Cebuano Language - Compiled Threads

[habagatcentral1]

Post away folks! :)

[amigo32]

unsa may atong i post?

hehehe

[habagatcentral1]

Bisag unsa. Dedication for Rogelio? :D

[amigo32]

sige larga na.

naa na kay speech gi andam para sa imong award nga makuha?:D

hehehehe

bitaw. gigutom pa ko.

[flesh_is_weak]

^^kinsa, si rogelio_y010?

[amigo32]

dk010:D

[Mercato]

Bantog ra to'ng naglisud ko'g su'od sa SSC ganinang hapon. Kay nahibulong ko ngano man to'ng na-banned man intaun si dodong Wind Shear nga maorag buotan ra ba tong bata-a. Nagmugna na pud diay ug kaluha ang mungaw. ja ja ja. :hahaha: Hala kinsa kahay sunod i-clone no? Basi'g si Ang Bantayanon ang sunod himu-an ug kaluha; be, bai AB ato na ning bendisyunan sa atong mga barang barang nga pangadye ang panuway ka'ay nahasudlan na jud ni tingali sa yawa. :lol: Parehas ba atong akong nakit-an nga salida nga X-men. Katong sidekick ni Magneto nga si Mystique kusog kaayong mangaluha. haaay makadto sa ko, do.:goodbye:

[flesh_is_weak]

^^hala mo, it wont be long before the abductions begin...mawala lang mo kalit nya pulihan ug clone...bwahahahaha

[Ang_Bantayanon]

Bantog ra to'ng naglisud ko'g su'od sa SSC ganinang hapon. Kay nahibulong ko ngano man to'ng na-banned man intaun si dodong Wind Shear nga maorag buotan ra ba tong bata-a. Nagmugna na pud diay ug kaluha ang mungaw. ja ja ja. :hahaha: Hala kinsa kahay sunod i-clone no? Basi'g si Ang Bantayanon ang sunod himu-an ug kaluha; be, bai AB ato na ning bendisyunan sa atong mga barang barang nga pangadye ang panuway ka'ay nahasudlan na jud ni tingali sa yawa. :lol: Parehas ba atong akong nakit-an nga salida nga X-men. Katong sidekick ni Magneto nga si Mystique kusog kaayong mangaluha. haaay makadto sa ko, do.:goodbye:


Murag kita tanan gyud i-clone atong kigwa kay gadumot to nato...:ohno: Hehehe.. sige bai Mercato sugdi na ang orasyon kay ikaw man ang pangulong pari dinhi unya manabat lang mi. :lol::lol::lol:

Bitaw, dia na ang orasyon para pakubol sa nagdaku nga 010 ni Rogelio:

"Icuposrum lagayrum rogelium impaktum mahimurom pipirum arum dinarum samokrum kamirum dinhirum."

Let's say it altogether guys. Sa sunod kung makari si Rogelio mosinggit na dayon ina siya'y: "Darnarum!" Then he will turn into an ugly toad.

Hahaha!:tyty:

[eonynx]

^^apparently, @rogelio stirred something of a hornet's nest in the last thread. congratulations for the thread 2 of this informative cebuano/bisaya language!:)

[Mercato]

Sa akong tan-aw sunod na si AngBantayanon. jajaja. We 'taun koy labot kay akong i-volunteer si Lord Carnal kay siya ma'ay nagbisto sa karaang kalaki ni oplok o di ba si Bukid kay iya man tong gidabu-dabuhan sa miaging thread. :lol: buotan man ko...


^^hala mo, it wont be long before the abductions begin...mawala lang mo kalit nya pulihan ug clone...bwahahahaha

Yuna pa.... Name that movie.... Nicole Kidman in Invasion of the Body Snatchers? I forgot the exact name of the movie. That was where aliens from outer space possessed Nicole's ex-hubby and the rest of town except her son who was immune. The only way to avoid detection was if Nicole didn't show any emotion at all.

[habagatcentral1]

^^ The Invaders bai, kuyog si Daniel Craig. :D

[bukid]

Sa akong tan-aw sunod na si AngBantayanon. jajaja. We 'taun koy labot kay akong i-volunteer si Lord Carnal kay siya ma'ay nagbisto sa karaang kalaki ni oplok o di ba si Bukid kay iya man tong gidabu-dabuhan sa miaging thread. :lol: buotan man ko...

hadlok na nako bai. kay ako gyud nang litsonon.

[amigo32]

hadlok na nako bai. kay ako gyud nang litsonon.

ingna lang ko ug ma litson na ka kay mo ambit mi. pitso akong pili-on, ug ang imong t******t

[Sinjin P.]

ingna lang ko ug ma litson na ka kay mo ambit mi. pitso akong pili-on, ug ang imong t******t

Unsa man na imong gicensor, torotot?

[amigo32]

ipha ang asterisk. kulang pa kung torotot.

duha ka parte na dong.


:D

[Ang_Bantayanon]

Maayong gab-i Sugbo?
Hain ayhan ang mga taw sara?

[Mercato]

Uyab, Kabit, ug Asawa

Uyab: morag isdang tinula nga lami kan-on labi nag nag-aso pa!
Kabit: morag isdang gipaksiw lami kan-on bisag kaugmaan pa!
Asawa: morag sardinas ablihan lang kon wala nay laing sud-an!


Kugmo

Kon ang kugmo tam-is, naa kay sakit nga diyabetes.
Kon ang kugmo aslom, naa kay sakit sa kidney.
Kon ang kugmo imong tilawan, naa kay sakit sa ulo.


Gahig ulo

Babaye: Patsek-ap mi Dok.
Doktor: Sige huboa ang panty ug bra unya higda.
Babaye: Dili man ako, ang ako mang Lola.
Doktor: Sige Lola, ginhawa og lawom!
Lola: Di ko maghubo Dok?
Doktor: Ginhawa! Gahig ulo!

:lol:

[Mercato]

ENGLISH...............OLD CEBUANO...............MODERN CEBUANO
man.....................lac..............................lalaki
woman.................paranpaon....................babaye
young woman........beni beni......................dalaga
married woman.......babay.........................babayeng minyo
buttocks...............samput........................balat-ang
thigh....................paha...........................paa
knee.....................tuhud.........................tuhod
shin......................bassag-bassag.............bitiis
ankle....................bolbol..........................buulbuul
heel.....................tiochid.........................kiting
sole (foot)............lapa lapa......................lapalapa
gold.....................balaoan........................bulawan
silver...................pilla.............................plata/pilak
brass...................concach.......................tumbaga/ bronse
iron.....................butan...........................puthaw
sugarcane............tube.............................tubo
spoon..................gandan.........................kutsara
rice.....................bughax/baras.................bugas
honey..................deghex..........................dugos
wax.....................talho.............................talo
salt.....................acin...............................asin
wine....................tuba nio nipa...................tuba/bino/alak
to drink................minuncubil.......................moinom
to eat..................macan............................mokaon
hog.....................babui..............................baboy
goat....................candin............................kanding
chicken................monoch...........................manok
millet...................humas.............................dawa
pepper.................manisa............................sili/paminta
gloves..................chianche.........................gwantis
hair.....................boho...............................buhok
face....................guay...............................dagway
eyelids.................pilac...............................tabontabon
eyebrows .............chilej...............................kilay
eye.....................matta..............................mata
nose....................ilon................................. ilong
jaws....................apin................................apapangig
lips......................olol.................................ngabil
mouth..................baba...............................baba
teeth...................nipin................................ngipon
gums...................leghex..............................lagus
tongue................ dilla..................................dila
ears....................delengan...........................dalunggan
throat................. liogh.................................tutonlan
neck....................tangip..............................liog
chin.....................queilan.............................suwang
beard.................. bonghot............................bungot
shoulders............. bagha...............................abaga
spine...................licud.................................taludtod
breast................. dughan.............................dughan
body................... tiam.................................lawas
armpit................. ilot.................................. ilok
arm.....................botchen............................bukton
elbow..................sico..................................siko
pulse...................molanghai..........................pulso
hand....................camat..............................kamot
palm of the hand....palan...............................palad
finger...................dudlo...............................tudlo
fingernail..............coco................................kuko
navel...................pusot...............................pusod
penis...................utin................................. utin
testicles...............boto................................itlog
vagina.................bilat.................................bilat/bisong
cinnamon............. mana................................kanela/sinamon/kaningag
ginger..................luia..................................luy-a
garlic...................laxuna..............................ahos
oranges................acsua..............................kahil
egg.....................silog.................................itlog
coconut...............lubi...................................lubi
vinegar.................zlucha...............................suka
water...................tubin.................................tubig
fire......................clayo.................................kalayo


* The English and Old Cebuano entries are from Document 15, "First Voyage Around the World (1519-1522)" by Antonio Pigafetta in Gregorio F. Zaide, Documentary Sources of Philippine History. Manila: National Bookstore, 1990. pp. 81-210.

The Modern Cebuano gloss is supplied by Jessie Grace U. Rubrico.

[bukid]

^^ oi kana si pigafetta nagpataka ra mana kay lahi man iyang pandungog kay italiano man sya. unya kanang mga espanyol mura mana silag mga yungit kung mag-istorya mao siguro kuwangkuwang ug mga syllables ang iyang entry dha sa iyang journal.

ingna lang ko ug ma litson na ka kay mo ambit mi. pitso akong pili-on, ug ang imong t******t

:D pitso lang imo. kanang iyang t******t lang oi.

Maayong gab-i Sugbo?
Hain ayhan ang mga taw sara?

maayong gab-i pud nimo. adi man la kami didi.

[red_jasper]

ENG : chin
CEB : suwang
Other BIS: baka (ba-kà)

ENG : breast
CEB : dughan
Other BIS: tutoy :)

[habagatcentral1]

Just watched the new Smart commercial...

Hay, I'm lucky to know and speak Cebuano...ok ra ko mangaluyag sa mga maanyag nga hazel-eyed Sugboanas. :D

[Il Tenore]

Uyab, Kabit, ug Asawa

Uyab: morag isdang tinula nga lami kan-on labi nag nag-aso pa!
Kabit: morag isdang gipaksiw lami kan-on bisag kaugmaan pa!
Asawa: morag sardinas ablihan lang kon wala nay laing sud-an!


Kugmo

Kon ang kugmo tam-is, naa kay sakit nga diyabetes.
Kon ang kugmo aslom, naa kay sakit sa kidney.
Kon ang kugmo imong tilawan, naa kay sakit sa ulo.


Gahig ulo

Babaye: Patsek-ap mi Dok.
Doktor: Sige huboa ang panty ug bra unya higda.
Babaye: Dili man ako, ang ako mang Lola.
Doktor: Sige Lola, ginhawa og lawom!
Lola: Di ko maghubo Dok?
Doktor: Ginhawa! Gahig ulo!

:lol:
hahaha! kataw-anan gud!

[Mercato]

Apan ana-a man sa’ay nakahantok. Susama sa “Macan”. The modern Malay word for “to eat” is “macan”. The modern Malay word for “fish” is “Ikan”. The modern Malay word for "all the same" is "sama sama/ samme samme". :hahaha: :D

ENGLISH....................OLD CEBUANO....................MODERN CEBUANO
balances......................tigban................................timbangan
weight.........................tahil...................................timbang
pearl............................mutiara...............................mutya
mother of pearl..............tipay...................................tipay
pipe (musical instrument).subing.................................plawta
disease of St. Job...........alupalan..............................hubag
bring me........................palatin comorica...................ambi
certain rice cakes...........tinapai................................puto/ bibingka
good............................main...................................maayo
no...............................tifale...................................dili
knife............................capol/sundan........................kutsilyo
scissors........................catle...................................gunting
to shave.......................chunthinch..........................mamalbas
well adorned man............pixao..................................pustorawo
linen.............................balandan.............................lino
cloth w/which
they cover themseves......abaca................................abaca (note: not used for clothing now)
classes..........................tacle..................................klase
comb.............................cutlei/ missamis....................sudlay
to comb.........................monssughod.........................manudlay
shirt..............................sabun................................. kamisadentro
sewing needle.................daghu................................. dagum
to sew...........................mamis.................................manahi
porcelain........................mobuluc..............................porselana
dog...............................aiam, ydo............................ iro
cat................................epos..................................iring
scarfs............................gapas.................................baliog
glass beads.....................balus..................................lusok
come here......................marica.................................ngari
house............................ilaga/balai............................balay
sleeping mats..................tagichan..............................banig
timber............................tatamue..............................kahoy
palm-mats......................bani....................................banig
leaf cushions...................uliman.................................uliman
wooden platters...............dulan..................................***
their god.........................abba..................................Bathala
sun................................adlo...................................adlaw
moon (sic)......................songhot...............................bulan
star...............................bolan/bunthun......................bitoon
dawn.............................mene..................................kaadlawon
morning..........................uema..................................buntag
cup...............................tagha..................................tasa
large.............................bassal..................................dako
bow...............................bossugh...............................pana
arrow.............................oghon..................................udyong
shields............................calasan................................sagang
quilted garments
used for fighting...............baluti...................................***
daggers..........................calix/baladao.........................baraw/punyal
cutlasses........................campilan...............................kampilan
spear.............................bancan.................................bangkao
like................................tuan....................................gustohan
bananas.........................saghin..................................saging
gourds............................baghin.................................baging
cords for violins................gotzap.................................kuldas/ kwerdas
river...............................tau.....................................suba
fishing net.......................pucat/laia.............................pukot
small boat.......................sampan.................................bangka
large canes......................cauaghan.............................kawayan
small ones.......................bonbon.................................***
large boats......................balanghai..............................barangay
smallboats.......................boloto..................................baroto
crabs..............................cuban..................................alimango
fish................................icam/yssida...........................isda
fish that is all colored........panapsapan...........................***
another red fish................timuan
another kind of fish...........timuan
all the same.....................siama siama...........................managsama
slave..............................bonsul...................................ulipon
gallows...........................bolle.....................................bitayan
ship................................henaoa.................................barko
king/ captain general..........raia......................................rajah
to blow...........................tigban...................................huypan
smoke.............................assu.....................................aso

* The English and Old Cebuano entries are from Document 15, "First Voyage Around the World (1519-1522)" by Antonio Pigafetta in Gregorio F. Zaide, Documentary Sources of Philippine History. Manila: National Bookstore, 1990. pp. 81-210.

The Modern Cebuano gloss is supplied by Jessie Grace U. Rubrico.

[red_jasper]

^^

mother of pearl..............tipay...................................tipay

ang tipay na akong nahibaw-an---butones (button) :D

large canes......................cauaghan.............................kawayan
small ones.......................bonbon.................................***

small canes---bagakay :)

[Il Tenore]

musta na man ang mga gwapong Bisaya (sama nako!) hehe!

[Mercato]

^^^^maau kaau, salamat. mao lang guihapon, one helluva lover...:hahaha: ikau ba'y guapo lalim ba... :colgate:


The modern Malay word (If I remember correctly) for "to cut" = "gunting"... :)

[bukid]

the waray call garlic, lasuna.

[azriel915]

Kadawat nuon ko warning kang Sir Mods dah..Ako pasabot sa akoa post Mods kay dli ang mga tawo nga Tagalog ang luod kundili ang mga Bisaya nga magtagalog sa Cebuano speaking place bisan ila kaistorya kasabot magbisaya..:)

[bukid]

^^ bitaw sakto bitaw ka. luod man gyud bisag unsaon ug balibali. sa tinuod lang. way taong angay masuko ana kay tinuod mana.

[Ang_Bantayanon]

^^ bitaw sakto bitaw ka. luod man gyud bisag unsaon ug balibali. sa tinuod lang. way taong angay masuko ana kay tinuod mana.

True :ohno:

[Il Tenore]

Kadawat nuon ko warning kang Sir Mods dah..Ako pasabot sa akoa post Mods kay dli ang mga tawo nga Tagalog ang luod kundili ang mga Bisaya nga magtagalog sa Cebuano speaking place bisan ila kaistorya kasabot magbisaya..:)
luod jud bitaw... muhiwi pa gani akong nawong! haha!

[diehardbisdak]

...guys, the website for CEBU: Pride of Place is now up!


...please click on the photo to see Cebu's pride

http://i104.photobucket.com/albums/m195/diehardbisdako/cebu_pride_of_place.jpg (http://cebuprideofplace.com)


...thanks to @southernbelle for letting me know about this wonderful website

[bukid]

luod jud bitaw... muhiwi pa gani akong nawong! haha!

:D kakuyaw! :lol:

[Wind Shear]

Guys,

Check this out: http://www.binisaya.com/cebuano/

And yeah, profanities are included. :D

[amigo32]

...guys, the website for CEBU: Pride of Place is now up!


...please click on the photo to see Cebu's pride

http://i104.photobucket.com/albums/m195/diehardbisdako/cebu_pride_of_place.jpg (http://cebuprideofplace.com)


...thanks to @southernbelle for letting me know about this wonderful website

nganong wala may puso sa Manila?

[Mercato]

^^^^
The "puso" is also an ancient Malay symbol of fertility and regeneration. Many "puso's" hang as decorations during the Malay festival of Hariraya (eid el fitri) ba' to, I forgot the full name but it is a Hariraya festival. The favoured colour is always fresh green for the 'puso'.


Guys,

Check this out: http://www.binisaya.com/cebuano/

And yeah, profanities are included. :D maau, maau 'ning balita-a da. :)

[Wind Shear]

nganong wala may puso sa Manila?

Well, according to history (though from Wikipedia, I'm still looking for a source) said that

Local stories passed down through the generations have attributed the creation of this style of rice preparation to the Cebuano seafarers' need to keep cooked rice from spoiling during long sea voyages. The coco leaves used in wrapping the rice are always shaped into a triangular form and stored hanging in bunches in the open air. The shape of the package facilitates moisture to drip away from the cooked rice while the coco leaves allow the rice to be aerated and at the same time prevent flies and insects from touching it.

Actually, hanging rice (puso) is not just only in Cebu. There is a Malay version of hanging rice called ketupat (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ketupat) as implied by Mercato. And the Kampangpangans have patupat.

Here's the site for the Art of Hanging Rice: http://www.wayblima.com/cebu-food-puso.html

[Ang_Bantayanon]

Well, according to history (though from Wikipedia, I'm still looking for a source) said that



Actually, hanging rice (puso) is not just only in Cebu. There is a Malay version of hanging rice called ketupat (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ketupat) as implied by Mercato. And the Kampangpangans have patupat.

Here's the site for the Art of Hanging Rice: http://www.wayblima.com/cebu-food-puso.html

The puso is a symbol of the Cebuano -- a survivor and a practical person. Survivor because Cebu is not blessed with much resources so the Cebuano has to come up with ways to survive. Barbecue has to be with puso or siomai kay kalain walay sud-an.. I can't imagine eating barbecue without puso. Practical so that it can be brought anywhere, particularly in the farflung fields where our ancestors had to toil and because it doesn't spoil immediately.. :banana:

[habagatcentral1]

Actually, my first encounter with "puso" was that I thought it was Cebuano suman. :D

[amigo32]

puso nga may chicken barbecue, sus kalami jud. panilap lagi. hehehehe

[habagatcentral1]

Hay, I almost give up fighting aggressively over this issue:

The Bisaya accent or intonation is still being used as something to refer to yayas and some derogatory reference...

Instead of being insulted, I instead going to show to the world what Visayan is. More than just a lowly boy or chimay, but an industrious and culturally-rich people. Progressive. :okay: Ganun na lang iniisip ko, most of the people in Manila haven't reached the Visayas yet or haven't seen the beauty of our culture... :okay:

[mwg12a]

Manila people can really be mean to anybody who are not from Manila, it's not only the visayan as they portray something (mostly in comedy movies or shows) as if they are second class citizen. Rmember? They also portray batanguenos and ilocanos as someone from a province who is "dumb" or "clueless" . Even the Kapangpangan are sometimes being mocked because they always add "h" to a word that doesn't need letter "h" and cut off "H" on words that needed it, like "ewan" "hewan", "ipo-ipo" = "hipo -hipo"

I think in real life there are those who are becoming more aware that the bisayas are making progress and are good english speakers than the tagalog simply because you guys have more preference to english and doesn't feel threatened if spoken to in english.

That's what I don't understand with the tagalogs, sometimes they would initiate english on you but when you started to respond in english and probably sounded better than they do, they started talking in tagalog. I don't know what it is but alot of times I knew they speak english well enough but for some reason, they would act like weirded out that you are responding back to them in english as if they are very intimidated by it...

[Wind Shear]

I think in real life there are those who are becoming more aware that the bisayas are making progress and are good english speakers than the tagalog simply because you guys have more preference to english and doesn't feel threatened if spoken to in english.

Simply because in history, English comes first before Tagalog in Visayas and Mindanao. In other words, English was taught during American occupation and Tagalog was introduced later in 1950s in education as Pilipino.

That's what I don't understand with the tagalogs, sometimes they would initiate english on you but when you started to respond in english and probably sounded better than they do, they started talking in tagalog. I don't know what it is but alot of times I knew they speak english well enough but for some reason, they would act like weirded out that you are responding back to them in english as if they are very intimidated by it...

Language pride? Or they nose-bled? :lol:

[bukid]

by the way, yesterday a friend sent me an sms about inday:

it says:


Dear inday,

Salamat sa tanan imo gipadala diri namo.

Ganahan mi kaayo atong chocolate ug candy na white rabbit. pati na ang usa ka lata na biskwet.

Usa lang gyud di namo gusto kadtong...

Nivea Moisturizing Milk kay nagkalibanga mi.

unta sa sunod,

kape na lang...

[amigo32]

by the way, yesterday a friend sent me an sms about inday:

it says:


Dear inday,

Salamat sa tanan imo gipadala diri namo.

Ganahan mi kaayo atong chocolate ug candy na white rabbit. pati na ang usa ka lata na biskwet.

Usa lang gyud di namo gusto kadtong...

Nivea Moisturizing Milk kay nagkalibanga mi.

unta sa sunod,

kape na lang...

nagbuwa-buwa ag baba ato:D

[bukid]

^^ wa man tingali kay di mana mubuwa ang lotion oi. sa man ka oi. murag man ug wa ta kasuway ug gamit. pirmi biya ta mugamit anang lotion pre, di ba?!? aron musamot pud kahamis ato kutis. :D

[mwg12a]

Simply because in history, English comes first before Tagalog in Visayas and Mindanao. In other words, English was taught during American occupation and Tagalog was introduced later in 1950s in education as Pilipino.



Language pride? Or they nose-bled? :lol:
i think it's more of being intimidated by it that the other person might be better and that being "pasosyal"

you just can't help but jump into every bit of a chance to comment and bash anything about tagalogs do ya? I think that is where the problem is coming from, so much hatred and resentments towards a tagalog that sometimes it is becoming part of the subsconscious to jump on the issue without even realizing one just did. I hope this would stop. We are one country with same cultural beliefs, sadly, we are divided by languages not just the ocean around us.

[Mercato]

^^^^:) I see you are prolific these days in all 3 Language Threads - Spanish, English and Cebuano. Hmmm, I wonder why the fascination? I thought you were more active in the Economy section.

Anyway, I for one do not believe it is subliminal hatred towards the tagalog. As I said in the English thread, even before Magellan landen in Mactan, Tagalog was our equal. We never evolved from Tagalog. Rather, we all developed side by side, in parallel with each other before 1521.

Which is why we find it not normal when it is taught to us formally in school whilst our own regional tongue and culture is swept aside and relegated to "home teaching". That is not acceptable and fair.

Like I said before in the other threads, there was no such thinggy as "Imperial Manila" during the Commonwealth Era. We were all very peaceful back then 'til the Japanese came. It is easy to figure out why... :)

[amigo32]

^^ wa man tingali kay di mana mubuwa ang lotion oi. sa man ka oi. murag man ug wa ta kasuway ug gamit. pirmi biya ta mugamit anang lotion pre, di ba?!? aron musamot pud kahamis ato kutis. :D

lotion diay to, hehehe kaingon nako ug sabon na may milk, wala na nako mabasa ug tarong.
:D

VCO man akong gamit pre. :D unya lain sab akong brand sa lotion. dili ko mogamit ug made in thailand:D

unilever akong gamit:D

[Ang_Bantayanon]

^^^^:) I see you are prolific these days in all 3 Language Threads - Spanish, English and Cebuano. Hmmm, I wonder why the fascination? I thought you were more active in the Economy section.

Anyway, I for one do not believe it is subliminal hatred towards the tagalog. As I said in the English thread, even before Magellan landen in Mactan, Tagalog was our equal. We never evolved from Tagalog. Rather, we all developed side by side, in parallel with each other before 1521.

Which is why we find it not normal when it is taught to us formally in school whilst our own regional tongue and culture is swept aside and relegated to "home teaching". That is not acceptable and fair.

Like I said before in the other threads, there was no such thinggy as "Imperial Manila" during the Commonwealth Era. We were all very peaceful back then 'til the Japanese came. It is easy to figure out why... :)

I agree. Pre-war Cebuano newspapers such as Bag-ong Kusog did not really mind Tagalog becoming national language then based on news articles like: "Mga Katarungan ni Pres. Quezon sa paghimong nasudnong dila sa Tinagawog" published on 14 Jan 1938 and "Nasudnong dila sa Pilipinas" on 21 Jan 1938 because there was no such thing as Tagalog imperialism then, but things have changed. :ohno: :bash:

[amigo32]

by the way, yesterday a friend sent me an sms about inday:

it says:


Dear inday,

Salamat sa tanan imo gipadala diri namo.

Ganahan mi kaayo atong chocolate ug candy na white rabbit. pati na ang usa ka lata na biskwet.

Usa lang gyud di namo gusto kadtong...

Nivea Moisturizing Milk kay nagkalibanga mi.

unta sa sunod,

kape na lang...

istorya sa akong tiya (patay na RIP)

pag uli sa akong igsoon gikan sa manila may dalang mga instant noodles. nagluto dayon akong igsoon unya nangaon mi.
sa bukid lagi midako mao nga wala gyud katilaw ug mga instant noodles.

tiya: lami man diay ni
ate: oo, mao man nay among sud-an ug mag dali-dali na mi ug luto kay ma late na mi sa trabaho
tiya: tagi ko bi, bisag usa ka ra ***** p.u.t.os
ate: sige pagdala ug usa.

pagka ugma

tiya: ngano man nga wa may lami tong akong giluto nga noodles?
ate: ha? gi unsa man diay nimo ug luto?
tiya: di, nag init ug tubig, pagbukal akong gilinunod ang tanang sulod sa plastic. akong gitilawan wala gyuy lami, unya diha man toy nanglutaw nga gagmay nga ***** plastic. unsa man to?
ate: mao man to ang sagol palami. wa diay nimo ablihi unya isagol sa noodles?
tiya: aww unsani gud diay, hehehe. wa ma ko kahibao mao diay to sagol.:lol::lol::lol::lol:

[bukid]

^^ toink! kabogo ba diay. :lol:

naa pud mi katabang na gipaluto namo ug instant noodles katong naay free na skyflakes o fita. pag-abot bitaw sa noodles nahibong mi ngano naa may nagpilitpilit man. :D

haskang kabuang ba diay pati man diay ang biskwit (skyflakes) giablihan ug gisagol sa instant noodles. gihimo niyag murag chicharon sa batchoy. nah, luod gud kaonon.


lotion diay to, hehehe kaingon nako ug sabon na may milk, wala na nako mabasa ug tarong.
:D

VCO man akong gamit pre. :D unya lain sab akong brand sa lotion. dili ko mogamit ug made in thailand:D

unilever akong gamit:D

abi nako mag victoria's secret ka kay humot man ka kaayo. :D ;)

[Ang_Bantayanon]

^^ toink! kabogo ba diay. :lol:

naa pud mi katabang na gipaluto namo ug instant noodles katong naay free na skyflakes o fita. pag-abot bitaw sa noodles nahibong mi ngano naa may nagpilitpilit man. :D

haskang kabuang ba diay pati man diay ang biskwit (skyflakes) giablihan ug gisagol sa instant noodles. gihimo niyag murag chicharon sa batchoy. nah, luod gud kaonon.




abi nako mag victoria's secret ka kay humot man ka kaayo. :D ;)

Dili to binugo oi.. inosente lang tawn to

[amigo32]

Dili to binugo oi.. inosente lang tawn to

:lol:tinuod na inosente gyud:D

[bukid]

Dili to binugo oi.. inosente lang tawn to

:lol:tinuod na inosente gyud:D

:D espresyon ra to oi. :D

[amigo32]

^^ toink! kabogo ba diay. :lol:

naa pud mi katabang na gipaluto namo ug instant noodles katong naay free na skyflakes o fita. pag-abot bitaw sa noodles nahibong mi ngano naa may nagpilitpilit man. :D

haskang kabuang ba diay pati man diay ang biskwit (skyflakes) giablihan ug gisagol sa instant noodles. gihimo niyag murag chicharon sa batchoy. nah, luod gud kaonon.




abi nako mag victoria's secret ka kay humot man ka kaayo. :D ;)

:lol::lol:

unsa man nang victoria's, hehehe
ang gamit lang nako pre, Dove para smooth skin:D, any rollon para sa kilikili power:D

humot? basig singot nako to:D humot man akong singot:D

dili gyud ko mogamit ug perfume:D malurong man ko sa sobra kahumot:D

[bukid]

:lol::lol:

unsa man nang victoria's, hehehe
ang gamit lang nako pre, Dove para smooth skin:D, any rollon para sa kilikili power:D

humot? basig singot nako to:D humot man akong singot:D

dili gyud ko mogamit ug perfume:D malurong man ko sa sobra kahumot:D

:D lami diay kag singot kay humot man.

unsay malurong pre? kanang mabuang? nahibung ra man gud ko kay murag winaray manang malurong oi.

[amigo32]

:D lami diay kag singot kay humot man.

unsay malurong pre? kanang mabuang? nahibung ra man gud ko kay murag winaray manang malurong oi.

another word for malipong:D
ambot lang kung lugar namo ra na gigamit nga word

[bukid]

^^ aw, kanang malurong sa amo kay mabuang mana. kanang lorong-lorong kay buang-buang. :D pero murag connected ra man pud.

[amigo32]

padulong pa sa pagkabuang ug dili madali:D grabe sa inyo no? sa amo nalipong pa, sa inyo nabuang na:D

[bukid]

^^ nah, ingana ni sa amoa. dinalian. way ugma ugma. kung magdinuslakay, dihadiha dayon. :D

[amigo32]

^^ nah, ingana ni sa amoa. dinalian. way ugma ugma. kung magdinuslakay, dihadiha dayon. :D

ako kang duslakon karon:D
hajang:D

[bukid]

^^ :D ayaw pre ayaw... ayaw dugaya. :D suwaysuway na tag kalami ani ron kay 30 na ta. hapit na ko magbirthday. inig 30 nako musuway na unya ko ana.


...

suway ko anang massage ba na balibalion kuno imong lawas kay lami kuno na. :D

[mwg12a]

^^^^:) I see you are prolific these days in all 3 Language Threads - Spanish, English and Cebuano. Hmmm, I wonder why the fascination? I thought you were more active in the Economy section.

Anyway, I for one do not believe it is subliminal hatred towards the tagalog. As I said in the English thread, even before Magellan landen in Mactan, Tagalog was our equal. We never evolved from Tagalog. Rather, we all developed side by side, in parallel with each other before 1521.

Which is why we find it not normal when it is taught to us formally in school whilst our own regional tongue and culture is swept aside and relegated to "home teaching". That is not acceptable and fair.

Like I said before in the other threads, there was no such thinggy as "Imperial Manila" during the Commonwealth Era. We were all very peaceful back then 'til the Japanese came. It is easy to figure out why... :)


Perhaps it hurts for me to see that I see that my fellow filipinos are having a deep discussions to the point that in other thread or I heard even in other forums, there would be bashing or I guess I can safely say "clash" between bisaya and tagalogs. I really think it is sad and because of all these, it is not helping the filipinos to become a much better filipino that I am beginning to think that these are all part of the reason why there is not much progress in the Philippines. That and the corruption in the Philippines from Batanes to Sulu.

This is why also that I don't believe that there would be a real unity among all filipinos even if we change our own national language to english or spanish because i feel that it still lies on the attitude of each filipinos towards one another and for the fact that anything foreign is better. I can see it's just not the economy that draw us to another country, it's the idea of actually the feel of living in another and make it our own, otherwise, why is it so comon for a filipino to deny they are filipinos or if not, can't straightly say they are filipino instead they will add, I'm half this and that blood. Usually would not speak in their native languages when they return home to the Philippines when you know they were not born and raised in that country.

[amigo32]

^^ :D ayaw pre ayaw... ayaw dugaya. :D suwaysuway na tag kalami ani ron kay 30 na ta. hapit na ko magbirthday. inig 30 nako musuway na unya ko ana.


...

suway ko anang massage ba na balibalion kuno imong lawas kay lami kuno na. :D

advance happy birthday pre:D

[bukid]

^^ salamat pre. :D maujaw man pud ta na mag 30 nalang ta wa pa man tay buot kuno ingon sila. saun nalang ni. special child man gud ta. :D

[Il Tenore]

^^ :D ayaw pre ayaw... ayaw dugaya. :D suwaysuway na tag kalami ani ron kay 30 na ta. hapit na ko magbirthday. inig 30 nako musuway na unya ko ana.


...

suway ko anang massage ba na balibalion kuno imong lawas kay lami kuno na. :D
hmmm... murag lain na lami imong nasa huna-huna ah! hehe!

[amigo32]

^^ salamat pre. :D maujaw man pud ta na mag 30 nalang ta wa pa man tay buot kuno ingon sila. saun nalang ni. special child man gud ta. :D

may buot, pero sa lubot mihuot:D joke:D

unsay guy special child pre? kanang kuwang-kuwang? hehehe

[bukid]

^^ hehehe di man tingali. kanang special child mao na ang bata ba na murag di na bata tanawon. :D

[amigo32]

^^ hehehe di man tingali. kanang special child mao na ang bata ba na murag di na bata tanawon. :D

nahala sige, ilabyog na:D

[bukid]

^^ hehehe oo pre mao ngita pa tag totoy pirmi kay bata lagi. :D

[amigo32]

^^ hehehe oo pre mao ngita pa tag totoy pirmi kay bata lagi. :D

si bloody red andyan, galit daw yun sa mga guapo, ayyy tagalog, di na nako i type ug utro, gitapolan na ko. pagbantay basig mamaak na kay guapohun raba ka, kauban sa trak-trak:D

[bukid]

^^ :D nah, guapohon ra man kaha. di diay kaayo guapo. di kaayo na kuyaw kay guapo ra man ang iya paakon gyud. guapohon ra man ta.

[amigo32]

^^ :D nah, guapohon ra man kaha. di diay kaayo guapo. di kaayo na kuyaw kay guapo ra man ang iya paakon gyud. guapohon ra man ta.

ikaw man gud, ngit ngit imong pic gi send sa email. wala may suga:D dili kaayo makita imong dagway as in hitsura, ang ubos ra ,ay kita kaayo:D

[amigo32]

gigusla:D na ko: kaon 'sa ko. gigusla=gigutom:D

[bukid]

^^ hay girl, di to ngitngit oi. kay kung ngitngit pa, di na to guapo. guapa na to. kay gabii bya ta mangitag boys. hahayz. itomon ra jud ko, day. :D

sige kaon usa diha. ako pud wa pa koy kaon. sige ayoayo ug hungit dha.

[Mercato]

Perhaps it hurts for me to see that I see that my fellow filipinos are having a deep discussions to the point that in other thread or I heard even in other forums, there would be bashing or I guess I can safely say "clash" between bisaya and tagalogs. I really think it is sad and because of all these, it is not helping the filipinos to become a much better filipino that I am beginning to think that these are all part of the reason why there is not much progress in the Philippines. That and the corruption in the Philippines from Batanes to Sulu.

This is why also that I don't believe that there would be a real unity among all filipinos even if we change our own national language to english or spanish because i feel that it still lies on the attitude of each filipinos towards one another and for the fact that anything foreign is better. I can see it's just not the economy that draw us to another country, it's the idea of actually the feel of living in another and make it our own, otherwise, why is it so comon for a filipino to deny they are filipinos or if not, can't straightly say they are filipino instead they will add, I'm half this and that blood. Usually would not speak in their native languages when they return home to the Philippines when you know they were not born and raised in that country.
There is no need to sad by intelligent and healthy discussions. That is much better than avoiding the issues altogether. The end result will be pent up emotions on both sides and a basic lack of understanding because both sides had effectively put up invisible walls. Discussion cannot be equated with “bashing” or “clashing”. One has to be more mature than that.

There is another point of view which Filipinos tend to forget when thinking about the nation. Unlike most other conventional, one land mass countries (hence easier to mould together as one nation), ours is an archipelagic nation.

Being an archipelago made it possible for all our diverse regional languages and cultures to evolve. The geographic nature of our country is already there so one has to deal with it. Inherent differences amongst the diverse ethnic groups do exist; but the solution, I’m afraid, is not a mere all out embrace of Tagalog. The Establishment had already tried that since 1946 and instead of uniting, they only succeeded in polarizing both sides of the divide.

As for the notions of:
1. speaking other languages to the exclusion of the mother tongue = most of us Cebuanos here are fluent in our mother tongue. I refrain to comment on other non-cebuanos who "forget" their own.

2. Half this; half that = I agree... I had already posted my opinions on this a long time ago.

3. national unity = but of course there was genuine national unity during the Commonwealth Era, don't you see? The differences back then were as minor as the rivalry between say, LA vs. New York.

[Il Tenore]

^^ hay girl, di to ngitngit oi. kay kung ngitngit pa, di na to guapo. guapa na to. kay gabii bya ta mangitag boys. hahayz. itomon ra jud ko, day. :D

sige kaon usa diha. ako pud wa pa koy kaon. sige ayoayo ug hungit dha.
duda na ko sa inyong duha da! hehe!!

[amigo32]

duda na ko sa inyong duha da! hehe!!

hindi ka ba nagbabasa sa samahan?:D

bawal dito:D

[bukid]

duda na ko sa inyong duha da! hehe!!

nah, nagduda pa gyud. kaklaro na ana. dugay naman mi ni amigo. sa una inig buntag sya ako bf ug ako iya gf. inig gabii ako iyang bf ug sya akong gf. karon pareha na mi mangitag bf sa gabii oi ug sa buntag naa mi amo pud gf. pero usahay once in a while. aw, kami ra gihapon do. karon duda pa ka? klaro na sah?!? :D nahala sige. mag-andam pa mi para unya gabii kay hapit na 6. sa man girl kuyog ka?!? adto kuno ta ron sa mga lugar sa makaatiii.

asa naman to ako mini-skirt oi. :D

[amigo32]

nah, nagduda pa gyud. kaklaro na ana. dugay naman mi ni amigo. sa una inig buntag sya ako bf ug ako iya gf. inig gabii ako iyang bf ug sya akong gf. karon pareha na mi mangitag bf sa gabii oi ug sa buntag naa mi amo pud gf. pero usahay once in a while. aw, kami ra gihapon do. karon duda pa ka? klaro na sah?!? :D nahala sige. mag-andam pa mi para unya gabii kay hapit na 6. sa man girl kuyog ka?!? adto kuno ta ron sa mga lugar sa makaatiii.

asa naman to ako mini-skirt oi. :D

micro mini nimo tua sa ilawom sa boxing gloves nimo. kalimot ka diba nag dali dali na ka ug hipos kay miabot na ang imong kuya basig mahibaw-an ka. sis guwapo ng kuya mo ha!

[bukid]

^^ nah, ajaw na pud kabuangi tong aho kuja kay strit baja to. majumbagan jud ka, do.

[amigo32]

^^ nah, ajaw na pud kabuangi tong aho kuja kay strit baja to. majumbagan jud ka, do.

lami man gud mo ug kaliwat:D
tan aw nako dako sya, himulig kaajo. mura ug lubi nga bag-ong pamunga:D

painumon nako ug lumay:D:lol:

[bukid]

^^ nah baja. puera buyag tawn, bungol ang naminaw. ajaw tawn ana ron kay byernes ra ba. :D lami ba tawn. kaitom ra namo ug kulong pa jud ug buhok murag kapre na nagbitay sa sanga. :D

[Ang_Bantayanon]

Kaluoy ni bukid ug amigo sila ra gyud duha nagtikawtikaw... unsaon ang SSC Cebu nag-meet pa man karon. Kamo ra gyud wa didto..

[flesh_is_weak]

^^nganong wala nanguyog :lol:

[amigo32]

Kaluoy ni bukid ug amigo sila ra gyud duha nagtikawtikaw... unsaon ang SSC Cebu nag-meet pa man karon. Kamo ra gyud wa didto..

kuyog unta mi ninyo, problema kami nalang duha nagkuyog:D

[Il Tenore]

nah, nagduda pa gyud. kaklaro na ana. dugay naman mi ni amigo. sa una inig buntag sya ako bf ug ako iya gf. inig gabii ako iyang bf ug sya akong gf. karon pareha na mi mangitag bf sa gabii oi ug sa buntag naa mi amo pud gf. pero usahay once in a while. aw, kami ra gihapon do. karon duda pa ka? klaro na sah?!? :D nahala sige. mag-andam pa mi para unya gabii kay hapit na 6. sa man girl kuyog ka?!? adto kuno ta ron sa mga lugar sa makaatiii.

asa naman to ako mini-skirt oi. :D
haha! kuyawa pud uy! mura man jud ug tinuod!

[overtureph]

http://i9.photobucket.com/albums/a89/overtureph/book1.jpg


http://i9.photobucket.com/albums/a89/overtureph/book.jpg

[flesh_is_weak]

gahapon ba, gahuna-huna ko, kung naa na tay Federal Republic of the Visayas, unsa man ang atong official language? (gawas sa Ingles, na klaro na kaayo) kung Sinugbuanon, moreklamo gyud ang mga Waray ug Ilonggo, ug mao ra pud istorya-ha kung usa ana nilang duha ang gamiton, naa gyud mang-reklamo...

mao na murag sakto gyud lagi na kinatsila ang gamiton kuyog sa iningles (alangan na man pud ug tagalog, malipay kaha mo?)

kay at least, ang kinatsila ug iningles, walay ethnic group dinhi sa ato na maka-angkon na ilaha nang pinulongan, mao na patas ang tanan, walay gipalabaw, ug wala puy gitamay-tamay

[habagatcentral1]

Morag aqui? Donde ka magtener? Unsa atong nilengua diri sa Federal Republica ahoy? Recomendar nga practisar na yo Chavacano Visaya. Pero tu sujestion para sa pinolungan sa Federal Republica ya muy bien pud. :D

Kalit ko nagpamensar ana, what if the Federal Republic went through. What language do we speak? I just wonder how our ancestors in the Visayas communicate with each other.

[Wind Shear]

gahapon ba, gahuna-huna ko, kung naa na tay Federal Republic of the Visayas, unsa man ang atong official language? (gawas sa Ingles, na klaro na kaayo) kung Sinugbuanon, moreklamo gyud ang mga Waray ug Ilonggo, ug mao ra pud istorya-ha kung usa ana nilang duha ang gamiton, naa gyud mang-reklamo...

mao na murag sakto gyud lagi na kinatsila ang gamiton kuyog sa iningles (alangan na man pud ug tagalog, malipay kaha mo?)

kay at least, ang kinatsila ug iningles, walay ethnic group dinhi sa ato na maka-angkon na ilaha nang pinulongan, mao na patas ang tanan, walay gipalabaw, ug wala puy gitamay-tamay

Read this http://cefedi.rpweb.ph/

I also read the Speak Out column in Sun.Star Cebu, dated June 24, 2008 entitled "Breaking the Barrier"

[habagatcentral1]

^^ Which one?

[bukid]

gahapon ba, gahuna-huna ko, kung naa na tay Federal Republic of the Visayas, unsa man ang atong official language? (gawas sa Ingles, na klaro na kaayo) kung Sinugbuanon, moreklamo gyud ang mga Waray ug Ilonggo, ug mao ra pud istorya-ha kung usa ana nilang duha ang gamiton, naa gyud mang-reklamo...

mao na murag sakto gyud lagi na kinatsila ang gamiton kuyog sa iningles (alangan na man pud ug tagalog, malipay kaha mo?)

kay at least, ang kinatsila ug iningles, walay ethnic group dinhi sa ato na maka-angkon na ilaha nang pinulongan, mao na patas ang tanan, walay gipalabaw, ug wala puy gitamay-tamay

wa man tawn nay angay lalisan kung ang 3 nalang diay ang himuon na "national" language sa FBI. ngano mupili pa man gyud ug usa ug ngano i-revive pa man ang chavacano bisaya na mahimo ra man nato himuon na "national" language ang 3. sa south africa man gani kay 11 ilang "official" languages. sa FBI, 3 ra gud na. unsay ato angay kalisdan nga mahimo ra mana tun-an ang 3. ako man gani kabalo man ko mag-waray, sugbuanon ug ilonggo.

[amigo32]

sakto jud bai,

[flesh_is_weak]

pwede.

bongga! ang mga traffic nya puhon sa atua kay upat na kabuok...pero sa iskwelahan, asa man sa tulo ang itudlo? lisod pud kaayo kung dunganon ang tulo...

unsa kahay mas maayo, kung taga Cebu, Sinugbuanon imong tun-an, kung taga Leyte pud ka, Waray imong tun-an...or kuan kaha, kung taga Cebu ka, either Waray or Ilonggo ang imong tun-an...or pwede pud, kung naa ka sa Leyte, Waray imong major language subject (gawas sa English na dili pwedeng tang-tangon) ug naay kay elective subject na Sinugbuanon o Ilonggo?

pero bongga pud baya kung Español atong itudlo, hinay-hinay na baya siyang gi-adopt sa Estados Unidos na maoy pinakadako nato na partner...kung ako lang lagi pabut-on, kinahanglan tanang estudyante sa high school pa lang daan hangtud kolehiyo naay elective subject na usa ka foreign language gawas sa English...gamit baya nang daghan tang foreign language na nahibaw-an aron mas competitive ta...

[bukid]

^^ mahimo ra mana na ang native language mao ang medium of instruction sa elementary. unya pag-abot sa high school itudlo gud ang 2.

pananglit...

kung sa sugbo...

elementary: ang pagtudlo kay sa sugbuanon.

high school:

1st and 2nd year ilonggo

3rd and 4th year waraywaray

sa iloilo naman...

elementary: ilonggo

high school:

1st and 2nd year: sugbuanon

3rd and 4th year: waraywaray

sa tacloban...

elementary: waraywaray

high school:

1st and 2nd year: sugbuanon

3rd and 4th year: ilonggo

o di ba, magkaanaa pa ug exchange of ideas kay ang mga ilonggo ug waray paarion man sa cebu aron naay magtudlo. unya ang mga sugbuanon ug waray pud paadtuon sa iloilo. kung naay exchange students naa pud mga exchange teachers.

wa puy lalis kay kung ang president ilonggo, ang prime minister kay sugbuanon man unya ang speaker of the house kay waraywaray aron patas tanan. unya after 3years magrotate na pud sila aron ang president sugbuanon na pud unya ang prime minister kay waraywaray ug ilonggo na pud ang speaker of the house. puli-puli lang aron way lalis. way usa na magpermanente sa usa ka position.

[habagatcentral1]

^^ :lol: Hehehehe!!! Ok na to nagpreach ko sa Gospel of "Benjo kag ang Tropang Pitbull" sa mga estudyante nako sa CebuDoc sa una...didto sila una nakahibalo og tinaga nga Hiligaynon. :D

[Wind Shear]

Or better yet, have other regional language of the choice in High School as elective.

For example, we can have all subjects and replacing Cebuano/Hiligaynon/Waray from Filipino/Tagalog as subject in elementary in respective places then in high school, they have the option to choose another regional language.

To figure it out:

In Cebu City:
Kindergarten 1 to Grade 6 (or Grade 7, if required to) - Cebuano
High School - pick one: Hiligaynon, Waray, Tagalog

In Iloilo City:
Kindergarten 1 to Grade 6 (or Grade 7, if required to) - Hiligaynon
High School - pick one: Cebuano, Waray, Tagalog

In Catbalogan City, Samar:
Kindergarten 1 to Grade 6 (or Grade 7, if required to) - Waray
High School - pick one: Cebuano, Hiligaynon, Tagalog


What do you think?

[bukid]

^^ way apil ang tagalog bay kay BIR (Bisayan Independent Republic) ni. ang tagalog para ra mana sa ila pud kaulgalingon na Republika ng Katagalugan. :)

[amigo32]

^^ way apil ang tagalog bay kay BIR (Bisayan Independent Republic) ni. ang tagalog para ra mana sa ila pud kaulgalingon na Republika ng Katagalugan. :)

Mobalik na ko diha usa magsirado ang borders. Basig diri na ko sa Manila eh ug dili ko kabalik diha. mokuha na pod ug passport, lisod ra ba makakuha ana:D

[bukid]

^^ ayaw kabalaka. diha lang ka kay nanginahanglan ning ato republika ug bangiitang espiya. :D

[mwg12a]

Or better yet, have other regional language of the choice in High School as elective.

For example, we can have all subjects and replacing Cebuano/Hiligaynon/Waray from Filipino/Tagalog as subject in elementary in respective places then in high school, they have the option to choose another regional language.

To figure it out:

In Cebu City:
Kindergarten 1 to Grade 6 (or Grade 7, if required to) - Cebuano
High School - pick one: Hiligaynon, Waray, Tagalog

In Iloilo City:
Kindergarten 1 to Grade 6 (or Grade 7, if required to) - Hiligaynon
High School - pick one: Cebuano, Waray, Tagalog

In Catbalogan City, Samar:
Kindergarten 1 to Grade 6 (or Grade 7, if required to) - Waray
High School - pick one: Cebuano, Hiligaynon, Tagalog


What do you think?

Do you know how much that would cost to have a set up like that?? Consider Books that is needed to publish for these. Teachers that needed to be trained and teacher's salary and the fund to keep these teachers from leaving the country... Changing the constitution itself will cost taxpayers money my friend. It's a nice idea but the problem is we will not have enough fund to accomplish these.

[flesh_is_weak]

lahi-lahi na lang ug official language kada-federal state...pero ang official language sa sentral na gobyerno kay english na lang para walay gubot

[mwg12a]

^^^ not gonna change anything with the filipinos even if english is the official language. Like what i said in english thread. tagalog would still be the same cocky tagalogs mocking others even if we hide in english. the only way to get rid of our accents is if we stop using our native languages and speak english at home. Manila will still be imperialist Manila to you guys even if we speak english. Why? because our accents is brought about the language we speak at home. Isn't that mostly what u guys are complaining about? tagalogs are mocking the way you talk and being portrayed as housemaids? Tagalog being shoved in your throats are secondary reason but that is because the regional languages are not included in Philippine educational system?

We just want to emphasis english because it helps us land a job in call centers and overseas but we can do that without replacing our official language into something foreign insterad of anything indegeous to the filipinos...

[amigo32]

i am a proud tsimoy:D ngano man dong beh?:D

[mwg12a]

^^^ you mocking tsinoy??LOL Saba deha uy!!!

[bukid]

Do you know how much that would cost to have a set up like that?? Consider Books that is needed to publish for these. Teachers that needed to be trained and teacher's salary and the fund to keep these teachers from leaving the country... Changing the constitution itself will cost taxpayers money my friend. It's a nice idea but the problem is we will not have enough fund to accomplish these.

but that will give the waray, ilonggos and cebuanos available jobs as language teachers and reducing the need for tagalog teachers. we only need to replaced the tagalog subject teachers with the bisayan teachers. we don't ned additional teachers. what we will do is removed those teaching tagalog and replace them with those who will be teaching bisayan.

changing the constitution might cost taxpayers money but in the long run it will save us much by giving the region more autonomy and bigger share in our revenues. it is imperialist manila who will lose much and corruption will be easier to monitor because the bureaucracy is much more simplier. our eyes and ears will be more focused and directed toward the regional capitol and the regional governors.

Consider Books that is needed to publish for these.

ahhh, ok. that must be the reason why they don't want the people of the philippines to learn about the indigenous culture and literatures, oral traditions, music, poetry and arts of all the indigenous inhabitants of the philippines, that must be the reason why they only gave us tagalog and anything tagalog because with "tagalog only" lessons it's a bigger savings for the country. wow, that's a very good Pro-tagalog statement. that must be the reason why no one knows anything about the other inhabitants of the philippines. because we need to save money and so we only limits our history, literatures and poetry lessons in all our national schools to anything tagalog so we can save money by printing books with as little pages as possible and all of them speaking only a little about the rest of the inhabitants and much about the tagalogs and the tagalog region. the rest of the inhabitants are insignificant, they're just like lice and fleas that you can crushed with your thumbs.

^^^ not gonna change anything with the filipinos even if english is the official language. Like what i said in english thread. tagalog would still be the same cocky tagalogs mocking others even if we hide in english. the only way to get rid of our accents is if we stop using our native languages and speak english at home. Manila will still be imperialist Manila to you guys even if we speak english. Why? because our accents is brought about the language we speak at home. Isn't that mostly what u guys are complaining about? tagalogs are mocking the way you talk and being portrayed as housemaids? Tagalog being shoved in your throats are secondary reason but that is because the regional languages are not included in Philippine educational system?

We just want to emphasis english because it helps us land a job in call centers and overseas but we can do that without replacing our official language into something foreign insterad of anything indegeous to the filipinos...

removing tagalog as a national language and a compulsory subject from elemetary to college will help reduce the problems you mentioned. because nationalism will not be equal to tagalog only. and that will give us a sense of equality.

I learn how to speak Cebuano and it never made me feel like I lost my identity.

let me rephrased what you said by saying...

I learn how to speak English and it never made me feel like I lost my identity. and so i also don't think that removing tagalog as a "national" language will make me feel like i lost my identity. besides, i'm not tagalog, i'm bisaya and bisayans are filipino (am i right?). and i can speak hiligaynon, sugbuanon and waray.

[amigo32]

^^^ you mocking tsinoy??LOL Saba deha uy!!!

tsimay pag girl
eh di tsimoy!:lol:

[habagatcentral1]

Actually I can speak Binisayang Ilonggo (a mix of Cebuano and Ilonggo) or the Gensan Binisaya. It goes to show the dynamism of language as an alive organism of the society. :D

[mwg12a]

^^ Dynamism is always positive and good.

[mwg12a]

Bukid, it's not a pro-tagalog point of view because I mentioned "Why not any of the filipino native languages instead of just english.

Yes, that will give the waray, Illongo and such a job to teach in that region, provided if they are not lured to work overseas for a much better pay. But then again, I mentioned many times that, yes, regional languages might be taught in their respective languages.

The Imperialist Manila would not totally lose it's impetus because they would still be the center for almost everything and the final decision will still be with the central government, it's not like a total autonomy from the Manila government much like how the federal government in the US?. The local regions would just have more power over their own jurisdictions, however, corruption would not just end there because the corruption is almost rampant everywhere in the Philippines, just that Manila is more of the focus of attention when it comes to these but it happen also everywhere in the Philippines. And with the attitude of alot of politicians who has their eyes on anything they can lay their eyes on is lethal not just in Manila but almost in every region.


Going back to your protest that it is just an added burden to the student to study the tagalog language will be the same burden if the regional languages is taught in the regional schools because, one, your reason was it is useless to study it because there is no use for it in any profession you would be going to in the future, doesn't that apply also to any regional languages? It will be just an added burden because you can't make use of it except when you speak to someone at home or your friends in your region. How is it gonna be any different from having tagalog in every school in the Philippines?

I think the only conflict we have here is how the constitution is written, because they use the word "filipino" instead of directly refering it into "tagalog". And maybe you're right, it should of been written as "tagalog" as an official language much like in india with "hindi" instead of "national language". But my point is, I still am in favor of ANY FILIPINO LANGUAGE as the "main" official languge and english would still be the "subsidiary or secondary language" for business and administration. Why? Because I was afraid that ALL of our native languages will disappear totally because if that happens? It will just give birth to another set of conflicts about languages because of the death of our languages and true filipino identity...


You know what? I am seriously thinking why should I care anymore? I don't have filipino citizenship and has never applied or i guess you can say "reapply"... For all I care if all the Philippine regions break away and declare their own independent nation or republic. It would be easier for me to deny my being filipino because there would no longer be Philippines when that happen. That is I guess if I can look at myself in the mirror and not see what background I have underneath my skin, which is kind of hard to do... Oh well, maybe it's for the best ... Let's just push for full separation of each region and create their own nation, Philippines is a hopeless case anyway...

[bukid]

The Imperialist Manila would not totally lose it's impetus because they would still be the center for almost everything and the final decision will still be with the central government, it's not like a total autonomy from the Manila government much like how the federal government in the US?. The local regions would just have more power over their own jurisdictions, however, corruption would not just end there because the corruption is almost rampant everywhere in the Philippines, just that Manila is more of the focus of attention when it comes to these but it happen also everywhere in the Philippines. And with the attitude of alot of politicians who has their eyes on anything they can lay their eyes on is lethal not just in Manila but almost in every region.


Going back to your protest that it is just an added burden to the student to study the tagalog language will be the same burden if the regional languages is taught in the regional schools because, one, your reason was it is useless to study it because there is no use for it in any profession you would be going to in the future, doesn't that apply also to any regional languages? It will be just an added burden because you can't make use of it except when you speak to someone at home or your friends in your region. How is it gonna be any different from having tagalog in every school in the Philippines?

I think the only conflict we have here is how the constitution is written, because they use the word "filipino" instead of directly refering it into "tagalog". And maybe you're right, it should of been written as "tagalog" as an official language much like in india with "hindi" instead of "national language". But my point is, I still am in favor of ANY FILIPINO LANGUAGE as the "main" official languge and english would still be the "subsidiary or secondary language" for business and administration. Why? Because I was afraid that ALL of our native languages will disappear totally because if that happens? It will just give birth to another set of conflicts about languages because of the death of our languages and true filipino identity...

corruptions may be rampant but at least with more money in the hands of the regional governors, it would be much easier to trace than when everything emanates from imperial manila. focus of our attention today is manila because that's where evrything starts. remember it's very centralized. and corruptions starts from the very top (mao na inig abot sa amo sinsiyo nalang...) so why not make it like the federal system of the U.S.? and give the regions greater automony and a bigger share in revenues from their income.

teaching bisaya will not be an added burden if we remove the teaching of tagalog in our schools. again we will not give additional subjects. we will only replaced what is tagalog with what is bisayan. and we are bisaya so that won't be a big burden to learn the bisayan language.

the constitution say "Filipino" but we all know that the "Filipino" taught in school is tagalog. so there might be no need to removed that phrase that "filipino is the national language of the philippines" but we have to be clear that the "filipino" language they teach us in school is "tagalog".

[mwg12a]

I give up, I wanted a UNITED and progressive Philippines since I spent half of my life there but I don't see that as happening anytime soon in my lifetime. I added something at the bottom of my latest post but i guess you missed it. I mean no offense to you Bukid, you're a great person to have a healthy discussion with. I'm just totally frustrated and somewhat disgusted on how things are in the Philippines...

But this is what I wrote in the end. I hope I didnt offend anybody by these. It's just an expression of frustration...

Added from the last post:

You know what? I am seriously thinking why should I care anymore? I don't have filipino citizenship and has never applied or i guess you can say "reapply"... For all I care if all the Philippine regions break away and declare their own independent nation or republic. It would be easier for me to deny my being filipino because there would no longer be Philippines when that happen. That is I guess if I can look at myself in the mirror and not see what background I have underneath my skin, which is kind of hard to do... Oh well, maybe it's for the best ... Let's just push for full separation of each region and create their own nation, Philippines is a hopeless case anyway...


Btw: My reaction towards the idea of federalism is that, sure it will help each region immensely but I feel that some of our fellow forumers here take that idea of "FEDERALISM" in a wrong context as in, each region would be totally be freed from the Central Government as if it's a separate country when it's not. I don't think it works that way. It will somehow decentralize the flow of revenue to a certain extent but a big chunk of it will still flow down to the capital government and much of the decisions in each regions would still be brought to the attention of the central goverment for approval so, there would still be loophole for corruption there, that there are still several regions that will be left stagnant economically and socially.

[bukid]

^^ that's what i'm thinking also. if federalism doesn't work. i support full independence. i believe we can be like singapore or costa rica as a separate nation. but i am willing to give federalism a chance. but definitely i'm not in favor of this centralized unitary system and the tagalog-centric education and tagalog-centric governance that we have at present.

[mwg12a]

I don't understand why you keep on saying tagalog centric governance when the governing body is not governed by tagalogs itself purely but from all different regions of the country.


Now, education? Tagalog centric? there maybe truth to it, but then again, this happened because of a non-tagalog kapangpangan chinese who thought that if we can pattern ourselves with a progressive country with one language for unity, would help the filipinos much better, somehow, it failed because of coup, corruptions and many destabilizing factors like the issue of insurgency and such. But before it, there would be some filipino/tagalog classes in the educational system just because it was the national language so it has to be taught so that it would serve as a unifying medium for communication for filipinos, not necessarily to shove in your guy's throat and change your whole being, again, like a broken record, regional languages were never banned from being use in their respective regions. But,somehow prior to it, most of the medium on instructions in schools like science and math were all in english .


It would be hard to replicate Singapore for the Bisaya republic, unless, the corruption there will also disappear completely and if you can match, Japan, singapore and Korea with techology, then compete with Thailand and Indonesia in tourism. There is not much natural resources you can export. Although Somehow one positive thing that would happen is that having your own separate republic, you guys can achieve the idea of having the english language as the main language, hopefully, you guys would stop sending graduates overseas, otherwise nothing would change while still being under the imperialist manila rule.

[bukid]

^^ when i say tagalog-centric education. it is not about tagalog as a medium of instruction. it is the lack of lessons on indigenous people and good history lesson that not only speaks about the tagalog region and the capital but one that would honestly speak about our history including those significant events that happened outside of the tagalog region. for example "the negros republic", "the balangiga incident", "the commonwealth government in leyte" etc... you see our history lessons in school would not even bother to mention these events. when i was a student, i never heard these being taugh in our DECS approved textbooks. but they speak so much about KKK and andres bonifacio as if that guy was advocating a philippine republic. we all know later that he was for a republika ng katagalugan.

tagalog-cenric education is stripping our people of the right to be educated in the rich oral traditions and literatures of our fellow filipinos (in original language but with translations) by concentrating too much on the balagtasan ni balagtas.

tagalog-centric governance is a governance where most (i do not say all) major infrastructure and development are in the manila and tagalog region. altho at present GMA is already doing something for the provinces but stil we are at the mercy of whoever is holding office in imperial manila. and they (the presidents) have to please the manila and residents of the tagalog region or else they will experience another EDSA. it is easier for them to march to malacanyang than for us non-tagalog to go to manila.

we have rich natural resources here. we can benefit with eco-tourism. boracay, guimaras, cebu, bantayan, bohol, bais, negros oriental, samar...

historical : panay, leyte and many more.

industries and handicrafts are also plentiful and are of export quality.

so who says we won't be able to become a new costa rica. i'm more in favor of the bisayas as an eco-tourist country.

and our festivals are one of those famous in the world. sinulog, dinagyang, ati-atihan...

[habagatcentral1]

^^ I think the I would question the Tagalog dominance in Philippine politics.
The highest positions in the government are not even Tagalogs per se. Gloria is Kapampangan, Winston is Cebuano, Gonzales is Ilonggo, so on and so forth. The members of the cabinet and the senate and even the lower house are mostly from the provinces.

I would rather say Manila-centric, rather than Tagalog-centric. We cannot blame the Tagalogs for being in the proximity of the capital. Manila is not Tagalog as many would believe. I might be describing metasocially but Manila is not comprised of the Tagalogs alone, but a mix of different groups who most of them migrated from the provinces.

Manila IMO is a city of dreams of the Filipinos as a whole during the post-war era. It would be unfair for the Tagalogs if you are to accuse them as imperialist. What if Legaspi didn't moved out of Cebu and chose it as a capital, will the Cebuanos have also "imperialist" or "hegemonic" tendencies to influence other cultures as well? Even the Batangueño Tagalogs are being ridiculed like their Visayan counterparts. I guess one behaviour of human beings when they reach progress is seemingly to look down to others who haven't developed that much.

Manila also needs to keep its machinery going because of its growing urban blight. And while Manila is experiencing such, oil is needed to lubricate the machinery in the countryside or places other than Manila. This lubrication will run the economy of this country properly IMO. Its not too late to give priorities too to other parts of Luzon, the Visayas and Mindanao.

On our part in Western Visayas, independence from Manila is farfetched as most of the Ilonggo prominent families, may it be economic or political, are based in Manila now. Autonomy, well we might be, but given the current situation I think it would be difficult for us to seperate.

[flesh_is_weak]

basta ako, i dont shout discrimination when tagalogs mock my accent...the french, the italians, etc...sound as 'funny' as bisayas...

why i want something foreign over something indigenous in the country is because i dont want any certain ethnic getting that feeling of superiority because their language is 'official' and is being force-fed in school, neither do i want to see certain ethnic groups (just like now) feeling inferior compared to another because their language is merely secondary...

it would be better, IMO, for a heterogeneous country like ours to have an official language thatis foreign to the country (not necessarily English, since Spanish would also make a good alternative) so that none of the ethnic groups could develop that so-called superiority complex, since they could lay claim to the language used officially by the country.

for our dear Visayan Republic, three official languages would be good, but as stated here before, 3 languages would be too expensive

[habagatcentral1]

I was thinking of using "Esperanto" :D

[Wind Shear]

And in fact, there's a short-lived republic in the Philippine Islands called Republic of Bohol in 1898 until 1900. I am very sure that there's none found in DECS-approved textbook.

[amigo32]

^^ when i say tagalog-centric education. it is not about tagalog as a medium of instruction. it is the lack of lessons on indigenous people and good history lesson that not only speaks about the tagalog region and the capital but one that would honestly speak about our history including those significant events that happened outside of the tagalog region. for example "the negros republic", "the balangiga incident", "the commonwealth government in leyte" etc... you see our history lessons in school would not even bother to mention these events. when i was a student, i never heard these being taugh in our DECS approved textbooks. but they speak so much about KKK and andres bonifacio as if that guy was advocating a philippine republic. we all know later that he was for a republika ng katagalugan.

tagalog-cenric education is stripping our people of the right to be educated in the rich oral traditions and literatures of our fellow filipinos (in original language but with translations) by concentrating too much on the balagtasan ni balagtas.

tagalog-centric governance is a governance where most (i do not say all) major infrastructure and development are in the manila and tagalog region. altho at present GMA is already doing something for the provinces but stil we are at the mercy of whoever is holding office in imperial manila. and they (the presidents) have to please the manila and residents of the tagalog region or else they will experience another EDSA. it is easier for them to march to malacanyang than for us non-tagalog to go to manila.

we have rich natural resources here. we can benefit with eco-tourism. boracay, guimaras, cebu, bantayan, bohol, bais, negros oriental, samar...

historical : panay, leyte and many more.

industries and handicrafts are also plentiful and are of export quality.

so who says we won't be able to become a new costa rica. i'm more in favor of the bisayas as an eco-tourist country.

and our festivals are one of those famous in the world. sinulog, dinagyang, ati-atihan...

Nganong Costa Rica? Costa Rica na sila niadto pang panahon sa Kastila di ba?

[Mond87]

Dili man ako bisaya. Dili pa ako gikaon... tama ba?

[amigo32]

Dili man ako bisaya. Dili pa ako gikaon... tama ba?

back to school.
you failed!:D

[flesh_is_weak]

@mond: ganahan ka kaonon tika? :jk:

ok ra baya iyang sentence construction, sayop lang ang words na gigamit

[Sinjin P.]

As our teacher would joke to those who do not understand Bisaya: "Ikabaligya ka sa Carbon dong" :lol:

[mwg12a]

^^ I think the I would question the Tagalog dominance in Philippine politics.
The highest positions in the government are not even Tagalogs per se. Gloria is Kapampangan, Winston is Cebuano, Gonzales is Ilonggo, so on and so forth. The members of the cabinet and the senate and even the lower house are mostly from the provinces.

I would rather say Manila-centric, rather than Tagalog-centric. We cannot blame the Tagalogs for being in the proximity of the capital. Manila is not Tagalog as many would believe. I might be describing metasocially but Manila is not comprised of the Tagalogs alone, but a mix of different groups who most of them migrated from the provinces.

Manila IMO is a city of dreams of the Filipinos as a whole during the post-war era. It would be unfair for the Tagalogs if you are to accuse them as imperialist. What if Legaspi didn't moved out of Cebu and chose it as a capital, will the Cebuanos have also "imperialist" or "hegemonic" tendencies to influence other cultures as well? Even the Batangueño Tagalogs are being ridiculed like their Visayan counterparts. I guess one behaviour of human beings when they reach progress is seemingly to look down to others who haven't developed that much.





Exactly Bernie, when you say tagalog centric is like blaming the tagalog in general and is almost sounding like prejudicial towards tagalog in general. That is what I have been saying long long time ago. Finally someone got it also, If the history were reversed and Cebu was named as the capital, then cebuanos or binisaya will be branded as "imperialist". It will be more of sterotyping. Just because one is tagalog or bisaya , it automatically cause the misery amongst other filipinos when the governing body isn't at all tagalog dominance from the highest seat of the president to the smallest branches of the government, because, it was never all tagalog governance, it's a mixture of all regions.

That is how I see it when a non-tagalog or bisaya or illonggo would call Imperialist Manila and synonumously refer Manila as tagalog-centric or tagalista. To me it's being "racist" we just don't notice it because racism isn't a recognized phenomenon in the Philippines but it is infact consider as racial prejudism. We all might have the same color of skin and have the same appearance but heritage wise, each region has it's distinct features and ways that makes us different from one another..

And you are right, separation of all these regions would probably be hard because of the lack of other resources, tourism can't be just a source of revenue like what bukid had mention, unless, there is already oil or electronic products that can be exported out of bisayan region that is strictly a product of the Philippines and no other nation can compete with it. In tourism alone, the bisaya region would compete with the neighboring countries like thailand and indonesia, if that is the asset of that region, it still won't level up with countries like Japan and Korea and those countries doesn't even have beach resorts but they are still much much more progressive than thailand and Singapore.

[bukid]

^^ but we're competitive and bisayans are intelligent, artistic and business minded so i'm sure we will be very successful. i have confidence in the bisayans. lapulapu had no cannons and high powered weapons but he was able to kill magellan. he outsmarts the white man. :)

^^ I think the I would question the Tagalog dominance in Philippine politics.
The highest positions in the government are not even Tagalogs per se. Gloria is Kapampangan, Winston is Cebuano, Gonzales is Ilonggo, so on and so forth. The members of the cabinet and the senate and even the lower house are mostly from the provinces.


that's probably the reason why the provinces are now getting more attention.


I would rather say Manila-centric, rather than Tagalog-centric. We cannot blame the Tagalogs for being in the proximity of the capital. Manila is not Tagalog as many would believe. I might be describing metasocially but Manila is not comprised of the Tagalogs alone, but a mix of different groups who most of them migrated from the provinces.

Manila IMO is a city of dreams of the Filipinos as a whole during the post-war era. It would be unfair for the Tagalogs if you are to accuse them as imperialist. What if Legaspi didn't moved out of Cebu and chose it as a capital, will the Cebuanos have also "imperialist" or "hegemonic" tendencies to influence other cultures as well? Even the Batangueño Tagalogs are being ridiculed like their Visayan counterparts. I guess one behaviour of human beings when they reach progress is seemingly to look down to others who haven't developed that much.

Manila also needs to keep its machinery going because of its growing urban blight. And while Manila is experiencing such, oil is needed to lubricate the machinery in the countryside or places other than Manila. This lubrication will run the economy of this country properly IMO. Its not too late to give priorities too to other parts of Luzon, the Visayas and Mindanao.

On our part in Western Visayas, independence from Manila is farfetched as most of the Ilonggo prominent families, may it be economic or political, are based in Manila now. Autonomy, well we might be, but given the current situation I think it would be difficult for us to seperate.

well, but that's the truth. the tagalog region because of its proximity to the capital is being given priority but who are the cows that being milked dry by the national government? it's the folks in the provinces whose income would have to go to manila before it is given back to them. and most of the time only so little is left because along the way the corrupt officials in the bureaucracy that starts from the very top take some of it and pass it on to the next corrupt official who again take some of it then pass it on again to another corrupt official who will give it to another corrupt official who would take some of it too until all of them gets a big percentage of what shoudl be for the people. in the end, the people suffers and is left with very little.

that is the reason why i am very much against this present centralized unitary system. the provinces should be given the right to retain more than 50% of their income. so they can use it for their own benefits. i believe that would be very fair.

[habagatcentral1]

^^ I think we couldn't blame the Tagalog culturally why they became hegemonic in nature. There is something in economic and governmental policy and because of the progress, human nature as we are, we tend to be either enlightened or become hegemonic in nature.

For me, it would be unfair for the Tagalogs to be seen "imperialist" and "trample down the Bisayans, while as a matter of fact Batangueños are looked down by the urbanites of Manila because they are promdi. In our backyard in the Visayas, even us urbanites sometimes tend to look down on the promdis, in our part in Iloilo we tend to look down to the Antiqueños and Kinaray-a speakers. I believe that even Cebuanos would sometime look down upon Boholanos as well.

This core-periphery relationship of culture really gives emphasis on why we as a group behave hegemonic.

What we can do is to emphasize also the peripheries in terms of education and economics.

[bukid]

^^ i have to make it clear that i have nothing against the tagalog as a people. what i am against is the system that is very tagalog-centric. i am against the system (centralized unitary system) and the tagalog-centric policies because it gives the tagalog a false sense of superiority that gives some tagalog a false sense of "nationalism". where being tagalog is being peddled as "nationalism" and the rest are branded as "regionalism" and the promotion of those other language, literature, history etc.. in the national level are labeled as "regionalistic".

i have always been against the system and the choice of one language as a "national" language. but i have nothing against the people because i do have relatives that are tagalogs. an uncle married a tagalog from the province of jose rizal. and their children considers themselves as tagalog. we have good relationship. but i am not in favor of the tagalog-centric education and the tagalog centric governance of this country. and i am against naming one language as a "national" language but i have no problem with calling it "official" language. so that they can never use it to justify converting everyone into that one culture and one language and calling it "nationalism".

[habagatcentral1]

^^ The question is going back to this:
Given that we have a current situation, Manila the capital and we have also non-Visayan groups such as the Ilocanos, Kapampangans, etc. How can we communicate with each other?

Lets site an example: Cotabato City in Mindanao. The ethicity of the said city is so "cosmopolitan" (given the various peoples of the three societies of Mindanao-Kristyano, Muslim and Lumad) that they have to use a lingua franca in the image of "Filipino," but again its based on Tagalog.

The question, given that we were not granted of the option of independence but granted the federal government, how can we communitcate to our fellow Filipinos who doesn't speak Cebuano or Visayan? If they go in Cebu, shall we force the Manilenos to speak Cebuano and vice-versa?

Of course, in the realm of education right? We may see the change not immediately but maybe by a generation. Educate the non-Visayans or any non-native speakers of a vernacular language.

The thing here is that the models of Germany, United States, Mexico, Malaysia and other federal states, I think they have some language that is their lingua franca.

I was thinking our own "Bahasa" which would transcend the three major Visayan languages if in the case of the Federal Visayan States.

What's your suggestion?

Now this is a question:
How do we use "regionalism" as a form of "nationalism?" May it be Pilipinas or Federal Visayan States?

Another question:
If the Visayan Federal Republic should be set up, what will be the guarantee that all of the three major Visayan regions will have equal distribution of powers?

[bukid]

^^ don't you know that 50years ago they were communicating with each other in chavacano. during the 50's, i believe my chinese grandfather spoke in chabacano while doing business in the visayas and mindanao particularly the surigao-butuan-CDO area altho my father said that it was spanish. and i believe there would be no harm in communicating in english. besides i wasn't advocating the removal of tagalog in school. but don't make it compulsory specially at the primary level, make it elective.

the best model for a good organization is switzerland. you see the country is composed of people who can say that each one of them belong to different countries. switzerland had italian, french, german cantons. but they do unite for a common cause and are proud of their country and yet those folks are very much regionalistic and they give so much importance to local culture and traditions but proud to belong to switzerland though they are french, italians and germans.

well there was a joke that says...

Heaven is... where the French are the cooks, the British are the policemen, the Germans are the engineers, the Italians are the lovers and the Swiss are the organizers...

Hell is... where the British are the cooks, the Germans are the policemen, the French are the engineers, the Swiss are the lovers and the Italians are the organizers.

so to answer the last question. why dont we examine how the swiss organized their confederation.

http://www.ch.ch/behoerden/00215/index.html?lang=en

[habagatcentral1]

^^ The Cantonal Swiss Federation. Now it reminds me closely to Negros Cantonal Republic.

But what if Americans came in a much later date (lets say 1 year, given Spanish defeat)? What might have happened to the relation of the fledgling republics of Malolos and the Visayas?

[bukid]

^^ i cannot give a categorical answer to a hypothetical question.

if... only if... so what if... but if... then that's it. we never know what could have happened. but what we know is this...

there are problems in the present system and we need to do something now.

[flesh_is_weak]

But what if Americans came in a much later date (lets say 1 year, given Spanish defeat)? What might have happened to the relation of the fledgling republics of Malolos and the Visayas?

interesting...i've read somewhere that the party Aguinaldo sent to Panay after the fall of the Spanish regime was viewed by some locals as an 'invasion force'

[habagatcentral1]

^^ They did. They even burned Iloilo City (present downtown area) to the ground in order that the city will not be utilized by the invading Americans, thus less bahay na bato or Spanish residential or commercial edifices in our area as compared to Cebu.

[flesh_is_weak]

^^was compensation made for this?

if not, maybe the city government of Iloilo could ask for it...magamit pud ang kwarta para sa rebuilding sa Iloilo karon

[habagatcentral1]

I dunno but after the war (and because of the sugar industry boom back then), the city quickly recovered, therefore the dominance of American colonial era structures in our city.

(Sorry for the OT guys)

[mwg12a]

^^ but we're competitive and bisayans are intelligent, artistic and business minded so i'm sure we will be very successful. i have confidence in the bisayans. lapulapu had no cannons and high powered weapons but he was able to kill magellan. he outsmarts the white man. :)



that's probably the reason why the provinces are now getting more attention.




well, but that's the truth. the tagalog region because of its proximity to the capital is being given priority but who are the cows that being milked dry by the national government? it's the folks in the provinces whose income would have to go to manila before it is given back to them. and most of the time only so little is left because along the way the corrupt officials in the bureaucracy that starts from the very top take some of it and pass it on to the next corrupt official who again take some of it then pass it on again to another corrupt official who will give it to another corrupt official who would take some of it too until all of them gets a big percentage of what shoudl be for the people. in the end, the people suffers and is left with very little.

that is the reason why i am very much against this present centralized unitary system. the provinces should be given the right to retain more than 50% of their income. so they can use it for their own benefits. i believe that would be very fair.

No bukid, from Marcos down to Arroyo, it's never all tagalog government. Ramos is an Ilocano, Arroyo is kapangpangan, not sure where the hell Erap is from though..LMAO

There is no doubt that bisayans are competitive and business minded, but mind you that the leading businessmen from the bisayan regions specially Cebu are also Chinese filipinos.. There are many bisayan who also leave the Philippines to work in various fields overseas, they are like the rest of the filipinos, most were trying to finish a degree and mostly in medical health field to work in other countries, less native from bisayan region actually do start their own business, much like the tagalog and other regions.


I am not sure if this is really the reason why all the development is happening in the region. I know for sure that the reserve in the national treasury are being looted by the politicians, but accuse the tagalogs for doing that to the rest of the country is simply unfair...

the developments in the capital regions are brought about the businesses in the private sectors, like the ones in Makati, Calabarzon where alot of investments are going on, probably because of the proximity of the government offices and since investors are flocking in those areas the government is providing somehow a way to keep these investors stay. Secondly, alot of foreign investors are just now recognizing that Cebu or the bisayan region is safer than Mindanao. Did you not remember that the kidnapping incidents of foreigners were from mostly down south of Luzon? I have not heard of any incident that a foreigner was kidnapped anywhere in Luzon.

It is rather really unfair that the government is equated to tagalogs when the government are all not tagalogs. There are representatives from Mindanao and Visayas, those representative are supposed to be the VOICE AND ADVOCATE for their regions they are the ones who is responsible for the growth in the region, not just the president and the vice president. Marcos alone in his term? Did any big development happen in the Ilocos region during his term? Nothing.. it mostly went to his own pocket and very less in his own town. We can't blame Manila because somehow Manila sustained itself from "it's own private local and foreign investors" they are the ones responsible in all the high rises in makati and such. The development in respective provinces are by their own representative, just as Drillon or was it somebody else who proposed airport in Bacolod? Well the government officials are almost the same government officials we had even during marcos time. Why is it now that they are doing something for their home town????

[mwg12a]

^^ I think we couldn't blame the Tagalog culturally why they became hegemonic in nature. There is something in economic and governmental policy and because of the progress, human nature as we are, we tend to be either enlightened or become hegemonic in nature.

For me, it would be unfair for the Tagalogs to be seen "imperialist" and "trample down the Bisayans, while as a matter of fact Batangueños are looked down by the urbanites of Manila because they are promdi. In our backyard in the Visayas, even us urbanites sometimes tend to look down on the promdis, in our part in Iloilo we tend to look down to the Antiqueños and Kinaray-a speakers. I believe that even Cebuanos would sometime look down upon Boholanos as well.

This core-periphery relationship of culture really gives emphasis on why we as a group behave hegemonic.

What we can do is to emphasize also the peripheries in terms of education and economics.

Okay, this is what I was saying before to Bukid, because I had a first hand experienced to kind of looked down upon mostly because I was perceived as a tagalog. I mean, its not only the tagalogs that are mocking the bisayans especifically, but most others outside manila, but it doesn't necessarily mean it's a tagalog from manila doing that. Now, even in cebu, it happens and i can attest to these when someone outside of Cebu would look down people from out of the area.. The bottom line is, filipinos in general, people or filipinos needs to change their attitudes as most of us tend to look down and even stump on people whom we feel of lower class and less sophisticated than us, instead of helping them by leading them as a good example and a good citizen, but no, those people who are put down would have the tendency to pick up what was done to them and do it to others instead, just because they started living in Cebu or Manila, they think promdi's are all dumb or stupid that they would laugh at them...

[mwg12a]

^^ i have to make it clear that i have nothing against the tagalog as a people. what i am against is the system that is very tagalog-centric. i am against the system (centralized unitary system) and the tagalog-centric policies because it gives the tagalog a false sense of superiority that gives some tagalog a false sense of "nationalism". where being tagalog is being peddled as "nationalism" and the rest are branded as "regionalism" and the promotion of those other language, literature, history etc.. in the national level are labeled as "regionalistic".

i have always been against the system and the choice of one language as a "national" language. but i have nothing against the people because i do have relatives that are tagalogs. an uncle married a tagalog from the province of jose rizal. and their children considers themselves as tagalog. we have good relationship. but i am not in favor of the tagalog-centric education and the tagalog centric governance of this country. and i am against naming one language as a "national" language but i have no problem with calling it "official" language. so that they can never use it to justify converting everyone into that one culture and one language and calling it "nationalism".

Well, What if I can equate that as an envy (not that I really am) because the tagalog was made into a national language and having a national language, it should be taught in schools because it is being considered as a language of unity and is considered indegenous to us. It is not meant to ban other regional languages to be spoken at home.

Back in the days, it was not even thought of that english would be a tool for a greener pasture of the filipinos overseas. English was also been shoved to our throats by no less than the americans but we keep on swallowing it ( I didnt say that out of hate but just for the sake of discussion). Why is it okay for us if a foreigner will make us do things, shove their languages in our throats and is considered heaven to us if we follow but when an indegenous filipino language no matter if it's tagalog or bisaya, it seems like a crime and morally wrong for us???

We need to start thinking about these, because to me it boils down to the effect of "colonial mentality" .. I am not sure what it was really but it seems to us anything foreign english or american is alot better than whatever we have. Do we really hate ourselves and hate the race we became???

[bukid]

^^ To seek for equality is not envy. it is every citizen's right to seek equal recognition under the law because we are no slaves of anyone.

to seek the removal of a national language is to seek equality under the law. they may have shoved english down our throat but at least english is an international language. besides, i am not telling you to ban tagalog in school. we would just remove it as "national" language because more than 50% of the inhabitant of the philippines are not tagalog. again, i will give you india as an example they have no "national" language though 75% of the population are hindi. they only call it "official" language with english as " co-official. and yet the people are proud to be indians.

by the way, spanish wasn't shoved down our throat. people just learned it. that is why we end up with a real national language called "chabacano". i dont know if english was shoved down our throat. but one thing is clear, it helped us a lot to learn it than learning tagalog.

one more thing, "tagalog-centric governance" doesn't necessarily mean that the head of government are tagalog but its policies are PRO-tagalog. they have to please the people of manila and neighboring province (tagalog region) or else malakanyang will again witness another EDSA.

[habagatcentral1]

^^ Yet I noticed that Indian broadcast Hindi despite multitudes of dialects.

My perspective of nationalism and regionalism:
IMHO, nationalism can be promoted by simply acknowledging the different cultures that we have as a Filipino. Somehow we have to veer away from the traditional notion that Philippines is Manila alone. Instead acknowledge that Manila is a cosmopolitan city in which all peoples in the country converge (which is a fact that only a meager portion of the population traces its roots in Manila or within the Metro itself).

The language issue itself is still debatable even if the main proponent(s) are dead for several decades already. This is natural as the Filipinos seek to search for the real identity of who we are and why are we here.
That same thing happens most probably in Cebu. People are flocking in multitudes to Cebu for work. And because of the dominance of the Cebuano culture over the langyaw culture, the migrants tend to acculturate.

This I speak on the context of culture.

On economics, it would be fruitful for the national government to ALSO give utmost priority to non-Manila localities when it comes to economic growth. The end point is that it has to have sustainable development not just from Manila and its environs but also the "peripheries" or the localities outside Manila.

[bukid]

^^ yeah, even if they broadcast in tagalog that's not a problem. so long as they don't call it a "national" language. it's better that way. so they would have no reason to peddle tagalog as "nationalism". that was exactly why india don't want to call hindi a "national" language because when hindi is peddled as "nationalism", the rest who are non-hindi indian citizens becomes "unnationalistic" for being non-hindi or for promoting non-hindi language or culture at the national level. and that would be inequality in the eyes of the constitution. if i am correct, that is the reason why the U.S. don't have a "national" language. english is just a de-facto official.

[habagatcentral1]

^^ Which reminds me....It irks me when you do not speak "po" and "opo" it connotes disrespect and brand you Bisaya. Yun ang nakaka-irita. Well in fact, the Visayans themselves have ways in expressing respect to the elderly.

In our part in Ilonggo, the usual gentle accent is expressed even in a much gentler tone or adding up "choi" "chai" "manong (referring to kuyas)" "manang (referring to ates)" etc.

[mwg12a]

^^ To seek for equality is not envy. it is every citizen's right to seek equal recognition under the law because we are no slaves of anyone.

to seek the removal of a national language is to seek equality under the law. they may have shoved english down our throat but at least english is an international language. besides, i am not telling you to ban tagalog in school. we would just remove it as "national" language because more than 50% of the inhabitant of the philippines are not tagalog. again, i will give you india as an example they have no "national" language though 75% of the population are hindi. they only call it "official" language with english as " co-official. and yet the people are proud to be indians.

by the way, spanish wasn't shoved down our throat. people just learned it. that is why we end up with a real national language called "chabacano". i dont know if english was shoved down our throat. but one thing is clear, it helped us a lot to learn it than learning tagalog.

one more thing, "tagalog-centric governance" doesn't necessarily mean that the head of government are tagalog but its policies are PRO-tagalog. they have to please the people of manila and neighboring province (tagalog region) or else malakanyang will again witness another EDSA.


Well then the answer is not necessarily removing tagalog as national language, because changing it to the word "official" doesn't really change anything. The answer is that all regional languages should also be allowed and developed in the Philippine educational system and have it implemented in it's respective region.

We all knew that the recentment in tagalog language was brought about by people in the past and even in the future, because the bisaya people feel that the sit of the nation should have been Cebu because it is where Magellan landed, secondary is that there are more bisayan in terms of population but somehow when the independent Philippine constitution, those who made a study that alot of filipinos are already speaking tagalog so they considered tagalog as the national language, this happened that time probably because Manila is the center for trade and commerce more than anywhere in the Philippines and that the Spaniards set it up that way for some reason.

Just like what habagatt had mentioned, inspite that india has been calling "hindi" as an official langauge, they still use "hindi" anywhere in India, and mostly in media...So, there is not much difference there, they are still patriotic with their "hindi" language. As a matter of fact, American Hindi people even teach their children hindi even if they were born in the US and their parents were from all different parts of India, but when it comes to filipinos, we don't do that, whether you are bisaya or tagalog, we are so proud that our kids can't speak our native tongue just because they were born in the US. Now, what kind of mentality is that? It's not necessarily a crime and immoral but we lack patriotism and we don't embrace our heritage. We were an independent country after our freedom and I believe that the filipinos were born then, not during the spanish era because we were not a nation back then and Spanish were not taught to an average filipinos and that's right, in 300 years they ruled the chain of Island they started calling the Philippines, not even proper education was given.

What I mean by "english was shoved in our throats" is not necessarily be the american people but what you have been calling tagalog centric and Imperialist Manila, because it was mandated, they could of removed that back then, like I said, english was never even thought about to help us in our economic crisis, so, the same tagalog people are actually the same people shoving the english language in our throats, but why is it okay for us? Because it is something nicer in our eyes, very american and we are smitten by anything american, they sound nicer in movies when we watch them and now, we have all these call centers to call people in the US, we are even more smitten to the english language that we wanted to be able to talk and speak like americans and unless you can talk that way, you will not be able to work in call centers. That is just one of the little facts I'm observing aside from the fact that it helps us land a job in other countries.


When you say tagalog centric, it follows a whole broader spectrum not just language, because it also pertains the people, so, by saying that Manila is imperialist and tagalogs are all cocky and arrogant towards promdi's, tagalog centric governance falls hand in hand, it pertains not just the language. so basically, it boils down to hate towards the tagalogs. You may not have a direct hate towards tagalogs but it sure can ignite the issue when it comes to tagalogs.. that is why it is becoming more unfair and prejudicial when some started saying Tagalista and such because you are basically looking down on people, people saying it that way might not be so aware of it but it sums up to that, and that's what I meant in the past that filipinos can be prejudice, we just can't believe we are commiting prejudism because in media we only hear the white americans commiting the same crime, our maybe a bit more peaceful but it still boils down to the same prejudicial act one can commit against another human being that can spark hatred and recentment towards one another.

BTW, just a reminder, I think we need to bring this discussions back to english language topic, I think the whole idea of cebuano/bisaya thread is more on increase awareness of binisaya language and to those who wanted to learn and improve their cebuano language... Smiles and peace, no pun intended, for the above discussion. Just one of those real deep discussion about us as a filipino and it's languages. Thank you.

[mwg12a]

^^ Which reminds me....It irks me when you do not speak "po" and "opo" it connotes disrespect and brand you Bisaya. Yun ang nakaka-irita. Well in fact, the Visayans themselves have ways in expressing respect to the elderly.

In our part in Ilonggo, the usual gentle accent is expressed even in a much gentler tone or adding up "choi" "chai" "manong (referring to kuyas)" "manang (referring to ates)" etc.

Well, Philippines in general are patriarchal society, our parents always have "the last say" and they are still backwards or oldschool. We all look up to our parents too much and scared of them, If we speak our minds out to our parents, they would be shocked and can't take/handle it, the consider it as being insubordinate, the same in tagalog elderly, they get all hyped and huffy if someone younger doesn't speak to them the usual way, they call you disrespectful. Doesn't it that bisaya parents always have a "say" to their kids because they want things done by their kids "their way" or else, they will threaten to cut you off financial support if not, disown you, especially if they doesn't like the girl or boy their kids are dating? It's pretty much the same thing, only it's shows to us in different angles.

[flesh_is_weak]

what's wrong with wanting to learn and master english? (yes even choosing it over tagalog)

if we want to become competent in the global market, it is but right for us to know the language of the market, which is English...and i dont even suggest stopping there, by all means, we should also start learning Mandarin, Spanish etc. for the same reason...

Tagalog? nah, we could put it up for later, as you can see, we Bisayas have a lot of work to do concerning our own language, and we still have to learn more important foreign tongues after that

widespread use of Tagalog by the media should be enough education for us :lol:

[flesh_is_weak]

a sizeable portion of the State's resources is continually being used and a significant amount of regional heritage is slowly disappearing, thanks to the insistent use and propagation of Tagalog as a National Language...

if we ought to have a National Language, then it should be English, based on @bukid's argument that it is an international language. Why are languages set-up anyway? is it not for communication and the exchange of ideas? I believe that this 'exchange of ideas' could be facilitated better in English...Even if we were to one day (magically, i guess) end up with a separate Bisaya State, i would'nt lobby for Bisaya as a National Language, nurture it, yes it is but proper, but our national language should be something that we could use to communicate with the rest of the world...

National Identity? I see that we have more than enough cultural idiosyncracies--both the beautiful and the weird--to define our people...and when all else fails, our brown skin and uniquely filipino-features would vouch for us, and that is a mark far more indelible than any language :)

[mwg12a]

what's wrong with wanting to learn and master english? (yes even choosing it over tagalog)

if we want to become competent in the global market, it is but right for us to know the language of the market, which is English...and i dont even suggest stopping there, by all means, we should also start learning Mandarin, Spanish etc. for the same reason...

Tagalog? nah, we could put it up for later, as you can see, we Bisayas have a lot of work to do concerning our own language, and we still have to learn more important foreign tongues after that

widespread use of Tagalog by the media should be enough education for us :lol:



There is, you are turning back from your own heritage. Because, the repercussion of having english as the national language, is the death of all our native languages, you guys here alone said that other regions are losing their own identity because tagalog is being shoved in you guys throats which is really untrue, because we are failing to notice that the same time, english was being shoved in our throats by no less than our Imperialist Manila itself when they created the constitution as a separate nation, I'm not talking about the time we were having transitional governent, that is probably our constitution was written in spanish, because it was the transitional phase.


There is nothing in our history that would relate to us into being english,
Even india, they have english as a subsidiary official language, but everything is written in hindi and even their media they still use "hindi" and not english.

Let me ask you this same question. What is wrong with tagalog or bisaya as a national and official language, that we have to cover our identity with an english language and it is not enough for you that english should just remain as a secondary language instead of primary?

what's wrong with wanting to learn and master english? (yes even choosing it over tagalog)

if we want to become competent in the global market, it is but right for us to know the language of the market, which is English...and i dont even suggest stopping there, by all means, we should also start learning Mandarin, Spanish etc. for the same reason...

Tagalog? nah, we could put it up for later, as you can see, we Bisayas have a lot of work to do concerning our own language, and we still have to learn more important foreign tongues after that

widespread use of Tagalog by the media should be enough education for us :lol:

You can tap in the global market by not using english as our national language and just be secondary official language. Does Korea, Japan, India and even vietnam needs english to become a world power? China itself is tapping the world market and english is not their main language. Let's not just loook around asia, Belgium in europe, The Netherlands and Germany. They are all non english countries but they still tapping into the global market....


And yes, you can master english as a secondary language, it has been that way before, people from the older generations can speak fluent english better than the filipinos of today in general and mind you, those times after the war, they were just 7th grade graduates and their english is as g00d as the professionals of today. I will give credit my great grand mother to that, she can attest as a living example to that, she is pushing towards 90 or over 90, she is very fluent in written and spoken english, it would even put a master's degree holder to shame...


And yes, there is a national identity and regionalistic identies in us. It should all be given importance, and you guys are right, not just tagalog. That is the reason why that if worse comes to worst, I would accept bisaya as my national language with pride. I want our filipino students to be competitive in english because i know no matter what the tagalog in me can not be altered, but then, it's not only the english language we can progress economically. If we have something we can export, like compete with electronics, auto, or something unique that other countries can't replicate not just our manpower, it will mean progress to our country. We are just so focused in english, even our government officials because it will land us a job overseas. Are we only good to be an employer and not an employee? Are we only as good as domestic helpers, laborer, drivers, factory workers, even mail order brides because our english is good and they can communicate with us better than other people from different countries? Are we only good as nurses employed by foreign owners and we are like pretty much like slaves?? I know I maybe exaggerating these and I know these are all noble jobs that are all respectable. But please, can't we make ourselves much better than that? The best there is? Because, come to think of it, many people all over the world already knew inspite of their praises and respect, they really knew we are escaping poverty in our country... I just wish there is something can do to make ourselves better... Be achiever than just a follower... And having the english language as our national language would automatically bring progress to our country.

I can agree with bukid and perhaps habagat/bernie with changing the word official on tagalog. If it remained to be Filipino as aa national, it should be equally respected and be given equal importance. I also believe and would be advocating the preservation of all our native languages because, it is part of us. An awareness about all other regional cultures and languages should be an utmost important to all of us, because we need it to bind us together, and in lieu to that, prejudism and respect to regionalistic cultures and as a human being itself should be widely promoted so we can avoid conflict between regions and promote more unity. I think that is what we are lacking mostly.

[bukid]

Well then the answer is not necessarily removing tagalog as national language, because changing it to the word "official" doesn't really change anything. The answer is that all regional languages should also be allowed and developed in the Philippine educational system and have it implemented in it's respective region.

it really change something. it change the mindset that tagalog is nationalism while non-tagalog is regionalism. that's the core issue why we should just call it "official" and not "national". but it's not just the mindset, it's the propaganda by those advocating the advancement and promotion of tagalog that tagalog is "nationalism". so by retaining it as "official" and removing it as "national" we also remove the propaganda that tagalog is "nationalism".

so that they promote tagalog as "officialism" but never as "nationalism". kahit gawin pa nila yan hanggang magsawa sila but never will they now call it "nationalism".

if you only know our culture. one word and one title can really change a lot of things.

[habagatcentral1]

Perhaps from a viewpoint of education, we can still change that mindset of the Filipino.

Different languages as we are, we still have the connotation and idea and way of respecting elders. That serves an answer for the "po-opo imperialism" argument.

Again, change is not bad for nationalism. The trend nowadays in Philippine historiography is going local. That means, giving more voice to the regions as the Manila-centric historiography is already saturated and overrated.

Our profs in UP has never subjugated themselves under the "Diliman Imperialism" as what some other people say but instead was made as centers for research on local cultures. What are we and where do we come from, if we are to view it in a Tagalog-centric history, the quest and the thirst of knowledge is not enough, therefore giving way to local history and anthropology...Diliman is not imposing that "Filipino as Tagalog" but "Filipino for the Filipinos."

Look at the once Greek city-states, they were seperated but in unison they defeated Persia. :D

Anyway, what I'm trying to say is that its not too late to change the mindset of the people about nationalism. What about "nationalism" is defined as the love for country and respect for each other differences and cultures instead?

[flesh_is_weak]

i did say that we should not stop with English only, but be more competitive and learn as much foreign languages as we can. if it would remove the feeling of being 'second-class citizens' from non-Tagalogs, then i dont see anything wrong with installing a foreign language to be our official language in lieu of Tagalog...in the end of the day, nothing's lost...and the gains would be big, since we could do business better with the rest of the world in a language (not necessaily English) that is more widely used than our local tongues...even Koreans are seeing the importance of this, and are flocking to our country by the numbers to study English...

but that doesnt stop there, with my proposal of making learning at least one foreign language compulsory in secondary school or maybe in college, we can have a better edge over those countries who insist only in using their own language...

there would be no abandoning our national heritage either, or a ban on Tagalog...we'll simply set things right...put Tagalog into it's proper place as just another one of the Filipino tongues that should not be enforced upon anyone, and together with the other languages and dialects that make up a phletora of tongues in our islands, it is to be used and developed in areas where it is endemic

then, like @bernie's greek city-states, we could 'defeat' whatever nation that stands against us

* * *

what's so bad about English anyway? for me, it's no longer just the white invader's language, but a language of the world...it breaks barriers and facilitates the smooth flow of knowledge and ideas the world over... (although @bernie's Esperanto could be a better substitute)

[mwg12a]

Perhaps from a viewpoint of education, we can still change that mindset of the Filipino.

Different languages as we are, we still have the connotation and idea and way of respecting elders. That serves an answer for the "po-opo imperialism" argument.

Again, change is not bad for nationalism. The trend nowadays in Philippine historiography is going local. That means, giving more voice to the regions as the Manila-centric historiography is already saturated and overrated.

Our profs in UP has never subjugated themselves under the "Diliman Imperialism" as what some other people say but instead was made as centers for research on local cultures. What are we and where do we come from, if we are to view it in a Tagalog-centric history, the quest and the thirst of knowledge is not enough, therefore giving way to local history and anthropology...Diliman is not imposing that "Filipino as Tagalog" but "Filipino for the Filipinos."

Look at the once Greek city-states, they were seperated but in unison they defeated Persia. :D

Anyway, what I'm trying to say is that its not too late to change the mindset of the people about nationalism. What about "nationalism" is defined as the love for country and respect for each other differences and cultures instead?


Exactly, it does not define only as the language but love for one's country, respect to it's constitution (although, I know half of us don't really give shit about it but then once people grow into maturity, it will mean alot)

[mwg12a]

i did say that we should not stop with English only, but be more competitive and learn as much foreign languages as we can. if it would remove the feeling of being 'second-class citizens' from non-Tagalogs, then i dont see anything wrong with installing a foreign language to be our official language in lieu of Tagalog...in the end of the day, nothing's lost...and the gains would be big, since we could do business better with the rest of the world in a language (not necessaily English) that is more widely used than our local tongues...even Koreans are seeing the importance of this, and are flocking to our country by the numbers to study English...

but that doesnt stop there, with my proposal of making learning at least one foreign language compulsory in secondary school or maybe in college, we can have a better edge over those countries who insist only in using their own language...

there would be no abandoning our national heritage either, or a ban on Tagalog...we'll simply set things right...put Tagalog into it's proper place as just another one of the Filipino tongues that should not be enforced upon anyone, and together with the other languages and dialects that make up a phletora of tongues in our islands, it is to be used and developed in areas where it is endemic

then, like @bernie's greek city-states, we could 'defeat' whatever nation that stands against us

* * *

what's so bad about English anyway? for me, it's no longer just the white invader's language, but a language of the world...it breaks barriers and facilitates the smooth flow of knowledge and ideas the world over... (although @bernie's Esperanto could be a better substitute)

I thought you guys are complaining about having too many languages being taught in school because it impedes alot of the filipino student's learning experience? Why add korean, Japanese, chinese or spanish as compulsary? Would those language would take most of your time instead of learning what profession you will be going to? An added burden. English is already the co-official language in the Philippines, what else do we need? We already mastered the english language although it is a bit different than how the brits, aussies and north american are expressing their english language than us. The koreans who were flucking in the Philippines soil came from a rich country in asia even before their awareness in english, it didn't stop them from their own progress even in the past, the people were just trying to catch up with the hype of the world for personal gains, just as one filipino I know who worked in UAE mentioned that the locals there are trying to learn english because, to them, it's a social status. The same with the koreans, but more of a fad rather than just social status.

The importance of our own language to be the national or main official language serves as our identity to help bind us together but some of us see it differently just because their native regional language wasn't chosen as the national language. What makes the non tagalog feel like a second class citizen is the mockery from the media on how promdi's are portrayed, not really the language because our native regional languages trive and dominate each regions we are in. If a foreign language is instituted as the main official language, chances are, it would be like you guys were telling us in another thread, that there are youths in your region who speaks more the official language which happen to be tagalog than their native languages, can't we see that as happening in the future because the kids would prefer more to communicate in english even in their own regions not just intra-region and the repercusion of these is what? s "killing our own regional languages, heritage and identity... because? we are going to be english. We keep on citing india as an example, they do have "hindi" and is being shoved in their own throats instead of english, but guess what? If they are in another country like the US, they teach their kids the same "hindi" language. US? We don't do that.. filipino parents would intentionally not teach their kids their native language because it's a pride for them that when they take their kids to the Philippines, they sound so american and this is not only happening in one region, everywhere in the Philippines too. Do we bother to even wonder why????? And yet we envy vietnam and india for surpassing the Philippines in terms of progress when we the filipinos speaks and pronounce better english than them. And they do not fight about the national or official language as bad as us filipinos...

The same question I wil throw to you? What's bad about our own languages that we can't honor any of it to be the official language? And again, I will repeat this, the Imperial Manila shoved the english language in our throats either, not just the americans, just that Cory a chinese kapangpangan spoiled it and made the filipinos lagged behind with the english language skills and math... Can't tagalog or bisaya serve the same purpose if it is meant to facilitate communication and unity amongst us? Is any of our languages that worse and ugly? We will never have any language barriers from the whole world because using english as a secondary language already has helped us connect to the world and it served its purpose inspite of that. The barrier is if we will be mistreated or be treated indifferently and be looked down upon as if we are all DH or poor people scaping hunger from our own country.

We can look bernie's good example about us filipinos. Manila folks look down on people who are from outside Manila, the same thing with cebuanos looking down bohololanos and neighboring provinces. Here alone, a guy from bacolod insulted me because once he said " I was just a tagalog and I am not worth anything.." (that's in private, I was just sharing it for the sake of discussion) We as filipinos tend to look down on people lower than us. Worse is, we look down on each other equally. This is really were our problems lies, we all fight one another, this is really what hamper our progress, aside from the same scenarios we see with our policians. I bet even if we have our own separate state, those states who separated would have their own little fights towards another region, so things wil be repeated all over again in each region. It just surprise me what kind of mentality does filipinos has... such a shame if you really ask my opinion.

[red_jasper]

...We keep on citing india as an example, they do have "hindi" and is being shoved in their own throats instead of english, but guess what? If they are in another country like the US, they teach their kids the same "hindi" language. US? We don't do that.. filipino parents would intentionally not teach their kids their native language because it's a pride for them that when they take their kids to the Philippines, they sound so american and this is not only happening in one region, everywhere in the Philippines too...

^^ I have to comment on this because not all Pinoy parents are like that...

i personally know one Filipina mother who feels very proud because her Caucasian-looking (from a foreigner father) daughter speaks to us in fluent Bisaya despite her having been born and raised in another country.

i believe this act of giving importance to our language heritage is not an isolated instance among other Filipino families wherever they may be in the world :cheers2:

We as filipinos tend to look down on people lower than us. Worse is, we look down on each other equally. This is really were our problems lies, we all fight one another, this is really what hamper our progress, aside from the same scenarios we see with our policians.

^^the problem with general statements is... they are not always proven true :) the fact that Cebuano-speaking Filipinos want to raise the Cebuano dialect to a higher level than where it's at at present is not necessarily an act of "looking down" on other Filipino dialects or of "fighting" with non-Cebuano speaking Pinoys. :ohno:

[flesh_is_weak]

oh crap, so much for lengthy discourse...let me get straight to my point...

I'd rather eat English than learn Tagalog...why? because I can't stomach this Tagalog-centrism that comes with Filipino Nationalism...

* * *

although @mwg, perhaps I understand how you feel, being miles away from the country, you tend to get homesick and would cling to anything Filipino...even when I took a vacation once out of the country for a few weeks, I'd get so homesick that I would feel so glad to see another Filipino :lol:

but here back home, things are different, we Filipinos arent exactly a close-knit nation...but i'm cool with that, perhaps we're intended to be this way...ever wonder why we're made up of 7K+ islands?

[flesh_is_weak]

ato na ning undangan uy...murag dili gyud ni kasabot sa @mwg sa Bisaya Nationalism...

* * *

pero dili baya ko makig-away ug tawo tungod kay tagalog siya, daghan man ko ug tagalog na amigo ug amiga, dili man pud ethnicitiy akong basehan sa pagpili ug friends...

* * *

lain na pud atong topic...

ganiha, didto ko ug Starbucks Northwing kay nang-apply ko pagka-part-time store attendant...while ga-fill-up ko sa application form didto sa kilid, naay laki na pa-choy kaayo--klaro baya kaayong bayot--na kanang yuppie bitaw na hilason...nya ako, walay **** sa akong isul-ob, ga-maong ra baya ug t-shirt na ukay-ukay...hilas kaayo ug tinan-awan ang buang, murag naka-minos na ngano naa ko didto sa starbucks na yagit man kaayo ko...

pasalamat siya buotan ko...sa tinuod baya, gwapo lang siya tan-awon tungod sa iyang gisul-ob, ug tungod tingali sa papaya soap ug unsa pang mga imbensyon ni vicky bello na iyang gihumol sa iyang lawas...hamis tuod siya ug nawong, pislat baya kaayo ug ilong...salbahis pa lang lagi kong pagkatawhana ako gyud tong gi-ingnan: "tan-aw man ka? naka-minos ka na? uy, sa tinuod lang, gwapo ka tan-awon tungod sa imong get-up, pero mas gwapo pa intawn ko nimo, ka-common anang imong nawong, magpunit ko ug istambay didto sa colon nya akong ipa-saloon, nah, parehas ra gyud mo ug nawong!"

[habagatcentral1]

Maayo na ni...at least there is no and hopefully there would never have any case of genocide here in Pinas.

[Animo]

This was a translation of Les Philippines/ 1846 by J. Mallat.

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3101/2653973166_b90bdda049_o.jpg

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3063/2653148683_19f7060891_o.jpg

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3193/2653973260_dd887f114e_o.jpg

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3192/2653973328_4bd370e3e3_o.jpg

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3248/2653148807_582c84b74f_o.jpg

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3225/2653148859_5032298255_o.jpg

---

Sa aco, walay problema cung ingani ang atong ortografia. :lol: But seriously when I was skimming on the pages I read a lot of words that are archaic and are no longer heard. Also, some words that I didn't know were already part of the Cebuano language. We could still bring those back and use them instead of having to rely on Tagalog or English loan words.

[mwg12a]

oh crap, so much for lengthy discourse...let me get straight to my point...

I'd rather eat English than learn Tagalog...why? because I can't stomach this Tagalog-centrism that comes with Filipino Nationalism...

* * *

although @mwg, perhaps I understand how you feel, being miles away from the country, you tend to get homesick and would cling to anything Filipino...even when I took a vacation once out of the country for a few weeks, I'd get so homesick that I would feel so glad to see another Filipino :lol:

but here back home, things are different, we Filipinos arent exactly a close-knit nation...but i'm cool with that, perhaps we're intended to be this way...ever wonder why we're made up of 7K+ islands?


I don't think it's homesickness at all, it's more of appreciating what I am and my roots comparing to when I was younger. I admit, there are things in some filipino ways that I find off, but there are many things I have learn to appreciate more and understand.


Nationalism doesn't really just stop in the language itself. It's the cultural heritage , custom and traditions. Tagalog is just a portion of it because we all knew that if a filipino does not speak tagalog like some of our elderly non tagalog, they are still love their filipino ways. I firmly believe that if the bisaya language was made as the national language and with the attitudes we have right now, it will also give birth to "bisaya-ism" but let's all face it, and I am not saying it's flesh or bukid but some others in general. The main reason for all these "disapproval" for the tagalog language is a combination of how Manilenos portraying people outside of the Manila and since "tagalog" was elected to be the national language in Manila, it has somehow cost resentments amongst our bisaya brother's and sisters because come to think of it, the history all started in the island of Cebu.

I mentioned bisaya'ism because I myself can feel that the bisayas around me are somewhat impossing to me the language even in some of my inlaws family members although I have not making it a big deal and welcome the idea of learning bisaya because I believe that in doing so, it will cut the barrier that is subconsciously brewing between us all. Why do I know these, because alot of times, I would notice how my inlaw's inlaws and even my inlaws themselves react to certain things I say. They do not confront me because I believe they give the benefit of the doubt that I didnt' really mean the way they think I was trying to say which is really nice of them, but somehow, I know and felt it already is why I was always cautious with what I say. But I know for a fact, I was told I have to speak to them in bisaya or if not atleast understand it so they don't have to speak in tagalog to me as much as possible, I believe their reason is they are having hard time speaking tagalog, so i readily oblige because it is not really that hard to understand bisaya when they all talk to me, (i've noticed these to those who hasn't really lived in Manila but visit, but those who actually have lived in Manila is abit more linient, although I find the cebuanos in cebu (business establishments mostly) more accomodating when they know I can speak bisaya fluently.


One more question flesh. What about the bisayan language? Would you compromise the bisayan language in favor of the english language? I don't think you will be thrown in jail if you will not speak tagalog really... I never knew of any case that a bisaya was thrown in jail for not speaking the language and insist speaking in bisaya to a tagalog. I'm sure if the bisaya language is the national language, you guys would also tell the non bisaya to speak tagalog because it's the national language. I think when one say that to a person, they don't necessarily mean "lose your identity" but just for the sake of better communication otherwise if you know the person is actually staying on your area, you can tell them they do need to speak your language just like how the old saying goes "do as the roman's do" it's just proper and polite...

and btw, yes, it's ones prerogative if he or she doesn't want to speak any other filipino dialects or language and it should be respected.

[mwg12a]

ato na ning undangan uy...murag dili gyud ni kasabot sa @mwg sa Bisaya Nationalism...

* * *

pero dili baya ko makig-away ug tawo tungod kay tagalog siya, daghan man ko ug tagalog na amigo ug amiga, dili man pud ethnicitiy akong basehan sa pagpili ug friends...

* * *

lain na pud atong topic...

ganiha, didto ko ug Starbucks Northwing kay nang-apply ko pagka-part-time store attendant...while ga-fill-up ko sa application form didto sa kilid, naay laki na pa-choy kaayo--klaro baya kaayong bayot--na kanang yuppie bitaw na hilason...nya ako, walay **** sa akong isul-ob, ga-maong ra baya ug t-shirt na ukay-ukay...hilas kaayo ug tinan-awan ang buang, murag naka-minos na ngano naa ko didto sa starbucks na yagit man kaayo ko...

pasalamat siya buotan ko...sa tinuod baya, gwapo lang siya tan-awon tungod sa iyang gisul-ob, ug tungod tingali sa papaya soap ug unsa pang mga imbensyon ni vicky bello na iyang gihumol sa iyang lawas...hamis tuod siya ug nawong, pislat baya kaayo ug ilong...salbahis pa lang lagi kong pagkatawhana ako gyud tong gi-ingnan: "tan-aw man ka? naka-minos ka na? uy, sa tinuod lang, gwapo ka tan-awon tungod sa imong get-up, pero mas gwapo pa intawn ko nimo, ka-common anang imong nawong, magpunit ko ug istambay didto sa colon nya akong ipa-saloon, nah, parehas ra gyud mo ug nawong!"

makasabot man ko bai.

I mean I'm not arguing or anything, I'm sorry if you are getting annoyed by the discussion but that's my only thing, I don't want any of the filipino languages and dialect to disappear.

Star buck colon ka muapply part time dong? Dili mo ako patyon ra dong pag natanggap ka part time? Walang pesticide sa cafe ko ha??LMAO

pislat ba ang ilong mo o siya?? You dig handsome dude ha??

Wag ka naman magalit sa akin bai. Mabaiit naman ako...

[flesh_is_weak]

^^wala man SB sa colon, didto sa SM...gisapot lang ko atong tawo didto sa SB na naka-atbang nako ug lingkod kay hilas kaayo mo-tan-aw...hehehe...

* * *

re: bisaya:

ana gyud mi, murag imprinted na man gud sa among psyche na naay gamay na pagdumot sa mga tagalog as a group...glad that you understand

[habagatcentral1]

This was a translation of Les Philippines/ 1846 by J. Mallat.

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3101/2653973166_b90bdda049_o.jpg

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3063/2653148683_19f7060891_o.jpg

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3193/2653973260_dd887f114e_o.jpg

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3192/2653973328_4bd370e3e3_o.jpg

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3248/2653148807_582c84b74f_o.jpg

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3225/2653148859_5032298255_o.jpg

---

Sa aco, walay problema cung ingani ang atong ortografia. :lol: But seriously when I was skimming on the pages I read a lot of words that are archaic and are no longer heard. Also, some words that I didn't know were already part of the Cebuano language. We could still bring those back and use them instead of having to rely on Tagalog or English loan words.

I noticed that the "Visayan" phrases by Malliat there are Archaic Hiligaynon (Ilonggo).


Examples from the post of Animo:


naga-ampo ako sa imo kag naga-pani.
Nag-ampo ko kanimo og (kalimot ko unsa ni, hehe!!)
mag-hipos ka sing maayo.
Paghilum ka
nga-a guinahambala ako sing tagalog?
Nganu gisultihan ako og tagawg?
buot ka mamahaw?
Ganahan ka mamahaw?(correct ba?)
matam-is nga halambalun kag matahum.
matam-is nga (lingwahe) og maanyag.
Yara sa imo sa walo ka leksyon kag basahon sing madali kag duha ka pulo kag hibaluan sing maayo maski (biskan) ano nga libro kag tulungan (buligan) sing maayo sang diksyonaryo
Naa kanimo sa walo ka leksyon og basahon nga paspas og duha ka pulo og inga og maayo bisag unsa nga libro og tabangan (sing) maayo og diksyonaryo.


^^ The ones in green are my rough translation into Cebuano. Plese correct me if I'm wrong.

Could it be that during the haydays of textile industry in Iloilo (late 18th to early 19th century) Hiligaynon was "Bisaya" or did Malliat assumed that Hiligaynon is being spoken all throughout the islands of the Visayas and hasn't been to Cebu or any part of Central and Eastern Visayas?

[mwg12a]

^^wala man SB sa colon, didto sa SM...gisapot lang ko atong tawo didto sa SB na naka-atbang nako ug lingkod kay hilas kaayo mo-tan-aw...hehehe...

* * *

re: bisaya:

ana gyud mi, murag imprinted na man gud sa among psyche na naay gamay na pagdumot sa mga tagalog as a group...glad that you understand

basin giganahan sa imo. Di ba nimo type-sad? maayo kun imong gi-flirt'an para mauyab nimo..LOL

[tigidig14]

This was a translation of Les Philippines/ 1846 by J. Mallat.

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3101/2653973166_b90bdda049_o.jpg

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3063/2653148683_19f7060891_o.jpg

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3193/2653973260_dd887f114e_o.jpg

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3192/2653973328_4bd370e3e3_o.jpg

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3248/2653148807_582c84b74f_o.jpg

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3225/2653148859_5032298255_o.jpg

---



cacatawa ito!

[bukid]

This was a translation of Les Philippines/ 1846 by J. Mallat.

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3101/2653973166_b90bdda049_o.jpg

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3063/2653148683_19f7060891_o.jpg

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3193/2653973260_dd887f114e_o.jpg

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3192/2653973328_4bd370e3e3_o.jpg

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3248/2653148807_582c84b74f_o.jpg

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3225/2653148859_5032298255_o.jpg

---

Sa aco, walay problema cung ingani ang atong ortografia. :lol: But seriously when I was skimming on the pages I read a lot of words that are archaic and are no longer heard. Also, some words that I didn't know were already part of the Cebuano language. We could still bring those back and use them instead of having to rely on Tagalog or English loan words.

hiligaynon man diay nang bisayaa. pero kalaladlawan lagi a. parehas man sa "maayo guihapon caluyi sa dios." ano man gani ang "caluyi"? cag yara pa sya "maayo nga caby sa imo" indi gani "caby", "gaby" man sina.

[habagatcentral1]

hiligaynon man diay nang bisayaa. pero kalaladlawan lagi a. parehas man sa "maayo guihapon caluyi sa dios." ano man gani ang "caluyi"? cag yara pa sya "maayo nga caby sa imo" indi gani "caby", "gaby" man sina.

Maayo gihapon, kaluy-i/on (ka) sa(ng) Dios. (maau ghpn, kluy-n k sg Dios)

Maayo nga (basin kabay) sa imo or Maayong gab-i sa imo. (txt: maau gb-i cmu)

[bukid]

^^ daw quinachila man ang pagkahambal nya sang hiligaynon nya.

[habagatcentral1]

^^ daw quinachila man ang pagkahambal nya sang hiligaynon nya.

Actually, we still speak the same way..more for the old people.

Daw Kinatsila mang ang pagkahambal sang Hiligaynon nya.

Tawag gani namon sa mga Espanyol ukon sang tyempo sang kolonisasyon: Katsila/Kachila imbes nga Kastila.

[bukid]

^^ amo man dyapon di sa amon. katsila/kachila man tawag namon sa mga espanyol.

[red_jasper]

Came across the following news article on the PIA (http://www.pia.gov.ph/?m=12&r=&y=&mo=&fi=p080710.htm&no=80) site:

Hiligaynon News: Gobyerno prayoridad ang research and development para mag-umwad ang ekonomiya

Manila (10 July) -- Si Presidente Gloria Macapagal-Arroyo nagsiling nga sa pagpalapnag ("pagpalambo" ?)sang engineering research and development (R&D) ang gobyerno nag-andam sang balor tres bilyones pesos nga special nga pondo sa pagpanalawsaw kag pag-umwad sang teknolohiya sa sulod sang 2007 hasta 2010, upod ang Science and Technology Complex sa University of the Philippines. Para padayon nga mapalapnag ang mga aktibidades sa engineering R&D sa bug-os nga nasyon para mabag-o ang tanan nga aspeto sini.

Kinahanglan ang modernisasyon nga nakabase sa Medium Term Plan, nga madamo sang R&D nga kinahanglan ang katawhan para maabot sang aton nasyon ang First World sa sulod sang bente ka tuig. Sang nagligad ("miagi"?) nga tuig ang science and technology consortium nga ginapamunuan sang UP, nagatanyag sang eskolarship sa idalum ("ilawom"?) sang R&D development program para sa masters kag doctoral degrees sa science kag engineering.

Hambal ni presidente nga sa 2008 general appropriation ang DOST nakabaton sang daku nga pagtaas sang budget nga may 51% ang pagtaas para buligan ang programa nga R&D sa pagkaon, agrikultura, enerhiya, maayong panglawas, information kag communication technology, kag ang pag-amlig sang palibot , upod na ang disaster prevention.

Dugang pa ni presidente nga ang una nga tatlo ka prayoridad amo ang ekonomiya, edukasyon, kag environment. Dugang pa ang pagsolbar sang problema kada adlaw ilabi na sa enerhiya kag pagkaon sa kada lamesa sang mga imol nga Pilipino.

^^ di man ko kahibawo ug Hiligaynon pero nakuha nako ang buot ipasabot sa artikulo. pero ang mga pulong nga asul medyo naglisod ko ug hubad :D unta naay mohubad aron makat-on sab ko ug gamay'ng Hiligaynon...

salamat :)

[habagatcentral1]

b'z2;22447758"]Came across the following news article on the PIA (http://www.pia.gov.ph/?m=12&r=&y=&mo=&fi=p080710.htm&no=80) site:
^^ di man ko kahibawo ug Hiligaynon pero nakuha nako ang buot ipasabot sa artikulo. pero ang mga pulong nga asul medyo naglisod ko ug hubad :D unta naay mohubad aron makat-on sab ko ug gamay'ng Hiligaynon...

salamat :)

I'll translate it to rough Tagalog and Cebuano na lang:


nagsiling = nagsabi = matud/niingon
pagpanalawsaw = (masyadong malalim to, dunno na)
palapnag (maybe its palapta) - ipagkalat (?)
upod = kasama = kuyog
nagligad = nagdaan = miagi
hambal = sabi = ingon
pag-amlig = pag-ingat = (?)
idalum = ilalim = ilawum
imol = mahirap = pobre

[Il Tenore]

maayong gabii mga bisaya nakong mga igsuon! murag naay gubot nahitabo diri aH!unsa man ang gihisgot diri?

[habagatcentral1]

maayong gabii mga bisaya nakong mga igsuon! murag naay gubot nahitabo diri aH!unsa man ang gihisgot diri?

Wala'y gubot diri, intelectuall orgy ra. :lol: :lol:
Nah, we're just discussing our different perspectives but no personal bashings whatsoever. So ayaw kabalaka bai. :)

[bukid]

I'll translate it to rough Tagalog and Cebuano na lang:


nagsiling = nagsabi = matud/niingon
pagpanalawsaw = (masyadong malalim to, dunno na)
palapnag (maybe its palapta) - ipagkalat (?)
upod = kasama = kuyog
nagligad = nagdaan = miagi
hambal = sabi = ingon
pag-amlig = pag-ingat = (?)
idalum = ilalim = ilawum
imol = mahirap = pobre



panalawsaw = research

palapnag = ipagkalat

pag-amlig = pag-amping

[habagatcentral1]

^^ We use "pag-halong" more often than "pag-amlig". In English it still means "take care" or "taking care" but they have different connotations.

Paghalong means "be careful" or shooing away from trouble.
Pag-amlig or pag-tatap is to "caring" or tender loving care.

[bukid]

^^ yeah correct, that is why we often say "halong ka da, to"

[habagatcentral1]

^^ yeah correct, that is why we often say "halong ka da, to"
Its like pagpalangga and gugma is of two different degrees of the English word "love," quite similar to Greeks "agape", "philio", "eros". :)

[bukid]

^^ yes, they are synonyms. like hambal and siling are both "say".

[habagatcentral1]

^^ Yup.
Pagpalangga and Paghigugma are two different degrees of love in the Visayan language. :D

[bukid]

^^ i think one is a more informal and casual way of saying "love", the other is the more formal way much like "je vous aime" (gihigugma ta ka) and "je t'aime" (palangga ta ka) is casual and usually spoken to your uyab.

[red_jasper]

^^ @habagat & @bukid: salamat sa paghubad

"halong ka da to" = (pag)ayo-ayo bai (???) :D

[bukid]

^^ "halong ka da, to" = "amping ka diha, bai!" :)

kung manginahanglan ka ug tabang sa ilonggo ug waray, ayaw lang kaikog, post lang diri kay ato hubaron aron makakat-on pud ka.

[habagatcentral1]

Actually I was thinking of merging the La Lengua Panayana thread with this existing thread in order to have exchanges about the Visayan languages in a much wider perspective.

[red_jasper]

^^ "halong ka da, to" = "amping ka diha, bai!" :)

kung manginahanglan ka ug tabang sa ilonggo ug waray, ayaw lang kaikog, post lang diri kay ato hubaron aron makakat-on pud ka.

^^ will do... salamat :cheers2:

[habagatcentral1]

Sa pagbangon sang syudad
‘MAS MATAHUM NGA ILOILO’ – TREÑAS


Ni Glenda Sologastoa

Syudad sang ILOILO – “Mas matahum nga syudad.” Bilang amay sang Syudad sang Iloilo, ini ang positibo nga pananan-awan ni Mayor Jerry P. Treñas sa pagbangon sang syudad mga duha ka semana makaligad ang kahalitan sang bagyo Frank.

“We have two years to go to reconstruct everything. Kon matabo mas magatahum pa ang syudad,” napun-an sang paglaum nga pahayag ni Treñas kahapon.

Pila sa mga ginapunto diri ni Treñas amo nga sa nagakaigo nga tinion mahatagan na sang mga pamalay ang informal settlers, mahatagan sang negosyo ang mga nabiktima sang bagyo kaangay sang mga manugbaligya paagi sa mga microfinance agency, kag ma-improbar sang maayo ang mga pasilidades sa syudad kag iban pa.

“While doing the relief operation, ang rehabilitation plan ginapreparar na. Positive kita dapat. We have to look not at our present situation but on what we can do for the future,’ pabutyag ni Treñas.

Ginakabig man ni Treñas kag wala ginadula ang posibilidad nga basi blessings in disguise ang nagluntad nga unos sa syudad rason nga positibo ini nga nagapanguna sa pag-atubang sang tanan para sa pagbangon sang Iloilo.

Sa karon, apisar sang masobra na duha ka semana nga nagwaswas ang bagyo diri, padayon sa gihapon ang pag-inabot sang mga bulig para sa syudad gikan sa iban nga mga syudad, organisasyon (pribado kag pampubliko) kag iban pa gid nga mga ahensya.

Samtang, ang bantog nga Microsoft owner nga si Bill Gates ang naghatag man sang iya bulig sa tanan nga mga biktima sang bagyo Frank nga kapin 500,000 US dollar sa diin ginakabig ini ni Treñas nga isa ka daku nga bulig para sa mga biktima sa bilog nga Kabisay-an Nakatungdan./H

Here's a challenge for Cebuano speakers or Waray speakers.
Have this translated into Cebuano or Waray the best possible way you can...Even one paragraph would be enough. :D Its already in Ilonggo-English popular language already.

Lets see how easy or difficult it is to learn different Visayan languages and how they are similar or contrast with each other. :)

[Il Tenore]

Wala'y gubot diri, intelectuall orgy ra. :lol: :lol:
Nah, we're just discussing our different perspectives but no personal bashings whatsoever. So ayaw kabalaka bai. :)
ok ra uY! kapoy man pud basa sa mga pinulongang asa na padulong..hehe!!

[bukid]

^^ musta naman ka, dong? dugay man ka wa makit-i diri. :)

[Wind Shear]

Sa pagbangon sang syudad
‘MAS MATAHUM NGA ILOILO’ – TREÑAS

Sa pagbangon sa dakbayan
"MAS NINDOT NGA ILOILO"

Ni Glenda Sologastoa

Syudad sang ILOILO – “Mas matahum nga syudad.” Bilang amay sang Syudad sang Iloilo, ini ang positibo nga pananan-awan ni Mayor Jerry P. Treñas sa pagbangon sang syudad mga duha ka semana makaligad ang kahalitan sang bagyo Frank.

Dakbayan sa Iloilo - "Mas nindot nga dakbayan.", mao nga saad sa Dakbayan sa Iloilo, nga positibo nga panan-aw ni Mayor Jerry P. Treñas sa pagbagon sa dakbayan duha ka semana nilabay sa Bagyong Frank.

“We have two years to go to reconstruct everything. Kon matabo mas magatahum pa ang syudad,” napun-an sang paglaum nga pahayag ni Treñas kahapon.


"We have two years to go to reconstruct everything. Kon mahitabo man, mas maninto pa ang dakbayan" matud pa ni Treñas kagahapon dala sa taas nga paglaum.

Pila sa mga ginapunto diri ni Treñas amo nga sa nagakaigo nga tinion mahatagan na sang mga pamalay ang informal settlers, mahatagan sang negosyo ang mga nabiktima sang bagyo kaangay sang mga manugbaligya paagi sa mga microfinance agency, kag ma-improbar sang maayo ang mga pasilidades sa syudad kag iban pa.

Pilipa sa mga ginapunto ni Treñas, mahatagan ug panimalay sa mga informal settlers, mahatagan ug negosyo ang mga biktima sa bagyo nga mamaligya pinaagi sa microfinance agency, ug ma-improbar sa mas maayong pasilidad sa dakbayan ug uban pa.

“While doing the relief operation, ang rehabilitation plan ginapreparar na. Positive kita dapat. We have to look not at our present situation but on what we can do for the future,’ pabutyag ni Treñas.

“While doing the relief operation, ang rehabilitation plan giandam na. Positive kita dapat. We have to look not at our present situation but on what we can do for the future,’ matud ni Treñas.

Ginakabig man ni Treñas kag wala ginadula ang posibilidad nga basi blessings in disguise ang nagluntad nga unos sa syudad rason nga positibo ini nga nagapanguna sa pag-atubang sang tanan para sa pagbangon sang Iloilo.

naglibog pa ko diri... am confused on this part... nalito ako dito...

Sa karon, apisar sang masobra na duha ka semana nga nagwaswas ang bagyo diri, padayon sa gihapon ang pag-inabot sang mga bulig para sa syudad gikan sa iban nga mga syudad, organisasyon (pribado kag pampubliko) kag iban pa gid nga mga ahensya.

Sa karon, nilabay na ang duha ka semana nga bagyo, padayon gihapon ang pag-abot sa mga tabang alang sa dakbayan gikan sa ubang dakbayan, kapunongan (pribado ug publiko) ug uban pang ahensya.

Samtang, ang bantog nga Microsoft owner nga si Bill Gates ang naghatag man sang iya bulig sa tanan nga mga biktima sang bagyo Frank nga kapin 500,000 US dollar sa diin ginakabig ini ni Treñas nga isa ka daku nga bulig para sa mga biktima sa bilog nga Kabisay-an Nakatungdan./H

Samtang, ang bantugan nga tag-iya sa Microsoft nga si Bill Gates nihatag man sa ug tabang sa tanang biktima sa Bagyo Frank nga kapin 500,00 US dollars nga matud pa ni Treñas nga usa ka dako nga tabang alang sa mga biktima sa tibuok Kasadpang Kabisaya-an.

[Animo]

Ginakabig man ni Treñas kag wala ginadula ang posibilidad nga basi blessings in disguise ang nagluntad nga unos sa syudad rason nga positibo ini nga nagapanguna sa pag-atubang sang tanan para sa pagbangon sang Iloilo.

naglibog pa ko diri... am confused on this part... nalito ako dito...



Gi-ingon daw niya na positibo o "blessing in disguise" daw ang nahitabo kay puede daw ni makatabang sa pagbangon sa Iloilo. It's a good factor for the rebuilding of Iloilo from scratch. Mao ba ni Bernie? :D

[bukid]

^^ murag ing-ana tingali pero wa siya mi ingon na makatabang ang bagyo sa pagtindog balik sa iloilo. ang ingon lang possible na blessings in disguise ang bagyo ug positibo na gipangunahan ni trenas ang pag-atubang sa tanan aron itindog balik ang iloilo.

[flesh_is_weak]

@mwg: i hate to admit, but you've won a victory in Miss Universe '08...

all of the girls in the top 5 were not native speakers of English, Miss U Foundation even provided them with translators...but except for Ms Russia and Ms Dominican Republic, nagmaganda yung ibang latina candidates at nag-insist na mag-English...the results, less than mediocre answers...IMO, Dominican Republic gave the best answer among the top 5...

[mwg12a]

I didnt see miss U 2008, i just read you guy's comments here. I'm not sure I am following your comment above... Peace!

[sisigman]

GRAND PREMIERE
August 27, 2008
SM City Pampanga
FREE ADMISSION

http://img174.imageshack.us/img174/2404/kalamthumbnailsjv3.jpg

Me keni and make way for the 1st Kapampanganovela!

To the knowledge of most Filipinos, only Manila has the capability of producing teleseryes in the country, while all other dramas must have been produced by Koreans, Americans, Japanese, Mexicans, or Chinese.

But did you know that in other regions, Pinoy TV dramas are also being produced and are even employing the use of non-Tagalog languages like Cebuano? With the cultural fervor sweeping the regions, one could only be reminded that the Philippines—amidst the institutionalized belief that this archipelago only speaks Tagalog as its language while the rest are mere “dialects”—is, indeed, a diverse country, and that its diversity is bound to extend even to the field of TV dramas.

Take for example the Kapampangans, the latest Filipino ethnolinguistic group to enter the field of teleserye production. This August, which is considered the Language Month, a Kapampangan cable channel (Infomax-8) and a creative pool of Kapampangan youth (Kalalangan Kamaru) will be launching Kálam, the first ever Kapampanganovela—the term introduced to refer to kabalen-produced TV dramas—in Philippine broadcasting history.

Combining the Contemporary and Folklore

Like other Philippine regional communities, Kapampangans possess a rich and colorful collection of folklore. Apart from the usual laman labuad (“laman lupa” for the Tagalogs), Kapampangans have a diverse world of folk healers and sorcerers.

Aside from the popular mangkukulam and mambabarang, there is the magkukusim, who can project his soul from his body to bewitch people across distances; the katulunan, who can channel the spirits of various living creatures; the uple, illusion makers; the ustuang, powerful witches that can make their bodies explode and incinerate the surroundings, and many other strange, magical characters that continuously add color to our local culture, but are sadly being forgotten and replaced by foreign monsters like the Bogeyman, Big Foot, and the Loch Ness Monster.

However, in ‘Kálam’ (a Kapampangan word for “grace” or “gift”) instead of portraying these magical characters in their conventional barrio setting, they will be portrayed in the modern, urban world, dissolving the gap between science and superstition, technology and magic, and the traditional and the modern. Imagine mangkukulam, ustuang, and mangguguna (potion chemist and charms maker) living with us in the city as seemingly normal people who dress up like us, listen to the same songs we patronize, watch the latest concerts, keep Friendster accounts, occupy seats in the government, and occupy jobs in call centers and malls.

This is the universe of ‘Kálam,’ where contemporary drama meets folkloric fantasy.

More than a TV show

The producers stress that ‘Kálam’ is more than a TV show. It is also an advocacy project seeking to promote Kapampangan culture and language to the rest of the world while showcasing and enhancing the Kapampangan’s media-related skills. They dream of the day when various ethnolinguistic groups start exchanging teleseryes with one another instead of importing shows from abroad. Such cultural exchange through broadcast media will contribute to the long overdue realization of national unity for the Filipinos.

Starring an all-Kapampangan cast and written, produced, and directed by an all-Kapampangan staff and crew, ‘Kálam’ will air weeknights at Infomax-8 in Pampanga. For people outside Pampanga, keep visiting http://kalamtv.blogspot.com for updates.

Add yu kami friendster: http://profiles.friendster.com/kalamtv

[amigo32]

toink, unsa may gibuhat aning kapampangan sa cebuano thread:D

[bukid]

sagdai lang nangimbita ra mana sila. para naa pud ta exchanges diri. panagsa ra bitaw na kay di man ta tig-adto sa ila thread pud so okey ra na at least ma-inform pud ta sa ila mga activities.

[Ang_Bantayanon]

No, he is trying to make a point about Kapampangan's utility to its speakers just like Cebuano. He is trying to emphasize that Tagalog isn't the only language used, particularly in regional areas. Cebuano language is the acknowledged leader in teleseryes and like it, Kapampangan teleserye will also succeed.

[amigo32]

aahhh mao ba, wala na man gud nako basaha. kaingon nako ug wrong post

[flesh_is_weak]

^^basin themesong ana ilang salida kay katong kanta ninyo ni @bukid sa musikahan thread...

(kapampangan ba to, or was it in the pangasinan dialect?)

[bukid]

^^ kapampangan bitaw to. katong "O Jo Kaluguran Daka"

[Mercato]

I enjoyed reading the exchange of ideas. I am in favour of Federalism. If all else fails, then I am also in favour of seccession. Bukid stated it very eloquently. I’m glad mwg is starting to agree with the idea, too.

I agree with flesh is weak on the need for neutral languages. I also agree w/ habagat on more exchanges between ylonggos cebuanos & warays. :grouphug: :lol:


But I wish to raise this question to all Visayans and Mindanaoans. It is no secret that majority of the people of Mindanao are descendants of visayan immigrants or ethnic Visayans themselves. Not to mention Masbate, w/c sinjin pointed out a long time ago.

Is it possible to include Mindanao in our Visayan Federal States? (sus cada huna huna nako sa V.F.S. manlimbawot acong balhibo sa tumang kalipay. Hahaha. Guapo ra ba caayo ang ngalan visayan. – V.F.S.! VFS! Tutal, ethnic brods man guihapon nato sila? Unsa kahay maayo no? Sigue, huna-hunaa sa ninyo kay mobalik na ko sa akong lungon. ngyawa hubog napudko. :goodnight

[bukid]

I enjoyed reading the exchange of ideas. I am in favour of Federalism. If all else fails, then I am also in favour of seccession. Bukid stated it very eloquently. I’m glad mwg is starting to agree with the idea, too.

I agree with flesh is weak on the need for neutral languages. I also agree w/ habagat on more exchanges between ylonggos cebuanos & warays. :grouphug: :lol:


But I wish to raise this question to all Visayans and Mindanaoans. It is no secret that majority of the people of Mindanao are descendants of visayan immigrants or ethnic Visayans themselves. Not to mention Masbate, w/c sinjin pointed out a long time ago.

Is it possible to include Mindanao in our Visayan Federal States? (sus cada huna huna nako sa V.F.S. manlimbawot acong balhibo sa tumang kalipay. Hahaha. Guapo ra ba caayo ang ngalan visayan. – V.F.S.! VFS! Tutal, ethnic brods man guihapon nato sila? Unsa kahay maayo no? Sigue, huna-hunaa sa ninyo kay mobalik na ko sa akong lungon. ngyawa hubog napudko. :goodnight

i want to advocate the rights of the lumads to their ancestral domain. that's what i am supporting. christians and muslims have done injustice to these lumads by taking away these land from them. if i am right, a christian group in davao was even reported by some lumad for taking away their ancestral land. my advocacy for mindanao really is the right of the lumads to their ancestral domain. and that no muslim or christian can take that land away from them nor impose their religious laws on them.

[mwg12a]

Well Mercato, I do support in giving other regional languages an equal importance, but I do not want to see the whole Philippines separate. Singapore may have been a good example for a successful state but we can't get the assurance that it will be replicated, first of, filipinos all over the whole archepelago shows the same pattern or traits and that is to finish college and work overseas especially the united states while singaporean and the chineses there and even indians, they have the sense of enterprenaural leadership that we have been lacking. Tourism isn't enough to sustain an island nation like the bisayas, there has to be alot more.

Unlike some tagalogs just like that one person I happen to chance upon reading his or her post kind of disgust me because of it's one tract mind, but his attitude was almost no different than the rest of the other filipinos, they are resistive of tagalogs and the tagalogs are so resistive of other filipino languages. The difference is, I don't let a small group affect the Philippines as awhole when we can all work together and compromise, to learn from one another, because if we surpassed that, I believe that only then, the filipino culture and identity will flourish to complement one another, giving birth to a renewed Philippines for better future.

I support the preservation of of all filipino languages, cultures and identity because I believe all of it are as equally as important for the evolution of our nation.

On the Mindanao issue, I believe it would be tough, perhaps half of mindanao maybe tapped with the Visaya region, but since we have our muslim brothers down there, their issue is a bit more than just the preservation of their identity and culture, their freedom religious expression the way they want their laws be followed is also at stake, so, it's inevitable to divide the Philippines into only two separate state , it will always have to be 3.

[Mercato]

i want to advocate the rights of the lumads to their ancestral domain. that's what i am supporting. christians and muslims have done injustice to these lumads by taking away these land from them. if i am right, a christian group in davao was even reported by some lumad for taking away their ancestral land. my advocacy for mindanao really is the right of the lumads to their ancestral domain. and that no muslim or christian can take that land away from them nor impose their religious laws on them.

Ergo we have to include Mindanao in order to promote ur cause then. I can think of 3 guarantees that will help the lumads. But only a strong willed State can enforce these guarantees: :)

1. Legal – define their ancestral domains and protect these by federal law.
2. Armed – by integrating them with armed forestry/federal agents and giving some of them the right to bear arms. I believe the preservation of huge tracts of ancestral domains equates greatly with the protection of the environment as well. Two birds with one stone.
3. Educate lumad youth – It’s not wise to preserve lumads in time capsule museums. That will spell doom for them in the long term. Their heritage will be best protected by a well educated youth. If need be, I might even favour a semi-bumiputra style solely for lumads in our educational system.

A possible 4th one would be to encourage lumads and other indigenous groups to form corporations so that they have control over the eco-tourism business their domains can generate. Or they can franchise 7-11s or something like that.

I think I am in favour of the Visayan Federal States carved along ethno-linguistic lines. Having said that, it will cover a vast expanse from East to West; from north in Masbate to south & most of Christian Mindanao :cheers:

[Mercato]

@mwg
Bukid and the others had already expounded well on what our basic position is. I concur with most of what they had already stated. The rest are really minor.

I cannot put a finger to it but I seem to have more trust and confidence in our Visayan politicians. I mean I trust them well enough to pull off a Lee Kuan Yew style economic card trick up their sleeves. Our leaders can only do that if we have more autonomy, aka Federal.

I used to think of economic miracles as by random or by luck. My experience here suggests that economic miracles can be pulled off in a short span of 1 generation, 20-30 years, by a strong willed government.

Looking at it from the perspective of where Singapore came from and where the Visayan regions are now; In 1965 when it was kicked out of the Malay Federation, Singapore had 0 natural resources, an area 1/10 of Cebu, raging racial riots, a very undisciplined population. They pulled it off & they still have 0 natural resources. The Visayan cities are in a much better shape than Singapore was in 1965. Plus we have abundant natural & human resources.

The key seems to be strong leadership with a good economic team. :)

[flesh_is_weak]

^^autonomy man kaha, diretsohon na lang nato, pakick-out ta sa Philippine Republic :lol:

[Mercato]

^^Ayaw ayaw intawon pagsaba cay masakpan ‘nya ‘ta sa atong mga plano. Imbes magpalumos ko sa hari-anon nga pinulongan na hala mokagiw na lang ta oi! Pinangga ko ra ba ni ang akong binisaya kaluoy kon mawagtang sa agtang nato. :lol:

Aww, puslan man ganing sikaran ta hala ato ning birahon pud kutob sa mga mokuyog kanato sa tibuok bisayas ug mindanao. Jajaja. Guiatay, ngano man tong nag-iningles iningles man ko gahapon, oi. Magsigue na lang tag binisaya ug lawom para dili makalangoy ning espiya nila diri nga Kano. jajaja :lol:

[mwg12a]

oi, may mga kano na marunong mag binisaya mga dong... he he

problema sa federalism, may kaonting kalayaan pero tulad din sa america may punog gobierno pa rin. I think alot of filipinos have a different notion on how a federalism is all about, I think bukid and I has already mentioned it in the past. It's not necessarily giving each region a complete autonomy, with financial budgeting, and some local laws would probably differ but above all everybody would still be adhering to the same constitutions and bylaws of the main government. It's not like one region would function as a separate country or state, it's nothing like that, because major decisions would still have to come from the main government of the Philippines which sadly for some of you or us, would still be Manila government. And if the Visayas and Mindanao region would try to secede from Luzon? It would only probably cause instability within the whole region which may affect and include other countries who might support the secession and separation of our country which is sadly would probably be the beginning of a modern day war because it would have a rippled effect to other countries especially for the ones supporting each regions. I'm pretty sure that the Manila government would not sit there and watch the whole nation separate without putting up a fight, and that means, staging an all out war via military force, and you know how that goes, US and other foreign countries would step in... I don't know if this is a wild idea but that alone can cause world war 3, you never know?

[habagatcentral1]

Would you agree with this statement? A main argument from the old Manileños (pre-war Manila natives...perceived to be in a brink of extinction in few years time) and of Nick Joaquin:

"Manila is now a Visayan city."

Now that most of the old-timer Manileño tradition and culture is running towards "extinction" and the one that you see now is a culture of mixed migrants and urbanity. A culture that was established after WWII.

What's your say?

[mwg12a]

i believe it, bisayans are everywhere in the Philippines especially in greater manila areas and localities, I even got 2 uncles who is married to a bisaya...

The authentic tagalog Manilenos are actually very few even back when I was still in the Philippines, You would find all different filipinos in manila that actually rooted from all over the Philippines so it's safe to claim that Manila is not at all pure tagalogs anymore... Some or alot may have been born in Manila but their backgrounds are from elsewhere in the Philippines.

[tigidig14]

karamihan sa bisaya magaganda ang ngipin at di na kailangan mag-brace

[flesh_is_weak]

ingon sila dili kuno angayan ang pederalismo sa atoa tungod kay ang tinuod na pederal na nasud, nagsugod isip usa ka grupo sa mga nagkalain-lain na mga gagmay na nasud na naghugpong aron mahimo ug usa ka pederasyon...pero para nako, wala may sayop ani...ang pagpatuman ug pederalismo sa atuang nasud, igo lang mo-ayo sa usa ka dakong sayop na nahimo pila na siglo ang ninglabay...kining maong sayop ang pagpugos sa nagkadaiyang ginagmay na nasud ug gingharian na mahiusa ug mahimo ug usa ka estado na gibunyagan sa mga banyaga us "Pilipinas", ug karon gipadayon sa ilawom sa usa ka sentral na tagalista na sistema...

dili na kini angay pa natong antusan...angay na gyud nga isulong ang pederalismo dinhi sa atua...tungaon ang nasud ug igrupo dili lang base sa heograpiya, kung dili base usab sa mga linyang etniko ug base sa pinulungan. ug inig kahuman sa pagbahin, pinaagi sa usa ka referendum papilion ang mga lumulupyo niining mga gibahin na teritoryo kung uyon ba sila na mopailawom sa usa ka pederal ug desentralisado na gobyerno sa Pilipinas, o kung pilion ba nila na mahimong usa ka nasud na gawasnon...

sa akong paglantaw, daghan problema ang masulbad niini...katong mga lugar na lagyo na kapitolyo na dili kaayo mabantayan sa sentral nga gobyerno ug gustong makabaton ug independence pwede nang makabaton sa ilang gusto--ug mao kini ang kagawasan ug ang gahum sa pagbuot ug sa pagpadagan sa ilang lugar sa paagi na gusto nila...

matabangan pud niini ang gobyerno sa pilipinas, tungod kay maibanan ang ilang galastoon tungod kay gamay na lang sila ug mga lugar na angay problemahon...ug labaw sa tanan, mas mahimo kining usa ka kusgan nga republika tungod kay katong mga estado na nipiling magpabilin ug mahisakop sa pederal na nasud, aduna na may igong gahum ug autonomiya sa pagmugna ug mga palisiya, ug dili na lang magdepende sa sentral na gobyerno

pero sa akong pagtuo, kung kini ma-implementar, dako kaayo ang puruhan na piliin sa mga Sugbuanon ug mga Sugbuanon na probinsya (dili lang bisaya, apan kana gyung mga probinsya na sugbuanon maoy kadaghanan) ang kagawasan...sa akong paglantaw, bisan man gani niadto pang unang panahon, kung pananglitan ang Sultan sa Maynilad modungo sa Sugbo o di kaha sa Mactan ug angkonon kini isip iyang teritoryo, dili gyud lain kang Magallanes ang iyang hidatnan.

[Mercato]

^^Maora mag canta ang sinugdanan ngilnguiga di-ay niining bai flesh is weak oi bilib ko dah. Matud nila kita dili angay nga maglantaw sa guinatawag nga federalisimo. Matud nila kita dili malipay kay wa man ta’ay bahandi nga sa kanila igasa. Kay unsa may silbi ning kinabuhi, kun ang atong kagawasnon daw langgam nga hiniktan? Pero para kanako mas labing maayo kun ang tanan natong mga kaigsoonan nga sugbuanon o bien mga bisaya mokuyog ug magdahunog susama o daw sa usa ka dakong tingog. Ang tingog sa etnicong Sugbuanon, mga halangdon nga kaliwat ni Lapulapu ug Dagohoy. Mao kini ang upat ka mga nawong sa Bisaya. Pareho ni Lapulapu ug Dagohoy, ang moduol nga malupigon mosukol gayud 'ta taman sa guinhawa. Apan ang moduol nga susama sa higala ato pong abi-abihon ug dawaton daw igsoon pareho ni Humabon ug Sikatuna. Tungod kay bisa'g unsaon, bisa'g unsaon Pusyon Bisaya kita... :lol: porvida... Yuna pa, kay nahutdan na kog kadiyut sa laglum nga binisaya kay sakit pa ning akong hangover. Hala, sigue ipadayon sa ninyo... o aver kinsa ma’ay makaperde sa lawom kaayong binisaya ni flesh is weak.. :cheers:

[mwg12a]

Yeah, you guy's binisaya is too deep, I'm still having hard time reading it...lol

it's probably nice to have federalism and hopefully it will pave way for progress in each region as it is really hard if one region has a limited power on their resources because first of all, it takes time to process things because it has to come from the main government, so, now if there is a little bit more of freedom of each region to decide what development is good for their regions, they can speed up the action according to their needs and funding.

[habagatcentral1]

But regarding "federalism," we have some serious issues to tackle. So serious that it may spread outwards towards Visayas and Luzon....and you know what I am talking about right now.

[mwg12a]

I don't, you can que me in... he he

[habagatcentral1]

^^ Mindanao.

[Il Tenore]

mga higala, maayong gabii!

murag naa may pulong dinhi bahin sa pederalismo.. pwede mu tugsaw? haha!

[flesh_is_weak]

^^ Mindanao.

lahi man pud to ilaha...it runs on deeper divisions...those cut through by religion...

* * *

on the bright side, this could pave the way for federalism

[habagatcentral1]

lahi man pud to ilaha...it runs on deeper divisions...those cut through by religion...

* * *

on the bright side, this could pave the way for federalism

Not just religion bai, as in lisod kaayo makasabot sa ila nga situation ron.

[Mercato]

Jala dayon, dayon kamong tanan. Basta ang atong panagkabildo ug panagkahisgutan pina’agi sa pinulongan sa ato’ang mga guinikanan o mga apohanonong bisaya. Natental man gani ko’ug balitok niining acong sinu’atan sa cinara’an nga sugbuanon para ma’wani ni’ng atong bisita nga nahimuot caayo ug estar diri. Ngano caha no? Nganong ganajan man caayo siyang motalirong canato?

Sus ginoo, unsa’a ma’ay caso nianang Mindanao? Kahibalo man ang tanan nga dacong majoria sa Mindanao pulos mga Bisaya; natural wa’ay labot lang tong mga yuta sa mga Lumad, mga indigeno, mga Muslim ug mga Chavacano, di ba? Con mahimo man gani atong i-apil pud ang Masbate cay Bisdak caayo. Aver, mag-ihap co sa mga nahibaw-an ko nga bisaya nga mga dakbayan sa Mindanao. Davao, Cagayan de Oro, Butuan, Ozamiz, Yligan, General Santos, Camiguin ug uban pa. Ensacto si flesh is weak. Ipaagui ug referendum para cuentas claras, sin duda, sin pensar; wa’ay mahay-mahay cay ang tingog sa katawhan daw tingog sab ni bathala. :lol:

Sayun ra na oi. diri gani nagkasabut sabut man gani ang tulo ka raza - chinese, indian ug malay hasta lain-lain nga relihiyon. Chopsuey lang ang buddhist christian muslim hindu. Ang pama-agi mao ang proper education. :lol:

Ang acong damgo nga hinaut untang makaplagan nato ang usa ka dakong revival sa Sri Visayan Empire. Aww maorag gamitoy ra para empire mahimo pud tingali nga Sri Visayan Islands aka Visayan Federal States, mao nga maayo untag manguyog ni’ng atong mga primo sa west ug east... :banana:

[flesh_is_weak]

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/c/c8/Distribution-ceb.png/384px-Distribution-ceb.png

sus, dakua baya nato ug teritoryo ani...bisan pa kung kanang mga light blue ug color dili mo-apil nato, walay problema...

naa na tay tubig, kuryente, mga mina sa bulawan, tanso, ug uban pa...naa pa gyud ta'y mga kahumayan, katubhan, ug uban pang yutang katamnan...

[Mercato]

^^:banana: Puede, puede caayo. jajaja :lol:

apan unsa man na'ang maorag sapatos in between Cagayan de oro ug Davao nga coloured gray? nganong pahak man ug gray:??

[habagatcentral1]

^^:banana: Puede, puede caayo. jajaja :lol:

apan unsa man na'ang maorag sapatos in between Cagayan de oro ug Davao nga coloured gray? nganong pahak man ug gray:??

Areas settled by Manobo tribes. But there are some Visayan settlements there.

By the way, is Cebuano the only "Bisaya" language?

[Mercato]

^^ dili oi. mao bitaw acong pangandoy ang sri visayan islands aka visayan federal states. awww yuna pa, bai flesh is weak, nganong ang sugbuanon nga bahin ra man na-shade ug blue? Ah, basin iya lang ni'ing gikuha guikan sa wiki page. Mas labing gamhanan ta kun ang 3 ka bisaya ingredients completo. :)

Calimot ko ug hisgot.. dili lang kay 3 ang clase sa bisaya. 4! Ang ika-4 nga Bisaya ana-a sa Brunei, usa ka indigenous tribu nga Bisaya ang ngalan...

-------------------------
Maorag manginahanglan jud diay ta'ag neutral language ini. hmmm... unsa kahay mosacar no?
Unsa ma'ay atong simbolo? Sundang ni Lapulapu? Manga? Sigay o Triton's Trumpet? Tarsier? Durian? Lilang's guitar?

[flesh_is_weak]

^^Sugbuanon man na nasud ang akong gihuna-huna gud...basin diay dili ganahan mokuyog ang mga illongo ug mga waray...

paeta ani atong kahimtang...kung dili ta maghimo ug Bisaya Liberation Front, dili gyud diay ta ani makabaton ug Bisaya State-within-a-state :lol:

unsa kaha kung kani na lang mahitabo...kung pananglitan mabuntog sa mga komunista ug mga walhon ang gobyerno ngadto sa luzon, naa na tay rason aron magpalahi...mura ta ani ug Vietnam ug Korea :lol:

sige sa sunod na mag-edsa-edsa sila didto sa manila, pasagdahan nato...pabor ra man nato kung unsay mahimong resulta :lol:

"Welcome to the South Philippines a.k.a. Bisaya Nation...if you're adventurous enough, you could cross the border and visit the Democratic People's Republic of the Philippines in the north" :rofl:

[diehardbisdak]

...mga bai, kinsa na-ay idea kung asa gyud gikan ang word nga "BAI" or "BAY"? ...i'm just curious because all my Indian Officemates (Hindi-speaking) here in Riyadh, they call their friends by adding "BAI" or "BAY" after the name of the person.... like, "Bernie Bai"

[bukid]

^^ dili oi. mao bitaw acong pangandoy ang sri visayan islands aka visayan federal states. awww yuna pa, bai flesh is weak, nganong ang sugbuanon nga bahin ra man na-shade ug blue? Ah, basin iya lang ni'ing gikuha guikan sa wiki page. Mas labing gamhanan ta kun ang 3 ka bisaya ingredients completo. :)

Calimot ko ug hisgot.. dili lang kay 3 ang clase sa bisaya. 4! Ang ika-4 nga Bisaya ana-a sa Brunei, usa ka indigenous tribu nga Bisaya ang ngalan...

-------------------------
Maorag manginahanglan jud diay ta'ag neutral language ini. hmmm... unsa kahay mosacar no?
Unsa ma'ay atong simbolo? Sundang ni Lapulapu? Manga? Sigay o Triton's Trumpet? Tarsier? Durian? Lilang's guitar?

Bisan pa siguro muingon ka na kanang mga lugara napuno na sa mga bisaya. ato pa gihapon kinahanglan hunahunaon na ang mga lumad naay katungod na magkapangangkon sa ilang kaugalingon na luna ug yuta na bahandi gikan sa ilang mga kaapoyan sa una. mao na ang ako lang buot isaysay, hinaot unta ayaw nato hunahunaa na basta naay bisaya kinahanglan apil na sya sa atong buot na himoong bisayan state. kay mao ni ang nakapait sa uban natong mga kaigsoonan aning nasud nato karon. gibahinbahin na sa mga christiano ug muslim ang yuta sa mindanao na halos kalimtan nalang ang mga lumad. o kung hinumduman man, wala silay plano na ihatag ang angay ihatag na dakong bahin sa ilang yutang bahandi (ancestral land/ pamanang lupa). nagpuyo naman lang gani sila (lumad) ron sa mga kabukiran kay ato nang giangkon ang kapatagan. mao hinaot unta di pud ta mapalabihan sa kahangol na hasta ang dili ato, ato nang angkonon.

[habagatcentral1]

...mga bai, kinsa na-ay idea kung asa gyud gikan ang word nga "BAI" or "BAY"? ...i'm just curious because all my Indian Officemates (Hindi-speaking) here in Riyadh, they call their friends by adding "BAI" or "BAY" after the name of the person.... like, "Bernie Bai"

:lol:

[Mercato]

Bisan pa siguro muingon ka na kanang mga lugara napuno na sa mga bisaya. ato pa gihapon kinahanglan hunahunaon na ang mga lumad naay katungod na magkapangangkon sa ilang kaugalingon na luna ug yuta na bahandi gikan sa ilang mga kaapoyan sa una. mao na ang ako lang buot isaysay, hinaot unta ayaw nato hunahunaa na basta naay bisaya kinahanglan apil na sya sa atong buot na himoong bisayan state. kay mao ni ang nakapait sa uban natong mga kaigsoonan aning nasud nato karon. gibahinbahin na sa mga christiano ug muslim ang yuta sa mindanao na halos kalimtan nalang ang mga lumad. o kung hinumduman man, wala silay plano na ihatag ang angay ihatag na dakong bahin sa ilang yutang bahandi (ancestral land/ pamanang lupa). nagpuyo naman lang gani sila (lumad) ron sa mga kabukiran kay ato nang giangkon ang kapatagan. mao hinaot unta di pud ta mapalabihan sa kahangol na hasta ang dili ato, ato nang angkonon.

Ang katong akong gihisgot cay mikalit man lang ug pangutana si habagat kun ang Cebuano is the only Bisaya language, nisimang hinu-on ang akong panghuna-huna; kay nakapangutana siya basin pud niatong blue nga mapa ni fleshisweak.

Apan mouyon ko sa imohang panglantaw mahitungod sa mga lumad. Tinuod nga ang mga cristiano ug muslim modayon lang ug pamira ug yuta wa'ay pupananghid; ipa-agi lang sa pa-ugat ug sa labaw nga kusog.

Mao 'tong na-a koy general outline sa mga punto nga makatabang sa mga lumad. Usa niana mao ang pag-integrate sa mga lumad sa usa ka government agency nga legal silang taga-an ug armas para pag-protejer sa ilahang kaugalingon. Ikaduha ma-o ang paghatag ug "bumiputra" status sa mga lumad nga batan-on sa ato-ang educational system. Ang pag-protejer sa dakong kayuta-an nila nahi-uyon sab sa pagprotejer sa environment ug nature.

Dako di-ay caayo ug yuta ang mga Manobo sulod sa atong sugbuanon nga dapig no? Bahin sa mga existing nga settlements; mas labing maayo tingali nga inanay nga awhagon ang mga bisaya sa pagpamalhin sa la-ing dapig na lang. Puerte man gyud nang dako-a kaayo ang Mindanao.

[Mercato]

^^Sugbuanon man na nasud ang akong gihuna-huna gud...basin diay dili ganahan mokuyog ang mga illongo ug mga waray...

paeta ani atong kahimtang...kung dili ta maghimo ug Bisaya Liberation Front, dili gyud diay ta ani makabaton ug Bisaya State-within-a-state :lol:

unsa kaha kung kani na lang mahitabo...kung pananglitan mabuntog sa mga komunista ug mga walhon ang gobyerno ngadto sa luzon, naa na tay rason aron magpalahi...mura ta ani ug Vietnam ug Korea :lol:

sige sa sunod na mag-edsa-edsa sila didto sa manila, pasagdahan nato...pabor ra man nato kung unsay mahimong resulta :lol:

"Welcome to the South Philippines a.k.a. Bisaya Nation...if you're adventurous enough, you could cross the border and visit the Democratic People's Republic of the Philippines in the north" :rofl:

Kinahanglan na-a ta'ay dakong outlet padu-ong sa China Sea ug Pacific Ocean. Kay unsa-on man ni-ini pagbaton sa estado nga major shipping ports kun pulos mga gamitoy ug nipis nga dagat ra ang ato-a? :lol:

mokakak lagi na ang mga taga-Norte ug su-ong sa atong kayuta-an ka'ay mga di man na sila kahibalong manglangoy. :lol:

mas nindot sa akong dunggan ang Visayan Federal States. Na jala, manguyog lagi na sila (ang uban); basta ayuhon lang ug explicar ug bien pangulitaw. :lol:

[habagatcentral1]

Nosebleed ko sa kalawum sa Sinogbuhanon nyo wui....:lol:

[diehardbisdak]

...some of the bisaya expressions:


"kabayong pak-an"

"inahak kang dako"

"nawong tambaloslos"

:lol:

[Mercato]

@bai flesh is weak!!!
tan-awa ra to'ong mapa sa Visayas thread mahitungod sa bag-o nga mapa sa ARMM; ngano gud tawon nga nagsigue na lang ug angkon ug yuta nga dili sakop nila? Out of touch na jud ko diay no...

Ang imong blue map mausab gayud! Even Zamboanga del Norte which is heavily visayan and christian (sakto ba ko?) is included and Palawan. Ano sinuswerte???

@diehard, hulman ko na imong expression, peste ka tambaloslos na gud nianing gobiernoha paloy nga wa'ay susama. Mahinang clase grabe.:bash:

Di ba dapat the good of the majority outweighs the good of the minority? ilaha jud ning ipadayon?

[Animo]

...mga bai, kinsa na-ay idea kung asa gyud gikan ang word nga "BAI" or "BAY"? ...i'm just curious because all my Indian Officemates (Hindi-speaking) here in Riyadh, they call their friends by adding "BAI" or "BAY" after the name of the person.... like, "Bernie Bai"

I found in the internet that the Indian Bai means lady. Not sure tho! Its a title for an Indian woman. In Euskara, which is a language spoken in Spain it means yes.

[sandman.ink]

just wanna ask ano ung new term na Cebu for sutokil?

[diehardbisdak]

I found in the internet that the Indian Bai means lady. Not sure tho! Its a title for an Indian woman. In Euskara, which is a language spoken in Spain it means yes.


...my officemates come from the Kerala State in India...and by the way, it's Malayalam, not Hindi as I mentioned in my earlier post...it's very clear to my ear that they are using "BAI"...promise! hehehhe! ...like, Animo Bai! :lol:

[diehardbisdak]

just wanna ask ano ung new term na Cebu for sutokil?


SUgba, TOwa, KILaw

...or sa tagalog, Inihaw, Pangat sa Kamatis (or Tinola) at Kilawin

[flesh_is_weak]

@Mercato: sa akong mga nadunggan, kani kunong mga orihinal na tribu na gapuyo sa amihanang Mindanao, dili daw kahibawo--o tapulan lang gyud mo-uma...mao na katong ning abot ang mga bisaya nga migrante sa mindanao na nanimpalad, mao to sila (mga bisaya) ang ni-presentar na mo-uma ug mopalambo sa yuta...sa ato pa, sila ang nipahimulos sa Yutang Gisaad, apan katong mga gitawag na lumad, wala man pud pugsa, kay lagi, tungod kay dili sila mo-uma, ilang gihatagan ug pagtugot ang mga bisaya na maoy mogamit sa ilang yuta, ug ilang gipili--gipili, ug wala sila gipugos--na magpadaplin lang samtang nagkugi ang mga bisaya sa pagpalambo sa yuta...

apan karon, unsa kahay nakaon aning mga tawhana, sayon-sayonon ra man nila ug pangayo ang yuta na wala gani nila gisingutan ug gihaguan...ka mga baga ba ani nila ug nawong...modawat lang sila ug limpyo? mga p*steng in*tay!

para nako, mas duna pay basehan ang paghatag ug autonomiya sa mga lugar na bisaya kaysa sa paguli aning mga yuta na nahimo na ug bisaya sulod sa pipila ka dekada ngadto sa mga lumad na walay nahimo pagpalambo niini...

[bukid]

^^ nakasiguro ka ba na kanang imo nadunggan tinuod? ang kinabuhi sa mga lumad dili pareha sa kinabuhi sa mga bisaya apan sila nabuhi gihapon sa pag-atiman sa yuta na maoy ilang gisaligan sa ilang mga pagkaon sama sa mga baboy ramo ug mga hayop na ilang gamiton sa mga ritual. kung pag-uma ang imong pasabot. naa man gihapon sila pag-uma apan dili pareha sa pag-uma nato ha halos ang dakong lugar atong hawanan aron atong tamnan. sanglit ayaw pag-ingon lang na nanguha lang silag limpyo kay sila man naningkamot sa laing pamaagi aron sila mabuhi sa yuta na ila man gihapon gisaligan sa ilang adlaw-adlaw na kinabuhi. respetuhin nato ang ilang kinaraan na kinabuhi na wala sa ilaha ang kinaugalingon pagpangangkon sa yuta.

most of these tribes live a communal life, they are hunter gatherers but that doesn't mean they didn't help protect the land and make it fertile. in fact, their lifestyle in a way helped the environment. and preserve it from over exploitation.

sila manguha lang sila sa ilang kinahanglan. apan kita pati ang dili nato kinahanglanon atong kuhaon aron ibaligya aron makakuarta ta. mao ba ni ang pagpalambo na inyong buot ipasabot?

[Mercato]

@fleshisweak
maorag ang nangugat ug pamawi sa akong paminaw dili man tingali ang mga lumad mismo apan ang MILF. Apan kun husayon jud diay ni'ng tanan ang mas labing may katungod sa yuta natural ang tag-iya giud. Ang nag-abang wala'y mahimo kay igo ra man siya nga bantay. Pero naa po'y mga mekanismo nga dili pud tanto kaayo nga alkanse na lang jud ang nag-abang.

@bukid
unsaon man pag-solbar niining ilahang kahimtang nga diyutay ra man kaha sila? (tinu-od ka nga kun ipa-agi ug referendum na, perde jud ang mga lumad. Sus, mahurot jud nang ancestral domain nila ug suyop sa MILF.)

Ngano sa'b kaha ni'ng mga taga-Mindanao no nga wala man kaayo magpakabana sa mga kalihukan sa ilang tugkaran ra?

Sa akong nabasahan, mouyon ko atong kalihokan sa mga Ylonggo nga nag-fund raising ug mga armas. Kay unsa goy pagtuo niining mga MILF, nga kita we were born yesterday? Ngano man kaha nga puede silang (MILF) mobaton ug daghan kaayo nga armas apan ang mga silingan nilang Cristiano dili jud diay mahimo? Usapa na nila oi. Kun mao man gani mouyon ko lagi ug revive niadtong mga CAFGU ug mga Tadtad unya taga-an ug armas pud ang mga lumad. :lol:

[flesh_is_weak]

hehehe...sa makabintaha lang...biased man ko in favor sa mga bisaya...hehehe...

pero bitaw, nagpasalamat pud ko ani nilang mga tawhana (MILF), kay naa pud diay ni silay gamit...tungod nila, gi-open na balik for discussion ang pederalismo...hehehe

[sandman.ink]

SUgba, TOwa, KILaw

...or sa tagalog, Inihaw, Pangat sa Kamatis (or Tinola) at Kilawin

Thanks pre...actually mali ung tanong ko...ngutana lang ko, di ba naa bago-o na mura sutokil pud ang name na mga kan-anan dinha?

[bukid]

Thanks pre...actually mali ung tanong ko...ngutana lang ko, di ba naa bago-o na mura sutokil pud ang name na mga kan-anan dinha?

oo sa mango. kanang duol sa jolibee mango na atbang sa national bookstore. ako tanawon pa unsay pangalan gyud ato kay ang nabantayan lang nako diha kay naa syay suwat na sutokil.

[habagatcentral1]

Some issues and concerns on Bisayan history
Posted on August 15th, 2008

Author: Bridging the Gap, Henry Funtecha, ◙ The News Today

CONTEMPORARY Filipino historians are often handicapped by the lack or absence of written materials that could counterbalance the misconceptions, misrepresentations, biases and prejudices of Spanish and American colonial writers. This predicament is true of the history of every group of people in the Philippine archipelago, including that of the Bisayans.

It must be pointed out that the early history of the Filipino people was essentially based on the writings of the colonialists and, therefore, seen and judged through their own perspectives. Their writings were generally damaging to the natives because the common theme presented was that of the Filipinos being uncivilized, primitive, illiterate, backward, indolent, unhygienic and unintelligent. On the other hand, the colonialists pictured themselves as the “liberators” of the “untamed” natives, professing themselves to be the “benefactors” and “educators” of the latter. Thus, they were afflicted with some kind of Narcissus complex and considered themselves as civilized, kind, competent, efficient, religious, God-fearing, and self-sacrificing. Students of history would know what the so-called “white man’s burden” and “manifest destiny” stand for.

Other than the obvious unreliability and untruthfulness of many of the writings of the colonialists, there is also the Manila-centered or Tagalog-centric tendency and orientation of Philippine history. For most of the past decades, it was viewed that the history of the Tagalogs represented also the character of the histories of the rest of the Filipino people. In others words, the common thinking was that Tagalog history was already the history of the Filipinos. This was aggravated by the fact that there has always been the lack of emphasis or interest on local history research and writing. It is only from the 1970s onward that there has been an increasing interest and sustained activity on local history throughout the country.

All of the above, therefore, have resulted to many gaps or “missing links” in Philippine national and local history materials. In the case of Bisayan history, some interesting issues and concerns present themselves that need the attention of historians and history teachers alike. They are the following:

1. Why is the central part of the Philippines referred to collectively as the “Visayas”?

2. Is the so-called “Maragtas” really a historical document? Was it written in the middle part of the 13th century?

3. Is “Iloilo” really taken from the word “Ilong-ilong”?

4. Is “Lapulapu” the correct name of the hero of Mactan? Should he be considered as the first defender of Filipino freedom?

5. Was it really Lapulapu who killed Magellan?

6. Was Enrique, the slave of Magellan who served as the interpreter for the Spaniards, a Bisayan by origin?

7. Is the word”babaylan” derived from the phrase “babaye lang”?

8. Why did the Spaniards initially called the Bisayans as “Pintados”?

9. Where was the first Catholic mass in the Philippines really held? Was it in the Visayas or in Mindanao?

10. Is the name “Jaro” the hispanized version of “Salog”?

11. Is Iloilo River not a true river? Is its old name “Batiano River”?

12. Is it true that the Bisayans were still uncivilized and spent most of their time in warfare before they were colonized by the Spaniards?

As can be seen from the above questions, there are many gaps or “missing links” involved in Bisayan history. It is, therefore, the task of every teacher or researcher of the social sciences and the humanities to endeavor to bridge and clarify the issues and concerns confronting the people’s knowledge and understanding of Bisayan history and culture. In so doing, people in the West Visayas region will be better enlightened and will be able to appreciate more their historical and cultural heritage as Bisayans.

--------
^^ Our say in the Visayan questions.

[flesh_is_weak]

is Ilo-ilo river the body of water that separates downtown Ilo-ilo from the Panay mainland?

if it is, well it may not be a river at all, and that downtown Ilo-ilo is in fact a sea island...much like Cordova, the body of water that separates it from Mactan is called the Gabi River...but it is more like an extension of the sea than a river, thus effectively making Cordova a separate island.

[habagatcentral1]

^^ An estuary. Yes, it is the one that separates downtown Iloilo City from mainland Panay.

[Mercato]

Some issues and concerns on Bisayan history
Posted on August 15th, 2008

Author: Bridging the Gap, Henry Funtecha, ◙ The News Today

1. Why is the central part of the Philippines referred to collectively as the “Visayas”? Our islands were named after the ancient Sri Vijayan Empire. :)
4. Is “Lapulapu” the correct name of the hero of Mactan? Should he be considered as the first defender of Filipino freedom? In the absence of contradictory evidence, thence oral traditions hold. I believe Lapulapu refers to the hero, pugapo to the fish. Of course, Lapulapu is logically the first defender of Filipino freedom; that is, sans the ubernationalist nazis we have where such ideas are “not politically correct”. :)
5. Was it really Lapulapu who killed Magellan? In the absence of contradictory evidence, thence oral traditions do hold. I mean hard evidence, not just because some upstart says so in a newfangled book. :lol:
6. Was Enrique, the slave of Magellan who served as the interpreter for the Spaniards, a Bisayan by origin? Logically, a fellow European won’t make good slave material. Then the slave has to be fluent in the austronesian languages to be of any use. Therefore, I believe Enrique was a baptised Bisayan by ethnic origin. :lol:
8. Why did the Spaniards initially called the Bisayans as “Pintados”? Now this one I reaaaallllly like. Yup yup. Our great grand daddies were covered in full body tattoos, hence the Spanish name Pintado. It sounds so coooool these days to have tattoos, unsa pa caha con full body. Niiiice caayo, oi. Maluma kining mga Yakuza o mga bloods & crips sa LA sa patigasan ng tattoo, mwa jajaja. Labi na'g puno ko sa full body tattoo unya mag-bahag ko, aww sexy giud kaayo ko. :banana:
9. Where was the first Catholic mass in the Philippines really held? Was it in the Visayas or in Mindanao?
Doesn’t matter to me w/c place, albeit I’m pretty sure the first attendees were Bisayans. :cheers:
12. Is it true that the Bisayans were still uncivilized and spent most of their time in warfare before they were colonized by the Spaniards? Whatever, doesn’t matter to me. The more warlike, the betteeeeer. Coooool caayo maorag Apocalypto ba sa mga ‘laki ug Pocahontas para sa mga ba’ye. Kana giu’ng isog ug paugat, hai’ labi nianang papaloy-paloy maorag tambaloslos nagtanghal lang, di ba? :banana:

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^^ Our say in the Visayan questions.
Hagbong man tingali ko sa test ni senyor habagat. :lol: