except...the capital :)

Oh there's always an exception;)
Well for Macedonia i would have to say Bitola then, the second largest city.
But you'll have to wait for members who live there to confirm that. Or maybe Ohrid too, with all the tourists, everyone benefits, from the hotels to normal people who offer private accomodation in their home.

Oh there's always an exception;)
Well for Macedonia i would have to say Bitola then, the second largest city.
But you'll have to wait for members who live there to confirm that. Or maybe Ohrid too, with all the tourists, everyone benefits, from the hotels to normal people who offer private accomodation in their home.

different ways to see it Dejan. Bitola and Ohrid might both look wealthier at first glance but transition has hit them hard. Bitola was the centar of the pyramidal savings collapse lots of people lost money in that. Ohrid tourism is just picking up again after almost 15 years relying solely on domestic tourists.

Statisticly only Skopje (capital), Ohrid (southwest), Gostivar (west) and Gevgelija (south central) are above the average national GDP per capita.

However as far as I know Strumica enjoys very nice standard of living and unemployement is low. Strumica also left Yugoslavia as the wealthiest region of Macedonia (a bit wealthier than Skopje too beleive it or not) and has passed the transition a bit easily because it didn't rely to some big industral complexes that went down.

So I think besides Skopje, it's Strumica. Here it is on the map southeast of the country

http://img222.imageshack.us/img222/8400/strox3.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

Thanks!:)

I think Banja Luka region and Western Hercegovina are the richest in BiH

Well after Kyiv, comes Donetsk, Dnipropetrvosk, Odessa, Lviv, and others.

I think Banja Luka region and Western Hercegovina are the richest in BiH

Isn't it the District of Brcko (population ~100.000) thats now the richest in Bosnia & Herzegovina?

Well, Tirana is followed by Durres and Vlora.

Isn't it the District of Brcko (population ~100.000) thats now the richest in Bosnia & Herzegovina?

i don´t think so, it is coz they get all taxes that they collect coz they are district, so this could be misleading and that is only one town, we are talking about region

Well, Tirana is followed by Durres and Vlora.


What about Saranda?

BTW, the richest region in Kosovo is the one of Prizren, while the richest city is Prishtina!

I dont agree with you djurob, since the whole of eastern macedonia is known to be poorer than the central and western parts. The villages around Strumica are some of the poorest villages in the country. Maybe Strumica the city is better off, as far as cities go i think its Ohrid, Gevgelija and Shtip. I dont know where Dejan got Bitola from, it has suffered more than anywhere else in the past 15years.

I dont agree with you djurob, since the whole of eastern macedonia is known to be poorer than the central and western parts. The villages around Strumica are some of the poorest villages in the country. Maybe Strumica the city is better off, as far as cities go i think its Ohrid, Gevgelija and Shtip. I dont know where Dejan got Bitola from, it has suffered more than anywhere else in the past 15years.



I've heard that Strumica and Gevgelija have developed some kind of 'dental' tourism and that lots of Greeks are going there to do their teeth and they also spend lots of money in many other things since its cheaper then Thesaloniki or something! Together with their vineyards and stuff maybe they've survive easier the transition period then lets say places that had big factories which were all closed or so!

Except for Bucharest, the western cities of Timisioara and Cluj

Excluding Tiranë-Durrës region i would have to say Vlora County where Saranda is included is proppably the richest.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/c/c3/AlbaniaVlor%C3%ABCounty.png

GM where do you get your info man?

Eastern Macedonia was not poorer in the past, but was hit harder during the transition because it was more oriented towards big industry (especially mining and textiles). The south-east part however (Strumica, Gevgelija, Valandovo) was exception. They were rich agricultural regions and they didnt suffer so much. Today it is clear that they've overtaken most of the country.

BTW Gevgelija was one of the richest municipalities in Jugoslavija and today is finally picking up fast.

I dont agree with you djurob, since the whole of eastern macedonia is known to be poorer than the central and western parts. The villages around Strumica are some of the poorest villages in the country. Maybe Strumica the city is better off, as far as cities go i think its Ohrid, Gevgelija and Shtip. I dont know where Dejan got Bitola from, it has suffered more than anywhere else in the past 15years.

eastern Macedonia is/has been poorer than the rest but Strumica region (including the villages) is an exception. Unlike most places in MK it didn't rely on several big factories but was largely 'decentralized' business wise among its population. So as GreenAlbanian and Realek are also saying and I agree it was easier for the population to pass the transition in MK.

@GreenAlbanian it's true about the dental tourism but it's more Gevgelija and Bitola than Strumica...

What about Ohrid Lake region in Macedonia? How rich is it?
After all, its where Macedonia's only airport outside of Skoplje is located:yes:

For Bulgaria, besides Sofia, it's mainly the Black Sea counties, where the resorts are (Varna, Burgas, Nessebar, Sozopol and etc.), although it's mainly seasonal there. They get dough during the summer when the tourists come and it's enough for the whole year. Same goes for Bansko, Borovets and Pamporovo - the winter resorts (only they get their cash in the winter). Again - seasonal and less profitable than the coastal ones. Otherwise I can't really say a whole area is better off than the rest. Maybe North Central Bulgaria (around Veliko Tarnovo), but then again every rule has its exceptions. :) In general, in the bigger cities people live better than in the smaller ones and in the villages. Obviously, it's because there are more businesses and jobs in the big city. As relatively prosperous I must mention (besides Sofia, Varna and Burgas) Stara Zagora, Haskovo, Veliko Tarnovo, Blagoevgrad, to some extent Plovdiv and the towns of Sevlievo (North Central Bulgaria) and Petrich (Southwestern Bulgaria - by the Greek and Macedonian border).

What about Ohrid Lake region in Macedonia? How rich is it?
After all, its where Macedonia's only airport outside of Skoplje is located:yes:

Ohrid too suffered a lot. Besides the tourism, Ohrid had 3-4 large factories and they all had big problems. Before it was most certainly one of the richest places and despite the blows suffered it will be again. If not else the tourism is enough.

What about Ohrid Lake region in Macedonia? How rich is it?
After all, its where Macedonia's only airport outside of Skoplje is located:yes:

it's also above national averge GDP per capita. But transition has hit it hard

- Ohrid region has also some industrires which were hit hard and some didn't survive transition
- tourisam has yet to come back to pre 1990 levels and to be surpassed in terms of foreign tourists.
The airport there doesn't represent any well being. It's build and used mainly for tourism purposes but that's again related to the influx of foreign tourists. And as I already said foreign tourists are just starting to rediscover it. For example I have statistics for Dutch tourists. This year was the best after 1990 attracting 4.000 Dutch tourists. The pre-war numbers were 50.000 Dutch tourists anually. But 4.000 is better than virtually nothing just 2-3 years ago. Last year they were 2.500.

still Ohrid is doing good but there is a huge potential to be unleashed.

For Bulgaria, first of all I must say Sofia (the capital municipality). After that come the Black Sea counties, where the resorts are (Varna, Burgas, Nessebar, Sozopol and etc.), although it's mainly seasonal there. They get dough during the summer when the tourists come and it's enough for the whole year. Otherwise I can't really say a whole area is better off than the rest. In general, in the bigger cities people live better than in the smaller ones and in the villages. Obviously, there are more businesses and jobs there. As relatively prosperous I must mention (besides Sofia, Varna and Burgas) Stara Zagora, Haskovo, Veliko Tarnovo, Blagoevgrad, to some extent Plovdiv and the towns of Sevlievo (North Central Bulgaria) and Petrich (Southwestern Bulgaria - by the Greek and Macedonian border).


Have been to both Varna and Burgas I'd say Varna is much richer and way ahead of Burgas.

come to think of it, i think brcko is easily the richest in bosnia. once the approved factories get built, i'd say that brcko could easily be one of the richest regions in all of the balkans.

i know Tetovo is booming in MK...if you go there you'd be surprised at how many projects are going up.

Have been to both Varna and Burgas I'd say Varna is much richer and way ahead of Burgas.

Well as a Burgas resident I would not use MUCH. Let's face it. Varna is the older and larger city. Their downtown is more beautiful, plus they have had good mayors in the past/present. Burgas has re-elected the same mayor Yoan the Drunk-Head 3 times in a role. Obviously, you sense I don't like him. But Tego meant regions as a whole not just the administartive centers.

Well as a Burgas resident I would not use MUCH. Let's face it. Varna is the older and larger city. Their downtown is more beautiful, plus they have had good mayors in the past/present. Burgas has re-elected the same mayor Yoan the Drunk-Head 3 times in a role. Obviously, you sense I don't like him. But Tego meant regions as a whole not just the administartive centers.

it's weird that Tego pointed the Plovdiv region to be developed 'to some extent'. I always had the impression that that region is quite prosperous...

it's weird that Tego pointed the Plovdiv region to be developed 'to some extent'. I always had the impression that that region is quite prosperous...

Plovdiv is really lagging behind if you consider its size. Stara Zagora (1/2 of Pv's population) gets more investment and job opportunities.

Well as a Burgas resident I would not use MUCH. Let's face it. Varna is the older and larger city. Their downtown is more beautiful, plus they have had good mayors in the past/present. Burgas has re-elected the same mayor Yoan the Drunk-Head 3 times in a role. Obviously, you sense I don't like him. But Tego meant regions as a whole not just the administartive centers.

Yeah,Yoan was/is a disaster for Burgas.

Yeah,Yoan was/is a disaster for Burgas.

So why is he getting re-elected?

I would say in Albania it could be Durres, with Vlora and Saranda following.

So why is he getting re-elected?

Because of his looks.:lol:

http://beta.pmgbs.com/p/kmethi.jpg

He used to be very popular with the old ladies that were having their physical therapy in the sea garden early in the morning while he was jogging on the beach. But too much rakiya lately...he doesn't jog anymore.:lol:
Plus, for some reason he appeals to many ppl as being a true-old Burgazliya, go figure. So the 3rd time they elected him as an independent candidate.However, the first 2 times he was on the Socialists' list, that's why he got elected. Burgas is one of BSP (socialist party) main strong-holds. Unfortunately.

Wow. This guy has been mayor for the past 15 years!!!

Plovdiv is really lagging behind if you consider its size. Stara Zagora (1/2 of Pv's population) gets more investment and job opportunities.

I would not necessarily agree that Plovdiv is not doing well. It gets a lot of foreign investment, which goes primarily in the adjacent smaller municipalities. All foreign companies have their factories in the smaller towns/villages around Plovdiv not the city itself. The Plovdiv region was one of the wealthiest in the Eurostat ranking.

OK. In general terms Sofia, Plovdiv, Varna and Burgas -- the 4 major cities.

Interesting how some of the most prosperous regions are the ones that are closest to Greece. The Albanian regions are also historically Greek areas with a sizeable Greek community to this day.

Interesting how some of the most prosperous regions are the ones that are closest to Greece. The Albanian regions are also historically Greek areas with a sizeable Greek community to this day.

For your information, the south-east Rodopi regions in Bulgaria which border on Greece are the poorest. :)

For your information, the south-east Rodopi regions in Bulgaria which border on Greece are the poorest. :) I said some of the areas bro and I didn't actually have Bulgaria in mind.

Interesting how some of the most prosperous regions are the ones that are closest to Greece. The Albanian regions are also historically Greek areas with a sizeable Greek community to this day.

Durres is greek now? :nuts:

the ethinc greek minority in albania is centered around here:
http://i13.tinypic.com/2z4y8zn.jpg

not only do they make up the most 30,000 out of 3.5 million but they also live in villages. they nor greece are responsible for their prosperity. either way it's durres that the most prosperous outside of tirana. vlora is next but you'd have to question it's legitimacy.

I said some of the areas bro and I didn't actually have Bulgaria in mind.

By the way, isn't northeast Greece the poorest part of your country? Just curious.

By the way, isn't northeast Greece the poorest part of your country? Just curious. Could be, but some slums of Athens and Thessaloniki could probably be up (or should I say down) there.

@ lakerdar, Durres is Albanian, but wasn't it founded by Greeks?

Interesting how some of the most prosperous regions are the ones that are closest to Greece. The Albanian regions are also historically Greek areas with a sizeable Greek community to this day.

cut your bullsh*t and stop spreading propaganda, there's no such thing as greek land on Albania. And for your information, most southern cities are able to prosper because of tourism not because they have anything to do with greece. I know you people think that we have to worship you and we have to thank you people for everything that's good in our country, but you're dumb if you think so.

And no, it's not "interesting" at all, and by sizeable i hope you mean something like 1-2 percent of our population and not 50 percent.

Could be, but some slums of Athens and Thessaloniki could probably be up (or should I say down) there.

@ lakerdar, Durres is Albanian, but wasn't it founded by Greeks?

no it wasn't

Are you sure?

pretty much about everything that i said. And don't start posting websites and sources, cause i'm not going to read them.

Again, i know that you think Albania has every reason to be grateful to you for our existence, but you're wrong.

Are you sure?

it was colonized by corinthians.

Greeks, right? ;)

and burek I said nothing of the sort

yes i'm sure the Corinthians are responsible for durres prosperity.

Hay guys, let's not go off topic.

it's perfectly on topic. who is responsible for durres prosperity? the Corinthians that colonized it 2500 years ago or the indigenous people.

I dont know where Dejan got Bitola from, it has suffered more than anywhere else in the past 15years.
I got it from my deep love for the city :) hehe

Anyway everyone stfu about the history part.

I think Banja Luka region and Western Hercegovina are the richest in BiH

In 1991 the poorest part of BiH, in 2006 the wealthiest.

As for Croatia (Zagreb notwithstanding), it would be Istra and the Northern Counties (Medjiumrje, Varazdin etc ...).

it's perfectly on topic. who is responsible for durres prosperity? the Corinthians that colonized it 2500 years ago or the indigenous people. The Albanians are.

Durres is about as Greek today as Marseille or Naples is. Zilch. Although all these Mediterranean ports have a "Mad Greek" character about them. I mean that in the best possible way. I love ports.

All the nations on Greece's northern borders will experience a rise in wealth equivalent to its EU neighbour and will probably surpass it with better planning and management, especially in the areas of tourism. For many n Greece the standard of living is equal to it's northern neighbours anyway, even if it has a higher GDP. Similar opportunties (or lack of), work practices, problems, mentality etc.

All the nations on Greece's northern borders will experience a rise in wealth equivalent to its EU neighbour and will probably surpass it with better planning and management, especially in the areas of tourism. For many n Greece the standard of living is equal to it's northern neighbours anyway, even if it has a higher GDP. Similar opportunties (or lack of), work practices, problems, mentality etc.

thats just stupid. you're not gonna compare ionnina with it's northern neighbors :bash: . i know that region is the poorest in greece but thats only relative to the rest of greece. it certainly is not at the same levels as tirana, skopje or sofia.

*hisses*
Anyway Helsinki was founded by a Swedish king but i don't think that has anything to do with it being the capital of Finland today.

Interesting how some of the most prosperous regions are the ones that are closest to Greece. The Albanian regions are also historically Greek areas with a sizeable Greek community to this day.

Southern greeks were brought to Albania during the 19th century when Ali Pashë Tepelena was ruler of Northern Greece (before it got its Independence with the help of Albanians)
Traces of greeks in the South are so scarce which explains it perfectly why the population is not really indigenious like let's say the chams.
They spread in villages, not in cities and they dont occupy a particular area unlike the chams did in Northern Greece.
Have you ever wondered why nationalistic greeks dont outline a detailed map about their minority in Albania?
Well, the answer i just explained to you.

The reason why Saranda is rich has to do mainly with Tourism while Vlora is well known for being the capital of People Smugglers and Money Launderers.

^^Like i said earlier
...stfu about the history part. nobody cares:crazy:

Neorion why do you always gotta ruin a good thread man. Im sick of seeing these Greeks(like you) coming in and talking about a topic that they know they will get a response (that will cause a debate) if u want to talk about such things go to the Greek forum and start one, talk all u want about the twisted history you have been taught and share them with people who actually give a shit. Im an Albanian from the south and there is nothing you can say show and tell me about ur stupid beliefs, I dont buy them I go there every year and I see everything with my own eyes as for how many Greeks there are there. Stop talking nonsense and start talking of what the topic is really about. The world does not revolve around Greece. Durres is more connected to Italy than Greece so is Vlora. Ill tell you if you want to meet Greeks in Albania go to Himara and some villages outside of Gjirokastra (They make the best cheese honestly) Other than that you will have more luck finding more Albanian villages in Greece around Ioaninna than Greek villages in Albania if u want direct details to where they are located let me know ill give u good directions. Other than that the best chance for u to find a Greek in Albania R the businessmen (Greek). Stop ruining a good thread.


As for Albania every city has their own based economy. Korca has two villages that many tourists come and visit aswell as many immigrant workers bring in and rebuild their houses etc. Saranda has one of the best touristic economies in Albania with Butrinti and Blue eye being a big plus. Durres would probably make the most money because of all the tourists that come there from Kosova and Macedonia, Italy and being close to Tirana a summer getaway for the largest populated city in Albania.

I think Vlora will be the fastest growing economy in Albania in the future with the best economy. Its location,Historical, and strategic location with other cities around it give it the best chance for development. It needs smart planning from specialits and good leaders on the local government.

for Slovakia for sure richest in Gdp terms is exept Bratislava all western part of Slovakia ( in Eu is Biggest diferent betwen east and west in one contry!!) so thats Zilina( car plant) , Trnava(car plant), Nitra maybe slowly catching , Piestany( baths and thermall polls) and maybe second biggest city in Slovakia Kosice( steel company- over 25000 people working there)

no it wasn't

Yes it was. Ancient Epidamnos.

Anyhow, it wouldn't be a stretch to assume that many places in southern Albania would be wealthier than the north in part that many Albanians working in Greece come from the south of Albania and they send back hundreds of millions of Euros a year.

ye ancient koqet e mia
how does Albanians wokring in greece and sending money back have to do with durres and Albania being greek?

You make no sense

why are you always in this section of the forum starting crap?

ye ancient koqet e mia
how does Albanians wokring in greece and sending money back have to do with durres and Albania being greek?

You make no sense

why are you always in this section of the forum starting crap?

Forgive the mix up. I didn't mean it as such.

Why are you such a prude anyhow? Why do you let your nationalism make you see things which no one said?

my nationalism gets in the way of your extremism, look at everything you say
you just said it wouldn't be a stretch assuming "that" (about south albania being greek) since it's wealthier and Albanians send money back there because of greece.
I don't know what you meant, you should re-read what you say cause people take things like that offensive.
And for your information, most of the Albanian immigrants aren't even from the south (in greece)

my nationalism gets in the way of your extremism, look at everything you say
you just said it wouldn't be a stretch assuming "that" (about south albania being greek) since it's wealthier and Albanians send money back there because of greece.
I don't know what you meant, you should re-read what you say cause people take things like that offensive.
And for your information, most of the Albanian immigrants aren't even from the south (in greece)

I was quoting another post which did not go right.

Problem is you are so damn standoffish and closed minded. :ohno: Like a loaded pistol ready to fire off.

Did not go right? Somebody said Durres was greek or something, and i responded.
Ok, that's the last thing i'm saying.

Did not go right? Somebody said Durres was greek or something, and i responded.
Ok, that's the last thing i'm saying.

Yes I pasted the quote but it did not copy and I pressed post without it there which is why it didn't make too much sense.

And btw, just because someone says 'x' city was founded by 'y' people, or that some 'z' people live in 'x' city doesn't mean "was Greek or something".

But it's not surprising many would see the world in this simple equation here. So, relax and breathe. It's not so good to be angry and ready to pop all the time. You will get a aneurism or something.

*hisses*
Anyway Helsinki was founded by a Swedish king but i don't think that has anything to do with it being the capital of Finland today.

No it doesn't. It was a Russian Tsar, who moved the capital to Helsinki. :D

I would not necessarily agree that Plovdiv is not doing well. It gets a lot of foreign investment, which goes primarily in the adjacent smaller municipalities. All foreign companies have their factories in the smaller towns/villages around Plovdiv not the city itself. The Plovdiv region was one of the wealthiest in the Eurostat ranking.

In fact the territory of the Municipality of Plovdiv is very small - just beyond the city limits, hence the investors cannot built their facilities there but in the neighbouring municipalities - Rodopi, Maritsa, etc.

I think Banja Luka region and Western Hercegovina are the richest in BiH

true :okay:

the coast. :banana:

varna and to the south

As a city, Odesa comes next after Kyiv.

Except the capital...I take it the region around the capital is included in that "ban" right?

Hmm... I guess it will be Denmark's second largest city Århus then...

This is how i would express it more or less:

http://file018a.bebo.com/5/large/2006/12/25/10/354360019a2964860972b628523293l.jpg

Our Top 10 according to the latest published official numbers in 2002

Bolu >> Izmit >> Adapazari >> Düzce >> Izmir >> Mugla >> Bursa >> Ankara >> Istanbul >> Eskisehir

G.N - The Krakow region isn't rich. Only the city itself is rich, the rest of the region is rather poor. And why didn't you make Katowice red?

This is how i would express it more or less:

http://file018a.bebo.com/5/large/2006/12/25/10/354360019a2964860972b628523293l.jpg


http://img386.imageshack.us/img386/4884/polandadministrativedivta1.jpg

^^ This is a joke, right?

Our Top 10 according to the latest published official numbers in 2002

Bolu >> Izmit >> Adapazari >> Düzce >> Izmir >> Mugla >> Bursa >> Ankara >> Istanbul >> Eskisehir

The great eastern European regions regions of Ankara and Eskisehir. :lol:

The great eastern European regions regions of Ankara and Eskisehir. :lol:

Didn't catch it, what you mean?

I think Banja Luka region and Western Hercegovina are the richest in BiH

Sarajevo is wealthiest region in Bosnia it represents 42% of Bosnia's GDP, this is based on 2005 figures.

Bosnian GDP in 2005 was 9.56 billion U$,
Bosnian GDP for 2006 is expected to hit 11.2 billion U$.
and 2007 - 12.85 billion U$.
extrapolate this and you get follwong figures...

Sarajevo has population of 525 000.

2005 - 4billion U$ - 7600 U$
2006 - 4.5 billion - 8500 U$
2007 - 5.2 billion U$ - 10 000 U$

525.000? Entire "Sarajevo Canton" has 402.000 population. Sarajevo's population is about ~310.000.

^^ This is a joke, right?

want to make it better

525.000? Entire "Sarajevo Canton" has 402.000 population. Sarajevo's population is about ~310.000.

well I am going with the figures I have. if that be the case than Sarajevo is even richer.

^^ This is a joke, right?

Lodz is one of the poorest of the bigest cities in Poland:))) He made a joke of course.

Lodz is one of the poorest of the bigest cities in Poland:))) He made a joke of course.

Voivodeships are combined into bigger regions, which are used for statistical reports
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Voivodeships_of_Poland

Sarajevo is wealthiest region in Bosnia it represents 42% of Bosnia's GDP, this is based on 2005 figures.

Bosnian GDP in 2005 was 9.56 billion U$,
Bosnian GDP for 2006 is expected to hit 11.2 billion U$.
and 2007 - 12.85 billion U$.
extrapolate this and you get follwong figures...

Sarajevo has population of 525 000.

2005 - 4billion U$ - 7600 U$
2006 - 4.5 billion - 8500 U$
2007 - 5.2 billion U$ - 10 000 U$

+
the average (netto) salary in Sarajevo Canton is 800KM (410€), in Herzegovina-Neretva Canton 750KM (384€), in Banja Luka region 650KM (332€) and those 3 regions are the richest in Bosnia

+
the average (netto) salary in Sarajevo Canton is 800KM (410€), in Herzegovina-Neretva Canton 750KM (384€), in Banja Luka region 650KM (332€) and those 3 regions are the richest in Bosnia

well, I thought he asked for richest region, if he asked for 3 richest...

^^ I just added the fact about netto salaries :)