we could catch up too THE ATLANTIC..

great photos Beppe thanks. Progress looks good. Soon both towers will be above road height. The towers don't look that substantial ie not wide or deep and so we could see them quickly rise. We just need to see some action on the hotel which hopefully will be soon.

Well let's try to get a group together to send a letter or request to BCD and SP and see where that takes us. It won't cost anything. Anything we get is better than nothing. If necessary I can go and see SP personally to make sure they understand the strength of our feelings on this matter.

All we need is an email from any interested BC investor stating their name and BC apartment number(s) and that they would like a further payment delay of whatever. We then submit or hand over all these together en masse.

I am happy to coordinate this but if someone else wants to do this with BCD/SP that's fine by me.

Is there sufficient interest in this? If you are put a post on this thread or PM FWIW or me and we'll see where we get.

six investors have contacted me so far. Anyone else want to join in?

Hope diveksa is not reading this :lol: but The ATLANTIC is worst (slow).

I bet Botanica investors would prefer to be in Atlantic.:)

DCE are cheating here, they are just pouring the tower footprint and leaving the rest of the basement untouched. So far only raft and 1 floor cast in 10 weeks. Sometimes you have to cheat to win.:laugh:

Sometimes you have to cheat to win.:laugh:

I knew that.

Don’t appear to have many workers, still catching up fast here.

I bet Botanica investors would prefer to be in Atlantic.:):

Botanica already in Atlantic.





Ocean:runaway:

Hi

I am just back from a 6 day holiday in Dubai.

Firstly I have no technical qualifications related to construction or architecture - so please do not ask me to comment on how many floors or the quality of build! The Marina is looking absolutely fabulous and the shops and restaurants at the base of JT - the Walk are open and really buzzing. My last visit was 2006, when I viewed the BC site. JLT was not completed and i do not think any shops were trading - now it is very lively with just a small number of shops still preparing for opening. You can really get a sense of how well placed BC is - just by standing on the Marina and looking down the side of Al Fattam (spelling?) towers and you can see BC. So literally 100m from the the Walk and beach. We had lunch/dinner on the Walk on 3 occasions and met many people that had decided to come out from the big hotels along the beach to have dine on the Walk. I would say the prices along the Walk are inline with UK prices about £30.00+ per head at Paul restaurant sort of upmarket Chez Gerrard - so at 5 AED that was not bad - of course I would prefer 7 AED!

We also visited the Marina Mall - super views onto the BC site - some well known shops have already opened including Waitrose plus a cinema will soon follow. I think this will be a real attraction for those buyers who will rent our their properties. We stayed near the Burjuman Shopping Mall - really expensive - you know you can't afford it when there is no price tag!

We also saw the monorail being tested - the stop along the SZR is about 7 mins walk from BC. The BC site from what I could see was busy with workers and activity. This was the first visit to Dubai for my other half and he was blown away by the location. We are both disappointed by the delay in completion but due to the location and the surrounding area we both agreed that it will be a fabulous residence, so worth the wait. :)

Ianthy

great photos Beppe thanks. Progress looks good. Soon both towers will be above road height. The towers don't look that substantial ie not wide or deep and so we could see them quickly rise. We just need to see some action on the hotel which hopefully will be soon.

pics were mine i asked beppe to post it on ssc . beppe does a better job of posting them than me:banana:

Hi

I am just back from a 6 day holiday in Dubai.

Firstly I have no technical qualifications related to construction or architecture - so please do not ask me to comment on how many floors or the quality of build! The Marina is looking absolutely fabulous and the shops and restaurants at the base of JT - the Walk are open and really buzzing. My last visit was 2006, when I viewed the BC site. JLT was not completed and i do not think any shops were trading - now it is very lively with just a small number of shops still preparing for opening. You can really get a sense of how well placed BC is - just by standing on the Marina and looking down the side of Al Fattam (spelling?) towers and you can see BC. So literally 100m from the the Walk and beach. We had lunch/dinner on the Walk on 3 occasions and met many people that had decided to come out from the big hotels along the beach to have dine on the Walk. I would say the prices along the Walk are inline with UK prices about £30.00+ per head at Paul restaurant sort of upmarket Chez Gerrard - so at 5 AED that was not bad - of course I would prefer 7 AED!

We also visited the Marina Mall - super views onto the BC site - some well known shops have already opened including Waitrose plus a cinema will soon follow. I think this will be a real attraction for those buyers who will rent our their properties. We stayed near the Burjuman Shopping Mall - really expensive - you know you can't afford it when there is no price tag!

We also saw the monorail being tested - the stop along the SZR is about 7 mins walk from BC. The BC site from what I could see was busy with workers and activity. This was the first visit to Dubai for my other half and he was blown away by the location. We are both disappointed by the delay in completion but due to the location and the surrounding area we both agreed that it will be a fabulous residence, so worth the wait. :)

Ianthy

not as many workers as silverene. look at silverene site . I took pics at the same time walking across the bridge.
i went to the marina mall aswell and mall of emirates. not many people around carrying posh shopping bags. my imprssion was that most people are window shopping than actually buyimg anything.:banana:

Clearly SP/SG new someone was taking photos and created an illusion to make it look better than it is. The actual facts of the matter is they have not dug and prepared basement, they have not done all the work on central tower, and west tower was put in that spot yeterday purely for the purpose of the photo. The fact that the photo [time 09:55] shows much more progress has taken place in BC than the Atlantic means nothing. Even although the Atlantic was launched 1 yr [at least] prior to BC and is about a quarter of the size means nothing. SP/SG are still worse. History has shown that photos are easily doctored so don't rely on them...Remember - SP are masters of deception and will stop at nothing!!!

Feels good bashing and writing nonsense for no reason at all. Now i understand why the core crew on here continually do it for no reason.

I actually thought i should say progress looks great and differencies can been seen on a daily basis. I wanted to go on and say that i am happy and such great progress is welcome. Finally i might have allowed a wee thought of days to come sitting in a fanatstic tower having a beer with all my SSC "buddies" - but where is the fun in that!!!...BASHING IS MUCH MORE FUN and hopefully will allow me to be accepted into the big boys gang.

DXBGO - Photos are fantastic...keep them coming.

Great photos DXBGO and thanks for posting Beppe786!

six investors have contacted me so far. Anyone else want to join in?

now up to ten investors. Any more? I'll leave it another few days to give time for more people to see this post

six investors have contacted me so far. Anyone else want to join in?

Not sure if you counted me in or not. I was at the back with my hand up!

For the avoidance of doubt - Yes please count me in!

Cheers - :cheers:

Sunny , blue lines, red lines , boy you got me well confused.

Well done here at last some movement in the right direction. Vertically this will fly past Atlantic but the podium is a different issue. This is major part of the development. That Atlantic is the slowest thing ever, must be real frustrating for all in here. Good continued progress at The Point aswell.

TB, why did you spoil the party for the "great progress" crowd! It will be minimum three years behind schedule and these people are cheering because the slip is above ground, irrespective of the missing tower (fate unknown) and no basement work.

please let them live in their bubble, it feels better there.

Other developers are reducing original prices and working with investors on payments, but not Select, even though their launch prices were about 20% higher than the prevailing rates at the time.


DCE are cheating here, they are just pouring the tower footprint and leaving the rest of the basement untouched. So far only raft and 1 floor cast in 10 weeks. Sometimes you have to cheat to win.:laugh:

now up to ten investors. Any more? I'll leave it another few days to give time for more people to see this post

count me in i have e mailed you . confirm it by e mail.:cheers:

^^ count me in aswell slowhand..

count me too

why we are comparing two worst projects...(in terms of developments -- BC and Atlantic)..

we should compare with the Silverlane....i had never ever seen any tall building construction in my life....but i can tell that Silverlane has a much much organised Work force...as i can not find any junks lying around or any small detail which is missing...

while looking at BC its just look in a clear mess....though some progress have been made...

clearly lack of workforce...sometime 100...sometime 50 sometime..0...looking at recent pictures it was just about 20 people working in this massive project....

God save us...

BC workers are always on tea breaks.. thats why no work is done..

http://i44.tinypic.com/svqpzo.jpg

BC workers are always on tea breaks.. thats why no work is done..

http://i44.tinypic.com/svqpzo.jpg

hey, would you work hard in that heat if there was a guy on your right next to you doing nothing except gazing into the distance from his luxury boat waiting for you to build his apartment :) no wonder he has a flood of tears coming from each eye

Central tower and edge of west tower

http://i42.tinypic.com/2em2aso.jpg

Hi

I am just back from a 6 day holiday in Dubai.

Firstly I have no technical qualifications related to construction or architecture - so please do not ask me to comment on how many floors or the quality of build! The Marina is looking absolutely fabulous and the shops and restaurants at the base of JT - the Walk are open and really buzzing. My last visit was 2006, when I viewed the BC site. JLT was not completed and i do not think any shops were trading - now it is very lively with just a small number of shops still preparing for opening. You can really get a sense of how well placed BC is - just by standing on the Marina and looking down the side of Al Fattam (spelling?) towers and you can see BC. So literally 100m from the the Walk and beach. We had lunch/dinner on the Walk on 3 occasions and met many people that had decided to come out from the big hotels along the beach to have dine on the Walk. I would say the prices along the Walk are inline with UK prices about £30.00+ per head at Paul restaurant sort of upmarket Chez Gerrard - so at 5 AED that was not bad - of course I would prefer 7 AED!

We also visited the Marina Mall - super views onto the BC site - some well known shops have already opened including Waitrose plus a cinema will soon follow. I think this will be a real attraction for those buyers who will rent our their properties. We stayed near the Burjuman Shopping Mall - really expensive - you know you can't afford it when there is no price tag!

We also saw the monorail being tested - the stop along the SZR is about 7 mins walk from BC. The BC site from what I could see was busy with workers and activity. This was the first visit to Dubai for my other half and he was blown away by the location. We are both disappointed by the delay in completion but due to the location and the surrounding area we both agreed that it will be a fabulous residence, so worth the wait. :)

Ianthy

Absolultely agree with you, Bay Central and the Botanica are both in one of the best locations in the Marina. In the long run, despite the frustrating delay and current negative economic doom and gloom, the sun will always shine here!

Oil prices is staying above $50 now.....hmmm - maybe we will be out of recession sooner than we think!

Clearly SP/SG new someone was taking photos and created an illusion to make it look better than it is. The actual facts of the matter is they have not dug and prepared basement, they have not done all the work on central tower, and west tower was put in that spot yeterday purely for the purpose of the photo. The fact that the photo [time 09:55] shows much more progress has taken place in BC than the Atlantic means nothing. Even although the Atlantic was launched 1 yr [at least] prior to BC and is about a quarter of the size means nothing. SP/SG are still worse. History has shown that photos are easily doctored so don't rely on them...Remember - SP are masters of deception and will stop at nothing!!!

Feels good bashing and writing nonsense for no reason at all. Now i understand why the core crew on here continually do it for no reason.

I actually thought i should say progress looks great and differencies can been seen on a daily basis. I wanted to go on and say that i am happy and such great progress is welcome. Finally i might have allowed a wee thought of days to come sitting in a fanatstic tower having a beer with all my SSC "buddies" - but where is the fun in that!!!...BASHING IS MUCH MORE FUN and hopefully will allow me to be accepted into the big boys gang.

DXBGO - Photos are fantastic...keep them coming.

will do . photo time is actually 11.30 am did not change it from mumbai where i was for last 3 days previously.
next batch will be 15th april . will post them on return around 21st april.
dxbpc -thanks for the compliment i just point and click the camera:cheers:

I bet Botanica investors would prefer to be in Atlantic.:)

DCE are cheating here, they are just pouring the tower footprint and leaving the rest of the basement untouched. So far only raft and 1 floor cast in 10 weeks. Sometimes you have to cheat to win.:laugh:

True Blue --Cant they build the tower without podium??/ cant they work on basement later on???

^^Sure, they can if they want but makes life a little harder later on when you are taking deliveries of cladding/glass or high quality kitchens when there is no podium to unload and store to or even climb over the podium work.

Rising slip form is political and makes the structure visible above ground. Remember they erected a tower crane almost a year ago because it looked good.

why we are comparing two worst projects...(in terms of developments -- BC and Atlantic)..

we should compare with the Silverlane....i had never ever seen any tall building construction in my life....but i can tell that Silverlane has a much much organised Work force...as i can not find any junks lying around or any small detail which is missing...

while looking at BC its just look in a clear mess....though some progress have been made...

clearly lack of workforce...sometime 100...sometime 50 sometime..0...looking at recent pictures it was just about 20 people working in this massive project....

God save us...

They can't compare against Silverene or Cayan because they would look like complete amatures instead better to compare against other complete amatures.

Thanks to 234sale for this...
http://i39.tinypic.com/ouv3om.jpg

The great Imre for this...
http://i43.tinypic.com/2wmgxnc.jpg

WOW BC begats BD -----:lol::lol:

^^Sure, they can if they want but makes life a little harder later on when you are taking deliveries of cladding/glass or high quality kitchens when there is no podium to unload and store to or even climb over the podium work.

Rising slip form is political and makes the structure visible above ground. Remember they erected a tower crane almost a year ago because it looked good.

They can't compare against Silverene or Cayan because they would look like complete amatures instead better to compare against other complete amatures.

The developer is spending money at a slower rate than is being spent on Silverene but this doesn’t mean they are amateurs. The rate of spend I think is a function of how much money the developer is willing (or able) to put in the pot to supplement investors’ funds.

In today’s Sunday Times there are details of developers that have gone bust in several European countries leaving investors with nothing. Investors’ primary concern is will BC get built? Yes, it will. Many investors will settle for this in today’s economic climate.

Investors’ secondary concern is when? The developer says 2010. I think something like early 2012 depending on few factors. You have expressed similar views. Time will tell but at least we now have an outline plan and dialogue going with the developer on this timetable which will help us all reach a view on a likely handover date as time moves on. Progress this next 3 months should tell us much as
- piling on the hotel should have started
- the rate of progress on the residential towers has improved markedly since Xmas. Will this be maintained, improved upon or slow down? Time will tell. I am optimistic
- the ongoing updates from the developer should allow us to judge how reliable the most recent ones are.

The developer has a track record on the Point, the Torch and BC of being late but keeping construction going. The Point is now not far of being complete (see the thread for latest pictures). There is nothing to indicate this won’t be our experience with BC. The increasing influence of RERA is also helpful to investors.

An investor’s point of view depends on personal timescales, personal financial circumstances, why they invested in the first place, how much previous experience they had of investing in Dubai and what they expected. Many investors will be happy just to see BC built at the current rate of progress (especially if we get a further payment delay which is what we are trying to achieve at present) and some won’t and you can tell who is who from the posts on this forum.

Found this and already had a reply from his office. Thought if everyone goes down this route and complains/suggets via this website it may get listened too. Worth a try.

http://primeminister.ae/en/communicate/index.html

now up to ten investors. Any more? I'll leave it another few days to give time for more people to see this post

now 12 being the following

slowhand
beppe
FWIW
ianthy
DXBGO
morrismarina
kuttika
loubylou
DxbPC
dubman
raj 008
nicarzani

We are collectively buying 15 or 16 apartments. I am waiting for details from one or two of the above before numbers are confirmed.

I intend to send the letter on Wednesday requesting a total of 12 months delay ie another 9 months beyond the 3 months already granted.

any more? only me and possibly raj 008 from central tower. please send me your surname and apartment number(s) by PM

slowhand

now 12 being the following

slowhand
beppe
FWIW
ianthy
DXBGO
morrismarina
kuttika
loubylou
DxbPC
dubman
raj 008
nicarzani

We are collectively buying 15 or 16 apartments. I am waiting for details from one or two of the above before numbers are confirmed.

I intend to send the letter on Wednesday requesting a total of 12 months delay ie another 9 months beyond the 3 months already granted.

any more? only me and possibly raj 008 from central tower. please send me your surname and apartment number(s) by PM

slowhand

Dear "letter re payment holiday” group
I would like just to underline my point of view about your payment holiday issue.
I bet, a large part of you is on LPP, therefore would be pleased to obtain some relief from your due installments and this is understandable for sure; just a 3 month payment holiday from SP is not meaningful against of an announced one year delay.
I’m on SPP and, within my specific case, your payment holiday query is not useful due to the fact that 90% of the overall purchase price for the apartment has been already paid and my next payment will be due on completion.
Well completion… as any investor within this thread I will be very glad to reach the completion ASAP, but in my opinion this is not the best way to address the question.
Now that BC seems finally growing at a good pace, SP needs our money in order to comply with the proposed timescale without further poor excuses!
SP financial difficulty is the worst thing which could happen at this stage; facing with a large amount of investor delaying their payments.
Instead of your proposal I would try to lead the way to other issue; to obtain the interests on the large sums of money sitting within our Escrow accounts which definitely are not due to SP.
Who will profit by the interests arising from these accounts?
At least SP should allow us to earn interest on our money rather than earn it or should be inclined to concede further benefit or discounts.
Following their delay within the construction process (1 full year as stated within their communication) we are losing potential revenue from rental income or the right of personal usage.
Therefore, I beg your pardon, I will not join with you but I will be glad to address to SP a formal request about interest arising from our Escrow accounts.
However, I wish you good luck for your attempt…facing our SP friends I think you’ll need a lot:laugh:.
Cheers!:soon:

Dear "letter re payment holiday” group
I would like just to underline my point of view about your payment holiday issue.
I bet, a large part of you is on LPP, therefore would be pleased to obtain some relief from your due installments and this is understandable for sure; just a 3 month payment holiday from SP is not meaningful against of an announced one year delay.
I’m on SPP and, within my specific case, your payment holiday query is not useful due to the fact that 90% of the overall purchase price for the apartment has been already paid and my next payment will be due on completion.
Well completion… as any investor within this thread I will be very glad to reach the completion ASAP, but in my opinion this is not the best way to address the question.
Now that BC seems finally growing at a good pace, SP needs our money in order to comply with the proposed timescale without further poor excuses!
SP financial difficulty is the worst thing which could happen at this stage; facing with a large amount of investor delaying their payments.
Instead of your proposal I would try to lead the way to other issue; to obtain the interests on the large sums of money sitting within our Escrow accounts which definitely are not due to SP.
Who will profit by the interests arising from these accounts?
At least SP should allow us to earn interest on our money rather than earn it or should be inclined to concede further benefit or discounts.
Following their delay within the construction process (1 full year as stated within their communication) we are losing potential revenue from rental income or the right of personal usage.
Therefore, I beg your pardon, I will not join with you but I will be glad to address to SP a formal request about interest arising from our Escrow accounts.
However, I wish you good luck for your attempt…facing our SP friends I think you’ll need a lot:laugh:.
Cheers!:soon:


Hi JoeCoolSA,

First not all on SPP have paid 90% of the entire amount; some have 30%, 50% and some others 70%.
I agree that SP needs our money and indeed already has it. I’m asking SP to utilize it and speed up construction. At the moment there is a huge misalignment between payments and construction level. Would SP bring a substantial balance between them, I’ll be the first one to pay.

The developer is spending money at a slower rate than is being spent on Silverene but this doesn’t mean they are amateurs. The rate of spend I think is a function of how much money the developer is willing (or able) to put in the pot to supplement investors’ funds.

In today’s Sunday Times there are details of developers that have gone bust in several European countries leaving investors with nothing. Investors’ primary concern is will BC get built? Yes, it will. Many investors will settle for this in today’s economic climate.

Investors’ secondary concern is when? The developer says 2010. I think something like early 2012 depending on few factors. You have expressed similar views. Time will tell but at least we now have an outline plan and dialogue going with the developer on this timetable which will help us all reach a view on a likely handover date as time moves on. Progress this next 3 months should tell us much as
- piling on the hotel should have started
- the rate of progress on the residential towers has improved markedly since Xmas. Will this be maintained, improved upon or slow down? Time will tell. I am optimistic
- the ongoing updates from the developer should allow us to judge how reliable the most recent ones are.

The developer has a track record on the Point, the Torch and BC of being late but keeping construction going. The Point is now not far of being complete (see the thread for latest pictures). There is nothing to indicate this won’t be our experience with BC. The increasing influence of RERA is also helpful to investors.

An investor’s point of view depends on personal timescales, personal financial circumstances, why they invested in the first place, how much previous experience they had of investing in Dubai and what they expected. Many investors will be happy just to see BC built at the current rate of progress (especially if we get a further payment delay which is what we are trying to achieve at present) and some won’t and you can tell who is who from the posts on this forum.

I have to disagree with you!

Some simple arithmatic to ponder. If a project costs $100M to build over a 3 year period then the monthly cash flow should average $100M/36months = $3M/month approx. How do you spend that kind of money with 75men onsite pouring 1 floor a month? Amateurs!! We could also look at what % of the total amount of concrete has been poured against what % of the time has elapsed.

Get your head out of your backside and stop making excuses for these clowns.

I think your valid point just proves that we all have different circumstances and there is no one solution. I have SPP but have only paid 50% so SLOWHAND's idea suits me. Likewise i agree that the interest in the escrow account is ours but how do you get it? I also agree that no action should be taken to jeopordize the build. Unfortunately i have no answer other than everyone must deal with their own circumstances on an individual basis.

BTW Delighted with progress.


Dear "letter re payment holiday” group
I would like just to underline my point of view about your payment holiday issue.
I bet, a large part of you is on LPP, therefore would be pleased to obtain some relief from your due installments and this is understandable for sure; just a 3 month payment holiday from SP is not meaningful against of an announced one year delay.
I’m on SPP and, within my specific case, your payment holiday query is not useful due to the fact that 90% of the overall purchase price for the apartment has been already paid and my next payment will be due on completion.
Well completion… as any investor within this thread I will be very glad to reach the completion ASAP, but in my opinion this is not the best way to address the question.
Now that BC seems finally growing at a good pace, SP needs our money in order to comply with the proposed timescale without further poor excuses!
SP financial difficulty is the worst thing which could happen at this stage; facing with a large amount of investor delaying their payments.
Instead of your proposal I would try to lead the way to other issue; to obtain the interests on the large sums of money sitting within our Escrow accounts which definitely are not due to SP.
Who will profit by the interests arising from these accounts?
At least SP should allow us to earn interest on our money rather than earn it or should be inclined to concede further benefit or discounts.
Following their delay within the construction process (1 full year as stated within their communication) we are losing potential revenue from rental income or the right of personal usage.
Therefore, I beg your pardon, I will not join with you but I will be glad to address to SP a formal request about interest arising from our Escrow accounts.
However, I wish you good luck for your attempt…facing our SP friends I think you’ll need a lot:laugh:.
Cheers!:soon:

^^Divide and conquer - SP must be laughing at us! We ALL need to stick together.

JoeCoolSA - you raise a very good point regarding interest in escrow account. However, the money has long gone and used for acquisitions.

Have a look here: http://www.select-group.ae/acquisition.html

Quote:
In 2007, the group acquired two residential towers Yacht Bay and Royal Oceanic, both located in Dubai Marina and successfully completed and delivered Yacht Bay while Royal Oceanic is under completion. Key characteristics of both of these developments are presented on the following pages to illustrate the addition of these iconic towers to Select Developments’ portfolio.

I don't understand the "divide and conquer - SP must be laughing at us" statement. There is no way to "stick together" on every issue as we all have many different circumstances. Conquer what by the way? Its not a battle. Its a negotiations for suitable terms that people are happy with! There is no way to strike an agreement that every investor will be happy with.
I have been discussing my issues with SP and i am happy with the way i am being dealt with. I am sure i am no different from everyone else!!? Talk to them in a reasonable manner and they will respond similarly. Just talk to a decision maker and not an account manager.
Only my thoughts.
It would go along way if you could let me know how we can appease everyone and all the various problems and not create any that will affect the build.

Finally - should this be under construction or is it still ground work?

^^Divide and conquer - SP must be laughing at us! We ALL need to stick together.

JoeCoolSA - you raise a very good point regarding interest in escrow account. However, the money has long gone and used for acquisitions.

Have a look here: http://www.select-group.ae/acquisition.html

Quote:
In 2007, the group acquired two residential towers Yacht Bay and Royal Oceanic, both located in Dubai Marina and successfully completed and delivered Yacht Bay while Royal Oceanic is under completion. Key characteristics of both of these developments are presented on the following pages to illustrate the addition of these iconic towers to Select Developments’ portfolio.

^^Look - I think it is only fair that as SP/SG have thrust a 1 year delay on us (even after my many emails and calls to them that the original date did not look possible) that they give us a 1 year payment break.

In my mind this would be 'fair' to most reasonable people regardless if they are on SPP or LPP. This would also incentivise SP/SG to complete the build asap, as any further delays should again become payment holidays.

By working with investors on this, SP/SG will once again become a trusted developer. By issuing better communications they are moving in the right direction, they just need a collective shove to 'do the right thing'.

^^Look - I think it is only fair that as SP/SG have thrust a 1 year delay on us (even after my many emails and calls to them that the original date did not look possible) that they give us a 1 year payment break.

In my mind this would be 'fair' to most reasonable people regardless if they are on SPP or LPP. This would also incentivise SP/SG to complete the build asap, as any further delays should again become payment holidays.

By working with investors on this, SP/SG will once again become a trusted developer. By issuing better communications they are moving in the right direction, they just need a collective shove to 'do the right thing'.

I agree

I do Agree as well....

Point is about to finish...Torch..atleast its going well now...
.so now SP have good project and construction management knowledge....

Also they have deliverd Yacht Bay...so their team and management have all round knowledge which they can tranfer into building a strong company...

also they can utilise all the above skill to Deliver BC on time.....and they can emerge as a one of the better devloper in a region....atleast i m hopeful....

^^Look - I think it is only fair that as SP/SG have thrust a 1 year delay on us (even after my many emails and calls to them that the original date did not look possible) that they give us a 1 year payment break.

In my mind this would be 'fair' to most reasonable people regardless if they are on SPP or LPP. This would also incentivise SP/SG to complete the build asap, as any further delays should again become payment holidays.

By working with investors on this, SP/SG will once again become a trusted developer. By issuing better communications they are moving in the right direction, they just need a collective shove to 'do the right thing'.

As much as I can understand where you are coming from, I imagine they will have a 12 month delivery clause in their contract, which will always be the actual completion date of any project.

So personally I cannot see them making any major changes to payment plans and so forth unless they are planning a major change in company policy

Wish you the best of luck however

Well,
Just to let you know that I do have 2 x2 bedroom apartments in Bay Central, West tower, on the 29th and 30th floor.
I already have one with the resale department.I bought it march 2007.
If interested, PM me .
I moved to Dubai and i have to let go of one and buy a completed one.I am wasting my money on rent.
Let me know.
P.S: I was finally able to log on !
I have been following this thread and I thank all those who posts those new pictures.
It kind of reassure me little bit that things are moving along better than before.
best wishes to all!

I have to disagree with you!

Some simple arithmatic to ponder. If a project costs $100M to build over a 3 year period then the monthly cash flow should average $100M/36months = $3M/month approx. How do you spend that kind of money with 75men onsite pouring 1 floor a month? Amateurs!! We could also look at what % of the total amount of concrete has been poured against what % of the time has elapsed.

Get your head out of your backside and stop making excuses for these clowns.

:lol: Hey, I know something about your construction experience or lack of it. I wouldn't be that rude if I was you.

A bit more thought on your behalf when it comes to financials would help. Expenditure on the site including all start up costs inc marketing etc will not be even. Payments by investors on SPP and LPP will not be equal. You don't know how much they have spent so far. Your analysis is too simplistic.

You are missing the point. Just because they have chosen to build at a certain pace (which they have) doesn't make them amateurs. Being amateur means doing a bad job, an inefficient job etc. They are behind timescales we know but there is a sound business reason from their point of view why they have chosen to do this - they can largely use our money to finance the project. This doesn't make them amateurs. Misleading to investors agreed but not necessarily amateurs.

Don't think you have enough relevant experience for you to judge this any how.
If you have please state this. How many sky scraper projects have you worked on? In what capacity? How recent is this experience?

I think it is you who is more likely to be the amateur (on construction issues). Prove me wrong with evidence of your relevant experience? I don't think you have any. Your an impostor!

Well…anyone within this thread has its own respectable point of view and any attempt to speed up the process is more than welcome, but in my opinion we need to address all our efforts to assure a solid support to BC construction in order to obtain our apartments in accordance with the re scheduled completion time (DEC 2010).
Until that period I will grant my confidence to SP bearing in mind that 1 year of delay is already in place and they need to demonstrate their reliability with regular updates and outstanding construction progress.
After this date further delays will not be “acceptable” and my attitude will be different for sure! :bash:

Dear "letter re payment holiday” group
I would like just to underline my point of view about your payment holiday issue.
I bet, a large part of you is on LPP, therefore would be pleased to obtain some relief from your due installments and this is understandable for sure; just a 3 month payment holiday from SP is not meaningful against of an announced one year delay.
I’m on SPP and, within my specific case, your payment holiday query is not useful due to the fact that 90% of the overall purchase price for the apartment has been already paid and my next payment will be due on completion.
Well completion… as any investor within this thread I will be very glad to reach the completion ASAP, but in my opinion this is not the best way to address the question.
Now that BC seems finally growing at a good pace, SP needs our money in order to comply with the proposed timescale without further poor excuses!
SP financial difficulty is the worst thing which could happen at this stage; facing with a large amount of investor delaying their payments.
Instead of your proposal I would try to lead the way to other issue; to obtain the interests on the large sums of money sitting within our Escrow accounts which definitely are not due to SP.
Who will profit by the interests arising from these accounts?
At least SP should allow us to earn interest on our money rather than earn it or should be inclined to concede further benefit or discounts.
Following their delay within the construction process (1 full year as stated within their communication) we are losing potential revenue from rental income or the right of personal usage.
Therefore, I beg your pardon, I will not join with you but I will be glad to address to SP a formal request about interest arising from our Escrow accounts.
However, I wish you good luck for your attempt…facing our SP friends I think you’ll need a lot:laugh:.
Cheers!:soon:

I understand your point of view. I have paid 70% not 90%. The key reason I have not been keen to take a hard line with the developer, which is reflected in the tone of my posts on this forum, is that I wouldn't want them to run out of money and not complete. This might happen if they are largely financing the project with our funds (which I think they are) and have no meaningful funds of their own to put in. There is no way of knowing whether they have or haven't any funds of their own. I think the balance of investors in BC who post on this forum share my concerns based on the PMs I have been receiving recently. Clearly if you are not an investor (like TB and co) you can be as cavalier or as unthinking as you want with your words and there are no consequences.

We now have 14 supporters

slowhand
beppe
FWIW
ianthy
DXBGO
morrismarina
kuttika
loubylou
DxbPC
dubman
raj 008
nicarzani
uk to dubai
monalisa2

Thanks beppe, FWIW & DXBGO for the info.

We are collectively buying 18 apartments, 5 in central tower and 13 in west tower.

I intend to send the letter on Wednesday requesting a total of 12 months delay ie another 9 months beyond the 3 months already granted.

Last call - any more?

Well done Slowhand. Good effort.

Glover where's your name...have you already cut a deal?

We now have 14 supporters

slowhand
beppe
FWIW
ianthy
DXBGO
morrismarina
kuttika
loubylou
DxbPC
dubman
raj 008
nicarzani
uk to dubai
monalisa2

Thanks beppe, FWIW & DXBGO for the info.

We are collectively buying 18 apartments, 5 in central tower and 13 in west tower.

I intend to send the letter on Wednesday requesting a total of 12 months delay ie another 9 months beyond the 3 months already granted.

Last call - any more?

:lol: Hey, I know something about your construction experience or lack of it. I wouldn't be that rude if I was you.
A bit more thought on your behalf when it comes to financials would help. Expenditure on the site including all start up costs inc marketing etc will not be even. Payments by investors on SPP and LPP will not be equal. You don't know how much they have spent so far. Your analysis is too simplistic.

You are missing the point. Just because they have chosen to build at a certain pace (which they have) doesn't make them amateurs. Being amateur means doing a bad job, an inefficient job etc. They are behind timescales we know but there is a sound business reason from their point of view why they have chosen to do this - they can largely use our money to finance the project. This doesn't make them amateurs. Misleading to investors agreed but not necessarily amateurs.

Don't think you have enough relevant experience for you to judge this any how. If you have please state this. How many sky scraper projects have you worked on? In what capacity? How recent is this experience?

I think it is you who is more likely to be the amateur (on construction issues). Prove me wrong with evidence of your relevant experience? I don't think you have any. Your an impostor!

^^Is this you trying to appear intelligent again? You don't know anything about me, and neither does DXBPC despite what he may think.

Ask him in which 2 years did I graduate and which 2 Universities, how long I have been a Member of the Institution of Civil Engineers, which very famous Civil Engineer worked for the same Consulting Engineers as me when I was designing Nuclear power stations? Which large bridge projects have I worked on using single pour slipforms or what about the largest raft foundation poured in Scotland by my company, how many piles does it sit on? Clue, the answer is atleast 1000 more than anything I have seen in the marina so far! Yes, there are not many skyscrapers in Scotland or GB for that matter but there is nothing difficult about them, cut and paste as many have already noticed.

Fact, I do know a lot more than the 2 of you put together and still wait to be proved wrong on anything I have said regarding SP or any of their projects. If you keep missleading follower of this forum with your "well pleased with progress" then I will continue to address the balance.:okay:

slowhand... please count me in as well

i'm sending you a PM with my details :)




...

Addressing the balance

In case you are too affraid to venture accross to the Silverene thread, I thought I would bring it to you. All developers are the same, as one wise forumer once claimed:)

Press Release Content


Arabtec Construction L.L.C. a subsidiary of Arabtec Holding has announced an acceleration in the pace of construction works on the Silverene Twin Towers Residential Development in Dubai Marina.


Under a contract with Cayan Property Investment and Development, construction on this luxury development project, worth AED 638 million, is ahead of schedule.

Raft-casting work has already been completed with a quantity of 16,300 cubic metres of reinforced concrete, and the core walls of both towers are progressing using Arabtec slip-form and are already above ground level. The slab is already on the third level.

As a repeat client, Cayan is confident Arabtec will deliver a high-quality and satisfactory finished product on time. “Our alliance with Arabtec has formulated a new perspective into building construction. We are excited by the pace of the work that we have observed, which highlights Arabtec’s project execution skills. Construction work is progressing and Cayan is looking forward to seeing the rest of the project take shape,” stated Mr Omar Derbas, Cayan Project Manager.

“Due to Arabtec’s organisational set-up and well-controlled labour force, they are already well ahead of schedule after only three (3) months of construction. As the project Engineer, we are observing proper Quality control and high standard of workmanship, as per the guidelines,” added the Resident Engineer of M/s RMJM, the Consultant and the Project Manager.

Built by Arabtec, the project consists of two towers which extend over a total area of 108,174 square metres, located at the water’s edge of Dubai Marina, in the vicinity of the Marina Mall, the Yacht Club and Al Majarra Community. The 34-storey Tower A comprises a selection of distinguished one-, two- and three-bedroom apartments and penthouses, while Tower B, which stands at 26 storeys, provides an elegant mix of studio and one- two- and three-bedroom apartments, and duplexes. The towers will each include a four-storey basement, with one Mechanical Floor and three Car Park Levels.

Linking the two towers will be a four-storey Podium with two floors of exclusive retail outlets, and a spacious sun-deck with a swimming pool for residents. Each tower will feature its own fully equipped gymnasium.

The Silverene Twin Towers are slated to be one of the highest quality construction buildings in the region. This will add to Arabtec’s diversified portfolio of projects, backed by the company’s commitment to quality construction to the highest of standards.

^^Is this you trying to appear intelligent again? You don't know anything about me, and neither does DXBPC despite what he may think.



Not to sure how i got a mention here but thanks for thinking of me. I feel special. Paranoia is a terrible thing you know.

Excellent progress on BC site. I am delighted.

Slowhand, please also count me in. Will send you an email with the details today.

Progress Pictures please...its been almost a week now....looking forward to see some progress at hotel site

I would just like to say "Well Done" to SP/SG for sending me my Dubai Land Registration documents well within the timeframe I gave them. :applause:

Now, if we could get another 9 month payment break, we would all turn into a real advocates for your company!

count me in on that! If you keep missleading follower of this forum with your "well pleased with progress" then I will continue to address the balance.:okay:

I would just like to say "Well Done" to SP/SG for sending me my Dubai Land Registration documents well within the timeframe I gave them. :applause:

Now, if we could get another 9 month payment break, we would all turn into a real advocates for your company!


Is it for Bay Central or Torch?

I only have a Bay Central! No torch apartments for me...

Important Notice
It has come to our attention that a 'grievance-room' website is to be launched by a single customer, but due to the immediacy and global audience reach of the Web we felt it was important to issue an official response to this kind of disreputable attempt to damage consumer confidence at a time of severe economic uncertainty.
In March this year Select Property celebrated its fifth anniversary carefully selecting property developments that offer the best value, location, desirability, credibility and ease of purchase to its customers - making overseas home ownership accessible to a wider audience of people than just professional property investors.

We have sold over 5,000 properties to over 3,000 individuals. Many of these developments have won awards for the benefits they offer to their owners. Our company itself was voted one of the top ten companies to work for by the Sunday Times in 2009 and was shortlisted for Manchester Evening News Business of the Year last year.

But as we all know, in spite of the success we have shared with our customers over the years, the world in which we live and work has changed drastically in the last year; credit has become hard to obtain, previously stable currency exchange rates have changed drastically, all forms of income are being squeezed and the value of companies in almost all sectors has been eroded by the contraction of every major global economy.

It is indeed a very difficult time for all of us, from the single holiday-home owner to the biggest international developer. None of us are to blame for this rapid downturn in prospects and many did not foresee it, but we must all deal with it - by reassessing our plans and protecting our investments.

In that respect, our long-term interests are exactly the same as our customers' - the successful delivery of property developments that can be lived in, rented out or sold on.

Many of the developments we have represented are being constructed at a greater pace than similar developments nearby which were launched earlier and with completion dates that have long-since passed. Some of the developments we have represented are the only developments of their kind to receive all the necessary approvals and the only ones to have awarded construction contracts already. Purchasers' funds in all developments we have represented in the UAE are protected by 'escrow'.

Only one of the developments we have launched has been cancelled - 'Royal Gulf' in the UAE. This was our own decision, to protect purchasers being exposed to the risk that the forecast slow-down in sales might prevent us from being able to commence construction. All the buyers quickly moved their funds into alternative properties or received full refunds.

Retaining the faith and commitment of purchasers will ensure we all get through the short-term turbulence until the long-term benefits are restored, it is our number one priority and we devote most of our time and energy to it. If we succeed, we succeed together and by listening to and supporting our customers we have thankfully been able to enjoy fewer cases of cancellations than many other property companies in our field.

We have worked extremely hard as a company to follow some common-sense principles to guard against the many risks associated off-plan overseas property sales. We have implemented research practices, training and development techniques and system checks and balances which make us stand out in a market where less scrupulous operators have been allowed to profit from the increasing appetite of the market, in an property sector which escapes regulation in the UK for the time-being.

In spite of all of this, occasionally we inevitably get it wrong, and we have fair and consistent procedure for investigating cases where our people or processes have fallen short of the high standards we set for ourselves. We allow any customer access to this procedure and thankfully, through professional cordial dialogue, we are able to address those mistakes and restore our customers' faith in our professional integrity.

It is disappointing however that some people do not want to engage with us and reject all fair and reasonable attempts to solve their individual issues. Instead, an increasing number (although still a small minority) seek to publish their subjective opinions in the form of personal attacks intended to bring celebrity to their cause and damage both the reputations of professional companies and the confidence of other consumers.

We hope that the majority of people can put these subjective and often emotive accounts (typically from private individuals who are sadly suffering from financial difficulty or have been over-exposed to risk) into context.

Consumers should also have an opportunity to hear some of the positive experiences which the majority of buyers are able to recount. We remain optimistic that most people will take a responsible approach to sharing and forming opinions, and talk to our committed team before making up their own minds.

Above all, we hope that we can all continue to share our experiences positively, learn from what changing market conditions tell us, and support each other to achieve our mutual goals.

If you have any questions regarding this specific matter please contact us by email.

Post and links here
http://www.selectproperty.com/grievance/

Good news then. When did you get your docs through?
I only have a Bay Central! No torch apartments for me...

Thanks for sharing the SP story. Directionally, it is correct. We would all be better off if we could keep it constructive, positive and transparent.

It looks that Select, afer some time of inertia, has seen what the way forward is and is working on both completion and restoring relationships with the investors.

I had a recent very good experience with the SP Dubai office. Unexpected, SP Dubai rang discussing all my issues and taking action where required. All where completely resolved within 24 hours, but one - the financial one. I understand that is is for most a key issue.

Let us now see how Slowhand can get a mutual and common understanding in this area with Select. If all funds are locked up in the escrow and with lower actual building costs than foreseen when setting the prices, there must be room for some financial breather.

^^Is this you trying to appear intelligent again? You don't know anything about me, and neither does DXBPC despite what he may think.

Ask him in which 2 years did I graduate and which 2 Universities, how long I have been a Member of the Institution of Civil Engineers, which very famous Civil Engineer worked for the same Consulting Engineers as me when I was designing Nuclear power stations? Which large bridge projects have I worked on using single pour slipforms or what about the largest raft foundation poured in Scotland by my company, how many piles does it sit on? Clue, the answer is atleast 1000 more than anything I have seen in the marina so far! Yes, there are not many skyscrapers in Scotland or GB for that matter but there is nothing difficult about them, cut and paste as many have already noticed.

Fact, I do know a lot more than the 2 of you put together and still wait to be proved wrong on anything I have said regarding SP or any of their projects. If you keep missleading follower of this forum with your "well pleased with progress" then I will continue to address the balance.:okay:

You don't have to justify your comments, they will soon find out how stupid they were.......... I promise

count me in on that!

Me too, I will be back shortly to educate some on here and to address this rubbish posted above in details and from experience, DS/SG party is over :cheers:

^^I'm confused Mackie - last time you wrote all was good with SP/SG...

You never did get round to telling us all the bad stuff...

^^
^^
^^I'm confused Mackie - last time you wrote all was good with SP/SG...

You never did get round to telling us all the bad stuff...

Me too. I didn't realize it was a competition to see who was right. I assumed i could just offer my opinion on what i see. How wrong am I?

I think progress looks good. It really is that simple.

I don't understand why owners are pleased with receiving such rubbish from SP when the project is only moving at a pedestrian pace. Would you not prefer to read the sort press release I posted stating how the project is ahead of schedule. Remember that Silverene was sold at approx 25% cheaper per square foot that BC and look at the service they are receiving from their developer.

Cayan are not famed for their personal touch or airport meet and greet but they are delivering the goods and that is what counts.

I remember Giles stating that actions will speak louder than words, we are still waiting but all we get is more words.

I don't understand why owners are pleased with receiving such rubbish from SP when the project is only moving at a pedestrian pace. Would you not prefer to read the sort press release I posted stating how the project is ahead of schedule. Remember that Silverene was sold at approx 25% cheaper per square foot that BC and look at the service they are receiving from their developer.

Cayan are not famed for their personal touch or airport meet and greet but they are delivering the goods and that is what counts.

I remember Giles stating that actions will speak louder than words, we are still waiting but all we get is more words.

Fair point can't disagree with that much other than to say the pace of late has increased quite dramatically. It may still be slower than it should be but is faster than it was.

Al Madar open to offer flexible payment plan to customers


Al Madar has invested around Dh2bn in the Dubai realty sector. (SUPPLIED)


By

Anjana Kumar on Wednesday, March 25, 2009

Qatar-based Al Madar Group will be offering flexible payment solutions to its buyers but on a selective basis, said a top company executive.

Mohammad Khazami Zadeh, General Manager, Al Madar Investment, Dubai, told Emirates Business: "We are checking every individual customer and assessing as to who is defaulting. Some of our customers are coming back to us saying they would like to cancel their contracts.

"However, we have not yet cancelled any contracts despite some defaulting. We understand they are not defaulting payments on purpose and we are open to offer a flexible payment plan but on a case-to-case basis."

From late last year, real estate developers have started offering flexible payment options to investors as the financial crisis hit the regional property market.

Al Madar has currently invested around Dh2 billion so far into the realty sector in Dubai. The group is not looking at any consolidation or joint ventures despite the global downturn.

"We have six plots of land in Dubai in all for the six projects that we are developing. We do not have any other land in the emirate."

Zadeh said the company has secured project financing for its Scala Tower, a 18-floor residential project in Business Bay.

"We also have mortgage financing on four of our projects from Abu Dhabi Commercial Bank, Doha Bank and Badr Al Islamic Bank.

"It is a concern for us that banks have lowered lending. Some of our projects received lending up to 90 per cent before the crisis struck, and now our lending ratios have lowered considerably to around 60 per cent to 65 per cent loan-to-value ratio," Zadeh added.

"There is a tough summer ahead and it will be a miracle if the sector sees any surge in real estate prices by then."


:)

You don't have to justify your comments, they will soon find out how stupid they were.......... I promise

Me too, I will be back shortly to educate some on here and to address this rubbish posted above in details and from experience, DS/SG party is over :cheers:

I would ask you to let us in on your information and stop the mind games.

Thanks

You don't have to justify your comments, they will soon find out how stupid they were.......... I promise



Me too, I will be back shortly to educate some on here and to address this rubbish posted above in details and from experience, DS/SG party is over :cheers:

Mackie, your posts on what you found out about the Torch although trailed with "I'm very busy but really you want to hear this exciting, dramatic stuff I am going to tell you" amounted to
- you met Rahail (MD of SG)
- he was professional
- he stated that his focus was delivering the projects
- he wasn't too bothered what investors thought.

I could have saved you the bother of the meeting since you are so busy. Your conclusions are not news to many people. If you ask SP they will tell you exactly this. If you think about it, this is why all SG projects are late but will be built. It is rather obvious isn't it? There is no mistery.

My posts have only been saying
- BC will be built so don't worry about (many investors are). When we see progress improve as it has done since Xmas this is supporting evidence for those investors who are worried. That's all. No mistery.
- it will be late. I think 2012
- SG is proceeding at their pace not ours. This is explained by the above conclusions about Rahail
- there is nothing in practice you can do about it because of the legal set up and the contract terms. RERA are the only ones that can make a difference

It is about setting expectations on what we can acheive. TB is comparing SG with Silverene who have chosen a different approach. He can carry on doing this but what's the point? What would be helpful is if we proceed at the current pace what is the likely handover date? What isn't helpful is what would be the handover date if Silverene's developers were doing the job because they aren't and never will be.

Glover does the same thing and what will he acheive? We all understand SG for what they are. There is no mistery. It is obvious they don't meet investors' initial expectations. Instead of whinging then state what we can do in practice. This would be helpful. Whinging by itself is not. It's a medical problem.

I am a partner in a professional services firm that assists banks monitor and support businesses in financial difficulties (breached convenants typically)but not close to insolvency. If the management team and the staff only see the down side then things don't usually improve and they end up in the next department ie insolvency. In our case if the doom and gloom merchants, who are NOT usually investors, prevail then this might lead to many investors withholding payments leaving the project in financial difficulties with possible insolvency.

Those that aren't as pessimistic and take a more positive pragmatic view to tackling their problems usually avoid insolvency. The point is many if not most investors will now settle for BC being built. "Better late than never". They want it built ASAP and hope this is DEC2010 but if it is later then in practice we have to accept it. Just like investors have done on the Point and the Torch. We will have options to hand them back etc but all this is a long way off and can be considered then. There is nothing on the BC thread that hasn't been said on the threads for the Point and the Torch. Just read them and you'll see. TB has said the same thing 50 times. SG are crap. Does he have to say it again? Would he say this if he were an investor and potentially spook the group into doing something against his and their interests? No he wouldn't. See also the following post from the Point thread yesterday

Quote:
Originally Posted by audir8
True Blue have you read a Point contract? SP do not get the final payment until handover. Handover equals keys in hand and enjoy appt. F..k all to do with SP taking payment now and and delivering next year. Your posts on SSC are always ones I enjoy to read as you obviously have excellent construction knowledge (but has he? his mate thinks he picked up from watching Bob the Builder :)) but your continual slating of SP is so fucki.g boring.

TB says "You must pay before you get keys in hand! It's the time in between that concerns me.
I take on board your comments and in future I will attempt to make my slating less boring "

Someone else thinks the same thing. It's odds on TB hasn't bought anything from SP/SG otherwise he wouldn't be so cavalier and unthinking about his comments.

Glover has said something similar on this thread many times. He should see a doctor. Read Joecool's post. He is a worried investor who has paid 90%. Don't you understand his concerns?

The efforts being made are to improve communication and pressure SG for further delays in payment. We shouldn't have to do this but we have to in practice and it is in our interests to do so. Many investors are pleased with these improvements never the less. Just read their posts. You might think it is small beer but many don't.

Many investors will be very pleased with their apartments when they get them. The location and general environment around the Marina are really top notch.

^^I'm confused Mackie - last time you wrote all was good with SP/SG...

You never did get round to telling us all the bad stuff...

He is a drama queen.

:lol: Hey, I know something about your construction experience or lack of it. I wouldn't be that rude if I was you.


spill the beans on True blue..

spill the beans on True blue..

Sounds kinky! Whipped cream would be more fun:)

...

taken at 11.00am. will post a couple more later once i have more time.

http://i43.tinypic.com/23itiiw.jpg



http://i42.tinypic.com/6gbdp1.jpg

^^Thanks for the pictures

all lower floors looking towards the boat club will have marina quays in the way.. say above 15 and your be ok

thanks for the pictures

Will need to learn how to upload first.

^^ easiest way is on www.tinypic.com

^^ LSTdxb....somehow....i just saw your pictures...taken on 19th March....it looks like hotel tower work has started....???...or not ????

Joannides ..anymore Pictures from other angle???

I don't understand why owners are pleased with receiving such rubbish from SP when the project is only moving at a pedestrian pace. Would you not prefer to read the sort press release I posted stating how the project is ahead of schedule. Remember that Silverene was sold at approx 25% cheaper per square foot that BC and look at the service they are receiving from their developer.

Cayan are not famed for their personal touch or airport meet and greet but they are delivering the goods and that is what counts.

I remember Giles stating that actions will speak louder than words, we are still waiting but all we get is more words.

Fair comment

I have sent the email to the developer via SP now in respect of the following purchasers.

slowhand
beppe
FWIW
ianthy
DXBGO
morrismarina
kuttika
loubylou
DxbPC
dubman
raj 008
nicarzani
Monalisa2
Doctor-uk
bayvee

I will forward you a copy of the email individually at the weekend along with some other observations.

Thanks also to joannides for the pics which show steady progress

slowhand

Joannides ..anymore Pictures from other angle???


here is one more (sorry i thought i had taken more than 3)

http://i44.tinypic.com/9hhzr8.jpg

I have sent the email to the developer via SP now in respect of the following purchasers.

slowhand
beppe
FWIW
ianthy
DXBGO
morrismarina
kuttika
loubylou
DxbPC
dubman
raj 008
nicarzani
Monalisa2
Doctor-uk
bayvee

I will forward you a copy of the email individually at the weekend along with some other observations.

Thanks also to joannides for the pics which show steady progress

slowhand

thanks slow hand . let us see what happens

Thank you:)

We now have 14 supporters

slowhand
beppe
FWIW
ianthy
DXBGO
morrismarina
kuttika
loubylou
DxbPC
dubman
raj 008
nicarzani
uk to dubai
monalisa2

Thanks beppe, FWIW & DXBGO for the info.

We are collectively buying 18 apartments, 5 in central tower and 13 in west tower.

I intend to send the letter on Wednesday requesting a total of 12 months delay ie another 9 months beyond the 3 months already granted.

Last call - any more?

As you can see i was on the list last time...but not this time...any reason????:::ohno:

^^yes it would have been good for us to see a draft and ensure all names were on before sending?

Thanks slowhand99.

cheers slowhand

:banana::banana:am i the only person on this board who is pleased with the current progress, at present i am involved in a coulple of personal build projects in uk and my policy is "let the builders build" I wonder if all you guys would be calling for a payment holiday if it was 3 dollars to the pound instead of 1.40ish...mmmm i wonder.........:banana::banana:

You don't have to justify your comments, they will soon find out how stupid they were.......... I promise



Me too, I will be back shortly to educate some on here and to address this rubbish posted above in details and from experience, DS/SG party is over :cheers:
???

:banana::banana:am i the only person on this board who is pleased with the current progress, at present i am involved in a coulple of personal build projects in uk and my policy is "let the builders build" I wonder if all you guys would be calling for a payment holiday if it was 3 dollars to the pound instead of 1.40ish...mmmm i wonder.........:banana::banana:

All my money in Dubai so exchange not a problem. I am happy with progress but don't understand why you think my money should sit in their account rather than mine. Educate me!

As you can see i was on the list last time...but not this time...any reason????:::ohno:

Your name was included. Sorry I made a cut and paste error when I made the last post.

III. I have set your details on as I had already sent the email.

Apparently these things are considered by a committee which sits every week. There is a few days before the next one I think. I reckon we should hear within 2 weeks.

I had quite a few suggestions on wording and what we should claim. Some of these were incompatible. So I just asked for a 9 month delay on top of the 3 months already announced with a justification based on the loss of use or rental income from the residential units, the adverse impact of the delay to the hotel and in any event our claim was in line with the 12 month delay officially announced.

Circumstances are being aggravated by the rubbishing of the developer and SP online in various places (the deleted enforcer posts on SSC for example) and other threats being made at present to them by SSC members. Shortly the developer may take over all communication with investors. If this happens, it is likely this will be by email only. I expect we will then get little if no communication and our apartments handed over in due course when it suits the developer. SP will be out of the loop.

These SSC members may be seeking to get redress for all of us or just for themselves but the immediate consequences will be
- extra difficulty over the coming months and years selling our apartments especially if there is quite some time to completion because of bad press about SG developments. Comments sometimes linger on the Internet long after they have been made
- a deterioration in communication and an inability to talk to anyone on the phone.

You might want to ask Mackie, Glover and others what are trying to acheive by these tactics? They may think they are smart or like playing the bigshot but are they doing us all a favour? The main reason (and possibly the only reason!) for SP and SG wanting to keep in communication with us and to meet some of our requests is to recreate and maintain goodwill with existing investors. We all have views on this issue. However if THEY think it is a lost cause then why would they bother. Would you in their shoes? (as it is less hassle, easier and cheaper not to). I beleive they are close to this point and making plans right now to do this.

^^^^^^
Thank you:)

dumb and dumber are at it again. they should really stick to "progress is good/great" line. reality is just too uncomfortable for them.

now they are blaming SSC for Select's self-inflicted wounds (which are about to further increase). please go back and hide in your bubble.

as i said before, the day when investors deal directly with Select Group, rather than a selling agent (Select Property), is a day every investor should look forward too.

just for your information, because i don't trust anything Select says over the phone, and to set a record of all their claims, i have asked my account manager to put all communications in writing.

dumb and dumber are at it again. they should really stick to "progress is good/great" line. reality is just too uncomfortable for them.

now they are blaming SSC for Select's self-inflicted wounds (which are about to further increase). please go back and hide in your bubble.

as i said before, the day when investors deal directly with Select Group, rather than a selling agent (Select Property), is a day every investor should look forward too.

just for your information, because i don't trust anything Select says over the phone, and to set a record of all their claims, i have asked my account manager to put all communications in writing.
Glover you are clearly set on a certain plan of attack and disagree with my opinons. Please advise me on how I should deal with the current situation and delay. If you have a clear stratedgy that won't threaten my investMent in any way I will be on board. I am NO different to you other than in the way I express myself.

i think when people type messages on here it sometimes comes across in different way to others..

We have all made and an investement and dont want too harm it..

We should all work together as a team..

nothing we as investors in BC can do that will jeopardize this project.

most investors have already paid over 50% of the value of their properties. Select bought the land before prices rocketed, and was selling BC apartments about 25-30% more than the going rate at the time (I paid 1,360 aed psf in 2007). construction material prices have come down dramatically over the last few months, and thus the cost of building this project will come down quite a bit. overall, Select has done very well financially with this project. Their profit margin is probably 40-50%, so the money they received so far should pretty much cover the cost of the land and building BC.

it is their other projects that could threaten the company and therefore the future of BC. they are way behind in all of them and have not started construction in many of them.

the only way here to regain investor confidence is to genuinely work with investors in these difficult times toward completing these projects. have they done that today! absolutely not in my opinion.

On other news, i just took a walk on JBR podium overlooking BC site. there were workers there on the west tower, about 20 or so. this is the first time i see workers there at 7 pm.

Glover...you used to post best photos...what happen??

nothing we as investors in BC can do that will jeopardize this project.
Slightly disagree with this

most investors have already paid over 50% of the value of their properties. Select bought the land before prices rocketed, and was selling BC apartments about 25-30% more than the going rate at the time (I paid 1,360 aed psf in 2007). construction material prices have come down dramatically over the last few months, and thus the cost of building this project will come down quite a bit. overall, Select has done very well financially with this project. Their profit margin is probably 40-50%, so the money they received so far should pretty much cover the cost of the land and building BC.
100% agree with this.

it is their other projects that could threaten the company and therefore the future of BC. they are way behind in all of them and have not started construction in many of them.
I don't understand this [seriously] as it is a seperate entity and the finances are seperate. Also i believe my funds to be safe in Escrow and until proven by fact, have no reason to doubt this. I pay my funds directly to an escrow with my individual details, name and apt numbers. Surely everyone is the same and no one pays to a general account!!?
Escrow details are something like this

Beneficiary Name: Escrow A/C - Bay C West & C Tower - Bay Central Developments Ltd
Beneficiary's Address: C/O Dubai Islamic Bank, P.O. Box 1080, Dubai
Beneficiary's Bank: Dubai Islamic Bank
Bank Address: P.O. Box 1080 Dubai
Swift Number: DUIBAEAD
Beneficiary's Account No: E*********apt.no.
Reference Number: myname/BC-W apt. no.
The last two details are specific to me with my account number and name present in both.

the only way here to regain investor confidence is to genuinely work with investors in these difficult times toward completing these projects. have they done that today! absolutely not in my opinion.
In my opinion if SP/SG allow for a further break [9 months] or similar] as per the recent movement by a few of us this would suit me and put my mind at ease. I know everyone's circumstances are different so it may not suit all. The more of us working together in a positive manner the better as far as i am concerned. Anyone with ideas that may not have been mentioned so far...let us know.

On other news, i just took a walk on JBR podium overlooking BC site. there were workers there on the west tower, about 20 or so. this is the first time i see workers there at 7 pm.
Great news [i think - yes? no?] - Get some photos and post them. If you can from Oasis Beach tower.

Cheers

I don't understand this [seriously] as it is a seperate entity and the finances are seperate. Also i believe my funds to be safe in Escrow and until proven by fact, have no reason to doubt this.......


If this is the case why don't they send us the relative Escrow Account Bank Statements? No one has ever seen such a statement! In mathematics the process of elimination would lead to the opposite conclusion.

If this is the case why don't they send us the relative Escrow Account Bank Statements? No one has ever seen such a statement! In mathematics the process of elimination would lead to the opposite conclusion.

I assume you have contacted Dubai Islamic bank to discuss the issue with them!

Head Office:

Dubai Islamic Bank PSJ
P.O.Box 1080 Dubai
United Arab Emirates
Tel. : + 971 4 295 3000
Fax : +971 4 295 4111

General Enquiries and Customer Services (Call Center) :
Phone: +971 4 6092222
email: contactus@dib.ae

look lets have some positive talk on here, you all just snipe and whinge..am not a rich man but came in here and took the plunge,blind if you like,and will be fully paid up soon, but hey once a chancer always a chancer, yes were late but these guys will deliver 100% that am sure, exchange rates should not come in to it they should be a positive... always expect the worst ...budget in for it and you will never go wrong...:banana::banana::banana::banana::banana::banana::banana::banana::banana::banana:

look lets have some positive talk on here, you all just snipe and whinge..am not a rich man but came in here and took the plunge,blind if you like,and will be fully paid up soon, but hey once a chancer always a chancer, yes were late but these guys will deliver 100% that am sure, exchange rates should not come in to it they should be a positive... always expect the worst ...budget in for it and you will never go wrong...:banana::banana::banana::banana::banana::banana::banana::banana::banana::banana:

100% agree!!! What tower are you in again?

no where in my post above did i suggest we will loose our money if Select goes down. in fact, even if that happens, the prime location of the project will guaranty that another developer will take over. but if Select gets in trouble, all their subsidiaries/affiliates will suffer, no matter how separate they are legally. if something like this happens, BC could take many years, beyond the forecasted handover date of 2012, to be completed. we are talking handover in 2016/17.

preparing for the worst also includes the worst that could happen to the developer, not only the investor.

no where in my post above did i suggest we will loose our money if Select goes down. in fact, even if that happens, the prime location of the project will guaranty that another developer will take over. but if Select gets in trouble, all their subsidiaries/affiliates will suffer, no matter how separate they are legally. if something like this happens, BC could take many years, beyond the forecasted handover date of 2012, to be completed. we are talking handover in 2016/17.

preparing for the worst also includes the worst that could happen to the developer, not only the investor.

Any chance you could take some decent photos and psot them? Or if anyone has them could they post some?

anyone...pictures please..i think hotel tower work has started ???????

Area hasnt been excavated, so hotel piling not started, all of the hill going into the site will have too be cleared before hotel pilling can start from what i can see

http://i44.tinypic.com/9hhzr8.jpg[/QUOTE]

^^Looking good! Is West tower above street level yet?

^^Looking good! Is West tower above street level yet?

Well above now can see it as you drive past

^^Thanks for confirming - let's all hope that they can get this topped out by Jan/Feb 2010!

I have sent the email to the developer via SP now in respect of the following purchasers.

slowhand
beppe
FWIW
ianthy
DXBGO
morrismarina
kuttika
loubylou
DxbPC
dubman
raj 008
nicarzani
Monalisa2
Doctor-uk
bayvee

I will forward you a copy of the email individually at the weekend along with some other observations.

Thanks also to joannides for the pics which show steady progress

slowhand

Slowhand,

Could you send me a copy of the email you sent please?

Also if any other investors want to be included on my email lists then please private message me your email address. I will email you back!

Thanks!

I would like a copy too please slowhand99. Thanks.

Slowhand,

Could you send me a copy of the email you sent please?

Also if any other investors want to be included on my email lists then please private message me your email address. I will email you back!

Thanks!

Dear Mark



I have been asked by 15 purchasers of apartments in Bay Central who are buying 18 apartments between them to write to the developer and request a further payment delay on instalments for Bay Central. As you know I am buying 2 apartments in Bay Central so this request is on behalf of 16 purchasers. You have told me that the developer has engaged Select Property to interact on their behalf with purchasers and this is why I am writing to you. Details of the purchasers making this request are at the end of this email. Please pass this request to the developer as soon as possible. Please will you confirm by email when you have done this.



The reason for this request is because of delays in construction. The developer has already announced a 12 month delay over the initial plan laid out in our contracts. This delay will mean substantial loss of rental income for some investors. In addition, although you have not published a new completion date for the hotel, you are clearly anticipating this will be quite some time after the residential towers will be handed over. Purchasers will have the inconvenience of construction traffic and noise to contend with after they move in. In addition we will not be able to enjoy the hotel facilities and rental possibilities with the hotel until the hotel is completed.



The developer has announced a 3 month delay in payments already. We are now requesting a further delay in the payment of instalments of 9 months bringing the total delay to 12 months. This matches the delay you have already announced in construction of the residential towers. You will be aware that RERA have made pronouncements on this subject and other developers have rescheduled instalments to be more in line with construction progress.



From your point of view this will go a long way to restoring and maintaining goodwill with purchasers and investors.



We look forward to receiving an early response from the developer.



Regards


It has been confirmed by Mark Stott that this email will be put before the developer's next committee meeting.

^^Thanks. We await a decision!

^^
Is the payment delay available to purchasers on the 15yr LPP as well?

I am sure this has been answered before - sorry for asking again please could someone confirm the name of project/building next to the west tower. The building looks fairly low rise, i just want to understand how tall this building will be and the impact on views.

thks

Ianthy

I am sure this has been answered before - sorry for asking again please could someone confirm the name of project/building next to the west tower. The building looks fairly low rise, i just want to understand how tall this building will be and the impact on views.

thks

Ianthy

Marina Quays - http://www.emaar.com/index.aspx?page=emaaruae-dubaimarina-marinaquays

Below floor 12 [ish] in BC will have views blocked by it. Above floor 12 will look over Yacht Bay etc.

cheers!

Bay Central One bed for sale - West Tower 1601 Marina facing

Just decided to put my apartment up for sale. 771 sq ft. On Lengthy Payment plan so no mortgage needed. Will have nice view, high enough to see Yacht Club.

PM me if interested.

Re loss of rental income.

I don't see how you have a case for loss of rental income as the project is not overdue. It can only be claimed from the due date and at market rates prevailing at that time. We all know that the market for rentals has slowed considerably but we don't know what the market will be in the future.

When Park Island, Maina Quays, The Point, The Torch etc are all finished there will be plenty of empty units on the market trying to find tenants. I now realise that DCE have done me and others a big favour by being so inept at finishing projects on time.

:banana2:D C E :banana:

Re loss of rental income.

I don't see how you have a case for loss of rental income as the project is not overdue. It can only be claimed from the due date and at market rates prevailing at that time. We all know that the market for rentals has slowed considerably but we don't know what the market will be in the future.

When Park Island, Maina Quays, The Point, The Torch etc are all finished there will be plenty of empty units on the market trying to find tenants. I now realise that DCE have done me and others a big favour by being so inept at finishing projects on time.

:banana2:D C E :banana:

What is the point of this post?

^^
Is the payment delay available to purchasers on the 15yr LPP as well?

Yes it should be as both parties are affected the same.

A construction delay moves the incoming cash flow back for both parties in the same way and hence the economic cost is the same for both LPP as direct payment plans.

An example. Say you had calculated a net rental income of 8% of purchase price, delayed 2 years, then all of us are losing 16% income. Delaying payment by 2 years has an actual much lower economic value for most of us.

In LLP, we pay typically 2% of the unit price per quarter, ie 8% pa. The economic just compensation would be not only to delay payment but to cancel out the payment all together, ie to delete or compensate pay for 2 years. This would match our loss of 16%.

The comfort zone compensation may however be different for each position.

- LPP - financial compensation or equivalent in delay of payments
- Direct having paid most - compensate by paying interest over part paid "too early"
- Direct paid around 50% - allow payment holiday.

Hope this helps
:)

Bay Central One bed for sale - West Tower 1601 Marina facing

Just decided to put my apartment up for sale. 771 sq ft. On Lengthy Payment plan so no mortgage needed. Will have nice view, high enough to see Yacht Club.

PM me if interested.

Morris, do we not loose the LPP facility once sold to another person ?

cheers!

You need a lot heigher than the top of the Marine Quays (id 12 floors) to see the water and the boats in the Marina For a lcear view, I think it maybe a difference of at least 6-7 floors

does anyone have the latest pictures???....it should be doing well...

.Botanica Pilling work has started...SP has just confirmed that and also posted some pictures.....also confirm 6 months payment holiday...

this is positive move from SP and if their all projects are on progress and also look after their customer in terms of payment break etc......it can become reputed company in middle east...and i may invest once again in near future..

think we should get atleast same period for payment break....

Morris, do we not loose the LPP facility once sold to another person ?

The LPP can be transferred.

You need a lot heigher than the top of the Marine Quays (id 12 floors) to see the water and the boats in the Marina For a lcear view, I think it maybe a difference of at least 6-7 floors

its the middle tower (Quays) that you have too be high enough too look over it and into the water.. ill say from the central tower around 20 and above

its the middle tower (Quays) that you have too be high enough too look over it and into the water.. ill say from the central tower around 20 and above

http://www.ameinfo.com/images/news/4/12224-emaar23.jpg

I don't understand why its the middle tower and above 20. The two smaller towers are only 12 floors high [with tallest tower at 39] and BC sits on a 6 storey podium. So to be safe i would assume above 12 as BC podium takes that up another few. Or am i missing something?

^^ yeah too look over it into the distance you would be fine.. but you need too be higher too look over it into the water or at the boats

view video of BC made a while back

View My Video (http://tinypic.com/player.php?v=86iprie&s=1)

view video of BC made a while back

View My Video (http://tinypic.com/player.php?v=86iprie&s=1)

What is it showing and what are the spots and how was it composed?

....

What is the point of this post?

SP bashing by TB again, it's rumoured that he was rejected a job by them by personally don't think so. I think he likes having an audience and preaching :cheers:

view video of BC made a while back

View My Video (http://tinypic.com/player.php?v=86iprie&s=1)

Hi Beppe.
Could you please post March update for SP including pictures as you are very good in uploading that.

Thank you

^^ SP havent sent me the march/april update yet.

Hi Beppe.
Could you please post March update for SP including pictures as you are very good in uploading that.

Thank you

March update was on post 3203. Did you mean April? I haven't recieved that yet.

Thanks Beppe,Dxbpc...i mean April Update for the month of March09...

anyone Pictures please.....

Thanks Beppe,Dxbpc...i mean April Update for the month of March09...

anyone Pictures please.....

will get some around 15 th april and post them on return around 21st april:cheers:

Not vital for this forum = straight to the trashbin!

Not vital for this forum = straight to the trashbin!

Ok.

Hi i am new on here i have got a property on aquitainia and have not payed the jan 09 payment and think a lot of other people havent either, i have been in talks with sp and now have been told the payments are on hold for now.
Has anybody else got a property on aquitainia and have you made the payment and what have you been told off sp.

Welcome Invester, what percentage have you paid so far and how much per sq foot? Perhaps you might want to suggest to Select that you do a trade for something in the torch. They will have plenty of them to sell in the summer.

i have payed 15% so far at 5089dirhams (£978 per sq foot) i have suggested a change of development to sp but had no answer yet they havent been too intrested do have a property there

sorry do you have a property on there

Try insisting rather than suggesting. Thats a lot of money and who knows at the moment what will happen. You will get 4 in the torch for the same money. I have studio in the bay central and 1 bed in the point. Good luck.

do you know of anybody else that has been granted this

No, be first.

thanks if anybody elso knows anything about this or has a property on aquitainia please let me know it will be much appreciated

Just wondering, if anybody is aware of the current market price for the square foot in W-Bay Central, please share with us. I have to sell 1 of my 2 apts.(It is a 2bedroom) and I want to price it right.I appreciate your input and I am very pleased with the progress. This is a beautiful project and an excellent location.Let 's hope all goes well.

Just wondering, if anybody is aware of the current market price for the square foot in W-Bay Central, please share with us. I have to sell 1 of my 2 apts.(It is a 2bedroom) and I want to price it right.I appreciate your input and I am very pleased with the progress. This is a beautiful project and an excellent location.Let 's hope all goes well.

This as is published in today's Gulf News -

http://www.gnads4u.com/doc.html?_a=view&id=5353164

BAY CENTRAL
1 Bedroom
16th Floor
Full Marina View
827.83 sq.ft.
AED 1,760,273

Works out around AED 2100 psf - Hopeful!!

Thanks for a quick feedback.I was thinking slightly less than 1700, is that low?
What price would be considered a "good deal:banana:" for somebody???

^^
It will be nothing short of a miracle if you sell it for more than 1,000 psf.

There are completed properties in the Marina NOT SELLING for less than this now, and regardless of what drugs you prefer to indulge in Bay Central will not handover for at least 3 years.

Good luck anyway.

Is it something you have seen or just an opinion? would you be able to share where are these apartments located?
We must be responsible and accurate in our postings so we don't cause unecessary panic which adds to anxiety among investors. I appreciate your feedback on this to have better understanding.

Here is an example for you;

Completed ready to move in 2 bed AED 1,493,500 @ 1,739 sqf = AED 858 psf.

http://www.bhomes.com/UAE/residential/sales/Dubai/Dubai_Marina/DEC_Tower_2/248018.xhtml

This is asking price so you can knock 10%-20% off this at the moment too.

I hope this is responsible and accurate enough for you. :)

I agree with High Times but there is one advantage we have in this devlopment is payment plan...we have LPP which can attract safe investor...remember if you want to buy a apartment @1000 AED..you need to pay cash...which is a problem at the moment....so i would say around 1300 AED would be fine considering that BC have a great flexible payment plan which no other developer is offering...my view...

The Great Imre is Back Yday...so we may see some more picturs soon...

anyone latest pictures please

Thanks for your reply.The issue of LLP makes sense. True that with credit crunch people have more difficulty coming up with the cash. That is why I liked SP, LLP+escrow.

okay, calling all readers, I will go between the 1700 and the 1000!
1350/sq.ft with option taking over the LLP I have, if interested, you know what to do at the sound of the beep!
You can go:banana: now
:)



P.S: High Times, you have been accurate and responsible.Thank you. You know what I meant.

okay, calling all readers, I will go between the 1700 and the 1000!
1350/sq.ft with option taking over the LLP I have, if interested, you know what to do at the sound of the beep!
You can go:banana: now
:)



P.S: High Times, you have been accurate and responsible.Thank you. You know what I meant.

It's nice when we can all play nice together!

monalisa2 - What floor and which tower is it in? Also what do you think the view will be like?

An ex teacher I guess always a moderator?
Mine is the 29th floor. West tower.

Once a teacher always a teacher! LOL.

Can I ask miss another question?
Al Fattan view, marina view towards Dubai Marina, marina view towards Marina Quays or Shopping Mall view?

Yes, it has marina view toward Dubai Marina view.If you look at plans it is 2905.
You got an A on your reading research.I love it!

Nice to see this thread has turned into a market place.


We must be responsible and accurate in our postings so we don't cause unecessary panic which adds to anxiety among investors.

^^Made me smile:). BTW I'm in MIA at the moment if you want to hunt me down and bash me.:lol:

Imre...please post some BC pictures...Thanks

Bay Central One bed for sale - West Tower 1601 Marina facing

Just decided to put my apartment up for sale. 771 sq ft. On Lengthy Payment plan so no mortgage needed. Will have nice view, high enough to see Yacht Club.

PM me if interested.
Market place indeed ..Even the man behind shifting some BC apartments is putting he's apt up for sale ... Maybe for personal reasons, maybe not. I guess, no hotel announcement is forthcoming.

I hope there is nothing wrong with "market place"
where would it be more relevant to discuss this other than with other BC investors???
You are safe True Blue,I am in Dubai. Enjoy MIA while you are there.Bayside is available whenever you miss the marina:)
The home prices there will remind you of Dubai's market too.

Here is an example for you;

Completed ready to move in 2 bed AED 1,493,500 @ 1,739 sqf = AED 858 psf.

http://www.bhomes.com/UAE/residential/sales/Dubai/Dubai_Marina/DEC_Tower_2/248018.xhtml

This is asking price so you can knock 10%-20% off this at the moment too.

I hope this is responsible and accurate enough for you. :)

Not really responsible as you have chosen the cheapest on the web. Below is one of the many for sale in Dorra Bay with better homes priced at 2000psf. They range from 1500 - 2000 depending on floor and view.


Apartment - Dorra Bay322Panoramic views of the marina
Ref No: AP230902
Location: Dubai, Marina Emirates Living District, Dubai MarinaApprox. size: 1,775 sq.ft
Approx. price: AED 3,708,000

DEC towers are alot cheaper

marina most expensive side is the tallest block then as you go down it gets cheaper DEC is right on the other side/ but the development aswell makes a difference in price

Not really responsible as you have chosen the cheapest on the web. Below is one of the many for sale in Dorra Bay with better homes priced at 2000psf. They range from 1500 - 2000 depending on floor and view.

Keep on deluding yourself buddy.

There are many COMPLTED UNITS in the Marina being OFFERED for sale at less than 1,000 psf. I get them in my inbox every other day.

The clue here sparky is that they are FOR SALE not SOLD.

You, nor I for that matter, have a clue what units are actually selling for but i bet my nuts that it's LESS than the asking price. By at least 10% i expect.

Still if it makes you happy to belive that Bay Central units can sell for 1,700 psf whilst the podium is still incomplete when there are empty completed units for sale at just over 50% of that figure then thats cool.

I was just offering some realistic advice to someone who asked. Maybe you could give her your Select Property account managers phone number. I'm sure they will agree with whatever you say.

At least he supported that there are such prices. I agree location in the marina does make a difference.
So, 10% off 1500 which is the lowest end of the range is 1350.
Still in the market, then offering it at 1350/sq.ft, going once, going twice...going checking my full inbox!

Keep on deluding yourself buddy.

There are many COMPLTED UNITS in the Marina being OFFERED for sale at less than 1,000 psf. I get them in my inbox every other day.

The clue here sparky is that they are FOR SALE not SOLD.

You, nor I for that matter, have a clue what units are actually selling for but i bet my nuts that it's LESS than the asking price. By at least 10% i expect.

Still if it makes you happy to belive that Bay Central units can sell for 1,700 psf whilst the podium is still incomplete when there are empty completed units for sale at just over 50% of that figure then thats cool.

I was just offering some realistic advice to someone who asked. Maybe you could give her your Select Property account managers phone number. I'm sure they will agree with whatever you say.

Very condescending. I am guessing you are very insecure and consider yourself an "expert"?
I "gave examples" as you did from two sources one of which you quoted...not my opinion.
My point is depending on where, when, what and what reason you are selling there are many differentials. You quoted a bottom end unit at the bottom end of the Marina. Surely your genuis allows you that insight?
By the way not interested in the price as i am not interested in selling.
Cheers

ok, why this sounds familiar...
It is ok to disagree, you were both very helpful indeed.
We can see the cup half full or half empty.It is the same cup, okay?:grouphug:

^^Hello miss talking about cups is distracting me from my classwork...:lol:

..

Its all about what you GOT for it. HT you seem a sensible guy, we have just sold and I dont mean August or Sept I mean within the last 28 days a 1 bed in The Point in its present stage of construction a 10 style appt (THE BEST 1 BED IN THE TOWER) 758 sq ft. DIRECT YATCH CLUB VIEW. You tell me how much? Now we are talking FACT, not bollocks from your muggy gnads mags or drunk Barasti bar real estate agents talk, FACT, and Fact is what you all need to get your head around. Put em up at what you want and take a punt, if they aint eating no corn, you can afford to wait. But too many are too streched and need to get out.
Paloma 1664sq ft high floor 03 great flat on at 2m before you bash em up. Easy converts to 3 bed. This is a steal, All about circumstance.

Hi Invester, i also have a property on aquitainia for my sins,nick to see someone

Hi Mick have you payed your jan-09 payment?

Hi Invester no i haven't paid jan 09 payment expecting reminder in june, i have spoken to sp as well with no joy about swopping to different development so not looking good.

Hi Invester just noticed you have opened new thread for aquitainia will post on new thread

ok see you on there

:hilarious

How much is it ?

05/April/2009

Bay Central

http://i44.tinypic.com/2pze9vk.jpg

http://i40.tinypic.com/evbb7k.jpg

http://i41.tinypic.com/6h55lk.jpg

http://i39.tinypic.com/976t4w.jpg

new advertising on the red bit.. podium is coming along

Thanks for pics Imre

07/April/2009

Bay Central

http://i44.tinypic.com/14jpagm.jpg

http://i42.tinypic.com/a3hykk.jpg

http://i40.tinypic.com/6pukyf.jpg

http://i41.tinypic.com/29mueqt.jpg

http://i41.tinypic.com/2v0206t.jpg

^^Thanks Imre - :applause:

trucks are coming in and out.. over the hotel tower plot.. They need to make another enterance to the site only then they can work on the hotel piling

would have been good at this stage too see all three towers rising

^^Thanks Imre - :applause:

bravo IMRE :righton:

trucks are coming in and out.. over the hotel tower plot.. They need to make another enterance to the site only then they can work on the hotel piling

would have been good at this stage too see all three towers rising

if the hotel is going to be in a similar position as west tower ie near the road but at the other end of the site, it is difficult to see how they would maintain access to the site given its semi-circular shape and current access point.

we are due an update shortly which might give us a clue about what is going to happen re the hotel and when.

no news yet re our request for a further delay on paying instalments. Should hear within a week now I would guess.

they are making steady progress though on the two residential towers as well as the Point, Torch and now Botanica all of which is reassuring that the developer will complete (unlike quite a few other Marina developements according to High Times' chart on the Dubai Marina thread). Hopefully the developer will learn from the completion and handover processes (their first ones) for the Point and Torch to smooth out those for BC.

I agree it would be great if all 3 towers were rising together

im hoping we get a delay in payments but even better if the new law linking payments comes into place officially.

Have to say am quite pleased with the progress here as well as with TP, TT and Botanica. SP keep it up now and get back some customer confidence! This developement will start to turn heads once/if the hotel starts rising...

I agree with the postive comments - I am encouraged by the progress. I am no building/contruction expert but even I can see the difference compared to when i was on holiday in Dubai 3 weeks ago. SP made a shakey start but they now seem to be delivering the goods.

I am looking forward to the next update plus fingers crossed regarding a further payment delay.

Big thks for photos Imrie - keep them coming!

Ianthy

Saw it yesterday, progressing very fast and many workers on the site :banana2:

Desert diver...have you got any pictures??? please take some when you pass by..
thanks...i have seen your pictures posted on your thread...its simply amazing...

^^ Thanks :) Actually I saw BC the evening before yesterday when I didnt bring my camera (was just walking around JBR and the Walk). When I went to Dubai Marina yesterday I didnt walk past BC, so unfortunately I dont have any recent pics. Anyways they wouldnt be better than the ones Imre provided ;)

[IMG]

today, 3 pm west tower. saw only a handful of workers onsite.

http://img8.imageshack.us/img8/3941/img0231dtm.jpg (http://img8.imageshack.us/my.php?image=img0231dtm.jpg)

http://img206.imageshack.us/img206/2904/img0233.jpg (http://img206.imageshack.us/my.php?image=img0233.jpg)

http://img512.imageshack.us/img512/4757/img0234k.jpg (http://img512.imageshack.us/my.php?image=img0234k.jpg)

http://img9.imageshack.us/img9/151/img0235g.jpg (http://img9.imageshack.us/my.php?image=img0235g.jpg)

http://img403.imageshack.us/img403/1562/img0238s.jpg (http://img403.imageshack.us/my.php?image=img0238s.jpg)

Thats because they are all enjoying a holiday in The Highlands see post 3444.

You pay peanuts, you get monkeys............

Beppe, I think you are not helping the cause by posting these type of photo's.

So where is the third tower - from what I could figure out today, the central and west are there, but the third hasn't even broken ground. I took a load of pics but think that Glovers pretty much cover it. FYI, when I was there at about 2.30pm today, there were workers crowding at the gate, so could have been shift change.

I'm not presently an owner, so feel like a bit of an interloper on this forum, but I'm thinking about picking up a 1bd from a friend who needs to get out - got credit crunched in the UK. Insane? Appreciate any insights. I'm waiting on info from him as to what is left to pay, and whether it is even possible to buy outright.

Happy to share the images with anyone interested. Trying to figure out how to upload them when flikr is blocked, any hints?

try tinypics
or forward it to Beppe

Preliminary works for phase one of the Al Sufouh Transit System project have started, a Dubai transport chief announced on Tuesday.

Story continues...
http://www.arabianbusiness.com/544962-preliminary-works-start-on-al-sufouh-tram-project

Preliminary works for phase one of the Al Sufouh Transit System project have started, a Dubai transport chief announced on Tuesday.

Story continues...
http://www.arabianbusiness.com/544962-preliminary-works-start-on-al-sufouh-tram-project
With infrastructure like this in the pipeline I am convinced this area will suceed - roll on 2011 !!

With infrastructure like this in the pipeline I am convinced this area will suceed - roll on 2011 !!

improvement in transport infrastructure expecially urban trams increases popularity of an area and prices tend to go up. Completion of this new system should roughly the time BC completes.

pictures of site offices are on Dubai Marina thread post 4204.

any ideas on the route or where the stations will be on this new section?

glover thanks for pics.

looks like further work being done on podium surrounding the towers. Maybe when the podium is at road height this will provide a means of extra access to the site?

improvement in transport infrastructure expecially urban trams increases popularity of an area and prices tend to go up. Completion of this new system should roughly the time BC completes.

pictures of site offices are on Dubai Marina thread post 4204.

any ideas on the route or where the stations will be on this new section?

Roughly

http://i39.tinypic.com/mtp3lu.jpg

if your eyes are good you will see there is a station outside BC. Good...i think!
http://i41.tinypic.com/29dg414.jpg

It looks like there will be only 2 marina stataions inside the marina and one is just outside of the BC...Great News

Yes, and the other right outside The Point, things are looking for Select now.

It looks like there will be only 2 marina stataions inside the marina and one is just outside of the BC...Great News
Very good news --- i've resigned myself to waiting anyway but it will definitely be worth the wait I think

Found this...worth a look.

Yd0BydsBoDE

Very good news --- i've resigned myself to waiting anyway but it will definitely be worth the wait I think

the marina has all the ingredients to be a very, very desirable place to live or go on vacation for many people ie beach, marina, many cafes and restaurants, places to stroll ie the WALK, high quality developments, good transport infrastructure, good quality hotels, tax free business environment, regulated business environment, affordable freehold properties etc

I reckon the Marina will be THE place to live in Dubai for many.

regarding investment potential only doubt is the number of properties being built ie potential oversupply. Reckon it will hinge on how quickly the credit crunch lasts and/or time taken for global business sentiment to pick up to former levels. If this takes 3 to 5 years then financial returns may not be that great. However if it takes 1 to 2 years then BC is looking good if not great.

[QUOTE=DxbPC;35033468]Roughly



if your eyes are good you will see there is a station outside BC. Good...i think!

Good work DxbPC! A change of fortune since Xmas for BC investors - things are looking much more promising now.

The last uncertainty is the hotel. We should get an update on this soon.

Found this...worth a look.

Typical "spin" though this implies it is already running !!
- it'll be great when it is though !!

Beppe, I think you are not helping the cause by posting these type of photo's.

whats wrong with my picture.. its a ture representation of select they have been lying too everyone untill they are red in the face..

I was in dubai 10-13th April

I took these pictures on 11th. around 21:30.
I saw 20+ workers on site around that time.

http://img4.imageshack.us/img4/8918/dsc00440xrl.jpg
http://img13.imageshack.us/img13/8986/dsc00442q.jpg
http://img23.imageshack.us/img23/5985/dsc00443q.jpg

^^Thanks for that last picture AZ - It really shows how much higher they are now compared to the pavement.

Let's hope that this increased level of construction continues and recent,published deadline of Dec 2010 can be met.

around end of march

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3560/3436400140_e0a1cdd9b1_b.jpg

Few days old.. you can get a good view of overall progress

http://i41.tinypic.com/27zf804.jpg

http://i41.tinypic.com/2h7mjp4.jpg

I have tried to create a simple chart that will hopefully track progress...Not to scale but should give a visual timeline.

http://i39.tinypic.com/9gdeyu.jpg

I was in dubai 10-13th April

I took these pictures on 11th. around 21:30.
I saw 20+ workers on site around that time.

http://img23.imageshack.us/img23/5985/dsc00443q.jpg

Good photos and good positive news. Thanks.

I like to know if anybody has had their units registered with the Land Registry yet ?? I paid the fee in August last year and still not registered.

I like to know if anybody has had their units registered with the Land Registry yet ?? I paid the fee in August last year and still not registered.

I have been told that registration has gone through last week for my apartment and to expect the documentation withinin the next two weeks.
I have also explained if this is not forthcoming i insist on my registration fees back until such time as they need it. Will keep you posted.

I have tried to create a simple chart that will hopefully track progress...Not to scale but should give a visual timeline.

http://i39.tinypic.com/9gdeyu.jpg

I think even if this complicated build is toped out early next year, one would be looking at a hand over 2012 at best assuming no more go slows or financial wows !
So please don,t dream of a 2010 comp :)
it ain,t gonna happen !

I think even if this complicated build is toped out early next year, one would be looking at a hand over 2012 at best assuming no more go slows or financial wows !
So please don,t dream of a 2010 comp :)
it ain,t gonna happen !

Don't get me wrong - I am still sticking to my original guess of Sept 2011.
But like Obama, I have hope and SP keep telling me "Yes we can"!:banana:

I have been told that registration has gone through last week for my apartment and to expect the documentation withinin the next two weeks.

how many times have we heard that from select!!

^^I already got my OQOOD receipts from SP. Am I the only one who has them? :ohno:

how many times have we heard that from select!!
I have never had them tell me that something has gone through before. Up until several days ago they told me it hadn't been done and explained why. I confirmed this with Land Reg in Dubai. I have no reason to doubt them and will keep you updated. If i don't recieve them by Friday i have demamded a full return of reg fees.

^^I already got my OQOOD receipts from SP. Am I the only one who has them? :ohno:

Is it from RERA or SP???

Is it from RERA or SP???

SP emailed a PDF to me that contains the output from the RERA and Dubai Land Department's OQOOD system.

Has details of the voucher numbers and 1% paid by each party.

Just ask your account manager and they should be able to get it for you. May take a few weeks though.

Thanks for the info.

how many times have we heard that from select!!

Recieved registration documents through today

http://i40.tinypic.com/315xsg0.jpg
http://i39.tinypic.com/k2z18w.jpg
http://i44.tinypic.com/r86xya.jpg
http://i42.tinypic.com/2a8nnds.jpg
http://i39.tinypic.com/2zs37z6.jpg

^^^^^^
Structure of Basements: Start, March 2009 - Finish April 2009 (no start yet)
Structure of Podium: Start, April 2009 - Finish April 2009 (no start yet)

as my pictures show, already behind their own revised schedule only few months after promising that this time around, they mean business.

and even if they get the permit for the hotel this month, it will take weeks, if not months, to mobilize the site and start piling.

^^^^^^
Structure of Basements: Start, March 2009 - Finish April 2009 (no start yet)
Structure of Podium: Start, April 2009 - Finish April 2009 (no start yet)

as my pictures show, already behind their own revised schedule only few months after promising that this time around, they mean business.

and even if they get the permit for the hotel this month, it will take weeks, if not months, to mobilize the site and start piling.

Not an expert so apologies if I've misunderstood it, but doesn't it look like the basemets and podium have in fact started? The first picture on the SP update looks like the construction of the villas at the bottom of the project. Wouldn't that be the basement&podium levels?

hi there,

is anyone else on the long term payment plan that has enquired into what the compensation will be if the project runs over dec 31st 2010? i did speak to DS and it doesn’t sound great, also they only pay the penalty once the property is complete we still need to maintain the quarterly payments, if anyone has info regarding this please post threads, I was under the impression that they would begin to pay us if they were late by over 1 yr, but its more like a credit on completion and I still don’t know how it will work in practice,

thanks in advance

^^Don't worry about it - they will claim Force Majeure before paying us poor investors any compensation as per SPA...

BTW my contract states (and has been confirmed in a seperate email from my account manager) that compensation would be paid quarterly.

Finish of superstructure Dec '09 = topped out! Yeah of course... :rofl:

Still calling it The East Tower...........

Still calling it The East Tower...........Because it will be apartments now ?

http://www.clydeco.com/knowledge/articles/dubai-real-estate-alert-dubai-law-13-amendment-issued.cfm

http://www.clydeco.com/knowledge/articles/dubai-real-estate-alert-dubai-law-13-amendment-issued.cfm

This is important:

(c) Where construction has commenced but construction of less than 60% of the project has been completed, the developer may revoke the contract and retain 25% of the purchase price.

This is important:

(c) Where construction has commenced but construction of less than 60% of the project has been completed, the developer may revoke the contract and retain 25% of the purchase price.

The context of the above statement is when a purchaser defaults on his property. It is not a stand alone statement as written here. It is ONLY in reference to purchasers that default on their contractual obligation. So in other words it should read

If a purchaser defaults on his contractual obligation and where construction has commenced but construction of less than 60% of the project has been completed, the developer may revoke the defaulting purchaser's contract and retain 25% of the purchase price.

In isolation, the statement in your post was very misleading and could be read as a sweeping statement.

^^OK whatever makes you happy. I just didn't want to repost the whole thing. The bit that is important to me is that the developer can keep 25% of purchase price if investor defaults. This affects people on the LPP because we are all under 25% of contractual purchase price.

^^OK whatever makes you happy. I just didn't want to repost the whole thing. The bit that is important to me is that the developer can keep 25% of purchase price if investor defaults. This affects people on the LPP because we are all under 25% of contractual purchase price.

I genuinely don't understand statement " we are all under 25%"! do you mean you have paid less than 25% or if you default you will lose 25%. I have a unit on lpp and I have paid 50% towards total.
As I keep saying - don't default. If people think they can stop paying and get all their money back then the projects would stop. This law is required.
BTW - if someone from UK defaults and takes a 25% hit they will still get all their money back and a wee bit extra too assuming they bought at aed 6.9 or above and they exchange it back to £'s.
Just a thought

^^OK whatever makes you happy. I just didn't want to repost the whole thing. The bit that is important to me is that the developer can keep 25% of purchase price if investor defaults. This affects people on the LPP because we are all under 25% of contractual purchase price.

Hey Sunny dont you go defaulting on your payments over the next 4 years buddy. If you get a bit short let me know, as it happens i'm feeling a bit flush lately. Some of my insane UK Bank investments are starting to bear fruits.

He who dares Rodney. :)

My generic advice on UK Bank shares is that they hold good value for a long term investor. Long term being 4 years plus. The prospect of a 100% return on UK Bank shares proir to your keys being handed over at BC is still a recomendation that i would stand by.

you do lose credibility when you recommend UK bank shares (as you have for many months). All UK banks are technically insolvent and all inc Barclays will require capital injections by UK govt over the coming months.

Sorry - Barclays closed 10p down at 88p. RBS now 11.60p only 63% down on day. Now short selling is allowed again, banking shares are likely for forseeable future to go one way ie down.

In comparison values at BC has now probably bottomed, will stay there for a time and will rise with construction progress.

http://i39.tinypic.com/2prgtig.jpg

So thats 88p - £2.27. a return of 259% in 3 months.

Slowhand best you steer away from investment advice and stick to promoting the interests of Select Property. Thats what you seem to be good at.

This is important:

(c) Where construction has commenced but construction of less than 60% of the project has been completed, the developer may revoke the contract and retain 25% of the purchase price.

This has always been the case - at least on contracts I have that are two years old

HT - yes Barclays were ok werent they 50p now £2+ - thanks for the advice at the time

Hey Sunny dont you go defaulting on your payments over the next 4 years buddy. If you get a bit short let me know, as it happens i'm feeling a bit flush lately. Some of my insane UK Bank investments are starting to bear fruits.

He who dares Rodney. :)







http://i39.tinypic.com/2prgtig.jpg

So thats 88p - £2.27. a return of 259% in 3 months.

Slowhand best you steer away from investment advice and stick to promoting the interests of Select Property. Thats what you seem to be good at.

easiest thing in the world to pick low points and with hindsight claim investment prowess when shares climb. It's called delusion. Like I said previously most people including you haven't got a clue which way a particular share will go

we've seen it with oil where goldman sachs (reputedly the smartest guys)said oil would hit $200 a barrel and where is it now, $50. where will it be in 6 months? who knows

go on clever dick tell us where individual bank shares will be in 3, 6, 9 months time and we will see how smart you are

easiest thing in the world to pick low points and with hindsight claim investment prowess when shares climb. It's called delusion. Like I said previously most people including you haven't got a clue which way a particular share will go

we've seen it with oil where goldman sachs (reputedly the smartest guys)said oil would hit $200 a barrel and where is it now, $50. where will it be in 6 months? who knows

go on clever dick tell us where individual bank shares will be in 3, 6, 9 months time and we will see how smart you are

Oil $70 by October
Bank shares ?? Better than they were 2 months months ago !
And that will be good news for all of us in UK and DUBAI
I,M ONLY GUESSING MIND YOU !!

ps BC West and Central topped out by this time next year ?

easiest thing in the world to pick low points and with hindsight claim investment prowess when shares climb. It's called delusion. Like I said previously most people including you haven't got a clue which way a particular share will go

go on clever dick tell us where individual bank shares will be in 3, 6, 9 months time and we will see how smart you are

You really are an amateur.

Tell me something wise guy? Did i have hindsight back in Oct/Nov/Dec when i started entering the market and continued to buy as prices were diving throughout the crisis? I seem to remember you and your gang were all laughing at me back then?

The truth of the matter is I still hold Bank stock that I am showing losses on, but I will hold that for my investment term of 5 years +. Due to my hindsight, knowledge, expertise, balls, brains call it whatever you like I have also made massive gains on Bank stock this year. Investment profits your sorry little arse can only dream about because you are too spineless to dare when there is uncertainty. There is still a long way to go and within 2-3 years Barclays will be back around £3.00 - £4.00 other UK Bank stock will recover along similar lines too.

As for picking low points I used YOUR dates, NOT mine. If I wanted to pick low points I would have chosen 0.59p on the 22nd January. That would then equate to 385% return to date and the markets are still trading 40% down on a year ago.

I picked the dates that you were feeling big and brave and were mocking my suggestion that UK Bank shares represented better value than Investing in Bay Central at the time.

This is the way it works:

When all those scared little loosers (you and your gang), were worried that the UK banking system was going to collapse. You ran for cover and sold all your stock. That's when the clever people like me and my gang were happy to take your stock off your hands because we could see you were frightened little boys in a big mans world.

Now that the storm is beginning to ease, more people want to buy back their stock becuase they are not so scared anymore and the government is using their tax money to support all the nasty Banks anyway.

This is when the clever people say "ok you can have your stock back but you pay my price", which is a lot more than i paid you 2-3 months ago.

Do you get it now ? or do you want me to draw you a picture.

Anyway apologies to Bay Central investors for this brief interlude but you should all be warned that Mr Slowhand is nothing more than an SP mouthpiece and you should not take his representations seriously regarding either construction progress or indeed what constitutes an investment oportunity.

Good luck to all with this one. :cheers:

http://www.clydeco.com/knowledge/articles/dubai-real-estate-alert-dubai-law-13-amendment-issued.cfm

all in favor of the developer...

when they releasing the new contruction linked with payments?