Stadium plans and rumours in the uk thread

[2005]

This thread will simply look at current stadium plans and also say some tasty rumours. I'll post what I know and what I've heard and then you'll do the same.

Rumours
Tottenham - Spurs chairman Daniel Levy hopes to buy the rest of the land behind the Paxton Road Stand. Word is it will be used to build a new 60,000 seater stadium or spurs will redevelop WHL and build a Casino, Restuarants, shops, hotels on the land behind the paxton.

http://img129.imageshack.us/img129/2185/1111111111whllv5.th.gif (http://img129.imageshack.us/my.php?image=1111111111whllv5.gif)

Also it's been rumoured that Tottenham have found a site in Northumberland Park, about a mile away.

West Ham - Plan to move. Olympic park has been ruled out

Chelsea are to buy Earls Court and build a stadium with 60,000 seats.

Manchester United - Recently it has been said that United want to take the capacity up to 90,000 at Old Trafford.

Plans
Charlton Athletic plan to take the capacity up to 40,000 at The Valley. Plans have been hamperd by the club's performances on the pitch. If the club get relegated then there will be no doubt that the plans will be put on ice.

http://www.cafc.co.uk/uploads/charlton29566news1.jpg

Chesterfield - The club have plans to build a stadium at Whittington Moor. The capacity will be 10,500.

http://www.chesterfield-fc.premiumtv.co.uk/page/GroundPlans/0,,10435,00.html

Liverpool - Looks like their plans for a new stadium next door will come true. 60,000 seater stadium.

http://www.liverpoolfc.ch/liverpool/specials/new_stadium/photos/NewStadium_02_400x211.jpg

http://www.liverpoolfc.tv/newstadium/images/3big.jpg

Look foreward to reading what you know :cheers:

[DarJoLe]

A new West Ham stadium is being proposed for a site to the south-west of the Tube station, on LDA owned land currently occupied by a Parcelforce depot. The site is to the south of the proposed West Ham super-mosque and will include new housing and amenities.

[Mo Rush]

london might only be getting a "half roof" olympic stadium lol

[Ciudad Bristol]

Now the Irish national sides have moved to Croke Park, the new Lansdowne Road (50,000 seats) starts construction soon for completion in 2009.

http://www.lrsdc.ie/gallery/thumbnail.aspx?img=EXTERIOR 1200 x 712.jpg&w=355&h=238

http://www.lrsdc.ie/gallery/thumbnail.aspx?img=INT_RUGB 1200 x 872.jpg&w=355&h=238

Bristol Rovers 18,500 seat stadium for the existing site:
Old design I think
http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/images/40932000/jpg/_40932052_203_mem1.jpg

Plus Everton's plans for a new 55,000 stadium in Kirkby have been announced.

[majormystery]

The Olympic stadium could now be used by Leyton Orient after the games. They don't mind the running track being retained and the reduced capacity of the stadium will suit their needs.

[Ciudad Bristol]

I think their current stadium is adequate for their needs once the north side stand is completed. It is unique as well, with residential blocks on all four corners.

[2005]

Now the Irish national sides have moved to Croke Park, the new Lansdowne Road (50,000 seats) starts construction soon for completion in 2009.

http://www.lrsdc.ie/gallery/thumbnail.aspx?img=EXTERIOR 1200 x 712.jpg&w=355&h=238

http://www.lrsdc.ie/gallery/thumbnail.aspx?img=INT_RUGB 1200 x 872.jpg&w=355&h=238

Bristol Rovers 18,500 seat stadium for the existing site:
Old design I think
http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/images/40932000/jpg/_40932052_203_mem1.jpg

Plus Everton's plans for a new 55,000 stadium in Kirkby have been announced.

Since when and also did they release any artists impressions?

[Gherkin]

I love rumours :) I am a good rumour monger myself, but all my rumours have been posted already by the previous posts! :(

[andysimo123]

Breaking News


Manchester City have plans to build a 100,000 seater Stadium because they are a massive club.

:nuts:

[cinosanap]

I hardly think 100,000 seats will be enough to hold all the glory hunters. ;)

Cowdenbeath are to build a new stadium within two years and so are Ayr United. :lol: I'm sure you all wanted to know that...

[andysimo123]

huh :dunno:

[Chrisyd]

Deepdale, Preston should have the 4th side redeveloped and have a capacity of 30,000. (Two ends hold 6,000 each and Tom Finney stand holds 8,100).

Sheffield Utd are going to rebuild the Kop end (currently has pillars in) and increase the capacity by a further 4,000 in the process bringing this up to 36,000.

Madjeski stadium, Reading, planning permission has been applied for (22-01-07) to increase the capacity to over 34,000 - The stadium was built in such a way to make this relatively simple.
http://www.readingfc.premiumtv.co.uk/javaImages/a0/fe/0,,10306~3014304,00.jpg

Vicarage Road (Watford), the East Stand - current mis-mash of stands - to be replaced with a 4,500 single tier stand, total capacity 23,000.

Villa Park (Aston Villa) they have planning permission to fill in the corners at either end of the North Stand and thus increase capacity to 51,000

Fratton Park (Portsmouth) are due to rotate the pitch through 90 degrees and rebuild to an initial capacity of approx 30,000 which could be easily increased, unsure why this has not actually started (maybe change of ownership).

Stadium of Light (Sunderland) already has planning permission to add a second tier to the South Stand, although no time table has given as to when this will occur. Total capacity 55,000

[Scarecrow]

Plus Everton's plans for a new 55,000 stadium in Kirkby have been announced.

Since when and also did they release any artists impressions?

Recently. No artists impressions yet. An outline proposal has been presented to Knoiwsley Borough Council, in partnership with Tesco. :)

http://www.evertonfc.com/news/archive/initial-kirkby-proposals-submitted-to-knowsley.html

No mention of capacity. The 55,000 suggested is probably based on the Kings Dock stadium, and is a bit on the small side. 10 years ago, former chairman Peter Johnson proposed a 65,000 seat stadium in Kirkby. Around 60,000 with room for expansion would probably seem the safest bet, seeing as it's going to be bankrolled by Tesco anyway. :)

[Gherkin]

Liverpool will begin construction on a 61,000 seater stadium (2nd biggest in Prem league) asap. It isn't at all likely it will be named 'New Anfield', but will be named after a sponsoring company. 'Coca-Cola stadium' for instance. :)

[jrb]

Breaking News


Manchester City have plans to build a 100,000 seater Stadium because they are a massive club.

:nuts:

obsessed :lol:

[jrb]

New stadium for Salfords City Reds.

The original Red Devils. Long before Stretford nicked it.(Andy) ;)


http://www.reds.co.uk/images/frontpage_photos/rotator_web.gif

http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?p=11711023#post11711023

[andysimo123]

obsessed :lol:


Totally going strong for 31 years and many many more years to come.

[johnnypd]

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v293/throwaway/gallowgate.jpg

what St. James Park would look like if the Gallowgate was extended. would only happen if we were back in the Champion's League though, and that looks very unlikely. Shepherd has talked about it in the past but no concrete plans in place.

[vertigosufferer]

The Liverpool Stadium render, looks like Arsenal's Emirates Stadium.

[El Paulo]

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v293/throwaway/gallowgate.jpg

what St. James Park would look like if the Gallowgate was extended. would only happen if we were back in the Champion's League though, and that looks very unlikely. Shepherd has talked about it in the past but no concrete plans in place.

Blud yell! What would the capacity of that bugger be?

[2005]

I've hear that the Capacity of St. James would be 65,000. Very impressive considering what they've won the past 52 years. Just shows how much the club is community and they stay loyal :applause:

It been said, lately, that Chelsea have a design for a state-of-the-art stadium. The capacity is said to be 55,000 and they're now finding a site. The one they want the most is Earls Court.

[majormystery]

Blud yell! What would the capacity of that bugger be?

And what would it be if it formed all 4 sides?

[johnnypd]

And what would it be if it formed all 4 sides?

dunno, but that is impossible due to the grade 1 listed buildings next door. anyway we couldn't fill a stadium that big, i think we'd only fill 65,000 if we were more successful or tickets were cheaper.

[Gherkin]

And what would it be if it formed all 4 sides?

I've heard the 80,000+ mark being thrown around on these forums, and there was a photoshop render some years ago with all the 4 stands and corners the same size. I've looked but cannot find anything.

[cooperman]

The Everton board have been using Cologne's new stadium as the basis of their investigations into the new ground. It's very likely that when built it will resemble something like this...

http://static.flickr.com/79/249866861_08e7311849.jpg
http://www.abc.net.au/reslib/200604/r83281_242737.jpg

[Mo Rush]

The Everton board have been using Cologne's new stadium as the basis of their investigations into the new ground. It's very likely that when built it will resemble something like this...

http://static.flickr.com/79/249866861_08e7311849.jpg
http://www.abc.net.au/reslib/200604/r83281_242737.jpg

do you have a google earth image of the site of the new stadium?

[2005]

About a month ago this was posted on a Spurs forum. Make interesting reading.

"Not really sure where to post this but i some information that will come as a pleasant surprise to many. I have it on very good authority that Daniel Levy has almost completed a deal for the purchase of an industrial estate behind Paxton Rd. A printing firm on this estate is refusing to sell, but he hopes to wrap up a deal shortly. What relevance does this have on the club I hear you ask. Well, the plan is to rotate white hart lane on to this land and create one of the largest stadiums in the country."

[antigr12]

The Everton board have been using Cologne's new stadium as the basis of their investigations into the new ground. It's very likely that when built it will resemble something like this...

http://static.flickr.com/79/249866861_08e7311849.jpg
http://www.abc.net.au/reslib/200604/r83281_242737.jpg



they can do far better and sophisticated than that this somewhat cheap looking stadium ( mainly exterior ) with the money they'll spend on the project .

[Scarecrow]

Also in terms of capacity, Cologne is much too small. They'll probably be thinking along the lines of a relatively low cost/seat ratio and room for expansion into corners and third tiers, something that designs like Emirates and New Unfilled will struggle with if capacity is reached regularly.

Here's the site in Kirkby. The town centre is the bit to the north.
http://img257.imageshack.us/img257/2928/efckirkbybe9.jpg

And here is the site in the great scheme of things. Both Goodison and Kirkby have been painted blue.

http://img144.imageshack.us/img144/2709/efckirkby2ld2.jpg

And here's a pic my missus painted of John Terry that I've just discovered on my computer. :D
http://img144.imageshack.us/img144/8141/2501062347rq3.jpg

[Mo Rush]

they can do far better and sophisticated than that this somewhat cheap looking stadium ( mainly exterior ) with the money they'll spend on the project .

Cologne stadium is an excellent stadium with an excellent design. The stadium is certainly not cheap looking.

[Agent Vengence]

And here's a pic my missus painted of John Terry that I've just discovered on my computer. :D
http://img144.imageshack.us/img144/8141/2501062347rq3.jpg

WOW!! thats a painting? that is brilliant piece of work.

Swindon Town have been attempting to get a new stadium for years now, the saga has resulted in many ups and downs (mostly downs), but if any proper progress is made then i will post it.

[Gherkin]

And what would it be if it formed all 4 sides?

Found it:

http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y281/gherkin007/WC2018/sjp2010.jpg

:D

[Borras_Hwfa]

Not on the same scale, I know, but these plans have not long been released to redevelop part of The Racecourse Ground, Wrexham. Most football fans will know we have been up poo valley with out a short oar since we fell into the age old trap of:-

1. property developer buys club
2. property developer sells ground to another company he's involved with for nominal fee
3. property developer tries to evict club from ground so he can create his 'exciting retail opportunity'

culminating in administration, getting docked 10 points, relegation, lenghty legal battle to wrestle back ground, exodus of star players for no money etc etc leaving us currently teatering on the edge of relegation to the Football Conference.

The plan is to redevelop one end of the ground, freeing up land to build executive apartments, retail outlets, a hotel, leisure facilities and all the other crap that seems to fill any spare space in a built up area these days. A few quid for the club, a few for the developers, everyone's a winner.

What they are going to do is get rid of the current terracing, flatten the massive bank it stands on, build a compact stand, and put the access road behind it. That will free up all the land between this access road and the railway line to develop. Currently on this site is the local Vauxhall dealership, Dickens. This will be moved to an out-of-town site, which I think is currently under construction. Incidently, the consortium that has "rescued" the club from administration is headed by one Neville Dickens.

This is how it currently looks

http://www.red-passion.com/images11/racecourseessentials.jpg

http://lluniau.simonjones.org/ssc/racecourse_key.jpg

The new access road will approximately follow the line where the green and blue areas meet. I'm sure somebody told me that the current road, Crispin Lane, which is up the right hand side of the blue area, will be cut off. There will also be some development on the current car park area in the top right of the red area.

Here are some early proposals.

http://lluniau.simonjones.org/ssc/racecourse_01.jpg

http://lluniau.simonjones.org/ssc/racecourse_02.jpg

Kop at the moment:-
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v317/pietjebel/F2006/WrexhamD.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v317/pietjebel/F2004/Wrexham9.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v317/pietjebel/F2006/WrexhamA.jpg

Current view from the Kop
http://dspace.dial.pipex.com/town/park/yfh45/wrexham3.jpg

The new stand will merge into one which is replacing this one
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v317/pietjebel/F2004/Wrexham12.jpg

Proposals for the new stands.

http://lluniau.simonjones.org/ssc/racecourse_03.jpg

http://lluniau.simonjones.org/ssc/racecourse_04.jpg

http://lluniau.simonjones.org/ssc/racecourse_05.jpg

http://lluniau.simonjones.org/ssc/racecourse_06.jpg

[romablue]

The Everton board have been using Cologne's new stadium as the basis of their investigations into the new ground. It's very likely that when built it will resemble something like this...

http://static.flickr.com/79/249866861_08e7311849.jpg
http://www.abc.net.au/reslib/200604/r83281_242737.jpg


Is it true that Everton intend to place Prince Rupert towers (their logo) in the four corners?

[romablue]

Not on the same scale, I know, but these plans have not long been released to redevelop part of The Racecourse Ground, Wrexham. Most football fans will know we have been up poo valley with out a short oar since we fell into the age old trap of:-

1. property developer buys club
2. property developer sells ground to another company he's involved with for nominal fee
3. property developer tries to evict club from ground so he can create his 'exciting retail opportunity'

culminating in administration, getting docked 10 points, relegation, lenghty legal battle to wrestle back ground, exodus of star players for no money etc etc leaving us currently teatering on the edge of relegation to the Football Conference.

The plan is to redevelop one end of the ground, freeing up land to build executive apartments, retail outlets, a hotel, leisure facilities and all the other crap that seems to fill any spare space in a built up area these days. A few quid for the club, a few for the developers, everyone's a winner.

What they are going to do is get rid of the current terracing, flatten the massive bank it stands on, build a compact stand, and put the access road behind it. That will free up all the land between this access road and the railway line to develop. Currently on this site is the local Vauxhall dealership, Dickens. This will be moved to an out-of-town site, which I think is currently under construction. Incidently, the consortium that has "rescued" the club from administration is headed by one Neville Dickens.

This is how it currently looks

http://www.red-passion.com/images11/racecourseessentials.jpg

http://lluniau.simonjones.org/ssc/racecourse_key.jpg

The new access road will approximately follow the line where the green and blue areas meet. I'm sure somebody told me that the current road, Crispin Lane, which is up the right hand side of the blue area, will be cut off. There will also be some development on the current car park area in the top right of the red area.

Here are some early proposals.


Borras, what would the capacity be at the Racecourse if Wrexham perform these developments?

[Borras_Hwfa]

Borras, what would the capacity be at the Racecourse if Wrexham perform these developments?

I've heard it's going to be somewhere around the 15,000 mark (current capacity is 15,500). Best ground in the Conference by a mile!

[romablue]

I've heard it's going to be somewhere around the 15,000 mark (current capacity is 15,500). Best ground in the Conference by a mile!


Thanks :)

Not a bad capacity, though I remember in the old days Wrexham used to get a lot of the full international games. Today 15k is only good for U21 level.

[Borras_Hwfa]

Thanks :)

Not a bad capacity, though I remember in the old days Wrexham used to get a lot of the full international games. Today 15k is only good for U21 level.

So do I! Happy days indeed. But that was when the FAW was still based in Wrexham. It's all down Cardiff these days, so I don't get to watch Wales much any more. They rarely get about 15,000 down there anyway. Too busy hugging peanuts I reckon!

We get the odd international, Liverpool reserves, TNS's European games and Welsh Cup Final, but I reckon it's still far too big. Something like Chester have got would do us.

[vertigosufferer]

Found it:

http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y281/gherkin007/WC2018/sjp2010.jpg

:D

Wow St James lookin' good. San Siro eat your heart out.

[cinosanap]

What are you talking about? Apart from capacity, that is crap.
Nothin exiting about it. Looks like a carpark from the outside!

[Gherkin]

What are you talking about? Apart from capacity, that is crap.
Nothin exiting about it. Looks like a carpark from the outside!

St. James Park is more impressive than beautiful. It's location on the hill and huge stands inside the stadium make it seem like a big stadiumic monster! If you're in Newcastle, go have a look! I agree it would be much better looking if it were symmetrical, meaning at least 3 stands would have be the same size...

]http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v293/throwaway/gallowgate.jpg

...but ideally all four :D

http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y281/gherkin007/WC2018/sjp2010.jpg

[WeasteDevil]

Wow St James lookin' good. San Siro eat your heart out.

Would be a bit stupid, they would never fill it.

[WeasteDevil]

What are you talking about? Apart from capacity, that is crap.
Nothin exiting about it. Looks like a carpark from the outside!

The prime purpose of a stadium is not what it looks like from the outside, or even what it looks like from the inside, that's not the point is it? Would you be happy if they spent millions cladding it in glass and making it all shiny like?

[WeasteDevil]

Lancashire County Cricket Club has paved the way for an exceptional, leading edge, sports-led regeneration scheme which is set to safeguard the future of cricket at Old Trafford.

In the 150th anniversary year of Old Trafford, the Club has passed a major milestone in its redevelopment plans by signing a significant collaboration agreement with partners Trafford Borough Council, Ask Developments and Tesco.

The cricket ground will form the lynchpin of an anticipated 750,000 sq ft development which will have at its heart a new 25,000-seater stadium on its historic site, with new stands, conferencing and banqueting facilities and hotel, and education, training and other sports opportunities for the local community.

Various options for development are now being considered. The development partners are considering a mixed-use scheme of significant quality with business space, residential, retail, hotel, leisure and other supporting development with a potential end value of £190m. More than 2,000 new jobs could be created by the development.

Options for the best possible design and layout of the site for the retail and other elements are to be identified in a new masterplan for the overall site, but it will be fundamentally a highly sustainable development, embracing Metrolink and the prime driver being the anchoring of a new Test Venue as its centrepiece.

Lancashire CCC Chief Executive Jim Cumbes said, "the Old Trafford brand has a massive standing in world cricket. The club has been on the same site since 1857. Our membership and cricket lovers everywhere recognise the contribution that the club makes locally to the economy through visitor attraction, image, marketing and employment in the Borough.

“Together with our local partners, the North West Development Agency and Sport England, we will work towards delivering a scheme which will have at its heart a new stadium fit for the next 150 years, and which will be recognised as world-class standard, fit for the UK’s greatest sporting city region and serving the huge cricketing hotbed in the north west.

“I am delighted that a Partnership of this calibre can now work up the solution to fund this major international sporting initiative and deliver huge economic benefits for the region. Together we make a formidable team and can harness all our capabilities to realise the full potential of the site for our membership, residents, the wider community and visitors.“

Leader of Trafford Borough Council Susan Williams said, "we welcome the signing of this collaboration agreement as a major step forward in securing the future of world class cricket in the Borough and look forward to working with our partners over the coming months to bring the scheme to fruition”.

For Tesco, Tony Fletcher, Property Communications Manager North West, said, "Tesco are very pleased to have this opportunity, in conjunction with our other partners, to use our combined expertise to identify the best possible options for this exciting development, from both a regeneration and a sporting perspective."

The partners will be reviewing all of the development options available over the next 6-12 months with a view to identifying the preferred development scheme early in 2008. Detailed discussions with both the North West Development Agency and Sport England, both of whom have expressed an ongoing desire to support this important regional and nationally significant sporting and regeneration initiative are ongoing.

[*England*]

http://www.toffeeweb.com/images/club/kings-dock/new-stadium_1.jpg

are they not going with this at everton now then?

[Scarecrow]

No. They're building the Liverpool Arena & Conference Centre there instead:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v421/Martin_S/DevelopmentSummary/kingsdockaerial0406.jpg

http://img206.imageshack.us/img206/522/imgp3089rf7.jpg

http://img66.imageshack.us/img66/2479/imgp2828vl2.jpg

http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=357202&page=18

[2005]

http://www.toffeeweb.com/images/club/kings-dock/new-stadium_1.jpg

are they not going with this at everton now then?

I think they pulled out out of it because of financial reasons. I never once saw an interior render of that stadium.

[Lostboy]

Would be a bit stupid, they would never fill it.

I think they would. Newcastle until this season had the second highest after Man United, sell out crowds in the Premiership.

[StiffUpper]

Is it true that Everton intend to place Prince Rupert towers (their logo) in the four corners?

That would be ripping off West Ham, we've got 2 enormous MDF towers on the outside one of our stand.

Hope Everton do build something a bit like the Cologne stadium, I don't much like the bowl style of most modern grounds.

Give me a rectangular ground with assymetrical stands any day.

And bring terracing and drop the word 'Stadium'.

Where's my pipe and slippers?

[Scarecrow]

Or ripping off their own club shop.
http://s23.photobucket.com/albums/b389/andalucia_/Everton-FC/th_ee1.jpg

[Noostairz]

SPURS EYE WEMBLEY WAY (http://www.sundaymirror.co.uk/sport/football/tm_headline=spurs-eye-wembley-way%26method=full%26objectid=18639130%26siteid=62484-name_page.html)
Exclusive by Steve Stammmers

TOTTENHAM could make Wembley their new home for two years if the club decide to completely rebuild White Hart Lane.

That is one of the options being considered by chairman Daniel Levy and his board as they attempt to boost the image and the income of the club.

Levy and his team have made a thorough logistical survey on how to expand the capacity at White Hart Lane and are aware that the vast majority of Spurs fans want to stay close to the stadium which has been their home since 1899.

They looked at relocation outside the borough of Haringey but there were numerous obstacles to overcome.

On one potential site, for instance, Levy discovered that he would have to deal with EIGHTY different owners. The preference is to stay at White Hart Lane, and redeveloping the stadium from scratch has also been put forward as a possibility.

Indeed, there have been inquiries made about the cost of buying properties close to the existing ground so that the club could demolish the present stadium and in its place build a 55,000-capacity new one which would offer the best in corporate facilities and generate the kind of income that Arsenal are reaping from the £350million Emirates project at Ashburton Grove.

No planning applications have yet been submitted to Haringey council and Tottenham would need to satisfy the borough that it would be of immense benefit to keep the club at its present location.

If the ambitious plan is given the green light Tottenham would need a temporary base while the stadium is built over, probably, two years.

The most logical solution would be to share with Arsenal at The Emirates but Levy is well aware that the idea would be greeted with mass disapproval from both sets of fans.

That is why the new Wembley stadium could enter the equation.

Wembley's owners have made it clear they have had no talks with any club about using the new ground but Tottenham look certain to make an approach should they choose to knock down White Hart Lane.

Many hurdles would still have to be overcome should Tottenham decide to go down that route - notably the public transport infrastructure as well as having to cope with the increase in the number of private cars that would be generated by a stadium with a capacity some 20,000 more than the present 36,000.

But Levy is determined that Tottenham should progress off the field as well as on it.

He is involved in a battle to establish a new training centre and academy close to the A10- M25 junction at Middleton House and he also wants a stadium which would reflect the ambitions of the club.

[victor ebuwa]

Would be a bit stupid, they would never fill it.

You never can tell. Look at Man U 17 years or so ago. 48,000 capacity stadium with an average crowd of 40,000. Now they are talking about extending it to 100,000!

If you said to someone at Man U in '92 that they'd be playing to full houses (for league games anyway) week in week out in 2007, they'd have laughed, if you'd have said they'd be doing so in a 75,000 seater stadium they'd have had you committed!

Of course it depends on on-field success. If Newcastle were guaranteed a CL seeding each season, like Man U, and were regularly in the top 3, then they could fill it no problem. Conversely, if Man U were to go 25 years (let alone 50 odd) without winning the league again, their average gate would drop back down to the 40k mark.

[cardiff]

has anyone mentioned the new stadium in Cardiff? 30,000 - giving another stadium to the Cardiff skyline :)

[jimbo]

St. James Park is more impressive than beautiful. It's location on the hill and huge stands inside the stadium make it seem like a big stadiumic monster! If you're in Newcastle, go have a look! I agree it would be much better looking if it were symmetrical, meaning at least 3 stands would have be the same size...

]http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v293/throwaway/gallowgate.jpg

...but ideally all four :D

http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y281/gherkin007/WC2018/sjp2010.jpg

I thought the reason they couldn't do that was because Leazes Terrace was listed, or at least protected (its the road backing on the little stand). It was when I was at university in Newcastle, but I can't imagine the Geordies would be that chuffed that students were preventing St James from being completed right round. Can't imagine they could fill 80,000.

[spud]

they could do the first pic..but can't do the second..as you say,that terrace is listed......


it's a shame though cos a fully bowled st james park would be a sight to behold imo..

[TheFly]

You never can tell. Look at Man U 15 years or so ago. 48,000 seater stadium with an average crowd of 40,000. Now they are talking about extending it to 100,000!

If you said to someone at Man U in '94 that they'd be playing to full houses (for league games anyway) week in week out in 2007, they'd have laughed, if you'd have said they'd be doing so in a 75,000 seater stadium they'd have had you committed!

Of course it depends on on-field success. If Newcastle were guaranteed a CL seeding each season, like Man U, and were regularly in the top 3, then they could fill it no problem. Conversely, if Man U were to go 25 years (let alone 50 odd) without winning the league again, their average gate would drop back down to the 40k mark.

Another great qoute from Victor!

in 1994 Victor, United were on the way to the double, with what most people consider Fergies best side. The ground was full.

It has been common knowledge that united were/are getting 10-12,000 applications per league game they cannot supply. That is without people bothering to apply because they think they will not get a ticket.

United are currently the best supported team in Europe.

Bar (ask the Liverpool fans) about 2/3 seasons we have had the highest attendances in English football for the last 50years.

Go away Victor. Explain your constant attacks on all things Manchester.

Your posts are everywhere containing dumb statements with not a scintilla of facts.

[Isaac Newell]

Manchester United Have never had a 48,000 seat stadium.

[Chrisyd]

Perhaps if he had of said 1987-88 when the average attendance was 39,152 or a season later when it was 36,474. In 87-88 the best attendance was 50,000 in the cup against Chelsea, a season later 55,000 saw a match against Notts Forest in the cup.

I am not certain, but I am convinced there was no redevelopment at this time (Stretford end went all Seater in the first year of the Premier League - I think). Therefore Old Trafford was not sold out every week, it was very popular but not sold out. Then again, nowhere else was either.

Interestingly Newcastle where in the top flight (not selling out) and averaging crowds of 22,000 (ish in those two seasons). Only 16,000 less in the crowd than Manchester United now it is about 26,000 less.

I think that is enough random statistics ripped from various websites!!!

http://www.european-football-statistics.co.uk/attn.htm
http://www.stretfordend.co.uk/seasonmenu.html

[cinosanap]

The prime purpose of a stadium is not what it looks like from the outside, or even what it looks like from the inside, that's not the point is it? Would you be happy if they spent millions cladding it in glass and making it all shiny like?


The guy said it looked good, I was only stating what I thought. No need to cry.

It would obviously look better clad in glass but that was obviously meant to be an insult which failed miserably.

[romablue]

I think when talking about crowd figures from the early 90s one should consider that most stadiums at the time where not as friendly as stadiums are today. Hooliganism was more noticeable and many families didn't attend games. The rise in crowds is also due to improvements in selling the product. Clubs which have invested in new grounds have generally seen gates rise, though for this to be sustained they also need success on the pitch.

[victor ebuwa]

I meant 1992. You won the league in 93 to sell out crowds of 30k (down to redevelopment) and have been sold out ever since.

You have been the best supported English club for nearly all time, but before you won the league in 93, you were averaging around 40,000. You played Forest on Easter Monday in 92, a win would have all but secured the league title, it was full (the only sell out that season), and the attendance was 48,000. The capacity of OT in 92 was 48k, whatever Isaac Newell says.

I'm not attacking Manchester, no more than the man attacked Newcastle. I'm just pointing out a few facts, that's right, FACTS, that show Man Utd's size is dependent on on field success.

You may think Man U have always been a super club, but you'd be wrong, pointing this out isn't an attack on Manchester any more than pointing out that BBC journalists are up in arms over the move to Manc because they consider it (rightly so) a backward step in their career.

Jesus, if someone isn't constantly gushing over Manchester they must have a anti Manchester agenda mustn't they?

The reality is, Mancs' opinion of Manchester and Man Utd is so inflated its untrue and they can't bear to be brought down to earth so the conspiracies start.

No other group on this forum, or any similar forum, behave in the same way. Get a fucking grip.

If Newcastle were as successful as you, they'd sell out a larger stadium, if you were as unsuccessful as them, you wouldn't need such a big stadium.

The fact is you only needed this extra capacity AFTER you started winning the league and guaranteeing yourself CL places and CL money to buy CL calibre players. Deal with it for fucks sake, its not the end of the world.

40,000 was a good average in the early 90's, it was a little bit higher than 'pool, but you did have the larger ground so ...

[TheFly]

1992 Attendances after not winning the league for 26 years Victor:

1 Manchester United 45.382
2 Liverpool 35.085
3 Arsenal 31.886

Newcastle were in the 1st division and had 21,000 gate ARF!

Victor last time we were in the old 2nd division do you know what our average attendance was?

Go away, you have so big a chip on your shoulder about Manchester you are covering yourself with embarrassment.

Not bigging up Manchester, just correcting some more anti-Manchester piffle.

[TheFly]

1978-1979 Manchester United 46.430 next nearest 46,407
1977-1978 Manchester United 51.860 next nearest 45,546
1976-1977 Manchester United 53,710 next nearest 47,221
1975-1976 Manchester United 54,750 next nearest 41,623
1974-1975 Manchester United 45,966 next nearest 40,021

The list goes on Victor, only 1987-1988 and 1988-1989 did we not have the highest attendances in English football. This was in the post Hysel period when we and Everton especially were robbed of any incentive by the murdering Liverpool supporters at the European Cup final. Not surprisingly all of football was in the doldrums then.

These were our Newcastle years Victor.

As a side script that Liverpool team that was banned from Europe was probably the best team of the last 50years with Rush,Aldridge, Beardsley, Barnes....what a team that was.

[Isaac Newell]

The capacity of OT in 92 was 48k, whatever Isaac Newell says.


You said 48,000 seater. I corrected you. You remain corrected.

[TheFly]

You said 48,000 seater. I corrected you. You remain corrected.

It's a poor fool who picks on Manchester United attendances as a weapon to beat Manchester with.

If he truly believes his own words on this subject then you may as well help him pack his bags. Can two people not get him certified?

He is the type of person who would deny the earth orbits the sun.

[2005]

1978-1979 Manchester United 46.430 next nearest 46,407
1977-1978 Manchester United 51.860 next nearest 45,546
1976-1977 Manchester United 53,710 next nearest 47,221
1975-1976 Manchester United 54,750 next nearest 41,623
1974-1975 Manchester United 45,966 next nearest 40,021

The list goes on Victor, only 1987-1988 and 1988-1989 did we not have the highest attendances in English football. This was in the post Hysel period when we and Everton especially were robbed of any incentive by the murdering Liverpool supporters at the European Cup final. Not surprisingly all of football was in the doldrums then.

These were our Newcastle years Victor.

As a side script that Liverpool team that was banned from Europe was probably the best team of the last 50years with Rush,Aldridge, Beardsley, Barnes....what a team that was.


YOU ARE A C***

Look, I'm a Tottenham fan and I know that Hysel is one of the biggest reasons for Tottenham's downfall but I don't go about saying that. The juve fans attacked the scousers, the scousers replied thus forcing the Juve fans to retreat to where, sadly, a wall, which was in a weak stadium that shouldn't have hosted the European Cup final in the first first place, collapsed.

I bet you if a few United fans had died last night you wouldn't have been singing "You killed your own"

[victor ebuwa]

Not bigging up Manchester, just correcting some more anti-Manchester piffle.

I've nothing against Manchester.

Look, in 92 you averaged 45k, pretty much what I guessed. Your lowest crowd was 40k and your highest 48k. Had you a larger stadium, your average wouldn't have been much higher on account of you only selling out once.

15 years and lots of pots later, you average 70 odd thousand. Coincidence?

Now back to the original point, someone said Newcastle would never fill a bigger stadium. What did I say? I said, "You never know, look at Man U."

I used your beloved Man U as a template to show how Newcastle, if they enjoyed the same success as you, could potentially double their support too.

They haven't won anything for 50 years. If they won the league next year, the following season would be a sell-out and they'd be wise to redevelop.

How does that make me anti Manchester? The only other "anti Manchester" thing I have said is that a journalist working for the Beeb in London will see a move to Manc as a backward step in his career and a film star doing a days worth of interviews in London, will not travel to Manchester to do one. Both of these things are true.

I have another "anti Manchester" thing to say. Why the fuck are you all so precious? It's like arguing with toddlers. Two bastard things I've said and I'm "anti Manchester". Get a fucking grip you sad fucks!

Can't anybody say anything realistic about Manchester? What's the point of a city forum when any negative comment is dismissed as "obsession" or "conspiracy" or "jealousy."

But whatever, believe what you want, here I'll help:

"Manchester is the most famous city in the world it is the bestest city and as big as London. London not yet Manchester now.

Manchester is the home of the industrial revolution it has world class skyscrapers and is the bestest and anyone who say otherwise is a jealous nobhead the MEN tells me all I need to know thank you I dont need outsiders giving realistic impressions cos they make me cry and Man U could have sold 100,000 tickets in '92 but couldn't be bothered."

[Isaac Newell]

Manchester is the home of the industrial revolution it has world class skyscrapers and is the bestest and anyone who say otherwise is a jealous nobhead the MEN tells me all I need to know thank you I dont need outsiders giving realistic impressions cos they make me cry and Man U could have sold 100,000 tickets in '92 but couldn't be bothered."

I must correct you again. whilst most of the above is correct, it's 120,000 tickets.

[victor ebuwa]

Hilarious. I bet you are a big hit with the ladies.

[Isaac Newell]

No, most ladies are bored stiff by football as you have probably realised.

[TheFly]

YOU ARE A C***

Look, I'm a Tottenham fan and I know that Hysel is one of the biggest reasons for Tottenham's downfall but I don't go about saying that. The juve fans attacked the scousers, the scousers replied thus forcing the Juve fans to retreat to where, sadly, a wall, which was in a weak stadium that shouldn't have hosted the European Cup final in the first first place, collapsed.

I bet you if a few United fans had died last night you wouldn't have been singing "You killed your own"

EXCUSE ME.

Can this guy by banned for the insult?

Which bit of Hysel was not the fault of violent Liverpool fans. Why were we banned from Europe for 5 years (Liverpool 7?) .

YOU NO MARK.

You are acting like a holocaust denier.

Pathetic.

[TheFly]

Jesus you history re-writing, liar.

[Scarecrow]

How about the inadequate stadium, useless policing, Juventus fans being put into a neutral section adjacent to Liverpool fans? Provocation and retaliation played their part, but were certainly not the only factors.

Seeing as it is now acceptable to rewrite history, it was quite disgusting seeing all of those drunken United fans trying to overpower the police and storm the pitch at Lille the other night, wasn't it? :ohno:

[TheFly]

How about the inadequate stadium, useless policing, Juventus fans being put into a neutral section adjacent to Liverpool fans? Provocation and retaliation played their part, but were certainly not the only factors.

Seeing as it is now acceptable to rewrite history, it was quite disgusting seeing all of those drunken United fans trying to overpower the police and storm the pitch at Lille the other night, wasn't it? :ohno:

Yes it was, exactly.

For every Utd fan in difficulty there were loads of dicks on the fences provoking a reaction.

Re Hysel, in a shooting who gets blamed, the gun manufacturer, the bullet manufacturer or the shooter.

Liverpool fans were found to be the shooter with the stadium choice a close 2nd. Importantly the stadium choice was a secondary factor in the disaster.

Hence we were banned from Europe for 5 years with Liverpool for 7 years(?).

The idiots who claim otherwise are are beneath contempt. Coming out with crass statements of how if it was a United fan involved. What so I loose all sense of justice and bias. Do me a favour. The deaths were directly attributed to rioting fans.

Re crushing at Lille. All footy fans of a certain age remember the swaying terraces..I was crushed in Utd Road, Old Trafford in the mid-eighties...I think it was Spurs...they opened up a spare pen nearer the away fans to releive the pressure...in the late entry gates section. That was very scary, I was winded so Hillsborough was a disgrace because all footy fans/authorities new the dangers of fans rushing in at the last minute and flow dynamics in terraces etc.

However, Hysel was different. A culmination of decades of idiots travelling round Europe (see Benidorm during the summer now).

[TheFly]

They haven't won anything for 50 years. If they won the league next year, the following season would be a sell-out and they'd be wise to redevelop.

"

which would bring you to Chelsea, who won nothing of any importance for 50 years and do not sell out their home matches.

which would bring you to Liverpool, who won far too much and do not sell out every match.

which brings you to united who have had the most loyal fan base of any club-period. No arguement.

[Agent Vengence]

interesting how this has got to this topic.

maybe a Heysel disaster thread should be started.....

[victor ebuwa]

Yes, they are especially loyal when winning. Travelling all the way from Surrey in 99% of cases

[Isaac Newell]

Yes, they are especially loyal when winning. Travelling all the way from Surrey in 99% of cases

You're wrong again it's 100%

[TheFly]

Victor has started another thread a few days back
http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=441853

listing attendances for league clubs...the only club he didn't put the correct name down for was?

Any guesses?

Yup!

He put `scum' instead of Mancheser United.

Hilarious chap.

Slags off Manchester United
Slags off Beeb move to Manchester
Slags off ???

One can only guess where this paranoia came from perhaps the subject of an entirely new thread.

99% Man Utd fans from Surrey....you crack us up!

Then again, I still would not see the problem with that. Why would that matter to Victor either?

Strange boy, over compensating for some other deficit in his life.
So much anger, such loose fingers.

Still, in fairness he pops his head up and trots out his anti-Manchester bile with few facts.

[TheFly]

Yes, they are especially loyal when winning. Travelling all the way from Surrey in 99% of cases


Victor, have you noticed no other football fan is joining your point of view.

Not even a Newcastle fan would dare say they are more loyal than United fans... the attendance figures during these clubs trophy wilderness years were frankly appalling.

[victor ebuwa]

Newcastle have doubled their crowd in the same time Man U have doubled theirs. Newcastle have enjoyed no success in that time, Man U have enjoyed unprecedented success.

You may have more "fans" but the geordies are more loyal.

Newcastle haven't won anything for ages but get 52000. When you hadn't won anything for ages, you averaged 40,000.

And Newcastle fans by and large come from the NE.

It's easy for somebody to support Man U, that's why they have so many fans accross the country and they are always the same type. No success in their own life, money sex etc, so they latch onto something successful to make up for that.

I've lived all over the UK and every Man U fan from outside of Manchester, ie most of them, are of that type. They can't compete socially with normal men who support their own club, but by supporting Man U, they finally have something to cling to, some way they can be top dog, if only for a day. It's kind of sad, but also sweet.

I don't know about Man U fans actually from Manchester who go, they seem ok and pretty much like a normal football fan, but those from outside Manc, ewww, strange little oddballs.

[Isaac Newell]

Newcastle have doubled their crowd in the same time Man U have doubled theirs. Newcastle have enjoyed no success in that time, Man U have enjoyed unprecedented success.

You may have more "fans" but the geordies are more loyal.

Newcastle haven't won anything for ages but get 52000. When you hadn't won anything for ages, you averaged 40,000.

And Newcastle fans by and large come from the NE.

It's easy for somebody to support Man U, that's why they have so many fans accross the country and they are always the same type. No success in their own life, money sex etc, so they latch onto something successful to make up for that.

I've lived all over the UK and every Man U fan from outside of Manchester, ie most of them, are of that type. They can't compete socially with normal men who support their own club, but by supporting Man U, they finally have something to cling to, some way they can be top dog, if only for a day. It's kind of sad, but also sweet.

I don't know about Man U fans actually from Manchester who go, they seem ok and pretty much like a normal football fan, but those from outside Manc, ewww, strange little oddballs.

You've never been near a football ground.

[victor ebuwa]

No, you have never been near one. Nor have you been near a woman

You must be able to come up with a better argument than that, my facts are true, but the spin I've put on them is incredible! Still, it's a solid argument which proves Newcastle are a bigger club, in a way.

[Isaac Newell]

No, you have never been near one. Nor have you been near a woman

You must be able to come up with a better argument than that, my facts are true, but the spin I've put on them is incredible! Still, it's a solid argument which proves Newcastle are a bigger club, in a way.

You have never been near a football ground

[victor ebuwa]

No, you have never been near a football ground, or a woman.

[Isaac Newell]

No, you have never been near a football ground, or a woman.

You have never been near a football ground.

[Scarecrow]

:lol:

[victor ebuwa]

No, you have never been near a football ground, or a woman

[TheFly]

Taxi for Victor!
What size white coat sir?
There's that 1st cuckoo of spring again!
A sandwich short of a picnic sir?
Staring at the bottom of the bottle again?


Who is Victor?

is Victor the new Concrete Dan?