Actually, those "participants" are just observers

21st century warfare is very predictable and high amount of men power is not needed as the jobs can be done by robots and the powerful toys :cool:

Not necessarily. Toys are one thing, strategies are another.

how are you going to defend yourself unless you have a strong navy? considering it philipine is an island nation.



japanese troops couldn't have landed on the philipine soil if you had a comparable navy. (like how the royal navy blockaged the english channel and defeated the nazi uboats and luftwaffe which couldn't have achieved air supremacy over the raf, as a result the germany troops couldn't have set their feet on the british soil)

again being an island nation is an advantage and the enemies have only two option in order to invade/occupy phipine, 1. by sea, 2 by air. if you are strong in these two aspects the success is guaranteed and you'll be able to deal with all the threats and defend yourself from others attacks. :)

Agree. Let's look at what happened before Operation Sea Lion was canceled. Great Britain did not have a strong army. Their main weapons were the Royal Air Force and the Royal Navy which at that time dominated the sea. That is quite the reason why they allied themselves with the French who had a superior ground force. They are an island nation. First things first, you cannot invade an island nation without landing your troops on any of the islands. And you can never do so unless you gain aerial and naval supremacy over the enemy's territory. What kept Britain from being knocked off the war was by preventing the Germans from gaining supremacy over its airspace making any landing or even dropping of paratroops impossible. The Home Fleet alone can cripple the Kriegsmarine from deploying Wermacht troops inland from the northern French coast.

If the Philippines is ever invaded, the very first and the most decisive battles would be fought in the air and in the sea. There is no need to expand much the army, just modernize it and make it more accustomed to jungle fighting. Make our terrain an advantage.

It is also one reason why I reject the idea of having Sabah because we are just exposing ourselves to having a land border with Malaysia and Indonesia. It is quite a financial burden to fence up a border crossing and stationing troops to monitor illegal immigrants.

I must admit though that being an island nation is both an advantage and a disadvantage. Which in this case is an advantage that really helps a lot.

With what's happening now, we should adopt the foreign policy of England since the 1600's. This to ensure that we have our independence politically, economically and militarily.

Agree on the Strong Navy and Strong Air Force theory. We are not just an island nation like a single British isle or Japanese isle, we are an archipelago of 7107 islands with a lotta blue sea in between. All the more reason for a stronger Navy and Coast Guard. These days, in addition to the Navy and Air Force, there are also missiles and drones that can be used to hit the enemy.

Our ancient austronesian forefathers mastered their environments which allowed them to colonize all the islands of the South Seas from Madagascar to Easter Island. ;) If they can do it with primitive technology, why not we with modern? The sea protected them and also gave them food.

^ i think you're underestimating the strength and capability of the modern warships :nuts:

an advanced warship alone is capable to defend pretty much the entire airspace and able to deal with all the incoming threats

you don't need plenty of ships to be based at every harbour and little island though. :mad2:

Agree on the Strong Navy and Strong Air Force theory. We are not just an island nation like a single British isle or Japanese isle, we are an archipelago of 7107 islands with a lotta blue sea in between. All the more reason for a stronger Navy and Coast Guard. These days, in addition to the Navy and Air Force, there are also missiles and drones that can be used to hit the enemy.

Our ancient austronesian forefathers mastered their environments which allowed them to colonize all the islands of the South Seas from Madagascar to Easter Island. ;) If they can do it with primitive technology, why not we with modern? The sea protected them and also gave them food.

Britain is also part of the British Isles. It's an archipelago too. Not just one island. They have northern Ireland and the Isle of Man.:)

Britain is also part of the British Isles. It's an archipelago too. Not just one island. They have northern Ireland and the Isle of Man.:)

uk has more islands to defend, not only home water/land but also the rest of oversea territories (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_Overseas_Territories) as well. and they also have to send in their subs and frigates to many parts of the world according to the annual schedules of the oversea deployment. i am sure philipine isles would be highly defended if had about 6 units of type 45 destroyers based in different parts of the regions like in the map below :lol: no single enemy aircraft would be allowed to fly near to the philipine airspace, all the incoming missiles and even the chinese nuclear missiles would be shot down :guns1:

http://i.imgur.com/fE9c3.jpg

With what's happening now, we should adopt the foreign policy of England since the 1600's. This to ensure that we have our independence politically, economically and militarily.

Ok as long as it's Churchill and not Chamberlain...:uh:


Chamberlain and Hitler 1938 (http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/education/lesson31.htm)

...At Munich, Chamberlain got an international agreement that Hitler should have the Sudetenland in exchange for Germany making no further demands for land in Europe. Chamberlain said it was 'Peace in our time'. Hitler said he had 'No more territorial demands to make in Europe.' On 1 October German troops occupied the Sudetenland: Hitler had got what he wanted without firing a shot. ...

^^ With that, we will need a large Home Fleet to defend the islands. Also do not forget our 'unsinkable aircraft carriers. We can launch aircraft from the south to intercept incoming Chinese planes. We also need submarines to sink enemy transport ships. We don't need those white elephant aircraft carriers as our main goal is only for defense. We have many unsinkable aircraft carriers, 7,107 of them actually. ;)

We just need to strategically position anti-air and ballistic missiles in important areas of the country to help shoot down incoming missiles and aircraft. We have a larger chance of standing our ground if we have a strong home fleet as supplies would now come form vital life-lines from the United States where we expect most of the aid would come from if war breaks out.

Ironically, the Philippines and Great Britain have been guarding US' flanks against threats from both the east and in the west. We, above others must receive more support if they are to maintain their status as a pacific power. They say, the Philippines is the key to Asia, and indeed it is. We on our side must not forget the sacrifices of our forefathers and stop aggressors from trampling our heritage and our national pride. We should fight them in the air, in the sea and in the land.

Ok as long as it's Churchill and not Chamberlain...:uh:

Chamberlain just did what he thinks is appropriate. Indeed the Western powers were still exhausted from the first great war and are in no mood to challenge Hitler. Appeasement of the German dictator was their only option. Until December of 1939 after the fall of Danzig.

But I really applaud Sir. Winston Churchil for keeping England afloat despite the odds. The British are a hardy people indeed.

The key is, 'balance of power', that is what England has been struggling to maintain since its emergence as an empire. From siding with Prussia to the Franco-British Alliance. Lady Britannia is an example for us, an island nation like them. :cheers:

We just need to strategically position anti-air and ballistic missiles in important areas of the country to help shoot down incoming missiles and aircraft.

i didn't know philippine had these babies :runaway: :D

^^ I didn't know we had destroyers either and a large home fleet. I was just saying what we ought have in the defense of the country. LOL! :lol:

We have lots of "baby rockets" in the philippines. They are locally made.

^^ With that, we will need a large Home Fleet to defend the islands. Also do not forget our 'unsinkable aircraft carriers. We can launch aircraft from the south to intercept incoming Chinese planes. We also need submarines to sink enemy transport ships. We don't need those white elephant aircraft carriers as our main goal is only for defense. We have many unsinkable aircraft carriers, 7,107 of them actually. ;)

We just need to strategically position anti-air and ballistic missiles in important areas of the country to help shoot down incoming missiles and aircraft. We have a larger chance of standing our ground if we have a strong home fleet as supplies would now come form vital life-lines from the United States where we expect most of the aid would come from if war breaks out.

Ironically, the Philippines and Great Britain have been guarding US' flanks against threats from both the east and in the west. We, above others must receive more support if they are to maintain their status as a pacific power. They say, the Philippines is the key to Asia, and indeed it is. We on our side must not forget the sacrifices of our forefathers and stop aggressors from trampling our heritage and our national pride. We should fight them in the air, in the sea and in the land.


If only we could move our islands lime in that pure map. Seriously :lol:

Life is shitty if your neighbors with china. Youd even fight with them for a piece of rock anchored in the ocean :lol:

Just wanna raise again the pending SOVFA

Wikileaks: Aussies junk bases in RP
By Michaela P. del Callar

05/01/2011

Australia has no plans of establishing military bases in the Philippines amid public fears that the signing of an expanded defense agreement with Manila would pave the way for a permanent Australian armed forces presence in the country, a 2007 confidential diplomatic cable released by on-line whistle-blower Wikileaks said.

The cable submitted to the State Department by former US Ambassador to the Philippines, Kristie Kenny, dated June 1, 2007, said Australia has vowed to support the country’s counter-terrorism efforts, particularly in the restive Southern Philippine region of Mindanao, as well as help it combat transnational crimes.

During the state visit of former President Gloria Arroyo to Australia on May 30 to 31, 2007, Canberra likewise stressed that it will not assume any combat role in the Philippines nor build bases under the Status of Visiting Forces Agreement (SOVFA).

“The two sides emphasized their counter-terrorism partnership, especially in Mindanao and against transnational terrorism, but underscored that there would be no Australian bases in the Philippines, nor would Australian troops undertake combat operations,” according to one of the series of cables from the US Embassy in Manila obtained by Wikileaks and released only last Thursday.

Arroyo and former Australian Prime Minister John Howard witnessed the signing of the bilateral defense pact during the state visit at the Parliament House in Canberra.

Kenney believed at that time that the ratification of the SOVFA by the Philippine Senate “promises to be a contentious affair, as the new Senate will likely be dominated by foes of the Arroyo administration, with eyes on the presidential elections in 2010.”

Moreover, Kenney noted in the cable that the absence on the scene of Secretary Avelino Cruz, who resigned as Arroyo’s defense chief, may have weakened “in the short run” the former administration’s ability to persuade the new Senate to go along with SOVFA.

Kenney described Cruz as a “champion” of the agreement.

But under the new government of President Aquino and four years since it was signed, the SOVFA has yet to come into effect as it needs to undergo ratification by the Philippine Senate.

The SOVFA is seen to enhance defense and counter-terrorism capabilities of both countries, aside from the conduct of education and training, capacity-building, and humanitarian and disaster/relief assistance.

Under the agreement, the Australian government also pledged to provide grants for military training in order to upgrade the capability of the Filipino soldiers.

Aside from Australia, the Philippines has a similar agreement with the United States, called the Visiting Forces Agreement (VFA) which was ratified in 1999.

However, the SOVFA is seen as a “better” accord than the VFA as it has more legal and constitutional safeguards.

Australian diplomats in Manila, according to Kenney’s report, confirmed that the SOVFA “will enable Philippine authorities to gain custody over Australian soldiers accused of crimes outside their official duties (as long as the alleged offense would also be a crime in Australia) and that detention and any eventual imprisonment would be on Philippine soil, unlike the terms of the VFA.”

There are also reciprocal provisions for Philippine troops who commit crimes in Australia, it added.

In December 2006, an American Marine, who was in the country for joint military exercises under the VFA, was charged for raping a Filipina at the former US military base of Subic Bay in Olongapo City, Zambales. Initially held in a Manila jail, the American was spirited out of the Makati City Jail by authorties in the dead of the night, and quickly turned over to the US Embassy in Manila, where he was placed under custody, while awaiting the outcome of his court appeal to the dismay of several Philippine lawmakers and activists.

Three years after, the woman, believed to have been offered a green card and at least $100,000 by the US government, recanted her statement and quietly left for the US, after which the Court of Appeals junked an earlier decision of the lower court convicting the American soldier of rape.

http://www.tribuneonline.org/headlines/20110501hed4.html

Here is the ideal map and location of the Philippines :lol:

http://i.imgur.com/7BTuG.jpg

Don't you love it? Away from the big bad China. Only that, we have to be beware of the "pink tide" :lol:

imagine if these babies belong to philpines :popcorn: :shocked:

http://www.doobybrain.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/02/davis-monthan-air-force-base-planes.jpg


:drool: :drool: :drool: :drool:

http://www.google-earth.es/index.php?name=Forums&file=download&id=33052



Here is the ideal map and location of the Philippines :lol:

Don't you love it? Away from the big bad China. Only that, we have to be beware of the "pink tide" :lol:

the location between north america and europe is safer, i think you should relocate philipine in the north atlantic ocean :banana:

^^ Nah! It's better to be closer to our Latin American cousins. :)

where? :? south atlantic ocean? watch out for the falkslands war game and the royal navy submarines down there :uh:

I redid it. I feel bad for leaving East Timor :lol:

http://img838.imageshack.us/img838/5347/7btug1.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/838/7btug1.jpg/)

Uploaded with ImageShack.us (http://imageshack.us)

it's really not that far from latin america. Imagine being able to travel to North America, Europe, Latin America at shorter distance! :lol: We could perhaps discover Africa, too

PHL rejects China’s historical claim to Panatag Shoal (http://www.gmanetwork.com/news/story/255403/news/nation/phl-rejects-chinas-historical-claim-to-panatag-shoal)

The Philippines on Wednesday rejected China’s historical claim to the disputed Panatag Shoal, where Philippine and Chinese vessels have been engaged in a standoff since April 8.

In a position paper released to the media, the Philippine Department of Foreign Affairs said China cannot use a historical claim as the basis for owning the shoal, since “a mere showing of long usage is not enough” to acquire a territory.

“Chinese assertion based on historical claims must be substantiated by a clear historic title… A claim by itself, including historical claim, could not be a basis for acquiring a territory,” the DFA said.

The DFA statement added that China’s claim of Panatag Shoal as part of its “traditional fishing waters” does not give it sovereignty over the disputed territory.

“Fishing rights are not a mode of acquiring sovereignty. Neither could it be construed that the act of fishing by Chinese fishermen is a sovereign act of a State, nor can be considered as a display of State authority,” the position paper read.

Last April 8, the Philippine Navy caught eight Chinese vessels with a haul of various marine species in the vicinity of Panatag Shoal. Before Philippine authorities on board BRP Gregorio del Pilar could arrest the fishermen, two Chinese maritime vessels blocked the navy ship’s path.

The Chinese fishing boats were able to leave the area undetected with their catch during the standoff.

A triangle of small islands in the West Philippine Sea surrounding a 150-square-kilometer lagoon, the Panatag Shoal is part of the Philippines’ 200-nautical-mile exclusive economic zone under the United Nations Convention on the Law of the Sea (UNCLOS).

The Philippines and China are signatories to the UNCLOS, but Beijing is insisting that China owns the shoal on the grounds that it was supposedly first discovered by the Chinese during the Yuan dynasty in the 13th century.

‘Regimes of the islands’

In its position paper, the DFA cited Panatag Shoal–officially identified as “Bajo de Masinloc” under Philippine laws–as part of Philippine territory, because the country exercised “effective jurisdiction” over the shoal since its independence.

The legal name showed the shoal as an appendage to Masinloc town in Zambales province.

As early as 1734, maps drafted by the Spanish friar Pedro Murillo Velarde showed the shoal as part of Zambales, according to the DFA.

A map published by the US Coast and Geodetic Survey in 1990 also showed the shoal as part of Philippine territory, it added.

The Philippine Baselines Law (Republic Act 9522) identified Bajo de Masinloc as part of the “regimes of the islands,” the DFA said.

DFA Secretary Albert del Rosario on Tuesday said Manila plans to elevate the dispute over Panatag Shoal to the International Tribunal on the Law of the Sea (ITLOS). —Andreo Calonzo/VS/HS, GMA News

xBDZdDRBPoc

Panatag shoal, now Bajo de Masinloc (lower Masinloc?)

2 new fishing vessels in the area.

DND: China bullying Phl (http://www.philstar.com/Article.aspx?articleId=798445&publicationSubCategoryId=63)

MANILA, Philippines - “How can an ant bully an elephant?”

This was how Defense Secretary Voltaire Gazmin reacted to China’s claim that Filipino sailors had harassed Chinese fishermen in Scarborough Shoal, which the Philippines calls Panatag Shoal.

In a phone patch interview with defense reporters, Gazmin said Filipinos should make it known that it’s the Philippines that is being bullied by China.

“The people should know that what the government is doing is for the benefit of each Filipino. The people should help so the world would know that we are being bullied,” Gazmin said. “We should instill in the people the need to love our country by supporting the government’s stand right now against China.”

Navy chief Vice Adm. Alexander Pama said that while his men are on alert, he hopes the standoff in Scarborough will end peacefully.

“The sooner (the standoff is resolved) the better,” he said in a separate interview.

On April 10, two Chinese surveillance ships prevented the crew of navy warship BRP Gregorio del Pilar from arresting Chinese fishermen found poaching in Scarborough Shoal.

The Del Pilar later withdrew and was replaced by the smaller and lightly armed coast guard vessel BRP Pampanga.

The Chinese maritime ships are still in the vicinity. The Chinese fishing boats were able to leave the area with their illegal harvest of corals, giant clams, and live sharks.

Panatag Shoal is only 124 nautical miles from Zambales and is well within the Philippines’ 200-nautical mile exclusive economic zone (EEZ) based on the United Nations Convention on the Law of the Sea (UNCLOS), to which China is a signatory.

Meanwhile, the Department of Foreign Affairs (DFA) argued that Panatag Shoal, originally called Bajo de Masinloc, is not among the disputed territories and is within the country’s 200-mile EEZ.

“In the case of Bajo de Masinloc, the Philippines has exercised both effective occupation and effective jurisdiction over (it) since its independence. The name Bajo de Masinloc (translated as ‘under Masinloc’) itself identifies the shoal as a particular political subdivision of the Philippine province of Zambales, known as Masinloc,” the DFA said in a report.

“Bajo de Masinloc is not an island. Bajo de Masinloc is also not part of the Spratlys. Obviously therefore, the rocks of Bajo de Masinloc are also within the 200-nautical mile EEZ and 200-nautical mile continental shelf of the Philippines,” the DFA said in the report.

One of the earliest known and most accurate maps of the area, Carta Hydrographical y Chorographica de Las Yslas Filipinas by Fr. Pedro Murillo Velarde, SJ, and published in 1734, included Bajo de Masinloc as part of Zambales.

In 1792, another map drawn by the Alejandro Malaspina expedition and published in 1808 in Madrid, Spain, also showed Bajo de Masinloc as part of Philippine territory. This map showed the route of the Malaspina expedition to and around the shoal. It was reproduced in the Atlas of the 1939 Philippine Census.

The Mapa General, Islas Filipinas, Observatorio de Manila published in 1990 by the US Coast and Geodetic Survey, also included Bajo de Masinloc as part of the Philippines. In 1965, the Philippines built and operated a small lighthouse in one of the islets in the Shoal.

In 1992, the Philippine Navy rehabilitated the lighthouse and reported it to the International Maritime Organization for publication in the List of Lights. Currently the lighthouse is not operational.

Bajo de Masinloc was also used as an impact range by Philippine and US naval forces stationed in Subic Bay in Zambales.

“Chinese assertion based on historical claims must be substantiated by a clear historic title. It should be noted that under public international law, historical claims are not historical titles. A claim by itself, including historical claim, could not be a basis for acquiring a territory,” the DFA said.

No dent on relations

Malacañang, for its part, said much has yet to be achieved in the negotiations on the dispute in the whole of the West Philippine Sea but that these should not affect other aspects of Philippines-China relations.

“The Philippines has long-standing and multifaceted relations with China, and there has been a lot of focus on the territorial dispute, and we will assert our rights there as China is expected to do the same, but we do view our relationship with China in the long-term and with many different aspects, and we are looking for ways for our two countries to be able to resolve this issue without it spilling into the other aspects of our relations with China,” Presidential Communications Development and Strategic Planning Office Secretary Ricky Carandang said in a press briefing.

“The good news is that both parties are talking and we’re both trying to find a way out of this that will save face for both parties without escalating tensions. The filing of protests of one side and the other is part of process of negotiations,” he said. “We’re hoping, we’re confident that this can be resolved in a way that does not escalate tensions any further.”

“It is under consideration,” Carandang said on reports that President Aquino is considering a new nominee for Philippine ambassador to China vice Domingo Lee, who has been bypassed by the Commission on Appointments.

Left hits China

It’s China and not the Philippines which should leave Panatag Shoal, Bayan Muna Rep. Teddy Casiño said yesterday.

“They entered our territory, fished in our waters and they should be the ones who should leave,” he said.

He made the statement in reaction to China’s demand that the Philippines abandon the disputed group of rock formations. The two sides are keeping their ships in the area.

Casiño and Bayan Muna colleague Neri Colmenares filed yesterday Resolution 2330 criticizing the latest Chinese incursion and asking China to leave the shoal.

The resolution also expresses the congressmen’s support for the government’s call for China to agree to resolve the conflict through the International Tribunal of the Law of the Sea (ITLOS).

“This matter is best settled between China and the Philippines through diplomatic means and using international conventions,” Casiño said.

He suggested that aside from bringing the dispute to the ITLOS, the government, including Congress, should also assert the 2002 Declaration on the Conduct of Parties in the South China Sea.

He said members of the Association of Southeast Asian Nations (ASEAN) and China signed the declaration to ease tensions in the region and to serve as the framework for future negotiations for resolving disputes.

Members of Bayan Muna are scheduled to picket the Chinese embassy today to protest against China’s incursions.

A militant group of fishermen, for its part, has expressed concern the US might take advantage of the issue to persuade the Aquino administration to allow greater US access to its former naval base in Subic.

In a statement, the Pambansang Lakas ng Kilusang Mamamalakaya ng Pilipinas (Pamalakaya) said the Panatag issue “is part of the calculated plan to convince the Filipino people to let the US government renegotiate for the control of the former American naval base in Subic.”

“In April last year, a high level US visit to Subic was led by US Senators Daniel Inouye and Thad Cochran and details of the visit were not disclosed to local media, raising speculation that the American government wants permanent basing for US troops who will be redeployed from tsunami stricken country of Japan to the Philippines,” Pamalakaya national chairperson Fernando Hicap said.

Hicap also recalled that in March last year, “US Ambassador to the Philippines Harry Thomas Jr. also met with local officials and discussed with them the impact of the earthquake and tsunami that hit Japan on the transfer of US military bases in Okinawa to Guam.”

“The US envoy’s visit to Subic was also kept secret to media,” he noted.

Pamalakaya, through its vice chairman Salvador France, said the developments in the shoal would “affect activities of small fishermen and commercial fishing operations in Zambales Bay and nearby Lingayen Gulf.”

Spratlys solution

For the dispute over Spratlys, Sen. Ralph Recto said the government should consider engaging China not through diplomatic protests, but through a possible joint exploration agreement.

“Every standoff, the territorial tension only escalates and we’re not gaining anything - zero. We could pursue a different tack by working out a possible joint exploration without impinging on our sovereignty,” Recto said in a statement.

Recto, a member of the Senate national defense and security and of foreign relations committees, said the country should not expect full support from ASEAN since its members are also trading with China.

“I’m not saying that we backtrack from our claim. In fact, we should do it relentlessly. But while the natural finds of Spratlys lay underneath, idle and untapped, a joint exploration appears to be the more logical engagement with China,” Recto said.

-With Pia Lee-Brago, Aurea Calica, Evelyn Macairan, Ding Cervantes, Christina Mendez, Jess Diaz

US mum on intervention in Phl-China sea dispute (http://www.philstar.com/Article.aspx?articleId=798448&publicationSubCategoryId=63)

WASHINGTON – The United States is mum on the circumstances under which it would intervene on behalf of the Philippines in the West Philippine Sea even as US troops began a joint military exercise with Filipino soldiers off Palawan.

The US Congressional Research Service (CRS) said although both sides have denied that the activities are aimed specifically at China, Beijing has raised concern about their real purpose.

The CRS report, prepared for members and committees of Congress, said the Philippine-US Mutual Defense Treaty (MDT) left room for different interpretations.

Some Philippine officials have suggested or sought assurances that the treaty obliges the US to come to the defense of the Philippines if China were to take disputed territories in the West Philippine Sea by force.

However, some interpretations limit US intervention to a foreign military attack on the main Philippine islands or upon Philippine military forces.

Although some US foreign policy analysts have expressed support for a stronger understanding, the Obama administration is not clear on circumstances under which the US armed forces would intervene to help the Philippines, said the CRS report written by Thomas Lum, an Asian affairs specialist.

Some foreign policy analysts in the region fear that an explicit US promise to invoke the MDT would raise rather than lower tensions, Lum said.

The foreign and defense secretaries of the Philippines and the US are meeting in Washington on April 30 to discuss among other things the maritime defense of the Philippines in the light of increasing tensions in the West Philippine Sea.

The CRS said in addition to equipment and training, US officials envision establishing a greater military presence in the country.

Given Philippine constitutional prohibitions and nationalistic sensitivities, the US desires to maintain a “light footprint,” and that with budget constraints, no permanent US bases or large-scale troop realignments are proposed.

It said options under discussion for enhanced security cooperation and US assistance include greater US access to Philippine ports and airfields for re-fueling and service of warships and planes, stationing of US warships and reconnaissance and other aircraft on rotational basis, increasing the number and frequency of joint military exercises, training, ship and aircraft visits, and related activities; increasing the number of US troops serving on a temporary basis, and purchase and leasing of US military ships and aircraft by the Philippines.

PH has claimed Scarborough for centuries (http://www.abs-cbnnews.com/-depth/04/18/12/ph-has-claimed-scarborough-centuries)

MANILA, Philippines - The Department of Foreign Affairs (DFA) released Wednesday a paper entitled "Philippine Position on Bajo de Masinloc and the Waters Within its Vicinity" showing that the Philippines has claimed Scarborough Shoal for centuries.

The political section of the Chinese embassy in Manila relased its own position a day earlier.

"We were really going out with this paper even before the Chinese embassy released its position," DFA Assistant Secretary Raul Hernandez said before reading the 6-page paper before the press.

Hernandez called Scarborough Shoal (or Panatag shoal or Huangyan island as the Chinese call it) "Bajo de Masinloc," which is translated in English as "under Masinloc."

He explained that the area is an integral part of Philippine territory, specifically under the municipality of Masinloc in the province of Zambales.

The shoal is located 124 nautical miles west of Zambales and is within the country's 200-nautical-mile Exclusive Economic Zone and the Philippine continental shelf.

"The name Bajo de Masinloc was a name given to the shoal by Spanish colonizers. In 1792, another map drawn by the Alejandro Malaspina expedition and published in 1808 in Madrid, Spain, also showed Bajo de Masinloc as part of Philippine territory. These maps showed the route of the Malaspina expedition to and around the shoal. It was reproduced in the Atlas of the 1939 Philippine Census," Hernandez said.

In the paper, the DFA said Philippine flags have been erected on some of the islets of the shoal, including a flag raised on an 8.3-meter high flag pole in 1965 and another Philippine flag raised by Congressman Roque Ablan and Jose Yap in 1997.

In 1965, the Philippines also built and operated a small lighthouse in one of the islets in the shoal.

In 1992, the Philippine Navy rehabilitated the lighthouse and reported it to the International Maritime Organization for publication in the List of Lights. The lighthouse is currently not operational.

Bajo de Masinloc was also used as an shooting range by Philippine and US Naval Forces stationed in Subic Bay in Zambales.

The DFA maintains that China's assertion based on historical claims must be substantiated by a clear historic title.

The department said under public international law, historical claims are not historical titles.

A claim by itself, including historical claim, cannot be a basis for acquiring a territory, it added.

The DFA said under international law, the modes of acquiring a territory are discovery, effective occupation, prescription, cession, and accretion.

Hernandez said a vessel from Philippine Coast Guard is still on standby in Bajo de Masinloc, along with the M/Y Saranggani that is on an archaeological mission for the Philippine Museum.

Two vessels from China are also in the area.

The DFA said it will continue to pursue diplomatic channels in resolving the dispute.

"This is ours and we will not leave just because somebody told us to leave," Hernandez said.

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-vLREnkyyTDE/T47UWkFNbyI/AAAAAAAASL8/SMbcxy88THM/s1600/170902310.jpg


Russia’s Yak-130 Joins Philippine Combat Trainer Tender (http://en.ria.ru/world/20120418/172892388.html)
14:22 18/04/2012
KUALA LUMPUR, April 18 (RIA Novosti)


Russia has decided to join a tender on the delivery of six light fighter jets to the Philippines with its new Yakovlev Yak-130 Mitten combat trainer, state-run arms exporter Rosoboronexport said on Wednesday.

“We are taking part in the Philippine tender with the Yak-130 aircraft,” deputy general director of Rosoboronexport, Viktor Komardin, said at the Defense Services Asia-2012 arms show in Malaysia.

The tender for six aircraft to replace the retired U.S.-built Northrop F-5A Tiger fighters was announced last year. The results will be made public in two to three months, the Russian official said. Two rival designs, the Italian Alenia Aermacchi M-346 and South Korea's KAI TA-50, are also competing in the tender.

The Philippines is a new market for Russian arms exporters. Manila used to order military equipment mainly from the United States.
“We regard this tender as an opportunity to expand our influence in the region and to demonstrate the capabilities of our military equipment,” Komardin said.

The Yak-130 is a highly maneuverable aircraft with an extended range of about 2,000 kilometers (1,250 miles) and a maximum speed of 1,060 km/h (600 m/h) in level flight. It can carry a combat payload of up to 3,000 kilograms (6,600 pounds), consisting of a variety of Russian and Western developed weapons.

The Yak-130 has been chosen as a basic aircraft for Russian Air Force pilot training. First deliveries started in 2009.

Bibili ba tayo nyan?

Agree. Let's look at what happened before Operation Sea Lion was canceled. Great Britain did not have a strong army. Their main weapons were the Royal Air Force and the Royal Navy which at that time dominated the sea. That is quite the reason why they allied themselves with the French who had a superior ground force. They are an island nation. First things first, you cannot invade an island nation without landing your troops on any of the islands. And you can never do so unless you gain aerial and naval supremacy over the enemy's territory. What kept Britain from being knocked off the war was by preventing the Germans from gaining supremacy over its airspace making any landing or even dropping of paratroops impossible. The Home Fleet alone can cripple the Kriegsmarine from deploying Wermacht troops inland from the northern French coast.

If the Philippines is ever invaded, the very first and the most decisive battles would be fought in the air and in the sea. There is no need to expand much the army, just modernize it and make it more accustomed to jungle fighting. Make our terrain an advantage.

It is also one reason why I reject the idea of having Sabah because we are just exposing ourselves to having a land border with Malaysia and Indonesia. It is quite a financial burden to fence up a border crossing and stationing troops to monitor illegal immigrants.

I must admit though that being an island nation is both an advantage and a disadvantage. Which in this case is an advantage that really helps a lot.

In theory, we dont need a strong army. But then, it is not a bad plan b back up to have one in case the airforce and navy are outmaneuvered. In reality, we do need a strong army. We have NPAs and MILFs in our jungles. You can't find them with the Navy or even airforce. As a matter of fact, you would not even want to constantly bomb them as these sissies usually live in civilian populated areas, the NPA's especially.

Also, do not assume that the MILF will be loyal to "the country". A lot of their financiers are not even local muslims and the reds for sure will take advantage to assault the military as a whole (there was an MGB youtube vid I watched where the NPAs ambushed an airforce unit in Batangas or Laguna, I don't exactly remember which provice)

In theory, we dont need a strong army. But then, it is not a bad plan b back up to have one in case the airforce and navy are outmaneuvered. In reality, we do need a strong army.

an island nation with a weak navy and air force is very vulnerable and if i was a president of phlipine i'll spend 2.5% of gdp on defense

It looks like Bayad Muna is going to rally in front of Chinese Embassy. Too little, too late for them to erase what we thought about them. Are they also going to throw paint balls and destroy emblems?

^^Kung Fu panda din ba plackard nila? :lol:

an island nation with a weak navy and air force is very vulnerable and if i was a president of phlipine i'll spend 2.5% of gdp on defense

I agree with the defense spending 2 Billion is not enough.

given the communists and separatists insurgency, it is needed at the moment.

I dont totally disagree with you with a strong navy and airforce, but a strong army is not bad either esp in a country where there are separatists and insurgents that want to overthrow the current democratic system

here's a documentary on what the military in the philippines, sorry it's not in english. there are local programs

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qgPh5KTkIIE&feature=relmfu

No need to invite China,PHL should bring case to UN (http://ph.news.yahoo.com/blogs/the-inbox/no-invite-china-phl-bring-case-un-155029768.html)

By Ellen Tordesillas

Albert del RosarioForeign Secretary Albert del Rosario is in New York now.

The Department of Foreign Affairs yesterday released his statement saying," In pursuing a peaceful settlement of the Scarborough Shoal issue, we fully intend to humbly invite our Chinese friends to join us in the International Tribunal on the Law of the Sea (ITLOS)."

ITLOS was established to adjudicate conflict over the interpretation and implementation of the United Nations Convention of the Law which defines the rights and responsibilities of nations in their use of the world's oceans.

Del Rosario said, "The purpose of the exercise will be to ascertain which of us has sovereign rights over the waters surrounding Scarborough Shoal where Chinese ships are currently engaging in illegal activities within the Philippine Exclusive Economic Zone (EEZ). "

We are not sure if the Philippines will go ahead with bringing to ITLOS the issue of Scarborough Shoal even if China spurns its invitation, which we expect would happen. China, opted out of compulsory arbitration provided in UNCLOS.

But lawyer Harry Roque, who teaches public international law at the University of the Philippines, said it does not need the agreement of China for the issue on Scarborough Shoal, which is 124 nautical miles (therefore within the Philippines' 200 NM exclusive economic zone) from Zambales, to be brought to the ITLOS because it involves the country's sovereign rights.

Roque, in his article in the Philippine Daily Inquirer, differentiated the Spratlys issue from the Scarborough Shoal case. He said: "Scarborough Shoal is separate and distinct from the dispute over the disputed Spratly islands in the West Philippine Sea. This is because Scarborough Shoal presents issues that are less insurmountable than those arising from the dispute in the Spratlys.

"The difference between Scarborough Shoal and the Spratlys is both physical and legal. As a shoal, Scarborough does not involve conflicting claims to land territory. Accordingly, the Philippine claim to it may be resolved wholly on the basis of the United Nations' Convention on the Law of the Sea (Unclos). And without a doubt, the Philippine claim to the area is superior because it falls within its 200-nautical-mile exclusive economic zone. This gives us the exclusive right to explore and exploit the living resources in these waters. The Spratlys, on the other hand, and this is contrary to repeated declarations by the Department of Foreign Affairs, cannot be resolved wholly through the Unclos. The reason is obvious: The Unclos only deals with the sea and cannot be applied to disputed islands.

"The point is: With the incursion of China in an undisputed maritime area under the sovereign right of the Philippines, we could avail ourselves of the mandatory and compulsory jurisdiction of the UN Tribunal of the Law of the Sea, which we could not otherwise resort to in the case of the Spratlys. This is because unlike issues involving the exercise of sovereign rights, which are subject to the compulsory jurisdiction of the tribunal, conflicting claims to both maritime and land territory will require the consent of China to litigate."

The Philippines should also push its long-discussed plan to bring the issue of China's ridiculous nine-dash line map to the UN which covers the whole of South China Sea and encroaches on the territory of a number of countries in Asia.

Supreme Court Justice Antonio Carpio, in his speech at the Ateneo de Davao University October last year,Carpio urged the government not to waste any more time to bring the issue to the international court.

He said, "First, a state that opts out of the UNCLOS compulsory dispute settlement mechanism is still subject to compulsory conciliation under UNCLOS. While the decision of an UNCLOS conciliation commission is not binding on the parties, its ruling is nevertheless persuasive. If the conciliation commission concludes that China's 9-dashed line map has no basis in international law, then that is practically the end of China's claim to 90% of the South China Sea. World opinion will turn strongly against China if it insists on its 9-dashed line map. The South China Sea is the second busiest international sea-lane in the world. More than one-half of the world's merchant fleet by tonnage passes through the South China Sea every year. More than 80% of the crude oil for Japan, South Korea, and Taiwan passes through the South China Sea. The entire world has an important stake in the South China Sea. A country like China that depends on international trade for its growth and prosperity cannot simply ignore world opinion. As events in the break-up of Yugoslavia and the upheavals of the Arab Spring have shown, world opinion has become the defining moral force behind the Rule of Law.

"Second, UNCLOS allows states to opt out of compulsory arbitration only with respect to the delimitation of overlapping maritime zones or issues involving historic bays or titles forming part of internal waters. The validity of China's 9-dashed line map is an issue that is independent of maritime delimitation because it also affects fishing, scientific research and freedom of navigation in the South China Sea. No historic bay or title is involved because China obviously cannot claim the South China Sea as its internal waters.

"Also, whether the geographic features in the Spratlys Islands Group in the West Philippine Sea are rocks or islands entitled to maritime zones is an issue not subject to the opt out clause as this issue does not involve the delimitation of maritime boundaries. Once the maritime status of these rocks and islands are defined, as distinguished from their sovereignty status, the extent of the disputed area in the South China Sea will also be defined and narrowed. If none of the islands generate their own EEZs, then there will be no overlapping EEZs between China and the Philippines in the Spratlys Islands Group. If some islands generate their own EEZs, then the dispute will be narrowed to those overlapping EEZs, freeing the rest of the South China Sea from any dispute.

"Thus, some international law scholars have suggested that opposing claimant states should subject the validity of China's 9-dashed line map, as well as the maritime status of the rocks and islands in the South China Sea, to compulsory arbitration under UNCLOS.

"In this crucial battle to secure our EEZ under UNCLOS, the Philippines can never lose to China, unless the Philippines commits an irremediable blunder like bringing the battle outside of UNCLOS. We must bring the battle to an UNCLOS tribunal for resolution of the dispute under UNCLOS. Our right to our EEZ in the South China Sea is guaranteed under UNCLOS. UNCLOS will lose its reason for existence if it fails to secure for the Philippines its EEZ. If the Philippines brings the battle outside of UNCLOS, it can never expect to win over China, whether militarily or diplomatically."

Philippine leadership is aware of that reality. Del Rosario said,"The whole world knows that China has myriad more ships and aircraft than the Philippiness. At day's end, however, we hope to demonstrate that international law would be the great equalizer."

yeah the current military budget of philippine is only $1.48 billion a year which is quite low compared to the percentage and proportion of it's gdp.

2011 crazy spending!

s-bHc1mZFO4

yeah the current military budget of philippine is only $1.48 billion a year which is quite low compared to the percentage and proportion of it's gdp.
One documentary I watched (in local language) cited that 85% alone of the budget goes to the salaries of troops. hardly any budget for acquisition of new equipment

2 billion is also too low for a country faced with communist insurgency, separatist, and foreign terrorism (the recently nabbed/killed terrorists are not Filipinos). I wonder how the heck do the military do with such antiquated equipment. The terrorists probably have more access to newer weapons since they have foreign financiers

It looks like Bayad Muna is going to rally in front of Chinese Embassy. Too little, too late for them to erase what we thought about them. Are they also going to throw paint balls and destroy emblems?

They should bring their buddies from LFS, AmoyPawis and Gabriela. If they don't deface the Chinese embassy signs, I would be pissed off more than I usually am at them:nuts::lol:

2011

s-bHc1mZFO4

Wow, Saudi spends hell a lot in terms of their GDP.

yes saudi spends a lot of billions on high end and latest jets (like typhoon), missiles and other weapons. saudi always has to be ready to deal with the threats from it's neighbours especially the israeli forces.

Bibili ba tayo nyan?

Malapit na.

Hmmm...one of the most militarized country, NoKor, how much do they spend? in terms of $ amount and GDP? They dont seem to be on top

Does the US budget contain foreign aid?

Malapit na.

It doesnt say we're going to buy it in the article

Does the US budget contain foreign aid?

no!

an island nation with a weak navy and air force is very vulnerable and if i was a president of phlipine i'll spend 2.5% of gdp on defense

Not just a weak navy and air force but having no fighter jets at all!

no!

you mean all these are for the overseas bases and their new toys?:guns1:

^ here's the figures of the united states spending

http://i.imgur.com/iQD2j.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/QUFSD.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/9eolu.jpg


@Manila-X yes the situation seems quite worrying if you think about the threats from neighbour emerging countries which are planning to stretch their muscles and influence in that region.

They should bring their buddies from LFS, AmoyPawis and Gabriela. If they don't deface the Chinese embassy signs, I would be pissed off more than I usually am at them:nuts::lol:

We need Ely Pamatong to burn the Chinese flag



IN FRONT OF THE CHINESE EMBASSY

Not the US Embassy (again) :lol:

^ the situation seems quite scary if you think about the threats from neighbour emerging countries which are planning to stretch their muscles and influence in that region.

@Nabartek here's the figures of the united states spending

http://i.imgur.com/iQD2j.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/QUFSD.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/9eolu.jpg

Thanks. The figure alone in the youtube vid is DOD alone

hate to sound like a freeloader, maybe they should give us for free their decommissioned equipments :lol:

does philippine have a good relationship with indonesia and malaysia and which countries are top 3 enemies of philippine?

^^ With that, we will need a large Home Fleet to defend the islands. Also do not forget our 'unsinkable aircraft carriers. We can launch aircraft from the south to intercept incoming Chinese planes. We also need submarines to sink enemy transport ships. We don't need those white elephant aircraft carriers as our main goal is only for defense. We have many unsinkable aircraft carriers, 7,107 of them actually. ;)


Actually, the concept of using our island as an unsinkable Carriers is really a bad one -- especially for a cash-strapped military like ours. If we are going for American Planes, you should know that they (f15,f18) require good paved runways (1km -2km) plus hangars for storage, ans logistic support, if they lack any of these, they're basically useless. The cost alone of building a runway for taxiing fighters and storage is horrifying; we are having a hard time building roads and schools in our country, i really doubt we can do that.

Indonesia is okay. Malaysia, not so much albeit there is a "friendly" relations, but not to the point of being really good friends as in kinda the "fanboy mentality" we have towards the US.

uk is building some serious sh*t (http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showpost.php?p=90532360&postcount=768) :drool:

dang, a carrier. When will we have our own? :lol:

I wonder why our AFP never mentioned anything about land based anti-aircraft or anti-ship missile defense system. Not necessary Patriot type missile system.

How come they never mentioned any missile system for our Navy or Airforce or even our Army?

uk is building some serious sh*t (http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showpost.php?p=90532360&postcount=768) :drool:

That won't be operational until 2020.

I wonder why our AFP never mentioned anything about land based anti-aircraft or anti-ship missile defense system. Not necessary Patriot type missile system.

How come they never mentioned any missile system for our Navy or Airforce or even our Army?

baka secret. parang yung smart bombs din, nalaman lang natin nung ginamit nila

but then, IMO, it is better secret than China knowing and scrambling and accusing us as aggressors...hehehehe

I wonder why our AFP never mentioned anything about land based anti-aircraft or anti-ship missile defense system. Not necessary Patriot type missile system.

How come they never mentioned any missile system for our Navy or Airforce or even our Army?

I think they had plans to install missiles on our peac*ck class corvettes, but the lacks budget prevent it to push through. For our airforce, we still have anti-air missiles from our retired f5s but we don't have a platform to use it (correct me if i'm wrong).

Air strike vs NPA rebs misses targets (http://businessmirror.com.ph/home/nation/25341-air-strike-vs-npa-rebs-misses-targets)

AN air strike against New People’s Army guerrillas on Thursday missed the target, suggesting that military pilots need to further hone their skills.

The failed strike paled in comparison to the accurate bombing that was carried out by two OV-10 “Bronco” armed observation planes in February this year in Sulu that killed Jema’ah Islamiyah leaders Marwan and Mauiyah and Abu Sayyaf leader Abu Gumdail alias Dr. Abu.

In the Bukidnon air strike an Aermacchi SF.260 armed trainer plane fired 14 rockets against an NPA guerrilla formation but apparently missed. All that the ground troops recovered were two back packs allegedly containing “documents of high intelligence value” and gun parts.

Another operation against communist guerrillas in Surigao del Sur, meanwhile, resulted in the forced evacuation of several families of Lumads.

However, Col. Leopoldo Galon, spokesman for the Armed Forces Eastern Mindanao Command, said bloodstains were seen in the rebels’ withdrawal routes.

A soldier was slightly wounded in the ground operations.

Galon said troops from Charlie Company of the Army’s 8th Infantry Battalion clashed with guerrillas, prompting them to call for an air strike and an SF.260 armed trainer was sent by the Air Force. The SF.260 reportedly delivered 14 rockets.

The clash occurred at around 5:20 a.m. at Barangay Sampaguita, Kibawe, Bukidnon, and raged until 9:20 a.m.

Amid the firefight, the Air Force Tactical Operations Group 11 sent the armed trainer to provide support.

Galon explained that the rebels, who were positioned in an elevated portion, have pinned down the soldiers who could not extricate themselves.

He said the military could not use artillery for fear that it might hit the soldiers.

After the firefight, the clearing operation by the soldiers resulted in the recovery of two backpacks containing documents, assorted clothing and a half sack of rice.

The soldiers also recovered assorted empty shells and damaged M-16 rifle parts.

At noon on Thursday, members of the 75th IB, who were on security patrol, clashed with five rebels at Sitio Sangay, Barangay Anomar, Surigao City.

The firefight lasted for 10 minutes. Pfc. Victor Damaso was wounded.

Following the firefight, the soldiers recovered an improvised land mine, blasting caps and personal belongings.

However, the brief clash also resulted in the evacuation of 84 families of Lumad at Barangays Tambis and Barobo.

Indonesia is okay. Malaysia, not so much albeit there is a "friendly" relations, but not to the point of being really good friends as in kinda the "fanboy mentality" we have towards the US.

See the Mama Eagle feed her baby

http://s15.postimage.org/rd1xfsejf/5779984548_0cf004c110_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/danas_pics/5779984548/)

Sorry, what was I saying?:lol:

That won't be operational until 2020.

no! the first one "queen elizabeth (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Queen_Elizabeth_class_aircraft_carrier)" carrier will be in service by 2016 and the second one "prince of wales" is expected to be commissioned by 2020. the problem is that the gov has not decided whether they will get f-35 c or b variant. first one was originally planned to be built with STOVL version which can operate f35 b short take off and vertical landing aircraft but david cameron changed the plan and reverted CATOBAR-type because the cost of f35 c is slightly cheaper but it can carry more fuel, has longer range, bigger wings and superior performance. but another problem is that in order to launch c type aircraft, the carrier needs emals (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electromagnetic_Aircraft_Launch_System) systems which will cost a lot of money and f-35 c has flaws regarding with it's design (tail and hook). so, if uk goes with the f35 c variant the carriers will not be in service until 2020 but if the gov go with the b variant the first carrier will be operational by 2016.

See the Mama Eagle feed her baby

http://s15.postimage.org/rd1xfsejf/5779984548_0cf004c110_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/danas_pics/5779984548/)

Sorry, what was I saying?:lol:

But we ain't bald! :lol:

http://lifeofpixels.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/10/Philippine-Eagle7.jpg

ha ha, mag ra rally na mga Bayad Muna siguro matapos mabasa dito ng isang myembro nila, and they read the sentiments of many pinoy here, pakitang gilas kumbaga :lol: never too late daw eh :lol:

India will be testing its Agni V missile this week, the missile with a range of 5,000 km would bring Japan, Somalia, the southern Phillipines, Turkey, Eastern Europe and European Russia within its reach.

http://www.google.com/hostednews/afp/article/ALeqM5hESSC3k6f5Ml5UwxHz-WexGldf9A?docId=CNG.863418a31078fa72b3dfb7a1607e1bb1.571

US seeks 'restraint' amid India missile plan
(AFP) – 4 hours ago

http://www.google.com/hostednews/afp/media/ALeqM5iYaQsGKWzohf4KQU2J2ObOpJiJxw?docId=photo_1334777767311-1-0&size=l

WASHINGTON — The United States called Wednesday on all nuclear powers to exercise restraint, but stopped short of criticizing growing partner India which plans to test a new long-range nuclear-capable missile.

Asked about the missile which could strike deep into China, State Department spokesman Mark Toner said that the United States was aware of the test plans but has not "specifically" raised the issue with India.

"I just would say that we urge all nuclear-capable states to exercise restraint regarding nuclear capabilities. That said, India has a solid non-proliferation record," Toner told reporters.

India hoped to test the new Agni V on Wednesday evening from the eastern state of Orissa on the Bay of Bengal, but bad weather forced it to postpone the launch until Thursday or Friday.

The Agni V has a range of 5,000 kilometers (3,100 miles). India first tested nuclear weapons in 1998 and officials at the time said the chief concern was fellow Asian giant China -- not historic rival Pakistan, which followed with its own nuclear test.

The United States in recent years has rarely criticized India other than on commercial issues as US leaders seek to build a closer partnership between the world's two largest democracies.

Some analysts say that the momentum in US-India ties has slowed down in recent months amid economic disputes and Washington's concern over India's continued oil imports from Iran

^^as long as they point their missile southward to the Indian ocean

Russia's YAK-130 Advanced Combat Trainer Jets Joins PAF Tender ...

http://en.rian.ru/world/20120418/172892388.html

the chinese are comin' :shocked:

aP33K72nmDo

HN9CzHf9aKk

Russia's YAK-130 Advanced Combat Trainer Jets Joins PAF Tender ...

http://en.rian.ru/world/20120418/172892388.html

If its cheaper than those Italian M346 or Korean T-50. Russia na.

WE need armaments like this:


http://en.rian.ru/images/16016/24/160162414.jpg
http://en.rian.ru/images/16016/24/160162414.jpg
Iranian missile system

WE need armaments like this:

to shoot whom?

^^as long as they point their missile southward to the Indian ocean

or North of Himalayas. :D :lol:

WE need armaments like this:


http://en.rian.ru/images/16016/24/160162414.jpg
http://en.rian.ru/images/16016/24/160162414.jpg
Iranian missile system

How about we exchange this for tons of supply of bananas ? :lol:

or North of Himalayas. :D :lol:

I like that. As long as its not esstward :lol:

to shoot whom?

You know who. ;)

to shoot whom?

Ba e ewan ko sa iyo. Tanungin mo sarili mo.

How about we exchange this for tons of supply of bananas ? :lol:

Puede. Italians nuon tumanggap ng bra at panty for S-211. Asan na ba yung government agency na nag-negotiate for counter trade.

uk is building some serious sh*t (http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showpost.php?p=90532360&postcount=768) :drool:

So? your Point?

India will be testing its Agni V missile this week, the missile with a range of 5,000 km would bring Japan, Somalia, the southern Phillipines, Turkey, Eastern Europe and European Russia within its reach.

http://www.google.com/hostednews/afp/article/ALeqM5hESSC3k6f5Ml5UwxHz-WexGldf9A?docId=CNG.863418a31078fa72b3dfb7a1607e1bb1.571

So what is the connection of this to the China -Philippines stand off?

So what is the connection of this to the China -Philippines stand off?

I think its because having the missile is a deterrent to China?

You know who. ;)

the chinese? :shocked:

So? your Point?

hello argentina, we are comin for you! :soon::guns1:

Ba e ewan ko sa iyo. Tanungin mo sarili mo.

whut? lol :?

I think its because having the missile is a deterrent to China?

Alam ko puntirya nyan ay ang India's archenemy and wannabe nuclear power Pakistan.

Jammu and Kashmir....

India has skirmish with both pakistan and china.

never thought philipine would hate china :baaa:

India has skirmish with both pakistan and china.

Yes. But the real and present danger is Islamist Pakistan and their battle for the control of Jammu and kashmir.

never thought philipine would hate china :baaa:

You have not been reading the news the past two years on the asia-pacific

You have not been reading the news the past two years on the asia-pacific

yeah that's true, i have been mainly focusing on falklands, north korea and iran issues unfortunately :fiddle: but try to follow china vs philipine issues too

guysingatingatlang sa isanatorinparangkasamahan atasyang isangtsikompero ibang style lang todinagyayabang agad.

guysingatingatlang sa isanatorinparangkasamahan atasyang isangtsikompero ibang style lang todinagyayabang agad.



Shanawa

guysingatingatlang sa isanatorinparangkasamahan atasyang isangtsikompero ibang style lang todinagyayabang agad.

Hindi naman siguro. Basahin mo nalang yung mga nakaraang page. May nagsuggest pa nga na dapat palakasin ang hukbong dagat at hukbong panghimpapawid para mas maganda ang depensa natin laban sa mga Chicom na yan. May sense nga naman hango sa historical perspective ng Inglatera at ng Hapon. :lol:

never thought philipine would hate china :baaa:

You have not been reading the news the past two years on the asia-pacific

pretty obvious.

the chinese are comin' :shocked:

aP33K72nmDo



Philippines is not scared at all. 900 poorly clothed, poorly equipped Filipinos made 40,000 Chinese run for their lives during the Korean War. :lol:

Seoul would have been captured by North Korea and China forever without this important battle.

It's a fact (http://rokdrop.com/2008/05/07/heroes-of-the-korean-war-lieutenant-colonel-dionisio-ojeda-part-1/).

If its cheaper than those Italian M346 or Korean T-50. Russia na.

How about the logistics and after market support ?

Syria has a plan to acquire 36 units for $550m; that's roughly $15+m a piece, they do have Russian base in Tartus, so these jets are just probono for them.

never thought philipine would hate china :baaa:

with a passion.


ha ha, mag ra rally na mga Bayad Muna siguro matapos mabasa dito ng isang myembro nila, and they read the sentiments of many pinoy here, pakitang gilas kumbaga :lol: never too late daw eh :lol:


Catchy pala ang Anak Maoist. Hahaha. Natawa ako dun sa malamyang mga blog entry ni Renato Reyes. I have feeling na may clearance muna sa Beijing yung 'stand' at 'rally' nila --> para daw hindi obvious na pokpok ng mga tsikom.

India will be testing its Agni V missile this week, the missile with a range of 5,000 km would bring Japan, Somalia, the southern Phillipines, Turkey, Eastern Europe and European Russia within its reach.

http://www.google.com/hostednews/afp/article/ALeqM5hESSC3k6f5Ml5UwxHz-WexGldf9A?docId=CNG.863418a31078fa72b3dfb7a1607e1bb1.571

Meh. Kinda idiotic when India's only real enemy is China (and Pakistan). Why need an ICBM. Superfluous.

does philippine have a good relationship with indonesia and malaysia and which countries are top 3 enemies of philippine?


1. China
2. China
3. Jejemons

How about the logistics and after market support ?

Syria has a plan to acquire 36 units for $550m; that's roughly $15+m a piece, they do have Russian base in Tartus, so these jets are just probono for them.

Same question with the Italian M346 (The Alenia Aermacchi M-346 Master is a military transonic trainer aircraft. The design of the plane is based on the Yak-130, developed by Yakovlev and Aermacchi as a joint venture.) and Korean TA-50.

May condition naman ang AFP, baka marami naman atang nagamit ng Yak-130.
Pero Russia, mismo, Vietnam, Algeria at Syria gumagamit at gagamit so mukhang ok.

Anyway, if its 15 million dollars still cheaper that both Italian and Korean jets at 20 million euros and 30 million dollars apiace respectively.

Philippines is not scared at all. 900 poorly clothed, poorly equipped Filipinos made 40,000 Chinese run for their lives during the Korean War. :lol:

Seoul would have been captured by North Korea and China forever without this important battle.

It's a fact (http://rokdrop.com/2008/05/07/heroes-of-the-korean-war-lieutenant-colonel-dionisio-ojeda-part-1/).

i know you ain't scared of the rise of china but sorry to rock your boat and to be frank mate philippine would not stand a chance against a strong opponent like china, furthermore i do reckon that philipine won't survive more than 1 week if china deployed the combined forces and launched the constant attacks like shock and awe style used in iraq back in 2003. but this is very unlikely to happen as the international community alongside the UN will not allow this kind of violent actions. besides, this might probably motivate nato forces to participate in a new massive campaign in the chinese sea and over the chinese airspace.

meh, but it still ridiculously overrated, see what will happen to them when they face with professionally trained forces.



:nono:

israel has plenty of enemies in that region. turkey also does not have a good relationship with israel as far as i know.

other arab nations like saudi arabia, uae and egypt etc also hate the arrogant israel.

if the war between israel/iran occurred many arab countries would support iran in order to wipe israel off the map. :happy:

the only thing that makes everyone to think twice is the nuclear missiles that israel is believed to possess :ohno:

it's easy how could some people forget the very short 6 day war in the 1960s. being surrounded by adversaries and on the brink of an apparent national demise, israel became victorious against all her enemies in an amazing 6 days.

that war by the way, and the subsequent 1973 arab-israeli conflict became the basis that egypt, unthinkable at that time, attempted to establish diplomatic ties with israel. nuclear capabilities aside, israel is the strongest military nation in the middle east. that's something that you should consider.;)

with a passion.





Catchy pala ang Anak Maoist. Hahaha. Natawa ako dun sa malamyang mga blog entry ni Renato Reyes. I have feeling na may clearance muna sa Beijing yung 'stand' at 'rally' nila --> para daw hindi obvious na pokpok ng mga tsikom.



Meh. Kinda idiotic when India's only real enemy is China (and Pakistan). Why need an ICBM. Superfluous.




1. China
2. China
3. Jejemons



:lol:

i know you ain't scared of the rise of china but sorry to rock your boat and to be frank mate philippine would not stand a chance furthermore i do reckon it won't survive more than 1 week if china deployed the combined forces and launched the constant attacks like shock and awe style used in iraq back in 2003. but this is very unlikely to happen as the international community alongside the UN will not allow this kind of violent actions.

They can shock and awe with all the technology they have, but take a look on how Vietnam did it with their stone age technology back then even with Russian assistance.

The war dragged on for decades but the VC's keep on fighting, and it did pay off in the end.

Philippines may not have the strong navy with airforce that is virtually non existent but it doesn't mean to say we don't have a fight. ;)

i know you ain't scared of the rise of china but sorry to rock your boat and to be frank mate philippine would not stand a chance furthermore i do reckon it won't survive more than 1 week if china deployed the combined forces and launched the constant attacks like shock and awe style used in iraq back in 2003. but this is very unlikely to happen as the international community alongside the UN will not allow this kind of violent actions.

no wonder then, that china is adamant that this tension should not be elevated to the UN. china already thinks that this body of water is part of her land and maritime sovereignty.

They can shock and awe with all the technology they have, but take a look on how Vietnam did it with their stone age technology back then even with Russian assistance. ;)

don't make me laugh again with this vietnem issue.

no need to say more just google the casualties numbers by yourself and you'll find out who suffered the most. :ohno:

being said that usa fought and won that war although it is more than 9000 miles away from home. (in other words, other side of the world)

^^ that is why they dont like any of their "historical" claims be brought in international forum

don't make me laugh again with this vietnem issue. no need to say more just check out the casualties numbers and you'll find out who suffered the most. :ohno:

But in the end, who gave up fighting there? Let's just base it on historical fact.

It may have cost them their lives, but Vietnam became united.

Its the end results that matters

Its the end results that matters

Exactly. :lol:

But in the end, who gave up fighting there? Let's just base it on historical fact.

Casualties and losses

UNITED STATES - 58,220 dead
VIETNAM - 1,176,000 military dead, 2,000,000 civilian dead (3.17 million population total)

:fiddle:

dIhGYu5Uc08

i know you ain't scared of the rise of china but sorry to rock your boat and to be frank mate philippine would not stand a chance against a strong opponent like china, furthermore i do reckon that philipine won't survive more than 1 week if china deployed the combined forces and launched the constant attacks like shock and awe style used in iraq back in 2003. but this is very unlikely to happen as the international community alongside the UN will not allow this kind of violent actions. besides, this might probably motivate nato forces to participate in a new massive campaign in the chinese sea and over the chinese airspace.

Of course. Even a grade school student knows that in the Philippines. But at least we will not just give up with out a fight.

China is a superpower with a powerful military against the Philippines with a military that just came out of the ICU.:lol::lol::lol:


Anyway, the Philippines will not go into war with China. Im very sure about that. We will use all available diplomatic channels to resolve the issue.And the international community is watching.

China, who is projecting itself as a benevolent international power (who wants to join the Arctic Council) and busy exploring (exploiting) African nations for more contracts to benefit its voracious appetite for resources and market for its crappy exports..will not risk having a negative image as a bully who will destroy a puny country like the Philippines at will.

Casualties and losses

UNITED STATES - 58,220 dead
VIETNAM - 1,176,000 military dead, 2,000,000 civilian dead

of course vietnem won that war :lol: facts prove it ...

Of course they won it because if not, Vietnam would not be a communist.

Casualties and losses

UNITED STATES - 58,220 dead
VIETNAM - 1,176,000 military dead, 2,000,000 civilian dead

of course vietnem won that war :lol: facts prove it ...



You are forgetting the political aspect of wars

But in the end, who gave up fighting there? Let's just base it on historical fact.

It may have cost them their lives, but Vietnam became united.

Very true.

Maybe this guy thinks Vietnam is still a colony of the US.:lol::lol::lol:

You are forgetting the political aspect of wars

US lost because of their Politics, and the high level of nationalism of Vietnamese. The South Vietnam wants to reunite with their country, it's only US and its allies wanted to prevent the spread of communism in South East Asia, and we all know they fail.

China is a superpower with a powerful military.

:nono: china is nowhere close to a league of a superpower,

but without a doubt it is a developing nation with the world's biggest population and it is also the biggest exporter. that's about it. :sad2:

:nono: china is nowhere close to a league of a superpower,

but without a doubt it is a developing nation with the world's biggest population and it is also the biggest exporter. that's about it. :sad2:

but they do try very hard. :lol:

:nono: china is nowhere close to a league of a superpower,

but without a doubt it is a developing nation with the world's biggest population and it is also the biggest exporter. that's about it. :sad2:

Being a super power nowadays doesn't mean you have a large and most modern military. Just having a bunch of nuclear and ballistic missiles in your arsenal; having that capability to strike you enemy without sending units their land or water, makes you a superpower. They may not have the most modern military, but no nation would dare to go head to head with them.

:nono: china is nowhere close to a league of a superpower,

but without a doubt it is a developing nation with the world's biggest population and it is also the biggest exporter. that's about it. :sad2:

Really? why not check the new list re: biggest economies of the world. US is no.1 China is number 2. Japan 3. Germany 4. Brazil is 5. France is 6.

Military wise. Check the PLA's strength.

Sorry to say this, you are clueless about whats happening in this side of the world. Or you are just plain, like those history books made in the "West" --Eurocetric.:lol::lol:

The end of the caucasian monopoly of power has ended.:lol::lol:

Perhaps the West, the white race or Europeans still see themselves as the master of the world. They should wake up.

Even pathetic Philippines has an economy bigger than some European countries.

Being a super power nowadays doesn't mean you have a large military. Just having a bunch of nuclear and ballistic missiles in your arsenal; having that capability to strike you enemy without sending units their land or water, makes you a superpower.

sick! i didn't know the uk was a superpower as well, god save the queen :angel:

royal navy has the capability to strike any part of the globe in less than an hour. :shocked:

Of course. Even a grade school student knows that in the Philippines. But at least we will not just give up with out a fight.

China is a superpower with a powerful military against the Philippines with a military that just came out of the ICU.:lol::lol::lol:


Anyway, the Philippines will not go into war with China. Im very sure about that. We will use all available diplomatic channels to resolve the issue.And the international community is watching.

China, who is projecting itself as a benevolent international power (who wants to join the Arctic Council) and busy exploring (exploiting) African nations for more contracts to benefit its voracious appetite for resources and market for its crappy exports..will not risk having a negative image as a bully who will destroy a puny country like the Philippines at will.

that's why, all this is just hard power posturing...at least for now. knowing china's economy is profoundly dependent on exports, it can't risk blanket international condemnation if it will invade the philippines.

it's easy for even non-commited nations to realize that china's sovereignty is nowhere near at stake in these recent incidents. but the philippines' own sovereignty obviously is the one at stake.

no matter, the prevention of similar future incidents could be achieved in the rethinking and strengthening our ties with the US. ASEAN, as a single military and security apparatus may come in the future. but today, the road to washington is our most realistic security direction.

sick! i didn't know the uk was a superpower as well, god save the queen :angel:

royal navy has the capability to strike any part of the globe in less than an hour. :shocked:

Really?

sick! i didn't know the uk was a superpower as well, god save the queen :angel:

royal navy has the capability to strike any part of the globe in less than an hour. :shocked:

UK is a part of NATO and EU. It has the capability to manufacture and develop its own weapon. It has nuclear and ballistic missiles in their arsenal.

sick! i didn't know the uk was a superpower as well, god save the queen :angel:

royal navy has the capability to strike any part of the globe in less than an hour. :shocked:

during the cold war, the only legitimate superpowers were the US and the former USSR. the end of the cold war left the US as the lone superpower.

the UK is considered as one of the nuclear power nations, but not a superpower.

:nono: china is nowhere close to a league of a superpower,

but without a doubt it is a developing nation with the world's biggest population and it is also the biggest exporter. that's about it. :sad2:

but they do try very hard. :lol:

and tries hard to project that superpower posture on countries like the philippines!:lol:

and tries hard to project that superpower posture on countries like the philippines!:lol:

....yes on puny countries like us and Vietnam. But why not China project the same superpower bully to the US or Russia or India or Brazil. Countries of the same size.

Thats why Im not sure if the BRICS (Brazil, Russia, INdia, China and South Africa) will ever succeed if turned into a club of new rich countries like the caucasian dominated G8 countries.Why because except for South Africa and Brazil, Russia, CHina and India hate each other.:lol::lol::lol::lol:

Really? why not check the new list re: biggest economies of the world. US is no.1 China is number 2. Japan 3. Germany 4. Brazil is 5. France is 6.

let me fix that for ya

in terms of gdp (nominal)


United States 15.094,025 (USD$ trillion) (311 million people)
China 7.298,147n2 (1.33 billion people)
Japan 5.869,471 (127 million people)
Germany 3.577,031 (81 million people)
France 2.776,324 (65 million people)
Brazil 2.492,908 (192 million people)
United Kingdom 2.417,570 (62 million people)
Italy 2.198,730 (60 million people)
Russia 1.850,401 (143 million people)
Canada 1.7 (34.7 million people)


i am not surprised at all because it has that ridiculous population in reality it should have at least $65 trillion or above in order to match with it's population size.

in terms of gdp nominal per capita (this is more important in daily life)

http://i.imgur.com/taCK3.jpg

China ranked at 92th worldwide ($8,382) :fiddle:



Military wise. Check the PLA's strength.

you're counting the numbers again. in the military point of view the numbers are useless to be honest.



Even pathetic Philippines has an economy bigger than some European countries.

so you think that heaving a bigger economy is the same as having a higher living standard, higher human development index, better education, better universal healthcare system, better democracy, more freedom of speech and more? :nuts:

Really?

google a thing called trident d5 :angel:

Really? why not check the new list re: biggest economies of the world. US is no.1 China is number 2. Japan 3. Germany 4. Brazil is 5. France is 6.

Military wise. Check the PLA's strength.

Sorry to say this, you are clueless about whats happening in this side of the world. Or you are just plain, like those history books made in the "West" --Eurocetric.:lol::lol:

The end of the caucasian monopoly of power has ended.:lol::lol:

Perhaps the West, the white race or Europeans still see themselves as the master of the world. They should wake up.

Even pathetic Philippines has an economy bigger than some European countries.

I think the economy that China has is mainly because of their huge population. but when you think about military power, technology, budget and maturity, US is still at the top of its game.

Have you seen the fighter planes made by China

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shenyang_J-11

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sukhoi_Su-27

or its stealth fighter:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chengdu_J-20

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/F22_Raptor

copy cats... There are even reports from US Intelligence Agency that they've been hacked a few months before China unveils their Stealth Fighter. They also confirmed that the hacker is trying to get files related to stealth technology...

This is a defense thread, not gdp threat folks :D

The MILF is still loyal to the nation perhaps. They have wanted a 'sub-state' but that is on the context of them being neglected and marginalized as a minority. They wanted autonomy because they feel alienated with the majority Christian Philippines but their loyalty is still for the country. Even the Muslim communities in Mindanao will support the country against a foreign aggressor.

The MILF is not loyal to our nation, in fact they don't call themselves as Filipinos but as Bangsamoro people because they have their own constitution.

I also want to add that when the based were still open, us militarymen are favorite targets of the new people's army. I have no doubt they are about to do the same

That also happens in Iraq, Afghanistan, and in Vietnam (during the Vietnam War) so it's already a known issue worldwide therefore preventive measures have already been made by the US Military to address it. It's a common danger that most American soldiers are already aware of.

during the cold war, the only legitimate superpowers were the US and the former USSR. the end of the cold war left the US as the lone superpower.

the UK is considered as one of the nuclear power nations, but not a superpower.

yeah sure, but according the post below, a nation can be classified as a superpower if it has got a couple of nukes to shoot :hilarious

Being a super power nowadays doesn't mean you have a large and most modern military. Just having a bunch of nuclear and ballistic missiles in your arsenal; having that capability to strike you enemy without sending units their land or water, makes you a superpower.

ok so both iran and north korea are the mighty supwerpowers now? :nuts: :crazy:

folks, superpower is a very wide term, more than both military and economic power. many factors have to be taken into consideration as well especially in aspects such as media, diplomacy, banking, technology, healthcare, education, popularity, living standard, contribution to the world, participation in international events, democracy index, political power, infrastructure, advanced communication, reserve currency, aid money, quality of life, entertainment, power projection etc. :yawn:

let me fix that for ya

in terms of gdp (nominal)


United States 15.094,025 (USD$ trillion) (331 million people)
China 7.298,147n2 (1.33 billion people)
Japan 5.869,471 (127 million people)
Germany 3.577,031 (81 million people)
France 2.776,324 (65 million people)
Brazil 2.492,908 (192 million people)
United Kingdom 2.417,570 (62 million people)
Italy 2.198,730 (60 million people)
Russia 1.850,401 (143 million people)
Canada 1.7 (34.7 million people)


i am not surprised at all because it has that ridiculous population in reality it should have at least $65 trillion or above in order to match with it's population size. Where did you get the 65 trillion dollars?:lol::lol::lol:


European Caucasians are being kicked out one by one by Asians and former colonies..:lol::lol::lol: I will not be surprised Italy and the United Kingdom will be stricken out of this list.


China ranked at 92th worldwide ($8,382)

Due to a bigger population compared to ageing and dying population of Europe and Japan.:lol::lol::lol:

Anyway, having lots of money make people happy.


you're counting the numbers again. in the military point of view the numbers are useless to be honest.

Of numbers matter. Do you really think UK really has an advantage over China in terms of armaments?prove it.

By the way, you still need people to operate such armaments even those unmanned ones. Somebody should push the button.:lol::lol:


so you think that heaving a bigger economy is the same as having a higher living standard, higher human development index, better education, better universal healthcare system, better democracy, more freedom of speech and more?

No.

I admit, after plundering nations after nations in the past, European colonial powers have better living standards, higher human development index, better universal healthcare.:lol::lol:

But Im not sure about democracy and freedom of speech.:cheers:


By the way, even if you have "better living conditions" because of your higher income do you think you are happy?:lol::lol::lol:

Equipment wise, it is singapore and australia.

Don't forget Taiwan and South Korea which can make their own modern military equipment. Taiwan is a perfect match to Singapore if you put them on a 1-on-1 full scale war game.

I found another website


Global Firepower Nations by Rank
Ranking the world military powers is no easy task though, inevitably, it all comes down to the numbers.

http://www.globalfirepower.com/countries-listing.asp

Such an unreliable source of military information. :ohno:

What deals do they have with the germans?

He couldn't answer how the Germans forced them and what were those deals because he lacked a link to his source.

It doesnt say we're going to buy it in the article

Yes it doesn't because if you'll read carefully, it stated that the Yak-130 will be joining the PAF contest for its search for a new advanced combat trainer jet which is currently being competed by the Alenia Aermacchi M-346 and the KAI T/A-50.

I think the economy that China has is mainly because of their huge population. but when you think about military power, technology, budget and maturity, US is still at the top of its game.

Have you seen the fighter planes made by China

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shenyang_J-11

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sukhoi_Su-27

or its stealth fighter:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chengdu_J-20

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/F22_Raptor

copy cats... There are even reports from US Intelligence Agency that they've been hacked a few months before China unveils their Stealth Fighter. They also confirmed that the hacker is trying to get files related to stealth technology...

Never said China is better that the US.

The US is still the undisputed economic political military superpower in the world. Still the international police.

China wants to be one. Using her pirated military equipments and crappy imitation products.:lol::lol::lol:

....yes on puny countries like us and Vietnam. But why not China project the same superpower bully to the US or Russia or India or Brazil. Countries of the same size.

Thats why Im not sure if the BRICS (Brazil, Russia, INdia, China and South Africa) will ever succeed if turned into a club of new rich countries like the caucasian dominated G8 countries.Why because except for South Africa and Brazil, Russia, CHina and India hate each other.:lol::lol::lol::lol:

BRICS, right now, is more of an economic phenomenon which, in turn, has increasing clout in international politics. its evolution into an exclusive political and economic pact, at this time is remote. these are for both the simple and complex reasons that china and india have an evolving power struggle against each other on almos every front.

we must remember that the G8 was once only a G7. it became its present state when the USSR became extinct and the resulting russian state abandoned its plans (at least, overtly) of challenging the US for world dominance, and was thereby admitted to the group that became the present G8.

with the present state of affairs between china and india, for them to join a single club is like warsaw and NATO forming a single alliance during the cold war. at this time, at least, that is not possible because the very reason why one strengthens its influence is to counter the other.:lol:

Casualties and losses

UNITED STATES - 58,220 dead
VIETNAM - 1,176,000 military dead, 2,000,000 civilian dead (3.17 million population total)

:fiddle:

dIhGYu5Uc08 Reminds me of the casualties of the Philippine-American War.

US side: 4,165 killed. 3,000 wounded

Philippine side:

soldiers killed - 20,000
civilians killed - 1,500,000. Don't think of this number in 21st century terms. Think of this number in relation to the total Philippine population at that time. The population of the Philippines in 1900 was 7,409,000.

So from that point of view, it can be said that 1/6 of the entire Philippine population was wiped out during the War, or that's 21% of the whole population, which is pretty steep and mind boggling.

Saw this video last year and it reminded me of KO toys from China

KXRa5IGmVto

Never said China is better that the US.

The US is still the undisputed economic political military superpower in the world. Still the international police.

China wants to be one. Using her pirated military equipments and crappy imitation products.:lol::lol::lol:

I totally agree with that! :cheers::lol::lol::lol::lol:

does philippine have a good relationship with indonesia and malaysia and which countries are top 3 enemies of philippine?

Malaysia helped create the MNLF to overthrow former President Marcos but even after former President Marcos is gone, they still continued the fight because they went uncontrollable from Malaysia that's why whenever there's a peace talk involving Islamic rebel groups... Malaysia is always there to observe.

If its cheaper than those Italian M346 or Korean T-50. Russia na.

It shares the same performance as the Alenia Aermacchi M-346.

baka secret. parang yung smart bombs din, nalaman lang natin nung ginamit nila

but then, IMO, it is better secret than China knowing and scrambling and accusing us as aggressors...hehehehe

The smart bombs were not a secret, it was one of the million dollars precision guided munitions that were given by the United States some time ago and it was posted in our local newspapers.

How about we exchange this for tons of supply of bananas ? :lol:

We won't be able to do that because of the international arms and trade embargo that was imposed on Iran.

Never said China is better that the US.

The US is still the undisputed economic political military superpower in the world. Still the international police.

China wants to be one. Using her pirated military equipments and crappy imitation products.:lol::lol::lol:

Yan ang katotohanan :lol:

yeah sure, but according the post below, a nation can be classified as a superpower if it has got a couple of nukes to shoot :hilarious

ok so both iran and north korea are the mighty supwerpowers now? :nuts: :crazy:

folks, superpower is a very wide term, more than both military and economic power. many factors have to be taken into consideration as well especially in aspects such as media, diplomacy, banking, technology, healthcare, education, popularity, living standard, contribution to the world, participation in international events, democracy index, aid money, quality of life, entertainment and more. :yawn:

we are then both on the same page in this issue. a superpower status (or the lack of it) is a combination of hard power (military strength) and soft power (diplomatic clout) factors plus a county's degree of global economic influence.

in the hard power arena, a combination of nuclear and conventional forces should be considered in terms of technology, quantities (materiel and manpower), world-wide reach, degree of superiority over and above any other country, and the financial capability to create such a military-industrial complex. save for the manpower, the US is the undisputed leader in all aspects. These are in addtion to the US' superior but increasingly challenged global diplomatic clout.

Where did you get the 65 trillion dollars?:lol::lol::lol:

it is the economic clout and out put which china should possess in order to match it's population ratio

European Caucasians are being kicked out one by one by Asians and former colonies..:lol::lol::lol: I will not be surprised Italy and the United Kingdom will be stricken out of this list.

does it mean the living standard of italian and the british people will be transformed into a third world standard and they will be getting some aids from the oversea countries like india and china? :lol:

Of numbers matter. Do you really think UK really has an advantage over China in terms of armaments?prove it.

the royal navy is considered second to the united states navy in terms of total military power projection.

the uk has the biggest air force and navy in the european union. it's cutting edge technology is second to none.

it's type 45 air defense destroyers are most advanced in the world and it's astute class nuclear-powered submarines are the stealthiest and deadliest attack submarines. not to mention the trident missiles which can travel 13,500 miles per hour and can strike to any part of the globe. :angel:

but of course today's royal navy is nowhere close to the size and quantity of 20th centry royal navy when it was a dominant world power and it used to control 1/3 of the the globe and also possessed the unchallengeable sea power at the time.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Royal_Navy
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Type_45_destroyer
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Astute_class_submarine
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Queen_Elizabeth_class_aircraft_carrier
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_aircraft_carriers_by_country
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HMS_Vanguard_(S28)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/UGM-133_Trident_II
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Global_Combat_Ship
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Defense_contractor
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BAE_Systems_Taranis
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BAE_Systems

world's biggest defense contractors (china is not even close to the group of world's top 20) :sad2:

http://i.imgur.com/tWiGQ.jpg


By the way, you still need people to operate such armaments even those unmanned ones. Somebody should push the button.:lol::lol:

UK is currently working on 6 UAV projects as far as i know, among them BAE Taranis is the coolest one imo because it is unmanned, undetectable by radar, it is stealth, it carries a lot of weapons including air to air and air to ground laser guided missiles, it can penetrate the enemy airspace in another continent. it can also track and engage in dogfights with other manned fighter jets although it is not controlled by a human pilot.

http://i.imgur.com/H3edm.jpg

check out the link for more pics mate http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=1429492

no doubt china is many years behind when it comes to UAVs and future drones.


By the way, even if you have "better living conditions" because of your higher income do you think you are happy?:lol::lol::lol:

well, richer does not necessarily mean happier but if you have higher income it makes your life more comfortable, you have more freedom as you can do anything in you life. you can have english breakfast in london in the morning, lunch in a french restaurant on top of the eiffel tower and dinner in a lovely city rome etc you can do that in the same day (you can even visit the moon if you pay) and i believe money is not everything but it makes your life a lot easier. :D i suppose!

Its the end results that matters

if that's the case, then it doesn't matter how long we hold out a Chinese attack (if it does happen); maybe 4 days, 4 weeks, or 4 months, but let's admit it--w/o outside help we're gonna crumble eventually...

WE need armaments like this:


http://en.rian.ru/images/16016/24/160162414.jpg
http://en.rian.ru/images/16016/24/160162414.jpg
Iranian missile system

we can probably buy TELs (used) from countries in Eastern Europe and those from the former Soviet Union... NoKor has a lot of them (suspected to be from Czech Republic or Belarus) with ranges between 200 to 3000km--they revealed a new TEL (medium-range) in a recent parade which looks to be manufactured from China...

pero kahit simpleng short-range missiles lang at SAMs okay na...

:cheers:

some quite old news but sounds interesting. :)

USA Russia Australia Japan Indonesia -Supports Philippines for Spratly Disputes

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-xmxqC2QCd3M/T2NDFl8KJLI/AAAAAAAANhM/UFR7YjiBXSM/s320/USA%252C%2BRussia%252C%2BAustralia%252C%2BJapan%252C%2BIndonesia%2BSupports%2BPhilippines%2B%2509for%2BSpratly%2BDisputes-701845.png

Russia will support the Philippines for the Spratly Disputes against China's force

March 13, 2012: Russia Pronounce its support to the Philippines over Spratly disputes with china and other claimants. Philippines - Russia is supporting the Philippines' stand that rules based on transparency and diplomacy should be used to resolve maritime issues.

USA Supports the Philippines for the Spartly Disputes

June 14, 2011. The Unites States (US) on Tuesday threw its support to the Philippines amid the escalating tensions over the disputed Spratly Islands in the West Philippine Sea (South China Sea).

"I assure you, in all subjects, we, the United States are with the Philippines," US Ambassador Harry Thomas said in his speech during the grand launch of the National Renewable Energy Program in Makati.

"The Philippines and the United States are strategic treaty allies. We are partners. We will continue to consult and work with each other on all issues, including the South China Sea," he added.

Malacañang earlier expressed confidence that the US will side on the Philippines, citing Mutual Defense Treaty (MDT) in case the territorial dispute in the West Philippine Sea heightens.

Australia expresses support for Philippines on Spratlys dispute :cheers1::kiss:

November 14th, 2011. President Benigno Aquino III on Saturday received Australia's support for the Philippines' move to declare the West Philippine Sea (South China Sea) as a zone of peace, freedom, friendship and cooperation.

Mr. Aquino met with Australian Prime Minister Julia Gillard on the sidelines of the Asia-Pacific Economic Cooperation (Apec) summit, according to presidential spokesperson Edwin Lacierda.

"(The) Australian prime minister just mentioned that 20 percent of their exports pass through the West Philippine Sea. Basically, that's it and the President spoke on the solution of the West Philippine Sea being a zone of peace, freedom, friendship and cooperation," Lacierda said in a news briefing.

Asked whether there was an expression of support, Lacierda said, "Yes, yes."

Foreign Undersecretary Laura del Rosario, who attended the bilateral meeting, said Gillard also lauded Mr. Aquino's efforts to promote transparency and accountability.

"The Australian prime minister congratulated or applauded the President on his governance initiatives, in all his steps that he has taken to make sure that, he called it technical corruption, is also being addressed and that resources are being freed to address our need," Del Rosario said.

Del Rosario said Gillard asked Mr. Aquino to visit Australia possibly in mid-2012.

Philippines gets Japan support on Spratlys dispute

September 28th, 2011. President Benigno Aquino III on Tuesday night secured Japanese Prime Minister Yoshihiko Noda's support for a peaceful resolution of the six-nation dispute over the potentially oil-rich Spratly islands.

The maritime issue in the South China Sea, which Manila calls the West Philippine Sea, ranked high in the agenda of the two leaders' meeting that sought to elevate their country's bilateral relations to a more meaningful "strategic partnership."

In a joint statement, Mr. Aquino and Noda "confirmed that the South China Sea is vital, as it connects the world and the Asia Pacific region, and that peace and stability therein is of common interest to the international community."

Following the meeting, the President and Noda "confirmed that freedom of navigation, unimpeded commerce, and compliance with established international law including the UNCLOS and the peaceful settlement of disputes serve the interests of the two countries and the whole region." UNCLOS refers to the UN Convention on the Law of the Sea.

Indonesia supports PHL stand on Spratlys

14 DECEMBER 2011. Indonesian government assured the Philippines that its proposal to segregate parts of the disputed West Philippine Sea will not be rejected by the Association of Southeast Asian Nations (ASEAN) amid alleged bullying by China.

The Philippines and Indonesia concluded on Wednesday the 5th Joint Commission for Bilateral Cooperation (JCBC) in Manila where they discussed extensively the scheduled drafting of the legally binding Code of Conduct that will govern claimant countries to the disputed parts of the West Philippine Sea.

"ASEAN as a whole has a very strong interest to settle the dispute peacefully in accordance with maritime laws."

In a joint statement on Tuesday, Filipino and Indonesian diplomats agreed to conclude a plan of action covering the period 2013 to 2015 that will cover trade, security, defense and border cooperation as well as cultural issues.

link (http://betterphils.blogspot.com/2012/03/usa-russia-australia-japan-indonesia.html#.T4-L27MthlM)

I'm surprised with Russia, but anyway,
:grouphug:

if that's the case, then it doesn't matter how long we hold out a Chinese attack (if it does happen); maybe 4 days, 4 weeks, or 4 months, but let's admit it--w/o outside help we're gonna crumble eventually...



Well, outside help should be secondary in nature. What's more important is seriously getting into the business of upgrading the defense that extends out to the air and sea since Philippines is a maritime country.

Me too on RUSSIA. The latest news is that they have war games with China. I wonder how this affects their relationship with Beijing, i mean their support

Russia is in it for the sales of war equipment! they sell to PHL, they sell to china. they profit, they win.

dumating na kaya yung Corvette natin from South Korea??????

being said that china can fight a war only in it's backyard it does not have any power projection to fight in other part of the globe. it's navy is shit imo :ohno:

a lot of modernization needs to be done in order to catch up with the other global players.

oh i even heard that they are still struggling to produce good homemade jet engines, is it true? :dunno:

Well, outside help should be secondary in nature. What's more important is seriously getting into the business of upgrading the defense that extends out to the air and sea since Philippines is a maritime country.

well, right now it looks like the US is distancing itself from the SCS issue based on latest news...

anyway, just a week after NoKor launched theirs, India has launched their Agni V ICBM with a range of 5000km (enough to strike Shanghai and even Beijing)... no word yet if the launch is successful or not...

Media say India tests missile that can hit Beijing
Associated PressBy RAVI NESSMAN | Associated Press – 47 mins ago

NEW DELHI (AP) — India test launched a new nuclear-capable missile Thursday that would give it, for the first time, the capability of striking the major Chinese cities of Beijing and Shanghai, according to television news channels.

The government has hailed the Agni-V missile, with a range of 5,000 kilometers (3,100 miles), as a major boost to its efforts to counter China's regional dominance and become an Asian power in its own right.

...

rest of article:
http://news.yahoo.com/media-india-tests-missile-hit-beijing-030322313.html


EDIT the launch is successful... even more amazing is its possible to develop MIRV for the Agni V...:shocked:

Reminds me of the casualties of the Philippine-American War.

US side: 4,165 killed. 3,000 wounded

Philippine side:

soldiers killed - 20,000
civilians killed - 1,500,000. Don't think of this number in 21st century terms. Think of this number in relation to the total Philippine population at that time. The population of the Philippines in 1900 was 7,409,000.

So from that point of view, it can be said that 1/6 of the entire Philippine population was wiped out during the War, or that's 21% of the whole population, which is pretty steep and mind boggling.

The only difference - Philippines was fragmented. On the other hand, the VC's gained widespread support against the corrupt South Vietnamese government. They proved themselves through self determination.

Russia is in it for the sales of war equipment! they sell to PHL, they sell to china. they profit, they win.

Parang us lang nung WW1 before they joined the war. I hope they dont meddle if ever there'd be a stalemate...?

it is the economic clout and out put which china should possess in order to match it's population ratio



does it mean the living standard of italian and the british people will be transformed into a third world standard and they will be getting some aids from the oversea countries like india and china? :lol:



the royal navy is considered second to the united states navy in terms of total military power projection.

the uk has the biggest air force and navy in the european union. it's cutting edge technology is second to none.

it's type 45 air defense destroyers are most advanced in the world and it's astute class nuclear-powered submarines are the stealthiest and deadliest attack submarines. not to mention the trident missiles which can travel 13,422 miles per hour and can strike to any part of the globe. :angel:

but of course today's royal navy is nowhere close to the size and quantity of 20th centry royal navy and when it was a dominant world power which used to control 1/3 of the earth surface and possessed the unchallengeable sea power.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Royal_Navy
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Type_45_destroyer
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Astute_class_submarine
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Queen_Elizabeth_class_aircraft_carrier
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_aircraft_carriers_by_country
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HMS_Vanguard_(S28)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/UGM-133_Trident_II
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Global_Combat_Ship
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Defense_contractor
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BAE_Systems_Taranis


world's biggest defense contractors (china is not even close to the group of world's top 20) :sad2:

http://i.imgur.com/tWiGQ.jpg




UK is currently working on 6 UAV projects as far as i know, among them BAE Taranis is the coolest one imo because it is unmanned, undetectable by radar, it is stealth, it carries a lot of weapons including air to air and air to ground laser guided missiles, it can penetrate the enemy airspace in another continent. it can also track and engage in dogfights with other manned fighter jets although it is not controlled by a human pilot.

http://i.imgur.com/H3edm.jpg

http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=1429492

no doubt china is many years behind when it comes to UAVs and future drones.




well, richer does not necessarily mean happier but if you have higher income it makes your life more comfortable, you have more freedom as you can do anything in you life. you can have english breakfast in london in the morning, lunch in a french restaurant on top of the eiffel tower and dinner in a lovely city rome etc you can do that in the same day (you can even visit the moon if you pay) and i believe money is not everything but it makes your life a lot easier. :D i suppose!

i didn't realized that the f35 joint strike fighter is already operational. very good for the RAF then!

well, right now it looks like the US is distancing itself from the SCS issue based on latest news...

anyway, just a week after NoKor launched theirs, India has launched their Agni V ICBM with a range of 5000km (enough to strike Shanghai and even Beijing)... no word yet if the launch is successful or not...

Media say India tests missile that can hit Beijing
Associated PressBy RAVI NESSMAN | Associated Press – 47 mins ago


I think they are being cautious. You know how China can twist facts ans that the US image is not really the "savior" image.

I read in the news though that Sec Rosales(?) is in the US I believe to raise the issue with the US

being said that china can fight only in it's backyard it does not have any power projection to fight in other part of the globe. it's navy is shit imo :ohno:

a lot of modernization needs to be done in order to catch up with the other global players.

That is what China has been trying to build to project its naval power in China Seas, and the Indian Ocean in the future.

That is what China has been trying to build to project its naval power in China Seas, and the Indian Ocean in the future.

And potentially the pacific. That being said, the US will eventually have to be more generous in arms to us if they seriously want to contain China.

In theory, we dont need a strong army. But then, it is not a bad plan b back up to have one in case the airforce and navy are outmaneuvered. In reality, we do need a strong army. We have NPAs and MILFs in our jungles. You can't find them with the Navy or even airforce. As a matter of fact, you would not even want to constantly bomb them as these sissies usually live in civilian populated areas, the NPA's especially.

Also, do not assume that the MILF will be loyal to "the country". A lot of their financiers are not even local muslims and the reds for sure will take advantage to assault the military as a whole (there was an MGB youtube vid I watched where the NPAs ambushed an airforce unit in Batangas or Laguna, I don't exactly remember which provice)

We need not EXPAND the army to such an extent but instead just IMPROVE its quality and mettle. That's all we need. The greater dangers lie out at sea and in the air as these are the main entry points of enemy troops from whichever country they hail from. We need a decent army but not as expansive to the extent of how large we need our navy and air force to be. We also need to balance where to spend the money. It might turn out to be another financial burden and I don't want the country to run on deficit spending anymore. And we still have other priorities like social/basic services. We just need to develop which areas should be developed.

We need not EXPAND the army to such an extent but instead just IMPROVE its quality and mettle. That's all we need. The greater dangers lie out at sea and in the air as these are the main entry points of enemy troops from whichever country they hail from. We need a decent army but not as expansive to the extent of how large we need our navy and air force to be. We also need to balance where to spend the money. It might turn out to be another financial burden and I don't want the country to run on deficit spending anymore. And we still have other priorities like social/basic services. We just need to develop which areas should be developed.
That is why i said strong army not big army. I never mentioned big army. I merely stressed that ground troops should not be "ditched".

Russia is in it for the sales of war equipment! they sell to PHL, they sell to china. they profit, they win.

they may both have more or less, the same types of repressive governments, but russia and china have had a historical mistrust toward each other. a militarily dominant and militarily aggrresive china is not a receptive concept or idea to kremlin.

we are then both on the same page in this issue. a superpower status (or the lack of it) is a combination of hard power (military strength) and soft power (diplomatic clout) factors plus a county's degree of global economic influence.

in the hard power arena, a combination of nuclear and conventional forces should be considered in terms of technology, quantities (materiel and manpower), world-wide reach, degree superiority of superiorityover and above any other country, and the financial capability to create such a military-industiral complex. save for the manpower, the US is the undisputed leader in all aspects. These are in addtion to the US' superior but increasingly challenged global diplomatic clout.

i second that, thank you.

South Korea to Gift Corvette to Philippines Navy

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-jmvOsgBBfgQ/TpTebA4ZX5I/AAAAAAAAKso/rWhHeHr2jmA/s400/Po%2BHang.jpg

Po Hang Retires To The Tropics

South Korea is donating one of its recently retired Po Hang class corvettes to the Philippines Navy. The Po Hangs are 1,200 ton warships that first entered service in 1984. Since then 24 have been built. Each is armed with four Harpoon anti-ship missiles, one 76mm cannon; two twin 40mm automatic cannon, six torpedo tubes and twelve depth charges. The crew of 95 also operates radar and sonar. Top speed is 59 kilometers an hour. Two Po Hangs have been retired so far, and one was sunk by a North Korean torpedo last year.

link (http://defense-studies.blogspot.com/2011/10/south-korea-to-gift-corvette-to.html)
I hope this one has arrived....

Why don't the government try to look for Philippine-based shipbuilders and let them build our ships? Maybe we can see something workable here inside the country. We may also start creating a bigger WAR INDUSTRY. It could be a win-win solution somehow. We get the military equipment we need and the economy benefits from it. At least if war breaks, we are capable of replenishing lost armaments and supplies on our own to avoid being overwhelmed by the enemy.

Why don't the government try to look for Philippine-based shipbuilders and let them build our ships?

don't be a nationalist, the world has become a little village now and the globalisation is also a good creation for human. :cheers:

don't be a nationalist, the world has become a little village now and the globalisation is also a good creation for human. :cheers:

Philippines has a ship building industry to begin with so given enough time, investment and technology, the country has the potential to build its own warships.

Also, commercial ships are also currently being manufactured in the Philippines from many shipping companies around the world - mostly tankers and cargoes.

So yes, globalization is also a good creation for human. :D

Why don't the government try to look for Philippine-based shipbuilders and let them build our ships? Maybe we can see something workable here inside the country. We may also start creating a bigger WAR INDUSTRY. It could be a win-win solution somehow. We get the military equipment we need and the economy benefits from it. At least if war breaks, we are capable of replenishing lost armaments and supplies on our own to avoid being overwhelmed by the enemy.

There were ships that were already subcontracted by the Philippine navy - but most of them are transport/support ships for the mean time.

Buti pa SK nagbibigay ng libre.:lol:

Philippines has a ship building industry to begin with so given enough time, investment and technology, the country has the potential to build its own warships.

Also, commercial ships are also currently being manufactured in the Philippines from many shipping companies around the world - mostly tankers and cargoes.

So yes, globalization is also a good creation for human. :D


sure, philipine needs to invest more in it's ship building industry and technology research/development industry as well.

who knows philipine may probably get a leader like hitler one day and then start occupying and dominating the entire asian regions :horse:

sure, philipine needs to invest more in it's both ship building industry and technology research and development industry. how knows philipine can probably get a leader like hitler one day and then start dominating the entire asian regions :horse:

I don't think we're gonna go that far. Before that happens, people power will take place first to topple the dictator like what we did in '86. :lol:

Besides, with China being assertive on projecting its power in the region, what Philippines needed right now is a defensive power position similar to Taiwan.

Umaabuso na tong bwisita ha.. :lol:

Umaabuso na tong bwisita ha.. :lol:

Alam ko, minamaliit ang kakayahan ng Pinas.

Pero may insight din tayo na nakukuha diba tungkol sa pinaguusapan natin ngayon. :lol:

I don't think we're gonna go that far. Before that happens, people power will take place first to topple the dictator like what we did in '86. :lol:

Besides, with China being assertive on projecting its power in the region, what Philippines needed right now is a defensive power position similar to Taiwan.

true ture!!! i think what philipine needs right now is to spend a bit more on defense and then it will find extra budget to purchase a nice multirole fighter jet like Gripen (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saab_JAS_39_Gripen). china forces will not be able to land on the philipine soil if it can't control the airspace of philipine. any chinese ship which tries to approach the coast will be boomed and smashed into pieces by the fighter jets of the PAF! :cheers2:

gusto ko nga merong hitler sa pinas eh:lol: yung good qualities ni hitler:D

ito hitler din namn si ngoy kaso softhearted :lol:

true ture!!! i think what philipine needs right now is to spend a bit more on defense and then it will find extra budget to purchase a nice multirole fighter jet like Gripen (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saab_JAS_39_Gripen). china forces will not be able to land on the philipine soil if it can't control the airspace of philipine. :cheers:
hey SO143 where are you from?


143= i love you ba?:lol:

don't be a nationalist, the world has become a little village now and the globalisation is also a good creation for human. :cheers:

Why not? I'm a Filipino, I should be devoted to my country more than anything else. :bash:

Buti pa SK nagbibigay ng libre.:lol:

pede na pagtyagaan yan panghuli antin sa mga tsikom fishermen kuno:lol:

Umaabuso na tong bwisita ha.. :lol:

Alam ko, minamaliit ang kakayahan ng Pinas.

Pero may insight din tayo na nakukuha diba tungkol sa pinaguusapan natin ngayon. :lol:


duda na talaga ako dyan, di ba sumulpot lang yan ng nawala na yung unang ogag na tsikom? siguro sabi nila ibahin na naman nila style sa pag aatake dito sa ating pinasfora:nuts:

parangkasama ata'to ni 'olivio' galingsanakaraangthread ah. nahahlatakona'ng jejemonato. :lol::lol::lol:

wa'gna patulanangmga kasamanigolai. :)

Let's have a look at your budget, shall we


Source, Wikipedia:
Budget Allocation Millions of Pesos
(PHP) Millions of US Dollars
(USD) %
Department of Education
₱207,300 $4,573 30.86%
Department of Public Works and Highways
110,600 2,439.8 16.46%
Department of National Defense
104,700 2,309.7 15.58%
Department of Interior and Local Government
88,200 1,945.7 13.13%
Department of Agriculture
37,700 831.7 5.61%
Department of Social Welfare and Development
34,300 756.7 5.11%
Department of Health
33,300 734.6 4.96%
Department of Transportation and Communications
32,300 712.5 4.81%
State Universities and Colleges
23,400 516.2 3.48%


*As per Wikipedia...

Now where would you like to cut spending, because it's not required.

I repeat what I have stated earlier. If China really wants to occupy, for no real reason, Philippines, there is nothing you can do to keep them away from your shores. You don't have the funds to put up a military that could make a difference.

Your social problems and economic development should be your first priority.

I agree, your army should update their equipment, in order to get a the domestic problems under control. If that is actually really wanted.

Once you are actually on par with your neighbouring countries you can waste your money on big ships and fancy fighter jets...

why are you guys so xenophobic, jeez...:doh: are we just gonna scare/intimidate any foreign forumers??:ohno:

and btw, he posts in the UK Thread, Oliver (IIRC) posts in the east asian forum and the skybar

Let's have a look at your budget, shall we


Source, Wikipedia:
Budget Allocation Millions of Pesos
(PHP) Millions of US Dollars
(USD) %
Department of Education
₱207,300 $4,573 30.86%
Department of Public Works and Highways
110,600 2,439.8 16.46%
Department of National Defense
104,700 2,309.7 15.58%
Department of Interior and Local Government
88,200 1,945.7 13.13%
Department of Agriculture
37,700 831.7 5.61%
Department of Social Welfare and Development
34,300 756.7 5.11%
Department of Health
33,300 734.6 4.96%
Department of Transportation and Communications
32,300 712.5 4.81%
State Universities and Colleges
23,400 516.2 3.48%


*As per Wikipedia...

Now where would you like to cut spending, because it's not required.

I repeat what I have stated earlier. If China really wants to occupy, for no real reason, Philippines, there is nothing you can do to keep them away from your shores. You don't have the funds to put up a military that could make a difference.

Your social problems and economic development should be your first priority.

I agree, your army should update their equipment, in order to get a the domestic problems under control. If that is actually really wanted.

Once you are actually on par with your neighbouring countries you can waste your money on big ships and fancy fighter jets...

oh so oyu want us to discuss our military plan with you now?:lol: don;t dictate us of what to do, just mind your own business and stop those bullies instead!

why are you guys so xenophobic, jeez...:doh: are we just gonna scare/intimidate any foreign forumers??:ohno:

and btw, he posts in the UK Thread, Oliver (IIRC) posts in the east asian forum and the skybar

not really ah, we just should have extra precautions since a word war might escalate and thus will result to closure of our dear threads:cheers:

why are you guys so xenophobic, jeez...:doh: are we just gonna scare/intimidate any foreign forumers??:ohno:

and btw, he posts in the UK Thread, Oliver (IIRC) posts in the east asian forum and the skybar

i agree, why do we always consider threads such as this like "we" own it?:ohno::bash:
we can actually get some insight (good or bad) from others even from that ultra-nationalist chicom oliver.

He tends to somewhat impose his ultr-nationalist beliefs here. It's ok to share and if everyone agrees, then great. But this is still the Philippines. Whether to agree or to not agree will be up to the Filipinos. The problem is when they start to bash the country and become so big and mighty right in our own turf. It would be fine if this were the Chinese forums. We're not doing the same thing to them in their turf anyway so why are they still wasting time here? I do not see any good insight from that oliver, just declarations of how powerful China is and that the Philippines should just deal with it.

Everyone who has an insight is welcome. Just try not to overdo it. (I've been trying hold back my horses as much as possible)

He tends to somewhat impose his ultr-nationalist beliefs here. It's ok to share and if everyone agrees, then great. But this is still the Philippines. Whether to agree or to not agree will be up to the Filipinos. The problem is when they start to bash the country and become so big and mighty right in our own turf. It would be fine if this were the Chinese forums. We're not doing the same thing to them in their turf anyway so why are they still wasting time here? I do not see any good insight from that oliver, just declarations of how powerful China is and that the Philippines should just deal with it.

Everyone who has an insight is welcome. Just try not to overdo it. (I've been trying hold back my horses as much as possible)

If everyone agrees as you want it, then that defeats the purpose of a forum. Guess we're just too onion-skinned.

Might as well join all those cult pseudo-religion sprouting everywhere.
and one more thing...this is not the Philippines...this is the INTERNET.

there's no turf... we don't own shit, we all have the same "privileges"--being able to post in a private forum such as this... as long as we abide by the rules, everyone should be free to post anywhere, whether we agree with the views or not; this is a forum after all...

:cheers:

oliver was just trolling:D we just responded:D by feeding him

there's no turf... we don't own shit, we all have the same "privileges"--being able to post in a private forum such as this... as long as we abide by the rules, everyone should be free to post anywhere, whether we agree with the views or not; this is a forum after all...

:cheers:

That's what i don't get from some of the posters here, they think they own the threads named after them or their place...damn...we might as well impose a visa for anyone who visits "our" threads then.

Anyway, this is so OT.

with this particular development, don't you guys think it's time for us to bolster our economic and military ties with the Indians? :naughty:

India Tests Nuke-Capable Missile Able to Hit China (http://abcnews.go.com/International/wireStory/india-tests-nuke-capable-missile-hit-china-16169270)
By RAVI NESSMAN Associated Press
NEW DELHI April 19, 2012 (AP)


India announced the successful test launch Thursday of a new nuclear-capable missile that would give it the capability of striking the major Chinese cities of Beijing and Shanghai for the first time.

The Agni-V missile, with a range of 5,000 kilometers (3,100 miles), still requires a battery of tests before it can be inducted into India's arsenal. But officials hailed the successful launch as a major boost to the country's efforts to counter China's regional dominance and become a respected world power in its own right.

"The nation stands tall today," Defense Minister A.K. Antony said, according to the Press Trust of India.

The test came just days after North Korea's own failed rocket launch, but sparked none of the same global condemnation that greeted that test.

Video released by the government showed the Agni-V taking off from a small launcher on what appeared to be railroad tracks at 8:07 a.m. from Wheeler Island off India's east coast. It rose on a pillar of flame, trailing billows of smoke behind, before arcing through the sky.

The missile hit an altitude of more than 600 kilometers (370 miles), its three stages worked properly and its payload was deployed as planned, the head of India's Defense Research and Development Organization, Vijay Saraswat, told Times Now news channel.

"India has emerged from this launch as a major missile power," he said.

The window for the launch opened Wednesday night, but the test had to be postponed because of weather conditions.

Avinash Chandra, mission director for the test, said that when the launch took place Thursday morning the missile performed as planned.

"We have achieved exactly what we wanted to achieve in this mission," he told Times Now.

The Chinese government did not immediately comment on the missile launch. State-owned China Central Television called the test "a historic moment for India and it shows that India has joined the club of the countries that own ballistic missiles."

The state broadcaster then enumerated some of the missile's shortcomings, from a problem with guidance systems to its 50-ton-plus weight, which it said would require it to be fired from fixed, not mobile positions and thus make it more vulnerable to attack.

"It does not pose a threat in reality," CCTV said.

The Agni-V is a solid-fuel, three-stage missile designed to carry a 1.5-ton nuclear warhead. It stands 17.5 meters (57 feet) tall and was built almost completely with Indian-made technology at a reported cost of 25 billion rupees ($486 million). It can be moved across the country by road or rail and can be used to carry multiple warheads or to launch satellites into orbit.

The missile will need four or five more trials before it can be inducted into India's arsenal at some point in 2014 or 2015, Indian officials said.

China is far ahead of India in the missile race, with intercontinental ballistic missiles capable of reaching anywhere in India. Currently, the longest-range Indian missile, the Agni-III, has a range of 3,500 kilometers (2,100 miles) and falls short of many major Chinese cities.

India hailed Thursday's test as a major step in its fight to be seen as a world power.

"India has today become a nation with the capability to develop, produce, build long-range ballistic missiles and today we are among the six countries who have this capability," Saraswat said.

Analysts say France, Russia, China and the United States have this technology, while Israel is also believed to have developed such missiles.

India and China fought a war in 1962 and continue to nurse a border dispute. India has also been suspicious of Beijing's efforts to increase its influence in the Indian Ocean in recent years.

"While China doesn't really consider India any kind of a threat or any kind of a rival, India definitely doesn't think in the same way," said Rahul Bedi, a defense analyst in New Delhi.

India already has the capability of hitting anywhere inside archrival Pakistan, but has engaged in a splurge of defense spending in recent years to counter the perceived Chinese threat.

The Indian navy took command of a Russian nuclear submarine earlier this year, and India is expected to take delivery of a retrofitted Soviet-built aircraft carrier soon.

The new Agni, named for the Hindi word for fire, is part of this military buildup and was designed to hit deep inside China, Bedi said.

Government officials said the missile should not be seen as a threat.

"We have a declared no-first-use policy, and all our missile systems, they are not country specific. There is no threat to anybody," said Ravi Gupta, spokesman for the Defense Research and Development Organization, which built the missile. "Our missile systems are purely for deterrence and to meet our security needs."

The test came days after North Korea's failed long-range rocket launch. North Korea said the rocket was launched to put a satellite into space, but the U.S. and other countries said it was a cover for testing long-range missile technology.

One Delhi-based Western diplomat dismissed comparisons with the international condemnation of North Korea's launch, saying that Pyongyang was violating U.N. Security Council resolutions requiring it to suspend its missile program, while India is not considered a global threat. The diplomat spoke on condition of anonymity because he was not authorized to comment on India's security affairs.

In Washington, State Department spokesman Mark Toner said the United States urges all nuclear-capable states to exercise restraint regarding nuclear capabilities.

"That said, India has a solid non-proliferation record," he told a news briefing. "They're engaged with the international community on non-proliferation issues."

Some reports characterized the Agni-V as an intercontinental ballistic missile — which would make India one of the few countries to have that capability — but Gupta and analysts said its range fell short of that category.

India has no need for such sophisticated weapons, said Rajaram Nagappa, a missile expert and the head of the International Strategic and Security Studies Program at the National Institute of Advanced Studies in Bangalore.

"I don't think our threat perceptions are anything beyond this region," he said.

As for me, it seems like a healthy discussion so far. If they have the bragging rights, let them have it as long as its supported by facts and sound view points. I think we can learn from each other.

oliver was just trolling:D we just responded:D by feeding him

iba naman yun--troll mode na talaga ang ginawa...:nuts: eto parang si goolai lang sa naivety level...:D

with this particular development, don't you guys think it's time for us to bolster our economic and military ties with the Indians? :naughty:

I expect the Left are now saying India is demonising (Mother) China.:lol:

oh so oyu want us to discuss our military plan with you now?:lol: don;t dictate us of what to do, just mind your own business and stop those bullies instead!

I am dictating? I am asking you whether your beloved country hasn't got bigger issues...
Are you capable of contributing properly to a discussion?

andami namang pumapasok d2.... mga ispiya cguro ang mga 2.

Let's have a look at your budget, shall we


Source, Wikipedia:
Budget Allocation Millions of Pesos
(PHP) Millions of US Dollars
(USD) %
Department of Education
₱207,300 $4,573 30.86%
Department of Public Works and Highways
110,600 2,439.8 16.46%
Department of National Defense
104,700 2,309.7 15.58%
Department of Interior and Local Government
88,200 1,945.7 13.13%
Department of Agriculture
37,700 831.7 5.61%
Department of Social Welfare and Development
34,300 756.7 5.11%
Department of Health
33,300 734.6 4.96%
Department of Transportation and Communications
32,300 712.5 4.81%
State Universities and Colleges
23,400 516.2 3.48%


*As per Wikipedia...

Now where would you like to cut spending, because it's not required.

I repeat what I have stated earlier. If China really wants to occupy, for no real reason, Philippines, there is nothing you can do to keep them away from your shores. You don't have the funds to put up a military that could make a difference.

Your social problems and economic development should be your first priority.

I agree, your army should update their equipment, in order to get a the domestic problems under control. If that is actually really wanted.

Once you are actually on par with your neighbouring countries you can waste your money on big ships and fancy fighter jets...

Thank you for this points that we already know. The social problems and economic development are being addressed continuously. It is an On Going process. Are you suggesting that we ignore the China threat and solve first the internal mess we have? Everyone knows we lack the hardwares but being vocal and diplomatic about this, for now is the only thing we could do.

dumating na kaya yung Corvette natin from South Korea??????

Anong corvette??? :ohno:

link (http://defense-studies.blogspot.com/2011/10/south-korea-to-gift-corvette-to.html)
I hope this one has arrived....

Don't believe everything you see in blogs until you see them posted in reliable news sources because blogs can also be made by fan boys and so-called military enthusiasts!

Gunsan PCC-757 Korea Takoma Shipyard
(now Hanjin Heavy Industries) 30 November 1984 29 September 2011 To Be Donated to Colombian Navy

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pohang_class_corvette#Ships_in_the_class

Decommissioned: 29 September 2011
Fate: transferred to Colombian Navy

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ROKS_Gunsan_(PCC-757)

Colombia is expanding its marine
corps and plans to create three new marine brigades. Colombian marines and
riverine forces play a crucial role in the
country’s counter-drug fight, and funding
for the navy and marine corps is expected
to remain high for the next few years. In
May 2011 Colombia received its first new
40-meter coastal-patrol vessel, the 11 de
Noviembre. The German-built, 245-ton,
CPV 40–class vessel is being joined by a
former South Korean Pohang-class ship
that will be formally donated to Colombia
later in 2012.

http://www.ericwertheim.com/Wertheim_Mar_12.pdf (page 47)

And that's what I said in my earlier post, a diplomatic option is the only viable. Amend your constitution and allow US to have a base on your turf.
I applaud your move to raise the matter to international attention and name and shame China for what they did. A blatant violation of your sovereign rights.

I would be just very disappointed if you spent money, you don't have, on equipment that wouldn't make a difference. If China would really come for you, though I wouldn't know why they would want a full out war with Philippines, there is little you can do to stop them.

Go ahead and buy proper Reconnaissance and Surveillance tools, upgrade the equipment of your marines so they can fight the guys in the jungle. F16, SAMs and destroyers, would be of little help in that.

don't be a nationalist, the world has become a little village now and the globalisation is also a good creation for human. :cheers:

..Why? I know, maybe perhaps, there will be somebody left to buy your products?Very self-serving..:lol::lol:

I am dictating? I am asking you whether your beloved country hasn't got bigger issues...
Are you capable of contributing properly to a discussion?

so what if we've got bigger issues? what's it to you??? so what if we put 100% of our budget in strengthening our defense, why does it really matter to you?

Philippines has a ship building industry to begin with so given enough time, investment and technology, the country has the potential to build its own warships.

Also, commercial ships are also currently being manufactured in the Philippines from many shipping companies around the world - mostly tankers and cargoes.

So yes, globalization is also a good creation for human. :D

On the other hand, we can be a nationalist and can embrace globalization at the same time. Just look at China, Japan, Korea and our ASEAN neighbors. They talk globalization yet they keep on protecting their industries.

The West like the UK wants countries to give up nationalism(actually nationalism made UK a very strong country during the mercantilism period) today because to survive they still need to screw other countries (buy their exports or will host their multinational companies) .:lol::lol::lol: .

I think there is a need to increase the number of naval patrol ships, our Navy is severely lacking in equipment. Granted that we will probably lose a naval war with China by ourselves, the increase in the number of ships will help help deter Chinese fishing vessels from poaching our seas.

Some local manufacturers could probably build fast patrol ships and the US should continue to donate used military ships to the Philippines. The purpose is to act as a deterrent to those Chinese fishing vessels.

Another US Base? They should give us a good package and we will probably think about it, the one they proposed in 1991 was inequitable that's why their lease was not extended.

I doubt however if China is willing to go to war given the present economic climate, a war will just ruin things for them. However, this does not mean that the Philippines should not be spending on its military capability.

And that's what I said in my earlier post, a diplomatic option is the only viable. Amend your constitution and allow US to have a base on your turf.
I applaud your move to raise the matter to international attention and name and shame China for what they did. A blatant violation of your sovereign rights.

I would be just very disappointed if you spent money, you don't have, on equipment that wouldn't make a difference. If China would really come for you, though I wouldn't know why they would want a full out war with Philippines, there is little you can do to stop them.

Go ahead and buy proper Reconnaissance and Surveillance tools, upgrade the equipment of your marines so they can fight the guys in the jungle. F16, SAMs and destroyers, would be of little help in that.

yes of course we will do that. we will settle the matter diplomatically but at the SAME TIME we will upgrade our military:) we are a peace loving country but tired already of the bullying of the communist china. it keeps on creeping to our shores, who knows one day we'll wake up and they're sleeping beside us already:nuts:

a strong military although is not a guarantee to deter enemies but at least it could remind the enemy to have a second thought of bullying us next time.

Why not? I'm a Filipino, I should be devoted to my country more than anything else. :bash:

He wants so to be devoted in buying goods from abroad so that other countries like his country will be strong and our country weak.

No matter what globalist says, its plain stupid not to love your country first before embracing an exploitative world.

Walang magmamahal sa sarili mo at sa bayan mo kundi sarili mo rin.

US, UK will talk about globalization kasi sila ang makikinabang dyan unang una.

He wants so to be devoted in buying goods from abroad so that other countries like his country will be strong and our country weak.

No matter what globalist says, its plain stupid not to love your country first before embracing an exploitative world.

Walang magmamahal sa sarili mo at sa bayan mo kundi sarili mo rin.

US, UK will talk about globalization kasi sila ang makikinabang dyan unang una.


korek!!! tayo lang naman kasi nag papaloko.

Pansin ko lang sa mga mukhang foreign forumers dito e feeling superior at lakas ng loob na magdikta kung anung gagawin natin..Great white hope ang feeling pa rin..

Parang China at Japan nuon...feeling nila puti na rin and still feel that the whites is the saviour of the world pa rin..

Kasalanan ng Pinoy, may nasabi lang ang foreigner, bilib na bilib na parang walang sariling bait...

parang yung isa rito na mukhang love na love ang Britanya. Kundi pa inabuso maraming bansa at pinagtatapon yung mga patapon sa kanila hindi naman yayaman. Ayaw nga ng Romans sa bansa nila e. toinks!

don't be a nationalist, the world has become a little village now and the globalisation is also a good creation for human. :cheers:

And every village has its own idiot. :lol::lol::lol:


i know you ain't scared of the rise of china but sorry to rock your boat and to be frank mate philippine would not stand a chance against a strong opponent like china, furthermore i do reckon that philipine won't survive more than 1 week if china deployed the combined forces and launched the constant attacks like shock and awe style used in iraq back in 2003. but this is very unlikely to happen as the international community alongside the UN will not allow this kind of violent actions. besides, this might probably motivate nato forces to participate in a new massive campaign in the chinese sea and over the chinese airspace.


The Philippines is indefensible. It's a useless exercise for China to even try.

pinadalhan ako ni noki noki ng wlang laman na mensahe, virus ba t? binuksan ko naman, naku :lol:

I think there is a need to increase the number of naval patrol ships, our Navy is severely lacking in equipment. Granted that we will probably lose a naval war with China by ourselves, the increase in the number of ships will help help deter Chinese fishing vessels from poaching our seas.

Some local manufacturers could probably build fast patrol ships and the US should continue to donate used military ships to the Philippines. The purpose is to act as a deterrent to those Chinese fishing vessels.

Another US Base? They should give us a good package and we will probably think about it, the one they proposed in 1991 was inequitable that's why their lease was not extended.

I doubt however if China is willing to go to war given the present economic climate, a war will just ruin things for them. However, this does not mean that the Philippines should not be spending on its military capability.

absolutely!

And every village has its own idiot. :lol::lol::lol:


:lol::lol::lol:

if all of you are browsing through the local defense forums, especially the Timawa forums, there are now five possible candidates for the Philippine Air Force surface attack aircraft/lead-in fighter training aircraft requirement:

http://www.airforce-technology.com/projects/yak_130/images/yak130_10.jpg
-- Yakovlev Yak-130 (Russia)

http://www.airforce-technology.com/projects/l159/images/l1591.jpg
-- Aero Vodochody L-159 ALCA (Czech Republic)

http://www.airforce-technology.com/projects/t-50/images/t50_3.jpg
-- KAI TA-50 Golden Eagle (South Korea)

http://www.airforce-technology.com/projects/yak/images/m-346_2.jpg
-- Alenia M-346 Master (Italy)

http://www.airforce-technology.com/projects/amx-fighter-bomber/images/img3.jpg
-- AMX (Italy-Brazil)

don't be a nationalist, the world has become a little village now and the globalisation is also a good creation for human. :cheers:

on the contrary, it's because of this global village phenomenon that the tribalism of some became exacerbated! for them to rise, they need or they want others to fall.

and what's the alternative to being NOT nationalistic? being exploited subjects of foreign rule? one thing's for sure: either proposal is a disaster for any nation or state.

if all of you are browsing through the local defense forums, especially the Timawa forums, there are now five possible candidates for the Philippine Air Force surface attack aircraft/lead-in fighter training aircraft requirement:

http://www.airforce-technology.com/projects/yak_130/images/yak130_10.jpg
-- Yakovlev Yak-130 (Russia)

http://www.airforce-technology.com/projects/l159/images/l1591.jpg
-- Aero Vodochody L-159 ALCA (Czech Republic)

http://www.airforce-technology.com/projects/t-50/images/t50_3.jpg
-- KAI TA-50 Golden Eagle (South Korea)

http://www.airforce-technology.com/projects/yak/images/m-346_2.jpg
-- Alenia M-346 Master (Italy)

http://www.airforce-technology.com/projects/amx-fighter-bomber/images/img3.jpg
-- AMX (Italy-Brazil)

In the end, sa presyo magkakatalo. Yung Czech planes second hand pero 15 million dollars pa rin ata. So wag na. Yung sa Italy-Brazil bago yun. Yak-130 15 million dollars daw. M-346 20 million euros mahal. TA-50 30 million dollars din.


Unless, kung may freebies yung mahal (Italian M-346 o Korean TA-50) tulad ng free frigates or corvettes. Puede!:cheers::cheers::cheers:

^^

Nice!

Hopefully we could purchase some jets so we could at least have a semblance of an airforce.

I was also thinking about armored Toyota Hiluxes instead of Hummers:

http://www.practika.ua/en/catalog/military/Toyota-Hilux

http://img151.imageshack.us/img151/5633/toyotahilux.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/151/toyotahilux.jpg/) Uploaded with ImageShack.us (http://imageshack.us)

We've got lots of Hiluxes here, why don't we just slap some metal on them and arm them with 50 calibers or anti aircraft guns? We don't need to import those expensive Hummers.

Dapat ito i-revive. Gawa ito ng local company called Steelcraft:


MX-7
http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c79/phichanad/MX7-1.jpg
http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c79/phichanad/MX7-1.jpg

http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c79/phichanad/MX7-2.jpg
http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c79/phichanad/MX7-2.jpg

MX-7
http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c79/phichanad/Steelcraft5.jpg
http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c79/phichanad/Steelcraft5.jpg

http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c79/phichanad/IMG_1743.jpg
http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c79/phichanad/IMG_1743.jpg

^^

Pwede, although I'm leaning towards an armored Hilux instead since they are faster and less expensive.

We don't really have to import military hardware since we have local manufacturers. I mean those vehicles could be put to good use against the Abu Sayaff. But then again a Hilux has better off road capability hehe.

China rejects Manila's move to take sea dispute to ITLOS (http://zeenews.india.com/news/world/china-rejects-manila-s-move-to-take-sea-dispute-to-itlos_770642.html)
Last Updated: Thursday, April 19, 2012, 13:11


Beijing: China has rejected a proposal by the Philippines to take the maritime dispute over South China Sea to an international tribunal, even as Beijing sent a major ship to beef up patrol in the disputed waters.

Manila had on Tuesday said that it had planned to take the dispute to the International Tribunal for the Law of the Sea, to confirm whether it had "sovereign rights" over the waters.

Chinese Deputy Foreign Minister Fu Ying summoned Philippine charge d'affaires in Beijing, Alex Chua, for the second time in four days yesterday to protest against Manila's claim over Huangyan Island in the South China Sea.

She urged the Philippines to "fulfil its promise" of easing tension and withdraw its vessels from China's territorial waters, Foreign Ministry spokesman Liu Weimin said.

Yesterday, Fu had also requested Manila "not to take any more measures that would worsen the situation", a report on state-run website China.Org.Cn, said.

Philippines Defence Secretary Voltaire Gazmin was quoted by The Philippine Star as saying that the dispute will be discussed on April 30 at a meeting in Washington between the country's top defence and foreign affairs officials and their US counterparts.

China and Philippines had recently entered into a confrontation near the Huangyan Island after their ships came face to face.

A Philippine archaeological research ship was also in the waters near the island, which was, on Monday, requested by Beijing to leave.

Last morning, China's fastest fishery administration vessel 'Yuzheng 310' left Guangzhou to cruise on a yet to be known destination in the South China Sea, which officials said, was aimed to "better protect" Chinese fishermen's rights and marine resources.

The move underscores Beijing's determination to protect its maritime interests in response to Manila's refusal to withdraw ships from Chinese waters, analysts said.

Dapat ito i-revive. Gawa ito ng local company called Steelcraft:


MX-7
http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c79/phichanad/MX7-1.jpg
http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c79/phichanad/MX7-1.jpg

http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c79/phichanad/MX7-2.jpg
http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c79/phichanad/MX7-2.jpg

MX-7
http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c79/phichanad/Steelcraft5.jpg
http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c79/phichanad/Steelcraft5.jpg

http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c79/phichanad/IMG_1743.jpg
http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c79/phichanad/IMG_1743.jpg

I doubt it any of these can protect you from an Ak-47.

I doubt it any of these can protect you from an Ak-47.

Bakit nasubukan mo na ito na nakasakay ka at pinaulanan ng Ak-47??Share your experience please..:):):)

China sends another ship to Scarborough as Philippine troops spot 3 new fishing boats

MANILA, Philippines - China has sent another ship to the Scarborough Shoal area, where Philippine and Chinese forces have been in a standoff over fishing rights since April 10.

The Yuzheng 310, China’s fastest fishery administration vessel, sailed from Guangzhou for Scarborough (also called Panatag by the Philippines), according to China state media.

http://www.interaksyon.com/article/29845/china-sends-another-ship-to-scarborough-as-ph-troops-spot-3-new-fishing-boats

I think we should first get a lot of corvettes since what we want is to chase out those pesky Chinese fisherman out of our territory. If are capable then we can start building up bigger vessels but never an aircraft carrier. Get a few squadrons of good quality jet air crafts and then start building deterring armaments across the archipelago. :)

But as much as possible, we'll have to rely on what resources we have and what industries we have. Let's prioritize Philippine based industries to help in the acquisition of weapons and defenses. We have to emphasize that this military build-up is also in a sense 'a form of economic stimulus' to allow local industries to grow. We're the 4th largest shipbuilding nation in the world. It's quite ironic that even our navy vessels are bought abroad. I do not see why we have to be content with second-hand ships when we can have brand new ones from the home court.We might even save up money if we buy locally. :cheers:

Just my two cents worth. :2cents:

China rejects Manila's move to take sea dispute to ITLOS (http://zeenews.india.com/news/world/china-rejects-manila-s-move-to-take-sea-dispute-to-itlos_770642.html)
Last Updated: Thursday, April 19, 2012, 13:11



She urged the Philippines to "fulfil its promise" of easing tension and withdraw its vessels from China's territorial waters, Foreign Ministry spokesman Liu Weimin said.

Yesterday, Fu had also requested Manila "not to take any more measures that would worsen the situation", a report on state-run website China.Org.Cn, said.



parang bata lang ang kausap nya ah... inuuto ba tayo nito... sinabi natin na we will ease the tension inde natin sinabing ibibigay natin sa kanila yung Panatag Shoal..

I think we should first get a lot of corvettes since what we want is to chase out those pesky Chinese fisherman out of our territory. If are capable then we can start building up bigger vessels but never an aircraft carrier. Get a few squadrons of good quality jet air crafts and then start building deterring armaments across the archipelago. :)

But as much as possible, we'll have to rely on what resources we have and what industries we have. Let's prioritize Philippine based industries to help in the acquisition of weapons and defenses. We have to emphasize that this military build-up is also in a sense 'a form of economic stimulus' to allow local industries to grow. We're the 4th largest shipbuilding nation in the world. It's quite ironic that even our navy vessels are bought abroad. I do not see why we have to be content with second-hand ships when we can have brand new ones from the home court.We might even save up money if we buy locally. :cheers:

Just my two cents worth. :2cents:

very well said.:cheers::cheers:

China rejects Manila's move to take sea dispute to ITLOS (http://zeenews.india.com/news/world/china-rejects-manila-s-move-to-take-sea-dispute-to-itlos_770642.html)
Last Updated: Thursday, April 19, 2012, 13:11


Beijing: China has rejected a proposal by the Philippines to take the maritime dispute over South China Sea to an international tribunal, even as Beijing sent a major ship to beef up patrol in the disputed waters.

Manila had on Tuesday said that it had planned to take the dispute to the International Tribunal for the Law of the Sea, to confirm whether it had "sovereign rights" over the waters.

Chinese Deputy Foreign Minister Fu Ying summoned Philippine charge d'affaires in Beijing, Alex Chua, for the second time in four days yesterday to protest against Manila's claim over Huangyan Island in the South China Sea.

She urged the Philippines to "fulfil its promise" of easing tension and withdraw its vessels from China's territorial waters, Foreign Ministry spokesman Liu Weimin said.

Yesterday, Fu had also requested Manila "not to take any more measures that would worsen the situation", a report on state-run website China.Org.Cn, said.

Philippines Defence Secretary Voltaire Gazmin was quoted by The Philippine Star as saying that the dispute will be discussed on April 30 at a meeting in Washington between the country's top defence and foreign affairs officials and their US counterparts.

China and Philippines had recently entered into a confrontation near the Huangyan Island after their ships came face to face.

A Philippine archaeological research ship was also in the waters near the island, which was, on Monday, requested by Beijing to leave.

Last morning, China's fastest fishery administration vessel 'Yuzheng 310' left Guangzhou to cruise on a yet to be known destination in the South China Sea, which officials said, was aimed to "better protect" Chinese fishermen's rights and marine resources.

The move underscores Beijing's determination to protect its maritime interests in response to Manila's refusal to withdraw ships from Chinese waters, analysts said.

why am i not surprised by the wording? beijing makes it appear that we are the ones fanning the tensions when it is in fact the one who does it.

their fishermen are encroaching on our territory and then accuse us of creating the tension. if china is sincere in easing this issue, the least it could do is discouraging its fishermen in sailing to the area while both countries are mapping what diplomatic course to take.

I doubt it any of these can protect you from an Ak-47.

The 3rd picture is actually the MX-8 Barako which can resist 7.62mm rounds which is the standard bullet used by AK-47 rifles and M-60/SAW machine guns.

All the other locally-made armored combat vehicles in that picture never get pass their experimental stage including the MX-7 Gagamba which looks like an unlicensed copy of a foreign armored car, the Ferret Scout car (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ferret_armoured_car).

http://parrotheadjeff.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2009/05/ferrett.jpg

I think we should first get a lot of corvettes since what we want is to chase out those pesky Chinese fisherman out of our territory.

You don't use corvettes to chase out fishing vessels unless they are as big as the whaling ships used by Japan because these fishing vessels can just tire the corvette. You use smaller but faster patrol boats or you equip the corvette with rubber hull inflatable motor boats for such an operation.

If are capable then we can start building up bigger vessels but never an aircraft carrier.

Why not have an aircraft carrier? We can have LPDs in the future, actually soon we will have 2-3 MRVs that are capable of carrying VTOL aircraft which makes them look like light aircraft carriers.

We're the 4th largest shipbuilding nation in the world. It's quite ironic that even our navy vessels are bought abroad. I do not see why we have to be content with second-hand ships when we can have brand new ones from the home court.We might even save up money if we buy locally. :cheers:

Just my two cents worth. :2cents:

We are the 4th largest shipbuilding nation in the world in terms of commercial and merchant marine vessels but not warships. The least our shipbuilding industry can do is build unarmored hulls for our planned warship designs but the rest like the weapons system, etc. would eventually be outsourced to a foreign contractor.

if all of you are browsing through the local defense forums, especially the Timawa forums, there are now five possible candidates for the Philippine Air Force surface attack aircraft/lead-in fighter training aircraft requirement:

http://www.airforce-technology.com/projects/yak_130/images/yak130_10.jpg
-- Yakovlev Yak-130 (Russia)

http://www.airforce-technology.com/projects/l159/images/l1591.jpg
-- Aero Vodochody L-159 ALCA (Czech Republic)

http://www.airforce-technology.com/projects/t-50/images/t50_3.jpg
-- KAI TA-50 Golden Eagle (South Korea)

http://www.airforce-technology.com/projects/yak/images/m-346_2.jpg
-- Alenia M-346 Master (Italy)

http://www.airforce-technology.com/projects/amx-fighter-bomber/images/img3.jpg
-- AMX (Italy-Brazil)

I've been to those local defense forums regularly but the AMX jet is not a contender because it is not a lead-in fighter trainer (LIFT) jet in the 1st place, it's purely a surface attack jet that has air defense capability.

The proposed acquisition of the AMX jet is a stopgap measure in case the planned 2nd hand, mothballed F-16 acquisition fails. It could also be used by Italy as a sweetener in their M-346 offer just like South Korea's proposal of giving free (I doubt if it's really for free because you still have to pay for the transfer and other miscellaneous fees) KF-5 fighter jets if you will buy their KAI T/A-50. The KF-5 is older and less modern than the AMX jet but both will be sold as 2nd hand refurbished aircraft.

The 3rd picture is actually the MX-8 Barako which can resist 7.62mm rounds which is the standard bullet used by AK-47 rifles and M-60/SAW machine guns.

All the other locally-made armored combat vehicles in that picture never get pass their experimental stage including the MX-7 Gagamba which looks like an unlicensed copy of a foreign armored car, the Ferret Scout car (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ferret_armoured_car).

http://parrotheadjeff.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2009/05/ferrett.jpg



You don't use corvettes to chase out fishing vessels unless they are as big as the whaling ships used by Japan because these fishing vessels can just tire the corvette. You use smaller but faster patrol boats or you equip the corvette with rubber hull inflatable motor boats for such an operation.



Why not have an aircraft carrier? We can have LPDs in the future, actually soon we will have 2-3 MRVs that are capable of carrying VTOL aircraft which makes them look like light aircraft carriers.



We are the 4th largest shipbuilding nation in the world in terms of commercial and merchant marine vessels but not warships. The least our shipbuilding industry can do is build unarmored hulls for our planned warship designs but the rest like the weapons system, etc. would eventually be outsourced to a foreign contractor.

Aircraft carriers are very costly to maintain. We can, that is if we are financially able to maintain those white elephants. Not now, we don't even have good fighter planes to begin with. We're still on the stage of rebuilding our capabilities. In the far future maybe we can have those savvy military hardware but now I still don't think so. :)

Oh? Ok. :lol: Thanks. I'll say we need more patrol boats. And of course still acquire corvettes, destroyers and battleships in the future. :cheers:

On the shipbuilding thing. The shipbuilder should find the opportunity in this need of the military. They could start to improve and take their products to a higher level. The government should also assist them in upgrading what they can produce like incentives and such. In which case, both the military and the economy will benefit. :cheers:

On the Panatag Shoal issue, the Philippines should also stress that should the Chinese successfully claim the shoal and put up military garrison, it is within striking distance from any attack.

These Chinese are accusing us of making things more complicated when they are the one sending in more fishing vessels? Dumdums!

Let's have a look at your budget, shall we


Source, Wikipedia:
Budget Allocation Millions of Pesos
(PHP) Millions of US Dollars
(USD) %
Department of Education
₱207,300 $4,573 30.86%
Department of Public Works and Highways
110,600 2,439.8 16.46%
Department of National Defense
104,700 2,309.7 15.58%
Department of Interior and Local Government
88,200 1,945.7 13.13%
Department of Agriculture
37,700 831.7 5.61%
Department of Social Welfare and Development
34,300 756.7 5.11%
Department of Health
33,300 734.6 4.96%
Department of Transportation and Communications
32,300 712.5 4.81%
State Universities and Colleges
23,400 516.2 3.48%


*As per Wikipedia...

Now where would you like to cut spending, because it's not required.

I repeat what I have stated earlier. If China really wants to occupy, for no real reason, Philippines, there is nothing you can do to keep them away from your shores. You don't have the funds to put up a military that could make a difference.

Your social problems and economic development should be your first priority.

I agree, your army should update their equipment, in order to get a the domestic problems under control. If that is actually really wanted.

Once you are actually on par with your neighbouring countries you can waste your money on big ships and fancy fighter jets...


Cut on DILG and DOTC...the laziest departments :lol:

i agree, why do we always consider threads such as this like "we" own it?:ohno::bash:
we can actually get some insight (good or bad) from others even from that ultra-nationalist chicom oliver.

He tends to somewhat impose his ultr-nationalist beliefs here. It's ok to share and if everyone agrees, then great. But this is still the Philippines. Whether to agree or to not agree will be up to the Filipinos. The problem is when they start to bash the country and become so big and mighty right in our own turf. It would be fine if this were the Chinese forums. We're not doing the same thing to them in their turf anyway so why are they still wasting time here? I do not see any good insight from that oliver, just declarations of how powerful China is and that the Philippines should just deal with it.

Everyone who has an insight is welcome. Just try not to overdo it. (I've been trying hold back my horses as much as possible)

If everyone agrees as you want it, then that defeats the purpose of a forum. Guess we're just too onion-skinned.

Might as well join all those cult pseudo-religion sprouting everywhere.
and one more thing...this is not the Philippines...this is the INTERNET.

Guys, you know what, it's good getting perspectives from outside. Some of their comments may be "intimidating" but thinking again, an outside assessment may help us have a better view of our military capabilities (or the lack thereof).

It's not as if these guys are a la Oliver999 who can't even connect the dots and just repeats what the CCP say. That dude can't even think independently :lol:

There are pictures of Bayan Muna protest at Timawa

See here (http://www.timawa.net/forum/index.php?topic=31008.30)

I am loving the Indians. They are, by large (the forumers) with us and have critical thinking skills unlike their Chinese visitors who merely parrots whatever the CCP says :lol:

Maybe, we should invite them over here? ;)

http://defenceforumindia.com/forum/china/34541-so-begins-philippine-warship-standoff-china-vessels-7.html

Philippines ignores China demand to quit shoal (http://globalnation.inquirer.net/33847/philippines-ignores-china-demand-to-quit-shoal)

Philippines ignores China demand to quit shoal
But Palace says talks continuing to resolve dispute
By Christine O. Avendaño, Dona Z. Pazzibugan, Jerry E. Esplanada
Philippine Daily Inquirer
12:15 am | Thursday, April 19th, 2012
share748 712

Communications Secretary Ricky Carandang said talks between the Philippines and China were continuing. INQUIRER FILE PHOTO

Philippine officials on Wednesday ignored China’s demand to withdraw Filipino vessels from Panatag Shoal, declaring “that’s our territory” and warning Chinese vessels to back off.

The officials said a Philippine Coast Guard search and rescue vessel, BRP Edsa, along with an archaeological survey mission aboard the MY Sarangani and a fishing boat, remained in the area, facing off two Chinese maritime surveillance vessels and a fishing boat.

On Monday, China demanded that all Filipino vessels clear the area, which it calls Huangyan Island and which is known internationally as Scarborough Shoal, and sent an aircraft to buzz a Philippine fishing boat in the second such incident since Saturday.

“We’re also telling their ships to do the same,” Communications Secretary Ricky Carandang told reporters. “That’s our territory and we’re also saying the same thing to their ships.”

Carandang said talks between the Philippines and China were continuing. “Tensions have not degenerated,” he said, and the fact “that not a shot has been fired is already a sign that the situation is not deteriorating.”

Arbitration call ignored

China and the Philippines have agreed to settle the dispute diplomatically but have both insisted on their ownership of the shoal, prolonging an eight-day standoff on the high seas.

Foreign Secretary Albert del Rosario on Tuesday asked China to bring the dispute to the International Tribunal on the Law of the Sea for arbitration. The Chinese embassy, however, ignored the proposal and asked the Philippines to withdraw its vessels from the shoal “and restore peace and stability there.”

The latest standoff between Manila and Beijing over disputed islands in the West Philippine Sea (South China Sea) began on April 8 when a Philippine Navy plane spotted eight Chinese fishing boats in Panatag, a cluster of reefs and islands around a lagoon.

The Philippine Navy flagship, BRP Gregorio del Pilar, was dispatched to the area on April 10 and its officers boarded the fishing boats, but a Chinese maritime surveillance vessel intervened. The fishing boats slipped away last Friday night.

The dispute is one of a myriad of conflicting claims over islands, reefs and shoals in the South China Sea that pit China against the Philippines, Vietnam, Brunei, Malaysia and Taiwan.

Tension has risen in the past two years over worries China is becoming more assertive in its claims to the sea that straddles shipping lanes between East Asia and Europe and the Middle East.

Although claimant countries have pledged to settle the territorial rifts peacefully, the disputes have erupted in violence in the past, including in 1988 when China and Vietnam clashed in the Spratly Islands in a confrontation that killed 64 Vietnamese soldiers. Many fear the disputes could become Asia’s next flash point for armed conflict.

Vietnam held a maritime ceremony on Monday near the area where the incident occurred to remember the dead soldiers, state-controlled media reported.

Several rounds of talks have failed to end the impasse at Panatag, which is 872 km from Hainan province, China’s nearest territory to the shoal.

Ancient Chinese shipwreck

Chinese embassy spokesperson Zhang Hua has acknowledged that the UN Convention on the Law of the Sea, or Unclos, allows countries to claim an exclusive economic zone, but said the Philippines could not exercise sovereignty on areas within those waters that are owned by other countries.

An ancient Chinese shipwreck can be found off Panatag, but the Philippine research ship has no right to salvage it, Zhang said. “We urge the archaeological vessel to leave the area immediately,” Zhang said in a statement.

‘We will not leave’

Defense Secretary Voltaire Gazmin, in an interview with reporters, on Wednesday called on Filipinos to come together and let the world know that “we are being bullied” by China.

On Tuesday, Gazmin said, “We will fight for what is ours. We are in the area and we will not leave while we continue the talks” between the DFA and Chinese authorities.

Also on Wednesday, Bayan Muna Representatives Teodoro Casiño and Neri Colmenares filed a resolution condemning China and calling for an inquiry into the government’s failure to assert sovereignty over the shoal.

“We also do not want to go to war, but we must assert our sovereignty, through whatever means we can,” Casiño said. With reports from Cynthia D. Balana and Jerome Aning; Carla P. Gomez, Inquirer Visayas, and AP

Oh, pictures from yahoo!

http://l.yimg.com/bt/api/res/1.2/7RrGBbr4EhmBeJds.jpzYA--/YXBwaWQ9eW5ld3M7Zmk9aW5zZXQ7aD00NDM7cT04NTt3PTYzMA--/http://media.zenfs.com/en_us/News/Reuters/2012-04-19T061913Z_1448454652_GM1E84J13ZZ01_RTRMADP_3_PHILIPPINES.JPG

http://l.yimg.com/bt/api/res/1.2/Wwhj0W7Oe3H3mPTP5MPgYw--/YXBwaWQ9eW5ld3M7Zmk9aW5zZXQ7aD00MzE7cT04NTt3PTYzMA--/http://media.zenfs.com/en_us/News/Reuters/2012-04-19T061607Z_1099415007_GM1E84J13S901_RTRMADP_3_PHILIPPINES.JPG

http://l.yimg.com/bt/api/res/1.2/U39ku3IDN0vh4xCIZVFbgA--/YXBwaWQ9eW5ld3M7Zmk9aW5zZXQ7aD00MjU7cT04NTt3PTYzMA--/http://media.zenfs.com/en_us/News/Reuters/2012-04-16T051026Z_850872858_GM1E84G109V01_RTRMADP_3_PHILIPPINES.JPG

Nainggit ata si Teddy Casino sa rally ng Akbayan :lol:

Philippines ignores China demand to quit shoal (http://globalnation.inquirer.net/33847/philippines-ignores-china-demand-to-quit-shoal)



China have just proved to the world that they have no legal basis to own the Scarborough Shoal as they ignored the Philippines' request to settle this to international tribunal!

Chinese knows this, kaya ayaw nila ilaban sa international court ito dahil alam nila matatalo lang sila so kaya dinadaan nila ito sa pambubully! F---k china!

Small victory for the philippines!

:cheers:

I am loving the Indians. They are, by large (the forumers) with us and have critical thinking skills unlike their Chinese visitors who merely parrots whatever the CCP says :lol:

Maybe, we should invite them over here? ;)

http://defenceforumindia.com/forum/china/34541-so-begins-philippine-warship-standoff-china-vessels-7.html

or we could cross over there!;) and i will do that within the week.

Philippines ignores China demand to quit shoal (http://globalnation.inquirer.net/33847/philippines-ignores-china-demand-to-quit-shoal)
for flag, country, and sovereignty!:cheers:

or we could cross over there!;) and i will do that within the week.

Not a bad idea, but it is better here, I guess and a livelier discussion is more probably. There are more Chinese trolls there than here :)

for flag, country, and sovereignty!:cheers:

We're a patient and forgiving bunch but enough is enough. :)

Not a bad idea, but it is better here, I guess and a livelier discussion is more probably. There are more Chinese trolls there than here :)

both sides could do both ways! those smart indians can visit this thread and we can also visit theirs. a bilateral agreement that will result in two-way animated state visits!:cheers:

both sides could do both ways! those smart indians can visit this thread and we can also visit theirs. a bilateral agreement that will result in two-way animated state visits!:cheers:

Not a bad one... Hahaha, "bilateral agreement". I wish that could go up into national politics/foreign policy too. Indians are much more friendlier than the China. After all, aren't dragons vicious creatures? :lol:

I think there is a need to increase the number of naval patrol ships, our Navy is severely lacking in equipment. Granted that we will probably lose a naval war with China by ourselves, the increase in the number of ships will help help deter Chinese fishing vessels from poaching our seas.

Some local manufacturers could probably build fast patrol ships and the US should continue to donate used military ships to the Philippines. The purpose is to act as a deterrent to those Chinese fishing vessels.

Another US Base? They should give us a good package and we will probably think about it, the one they proposed in 1991 was inequitable that's why their lease was not extended.

I doubt however if China is willing to go to war given the present economic climate, a war will just ruin things for them. However, this does not mean that the Philippines should not be spending on its military capability.

I don't think another US base is feasible even if we amend the Constitution. With the US already spending aid for Pakis and Afghan due to ongoing operations and proposed budget cuts, it highly unlikely. Besides, I don't believe they will allow themselves to be 'held' to a lease negotiation especially with a third world country whose desperate for money every year again :nuts:
And I don't want the US to return permanently here either. Our government becomes complaisant and greedy with the lease money.
Also to put in perspective for those of you , that money is still US taxpayers money which also includes us working here. I am not paying for Pilipinas kong mahal to be a mendicant forever and then whine about it.

Balikatan photos @PDFF

http://pdff.sytes.net/index.php?showtopic=2396&st=225

We're a patient and forgiving bunch but enough is enough. :)

sovereignty is something that's non-negotiable. in this stand-off, china's sovereignty was never remotely at stake while ours became vulnerable. those critical minded indians even realized that. you talk about an objective observer and one realizes that china is slowly inching its way in claiming the disputed areas by starting with a defesively weakest link-- us. heck, beijing is even behaving as if it already owns the area. how does one supposes that the country itself is encouraging its fishermen to get maritime resources in our part of the seas/ocean? there can be no other supposition save for the fact that in beijing's mind, this area is already as good as theirs.

I don't think another US base is feasible even if we amend the Constitution. With the US already spending aid for Pakis and Afghan due to ongoing operations and proposed budget cuts, it highly unlikely. Besides, I don't believe they will allow themselves to be 'held' to a lease negotiation especially with a third world country whose desperate for money every year again :nuts:
And I don't want the US to return permanently here either. Our government becomes complaisant and greedy with the lease money.
Also to put in perspective for those of you , that money is still US taxpayers money which also includes us working here. I am not paying for Pilipinas kong mahal to be a mendicant forever and then whine about it.


Indeed. I think yung hinihingi natin nung 1991 ang pinakagarapal. In the bases in South Korea, it is the SoKor government that is paying for the salaries of the Korean employees.

The VFA is sufficient. At least the US can have troops in the Philippines when needed and they can share bases with the Philippines. I think that way, it promotes more interoperability and camaraderie than "separating" the US Forces from Philippine forces. The troops from each country need to "adjust" and familiarize themselves with each other. And since the US forces are here, they should be the ones adjusting more. I'm not saying this as an arrogance but in case they needed to be deployed to the Philippines shall hostilities begin, they are more adapted to our climate and ways :)

sovereignty is something that's non-negotiable. in this stand-off, china's sovereignty was never remotely at stake while ours became vulnerable. those critical minded indians even realized that. you talk about an objective observer and one realizes that china is slowly inching its way in claiming the disputed areas by starting with a defesively weakest link-- us. heck, beijing is even behaving as if it already owns the area. how does one supposes that the country itself is encouraging its fishermen to get maritime resources in our part of the seas/ocean? there can be no other supposition save for the fact that in beijing's mind, this area is already as good as theirs.

Beijing may have more guns than us, but they seriously lack critical thinking. You see, they call us as the one who escalates the tension but look at what they have done recently. Send more fishermen and another ship. While we pulled out our navy for diplomatic reasons and sent our CG instead and they call us sissies.

Japanese soldiers train Philippine counterparts in disaster response, in line with Balikatan 2012 (http://www.interaksyon.com/article/29714/japanese-soldiers-train-philippine-counterparts-in-disaster-response-in-line-with-balikatan-2012)

MANILA, Philippines - The Armed Forces of the Philippines underwent a humanitarian assistance and disaster response seminar from some of the best in the field, members of the Japan Self-Defense Force, as part of this year's Balikatan exercises.

Describing the JSDF's Disaster and Response Operations, Captain Yuzo Shibata said: "In my country, when disaster strikes, the local governors in each respective prefectures are to issue the JSDF (an) aid request to (the) local military unit."

"Upon receiving the request, the unit will either conduct DR Ops or pass the word to other units or branches depending on the scale of the disaster," he said.

In the event that all communication lines are down and the situation is critical, local commanders are expected to conduct disaster response operations on their own.

Shibata admitted that, although the JSDF is considered among the most prepared to respond to disasters, they "never imagined doing these operations before," referring to their response to the nuclear leak at the Fukushima power plant.

The JSDF conducted aerial and ground water spraying, search and rescue operations in contaminated areas, and screened people for contamination.

The US military also shared details of Operation Tomodachi, launched in response to the Japan quake and tsunami.

Part of this year's joint exercises is a tabletop exercise that will simulate different natural disaster and calamity scenarios to test and improve the planning, preparations, program of action and responses of both the Philippine and US militaries.

I don't think another US base is feasible even if we amend the Constitution. With the US already spending aid for Pakis and Afghan due to ongoing operations and proposed budget cuts, it highly unlikely. Besides, I don't believe they will allow themselves to be 'held' to a lease negotiation especially with a third world country whose desperate for money every year again :nuts:
And I don't want the US to return permanently here either. Our government becomes complaisant and greedy with the lease money.
Also to put in perspective for those of you , that money is still US taxpayers money which also includes us working here. I am not paying for Pilipinas kong mahal to be a mendicant forever and then whine about it.

for US strategic thinkers, maintaining a US base here is beneficial to them. one only has to look at the philippine map to immediatley realize why. as for the corrupt and greedy issues, these are constant things whether there is a US base or not. because of that reality, it's better to choose a lesser evil and deal with a frying pan than jump headlong to the fire by leaving ourselves vulnerable with few, if any, bargaining chips.

for US strategic thinkers, maintaining a US base here is beneficial to them. one only has to look at the philippine map to immediatley realize why. as for the corrupt and greedy issues, these are constant things whether there is a US base or not. because of that reality, it's better to choose a lesser evil and deal with a frying pan than jump headlong to the fire by leaving ourselves vulnerable with few, if any, bargaining chips.

I think it is more cost-effective if they have the VFA permanently but no permanent bases. I actually like the idea of the US forces "sharing" bases with Philippine military. Come to think of it, it will develop more camaraderie and the US forces will eventually have to adapt to Philippine forces more. I mean, the two militaries can develop deeper friendship... :D

But then, that's just me.

for US strategic thinkers, maintaining a US base here is beneficial to them. one only has to look at the philippine map to immediatley realize why. as for the corrupt and greedy issues, these are constant things whether there is a US base or not. because of that reality, it's better to choose a lesser evil and deal with a frying pan than jump headlong to the fire by leaving ourselves vulnerable with few, if any, bargaining chips.

Yes it is. I know that. As a matter of fact, Nabartek and I have read documents on that. But times have changed. They have other bases and strategies have become more "mobile" when it comes to operations.
Besides, I don't foresee a war between China/US. Small skirmishes maybe. And it's more likely to happen between PH and China.
But here is the gist of my statement. IT IS JUST NOT FEASIBLE in light of the present. Furthermore, I think they'd rather choose more reliable allies and less financially needy allies like Australia.
As Nabartek said, we should be content with VFA for now.

Beijing may have more guns than us, but they seriously lack critical thinking. You see, they call us as the one who escalates the tension but look at what they have done recently. Send more fishermen and another ship. While we pulled out our navy for diplomatic reasons and sent our CG instead and they call us sissies.

propaganda. that's the typical behaviour of repressive states. spewing one misleading motherhood statement after another but doing the opposite. declaring peacefull intentions but fanning the flames of aggression. one only has to read the motherhood statements of pyongyang against seol and one can see the similarity with the motherhood statements released by beijing in dealing with manila. admittedly, beijing's declarations and propaganda are much tamer than pyongyang's but the degree of aggression could be in the same evolving trajectory.

http://www8.gmanews.tv/webpics/v3/2012/04/640_BALIKATAN-041912.jpg

Source: http://www.gmanetwork.com/news/photo/18437/balikatan-exercises-continue-amid-phl-china-tension

wicked! i'd to see the war between china and ph

wicked! i'd to see the war between china and ph

:bash:

I think it is more cost-effective if they have the VFA permanently but no permanent bases. I actually like the idea of the US forces "sharing" bases with Philippine military. Come to think of it, it will develop more camaraderie and the US forces will eventually have to adapt to Philippine forces more. I mean, the two militaries can develop deeper friendship... :D

But then, that's just me.

Yes it is. I know that. As a matter of fact, Nabartek and I have read documents on that. But times have changed. They have other bases and strategies have become more "mobile" when it comes to operations.
Besides, I don't foresee a war between China/US. Small skirmishes maybe. And it's more likely to happen between PH and China.But here is the gist of my statement. IT IS JUST NOT FEASIBLE in light of the present. Furthermore, I think they'd rather choose more reliable allies and less financially needy allies like Australia.
As Nabartek said, we should be content with VFA for now.

i'm not sure if the US base in SK shares the same miltary camp with their SK counterparts considering that the two koreas are still technically at war and have a very fragile peace. as for a likely war to happen between china and ph, that actually gives credence to some urgency that a US base should be reactivated here. alright, that said, i could settle with that VFA. but one that should have a conspicuous presence to make the chinese rethink of their aggressive plans that challenge our sovereignty

wicked! i'd to see the war between china and ph

i wonder how will that strategically benefit the state of your allegiance? perhaps, you're a beijing sympathizer, knowing full well that when that happens, it will be a national disaster for us.