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Mr Downtown November 12th, 2009, 10:09 PM I think they're both goners. I don't agree that one is L-shaped. It's just that the southern one had a little light well for the upper floors. Look at a Bing or Google aerial. They're both 40 feet wide and go straight back from sidewalk to alley.
http://i37.tinypic.com/5p1qi9.jpg
East-West has ambitions to expand into a larger campus, and I was told they had actually purchased the Wabash side of the Park 1000 property. I was a little surprised to learn that they had purchased this property a little over a year ago, though it adjoins their current facilities. There are a couple of cardboard massing models in the university's board room, but I've never studied them very carefully.
spyguy November 13th, 2009, 06:51 PM Could you remind me what this project was again?
I should clarify that it was a real proposal as part of a competition. I only caught a glimpse, but it was a fairly tall, thin crystalline tower in this general area. Mr D mentions expansion, and there's probably some of that, but what I heard was they wanted to consolidate into mostly one building. How they can afford all this, I don't know.
Loopy November 13th, 2009, 10:56 PM ..
Loopy November 13th, 2009, 10:58 PM ..
Mr Downtown November 14th, 2009, 01:06 AM Johnson Publishing bought up most of the block, maybe as early as the 1970s, but in the 80s they had high hopes for profiting from the 1992 World's Fair and just sat on the property. Did they make a fortune? Maybe, but there were carrying costs with no rent for all those decades.
I don't remember a building NEC 9th/Wabash. Can you refresh my memory? It's not on the 1985 aerials, and I'm not sure I have anything earlier.
Loopy November 14th, 2009, 04:41 PM ..
Mr Downtown November 16th, 2009, 06:17 PM As the sign and old insurance maps show, it was apparently built as a branch of the Lincoln Warehouse and Van Co. The 1970 land use atlas shows it, but 1973 aerials do not.
Loopy November 16th, 2009, 09:08 PM ..
Mr Downtown November 17th, 2009, 02:39 AM The tour guide might have been referring to the Vitagraph building, which was the second building north of the corner. It was a Holabird & Roche design from 1920, but I think it disappeared in the early 70s along with the corner building.
This was, of course, years before East-West University was even founded.
spyguy November 25th, 2009, 02:13 AM http://featuresblogs.chicagotribune.com/theskyline/2009/11/roosevelt-university-to-construct-32story-building-school-says-it-will-be-2ndtallest-in-us-behind-un.html
Roosevelt University to construct 32-story building; school says it will be 2nd-tallest in U.S. behind University of Pittsburgh's tower
By William Lee
Officials at Roosevelt University are moving forward with a plan to build what they say would be the second-tallest university building in the nation.
Construction on the 32-story, $110 million building is set to begin in February on the site of the old Herman Crown Center in the 400 block of South Wabash Avenue. The groundbreaking will begin once demolition of the old building is complete, with the center itself slated to open in January 2012, officials said.
http://img4.imageshack.us/img4/4973/97645709.jpg
CHIsentinel November 25th, 2009, 07:18 PM ^^Love it!!!!!
Thanks spymaster! ;)
ChicagoismynewBlog November 27th, 2009, 05:45 AM Don't mind my amateur "Paint" skills but I thought it would be cool to show a variation for those of you who like more height. I was bored...haha.
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2515/4137762512_1f1fec0495_o.jpg
http://chicagoismynewblog.wordpress.com
TampaMike November 27th, 2009, 06:01 AM Make it even taller and have the top meet in the center. Rather like it flat aswell rather than a tip.
:)
ChicagoismynewBlog November 27th, 2009, 10:40 PM What about this?
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2748/4139393910_be9257cd6e_o.jpg
http://chicagoismynewblog.wordpress.com
TampaMike November 28th, 2009, 05:42 AM Superb. Ofcourse it would look better in a 3D rendering, it's basically what I was looking for. The whole flat top on the original rendering just seems like a waste and is kind of hideous since it's a large size of flat top.
Mr Downtown November 28th, 2009, 05:24 PM ^Large? It's only 75 x 150 feet.
SoloMotorRow December 2nd, 2009, 09:44 PM Well, as you may know, I actually designed the faces of the "blocks of type," choosing a period typeface and creating fragments of the right length, then exporting CAD drawings. The challenge was to keep them from looking like kids' blocks. I was very pleased to see that all the details I carefully specified survived value engineering, shop drawings, and fabrication. The only thing that surprised me was the black coloration on the raised surfaces. That's something that happens with rubber stamps, but wasn't usually noticeable on used slugs of metal type.
I live in the area & of course was hoping that this spot was used to create
an entertainment venue (gameworks, dave/buster), theatre, high-end restaurant or boutique hotel, but I will live with it as long as S.Michigan (south of Cermak) gets developed into high-end restaurants & bars. Since the Data Center is being built on Indiana/Cermak, I was hoping that along Cermak they somehow build a nice park with some seating like RUSH University just built. Any drawings or plans that you are aware of ? I think RUSH did a fantastic job with their new streetscape (lighting, tree planters, seating).
Mr Downtown December 6th, 2009, 05:21 AM Astoria Tower:
http://i48.tinypic.com/14lq2r7.jpg
The Urban Politician December 6th, 2009, 06:14 AM ^ So I take it they chopped off the top?
Mr Downtown December 6th, 2009, 05:44 PM ^Hard to say for sure. The top was always going to be light metal strips, which could easily be erected with a couple of guys and a small derrick or scaffolding. The bottom two rows were installed. I would have guessed that merely meant they were waiting until roof chiller units were installed using a helicopter lift, but people are now living in the building.
SouthLoopArch/PilsenArch keeps asserting that the top will never be installed, but cites no source for his info.
slooparch December 7th, 2009, 03:45 PM ^Hard to say for sure. The top was always going to be light metal strips, which could easily be erected with a couple of guys and a small derrick or scaffolding. The bottom two rows were installed. I would have guessed that merely meant they were waiting until roof chiller units were installed using a helicopter lift, but people are now living in the building.
SouthLoopArch/PilsenArch keeps asserting that the top will never be installed, but cites no source for his info.
Based upon general knowledge of construction techniques and structural requirements necessary to build what was originally proposed. What is there now is not a structural system that could ever possibly support the proposed design. Like much of the rest of the building that was seriously dumbed down from the drawings presented to the neighborhood groups, the buidling's crown was chopped off to save $$
Mr Downtown December 7th, 2009, 05:25 PM ^Sounds like you're assuming the pyramidal top would be masonry, or at least something solid with wind loading considerations. But suppose it was simply a series of 12-inch-wide steel slats arranged in squares, each square 12 inches inside and 8 inches higher than the previous one. Look at the two squares that are already up there, and imagine that series continuing upward. This would only amount to a few hundred pounds of steel.
slooparch December 7th, 2009, 06:26 PM ^Sounds like you're assuming the pyramidal top would be masonry, or at least something solid with wind loading considerations. But suppose it was simply a series of 12-inch-wide steel slats arranged in squares, each square 12 inches inside and 8 inches higher than the previous one. Look at the two squares that are already up there, and imagine that series continuing upward. This would only amount to a few hundred pounds of steel.
No, I wasn't assuming masonry. The construction you describe would need very significant steel framing behind it to transfer the wind loads which still would be very substantial. Based upon the framing already up there, there is no indication that they intend to have any future significant wind load other then the minimal conditions that would result from the existing (rather minimal both visually and structrually) construction. Futhermore, just based upon construction techniques of the various trades, it would be highly unlikely for the subcontractor to construct 10% of the pyramid only to have to come back and set up all over again to construct the rest without a very good sequencing reason.
Hey, I would love to see this finished, but based upon the other cuts they already made to this project and this particular developers desire to put up arguably the worst schlock on the skyline during the recent boom, that is why I can gurantee you, it is finished.
spyguy December 8th, 2009, 09:54 PM So is the "Illinois Center for Broadcasting" taking part of the first floor space in Library Tower?
Mr Downtown December 8th, 2009, 10:36 PM I haven't heard that. I've been told that Columbia is leasing space there.
spyguy December 17th, 2009, 02:28 AM http://www.suntimes.com/news/watchdogs/1937511,CST-NWS-watchdogs14.article
What was Michael Scott's last big deal?
BY TIM NOVAK, CHRIS FUSCO, FRAN SPIELMAN AND DAVID ROEDER
December 14, 2009
Even as he served on the city's Olympic planning committee, Michael W. Scott, the late Chicago School Board president, was also involved in a multibillion-dollar lakefront development project near the proposed Olympic village, records and interviews show.
Scott, who was a close friend and political ally of Mayor Daley, was a consultant on the proposed condo-and-hotel project across from Soldier Field when he committed suicide last month. Since January, he had been getting paid an undisclosed monthly fee from developer Gerald W. Fogelson, according to B. Timothy Desmond, president of Fogelson Properties Inc.
Flubnut December 17th, 2009, 03:17 PM They want half a billion dollars in TIF money? Good luck with that.
Mr Downtown December 17th, 2009, 03:52 PM Hell, Roosevelt Collection is now trying to get TIF money for tenant buildout.
The Urban Politician December 18th, 2009, 07:49 PM With all the students taking up residence in the S. Loop, it seems to me that this area of town will evolve into something akin to the NYU area of Greenwich Village (although less intense). Even Dearborn park may some day become student housing once the old fogies who live in those houses pass away
PrintersRowBoiler December 19th, 2009, 05:51 AM Just got this Friday in a newsletter from Ald. Fioretti:
[COLOR="Navy"][FONT="Georgia"]LaSalle-Congress Intermodal Transfer Center
I am very happy to present this project to 2nd Ward residents and businesspeople. The City of Chicago intends this project to make it easier to get from the La Salle Street Metra station to nearby CTA buses. The new connection will feature two new dedicated CTA bus lanes on Financial Place.
http://i40.tinypic.com/24griht.jpg
What ever happend with this project? I thought it was supposed to break ground in August?
Mr Downtown December 19th, 2009, 06:55 AM Even Dearborn Park may some day become student housing
Already happening in the highrises, which at age 30 are nearing 25% rental. Some are straight rentals from investment owners; others are daddy-owned. My building seems to have a fair number of med students for some reason. You know how rowdy they can be.
The Urban Politician December 19th, 2009, 05:09 PM ^ :lol:
Rowdy, drunk college students also make for less vocal NIMBY's, so that in 20-30 years when a developer comes in and starts buying up property in Dearborn Park, perhaps there is hope that something worthwhile can be built to replace it.
Mr Downtown December 19th, 2009, 10:16 PM I don't see that really happening, because all of Dearborn I and most of Dearborn II is grouped into condo and homeowner associations. So until a developer owned two-thirds of the units in the association, he'd be unable to change the declaration. Stranger things have happened, though; in the 1990s there were entire small subdivisions in Atlanta, Houston, and Oakbrook Terrace that sold out en masse to developers.
It's rather naïve to assume that townhouse-scale development always and inevitably gives way to highrise development. There's obviously a market for both, and it's so much easier to develop new highrises on vacant or nonresidential sites that the troublesome and expensive land assembly you posit almost never occurs in North America. Even Manhattan is still full of townhouses.
The Urban Politician December 20th, 2009, 05:05 AM ^ I'm not talking about the whole neighborhood (DP 2, especially) being redeveloped, just the perimeter of it, such that:
1) higher density mixed uses face the surrounding streets
2) something less insulting than a wall faces Clark
and, perhaps some day:
3) Better street connections to the surrounding neighborhood.
Mr Downtown December 20th, 2009, 06:59 AM Well, you'll get no argument from me that the place would be nicer if those things happened. But what force is there to bring them about? Our only imperialist, Mayor Daley, looked at the low crime rate of Dearborn Park in the 90s and--misinterpreting the reasons--promptly began turning streets all over the city into cul-de-sacs.
People tend to like their neighborhoods the way they are, and resist any change. How will you get them to voluntarily do things that they perceive as detrimental to their own enjoyment and safety?
PrintersRowBoiler December 21st, 2009, 04:37 AM With all the students taking up residence in the S. Loop, it seems to me that this area of town will evolve into something akin to the NYU area of Greenwich Village (although less intense). Even Dearborn park may some day become student housing once the old fogies who live in those houses pass away
I don't see students taking over Dearborn Park. With the two new towers at Roosevelt, I see everyone shifting north. The University Center and other student residences will lose residents from Roosevelt and open up space for other students. Some students will continue to rent in some of the taller buildings in DP or Printers Row, but I can't imagine any students wanting to live in the townhouses of DP.
Plus with JCP being one of the top 100 high schools in the country (which may be the top in the City after they rebuild it) and with the CPS looking like they will give more spots to local residents, I am anticipating the townhomes in DP and DPII will become much more valuable to families. Just think of all the money people pay to live in Naperville and Hinsdale (instead of the town next door) just because of the schools.
The Urban Politician December 21st, 2009, 04:37 AM People tend to like their neighborhoods the way they are, and resist any change. How will you get them to voluntarily do things that they perceive as detrimental to their own enjoyment and safety?
^ By waiting for them to die. And once their descendants rent out their property to oblivious temporary residents they'll be less hesitant to sell at a higher price to real estate developers who will, like vultures, be circling this highly underdeveloped piece of real estate in a future in which developable land in the South Loop becomes scarce
Mr Downtown December 21st, 2009, 06:21 AM ^You do know that, generally in the US, when someone ages or dies, they just sell their house to someone else, right? There's no requirement for it to stay with their heirs. I doubt that more than 20 of the white townhouses are owned by the original owners at this point. Nor are they rented out. They have appreciative new owners who aren't going to be any more keen than their predecessors on having a highrise next door or having through traffic on the street out front.
And when you really study it, there's not really much place to put a new highrise. There are already highrises or midrises on nearly the whole periphery. Those little townhouses that back up to State Street south of 11th are bad for the streetscape on State, but the parcels are really not deep enough to ever build anything else there. About the only opportunity I see for a highrise would be the Garden Homes and their garages at NWC Plymouth/Roosevelt. That was originally to have been the site of the third highrise, but the first two had sold so slowly that in 1984 DPC gave up and sold it to a townhouse developer. I could maybe imagine a developer, 20 years from now, buying those up and doing a building entered from Roosevelt, with the good views north across the white townhomes to the skyline.
The Urban Politician December 21st, 2009, 06:35 AM ^ Point taken.
Perhaps economic/development pressures will change things in the future? God knows.
All I know is, DP2 doesn't have to completely bite the dust to be a more neighbor-friendly, city-embracing development. 90% of the neighborhood can remain completely unchanged, it just needs a few tweaks and I would never criticize that place again..
Satan's Mile Boy December 31st, 2009, 02:49 PM The old garage on 16th/Wabash was completely torn down this week. Does anyone know if there's a new building that will replace it? The last rumor I heard was that only the roof of the garage was being replaced, but apparently that's not true since the whole building is now gone.
http://img300.imageshack.us/img300/5118/img0027sloopoldgarage01.jpg
Mr Downtown December 31st, 2009, 04:22 PM Firestone is planning a replacement store on the site.
ChicagoismynewBlog December 31st, 2009, 07:25 PM They're rebuilding the garage because the building was in such bad shape from years and years and years of neglect.
http://chicagoismynewblog.wordpress.com
ChicagoismynewBlog December 31st, 2009, 07:26 PM They're rebuilding the garage because the building was in such bad shape from years and years and years of neglect.
http://chicagoismynewblog.wordpress.com
Whoops, didn't see your answer.
http://chicagoismynewblog.wordpress.com
Mr Downtown January 7th, 2010, 10:09 PM Demolition has begun on the old YWCA Building at 830 S. Michigan.
spyguy January 7th, 2010, 10:23 PM Demolition has begun on the old YWCA Building at 830 S. Michigan.
Wow, that's incredibly sad. I REALLY hope we don't end up with another dull Park 1000 design when this lot is developed.
PrintersRowBoiler January 12th, 2010, 07:56 PM Demolition has begun on the old YWCA Building at 830 S. Michigan.
Are they taking it down completely? I was hoping someone would do a facadectomy on this one.
Mr Downtown January 12th, 2010, 10:08 PM ^No one stepped up with money to preserve the façade. Remember, without the (wooden) structure behind it, it's just a tall thin stack of bricks. That's different from the McGraw-Hill, Farwell, or Jewelers Row buildings. It's probably easier to reconstruct it from photos than to try to hold it up as a façade.
Mr Downtown January 12th, 2010, 10:32 PM Here's the new Firestone store. Woo-hoo.
http://i45.tinypic.com/2gulb37.jpg
The building will be back at the back of the lot, with a lovely parking lot in front. There will be five service bays entered from the alley side (though not from the alley itself).
spyguy January 22nd, 2010, 12:08 AM ^*Shudder*
http://www.chicagojournal.com/News/01-20-2010/Burnham_Memorial_up_before_parks_board
Burnham Memorial up before parks board
01/20/2010 10:00 PM
...The district is expected to enter into an intergovernmental agreement with the city of Chicago, accepting $2 million in tax increment financing dollars to create a new, 1.08-acre park at 1611-1629 S. Wabash.
Friedler Construction Co. may be chosen to redevelop the shoreline on the north side of Ping Tom Park, 300 W. 19th. A contract not worth more than $4.9 million would pay for environmental remediation of the land; two riverfront trails; a boardwalk over the Chicago River; site grading; and a range of landscaping work.
---
Mr. D, any idea on what the Wabash park will look like?
Mr Downtown January 22nd, 2010, 05:39 AM All I've heard is that Alderman Fioretti wants a park there with a dog-friendly area. :gaah: I'm confused about how this works with True Rock's expansion plans.
I asked his parks coördinator why that was necessary with a dog park already in place at 14th Place and Wabash. That one's in the 3rd Ward, so apparently its existence was news to her.
Satan's Mile Boy January 23rd, 2010, 07:49 AM Does this mean the 1611-1629 S. Wabash park will get built in a few months? I hope they put lots of trees and not just grass.
Mr Downtown February 8th, 2010, 08:37 PM Today's Sun-Times reports (http://www.suntimes.com/news/cityhall/2035180,CST-NWS-walsh08.article) award of a contract for construction of the intermodal center at LaSalle Street Station.
A clout-heavy company with two generations of ties to the Daley family has been awarded a $3.3 million contract to build a "transfer center" meant to make it easier for commuters at Metra's LaSalle Street station to switch to CTA buses.
Walsh Construction will convert a surface parking lot at the southeast corner of Congress and Financial Place into a bus turnaround, with covered shelters, a lighted, landscaped plaza, and an elevator and staircase to the Metra station.
Metra passengers will be able to board CTA buses in one place, instead of walking to bus stops on Jackson, Van Buren, LaSalle or Harrison. The project will feature two new, dedicated CTA bus lanes on Financial Place.
Not sure why Fran Spielman felt the need to focus on Walsh's supposed clout when they were the low bidder.
Flubnut February 9th, 2010, 04:12 PM Not sure why Fran Spielman felt the need to focus on Walsh's supposed clout when they were the low bidder.
You want your news fair and balanced? Where's the fun in that?
nomarandlee March 19th, 2010, 12:12 PM http://www.suntimes.com/business/2111255,CST-NWS-grand19.article
Grand possibility for rail terminal site
S. LOOP | Huge rail terminal site on market, for buyers with patience
March 19, 2010
BY DAVID ROEDER droeder@suntimes.com
The biggest empty chunk of downtown Chicago is for sale, ready for somebody to take a chance on a future cycle of real estate growth.
Buyers should bring cash, great credit and patience.
The property is eight acres at the southwest corner of Harrison and Wells, which several investors have taken a crack at. It has been vacant since 1971, when the Grand Central Station rail terminal was torn down, to the horror of people who loved the architecture.
Russland Capital Group Inc. of Skokie owns the largest part of the tract, 6.6 acres, and is marketing it for $41 million.
The remaining 1.5 acres is at the corner. Its owner, D2 Realty Services Inc., is trying to sell it, but a price could not be learned. It had tried to peddle it for $15 million, but the contract never closed.
Russland's part includes frontage on the Chicago River, so developers have eyed it for a residential and retail mix. The housing collapse and credit squeeze upset those plans.
Jacob Bletnitsky, Russland president, said his firm doesn't want to hold the land for the next boom. "We're developers. We have other uses for the cash, and this is very expensive property to keep," he said.
Bletnitsky said Russland paid $34 million for the site two years ago and that valuations have veered wildly. He said that a few months after he bought it, Dubai investors offered him $100 million. He said they were working on the contract before the Dubai economy collapsed.
To market the property, Russland has hired Rick Levin & Associates Inc. The firm is best known for auctioning properties, but President Rick Levin said he is selling the parcel conventionally.
The land is just south of the city's financial markets. Levin said it will be the logical place for downtown to expand when the economy improves.
Bonnie Sanchez-Carlson, president of the Near South Planning Board, said neighbors probably will resist a zoning plan for the site that calls for a massive dose of housing. She said the South Loop has too many unsold condos.
Ald. Robert Fioretti, whose 2nd Ward includes the site, said the river exposure makes the land attractive for new homes. But he said he would resist high-rises because too many have been built, bringing congestion to the South Loop.
..
Flubnut March 19th, 2010, 03:50 PM * post deleted by me...cuz I'm dumb and can't read so good...
Mr Downtown March 19th, 2010, 04:10 PM Today's Tribune has an article about Roosevelt University adding student athletics so it will seem more like a "real" university. Buried near the end is this graf:
Roosevelt officials plan to transform a 14,000-square-foot parking lot in the South Loop into a multistory athletics building paid for by donors and sponsors, Cassidy said.
The Urban Politician March 19th, 2010, 08:58 PM Today's Tribune has an article about Roosevelt University adding student athletics so it will seem more like a "real" university. Buried near the end is this graf:
Roosevelt officials plan to transform a 14,000-square-foot parking lot in the South Loop into a multistory athletics building paid for by donors and sponsors, Cassidy said.
^ Oh my God! EMERGENCY MEETING of the South Loop neighbors! We cannot lose another parking lot. What will we do? Where will we go? Our neighborhood is falling apart!
First shadows, now more parking being lost. Luckily that new school on S. Michigan Ave will have a parking lot. Whew, dodged one there. We have to keep our neighborhood livable, that means NO MORE development on our precious parking lots! After all, where will Grandma park when she visits us next Christmas? Evil developers!!
:lol: Okay, sarcastic semi-humorous rant over..
skyduster March 19th, 2010, 09:30 PM ^^ lol
Everytime the city loses another parking lot, I do a little dance.
:banana::carrot::pepper::lock::cucumber::banana2:
May developers kill many, many more parking lots. They have my full blessing. :lol:
spyguy March 19th, 2010, 10:03 PM Any idea what lot they're talking about?
Mr Downtown March 20th, 2010, 06:41 AM ^No, though the (rather small) 14,000 sf size fits the one right across Wabash from the new building—it's 80 x 172. SEC Congress/Wabash (Auditorium Garage) might be another possibility, but I’d hate to see that site thrown away for a gym. It makes more sense for a pair of residential highrises that would look out over the Congress Hotel to Grant Park.
^ Oh my God! EMERGENCY MEETING of the South Loop neighbors! We cannot lose another parking lot.
I’m not sure what has provoked such sniping from the country cousins in Wisconsin. You know, South Loop Neighbors is an actual group with actual positions and organized meetings and everything. It’s not just some random gits on the Internet. The group has never ever asked for more parking for any project, nor bemoaned the loss of a parking lot.
And why is it that you cannot seem to understand that the Old St. Mary’s school is replacing a parking lot, not building one?
The Urban Politician March 20th, 2010, 11:27 PM I’m not sure what has provoked such sniping from the country cousins in Wisconsin. You know, South Loop Neighbors is an actual group with actual positions and organized meetings and everything. It’s not just some random gits on the Internet. The group has never ever asked for more parking for any project, nor bemoaned the loss of a parking lot.
^ I realize that it's an actual group, and I really was just having a bit of fun. That's why I referred to it as a 'semi-humorous' rant ;)
PrintersRowBoiler March 23rd, 2010, 07:30 PM I’m not sure what has provoked such sniping from the country cousins in Wisconsin. You know, South Loop Neighbors is an actual group with actual positions and organized meetings and everything. It’s not just some random gits on the Internet. The group has never ever asked for more parking for any project, nor bemoaned the loss of a parking lot.
I am pretty sure it was a shot at me becuase I said 3 years ago that I supported Larry Doody's position (along with a vast majority of S. Loopers) to require developers to provide 2 parking spaces for every unit. Apparently asking for two spaces in a new development replacing a parking lot means I would rather have the surface parking lot.
The Urban Politician March 23rd, 2010, 11:24 PM I am pretty sure it was a shot at me becuase I said 3 years ago that I supported Larry Doody's position (along with a vast majority of S. Loopers) to require developers to provide 2 parking spaces for every unit. Apparently asking for two spaces in a new development replacing a parking lot means I would rather have the surface parking lot.
It remains as completely idiotic a proposition now as it did then, and will continue to remain a horribly stupid idea in perpetuity. If "most" south loopers supported that idea then, then I will go ahead and restate my suspicion that most south loopers are dumb.
Lets just hope that such a ridiculous scheme is never implemented and goes the way of other ridiculous ideas like New Coke, repealing Medicare, and men wearing white wigs.
The Urban Politician March 23rd, 2010, 11:45 PM ^ Okay, men wearing white wigs was actually kind of cool now that I think about it. Who wouldn't want their founding fathers to look like that?
PrintersRowBoiler March 24th, 2010, 02:37 AM It remains as completely idiotic a proposition now as it did then, and will continue to remain a horribly stupid idea in perpetuity. If "most" south loopers supported that idea then, then I will go ahead and restate my suspicion that most south loopers are dumb.
76.6% of votes in the 2nd ward supported the idea on the advisory ballot in the 2007 Feb election. Of the voters in Printers Row, 71.5% supported the idea.
I don't think it is an idiotic idea nor do I think most South Loopers are dumb. We urban residents don't need people from Wisconsin telling us we are dumb because we are too "dependent on cars."
I will say Fioretti telling developers at Franklin Point they must build low-density buildings (townhomes) at that site because the City has too many high rises is questionable though.
spyguy March 26th, 2010, 07:05 PM Trader Joe's coming to Roosevelt and Wabash (Trailways Building)? Maybe (http://www.sloopin.com/2010/03/rumor-has-ittrader-joes-moving-into-old.html).
robituss April 3rd, 2010, 05:05 AM 76.6% of votes in the 2nd ward supported the idea on the advisory ballot in the 2007 Feb election. Of the voters in Printers Row, 71.5% supported the idea.
I don't think it is an idiotic idea nor do I think most South Loopers are dumb. We urban residents don't need people from Wisconsin telling us we are dumb because we are too "dependent on cars."
I will say Fioretti telling developers at Franklin Point they must build low-density buildings (townhomes) at that site because the City has too many high rises is questionable though.
Well I live in the south loop and I think its a dumb idea to require two parking spots per unit. At least, i think its excessive. Depending on where you live in the south loop, if you work downtown (which most seem to) you can take the el at roosevelt, take one of many buses, ride a bike, or simply walk.
spyguy April 9th, 2010, 01:17 AM http://www.chicagobreakingbusiness.com/2010/04/columbia-college-plans-south-loop-residence-hall.html
Columbia College plans South Loop residence hall
By Mary Ellen Podmolik
Columbia College Chicago said it will take over a South Loop apartment building and turn it into a residence hall, beginning this fall.
The college said it signed a five-year lease to operate a residence hall in the 16-story Dwight Lofts at 626 S. Clark St., which currently functions as an apartment building owned by ASB Capital Management of Bethesda, Md. The building has 771 beds in 178 loft-style units.
---
http://www.chicagojournal.com/News/04-07-2010/Foreclosures_sting_developer
Foreclosures sting developer
By MICAH MAIDENBERG
Three banks have filed foreclosure suits against Krzysztof Karbowski’s East Garfield Park and South Loop properties.
http://img710.imageshack.us/img710/903/11371.jpg
Mr Downtown April 15th, 2010, 03:16 PM Red Bull is apparently planning a wicked temporary BMX track on the Franklin Point site (http://bmx.transworld.net/1000098522/news/red-bull-announces-stomping-ground-dirt-contest-in-chicago/) at Wells & Harrison.
spyguy April 16th, 2010, 12:36 AM ^^Interesting.
Does anyone have an update on the new Jones College Prep? I've heard that Perkins + Will is the architect, but I'm not entirely sure of that...
spyguy April 16th, 2010, 09:43 PM Harrison & Wells for $41 million and now this:
http://www.chicagorealestatedaily.com/cgi-bin/news.pl?id=37855
Rezmar site in South Loop up for sale again
A 60-acre South Loop development site once controlled by convicted political fundraiser Antoin “Tony” Rezko is back on the market. An affiliate of Luxembourg-based conglomerate General Mediterranean Holding SA (GMH) has hired CB Richard Ellis Inc. to sell the Riverside Park parcel at the southwest corner of Roosevelt Road and Clark Street. The property is being offered without an asking price, and GMH is willing to sell off a joint-venture stake or subdivide the land for parties that don’t want the entire site, says CB Richard Ellis Senior Associate Marcello Campanini. The GMH affiliate paid about $131 million for the parcel in 2005, acquiring it from Mr. Rezko’s development firm, Rezmar Corp., which had planned to build about 4,600 residential units and 670,000 square feet of retail space there. GMH hired brokers in 2006 to sell off 17 acres within the site but never consummated a deal. Attempts to reach a local GMH representative were unsuccessful. Newsletter Real Estate Alert first reported that the site has been put up for sale.
spyguy April 23rd, 2010, 01:19 AM http://www.chicagojournal.com/News/04-21-2010/Land_swap_means_funds_for_Jones_Prep
Land swap means funds for Jones Prep
School benefits from deal between archdiocese, city and CPS
04/21/2010 10:00 PM
By IAN FULLERTON
Jones Prep High School is on deck to receive some roundabout city subsidies. The city announced last week that the school would receive tax increment financing funds to assist in the school’s plans for a new eight-story facility in the South Loop.
spyguy April 28th, 2010, 11:20 PM ^No, though the (rather small) 14,000 sf size fits the one right across Wabash from the new building—it's 80 x 172. SEC Congress/Wabash (Auditorium Garage) might be another possibility, but I’d hate to see that site thrown away for a gym. It makes more sense for a pair of residential highrises that would look out over the Congress Hotel to Grant Park.
For only $5 million how permanent can this structure be?
http://www.roosevelttorch.com/sections/business/field-house-future-1.2241804
Field house future
By Dylan Heath
Roosevelt is working on plans to build a field house for the sports department to replace the parking lot on the corner of Congress and Wabash Ave., Roosevelt President Middleton announced at the ground breaking for the building that will replace the Herman Crown Center.
Prairie Avenue May 13th, 2010, 08:16 PM ^^Interesting.
Does anyone have an update on the new Jones College Prep? I've heard that Perkins + Will is the architect, but I'm not entirely sure of that...
That is correct. They have been selected. The current plan is to have Jones be constructed entirely on the former Pacific Mission footprint and hold 1200 students, up from the 800 capacity of the current Jones.
The Urban Politician May 14th, 2010, 03:50 AM That is correct. They have been selected. The current plan is to have Jones be constructed entirely on the former Pacific Mission footprint and hold 1200 students, up from the 800 capacity of the current Jones.
^ What happens to the current Jones? Demo?
Mr Downtown May 14th, 2010, 06:19 AM ^Apparently. The plan is supposed to be for the Board of Ed to sell off the current Jones site for redevelopment, but at the last minute they'll probably decide they need it for teacher parking, or worse, bring it to market at the bottom of a cycle and it'll become a one-story Office Depot or something.
ChitownCity May 15th, 2010, 07:04 AM ^^ Lol dear God I hope not
spyguy May 17th, 2010, 07:17 PM http://columbiachronicle.com/columbia-plans-for-improvement/
Columbia plans for improvement
Ciara Shook
05-10-10
...Columbia is teaming with Gensler Architects this summer for exterior restorations of the South Campus Building, 624 S. Michigan Ave., and the Alexandroff Campus Center, 600 S. Michigan Ave. This is part of a project to restore several buildings on campus, which will span approximately four years and will also include the 1104 Center, 1104 S. Wabash Ave., the 11th Street Campus Building, 72 E. 11th St. and the 33 E. Congress Parkway Building.
...Heidi McClenahan, architect for Gensler, said changes to the facades will include replacing the cornice on the Alexandroff Campus Center—crowning ornamental elements that line the top of the building. Other repairs produced by general weathering of the building will also be included in the process.
---
http://img265.imageshack.us/img265/1984/624smichigan.jpghttp://img706.imageshack.us/img706/7582/600smichigan.jpg
I would love to see the top floors of 624 restored.
Prairie Avenue May 18th, 2010, 06:44 PM ^Apparently. The plan is supposed to be for the Board of Ed to sell off the current Jones site for redevelopment, but at the last minute they'll probably decide they need it for teacher parking, or worse, bring it to market at the bottom of a cycle and it'll become a one-story Office Depot or something.
There are some possibilities of putting money into it and keeping it as a school under discussion, but demolition appears top of the City's and CPS' list.
Loopy May 18th, 2010, 07:34 PM ..
Mr Downtown May 18th, 2010, 08:05 PM Seems like it would be a good property for the Archdiocese of Chicago to operate as a parochial high school. Or for something like Loyola Academy Downtown. But of course that would provide a low sales price and no property tax revenue.
PrintersRowBoiler May 19th, 2010, 08:23 PM Seems like it would be a good property for the Archdiocese of Chicago to operate as a parochial high school. Or for something like Loyola Academy Downtown. But of course that would provide a low sales price and no property tax revenue.
I have heard possibly a junior high or another elementary to help with the overcrowding at south loop school.
This may be too close to St. Ignatius (about 2 miles) for the archdiocese to get a good draw, but that school is extremely tough to get into (about the 90th percentile or better if there is no "loyalty") - so maybe just the "rejects" will be enough of a draw. Plus with St. Mary's expanding, maybe there will be the demand. But that is hard to justify with some of the other catholic schools struggling.
But I doubt another Jesuit school like Loyola Academy will open downtown with Cristo Rey, Christ the King, and Ignatius within the City limits.
BUT if the voucher program goes through (as anticipated after the November elections), the enrollment for the archdiocese is expected to go through the roof.
spyguy May 26th, 2010, 03:52 PM http://www.chicagorealestatedaily.com/cgi-bin/news.pl?id=38370
Auction ordered for development site near Grant Park
By Alby Gallun, May 26, 2010
A South Michigan Avenue development site that would have been a hot commodity during the condominium boom is being sold in a court-ordered auction more than two years after a lender filed to foreclose on the property.
spyguy June 4th, 2010, 09:37 PM ^Apparently. The plan is supposed to be for the Board of Ed to sell off the current Jones site for redevelopment, but at the last minute they'll probably decide they need it for teacher parking, or worse, bring it to market at the bottom of a cycle and it'll become a one-story Office Depot or something.
This is OK as a temporary solution because no new residential will be built here for some time and this will minimize disruptions for the school. But otherwise, ugh.
http://www.gazettechicago.com/index/2010/06/new-building-for-jones-by-fall-of-2013/
New building for Jones by fall of 2013
By Marie Balice Ward
Although Chicago Public Schools (CPS) officials have scrapped plans to demolish the Jones College Prep building at 606 S. State St., the school will move to a new facility immediately south of its current site by fall 2013. The new building will accommodate 1,200 students
Prairie Avenue June 9th, 2010, 03:57 PM New building for Jones by fall of 2013
By Marie Balice Ward
Although Chicago Public Schools (CPS) officials have scrapped plans to demolish the Jones College Prep building at 606 S. State St., the school will move to a new facility immediately south of its current site by fall 2013. The new building will accommodate 1,200 students
The wording there is confusing. CPS hasn't scrapped plans to demolish the Jones building. What they have scrapped is a design for the new building to be built in part on the existing Jones school footprint. The prior plan had Jones relocating for a year of construction. The new plan has them building the new Jones entirely within the footprint of the current surface parking lot. Once the new building is up, the current thinking is the old building will be demolished.
spyguy June 22nd, 2010, 06:26 AM Has anyone heard anything about the Roosevelt Collection lately? Specifically if there's been any new retail activity or why the park by the elaborate staircase hasn't been built yet.
Prairie Avenue June 24th, 2010, 08:07 PM Has anyone heard anything about the Roosevelt Collection lately? Specifically if there's been any new retail activity or why the park by the elaborate staircase hasn't been built yet.
Same answer for both, no money. The developer is seeking TIF dollars to finish space so he can offer it for lease.
spyguy July 14th, 2010, 09:06 PM Illinois Center for Broadcasting
530 S State
http://img17.imageshack.us/img17/4343/icbay.jpg
http://img686.imageshack.us/img686/8186/icbb.jpg
(Images from website (http://beonair.com/chicago))
The Urban Politician July 14th, 2010, 09:30 PM ^ That's a great location to put this new campus, with all those students walking around.
The south loop is becoming quite the education incubator...
spyguy July 21st, 2010, 05:48 AM http://www.chicagobusiness.com/cgi-bin/mag/article.pl?articleId=33684
Matthew Pritzker tests wings with investments in real estate, movies and more
By: Steven R. Strahler July 19, 2010
...In a deal from the Pritzker playbook, a venture linked to him paid $17.6 million for a foreclosed site at 830 S. Michigan Ave., where a condominium project fell through.
..."Most of the properties that I have will involve some form of upgrade or construction," says Mr. Pritzker, who is single and rich enough to bank land during a slow recovery and then cash in by flipping or developing it. He says the vacant 36,000-square-foot Michigan Avenue site remains slated for condos.
slooparch July 21st, 2010, 05:22 PM http://www.chicagobusiness.com/cgi-bin/mag/article.pl?articleId=33684
Matthew Pritzker tests wings with investments in real estate, movies and more
By: Steven R. Strahler July 19, 2010
...In a deal from the Pritzker playbook, a venture linked to him paid $17.6 million for a foreclosed site at 830 S. Michigan Ave., where a condominium project fell through.
..."Most of the properties that I have will involve some form of upgrade or construction," says Mr. Pritzker, who is single and rich enough to bank land during a slow recovery and then cash in by flipping or developing it. He says the vacant 36,000-square-foot Michigan Avenue site remains slated for condos.
very good news... there's a chance that pritzker might even hire a decent architect...
spyguy July 29th, 2010, 02:05 AM http://www.chicagorealestatedaily.com/cgi-bin/news.pl?id=39012
Parcel near Grant Park auctioned for less than half its debt
By Alby Gallun, July 28, 2010
...An affiliate of First American Bank prevailed in the auction of the vacant property at 1000 S. Michigan Ave., with a winning bid of $11.3 million, less than half the $25.3 million the Elk Grove Village-based lender is owed on the site, says auctioneer Rick Levin, whose firm conducted the sale.
---
http://www.chicagojournal.com/News/07-21-2010/Wheels_start_turning_for_new_park
Wheels start turning for new park
By MICAH MAIDENBERG
The real estate firm that put up the Roosevelt Collection project and the Chicago Park District are negotiating over the contours of a new park in the South Loop, representatives from both organizations have confirmed.
spyguy August 2nd, 2010, 11:50 PM The Plymouth (dorms, 20 units)
http://img12.imageshack.us/img12/24/theplymouth.jpg
i_am_hydrogen August 3rd, 2010, 11:15 PM ^I ♥ adaptive reuse.
untitledreality August 5th, 2010, 11:04 PM ^I ♥ adaptive reuse.
I ♥ Printers Row.
PrintersRowBoiler August 9th, 2010, 06:02 AM The Plymouth (dorms, 20 units)
http://img12.imageshack.us/img12/24/theplymouth.jpg
anyone know the status of the building just to the north of this one on dearborn? wasn't this planned to be converted to dorms?
The Urban Politician August 9th, 2010, 06:03 PM ^ Oh my God, PRB, where will they park?
20 dorms=40 parking spots BADLY needed! Call the fire department! Disaster is looming! Where will Grandma park on Thanksgiving?? Oh the HUMANITY!!!!!! :lol:
Just poking fun. Sorry, the forums have been particularly dull lately...
The Urban Politician September 24th, 2010, 03:54 AM Board OKs $111 mil. site for new Jones Prep (http://www.suntimes.com/news/education/2738784,CST-NWS-jones23.article)
September 23, 2010
BY ROSALIND ROSSI Education Reporter/rrossi@suntimes.com
Despite tight budget times, a new $111 million school building would replace the current elite Jones College Prep under a plan approved Wednesday that raises new questions about the future of the existing South Loop building.
The new Jones College Prep is slated to rise eight stories high just south of the old one on land once occupied by the Pacific Garden Mission at 646 S. State.
With neighborhood kids not guaranteed seats in a college prep, Ald. Bob Fioretti (2nd) revealed Wednesday that he wants to explore converting the current Jones building into a high school for neighborhood students. Fioretti contends the South Loop will eventually have enough teens to support a neighborhood high school.
Another idea is to turn the current Jones into a selective-enrollment school for roughly 800 high-achieving seventh- and eighth-graders, Jones Principal Joseph Powers said.
That plan is "speculative," Powers said, but "I believe . . . CPS sees the value of keeping a building that's a ready-made school in the downtown area."
CPS spokeswoman Monique Bond said current plans call for the new Jones to house 900 "selected enrollment" students and 300 "neighborhood'' ones, although she could not explain how local kids would be admitted.
Back in 2004, CPS officials had planned to place a $20 million addition to Jones on the Pacific Garden Mission site to hold those elements missing from Jones, such as a library and fitness center. Powers said by the time he became principal in 2008, officials were discussing constructing a whole new school for 1,200 kids, rather than just an addition.
Currently, he said, Jones rents fitness space nearby and uses a gym five miles away at a former school.
Bond said the new Jones would be bankrolled with tax-increment financing dollars.
spyguy September 30th, 2010, 01:52 AM http://www.chicagorealestatedaily.com/article/20100929/CRED03/100929871/judgment-clears-way-for-d2-realty-to-find-south-loop-site-buyer
Judgment clears way for D2 Realty to find South Loop site buyer
By: Alby Gallun September 29, 2010
The owner of a prime 1.6-acre parcel just four blocks south of the Willis Tower plans to put the site back on the market after winning a lawsuit against an Irish developer that backed out of a contract to buy the property last year.
ChitownCity September 30th, 2010, 05:02 PM ^ I hope that is very promising news... (:whispers: skyscrapers :whispers:)
The Urban Politician October 6th, 2010, 11:03 PM McPier sells first $1.12B in bonds (http://chicagobreakingbusiness.com/2010/10/mcpier-sells-first-1-12b-in-bonds.html)
By Kathy Bergen
Posted today at 1:13 p.m.
The agency that runs McCormick Place got long-awaited financial relief Wednesday with the sale of $1.12 billion in bonds to restructure old expansion debt and finance an addition to the convention center hotel.
spyguy October 7th, 2010, 02:41 AM Well, that's another tower that will presumably start relatively soon. Hoping for better architecture this time, though.
Mr Downtown October 11th, 2010, 09:19 PM News of South Loop universities:
John Marshall Law School will replace the Walgreen's at State/Jackson with school facilities, including a new student commons. Crain's story. (http://www.chicagorealestatedaily.com/article/20101011/CRED03/101019998/john-marshall-to-expand-in-law-school-arms-race)
Roosevelt will build its student athletic center on the parking lot at the southeast corner of Wabash & Congress. The site is only the small surface lot on the corner, not the L-shaped garage.
East-West University is talking about building "soon" an 800,000 sq ft building, including 230 beds of dorm space, an athletic center, food court, etc. Presumably this would be at 9th & Wabash SEC. No other details yet.
nomarandlee October 11th, 2010, 11:37 PM Great updates D. Would be nice to see something a bit taller then an athletic center at Wabash & Congress but it will be nice to see these Wabash lots finally get built up.
spyguy October 12th, 2010, 02:12 AM East-West University is talking about building "soon" an 800,000 sq ft building, including 230 beds of dorm space, an athletic center, food court, etc. Presumably this would be at 9th & Wabash SEC. No other details yet.
If this actually goes through, wow. If it's the similar to the design I saw a few years ago, even more amazing.
Azure Tower is dead (http://www.chicagorealestatedaily.com/article/20101011/CRED03/101019996/in-brief-united-grows-at-willis-loop-refi-auctions) (no surprise).
spyguy October 21st, 2010, 05:54 PM Well this isn't good. They're marketing the lots on both sides of Dearborn (& Polk) as lowrise retail buildings.
http://img253.imageshack.us/img253/7114/40180505.jpg
The previous plans, which I thought were mediocre for the site:
http://img243.imageshack.us/img243/9095/60wpolkview1.gifhttp://img543.imageshack.us/img543/2008/50wpolkview1.gif
You could do a lot more with this unique location than what's been shown so far.
ChitownCity October 21st, 2010, 06:36 PM I'm so sick of this bullshit. The South Loop really is in desperate need of some highrises/scrapers... besides the roosevelt university...
The Urban Politician October 21st, 2010, 09:18 PM Actually, I think for now this is exactly what the S Loop needs.
TroyBoy October 22nd, 2010, 07:30 AM Actually, I think for now this is exactly what the S Loop needs.
Agreed, it could use more retail and restaurants.
untitledreality October 25th, 2010, 03:48 AM I'm so sick of this bullshit. The South Loop really is in desperate need of some highrises/scrapers... besides the roosevelt university...
Go find a group of investors willing to put up 50 million dollars, find a bank willing to lend you 200 million dollars and have at it.
There are plenty of neighborhoods in Chicago that built their success off of low rise, street friendly development. Density and Demand go hand in hand, can't ever have one without the other and both have to start from Zero.
ChitownCity October 25th, 2010, 04:48 PM ^ I know but I still hate how the skyline completely falls off as soon as you go south of Van Buren (what's so hard about putting a couple skyscrapers a few blocks south of the Sears Tower?) and yes it does need more street life development considering alll of the schools in the area...
The Urban Politician October 25th, 2010, 08:38 PM (what's so hard about putting a couple skyscrapers a few blocks south of the Sears Tower?)
:ohno:
Either you're very young or you're in complete denial about just how shitty the economy is right now.
Other than a University associated development or perhaps 1 apartment tower (unlikely), or maybe the expansion of McCormick's hotel (more likely), expect that not a single new highrise will go up south of Congress before 2015, if not 2018 or even 2020.
The south loop highrise boom is DEAD. Banks aren't even willing to lend to buyers who want to buy unsold condo inventory. Things are really bad right now.
Nathan7888 October 25th, 2010, 09:31 PM News of South Loop universities:
John Marshall Law School will replace the Walgreen's at State/Jackson with school facilities, including a new student commons. Crain's story. (http://www.chicagorealestatedaily.com/article/20101011/CRED03/101019998/john-marshall-to-expand-in-law-school-arms-race)
Roosevelt will build its student athletic center on the parking lot at the southeast corner of Wabash & Congress. The site is only the small surface lot on the corner, not the L-shaped garage.
East-West University is talking about building "soon" an 800,000 sq ft building, including 230 beds of dorm space, an athletic center, food court, etc. Presumably this would be at 9th & Wabash SEC. No other details yet.
For the Roosevelt University athletic center, is there a reason why the L-shaped garage is not being used for the site? That SIGNIFICANTLY shrinks an already skinny site, so I'm curious as to how the building would turn out without that part of the lot. The lot is especially tight if Roosevelt intends to have a full arena or if they simply want a more dedicated athletic building (more gym and auxiliary space rather than full-blown arena).
I also have heard that SCB has the commission for the building, and I wonder what phase of the project they are in which may give some insight into what plot of land is or is not being used.
spyguy October 26th, 2010, 05:10 AM Actually, I think for now this is exactly what the S Loop needs.
Well what I posted is unlikely what ends up being built. There's almost no way you'll see 3 story retail buildings in the South Loop. If we're lucky it'll be 2 floors, maybe one even. Would you still feel the same way then? Or a Qdoba on one side and a drive thru bank on the other?
I understand that financing for large residential buildings is scarce and that developers might feel financial pressure to put anything up. But not every lot has to be developed right at this moment. Hopefully they can wait it out for a few years and we can get something more appropriate then instead of squandering these prime spots for years to come.
nicksplace27 October 26th, 2010, 04:01 PM Well what I posted is unlikely what ends up being built. There's almost no way you'll see 3 story retail buildings in the South Loop. If we're lucky it'll be 2 floors, maybe one even. Would you still feel the same way then? Or a Qdoba on one side and a drive thru bank on the other?
I understand that financing for large residential buildings is scarce and that developers might feel financial pressure to put anything up. But not every lot has to be developed right at this moment. Hopefully they can wait it out for a few years and we can get something more appropriate then instead of squandering these prime spots for years to come.
I completely agree. This has been happening to sites all over town and I hope developers have anough foresight to know waiting will make them more cash in the long run.
ChitownCity October 26th, 2010, 04:43 PM :ohno:
Either you're very young or you're in complete denial about just how shitty the economy is right now.
Other than a University associated development or perhaps 1 apartment tower (unlikely), or maybe the expansion of McCormick's hotel (more likely), expect that not a single new highrise will go up south of Congress before 2015, if not 2018 or even 2020.
The south loop highrise boom is DEAD. Banks aren't even willing to lend to buyers who want to buy unsold condo inventory. Things are really bad right now.
I know its dead and the economy is garbage at the moment (although slowly recovering) but why put something this small on a lot with such great potential instead putting it in the west loop where it'd be more appropriate? When the next boom does come how likely would it be that this brand spanking new development be demolished for another building? I'd rather it just stay a lot until the next highrise boom given its location... ( and yes I'm young...)
The Urban Politician October 26th, 2010, 05:39 PM I completely agree. This has been happening to sites all over town and I hope developers have anough foresight to know waiting will make them more cash in the long run.
^ Or perhaps it is you who doesn't have the foresight (I'm not trying to be offensive) to realize that even a 1 story retail shop will ultimately have more value for the neighborhood than a vacant lot. Yes, even a Qdoba or a bank--people utilize those businesses.
Landbanking is not a good thing for cities. Now I'm not saying that I advocate for strip malls, but I think putting these lots to productive use in a manner that makes the South Loop a more desirable place to live will ultimately serve the community better, bring up property values, and attract future buyers/renters to the area than keeping it a parking lot for another 15 to 20 years with the hopes of eventually building a skyscraper there.
Cities, especially mature cities like Chicago, are built over the course of generations and lifetimes, not in 10 years. We are all impatient to see the South Loop turn into Manhattan in our lifetimes, but the reality is, that transformation (if it ever happens) will take a very long time--perhaps our grandkids will see it.
nicksplace27 October 27th, 2010, 12:48 AM ^ Or perhaps it is you who doesn't have the foresight (I'm not trying to be offensive) to realize that even a 1 story retail shop will ultimately have more value for the neighborhood than a vacant lot. Yes, even a Qdoba or a bank--people utilize those businesses.
Landbanking is not a good thing for cities. Now I'm not saying that I advocate for strip malls, but I think putting these lots to productive use in a manner that makes the South Loop a more desirable place to live will ultimately serve the community better, bring up property values, and attract future buyers/renters to the area than keeping it a parking lot for another 15 to 20 years with the hopes of eventually building a skyscraper there.
Cities, especially mature cities like Chicago, are built over the course of generations and lifetimes, not in 10 years. We are all impatient to see the South Loop turn into Manhattan in our lifetimes, but the reality is, that transformation (if it ever happens) will take a very long time--perhaps our grandkids will see it.
I agree I suppose. I just I may just be spoiled by all of the recent development all at once.
untitledreality October 27th, 2010, 03:08 AM I thought this entry on Curbed Chicago was appropriate...
http://chicago.curbed.com/archives/2010/10/26/zombie-buildings.php
"whats so hard about putting a couple skyscrapers a few blocks south of the Sears Tower?"....apparently really hard, even after they get built.
untitledreality October 27th, 2010, 03:20 AM ^ Or perhaps it is you who doesn't have the foresight (I'm not trying to be offensive) to realize that even a 1 story retail shop will ultimately have more value for the neighborhood than a vacant lot. Yes, even a Qdoba or a bank--people utilize those businesses.
Landbanking is not a good thing for cities. Now I'm not saying that I advocate for strip malls, but I think putting these lots to productive use in a manner that makes the South Loop a more desirable place to live will ultimately serve the community better, bring up property values, and attract future buyers/renters to the area than keeping it a parking lot for another 15 to 20 years with the hopes of eventually building a skyscraper there.
Cities, especially mature cities like Chicago, are built over the course of generations and lifetimes, not in 10 years. We are all impatient to see the South Loop turn into Manhattan in our lifetimes, but the reality is, that transformation (if it ever happens) will take a very long time--perhaps our grandkids will see it.
Im glad you typed it so I didn't have to :)
spyguy October 28th, 2010, 10:19 PM 8 floors, 1 floor underground parking
Perkins + Will
http://img828.imageshack.us/img828/6690/wjprep1.jpg
http://img258.imageshack.us/img258/5602/wjprep2.jpg
Mr Downtown October 28th, 2010, 10:25 PM Thanks, spyguy. Any idea what happens in those ground-floor voids? The ones you can see just to the left of the crossing pedestrian?
The Urban Politician October 29th, 2010, 03:36 AM Thanks, spyguy. Any idea what happens in those ground-floor voids? The ones you can see just to the left of the crossing pedestrian?
^ That's where the pot-smokers are supposed to hang out
mohammed wong October 29th, 2010, 05:25 AM Its about time chicago got its own fancy down town highschool.
Very Nice.
Anthony H October 29th, 2010, 07:00 PM Whatever happened to stately public buildings? Haven't we had enough experimental garbage on the public dime?
This is what Stewart Brand would have called "Magazine Architecture". It looks stunning in renderings and magazine spreads but won't work as a building.
Designs (and waste) like this are why people vote against ballot initiatives for new schools.
Flubnut October 29th, 2010, 08:14 PM It looks stunning in renderings and magazine spreads but won't work as a building.
Can't really say that just by looking at a few renderings of the outside. I'm sure Perkins + Will spent a good amount of time looking at student movements, classroom layouts, etc.
And this is Chicago. DOWNTOWN Chicago. Taking some architectural risk is pretty much a requirement. Every new building can't be a Chicago Cultural Center knockoff. That'd be utterly boring. (and way more expensive to build than this proposal.)
spyguy October 30th, 2010, 01:55 AM Any idea what happens in those ground-floor voids?
No, not really, although I can't imagine it'll be something that engages passersby. I like TUP's explanation.
Rather overlooked development in Chinatown mentioned in the Chicago Reader (http://www.chicagoreader.com/TheBlog/archives/2010/10/28/going-down-at-richland-center-chinatown):
Richland Center
2002 S Wentworth
http://img188.imageshack.us/img188/9651/4796301955b324f56ac9b.jpg
Zol87/ flickr (http://www.flickr.com/photos/zol87/4796301955/in/photostream/)
^The top portion under construction in this older pic now features two large LED screens for ads
This is where Tony Hu just opened his upscale restaurant, Lao You Ju. Another restaurant, Tao Ran Ju, is on the first floor. In the basement there is a food court with a sushi bar, buffet, Kylin Teppanyaki, and soon a Korean noodle stall, Thai stall, and Hong Kong sandwiches with more space available.
http://img191.imageshack.us/img191/1566/1288275692img1452.jpg
Mike Sula/ Chicago Reader
Obviously a little empty right now, but it's great to see Chinatown expanding. Hopefully some of those larger developments in the area come to fruition.
The Urban Politician October 30th, 2010, 04:53 AM ^ Yeah, I was pleased to see that this expansion of Chinatown Square didn't follow the 'parking out front' format of the original shopping center.
Chinatown has a lot of potential, but the neighborhood really lacks cohesiveness, especially for pedestrians. The Chinatown square shopping center is disconnected from the original Chinatown by a rather awkward array of wide lane streets and parking lots.
I've mentioned this before long ago, but I think the Chinatown parking lot along the Red Line is an absolutely PRIME site for development into a multilevel garage with lower level retail/commercial space. A highrise would also be an option there, except that in Chicago people don't like living next to the L tracks.
spyguy November 17th, 2010, 01:01 AM http://www.colum.edu/News/johnson-publishing-building-purchase-letter-from-dr.-carter.php
Columbia College Purchases Iconic Johnson Publishing Headquarters Building
Columbia College Chicago is purchasing the Johnson Publishing headquarters at 820 S. Michigan Avenue. In difficult economic times and with a shrinking budget, you may wonder why we would be making this decision now. You may recall that in early 2009, we discovered that due to the Library’s growing collection over time, the weight of the Library itself had come to exceed the capacity of the 624 S. Michigan building structure. The building remains safe to occupy because we have made some interim changes to address the situation, such as distributing books over a larger area and instituting a policy of no net addition of books in 624 S. Michigan. (The Library collection growth is being accommodated by using spaces in other buildings.) However, this is obviously only a temporary solution.
...
Q: Why did you also purchase the parking garage at 801 S. Wabash?
A: If we did not purchase the garage at 801 S. Wabash, we would not have been able to purchase the building. The acquisition of the parking garage provides the College the ability to offer parking to faculty and staff at reduced rates as well as the opportunity of a centrally located future development site in the heart of our campus.
spyguy November 27th, 2010, 10:09 PM First, a proposal to develop a park at 16th and Prairie. A nearby medical office would pay for the improvements in exchange for building some surface parking spaces on the lot.
http://img585.imageshack.us/img585/3139/16prairie.jpg
And it's no longer a rumor - Trader Joe's is coming (http://chicago.everyblock.com/business-licenses/by-date/2010/11/24/3574886/) to the South Loop at Roosevelt & Wabash. Should be a very good development for the neighborhood.
Flacos November 29th, 2010, 10:23 AM First, a proposal to develop a park at 16th and Prairie. A nearby medical office would pay for the improvements in exchange for building some surface parking spaces on the lot.
http://img585.imageshack.us/img585/3139/16prairie.jpg
And it's no longer a rumor - Trader Joe's is coming (http://chicago.everyblock.com/business-licenses/by-date/2010/11/24/3574886/) to the South Loop at Roosevelt & Wabash. Should be a very good development for the neighborhood.
saw the presentation on the park at 16th and Indiana with friends who live in the building adjacent to the parcel - the park depicted in your post is not a new park, but an existing park, zoned as a park in the central station plan, where apparently someone is trying to pull a fast one on by slicing the existing park and adding a surface parking lot for private use only. :nuts:
according to my friends this is one sleazy/slimeball :ohno:deal with some obvious zoning and legal hurdles, and the park is already scheduled to be improved in future by the park district, after it was to be conveyed in similar fashion to lakeshore east park by the developer.
ChitownCity November 29th, 2010, 04:42 PM park or parking lot either way its not that much of an improvement imo... I'd probably take the lot over the park....
slooparch November 29th, 2010, 04:48 PM saw the presentation on the park at 16th and Indiana with friends who live in the building adjacent to the parcel - the park depicted in your post is not a new park, but an existing park, zoned as a park in the central station plan, where apparently someone is trying to pull a fast one on by slicing the existing park and adding a surface parking lot for private use only. :nuts:
according to my friends this is one sleazy/slimeball :ohno:deal with some obvious zoning and legal hurdles, and the park is already scheduled to be improved in future by the park district, after it was to be conveyed in similar fashion to lakeshore east park by the developer.
"Flacos" is a known community 'crazy' that specializes in spewing misinformation. The "park" is privately owned by the adjacent condo association that obviously does not have the resources to maintain much less improve the parcel. The Park District has no foreseeable plans to acquire or maintain the property and the deal with the local business would not preclude this from happening anyway....
Flacos November 29th, 2010, 10:31 PM "Flacos" is a known community 'crazy' that specializes in spewing misinformation. The "park" is privately owned by the adjacent condo association that obviously does not have the resources to maintain much less improve the parcel. The Park District has no foreseeable plans to acquire or maintain the property and the deal with the local business would not preclude this from happening anyway....
mr./ms. slooparch, who are you and why are you initiating personal attacks when we have never communicated in regard to any of this, nor did I attack you? are you with the alderman's office? people are allowed to seek or provide informed opinions, facts, and nuggets to pass on; reasonable people can disagree without resorting to your tactics.
slooparch November 30th, 2010, 08:30 PM mr./ms. slooparch, who are you and why are you initiating personal attacks when we have never communicated in regard to any of this, nor did I attack you? are you with the alderman's office? people are allowed to seek or provide informed opinions, facts, and nuggets to pass on; reasonable people can disagree without resorting to your tactics.
If you decide to post facts rather then emotion veiled as facts in your 3rd post to Skyscraper City, then you shouldn't concern yourself with 'personal' attacks...
Flacos December 1st, 2010, 02:31 AM If you decide to post facts rather then emotion veiled as facts in your 3rd post to Skyscraper City, then you shouldn't concern yourself with 'personal' attacks...
if there are inaccuracies i will kindly correct or personally apologize.
the space in the renderings could be from any suburban strip mall lot, not a major US city. building surface parking lots appears to counter the goal of facilitating more public transportation based urban density and providing true urban quality open spaces.
could you elaborate on the zoning law or published study that explains your comment of "association that obviously does not have the resources to maintain much less improve the parcel". how does one determine this? if you have it, i would be interested in learning more about the announcement where the park district indicated they do not want the space;
as it stands, a much needed existing park being partially converted for private use into a daily private parking, when there is a dearth of quality completed park space for almost any use.
slooparch December 1st, 2010, 03:48 PM Facts:
The open lot at the NE corner of 16th and Indiana is currently NOT a park.
The open lot is privately owned and the public currently as no right to access it.
NearNorthGuy December 2nd, 2010, 02:59 AM This is the wrong place for a surface parking lot. This is the Central Area, for crying out loud.
This land should be made, in its entirety, into park space. Alderman Fioretti should be working with the Park District and the City to find the funds to purchase the land that is privately owned and make a park of entire site.
slooparch December 2nd, 2010, 03:11 AM everyone agrees with that.... it's just not happening...
J.S. Ford December 2nd, 2010, 03:28 AM I live in one of the adjacent buildings to the park at 16th and Indiana Ave. and can confirm slooparch’s info is accurate. More specifically, the local Prairie District Neighborhood Alliance Board conducted a thorough review of issues, restrictions, and history surrounding the park in question to clarify any miscommunication.
http://library.constantcontact.com/download/get/file/16th_Street_Park_to_Parking_Lot_Survey_2010.pdf
Flacos December 11th, 2010, 05:19 AM Facts:
The open lot at the NE corner of 16th and Indiana is currently NOT a park.
The open lot is privately owned and the public currently as no right to access it.
Your facts are totally 100% incorrect. Can you post where it is written that this lot is not a park or publically accessible open space? In addition to JS Ford's link, any one can go to the City Clerk's website http://www.chicityclerk.com/journals/2001/oct3/TOC_oct3_2001.pdf pages 68723 to 68739 and see where it is written relevant to information. it is common knowledge that the space is a publically accessible open space. "The park shall be open and accessible to the Public..."
It does not get any clear than that. So where do you get your facts again?
slooparch December 13th, 2010, 11:21 PM Your facts are totally 100% incorrect. Can you post where it is written that this lot is not a park or publically accessible open space? In addition to JS Ford's link, any one can go to the City Clerk's website http://www.chicityclerk.com/journals/2001/oct3/TOC_oct3_2001.pdf pages 68723 to 68739 and see where it is written relevant to information. it is common knowledge that the space is a publically accessible open space. "The park shall be open and accessible to the Public..."
It does not get any clear than that. So where do you get your facts again?
The document you reference is NOT reality - it is a PLANNING document. My facts are in all the public records detailing ownership of the site. I'm sure we all can find planning documents that detail all sorts of public amenities that never came to fruition and try to cry and whine their way into existence or somehow magically transfer ownership.
Again, local 'activist' with personal agendas:
This space is NOT publicly owned.
This space is NOT a park.
The public has NO RIGHT TO ACCESS.
Mr Downtown December 14th, 2010, 06:27 AM The document you reference is NOT reality - it is a PLANNING document. . . I'm sure we all can find planning documents that detail all sorts of public amenities that never came to fruition and try to cry and whine their way into existence or somehow magically transfer ownership.
Have to disagree with you there. This is not a mere community plan or statement of goals. It’s a zoning ordinance duly passed by the City Council on October 3, 2001. Let’s look at the actual ordinance language:
3. The requirements, obligations and conditions applicable within this planned development shall be binding upon the Applicant, its successors and assigns and. . . any homeowners association(s) formed to succeed the Applicant. . . .
4. This plan of development consists of these thirteen (13) statements . . .These and no other zoning controls shall apply to the area delineated herein.
5. The following uses shall be permitted within the areas delineated herein: multi-family dwelling units; accessory parking; ground floor residential uses; park uses, accessory uses and related uses. (Note that nonaccessory parking is not a permitted use.)
10. . . . The park shall be constructed at the time of first occupancy of the building. The park shall be open and accessible to the public during regular City of Chicago Park District hours.
Now, personally, I think it's a distasteful but acceptable tradeoff to get a nicely landscaped park with parking spaces instead of an empty lot with scruffy grass. But the ordinance is clear: the condo association must keep the lot open to the public during regular park hours and must maintain it as a "park."
Flacos December 14th, 2010, 10:27 AM The document you reference is NOT reality - it is a PLANNING document. My facts are in all the public records detailing ownership of the site. I'm sure we all can find planning documents that detail all sorts of public amenities that never came to fruition and try to cry and whine their way into existence or somehow magically transfer ownership.
Again, local 'activist' with personal agendas:
This space is NOT publicly owned.
This space is NOT a park.
The public has NO RIGHT TO ACCESS.
mr./ms. southloop arch, what are you talking about? planning documents? activist? the information referenced details explicit and specific zoning requirements & limitations for the park in discussion, from the project zoning ordinance, as mr downtown has so efficiently detailed. it equivocally refutes #2 and #3 of your claimed "facts", and places restrictions to #1 on your list. are you referring to some other 'magically' created public records that the rest of us are not aware of, because someone may be misinforming you.
also, i am not aware of or do not follow your claims of 'activists' or 'personal agendas' and their applicability to reasonable and thoughtful development & zoning discussion here. these imaginary claims do not appear to be germane to the conversation.
what is relative is potential impact to future development objectives, tactics, and precedents to achieve more density. it is a slippery slope when we let everyone re-write zoning ordinances after the fact for short term expediency or personal gain.
fulfilling the south loop development vision is a marathon, not a sprint.
slooparch December 14th, 2010, 05:17 PM Have to disagree with you there. This is not a mere community plan or statement of goals. It’s a zoning ordinance duly passed by the City Council on October 3, 2001. Let’s look at the actual ordinance language:
3. The requirements, obligations and conditions applicable within this planned development shall be binding upon the Applicant, its successors and assigns and. . . any homeowners association(s) formed to succeed the Applicant. . . .
4. This plan of development consists of these thirteen (13) statements . . .These and no other zoning controls shall apply to the area delineated herein.
5. The following uses shall be permitted within the areas delineated herein: multi-family dwelling units; accessory parking; ground floor residential uses; park uses, accessory uses and related uses. (Note that nonaccessory parking is not a permitted use.)
10. . . . The park shall be constructed at the time of first occupancy of the building. The park shall be open and accessible to the public during regular City of Chicago Park District hours.
Now, personally, I think it's a distasteful but acceptable tradeoff to get a nicely landscaped park with parking spaces instead of an empty lot with scruffy grass. But the ordinance is clear: the condo association must keep the lot open to the public during regular park hours and must maintain it as a "park."
The 'park' was never constructed, therefore the public has no right to access what is not there....
Mr Downtown December 14th, 2010, 09:02 PM ^The site is at ground level and is covered with grass. In your mind, what are the requirements for it to become a "park?"
Flacos December 15th, 2010, 02:53 AM The 'park' was never constructed, therefore the public has no right to access what is not there....
the J.S. Ford post link, and the ordinance information all seem to confirm a park site is currently built to original specifications, do they not? claims that "the park was never constructed" appear to be inaccurate. i am not following your rationale for communicating that the the "park was never constructed".
Mr Downtown December 16th, 2010, 12:30 AM McCormick Place officials will drop legal attempts to acquire a neighboring parcel for potential hotel development, officials said Wednesday.
Jim Reilly, the trustee overseeing the Metropolitan Pier and Exposition Authority, decided to end the agency's two-year effort to acquire the land through condemnation proceedings, citing the expenses associated with it, an MPEA spokeswoman said. The decision was announced at the authority’s monthly meeting Wednesday morning.
The condemnation proceedings targeted four properties close to the convention center, bounded by Indiana Avenue, Prairie Avenue, Cermak Road and Cullerton Street.
Crain's story (http://www.chicagobusiness.com/article/20101215/NEWS02/101219915/mcpier-gives-up-trying-to-buy-parcel-for-mccormick-place-hotel#ixzz18E4kretG)
Flacos December 16th, 2010, 07:04 AM McCormick Place officials will drop legal attempts to acquire a neighboring parcel for potential hotel development, officials said Wednesday.
Jim Reilly, the trustee overseeing the Metropolitan Pier and Exposition Authority, decided to end the agency's two-year effort to acquire the land through condemnation proceedings, citing the expenses associated with it, an MPEA spokeswoman said. The decision was announced at the authority’s monthly meeting Wednesday morning.
The condemnation proceedings targeted four properties close to the convention center, bounded by Indiana Avenue, Prairie Avenue, Cermak Road and Cullerton Street.
Crain's story (http://www.chicagobusiness.com/article/20101215/NEWS02/101219915/mcpier-gives-up-trying-to-buy-parcel-for-mccormick-place-hotel#ixzz18E4kretG)
this impacted potential projects like 230 east cermak proposal:
http://www.loopnet.com/Listing/15739235/230-East-Cermak-Rd-Chicago-IL/
not surprising for a few factors. first, the calumet & cermak TIF will likely be closed to capture TIF surplus. 2nd, state approval for McCormick to refinance for 2nd Hyatt above their garage, would likely negatively impact demand for similar facilities across the street in the highlighted are at this time.
3rd, if recent reported news that indicated that the principle owner of the property, Pam Gleichman, was having financing problems and would likely default, the state or city could get the property a lot cheaper on the open market. circle back to the lack of possible TIF $ availability, and the owners would have harder time getting any project off the ground at this time.
Prairie Avenue December 19th, 2010, 04:58 AM The 'park' was never constructed, therefore the public has no right to access what is not there....
This is simply not true. The rendering that was posted earlier in this thread shows the existing park. The fencing is the same. The trees/bushes shown are the existing ones. The park bench is existing. The changes in the rendering are the building of a parking lot within the existing parkland, the addition of a gate off of 16th and some minor upgrades in the current park -- some gravel paths and a fountain in the rendering. To say this is currently not a park is to disregard reality.
The real issue is whether the association can get their change through the legal process of taking land that was to be open and accessible to the public as a park and pave over it for the benefit of the landlord of the commercial space in their building. You are essentially taking public land and turning it into a commercial asset.
spyguy December 20th, 2010, 09:28 PM My post about the park (or whatever you want to call it) was just a throwaway comment. I'm (pleasantly) surprised that it generated this much activity since this thread is usually so quiet.
Anyway, the city is supposedly committing $10 million in TIF for a new field house in Ping Tom park. Images from the park's framework plans:
http://img227.imageshack.us/img227/6506/pingtomfh1.jpg
http://img20.imageshack.us/img20/4001/pingtomfh.jpg
Also saw this on Oasis Senior Living's website under "Future projects":
The Oasis of Chinatown
2428 S. Wallace Street, Chicago, IL
Lot description: Part of a 25,798 commercial and industrial site area
Building Area: 52,245 square feet
Plan: 7- story building, 97 apartment units (85 single occupancy and 12 double occupancy) totaling 116 beds.
Estimated 82 units reserved for Medicaid-eligible and 15 for private pay seniors
I think this may be the midrise portion of Eastern Tower. I thought it was originally going to be just condos but perhaps they've changed to senior housing.
http://img337.imageshack.us/img337/8482/270179.jpg
spyguy December 21st, 2010, 08:02 PM Roosevelt will build its student athletic center on the parking lot at the southeast corner of Wabash & Congress. The site is only the small surface lot on the corner, not the L-shaped garage.
http://img262.imageshack.us/img262/8503/rufw.jpg
Flacos December 21st, 2010, 11:05 PM Also saw this on Oasis Senior Living's website under "Future projects":
The Oasis of Chinatown
2428 S. Wallace Street, Chicago, IL
Lot description: Part of a 25,798 commercial and industrial site area
Building Area: 52,245 square feet
Plan: 7- story building, 97 apartment units (85 single occupancy and 12 double occupancy) totaling 116 beds.
Estimated 82 units reserved for Medicaid-eligible and 15 for private pay seniors
I think this may be the midrise portion of Eastern Tower. I thought it was originally going to be just condos but perhaps they've changed to senior housing.
http://img337.imageshack.us/img337/8482/270179.jpg
color me unimpressed with anything planned near chinatown; all the new development and construction seems poorly designed, uses the same quality lacking material, and is uninspiring (except possibly for the proposed clark & archer hotel), and incredibly tired looking after about 2 years.
for example the chinatown square does not appear all that inviting.
http://chicago.about.com/od/neighborhoodshistory/ig/Chinatown-Pictures/Chinatown-Signs.--AM.htm
many wonder why such a potentially prominent location so close to the loop gets such a free pass for design and development review. either go full authentic, or dump the concept and go full bore chicago architecture.
the irony is that the redeeming character of chinatown comes from is the original chicago style brick buildings on cermak, wentworth, etc.
paytonc December 21st, 2010, 11:43 PM color me unimpressed with anything planned near chinatown; all the new development and construction seems poorly designed, uses the same quality lacking material, and is uninspiring (except possibly for the proposed clark & archer hotel), and incredibly tired looking after about 2 years.
How about CASL's headquarters? Ping Tom Park's first phase? Archer Courts? They've won numerous architectural awards between them.
I'll grant that a lot gets done there on the cheap, with glossy interior materials trying to substitute for architectural quality -- but given how that's generally the rule in China, perhaps it carries over to Chinatown. I wish that the Chinatown Square parking lots could be infilled at some point so that Archer could become a proper retail street, but no -- since that's all LAZ parking, that'll never happen.
Flacos December 23rd, 2010, 05:42 PM How about CASL's headquarters? Ping Tom Park's first phase? Archer Courts? They've won numerous architectural awards between them.
I'll grant that a lot gets done there on the cheap, with glossy interior materials trying to substitute for architectural quality -- but given how that's generally the rule in China, perhaps it carries over to Chinatown. I wish that the Chinatown Square parking lots could be infilled at some point so that Archer could become a proper retail street, but no -- since that's all LAZ parking, that'll never happen.
Agree on the Archer idea and surface lots. the Cermak entrance, due to traffic design for the Dan Ryan might look nice in the car due to the Chinese archway, but it is not very people friendly. with the cermak underpass design, it is just not appealing or linking to the south loop.
with those issues, and in light of the truck crashing into the CTA cermak red-line entrance 2 years ago, perhaps a more pedestrian and visually oriented focus on the archer entrance back to clark (including the underpass). With a more prominent red-line entrance off of archer, it might be a more pedestrian pleasing entrance, and the red-line station would feel more integrated into the south loop for locals (who wouldn't have to walk through the disappearing panhandle scene and traffic on cermak).
spyguy December 23rd, 2010, 09:36 PM http://www.chicagojournal.com/News/12-22-2010/New_Jones_College_Prep_on_schedule_for_2013
New Jones College Prep on schedule for 2013
By MATTHEW BLAKE 12/22/2010 10:00 PM
Representatives from the mayor’s office and South Loop Ald. Robert Fioretti (2nd) proudly announced at a public meeting Dec. 14 that the construction of a new Jones College Prep High School, a selective enrollment school, should be completed by 2013.
...Carbonargi said that the city “is looking at all sorts of permutations for the current building,” which is located at 606 S. State St. One possibility is the conversion of the building into to a neighborhood school, though the city cannot “rule out” selling the property to a private developer.
---
I didn't know Perez was running for alderman. Now I almost want Fioretti to win.
spyguy January 5th, 2011, 10:51 PM Another possible proposal across from the Transportation Building
http://img403.imageshack.us/img403/4771/prg20elev.jpghttp://img821.imageshack.us/img821/980/prg2020view20from20chas.jpg
dvidler January 5th, 2011, 11:17 PM That looks like a perfect fit for that location. I hope any development there includes space for more restaurants or bars. Either way, I am glad someone is proposing something for that location. Do you know if this is a new proposal or a very old one?
Mr Downtown January 7th, 2011, 02:19 AM I'm glad to see a proposal, too, but this seems overly derivative of the Donohue Building. And there seems to be no retail; just blind windows for a parking floor.
Rather perversely, the logistics of parking have apparently been a stumbling block for that site. I'm told that it's almost impossible to lay out parking floors in any efficient way. Perhaps that's another reason this building seems to be so short in such a good location.
spyguy January 22nd, 2011, 12:26 AM East-West University is talking about building "soon" an 800,000 sq ft building, including 230 beds of dorm space, an athletic center, food court, etc. Presumably this would be at 9th & Wabash SEC. No other details yet.
IL Finance Authority approved issuing up to $35 million in bonds for this project. The architect has not yet been determined.
East-West University is requesting approval of a Final Bond Resolution in an amount not-to-
exceed $35,000,000. Bond proceeds will be used to (i) construct and equip a new, 14-story multi-
purpose building to be located in the 800 block of South Wabash Avenue (i.e., formerly the site of
building located at 825 and 831 South Wabash) in Chicago; (ii) renovate and equip East-West’s
existing buildings located at 816 South Michigan Avenue and 819 South Wabash Avenue in
Chicago; (iii) pay capitalized interest on certain portions of the project, if necessary or desirable;
and (iv) pay costs of issuance. The new multi-purpose building will include limited ground floor
parking, retail shops, a student athletic center/health club; a campus library; instructional labs,
classrooms, and faculty offices, and 10 floors of student housing including studio, one-bedroom,
and two-bedroom apartments with kitchen and bathroom that will house approximately 220
students.
• Basement – 29 Parking spaces
• 1st Floor – Lobby and Retail Shops mainly consisting of a food court serving both resident and nonresident
students. The food court will be visible and easily accessible from the street allowing its use also
by students from other institutions in the area and by the general public. It will include a collection of fastfood
restaurants with shared eating space.
• 2nd Floor – Student Activities Complex mainly consisting of an athletic center housing weight and
exercise room, lockers, pool table and table tennis, etc., and a large auditorium with a seating capacity of
500.
• 3rd Floor – Library and Learning Resource Center
• 4th Floor – Instructional labs and offices for ancillary services.
• 5th through 14th Floors – Student housing consisting of studios, one or two bedroom apartments with
full kitchen and bathroom, for approximately 220 students.
nicksplace27 January 22nd, 2011, 01:06 AM IL Finance Authority approved issuing up to $35 million in bonds for this project. The architect has not yet been determined.
East-West University is requesting approval of a Final Bond Resolution in an amount not-to-
exceed $35,000,000. Bond proceeds will be used to (i) construct and equip a new, 14-story multi-
purpose building to be located in the 800 block of South Wabash Avenue (i.e., formerly the site of
building located at 825 and 831 South Wabash) in Chicago; (ii) renovate and equip East-West’s
existing buildings located at 816 South Michigan Avenue and 819 South Wabash Avenue in
Chicago; (iii) pay capitalized interest on certain portions of the project, if necessary or desirable;
and (iv) pay costs of issuance. The new multi-purpose building will include limited ground floor
parking, retail shops, a student athletic center/health club; a campus library; instructional labs,
classrooms, and faculty offices, and 10 floors of student housing including studio, one-bedroom,
and two-bedroom apartments with kitchen and bathroom that will house approximately 220
students.
• Basement – 29 Parking spaces
• 1st Floor – Lobby and Retail Shops mainly consisting of a food court serving both resident and nonresident
students. The food court will be visible and easily accessible from the street allowing its use also
by students from other institutions in the area and by the general public. It will include a collection of fastfood
restaurants with shared eating space.
• 2nd Floor – Student Activities Complex mainly consisting of an athletic center housing weight and
exercise room, lockers, pool table and table tennis, etc., and a large auditorium with a seating capacity of
500.
• 3rd Floor – Library and Learning Resource Center
• 4th Floor – Instructional labs and offices for ancillary services.
• 5th through 14th Floors – Student housing consisting of studios, one or two bedroom apartments with
full kitchen and bathroom, for approximately 220 students.
South Loop Universities kick ass! First Roosevelt and now this? I hope this increases the profile of both of these institutions.
I really want DePaul to get in on the action and build some really awesome tower down here. We seem more interested in buying up older buildings; though we do it really well. 10 E Jackson (now the Richard J. Daley Building) looks awesome.
spyguy January 24th, 2011, 11:21 PM I really want DePaul to get in on the action and build some really awesome tower down here. We seem more interested in buying up older buildings; though we do it really well. 10 E Jackson (now the Richard J. Daley Building) looks awesome.
I think they're planning to renovate the Merle Reskin theater sometime in the near future. Then there were proposals to develop the lot at Wabash and Adams with a really tall tower and performance spaces (in conjunction with the CSO) at the base - I assume something like that will resurface when the time is right. And then they always have that lot on Wabash and Van Buren.
spyguy February 8th, 2011, 05:27 AM The first phase of D2's Curve project showed up on BidClerk - hopefully this is a signal that things are finally moving forward. Remember, the second phase is a condo/rental tower.
2011/01/30 The Curve - Phase I 60,000-square-foot retail building, $6 million 1000 S Clark St, Chicago, IL 60605, USA Cook
Aerial view of the site next to Target
http://img717.imageshack.us/img717/1998/39522101502764749553724.jpg
Hirsch Associates/ Facebook (http://www.facebook.com/album.php?fbid=10150276474915372&id=472644855371&aid=556177)
Also, an updated rendering of the new Jones College Prep
http://img703.imageshack.us/img703/6987/9416lg.jpg
PointDuSable February 8th, 2011, 08:46 PM Nice bit of infill with the Jones Prep building - the wall along Polk looks a bit pernicious, but not necessarily threatening. Any idea if this will replace the existing structure on Harrison, or will this serve as a complement to that structure/school?
Btw, long time lurker here, first time poster. Thanks for keeping this site (and these Chicago threads) active during the downturn, folks. Hope 2011 and onwards turns out to be better than the past two years.
Mr Downtown February 10th, 2011, 06:43 AM The fate of the current Jones HS structure is still very much undecided. The original scheme was to demolish the current building and sell the site for redevelopment, but I don't hear much about that these days. The old school might play some role in a scheme to let Jones serve kids from the South Loop while still remaining a selective-admission high school. Or it might help take some load off South Loop Elementary.
PrintersRowBoiler February 14th, 2011, 06:48 AM The fate of the current Jones HS structure is still very much undecided. The original scheme was to demolish the current building and sell the site for redevelopment, but I don't hear much about that these days. The old school might play some role in a scheme to let Jones serve kids from the South Loop while still remaining a selective-admission high school. Or it might help take some load off South Loop Elementary.
I wonder what Genita Robinson thinks? ;-) I can't see this being resolved anytime before the end of the current terms since Fioretti has flip-flopped on this topic so many times, despite his input is probably not going to be the deciding factor anyways.
untitledreality February 17th, 2011, 06:01 AM Also, an updated rendering of the new Jones College Prep
http://img703.imageshack.us/img703/6987/9416lg.jpg
I dont think the rendering will do the final product justice. Ralph Johnson does great work
ardecila February 18th, 2011, 04:47 AM The first phase of D2's Curve project showed up on BidClerk - hopefully this is a signal that things are finally moving forward. Remember, the second phase is a condo/rental tower.
2011/01/30 The Curve - Phase I 60,000-square-foot retail building, $6 million 1000 S Clark St, Chicago, IL 60605, USA Cook
So... this is basically a big-box store with caisson foundations.
Does anybody know when Roosevelt Collection will do the landscaping on their park? That was something they promised to the community.
Mr Downtown February 18th, 2011, 05:27 AM With Centrum desperately trying to sell the project, I wouldn't hold my breath. I don't really know what leverage the city has over an LLC that doesn't need anything.
spyguy March 1st, 2011, 12:14 AM http://www.chicagorealestatedaily.com/article/20110228/CRED03/110229880/south-loop-development-site-on-auction-block#axzz1FBVAzRCg
South Loop development site on auction block
By: Frank Kalman February 28, 2011
A South Loop development site is headed to the auction block as its owner tries to woo investors even as the neighborhood is still working to climb back from the recession and condo crash.
The parcel of more than five acres, which borders Roosevelt Road and the Chicago River near Roosevelt Collection, has 837 feet of river frontage and 216 feet along Roosevelt Road. It is zoned for 1,500 residential units and a half-million square feet of retail space.
i_am_hydrogen April 8th, 2011, 04:38 PM Jones Prep is now u/c:
http://www.sloopin.com/2011/04/construction-begins-for-new-jones.html
spyguy April 22nd, 2011, 07:00 PM Dearborn and Congress - retail and office
http://img851.imageshack.us/img851/5848/dearborn.jpg
msu2001la April 22nd, 2011, 07:59 PM New plans coming next week for the proposed park at 16th and Wabash:
http://www.chicagojournal.com/News/04-20-2011/New_plan_coming_for_Wabash_dog_park
http://media.chicagojournal.com/photos/Publication/Article/2190-1.jpg
Ordoseclorum April 22nd, 2011, 09:41 PM Awesome news about that little space by the Manhattan building getting used. The Manhattan looks amazing (from two sides.) This will really improve the streetscape and maybe make that landmark seem a little more whole.
Now if we can just fill in that parking lot a half block east. I expect once the Congress pedestrian improvements happen we'll see a boomlet around around Printer's row.
msu2001la May 11th, 2011, 12:07 AM A new rendering of the proposed park at 16th Street and Wabash, called Fred Anderson Park, shakes things up a bit. The new design shrinks the dog-dedicated portion of the park, much to the dismay of local dog owners, but adds several unique features.
In the new plan, a bridge goes over the middle of the park and the dog-friendly area. The stage space at the park has been significantly expanded from the last concept, as well, to go along with the idea of dedicating the park to South Loop jazz legend Fred Anderson.
http://media.chicagojournal.com/photos/Publication/Article/2225-1.jpg
http://www.chicagojournal.com/News/05-04-2011/Jazzy_new_park
BColeKid May 12th, 2011, 09:47 PM I am really excited about the park at 16th and Wabash as well as the small development next to the Manhattan. I don't necessarily understand the economics given the Taco Bell building across the street has been vacant for years, though granted the Taco Bell Building is a difficult space. But before Printer's Row around the Manhattan is improved, someone has to fix the light at Plymouth. Cars on Congress do not see it!
Mr Downtown May 17th, 2011, 11:59 PM Well, just because someone drew a picture doesn't mean the Manhattan lot will get developed.
I've been fighting CDOT on the Plymouth signal for years, and a mast-arm signal will be installed as part of the current streetscaping project.
i_am_hydrogen June 7th, 2011, 07:11 PM http://img262.imageshack.us/img262/8503/rufw.jpg
http://img202.imageshack.us/img202/6030/rooseveltuniv12a.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/202/rooseveltuniv12a.jpg/)
spyguy June 8th, 2011, 03:05 AM John Marshall Law School renovations (former Dollar Daze, etc. building)
http://img21.imageshack.us/img21/3779/rendering621x260.jpg
I think a few more signs will help avoid any confusion.
Mr Downtown June 13th, 2011, 05:32 PM Work has resumed on Jones HS.
spyguy June 24th, 2011, 08:21 PM http://www.suntimes.com/business/6139396-420/strategic-south-loop-parcel-sold-at-auction.html
Strategic South Loop parcel sold at auction
BY SANDRA GUY
A private capital fund has bought a strategically important five-acre South Loop parcel at auction from Jos. Cacciatore & Co. Real Estate for significantly more than the $8.4 million opening bid, the deal broker said Thursday.
The buyer of the 928 S. Wells site, who is not being identified, intends to quickly partner with a builder to develop the property, said Frank Diliberto, president of Diliberto Real Estate Services, which brokered the deal.
nomarandlee July 20th, 2011, 07:54 PM http://www.chicagotribune.com/business/breaking/chi-mccormick-place-moving-ahead-with-hotel-expansion-20110720,0,2966801.story
McCormick Place moving ahead with hotel expansion
By Kathy Bergen
Tribune staff reporter
10:39 a.m. CDT, July 20, 2011
McCormick Place officials are moving ahead with long-stalled plans to expand the convention center hotel. Another 461 rooms will be added to the Hyatt Regency McCormick Place, which currently has 800 rooms, with completion due in mid-2013.
Contracts CBG Hotel Design-Builders won the $86.9 million contract to design and build the second tower and to renovate the existing property............
...
Mr Downtown August 12th, 2011, 06:05 AM Columbia College is working on an interesting refacing project with Gensler for 618 S. Michigan, the old Spertus Institute building. The building was originally built in 1913 as the Arcade Building, but was refaced by IBM in 1958. The new curtain wall would be a contemporary glass system, but with a frit that suggests an image of the original façade. There are a lot of details to be worked out yet about the image, but Landmarks staff is pretty much on board.
http://i56.tinypic.com/1z6zeb9.jpg
http://i54.tinypic.com/rk0mzn.jpg
i_am_hydrogen August 12th, 2011, 07:36 PM Article on what may happen to the old Jones Prep site:
http://chicagojournal.com/News/08-10-2011/Park,_new_intersection_could_replace_old_Jones_College_Prep
untitledreality August 12th, 2011, 10:24 PM Columbia College is working on an interesting refacing project with Gensler for 618 S. Michigan, the old Spertus Institute building. The building was originally built in 1913 as the Arcade Building, but was refaced by IBM in 1958. The new curtain wall would be a contemporary glass system, but with a frit that suggests an image of the original façade. There are a lot of details to be worked out yet about the image, but Landmarks staff is pretty much on board.
http://i56.tinypic.com/1z6zeb9.jpg
http://i54.tinypic.com/rk0mzn.jpg
Way cool
Mr Downtown October 7th, 2011, 05:35 AM Looks like the Mariano's is a go for 16th & Clark. (http://chicagojournal.com/Blogs/Near-Loop-Wire/09-30-2011/Mariano%27s_moving_into_South_Loop)
Eco18 is officially dead. The site will become a new Goodyear service center. Site plan very similar to the new Firestone. The little building right on the corner that used to be a currency exchange is not part of the deal.
The Urban Politician October 7th, 2011, 07:45 PM Looks like the Mariano's is a go for 16th & Clark. (http://chicagojournal.com/Blogs/Near-Loop-Wire/09-30-2011/Mariano%27s_moving_into_South_Loop)
^ The final store will be a roughly 60,000-square-foot, one-story building, replete with a large produce section and a pharmacy. Parking for the store would be in a surface lot at street level, as well as on top of the building.
^ Way to fight for your neighborhood, Mr. D. A suburban-style grocery store with surface parking. Gee whiz, you guys sure have gotten desperate for development. What next, a drive thru Wendy's?
i_am_hydrogen October 8th, 2011, 05:26 AM ^Was that really necessary?
The Urban Politician October 8th, 2011, 07:41 PM ^Was that really necessary?
Probably a bit harsh, my apologies.
Either way, I can't imagine any reason why the city should still allow a business to have surface parking in the Central Area. Some reasonable exceptions are gas stations and auto repair shops.
The south loop just seems to be going in reverse compared to the rest of the downtown area, and naturally I blame the people at the helm..
Mr Downtown October 9th, 2011, 04:35 AM At the helm? Perhaps you have me confused with an alderman.
I'm always intrigued to read of this alternate universe where neighborhood groups actually have any influence over developers building as-of-right projects. As a board member of such a group, I've got one and only one weapon: If my neighbors are really upset about some proposed building, 60 of them might show up one night in a church basement to ask pointed questions of a developer and clap for people who agree with them. That's it. I try to leverage that one tactic into occasionally getting invited to meetings and "being consulted," but Chicago doesn't exactly have a culture of citizen involvement.
In this case, there hasn't even been a meeting yet. I haven't seen a site plan; know nothing other than what's in the Journal story. Ald. Dowell has already squeezed Roundy's pretty hard, wringing from them a signed lease for a Pershing & State store just to be allowed to advance this plan toward land transfer. The city is dying to sell the land for cash and take credit for creating 450 new jobs in the store.
Now suppose I did get invited to a meeting and asked my opinion. What argument should I take to DHED regarding a site fronting a high-speed arterial surrounded by surface parking for the police station, townhouses, and one-story industrial buildings? That Roundy's must wait to open a South Loop store until there's another highrise boom? If they wanted a store in a highrise, they could be open in Lexington Park by January. Or should I just explain that there's some fanboys on the Internet who always want a bigger erection?
urbanpln October 9th, 2011, 04:50 PM The site plan will change a little. It's still being reviewed.
urbanpln October 9th, 2011, 09:38 PM Probably a bit harsh, my apologies.
Either way, I can't imagine any reason why the city should still allow a business to have surface parking in the Central Area. Some reasonable exceptions are gas stations and auto repair shops.
The south loop just seems to be going in reverse compared to the rest of the downtown area, and naturally I blame the people at the helm..
I feel your pain man and share your view on this matter but, the truth is those new residents support and demand this type of development in the South Loop. They are people who are not accustom to mass transit living or, have moved to a different stage of life. Also because the South Loop was not built out, has many vacant lots and moderate demand, newcomers have a better chance of shaping the landscape.
I am only guessing but, residents in this market area (Printers Row to 26th Street/ east of the D. Ryan and Near West) are probably in their early 30's to mid 60's. They are probably moderately affluent (not Gold Coast rich) and, have young families. I also believe many who shop in the area come from as far south as Hyde Park, which mean they drive. The truth is, if you are a moderately affluent woman who has a young family, more than likely you own a nice car (probably a big SUV or luxury sedan). Retailers know this and are affective convincing decision makers to support them.
The City Planners do not like surface parking lots anywhere especially in the central area and, fight hard to fine decent alternatives. Usually there is a little compromise, maybe not enough but, change has been occurring slowly.
I've had developers from NYC to tell me that even in the outer boroughs (brooklyn, bronx, queens, etc.) surface parking is necessary to attract big box retailers.
Mr Downtown November 8th, 2011, 09:14 PM Crain's reports that Golub is the purchaser of the SEC Ninth & State, eventually planning a 35-story, 392-unit apartment tower there.
Story here. (http://www.chicagorealestatedaily.com/article/20111108/CRED03/111109769/golub-plans-south-loop-apartment-tower)
The Urban Politician November 8th, 2011, 09:34 PM ^ I'm concerned about the shadow this tower will cast over State St ;)
southloopscotty November 9th, 2011, 07:48 AM Crain's reports that Golub is the purchaser of the SEC Ninth & State, eventually planning a 35-story, 392-unit apartment tower there.
Story here. (http://www.chicagorealestatedaily.com/article/20111108/CRED03/111109769/golub-plans-south-loop-apartment-tower)
Excellent!
southloopscotty November 9th, 2011, 08:02 AM While I enjoy the updates this blog provides, I really hate the fact that any D-bag with a computer can make snarky comments. Does anyone else besides myself feel that if the owner of said blog was more discerning about who post on the blog (no anonymous post) it would make for better source of information? :bash:
Mr Downtown November 9th, 2011, 06:29 PM Very curious. Someone—not me, as you can easily tell from the spelling and word choice—is posting over at sloopin using the name Mr Downtown.
southloopscotty November 9th, 2011, 10:39 PM Very curious. Someone—not me, as you can easily tell from the spelling and word choice—is posting over at sloopin using the name Mr Downtown.
I wasn't sure if it was you, none the less, I defended your honor... :) (not that you needed it) Anyhow, I'm finding Sloopin to be denigrating...
Mr Downtown January 14th, 2012, 07:03 PM A few more details on the Amli and Golub projects:
Amli Lofts SWC Polk & Clark
Two 11-story buildings, containing a total of 398 units and 9000 sq ft retail. Rental loft-style units, though “loft-style” seems to be mostly a marketing phrase. The exterior is metal panels with no masonry and no real depth at the windows, though some articulation for balconies and other places. The buildings are set back an additional 7 feet from both Polk and Clark for potential sidewalk dining, but the retail will hold the corner. Two two-level parking decks with 280 spaces back next to the Metra tracks. The Avalon Bay PD would be vacated, although the street vacations/dedications would not be rescinded, and this project would be as-of-right under DX-7 zoning. Here’s a rough site plan as I remember it:
http://i39.tinypic.com/sytjdy.png
Golub highrise SEC 9th & State
Residential tower designed by SCB over four-story parking and amenity base as previously reported. Will have 392 units, 241 parking spaces, 9500 sq ft of retail. Units will be small (mostly studios and 1 BRs) with no balconies, and in a real throwback, the pool on the roof. Garage entry from Holden Court. The State Street podiums well be set back nine feet from the property line, but the tower will come to the line.
tprb52 January 26th, 2012, 03:45 PM So Mr. Downtown, Re: the SWC of Clark and Polk, Amli purchased the site? I was under the impression that Moran still had it listed...?
Thanks for the site layout.
TR
Mr Downtown January 26th, 2012, 09:42 PM I don't know if it's under option, under contract, or closed. But Amli is spending money on architects and plans for the site.
Mr Downtown February 1st, 2012, 05:29 AM http://i43.tinypic.com/6yo7io.jpg
Yes, that's corrugated metal in between "prefinished metal panels." The architect claims this design is "for the future." I think it's a leftover project from Seattle's Belltown. At any rate, it certainly doesn't belong to Chicago's South Loop.
http://i41.tinypic.com/34i24aq.jpg
Sorry for the photo quality; these were taken in a rather dark room.
ChiSkyline February 4th, 2012, 09:15 AM http://i43.tinypic.com/6yo7io.jpg
Yes, that's corrugated metal in between "prefinished metal panels." The architect claims this design is "for the future." I think it's a leftover project from Seattle's Belltown. At any rate, it certainly doesn't belong to Chicago's South Loop.
http://i41.tinypic.com/34i24aq.jpg
Sorry for the photo quality; these were taken in a rather dark room.
So has constuction start or are they finished?
Reaperducer March 2nd, 2012, 12:07 AM So has constuction start or are they finished?
Construction hasn't started, but the plan is a go. According to the Chicago Architecture Blog, the project is self-financed, so it'll happen no matter what the banks think.
I've heard groundbreaking late this summer/fall, with completion in 18 months.
Here's CAB's article about it: Bad Economy Good for South Loop Developer (http://blog.chicagoarchitecture.info/2012/02/28/bad-economy-good-for-south-loop-developer/)
ChiSkyline March 6th, 2012, 06:02 PM Construction hasn't started, but the plan is a go. According to the Chicago Architecture Blog, the project is self-financed, so it'll happen no matter what the banks think.
I've heard groundbreaking late this summer/fall, with completion in 18 months.
Here's CAB's article about it: Bad Economy Good for South Loop Developer (http://blog.chicagoarchitecture.info/2012/02/28/bad-economy-good-for-south-loop-developer/)
Thats awesome I think its beautiful. So i would love for this to happen. Thanks Alot
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