Jews have been living in Iran for over two thousand five hundred years. From the time when Cyrus the Great, freed them from Babylonian captivity.

"Persian Jews, Iranian Jews, or the 'Jews of Persia' are Jews historically affiliated with the Persian Empire or the modern country of Iran.

Judaism is one of the oldest religions practiced in Iran and dates back to the late biblical times. The biblical books of Isaiah, Daniel, Ezra, Nehemiah, Chronicles, and Esther contain references to the life and experiences of Jews in Persia.

Today, the largest groups of Persian Jews are found in Israel including second-generation Israelis and the United States especially in the Los Angeles area and Great Neck, New York"

Iran currently has the largest Jewish population in the Middle East, (after Israel).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persian_Jews

"Bukharan Jews (Bukhoran Jews, Bukhari Jews) is a blanket term for Jews from Central Asia who speak Bukhori, a dialect of the Persian language."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bukharan_Jews

Jews of the Caucaus region :

"In terms of ethnic origin, it is assumed that the Mountain Jews and Tats have inhabited Caucasia for a long time. Their distant forefathers once lived in southwest Persia, the south-western part of present-day Iran. It was there that they adopted the Middle Persian language."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mountain_Jew

http://www.iranchamber.com/history/cyrus/cyrus_decree_jews.php

:)

I posted this information so that more people can learn about the history of Persian Jews. Persian Jews have contributed greatly to the culture of Iran and Israel.

Moshe Katsav (Hebrew מֹשֶׁה קַצָּב, Persian موشه کاتساو), (born Mussa Ghassab December 5, 1945) is the eighth and current President of Israel (since 2000). He is married to Gila Katsav.

Moshe Katsav was born in Yazd, Iran. His family brought him to Tehran when he was an infant; in August 1951, when he was 5, they emigrated to Israel. He remains fluent in Persian.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moshe_Katsav

Shaul Mofaz (help·info) (Hebrew: שאול מופז, born 1948 in Tehran, Iran) is the current Israeli Minister of Transport and a Deputy Prime Minister, and former Minister of Defense. Previously he was the 16th Chief of the General Staff of the Israeli Defence Forces, and was the first Israeli of Iranian origin to achieve that post. Mofaz was born in Tehran, although his parents came from Isfahan.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shaul_Mofaz

"Dan Halutz (help·info) (Hebrew: דן חלוץ) (born 1948 in Hagor to an Iranian, (Persian)-Jewish family) is an Israeli Air Force Lt. General and former Israeli Air Force commander"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dan_Halutz

nice thread, show it to ahmedinejad before when he talks about destroying israeli again ;)

Not to mention the Tomb of Mordekhai and Ester in Hamedan ;)

Ahmadinejad, is a pyscho. I hate him. He does NOT represent Persian people.
The current regime in Tehran was not elected...they are in power by force. The "elections" were a joke. The mullahs only allowed their own representatives to run, and everyone knows that the results were rigged.

Honestly, Iranian people respect and get along with Jews. Dont beleive what you see on Fox News. :)

"Relations between Iran and Israel have alternated from close political alliances between the two states during the era of the Pahlavi dynasty to hostility following the rise to power of Ayatollah Ruhollah Khomeini. The history of the Persian Jews has been uninterrupted for over 2,500 years. It is a Mizrahi Jewish community in the territory of today's Iran, the historical core of the former Persian Empire, which began as early as the 8th century BCE, at the time of captivity of the ancient Israelites in Khorasan.

Upon its establishment in 1948 and until the Iranian Revolution in 1979, Israel enjoyed cordial relations with Iran (then ruled by the Pahlavi dynasty). Iran was one of the first nations to internationally recognize Israel, and was considered one of Israel's closest and few Muslim friends. However, Iran and Israel did develop close military ties during this period. This can be seen from the development of joint venture military projects, such as Project Flower, the Iranian-Israeli attempt to develop a new missile."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iran-Israel_relations

i know that, actually mr shugs right here is a good friend of mine :)

^ I should bloody well hope so :P

Iran's democracy is a fars (no pun intended!).. as the elected bodies have limited power and under the Islamic Republic constitution the assembly of experts and the supreme leader out rank any other position in the nation.

These are some very important historical Jewish monuments/shrines in Iran:

1.) Tomb of Daniel, Susa, is a popular attraction of Iran's Jewish community.

2.) The Seljuk era shrine of Habakkuk in Toyserkan.

3.) The Shrine of Esther and Mordechai in Hamadan.

4.) Peighambariyeh ("the place of the prophets"), Qazvin: Here, four Jewish prophets are said to be buried. Their Arabic names are: Salam, Solum, al-Qiya, and Sohulli.

what is happening with this places?
anyone care for them?
can you show pics?

LOL! why should anyone care for them? they can care for themselves :S they have great lifes in Iran :S

Great life? more like ghetto..

anyway I was talking about the holy places.

Great life? more like ghetto..

LMAO I really dont understand your obnoxious atitude to everyone appart from your own.

For your information Iranian Jews are among the richest in Iran and in general when they migrate to your great land of Isreal is when they end up living in ghettos in comparison to their material wealth in Iran.

The historical sites Dariush mentioned are very well looked after.. if you care to see images of them.. i know the ones of the Tomb of Ester and Mordecai are in Gilgamesh's Iran photos in the Iran forum

Im still searching for them.. its not in the photos indexes


can you post a link to it?

Im still searching for them.. its not in the photos indexes


can you post a link to it?

I went to the tomb of esther in Hamedan this summer,

this thread, post #1 http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=392813

btw the keeper of the site was jewish, very nice man. ;)

Oh and I have some photos of the Tomb of Daniel in Susa, ( not taken by me) will post them later.

nice, some of the hebrew text on the walls is very weird.]

Im not sure if they are considered holy so much Ill check with the ask-a-rabbi website.

anyway apart from iraq (babylonian jews) I think persian jews were the oldest/longest exiled comunity.

If I remember, the book of daniel tells of scrolls that the persian king found of his fathers period that let the jews return to israel to rebuild the second temple and daniel was some advisor to the king and solved his dreams.

When Cyrus the Great freed the Jews, Babylon was under Persian Control. So I would not consider them Iraqi Jews...because at that time the country of Iraq was not created yet. It was still a Persian provence.

Therefore, the oldest Jewish community in exile are the "Persian" Jews.

BTW, Persian Jews are some of the Richest and best represented minority groups in all of Iran.
Did you know that Beverly Hills, California is 40% Persian and most of them are Jewish...

Also, all of the places I mentioned are officially recognized as national historical sites and are protected by law.

....

the first group of jews from hamadan to return to israel did it after ww1 in 1918, through iraq syria and lebanon on foot and donkeys. Mulla (leader) menahem levi was the group's leader and they lived in jerusalem in yekhezkiel street, which became the center for hamadan and later iranian jews, with the synagogue "of shoshan habira" (or the ancient persian capital shoshan)

one of the folklore is that praying in the tomb of mordekhai and ester can erase bad things or rules muslims want to do to jews, the picture of mordechai comes in their sleep to warn and stop them.

another folklore is that their tomb is in the galilee and were brought to it when jews returned from persia.

Shawarma, When you find out, I would also like to know if those sites are considered holy in the Jewish religion.

Did you know that Beverly Hills, California is 40% Persian and most of them are Jewish...

also the inventor of the Bratz dolls..

Shawarma, When you find out, I would also like to know if those sites are considered holy in the Jewish religion.

I posted it as a question.
its iteresting to see what they say.

:P

Iran's democracy is a fars (no pun intended!)..


Good one! ;)

When Cyrus the Great freed the Jews, Babylon was under Persian Control. So I would not consider them Iraqi Jews...because at that time the country of Iraq was not created yet. It was still a Persian provence.

Therefore, the oldest Jewish community in exile are the "Persian" Jews.

So what about Mesopotamia or Assyria?

Under Achamenid rule Mesopotamia or modern day Iraq was never considered a 'Persian province.' It was a nation under Achamenid rule... I mean you could argue it was in the Sassanid dynasty but even so, they only located their cities in Mesopotamia for strategic reasons while they were taking on the Romans.

Its a pretty tall order claiming pretty much the entire Jewish population outside Israel in the Middle East are 'Persian' because we once ruled the entire region.. for a start they are semites.

But yes Iran does or rather did have the largest and oldest Jewish community in the Middle East outside of Israel

The oldest exile is Babylon which then in 539 BC was conquered by Cyrus the Great, king of Persia.

http://www.wsu.edu/~dee/HEBREWS/EXILE.HTM

^ Did the Jews stay in Babylon after Cyrus the Great released them from Babylonian captivity???

I dont know we dont have lots of historical accounts, as nowdays we can assume some stayed, some probably converted as zoroastrians etc, but as its mentioned there, by the time the greeks invade and start exiles, they have very well documented jewish communities around the middle east and greece, those ones are the ones that stick more or less inside themselves and make it through to modern times. the ones that revolted in judea (macabbians) are almost all killed (~600,000) or again exiled, and these cities are replaced with other peoples. from greece and north africa they reach spain, from spain (inquisition) to europe, from europe to russia. the other branches remain in the middle east and caucus, and from there it splits until today into ashkenaz (europe) and sfarad (north africa and asia)

I think there must have been a small jewish community that remained in shoshan and babylon and persia which probably just grew again in numbers after the greek exiles added new people.

The history of babylonian jewry is detailed in two books, the small chronicles and big chronicles. Its very detailed, this is the explanation of how things formed in babylon for jews, until it reached the greatest period as the center for jews, when the babylonian Talmud was written, and how persian rulers also affected it again later in the Sassanid Period

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_Jews_in_Iraq

Under Achamenid rule Mesopotamia or modern day Iraq was never considered a 'Persian province.' It was a nation under Achamenid rule... I mean you could argue it was in the Sassanid dynasty but even so, they only located their cities in Mesopotamia for strategic reasons while they were taking on the Romans.

Its a pretty tall order claiming pretty much the entire Jewish population outside Israel in the Middle East are 'Persian' because we once ruled the entire region.. for a start they are semites.

But yes Iran does or rather did have the largest and oldest Jewish community in the Middle East outside of Israel

Actually, Mesopotamia was not a nation under Persian rule. It was just another provence of Persia. The region did not have autonomy. It had to follow the same laws, and taxes as the other provences. In order to be recognized as a nation you must have a form of independence. The Mesopotamian Satrap, (governer) had to consult with the Persian capital before making any decisions. The system was very similar to the United states today. The satraps had some say in local decisions but for anything on a national level they had to get proper authorization.

Also, I put the word "persian" in quotations because I did not mean the Jews were ethnic Persians, but rather citizens of the Persian empire. I never said the entire Jewish population outside of Israel was Persian. I said that the Jews of babylon were NOT Iraqi..because the country of "Iraq" as a political entity was only created by the British in the last century...

Not iraqi, but babylonian not persian.
at least in all our books its always two diferent kingdoms, one babylonians (mesopotamia) - Bavel , one is persians - Paras/Madai. of course all the time were changes when those came under one rule and split again, but still if you read all the time the written scrolls of
the jewush messengers from all comunities (benjamin of tuleda from spain) that came to babylon always called them babylonian jews, the persian jews were a different group, also different local languages. probably because the cities were far away, its not like today you fly some hours and youre there, it was weeks or months of walking, riding.

http://www.iraqijews.org/

^ interesting site about Iraqi jews and babylonian jews.

Actually, Mesopotamia was not a nation under Persian rule. It was just another provence of Persia. The region did not have autonomy. It had to follow the same laws, and taxes as the other provences. In order to be recognized as a nation you must have a form of independence. The Mesopotamian Satrap, (governer) had to consult with the Persian capital before making any decisions. The system was very similar to the United states today. The satraps had some say in local decisions but for anything on a national level they had to get proper authorization.

Also, I put the word "persian" in quotations because I did not mean the Jews were ethnic Persians, but rather citizens of the Persian empire. I never said the entire Jewish population outside of Israel was Persian. I said that the Jews of babylon were NOT Iraqi..because the country of "Iraq" as a political entity was only created by the British in the last century...

Even so.. the Assyrians banished the Jews to Babylon decades before the 'Parsue' even gained power from Media so when they were banished there it was not under Persian or any other Iranic tribe's rule.

In addition Babylon was a separate entity to Aryanam (Iran) I don't dispute that Babylon & Mesopomia were not provinces of Persia.. as were Egypt, Ethopia, Lydia, Bactria, Media, the Punjab etc etc... To quote Tom Holland Darius the Great was "...a Pharaoh in Egypt, a king in Babylon & Mesopotamia and a self proclaimed heir of the house of Astyages in Media." He took part in the rediculous shaming traditions in the Temple of Marduk in Babylon (where the king is slapped and pinched). Infact the attempt of Cambyses and Badriya (Cryus the Great's heir's) tried to disolve such traditions and turn Babylon into what your suggesting and they were met with feirce uprisings by the native population.

Please do not address to me like I am uneducated :)

You seem to have misunderstood the original post, I think you should read it again....I never said that all Middle Eastern Jews outside of Israel were Persian. I said that that the Jews at the TIME OF CYRUS were citizens of the Persian empire and NOT iraqi jews.

"into what your suggesting and they were met with feirce uprisings by the native population."

What I was suggesting is....when babylon was apart of the Persian empire, it was nothing but a provence, they were not a state, as you claim.

I studied near eastern history in school, so you dont need to try and teach me about this topic.:)

I have done over two years of private study on the topic including current international relations & politics so you dont need to teach me mate.

I guess we're typical Iranians... too arogant to get along :|

anyway iraqi jews is so 1980's..

the current new trend is indian jews.

if you find any in indonesia-vietnam area tell us cause you know how fashion is, its always looking for new trends..

i dont think those bnei menashe real jews, i think they are people who just want to leave the poverty behind, its a shame cause real jews are lost due to assimilation everyday, also is a shame we dont accept people who have a jewish father as jews but the rabbinate accept these impostors, its really a shame, laws need to be changed!!! :ohno:

2 tribes down, 8 spaces left.

who wants to be a jew?
join the tribal-tragedy while you can.

My major in Uni was Near Eastern studies, and I have to agree with you on the 2'nd part of your post ; )

From living in Los Angeles, it certainly appears that the Iraqi Jews and Iranian Jews form separate communities. They have separate synagogues and speak different languages. Most Persian jews speak Farsi and the signage on their storefronts is in Farsi also. A lot of the Iraqi Jews are Sephardic and speak Ladino. Others speak Arabic. As far as I can see, the Persian jews identify strongly with Iran though they hate the current government and are involved in media opposing the mullahs.

Hey Darius,
I hope you make yourself heard to as many Iranians as possible, before the psycho Ahamdinajad is going to blow up the Middle East.

here are soem thoughts I would like to send to Iranians:

The vicious attacks of Ahmadinajad against Israel are not random, nor coincidental when compared to the WWII scenario. By vilifying the Jews the Iranian dictator creates the environment of fear and hate which all dictators need to instill in the public before starting a war. Ahmadinajad deceives the media about his anti-Semitism, or more correctly anti-Jewish feelings by referring to the Jews as Zionists.

Ahmadinajad and others may or may not know that Zion to Jews is the same asMecca to Muslims. To be a Zionist is really not much different than for a Moslem to adhere to the belief that Mecca is the spiritual center of Muslims. A reporter may ask the Iranian dictator if Muslims have more right to claiming Mecca as their religious center then Jews have to claiming Mount Zion in Jerusalem. Ahmadinajad demands the deportation of the Jews from Israel "back" to Europe. An interviewer may also ask: should the Jews who came from the Arab world (and Persia) – about half of the Jews in Israel – also be sent to Europe? These and other crucial questions fail to be brought to light to confront the dictator of Iran.

read more at:
http://www.groundreport.com/articles.php?cid=39&id=77

Oh please, why did most religious jews and rabbis oppose zionism until 1948 and today, most orthodox jews religious reject zionism?

You are right about the creation of an environment of fear as a tool to serve political purposes, unfortunatly, what you fail to see is that this climate of fear is also maintained by right-wingers pretending that ahmadinejad is the new Hitler. This gives extreme zionists the feeling that Israel is besieged and thus it legitimates the to continuing support to the Israel's oppression of the Palestinians.

However I really don't understand why some people join and this is the first thing they say.... I mean this is still a freakin' architecture forum...

Oh please, why did most religious jews and rabbis oppose zionism until 1948 and today, most orthodox jews religious reject zionism?

You are right about the creation of an environment of fear as a tool to serve political purposes, unfortunatly, what you fail to see is that this climate of fear is also maintained by right-wingers pretending that ahmadinejad is the new Hitler. This gives extreme zionists the feeling that Israel is besieged and thus it legitimates the to continuing support to the Israel's oppression of the Palestinians.

However I really don't understand why some people join and this is the first thing they say.... I mean this is still a freakin' architecture forum...

This is wrong. Most Orthodox jews definitely support Israel especially the modern Orthodox and Chabad. The Neturi Karti are a tiny minority that most Jews including religious ones just consider crackpots. They do get a lot of publicity though probably because of their colorful dress, right out of 18th century Poland.

Things are much more complicated than that

you have orthodox zionism, non-zionism and anti-zionism.

Most orthodox are either non-zionists or anti-zionists, and anti-zionism orthodoxy is not limited to naturei karta as you said but is spread to others, more important but more discreet groups.

khalas virtual!
youre spreading so much false facts its becoming a joke.
most orthodox are anti-zionist? lol, maybe 1%.. and even they dont believe
its not jewish land, they only believe that the messiah has to come and
"make it" jewish again.. lol, Im sure if hitler was around they would hug and kiss him also
before he would send them to gas chambers.

virtual are you neturei kharta barta?

Just re-read my post above yours

Just re-read my post above yours

Well the Satmars just came out condemning the Neturi Karti. I don't know what is going on in Paris, but in the US virtually all Jews support Isreal, and with a few exceptions, the more religious, the more recognition of the Jewish homeland.

Jews who were freed By Cyrus were Jews from Palistaine not Persia or Babylonia, they were taken as slaves then freed.

so those people were not "Persian" Jews, unless you are talking about Persians who Converted to Judaisim, then yes those are Persian Jews.

Well the Satmars just came out condemning the Neturi Karti. I don't know what is going on in Paris, but in the US virtually all Jews support Isreal, and with a few exceptions, the more religious, the more recognition of the Jewish homeland.

And as I said, Satmar's condemnation of Naturei Keita doesn't take anything off their antizionist stance.

They are openly antizionist, and the biggest Hassidic group out there, whatever their stance on Naturei Keita and wether you like it or not.

virtual stop destroy threads!!!!!
u have too much hatred in u'r heart!
thanx to virtual i'm closing this nice thread!!!!!!!!