The new Nova Bus that Translink has recently ordered:
http://members.shaw.ca/dgallery.upload/upload/olympics/translink/nova.jpg
(picture of a test bus)


The New Flyer diesel bus that is beginning to arrive:
http://members.shaw.ca/dgallery.upload/upload/olympics/translink/bus01.jpg




TransLink inks contract with Nova Bus for 126 new buses

Nova Bus announced today that it has signed a contract to supply 126 new buses to TransLink, the transit authority serving the Greater Vancouver region. The $50.2 million order will see 51 standard 40-foot buses added to TransLink’s fleet with the remaining 75 buses replacing older units that have been in service since the early 1990s. The new buses will be delivered in 2007.

The new Nova LFS buses will feature the newest generation “clean diesel” engines running on ultra-low-sulphur fuel with a particulate exhaust trap.

A further enticement for TransLink was the Nova LFS’s impact on net air quality and the life-cycle cost. For Nova Bus president and CEO Gilles Dion, this was further confirmation that Nova Bus is “committed to delivering the best products and services.” He added that “We are proud to partner with TransLink in supplying 126 low-floor Nova LFS buses for 2007, and are looking forward to a long-term relationship.”

TransLink chair Malcolm Brodie said the purchase marked another important commitment delivered from TransLink’s 2005–2007 Three-Year Plan. “This bus order moves us close to our target of 1,400 buses in the transit fleet by the end of our current plan. We had an opportunity to test a Nova Bus in 2005, and we were as impressed with the look and ride as we were with its performance.”

Cool...may I have one of those on Cambie Street asap please?

That's good that we are getting 51 Nova Buses added to the fleet but how many Flyer Diesel are we getting?

Cool...may I have one of those on Cambie Street asap please?

That's good that we are getting 51 Nova Buses added to the fleet but how many Flyer Diesel are we getting?

Well, last year Translink ordered 107 natural gas buses from New Flyer. But this year, they decided to go for diesel - the cheaper option - and were able to turn 52 buses in that order into diesel buses. So we're getting 52 diesel from the Flyer.

Where is Nova based?

Novabus is based out of Quebec. They have built up quite a little empire there largely due to the provincial government of Quebec's procurement process. My understanding is that any goods purchased with provincial dollars has to be sourced from Quebec unless there is no product available. The main complaint I have heard about this policy is that it places location above cost and the public ends up paying more for a local product than they would if the playing field were level.

For Winnipeg's New Flyer bus company this has meant being largely shut out of Quebec despite consistently providing an equivalent product at a lower price. For Vancouver I think the decision to buy from Novabus stemmed from an ongoing order backlog at New Flyer. The procurement of these buses was accelerated from an initial 2008-9 delivery date to complete delivery in 2007. New Flyer lost the contract, or more accurately lost the full exercising of TransLink's option, and NovaBus was able to step into the breach and delivery at an earlier date. I think the two buses are functionally identical. They look a little different and I think the Novabuses have a slightly smaller capacity, on the order of one or two people. Also, the NovaBuses are made of rust-resistant stainless steel. This is a big selling point in the rest of Canada where road salt eats away at anything that moves on four wheels. Here on the west coast this is not a major factor and is more of an unanticipated bonus than a necessity.

They are quite similar judging from their fact sheets:
Nova Bus: http://www.novabus.com/doc/en/19760-fiches_technique_ang.pdf
New Flyer: http://www.newflyer.com/index/diesel_d30_35_40_60l

IMO it seems more of an expense to buy from two separate companies, as they now have to buy a totally new set of spare parts for it, whereas most New Flyer buses from 1990s to these new ones have the same basic parts inside.

I see most of these new buses (New Flyer) operating in Burnaby, and Translink seems to like to test them on the uphill part up to SFU (proving ground?)

The Nove Bus has less seating but more standing room so you can squeeze more people into them. They're really comfortable and not very bouncy and really queit. We've had them here in Victoria since the summer.

I'm a student at SFU and you are right, zivan56, there are a lot of the new ones in Burnaby. The natural gas buses are largely confined to the Northeast part of the region because their only fuelling station is in Port Coquitlam. They ran all of the test buses over the last two years up to SFU to gauge their hill climbing ability and sustained breaking endurance while being grossly overloaded with students.

I have heard mixed reviews from the drivers of the natural gas buses. They are a little bit less predictable than the conventional diesels and we once lost power to little more than walking speed going up the hill packed to the rafters one morning. On the other hand, the new New Flyer layout seems to be able to haul more people. There is marginally more standing room but it feels like a bigger internal volume.

It is good to hear from someone who has first hand experience with the Nova buses. I kind of like how bouncy the New Flyers are; it adds character. Regardless, Translink is certainly does not seem to be not buying lemons with our money and there genuinely are a lot of new buses on the roads for the first time in memory (excluding the articulated B-Line fleet).

Now if Translink would only give themselves are more meaningful goal for fleet size. 1500 buses is still truly inadequate for the region. I envision 3000+ as being more in line with demand and the increasing need for feeder routes into the rapid transit network. I am glad that the TransLink board and its planners seem genuinely interested in improving the transit network. I give them credit for what has been accomplished in seven years, even if it is still woefully inadequate in many respects.

Are there any plans to buy extended buses for the B-Line routes?

IMO, I don't really care where the buses come from as long as we get them quickly and they are reliable and efficient. The current shortage is getting ridiculous along busy routes.

The Nove Bus has less seating but more standing room so you can squeeze more people into them. They're really comfortable and not very bouncy and really queit. We've had them here in Victoria since the summer.

Yes from my Victoria Novabus experience, they are waay better than the other buses—although I'm sure the newness is a factor. Anytime I see one of them coming to my stop, it's alyways awesome—since low brances makes it impossible for double deckers, and these buses are way more spacious than the other ones (except for those ancient high-floor pieces of crap that they don't use on my route).

I have to say I'm not too impressed with the new New Flyer buses.

Performance-wise, the new New Flyers are still almost as loud and vibrating as the previous ones, and they still roll a lot in corners. When I rode the new Nova test bus a few years ago, I recall it was much, much tighter, cornering more like a car.

The big disadvantage of the new New Flyer is the comfort level. Extremely thinly-padded seats on stainless steel frames. Sure it's space-saving and stylish, but it's just not comfortable, especially since when you're sitting, part of your leg is often on the frame, which is freezing cold.

Another major design flaw for Vancouver is the floors - they're really slippery when wet!

A minor gripe is the Next Stop sign is cheap looking (backlit unevenly by a dim bulb), and it's also much smaller than before. It would be useful if there was an interior sign that showed the route terminus as there are several bus routes with the same number yet end at different destinations, and it's easy to forget which one you're on.

The one advantage they do have is that there's no middle vertical bar at the standing area between the rear doors, which makes people exit a lot easier since the lack of something to hold on to causes fewer people to stand around blocking the doors.

The exterior looks cool, but, overall, the user experience suffers.

2 out of 5 Stars

Are there any plans to buy extended buses for the B-Line routes?

IMO, I don't really care where the buses come from as long as we get them quickly and they are reliable and efficient. The current shortage is getting ridiculous along busy routes.

Translink has ordered 40 sixty-foot trolleys (B-Line sized); the buses that have a gangway. I'd think some of the buses would serve the 98.

^^ Any info if they will have the classic design (D60LF) or be redesigned (D60LFR). I believe

^^ Any info if they will have the classic design (D60LF) or be redesigned (D60LFR). I believe

the D60LFR?

the D60LFR?
Yep, I just saw some assembly pictures for the E60LFR and D60LFR, so they will indeed look like those new buses.

The first 51 will be arriving this month. Apparently, a few have already been on the roads for a couple weeks. The other 75 will come by year end.

:banana:

There's an article about it in the Sun (http://www.canada.com/vancouversun/news/westcoastnews/story.html?id=6ec3ca35-62ae-4f6a-b163-ff57653c4a54). Highlights below.

ABS & traction control:"We had the demo bus and we tried everything we could to make it go sideways in the yard, but we couldn't do it. It was like the bus was on rails"

Driver's like them:"They accelerate smoother, they brake smoother and they give the driver great visibility because there's no break in the windscreen; it's just one big piece"

Where you'll see them:Most will be used for high-demand routes within Vancouver and Burnaby

Good for the environment:"They are the most energy-efficient non-trolley buses we've ever had" ... Emission filters will remove 90 per cent of smoke and soot from the engine, which operates on low-sulphur diesel... The bus is about 1,000 kilograms lighter than a comparable vehicle, which helps its fuel efficiency

I'm excited. Watch this space for my review.

i was on a new novabus last night. it was operating as the 135/145. they have pretty cool interiors, with those seats facing backwards at the back

Well, after finally getting a couple rides on some of these Nova buses, it's time for my review.

Performance-wise, the Nova buses are excellent. They exhibit far less body roll than the new New Flyers, which also makes them a lot nicer to ride, especially if standing. The engine and especially transmission is somewhat quieter too. Are these turbocharged engines? They sound like they spool.

Not all is fine and dandy though. The Nova Bus interiors are very similar to the new New Flyers. The Nova Buses also have the major design flaw of what appear to be slippery floors when wet (although I haven't had the chance to test this yet though). Their seats are, again, thinly-padded, which means they're somewhat uncomfortable compared to the old New Flyers.

Furthermore, the backwards seats seem to be a poor idea. The back-to-back seats appear to waste space, and it is simply uncomfortable looking backwards on a bus which is constantly turning, braking, and accelerating, while you're right in someone's face. The only time I enjoyed them was in the company of friends. But I do like the tall knee-to-ad board windows back there.

The Nova Buses' "Next Stop" signs are somewhat better than the New Flyers, especially since there is a second sign for the rear half of the bus. They still appear to be backlit by incandescent lights, but they are brighter and more evenly lit than the new New Flyers' signs.

Like the new New Flyers, they have no middle vertical bar at the standing area between the rear doors, which improves door access. The (I assume) transverse-mounted engine in the Nova buses yields a lot more space in the back of the bus for passengers, but I think it is poorly utilized with a roughly circular seating layout. I think a missed opportunity here would be a third half-sized door at the very back of the bus, just for people to exit. It would certainly encourage more people to move right to the back of the bus when asked. Speaking of doors, the second door opens like molasses - I don't know if it's underpowered, or getting caught on the brushes. Hopefully, that gets fixed.

Aesthetically, the Nova Bus is worse off than the new New Flyers. The Nova Bus exterior does not have the maturity of the new New Flyers. The interior is a veritable jungle gym of bars - it's functional but terribly inelegant. Another interior quibble is the ceilings. They are made up of some grid-drilled panelling that various fixtures such as the Next Stop signs are screwed into; another case of function over form.

In conclusion, I find the Nova Buses better suited for busy city routes. The New Flyers (both new & previous generation) would seem a better choice for lighter suburban routes because of their greater seat count and traditional forward-facing seats. I was not as impressed with the Nova Buses as I thought I would be, but overall, they are a little better than the new New Flyers.

3 out of 5 Stars