no legal connection whatsoever to the separate developers or SG. They act on an arms legth basis as sales agent and conveyer of information. You can sue SP if you want but be sure of your grounds. They are not responsible for what the developer does.

The reality is that because of
- the legal structures of SP and the separate developers ie all independent standalone companies with no cross holdings
- the clauses in contracts we all signed with each separate developer
- the Dubai authorities allowed in the past (but not now) any developer to use investors monies to wholly finance a project as I believe SG has done with the Point, the Torch, BC etc. There is nothing illegal in this. It makes sense to do this if the authorities allowed it which they did at the time

there is not much in reality you can do. If you think there is educate yourself on company and contract law by talking to a corporate lawyer or someone with similar knowledge.

The die was cast from the outset. The delays we are experiencing were built into the starting plans and were always going to happen. The set up of the companies involved was such that you could never in practice do anything about it. It is worth repeating, the die was cast from the outset. We didn't know this. They did. We are all wiser now.

I do not rejoice in any of this as I am like most of you on the receiving end as I have invested in BC. We might as well understand however what is and what isn't possible in the circumstances.

Because of SG's other Dubai investments and because of RERA investors will not get ripped off but they will have to wait until the Point developer and the Torch developer and the BC developer finish off the projects at their pace.

Your best chance is to make a fuss with RERA who might instruct the developer to delay further installments but if this threatens completion then I don't think this will happen.

That is why I am chilled out. I am pleased to see continual construction progress however slow some of you might think it is. I'll have to wait but I am sure I will get my apartments. I see no point in bleating about what I can't do anything about. If you better understood the realities more of you might come to the same conclusion.

Where is Morris? He sees the light. :)

^^
You dont fool me .. You are Morris :ohno:.

Dear Slowhand,

I don't give two f**ks how the company is arranged or organised. As far as I am concerned my contract is with Dubai Select, paid for and signed for in their Dubai offices. Also advertised as the only ESCROW compliant development at launch time.

I am not some numpty that bought an apartment from them in Manchester before even coming to Dubai. I am also not so dumb as to buy an apartment in JBR from them - why didn't you buy it from Dubai Properties like me? Why did you need to use a middleman? Was it because you were brainwashed or just late to the party?

I am sure the Dubai legal system will uphold my rights eventually. I have enough money to see this through to the bitter end, as I have always planned for the worst case scenario.

God helps those that help themselves first. Think about it and then realise that you have already lost out because you have weak will power and cannot work through the fog. Fight or Flight? I know what I will do, you want to runaway that's your choice.

When Select do a deal with me and the others on here that stand up for our collective rights, you will be begging to be cut in.

SP have bitten off more than they can chew with me and a few other very serious investors that actually give a damn. Not everyone that complains about the situation is hard up you know.

You should stop being a cheerleader and use your obvious intelligence to break out of their 'control'.

Peace out.

^^^^ the funny thing he is now talking like an expert about what RERA will or will not do, and providing the same advice to investors in other Select properties. check the Botanica thread. that development is a cesspool now, and Select is still demanding payments. he is discouraging investors from taking real and serious action, because he knows better. what a joke.

Not the only Marina tower to be put ON HOLD lately. http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showpost.php?p=33260172&postcount=1705

Shhhhhhhhh Dont tell True Blue.
What a Shame best tower in Marina (apart from BC )

08/March/2009

Bay Central

http://i43.tinypic.com/2wbvq1c.jpg

http://i43.tinypic.com/259bngk.jpg

http://i43.tinypic.com/2ufrhpz.jpg

Thanks Imre...^^

Reasonably good progress...site looks busy with the workers and equipments...good sign....

i am happy with it...

central tower pictures please...

Today

http://www.quetschluft.de/dubai/300_2583_qa.jpg

http://www.quetschluft.de/dubai/300_2584_qa.jpg

http://www.quetschluft.de/dubai/300_2586_qa.jpg

Nice to see progress-- good or bad --the "red is moving up" - 10 floors by xmas is possible ?

^^

without havin any knowledge in contruction..::nuts:i had to compare with the Torch and The Point to find out how the work will progress from current stage....

i think The Point was in similar stage in DEC07 (as per pictures posted by Imre)...so to achieve 10 floor by DEC09 should not be any problem...

We also need to see the progress of the Hotel tower as well

Experts comments are welcome..

great pictures thanks imre and desert driver..

is the central tower rising?

how easy would it be too half complete the poidum with out the third tower?

happy with the pace.. :banana: but would still like longer payment hoilday :ohno:

happy with the pace.. :banana: but would still like longer payment hoilday :ohno:

I'm happy if you're happy:)

BTW any chance of a loan of £50k for a little while, or have you already given it to some other trusty sole?

^^

yeah ive given it too Cayan your best buddies..

deleted

^^

without havin any knowledge in contruction..::nuts:i had to compare with the Torch and The Point to find out how the work will progress from current stage....

i think The Point was in similar stage in DEC07 (as per pictures posted by Imre)...so to achieve 10 floor by DEC09 should not be any problem...

We also need to see the progress of the Hotel tower as well

Experts comments are welcome..

That's how I came to my conclusion - they could top Out by Dec10 - HANDOVER DEC2011 ?

Change title to under construction - thx

the Torch and the Point don't have a huge shared podium like BC. Add a minimum of 6-9 months for the podium alone.

If it takes 6 months for podium ( March to August), can achieve 10 floor by december....

i am positive...but all depends on consistancy as it should not be like 200+ workers on one day and 30+ on other....


need pictures-- how many workers are there??? any idea

cant they build up the tower and work on podium as the same time..?

^^i think we should take an honest openion from our experts...

http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=501854

was just going through website and found "Manhatten"project in JV....was just comparing the last pictures on that thread...

i found the wall was completley covered with metal ---and the ground level is completley poured and from top to bottom proper concrete and metal work.....i have seen same thing at Silverlane as well....

just surprised...there should not be much diffrence between two construction sites as the basic methods are same...

i really need experts openion --

i am confused:ohno:

Dear Slowhand,

I don't give two f**ks how the company is arranged or organised. As far as I am concerned my contract is with Dubai Select, paid for and signed for in their Dubai offices. Also advertised as the only ESCROW compliant development at launch time.

I am not some numpty that bought an apartment from them in Manchester before even coming to Dubai. I am also not so dumb as to buy an apartment in JBR from them - why didn't you buy it from Dubai Properties like me? Why did you need to use a middleman? Was it because you were brainwashed or just late to the party?

I am sure the Dubai legal system will uphold my rights eventually. I have enough money to see this through to the bitter end, as I have always planned for the worst case scenario.

God helps those that help themselves first. Think about it and then realise that you have already lost out because you have weak will power and cannot work through the fog. Fight or Flight? I know what I will do, you want to runaway that's your choice.

When Select do a deal with me and the others on here that stand up for our collective rights, you will be begging to be cut in.

SP have bitten off more than they can chew with me and a few other very serious investors that actually give a damn. Not everyone that complains about the situation is hard up you know.

You should stop being a cheerleader and use your obvious intelligence to break out of their 'control'.

Peace out.


Hey, relax I am on the same side.

The developer hasn't taken into account the stress their actions in delaying all their projects 2/3 years is having on many investors.

I have chosen to deal with this by accepting the delayed outcome. My investment is long term so this is not that difficult for me. From my detailed enquires, I can't see an effective course of action except to contact RERA. I have a professional business qualification so I am used to considering company structures and legal action and the like. Sometimes your case is a just one but in practice for all sorts of reasons you won't get a result. In the last resort, SG could just fold BCD (the BC developer) without putting any of their money in. SG would then look to buy it back cheap from the liquidator with no obligations to current investors. (RERA won't let that happen by the way but won't be sympathetic to investors who contribute to this situation.)

If you work out an effective course of action to change things for the better then great. Let's all discuss what we can do. I have been party is the past to two initiatives. I thought the first involved you FWIW via PMs and the second certainly involved Glover. Nobody could come up with a consensus on action as I recall so we have effectively given up. I subsequently have conducted my own investigations to come up with my conclusions.

I am not interested in becoming a cheer leader for anyone. However there are some people who don't post but read this thread that I think would benefit from reading a range of opinion especially when some of this opinion is based on proper research and ongoing meetings and discussions with key players. Some of the other posts on this thread are just rants or based on a lack of any useful knowledge. I wouldn't mind if they were humourous.

I am surprised you don't realise or perhaps have forgotten that most of what has been said about BC regarding delays, poor coommunication, collecting installments well ahead of progress etc has been said before about the Torch and the Point. In other words it is the same track record but clearer now because more time has passed.

Nice to see progress-- good or bad --the "red is moving up" - 10 floors by xmas is possible ?

thanks for the photos Desert Diver. The first photo shows further progress on both towers since last photos. Looks like the central tower is catching up?

they expect to be able to do a new floor every 5 days. Presumably this is above the podium. How big is the podium?

extract from Ben's recent post on Torch thread

"Once finished it will be great, some of the best bars, nightclubs, restaurants and shops are all within (staggering) walking distance. The Marina walk and JBR walk are both outstanding and the Marina Mall (Waitrows) is great and will get better once things pick up again."

something to look forward to :)

also from recent posts on the Point thread

"Quote:
Originally Posted by Stone803
The rate this is going Im beginning to think June is a real possibility for completion now.

Don't get too optimistsic now Stone !
Although there has been huge progress in a couple of months !"

maybe SG are starting to get their fingers out!

What you will see is exactly what we noticed when TP was at this stage. The slip form or red thing as some call it will rise rapidly to about 10 floors and then they prepare the podium levels. This is a massive podium compared to TP and will take months to complete. Then you will see your floors coming at about 1 every 6 or so days.

mr. cheerleader, there is a third attempt now and you will not be part of it for sure unless you stop bashing other investors and observers, and stop your delusions about Select. If Select truly changes and start working with investors in these difficult times, we will all be cheerleaders for them. right now, they are only looking at their own interest and pockets and disregarding investors, something they would get away with if all investors were like you, complacent and too afraid to face reality. the so called research you say you did is bits of information fed to you by Select.

I thought the first involved you FWIW via PMs and the second certainly involved Glover. Nobody could come up with a consensus on action as I recall so we have effectively given up.

mr. cheerleader, there is a third attempt now and you will not be part of it for sure unless you stop bashing other investors and observers, and stop your delusions about Select. If Select truly changes and start working with investors in these difficult times, we will all be cheerleaders for them. right now, they are only looking at their own interest and pockets and disregarding investors, something they would get away with if all investors were like you, complacent and too afraid to face reality. the so called research you say you did is bits of information fed to you by Select.
I, like every other investor , don't understand why SP won't allow for a further payment break in line with delay. This is my one concern and point i would fight over. I am in constant contact with SP over this subject and will continue to do so until my next payments are due...
I would welcome any advise on this subject if anyone has had a more positive result than me.
I don't want involved in anything which will jeopodize the project. I am happy to see progress of any kind and recently i think it is good progress.

Any constructive thoughts welcome...

^^i agree with that....

the progress is good atleast now.....if we get more break in payment...that will be in line...


slowhand,Imre,DD,FWIW,(Glover)(used to take very good pictures-what happen?? any pictures please

deleted

mr. cheerleader, there is a third attempt now and you will not be part of it for sure unless you stop bashing other investors and observers, and stop your delusions about Select. If Select truly changes and start working with investors in these difficult times, we will all be cheerleaders for them. right now, they are only looking at their own interest and pockets and disregarding investors, something they would get away with if all investors were like you, complacent and too afraid to face reality. the so called research you say you did is bits of information fed to you by Select.

There is nothing frightening to face. Reality is we will get our apartments in 2/3/4 years time. That's it. Progress is being made on BC and the Torch and the Point at a faster rate than it was. The likely timescales for BC should become clearer over these coming months.

You have no idea what research I have done and therefore are unable to make a useful observation. None of your observations of my comments are well presented or argued or contribute anything to a better understanding. I wish they were.

There is nothing you have said indicates you understand the legal and company legal structures of SG, SP and the specific developer for BC. There is nothing in what you have said that indicates you understand the importance of these. They dictate what you can and cannot achieve.

You can't point out anything that investors on the Torch or the Point have achieved with the developer despite having a similar but earlier experience than us and despite wanting to bring about a change, can you?

I am sure all the other readers are getting tired of you trying to rubbish my comments and with my replies. We know your view of my posts. You know my view of your posts.

Trying posting something more persuasive or useful to everyone or interesting or funny for a change. Try posting some pictures or what you have discovered about Select or your thoughts about what we should do next or tell a joke. Ranting about my posts is not impressive at any level whereas shedding extra light on something we didn't know about could be.

^^^^^^ right, good research! is that the research that led you to buy a JBR apartment from Select! how deluded can you be!

one thing for sure, your attempts to discourage investors in BC from taking serious action are not working. Is that why you are expanding your efforts to the Botanica now. hey, why don't you try the Torch, they will love to hear your "positive" take on Select.

we have at least three years to go until handover (assuming Select will survive this crisis) and not only you have already decided there is nothing you can do about Select's manipulation and deception, but you are also trying to convince other investors to reach the same conclusion. actually, you think we should be thankful to Select, for at least they are going to finish the project!

There is nothing you have said indicates you understand the legal and company legal structures of SG, SP and the specific developer for BC. There is nothing in what you have said that indicates you understand the importance of these. They dictate what you can and cannot achieve.


^^
This would serve as the element of surprise or would demonstrate the magnitude of SP's deception to investors.

For those who havent seen them model of BC...


http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3544/3347062881_0dd932cb2a_o.jpg

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3437/3347899754_acf2cf8724_o.jpg

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3622/3347899672_b88522b5f0_o.jpg

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3617/3347899588_0546665b41_o.jpg

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3663/3347899386_a3d8666081_b.jpg

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3552/3347899116_766c9f59f5_o.jpg

^^^^^^ right, good research! is that the research that led you to buy a JBR apartment from Select! how deluded can you be!

one thing for sure, your attempts to discourage investors in BC from taking serious action are not working. Is that why you are expanding your efforts to the Botanica now. hey, why don't you try the Torch, they will love to hear your "positive" take on Select.

we have at least three years to go until handover (assuming Select will survive this crisis) and not only you have already decided there is nothing you can do about Select's manipulation and deception, but you are also trying to convince other investors to reach the same conclusion. actually, you think we should be thankful to Select, for at least they are going to finish the project!

Glover...Why are you always harrasring and bullying people? Slowhand is in know way attempting to discourage investors he is merely dealing with things in his own way.
He has not decided there is "nothing he can do" he is attempting to remain up beat while dealing with his problems in the background. We ARE in the same position as you and feel the SAME as you. We choose to deal with it differently ~ surely thats allowed!
Please offer valid points of view or advice [as i ask continually] rather than just picking on people because they have an opinion.
What are you doing to help "the cause" and what do you ask / suggest we do. If you are embarresed being helpfull openly why not PM me instead.

^^^^^^ right, good research! is that the research that led you to buy a JBR apartment from Select! how deluded can you be!

one thing for sure, your attempts to discourage investors in BC from taking serious action are not working. Is that why you are expanding your efforts to the Botanica now. hey, why don't you try the Torch, they will love to hear your "positive" take on Select.

we have at least three years to go until handover (assuming Select will survive this crisis) and not only you have already decided there is nothing you can do about Select's manipulation and deception, but you are also trying to convince other investors to reach the same conclusion. actually, you think we should be thankful to Select, for at least they are going to finish the project!

Hey, my JBR apartment has proved to be a great investment. A 14% rental return on cost is good enough for me. You wouldn't know how to work out what was a good investment or a bad one is.

the rest is your words not mine and a negative rant as usual.

you never answer my specific points either because
a. you can't read
b. or you can read but don't understand
b. or you do not want to entertain any other opinion but your own

if you want to harass SG then it is fine by me just carry on - I am not stopping you. I think you will get something but will it be worth the effort?

when are you going to post something of use or of interest or debate properly if you disagree? I get more sense out of my 2 year old nephew.

I'd see a doctor about your obsessional behaviour, I wouldn't want you to go pop.

West Tower (SEE LAST PICTURES FOR COMPARISON WITH 280209 AND 040109)

http://i43.tinypic.com/314pfzd.jpg

http://i39.tinypic.com/hwkh0m.jpg

NOT SURE WHAT IS HANGING DOWN IN THE MIDDLE OF THE RED BIT


Central Tower (SEE LAST PICTURES FOR COMPARISON WITH 280209 AND 040109)

http://i41.tinypic.com/2m34942.jpg

http://i41.tinypic.com/xftizq.jpg


PICTURES FROM 280209 FOR COMPARISON
http://i43.tinypic.com/6j3air.jpg

http://i44.tinypic.com/xm7fqx.jpg


PICTURE FROM 040109 FOR COMPARISON

http://i39.tinypic.com/ve9jbl.jpg

Dear Mary,

Hope you are taking your medicine and resting. Please do not get stressed out by recent events. Just to update you I have had some great input and help from other users of this website.

Copy to: All stakeholders in your companies and not forgetting most importantly and by no means least, the lovely Sarah, The Duchess of York. (Sarah, I feel this episode may be worse than ‘toe-sucking’).

I heard the skunk is strong over there. You must be smoking quite a bit.

Hey, my JBR apartment has proved to be a great investment. A 14% rental return on cost is good enough for me. You wouldn't know how to work out what was a good investment or a bad one.

the rest is your words not mine and a negative rant as usual.

you never answer my specific points either because
a. you can't read
b. or you can read but don't understand
b. or you do not want to entertain any other opinion but your own

if you want to harass SG then it is fine by me just carry on - I am not stopping you.

when are you going to post something of use or of interest or debate properly if you disagree? I get more sense out of my 2 year old nephew.

I'd see a doctor about your obsessional behaviour, I wouldn't want you to go pop.

Too many b's you will get slated.

:applause: Proper pics, well done.

Too many b's you will get slated.

I need to drink more like Morris. He doesn't use too many bs (not b's) :)

Hi guys

A pic from today, not as useful as the ones posted earlier, but hey, I took it so I aint gonna hold it back :)

http://www.quetschluft.de/dubai/300_2719_qa.jpg

[QUOTE=Desert Diver;33518424]Hi guys

A pic from today, not as useful as the ones posted earlier, but hey, I took it so I aint gonna hold it back :)

thanks for the pic. Please keep taking and posting them. Nice to see some palm trees. None where I live.

I think something along the following lines submitted en masse to RERA will bear fruit. Those who want to pursue the Developer direct can do so but at a certain point the Developer may walk away from the project if they consider it is no longer worthwhile.


Dear RERA

I am an investor in Bay Central in the Marina. The developer is Bay Central Developments Limited.

I am writing to complain strongly about
- the project being at least 2 years behind schedule
- developer is expecting payment instalments well ahead of construction progress. I have paid 70% of the purchase price so far and I estimate that construction is 20% complete. We have been offered a 3 month delay on the next scheduled payment but by then I will have paid 90% and construction might be 35% complete
- the developer will not communicate directly with investors and chooses to communicate exclusively through the sales agent (Select Property) who is in effect just a messenger. Efforts are being made to improve communication via the sales agent but this is not an adequate substitute for direct communication.

We would like you to intervene on our behalf and instruct the developer to
- reschedule payments so they are it is in line with construction progress
- issue revised timescales for handover which has been audited by an independent construction consultant as achievable
- communicate directly with investors in future and not via the sales agent
- explain why there has been such a substantial delay in the project and offer some remedy to investors for the loss of use of their properties or loss of rental income as a result of this delay.

Yours sincerely

Note to Glover: If you want to do something different then do it. Others might prefer an approach to RERA but don't get upset again.

This is also good advice from FWIW

1) Complain to RERA about total lack of construction at this site. Use ceo@dubailand.gov.ae and RERA online complaint site here http://rpdubai.ae/rpdubai/welcome - also ask for payment holiday to be made. Make a note of your RERA ref number.
2) Ask Land Department if SP/SG have used your 1% registration fees to register YOUR property. Use phone or info@dubailand.gov.ae
3) Get Land Department Registration docs asap from SP/SG. Do not be fobbed off about the time it takes for the OQQOD system to do its thing.

^^
This would serve as the element of surprise or would demonstrate the magnitude of SP's deception to investors.

If we knew then what we know now no one including me would have invested.

However our money is now invested and we have to deal with the developer ie Bay Central Developments Limited (BCD) as set up and the contract terms we have signed up to.

I don't expect BCD has any money except ours. I don't expect we will be able to force SG to put any money in BCD. Only RERA can force this to change.

On the bright side, look at the great progress between 28/02/09 and 12/03/09 as shown in above pictures. If BC maintains this pace or better then we will see a big visual change over the coming months which will further reassure investors. I am much more optimistic now than I was 6 months ago.
I am sure if we ALL pressed RERA they will give us a further payment delay.

Thank you very much Slowhand and Desert Diver...

Slowhand...thanks for posting pictures as it gives hope to all investors

Rahail Aslam Chairman of Select Property Group


***Message to Investors***


And now, the end is near;
And so I face the final curtain...

My friends and investor’s , I’ll say it clear,
I’ll state my case, of which I’m certain.

I’ve lived a life that’s full, thanks to all your money.
I’ve traveled each and every highway in Dubai
And more, much more than this,
I did it my way.

Regrets, I’ve had a few;
But then again, too few to mention.
I did what I had to do
And saw it through without exemption.
But now my past has caught up with me….

I deviously planned and charted each course;
Each careful step along the byway,
I’ve bribed, cheated and robbed.
But more, much more than this,
I did it my way.

Yes, there were times, I’m sure I knew
When I bit off more than I could chew.
But the allure of so much money was too great
Yet through it all, when there was doubt;
I ate it up and spit it out.
I have to face it all and I need help to stand tall,
But, I’ll do it my way….

I’ve loved endless hookers,
I’ve laughed when you sent in the money,
I am crying because (THEY) know everything and the clocks ticking…..

I’ve not had my fill; my share of money that I’m losing.
It’s all too great…
And now, as my tears subside,

I find it all so amusing……

To think you lot fell for all that;
And may I say – to each and everyone of you I have duped you all and not in a shy way,
No, oh no not me,
I did it in a BIG way…..

For what is a man, what has he got?
If not himself, and no money, then he has naught.

To say the things he truly feels;
‘B----cks’ to you all...
Not the words of one who kneels.
The record will show and I will now have to take the blows

But I will do it my way!

Very funny. How much time on your hands have you got!

Rahail Aslam Chairman of Select Property Group


***Message to Investors***


And now, the end is near;
And so I face the final curtain...



To say the things he truly feels;
‘B----cks’ to you all...
Not the words of one who kneels.
The record will show and I will now have to take the blows

But I will do it my way!

Not really original and total codswallop of course but still it is amusing

08/March/2009

Bay Central

http://i43.tinypic.com/2wbvq1c.jpg

http://i43.tinypic.com/259bngk.jpg

http://i43.tinypic.com/2ufrhpz.jpg

sorry IMRE missed these. Thanks for the pics.

who are you? what do you know about anything? You obviously haven't been reading all the BC posts so either your illiterate or lazy or both. I'll put you in the numpties category. :)

For the record
- the BC developer is amongst the slowest. This is not necessarily because they are incompetent but more likely because they are using investors’ money to fund the whole build and none of theirs
- BC is making continual progress albeit too slow for investors’ liking and will get built
- handover is likely to be 2012 maybe 2011. TBTB can't be bothered enlightening us with his wisdom with a plan so we can better judge when handover will be
- the developer is not really interested in investors. They are proceeding at their pace not ours
- there is nothing in practice we can do about this. There have been several initiatives by people on this thread but none has come to much
- in practice only RERA can pressure the developer
- the marina is looking better and better each day and will get better still (look at some of the recent photos on other threads). It will turn out to be a good if not great investment in the medium term.

The wise ones realised all this sometime ago and have chilled out. As did some Torch and the Point investors who went through this experience earlier than with BC. The penny hasn't dropped with newcomers, dullards and numpties as yet.

Whingers, snipers, trouble causers, people who overextended themselves can't stop themselves whinging because they have nothing better to do or they have got themselves in financial difficulties. That’s it really. :)

sorry this was a bit rude

http://i41.tinypic.com/2mrif5z.jpg

http://i39.tinypic.com/xql0na.jpg

http://i43.tinypic.com/vdess6.jpg

http://i41.tinypic.com/33lknzl.jpg

http://i40.tinypic.com/2z9lc88.jpg

http://i40.tinypic.com/qysfew.jpg

Hmm ...
Final building permit awarded - 24 Feb 2009 (3 years after Pilling Permit)
Completion date for all three towers - Dec 2010

Approx 2years to build a complex of three towers :ohno:.

Needless to say these updates are for those without a clue of whats going on, on the site. Good luck SP in reaching your targets

i have just checked my email...i think its good update...
atleast cleared some points which was complecated ( i.e -separate handover )..
..now we know what is going to happen with hotel...etc...

Good interim update SP/SG. Well done! That table is very useful. :applause:

Basement and Podium finished by Apr 2009? I would love to see you achieve this as then we might have a chance of getting handover in Dec 2010.

True Blue - Give me your verdict mate!

What if they don’t get permission for hotel tower?

They will put up 300 appts like they always intended to.

Good interim update SP/SG. Well done! That table is very useful. :applause:

Basement and Podium finished by Apr 2009? I would love to see you achieve this as then we might have a chance of getting handover in Dec 2010.

True Blue - Give me your verdict mate!

I was hoping that TB would have produced something similar to the table some time ago. If he disagrees hopefully he will produce an alternative timetable.

In 6 weeks time we will know whether they have hit the April 2009 target. Not long. If we can between us keep the photos coming we can measure them against the milestones on a continual basis.

Slowhand forget April, this basement and podium cant be finished this year.

Found good photo on JBR thread originally from SPUR.

He said...
"i took this pic on JBR beach (between the shereton and the Hilton hotels) on the saturday just gone. The Fri, Sat, and Sunday was this busy every day.
Ive been here 2 years and have never seen it as busy as this.
Atmosphere was amazing for the 3 days."

Looks Great

http://i40.tinypic.com/esutdv.jpg

ive counted 50 workers on the west tower.. and around 50 on the central tower/ in the pictures above..

15/March/2009

Bay Central

http://i44.tinypic.com/29xfcxt.jpg

http://i42.tinypic.com/28i5lxs.jpg

http://i43.tinypic.com/t7my3k.jpg

Thanks Imre...

going well...i think....

Found good photo on JBR thread originally from SPUR.

He said...
"i took this pic on JBR beach (between the shereton and the Hilton hotels) on the saturday just gone. The Fri, Sat, and Sunday was this busy every day.
Ive been here 2 years and have never seen it as busy as this.
Atmosphere was amazing for the 3 days."

Looks Great



This area of the beach and the Walk are lively (by Dubai standards!) because of the numbers of cafes and restaurants one after another, it is a place to stroll before and after dinner and there is a very large car park that non JBR residents can use. Lots of people around attract lots more. It is an area where the locals drive past slowly to show off their exotic cars. There is a mixture of locals, expat workers and tourists. I reckon most people are in their late 20s, 30s and 40s. BC is just the other side of JBR and is a 3 or 4 min walk directly through JBR. As more restaurants open and more JBR and other Marina residents move in it should stay busy.

:dance:

Partyalarm !! Finally some good progress !! :banana::cheers:

'the enforcer' where did you get the above crap from? stop spreading rumours. We only want facts on this forum.

please provide more information...

if its not true.....cancel his membership from this site as it creates panic in investors:bash:

"the Enforcer" message about SP under investigation has been removed? If the news will be not confirmed (hopefully) "the Enforcer" must be removed from this forum!!!
Please further updates about these issues!

Can we change the title too under c

With reference to comments posted previously which have since been removed, we would urge readers of this forum not to act on any false claims - please remember that this is an unofficial public forum on which people can seemingly say what they wish without sanction, although we place trust in the moderators of these pages to act responsibility in the interests of all parties.
For anyone thinking of posting unverified claims, we will not take defamatory comments intended to damage our business lightly. Contact us with your real identity and we will happily set the record straight on any of the misinformation or rumours which seem to be innevitable at a time of global economic uncertainty but please, desist from scaremongering in the public domain.

Thanks to Moderator and Select Property for quick action

hi all been away last week at cheltenham, back now, seem to have been some action on here what happened... progress looks good!

to dumb and dumber, i am not going to waste my time on you.

Select has finally put in writing the issue of handover without the hotel. now the issue is, should we trust them. obviuosly, there track record tells us not to. in fact, giving their history, their statment sounds more like an attempt to buy time and allay investor concerns. then they can backtrack and blame the authorities in two years time.

that's why i am going to ask Select to show official documents from Dubai municiplaity proving their separate handover statement.

^^There is no way handover will commence whilst hotel tower is still under construction.

Remember, I speak with my experience from jbr. There were 36 separate residential jbr towers, and handover only started once health & safety were satisifed that general public were not in any danger.

It was frustrating at the time, because we could see our tower was ready. But we had to wait for DEWA and other authorities to give Dubai Properties the go-ahead.

Now I bought into the development because of the hotel. If the hotel is not ready at the same time as my apartment, then do I really want something that will be a building site until hotel opens?

If I decide to let it out, would I really get the best rental from any future tenants until hotel opens?

Obviously SP/SG read our posts here - SP please can you ensure that I get what was promised to me? You need the 3 towers to rise together, and handover as a complete project. If this will only happen after Dec 2010 (as it is pencilled in now), please tell us now. Upfront. We are all grown ups on here (well I am anyway) and can take it.

I have already stated that I think completion will be in Sep 2011...that is my guess and I want to be proved wrong.

to dumb and dumber, i am not going to waste my time on you.



then don't.

glover you are a banker and always have been and always will be.

^^There is no way handover will commence whilst hotel tower is still under construction.

Remember, I speak with my experience from jbr. There were 36 separate residential jbr towers, and handover only started once health & safety were satisifed that general public were not in any danger.

It was frustrating at the time, because we could see our tower was ready. But we had to wait for DEWA and other authorities to give Dubai Properties the go-ahead.

Now I bought into the development because of the hotel. If the hotel is not ready at the same time as my apartment, then do I really want something that will be a building site until hotel opens?

If I decide to let it out, would I really get the best rental from any future tenants until hotel opens?

Obviously SP/SG read our posts here - SP please can you ensure that I get what was promised to me? You need the 3 towers to rise together, and handover as a complete project. If this will only happen after Dec 2010 (as it is pencilled in now), please tell us now. Upfront. We are all grown ups on here (well I am anyway) and can take it.

I have already stated that I think completion will be in Sep 2011...that is my guess and I want to be proved wrong.

I think sometime early 2012 based on my experience with JBR. Could be earlier if they get a move on or later if they hit problems especially with hotel which is more of an unknown at present. Should know more about the hotel in a month or so per update.

This is an extract from Mackie's very helpful post on the Torch thread. It is about a recent series of meetings Mackie had in Dubai including one with MD of SG.

"I will tell you about the meeting with Rahail.
He seemed to be a nice guy, a sharp businessman but clearly does know little about construction (he does not need to, I understand that but it would help).

He was in a mode of no negotiations and very much focused on delivering all the projects. He claims that he will be the only developer to complete their entire projects and in the current climate, he is one of very few that are paying all of their bills.

He seems to think that whatever he does, he can not please everybody and therefore his main focus is to deliver the project. I did not like that bit about willing to upset a few investors to ensure delivery of the project but deep down, I was thinking under the current climate, I would do the same."

I know other people who have met Rahail and they think SG will definitely finish their projects inc BC. He is an entrepreneur, is hard nosed and not that sensitive to concerns of investors. This is all consistent with delivery sometime 2011/2012 the actual timing depending on a few factors.

Progress on the Point, the Torch and BC is much improved this last 3 months which supports the above.

All will be revealed on May 2nd when we all get our homes in The Point as promised by the man himself:ohno:

I was hoping that TB would have produced something similar to the table some time ago. If he disagrees hopefully he will produce an alternative timetable.

In 6 weeks time we will know whether they have hit the April 2009 target. Not long. If we can between us keep the photos coming we can measure them against the milestones on a continual basis.

A positive move by SP to issue target dates, this will give us a benchmark to measure progress against;

http://i39.tinypic.com/xql0na.jpg

My estimate of progress is slightly different but optomistic none the less:)


Basement and podium structures complete ......Nov 2009
Superstructures complete.............................Sept 2010
Glazing/cladding complete............................. Mar 2011
Residential towers complete.......................... Dec 2011

Hotel piling complete ................................... Aug 2009
Raft poured................................................ Dec 2009
Podium structure complete............................ May 2010
Superstucture complete................................ Mar 2011
Glazing/Cladding complete............................. Nov 2011
External works complete............................... Apr 2012

True Blue estimate of project complete........... Dec 2012

A positive move by SP to issue target dates, this will give us a benchmark to measure progress against;

My estimate of progress is slightly different but optomistic none the less:)


Basement and podium structures complete ......Nov 2009
Superstructures complete.............................Sept 2010
Glazing/cladding complete............................. Mar 2011
Residential towers complete.......................... Dec 2011

Hotel piling complete ................................... Aug 2009
Raft poured................................................ Dec 2009
Podium structure complete............................ May 2010
Superstucture complete................................ Mar 2011
Glazing/Cladding complete............................. Nov 2011
External works complete............................... Apr 2012

True Blue estimate of project complete........... Dec 2012

Thanks very much TB very useful info. We are starting to get more clarity on likely completion dates on which there has been much understandable speculation by people like me and others who have little or no construction knowledge.

I think your timescales are more credible than those in the update which appear to be overly optimistic but SG/SP get credit for publishing them which they haven't done before.

Is it wrong that I enjoy being right this much!!!

Hotel and Residential separate affection plan = enabling separate hand over, bravo Select very clever.

^^^^ not so fast! this is what SELECT is claiming. they have done this before when it's convenient to them many times, claimed something to sell their products and fool the unsuspected only to backtrack few months/years later when it's too late.

the only way i will buy this is to see official documents from Dubai municipality, which is something i am planning to ask Select to provide. Further, i am going to verify this claim with Dubai municipality.

right now, its only an unsubstantiated claim by Select!

Does anyone have photos? Seems everyday brings big changes.

Our fellow investors in The World Aquitania project may be given some 'relief'.

http://groups.google.com/group/dubai-property-investors/t/4b22dde62f171378?hl=en

How about other SP projects? I need some 'relief' too!

Our fellow investors in The World Aquitania project may be given some 'relief'.

http://groups.google.com/group/dubai-property-investors/t/4b22dde62f171378?hl=en

How about other SP projects? I need some 'relief' too!

I think if a group of us ie 20 or 30 submitted a letter/request asking for a further payment delay beyond the 3 months already granted it would be forthcoming.

Is this the sort of relief you are after?

^^That would help.

But I actually feel like we deserve 1 year payment holiday as they have delayed project by at least a year...

^^That would help.

But I actually feel like we deserve 1 year payment holiday as they have delayed project by at least a year...

Well let's try to get a group together to send a letter or request to BCD and SP and see where that takes us. It won't cost anything. Anything we get is better than nothing. If necessary I can go and see SP personally to make sure they understand the strength of our feelings on this matter.

All we need is an email from any interested BC investor stating their name and BC apartment number(s) and that they would like a further payment delay of whatever. We then submit or hand over all these together en masse.

I am happy to coordinate this but if someone else wants to do this with BCD/SP that's fine by me.

Is there sufficient interest in this? If you are put a post on this thread or PM FWIW or me and we'll see where we get.

Well let's try to get a group together to send a letter or request to BCD and SP and see where that takes us. It won't cost anything. Anything we get is better than nothing. If necessary I can go and see SP personally to make sure they understand the strength of our feelings on this matter.

All we need is an email from any interested BC investor stating their name, BC apartment number(s) and a phone number so SP can check they are valid and that they would like a further payment delay of whatever. We then submit or hand over all these together en masse.

I am happy to coordinate this but if someone else wants to an deal with BCD/SP that's fine by me.

Is there sufficient interest in this? If you are put a post on this thread or PM FWIW or me and we'll see where we get.

I am in for any reaonable approach and have already PM'd you with my details. I have two apartments in BC west tower.

same here....i will pm my detail...
thanks Slowhand for Organising common approach to get reasonable payment break...

anyone Pictures please

from dxbgo

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3426/3367037939_9707191fc7_o.jpg

http://i40.tinypic.com/23j040l.jpg

http://i43.tinypic.com/68x3kh.jpg

http://i40.tinypic.com/20usb2b.jpg

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3538/3367038543_d6de27042d_o.jpg

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3634/3367037697_6d337b1a1c_o.jpg

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3585/3367037829_c4e8b351af_o.jpg

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3017/3367038037_8130fb8deb_o.jpg

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3426/3367037939_9707191fc7_o.jpg

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3641/3367038171_a3c10eff03_o.jpg

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3581/3367038121_e3cab414f7_o.jpg

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3576/3367038309_68fee37fd2_o.jpg

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3663/3367862598_e2e5c87d30_o.jpg

They have put lights on the west tower.. so are they working day and night?

^^ Do u have a link for DXBGO Construction Pictures ? !

Don’t appear to have many workers, still catching up fast here.

we could catch up too THE ATLANTIC..

Hope diveksa is not reading this :lol: but The ATLANTIC is worst (slow).