Nagproprotesta sa subs mga militante pero di nagproprotesta sa chinese warships. Nakow, red carpet ang pang salubong ng militante dyan

Sadyang tanga ba sila na di nila napapansin na napapansin ng taong bayan na di sila nagproprotesta sa intsik?
Kung nanjan lang ako sa rally nila, ihahagpas ko sa mga mukha nila ang kanilang mga plackards!!! Mga walng pag-iisip!

The US navy should be allowed to return and actually base ships and aircraft at Subic, throwing them out was ridiculous in the first place .

Ano ba talaga I aaquired
40Meter Patrol Vessel
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-YDiliJhIkvw/T7dAikhG7UI/AAAAAAAANhM/MPcRQjUbx7E/s1600/Mihashi+class+46+meter.jpg
Shiretoko
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/8/80/PL101_Shiretoko.jpg/800px-PL101_Shiretoko.jpg
Hateruma 1000T
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/e/e3/Plhakata.jpg

^^ Agree. Even countries that have stronger military than ours have US bases. Compared to these countries, we are actually getting a lot. Korea pays for the salary of Korean base employees, Japan I heard, pays for part of the bases.

Yet, here, the Philippines, says Yankee go home (take me with you) without even building a formidable military. Our nationalists "kuno" have all these empy bravado. Buti sana kung sila unang sasabak sa frOntline :lol:

Ano kaya gagawin ng militante kung Chinese sub and lumitaw sa Subic? :lol:

^^ Agree. Even countries that have stronger military than ours have US bases. Compared to these countries, we are actually getting a lot. Korea pays for the salary of Korean base employees, Japan I heard, pays for part of the bases.

Yet, here, the Philippines, says Yankee go home (take me with you) without even building a formidable military. Our nationalists "kuno" have all these empy bravado. Buti sana kung sila unang sasabak sa frOntline :lol:

Ano kaya gagawin ng militante kung Chinese sub and lumitaw sa Subic? :lol:

Contrary to the leftists mantra that the Philippine Constitution does not allow US military bases, the Philippine Constitution actually makes an exemption that would allow foreign military bases in the country.

"Article 18, Section 25. After the expiration in 1991 of the Agreement between the Republic of the Philippines and the United States of America concerning military bases, foreign military bases, troops, or facilities shall not be allowed in the Philippines except under a treaty duly concurred in by the Senate and, when the Congress so requires, ratified by a majority of the votes cast by the people in a national referendum held for that purpose, and recognized as a treaty by the other contracting State."

The Philippine public needs to be educated properly on this provision, as well as the American public which looks like they are mislead by the media and the leftists.

^^ yes, if it is ratified by the senate, it is constitutional. So their yakking about "sovereignty" has no grounds.

Funnily, they say nothing about the Chinese in our territory practicing "their jurisdiction" in our own territory and EEZ

^^ Agree. Even countries that have stronger military than ours have US bases. Compared to these countries, we are actually getting a lot. Korea pays for the salary of Korean base employees, Japan I heard, pays for part of the bases.

Yet, here, the Philippines, says Yankee go home (take me with you) without even building a formidable military. Our nationalists "kuno" have all these empy bravado. Buti sana kung sila unang sasabak sa frOntline :lol:

Ano kaya gagawin ng militante kung Chinese sub and lumitaw sa Subic? :lol:

Mga walang kwenta yan. They have something in common with corrupt generals - tatakbo lang ang mga yan pag lusubin ang Pilipinas.

Walang mapapala ang Pilipinas sa kanila. They suggest that we leave our country defenseless to prioritize on other things so what? we are open to invasion? Now that China is at our doorstep demanding to hand in our territory, you won't hear anything from them. With that kind of mindset, why should we waste our energy on them.

Wonder how we can realistically win a dog fight against a squadron of these Chinese J-20's... :ohno: :ohno: :ohno:

Report: Chinese J-20 stealth fighter to be operational by 2018
By Jennifer Rizzo
CNN
http://security.blogs.cnn.com/2012/05/18/report-chinese-stealth-fighter-to-be-operational-by-2018/

The U.S. believes that China's radar-evading fighter jet will be operational in six years, a Pentagon official said Friday.

China is expected to have sufficient numbers of its J-20 fighter and enough pilots trained to conduct missions with the stealthy jet by 2018 but not any earlier, according to David Helvey, acting deputy assistant secretary of defense for East Asia and Asia Pacific affairs.

Chinese officials have said they expect the J-20 to be operational between 2017 and 2019.

Helvey spoke about the Defense Department's annual report to Congress regarding China's military developments.

Analysts believe that the J-20 will have the radar-evading capability of fifth-generation fighters produced by the United States, like the F-22 and F-35.

The report cited the J-20 as an example of China's emphasis on military modernization programs.

In March, China announced an estimated 11% jump in its military budget, to roughly $106 billion. The actual figure, which is probably much larger, is difficult to estimate due to the non-transparent nature of China's budget.

For example, Helvey said, the published military budget does not include several major categories of expenditures such as foreign weapons purchases, nuclear force modernization and research and development.

The Defense Department estimates that in 2011, China's total military-related spending ranged between $120 billion and $180 billion.

While the report says China's main focus is deterring conflict with Taiwan, the U.S. again made bold statements on the cyberthreat posed by China, accusing the nation of cyberattacks and economic espionage.

"Chinese attempts to collect U.S. technological and economic information will continue at a high level and will represent a growing and persistent threat to U.S. economic security," the report said.

Various sections of the report also mentioned the larger role China is playing around the globe with non-traditional security missions like humanitarian assistance and disaster relief operations, non-combatant evacuation operations, military medical assistance missions and U.N. peacekeeping missions.

"For the first time in its history, the (People's Liberation Army) is going places and doing things and is at the incipient stages of taking on an expeditionary mindset," said David Finkelstein, who directs the China studies program at CNA, a nonprofit research institute in Alexandria, Virginia.

Finkelstein pointed to the navy's ongoing anti-piracy operation in the Gulf of Aden as a prime example.

"While some might call into question how operationally significant the mission is, no one should question the significance of the political decision made back in 2008 to take on the mission," he said. "Given China's growing set of national security interests and its expanding international footprint, this trend should come as no surprise, and the report points this out."

The themes surrounding a growing Chinese military were similar to those mentioned in previous reports. The most striking difference this year was the length of the report, coming in at half the size of previous versions.

The Pentagon says it consolidated the document to keep with agency-wide guidance on how to handle congressional reports, but one analyst sees the move as policy-motivated.

"The Chinese have complained bitterly about this report from its inception," Chinese military expert Richard Fisher said. "It is the most useful and comprehensive statement by any government on this planet about the capabilities and intentions of China's military. That is why the Chinese government screams so loud every time it's published. But they are going to be really happy that the U.S. government cut its length in half."

Fisher says the Obama administration is using the report as a way of appeasing the Chinese.

"Early in 2009, the Obama administration made a very direct and consistent effort to make nice with China and to make nice with the PLA," Fisher said. "And very early on, it seized on the opportunity to use this report as a way of signaling to the PLA that we want to make nice."

Finkelstein disagreed.

"The format, tone and minimal use of jargon in this year's report makes it, in my view, very effective in conveying to the Congress and the general public a basic understanding of what the PLA is trying to accomplish," he said.

Japan patrol vessels due for transfer to the PCG by years end, 2 Shiretoko-class 970 tons (78 meters) and 10 Bizan-class 180 tons (40 meters) ...
http://defense-studies.blogspot.com/2012/05/philippines-coast-guard-acquiring-10.html
http://i332.photobucket.com/albums/m335/filipinas40/JCGBizanClass.jpg
10 Bizan Class
http://defense-studies.blogspot.com/2012/05/japan-provides-patrol-ships-to.html
http://i332.photobucket.com/albums/m335/filipinas40/Shiretoko.jpg
2 Shiretoko Class
For comparison purposes: WW II Imperial Japanese Navy warships
---Fubuki-class destroyer: 2,090 tons (388 ft/118 meters)
---Chokai-class heavy cruiser: 13,160 tons (663 ft/202 meters)
---Yamato-class battleship: 71,659 tons (863 ft/263 meters)
---Ise-class battleship: 35,800 tons (708 ft/215 meters)
---Shokaku-class aircraft carrier: 25,657 tons, 85 aircraft (844 ft/257 meters)
---Kaga-class aircraft carrier: 38,200 tons, 90 aircraft (812 ft/247 meters)

source:
Japanese high seas fleet, Richard Humble, pp. 92-97

sa coast guard rin ba or navy ang gagamit ng mga ships from japan???

Kung nanjan lang ako sa rally nila, ihahagpas ko sa mga mukha nila ang kanilang mga plackards!!! Mga walng pag-iisip!The US navy should be allowed to return and actually base ships and aircraft at Subic, throwing them out was ridiculous in the first place .I concur. Hand back Subic to the US. And if it's not feasible for Clark anymore, at least hand back Sangley as well to the US. :D :D Subic and Sangley!

Wonder how we can realistically win a dog fight against a squadron of these Chinese J-20's... :ohno: :ohno: :ohno:

Report: Chinese J-20 stealth fighter to be operational by 2018
By Jennifer Rizzo
CNN
http://security.blogs.cnn.com/2012/05/18/report-chinese-stealth-fighter-to-be-operational-by-2018/

The U.S. believes that China's radar-evading fighter jet will be operational in six years, a Pentagon official said Friday.

China is expected to have sufficient numbers of its J-20 fighter and enough pilots trained to conduct missions with the stealthy jet by 2018 but not any earlier, according to David Helvey, acting deputy assistant secretary of defense for East Asia and Asia Pacific affairs.

Chinese officials have said they expect the J-20 to be operational between 2017 and 2019.

Helvey spoke about the Defense Department's annual report to Congress regarding China's military developments.

Analysts believe that the J-20 will have the radar-evading capability of fifth-generation fighters produced by the United States, like the F-22 and F-35.

The report cited the J-20 as an example of China's emphasis on military modernization programs.

In March, China announced an estimated 11% jump in its military budget, to roughly $106 billion. The actual figure, which is probably much larger, is difficult to estimate due to the non-transparent nature of China's budget.

For example, Helvey said, the published military budget does not include several major categories of expenditures such as foreign weapons purchases, nuclear force modernization and research and development.

The Defense Department estimates that in 2011, China's total military-related spending ranged between $120 billion and $180 billion.

While the report says China's main focus is deterring conflict with Taiwan, the U.S. again made bold statements on the cyberthreat posed by China, accusing the nation of cyberattacks and economic espionage.

"Chinese attempts to collect U.S. technological and economic information will continue at a high level and will represent a growing and persistent threat to U.S. economic security," the report said.

Various sections of the report also mentioned the larger role China is playing around the globe with non-traditional security missions like humanitarian assistance and disaster relief operations, non-combatant evacuation operations, military medical assistance missions and U.N. peacekeeping missions.

"For the first time in its history, the (People's Liberation Army) is going places and doing things and is at the incipient stages of taking on an expeditionary mindset," said David Finkelstein, who directs the China studies program at CNA, a nonprofit research institute in Alexandria, Virginia.

Finkelstein pointed to the navy's ongoing anti-piracy operation in the Gulf of Aden as a prime example.

"While some might call into question how operationally significant the mission is, no one should question the significance of the political decision made back in 2008 to take on the mission," he said. "Given China's growing set of national security interests and its expanding international footprint, this trend should come as no surprise, and the report points this out."

The themes surrounding a growing Chinese military were similar to those mentioned in previous reports. The most striking difference this year was the length of the report, coming in at half the size of previous versions.

The Pentagon says it consolidated the document to keep with agency-wide guidance on how to handle congressional reports, but one analyst sees the move as policy-motivated.

"The Chinese have complained bitterly about this report from its inception," Chinese military expert Richard Fisher said. "It is the most useful and comprehensive statement by any government on this planet about the capabilities and intentions of China's military. That is why the Chinese government screams so loud every time it's published. But they are going to be really happy that the U.S. government cut its length in half."

Fisher says the Obama administration is using the report as a way of appeasing the Chinese.

"Early in 2009, the Obama administration made a very direct and consistent effort to make nice with China and to make nice with the PLA," Fisher said. "And very early on, it seized on the opportunity to use this report as a way of signaling to the PLA that we want to make nice."

Finkelstein disagreed.

"The format, tone and minimal use of jargon in this year's report makes it, in my view, very effective in conveying to the Congress and the general public a basic understanding of what the PLA is trying to accomplish," he said.

yun pa nga lang kinanibalized nilang carrier dipa nila mabuo yan pa kayang stealth???yung mga sukhoi clone nila sa itsura lang parehas, yung functionality baka mas maayos pa F4 (na bago) sa performance,..mock up lang yan with top gun movie clips,..:ohno::nuts::lol:

yun pa nga lang kinanibalized nilang carrier dipa nila mabuo yan pa kayang stealth???yung mga sukhoi clone nila sa itsura lang parehas, yung functionality baka mas maayos pa F4 (na bago) sa performance,..mock up lang yan with top gun movie clips,..:ohno::nuts::lol:

Malamang pirated din ang labas. :lol::lol:

I concur. Hand back Subic to the US. And if it's not feasible for Clark anymore, at least hand back Sangley as well to the US. :D :D Subic and Sangley!

IMO, yung Spratly i-offer na bagong US base or some island in Palawan,..dna nila kailangan ng malalaking space para sa maraming mga kagamitan, 2 nuke attack and guided missile subs, stealth ships and AUVs kailangan nila to ward off the pirates from the WPS,..

Sana tuloy tuloy na to at HWAG SANANG KURAKUTIN NG MGA DEMONYONG KURAP NA GENERALS!...nagkaroon din ng pakinabang si Lacson he hee..:D...syempre dapat bumulusok pataas ( hindi pababa hah ) ang ekonomiya natin para maisakatuparan ang bill na to...so PNOY FOCUS ON OUR ECONOMY PLEASE!!


Senate sponsors passage of AFP Modernization Bill
By Marvin Sy (The Philippine Star) Updated May 20, 2012 12:00 AM Comments (0) View comments



http://www.philstar.com/Article.aspx?articleId=808813&publicationSubCategoryId=63

Any modernization bill/program should explicitly include a self-reliance program that will not only develop our local defense capability but will also help our economy.

It does not mean we will not buy anymore from other countries but we need to build our capability just like all self-respecting country in the world-not fully dependent on the help of other nations for its defense.

Like the US, we have some small scale military-industrial firms here like Armscor, so it might help local companies to expand and provide jobs and income to many Pinoys.

Just imagine if the government force all those Danao based gunsmiths to work as a cooperative and standardized their products, that will be a win-win situation for us.

^^ Agree. Even countries that have stronger military than ours have US bases. Compared to these countries, we are actually getting a lot. Korea pays for the salary of Korean base employees, Japan I heard, pays for part of the bases.

Yet, here, the Philippines, says Yankee go home (take me with you) without even building a formidable military. Our nationalists "kuno" have all these empy bravado. Buti sana kung sila unang sasabak sa frOntline :lol:

Ano kaya gagawin ng militante kung Chinese sub and lumitaw sa Subic? :lol:

Speaking of take me with you, I found Nicole's sister!:rofl:
http://s7.postimage.org/ouwrsygcr/630screenshotkiss_jpg_062410.jpg (http://postimage.org/)
Kiss them foreigners and cry rape. The New Lotto:lol:
(Nagsalita na kaya ang Gabriela?)

Ok back to thread.

Sen. Panfilo Lacson, sponsor of the AFP Modernization Bill, said the first AFP modernization program that started in December 1996 “fell short of the target.”

“What was then envisioned as a modernization program turned out to be only a capability upgrade for the AFP. But even at this level, the program still fell short of its target. The basic requirements of move, shoot and communicate of the AFP are substandard and outdated, if not totally lacking,” Lacson told the plenary Tuesday.

hay naku Senator Lason! sa tagal mo ng nakaupo ngaun mo lang yan napansin.

For comparison purposes: WW II Imperial Japanese Navy warships
---Fubuki-class destroyer: 2,090 tons (388 ft/118 meters)
---Chokai-class heavy cruiser: 13,160 tons (663 ft/202 meters)
---Yamato-class battleship: 71,659 tons (863 ft/263 meters)
---Ise-class battleship: 35,800 tons (708 ft/215 meters)
---Shokaku-class aircraft carrier: 25,657 tons, 85 aircraft (844 ft/257 meters)
---Kaga-class aircraft carrier: 38,200 tons, 90 aircraft (812 ft/247 meters)

source:
Japanese high seas fleet, Richard Humble, pp. 92-97

SANA MATULOY YAN.. MEDYO MADAMI CYA IN NUMBERS.. ITS A VERY BIG HELP...

Speaking of take me with you, I found Nicole's sister!:rofl:
http://s7.postimage.org/ouwrsygcr/630screenshotkiss_jpg_062410.jpg (http://postimage.org/)
Kiss them foreigners and cry rape. The New Lotto:lol:
(Nagsalita na kaya ang Gabriela?)

Ok back to thread.



Kalbo pa pinatulan. Lol

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vh2vrpoRyBI

Japanese cost guard ship on rough sea.

Any modernization bill/program should explicitly include a self-reliance program that will not only develop our local defense capability but will also help our economy.

It does not mean we will not buy anymore from other countries but we need to build our capability just like all self-respecting country in the world-not fully dependent on the help of other nations for its defense.

Like the US, we have some small scale military-industrial firms here like Armscor, so it might help local companies to expand and provide jobs and income to many Pinoys.

Just imagine if the government force all those Danao based gunsmiths to work as a cooperative and standardized their products, that will be a win-win situation for us.

i think ship building would be a good industry that would benefit both the economy and military.

i think ship building would be a good industry that would benefit both the economy and military.

Yes, it would be a waste as being the 4th largest shipbuilding country in the world, we cant even build one for us either for civilian/commercial use/military use.

eto ginagawa ng mga Japan Coast Guard sa mga hinayupak na Chinese fishermen na yan

sana ganito ka aggressive ang response natin para tumanda yang mga yan at mag dalawang isip sa pag plunder ng mga resources natin

Japan's strong military and aggressive stance in the Senkaku Islands means only one thing => walang bargaining chip ang China to settle "peacefully" at no chance mang bully sa Japan

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hXI0DwLxOhA&feature=related

Yes, it would be a waste as being the 4th largest shipbuilding country in the world, we cant even build one for us either for civilian/commercial use/military use.

Yup - we'd have to be reasonable wit it though. Obviously start with civilian/commercial ships and once we've mastered that, move onto military ones. I'm not sure how long that would take, but my [uneducated] guess would be somewhere between 12-20 years. My understanding is that we've already got some decent shipbuilding companies, but we need to make an active effort to expand these.

For one thing, the Chinese have the dough and we are here drowning in debt up to our necks. We have been taken down a path of no return by unsound financial practices and the Chinese feel we are a good financial risk for them to take and why not. The real estate here is pretty nice and dirt cheap right now, the natural resources are bountiful and the Chinese are looking to expand their global market share. What better place for them to do it. We are on our knees right now begging (as is Europe) and the Chinese like what they see here in America, cheap real estate, oil and gas. The Chinese are practical people. They do not engage in senseless wars.

Navy Commissions Amphibious Transport Dock Ship San Diego

Story Number: NNS120517-31 Release Date: 5/17/2012 3:39:00 PM

From Department of Defense Public Affairs

WASHINGTON (NNS) -- The Navy will commission the newest San Antonio-class amphibious transport dock ship San Diego during a 10 a.m. PDT ceremony Saturday, May 19, 2012, in San Diego, Calif.

http://www.navy.mil/management/photodb/webphoto/web_120406-N-DH124-073.jpg

http://www.navy.mil/search/display.asp?story_id=67250
enlarge photo

http://www.navy.mil/management/photodb/photos/120406-N-DH124-073.jpg

commissioning of USS San Diego (LPD22) Saturday May 19, 2012

http://www.livestream.com/usnavy/video?clipId=pla_c272dd97-90be-4933-9c1e-aad544b9f373&utm_source=lslibrary&utm_medium=ui-thumb

http://www.livestream.com/usnavy/video?clipId=pla_35a07f41-1b46-44db-bac7-cd49d7e55a26&utm_source=lslibrary&utm_medium=ui-thumb

USS Dallas will be decommissioned in 2014 as you will hear at the end of this video.

wishlist lang.
Description: The amphibious assault ship USS Peleliu (LHA 5) underway off the coast of Southern California.

http://www.navy.mil/management/photodb/webphoto/web_060119-N-9866B-010.jpg
060119-N-9866B-010 Pacific Ocean (Jan. 19, 2006) - The amphibious assault ship USS Peleliu (LHA 5) underway off the coast of Southern California. Peleliu and Expeditionary Strike Group Three (ESG-3) are conducting their Joint Task Force Exercise (JTFX) prior to an upcoming scheduled deployment. U.S. Navy photo by Journalist 2nd Class Zack Baddorf (RELEASED)

http://www.navy.mil/management/photodb/photos/060119-N-9866B-010.jpg

http://www.navy.mil/navydata/fact_display.asp?cid=4200&tid=400&ct=4

China deploys warships, US submarine blamed

Five Chinese warships were reportedly deployed near Philippine waters following the visit of a nuclear-powered submarine from the United States.

Philippine Star reported that a news outlet from Taiwan identified the ships as two Type-052B destroyers, two Type-054A frigates and one Type-071 amphibious transport vessel.

More... (http://thepoc.net/breaking-news/world/15988-china-deploys-warships-us-submarine-blamed.html)

Ogag talaga. Eh di meron nang target yung US sub ngayon!

China is pushing exploring - pushing U.S. to it's maximum tolerance level. . . With "Hu Bama" in the White House, there's no way China can be stopped in South China sea. . . Plus the communist allies of China in the Philippines criticizing every U.S. move. . . U.S. has no choice but to back off a because as much as she wanted to help the Filipino pushes her away. . . I would like to see the leftist being outnumbered by pro U.S. protester in the Philippines. . .

BAYAN explained that “The port calls made by US warships is part of a greater strategy to project US military power in the region. It is directed at all countries in the region, but most especially China, in order to keep China subservient to US dictates.”

BAYAN secretary general Renato Reyes Jr. said the visit created “a host of social and legal issues.”

He explained that while the “virtual basing and hosting” of US warships are being justified by the Visiting Forces Agreement and the Mutual Logistics Support Agreement, it is a way for US to “rebalance” towards Asia.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

So what kung it is U.S. way to avert China's power in Asia..? We are small and incapable in any means. Both U.S. and China can get us if they want to. But I'd prefer U.S. than China if Philippines is going to submit to their pressures. . . At least U.S. is friendlier than China. . .

yung pag agaw ng china sa mischief reef hindi ba pananakop yun..? anu ba ang utak meron itong mga pro china groups na ito.. Pag CHINA ang nang aagaw ok lang sa kanila, kapag U.S. ang nasa Pilipinas binbatikos nila, eh ang U.S. hindi naman inaagaw ang Pilipinas, tinutulungan pa nga tayo para ma control ang pagiging gahaman ng China...

Dapat sa mga leftist na ito ipa deport sa China, hindi sila Filipino at Heart... They are Filipino in papers but Chinese at Heart. . .

China deploys warships, US submarine blamed

mga 9gag talaga itong mga PLA nato mga walang isip!!!!ano naman ilalaban niyan sa isang attack sub na may bitbit na cruise missile???mahilig kayo sa paramihan ng mga kagamitan mga walang isip!!!:bash::bash::bash:

mga 9gag talaga itong mga PLA nato mga walang isip!!!!ano naman ilalaban niyan sa isang attack sub na may bitbit na cruise missile???mahilig kayo sa paramihan ng mga kagamitan mga walang isip!!!:bash::bash::bash:

Pissing contest lang yan until an 'accident' occur.

Well we should just ignore the activists. They are irrelevant anyway. Pampadami lang ng space ang mga yan sa newspaper kaya yung mga walang magawang journalists eh binibigyan sila ng pansi. For many Filipinos, these activists do not have relevance.

Re: Deployment of PLAN ships:

Don't be too hasty to dismiss them as just "targets" for a US submarine. A quick and basic internet search yields sufficient information to confirm that this really is a rather effective counter-move instead:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Type_052B_destroyer

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Type_054A_frigate

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Type_071_amphibious_transport_dock

As you can see 4/5 of the ships have ASW capability. Hardly helpless against submarines. The last one is the only relatively soft target but it wasn't meant for naval combat in the first place, it's for an amphibious assault. But where I wonder?

The stakes in this brinkmanship game just got raised big time. And we (Philippines) are caught in the middle again, to be used by both sides as they see fit.

Damn all their hides!

Re: Deployment of PLAN ships:

Don't be too hasty to dismiss them as just "targets" for a US submarine. A quick and basic internet search yields sufficient information to confirm that this really is a rather effective counter-move instead:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Type_052B_destroyer

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Type_054A_frigate

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Type_071_amphibious_transport_dock

As you can see 4/5 of the ships have ASW capability. Hardly helpless against submarines. The last one is the only relatively soft target but it wasn't meant for naval combat in the first place, it's for an amphibious assault. But where I wonder?

The stakes in this brinkmanship game just got raised big time. And we (Philippines) are caught in the middle again, to be used by both sides as they see fit.

Damn all their hides!

There's really no avoiding for us being used as we're only a pawn in this game but we do have the choice which sides we place our bets though, either the eagle or the dragon.

The single US submarine is a match for those ships and aside from it's dissuasive effect by simply being there it's main purpose is probably to observe the situation in the region in order to assess wheter freedom of navigation is being impeded, and if it is no doubt the US will soon after send more forces to make it's presence felt in a significant way .

In terms of the balance of conventional military forces China is to the US/Nato and it's other allies what the Phillippines is to China as the US and it's allies around the world account for close to 90% of the worlds military spending and controls most of the global economic and political system .

Japan, SoKor, Australia to help PH improve defense capability – DFA
By Jerry E. Esplanada
Philippine Daily Inquirer
4:54 pm | Sunday, May 20th, 2012

http://globalnation.inquirer.net/37441/japan-sokor-australia-to-help-ph-improve-defense-capability-–-dfa

MANILA, Philippines — Aside from the United States, at least three other countries – Japan, South Korea and Australia – are helping the Philippines establish a minimum credible defense posture to complement its diplomatic capacity in dealing with its territorial disputes with China in the West Philippine Sea (South China Sea).

Foreign Affairs Secretary Albert del Rosario pointed this out over the weekend as he also disclosed that the Tokyo government is likely to provide the country with 12 patrol boats.

“They’re considering 10 forty-meter patrol boats on ODA (Official Development Aid) and two larger ones as grants,” Del Rosario told the Philippine Daily Inquirer

In a text message, he also said: “Regarding South Korea, we have a logistics agreement and we have received equipment, such as vests and helmets (for the Armed Forces of the Philippines).”

“I understand our defense department is looking to possibly purchase aircraft from there,” according to Del Rosario.

In November, President Benigno Aquino III asked visiting South Korean President Lee Myung-bak for aircraft, patrol boats and other hardware to help boost the country’s military amid then rising tensions with China over the Spratlys Islands.

Lee did not disclose any response to the specific request but said Seoul wanted to help Manila resolve its maritime problems.

From Australia, the Department of Foreign Affairs head said the country could expect to get “a number of vessels for search-and-rescue, as well as significant training here and abroad for large numbers of our military (personnel).”

“We expect increased help (from the Australian government) when the Status of the Visiting Forces Agreement (or SOFVA between Manila and Canberra) is ratified, hopefully this week,” said Del Rosario.

The SOFVFA, which covers the “status of visiting forces from each state while in the territory of the other state,” was signed on May 31, 2007 in the Australian capital by then Defense Secretary Hermogenes Ebdane Jr. and his counterpart Defense Minister Brendan Nelson.

The signing of the bilateral pact was witnessed by then President Gloria Macapagal-Arroyo and then Australian Prime Minister John Howard.

Last week, Defense Secretary Voltaire Gazmin confirmed reports that the Philippines would acquire at least 10 patrol boats from Japan. However, he declined to discuss with reporters details of the acquisition still in progress.

Coast Guard head Vice Admiral Edmund Tan said they have been negotiating a loan for the acquisition of the vessels.

Meanwhile, the AFP chief of staff, Lt. Gen. Jessie Dellosa, said the process of building a credible defense for the country has been moving fast, with the Navy’s acquisition of a second Hamilton-class cutter from the US.

The first such acquisition, the BRP Gregorio del Pilar, figured in the early part of the standoff between the Philippines and China over the Scarborough Shoal in the West Philippine Sea, which Manila calls Bajo de Masinloc and Panatag Shoal.

On the other hand, Beijing refers to the rock formation as Huangyan Island.
Del Rosario has repeatedly said “we have committed ourselves to improve our national defense by building a minimum credible defense posture” as he also stressed the need to protect national sovereignty.

“Given the country’s lack of resources, it behooves us to proactively seek the assistance and cooperation of our various international partners to achieve this minimum credible posture, which is a fundamental attribute of any sovereign country,” he also said.

According to Del Rosario, the “defense track” is part of the DFA’s comprehensive overall plan in promoting national security.

This year, the Philippines would be receiving about $144.66 million (about P6.25 billion) in defense assistance from the US, he said.

Aside from the delivery of a second Coast Guard cutter, “negotiations are likewise underway for more defense articles, including newer air assets for the Philippine Air Force. We also successfully secured funding in the amount of $53 million (about P2.3 billion) for radar systems to be used by the Coast Guard Watch Council for enhanced maritime domain awareness.”

He said Manila has been upgrading its defense partnership with Washington under the two allies’ Mutual Defense Treaty, citing changes in the regional and global security environment.

Del Rosario emphasized their focal point for cooperation has been to “increase our capacity for territorial defense and maritime security.”

Aside from the defense track, he also referred to the DFA’s diplomatic or political track, where the country would continue to push for the transformation of the West Philippine Sea into a Zone of Peace, Freedom, Friendship, and Cooperation, or ZoPFFC.

Under the ZoPFFC, Manila would observe a rules-based approach to all disputes in
accordance with the United Nations Convention on the Law of the Sea (UNCLOS).

For the legal track, the DFA plans to continue coordinating with other concerned government agencies as it resorts to dispute settlement mechanisms under UNCLOS.

According to Del Rosario, “there are five of them and we’re assessing which one is best for us, one that will serve our purpose well.”

Scarborough Shoal lies north of the Spratlys and 124 nautical miles west of Zambales province.

Both asserting their territorial claim to the shoal, Manila and Beijing have refused to recall their vessels from the area.

China has violated the Asean Declaration on the Conduct of Parties “for not allowing us to enforce our laws in the country’s 200-nautical mile Exclusive Economic Zone,” according to Del Rosario.

The Philippines earlier filed a protest with the UN, challenging China’s nine-dash claim that encompasses the whole West Philippine Sea.

Last month, Manila asked the Association of Southeast Asian Nations (Asean) to take a stand on its dispute with China over the Scarborough Shoal.

Del Rosario asserted that “all, not just the Philippines, will ultimately be negatively affected if we do not take a stand.”

He observed “if you take a good look, it appears to us that China wants to establish the rules. Obviously, there’s a negative implication for everyone, not just the Philippines.”

Asked if they would ask the US government’s help in resolving the conflict, he said they “would want all nations to make a judgment as to what’s happening there and what the implications are to their own countries.”

He claimed Washington has already taken a “very constructive role” in resolving the Spratlys dispute, when it pushed for the application of international law in solving the problem.

^ Good news yan. Proof yan na we're not alone in our fight against the big bully up north. Our interests do align with the interests of Korea, Japan and Australia.

In the end of the day a credible defence requires a credible economy we need to develop the larger oil and gas fields off the coast of Palawan in order to increase government budgets both for defence purposes aswell as to invest in developing infrastructure and the economy, the government must also quickly reform ridiculous laws which hampers foreign investors and their FDI to the country, we must also try to entice more Japanese and South Koreans and others to come and live work and invest in the country which will help job creation and overall economic development further increasing the governments tax revenues which can be plowed into defence budgets .

In the end of the day a credible defence requires a credible economy we need to develop the larger oil and gas fields off the coast of Palawan in order to increase government budgets both for defence purposes aswell as to invest in developing infrastructure and the economy, the government must also quickly reform ridiculous laws which hampers foreign investors and their FDI to the country, we must also try to entice more Japanese and South Koreans and others to come and live work and invest in the country which will help job creation and overall economic development further increasing the governments tax revenues which can be plowed into defence budgets .

As for The Chinese government, they should think twice before letting loose the canon. It would not be good for their country if it gains a lot of enemies.

it's an ATTACK SUBMARINE it can counter those lowly ASW of the pirates and even sunk those pirates before they can even perform ASW,..AND!how's the submarine-launched harpoons appeal to these stupid pirates???

And how do you know that there aren't any submarines of the Chinese in the area...did you count?

what are you???a commie???

Answer my question...

^^regardless, the US is not stupid enough to deploy only a single sub in the area.

Neither would the Chinese deploy a group of ships that is vulnerable to submarines without proper support.

I am not taking sites, I just want to put things into perspective.

Answer my question...

before i answer your question tell your commie friends first to get the fuck out of our country's territory! besides, they can face someone their size not bully the Philippines like facing up with their white balls the american might so that we can see how powerful they are or how stupid they are, but it is very clear they belong to the latter,..and, do you think their current submarine technology can match the west and the americans???wala pa nga silang nuke powered sub e,..:bash::bash::bash:

Neither would the Chinese deploy a group of ships that is vulnerable to submarines without proper support.

I am not taking sites, I just want to put things into perspective.

Wow after flooding the economy thread with your pessimistic ideas, suddenly you appear here. Anyway to answer your query. Chinas subs at of WWII technology so there you are, China subs will be scrap metal after a naval war and we will be collecting them as china wares after.

Get over yourself, calling me a commie is not adding any credibility to your statements.

All I am saying is that there might be a little more than you can see.

Of course it wont come to a war and China might still be behind the US but they are doing leaps and will have caught up with them in near future.

do we have military details such as this (http://www.atoplists.com/awow-17)? :)

look at that.. *envy mode* :lol:

Get over yourself, calling me a commie is not adding any credibility to your statements.

All I am saying is that there might be a little more than you can see.

Of course it wont come to a war and China might still be behind the US but they are doing leaps and will have caught up with them in near future.

PIRATES DON'T HAVE CAPABILITIES!!!:bash::bash::bash::ohno::nuts:okay pirate, then don't ask me to count your friend's sub,..they need innovations not stealing other's ideas before they can caught up and be called a superpower!!!:bash::bash::bash:

Get over yourself, calling me a commie is not adding any credibility to your statements.

All I am saying is that there might be a little more than you can see.

Of course it wont come to a war and China might still be behind the US but they are doing leaps and will have caught up with them in near future.

Highly doubtful China can catch up with US Defense technology in the "near future"...China can only steal so much and whatever tech they manage to steal, it would still take several years or even a decade for them to make it workable.

Get over yourself, calling me a commie is not adding any credibility to your statements.

All I am saying is that there might be a little more than you can see.

Of course it wont come to a war and China might still be behind the US but they are doing leaps and will have caught up with them in near future.

As what you are saying yourself China is trying to close the gap with the US then why should we not close the gap with our asian nieghbors as well. Do you think China is the only country trying to take advantage of our miliraty incapabilities? Vietnam is also there and so is malaysia and taiwan. Can we not atleast up our defenses with our smaller asian neighbors. Fyi even thailand has its own aircraft carrier.

As what you are saying yourself China is trying to close the gap with the US then why should we not close the gap with our asian nieghbors as well. Do you think China is the only country trying to take advantage of our miliraty incapabilities? Vietnam is also there and so is malaysia and taiwan. Can we not atleast up our defenses with our smaller asian neighbors. Fyi even thailand has its own aircraft carrier.

^^
that was really not an aircraft carrier..

^^
that was really not an aircraft carrier..

how so? if it can carry 6 harriers and 6 seahawks then it is an aircraft carrier.

I don't get it. Some people here are advocating for us to just accept Chinese bullying because they have an overwhelming military advantage. If that reasoning is followed by Taiwan, Vietnam and others, they would have been vassal states of China by now. Well they're not, because they built up their military strength enough to make China think of the consequences. We must follow the same. Good thing we have friends as well to help us on that but ultimately, defense of our borders lie with us.

I don't get it. Some people here are advocating for us to just accept Chinese bullying because they have an overwhelming military advantage. If that reasoning is followed by Taiwan, Vietnam and others, they would have been vassal states of China by now. Well they're not, because they built up their military strength enough to make China think of the consequences. We must follow the same. Good thing we have friends as well to help us on that but ultimately, defense of our borders lie with us.

Do not worry I am with you on this one, let us support our military to boost our countries defences

Pissing contest lang yan until an 'accident' occur.

I agree. I think by overreacting to us, they are trying to provoke us to fire the first shot so they will have the justification to send their fleets

As what alot of guys mentioned here, I agree, lets just enjoy noynoying...:):)

Manigas ang China sa pag-provoke sa atin. Because we will never fire the first shot..:cheers:

And as the situation goes, if ever China would send cannons and missiles to us majority of the world will be on our side. China would be in a bad light and their image would be even more tarnished. Everyone would distrust the Chinese then boom goodbye superpower aspirations.

I don't know with this Nookie guy but upgrading for the sake of sending a message of defiance to China is what the Philippines is doing and not to act as a deterrent. A minor upgrading from our side could never be a deterrent to an already vast arsenal of weapons and military assets. This battle could only be won by wits and how the government will play its card as a poor, insignificant and weak country against the 2nd largest economy in the world.

DND: China warships not cause for concern (http://www.philstar.com/Article.aspx?articleId=809157&publicationSubCategoryId=63)

MANILA, Philippines - The reported deployment of five Chinese warships near the Philippines’ maritime domain should not be a source of serious concern as long as these remain in international waters, the Department of National Defense (DND) said yesterday.

DND spokesman Peter Galvez said the vessels of other countries are also plying areas in the West Philippine Sea (South China Sea) as this is guaranteed by their freedom of navigation.

“As long as they are in international waters, this (report) should not be of serious concern,” Galvez said in a phone interview.

“It should not be given any color. There are also ships from other countries that go to the area,” he added.

Galvez said the West Philippine Sea is a “heavily transited maritime area,” but declined to comment on the notion that the deployment of the five Chinese warships was a response to the recent visit of a US submarine in Subic Bay, Zambales.

“It’s not for us to speculate on the actions of other countries,” he said.

The DND official, however, said other countries can ply the route and can do port calls when needed subject to prior approval.

Galvez said they would continue to monitor developments in the West Philippine Sea, which is the subject of a territorial row in the region.

Earlier, Duowie News, a news outlet operated by overseas Chinese in Taiwan, reported that five Chinese warships have been sent on a training mission in a yet unspecified location near the Philippines.

The ships deployed for the mission were two Type-052B destroyers, two Type-054A frigates and a Type-071 amphibious transport vessel, the report said.

Talk about the supposed deployment of the five Chinese warships came after the US submarine USS North Carolina surfaced in Subic Bay last week.

There have been speculations that the five ships may be used to support the Chinese vessels around Panatag Shoal if the standoff over the disputed area worsens.

Known internationally as Scarborough Shoal, Panatag is 124 nautical miles from the nearest base point in Zambales.

The area is within the Philippines’ 200-nautical mile exclusive economic zone based on the United Nations Convention on the Law of the Sea (UNCLOS), to which China is a signatory.

The Panatag Shoal standoff started on April 10 after two Chinese maritime surveillance vessels barred the Philippine Navy from arresting Chinese fishermen who had poached endangered maritime species from the area.

The Philippines has been calling for a rules-based multilateral approach to the territorial row but China said this would only complicate the issue. China has rejected an invitation by the Philippines to bring the standoff before an international body.

The US has declined to take sides on the territorial row but has promised to help the Philippines improve its maritime security capabilities.

The submarine USS Carolina surfaced last Sunday but officials claimed that the port call was not related to the standoff.

Philippine security officials said the visit of the submarine was a routine port call scheduled on April 3, a week before the standoff started.

The submarine is designed to operate with stealth, agility and endurance in the world’s littoral regions, as well as the deep oceans.

Taiwan president hopes for peaceful end to shoal row (http://www.philstar.com/Article.aspx?articleId=809152&publicationSubCategoryId=63)

TAIPEI – Taiwanese President Ma Ying-jeou expressed optimism yesterday that conflicting territorial claims of the Philippines, China and Taiwan in the South China Sea will be resolved peacefully.

Ma said they are committed to addressing the dispute in a “rational and peaceful way.”

“In the South China Sea, we have implemented a cohesive policy that we safeguard the sovereignty dispute, pursue peace and prosperity and promote joint exploration,” Ma said yesterday about two hours after he was sworn into office for his second term.

“We are a peace-loving country and we will solve the conflict in a rational and peaceful way,” he said.

With other government officials by his side, Ma held a 40-minute press conference at the President’s Office attended by journalists from different countries.

“We will solve the dispute in a peaceful manner, but we will still continue to uphold sovereign claims over the South China Sea,” the Taiwanese president said.

The claim on Panatag or Scarborough Shoal heated up after Chinese vessels started preventing Filipino fishermen frin entering the shoal lagoon.

The standoff at Panatag began on April 10 when two Chinese fishery ships were deployed in the area to prevent the Philippine Navy from arresting and detaining Chinese poachers who had been apprehended in the area for illegally harvesting endangered marine species.

China has also suspended the importation of produce from the Philippines, including bananas, which has hurt local producers in the country.

Aside from the conflict in Panatag, journalists from different countries also asked Ma about his dipping popularity over some policies implemented by his administration, which include the pricing structures of electricity and the possible lifting of a ban on US beef, among others.

“(In my second term) our goal is to promote and uphold ideas, work together and create well-being for Taiwan,” Ma said.

“The real second term starts after the election, so after the election we reshuffled the Cabinet and proposed some new policies... which gained some negative opinions from the public and (thus we will) make necessary adjustments,” Ma said.

Local newspapers here reported thousands of people marched in the streets of Taipei protesting some of the government’s recent controversial moves.

Manila Mayor Alfredo Lim also attended the reception on Saturday night hosted by Taiwan’s Ministry of Foreign Affairs.

Earlier, the Philippine government expressed hope that there will be more work opportunities for Filipinos during Ma’s second term.

Amadeo Perez, chairman of the Manila Economic and Cultural Office (MECO) in Taipei, said since 2010 more Filipinos have managed to find employment in Taiwan.

“Under President Ma, we were able to increase labor arrivals here from the Philippines,” Perez told reporters from the Philippines during Ma’s inauguration.

“For his second term, I hope we could further improve our relations between the Philippines and Taiwan,” Perez added.

If Americans step forward to balance China for everyone else in the region, the nations of the Indo-Pacific will hang back and let us take the lead. And if we put ourselves between them and China, they will not just rely on us to back their existing claims against China, they will up the ante. It cannot make sense to empower the Philippines, Vietnam and others to pick our fights with China for us.

The bottom line is that the return of Japan, South Korea and China to wealth and power and the impressive development of other countries in the region should challenge us to rethink the entire structure of our defense posture in Asia. Unable to live by our wallets, we must learn to live by our wits. In my view, President Nixon’s "Guam Doctrine" pointed the way. We need to find ways to ask Asians to do more in their own interest and their own defense. Our role should be to back them as our interests demand, not to pretend that we care more about their national-security interests or understand these better than they do, still less to push them aside to take on defense tasks on their behalf.

http://nationalinterest.org/commentary/the-china-bluff-6561?page=show

^^ I like that. Even though how futile or worthless our upgrading efforts it is still within our interest and for the defense of our territory.

US, ASEAN talk security in Manila amid Scarborough standoff with China
Interaksyon | Agence France-Presse
http://www.interaksyon.com/article/32430/us-asean-talk-security-in-manila-amid-scarborough-standoff-with-china

MANILA -- The United States and Southeast Asian nations embarked on three days of talks Sunday that would include security cooperation, shortly after a Pentagon report raised concerns about China's military build-up.

The Philippines, hostsof the discussions and an Association of Southeast Asian Nations (ASEAN) member, is engaged in a month-long maritime stand-off with China over a disputed shoal in the South China Sea.

"Eminent persons" and senior officials from the United States and ASEAN would meet from May 20 to 22 in Manila, US embassy and Philippine foreign department statements said.

Deepening security cooperation, climate change, and trade and investment will all be on the table over the three days of talks. They will also "review key elements of the US-ASEAN partnership," the embassy said.

The meeting will also prepare for US-ASEAN leaders' talks in November.

The poorly armed Philippines has been stressing its defense ties with close ally Washington to help bolster its position against China.

A Pentagon report on Friday said China was carrying out aggressive cyber espionage as part of a steady build-up of its military power. Beijing expressed its "firm opposition" to the findings of the annual assessment.

'The US will not abandon the Philippines'
(http://www.philstar.com/Article.aspx?articleId=808906&publicationSubCategoryId=64)
NEW YORK CITY — A former US intelligence official bluntly told me that “there is absolutely no way the United States will ever abandon its commitment to the Philippines.” First of all, my American friend said, it is in America’s interest that the Philippines play a central role in Asia against terrorism. Despite the demise of Osama bin Laden, Al Qaeda continues to be a threat since affiliates like the Jemaah Islamiyah still operate in Southeast Asia, in particular the Philippines — dubbed a decade ago by the US as the “second front” in the war against terror. Mindanao — the so-called “backdoor” — has been acknowledged as a training ground for terrorists and militants, so that it continues to be absolutely important that RP-US Balikatan exercises be held almost always in the region. USAID has also implemented over 1,400 infrastructure projects in Mindanao, with focus given on “conflict-affected” areas. 

Secondly, it is clear that there is that special bond between the US and the  Philippines in almost all aspects of their relationship which goes back to the time of President Manuel L. Quezon and General Douglas MacArthur. That probably helps explain why regardless of who occupies the White House, the US has maintained strong relations with the Philippines. Over the years, the Filipino population in America has grown to about five million (including the undocumented) — making them the second biggest Asian group according to the latest US Census Bureau report. The report shows that Filipino-American organizations now have political clout in Washington since their numbers can be parlayed into a significant force especially with State Representatives that are largely elected by Filipino-Americans.

P-Noy is very smart to have appointed Foreign Secretary Albert Del Rosario who is doing an excellent job as our country’s chief diplomat. His previous appointment as Ambassador to Washington has made him very adept at navigating the corridors of Washington — and this comes in very handy especially at this time when the Philippines is embroiled in a tricky situation with China over Scarborough Shoal. Secretary Del Rosario has made it clear the Philippines is committed to the US and expects reciprocity especially with respect to the Mutual Defense Treaty.

“You can be sure that if ever the Philippines comes under threat of an attack by China or other countries, the US will uphold its commitment,” the former intelligence official said, echoing US State Secretary Hillary Clinton’s statement reaffirming US “commitment and obligations” under the MDT during the “Two Plus Two” meeting in Washington three weeks ago between Clinton, Del Rosario, US Defense Chief Leon Panetta and Defense Secretary Voltaire Gazmin.

One “good” thing that has come out of the standoff with China is the certainty that the Philippines is being closely monitored by Washington radar screens — with more “visiting forces” in Mindanao and US vessels now being clandestinely deployed, ostensibly for “repairs and supplies replenishment” like the USS North Carolina — one of the stealthiest and most advanced submarines — that docked at Subic a few days ago. The situation has also placed a sense of urgency on the need to fast track the modernization of the AFP to build a “minimum credible defense posture” that can be achieved primarily with assistance from the US.

No less than the chairman of the US Joint Chiefs of Staff, General Martin Dempsey, has admitted the shift in demographic, geopolitical, economic and military attention towards the Asia-Pacific region now that Washington is disengaging from the Middle East. Even the UN points to Asia-Pacific as an “anchor of stability for the world economy.” Indeed, more countries are looking to China as an economic partner yet ironically, they are increasingly relying on the US for security, expecting it to be the “regional balancer” without necessarily resorting to military force, according to former US National Security Adviser Zbigniew Brzezinski.

Despite the saber rattling and angry rhetoric from China, expressing irritation over perceived US interference on “strictly” Asian affairs and accusing America of fomenting a “cold war” mentality (due to increased and permanent US military presence in Australia), China knows it holds over $1.169 trillion in US debt, making it America’s largest debtor. So when I asked the intelligence official if Americans were afraid to engage the Chinese in a confrontation because of the debt, he retorted, “Precisely, we owe them a lot of money so it will be in their interest to maintain stable relations with us - otherwise, who knows? They may never see that money again,” he pointed out. :lol:

Recent developments involving the two giants reinforce this observation. Chinese Defense Minister Liang Guanglie visited the US last week (the first after nine years) where consensus was reached to further military ties, strengthen communications and steer the relationship toward stability, mutual trust and cooperation. Another indicator is Chen Guangcheng — the blind Chinese activist who escaped house arrest and sought refuge with the US Embassy in Beijing — with China finally agreeing to issue him a passport to leave for the US.

Nevertheless, it is clear that the Obama adminis-tration’s renewed attention to Asia through enhanced multilateral partnerships with Vietnam, Singapore, Australia, Japan, South Korea and of course, the Philippines, is meant to check China’s rising influence and maintain regional stability. 

“The Washington trip of your president (Aquino) this coming June should be a clear signal to the Chinese,” reiterated the former intelligence official, who has spent a long time in Asia and most definitely knows what he is talking about. When all is said and done, “the US will never abandon the Philippines — because it is clearly not in our interest to do otherwise,” he firmly concluded.

Unseen threats, prospects from the China crisis
by Francisco S. Tatad
Manila Standard
http://news.manilastandardtoday.com/2012/05/21/unseen-threats-prospects-from-the-china-crisis/

WHAT began at Scarborough Shoal as a purely maritime problem with China has now migrated to certain areas of the country’s economy and trade. It has shot up, and the end is not yet in sight.

The good news is that no hostilities have broken out over any endangered marine species being removed by the Chinese from disputed Philippine waters. The bad news is that Beijing’s travel advisory on the Philippines and its new sanitary measures on Philippine bananas are already hurting the country where it hurts the most.

At risk too is the fate of tens of thousands of Filipino Workers in Hong Kong and Macau. Beijing has said nothing about it, but the Filipino workers’ position could become precarious if China continues to play hardball and nothing happens to break the impasse. Yet the more serious problem could come not from China itself but from how the local Chinese finally respond to a prolonged Philippine-Chinese crisis.

The local Chinese are a minority, but their impact on the nation’s economy far outweighs their number. They are loyal to the Philippine republic, but their deep feelings as Chinese could find radical expression if the crisis begins to fester instead of being solved. Racial tension could arise, and that could tear the nation apart as it has torn other multiracial societies.

That is neither imminent nor predestined, and must be avoided at all costs. But it needs a less dysfunctional government that knows what it is doing and sees beyond the obvious, and a coherent and credible policy that allows the government to assert its position on the Spratlys while fully energizing its pursuit of peace.

The dispatch of a couple of small boats to fly the Philippine flag at Scarborough is not incompatible with such pursuit. Those who know the difference between a blue water navy and a reconditioned coast guard frigate will know that such maritime presence is merely symbolic. China knows it represents no threat.

But the nation’s political leaders will have to avoid trying to give the impression that those two small boats out there are the advance units of the US Seventh Fleet. They will also have to avoid trying to get the US State Department and the Pentagon to commit to an automatic US military response, if the Philippines figured in a naval clash in the Spratlys, and looking disappointed when told it is not in the treaty document.

The 1951 RP-US Mutual Defense Treaty (MDT) does not permit the US to get involved in the Spratlys territorial dispute, and contains no “automatic retaliatory clause” similar to that in the North Atlantic Treaty Organization (NATO) treaty document. The Philippine secretaries of foreign affairs and defense therefore were shooting from the hip when they suggested that the US supports the Philippine claim and action on the Spratlys.

Because there is no economic or military parity between the parties, China is not likely to start a war with its virtually unarmed neighbor without provoking international opprobrium and outrage. If there is to be war, it may have to start from the Philippine side, if it knew how to start a war, and if it desperately needed one. But the Philippines renounce war as an instrument of national policy. It does not need—and it cannot afford—war.

The stress on diplomacy is healthy and refreshing. But the government must know when its diplomats are performing or not, and it should be able to take the first basic steps in diplomacy before attempting anything complicated. There is no valid excuse why the post of Philippine ambassador in Beijing should remain unfilled just because the Commission on Appointments will not confirm a nominee who may know more about making money than basic diplomatic etiquette. If the President is serious, nothing should prevent him from sending a top career diplomat or statesman to Beijing as a sign of high respect for China’s status.

With the proper foreign policy and national security structure in place, the government should engage China in all seriousness. It could pick up a 12-year-old proposal to negotiate a Treaty of Friendship, Cooperation and Good Neighborliness with China, equivalent to what the French call Traite d’amitie, de cooperation et de bon voisinage, and start a new era in Philippine-Chinese relationship.

In 2000, as Senate Majority Leader, I proposed the treaty idea in a speech to the Senate on the 25th anniversary of the establishment of relations between the Philippines and China. The declared purpose was to update and replace the joint communiqué signed by President Ferdinand Marcos and Prime Minister Chou En Lai in Beijing on June 7, 1975 on the establishment of those ties.

Under the communiqué, Chinese-Philippine ties, under the “One-China” policy, were to be governed by peaceful coexistence, mutual respect for each other’s sovereignty and territorial integrity, mutual non-aggression, non-interference in each other’s internal affairs, equality and mutual benefit, and the peaceful settlement of disputes. Some of those principles have since come under strain.

A new treaty should cover the whole gamut of Philippine-Chinese relations—political, economic, trade, investments, tourism, air services, maritime, shipping, cultural, scientific, technological, agricultural, fisheries, forestry, environmental protection, mining, offshore minerals and petroleum exploration, and industrial joint ventures. Above all, it should provide for a mechanism for the pacific settlement of disputes in accordance with the UN charter as well as customary international law and treaty law, beginning with the UN Convention on the Law of the Sea.

Although China insists on a purely bilateral approach to the Spratlys issue, the Philippines should continue accessing the help of the UN and other friendly parties in trying to persuade its giant neighbor to submit their dispute to a peaceful settlement. In 1999, President Joseph Estrada tried to do that in his talks with UN Secretary General Kofi Annan in New York. No effort should be spared to persuade China to consider doing what others have done to resolve their territorial disputes.

There are notable examples. Malaysia and Indonesia allowed the World Court to resolve their territorial dispute over Ligitan and Sipadan islands. Botswana and Namibia did the same thing with respect to their dispute over the Kasikili/Sedudu island. And Spain, Morocco and Mauritania agreed to settle their dispute over Western Sahara, a colony administered by Spain but claimed by the two other countries, following an advisory opinion from the World Court on the legal status of the territory.

While China is opposed to a World Court settlement, the Western Sahara model might prove acceptable to the Chinese. In that model, the claimants did not ask the World Court to adjudicate the conflict. Instead, they asked the UN General Assembly to request the World Court for an advisory opinion on the legal status of the disputed territory. Based on that, the General Assembly asked the Court to say 1) whether at the time of Spain’s colonization, Western Sahara (Rio de Oro and Sakiet El Hamra) was a territory that belonged to no one (terram nullius); and 2) whether legal ties existed between Western Sahara and the Kingdom of Morocco and the Mauritanian entity, and if so, what were they?

Spain opposed the Court’s intervention, saying the territorial dispute could not be put to the Court without its consent. The Court replied that the request for an advisory opinion did not call on it to adjudicate the conflict, and that no state could prevent it from giving an opinion to the UN, which was the requesting party.

After due examination of the facts, the Court concluded that at the time of colonization there were legal ties of allegiance between the Sultan of Morocco and some tribes living in the territory of Western Sahara, but these did not establish ties of territorial sovereignty between Western Sahara and the Kingdom of Morocco or Mauritania.

The advisory opinion did not end the conflict. But influenced by this process, Spain, Morocco and Mauritania agreed on Nov. 14, 1975 to the partitioning of Western Sahara between Morocco and Mauritania, in exchange for the award of mineral and fishing rights to Spain. This agreement was then confirmed by the UN.

In like manner, the claimants to the Spratlys could request the UN General Assembly to ask for an advisory opinion on the legal status of the Spratlys. That could go a long way in tranquilizing the South China Sea and the Asia Pacific.

A far-seeing Philippine government should be able to lead in this process.

^^ Tatad failed to actually bring about a resolution to the Scarborough. All he was mentioning was the Spratly's which is a DIFFERENT matter from the Scarborough shoal.
He was mentioning the stand off but his resolution was the Spratly's which as entirely a different nature with Scarborough

Anu bah! Why are our politicians politically correct towards the Chinese government, ha?

"The United States will never abandon the Philippines"

Translation: The US wants a piece of the Oil action under the South China Sea.:lol:

"The United States will never abandon the Philippines"

Translation: The US wants a piece of the Oil action under the South China Sea.:lol:

LOL!

In fairness at least a piece lang. Sa China, "I want all your oil"; therefore I will make the whole sea "my territory" :lol:

And as the situation goes, if ever China would send cannons and missiles to us majority of the world will be on our side. China would be in a bad light and their image would be even more tarnished. Everyone would distrust the Chinese then boom goodbye superpower aspirations.

I don't know with this Nookie guy but upgrading for the sake of sending a message of defiance to China is what the Philippines is doing and not to act as a deterrent. A minor upgrading from our side could never be a deterrent to an already vast arsenal of weapons and military assets. This battle could only be won by wits and how the government will play its card as a poor, insignificant and weak country against the 2nd largest economy in the world.

Well said.:cheers:

LOL!

In fairness at least a piece lang. Sa China, "I want all your oil"; therefore I will make the whole sea "my territory" :lol:

:):):):):)

PHL ready for Chinese cyber warfare, Malacañang says (http://www.gmanetwork.com/news/story/258851/news/nation/phl-ready-for-chinese-cyber-warfare-malaca-says)

Malacañang on Sunday said it is ready to deal with potential cyber-attacks, amid reports that China is investing in cyber-warfare as part of its steady military buildup.

“Our technical people are very competent, we have been coordinating with the Department of Science and Technology. As to whether (the) Chinese have been involved or investing in that, we are in no position to comment," presidential spokesman Edwin Lacierda said on dzRB radio.

"Suffice it to say that as soon as we detect on our servers (an incident) that would point to a (denial of service attack), our IT people are on top of it and they are competent in dealing with it,” he added.

He was referring to recent cyber-attacks on government websites, including that on the Official Gazette (www.gov.ph), where there were signs the attacks originated from China.

Other recent attacks had targeted the sites of the Department of Budget and Management (www.dbm.gov.ph) and the Philippine Atmospheric Geophysical and Astronomical Services Administration (www.pagasa.dost.gov.ph).

The attacks occurred amid a month-long standoff between the Philippines and China at Panatag (Scarborough) Shoal.

The dispute started when Philippine military forces spotted Chinese fishermen gathering marine species from the area but were blocked by Chinese vessels when they tried to make arrests.

Some of the attacks from China had involved the defacement of the sites with a Chinese flag and the Chinese national anthem playing in the background, along with a message that Huangyan Island – the name China uses to refer to the shoal – is China’s.

Reports during the weekend quoted the Pentagon as saying China is pursuing a steady military buildup and investing in cyber-warfare.

“We have recently been the subject of several cyber-attacks... (but) so far we have been able to defend our website,” Lacierda said.

No info on added Chinese warships

Meanwhile, Lacierda said the Palace has no information on reports that China has sent five warships close to the maritime domains of the Philippines after the arrival of the nuclear-powered US submarine USS North Carolina.

“We have no information na magpapadala ng Chinese warships sa waters natin, I have no information on that. I chekced it with the AFP, wala sila ganoong information," he said.

In the meantime, he said it is in the interest of both the Philippines and China to continue pursuing a peaceful solution to the standoff.

“It’s in the interest of both countries to pursue a peaceful resolution to this,” he said.

He added that on the part of the Philippines, it has been “prudent” in both actions and words in making gestures of goodwill on the matter.

“As emphasized by (President Benigno Aquino III), we have maintained our position of de-escalating the tension in the Bajo de Masinloc standoff,” he said. — LBG, GMA News

Anong mapapala ng Chinese sa pagcyber warfare sa atin, wala naman silang magegain na info masyado kasi mano a mano pa tayo by large :lol:

If Americans step forward to balance China for everyone else in the region, the nations of the Indo-Pacific will hang back and let us take the lead. And if we put ourselves between them and China, they will not just rely on us to back their existing claims against China, they will up the ante. It cannot make sense to empower the Philippines, Vietnam and others to pick our fights with China for us.

The bottom line is that the return of Japan, South Korea and China to wealth and power and the impressive development of other countries in the region should challenge us to rethink the entire structure of our defense posture in Asia. Unable to live by our wallets, we must learn to live by our wits. In my view, President Nixon’s "Guam Doctrine" pointed the way. We need to find ways to ask Asians to do more in their own interest and their own defense. Our role should be to back them as our interests demand, not to pretend that we care more about their national-security interests or understand these better than they do, still less to push them aside to take on defense tasks on their behalf.

I just don't like this part. Who is picking a fight with China? Us? Papa Sugar? Papa Sugar has actually been more diplomatic to the point of almost appeasing the fatty Panda. We have also appeased the Panda in the past and are still trying to pursue diplomatic solution despite holding on our claim

I can still smell a Left Wing (Lib) Kano here.

^^ His statements are actually contradicting at best.

Isn't it that asking Asians to step up on their interest and defense are still "empowering" them, albeit subtly?

It seems to me that by large, Americans still don't understand China, therefore dismissing any China threat

^^ His statements are actually contradicting at best.

Isn't it that asking Asians to step up on their interest and defense are still "empowering" them, albeit subtly?

It seems to me that by large, Americans still don't understand China, therefore dismissing any China threat

No he is saying that Americans don't understand China. He's a Lib alright, a Chinese sucking one.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_W._Freeman,_Jr. I googled him. Apparently he was once a Chinese Interpreter for Nixon.

Look at his statements during 9/11:

Freeman commented at a Washington Institute for Near East Policy (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Washington_Institute_for_Near_East_Policy) meeting in 2002 that, "And what of America’s lack of introspection about September 11? Instead of asking what might have caused the attack, or questioning the propriety of the national response to it, there is an ugly mood of chauvinism (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chauvinism). Before Americans call on others to examine themselves, we should examine ourselves."[38] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_W._Freeman,_Jr.#cite_note-37) In October 2005, Freeman told another Washington conference: "On the question of U.S. strikes on targets in Iran or elsewhere, I simply want to register what I think is an obvious point; namely that what 9/11 showed is that if we bomb people, they bomb back."[39] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_W._Freeman,_Jr.#cite_note-38)

This ignorant, Chinse sucking Lib doesn't know that radicalism/extremism been steadily creeping since the 70's and US attitude was "Who Cares? They can't touch us" until 9/11 (remember the Burnhams hostage)?

^^ Just to clarify my last statement, I include him to those who don't understand China, therefore he could not really understand the China threat to Southeast Asia as well as to the West. He is a politically correct nut.

Not his "Americans don't understand China"

I find this article contradicting at best. On one hand, it kowtows to China, on the other hand, it encourages the US to find other ways...

It also baffles me that he had included US allies in his "rise to power" statement. So far, only China has been wanting to challenge the US might despite other countries have leaped in their defenses, too.

The only line I agree with him was the one I bolded.

This is so far his most bothering statement:

We need to think very differently than we have done over the nearly seven decades since the end of World War II. To be sure, a less forward-leaning American approach to securing our interests in Asia would require painful adjustments in Japan’s and South Korea’s dependencies on us as well as in our relations with the member states of ASEAN and India and Pakistan. It would almost certainly require an even stronger alliance with Australia. Paradoxically, it would be more than a little unnerving for China, which has come to like most aspects, even if not everything, about the status quo.

Is he saying, more support to Aussie and less support to "non-white countries"?

The chicoms will be happy if the US relocates to Australia

"The United States will never abandon the Philippines"

Translation: The US wants a piece of the Oil action under the South China Sea.:lol:

I doubt its about oil this time. It's more like their freedom of navigation in the WPS.

^^ Kasama na rin yan. :lol:

The advisory opinion did not end the conflict. But influenced by this process, Spain, Morocco and Mauritania agreed on Nov. 14, 1975 to the partitioning of Western Sahara between Morocco and Mauritania, in exchange for the award of mineral and fishing rights to Spain. This agreement was then confirmed by the UN.

In like manner, the claimants to the Spratlys could request the UN General Assembly to ask for an advisory opinion on the legal status of the Spratlys. That could go a long way in tranquilizing the South China Sea and the Asia Pacific.

A far-seeing Philippine government should be able to lead in this process.

"The United States will never abandon the Philippines"

Translation: The US wants a piece of the Oil action under the South China Sea

Alot of this does have alot more to do with oil and gas rather than securing imaginary lines on a map or for the sake of a handful of rocks although national prides too play a role and it isn't really the US that needs or seeks them as it has alot of other sources to draw from .

Both the Phillippines and China are more likely to be the one's to want and need those ressources both from a slightly different angle, if this could be solved diplomatically then it must be so that China agrees to cede actual territorial sovereignty of the territories to the Phillippines while the Phillippines agrees to exclusively sell or earmark most of those ressources to the Chinese thus satisfying China's voracious apetite for ressources .

Im sure up to this point the Chinese could agree with such a deal the main sticking point i suppose would be who actually exploits the ressources would it be Chinese oil and gas companies or would it be western or Filipino one's ?, i think that the country must insist on having the final say as to who should run the actual exploitation of these ressources .

In the end of the day the development of the larger oil and gas fields of this region and the revenues the government can derive from it is a vital national interest for the future development of the country, the Chinese tho probably also fear the Phillippines speeding up it's development thanks to these ressources as it could bolster the US alliance system against them abd become another South Korea or a mini Japan, to ease Chinese concerns if this were one of them im sure the country can accept to have a more neutral stance between the two nations at least from a military point of view whereby the Phillippines would accept to not be as heavily incorporated into the US alliance system and maintain a more neutral self defence posture ... .

But the Phillippines has more cards to play here and should stick to it's guns and get the most out of any eventual deals, we must definetely insist on full territorial sovereignty and exploitation right's while accepting to earmark the actual ressources for China, if they refuse things might be harder for us but we will still be able to exploit those ressources and make life difficult for China in the future as the Phillippines economy and ability to defend itself develops and grows to a more considerable size .

---

The reason why the US will never and can not abandon the Phillippines has more to do with it's credibility in the Asia Pacific region, US credibility suffered a blow when it was unable to do much to save it's puppet allied regime in Georgia against the Russian counterstrike in 2007, of course that can be forgiven as Georgia was located in a part of the world that has never been a traditional US sphere of influence and a place which it doesn't seriously see as part of it's national interest, South East Asia on the other hand is a different place geographically it is closer mentally to what the US considers it's living space and it's got alot of history in the region stretching from the Spanish American war and it's relationship with the Phillippines to WW2 and the Korean and Vietnam wars aswell as a more strategic economic interests in the region which is vital for the maintenance of the US economic system and model .

So it is indeed inconceivable that the US would abandon the Phillippines because to do so would be to abandon any American pretention to being an Asian power and not just an Asian power but the main hegemon of this region to do so would signal the end of America as a superpower, but this does not mean a blank cheque they will not go to war with China for little spats or disputes this trump card is only valid as a last resort .

Given the fact that Iran has several times threatened blockade of the strait of Hormuz, talagang kasama yan. They will want an alternative for oil resource other than the Middle East. Freedom of navigation and WPS oil come together. There has to be freedom of navigation and lack of Chinese threat to be able to get oil from the WPS. Sa niliit ng WPS sobrang interesado sa freedom on navigation dyan ang US

'The US will not abandon the Philippines'
(http://www.philstar.com/Article.aspx?articleId=808906&publicationSubCategoryId=64)

“Precisely, we owe them a lot of money so it will be in their interest to maintain stable relations with us - otherwise, who knows? They may never see that money again,” he pointed out."

TY ang utang sa China pag mangyari yan. :lol::lol:

Both the Phillippines and China are more likely to be the one's to want and need those ressources both from a slightly different angle, if this could be solved diplomatically then it must be so that China agrees to cede actual territorial sovereignty of the territories to the Phillippines while the Phillippines agrees to exclusively sell or earmark most of those ressources to the Chinese thus satisfying China's voracious apetite for ressources .



Not so sure, but I doubt that China will agree to this. Although oil and gas is one of their interest in the area, "control of trade" (loose sense) and their "island chain of defense" are also part of it. Their trade to almost all parts of the world pass through the WPS. (So does ASEAN and other East Asian states). If it were merely oil and gas, it would have been better for them to invest heavily on their neighbors oil and gas resources rather than claiming their neighbors coasts and practically the whole body of water.

I doubt its about oil this time. It's more like their freedom of navigation in the WPS.

I agree because if China is successful in taking over the whole of South China Sea as a Chinese territory, the US will not be able to cross through the Straits of Malacca to the Indian Ocean without going a longer path to south of Indonesia.. and if they want our oil fields.. I'd rather partner with a domocratic state than a communist state...

here is an interesting read

http://www.cnas.org/files/documents/flashpoints/CNAS_ESCS_bulletin3.pdf

Phl acquiring 10 patrol boats from Japan (http://www.philstar.com/Article.aspx?publicationSubCategoryId=63&articleId=808451)
By Jaime Laude (The Philippine Star) Updated May 19, 2012 12:00 AM

MANILA, Philippines - The Philippines will acquire 10 brand new patrol vessels from Japan for the Coast Guard in the West Philippine Sea.


Mabuti naman at naisip na bumili sa Japan, pero sana nga brand new. Kung hindi , wag naman mashado tanders na.

Pero sana ma explore yung possibility na baka kaya ng gumawa sa Pinas nito. (Cebu)

"The United States will never abandon the Philippines"

Translation: The US wants a piece of the Oil action under the West Philippine Sea.:lol:

You'd be a fool not to realise that.

Phl acquiring 10 patrol boats from Japan (http://www.philstar.com/Article.aspx?publicationSubCategoryId=63&articleId=808451)
By Jaime Laude (The Philippine Star) Updated May 19, 2012 12:00 AM



Mabuti naman at naisip na bumili sa Japan, pero sana nga brand new. Kung hindi , wag naman mashado tanders na.

Pero sana ma explore yung possibility na baka kaya ng gumawa sa Pinas nito. (Cebu)

Agree sir on both statements.:cheers:

WE should buy brand new and preferably Philippine made.

Phl acquiring 10 patrol boats from Japan (http://www.philstar.com/Article.aspx?publicationSubCategoryId=63&articleId=808451)
By Jaime Laude (The Philippine Star) Updated May 19, 2012 12:00 AM



Mabuti naman at naisip na bumili sa Japan, pero sana nga brand new. Kung hindi , wag naman mashado tanders na.

Pero sana ma explore yung possibility na baka kaya ng gumawa sa Pinas nito. (Cebu)


Kahit na hindi brand new kasi galing Japan kaya super ok ang condition na parang brand new...Mas mahigpit pa sa Japan kaysa USA ang maintenance ng mga gamit nila.

EDITORIAL - Tragic consequences
(The Philippine Star) Updated May 21, 2012 12:00 AM

http://www.philstar.com/Article.aspx?articleId=809151&publicationSubCategoryId=64

Here is another reason to speed up efforts to develop the country’s credible defense capability: preventing further loss of lives among those who are tasked to keep the nation safe. Last Friday morning, another trainer plane of the Philippine Air Force crashed off La Monja Island in Cavite. The Warrior Cessna had taken off from Sangley Point in Cavite before 7 a.m. before witnesses saw it plunge into the sea. As of yesterday, the two PAF pilots, Maj. Neil Tumaneng and 1Lt. Michael Arugay, had not yet been found.

PAF aircraft are needed not just for fighting enemies of the state but also for relief and rescue operations. Patrol aircraft are also needed as much as patrol boats to keep out intruders and uphold Philippine sovereignty over its territory.

Yet investment in credible defense has received low priority, with the national leadership seeing no need to fill the security vacuum created when the country shut down the US bases in Clark Field and Subic Bay in 1992. The modernization program for the Armed Forces of the Philippines, belatedly started in 1996, has fallen woefully short of expectations. Compounding the lack of investments in new PAF aircraft, many of the old ones have crashed, with a high incidence of mishaps involving trainer planes.

The ongoing standoff with China in Panatag or Scarborough Shoal has brought home the reality of how weak the Philippine military has become, and has given urgency to AFP modernization efforts. With AFP priorities shifting from internal security to territorial defense, the government has announced plans to acquire additional PAF aircraft. This should move quickly beyond the planning stage and political rhetoric. In the past years a standing joke about the PAF is that it is all air and no force. The joke would be hilarious if it didn’t have such tragic consequences.

Kahit na hindi brand new kasi galing Japan kaya super ok ang condition na parang brand new...Mas mahigpit pa sa Japan kaysa USA ang maintenance ng mga gamit nila.

With these boats, we can place them on the roughest seas.

vh2vrpoRyBI

Totoo ba na censored na yung mga images sa Google Earth/Maps ang Spratlys at Scarborough?

Information regarding to-be-acquired Japanese patrol boats:

Shiretoko class:
http://ja.wikipedia.org/wiki/%E3%81%97%E3%82%8C%E3%81%A8%E3%81%93%E5%9E%8B%E5%B7%A1%E8%A6%96%E8%88%B9

Bizan class:
http://ja.wikipedia.org/wiki/%E3%81%B3%E3%81%96%E3%82%93%E5%9E%8B%E5%B7%A1%E8%A6%96%E8%88%B9_(2%E4%BB%A3)

The Shiretoko class is older (1970s), speed = 20 knots, effective range = 4,400 nautical miles (this is good and exactly what we need), armament = 1 x Bofors 40mm Autocannon (later upgraded to JM61-M 20mm Vulcan) and 1 x Erikun (sp?) 35mm Autocannon

The Bizan class is newer (1990s), speed = 35 knots (very good, we need this), effective range = 600 nautical miles, armament = 1 x JM61 20mm Vulcan + C41 RFS fire control system

While still no missiles IMO these ships are actually quite a good deal (the Vulcans are lethal at close range) and will provide a much needed boost for our navy (given the condition it's in) despite them being originally Coast Guard assets. Only remaining question now is the price $$$...

Totoo ba na censored na yung mga images sa Google Earth/Maps ang Spratlys at Scarborough?

meorn yung cows tongue sa google maps :lol:

http://img404.imageshack.us/img404/1556/capturecc.jpg

With these boats, we can place them on the roughest seas.

vh2vrpoRyBI

WOW ! Awesome video of the Shiretoko class cutter under heavy seas, the ship almost FLIP over by the way ... PCG will get 2 of this class vessels by the way, thanks for sharing the video !

Excited for July.

Yeupz with those tough boats, we can have our coastguards on stand by most of the time without losing sight of our territories being taken over by the Chinese pirates without us being aware of it.

With these boats, we can place them on the roughest seas.

vh2vrpoRyBI

Kapag nakasakay ako dyan ay ganito na siguro ako :nuts::nuts::nuts: ngayon.

keep in mind that those Japanese Coast Guard ships/boats are going to the PHL Coast Guard, not the PHL Navy.

and it leads me to think, will the PHL Coast Guard retain the armaments? as our Coast Guard is a civilian organization. if i'm not mistaken, hand gun at small arms lang ang meron sa PCG.

the PHL Navy has its own thrust in terms of acquisition, namely the MRV project, the 2,000-ton corvettes, and a strategic sea-lift vessel. not to mention the upcoming USCG Dallas coming in Q2 as a patrol frigate and a probable 3rd patrol frigate by 2013.

the PHL Navy also plans to acquire its first submarine by year 2020.

go lang ng go, slowly but steadily, at least hindi nagkukulang ang gobyernong ito sa pag modernize ng AFP

Coast Guard is still part of The Armed Forces.

As for the sub, does The Philippines need one? What we need are weapons, equipment and vehicles that are capable enough to defend the country and interests from any foreign invasion.

As for the sub, does The Philippines need one? What we need are weapons, equipment and vehicles that are capable enough to defend the country and interests from any foreign invasion.

Submarines are one of the best means of doing so especially for an island nation ... .

yWoqqxREIA4

9ntz7MbKAvw&NR

( Submarine segment at the end of pt 2 and begining of pt 3 )

It was the threat of a British submarine that kept the rest of the Argentine navy from leaving their ports especially their aircraft carrier especially after a British submarine sunk Argentina's battlecruiser ... .

The Falklands war was the last major naval and island warfare to date it is the closest example of what war for the Phillippines could look like and should learn from .

From the British we should learn the power of the submarine and the value of having credible force projection capability to take or recapture islands, from the Argentines we should learn the value of naval air power and anti ship missiles .

If the Phillippine navy had submarines it could cut of China's vital sea lanes of communication a situation it can't endure for long so short of a powerfull surface fleet or air forces and nuclear weapons submarines are the best and only true means of dissuasion .

Get over yourself, calling me a commie is not adding any credibility to your statements.

All I am saying is that there might be a little more than you can see.

Of course it wont come to a war and China might still be behind the US but they are doing leaps and will have caught up with them in near future.

Oh by the way, the sub that China will deploy in WPS will be happy kissing its seabed and not knowing what and who hit them. Just having subs dont show your naval superiority when you know your technology is much inferior with the technology of others. And US is not stupid enough to create a stealth submarine without thinking how can they deploy missiles from it undetected.

Submarines are one of the best means of doing so especially for an island nation ... .

It was the threat of a British submarine that kept the rest of the Argentine navy from leaving their ports especially their aircraft carrier especially after a British submarine sunk Argentina's battlecruiser ... .

The Falklands war was the last major naval and island warfare to date it is the closest example of what war for the Phillippines could look like and should learn from .

From the British we should learn the power of the submarine and the value of having credible force projection capability to take or recapture islands, from the Argentines we should learn the value of naval air power and anti ship missiles .

If the Phillippine navy had submarines it could cut of China's vital sea lanes of communication a situation it can't endure for long so short of a powerfull surface fleet or air forces and nuclear weapons submarines are the best and only true means of dissuasion .

The Falklands is one of my favorite battles in history and it is the only war in modern times where a South American country got involved with a foreign power especially Great Britain.

As for the sub, the question is costs. For now, the country should purchase fighter planes.

As for the sub, the question is costs. For now, the country should purchase fighter planes.

Well were not going to buy and or operate a nuclear powered hunter killer submarine that's for sure, but we don't need those kinds of subs the US navy need them because it has to operate around the world and thus require the range and autonomy that nuclear power can provide but this also require large hulls to house the powerplant and crew .

What the Phillippine navy needs and is actually even better than nuclear subs for this purpose are modern western specifically German type U214 diesel subs equipped with hydrogen fuell cells giving them long endurance and basically making these the quietest and most stealthy submarines in the world today .

These usually costs around 300 million $ a piece brand new but there are bound to be a few available second hand especially from Greece which can no longer really afford the one's they ordered, or otherwise im sure some can be ordered at lower costs by having say South Korea build them under license from Germany which it already has for it's own navy .

300 million $ can maybe buy you 5 or 6 f16's ..., so is it worth it id say i agree that the next priority should be procuring jets but once the paf does have a squadron or two i don't see why the navy shouldn't procure at least 2 of these types of subs .

TfjYZUiOkUw

I'm wondering how our defense budget is split. How much does The Army get? Or the Navy / Marines / Coast Guard or the PAF?

I'm wondering how our defense budget is split. How much does The Army get? Or the Navy / Marines / Coast Guard or the PAF?

^^ You may view it on the 2012 General Appropriations Act.

http://www.dbm.gov.ph/wp-content/uploads/GAA/GAA2012/DND/F.pdf

Coast Guard is still part of The Armed Forces.

As for the sub, does The Philippines need one? What we need are weapons, equipment and vehicles that are capable enough to defend the country and interests from any foreign invasion.

PCG is now under the DOTC I think.

PCG is now under the DOTC I think.

You are correct.

Russia Against Meddling
Standoff 'Must Not Involve Non-Claimant Countries'
By ROY C. MABASA
May 20, 2012, 4:36pm

MANILA, Philippines - Expressing “concern,” the Russian Federation declared it is against any meddling by nations other than the claimant-countries in the South China Sea (or West Philippine Sea) territorial dispute, a Russian diplomat said over the weekend.

http://www.mb.com.ph/articles/360014/russia-against-meddling

Translation:
1) We dont want the US to benefit from the riches of the region thru Philippines
2) Let Philippines and China slug it out...obviously china which is our ally ( well..better than the Philippines ) would win this and so is our "interest"
3) IF US gets involved so would we with any ally of our choosing ( maybe Vietnam )
4)...............................................open to translation :D:D

^^^^^^Russia is just parroting China's pronouncements.:ohno::ohno:

Russia Against Meddling
Standoff 'Must Not Involve Non-Claimant Countries'
By ROY C. MABASA
May 20, 2012, 4:36pm



http://www.mb.com.ph/articles/360014/russia-against-meddling

Translation:
1) We dont want the US to benefit from the riches of the region thru Philippines
2) Let Philippines and China slug it out...obviously china which is our ally ( well..better than the Philippines ) would win this and so is our "interest"
3) IF US gets involved so would we with any ally of our choosing ( maybe Vietnam )
4)...............................................open to translation :D:D

It should not be surprising. After all, lately, the bear and the dragon have the same line of thinking.

It's surprising they are not bothered that their dragon does not want international arbitration...:nuts:

It should not be surprising. After all, lately, the bear and the dragon have the same line of thinking.

It's surprising they are not bothered that their dragon does not want international arbitration...:nuts:

Stupid Russians, Wait till China rapes your women, like what happened with the German - Russian Alliance before. First they stand side by side then after Russia fails to commit Germany started bombing and occupying them then raped most of there women. This will happen again looking at the proximity of Russia to Germany and Russia to China now. This time around China Men will rape there ladies. There's a saying "History Repeats its self" I feel very sorry for Russia for Aligning itself to China. Rest in Peace!

Well. Chinese and Russian Bolsheviks share the same way of twisted thinking. Russia never learnt from its demise at the hands of the United States in the Cold War and now they want the same thing to happen to China by encouraging the ambitious paper dragon. Let it be, both nations will be the losers anyway. At least Russia is doing us a favor by dragging China down the shit-hole with them.

I had always held no love for the Bolsheviks exacerbated by their massacre of the Russian Royal Family. Both of them have lost the luster and wisdom of their imperial past. And now they still think they can dominate the world. They're nothing more than remnants of the USSR who grudgingly struggle to compete with America and the victorious Western Allies.

They will have to accept the reality that socialism/communism will not work in a world dominated by capitalism. Their Cold War view of the world will be detrimental to all our efforts in the past to keep the status quo and maintain the peace by which all of us have greatly benefited from.

NATO beefing up its missle defense system. the europeans told it's for protection against iran. and iran has no capability to reach them. which means...russia and china. even the europeans walang tiwala sa russia at china. better safe than sorry :) they clearly know something we dont know yet :)

They will have to accept the reality that socialism/communism will not work in a world dominated by capitalism. Their Cold War view of the world will be detrimental to all our efforts in the past to keep the status quo and maintain the peace by which all of us have greatly benefited from.

Sabay tayo pa ang pinagsasabihan ng Cold War mentality. The reason why Asian nations are beefing up on defenses is because of Chinese aggression and arrogance. Even the Philippines who slacks in military upgrade finally found itself desperately trying to upgrade. :lol:

China is the cause of an arms race. Kahit may problema tayo sa terrorismo, hindi naging ganito kaseryoso ang arms upgrade natin. Ngayon lang na yumayabang mga communista na yan

NATO beefing up its missle defense system. the europeans told it's for protection against iran. and iran has no capability to reach them. which means...russia and china. even the europeans walang tiwala sa russia at china. better safe than sorry :) they clearly know something we dont know yet :)

Given the long history of distrust between the Bolsheviks and the Europeans especially those in the west, it is not surprising. Except for the French and some eastern european countries that in some ways tend to align with socialist policies.

Sabay tayo pa ang pinagsasabihan ng Cold War mentality. The reason why Asian nations are beefing up on defenses is because of Chinese aggression and arrogance. Even the Philippines who slacks in military upgrade finally found itself desperately trying to upgrade. :lol:

China is the cause of an arms race. Kahit may problema tayo sa terrorismo, hindi naging ganito kaseryoso ang arms upgrade natin. Ngayon lang na yumayabang mga communista na yan

What's good about this is that we are tremendously benefiting from it in terms of building a more cohesive country and galvanizing our national identity. Some economic pressures are nothing when you compare to what benefit we can get if we become a true united nation. The defense upgrade and reputation build-up we get are just icing on top of the cake. :cheers:

As I said, they are actually doing us a favor with all of their actions. They will lose more than what us. I mean, what can someone who's got nothing lose? :lol:

TfjYZUiOkUw
Until batteries are developed that are capable of very deep discharging and a better power to weight ratio, hybrid-engined subs will be very desirable! Unfortunately, Chile and China holds lots of deposits of lithium, a lighter material for the manufacture of batteries! See below;
Lithium mine production (2011) and reserves in tonnes
Country Production Reserves
*Chile 12,600 7,500,000
*People's Republic of China 5,200 3,500,000
*Australia 9,260 970,000
*Argentina 3,200 850,000
*Canada*(2010) 480 180,000
*Brazil 160 64,000
*Zimbabwe 470 23,000
*Portugal 820 10,000
World total 34,000 13,000,000

I'm wondering how our defense budget is split. How much does The Army get? Or the Navy / Marines / Coast Guard or the PAF?
Heck you can bet the lions share goes to the pension funds, bank accounts and real estate properties of the generals and their families. Everything else is secondary.

http://resources2.news.com.au/images/2010/07/05/1225887/950766-submarine-cocaine.jpg
Columbian Home-made Drug Smuggling Submarine

Submarines are very good defense weapons.:cheers:

If the Columbian Drug Cartels can make their own subs. Why can't the Pinoys?

Start copying Filipinos!

Wow! those nations being bullied by China ( except for Australia ) are all pitching in to help us stand against the red monster I hope this send in a strong message to China that nations are coming together to counter your arrogance and aggressiveness in the region, I also hope that WE COULD HAVE A UNIFIED STANCE TO START BANNING OR AT LEAST LIMITING CHINESE IMPORTS to teach them a lesson and to remind them hard that their insolence is not tolerated in the international community and THEY NEED THESE COUNTRY THEY ARE BULLYING TO PROSPER!...I feel the the Philippines become the unifying factor and catalyst to have a unified stance againts china!!:banana::banana:

By the way....where is ( our so called ) ASEAN brothers??:dunno:...IMHO ASEAN nations ARE BUSY COMPETING WITH ONE ANOTHER That the demise of one competitor will ease up competition...well bad news my "brothers"! we will stand against this adversary and we will emerge stronger than ever!! :horse::horse:


Japan, SoKor, Australia to help PH improve defense capability – DFA
By Jerry E. Esplanada
Philippine Daily Inquirer
4:54 pm | Sunday, May 20th, 2012

MANILA, Philippines — Aside from the United States, at least three other countries – Japan, South Korea and Australia – are helping the Philippines establish a minimum credible defense posture to complement its diplomatic capacity in dealing with its territorial disputes with China in the West Philippine Sea (South China Sea).

Foreign Affairs Secretary Albert del Rosario pointed this out over the weekend as he also disclosed that the Tokyo government is likely to provide the country with 12 patrol boats.

“They’re considering 10 forty-meter patrol boats on ODA (Official Development Aid) and two larger ones as grants,” Del Rosario told the Philippine Daily Inquirer

In a text message, he also said: “Regarding South Korea, we have a logistics agreement and we have received equipment, such as vests and helmets (for the Armed Forces of the Philippines).”

“I understand our defense department is looking to possibly purchase aircraft from there,” according to Del Rosario.

In November, President Benigno Aquino III asked visiting South Korean President Lee Myung-bak for aircraft, patrol boats and other hardware to help boost the country’s military amid then rising tensions with China over the Spratlys Islands.

Lee did not disclose any response to the specific request but said Seoul wanted to help Manila resolve its maritime problems.

From Australia, the Department of Foreign Affairs head said the country could expect to get “a number of vessels for search-and-rescue, as well as significant training here and abroad for large numbers of our military (personnel).”

“We expect increased help (from the Australian government) when the Status of the Visiting Forces Agreement (or SOFVA between Manila and Canberra) is ratified, hopefully this week,” said Del Rosario.

The SOFVFA, which covers the “status of visiting forces from each state while in the territory of the other state,” was signed on May 31, 2007 in the Australian capital by then Defense Secretary Hermogenes Ebdane Jr. and his counterpart Defense Minister Brendan Nelson.

The signing of the bilateral pact was witnessed by then President Gloria Macapagal-Arroyo and then Australian Prime Minister John Howard.

Last week, Defense Secretary Voltaire Gazmin confirmed reports that the Philippines would acquire at least 10 patrol boats from Japan. However, he declined to discuss with reporters details of the acquisition still in progress.

Coast Guard head Vice Admiral Edmund Tan said they have been negotiating a loan for the acquisition of the vessels.

Meanwhile, the AFP chief of staff, Lt. Gen. Jessie Dellosa, said the process of building a credible defense for the country has been moving fast, with the Navy’s acquisition of a second Hamilton-class cutter from the US.

The first such acquisition, the BRP Gregorio del Pilar, figured in the early part of the standoff between the Philippines and China over the Scarborough Shoal in the West Philippine Sea, which Manila calls Bajo de Masinloc and Panatag Shoal.

On the other hand, Beijing refers to the rock formation as Huangyan Island.

Del Rosario has repeatedly said “we have committed ourselves to improve our national defense by building a minimum credible defense posture” as he also stressed the need to protect national sovereignty.

“Given the country’s lack of resources, it behooves us to proactively seek the assistance and cooperation of our various international partners to achieve this minimum credible posture, which is a fundamental attribute of any sovereign country,” he also said.

According to Del Rosario, the “defense track” is part of the DFA’s comprehensive overall plan in promoting national security.

This year, the Philippines would be receiving about $144.66 million (about P6.25 billion) in defense assistance from the US, he said.

Aside from the delivery of a second Coast Guard cutter, “negotiations are likewise underway for more defense articles, including newer air assets for the Philippine Air Force. We also successfully secured funding in the amount of $53 million (about P2.3 billion) for radar systems to be used by the Coast Guard Watch Council for enhanced maritime domain awareness.”

He said Manila has been upgrading its defense partnership with Washington under the two allies’ Mutual Defense Treaty, citing changes in the regional and global security environment.

Del Rosario emphasized their focal point for cooperation has been to “increase our capacity for territorial defense and maritime security.”

Aside from the defense track, he also referred to the DFA’s diplomatic or political track, where the country would continue to push for the transformation of the West Philippine Sea into a Zone of Peace, Freedom, Friendship, and Cooperation, or ZoPFFC.

Under the ZoPFFC, Manila would observe a rules-based approach to all disputes in accordance with the United Nations Convention on the Law of the Sea (UNCLOS).

For the legal track, the DFA plans to continue coordinating with other concerned government agencies as it resorts to dispute settlement mechanisms under UNCLOS.

According to Del Rosario, “there are five of them and we’re assessing which one is best for us, one that will serve our purpose well.”

Scarborough Shoal lies north of the Spratlys and 124 nautical miles west of Zambales province.

Both asserting their territorial claim to the shoal, Manila and Beijing have refused to recall their vessels from the area.

China has violated the Asean Declaration on the Conduct of Parties “for not allowing us to enforce our laws in the country’s 200-nautical mile Exclusive Economic Zone,” according to Del Rosario.

The Philippines earlier filed a protest with the UN, challenging China’s nine-dash claim that encompasses the whole West Philippine Sea.

Last month, Manila asked the Association of Southeast Asian Nations (Asean) to take a stand on its dispute with China over the Scarborough Shoal.
:dunno:
Del Rosario asserted that “all, not just the Philippines, will ultimately be negatively affected if we do not take a stand.”

He observed “if you take a good look, it appears to us that China wants to establish the rules. Obviously, there’s a negative implication for everyone, not just the Philippines.”

Asked if they would ask the US government’s help in resolving the conflict, he said they “would want all nations to make a judgment as to what’s happening there and what the implications are to their own countries.”

He claimed Washington has already taken a “very constructive role” in resolving the Spratlys dispute, when it pushed for the application of international law in solving the problem.

http://globalnation.inquirer.net/37441/japan-sokor-australia-to-help-ph-improve-defense-capability-%E2%80%93-dfa

Oh by the way, the sub that China will deploy in WPS will be happy kissing its seabed and not knowing what and who hit them. Just having subs dont show your naval superiority when you know your technology is much inferior with the technology of others. And US is not stupid enough to create a stealth submarine without thinking how can they deploy missiles from it undetected.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-492804/The-uninvited-guest-Chinese-sub-pops-middle-U-S-Navy-exercise-leaving-military-chiefs-red-faced.html

woopsie...

Philippines to get 2nd US coast guard ship

Manila, May 21 (Xinhua-ANI): The United States government is turning over the second Hamilton class cutter to the Philippine government on Wednesday, according to the Philippine government.

Armed Forces of the Philippines (AFP) spokesman Col. Arnulfo Marcelo Burgos confirmed on Monday that AFP chief Gen. Jessie Dellosa and Rear Adm. Jose Luis Alano, commander of the Navy's Philippine Fleet, have flown to the U.S. to receive the second Hamilton class cutter.

Burgos disclosed that after the turn over, the ship will undergo refurbishing in the U.S. while Navy personnel will undergo training to operate the vessel. The U.S. government, however, did not grant the request of the Philippine government to retain close- in weapon and radar systems in the second ship.

-edited-


source
http://in.news.yahoo.com/philippines-2nd-us-coast-guard-ship-101934962.html

Coast Guard is still part of The Armed Forces.

As for the sub, does The Philippines need one? What we need are weapons, equipment and vehicles that are capable enough to defend the country and interests from any foreign invasion.

the Coast Guard is under the DOTC, a civilian agency thus its civilian nature.. it can only be deputized by the AFP during times of war..

acquiring a submarine is always a capability upgrade for the AFP, as we need to explore all avenues for defense and deterrence strategies.. it revolves around the notion that what your enemy have, you should also have, for deterrence..

anyway the submarine acquisition is not a priority now, as it belongs to the final phases of AFP modernization (2020 and beyond)

Philippines to get 2nd US coast guard ship

Manila, May 21 (Xinhua-ANI): The United States government is turning over the second Hamilton class cutter to the Philippine government on Wednesday, according to the Philippine government.

The U.S. government, however, did not grant the request of the Philippine government to retain close- in weapon and radar systems in the second ship.

-edited-


source
http://in.news.yahoo.com/philippines-2nd-us-coast-guard-ship-101934962.html

Very sad. To have a credible defense force, we need naval ships with missile system.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-492804/The-uninvited-guest-Chinese-sub-pops-middle-U-S-Navy-exercise-leaving-military-chiefs-red-faced.html

woopsie...


hahaha ooppsiieess. and do you have any idea why the Americans didnt attack that submarine when it emerged? They could easily sink that sub since it showed its presence in the middle of exercise and knowing that it is uninvited? Think, think, and think. OK?

hahaha ooppsiieess. and do you have any idea why the Americans didnt attack that submarine when it emerged? They could easily sink that sub since it showed its presence in the middle of exercise and knowing that it is uninvited? Think, think, and think. OK?


no please enlighten me

Why didn't US sink it, why didn't they commit an act of war...:nuts:

the commies are making a lot of pirated stuffs, even a forum member is as fake as a pirated things made in china:bash::bash::bash:

Heck you can bet the lions share goes to the pension funds, bank accounts and real estate properties of the generals and their families. Everything else is secondary.

I doubt Aquino will allow that especially during time of crisis.

Very sad. To have a credible defense force, we need naval ships with missile system.

The process of getting those missile systems is underway. Wait for July.

I doubt Aquino will allow that especially during time of crisis.

not only during crises i hope but at all times...

no please enlighten me

Why didn't US sink it, why didn't they commit an act of war...:nuts:

The US would not fire any shot because they dont want WW3 to start.

Very sad. To have a credible defense force, we need naval ships with missile system.

we are not going to war at the moment, so we just need oceangoing and high-endurance patrol vessels like the Hamilton-class..

missile-armed ships are in the pipeline, that's for sure. but for now, we just need naval assets capable of patrolling every breadth of our territorial seas..

even if we instantly buy a couple of missile-armed ships now, China will just laugh at us.. and besides, it takes YEARS or even DECADES to buy that kind of stuff.. it's not like buying some shirts at the mall

i'm in disbelief at the sincerity of the US to "help" us against China when they won't allow us retaining the CIWS systems of these ships.. the CIWS can actually save these ships from a barrage of Chinese SSM's since our ships don't have VLS for air-defense.. kahit MANPAD wala tayo, and goodluck trusting the 76mm for air-defense :nuts:

^^ I commend the current admin for fast tracking capability upgrades for the AFP. We didn't get any ship comparable to the Hamiltons before on the other admins. Yes it is old but i think it is better than having none at all, plus the fact that its size makes it possible to add more sensors and missiles on- board in the future.

i'm in disbelief at the sincerity of the US to "help" us against China when they won't allow us retaining the CIWS systems of these ships.. the CIWS can actually save these ships from a barrage of Chinese SSM's since our ships don't have VLS for air-defense.. kahit MANPAD wala tayo, and goodluck trusting the 76mm for air-defense :nuts:

the US is just playing it safe. Beggars can't be choosers.

The US would not fire any shot because they dont want WW3 to start.

Yes, obviously...but uncle sams little boyfriend over there can't comprehend that neither china nor US wouldn't want to risk a war

gladly so

The process of getting those missile systems is underway. Wait for July.

details? are we seeing Harpoons or Exocets on our Hamiltons?

the US is just playing it safe. Beggars can't be choosers.

hay buhay, haha.. we can actually afford the CIWS, but yeah i think the "bargain transfer" conditions screwed it up

details? are we seeing Harpoons or Exocets on our Hamiltons?


Ansave, magkakaroon daw tayo ng anti-ship missiles na pakakawalan mula sa kalupaan. (para to sa seguridad kontra sa mga tsekwang nagbabasa ng forum) :cheers:

Ansave, magkakaroon daw tayo ng anti-ship missiles na pakakawalan mula sa kalupaan. (para to sa seguridad kontra sa mga tsekwang nagbabasa ng forum) :cheers:

galing sa lupa pala.. gets ko na

Russia Against Meddling
Standoff 'Must Not Involve Non-Claimant Countries'
By ROY C. MABASA
May 20, 2012, 4:36pm



http://www.mb.com.ph/articles/360014/russia-against-meddling

Translation:
1) We dont want the US to benefit from the riches of the region thru Philippines
2) Let Philippines and China slug it out...obviously china which is our ally ( well..better than the Philippines ) would win this and so is our "interest"
3) IF US gets involved so would we with any ally of our choosing ( maybe Vietnam )
4)...............................................open to translation :D:D


Idiots.

camote pala mga pirata e, talo!!!:cheers:dba nila alam na spratly's ang nakataya sa laban na to?:lol:



Gabuco: This is for my son

MANILA, Philippines - Josie Gabuco had just stepped out of the plane that carried members of the Philippine boxing team from Qinhuangdao, China when she was handed the phone.

Gabuco was asked how she felt winning the gold medal in the AIBA World Women’s Boxing Championships.

“Masayang-masaya po ako (I’m very happy). Thank you,” said the 25-year-old who won the light-flyweight gold at the expense of a hometown bet.

It was the first gold medal for the Philippines in the AIBA World Championships.

Not even the male boxers have won it before with Harry Tañamor and Roel Velasco settling for the silver medals in 2007 in Chicago and in 1997 in Budapest.

Gabuco said she worked hard for the event but never expected much.

“Mahirap po kasi mag-expect ng malaki (It’s difficult to make big expectations),” said Gabuco, considering that she was up against China’s Xu Shiqi in the finals.

“Especially sa finals, alam ko na kung dikit ang laban, tagilid tayo (I knew that in a close match, we’re in trouble),” said Gabuco.

But she pulled it off against her fading opponent, and went on to score a 10-9 victory after entering the fourth and final round trailing, 8-7.

“Naging fair naman sila,” she said of the judging.

“We’re so proud of Josie,” said ABAP executive director Ed Picson who traveled with the team.

Gabuco, who won the bronze in the same tournament in 2008, stands to receive a hefty cash incentive from PLDT/Smart, the main backers of the Amateur Boxing Association of the Philippines.



She can easily get a million pesos for it, and just the thought of it makes her so happy.

Gabuco has a five-year-old son, Mack Joseph, whom she had entrusted to her teammates at the ABAP Gym at the Rizal Memorial Sports Complex while she was away.

Josie Gabuco
“Gusto ko na siya makita. Para sa kanya ito (I want to see him now. This is for him),” said the two-time gold medalist in the Southeast Asian Games.

“Kung ano man ang matanggap ko, para sa anak ko ito. Assured na ang future niya,” said Gabuco, who’s also hoping to pay the balance for the house she built in Laguna.

“Sana po mabayaran ko na din,” she said.

For her victory, Gabuco also stands to get a cash bonus from the Philippine Sports Commission under Republic Act 9064.

For quadrennial world championships, the gold is worth P2.5 million, but since the AIBA World Championships is a biennial event, the PSC said it will think of something else.

“It does not qualify with the same incentive for a quadrennial world championship. But we will think of something that will make her happy,” said PSC chairman Richie Garcia yesterday.

“We have not talked about it yet,” said ABAP president Ricky Vargas of the cash incentive.

Gabuco may be in for the surprise of her life.

http://www.philstar.com/sportsarticle.aspx?articleid=809177&publicationsubcategoryid=69

Ansave, magkakaroon daw tayo ng anti-ship missiles na pakakawalan mula sa kalupaan. (para to sa seguridad kontra sa mga tsekwang nagbabasa ng forum) :cheers:

magkano lang naman guro i-retrofit yan, kailangan talaga natin ng mga ASM na to,..plus kung pd isama sa budget yung mga land based mobile ASM launchers,..

even though it's land-based, it's still called SSM (ship-to-ship missile), not ASM

even though it's land-based, it's still called SSM (ship-to-ship missile), not ASM

SSM is a generic term and it's not ship to ship but surface to surface and ASM is one of its categories,..How can you classify a wheeled vehicle launcher of either a native or modified mobile launchers of the exocets (argentines) and the harpoon?

Mobile harpoon ASM
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/57/RDN_mobile_misbat.jpg/320px-RDN_mobile_misbat.jpg

Modified land based mobile laucher for exocet ASM
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/b/ba/Exocet_ITB.jpg

If the argentines able to modify it why not us???maraming mga APC na medyo nasabugan ng mina, i-convert natin into ASM launchers:cheers:

Yes, obviously...but uncle sams little boyfriend over there can't comprehend that neither china nor US wouldn't want to risk a war

gladly so

Russia is just parroting China's pronouncements.


I don't believe any war would erupt over such islands. Clashes, probably or small conflicts like the Taiwan Strait crisis 1996. China currently doesn't have enough military capability even for all their defense spending and they know they are being watched like a hawk by their neighbors for their attitude.
Russia won't be able to do anythng if her bitch China fires the shot first. Russia will suddenly become very lonely at the UN table:lol::lol::lol:

Kasalanan talaga to lahat ng mga pesteng communista at mga leftists na ugok na yan. Unbelieeeevable.

Kundi dahil sa paglulupasay at pag-ngangalngal nila e di sana andyan pa ang US Air Force sa Clark. Safety issue re external Chinese threats resolved.

E ngayon wala na ang US Air Force? :mad2: Pati pagbibiyahe ko pipilitan pa ngayon kami na lumuwas hanggang sa dulo ng walang haggan doon sa Clark para lang kunin mga flights in and out of the country? Pinipilit nila ngayong ipasara ang NAIA e at lipat lahat duon sa Clark. AYAW KO.

Columbian Home-made Drug Smuggling Submarine

Submarines are very good defense weapons.:cheers:

If the Columbian Drug Cartels can make their own subs. Why can't the Pinoys?

Start copying Filipinos!

What's interesting is that they hired Russians to design their own subs.

Wow! those nations being bullied by China ( except for Australia ) are all pitching in to help us stand against the red monster I hope this send in a strong message to China that nations are coming together to counter your arrogance and aggressiveness in the region, I also hope that WE COULD HAVE A UNIFIED STANCE TO START BANNING OR AT LEAST LIMITING CHINESE IMPORTS to teach them a lesson and to remind them hard that their insolence is not tolerated in the international community and THEY NEED THESE COUNTRY THEY ARE BULLYING TO PROSPER!...I feel the the Philippines become the unifying factor and catalyst to have a unified stance againts china!!:banana::banana:

By the way....where is ( our so called ) ASEAN brothers??:dunno:...IMHO ASEAN nations ARE BUSY COMPETING WITH ONE ANOTHER That the demise of one competitor will ease up competition...well bad news my "brothers"! we will stand against this adversary and we will emerge stronger than ever!! :horse::horse:

Japan, SoKor, Australia to help PH improve defense capability – DFA
By Jerry E. Esplanada
Philippine Daily Inquirer
4:54 pm | Sunday, May 20th, 2012

http://globalnation.inquirer.net/37441/japan-sokor-australia-to-help-ph-improve-defense-capability-%E2%80%93-dfa

I think boycotting their products is enough because we might run against the WTO of which the PRC is a member if we officially ban their goods.

We just need a strong industrial base. We have a very large domestic market thanks to the middle-class fueled by BPO. If we have them, we can manufacture all of what we need even armaments for the Defense Department.

I think boycotting their products is enough because we might run against the WTO of which the PRC is a member if we officially ban their goods.

We could do what china does, "stricter standards". Siguradong maraming babagsak :lol:

^^ And please close down those tiangge's selling China-made substandard products. We're suffering from these cheap-shot products being sold all around the country. :bash:

http://youtu.be/BMmfL1AIsd4/China infuriated by US-Philippines defense plans

may kakampi pala sa philippine congress at philippine sanate ang china,yong mga militanteng congresista at may mga senatong pa.napanood ko sa youtube.dapat ma ikulong na at hulihin ang mga pulitikong yan na bata ng china.syempre nakikinabang sila sa perang nangagaling sa china at sa pera ng philippine govt.mga traidor ang mga yan ibebenta tayo sa china.:bash:

pannorin nyo ang link na pinost ko,si arroyo pala ay bata ng china.

This should be very interesting....

Pentagon warns China on Spratlys, Scarborough backlash (http://www.abs-cbnnews.com/-depth/05/21/12/pentagon-warns-china-spratlys-scarborough-backlash)

MANILA, Philippines - The US Department of Defense has warned China that it courts backlash from other countries if it insists on its aggressive stand on territorial disputes.

The Pentagon, in its 2012 report to the US Congress on the military and security developments involving China, said Beijing must balance its interests if it wants to maintain harmony with other countries that it depends on for economic growth and development.

"Beijing is finding it increasingly difficult to balance these interests, particularly when the pursuit of one conflicts with the pursuit of another," said report released over the weekend.

It mentioned China's territorial disputes with other countries, including the Philippines.

"China's leaders view the first two decades of the 21st century as a 'period of strategic opportunity' for China’s growth and development. They assess that this period will include a generally favorable external environment, characterized by interdependence, cooperation, and a low threat of major power war.

"They believe this provides China a unique opportunity to focus on internal development while avoiding direct confrontation with the United States and other great powers. China’s leaders do not expect this period to be free of tension or competition (as evidenced by periodic flare-ups with neighbors over territorial disputes in the South China Sea) or to last indefinitely," the report said.

It said Chinese military theorists see the Spratlys and Scarborough shoal as belonging to the "first island chain" of China's maritime perimeter.

The Philippines itself is in the "second island chain" of China's maritime perimeter that extends from Japan to Guam.

Ayan na si Papa Sugar :lol:

http://youtu.be/BMmfL1AIsd4/China infuriated by US-Philippines defense plans

may kakampi pala sa philippine congress at philippine sanate ang china,yong mga militanteng congresista at may mga senatong pa.napanood ko sa youtube.dapat ma ikulong na at hulihin ang mga pulitikong yan na bata ng china.syempre nakikinabang sila sa perang nangagaling sa china at sa pera ng philippine govt.mga traidor ang mga yan ibebenta tayo sa china.:bash:

It's Russia Times kaya ganyan kaslanted :lol:

I saw a video from RT times too where they had this guest saying that the US daw is behind the Scarborough stand off:lol::lol::lol::nuts:

Sovereignty first (http://opinion.inquirer.net/29219/sovereignty-first)

There are many situations where the mind of a businessman can solve problems and break deadlocks where the mind of a politician cannot. Often, the businessman—thinking only in terms of pesos and centavos—can formulate innovative solutions that are beyond the imagination of the politician who is hobbled by having to balance a million and one considerations for a multitude of stakeholders. Indeed, a pragmatic businessman can move things forward in ways a pragmatic politician cannot.

But the issue of Philippine sovereignty over disputed territories in the West Philippine Sea, especially those currently occupied by Filipinos, does not make up such a situation.

Consider the resource-rich Recto Bank (internationally known as Reed Bank), which lies within the Philippines’ 200-nautical-mile exclusive economic zone. It is believed to hold deposits of oil and gas and has been the subject of past Philippine exploration campaigns. The idea of certain private groups of pushing ahead with the commercial development of Recto Bank in partnership with China’s largest oil company may be a well-intentioned one. But it is also ill-advised, brought about by a fundamental miscalculation of China’s intentions in the region.

Wildly developing and therefore energy-hungry China will have use for the oil or gas or whatever else will come up from the seas around Recto Bank and the disputed Spratly island chain. But while the Philippines and other countries claim only parts of the Spratlys, China claims the islands in their entirety, naturally including the resources found in and around them. (Remember that it also claims our Panatag Shoal as its Huangyan Island.)

The fundamental flaw of dealing with China National Offshore Oil Corp. on business terms—while ignoring the hot-button issue of sovereignty—is the assumption that the giant firm thinks like a private entity. The fact is that it does not. CNOOC is a state-owned enterprise whose every move requires the blessings of the highest Chinese officials. It is, for all intents and purposes, a state actor. And it should be dealt with as such, with Filipino businessmen harboring no illusions that they can appease the aggressive Chinese dragon with offerings of profit sharing from oil exploration.

In addition, the idea of doing business without talking ownership (an idea relentlessly pushed by the Arroyo administration) is an implicit capitulation to China’s claim that it owns Recto Bank.

Undertaking a joint exploration of the area with CNOOC—with the explanation that Filipino-owned firms do not have sufficient resources to fund such an expensive project—amounts to a cop-out. In both the virtual and physical sense, it will expand China’s sphere of influence (and physical territory) while we pretend that our rights over the area are not eroded.

If the Philippines needs a wealthy partner who can help fund the exploration, it should search for a private oil exploration giant whose acquisition target is restricted to dollars and cents and does not include territory.

What then should the Philippines do, faced with the massive threat that is China? It should stand its ground and not yield an inch, even when talking about joint exploration from a business angle.

President Aquino himself said last week that the Philippines did not have to be “the sole winner in the exploitation of resources” in the disputed areas, and that it had always been a good neighbor to other countries in the Asia-Pacific. But he also pointed out that it had to draw the line and look after its rightful interests, and noted Recto Bank’s position in the Philippines’ exclusive economic zone.

Of course, diplomacy remains the paramount approach, and the Philippine government is well-advised to maintain the issue on the international radar.

But in the end, the Aquino administration will find that the economics of putting sovereignty before business is a double-edged sword. The proposed joint development of Recto Bank with China should ring all the alarm bells. How will the Philippines share the wealth without ending in the belly of the beast?

So, it's all OUR FAULT, Mr Magno and bringing it to international arbitration is a bad idea?

Magkano ang investment mo sa China? :D So you admit that the EEZ we are entitled to is "actually" Chinese "territory"?

In the face of a possible protracted war of attrition with China over the disputed shoals, Foreign Secretary Alberto del Rosario called on Filipinos to prepare to make sacrifices. That is a passive, even defeatist, attitude to take.

Former president Fidel V. Ramos takes a more proactive, more dynamic attitude: dispatch Vice President Jojo Binay to Beijing. There he could sit down with his counterpart, who will be China’s leader later in the year, and discuss all the outstanding issues in a comprehensive manner.

Inasmuch as the Palace seems bent on Noynoying on the matter of appointing an ambassador to Beijing, Ramos’ suggestion makes a lot of sense. China is now our most important bilateral relationship. We cannot allow this impasse in our relationship go on and on.

The ice must be broken. The diplomatic chill thawed.

Beijing sits and waits for us to make a meaningful move. Manila, after all, is responsible for the tensions. We broke the holy silence about sovereignty over Scarborough Shoal. We sent a warship into the contested waters, something the Chinese were very careful not to do, patrolling the area only with civilian reconnaissance vessels.

Earlier, Beijing showed its displeasure with Manila’s cavalier treatment of the bilateral relationship. Ambassador Liu, a ranking diplomat and party official was replaced by a diplomat of lower rank and lower party stature. It was a subtle signal and Manila seems to have missed it.

The replacement happened after the Luneta incident, Manila’s refusal to formally apologize for it, and the administration’s foot-dragging on key Chinese-assisted infrastructure projects. By changing the stature of their ambassador to Manila, Beijing has downgraded the relationship.

Then comes the Scarborough incident and all the stupid things said in Manila about it, including the ridiculous proposal to unilaterally bring the matter to international arbitration. As I mentioned in the previous column, international arbitration can only happen if both parties submit to it. There is no such thing, in the world of diplomacy, as a unilateral submission to arbitration.

President Aquino’s attempt to install a seriously under-qualified family friend to be ambassador to China did not please Beijing. When that nomination was withdrawn, Aquino still went on to appoint the man as “special envoy” to China. To do what is anybody’s guess. What is clear is the move insults Beijing even more.

In the eyes of Beijing, Manila is either grossly insensitive or intentionally insulting. Someone should go there to assure them we were not intentionally insulting. Our officials are just grossly insensitive — or grossly incompetent.

That someone can only be Binay. We do not have a career ambassador in the roster capable of making a huge impression on the Chinese leadership. The worst that could be done from Manila’s end is to send yet another under-qualified person to Beijing, someone without the gravitas required to talk on the level and forge a lasting framework for our bilateral relationship.

Trust Ramos’ instincts, although the proposal might be painful for one Palace faction to accept. We have to show the Chinese leadership how much we value the relationship and how anxious we are to keep it stable and warm.

Only Binay can go there with enough political gravitas, hopefully equipped with plenipotentiary powers to heal a damaged friendship.

http://www.philstar.com/Article.aspx?publicationSubCategoryId=64&articleId=809434

Does he not see the problem? As a signatory of UNCLOS, China refuses to follow it

If China can refuse international arbitration, then we can refuse bilateral talks!

US: Weapons not included in warship (http://www.philstar.com/Article.aspx?articleId=809487&publicationSubCategoryId=63)

MANILA, Philippines - The United States did not give in to a request by the Philippines to include weapons and accessories in the second warship it will provide to the Philippine Navy.

Defense Secretary Voltaire Gazmin said during an interview over radio dzRH that US Coast Guard ship Dallas would be similar to BRP Gregorio del Pilar, which had been stripped of its weapons system before it was turned over to the Philippines last year.

“Pareho lang ng del Pilar (The same with del Pilar),” Gazmin said when asked whether the US had granted the Philippines’ request to retain the armaments of Dallas.

Earlier, officials asked the US to retain some key features of the Dallas but Navy chief Vice Admiral Alexander Pama said the request was turned down last May 8.

Among the ship’s features that Pama wanted retained were its close-in weapons system, Bushmaster cannons, air search radars and fire control system.

Armed Forces of the Philippines (AFP) chief Gen. Jessie Dellosa and Philippine Fleet commander Rear Admiral Jose Luis Alano will attend the symbolic turnover of the ship on Wednesday (Manila time) at North Charleston, South Carolina.

US Coast Guard ship Dallas will be renamed BRP Ramon Alcaraz, a torpedo boat commanding officer during World War II. Alcaraz retired as a commodore of the Philippine Fleet in 1966 and died in 2009.

“What we are trying to prevent is the commission of transnational crimes that can affect our economy like poaching, piracy and drug trafficking,” AFP spokesman Col. Arnulfo Burgos Jr. said.

“Our borders are porous so we have to guard them closely and the acquisition of the long-range cutter will help the Armed Forces of the Philippines,” he added.

The Dallas is an all-weather, high-endurance cutter and has features similar to that of Gregorio del Pilar.

The cutter was used mostly for drug and migrant interdiction, law enforcement, search and rescue, living marine resources protection, and defense readiness.

The ship can accommodate up to 180 officers and sailors.


I am curious of what the reason is for stripping it off again of weapons? Cash? Corruption cases? Fear that we will fire the first shot?

Albay attack shows Reds' lack of sincerity - Palace (http://www.philstar.com/nation/article.aspx?publicationSubCategoryId=67&articleId=809077)

MANILA, Philippines - The communist rebels’ latest attack in Legazpi City where P70 million worth of construction equipment have been destroyed only negates further the chance to reach a peace settlement, a Palace official said yesterday.

“It certainly does not do well that while we speak with them, they do other actions which would indicate their lack of sincerity to pursue peace,” presidential spokesman Edwin Lacierda said.

Peace talks between the Communist Party of the Philippines and its umbrella organization, the National Democratic Front, have been stalled primarily because of the rebels’ refusal to provide the government with a list of its members who should enjoy immunity.

No less than President Aquino himself, the commander-in-chief of the Armed Forces, had sensed that the CPP-NDF and its armed wing, the New People’s Army, does not seem to be sincere in dealing with the government in talking peace.

Albay Gov. Joey Salceda has ordered the Army’s 901st Infantry Brigade and the police to secure the Southern Luzon International Airport (SLIA) in Daraga town after NPA rebels raided the construction site Friday night.

The incident left two Army enlisted personnel wounded when the NPA rebels torched 12 construction equipment.

Gov't to end peace talks next year, NDF says (http://www.philstar.com/nation/article.aspx?publicationSubCategoryId=67&articleId=809358)

MANILA, Philippines - The National Democratic Front (NDF) has claimed the Aquino administration plans to terminate the peace talks next year even as it slammed the government over its supposed lack of interest in pursuing the negotiations.

“We have already received reliable information from Palace insiders that (President) Aquino plans to terminate negotiations with the NDF next year or earlier especially if he succeeds in controlling all three branches of the government and in making a peace agreement with the MILF (Moro Islamic Liberation Front),” the NDF said in a statement.

“It is Aquino no less who is blocking both the regular track and the special track, which offer the possibility of truce and alliance on the basis of a general declaration of common intent for the benefit of the people,” the statement added.

Malacañang, for its part, said members of the Communist Party of the Philippines-New People's Army-NDF only have themselves to blame if the peace negotiation is stalled or terminated.

”We’re not moving in the peace talks because the CPP-NPA does not have the JASIG (Joint Agreement on Safety and Immunity Guarantees) list, which we have agreed upon will be used as a ground to release personnel they claim to be their own. They have not reconstituted it,” presidential spokesman Edwin Lacierda said yesterday.

Lacierda said the government could not rely on the statements of the CPP-NPA-NDF leaders on the number of people and the names of those they want released without a JASIG list.

Meanwhile, NDF spokesman Fidel Agcaoili, chided Aquino for saying the CPP-NPA-NDF is not sincere in talking peace.

“He (Aquino) exposes himself as the hypocrite who pays lip service to peace but is in fact obsessed with carrying out a brutal war,” Agcaoili said.

“He is not at all interested in serious peace negotiations but only in demanding the surrender and pacification of the revolutionary forces and people,” he added.

The NDF also accused the Aquino administration of condoning the human rights violations of the Arroyo administration.

“He keeps in prison more then 350 political prisoners, who have been accused of being rebels and yet charged with common crimes,” Agcaoili said.

Malacanang accused the communist rebels of lack of sincerity in pursuing the talks after the attack on a construction site of an airport in Daraga, Albay last Friday.

The attack left two soldiers wounded and destroyed P70 million worth of construction equipment.

Retiring soldier fights off 5-man rob gang in Surigao (http://www.philstar.com/nation/article.aspx?publicationSubCategoryId=200&articleId=809298)
MANILA, Philippines - A soldier due for retirement single-handedly fought off a five-man robbery gang believed to be headed by a policeman.

For answering the call beyond his tour of duty last Friday, M/Sgt. Eleno Leopoldo of 58th Infantry Battalion based in Misamis oriental, will be honored for his heroism, Maj. Julio Eugene Osias IV, spokesman of the 4th Infantry Division said.

On leave prior to retirement, Leopoldo, a native of Surigao del Sur, was returning home after following up his Army exit schooling when he chanced upon an ongoing robbery near his place at Purok Kalipay, Sitio Banuison, Barangay Burgos, Cortes town in Surigao del Sur at about 5:30 p.m. last Friday.

Leopoldo’s attention was caught by a loud commotion while walking home and when he checked to verify, he came across five armed robbery suspects.

“Without hesitation and beyond the call of duty, M/Sgt. Leopoldo, engaged the robbers, killing one and injuring the other who was later arrested by the responding local policemen,” Osias said.

Local police investigators later identified the slain suspect as Police Officer 1 Arnold Valinten Olveda, assigned at the Mati City Police in Davao del Sur.

Olveda was identified through an identification card recovered from his pocket by the local police. Police also retrieved a cal. 9mm and a cal .45 pistols from the slain suspect's possession.

Leopoldo, using a caliber .22 rifle, also hit and wounded another suspect identified as Tomie Vainten Olveda, believed to be a relative of the slain policeman-suspect.

Three remaining suspects, however, were able to escape with P400,000 cash and P14,000 worth of jewelry and a cellphone from the grocery store raided by the gang.

http://resources2.news.com.au/images/2010/07/05/1225887/950766-submarine-cocaine.jpg
Columbian Home-made Drug Smuggling Submarine

Submarines are very good defense weapons.:cheers:

If the Columbian Drug Cartels can make their own subs. Why can't the Pinoys?

Start copying Filipinos!

Ang problema mga drug cartels at manufacturers sa Pilipiunas eh mga taga-mainland :lol::lol:

Cheers to our Viet brothers and sisters. Shall the same thing happen to them, I think we should also give them some moral support (kahit hindi ko pa nalilimutan yung island grabbing nila noon sa Spratly's but that's another matter)

Vietnamese intellectuals back PH Panatag claim (http://www.manilatimes.net/index.php/news/top-stories/23361-vietnamese-intellectuals-back-ph-panatag-claim)

HANOI: Sixty-six Vietnamese from various backgrounds and fields, supported the Philippines’ claim on the Panatag (Scarborough) Shoal and called on China to abandon its “absurd marital claim” on the area.

The group, which include well-known intellectuals and academicians in Vietnam and overseas, sent a letter to Philippine Ambassador to Vietnam Jerril Galban Santos to express their support for the Philippines in the standoff with China.

Among the signatories are a former Vietnamese ambassador to China, several heads of tertiary institutions, poets and social scientists.

“We fully support the sovereign rights of the Philippines in the Panatag Shoal area and the Philippines’s actions to defend her sovereign rights,” they said in their letter.

“We resolutely oppose China’s attempts to use its “nine-dashed line”, which is completely without historical or legal basis, to encroach on the Exclusive Economic Zones and continental shelves of the Philippines, Vietnam and other Association of Southeast Asian Nations (Asean) countries. We strongly oppose China’s illegal actions and threats of force in the Panatag Shoal dispute,” they added.

The group also backed the Philippine government’s proposal to submit the dispute to the International Tribunal for the Law of the Sea (Itlos).

“We call on the governments and citizens of all Asean countries to take concrete actions to show solidarity with the Philippines, to assist her in the defense of her sovereign rights in the Panatag Shoal area, and to defend the sovereign rights of each and every Asean country as affirmed in United Nations Convention on the Law of the Seas (Unclos),” they said.

“We solemnly declare that China’s illegal “nine-dashed line” constitutes a threat to peaceful cooperation and sustainable development in Southeast Asia. To re-establish stability and ensure freedom of navigation in the West Philippines Sea/East Sea, we demand that China gives up its absurd maritime claims in these waters. The just cause of the government and people of the Philippines will prevail,” they added.

Those who signed the letter were Major-General Nguyen Trong Vinh, Former Ambassador of The Socialist Republic of Vietnam to PR China, Prof. Nguyen Minh Thuyet, PhD, Former Vice-President, The Committee for Culture, Education and Youth, National Assembly, Nguyen Ngoc, Writer, Bui Ngoc Tan, Writer, Thanh Thao, Poet, Prof. Pham Duy Hien, PhD, Former Director, Da Lat Institute of Atom, Prof. Nguyen Hue Chi, Former President of Scientific Committee, Institute of Vietnamese Literature, Pham Toan, Educator, Prof. Nguyen The Hung, PhD, University of Da Nang, Vice President, Vietnamese Association of Hydromechanics, Prof. Chu Hao, Director, Tri Thuc Publisher, Dr. Nguyen Dinh Nguyen, PhD, Garvan Institute of Medical Research, Sydney, Australia. Association Prof. Hoang Dung, PhD, Ho Chi Minh City University of Pedagogy, Pham Xuan Nguyen, President, Association of Ha Noi Writers, Nguyen Ba Dung, Engineer, Pham Hoang Quan, Independent Researcher, Hoang Hung, Poet, Prof. Tuong Lai, Former President, The Institute of Sociology of Vietnam, Nguyen Quang A, PhD, Former President, The Institute of Development Studies, Nguyen Ngoc Giao, Former Lecturer, Freelance Writer, Paris, France, Thai Van Cau, Space Science Specialist, USA, Nguyen Xuan Dien, PhD, Institute of Han-Nom, Dinh Kim Phuc, Researcher on the East Sea and Vietnamese Islands, Le Dang Doanh, PhD, Former Director, Central Institute of Economic Management (CIEM), Prof. Hoang Tuy, PhD, Former President, Scientific Committee of Vietnam Institute of Mathematics, Prof. Emeritus Nguyen Dang Hung, PhD, University of Liege, Belgium, To Van Truong, PhD, Specialist of Vietnamese Natural Resources and Environment, Ha Si Phu, PhD, 4E Bui Thi Xuan Str., Dang Thi Thanh Bien, Phan Dac Lu, Poet, Mac Lam, Journalist, Mai Thai Linh, Former Teacher, Researcher, Huynh Nhat Hai, retired Official, Huynh Nhat Tan, Ha Dinh Nguyen, 76, Tran Thanh Van, Association Prof. Dang Ngoc Le, PhD, President, Association of Linguistics of Ho Chi Minh City, Tran Thi Khanh, Editor, Nguyen Thi Tu Huy, PhD, lawyer Tran Quoc Thuan, Former Permanent Vice Chairman, Office of National Assembly of the SR of Vietnam, Kha Luong Ngai, Former Deputy Editor-in-Chief, Sai Gon Giai Phong News, Cao Lap, Former Political Prisoner in Con Dao, Tran Minh Thao, Writer, Dang Thi Hao, PhD, Former Vice Head, Section of Ancient and Mediveal Literature, Institute of Literature, Ha Noi, Vu Quang Viet, Specialist of Economics for UN, USA, Prof. Nguyen Dinh Cong, PhD, Former Chair of the Construction Department, University of Construction, Ha Noi, Nguyen Duc Hiep, Specialist of the Atmosphere, Office of Environment and Heritages, NSW, Australia.

Paulus Nguyen Thai Hop, Archbishop, Chairman, Committee of Justice and Peace, Nguyen Chi Thanh Long, Prof. Tran Van Tho, PhD, Waseda University, Tokyo, Tran Duc Que, Lawyer Ta Van Tai, Former Lecturer, Research Fellow, Harvard Law School, Lawyer Le Hieu Dang, Deputy Head, Services of Legal and Democratic Issues, Central Committee of Vietnam Fatherland Front, Dr. Huynh Tan Mam, PhD, former president, Association of Students of Saigon before 1975, Former Editor-in-Chief of Thanh Nien Newspaper, Former Member, National Assembly of SR Vietnam Le Cong Giau, Former General Secretary, Association of Students of Saigon before 1975, Former Director, Center for the Promotion of Investment and Trades, Nguyen Phu Yen, Composer, Ho Hieu, Association of Students and Youths of Da Lat for Democracy before 1975, Nghiêm Phuong Mai, Biologist and Educator, Canada Prof. Pham Xuan Yem, Former Director of Research on Physics, CNRS, Former Professor, University Paris VI, France, Prof. Ha Duong Tuong, Former Professor, University of Technology Compiegne, France, Tong Van Cong, and Mai Hien, Journalists, Prof. Do Dang Giu, Former Director of Research, CNRS, Former Professor, University Paris Sud, France, Phan Hoang Oanh, PhD, Lecturer, Association. Prof. Ha Thuc Huy, College of Natural Sciences - Ho Chi Minh City National University, Huy Duong, United Kingdom Do Minh Tuan, Poet and Film Director.

We have "fans" in Vietnam :lol:

PH’s failed gambit in Panayag (Scarborough) dispute (http://www.manilatimes.net/index.php/opinion/columnist1/23397-phs-failed-gambit-in-panayag-scarborough-dispute)

ILLEGAL fishing and poaching by Chinese operating large vessels in waters claimed by the Philippines is nothing new. The Panatag or Masinloc or Scarborough Shoal is no exception. In the past, these incidents were peacefully and quietly resolved through backroom diplomatic negotiations. The recent Scarborough standoff, however, is quite different in that it escalated tensions between China and the Philippines to a level not previously seen. All thanks to the reckless response and misguided strategy of the Aquino administration.

For starters, we dispatched a Philippine Navy warship to deal with Chinese fishermen. Sending a warship to enforce fishery or maritime laws would certainly be construed as military action targeting Chinese civilians. On the other hand, all Chinese vessels involved in the incident were civilian. The two unarmed China Marine Surveillance Vessel (CMS) vessels that positioned themselves between the fishing boats and our warship to prevent the arrest of the Chinese fishermen, fall under the authority of China’s State Oceanographic Administration. The additional armed Fishery Law Enforcement Command (FLEC) ship deployed by China is under the Ministry of Agriculture’s Bureau of Fisheries Administration.

The Philippine government upped the ante by making a lot of noise about the Scarborough incident at a time when the joint military exercise between the United States and the Philippines – known as
Balikatan exercises – was to be held. Although planned long before the Panatag Shoal incident, China has been critical of such military exercises saying it does not contribute to regional peace and stability.

Moreover, China has always maintained that territorial disputes with the Philippines should be settled bilaterally. The Philippine government, however, refuses to enter into bilateral negotiations with China. Even before the standoff, the Philippines tried to push for a united stand within the 10-member Association of Southeast Asian Nations (Asean) under the guidelines of the Declaration of the Conduct of Parties in the South China Sea— a non-binding agreement between China and Asea – in order to strengthen our bargaining position in future negotiations with China but it was opposed by many Asean members.

The Aquino administration tried to drag the US into the territorial dispute, with the Department of Foreign Affairs (DFA) boldly declaring that it was bringing the Scarborough Shoal issue to the attention of its strongest ally. This despite China’s warning that “internationalizing” the simmering territorial dispute will only escalate tension with the Philippines.

Political observers say the Philippines’ move is reminiscent of the Japanese strategy during a similar incident in the Senkaku Islands – the group of uninhabited islands in the East China Sea – which are being claimed by China and Taiwan. In 2010, a Chinese fishing boat collided with Japanese Coast Guard vessels while trying to evade boarding. After the boat was seized and the crew arrested, the Japanese threatened to put the Chinese boat captain on trial. In retaliation, China choked-off rare earth shipments to Japan and cancelled talks on the joint exploration of disputed oil and gas fields. China also cancelled a visit by 1,000 Japanese students to the Shanghai Expo and a concert by a top Japanese band while small anti-Japanese protests were held in several Chinese cities.

Then Japanese home minister, Seiji Maehara, jetted off to seek the support of the US. After meeting with US Secretary of State Hillary Clinton, Maehara claimed that “Clinton said that the Senkakus ... are subject to Article 5 of the bilateral security treaty, which authorizes the US to protect Japan in the event of an armed attack ‘in the territories under the administration of Japan’.”

What soon followed was an international outcry against China’s bully-tactics and the Senkaku incident became the centerpiece of the argument for a strong Asean-US alliance to counter Chinese bullying in the South China Sea.

That gambit apparently failed in the recent Scarborough Shoal dispute. When DFA Secretary Albert del Rosario tried to do a Maehara and invoke US backup for the Philippine position during the “two-plus-two” meeting in Washington between the Defense and Foreign ministers of the US and the Philippines, he was openly rebuffed. The US declared that it would help build the Philippines’ sea patrol capability but will not take sides in the standoff with China at the disputed shoal. Clinton even stressed that Washington does not take sides on competing sovereignty claims. Evidently, despite all the Philippine rhetoric about the US being our strongest ally, the feeling isn’t mutual.

If we are to gain the full backing of the US, the Philippines would need to show that it is a reliable ally who can effectively contribute to its alliance with the US, starting with the modernization of our armed forces to create a minimum credible deterrent against conventional threats in the South Pacific. Until that happens, we’re on our own.

PH’s failed gambit in Panayag (Scarborough) dispute (http://www.manilatimes.net/index.php/opinion/columnist1/23397-phs-failed-gambit-in-panayag-scarborough-dispute)
If we are to gain the full backing of the US, the Philippines would need to show that it is a reliable ally who can effectively contribute to its alliance with the US, starting with the modernization of our armed forces to create a minimum credible deterrent against conventional threats in the South Pacific. Until that happens, we’re on our own.
:lol: Pakiramdam ko nga yung pagsasabi ni Sec na "We have no one to blame but ourselves for our limited military capability" kina Clinton ay isang subtle apology o makaawa.

Ah well. Kaawa-awang bata talaga

Cheers to our Viet brothers and sisters. Shall the same thing happen to them, I think we should also give them some moral support (kahit hindi ko pa nalilimutan yung island grabbing nila noon sa Spratly's but that's another matter)

Vietnamese intellectuals back PH Panatag claim (http://www.manilatimes.net/index.php/news/top-stories/23361-vietnamese-intellectuals-back-ph-panatag-claim)

We have "fans" in Vietnam :lol:

Very interesting news!:)

Taiwan says China to build two aircraft carriers (http://www.gmanetwork.com/news/story/258930/news/world/taiwan-says-china-to-build-two-aircraft-carriers)

Taipei - Taiwan's intelligence chief said Monday that China plans to build two aircraft carriers in addition to the first in its fleet, a refitted former Soviet carrier currently undergoing sea trials.

"Indeed, the Chinese communists have decided to build two aircraft carriers on their own," Tsai Teh-sheng, head of the island's National Security Bureau, told parliament.

Tsai said that construction of the warships is slated to start in 2013 and 2015 respectively, with delivery dates of 2020 and 2022, and that they would be conventionally powered.

Tsai said that since mid-2011, China had conducted six sea trials of its first carrier, and that Taiwan expected it to go into service before the end of this year.

"Initially it may simply serve for training purposes but it can be transferred for battles when necessary in the future," he said.

The Chinese ship's sea trials have sparked international concern about China's widening naval reach amid growing regional tensions over maritime disputes and a US campaign to assert itself as a Pacific power.

Tsai's comments came in response to queries from Lin Yu-fang, a lawmaker from the ruling Kuomintang party who said the development could force Taiwan's entire defence strategy to be overhauled.

"Once the two warships join the Chinese navy, their threat to Taiwan will be way larger than that of the 'Varyag'," he said, referring to the reconditioned 1980s Soviet-era carrier.

In response to China's naval build-up, Taiwan is arming more of its warships with its new "carrier killer" anti-ship missiles and building a fleet of 12 corvettes designed with "stealth" technologies.

The Hsiung Feng (Brave Wind) missiles are reportedly designed to cruise at a speed of Mach 2.0, or twice the speed of sound, with a range of up to 130 kilometers (80 miles).

In an inauguration speech Sunday after winning re-election in January polls, Taiwan's President Ma Ying-jeou said his administration would maintain an "effective deterrent" while pursuing detente with China in the years ahead.

Ties between China and Taiwan have improved significantly since the Beijing-friendly Ma became the island's president in 2008, vowing to adopt a non-confrontational policy towards the mainland.

China still regards Taiwan as part of its territory awaiting reunification, by force if necessary, although the island has governed itself since the two sides separated in 1949 after a long civil war. — AFP

US diplomat says America not forcing ASEAN to choose between them and China (http://www.gmanetwork.com/news/story/258915/news/nation/us-diplomat-says-america-not-forcing-asean-to-choose-between-them-and-china)

A senior United States diplomat on Monday said America is not pushing the Association of South East Asian Nations (ASEAN) to choose between them and China even as both nations are perceived to be competing for influence over the region.

Former ambassador J. Stapleton Roy, US representative to the ongoing ASEAN-US Eminent Persons Group (EPG) meeting in Manila, said Washington’s comeback to the region after years of preoccupation in the Middle East should not be construed as a containment of China.

“If we were approaching it that way, then that would be a failed policy because there is no support for that approach,” Roy told reporters on the meeting’s sidelines.

The US and China have been at loggerheads in Asia, where they have tried to court support and expand security and economic clout.

Territorial disputes over the resource-rich South China Sea or West Philippine Sea to Manila recently became a tug-of-war ground for a rising China and a returning America, the Pacific power which has come to realize how rapidly it lost the strategic advantage and tight control it once wielded over the region when it stepped back and focused its attention in Iraq and Afghanistan.

Roy said it would be a “mistake” to force the ASEAN to take sides since Southeast Asia and northeast Asian countries like Japan and South Korea, as well as the US, “have important relations with China,” the world’s second biggest economy.

Neutral stance

Philippine eminent person and former ASEAN Secretary General Rodolfo Severino Jr., who is co-chairing the meeting with Roy, said ASEAN had always maintained a neutral stance concerning the two rival powers.

“In the spirit of inclusiveness, ASEAN has made it a point that it should not be forced to choose between China and the United states,” Severino said in his opening remarks as he asked the US to clarify the sustainability of its presence in the region.

“It has been repeatedly said so and there’s no question on ASEAN taking sides in whatever rivalry is taking place,” Severino said.

The EPG, which is meeting for the first time in Manila since it was formed by leaders of the ASEAN and the U.S in 2009, is an advisory body tasked to formulate recommendations on how to strengthen the relations between the two sides, specifically economic, political and security.

The US is one of the longstanding dialogue partners of ASEAN, having established relations with the multilateral body in 1977. ASEAN, a bloc of democratic, socialist and aristocratic states formed in the Cold War era, consists of the Philippines, Thailand, Malaysia, Indonesia, Singapore, Brunei, Vietnam, Cambodia. Laos and Myanmar.

Roy admitted that many Americans think the only reason the US is re-focusing its attention on Southeast Asia is because of the rise of China.

But the 10-member ASEAN’s vast economic potential, he noted, largely influenced America’s so-called pivot to the region.

Roy said Washington sees a long-term presence in Southeast Asia, which is rapidly transforming itself as one of the world’s most economically vibrant region, while providing “the conditions of peace and stability that are necessary underpinning for continued economic growth.”

The US diplomat added that an increased engagement with ASEAN is beneficial to the US economy.

He said ASEAN cannot simply be ignored as it is nearly three times greater than US investments in China and nine times more than its investments in India.

The Asian Development Bank predicted that by 2030, the region will have a population of more than 700 million people twice the size of the US population and would become Asia’s economic hub.

“Any country that neglects this region is going to pay a serious cost in terms of the health of its economy,” he said. — Michaela del Callar/RSJ, GMA News

Analysis: US will do well to watch developments at Panatag Shoal closely (http://www.gmanetwork.com/news/story/258892/pinoyabroad/worldfeatures/analysis-us-will-do-well-to-watch-developments-at-panatag-shoal-closely)

American policymakers would do well to keep a close eye on the latest developments in the South China Sea involving China and the Philippines, a formal U.S. security treaty ally. It could have major implications for the U.S.

Since early April, Chinese and Philippine government ships have been confronting each other off Scarborough Shoal in the South China Sea.

The shoal, 124 nautical miles from the main Philippines archipelago, is distinct from the dispute over the Spratlys several hundred miles to the south.

The current confrontation first arose when the Philippine navy began to arrest Chinese fishing boats involved in harvesting protected marine life.

The Chinese countered with a number of fisheries protection vessels, as well as additional fishing boats.

For its part, the Philippines withdrew its naval vessel for replenishment and, in a diplomatic gesture to avoid escalation, determined not to send it back. It is now represented at the shoal by only civilian government vessels.

The South China Sea is rife with disputes over sovereignty. China, Taiwan, and Vietnam dispute the Paracel islands; there are six claimants to the Spratlys (Brunei, China, Taiwan, Malaysia, the Philippines, and Vietnam). In general, these disputes have been fairly low-key, although in 1988, China sank three Vietnamese freighters to underscore its claims.

But several recent developments suggest that the Scarborough Shoal situation could be much more dangerous. China, the fourth largest source of tourists to the Philippines, has halted tours and called upon Manila to safeguard the safety of those Chinese tourists already in the archipelago.

At the same time, the Chinese have begun to quarantine shipments of Philippine bananas on the grounds that they may be carrying agricultural pests.

Neither of these developments might be directly linked to the Scarborough Shoal situation, but they smack of an attempt to bring China’s economic power to bear on a diplomatic cause—similar to the heavier-handed economic measures the Chinese took against Japan during the 2010 Senkakus/Diaoyutai incident.

At that time, China cut off all shipments of rare earth minerals to Japan, seeking to exploit its dominant position in that market.

Thus far, the Chinese navy has not played a direct role—the Chinese vessels have all come from civilian agencies. But China has assets at sea, including a naval task force comprising two guided missile destroyers, two frigates, and an amphibious ship operating near Okinawa on exercises.

Any diversion of this force to Scarborough Shoal would constitute a major escalation of the situation.

With the Chinese leadership focused on their internal succession struggles, to the point of possibly delaying this fall’s Party Congress (when the new leadership will be officially announced), few senior leaders are likely devoting their full attention to this situation.

Recent reports that head of internal security Zhou Yongkong has been forced to relinquish his powers as part of the ongoing Bo Xilai drama only further underscores how many things are on Chinese leaders’ plates—and therefore how little attention they may be paying to this.

Given the internal political situation, though, it is unlikely that anyone would be willing to appear “weak” by being conciliatory. This may explain the Chinese rejection of the Philippine proposal for arbitration of the dispute under the Law of the Sea Treaty, which both Manila and Beijing have signed.

One would hope that both parties to the dispute at Scarborough Shoal find a peaceful, face-saving way to back out of this crisis. But it bears watching by American policymakers in case this does not prove to be the case. - The FilAm

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US: Weapons not included in warship (http://www.philstar.com/Article.aspx?articleId=809487&publicationSubCategoryId=63)



I am curious of what the reason is for stripping it off again of weapons? Cash? Corruption cases? Fear that we will fire the first shot?

Is there a way to equip the cutter of the components that were taken away before handing it to our coast guards?

Is there a way to equip the cutter of the components that were taken away before handing it to our coast guards?

Superlolo na may baby rocket?:lol:

they don't want us spoon-fed, it's high time to work our own way in developing our defense system, the americans are initiating the build-up we just need to finish it,..kaya naman natin lagyan ng mga armas itong mga hand me downs na mga ito e, kung pera ang problema aba maghanap ng paraan itong gobyernong ito kung papaano, di naman lahat pwedeng libre,..paano tayo makakatayo ng sarili nating mga paa simpleng bagay lang lahat gusto iaasa:ohno:

no please enlighten me

Why didn't US sink it, why didn't they commit an act of war...:nuts:


Nice, now you used your brain :) What will they get if they sink that ship? So might as well to just ignore it and have its glory of stupidly showing itself in the middle of an exercise. Just because they said they didnt see it means they really didnt see it. Right?

your Oligarch manipulated, mediocre mainstream educational system (with due consideration to the sincere and dedicated teachers who only had to follow the very limited mainstream data dictated to them) seemed so inefficient in strengthening this nation's foundation especially its Historical position in dilemmas as these presently occuring over China's, you were even kept ignorant as to your rightful legacy that dated way beyond pre-colonial era nor the neocolonialist Oligarchy that mind conditioned you to mere shallow, colonial mentality based, historically shortsighted vision of your otherwise profound ancient ancestry and history as a people...

... that most likely even caused ancient China to burn its own merchant and navy ships many centuries ago in awe of it, and the neocolonial Oligarchy systematically suppressed it out of sheer hysterical panic as it threatens its control on Filipinos it gripped by ignorance the moment they become more AWARE instead.


your mediocre, neocolonialist oligarch manipulated mainstream educational system did not inform you that even way beyond the colonial era:

* our archipelago islands were known by the ancient Greeks, Hindus, Chinese, even Hebrews as a land so filled with wealth and abundance it was known as ISLE of GOLD;

* we were an integral part of the vast and great Southeast Asian kingdoms, the SriVijayan, Majapahit Empires the richest in the ancient World during those times and the royal descendants eventually sailed toward our sacred shores and merged their untold wealth and powers, even transcending beyond in Metaphysical realms as our ancestors' deities were tasked to protect these in behalf of World Humanity. These ancient empires interestingly emerged in the modern era, as if deeply embedded in our race and manifesting again as the ASEAN;

* our ancestors' Royal Lineage still existed despite the onslaught of Western colonialism and had played an active role in maintaining the sovereignty of this country and its people throughout history (the royal prince actually paid the $20 Million acquired by the US for Spain) and the documents they hold defended previously by well known lawyers as Atty. Tanada, Claro M. Recto, Marcos, etc. and presently by Atty. Homobono Adaza and are honored by World governments as USA, Spain, Britain etc. that we were once known as the KINGDOM OF MAHARLIKA and even in its history we may even rightfully claim its vastness as far as Guam and Hawaii;

fEmasKYyRI8&feature=related

* our Indigenous Peoples had preserved the ancient legacy of Humanity that may even rewrite history, contrary to China's despite its olden history spanning thousands of years, our People's had actually recorded in its myths and legends our ancestry and civilization dating not thousands, nor even millions, but hundreds of millions of years to as far as during the era prior to the continental drift of the ancient supercontinent Pangaea and the Paleozoic era even before our mammalian ancestry were yet to evolve!! Their myths and legends may even explain, even much older than those of the ancient Sumerians (supposedly the oldest post deluvian civilization) the formation of Asteroid Belt and the depletion of waters in Mars!!!!

http://maharlikan.blogspot.com/2012/01/lemurian-timeline.html

despite the deliberate suppression of our ancestral knowledge by those in hysterical panic as it will challenge their exploitative and abusive grip but instead provided a mediocritized people with flimsy, mediocre colonial mentality brand of sense of history, these Knowledge will still resurface and will be rightfully revealed because it is every Maharlikan Filipino individual's Sacred Right.




therefore Scarborough/Panatag Shoal is rightfully owned long before by our ancient ancestors as with our Sri-Vijayan, Majapahit lineage, our rightful and noble ancestors the MAHARLIKAN People, and MORE....

Hello guys. First time in the forum.

I dont understand why American cant provide some heavy duty weapon to the Phil.. While the Taiwanese gets a Apache, F-16 and 2 US naval vessel.

Hello guys. First time in the forum.

I dont understand why American cant provide some heavy duty weapon to the Phil.. While the Taiwanese gets a Apache, F-16 and 2 US naval vessel.

binibili ng mga taiwaese yung mga yun, hinde aid o donated,..isa pa bat namin lahat i-aasa, ang kano nagbibigay na ng direksyon paano tayo mag-umpisa aba gusto pa bang ihadid sa patutunguhan natin???kainutilan na yun!!!:bash::bash::bash:

binibili ng mga taiwaese yung mga yun, hinde aid o donated,..isa pa bat namin lahat i-aasa, ang kano nagbibigay na ng direksyon paano tayo mag-umpisa aba gusto pa bang ihadid sa patutunguhan natin???kainutilan na yun!!!:bash::bash::bash:

Yeah. I understand why the defense secretary dropped the idea of buying F-16 (2nd hand). (They looks pissed)

Sa Europe na lang or baka sa Korea.

Magkano bilig ng PHL dun sa second "warship" na stripped bare naman?

Bakit ba warship ng warship ang media. Tsk

Mga 10 m dollars ata, napunta sa refurbish at replacement yun ang balita ko

Isang oversize patrol boat pretending to be a frigate nanaman ulit bigay ng US.... Kuha nalang ang Pilipinas sa ibang bansa lalo na sa Europe.

Isang oversize patrol boat pretending to be a frigate nanaman ulit bigay ng US.... Kuha nalang ang Pilipinas sa ibang bansa lalo na sa Europe.

Ikaw na mismo ang nagsabi tapos choosy ka pa. jeez!

Dahil gagastos din ang Pilipinas sa mga Hamilton class na yan from US kaya mas magandang mag invest nalang ang Pilipinas sa ibang warship na mas completo ang gamit. Nakakainis isipin na pinapadala mga sundalo sa isang lugar na magulo pero masyadong tinitipid ang binibigay na gamit na pang depensa nila.

Superlolo na may baby rocket?:lol:

they don't want us spoon-fed, it's high time to work our own way in developing our defense system, the americans are initiating the build-up we just need to finish it,..kaya naman natin lagyan ng mga armas itong mga hand me downs na mga ito e, kung pera ang problema aba maghanap ng paraan itong gobyernong ito kung papaano, di naman lahat pwedeng libre,..paano tayo makakatayo ng sarili nating mga paa simpleng bagay lang lahat gusto iaasa:ohno:

I hope they finally figure out that you get what you pay for - just a big boat out of hot transfer program so yeupz, beggars can not be choosy. :lol:

Now, it's up for the Philippines to expand its capability - and that means we can't go cheap on defense spending here.

Dahil gagastos din ang Pilipinas sa mga Hamilton class na yan from US kaya mas magandang mag invest nalang ang Pilipinas sa ibang warship na mas completo ang gamit. Nakakainis isipin na pinapadala mga sundalo sa isang lugar na magulo pero masyadong tinitipid ang binibigay na gamit na pang depensa nila.

Kasi binili rin nila yan sa mga military and defense companies nila tulad ng Lockheed, Boeing, Northrop, etc.. and they cost hundreds of millions to billions of dollars.

Eh yung Pinas, hihingiin lang o di kaya may tawad pa. :lol: Aba, sinuswerte sila.

Isang oversize patrol boat pretending to be a frigate nanaman ulit bigay ng US.... Kuha nalang ang Pilipinas sa ibang bansa lalo na sa Europe.


The boat is one thing, The technology is another, This things we are struggling to get for free from America are state of the art weaponry. Of course they can give the boat discounted but the technology should surely be paid for. Weapons like this cost alot during its research and development stage and to just give it way for free is just not right.

wala na tayong magagawa move on nalang tayo, talagang ganoon ang buhay hindi lahat libre kung baga unit lang yun ibinigay tayo na bahala sa pagset up... yun mga ibibgay ba ng japan stripped din ba or as is nilang ibibigay???

The boat is one thing, The technology is another, This things we are struggling to get for free from America are state of the art weaponry. Of course they can give the boat discounted but the technology should surely be paid for. Weapons like this cost alot during its research and development stage and to just give it way for free is just not right.

Or better yet, make the boats and import their technology instead.
If Philippines has been exporting high speed catamarans, then I don't see any reason why it can't be done. That's what happens when the old school people are in charge of the government with their colonial mentality as the excess baggage.

may pagka filipino love movies ang storya ng Philippines at US

USA: What do you want me to do? I already give my all to you...
PHL: All I need is you, Your presence in my struggles...

how sweet, kinapos nga lang sa mga military equipment... bakit ba bitin lagi yun mga donation ng US sa Pilipinas? kaya marekla ang lahat eh magbibigay nalang din naman ng barko ndi pa nilubos lubos, sa museum lang din namn nila ilalagay yun mga tinangal nila sa Cutter...hehehe

Or better yet, make the boats and import their technology instead.
If Philippines has been exporting high speed catamarans, then I don't see any reason why it can't be done. That's what happens when the old school people are in charge of the government with their colonial mentality as the excess baggage.

Supercat style ship and equip it with harpoons/exocets and CIWS would be a force to deal with. :) Fast and with asskicker load.

may pagka filipino love movies ang storya ng Philippines at US

USA: What do you want me to do? I already give my all to you...
PHL: All I need is you, Your presence in my struggles...

how sweet, kinapos nga lang sa mga military equipment... bakit ba bitin lagi yun mga donation ng US sa Pilipinas? kaya marekla ang lahat eh magbibigay nalang din naman ng barko ndi pa nilubos lubos, sa museum lang din namn nila ilalagay yun mga tinangal nila sa Cutter...hehehe

Ah dahil pinaalis ng letsing MORON 12 na mga Senators yung mga kano.

Ah dahil pinaalis ng letsing MORON 12 na mga Senators yung mga kano.

Actually, we can't really blame them for taking out the US bases. It was simply the failure of the Philippine government to follow up and fast track a serious modernization program that should have been urgently followed up in anticipation of the Chinese economic and military build up.

The US and Philippines remain allies - in fact a very important one. AFP modernization is also within the interest of the US to develop as well because Philippines will have to play its part in balancing the power in Asia Pacific along with other US Allies in the region.

What we got..again..is basically a training ship and a stable platform for an array of weapons and sensors. Its up to the government on how to proceed in up arming the ship. We can install a Harpoon launcher, a NATO Sea Sparrow or RAM, torpedo tubes and all other stuffs of a modern warship on this "new" ships of the PN.

What we got..again..is basically a training ship and a stable platform for an array of weapons and sensors. Its up to the government on how to proceed in up arming the ship. We can install a Harpoon launcher, a NATO Sea Sparrow or RAM, torpedo tubes and all other stuffs of a modern warship on this "new" ships of the PN.

I think we should see this as an opportunity to customize and load the weapons of our liking. Maybe excluding them could be a blessing in disguise - there could be other systems out there that are newer, better and cost-saver to choose from.

Exactly, the world market for arms is saturated will all sorts of weapons, surely they can invite experts to take a look at the ship and see how a weapon system will fit in without sacrificing stability.

Let our AFP not be the laughing stock on this part of the world, let us show some national self respect by having a credible defense capability..and please do away with begging..we keep on harping about the Phil coming out party as an emerging economy and we beg for weapons to arm our military...doesn't make sense at all.

Actually, we can't really blame them for taking out the US bases. It was simply the failure of the Philippine government to follow up and fast track a serious modernization program that should have been urgently followed up in anticipation of the Chinese economic and military build up.

The US and Philippines remain allies - in fact a very important one. AFP modernization is also within the interest of the US to develop as well because Philippines will have to play its part in balancing the power in Asia Pacific along with other US Allies in the region.

It just occured to me as a what if

Say, Ron Paul wins and China attacks the Philippines and the US does not respond. I wonder what will happen with the alliance between the two countries

^^

Good question.

The Allies could be in big trouble partcularly the Philippines.

Nothing to hold back China's military adventurism and expansion. There is so much at stake here when the worst case scenario happens with Ron Paul.

Magaling din ang china....they are trying to soften then defeat the US military thru the backdoor by supplying then substandard, counterfeit and bogus parts from china...and they are not allowing US inspectors to check their plants and manufacturing facilities...its like slowly poisoning a person to death like what they did in that melamine milk scandal ( come to think of it I think it was an experiment using thier own people :D )..they are slowly poisoning and weakening US military and THE WORLD with thier counterfeit, substandard, lousy, second-rate products....chinese cars anyone??:ohno::ohno:


Chinese fake parts ‘flood’ US military—Senate report
Agence France-Presse
9:27 am | Tuesday, May 22nd, 2012

WASHINGTON – More than a million Chinese counterfeit electronic parts are estimated to be in use in US military aircraft, according to a US Senate report released Monday saying the discovery jeopardizes safety and national security.

The Senate Armed Services Committee said its year-long investigation launched by Democratic chairman Carl Levin and ranking Republican John McCain uncovered 1,800 cases of bogus parts, including on the US Air Force’s largest cargo plane, special operations helicopters and Navy surveillance planes.

The 112-page report “outlines how this flood of counterfeit parts, overwhelmingly from China, threatens national security, the safety of our troops and American jobs,” Levin said.

“It underscores China’s failure to police the blatant market in counterfeit parts — a failure China should rectify.”

The report also said the Chinese government denied visas to committee staff to travel to the Asian giant as part of the committee’s probe, with a Chinese embassy official saying the issue was sensitive and that a negative report could end up “damaging” US-China relations.

While the senators lay the blame squarely on China, the report said US authorities and contract companies contributed to the vulnerabilities to the defense supply chain by not detecting the fakes, or routinely failing to report suspected counterfeiting to the military.

“The failure of a single electronic part can leave a soldier, sailor, airman or Marine vulnerable at the worst possible time,” the report said.

“Unfortunately, a flood of counterfeit electronic parts has made it a lot harder to prevent that from happening.”

The fakes included parts in the Electromagnetic Interference Filters used in night missions and in operation of “hellfire” missiles on SH-60B Navy helicopters.

The were also found in memory chips in the display systems of C-17 Globemaster III and C-130J military cargo planes, and refurbished ice detection modules on the Navy P-8A Poseidon, modified Boeing 737 aircraft incorporated with anti-submarine and anti-surface warfare capabilities.

The report said the Defense Department “lacks knowledge of the scope and impact of counterfeit parts on critical defense systems,” and that the use of unvetted independent distributors for the supply of critical military parts results in unacceptable risks to national security and safety.

http://newsinfo.inquirer.net/197823/chinese-fake-parts-flood-us-military%E2%80%94senate-report


A strong and very timely advice to the Americans... LOCATE YOUR MANUFACTURING PLANT IN THE PHILIPPINES AND REQUIRE YOUR VENDORS TO OUTSOURCE YOUR PART FROM THE PHILIPPINES IN THAT WAY YOU ARE ASSURED OF HIGH QUALITY, HIGH-CALIBER EXCEEDING STANDARD PARTS!..:okay::okay:

^^ On top of that, we will also boycott Chinese products and enforce our anti smuggling laws against them.

If that happens, Philippines would be considered sterile of Chinese products. :lol:

China is INTENTIONALLY sabotaging the US.

Geez, China, if uncontained, can be worse off that Germany or Japan has been

^^

Good question.

The Allies could be in big trouble partcularly the Philippines.

Nothing to hold back China's military adventurism and expansion. There is so much at stake here when the worst case scenario happens with Ron Paul.

It may "save" cash for the US in the short run but its consequences will be damaging. Ron Paul is too much ass kissing

If he were the president and China attacks the Philippines, he will likely not intervene because China will say "do not intervene" :lol:

Ron Paul is just clueless about geopolitics. China will not fight the US on US soil but China will prefer a proxy fight, preferably to demoralize US allies

This, coupled with the security guarantee the Philippines enjoys by virtue of its alliance with the US, has caused it to stand firm and confront China. So much so that Dai Bingguo, one of Beijing’s top foreign policy hands, accused the Philippines, “a smaller country”, of bullying China. He has a point. As China’s leaders ought to know all too well, small countries that are backed by great powers have disproportionate negotiating power, and they “bully” both their adversaries and their backers. The Philippines might calculate that it has relatively less to lose by letting tensions escalate

http://acorn.nationalinterest.in/2012/05/21/is-china-being-bullied-by-the-philippines/


I wonder, how would the author explain China's action towards Vietnam who does not have an MDT with a superpower like we do? :poke: If not for the MDT, I'm confident that China would have done a Paracels to us

Related article: http://www.readability.com/read?url=http%3A//acorn.nationalinterest.in/2012/05/21/the-cats-paw/

One thing is for sure...we will never bar any US inspectors in our manufacturing facilities so they are free to implement and apply any requirement they want ( as long as its reasonable ) to meet their standards...its also good for the Filipino workers and entrepreneurs to learn from the Americans about quality, durability and efficiency in manufacturing high tech products......

I remember back in the late 90's ( or early 20's) when electronic chips was missing ( a whole lot! ) in Maxim Semicon and Intel the FBI came in to investigate....yes FBI in our soil!....and it never reach the headlines....thats how transparent and open we are to cooperate with the authorities...

Dahil gagastos din ang Pilipinas sa mga Hamilton class na yan from US kaya mas magandang mag invest nalang ang Pilipinas sa ibang warship na mas completo ang gamit. Nakakainis isipin na pinapadala mga sundalo sa isang lugar na magulo pero masyadong tinitipid ang binibigay na gamit na pang depensa nila.

Di ba may balita dito dati na Spain is offering to build a brand new (and sell, of course) frigate to the philippines? that can be an alternative to US made hand-me-downs.

does anyone here recall that?

Supercat style ship and equip it with harpoons/exocets and CIWS would be a force to deal with. :) Fast and with asskicker load.

Or if not, build a craft/vessel that can carry a dozen jetskis modified to carry torpedoes. Instead of an aircraft carrier, its going to be a seacraft carrier, since anyway, we don't have a capability to build the former.

Jetskis armed with torpedoes and cannon instead of aircraft carrier for the Philippine navy, anyone? :)

Cheers to our Viet brothers and sisters. Shall the same thing happen to them, I think we should also give them some moral support (kahit hindi ko pa nalilimutan yung island grabbing nila noon sa Spratly's but that's another matter)

Vietnamese intellectuals back PH Panatag claim (http://www.manilatimes.net/index.php/news/top-stories/23361-vietnamese-intellectuals-back-ph-panatag-claim)



We have "fans" in Vietnam :lol:


indeed, our ancient brothers and sisters comprising the great, noble Sri-Vijayan and Majapahit Empires have not forgotten, and in fact have re-awakened and presently manifesting itself as the united ASEAN nations!

http://anc.abs-cbnnews.com/videos/454/ph-navy-gets-new-vessels-equipment-as-it-marks-114th-anniversary/

French philosopher Voltaire once wrote a story about the mad behavior of men going to war over a “few lumps of earth.” In Southeast Asia, there are numerous small and midsize conflicts between countries over temples, borders, islets, reefs, shoals, and even puny rock formations that disappear during high tide.

For example, Thailand and Cambodia are feuding over the ownership of the historic Preah Vihear temple and the four square kilometers of territory around it. The conflict intensified in 2008, which led to some deadly exchanges of fires between border troops. It strained the relations of two erstwhile friendly neighbors and, more tragically, it reinforced ultra-nationalism and xenophobia in their countries. Last February, renewed clashes resulted in lives lost on both sides.

For several decades, Singapore and Malaysia contested the ownership of several islands, namely Pedra Branca, Middle Rocks and South Ledge, which are all strategically located at the eastern entrance of the Singapore Strait. Middle Rocks consists of two clusters of small rocks, while South Ledge is visible only at low tide. Fortunately, the International Court of Justice in 2008 recognized Singapore as the owner of Pedra Branca and gave Middle Rocks to Malaysia.

The Paracel Islands, meanwhile, are being claimed by Vietnam, China, and Taiwan, while Indonesia and Malaysia have a longstanding dispute over maritime naval borders in the Malacca Strait, which has led to several coastal patrol detentions of fishing boats of the two countries. Recently, the decades-long maritime dispute in the Bay of Bengal, which involved Burma and Bangladesh, was finally resolved by the International Tribunal for the Law of the Sea.

The active flashpoint today is in the Scarborough Shoal, located in the South China Sea or West Philippine Sea. It’s a chain of reefs and rocks claimed by China, the Philippines, and Taiwan. China is accused of using its superior force to assert ownership of the territory. Its decision to dispatch oversized quasi-civilian boats near the shoal is interpreted by many Filipinos as an act of bullying and aggression.

But the main conflict in the region involves the resource rich Spratly Islands, which are being claimed by six countries: China, Vietnam, Taiwan, Malaysia, Brunei, and the Philippines. Tension is permanently high in the area because of the military posts established by the claimants. If the dispute isn’t resolved diplomatically today or in the near future, it could potentially trigger a broader conflict in the Asia-Pacific.

Could the little spats over Scarborough, the Paracels, Pedra Branca, and the Malacca Strait lead to a bigger clash over the Spratlys? Are they just a sideshow to the main event? Are they just a foretaste of the real tragedy that will befall the region if the Spratlys dispute explodes into a Southeast Asian War? Diplomacy and peace must be given the chance to succeed now.

http://the-diplomat.com/asean-beat/2012/05/20/scarborough-shoal-a-precursor/

Thailand will be like a vassal of China (http://nationalistvietnam.wordpress.com/2012/05/16/thailand-will-be-like-a-vassal-of-china/#comment-29)

“People in Thailand are worried,” said a former foreign ministry diplomat, placing down his glass of red wine.

“China’s economy is so big, and ours is so small, that we cannot compete with all the Chinese things being sold here. It is especially a problem for Thai S.M.E.s,” he said, referring to small and medium-sized enterprises.

“China will own us!” said an official interpreter for top government leaders, expressing her outrage at Beijing’s rapidly growing influence on Bangkok’s economy.

“Of course China will also own America, but your economy is so big you can just tell Beijing that you won’t pay all the money you owe, and they can’t do anything about it. But Thailand is small. We can’t say no to Beijing.

“Thailand will be like a vassal of China,” she said.

U.S. corporations are also fretting about how to compete in a region where the shared knowledge of Chinese dialects and an ancient heritage, give China some unique advantages over America.
China’s ability to sell food, household goods and other items at lower prices than Thai manufacturers has also pleased customers in this Southeast Asian nation.

Beijing is simultaneously increasing its military and cultural influence in Thailand, trying to wean Bangkok away from Washington and other foreign governments while expanding China’s reach southward.

Chinese migrants have been settling in Thailand for generations, arriving through Laos and across the Mekong River or, more often, by sea from China’s southeast coastal towns to Bangkok.

The earliest arrivals melded into a relatively unpopulated land centuries ago, maintaining some Chinese roots while mixing with ethnic Mon, Shan, Khmer and Thais to produce offspring who are today generally called Sino-Thais.

Many Thais admire local Chinese for educating their kids in Thailand’s private “Chinese schools” while keeping their families united and working hard as a business team.

Thailand’s newly elected government meanwhile is expected to confirm Yingluck Shinawatra as the country’s first female prime minister in August.

She appears eager to allow China to construct high-speed trains on five main routes across Thailand, replacing this country’s decrepit, accident-prone railway.
The first 380-mile (615-km) Chinese rail line would link Bangkok and Thailand’s northern border town of Nong Khai, where a railway bridge over the Mekong River already leads to Vientiane, the capital of tiny Laos — an impoverished country wedged between Thailand and China.

The Chinese railway projects could take a decade or more to complete, but Thailand’s integration with China would be greatly enhanced.

The collision in China on July 24 of two bullet trains, which killed at least 39 people, has raised questions however among some Thais about Beijing’s ability to build safe trains.

In January, Chinese investors began building a $1.5 billion China City Complex near Bangkok which could employ more than 70,000 Chinese citizens.

They would be able to import parts from China, manufacture the items into finished products on Thai territory, and export them elsewhere as “made-in-Thailand” without suffering some of the expensive tariffs which made-in-China products must pay.

The Chinese will also be able to sell the 700,000-sq-meter complex’s clothing, household items and other goods to people within Thailand, free of tariffs.

“Apart from the business opportunities in Thailand, Chinese exporters can also promote their products to developed markets such as the European Union and the United States through this project,” said Yang Fangshu, chairman of the ASEAN-China Economic and Trade Promotion Center.

In 2006, when Thailand’s military staged a coup and toppled the prime minister, Washington suspended $24 million in military assistance and restricted high-level meetings.

Beijing, however, described the coup as Bangkok’s internal affair and gave $49 million in military aid and credits to Thailand, while increasing the number of exchange students at both countries’ staff colleges, and convincing the Thai military to participate in yearly, small-scale Special Forces joint exercises.

Chinese and Thai special forces held a 15-day joint anti-terrorism drill, “Strike-2010,” during October in China’s southern Guilin city to practice shooting, assaults and strategy.

During the same month, more than 100 troops and officers from the China Marine Corps’ amphibious special warfare unit participated in a 10-day “Blue Strike-2010″ drill with their Thai counterparts, using light weapons, underwater combat equipment, amphibious reconnaissance and anti-terrorism equipment.

It was the first time Chinese marines conducted a drill with a foreign army abroad.

But China has sold inferior weaponry to Thailand, making some Thai military officials wary of becoming dependent on Chinese supplies.

For Bangkok, commerce with Beijing appears to be much more important than military links.
Thailand’s “government officials and academics sympathetic to the U.S. see the dynamic of China rising — and the U.S. receding — likely to continue, unless the U.S. takes more vigorous action to follow-up with sustained efforts to engage on issues that matter to the Thai and the region, not just what is perceived as the U.S.’s own agenda,” said a confidential American Embassy cable to Washington in February 2010.

The cable, “10BANGKOK269,” was titled: “China’s Sustained, Successful Efforts to Court Southeast Asia and Thailand — Perspectives and Implications.”

It was signed by then-U.S. Ambassador Eric John and released by WikiLeaks.

The cable’s section subtitled, “China Rising, U.S. Fading?” warned: “Indications that the U.S.’s historically close relationship with Thailand and the region is being challenged by the rise of China have become increasingly evident in recent years in a variety of arenas, not just economically but diplomatically, culturally, politically, and even in some security areas.”

The U.S. Embassy even felt competition on a diplomatic level.

“We have also noticed an ever increasing quality to the Chinese diplomatic presence in Thailand. Many Chinese diplomats are fully fluent in Thai, led by the Chinese Ambassador, who has spent 17 years of his career posted here and routinely makes local TV appearances.

“Those that do not have previous Thai experience, like the DCM [Deputy Chief of Mission] are smart, articulate, and increasingly confident in speaking up at English-language international relations seminars once the preserve of ‘Western’ diplomats,” the cable said.

China’s roll south also includes prostitution, gambling and other hedonistic offerings, most surprisingly in and around a tacky, Greco-Roman building complex on the Lao side of the Mekong River across from Thailand.

Chinese recently leased a 25,000-acre Special Economic Zone from the Lao government and constructed an extravagant casino, topped by a garish golden crown, in newly created Kapok City.

The Chinese complex will also offer golf, restaurants, hotels, an airport and shopping malls.
Construction includes a 46-km road linking the casino to Huay Xai town on the Mekong River, according to Chiang Mai’s Citylife magazine, and will help the area prosper.
“Before, it was opium and drug businesses, maybe only 10 years before,” in the area, the casino’s manager told the magazine.

“There were no roads, no electricity, no water. Laos is developing, and it is good for them.”

Several top Thai corporations are meanwhile trying to make profits by investing in China, hoping to copy the perceived success of Thailand’s Charoen Pokphand Group.

In 1979, CP Group — known in China as the Chia Tai Group (Zheng Da Ji Tuan) — was the first multinational enterprise to invest in China’s agribusiness.

Famous in Thailand for chicken and other food products, they expanded into China by focusing on the growing, processing and marketing of poultry and other edibles, alongside investments in huge supermarkets, entertainment complexes, automotive and other industries, plastics, and TV media.

More recently, Thailand’s agricultural exporters have been exporting magosteens, durians, pomelo, tamarind and other food to China, helped by a deal signed in April which streamlined customs checks for road shipments.

Sealed trucks are now able to speed to northern Thailand’s border town of Chiang Khong, cross the Mekong into northwest Laos at Huay Sai, travel further north on Route 3 to the Lao-China border town of Mohan, and enter southern China’s Yunnan province for delivery by superhighway to Jinghong and Kunming.

Before the agreement, trucks had to stop at the Thai-Lao border for laborious reloading onto different vehicles inside Laos, and again be unloaded and reloaded at the Lao-China border.
Alternatively, Thai exporters use Bangkok’s port to ship goods along the Gulf of Thailand and South China Sea into Hong Kong.

China, however, produces much larger and more diversified foods for export into Thailand, threatening local producers and worrying consumers who fear China’s deadly toxic contamination.

Thailand’s Food and Drug Administration recently increased checks on food arriving from China, testing for mercury, melamine, pesticides and other hazardous substances.

Cheers to our Viet brothers and sisters. Shall the same thing happen to them, I think we should also give them some moral support (kahit hindi ko pa nalilimutan yung island grabbing nila noon sa Spratly's but that's another matter)

Vietnamese intellectuals back PH Panatag claim (http://www.manilatimes.net/index.php/news/top-stories/23361-vietnamese-intellectuals-back-ph-panatag-claim)



We have "fans" in Vietnam :lol:


THANK YOU VIETNAM!! At least one of our "ASEAN brothers" spoke up for us...we MUST DO THE SAME if they get bullied by the red monster up north...we are in this together and we have a common foe

THANK YOU VIETNAM!! At least one of our "ASEAN brothers" spoke up for us...we MUST DO THE SAME if they get bullied by the red monster up north...we are in this together and we have a common foe

I think we should back vietnam too, esp. on their claim re. the paracel islands.

Aside from Vietnam, according to Sec. Del Rosario, Singapore has showed support to Philippines by demanding to China an explanation about their 9 dash concept.

http://www.manilatimes.net/index.php/news/top-stories/23061-singapore-backs-philippines-on-panatag-dispute--del-rosario

The Paracels belong to Vietnam! The Vietnamese people will never forget how the Chinese invaded their islands and murdered scores of Vietnamese people. :ohno:

Aside from Vietnam, according to Sec. Del Rosario, Singapore has showed support to Philippines by demanding to China an explanation about their 9 dash concept.

http://www.manilatimes.net/index.php/news/top-stories/23061-singapore-backs-philippines-on-panatag-dispute--del-rosario

They have to as it will be their demise as a port hub if China gets its way with that tongue.

They have to as it will be their demise as a port hub if China gets its way with that tongue.

I agree sir. :cheers:

I do hope that China does not gain a lot of enemies as time continues.

we can always ask china for the technology... hahaha:nuts:

Or better yet, make the boats and import their technology instead.
If Philippines has been exporting high speed catamarans, then I don't see any reason why it can't be done. That's what happens when the old school people are in charge of the government with their colonial mentality as the excess baggage.

kidding aside, i think china is not really serious... as the tiawanese official mentioned, china will not make US be involved in the situation. parang sa tiangge lang yan, kung kakakgat ikaw sa presyo ng binebenta nilang fake goods, edi sige ipagbibili niya sa iyo. if china's neighbors allow her to claim the shoal without resisitance, the she will do so. but if her neighbors are consitent and act as one against her claims, them she will more likely behave.

China afraid of American intervention – Taiwanese (http://www.manilatimes.net/index.php/news/top-stories/23363-china-afraid-of-american-intervention--taiwanese)


TAIPEI: The People’s Republic of China (PROC) would not attempt to launch any move to worsen its territorial dispute with the Philippines over the Panatag (Scarborough) Shoal because it fears a possible intervention from the United States (US).

According to Arthur Ding, acting director of the Institute of International Relations at Taiwan’s National Chengchi University, China wouldn’t want the shoal tensions to escalate because it is still in the process of improving its relationships with the member-countries of the Association of South East Asian Nations (Asean).

He said that in case China makes a drastic move to confront other claimants of the disputed area, it will jeopardize its relations with Asean countries and will be an opportunity for the US to further get into the picture and establish its presence in the region.

He likewise said that China has been very careful with its actions on how to deal with the territorial dispute since it “can foresee the consequence if take actions.”

Because of this, Ding expressed optimism that the dispute in the West Philippine Sea (South China Sea) will not worsen and be solved peacefully.

“China does not want to alienate and jeopardize relations with neighboring countries and for the US to have an excuse to get more involved in this region,” he told a group of foreign journalists.

That is why, Ding said, the Taiwanese government has always been seeking for a peaceful and diplomatic solution to the territorial conflict in the South China Sea.

“There’s no doubt [that] there’s so many tension, probably some kind of frictions in South China Sea, which is claimed by different countries, Taiwan included. I don’t see the likelihood for the tension to escalate into a kind of major conflict, but it will be settled peacefully,” he added.

Apart from the Philippines and China, Taiwan had also been claiming sovereignty over the Panatag Shoal, which the Chinese call Huangyan Island.

Newly-inaugurated Taiwan President Ma Ying-jeou on Sunday reaffirmed his government’s position that the disputed shoal is part of their territory.

To arrest the tensions, Ma had suggested a joint exploration of resources in the disputed area.

Tensions in the South China Sea or West Philippine Sea started when Chinese vessels prevented a Philippine navy ship from arresting Chinese fishermen who were found exploiting marine sources in the area.

^^
exactly....

we can always ask china for the technology... hahaha:nuts:



kidding aside, i think china is not really serious... as the tiawanese official mentioned, china will not make US be involved in the situation. parang sa tiangge lang yan, kung kakakgat ikaw sa presyo ng binebenta nilang fake goods, edi sige ipagbibili niya sa iyo. if china's neighbors allow her to claim the shoal without resisitance, the she will do so. but if her neighbors are consitent and act as one against her claims, them she will more likely behave.

As I read your post, it seems you're talking about how to tame a chow chow! If that's the case, we might just hire Cesar Milan, the Dog Whisperer!:cheers::cheers::cheers::cheers:

Chinese defense attaché 'lectures' Filipino journalists
(http://www.philstar.com/nation/article.aspx?publicationsubcategoryid=200&articleid=809599)
A Chinese defense attaché on Tuesday lectured Filipino journalists covering the Philippine Navy’s 114th anniversary and reminded them of their social responsibility by reporting what is factual and what is truthful surrounding issues involving the standoff in Panatag Shoal.

ito lang masasabi ko...hahahahahaha

As I read your post, it seems you're talking about how to tame a chow chow! If that's the case, we might just hire Cesar Milan, the Dog Whisperer!:cheers::cheers::cheers::cheers:

http://static.guim.co.uk/sys-images/Guardian/Pix/pictures/2011/2/2/1296662132282/Cesar-Millan-007.jpg

Chinese defense attaché 'lectures' Filipino journalists
(http://www.philstar.com/nation/article.aspx?publicationsubcategoryid=200&articleid=809599)


ito lang masasabi ko...hahahahahaha

Factual my arse. This is coming from an officer who belongs to a country that treats media as its own propaganda machine. Sorry, but the Philippine media is by and large, a free one.

Naninibago siguro ang officer na ito na hindi 'tame' ang media dito as compared to theirs. :lol::lol::lol::lol:

New ASEAN members: Vietnam, Philippines, Singapore,..Tanggalin na ang mga naka-upo lang sa bakud!!!:bash::bash::bash:THAILAND- dafaulted herself, she preferred the pirate than ASEAN,..:ohno:

New ASEAN members: Vietnam, Philippines, Singapore,..Tanggalin na ang mga naka-upo lang sa bakud!!!:bash::bash::bash:THAILAND- dafaulted herself, she preferred the pirate than ASEAN,..:ohno:

Take it easy, it's their prerogative. ASEAN is worthless, no use to single out countries perceived unsympathetic to us.

Isang oversize patrol boat pretending to be a frigate nanaman ulit bigay ng US.... Kuha nalang ang Pilipinas sa ibang bansa lalo na sa Europe.

that's a calculated move by the US. they'd rather that beijing fire first. at the very least if manila can't fire the first bullet then that leads only to beijing being capable of starting the war. either way, washington will be dragged. having the guns removed would ATLEAST lessen down the chances of military confrontation. beijing sees no gun, will (in effect) wont dare start firing. manila with no gun, apparently couldnt start firing. it's a very well-planned maneuvering by washington.

New ASEAN members: Vietnam, Philippines, Singapore,..Tanggalin na ang mga naka-upo lang sa bakud!!!:bash::bash::bash:THAILAND- dafaulted herself, she preferred the pirate than ASEAN,..:ohno:

I believe Indonesia also supports the Philippines.... :)

Whats up China.

China readies new missile corvette

LATEST TYPE:Defense analysts believe that the new missile boats will be perfectly suited to meet the challenges that China is facing in its South China Sea disputes

http://www.taipeitimes.com/News/taiwan/archives/2012/05/22/2003533438

The only thing our two ship or future coming ship is the lack of CIWS (close-in weapon system).

Take it easy, it's their prerogative. ASEAN is worthless, no use to single out countries perceived unsympathetic to us.

this time you misconstrued, do not always mimic the getting obsolete Western paradigm of undermining the region's potential as it will prove to be an undoing.

the ASEAN region with its highly strategic geographical position will be at the forefront in the rising of the East, and its great and glorious past that once made it the ancient world's most prosperous maritime empire in its time will once again be reawakened.


New ASEAN members: Vietnam, Philippines, Singapore,..Tanggalin na ang mga naka-upo lang sa bakud!!!:bash::bash::bash:THAILAND- dafaulted herself, she preferred the pirate than ASEAN,..:ohno:

as recorded in the past history, Thailand as nation had been suave at diplomatic maneuverings between other countries including powerful colonial empires and always it emerges with its sovereignty intact; wonders how this ASEAN country will handle China this time.

China vows to guard Scarborough shoal
http://www.abs-cbnnews.com/global-filipino/world/05/22/12/china-vows-guard-scarborough-shoal

Lalo iinit ang ulo ko.

Take it easy, it's their prerogative. ASEAN is worthless, no use to single out countries perceived unsympathetic to us.

we need a new ASEAN, and we do not need Thailand this early, they are fickle-minded, your choice of sympathy and loyalty should be unquestioned, anyway, they CHANGED a lot either physically literally or simply obnoxiously!!! Yes, Indonesia, and I assume BRUNEI, one of our closest ally. Who else??? How about the Malays???:ohno:A new ASEAN similar to either NATO or WARSAW PACT solidarity and brotherhood in the face of awakened monster pirate in the shores and territories of these countries,..

this time you misconstrued, do not always mimic the getting obsolete Western paradigm of undermining the region's potential as it will prove to be an undoing.

the ASEAN region with its highly strategic geographical position will be at the forefront in the rising of the East, and its great and glorious past that once made it the ancient world's most prosperous maritime empire in its time will once again be reawakened.




as recorded in the past history, Thailand as nation had been suave at diplomatic maneuverings between other countries including powerful colonial empires and always it emerges with its sovereignty intact; wonders how this ASEAN country will handle China this time.

Ahem

During WW2, the Japanese demaned for access through Thailand for it's forces to invade countries such as Burma and Malaya. Under pressure from Japan and because it was in no position to fight with the Japanese force,the Thai government declared war on Britain and the United States
Read more: http://wiki.answers.com/Q/What_happened_in_Thailand_during_World_War_2#ixzz1vcP7eqEl


Not exactly suave. But good thing the war ended, no?

China vows to guard Scarborough shoal
http://www.abs-cbnnews.com/global-filipino/world/05/22/12/china-vows-guard-scarborough-shoal

Lalo iinit ang ulo ko.

But we are guarding it too right? I hope we still have at least one ship there just for the purpose of who blinks first..

China vows to guard Scarborough shoal
http://www.abs-cbnnews.com/global-filipino/world/05/22/12/china-vows-guard-scarborough-shoal

Lalo iinit ang ulo ko.

He has an inflated ego

Hey guys i suggest we spread the word to visit google earth and in particular to observe the scarborough shoal area where all of a sudden there now seems to be lots of Chinese photo's some of which have relatively rude remarks on them, basically we should start to bring this sort of cyber flooding to the attention of panoramio and google earth .

On the Panoramio photo's in particular you can click on the "misplaced" or "innapropriate" links to have them hopefully removed, let's see how they like "censorship" lol .

http://www.panoramio.com/photo/70080459
here's one example

He has an inflated ego


Aw. Look how upset the Chicoms and their US spies are

China criticises US vote on Taiwan fighter jet sales
(http://news.yahoo.com/china-criticises-us-vote-taiwan-fighter-jet-sales-170835967.html;_ylt=A2KJNF8K6rtPtVMAgOLQtDMD)
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http://l2.yimg.com/bt/api/res/1.2/VoFIhg4TD3F.Fwpud0VG7Q--/YXBwaWQ9eW5ld3M7Y2g9MjkwO2NyPTE7Y3c9NTEyO2R4PTA7ZHk9MDtmaT11bGNyb3A7aD0xMDg7cT04NTt3PTE5MA--/http://media.zenfs.com/en_us/News/AFP/photo_1337620051241-1-0.jpg (http://news.yahoo.com/photos/world-events-slideshow/us-made-f-16-fighter-jet-releases-flares-photo-170835516.html)A US-made F-16 fighter jet releases …




China on Monday criticised a vote by the US House of Representatives last week requiring the United States to sell 66 new fighter jets to Taiwan, describing the measure as interference by Washington.

USCGC Dallas now officially owned by the Philippines! Welcome to the PHL Navy fleet BRP Ramon Alcaraz!

Hey guys i suggest we spread the word to visit google earth and in particular to observe the scarborough shoal area where all of a sudden there now seems to be lots of Chinese photo's some of which have relatively rude remarks on them, basically we should start to bring this sort of cyber flooding to the attention of panoramio and google earth .

On the Panoramio photo's in particular you can click on the "misplaced" or "innapropriate" links to have them hopefully removed, let's see how they like "censorship" lol .

http://www.panoramio.com/photo/70080459
here's one example

I think it's better for us Filipinos to have an intelligent discussion among ourselves as well as with our allies. IMO, it's a waste of time arguing or even discussing with the Chinese netizens who do not have logic and just parrots what the CCP is saying. You see, how can Scarborough be a Chinese "inherent" territory if it's only in the past years they have been trying to "practice" sovereignty by sending boats? We've been practicing sovereignty in the shoal for hundreds of years now.

Defense chief bares 138 projects to modernize military
Manila Standard
http://news.manilastandardtoday.com/2012/05/22/defense-chief-bares-138-projects-to-modernize-military/

THE government is committed to speeding up the purchase of new equipment for the military in the 138 contracts it will sign to modernize it and to boost the country’s territorial defense, Defense Secretary Voltaire Gazmin said Tuesday.

“The deadline that we’ve set for ourselves for the approval of all these contracts is on July 31, 2012,” Gazmin said in a speech to toast the Navy’s 114th anniversary.

“These projects would surely afford the Philippine Navy with brand new and ready-for-sea vessels and air assets for its surface, sub-surface and air operations, along with the operational requirements of the Philippine Air Force and the Philippine Army.”

Gazmin said 58 of the projects had already been approved, and that the Aquino administration had earmarked P70 billion for it.

Mr. Aquino has talked about buying naval assets from other countries after dropping the idea of buying used F-16 jet fighters from the United States.

Gazmin on Tuesday cited the transfer of the P450-million second Hamilton-class high endurance cutter USS Dallas to the Philippines from the United States, although the vessel had been government stripped of its weapons.

The first Hamilton delivered to the Philippines, the BRP Gregorio del Pilar, was acquired from the US Coast Guard last year, and that had also been stripped of its weapons. The second Hamilton will be renamed BRP Ramon Alcaraz, and it’s expected to arrive in November for commissioning the following month.

“I’ve been very well aware of our Navy’s continuous surface patrol operations, especially over the long stretch of the West Philippine Sea,” Gazmin said.

“And it did not surprise me to learn that last month, our man of war, the BRP Gregorio del Pilar, was the first to arrive at Panatag Shoal and reported the developments on the activities of the intruders therein.”

Still, two of China’s ships stopped the BRP del Pilar from arresting the Chinese fishermen in eight fishing boats full of giant clams, corals and different kinds of marine species.

Three days later, the BRP del Pilar withdrew to Poro Point in La Union because, according to military sources, it would have been embarrassing if China had deployed its own gunboat to the shoal to confront a weaponless patrol boat of the Philippine Navy.

China claims the whole of the Spratly Island as its own. The Philippines, Taiwan, Vietnam, Malaysia and Brunei also claim all or parts of the Spratlys.

I think it's better for us Filipinos to have an intelligent discussion among ourselves as well as with our allies

Well my point was not to discuss anything but to try and get those pictures and commentary down from google earth and panaromio by clicking on the report links "inappropriate" or "misplaced" as part of this for them at least is to try and justify their claims by trying to rewrite information, just think about what the next time a curious person somewhere in the world opening google earth and panaromio will see ?, they will see those pictures and the shoal called "nansha islands" instead of scarborough shoal and the next thing you know people would believe that it is indeed Chinese because google earth says so .

Navy unveils PHL-made multipurpose attack craft
Business Mirror
http://www.businessmirror.com.ph/home/nation/27521-navy-unveils-phl-made-multipurpose-attack-craft

DEFENSE Secretary Voltaire Gazmin on Tuesday again assured the military of the government’s commitment to speed up the procurement of brand-new assets that are included in the 138 contracts under the five-year modernization project for territorial defense.

At the same time, the Navy presented a new Filipino-made multipurpose attack craft (Mpac) and two multipurpose disaster-response vehicles (MPDR) in its inventory.

The Mpac is designed for rapid deployment and insertion of troops during special operations. It is equipped with M-60 machine guns and can seat up to 21 fully equipped troops. Its hull is made of welded aluminum and has a speed of up to 35 knots. This light water jet-propelled attack boat can also operate in shallow waters and conduct surprise raids and maneuvers and land of troops on sandy and rocky beaches. The Mpac can be deployed anywhere in the Philippines.

The multipurpose disaster response vehicle is amphibious and can seat up to 20 persons.

“Also, a work in progress is the planned acquisition of a couple of frigates, five naval helicopters, the continuing expansion of our coast watch system and other capability upgrade projects,” Vice Adm. Alexander Pama, Navy flag officer in command, said.

“The deadline that we’ve set for ourselves for the approval of all these contracts is on July 31, 2012. These projects would surely afford the Navy with brand-new and ready-for-sea ships and air assets for its surface, sub-surface and air operations, along with the operational requirements of the Air Force and the Army,” Gazmin said during the Navy’s 114th founding anniversary at its headquarters on Roxas Boulevard in Manila.

He said 58 of the projects were already approved.

The Aquino administration was working with an earmarked P70-billion budget to modernize the military.

we can always ask china for the technology... hahaha:nuts:

kidding aside, i think china is not really serious... as the tiawanese official mentioned, china will not make US be involved in the situation. parang sa tiangge lang yan, kung kakakgat ikaw sa presyo ng binebenta nilang fake goods, edi sige ipagbibili niya sa iyo. if china's neighbors allow her to claim the shoal without resisitance, the she will do so. but if her neighbors are consitent and act as one against her claims, them she will more likely behave.

That's why we do the opposite - let's involve the US.

Uncle Sam is our most powerful deterrent. They wouldn't dare. :lol:

That's why we do the opposite - let's involve the US.

Uncle Sam is our most powerful deterrent. They wouldn't dare. :lol:

It makes me wonder what would have happened if the MDT was abolished along with the kicking out of the bases

Coast Guard cutter heading to Philippines

CHARLESTON, S.C. — A decommissioned Coast Guard cutter that was based in Charleston is heading for the Philippines.

The Dallas is being turned over to the Philippine Navy during a ceremony Tuesday at the old Charleston Navy Base. The cutter was decommissioned at the end of March.

The 378-foot cutter Dallas has patrolled off the Vietnam coast and in the Pacific to the Mediterranean during the 45 years since it was commissioned in 1967.



I know this off the topic but check this out.
One LCS Class for the Gulf, one LCS Class for the Pacific
http://s16.postimage.org/3y56v8e8l/2_LCS.jpg (http://postimage.org/)
http://defensetech.org/2012/05/22/one-lcs-class-for-the-gulf-one-lcs-class-for-the-pacific/

It makes me wonder what would have happened if the MDT was abolished along with the kicking out of the bases

Then, they'll pull a Paracel on us.