The beginnings of Sandton's Times Square


http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5306/5592161446_98fcac9a01.jpg

^^ Let's hope Old Mutual and Alexandra Forbes will come to the party. It would be nice.

Are those screens, or just random images?

Are those screens, or just random images?

They screens

The beginnings of Sandton's Times Square


http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5306/5592161446_98fcac9a01.jpg

Awesome!!! :colgate: Just still hope they add some of the missing floors!

They screens

Thanks

See the impact those screens makes at night then you will certainly understand why Nostra is refering to NYC's Times Square.

A scope of what is to come in the near future...:)

Sandton set to keep booming
14 Apr 2011



New development in the Sandton central business district will see almost 200 000 sqm of new office, residential and retail developments being built over the next few years. About 48% of this is being done on a speculative basis according to figures compiled by the South African Property Owners’ Association (Sapoa).


New development in the Sandton central business district will see almost 200 000 sqm of new office, residential and retail developments being built over the next few years.
Sandton is characterised by a large number of owner-occupied development that includes major local and international banks, the Johannesburg Stock Exchange and insurance companies and legal firms.

The region is acknowledged as the premier financial district in South Africa.

According to David Reid, investment broker for JHI, some of the buildings in the central business district have been there for more than 20 years

“There is considerable potential for iconic architecture in this node. We have seen the redevelopment of commercial buildings into premier residential blocks and we expect to see greater levels of mixed-use development as redevelopment plans are unveiled,” says Reid.

Within the next five years various new developments are likely to be undertaken including:

- 9 000 sqm at 140 West Street;
- 35 000 sqm for Standard Bank in Alice Lane;
- 150 000 sqm on the site of the old Sandton municipality’s offices;
- 60 000 sqm for Old Mutual at the West, Stella and Rivonia road intersection;
- Village Walk refurbishment that will comprise 150 000 sqm of retail and office space;
- 25 000 sqm of alterations to FNB Towers.

The developments that are currently under construction include:

- 20 000 sqm of sectional title office space on the corner of Katherine and West Streets;

- 30 000 sqm at 114 West Street;
- 18 000 sqm at 6 Sandown Valley Crescent;
- 16 000 sqm at 1 Protea Place, with Cliffe Dekker Hofmeyr Attorneys as the tenant;
- 26 000 sqm at Sandhurst Office Park.

http://www.property24.com/articles/sandton-set-to-keep-booming/13422

I think the most exciting of all these developments must be the old Sandton Municipal offices - 150 000 sqm in just about the primest land in Joburg!

I dont know hey Inertia, the Village Walk masterplan looks fantastic

Can anyone point out on google earth where the location is of the Sandton Municipal Offices?

It's sandwiched by the Sandton Library, Nelson Mandela Square and the Gautrain Station

Shot, i checked it out. Can a 150 000 sqm development fit in that space?

I dont know hey Inertia, the Village Walk masterplan looks fantastic

I have to say that Village Walk masterplan tickle my fancy as well.

Shot, i checked it out. Can a 150 000 sqm development fit in that space?

I guess it'll have to make up in height for what it lacks in ground area :cheers:

Shot, i checked it out. Can a 150 000 sqm development fit in that space?

Yes, in the sky.

In the sky u say... :) Will the building be the new Sandton Municipal Office building? Or something new

In the sky u say... :) Will the building be the new Sandton Municipal Office building? Or something new

I doubt the municipality could afford the rents. But then again if it means the officials will work in luxury some strings will be pulled :lol:

Sounds like something is cooking?

End of the road for Sandton’s landmark Village Walk?

No new tenants being taken on board as shops stand empty.


Sandton’s popular Village Walk shopping centre (see images) is due for a major overhaul which will include the demolition of parts of the precinct for re-development. The final plans are yet to be approved by the Metropolitan Properties’ board before timelines for the project will become available. The adjacent Balalaika Hotel will also be refurbished. Metropolitan Properties’ managing director, Vuyani Hako, says part of the plans for the centre will be beefing up retail and the office component.

For now, existing leases are not being renewed and new tenants are not being taken on board. A former patron says the centre started suffering in the early 2000s with foot traffic declining steadily. He says the owners lacked vision and had failed to formulate a definitive plan for the centre. The Blues Room was the main attraction to the complex but has now also closed its doors, albeit for the time being.

An official involved in the planning of the re-development says the thinking behind it is not to compete with mega centres like Sandton City and Nelson Mandela Square in the vicinity. It is more a matter of coming up with a shopping experience that will blend with the existing mix.

He says care will also be taken to ensure the property conforms to council requirements which were different when the original centre went up 20 years ago. The village is only a couple of blocks away from the Gautrain station which is likely to become a major hub when the line between Johannesburg and Pretoria is up and running at the beginning of July. The envisaged village will have to make provision for public transport and the parking area will be completely revamped.

Tenants are likely to be given notice only once the plan has been endorsed by the Metropolitan board. Attempts will also be made to secure alternative accommodation for them until the project has been completed.

Meanwhile, the once bustling precinct along what is known as “the richest square mile” in Africa, has fallen into disrepair and it’s not something a lick of paint will fix. Several shops have closed down while others display, rather depressingly, “everything must go” posters in their shop windows.

This writer remembers a time when it was nigh impossible to pop in for a Saturday or Sunday lunch without booking well in advance. A recent visit showed few patrons frequenting the plethora of restaurants and eateries – admittedly it was on a weekday. What is thriving is the underground parking lot which giants like the Johannesburg Stock Exchange make use of to accommodate visitors.

Then there’s the legendary Blues Room jazz venue that has now “closed” sign dangling from within. Fond memories indeed. While many will be sad to see the demise of the 20-year-old complex as we know it, Hako says: “The tenants that have performed and have formed part of the Village Walk history will be encouraged to be part of the new look centre.”

http://www.moneyweb.co.za/mw/view/mw/en/page292525?oid=535744&sn=2009+Detail&pid=287226

sounds like a pretty big deal

from www.moneyweb.co.za

Reviewing the future of its current head office.

JOHANNESBURG – Goliath insurer Old Mutual (JSE:OML) is planning new headquarters in South Africa and for this it wants to build a multi-storey office precinct on Stella Road Sandton, Johannesburg, next to the Gautrain station.

“Old Mutual Property (the property investment boutique of Old Mutual Investment Group South Africa) is planning a multi storey mixed use office precinct comprising office and retail with basement and on-grade parking in Stella Road, Sandton.

“We are currently reviewing the existing property in Sandton and its suitability for the future requirements of the business. However, no decisions have yet been made in this regard,” an Old Mutual spokesperson said.

Old Mutual, which operates in five other African countries outside South Africa, sees the Johannesburg office as a springboard to drive its business agenda in Africa. Its emerging markets top leadership are also based in Johannesburg.

An insider at Old Mutual believes the planned headquarters next to the Gautrain will make it convenient for executives and clients from London and other countries to access the offices from the OR Tambo airport, via the Gautrain. The new planned office is expected to be within a very short walking distance from the railway station.

Old Mutual did not want to say how much it budgeted for the new head offices and when construction would start and complete. But in its annual report Old Mutual notes that “the construction and planning team for our new head office at Mutual Place consists of 26 different companies. It is a very large and diverse team who are tasked with delivering a flagship investment for Old Mutual. The power of the team lies in its diversity”.

The Old Mutual Group head office is based in London, Lambeth Hill and its South African head office is currently located at no. 93 Grayston Drive, Sandton, Johannesburg. Group headquarters are expected to remain in London.

Old Mutual has its other offices in Pinelands, Cape Town. About 85% of their non-sales staff are still working in the Pinelands office. It is also unclear if other office functions will be moved from Cape Town to Johannesburg.

^^It's gonna be a glass skyscraper!! Wohoo!!

I've noticed that alll the projects that were on hold during the recession are now back on track. Rosebank in particular is starting to boom again...)

^^ it would be nice to see the tallest coming on board, specially this one, http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=435549

http://i54.photobucket.com/albums/g102/joburgboy/Joburg%20developments/CIMG3724.jpg

This one still saddens me!

I wonder why Old Mutual are moving? I have always really liked their current offices on Grayston. It would be sad to see that building left empty.

I wonder why Old Mutual are moving? I have always really liked their current offices on Grayston. It would be sad to see that building left empty.

Are you talking about that fake neo-classical building in Grayston Drive? I HATE that building with an absolute passion! But that is just me. I would happily not only see that facebrick Pretoria-meets-Italy building empty, I would love to see it bulldozed! hehe. But I am just evil in that way. And quite opinionated! On the other side, I don't think that the offices in Grayston are that expansive - so it should be pretty simple to fill them up with a different tenant - or to keep a part of the office there?

PS - take everything I say with a grain of salt!

This one still saddens me!
It is certainly a heart breaker...

I'm with Jakes1 on this. Had to go there the other day. Buildings have names like Isibaya. Though only redeeming feature is the view you get of the glass and steel structure next to it...

Old but still worth a read...


Thursday, 14 April 2011 10:29
Sandton Central Business District Poised for Growth

Second in size only to Johannesburg CBD, the Sandton business district has greater potential than any other modern CBD in South Africa to dramatically increase in size and density, with several developers ready to commence new development projects within the next five years, says JHI property services group.

Characterised by a large number of owner occupied developments and with the majority of international banks, the JSE Securities Exchange, legal and management consultancies, Sandton is widely acknowledged as the premier financial district in South Africa.
Elaborates David Reid, investment broker for JHI: "Although Sandton CBD is relatively modern, there is a category of buildings which, being 20-30 years old, is now considered obsolete. What today's office market requires and demands are buildings with wide floor plans of 2000 square metres and more, with minimum wing widths of 16m and modern architecture, infrastructure, fixtures, and fittings which reflect the contemporary designs and needs of today's hi-tech world. In addition, there is growing interest in buildings with energy conserving or 'green' features, particularly with rising electricity and water costs," says Reid.

"As a result, there is considerable potential for iconic architecture to be developed in this node, particularly when you take into consideration the fact that most of those obsolete buildings cannot be rebuilt piecemeal due to the major disruption for existing tenants. In most cases such buildings can be demolished altogether and redeveloped into a more appealing mixed use development with ground floor retail and offices of approximately six floors above.

"While we have seen successful redevelopment of some former commercial buildings into upmarket residential apartments, the slowdown in the residential property market impacted negatively on some of these. However, as the economy improves – underpinned by increasing consumer demand and thereby creating an underlying tenant demand, it is anticipated that we will start to see a trend more towards manageable mixed use developments as outlined above, resulting in a higher concentration of offices," he says.

Transport is key factor impacting on future development, and with the high cost of transport including proposed high toll fees in Gauteng, it is likely that businesses – particularly those with staff living nearby – will look to relocate to the Sandton CBD. Sandton is already home to the biggest Gautrain station and implementation of the Bus Rapid Transport system (scheduled for completion in 2013) will improve public transport facilities and increase the accessibility of the node.

SAPOA reports that there is currently some 199 784sqm of committed new developments in the Sandton business district, of which approximately 48 percent is speculative development, which may lead to an increase in vacancies in the short to medium term. Some developments currently under construction or in the pipeline include: 20 000sqm of sectional title office space on the corner of Katherine and West Streets – for occupation in 2013; 30 000sqm at 114 West St, being new headquarters for Alexander Forbes; 6 Sandown Valley Crescent, with a gross lettable area of 18 000sqm and a projected completion date of mid-2011; 16 000sqm at 1 Protea Place, with Cliffe Dekker Hofmeyr Attorneys as a tenant and other smaller tenants; and Sandhurst Office Park, where 26 000sqm of office space becomes available in 2013.

A key driver of Sandton's commercial property market at present are tenants linked in some way or other to the financial services market, with the most sought after area being within or on the periphery of a triangle between Rivonia Road to the east, Grayston Drive to the west and West Street to the south. The most deciding factors for the future are proximity to the JSE and Gautrain, coupled with the physical attributes of buildings such as those with large floor plates, adaption to electronic communication, accessibility and parking.

Within the next five years the following developments are expected to commence: 9 000sqm at 140 West Street; 35 000sqm for Standard Bank at 11 Alice Lane; 150 000sqm on the site of the old Sandton municipal offices; 60 000sqm for Old Mutual on the corner of West, Stella and Rivonia Roads; Village Walk rebuild of approximately 150 000sqm on the corner of Rivonia Road and Maude Street; and at FNB Towers, 25 000sqm of additional bulk.

Currently in the Sandton business district JHI are marketing available office space to purchase and to lease, ranging from 250 to 4 500 square metres and in some instances even up to 26 000 square metres.

NIMBYs are at it again, today's main story on Talk 702 was the change of Sandton's skyline and talk of projects taking place. They were already bitching about Electricity and traffic...were in the world will those 2 not get impacted if any city embarks on such projects? Should we now stop developing because of that?

^^Heita Pule. The problem is that some people see problems where others see opportunities. I have to say though that Sandton traffic is killer at the end of the day, there're are just too many cars leaving the place at once. Another amazing thing is that our new highways are already reaching capacity with all the new cars being bought.


The only solution for a megacity like Joburg to keep growing and developing is massive investment in mass transit. So bring on more Gautrains, BRT and GFIP phase 2. Only problem is that most people do not understand that the cost of congestion to the economy, hence the noise about the tolls.

NIMBY's make me sick.

they need to be put in cages.

^^Heita Pule. The problem is that some people see problems where others see opportunities. I have to say though that Sandton traffic is killer at the end of the day, there're are just too many cars leaving the place at once. Another amazing thing is that our new highways are already reaching capacity with all the new cars being bought.


The only solution for a megacity like Joburg to keep growing and developing is massive investment in mass transit. So bring on more Gautrains, BRT and GFIP phase 2. Only problem is that most people do not understand that the cost of congestion to the economy, hence the noise about the tolls.

I fully agree Nostra.

Same morons who screamed blue murder at the Greenpoint redevelopment - and I mean just LOOK at it now.
Only insane people would have objected to what we now have there - so lets have them declared insane and locked the F*ck away!

I'd actually love for someone to hunt those fools down and see what they have to say now.

They were born to complain, pity we don't entertain thier nonsense.

NIMBY's make me sick.

I hate to admit this, but two projects in NYC turned me into a Nimby. The new WTC is just utterly disgusting and it "weighs down" the entire part of lower Manhattan because it is out of scale. It is just a bland glass thing. The train station is designed by Calatrava, and just so sexy. Pity about the tower. Closeby one of the tallest apartment buildings in the world (designed by Frank Gehry), shows one what decent design should look like. Much taller than its neighbours, but it is a piece of art.

The other project is a new tower on the site of the Penn Hotel. The old hotel will be demolished, and this building has too much architectural merit to go. It is also on 34th street, close to the Empire State. The new tower will be taller than the Empire State, and this will unsettle midtown, IMO. The ES is just such a powerful symbol, and you see it from miles away before enterring Manhattan. the new tower is also just a bland piece of glass. Vile, compared to the buildings around it. Luckily, with the current economic climate it is unlikely to speed ahead. Even the WTC will struggle to attract people. times are tougher than we think.

Does this mean I am a NIMBY?

Not at all. There's a big difference between being selective and just being outright against any development whatsoever (eg. Green Point residents).

I hate to admit this, but two projects in NYC turned me into a Nimby. The new WTC is just utterly disgusting and it "weighs down" the entire part of lower Manhattan because it is out of scale. It is just a bland glass thing. The train station is designed by Calatrava, and just so sexy. Pity about the tower. Closeby one of the tallest apartment buildings in the world (designed by Frank Gehry), shows one what decent design should look like. Much taller than its neighbours, but it is a piece of art.

The other project is a new tower on the site of the Penn Hotel. The old hotel will be demolished, and this building has too much architectural merit to go. It is also on 34th street, close to the Empire State. The new tower will be taller than the Empire State, and this will unsettle midtown, IMO. The ES is just such a powerful symbol, and you see it from miles away before enterring Manhattan. the new tower is also just a bland piece of glass. Vile, compared to the buildings around it. Luckily, with the current economic climate it is unlikely to speed ahead. Even the WTC will struggle to attract people. times are tougher than we think.

Does this mean I am a NIMBY?

NIMBYs are defined by their inability to reason between beneficial and detrimental projects. They are opposed to ANY change. I don't think you are a NIMBY :cheers:

Phew, I am so relieved!

:cheers:

NIMBYs are defined by their inability to reason between beneficial and detrimental projects. They are opposed to ANY change. I don't think you are a NIMBY :cheers:

Gautrain inspired, I am sure...

SLOW lounge in SandtonFollow us on Twitter


August 3rd, 2011

Following the success of the award winning SLOW lounges at airports in Cape Town, Johannesburg and Durban, Comair in partnership with FNB has launched the first ‘SLOW in the City' in the heart of Sandton, Africa's bustling commercial hub.



The idea behind this brand new inner city oasis is to offer high flyers the opportunity to conduct business from a comfortable, chic, yet professional out-of-office working space, breaking away from the noisiness of coffee shops/restaurants, the impersonal feel of many hotels and the monotony of the office.

Signature features of SLOW in the City are the ‘Light' and ‘Dark' Rooms. The Dark Room enables guests to take some quiet time and think, thus blocking out external sensory distractions while the Light Room provides an inspirational environment to generate fresh solutions.

Unlike airport lounges, there is an entrance charge for qualifying guests to use SLOW in the City. Access to SLOW in the City is exclusively for British Airways Executive Club members, British Airways Club (business class) passengers, and select FNB and RMB Private Bank Clients. However, the private meeting facilities can be booked for use by corporate and the general public.



Jamie Clyde, CEO of SLOW says, "Our SLOW concept has really taken off in South Africa - it fits with a growing international trend to appreciate life's journey as much as achieving an end goal. SLOW in the City provides the perfect escape from the frantic yet often unproductive pace of modern business. SLOW in the City is for extremely busy people who desire luxury, comfort and the functionality to enable them to be enjoyably productive when away from their usual place of work."

Branding and design consultancy GRID have worked with Comair to develop the SLOW in the City brand and concept. The interior décor and design was created by Tonic - with a holistic focus using natural materials and colours combined with manmade elements associated with the city and complemented by local art work.



The following facilities are available at SLOW in the City:

• A range of meeting rooms and workspaces
(Private lounges, Boardrooms, Function rooms, Signature meeting spaces, Library Desks, Private studies and Private Studios)

• Bar offering specialty teas and coffees as well as wine and cocktails

• Bistro serving breakfast, lunch and afternoon teas plus a Wine & Cheese Room

• Private washrooms with full shower facilities

• Super Fast Wifi and 3G

• Newspapers, magazines and business journals

• PC workstations and printing facilities

• Video conference suite

• International Power sockets throughout the facility

• Self service Airport Check-in, OR Tambo airport flight information display and Gautrain tickets

• Cloakroom for luggage and coats as well as Personal lockers

• Exclusive offers from our sponsors including discounted Car Rental and Chauffeur Drive

SLOW in the City is located on the ground floor of the Gautrain Hotel on the corner of Rivonia and West street (opposite the Gautrain station in Sandton). Opening hours are from Monday to Friday from 06:00 am - 18:00 pm.

This is my line of work, and I'm really excited that the concept is taking off in South Africa :)

http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6070/6107374034_c284fc0f9f_b_d.jpg

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Not spontaneously combusting when walking on actual streets!

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What's the real name of the building in the centre?Always just called it Mario.

http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6083/6106981355_1088797ea5_b_d.jpg

Fabulous. Thanks The E.N.D

Hi guys. I'm new here.

Welcome :) Hope to see you posting more!

Hi guys. I'm new here.

Welcome to the forum. Just remember. I will always be Jakes number 1. hehe.

What's the real name of the building in the centre?Always just called it Mario.

http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6083/6106981355_1088797ea5_b_d.jpg[/QUOTE]

Its called the Forum. I think.

What's the real name of the building in the centre?Always just called it Mario.

http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6083/6106981355_1088797ea5_b_d.jpg

Its called the Forum. I think.[/QUOTE]

Yep it's the forum

A nice shot of the Sandton CBD:

http://www.sacommercialpropnews.co.za/thumbnail.php?file=articles/Sandton_under_construction__Johannesburg__South_Africa_2_162319946.jpg&size=article_medium

Source: SA Commercial Property News (http://www.sacommercialpropnews.co.za/business-specialties/construction-development/3756-development-plans-for-sandton-cbd-gets-underway.html)

A nice shot of the Sandton CBD:

http://www.sacommercialpropnews.co.za/thumbnail.php?file=articles/Sandton_under_construction__Johannesburg__South_Africa_2_162319946.jpg&size=article_medium

Source: SA Commercial Property News (http://www.sacommercialpropnews.co.za/business-specialties/construction-development/3756-development-plans-for-sandton-cbd-gets-underway.html)

Unfortunately it's about 4 years old! Thanks anyway :)

Unfortunately it's about 4 years old! Thanks anyway :)

Yeah I figured :lol: But it makes it look nice and dense :cheers:

Sandton under construction


Author: Micel Schnehage|


31 October 2011 17:30

There are 30 development proposals including the redevelopment of Southern Sun Hotel.

JOHANNESBURG – In less than a month the landmark Southern Sun Grayston Hotel will close its doors with an application having been lodged for redevelopment of the building.

This is just one of a number of developments mushrooming in the Sandton central business district. The Gautrain station is also set to house a mixed use development to be built on top of the existing structure. It’s not yet known when construction is set to begin.

Across the road from the Gautrain, work has begun on Alexander Forbes’ new head office. Old Mutual is also planning on erecting new offices in the business hub near the Gautrain while Standard Bank is building on Alice Lane.

A newly built retail space measuring 30 000m² will be unveiled on November 12 2011 offering luxury shopping in the form of Hugo, Tag Heuer, Canterbary, Bellagio and Lecoqsportif, to mention but a few. A carbon copy of the esteemed Paul & Sharks store in Milan on Via Montenapoleone will also be opening after being designed in Italy. This is part of a R1.77bn first phase of the Sandton City shopping centre development project.

Sandton City is also upping its game with the opening of a further 69 stores on the corners of Rivonia and Sandton Drive in November 2011.

This will bring the number of stores to 360.

Sandton City's entire retail space will total 143 690m² on completion of this phase taking the complex, which includes the Sandton hotel and office component to 215 000m².

Not far from Sandton City, work has already begun on luxury penthouse apartments on Katherine Street.

Also in Sandton, Village Walk will be completely demolished in 2012 to make way for a mixed use development which will include a new hotel. The Balalaika will also close down. A nearby temporary taxi rank has also been earmarked for development.

These are just a few of the many developments underway. According to looklocal Sandton, “there are 30 development proposals for the Sandton business district alone, which includes new zoning and renovations”.

Some of the construction companies involved are WBHO and Tiber Projects.

Source : Moneyweeb

http://www.moneyweb.co.za/mw/view/mw/en/page292525?oid=555140&sn=2009+Detail&pid=287226

^^
I was about to post this lol, are all the projects mentioned in this article accounted for here?

The mentioned projects have been catered for...

We've been appointed architects and interior designers for the Grayston Sun refurbishment. More details to follow later!

Nice :) We look forward to it!

How did this pass us by? The Sandton Central Park Development. It is opening April 2012.

Quite exciting. Should we start a thread for it?

http://www.simplylinks.co.za/article3437_view.htm

Green belts, urban forests, green environmental projects and parks add a certain value to both communities and the environment in which they live in. They provide a haven for families and communities and enable them to be out in nature whilst living in an urban jungle surrounded by cement. Johannesburg is a rapidly growing city and the central business district of Sandton is ever rising. Buildings and developments are springing up all over the area which has its considerable benefits but disadvantages too. There is the decrease of vegetation and wildlife which reinforces pollution and the surrounding carbon footprint. Sticking true to one of the city of Johannesburg’s claims to fame that it boasts the biggest urban forest in the world; a new environmental project has been created, a green lung district and green belt in its own right.

To counteract Sandton’s rapidly growing and evolving center, an environmental project has been development in the form of the Sandton Central Park Project. The environmental project took five years to complete and as it neared its completion at the end of 2011, a ceremony was held to celebrate its completion. Khan Morbee of the South African Rock group Parlotones acted as an ambassador for CarbonWorx, one of the primary sponsors of this South African environmental project along with Standard Bank and planted an indigenous wild olive tree. CEO of CarbonWorx, Mark Smith as well as members of the Sandton central management district were present for the special occasion. The Sandton Central Park project, a prominent force in community environmental projects, will provide a much needed oasis in the heart of Sandton. The environmental project will alleviate the surrounding areas carbon footprint, create a surge of oxygen, provide environmental sustainability, reduce pollution and form part of a community based destination for the residents in the surrounding areas. The Sandton central park project, a great among environmental project ideas, will offer natural 'landscape seating areas situated under, along with 'special places' such as an area set aside for children, game infrastructure, and meditation areas. Different environmental project ideals have been utilized in various businesses in Sandton in the form of recycling initiatives and solar water geysers just adding to the areas environmentally holistic approach.

In such a business and corporate infused area, it is amazing to see such environmental projects making an appearance. The district of Sandton is noting their environmental responsibility and the creation of Sandton’s central park project will see the leaders and residents of the area taking a stride in the right green direction. The park will be open to the public in the next following month.

I did an interview with the CCID a few weeks ago regarding Central Park. I forgot to post it on SSC :)

Sandton Centrals' Multi-Million Rand Developments


Wednesday, 11 January 2012 09:11

AS developments continue in Sandton central, the business district will see some dramatic changes and the creation of some new landmarks.



Kgoro Gateway (planned):
The intended city centre of Sandton central, Kgoro Central will consist of a mixed-use art precinct developed around a public square, situated above the new Sandton Public Transport Interchange.

Located between West Street, Rivonia Road and 5th Street, Kgoro will be the first entry point for travellers coming off the Gautrain.
The building will make use of on-site power generation, utilisation of waste heat for heating and cooling, and stormwater retention.

Alexander Forbes (in progress):
Located at 115 West Street on the corner of Rivonia Road, the R840 million development will be an eight-storey office building accommodating Alexander Forbes' 2 200 Johannesburg employees. The building will make use of plant-filled outdoor areas and natural and energy efficient lighting. Planned occupation is 1 October 2012.

Mutual Place (planned):
Located on the corner of Rivonia Road and Stella Street the development will be a
60 000m² multi-storey, mixed-use office precinct. Old Mutual will offer rental space to offices and retail companies. Construction is expected to start in early 2012 and to be completed by 2014.

Village Walk (planned):
Located on the corner of Maude Street and Rivonia Road, the development will be a mixed use premises of retail, office and hospitality space. The project will require the demolition of the current Village Walk shopping centre. Construction is expected to commence in mid 2012 and be completed by 2016.

Katherine and West Development (in progress):
Located on the corner of West and Katherine streets, the R650 million office premises already has 30 percent of the sectional title space signed for or in an advanced stage of negotiation. Occupation is expected from 2014. The eight-storey building will have six parking levels and seven luxury penthouse apartments.

Alice Lane (planned):
Located on the corner of Alice Lane and 5th Street, phase 1 of the 35 000m² office building is expected to be ready for occupation by September 2012.


http://www.sandtoncentral.co.za/home/sandton-centrals-multi-million-rand-developments


.

Where is the Sandton Central Park situated?

All pics courtesy of story of Bing :http://www.storyofbing.com/2012/01/evening-view-of-sandton/

http://www.storyofbing.com/pics3/ff1569_sandton_city_view.jpg

http://www.storyofbing.com/pics3/ff1570_sandton_city_view.jpg

http://www.storyofbing.com/pics3/ff1572_sandton_city_view.jpg

http://www.storyofbing.com/pics3/ff1573_sandton_city_view.jpg

http://www.storyofbing.com/pics3/ff1574_sandton_city_view.jpg

http://www.storyofbing.com/pics3/ff1576_sandton_city_view.jpg

http://www.storyofbing.com/pics3/ff1577_sandton_city_view.jpg

http://www.storyofbing.com/pics3/ff1578_sandton_city_view.jpg

Beautiful :)

Damn Nostra, fantastic pictures!

Hey Pule, just read that and was about to post it!


Great news all round, especially with the park aspect in the mix...

Hey, can anyone get a photo of the newly installed video wall at Sandton Central? Apparently it is pretty flipping huge!
Like as in 15m by 15m...

Sandton Centrals' Multi-Million Rand Developments


Wednesday, 11 January 2012 09:11

AS developments continue in Sandton central, the business district will see some dramatic changes and the creation of some new landmarks.



Kgoro Gateway (planned):
The intended city centre of Sandton central, Kgoro Central will consist of a mixed-use art precinct developed around a public square, situated above the new Sandton Public Transport Interchange.

Located between West Street, Rivonia Road and 5th Street, Kgoro will be the first entry point for travellers coming off the Gautrain.
The building will make use of on-site power generation, utilisation of waste heat for heating and cooling, and stormwater retention.

Alexander Forbes (in progress):
Located at 115 West Street on the corner of Rivonia Road, the R840 million development will be an eight-storey office building accommodating Alexander Forbes' 2 200 Johannesburg employees. The building will make use of plant-filled outdoor areas and natural and energy efficient lighting. Planned occupation is 1 October 2012.

Mutual Place (planned):
Located on the corner of Rivonia Road and Stella Street the development will be a
60 000m² multi-storey, mixed-use office precinct. Old Mutual will offer rental space to offices and retail companies. Construction is expected to start in early 2012 and to be completed by 2014.

Village Walk (planned):
Located on the corner of Maude Street and Rivonia Road, the development will be a mixed use premises of retail, office and hospitality space. The project will require the demolition of the current Village Walk shopping centre. Construction is expected to commence in mid 2012 and be completed by 2016.

Katherine and West Development (in progress):
Located on the corner of West and Katherine streets, the R650 million office premises already has 30 percent of the sectional title space signed for or in an advanced stage of negotiation. Occupation is expected from 2014. The eight-storey building will have six parking levels and seven luxury penthouse apartments.

Alice Lane (planned):
Located on the corner of Alice Lane and 5th Street, phase 1 of the 35 000m² office building is expected to be ready for occupation by September 2012.


http://www.sandtoncentral.co.za/home/sandton-centrals-multi-million-rand-developments


.
and sandton city, the biggest investment and development by far ?

Damn Nostra, fantastic pictures!

Thanks big guy, obviously the credit must go to Bing, she took them and I just posted them.

Nostra, nice pics... Diggerdog, beat you to it :)

Sandton City mall floodedArticle By: Rahima Essop @ iAfrica
Thu, 26 Jan 2012 4:05

Several stores in Sandton City Shopping Centre have been flooded, due to a burst pipe on Thursday afternoon.

The pipe burst above the iStore, which sells high-tech electronic gadgets.

The water is spreading rapidly and dozens of cleaners are using buckets to shovel the water, while others frantically mop up behind them.

The affected areas have been cordoned off with tape, and shoppers are squeezing past leaving muddy footprints.

The centre's manager Sharon Swain, said a cold water pipe burst, causing part of the roof of the iStore to give way.

She says teams are on site to fix the problem and help with mopping up.

While some tenants are helping out with the cleaning, others are staring in disbelief.

While some tenants are helping out with the cleaning, others are staring in disbelief.

LOL, this could easily happen.. I don't see how this is so shocking. I remember my classroom in 4th grade elementary school flooded everytime it rained and during some bad rainstorms there would be ankle deep water.

Hahaha I was there when it happened yesterday. Will try to post some pictures.

I also cant figure out where this park is and I live and work in Sandton CBD! Can anyoine post a map showing its location?!

Also not sure about this video wall. Where exactly is it?

Video wall is in the new shopping centre...no idea about the park...

I also cant figure out where this park is and I live and work in Sandton CBD! Can anyoine post a map showing its location?!

Also not sure about this video wall. Where exactly is it?

They say the park starts on the Corner of Grayston and 5th. So I am assuming that those Alice lane Sandhurst towers overlook the park? They also state that the park is walking distance from Sandton City.

Corner of Grayston and 5th? Looked on Google Earth and there is a small park there already. But nothing worthy of being called a "Central Park." Mushroom Farm Park is bigger

I still cant think where that would be. I live right next to Mushroom Park and it is lovely. I always consider that park to be Sandton CBD's main "green lung"

Even in that case, compare the relative size of all the parks in the Sandton Area and then look at similar cases overseas. Looking relatively. There is no way the space is available for a large main park without the demolishion of many buildings

Corner of Grayston and 5th? Looked on Google Earth and there is a small park there already. But nothing worthy of being called a "Central Park." Mushroom Farm Park is bigger

I actually think this is the one. Mushroom Farm Park is already open to the public. Is that the one with the Hyundai baloon? Because they gave that park a new leash on life as well.

I don't get it, this little green thing in the middle is Sandton Central Park. How are they supposed to expand that? (Imagery from Dec. 2010)


http://img528.imageshack.us/img528/8914/picture9l.png

Corner of Grayston and 5th? Looked on Google Earth and there is a small park there already. But nothing worthy of being called a "Central Park." Mushroom Farm Park is bigger

its on corner of Grayston and the M1, Innesfree park? signs up about opening etc. maybe it a make over

This is the park on the corner of Grayston and 5th. Now before we get all tense about the size, there would be very few similar size plots (in council hands) available. Sandhurst Towers face onto this development, so biiig improvement for them. And it is close to the Sandton CBD (if you survive the crazy walk down and up 5th ave). The best part? The largest part of the park faces Sandton Drive, and that piece of pavement is very very grotty indeed. Will bring many improvements. Innesfree seems to be receiving attention as well (it is huge, but far from the Center). And Mushroom farm park is just looking lovely, and it is close enough to serve lower CBD as well. I am quite excited about the green space!

Mushroom Park is right next to my house and is LOVELY. It was looking a bit grotty for the last few months as they have been upgrading it but its looking stunning now.

Photos of the park please guys!

Actually I took a stroll round Mushroom Park on Saturday and it is looking far from stunning. The grass has not been cut for ages. the paths have been half finnished and there is rubble and bricks everywhere. I fear that it is going to be a typical Joburg city council effort: a half arsed job and not bother to clean up afterwards. I really hope I am wrong and they have not finnished but it has been in that state for a while now. Very sad. Its a shame because it was looking much better before the "upgrades" than it is now.

Actually I took a stroll round Mushroom Park on Saturday and it is looking far from stunning. The grass has not been cut for ages. the paths have been half finnished and there is rubble and bricks everywhere. I fear that it is going to be a typical Joburg city council effort: a half arsed job and not bother to clean up afterwards. I really hope I am wrong and they have not finnished but it has been in that state for a while now. Very sad. Its a shame because it was looking much better before the "upgrades" than it is now.

It's a shame but the vast majority of Joburg lies in this state. Unless a corporate has forked out the cash to finish what the council started things pretty much lay half done - it is quite astonishing really

Is this the case of all public parks in Joburg? Surely there are a few good ones?

Is this the case of all public parks in Joburg? Surely there are a few good ones?

Joburg has some very nice parks - the one just opposite the Wanderer's Planet Fitness for example is pretty awesome, go there often.

But the point was that when the council starts a project, usually involving digging up the streets or roads, it rarely if ever gets finished to the same standard that it was at before, which mind you wasn't that great. Things in Joburg either stay the same or get worse, it's quite sad.

From what I have seen, heard and read, the new Mushroom Farm Park is really good!? I haven't been there however...but if the grass hasnt been cut and wotnot, there are a number of contacts to hit with an enquiry...for example...

The Sandton Central Management District
For general information contact:
Cara Reilly
Mobile: + 27 (0) 83 372 1558
Email: cara@kumsandton.co.za

Hyundai have a section of the park, 'Hyundai Sky Park' - they have a partnership with Johannesburg City Parks, and here is an extract from their website -

Due to the efforts of Hyundai in partnership with Aerial Displays and Johannesburg City Parks, the park has been transformed into a green oasis for residents and people working in the Sandton area to appreciate and enjoy. The state-of-the-art park is complete with an interactive children’s play area, a stunning earth garden, amphitheatre, giant balloon riding facility, and will soon see the introduction of a coffee shop and restaurant, making it the ideal spot for live events, picnics and soaking up some sun in safe and tranquil surroundings in the midst of one of Gauteng’s most built-up areas.

The giant balloon riding facility offers visitors a unique and panoramic view of Johannesburg from a vantage point of 120m above the ground – weather permitting. In addition to the facility in Sandton, Hyundai has also taken over the Monte Casino site. Hyundai is now able to offer visitors this unique perspective of the Johannesburg skyline from two different angles

Have to admit, looks pretty good in these photos from late last year...

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-gDh7Emd1RQ4/TuM00zYaTXI/AAAAAAAABYw/ehEJtM8KCUI/s320/20082011540.jpg

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-hn4ugF5pobw/TuMvAApVREI/AAAAAAAABYo/lGFGo1Glpd0/s320/20082011531.jpg

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-q1pg212ZH1A/TuMrrBQwnFI/AAAAAAAABYA/OEQ7jlK7bZc/s320/20082011490.jpg

It looks different now. A real mess. The paths are all half finnished, the grass lumpy and overgrown etc. So frustrating. Why do a renovation if you are going to make it worse? Its crazy!!

Joburg does have some great parks: Zoo Lake, Emmerentia Dam, Victory Park etc but its a shame what has happened to Mushroom Park.

^^ This pretty much confirms everything:

Joburg ‘the worst’

February 21 2012 at 01:29pm

INLSA
ANNA COX

THE CITY of Joburg is financially the worst-performing municipality in the country.

This is according to Ratings Afrika’s Municipal Financial Sustainability Index (MFSI).

The Joburg council got just 26 points out of 100, with Tshwane not far behind at 32 and Ekurhuleni at 47.

Cape Town, among the nine metros, scored the highest at 63 out of 100.

The findings had serious implications for Joburg residents, said MFSI analyst Leon Claassen. The council was cash-strapped, which meant a future of non-service delivery and non-maintenance of infrastructure for residents, he added.

The ratings are based on a general analysis of municipalities’ financial statements.

There are four criteria:

lThe municipality’s financial position and its ability to self-fund.

lIts operational performance – whether it makes a surplus or a deficit.

lIts borrowing or liability management.

lIts liquidity, or how much cash in hand it has.

“The same model was used on all the 102 municipal entities we scored – no matter how big or how small,” Claassen said.

Joburg scored badly on all four counts, but especially in terms of its liquidity situation, for which it achieved a negative score.

“This is a severe problem. It means that the city cannot pay its short-term obligations. This, in effect, means that service delivery will suffer, normal maintenance will be done cheaply (and might result in potholes being patched instead of being fixed properly, for instance).

“This will affect long-term service delivery because the degradation will catch up in years to come. If the city does not fix its liquidity problems soon, it is going to have major problems in the future,” Claassen said.

The study was inspired by the public focus on municipalities as a result of poor service delivery, corruption, deteriorating infrastructure and financial mismanagement. It was done to introduce an independent, objective view of the financial stability of municipalities.

“In general, in all 102 municipalities it was found that the general deterioration in the financial stability has been arrested in a number of cases.

“The nine metros, as economic hubs and drivers of economic growth in the provinces, reveal financial weakness in some, while others reflect good stability, even while they experience huge service delivery challenges,” Claassen said.

The financial instability of the metros is caused by the huge pressure to develop infrastructure, which is only partially funded from own sources, the remainder being from borrowed funds.

Because of the higher debt burden, the liquidity positions of some of the metros, such as Joburg and Tshwane, have weakened, according to Claassen’s report.

Joburg’s liquidity was further hampered by its billing crisis and low revenue collection, the study found.

Among the smaller municipalities, KwaDukuza (Stanger/ Ballito) scored the highest with 86, Tlokwe (Potchefstroom) 82, Metsimaholo (Sasolburg) 73 and Midvaal, the only DA-run council in Gauteng, 50.

“This shows that in spite of challenges, there are still well-managed municipalities around.

“They adhere to good budgetary practices, strict financial control and good revenue collection, even during tough economic conditions,” Claassen said.

He expressed concern that more than half the 102 municipalities could not reach a score of 50. (http://www.iol.co.za/the-star/joburg-the-worst-1.1239237)

Great job ANC

Yup. Does not suprise me in the slightest.

I love how Diggerdog and co. comfortably evade the harsh realities of the country when they pop up on this forum. I don't want to bring us back to that period of infighting within the SA forum but at least have a balanced view and frequent the bad parts of the forum along with the good ones. Living in a bubble is just silly.

If you don't want to start the infighting, Inertia, then don't fucking start it.

Where exactly are the 'bad' parts of the forum?

And I don't 'pop up' on this forum, I am here all the time - what do you own the forum now?

And stick your bubble - who do you think you are talking to?

By the way, just constantly whining about the ANC does not make you a soothsayer or a hero, it just makes you a bit tiresome.

@ DIGGERDOG: Sorry to ask, plz wHAT rAcE ARE U.?

If you don't want to start the infighting, Inertia, then don't fucking start it.

Where exactly are the 'bad' parts of the forum?

And I don't 'pop up' on this forum, I am here all the time - what do you own the forum now?

And stick your bubble - who do you think you are talking to?

By the way, just constantly whining about the ANC does not make you a soothsayer or a hero, it just makes you a bit tiresome.

No need to swear or get so worked up, it's just an internet forum. If you feel that my comments are out of line then you can say so - you have that freedom of speech (for now).

I still stick by my earlier comments though - I would love to hear about your take on the current situation in South Africa outside SKA and the Western Cape.


PS. And of course it can get tiresome, it is a rather depressing situation we find ourselves in. But it's the truth.

So much positive energy... I think its time for me to spend my time elsewhere. Lets close the thread for SA. All is lost. If you want me, Im posting pictures on the death of joburg forum.

No need to swear or get so worked up, it's just an internet forum. If you feel that my comments are out of line then you can say so - you have that freedom of speech (for now).

I still stick by my earlier comments though - I would love to hear about your take on the current situation in South Africa outside SKA and the Western Cape.


PS. And of course it can get tiresome, it is a rather depressing situation we find ourselves in. But it's the truth.


Hmm, OK, well I am not depressed. And I like swearing, and using my freedom of speech.
You should know my take on SA by now, I don't just hang out in the western cape forum at all, I am all over this shop.

You are the one with the problem. You have let some of the (admittedly ludicrous) activities of the ruling party drive you over the edge - to the point where you are routinely telling your fellow formers that all is lost, the country is finished, leave while you can...
And you wonder why you don't get much support :ohno:

SA will continue to grow, through it's problems and politics, and we are free to comment and contribute as we see fit.
You just seem to be locked in a box, and there is nothing good inside it.

I dont see why all is seemingly lost? Malema is gagged ( wasnt he the big force "every" white person feared? ) The battle against the media is ripping the ANC apart and the DA is growing like never before.

Corruption although rife in the North is being exposed and dealt with and even the ANC is trying to improve service delivery ( although from national gov more than branch level ).

Nothing is ever lost in South Africa . The sky will not fall...

amen Digger and Johan :)

^^ Well said guys. I don't know why being depressed is so fashionable nowadays, what's up with this fatalistic attitude? And usually the ones who're so depressed don't even have a reeason to be, they live a pretty good life compared to an average South African, and they walk round like life's dealt them a bad hand.

anyways we've got s much to look forward in SA, this country's best years are still to come imo...

By the way, even the problem with JHB's finances is being tackled and already yielding results. You can't do much about problems but as long as there are signs that the govt listens to the population and makes an effort to tackle problems, I will remain hopeful. Nobody said democracy means living in an ideal country with perfectly manicured lawsn, democracy offers you a chance to solve problems that arise...


Better-than-expected figures for the first half of the financial year signal “a growing confidence among ratepayers who contribute to the city’s coffers”.
JOHANNESBURG is ahead of its revenue collection targets and the City is on track to meet the goals set in the 2011/12 Budget.

MMC for finance Geoffrey MakhuboThe member of the mayoral committee for finance, Geoff Makhubo, says “figures for the first half of the financial year reflect the robust health of the Johannesburg finances and a growing confidence among ratepayers who contribute to the city’s coffers”.

“We are making steady progress to strengthen our revenue collection service and restore confidence in the integrity of our billing data,” he says.

“The Revenue Roadmap announced in November is already achieving measurable results and we are getting positive feedback from ratepayers whose billing concerns are being resolved.”

The six-months’ figures as compiled at the end of January show that Johannesburg collected R11,86-billion, which is 50,6 percent of the adjusted budget of R23,4-billion.

“We have exceeded our revenue targets by R466,2-million and I am confident that we will also meet the 12-month goals,” says Makhubo.

Johannesburg had a cash balance of over R2-billion at the end of January which reflects the healthy financial position of the City.

“Our new revenue and customer relations system is being put place over a 19-month period but we are already seeing improved results. We are improving the quality of the customer’s interaction with the City and introducing a step change in our collection system.

“Our customers are showing greater inclination to pay for services such as water, electricity and waste removal as they gain more confidence in the data that are reflected on their bills.”

The six-months’ figures also show an operating surplus of R785,8-million – against a budgeted surplus of R688,7-million – while the actual operating expenditure was over budget by R369,1-million.

We have a R2.1 billion sinking fund assets to address our maturing bond. Revenue excluding capital grants as increased by 20 percent year-on-year while our expenditure increased 13 percent year-on-year. This enhanced the ability to meet our obligations.

The City has also put in place a strategy to ensure that expenditure takes place within the revenue envelope. The total operating budget for 2011/2012 was adjusted upwards by R836,8-million to R32,81-billion while the capital budget increased from R3,72-billion to R3,74-billion.

Johannesburg’s budget for the 2012/2013 financial year will be delivered in May.



Read more: http://www.joburg.org.za/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=7771&catid=88&Itemid=266#ixzz1nUALXnJk

I dono sometimes I feel like I'm going crazy and I'm seeing a different world to you guys. But ya i guess some people are just eternal optimists :lol:

I haven't changed my opinion and won't until it deserves to be changed; Yes I do live quite an amazing life in SA but I also do in the USA where I live some months of the year... And I must admit the qualify of life is incomparable at times, although I miss Joburg like crazy when I'm away.

Do you really believe everything that's said in that article Nostra after what I posted earlier, the billing crisis, and the huge mess that was discovered in the Western Cape?

I'm living in joburg now and i knew what i was getting into by accepting an offer here and don't regret a second. Its brash, its bombastic , its energy, its run down , its beautiful.
currently in a suite on the 18th floor of the sandton sun and have a different perspective of sandton from up here.

Well, yes, it is optimism I suppose.
But again, that does not mean there are not problems, come on, we know them well. We know there are basket case municipalities, for example...this is not just blind happy go lucky optimism.

But then I think that IF Joburg does recover from this disgraceful mess, if it gets a clean audit next time around, then that is progress, that is good.
I don't see how that is living in a dream world.

Each year we are moving closer to a two party political situation, which has created real competition and is increasing the pressure on the ruling party to lift its game.
So I do think the future looks promising.

I dono sometimes I feel like I'm going crazy and I'm seeing a different world to you guys. But ya i guess some people are just eternal optimists :lol:

I haven't changed my opinion and won't until it deserves to be changed; Yes I do live quite an amazing life in SA but I also do in the USA where I live some months of the year... And I must admit the qualify of life is incomparable at times, although I miss Joburg like crazy when I'm away.

Do you really believe everything that's said in that article Nostra after what I posted earlier, the billing crisis, and the huge mess that was discovered in the Western Cape?

Yes, I'm willing to give them the benefit of the doubt....

I find the problem in general in this country right now is that when government, municipalities etc etc take 10 steps back, then not much is said, and if you talk about it you are labelled a pessimist. But then if 1 step is taken forward, everyone talks about the great changes that are occurring. In the long run, everything is deteriorating.

I find the problem in general in this country right now is that when government, municipalities etc etc take 10 steps back, then not much is said, and if you talk about it you are labelled a pessimist. But then if 1 step is taken forward, everyone talks about the great changes that are occurring. In the long run, everything is deteriorating.

I think you mean that this is the problem with the forum, and I agree 100%!!!

I don't think it's a coincidence that the forum is dead these days, it's because 90% of the news is very negative, but when the odd positive story comes by it's treated as though it trumps all the other negative stories, which it obviously doesn't.

I find the problem in general in this country right now is that when government, municipalities etc etc take 10 steps back, then not much is said, and if you talk about it you are labelled a pessimist. But then if 1 step is taken forward, everyone talks about the great changes that are occurring. In the long run, everything is deteriorating.

Talking about it isn't the problem. Almost only/only talking about it is.


I don't think it's a coincidence that the forum is dead these days, it's because 90% of the news is very negative, but when the odd positive story comes by it's treated as though it trumps all the other negative stories, which it obviously doesn't.

And why is that bad? This is one of the few places on the internet where South Africans come together in a constructive manner without acting as if the sky is falling on our heads and share mostly positive news and information about the development of our country. Most joined the forum in the first place because it's an excellent resource for individual development-related information.

If I want negative discussion about the country, I have such a wide selection of other forums and websites across the internet because that's unfortunately the habit many of the "have's" for some reason fall into. The last thing I want to see when I log onto SSC is nonsense such as us needing to abandon the country by 2020, especially considering the current picture is looking far rosier compared the the past one or two years.

It's not a matter of burying one's head in the sand. Unfortunately that's pretty much impossible if you have anything resembling a social life. The amount of negative news one encounters between walking the streets to chatter in the workplace is disturbing, so forgive a few people wanting some sort of place to get away from all of that and actually hear something positive for once.

Talking about it isn't the problem. Almost only/only talking about it is.




And why is that bad? This is one of the few places on the internet where South Africans come together in a constructive manner without acting as if the sky is falling on our heads and share mostly positive news and information about the development of our country. Most joined the forum in the first place because it's an excellent resource for individual development-related information.

If I want negative discussion about the country, I have such a wide selection of other forums and websites across the internet because that's unfortunately the habit many of the "have's" for some reason fall into. The last thing I want to see when I log onto SSC is nonsense such as us needing to abandon the country by 2020, especially considering the current picture is looking far rosier compared the the past one or two years.

It's not a matter of burying one's head in the sand. Unfortunately that's pretty much impossible if you have anything resembling a social life. The amount of negative news one encounters between walking the streets to chatter in the workplace is disturbing, so forgive a few people wanting some sort of place to get away from all of that and actually hear something positive for one.

Yes but we need a balance. Sick of hearing how SSC is the place to come for positive news, and we shouldn't bring negative news here because it's what we hear on a daily basis in our normal lives blah blah. I'm not saying we mustn't post positive news, on the contrary we must post all of it. But it must be balanced with reality. News didn't just suddenly dry up in SA, it's still there but it's mostly bad things, hence why this forum is really quiet.

You ask why it's bad: it's bad because it's not real. One positive story does not trump 10 negative ones. Forgetting about the negative stories is what's dangerous. I think waltjie is spot on and if we don't start realising that SA is in a very bad place at the moment things are going to get worse. And yes, things are bad, no matter what you guys say - it's the reality. First we must accept it, get angry, mad, depressed, and then act on it. You can only measure the positive stories relative to the bad ones.

Case in point, you get every professional from the property developers to the market analysts to the rating agencies telling us the kind of financial shambles the Joburg metro is in, but then a statement on the joburg.gov.za website by some government official telling us there's no crisis and Nostra is prepared to give them the "benefit of the doubt". It's not real guys. It's not reality. Things are bad, they are worse than bad, and we must accept it.

Yes but we need a balance. Sick of hearing how SSC is the place to come for positive news, and we shouldn't bring negative news here because it's what we hear on a daily basis in our normal lives blah blah. I'm not saying we mustn't post positive news, on the contrary we must post all of it. But it must be balanced with reality. News didn't just suddenly dry up in SA, it's still there but it's mostly bad things, hence why this forum is really quiet.

You ask why it's bad: it's bad because it's not real. One positive story does not trump 10 negative ones. Forgetting about the negative stories is what's dangerous. I think waltjie is spot on and if we don't start realising that SA is in a very bad place at the moment things are going to get worse. And yes, things are bad, no matter what you guys say - it's the reality. First we must accept it, get angry, mad, depressed, and then act on it. You can only measure the positive stories relative to the bad ones.

PS. I'm also of the opinion that things will get a lot worse before they start getting better.

But surely if you're hoping to achieve some sort of balance you should contribute towards that balance? I think people have been getting annoyed because, apart from the odd mildly positive comment on a development or a sports result, you've posted little that hasn't been overly negative.

However, I disagree with you on your second paragraph. What exactly has happened that's suddenly put us in such a bad place? What is worse that it trumps the crap we've had to deal with over the past year or two? The likes of Julius have been dealt with, there are massive rifts within the ruling party and between it and its alliance partners, the recession is over - however slow the recovery may be, we have massive infrastructural investments on the horizon coming off the back of a national budget that received largely positive review, crime is dropping steadily but surely...I could go on.

Like I said - I'm at a complete loss as to what is so bad all of a sudden? Sure, some other fool is likely to rise in Julius' place, but you do realise that's likely to create even more of a split in the ruling party, right? Something that can only mean growth for the opposition.

I think I just find it funny, because I haven't felt this positive about our future since the World Cup.

Lets recap.

Some of us are overtly positive? Excuse me for not stating that NOTHING changed in JHB CBD since 2001 and that it is a shithole. Excuse me for not stating that ALL white people should leave the country immediately because it is a shithole that will implode soon. If that is people on this forum on a 'good' day, I don't want to be around for a bad one. I would much rather walk with the photowalkers, jog with the Nike crowd and invite fellow bibliophiles over to my apartment than sit an minge and moan online. Thats why this forum is dead. It is boring. There is nothing new here. What we find here in terms of discussion and attitude we might as well find on news24. I tried to convince Joburg (the poster) to rejoin us, but this is the main reason why he left. And sadly, it is the same reason why I am leaving.

Do you think Joburg is the only city in the world facing challenges? Our company recently did training, with our colleagues from Egypt, India, Brazil and Argentina. Everyone commented on what a great city Joburg is, and how surprized they are regarding how clean it is (Yes, Waltjie, we did the dreaded shithole of a dead CBD walk with them as well). They loved it. I was frustrated at times, mainly because many places of importance are not well-maintained (like Kliptown).

Open your eyes guys. Do you truly believe nothing changed in Joburg? Nothing? Not a thing? All is bad? Doom and gloom?

Joburg is alive. This forum is dead. Go to blogs like 2summers.net and storyofbing.com if you need to attack some other positive people (who are expats by the way). My one friend is from Russia, living in Brixton now, working in Newtown. She loves the city. I have many Norwegian friends. Guess what, they LOVE it. Granted, my one friend from Norway hates the Northern suburbs (but what rational human being can love Fourways and Sunninghill).

Tired of this crap. Tired of the moaning. If you are looking for me, I am on a photowalk in the CBD, Hillbrow, Diepsloot, Diepkloof, Orlando, Melville, Alex or any other place that seems interesting. Because this forum is certainly not interesting, rational, engaging or objective.

But surely if you're hoping to achieve some sort of balance you should contribute towards that balance? I think people have been getting annoyed because, apart from the odd mildly positive comment on a development or a sports result, you've posted little that hasn't been overly negative.

However, I disagree with you on your second paragraph. What exactly has happened that's suddenly put us in such a bad place? What is worse that it trumps the crap we've had to deal with over the past year or two? The likes of Julius have been dealt with, there are massive rifts within the ruling party and between it and its alliance partners, the recession is over - however slow the recovery may be, we have massive infrastructural investments on the horizon coming off the back of a national budget that received largely positive review, crime is dropping steadily but surely...I could go on.

Like I said - I'm at a complete loss as to what is so bad all of a sudden? Sure, some other fool is likely to rise in Julius' place, but you do realise that's likely to create even more of a split in the ruling party, right? Something that can only mean growth for the opposition.

I think I just find it funny, because I haven't felt this positive about our future since the World Cup.

Are you kidding? I practically spearheaded the Gautrain on these forums, defended it to its death - I even became an official public representative (representing THIS forum) for the Gautrain. I took a ride on the Rea Vaya from Ellis Park all the way to Thokoza for the sake of the forum. Let's not talk about chilling at Neighbourgoods on the weekend. Every single high rise and high density development in SA has been positively commented on by me. I'm sorry if there just aren't that many developments happening right now to post positively about. I recently had a long conversation over PM with a forum member travelling to Joburg telling him how not to be afraid to visit Joburg and what can be done to see here:

Hi ******

In short, no. If you stay away from the CBD and suburbs then you might as well not visit Joburg. Joburg is a dangerous city, as is San Francisco and New York.

If you remain street smart and don't do anything stupid, you should be fine! I've lived in Joburg for 22 years and have yet experienced anything serious.

Soccer City is technically in Soweto but it is outside the city proper. I'm not sure if the stadium has tours or not. I'm sure you can find this out on the net. Otherwise you can drive there and have a walk around, as many of my friends have done. Orlando Stadium is in a very vibrant area of Soweto. You can catch the Rea Vaya busses to the stadium - there is a station right outside:

This is if you don't mind travelling with the working class of Soweto, which is by all means safe - I have done it before. Orlando Stadium is located on a street with many bars, restaurants and hotels. Soccer City is basically in the middle of no where and doesn't have much around it, so i wouldn't technically call it a 'bad area'.

Hope that answers some of your questions

I would like to tell you to read the Sunday Times where the head of WBHO was interviewed where he said he seriously wonders if the government's promise this time of infrastructure will be like the last promise - empty with no fruition and leaving the construction industry on the brink of collapse. But I might be called a "news24 troll" and scare more forumers away (sorry Jakes).

Ok. Closing arguments from everyone and then let's move on.

Are you kidding? I practically spearheaded the Gautrain on these forums, defended it to its death - I even became an official public representative (representing THIS forum) for the Gautrain. I took a ride on the Rea Vaya from Ellis Park all the way to Thokoza for the sake of the forum. Let's not talk about chilling at Neighbourgoods on the weekend. Every single high rise and high density development in SA has been positively commented on by me. I'm sorry if there just aren't that many developments happening right now to post positively about.

I would like to tell you to read the Sunday Times where the head of WBHO was interviewed where he said he seriously wonders if the government's promise this time of infrastructure will be like the last promise - empty with no fruition and leaving the construction industry on the brink of collapse. But I might be called a "news24 troll" and scare more forumers away (sorry Jakes).

Ok. Closing arguments from everyone and then let's move on.

I was referring to the notable increase lately, as opposed to the past.

But yes, clearly we all need to agree to disagree.

Ok. Closing arguments from everyone and then let's move on.

Thank you Inertia.

My 'closing' argument then, is this... I'm certainly not saying that Johannesburg is 'unique' as a city with problems, not at all, but it IS a shithole. Walking from Newtown up Main Street to the Carlton Centre and back taking pictures without getting mugged is not a miracle... FFS it is our RIGHT! But please, don't pretend that being able to do that makes Johannesburg a safe place and come with bullsh&t about it having turned itself around. Go walk around in Bertrams, Berea, Yeoville, Hillbrow... go at night-time whilst you're at it and THEN come back and report on how fantastic it is. I couldn't care less about a place like Neighbourhood Market or whatever it is called... The only reason why it is 'working' is because it is the "in" thing to do. For heaven's sake, it is a bloody tourist attraction, and I am sure that half the people who go there from the north say a silent Thank You when they make it out alive afterwards. So there are foreigners who think the city is great... Good for them. You know what, in downtown Joburg there are 100's of 1000's of them, although they are illegal foreigners. The problems are endless and getting worse by the day. So the city makes an effort to sort out their financial issues, and everyone goes "hooray" like it's a major achievement... No! They weren't supposed to f_ck it up in the first place! You don't deserve praise for fixing your own mess at someone else's expense, you deserve praise for making something better than it was in the first place. If you cover a heap of crap with paint, it's just a painted heap of crap. Nothing more. So you install some arty street furniture on the pavements, you put up some mural of mosaic, you install fairy lights to make some tree light up at night, you do whatever... it doesn't solve any of the underlying problems. We all know what the major problem(s) is/are in the country, but nobody dare say it out loud. "World Class City" my ass... R30bn spent on the Gautrain and it fails... Why? Because nobody suspected that it's Achilles Heel ie the bus drivers will bring it to it's knees. Fabulous airport... but baggage gets stolen and broken into for almost a decade already... Why? Because you cannot trust a freaking baggage handler to do his job. SAA has won the award again of Best African Airline... whoo hoo! Hallo! They are again asking for a R6bn bail-out... The list goes on and on and on...

One step forward for every ten steps back is just not good enough, and building any amount of glass-clad towers in Sandton ain't gonna change a damn thing...

And this doesn't just apply to Johannesburg. It goes for every city in this country.

Go to Youtube and watch the series called "Stayin' Alive in Joburg" - it's a 6 episode documentary made by a resident from Joburg and shows you the REAL Johannesburg.

...So, on to the 'positive' developments now... I hear the Constitutional Court is under threat...

Joburg should never have got in this mess in the first place, Waltjie, I agree. I saw the article on how they were supposedly getting the finances back in order, but didn't post it because they didn't deserve it...BUT, we hope it shows that they are on their way back up.
It doesn't mean all us 'positive' formers think that everything is just dandy in Joburg now!

And it's more like every bad news story spells widespread doom and gloom or even the end of the country.

Inertia started this 'discussion' up with some ridiculous comments, including that he thinks the 'sensible' thing to do is for all skilled people to leave the country! Now, really, that is just an outright dumbass comment - and he then said he stood by it.
And now he is telling us all to put in our 'closing arguments'!

I am with Lydon in that I feel more positive right now (as in the last 3-4 months) - there are a lot of positives.
A few months ago, the end was nigh because Malema was running around with racist comments and calling for nationalization - remember?
It was all ANYONE could talk about, our biggest challenge by a mile!

And now? Well, now he has been roundly condemned, stood down, disciplined and embarrassed - he is off the news wires, and nationalization is off the table.
Surely you must agree that that, for example, is good news!

And saying the Gautrain has 'failed' is again going over the top! It has the seepage problem which I think has been its major setback in this period, because it is running at less than half it's potential. And the bus links and other transport links were never there to start with, and always going to be a difficult proposition with the taxi industry etc.

And whilst it is struggling right now - I am certain that when they finally complete the friggin line, and the tolls come in, and the system beds down, it will be a success of note.

What happened to Pule, Kulani and african biohazard? These people always made the joburg section interesting.

Well Diggerdog if it was such an insensible thing to do I wonder why such a huge number of people did it - some may even say the majority of the skilled population has already left... It might be dumb to you but honestly your opinion doesn't mean much in the grander scheme of things - people have their reasons and I can guarantee you some of the most intelligent and productive people I know decided to make a move, but I'm sure they're just dumbass billionaires taking their money elsewhere.

Anyway thanks for the discussions guys, most interesting the forum's been in a while :)

LADEN, they probably emigrated :lol: <-- that's a joke, don't leave the forum guys

I hang my head in shame. This forum has gone to the dogs. Waltjie, what can I say... Eish man. Eish. Im off.

Well Diggerdog if it was such an insensible thing to do I wonder why such a huge number of people did it - some may even say the majority of the skilled population has already left... It might be dumb to you but honestly your opinion doesn't mean much in the grander scheme of things - people have their reasons and I can guarantee you some of the most intelligent and productive people I know decided to make a move, but I'm sure they're just dumbass billionaires taking their money elsewhere.

Anyway thanks for the discussions guys, most interesting the forum's been in a while :)

LADEN, they probably emigrated :lol: <-- that's a joke, don't leave the forum guys


I said YOUR comment was dumb - and it is and was, which is why you have been trying to qualify it!
We know the history Inertia, we know people with skills left, we a
know people with skills have been returning in the last 3 years.

You said the sensible thing to do would be to leave the country - and not just you, but ALL skilled people!

This forum is mostly about developments, construction, tall buildings, shiny trains and new shopping centers, and the rest.
So advocating everyone leave the freakin country is a bit ridiculous.

Let's see what happens in the coming year - if the Gautrain comes right and Joburg recovers, if unemployment comes down and crime decreases.
I feel strongly that this will occur, you think directly the opposite.

Well, you are right in one thing, this discussion appears over.

The problem with this forum is that negative topics receive much attention than what SSC is intended for and I dont have time to entertain such. Any of you Joburgers who mushroom only for such topics ever seen this thread, http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=1154611&page=6

There are more interesting developments taking place in Sandton which can be entertained when all contributes the way they supposed to and leave politics to those that know them best.

This whole discussion is a perfect example of the problem with South Africa and the world in general... Just profound negativity, notwithstanding all the good in the world.

Some of you don't know me, others do, but I've been around SSC for many years, contributed when I can, raised my opinion when I felt it was necessary. So I believe I am reasonably qualified to raise an issue. And that is, one thing which has made me bitter toward South African's, and especially the middle- and upper-class in this country, it's this absurd negativity about the state of the country and where it's going.

Since I was involved with SSC, I have lived in Polokwane, Pretoria and I now live in Joburg. In those years, I have experienced all three these cities in detail - the suburbs, the CBDs, the office life, the night life, the rural areas, everything. And not only by myself, but with many other people, both locals and foreigners. Students, businessmen, random people I had a drink with.

The one thing that always struck me as the truth and the heart of this country is this - We are a country of fighters, we want to be better, and we're slowly clawing our way there. This is indisputable. We have an economy which is growing. It might be slower than we would like, but it's happening. We're getting foreign investment - not as quick as everyone would like, but it's happening. Hell, even the political environment is changing. Slowly but surely, it's all changing. And this is doubly true for the cities, and especially joburg.

Yes, the CBD is not perfect. But it's still a magical place, if one only gets of the high, privileged horse that ALL of us on SSC occupy, and actually appreciate it for what it is - home and workplace for thousands, probably millions of people. I have spent many days in that CBD, and also the Pretoria CBD. There is a lot wrong with both, but the undeniable truth is still that it is changing, for the better.

There are many neglected areas in Joburg. But can anyone expect the city to become a perfect example of city life in a decade or two, if one considers all the other societal and economical problems this country and the world has had to face? It's simply not possible.

Yes, there is the constant problem with crime. But that's a problem in New York, Paris and London as well. The REASON for that crime should be considered, and it is simply a question of employment - which is slowly but surely being addressed. I would be the first one to say that our government has a lot to do there, but it's a damn big problem in every country in the world, and it's a really tough issue to fix. I'm not going to get into a debate about 'how', but the point is that South Africa's problems will not be fixed by simply applying logic and ideas which were successful in a different country. No problem can simply be fixed by copying and pasting. But I'll leave that there.

If one looks at Joburg objectively (and at Pretoria, Cape Town, and every other major city in SA), the fact is that stuff is happening. People are building, roads are built, old buildings are renovated or replaced, and quality of life is improving. Anyone who says otherwise is so blinded but statistics and negativity, that I simply have no answer to it.

I have a friend, who was born in Zimbabwe, studied with me in Pretoria, lived in New York, Geneva, The Hague and Berlin subsequent to that, and who recently moved to Joburg - The one thing that I can always expect to hear from her is, wow, how amazing is this country and these cities.

Consider this. Every single one of us posting on SSC, who live in SA, probably owns a car. Possibly even two, or more in some cases. We all have homes, some rent, some own that home. That home, in most examples, probably has a garden, maybe even a pool (show me the proportion of people in Europe who will EVER own a house with a garden, nevermind a pool!). We shop at some incredible clothing and home stores, buy some of the best quality groceries compared to anywhere in the world. We wear expensive watches, call each other on smartphones with some of the best mobile networks anywhere, play with our iPads - and then we STILL bitch and moan about the state of our lives and our country whilst sipping whisky or wine, in front of our full HD tv's on our full-grain leather couches, with our friends and family surrounding us.

THAT is the true state of this country. We are alive, we are doing well, and we have NO real reason to complain. I honestly don't think we, the people from SA who post on SSC, have a right to complain, because our lives are perfect compared to the 25% of people in this country who don't even have jobs.

Every country has problems. Moaning about it never fixed anything. If something is bothering you, or you witness something which is wrong, or you notice something which is broken, REPORT IT to someone who can do something about it, or do it yourself. But stop blindly bitching about how bad things are here, or grabbing hold of every piece of negative press and proclaiming that to be the end of all things. We have an incredible country, filled with even more incredible people, and we are certainly not on the way to doom.

Just be proud for once. There's more than enough reason for that if you open your eyes.

This whole discussion is a perfect example of the problem with South Africa and the world in general... Just profound negativity, notwithstanding all the good in the world.

Some of you don't know me, others do, but I've been around SSC for many years, contributed when I can, raised my opinion when I felt it was necessary. So I believe I am reasonably qualified to raise an issue. And that is, one thing which has made me bitter toward South African's, and especially the middle- and upper-class in this country, it's this absurd negativity about the state of the country and where it's going.

Since I was involved with SSC, I have lived in Polokwane, Pretoria and I now live in Joburg. In those years, I have experienced all three these cities in detail - the suburbs, the CBDs, the office life, the night life, the rural areas, everything. And not only by myself, but with many other people, both locals and foreigners. Students, businessmen, random people I had a drink with.

The one thing that always struck me as the truth and the heart of this country is this - We are a country of fighters, we want to be better, and we're slowly clawing our way there. This is indisputable. We have an economy which is growing. It might be slower than we would like, but it's happening. We're getting foreign investment - not as quick as everyone would like, but it's happening. Hell, even the political environment is changing. Slowly but surely, it's all changing. And this is doubly true for the cities, and especially joburg.

Yes, the CBD is not perfect. But it's still a magical place, if one only gets of the high, privileged horse that ALL of us on SSC occupy, and actually appreciate it for what it is - home and workplace for thousands, probably millions of people. I have spent many days in that CBD, and also the Pretoria CBD. There is a lot wrong with both, but the undeniable truth is still that it is changing, for the better.

There are many neglected areas in Joburg. But can anyone expect the city to become a perfect example of city life in a decade or two, if one considers all the other societal and economical problems this country and the world has had to face? It's simply not possible.

Yes, there is the constant problem with crime. But that's a problem in New York, Paris and London as well. The REASON for that crime should be considered, and it is simply a question of employment - which is slowly but surely being addressed. I would be the first one to say that our government has a lot to do there, but it's a damn big problem in every country in the world, and it's a really tough issue to fix. I'm not going to get into a debate about 'how', but the point is that South Africa's problems will not be fixed by simply applying logic and ideas which were successful in a different country. No problem can simply be fixed by copying and pasting. But I'll leave that there.

If one looks at Joburg objectively (and at Pretoria, Cape Town, and every other major city in SA), the fact is that stuff is happening. People are building, roads are built, old buildings are renovated or replaced, and quality of life is improving. Anyone who says otherwise is so blinded but statistics and negativity, that I simply have no answer to it.

I have a friend, who was born in Zimbabwe, studied with me in Pretoria, lived in New York, Geneva, The Hague and Berlin subsequent to that, and who recently moved to Joburg - The one thing that I can always expect to hear from her is, wow, how amazing is this country and these cities.

Consider this. Every single one of us posting on SSC, who live in SA, probably owns a car. Possibly even two, or more in some cases. We all have homes, some rent, some own that home. That home, in most examples, probably has a garden, maybe even a pool (show me the proportion of people in Europe who will EVER own a house with a garden, nevermind a pool!). We shop at some incredible clothing and home stores, buy some of the best quality groceries compared to anywhere in the world. We wear expensive watches, call each other on smartphones with some of the best mobile networks anywhere, play with our iPads - and then we STILL bitch and moan about the state of our lives and our country whilst sipping whisky or wine, in front of our full HD tv's on our full-grain leather couches, with our friends and family surrounding us.

THAT is the true state of this country. We are alive, we are doing well, and we have NO real reason to complain. I honestly don't think we, the people from SA who post on SSC, have a right to complain, because our lives are perfect compared to the 25% of people in this country who don't even have jobs.

Every country has problems. Moaning about it never fixed anything. If something is bothering you, or you witness something which is wrong, or you notice something which is broken, REPORT IT to someone who can do something about it, or do it yourself. But stop blindly bitching about how bad things are here, or grabbing hold of every piece of negative press and proclaiming that to be the end of all things. We have an incredible country, filled with even more incredible people, and we are certainly not on the way to doom.

Just be proud for once. There's more than enough reason for that if you open your eyes.

:applause:

Consider this. Every single one of us posting on SSC, who live in SA, probably owns a car. Possibly even two, or more in some cases. We all have homes, some rent, some own that home. That home, in most examples, probably has a garden, maybe even a pool (show me the proportion of people in Europe who will EVER own a house with a garden, nevermind a pool!). We shop at some incredible clothing and home stores, buy some of the best quality groceries compared to anywhere in the world. We wear expensive watches, call each other on smartphones with some of the best mobile networks anywhere, play with our iPads - and then we STILL bitch and moan about the state of our lives and our country whilst sipping whisky or wine, in front of our full HD tv's on our full-grain leather couches, with our friends and family surrounding us.

THAT is the true state of this country. We are alive, we are doing well, and we have NO real reason to complain. I honestly don't think we, the people from SA who post on SSC, have a right to complain, because our lives are perfect compared to the 25% of people in this country who don't even have jobs.

Every country has problems. Moaning about it never fixed anything. If something is bothering you, or you witness something which is wrong, or you notice something which is broken, REPORT IT to someone who can do something about it, or do it yourself. But stop blindly bitching about how bad things are here, or grabbing hold of every piece of negative press and proclaiming that to be the end of all things. We have an incredible country, filled with even more incredible people, and we are certainly not on the way to doom.

Just be proud for once. There's more than enough reason for that if you open your eyes.

^^ Totally agree.

WOW, Rib...that's a comment and a half.

.....i totally agree with Rib!........but i think we sometimes forget that there are some people who have no lives........SSC is their lives and when they say something negative about South Africa, the ANC or Mbeki on SSC, it makes them feel better and superior......on the other hand those of us who have children don't see South Africa as a doomed negative place some of these people see it........our children make us see South Africa from a rose colored glasses.......i use to contribute a lot, but sometimes the negativity and snobbish comments just turns me off from this forum.......like Rib, i started following SSC when my kids were just 7 and 8 years old before i joined ......and now they are 12 and 13 years old.......they are two very happy and handsome young men living and breathing in South Africa.......they don't care if Cape Town is run by the ANC or the DA.......and whenever we travel around South Africa, we don't visit a "DA" or "ANC" city or park......i grew up in a negative and intolerant South Africa........i am glad we have a different country today.........but if someone wonder why i keep coming back to this SSC forum despite all the negativity?....... the answer is simple: there are people like my brother Pule and Mo Rush who continue to do an amazing job on this SSC......and thats what keeps bringing me back time and again......

The building wrapped with a Jonnly Walker wrap has been demolished and there's gazillion construction vehicles going in and out. Any one with any info?

There's an approved right to contruct a builidng of 50 00 sqm on that site. This site is separated by a fence with the new Alexander Forbes building.

http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7053/6989741143_124d3ffaf5_b.jpg

^^ the demolished building is visible from the bottom left corner of this photo.

http://www.kgorocentral.co.za/content/wp-content/uploads/2011/11/Construction-Progress-1.jpg

Guys, I was driving pass Graston Drive ther other day and saw a rennder for what seem to be an almost 20 story plus development on one of these 2 buildings. Anyone with any info?

http://www2.picturepush.com/photo/a/7937020/img/7937020.bmp

^^ Just a concept redevelopment but no tenant to justify building to start.

Thanks buddy, wish all these developments gets tenants soon.

Surely there must be a better place for those Mercedes metered taxis to park instead of outside the JSE.
Who ever uses those rip offs any way?
They should have allowed for a small rank outside the Gautrain station instead, and those prices should be regulated.R200 for a one way ride from Sandton to Rosebank is a complete rip-off even with the current petrol price.

Mate they took you for a fool: it is R150 to Parkhurst from Sandton so R200 from Sandton to Rosebank is certainly NOT the normal fare.

What I don't understand is how none of these taxi's have meters. They are called 'metered' taxis. I only use ones with meters and it usually comes to under half the price that I originally got quoted. Having said that the ones with meters are rare

Took a drive through Sandton and noticed two prominent buildings being demolished. The one is the building next to Investec with a billboard of a semi-high-rise infront of it. The other is a building which is on the corner of Sandton Drive and Alice Lane, right infront of Norton Rose.

saw both today. One next to invested is by Redefine and around 12-14F with 5F being demolished to accommodate it. Quite radical design and we need to show a pic.

One behind Norton rose is being demoed old school from the top with bobcat and mini breaker.Might be simply adding floors as don't see them attacking the structure.Been asking by no one knows.